Hello and welcome to another episode of Run Till You're Done.
Tonight's guest is a lady that really does inspire me and the
running community. She's done quite a lot of things
that do inspire me and I've been desperate to get it on the
podcast and to tell a story and find out how she got started.
So welcome to the podcast, Michelle Young.
Hello, thank you for having me. Hello, Michelle.
Nick is an introduction, but I don't know much about you.
So we're going to start off with our normal.
First question is how did you get into running?
So by complete accident, genuinely I was not a runner.
So about 2012 I used to go out walking my dog who I no longer
have. But I used to walk my dog around
this route, sort of a 5K route every day.
And most days I would pass this chap who was also walking.
And, you know, we would just have the niceties of, oh, hello,
hello. And I knew he was a runner
because I would sometimes see him running.
And he said to me one day, do you run?
I said, no. He said, well, you walk so fast
and you should just try running. And I'm like, Nah, I'm not like
I'm not a runner. I had tried running sort of when
I was probably in my 20s. And I just thought, this is not
for me. I like, I never ran at school.
It just wasn't for me. I was mowed into my mountain
biking and stuff. So anyway, once he said that, I
say, I sort of thought to myself, well, maybe I should.
Maybe I will just try running when I'm out walking the dog.
And it was kind of got to like a personal challenge how long and
quickly I could get round this, this route that I used to do
regularly. And I just genuinely started
sort of walk jogging, you know, in my jeans.
I'd be like an absolute sweaty mess when I got home.
And I probably did that for probably for a few months and
then I must have got some running gear and, and started
running. Didn't have a clue.
You know, I just got something that was more comfortable than
jeans and just started jogging around this route, just sort of
walk jogging and and it just kind of went from there.
And then I sort of had this arbitrary goal that I wanted to
run 10K by the time I was 40. I've never had any aspirations
to do anything. I thought I just wanted to do
the distance. It's not even that I wanted to
do a race. And I was AI was a member of a
gym back then, so it must have been on or around my 40s.
It was definitely before. And I went along to the gym and
I went on the treadmill and I just thought, right, I'm going
to do this 10K. And I did it.
And I think I probably would have told anyone that we don't
listen to anyone that looked my way.
It's like I just ran 10K. Look at me.
And I was like, I was so proud of myself.
And it came. That's how it started.
And I guess I just kind of got a bit of the running bug.
I also, yeah, I started a sort of running streak, which which
went on for maybe three years until I ended up with a stress
factor. But I'd been running for.
Yeah, I'd been running for a few years by then.
So yeah, that was, that was kind of it.
Didn't know any other runners. Never ran with anyone.
Just did it all. Just did it all myself in secret
almost. And your first 10K was on a
treadmill. Oh, yeah.
I, I don't mind the treadmill run.
I've quite not regularly, but I've done many half a marathon
on on the treadmill. I can just, if I'm, if that's
what I'm locked in to do, if I've got it in my mind that
that's what I'm going to do, I'll just do it.
And I can just switch off and just find stuff to watch,
Netflix, podcasts, YouTube. Yeah.
You're you're running streak. How far was your most most
people have got you have to do this much 5K or whatever in a
day. What?
What was your streak? It it probably was around
because I wasn't running big. Well, I say I wasn't running big
distances. Probably the most I would have
done because I'd done a couple of marathons, but I would
probably do absolute minimum and male.
But I had sort of a route. I didn't have any idea how far I
was running because I'd never heard of Strava.
I didn't have a Garmin. I didn't know there were things
that you could plot roots on and sort of going out with a little
trundle heel. I didn't know how far I was
running, so I had sort of a 5K route and that would be what I
did every morning. Sometimes I would jazz it up and
go opposite direction, but I'm a real creature.
I have it. So yeah.
I think the minimum I would let myself do would have been a
male, but I've honestly no idea of what distances I was doing.
If you hadn't got your stress fracture, do you think you'd
continued it? Yeah, I think so.
It was almost, it wasn't a good, it wasn't a good thing, but I
kind of, it broke that. It broke that feeling of I have
to go out and run every day. Now don't get me wrong, I do
still like to run every day, but I don't have a meltdown if I
don't. Yeah, I, I did a, a run streak.
It was 10 miles a day and I did it for 100 days.
And I, I got to the point where I was doing it for the sake of
doing it, not because I was enjoying it.
And I got to, it was like, right, that's 100, That's a
round Number because it means nothing to anybody apart from
me. I'm stopping now.
Yeah. So you progressed from your
thank you on the treadmill. What was your first race that
you entered and what prompted you for that?
So my first race was Edinburgh Half Marathon in 2014.
So I'd obviously done a couple of years of just plodding around
the streets and thought I don't even know why.
I don't know why I did it. I can't remember if so, my dad
had my dad was diagnosed with leukemia now he was diagnosed
when I was 40. So I think the first one I did
for charity and I think there was just a bit of that and it
was just a bit of I'm just going to try it and see if I can do
it. I didn't honestly didn't have a
clue and I probably hated it and finished it.
