Thanks Andy for coming on mate. I appreciate it and thank you so
much. Thank you for having me here.
No mate, we should have done this.
Like I said, I think we tried to do this a while ago and I think
maybe we just got really busy then.
Yeah, I. Think it's been, it's been
years. Because last time, the first
time you, you, you wrote to me, I was living in another country.
Oh, really? So I was about to move back to
Spain and the next time you got in contact, I think I was was
moving to another, just going to move to another city.
So it's been like constant things happening in my life.
That's fair enough. I.
Should have called you before. No, not at all.
It I think it was only because I had Mccurious and Pablo on and
you were in the chat and I thought, oh, that's right, I
have to contact you again about getting you on.
So I'm glad you did that that day because sometimes it's hard
to keep up with a lot of things, you know, because there's so
many things going on, you know, that, you know, you're working,
you're doing stuff. And yeah, but I know you're
really, you made some wonderful releases there for a while and
did some kick starters on your projects for Red Bar games,
which were really cool. You know, they're sort of really
in theme and in in the style of what we guys enjoy
aesthetically. So mate, how did, how did that
all? How did that all start?
Because you sort of mentioned you did some Commission painting
before and stuff like that. How did how did it turn into
doing red bar games like, you know, sculpting miniatures and
everything? Well, I, well, I think like,
like like most of us, like it's been always there since they're
a kid, like the, the interest in this, I think I started with
Hero Quest, like many, many others here, especially here in
Spain, because we didn't have anything before and since Hero
Quest. Well, I start painting, not
playing because I didn't have like a group of people, you
know, like collecting miniatures and playing role-playing games
or buying them. Then when I when I was a
teenager, I joined a group of people or Hammer Club, and since
then I haven't stopped. So.
Well, you have all this period when you start drinking and
going out and you forget about and for some years you put all
your miniatures in a drawer and just think about other stuff.
Yeah, it's been always, always there.
Then I I was a staff also in beans worship here in Madrid.
I see your. I see your.
Still got it on mate. Yeah, 35 years later.
You working there? I worked at the Oxford Street
store in 1995 for about, I don't know how many months.
It was maybe 6 months. And then I moved, moved to Luton
and worked there for about, I don't know, three or four
months. And then I got a job at the
studio as a, as a painter. Yeah, for a very brief short
time. And I wish I'd stayed there, but
for whatever reason, I think I just got homesick and I just
wanted to go back home again. So I was kind of a silly movie.
Where are. You from Australia originally,
yeah. Yeah.
But now living in Japan, yeah. Yeah, yeah.
As you know, but yeah, and I had a brief, brief whirlwind kind of
tour of of UK and working as my dream was my dream to work for
the gangs workshop as AI don't know what how old I was then I
think about 19 or 20 or something like that.
And I did the same thing I discovered here request like you
mate back in 1990 or 1989. And yeah, just was really
totally, you know, this was the hobby for me.
I couldn't stop Yeah, looking at the pictures and then finding
White Dwarf and 4th edition fantasy battles.
And yeah, just that was my dream just to work for the company as
we didn't have we didn't have stores in Australia at that
time. There was nothing.
So yeah, what? What?
Yeah, same here. We, we have a first thoughts
when they're, I think 92 when they released 4th edition, maybe
9294. I, I can't remember.
I, I can still remember the like the, the smell when I opened the
hero quest box of the spruce and it was like, like, like life
changing for me. Well, for many, many of us.
I, I do remember the, the sensations and where I was in my
house was sitting in like in the carpet in the dining room.
I, I was very young then. So yeah, that's, that's where
you start. And then, you know, I never,
never thought of making miniatures because it was
something like, from like being a, like a rock star or something
that you don't, you don't dream of.
It's like other people's stuff. Like even even I couldn't even
conceive like the, the existence of that job was something alien
for me back then was very was, was was more difficult than now
to make miniatures because you you need a lot of infrastructure
like spinning balls and all that thing.
Now it's very easy now everyone can do it.
Years later, I found some friends that they have made
their own company and they were starting to grow.
Now they're very big last short miniatures.
I don't know if you've heard of them, they have a a Patreon.
Last sword miniatures? I haven't heard of them, no.
Well, they're, they're very, they're very good, quite big.
Now they make more modern stuff. They don't make like old, old
school stuff, old school stuff, you know, But they, they were
friends from mine when I was starting playing with in a group
and I got inspired and I started, I made an online course
for three days Captain. And while I was working, I was
working in a, in an architecture firm, like making houses and
that stuff. I started sculpting like like a
hobby. And when I had some meters
together, I launched my first Kickstarter and I decided to, to
lose job stability and become half real.
