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Hello and welcome to another 
episode of Run Till You're Done.

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Today we are joined by someone 
who proves loudly and 

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unapologetically that it is 
never too late to completely 

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rewrite your life. 
Our guest didn't start running 

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until his 40s, and since then 
he's gone on to race some of the

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toughest and most epic ultra 
events on the planet. 

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From the UTNB series to the wild
landscapes of Chile and Spain 

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where he now splits his time, 
he's built a global following by

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being honest, raw, and 
refreshingly unfiltered about 

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the highs, lows, and the 
absolute madness of ultra 

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running. 
He's a coach, storyteller and 

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adventurer and a fantastic 
example of what can happen when 

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you stop making excuses and you 
start moving forward. 

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Welcome to the show, Ian Morgan.
Wow. 

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Thanks, Nikki, and hi, Mike, and
thanks for the introduction. 

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I always feel like when whenever
I do a podcast, I feel like 

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you're introducing someone else 
that's done a whole lot of 

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things in their life. 
And you know, for me, it's this 

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is just, it's just what I do. 
So it's not, it's my normal 

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everyday life. 
So yeah, I appreciate all the 

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kudos though. 
Well, not a problem. 

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Welcome to the show, Ian. 
Since it is your everyday life, 

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tell us how how did you first 
get into this being your 

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everyday? 
Well, I had quite a different 

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life. 
I didn't do any sport. 

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I did when I was in school, high
school, and I did do some cross 

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country and hiking and those 
kinds of things. 

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But well, Fast forward to my mid
40s and I was in an ongoing 

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court case with the government 
of New Zealand fighting to 

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change the law on a certain 
topic around insurance. 

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And, and we had some big 
earthquakes and I was under a 

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lot of stress, a lot of pressure
trying to run a business. 

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My marriage at the time was 
falling apart and in divorce. 

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So I was under a lot of stress, 
a lot of pressure. 

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And I thought, man, this is 
hard. 

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Like I thought I'd made it. 
I'd I'd bought the house, I had 

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the cars, I had an amazing 
business and I was really happy,

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or what I thought was happy that
that was meant to be the sorry, 

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the definition of success and 
happiness. 

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But I just felt quite empty 
inside. 

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And not to say that it was the 
circumstances around me that 

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were causing that, but it was 
more, I wasn't being true to 

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myself. 
And I just thought, when was I 

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last happy? 
And I thought when I was a kid 

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and I was running in the hills 
behind the house, just playing 

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and mucking around and I just 
thought, yeah, maybe that's it. 

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Maybe if I just get up and run I
can catch that feeling again. 

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Let's just say the first few 
runs I didn't catch that feeling

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just about killed me. 
However, that was the turning 

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point. 
It was just this, I don't know, 

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desire to seek something out 
that was pure, simple and 

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something I could immerse myself
in that that wasn't all the 

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noise that was going on at the 
time. 

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And do you think looking back at
the pre running life that is 

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what you were looking for? 
Just what was it that you were 

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searching for when you decided 
you wanted to start the running?

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Yeah, I mean, honestly, at that 
point in time, it was escape. 

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You know, I'll be entirely 
honest. 

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And, you know, that sounds 
pretty mature. 

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It's like, oh, well, you're 
going to literally run away from

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your problems. 
Yeah, 100%. 

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That's how I felt at the time. 
Obviously that's grown and 

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developed. 
Now it's it's it's more form of,

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you know, meditation. 
It's it's part of me and what I 

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do. 
It doesn't define me and it 

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allows me to do wow, just these 
incredible things that I never 

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imagined. 
So yeah, I mean, I would say 

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honestly, it was initially an 
escape. 

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Do you think there was a a 
point, either a race or an event

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that you just went? 
This is what I do now. 

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Yeah. 
You know, it's an interesting 

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one. 
There were probably two or three

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points like that and probably 
the defining one that that made 

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me 100% commit to this is what I
do now was when I collapsed in a

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race down in Queenstown, which 
is a mountain town on the South 

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Island of New Zealand. 
And I was taken to hospital. 

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And that's when they found out 
about my heart issues. 

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And then I remember the one of 
the doctors in the cardiac ward 

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said, well, that's the end of 
your running days. 

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You know, now you're going to 
have to take it easy and slow 

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down. 
And I thought, no, I want to do 

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the opposite now. 
I want to embrace life and 

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really live it, So yeah, I think
that would have been the 

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catalyst to really commit to 
this lifestyle. 

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Did you think that it's it's all
over, but I'm going to live what

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I've got left or where you're 
thinking I'm going to change my 

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life. 
I'm going to get fit. 

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I'm going to be the best I can 
be. 

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Yeah. 
I mean, it's a combination of 

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both. 
Because you know, I looked at 

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the research, I mean, I did 
actually go to two or three 

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different cardiologists and then
found one that was also an ultra

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runner and they said, Oh no, 
that's absolute rubbish. 

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You can live a completely 
healthy life. 

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You can do amazing things. 
You do have to make some 

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fundamental changes. 
And probably a lot of it was 

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related to how I dealt with 
stress. 

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I mean, there was obviously diet
and lifestyle, et cetera, but 

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yeah, I had to look at a lot of 
different aspects of my life 

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and, and say, OK, the things I 
can change, I have to the things

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I can't change, you know, I have
to accept. 

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But there's other things I need 
to to try to do better with. 

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And and yeah, that was a turning
point in a lot of different 

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ways. 
I'd like to ask, sorry mate, 

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just to jump in. 
We're talking about your old 

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life and this life. 
We say, you know, you know that 

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it's almost like those two IANS.
Did you completely leave your 

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job and everything as well to do
this full time? 

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And if so, how were you brave 
enough to leave like that? 

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Financial security as such. 
Well, the amazing thing about 

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lying on an operating table and 
people poking around inside your

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heart is, yeah, you start giving
a crap. 

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Can I say that you. 
Can say whatever you want. 

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You start giving a crap about 
what everyone thinks and and 

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what's going to happen because 
the chances are you're not there

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the next moment. 
So it's kind of gives you a new 

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perspective on how to live life 
and you realize the things that 

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you used to think were risky 
really aren't. 

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The biggest risk is, is not 
taking a chance, is not trying 

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to live a life that's more 
authentic to what I don't know 

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you, you believe is the way you 
should live it. 

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What's the worst that can 
happen? 

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I mean, I've already been on the
operating table. 

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OK, Yeah. 
The worst that can happen is you

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don't get up from it. 
And, you know, if you get a 

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chance, you get up from it, you 
move forward. 

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Now, don't take this the wrong 
way. 

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I'm not suggesting that everyone
just go and live their fantasy, 

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you know, leave their families 
and do whatever, you know, OK, 

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I'm not paying bills anymore 
because that's not part of my 

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plan. 
Yeah. 

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You know, OK, I'm a realist, 
too. 

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I realize it takes time and 
planning. 

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And it's taken many years to get
to the point where this became a

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relatively sustainable 
lifestyle. 

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It wasn't just I woke up one 
day, transitioned into this and,

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you know, two or three months 
later. 

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Wow, It's fantastic. 
It's been a a lot of hard work 

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in it and, and I wouldn't say, 
you know, there's obviously 

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there's, I'm still the same guy.
You know, my perspective of chat

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has changed on some things, but 
it's not like, well, there's one

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life here and that's gone and 
now there's this life. 

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It's just a transition. 
I think we all change through 

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our lives. 
I mean, we're not the same as we

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were when we were in our 20s. 
Are we like right now? 

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So, you know, we move forward, 
we change things something stay 

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the same. 
And I think you just as you get 

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older, you start to embrace the 
new and the things that you 

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really enjoy and you start to 
leave a lot of the baggage that 

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you've been carrying behind when
you realize really most of it 

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isn't very important at all. 
Listeners will know that I've, 

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I've had heart surgery as well 
and there's been times that I've

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looked back at what, what you 
call your previous life and sort

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of pre, pre surgery, pre heart 
condition. 

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It's been any points that you've
thought, Oh, that makes sense 

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that that I, I had a condition. 
It's like I've or things like 

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I've been up in the hills on my 
own in stupid temperatures that 

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you, it's things you really 
shouldn't be doing even if 

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you're 100% fit and you just 
think, yeah, I shouldn't have 

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done that. 
Is there any moments like that? 

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Yeah. 
Yeah, I still do it, yeah. 

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But yeah, having, having that 
surgery gives you a more an 

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awareness around not just, you 
know, not just for your own 

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life, but you start to think, 
OK, if something goes wrong 

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here, then there's going to be 
people worried about me. 

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Someone's going to have to 
organize someone to find me. 

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And there's, there's going to be
consequences outside of what I'm

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just living my life and doing my
thing, you know, So you do have 

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to take that into account and, 
and, you know, plan accordingly 

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for that. 
Like a, if I'm going to do 

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anything really long, I'm going 
to let people know where I'm 

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going. 
I do take emergency heart 

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medication with me if it's a the
old Nitro pill under the tongue,

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that kind of thing. 
So I, you know, I'm more 

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practical in the sense of I 
realize I do have a heart 

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condition and I can't just like,
push it and the hell with 

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everything. 
So, yeah, you know, there is an 

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awareness around that and well, 
I still like to take risks in 

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certain areas. 
You know, they're they're 

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calculated and managed. 
Do you think that because you 

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know about your condition like 
I, I've been told that I've got 

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a fully functioning heart now. 
And what I said to myself is, 

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well, I know that I can push it 
now because everybody else in 

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the race doesn't know what 
they've got wrong with them. 

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100% Actually, this is a really 
good point because when I was 

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doing one of the stress tests, 
my, my heart actually stopped 

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when I was on the treadmill. 
And, and the, the cardiologist 

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too is doing the test. 
He, he got me on the, on the 

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scanner and that they did an 
echo of my heart and you could 

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see it beating and then stopping
and then beating again. 

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And it's a really weird 
sensation, you know, part of 

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your heart shutting down while 
you're breathing and then you 

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feel the pain and the tightness.
Yeah, it back to the point that 

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I was doing the test, he said, 
well, that's kind of your limit 

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where things start to go wrong 
with your heart. 

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So now when I get to that point 
and I go past it, I think it's 

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fine. 
It's all the pipes are cleared, 

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everything's working, the 
muscles strong. 

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Yeah. 
Whereas someone else that 

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doesn't know, they don't know 
when it's going to happen or how

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it's going to happen. 
But it's kind of like, you know,

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you know, it's your Formula One 
engines been taken apart and 

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stripped down. 
It's been all been checked clean

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bill of health back together. 
Now you're on the racetrack 

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where you go and and yeah, you 
can push it a lot more. 

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I I didn't realize what fatigue 
was until I didn't have it after

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the heart surgery. 
You know, like the level of 

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fatigue I was dealing with in 
training and I thought that was 

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normal. 
And then all of a sudden your 

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new normal is is quite. 
Different. 

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So did you feel that you or do 
you feel now that you were being

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held back previously? 
Yeah, 100%. 

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Yeah. 
Yeah, I think over the last, I 

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think the last year I felt 
relatively OK was about 

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2020-2021. 
And I, I came off an ultra race 

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in, in Spain, 100K mountain 
ultra race off to put an O. 

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Then a few weeks later I did the
Barcelona Marathon because at 

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the time it was COVID. 
So that changed the date to the 

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end of the year instead of in 
spring. 

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And I think I ran a 250 at that 
marathon off the back of 100 

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kilometer ultra. 
And I thought wow, I'm just like

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on fire. 
I'm just like keep going. 

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I'm feeling really good. 
And then I all of a sudden I, my

224
00:13:15,280 --> 00:13:19,200
blood pressure shot up to 
something like crazy, 200 and 

225
00:13:19,640 --> 00:13:24,480
10220 / 160, something like 
ridiculous. 

226
00:13:24,480 --> 00:13:26,720
And I felt like my heart was 
beating out my chest. 

227
00:13:26,720 --> 00:13:29,760
And from that point it sort of 
went away and they gave me some 

228
00:13:29,760 --> 00:13:30,960
pills. 
From that point. 

229
00:13:31,040 --> 00:13:34,480
From about 2021 it started to my
performance started to 

230
00:13:34,480 --> 00:13:40,160
deteriorate. 
And I'm sure we'll get back to 

231
00:13:40,200 --> 00:13:43,280
talking about the important 
things like heart conditions, 

232
00:13:43,760 --> 00:13:51,600
but for now you split your time 
between Chile and Spain. 

233
00:13:52,240 --> 00:13:56,080
What's the sort of cultural 
differences between the two? 

234
00:13:57,280 --> 00:14:02,160
Particularly coming towards 
running, Yeah, I mean, I think 

235
00:14:02,160 --> 00:14:05,640
Spain is just quite an 
established ultra trail and 

236
00:14:05,640 --> 00:14:09,640
running community that I've been
doing it for a long time. 

237
00:14:10,600 --> 00:14:12,080
There's a lot of incredible 
events there. 

238
00:14:12,240 --> 00:14:15,360
Whereas Chile now, it's re 
established. 

239
00:14:15,360 --> 00:14:20,960
The first time I came to Chile 
in 2017, it was still a growing 

240
00:14:20,960 --> 00:14:23,480
sport, but not huge. 
It was still sort of like, I 

241
00:14:24,560 --> 00:14:29,120
don't know, we're still like in 
its early stages in Chile. 

242
00:14:30,200 --> 00:14:36,000
So it was a developing but still
very small community, a little 

243
00:14:36,000 --> 00:14:39,000
bit Wild West in some ways, 
which was quite cool actually. 

244
00:14:40,600 --> 00:14:46,720
But now I'd say Chile has 
certainly done a lot of catching

245
00:14:46,720 --> 00:14:49,800
up with the European type events
in Spain. 

246
00:14:50,680 --> 00:14:54,440
There's a difference in the 
sense that Spanish culture and 

247
00:14:54,440 --> 00:14:59,440
Latino culture, while they're 
very similar, there are some 

248
00:14:59,680 --> 00:15:03,920
quite big differences. 
There's there's a lot more music

249
00:15:04,360 --> 00:15:09,960
at Latin, Latin American events,
a lot more music and dancing at 

250
00:15:09,960 --> 00:15:11,480
the end. 
I don't know how they do it 

251
00:15:11,480 --> 00:15:12,560
actually. 
They just run a race. 

