1 00:00:00,200 --> 00:00:04,200 Welcome to she persisted I'm your host Sadie Saxton a 19 year 2 00:00:04,200 --> 00:00:07,100 old from the Bay Area studying psychology at the University of 3 00:00:07,100 --> 00:00:10,400 Pennsylvania. She persisted is the Teen Mental 4 00:00:10,400 --> 00:00:13,800 Health podcast made for teenagers by a team in each 5 00:00:13,800 --> 00:00:15,400 episode. I'll bring you authentic 6 00:00:15,400 --> 00:00:18,300 accessible and relatable conversations about every aspect 7 00:00:18,300 --> 00:00:21,600 of mental Wellness. You can expect evidence-based, 8 00:00:21,600 --> 00:00:25,100 Tina, proof resources, coping skills, including lots of DBT, 9 00:00:25,100 --> 00:00:28,300 insights and education. In each piece of content, you 10 00:00:28,300 --> 00:00:31,700 consume, she persisted It offers you a safe space to feel 11 00:00:31,700 --> 00:00:34,800 validated and understood in your struggle while encouraging you 12 00:00:34,800 --> 00:00:37,000 to take ownership of your journey and build your life 13 00:00:37,000 --> 00:00:40,900 worth living. So let's dive in this week on 14 00:00:40,900 --> 00:00:45,700 she persisted I think that not trusting yourself can coincide 15 00:00:45,700 --> 00:00:49,400 with a void ends. If you are avoiding situations, 16 00:00:49,400 --> 00:00:52,700 if you are avoiding interactions for avoiding public speaking, 17 00:00:52,700 --> 00:00:54,800 literally whatever it is something that you are avoiding. 18 00:00:55,000 --> 00:00:56,700 You'll kind of have that thought of I can't do this. 19 00:00:56,700 --> 00:00:57,900 Like I don't trust myself to do this. 20 00:00:57,900 --> 00:01:00,100 I can't handle it. There's that lack of trust. 21 00:01:00,300 --> 00:01:01,900 You can do it. So, the more that you push 22 00:01:01,900 --> 00:01:04,200 yourself outside of your comfort zone, the more that you expose 23 00:01:04,200 --> 00:01:07,200 yourself to the thing that's making you anxious, the more you 24 00:01:07,200 --> 00:01:10,100 will trust yourself to handle that situation in. 25 00:01:10,100 --> 00:01:12,500 The more you'll trust yourself to handle any new situation or 26 00:01:12,508 --> 00:01:13,600 challenge. Hello. 27 00:01:13,600 --> 00:01:16,300 Hello, and welcome to. She persisted. 28 00:01:16,300 --> 00:01:18,300 If you're new here, my name is Sadie. 29 00:01:18,300 --> 00:01:20,300 I'm a sophomore at University of Pennsylvania, studying 30 00:01:20,300 --> 00:01:23,300 psychology, I started to persisted after a 31 00:01:23,300 --> 00:01:26,100 year-and-a-half of intensive treatment and I wanted to create 32 00:01:26,100 --> 00:01:27,700 the resource. I wish I had when I was 33 00:01:27,700 --> 00:01:30,100 struggling as a team with depression and anxiety. 34 00:01:30,200 --> 00:01:33,300 See, all of the things we're doing a rapid fire Q&A today. 35 00:01:33,300 --> 00:01:36,500 I have two tests in an essay this week so things are busy. 36 00:01:36,500 --> 00:01:38,300 We're on a time crunch. We're going to do some rapid 37 00:01:38,300 --> 00:01:42,900 fire mental, health questions. And that's the plan question 1. 38 00:01:42,900 --> 00:01:45,700 How do I cope with other people's willfulness like a lack 39 00:01:45,700 --> 00:01:49,300 of desire to use their skills. So the term willfulness is 40 00:01:49,300 --> 00:01:52,300 something in DBT that kind of becomes a catch-all for when you 41 00:01:52,300 --> 00:01:55,200 are not willing to be effective, when you are having like 42 00:01:55,200 --> 00:01:57,800 personal resistance to something, so it kind of becomes 43 00:01:57,800 --> 00:02:00,600 a catch-all for when you are not willing to use your When you 44 00:02:00,600 --> 00:02:03,300 don't want to be effective, when you're feeling some personal 45 00:02:03,300 --> 00:02:06,300 resistance to doing something, if you're like I don't want to 46 00:02:06,300 --> 00:02:08,400 go there, I'm anxious. I'm not I'm not going to see 47 00:02:08,400 --> 00:02:09,900 that person. I'm not going to talk to them, 48 00:02:10,300 --> 00:02:12,800 that's being willful your there's that avoidance there. 49 00:02:13,500 --> 00:02:17,400 It's a really amazing term in a really amazing way to flag when 50 00:02:17,400 --> 00:02:20,100 something is getting in the way and when you probably should 51 00:02:20,100 --> 00:02:23,900 push yourself to do a little bit of exposure therapy, what I do 52 00:02:23,900 --> 00:02:26,500 when I come across someone that has skills and decides not to 53 00:02:26,500 --> 00:02:28,500 use them. Which Full disclaimer is me 54 00:02:28,500 --> 00:02:30,900 often? Like I think we We all have 55 00:02:30,900 --> 00:02:34,100 skills that we could be using and especially with my siblings, 56 00:02:34,100 --> 00:02:35,300 when I'm interact with my family. 57 00:02:35,300 --> 00:02:37,000 Sometimes you just choose to be willful. 58 00:02:37,200 --> 00:02:38,600 Is the most effective? No. 59 00:02:38,600 --> 00:02:41,400 But it happens, we're human. But what do you do? 60 00:02:41,400 --> 00:02:43,700 When someone else has the skills, they're choosing not to 61 00:02:43,700 --> 00:02:45,000 do them. I feel like a really great 62 00:02:45,000 --> 00:02:47,300 example of this. Sorry, younger siblings going to 63 00:02:47,308 --> 00:02:50,300 put you on. Blast is my younger brother when 64 00:02:50,300 --> 00:02:54,200 he's like, I don't want to do something and you're bothering 65 00:02:54,200 --> 00:02:55,700 me. So I'm going to annoy you as 66 00:02:55,700 --> 00:02:57,800 much as possible and they're like, taking something in your 67 00:02:57,800 --> 00:03:00,100 ear, the going above and beyond to get on your nerves. 