1 00:00:23,600 --> 00:00:27,680 Welcome back to another episode of Runto done today. 2 00:00:27,680 --> 00:00:35,960 I'm joined by the newly crowned W Helen Way Champion as of It's 3 00:00:35,960 --> 00:00:40,720 been 3-4 days now. Yeah, I've lost count because I, 4 00:00:40,720 --> 00:00:42,280 I don't know about you, but I didn't sleep. 5 00:00:44,200 --> 00:00:48,960 So Charlotte McKenna, congratulations. 6 00:00:49,640 --> 00:00:52,040 Thanks very much. Yeah, thanks for having me on. 7 00:00:52,480 --> 00:00:54,280 So it's good to be with Helen Way champion. 8 00:00:56,760 --> 00:01:02,680 So before we get on to the the topic of the the moment, can you 9 00:01:02,680 --> 00:01:05,440 tell me how you started off running? 10 00:01:06,560 --> 00:01:11,240 I, I got into it kind of, yeah, pure by chance. 11 00:01:11,600 --> 00:01:14,440 I used to work down at down in London and there was a group 12 00:01:14,440 --> 00:01:18,720 there they got, they were doing the Hyde Park release. 13 00:01:19,520 --> 00:01:21,360 So yeah, just a bit of a fun thing. 14 00:01:21,360 --> 00:01:24,240 But we basically put together A-Team and that sort of got me 15 00:01:24,480 --> 00:01:28,160 started and then maybe about six months later I properly started. 16 00:01:28,160 --> 00:01:31,080 So yeah, that was kind of the start of start of it all. 17 00:01:31,640 --> 00:01:35,400 That was back in 2010, I think, Yeah. 2010, that's, that's 18 00:01:35,480 --> 00:01:42,000 probably about, yeah, I think it's 2009 I started running. 19 00:01:42,040 --> 00:01:44,840 So we're about the same, same vintage. 20 00:01:46,760 --> 00:01:49,080 Maturing well, hopefully. Yeah, hopefully. 21 00:01:49,200 --> 00:01:51,240 Well, we're still running, so we can't be that badly. 22 00:01:52,640 --> 00:01:55,640 So what was the first race that you did? 23 00:01:56,400 --> 00:02:00,200 I suppose that was actually the first race to the Hyde Park 24 00:02:00,200 --> 00:02:04,560 release. I mean, yeah, if you call it a 25 00:02:04,560 --> 00:02:06,240 race, it was. It was a race event. 26 00:02:06,520 --> 00:02:10,880 But it was more for, yeah, more of a well, some, some, some 27 00:02:10,880 --> 00:02:12,400 teams took a serious third team Weren't. 28 00:02:12,440 --> 00:02:16,000 Yeah. If it's not fun, why taking 29 00:02:16,000 --> 00:02:17,440 part? Exactly. 30 00:02:18,520 --> 00:02:20,800 I think, I think probably Bristol half more than the 31 00:02:20,800 --> 00:02:25,040 following year was sort of my first event, I think, yeah, my 32 00:02:25,040 --> 00:02:27,600 first like an individual sort of event that I aim for. 33 00:02:27,720 --> 00:02:32,640 Yeah. Have you sort of went up the up 34 00:02:32,640 --> 00:02:36,640 the distances of the traditional, you do the 5K10K 35 00:02:36,640 --> 00:02:40,200 half marathon, have you followed that or he went straight into 36 00:02:40,200 --> 00:02:43,800 ultras to? To some degree. 37 00:02:44,880 --> 00:02:48,760 So I think it started off at the half and then maybe the next 38 00:02:48,760 --> 00:02:50,360 year I think I'd done my first marathon. 39 00:02:50,600 --> 00:02:54,160 So I've quite quickly moved up to marathon unless they moved up 40 00:02:54,160 --> 00:02:56,800 kind of, yeah, took on the challenge of a marathon. 41 00:02:57,640 --> 00:03:01,280 But I, I more or less stayed at marathon for the next 10 or so 42 00:03:01,280 --> 00:03:05,800 years trying to better my time. And I think I've done a couple 43 00:03:05,800 --> 00:03:07,400 of ultra. Well, I did do a couple of 44 00:03:07,400 --> 00:03:10,440 ultras in there, but they were more just to try out. 45 00:03:10,440 --> 00:03:13,680 I wasn't really thinking ultras at the time, but I tried to 46 00:03:13,680 --> 00:03:18,040 focus on yeah, try and prove my marathon to do What typical Rd. 47 00:03:18,040 --> 00:03:20,720 runners do is try to yeah, beat the clock if you can. 48 00:03:20,800 --> 00:03:25,080 The the typical question, they don't get so much in ultras, but 49 00:03:25,080 --> 00:03:27,440 for marathon, what's your marathon PB? 50 00:03:28,560 --> 00:03:33,880 It's that's two, yeah, 224. So I kind of ran out a couple of 51 00:03:33,880 --> 00:03:36,880 years in a row and have been declining since. 52 00:03:38,640 --> 00:03:40,160 What? What would you say your PB is? 53 00:03:40,160 --> 00:03:43,120 Well, not your PB, your your current marathon time is. 54 00:03:44,520 --> 00:03:48,040 I think I would say it's probably around 2:28. 55 00:03:48,680 --> 00:03:51,600 Yeah, I'd certainly like like I'd go under 230 still. 56 00:03:52,680 --> 00:03:54,960 I'm sorry. Yeah, I was at 2:24 and then I 57 00:03:54,960 --> 00:03:58,120 sort of gradually started adding in a minute each year sort of 58 00:03:58,120 --> 00:04:00,880 thing. That said, I've upped my mileage 59 00:04:00,880 --> 00:04:04,800 more since and actually even my 5K times and stuff have come 60 00:04:04,800 --> 00:04:06,760 down. So it's possible the Marathon 61 00:04:07,320 --> 00:04:11,000 might be better than I I think that's I would say yeah. 62 00:04:11,000 --> 00:04:14,080 I I feel like I'm slowing down and at Marathon PS5. 63 00:04:14,440 --> 00:04:18,519 You say you're slowing down, but 99% of people out there but 64 00:04:18,519 --> 00:04:25,240 still say that under 2 1/2 hours is unachievable Dream, yeah. 65 00:04:25,760 --> 00:04:27,840 That's that's the thing with all sorts of running. 66 00:04:27,840 --> 00:04:31,760 It's, it's all relative. So yeah, yeah, you know, 224 is 67 00:04:31,760 --> 00:04:34,320 not going to set anybody alike like when you're thinking, you 68 00:04:34,320 --> 00:04:37,040 know, UK standard. But yeah, certainly it's a big 69 00:04:37,040 --> 00:04:38,680 thing for some people. OK. 70 00:04:39,080 --> 00:04:47,280 And talking about other races other than the West Island way, 71 00:04:47,920 --> 00:04:52,760 have you got any sort of bigger standout races that you can name 72 00:04:53,000 --> 00:04:55,280 that you've done? Yeah. 73 00:04:55,280 --> 00:04:57,880 Some of my first 100 Miller was last year, which was the 74 00:04:57,880 --> 00:05:01,600 Lakeland 100. So that was that was that was a 75 00:05:01,600 --> 00:05:05,440 huge challenge for me actually. But yeah, so that was that was 76 00:05:05,440 --> 00:05:08,960 obviously a big one. And then I suppose I've done 77 00:05:08,960 --> 00:05:10,960 lakes in a day. That was a 50 Miller. 78 00:05:10,960 --> 00:05:13,640 That was a good one. I've done it. 79 00:05:13,640 --> 00:05:17,800 It's just 100K on the road. The Anglo Celtic plate last 80 00:05:17,800 --> 00:05:21,760 year, ACP. So those are sort of the 81 00:05:21,760 --> 00:05:23,720 biggest, yeah, the big ones I've done. 82 00:05:24,120 --> 00:05:29,320 Yeah, there's a bit of a difference between the ACP and 83 00:05:29,560 --> 00:05:33,320 the Lakeland. How do you train for both of 84 00:05:33,320 --> 00:05:38,000 those? Apparently by similar football I 85 00:05:38,080 --> 00:05:42,720 might not be taxed. So yeah, I think for the for the 86 00:05:42,720 --> 00:05:46,600 ACPA, can it just, well, actually most of the time I keep 87 00:05:46,600 --> 00:05:49,320 them a similar sort of training routine during the week and then 88 00:05:49,320 --> 00:05:52,760 I just up the week, the weekend mileage, the long run mileage. 89 00:05:53,840 --> 00:05:57,680 So going into ACP had a really good kind of training stint or 90 00:05:57,680 --> 00:06:01,720 block if you like. And I suppose after that I just 91 00:06:01,720 --> 00:06:06,240 maybe did a wee bit more off, off or my off road because most 92 00:06:06,240 --> 00:06:08,520 of my running tends to be road running. 93 00:06:10,080 --> 00:06:12,680 But yeah, I put in a wee bit more in the trails, partly 94 00:06:12,680 --> 00:06:14,200 racking the course and stuff like that. 95 00:06:14,200 --> 00:06:17,480 So naturally I kind of spend more time on the trails, but the 96 00:06:17,480 --> 00:06:21,120 kind of approach was very similar and similar in terms of, 97 00:06:21,560 --> 00:06:23,480 you know, the peak mileage and stuff like that, so. 98 00:06:24,760 --> 00:06:29,440 What kind of you say you did the same thing on a normal week? 99 00:06:29,440 --> 00:06:31,400 What would a normal week involve? 100 00:06:32,640 --> 00:06:34,720 Yeah. So there's, well, I guess 101 00:06:34,720 --> 00:06:36,720 there's, there's one interval session there usually on a 102 00:06:36,720 --> 00:06:41,440 Tuesday and then there's usually a hill session on a Thursday. 103 00:06:41,440 --> 00:06:45,600 And then the weekends would be the long run or if it's 104 00:06:45,600 --> 00:06:48,320 something building up to something big, maybe a double 105 00:06:48,320 --> 00:06:51,920 weekend it. Is Tuesday Thursday? 106 00:06:51,920 --> 00:06:56,560 Is that with a club? No, that's, that's just, yeah, 107 00:06:56,560 --> 00:06:58,880 just the personal, I think. So. 108 00:06:58,880 --> 00:07:02,160 I used to I used to go to club sessions and they actually 109 00:07:02,160 --> 00:07:04,560 happened to be on a Tuesday. So maybe I just got into that 110 00:07:04,560 --> 00:07:07,000 routine. But I find it works well because 111 00:07:07,200 --> 00:07:08,760 I could do the long run on Sunday. 