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OK, everybody, welcome back to 
the Credit Command Podcast and 

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today I've got two very special 
guests. 

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We've got a duo, in fact, from 
the Build Paint and Play Live 

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stream channel on YouTube that 
I've been a participant on just 

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recently talking to the guys 
about hobby, painting, Games 

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Workshop, everything. 
They're both, I believe X Games 

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Workshop members or staff 
members from the past. 

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So of course we've got Dave 
Taylor and Dave Taylor is was a 

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previous guest on the podcast 
before, but Jake's a new member 

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coming on for the very first 
time. 

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But I really wanted to introduce
you both to both of these great 

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gentlemen in the hobby and to to
learn about their story and why 

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they they began this crusade for
people to build, paint and play 

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with their miniatures on the 
table. 

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So both of you guys welcome and 
good evening to you both. 

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Oh yeah. 
Thanks very much for having us, 

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Josh. 
Yeah, for sure. 

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Thank you so much. 
My pleasure. 

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So of course, Dave's been on the
podcast before, so we know a 

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little bit about Dave's previous
experiences with how he got into

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the hobby and that kind of 
thing, and his journey through 

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Games Workshop and where that 
took him. 

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So for Jake, mate, tell us about
yourself. 

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Like, where you're from and you 
know, how did you get into this 

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weird, wonderful hobby of ours? 
Sure. 

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I'm sure your listeners are 
going to be like, who is this 

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guy? 
Why is he on the show? 

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So I like a lot of us. 
I I got into like you know, mini

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war gaming and and miniature 
painting when I was a lot 

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younger. 
I think I was in pretty sure I 

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was in grade school. 
I think it all started with like

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Dungeons and Dragons and you 
know painting the old metal, 

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white metal Ralph Partha Minis 
and stuff like that. 

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And then my first, my first 
exposure to Games Workshop was I

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went to a Dungeons and Dragons. 
Like, I don't want us to call it

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a convention because it was like
really tiny but basically was 

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like a proto convention and it 
was a lot of like gaming related

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stuff. 
And there was a guy who had a 

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little booth set up and they had
the old RTB Rogue Trader box of 

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Space Marines. 
And so I picked it up and 12 

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year old Jake was like, oh this 
is so cool, what is this? 

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And the guy started talking to 
me and my ADHD kicked in and I 

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zoned out while he was talking. 
And in my brain I was like, look

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at these Crimson fists fighting 
all these guys. 

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Like I didn't know they were 
Crimson Fists, but like I was 

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like look at all these guys. 
Like this looks super cool. 

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So I bought them and I bought I 
think a White Dwarf and took it 

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home and you know went went 
nuts. 

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And this is back when White 
Dwarf had like advertisers for 

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like Dungeons and Dragons and 
like other games like Dark 

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Future and all that sort of 
stuff and just kind of fell in 

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love with it. 
And I built the models, I 

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thought, and and I had built 
model kits like World War 2 

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planes and the USS Enterprise 
and stuff like that. 

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But I had never built minis to 
paint, if that makes sense. 

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I was like, this is weird. 
It's like this cool mash up of 

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two things that I like, painting
minis and building models, but 

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it's the same thing. 
So I painted them up and then 

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couple years went by and my 
cousin came over and he was like

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he saw like I had a bunch of 
different ones that I had 

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painted and he was like oh, you 
play this game. 

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And I was like there's a game 
like I thought it was just like 

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D&D. 
So I got sucked into it again. 

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And then I think I was in 
college when I started playing 

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pretty regularly. 
I think it was during 3rd 

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edition 40 Ki Believe. 
And then while I was in college,

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I got hired by Games Workshop 
and I was working part time. 

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And then when I graduated they 
snapped me up and gave me a 

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store. 
And then I worked for the 

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company for like 6 years and 
within probably 6 months I got 

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promoted to running the bunker 
store. 

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It's one of the big ones here in
the States. 

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At one point we had four. 
There was one in Boston, which 

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was the one that I ran. 
There was one in Chicago. 

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There was one in Glen Burnie, 
MD, which is where HQ was, and 

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then there was one on the West 
Coast, I think. 

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Was it LA or Seattle? 
LA. 

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OK. 
But so I was running the Boston 

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store, so I got flown down to 
Baltimore all the time. 

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And that's How I Met Dave. 
I met Dave, I I want to say I 

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met Dave in like 2003 or 2004. 
So I mean I've known Dave for 

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like 20 years now and he, I mean
Dave, you know Dave is Dave is 

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super charming and like very 
welcoming. 

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It was was just great. 
It was super nice to talk to him

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and and at and at that point 
there was AUS edition of the of 

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White Dwarf which I think there 
were several different like 

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national editions. 
But so Dave and our buddy John, 

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our buddy John Shaffer who's on 
the four Warlords with us and a 

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couple of other guys, they were 
all like the core of the White 

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Dwarf US staff. 
So it was really cool. 

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Like, it was definitely a nerd 
moment for me, being like, oh, 

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that's Dave Taylor. 
But it was, it was really cool 

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and now I'm just kind of riding 
his coattails. 

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I'm Robin to his Batman as we 
get to do this, so. 

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That's that's. 
Awesome. 

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You stand, the two of us next to
each other. 

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In no world am I the hero and. 
He's he he in in real life I'm 

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I'm much taller than Dave but in
in in legendary stature Dave is 

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Dave is far grander. 
But balance is now. 

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Right. 
Yeah, yeah. 

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It all comes out in the wash. 
But yeah, after work with GW for

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years, I I I worked at a couple 
different companies. 

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I was a beta tester at Fantasy 
Flight. 

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I did some of their Star Wars 
RPG stuff, which was fun. 

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And then I decided to just open 
my own store. 

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My buddy Adam and I was another 
XGW. 

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We're we're everywhere. 
XGW guys are everywhere. 

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The world. 
The gaming industry is lousy 

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with us. 
But so we opened my own store 

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and and Dave and I have just 
kind of kept in touch ever 

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since. 
And I want to say it was like 

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coming out of the pandemic we 
had, we had talked about, like, 

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I was thinking about maybe doing
like a show about like lore, 

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like a 40K lore stories and 
going into like Horace, Heresy 

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and Necromunda and all that 
stuff. 

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And Dave was like, oh, I kind of
want to do like more hobby stuff

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because he had been on another 
show that was that was good. 

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But they, the wheels had kind of
fallen off. 

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Like some of the people behind 
it weren't really just kind of 

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getting it going the way that 
they should have. 

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So we were like, yeah, let's 
just, you know, kind of get some

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chocolate on your peanut butter,
get some peanut butter on my 

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chocolate. 
Let's just Reese's pieces this. 

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And you know, we turned into 
into Dave and I doing build, 

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pay, play, which we went into 
being like if this doesn't work 

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and it's just Dave and I talking
to each other for an hour and a 

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half every week, sounds great, 
like that's fine. 

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That is literally how we got 
anything. 

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So. 
Yeah. 

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Jake, I've got a new job for 
you, mate. 

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You're not not just a hockey 
goalkeeper. 

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I think I'm going to use your 
voice for a Blood Bowl battle 

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reports, mate. 
I think you'll be perfect for 

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it, 'cause you can just ramble 
on so quickly. 

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I can't do it. 
And you got the perfect accent 

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for it, mate. 
You got the perfect everything, 

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The perfect Blood Bowl, you 
know, presenter, you know. 

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I'm happy to do that. 
I was a radio DJ for a bit, so. 

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I oh, there you go, there you 
go. 

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You got you got a radio voice, 
mate, Honestly. 

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Yeah. 
My my wife says they sound like,

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My wife says they sound like 
Will Arnett. 

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And I was like, I don't really 
hear that, but I mean, it's your

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voice sounds different to 
yourself, so. 

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Yeah, true. 
Yeah, that's good. 

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Now that you've said that, it's 
totally true. 

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She's. 
That great. 

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Correct. 
I can do, I can do the all the 

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GMC ads in Lego Batman and all 
that good stuff I would love to 

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make. 
I would love to make some Will 

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Arnett money. 
That would be great. 

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Yeah, that is. 
So you you you talked about you 

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know starting up your own store 
now I can imagine that would be 

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pretty a pretty courageous 
courageous step like financially

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and and that kind of thing like 
what what sort of got you over 

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the line What what sort of like 
you talked about your friend 

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there for a moment there before 
you said you you sort of started

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your store but what was the real
thing that did you, you know you

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you were always working the game
industry at some in some 

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capacity so why did you open the
store, like what was your 

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incentive behind that? 
I think part of it was I had I I

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mean, I spent a lot of my time 
in, like corporate in the 

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corporate world. 
You know, I've over 2 1/2 

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decades working for different 
Fortune 500 companies. 

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And I had where I had left the 
corporate world and was working 

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in the nonprofit sector, which I
thought would be a nice change 

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of pace and it was nightmarish. 
Everything in the in the, at 

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least for the nonprofit I worked
for. 

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They're a great nonprofit, and 
they have a great mission. 

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But everything there moves at 
the speed of smell, so it just 

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crawls along and nobody's really
sure what's happening. 

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And there there's just so much 
waste, like just wasting time 

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and wasting money and wasting 
resources. 

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And it it's crazy to me 'cause 
I'm like you're a non profit, 

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like you don't have that sort of
margin to to have that. 

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But a a big part of it also came
from my love of the hobby. 

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Like again, I've I've played 
forever. 

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Like I know we're not doing this
like we can see each other, but 

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the folks at home are just 
listening to us, like you guys 

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behind me. 
It's just inundated with like 

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nerd stuff. 
I have like a ton of Black 

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Library books and I have Star 
Wars memorabilia and a huge 

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comic collection and my 
Warhammer collection is insane. 

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But I had had a really bad 
experience at a store. 

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And I'm not gonna say what 
store, but I I walked into a 

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store and this is, I mean, this 
is gonna be probably seven or 

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eight years ago at this time. 
And I was looking, and this is 

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how it's gonna date me. 
I was looking for a box of 

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original submarines and a pot of
Chaos black. 

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And I walked in and the kid at 
the counter didn't even look up.

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He was like playing with his 
phone or looking at Yu-gi-oh 

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cards or something. 
And I walked in and it was fine.

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I mean, I don't need any help. 
I know where I'm going. 

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Well, you know, I, but I I've 
worked in customer service for 

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so long. 
Like, you always want to welcome

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people and be like, hey, how's 
it going? 

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Like you need any help? 
No. 

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OK, cool. 
Like, let me know if you got any

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questions. 
So I walked in and I go 

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downstairs and I'm looking 
around and I don't see it on the

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shelf. 
And they have the old GW paint 

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rack, which has the box on top 
where you could put extras like 

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Overstock. 
And I'm tall enough to see that.

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So I'm looking through there and
I'm like, Nope, it's not here. 

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So I go upstairs and I'm waiting
in front of the counter and the 

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kids, like, still get his head 
down, not looking at me. 

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And I clear my throat and he 
looks up and he's like, oh, hey,

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so I said, hey, I'm looking for 
a box of submarines and a pot of

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paint. 
And he's like, oh, yeah, I I 

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guess it's downstairs. 
And I was like, no, I know where

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it is. 
I'm like, I went and I looked, 

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You don't have it. 
Do you guys have, like, backroom

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or overstock or anything? 
And he's like, oh, I don't, I 

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don't really know. 
Like, I don't, I don't play that

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that. 
I don't play that. 

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And I was like, so is there 
somebody that can help me with 

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this? 
Oh, I'm the only one here. 

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Do you guys have a backroom? 
No. 

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All of our product is out. 
So at this point, I'm kind of, 

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like, waiting for this kid to 
offer something. 

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So I go, when is the, do you 
have anybody on staff that's 

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like a Warhammer guy? 
Like, I can come in and talk to 

223
00:10:25,160 --> 00:10:27,240
you and he's like, oh, I don't 
really know. 

224
00:10:27,240 --> 00:10:30,200
And I inside my brain, I was 
like, screaming. 

225
00:10:30,200 --> 00:10:32,480
I wanted to be like, how did you
get this job? 

226
00:10:32,720 --> 00:10:34,520
Why are you here? 
What? 

227
00:10:35,120 --> 00:10:37,120
Who is the owner that you are 
stealing money from? 

228
00:10:37,120 --> 00:10:39,200
To be here like, this is 
atrocious. 

229
00:10:39,640 --> 00:10:41,400
So I leave. 
I was just like, I've had it. 

230
00:10:42,080 --> 00:10:45,240
So I went back. 
Months later, months, months 

231
00:10:45,240 --> 00:10:47,320
later, I went back and I was 
looking for a role-playing book.

232
00:10:48,560 --> 00:10:53,320
Different kid, different store, 
identical experience. 

233
00:10:53,320 --> 00:10:56,200
Like, no attempt at help? 
No. 

234
00:10:56,200 --> 00:10:58,680
Like, like if it's me, like if 
you and Dave come in and you're 

235
00:10:58,680 --> 00:11:00,760
looking for some, I would be 
like, you know what, I don't 

236
00:11:00,760 --> 00:11:02,280
have that. 
But let me take down your 

237
00:11:02,280 --> 00:11:04,360
information and I'll, I'll have 
somebody reach back out to you. 

238
00:11:04,520 --> 00:11:07,520
Or let me write down what you 
want and I'll make sure my boss 

239
00:11:07,520 --> 00:11:09,400
orders it and I'll call you when
it comes in. 

240
00:11:09,400 --> 00:11:12,920
Or give me your phone number and
I'll have somebody who knows how

241
00:11:12,920 --> 00:11:16,360
to do their job call you like 
and zero attempt at helping me. 

242
00:11:16,360 --> 00:11:18,560
No, no attempt at customer 
service. 

243
00:11:19,040 --> 00:11:22,240
So couple months go by and it's 
the summertime. 

244
00:11:22,240 --> 00:11:24,680
And I have a bunch of guys over 
the house, including Adam, who, 

245
00:11:25,120 --> 00:11:27,600
you know, I I mentioned before 
and we're kind of sitting around

246
00:11:27,600 --> 00:11:31,440
and we're all kind of whinging 
like we all do about our hobby. 

247
00:11:31,480 --> 00:11:33,080
Like, you know what I mean? 
Like part of the hobby is 

248
00:11:33,080 --> 00:11:36,400
whinging about the hobby. 
So somebody said something like,

249
00:11:36,840 --> 00:11:39,640
oh, I'm trying to build, I don't
know what he was working on. 

250
00:11:39,640 --> 00:11:41,520
I think he was, oh, he was 
working on Armageddon, Steel 

251
00:11:41,520 --> 00:11:43,040
Legion. 
And he was like, I can't find 

252
00:11:43,040 --> 00:11:47,400
any more Steel Legion guys. 
And I was like, yeah, I'm like, 

253
00:11:47,400 --> 00:11:48,680
I'm sure we can find some 
somewhere. 