68 00:03:00,800 --> 00:03:04,000 That's a perfect example of when you would have to be like this 69 00:03:04,000 --> 00:03:06,300 person could choose to be more effective and yet they are 70 00:03:06,300 --> 00:03:08,400 blatantly not. So what do you do in that 71 00:03:08,400 --> 00:03:10,800 situation? The first I think is totally 72 00:03:10,800 --> 00:03:14,100 flagging that and doing radical acceptance and being very aware 73 00:03:14,100 --> 00:03:18,100 of that being like, this person is choosing to not be as 74 00:03:18,100 --> 00:03:20,600 effective as they could be when it comes down to it. 75 00:03:20,600 --> 00:03:22,400 This isn't in our personal interaction. 76 00:03:22,400 --> 00:03:24,900 So we are using inner personal Effectiveness skills. 77 00:03:25,300 --> 00:03:27,400 And the foundation of interpersonal, Effectiveness is 78 00:03:27,400 --> 00:03:30,200 deciding what your objective is. Do you want to protect yourself? 79 00:03:30,400 --> 00:03:32,700 Spect, do you want to get your objective met? 80 00:03:32,800 --> 00:03:35,100 Do you want to improve the relationship if someone is 81 00:03:35,100 --> 00:03:38,100 getting on your nerves and they are being unskillful, you will 82 00:03:38,100 --> 00:03:41,400 likely either want to get your objective met or protect your 83 00:03:41,400 --> 00:03:44,000 self-respect. And I feel like in most cases it 84 00:03:44,000 --> 00:03:46,900 will, honestly be protecting yourself respect because if it's 85 00:03:46,900 --> 00:03:50,400 not a two-way street, and if both people aren't attempting to 86 00:03:50,400 --> 00:03:53,600 come to the middle, to have a compromise to both work on this 87 00:03:53,600 --> 00:03:55,900 issue, my goal would be to leave. 88 00:03:55,900 --> 00:03:58,800 The situation saying, I did everything I could I was a 89 00:03:58,808 --> 00:04:01,700 skillful as possible. Ball is in their Court, there's 90 00:04:01,700 --> 00:04:03,700 nothing more. I can do that would probably be 91 00:04:03,700 --> 00:04:06,500 what I would want to do and to me, that is defined as 92 00:04:06,500 --> 00:04:08,600 self-respect. So I would think of the moment 93 00:04:08,600 --> 00:04:11,800 and say, my objective, maybe you're asking them to do 94 00:04:11,800 --> 00:04:16,000 something, you're asking them to do a favor, they're objecting, 95 00:04:16,000 --> 00:04:18,800 they're being rude about it, they're giving you attitude. 96 00:04:19,399 --> 00:04:22,200 How are you going to respond when they are being willful? 97 00:04:22,200 --> 00:04:23,900 You're going to do to your man. You're going to say this is the 98 00:04:23,907 --> 00:04:26,300 situation, this is what I would like to happen. 99 00:04:26,300 --> 00:04:27,700 This is how it's going to benefit you. 100 00:04:27,700 --> 00:04:30,200 I know this is a big cast excetera, Etc. 101 00:04:30,400 --> 00:04:32,800 Yeah. And then you are going to accept 102 00:04:32,800 --> 00:04:34,200 that. You did everything, you could to 103 00:04:34,207 --> 00:04:38,500 be effective and that if they choose not to do it, that's not 104 00:04:38,500 --> 00:04:41,200 a reflection of you. And a lot of self-validation 105 00:04:41,200 --> 00:04:44,800 around that that I did, what I could, I try to be effective, I 106 00:04:44,800 --> 00:04:47,800 used my skills and this is not a reflection of me, it's 107 00:04:47,800 --> 00:04:50,600 reflection of them. And I think the only way that 108 00:04:50,600 --> 00:04:53,300 this could potentially go negatively, well, there are 109 00:04:53,300 --> 00:04:57,000 multiple ways, but one big way this could potentially be - is 110 00:04:57,000 --> 00:05:00,200 if you see them being ineffective and then decide to 111 00:05:00,400 --> 00:05:02,700 That around and have it be a reflection of your own skills 112 00:05:02,700 --> 00:05:04,600 usage. So they're being willful and you 113 00:05:04,600 --> 00:05:06,400 say I could have been more skillful I could have done more. 114 00:05:06,400 --> 00:05:09,500 I could have done better with yes we always can do better but 115 00:05:09,500 --> 00:05:12,800 you tried your best and so the self-validation around that and 116 00:05:12,800 --> 00:05:15,600 understanding that the ball is in their court and they didn't 117 00:05:15,600 --> 00:05:18,400 reciprocate. That was not even rapid fire. 118 00:05:18,400 --> 00:05:21,800 But that would be my answer, self validation, protect 119 00:05:21,800 --> 00:05:24,300 yourself, respect to get clear on what your objective is and 120 00:05:24,300 --> 00:05:26,700 really radically except at the balls in their court. 121 00:05:27,300 --> 00:05:30,200 Next question, how do I communicate my needs to others? 122 00:05:30,400 --> 00:05:33,100 This is tough. I struggle with this and I 123 00:05:33,100 --> 00:05:35,400 notice I'm struggling with it when I expect things from other 124 00:05:35,400 --> 00:05:39,300 people and I get irritated when they don't do what I want. 125 00:05:39,300 --> 00:05:41,900 When I've never communicated what those needs are. 126 00:05:42,600 --> 00:05:46,500 I think the best way to go about it is to really plan, really 127 00:05:46,500 --> 00:05:48,400 take some time to be intentional. 128 00:05:48,400 --> 00:05:50,800 Okay, what are my needs? And we can think about that from 129 00:05:50,800 --> 00:05:53,200 a couple of perspectives. The first one that comes to mind 130 00:05:53,200 --> 00:05:55,000 is your place skills. You have physical needs. 131 00:05:55,000 --> 00:05:56,100 Do you have to eat a certain time? 132 00:05:56,100 --> 00:05:58,300 Are you feeling hungry? And you got enough sleep? 133 00:05:58,400 --> 00:06:00,200 Do you need to exercise every day? 134 00:06:00,200 --> 00:06:01,600 So You can maintain your mental health. 135 00:06:01,700 --> 00:06:03,400 Are you sick? Do you need to take time off 136 00:06:03,400 --> 00:06:06,300 work and protect that need another need that comes to mind. 137 00:06:06,300 --> 00:06:10,500 If you are more introverted and your social battery has run out, 138 00:06:10,500 --> 00:06:12,600 that would be a need that you would need to communicate. 