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Hi, hello. 
Welcome back to nevertheless. 

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She persisted a podcast with 
Shady Side. 

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Today, I'm here to Kayla. 
Hello. 

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And we're going to talk about 
anxiety and worries, and what 

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it's like to have anxiety 
experiences. 

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All That Jazz. 
Oh, the fun things. 

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So I'm 16, I'm 15. 
Yeah! 

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Tell me a little bit brief bit 
about yourself, so I grew up in 

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Texas and I've lived my entire 
life there. 

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My parents got divorced, 
whenever I was in fifth grade. 

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Aid and my mom is still 
currently living in the house 

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that I came home from the 
hospital too. 

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So yeah, I don't know. 
My world has been pretty small 

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up until the past year whenever 
I like started my whole 

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treatment Journey like going to 
outpatient and then Wilderness. 

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And now here at a boarding 
school. 

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So yeah, cool. 
I thought I should be just 

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started beginning. 
Yeah, sure what is like? 

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Your first memory of like being 
anxious or having anxiety about 

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something that we think these 
are so funny because they're 

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like over the worst things ever 
whenever I was in like 

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kindergarten. 
I remember being like the coming

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home from school and telling my 
mom about all these cool girls 

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who have like cool clothing and 
like me, wanting to be like them

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and And small things like that. 
Like, I'm a role on. 

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Go got an iPod for and one for 
Easter eggs. 

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I think and I was like, oh cool.
I know it is Easter, it looks 

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like it's really stupid, but I 
was like, I'm jealous. 

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I just want to be them and she 
was like like you need to be 

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yourself and I was like, but I 
want myself to be them. 

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Yeah. 
So that's probably like my first

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dosage of me. 
Not being comfortable with 

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myself and be like wanting to be
other people, which I consider 

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anxiety. 
Yeah. 

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Yeah, I know when I was really, 
I think it was like, first 

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grade, but I had a group of 
friends and it was like, when 

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people are starting to sleep 
over, as I was like, only one 

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year into this school, but this 
girl like major Disney fanatic, 

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like Disneyland, every weekend. 
All that kind of stuff. 

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And she's like, are having a 
sleepover and I was like, Okay. 

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And she was like, it's on like 
Tuesday or something which was 

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like a school night and I was 
like, okay, and she was like, 

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it's going to be so fun. 
We're gonna camp in the backyard

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and we're going to put balloons 
on top of the tent. 

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And we're going to fly to 
Disneyland like an up. 

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And then we'll wake up. 
And we'll go skiing and sing 

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with the Chipmunks from the 
squeak walls and I was like, 

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okay, okay, I'm coming. 
Yes. 

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All right, and I like went home 
and I was like, Mom She's having

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I don't chase a name. 
Go for it. 

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I was like, Mom MacKenzie's like
having the sleepover like I my I

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have to go. 
And she was like I haven't heard

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anything about it. 
Like I haven't gotten an email 

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and I was like, literally, in 
the first grade like no one 

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goes, someone's house. 
The parents have communicated, 

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and I was like, she told me, 
like she said, it's happening. 

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We're going in the tent to 
Disneyland. 

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Like, I have to be at the 
sleepover mom on, and she was 

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like, I'm sorry, like you can't 
go unless I hear something about

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it. 
And so I remember going to 

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school and I say and I was just 
so anxious that people are going

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to be going. 
And I wasn't, I had to like tell

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them, I think I can't go to the 
sleepover and I was just like so

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upset about it. 
Um, but the And then a couple 

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days later I was talking about 
it with my other friend who's 

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supposed to go, and she was 
like, you know, my mom said I 

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could go also. 
But then, your mom talked to, 

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MacKenzie's, mom, and 
MacKenzie's mom had no idea. 

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So, then she was calling all 
these moms. 

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And I almost showed up at her 
house for no reason, and I was 

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like, okay, so there was no 
flight to Disneyland, but I had 

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hope. 
Yes. 

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Yes, that was a really long 
story. 

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So I was anxious that I'd be 
like missing out on how to tell 

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people and I couldn't do 
something like that again. 