No, but back then my, the company where I worked, yes, it
went bankruptcy. So I was like forced to, to do
something with my life. And this was like, and because I
liked all these old school I, I tend to do this, this kind of
style. I know it's, it's a very small
community, like old school alhammer people.
We are not very much, there's not, there's not a lot of market
inside that market. Many people are just collectors
from original stuff and other people just like metals, metal,
miniatures. So what I'm doing is like a
niche inside a niche inside, you know, like something very
specific inside something very specific inside something very
specific. But but yeah, I have some
regular customers. People are people respond very
well. I'm not happy with it.
Oh, that's good mate, That's great.
Well, maybe maybe it was just, you know, fate that your company
went bankrupt and it forced you into doing something.
And, and now look at you now you know, you've got a wonderful
website, got all these amazing things that you've made and you
know, you're obviously building reputation and people are buying
your products and you're selling or exporting your stuff to
different stores and people are stocking it on the shelves.
Well, I, I, I only have one store.
I I usually only sell online, but I have some customers that
that they have a store and they just happen to live in the city
that that's right next to where I live.
So I just go there and leave them some stock.
And once a month or twice a month, I go and, and exchange
change things to do stock. Yeah, but mostly this is, I
mean, it's very difficult to to have a profit if you're selling
through a store. There are lots of people and I
don't, I don't, you know, I made everything at home.
I print at home. It's not like a big
manufacturing, it doesn't scale very well.
It's a lot of it takes a lot of time to print and prepare the
menus and clean them. To make it like wholesale
business, it has to be like greater to consumer deal.
Yeah, you sort of like print order kind of thing.
They order the. Yeah.
It's print order. Yeah, Yeah.
So I don't have to to have a a warehouse because as I say,
there's not a big market for this.
We are always the same people around.
Yeah, but it's it's putting some really nice designs in people's
hands that, you know, have that same feel like I like, I really
like the the I'm looking at the Yogas here now and the I think
he did some Ogrins as well, which were really nice and some
nice orc inspired pieces with the Wyvern.
Was it a coctress or Wyvern that you had the?
Things like. Coctress yeah, that was really
nice too. And yeah, really nicely painted,
I think. What's the old mate in Spain who
paints those for you? Maxi?
Maxi. Yeah, he did a really good job
on. That yeah, Maxi.
Yeah, really nice. Yeah, well, I start.
I met Maxi through a friend. Come on, friend.
And the the first big status I paint all by myself.
Then I was like overwhelmed with I couldn't do everything.
So I contact him and I mean, he's he's very good painter.
He is very, very good. And now I moved to where?
To his city. So I'm, I'm living, I'm his
neighbor. Oh, that's good.
That's great. I mean, I didn't move because of
him. I moved here and then he was, he
was here. Yeah, but it makes things easier
because I just can go knock on his door and ask him to paint
things. It's easier to for sending
things back and forth. Yeah, because I think he's a
full time Commission painter too, isn't he?
Yeah, yeah, he's a full time commissioner.
Yeah. Yep, nice.
I should have called him. Yeah, we should.
We should have done. Yeah, we do.
I had I had him on a live stream years ago on the chronic amount.
This is going back I think 2020-2021 I think and I spoke to
him. But the, the, unfortunately the
Wi-Fi connection on his side was really bad.
So the picture was really terrible and really grainy and
you couldn't see anything. And so I'll need, we'll need to
reconnect with Maxi and get him back on and go through like his
entire catalog of stuff. Because I, I'm very pleased to
say that I've met really great Spanish people through the
Chronic command. I've met like Maxi.
I know Angel. I know Angel.
His last name I can't pronounce, but he's he's the really
talented guy behind the Hirohammer fanzine.
So if you if you're familiar with our fanzine that he created
it, he's the graphic designer. He does all the layout and all
the he's really good at he's a really he's a trained artist, so
he does a lot of illustrations. He did the front cover for the
second issue with the scathing on it.
And he also is a passionate gamer in the 4th edition era.
That kind of the thing that I really, we, we really sort of
like that kind of era of White magazine and everything.
So he stylized everything around that.
Very good miniature painter as well.
And I'm pretty sure he's in Madrid too.
So I'll need to get you guys in contact.
Look, I'm not in Madrid anymore. Oh, and really I.
Moved. Yeah.
Are you in Barcelona? No, I'm in a small down in the
north of Spain. Right, it's.