112 00:07:08,800 --> 00:07:11,440 I'm reasonably, I wouldn't necessarily say fresh, but 113 00:07:11,440 --> 00:07:15,520 Tuesday, but I'm I'm really recovered to do the interval and 114 00:07:15,520 --> 00:07:19,640 then Thursday's kind of yeah, again, hills is slightly using 115 00:07:19,640 --> 00:07:21,960 slightly different muscles and then I'm sort of ready again for 116 00:07:21,960 --> 00:07:24,480 the long run at the weekend. So I kind of the pattern were 117 00:07:24,480 --> 00:07:29,040 sort of works for me quite well. Where about you're you're from 118 00:07:29,040 --> 00:07:30,760 Northern Ireland, but where about are you staying at the 119 00:07:30,760 --> 00:07:34,680 moment? In Newcastle, up on Thames NE 120 00:07:34,680 --> 00:07:38,680 England OK. So how's the the hills around 121 00:07:38,680 --> 00:07:42,240 there? In Newcastle, the South, not so 122 00:07:42,240 --> 00:07:44,440 much. I mean there is a little bit of 123 00:07:44,440 --> 00:07:48,280 L actually, to be fair, if you wanted to find hills like the 124 00:07:48,280 --> 00:07:51,800 time by the Tyne, it kind of sinks down as it goes in. 125 00:07:52,920 --> 00:07:57,000 But I don't do too much. I mean I do my reps on on a kind 126 00:07:57,000 --> 00:07:59,160 of local hill, which is not particularly long. 127 00:07:59,440 --> 00:08:02,040 You maybe get about 50 seconds uphill in it. 128 00:08:02,880 --> 00:08:06,080 But if I want to get out into like the real hills, I mean up 129 00:08:06,080 --> 00:08:09,160 into the Northumberland, yeah, up up Northumberland, like the 130 00:08:09,160 --> 00:08:12,760 Cheviots and stuff. And sometimes I'll go over to 131 00:08:12,760 --> 00:08:15,360 the lakes. So if I want to get real, yeah 132 00:08:15,440 --> 00:08:20,480 more well mounted type of hills. I I've done a race starting in 133 00:08:20,480 --> 00:08:24,880 Whitehaven and finishing in Tynemouth, yes. 134 00:08:25,360 --> 00:08:30,160 So I wouldn't say that I know the area well because I think it 135 00:08:30,160 --> 00:08:34,799 was about 31 hours it took me and by the time I got to 136 00:08:34,799 --> 00:08:37,480 Newcastle I've no idea. I can't remember. 137 00:08:39,640 --> 00:08:43,480 It's a nice area, it's a good place to live and yes, it's easy 138 00:08:43,480 --> 00:08:47,040 getting out to different areas, like I say, up up to upper 139 00:08:47,040 --> 00:08:50,160 Northumberland and over to Cumbria if you need. 140 00:08:52,120 --> 00:08:56,400 So going back to your your races, other than the West Helen 141 00:08:56,400 --> 00:08:59,920 way that you obviously just won, what's your biggest achievement? 142 00:09:03,520 --> 00:09:06,520 It's, it's, it's I would say it's hard to differentiate. 143 00:09:06,960 --> 00:09:10,360 Like probably on paper, maybe the Anglo Celtic played last 144 00:09:10,360 --> 00:09:13,960 year would be just be being the British championships and stuff. 145 00:09:13,960 --> 00:09:17,680 So just kind of stand out. Personally, I think my best 146 00:09:17,680 --> 00:09:19,400 effort was probably the Lakes in a day. 147 00:09:21,200 --> 00:09:25,280 I I managed to get the record for that and it was, it was I 148 00:09:25,280 --> 00:09:27,200 had to go full out the whole time. 149 00:09:28,200 --> 00:09:31,160 So yeah, that was probably on a personal level, that was maybe 150 00:09:31,160 --> 00:09:34,640 my toughest race, if you like, in terms of pushing myself and 151 00:09:34,680 --> 00:09:41,920 getting the best for myself. And going back on to the the 152 00:09:41,920 --> 00:09:46,960 rest of the moment in the West Island way, did everything go to 153 00:09:46,960 --> 00:09:50,960 plan? It's certainly winning it. 154 00:09:50,960 --> 00:09:53,440 Yeah, that was better than planned. 155 00:09:54,880 --> 00:09:59,360 I'd, I'd say the first half was tough and just in terms of I, I 156 00:09:59,360 --> 00:10:06,000 found it difficult to nutrition wise, yeah, I wasn't, I wasn't 157 00:10:06,000 --> 00:10:07,840 terrible, but I wasn't feeling great. 158 00:10:09,160 --> 00:10:13,120 And then I, I, well, I was sort of sick around Octatar, which 159 00:10:13,120 --> 00:10:18,920 is, I think this is it like 5051 mile in or something, I can't 160 00:10:18,920 --> 00:10:23,920 remember exactly. Yeah. 44949 yeah. 161 00:10:23,920 --> 00:10:27,760 So let's say roughly halfway. And then suddenly after that, 162 00:10:27,760 --> 00:10:31,560 everything changed and the the running really started to feel 163 00:10:31,760 --> 00:10:34,920 more fluid. And from there onwards, it was 164 00:10:34,920 --> 00:10:37,160 pretty standard. I didn't even try to take on 165 00:10:37,160 --> 00:10:41,560 solid food after that. I just, yeah, just, well, Coke 166 00:10:41,640 --> 00:10:45,680 kind of kept me, kept me going, but yeah, things things were 167 00:10:45,680 --> 00:10:47,280 going well. So I didn't need to change 168 00:10:47,280 --> 00:10:49,200 anything and it felt good from there on. 169 00:10:49,960 --> 00:10:53,400 A lot of people think, oh, that's a bad question to ask, 170 00:10:53,400 --> 00:10:55,200 that it go well. Of course it went well, you won 171 00:10:55,200 --> 00:11:00,560 the race, but it just shows that it doesn't go well for like just 172 00:11:00,560 --> 00:11:03,160 because you won the race, it doesn't mean say that everything 173 00:11:03,160 --> 00:11:04,240 went exactly. How you? 174 00:11:04,240 --> 00:11:08,080 Absolutely. So it kind of leads on to my 175 00:11:08,080 --> 00:11:11,000 next question. If things did go to plan, do you 176 00:11:11,000 --> 00:11:17,040 think you could improve? I would think so, like so I 177 00:11:17,040 --> 00:11:20,280 don't know. I would say on Saturday, on 178 00:11:20,280 --> 00:11:24,160 Saturday EE, even without the stomach issues, I'm not sure 179 00:11:24,160 --> 00:11:26,320 that I've got too much more out of myself. 180 00:11:26,360 --> 00:11:29,560 I think with my fitness where I was on Saturday, I probably got 181 00:11:29,720 --> 00:11:31,600 very close to as good as I could have got. 182 00:11:32,520 --> 00:11:35,560 I don't think I went into it for the full fitness. 183 00:11:35,560 --> 00:11:39,040 So in that sense, I feel like maybe, maybe there was more to 184 00:11:39,040 --> 00:11:42,440 be got there. But I, I think on the day it 185 00:11:42,440 --> 00:11:44,800 went more or less, I got as much as I could have. 186 00:11:45,160 --> 00:11:48,200 Maybe maybe those earlier parts maybe could have run away a bit 187 00:11:48,200 --> 00:11:50,440 more freely and got a little bit more time. 188 00:11:50,560 --> 00:11:55,280 But yeah, I would have been, I'm talking minutes here or you 189 00:11:55,280 --> 00:11:58,200 know, 5-10 minutes of this, not huge amounts. 190 00:11:58,880 --> 00:12:03,520 I I first saw you after tire farm, as you said it was when 191 00:12:03,520 --> 00:12:08,640 you weren't feeling that great. Yeah, that was probably my low 192 00:12:08,640 --> 00:12:12,520 actually, if I'm honest, or at least, yeah, the three miles 193 00:12:12,520 --> 00:12:16,400 going into that. But it it flipped a flicked the 194 00:12:16,400 --> 00:12:19,320 switch literally as I went to leave Octa Tower Farm. 195 00:12:20,320 --> 00:12:27,080 Yeah, I was, I was sick. And almost immediately it just 196 00:12:27,080 --> 00:12:29,840 started working for me and yeah, the legs were running again. 197 00:12:30,640 --> 00:12:34,280 You came into the farm and Robbie was right beside you, 198 00:12:34,280 --> 00:12:36,280 Robbie Dunlop, who finished second. 199 00:12:36,920 --> 00:12:40,440 Had you been running with him previous to that or? 200 00:12:40,440 --> 00:12:43,240 Yeah, yeah. So I think early on there was a 201 00:12:43,800 --> 00:12:48,000 fair, fairly sized group of us and Robbie was in with that 202 00:12:48,000 --> 00:12:51,600 group. And then kind of leading into 203 00:12:51,640 --> 00:12:57,440 our Roar, Denon and I was running with Robbie and having a 204 00:12:57,440 --> 00:12:58,800 bit of a chat and stuff with them. 205 00:12:59,280 --> 00:13:01,320 And then I sort of lost him a wee bit coming out of Roar 206 00:13:01,320 --> 00:13:02,920 Denim. I took a wee bit longer than 207 00:13:02,920 --> 00:13:07,360 him, but then I caught up with him by Emerson Ed and then we 208 00:13:07,360 --> 00:13:11,000 ran together pretty much two octave tower for him at that 209 00:13:11,000 --> 00:13:13,920 point. And yeah, it was really good 210 00:13:13,920 --> 00:13:17,320 company running with him. He's he's he's a quite a chatty 211 00:13:17,440 --> 00:13:19,160 good guy. Yeah, fun guy. 212 00:13:19,160 --> 00:13:23,840 So half the miles, especially at the time when I, I think I was 213 00:13:23,880 --> 00:13:28,040 in a bit of a low. Yeah, yeah, it was it was nice 214 00:13:28,040 --> 00:13:29,400 for him. I almost felt like he was 215 00:13:29,400 --> 00:13:32,040 dragging me along at times. So I was trying to keep keep 216 00:13:32,040 --> 00:13:36,680 with him. So do you think that if you said 217 00:13:36,680 --> 00:13:40,560 he was dragging you along, did that keep you going or was that 218 00:13:41,280 --> 00:13:44,160 you weren't You were running his race rather than your own race 219 00:13:44,160 --> 00:13:50,440 or not? Yeah, I think it's hard to know 220 00:13:50,440 --> 00:13:52,840 how it would have been if I was on my own. 221 00:13:52,840 --> 00:13:56,160 I think he he was very good along that sort of rocky 222 00:13:56,160 --> 00:14:00,040 technical bit along the the Loch Lomond along the side of it. 223 00:14:00,040 --> 00:14:04,240 So I enjoyed that actually, kind of just keep in with them. 224 00:14:04,240 --> 00:14:06,520 It kept me good with them going for me. 225 00:14:07,040 --> 00:14:09,680 And then I think we're both running really well. 226 00:14:09,920 --> 00:14:13,280 Like to be in class and to be honest, I think he maybe 227 00:14:13,280 --> 00:14:15,760 struggled a wee bit before Octatar as well. 228 00:14:16,320 --> 00:14:19,520 But we're going through some quiet moments and I think we 229 00:14:19,560 --> 00:14:22,440 were, yeah, we were both maybe struggling a little bit to some 230 00:14:22,440 --> 00:14:25,160 extent. So I think having his company 231 00:14:25,160 --> 00:14:28,560 really, yeah, managed to kind of keep the mind off the fact that 232 00:14:28,560 --> 00:14:31,040 maybe it was wasn't a bit of a low at that point. 