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I'm Brandon. 
And I'm Jesse. 

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We're. 
Cannabis school having cannabis 

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infused conversations. 
With everyday. 

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People, Cannabis companies. 
Celebrities. 

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And your mom. 
Welcome to the sash. 

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Hey, welcome to the Sash. 
Hey, so we kind of wanted to 

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give these sessions where 
Brandon and I are getting 

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together and and we discussed a 
topic and one topic that we were

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talking about that really 
resonated with both of us. 

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And it was good, 'cause we could
have a really open conversation 

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and you can learn a little bit 
more about us. 

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So this one's really personal. 
You you've already read the 

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title over there, why he left 
and why he stayed. 

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And what we're talking about is 
faith, or organized. 

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Religion, not a gay 
relationship. 

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Brandon likes to go into that. 
That's totally fine. 

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If that's who you are, great. 
Me, yeah, I'm a breeder. 

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I went through. 
What? 

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Bro, I'm a breeder. 
What do you in your former life?

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But it is just kidding. 
No, but talking about religion 

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and faith and things like that 
and we don't wanna go to, like, 

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you're not gonna get preachy 
here by any means. 

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We've learned that over time. 
We're all the same, but there's 

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certain things that dynamics 
that society create, including 

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religion, that helps to kind of 
create this rift even though. 

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Was same, same but the 
different. 

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Yeah, but the the the whole 
thing is that they're trying to 

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be able to bridge a gap and 
being able to say look, no, 

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really like, I'm like you just 
follow me. 

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I have the right path. 
I have the right answers. 

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When as humans like I, I look at
religion the same way as my kids

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eating food. 
Like sometimes my kids like all 

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I want is cereal or one of 
them's like I want chicken 

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Nuggets or hey, I want something
real healthy like it, it 

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changes. 
It varies from child to child. 

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So for me to say that oranges 
are the only fruit that you 

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should eat and that's it. 
Well, 'cause, I mean, we talk 

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all the time, of course, and 
we've had endless discussions 

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over the years. 
The more we've studied other 

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cultures, other religions, other
dogmas, it's really just 

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realizing that every single one 
is just based on stories and 

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that there's many similarities 
across all of these stories. 

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Well and and The thing is though
also it's gonna be what one 

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experiences because to break it 
down in a such a a very linear 

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fashion as as you're stating 
right now, I I would push back 

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on because there are certain 
things that I've experienced in 

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my life and I came from a very 
atheistic background like. 

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I not originally. 
No, no, no. 

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I was born into something, but I
didn't believe. 

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It, yeah. 
I didn't I so to say that. 

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But The thing is, and this is 
kind of what I wonder, is I was 

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also born into it, yeah, But I 
don't feel like I ever believed 

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it. 
Now, I don't understand, but you

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grew up in a family that was 
quite different from mine. 

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Mine. 
My dad was a convert. 

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My mom was a convert to the LDS 
faith. 

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Yours is five generations deep. 
It's no longer a religion, it's 

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a cult. 
Yeah, it is. 

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It is part of who you are. 
It is part of who the family is.

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Yeah. 
There are things that you have 

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to follow and say in order for 
you to be a part of, said it. 

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I mean, if if you would have 
done what you've done now with 

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your family and let's rewind it 
back to the 90s, say you're now 

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30 and you come out to your 
family going, hey man, pot's the

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way. 
Oh, it would have been you would

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have been ostracized. 
Well, 'cause even then I hadn't.

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I would never came out that way,
no. 

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No, but I'm just saying like, 
I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm fast 

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forwarding it because if you 
would have come to your family, 

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one, it was incredibly illegal 
at that time. 

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Oh, highly. 
Two, you would have been seen as

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your life is over and you're 
gonna do heroin soon which 

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sometimes when I watch you do 
dab and then hit a bong and then

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hit another machine. 
I I contemplate. 

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But if you think about it when 
and and and and I'm not. 

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I'm not trying to take anything 
away. 

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It's just observation from the 
outside. 

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I I feel for you on the sense of
what faith typically means to 

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people from the outside looking 
in what is what is faith and the

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basic sense of it. 
It is a group of people that 

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have a belief structure that 
they feel creates a a world of 

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of love, a hope and connect. 
Not even necessarily that. 

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I think a faith is just a 
similar belief structure in 

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something it. 
But I mean, it's tied more to 

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the emotional part. 
Hope religion is not a but I 

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look at just a theoretical side 
where it's just ABCD. 

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But there are some who are. 
And this is not every religion 

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or every person, but there are 
the fanatical extremists out 

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there who aren't about love and 
that, but they still have faith.

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So that's what I'm saying is I 
don't think faith necessarily 

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has. 
Narcissists. 

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Some people in religions are 
narcissists. 

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Some people outside of religions
are narcissists. 

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Mother 100%. 
No, I just think like there are.

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We look at the extremists in 
certain religions. 

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You look at like holy wars that 
have been, and I don't think 

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that those are necessarily over 
love, but it's this idea of 

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faith is still based around it. 
And we can have religious 

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things, but I think the faith 
and belief is it's everyone has 

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these ideas and it's really 
based on feelings. 

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Well, you had brought up before 
we got on about a close friend 

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of ours and he's like, I don't 
believe that there are so many 

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different religions. 
I believe there's like over 8 

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billion religions because each 
individual. 

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Follows even every that religion
to their own belief within. 

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That and and to take anything 
right from Catholicism to to 

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Mormonism to Judaism, you pick 
whatever ISM, what's associated 

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with it. 
There's an original concept and 

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then the concept is slowly 
changed based off of those 

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individual religions and then 
when they get to a certain 

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period. 
Inside it you even with like 

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biblical times you go to like 
the Alexandria back when they 

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had counseled Nicaea and they 
voted on what was biblically 

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believed on or true at that 
time. 

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And then you get team Henry who 
alternates and alters the Bible 

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and you know how many other 
religions history is written by 

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the victor or the person in 
power. 

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So how many time have these 
stories that our religions are 

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based upon been retold or 
changed or you know, but if you 

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look it's most religions have 
those similarities in their 

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stories that we discuss of like 
absolutely. 

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But it's like, I don't think one
religion is wrong. 

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I don't think one religion is 
right. 

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Absolutely. 
But for why I left was like. 

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No, I get. 
Where you? 

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Yeah, we've had well. 
Yeah, well, everybody will learn

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this and it and it's over time. 
I mean, of course we don't want 

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to take like that would take 
like 6 hours to really like peel

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that onion. 
We could have a Reader's Digest 

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version. 
Yeah, there you go. 

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The Reader's Digest, I mean, 
from outside looking in. 

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And I'd like you to fill in 
these gaps. 

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You grew up in a fifth 
generation Mormon. 

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Now, for those of us who don't 
know what a Mormon is, I'm sure 

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you've visited those nice 
gentlemen or girls that come by 

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with the white shirts and the 
smiley faces and yeah, and and 

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some of them are really cool. 
Some of them creep the shit out 

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of you. 
I've had lots of those too. 

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And yeah, of course, 
interesting. 

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Like, because I don't, I don't 
consider everybody inside the 

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faith that I'm involved with to 
be the same as me. 

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Not even close. 
Well then. 

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But a lot of them do. 
A lot of them feel like I do 

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these things. 
Now we're connected because of 

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that. 
Well it's it's and this is what 

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I don't like about that culture 
because we grew up in the same 

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area is a lot of it is in this 
area is did you meet your 

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checklist. 
Yeah. 

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Like and that's what I didn't 
like about it because. 

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Because you don't. 
You grew up in it. 

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Yeah, you don't like that, but I
know lots of people that I have 

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met. 
That is how they grew up. 

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I I think the reason why I I 
have a a happier disposition now

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to be completely transparent. 
My family, my my extended 

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family, my brothers and sisters,
like, no, I don't think any of 

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them are a part of the religion 
at all anymore. 

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My mom isn't. 
She's more of just agnostic. 

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She doesn't really follow 
anything. 

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She doesn't practice anything. 
My dad, he's the one that 

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brought our whole family into 
the LDS faith by my parents 

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marrying all that thing. 
He's really not a part of the 

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church anymore. 
My brother definitely isn't a 

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part of the church. 
My sisters, they have left. 

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I'm the only one that's a part 
of that faith. 

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And The funny thing I I I find 
with a lot of people who leave 

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the faith is they act like they 
were still in the faith. 

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Hence I can't believe you still 
believe in that. 

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And that is the the sides that 
go there, because they go, well,

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you're really intelligent or 
you're very well read or you 

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know these things. 
But at the same time, one's 

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trying to be right. 
And I don't believe in truth. 

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I don't believe in any truth. 
I believe there's just a 

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furtherment of knowledge. 
So I learned new things, meaning

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that my mind can change, and it 
always does. 

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And because I'm outspoken and 
I'm a bit gregarious, it's 

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easier for me to get a pass. 
But if you get somebody who's 

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really passive and all the 
sudden they start to say the 

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same things with me, I guarantee
they'd be ostracized 100%. 

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Their families would disown 
them. 

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They would, I mean. 
I was very worried about because

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in the Mormon culture, when I 
started looking and studying, 

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because I had never really 
questioned that, I believed that

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I grew up in A and it was like. 
This is what you do. 

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This is what you do. 
But me and my younger brother, 

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we started sneaking out of class
when I was maybe 12. 

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We would sneak out and go home 
from then on. 

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And then when I was 16, I asked 
to work Sundays when I got a job

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because I didn't want to be at 
church. 

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I didn't want to go. 
I had to go. 

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How did that conversation go 
with your parents, 'cause I know

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that they were very about the 
aesthetics of it, how people 

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sell them. 
Yeah, but at the time I had, I 

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didn't. 
I worked with my dad all the 

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time. 
During weekends during the 

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summers, I would help him build 
homes and do all he's. 

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One of the hardest working 
motherfuckers you've ever met in

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your life. 
I mean, his dad is just like, 

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nuts. 
He just hurt his shoulder, 

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shoveling snow. 
Well, but that's after he just 

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had nine discs replaced a year 
ago and he's remodeled 3 

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apartments in that, like since 
then. 

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Like there's so much crap and 
he's still finishing his home. 

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Like there's so much stuff that 
he's doing constantly. 

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He's just. 
Constantly. 

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Working, yeah, but that's 
brilliant. 

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But it's just, yeah, but you 
were always going with that. 

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00:10:43,440 --> 00:10:46,240
No, no, I'm sorry. 
I I I went off and gave your dad

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props. 
So anyways, Greg, you're 

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awesome. 
But yeah, you were going into it

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like your your. 
Family was just so I had to get 

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a job because I totaled the car 
that my parents got me to drive.

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Oh sweet. 
So you got out of. 

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Sunday school, three weeks after
I drove, my three weeks after I 

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got my license, I totaled the 
car and they're like, well, you 

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can't get your license back 
until you pay ticket deductible 

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and towing. 
And I didn't have enough in 

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savings from working with my dad
from that. 

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So I had to go get my first 
actual job working for a 

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company. 
And so it was a hey, I need to 

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be working these hours. 
And finally it was Hey, they 

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told me I have to work one 
Sunday every every month. 

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But you asked for it. 
I did and then when I became a 

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manager after like 6 months they
were like. 

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Hey, you gotta be here almost 
every Sunday. 

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No, I told my parents that, hey,
mom, dad, I have to be there 

226
00:11:40,640 --> 00:11:43,320
almost every Sunday, 'cause I 
have to open because I'm the 

227
00:11:43,320 --> 00:11:45,960
newest manager and it's the 
crappiest day. 

228
00:11:46,440 --> 00:11:50,800
So I from then on, even if I 
didn't work, it became because 

229
00:11:50,800 --> 00:11:53,040
it was such a chill job. 
It was at this restaurant. 

230
00:11:53,040 --> 00:11:54,080
It was. 
It's Utah. 

231
00:11:54,080 --> 00:11:55,720
Nothing's open on Sunday. 
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 

232
00:11:56,400 --> 00:11:59,840
So we would bring in like an 
Xbox and ATV and we would play 

233
00:11:59,840 --> 00:12:02,480
Halo behind in the kitchen and 
just like because. 

234
00:12:02,480 --> 00:12:03,640
There's no there coming in 
there, yeah. 

235
00:12:03,640 --> 00:12:05,600
Yeah. 
Or we'd get there hours early 

236
00:12:05,600 --> 00:12:08,600
and we would prep and we'd bring
in these airsoft guns and we 

237
00:12:08,600 --> 00:12:11,320
were running and jumping over 
the tables having airsoft wars, 

238
00:12:11,320 --> 00:12:13,520
and then we'd just hurry and 
sweep it all up before we 

239
00:12:13,520 --> 00:12:15,280
opened. 
Yeah, the store's no longer open

240
00:12:15,280 --> 00:12:17,000
anyhow. 
They've been, they closed years 

241
00:12:17,000 --> 00:12:18,360
and years trying. 
To bring them back. 

242
00:12:18,360 --> 00:12:20,960
I did and I'm so excited. 
I love their cheese fries. 

243
00:12:20,960 --> 00:12:22,000
Yeah, I remember the cheese 
fries. 

244
00:12:22,000 --> 00:12:25,040
Shout out to training table, 
Love your shit. 

245
00:12:26,120 --> 00:12:28,760
But anyway, so that was that was
how I got out of it. 

246
00:12:28,760 --> 00:12:31,240
And from then on I never went 
back. 

247
00:12:31,960 --> 00:12:39,520
I moved out at 18, right at 18 
and my buddy we moved to this 

248
00:12:39,520 --> 00:12:43,480
BYU approved ward, which for 
those who don't know is a Mormon

249
00:12:43,480 --> 00:12:46,400
school basically for university.
Yeah, it's like joining a 

250
00:12:46,400 --> 00:12:48,640
convent or. 
Or like Duke. 

251
00:12:48,640 --> 00:12:51,880
It's like going to Duke or any 
of these other ones that are 

252
00:12:51,920 --> 00:12:53,240
religious. 
Or something like that. 

253
00:12:53,400 --> 00:12:54,760
Carver's a religious. 
One, isn't it? 

254
00:12:54,760 --> 00:12:57,080
Yeah, very much so. 
Do you have to take religious 

255
00:12:57,080 --> 00:12:58,240
studies? 
OK. 

256
00:12:58,560 --> 00:13:00,920
Yeah, it's more like biblical 
because it's a very Catholic 

257
00:13:00,920 --> 00:13:02,040
school. 
OK, Yeah. 

258
00:13:02,040 --> 00:13:05,120
So at BYU, you have to take 
Mormon studies, you have to go 

259
00:13:05,120 --> 00:13:08,600
through these things in order to
attend their university, and 

260
00:13:08,600 --> 00:13:11,920
there's a lot of restrictions 
that they put in place. 

261
00:13:11,920 --> 00:13:13,920
Yeah, they have like a code of 
ethics or some. 

262
00:13:13,960 --> 00:13:15,840
Flip flops. 
Your hair couldn't be below your

263
00:13:15,840 --> 00:13:18,440
ears and you could have a beard.
Yeah, all of this stuff. 

264
00:13:18,440 --> 00:13:19,720
You can have a mustache, 
couldn't you? 