And when I had that initial high in thinking, no, I'm never doing
that again, but I did. So that was, that was my first,
my first race, but, and to be honest, I didn't realize I how
many Rd. races I had done. I remember doing the half, the
Edinburgh half once, the Scottish half once.
And I knew I had done the Edinburgh marathon twice.
But when I looked back in total I had done, I think I did 7 half
marathons and the two marathons and yeah, the last, the last
full marathon I did and I swore that was it.
I was not doing anything that long again. 100% never again and
then a friend sorry when you go. Were they, were they all on road
then? Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, and this, I mean, I remember, I remember going into
a running shop which is no longer in existence.
And I, I must, I don't know what I was running in, but they had
sold me. I didn't have a clue.
They sold me a pair of trail shoes to go and do this road
marathon. So I so, I mean, honestly, it's
that's how clueless I was. Didn't have a clue about
anything. Yeah, but that was that was the
the road marathons and then and then the ultras started.
You're Edinburgh either half a marathon?
Did you get one of the infamous medals?
I think, I think I have. Yes, I have.
For anybody, any listener who doesn't know, one of the medals
look like a male appendage if you looked at it from reverse.
Yeah, yeah, I thought I've always had.
Sorry, Nikki, Sorry. Sorry, I was just thinking that
when you said infamous, I was thinking you, I mean, did you
just get a medal? And I thought Michelle's quick,
so I shouldn't have got a medal. Yeah, no, there have been.
There was one of the Scottish halves where they didn't have,
they don't have medals for anyone at the end.
Yeah. That so that's I've been in that
situation as well. That's fine.
So going from infamous medals to maybe more favorite medals, but
honestly, a medal, you're doing a race because you enjoy the
race. Have you got a favorite race
that you've done? There's many and they're all my
favorite for for different reasons.
I think my can I have two favourites but.
You can have. All my favourites, but if I had,
I can't just choose one, I can choose 2.
So I think my first favorite is Space and Wheel Tree Ultra
because it was the first ultra that I did and I love it up on
the Mori Coast. It's, it's one of my favourite
places in Britain. And it was the very first ultra
that I did. And I just again, I didn't have
a clue. I kept waiting for mummy at
checkpoints and he's like, what are you doing?
Just run. And I just, I don't know why.
I just, I just didn't have a clue.
And the next time I went back to that, that's when I got my
stress fracture during the race. And then I went back to 1/3 time
and was amazed to be first lady in it.
So I have very fond memories from it being my first race to
be in the first time I I won a race was quite the thing.
And then the other has to be the waste island.
We for you know, it's it's beautiful.
The the course is just amazing. The I love the atmosphere of it.
It's it's such good fun. You know, you, it is a laugh and
I think so I've done that. Fortunate enough to have done it
three times. And 2023 was everything just
went right. And you know, I'd, I'd wanted
that, I'd hoped to get sub 24 and I got that within 5 minutes.
And my son always says that he, if it wasn't for me, mom, you
wouldn't have got that because he basically ran off down the
fire road. And I thought, well, I'm going
to just have to keep up with them.
So. So yeah, he, he takes the, he
takes the credit for that one. So they're probably my 2
favourites. But other races, you know, where
I've had to dig deep, where it's been, it's just been awful.
And you think, what, what am I doing?
This is just horrible. I'm kinda, they're my favorite
in different ways that I've had to dig deep for them.
And yeah. What, what do you think's the
the deepest that you've had to dig yourself out of?
Probably hauling off my hauling myself off the Kenlock, leaving
Sports Center floor AT3O clock in the morning thinking I've got
to go and I'm not. Yeah.
So feeling physically unwell during the waste Highland we and
having macerated feet on the southern upland we during the
ultra Scotland hundreds. So they've probably been the
toughest. They're the ones that come to
the front of my mind. Yeah, has been the the toughest
ones. But but I'm also quite.
They're my favorite just for different reasons as well.
You men, you mentioned the ultra Scotland 100 there with your
macerated feet, your desires to do race across Scotland.
Yeah, that was the answer to one of my later questions.
But there's something, there's something about the southern
upland. We I have done the full route
with, with my friend Neil, who I do lots of running with.
We did it over a number of weekends.
So we do sort of point to point and and split it over I think
four or five weekends. It took us months just because
of trying to get timings and stuff.
But I have done the full thing and the middle section it's it's
just breathtaking. The the scenery is just, it's
just incredible. It's just so vast.
It's you're just, it's, it's lovely.
And I've had days up there where Neil and I have thought we were
going to die. I mean, I can laugh about it
now. It wasn't funny at the time.
We took in turns to be panicking.
And it was kind of like, yeah, so there is something, there's
something about the Southern Upman way that's that's drawing
me to doing something bigger. But I have to learn how to look
after my feet first. But what's Neil's surname so we
can give him a shout out? Neil Ramsey, Yep, he's the one
that got me into all this ultra nonsense, he said.