254
00:11:48,680 --> 00:11:51,360
We'll just have to look around. 
And then, you know, Adam was 

255
00:11:51,360 --> 00:11:53,000
like, hey, didn't you have a 
weird experience a couple weeks 

256
00:11:53,000 --> 00:11:53,920
ago? 
And I was like, yeah, I was 

257
00:11:53,920 --> 00:11:56,520
looking for like a salt rings 
and and a pot of black paint. 

258
00:11:56,520 --> 00:11:59,120
Like, nothing crazy. 
It's like I was trying to find 

259
00:11:59,120 --> 00:12:01,320
something, you know, untoward. 
It was pretty basic. 

260
00:12:02,160 --> 00:12:04,680
So we were all kind of sitting 
around and and I was like, why 

261
00:12:04,680 --> 00:12:07,000
can't somebody open a store 
where the people know what 

262
00:12:07,000 --> 00:12:09,960
they're doing and they carry 
everything and the staff is 

263
00:12:09,960 --> 00:12:12,680
knowledgeable and it's a fun 
place to go and hang out and 

264
00:12:12,680 --> 00:12:15,040
there's room to play. 
And people just want to like, 

265
00:12:15,240 --> 00:12:19,040
hang out and have fun. 
And our buddy Fred went, why 

266
00:12:19,040 --> 00:12:22,280
don't you guys just open a store
and we're like, oh, that's it 

267
00:12:22,280 --> 00:12:23,920
was like the light bulb went off
and I was like, all right, we 

268
00:12:23,920 --> 00:12:27,960
could just do that. 
So Adam has experience running a

269
00:12:27,960 --> 00:12:29,760
private, a private store out in 
the West Coast. 

270
00:12:30,200 --> 00:12:33,160
And both he and I have worked 
for GW for years like I'd worked

271
00:12:33,160 --> 00:12:35,520
for, I think I worked for them 
for like 5 or six years. 

272
00:12:35,840 --> 00:12:39,680
Adam was there for, I want to 
say like 11. 

273
00:12:40,040 --> 00:12:43,560
And then we both went back a 
couple like probably 8 years ago

274
00:12:43,560 --> 00:12:46,160
at this point and they wanted us
to come back and run stores. 

275
00:12:46,680 --> 00:12:48,600
And then I was like, look, I'll 
I'll hope you guys, I'll be a 

276
00:12:48,600 --> 00:12:49,640
part timer. 
Like that's fine. 

277
00:12:49,640 --> 00:12:52,880
I love the discount. 
But like I can't do this. 

278
00:12:52,880 --> 00:12:55,960
Like I'm, I'm married and have 
you know, I, I, I can't live on 

279
00:12:55,960 --> 00:12:57,840
AGW salary. 
That's just not going to happen.

280
00:12:57,840 --> 00:13:01,040
And then we just opened the 
store and we were really lucky. 

281
00:13:01,040 --> 00:13:03,600
We had a couple of people that 
were really excited about it and

282
00:13:03,800 --> 00:13:07,280
we had some investors step up by
the way, before that happens, 

283
00:13:07,560 --> 00:13:11,560
trying to explain what a hobby 
store is to investors is insane.

284
00:13:11,560 --> 00:13:13,480
It it's like explaining math to 
a horse. 

285
00:13:16,920 --> 00:13:20,320
But so we. 
So we explained it to this one 

286
00:13:20,320 --> 00:13:22,280
guy and he was like, so I don't 
understand. 

287
00:13:22,280 --> 00:13:25,040
So why do you guys have tables? 
And I was like, so people can 

288
00:13:25,040 --> 00:13:27,520
come in and play and he's like, 
do you charge to use your 

289
00:13:27,520 --> 00:13:29,440
tables? 
And I said no. 

290
00:13:29,760 --> 00:13:30,920
And he's like, then how do you 
make money? 

291
00:13:30,920 --> 00:13:32,720
And I was like, because we sell 
everything. 

292
00:13:32,720 --> 00:13:37,560
So we sell model kits and board 
games and paints and D&D stuff 

293
00:13:37,560 --> 00:13:39,280
and card games and you know, 
whatever. 

294
00:13:39,960 --> 00:13:41,360
So he's like, I don't 
understand. 

295
00:13:41,360 --> 00:13:45,000
So finally I had to be like, OK,
how can I explain this to, you 

296
00:13:45,000 --> 00:13:48,520
know, somebody who is outside 
our, like, like, this is a 

297
00:13:48,520 --> 00:13:50,240
nergling who has come from the 
warp. 

298
00:13:50,480 --> 00:13:52,880
But I'm trying to explain how 
toothbrushes work. 

299
00:13:52,920 --> 00:13:54,080
And I was like, how do I do 
that? 

300
00:13:54,480 --> 00:13:59,320
So I said, are you familiar with
the Starbucks model versus like 

301
00:13:59,320 --> 00:14:02,080
a bowling alley? 
And he was like, sort of. 

302
00:14:02,080 --> 00:14:04,880
And I said, so when you go to a 
bowling alley, you have to pay 

303
00:14:04,880 --> 00:14:09,560
to rent the shoes and then you 
pay to use the lanes and then 

304
00:14:09,560 --> 00:14:11,200
they let you use the balls that 
are there. 

305
00:14:11,200 --> 00:14:14,160
Or you can bring your own. 
I was like, but you're paying to

306
00:14:14,160 --> 00:14:16,440
use the lane. 
And he was like, right, I said, 

307
00:14:16,440 --> 00:14:17,480
where is it? 
Starbucks. 

308
00:14:17,880 --> 00:14:19,800
As long as you buy a drink and 
you're a quote, UN quote 

309
00:14:19,800 --> 00:14:23,360
customer, you can use the Wi-Fi.
You can hang out at the tables. 

310
00:14:23,360 --> 00:14:27,040
Like, that's our business model.
Like we sell the stuff, You can 

311
00:14:27,040 --> 00:14:29,520
use our tables as long as you 
bought the stuff here. 

312
00:14:29,600 --> 00:14:33,120
And he was like, oh, OK, but no,
we got really lucky. 

313
00:14:33,120 --> 00:14:37,040
It was, it was definitely like 
nerve racking to think about the

314
00:14:37,040 --> 00:14:39,720
amount of money that we needed 
up front to start a store. 

315
00:14:40,720 --> 00:14:42,120
And it was a it was a chunk of 
change. 

316
00:14:42,120 --> 00:14:43,760
It was north of 1/4 of 
$1,000,000. 

317
00:14:45,240 --> 00:14:48,760
So we basically, I'd written up 
a whole business plan and you 

318
00:14:48,760 --> 00:14:52,640
know, built into that was first 
lesson, security for rent, a 

319
00:14:52,640 --> 00:14:54,960
year's worth of rent up front in
the in the bank in case we 

320
00:14:54,960 --> 00:14:57,520
didn't make any money. 
Like, I padded our numbers 

321
00:14:57,520 --> 00:14:59,720
pretty well. 
But I think a lot of the people 

322
00:14:59,720 --> 00:15:03,040
that invested like that 'cause 
it showed that we had thought it

323
00:15:03,040 --> 00:15:06,000
through. 
I made sure that our salary for 

324
00:15:06,000 --> 00:15:07,600
Adam and I was built into that 
number. 

325
00:15:08,400 --> 00:15:10,680
And some guy got really mad. 
One guy was like, I'm not going 

326
00:15:10,680 --> 00:15:12,200
to fund you. 
And I was like, why he goes, 

327
00:15:12,360 --> 00:15:14,520
well, 'cause you and you and 
your guys are gonna pay yourself

328
00:15:14,520 --> 00:15:16,080
out of the money. 
And I was like, right? 

329
00:15:16,080 --> 00:15:18,600
And that's so we're not worried 
about our next paycheck. 

330
00:15:18,600 --> 00:15:21,400
And instead of being here 
focused on the job, I'm working 

331
00:15:21,400 --> 00:15:24,560
a second part time job at like 
McDonald's or something to try 

332
00:15:24,560 --> 00:15:26,520
to make ends meet. 
Like we need to be focused on 

333
00:15:26,520 --> 00:15:28,480
the business. 
So we need to be here at the 

334
00:15:28,480 --> 00:15:31,080
business. 
But it was fun. 

335
00:15:31,080 --> 00:15:34,600
Like, I mean this this summer or
sorry, in March, in March, it'll

336
00:15:34,600 --> 00:15:36,720
be six years. 
Wow mate, that's great. 

337
00:15:36,720 --> 00:15:38,560
Fantastic. 
We'll be going into our 7th year

338
00:15:38,560 --> 00:15:39,760
so. 
That's amazing. 

339
00:15:40,800 --> 00:15:42,280
Fantastic, mate. 
Yeah, because I've always 

340
00:15:42,280 --> 00:15:47,760
wondered how, how like retailers
can survive not just through the

341
00:15:47,760 --> 00:15:50,840
pandemic or anything like that, 
but just just just day-to-day 

342
00:15:50,840 --> 00:15:53,560
kind of business. 
I mean, they've got to have 

343
00:15:53,560 --> 00:15:56,880
something there that allures 
people in there, either existing

344
00:15:56,880 --> 00:16:00,600
gamers or new people, you know, 
walking past your store and you 

345
00:16:00,600 --> 00:16:03,160
want to grab them in there and 
try to, you know, sell them this

346
00:16:03,160 --> 00:16:05,640
concept of war gaming and that 
kind of thing. 

347
00:16:06,320 --> 00:16:10,080
But it's really, really 
encouraging to hear that you 

348
00:16:10,080 --> 00:16:14,040
yourself, on this almost 
seven-year journey, have made it

349
00:16:14,040 --> 00:16:16,640
mate so, even through a 
pandemic, of all things. 

350
00:16:17,080 --> 00:16:18,640
Yeah, that was a little dodgy. 
I'm not gonna lie. 

351
00:16:18,640 --> 00:16:20,640
It was a little dicey for a 
couple of months, but. 

352
00:16:20,640 --> 00:16:23,600
Absolutely, mate. 
Yeah, that's amazing. 

353
00:16:24,720 --> 00:16:28,120
Now of course, Dave is here too,
yeah. 

354
00:16:28,120 --> 00:16:29,520
Sorry, I've been. 
I've been Bulgarian the Mic. 

355
00:16:29,520 --> 00:16:31,680
No, no, no, Not at all, mate. 
Not at all. 

356
00:16:31,680 --> 00:16:33,760
No, no, not at all. 
All good, all good. 

357
00:16:33,880 --> 00:16:36,800
Because, yeah, I obviously 
brought you both, both in at the

358
00:16:36,800 --> 00:16:38,760
same time. 
So you know, because you both 

359
00:16:38,800 --> 00:16:40,960
are good friends and you know 
each other very well. 

360
00:16:40,960 --> 00:16:44,800
And of course you do this build,
paint, play, live stream 

361
00:16:44,800 --> 00:16:46,760
together. 
I actually did. 

362
00:16:46,760 --> 00:16:49,800
And you did mention about Dave 
having started something else on

363
00:16:49,800 --> 00:16:51,960
a live stream, and I actually 
watched that for a little bit, 

364
00:16:51,960 --> 00:16:53,560
but I can't remember what it 
was. 

365
00:16:53,560 --> 00:16:55,880
But it was like a group of 
people painting miniatures or 

366
00:16:55,880 --> 00:16:59,160
something and chatting. 
What was that? 

367
00:16:59,160 --> 00:17:00,320
Sorry, Dave, what was that 
again? 

368
00:17:00,960 --> 00:17:03,360
Painting happy little Minis, 
right? 

369
00:17:04,400 --> 00:17:09,880
It was basically started by a 
mutual friend of Jake and mine, 

370
00:17:10,480 --> 00:17:14,839
Rick Agny, when he worked for 
Alliance Game Distributors. 

371
00:17:15,839 --> 00:17:19,680
Yeah. 
So he was responsible for sort 

372
00:17:19,680 --> 00:17:28,560
of video media for Alliance and 
sorry, Alliance and Diamond 

373
00:17:28,600 --> 00:17:32,880
Comics Distributors as well, 
which is one of the biggest 

374
00:17:33,160 --> 00:17:38,280
comic distributors in the US And
basically he put together a 

375
00:17:38,280 --> 00:17:45,040
number of shows that would focus
on or promote products that 

376
00:17:45,120 --> 00:17:49,840
Alliance carried. 
So if Alliance carried Vallejo, 

377
00:17:50,280 --> 00:17:53,960
we'd use Vallejo Paints. 
We'd use the Army Painter as 

378
00:17:53,960 --> 00:17:56,360
well because that were carried 
by Alliance. 

379
00:17:56,640 --> 00:17:59,200
We'd paint miniatures that were 
carried by Alliance, that kind 

380
00:17:59,200 --> 00:18:01,520
of thing. 
So it was always like, oh, what 

381
00:18:01,520 --> 00:18:02,960
are you working on? 
What are you painting there? 

382
00:18:02,960 --> 00:18:06,560
We're painting this. 
We're painting like at one point

383
00:18:07,040 --> 00:18:09,440
we're painting Star Wars Legion,
which at the time was carried by

384
00:18:09,440 --> 00:18:11,240
Alliance. 
We're like, yeah, you can just 

385
00:18:11,240 --> 00:18:14,280
get to your local store to give 
their Alliance Rep a call and 

386
00:18:14,280 --> 00:18:16,200
you can get this product in your
local store. 

387
00:18:16,920 --> 00:18:21,320
It was that kind of sort of 
angle for it that we were doing 

388
00:18:23,560 --> 00:18:28,120
at the height we were doing 2 
shows a week, two sort of hour 

389
00:18:28,120 --> 00:18:35,120
Long live streams on Tuesday and
Thursday and it kind of 

390
00:18:37,000 --> 00:18:40,760
progressed for a while. 
Then of course pandemic hit. 

391
00:18:41,880 --> 00:18:46,600
We had a couple of changes then 
we worked out that we could do 

392
00:18:46,600 --> 00:18:50,400
some painting from home. 
So I ended up sitting in a seat 

393
00:18:50,400 --> 00:18:54,560
that I'm in now and Tuesdays and
Thursdays we do the live stream.

394
00:18:56,680 --> 00:19:02,960
Yeah, to the point where late in
2021 I was in Australia for a 

395
00:19:02,960 --> 00:19:06,400
few weeks and we did a live 
stream. 

396
00:19:06,400 --> 00:19:08,560
While I was there. 
I had to wake up sort of extra 

397
00:19:08,560 --> 00:19:14,080
early and was able to do well. 
Basically record the the same 

398
00:19:14,080 --> 00:19:16,160
live stream. 
Yeah, yeah. 

399
00:19:16,920 --> 00:19:19,000
So it was pretty pretty amazing 
to be able to do that. 

