Hello and welcome to episode 44, a design.
Curious podcast. I'm your host a mentor of
Rebecca Ward today on the podcast we have a fabulous
interview with Nina parish and I just know you're going to love
this conversation that I had with her.
So before I tell you a little bit more about her wanted to
remind you, this is the last week that you can take advantage
of the promotion that we're doing with Erica sort.
You'll remember Erica sort from episodes 38.
Eight of how storytelling and brand marketing will level up
your interior design career. So, she's created and just
launched a new course, called the brand storytelling master
class on teachable for people just like you.
And so there is an opportunity to take this master class for
free. And how you can do that is
leaving review of design periods.
Podcast screenshot that review and send it to me, you can email
it podcast at our Ward design.com.
Posted on Instagram and tag me and Erica.
And we will send you the code to take that Master Class for free.
And you're going to want to do this because the course is
designed to be short and easy to complete, but you'll learn how
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taglines brand scripts and content Matrix allowing you to
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So, take advantage of this last week of being able to get that
coupon code to take her master class, you're going to want to
do this brand, storytelling is so important for your business,
for your brand and just getting out there.
Also, while you're checking out that link in my show notes,
you're going to want to get the link for the downloads that I
offer, as well as checking out my mentor.
It program, my design Mentor. So, check out all of that.
I know you're going to want to get all the information you can
as you're starting out in your career.
So this is a great resource for that.
All right, let me tell you a little bit about Nina.
She was born and raised in Charming town about an hour
outside of Paris. And we'll hear a little bit
about her story of getting into the School of Architecture and
that they called a bizarre then just how She started her career,
it's just really fast and I'm going to let her tell that story
but her approach to work is holistic.
And there are boundaries between the divisions of the field from
lighting to structural design to FF and E and it's developed a
desire in her to build something that she can carry the projects
through fully and completely without jeopardizing or
compromising on the thread that ties the whole characteristic
Narrative of the project together.
Her curiosity, led her to learn from Different fields that she
did not specialize in and learned how to become an
Interior Designer, a lighting designer, and even learned a lot
about fields that she thought she disliked such as Plumbing,
or automation systems, which still gives her anxiety attacks.
So she really has a can-do attitude willing to take on any
project, learn anything that she needs to to make her projects,
really stand out and customized to the nth degree for her
clients. And she has some incredible
projects all around the world taken when check out her
information in the show notes as well to see her portfolio and
all the great work that she's done.
So she has so much great knowledge to share.
You're gonna love this interview, so now let's hear
from Nina. You're now listening to design,
curious a place where you creative one are here to learn
about what it really is. Like, to be an interior designer
and I'm your host and Mentor Rebecca, Ward, if you're worried
about how to succeed in a creative career, if you're ready
to learn your next steps to become an Interior Designer.
And if you want the satisfaction of doing something, you love
every day, you are in the right place.
Grab a coffee, a notebook. Let's dig into today's episode.
Hi, Nina, welcome to design curious podcast.
Hi Rebecca. Thanks for having me.
Yes, of course. And I'm so excited that we were
able to coordinate this. I know that you are now.
Working out of Dubai. Is that right?
Yes, that's correct. So I'm basically I was born and
brought up in France and I moved to the Middle East about 13
years ago where I directly started my own business pasty to
my design business. Okay.
Wonderful Awful. So let's start in France where
you were born and at what point did you get into interior
design? And what inspired though?
What I heard from like a lot of your guests from a very, very
young age. As far as I remember, my
grandmother would say to my mom. When I was like three years old,
she's going to be an architect. She's going to be a designer,
because from a very young age, I was drawing.
Like apparently my drawings as we're not like a normal child.
So I remember being like 23 years old and being at nursery
and my parents picking me up and the teacher would say like she's
drawing full houses. So yeah, the first point is I've
ever done where Like Houses, you know?
So and then as I grew up and as I was a teenager, my mom really
pushed me to go to, you know, the kind of art school that you
go after classes. Yeah.
Attended all of that quite early on and I was always the youngest
beside the fact that Like at home, I was a real design
dictator and I think more than I was always, like, very sensitive
to spaces. I think, I realized very early
on how spaces could affect your mood.
Of course, at the time, I didn't know why or how.
But I knew that in some spaces, I was like really happy and in
some others, I hated that, you know, I used to like, a phobia
of green color I think from a very young age.
I knew that I was going to be a an architect in France.