Sign up for Space Sideway and worry about it.
Neither the time, OK. You've got a really nice segue
and so I think you read my mind there because what I my next
question that's not on the set was going to be how did you
progress from I am never doing this distance from a road
Madison ever again to becoming the ultra runner?
How I know you know? Yeah, so it's through, it's
through Ian, my husband. It's it's a friend of it was a
friend of his. And we'd been in the pub and he
happened to mention that he was doing this race the space eyed
way ultra. And I think my ears probably
picked up for two reasons. I was like, oh, space ice baby,
I love it up there. What's what is what's this
ultra? What is what are you talking
about? And, and he sort of, you know,
he explained it and I thought, that's mad.
You know, imagine, imagine doing a marathon and then having to
keep going for another, I don't know, like 12 miles or
something. That's just insane.
How can you do that? And I think it just sort of it
just planted a seed. And as I say, Neil said to me,
just sign up for it. You know, this was probably
early in the year, maybe February, March time.
Just sign up for it and and worry about it neither the time.
So that's exactly what I did. And then you caught bug.
Yeah, yeah. When you've done space side, was
it Kyle? Was Kyle taken over or was it
back when Sarah was still in charge?
That was Sarah, Yeah. So we used to go for the the
they would do like a Curry and Bucky, Yeah.
So yeah, it was great. They were great races.
Yeah, I've, I've done them myself.
The other questions when I asked was macerated feet.
How did you get over them and finish with them?
I don't know. I don't know that.
I don't know what to do. I don't know how to deal with
it. I remember I'd gone into, I
forget what the checkpoints called, but there's a bit on the
Southern Upland Way, one of the checkpoints you have to run past
the the Southern Upland Way to this hall, the name which
escapes me. And my feet were just so, so
sore. And the, the crew, not the crew,
the volunteers weren't allowed to help you.
And I remember I was, I just feeling sick.
My feet were so sore. It was the middle of the night.
The weather was horrible. And I thought I had to taken off
my socks and shoes. You know, I was going to put dry
things on. And he was kind of, you just
need to let them dry out a bit. So not knowing what to do, I
didn't know you had all this kit in my box, but I didn't know how
to, how to use it, you know, didn't know where to start.
And I thought that all I can do here is try to let them dry out
the best I can and then put on dry dry socks.
But then you're putting them back into dry shoe.
Sorry, wet shoes. So got my feet back, got my
shoes back on, went off into the night, threw more bogs.
And I remember so I didn't. I had never had macerated feet
before and I'd come down to the side of Saint Mary's Loch and it
was mourning by then and I remember going along and saying
to my support runner Dave, who's just an absolute star.
I was like, Dave, I've I've got something in my shoe and I'm
going to have to stop as it's goofy and I think I've got glass
in my shoe. And I sat down at the side of
the lock and it was freezing cold and I took my shoe and sock
off and I just, I almost wanted something to fall out my shoe.
Nothing came out. And I thought, that's my foot.
My foot's just absolutely trashed.
I said I can't do this. And my crew was meeting me at
the end of the lock and I just thought, I don't think I can do
this. And Dave was just kind of like,
you can do it, you know, I think I probably only had only, I
don't know, 20 odd miles or maybe something that was maybe
about 80 miles in. So I don't know, I just, I just
have to try ignore it. And they, they healed up pretty
quickly after it. It's amazing.
Just as soon as you get them dry, how quickly they start to
feel better. But it is something that worries
me about going back to that route because I think if it
never rained again, that route would still be wet.
I think gravity is broken on the southern Auckland way.
The water just sits everywhere so.
Yeah. It's not nice and I've never had
macedrated feet like that again, fortunately, but.
Well, Dave, you said it was a star, so what's his name?
Oh, David Hanna, he, yeah, he's a, he's a an amazing runner.
He does. He does tough stuff and he has
very kindly run with me on each of my West Highland ways and and
the southern the Outer Scotland 100 as well, so he puts up with
a lot from me. I think that's important though,
to have someone like that on your crew that does know you.
And as you say, when you say, oh, I can't do it.
It's the crew member knowing that he can push you on.
Because some that I've read and heard from a lot of people never
have your spouse because they're oh, they're there, you know, or
they'll just say suck it up. Do you know what I mean?
It's well, exactly, exactly that.
So Dave ran with me. Sorry I'm jumping about here but
Dave ran with me this year in the West Highway again from He
always Comes with me Octo Tyre to Glencoe and from about Bridge
of Orchy to to Glencoe. I was, I was, I was just a
wreck. I just was, I was, I was
emotional. I felt rubbish.
I was in tears. And and Dave was just brilliant.
And when I got to Glencoe, the volunteers were lovely to me,
which made me cry even more. And Ian, my husband said to me,
we'll just stop. And I'm like, are you?