265
00:13:19,720 --> 00:13:21,600
No, you didn't even do a 
mustache. 

266
00:13:21,600 --> 00:13:23,520
You. 
Have to get a beard card like 

267
00:13:23,520 --> 00:13:25,320
you have to get an approval from
your doctor. 

268
00:13:25,320 --> 00:13:27,400
Sounds like the fucking Navy. 
Yeah, it's ridiculous. 

269
00:13:28,640 --> 00:13:33,560
But so I moved out and I went to
the singles ward with my buddy 

270
00:13:33,560 --> 00:13:36,600
Cause it was like, oh, there's 
going to be some women there. 

271
00:13:36,600 --> 00:13:38,960
And I was like, cool, I'm 18, 
like let's go see if there's any

272
00:13:38,960 --> 00:13:41,480
cool women. 
It was like, I don't, I don't 

273
00:13:41,480 --> 00:13:42,960
like church. 
Why am I here? 

274
00:13:43,480 --> 00:13:46,040
Why am I going? 
I went like twice and I never 

275
00:13:46,040 --> 00:13:49,800
went back until I met my ex-wife
and her family would go 

276
00:13:49,800 --> 00:13:53,320
sometimes. 
And so we started going And then

277
00:13:53,320 --> 00:13:57,600
my youngest brother. 
So I come from a family of four,

278
00:13:57,720 --> 00:14:02,840
four boys and one girl. 
And in EU, the Mormon culture, 

279
00:14:02,840 --> 00:14:05,680
it's pretty common for boys to 
go on missions. 

280
00:14:05,960 --> 00:14:10,000
Yeah, and an and an LDS Mission 
is a kid now. 

281
00:14:10,000 --> 00:14:14,440
It's it used to be 19 and above.
Now it's 18 and above and you go

282
00:14:14,440 --> 00:14:16,480
for two years. 
You have to pay for it. 

283
00:14:16,800 --> 00:14:18,680
I never went. 
I wasn't a part of the church at

284
00:14:18,680 --> 00:14:20,440
the time, at that age. 
Oh, I kind of was. 

285
00:14:20,440 --> 00:14:21,800
I was involved. 
In you were inactive. 

286
00:14:22,080 --> 00:14:25,640
I was super inactive. 
The the Bishop always tried to 

287
00:14:25,640 --> 00:14:28,440
get me, come along to go visit 
families and stuff like that. 

288
00:14:28,640 --> 00:14:32,000
The Bishop is the religious 
leader of that small church 

289
00:14:32,000 --> 00:14:34,640
right there, and there's several
different wards and that 

290
00:14:34,640 --> 00:14:37,440
individual. 
There's one individual per Ward 

291
00:14:37,440 --> 00:14:38,680
I. 
Think bishops are also in the 

292
00:14:38,680 --> 00:14:39,600
Catholic Church? 
That's. 

293
00:14:39,680 --> 00:14:41,440
Yeah, but they serve a different
purpose. 

294
00:14:41,880 --> 00:14:44,880
They they it's more of like a 
priest or or a father that. 

295
00:14:44,880 --> 00:14:47,720
Would be there over the 1A. 
Bishop would be more like a 

296
00:14:47,720 --> 00:14:49,920
stake president in the Catholic 
religion. 

297
00:14:50,320 --> 00:14:52,320
That's what it would be. 
So it's just higher up on the 

298
00:14:52,320 --> 00:14:57,120
chain and they see over more of 
those individuals, those priests

299
00:14:57,360 --> 00:14:59,560
and those fathers, right. 
So but it. 

300
00:14:59,560 --> 00:15:03,160
Yeah, absolutely it's it, it it 
sound like a nightmare. 

301
00:15:03,160 --> 00:15:06,080
And I mean I could imagine real 
quickly to go into it because 

302
00:15:06,080 --> 00:15:07,360
we're going right down that 
path. 

303
00:15:08,000 --> 00:15:11,600
Did your parents try to, like, 
coerce you, or talk to you or 

304
00:15:11,600 --> 00:15:13,960
get you to go on a mission? 
Everyone wanted me too, 'cause 

305
00:15:13,960 --> 00:15:16,360
it was just what all of our 
family did. 

306
00:15:16,680 --> 00:15:23,000
I have on my dad's side. 
On the elder side, there is a / 

307
00:15:23,000 --> 00:15:27,560
160 of us counting cousins, 
their siblings. 

308
00:15:27,560 --> 00:15:30,400
Like, there's kids. 
Like all of them. 

309
00:15:30,920 --> 00:15:35,600
There's just so many elders 
because they all have so many 

310
00:15:35,600 --> 00:15:37,520
kids. 
My dad comes from a family of 

311
00:15:37,520 --> 00:15:40,040
eight children, and then all of 
them had at least five kids. 

312
00:15:40,040 --> 00:15:42,800
And then, like, all of them. 
Yeah, And it's like, all right, 

313
00:15:42,800 --> 00:15:44,840
well, we don't have a lot of 
hobbies, but we know what we're 

314
00:15:44,840 --> 00:15:47,280
good at. 
So it was just interesting 

315
00:15:47,280 --> 00:15:52,400
because that whole side, every 
single one of them were Mormon, 

316
00:15:52,400 --> 00:15:57,240
except for I have one uncle. 
But he left back when I was 8. 

317
00:15:57,760 --> 00:16:01,160
He was almost ostracized, like 
treated way differently from the

318
00:16:01,160 --> 00:16:04,640
family, sad. 
And now like people still see 

319
00:16:04,640 --> 00:16:07,880
him differently. 
It's been years, but like, I 

320
00:16:07,880 --> 00:16:10,360
feel closer to him than I do any
of my out there uncles. 

321
00:16:10,800 --> 00:16:14,680
And that's because he is the 
most open, honest, loving, 

322
00:16:14,680 --> 00:16:19,480
caring person in the family. 
And it sucks because I see even 

323
00:16:19,480 --> 00:16:21,800
on like my mom's side, you know 
them very well. 

324
00:16:22,560 --> 00:16:27,800
They are all very staunch 
religious Mormon like LDS. 

325
00:16:27,800 --> 00:16:34,040
This mindset of perfectionism. 
Like the Not even necessarily 

326
00:16:34,040 --> 00:16:38,240
perfectionism, but the 
appearance of perfectionism. 

327
00:16:38,240 --> 00:16:40,400
Yeah. 
No, No blemishes. 

328
00:16:40,400 --> 00:16:42,040
No problem. 
Always happy. 

329
00:16:42,440 --> 00:16:44,240
Always willing to serve. 
Always. 

330
00:16:44,280 --> 00:16:46,240
And I I think that's great. 
That's one of the things that I 

331
00:16:46,240 --> 00:16:48,920
really enjoy about it. 
But yeah, no, I get it. 

332
00:16:49,000 --> 00:16:52,640
Like, I I know that your 
family's your mom's side. 

333
00:16:53,080 --> 00:16:56,760
I know very well. 
And you can see that stark 

334
00:16:56,760 --> 00:17:00,360
contrast between all of them. 
And then The funny thing is the 

335
00:17:00,360 --> 00:17:06,720
break from your mom and her 
brother, my father-in-law that I

336
00:17:06,720 --> 00:17:09,520
have no contact with at all. 
My family has no contact with 

337
00:17:10,240 --> 00:17:14,119
but and and and part of it was 
the religion and and what he had

338
00:17:14,119 --> 00:17:16,040
claimed over there. 
And that's something that I have

339
00:17:16,040 --> 00:17:18,839
always been not fighting 
against, but trying to be able 

340
00:17:18,839 --> 00:17:20,920
to help. 
Like not all of us are cut from 

341
00:17:20,920 --> 00:17:23,200
the same cloth. 
It's very easy to be able to 

342
00:17:23,200 --> 00:17:26,079
from what you saw growing up. 
Well, in that same thing, the 

343
00:17:26,079 --> 00:17:31,040
mindset that my dad had is that 
same mindset that like my ex 

344
00:17:31,040 --> 00:17:35,240
wife's ex-husband had, where 
it's this very patriarchal, like

345
00:17:35,240 --> 00:17:38,280
you do what I say because I'm 
the authority figure in here. 

346
00:17:38,280 --> 00:17:40,240
I'm the like. 
I'm the priesthood, the man. 

347
00:17:40,240 --> 00:17:42,240
I'm the priesthood holder of 
this home, yeah. 

348
00:17:42,960 --> 00:17:46,120
And there's been many 
conversations that we were sat 

349
00:17:46,120 --> 00:17:49,480
down and it was like, you will 
obey because this is what God 

350
00:17:49,480 --> 00:17:51,960
says. 
And God says that the kids 

351
00:17:51,960 --> 00:17:55,920
listen to the dad, the wife 
listens to the dad, that the 

352
00:17:55,920 --> 00:17:59,040
father is this like. 
Authoritarian figure. 

353
00:17:59,040 --> 00:18:01,440
He's an extension of God and you
have to listen to him. 

354
00:18:01,440 --> 00:18:04,080
Yeah, it's this third party 
maven that makes all the 

355
00:18:04,080 --> 00:18:05,080
decisions. 
Yeah. 

356
00:18:05,080 --> 00:18:07,840
And it's really interesting. 
And it was like the concept of 

357
00:18:07,840 --> 00:18:11,200
free will that they teach you. 
Like, the whole basis of Mormon 

358
00:18:11,200 --> 00:18:14,000
religion is that you have free 
will. 

359
00:18:14,520 --> 00:18:17,240
But and but then it's taught 
within the people. 

360
00:18:17,320 --> 00:18:19,760
And I say the people, not 
necessarily the faith. 

361
00:18:20,080 --> 00:18:22,280
Always the faith at the top of 
the people. 

362
00:18:22,520 --> 00:18:24,080
And then it becomes a part of 
the doctrine. 

363
00:18:24,080 --> 00:18:26,520
That's the weird thing. 
It becomes part of the dogma 

364
00:18:26,520 --> 00:18:28,720
because it becomes so 
indoctrinated. 

365
00:18:28,920 --> 00:18:31,560
Because when you meet LDS people
outside of this state, they 

366
00:18:31,560 --> 00:18:33,040
don't act like. 
That much better. 

367
00:18:33,160 --> 00:18:36,280
But again, it's based on the 
community, based on who's. 

368
00:18:36,280 --> 00:18:37,680
There, there's great people 
here. 

369
00:18:37,680 --> 00:18:41,040
I've had people that I grew up 
with who are Mormon, who I loved

370
00:18:41,040 --> 00:18:43,920
this day because I know the 
people who they are are 

371
00:18:43,920 --> 00:18:45,680
incredible people. 
Oh, thanks, man. 

372
00:18:45,680 --> 00:18:49,320
And then, but you know that. 
And then there's other ones who 

373
00:18:49,320 --> 00:18:51,400
you see who are two faced and 
they like. 

374
00:18:51,680 --> 00:18:53,280
Oh yeah, Sunday faces is what I 
used to. 

375
00:18:53,280 --> 00:18:53,720
Call. 
Yeah. 

376
00:18:53,720 --> 00:18:57,080
And it's like, you know, I don't
like that because it's fake. 

377
00:18:57,280 --> 00:19:00,720
And I hate, I hate fake. 
It's not worth the time. 

378
00:19:00,720 --> 00:19:04,240
It's not worth the energy. 
And I don't want to like deal 

379
00:19:04,240 --> 00:19:07,120
with that. 
Well and and we've seen a lot of

380
00:19:07,120 --> 00:19:10,560
there's been a mass exodus of of
a lot of faiths around the world

381
00:19:10,640 --> 00:19:14,080
not just LDS but but for the LDS
faith it's it's very 

382
00:19:14,080 --> 00:19:17,320
disheartening for them because 
it's you know what Brandon just 

383
00:19:17,320 --> 00:19:21,280
said it it's taught on well the 
the main principles are taught 

384
00:19:21,280 --> 00:19:27,000
on your freedom of choice right.
You have freedom you have agency

385
00:19:27,320 --> 00:19:29,880
to be able to do that. 
But I I like what you said there

386
00:19:29,880 --> 00:19:32,760
because it's this you have 
agency as long as you follow 

387
00:19:32,760 --> 00:19:37,160
these rules and understandable 
right way the way they're 

388
00:19:37,160 --> 00:19:39,640
thinking about it. 
But again, that negates. 

389
00:19:39,680 --> 00:19:42,680
It even goes to like you've had 
this discussion with your wife 

390
00:19:42,680 --> 00:19:45,480
because your wife really wanted 
to make your kids go to church 

391
00:19:45,720 --> 00:19:48,920
and you were like, no, they have
agency. 

392
00:19:48,960 --> 00:19:50,840
She really wanted it, but it's 
go because of the. 

393
00:19:50,840 --> 00:19:53,040
Mindset of how we grew up. 
Oh, totally. 

394
00:19:53,040 --> 00:19:54,480
And it's hard. 
It's still hard for her. 

395
00:19:54,480 --> 00:19:57,680
Yeah, but it's just something of
like, OK, but if you truly want 

396
00:19:57,680 --> 00:20:00,840
your kids to have the agency, 
don't like, yes, they're kids. 

397
00:20:00,840 --> 00:20:04,280
You obviously have boundaries 
and limits to keep your kids 

398
00:20:04,280 --> 00:20:05,080
safe. 
Correct. 

399
00:20:05,200 --> 00:20:08,880
But is necessarily making sure 
that they are at church every 

400
00:20:08,880 --> 00:20:13,440
single Sunday in that guideline 
or is it sometimes like hey, no.

401
00:20:13,880 --> 00:20:15,800
Yeah, I can understand. 
It's fine that you're at home 

402
00:20:15,800 --> 00:20:17,440
today. 
You actually brought up a 

403
00:20:17,440 --> 00:20:19,920
memory. 
My wife and I were dating at the

404
00:20:19,920 --> 00:20:24,320
time, and her mom is like, she's
a theologian. 

405
00:20:24,440 --> 00:20:26,400
I love the stories that have 
come. 

406
00:20:26,800 --> 00:20:30,200
They're awesome, but you know, 
and again, this is this was 

407
00:20:30,200 --> 00:20:32,880
taught to her now. 
Since then, she has opened up. 

408
00:20:33,040 --> 00:20:35,320
A lot. 
It's been taught to a lot. 

409
00:20:35,480 --> 00:20:37,240
Right. 
And it's it's not necessarily 

410
00:20:37,240 --> 00:20:39,080
breaking it. 
It's just getting a different 

411
00:20:39,080 --> 00:20:41,160
perspective. 
And that's why, again, I always 

412
00:20:41,160 --> 00:20:45,520
lean on I don't believe in truth
because truth is final for many 

413
00:20:45,520 --> 00:20:48,800
people, right? 
It's saying that there's only 

414
00:20:48,800 --> 00:20:51,080
one way that Brandon can hit 
that bong. 

415
00:20:51,160 --> 00:20:53,680
There's only one way. 
How many different bongs are out

416
00:20:53,680 --> 00:20:55,360
there, right? 
They had to put it in the 

417
00:20:55,360 --> 00:20:57,600
cannabis context in here because
it is cannabis school. 