Called abiles. It's like in like in the coast,
but in the north. Right.
OK, We have a a climate similar to to the South of England.
So it's rainy. Yeah.
It's green. Everything's green.
There's mountains. Yeah.
Oh.
Sounds nice. This.
This is very nice. Yeah, yeah.
And it's much cheaper than Madrid.
I'd imagine it would be, yeah. Imagine it would be me.
I mean, like housing is, but third is, is really different.
So we have to move to here. We we moved here to to afford
that. House, yeah, to get a house and
yeah, to have a living. Yeah, I can understand that
mate. And also the climate in Madrid
is really hot. In summer it cannot be there.
And in winter it's really cold. So it cannot be there.
Never. It's it's always uncomfortable.
Yeah, it doesn't sound. So I, I grew there.
I've lived there all my life. But now we've come here and it's
really nice. And it's also a smaller place,
more like can life is different here.
The sort of Alzheimer community here in Spain and creators and
people, people doing all kinds of things.
One of my friend is Alberto and he makes for, he makes like, you
know, designs for, for, for Warhammer Quest supplements.
So he he makes like material and adventures and he's always like
maybe graphic design for, for all this.
He's quite, he's like quite known in the Warhammer, what's
the name? Warhammer Quest.
Quest. Community, Yeah.
Yeah, that's we're, we're quite a lot of people here and I think
that era hit hard here in Spain. Yeah, it's interesting.
Like I had like, you know, Mercurius on and Pablo and I
don't know much about, you know, like how the how the hobby was I
how it impacted other countries apart from the UK and maybe the
United States being the two big countries.
And then you realize, wow, they they sort of expanded out and
they went into the European market and they went to Germany,
Spain, where else? France, France as well.
That's right. France, yeah.
They they they translate. Italy, yeah.
Oh, in Italy too. Yeah, Italy as well, yeah.
You know, France and and Spain had back when I was a painter or
what? What?
Back when I was in beings worship, they were famous for
their paint for the painters. We had the very, very good
painting community and they, they won a lot of golden demons
and they travelled. You had the Spanish team that
travelled to, to different countries to for the golden
demons because each country had their own competition.
So yeah, there, there, there was a lot of of movement here.
Yeah, I mean, you know, the the miniature hobby has been, you
know, especially in Spain has been quite prolific.
If you think of companies like Vallejo, the paint range, which
I love, I use them all the time. And and of course I played a lot
of the Infinity system from Corbis Belly, which is also a
massive company there. Yeah.
Plus there's the other night
night game. Is it night models?
Night. Games.
Night games. Nightmare Models is from Spain.
Night Models is from Spain Peraso.
Yep. Greenstaff World is from Spain,
I think scale model is is from Spain.
The paint, the paintings, the paints, yeah, there's a lot of
industry there is is that nothing compared to to England,
obviously that's where that's another level that's that's
great. Yeah, but there seems to be, you
know, obviously you've got, you've got an all timer event.
You know, I think maybe that is in Barcelona.
I think when people all get together and play like third
edition type of stuff and all that kind of thing.
We used to have one for several years in Madrid.
I don't know if there's other events in, in Barcelona, but I
mean, it was made by a group, a group of friends.
It was a lot of work. So we did like 3 and then the
energy and interest fade and we kept, I mean, it turned, it
turned like it sounded like a, a group of people wanted to get
together to make an old hammer event.
And then it turned into a group of friends, like getting
together on weekends and, you know, making like small things
more often, but not open to the to the general public.
Right. And we made like a meeting.
It was not like a hammer event because it was semi private.
It was not announced. We made one last year and we
have when we we hire like in in a hotel.
We had a big room with with desks and a lot of there was
Mercurios there Pablo. Well, lots of everyone and it
was really fun. It was really fun.
It was really nice. Can you spend like a weekend
with your friends? You play a day party at night
and go lunch together. It's really fine.
It's like like, well, you've been to boil.
I haven't been to boil yet, no. OK.
But you are going to you are going this year.
I hope so. You're planning to go kind of
the attention. I hope so, yeah.
OK, well, it's kind of like that, but without having all the
all the original miniatures for the white darts around you, that
kind of spirit. We, we were like, I mean, maybe
3030, forty people, I don't know, because then people came
and and and go. And there were lots of they were
like let me check, they have at least like 6 tables, six games
running at the same time. Somewhere longer, somewhere
shorter, you have like more Dame or a passive request.
I played Warhammer 40K second edition with Mercurius.