No, you muppet, why would I stop now?
Shut up. So yeah, the, the crew, they
know not to. They probably know you do want
to stop, but you don't really want to stop, Yeah.
You might want to stop at that particular time, but you will
regret it 2 minutes later. Exactly.
And I have so the the couple of times where I have wanted to
quit, I have had this internal dialogue and Dave said to me how
will you feel if you stop now? How will you feel, You know, a
couple of days after this and I do try to do the nothings acute.
I'm not there's your legs not falling off, you're not really
unwell. This is kinda normal.
So just get on with it. And at that section was it makes
Jelly baby that helped as well. That's.
Exactly what got me to Glenn. Cool.
I hope that wasn't all you were eating, but it definitely had an
influence. Yeah.
So fuel and I had fuel pretty well actually, probably up until
Octo tire. And then the heat of the day.
I'm getting the weather that day, I think from one O clock in
the morning till I finished at whatever time on Sunday morning.
Just tried to kill me. You know, it went from blistered
and hot humid to with a storm on the Latig Moor.
So I was like, yeah, just give me all today, it's fine.
But I didn't my fuel and just fell off a Cliff from from Alter
Tire and I think I got quite dehydrated as well, which I
ended, which is why I ended up in the state I was in and
Kenlock leaving. So yeah.
So compared to your 2023 when you said everything went right,
how would you normally feel? So I have, I feel like I'm going
full circle with my fuel. And I used to always just be,
I'd go out with real food. I'd go out with, you know,
peanut butter and jam sandwiches, chocolate bars,
crisps, dilutin juice in my bottles.
I never used to do electrolytes. I've never heard of them.
And so that was what that's how I'd fuel probably till maybe a
year ago, 18 months ago. And I think, I think the whole
gel thing, carbs per hour, it's just it's everywhere.
Everyone's trying to do X number of grams.
And I guess I jumped on the bandwagon and thought, I
wondered if gels would be easier.
I wonder if they'd make me not fall to bits after 10 hours or
whatever. So I did, I did use gels.
No, I've never used them exclusively, but for the waste
time and we did gels pretty much until maybe I'm trying to think
what's before Octo Ben Glass. I probably had something to eat
at Ben glass, but the more of the more I've thought about it,
I'm not fast enough to need gels.
I'm not doing that intensity, you know, just the view.
I'm, I'm, I'm almost going right back to, I'm just going to go
back to real food. Don't get me wrong, I've still
got a pile of gels that are that I've got to use.
So I'll carry them and I'll maybe have them if I'm out on a
shorter run. But I think I'd much rather be
able to eat, even if it's less. I'd rather eat be able to eat
less for the whole thing rather than ending up in an absolute
state with nausea, which I know will always.
It happens, but I'm veering back to real food now.
You say for the jails for the shorter runs.
Would you fuel on shorter runs in your training with jails even
still? So yes, probably just to use
them, but I never used to again. I still every day is I'm
learning, I'm fueling. I've been pretty poor at I think
I've got a way for many years of I would never fuel.
So I do most pretty much all of my runs early morning, some
might say middle of the night, but that early morning for me.
And so the thought of eating something, anything before I go
and do that is kind of that's not appealing to me.
Yeah. But I'm trying to reframe it
and, and I think I'm getting more interested about the
recovery thing and how, you know, after a run, how I'm
dealing with the rest of that day and then the next day and
the next run. So yeah, I would, I've, I've
started trying to eat before a run, even if it's something
small and even if it's an hours run, you know, having something
before maybe having something during it.
So yeah, I might stick a gel in a pocket and but I think once
they're gone, I don't, I'm not convinced I'm going to go back
to them. And for the viewers and
listeners that don't know Michelle Michelle's on My
Strava, a lot of Michelle's run start in the morning with a
four. So you're saying eating
something small? And I can resonate with that
because the earliest runs I'll start at just before 5:00 or
5:00-ish when I'm on a good day and I've really got the mindset.
What would you try and eat? So I have been having a banana.
Right. And yeah, and I, I guess I'm
just, I'm open to trying to, to try something different.
So I'm kind of just like, well, they're, they're, they're easy.
So that's what I've been, that's what I've been doing.
So that I think this morning, that's what I had.
I had half a banana, you know, it's just, it's just something
going in. Yeah.
So will you have that and then go out straight away or will you
have that and then get ready for your run and?
Oh, I've not got time for that, Nikki.
Yeah, it's literally up running gear.
Yeah. Something you know, I wouldn't
normally, but it takes it takes no time to to eat a bit banana
and then and then run. And I was about, I did wonder if
it was going to like, I hate the thought of something like
repeating on me, like, you know, you're going along burping
banana or whatever. Yeah.
But it's but it's been OK. See, I worry about it going the
other way, especially in the mornings.
If I eat something, it kick starts.