When you're at school, they always ask you what do you want
to be when you grow up? Like at first it was cool.
Then as far as I remember, I always brought like I want to be
an architect. So yeah.
Yeah, yeah. So this is how far it goes and
and then I basically you know, apply to different architecture
school at the end of high school and and you know, got accepted
in one of the best school in Paris basically.
So I graduate an architect. Okay course then in my practice,
you know, moved from I mean, we still do a lot of architecture,
but I would say, you know, when you do a project from A to Z the
architecture, phase is maybe three months.
Whereas, the interior design phase takes like nine months,
you know. So he will re sure.
Okay. So yeah, but I'm a trained
architect basically. Did you have any other
colleagues that were women in the architecture program?
Was it primarily men or no? I mean I think in France
actually I remember. So I started my studies In 2002
France, the program is about 6 years.
So it's, you know, a bit longer than in the US but no, it was
very equal. And I actually remember, first
year of architecture one of my professor announcing that it was
the first year that there was more female in the in that batch
than men, you know. So it was interesting and I
think right now, if you look at the data as I mean, it's really
like 50/50 if not more women than men actually graduating
Architecture school this. Yeah.
Okay. So did that program also fold in
interior design elements as well.
Absolutely. So the reason why I think I
decided to go to the architecture past is because,
you know, I wanted to learn the larger scale because I was also
accepted to one of the best school you know, in the word in
terms of interior design. But then I thought if I learn
everything from the interior perspective and what's going to
be my perspective on, I'm thinking of the whole thing.
And one of the most important factors for me, I think, is the
link between architecture and interior design, and too often,
I think they're Architects out there.
That do not care about interior design and anything designers,
get stuck with the mistakes of the architect.
So this is something that I don't believe in.
I don't believe in boxes and design.
You know, from the scale of like Urban Design to the scale of
Furniture Design. So that's the reason why I
actually he studied architecture for the scale just to understand
like the larger scale. And then I told myself, I
understand the larger scale while obviously I'll be able to
zoom in into the smallest scale and but actually not like that
at all. And I know how difficult
interior design was, you know. Yeah.
But it's not about thinking as a student.
Yeah, yeah, okay. So then what happened?
Once you graduated with your degree while I was doing my
studies? I always knew that I was going
to create my own - like I always add equally a designer mind and
an entrepreneurial mind. So for me this was like a given
and you know I graduated in 2008 worldwide crisis at that point
at least in Europe. You better off working at
McDonald's and being a designer. So for me there was no way that
I was going to work like 80 hours a week.
We know like in those fields, very long hours.
I mean, I always say this to students that are starting their
Their studies and their journey and I'm like, don't expect easy
studies, don't expect easy working hours.
So so yeah. I mean, I knew I was going to, I
wanted to create my own business, so doing my studies.
I actually, you know, worked in New York for your worked in
Istanbul for, you know. So I was like experimenting in
different areas and I also knew I wouldn't want to stay in
France because I consider that France, even though I would say
that, it's one of the centers. Interior design on your like
with Italy France. Those countries are really they
generated interior design as we speak.
So I knew I didn't want to stay there because to me it was too
conservative in the entrepreneurial mind.
So I had an opportunity to move into the Middle East.
I actually had an opportunity to go teach interior design to the
first batch of interior design graduates in Saudi Arabia, to
the first batch of female interior design graduate.
Saudi Arabia. So it was very very thing.
They had no idea that I was younger than them.
They thought that probably because I had published a
project part of my last year and they had heard about me.
So they they asked me if I wanted to come as a guest
lecturer for semester. So when I got there, they
realized that, you know, I was 23.
So a lot of the students were actually older than me, but I
think it helped me a lot in to, you know, like developing my
carrier to. So I, this is what I did.
I moved in To Saudi Arabia very weirdly out of all the odds.
But I was like, you know, it's an opportunity.
And then from there I realized that at the time in Saudi I mean
right now the Middle East is really moving so fast and like
you know it's one of the epicenters of having new
project. Also I'm originally even Ian so
culture shock didn't bother me, you know, something very very
adventurous and so this is R like I moved at 23 so I was
teaching at University interior design and in the same time,
literally signed my first project at the age of 23, like
which was a mega 4000 square meter.
You said forty thousand square feet.
Yeah, residential project. So this is how it started right
out of basically, which was violence.
