It's. Nice to finally meet you,
Martin. I know, right?
It's been so long and it's always been been via text.
But yeah, super, super happy to finally be on here as well and
just have the chance to all hang out a bit.
Yeah mate, Yeah, for sure, man. Everything all well at your end.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely. Perfect, mate.
Beautiful. You too.
Nice. Yeah.
Just I'm I'm glad that I could still do it because I ended up
having my wisdom teeth out last last week.
So it's it's been a bit wild but all good you know Got the
painkillers, got everything else happening.
It's all good. So a.
Big glass of painkiller. That's what I like to see.
Yes, exactly. Yeah.
Oh, look, it's it. It kind of lined up just right
because I think almost, I think Monday I could finally have a
drink. So yeah, yeah, worked out good.
Good on. Your mind Are you in the Martin
Hobby room? Is this the man Martin Man Cave?
It is, it is. It's a little bit, little bit
whatever still, but I've at least got the display cases for
what I can fit in, and then the the drawers for everything else
and then everything that's sort of currently being used right at
this moment, so. Yep.
Nice. That's this, This is sort of the
the everything, everything that isn't adding room.
So it's just kind of shifted everything over from from work
for through the day. But hey, you know, all worked
out well. Yeah, mate.
Yeah. Thank you much.
Yeah. Thanks again for you and your
wife to accommodate this time. I know that's difficult for
young families and at that time, that kind of thing.
It's all good. Yeah, she's she's just picking
her son up now from daycare. But I've sort of already said,
oh look, you know this is all happening and she knows that's
all fine. So, but if there is an excited
toddler who who jumps in and that's, that's going to be wise.
Fact the laughter of the day was My wife came in here, She really
comes in here like my my area. But she really, she came in and
I think she wanted to ask me something or whatever.
And I don't know how it came up, but I said something about my
podcast and she said what? What's a podcast?
I said, you know, the thing I've been doing for the last four
years, what I said, you know, I've been doing.
I've been recording podcasts, interviews with people for the
last four years. Oh, OK, well, she didn't even
know it's. Like.
I'm sure you know this my wife is always like that.
You know she just just she lives in we live in planets made.
I'm sure totally she's like oh OK And I said yeah, I've been
doing it for the last four years.
We're celebrating because I did like a celibate, like I recorded
a podcast with somebody. 2 guests were on the first one.
Justin and and I don't for somehow it came up in
conversation or whatever and then she was just totally blown
away that I've been doing a podcast for four years but there
you go there's my wife. Totally, totally.
Yeah totally. What do you what do you how you
say that. Yeah, just not just not knowing.
Whatever goes on here, it's just surprising.
It's, you know, I'm lucky with my partner Chris.
She's like, you know, she's she's very supportive, but she's
not really interested, which is fine.
Like you know, she loves board games and we'll play those
together and that's really good. And Stan is getting very
interested, you know, he's starting to he's got a selection
of 4th edition night Goblin arches that he's been painting,
which is good stuff. But he like, she knew that
obviously the podcast was happening and I'm like, OK, Yep.
Cool. Like just a reminder, you know,
like when you guys get in, I'll, I'll be in here.
The door will be closed. If you can keep Finn out, that'd
be great, you know. But but it's all good.
And be like where are you doing the podcast?
And I'm like, well I'm not going to bloody Japan am I?
Like she seems to record a movie one like well, so you know what
it's like. But yeah, that's nice.
Sorry. What does that mean?
Now, I'm sure. I'm sure Finn's going to come
bursting through that door like a goblin fanatic and sweep you
up. And.
Give you a hug and after daycare.
Yeah, yeah. It's going to be just like the
what was it the the political commentary guy with working from
home, with the kids jumping in, I'm sure and of.
Course the count effects here, mate.
You know, count effects you met up recently, eh?
Yes, yeah, we did. Also in the flesh as well,
finally, which is great. So I'm yeah, real glad that you
can join as well. I'm really, really excited.
But you know, we've got got the Aussies on.
It's nice. Sure is, mate.
Yeah, it's great. It's it's really good that you
guys connected. I was.
I was really nice to see that in the photo the other day.
When you're playing, is it in the Blue Mountains or something?
Do you play in the Blue Mountains?