252
00:15:12,760 --> 00:15:18,040
But yeah, it's it's in the 
culture, probably still a lot of

253
00:15:19,160 --> 00:15:25,680
a lot more community within the 
Chilean trail trail running 

254
00:15:25,680 --> 00:15:28,320
space. 
A lot of people know each other 

255
00:15:28,600 --> 00:15:31,920
for a connected, whereas Spain 
is is like that as well. 

256
00:15:31,920 --> 00:15:34,400
But it's just so much bigger 
that you you just don't know 

257
00:15:34,400 --> 00:15:36,560
everybody. 
So it's a huge country, a lot of

258
00:15:36,560 --> 00:15:40,480
people, but both incredible 
trail running cultures and I 

259
00:15:40,480 --> 00:15:43,240
love them. 
How do you? 

260
00:15:44,200 --> 00:15:48,160
Sorry, Mike. 
Why? 

261
00:15:48,240 --> 00:15:50,680
Why are you split between the 
two? 

262
00:15:51,400 --> 00:15:57,080
I was going to ask the same. 
Well, you want the truth, OK. 

263
00:15:58,800 --> 00:16:01,960
We love the summer, me and my 
wife Fran, who's also an 

264
00:16:01,960 --> 00:16:03,720
orchestra runner, We love the 
sun. 

265
00:16:03,720 --> 00:16:07,200
And you know, I, we, I lived in 
the South of New Zealand, which 

266
00:16:07,200 --> 00:16:10,680
is quite cold and wet in the 
winter, gets down to the, you 

267
00:16:10,680 --> 00:16:14,960
know -5 -, 8 frosts, sometimes a
bit of snow. 

268
00:16:15,760 --> 00:16:17,760
And that's fine. 
No problems with that. 

269
00:16:19,240 --> 00:16:21,440
But I've done that for 40 
something odd years. 

270
00:16:21,680 --> 00:16:24,800
And I just thought, you know, if
I get the opportunity to do 

271
00:16:24,800 --> 00:16:26,760
this, I'd love to go from summer
to summer. 

272
00:16:27,080 --> 00:16:28,640
And Fran and I both like the 
heat. 

273
00:16:28,720 --> 00:16:32,360
We both like the sun. 
So we thought, well, you know, 

274
00:16:32,360 --> 00:16:35,480
Fran's a Spanish citizen. 
I've got a residency there. 

275
00:16:37,880 --> 00:16:41,880
I can live in Chile six months 
of the year on my tourist visa 

276
00:16:42,320 --> 00:16:45,000
or three months, and then renew 
it every three months after 

277
00:16:45,000 --> 00:16:47,560
that. 
So it just made sense. 

278
00:16:47,840 --> 00:16:49,400
Friend has a beach house here in
Chile. 

279
00:16:49,760 --> 00:16:53,040
So it's kind of like, why not? 
Why not go from summer to 

280
00:16:53,040 --> 00:16:55,240
summer? 
We tried a few years ago and we 

281
00:16:55,240 --> 00:16:56,600
loved it. 
We just loved it. 

282
00:16:56,600 --> 00:17:00,200
No more winter. 
We can choose winter, I think 

283
00:17:00,640 --> 00:17:02,520
would be the term. 
If we want to go to the 

284
00:17:02,520 --> 00:17:04,119
mountains when it's colder, we 
can do it. 

285
00:17:04,119 --> 00:17:07,480
But we choose to live somewhere 
that's sunny most of the time 

286
00:17:07,480 --> 00:17:10,640
and thought, well, we haven't 
got that many summers left, so 

287
00:17:10,640 --> 00:17:15,000
let's let's double them each 
year and then, you know, we can 

288
00:17:15,000 --> 00:17:19,400
go from there. 
Well, the forecast here just 

289
00:17:19,400 --> 00:17:23,720
north of Aberdeen in Scotland 
tonight is -5 so. 

290
00:17:26,920 --> 00:17:29,240
I can, I can, I can relate to 
that. 

291
00:17:29,240 --> 00:17:30,880
I used to live in those 
temperatures. 

292
00:17:31,080 --> 00:17:33,440
Nothing wrong with it, like I 
said, but if you're a summer 

293
00:17:33,440 --> 00:17:37,360
person and a sun person, it just
makes sense to to be in these 

294
00:17:37,360 --> 00:17:42,160
places. 
Also like who would not want, 

295
00:17:42,200 --> 00:17:45,760
you know, Spain, incredible food
culture. 

296
00:17:46,200 --> 00:17:50,240
We live by the Mediterranean 
when we're there in a town, 

297
00:17:50,240 --> 00:17:53,600
about 30,000 people when we're 
here, we live between the beach 

298
00:17:53,600 --> 00:17:56,800
and in Santiago and the Andes 
mountains, like they're about 

299
00:17:57,280 --> 00:17:59,760
that way about four kilometers 
away. 

300
00:18:00,040 --> 00:18:03,000
And I'm at the foot of the Andes
and a while ago and I can run up

301
00:18:03,000 --> 00:18:06,200
to, you know, 345000 meter 
peaks. 

302
00:18:06,720 --> 00:18:10,720
So yeah, it's, I'm pretty lucky 
actually. 

303
00:18:10,720 --> 00:18:14,720
I must admit, I really do 
appreciate living between two 

304
00:18:14,720 --> 00:18:16,360
countries. 
Or the ability to, yeah. 

305
00:18:18,560 --> 00:18:21,320
If I had. 
The but sorry, I was going to 

306
00:18:21,320 --> 00:18:24,680
say, you say luck, but it's a 
life you've made for yourself 

307
00:18:24,680 --> 00:18:29,360
so. 
Yeah, I I still believe like, 

308
00:18:29,360 --> 00:18:34,800
you know what I mean, part of it
is, but part of it is just being

309
00:18:34,800 --> 00:18:37,440
in the right place at the like 
right time, saying yes to 

310
00:18:37,440 --> 00:18:40,720
opportunity, taking a chance. 
I mean, it's not all been smooth

311
00:18:40,720 --> 00:18:43,440
sailing sailing. 
I haven't just transitioned into

312
00:18:43,440 --> 00:18:49,840
this doing visas, paperwork, tax
issues, all the related things. 

313
00:18:49,960 --> 00:18:53,000
It's, it's a bit of a nightmare 
at times trying to, you know, 

314
00:18:53,000 --> 00:18:56,600
you're not really living 
anywhere but but you're, you're 

315
00:18:56,600 --> 00:19:00,640
always somewhere. 
So it can, it's, it's a bit like

316
00:19:00,640 --> 00:19:04,520
juggling at times. 
However, I love the lifestyle so

317
00:19:04,520 --> 00:19:06,640
much that that that's part of 
the price you pay. 

318
00:19:07,120 --> 00:19:11,520
Yeah. 
So you, you've done a fair 

319
00:19:11,560 --> 00:19:15,880
amount of UT MB series races. 
I don't know if this is going to

320
00:19:15,880 --> 00:19:17,760
be a hard question for you to 
answer. 

321
00:19:17,760 --> 00:19:20,520
Do you have a favorite? 
Wow. 

322
00:19:21,360 --> 00:19:26,560
Yeah, I mean, to be honest, I 
think, and I know it sounds 

323
00:19:26,560 --> 00:19:30,960
cliche, but UTMB Mont Blanc is, 
it's just such a big event. 

324
00:19:32,400 --> 00:19:36,360
Yeah, it's super commercial. 
Yes, all the brands are there, 

325
00:19:36,360 --> 00:19:39,840
but so are so many people from 
around the world that that, you 

326
00:19:39,840 --> 00:19:43,960
know, you might be chatting with
on social media and, and you 

327
00:19:43,960 --> 00:19:45,480
actually get to meet them in 
person. 

328
00:19:46,360 --> 00:19:50,000
You get to experience that 
whole, like, vibe and buzz of 

329
00:19:50,000 --> 00:19:54,360
the community trial community, 
international trial community. 

330
00:19:55,560 --> 00:19:56,840
Yeah. 
There are some aspects of it 

331
00:19:56,840 --> 00:20:00,680
that go away pretty exhausted, 
to be honest, from that week. 

332
00:20:00,680 --> 00:20:03,800
And that's before the race, you 
know, just just turning up. 

333
00:20:04,280 --> 00:20:08,280
But I think that will be my 
favorite UTMB event. 

334
00:20:08,360 --> 00:20:09,520
I mean, there's so many out 
there. 

335
00:20:09,520 --> 00:20:13,880
We'd like to do some in China 
and Asia this year, which we're 

336
00:20:13,880 --> 00:20:18,000
working on at the moment. 
So, yeah, I can't say, you know,

337
00:20:18,080 --> 00:20:20,720
that might change in the future,
but for now, yeah. 

338
00:20:20,800 --> 00:20:24,800
Mount Block. 
And looking at your Instagram, 

339
00:20:25,120 --> 00:20:29,960
you've obviously as as part of 
your transitioning, you've 

340
00:20:30,960 --> 00:20:43,760
gotten a bit jacked. 
How does things like cardio, You

341
00:20:43,760 --> 00:20:48,000
don't want your to ruin your 
gains to doing too much cardio. 

342
00:20:48,000 --> 00:20:53,080
You your your your macros. 
You don't want to be eating too 

343
00:20:53,080 --> 00:20:57,320
much carbs depending on which 
body of thought you go down. 

344
00:20:58,720 --> 00:21:02,960
How does running fuel and 
running itself interfere with 

345
00:21:03,720 --> 00:21:09,640
physique? 
Once again, I don't really care 

346
00:21:09,640 --> 00:21:11,720
that much about tracking 
anything. 

347
00:21:12,480 --> 00:21:14,280
I think I'm genetically very 
lucky. 

348
00:21:14,280 --> 00:21:20,680
For some reason, I just, yeah, 
when it comes to race season, 

349
00:21:20,720 --> 00:21:23,360
I'm just running so much that I 
just cut back. 

350
00:21:24,720 --> 00:21:27,960
Obviously I lose weight just 
because I'm just training so 

351
00:21:27,960 --> 00:21:29,960
much. 
I just can't eat enough to to 

352
00:21:29,960 --> 00:21:35,080
maintain, I don't know, a larger
body weight in the offseason, 

353
00:21:35,080 --> 00:21:37,880
I'll gain 3 or 4 kilos. 
That's cool. 

354
00:21:38,040 --> 00:21:43,520
I don't really focus so much on 
like macros or, you know, 

355
00:21:43,960 --> 00:21:45,760
whether I'm losing or gaining 
muscle. 

356
00:21:46,000 --> 00:21:49,960
If I want to gain muscle, I do 
like six weeks of like more 

357
00:21:49,960 --> 00:21:52,400
intense gym and strength type 
workouts. 

358
00:21:52,840 --> 00:21:58,320
And I seem to be able to like 
within six weeks it it's there 

359
00:21:59,280 --> 00:22:02,720
and yeah, maybe run a bit less. 
And then when I'm training for a

360
00:22:02,720 --> 00:22:05,760
mountain event, I'll lose a bit 
of the muscle and, and a bit of 

361
00:22:05,760 --> 00:22:08,560
body weight just because of the 
sheer volume of what I do. 

362
00:22:09,080 --> 00:22:11,840
And yeah, then I'm roundabout 
race weight. 

363
00:22:11,840 --> 00:22:16,120
So I, I wish I could say it was 
cleverly planned and carefully 

364
00:22:16,120 --> 00:22:19,600
measured. 
And, and my, my wife says I hate

365
00:22:19,600 --> 00:22:21,320
you. 
She said it's, it's, that's not 

366
00:22:21,320 --> 00:22:24,640
fair. 
She said a friend is like, she's

367
00:22:24,640 --> 00:22:27,280
measuring everything. 
And she said, how do you do it? 

368
00:22:27,280 --> 00:22:29,600
It's not fair. 
She says you're eating like 

369
00:22:29,800 --> 00:22:34,040
chocolate and you know, the 
whatever croissants. 

370
00:22:34,040 --> 00:22:36,640
And then all of a sudden, six 
weeks later, you're like, your 

371
00:22:36,640 --> 00:22:42,800
abs are there and away you go. 
I think, yeah, there's a certain

372
00:22:42,800 --> 00:22:45,320
element of, once again, I'd say 
luck in it. 

373
00:22:45,680 --> 00:22:51,240
And also, I think once you know 
your body, you realize that, OK,

374
00:22:51,680 --> 00:22:54,280
this is going to take about 8 
weeks to do and I need to cut 

375
00:22:54,280 --> 00:22:55,760
back on this and I need to do 
that. 

376
00:22:55,760 --> 00:22:58,040
So you kind of get it used to 
the routines. 

377
00:22:58,280 --> 00:23:02,720
But outside of the season, when 
I'm not really, like, racing, 

378
00:23:03,280 --> 00:23:06,960
I'm quite happy, you know, the 
ABS will go and, you know, get a

379
00:23:06,960 --> 00:23:09,720
little bit tighter around the 
waist. 

380
00:23:09,720 --> 00:23:12,320
And I just accept that, you 
know, that's cool because I know

381
00:23:12,520 --> 00:23:13,920
I don't have to be disciplined 
all year. 

382
00:23:13,920 --> 00:23:16,400
I'm human. 
And. 

383
00:23:16,520 --> 00:23:18,000
And what difference does it 
make? 

384
00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:20,480
Like, who really cares? 
Like, yeah, for social media. 

385
00:23:20,480 --> 00:23:25,120
OK, do the posts and. 
And it's like, you know, I did 

386
00:23:25,120 --> 00:23:28,960
them as a kind of a joke at 
first because someone dared me 

387
00:23:28,960 --> 00:23:33,440
to do it, and then it took off. 
Social media is kind of a funny 

388
00:23:33,600 --> 00:23:36,400
game. 
But yeah, so I've kept doing it.