I mean, violent in the sense that you're not prepared for
that. I think, when you graduate
design, you are not prepared to be Handed over a project from A
to Z button because I was I think it was one of the I always
like retrospectively always think about it because my plan
was actually to move to the us and that was like no way on
Earth. Would I have been given the
chance as 23 with no experience to be given a project from
ground up you know and from ground to the last piece of
furniture that was going into that residential home, you know.
So thank you. Amazing curve of learning
basically. Yeah.
And at that time, 2007-2008. That's when the US was
experienced such such a, you know, recession in our Housing
Industry and everything. So there probably wasn't even an
opportunity for you there. Yeah, we're up was same to be
honest. Yeah.
So what how was Dubai at that time or I mean at the time in
the Middle East, you know, Dubai.
So because I basically started my carrier in Saudi was my first
project and then Because I created my office there and then
three years later expanded to Dubai.
So we basically had projects all over the Middle East, 2008,
2009, 2010, we're not great years in in Dubai either.
I think Dubai is very, very rapidly changing for the past,
like, three, four years. But it was not amazing.
Hence, I started having large projects in Saudi Arabia.
It was an amazing. Yeah, I mean, the opportunities
were incredible because As we session, I'm probably hit a bit,
but you could not see the effect and the impact on very wealthy
individuals, right? So, like in any crisis, even
even right now, I mean, the rich, get richer, right?
So, and again, very rapidly, my clientele.
So, this is what we do as a as a design office.
We really specialize in super, super high-end projects.
Of course, it didn't start like this, but I would say initially
when I told Three. I signed.
My first 40,000 square feet project.
It was a very high-end Villa and then from there, you know you
experiment, right? Like, so we took our commercial
project, F and B project. So we really experimented I
would say for a good six, seven years before, really
specializing in, in high-end residential, which we are now
doing in Europe in the Middle East.
So, not only do by, we have projects in Paris, we have
projects in Milan upcoming so, so yeah.
Wow. So So when you arrived in your
teaching and get your first project so was it just you did
you hire someone right away? How did you set up your
business? So I mean it was really like I
think all those you know stories of when you're super young and
you're started. So I literally I'll never forget
how I signed my first project. So I was 23 as I told you and I
was leaving in a kind of residential compound, and my
neighbor was a British contractor that had been living
in the Middle East for over 25 years.
So he was a contractor working with all those big industrial.
Very wealthy family is. So he said to me, you know,
we're always lacking people doing sketches for us drawing
for us and there's this very, very important family.
So which is very well known in the region are very big
industrial family, but, you know, at 23, I had no idea who
was who and, you know, it's good to be naive to at one point, you
know, when you're young because then you don't, I feel the
pressure and he said to me, you know, they've been trying to
build their home for the past three years.
They've already hired three architect, five interior, design
offices. Are you willing to meet them and
and give it a shot basically? I'm like, sure.
I'm like, can I see you think plans?
And he showed me the existing drawings and plans and I was
like, so shocked to know because I think when you come out of
school and and this is when you realize like everything in life,
whether you're an architect. Designer a doctor, you know, you
have great people in the field. We also have people that are not
that competent in every field. And I remember me and my naive
kind of behavior coming out of school and kind of, you know,
having ethics, you know, in the design word thinking, you know,
they taught us to design like this.
This is what I have to. And I was the drawings that I
saw where horrendous. So I went to the client and I
said, listen, I'm just 23, I don't need any money, just give
me two weeks and I will come back with a proposal like was a
full plan and I had received my first salary from the University
because it was literally months to that.
I had moved into the Middle East.
So I had my small salary from the University teaching and I
literally called my friends from Paris because at that point as
we said, 2008 disastrous, you know, like housing and there's
no project. Basically so all my friends that
have graduated from either interior design or architecture
departments, they're all out of jobs, you know.
So they're all at home site literally called six of my
friends and I said, I'll pay you each 200 euro week, two hundred
dollar and please help me. So imagine in a matter of 14
days, we pulled out like a 40,000 square feet project with
perspective and Arisen you know, 2000.
Nine, you know, rendering like very realistic rendering.
We're not that common, right? So even if you see those renders
like, you laugh, because like, you know, software's have
evolved so much. So this is how I got my first
project we work day and night for 14 days.
I paid everybody 200 euro out of my pocket and this is how I
signed my first project basically, and it was not an
easy ride. No, it's not, right?
But yeah, it was a huge. Of learning.
Yes, I'm sure. Yeah.