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I did it for MO is real. 
Yeah. 

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Missing out is like totally a 
thing. 

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Yeah. 
And it's like I like hate that 

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term so much because you yeah, 
you always think of it as like, 

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oh, fear of like Peter to see 
people hanging out but like 

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whatever I get that. 
I'm like literally sitting in 

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the same room and I'm like I'm 
just not like yeah, yeah yeah 

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for me it's like anything. 
I'm from like I don't know, 

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going to restaurant and like 
seeing my friends hanging out 

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without me or like I don't know.
They're they're all like, 

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simultaneously not texting me. 
And I'm like, they're totally 

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like talking about me on a 
different group chatter, 

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something or even like, sitting 
in the same room with him and 

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they're having a conversation 
about something that I have 

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nothing. 
Like, I don't know anything 

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about. 
Yeah. 

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So yeah, you wait on me every 
single flavor of social anxiety.

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That could possibly exist is 
present. 

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There's for me, I never really I
realized like what I was having 

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was anxiety, until after first 
time, I was in the hospital. 

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Because before then I was just 
like, in like a consultative, 

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like, numbness and depression. 
And then, after that, I 

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understood what was going on. 
So, it lifted, like I wasn't 

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just like numb and not a 
misunderstanding but I was like 

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it, immediately reverted to 
anxiety and it was constantly in

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flux. 
So I was too depressed to be. 

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Expressing are so anxious. 
It's like really didn't make a 

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whole lot of sense. 
But I just remember after that 

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point like my parents are so I 
was much more fidgety and 

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Restless anxiety, like took much
more attention from me than, 

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like it did before. 
Yeah. 

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Um, for me, like, I didn't even 
know that anxiety was like a 

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term. 
Yeah. 

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And until I was in like second 
or third grade and then Whatever

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I did figure out it was a term I
thought like this is an 

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adjective and I didn't know that
it was a lie considered a mental

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illness or something like that 
until like eighth grade. 

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Yeah, so yeah. 
Pretty late into my eggs. 

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Rice field that I even know that
it existed. 

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Yeah. 
So I feel like that was kind of 

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like I do want to say 
incapacitating but like kind of 

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limited me because I thought 
that it was a normal thing. 

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That just no one talked about 
which kind of played to me 

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having like, really, really 
struggled throughout my life 

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with like sharing, my emotions 
and being vulnerable with 

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people. 
Yeah, so yeah. 

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What'd like that anxiety. 
Look like for you like, what did

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that feel? 
Like it presented in so many 

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ways? 
It would be like me struggling 

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to wake up at four School in the
mornings? 

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It would be because you were 
like to anxious. 

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You were anxious about legal 
happened at school. 

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Of the thing. 
Yeah, like me, avoiding 

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schoolwork. 
And then me getting extremely 

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anxious about having to tell my 
teachers that I didn't do my 

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homework. 
So, an obvious solution in my 

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eyes was just not go to school, 
and then I would miss more, and 

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then it would just be like this 
terrible. 

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Yeah, we're spiral. 
And then my social life, I just 

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constantly assume that everyone 
hated me at all times. 

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Which I convinced myself was so,
I wouldn't ever be disappointed 

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in quotes. 
Yeah, but in reality is that one

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before. 
Yeah, back it. 

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The worst something better is 
always gonna happen. 

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Totally. 
But I just like live the life of

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disappointment and sadness and 
fear. 

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Yeah. 
And never really had any true 

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friends because I never really 
trusted anyone to ask for what 

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you need and what you want. 
And ask and have asking a 

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request or having our quest for 
someone might be part of that. 

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So everyone is entitled to 
advocate for themselves and ask 

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for write something. 
Okay? 

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So going back to the first one. 
I gave you, where, it's Miss 

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that and you like say that 
you're saying this, I don't 

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deserve to get what I want or 
need. 

