Welcome back to another episode of run Till You're done.
Tonight's guest is might not need an introduction is quite
famous in the the ultra running scene around Scotland.
He has been, he'll describe himself as a a lifelong runner,
a career spanning about 40 plus years.
Former GB international runner, 100 marathons, 100 ultra
marathons, 15 W Hwy. goblets, including two podiums.
He's a selector for Scottish and GB ultra running teams.
Runs his own website, Runners or smilers.
Contributes to a lot more sort of running news websites.
I know that I've read of a lot of them.
He used to be a manager of a running shop.
So he's seen all the gimmicks, all the fads come and go.
I'm sure it will get on to that. When we asked our guest to be on
the podcast, he said yes, no problem.
But promise me you won't ask just the genetic questions that
he always gets asked. So hopefully we've came up with
a few different ones tonight. Welcome our guest Adrian
Stocked. Thank you.
Thanks for having me. Thanks for turning on.
We'll, we'll start off with the possibly the one formal question
this year. The things have changed.
When we when we asked you to come on the podcast, we didn't
know what what we're going to talk about, but you've given
U.S. news that I don't think you've been asked about.
And that is the news that as of 2026, you're going to be the
race director for the West Island Way.
So do you want to tell us about that and how how things are
going to change? Right.
Well, first of all, I've been involved organizing, having to
organize the West Island way for many years.
You know, while Ian's been in charge, Ian BC has been in
charge. Ian's been steering the ship for
many years now, since Derry passed away.
In fact, Jeremy, Mel around, he's a previous race director
and Ian's did it very well. It's a very successful event.
It's oversubscribed every year. Feedback we get is just
phenomenal every year. There's such a great community
spirit around the event. So Ian is busy with many
projects, as you know, both in his business life and just work
with UK Athletics. So he just feels the time has
come just to sort of not disappear.
He's saying he's still being involved in the background but
he's just not going to be race director.
So my involvement over many years, I said OK, I'll step up.
But I must stress as part of the team, I mean we've got John
Helenman over very much involved in the background.
Happened for many years, Sean Stone on the medical still so.
And we've got people who are very familiar to the West
Highland Way family like Julie Clark, Keith Hughes, and we've
also added a few people to the committee.
We've now got Neil Mcgritchie involved on the committee who we
hope it's not going to stop him still running it.
He's a deal is he can still run it and try and get go for #20
this next year along with Fiona, Fiona Rennie.
But he brings a lot of just a running experience of knowing
the rest time away and just getting what the rest time away
is to everybody, as well as being AGP and a medic who's
worked at events. So it brings a huge amount of
expertise, which I know we can tap into in the years going
forward. But as to say, what are we going
to change? Not a lot in the first instance,
I don't think. Yes, we've, we've had some
meetings and we've sat down and sort of thought like most
everyone does with their life in general, what small business
owners, big corporations, do you have a OK, let's have a blank
sheet of paper. And if we were starting this
race tomorrow, what would we change?
And there are many things you could change, but it's usually
limited by your either your ingenuity or more usually your
budget. Yes, we could easy charge
everyone $500 and change the race dramatically.
But is that what people want? Maybe in a few years time, who
knows? So it's it's evolution rather
than revolution. Yes, there will be some changes
for next year. Don't think I can let you know
what any of them are yet because they're still under under
consideration. Yeah, but no, they we're looking
at several things like checkpoints, things like this
reviving podcast, podcast, maybe getting involved in changing the
webinars, you know, getting a bit more interest going notice
arrival to yourselves. Yeah, but just something to
bring a bit more. It's feel like just more
involvement with the community and the families throughout the
year. Should we say?
Yeah, yeah. Well, one thing that I've seen
posted, so I'm sure it's not a secret, is the the federal
policy for pregnancy. That's just one thing we've
looked at. I mean, we again, the art of
being a good race director or a good sort of leader in any field
is you listen to your runners and you listen to what you look
and learn from what other races are doing.
And some people that races out there are doing some good things
and you look at them and you see that that's the extraction.
And it's a positive thing that people will, will, will
appreciate. So yes, we brought that in.
There might be the other other changes we make going along too,
but I'd probably just say there will be changes, but it'll more
be of a gradual nature rather than anything totally
revolutionary. Well, we'll, we'll wait and see.
No spoilers tonight. So you're the best director
yourself now. Congratulations.
Will you be going for Goblet 16 at all?
Not next year, I think I did my last West Highland way
20/16/2017 and then got very busy with several projects and
was still running recreationally fairly well.
But I had an accident on my bike, as many of my friends will
know what's 3 years ago now, which necessitated having sort
of a new hip basically jumping the queue completely.
Had an accident on my bike with a pothole in Edinburgh and ended
up splashing up my hip and then gave me a new one.
So although I've been able to get back to doing pretty
everything I want to do in life, running is still problematic and
I'm not getting any younger, let's face it.
So I would never say never when you think that people like Paddy
McDonald are still churning out West Island ways at age 7374 and
Rob Reed finished it well into his 70s and Andy Cole is 75 or
76 years young, completed it. So never say never.
And while we're still on the topic of the West Highland Way,
because we've got so much to cover tonight, well, this is the
first sight question that we have for you, Adrian, and one
that just pops into my head. I think this is the way the
interviewer will go. What is it about the West
Highland where you've done it 15 times, but what is it that keeps
you going back to doing that specific event?
What can I say? Everyone who's a runner,
whatever distance they do, whether they're doing their
first park run, whether they're doing marathons, ultras, they've
kind of at some point in the formative running years, just
find an event that just is magical.
And for me, that's the West Island way.
It just happened at the right time, right place as it has so
many people listening to this, I hope, and many people involved
with the family. It's one of these races that's
particularly as Scotland. It's just the West Island Way.
I think anyone who's involved in the outdoors in Scotland
appreciate that the West Highland Way is this our
wonderful iconic long distance trail.
It's the original 1. You can like it to like, you
know, England have their Pennine Way.
You know which people like outdoor people in the north of
England always want to sort of run or walk.
I sit back. It's on in the West Country.
You've got all the coastal paths.
There's so many long distance trails now.
But the West Highland Way is just Scotland's iconic trail,
and I think even if you're an outdoor person, you probably
will walk it at some time in your life, either in Iguana or
as a family bolding exercise with brothers, mums, dads,
grandchildren, whatever. We see them all around on the
way, just hiking away. And if you're a rather, it
probably is the ultimate challenge in Scotland.
It's not the toughest, it's not the, I wouldn't say it's the
most scenic there. It is very scenic, but we won't
claim it's the most scenic races, many scenic races in
Scotland that are very beautiful, but it just has that
iconic lure of being hard enough to challenge you but not too
hard to kill you. That makes sense.
It's achieve rule by anyone who just has a little plan over a
year, 2-3 years, whatever to get it done.
Yeah, definitely. And it's just some of it even
started going back to the very early West Highland Ways when
Jim Stewart was the organiser and then Dario following him and
out. Ian and the crew have tried to
develop a sense. We've just tried to develop that
sense of family and we don't have an exclusive on that.