400
00:19:19,600 --> 00:19:23,480
But we got to a point where our 
producer moved on to another 

401
00:19:24,400 --> 00:19:33,800
career and my Co host left to 
become a a mum and they didn't 

402
00:19:33,800 --> 00:19:36,240
really. 
Things were sort of a little bit

403
00:19:36,240 --> 00:19:41,240
odd at Alliance at the time and 
they kind of we were waiting to 

404
00:19:41,240 --> 00:19:44,880
hear if there was going to be a 
sort of revamp of the show. 

405
00:19:46,080 --> 00:19:48,640
But at that time, Jake was like,
yeah, I'm thinking maybe you're 

406
00:19:48,640 --> 00:19:51,520
doing a live stream. 
I was doing a podcast and I was 

407
00:19:51,520 --> 00:19:54,640
like, well, I have all this 
extra time. 

408
00:19:57,160 --> 00:19:59,080
That's wonderful. 
Let's talk about it. 

409
00:19:59,080 --> 00:20:04,080
So yeah. 
And then of course, we've just 

410
00:20:04,080 --> 00:20:07,600
been, a lot of it's been messing
around and previously having a 

411
00:20:07,600 --> 00:20:12,320
producer, having a team of 
people who created, sorry, 

412
00:20:12,320 --> 00:20:15,200
painting, having all minis, it 
was like all I had to do was 

413
00:20:15,200 --> 00:20:20,000
show up and and paint and talk. 
And then I was like, OK, well, 

414
00:20:20,000 --> 00:20:22,440
now I have to work out how to do
all this thing, these things. 

415
00:20:23,000 --> 00:20:25,520
And do we use Stream Yard? 
Do we use OB? 

416
00:20:25,520 --> 00:20:27,680
Yes. 
Do we use something else? 

417
00:20:27,680 --> 00:20:32,240
How do we get people to call in?
And it's gone through several 

418
00:20:32,240 --> 00:20:37,480
iterations of the we're on our 
fourth season now, and through 

419
00:20:37,480 --> 00:20:39,680
several iterations since the 
start. 

420
00:20:40,760 --> 00:20:41,840
Wonderful guys. 
That's good. 

421
00:20:41,840 --> 00:20:44,200
Yeah, because I thought, I think
I just found you by chance. 

422
00:20:44,200 --> 00:20:48,920
I think just on my, on my 
YouTube feed, I just popped and 

423
00:20:48,920 --> 00:20:51,080
I saw your face and I thought, 
oh, you're doing something new. 

424
00:20:51,080 --> 00:20:53,080
OK, I'll go and check it out. 
So that's how I sort of hopped 

425
00:20:53,080 --> 00:20:55,120
onto that. 
And as I'm sitting here painting

426
00:20:55,120 --> 00:20:58,400
through the day because your, 
your show starts at about 10:00 

427
00:20:58,400 --> 00:21:02,080
AM here. 
No, 9 AMI, think 9:00 AM here in

428
00:21:02,080 --> 00:21:03,720
Japan. 
So it's the perfect time. 

429
00:21:03,720 --> 00:21:06,800
So I, you know, take my son to 
school, come back, you know, put

430
00:21:06,800 --> 00:21:09,760
on the brew, come and sit here 
and start work and then watch 

431
00:21:09,760 --> 00:21:13,880
you guys talk about various 
different things in the hobby, 

432
00:21:13,880 --> 00:21:15,680
in your community. 
And then bring on some kind of 

433
00:21:15,680 --> 00:21:19,280
special guest and have like a, 
you know a round table kind of 

434
00:21:19,280 --> 00:21:21,880
thing where each each week you 
have a a different person on 

435
00:21:22,960 --> 00:21:25,200
which is always interesting to 
see what what's happening. 

436
00:21:25,560 --> 00:21:28,440
I must say that like a lot of 
the terminology used in 40K now 

437
00:21:29,200 --> 00:21:31,880
there's a whole new vocabulary. 
I don't understand any of it now

438
00:21:32,360 --> 00:21:34,520
like things you, you, you know, 
you and Jake are talking about, 

439
00:21:34,640 --> 00:21:37,160
you know, your loadouts on your 
dreadnoughts and your your 

440
00:21:37,280 --> 00:21:39,600
vehicles and stuff like that. 
I don't know what it is like 

441
00:21:39,600 --> 00:21:42,560
I've I've been so out of touch. 
But it's been quite a learning 

442
00:21:42,560 --> 00:21:45,000
experience, like listening to 
you guys talking about the 

443
00:21:45,000 --> 00:21:47,240
modern stuff. 
Because yeah, I do feel out of 

444
00:21:47,240 --> 00:21:48,400
touch with that sort of stuff 
now. 

445
00:21:49,240 --> 00:21:50,840
Yeah. 
I don't think, I don't think 

446
00:21:50,840 --> 00:21:53,200
it's changed that much. 
I mean, I mean it's it's 

447
00:21:53,200 --> 00:21:55,520
different from Rogue Trader for 
sure. 

448
00:21:55,520 --> 00:21:56,840
I'm. 
The line guy from Second 

449
00:21:56,880 --> 00:21:57,760
edition, mate. 
That's it. 

450
00:21:57,760 --> 00:22:00,200
But. 
But even in like in in second 

451
00:22:00,200 --> 00:22:02,200
and third edition, you could 
change the way a a dreadnought 

452
00:22:02,200 --> 00:22:04,160
was armed. 
They just they just changed the 

453
00:22:04,160 --> 00:22:05,320
name. 
Like a mortise pattern. 

454
00:22:05,320 --> 00:22:09,440
Dreadnought had a last gun and a
missile launcher and a Furiosa. 

455
00:22:09,440 --> 00:22:12,680
Dreadnought had two close combat
claws and a regular Dreadnought 

456
00:22:12,680 --> 00:22:16,480
had a claw and any one of like 5
weapons it could have. 

457
00:22:16,480 --> 00:22:19,120
AI think it'd have what, like a 
last cannon and assault cannon? 

458
00:22:19,360 --> 00:22:22,760
Twin heavy bolters melting a 
multi melter. 

459
00:22:23,040 --> 00:22:25,520
It's the same thing now it's 
just instead of making it 

460
00:22:25,520 --> 00:22:28,560
different types of Dreadnoughts,
it's just like, hey, you have a 

461
00:22:28,560 --> 00:22:30,160
Dreadnought how do you want it 
Armed. 

462
00:22:30,840 --> 00:22:33,200
And they they've they've brought
it back even with the the 

463
00:22:33,200 --> 00:22:34,880
primary stuff like Dave was 
showing last week. 

464
00:22:35,240 --> 00:22:39,240
So his brutalist Dreadnought is 
the one with two close combat 

465
00:22:39,240 --> 00:22:43,920
claws and his Ballistas 
Dreadnought is the old mortise 

466
00:22:43,920 --> 00:22:46,680
pattern so it has a rocket 
launcher and last cannons. 

467
00:22:46,880 --> 00:22:49,400
So it's all the same. 
They just keep changing the 

468
00:22:49,400 --> 00:22:52,080
names because of like the you 
know, they just want to own all 

469
00:22:52,080 --> 00:22:53,520
the IPS. 
So now instead of being. 

470
00:22:53,520 --> 00:22:55,640
I think I've done it. 
Yeah. 

471
00:22:56,120 --> 00:22:57,200
No, that's fair enough. 
That's fair enough. 

472
00:22:58,720 --> 00:23:00,200
You'd be fine. 
You're a strong swimmer. 

473
00:23:00,200 --> 00:23:01,800
You you can handle the current, 
you'll be good. 

474
00:23:03,280 --> 00:23:06,880
Yeah, this is a multi melter, 
not a multi melter. 

475
00:23:06,920 --> 00:23:09,160
Totally fine. 
The unpronounceables. 

476
00:23:09,400 --> 00:23:13,320
Yeah, not a gravis melt melt. 
Again it's no, I would I would 

477
00:23:13,320 --> 00:23:16,240
suggest like Jacob, I think it's
important to to say that like 

478
00:23:16,360 --> 00:23:19,680
because you've been in 40K all 
through those additions. 

479
00:23:19,680 --> 00:23:21,640
Yeah, that's why. 
It's kind of like the the frog 

480
00:23:21,640 --> 00:23:25,600
in the the pot of water. 
It's like you're at the point 

481
00:23:25,600 --> 00:23:29,600
where you haven't noticed that 
temperature increase, but it 

482
00:23:29,600 --> 00:23:33,040
just jumps in. 
Oh my God, I'm boiling. 

483
00:23:33,400 --> 00:23:37,200
Cold feet, mate, Cold feet. 
But look guys, we're going to go

484
00:23:37,200 --> 00:23:39,840
for a quick ad break now and 
when we come back we can talk 

485
00:23:39,840 --> 00:23:43,400
about more about the channel and
the build, paint, play 

486
00:23:43,400 --> 00:23:46,680
philosophy and maybe about the 
guests you brought on or the 

487
00:23:46,680 --> 00:23:49,160
projects you're working on and 
about the community itself. 

488
00:23:49,600 --> 00:23:50,880
So we'll be back in just a 
moment. 

489
00:23:52,920 --> 00:23:55,720
If you are enjoying this podcast
and the content on the Chronic 

490
00:23:55,720 --> 00:23:58,840
Command Games YouTube channel, 
then please consider supporting 

491
00:23:58,840 --> 00:24:02,200
me on Patreon. 
Becoming a Storm Boy allows you 

492
00:24:02,200 --> 00:24:06,000
access to Behind the scene news,
the information of upcoming 

493
00:24:06,000 --> 00:24:10,120
podcast guests and themes, video
batter reports and occasionally 

494
00:24:10,120 --> 00:24:13,720
exclusive podcasts with special 
guests or fellow patrons. 

495
00:24:14,440 --> 00:24:17,960
And coming soon are painting 
videos which we made to give you

496
00:24:17,960 --> 00:24:21,760
the skills and tips on painting 
in the red period using modern 

497
00:24:21,760 --> 00:24:23,840
paints and practical 
applications. 

498
00:24:24,560 --> 00:24:27,560
And you can also access one to 
one painting lessons in the 

499
00:24:27,560 --> 00:24:31,200
heavy LED Master class tier for 
a 40 minute personalized 

500
00:24:31,200 --> 00:24:36,600
painting lesson. 
So check out patreon.com/the 

501
00:24:36,600 --> 00:24:41,920
Crown of Command Podcast. 
Have you always dreamed of 

502
00:24:41,920 --> 00:24:44,520
having your old gangstership 
armies professionally painted in

503
00:24:44,520 --> 00:24:47,760
the style of the white dwarf 
battle reports of the 1990s? 

504
00:24:48,520 --> 00:24:52,080
Well, let me introduce you to 
Eddie LED Painting Studios Japan

505
00:24:52,800 --> 00:24:55,520
as a professional painter with 
over 30 years experience in 

506
00:24:55,520 --> 00:24:58,000
having a short stint working at 
the Gangstership Nottingham 

507
00:24:58,000 --> 00:25:00,960
Studio as a miniature painter in
the mid 1990s. 

508
00:25:01,360 --> 00:25:03,800
I now work as a full time 
professional miniature painter 

509
00:25:04,120 --> 00:25:06,840
having the joy to turn your old 
love metal and plastic 

510
00:25:06,840 --> 00:25:10,120
miniatures into life with 
saturated colour and of course 

511
00:25:10,120 --> 00:25:14,640
with Goblin green bases. 
For enquiries please contact me 

512
00:25:14,640 --> 00:25:27,320
via e-mail at evylead@gmail.com.
That's EAVYLEAD at gmail.com and

513
00:25:27,320 --> 00:25:29,720
please check out the links in 
the show description for my 

514
00:25:29,720 --> 00:25:33,000
Facebook gallery page and I hope
to hear from you soon to start 

515
00:25:33,000 --> 00:25:37,240
your dream project. 
OK. 

516
00:25:37,240 --> 00:25:40,960
Well, let's let's talk about the
streams because I want to the 

517
00:25:41,000 --> 00:25:44,320
the reason, another reason why I
wanted to bring you on is to 

518
00:25:44,680 --> 00:25:48,600
navigate people to your stream 
because I I noticed that you 

519
00:25:48,600 --> 00:25:51,960
know the quality stream, the the
conversation quality was really 

520
00:25:51,960 --> 00:25:55,720
good and it's really interesting
and you know it's great to have 

521
00:25:55,720 --> 00:25:58,640
all these other people in these 
third party people coming in to 

522
00:25:58,640 --> 00:26:02,240
talk about their products or you
know things that they do. 

523
00:26:02,240 --> 00:26:04,200
I know you guys have an 
association with the army 

524
00:26:04,200 --> 00:26:07,920
Painter and their products as 
they're a sponsor for your show.

525
00:26:08,280 --> 00:26:11,320
And you talk about Jake's store 
and you know Jake talks about 

526
00:26:11,760 --> 00:26:13,720
which is really interesting to 
me because like you know, the 

527
00:26:13,720 --> 00:26:16,240
insurance and outs of, you know,
running a retail store and the 

528
00:26:16,320 --> 00:26:19,840
hurdles that go with that and 
that kind of thing and then you 

529
00:26:19,840 --> 00:26:22,360
bring on. 
So I'm very interesting about, 

530
00:26:22,360 --> 00:26:23,760
you know, something they're 
doing. 

531
00:26:23,760 --> 00:26:27,120
So it might be the tale of four,
is it the four warlords you do. 

532
00:26:27,920 --> 00:26:30,760
So it's your sort of a mini 
painting challenge you have 

533
00:26:30,760 --> 00:26:34,080
internally with yourselves and a
couple other guys in the States 

534
00:26:34,600 --> 00:26:37,520
or it could be someone from a 
company talking about the 

535
00:26:37,520 --> 00:26:39,800
products they produce and 
promote and that kind of thing. 

536
00:26:39,800 --> 00:26:42,280
So you have a, you have a sort 
of a shared interest in 

537
00:26:42,280 --> 00:26:45,440
promoting other people's 
products and that kind of thing 

538
00:26:46,200 --> 00:26:49,640
in the hobby, which is great. 
So yeah, I wanted people, I 

539
00:26:49,640 --> 00:26:53,440
wanted to direct people to your 
live stream and we were talking 

540
00:26:53,440 --> 00:26:56,760
off air before that. 
It will soon be available as a 

541
00:26:56,760 --> 00:26:59,480
podcast, which would be great 
because I think a podcast is a 

542
00:26:59,480 --> 00:27:04,120
really good way to to consume 
media these days as people 

543
00:27:04,120 --> 00:27:07,640
commute from work and and home 
and that kind of thing, or as 

544
00:27:07,640 --> 00:27:11,880
they do their hobby, but also to
check out your live stream, like

545
00:27:11,880 --> 00:27:15,080
it, subscribe and hopefully 
catch along if they're in the 

546
00:27:15,080 --> 00:27:16,880
US. 
There's no reason why you can't 

547
00:27:17,000 --> 00:27:20,840
do that on a what's that Tuesday
evening for you guys, isn't it? 