139 00:06:12,600 --> 00:06:15,000 If you are not getting your needs met from a validation 140 00:06:15,000 --> 00:06:17,600 perspective, you're not feeling heard, you're not feeling seen, 141 00:06:18,000 --> 00:06:20,200 you might need to communicate that need and so I would get 142 00:06:20,200 --> 00:06:21,600 very clear. You're going to have to do some 143 00:06:21,600 --> 00:06:23,100 mindfulness. You're going to see how am I 144 00:06:23,100 --> 00:06:25,700 feeling in this relationship? Where does it feel? 145 00:06:25,700 --> 00:06:28,900 Like I am not getting enough and I'm feeling resentful towards 146 00:06:28,900 --> 00:06:30,200 this other person. I think resent. 147 00:06:30,300 --> 00:06:34,300 Is a very good Telltale sign that I need isn't getting met 148 00:06:34,300 --> 00:06:37,300 you then you really have to take accountability and be like, this 149 00:06:37,300 --> 00:06:39,300 is on me. I'm resentful to this other 150 00:06:39,300 --> 00:06:41,300 person, but it's a reflection of myself. 151 00:06:41,400 --> 00:06:44,000 Either you haven't communicated the need or to need, you need to 152 00:06:44,000 --> 00:06:45,700 meet yourself and you just have to communicate to the other 153 00:06:45,700 --> 00:06:48,300 person so you can go off and get that need met. 154 00:06:48,300 --> 00:06:51,700 Like if you need space if you need time but often times you 155 00:06:51,700 --> 00:06:54,500 haven't communicated that. So it's on you, it's not on 156 00:06:54,500 --> 00:06:56,300 them. They shouldn't have known, they 157 00:06:56,300 --> 00:06:59,000 can't know. And so you have to recognize 158 00:06:59,000 --> 00:07:03,100 that and I would do A dear man, which is what you do when you 159 00:07:03,100 --> 00:07:05,300 have an objective and your objective is to communicate that 160 00:07:05,300 --> 00:07:07,500 need. And when you're doing a dear and 161 00:07:07,500 --> 00:07:10,100 you want the other person to be able to respond by saying yes or 162 00:07:10,100 --> 00:07:12,000 no. So maybe your question is like, 163 00:07:12,000 --> 00:07:13,200 does that make sense? Is it okay? 164 00:07:13,200 --> 00:07:15,000 If I take some time to myself, is it okay? 165 00:07:15,000 --> 00:07:18,100 If I go on walk, would you be open to trying to be more 166 00:07:18,100 --> 00:07:19,500 intentional about listening to me? 167 00:07:19,500 --> 00:07:21,400 Something like that. So the first thing you do is 168 00:07:21,400 --> 00:07:23,500 describe the situation. What are the facts, where the 169 00:07:23,500 --> 00:07:26,100 objective things going on? We're going to express the 170 00:07:26,100 --> 00:07:27,100 emotion. I'm feeling sad. 171 00:07:27,100 --> 00:07:30,200 I'm feeling overwhelmed. I'm not feeling heard. 172 00:07:30,300 --> 00:07:32,300 That's not really great though because you really want to stick 173 00:07:32,300 --> 00:07:34,700 to the emotion words, but you can also say those kind of like 174 00:07:35,100 --> 00:07:37,600 experiences that can't be objectively measured. 175 00:07:37,600 --> 00:07:40,100 Assert, we're going to ask our question, can I go to walk and I 176 00:07:40,100 --> 00:07:42,400 have space? Would you be more open to trying 177 00:07:42,400 --> 00:07:44,500 to be more receptive to what I'm saying? 178 00:07:44,500 --> 00:07:47,000 Whatever it is then you're going to do a little bit of 179 00:07:47,000 --> 00:07:48,900 reinforcement. So, what is in it for them? 180 00:07:48,900 --> 00:07:50,800 Like are you going to be able to be more present in the 181 00:07:50,800 --> 00:07:52,700 relationship? Are you open to meeting their 182 00:07:52,700 --> 00:07:55,200 needs? Will you be able to support them 183 00:07:55,200 --> 00:07:56,700 or whatever? They're going through? 184 00:07:56,700 --> 00:07:58,300 Let them know what's in it for them. 185 00:07:58,500 --> 00:08:01,700 Then you're going to be mindful. And to appear confident and then 186 00:08:01,700 --> 00:08:03,400 if needed you're going to negotiate and come to a 187 00:08:03,407 --> 00:08:06,000 compromise, that's a dear man. That's what I would do to 188 00:08:06,000 --> 00:08:08,100 advocate for your needs and yeah. 189 00:08:08,400 --> 00:08:11,400 Next one is, how can you cope with other people needing space 190 00:08:11,400 --> 00:08:13,500 from you? And be cool about that? 191 00:08:13,500 --> 00:08:16,900 This is really tough and I would say that something. 192 00:08:16,900 --> 00:08:19,800 I internal issei in the back of my head that whatever I'm 193 00:08:19,800 --> 00:08:22,000 getting into like an argument, The Sibling, or there's a 194 00:08:22,008 --> 00:08:25,000 conflict going on or I want to say something, is that in the 195 00:08:25,008 --> 00:08:27,500 back of your head, you should have the reminder that it's 196 00:08:27,500 --> 00:08:29,100 always going to be more effective. 197 00:08:29,100 --> 00:08:30,200 It's going to be a more successful. 198 00:08:30,300 --> 00:08:33,299 Cecil conversation if you both take time away from the 199 00:08:33,299 --> 00:08:37,900 situation and then go back to it and I on many occasions given 200 00:08:37,900 --> 00:08:41,299 the urge to get in the last word or say, what I want to to be 201 00:08:41,299 --> 00:08:43,700 sad, but when you're doing that, you're acting from an emotional 202 00:08:43,700 --> 00:08:45,700 perspective, you're not being rational, you're not being 203 00:08:45,700 --> 00:08:48,500 effective and yes, sometimes it does feel good to give in to 204 00:08:48,500 --> 00:08:51,500 those emotional needs and like, say that judgmental comment or 205 00:08:51,500 --> 00:08:53,700 whatever it is. But you just have to kind of 206 00:08:53,700 --> 00:08:55,600 weigh the pros and cons. Like, do I really want to be 207 00:08:55,600 --> 00:08:57,400 effective to? I really have an outcome here. 208 00:08:57,400 --> 00:09:00,200 That's important to me. And if yes, how am I going to 209 00:09:00,400 --> 00:09:03,100 That mat and it's probably like returning to the conversation 210 00:09:03,100 --> 00:09:05,300 later. So with that in the back of your 211 00:09:05,300 --> 00:09:09,700 mind knowing that even though you want to talk about it now at 212 00:09:09,700 --> 00:09:12,900 the end of the day for everyone, it's going to be more effective 213 00:09:12,900 --> 00:09:16,300 if you revisit it knowing that that's the most effective path 214 00:09:16,300 --> 00:09:18,700 forward. I would Implement a bit of the 215 00:09:18,700 --> 00:09:22,100 stop scale. So you are going to freeze, 216 00:09:22,100 --> 00:09:23,300 you're going to leave the situation. 