That got going and everything. I'll admit I've had it once or
twice early morning runs, but I've tried it and I'm like, oh,
my stomach doesn't feel good. But thankfully I don't venture
too far away from the house. So yeah.
No, don't get me wrong, back when I was when I just started
running, I think, I think that was a fear of mine, but it's, it
actually isn't now. And I think even I think the
older I get as well, I just like, I just carry stuff with
me. And it's like not if I'm going
local, but if I'm going out for a long day, I'll just carry
stuff. And it's like, well, got to go,
you got to go. So take stuff that means that
you're not like in an absolute state for the rest of your run
kind of thing. But no, I have been in the early
days. It it's just like my body was
like, what the heck are you doing shoogling me about like
this? Yeah, but it's not it's not a
thing anymore. And if I have eaten something
out of the ordinary the night before, I'll maybe do a
treadmill run because then the I'm in the garage.
It's fine. Well, going going from the
conversation of crap onto good things, what is your And you may
have already answered this for your three West Ham Lake
goblets, but what is your biggest running achievement?
Gosh, every single race I finish is an achievement.
You know, I think there's been I've had tough southern.
I keep going back to the southern of the way is.
I think I didn't appreciate how how tough that route is.
You know, it might not be as rocky as the West Highland way,
but there's some vicious claims in there.
You know, it's that was a big achievement, probably because it
was the furthest I'd gone just with it being that bit over 100
miles. Yeah, but you know, doing I've
done getting 100 miles in 24 hours.
So I've done a couple of 24 hour events where I've managed to get
100 miles and that's that's quite an achievement.
So yeah, I think being able to run 100 miles in 24 hours is is
quite an achievement actually. Well, 100 miles in 24 hours is
happens to be backyard pace. So have you ever thought about
doing a Backyard Ultra? I've done 2.
You've done 2. I've done 2 but I they were
never here. I come with my my intention was
never to get the 100 miles. They weren't.
So I've done, I've done the Highlander and I did have a bit
of a foot injury when I was doing that, but I also was doing
the Devil of the Highlands a few weeks after so and the weather
was, the rain was biblical. It wasn't my intention.
I think I did, I think I did 11 yards and I did the cowshade
backyard ultra as well. And I think I did 12.
And again, it wasn't it wasn't my my race.
I think I had the waste tile we actually wasted on.
I think it was 2023. I did that as well.
So, but I am signed up to do be Craig's and it will be
interesting. It will be interesting to see
how I feel about it because what I like about the just the 24
hour events is if I want to take longer at the end of one lap, I
can't wait as the pressure of the the the on the hour start
time. Yeah, it it puts a whole other
dimension on to it. But I am, I'm looking forward to
having another go at that, yeah. And off of the back of running
achievements, Michelle, I wanted to ask earlier on when you'd
mentioned that you'd came first female at space side, what was
that feeling like? Did you go out to become first
female on that race or did you just go out to run?
Just went out to run like genuinely, I just, it was just
one of those. It was just one of those
mornings where, you know, I started running and I thought,
oh, I feel feel quite good. I don't know about you, but when
I start, even if it's a, if it's a long social run or, or a race,
I can normally tell pretty early on how I'm feeling, You know, in
terms of do my guts feel right? Do my legs feel like they don't
belong to me sort of thing. And I think I set off and, and
felt good. And I remember as I passed past
another runner, someone saying to me, you'll never keep up 8
minute miles or whatever. And I'm I was again at that
time, I had no idea about pacing.
And I just kind of thought in my head, well, I'll keep going at
this speed for as long as long as you can.
So I just ran my own sort of ran along enjoying it.
It was, it was a nice day and my husband was actually Marshall
and one of the road crossings. And as I came through, he said
to me, you're first female. And I said, shut up, be mad.
You, you must have missed them. They'll all be up the hill.
You've been chatting to someone. Anyway, that was, that was about
13 miles in or something. I, I roundabout there and I
didn't believe him. And again, I just was in a wee
world of my own and, you know, plodding along and there's
another, there's another bit of a climb.
It's not a, it's not a hilly route, but there is a bit of a
climb at some point. And I don't remember at what
point. And I remember a couple of girls
going past me and I genuinely like, I couldn't have cared
less. I was just out doing my own
thing sort of thing. And we 2 and we sort of like
were weak frogging each other along this route.
And when we got to speedy, which is so the year before, where my
foot where I'd actually felt the break happen.
I kind of remember getting to that point thinking, oh, this is
where my foot broke last year. I hope that doesn't happen
again. And this other woman, I think I
passed her and she stopped to take, I don't know, she stopped
to get something. And I just, again, I didn't know
where I was in positions and ran past.
It used to be seen as mom and dad.
I think we always had their camper van at the end of the
woods before you go into the woods and went past there.
And I was just running along and passing people and just felt
great. And as you go into, I think it's
Ian's town or something, it's called, which I always remember
because my husband's called Ian. I think it is Ian's town.
Is that what it's called? I can't.