Because not only did you have to sell the project but then he had
implemented, you have to implement it.
And remember, I graduated in architecture, right?
So this is where my interior design Journey starts because
well, you know, maybe took us three, four months, to kind of
come up with a shell, for the architecture of the villa, and
this is what we knew, right? This is what we knew, but then
you fall into the reality, guess what?
Like, we designed the whole project, it was hilarious.
And then I submitted the drawings and then the contractor
said, wait a second, where are the socket outlets?
And I'm like, and I started crying at forgotten, you know?
Like they don't teach you at school to put, suck it up.
I don't know. They don't teach you like, at
this in architecture, electrical drawings and now like is
important. And so, this is where we did the
interior design during his journey started, right?
So, yeah, just have this logic of For us, going from the
architectural volume to the room by room kind of logic, because
again, you're talking about 40,000 square feet.
So imagine the amount of rooms and like from kitchens two
living rooms two, bedroom, two formal kind of entertainment
areas. So, it was just, as I said, like
really if I have a word in mind is like curve of learning, which
we have incredible, you know, and yeah, when I think of that
project, because I still do project for that same family, It
started with the older brother. And we're actually right now,
working on the younger sister, Villa, and I somehow feel bad
for the older brother, because I'm like, I didn't know
anything, right? Like, I remember learning
lighting during that project, I remember learning so much about
interior materials and bathroom design.
And how do you design a through mean to did, you know, there's
such a huge gap between concept and reality.
And I think this is what made us become a successful design
office is we care so much about the reality rather than just
like ideas on papers? And yeah, this came from that
first project because, you know, I didn't have a choice, our
drawings, we're going on sites directly.
So when you design a bathroom and then you design a niche in a
bathroom, and what you design is not very realistic because the
corners are going to be disgusting and you see it, you
don't do that. Same mistake twice, right?
Better than So this is how I started basically really
Hands-On. Yeah.
Wow. So you had your friends that
were helping you for submitting the project then did they stay
with you after that? Or so this is really the premise
is like the very beginning of my company.
I mean a few of them so I was still having a full-time job at
the University, lecturing an interior in the interior design
department. So that was also very
interesting and then you You know, obviously my side job
which was more hours than my actual job was, you know, to
design this project. So yeah, I had actually my
friends that I hired from the school.
And yeah, so they stick to with me for good like you're and a
half two years and then you know, teams went and came and
this is how, you know, slowly slowly.
I think after two years, I established the license and quit
my, you know, job at the University, Ching and had
obvious in Saudi had an office in Dubai.
And this is how you know, little by little, you know, the office
and the team expanded. And of course, even that on its
own is a huge Journey. You know, for me like the
learning curve of the design aspect is equally as hard as the
entrepreneurial aspect if yeah. I was entrepreneur aspects
actually way harder because the design part is what you love.
Is what you have fun with the right.
So for me me, I always had funds going to suppliers learning
things that I didn't know, you know, and I was lucky enough to
do those very high-end projects, right?
So I think you're when you're in that kind of Niche, you learn so
much because let's say you go to a Furniture supplier.
I mean, you know, you have a lot of family owned houses in
Europe. In Italy, in France.
Particular, let's say, you know, a fabric house like lamb is a
computer today, which was known worldwide.
That they know their job for decades and centuries, you know,
so you learn so much from them in every aspect from fabric to
lighting to Furniture. So I was really lucky to evolve
with this kind of steer, but then the entrepreneurial Journey
was another story because I didn't really have a mentor to
tell me the things. I wish I could tell somebody
today, you know, yeah, wanted their interior design or their,
you know, they did, they design studio.
So so yeah. I mean, yeah, it was a whole
process. Yes obviously.
Wow. Yeah.
So do you ever have any interns or do you do any mentoring
current we do? We recently actually you know
that first contractor that I talked to you about.
So the son of the contractor which you know, we evolved
together like around the years. He's daughter who just graduated
in interior design in the UK flew to Dubai to have an
internship with us because when I think is very important but
even Beyond interns We always have like Junior designers,
right? Like junior interior designers
after 15 years of running this business.
I'm always like I'm so tired of training people but that's what
you have to do if you want to delegate.
Yeah you have to keep on training people and whoever I
hire like we just hired a new very junior interior designer
fresh off the boat. And I told her consider you know
nothing and then all the The meetings and just listen to what
happens. And I notice I seen her face
that sometimes she doesn't understand half of the things
we're talking about. But nonetheless, at least, you
know, she gets accustomed to. You know, when you're an
interior design school, you don't learn about MEP, right?