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How would you challenge that if 
you have that thought, like, oh,

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here's a good example today, we 
order takeout because on 

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counters are getting resealed 
and I was pretty, I was pretty 

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pushy. 
I was like Ruby, we are going to

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create fun. 
We're not going to get Barracuda

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or t. 
Plus like I really want to get 

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great fight and you said This is
happening again, it doesn't 

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matter what I want because 
you're just going to get angry. 

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So we're going to do what you 
want. 

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So that's you pretty much having
that belief that you don't 

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deserve to get what you want or 
what you need. 

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So how would you challenge that 
belief? 

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I am allowed to ask for 
something that I would want or 

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need. 
And I am not allowed to be like 

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pushed around by other people 
and their. 

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Yeah. 
And they're like requests and 

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stuff. 
So like you're challenging that 

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by saying I have wanted me. 
It's and that's valid, and 

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that's okay. 
And that's part of being human. 

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You have questions you want 
answered about therapy, 

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depression or anxiety, email 
Sadie's, time dot NS P at 

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gmail.com or reach out via 
direct messages on any of the 

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nevertheless. 
She persisted social media 

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accounts linked in today's 
episode notes. 

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You can also leave a voice 
message on anger. 

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I would love to hear from you. 
Okay. 

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The last one that I'm going to 
do is actually there's two more 

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that I think are really good. 
One of them is I must be really 

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in Adequate. 
If I can't fix this myself and I

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can challenge that by saying I 
can't fix everything myself and 

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it's okay to ask for help from 
other people, is there another 

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way you would challenge that. 
Yeah, like it's okay to ask for 

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help on something because as 
humans, everyone IO makes 

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mistakes, you are isn't able to,
you know, complete everything. 

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There is no perfect person 
around the world so everyone is 

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able to. 
Yeah, try it on. 

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Okay. 
And the last challenge for the 

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last myth we're going to 
challenge is You see the problem

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is just in my head if I would 
just think differently, I 

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wouldn't have to bother everyone
else and I would challenge this 

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by saying to be effective. 
Sometimes I need help thoughts 

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are very hard to change. 
How else would you charge that 

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Ruby? 
Yeah, I would say like wait one 

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of the ground. 
Obviously, the problem is just 

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in my head, if I would think 
differently, I wouldn't have to 

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bother anybody. 
Anybody else. 

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Well, one thing that really 
stands out to me, there is like 

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having to bother someone else, 
like you're not bothering them, 

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you're just getting what you 
need and asking for it. 

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And then, if the problems just 
in your head, I mean, sometimes 

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that is true. 
But other times, it really isn't

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a need to just talk about it. 
So like As Yang for your help. 

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Okay? 
Okay. 

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So for the rest of the episode, 
this overview on interpersonal, 

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Effectiveness. 
We're going to talk about 

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clearing price clarifying, 
priorities and goals and your 

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interpersonal situation. 
And next episode, we're going to

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do the dear man scale and the 
episode. 

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After that, we'll do give and 
fast. 

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So clarify my priorities and 
interpersonal situations So 

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freebie, I want you to think 
about. 

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I want to thank you to think 
about a situation that created a

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problem for you. 
Maybe you're like values, are 

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your wishes from being restrict 
respected? 

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You wanted someone to change 
something you wanted to say no 

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etcetera, Etc. 
What's a situation that we could

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use um a situation where I 
wasn't getting what I need or a 

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situation? 
Where problem arose for you for 

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me? 
The other person necessarily it 

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can be the other person, okay? 
Um, one example of a situation 

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like that would be when I was 
this a random problem. 

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You're like yeah, just a 
situation that your values 

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weren't respected. 
You wanted someone to do 

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something differently. 
You needed to say, no. 

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Oh, I got into a disagreement 
with my friend at school and she

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wouldn't apologize and I Felt a 
little bit just respected 

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because I had apologized to her 
and she, yeah, done as I had 

228
00:12:39,600 --> 00:12:42,300
requested, which were they? 
So you needed a repair in that 

229
00:12:42,300 --> 00:12:44,700
situation from someone else. 
Okay. 

230
00:12:45,000 --> 00:12:47,000
So what was the prompting of 
that? 