418
00:20:57,960 --> 00:21:01,640
But at the same time though, 
like when when she would go 

419
00:21:01,640 --> 00:21:05,360
into, like her hardcore 
theology, it would go into her 

420
00:21:05,360 --> 00:21:08,800
every day. 
And my wife and I I mean, I'd 

421
00:21:08,800 --> 00:21:11,920
pick her up at her mom's house. 
And when I would pick her up, 

422
00:21:12,840 --> 00:21:15,040
her mom be like, are you gonna 
come to church with us today? 

423
00:21:15,240 --> 00:21:20,040
I said no, that's not happening.
And her her daughter, my wife 

424
00:21:20,040 --> 00:21:21,840
now she was like, no, I'm going 
with Jesse. 

425
00:21:21,840 --> 00:21:24,920
And she goes, well, I guess I'll
be the only one up in heaven 

426
00:21:24,920 --> 00:21:28,640
then, you know or LDS people 
believe in three tiers of 

427
00:21:28,640 --> 00:21:29,920
heaven. 
There's other faiths that 

428
00:21:29,920 --> 00:21:31,760
believe in even more tiers of 
heaven. 

429
00:21:31,960 --> 00:21:34,320
Whatever it is, it's the top 
tier. 

430
00:21:34,400 --> 00:21:36,680
She believed that if because we 
didn't come to church, we 

431
00:21:36,680 --> 00:21:38,320
wouldn't be able to gain access 
to there. 

432
00:21:38,640 --> 00:21:41,320
And all I said is, well, if 
you're the only one being able 

433
00:21:41,320 --> 00:21:44,520
to go up there then it's gonna 
be pretty fucking lonely because

434
00:21:44,560 --> 00:21:46,280
I don't. 
I don't believe in that type of 

435
00:21:46,960 --> 00:21:49,000
wherever is gonna happen we 
don't know. 

436
00:21:49,320 --> 00:21:52,960
That's that's the the concept of
ideology like, but that's the 

437
00:21:52,960 --> 00:21:55,360
thing like there's no truth. 
There's only the furtherment of 

438
00:21:55,360 --> 00:21:56,920
knowledge. 
Like the more I understand, the 

439
00:21:56,920 --> 00:21:58,920
more I can apply and it's what I
believe. 

440
00:21:59,240 --> 00:22:00,760
It's not what somebody can 
prove. 

441
00:22:01,040 --> 00:22:04,400
Like the best argument on there 
is you take up individual like 

442
00:22:04,400 --> 00:22:08,000
Neil deGrasse Tyson, right. 
Very intelligent scientist. 

443
00:22:08,320 --> 00:22:12,960
He is a theorist. 
He does not build, he does not 

444
00:22:12,960 --> 00:22:17,000
create. 
He only thinks and theoretical 

445
00:22:17,000 --> 00:22:21,520
physicist like him like even 
Cuku Taco or whatever his name 

446
00:22:21,520 --> 00:22:26,200
is he these guys. 
Like, I heard a really great 

447
00:22:26,200 --> 00:22:30,240
argument from another scientist 
who's a scientist like he 

448
00:22:30,360 --> 00:22:33,920
applies his learnings to actual 
shit. 

449
00:22:33,920 --> 00:22:37,680
We either make, create, or think
where we can go. 

450
00:22:37,920 --> 00:22:41,080
These guys are like, oh, and 
it's the quasar and all this 

451
00:22:41,080 --> 00:22:44,120
other stuff, which is great and 
we have some information, but 

452
00:22:44,120 --> 00:22:45,960
they talk about it as dogmatic 
truth. 

453
00:22:46,320 --> 00:22:50,840
And how I can prove this is go 
watch Neil deGrasse Tyson on any

454
00:22:50,840 --> 00:22:54,640
podcast and have him find an 
argument where he doesn't agree 

455
00:22:54,640 --> 00:22:57,600
with somebody else. 
It is the exact same way that 

456
00:22:57,600 --> 00:23:02,000
you will meet a very fanatical 
religious person talking about 

457
00:23:02,000 --> 00:23:06,800
the way to pray, the way to 
exercise your faith, the way to 

458
00:23:07,160 --> 00:23:09,160
encourage others to be a part of
your faith. 

459
00:23:09,320 --> 00:23:14,920
They're so fucking on point that
you are wrong no matter what you

460
00:23:14,920 --> 00:23:17,680
say, and it's not a narcissistic
idea. 

461
00:23:17,960 --> 00:23:22,200
It is truly a parasite. 
At that point, you are 

462
00:23:22,200 --> 00:23:25,560
brainwashed to do. 
You're an automaton. 

463
00:23:25,760 --> 00:23:30,440
You move the way we say, you do 
what we say, or else there is a 

464
00:23:30,440 --> 00:23:32,560
consequence. 
You don't get to go into the top

465
00:23:32,560 --> 00:23:34,680
tier heaven. 
You don't get to VIP heaven if 

466
00:23:34,680 --> 00:23:37,360
you don't meet these. 
Where hot chocolate's always is 

467
00:23:37,360 --> 00:23:39,840
always hot, but just at the 
right temperature in your 

468
00:23:39,840 --> 00:23:41,800
porridge. 
It's never cold, It's never too 

469
00:23:41,800 --> 00:23:42,800
hot. 
It's just right. 

470
00:23:43,200 --> 00:23:46,920
And that's weird, this concept 
of knowing that we're gonna go 

471
00:23:46,920 --> 00:23:50,040
somewhere without a doubt. 
And then you're saying, cool, do

472
00:23:50,040 --> 00:23:51,520
you have pictures? 
Yeah. 

473
00:23:51,520 --> 00:23:53,080
No. 
Do you have a journal where you 

474
00:23:53,080 --> 00:23:53,760
were writing? 
It's. 

475
00:23:53,960 --> 00:23:57,720
All based on ideas. 
And it's like, that's why it's 

476
00:23:58,240 --> 00:24:02,320
it's always funny when it's like
this is true and it's like, no, 

477
00:24:02,320 --> 00:24:06,240
you might feel it's true and 
that's OK That's OK to feel like

478
00:24:06,240 --> 00:24:10,640
it's true because all religion 
is based on feelings, and 

479
00:24:10,640 --> 00:24:14,000
feelings are only within you. 
Those feelings don't come from 

480
00:24:14,000 --> 00:24:17,240
another person, so no one can 
tell you that that feeling that 

481
00:24:17,240 --> 00:24:19,840
you had was like incorrect for 
you. 

482
00:24:20,400 --> 00:24:24,120
So let me ask you then, today we
we Fast forward you. 

483
00:24:24,200 --> 00:24:26,400
You haven't been in the faith 
for many, many, many years. 

484
00:24:26,520 --> 00:24:28,000
Probably a decade. 
Yeah. 

485
00:24:29,120 --> 00:24:33,400
Now, how is the relationship 
with, say, your mom, who is 

486
00:24:33,400 --> 00:24:36,440
very, she's very religious. 
How is that relationship? 

487
00:24:36,440 --> 00:24:40,000
Do you feel like it's stunted in
any way, that it's not fully 

488
00:24:40,200 --> 00:24:43,600
there or your mom loves you? 
My family loves me. 

489
00:24:43,600 --> 00:24:46,800
I feel like over the years, 
actually in the last 10 years, 

490
00:24:48,280 --> 00:24:50,800
that for my mom, I've always 
been closer with my mom. 

491
00:24:51,600 --> 00:24:54,200
So no matter what you've done, 
she's never shunned you. 

492
00:24:54,200 --> 00:24:58,720
Never pushed you away, so in. 
Truly acting as Christ, it 

493
00:24:58,720 --> 00:24:59,480
would. 
But you know. 

494
00:24:59,560 --> 00:25:01,280
As the faith of belief, yeah. 
You know my mom. 

495
00:25:01,280 --> 00:25:03,320
Totally. 
Like, I have nothing bad ever to

496
00:25:03,320 --> 00:25:04,960
say. 
I can't even do your mom jokes 

497
00:25:04,960 --> 00:25:07,160
and feel OK with it. 
We know. 

498
00:25:07,160 --> 00:25:08,400
We've talked about that. 
It's. 

499
00:25:08,840 --> 00:25:11,440
It's just different. 
But I've always been closer with

500
00:25:11,440 --> 00:25:14,240
her, Even so growing up where 
there's all these things that 

501
00:25:14,240 --> 00:25:18,040
are sins and frowned upon and 
you shouldn't do because you'll 

502
00:25:18,040 --> 00:25:22,160
go to hell. 
Like when I had sex with a woman

503
00:25:22,880 --> 00:25:24,720
for the first time. 
Well, I'm so glad that you 

504
00:25:24,720 --> 00:25:25,680
classified that. 
Oh. 

505
00:25:25,840 --> 00:25:30,640
My God. 
With a woman, not my hand or 

506
00:25:30,640 --> 00:25:31,560
something. 
That goes up. 

507
00:25:32,480 --> 00:25:37,000
So when I had sex and I went and
like I told my mom, not right 

508
00:25:37,000 --> 00:25:39,320
after, but like months later 
when I was having a real 

509
00:25:39,320 --> 00:25:43,800
conversation about stuff and I 
like I was talking to her and I 

510
00:25:43,800 --> 00:25:47,160
was like, this happened and she 
didn't judge me. 

511
00:25:47,160 --> 00:25:51,560
She didn't get mad at me. 
She was like, I was able to have

512
00:25:51,560 --> 00:25:52,880
a conversation. 
That's cool. 

513
00:25:53,400 --> 00:25:58,040
And so my dad, I can't do that. 
I haven't been able to because 

514
00:25:58,040 --> 00:26:00,920
he's very much so. 
This is how it is. 

515
00:26:00,960 --> 00:26:02,600
Which is funny. 
I mean, I'm not going to go into

516
00:26:02,600 --> 00:26:04,320
that, but that's funny. 
It is funny. 

517
00:26:05,440 --> 00:26:09,280
And so I just, I've never had 
that same conversation, like the

518
00:26:09,280 --> 00:26:12,200
same relationship that I've been
able to open up and do that 

519
00:26:13,000 --> 00:26:15,480
until more recently. 
It's taken time. 

520
00:26:16,000 --> 00:26:20,640
So with my mom, when I had 
decided that I was having my 

521
00:26:20,640 --> 00:26:24,760
records removed from the church,
that was hard to decide because 

522
00:26:25,280 --> 00:26:28,200
it wasn't because I didn't want 
to be there. 

523
00:26:28,200 --> 00:26:29,400
You just. 
Didn't want to hurt her. 

524
00:26:29,680 --> 00:26:33,160
It was because I truly couldn't 
believe it anymore and it was 

525
00:26:33,160 --> 00:26:36,320
like I sat down and my brother 
was getting married, my youngest

526
00:26:36,320 --> 00:26:40,960
brother around the same time and
he was getting married in the 

527
00:26:40,960 --> 00:26:44,360
temple and to go to his wedding 
in the temple. 

528
00:26:44,360 --> 00:26:46,440
You have to have records. 
You have to have a temple 

529
00:26:46,440 --> 00:26:49,680
recommend. 
I had an active temple recommend

530
00:26:49,920 --> 00:26:53,000
when I had my records removed. 
Yeah. 

531
00:26:53,000 --> 00:26:55,640
And I and you know what? 
I I applaud you on that because.

532
00:26:56,680 --> 00:26:59,000
But I I sat down with him and I 
was like. 

533
00:26:59,000 --> 00:27:00,840
Was that hard for him? 
It was. 

534
00:27:01,160 --> 00:27:03,840
It was, but it wasn't. 
It was hard because he had no 

535
00:27:03,840 --> 00:27:06,480
answers and the thing that I 
said because. 

536
00:27:06,480 --> 00:27:09,680
He wanted to have answers. 
Yeah, because I said, Thomas, 

537
00:27:09,680 --> 00:27:12,440
the reason why I I can't be at 
your wedding is not because I 

538
00:27:12,440 --> 00:27:17,280
can't like, because not because 
I don't want to be there, but 

539
00:27:17,280 --> 00:27:21,280
because truly I can't be there. 
Because this paper says that I 

540
00:27:21,280 --> 00:27:22,840
believe that this church is 
true. 

541
00:27:23,840 --> 00:27:27,440
Then I don't, and I don't 
believe that these things are 

542
00:27:27,440 --> 00:27:29,720
there because. 
And I said, and it's hard 

543
00:27:29,720 --> 00:27:32,080
because I've looked for these 
answers. 

544
00:27:32,080 --> 00:27:35,320
And where I looked was in what I
was taught, all of Mormon 

545
00:27:35,320 --> 00:27:37,680
history, Mormon literature, 
Mormon documents. 

546
00:27:38,040 --> 00:27:40,120
Because I was like, it was hard 
to go. 

547
00:27:40,400 --> 00:27:43,760
Everything I believed might not 
be true. 

548
00:27:43,760 --> 00:27:46,760
Everything I thought was true 
might not be true. 

549
00:27:46,760 --> 00:27:49,560
And yeah, I can go find, like 
you said, there's always biased 

550
00:27:49,560 --> 00:27:53,040
info everywhere 100%. 
That's why growing up they say 

551
00:27:53,320 --> 00:27:55,840
don't go read stuff because it's
anti Mormon literature And I'm 

552
00:27:55,840 --> 00:27:58,560
like I don't want to read stuff 
that is biased against it 

553
00:27:58,560 --> 00:28:01,600
because I know that's there. 
That's not the perception that 

554
00:28:01,600 --> 00:28:05,720
I'm trying to understand. 
I'm trying to learn about this. 

555
00:28:05,880 --> 00:28:09,040
Well, and and coming from a 
point where you're just like, 

556
00:28:09,160 --> 00:28:12,120
'cause it, and I get it, where 
you were grown up in this thing,

557
00:28:12,120 --> 00:28:14,920
where it's like, this is the 
truth, this is the truth, this 

558
00:28:14,920 --> 00:28:17,320
is the truth. 
And that's why I saw a lot of 

559
00:28:17,320 --> 00:28:20,360
people during the pandemic 
leaving the church, in my 

560
00:28:20,360 --> 00:28:23,720
neighborhoods, in my wards, in 
my, in my religious faction, 

561
00:28:24,200 --> 00:28:28,480
people were leaving like crazy 
because, and this is the way I 

562
00:28:28,480 --> 00:28:31,000
describe it, their faith was 
built on a sheet of glass, very 

563
00:28:31,000 --> 00:28:33,280
thin glass. 
It was built by others. 

564
00:28:33,440 --> 00:28:35,200
They never built their own 
foundation. 

565
00:28:35,480 --> 00:28:38,600
Well, it's just like mine. 
I had never really spent the 

566
00:28:38,600 --> 00:28:42,480
time to question or study and 
go, is this true? 

567
00:28:42,480 --> 00:28:45,600
Do I feel Because that's what 
it's all based on? 

568
00:28:45,600 --> 00:28:49,920
Do I feel that this is true? 
And then when I went through it 

569
00:28:49,920 --> 00:28:53,160
and I had like, all of these 
questions that I found and I 

570
00:28:53,160 --> 00:28:56,480
researched and all the answers 
that I found from the church 

571
00:28:57,200 --> 00:28:59,040
were not answers. 
It was circling around the 

572
00:28:59,040 --> 00:29:00,560
thing. 
And I'm like, you didn't answer 

573
00:29:00,560 --> 00:29:02,440
my question, You didn't address 
it. 