You look at Lakeland 50 a hundred, you look at sort of the
hard most events. They've all got their little
communities which are great. But obviously the West Highland
Way, being the iconic Scottish trail that it is, is something
special. Going back to you've done it 15
times, come back to your sort of early days, what sort of is
there anything that sticks out from year one that would say
that This is why this is what brought me back?
Probably it was it was in my sort of whole running
adventures, if you like. It just came at the right time.
It's just something that really took me out of my comfort zone.
That again is one of the attractions as the West silent
way. It just it's just something that
brings everyone together, sort of friends, family, volunteers,
runners. And for one just wacky weekend
in Midsummer, we're all taken completely out of our comfort
zone, whether we're helping, whether we're running and we
just have the most fantastic time and go back home with tales
of the keep us going for the next year, basically.
And I think my first West Highland Way, many years ago,
1991 was my first. I think 25 people started, I
think about 15 finished. And in those days you could do
it unsupported or supported. And I did it unsupported and I
was very naive, young ultra runner.
I'd done several ultras. There weren't many around in
those days in Scotland. There was just the two bridges
and the West Highland Way end of probably hard to believe now and
younger listeners will find that very hard to believe that there
was just two ultras in Scotland and there weren't many more.
In England. We had the there was a classic
London to Brighton race. There were other long road races
like the Woodford, the South End and the Blackpool Depressed and
just Rd. races joining towns basically, which have all gone
because the traffic's just got too crazy.
And everyone, it's not that we didn't run on the trails and we
all ran on the trails, but there were no races on the trails
because the whole network of long distance footpaths wasn't
there then as it is now. Yeah.
So I'd heard about the West Highland Away and I'd done, I
think, a couple of 24 hour races of those silly things that go
around in circles, you know, And I'd met runners who'd done the
West Highland Away because there weren't many, what you call
ultra runners around in those days.
And we were still looked as a very lunatic fringe, you know,
sandpots going out and doing something really weird.
And I arrived and started the West Highland Way with a whole
lot of drop bags to put up the way.
And hey ho, just over 22 hours later I was in Fort William.
But it was quite an adventure. There was a lot of little
adventures on the way and it just had a profound effect on me
with this. So very few runners in those
days and the checkpoints were very minimal.
There's just one or two guys close to a red phone box, which
there's Mission Control. There were no mobile phones.
There's no Internet, so checkpoints will provide red
phone boxes. You phoned your time into Fort
William Mission Control and you had that feeling of this
absolute world, innocent desolation because even the
trail then there weren't the number of people walking the
trail and it was like having a fabulous day out.
You know, back in the nose. You were just out on this trail
then you hardly saw a soul and you were just going through this
whole I never even set foot on the West side the way before
that race. Again, very naive that it all
and this just wonderful landscape starting in the
lowlands going then gets a lot longer and you get to the the
mid Highlands. Then you get up to the proper
Highlands and it's just, it's just seeing Scotland in the
Midsummer and all its absolute beauty.
I've, I've done the race three times, been involved since 2010,
I think was my first involvement and I've been involved every
year since in either supporting or crewing.
So as you say, it just kind of sucks you in, you can't escape
it. But for those that are watching
on YouTube, Adrian's got a picture of the Devil staircase
in the background there. And my my memory of seeing
Adrian on the race is Rob Sinclair was in the process of
setting the record. He was about to run up the devil
staircase and I was shouting profanities of him for talent.
He was going too slow and what I didn't know was around the
corner. Adrian was standing there taking
photos, so I'm sorry if you heard that.
Actually, I can't a diplomatic and say I cannot recall that.
What I do recall for anyone listening and younger viewers as
well, we're talking about Rob Sinclair, who has the still
holds the record of the West Island way.
It's something ridiculous. That's 13 hours, 42 or
thereabouts, I think. And Mike was his crew that year.
And I just have this memory being at that spot is just at
the bottom of the level staircase.
And I I was helping me out of that year, but I was on my way
up to Fort William to help set up the finish and just happened
to be in the right place, right time.
Sorry, Glencoe, I think, then scooted across to the devil.
So I thought, what if I can just get this magical shot and I'm
never scooting up the trail for that first little bridges just
up from the little car park at down the fade and tried to frame
the best I could. Rob coming over the bridge with
the book hall in the background. It's down on the West Island
Riverside. You can see it.
It's it's it's not a professor I've talked with was find a lot
of faults with it, but it just captures that one moment.
I remember thinking, well, OK, I'm just going to watch Rob and
see how far he gets and just see how far he runs before he walks
up the down staircase as most of us do.
And I just watched him run all the way up and over the top
without sort of breaking step. That's how you run 1342 on the
West side away. You can't afford to walk
anywhere. You've just got to run the whole
blooming thing. Yeah.
That's unreal, isn't that? I've got one more question as
well before we do move on about the West Highway.
You're saying about from 1991, No mobile phones, no Internet,
no Garmin Strava, none of your nonsense.
The trail itself, Has it always been as well signposted as what
it is today, or was there definitely still potential to
get lost on it? Definitely, it was signposted.
It was potential to get lost more than it is these days.
I said the trail is a lot different from what it was then.
I mean, yes, you talk to some of the old school people and
they'll argue about it was harder and we did it back then.
But the trail is what it is and it's evolved.
And yes, you look at what they've done, the Conic Hill
now, you know, you look at Glenn, Finland, beyond being
glass all the way up to dairy Derrick farm and just beyond was
just a bog basically. You know, that whole land of
track that goes right up from being glass was hardly there.
But it wasn't there. It was, it was that was driven
through years later, there's a very low level parcel went right
along by the river overlooking the falls of Phallic there.
And I remember one year the river was in flowers and the
river was overflowing into the field.
So you just had to, you're up to your ankles in mud, you know,
which isn't there now. And the way they've improved the
early part of Loch Lomond side there was, we all love that
stretch of Land Rover track from railroad then and goes on for
about 5 or 6 miles now, but that only went on for about a couple
of miles back then. So there's a lot more, shall we
say, of the uneven lock side path and there is.
They've got it easy nowadays. It's.
Not easy. It is what it is.
But, but it's different. Yeah, and but still has a start,
has a finish to West Silent ways.
There, you're still seeing Scotland in all its grandeur.
And your, your other things that you do organise the races and
one thing they do is you're a selector for GB and the Scotland
ultra teams. I, you might not know this, but
I, I, I was aware of you watching a race.
It was the D33IN, I'm going to say 2014.
I, I ended up coming second. There was a minute and probably
a minute 20 or something like that behind David Gardner.
And he, he got selected for the ACP based on him winning that.
And I, I was a regret of mine because he told me afterwards if
he, he was dying. And I, I knew that if I knew
that I could have gone faster. But yeah, he, he got the
selection and I didn't. That was a regret.
First, Dave, I think it, I don't think it was just that race the
selection was based on that was a key race for him, certainly.