548
00:27:21,440 --> 00:27:22,440
Yeah, Yep. 
Yep. 

549
00:27:23,520 --> 00:27:26,560
Which is, is that, is that what,
Wednesday morning for you guys 

550
00:27:26,560 --> 00:27:28,920
or is it Monday morning? 
It's Wednesday morning for me 

551
00:27:28,920 --> 00:27:30,440
because I live in your future, 
my friend. 

552
00:27:31,120 --> 00:27:33,480
I'm in a DeLorean, so I live in.
The. 

553
00:27:33,800 --> 00:27:35,880
Future. 
So I'm it's basically here, 

554
00:27:35,880 --> 00:27:41,080
it's, it's 9:00 AM here when it 
starts, it's your 8:00 PM or 

555
00:27:41,080 --> 00:27:46,480
7:00 PM. 7:00 PM. 7:00 PM there 
and the show is you're saying 

556
00:27:46,480 --> 00:27:48,320
you you you go for about two 
hours. 

557
00:27:49,240 --> 00:27:50,080
Yeah. 
And. 

558
00:27:50,080 --> 00:27:52,800
Initially, initially we said 
we're, yeah, we'll go for like 

559
00:27:52,800 --> 00:27:55,880
an hour or so. 
And then we found we were doing 

560
00:27:55,920 --> 00:27:59,280
like a 3 1/2 and then I was like
we'll go for an hour and a half 

561
00:27:59,280 --> 00:28:01,840
or so and now we're doing 2 
hours, like pushing two hours. 

562
00:28:01,840 --> 00:28:04,520
It's probably probably an hour 
45. 

563
00:28:04,520 --> 00:28:08,960
Hour 50 is kind of standard. 
It's it's mostly my fault. 

564
00:28:08,960 --> 00:28:11,280
Like when we have guests on 
like, I tend to tangent pretty 

565
00:28:11,280 --> 00:28:13,440
hard and we'll go down a rabbit 
hole. 

566
00:28:13,600 --> 00:28:16,200
I mean, Dave does it too from 
time to time, if it's the right 

567
00:28:16,200 --> 00:28:17,600
thing. 
Yeah. 

568
00:28:17,800 --> 00:28:20,360
Like if it's like the quality 
and consistency of a specific 

569
00:28:20,360 --> 00:28:24,200
white paint, like Dave can talk 
for hours about that like his 

570
00:28:24,200 --> 00:28:27,320
favorite brand of white paint or
or whatever color we're talking 

571
00:28:27,320 --> 00:28:30,120
about. 
But no it's it's a lot of it 

572
00:28:30,120 --> 00:28:32,520
depends on the guests and you 
know what we're talking about 

573
00:28:32,520 --> 00:28:36,280
and you know how, how, how off 
the rails that goes. 

574
00:28:36,280 --> 00:28:40,680
And and we have in addition to 
answering questions that have 

575
00:28:40,680 --> 00:28:44,080
been posed on our Facebook 
during the week, we also have 

576
00:28:44,080 --> 00:28:47,040
people that will live chat 
during the during the show. 

577
00:28:47,160 --> 00:28:49,640
So a lot of times we'll, you 
know we'll we'll use questions 

578
00:28:49,640 --> 00:28:54,120
from them or or the guest will 
answer questions and that can, 

579
00:28:54,360 --> 00:28:57,320
you know, that can kind of you 
know, mess up our quote UN quote

580
00:28:57,320 --> 00:28:59,320
timeline. 
But it's kind of the beauty of 

581
00:28:59,320 --> 00:29:02,120
our show is like we're the whole
reason that Dave and I do it 

582
00:29:02,120 --> 00:29:04,680
live is it was just less work 
than trying to record it and 

583
00:29:04,680 --> 00:29:07,680
stuff And it it that's the 
beauty of doing it live, right. 

584
00:29:07,680 --> 00:29:09,680
I mean if it goes long, it goes 
long, if it's shorter, it's 

585
00:29:09,680 --> 00:29:12,080
shorter. 
It's, it doesn't really, it 

586
00:29:12,080 --> 00:29:13,640
doesn't really matter. 
No, no one's going to get 

587
00:29:13,640 --> 00:29:16,400
shortchanged. 
I mean, like the average show is

588
00:29:16,400 --> 00:29:19,400
between like, like Dave said, an
hour and a half to an hour and 

589
00:29:19,400 --> 00:29:22,400
45. 
But yeah, we do have a couple 

590
00:29:22,400 --> 00:29:23,040
longer. 
Ones. 

591
00:29:25,080 --> 00:29:30,120
Yeah, no, that's good. 
So now Dave, like you have you 

592
00:29:30,120 --> 00:29:34,200
have a Facebook group as well 
which you then share during your

593
00:29:34,200 --> 00:29:36,600
streams. 
They're amazing work. 

594
00:29:36,600 --> 00:29:39,080
Hey, there's a lot of great 
painters in your in your 

595
00:29:39,080 --> 00:29:42,920
community on Facebook. 
Yeah, we have a yeah, we have a 

596
00:29:42,920 --> 00:29:45,320
Facebook group. 
The Build Paint Play community 

597
00:29:45,960 --> 00:29:47,040
is the name of the Facebook 
page. 

598
00:29:47,040 --> 00:29:51,680
So nice and straightforward, but
yeah, we've got a lot of lot of 

599
00:29:51,680 --> 00:29:57,000
people there who are very avid 
hobbyists who are working on 

600
00:29:57,000 --> 00:30:00,880
stuff every every week. 
We have some folks who sort of 

601
00:30:00,880 --> 00:30:03,600
pop in intermittently and share 
their work. 

602
00:30:04,920 --> 00:30:09,560
We have a lot of people who 
share share stuff that is very 

603
00:30:09,680 --> 00:30:14,440
unique I guess within the group 
ideas that we haven't seen 

604
00:30:14,440 --> 00:30:17,400
before, paint styles or paint 
approaches to painting. 

605
00:30:19,800 --> 00:30:22,520
We have a guy at the moment, 
Steven Ryder, who is posting a 

606
00:30:22,520 --> 00:30:28,800
lot of classic miniatures, very,
very old fantasy miniatures, so 

607
00:30:29,440 --> 00:30:38,360
late 70s, early 80s, Grenadier 
Mini that are exciting to see is

608
00:30:38,360 --> 00:30:41,640
like they were into a few times 
where it's like, oh, oh, I 

609
00:30:41,640 --> 00:30:43,280
remember that. 
That was like the first set of 

610
00:30:43,280 --> 00:30:45,080
minis. 
Yeah, times. 

611
00:30:45,480 --> 00:30:46,800
Oh my God, where did that come 
from? 

612
00:30:46,800 --> 00:30:50,960
I've never seen that at all and 
it'd be like, well, nobody ever 

613
00:30:50,960 --> 00:30:55,560
shipped it to Australia. 
So I never saw it at the time. 

614
00:30:55,880 --> 00:31:00,080
But yeah, it's I think one of 
the things you you mentioned 

615
00:31:00,080 --> 00:31:04,040
before you asked about the sort 
of the philosophy behind build, 

616
00:31:04,040 --> 00:31:07,520
paint, play. 
And one of the key things that 

617
00:31:07,520 --> 00:31:14,280
we wanted to do was basically 
have a have a show where if we 

618
00:31:14,280 --> 00:31:17,840
were presenting things in a 
positive light, we're looking 

619
00:31:17,840 --> 00:31:21,080
for the the positive in as many 
things as we could. 

620
00:31:22,160 --> 00:31:25,640
Because there's certainly a lot 
of, I think unfortunately there 

621
00:31:25,640 --> 00:31:30,480
are a lot of clicks going to 
people who are like, Oh my 

622
00:31:30,480 --> 00:31:33,720
goodness, have you seen what 
they've done now Doomsday. 

623
00:31:34,520 --> 00:31:37,440
Yeah, I I can't. 
I can't stand I. 

624
00:31:37,440 --> 00:31:39,080
Can't stand it either, mate. 
I think that's. 

625
00:31:39,120 --> 00:31:41,440
I think that's one of the 
reasons why Dave and I get along

626
00:31:41,440 --> 00:31:46,080
so well is like we we both are 
are pretty positive like Dave is

627
00:31:46,080 --> 00:31:50,560
Dave is very positive. 
I I try to be I tell my people I

628
00:31:50,560 --> 00:31:53,280
tell my friends all the time I 
am a hopeful pragmatist. 

629
00:31:53,960 --> 00:31:56,680
So but I I think it's. 
I think it's. 

630
00:31:56,680 --> 00:32:00,520
I think it helps out a lot. 
You know we won't spend. 

631
00:32:00,720 --> 00:32:03,040
There's plenty of stuff that we 
all don't like I'm sure. 

632
00:32:03,560 --> 00:32:05,600
Yeah. 
But Dave and I try to not focus 

633
00:32:05,600 --> 00:32:06,720
on that. 
Like that's not what the show's 

634
00:32:06,720 --> 00:32:08,520
about. 
The show's about hey, what are 

635
00:32:08,520 --> 00:32:12,920
you working on What do you think
is fun What what's the new thing

636
00:32:12,920 --> 00:32:14,960
you're excited about or what's 
the new model you're painting or

637
00:32:14,960 --> 00:32:16,400
what's the new paint line you 
want to try. 

638
00:32:17,720 --> 00:32:21,200
And and I think that for a lot 
of people it's just kind of 

639
00:32:21,200 --> 00:32:24,120
refreshing. 
I I can't stand the whole oh, 

640
00:32:24,120 --> 00:32:25,400
I'm really upset about this 
thing. 

641
00:32:25,400 --> 00:32:27,480
I'm not going to play sisters 
and guess why. 

642
00:32:27,480 --> 00:32:30,760
And then you click and it's, you
know, it's two nerds in a 

643
00:32:30,760 --> 00:32:34,640
basement whinging about the new 
rule set and how they change the

644
00:32:34,640 --> 00:32:36,520
sculpt. 
And my rules are worse and 

645
00:32:36,520 --> 00:32:39,200
there's no AP and I just that 
stuff drives me now. 

646
00:32:39,200 --> 00:32:42,240
I can't handle that. 
Whereas we're we're two nerds in

647
00:32:42,240 --> 00:32:44,920
basements avoiding whinging 
about. 

648
00:32:45,240 --> 00:32:47,840
Exactly. 
Come on, the secondary. 

649
00:32:47,920 --> 00:32:49,160
Price I'm OK. 
I'm safe. 

650
00:32:49,240 --> 00:32:52,680
I must be elevated and beyond 
the basement. 

651
00:32:54,720 --> 00:32:56,720
It all averages out it all out. 
Well, I wish I could be a 

652
00:32:56,720 --> 00:32:58,000
basement dweller. 
Sounds fun. 

653
00:32:58,320 --> 00:33:00,040
Sounds good, especially in the 
summer. 

654
00:33:00,960 --> 00:33:02,720
It is definitely cooler in my 
basement in the summer. 

655
00:33:02,720 --> 00:33:07,320
Yeah, but yeah, you're right. 
I mean, there's so much 

656
00:33:07,320 --> 00:33:09,120
negativity out there, so much 
clickbait. 

657
00:33:09,800 --> 00:33:12,480
And I hate those. 
Like, I shouldn't say hate, but 

658
00:33:12,480 --> 00:33:14,960
I I don't look at them. 
I don't watch them because of 

659
00:33:14,960 --> 00:33:17,480
that particular reason. 
I think there's enough 

660
00:33:17,480 --> 00:33:20,280
negativity in the world already.
Why would you want to bring it 

661
00:33:20,280 --> 00:33:21,560
into your hobby? 
You know what I mean? 

662
00:33:21,560 --> 00:33:26,320
So I always are attracted to 
positive people, you know, 

663
00:33:26,320 --> 00:33:29,200
whether it be talking about 
things that I'm interested in, 

664
00:33:29,320 --> 00:33:33,880
interested in or not. 
It just elevates that experience

665
00:33:33,920 --> 00:33:36,320
of oh wow, they're really 
passionate about this. 

666
00:33:36,320 --> 00:33:40,440
And maybe it's not my cup of 
tea, but it's it's nice and 

667
00:33:40,440 --> 00:33:43,920
refreshing to hear someone 
talking about it so positively 

668
00:33:43,920 --> 00:33:46,520
and it sort of attracts like 
minded people. 

669
00:33:46,520 --> 00:33:50,040
And and I think you know, you, 
you guys and what you do and the

670
00:33:50,040 --> 00:33:53,200
community you're building is, 
you know, you get followers and 

671
00:33:53,200 --> 00:33:55,440
attract people who feel the same
way. 

672
00:33:55,920 --> 00:33:58,600
And we're all in the hobby for 
various different reasons. 

673
00:33:58,600 --> 00:34:02,640
Whether it's like me, you know, 
being this madman in Japan with 

674
00:34:02,720 --> 00:34:08,040
stuff from the 1990s and, you 
know, trying to try to con 

675
00:34:08,040 --> 00:34:11,040
people into playing games with 
me or it's, you know, you guys 

676
00:34:11,040 --> 00:34:14,880
doing the modern stuff and being
really excited about that. 

677
00:34:15,719 --> 00:34:17,280
You know? 
And you know, like I said, one 

678
00:34:17,280 --> 00:34:19,960
of your guys in your groups 
doing something from, you know, 

679
00:34:19,960 --> 00:34:24,960
way back in the 70s, collecting 
and and painting models from 

680
00:34:25,040 --> 00:34:27,960
Grenadier and rail path or what 
have you, you know, we're all in

681
00:34:27,960 --> 00:34:31,239
there all in this together doing
something that we feel really 

682
00:34:31,239 --> 00:34:34,880
passionate about. 
So it's like, you know, just 

683
00:34:34,880 --> 00:34:38,239
find something, find your niche 
and yeah, just get behind stuff 

684
00:34:38,239 --> 00:34:40,080
that's really positive and 
motivating. 

685
00:34:40,239 --> 00:34:41,920
That's really what it is. 
At the end of the day, yeah. 

686
00:34:43,120 --> 00:34:45,040
Yeah, exactly. 
Yeah. 

687
00:34:46,040 --> 00:34:50,960
I think we're we're very lucky. 
We've got in our like in amongst

688
00:34:51,000 --> 00:34:55,719
our our regular viewers that we 
have like the live stream who 

689
00:34:55,719 --> 00:34:57,560
are in The Who pop into the 
chat. 