217 00:09:23,300 --> 00:09:24,800 You're not going to put any thought into it. 218 00:09:24,800 --> 00:09:27,200 Like you're physically and mentally going to freeze. 219 00:09:27,500 --> 00:09:30,200 And then you're going to get yourself to go through that. 220 00:09:30,300 --> 00:09:34,200 Pros and cons list of staying talking about this or revisiting 221 00:09:34,200 --> 00:09:36,600 it later, but you need to kind of break up that emotional 222 00:09:36,600 --> 00:09:38,100 cycle. You need to break up those 223 00:09:38,100 --> 00:09:40,000 thoughts, going through your head, you need to break up the 224 00:09:40,000 --> 00:09:42,400 back and forth. And to do that, you really need 225 00:09:42,400 --> 00:09:44,600 to implement this top skills, you're freezing, mentally and 226 00:09:44,600 --> 00:09:46,600 physically. You're observing the situation, 227 00:09:46,600 --> 00:09:48,800 and then you're doing your pros, and cons, and deciding how it's 228 00:09:48,800 --> 00:09:51,200 best to proceed. And then, once you hopefully 229 00:09:51,200 --> 00:09:54,300 come to the decision that you're going to revisit it later, I 230 00:09:54,300 --> 00:09:57,200 would do some distraction, you really initially need to get out 231 00:09:57,200 --> 00:10:00,200 of that emotion mind, headspace, and then it will be really easy. 232 00:10:00,300 --> 00:10:02,700 See. Okay, like we can talk about 233 00:10:02,700 --> 00:10:05,400 this tomorrow in the world is not going to fall apart. 234 00:10:05,400 --> 00:10:08,300 We can talk about this the day after and things will continue 235 00:10:08,300 --> 00:10:10,600 in this will not impact my daily functioning. 236 00:10:10,900 --> 00:10:13,400 So you really just need to get out of that first, like 15 to 20 237 00:10:13,400 --> 00:10:15,600 minutes or you're still angry. You're still annoyed, you're 238 00:10:15,600 --> 00:10:17,800 still upset, you're still feeling insecure, whatever it 239 00:10:17,800 --> 00:10:20,100 is. So watch a TV show, talk to 240 00:10:20,100 --> 00:10:23,600 another friend, take a shower exercise, do anything to 241 00:10:23,600 --> 00:10:26,200 distract yourself, and that first 15 to 20 minutes. 242 00:10:26,500 --> 00:10:29,700 And then your thoughts will start to shift to what you know 243 00:10:29,900 --> 00:10:33,500 is Most aligned and being effective, and being willing to 244 00:10:33,500 --> 00:10:36,800 use your skills. Another question that I got is 245 00:10:36,800 --> 00:10:39,300 how can I build trust with myself and learn to trust 246 00:10:39,300 --> 00:10:41,400 myself. And this is a really interesting 247 00:10:41,700 --> 00:10:44,100 question, and when I got this, I was like I don't wanna answer 248 00:10:44,100 --> 00:10:48,400 this because I have an interesting perspective and hot 249 00:10:48,400 --> 00:10:51,400 take if you will about self-trust. 250 00:10:52,000 --> 00:10:56,300 I really am not a fan of those Tik toks and Instagram reals, 251 00:10:56,300 --> 00:10:59,700 where they're all saying you need to make promises with 252 00:10:59,700 --> 00:11:01,400 yourself. Stop breaking promises to 253 00:11:01,408 --> 00:11:03,100 yourself. No wonder your self-esteem is 254 00:11:03,100 --> 00:11:07,300 struggling or constantly breaking promises and I'm sure 255 00:11:07,300 --> 00:11:09,100 you've seen them. Listen to last week's episode 256 00:11:09,100 --> 00:11:11,500 with Bert Frank, we talked about this and why this is not the 257 00:11:11,500 --> 00:11:12,700 case. We talk about what to do when 258 00:11:12,700 --> 00:11:14,400 you're feeling stuck. And I think one thing that 259 00:11:14,400 --> 00:11:16,400 people do when they're feeling stock because they jump into 260 00:11:16,400 --> 00:11:19,200 making a promise and then they break it, she talks about using 261 00:11:19,200 --> 00:11:22,500 systems rather than setting that like promised amazing 262 00:11:22,500 --> 00:11:25,100 conversation. Go listen but the reason I think 263 00:11:25,100 --> 00:11:27,900 I feel some resistance towards the idea of keeping promises 264 00:11:27,900 --> 00:11:29,700 with yourself is the number of thoughts. 265 00:11:29,700 --> 00:11:32,900 I have In a day is insane. I don't know if this is just 266 00:11:32,900 --> 00:11:35,900 from an anxiety perspective or fall brains work this way but 267 00:11:35,900 --> 00:11:38,800 the number of commitments or ideas or things I would like to 268 00:11:38,800 --> 00:11:42,000 do is obscene. There's no way that any human 269 00:11:42,000 --> 00:11:45,000 person could keep that level of commitments and promises and 270 00:11:45,000 --> 00:11:48,200 intentions to themselves. And so, the idea that every 271 00:11:48,200 --> 00:11:50,900 single time you promised something to yourself, or you 272 00:11:50,900 --> 00:11:53,100 make a commitment, or you have an intention. 273 00:11:53,300 --> 00:11:55,100 That if you're not following through with that, you're 274 00:11:55,100 --> 00:11:58,300 disobeying your own trust that you're hurting your relationship 275 00:11:58,300 --> 00:12:00,200 with yourself. I don't really like that because 276 00:12:00,300 --> 00:12:04,000 Is it doesn't feel like it fully encapsulated the relationship of 277 00:12:04,000 --> 00:12:07,800 how we pursue goals and what makes us feel good in our 278 00:12:07,800 --> 00:12:10,000 self-esteem and how we speak to ourselves. 