389
00:23:36,400 --> 00:23:38,560
And they, you know, let's be 
honest. 

390
00:23:38,560 --> 00:23:40,200
Like, I laugh at myself a bit 
about it. 

391
00:23:40,200 --> 00:23:42,440
I don't stand on top of 
mountains without a shirt 

392
00:23:42,560 --> 00:23:44,520
standing like this. 
No one does. 

393
00:23:44,520 --> 00:23:47,000
I just go on a run. 
But, you know, it creates 

394
00:23:47,000 --> 00:23:51,400
traction, which creates 
followers and attention, which 

395
00:23:51,400 --> 00:23:54,360
then allows me to do what I 
really want to do in this this 

396
00:23:54,360 --> 00:23:56,840
life. 
So it's kind of like a job that 

397
00:23:56,840 --> 00:23:59,160
I do. 
But yeah, most of the time I 

398
00:23:59,160 --> 00:24:01,920
walk around with a shirt on and 
just a normal guy. 

399
00:24:02,280 --> 00:24:04,760
So can I? 
Just see and see. 

400
00:24:04,760 --> 00:24:07,560
If I had ABS like yours I would 
walk around showing them all. 

401
00:24:10,760 --> 00:24:16,000
So during race season, during 
hard training efforts, whatever,

402
00:24:16,200 --> 00:24:19,520
how do you feel? 
How do I feel? 

403
00:24:20,240 --> 00:24:22,200
Yeah, I do watch things more 
carefully. 

404
00:24:23,160 --> 00:24:29,200
Probably switch to higher 
carbohydrate during training. 

405
00:24:30,080 --> 00:24:36,120
I tend to take on, yeah, a fair 
bit of fuel and racing even more

406
00:24:36,760 --> 00:24:38,720
so. 
It's kind of cyclical. 

407
00:24:39,160 --> 00:24:42,800
It's like when I mentioned it, 
the last question, you know, 

408
00:24:43,120 --> 00:24:45,520
I'll cut back on certain things 
and increase other things. 

409
00:24:45,680 --> 00:24:47,400
So I do actually look at that 
side of it. 

410
00:24:47,400 --> 00:24:50,120
I don't just wing it anymore 
because, you know, as we get 

411
00:24:50,120 --> 00:24:54,960
older, we do need every 
advantage we can to help us in 

412
00:24:54,960 --> 00:25:00,680
our performance. 
So yeah, in that in that sense, 

413
00:25:00,680 --> 00:25:05,080
I would increase carbohydrate 
intake, especially during and 

414
00:25:05,080 --> 00:25:08,680
just after training or probably 
pre, during and post training. 

415
00:25:08,840 --> 00:25:10,800
Not so much the rest of the 
time. 

416
00:25:11,200 --> 00:25:15,520
But I do tend to have more in 
race season just for the mere 

417
00:25:15,520 --> 00:25:17,920
fact. 
If I didn't, I would probably 

418
00:25:18,160 --> 00:25:21,600
get quite sick. 
My bloods would show that, you 

419
00:25:21,600 --> 00:25:24,080
know, I'm. 
I'm not fueling and eating 

420
00:25:24,080 --> 00:25:25,240
enough. 
And, you know, I don't want to 

421
00:25:25,240 --> 00:25:28,760
get into a situation where, you 
know, it's another stress on the

422
00:25:28,760 --> 00:25:29,320
body. 
You. 

423
00:25:30,040 --> 00:25:33,120
Something I can't reiterate 
enough in the sport is I don't 

424
00:25:33,120 --> 00:25:34,480
think a lot of people eat 
enough. 

425
00:25:35,080 --> 00:25:37,200
And I think it's really 
important that you do. 

426
00:25:38,200 --> 00:25:39,080
Yeah. 
OK. 

427
00:25:39,080 --> 00:25:41,600
It's easy to say. 
People say you're a skinny guy. 

428
00:25:41,600 --> 00:25:43,560
It's easy for you. 
Yeah. 

429
00:25:43,560 --> 00:25:45,160
OK. 
Genetically, there might be 

430
00:25:45,160 --> 00:25:47,720
something there that that does 
make it easier. 

431
00:25:47,720 --> 00:25:51,960
However, I'd rather be a bit 
bigger and well fueled then, you

432
00:25:51,960 --> 00:25:55,680
know, skinny race weight and 
like just a mess inside 

433
00:25:55,680 --> 00:25:57,920
metabolically. 
So I think that's really 

434
00:25:57,920 --> 00:25:59,640
important. 
Just eat enough and drink enough

435
00:25:59,640 --> 00:26:03,400
people. 
As Mike was saying as well, 

436
00:26:03,560 --> 00:26:08,680
you've went from your previous 
lifestyle to jacked out with 

437
00:26:08,720 --> 00:26:12,760
this season and like you know 
where you're at now because we 

438
00:26:12,760 --> 00:26:15,280
know that you are a runner now 
at the very, very start of 

439
00:26:15,280 --> 00:26:18,240
you're done there from that 
amazing picture that's on the 

440
00:26:18,240 --> 00:26:23,520
social media, how did you get 
from the very beginning to where

441
00:26:23,520 --> 00:26:27,440
you are now? 
Did you just cut things were bad

442
00:26:27,440 --> 00:26:32,440
for you back initially? 
Good question, Nikki. 

443
00:26:34,080 --> 00:26:41,000
Yeah, I mean, I did initially. 
I knew myself well enough to 

444
00:26:41,000 --> 00:26:44,200
know that if I had things in the
house that I like to snack on, I

445
00:26:44,200 --> 00:26:47,800
was going to eat them even no 
matter how much Willpower or 

446
00:26:48,440 --> 00:26:51,920
David Goggins videos or whatever
you want, you know, I can't 

447
00:26:51,920 --> 00:26:54,960
remember who it was at the time,
but you know, no matter how much

448
00:26:54,960 --> 00:26:57,240
motivation you have, you're just
going to do it. 

449
00:26:57,280 --> 00:27:00,320
Like that's that's me. 
I'm speaking from personal 

450
00:27:00,320 --> 00:27:02,920
experience. 
So I just removed those from my 

451
00:27:02,920 --> 00:27:06,400
diet for six months and I said, 
if I can remove it for six 

452
00:27:06,400 --> 00:27:10,120
months and then I will 
reintroduce certain things and 

453
00:27:10,120 --> 00:27:13,120
if it's still a problem, then I 
won't have it anymore. 

454
00:27:13,120 --> 00:27:16,520
If it's not, then, you know, and
what I learned is it wasn't so 

455
00:27:16,520 --> 00:27:21,760
much the foods or alcohol or 
whatever that was the issue. 

456
00:27:21,760 --> 00:27:26,240
It was actually, you know, me 
and how I, my relationship with 

457
00:27:26,240 --> 00:27:29,120
those things. 
So I think that changed removing

458
00:27:29,120 --> 00:27:30,720
them initially and then bringing
them back in. 

459
00:27:30,720 --> 00:27:34,600
I realized, you know, a lot of 
things about myself, what I 

460
00:27:34,600 --> 00:27:39,200
could manage, what I could. 
I don't like to use the word 

461
00:27:39,200 --> 00:27:41,400
control because then you've got 
an issue if you have to control 

462
00:27:41,400 --> 00:27:43,160
it. 
But what I could have in my life

463
00:27:43,160 --> 00:27:45,120
and it was OK and then what I 
couldn't. 

464
00:27:45,640 --> 00:27:51,880
And yeah, so I think now I can 
eat, you know, most things that 

465
00:27:51,880 --> 00:27:54,440
I used to have around because I 
just don't really feel like 

466
00:27:54,440 --> 00:27:55,640
eating them all the time 
anymore. 

467
00:27:56,040 --> 00:27:59,840
But there's still, there was a 
period of a say six months where

468
00:27:59,840 --> 00:28:03,280
I said, cut everything, eat 
really healthy, really lean, 

469
00:28:03,280 --> 00:28:07,080
plan and measure everything and 
then get to know yourself and 

470
00:28:07,080 --> 00:28:10,040
what you could at what you need 
to work on and, and go from 

471
00:28:10,040 --> 00:28:12,880
there. 
And, and to be, to be fair, I 

472
00:28:12,880 --> 00:28:15,560
did that for six months, then 
then reintroduced some things 

473
00:28:15,560 --> 00:28:18,240
and then spent another six 
months to a year working on 

474
00:28:18,240 --> 00:28:22,280
things like strength training 
and, and like building a more 

475
00:28:22,600 --> 00:28:25,560
resilient body. 
I think would be not, not to 

476
00:28:25,560 --> 00:28:28,520
look a certain way on Instagram,
but the one that could put a 

477
00:28:28,520 --> 00:28:31,480
pack on and hike up a mountain 
and do all these kinds of 

478
00:28:31,480 --> 00:28:34,880
things. 
Very practical in the sense that

479
00:28:35,800 --> 00:28:38,240
I want to be able to do the 
sport for as long as I can. 

480
00:28:38,320 --> 00:28:44,280
And I realized for me that 
because I'm 6 foot 1 or 187 ish 

481
00:28:44,280 --> 00:28:48,840
centimeters, that if I'm 
carrying too much weight that, 

482
00:28:49,080 --> 00:28:50,680
you know, I just don't feel 
good. 

483
00:28:50,680 --> 00:28:52,000
I don't have the energy to do 
it. 

484
00:28:52,120 --> 00:28:56,200
So I stay in sort of this white 
range to be able to do that. 

485
00:28:56,960 --> 00:29:01,040
But yeah, back to your question,
yeah, initial restriction and 

486
00:29:01,040 --> 00:29:04,040
then reintroducing things that 
that is what worked for me. 

487
00:29:05,080 --> 00:29:08,880
No, everything in moderation. 
Yeah, yeah, in moderation. 

488
00:29:08,960 --> 00:29:10,720
I I've got chocolate in the 
other room. 

489
00:29:10,720 --> 00:29:14,320
I had some just before. 
Don't tell anyone but but, but 

490
00:29:14,520 --> 00:29:17,960
you know, and that's fine 
because I don't have to eat the 

491
00:29:17,960 --> 00:29:20,360
whole block at once. 
You know it. 

492
00:29:20,800 --> 00:29:27,160
Your life changes in that sense 
that, that you, you just change 

493
00:29:27,160 --> 00:29:29,560
when you change the habit. 
Restrict, maybe restrict 

494
00:29:29,560 --> 00:29:31,760
something in my case, and you 
don't have to restrict things. 

495
00:29:31,760 --> 00:29:35,560
Some people can do it and, and 
just minimize things and that's 

496
00:29:35,560 --> 00:29:37,480
fine. 
If if you know yourself and know

497
00:29:37,480 --> 00:29:41,840
that you're good at that, do it.
There's no right or wrong way. 

498
00:29:42,160 --> 00:29:46,200
It's what works best for you and
and what you want to achieve. 

499
00:29:46,520 --> 00:29:52,280
I really, you know, think that 
everyone has got to find their 

500
00:29:52,280 --> 00:29:55,240
way of doing it. 
It's a bit like training. 

501
00:29:55,560 --> 00:29:57,680
There's a lot of different ways 
to get to the same point. 

502
00:29:57,680 --> 00:30:02,120
Yeah, there's some obviously 
standard paths we can use and 

503
00:30:02,160 --> 00:30:04,760
that are proven. 
But I think everyone has to do 

504
00:30:04,760 --> 00:30:07,000
it their own way to get to that 
point. 

505
00:30:07,000 --> 00:30:10,200
And and the way that works best 
for you is is the one that's 

506
00:30:10,200 --> 00:30:18,480
going to be the most successful.
So thank you for that. 

507
00:30:18,480 --> 00:30:22,280
That was a great breakdown on 
the Dire and how you've got to 

508
00:30:22,280 --> 00:30:26,120
where you are. 
You've had a lot of races out 

509
00:30:26,120 --> 00:30:29,240
with even UT MB. 
What is the hardest moment that 

510
00:30:29,240 --> 00:30:31,840
you've ever had in a race and 
what got you through it? 

511
00:30:35,360 --> 00:30:41,360
Yeah, that's a good one. 
You know, I think the most of 

512
00:30:41,360 --> 00:30:50,680
them have been probably, this is
a good question because there's 

513
00:30:50,680 --> 00:30:55,000
two, but I'll say one, probably 
one of the hardest moments was a

514
00:30:55,000 --> 00:31:00,160
DNF when I ran into a tree in 
the middle of the night. 

515
00:31:00,160 --> 00:31:03,760
Now, random thing, I've just 
been sent some new headlights. 

516
00:31:03,760 --> 00:31:08,000
I won't name the, the brand, 
some new model headlights from 

517
00:31:08,520 --> 00:31:11,200
a, from a potential sponsor to 
use. 

518
00:31:11,200 --> 00:31:14,280
And I, I, you know, nothing new 
on race day except the new 

519
00:31:14,280 --> 00:31:18,960
headlights. 
So I had two new headlights, put

520
00:31:18,960 --> 00:31:20,480
one on. 
I was running through the night,

521
00:31:20,480 --> 00:31:25,040
was raining, got up to the top 
of the the biggest climb and was

522
00:31:25,040 --> 00:31:29,360
running down through a forest, 
still raining and just in one 

523
00:31:29,400 --> 00:31:31,960
instant headlight was bright, 
just turned off. 

524
00:31:32,760 --> 00:31:36,200
So shut off and I ran. 
There was a branch like with 

525
00:31:36,200 --> 00:31:38,040
about head height across the 
path. 

526
00:31:38,680 --> 00:31:42,960
And the moment the lights shut 
off, I ran into the branch and I

527
00:31:44,040 --> 00:31:47,280
smacked my head like, like you 
imagine running down a hill into

528
00:31:47,280 --> 00:31:49,200
a branch that you didn't realize
was there. 

529
00:31:49,560 --> 00:31:53,560
Knocked myself out, woke up, I 
think about four minutes, 5 

530
00:31:53,560 --> 00:31:54,400
minutes. 
I don't know. 