690
00:34:59,280 --> 00:35:06,160
We've got folks who are running 
paint takes and helping demo 

691
00:35:06,160 --> 00:35:12,320
games at conventions. 
We've got folks who are salesman

692
00:35:12,320 --> 00:35:16,600
for places like Alliance. 
We've got folks who are, it's 

693
00:35:17,240 --> 00:35:20,360
very much it's their hobby. 
They're not commercially 

694
00:35:20,360 --> 00:35:24,880
involved in the industry, but 
they've got a particular take on

695
00:35:24,880 --> 00:35:30,040
things. 
And it also it helps us, well, 

696
00:35:30,040 --> 00:35:35,520
certainly certainly helps me 
realize that my experience or 

697
00:35:35,520 --> 00:35:39,160
the things that I can 
experience, not what everybody 

698
00:35:39,160 --> 00:35:41,880
else can experience. 
So I'm lucky. 

699
00:35:41,880 --> 00:35:47,440
I've got a great sort of friends
in Baltimore, number of gaming 

700
00:35:47,440 --> 00:35:51,360
groups that I can participate in
who are doing different stuff. 

701
00:35:52,000 --> 00:35:55,040
So I can't just. 
But there are people who watch 

702
00:35:55,040 --> 00:35:58,480
us who are like, it's that it's 
that guy and two other guys in 

703
00:35:58,480 --> 00:36:04,400
their small town in rural Canada
that don't have that 

704
00:36:04,400 --> 00:36:08,080
opportunity. 
And so it's looking for OK, how 

705
00:36:08,080 --> 00:36:12,240
can we help you participate more
in this hobby you love? 

706
00:36:12,880 --> 00:36:17,560
Yeah, so our community. 
Is our community is small but 

707
00:36:17,560 --> 00:36:19,000
mighty. 
Like I think that we have a 

708
00:36:19,000 --> 00:36:22,000
pretty good, I think we have a 
we have a really good cross 

709
00:36:22,000 --> 00:36:24,520
section of folks like we've got 
like Dave was saying, there's 

710
00:36:24,760 --> 00:36:26,880
there's a bunch of people who 
work in the industry like a 

711
00:36:26,880 --> 00:36:29,720
bunch of them that are on. 
We've got some people that are 

712
00:36:29,720 --> 00:36:32,520
really well known kind of like 
in the streaming community that 

713
00:36:32,520 --> 00:36:33,960
are on there. 
We've got some guys that are 

714
00:36:34,200 --> 00:36:37,840
like widely recognized 
professional painters that are 

715
00:36:37,840 --> 00:36:39,520
in there. 
But then you know we also have a

716
00:36:39,520 --> 00:36:41,880
bunch of guys who are just a 
bunch of friends of ours and 

717
00:36:41,880 --> 00:36:43,640
some people who are just, I 
heard about this from a friend 

718
00:36:43,640 --> 00:36:46,440
of a friend, Like people who are
like we had a guy in a couple 

719
00:36:46,440 --> 00:36:47,760
weeks ago. 
He's like, I've painted my first

720
00:36:47,760 --> 00:36:51,240
miniature, which is awesome. 
Like, I mean that's that's kind 

721
00:36:51,240 --> 00:36:54,400
of like what we're trying to do.
And it's like, like you said, 

722
00:36:54,400 --> 00:36:55,800
we're all excited about the same
things. 

723
00:36:55,800 --> 00:36:58,600
We we all, if not exactly the 
same things. 

724
00:36:58,800 --> 00:37:01,320
We're all like in the same aisle
in the grocery store kind of 

725
00:37:01,320 --> 00:37:02,040
thing. 
Yeah. 

726
00:37:02,200 --> 00:37:05,040
Yeah, that that's been. 
That's been really, that's 

727
00:37:05,040 --> 00:37:07,320
really fun. 
Because, you know, like we've 

728
00:37:07,320 --> 00:37:09,840
got guys in our community who 
play a lot of historical gaming.

729
00:37:09,920 --> 00:37:13,160
We've got guys who play, you 
know, really obscure games we've

730
00:37:13,160 --> 00:37:15,400
never heard of. 
And you know, at the end of the 

731
00:37:15,400 --> 00:37:17,000
day, like, you know, I know 
we're going to talk about the 

732
00:37:17,000 --> 00:37:18,880
old world. 
When I was on there and I said 

733
00:37:18,880 --> 00:37:21,760
to Dave, look, mate, I haven't 
read the books. 

734
00:37:21,760 --> 00:37:23,520
I don't know much about it. 
I don't think I'm the best 

735
00:37:23,520 --> 00:37:26,400
person to talk about it really 
with you guys to give my 

736
00:37:26,440 --> 00:37:30,160
analytical sort of, you know, 
deep dive into the rules and 

737
00:37:30,160 --> 00:37:32,760
that kind of thing you probably 
get, you probably find someone 

738
00:37:33,000 --> 00:37:35,640
better to talk about that with 
in your community. 

739
00:37:36,360 --> 00:37:41,360
But even though the new old 
world is not really my, you 

740
00:37:41,360 --> 00:37:44,320
know, slice of the the kind. 
Of thing I like that. 

741
00:37:44,640 --> 00:37:47,480
The new, old world. 
But you know, I'm really, I'm at

742
00:37:47,480 --> 00:37:51,000
the same time, I'm genuinely, 
genuinely excited that other 

743
00:37:51,000 --> 00:37:54,200
people are like, yeah, this is 
great, now we're going to start 

744
00:37:54,200 --> 00:37:55,680
playing Warhammer again and that
kind of thing. 

745
00:37:55,680 --> 00:37:57,760
Even though they could have 
played Warhammer at any time, 

746
00:37:57,760 --> 00:38:00,360
they could just pick up their 
old additions off the shelf and 

747
00:38:01,200 --> 00:38:02,680
gave them a go. 
Or there's some, you know, 

748
00:38:02,680 --> 00:38:06,320
there's some fan based stuff out
there as well that's free to 

749
00:38:06,320 --> 00:38:09,680
download and you can go go, you 
know Hammer and Toms with that. 

750
00:38:09,680 --> 00:38:12,640
But it's great to see that this 
has brought up a new revival of 

751
00:38:12,640 --> 00:38:14,920
people. 
And hopefully, and this is the 

752
00:38:14,920 --> 00:38:18,920
main thing, we hopefully get new
people in, younger people, 

753
00:38:19,560 --> 00:38:22,720
right, who want to experience 
something new that's not a 

754
00:38:22,720 --> 00:38:25,320
computer game, it's not 
something digitally downloaded. 

755
00:38:25,320 --> 00:38:30,640
It's something that's 
intrinsically a hobby that is 

756
00:38:31,360 --> 00:38:35,760
community based. 
It's getting the table, having 

757
00:38:35,760 --> 00:38:38,440
some snacks, you know, rolling 
some dice, having a laugh, 

758
00:38:38,440 --> 00:38:43,160
having a fun. 
It's a very sociable thing, you 

759
00:38:43,160 --> 00:38:45,320
know, whether it be a board 
game, you know, tabletop, war 

760
00:38:45,320 --> 00:38:49,800
game, just, you know, painting, 
miniatures, anything like that. 

761
00:38:49,800 --> 00:38:52,480
Whether it's new, old, doesn't 
matter, you know, we're all 

762
00:38:52,480 --> 00:38:56,680
trying to build a, you know, for
my son and for, you know, Dave's

763
00:38:56,680 --> 00:38:58,720
kids or your kids, Jake or 
whatever, all the kids that 

764
00:38:58,720 --> 00:39:00,960
enter your store. 
We want to make sure the 

765
00:39:00,960 --> 00:39:04,120
foundation's there to say, hey, 
you know, this is a great hobby.

766
00:39:04,120 --> 00:39:05,640
You should, you know, just give 
it a try. 

767
00:39:05,640 --> 00:39:08,080
I'm going to try a demo. 
You know what I mean? 

768
00:39:08,840 --> 00:39:10,600
Maybe you're just interested in 
painting the miniatures. 

769
00:39:10,600 --> 00:39:12,120
Maybe you're just a talented 
person. 

770
00:39:12,120 --> 00:39:15,640
Maybe you're an artist and you, 
you want to make terrain or, you

771
00:39:15,640 --> 00:39:16,840
know, get into that side of the 
hobby. 

772
00:39:16,960 --> 00:39:19,120
Maybe you're an artist. 
You want to draw and and 

773
00:39:19,120 --> 00:39:22,720
replicate the images you see in 
the books and and illustrate 

774
00:39:22,720 --> 00:39:25,560
those, you know, as a hobby. 
So we're all coming from 

775
00:39:25,560 --> 00:39:28,520
different angles. 
And yeah, I I just want to see 

776
00:39:28,520 --> 00:39:31,120
the hobby continue, you know, 
keep it, keep it going, 

777
00:39:32,720 --> 00:39:35,320
whatever, whatever shape or form
it turns into be, you know what 

778
00:39:35,320 --> 00:39:38,240
I mean? 
So and that's about, you know, 

779
00:39:38,480 --> 00:39:40,960
being positive, doing things 
like your gut, you know, your 

780
00:39:40,960 --> 00:39:43,360
initiative doing that, you know,
doing a live stream about it, 

781
00:39:44,400 --> 00:39:47,400
you know, opening up a store and
those those kind of things where

782
00:39:47,400 --> 00:39:51,360
it's like a a shop front where 
people can look in and say, wow,

783
00:39:51,360 --> 00:39:53,280
what's all this stuff? 
Because you know, the exposure, 

784
00:39:53,280 --> 00:39:55,360
that's the the other thing that 
people don't get. 

785
00:39:55,840 --> 00:39:59,280
There's just not enough places 
where people can see this stuff,

786
00:39:59,520 --> 00:40:00,800
you know? 
I agree. 

787
00:40:00,800 --> 00:40:02,040
I think it's. 
I think it's a it's. 

788
00:40:02,040 --> 00:40:03,440
I don't want to say it's a it's 
not. 

789
00:40:03,440 --> 00:40:06,280
It's definitely not a dying or 
shrinking hobby because it's 

790
00:40:06,280 --> 00:40:12,320
bigger now than it's ever been. 
But I think the, I think one of 

791
00:40:12,320 --> 00:40:14,280
the the craziest things to me is
like all the people that are 

792
00:40:14,280 --> 00:40:17,520
wandering in my store and you 
know like like we talked about 

793
00:40:17,520 --> 00:40:19,960
last time on when you got one on
our show, we're all around the 

794
00:40:19,960 --> 00:40:21,880
same age, right? 
Like I'm in my late 40s. 

795
00:40:21,880 --> 00:40:23,720
You guys are you guys around the
same? 

796
00:40:23,720 --> 00:40:25,200
You're within a. 
Couple years ago, much younger 

797
00:40:25,200 --> 00:40:26,840
Jake, not younger, but. 
Yeah, you're like 20. 

798
00:40:26,840 --> 00:40:31,400
Seven at least, but like. 
But the but the rest of us, but,

799
00:40:31,400 --> 00:40:34,560
but like some, some guy wandered
in my store and we're chatting 

800
00:40:34,560 --> 00:40:37,600
for a few minutes and I said to 
him, I was like, he's like, 

801
00:40:37,600 --> 00:40:39,040
well, you know, I'm too old to 
play all this stuff. 

802
00:40:39,040 --> 00:40:41,520
And I looked at him and I went, 
I bet I'm older than you. 

803
00:40:41,760 --> 00:40:44,080
And he was like, well, I just 
turned 47. 

804
00:40:44,120 --> 00:40:47,440
And I was like, I turned 48. 
I turned 49 this summer. 

805
00:40:47,720 --> 00:40:51,080
And he was like, he was like, 
oh, whoa, whoa, I mean, whoa. 

806
00:40:51,240 --> 00:40:52,440
I was just never exposed to 
this. 

807
00:40:52,440 --> 00:40:54,560
And he's like, you must have had
an older brother that was in it.

808
00:40:54,560 --> 00:40:55,840
I was like, Nope. 
I was like, I'm the oldest 

809
00:40:55,840 --> 00:40:58,120
brother. 
And he was like, oh, like it's 

810
00:40:58,200 --> 00:41:00,760
it's just so many people. 
Like, Like you said, so many 

811
00:41:00,760 --> 00:41:02,720
people just never had the 
opportunity. 

812
00:41:03,080 --> 00:41:06,080
And it's it's kind of a shame, 
right, 'cause it's like why I 

813
00:41:06,080 --> 00:41:08,720
didn't get exposed to this. 
So I said to the guy, the best 

814
00:41:08,720 --> 00:41:11,400
thing you can say to anybody. 
You can always get into it now 

815
00:41:11,920 --> 00:41:14,040
like it. 
It's not like you miss the ride.

816
00:41:14,040 --> 00:41:15,920
Like the bus is still here. 
Just get on the bus. 

817
00:41:15,920 --> 00:41:18,280
Like you don't need to. 
You don't need to worry about 

818
00:41:18,280 --> 00:41:19,440
it. 
Like just do you think this is 

819
00:41:19,440 --> 00:41:20,880
cool? 
Then you should get into it. 

820
00:41:21,040 --> 00:41:22,400
And we've been lucky. 
We've got a lot of people that 

821
00:41:22,400 --> 00:41:25,560
do that. 
One of one of our newest members

822
00:41:25,560 --> 00:41:28,240
on on our stream, the guy who 
was painting the Gundams Dave, 

823
00:41:28,240 --> 00:41:31,680
he he popped into my store today
and he's never painted a space 

824
00:41:31,680 --> 00:41:35,200
marine. 
So today he was like, hey, can I

825
00:41:35,200 --> 00:41:38,640
just buy a space marine? 
And I was like, there's no way 

826
00:41:38,640 --> 00:41:40,200
to. 
And I was like, oh, wait, I have

827
00:41:40,200 --> 00:41:43,880
the the start, you know, getting
started with warmer 40,000, the 

828
00:41:43,880 --> 00:41:46,960
little magazine booklet that 
comes with a Necron and a Space 

829
00:41:46,960 --> 00:41:49,560
Marine. 
And I was like, here and he was 

830
00:41:49,560 --> 00:41:51,000
like, oh, this is so cool, I can
made a space Marine. 

831
00:41:51,000 --> 00:41:54,360
My son's gonna be super excited.
I was like awesome like that. 

832
00:41:54,360 --> 00:41:57,920
That's what you want, right? 
Yeah, yeah, for sure. 

833
00:41:59,720 --> 00:42:01,720
That's definitely cool. 
Yeah, that's really good. 

834
00:42:02,400 --> 00:42:06,080
So, and I think nowadays, you 
know, just aside from Games 

835
00:42:06,080 --> 00:42:09,600
Workshop, of course, they've got
a very strong IP with Lord of 

836
00:42:09,600 --> 00:42:11,240
the Rings and The Hobbit and 
that kind of thing. 

837
00:42:11,760 --> 00:42:14,200
But I want to talk to you guys 
about that too. 