574
00:29:02,440 --> 00:29:06,200
And so my mom was like, so when 
I sat down and I was like, This 

575
00:29:06,200 --> 00:29:07,840
is why I can't believe it 
anymore. 

576
00:29:08,240 --> 00:29:10,680
And she's like, I don't, I don't
have those answers. 

577
00:29:10,680 --> 00:29:12,040
And I was like, I know you don't
mind. 

578
00:29:12,800 --> 00:29:16,080
Because I've spent. 
I've spent months and months 

579
00:29:16,360 --> 00:29:18,080
trying to find these answers, 
and I can't. 

580
00:29:18,080 --> 00:29:21,240
She was like, well, will you 
talk to Brother Branchley? 

581
00:29:21,240 --> 00:29:23,560
I grew up with him. 
He was a seminary teacher for 25

582
00:29:23,560 --> 00:29:25,280
years. 
I was like, I would love to. 

583
00:29:25,920 --> 00:29:29,600
And so I sent him all of my 
questions and all he sent back 

584
00:29:30,040 --> 00:29:33,040
was the pre things that I had 
already read from the church 

585
00:29:33,040 --> 00:29:35,240
that skirted around it. 
And he basically was like, I'm 

586
00:29:35,240 --> 00:29:38,560
sorry I don't have answers, but 
this is all I can find. 

587
00:29:38,960 --> 00:29:41,120
And I was like, I appreciate you
taking that time. 

588
00:29:41,440 --> 00:29:43,360
These are the answers that I had
already found. 

589
00:29:43,640 --> 00:29:45,760
And This is why I can't believe 
it anymore. 

590
00:29:46,240 --> 00:29:47,880
And so I had to have that 
removed. 

591
00:29:47,880 --> 00:29:51,040
And Thomas, he had just gotten 
off a mission like a year 

592
00:29:51,040 --> 00:29:53,440
before. 
So he was out preaching to 

593
00:29:53,440 --> 00:29:55,600
people going, hey, come join our
church. 

594
00:29:55,760 --> 00:29:59,040
Like this is our church, 
whatever, like baptizing people 

595
00:29:59,040 --> 00:30:01,360
into it. 
And so for him being a teacher 

596
00:30:01,360 --> 00:30:04,400
and then me coming to him and 
going, I love you. 

597
00:30:04,440 --> 00:30:08,800
I. 
So I over those two years, I had

598
00:30:08,840 --> 00:30:13,120
a closer relationship with him 
than anyone else in my family. 

599
00:30:13,480 --> 00:30:18,120
I wrote him every week, No one 
else in my family, not my mom, 

600
00:30:18,120 --> 00:30:21,360
not my dad. 
No one wrote him every week but 

601
00:30:21,360 --> 00:30:24,160
me. 
And over those two years we 

602
00:30:24,160 --> 00:30:27,840
became incredibly close. 
So when he was getting married 

603
00:30:27,840 --> 00:30:30,240
and he's like. 
I want you there. 

604
00:30:30,240 --> 00:30:33,760
Yeah, and I would love to be 
there, but I was like, I can't 

605
00:30:33,760 --> 00:30:37,240
be there because I don't believe
this. 

606
00:30:37,480 --> 00:30:40,360
And this card is supposed to be 
for these people who are like 

607
00:30:40,960 --> 00:30:44,360
highest believers back like in 
my eyes, someone if you hold a 

608
00:30:44,360 --> 00:30:47,520
temple recommend you should be 
like a true believer. 

609
00:30:47,560 --> 00:30:49,040
Like actually. 
Yeah. 

610
00:30:49,040 --> 00:30:52,040
And I mean, I, I I get that. 
That's why I like, you know, 

611
00:30:52,200 --> 00:30:55,440
hearing what I've said, it's 
contradictory to what a lot of 

612
00:30:55,440 --> 00:30:58,760
people would think about it. 
So you know, and that's and 

613
00:30:58,760 --> 00:31:01,080
that's awesome though if you're 
able to admit that to. 

614
00:31:01,080 --> 00:31:04,560
Yourself. 
I also have looked at now what 

615
00:31:05,800 --> 00:31:10,240
like even Book of Mormon wise 
like you can drink your own 

616
00:31:10,240 --> 00:31:11,880
beer. 
You can drink your own wine 

617
00:31:11,880 --> 00:31:14,000
according to the Doctrine and 
Covenants. 

618
00:31:14,440 --> 00:31:16,360
Like there are so many things 
that are taught. 

619
00:31:16,360 --> 00:31:17,880
Or like the original Book of 
Mormon. 

620
00:31:18,120 --> 00:31:20,560
That is what I read. 
Well, and and you. 

621
00:31:20,560 --> 00:31:23,320
Have the original print. 
Yeah, And that's the thing. 

622
00:31:23,320 --> 00:31:24,800
It's sort of like it. 
It changes. 

623
00:31:24,800 --> 00:31:26,480
That's why people change it. 
You just said it there. 

624
00:31:26,480 --> 00:31:29,280
You know, the history goes to 
the victors and that's exactly 

625
00:31:29,280 --> 00:31:31,240
what happens. 
Whoever is inducted to that 

626
00:31:31,240 --> 00:31:33,760
higher point of the Church which
is the prophet of the LDS 

627
00:31:33,760 --> 00:31:36,600
Church, it would be the Pope of 
the Catholic Church as the 

628
00:31:36,600 --> 00:31:38,600
leader of that. 
Book of Mormon was rewritten and

629
00:31:38,600 --> 00:31:40,440
they changed. 
A lot of things. 

630
00:31:40,480 --> 00:31:44,800
And that entire structure 
changed because before the 

631
00:31:45,320 --> 00:31:49,600
Mormon church structure was a 
trinitarian view of the Godhead,

632
00:31:49,680 --> 00:31:52,520
a very Christian based Godhead, 
yeah, 100%. 

633
00:31:52,520 --> 00:31:58,040
And now in the rewriting, it 
changed Jesus from being God to 

634
00:31:58,040 --> 00:32:02,600
the Son of God and like it's 
created a whole different 

635
00:32:03,120 --> 00:32:06,040
structure. 
Which is fine, like every 

636
00:32:06,040 --> 00:32:08,480
religion has that, like every 
church. 

637
00:32:09,080 --> 00:32:10,960
It's not saying that their 
stories are incorrect. 

638
00:32:10,960 --> 00:32:13,720
It's just, I mean you could even
go from Jaden and Thor. 

639
00:32:14,080 --> 00:32:16,880
So it's just it's a continuation
of that and I think that's where

640
00:32:16,880 --> 00:32:19,840
humans are always trying to be 
able to find that and you know, 

641
00:32:19,840 --> 00:32:22,640
to hear what you've gone through
like absolutely. 

642
00:32:22,640 --> 00:32:27,320
Like I think that most people 
who are in a faith crisis, and I

643
00:32:27,320 --> 00:32:31,160
call it a faith crisis because 
it's you're not in a place where

644
00:32:31,160 --> 00:32:34,280
you feel comfortable anymore. 
You have so many questions. 

645
00:32:34,280 --> 00:32:38,360
And that's why like even with my
own kids, I I teach them that 

646
00:32:38,400 --> 00:32:43,360
the truth is what you believe. 
But be open to change because 

647
00:32:43,360 --> 00:32:46,200
it's a constant. 
And if you believe that 

648
00:32:46,200 --> 00:32:50,920
something is 100% true in one 
way and then somebody shows you 

649
00:32:50,920 --> 00:32:54,280
something like the other side of
the mirror and they go, it's 

650
00:32:54,280 --> 00:32:57,000
like a two way mirror, right? 
Imagine this. 

651
00:32:57,000 --> 00:32:59,840
You've got a two way mirror to 
use every day, whether you're 

652
00:32:59,840 --> 00:33:02,960
doing your makeup, getting 
ready, you know, pleasuring 

653
00:33:02,960 --> 00:33:04,960
yourself, whatever it is, 
whatever you're into, you're 

654
00:33:04,960 --> 00:33:06,840
doing it in front of this 
mirror. 

655
00:33:06,840 --> 00:33:10,200
And then one day somebody comes 
over and says hey let me show 

656
00:33:10,200 --> 00:33:12,680
you this little room. 
And you go into a room and 

657
00:33:12,680 --> 00:33:16,120
there's nothing but chairs and a
recording, and it's your mirror.

658
00:33:16,400 --> 00:33:19,400
From the other side. 
From the other side, To reveal 

659
00:33:19,400 --> 00:33:24,200
that would be terrifying, 
infuriating. 

660
00:33:24,440 --> 00:33:26,920
Could you imagine? 
But then your whole identity has

661
00:33:26,920 --> 00:33:28,920
been out there, and it's been a.
It's been a. 

662
00:33:29,240 --> 00:33:30,800
But that's what it feels like. 
Right. 

663
00:33:30,800 --> 00:33:33,920
You're being shown something, 
yeah, but it's not OK to you. 

664
00:33:34,000 --> 00:33:36,400
That's why I've always So now I 
don't. 

665
00:33:37,160 --> 00:33:39,400
I don't think there is a truth. 
I don't think there's something 

666
00:33:39,400 --> 00:33:42,440
that's like this. 
I mean, maybe it is, maybe there

667
00:33:42,440 --> 00:33:44,080
is. 
But we have no clue. 

668
00:33:44,080 --> 00:33:46,680
We have no fucking clue. 
Well, the the way that I look at

669
00:33:46,680 --> 00:33:49,040
a lot of of of religions is like
cultures. 

670
00:33:49,040 --> 00:33:51,080
So you have cultures and then 
you have subcultures. 

671
00:33:51,080 --> 00:33:54,200
Within those cultures all around
the world we have different 

672
00:33:54,200 --> 00:33:57,000
cultures especially like that 
great book I told you about 

673
00:33:57,000 --> 00:34:00,240
called the The The Culture Code.
Great book written by a 

674
00:34:00,240 --> 00:34:02,440
Frenchman. 
Does he really had it nailed 

675
00:34:02,440 --> 00:34:05,280
down? 
Because if you take Americans 

676
00:34:05,280 --> 00:34:08,760
for example, and and the Mormon 
faith was born here in the 

677
00:34:08,760 --> 00:34:12,080
United States, nowhere else. 
So the Mormon faith here, and 

678
00:34:12,080 --> 00:34:14,159
and I call it Mormon or LDS or 
whatever. 

679
00:34:14,520 --> 00:34:19,600
Mormon has just been like the 
most because it's the book it 

680
00:34:19,600 --> 00:34:21,679
was rebranded in the last 10 
years. 

681
00:34:21,679 --> 00:34:23,520
Yeah, they wanted to go more 
towards Latter Day Saints 

682
00:34:23,520 --> 00:34:24,960
because they are Latter Day 
Saints. 

683
00:34:25,120 --> 00:34:29,600
It's just Mormons is when their 
brand for the last 200. 

684
00:34:29,600 --> 00:34:30,600
Years. 
What is the book called? 

685
00:34:30,800 --> 00:34:33,679
The Book of Mormon, right. 
And so it was always so for 

686
00:34:33,679 --> 00:34:38,360
everyone listening who's not LDS
like Mormons is what you've 

687
00:34:38,360 --> 00:34:40,239
heard for the longest time. 
Right. 

688
00:34:40,239 --> 00:34:42,239
And it, and I mean, if you're 
hearing me and you get offended 

689
00:34:42,239 --> 00:34:45,520
because I'm calling it Mormon or
I have to call it LDS, eat a 

690
00:34:45,520 --> 00:34:47,400
Dick, 'cause I don't care. 
It doesn't. 

691
00:34:47,400 --> 00:34:48,920
Branding. 
You know what we're talking 

692
00:34:48,920 --> 00:34:50,840
about. 
Right the way I own it, like 

693
00:34:50,920 --> 00:34:53,639
what Derek said, I got a billion
religion. 

694
00:34:53,639 --> 00:34:57,400
Religions, because no one in 
that same religion has the exact

695
00:34:57,400 --> 00:34:59,600
same belief. 
Like their thoughts are going to

696
00:34:59,600 --> 00:35:01,520
be different than the person 
next to them, and their 

697
00:35:01,520 --> 00:35:04,000
experiences are going to craft 
them different than the person 

698
00:35:04,000 --> 00:35:06,040
next to them. 
So they're going to believe it 

699
00:35:06,200 --> 00:35:09,960
down to the granular level, 
totally different because 

700
00:35:09,960 --> 00:35:14,200
they're different people and 
it's like everyone has that. 

701
00:35:14,560 --> 00:35:18,320
You know, it's so interesting to
hear the contrast, the compare 

702
00:35:18,320 --> 00:35:20,920
and contrast from where you came
from to where I am at. 

703
00:35:21,240 --> 00:35:23,800
You know, the way that I got 
into it was my wife had. 

704
00:35:23,840 --> 00:35:26,560
She was very much a part of the 
faith and it very much helped 

705
00:35:26,560 --> 00:35:29,520
her feel good and comfortable 
with what she had. 

706
00:35:29,520 --> 00:35:31,560
But she never really owned her 
faith. 

707
00:35:31,560 --> 00:35:33,920
It's also been a security 
blanket in a lot of ways, 'cause

708
00:35:33,920 --> 00:35:37,760
there's been people who have 
helped you go through things in 

709
00:35:37,760 --> 00:35:39,480
there. 
But on top of it, though, you 

710
00:35:39,480 --> 00:35:41,680
have to look at it from the 
sense of what you grew up in. 

711
00:35:41,680 --> 00:35:46,240
She grew up in the same family 
structure, 5 generations, yeah, 

712
00:35:46,480 --> 00:35:50,280
all involved in the church. 
Both sides like really strong 

713
00:35:50,280 --> 00:35:53,760
and for me to come in being an 
atheist. 

714
00:35:53,960 --> 00:35:57,360
Well, that's why I don't ever. 
I can't imagine her leaving. 

715
00:35:57,800 --> 00:36:00,840
No, but well, I mean, I I told 
her and I was like, look, you 

716
00:36:00,840 --> 00:36:03,480
know, she says if you, you know,
I'll get married to you as long 

717
00:36:03,480 --> 00:36:05,880
as you can get sealed to me in 
the temple later on, which is an

718
00:36:05,880 --> 00:36:10,720
act that LDS Mormons do, you 
know, and it's part of their 

719
00:36:10,720 --> 00:36:12,600
faith and that that's fine. 
It's a rites of passage. 

720
00:36:12,600 --> 00:36:15,160
I got sealed later, yeah. 
Totally fine, right? 

721
00:36:15,160 --> 00:36:17,440
I mean, it doesn't it? 
It's just a choice. 

722
00:36:17,440 --> 00:36:21,320
And it's sad to see a lot of 
parents pressuring their kids to

723
00:36:21,320 --> 00:36:23,480
make sure that they do that. 
Look, if it's their choice, let 

724
00:36:23,480 --> 00:36:25,360
them do that. 
We were definitely pressured 

725
00:36:25,360 --> 00:36:28,240
into it. 
When I went through, my family 

726
00:36:28,240 --> 00:36:30,520
was in shock. 
They're like, what? 