Well, more people, but they were constant games on the day.
Nice. I I guess like 30-40 people.
That's a big turn out. It's a big turn out, yeah.
Yeah. Yeah.
And it was not announced. I mean, it was supposed to be
like, we are a group of friends getting together.
But then can I bring my friend? Can I?
I, I know this guy that wants to come.
So OK, you can, he can come. And at some point we were like a
lot of people. It was good.
It was fun. And I think that's the correct
way to do things because that's how you get to meet new people.
And it not it's like very endogamic, like always the same
people. It's good to have like,
different points of view and you see new miniatures, new ways of
painting. We'll get new friends.
I think that's the way. Just like poison.
Yeah, Oh, I was when I was I I went twice spoiled.
It's amazing. And you should go the third time
I went I was going to play a game with back with.
I think you have hit the David Fantastic guy, Dave.
Gilson. Gilson.
Sorry, Yeah.
Sorry, I don't mistake. My pronunciation?
No. Dave Gilson.
Dave Gilson? Yeah.
With his brother. Yeah.
Yeah, yeah.
They're a fantastic guide and I was very happy to go.
So I got into the plane, I arrived there and I was going to
be there on Monday and then the band was on Friday and Friday,
Saturday, Sunday. So I was going to be there the
whole week in in Nottingham. So I arrived there.
I start coughing, I start feeling bad.
So I take a COVID test and I had, well, I was positive in
COVID. So I, I got really, really sick,
like really, really sick. Terrible.
So I had to stay the whole week in my hotel room in Nottingham.
I mean, and it was the, the cheapest room in Nottingham.
So it was not like the Hilton Hotel.
It was like the movie transporting something like
that. And and I was like, I was having
like I had like very high fever, like 40.
I don't know. I had 40° in but very high
fever. Very dangerous.
And I was having like hallucinations, you know, like I
was really, really, really bad. And I couldn't, I was alone.
So I had to stay a whole week there.
It's just like transporting now. Just like, No, no heroin just
yet, yeah. It was like, yeah, with the, you
know, the, the blanket or sweaty, horrible.
It's horrible, it's terrible. And I missed the, the event.
I couldn't go to the event. And then next week we are having
a trip to Ireland with my wife and part of her, her family.
I got just in just healed to get to Ireland and I was not very
eager for that trip. But I, it was like a family,
family thing. So I, I had to make that trip
another week in Ireland being while while I was recovering.
So it was hard. It was not a very good
experience. And the next year was the last
year and I want I was going to go, but I just was moving from
Madrid to Abiles, so I had to cancel everything.
It's a shame. I hope, I hope this year is the
the year. Yeah, it's the revenge trip,
this one. So yeah, Dave, the Gilson
brothers bet. Are you ready mate, to host you
there? No, they, I, they were very nice
because the first time I, I went there, I didn't, I know I didn't
need anyone. I asked in the forum.
No, in the Facebook group, Is there space?
Can I, is there somewhere I can, are they quickly wrote, wrote me
back. And you can play our game and.
But they're not arguing with each other.
When they're not arguing, yeah. But it's it's, it's part of the
experience. Yeah, that's exactly.
It's like watching Fawlty Towers at the boil, you know, like
seeing those two, like Manuel and and Basil Fawlty, you know,
all Basil and Sybil, you know, fighting it over their their
their argument's been legendary. So have the cabaret in the
background. It'd be great.
Yeah, that'd be awesome. Yeah, but they're lucky to have
a brother that it's in the same hobby and the same interest.
Then then yeah, yeah, that's, I think that's very fortunate.
Yeah, absolutely. Yeah.
A lot of his 4th edition games have been legendary, like he's
recreated the Battle for Eastgate and Revenge of the Doom
Lord. Yeah, I played that game.
Oh, you played that one, did you?
Yeah, I played the reinforcements the from.
I think he's left reinforcement against Dino Allen.
Allen, I don't know. I don't think yeah.
Well, he's a friend of David. He's also the the the the nicest
guy. Right.
Nice. Yeah, probably.
And yeah, who played that? And I think, I think Jervis
Johnson was watching over. Yeah, yeah.
That's awesome. Yeah.
That. That's quite.
That's right. I didn't know who he was, but
they told me later. And he was like, yeah.
That, that's incredible to have Jervis Johnson there looking
over, looking over something He, he basically wrote, you know.
Yes, that's the thing that we don't have in the in Spanish
whole hammer. Yeah, with that, it's, it's
because Boyle is, it's nice because it's, it's like a
birthday party, Like everyone, everybody's around.
