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Hello and welcome to episode 53 
of Design Curious Podcast. 

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I'm your host and mentor, 
Rebecca Ward. 

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Today on the podcast I'm talking
about perfectionism and it is a 

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very important and relevant 
topic for interior designers as 

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we will get into. 
So remember, I have that quiz 

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that you can take to discover 
what type of interior design you

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should be doing, whether it's 
residential, commercial, 

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hospitality, or spatial 
experience. 

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You can take the quiz to find 
out where you should be 

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investing your time and energy 
in the design field. 

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So go check that out. 
Link is in the show notes. 

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I hope you are enjoying our 
summer series and it's just been

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so great having all of these 
interviews. 

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I would love for you to leave me
a review on what you're liking 

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about the podcast and even 
message me or e-mail me and just

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give me some feedback. 
I am looking to in the near 

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future do kind of a Q&A podcast,
so kind of answering your urgent

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questions and things that you 
want to know about the career. 

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So go ahead and send those over 
to me and I would love to be 

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able to address those here on an
episode of the podcast and all 

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the books and things that I 
recommend that I mention in 

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today's podcast you can find in 
the show notes. 

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Okay, let's talk about 
perfectionism. 

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You're now listening to Design. 
Curious. 

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A place where you, Creative One,
are here to learn about what it 

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really is like to be an interior
designer, and I'm your host and 

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mentor Rebecca Ward. 
If you're worried about how to 

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succeed in a creative career, if
you're ready to learn your next 

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steps to become an interior 
designer, and if you want the 

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satisfaction of doing something 
you love every day you are in 

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the right place, grab a coffee, 
a notebook, and let's dig into 

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today's episode. 
Okay. 

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So perfectionism is an 
interesting topic in general. 

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It is, I feel currently in all 
of the readings and podcasts and

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stuff that I listen to. 
Perfectionism is definitely a 

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negative quality, I would say 
that is coming to light because 

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of reasons that we'll go into in
this episode. 

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That being said, it doesn't mean
that we should not try to do 

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well in the things that we're 
working on or in trying to 

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improve ourselves. 
However, we have to also know 

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that we cannot ever be perfect 
as a person. 

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And because we are human and we 
are imperfect, the product and 

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the projects that we work on 
will not be perfect. 

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Because there's so many factors 
in life that go into what we're 

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working on, we don't have full 
control over everything. 

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Let's talk about perfectionism 
and how it plays into interior 

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design. 
Now, I would say that most 

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designers that I talked to would
say that they are 

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perfectionists. 
I would say that I am the 

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exception. 
I do not call myself a 

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perfectionist. 
I've known that I have not had 

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these qualities since I was 
little in kindergarten. 

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My teacher would encourage me to
color inside the lines and I 

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think I would just generally 
color the whole picture but not 

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necessarily care about staying 
inside the lines. 

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But if I put my focus on 
something and put my mind to it,

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I could definitely produce 
something that is very near 

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perfect or very well done and 
that is the type of focus and 

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attention that I put into my 
projects for my clients. 

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However, it does take me more 
effort I feel, than other people

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or maybe I just don't care as 
much about it being perfect as 

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it being done and being looking 
good. 

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So let's talk a little more 
about that. 

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So we talked a little bit a few 
weeks ago about personality 

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types and I touched on the 
enniogram. 

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Now type one of the enniogram is
called the perfectionist. 

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So obviously this is a lot of 
people that fall into this 

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category like to do things 
perfectly and criticize 

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themselves when they cannot. 
I am a type nine, however, my 

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wings. 
So to the one side of me is type

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1 perfectionist, and that is the
way that I lean towards. 

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And so I can lean into that 
perfectionism. 

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Hopefully I do it in a way that 
is in the positive aspect of 

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like pulling myself up to do 
something better and not 

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necessarily criticizing myself 
when it is not perfect. 

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I feel like I don't fall into 
that category. 

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However, I have a lot of people 
in my life who do. 

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My husband, my mom and often 
firstborns are put in this 

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category of being perfectionist 
because they're held option to a

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higher standard by the parents 
and then the siblings that 

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follow after they realize like, 
Oh well, not everyone's perfect 

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and it's hard to live up to the 
ideal standards that you have 

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when you first start out in 
parenting. 