233 00:14:33,240 --> 00:14:39,200 Just thinking were you like going along what they call lock 234 00:14:39,200 --> 00:14:44,480 side, the sort of technical, but had you been there before? 235 00:14:45,400 --> 00:14:49,480 Yeah, so I've done the whole course last summer over like 5 236 00:14:49,480 --> 00:14:52,120 days. I took a, took a family on a 237 00:14:52,120 --> 00:14:56,120 camping trip, so my wife and kids are pretty tolerable. 238 00:14:57,040 --> 00:14:59,040 So yeah. So basically last summer, I'd, 239 00:14:59,080 --> 00:15:03,120 I'd run, you know, segment and did move the tent and we'd sort 240 00:15:03,120 --> 00:15:06,000 of move on all our way up, up, up, along course. 241 00:15:06,000 --> 00:15:09,080 So I'd done it all once last summer, as I say. 242 00:15:09,360 --> 00:15:11,560 So I kind of knew what to expect, yeah. 243 00:15:11,680 --> 00:15:16,080 Yeah, and when you were running with him, were you running ahead 244 00:15:16,080 --> 00:15:19,720 of him or behind him? Were you sort of watching where 245 00:15:19,720 --> 00:15:23,000 his feet were? Is I know that Robbie's done it 246 00:15:23,200 --> 00:15:25,080 many, many times. He knows the course. 247 00:15:25,080 --> 00:15:28,000 So it's like, do you use that advantage? 248 00:15:29,720 --> 00:15:31,600 I was, I was definitely running behind him. 249 00:15:33,160 --> 00:15:36,320 Yeah, not nothing intentionally, but as I said, I almost felt 250 00:15:36,320 --> 00:15:40,160 like he was dragging me. But I was, I wasn't really 251 00:15:40,160 --> 00:15:42,280 watching his feet. I was just concentrating on, 252 00:15:42,320 --> 00:15:44,520 yeah, just concentrating where I was putting my own feet. 253 00:15:44,520 --> 00:15:50,120 But I mean, I'm reasonable on that sort of paper terrain 254 00:15:50,120 --> 00:15:52,120 anyway. It's, it's, it's when it's 255 00:15:52,120 --> 00:15:54,400 technical downhill stuff that that's where I struggled. 256 00:15:54,400 --> 00:15:56,800 But on the flat technical, it was, it was OK. 257 00:15:57,000 --> 00:15:59,840 I was just, he had a good momentum going and I was, it was 258 00:15:59,840 --> 00:16:02,280 quite nice trying to keep with him because it kind of meant I 259 00:16:02,280 --> 00:16:03,640 had a good momentum going as well. 260 00:16:03,640 --> 00:16:09,920 So OK. And I'd remember Octa Tire, 261 00:16:09,920 --> 00:16:13,000 there was two guys with you. Is that your main crew? 262 00:16:13,440 --> 00:16:15,280 Yeah, that's that's Craig and Mick. 263 00:16:15,280 --> 00:16:19,480 They're two brothers, so yeah, they they came up from, well, 264 00:16:19,760 --> 00:16:22,400 Newcastle and Hex. I'm so kind of up this area. 265 00:16:22,400 --> 00:16:25,880 So they both came up with us. Yeah, they were, they were 266 00:16:25,880 --> 00:16:27,320 fantastic. I would have. 267 00:16:27,800 --> 00:16:31,320 Well, yeah, they give up obviously a lot of time and they 268 00:16:31,320 --> 00:16:34,480 were really engaged and it was excellent. 269 00:16:34,920 --> 00:16:38,320 Good they experienced. Have they they accrued for 270 00:16:38,320 --> 00:16:41,400 people before. I don't think they experienced 271 00:16:41,400 --> 00:16:43,040 accruing. They're they're good runners in 272 00:16:43,040 --> 00:16:46,080 themselves, but more in a short distance. 273 00:16:46,080 --> 00:16:49,400 So I think it was kind of their first intro into the ultra 274 00:16:49,400 --> 00:16:53,960 experience if you like. So but yeah, they we talked 275 00:16:53,960 --> 00:16:55,480 through like nutrition and things like that. 276 00:16:55,480 --> 00:16:58,240 So we kind of share that interesting comment. 277 00:16:58,240 --> 00:16:59,440 So yeah, they're definitely runners. 278 00:16:59,440 --> 00:17:00,640 So it's. Yeah, that helps. 279 00:17:01,240 --> 00:17:05,000 So have you inspired or convinced them to? 280 00:17:06,000 --> 00:17:07,920 Will you be crewing for them next year? 281 00:17:08,440 --> 00:17:12,400 I would love to yeah, there's there's a lay the challenge out 282 00:17:12,400 --> 00:17:15,000 for them. Yeah, it did actually send a 283 00:17:15,000 --> 00:17:18,480 message saying yeah, they they might be turned towards ultra, 284 00:17:18,480 --> 00:17:20,720 but I don't know if they were getting or anything. 285 00:17:20,760 --> 00:17:25,440 Yes, but now I think, I think the whole, the whole events, it 286 00:17:25,440 --> 00:17:28,240 has a nice feel to it. And I think if you're surrounded 287 00:17:28,240 --> 00:17:32,120 by event, it's hard not to kind of feel at least a wee bit of, 288 00:17:32,120 --> 00:17:35,040 you know, that warmth and that excitement about it that you 289 00:17:35,040 --> 00:17:36,400 might actually be tempted yourself. 290 00:17:36,480 --> 00:17:40,880 So yeah. And leading up to the race you 291 00:17:40,880 --> 00:17:44,360 said you did wreckage, you said you've how you train on a weekly 292 00:17:44,360 --> 00:17:48,320 basis. What about other like cross 293 00:17:48,320 --> 00:17:50,560 training? Do you do anything else? 294 00:17:52,080 --> 00:17:55,040 I've started doing some equity jogging. 295 00:17:55,640 --> 00:17:58,520 So basically I got injured towards the back end of last 296 00:17:58,520 --> 00:18:04,440 year and those injuries actually kind of continued, yeah, well 297 00:18:04,440 --> 00:18:06,720 into this year. So that's where I felt a bit 298 00:18:06,720 --> 00:18:08,760 underprepared going into the West Highland way. 299 00:18:09,480 --> 00:18:13,080 But throughout that I kind of kept, well, I started equity 300 00:18:13,080 --> 00:18:14,760 jogging and I kind of kept it going. 301 00:18:15,360 --> 00:18:18,640 So in that sense, yeah. If you call that cross training, 302 00:18:18,640 --> 00:18:21,240 then yeah. Otherwise, not really. 303 00:18:21,240 --> 00:18:25,400 I do, I go through little phases of me maybe doing weep as a 304 00:18:25,400 --> 00:18:30,480 strength, like not, not even with stuff, just body with sort 305 00:18:30,480 --> 00:18:33,880 of exercises and things. But I'm not very good at them. 306 00:18:33,920 --> 00:18:37,400 So I I kind of do them for a few weeks and then I lose interest 307 00:18:37,400 --> 00:18:39,960 and maybe come back to them when I get an interview or something. 308 00:18:42,320 --> 00:18:45,680 What about, like work? Are you on your feet all day? 309 00:18:45,760 --> 00:18:47,400 Are you sitting at an office like me? 310 00:18:47,920 --> 00:18:50,760 Yeah, I'm mostly sitting. Sitting at a desk at an office. 311 00:18:51,720 --> 00:18:54,840 Yeah, move around a wee bit, but mostly sitting and computer 312 00:18:54,840 --> 00:18:56,960 based. Yeah. 313 00:18:57,880 --> 00:19:02,040 No, but I guess for me that's one of the reasons why I run, 314 00:19:02,040 --> 00:19:03,960 because you're you're setting it to the computer all day. 315 00:19:03,960 --> 00:19:06,600 You want to get outside. Yeah, no, absolutely. 316 00:19:06,600 --> 00:19:08,320 And I guess you can look at it two ways. 317 00:19:08,320 --> 00:19:11,840 You can look at that as recovery time and you know you're you're 318 00:19:11,960 --> 00:19:15,040 giving your legs a good rest. So when you do come to your 319 00:19:15,040 --> 00:19:18,920 fresh. So yeah, but ideally if I have 320 00:19:18,920 --> 00:19:22,080 had a dream job, I'd sort of be using the feet a lot more and be 321 00:19:22,120 --> 00:19:28,280 a bit more active, yeah. And during the race, what like 322 00:19:28,280 --> 00:19:33,080 you said you had you turned to non solids after halfway? 323 00:19:33,400 --> 00:19:36,480 What was the plan for? What were you meant to be 324 00:19:36,480 --> 00:19:40,280 eating? Yeah, so this is where I, I 325 00:19:40,280 --> 00:19:41,960 guess experience in Ultra's come in. 326 00:19:41,960 --> 00:19:46,200 So, so last year in Lakeland I had similar issues, actually 327 00:19:46,200 --> 00:19:50,080 worse to be honest. So in Lakeland I tried to use 328 00:19:50,080 --> 00:19:55,400 like, you know, those energy drinks, like the powder format. 