And then we we always look at a lot of ultra races, but Macy's,
any selection, you, you look at your, your policy is written for
you basically, yeah, by other people.
You just got to go with what the policy says.
Yeah. And so, yeah, yeah.
But yeah, I mean, again, selectors probably shouldn't
reveal their confidences, but I think there were other factors
apart from just that race that were taken into account, you
know, the previous promises, 100K and previous, possibly
previous Rd. marathons as well. Yes, yeah.
Yeah. And I assume that other other
things like certain years you have certain races and that is
the qualifier. For the 100K team, we've never
had a qualifier as such. We've identified people have
asked us what should I run? You know, you get a lot of good
marathon runners wanting to move up in distance.
So you get people who've run things on the trails and sort of
say is that good enough? And you sort of say, well, stay
hard to quantify, but you just got to have a policy which I
think for in terms of what the ACP does now if you look at the
Scottish as I think website for the Scottish team anyway.
Deemed to be capable of running 7 1/2 hours per 100K for men and
I think it's 855 for women. But performances in other
distances close will be taken into account, which is a lot
more, shall we say, some say lenient.
Then you get a Great Britain policy, which is just usually in
black and white. You must do this time or you
just won't even be thought about.
Yeah. And what non running habit would
you say has made you a better runner or race organiser?
Oh, probably many, I would say for those that don't know me,
I've had a lifelong interest in in yoga and meditation and I
have I practice meditation daily and I would say my meditation
practice has helped me be a better all round person.
So we say, I mean, that sounds a bit good, but it's just, it's
given me the ability just to listen and probably just take a
step back at times and just sort of say, OK, what's what's what's
going on here Now Just listen to runners, listen to other race
organizers and just try to come up with things that will make
them have a good experience when they're running a race.
That's all people want really. They yes, a lot of people
looking for PBS and looking sometime in, as you say, trying
to qualify for national teams, but the majority of runners just
want to go out and, and just have that total enjoyment just
being out on the trail, out doing a marathon, out doing
their local 10K. They just want to have a good
experience when they when they pin a #1.
With yoga and meditation, obviously like the word
mindfulness usually comes to mind when I certainly think
about is that they feel it brings that to you're running
and you're organizing in general life.
Does it make you more mindful? Hey, yes, I would say so.
You're just always trying to identify ways you can improve.
You know, people use the word self improvement very glibly,
you know, and just going beyond and beyond whatever, but you're
always trying to do whatever you're doing just that little
bit better. You know, it becomes like a
daily sort of discipline. OK, I'm just washing the dishes.
I want to do a good job of it. You know, I'm sweeping the
garden leaves. I just want to make sure
everyone is picked up, you know, and you transfer that to the
another race, OK. How can we do this better?
You know, you've got little teams and innovates, like even
in the West Highland way, you've got little teams at work and you
sort of, I know John and Helen go have their volunteer teams
they work with and they're going to teams saying, OK, you're this
little checkpoint, how can we help you?
What do you need? It's just a case of always just
trying to find that little bit extra that you can do to make
life, should we say, just have those little magical moments.
Speaking about magical moments drift back into West Allen way
again because as what we'll be doing all podcast.
If if you had a a feeling or a a moment or however you want to
express it to to do with running, to do with W Allen way,
and you could bottle up that feeling, what would it be?
I think it's just, as you said, the essence of family and
community and that everyone is there to help each other and I
think it's just epitomized so much by anyone listening to this
who's actually been there or just seen it on video.
The moment when the last finisher gets their goblet.
For those that don't know, the West Highland away is unusual
for many races. It's not just the prize giving
with the podium for the first 3 and everyone else gets the medal
as they cross the line in the centre of home.
We have a prize giving that in Fort William that coincides
shortly after the cut off time, the 35 hours, it's midday on
Sunday and everyone that comes to that and it's like, I think
Ian best describes it, Ian Beatty as like a graduation
ceremony. Everyone who's run that race
comes up and get their goblet and it's just like it's just
giving that family feeling of equality.
It doesn't matter whether you've finished right at the back of
the pack or right at the front. You you have challenged the way
and you've won, I think, and some people have challenged the
way and have come up short for many reasons.
We've all been there, stuff happens.
But the initiative we initiated many years ago, I think I might
be, I think it was Murder Mccune who came up with the idea that
the winner of the race presents the last finisher with a goblet.
And that moment at the end of the prize giving at the West
Island Way is always very magical.
Yeah. And it's almost standing.
Applause from everybody and hardly a dry eye in the house.
And everyone goes home buzzing. I think it's an aspiration for
some people to be the final finisher because you get the
biggest you're at the end. I can imagine myself waiting at
that sports centre. I say right on you go, on you
go. I don't think people tried to be
the last finisher, I think, but I think everyone who does the
best silent way. Over the years, you see hundreds
of people have taken on the challenge and some are naturally
gifted. You know, some people, as their
coaches say, chose their parents well and can how they need to
train and can get around it. For some people, it's the maybe
the hardest thing they'll ever do in their lives.
You know, like Mike's done it a few times and done all his
backyard ultras and things. I've done many things, but some
people and not naturally gifted, they have to graft and they can
spend four or five years getting to the point where, OK, I'm
ready to run the West Highland Way.
It's a little life goal they've had and and it's they'll
struggle. It'll be a real roller coaster,
but they'll get to the start line and they'll get to Fort
William and they may never do something as hard in their life
again. And, and those people are sort
of really the real heroes of the West Highland Way because
they're just taking on a challenge that they thought
almost wasn't attainable. But over the course of time,
it's become, OK, and maybe I could do this.
And then when they actually get there, anyone who's been at the
finish of the Highland Way, it's like any race, you just this
grown man just try a bucket full to finish because they've just
achieved something that, as I say, just taken them out of
their comfort zone big time. I was in the hall at the end of
last year and as the last runners were coming in, I heard
some of these crews saying, Oh no, he can't be last person.
He can't be last person. And somebody turned around and
said no, I think it'll be all right.
I think you'll want to be the last person.
So Adrian, as Mike mentioned in the intro, you've done one or
two ultras, so I'm hoping the answer for this question is
going to be quite an interesting one.
What is the weirdest thing that you've ever eaten, Madras.
Oh, when you sent that question, I thought about it and I I can't
really think of anything weird I've eaten.
I think I've always been pretty sensible with my food.
You you need to try a cold can of soup thin.
What kind of soup? Yeah, I've had them, certainly,
but that's not really weird. That's just sort of normal
stuff. Yeah, yeah.
See, it's it's normal to eat cold.
Soup. Not normal it.
Is normal. You just, you just deal with
what's in front of you and it's someone's has a can of cold
sweep in front of you. I think I've had, I've had that
experience. Yeah.
You know, you just go with it. You know, you know, sometimes
when you're doing altars, everyone who's done an ultra and
done many altars, especially longer ultras, sometimes you get
into a checkpoint and you find your crew and you just, you,
you, you know, you want something, but you can't really,
you're not really thinking properly.