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I would say that also our 
society supports perfectionism, 

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holds it up on a high standard. 
They want you to get perfect 

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grades and reward you for 
looking perfect and being 

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perfect in front of everybody. 
And that's just detrimental to 

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actually being authentic and 
being yourself and celebrating 

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who we are and all of our 
imperfections and celebrating 

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our personalities and the 
different strengths that we 

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have. 
And not everybody is good at 

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focusing on the details. 
I know that I am not. 

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So that's when I go to hire. 
I hire people who are good at 

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focusing on the details because 
that's one of my weaker points. 

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And so that's one of the reasons
why I love collaborating as well

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is because I know that I have 
weaknesses and other people have

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strengths in those areas and 
then we can work together and 

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create a much better product 
that way. 

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Another thought that I have 
about designers being 

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perfectionist and that holding 
them back is so designers are 

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typically perfectionists. 
They want to produce the best 

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design. 
And oftentimes you'll hear that 

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the holdup is that they are so 
worried about making sure the 

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design is perfect that they 
spend forever and ever and hours

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and hours that they don't feel 
that they can bill for trying to

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perfect the design and get it 
the best it can be. 

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And then it's not getting done. 
It's not getting released to the

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client, it's not getting put 
into action and it's not helping

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the client. 
It's definitely holding them 

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back from producing product by 
focusing on the perfectionism 

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and reiterating and reiterating 
until they've redesigned this 

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project 5 or 10 times. 
And maybe the first one or two 

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was going to be really good for 
the client and they didn't need 

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to spend all of this time and 
effort into reiterating the 

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project 8 more times. 
So this is an area that I 

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definitely encourage people who 
are coming through my design 

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mentor and things like that is 
to do your best work, come up 

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with a project and then let it 
go, let release it and let the 

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client get feedback and let you 
know. 

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They might find a spot where you
forgot to, you know dot and I 

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across the T and that's okay 
because you're not perfect and 

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they know that you're not 
perfect and you kind of don't 

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even want to set the expectation
that it's going to be 100% 

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perfect. 
Putting on a design project and 

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executing it and project 
management is really similar to 

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putting on a wedding. 
There is guaranteed something is

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going to go wrong. 
And so you're going to have to 

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roll with the punches and accept
that this is not going to be 

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perfect, but we're going to make
it right and we're going to make

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it good. 
Every single project I've done, 

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there's always something that 
didn't go perfectly, but we 

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usually can fix it and work on 
it until it gets to a point that

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is acceptable, is lovable, that 
we like it, we love it. 

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It just might not be exactly 
perfect. 

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That's one of the beauties of 
life. 

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Sometimes those imperfections 
give it character, right? 

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My husband's reading a book 
called Discipline is Destiny. 

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It looks really interesting and 
I might pick it up later, but he

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was commenting to me as he's 
going through it because it's 

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really calling out that his 
perfectionism gets in the way of

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him completing his personal 
projects or work projects. 

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He told me that a line in there 
says that not finishing 

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something is worse than not 
being perfect, like not 

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producing and not putting it out
in the world is that you are 

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withholding something that could
be helpful to other people and 

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keeping it for yourself and not 
releasing it out there. 

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And that is worse than it not 
being perfectly perfect. 

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Currently I'm reading a book 
called The Gifts of Imperfection

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Brené Brown. 
Actually my whole team is we're 

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going through it together as a 
fun book club that we do and I 

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haven't finished it yet but it's
definitely very good. 

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I highly recommend it's going to
be on my book list. 

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And one of the things in there 
that she talks about is that our

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society definitely kind of takes
shame around the notion of not 

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being perfect and that your 
value and worth is less if you 

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are not perfect. 
And so she kind of unpacks that 

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and really goes into how how to 
be vulnerable and how to be 

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authentic and not care or worry 
if people discover that you're 

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not perfect. 
Oh my goodness, How could that 

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be? 
So really lighten up, people, is

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what she's saying. 
Like, just be yourself, Be your 

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imperfect self. 
Show that to the world. 