531
00:31:55,000 --> 00:31:59,040
So I remember someone like 
shaking me and I sort of came to

532
00:32:00,280 --> 00:32:02,640
and then, yeah, I said, no, I'm 
OK, I'm OK. 

533
00:32:02,640 --> 00:32:06,360
The guy person I can't remember 
is a guy or a girl actually said

534
00:32:06,360 --> 00:32:08,240
to you, OK. 
I said, yeah, I think I just ran

535
00:32:08,240 --> 00:32:10,800
into that tree. 
Must have thought I was loopy 

536
00:32:10,840 --> 00:32:16,080
you know And so yeah, I got up 
ran down the rest of the 

537
00:32:16,080 --> 00:32:18,560
mountain and then realized I had
no balance. 

538
00:32:18,560 --> 00:32:20,760
I I couldn't put 1 foot in front
of the other. 

539
00:32:21,200 --> 00:32:25,120
I was stumbling got into the 
next aid station where actually 

540
00:32:25,120 --> 00:32:28,720
Fran had come in the car to meet
me to crew me and she said you 

541
00:32:28,720 --> 00:32:30,960
look terrible. 
It was like white. 

542
00:32:30,960 --> 00:32:32,920
I think I've still got a picture
somewhere of it. 

543
00:32:33,360 --> 00:32:36,880
I was like white as a sheep. 
I couldn't like really even 

544
00:32:36,880 --> 00:32:40,600
speak properly. 
So they, the the doctor, I got 

545
00:32:40,600 --> 00:32:42,800
into the age station, Fran said 
you're not finishing, you're not

546
00:32:42,800 --> 00:32:46,640
continuing. 
Saw the doctor and he did the 

547
00:32:46,640 --> 00:32:49,440
test with the the light in the 
eyes and he said hospital 

548
00:32:49,440 --> 00:32:52,840
please. 
And yeah, they found I had 

549
00:32:53,400 --> 00:32:56,400
pretty nasty concussion. 
Pulled all the muscles in the 

550
00:32:56,400 --> 00:32:59,120
neck as well from the snap back 
on the neck actually. 

551
00:33:00,560 --> 00:33:04,280
So yeah, that, that was probably
hardest physical moment. 

552
00:33:04,280 --> 00:33:06,000
I did break my shoulder in a 
race too. 

553
00:33:06,000 --> 00:33:08,440
Oh, and I had the heart attack. 
Yeah, there's actually quite a 

554
00:33:08,440 --> 00:33:10,080
few. 
Let's just stick with the first 

555
00:33:10,080 --> 00:33:12,200
one. 
But that was that was a DNF that

556
00:33:12,200 --> 00:33:15,560
was hard because it was like, 
it's just such a random thing to

557
00:33:15,560 --> 00:33:17,720
happen. 
And as a footnote to that story,

558
00:33:17,720 --> 00:33:23,800
I sent the the that exact light 
back to the manufacturer because

559
00:33:23,800 --> 00:33:26,600
actually my head, it was sort of
like just above the light, like 

560
00:33:26,600 --> 00:33:29,560
on this top bit of the head, my 
head took the brunt of the the, 

561
00:33:29,640 --> 00:33:32,120
the branch. 
I sent the headlight back and 

562
00:33:32,120 --> 00:33:34,560
they actually found a fault with
it or a wire had broken 

563
00:33:34,560 --> 00:33:37,120
internally. 
And they did apologize 

564
00:33:37,440 --> 00:33:39,600
profusely. 
So you know what happens. 

565
00:33:41,480 --> 00:33:44,640
But yeah, that that was probably
one of the most challenging 

566
00:33:44,640 --> 00:33:49,840
moments in a race. 
And obviously that's outside 

567
00:33:49,840 --> 00:33:54,520
interference, but do you have a 
a point where you've actually 

568
00:33:54,520 --> 00:33:56,520
felt that you've been pushed to 
your limits? 

569
00:34:01,520 --> 00:34:10,440
Running in running in the 
deserts in where was it in in 

570
00:34:10,440 --> 00:34:17,120
the Sahara in Tunisia, they that
there was meant to be an aid 

571
00:34:17,120 --> 00:34:19,560
station at a certain point in 
the middle of the Sahara desert,

572
00:34:20,040 --> 00:34:23,320
middle of the day running. 
So you're carrying a certain 

573
00:34:23,320 --> 00:34:25,920
amount of water, but you know 
where the next aid station is? 

574
00:34:25,920 --> 00:34:30,639
Well, that aid station was just 
a meant to be a truck with like 

575
00:34:30,639 --> 00:34:35,920
a small tent, sort of, you know,
portable marquee kind of thing 

576
00:34:35,960 --> 00:34:37,880
over it. 
Well, that truck had broken down

577
00:34:38,480 --> 00:34:41,520
and hadn't got there. 
So they sent a truck, another 

578
00:34:41,520 --> 00:34:44,880
truck to pick up the water and 
the tent to take to this place. 

579
00:34:44,880 --> 00:34:48,960
And that truck broke down. 
So I got to the aid station just

580
00:34:48,960 --> 00:34:50,840
out of water and there's no 
truck. 

581
00:34:51,480 --> 00:34:57,040
And I look at the GPX and I 
said, hey, I'm on the right 

582
00:34:57,040 --> 00:34:58,800
course. 
I've changed the course. 

583
00:34:58,800 --> 00:35:01,800
There's nothing here. 
And another guy came through and

584
00:35:01,800 --> 00:35:04,280
he said, yeah, where is it? 
So just carried on. 

585
00:35:04,280 --> 00:35:09,080
And that extra, I think 15 
kilometers, you know, 10 

586
00:35:09,240 --> 00:35:12,280
kilometers plus another 15. 
So 25 kilometers in the middle 

587
00:35:12,280 --> 00:35:15,000
of the day in the Sahara Desert 
without water just about killed 

588
00:35:15,000 --> 00:35:16,720
me. 
Like, I got to the next aid 

589
00:35:16,720 --> 00:35:19,400
station. 
I, I hopped in one of the cruise

590
00:35:19,400 --> 00:35:22,080
Land Cruisers and turned, they 
turned on the air con and I just

591
00:35:22,080 --> 00:35:24,400
sat there for 10 minutes 
drinking water. 

592
00:35:24,400 --> 00:35:31,200
And yeah, that was, I didn't 
realize then until that point 

593
00:35:31,200 --> 00:35:36,400
how much a lack of, you know, 
severe, more severe hydration 

594
00:35:36,400 --> 00:35:40,040
can affect you. 
And that was pretty dangerous. 

595
00:35:40,040 --> 00:35:43,320
I actually started to pee blood,
which is, you know, obviously 

596
00:35:43,520 --> 00:35:49,040
can be a sign of kidney damage 
and issues more due to lack of 

597
00:35:49,040 --> 00:35:51,400
hydration than anything. 
So yeah, that that was a pretty 

598
00:35:51,400 --> 00:35:53,680
challenging moment. 
But I, I didn't ever think of 

599
00:35:53,680 --> 00:35:55,680
giving up. 
I just thought of just keep 

600
00:35:55,680 --> 00:36:00,200
pushing through to the finish, 
which I did and. 

601
00:36:00,240 --> 00:36:04,080
Have you ever thought of doing 
the the races that I do now? 

602
00:36:04,400 --> 00:36:08,280
Backyard Altos, do you? 
Even know what they are yes yes,

603
00:36:08,560 --> 00:36:11,200
they're entering I actually 
trained a few clients in the US 

604
00:36:11,200 --> 00:36:14,480
that that do those I think 
they're incredible yeah. 

605
00:36:14,520 --> 00:36:19,240
I think that the mental aspect 
of it is something that that I'm

606
00:36:19,240 --> 00:36:22,960
definitely going to have a crack
at because I just, you know, I 

607
00:36:22,960 --> 00:36:27,440
can only imagine, like in your 
experience, what it's like to to

608
00:36:27,440 --> 00:36:29,240
just, you know, there's 
obviously the physical 

609
00:36:29,240 --> 00:36:32,120
exhaustion and the lack of 
sleep, but mentally, where does 

610
00:36:32,120 --> 00:36:36,440
that take you? 
And what happens at those points

611
00:36:36,440 --> 00:36:39,040
where you know, what is your 
limit? 

612
00:36:39,320 --> 00:36:41,760
Can you keep going is what stops
you? 

613
00:36:41,760 --> 00:36:43,160
Is it the physical? 
Was it the mental? 

614
00:36:43,160 --> 00:36:45,600
Is it a combination? 
Fascinates me. 

615
00:36:46,120 --> 00:36:49,080
Yeah, the same with me. 
I don't think that I've reached 

616
00:36:49,080 --> 00:36:52,520
my limit yet and I I crave to 
find it so. 

617
00:36:52,880 --> 00:36:56,520
Yeah, you know, I think that's a
common theme among all amongst 

618
00:36:57,040 --> 00:37:00,400
almost all runners. 
I spent mostly ultra runners. 

619
00:37:00,840 --> 00:37:02,320
Would you agree with that, 
Nikki? 

620
00:37:02,320 --> 00:37:06,360
Do you find that you want to 
you, you almost want to break 

621
00:37:06,360 --> 00:37:11,640
yourself to see, OK, you know, 
is there a point? 

622
00:37:11,640 --> 00:37:15,200
Is there a point where I just 
can't go on or or can I just 

623
00:37:15,200 --> 00:37:18,840
keep going until literally 
something stops me? 

624
00:37:18,880 --> 00:37:23,160
Like, you know, whether that's 
physical or, or, you know, I 

625
00:37:23,160 --> 00:37:26,600
literally can't crawl anymore. 
I think it's a fascinating 

626
00:37:27,200 --> 00:37:28,560
thing. 
I think we're all a little bit 

627
00:37:28,720 --> 00:37:32,320
broken inside somewhere. 
Maybe children and This is why 

628
00:37:32,320 --> 00:37:33,920
we're like this. 
I really don't know. 

629
00:37:34,520 --> 00:37:38,080
I definitely think the mental 
gets to you before the physical 

630
00:37:38,120 --> 00:37:41,680
100% if you've pushed yourself 
in any event. 

631
00:37:41,680 --> 00:37:46,680
And this is for anyone even from
like you know smaller distances 

632
00:37:47,280 --> 00:37:50,240
to the bigger ones. 
Whatever is your challenge, it's

633
00:37:50,480 --> 00:37:54,000
your mind will push you as far 
as it will take you. 

634
00:37:55,720 --> 00:37:59,400
For sure, for sure. 
And I think that's that's the 

635
00:37:59,400 --> 00:38:02,160
fascinating thing. 
I think that's that's such a 

636
00:38:02,160 --> 00:38:03,720
common thing. 
We're all searching for that 

637
00:38:03,720 --> 00:38:08,680
point of where do I give up? 
You know, where, where is where 

638
00:38:08,680 --> 00:38:13,760
is where is it too much? 
Where do I say no because I 

639
00:38:13,800 --> 00:38:15,920
don't know. 
I think we've probably all been 

640
00:38:16,000 --> 00:38:19,080
and, and this is all relative to
your experience, to your, 

641
00:38:20,040 --> 00:38:23,560
everyone's different. 
They don't try to say just 

642
00:38:23,560 --> 00:38:27,000
because someone's done this, 
that, that I'm a lesser or more 

643
00:38:27,400 --> 00:38:30,000
person because of it, because 
everyone's experience is 

644
00:38:30,000 --> 00:38:31,680
different, what someone's limit 
is. 

645
00:38:31,680 --> 00:38:35,160
So I, I think that's really 
interesting, but I think the 

646
00:38:35,160 --> 00:38:39,040
thing what I've seen is people 
that are hell of a lot stronger 

647
00:38:39,480 --> 00:38:41,520
than they believe they are. 
Definitely. 

648
00:38:42,280 --> 00:38:45,560
I think I've seen some 
incredible things where I 

649
00:38:45,560 --> 00:38:48,560
thought, man, why doesn't that 
person just give up? 

650
00:38:48,680 --> 00:38:51,040
And, and it's things like I'm 
not talking about the guys that 

651
00:38:51,040 --> 00:38:53,760
run a marathon in two hours or 
come first in an ultra. 

652
00:38:53,760 --> 00:38:57,680
I'm talking about the guy that 
comes in last at something like 

653
00:38:57,680 --> 00:39:02,200
UTMB that's that's leaning over 
like this and everything looks 

654
00:39:02,200 --> 00:39:08,840
broken and two knees bloodied. 
Or the mother that runs into the

655
00:39:08,840 --> 00:39:11,520
finish line and three of the 
kids greet her, knowing that 

656
00:39:11,520 --> 00:39:15,840
she's raising a family and doing
this incredible thing. 

657
00:39:16,160 --> 00:39:19,120
You know, those are the people 
that inspire me. 

658
00:39:19,920 --> 00:39:22,160
And I just think, you know, 
they're trying to do the same 

659
00:39:22,160 --> 00:39:23,080
thing. 
They're trying to find their 

660
00:39:23,080 --> 00:39:24,880
limits. 
What are they capable of? 

661
00:39:25,240 --> 00:39:27,920
And, and it gives me a lot of 
hope for, for humans actually, 

662
00:39:27,920 --> 00:39:30,200
when I see that, because I 
think, man, we can do some 

663
00:39:30,200 --> 00:39:32,520
incredible things if we put our 
minds and bodies to it. 

664
00:39:32,960 --> 00:39:35,680
Yeah, and relate to what you've 
just said. 

665
00:39:35,720 --> 00:39:39,800
I I've said to people in the 
past, you, you are better than 

666
00:39:39,800 --> 00:39:43,160
you think you are. 
Yeah, you are more capable of 

667
00:39:43,160 --> 00:39:44,840
doing it. 
You just need to convince 

668
00:39:44,840 --> 00:39:49,200
yourself that you can do it. 
100% I mean, how many times do 

669
00:39:49,200 --> 00:39:51,920
we say that to other people? 
Yeah, you're going to smash it. 