You've got a plan and you know what you like, but then your
crew just presents about four things in front of you.
And so you just, what do I pick? You know, And you just
automatically draw to some one of them, you know, and usually
the intuition says what you're looking at is probably something
that you need. You know, you're wanting
something savoury or salt or you're wanting, you know, the
sweet things or you're just wanting that, that cold kind of
sleep just OK, that's going to hit the spot.
Yeah. And following on from that, what
do you think ultra Running does teach us about human nature?
Oh, definite one, I would say it teaches you that.
Trying to not sound too glib here, but the unattainable is
attainable. You know, getting back to, you
know, I've, I've, my meditation teacher was Sri Chinmoy, as many
people know, some people deserve.
But his whole philosophy was based on self transcendence.
And you can always do more. And you know, he, he was
obviously a meditation yoga teacher, but his whole
philosophy of his transcendence in the running world, the ultra
running is a perfect metaphor for just always going beyond and
beyond. And no matter who you are, what
your level is, you know, whatever run the ability you
have, there is something that can be brought out of you to
make you a better runner. And on a very, very important
question that you might not have an answer for, you're running
the West Island way. You're going for goblet #16.
It is a roasting hot day. You've got to Oxford Tire Farm.
You saw your crew. You haven't seen them for since
Robert Dennon and they said or you can have an ice cream at
Tindrum Brody store. That used to be the place to get
it from. What flavour ice cream would you
get? Chocolate mint tip.
Oh, I wouldn't say no to that either.
And if I didn't have that, I'd probably go for something from
my childhood. I was born and brought up in
Cornwall and so I'd have to give a Cornish dairy ice cream, which
is proper ice cream. That's a good answer.
So at least I know now for next year's race, I know what to
bring you. Thank you.
I look forward to that. I think in the years that I've
had it, at that point it's been something like a Clippo because
that's the only thing that you can get.
But on a normal day I would probably have something similar
to the Mint Chalk Ship as well. And if races had theme music
attached to them, which some of them actually do.
But if there was one that you happen to be doing and it was
played if you run past the checkpoint, what kind of music
would you enjoy? Well, my musical tastes are very
varied. I don't think I can pinpoint 1
music, but maybe it's a little spoiler alert that.
Watch this space for ideas we might have for checkpoints next
year. Well, I look forward to that.
You're making this voluntary thing more than water peeling a
tree, but. Personally, as I say, my, my, I,
I'm just my, my musical taste is inspired by sometimes the
surroundings I'm in for what's going on.
Like sometimes, like you might be running up a Loch Loman side
and it's just, this is just, I mean, I've never been.
I never usually listen to music when I'm running.
I much prefer to hear nature's orchestra.
There's the sounds and there's the sights that are going on
around me. And even now if I go for a walk,
I don't, I don't listen to podcasts or anything.
I just like to go out and just experience what what's in front
of me. If you like, Yeah.
And it's just like in the West Highland, the way when you're
going up the Loch Loman side, you just sort of have sometimes
have these might sound a weird. You just sound like sort of like
an Irish or Scottish sort of Celtic music.
You get violins and flutes going through your head because it's
just that sort of countryside. As you have further noisy and
more majestic music. I it might sound crazy, but
that's this wonderful memory of going to a place you're very
familiar with. Mike the top of Jelly Baby Hill
and came to the top of Jelly Baby Hill and just looking out,
get that to the summit to see that vast expanse of Ranick Moor
stretching out ahead of you. And it's just one of those sort
of many wild moments. It's just as a the scenery opens
up as you go north and believe it or not, the thing that came
into my head was Beethoven's Ode to Joy.
Everyone knows that. Bomb, bomb, bomb, bomb, bomb,
bomb, bomb, bomb. And I just found myself cheering
down the hill just last night out of my mouth at top speed,
you know? So I think when you mentioned
going up Jelly Baby Hill from a long time ago, I remember Peter
Duggan being at the top of Jelly Baby Hill when Murdo playing on
his tin whistle, playing the Star Wars music.
Yes. Wonderful cameo moment, Yes.
You say about classical music, I actually love it and had it on
in my car for the first time in ages last week and I thought to
myself this would actually be like if you picked the right
theme in classical you could have a mate run with it.
I mean, I challenge anyone listening to Beethoven's Owned
for Joy and just get up a chair and start marching around the
room. I think I'll do that after this.
So again, getting the fault William is no problem, you know.
All right. The the next question was what
is the strangest or most scientifically questionable bit
of advice that either you've given been given at checkpoint
or just in running in general? Again, I I can't think of
anything really strange, you know, Maybe I'm just too normal.
You're absolutely not normal. The amount of ultra on the new
thumb. I mean, there are so many
scientifically questionable fads that are around bit of advice,
you know? It's all relevant to where you
are at at the time. You know, question and advice of
one situation with one person, how they're feeling is probably
absolutely appropriate at that time.
But to someone else at another point in time is just bonkers,
you know? Yeah.
So it's probably the case of dealing, as I say, dealing with
what's in front of you and how you're feeling at any point in
time. And what's the race or moment
that never made the headlines and the running world or in
general, but has meant the most to you personally?
Do you mean a personal race of mine or just an experience?
Of. Mine personally was probably my
best 24 hour race when I was in the British team and European
Championships in Holland and it's very special moment.
It's my first GB vest and I managed to place in the top ten
and we got the bronze medals and it was it was just a bunch of
guys who were just when they represented Great Britain and
had fun, you know, it was, you know, very much under the radar,
hardly made any headlines. I think it might have made a
little line and the Scotsman was the Press and Journal just as a
result, but nothing else apart from that.
But it was just the most fantastic life defining
experience for me, which I look back on very fondly.
In fact, I've still got to pick up the team just ahead of me on
my show. The team was, I'm going to show
this to you because some viewers might know this.
There's oops, it's not coming out on there, is it?
It's a younger version of me on the right hand side there.
This gentleman here is a legend otherwise known as Don Ritchie.
This is a guy called Wolster Hill who views in Scotland.
Probably don't know, but this guy on the far left is William
Hichel from Orkney who knows a little bit about ultra running.
So and we've known each other many years, run against each
other, race against each other, not 9 balls out of each other in
races. And just to come around, if we
had of that sort of weekend in Holland, to come back with the
team medals was still a very special memory.
Yeah. And what year was that?
I think that was 1875. No.
It was October 2000, yeah. Fantastic, yeah.
And the next one might be one that you've already mentioned,
but is there any behind the scenes moments, stories that
people wouldn't believe if you told them?
Probably nothing I can mention in public.
I know we nearly set the tent on fire at the ACP at Perth once,
but we we got away with it. No, luckily we had a we had a
plan to deal with it. Good race organisers do.
That's because you're running too fast, right?
But. There's many.
Every race organiser will tell you something you plan for the
unexpected, but stuff always happens, yeah.
And quite that was all for cool. Sorry, you were going to say
there, Nydia. No, Carry on.
Best of public, anyway. The next question is quite
philosophical. So what would you say to your
younger self before your very first ultra?