279 00:12:10,300 --> 00:12:14,000 I don't think it's that simple. So rather than thinking of 280 00:12:14,000 --> 00:12:17,200 self-trust from a perspective of what commitments am I keeping 281 00:12:17,200 --> 00:12:19,100 what promises am I making to myself? 282 00:12:19,100 --> 00:12:21,500 Because it's not that simple. We are interacting with 283 00:12:21,500 --> 00:12:23,900 ourselves 24/7. It's not like we're having one 284 00:12:24,000 --> 00:12:25,900 conversation and saying I promise. 285 00:12:25,900 --> 00:12:27,500 I'll go to the gym two times this week. 286 00:12:27,500 --> 00:12:31,200 Let's check in next week like With yourself all the time. 287 00:12:31,200 --> 00:12:34,300 So we can't just do that. So, rather than focusing it 288 00:12:34,300 --> 00:12:36,600 from, like, a promise. And something, I'm saying to 289 00:12:36,600 --> 00:12:40,800 myself perspective, I find self-trust from other places. 290 00:12:40,800 --> 00:12:44,300 And when I do think about, like, do I trust myself, I do, I feel 291 00:12:44,300 --> 00:12:48,400 really confident in my ability to handle situations and in my 292 00:12:48,400 --> 00:12:51,800 ability to think through things, I trust myself to navigate 293 00:12:51,800 --> 00:12:54,600 challenges to pursue new projects, Etc. 294 00:12:54,600 --> 00:12:59,500 Like to me, I do trust myself. I feel good being with myself, I 295 00:12:59,500 --> 00:13:03,100 feel, I feel happy. I feel safe being with myself 296 00:13:03,100 --> 00:13:05,800 and that's what feels like self-trust and there are a 297 00:13:05,800 --> 00:13:08,200 couple things that I think have led to that one. 298 00:13:08,200 --> 00:13:10,500 Is your ability to use your skills. 299 00:13:10,500 --> 00:13:14,700 It's a really daunting and overwhelming, and paralyzing 300 00:13:14,700 --> 00:13:17,700 experience to know that you are experiencing emotions, and 301 00:13:17,700 --> 00:13:19,800 thoughts, and urges. That you cannot control. 302 00:13:19,800 --> 00:13:23,300 You don't feel like you have the skill set to be able to cope 303 00:13:23,300 --> 00:13:25,100 with what your brain is doing to you. 304 00:13:25,100 --> 00:13:29,100 That's the most intense and terrifying thing. 305 00:13:29,100 --> 00:13:32,400 It's the definition. Mission of not trusting yourself 306 00:13:32,400 --> 00:13:36,100 to handle the situation and not having trust in your ability to 307 00:13:36,100 --> 00:13:38,600 navigate something. And what led to me, having 308 00:13:38,600 --> 00:13:41,400 self-trust in the early days of residential and in the early 309 00:13:41,400 --> 00:13:43,500 days of treatment, when I was susur, Lee, depressed, and 310 00:13:43,500 --> 00:13:45,700 anxious. And all of those things was 311 00:13:45,700 --> 00:13:49,200 having skills that worked and knowing that if I implemented 312 00:13:49,300 --> 00:13:52,400 the skill, it would lower, the intensity of my emotions. 313 00:13:52,400 --> 00:13:55,000 My thoughts would fade away. I would no longer be. 314 00:13:55,000 --> 00:13:59,400 So physically distressed the moment would pass and that I was 315 00:13:59,400 --> 00:14:01,700 having an impact. On that emotional experience. 316 00:14:01,700 --> 00:14:03,800 It wasn't just like life was running its course and I didn't 317 00:14:03,800 --> 00:14:05,500 know when this emotion was going to let up. 318 00:14:05,500 --> 00:14:07,600 I knew that the skills I was using, was impacting the 319 00:14:07,600 --> 00:14:10,100 emotion. So when it comes to that, if 320 00:14:10,100 --> 00:14:12,400 you're at the early stages, you have knows trust in your ability 321 00:14:12,400 --> 00:14:13,800 to cope. I would lean on distress 322 00:14:13,800 --> 00:14:16,400 tolerance because we know that distress tolerance is our highly 323 00:14:16,400 --> 00:14:19,400 effective and that's why we lean on those specific skills to 324 00:14:19,400 --> 00:14:21,600 tolerate distress because it's when our emotions are at their 325 00:14:21,600 --> 00:14:24,800 highest intensity possible. So it's things like ice Dives, 326 00:14:24,800 --> 00:14:27,200 it seems like the tip scale exercise. 327 00:14:27,200 --> 00:14:30,100 Distraction asking for help, those are distress tolerance. 328 00:14:30,200 --> 00:14:31,700 In skills. And we know that, if we use 329 00:14:31,700 --> 00:14:34,200 them, they will work you distract yourself from a 330 00:14:34,200 --> 00:14:36,600 thought. If you do a nice dive, your 331 00:14:36,600 --> 00:14:39,800 anxiety will go down. And so, when you start to 332 00:14:39,800 --> 00:14:42,700 practice those skills, and when you build up a track record of 333 00:14:42,700 --> 00:14:44,900 them working, you have trust, you can get through those 334 00:14:44,900 --> 00:14:47,700 situations. Then once you've implemented 335 00:14:47,700 --> 00:14:51,200 those skills that have like 100 percent Effectiveness, you then 336 00:14:51,200 --> 00:14:55,000 move to the skills that require a little bit more intention and 337 00:14:55,000 --> 00:14:57,400 execution. Things like, radical acceptance, 338 00:14:57,400 --> 00:14:59,900 things like self, validation your please skills. 339 00:15:00,200 --> 00:15:04,200 Things that require more effort on your part and more follow 340 00:15:04,200 --> 00:15:06,400 through. And again it's not a promise. 341 00:15:06,400 --> 00:15:09,000 But you have a track record of saying, I have these things in 342 00:15:09,008 --> 00:15:12,500 my toolbox and if I choose to use them, they will work and I 343 00:15:12,500 --> 00:15:17,000 have trust in my ability to execute the use of this skill. 344 00:15:17,100 --> 00:15:19,600 Intermission in this question, I'm so bad at rapid-fire. 345 00:15:19,600 --> 00:15:21,500 I just have really long answers to everything. 