329 00:19:55,400 --> 00:19:57,640 And then that's at the checkpoints. 330 00:19:57,640 --> 00:19:59,600 I take on solid foods and stuff like that. 331 00:19:59,600 --> 00:20:03,400 But I really was very sick in in during Lakeland Hundred last 332 00:20:03,400 --> 00:20:05,960 year. And so my plan for this one was 333 00:20:05,960 --> 00:20:07,120 to. Oh, sorry. 334 00:20:07,120 --> 00:20:09,360 The only thing that got through me Lakeland Hundred last year 335 00:20:09,360 --> 00:20:11,920 was Coke. I'd never drank Coke before in a 336 00:20:11,920 --> 00:20:14,160 race, but that was what I was on offer. 337 00:20:14,160 --> 00:20:17,120 The checkpoints and I the energy drinks were repulsing me. 338 00:20:17,120 --> 00:20:20,640 So I turned to Coke and actually found it worked really well for 339 00:20:20,640 --> 00:20:23,160 me. So my plan this time was to 340 00:20:23,400 --> 00:20:27,280 basically use Coke as my main liquid and energy obviously in 341 00:20:27,280 --> 00:20:28,720 there too. And it's got caffeine and stuff, 342 00:20:28,720 --> 00:20:31,680 which is great. I bought supplement that with 343 00:20:31,680 --> 00:20:34,000 gels. So that was sort of the plan, 344 00:20:35,160 --> 00:20:38,160 but yeah, the gels worked initially a little bit, but then 345 00:20:38,280 --> 00:20:42,400 yeah, it didn't really, yes, I mean, it's sort of yeah. 346 00:20:42,960 --> 00:20:45,600 You start feeling sickly and like I just the appetite for 347 00:20:45,600 --> 00:20:49,240 them wasn't there. So I, I, the other plan was to 348 00:20:49,240 --> 00:20:52,280 sort of some of the checkpoints take on little bits of solid, 349 00:20:52,280 --> 00:20:54,520 like bits of rice and porridge and stuff. 350 00:20:54,520 --> 00:20:59,480 So not loads, but just a wee bits to add and break up. 351 00:20:59,480 --> 00:21:04,440 Also the gels, but yeah, didn't quite go to fully to plan in 352 00:21:04,440 --> 00:21:07,800 that sense. Yeah, And without asking you, 353 00:21:07,800 --> 00:21:11,520 what's your secret numbers? Do you have a target for 354 00:21:11,920 --> 00:21:14,280 calories, carbs, anything like that? 355 00:21:16,360 --> 00:21:21,200 Yeah, I suppose my, for, for this one, my, my target was 356 00:21:21,200 --> 00:21:28,680 around 75g per of of carbs. And that was based, well, it was 357 00:21:28,680 --> 00:21:30,640 based of, I don't know if you know, precision fuel and 358 00:21:30,640 --> 00:21:32,320 hydration day, this calculator thing. 359 00:21:32,320 --> 00:21:35,280 So I used that and to be honest, I wasn't far off why this were 360 00:21:35,280 --> 00:21:37,640 expected. Like for some previous things I 361 00:21:37,640 --> 00:21:40,920 was working off about 90. So that was kind of where I 362 00:21:40,920 --> 00:21:42,600 ballpark where I thought I should be. 363 00:21:44,160 --> 00:21:46,760 But I think in reality, I must have fell well short of that 364 00:21:46,760 --> 00:21:51,480 because I definitely, I would say 2/3 of that was to be based 365 00:21:51,480 --> 00:21:55,480 off the jails and there was definitely didn't go in after 366 00:21:55,480 --> 00:22:00,560 the first, you know, 1520 miles. So yeah, I think I was well 367 00:22:00,560 --> 00:22:05,480 below that unreality. OK. 368 00:22:05,680 --> 00:22:13,840 And you said actually no, it's been three or four days since 369 00:22:14,080 --> 00:22:16,320 the race. How do you feel now? 370 00:22:17,120 --> 00:22:18,720 Surprisingly good. Yeah. 371 00:22:20,680 --> 00:22:26,120 Yeah, I think that that evening wasn't good, but I managed later 372 00:22:26,120 --> 00:22:27,840 on that evening to get some food in me. 373 00:22:28,240 --> 00:22:31,760 And then I woke up the next day and I had a good breakfast and 374 00:22:32,440 --> 00:22:35,760 the the legs have been sore. So, so, so the eating came back 375 00:22:35,760 --> 00:22:39,400 actually pretty quickly, which after Lakeland Hundred last year 376 00:22:39,400 --> 00:22:43,040 took me good 3-4 days to really get appetite back. 377 00:22:43,040 --> 00:22:44,680 So that was that was really positive. 378 00:22:45,200 --> 00:22:47,360 And then the legs, this time they've been sore. 379 00:22:47,360 --> 00:22:50,480 But to be honest, I've, I've done marathons and they've been 380 00:22:50,480 --> 00:22:54,120 worse. So yeah, I would say even today 381 00:22:54,120 --> 00:22:56,520 I managed to go out for a gentle joke this morning. 382 00:22:56,520 --> 00:22:59,960 So which I wasn't really expected to, expected to, you 383 00:22:59,960 --> 00:23:02,400 know, take a good week before I even went out at all. 384 00:23:02,800 --> 00:23:05,280 So yeah, I'm really happy with how it's gone so far. 385 00:23:05,760 --> 00:23:08,760 And what, what kind of food have you been eating? 386 00:23:09,160 --> 00:23:13,160 Bush race, Just shoveling it in? Anything that'll go in. 387 00:23:13,640 --> 00:23:16,280 Yeah, pretty much. I'm not, I'm not the best in 388 00:23:16,280 --> 00:23:20,280 terms of in terms of good diet anyway. 389 00:23:20,320 --> 00:23:24,520 Like I'm not terrible diet, but I do eat a lot of sweet stuff 390 00:23:24,520 --> 00:23:25,880 and biscuits and things like that. 391 00:23:25,880 --> 00:23:29,480 So yeah, it's been awesome. Yeah. 392 00:23:29,680 --> 00:23:32,080 Just, yeah, just happy to eat anything. 393 00:23:32,080 --> 00:23:37,720 So yeah. And you said you were Aqua 394 00:23:37,720 --> 00:23:42,840 jogging because of injury. Do you want to go into like what 395 00:23:42,840 --> 00:23:45,440 kind of injuries? Yeah, would you? 396 00:23:45,440 --> 00:23:48,800 Recover them from there or have you had any bad injuries? 397 00:23:49,480 --> 00:23:52,960 Yeah, so I think up until last year I had I didn't really have 398 00:23:52,960 --> 00:23:55,920 any injuries that, you know, usual leggles that everyone 399 00:23:55,920 --> 00:23:58,920 gets, but nothing, nothing took me out more than a week or 400 00:23:58,920 --> 00:24:03,840 ending at a time. So last October I got a stress 401 00:24:03,840 --> 00:24:08,840 fracture on the tibula. It's the the one in the leg is 402 00:24:08,840 --> 00:24:10,760 not the width bearing one the I think. 403 00:24:10,920 --> 00:24:14,520 Yeah, Tibula. And so that took me out from 404 00:24:14,880 --> 00:24:16,760 October till the end of the year. 405 00:24:16,760 --> 00:24:20,560 And then I I just started to sort of build back into it's a 406 00:24:20,560 --> 00:24:23,040 slow build up after stress fracture, but I'll just sort of 407 00:24:23,040 --> 00:24:26,560 I was about six weeks into that and then the sciatic nerve 408 00:24:26,640 --> 00:24:29,720 problem came on. So it's give a really strong 409 00:24:29,920 --> 00:24:33,840 pain in my buttocks and those sort of sharp up into my back 410 00:24:33,840 --> 00:24:37,040 and stuff. So I was out for another good 411 00:24:37,040 --> 00:24:40,800 month, but that's and then I sort of a couple of weeks into 412 00:24:40,960 --> 00:24:43,720 getting back from that's and it hadn't gone away by the way it's 413 00:24:43,720 --> 00:24:47,880 but I started to at least get running again a couple of weeks 414 00:24:47,880 --> 00:24:50,240 into that. Literally in the course of one 415 00:24:50,240 --> 00:24:54,040 run, it switched the other side. I've never felt it again on that 416 00:24:54,040 --> 00:24:58,480 left side where it started and but it was on the right side and 417 00:24:58,480 --> 00:25:00,040 that took me out another few weeks. 418 00:25:00,040 --> 00:25:04,480 And then a couple of weeks into that, like going and then I 419 00:25:04,480 --> 00:25:07,440 think it was the same issue, but there's sort of a pain just 420 00:25:07,440 --> 00:25:11,400 below the knee. So again, I chopped another 421 00:25:11,400 --> 00:25:14,840 couple of weeks, right. So yeah, it was a very stop 422 00:25:14,840 --> 00:25:18,480 start basically from October till really actually quite deep 423 00:25:18,480 --> 00:25:22,720 into May there. I've got a few long runs in over 424 00:25:22,720 --> 00:25:27,000 the weekend, but even then I was sort of interrupted some weekly 425 00:25:27,800 --> 00:25:30,520 training runs and just trying to manage it. 426 00:25:31,040 --> 00:25:33,480 So it's only really sort of towards the end of May that 427 00:25:33,480 --> 00:25:36,280 things properly turned. And I feel like the last month 428 00:25:36,360 --> 00:25:39,400 I've had a good, yeah, I think I've definitely turned the 429 00:25:39,400 --> 00:25:41,280 corner now at the moment to touch with and. 430 00:25:42,400 --> 00:25:47,440 Do you talk to any professionals like physios or anything like 431 00:25:47,440 --> 00:25:49,680 that? Or did you like what most of us 432 00:25:49,680 --> 00:25:54,200 do and just go on to Google and find out you've got something a 433 00:25:54,200 --> 00:25:55,800 lot worse than what you've actually got? 434 00:25:56,320 --> 00:26:00,880 Yeah, I think up up until the stress factor, I think I'd seen 435 00:26:00,880 --> 00:26:02,920 a physio maybe once in my running career. 