670
00:39:51,920 --> 00:39:54,360
You are so capable. 
But then we go to ourselves and 

671
00:39:54,360 --> 00:39:57,000
we go, you're so stupid. 
Why did you do that? 

672
00:39:57,200 --> 00:40:00,200
Why that? 
You know, man, stop putting 

673
00:40:00,200 --> 00:40:01,600
yourself down. 
Start. 

674
00:40:01,760 --> 00:40:05,760
I know it's not, you know, in 
our culture to lift ourselves up

675
00:40:05,960 --> 00:40:08,560
publicly. 
But we've got to pat ourselves 

676
00:40:08,560 --> 00:40:12,080
on the back internally. 
It's such a big, big thing 

677
00:40:12,080 --> 00:40:15,040
because would you speak to your 
kids or your partner that way or

678
00:40:15,040 --> 00:40:17,360
would you the way you speak to 
yourself? 

679
00:40:17,520 --> 00:40:20,040
And I think it's really 
important change that narrative.

680
00:40:20,240 --> 00:40:23,520
Start saying, yeah, man, I'm 
going to absolutely nail this. 

681
00:40:23,520 --> 00:40:25,160
I'm going to push as hard as I 
can. 

682
00:40:25,160 --> 00:40:28,080
I'm going to do it. 
I always visualize myself 

683
00:40:28,080 --> 00:40:31,640
crossing the finish line. 
And it doesn't matter if I get 

684
00:40:31,640 --> 00:40:36,520
there or not. 
The point is I'm, that's, that's

685
00:40:36,520 --> 00:40:39,160
the goal. 
And you know, it's going to take

686
00:40:39,160 --> 00:40:41,560
quite a lot to stop me getting 
there. 

687
00:40:41,560 --> 00:40:45,880
I think of the DNS I've had, 
they've all been, yeah, of all 

688
00:40:45,880 --> 00:40:50,280
the DNA, all the DNS I've had 
about 3-3 or four now have all 

689
00:40:50,280 --> 00:40:55,160
been medically advised or 
medically I've been removed from

690
00:40:55,160 --> 00:40:57,480
the race. 
I've never had one where I've 

691
00:40:57,480 --> 00:40:59,000
actually just stopped because I 
didn't want to. 

692
00:41:00,560 --> 00:41:04,800
So I've had relatively good 
reasons. 

693
00:41:04,800 --> 00:41:07,760
Well, they're not reasons I I 
just got pulled from the race. 

694
00:41:10,000 --> 00:41:16,120
And something that they've just 
thought of might be medically 

695
00:41:16,120 --> 00:41:20,040
told to stop the race, but 
hallucinations? 

696
00:41:20,040 --> 00:41:22,160
Have you had any and what were 
they? 

697
00:41:23,640 --> 00:41:25,160
Were. 
They caused by walking in a 

698
00:41:25,160 --> 00:41:29,720
tree. 
Yeah, actually, yeah, that that 

699
00:41:29,720 --> 00:41:31,720
one. 
No hallucinations there, but the

700
00:41:32,360 --> 00:41:36,120
the ones were run through the 
night or some of the multi stage

701
00:41:36,120 --> 00:41:39,720
races where you've had like 100 
kilometer stage and and you're 

702
00:41:39,720 --> 00:41:42,200
already tired from a couple of 
stages before that. 

703
00:41:43,360 --> 00:41:47,600
Yeah, hallucinations, yeah, all 
the time, pretty much enjoy them

704
00:41:47,600 --> 00:41:49,800
now. 
First time was was a bit unsure,

705
00:41:49,800 --> 00:41:51,800
but now it's it's part of the 
course. 

706
00:41:52,040 --> 00:41:55,800
You realize it's coming. 
You start to see people tree as 

707
00:41:55,800 --> 00:41:59,840
a person and animals and things 
moving, and they're fascinating 

708
00:41:59,840 --> 00:42:01,560
because it's so real when you 
see it. 

709
00:42:02,720 --> 00:42:05,680
And then you realize the logical
part of your brain says, you 

710
00:42:05,680 --> 00:42:08,920
know it's not real, but it's 
still there, and that's what you

711
00:42:08,920 --> 00:42:10,600
see. 
Any highlights? 

712
00:42:15,280 --> 00:42:19,640
There's people dancing, talking,
people talking to me and at me, 

713
00:42:19,640 --> 00:42:21,400
starting to have a conversation 
with them. 

714
00:42:22,400 --> 00:42:29,200
You know, I can't think of men, 
animals, like just different 

715
00:42:29,200 --> 00:42:32,520
types of animals, dogs, cats, 
rabbits, those kinds of things. 

716
00:42:32,520 --> 00:42:36,200
But yeah, nothing. 
One that I wish was a 

717
00:42:36,200 --> 00:42:38,960
hallucination, but it wasn't, 
was I was running in Mexico and 

718
00:42:38,960 --> 00:42:43,560
the Copper Canyons and some drug
cartel guys from the wasn't 

719
00:42:43,560 --> 00:42:45,560
there in the area. 
Sinaloa Cartel were there. 

720
00:42:46,040 --> 00:42:48,320
I came around the corner on 
motorbikes with machine guns and

721
00:42:48,320 --> 00:42:50,800
things and they said you're not 
coming this way. 

722
00:42:50,800 --> 00:42:55,080
I was, you know, running gear, 
running in this race, and they 

723
00:42:55,080 --> 00:42:56,560
said, you're not coming this 
way, Gringo. 

724
00:42:57,680 --> 00:43:00,480
They said, this is like, this is
our area, you got to go back 

725
00:43:00,480 --> 00:43:02,040
that way. 
And I thought, oh, OK. 

726
00:43:02,040 --> 00:43:05,560
So I had to take a shortcut to 
to I wish that was a 

727
00:43:05,560 --> 00:43:07,360
hallucination. 
That was a little bit scary. 

728
00:43:07,920 --> 00:43:10,320
I was going to ask, was that a 
hallucination or did that 

729
00:43:10,760 --> 00:43:12,240
happen? 
No, it actually happened. 

730
00:43:12,240 --> 00:43:13,440
Yeah. 
Oh my God. 

731
00:43:14,960 --> 00:43:16,520
It's part, of course, ultra 
running. 

732
00:43:16,520 --> 00:43:18,880
But I think they realized they 
knew a race was happening, so 

733
00:43:18,880 --> 00:43:21,520
they knew. 
I think it was just I'd gone 

734
00:43:21,520 --> 00:43:24,240
probably a little bit too close 
to where they were doing what 

735
00:43:24,240 --> 00:43:28,880
they were doing, but that's OK. 
Not that they were doing 

736
00:43:28,880 --> 00:43:32,080
anything wrong at all. 
Nothing wrong at all. 

737
00:43:32,080 --> 00:43:36,840
Nothing wrong at all. 
So from the scary and the laws 

738
00:43:36,840 --> 00:43:40,840
of races, have you ever had a 
moment that you can remember now

739
00:43:40,920 --> 00:43:43,920
that jumps out, that still gives
you gifts bumps? 

740
00:43:46,800 --> 00:43:54,480
Scary's and Low's? 
No, Probably sudden moments, 

741
00:43:54,480 --> 00:44:02,120
things like falling. 
Sometimes it's like, OK, I'm by 

742
00:44:02,120 --> 00:44:06,720
this Cliff, I'm actually going 
over and sort of not quite those

743
00:44:06,720 --> 00:44:11,520
moments can be pretty scary. 
Generally moments that they're 

744
00:44:11,520 --> 00:44:15,520
not like scary, but in the sense
of shocking is like, you know, 

745
00:44:16,400 --> 00:44:18,360
standing on a snake, something 
like that. 

746
00:44:18,840 --> 00:44:24,520
Those kinds of things, 
especially like like when I was 

747
00:44:24,520 --> 00:44:26,640
running around LA lot of 
rattlesnakes, those kind of 

748
00:44:26,640 --> 00:44:29,040
things like disturbing those and
they coil up and you think, oh 

749
00:44:29,080 --> 00:44:32,160
shit, that's could could bite 
me. 

750
00:44:32,200 --> 00:44:34,440
You know, it's more just a oh 
moment. 

751
00:44:34,440 --> 00:44:38,440
But you know, I've been bitten 
by dogs, I've been chased by 

752
00:44:38,440 --> 00:44:42,720
various animals, snakes, 
whatever. 

753
00:44:44,360 --> 00:44:48,320
You kind of get used. 
Sorry, what about happy moments?

754
00:44:48,680 --> 00:44:51,120
Like happy moments? 
Ghost bumps in that way. 

755
00:44:51,240 --> 00:44:56,920
Yeah, OK, happy moments, 
probably so many, but probably 

756
00:44:56,920 --> 00:45:00,200
ones that stand out. 
Running in Dubai in the deserts 

757
00:45:01,480 --> 00:45:05,080
towards the border with Oman and
running in this area. 

758
00:45:05,080 --> 00:45:10,200
It was like a sea of sand dunes 
and watching the sun come now, 

759
00:45:10,200 --> 00:45:14,880
the sunset and just seeing like 
the shadows and the, the, you 

760
00:45:14,880 --> 00:45:18,360
know, a million different colors
of 1000 different colors of pink

761
00:45:18,360 --> 00:45:22,160
and orange in the shadows over 
the sand dunes and sort of 

762
00:45:22,160 --> 00:45:24,800
running in that. 
And I was running with two or 

763
00:45:24,800 --> 00:45:26,920
three other people and we all 
just went quiet. 

764
00:45:27,000 --> 00:45:29,520
And you're all just looking at 
this and I'm just thinking it 

765
00:45:29,520 --> 00:45:33,040
just gives you goosebumps in the
sense that, wow, it's like I'm 

766
00:45:33,040 --> 00:45:37,320
here doing this and and just 
incredible. 

767
00:45:39,240 --> 00:45:41,320
Yeah. 
I think just so many moments 

768
00:45:41,320 --> 00:45:44,480
like that when you're in these 
races and events and you you 

769
00:45:44,480 --> 00:45:46,960
came around a corner when you 
see this mountain vessel in the 

770
00:45:46,960 --> 00:45:50,360
Dolomites running there, seeing 
the sun come up over the 

771
00:45:50,360 --> 00:45:57,280
mountains, you know, seeing the 
sunset and the desert just just 

772
00:45:57,760 --> 00:46:00,120
just gives me goosebumps 
thinking about them. 

773
00:46:00,120 --> 00:46:03,400
And I just think, you know, this
is what ultra running is. 

774
00:46:03,440 --> 00:46:07,560
You get to see these places that
that and experience the ACT, 

775
00:46:07,560 --> 00:46:11,360
being in the place at at that 
moment that we just don't get so

776
00:46:11,360 --> 00:46:13,000
much in our normal everyday 
life. 

777
00:46:13,000 --> 00:46:16,200
So yeah, I'm really grateful for
those those kinds of moments. 

778
00:46:18,280 --> 00:46:21,440
And we're going to move on to 
quick fire round. 

779
00:46:22,280 --> 00:46:26,320
We'll ask the questions quickly 
or probably not. 

780
00:46:28,240 --> 00:46:30,640
You can take as long as you want
to answer it. 

781
00:46:31,760 --> 00:46:34,880
You've you weren't just pre 
recording that you waffle on. 

782
00:46:35,480 --> 00:46:38,200
That's fine with us. 
OK, OK. 

783
00:46:39,440 --> 00:46:44,960
So favorite. 
Race snack, Favorite race snack.

784
00:46:49,680 --> 00:46:54,040
There's two or three. 
You know, I really like Mars 

785
00:46:54,040 --> 00:46:57,080
bars when I'm, when I'm running.
I don't know why I don't eat 

786
00:46:57,080 --> 00:47:01,920
them the rest of the time, but 
Mars bars that that's, I should 

787
00:47:01,920 --> 00:47:04,640
say, the gels my sponsors gives 
me. 

788
00:47:05,360 --> 00:47:07,800
But I've got to be honest. 
It'll be Mars bars, yeah. 

789
00:47:08,720 --> 00:47:10,400
I think we're on. 
Do they not melt? 

790
00:47:12,560 --> 00:47:14,240
If it's a mountain race, not so 
much. 

791
00:47:15,240 --> 00:47:20,960
If it's a hot race, yeah. 
Who are your sponsors? 

792
00:47:22,080 --> 00:47:25,600
Sponsors for nutrition sport 
hunger, which is like, it's kind

793
00:47:25,600 --> 00:47:27,760
of like the feed but in German 
and Europe. 

794
00:47:28,680 --> 00:47:31,840
So like they do all all sorts of
different nutrition products and

795
00:47:31,840 --> 00:47:37,280
Bix Fix Hydration, which is run 
by an ultra runner called Vlad 

796
00:47:37,280 --> 00:47:40,760
and they do some great products 
to gels and powders, etcetera. 

797
00:47:40,800 --> 00:47:44,000
So yeah, thanks guys. 
I really appreciate the support.

798
00:47:46,160 --> 00:47:48,360
Not sure that you get either of 
those in the UK. 

799
00:47:48,360 --> 00:47:50,760
I've not heard of them, so we'll
have to look them up. 

800
00:47:51,640 --> 00:47:54,160
Yeah. 
Anyway, back to the quick fire 

801
00:47:54,160 --> 00:47:56,200
question. 
Back to the questions. 

802
00:47:56,320 --> 00:47:59,400
What's next? 
Motivation or discipline? 

803
00:48:00,200 --> 00:48:05,040
Discipline. 
Easy favorite trail? 

804
00:48:05,640 --> 00:48:11,880
Chile or Spain or anywhere else?
I don't want to get divorced, so

805
00:48:11,880 --> 00:48:18,600
I should again. 
So I should say Chile, my friend

806
00:48:18,760 --> 00:48:23,160
to be to be fair, my my wife 
friend is is Chilena and 

807
00:48:23,160 --> 00:48:25,320
Espanola. 
So she's Spanish and Chilean. 