727
00:36:30,760 --> 00:36:34,720
Even going through it, which I 
won't discuss here, but even 

728
00:36:34,720 --> 00:36:36,640
during those things, you know, 
it was kind of funny, like 

729
00:36:36,640 --> 00:36:38,920
realizations to my wife, and it 
kind of made me laugh. 

730
00:36:38,920 --> 00:36:40,920
And I'm like, that's cool. 
Like, I don't, I don't. 

731
00:36:40,920 --> 00:36:42,320
It's not going to bother me that
much. 

732
00:36:42,320 --> 00:36:45,200
Like I enjoy. 
It's, it's a place of worship. 

733
00:36:45,200 --> 00:36:47,080
It's a place of meditation if 
you choose. 

734
00:36:47,080 --> 00:36:52,200
To do something to from religion
like my I look at it and I I see

735
00:36:52,200 --> 00:36:58,000
my parents, they're 60, like 
they are 60 years into this 

736
00:36:58,000 --> 00:37:01,200
religion with the mindset and 
the family like everything that 

737
00:37:01,200 --> 00:37:02,520
they've got. 
Their identity? 

738
00:37:02,520 --> 00:37:05,040
No. 
Way that I could ever see them 

739
00:37:06,120 --> 00:37:09,840
considering anything different. 
But if they did, it would be so.

740
00:37:09,840 --> 00:37:11,280
I think it world. 
Shattering. 

741
00:37:11,320 --> 00:37:14,000
That's what I would worry about,
is it would truly shatter 

742
00:37:14,000 --> 00:37:16,440
everything. 
And that would 'cause that's 

743
00:37:16,440 --> 00:37:18,560
what I experienced. 
But I didn't believe it like 

744
00:37:18,560 --> 00:37:21,800
they did, and I didn't have 60 
years of believing it like they 

745
00:37:21,800 --> 00:37:24,360
did. 
My dad went on a mission like 

746
00:37:25,320 --> 00:37:31,000
and he's been preaching all the 
time, like constantly and like 

747
00:37:31,280 --> 00:37:34,000
even to the point that now it's 
been over the years we've had 

748
00:37:34,000 --> 00:37:38,480
way more discussions and 
arguments on theologies and 

749
00:37:38,480 --> 00:37:40,440
ideas and stuff because. 
The illusion of truth. 

750
00:37:40,640 --> 00:37:44,360
And now it's like, he's very 
much so like, oh, this is right 

751
00:37:44,360 --> 00:37:48,920
or oh this and I'm like no. 
And like now I'm to the point 

752
00:37:48,920 --> 00:37:51,920
that I will argue it and just 
go, no, that's not it. 

753
00:37:51,920 --> 00:37:55,800
Like we were, I was helping him 
remodel an apartment and he was 

754
00:37:55,800 --> 00:37:58,400
like, well, we can both agree 
that Joseph Smith was a good 

755
00:37:58,400 --> 00:38:01,840
person, was like, no, see, 
that's why we're wrong. 

756
00:38:02,000 --> 00:38:05,280
You might assume that, but 
that's because I don't vocalize 

757
00:38:05,280 --> 00:38:07,160
all of my thoughts and 
perspectives on it. 

758
00:38:07,320 --> 00:38:10,600
Well, I mean, even that though I
I look at it going, it's easy to

759
00:38:10,600 --> 00:38:12,600
be able to find any fault in a 
human. 

760
00:38:12,600 --> 00:38:16,160
But to go, well, we both can say
this and I'm like, now you're 

761
00:38:16,160 --> 00:38:19,400
putting words in my mouth and 
now you're going that you know 

762
00:38:19,680 --> 00:38:22,640
everything I know about this 
person and you know how I feel 

763
00:38:22,640 --> 00:38:25,480
about this person. 
And that is 100% incorrect on 

764
00:38:25,480 --> 00:38:27,240
this. 
I've told you how I feel about 

765
00:38:27,240 --> 00:38:30,040
this person. 8 billion that. 
And I'm like 8,000,000 

766
00:38:30,240 --> 00:38:32,320
religions. 
And so that like moments like 

767
00:38:32,320 --> 00:38:35,840
that where I'm like, no, and I 
stop him and I and that was hard

768
00:38:35,840 --> 00:38:38,720
because I was like, I actually 
don't because of this. 

769
00:38:39,040 --> 00:38:41,320
And I said, I don't tell you 
these things because my intent 

770
00:38:41,320 --> 00:38:42,720
is never to shatter your 
beliefs. 

771
00:38:43,040 --> 00:38:45,680
Well and and and let me give the
contrast on this and so to 

772
00:38:45,680 --> 00:38:47,360
explain a little bit more about 
my story. 

773
00:38:47,360 --> 00:38:51,120
So we go through it. 
We have our kid. 

774
00:38:51,120 --> 00:38:55,200
My wife says, hey, I want to do 
that and I used to drink pretty 

775
00:38:55,200 --> 00:38:58,480
frequently, infrequently meaning
every week. 

776
00:38:58,680 --> 00:38:59,680
But it wasn't like I was 
getting. 

777
00:39:01,000 --> 00:39:02,520
Shit faced drunk. 
Yeah, I never did that. 

778
00:39:02,520 --> 00:39:04,200
Never. 
Just having a couple drinks. 

779
00:39:04,200 --> 00:39:06,920
Yeah, just having a few drinks. 
Like I I used to get shit faced 

780
00:39:06,920 --> 00:39:08,400
drunk when I was in the Navy. 
Why? 

781
00:39:08,400 --> 00:39:11,080
Because I was in the Navy like 
and I'm sorry if that's a 

782
00:39:11,080 --> 00:39:15,040
stereotype in the Navy like 99 
point something percent of Navy 

783
00:39:15,040 --> 00:39:17,680
people to actually drink and the
other small percent used to 

784
00:39:17,680 --> 00:39:20,600
drink but now they have a 
problem and you know but anyway 

785
00:39:20,600 --> 00:39:23,880
the. 
Problem is, don't drink and 

786
00:39:23,880 --> 00:39:26,040
they're surrounded by people who
do but. 

787
00:39:26,120 --> 00:39:29,080
We had all these circumstances 
happened in our life, right? 

788
00:39:29,080 --> 00:39:32,080
And we did the, the temple 
thing, 'cause it appeased her 

789
00:39:32,080 --> 00:39:33,680
side of the family. 
It really did. 

790
00:39:34,080 --> 00:39:36,200
And and some of my family were 
like, yeah, I'll support you on 

791
00:39:36,200 --> 00:39:37,200
that. 
They're like, that's cool. 

792
00:39:37,520 --> 00:39:39,320
You know, my sister who was 
involved in the church at the 

793
00:39:39,320 --> 00:39:41,840
time who's no longer in it, 
like, she was super supportive 

794
00:39:41,840 --> 00:39:43,680
of it. 
My dad was supportive of it. 

795
00:39:43,680 --> 00:39:45,680
My mom was supportive, but she 
lived in Massachusetts. 

796
00:39:45,680 --> 00:39:47,640
It didn't really matter. 
It's not a big thing, and it 

797
00:39:47,640 --> 00:39:50,560
wasn't a big thing to me. 
It was just another step. 

798
00:39:51,000 --> 00:39:53,800
And that's not even where my 
faith came from, because I was 

799
00:39:53,800 --> 00:39:55,520
just. 
I was annoyed. 

800
00:39:55,520 --> 00:39:59,080
We had this circumstance where 
I've I've been in generational 

801
00:39:59,080 --> 00:40:03,080
poverty for most of my life, but
it hasn't been like generations.

802
00:40:03,080 --> 00:40:05,680
I'm like the first generation of
poverty, but it came from my 

803
00:40:05,680 --> 00:40:07,400
parents. 
And my parents did well later 

804
00:40:07,400 --> 00:40:10,120
on. 
But I've gone up and down 

805
00:40:10,120 --> 00:40:13,200
throughout that whole time, 
right even now, like kind of 

806
00:40:13,200 --> 00:40:16,200
creeping out of poverty. 
But it's it's always been a 

807
00:40:16,200 --> 00:40:18,640
constant. 
And I wanted to break that, and 

808
00:40:18,640 --> 00:40:20,040
I'm doing things now to break 
that. 

809
00:40:20,040 --> 00:40:23,240
But we had this constant thing. 
But faith wasn't really a part 

810
00:40:23,240 --> 00:40:26,000
of my family's upbringing. 
It was just something we did. 

811
00:40:26,320 --> 00:40:28,440
And then when? 
We were treated with a lot of 

812
00:40:28,440 --> 00:40:30,760
hostility. 
My dad is first generation 

813
00:40:30,760 --> 00:40:32,400
Mexican here in the state of 
Utah. 

814
00:40:33,440 --> 00:40:35,840
Out of his whole family, he's 
the only one that came up here. 

815
00:40:36,280 --> 00:40:40,240
But he did it right. 
You know, he came up here 

816
00:40:40,440 --> 00:40:44,160
through a visa, applied for 
citizenship, took the test, went

817
00:40:44,160 --> 00:40:45,880
through everything. 
He didn't just marry my mom for 

818
00:40:45,880 --> 00:40:48,040
a green card. 
And he got. 

819
00:40:48,160 --> 00:40:50,400
In they were they were married 
for a long time. 

820
00:40:50,400 --> 00:40:52,320
Yeah, they were married for 
quite a bit, married for over 2 

821
00:40:52,320 --> 00:40:55,640
decades. 
And you know, my dad came up 

822
00:40:55,640 --> 00:41:00,120
here, the faith bringer. 
He is like, he lives this. 

823
00:41:00,320 --> 00:41:05,080
He served an LDS mission and has
some amazing, crazy stories, 

824
00:41:05,080 --> 00:41:06,720
right. 
He, he served his mission in 

825
00:41:06,720 --> 00:41:08,760
Sinaloa. 
You know what Sinaloa is? 

826
00:41:09,080 --> 00:41:12,320
Sinaloa cartel. 
One of the most brutal cartels 

827
00:41:12,320 --> 00:41:14,040
in Mexico out of time. 
Now they've got something in 

828
00:41:14,040 --> 00:41:16,160
there. 
It's way worse, but it's one of 

829
00:41:16,160 --> 00:41:18,080
the worst places. 
It also has one of the largest 

830
00:41:18,080 --> 00:41:19,560
lithium mines in the world. 
Wow. 

831
00:41:20,520 --> 00:41:22,440
Yeah, that's where the Chinese 
are down there. 

832
00:41:22,720 --> 00:41:26,680
But anyways, like, my dad served
as He comes here, meets my mom. 

833
00:41:26,680 --> 00:41:29,480
My mom converts like he has died
in the wall. 

834
00:41:29,800 --> 00:41:34,680
He is. 
He never understood racism or 

835
00:41:34,680 --> 00:41:37,760
discrimination by any means. 
And that's when he experienced 

836
00:41:37,760 --> 00:41:41,160
it was inside the church, from 
the members, from bishops, from 

837
00:41:41,160 --> 00:41:42,960
state presidents, from random 
people. 

838
00:41:42,960 --> 00:41:45,400
If they didn't serve a mission 
in Mexico, they would treat him 

839
00:41:45,400 --> 00:41:47,880
like an underling. 
And the reason why is because 

840
00:41:47,880 --> 00:41:50,080
Utah was predominantly white at 
the time. 

841
00:41:50,480 --> 00:41:52,480
Like there wasn't very many 
Hispanics or anything. 

842
00:41:52,480 --> 00:41:53,760
It was just white people. 
Terrible. 

843
00:41:54,160 --> 00:41:57,720
But again, it it was the time. 
Because the time was still 

844
00:41:57,720 --> 00:42:00,800
coming out of the the Jim Crow 
and all that other stuff. 

845
00:42:00,840 --> 00:42:03,680
It wasn't just people of color 
with black. 

846
00:42:03,680 --> 00:42:05,640
It was everybody who was not 
white. 

847
00:42:05,920 --> 00:42:08,200
It was terrible. 
Very white to my grandparents. 

848
00:42:08,240 --> 00:42:11,600
I've heard massively racist, 
racist comments. 

849
00:42:11,600 --> 00:42:13,760
Yeah, that's. 
Funny to me, what the fuck? 

850
00:42:13,880 --> 00:42:16,440
But I grew up in that. 
I grew up in Utah during that 

851
00:42:16,440 --> 00:42:19,240
racism time, so I had every 
reason to not be a part of this 

852
00:42:19,240 --> 00:42:21,360
faith. 
We left when I was young and I 

853
00:42:21,360 --> 00:42:23,960
never looked back. 
Yeah, I only did things with 

854
00:42:23,960 --> 00:42:26,520
like a Bishop when he would ask 
me to go visit these families 

855
00:42:26,520 --> 00:42:29,200
called home teaching. 
Back then, I would only do it 

856
00:42:29,200 --> 00:42:31,400
out of respect for my elders, 
'cause that's what I was taught.

857
00:42:31,560 --> 00:42:33,240
I respect my elders, so I would 
go with them. 

858
00:42:33,240 --> 00:42:34,640
Is that why you hang out with 
me? 

859
00:42:34,800 --> 00:42:37,200
No, no, no, no. 
I hang out with you, 'cause you,

860
00:42:37,480 --> 00:42:40,760
you know, you got me into pot. 
But no, there's not many 

861
00:42:40,760 --> 00:42:41,400
different things. 
But. 

862
00:42:41,720 --> 00:42:43,000
You know he's giving shit. 
Oh. 

863
00:42:43,000 --> 00:42:46,120
Yeah, yeah. 
But I had we we left it. 

864
00:42:46,120 --> 00:42:48,160
I never went back to it, never 
did any of it. 

865
00:42:48,160 --> 00:42:52,960
My dad still believed, and even 
up to when my brother served in 

866
00:42:52,960 --> 00:42:55,320
the Army and I'd served in the 
Navy. 

867
00:42:55,320 --> 00:42:59,000
My dad like asked me if I would 
put all my dog tads and I'm LDS 

868
00:42:59,000 --> 00:43:00,480
and I'm like, yeah, fine, 
whatever. 

869
00:43:00,680 --> 00:43:05,120
Like I didn't give a shit. 
I got like the the the chaplain 

870
00:43:05,120 --> 00:43:08,320
which is the religious leader on
the ship or a religious officer,

871
00:43:08,320 --> 00:43:12,680
I should say, there to help with
services for all faiths. 

872
00:43:13,240 --> 00:43:16,880
And he found a Book of Mormon 
that was like this tiny little 

873
00:43:16,880 --> 00:43:19,640
red one that they used to give 
the missionaries back in the 

874
00:43:19,640 --> 00:43:21,600
day. 
And he gave one to me, goes, 

875
00:43:21,600 --> 00:43:23,200
hey, I found this in the ship 
library. 

876
00:43:23,760 --> 00:43:26,360
I saw that your LDS, I'm kind of
in. 

877
00:43:26,800 --> 00:43:28,440
I have to give it to you so. 
It's funny. 