436 00:26:04,160 --> 00:26:07,000 But yeah, with the stress factor, I knew, I knew it was 437 00:26:07,000 --> 00:26:09,200 something quite serious, like I didn't know it was a stress 438 00:26:09,200 --> 00:26:12,040 fracture. In fact, initially I went to 439 00:26:12,080 --> 00:26:15,080 physio and she advised me to get scanned and I got scanned and 440 00:26:15,080 --> 00:26:17,320 they said there was something there as a reaction, but they 441 00:26:17,320 --> 00:26:19,240 didn't pick it up as a stress fracture. 442 00:26:20,360 --> 00:26:24,720 So but yeah, I kept going to physio, you know, every 2-3 443 00:26:24,720 --> 00:26:27,600 weeks kind of. And she gave me new exercise and 444 00:26:27,600 --> 00:26:30,080 stuff, but it wasn't really clearing. 445 00:26:30,080 --> 00:26:33,960 So after I think of it 6-7 weeks, she advised me to go back 446 00:26:33,960 --> 00:26:36,960 and get scanned again. And that's when it did sort of 447 00:26:37,160 --> 00:26:39,480 pick it up as a stress fracture. But by that point, it was 448 00:26:39,480 --> 00:26:42,680 already started to heal. So yeah, I kept seeing the 449 00:26:42,680 --> 00:26:44,440 physio through the stress fracture. 450 00:26:45,960 --> 00:26:49,400 And then I thought, well, OK, I'm back running again. 451 00:26:49,400 --> 00:26:52,280 I started to, you know, she gave me this sort of routine to sort 452 00:26:52,280 --> 00:26:55,320 of build up the mileage. And then the seiatic nerve 453 00:26:55,320 --> 00:26:58,640 problem came on. And yeah, I've been going 454 00:26:58,760 --> 00:27:01,360 reasonably regularly to to sort of get that thing. 455 00:27:01,360 --> 00:27:03,880 So yeah. So physio has been really good. 456 00:27:03,880 --> 00:27:07,760 So. But yeah, so obviously it's it's 457 00:27:07,760 --> 00:27:09,280 not cheap going to physios stuff. 458 00:27:09,440 --> 00:27:13,360 So yeah, I try not to when I when I can avoid it, but this 459 00:27:13,360 --> 00:27:19,000 time I definitely needed it. Yeah, and when I get injured, 460 00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:21,000 it's usually because of my shoes. 461 00:27:21,480 --> 00:27:22,640 You need to change them. Whatever. 462 00:27:23,320 --> 00:27:28,120 The rest is that you're doing the ACP and like Lakeland W 463 00:27:28,120 --> 00:27:30,680 Helen Way, it's obviously different terrains. 464 00:27:30,680 --> 00:27:34,960 Is that different shoes? Definitely different shoes. 465 00:27:34,960 --> 00:27:39,520 So yeah, like the AC PS that kind of there was well, I used 466 00:27:39,520 --> 00:27:42,760 was wearing paper place. So kind of super shoes if you 467 00:27:42,760 --> 00:27:46,120 like. And then obviously the yeah, 468 00:27:46,120 --> 00:27:50,720 those those trail ones on I'm not using I'm just using well, 469 00:27:51,240 --> 00:27:53,600 read me questions, normal trail shoes. 470 00:27:54,920 --> 00:27:58,320 So there's definitely variation of my shoes and even during the 471 00:27:58,320 --> 00:28:01,440 week, actually, depending what I'm doing, I'll, I'll change 472 00:28:01,440 --> 00:28:04,080 issues. So like the intervals and the 473 00:28:04,080 --> 00:28:08,320 long runs I'll use yeah, I'll use paper place actually for 474 00:28:08,320 --> 00:28:11,240 those just not, not because I want to go faster, but because I 475 00:28:11,240 --> 00:28:13,080 want to get recover from the quicker. 476 00:28:13,640 --> 00:28:16,800 And then I've got other sort of lower profile shoes just for my, 477 00:28:17,240 --> 00:28:22,280 you know, my easier runs. So I I definitely vary the shoes 478 00:28:22,280 --> 00:28:25,640 up, maybe push the lifetime of them too much possibly. 479 00:28:25,960 --> 00:28:28,160 I don't know. I mean, they're not cheap 480 00:28:28,160 --> 00:28:31,160 either. So and you go through high 481 00:28:31,160 --> 00:28:34,200 mileage. So yeah, but so it could could 482 00:28:34,200 --> 00:28:39,120 be issues, but it could be any number of things to like physio 483 00:28:39,120 --> 00:28:41,840 was, you know, suggesting, you know, things like even Reds, 484 00:28:41,840 --> 00:28:44,440 maybe it wasn't, it didn't have the right energy intake, you 485 00:28:44,440 --> 00:28:47,680 know, for the mileage it was doing, could have been doing too 486 00:28:47,680 --> 00:28:50,520 much mileage, which I definitely have up over the last couple of 487 00:28:50,520 --> 00:28:52,200 years. So yeah, it's very hard to say 488 00:28:52,200 --> 00:28:55,840 like. Yeah, it's all very well one of 489 00:28:55,840 --> 00:28:57,920 us saying that that's what's wrong with us. 490 00:28:57,920 --> 00:29:00,480 But we're we're not professionals. 491 00:29:00,480 --> 00:29:02,400 We're just runners who think we know better. 492 00:29:02,920 --> 00:29:06,320 Yeah, absolutely. So to be honest, I think the, I 493 00:29:06,320 --> 00:29:09,400 think the 2nd sciatic nerve problem probably came as a 494 00:29:09,400 --> 00:29:12,200 result of having a stress fracture and then weaknesses 495 00:29:12,200 --> 00:29:15,080 kind of came in from not, you know, not running for a long 496 00:29:15,080 --> 00:29:17,440 period. So yeah, so it's probably 497 00:29:17,880 --> 00:29:19,640 cumulative if you like. Yeah. 498 00:29:20,120 --> 00:29:23,600 Have you got any other pieces of kits other than your shoes that 499 00:29:23,600 --> 00:29:27,440 are stand out that your go to pieces of kit? 500 00:29:30,080 --> 00:29:33,480 And shoes actually for the for the trails, I really I highly 501 00:29:33,480 --> 00:29:37,400 rate the Adidas Terex speed ultras. 502 00:29:38,360 --> 00:29:41,960 Those are definite coaches for the for the long ultra stuff. 503 00:29:43,800 --> 00:29:46,120 Otherwise kits, my kits fairly basic. 504 00:29:46,880 --> 00:29:51,120 I like a good pair of shorts. So I use Ron Hill sort of 5 inch 505 00:29:51,120 --> 00:29:54,280 split ones there. They they just, yeah, feel good. 506 00:29:55,320 --> 00:29:59,080 But yeah, otherwise just using standard T-shirts or whatever. 507 00:30:00,080 --> 00:30:02,440 Keep in with the West Island Way sponsors there. 508 00:30:02,440 --> 00:30:04,960 I think Ron Hill's been with them for a long time. 509 00:30:06,280 --> 00:30:08,360 Yeah, well, they, they do do nice stuff, to be fair. 510 00:30:08,360 --> 00:30:12,560 Like even the top, the top they gave us for the, you know, the 511 00:30:12,560 --> 00:30:15,880 West Island way top, It's, yeah, it's got a lovely, lovely 512 00:30:15,880 --> 00:30:23,320 texture to it. So what do you do? 513 00:30:23,320 --> 00:30:25,600 You listen to music podcasts around like that while you're 514 00:30:25,600 --> 00:30:29,560 running. Training runs I do yeah pretty 515 00:30:29,560 --> 00:30:34,720 much all the name music actually sorry, it's really boring. 516 00:30:34,720 --> 00:30:40,720 I just I have the same music loaded and so for months and 517 00:30:40,720 --> 00:30:43,720 even years. I'll I won't bother replacing 518 00:30:43,720 --> 00:30:45,800 it. So I basically listening to 519 00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:48,600 almost the same stuff, repeat it over and over. 520 00:30:49,280 --> 00:30:51,640 Not the same song. Like I'll see, I've got, I don't 521 00:30:51,640 --> 00:30:54,280 know, 30-40 songs on there and they just go through shuffle 522 00:30:55,840 --> 00:30:57,160 races. I don't tend to. 523 00:30:57,160 --> 00:31:02,320 Although actually for the West Island way for the first time, I 524 00:31:02,320 --> 00:31:04,200 think, where was it? Glencoe? 525 00:31:04,200 --> 00:31:08,160 I, I put on some, some headphones there just to sort 526 00:31:08,160 --> 00:31:12,520 of, yeah, just to, I knew that next patch there was a, a long 527 00:31:12,520 --> 00:31:15,440 stretch of sort of flat before you get to Devil's Staircase and 528 00:31:15,440 --> 00:31:17,840 stuff. So just to break it up I thought 529 00:31:17,840 --> 00:31:21,680 I'd put on a bit of music, but I don't normally wear it wear them 530 00:31:21,680 --> 00:31:25,800 in in events. OK, there You say you've got a 531 00:31:26,720 --> 00:31:28,720 playlist that you use all the time. 532 00:31:29,080 --> 00:31:31,320 I've got one as well, but it's 15 hours long. 533 00:31:34,760 --> 00:31:38,520 But it means that you can go into places like say you're on 534 00:31:38,520 --> 00:31:40,040 the West Ham away and you get no signal. 535 00:31:40,200 --> 00:31:42,360 If you've already got the playlist downloaded, then you 536 00:31:42,360 --> 00:31:44,920 don't need to worry about that. It's yeah, it's one last thing 537 00:31:44,920 --> 00:31:46,920 to worry about. Yeah, no, it's, it's nice. 538 00:31:47,680 --> 00:31:50,680 But yeah, probably 15 hours is probably good because you don't 539 00:31:50,680 --> 00:31:53,920 know what's coming next first. Yeah, I I know half an hour 540 00:31:53,920 --> 00:31:55,640 later I'll probably get back to SO. 541 00:31:58,760 --> 00:32:02,440 So a really deep question coming up. 542 00:32:03,520 --> 00:32:06,520 Why do you run? Oh gosh, that is David. 