838
00:42:14,200 --> 00:42:18,560
I think the, the trends now 
within the war gaming industry 

839
00:42:18,560 --> 00:42:24,320
is that they try to acquire some
kind of big IP like Marvel or 

840
00:42:24,320 --> 00:42:31,360
Star Wars or The Song of Ice and
Fire, George R Martin's book 

841
00:42:31,360 --> 00:42:33,960
series Star Trek. 
You know you can. 

842
00:42:33,960 --> 00:42:37,760
You could rattle off a whole 
heap of Batman, Harry Potter 

843
00:42:38,680 --> 00:42:41,480
from night models. 
You can rattle off a whole heap 

844
00:42:41,480 --> 00:42:46,160
of different IPS where they're 
now trying to find obviously 

845
00:42:46,160 --> 00:42:48,440
younger people or you know, 
middle-aged people, whatever, 

846
00:42:48,880 --> 00:42:51,600
trying to lure them in that way.
Do you think you're seeing that 

847
00:42:51,600 --> 00:42:53,920
trend as well, Jake, with the, 
with the product on your 

848
00:42:53,920 --> 00:42:58,880
shelves, man? 
That's it. 

849
00:42:58,880 --> 00:43:03,520
That is a good question. 
So I would say, I would say that

850
00:43:03,960 --> 00:43:08,120
GW by far has the biggest like 
they're they're the £400 

851
00:43:08,120 --> 00:43:11,100
gorilla, right, Like they have 
they, they are the Dunkin' 

852
00:43:11,100 --> 00:43:15,080
Donuts or the Coca-Cola of of 
the brand. 

853
00:43:15,280 --> 00:43:19,320
So everybody knows what that is.
Everybody knows is familiar with

854
00:43:19,320 --> 00:43:22,880
it. 
If you are even remotely 

855
00:43:22,880 --> 00:43:26,040
interested in mini war gaming, 
you know what Games Workshop is 

856
00:43:26,120 --> 00:43:27,480
like, no one's confused about 
that. 

857
00:43:29,560 --> 00:43:33,480
But in terms of the licenses I 
think that I think that part of 

858
00:43:33,480 --> 00:43:35,920
the reason that some sometimes 
they do really well and 

859
00:43:35,920 --> 00:43:40,040
sometimes they don't and I think
part of it depends on not even 

860
00:43:40,040 --> 00:43:44,640
the not even the the the IP or 
the OR even the company it's how

861
00:43:44,640 --> 00:43:48,240
their deal was structured and 
and and this is more like I 

862
00:43:48,280 --> 00:43:50,800
don't know how businessy you 
want me to get but on the the 

863
00:43:50,800 --> 00:43:53,760
business side like on the on the
behind the scenes like we're 

864
00:43:53,760 --> 00:43:57,560
gonna make this thing. 
One of my favorites is Halo so 

865
00:43:58,520 --> 00:44:03,080
the guys who used to make drop 
drop Fleet commander or sorry 

866
00:44:03,080 --> 00:44:06,040
not not them it was it was the 
the Firestorm Ramada it was the 

867
00:44:06,040 --> 00:44:10,200
guys who made Firestorm Ramada. 
So Firestorm Armada was 

868
00:44:10,200 --> 00:44:12,720
basically a battle fleet, gothic
sort of surrogate, and it's 

869
00:44:12,720 --> 00:44:14,240
really fun. 
The rules are great, it runs on 

870
00:44:14,240 --> 00:44:15,840
the Armada system, so it's very 
similar. 

871
00:44:16,720 --> 00:44:17,880
And they made a couple of other 
games. 

872
00:44:17,880 --> 00:44:20,520
They make like a they make like 
a Wild West game. 

873
00:44:20,720 --> 00:44:24,080
Spartan Games Is it? 
Is it Spartan Games? 

874
00:44:24,080 --> 00:44:27,960
Is it Spartan? 
OK so so yeah, so Spartan 

875
00:44:28,240 --> 00:44:31,640
basically also made like a a 
wheeled a weird Wild West game 

876
00:44:32,000 --> 00:44:35,720
called Wild West Exodus and they
make Dystopian wars and 

877
00:44:35,720 --> 00:44:42,080
Dystopian Rising and they signed
a deal to get the Halo license. 

878
00:44:42,200 --> 00:44:45,600
And I I remember I was psyched. 
I was like oh that'll be really 

879
00:44:45,600 --> 00:44:48,360
cool, like Pillar of Autumn and 
all like the Halo ships, like 

880
00:44:48,360 --> 00:44:49,600
that'll be neat. 
And it was going to be a 

881
00:44:49,600 --> 00:44:53,480
Starfleet like combat game. 
The idea was that they were 

882
00:44:53,480 --> 00:44:56,440
going to expand and then make a 
miniature's combat game with 

883
00:44:56,440 --> 00:44:59,720
like, you know, Master Chief and
Spartans and Warthogs and like 

884
00:44:59,720 --> 00:45:01,640
all the, you know, the alien 
races and stuff. 

885
00:45:02,280 --> 00:45:09,400
And it's a huge license, but the
deal that they signed was Super 

886
00:45:09,400 --> 00:45:13,360
IP restrictive. 
And then on top of that, the 

887
00:45:13,360 --> 00:45:18,040
amount of money they had to pay 
just to get access to the IP, it

888
00:45:18,040 --> 00:45:19,920
drowned them like it literally 
pulled them under. 

889
00:45:20,160 --> 00:45:23,480
And you know the the starter set
for Halo War or Halo Starfleet 

890
00:45:23,480 --> 00:45:26,560
battles was like $300.00. 
There's 29999. 

891
00:45:27,240 --> 00:45:29,560
And again, for those of you who 
are familiar with Battle Fleet 

892
00:45:29,560 --> 00:45:33,120
Gothic or like Man of War, any 
of the naval games, it's the 

893
00:45:33,120 --> 00:45:36,080
same kind of thing. 
So it was 299. 

894
00:45:36,840 --> 00:45:39,440
It came with a rule book, you 
know, some Covenant ships, some,

895
00:45:39,440 --> 00:45:43,480
you know, United States or UNSC 
ships. 

896
00:45:45,560 --> 00:45:49,160
But they were only making 
something insane like they were 

897
00:45:49,160 --> 00:45:50,960
making like 30 bucks profit on 
the game. 

898
00:45:50,960 --> 00:45:52,720
And I was like how did that 
happen? 

899
00:45:52,720 --> 00:45:56,280
And it was like, well, it was a 
small print run and we did a ton

900
00:45:56,280 --> 00:45:59,520
of front loading to make all the
ships and make all all the 

901
00:45:59,520 --> 00:46:01,720
machinery up front. 
And we front loaded that. 

902
00:46:01,720 --> 00:46:06,880
And then the deal was anytime we
sell one, the company gets like 

903
00:46:06,960 --> 00:46:09,240
they get like it was like 50 or 
60 bucks. 

904
00:46:09,440 --> 00:46:12,160
That's just what you write a 
check to them for every time you

905
00:46:12,160 --> 00:46:15,880
sell one. 
So it it it just now I'm sure 

906
00:46:15,880 --> 00:46:17,960
there were other problems too, 
but like that was one of the big

907
00:46:17,960 --> 00:46:19,840
ones that I heard that that kind
of pulled them under. 

908
00:46:21,040 --> 00:46:25,320
So it wasn't that the license 
wasn't popular, it's the fact 

909
00:46:25,320 --> 00:46:29,000
that I don't think that enough 
people A knew about it and B, 

910
00:46:29,200 --> 00:46:31,360
they didn't have the money 
leftover to do marketing because

911
00:46:31,360 --> 00:46:33,440
of the way their their 
settlement was was structured. 

912
00:46:33,680 --> 00:46:35,760
And then they weren't making 
enough money on it. 

913
00:46:35,760 --> 00:46:38,960
So they were like front loading 
all of this work and then it 

914
00:46:38,960 --> 00:46:42,880
just it just drowned them and a 
bunch of their stuff still 

915
00:46:42,880 --> 00:46:44,760
exists. 
They got bought by some other 

916
00:46:44,760 --> 00:46:46,960
companies like I know I think 
the guys at War Cradle or 

917
00:46:47,320 --> 00:46:50,240
Warsenal one of those War 
Cradle. 

918
00:46:51,000 --> 00:46:51,960
So like they. 
Yeah. 

919
00:46:51,960 --> 00:46:54,680
So they bought like Wild West 
Exodus and Dystopian Wars and 

920
00:46:54,680 --> 00:46:57,960
all that stuff and Firestorm 
Ahmad I think was the old one 

921
00:46:57,960 --> 00:47:00,560
and and they were they're like 
they were great games but it 

922
00:47:00,560 --> 00:47:02,960
just it just pulled that company
under. 

923
00:47:03,840 --> 00:47:05,640
I think that other companies 
have been really smart like 

924
00:47:05,640 --> 00:47:07,960
Seamon you were talking about 
the song of it's a fire game. 

925
00:47:09,200 --> 00:47:11,960
So our buddy Brian Steele like 
worked on that a little bit with

926
00:47:11,960 --> 00:47:14,880
some of their testing and Mike 
Chanel like I I've met Mike a 

927
00:47:14,880 --> 00:47:19,800
handful of times, you know good 
solid designer and when they put

928
00:47:19,800 --> 00:47:21,360
out. 
Let's say that Jake, when you 

929
00:47:21,360 --> 00:47:23,520
next time you speak with him, 
don't call him Mike. 

930
00:47:23,840 --> 00:47:25,240
Make sure it's Michael. 
Yes. 

931
00:47:25,240 --> 00:47:26,720
Sorry. 
He he he likes Michael. 

932
00:47:28,480 --> 00:47:31,000
I I shorten everybody's names I 
just it's just a habit. 

933
00:47:31,640 --> 00:47:35,800
But so anyway so when when they 
got that license they didn't go 

934
00:47:35,800 --> 00:47:38,440
to George R Martin and get that 
license because at that point he

935
00:47:38,440 --> 00:47:40,440
was working with HBO and it 
would have cost them. 

936
00:47:40,960 --> 00:47:43,240
I don't even want to think about
what it would have cost them. 

937
00:47:43,760 --> 00:47:47,960
Dark Sword miniatures had to 
deal with George from way before

938
00:47:47,960 --> 00:47:50,320
that when he was still doing 
like he was writing like book 

939
00:47:50,320 --> 00:47:53,600
three or something and they were
putting out miniatures like you 

940
00:47:53,600 --> 00:47:57,120
can get like single guys and and
different characters. 

941
00:47:57,520 --> 00:47:59,920
It's like, oh, you can get the 
hound in metal like oh cool, 

942
00:47:59,920 --> 00:48:02,680
what metal? 
So they went through them and 

943
00:48:02,680 --> 00:48:04,000
they worked out idea with dark 
swords. 

944
00:48:04,000 --> 00:48:06,400
So like when you buy the song 
about some fire stuff on the 

945
00:48:06,400 --> 00:48:10,000
back of the box it says Seamon 
miniatures and then it says 

946
00:48:10,000 --> 00:48:12,480
George R Martin and then it says
dark Sword miniatures. 

947
00:48:12,760 --> 00:48:16,640
Yeah Dark Sword didn't do 
anything other than let them use

948
00:48:16,640 --> 00:48:19,880
the license that they had like 
and and again I I don't know 

949
00:48:19,880 --> 00:48:21,960
what the agreement was but that 
was how they did it. 

950
00:48:21,960 --> 00:48:24,240
So it was really smart they were
able to do it and have access to

951
00:48:24,240 --> 00:48:27,840
it and despite all the work that
that Michael did and and 

952
00:48:27,840 --> 00:48:30,680
everybody else building it if if
they hadn't gotten a good deal 

953
00:48:30,680 --> 00:48:33,400
on the licensing rights they 
would have killed them they they

954
00:48:33,440 --> 00:48:37,840
wouldn't have been able to make 
the game and and it and it's 

955
00:48:38,000 --> 00:48:40,320
obviously it depends on the size
of the company and like what you

956
00:48:40,320 --> 00:48:44,280
want to do and the scope of the 
project and it's like if you and

957
00:48:44,280 --> 00:48:47,320
Dave got access to Mad Max it's 
like OK are we making a Mad Max 

958
00:48:47,320 --> 00:48:48,840
role-playing game like a pen and
paper game. 

959
00:48:48,840 --> 00:48:50,560
Are we making a Mad Max 
miniatures game. 

960
00:48:50,880 --> 00:48:53,320
Are we making a Mad Max tabletop
war game. 

961
00:48:53,320 --> 00:48:54,920
Is it a skirmish game or is it a
war game? 

962
00:48:54,920 --> 00:48:58,080
Like it it all depends on we're 
making Fury Rd. 

963
00:48:59,000 --> 00:48:59,400
That's it. 
Yeah. 

964
00:48:59,400 --> 00:49:00,600
Awesome. 
I'm in. 

965
00:49:01,240 --> 00:49:03,120
And maybe a role-playing game, 
but Fury Rd. 

966
00:49:03,120 --> 00:49:06,720
I'm in I I'm 100% on board like 
where do we you got you guys 

967
00:49:06,720 --> 00:49:09,960
heard it here first on Cronic 
Command Dave Taylor gonna get us

968
00:49:09,960 --> 00:49:13,680
the rights to make I'm pretty 
sure if since he's Australian I 

969
00:49:13,680 --> 00:49:15,200
think we can just make a Mad Max
game. 

970
00:49:15,240 --> 00:49:18,720
I think that's just yeah. 
I I think it's required. 

971
00:49:19,080 --> 00:49:20,760
Yeah, it's. 
It's not even an option. 

972
00:49:20,760 --> 00:49:21,800
We have to make that game. 
It's. 

973
00:49:22,080 --> 00:49:22,400
Called. 
Really. 

974
00:49:22,400 --> 00:49:24,880
It's called Really Required. 
I'm obligated, yeah, for sure. 

975
00:49:26,160 --> 00:49:27,480
If we. 
If we don't, they're just gonna 

976
00:49:27,480 --> 00:49:29,520
mail Dave a creative Huntsman. 
Spiders and then. 

977
00:49:31,960 --> 00:49:32,680
But no. 
Yeah, so. 

978
00:49:32,920 --> 00:49:34,840
OK, they're not venomous. 
Yeah, no, I know. 

979
00:49:34,840 --> 00:49:36,120
They're just giant and scary 
looking. 

980
00:49:37,920 --> 00:49:39,480
But yeah, so it it a lot of it 
depends. 

981
00:49:39,480 --> 00:49:41,920
But but back to your original 
question, I think that some of 

982
00:49:41,920 --> 00:49:45,040
the other IPS are really clever 
that the song game, like I said,

983
00:49:45,040 --> 00:49:48,040
is great and they're putting on 
a new one called Tactics. 

984
00:49:48,040 --> 00:49:49,400
It's song invites of our tactics
I think. 

985
00:49:50,120 --> 00:49:51,920
And that's again going to be a 
skirmish based game. 