346 00:15:21,600 --> 00:15:24,000 So that was one of the biggest things for me was building up, 347 00:15:24,000 --> 00:15:27,400 trust in my ability to use my skills and with time trusting 348 00:15:27,400 --> 00:15:30,000 that, no matter what my emotions my brain. 349 00:15:30,200 --> 00:15:33,000 My urges throughout me, I could handle them and weather, the 350 00:15:33,000 --> 00:15:36,800 storm that gave me a lot of trust the other piece of trust, 351 00:15:36,800 --> 00:15:39,500 I would say, comes from a little bit of exposure therapy and 352 00:15:39,500 --> 00:15:42,000 putting yourself in uncomfortable situations, I 353 00:15:42,000 --> 00:15:46,000 think that not trusting yourself can coincide with avoidance. 354 00:15:46,500 --> 00:15:50,500 If you are avoiding situations, if you are avoiding interactions 355 00:15:50,500 --> 00:15:53,000 for in voiding public speaking, literally, whatever it is 356 00:15:53,000 --> 00:15:55,400 something that you are avoiding. You'll kind of have that thought 357 00:15:55,400 --> 00:15:57,300 of I can't do this. Like I don't trust myself to do 358 00:15:57,300 --> 00:15:58,400 this. I can't handle it. 359 00:15:58,400 --> 00:16:00,000 There's that lack of trust that you can do. 360 00:16:00,700 --> 00:16:02,900 The more that you push yourself outside of your comfort zone, 361 00:16:02,900 --> 00:16:04,600 the more that you expose yourself to the thing that's 362 00:16:04,600 --> 00:16:08,800 making you anxious, the more you will trust yourself to handle 363 00:16:08,800 --> 00:16:10,400 that situation in. The more you'll trust yourself 364 00:16:10,400 --> 00:16:12,700 to handle any new situation or challenge. 365 00:16:13,100 --> 00:16:14,300 So again, we're kind of reframing. 366 00:16:14,300 --> 00:16:17,900 This idea of like I'm promising myself that I'll overcome my 367 00:16:17,900 --> 00:16:20,600 fear of public speaking and I promised myself that will 368 00:16:20,600 --> 00:16:24,100 overcome social anxiety and I promise I don't be anxious and 369 00:16:24,100 --> 00:16:26,600 social situations. That's a really hard thing to 370 00:16:26,600 --> 00:16:29,100 follow through with and I really don't like that way of thinking 371 00:16:29,100 --> 00:16:31,800 about it. Instead it's more. 372 00:16:31,800 --> 00:16:35,500 What can I do to stack the evidence in my favor and show 373 00:16:35,500 --> 00:16:39,200 myself that if I use the skills I know I have I can get myself 374 00:16:39,200 --> 00:16:41,500 out of this and like I said earlier, you're not going to 375 00:16:41,508 --> 00:16:44,900 choose to use the skills 100% of the time where were willing and 376 00:16:44,900 --> 00:16:48,900 we're willful, but if you have the knowledge that I have the 377 00:16:48,900 --> 00:16:51,500 skills in my toolbox and if I use them, they will work. 378 00:16:51,500 --> 00:16:54,100 There's a lot of self-trust, they're both in the ability to 379 00:16:54,100 --> 00:16:56,700 cope with things internally and externally. 380 00:16:57,200 --> 00:16:59,600 This question is, how can I gain attention from others in a 381 00:16:59,600 --> 00:17:02,500 healthy way? This is interesting and I think 382 00:17:02,500 --> 00:17:06,700 I will more answer the flip side of it, which is, like, why do we 383 00:17:06,800 --> 00:17:08,400 look for attention in unhealthy ways? 384 00:17:08,400 --> 00:17:11,099 And I think a lot of that for me in my experience, whether it was 385 00:17:11,400 --> 00:17:13,700 with urges, the way I was expressing my emotions. 386 00:17:13,700 --> 00:17:16,900 The way I was getting validation things, like self harm, the way 387 00:17:16,900 --> 00:17:19,700 I was going about my relationship with my parents and 388 00:17:19,700 --> 00:17:23,300 therapy and all of these things that was not effective when I 389 00:17:23,300 --> 00:17:27,800 was really struggling, but it wasn't so much for attention. 390 00:17:27,800 --> 00:17:30,000 And for look at me and I want attention on me. 391 00:17:30,200 --> 00:17:33,400 Attention was a vessel through which validation was achieved. 392 00:17:33,400 --> 00:17:36,200 And all I wanted was for someone to say, I see you're in pain. 393 00:17:36,200 --> 00:17:37,500 I hear that you're not. Okay. 394 00:17:37,500 --> 00:17:39,500 And I can't even imagine what you're going through, because 395 00:17:39,500 --> 00:17:42,900 for me, 24/7 was struggling with my mental health and 396 00:17:42,900 --> 00:17:46,500 overwhelming, urges and scary thoughts, and no energy, and 397 00:17:46,500 --> 00:17:48,900 feeling isolated and all of these really overwhelming 398 00:17:48,900 --> 00:17:51,500 experiences. So all that I wanted was for 399 00:17:51,500 --> 00:17:55,400 someone else to acknowledge that and to validate me we need 400 00:17:55,400 --> 00:17:59,000 validation, we want validation. It's a fiery core Instinct and 401 00:17:59,000 --> 00:18:02,800 need So when we're looking for attention, especially with 402 00:18:02,800 --> 00:18:05,100 regards to mental health, I think a lot of that, it 403 00:18:05,100 --> 00:18:09,100 coincides with the need for validation and so if we can 404 00:18:09,100 --> 00:18:11,700 identify that, I don't necessarily just want someone to 405 00:18:11,700 --> 00:18:13,100 like look at me or pay attention. 406 00:18:13,400 --> 00:18:16,000 I want someone to say, they hear what I'm going through and they 407 00:18:16,000 --> 00:18:18,100 see I'm not okay, and they want to support me. 408 00:18:18,100 --> 00:18:21,500 So how can I get that need Matt, and it might not be her 409 00:18:21,500 --> 00:18:24,200 attention. It might be through really 410 00:18:24,200 --> 00:18:26,700 carefully communicating that you're not, okay? 411 00:18:26,700 --> 00:18:29,400 And this is what you're going through and while the other 412 00:18:29,400 --> 00:18:30,800 person won't be able to solve it for you. 413 00:18:30,800 --> 00:18:33,600 You just would love if maybe they could be in your corner and 414 00:18:33,600 --> 00:18:35,300 maybe they could be in your support system. 