543 00:32:09,400 --> 00:32:13,400 There's been times in the past I've asked myself that because 544 00:32:13,480 --> 00:32:15,400 there have been times actually in the past where I've not 545 00:32:15,400 --> 00:32:18,640 really enjoyed the training. And so I was like, well, why am 546 00:32:18,640 --> 00:32:24,360 I doing it? I think the, I don't know why I 547 00:32:24,360 --> 00:32:27,200 started running, if I'm honest, but I think now that I've got 548 00:32:27,200 --> 00:32:30,760 into running, first of all, I really enjoy the social aspect 549 00:32:30,760 --> 00:32:32,760 of it. I'm not the most social person, 550 00:32:32,760 --> 00:32:36,120 so I don't have big networks of friends outside of running. 551 00:32:36,120 --> 00:32:39,640 So I, I kind of really almost rely on the running to kind of, 552 00:32:39,760 --> 00:32:41,280 you know, keep in contact with people. 553 00:32:41,280 --> 00:32:42,920 So that's pretty important to me. 554 00:32:44,280 --> 00:32:46,840 And then I, I really do enjoy the challenge of running. 555 00:32:46,840 --> 00:32:50,400 So like going into events and testing, you know, marathon was 556 00:32:50,400 --> 00:32:53,600 kind of see what time I could do or not necessarily marathon, but 557 00:32:53,600 --> 00:32:56,000 even 510 KS and things like that. 558 00:32:57,440 --> 00:32:59,840 But in order to do that, you obviously need to put in the 559 00:32:59,840 --> 00:33:02,160 training stuff. Kind of kept me motivated there 560 00:33:02,760 --> 00:33:05,160 as I've probably gone off more away. 561 00:33:05,480 --> 00:33:07,400 I guess I'll do Rd. stuff too for sure. 562 00:33:07,400 --> 00:33:10,840 But as I've done more off road stuff, I've started to 563 00:33:10,840 --> 00:33:12,600 appreciate more of the extra the environment. 564 00:33:12,600 --> 00:33:14,320 So it's just gone off into hills and stuff. 565 00:33:14,320 --> 00:33:18,040 So I probably enjoy my running better now, like the training 566 00:33:18,040 --> 00:33:19,680 and stuff better than I did in the past. 567 00:33:20,600 --> 00:33:25,280 So that obviously keeps on going and well, doing well and events 568 00:33:25,280 --> 00:33:28,280 like, you know, like at the weekend that's, you know, that's 569 00:33:28,280 --> 00:33:32,800 nice to yeah. Well, leading on from that, when 570 00:33:32,800 --> 00:33:37,360 you're not got anything in your ears, listening to whoever 571 00:33:38,240 --> 00:33:42,320 question that I always get asked is what do you think about when 572 00:33:42,320 --> 00:33:48,840 you're running? Not very much I I don't think I 573 00:33:48,840 --> 00:33:51,720 have any real coherent thoughts. Like I'm sure I'm thinking about 574 00:33:51,720 --> 00:33:55,120 things, but there's it's not like I go out and figure out my 575 00:33:55,160 --> 00:34:01,120 day or figure out my life. I sometimes it is almost just 576 00:34:01,120 --> 00:34:04,720 yeah, like well what pace am I doing or how's it feeling or 577 00:34:04,920 --> 00:34:08,040 just I'm sure little thoughts come and go, but there's 578 00:34:08,040 --> 00:34:11,639 nothing, yeah, there's no real deep thinking there. 579 00:34:11,639 --> 00:34:16,520 So it's hard to hard to pinpoint while I'm actually thinking 580 00:34:16,520 --> 00:34:19,880 about this. Maybe just, you know, when, when 581 00:34:19,880 --> 00:34:23,960 what's coming up next door in the corner, you know, it's yes. 582 00:34:23,960 --> 00:34:26,600 It's not nothing of importance, I would say. 583 00:34:27,520 --> 00:34:32,679 I I used to run with a colleague from work at lunchtime and we 584 00:34:32,679 --> 00:34:36,840 would be running together, chatting away, solve every 585 00:34:36,840 --> 00:34:39,320 problem that we had at work. As soon as we go back to the 586 00:34:39,320 --> 00:34:43,120 office for forgot it's all. So it doesn't matter what you're 587 00:34:43,120 --> 00:34:45,080 thinking about it because you can't remember. 588 00:34:45,080 --> 00:34:48,600 Afterwards, yeah, exactly. I sometimes I've actually, I'm 589 00:34:48,600 --> 00:34:51,159 lying in bed and that's where all the real great thoughts come 590 00:34:51,440 --> 00:34:52,639 and then I get up in the morning. 591 00:34:52,639 --> 00:34:58,120 I've forgotten. So yeah, I'm sure I'm thinking 592 00:34:58,120 --> 00:34:59,920 about something running, but like it's nothing. 593 00:35:00,560 --> 00:35:04,280 Nothing that's. Nothing important because it was 594 00:35:04,280 --> 00:35:05,640 important. You would remember it. 595 00:35:05,640 --> 00:35:12,400 So yeah, probably. So think about before a race, 596 00:35:12,400 --> 00:35:16,360 have you got any sort of rituals that you do, anything that you 597 00:35:16,360 --> 00:35:21,600 must eat, anything like that? I suppose I've got a routine. 598 00:35:21,600 --> 00:35:24,800 I wouldn't as you say, Rachel, but yeah, I kind of have this 599 00:35:24,800 --> 00:35:29,080 routine of each maybe three years before and then sort of 600 00:35:29,080 --> 00:35:33,800 that last, yeah, maybe I don't know, an hour to 45 minutes 601 00:35:33,800 --> 00:35:38,080 before, take a gel and then I'll do my warm up exercises. 602 00:35:38,120 --> 00:35:42,200 I've kind of got a set routine of exercises that I kind of go 603 00:35:42,200 --> 00:35:47,720 through probably for the longer stuff there, they're not as 604 00:35:47,720 --> 00:35:52,880 important just because you, you start off slower, slower and you 605 00:35:52,880 --> 00:35:54,760 can kind of work into it a bit easier. 606 00:35:54,760 --> 00:35:57,040 But I, I kind of have this routine I sort of go through 607 00:35:57,040 --> 00:36:00,840 generally and then obviously that takes me up to about 1520 608 00:36:00,840 --> 00:36:02,720 minutes before when you're starting to get towards the 609 00:36:02,720 --> 00:36:05,840 start line and stuff. So yeah, that's kind of the 610 00:36:05,840 --> 00:36:08,840 routine I would say. But I, I don't have any, I don't 611 00:36:08,840 --> 00:36:13,120 have anything like have to, you know, yes, some good, good luck 612 00:36:13,120 --> 00:36:16,680 charm or something. Yeah, I, I always used to say 613 00:36:16,680 --> 00:36:20,200 that there's no point in doing a, a warm up because you're 614 00:36:20,200 --> 00:36:24,760 going to be running for 95 miles, the 1st 5 miles of your 615 00:36:24,760 --> 00:36:27,240 warm up. But as as I'm getting older I've 616 00:36:27,240 --> 00:36:31,400 definitely start feeling it like it's it's definitely a warm up 617 00:36:31,400 --> 00:36:34,040 because I feel a lot better after the first 5 miles. 618 00:36:34,320 --> 00:36:37,440 Yeah, no, I think there is, again, I noticed that even in, 619 00:36:37,680 --> 00:36:41,400 in training, like say training, it's just going out for a run. 620 00:36:41,560 --> 00:36:46,640 That first mile for sure is it's much slower than the others for 621 00:36:46,640 --> 00:36:49,240 the seminar sort of, you know, perceived efforts. 622 00:36:49,240 --> 00:36:53,560 So I think it, the body definitely takes a little bit to 623 00:36:53,560 --> 00:36:55,520 to to warm up to. I'm not saying I've done a mile 624 00:36:55,520 --> 00:36:58,000 or two before the West side. Yeah, it's enough to come. 625 00:36:58,000 --> 00:37:00,920 But I still went through and done some basic stretches and 626 00:37:00,920 --> 00:37:03,240 stuff just to kind of get the muscles sort of moving. 627 00:37:03,960 --> 00:37:05,920 Well, I'll let you into a little secret. 628 00:37:05,920 --> 00:37:08,360 Rob Sinclair did do 2 miles beforehand. 629 00:37:09,720 --> 00:37:11,640 Fair enough. Yeah, No, I don't. 630 00:37:12,280 --> 00:37:15,160 Yeah, I mean, I do. I do think there is something in 631 00:37:15,560 --> 00:37:17,560 getting the muscle stresses of properly. 632 00:37:18,280 --> 00:37:21,320 So definitely for shorter stuff like I suppose the reason I 633 00:37:21,320 --> 00:37:25,200 partly do that routine is coming from, you know, running with a 634 00:37:25,200 --> 00:37:28,480 club. They kind of got, you know, even 635 00:37:28,480 --> 00:37:30,680 before training sessions, we would do these sort of running 636 00:37:30,680 --> 00:37:33,600 drills. And so for shorter races like, 637 00:37:33,880 --> 00:37:36,520 you know, well, even up to up to Marth. 638 00:37:36,520 --> 00:37:39,000 And I definitely went through religiously these these kind of. 639 00:37:39,800 --> 00:37:42,720 Yeah. I think for certain races like a 640 00:37:42,720 --> 00:37:46,240 Marth and you're going out at pace right from the start, so 641 00:37:46,240 --> 00:37:49,320 you need to be warmed up. Absolutely no. 642 00:37:49,320 --> 00:37:52,000 Taking it easy. Yeah, not for sure exactly. 643 00:37:52,000 --> 00:37:53,880 So like, yeah, that's why the West End way. 644 00:37:53,880 --> 00:37:58,360 As I said, I I did a few token things just to sort of stretch 645 00:37:58,360 --> 00:38:01,240 myself out, but I didn't do any run before it. 646 00:38:02,520 --> 00:38:07,080 And thinking about leading up to the race, were you nervous? 