Yeah, yeah. So it that was actually the
first time that Mark and Adrian and I have been obviously doing
the challenge you know the docs challenge for what since you
want we've we've all met individually and we've I think
we've all had games before that but it was not with all of us in
the same room. So it was kind of strange that I
think there's like one other Aussie guy I think he's in SA
who was in the very first one. But when when we first joined
up, considering everyone was from, you know the the four
corners of the Arthurs were the fact that we were all within two
hours of each other. It was ridiculous like in
Australia, considering it was like, you know, like, you know,
Danes and the Brits and and the Americans and stuff, it was kind
of ridiculous, Yeah. But yeah, great, great times.
And also fantastic. Be able to, you know, be able to
see your minis in the flesh as well, you know, That was
fantastic. And I kind of wasn't expecting,
I didn't know what he was going to be bringing for the game.
So and in fact, you know, we talked about like, oh, there'll
be four of us, you know, I guess we'll just figure out what to
do. And we considered doing a, you
know, like a scenario or something like that with four
players. But truth be told, I don't think
I've played four players second edition since 1997.
Something like that. Yeah, I don't know how that
would pan out. Yeah, yeah, exactly.
The the combat rounds would probably be getting pretty
interesting there, I reckon. Did you end up getting close
combat when you played? Yeah, not much, which, you know,
considering I was playing the guard that time was probably a
good thing, but we. Didn't have a single single
round of close combat. Oh, that's right.
Yeah, you and Adrian did, which stunned.
Oh, he did. No, no, It's just really weird.
That's bizarre. Like it's.
I mean like just generally super rare for a Game of Second anyway
and there was plenty of cover and everything but no one was
really sort of bunkering down or hiding.
I was I was running up my my guard in our game and I mean oh
Mark, he he must have like, I don't know somehow offended the
Emperor or something. I don't know.
I don't think I've ever seen anyone roll so badly in the game
and and also I think I don't think I lost the whole squad.
So yeah, that's really saying something.
It was, it was nothing to do with generalship at all.
It was. It was just, yeah, it was
ridiculous. Yeah, that's a really good
point. So basically, trying to wipe out
an entire squad will net you quite a lot of victory points,
all of mine. The only reason I won was
because all my squads were like chipped away at and I think I
lost like a whole squad and two Sentinels or something like that
and a Chimera. And all it would have taken was
a few more shots at one or two squads and it would have easily
swung to the Ox and they had mass firepower in comparison.
So and I was playing very conservatively and being a
sneaky little git and hiding around ruins and using things
like flamers and hand flamers. So yeah, it it was pretty good
it it could have gone the Orcs way very, very easily.
Yeah, it's awful. I I love that kind of game.
You know, like it. It really creates that sort of
narrative as well and and how people are really clinging on to
to each dice roll as well. Like the weight of it is, you
know, a bit more meaningful, certainly much more than the the
newer editions with, you know, everything hitting on twos and
re rolling and winning on twos and re rolling and it's sort of
like bucketfuls of dice, but but at the cost of of drama.
So yeah, but enough talk of of new additions here anyway.
Yeah, on and off. I've been playing second the
last couple of years like very infrequently.
We all obviously and we've all got families and stuff and
getting to a games club to play is is the tricky bit.
But yeah, well, I guess the focus is just trying out new
armies at the moment and having fun with that.
And we're not going back to when we were teenagers and completely
being beady and cheesy and taking horrible things.
It's more like themed armies at the moment.
Yeah, for sure. I mean it.
It is you know like as I was saying like that that drama and
the story and and part of it is I don't I don't know like not
not to get all all too deep and meaningful but like certainly
not to COVID and and getting the chance to play with friends.
Again really valuing that that almost like group storytelling
aspect because you know like I played D&D, you know, since I
was a kid as well And the while it's not really an RPG game,
certainly not compared to something like Rogue Trader or
whatever. You you get that thing where
you're your regular opponents you know you have those
characters or those squads that you fear or you hate or or
you're proud of the ones that you have And it's great.
It's a it's a thing that sort of continues over the years and
making a list like that from the start is a lot more interesting
to me. I think also it means you get to
sort of like paint a bit of of everything as well.