878
00:43:28,520 --> 00:43:29,920
Cool. 
Threw it in my rack. 

879
00:43:29,920 --> 00:43:31,280
I didn't. 
I didn't fucking use it. 

880
00:43:31,600 --> 00:43:34,200
Makes sense I. 
Read it later on multiple times 

881
00:43:34,200 --> 00:43:36,280
while I was on in the service, 
but just read it. 

882
00:43:36,280 --> 00:43:38,440
To read it. 
I also read this time I looked 

883
00:43:38,440 --> 00:43:41,280
at King James Bible, I read a 
bunch of religious texts 'cause 

884
00:43:41,280 --> 00:43:48,120
I had nothing but fucking time. 
But all that said, we get to the

885
00:43:48,120 --> 00:43:50,760
time, even past the time where I
got in the temple, 'cause I did 

886
00:43:50,760 --> 00:43:53,440
that to keep my relationship 
with my wife. 

887
00:43:53,640 --> 00:43:55,320
Yeah, that's what I did. 
And a lot of people do that 

888
00:43:55,320 --> 00:43:57,600
tell. 
Me about when it changed. 

889
00:43:57,920 --> 00:44:03,280
So we had to move in with her 
dad and. 

890
00:44:03,960 --> 00:44:06,200
Yeah, we know how fun that is. 
Well, it wasn't even that. 

891
00:44:06,200 --> 00:44:08,120
It was My wife just told me, 
'cause you can't drink beer 

892
00:44:08,120 --> 00:44:09,920
anymore. 
She still let me drink beer. 

893
00:44:10,360 --> 00:44:12,960
And my my whole routine was 
like, we'd rent a place when 

894
00:44:12,960 --> 00:44:15,400
we're moving out. 
It was like one or two years. 

895
00:44:15,840 --> 00:44:18,520
I would clean the carpets and 
get shit faced on Heineken. 

896
00:44:19,360 --> 00:44:21,120
Like I would just drink. 
I would start upstairs. 

897
00:44:21,120 --> 00:44:22,400
By the time I got done, I was at
the front door. 

898
00:44:22,400 --> 00:44:23,840
I had to call my wife to come 
pick me up. 

899
00:44:23,920 --> 00:44:25,280
That's funny. 
That's right. 

900
00:44:25,280 --> 00:44:26,720
That was my routine. 
She's like, you can't do that 

901
00:44:26,720 --> 00:44:28,080
anymore. 
You can't go to bars or stuff 

902
00:44:28,080 --> 00:44:29,680
like that to hang out with your 
friends, which I never really 

903
00:44:29,680 --> 00:44:31,880
did. 
But I can't do any of that 

904
00:44:31,880 --> 00:44:34,200
anymore and we have to go to 
church. 

905
00:44:34,200 --> 00:44:36,680
That pissed me off. 
I was like, fuck that. 

906
00:44:36,680 --> 00:44:39,840
I'm not being a part of this one
Sunday. 

907
00:44:39,840 --> 00:44:43,360
I'm in church and I'm sitting 
there in one of, like, the front

908
00:44:43,360 --> 00:45:03,080
pews and I still get emotional. 
I'll talk about and I just, I 

909
00:45:03,080 --> 00:45:04,520
said, you know what? 
This is bullshit. 

910
00:45:05,280 --> 00:45:08,720
I don't want to sit here and 
listen to these sanctimonious 

911
00:45:08,920 --> 00:45:13,720
pieces of shit. 
Just go on about how cool they 

912
00:45:13,720 --> 00:45:15,720
look in front of people, 'cause 
that's what I had learned. 

913
00:45:17,640 --> 00:45:20,600
So I said, you know what? 
If you're real, any part of this

914
00:45:20,600 --> 00:45:23,320
is real. 
And I'm not just saying the 

915
00:45:23,320 --> 00:45:27,360
church, I'm just saying, God, if
this is real, you're going to 

916
00:45:27,360 --> 00:45:31,320
sit me down and just say these 
are good people, 'cause I'm 

917
00:45:31,320 --> 00:45:39,950
leaving. 
And I went to stand up and I 

918
00:45:39,950 --> 00:45:43,350
felt a presence. 
And I am not a religious person 

919
00:45:43,350 --> 00:45:45,910
at this point, ever. 
I would laugh at you. 

920
00:45:46,560 --> 00:45:49,120
There's God, fucking show me. 
That's what I would say. 

921
00:45:49,120 --> 00:45:51,120
Fucking show me. 
Well there's Christ. 

922
00:45:51,120 --> 00:45:53,600
I don't give a shit. 
Sounds like a cool dude. 

923
00:45:53,720 --> 00:45:55,080
Sounds like a really cool 
hippie. 

924
00:45:55,920 --> 00:46:00,240
And I was sat down and it felt 
like somebody hugging me and I 

925
00:46:00,240 --> 00:46:06,360
was overwhelmed. 
I was fucking over 10 years ago 

926
00:46:07,880 --> 00:46:11,080
and it changed my life. 
It changed my life in the sense 

927
00:46:11,080 --> 00:46:12,720
that I was just like, you know 
what? 

928
00:46:12,720 --> 00:46:14,400
I'm not going to follow 
everything that these guys go 

929
00:46:14,400 --> 00:46:16,280
over. 
I'm not going to believe all the

930
00:46:16,280 --> 00:46:19,280
dogmatic things that you guys go
through, but it just made me 

931
00:46:19,280 --> 00:46:21,760
feel like there's something 
more. 

932
00:46:22,360 --> 00:46:25,880
And ever since then, I'm like, I
don't claim to know everything. 

933
00:46:25,880 --> 00:46:29,360
And I don't claim to say that 
what my faith is, is the real 

934
00:46:29,360 --> 00:46:31,840
faith or the true faith. 
Cause again, that would negate 

935
00:46:32,160 --> 00:46:34,640
what I just said. 
I don't believe in truth, but 

936
00:46:34,640 --> 00:46:36,080
this is where I feel 
comfortable. 

937
00:46:36,080 --> 00:46:38,720
These are good people. 
They've taken care of me and my 

938
00:46:38,720 --> 00:46:41,000
family. 
They're all about service. 

939
00:46:41,000 --> 00:46:43,080
Those are them around. 
And and a lot of it has to do 

940
00:46:43,080 --> 00:46:46,560
with my personality. 
Like I'll show up to church in a

941
00:46:46,560 --> 00:46:49,920
kilt. 
Yeah, right, 'cause I'm, I'm a 

942
00:46:49,920 --> 00:46:52,400
part of this kind of Scottish 
thing and and I like it. 

943
00:46:52,400 --> 00:46:55,080
And I'm inducted from my actual 
wife's side. 

944
00:46:55,080 --> 00:46:59,080
My, my mother in law's side has 
Scottish heritage and so they're

945
00:46:59,080 --> 00:47:01,720
part of Clan Campbell. 
So I was just like, yeah, I'll 

946
00:47:01,720 --> 00:47:04,600
wear this kilt and I'll be at 
church going, hey, how you 

947
00:47:04,600 --> 00:47:06,120
doing? 
Got a kill? 

948
00:47:06,520 --> 00:47:08,240
What's wrong with you? 
You know, I'm not saying I'm on 

949
00:47:08,240 --> 00:47:12,840
and a kill and they laugh, but I
tell you, like, I come with that

950
00:47:12,840 --> 00:47:14,840
feeling of what I believe Christ
was. 

951
00:47:14,840 --> 00:47:18,120
And Christ was a a lover, a 
server. 

952
00:47:18,600 --> 00:47:21,760
He didn't want to be right. 
He just wanted you to love him 

953
00:47:22,080 --> 00:47:24,640
and love others around him and 
that's it. 

954
00:47:24,640 --> 00:47:28,200
Like, I don't need all the other
special fucking trinket to go on

955
00:47:28,200 --> 00:47:30,480
a Christmas tree, right? 
Which I think is funny. 

956
00:47:30,480 --> 00:47:33,160
We can get into that later on, 
where Christians believe in a 

957
00:47:33,160 --> 00:47:35,920
bunch of Pagan religions. 
Yeah, and a bunch of Pagan like 

958
00:47:36,360 --> 00:47:38,840
symbols and stuff like fucking. 
Halloween. 

959
00:47:38,840 --> 00:47:40,640
That's hilarious. 
Like, oh, it's a great day. 

960
00:47:40,640 --> 00:47:42,320
Like. 
You don't know what your Pagan 

961
00:47:42,320 --> 00:47:44,080
stuff. 
It's just like everything is 

962
00:47:44,640 --> 00:47:47,840
Easter, everything is around 
Pagan holidays, and it's like, 

963
00:47:47,840 --> 00:47:49,240
all right, but that's the. 
Cool part. 

964
00:47:49,240 --> 00:47:51,880
That's what I like about it 
because even the LES faith is a 

965
00:47:51,880 --> 00:47:54,240
lot like any other faith. 
We took a little bit of break. 

966
00:47:54,240 --> 00:47:57,600
Brandon was gonna piss himself 
and so I'm glad he took a break.

967
00:47:58,520 --> 00:48:00,560
So I won't go too far into where
I was at before. 

968
00:48:00,560 --> 00:48:05,480
So ultimately what it is for me 
and and you can see visibly like

969
00:48:05,560 --> 00:48:09,120
you know this still very 
emotional for me and and the 

970
00:48:09,120 --> 00:48:12,360
reason why it's just it spoke to
me and that's what I want to 

971
00:48:12,480 --> 00:48:16,120
really emphasize here is that 
because of how emotional I am 

972
00:48:16,120 --> 00:48:20,480
about this it's because I in 
something either inside me or 

973
00:48:20,480 --> 00:48:26,160
outside me which I do believe 
wholeheartedly in a a God. 

974
00:48:26,160 --> 00:48:31,080
I believe in Christ because 
they've they've helped make me a

975
00:48:31,080 --> 00:48:35,600
happier person and that's for me
like I don't care what it is. 

976
00:48:35,600 --> 00:48:38,320
There are so many different 
types of faiths out there, and 

977
00:48:38,320 --> 00:48:41,800
there's always organizations. 
And I think the reason why I 

978
00:48:41,800 --> 00:48:45,280
like when I meet people who have
left the church, which to be 

979
00:48:45,640 --> 00:48:49,000
totally upfront about it, like 
the best thing is you've been 

980
00:48:49,000 --> 00:48:53,000
the most accepting and loving on
that side to support me. 

981
00:48:53,960 --> 00:48:56,480
A lot of people on the outside 
just, oh man, let me tell you 

982
00:48:56,480 --> 00:48:58,480
why you're wrong and the reason 
why. 

983
00:48:58,480 --> 00:49:03,680
And I I think this, I had a very
true religious experience. 

984
00:49:03,920 --> 00:49:05,320
Very true. 
Yeah. 

985
00:49:05,320 --> 00:49:08,440
When I didn't want it, I really 
didn't want it. 

986
00:49:08,680 --> 00:49:10,160
Yeah, Like it was fucking 
irritating. 

987
00:49:10,160 --> 00:49:12,120
Well, it comes just when it 
happens. 

988
00:49:12,120 --> 00:49:14,760
Right and any faith, just like 
when you left. 

989
00:49:14,760 --> 00:49:17,320
It wasn't because I wanted. 
It no it just because it. 

990
00:49:17,640 --> 00:49:21,160
It's what it presented itself 
and it was like, but yeah, it's 

991
00:49:22,160 --> 00:49:25,720
I think it's good, like you get 
a lot of value out of it and 

992
00:49:26,160 --> 00:49:29,040
there's nothing wrong with 
having a religion or a belief 

993
00:49:29,040 --> 00:49:33,000
or, but there's also higher in a
community that you connect with 

994
00:49:33,000 --> 00:49:35,040
that. 
But you have the same thing 

995
00:49:35,040 --> 00:49:38,680
where where people are just, 
they're not into organized 

996
00:49:38,680 --> 00:49:41,200
religion just because there are 
things, There's faults, there's 

997
00:49:41,200 --> 00:49:44,200
stories that conflict. 
I get that. 

998
00:49:44,360 --> 00:49:48,320
So I think and where people are 
like so blindsided or just 

999
00:49:48,960 --> 00:49:51,040
baffled that you're still part 
of it, I think is. 

1000
00:49:53,200 --> 00:49:54,880
That so can I smoke pot and I 
say fuck. 

1001
00:49:54,960 --> 00:49:59,880
No, no, because you're human. 
Like honestly, well, yes, 

1002
00:50:00,600 --> 00:50:02,520
because here in Utah, no one is 
that way. 

1003
00:50:02,800 --> 00:50:06,680
They are all too many of them 
Put the facade up of, hey, I'm 

1004
00:50:06,880 --> 00:50:10,240
this versus just being who they 
are. 

1005
00:50:10,520 --> 00:50:15,360
And so I also think that a lot 
of people, you didn't grow up 

1006
00:50:15,360 --> 00:50:20,520
being so indoctrinated into it 
that it was truth and that 

1007
00:50:20,520 --> 00:50:23,320
nothing aside from that was 
truth. 

1008
00:50:23,880 --> 00:50:29,400
And so when they find out that, 
hey, maybe it is not truth, that

1009
00:50:29,400 --> 00:50:31,360
is a world shattering thing for 
them. 

1010
00:50:31,960 --> 00:50:36,120
And so then to see that and go, 
hey, you know, all for me when 

1011
00:50:36,120 --> 00:50:38,080
it was like, you know, all of 
this stuff. 

1012
00:50:39,120 --> 00:50:40,320
'Cause I knew all that. 
How you? 

1013
00:50:40,360 --> 00:50:42,600
Know all of this shit and you're
still part of it. 

1014
00:50:42,600 --> 00:50:46,000
And then it's like, OK, but he's
not there because it's what 

1015
00:50:46,000 --> 00:50:49,680
resonates on the deepest level 
of like, this is what truth is. 

1016
00:50:49,680 --> 00:50:52,400
It was the one moment. 
It was that one moment. 

1017
00:50:52,400 --> 00:50:56,320
But that moment wasn't Hey, this
is the true church, and nothing 

1018
00:50:56,320 --> 00:50:58,160
else is. 
I wasn't reading the book and 

1019
00:50:58,160 --> 00:51:00,320
all of a sudden I said Oh my 
gosh, this is what it's for. 

1020
00:51:01,040 --> 00:51:02,760
Me. 
And so it's like, you know, it's

1021
00:51:02,800 --> 00:51:06,440
it's a thing of like, OK, you 
get what you get from that. 

1022
00:51:06,440 --> 00:51:09,920
And that's 100% OK Do people 
feel things? 

1023
00:51:09,920 --> 00:51:12,240
Yes, I felt things at church 
before. 

1024
00:51:12,880 --> 00:51:18,480
That doesn't mean that 
everything is true or not true. 

1025
00:51:18,760 --> 00:51:23,080
But I think when so many of the 
members of any faith who believe

1026
00:51:23,080 --> 00:51:28,480
it in such a truth is like, this
is a hard line of truth. 

1027
00:51:29,120 --> 00:51:33,480
And then when you realize no 
it's not, that becomes an 

1028
00:51:33,480 --> 00:51:35,880
instant of like, well, what is 
truth? 