It's not like going to like a big event where you have like
when you see all these people far away, like is, is that
everything is like in the same place merging together.
You can walk, you can start talking to to different people
that and you turn around and there's Rick Presley and you
turn the other way around and you have, I don't know, like
jump Blanche. It's and everyone is very nice.
It's yeah, it's you're going to, you're going to like, you're
going to love it. And you already know half of the
people there. Well, that that was that was
kind of the reason to go is to meet everyone.
It, you know, face to face that I've sort of known and been in
contact with people like Ang Hill, like I was talking about
before. He's actually going this year.
So to meet him for the first time will be amazing to meet a
lot of the guys, you know, a lot of people that I've known
through the chronic command to meet them in person.
And maybe the bit maybe this is the only chance I'll ever have
of ever doing it. So it'd be pretty special if I
can do it and I just hope that I don't get bloody COVID when I go
there or get get something, you know?
Well, I I mean, it's not as easy to go from Japan to England that
from Spain, I mean. Yeah, Yeah, that's true.
That's it's, it's a different, different experience, I mean,
and much more expensive, right? But I mean, it's something you
have to do sometime in your life, a little, a little once.
If you are a part of this community, it's like pilgrimage
or like something it is a bit. It is a bit, yeah.
Yeah, that's true. I tried to tell that to my
friends about a lot into this, and they are.
Yeah, yeah, I will go someday. You know, every year people get
older. It's not going to last forever,
so it should be done as sooner as possible.
Yeah, that's true. You're absolutely right.
And it's a real shame that I can never meet Brian Ansell, meet
him in the purse, be in person, shake his hand and say hello and
thank him for all the amazing, you know, miniatures and games
he helped produce and, and all of that.
But I get to meet Kev, and hopefully he'll be still around
when, when I eventually get there, Kev Adams will be one of
the people I really want to, you know, shake hands with and thank
him for all the amazing love and talent he's put into these
models that we've painted and collect over the years.
Because I can still remember being on the school bus going
back from school, from high school back home, and, you know,
looking at all those beautiful night goblin models that are in
those pages, you know, thinking, wow, that this looks amazing.
You know the character in those figures are incredible.
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www.blackarrowminis.com. We are lucky to to have our, I
want to say heroes, but people so that that have been so
influential, especially if if we are living, if we are making a
living out of this that they are these people have been really
influential and they are not they are affordable.
People mean that. I mean, if I was a musician, I
would never meet Mike Jagger. I mean, that would be something
really impossible to to do because it's, it's like in a
stratospheric level, someone that you would never be able to
approach. But the people that really
influence us as as kids, the people that were making all
those signatures, they're just, they, they go to they're,
they're not like superstars. And the fact that they're really
approachable people and you can find them, you can talk to them,
you can ask them questions, you can merge with them.
So I think that's something good about our hobby.
Yep, Yep. Absolutely.
Man, that's nice. It's nice that those guys want
to come down to those events and reconnect with people that do
admire these people as being sort of their sort of, you know,
childhood heroes, if you like. Yeah, and they're also they're
enjoying the band. I mean, it's not that they are
like they're paid to be there or you know, like they're not going
to to sign autographs and sit in the.
I mean, they're part of the the that they're enjoying that thing
as the same as you, so. Yes, that's a good point.
Because it's not like one of those conventions where you go
to see some star personality and they're just in a booth and you
walk up and say hello and, you know, can you sign my book or
whatever? Yeah, it's not like.
They're not, they're not there for the money, you know, they're
for the experience. No, that's.
Nice are there for a nice pint of beer and a Curry and a good
good. Curry people.
Yeah, so. Well, and the people, they're
the people who organized the band and, you know, Diane and
and Marco, they're really, really, really, really nice
people. Yeah, yeah, that'd be nice,
mate. What, what kind of, what kind of
like, you know, in terms of the old hammer movement kind of
thing, like, you know, in terms of games and miniatures, what
kind of things are your favourites?
What, what kind of games do you really enjoy playing in
miniatures? You like collecting and
painting? Oh, well, in games, I'm really
like hijacker, hijacker, you know, I get in in the game that
other people are organizing. I when we play.
Yeah. Yeah.
So honestly, I, well, I have an army of orcs, but it goes very
slow because I paint maybe one miniature every six months.
So it takes me well, probably I have been years since I've been
last, but I like to when we play here, at least here, there's
always someone that brings the miniatures and we just hop in
the we play the games I I enjoy the most.