OK, I actually saw hard about this and probably my first
advice would be good only for having a go, but you should have
waited another year. And the second bit of advice
and, and that's if I can elaborate on that using the
classic expression. If I knew now, if I knew then
what I know now, what would I talk?
My youngest half is? It's just a question you're
asking. I see too many people setting
themselves too big a challenge too quickly, and usually a they
don't even get to the start line because they're not ready for it
yet. Or they get to the start line
and don't have a good experience.
Whereas if they just wait another year, consolidate where
they are a they'd be better prepared and they will actually
enjoy it much more. It'll still be hard, but if
you're going to challenge yourself and push the boat out,
you want to have a bit of fun while you're doing it as well.
Yeah, shouldn't be taught you. It should be a a, a nice life
defying the experience for you. Yeah, so.
I I think. The other main thing I would say
is just you have to learn patience in any ultra, whether
it's a in a marathon, you have to learn patience in an ultra
especially, you just have to learn patience and just, and
that's something you learn. It's true of 50K, it's true of
50 miles, it's true of things like the West Island Way.
Even I was lucky enough to be at Nowby last weekend for the world
24 hour championships, 2 weekends ago now and all the
people there are people who have learned how to run 24 hours as
an event. They weren't just doing their
first. There's some incredible
performances as you might have had the world record went for
the ladies with Sarah Webster running ridiculous 173 miles.
But you don't just wake up in the morning and run 173 miles in
24 hours. It's something that is built up
over many years, all those amazing performances and just
like, and I guess what I'm trying to say is it's worth
patience and waiting another year to make sure you actually
enjoy the target goal that you've set yourself.
I think we also people go into it too early and they might get
to the finish but as you say you might not enjoy it and if you
waited and actually are ready for it then you would enjoy it
and then go back and do it 15 times.
Yeah, it's, and it's not that people can't do it, of course
they can. But I, I come across so many
runners these days who've gone from like half marathon to doing
the fling, you know, they, they sidestepped the marathon
completely, you know, and it's good on them, I'd say.
But you have to ask yourself, should they have?
They've obviously done it and, and, but you, if you're going to
take up running, you want it to be a lifelong experience that
you're going to save and enjoy. The next question was cliche
sayings or whatever out there, like it's tortoise beats the
hair and stuff like that. It's a journey, trust the
process. All this, the cliches that are
always out there. If there's one thing that you
could delete out of existence, what would it be?
This may sound a bit controversial, but I wouldn't
delete any of them because I think even the most good cliche
is, is OK in the right context. When it was first said, when
someone first said to somebody, you know, it's a journey, it was
probably meant from the heart for one approach to a particular
person in a particular point in time to inspire that person.
That makes sense and the same as all the other ones, you know,
you know, trust the process, etcetera.
Yes, you do have to trust the process, but you if it's said in
context in the right place, I think any little phrase is good
and it is set from the heart and well meaning at a certain point
in time to an athlete at the right time in the right moment.
But yeah, it's a lot of cliches. I guess what you're saying is
they're overused and and not used in the right context, or
was just used as a throwaway remark by any Any bit of advice
is is relevant in the right at the right point in time to the
right person. And I've got 2 questions rolled
into the one about kit. So which piece of running kit do
you feel is the most overrated? And then following that, which
bit of cheap which cheap piece of junk has secretly saved your
race? Oh, it's not some running kit.
Here's probably a personal opinion because it's now valid,
but I've always felt that technology has been overrated.
It's not to say they're wrong. I can remember when Hotmail
monitors were very young against this, getting my age very bit.
And I went to a lecture with the New Zealand coach Arthur
Lydiard, who many people have heard about.
It was taught all the New Zealanders how to win gold
medals basically at the Olympics in the 60s and then became the
national coach of Finland and was involved in setting up their
programs. So the Finnish runners became
world class distance runners. And that's our lecture.
Harvey monitors were just a new thing that I don't think they're
even garments around then. But someone asked him, what do
you think of heart rate monitors?
And also being a very down to earth Kiwi just shot back
Kenyans don't use them. So all they do is when they they
run easy most of the time and twice a week they just run their
guts out. But then I'm watching the
hardware they're just running till they're done basically as
the thing goes. So I wouldn't say technology is
bad, but I would say that if there's one thing that has been
misused over the years, possibly and given more relevance and
maybe it should have been, it's it's running technology.
Nothing is wrong. It's like our expressions again,
in the right place and for the right session, absolutely fine.
But don't worry, your heart rates drop overnight.
So you can find out where your heart rate is in the morning.
I know people have done that. Trust me, you know it's.
And the other question was, is there any sort of cheap bit of
tat that's actually been beneficial?
To you, my daughter's tool bag saved me on my first West Island
way back in 1991. There were no hydration vests.
So Pete Bland had his famous bum bags.
You had sort of a big backpacks. And here I am doing my first
long trail race up the West Island way and OK, I've got to
carry some gear for a change. You know, what do I, what do I
put it in? All I could find was my
daughter's school bag. Yeah, play bags.
I'll tell you what, hydration bags, they can be overrated.
I think Begs was a not a man that got called bag man mate.
He's been doing that for a while.
Yeah. He prefers to run with what what
people call a shopping bag, but it's like a a dry bag and he
puts his hydration bottles in that and he just carries it in
one hand like as if he was carrying a shopping bag.
So it works for him. That's how he runs so.
I've been known to just go out for training runs back in the
day, just carrying a 1 1/2 litre bottle of water.
There you go, one litres. That'll do me for the next 3 or
4 hours, yeah. And when you're out for three or
four hours and all the ultras that you've done your, your
shoes have done the miles, if your shoes could talk, what
would you say? Please retire me before I get
too old. Is that your body or your shoes?
Yeah. Again, having worked in the shoe
trade, you see all these. They are good expressions.
You know, your shoes will last 500 miles, 700 miles.
And when you take down and find out who's done that research,
it's usually been funded by a shoe company.
Yeah. What is the longest you've got
out of a pair of shoes? I, oh, I've got old pairs.
I've probably run 2000 miles in Wow.
Yeah, I mean them all the time. You know, I sort of retired and
then because they've had special memories of certain races, I
just won't throw, haven't thrown them out or, or tamed to
recycling or put them, you know. So I used to just bring them out
now and again just to go for a little run of them and just some
memories. I remember when I did this race.
And you might have actually already have answered this for
us, but with the evolution of the sport, I mean, 1991 was
quite a while ago now, technology and everything coming
in. Is there anything else that
might make your eyes roll or think or there's no needs?
Yes and no. Yes, sometimes it does.
But then you think, as I was saying before, in in the right
context, all, all new, new things are good.
You know, the right person, as long as they're used for the
purpose that they're meant for and that person is getting a
benefit from them and isn't just sort of following the crowd, you
know, not just taking on a diet because Jim Warmsley is on the
same diet or Jim Warmsley has this jail cell must be the
great, greatest thing to have. You know, it's all about context
for you as a person. Yeah.