231
00:12:47,500 --> 00:12:52,200
Like, what made the surprise, 
who did, what to whom, what led 

232
00:12:52,200 --> 00:12:54,200
up to it? 
What about the situation is the 

233
00:12:54,200 --> 00:12:58,500
problem for you? 
She had told one of her other 

234
00:12:58,500 --> 00:13:02,200
friends, that I was like saying 
mean stuff to other people, 

235
00:13:02,300 --> 00:13:05,700
which didn't happen. 
And I was like very confused and

236
00:13:05,700 --> 00:13:08,300
got a little fresh and was like,
hey why would you go around 

237
00:13:08,300 --> 00:13:10,200
saying that? 
And I just immediately accused 

238
00:13:10,200 --> 00:13:12,500
her of that which I probably 
shouldn't have done. 

239
00:13:12,500 --> 00:13:16,800
I should have gone in it with 
just some more calmness and then

240
00:13:16,800 --> 00:13:20,400
she kind of defended herself 
immediately as like very 

241
00:13:20,400 --> 00:13:24,600
understandably is that I didn't 
do that but I had had like three

242
00:13:24,600 --> 00:13:28,400
other people tell me she had. 
So then I said, hey I'm really 

243
00:13:28,400 --> 00:13:31,600
sorry. 
I didn't if it felt like I was 

244
00:13:31,600 --> 00:13:35,100
doing that I did not. 
I'm so sorry, I didn't mean to 

245
00:13:35,100 --> 00:13:37,800
do anything like that and then 
feature, maybe if you could tell

246
00:13:37,800 --> 00:13:40,300
me when it sounds like I'm doing
that and I can stop so that it 

247
00:13:40,300 --> 00:13:43,300
doesn't sound like I'm trying to
like say something mean about 

248
00:13:43,300 --> 00:13:46,200
someone else. 
So you confronted your friend 

249
00:13:46,200 --> 00:13:52,500
about talking about, you behind 
your baton and the problem for 

250
00:13:52,500 --> 00:13:56,500
you was that she'd been talking 
about you and you didn't feel 

251
00:13:56,500 --> 00:13:58,600
like there had better repair. 
Yeah. 

252
00:13:58,600 --> 00:14:03,400
Okay so we're going to talk 
about your objectives. 

253
00:14:04,000 --> 00:14:07,600
For what you want, the 
relationship and your 

254
00:14:07,600 --> 00:14:10,500
self-respect. 
So what specific result did you 

255
00:14:10,500 --> 00:14:13,200
want from this situation? 
What did you want this person to

256
00:14:13,200 --> 00:14:16,800
do stop or except in this 
situation? 

257
00:14:16,800 --> 00:14:20,700
I wanted this person to 
apologize to me after I had 

258
00:14:20,700 --> 00:14:23,900
apologized to them and then 
maybe go back and tell the 

259
00:14:23,900 --> 00:14:29,000
people who she had, you know. 
Yeah, whispered to about me that

260
00:14:29,100 --> 00:14:32,200
she was sorry that she had done 
that and then that's not true. 

261
00:14:32,200 --> 00:14:36,900
Because okay, so you To repair 
which for you met and Paula G 

262
00:14:36,900 --> 00:14:40,100
and then her circling back to 
the people and saying that would

263
00:14:40,100 --> 00:14:41,800
happen, wasn't true? 
Yeah. 

264
00:14:41,900 --> 00:14:44,900
Okay. 
So for your relationship, how 

265
00:14:44,900 --> 00:14:47,800
did you want the other person to
feel and think about you because

266
00:14:47,800 --> 00:14:49,500
of how you handled the 
interaction. 

267
00:14:50,400 --> 00:14:53,400
I would all the other person to 
think of me is, I mean return. 

268
00:14:53,400 --> 00:14:54,600
And why? 
Because I was able to like 

269
00:14:54,600 --> 00:15:00,300
handle, my emotions and like, 
interpersonally effective. 

270
00:15:00,300 --> 00:15:06,600
Yeah, but I was going to say, So
you want them to think that 

271
00:15:06,600 --> 00:15:10,200
you're mature, anything else and
it personally affected perfect. 

