Welcome back to another episode of nevertheless, she persisted
your how-to guide. Happy place and support system
for navigating the ups and downs of Life.
Please share today's episode with your friends and family
members and leave a review when Apple podcasts.
And as always, I'm not a licensed therapist.
Just a teenage, girl, hoping to help enjoy Welcome back to
another episode today. I'm joined by my dad.
Hello Sadie. Hi.
So can you introduce yourself a little bit?
Just to give listeners a little bit. that you were repairing,
you've I'm sure. Well, I'm your father and
happily so and in addition to being a father of three other
kids who are your siblings and you're absolutely right that I
along with your mom have had the experience of going through a
severe depression in terms of you know the depression that you
had earlier in your life. And so I have that experience as
a father to a teenage girl that suffered from severe depression
and anxiety. And so that's my background
also. Okay.
So I was Wondering if you could similar to what we talked about
in one of our first episode, if you could give a little bit of a
recap of emotionally, what it was like to be a parent to a
child who was struggling with depression and anxiety.
Like you mentioned, well, I'd say that.
The brief recap is that, you know, someone who didn't have
any experience. Just prior to when you had
depression, I'd say that the first feeling you feel,
emotionally is just confusion and this feeling that you don't
know what to. To do.
And so where it started was just sort of a feeling that there was
an obstinance or a refusal on your part to do certain things
that a normal fourteen-year-old girl would do in terms of
getting out of bed and going to school or doing things.
That would be very normal, which is to sit at the dinner table
with us or to, you know, speak and when we had guests over and
things like that. So, so I'd say that the
emotional Journey for me as a parent going through that was
starting The confusion and frustration to, then a whole
world of things. Once we actually understood what
was going on, what do you mean when you say a whole world of
things? Well, I think that what I mean
is to First recognize that this isn't anything that you wished
upon yourself. This is anything that you were
doing to sort of, you know, you certainly didn't want this for
yourself. And so I'd say that the big aha
moment for us was that once we realized how how serious this
was and more importantly, how much you were suffering.
That was the critical moment when we realized just how
important it was for us to turn our world upside down to try and
prove give you help and to give you support as opposed to
thinking that we could just fix it by saying some things or
taking you know, actions just between your mom and myself. you
like turn the whole world upside down and you mean like The
country and not McClain and then being a boarding school for
years out you're referring to. Yeah I mean basically the you
know as I would think anybody would in this situation, does
you start locally and you try and get help and support from
local doctors and clinicians and and subject matter experts and
in our situation that was a nun, high enough level of care for
the situation. So you know, that's absolutely
what I mean, when I talk about turning the world upside down
which There's nothing that I think your mom and I wouldn't
have done teachers try and get you the help and support that
you needed. And you know, for your mom and
myself to learn as much about this as as possible and to be
really good partners and parents to you through it all Whether
that's geography weather, that's time investment, you know, a
whole host of things. Gotcha.
So, what preconceptions do you have about depression anxiety?
Especially in adolescents, prior to be experiencing all that and
you and Mom playing a big role in me getting treatment.
I didn't have any experience in it before as it relates to,
teenage depression. So I like, what, like, what
preconceptions did you have? Were you like, oh, just pop into
kids or it? It's not a thing that they would
experience, or maybe like anxiety is only about like a
presentation. Like what did you think when
relating to adolescents? What did you believe about
depression and anxiety? I think I'd have to say from
being just brutally honest with myself.
When I say this is that I guess based on my behavior that I
probably didn't think that it was possible for a young girl to
be so severely impacted by depression and anxiety.
In the manner that you were, and I say this because obviously, I
quickly learned, you know, kind of bad as what, once we figured
out what was actually going on. I think I tried to do a 180 to
really educate myself and to just learn as much as I could.
But I'd have to say that before that moment, while I have, you
know, kind of an experience with through my father, understanding
what depression is like, in adults.
And, and when I was growing up, My mom always told me about the
depression that my father had and that it started for him when
he became an adult when he went off to college.
And so in my mind, I think it's fair to say that.
I just assumed that depression really can't show up until you
become an adult. And clearly that is not the
case. And so when you first presented
symptoms of anxiety and depression, I think, at first,
your mom and I thought that, oh, this is just sort of the
challenging. Years and and, you know, just
some obstinance and some nervousness that are just part
of being a teenage teenager and that's where we started.