And find what works for you and, and follow that.
Yeah. The next question, it might fall
under the same sort of thing. It's What is the strangest thing
you've found, but strange to you might not be strange to somebody
else. What was the strangest thing you
found? Left behind checkpoints or after
a race, or in somebody's kit bag.
Trying to think every year we always have a quite a lot of
lost property, so it gets down the road to Fort William
eventually, but it's usually pretty run-of-the-mill things.
I've spoken to find anything that's been totally weird, yeah.
I've seen a picture. Of somebody you've seen, yes.
I've I've not seen it personally but I know somebody called Flip.
It always puts up a picture who is a picture of a, let's say,
prophylactic filled with, I think it's something like rice
pudding, and the person's just nipped the end off of it and
squared into their mouth. Each to their own.
Yeah, not for me. Yeah.
Can I actually share a story that I've heard at a race and I
was talking to other volunteers and race directors and say
keeping on a on a minity. I can't say that word.
I will not mention who or where it was, but the strangest thing
they've actually seen or probably the grossest was a
runner had a, a misfortunate accident, shall we say, and used
a really good branded jacket, waterproof and ended up throwing
it away. And they actually fished out the
bin and said, right, who's taking it home?
Because I'm just going to wash it.
Who wants it because apparently it was quite an expensive
jacket. So that's that's your standards?
I said. I think I'll take it home and
wash it. Yes.
And the next question, this isn't make drafted a few of
these questions, and I think this is a great one.
It's probably one of the best ones I think we've had on the
podcast. What is a smell that instantly
reminds you of running? Well, for me it's things like
like at the moment just awesome relieves just running through
woodland or by Riverside and just that smell of just sort of,
it's not really decay. It's almost been, there's a
start of renewal again, just like the whole changing of the
seasons. And it's just like in spring you
get the blossom coming out. It's just as I said, I don't
listen to music when I'm running.
I never, never did. I was always just trying to
absorb the sights and sounds that are around you all the
time. So you you just get the feeling
of those autumnal awesome leaves and the blossom coming in the
spring and just nothing in the winter, just absolutely bare
trees or just be in the top of a hill.
And the sound you've got in your ears is just a wind almost
blowing you off. The down thing, you know, it's
just just those little ethereal sounds of nature that just stay
with you. And next one is if you were to
take all your running experiences and you're, you're
writing a a running Bible for for anybody, whether it's new or
old people, not old people, but old runners, what would your
commandments be? I.
Think I came up before actually thought about this one was I
think we alluded to this a bit earlier, but don't let running
define you running itself, you know, always, always what's the
expression This is a good expression.
Get a life. But what I mean by that is this
have a balance. Yeah.
Running is important to all of us.
You know, it's something we spend hours thinking about,
talking about reading about listening to podcasts about
these days. But that line between sort of
dedication and obsession, it's it's it's good on one level, but
it's not good if it just totally takes over your life.
You need to have a balance and have, if you haven't got family
and friends, you've got some interests, whether that sort of
jigsaws or basket weaving or whatever, you just need
something to take you away from, from running and just strike a
balance. You know, there's the world is
such a, an amazing place for so many people like we.
I'm used to dealing with the ultra community and runners.
But this afternoon my wife took me to the Andy Goldsworthy
exhibition here in Edinburgh at the National Galleries.
And if you haven't been and you're in Edinburgh, it's there
for another week, do go and see it.
It is just amazing. But this is an an artist, Andy
Goldsworthy, who is just makes these amazing installations that
are just from another sort of realm of consciousness, you
know, And it's just something totally different to the space
I'm usually used to. But you can relate to it because
being an ultra, I know you're used to sort of going somewhere
different if you like. Yeah.
And this guy, Andy Goldsworthy, is doing it in an artistic realm
as musicians do it in a musical realm.
It's just like there are many ways you can explore personal
boundaries and still have fun and still have your own
community. You know?
Like there's a whole, we live in our own little bubble of ultra
running or cross country running, as I've said, across
country, mid weekend, whatever. But outside that bubble, there
were so many other bubbles that are all interrelated.
And yeah, just don't get trapped in the ultra running bubble #1
#2 set challenging but realistic goals, which I think we've
talked about already. Sounds a bit boring.
But yes, push the boat out. You can.
And everyone can do amazing things relative to their own
capacity. But be patient.
Have a bit of time over it, you know?
Yeah, because you'll enjoy it much better #3 would be listen
to others. When you start running.
You read a few books, you read a few podcasts.
You might be lucky enough to have found a coach, you might
not. But if you can't get a coach,
just go and listen to others. And I remember people do it to
me now. I think tables of turn.
I remember when I was a younger runner reading just 20 years
ago, you'd be at a race or it could be any race, could be a
cross country race, could be in local 10K and you're in the
cafeteria afters, there's a coffee shop, whatever.
And you're all these people hanging out there talking about
how the race was. And this is probably a slightly
older guy just sitting by himself in the corner.
And I used to home in on them as I'm going to sit with this guy
because you know that they've got interesting stories to tell.
And usually 9/9 times out of 100 you sit down and spend 15
minutes with this total stranger.
They've got a lifetime of running inspiration to to
impart. And there'd be 1 little gem
there that you can take away and put into your own running.
So next race you're at, ditch your friends.
Go and talk to the stranger in the corner.
See, I've done that, Adrian. That gets me any bother usually.
Pick pick your moments, Nikki, pick your moments.
They might be the loner in the corner for a reason.
I I get that as well. Yeah.
But yeah, but you get an intuition.
This guy is going to be interesting.
Yeah. We'll go.
Yeah, yeah, yeah #4 Just as important as running is rest.
There's an obsession in just getting the training, in getting
the training, in doing this, doing that.
Miles in a week, counting them up.
Oh, Sunday lunchtime, dumb. A long run.
They've only been 95. Let's get back out and do
another 5 S 100 miles looks good in the training diary.
Sounds familiar to a lot of people, I'm sure.
Yes, It's not safe to take on the whole Kenyan philosophy.
Get up in the morning, go for your run, have your breakfast,
go back to sleep again, then get up and go for another one.
Go back to sleep again. But it's a balance to be struck.
One of the best bits of advice I was given is just see your body
as like an elastic band, like a seraband that Fizzies use.
It's just you've got to stretch it to make it to reach your
potential and push the boat out so that you can run the West
side away or run whatever you want to run.
But you've got to let that rubber band go back again.
And coaches call it the adaptation process.
You know, anyone who coach or has read any coaching books, you
have to let your body adapt to the pressure you've been under.
The whole principles of training are very simple.
You just, you put strain on the body so it can improve and do
wonderful things. But if you don't let it rest,
that rubber band is going to keep stretching and stretching
and stretching. And what's going to happen to
the rubber band breaking? It's going to break.
And the only way you can deal with that is just factor in some
quality rest. And that's that is an important
part of the training schedule is planning the miles.
And most, a lot of coaches forget about that.
And runners certainly don't think about it.