1029
00:51:36,200 --> 00:51:39,840
Like the conversation we had 
with that guy the other day, and

1030
00:51:39,840 --> 00:51:42,280
it was like, well, there is no 
free will, OK? 

1031
00:51:42,360 --> 00:51:45,360
Well, because it's instantly he 
left the church and he's two 

1032
00:51:45,360 --> 00:51:49,040
years into that and it's. 
Mind chatting, A lot of anger. 

1033
00:51:49,080 --> 00:51:53,480
It is because you think of that 
is your reality. 

1034
00:51:53,480 --> 00:51:58,240
That is your world of truth. 
And if that isn't true, what is?

1035
00:51:58,440 --> 00:52:02,800
What other things have you grown
up knowing or thinking are true 

1036
00:52:03,160 --> 00:52:05,920
that no longer are? 
Then you, you sit back and 

1037
00:52:05,920 --> 00:52:09,760
you're looking at everything you
know or thought you knew and 

1038
00:52:09,760 --> 00:52:11,560
going well. 
Is this true? 

1039
00:52:11,760 --> 00:52:14,200
Is this true? 
Did I just follow this because I

1040
00:52:14,200 --> 00:52:16,000
was told? 
Did I just follow this because I

1041
00:52:16,000 --> 00:52:18,720
was told? 
It becomes this unraveling of 

1042
00:52:18,720 --> 00:52:23,480
like everything and it's it is 
like it is a world shattering 

1043
00:52:23,480 --> 00:52:25,000
experience. 
And I can understand. 

1044
00:52:25,680 --> 00:52:28,840
It's hard to see so many people 
sit in anger and frustration 

1045
00:52:28,840 --> 00:52:33,000
with it because it's like, yes, 
you can hang on to that, you 

1046
00:52:33,000 --> 00:52:36,640
can, but that's not going to 
serve you to hate and have that 

1047
00:52:36,640 --> 00:52:40,080
because it's like it's this, 
this us and them. 

1048
00:52:40,400 --> 00:52:43,640
Yeah, this the way you're 
bringing it up. 

1049
00:52:43,680 --> 00:52:44,320
It's funny. 
Well. 

1050
00:52:44,320 --> 00:52:47,680
It's like and it's weird because
I am known like the person I was

1051
00:52:47,680 --> 00:52:51,040
10 years ago, 1215 years ago is 
not who I am today. 

1052
00:52:51,040 --> 00:52:53,480
Which is good because we evolve 
constantly our our 

1053
00:52:53,480 --> 00:52:55,920
personalities, our our belief 
structure. 

1054
00:52:55,920 --> 00:52:58,080
Proud to say that though you 
should be. 

1055
00:52:58,080 --> 00:53:00,960
And I know and and it's a thing 
of like people are like people 

1056
00:53:00,960 --> 00:53:03,120
can't change. 
Yes, people do change every day.

1057
00:53:03,120 --> 00:53:05,440
100%. 
And like if you if you're 

1058
00:53:05,800 --> 00:53:09,160
thinking you don't change, 
you're either blind or like 

1059
00:53:09,840 --> 00:53:11,400
you're living in some weird 
bubble. 

1060
00:53:11,680 --> 00:53:15,440
Well, the way I look at a lot of
people who leave a faith and 

1061
00:53:15,440 --> 00:53:19,080
they look at those who are still
involved in it are like hardcore

1062
00:53:19,080 --> 00:53:22,840
brand new vegans. 
Because they're like, do you 

1063
00:53:22,840 --> 00:53:25,640
know what that does to you? 
You know how bad that is for 

1064
00:53:25,640 --> 00:53:26,960
you? 
And let me tell you about all 

1065
00:53:26,960 --> 00:53:29,360
the reasons why meat is horrible
for you. 

1066
00:53:29,640 --> 00:53:33,080
They talked like honestly and 
just talking to you and 

1067
00:53:33,080 --> 00:53:35,880
contemplating a lot of this. 
I think the reason why a lot of 

1068
00:53:35,880 --> 00:53:41,600
people don't understand why I am
involved still is when I tell 

1069
00:53:41,600 --> 00:53:44,000
them that story, you know why 
they get mad at me. 

1070
00:53:44,000 --> 00:53:46,320
And many of them had said it and
this is The funny thing. 

1071
00:53:46,720 --> 00:53:51,200
I never experienced that. 
So and they they immediately 

1072
00:53:51,200 --> 00:53:55,240
say, you know what if if there 
were more people like you in the

1073
00:53:55,240 --> 00:53:58,360
church, I would go back and 
like, well, that's that's really

1074
00:53:58,360 --> 00:54:01,480
hollow to say you're mad because
of what? 

1075
00:54:01,520 --> 00:54:03,920
And they go, well because I 
didn't get the experience you 

1076
00:54:03,920 --> 00:54:06,840
just told me about. 
And I'm like, it's not a quid 

1077
00:54:06,840 --> 00:54:08,600
pro quo. 
But how could they? 

1078
00:54:08,880 --> 00:54:12,080
Because they've not lived every 
experience to put them in that 

1079
00:54:12,080 --> 00:54:14,960
moment that says I don't believe
this shit. 

1080
00:54:14,960 --> 00:54:16,560
All of these people are 
assholes. 

1081
00:54:16,800 --> 00:54:18,640
You either put me here or I'm 
leaving. 

1082
00:54:19,120 --> 00:54:20,520
Like, of course they're not 
going to. 

1083
00:54:20,520 --> 00:54:23,680
It's the same reason why I 
haven't joined the Navy and 

1084
00:54:23,680 --> 00:54:25,040
married like, yeah, there's just
like. 

1085
00:54:25,360 --> 00:54:28,520
You did things. 
Different humans, we've lived 

1086
00:54:28,880 --> 00:54:32,560
different lives, thoughts, 
experiences, like down to every 

1087
00:54:32,560 --> 00:54:34,840
single one. 
And it's like, it doesn't matter

1088
00:54:34,840 --> 00:54:37,400
if you and I have ever thought 
one same thing. 

1089
00:54:38,080 --> 00:54:42,880
We are 100% different people. 
But here's the the take away I 

1090
00:54:42,880 --> 00:54:48,200
have now. 
Like, I'm glad that I'm a more 

1091
00:54:48,200 --> 00:54:51,240
accepting person now than I was 
before. 

1092
00:54:51,560 --> 00:54:55,000
But I'm telling you that the 
reason why is because I wanted 

1093
00:54:55,000 --> 00:54:58,240
to be that way. 
Not because my faith or my 

1094
00:54:58,240 --> 00:55:03,520
special pajamas or, you know, my
cool space temple that I go to 

1095
00:55:03,520 --> 00:55:06,800
to connect with God, if that's 
the way I choose to do it, 

1096
00:55:06,800 --> 00:55:08,400
because I can connect God 
anywhere. 

1097
00:55:08,600 --> 00:55:12,560
One of the best movies I saw, 
which is a not a great movie but

1098
00:55:12,560 --> 00:55:14,880
at the very end is called this 
movie called Stigmata. 

1099
00:55:14,880 --> 00:55:16,200
Do you know what the stigmata 
is? 

1100
00:55:16,400 --> 00:55:19,320
I've heard of that. 
Stigmata is the belief that you 

1101
00:55:19,320 --> 00:55:21,600
start to be able to bear the 
wounds of Christ. 

1102
00:55:21,760 --> 00:55:24,080
You start to bleed from your 
palms and over here. 

1103
00:55:24,280 --> 00:55:26,360
But when you look at the 
historical thing, that's why I 

1104
00:55:26,360 --> 00:55:28,840
call it bullshit. 
Because historically, 

1105
00:55:29,280 --> 00:55:31,560
crucifixions were done to the. 
Wrists not in the hand. 

1106
00:55:31,640 --> 00:55:32,880
'Cause it would have ripped him 
off. 

1107
00:55:32,960 --> 00:55:35,160
Oh yeah. 
He would have fallen and and and

1108
00:55:35,160 --> 00:55:37,760
just one right there. 
Why do they stack him on top of 

1109
00:55:37,760 --> 00:55:40,120
it? 
To give the support only enough 

1110
00:55:40,120 --> 00:55:42,560
to suffocate you. 
That's why you suffocate. 

1111
00:55:42,640 --> 00:55:45,960
When you hang there, it was you.
You just died from getting 

1112
00:55:45,960 --> 00:55:48,920
nailed up there. 
And you slowly suffocate today. 

1113
00:55:48,960 --> 00:55:50,960
It's a horrible way to die, 
right? 

1114
00:55:50,960 --> 00:55:53,800
But it it just thinking about 
those things like people that 

1115
00:55:53,800 --> 00:55:56,080
stick them on it, right? 
But anyways, I dig your ass. 

1116
00:55:56,840 --> 00:55:59,280
The part of the movie that was 
the best for me, it was this 

1117
00:55:59,680 --> 00:56:02,280
entity that was speaking to this
woman who's supposed to be like 

1118
00:56:02,280 --> 00:56:05,360
a medium that can talk to these,
you know, spirits and all this 

1119
00:56:05,360 --> 00:56:07,480
stuff. 
And the spirit says, again, this

1120
00:56:07,480 --> 00:56:09,040
is fictional. 
I'm not saying this is what 

1121
00:56:09,040 --> 00:56:16,920
works, but it says God is not in
stone, nor in wood, nor in 

1122
00:56:17,040 --> 00:56:20,840
anything that man creates. 
Now, plain a little freedom on 

1123
00:56:20,840 --> 00:56:22,440
that one, but it's not in Booker
Stone. 

1124
00:56:22,440 --> 00:56:23,840
It's not in manic. 
It's in you. 

1125
00:56:24,680 --> 00:56:29,360
And that stuck with me for many 
years because I thought about 

1126
00:56:29,360 --> 00:56:31,120
that. 
This is when I became involved 

1127
00:56:31,120 --> 00:56:33,000
in the church. 
I was like cool and I've always 

1128
00:56:33,000 --> 00:56:35,560
sought it. 
I've always felt it for them. 

1129
00:56:35,560 --> 00:56:39,880
I go because I enjoy the 
community, but I enjoy that 

1130
00:56:40,480 --> 00:56:42,040
everybody's under the belief 
now. 

1131
00:56:42,040 --> 00:56:43,960
Not everybody it is, but 
everybody's under the belief 

1132
00:56:43,960 --> 00:56:45,600
that we're supposed to be really
good to each other. 

1133
00:56:45,880 --> 00:56:48,400
And I'm so gregarious. 
Imagine I'm sitting there with a

1134
00:56:48,400 --> 00:56:53,760
kilt and a button up shirt with 
a black tie and I'm being as 

1135
00:56:53,760 --> 00:56:58,000
loud as I normally AM and I'm 
just going off and people say 

1136
00:56:58,160 --> 00:57:01,760
what do you do for a living? 
And I joke around saying I smoke

1137
00:57:01,760 --> 00:57:02,960
pot for a living. 
That's right. 

1138
00:57:03,120 --> 00:57:07,840
And they go, OK, And then I go, 
hey, look, I got this awesome 

1139
00:57:07,840 --> 00:57:10,000
podcast, it's everywhere, all 
over the world. 

1140
00:57:10,320 --> 00:57:13,640
And they go OK And then 
immediately they start asking 

1141
00:57:13,640 --> 00:57:17,120
questions, what should I use? 
Because they were looking for 

1142
00:57:17,120 --> 00:57:19,200
that gateway. 
You know, it was funny. 

1143
00:57:19,360 --> 00:57:21,360
So I yeah. 
With your cousins. 

1144
00:57:21,480 --> 00:57:26,880
No, I just had we had to replace
our washer like a month ago and 

1145
00:57:26,880 --> 00:57:29,000
I just sold the dryer that's 
been sitting here. 

1146
00:57:29,560 --> 00:57:33,920
And the guy who came and picked 
it up was this oriental man from

1147
00:57:34,480 --> 00:57:37,720
He's a teacher. 
He teaches chemistry up at 

1148
00:57:37,720 --> 00:57:41,520
Timbu. 
There's a Walter White, right? 

1149
00:57:41,760 --> 00:57:45,760
And it was just funny because 
the volcano was on here. 

1150
00:57:46,440 --> 00:57:50,080
I usually there's always a box 
of something here. 

1151
00:57:50,080 --> 00:57:51,520
Yeah, there's always cannabis 
right now. 

1152
00:57:51,880 --> 00:57:54,400
Trying to, I tried to clean it 
up so there wasn't a ton of 

1153
00:57:54,400 --> 00:57:56,560
stuff out. 
The volcano was the only thing. 

1154
00:57:57,000 --> 00:58:01,720
And he's like, oh, I saw one of 
those down in in Vegas. 

1155
00:58:02,080 --> 00:58:05,160
Really expensive, really nice, 
though, right? 

1156
00:58:05,160 --> 00:58:08,800
And I was like, yeah, they are. 
And so we just started talking 

1157
00:58:08,800 --> 00:58:11,480
about cannabis and that. 
And it was interesting because I

1158
00:58:11,480 --> 00:58:14,720
never would have assumed that 
this man who's probably 60 years

1159
00:58:14,720 --> 00:58:20,040
old and like Asian man, who's a 
teacher. 

1160
00:58:20,040 --> 00:58:23,720
Yeah, and he here we are having 
a discussion about cannabis. 

1161
00:58:23,720 --> 00:58:27,920
And I'm like, it's just 
interesting because go back ten 

1162
00:58:27,920 --> 00:58:30,960
years ago I would have never 
thought that that would happen 

1163
00:58:31,520 --> 00:58:35,480
never in my life. 
But I'm also way more open about

1164
00:58:35,480 --> 00:58:38,640
discussions about cannabis and 
ketamine and psilocybin and just

1165
00:58:39,000 --> 00:58:42,400
these things that I know make 
massive impacts in my life. 

1166
00:58:42,400 --> 00:58:48,600
Like, I am 100% way more who I 
am from like, psilocybin and 

1167
00:58:48,880 --> 00:58:53,440
cannabis that I try way more to 
be Christ. 

1168
00:58:53,440 --> 00:58:57,520
Like, I feel like I try to show 
up as a way different person, 

1169
00:58:57,880 --> 00:59:00,520
way different than I did ever 
when I was religious. 

1170
00:59:01,200 --> 00:59:05,040
And it's interesting because 
even though I thought, hey, I'm 

1171
00:59:05,360 --> 00:59:09,520
a good person, I'm this or that.
Like I if I look back, I 

1172
00:59:09,520 --> 00:59:11,080
actually don't think I was 
present. 

1173
00:59:11,400 --> 00:59:14,240
I was like. 
Yeah, like like in a. 

1174
00:59:14,360 --> 00:59:18,840
What's the best way to describe 
being in a antidepressant? 

1175
00:59:18,840 --> 00:59:20,400
Haze. 
Yeah, just numb. 

1176
00:59:20,400 --> 00:59:23,280
Yeah, I'm like, I don't think I 
was a good person. 

1177
00:59:23,280 --> 00:59:27,920
I was a person and I was living.
I was judgmental as fuck because

1178
00:59:27,920 --> 00:59:30,920
that was bred into me and 
conditioned into me, right? 