You know, if you are, whether you're more a painter or a
gamer, regardless, you know, like you get to bury it.
You don't get bored. You don't get, you know, like
you, you get that intimidation from like, oh, I've got 30 snake
bite boys to paint on foot and there's like a lot of colors and
details and I mean, who would do anything like that, right?
Yeah, you could cheat like me and get pay Josh to paint some
brilliant models. Because the last time, 2 times
I've been up at the games club in the Blue Mountains, I've
brought an army that he's painted.
The first time was slanish Marines like, yeah.
And yeah, I had a lot of people like staring and gawking at them
because they haven't seen that sort of painting style, etcetera
since the 90s. Which is cool, yeah.
Look, I mean, oh, and Speaking of as well with with Old Demon
coming up as well, Josh that that Wiven is looking fantastic.
Oh, thanks. Bud Yeah, I'm really enjoyed it.
And like to see the finished product.
Yeah, yeah, it. Was actually.
It was actually painted before I painted it about three years
ago. It was for the Midden Middle
Hammer Painting Challenge when they had painting challenges
then. So.
They said you know every month you can enter a model, any model
you like and then it gets it just like a random draw and they
draw you if you get in, which I was, I was just drawn by luck
and I won the Scaven army book for 4th edition which is perfect
time because I was collecting Scaven at the time.
Yes, of course. Yeah.
But this? Is kind of like a repaint.
This is kind of repainting over the old darker color scheme to
make it much more vibrant, much more, you know, 90s, which it
looks wonderful. I mean it just, it just screams
color when you look at it, you know, it screams A wah.
You know the inner wah. So I love it you.
Know, you've also got to remember that.
Like, even if, like the Warhammer world or the 40K
universe, dark and terrible places, the orcs are having fun.
They're there to party. They're wearing, you know, their
party clothes. It's going to be bright.
It's going to be colorful. You know, like, just lean into
it. I think it's great.
Yep, for sure, mate. Absolutely, Martin.
That's a good segue because we're going to talk about your
hobby history now, how you got into the actual into gaming.
You talked, you touched on about playing D&D since you were a
kid. Was D&D the first sort of gaming
experience you had in tabletop gaming?
Probably my first experience would be Christmas 1992.
I would have got the Hero Quest box and that.
I mean you know as far as an intro, you know, it's got, it's
got everything you need and we certainly use that for DVD as
well. Like I was played with a couple
of mates and I think, yeah, that that would have been the
earliest 192. I think I'd I'd had my
neighbour's grandson give me a Rogue Trader Plastic Orc, which
I think was probably my first miniature.
So I knew what miniatures were. But seeing that Hero Quest and
of course at that point that's when you know that amazing ad
was on TV in Australia as well, you know, etcetera.
So I was into it, you know. But yeah that that was the very
first one where I sort of owned it and we could play and and the
rest of my family. You know my sister wasn't averse
to playing with me and and mum and dad would humor me and we
could actually sit and all play together.
So the gaming, it sounds silly to say because it is social for
most people, but it's always been a big thing for me as far
as being social with friends. So yeah, that that's for my
info. What edition of Dungeon and
Dragons did you start off with? 2nd Edition Advanced D&D so the
the life is cheap. You know Get excited about
rolling up a wizard with with it's 1D four hit points and then
tripping over a rock and dying at the start of the campaign.
Best edition, Yeah. Oh look, fantastic.
I mean you know if you you avoid things like encumbrance and and
certain rules that probably yeah make it all a bit time.
You got any back quanto and? Yeah.
Gum. Yeah, yeah, there was the A
friend of mine had the Oriental Adventures one as well.
So I think everyone sort of ended up making a Kenta at a
certain point as well. And I think that group of
friends have probably. So I think I was a teenager by
then. I had a few friends who I played
in like through through primary school we've played D&D and
played Warhammer. But high school was where it
really started amping up, where I had a regular games group
where we all played different stuff.
And yet that that Second edition AD and D we we absolutely
slogged through those books, played every single one we could
find our hands on, handwriting campaigns and whatnot.
So yeah, that that narrative thing has always been been big
for me as well, for sure. Wonderful, mate.