But plan your training, plan your rest, plan your rest days,
plan your easy days, plan your day when you're just going to
I'm just going to go and do something else.
I really like that analogy with the rubber band because I think
even out with running, I think you can't apply that to life as
well. Yeah, burnout is a is a thing
and I see it happening in novice ultra runners.
I see it happen with elite athletes in GB teams.
The real thing. They just, I think there's an
American swimming coach did a very good study on another
little analogy of entering the valley of I think they call it
the valley of death or something.
It's just like, you know, runner A goes and runs a 10K race and
he's expecting to run what's 35 minutes, 36 minutes, shall we
say? And they run 3738 minutes
because they're overtrained and they're tired.
So what do they do? Instead of sort of saying, OK,
I'm tired, I need to rest a bit, they still say, OK, if I train
even harder, I'll definitely get down to 35 minutes, you know,
and they go out and hammer themselves and, you know, 2
weeks later they goosed. They just take a step back and
said, OK, I'm feeling tired, I'm sluggish, my heart rate's up in
the morning. You know, let's just take a week
out here and then come back and start again.
Well, I think after that, the answer to those questions, Mike,
I'll definitely be writing those down because what a great answer
that was. It was really, really good
advice. Thank you.
Appreciate it. We spend all this time trying to
get to a start line and we've all seen it.
We've all got friends who've done it who who don't get to
that start line because they just don't follow simple little
rules. They don't listen to their
bodies nicely. Yeah, it's, it's heartbreaking
sometimes because you see the effort they put in and they
just, they get a little injury as they get sick and they just
carry on training and you just sort of, you know, oh, I'm on a
streak if I'll go and do a 2 miles today.
Yeah. OK.
That's that's fine. Go, go and have a walk.
Don't, don't need to run. Just go out and walk around the
block, you know, walk down to the shops and back, you know,
just get your exercise in. But listen to your body or it
says you're going to pay for it later.
Yeah. I think the only problem that I
can see with that answers is that we can't ask that question
again because Adrian's already given us all the answers.
There's plenty more out there, yeah.
I don't know, we could divide the running community because
people would listen to other answers and go, no, you're
wrong. You have to, you have to accept,
I mean it's all relative to what you're doing.
If I just paint a picture of what I've been doing the last
month, last 6-7 weeks in terms of saying take it easy and rest.
I I was helping at the wonderful St. in my 3100 mile race for
three weeks in New York, which people don't know.
It is a, it's the longest road race in the world certified road
race that goes round up an 800 meter block in New York for 52
days. So you've got guys and gals
there who are just pushing things way beyond what is normal
basically. Yeah, so, and they're living
proof that you can't do sort of crazy things and survive.
Yeah, yeah. But that's people who've spent
years and years getting to that point.
They haven't just woken up in the morning and decided I'm
going to run 3000 miles. They just sort of, it's
something they've done after 10/15/20 years of consistent
training. And that's the same as anyone
just looking at their first ultra, their second ultra,
moving up. It's just having that adaptation
and just being sick. Yes, Sensible doesn't sit well
with ultra runners, never has and never will.
Very nature is just to push Bambi's out and sort of be
bonkers, basically, yeah. So, but you within that you can
have much more enjoyment if you just take the time to rest.
I think that's what makes it unique though, isn't it?
Yeah, that's the challenge, whether you're, I've got friends
who are ultra distant swimmers and swimming the channel and
things. And it's a similar sort of
mindset. It's just a mindset that you've
got to push yourself, but you still have to have to relax and
recover as well. And the golden rule is, which is
a same feature in my head about things.
Yes, push yourself, push it up to the limit, but don't end up
in hospital. Yeah.
And before Nikki asks, yes, I have considered in that race,
but no, I couldn't get the time off work or family or life.
So there you go. Yes.
So following on from the evolution of the sport, what
comes with that is modern technology for social media
especially. Do you think that that has
helped or harm the sport? He's done both.
It's great that you can now like if to say the West side away is
an example. You're not waiting until Monday
morning to read your Scotsman or Tuesday till Fred comes back to
the club to get the result. It's there in real time and live
and people are talking about it and telling you Fred's up to tie
or Joe's going to be at Glencoe in 5 minutes, you know, and
that's fabulous. Downside is do you really want
to know every bit about their daily social life?
Maybe yes, maybe no. Again, in the right context,
yes. But I guess what I'm saying is
it's like the old analogy with the TV.
You control the on off button. Just find out what social media
you want in your life. And just, I don't know, I don't
want to be feel like I'm on a soapbox, but I mean, I, I, it's,
it is draining. Yeah.
It's physically and mentally draining social media people,
and I see it as well as we're trying to keep your schedule.
And it's just like if I go as a team for championship, you know,
we try to just get them to limit their phone use in the week
before a race because they just didn't want to focus on the
race. They just don't want to focus on
telling the world about what they're doing.
Yeah, they want to tell the world about what they're doing.
It's good they do that because that's the plus side of it.
People want to know what they're doing, yeah, in a, in a, in a
team and things, yeah. But at the end of the day,
they've got the priorities running their race, not sort of
how many Instagram followers they've got.
And the, the next question is one of our standard sort of
questions. And it, it can be awkward to
ask, but we've got a twist on it.
There's two parts. First part is, have you got
anybody that you can think of that you would like to go for a
run with? Either alive, not fictional or
real. I've been very lucky that I've
actually been able to meet a lot of very good runners, but if
there's anyone at the current sort of crop who I would like to
go out for a run with, I'd probably pick 2 that's allowed.
Yeah, you can take as many as you want.
You can have a whole. I did.
I actually did meet Jim Walmsley very briefly and Confrank of the
World Trail Champs recently had an interesting sort of five
minute chat with him. But I would love to go for a
longer run with Jim Walmsley because I don't know is the
American runner who I think has the West certainly born Western
states. I'm not sure he still has the
record. Also, it's one of the fastest
100K times. His versatility is amazing.
He's can run a good marathon, he can run a good 100K.
He can run a good hundred mile on the trails.
And the other character I find fascinating of all the runners,
I don't follow that many actually, but as the runners I
do follow Francesco Puppy, the Italian trail and mountain
runner PUPPI look him up. Francesco puppy follow him on
Instagram. He's he's got some very
interesting stuff he puts out there and I, I was just, he
thinks deeply about the sport. He's involved in it at a very
high level. And I would just love to sort of
sit down with him. We'll have a coffee or just go
for a run with him, yeah. And the the the second part to
the question was same. Same rules, but who would you
like to see run the West Island way, whether they might not be
might be fictional or not. Jim Wolveson and Francesco
Puppy. Fair enough.
You fantasize, I mean, yeah. Ian and I and the guys, we, we
fantasize. We've had fantasy West Island
Way. Who would you like to do?
What sort of time could Courtney do on the West Island Way, for
God's sake? You know?
Yeah. You know, we desperately would
like someone to come and have a go at Lucy Cohen's West Island
Way record for the ladies. It's stood to be there for far
too long and you think there are people that could do it, but how
do you make them more attractive?