808
00:48:25,800 --> 00:48:31,200
So yeah, let's let's say Chile 
with Spain, a very, very close 

809
00:48:31,200 --> 00:48:34,400
second. 
What one race you'll never do 

810
00:48:34,400 --> 00:48:38,960
again. 
Should I say? 

811
00:48:39,600 --> 00:48:45,280
Yes. 
That's a tough one because I I 

812
00:48:45,280 --> 00:48:50,320
really like the race. 
Owners pass it. 

813
00:48:50,520 --> 00:48:53,800
Doesn't even have to be for a 
bad reason, it's just it could 

814
00:48:53,840 --> 00:48:57,840
be something even that you have 
peaked on that race and you 

815
00:48:57,840 --> 00:48:59,680
that's the best time you'll ever
get. 

816
00:49:00,320 --> 00:49:04,600
Yeah, I mean, I will probably 
say, I don't know, I can't say 

817
00:49:04,600 --> 00:49:05,760
that either. 
I was going to say the Boston 

818
00:49:05,760 --> 00:49:08,400
Marathon because I've done it 
three times, but Fran wants to 

819
00:49:08,400 --> 00:49:09,760
run it and I want to run it with
her. 

820
00:49:09,960 --> 00:49:14,560
So yeah, that's a really tough 
one because I just love every 

821
00:49:14,560 --> 00:49:18,200
race is so different and I love 
them all, even the ones that 

822
00:49:18,200 --> 00:49:23,040
don't go according to plan. 
So yeah, I'm going to have to 

823
00:49:23,040 --> 00:49:24,800
pass on that one. 
Guys, I'm sorry. 

824
00:49:24,800 --> 00:49:26,760
I just can't answer it. 
That's OK. 

825
00:49:27,560 --> 00:49:30,480
When you've mentioned the 
marathon major there, I'm going 

826
00:49:30,480 --> 00:49:33,400
to throw in another quick fire 
extra. 

827
00:49:33,560 --> 00:49:35,880
How many Star major styles do 
you have? 

828
00:49:36,960 --> 00:49:39,080
One, I've only ever run Boston. 
I'm. 

829
00:49:39,240 --> 00:49:45,080
Saying just one as if I've got. 
I, I never progressed. 

830
00:49:45,080 --> 00:49:47,280
I love ultra running like so 
much. 

831
00:49:47,320 --> 00:49:50,240
I never sort of have gone back 
to do the road stuff. 

832
00:49:50,280 --> 00:49:52,400
I enjoy the road stuff. 
I'll do a marathon now and 

833
00:49:52,400 --> 00:49:54,640
again, jump in and then half 
marathon. 

834
00:49:54,640 --> 00:50:00,400
But it it just would take a lot 
of time and financial commitment

835
00:50:00,400 --> 00:50:04,000
to do the rest of the majors. 
I mean, if Abbott's is listening

836
00:50:04,000 --> 00:50:06,280
and you want to invite me, guys,
I'm there. 

837
00:50:06,280 --> 00:50:09,640
But yeah, apart from that, maybe
I'll do it when I'm 60. 

838
00:50:09,920 --> 00:50:14,640
Let's see. 
I always find ultras. 

839
00:50:14,960 --> 00:50:16,920
The question is did you complete
it? 

840
00:50:17,240 --> 00:50:19,680
You mentioned you've done 
marathons, so what's your PB? 

841
00:50:20,960 --> 00:50:24,520
Two, I think 250, two 48250, 
something around that. 

842
00:50:24,520 --> 00:50:26,360
So I'm not, I'm not a fast Rd. 
guy. 

843
00:50:27,600 --> 00:50:33,200
It's, it's, it's something I 
haven't really focused on. 

844
00:50:35,000 --> 00:50:41,520
You know, I run about A248250 
marathon, about a 1118 to 120 

845
00:50:41,520 --> 00:50:47,200
half, but it's not my thing. 
I I, I enjoy it. 

846
00:50:48,160 --> 00:50:51,480
And I think, you know, I had a 
coach a few years ago that said,

847
00:50:51,480 --> 00:50:53,520
you know, if you focused on this
for six months, you could 

848
00:50:54,200 --> 00:50:58,720
probably really do a lot better 
in that area. 

849
00:50:58,720 --> 00:51:04,440
But it's, I just love trails so 
much that, yeah, I couldn't give

850
00:51:04,440 --> 00:51:06,560
six months up just to pound the 
pavements. 

851
00:51:07,680 --> 00:51:12,680
Yeah, it's just not my thing. 
And the last question that we 

852
00:51:12,680 --> 00:51:16,280
have on the quick fire round is 
you have built a big following 

853
00:51:16,280 --> 00:51:20,480
by being unfiltered and open. 
Has that ever felt risky? 

854
00:51:20,480 --> 00:51:22,440
No. 
Not at all. 

855
00:51:22,440 --> 00:51:25,720
I mean, let's be honest, it's 
it's not real. 

856
00:51:25,720 --> 00:51:29,320
Like, I'm not being like 
disrespectful to followers or 

857
00:51:29,320 --> 00:51:35,760
social media, but it's, it's all
unknown for posts with me being 

858
00:51:35,760 --> 00:51:38,320
fat and then shirtless with ABS.
Like, come on. 

859
00:51:38,320 --> 00:51:40,200
It's not don't take yourself so 
seriously. 

860
00:51:40,200 --> 00:51:42,720
Like, I think you've got to 
accept that I'm grateful for 

861
00:51:42,720 --> 00:51:45,240
what I have. 
It's allowed me to do so much. 

862
00:51:45,560 --> 00:51:49,320
But if I'm not being myself, 
then what am I doing it for? 

863
00:51:49,320 --> 00:51:51,560
Like really. 
Like, yeah, there's a bit of 

864
00:51:51,560 --> 00:51:55,560
promotion and advertising and, 
and yeah, I do like do some 

865
00:51:55,560 --> 00:51:59,000
stuff that that's going to like,
you know, trigger the algorithm 

866
00:51:59,000 --> 00:52:01,480
to, to help with follower growth
and exposure. 

867
00:52:01,960 --> 00:52:04,440
But it's like work. 
It's like anything else for me. 

868
00:52:04,440 --> 00:52:09,120
It's how I make my living. 
So yeah, I don't take myself too

869
00:52:09,120 --> 00:52:12,680
seriously. 
Like I'm a 55 year old guy, you 

870
00:52:12,680 --> 00:52:15,800
know, posting shirtless pics on 
on Instagram and come on. 

871
00:52:15,800 --> 00:52:21,840
Like, like you got to laugh. 
That, that, that, you know, it's

872
00:52:21,840 --> 00:52:24,240
allowed me to do what I do. 
I'm also very grateful to the 

873
00:52:24,240 --> 00:52:27,120
people that follow me. 
And, and it's no, like I said, 

874
00:52:27,120 --> 00:52:31,760
no disrespect to them at all, 
but I think when you start 

875
00:52:31,760 --> 00:52:35,000
taking yourself too seriously 
and think that you're important 

876
00:52:35,000 --> 00:52:39,600
or someone, you know, that look 
at me, then you just, you should

877
00:52:39,600 --> 00:52:44,520
walk away and do something else 
because, because you know, like 

878
00:52:44,880 --> 00:52:48,280
it's just luck, isn't it? 
Let's be honest, there's a 

879
00:52:48,280 --> 00:52:51,120
million people in the world that
can do it and that do do it. 

880
00:52:51,440 --> 00:52:54,120
And there's people that have 
millions of followers that do 

881
00:52:54,120 --> 00:52:56,520
this. 
So I really just like, you know,

882
00:52:57,520 --> 00:53:00,280
yeah, wake up each day super 
grateful I get to do it. 

883
00:53:01,280 --> 00:53:02,680
But yeah, I'm still going to be 
me. 

884
00:53:03,480 --> 00:53:06,440
Do it my way. 
If people like it, great. 

885
00:53:06,640 --> 00:53:09,200
If they want to follow, great. 
If not, that's cool too. 

886
00:53:10,440 --> 00:53:15,560
And moving or staying on that 
topic, the social media sort of 

887
00:53:15,560 --> 00:53:18,960
things. 
We already said that you'd had 

888
00:53:18,960 --> 00:53:20,480
heart surgery. 
And. 

889
00:53:21,880 --> 00:53:25,720
I I can relate to that because 
being there myself, How do you 

890
00:53:25,720 --> 00:53:31,840
think that that has shaped you 
as a person, as an athlete, as 

891
00:53:31,840 --> 00:53:36,600
your social media presence? 
Yeah, Now that's an interesting 

892
00:53:36,600 --> 00:53:41,360
one because that's actually how 
I got on social media, my 

893
00:53:41,360 --> 00:53:45,600
daughter, my my doctor and then 
said you should carry a phone 

894
00:53:45,600 --> 00:53:47,920
when you run because I didn't 
used to carry a phone when I ran

895
00:53:47,920 --> 00:53:51,880
before that. 
So I started to carry a phone 

896
00:53:51,960 --> 00:53:55,560
and I started to take pictures 
and things. 

897
00:53:55,560 --> 00:53:57,360
Well, I mean, I didn't carry a 
phone much. 

898
00:53:57,360 --> 00:53:58,960
I didn't really take social 
media seriously. 

899
00:53:59,200 --> 00:54:01,280
And my daughter said, hey, look,
you should post some of this 

900
00:54:01,280 --> 00:54:03,640
stuff on social media. 
Now you're carrying a phone. 

901
00:54:03,880 --> 00:54:05,560
The places you run, they look 
super cool. 

902
00:54:06,240 --> 00:54:10,800
That's how it started. 
So kind of got, I have to thank 

903
00:54:10,800 --> 00:54:17,480
like having the heart problems 
to that led me to really expose,

904
00:54:17,560 --> 00:54:20,440
you know, what I do and the 
running side of things and 

905
00:54:20,440 --> 00:54:22,440
social media and that's how it 
all grew. 

906
00:54:22,440 --> 00:54:29,400
So, yeah, you know, the Hard 
thing is been an interesting 

907
00:54:29,400 --> 00:54:32,160
story because it's it's 
something I wasn't comfortable 

908
00:54:32,160 --> 00:54:35,160
talking about at first, but as 
it's happened and it's evolved, 

909
00:54:35,560 --> 00:54:37,320
I've seen it. 
It's a really good thing to 

910
00:54:37,320 --> 00:54:41,280
share because so many people do 
have issues or they're worried 

911
00:54:41,280 --> 00:54:43,800
about those things. 
So it creates an awareness 

912
00:54:43,800 --> 00:54:46,000
around it as well. 
You know, go and get it checked 

913
00:54:46,000 --> 00:54:49,160
if there's an issue. 
Take better care of yourself. 

914
00:54:49,160 --> 00:54:52,000
There's a whole lot of messages 
I think that you can unpack from

915
00:54:52,440 --> 00:54:54,000
that, that that's come from the 
hard issue. 

916
00:54:54,000 --> 00:54:58,320
But yeah, it's, it's certainly 
something that I've embraced on 

917
00:54:58,320 --> 00:55:02,040
social media and, and it's 
helped me in some ways. 

918
00:55:02,040 --> 00:55:04,200
I thought it would cause issues,
but it's, it's done the 

919
00:55:04,200 --> 00:55:07,160
opposite. 
It's actually created like a new

920
00:55:07,160 --> 00:55:11,240
opportunities to do things and, 
and, and get the message out 

921
00:55:11,240 --> 00:55:13,520
there about heart health and 
health in general. 

922
00:55:14,520 --> 00:55:18,400
So social media gets a lot of 
bad press because it is evil, 

923
00:55:18,400 --> 00:55:21,720
it's horrible and all, but if 
you use it correctly, it has got

924
00:55:21,720 --> 00:55:27,000
a good side to it. 100% yeah. 
I think that's the key. 

925
00:55:27,000 --> 00:55:30,440
You hit the nail on the head. 
It's it's a, it's like a tool. 

926
00:55:31,000 --> 00:55:33,200
It's something you, if you can 
pick it up and put it down and 

927
00:55:33,200 --> 00:55:36,560
use it for good, it's great. 
You can also use it for bad. 

928
00:55:37,160 --> 00:55:40,800
OK. 
You just get to decide which 

929
00:55:40,800 --> 00:55:43,520
which one of those you're you 
know you're going to use it for.

930
00:55:43,880 --> 00:55:47,280
Yeah, and they get many messages
from people that have had 

931
00:55:47,280 --> 00:55:51,440
similar heart health issues or 
like even thanking you for 

932
00:55:51,440 --> 00:55:54,880
raising awareness and something 
that they didn't know about and 

933
00:55:54,880 --> 00:55:59,040
went and got checked. 
Yeah, definitely lots, all the 

934
00:55:59,040 --> 00:56:02,280
time, every week, messages from 
people with with all sorts of 

935
00:56:02,280 --> 00:56:06,280
issues. 
Although I must say, all the 

936
00:56:06,280 --> 00:56:10,360
people that that ask and, and 
ask what, what that they asked 

937
00:56:10,360 --> 00:56:12,840
me, what should I do? 
I would say please go speak to 

938
00:56:12,840 --> 00:56:14,600
your cardiologist. 
I'm not a doctor. 

939
00:56:14,600 --> 00:56:16,280
I'm not an expert in heart 
health. 

940
00:56:17,360 --> 00:56:21,920
Just because I don't take a 
certain medication, I've talked 

941
00:56:21,920 --> 00:56:25,520
to someone about that and we've 
discussed it, you know, with my 

942
00:56:25,520 --> 00:56:30,720
doctor, cardiologist and various
medical advisors, doesn't mean 

943
00:56:30,720 --> 00:56:33,320
that you shouldn't take yours or
do what you're meant to be 

944
00:56:33,320 --> 00:56:36,400
doing. 
So please, you know, seek the 

945
00:56:36,400 --> 00:56:39,440
proper advice. 
There's a lot of medical advice 

946
00:56:39,440 --> 00:56:41,560
on social media, and there's a 
lot of people that will tell you

947
00:56:41,560 --> 00:56:44,120
to not do this and take this 
instead and do that. 