647 00:38:09,560 --> 00:38:13,360 A little bit more apprehensive actually, just because my 648 00:38:13,360 --> 00:38:17,720 fitness wasn't where I well wasn't where I would normally 649 00:38:17,720 --> 00:38:20,160 want it to be, or at least I didn't think it was. 650 00:38:20,160 --> 00:38:24,720 As it panned out, it was fine, but I definitely huge question 651 00:38:24,720 --> 00:38:27,920 marks over whether I had enough mileage in my legs. 652 00:38:29,400 --> 00:38:32,840 So as I'll say, going into kind of excited the fact that I was 653 00:38:32,840 --> 00:38:35,600 even on the start lane because for a long time I didn't think 654 00:38:35,600 --> 00:38:40,360 I'd actually get there, but I was definitely was a wee bit 655 00:38:40,360 --> 00:38:46,280 apprehensive of of, of yeah, not having done enough training 656 00:38:48,080 --> 00:38:50,240 probably for one of the first times. 657 00:38:50,240 --> 00:38:53,200 I wasn't too nervous actually. I wasn't like, I kind of went 658 00:38:53,200 --> 00:38:56,600 into not having any pressure on myself to kind of do well or 659 00:38:56,600 --> 00:39:00,440 anything too much expectation because partly because, yeah, 660 00:39:00,440 --> 00:39:02,320 the training hadn't gone the way it's sort of planned. 661 00:39:02,320 --> 00:39:04,440 So in that sense, I wasn't nervous. 662 00:39:04,440 --> 00:39:09,000 It's just more I was more nervous of the the the distance 663 00:39:09,240 --> 00:39:12,760 and whether I could actually make it all the way to Fort Fort 664 00:39:12,760 --> 00:39:15,120 William. And do you think taking the 665 00:39:15,400 --> 00:39:18,880 pressure off yourself, the no expectations, actually helped 666 00:39:19,120 --> 00:39:21,840 with the race? Yeah, I think, I think I 667 00:39:21,840 --> 00:39:25,520 probably did, yeah. Because they even those early 668 00:39:25,520 --> 00:39:28,000 bits were, you know, there was certainly, as I said, there's 669 00:39:28,000 --> 00:39:29,600 early on, there was a big group of us. 670 00:39:29,600 --> 00:39:32,960 And even when I was running with Robbie at that point, I wasn't 671 00:39:32,960 --> 00:39:35,240 really thinking of it as a race. I was actually more just trying 672 00:39:35,240 --> 00:39:37,400 to have some good company with him. 673 00:39:37,400 --> 00:39:39,800 And and so I kind of knew the race. 674 00:39:39,800 --> 00:39:44,120 That's, you know, if if I my running could keep going like it 675 00:39:44,120 --> 00:39:45,640 wouldn't start till later on anyway. 676 00:39:45,640 --> 00:39:49,800 But yeah, so those early parts, I wasn't really, yeah, nervous 677 00:39:49,800 --> 00:39:53,520 and I said and not maybe not have an expectation probably 678 00:39:53,600 --> 00:39:56,640 probably help with that. Whereas before if maybe if I 679 00:39:56,640 --> 00:39:59,560 went into it expecting to be kind of at the front or 680 00:39:59,560 --> 00:40:01,880 something and you know, there was lots of people around me and 681 00:40:01,880 --> 00:40:04,240 might feel more pressure. But yeah. 682 00:40:05,360 --> 00:40:10,040 And you, you said, well you obviously you're doing sort of 683 00:40:10,040 --> 00:40:15,040 100 Millers ish now and you've done 10 years of marathon. 684 00:40:15,040 --> 00:40:16,200 How many marathons have you done? 685 00:40:17,600 --> 00:40:22,800 I've done probably a bit, probably with 12 or 13 686 00:40:22,800 --> 00:40:25,720 altogether. I think I've done London, I 687 00:40:25,720 --> 00:40:29,320 think I've done London five times and I've done balfast 688 00:40:29,320 --> 00:40:31,960 maybe about five times. And then I've done a, yeah, a 689 00:40:31,960 --> 00:40:34,160 few others, just just random ones. 690 00:40:35,080 --> 00:40:41,160 And I of all the sort of distances, what distance do you 691 00:40:41,160 --> 00:40:46,080 prefer nowadays? That's a hard one. 692 00:40:46,080 --> 00:40:51,960 That's a really hard one. Genuinely, I, there's something 693 00:40:51,960 --> 00:40:55,360 about the short stuff, the those 510 KS that are really 694 00:40:55,360 --> 00:41:00,760 competitive, that's it's a very different feeling to, to running 695 00:41:00,760 --> 00:41:04,560 a, you know, an ultra because a lot of the altars I've run, you 696 00:41:04,560 --> 00:41:07,440 spend a lot of your time by yourself and you're not really 697 00:41:07,440 --> 00:41:10,200 even in competition. And that's not necessarily me 698 00:41:10,200 --> 00:41:11,800 being at the front. That's just means you're, you 699 00:41:11,800 --> 00:41:15,640 know, this field spreads out so much, whereas the short stuff 700 00:41:15,640 --> 00:41:19,080 that's you're constantly, you know, that that Renlin is 701 00:41:19,080 --> 00:41:24,840 constantly running. So probably because I've seen 702 00:41:24,840 --> 00:41:27,800 more success from the longer stuff, maybe that, yeah, maybe 703 00:41:27,800 --> 00:41:29,640 that's more of my preference is going now. 704 00:41:29,680 --> 00:41:32,400 But at the same time, I still really enjoy doing the short 705 00:41:32,400 --> 00:41:35,240 stuff. I'd like to think I keep in 706 00:41:35,240 --> 00:41:38,320 touch with the short stuff just because it is it is good fun. 707 00:41:38,320 --> 00:41:40,400 And you can, you can do them a lot more frequent too. 708 00:41:40,400 --> 00:41:43,760 It's not, you know, I'm not going to run 100 miles every 709 00:41:43,760 --> 00:41:47,720 week, but, you know, you can't. You could run 5 and 10 KS fairly 710 00:41:47,720 --> 00:41:49,560 fairly frequently if you wanted to. 711 00:41:50,200 --> 00:41:52,000 Yeah. All right, I'm going to get back 712 00:41:52,000 --> 00:41:57,000 on to the deep questions again. Have you got any running heroes? 713 00:41:58,920 --> 00:42:01,800 Yeah. So for a long time, Paula 714 00:42:01,800 --> 00:42:05,880 Ratcliffe was, Yeah. When I was sort of in marathon 715 00:42:05,880 --> 00:42:08,520 stuff, she was, she was an icon for me. 716 00:42:09,120 --> 00:42:10,760 Yeah. I, I probably grew up at the 717 00:42:10,760 --> 00:42:15,040 time when she was, you know, yeah, doing all her best stuff. 718 00:42:15,040 --> 00:42:19,000 So even when she was actually on the track, not quite making it 719 00:42:19,000 --> 00:42:22,880 on some of those big track events, the effort she put in, 720 00:42:23,360 --> 00:42:25,040 she kind of. Yeah, there's something about 721 00:42:25,040 --> 00:42:27,080 her. I've also followed Paula 722 00:42:28,720 --> 00:42:31,760 probably more recently as I've got into ultras, I start to 723 00:42:31,760 --> 00:42:35,440 appreciate, you know, a lot of these people like Killian Jordan 724 00:42:35,440 --> 00:42:38,080 and stuff, but even closer to home, like people like Mark 725 00:42:38,080 --> 00:42:41,440 Darbyshire and, you know, Tom Evans and stuff. 726 00:42:41,440 --> 00:42:43,880 Some of those guys are pretty special so. 727 00:42:45,840 --> 00:42:49,120 And yeah, question that you might not know the answer to. 728 00:42:49,480 --> 00:42:51,160 Do you know what your VO2 Max is? 729 00:42:52,440 --> 00:43:00,120 No, no, I think my watch tells me it's, you know, watch tells 730 00:43:00,120 --> 00:43:02,560 me it's a 57. I have no idea. 731 00:43:02,600 --> 00:43:03,280 I don't. Really. 732 00:43:03,800 --> 00:43:06,440 No, I I don't believe it, but my watch says exactly the same 733 00:43:06,440 --> 00:43:09,840 thing. Paula Radcliffe's VO2 Max when 734 00:43:09,840 --> 00:43:16,040 she was at her peak was 70. Yeah, fair enough. 735 00:43:17,080 --> 00:43:22,600 Yeah, yeah, I, I, as I said, I don't, that's one, that's 736 00:43:22,600 --> 00:43:25,200 certainly one. Well, I'm not huge into stats 737 00:43:25,200 --> 00:43:28,560 and stuff, but that's, that's one metric I don't really pay 738 00:43:28,560 --> 00:43:31,600 much heat on. But I, I, I must admit, yeah, 739 00:43:31,600 --> 00:43:35,120 have heard like, you know, obviously following her that she 740 00:43:35,120 --> 00:43:37,880 was pretty standard in terms of the POT Max. 741 00:43:37,880 --> 00:43:42,160 So yeah. So it's it's understandable why 742 00:43:42,160 --> 00:43:42,840 she was so good. So. 743 00:43:43,400 --> 00:43:45,880 Yeah, yeah, well, that's the thing. 744 00:43:45,880 --> 00:43:48,960 I think she she genuinely felt ahead of her time. 745 00:43:49,280 --> 00:43:51,800 You know, other people like, you know, Hailey Cabrus lost and 746 00:43:51,800 --> 00:43:54,640 stuff too. But but like the fact that Paul 747 00:43:54,640 --> 00:43:58,640 is more than time stood for so long and you know, it's only 748 00:43:58,640 --> 00:44:01,440 recently that's, you know, especially with shoes and 749 00:44:01,440 --> 00:44:04,400 nutrition and all coming along that people be able to break it. 750 00:44:04,880 --> 00:44:10,160 And yeah, I think it shows she was, she was definitely up 751 00:44:10,160 --> 00:44:11,400 there. Right. 752 00:44:11,400 --> 00:44:15,600 Next deep question, If you could go back in time to when you 753 00:44:15,600 --> 00:44:21,000 started running so 2010 I think you said, what would you tell 754 00:44:21,000 --> 00:44:28,520 yourself that you know now? I think, I think I'd have told 755 00:44:28,520 --> 00:44:33,200 myself to do the trail stuff more sooner because that's I 756 00:44:33,200 --> 00:44:34,840 think that's where the enjoyment has come. 757 00:44:35,760 --> 00:44:38,560 That's not that didn't enjoy running before, but I said some 758 00:44:38,560 --> 00:44:43,160 of the road stuff, yeah, it's hard training and it's not 759 00:44:43,160 --> 00:44:46,120 always the most exciting, you know, some of the training. 