And it's what we usually play are a little have a little bit
of role play, like a, a back story with maybe surprises
extra, you know, the, the characters have maybe their own
objectives. So it's, we have a game master
that is like usually the one who brings the miniatures and plants
it that, that, that kind of game that are not not like
competitive, but more like telling a story.
And, and that's, those are always fun.
And we play like group of people, I believe 5-6 people.
So that's, that's the thing that I enjoy the most maybe.
And the rules we use, we used to, we used to play with 3rd
edition because that's what many of our my friends use.
And sometimes 5th edition or I, I because I'm, I'm a bit out of
the of the group now that I'm here and I'm busy, but I think
they're using like the rules of ancient battles.
Oh. Yeah.
Because they are a little better than 4th edition, but they are
not quite 5th edition. So there it's like a a mix of of
rules and different editions. But it's I really it's most
mostly about the story, not the the rules of the of the
miniatures of the miniatures. Time to say I play with my I
have a beer guard army also like rogue trader, you know, the old
ones with the old ones from with rhinos and some squats also.
Yeah, that's the kind that's about what I paint.
But since I may meet my own miniatures, I'm to busy to or to
to tired to to do a side projects.
But I enjoy the the the experience of being there and
playing with other people, being part of that.
That's that's what I really enjoy.
That's good, mate. Yeah, that's the Imperial Guard
back in Rogue Trader. That's when they had Beastmen in
their forces too. Yeah, in fact, in my last
Kickstarter I made some alternative Beastmen.
I well, not, not me, I have, I work, I mean even the the
company company, the Red Bar games is mine.
I have sometimes a freelancer that helps me, that makes other
miniatures and we work like in tandem, like together.
And I tell him what to do, he sculpts.
I correct. So it's like a work of sometimes
it's a work of two, but he's like a freelancer and he does
other, other stuff also. He has his own, his own stuff
going. So he's not part of the he has
not the interest in the miniatures.
He's just a he's a sculptor and he's really good.
Yeah, we made some some business, but these were like we
have some like birds, it's with like like beak or like like
cows, but they were different animals.
Cool, Well that's good mate. Talk about Red bar games.
What projects or kick starters have you got lined up in the
future? What kind of projects are you
working on now? Our next project is not going to
be all Hammer. It's going to we are getting we
are making a Patreon to sell like digital sculptures or print
for the printers, but it's going before role-playing games.
Oh, cool. Obviously as an art director or
the the the person who chooses the style is going to look.
Everything tends to look what I like.
You know, my personal taste and my personal taste is very
influenced by by all hammer and all and the old school
miniatures. But we are like making something
different. And I hope I expect to lunch on
April or May the 1st month and every month is going to be like
an encounter in an adventure. Like the monsters and monsters
and terrain and characters like very, very small.
We're very small because we don't have like reasons to make
like units and armies. And we're going to we're going
to focus on giving every miniature like character and we
make it every very little, not not many miniatures, but every
miniature has to have like interest.
So that that's going to be our focus.
And while we do that, I will personally do some releases for
old school al hammers, Al hammers, old school stuff.
But I don't have plans for anything, for anything concrete
special. Maybe what I feel I'm, I'm going
to I'm going to try to make it more like a hobby.
So it's if I feel to do some works, I'll do some works.
I feel to do some elves. I do some elves but not not
following a strategy. Just making something to to feel
that hobby and to enjoy the hobby by myself.
Obviously you got to make things that sell too that are appealing
to people in a in a broader market.
Sure. Yeah, Yeah, that's something
that I've. I made that mistake several
times. The last two Kickstarters we
made were not very successful. We did like the human warriors
from the future were all like the the girls like were a woman
like Amazon. We call it space Amazons and you
know, many people liked it a lot, but it was not very
successful. And the one before we made like
a space frogs. We didn't have a lot of people
buying it. Right, OK, but.
You know, there were there were praise that I really enjoy doing
and I wanted to do that for a long time.
So maybe if if I have done some dwarfs that I, I love dwarfs was
my favorite. But if I have done some dwarfs,
it would be it would have been a much more successful project.
But yeah, sometimes you have to do what you feel.
And I mean, I think that there there are people that are really
happy that I did that. I mean, maybe there were not
many, but they are. I think they're very happy.
They're very happy. Well, I, I think Maxi did a
great job on the painting of them, Yeah.
And the, the banners and the shield designs are very nice.