You don't learn about a see, you don't learn about the
technicality of everything, but a big part of your job.
I think, when you design a room is to think, okay, what's the
impact of that? A Sea Grill in my space, right?
Or what's the impact Dove electrical work in my space
because true high-end interior design.
It's about all those details, you know?
So I guess. Yeah, the training goes to make
them from concept to reality and I always care about, this is
what I care. I think, at school, I always
said it, I think what matters to me is to develop your brain in
terms of thinking. Because the technical aspect,
you know, for me at school, somebody could have Explain me
10 times. I was a c or electrical was
working or Plumbing. I would not have understood, you
know. I think I understood when I saw
it in front of me but Yankee 100%.
Yeah. I think what matters really in
interior design studies and even in the early years is to
understand. Problem solving is to understand
relationship with clients is to understand how to have like a
conceptual mind, you know, how to put an idea into Into paper,
you know, I need to because to me this is the biggest quality
of I always say, like, designers, we are like
psychiatrists or psychologists know.
Like, it's almost like psychologist for me.
This is what I tell my client. I'm like I'm no longer an
architect. I'm a full-on psychologist
because, you know, you have two, especially when you do
Residential projects, I think is so intimate and so into ink to
the customer that you have to have a deep understanding of
their vision. Ian and your vision.
You put it back together basically.
Yeah, really good advice. Yea, that's great.
So do you primarily then do Residential projects?
Are you mixed with commercial? Yeah.
So right now, I mean in the past and you know, through our
websites, you know, the audience could find a lot of like even
restaurants FNB commercial, but now for the past I would say two
or three years we focused on high-end residential so that's
that typically what we do. And the reason is that, I don't
like budgets, and I also don't like to do things very, very
fast and because our Niche is to go into that segment of super
high quality, right? And quality is money and quality
is time, right? So it's like when we I mean
we're designing right now in Dubai an island, which has the
bill, Gary hotel and there are the real Gary residences As
we're designing one of the penthouse, which is very, very
exclusive. So when you design projects,
like this, that when the sales is on the newspaper, you know,
you need to take your time, right?
And yeah, let's know. We buy marbles from Italy or you
buy, you know, sanity wear anything like those things are
crafted and there are handcrafted.
So lead time is six months, you know, so it takes, and it's
very, very expensive. You know, especially host covid
the crisis in the supply chain, I You know so yeah that's the
reason why right now we're doing high-end residential because I
realized that at this stage for me, it's very interesting to
learn. I mean, this is the only way
that for me. I keep evolving is to learn from
those arches on kind of house. For example, now we are working
with the company in Italy that manufacturers kitchens and their
specialized in stone work. But they're so good at what they
do in terms of stonework that we learned so much, you know, about
this. Detailing and believe it or not,
we've been working maybe four or five months just on the TV
cabinet. I've seen not a simple TV
cabinet but nonetheless a TV cabinet, right?
So it's so much hours and back and forth between us, Italy.
And I have to fly to Tuscany to see the stone.
And again, it's in the worry of the details, right?
So again, High project, I think what makes the difference is the
detail, right? That's it.
The difference between a commercial project even a normal
residential project and a high-end residential project,
right? Because again, when you do with
the kind of customer, we have that, you know, travel the word
have properties, all over the world from New York, to London
to Paris to do by, the expectations are insane, you
know, so I think you have to kind of step up to that.
Yeah, have to step up and I always say, like interior design
and Architecture for anyone that wants to jump into this field.
The spectrum of what you do is so broad again, at least in our
practice, I always have like employees or ex-employees, you
know? Like, I'm always surprised like,
when every year I sit with them. Like, so how do you fit in the
company? What could we improve?
And I'm always like, positively surprised because of course,
it's a lot of pressure, but I'm always positively surprised when
they say we Learn so much in this company because so we take
on projects from A to Z, you know, from again architecture to
the early of the keys. So meaning that we hired a
contractor. So it's also very particular
business model. We hired a contractor, we handle
all procurement aspect, you know which I often feel in interior
design is a, is a very big part. Yeah.
The last thing that you want is to design something.
And then for x y, z reason, what you've designed And is not
implemented. Yes it's a kind of controlling
the whole process from a to zed massive responsibility, but also
it could be a huge reward because then the product that
you've designed the renderer let's say the reality is even
better than the rent under. So that's the interesting part
but it's also a lot of responsibility.