948
00:56:45,240 --> 00:56:50,400
Everyone's different, I think, 
you know, Yeah, so I do get a 

949
00:56:50,400 --> 00:56:52,400
lot of people reach out. 
But yeah, that would be the one 

950
00:56:52,400 --> 00:56:54,120
thing I've learned from it all 
different. 

951
00:56:54,240 --> 00:56:57,640
Seek find your own path, get the
best advice possible. 

952
00:56:58,200 --> 00:57:02,320
Yeah, and a doctor, if he's 
worth being a doctor, he's never

953
00:57:02,320 --> 00:57:04,320
going to complain that you've 
wasted his time and there is 

954
00:57:04,320 --> 00:57:07,520
nothing wrong. 
Yeah, 100% better to find out 

955
00:57:07,520 --> 00:57:09,120
that there's nothing wrong. 
Yeah. 

956
00:57:09,480 --> 00:57:11,920
Yeah, yeah, definitely, 
definitely. 

957
00:57:12,960 --> 00:57:20,320
So moving on from that bitty 
somber topic there, running 

958
00:57:20,320 --> 00:57:25,120
achievements or athletic 
achievements or life 

959
00:57:25,120 --> 00:57:28,120
achievements? 
What's your your biggest 

960
00:57:28,560 --> 00:57:32,280
achievement? 
Wow, that's a big one. 

961
00:57:35,240 --> 00:57:37,800
Wow. 
I mean, we've got full grown up 

962
00:57:37,800 --> 00:57:39,200
kids. 
They're also functioning in the 

963
00:57:39,200 --> 00:57:41,400
life. 
I think that's that's pretty 

964
00:57:41,400 --> 00:57:42,960
good. 
Well, I think that that that 

965
00:57:42,960 --> 00:57:46,280
might be due to, you know, not 
just to obviously to me, but to 

966
00:57:46,280 --> 00:57:51,920
to their their mother as well. 
So, and then running 

967
00:57:51,920 --> 00:57:59,680
achievements, well, I think I 
still don't know, everyone is 

968
00:57:59,680 --> 00:58:03,720
just great in its own way. 
I mean, you know, I've had a few

969
00:58:03,720 --> 00:58:10,640
podiums in my time, but you know
that sometimes the best races 

970
00:58:10,640 --> 00:58:13,840
are the ones where you feel that
you gave it everything and it 

971
00:58:13,840 --> 00:58:15,520
doesn't matter where the placing
was. 

972
00:58:15,640 --> 00:58:18,080
But you know that on the day you
gave it everything. 

973
00:58:18,080 --> 00:58:22,200
You have other times I've placed
quite well in the event, but I 

974
00:58:22,200 --> 00:58:25,320
know that I I could have tried 
harder and pushed harder and 

975
00:58:25,320 --> 00:58:30,440
I've, you know, maybe not 
cruised in and just, you know, 

976
00:58:30,440 --> 00:58:32,480
knowing that I was in pretty 
good shape and that the 

977
00:58:32,480 --> 00:58:34,440
competition maybe didn't have 
such good days. 

978
00:58:34,720 --> 00:58:37,720
So yeah, that's a hard one. 
I mean, finishing UTMB Mont 

979
00:58:37,720 --> 00:58:42,320
Blanc was was a biggie. 
That's the only 100 Mila that I 

980
00:58:42,320 --> 00:58:46,680
just cannot figure out the 
formula too. 

981
00:58:46,720 --> 00:58:49,200
I I've run so much faster 100 
miles. 

982
00:58:49,200 --> 00:58:50,440
So that that's an interesting 
one. 

983
00:58:50,600 --> 00:58:53,200
That's why I keep going back 
because I need to crack that 

984
00:58:53,200 --> 00:58:55,000
code. 
It's my I don't know. 

985
00:58:55,080 --> 00:58:58,360
It's my what's the one? 
It's that one race that's that's

986
00:58:58,360 --> 00:59:03,280
elusive anyway, life 
achievements getting to 55 and 

987
00:59:03,280 --> 00:59:13,840
I'm still here after numerous 
health issues finding a, a, a 

988
00:59:14,360 --> 00:59:20,800
wife Fran, my what current wife 
Fran who just gets me being with

989
00:59:20,800 --> 00:59:22,320
a partner. 
I don't think that's an 

990
00:59:22,320 --> 00:59:24,880
achievement. 
That's just like a a bonus to 

991
00:59:24,880 --> 00:59:27,880
everything makes everything so 
much easier and better in my 

992
00:59:27,880 --> 00:59:29,960
life. 
Couldn't do what I do without 

993
00:59:29,960 --> 00:59:32,480
her. 
She was the one come visit me in

994
00:59:32,480 --> 00:59:34,720
hospital every day when I was 
having the heart surgery, when I

995
00:59:34,720 --> 00:59:38,880
was in there, remember 4 * / 2 
months for because they had a 

996
00:59:39,080 --> 00:59:41,000
couple of problems with a couple
of the surgeries. 

997
00:59:42,800 --> 00:59:46,840
And she would just become an, 
you know, give up her own life 

998
00:59:46,840 --> 00:59:49,960
for that time until I was better
and ready to come back here. 

999
00:59:51,800 --> 00:59:57,280
Backs me up 100% supports me. 
Big kudos to her. 

1000
00:59:57,280 --> 01:00:01,960
Yeah. 
Well, yeah, I think that's, 

1001
01:00:02,000 --> 01:00:04,040
that's, that's really all I can 
think about. 

1002
01:00:04,040 --> 01:00:08,120
I don't like what achievements 
is and you know what business I 

1003
01:00:08,120 --> 01:00:12,480
had or What Car I drove or how 
many houses I had when I was in 

1004
01:00:12,480 --> 01:00:15,560
doing that kind of thing. 
Because they're really not 

1005
01:00:15,560 --> 01:00:19,200
important to me anymore. 
Just waking up each day, being 

1006
01:00:19,200 --> 01:00:20,920
happy. 
That's pretty much it. 

1007
01:00:23,200 --> 01:00:28,200
And do you run for performance, 
adventure or something deeper? 

1008
01:00:28,200 --> 01:00:29,280
What is your? 
Why? 

1009
01:00:30,840 --> 01:00:33,360
My why? 
Big, big one. 

1010
01:00:33,960 --> 01:00:37,880
I'm alive. 
Simply when I wake up each day. 

1011
01:00:38,720 --> 01:00:40,240
I'm alive. 
When you've had your heart stop 

1012
01:00:40,240 --> 01:00:43,400
a few times, you really 
appreciate everything. 

1013
01:00:43,640 --> 01:00:47,200
Everything. 
I've got coffee that a machine 

1014
01:00:47,200 --> 01:00:49,320
makes. 
Wow, it's amazing. 

1015
01:00:49,320 --> 01:00:50,920
It's incredible. 
The smell of it each morning. 

1016
01:00:51,440 --> 01:00:55,440
Like, you know, you start to 
appreciate everything that's 

1017
01:00:55,440 --> 01:00:57,640
simple in your life and the good
things. 

1018
01:00:57,640 --> 01:01:00,160
Yeah, there's a lot of noise and
there's always going to be 

1019
01:01:00,720 --> 01:01:04,960
issues and problems to solve and
things to fix, but none of it 

1020
01:01:04,960 --> 01:01:10,480
really matters. 
Biggest thing for me is my why 

1021
01:01:10,480 --> 01:01:12,800
is I'm alive and I get to enjoy 
this life. 

1022
01:01:12,920 --> 01:01:19,320
That's it. 
And next question, It could be a

1023
01:01:19,320 --> 01:01:24,600
really deep, a long answer. 
You waffle on all you want, or 

1024
01:01:24,600 --> 01:01:28,080
it might just be one word. 
What do you think about when 

1025
01:01:28,080 --> 01:01:33,800
you're running? 
Yes, it's not so deep. 

1026
01:01:34,840 --> 01:01:37,720
Generally I just switch off and 
I'm quite meditative. 

1027
01:01:38,200 --> 01:01:40,600
I'm just, that's why I think I 
like, try running. 

1028
01:01:41,000 --> 01:01:43,840
When I was on the road, I was 
listening to music and podcasts 

1029
01:01:43,840 --> 01:01:46,240
and that's great, you know, 
nothing wrong with that. 

1030
01:01:46,960 --> 01:01:52,720
But obviously safety first, not 
running across stoplights and 

1031
01:01:52,720 --> 01:01:55,480
things, you know, being aware of
what's around you. 

1032
01:01:56,400 --> 01:01:59,200
But when I'm on the trails, I 
just love nature. 

1033
01:01:59,200 --> 01:02:02,480
I love the lack of noise. 
And I don't just mean physical, 

1034
01:02:02,480 --> 01:02:05,800
but mental as well. 
I don't know, I kind of find 

1035
01:02:05,800 --> 01:02:09,160
immersed myself in the 
experience and just switch off. 

1036
01:02:10,320 --> 01:02:13,360
Sometimes I'm running with Fran 
and she says you're quite quiet.

1037
01:02:13,360 --> 01:02:16,640
What are you thinking about? 
Saying nothing like maybe that's

1038
01:02:16,640 --> 01:02:24,080
a guy thing. 
You know, we do get a called out

1039
01:02:24,080 --> 01:02:26,600
sometimes if we really are 
actually not thinking of 

1040
01:02:26,600 --> 01:02:32,520
anything in particular. 
So yeah, other times I solve 

1041
01:02:33,600 --> 01:02:37,000
things that have been, maybe I 
have to solve some problem or 

1042
01:02:37,000 --> 01:02:40,000
issue that that's kind of been 
on my mind. 

1043
01:02:40,000 --> 01:02:42,200
And with everything else going 
on when I'm in front of a 

1044
01:02:42,200 --> 01:02:45,320
computer and working and on 
social media, when I'm out on 

1045
01:02:45,320 --> 01:02:48,520
the trails, kind of can put 
everything into perspective and 

1046
01:02:48,520 --> 01:02:52,000
then make a plan of action. 
Kind of not in the sense that 

1047
01:02:52,000 --> 01:02:54,720
I'm thinking about it, but it 
just starts to fall into its 

1048
01:02:54,720 --> 01:02:56,880
right place. 
So maybe it's a seems like a big

1049
01:02:56,880 --> 01:02:59,600
problem, but it shrinks back 
down to what it actually is. 

1050
01:02:59,600 --> 01:03:02,160
And then it's like, OK, take the
next steps to do it. 

1051
01:03:02,680 --> 01:03:06,240
But a lot of the time it's just 
about switching off and just 

1052
01:03:06,240 --> 01:03:09,240
being in the moment, being in 
nature. 

1053
01:03:09,920 --> 01:03:13,800
There's a mountain behind us 
about two 2702 thousand, 800 

1054
01:03:13,800 --> 01:03:18,600
meters high. 
That is a beautiful climb, quite

1055
01:03:18,600 --> 01:03:20,200
technical at the top. 
You've got to do a little bit of

1056
01:03:20,200 --> 01:03:23,200
climbing. 
And you know, I just go up to 

1057
01:03:23,200 --> 01:03:26,000
the top of that and I can see 
the border of Argentina over 

1058
01:03:26,000 --> 01:03:29,200
there in the Andes Mountains and
and the biggest mountain in 

1059
01:03:29,200 --> 01:03:33,840
South America on the distance. 
It's about 6 1/2 thousand 

1060
01:03:33,840 --> 01:03:36,040
meters, I think high and I just 
think. 

1061
01:03:36,720 --> 01:03:38,760
Yeah. 
Pretty happy, just sit there 

1062
01:03:38,760 --> 01:03:42,320
quietly for 5 minutes looking at
that and really just let it wash

1063
01:03:42,320 --> 01:03:44,880
over me. 
I'm a pretty simple guy, I don't

1064
01:03:44,880 --> 01:03:50,760
need a lot of distraction. 
And do you have any projects or 

1065
01:03:50,760 --> 01:03:55,600
events or anything, any races 
coming up that you want people 

1066
01:03:55,600 --> 01:03:58,680
to know about? 
Yes. 

1067
01:03:59,880 --> 01:04:03,480
So we'll be doing some work with
UTMB again this year and some of

1068
01:04:03,480 --> 01:04:06,440
their races. 
So and yeah, one of those will 

1069
01:04:07,080 --> 01:04:12,320
be UTMB Mont Blanc. 
Again, we're like I mentioned 

1070
01:04:12,320 --> 01:04:16,160
earlier in the podcast, we're 
going to hopefully we're working

1071
01:04:16,160 --> 01:04:18,760
on some stuff in China. 
We're going to go and race over 

1072
01:04:18,760 --> 01:04:21,480
there. 
So that should be exciting. 

1073
01:04:21,480 --> 01:04:26,400
And also not just in Chile for 
the sunny weather and because my

1074
01:04:26,400 --> 01:04:30,480
wife lives here. 
I'm working on a project here 

1075
01:04:30,480 --> 01:04:33,280
with one of our sponsors that 
we're still putting together. 

1076
01:04:33,280 --> 01:04:35,920
I can't say too much about it 
right now. 

1077
01:04:37,000 --> 01:04:41,280
However, it's a multi day 
endurance project and it's going

1078
01:04:41,280 --> 01:04:49,240
to be a lot of fun. 
And do you have any races that 

1079
01:04:49,240 --> 01:04:52,000
are left on the bucket list that
you would still like to do? 

1080
01:04:53,240 --> 01:04:55,160
Yeah, I'm. 
I'm going to run out of life 

1081
01:04:55,160 --> 01:04:59,800
before I get to do everything. 
I'd love to come over, actually.

1082
01:05:00,040 --> 01:05:02,280
This is another thing I might 
scout out this year. 

1083
01:05:02,280 --> 01:05:06,440
I'd love to come over to, to the
UK and look at some of the, the 

1084
01:05:06,440 --> 01:05:10,960
races, Like, I mean, there's the
big ones, the spine race, the 

1085
01:05:12,200 --> 01:05:14,160
Dragons back through Wales, 
these these kind of things. 