And so I think it's fair to say that, I didn't appreciate that,
but it was even possible for a 14 year old girl to be so
profoundly depressed and anxiety ridden in the manner that you
were. And keep in mind, I don't think
this showed up 100% on day one. Yeah, felt like it was a gradual
onset and so, in those early station, the minimum.
Yeah, so that's right. It's a recognition that there is
truth in what the person is experiencing.
But I think that that parents either because of fear.
They don't know what to do with often.
Blame the child, hey, stop being lazy, get out of bed.
Yeah, you've got everything in the world.
Why do you know, like, what more could you need from us and all
of that sort of stuff? I'm so, so that, that it would
be a, you know, sort of a validation of curiosity, a
slowing down and on attacking Just being, you know, just
accepting that this is. I know it's hard but it often
gets to it will often get to Healing much quicker than simply
attacking. Yeah, I know my mom struggled
with that for a long time because she was like I just want
her to like get in the car and go somewhere.
And then she's like, how is it helping?
If I'm like, yes, I see you in pain.
And yes, it's suffering because a lot of the time, it's like,
how can I get out of this little mini crisis?
How can I keep moving? And not just look at the big
picture and now my dad and I Laughs when he's like I really
tried to like play classical music as loud as possible to get
you out of bed and I don't know why I thought that would work
but he just didn't know. He didn't understand it and it
took that Curiosity and asking those questions and then that
acknowledgement and growth together for him to understand
and for us to all move past that.
But yeah, so if that's what you tell parents, what would you
tell teenagers are anyone that suffering from mental illness?
Well, I think a few things one is, I want them.
To let me know about what it is that they're experiencing and
suffering. It's so like I think too many
professionals like somebody comes in and says I'm depressed
and say okay well you're depressed you is take this
pillow like I don't you tell you what what you need but I but I
really believe that I have to it has to come from within you like
this is my experience so that I am not going to judge.
I'm just going to listen. I'm going to understand to the
extent that I can. I'm going to hear you out and
and ask you what it is that you want to change how it is that
you want to live your life. And if what you're doing, Right
now is this is changing your state of suffering and if it
isn't changing your state of suffering, maybe you can do
something else. Now I don't know that as the
thing that you're going to do is going to make things better,
maybe it does or maybe it doesn't, but it's going to be
different, you know, the whole saying that of insanity is doing
the same thing over and over again and expect.
Yeah, salt in a sec saying okay but you're stuck in this Loop of
suffering, you can do something different so but that that but I
have to work. Came to put it to to say, aye,
you have to want to change this and I will work with you to want
to change it, but you've also got the freedom to not want to
change this and and trying to force you to change something
that you at this point in time. They want to change.
Doesn't make any sense to me. So so I will be here, but I will
be here. So when you go home and I don't
think that things are going to change, but when you go home and
they don't, if you want to All me up in a month's time.
I'm still going to be here, that's what I say.
Yeah, no, I love that. So to our questions, one is what
we used to do when everyone did their goodbyes from intensive
which is what's your DVD favorite?
DBT skill and why? Yeah, so I you know I mean I
know that people tease me a lot actually I just opened up a an
Instagram account and so I have no idea my own children.
Laugh at me because they say I have met Jesus to them but
somebody's hey, Mom to she So bad at all that.
Yeah, well that's it. So so the so that was nobody had
posted a dream about like what it looks like when I am doing
mindfulness. So I love my numbers.
I think it's the skill that I don't know.
Keeps me most grounded kisi most present.
He seemed most connected most true most authentic and yeah.
So that's that's the one I use most and then probably opposite
action. So opposite action is that when
I'm feeling miserable and I'm doing something that's keeping
me miserable. Well, I do something.
I actually caught a different action just because I, you know,
what's the opposite of lying in bed is sitting in a chair
opposite to lying in bed. Yeah, around the opposite.
You know, so I just think it's different action from what you
do. So those are my two favorites.
Not rolling over and sleeping on the other side like a little.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So the last one is pretty big,
but what do you want to get out here like on this podcast?
What do you want people to take away from you and just know from
your expertise in your opinion? Well, you know what?
I want them to take is I wish that they knew you were in you
and when I first knew you and and I wish this is such a mess.
I wish that they could see you because because, because each
and every day, when I see stories of success of
improvement, Aunt of like taking your life and owning it, it just
brings me, joy beyond anything and I'm so that's what I'd want
them is just, you know, like they can know you what you were
like then that you know, you can tell this story.
But but but you that's I think that, you know, your the
exclamation point at the end of this podcast.
Yeah, no. I that's kind of why I started
it because I again was the firmest believer that nothing
would ever change for me. And I just didn't believe it.