272
00:15:10,300 --> 00:15:12,300
Okay. 
And then, as far as your 

273
00:15:12,300 --> 00:15:16,700
self-respect, how do you want to
think or feel about yourself 

274
00:15:16,700 --> 00:15:18,700
because of how you handled the 
interaction? 

275
00:15:19,800 --> 00:15:22,600
Um, how do I want to think of 
myself? 

276
00:15:23,000 --> 00:15:26,400
I and you want to keep in mind 
that this is not dependent on 

277
00:15:26,400 --> 00:15:29,200
whether you get that repair from
the other person, no matter what

278
00:15:29,200 --> 00:15:31,100
the outcome is. 
What do you want to think and 

279
00:15:31,100 --> 00:15:33,800
feel about yourself? 
I would want to feel happy and 

280
00:15:33,800 --> 00:15:38,200
proud because happy because I 
would know that no matter what 

281
00:15:38,200 --> 00:15:40,000
she said, I knew that it wasn't 
true. 

282
00:15:40,100 --> 00:15:43,400
So I would just feel like, okay,
I know, maybe I didn't do 

283
00:15:43,400 --> 00:15:46,100
something in this situation, 
but, you know, I'm just gonna 

284
00:15:46,400 --> 00:15:52,500
not worried about it. 
I'm just gonna go on My day, and

285
00:15:52,800 --> 00:15:55,500
I feel proud of myself because I
was able to, in that moment, 

286
00:15:55,500 --> 00:16:00,600
he's my DBT skills to look at 
the disagreement in a different 

287
00:16:00,600 --> 00:16:03,200
way. 
And I've come out of it feeling,

288
00:16:03,400 --> 00:16:07,500
you know, good about it based on
the outcomes, so it's such a 

289
00:16:07,508 --> 00:16:08,300
good. 
Yeah. 

290
00:16:09,700 --> 00:16:12,400
Okay, so I want you to rank your
priorities. 

291
00:16:12,400 --> 00:16:16,300
So one is the most important to 
second, third least important. 

292
00:16:16,400 --> 00:16:20,700
So between objectives, which we 
talked about was And repair your

293
00:16:20,700 --> 00:16:24,100
relationship, which was that you
want to be seen as mature and 

294
00:16:24,100 --> 00:16:27,400
for yourself, you want to feel 
proud for how you acted? 

295
00:16:27,500 --> 00:16:31,900
What is the most important? 
What is kind of neutral? 

296
00:16:31,900 --> 00:16:34,700
And what is least important? 
I would say, the most important 

297
00:16:34,700 --> 00:16:36,100
thing would be to get their 
repair. 

298
00:16:36,200 --> 00:16:40,300
So objective number one, okay? 
The second I think would be for 

299
00:16:40,300 --> 00:16:43,800
me just some self, the self 
respect self-respect, just 

300
00:16:43,800 --> 00:16:46,900
because then in a future it's 
kind of like positive 

301
00:16:46,900 --> 00:16:48,300
reinforcement. 
I know we talked about that a 

302
00:16:48,308 --> 00:16:52,400
couple episodes ago. 
It kind of helps, it helps boost

303
00:16:52,400 --> 00:16:58,300
your self your self awareness in
your ability to be you know your

304
00:16:58,300 --> 00:17:01,000
ability be proud of how the way 
you handled it. 

305
00:17:01,000 --> 00:17:03,700
And I'm third probably the 
relationship but not to say 

306
00:17:03,700 --> 00:17:04,599
that. 
I don't value their 

307
00:17:04,599 --> 00:17:06,500
relationship. 
Yeah absolutely of course and 

308
00:17:06,500 --> 00:17:12,400
you're just Just think, how do 
you want to approach this 

309
00:17:12,400 --> 00:17:16,400
situation? 
So you are first and foremost, 

310
00:17:16,400 --> 00:17:18,700
you're going into this 
situation, wanting the repair 

311
00:17:18,700 --> 00:17:21,300
second. 
You want to make sure that you 

312
00:17:21,300 --> 00:17:24,500
feel good about yourself and 
you're proud of how you acted. 