Remember, anyway, people started saying, oh, you're doing great,
you're first woman. And again, I'm thinking you've
got this wrong. You have to have this wrong.
And I kinda, I started looking over my shoulder and that was a
weird thing because I would never look.
I didn't, I didn't care. And I remember coming into Bucky
and people cheating me on. They're doing amazing.
And I, and I just thought, God, this is, this is, this is good.
This is really feels really nice.
And as I put, as I, as I ran up to the finish, lo and behold, I
was, I was first, first female. And it was, it felt amazing.
I mean, I was completely in disbelief.
I had no idea that was that. It was not my intention.
I'd I never ever would have set out to to try win something.
But it felt good and I think. There was.
He must have been the latest. What was that?
You must have been the latest. I was and she came in maybe like
a couple of minutes behind me. So it was really close.
Yeah, it was great. I think I got during that race
as well. I think I got my my marathon PB
during that ultra. It was like.
I've heard that happens a lot to like people that decide they
want to do ultra running like they end up getting them out of
the bearing ultras. Just because they're more fun.
My my marathon PV was during D33.
So there you go. Looking at the map, the only
thing I can see is Port Gordon, OH.
Is it? That's not Ian's time.
I don't. I don't know.
I. Think there is an Ian's time?
I'm sure there is a. I'm sure anyway, check
afterwards and I'll let I'll let you know if I'm completely off
but while mates. Try to look up Ian's town.
I'll ask the next question as to why do you run.
I love, I love being outdoors. And I think that goes back to my
dad like I would, we'd always go out walking, you know, at the
weekend. And my mum was she was a took me
used to take my granny out. My Gran had she was in a
wheelchair. She had a polio.
And we would always take my Gran out for big long walks.
Well, they felt like big long walks.
They weren't, but they felt like these big long walks, Gran in
her wheelchair and you know, mum pushing her.
And I just always like that what going and doing something and
maybe going a bit further than than people would normally like
a normal walk. And my dad would, you know, he
would, we'd go up to the, the Braid Hills in Edinburgh.
And I just like being outdoors. And I love being outdoors,
particularly in the, in the spring, in the summer when it's
really light, really early and it's, it's really quiet and
sunrise. And yeah, it's, it's, it's, it's
just great. It soothes my mind.
And I love being in remote places.
Yeah. I love how you can be out there
and you can feel like, oh, this is we're miles from anything.
We're miles from safety. But you kind of know you're
going to be OK. And.
And this and just the, the feeling of afterwards, you know,
when you've been something that's really nice to be about
in wild weather, sometimes they're the best when you're
getting absolutely pelted with rain and you're freezing and you
get back and you get all warmed up and it's just, it's just
nice. Outdoors is good.
And running, I guess you can go a bit further in a shorter space
of time kind of thing. You know, I like going for a
walk, but I always think if I was running this wouldn't take
me as long. I think that's the beauty of the
Pentlands, How 'cause I know you like that as a training ground,
how you're saying it can feel like you're in the middle of
nowhere but really in reality. Or you can see Edinburgh from
the top. It's such a cool place to go.
I love it. Yeah, they're they're, they're
my, I feel really lucky to have them so close by.
Sometimes Neil and I will run from our house to the Pentlands.
If we're if we're doing a long run, we can, we can do that.
But you know, I can be there in 15 minutes if I, if I drive over
in the morning. And it's, it's great.
Yeah. I I think I've found Ian's town
or Ianston as it's probably announced locally.
It's to the east of Bucky, so I'm guessing you don't go that
far in the race that you were talking about.
Is it Bucky? You do.
You come. Yeah, you do.
You definitely run because you run through it, because you
think you're almost there and you're like, where's this bloody
Bucky? And I'm pretty sure.
Have you done the any Akhiles races?
Because that'll take you along because it's, yeah, the, the
race that you're talking the original space sideway.
I, I think it finishes in Bucky. So you don't go that Far East.
Oh, do you know, I could have sworn that I ran through there.
And then by after Bucky, you got Vandocti Venacti.
Yeah. And and then it was on to
Cullen. So yeah, you're not.
Maybe it's so we we Quality and Cullen quite a lot.
Maybe I'm misremembering from what I've been doing, but
anyway. But you're not done any races.
But you'll be checking your Strava map later.
And I will be dropping your message.
Did you do extra miles and you still won the race?
Absolutely not. Has been done before.
Right, the the next question is why do you run?
No, that's what we. First asked, I was busy looking
up the map and you, you took my question.
Oh no, it's not right. What do you think about while
you're running? Oh, any number of things.
I I never used to run with headphones, and probably in the
last again, the last couple of years I've listened to podcasts.
If I'm out just on a train and run, I'll put podcasts and
races. I don't listen to anything other
than the thoughts in my head where I'm trying to do the old
mathletics. How many miles have I still got
to go? If I do it this fast, when will
I be finished? When can this finish?