986
00:49:51,920 --> 00:49:55,600
It's only going to be a handful 
of models, whereas Song is a 

987
00:49:56,160 --> 00:50:00,520
it's a tabletop rank and flank, 
you know, giant blocks of units 

988
00:50:00,520 --> 00:50:02,840
that have flanks and rears, and 
you got to worry about your 

989
00:50:02,840 --> 00:50:05,920
charging and like what you're 
hitting, and it's a really fun 

990
00:50:05,920 --> 00:50:07,960
game. 
And then you've got companies 

991
00:50:07,960 --> 00:50:11,360
like asmode, who's a giant 
corporate juggernaut, and they 

992
00:50:11,360 --> 00:50:16,400
own like 37 different gaming 
companies. 70 something like 72%

993
00:50:16,600 --> 00:50:19,120
of the board game industry is 
owned by Asmode. 

994
00:50:19,480 --> 00:50:22,920
They own Fantasy Flight Games 
and Z Man Games and Rocket, 

995
00:50:22,960 --> 00:50:27,440
Rocket Dog and Space Cowboy and 
Repo Studios and Libelud. 

996
00:50:27,440 --> 00:50:31,880
Like they own so many of them. 
But Fantasy Flight kind of from 

997
00:50:32,040 --> 00:50:34,960
for a long time, Fantasy 
Flight's had a Star Wars license

998
00:50:36,120 --> 00:50:39,120
'cause they made what like 
Imperial Assault and then like X

999
00:50:39,120 --> 00:50:44,600
Wing and and Armada and all that
stuff and they're they're really

1000
00:50:44,600 --> 00:50:46,640
good. 
But the the Batman game the the 

1001
00:50:46,640 --> 00:50:52,920
night models game, it might as 
well be you know it's it's a 

1002
00:50:52,920 --> 00:50:55,720
it's a random skirmish game that
that lives in obscurity. 

1003
00:50:55,720 --> 00:50:58,680
Like it's it's a fun game and 
the models are the models are 

1004
00:50:58,680 --> 00:51:05,760
great but it it's another sort 
of like, I mean I don't even 

1005
00:51:05,760 --> 00:51:09,960
know how to it's it's like it's 
like being into like more time, 

1006
00:51:11,320 --> 00:51:15,000
right More time is a great game 
but it has a very specific fan 

1007
00:51:15,000 --> 00:51:17,120
set right. 
Like it's not you're not gonna 

1008
00:51:17,120 --> 00:51:19,200
see that everywhere. 
Even GW doesn't promote it 

1009
00:51:19,200 --> 00:51:20,680
anywhere. 
It's a it's a quote UN quote 

1010
00:51:20,680 --> 00:51:23,760
dead game. 
I know more people that play 

1011
00:51:25,400 --> 00:51:28,000
that than play the Batman game. 
Yeah, I know. 

1012
00:51:28,000 --> 00:51:29,160
I've never seen it play it 
either. 

1013
00:51:29,760 --> 00:51:30,840
Yeah. 
It's like a. 

1014
00:51:30,840 --> 00:51:34,000
Lot of. 
Games, you know, Yeah, from 

1015
00:51:34,000 --> 00:51:37,000
those really small companies. 
You just never see them get much

1016
00:51:37,160 --> 00:51:39,440
game time or play time on 
tables. 

1017
00:51:40,920 --> 00:51:43,880
But there's something alluring 
about those smaller games too. 

1018
00:51:43,880 --> 00:51:45,640
I don't know why. 
I've always been, I've always 

1019
00:51:45,640 --> 00:51:49,040
been attracted to the sort of, 
you know, the underground type 

1020
00:51:49,040 --> 00:51:50,400
games. 
I don't know why. 

1021
00:51:51,880 --> 00:51:54,560
Yeah, I love the yeah. 
Yeah, I knew about this before. 

1022
00:51:57,840 --> 00:51:59,800
Like Rackham from France, you 
know, that was like a really 

1023
00:51:59,800 --> 00:52:02,000
underground game. 
Infinity from Corvus Belly, when

1024
00:52:02,000 --> 00:52:03,320
that was like a really 
underground game. 

1025
00:52:03,320 --> 00:52:05,440
No, no one knew about it. 
I was really attracted to that 

1026
00:52:05,440 --> 00:52:09,240
kind of stuff as well. 
I think there's AI think there's

1027
00:52:09,240 --> 00:52:11,520
a there's a pretty big thing 
there though, that you're the 

1028
00:52:11,520 --> 00:52:14,320
two games you just brought up. 
Yeah, the What's the biggest 

1029
00:52:14,320 --> 00:52:17,160
thing about those games? 
The models are gorgeous. 

1030
00:52:17,360 --> 00:52:19,680
Yeah, exactly. 
Yeah, the Minis are amazing 

1031
00:52:19,680 --> 00:52:21,480
looking. 
Yeah, the artwork, the images. 

1032
00:52:21,800 --> 00:52:23,440
Yeah, And and that goes a long 
way. 

1033
00:52:23,440 --> 00:52:26,680
I I think that if you have like 
breathtaking looking miniatures,

1034
00:52:26,960 --> 00:52:28,040
I think that they're gonna sell 
them. 

1035
00:52:28,040 --> 00:52:29,720
It doesn't matter what the IP is
like, that's what. 

1036
00:52:30,360 --> 00:52:31,520
Yeah, we can make something up 
right now. 

1037
00:52:31,520 --> 00:52:33,560
As long as the minis are 
gorgeous, it's gonna sell. 

1038
00:52:33,920 --> 00:52:38,280
Yeah, I think that the, I would 
say the the biggest sort of 

1039
00:52:38,280 --> 00:52:40,880
pushback I would say on a lot of
the smaller scale games that 

1040
00:52:40,880 --> 00:52:44,920
you're talking about is I know 
that if I take my Warhammer, my 

1041
00:52:44,920 --> 00:52:49,000
if I take my Space Marine Army 
and I'm going out to like like 

1042
00:52:49,000 --> 00:52:51,400
in the summer, Dave and I are 
going to to San Diego Comic Con 

1043
00:52:51,400 --> 00:52:53,800
to paint paint lessons. 
We're gonna teach paint lessons,

1044
00:52:53,800 --> 00:52:54,680
We'll be there for like the 
week. 

1045
00:52:55,080 --> 00:52:58,600
But I know if I bring my Space 
Marine army I can get a game in.

1046
00:52:59,000 --> 00:53:02,880
I know I'll be able to get a 
game if if I show up with my 

1047
00:53:02,920 --> 00:53:07,080
Batman war band. 
I don't know like maybe. 

1048
00:53:07,680 --> 00:53:10,240
So with those smaller games. 
Part of the reason I think 

1049
00:53:10,240 --> 00:53:13,520
people get attracted to these 
games is if if I if I come to 

1050
00:53:13,520 --> 00:53:17,560
you and we're all hanging out 
regularly and I'm like, Dave, I 

1051
00:53:17,560 --> 00:53:19,600
painted up some space wings, 
this Warhammer game looks pretty

1052
00:53:19,600 --> 00:53:22,560
cool And Dave goes, those 
miniatures are pretty cool. 

1053
00:53:22,560 --> 00:53:23,720
You know what? 
I'm gonna paint up some of those

1054
00:53:23,720 --> 00:53:26,000
guys and then we talk to you and
we're like, hey, Dave and I 

1055
00:53:26,000 --> 00:53:28,000
painted armies from Warhammer 
40K. 

1056
00:53:28,000 --> 00:53:29,600
Like we're gonna try to play it 
this weekend. 

1057
00:53:29,600 --> 00:53:31,280
Do you want to play? 
It's like, Oh well my friends 

1058
00:53:31,280 --> 00:53:32,440
are into this. 
I'm gonna play it. 

1059
00:53:33,320 --> 00:53:35,960
Whereas if if you come to us and
you're like, hey I found this 

1060
00:53:35,960 --> 00:53:38,640
obscure game do you guys want to
have you guys ever heard of this

1061
00:53:38,640 --> 00:53:41,360
and Dave and I are like I don't 
like I don't know that game and 

1062
00:53:41,360 --> 00:53:42,560
it's like oh do you want to play
it. 

1063
00:53:42,560 --> 00:53:44,200
And it's like I don't even know 
any stores around here that 

1064
00:53:44,200 --> 00:53:46,800
carry that stuff. 
It's just I think it's just it's

1065
00:53:46,800 --> 00:53:51,520
more barriers to entry into what
is already a like a serious like

1066
00:53:51,520 --> 00:53:53,960
serious is the wrong word but 
like what is already like a a a 

1067
00:53:53,960 --> 00:53:57,120
pretty involved hobby. 
So I I whenever you add more 

1068
00:53:57,120 --> 00:54:00,680
layers of obstacles I just don't
think it's necessarily the best 

1069
00:54:00,680 --> 00:54:02,240
idea. 
Yeah, that's true. 

1070
00:54:02,920 --> 00:54:06,400
And I I think that's the key 
point there. 

1071
00:54:06,400 --> 00:54:10,240
It's one of the one of the 
barriers that is removed by 

1072
00:54:10,240 --> 00:54:14,480
using a well known IP like 
somebody's picking up those or 

1073
00:54:14,480 --> 00:54:20,160
deciding rather than creating 
our own miniatures game with our

1074
00:54:20,160 --> 00:54:24,720
own law and our own story and 
reasons for these miniatures to 

1075
00:54:24,720 --> 00:54:29,160
exist. 
If you go with Star Wars, you go

1076
00:54:29,160 --> 00:54:37,120
with Marvel, you go with DC and 
go with Horizon 0 Dawn, that 

1077
00:54:37,120 --> 00:54:41,800
kind of thing. 
There's a a large larger amount 

1078
00:54:41,800 --> 00:54:45,600
of the population who understand
what that is, kind of inherently

1079
00:54:45,600 --> 00:54:48,640
so, you know, then it just 
becomes OK. 

1080
00:54:48,680 --> 00:54:55,960
So I get the this representation
of General Kenobi and Grievous. 

1081
00:54:55,960 --> 00:54:57,520
Whatever is is it he also 
General? 

1082
00:54:57,880 --> 00:55:03,920
Yeah, Grievous General Kenobi. 
Yeah. 

1083
00:55:04,200 --> 00:55:08,160
So it's a they know who those 
things are and they wrap the 

1084
00:55:08,360 --> 00:55:11,560
concept much more easily that 
this is a piece representing, 

1085
00:55:11,840 --> 00:55:13,680
you know, I mean, this is a 
piece representing Grievous. 

1086
00:55:13,920 --> 00:55:15,400
And then I can smash them 
together. 

1087
00:55:17,960 --> 00:55:19,240
Sure. 
There are some rules that tell 

1088
00:55:19,240 --> 00:55:24,040
me how to smash them together 
rather than going what's what's 

1089
00:55:24,200 --> 00:55:25,800
this guy riding this lizard? 
I don't. 

1090
00:55:26,600 --> 00:55:31,640
I don't get it. 
Yeah, it's so it strips away 

1091
00:55:31,640 --> 00:55:34,480
that sort of thing which is why 
I think that yeah we we are 

1092
00:55:34,480 --> 00:55:40,440
seeing more IPS being mined for 
that kind of thing because it's 

1093
00:55:40,560 --> 00:55:43,680
it reduces that removes that 
particular barrier. 

1094
00:55:45,200 --> 00:55:49,080
The companies that are that are 
making their own stuff are doing

1095
00:55:49,080 --> 00:55:55,680
so at a much slower pace. 
It's a much more organic kind of

1096
00:55:55,680 --> 00:56:03,280
build for it. 
So or they're copying they're 

1097
00:56:03,280 --> 00:56:06,960
they're creating proxies for 
other sort of systems. 

1098
00:56:07,640 --> 00:56:14,720
So there's that that thing where
is it good? 

1099
00:56:14,720 --> 00:56:18,160
I think it's getting more people
playing is it unique and 

1100
00:56:19,880 --> 00:56:24,120
innovative Not so much. 
So it's there's that balance 

1101
00:56:24,120 --> 00:56:25,280
there. 
Yeah. 

1102
00:56:26,960 --> 00:56:30,840
Maybe also it sort of it, it 
spans across from, you know, 

1103
00:56:30,840 --> 00:56:36,000
movies, comic books, 
role-playing games, board games,

1104
00:56:36,120 --> 00:56:38,080
miniature games. 
So you you've got that sort of 

1105
00:56:38,080 --> 00:56:40,920
interrelationship between all of
those things where they're going

1106
00:56:40,920 --> 00:56:44,160
to catch you at some point. 
Somewhere along that line you're

1107
00:56:44,160 --> 00:56:46,480
going to see the movie. 
Oh, there's a there's a board 

1108
00:56:46,480 --> 00:56:49,720
game, there's Monopoly. 
Who's brought out ADC comics, 

1109
00:56:50,520 --> 00:56:53,720
you know, Avengers style, you 
know, Monopoly set. 

1110
00:56:53,720 --> 00:56:57,480
And then, you know, then you 
stumble across something else in

1111
00:56:57,480 --> 00:57:00,480
the store that has, oh, there's 
Games Workshop, they've got 

1112
00:57:00,480 --> 00:57:03,280
their own little thing or some 
other company of selling their 

1113
00:57:03,280 --> 00:57:06,400
miniatures or board game that 
have the same kind of IP 

1114
00:57:06,760 --> 00:57:10,680
relationship to that. 
So we're somehow getting, you 

1115
00:57:10,680 --> 00:57:12,000
know, because the Song of Ice 
and Fire. 

1116
00:57:12,000 --> 00:57:16,360
I got into that because I knew 
that I was really enjoying the 

1117
00:57:16,680 --> 00:57:20,800
HBOTV series. 
I knew about the characters, I 

1118
00:57:20,800 --> 00:57:23,920
knew about the houses and I 
thought I like rank and flank 

1119
00:57:23,920 --> 00:57:25,720
games. 
You know, I looked at the 

1120
00:57:25,720 --> 00:57:29,200
ministers, I thought, OK, I know
the PVC, but you know, I'll, 

1121
00:57:29,200 --> 00:57:31,880
I'll, you know, I like metal 
models, but I'll, I'll give it a

1122
00:57:31,880 --> 00:57:34,840
pass and I'll give it a go. 
It's actually a really good game

1123
00:57:34,920 --> 00:57:38,040
and if I was going to introduce 
anybody to like a mass table top

1124
00:57:38,040 --> 00:57:40,840
game game, I think some wise 
Fire does that beautifully. 

1125
00:57:40,840 --> 00:57:42,880
It's just got really great 
rules. 