Yeah. Yeah for sure.
So you had to really develop your team as far as like art
Then the and craftsmen who can do all these custom designs that
you're coming up with, for this higher has.
Yeah, absolutely. Even in my own team.
So we have Architects interior, designers, Furniture designer,
as we know, it's very broad, right?
I'd like we even have a textile designer, you know, that works
with print patterns. And so again, we'll take care
about at the end, is to me it doesn't matter whether you
graduated in interior, design or Architecture or because for me
all those fields they have to cross passes, you know?
Like for me it's impossible to I've been asked so many times to
come handle. The interior design of a project
that was already done. You know, like let's say there
is a veal and somebody has already designed the
architecture and you're called in for the interior design.
Well, so many mistakes because the Architects do not think from
an interior perspective, right? So my not Like my design, all
those huge windows and full of glazing.
But then, you know, what did you think of the curtains, right?
But you didn't think face the curtain track is going to take
for me. The balance has to be equal.
You know, you can't endure without thinking of the outdoor.
It does not work in the team. We have a very broad spectrum of
competences but line. I think what I try to train
everyone. What I've trained myself to is
to understand everything from A to Z, you know?
Yeah, of course you have lighting designers.
For example, you have landscapers but, you know, very
often, we do this in-house. Yeah, when I've tried, like I've
tried to hire external, let's say lighting designers, but then
I feel there is some sort of Miss coordination or that.
At the end of the day, like the vision is full, when every
aspect of design is taken into consideration, you know, This is
where we obtain the most successful projects.
Hmm, yeah. So with such a high touch
high-end industry, that you're in, I'm sure there's so many
moving parts and at times things.
Go wrong. Is there a mindset that you have
to maintain in order to know that things will go wrong, but
you're gonna move forward still. Of course.
Well, it's a very hard part and I think all the gray hairs that
I have up-to-date sorbet, Because of everything that went
wrong as you know, for the past two years but of course
everything goes wrong on every single project that's that's
like a guarantee. You just have to in the very
beginning, it was so hard for me and I used to get so angry and I
was like, then, you know, error is human, you know.
So at the end of the day, is just try to prepare it so much
so much like we're preparing every possibility of mistake.
We try to prepare Just today, I was driving and in my studio
manager called me and was like, you know, we have all these
marble being delivered on site, but there's no forklift on site.
So can we deliberate at the Contractors Warehouse?
And I was like, no, the marble is going to break, it's okay.
A storage fees on the spot like, you know, so it's just you try
to because I've done this mistake 10 times already and I
broke the marble and then lead time and, you know, so I guess
the mindset is just Keep calm and it's just designed.
I think this is one of the most like, a friend of mine gave me
this very valuable advice. And this is how I calm down my
own customers, right? So and there are very high, net
worth individual, that are used to have everything on the spot.
But the reality Rebecca is that, at the end of the day is just
design is just materialistic things.
Yeah, you know, something is implemented wrong.
Well, it's okay. It can be redone.
We're going to lose a week, but nobody's gonna die.
If the client moves a week, later into a property that is
going to have four years, right? Yeah, but perfectionist and I'm,
this is my biggest. I would say Pro and cons like in
my personality, it's very hard. Because when you're a
perfectionist and you want that little Edge to be perfect but
sometimes you have to accept that, maybe you're going to have
to redo it three times because maybe the contractor is not
going to understand what you mean or is not.
Going to have the eyes that you have, you know?
And like somebody maybe that edge is okay, before you is not
okay or like yesterday, you know, we post a lot on our
social media and like my team always makes fun of me but we
spent maybe two hours looking at the wood sample.
Because I kept saying no but sorry this wood is too
saturated. The grain is the veneers to read
is to read and I like you had 20 people thinking that I was
completely crazy. The with again this is when you
do super high-end projects. Yeah.
And and if we do the full door and it comes wrong, well guess
what? I'm going to have to be very
calm, explain the client that this was not the intent and it's
okay, you know? So I always say that like I
remember two years ago I had a client losing it on me because
of the wallpaper and wallpaper that took six months to be made
and was like handmade and hand painted and it It came and it
was the wrong height. I want to cry myself.
But yeah, the client Austin completely and I had to really
like, do a little meditation in my head in 30 second and say you
know is just interior design. Think that everything is
relative, right? So this is this is the kind of
mindset that I tried to keep in our case.