I didn't think it was possible. And I, when I got to the point
where I was like, wait, this is what everyone's talking about,
where you experience joy and you look forward to things and you
have people around you that you love.
And I was like, I got to tell someone about this because if I
the first thing that like had no faith that this would happen if
it happened to me than anyone can do it.
So yeah this wonderful you know the path is never going to be a
smooth all the time. It will be bumpy but At least
they're your bumps and their bumps, that you know, how to
manage when the grumpiness sets in, when every look, it's okay.
It's okay? Yeah.
And I think that was like something that was crazy for me,
when I would feel depressed, because I would immediately go
into, oh no, I don't know what to do.
Like this is off like this, I was like, wait, right, but I got
through this and I'll do this again.
Well, that's the thing is that you've gotten through the worst
moments of your life, thousands of times, you know.
Yeah. Here you are.
You know, you've got them. Yeah.
Here you are. Yeah, that was the same thing
with And he started because I was like staying inside all the
time. Like this is the worst thing I
could do for myself. And I was like, wait, I did
this. Like I stayed at residential and
I stayed in the hospital and I've done this before.
I know how to cope and do this, and still be happier than us.
So, yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. I was like, I have the perfect
special skill set for this quarantine and shelter in place
because I've done it. Well, thank you so much for
coming on and answering my questions.
Yeah, of course. If you enjoyed this week's
episode of nevertheless, she persisted.
Please leave a review on Apple. Casts and share with your
friends and family to stay updated on new episodes,
dropping and bonus content following, their fleshy
persisted on social media, Instagram at, she persisted
podcast Twitter at persist podcast Facebook at
nevertheless. She persisted podcast with Sadie
sign and check out my website. She persisted, podcast.com, and
don't worry. All of these are linked in
today's episode. Let's don't forget to subscribe
and I'll see you next Friday, and I can This thing that's just
kind of what I wanted to do. I want you brocade sorry that I
didn't. Yes, where did I stop right?
After talking about business podcasts?
Okay, yes. So I listen to a lot of business
podcast and just kind of podcast about mindset and I was like,
okay, is these people can do it? Why can't I I think we all have
a story to tell and that's basically what I want to start
my podcast but As far as the name goes, I remember it was
back in October of 2019. I was dating a guy and my friend
told me or actually, I was dating a guy.
And I was telling her about my relationship with him and to be
honest, it like wasn't, it wasn't all the bad.
Yeah, been healthy. We had terrible communication
and I remember she just kind of looked at me and then she was
like it ain't it sis and that's all The name because that's
really stuck with me. Yeah.
Yeah, this this isn't it and I kind of apply that to my podcast
and I really focus on kind of the different redirections and
like pivots that we all have in life.
Because I mean, regardless of who you are, we all have like
one thing at least one thing. I mean, granite, a lot of people
have more than one. Yes.
But we all have that one thing that really kind of set on this
on a different path in life. And I just kind of like, To
interview people and talked about it and talked about their
own. It ain't it says moment.
So, that's just like a little bit of what my podcast is about
and why Surya, I love that and especially just from like a
reflection to standpoint when you're looking at your life and
you're like, okay, what is it? That ain't it at the moment.
And when you change those things, when you make those
shifts, that's how you end up, living a life that you love.
That's how you end up, truly waking up every day.
And being like, I'm excited for what comes next and how you move
out of that place of depression, or anxiety, or Whatever mental
health stress, kind of educating yourself that life can be
different and then accepting that your life isn't where you
want it to be. And that's and that's scary
because like you said all these 60 and 70 year olds are like, my
life has passed me by, I don't recognize the life I'm living
and I don't know how it got here and it can be the same thing
with mental illness. Which is you didn't, you didn't
know, it could be different and you didn't recognize how you got
to this extreme low. You don't know how to get out of
it. It's so so scary.
When you realize what a low, you're at even more scary than
When you start going down, that slippery slope and and going
towards that load, because it's gradual, but that Rock Bottom.
When you're like, holy shit. Like this is, this is this is
horrible and I and you're just realizing it because you've been
turning a blind eye to it for years, because it's been here
normal. But yeah, yeah, it doesn't
doesn't have to be your normal. That's freaking.
Exactly. And it just takes the awareness
of that of that fact that it doesn't have to be this way.
And right now you're choosing to have it be that way and that's
also more power to you because you can choose To stay in that
low and and although you can argue that some parts of mental
illness are out of your control like the biological component.