1126
00:57:42,880 --> 00:57:45,480
It's a living rule book. 
You've got everything on an app,

1127
00:57:46,360 --> 00:57:48,280
you can download it for free, 
you've got everything at your 

1128
00:57:48,280 --> 00:57:50,960
fingertips, and I think it's 
just a really, you know, 

1129
00:57:50,960 --> 00:57:54,600
intuitively done game. 
It also has a couple of really 

1130
00:57:54,600 --> 00:57:56,840
nice things going for it. 
Like the the miniatures are, 

1131
00:57:57,160 --> 00:57:59,440
they're really nice. 
Like the sculpts are gorgeous. 

1132
00:58:00,480 --> 00:58:02,240
They're they're first wave 
stuff. 

1133
00:58:02,920 --> 00:58:05,200
Even like if you look back at it
now compared to like the new 

1134
00:58:05,200 --> 00:58:07,680
models that have come out, 
you're like it's not quite as 

1135
00:58:07,680 --> 00:58:09,160
good. 
They're still great. 

1136
00:58:09,160 --> 00:58:10,880
Like the new models are just 
better. 

1137
00:58:10,880 --> 00:58:12,640
Like they, they've just gotten 
better at it. 

1138
00:58:13,320 --> 00:58:15,480
But the sculpts are Dave. 
It's all big child creative, 

1139
00:58:15,480 --> 00:58:16,840
right? 
I think all the big child. 

1140
00:58:17,400 --> 00:58:19,000
'S doing all of the sculpting 
code. 

1141
00:58:19,200 --> 00:58:21,800
One, so the the the, the sculpt,
the sculpts are amazing. 

1142
00:58:21,800 --> 00:58:23,360
The character, the characters 
are phenomenal. 

1143
00:58:23,800 --> 00:58:25,120
They make some of my favorite 
units. 

1144
00:58:25,120 --> 00:58:28,120
Like I think the I think the She
Bears is like one of my 

1145
00:58:28,120 --> 00:58:29,840
favorite. 
Yeah. 

1146
00:58:29,840 --> 00:58:32,400
The Mormont She Bears are like 
one of my favorite models and 

1147
00:58:32,400 --> 00:58:34,600
like ever like they're just 
gorgeous sculpts. 

1148
00:58:36,120 --> 00:58:38,720
But you're right it's it's a 
it's also a solid gameplay. 

1149
00:58:38,720 --> 00:58:40,840
Again you know tip of the cap to
to Michael Chennell. 

1150
00:58:40,840 --> 00:58:44,360
He's done a phenomenal job with 
that game and and he's he's put 

1151
00:58:44,360 --> 00:58:47,960
a lot of time and energy into 
making sure that that game plays

1152
00:58:47,960 --> 00:58:50,120
the right way. 
And it it you know it it handles

1153
00:58:50,120 --> 00:58:52,400
the way that it handles and that
like you said the fact that it 

1154
00:58:52,400 --> 00:58:55,320
can like update in real time. 
There's no like Oh my army 

1155
00:58:55,320 --> 00:58:57,280
stinks. 
It's like it's cool like they 

1156
00:58:57,400 --> 00:58:59,920
they just updated like they 
fixed that thing or they fixed 

1157
00:58:59,920 --> 00:59:04,640
whatever. 
It's also as a consumer it's got

1158
00:59:04,640 --> 00:59:08,320
a great price point like you're 
you're talking $35 for a unit 

1159
00:59:08,920 --> 00:59:10,080
and again I'm you're you're in 
Australia. 

1160
00:59:10,080 --> 00:59:14,080
So all your prices are like 
double or whatever but it's it's

1161
00:59:14,080 --> 00:59:18,440
it's still, it's still very 
reasonable for for a price point

1162
00:59:18,440 --> 00:59:21,440
and they're the big starter 
boxes, the one player starter 

1163
00:59:21,440 --> 00:59:23,600
sets and there's like I think 
there's eight of them now 

1164
00:59:24,600 --> 00:59:27,280
they're they're great and every 
army plays different. 

1165
00:59:27,280 --> 00:59:30,040
They're not the same. 
Yeah, like if you just want to 

1166
00:59:30,040 --> 00:59:31,960
smash someone's face in and you 
don't want to have to worry 

1167
00:59:31,960 --> 00:59:34,080
about like, oh, I got to be 
cunning and I have to do this 

1168
00:59:34,080 --> 00:59:35,480
thing. 
And you play the Starks. 

1169
00:59:36,120 --> 00:59:39,840
If if you want to just hit stuff
super hard and be kind of like a

1170
00:59:39,880 --> 00:59:42,960
like a paper tiger, then you 
want to play like, you know the 

1171
00:59:42,960 --> 00:59:44,840
nights watch because you you hit
super hard. 

1172
00:59:44,840 --> 00:59:45,880
But they don't have a ton of 
armor. 

1173
00:59:46,520 --> 00:59:49,320
If you want to, if you want to 
be kind of like Trixie and move 

1174
00:59:49,320 --> 00:59:52,200
stuff around and, you know, take
casualties and then get extra 

1175
00:59:52,200 --> 00:59:55,080
bonuses, you want to play like 
the Greyjoys because they they 

1176
00:59:55,080 --> 00:59:56,920
look like they're big, scary, 
heavy infantry. 

1177
00:59:57,120 --> 00:59:59,000
They are not. 
They are designed to kind of 

1178
00:59:59,000 --> 01:00:01,960
hit. 
Yeah, like they're the first 

1179
01:00:01,960 --> 01:00:03,760
time we played them. 
They look like a bunch of Norse 

1180
01:00:03,880 --> 01:00:07,080
Reavers. 
So my my business partner, Ben. 

1181
01:00:07,440 --> 01:00:10,520
We were at Gamma and he got one 
of those boxes and I bought the 

1182
01:00:10,520 --> 01:00:13,880
Stark box and we were like, oh, 
cool, let's let's have our, you 

1183
01:00:13,880 --> 01:00:17,560
know, different. 
You know, my, my Stark guys with

1184
01:00:17,560 --> 01:00:20,560
Hobberks are gonna fight your 
Viking guys with Hobberks, and 

1185
01:00:20,560 --> 01:00:23,280
this will be fun. 
And after the after the first 

1186
01:00:23,280 --> 01:00:26,440
interaction, Ben was like, oh, 
OK, I see my guys are not meant 

1187
01:00:26,440 --> 01:00:28,240
to do that. 
Like I should not be throwing 

1188
01:00:28,240 --> 01:00:31,200
them in your heavy units. 
But it's just it's really fun. 

1189
01:00:31,200 --> 01:00:34,880
There's so many different 
variables, and and they all feel

1190
01:00:34,880 --> 01:00:37,520
different. 
Yeah, yeah, switch out your 

1191
01:00:37,520 --> 01:00:39,760
command to switch out the 
attachments and you're just 

1192
01:00:39,760 --> 01:00:41,120
playing a different game, you 
know what I mean? 

1193
01:00:41,120 --> 01:00:41,680
That's. 
Oh, absolutely. 

1194
01:00:41,760 --> 01:00:44,880
That's another great. 
That's excellent. 

1195
01:00:45,200 --> 01:00:48,600
The off the non combat character
on the on the little platform 

1196
01:00:48,600 --> 01:00:49,840
thing. 
Super cool. 

1197
01:00:49,840 --> 01:00:52,040
And they all do different things
depending on who you take and. 

1198
01:00:52,440 --> 01:00:54,960
Yeah, that's great. 
That's so there's really good 

1199
01:00:54,960 --> 01:00:59,040
stuff out there, really good 
innovative games out there, you 

1200
01:00:59,120 --> 01:01:00,840
know game wise and that kind of 
thing. 

1201
01:01:00,840 --> 01:01:04,480
So yeah, like I like you said I 
think to Jake and Dave I think 

1202
01:01:04,480 --> 01:01:07,680
we're living in the best time 
for to in terms of like the war 

1203
01:01:07,680 --> 01:01:08,920
game hobby. 
It's not going to go away. 

1204
01:01:08,920 --> 01:01:11,200
It's not dying. 
We've got plenty of people out 

1205
01:01:11,200 --> 01:01:15,200
there, plenty of games invest or
companies investing into the you

1206
01:01:15,200 --> 01:01:18,200
know the production and 
development of these games. 

1207
01:01:19,040 --> 01:01:22,040
So it's just great. 
So mate, look, we're almost out 

1208
01:01:22,040 --> 01:01:24,400
of time here today and I want 
you to, I want you to, I want to

1209
01:01:24,640 --> 01:01:28,320
firstly say thank you so much 
for coming on to talk about the 

1210
01:01:28,320 --> 01:01:32,840
Build Paint play program or 
well, not program community. 

1211
01:01:32,840 --> 01:01:38,000
I should say the live stream, 
it's like a secret US program 

1212
01:01:38,000 --> 01:01:40,800
maybe, I don't know, but in your
bunkers maybe that's what you're

1213
01:01:40,800 --> 01:01:43,840
sort of planning all along. 
But yeah, I want to, I want to, 

1214
01:01:43,880 --> 01:01:46,800
you know, say to people the 
links are down below, check them

1215
01:01:46,800 --> 01:01:49,440
out in the podcast. 
Go and click on that to get to 

1216
01:01:49,440 --> 01:01:52,680
the YouTube channel and the 
Facebook group so they can join 

1217
01:01:52,680 --> 01:01:54,920
and and participate. 
And at least, you know, have a 

1218
01:01:54,920 --> 01:01:57,400
look and try it out and see if 
if they enjoy it. 

1219
01:01:57,960 --> 01:02:00,200
But I know they'll enjoy the 
chats on the on the live stream 

1220
01:02:00,200 --> 01:02:03,120
a lot. 
And now, Jake, what's what's the

1221
01:02:03,120 --> 01:02:06,600
name of your store, buddy? 
Alpha Omega Hobby. 

1222
01:02:06,880 --> 01:02:08,840
That's it. 
Alpha Omega hobby So. 

1223
01:02:08,840 --> 01:02:10,520
Alpha, Alpha, Omega. 
Hobby. 

1224
01:02:10,520 --> 01:02:12,840
Single, Single. 
I'll check that. 

1225
01:02:12,840 --> 01:02:14,880
As in as in the Royal. 
It's all hobbies. 

1226
01:02:14,880 --> 01:02:16,240
It encompasses all. 
Hobbies, right? 

1227
01:02:17,080 --> 01:02:18,560
Like, you've got a really slick 
website. 

1228
01:02:18,560 --> 01:02:20,160
I must say, it's absolutely 
amazing. 

1229
01:02:20,160 --> 01:02:22,680
So I'll have to talk to you at 
some point, getting that the 

1230
01:02:22,680 --> 01:02:26,120
song by some fire stuff over 
here, because I can't. 

1231
01:02:26,120 --> 01:02:28,800
Yeah, I, I ship stuff. 
We shipped stuff everywhere. 

1232
01:02:28,800 --> 01:02:32,560
During the pandemic, we had a 
huge uptick in online sales, 

1233
01:02:32,560 --> 01:02:34,200
obviously 'cause you couldn't go
anywhere. 

1234
01:02:35,400 --> 01:02:38,920
I had a guy in Australia place 
an order for he was probably 

1235
01:02:38,920 --> 01:02:43,240
like $400.00 worth of stuff, and
his shipping was like 260 bucks.

1236
01:02:43,240 --> 01:02:45,400
And I'm recalling the guy and I 
was like, Are you sure you want 

1237
01:02:45,400 --> 01:02:47,080
to do this? 
And he's like, yeah, like nobody

1238
01:02:47,080 --> 01:02:48,440
has it. 
You guys are the only ones that 

1239
01:02:48,440 --> 01:02:50,400
have on the website and I just 
want to make sure I get it. 

1240
01:02:50,640 --> 01:02:52,920
So I was like, look, while I 
have you on the phone, is there 

1241
01:02:52,920 --> 01:02:54,760
like, is there anything else 
that you're looking for? 

1242
01:02:55,320 --> 01:02:57,520
Because the shipping isn't going
to change. 

1243
01:02:57,680 --> 01:02:59,160
So if you want to get more 
stuff, I'll add it. 

1244
01:02:59,160 --> 01:03:01,680
And he was like let he's like 
let me check And so he wanted 

1245
01:03:01,680 --> 01:03:04,040
like I added a bunch of paint 
and he added a couple more 

1246
01:03:04,040 --> 01:03:07,120
units. 
But again like we shipped some, 

1247
01:03:07,240 --> 01:03:10,360
I shipped some to guys in Japan.
So you will not be my first 

1248
01:03:10,360 --> 01:03:13,040
Japanese customer, but. 
All right, guys. 

1249
01:03:13,040 --> 01:03:15,080
Well, thank you so much again 
for for both of you coming on 

1250
01:03:15,080 --> 01:03:16,440
and taking your time. 
I know you're doing a bit of 

1251
01:03:16,440 --> 01:03:18,080
hobby, which is great because I 
don't want to take that time 

1252
01:03:18,080 --> 01:03:20,360
away from you, but enjoy the 
rest of your evening. 

1253
01:03:20,960 --> 01:03:25,360
And Dave, is there any, any last
words mate you want to say to 

1254
01:03:25,360 --> 01:03:27,480
the to the Cranker mass 
community, Cranker mass 

1255
01:03:27,520 --> 01:03:30,520
community? 
Just just say thanks very much 

1256
01:03:30,600 --> 01:03:33,600
for listening to us. 
And yeah, if you'd like what we 

1257
01:03:33,600 --> 01:03:36,160
heard, come check us out. 
All right. 

1258
01:03:36,880 --> 01:03:37,960
Yeah. 
Thanks for having us on, Josh. 

1259
01:03:38,080 --> 01:03:39,040
Yeah. 
Thank you so much. 

1260
01:03:39,520 --> 01:03:41,080
No problem. 
I I really enjoyed our chat 

1261
01:03:41,080 --> 01:03:42,640
today. 
I I I think we've covered a lot 

1262
01:03:42,640 --> 01:03:46,480
of good, good topics as well, 
and I just want to point out too

1263
01:03:46,480 --> 01:03:49,680
that Dave also has Dave Taylor's
Art of Book series. 

1264
01:03:50,160 --> 01:03:52,840
I'll leave a link in that for 
Dave's website so you can check 

1265
01:03:52,840 --> 01:03:55,320
out some of the amazing work 
people are doing out there in 

1266
01:03:55,320 --> 01:03:57,800
the hobby world. 
They are fantastic. 

1267
01:03:58,440 --> 01:04:00,720
All right, guys. 
Well, so thanks again. 

1268
01:04:00,720 --> 01:04:02,960
Take care, enjoy the rest of 
your night, and get back to your

1269
01:04:02,960 --> 01:04:04,040
hockey game, mate. 
OK. 

1270
01:04:04,760 --> 01:04:05,840
I need you. 
Thank. 

1271
01:04:07,360 --> 01:04:08,640
You so much. 
OK. 

1272
01:04:08,640 --> 01:04:09,080
Bye. 
Bye. 

1273
01:04:09,720 --> 01:04:10,040
See you.