313
00:17:24,500 --> 00:17:27,400
And third you want to be seen as
mature and respectful. 

314
00:17:27,900 --> 00:17:32,600
So, is there any like imbalances
or conflicts between your 

315
00:17:32,600 --> 00:17:35,500
priorities, that make it hard to
be effective with your 

316
00:17:35,500 --> 00:17:37,400
objective? 
Your goal of getting your 

317
00:17:37,400 --> 00:17:41,500
objective in this situation? 
The only thing, I feel like 

318
00:17:41,500 --> 00:17:44,500
guilty about asking that from 
her, is there anything like 

319
00:17:44,500 --> 00:17:46,400
that? 
I think that the only thing I 

320
00:17:46,400 --> 00:17:50,900
would feel that would like 
between my first objective, my 

321
00:17:50,900 --> 00:17:53,800
self-respect and my first 
objective, which would be the 

322
00:17:53,800 --> 00:17:58,000
repair would be me not fully 
getting that repair. 

323
00:17:58,000 --> 00:18:01,200
But just going straight to 
feeling very proud of my 

324
00:18:01,600 --> 00:18:03,200
accomplishment for using my 
skills. 

325
00:18:03,200 --> 00:18:06,300
Yeah, and then not recognizing 
that, I still do need something 

326
00:18:06,300 --> 00:18:09,400
from the other person in order 
to reach my second goal. 

327
00:18:09,600 --> 00:18:10,000
Yeah. 
Yeah. 

328
00:18:10,000 --> 00:18:12,600
And then later so maybe you 
would forget that. 

329
00:18:12,600 --> 00:18:17,400
Your first goal is the objective
and the moment get consumed with

330
00:18:17,400 --> 00:18:21,000
the happiness around your 
self-respect being met. 

331
00:18:21,000 --> 00:18:22,300
Yeah, gotcha. 
Okay. 

332
00:18:26,900 --> 00:18:30,100
But then also like making sure 
she feels the same about home. 

333
00:18:30,100 --> 00:18:32,200
I feel ya, okay, that was 
awesome. 

334
00:18:32,200 --> 00:18:36,200
That was perfect. 
Yeah, I'm okay. 

335
00:18:36,300 --> 00:18:40,200
This is actually kind of funny. 
So this I did 12 days after I 

336
00:18:40,208 --> 00:18:44,500
got to through East and I filled
this out for when you and Mom 

337
00:18:44,500 --> 00:18:46,500
and Dad relate to come, visit 
me, do you remember when you 

338
00:18:46,500 --> 00:18:48,200
brought me dinner? 
And we sat in the fish bowl, 

339
00:18:48,400 --> 00:18:51,300
okay? 
So I said it's the same activity

340
00:18:51,300 --> 00:18:55,800
that we just did with Ruby but I
did this February 26. 2008 came 

341
00:18:55,900 --> 00:18:58,500
to the prompting of Was that 
parents and siblings relate to 

342
00:18:58,500 --> 00:19:01,000
visit? 
It was from they were there from

343
00:19:01,000 --> 00:19:03,100
5:00 to 7:00 instead of from 4 
to 6. 

344
00:19:04,000 --> 00:19:07,000
So what in the situation was a 
problem was that I was anxious. 

345
00:19:07,000 --> 00:19:09,500
I was feeling hopeless, worry 
lonely and depressed. 

346
00:19:09,500 --> 00:19:12,200
So checking the facts. 
It was a misunderstanding about 

347
00:19:12,200 --> 00:19:14,900
time and it was on an honest 
mistake that have been made. 

348
00:19:15,100 --> 00:19:18,600
So even though I felt so upset, 
you guys were late, it was an 

349
00:19:18,600 --> 00:19:20,700
honest mistake no 
miscommunication in time. 

350
00:19:21,400 --> 00:19:24,100
So I said, what specific results
I want. 