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Be vulnerable. 
It's just so hard to be 

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vulnerable. 
And she has a lot of great books

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on being vulnerable, so check 
out Brené Brown for that. 

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But you don't want to hold 
perfectionism as a badge of 

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honor. 
You also don't want to hold that

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you are not a perfectionist as a
badge of honor. 

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And I don't know if maybe I was 
guilty of this ever, but I, you 

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know, know that I'm not a 
perfectionist. 

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And then maybe that could give 
me the excuse to just not do my 

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best, which is definitely not 
something that I want to go 

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towards. 
I always want to do my best, So 

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I know my best won't be perfect,
but it needs to be something 

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that I'm proud of and that I 
could live with. 

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Like I never designed anything 
or leave a client's house in 

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such a way that I couldn't live 
with it myself. 

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So I think that is something to 
definitely keep in mind. 

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Perfectionism is not a badge of 
honor. 

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A lot of societies and cultures 
in the past have really upheld 

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perfectionism. 
But I, you know, I'm glad 

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whenever I see this shift in our
culture, this discussion and our

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culture, that perfectionism is 
actually holding you back your 

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gift to the world. 
So think about that as you're 

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starting out as a designer, 
you're going to be doing a lot 

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of imperfect things, and you 
just have to accept that it's 

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not going to be perfect. 
Everything that you discover 

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that is imperfect is a learning 
opportunity. 

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And that's kind of like when I 
told you that I have this living

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document. 
Yeah, I was talking with James 

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Bartol that I had this document 
in my office that I continually 

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update and says lessons learned.
So every time I come across this

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imperfect part of a project, I 
can write it down what it is, 

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how I've learned to not repeat 
that mistake, and then learn 

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from it and go on and produce a 
better product at the next 

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project and not repeat my 
mistakes. 

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So I know this is a tough topic 
and nobody likes to be 

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vulnerable, nobody likes to 
accept that they're not perfect.

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But this is a truth in life. 
And so I hope that you got some 

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encouragement and benefit from 
just not holding back. 

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Take that risk to be vulnerable.
And I do think that if you're 

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going to go into business for 
yourself, you have to take a lot

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of risk. 
Risk takers, I don't think can 

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be 100% perfectionist. 
You have to be willing to take 

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the risk that it's not going to 
be perfect, that you might fail.

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And so if you're thinking about 
being an entrepreneur, then just

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think about the fact that it is 
a big risky thing and you're not

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going to be perfect doing it 
even when you get help. 

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It's just a lot of it is 
learning by experience. 

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Every situation is different, 
but you just understand that 

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it's worth the effort and worth 
the time and worth the risk when

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you want to have your own 
business. 

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And of course, if you don't want
to take that risk, then you can 

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always work for someone else and
learn from them and then still 

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produce a good product for that 
person. 

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That is not going to be perfect,
but it's going to be your best. 

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OK, that's enough on 
perfectionism. 

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So tell me what you thought 
about today's episode. 

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If you identify as a 
perfectionist, if this is 

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something that you are 
struggling with, I want to know.

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And if you are like me and maybe
not identifying as a 

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perfectionist and still have 
struggles with that in other 

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ways, then let me know as well. 
I'd love to hear more about 

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this, and I'm sure I'll bring up
the topic later as I read more 

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books. 
It's definitely something that's

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00:13:15,900 --> 00:13:20,620
a continual struggle for most 
designers, and so I think it 

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will be a recurring topic over 
the years. 

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All right. 
Like I said, you can find all 

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the links in the show notes. 
You can get the free downloads 

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about things I wish I had known 
before I started my career in 

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interior design, as well as the 
road map to interior design. 

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And stay tuned for next week. 
We have some wonderful 

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interviews coming up. 
Until then, stay creative. 

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Thanks for listening. 
If you love this episode, please

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00:13:45,440 --> 00:13:48,200
leave a rating and a review. 
This helps me reach other 

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curious creatives like you. 
If you have a topic request or 

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would like to contact me, simply
head over to my website 

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rwardesign.com or e-mail me at 
podcast@rwardesign.com.