1086
01:05:14,160 --> 01:05:16,800
I, I, I see. 
And I think, yeah, they're quite

1087
01:05:16,800 --> 01:05:17,720
cool. 
Like running. 

1088
01:05:18,200 --> 01:05:23,720
Look at that, look at that. 
You know, I like those kinds of 

1089
01:05:23,720 --> 01:05:27,440
challenges, those multi day or 
or challenging condition kind of

1090
01:05:27,440 --> 01:05:29,160
events where you have to push 
yourself. 

1091
01:05:29,160 --> 01:05:37,960
So yeah, there's I haven't raced
enough in in the UK to be fair 

1092
01:05:37,960 --> 01:05:39,360
because I'm usually tied up in 
Europe. 

1093
01:05:39,360 --> 01:05:40,760
So I'd love to come over there 
and do that. 

1094
01:05:40,760 --> 01:05:44,320
Obviously, China is 1 on my 
bucket list as well. 

1095
01:05:44,320 --> 01:05:47,680
And Asia, I think there's some 
incredible races there and I 

1096
01:05:47,680 --> 01:05:50,840
know it's exploding over there 
and we haven't even seen the tip

1097
01:05:50,840 --> 01:05:57,760
of the iceberg and that yet. 
And yeah, there's just so many. 

1098
01:05:58,200 --> 01:06:01,360
There's some that are quite out 
of the way in places like 

1099
01:06:01,880 --> 01:06:08,120
Georgia and and sort of 
countries that aren't on the 

1100
01:06:08,120 --> 01:06:10,560
ultra running map as such. 
But there's just some incredible

1101
01:06:10,560 --> 01:06:14,440
places that I've heard from 
other people and seen them run 

1102
01:06:14,960 --> 01:06:16,480
that I'd like to explore 
further. 

1103
01:06:16,680 --> 01:06:19,240
But like I said, I think I'm 
just going to run out of life. 

1104
01:06:19,920 --> 01:06:22,400
So I'll do my best to get around
them all. 

1105
01:06:22,680 --> 01:06:25,800
But I think yeah, definitely 
attract to the UK is on the 

1106
01:06:25,800 --> 01:06:29,240
cards. 
Come and check out what you guys

1107
01:06:29,240 --> 01:06:33,040
are doing over there. 
I see some amazing stuff and 

1108
01:06:33,960 --> 01:06:36,760
certainly up north there, man, 
you've got some some beautiful 

1109
01:06:36,760 --> 01:06:39,360
countryside up that way. 
Just incredible. 

1110
01:06:40,240 --> 01:06:43,880
And while Ian was answering that
question and was pointing at my 

1111
01:06:43,880 --> 01:06:46,480
T-shirt so that the Tunnel Ultra
so. 

1112
01:06:46,920 --> 01:06:48,720
There's not much scenery in 
that, Ian. 

1113
01:06:48,920 --> 01:06:51,640
You're running through a tunnel 
for 200 miles backwards and 

1114
01:06:51,640 --> 01:06:54,680
forwards. 
That, that is, that sounds 

1115
01:06:54,680 --> 01:06:58,040
pretty cool actually, right? 
I think the mental challenge of 

1116
01:06:58,040 --> 01:06:59,960
that is just incredible. 
Yeah. 

1117
01:07:01,440 --> 01:07:03,120
We'll, we'll talk about it off 
here. 

1118
01:07:07,840 --> 01:07:12,720
Next question, another possibly 
deep and meaningful one. 

1119
01:07:13,560 --> 01:07:16,640
Do you have anybody that you 
would like to go for a run with?

1120
01:07:16,960 --> 01:07:20,680
Either alive, not fictional, 
real. 

1121
01:07:21,120 --> 01:07:27,960
Up to you. 
You know, I got to be honest, 

1122
01:07:28,880 --> 01:07:32,760
once again, I love running with 
my wife like, and I'm not just 

1123
01:07:32,760 --> 01:07:34,680
saying that because she she'll 
listen to this. 

1124
01:07:35,400 --> 01:07:38,800
We actually get on so well. 
Like this is how we started our 

1125
01:07:38,800 --> 01:07:45,480
relationship when we were just 
friends and, and then obviously 

1126
01:07:45,480 --> 01:07:50,040
it grew into something else, but
we just both love to be outdoors

1127
01:07:50,040 --> 01:07:56,000
and run and, and we can spend 
hours a day out on the 

1128
01:07:56,000 --> 01:07:58,520
mountains. 
We've run 100K ultra together in

1129
01:07:58,520 --> 01:08:01,560
the, in the South of Chile, in 
the, in Patagonia, around the 

1130
01:08:01,560 --> 01:08:08,200
volcano, active volcano. 
You know, we just click and we 

1131
01:08:08,200 --> 01:08:12,400
can just like, we just enjoy 
each other's company so much 

1132
01:08:12,840 --> 01:08:18,800
that, I mean, I'm just drawn 
back to, to that again and 

1133
01:08:18,800 --> 01:08:20,479
again. 
We, we just really love spending

1134
01:08:20,479 --> 01:08:22,640
time together out in these wild 
places. 

1135
01:08:23,479 --> 01:08:27,840
You know, there's all the fast 
people and people. 

1136
01:08:27,880 --> 01:08:30,720
I mean, I, I've been in races 
with Killian, but The thing is, 

1137
01:08:31,080 --> 01:08:33,080
you know, I, I can't keep up 
with the guy. 

1138
01:08:33,160 --> 01:08:41,000
It's just impossible. 
So yeah, I mean, yeah, I'd say 

1139
01:08:41,000 --> 01:08:43,080
my wife, she'd be #1 on the 
list. 

1140
01:08:44,439 --> 01:08:48,439
And I follow Fran on Instagram 
as well and she looks so 

1141
01:08:48,439 --> 01:08:52,840
awesome. 
She is freaking awesome. 

1142
01:08:52,840 --> 01:08:56,040
I, I got to say, I mean, I'm 
biased obviously, but yeah, we 

1143
01:08:56,040 --> 01:08:58,399
just have a really good 
relationship because we're just 

1144
01:08:58,560 --> 01:09:00,399
both so passionate about 
running. 

1145
01:09:00,399 --> 01:09:03,319
When she's going to be 60 this 
year and she's still running 

1146
01:09:03,319 --> 01:09:08,960
races, you know, she's still, 
she just loves it, absolutely 

1147
01:09:08,960 --> 01:09:12,560
loves it, loves what she does. 
She loves to be in the outdoors.

1148
01:09:12,560 --> 01:09:16,399
She loves running. 
So I know I think that rubs off 

1149
01:09:16,399 --> 01:09:18,080
on me while I'm out there with 
her. 

1150
01:09:18,080 --> 01:09:21,960
So yeah, it's kind of like feeds
the feeds the fire a bit. 

1151
01:09:22,960 --> 01:09:26,920
And she also looks incredible. 
She doesn't look even though she

1152
01:09:26,920 --> 01:09:30,160
is even near 60. 
I don't know how she does it. 

1153
01:09:30,160 --> 01:09:33,120
I'm sure it's genetic. 
She says it's it's exercise and 

1154
01:09:33,120 --> 01:09:36,359
diet, but I'm sure it's genetics
because I don't know how she 

1155
01:09:36,359 --> 01:09:38,319
does it. 
She she looks way younger than 

1156
01:09:38,319 --> 01:09:39,880
me. 
Like I don't know how she does 

1157
01:09:39,880 --> 01:09:43,040
it. 
I'm sorry, Ian, but I'm agreeing

1158
01:09:43,040 --> 01:09:45,319
with you. 
Yeah, it's true. 

1159
01:09:46,439 --> 01:09:49,560
She does. 
Everyone thinks she's she we 

1160
01:09:49,560 --> 01:09:52,160
were at a function actually the 
other week or she was, I should 

1161
01:09:52,160 --> 01:09:57,360
say, and that she just the new 
president that just got voted in

1162
01:09:57,360 --> 01:10:00,800
here in Chile. 
He said he thought she was 40. 

1163
01:10:00,920 --> 01:10:04,440
He said, are you, you know, they
were talking about something and

1164
01:10:04,760 --> 01:10:08,320
and and she said I am 
celebrating my his birthday. 

1165
01:10:08,320 --> 01:10:10,600
He said, yeah, I'm going to be, 
I don't know, 60 something this 

1166
01:10:10,600 --> 01:10:11,520
year. 
She said, yeah, I'm going to be 

1167
01:10:11,520 --> 01:10:14,200
60. 
He said, no, I honestly don't 

1168
01:10:14,200 --> 01:10:16,640
believe it. 
You're like, you look like 

1169
01:10:16,640 --> 01:10:18,320
you're in your 40s. 
And that's what most people say 

1170
01:10:18,320 --> 01:10:20,120
when they meet her. 
She actually does look like her 

1171
01:10:20,120 --> 01:10:21,760
Instagram, like her social 
media. 

1172
01:10:22,000 --> 01:10:23,680
They're not, no, they're not 
filters. 

1173
01:10:24,080 --> 01:10:25,640
I don't know how she does it 
anyway. 

1174
01:10:25,640 --> 01:10:28,280
Maybe she's. 
I said to her just go and like 

1175
01:10:28,280 --> 01:10:31,880
sign a contract with like one of
the face screen people in Paris.

1176
01:10:31,880 --> 01:10:36,200
Just just say you use it. 
Just lie and say I said because 

1177
01:10:36,240 --> 01:10:39,000
people will believe it and 
you'll make a fortune. 

1178
01:10:39,000 --> 01:10:43,480
I said, OK, you know, yeah, it's
not the truth, but man, you, 

1179
01:10:43,600 --> 01:10:45,880
you'll be able to sell it 
because look at you anyway. 

1180
01:10:46,040 --> 01:10:48,200
Yeah. 
See so so she says that you're 

1181
01:10:48,240 --> 01:10:51,800
so lucky and whatever you can 
eat whatever you like and you 

1182
01:10:51,800 --> 01:10:54,320
still look the way you are. 
She is so lucky because because 

1183
01:10:54,320 --> 01:10:57,520
she has the beautiful skin, as 
you say, and she looks 

1184
01:10:57,600 --> 01:11:00,920
incredible as well. 
I don't know how she does it. 

1185
01:11:00,920 --> 01:11:03,840
Yeah, but I mean, yeah, like I 
said, I am incredibly lucky 

1186
01:11:04,600 --> 01:11:07,360
she's with me. 
I don't know why, but she is. 

1187
01:11:07,520 --> 01:11:10,800
So yeah, I must be. 
I must be must have a lot of 

1188
01:11:10,800 --> 01:11:16,040
luck on my side. 
And unless Mike has anything 

1189
01:11:16,040 --> 01:11:20,760
else that he wants to ask, the 
final question we have is it's 

1190
01:11:20,760 --> 01:11:22,920
quite philosophical, less it 
could be. 

1191
01:11:22,920 --> 01:11:26,880
If someone that is listening to 
this episode is stuck in life 

1192
01:11:26,880 --> 01:11:31,280
right now and running or in 
their own head, what is the 

1193
01:11:31,280 --> 01:11:33,480
first step that you would tell 
them to take? 

1194
01:11:36,360 --> 01:11:41,080
You know, I know it sounds 
cliche, but where you are now is

1195
01:11:41,080 --> 01:11:45,240
not where you're going to be. 
Never give up like it's, it's 

1196
01:11:45,640 --> 01:11:47,600
true. 
I every time I've been in a 

1197
01:11:47,600 --> 01:11:49,760
hospital bed, I've just come out
of surgery. 

1198
01:11:49,760 --> 01:11:55,120
I've just had a broken bone. 
I, I was in, I, I caught COVID 

1199
01:11:55,120 --> 01:12:01,160
in 2020 and was in isolation 
ward and had my lungs 70 cent 

1200
01:12:01,160 --> 01:12:04,920
block with COVID pneumonia, one 
of the nice early versions. 

1201
01:12:06,120 --> 01:12:10,720
And you know, all these things. 
I just thought, what can I do 

1202
01:12:10,720 --> 01:12:15,080
today to to make a difference? 
What can I do that's going to 

1203
01:12:15,080 --> 01:12:17,120
move me forward in some way, 
whether that's mental or 

1204
01:12:17,120 --> 01:12:20,840
physical or spiritual or 
whatever you know works for you.

1205
01:12:22,560 --> 01:12:25,280
So just don't give up. 
Where you are now is not where 

1206
01:12:25,720 --> 01:12:27,000
you're going to be in the 
future. 

1207
01:12:27,000 --> 01:12:29,840
Things do change. 
I'm not going to say it's all 

1208
01:12:29,840 --> 01:12:32,240
going to work out and it's going
to be better, but while you're 

1209
01:12:32,240 --> 01:12:35,440
alive, there's always a chance 
that things can change. 

1210
01:12:36,400 --> 01:12:42,760
So yeah, just don't give up. 
Like seriously, I'm living proof

1211
01:12:42,760 --> 01:12:47,480
that if you just keep taking the
next step, you can get to the 

1212
01:12:47,480 --> 01:12:50,000
place where you want to be. 
Doesn't mean it's going to be 

1213
01:12:50,000 --> 01:12:53,800
easy, doesn't mean you're not 
going to have setbacks, but man,

1214
01:12:53,840 --> 01:12:55,360
just keep going. 
Don't give up. 

1215
01:12:58,000 --> 01:13:01,840
And that brings us to the the 
end of our questions. 

1216
01:13:03,600 --> 01:13:11,000
It's just from me, from a Chile,
not Chile, Scotland to say thank

1217
01:13:11,000 --> 01:13:14,520
you Ian for coming on the show. 
Thank you Nikki for being Nikki 

1218
01:13:14,560 --> 01:13:16,720
and it's goodbye for me. 
Thanks for coming. 

1219
01:13:16,840 --> 01:13:18,440
On Ian. 
Thanks, Mike. 

1220
01:13:18,440 --> 01:13:20,960
Thanks, Nikki. 
It's been a lot of fun and I'd 

1221
01:13:20,960 --> 01:13:22,840
love to hear more about your 
story sometimes.