351
00:19:24,100 --> 00:19:27,700
I said I wanted to communicate 
to how That being late made me 

352
00:19:27,700 --> 00:19:33,500
feel to them and get an apology 
as well as validating for the 

353
00:19:33,500 --> 00:19:35,500
relationship. 
I wanted to be seen a skillful 

354
00:19:35,500 --> 00:19:38,100
and having good communication. 
And for my self-respect, I 

355
00:19:38,100 --> 00:19:41,600
wanted to feel good productive 
and that my private priorities 

356
00:19:41,600 --> 00:19:43,800
were met and that I prioritized 
well. 

357
00:19:43,800 --> 00:19:47,400
So I hurt eyes, my self-respect,
then the objective, and then the

358
00:19:47,400 --> 00:19:50,500
relationship the amounts of in 
complex for that. 

359
00:19:51,300 --> 00:19:53,900
I waited to bring this up again.
I don't want to communicate my 

360
00:19:53,900 --> 00:19:54,700
emotions. 
I thought. 

361
00:19:54,700 --> 00:19:56,500
So, I don't know if I ever 
actually said any of this to you

362
00:19:56,500 --> 00:19:56,900
guys. 
Guys. 

363
00:19:57,200 --> 00:19:58,900
No. 
But I did fill out the 

364
00:19:58,900 --> 00:20:01,300
worksheet. 
See about that interaction cats.

365
00:20:01,300 --> 00:20:03,100
Not So yeah. 
So that was kind of fun. 

366
00:20:03,200 --> 00:20:09,400
Yeah, yes. 
So really quickly, a review 

367
00:20:09,800 --> 00:20:13,100
about what we just talked about,
which is clarifying goals. 

368
00:20:14,300 --> 00:20:18,100
So, objective Effectiveness is 
getting what you want from other

369
00:20:18,100 --> 00:20:20,100
person. 
So, it's obtaining a right, it's

370
00:20:20,100 --> 00:20:22,600
getting another person to do 
something that you want to do. 

371
00:20:22,600 --> 00:20:25,500
It's saying no to an unwanted or
unreasonable request. 

372
00:20:25,500 --> 00:20:28,500
It's resolving interpersonal 
conflict, and getting your 

373
00:20:28,500 --> 00:20:30,800
opinion of you taken. 
Seriously, some questions you 

374
00:20:30,800 --> 00:20:33,400
might ask are what specific 
result, or changes to where I 

375
00:20:33,408 --> 00:20:36,600
want from this interaction. 
And what do I have to do to get 

376
00:20:36,600 --> 00:20:38,200
these results and what will 
work? 

377
00:20:38,700 --> 00:20:41,100
So, relationship Effectiveness 
is keeping improving the 

378
00:20:41,100 --> 00:20:43,700
relationship. 
So it's acting in such a way 

379
00:20:43,700 --> 00:20:46,300
that That the other person keeps
like am respecting you, it's 

380
00:20:46,300 --> 00:20:49,100
bouncing your immediate goals 
with the good of the long-term 

381
00:20:49,100 --> 00:20:54,100
relationship. 
And maintaining whatever 

382
00:20:54,100 --> 00:20:57,000
relationships for matter to you 
because the questions you'll ask

383
00:20:57,000 --> 00:20:59,400
yourself is how do I want the 
other person to feel about me 

384
00:20:59,400 --> 00:21:02,400
after the interactions over 
regardless of the result? 

385
00:21:02,800 --> 00:21:06,300
And what do I have to get or 
keep in this relationship? 

386
00:21:07,900 --> 00:21:11,000
So for self respect Factor - 
you're keeping your improving 

387
00:21:11,000 --> 00:21:13,000
self-respect, so you're 
respecting your own values and 

388
00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:15,400
beliefs, you're acting in a way 
that makes you feel more. 

389
00:21:15,900 --> 00:21:18,600
It acting in a way that makes 
you feel capable and effective. 

390
00:21:18,900 --> 00:21:21,800
So your questions you're asking 
yourself is how do I know what 

391
00:21:21,800 --> 00:21:24,700
to feel about myself after the 
interaction is over, regardless 

392
00:21:24,700 --> 00:21:27,500
of the outcome? 
And what do I have to do to feel

393
00:21:27,500 --> 00:21:29,800
that way about myself? 
What will be effective? 