Maybe that's a challenge for me over the next two or three
years. How can we attract some better
runners to come and do this? If the, as I said, the West Side
away is a very successful event, it's we hope the entries go live
this Saturday. The 1st put that plug in for
that. Get your get your entry in,
think about it carefully and be patient and wait another year if
you have to. Follow the commandments.
Follow the. Commandments, yes, but you sort
of think if if there's anything we, I would like to do
personally is just to attract some better runners.
And to do that you've got to look at things like well, how do
we attract them? Zip prize money, do you give it
entries, stuff like that which the budget is based certainly
can't afford at the moment going forward.
Could that change? I don't know, but it's a double
edged sword because the reason the race is so successful at the
moment, because we're all it's a volunteer LED race and it's got
such a family community to it. And in some ways that's what
people like about it. Yeah, it's a bit low key
compared with you go to your your mega professional UTMBS and
all this sort of stuff and, and they have their role, but not
everyone likes that sort of thing.
And you know, the West Highland way has its little niche and
it's very successful niche because we just try to do things
right by the runners, give the runners what we feel they want
and get their good experience. And we try to treat all the
runners the same. Whether it works, I don't know.
Please, please give us some feedback.
But we try to make the sort of the fast runners equally as
important as the runners who are Mason the cut offs.
It's their race. Basically the the West time away
is that challenge for their to everyone to to attempt and
embrace. What I've seen over the years is
that there have been big name runners coming in and try to
take on the West Island Way, but it's the ones that spend the
time on the West Island Way, put in the graft on the way that are
successful at it. Yeah, yeah, I think you're
right. Yeah.
That's not to say that if killing of the communist crime
can move on to it. And can I just ask as well,
Adrian, if Jim and Francesco happen to listen to this
podcast, is that an invitation that they don't have to enter
the ballot to get in? How do I diplomatically answer
that one in the anti criteria? If you look carefully I think.
I'm not sure whether it's me or Ian who crafted this sentence
many years ago. The rules of entry are all there
on the website. But there is this wonderful
catch all phrase that we would accept anyone who we feel will.
I can't even say that words will contribute contribute to the
improvement of the race. Yes.
So it's a bit of a catch all that sort of says OK, if if
Kelly decided in March he wants to come and run the West Island
way, he probably wouldn't say no if Kelly.
Had decided the day before. I don't think we would say no
either. Well, that might have just the
problems and Martin Stone just the timing might have a few
issues to sort of put them down about I'll.
I'll I'll personally draw his bed for him.
If Kelly wants to do it, I think we can.
Twist some arms. Having said that, being involved
with GB teams and that going to championships and following the
the elite scene was for a little bit, they have their not their
only gender. As such, the life of a top pro
athlete is very short. You might get 4-5, six years at
the top. You've got to pick your battles
and pick the races you really want to do and the ones if
you're trying to be a full time athlete, the ones that are going
to pay the bills basically, and the West Holloway is not going
to do that. And for those tuning in as well,
Adrian, that aren't aware, because as you've just mentioned
there, the entry opens as we are recording tonight, this
Saturday, we are recording on the Wednesday.
What is the entry criteria to get your name into the ballot?
Gosh, that's putting me on the spot.
Sorry, Adrian. OK, I'm going.
Let's go in character here. I think I John will correct me
if I'm wrong. John Monroe, who is, I think you
have to run A65K race in the last two, maybe three years.
You check on the West side, www.westhighlandway.org for the
entry qualifications. And the caveat to that is it
must be a race that has some sort of elevation in it.
Marathons are out, Commerce Marathon is out, Edinburgh,
Glasgow Canal Race is out, River Airway is out.
Basically, you're going over the you're going to be in Highland
country. You could be running over the
Devil's Staircase and over the Larry Gore in the middle of the
night. Was it blowing a huli even in
July? We want to know.
You can look after yourself. Yeah.
So we need to know you've done a race whereby you at least have
had some elevation and got up to, you know, a few 100 feet up.
And it's fairly technical terrain.
It's not a manicure canal pass. It's flat that you can look
after yourself and have accomplished something that is a
challenge, you know, and can be transferred to the West Island
Way. Because I've, I've been guilty
of encouraging many people to do things way out of their comfort
zone over the years. I think it's charged many times
and they've done it. Exactly.
They stepped up and done it. So I'd be the first one to
encourage anybody to put their hat in the ring for the Highland
Way. You can do it.
Anybody can do it now. You've seen them, but just have
that patience and that little, that little thing that just nags
away in here. I think I could do this.
You know, it will happen. You have that that little flame
will get brighter over the course of two 3-4 years.
And just in case Adrian has missed something, I I can't
think of anything they has. We have had Ian BE and Keith
Hughes and other guests on previously that evolved summed
up similar things. So go and listen to that
episode. It's going on the website.
Don't. Don't use Adrian as an excuse
that you missed something, that you haven't done your own
research. And the final question that we
have, unless make as anything else as you are a busy man that
we have gathered from this podcast, definitely what is next
for you in general, whether it be running or vase directing,
What have you got coming up? My next gig is I am helping out
to Scottish short course cross country in a couple of weeks at
LANIC. Yeah as well many hats that I
wear. I'm also an off track official.
I'm a qualified time keeper of those days, cross country
official. I love cross country in the
winter. Anyone listening to this,
whatever their level, they've never done a cross country race.
Just find one. They are just the most fun thing
in the world to incorporate into winter training.
I was at come back all over the weekend.
I started saying this earlier. Over the last eight weeks I've
been in New York for the 3100 mile race.
One end of the spectrum. I came home and then went off to
the Pyrenees for the World Trail champs with the GB team.
And then two weekends ago I was in France as a spectator and a
wannabe journalist at the World 24 hour Championships, which is
quite interesting. Then last week I was at
Cumbernauld for the Scottish cross country relays and cross
country is just bit like the family the rest time and the way
you've got Olympians like Megan Keith and Andy Butcher out there
and you've got this run-of-the-mill club runners
just going out and just having the time of their lives running,
just killing themselves doing the 4K cross country 4K for
God's sake. You know, it's just so sure it's
over before you know it, but all human life is there from sort of
11 year olds, right? So we were just sort of
eight-year olds just mixing it and just showing what a vibrant
sport athletics is. So you say the.
The cross country community and people, especially the runners,
come under the same category as failed runners to me, which is a
different level in Beast. I honestly caught cross country
terrifies me. You you, you say that the cross
country is what, 4K? And your New York race is 5K?
OK, it's 5000K but. Exactly.
It's all got its place, so, but I guess it's the same with
running all your technology, all your gadgets, all your gizmos,
It's all got its place. Whether the places they've been
or whether it's actually in use, we'll see.
But anyway, thank you Adrian for coming on tonight.
Thank you Nikki for being Nikki and it's goodbye from me.
Thanks, Adrian. Thank you.
And entries open on Saturday 1st of November for this year next
year's West Highland Way race.