415 00:18:35,300 --> 00:18:37,200 And you could know that you can count on them. 416 00:18:37,400 --> 00:18:41,800 Maybe it is going to therapy and having a safe space to talk 417 00:18:41,800 --> 00:18:44,600 about all of these things and get really intense validation 418 00:18:44,600 --> 00:18:48,500 and get the acknowledgement that things aren't okay and feel like 419 00:18:48,500 --> 00:18:51,000 you are getting support and working through them. 420 00:18:51,800 --> 00:18:55,300 So with regards to attention in an unhealthy way, I think we 421 00:18:55,300 --> 00:19:00,000 need to identify what is the root cause and what is it? 422 00:19:00,200 --> 00:19:04,300 Need there is it validation is it that you're not feeling like 423 00:19:04,300 --> 00:19:06,200 you're getting your needs met from an interpersonal 424 00:19:06,200 --> 00:19:08,400 perspective? You want more interaction? 425 00:19:08,400 --> 00:19:11,800 You want more connection? It's important to I think 426 00:19:11,800 --> 00:19:16,100 deconstruct, the idea that what you're really looking for is 427 00:19:16,100 --> 00:19:19,000 attention and understand what the underlying need is and then 428 00:19:19,000 --> 00:19:22,300 understand that like if you're going from point A to point C 429 00:19:22,700 --> 00:19:25,500 maybe attention is point B, but that's not actually what the 430 00:19:25,500 --> 00:19:27,600 goal is and I think that can take away kind of some of the 431 00:19:27,600 --> 00:19:31,000 negative connotation around wanting Attention or needing 432 00:19:31,000 --> 00:19:32,900 attention. But then you can really now that 433 00:19:32,900 --> 00:19:35,700 you know what your actual goal is which is validation or more 434 00:19:35,700 --> 00:19:38,800 time with friends and family members, more time, when you're 435 00:19:38,800 --> 00:19:40,500 just talking about what you're going through. 436 00:19:40,500 --> 00:19:41,900 Now that you know what your goal is? 437 00:19:41,900 --> 00:19:44,800 You can actually aim to solve that. 438 00:19:44,800 --> 00:19:47,800 So if you're like, I assumed to be getting attention all the 439 00:19:47,800 --> 00:19:49,500 time to talk about what I'm going through and you realize, 440 00:19:49,500 --> 00:19:51,600 well, I just really feel like I'm not able to voice what I'm 441 00:19:51,600 --> 00:19:53,900 experiencing and I feel like when I'm talking things out, I'm 442 00:19:53,900 --> 00:19:57,100 able to get more clarity on what's going on inside my head. 443 00:19:57,100 --> 00:19:59,900 So you make a therapy appointment and then you are 444 00:19:59,900 --> 00:20:02,600 able Able to again create that safe space for yourself to talk 445 00:20:02,600 --> 00:20:04,900 about what you're going through. We're able to more effectively 446 00:20:04,900 --> 00:20:07,800 Target the issue. Last question is, what are some 447 00:20:07,800 --> 00:20:09,800 common things to talk about in therapy? 448 00:20:10,000 --> 00:20:12,700 Struggling to figure out what to bring up in sessions. 449 00:20:13,000 --> 00:20:14,900 This is a really great question. I don't know if I've talked 450 00:20:14,900 --> 00:20:17,500 about this on the podcast yet, but I'm not actually in regular 451 00:20:17,500 --> 00:20:21,600 therapy anymore as of this year, like the start of this school 452 00:20:21,600 --> 00:20:25,700 year, I am no longer doing weekly therapy, which is insane 453 00:20:25,700 --> 00:20:30,100 because at the beginning of my sophomore year of high school, I 454 00:20:30,100 --> 00:20:32,300 was in a therapeutic boarding school and now my sophomore year 455 00:20:32,300 --> 00:20:35,900 of college I'm not in therapy, but it's like almost four years 456 00:20:35,900 --> 00:20:38,600 exactly, from, when I was at my lowest point, mental health, 457 00:20:38,600 --> 00:20:42,600 wise and therapy, was such an amazing resource to have that 458 00:20:42,600 --> 00:20:45,600 transition to deal with all the mental health challenges of 459 00:20:45,600 --> 00:20:47,700 being at home and adopting skills. 460 00:20:48,100 --> 00:20:50,900 But when I go home, we'll do a therapy session or so with my 461 00:20:50,900 --> 00:20:53,600 therapist at home but I'm no longer doing consistently like 462 00:20:53,600 --> 00:20:57,100 weekly sessions. But my Topics in therapy have 463 00:20:57,100 --> 00:21:00,700 ranged from anything and Nothing you can ever imagine. 464 00:21:00,700 --> 00:21:02,900 Like I bring in Tech talks to my therapist. 465 00:21:03,100 --> 00:21:05,300 Like, did you see this segment on John Oliver? 466 00:21:05,700 --> 00:21:08,300 I would say there are some reoccurring themes and I think 467 00:21:08,300 --> 00:21:11,600 one is definitely family interactions and how can I be 468 00:21:11,600 --> 00:21:13,600 more effective? How do I get my needs met here? 469 00:21:13,600 --> 00:21:15,300 How do I advocate for this thing? 470 00:21:15,500 --> 00:21:18,400 Like let's problem solve this. Let's get a really clear plan in 471 00:21:18,400 --> 00:21:20,200 place of how I can have this conversation. 