394
00:21:30,500 --> 00:21:33,600
So, as we'll talk about in the 
next two episodes, when you're 

395
00:21:33,600 --> 00:21:35,700
trying to get objective 
Effectiveness, you using the 

396
00:21:35,700 --> 00:21:37,600
skill called dear man, when 
you're doing. 

397
00:21:37,800 --> 00:21:41,000
You're using skills called give 
and thank and when you're 

398
00:21:41,400 --> 00:21:43,900
prioritizing, self-respect, 
you're using a scale called 

399
00:21:43,900 --> 00:21:45,700
fast. 
So, now that we know how to 

400
00:21:45,700 --> 00:21:48,800
clarify, what our goal is and 
decide what we want to focus on 

401
00:21:49,500 --> 00:21:51,800
next episode, we're going to 
learn the skills that you can 

402
00:21:51,800 --> 00:21:55,300
Implement those goals and chewy 
be effective. 

403
00:21:55,500 --> 00:21:58,200
Awesome sounds great. 
So thank you for coming on today

404
00:21:58,200 --> 00:22:00,400
Ruby. 
I'm excited for come here again.

405
00:22:00,600 --> 00:22:07,000
Yeah, Thursday yeah I might have
50 but I think I can go. 

406
00:22:07,400 --> 00:22:09,300
Okay. 
Okay, sounds good. 

407
00:22:09,800 --> 00:22:11,800
So yeah, thank you for 
listening. 

408
00:22:11,800 --> 00:22:18,400
Hopefully this was helpful and 
yeah last but definitely no like

409
00:22:18,400 --> 00:22:23,300
And subscribe. 
So, Hopefully this is how good 

410
00:22:23,400 --> 00:22:24,900
it was. 
Thank you. 

411
00:22:25,000 --> 00:22:26,000
All right. 
Bye. 

412
00:22:26,100 --> 00:22:29,700
Nevertheless. 
If you enjoyed this week's 

413
00:22:29,700 --> 00:22:32,000
episode of nevertheless, she 
persisted. 

414
00:22:32,000 --> 00:22:34,700
Please leave a review on Apple 
podcast and share with your 

415
00:22:34,700 --> 00:22:38,000
friends and family to stay 
updated on new episodes, 

416
00:22:38,000 --> 00:22:40,900
dropping and bonus content. 
Followed the nevertheless, she 

417
00:22:40,900 --> 00:22:43,200
persisted Instagram at 
nevertheless. 

418
00:22:43,200 --> 00:22:47,100
Podcast with SS, the Twitter 
account that she persisted 

419
00:22:47,100 --> 00:22:49,700
underscore SS. 
The Facebook at. 

420
00:22:49,700 --> 00:22:51,700
Nevertheless? 
She persisted podcast with 

421
00:22:51,700 --> 00:22:53,800
Sadie. 
And check out my blog. 

422
00:22:53,900 --> 00:22:57,100
Nevertheless, she persisted 
podcast with Sadie Sutton dot 

423
00:22:57,100 --> 00:23:00,400
photo dot blog, and don't worry.
All of these are linked in 

424
00:23:00,400 --> 00:23:03,200
today's episode notes. 
Don't forget to subscribe and 

425
00:23:03,200 --> 00:23:06,400
I'll see you next Friday. 
Thanks for listening PS. 

426
00:23:06,400 --> 00:22:53,800
Nevertheless, she persisted And 
check out my blog. 

427
00:22:53,900 --> 00:22:57,100
Nevertheless, she persisted 
podcast with Sadie Sutton dot 

428
00:22:57,100 --> 00:23:00,400
photo dot blog, and don't worry.
All of these are linked in 

429
00:23:00,400 --> 00:23:03,200
today's episode notes. 
Don't forget to subscribe and 

430
00:23:03,200 --> 00:23:06,400
I'll see you next Friday. 
Thanks for listening PS. 

431
00:23:06,400 --> 00:23:08,200
Nevertheless, she persisted