But yeah, just just random, like thoughts just come and go in my
head. It's a busy place in my head.
And it's just like a mash of don't know what I'm going to do
that day, what I'm going to do next week, you know, just it's,
it's dead, random, nothing in particular.
And, and do you remember afterward?
Like if you've had a brilliant idea, it's going to save the
world, it's going to solve the energy crisis, And do you
remember any of it afterwards? No, absolutely not.
Good, because they're right. So moving on from thinking about
what you think about when running, what have you got
coming up for the rest of the events wise or running wise in
general? So I've got the noon on
Saturday, which I'm quite looking forward to because I've
never been there. So I'm looking forward to that.
You know, I'm going with Gomer, my mate Neil.
I know other people that are that are doing it and it really
is as a social as a social weekend for me.
This. I've not done much racing this
year and the races I've done I've I've put ridiculous amounts
of pressure on myself. I had my first, I got tamed out
in Gran Canaria in February and I didn't realize how much
affected me. And as much as I kind of
thought, God, I had a fear of being tamed out on every race
I've done since then. So I'm looking forward to going
to an organized event, a route that I don't need to think
about. It's it's there and and being
around and being around other people.
And then I've got Bena he on in October.
And I am literally doing that for the T-shirt.
It's a great T-shirt. And what does it say on the
T-shirt? Bum scalped it.
Benny Ultra Marathon being bum. So yeah, I've got that in
October and then I've signed up for the Arc of Attrition 50 in
January on a whim. The things tracing me out most
about that is the logistics of getting there.
It is the absolute arts end of Britain and it'll be winter.
So that's I guess that's it's not an A race, but it's one that
I'll I want to do it. I want to feel good doing it.
You know, I want to to finish it feeling strong and not, you
know, get my feeling right and and just and feel strong through
and enjoy it. So that's, that's, that's the
rest of this year and start of next year.
Yeah, could be a good one. It's quite an iconic race on a
lot of people's bucket lists. It's seldom mine with it always
landed on my birthday weekend. Yeah, I don't when I'd I'd my
friend Dave that I'd mentioned he did the he did the 100 this I
think it was this year he did it and he said to me, you hate you
hate mud, cold, dark. Why?
Why are you doing that? And I don't know, part of me
wants to go and do things that it's kind of like, feel the fear
and do it anyway, you know, if they were all just lovely, then,
yeah, you know, and it might be nice down there.
We might get a nice crisp day. You never know.
We don't know what weather could be like in the UK in January.
Look at winter. Spain last year or the year
before when Jack's got time. The record?
Hot as January and God knows how long.
Yeah. Yeah.
So yeah, a few things to look forward to.
And you mentioned that earlier on, I think I nabbed this
question off you and you gave a bit of an answer as to dream
races or bucket list races. Aside from Wrasse, is there
anything else that's on your radar?
There, there isn't really I, I think, and it's not necessarily
a race, but I'd like to see if I can do longer than 100 multiple
nights. And again, it's, you know,
during the West Highway there I was telling everyone, anyone
that would listen to me. I'm never, I'm not cut out for
this long distance. And but there's just something
when you see other people doing it and they're, they're just
amazing. And I'm going to say they're
ordinary people. What is it, you know, if people
say they're ordinary people doing extraordinary things and
it's, yeah, I might fail. I wouldn't go into thinking I'm
going to fail, but I just would love to know if I could, if I
could make my body go from, you know, from one side of the
country to the other and, and do that, do that longer distance,
it'd be it'd be an adventure. I did tell Ian and he just sort
of shook his head and said, for God's sake, Michelle, which
spurs me on even more. There are easier ways to get
from one side of the country to the other.
Well was there not just someone recently that did the did an FKT
up north at the shortest? Yeah, there was, yeah, from West
of ullapool to Dornish, the shortest coast to coast in the
UK. Yeah, but where's the fun in
that? Yeah, so and so I don't have,
you know, yeah, there's races that I love watching, but
they're not necessarily, they don't necessarily have me
thinking I want to go and do them like UT MB, I love watching
them, Western states love watching them.
But that racing abroad is, it adds a whole other level of, to
me, stress. Yeah, You know, I get stress
going on holiday. Adding to that, taking all your
stuff for running. My mind's blown.
I can't. So I think the older I get, I
want to keep things more local. Going to England is far enough.
Yeah, yeah. And as you say, UTMB, from the
looks of it is an absolute suckass.
Like the amount of people that are at it.
I mean, it's, it looks an amazing course and an amazing
event, but to run in that, I mean, I, I don't do well in
crowds so that it would put me off.
You would hate the start of UT MB is you see the pictures of
Tour de France where all this sort of French people are not
nicely French, but in France there's a crowd in the street
and the cyclists can't even get through the gap.
That's kind of what it feels like with the start of the UT
MB. Yeah.
I don't know how busy. I mean, the arcs are UT MB
based. It's obviously it's, it's not
the UT MB, but I don't know how busy that will be.