So I think collectively, and I think that's for all the armies
that you guys have designed and Maxi's painted, they've been
very nice. And I in fact, I saw one of the
guys for the Wyomer Renaissance group in Denmark, he has a lot
of your ogres in his Ogre. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
They look great, Yeah, they fit right in.
You know, with the old Perry stuff.
Roon. Roon.
Maybe Roon? Yeah, Roon.
Yeah, that's right. It's one of my oldest clients.
Oh, good. Excellent.
Yeah, and we share the same last name.
Oh, OK, there you go. Yeah, yeah.
Because my last name here in Spain is something very strange.
I mean, nobody has it. So it's very surprising to me to
receive an order from someone that is has my my last name.
It's like, Oh no, I mean, it's a very common name in Denmark.
But for me it's something shocking to see someone that is
has your last name. So because no, I don't know.
I know no one with that here in Spain.
Wow, there you go. Yeah, I mean the others, I think
that was my my first, the big Kickstarter, well, big
relatively. I'll I will try to balance
things. But because we're fucking all we
are going to focus all our most of our efforts on the Patreon.
I'm, I will try to do things that I know that I, I want to
do. If you want to do something, if
you are really enjoying it, it's going to be a better thing that
if you are forced to do something, I mean, if you do it
with joy, the result is going to be something much more
interesting. I mean, the last thing I did was
just for joy was like an evil warrior on a manticore.
And it is just like a month ago and I enjoyed a lot making the
miniature because that was something I wanted to do for for
a long time. And I think that's going to work
well. But I mean, it's easy to to
start a project, thinking about selling and in the middle of the
process, like get lost and start doing things because these
projects and I think started, it takes a long time to to to
prepare. And you're in that process maybe
months. Maybe you start with some energy
or interest. And then at some point you're
only thinking on, but I need to make this unit and I need to
make something that that it's, I mean, I need to make some heavy
unit and I have to make like fast unit.
And at that point, you're thinking of practical things and
not of doing joyful things. I don't know if I'm trying, if
I'm expressing myself. So it's easy to get lost.
And I, I want to focus only on things that I really, when
you're, when you're in that mood of making something that you
have to make it, you just make it.
You, you check it's good. I mean, it's, I mean, I,
everything I release, I have to check that it's well done.
I make, if I have to scrap something from zero and throw it
away, I do it. I don't have any problem with
that. And I do it a lot.
Sometimes we have to restart from the from zero because it
doesn't work. I mean, I, I have, I make sure
that the, the, the thing that I release is good.
It has a, a certain quality of the sculpture of movement of I
mean, it's, it's interesting, but it's not the same.
If you are really, if it's something that you have to do
that is something that you really want to do, I would you
really enjoy to do. For example, making the ogres,
Each one of them is different and I enjoy them.
I enjoy each one of them because I didn't have any timeline.
I just have an idea. I have some influence from
drawing I've seen or painting or an idea or a movie or whatever,
and I want to make it into the that into that miniature.
I mean it it when you see the miniatures, the ogres are very
successful because people can sense that concerns like that
you have invest an extra time, an extra care and it's not just
good. It's it has the the love
component in it. You start to explain, but I
think, I think that's the way. So, yeah, I the all the augers
are done with a lot of care and a lot of of love.
And, and the, the frogmen, the first ones were done with a lot
of care. But, and then we decided that,
yeah, but if we, we are the only ones making this frogmen, this,
if someone wants an army of this, we have to offer them more
units because then if not, they are going to to be like
stranded. They're going to have one unit
and they, they cannot use it. So we have to make more units.
And then you enter it like in a cycle of, OK, what do we need?
We need a heavy, we have a close combat unit, we need a heavy
unit. And it's not so fun.
And the result, even if it's good, is not going to be the
same. That's fine.
That's why I think so. From now on I'm just doing
whatever I please. Yeah, good.
That's what you should do, mate. Absolutely.
Yeah. You know.
I guess it's the same with painting.
I mean, when you paint something that you really enjoy, you're
going to make like an extra effort.
That's why I'm, I'm very, I'm very thankful to Maxi because he
paints everything and he makes everything like top quality and
he doesn't like, I mean, he commits to a certain level.
And I know he was really tired of painting frogs because I sent
him like 200 frogs to paint and he was fed up with painting
frogs. But he is still made them really
good till the last one. But I mean, The thing is the
same with painting. When you paint something that
really, really interesting, you're going to, I'm going to
add a shadow here. It's not necessary, but it's
going to make it a little bit better.
And I buy, I don't care because I don't care this extra time
because I, I, I'm enjoying it a lot.