472 00:21:20,200 --> 00:21:22,000 Or what are your thoughts on how this went down? 473 00:21:22,400 --> 00:21:25,200 I would say another one is larger goals, I have for myself, 474 00:21:25,200 --> 00:21:29,400 so I'm like I want to try and be more social or I want to get my 475 00:21:29,600 --> 00:21:33,200 Bleep moron on track or I feel like I could be more effective 476 00:21:33,200 --> 00:21:35,700 with my study schedule and then we're like how do we problem 477 00:21:35,700 --> 00:21:38,000 solve those things? What plan can be put in place, 478 00:21:38,000 --> 00:21:40,600 what are my immediate goals? I'm really big no matter what it 479 00:21:40,600 --> 00:21:43,500 is that I'm bringing up leaving the session with one act and 480 00:21:43,500 --> 00:21:45,300 step. I'm going to take and my goal 481 00:21:45,300 --> 00:21:47,100 for that week and what I'm going to do and what I'm going to 482 00:21:47,100 --> 00:21:52,400 implement for a long time, my therapy sessions looked like 483 00:21:52,400 --> 00:21:54,500 going in. We would talk about, like, some 484 00:21:54,500 --> 00:21:57,000 crisis or problem behavior, that occurred that weeks we'd be 485 00:21:57,000 --> 00:21:58,900 like, all right, let's chain analysis. 486 00:21:58,900 --> 00:22:01,300 That's What happened? What was this? 487 00:22:01,300 --> 00:22:04,500 Huge suicidal ideation, or why did you call for skills coaching 488 00:22:04,500 --> 00:22:06,800 or like what happened with the self Harmons today and our, this 489 00:22:06,800 --> 00:22:10,300 unhealthy interaction and we would kind of work backwards and 490 00:22:10,300 --> 00:22:13,300 see what happened and then the second half would be like me 491 00:22:13,300 --> 00:22:16,700 trying to do family therapy in tears and mess arguing a whole 492 00:22:16,700 --> 00:22:19,500 thing. So now, it's more kind of a 493 00:22:19,500 --> 00:22:22,600 balance of like helped me skills wise. 494 00:22:22,600 --> 00:22:25,100 And then these are my longer-term goals or things that 495 00:22:25,100 --> 00:22:28,000 I'm thinking about, or things that I'd like to work through 496 00:22:28,400 --> 00:22:30,700 what I think, say, like things. I'm thinking about there's 497 00:22:30,700 --> 00:22:33,400 definitely certain themes of things that I might will go back 498 00:22:33,400 --> 00:22:36,500 to so like different places where my mind is going and I'm 499 00:22:36,500 --> 00:22:39,200 feeling more emotions. Tied to it arm ruminating more 500 00:22:39,500 --> 00:22:42,800 and kind of talking about like okay is this effective? 501 00:22:42,800 --> 00:22:44,700 It's not effective. It's kind of pulse this out. 502 00:22:44,700 --> 00:22:47,700 Let's walk through this, what's going on here, but it's 503 00:22:47,700 --> 00:22:49,900 important to kind of like differentiate like initially 504 00:22:49,900 --> 00:22:52,600 therapy, was a lot of Crisis problem solving and what 505 00:22:52,600 --> 00:22:55,300 happened this week? Let's recap that not really even 506 00:22:55,300 --> 00:22:58,500 any time to go into these larger issues or problems solve for the 507 00:22:58,500 --> 00:23:01,400 future. And now it's a lot more of that 508 00:23:01,400 --> 00:23:02,700 which is like, these are my goals. 509 00:23:02,700 --> 00:23:05,700 How can I work towards them? How can I be more effective? 510 00:23:05,900 --> 00:23:08,900 But I feel like hearing a lot to him to my therapy sessions. 511 00:23:08,900 --> 00:23:10,900 It's always good Tech talk. There's always lots of random 512 00:23:10,900 --> 00:23:13,700 references. There's always a funny story and 513 00:23:13,700 --> 00:23:16,900 that would kind of be some topics that I bring up pretty 514 00:23:16,900 --> 00:23:18,200 frequently. But I would say like the very 515 00:23:18,200 --> 00:23:19,500 requiring ones. I'm always talking about my 516 00:23:19,500 --> 00:23:21,700 sleep schedule. I'm always talking about habits 517 00:23:21,700 --> 00:23:22,800 things that I'm trying to increase. 518 00:23:22,800 --> 00:23:25,100 Decrease, maybe I'm trying to get more movement and I'm trying 519 00:23:25,100 --> 00:23:26,600 to watch less TV, things like that. 520 00:23:26,700 --> 00:23:29,200 Yeah, behavior is increasing and decreasing is a big one. 521 00:23:29,500 --> 00:23:33,000 Family relationships General goals, whether it's like, social 522 00:23:33,000 --> 00:23:36,000 or school, or all of those kinds of things than places that my 523 00:23:36,000 --> 00:23:37,800 thoughts are kind of like sticking a little bit more. 524 00:23:38,800 --> 00:23:41,200 So I hope that was helpful. Kind of just died. 525 00:23:41,200 --> 00:23:44,900 A catch-all, free-for-all little random ramble of an episode. 526 00:23:44,900 --> 00:23:46,100 I hope you guys liked it. I'm so sorry. 527 00:23:46,100 --> 00:23:48,400 If this was all over the place. Let me know what other Soul 528 00:23:48,400 --> 00:23:49,800 episodes. You guys would want to listen 529 00:23:49,800 --> 00:23:51,500 to. We're doing them every other 530 00:23:51,500 --> 00:23:55,400 week and I have some fun ideas in the works. 531 00:23:55,400 --> 00:23:58,300 But I always love hearing what you guys want me to talk about 532 00:23:58,300 --> 00:24:01,400 in and give insight. Also submit questions, there's a 533 00:24:01,400 --> 00:24:04,100 link on my website or DM me all the things. 534 00:24:04,300 --> 00:24:07,200 I hope you have a great rest of your week and I'll see you next 535 00:24:07,200 --> 00:24:09,400 Thursday. Thank you so much for listening 536 00:24:09,400 --> 00:24:11,300 to this week's episode of she persisted. 537 00:24:11,300 --> 00:24:13,800 If you enjoyed, make sure to share with a friend or family 538 00:24:13,800 --> 00:24:15,900 member. It really helps out the podcast 539 00:24:16,100 --> 00:24:19,000 and if you haven't already leave a review on Apple podcasts or 540 00:24:19,000 --> 00:24:22,200 Spotify, you can also make sure to follow along at at she 541 00:24:22,200 --> 00:24:25,100 persisted podcast on both Instagram and Tick-Tock and 542 00:24:25,100 --> 00:24:27,500 check out all the bonus resources content and 543 00:24:27,500 --> 00:24:31,100 information on my website. She persisted podcast.com, 544 00:24:31,500 --> 00:24:34,000 thanks for supporting, keep persisting and I'll see you next 545 00:24:34,000 --> 00:24:31,100 week. She persisted podcast.com, 546 00:24:31,500 --> 00:24:34,000 thanks for supporting, keep persisting and I'll see you next 547 00:24:34,000 --> 00:24:34,500 week.