1179
00:59:31,000 --> 00:59:34,200
That's what I knew. 
And it's hard to let go of that.

1180
00:59:34,200 --> 00:59:36,480
It's still evident in US every 
single day. 

1181
00:59:36,680 --> 00:59:40,160
And I'm like, but now like I 
don't see. 

1182
00:59:40,160 --> 00:59:44,080
I see way more of people's 
struggles and who they are and 

1183
00:59:44,080 --> 00:59:49,080
not not looking at like there's 
been some really fucked up stuff

1184
00:59:49,080 --> 00:59:50,600
that's happened. 
Oh shit, yeah. 

1185
00:59:50,600 --> 00:59:55,800
And then I look at it and I try 
and I genuinely try and see how 

1186
00:59:55,800 --> 00:59:58,400
or why, like see that person's 
perspective. 

1187
00:59:58,400 --> 01:00:04,200
Because there's been times that 
I've wanted to kill a person and

1188
01:00:04,200 --> 01:00:08,360
like to sit back and actually 
try and understand how in the 

1189
01:00:08,360 --> 01:00:11,760
fuck they get to that. 
Like it's just been very 

1190
01:00:11,760 --> 01:00:15,000
different than before. 
Where I might, I would have 

1191
01:00:15,000 --> 01:00:17,680
never. 
Spent the time to even consider 

1192
01:00:18,760 --> 01:00:22,600
that person's perspective 
because that wasn't important. 

1193
01:00:23,000 --> 01:00:25,480
Dude that's a that's beautiful. 
That's a great way to kind of 

1194
01:00:25,480 --> 01:00:30,120
wrap this up is I, I I tend to 
tell people within in my faith, 

1195
01:00:31,360 --> 01:00:34,840
especially when they ask me like
why I use cannabis. 

1196
01:00:35,280 --> 01:00:37,560
And I was like you really want 
to be that way. 

1197
01:00:37,560 --> 01:00:39,720
You want you want me to ask you?
It's like look I convert more 

1198
01:00:39,720 --> 01:00:42,480
people to cannabis than I do to 
Christ, you know why? 

1199
01:00:42,680 --> 01:00:44,920
And they go, why? 
And I'm like, because I'll say 

1200
01:00:44,920 --> 01:00:48,240
this, you wanna act more like 
Christ in an instantaneous way. 

1201
01:00:48,720 --> 01:00:51,120
Use this plant. 
Use this plant. 

1202
01:00:51,120 --> 01:00:54,880
Because I've never found it And 
and I'm, I'm just me in my 

1203
01:00:54,880 --> 01:00:56,320
perspective. 
But it's pretty broad 

1204
01:00:56,320 --> 01:01:00,360
perspective. 
I've never met anybody within 

1205
01:01:00,480 --> 01:01:02,800
any Piper cannabis. 
Just like that conversation that

1206
01:01:02,800 --> 01:01:04,880
you had with him, you don't 
know. 

1207
01:01:04,880 --> 01:01:07,040
But it's like the great, the the
great Uniter. 

1208
01:01:07,240 --> 01:01:10,760
I look at cannabis consumers, 
cannabis users, cannabis 

1209
01:01:10,760 --> 01:01:13,960
enthusiasts, just like Marine 
Corps people. 

1210
01:01:13,960 --> 01:01:15,920
And the reason why I detail it 
that way. 

1211
01:01:16,320 --> 01:01:20,280
When a Marine meets another 
Marine, they just know him by 

1212
01:01:20,280 --> 01:01:21,800
the way they walk, the way they 
dress. 

1213
01:01:21,920 --> 01:01:24,920
A Marine will keep the same 
haircut some not all the time 

1214
01:01:24,920 --> 01:01:26,120
but. 
A lot of their life and. 

1215
01:01:26,120 --> 01:01:28,920
Stereotypically they will keep 
that high and tight, right, 

1216
01:01:28,920 --> 01:01:33,040
because it is ingrained in them.
But there's a lot of proud, 

1217
01:01:33,040 --> 01:01:35,720
like, you know, like I, I know a
lot of guys in the Navy, Like 

1218
01:01:35,720 --> 01:01:38,120
I'm proud to serve in the Navy. 
But there's a lot of people who 

1219
01:01:38,120 --> 01:01:39,720
are like, fuck the Navy. 
Like, I get that and they're 

1220
01:01:39,720 --> 01:01:40,880
probably like, fuck the Marine 
Corps. 

1221
01:01:41,120 --> 01:01:44,120
But at the same time, like when 
you meet those dyed in the wool 

1222
01:01:44,120 --> 01:01:48,280
Marines, they'll ask the guy, 
what unit did you serve in and 

1223
01:01:48,280 --> 01:01:50,760
where were you stationed? 
Do you need anything? 

1224
01:01:51,000 --> 01:01:53,760
Can I help you? 
If he's a traveler, you would 

1225
01:01:53,760 --> 01:01:57,800
offer your home, you would give 
him food because he is just like

1226
01:01:57,800 --> 01:02:00,280
you. 
I see that with cannabis people,

1227
01:02:00,280 --> 01:02:02,960
because you can go anywhere, 
right? 

1228
01:02:02,960 --> 01:02:04,560
We're gonna have this guy on the
show. 

1229
01:02:04,760 --> 01:02:07,560
He's the craziest story where he
walked through one of the most 

1230
01:02:07,560 --> 01:02:10,360
dangerous neighborhoods in 
Chicago because he didn't know, 

1231
01:02:10,360 --> 01:02:15,360
because Google told him to go 
through it and a joint saved his

1232
01:02:15,360 --> 01:02:17,600
life. 
No bullshit. 

1233
01:02:18,040 --> 01:02:20,560
When he's on this, you're gonna 
be like, that's the most fucking

1234
01:02:20,560 --> 01:02:23,800
weird story ever. 
But I'm telling you, cannabis is

1235
01:02:23,800 --> 01:02:29,000
the great uniter like it. 
It just helps bridge that divide

1236
01:02:29,520 --> 01:02:34,080
because of our cannabis sharing 
cannabis the way that we have 

1237
01:02:34,760 --> 01:02:37,680
it, it breaks down those 
barriers with so many people 

1238
01:02:37,840 --> 01:02:41,480
where you've met religious 
people through it and they are 

1239
01:02:41,480 --> 01:02:44,440
like cool. 
I I respect you because you 

1240
01:02:44,440 --> 01:02:48,640
don't subscribe to my same space
of of faith or whatever else, 

1241
01:02:48,640 --> 01:02:54,240
but that there is no barriers or
or walls with cannabis you. 

1242
01:02:54,240 --> 01:02:55,760
Just nothing. 
To them, it's. 

1243
01:02:56,000 --> 01:02:57,920
No, it's us. 
It's just us together. 

1244
01:02:57,920 --> 01:02:59,480
Yeah, let's. 
And it's having the 

1245
01:02:59,480 --> 01:03:01,880
conversations and the 
connections and the community 

1246
01:03:01,880 --> 01:03:05,040
that circles around that because
it is like you share that 

1247
01:03:05,040 --> 01:03:09,480
experience and it's bonding. 
Yeah, bonding, definitely 

1248
01:03:09,480 --> 01:03:11,960
bonding, 'cause, I mean, how 
many times you meet somebody 

1249
01:03:11,960 --> 01:03:14,800
going, oh you partake and they 
go, yeah. 

1250
01:03:15,040 --> 01:03:17,120
You think about the disc golf. 
Yeah, that was fucking funny. 

1251
01:03:17,120 --> 01:03:19,320
How many stories are like that? 
All the time, all the 

1252
01:03:19,480 --> 01:03:22,000
everywhere, everywhere. 
I mean, every time I have some 

1253
01:03:22,000 --> 01:03:23,960
like a pen and I'm going 
somewhere and it's like 

1254
01:03:24,240 --> 01:03:27,320
someone's like, oh, or I see 
someone, I'm like, hey, look. 

1255
01:03:27,920 --> 01:03:31,280
And it just initially like, it 
sparks that conversation and 

1256
01:03:31,280 --> 01:03:33,800
that connection. 
And then it's like, oh hey, 

1257
01:03:33,960 --> 01:03:36,600
lifelong friends. 
Will you imagine if you came up 

1258
01:03:36,600 --> 01:03:39,640
on a couple of young gentlemen 
ready to start fucking fighting 

1259
01:03:39,640 --> 01:03:41,960
and shit, and they're in the 
street and everybody's got their

1260
01:03:41,960 --> 01:03:44,160
cell phones out going Worldstar,
right? 

1261
01:03:44,240 --> 01:03:46,640
They're trying to pull that 
bullshit, even if Worldstar is 

1262
01:03:46,640 --> 01:03:48,720
something that is around. 
I enjoy those videos. 

1263
01:03:48,720 --> 01:03:52,720
They're hilarious. 
But at the same time, dude, 

1264
01:03:52,720 --> 01:03:54,840
like, what if you came out 
there, just say, hey, hey, hey, 

1265
01:03:54,840 --> 01:03:57,560
let's smoke this. 
Let's just, let's just figure 

1266
01:03:57,560 --> 01:03:59,320
this shit out. 
Nobody needs to go to the 

1267
01:03:59,320 --> 01:04:01,000
hospital. 
Nobody needs to go to the jail. 

1268
01:04:01,000 --> 01:04:04,960
I'm honestly so disappointed in 
how often I see all of those 

1269
01:04:04,960 --> 01:04:07,440
fucking videos. 
Nobody's offering. 

1270
01:04:07,440 --> 01:04:10,080
No one steps in, no one says 
anything. 

1271
01:04:10,080 --> 01:04:11,480
Everyone just like videoing. 
I'm like. 

1272
01:04:11,480 --> 01:04:14,240
They want to watch. 
It's the Colosseum. 

1273
01:04:14,240 --> 01:04:16,560
It's too. 
It's just violence. 

1274
01:04:16,560 --> 01:04:18,960
Like, that's why I love video 
games, because it's it's 

1275
01:04:18,960 --> 01:04:21,040
synthetic violence. 
Like, I don't have to feel like 

1276
01:04:21,040 --> 01:04:21,600
it. 
And you know what? 

1277
01:04:21,600 --> 01:04:23,560
I wouldn't do those things in 
real life. 

1278
01:04:23,920 --> 01:04:26,000
Oh yeah. 
You know, I wouldn't do those 

1279
01:04:26,000 --> 01:04:27,960
things. 
I wouldn't be hacking up zombies

1280
01:04:27,960 --> 01:04:30,320
and all sorts of other bullshit.
It was fucking dumb, dude. 

1281
01:04:30,320 --> 01:04:32,280
It's a game. 
But I shouldn't. 

1282
01:04:32,320 --> 01:04:34,920
I I should look for ways to 
unite and connect with other 

1283
01:04:34,920 --> 01:04:36,480
people. 
That's it. 

1284
01:04:36,480 --> 01:04:40,480
And if, and that's what's great 
about what we do with this show 

1285
01:04:40,520 --> 01:04:43,520
is that we're just looking for 
ways to connect and what's 

1286
01:04:43,520 --> 01:04:46,080
happened. 
We have hundreds of thousands of

1287
01:04:46,080 --> 01:04:50,360
people out there that listen to 
this show all over the world and

1288
01:04:50,360 --> 01:04:52,560
they're united underneath this 
plant. 

1289
01:04:52,920 --> 01:04:55,720
We're connected to people who 
are listening to this or 

1290
01:04:55,720 --> 01:04:57,640
watching this right now. 
Over the world. 

1291
01:04:57,800 --> 01:05:02,920
All over any time of the day, 
you guys are smoking the same 

1292
01:05:02,920 --> 01:05:05,240
type of plant that we are. 
It's just a different 

1293
01:05:05,240 --> 01:05:07,320
composition. 
Yep, and maybe a different 

1294
01:05:07,320 --> 01:05:09,920
cannabinoid and terpene profile.
But like and then? 

1295
01:05:09,920 --> 01:05:11,120
Look at all the episodes we 
have. 

1296
01:05:11,120 --> 01:05:13,040
You can go back going, dude, I 
want to smoke what they're 

1297
01:05:13,040 --> 01:05:14,200
smoking. 
Shit. 

1298
01:05:14,200 --> 01:05:17,880
Maybe even that's an idea. 
And as we are opening more 

1299
01:05:17,880 --> 01:05:22,360
connections and conversations, 
if you have a really cool story 

1300
01:05:22,360 --> 01:05:24,600
or want to be part of the 
cannabis conversation you hear 

1301
01:05:24,600 --> 01:05:27,400
on the Sash, shoot us an e-mail.
Yeah, shoot us an e-mail. 

1302
01:05:27,400 --> 01:05:29,960
We'd be happy to be able to sit 
down with you and engage with 

1303
01:05:29,960 --> 01:05:35,040
you and real quick I want to 
give a shout out to Jet. 

1304
01:05:35,240 --> 01:05:38,520
Jet filtration systems. 
So this is the unofficial 

1305
01:05:38,520 --> 01:05:43,560
sponsored bong of the show. 
This has been a amazing product.

1306
01:05:43,560 --> 01:05:46,120
We're going to put the the 
website over there down there. 

1307
01:05:46,320 --> 01:05:47,680
We'll work something out with 
them. 

1308
01:05:47,680 --> 01:05:51,240
I'm sure just the. 
Smoothest, Smoothest. 

1309
01:05:51,240 --> 01:05:52,960
You notice none of us were 
coughing at all. 

1310
01:05:53,160 --> 01:05:56,480
Like not one show. 
This is ball shit. 

1311
01:05:56,960 --> 01:05:58,840
If they got a smaller one, get 
it this. 

1312
01:05:58,840 --> 01:05:59,880
They might even have a bigger 
one. 

1313
01:05:59,880 --> 01:06:01,600
I think they have a bigger one. 
I think they do. 

1314
01:06:01,600 --> 01:06:04,000
They have like four or five 
different sizes. 

1315
01:06:04,640 --> 01:06:06,560
It is the best bong you'll ever 
get. 

1316
01:06:06,560 --> 01:06:07,880
It's. 
Indestructible. 

1317
01:06:08,200 --> 01:06:11,920
Yeah, you could throw this shit.
It's built with amazing. 

1318
01:06:12,000 --> 01:06:14,080
You see how Brandon's taking a 
poll of it and then he just 

1319
01:06:14,080 --> 01:06:16,800
pushes this thing down and 
clears the pipe super smooth. 

1320
01:06:17,120 --> 01:06:18,560
It's got all these percolators 
in there. 

1321
01:06:18,560 --> 01:06:22,320
Percolators just cool to say and
then but you see that like all 

1322
01:06:22,320 --> 01:06:24,280
the water come in there. 
You could put a lot of water. 

1323
01:06:24,280 --> 01:06:26,680
You can put less water. 
There's so many cool things that

1324
01:06:26,680 --> 01:06:28,080
that. 
So for those who are consuming 

1325
01:06:28,080 --> 01:06:31,600
cannabis, remember that you are 
here to connect with others and 

1326
01:06:31,680 --> 01:06:35,720
allow this to be the vehicle to 
bridge that with others. 

1327
01:06:35,840 --> 01:06:37,640
Until next time, take care.