760 00:44:46,800 --> 00:44:49,800 Whereas I think with the, the off road I've, I've got more 761 00:44:49,800 --> 00:44:52,120 enjoyment in the running. So I probably would have told 762 00:44:52,120 --> 00:44:57,760 myself to, you know, stop being fixated on marathon time or even 763 00:44:57,760 --> 00:45:02,160 half marathon times sooner. And yeah, because probably there 764 00:45:02,160 --> 00:45:05,680 was quite a few years actually there where I probably had a bit 765 00:45:05,680 --> 00:45:09,120 of an urge to move off, try something different, go away 766 00:45:09,120 --> 00:45:13,000 from Rd. but somewhere was still hooked on this ambition of 767 00:45:13,000 --> 00:45:15,600 trying to bring down my more than time. 768 00:45:16,720 --> 00:45:18,600 So yeah. OK. 769 00:45:19,200 --> 00:45:25,920 And I asked you about your your distance, but is there any, have 770 00:45:25,920 --> 00:45:28,440 you got a bucket list? Is there any dream races that 771 00:45:28,440 --> 00:45:34,880 you would want to do? I think, yeah, bucket list. 772 00:45:36,200 --> 00:45:39,040 There's a wee bit of me would like to try something like a 773 00:45:39,040 --> 00:45:42,600 Spain, not necessarily the Spain, but something like that 774 00:45:42,600 --> 00:45:47,360 or Northern Traverse or the Race across Scotland, some of those 775 00:45:47,360 --> 00:45:50,360 really long stuff. So a bit of me would like to, 776 00:45:50,840 --> 00:45:52,720 the other half of me says don't be stupid. 777 00:45:53,880 --> 00:45:56,160 So in one sense they're bucket list. 778 00:45:56,160 --> 00:45:59,560 And that's, yeah, who knows, One day I might, and one day I 779 00:45:59,560 --> 00:46:00,800 might. What? 780 00:46:01,120 --> 00:46:03,480 What is it about them that you attract you to it? 781 00:46:04,400 --> 00:46:07,920 I think it's as I've sort of started to follow more of this 782 00:46:07,920 --> 00:46:11,800 stuff that's, you know, you, you, you don't, well, I do not 783 00:46:11,800 --> 00:46:13,960 watch like like a lot of people do. 784 00:46:13,960 --> 00:46:17,600 And it's, I think there's something almost romantic about 785 00:46:17,600 --> 00:46:20,520 them. And that's what, yeah, makes me 786 00:46:20,520 --> 00:46:23,520 kind of want to sort of test myself and go out and experience 787 00:46:23,520 --> 00:46:27,640 that for myself. But at the same time, when I run 788 00:46:27,640 --> 00:46:30,840 100 mile and I think, Oh, my God, how long is this? 789 00:46:32,840 --> 00:46:36,280 Yeah, that's where the other half of me says, yeah, you know, 790 00:46:36,920 --> 00:46:39,640 stay put before you're at. How's. 791 00:46:39,840 --> 00:46:43,200 Your navigation pretty. Poor. 792 00:46:43,200 --> 00:46:46,040 Yeah, pretty poor. Because that's the other thing 793 00:46:46,040 --> 00:46:48,040 too. It's actually the time 794 00:46:48,040 --> 00:46:50,320 commitment. And I, I almost feel like I'd 795 00:46:50,320 --> 00:46:53,440 have to Iraqi the whole thing at least once before I do it. 796 00:46:53,440 --> 00:46:57,360 So the time commitment in terms of, you know, going away for 797 00:46:57,360 --> 00:47:00,640 weekends and stuff away from the family and stuff to, to do the 798 00:47:00,640 --> 00:47:02,600 Rakis and stuff, it's it's a big commitment. 799 00:47:02,600 --> 00:47:05,800 So it's not just a, it's not just a whim thing for me. 800 00:47:05,800 --> 00:47:08,360 I have to really commit to it. And then there's obviously all 801 00:47:08,360 --> 00:47:10,880 the cost and the kit and stuff like that that goes with it. 802 00:47:10,920 --> 00:47:14,600 So. It's the spine for me. 803 00:47:15,440 --> 00:47:17,760 I I'd love to do the race, but I'm not. 804 00:47:18,320 --> 00:47:22,840 I don't know if I'm confident enough to think that I could 805 00:47:22,840 --> 00:47:25,920 navigate it at speed. I see. 806 00:47:26,280 --> 00:47:29,440 Yeah, well that's the thing, navigating through nights, yeah, 807 00:47:29,440 --> 00:47:34,640 even if you have wrecked it, it's not easy like you, you have 808 00:47:34,640 --> 00:47:39,240 to be really alert. So I think, yeah, I think with a 809 00:47:39,240 --> 00:47:41,720 Spain, I suppose with watches and stuff. 810 00:47:41,720 --> 00:47:45,560 Now I'm not too, I'm not too concerned by the navigation. 811 00:47:45,560 --> 00:47:49,960 But I suppose what I've actually a more apprehensive is that I've 812 00:47:49,960 --> 00:47:53,160 committed all that money to, you know, staying up to it and buy 813 00:47:53,160 --> 00:47:55,480 all the kit and stuff and then I, I don't make it. 814 00:47:55,920 --> 00:47:58,720 And that's where I would feel like I've kind of it's a huge 815 00:47:58,720 --> 00:48:01,600 investment and that may not actually come out with the the 816 00:48:01,640 --> 00:48:06,320 outcome of this sort of one. So, well, a race that I've done 817 00:48:06,320 --> 00:48:08,160 is the tunnel. Have you heard of that one? 818 00:48:08,160 --> 00:48:12,120 Oh yeah. Yeah, that's definitely not on 819 00:48:12,120 --> 00:48:17,080 my bucket list. So there's no navigation needed, 820 00:48:17,080 --> 00:48:20,720 it's pure pure running so. Yeah. 821 00:48:20,800 --> 00:48:22,960 So I'm not that desperate to do together. 822 00:48:26,400 --> 00:48:30,040 Yeah, I think actually something like a like a backyard ultra, 823 00:48:30,040 --> 00:48:31,920 that is something probably more attainable. 824 00:48:32,200 --> 00:48:35,440 I think I probably will do something like one of those. 825 00:48:36,600 --> 00:48:38,880 In fact, this year if I hadn't been injured, maybe I would have 826 00:48:38,880 --> 00:48:41,880 done. But so, yeah, maybe next year, 827 00:48:41,880 --> 00:48:43,880 the year after, I probably will revisit. 828 00:48:44,880 --> 00:48:49,640 Well, I'll, I'll maybe see you. I've done 9 so far, so maybe see 829 00:48:49,640 --> 00:48:50,360 you. And of course. 830 00:48:50,840 --> 00:48:55,080 I know your your backyard king so. 831 00:48:55,600 --> 00:49:01,280 Last question, what's next? Well I've got a place at 832 00:49:01,280 --> 00:49:06,200 Lakeland 50 for this year. I basically said to myself I'd 833 00:49:06,200 --> 00:49:10,640 see how chemo recovery wise after after the West anyway. 834 00:49:10,640 --> 00:49:15,560 So because it's only 5 weeks between them so the touch with 835 00:49:15,560 --> 00:49:19,480 so far this week's feeling good, but I don't want to yeah, I 836 00:49:19,480 --> 00:49:22,720 don't want to pressurize myself. So I'm going to see how the next 837 00:49:22,720 --> 00:49:25,000 week goes and if I'm feeling good then and maybe try and get 838 00:49:25,000 --> 00:49:28,280 in a a long run or so. And then I'm basically into 839 00:49:28,280 --> 00:49:30,680 taper. So all being well, I'll be in 840 00:49:30,680 --> 00:49:34,960 the start line of Lakeland 50. Beyond that, I don't don't 841 00:49:34,960 --> 00:49:38,400 really have anything. There's yeah, there's some short 842 00:49:38,400 --> 00:49:42,840 stuff I might, yeah, plan to do, but not nothing big in my head 843 00:49:42,840 --> 00:49:43,560 at the moment. So. 844 00:49:44,280 --> 00:49:46,400 OK. I said that was the last 845 00:49:46,400 --> 00:49:47,880 question. I've just thought of one more. 846 00:49:48,480 --> 00:49:50,480 Who was the midges on lock side not? 847 00:49:51,800 --> 00:49:53,720 Too bad actually, I mean that was another. 848 00:49:53,720 --> 00:49:55,840 I was quite apprehensive after that. 849 00:49:56,680 --> 00:50:00,320 I bought all this smidge cream and stuff and I totally covered. 850 00:50:01,920 --> 00:50:05,320 I felt running. They weren't too bad admittedly 851 00:50:05,320 --> 00:50:07,920 the the odd time I stopped, when I stopped and roared in and I 852 00:50:07,920 --> 00:50:11,120 definitely noticed them. I felt for my crew. 853 00:50:11,480 --> 00:50:15,440 So I I think, yeah, I think the crew and the the marshals 854 00:50:15,440 --> 00:50:17,800 probably had a really tough time, but actually running, they 855 00:50:17,800 --> 00:50:20,600 weren't as bad as I thought. I don't know how that compares 856 00:50:20,600 --> 00:50:24,320 to past years because I've heard some horror stories where you 857 00:50:24,320 --> 00:50:28,560 can almost hardly breathe, but I didn't feel too bad like there 858 00:50:28,600 --> 00:50:32,120 were those that were there and you know, my neck was covered 859 00:50:32,200 --> 00:50:34,280 with them and stuff like that. They were stuck to me. 860 00:50:34,280 --> 00:50:38,000 But no, actually for running the well, it was actually run 861 00:50:38,000 --> 00:50:38,960 moving. It was. 862 00:50:39,360 --> 00:50:41,320 They were fine. I didn't even notice them if I'm 863 00:50:41,320 --> 00:50:43,960 honest. But yeah, the check some of the 864 00:50:43,960 --> 00:50:47,560 checkpoints, I kind of noticed them briefly, but right. 865 00:50:48,080 --> 00:50:52,880 Well, you obviously enjoyed your time in Scotland and 866 00:50:53,880 --> 00:50:58,520 congratulations again and thank you for being on the show. 867 00:50:59,280 --> 00:51:03,120 It's been a welcome pleasure. And thanks everybody for 868 00:51:03,120 --> 00:51:07,000 listening and goodbye. Yeah, goodbye everyone.