I think that might be pretty busy as well.
I don't know if it might be the same as Lakeland.
You know, that's that's huge numbers of people.
So it'll be fine. I think Kellogg is busy, but I
think they do. I think it's about like flinging
that when they do carpet. I don't think there's that
course won't accommodate that one time.
I don't think so. It looks a good one.
Are you, I'm going to ask, are you going to do West Highland
Way twice more so that you can get your, you don't have to be
in the ballot entry. I would love to do it as many
more times as I can. It's a yeah.
The thing about doing it five times, then you to use that
right you have to do it 6 times. Yeah.
And then if you do it 6 times,
you then do it four more times. So you get your the cancer.
So you may as well, yeah. I mean, yeah, it's it's just
love. There's just something about it
from a, from a, It's O'Neal. Sorry if I'm gassing on here,
but my friend Neil, my love of the waste time we came from
joining him on, you know, they do the sort of organized social
run in the January and he was doing the race that year.
And I had gone along and just when I went along on that social
run and and I just thought I want to be part of this, but
couldn't imagine myself ever running 96 miles.
But then think, you know, I did. And and I just love it.
And every time I do it, I say never again.
But there's just something about it.
And you just yeah, you just if you.
Yeah, I just want to get to the end of it once I start it.
You, you mentioned that you want to do a race where you're
running through multiple nights. I, I can tell you that there's
something Lord of the Rings special about breaking the
second dawn. So as well you got to, if you're
getting into the second night and you need inspiration, just
think about how great it's going to be running into this the, the
second day, the second dawn as the light breaks through.
So I I recommend that. For Have you For have you done
race across Scotland, Mike? I've not no I the the first year
it was run, I was invited, given a a place and I couldn't accept
it because that was the my wife was due her child.
OK. A couple of weeks after or
before. So it's just like, no, I, I
can't risk being in a different part of the country.
No. And it's not like me to turn
down a free race, so. I know, but I think, you know,
it's, it's getting more and more popular as as well.
These, these races. It's, I mean, in the short space
of time that I've been participating in ultras, I've
noticed it's just blown up with the popularity and the number of
races that you can, that you can do, but certain ones are
becoming just more and more popular.
So yeah. Before I may cast the next
question, Michelle, which we're probably going to wrap up the
interview, I just want to know you do these big hundreds, 50
Milos and that do you have a preferred distance that you
really enjoy? I don't, I don't know, because
if you're having a good day, you know, then then it doesn't
matter, you know, you might be out for 1/2 marathon and I was
great. It was challenging, but it was
great. I, I don't know if I've got a
preferred distance. I mean, Saturday I'm looking
forward to, you know, I shouldn't, I hope all being
well, you know, I managed to eat for for that length of time, my
legs won't feel too trashed and to finish not feeling absolutely
wrecked will be will be nice. But I like a challenge.
And as well, if it's a nice course, then yeah, I like to go
for long, long runs. I've done most of the route but
I've never done the race. My father-in-law stays near the
noon. So I've been down there, but say
I haven't done the whole route because on the I think it's on
the way. Like you go around, it's around
a lock and then you're coming back.
And rather than following the normal route, I will up in the
hills. So just to make it harder.
Yeah. Right, on to the the final
awkward question to wrap it up. Is there anybody that you can
think of that you would aspire to either run with, race with
wherever you want. They can be alive or not,
fictional or not. Yeah, so I did think about this
one and and I'll try not to get emotional.
I would. I'd love to run with my family,
my parents and my husband and son.
You know, my parents gave me a love of the outdoors and I'm
always quite envious when I see people my age running with their
children. And I think I think that's
amazing. I would love to have had that
with my parents. And it's just that it's that
it's a generational thing now. You know, I don't, you know,
people my you do get people my parents age running, but it
wasn't the thing back then. And I think I'd love to see or
I'd love to see your trails with them.
And, and my husband as well, who isn't a runner and had never
been in the Pentlands until last year when I took him for a walk
up in the hills. And, and my son as well.
You know, I saw them, these pictures and I sometimes think
they don't, they don't get the real sense of adventure and, and
what it's like. So they're the people I would
love to go on a trail run with and, and be in beautiful parts
of the country and, and the, all the, the vistas that I see.
So sometimes I'll send, you know, I'll FaceTime my mum and
dad when I'm out. I did that once on the West
Highland we and I was sure, you know, turning the camera around
and showing them the, the views and yeah, they love it.
So that's, that's who I'd like to run with.
It will never happen, but that's who I'd like to run with.
Never say never, but I I think that draws us to a close.
Unless Nikki's got anything else to ask.
Nope, That's that was a great interview.
Thank you so much for coming on, Michelle.
Thank you for asking me. No problem at all.
Just bringing me to say thank you Michelle for coming on.
Thank you Nikki for being Nikki and it's goodbye for me.
Bye now. Thank you very much.
Bye.