What's difficult, sometimes is because we have the
responsibility of the budget and the money.
So, I try to teach my team to really be conscious because
guess what, if there is a mistake on a drawing and you
know, like I'm talking about that TV cabinet that I was
telling you but but TV cabinet cost nearly 200-thousand dollar.
So at tiny mistake, on the drawing means that mistaken
production means I'm bleeding twenty thirty thousand dollar
because I'm going to have to redo something right and that's
not the client, right? That's my team.
That did something wrong. So, this is also, So very hard
to make everybody understand. I think, when you have your own
business, you have to factor in finances and risk.
Yeah. And risk.
So yeah. Yeah.
And I think especially getting
into higher end, more custom detailing, there's more risk
involved because of that, like you're saying just one little
thing going wrong, then you've got to pay out tens of thousands
for that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, it's
timing. Also you know, it's I mean,
because you tell your clients and I always say, I think in our
field, what's important is how to manage expectations,
especially if you end up having very high, net worth
individuals, as customers, you have to manage their
expectations because if you say, I tell this to my team, I'm
like, please to anyone if you think you're going to finish
this task on Tuesday, say Tuesday, otherwise don't say
Tuesday, if you're 100% sure because it's matter of
expectation. So that goes in terms of site
Handover if my contractor tells me and I sign a contract with my
contractor saying, you know, met guaranteed, I'm not telling me
to the client because I know I suffered too much of like being
transparent like this, it never anything, the contractor will
tell me, I add 20% time you, let's tells me I'm telling the
client July and if July works, it's a miracle.
And already. I know it's managing expectation
and magic and you can only gain it by doing it doing mistakes.
And doing these texts are going to make you cry, you know, as a
business owner, as a designer if you really care about what you
do and and we do and I really do then it's hard, you know, like I
will never let go of, you know, a wrong paint color or I will
never let go at even if there's so much money.
Be involved but I think I guess you learn also like as you go on
with your practice you also have to sometimes mitigate if the
parquet is not the exact same tone that you wanted but
everybody says it's stunning. You're like okay, it's done, you
know like if the class have to let go of the own Perfection
that you have in your brain as a designer, you know, yes, 100% so
good. Wow.
Thank you. God, for all of the great ways.
I feel like We could just talk forever, you'd have more and
more advice to say anything to me.
Yeah anything else. Just last shot here for an
up-and-coming designer or someone curious about the career
that you would give some advice for them.
I mean I would say the Vida passionate about the pasture
taking like any other job actually whether a designer any
other job be so passionate because in this field I mean I
think is so hard. You have to be so attached to
and loving what you're doing because you know, long hours,
difficult clients. It's a service job, right?
It's a service job and you're dealing with visuals.
So never forget that that your you have in front of you, people
that when they are going to be in a good mood, when they are
going to be in a bad mood, whether you do huge commercial
project, whether you do tiny project, it always goes back to
humans. So I think if you're not good at
Being good with humans also like be aware of that and yeah and I
think you have to love what you do and always be willing to
learn because there's so much Innovation as well in this field
you know. So always willing to learn and
always look around and I think like traveling and also always
helps, you know, when it comes to design and design ideas and
and find your past because it's such a huge Spectrum, right?
Like you could have Have designers interior designers
that are only designing your thoughts or hospitals, or hotels
or and me, I didn't focus in the beginning.
I was doing a bit of everything but it allowed me to kind of
learn what I wear. I wanted to go and then once you
find out what you're the best at, then just my push, pushing
that path. And you know, be patient because
I guess, you know, when you're young and you're motivated,
designer entrepreneur, For interior design entrepreneur.
There's a lot of impatience, but I think with age and practice
patience is key. Yes, so good.
Well, thank you so much Nina for coming on the show.
Thank you so much. All right, we'll talk to you
later. Thank you.
Bye. What an inspiration, she has
accomplished so much at a young age and still has so much more
to give. And I love her willingness to
learn and try new things and her process that is completely
unique and knowing that she doesn't know it, all she goes
through all the same hardships that every other interior
designer does but she picked herself back up and know.
Knows how to move past all the struggles and make the project
come out a success in the end. So go check out Nina's
information because you're going to want to learn a lot more from
her and don't forget that you're going to want to leave a review
of design curious podcast so you can get the promo code.
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Kirsten until then stay creative.
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