I, I just, I don't want to, to finish it and send it.
I, I want to work on this. This makes me happy.
But when you have to paint like 2000 points of escaping, I
already did. I mean, it's it's just about
your your mind is just paint. It's OK.
Yeah, it's OK. Another one and you just want to
finish. So that's the two different
attitudes. And I want my life to be filled
with the first attitude that more than the second attitude.
Yeah, no, I understand you've got an established company with
a big range. Now I'm just looking through the
the list here. You've got dark warriors which
like basically chaos ogres, dwarves, orcs, undead, and then
you've got some Shields and scenery to accompany that.
And for the space fantasy range, you've got space amazons,
frogmen, space denizens, space Ogus and space dwarves.
So you you're sort of covering a lot of different different
armies or genres there that people can now access.
And it's just going to grow from there.
So I hope it's going to be really successful for you, mate,
for the next Kickstarter with your kind of role play
adventurer type theme you got there.
And we'll keep an eye on that and see how it goes.
And I think maybe that will be pretty, pretty appealing to a
lot of people because a lot of people like doing or like
collecting and painting individual type character models
for their role play adventures or skirmish games and that kind
of thing. Yeah, I think that's going to I
mean we've, we've done a lot of work in advance.
We have several months already. Sculpt.
I'm very, I'm very happy with them.
I don't know if I should say that, but yeah, I really like
them. And we've we've worked a lot.
We've made many, many hours into this many, many corrections.
It's been a very, very intense work.
And I think it's going to, I think it's at least I'm going to
be happy with the Versal. I don't know if it's going to be
a success or not, but I'm going to be happy with.
Well, that's great. Well, I wish you all the very
best and thank you very much for coming on to talk to me today,
Auntie. And you for having me.
Yeah, no. And thank you very much for
sending me some prize support for our upcoming one of the
Renaissance Day games Day. So that should be in June, I
think. So I know the guys will be
really excited about that because they've got something to
to to win for and they can select something out of that
wonderful batch of miniatures you've got there.
So you have a big community of people there.
Well, I mean, you know, it's, it's a it's a stable, small but
stable community. So we've got to make maybe about
on a really good day we might have 11:50, but average probably
eight people who will come to play.
So that's not too bad. I mean, you know, I'm pretty
happy with that for being Japan where we are, you know, so.
I mean Japanese make a land of hobbies but and I don't I don't
know many people or many things coming from Japan from I think
it's more like a western hobby. Well, I, I thought so too, but I
think you'd be very, very surprised Auntie, because I've
seen collections of like Citadel DND miniatures in people's boxes
and stuff like that. They've it, it goes back to, it
actually goes back to like 5th edition Warhammer when they
translated into Japanese and they opened up stores in Asia.
So it, it, they sort of started there.
And up on my wall is a is a box set of Milton Bradley Battle
Masters in Japanese. So it.
Goes back down to that. So it, yeah, it has extended way
back. And then even I've met students
who played Advanced Dungeons and Dragon Dragons Second Edition,
and they translated the rules so that it could play within their
Japanese playgroup at university and everything like that.
So there is a very small subculture of gamers here, but
it's not as nowhere near as prevalent as it is in Europe and
America and and the UK and even Australia.
I have lots of customers from Australia.
Australia is like one of the biggest, yeah.
Go to the Aussies. Oy, oy, oy, yeah.
It's surprising. Yeah.
Great.
Much more than any other countries.
Yeah. Really.
Yeah. Yeah, I had.
Yeah. Yeah.
Especially for fantasy things. Fantasy worked very well in
Australia. Well, that's good to hear.
Nice, mate. OK, that's wonderful.
Well, thank you so much again, and I wish you all the best with
you and the team behind Red Red Bad Games.
And yeah, like I said, I hope the next Kickstarter is
successful and that the company keeps going and turning over
some great projects and you keep selling stuff and keep doing
what you love doing, mate. All right.
Thank you so much for having me, it's been a pleasure and I hope
to see you. I have to see you this summer in
Nottingham and we have a drink together or something.
Absolutely. Yeah, You can get Leave Me a
space at the bar. I'll be there.
Yeah. Yeah, well, if you if you're
there, we're going to, oh, we're going to be.
I'll be drinking more than gaming, Yeah, no doubt, yeah.
You know, I'm done. Thank you so much.
OK, Auntie. Thanks mate.
Take care. Thank you very much.
Have a good night. Thank you very much.
OK, Well have a good day. See you mate.
Bye. Bye, bye, bye bye.
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