That's great. So when did you finally discover
Second edition 40K then? Oh, well, I so I live in
Katoomba. I've moved back the first time
in about 12 years, and I've bounced back and forth between
here and Sydney and various other places over the years.
But it was actually in Katoomba where there was a game shop,
mountain model trains and hobbies, which had, you know,
just a bit of everything. It was, yeah, model trains and
whatnot, but they had a decent Bahamas section.
And I remember I think Christmas 95, I think I would have got the
the classic box. So I'd seen the models.
I had friends who who had a handful, and we'd sort of tried
playing games before anyone. Anyone had the books.
We we'd been collecting white dwarfs and whatnot, but, but
that was sort of the OK, I've finally got the books.
We can all play everyone come over and play all set up you
know books for hills and such and doing the the classic improv
on everything when you couldn't afford stuff or or when you're
of a certain age as well. So yeah it would have been then
that that was also my first games club as well so and and
very strangely so since moving back here about two years ago
I've started going to a place up sort of mid mountains.
So not the one that kind of facts.
And I met up at at a few towns away met a guy randomly who is
the first person who's remembered that store and he
also used to go to that club. And it's quite likely that when
we were woof jeez, this would have been like 25 years ago, we
probably would have actually been going at the same time, but
we had no idea. So yeah, it's funny actually,
like coming to talk here now because I've just been reliving
some of those times as well where it's like, you know, you
get the classic as kind of X said the BD players where it's
like throw the dice and before it even can see, it's like, Oh
yeah, that's a six. Oh yeah, that's a six.
That's a six. I'm sorry.
So you know, like like many people since started
experiencing it. But yeah, I do remember, I think
all I had was Kazakov Straka 3 Chaos Terminators and then the
the Orcs and graduate from the second head box and that was my
first army at A at a games club. Yeah, it works.
I think four of those models were painted out of 60
something. That's a valid fighting force.
Yeah, yeah. Hey, look, still 25% are our
allies. You know, it's all good.
It's in the book, you know Ross, Ross and.
Dice. Exactly.
You know, a good book. That's it.
That's. Probably worth about $125.00 US
on eBay at the moment. So take it.
Take it. Really.
Yeah. Bloody hell.
Put. It in a safe, mate.
Don't let get into it. It is.
Stunning. You know, I mean, I think
probably, I know all of us have sort of been into it, you know,
either in or out or for a very long time.
But there are so many people returning to the hobby and not
just coming into to the current editions.
They're like they're finally feeling that nostalgia hit that
we've always been chasing. So people are looking for all
the books or all the models and prices obviously going up and
going up. It's I'm I'm very glad that I've
I've bought most of the stuff that I want or need at this
point to be able to play. But you know having having a
complete, well, I mean jeez, how much a Dark Millennium box would
be going complete right now. I shattered.
I think so. Yeah.
Yeah, mate.
Yeah. Very lucky to have that.
Yeah, yeah, indeed. I mean, oh, I don't know if this
is the one. Actually, I didn't.
I didn't mean to have everything here, but like I said, I kind of
just, you know, I have everything handy anyway.
Oh, it is this one. I managed to pick this up.
I bought the box, sorry. I bought the Chaos 4th edition
Fantasy Chaos book for I think 60 bucks, something like that.
Australian, which is pretty good for Aussie prices.
And I'm like, I love the box, but there's no bar if you're
going to be able to get it. And then this turned up on
Marketplace for 55 bucks. Beautiful.
And I've always wanted to buy that bit.
It's unpunched. Oh wow.
So people who can't obviously can't see this interview, but
Martin's holding up the 4th edition Chaos Army supplement
which is the classic set which I proudly owned as well.
But Martin has an unpunched 1, so all the Chaos gift cards are
still on their card Spruce and all the spells are on their card
stock as on as well. So it.
Is unreal, complete with the oh wow.
That's awesome. Same with those before.
It's, yeah, I mean, I think this is actually an American one.
That's wild Baltimore, MD. Yep.
There. Yep.
There. Yeah.
So it's like, you know, the guy was selling it because it's like
art doesn't have the book. It's not complete.
And I'm like, OK, sure. Loving it, Loving it now.
That's great, mate. I'm glad you got that.
That's a beautiful set. I love that because I loved
Chaos. And during the 90s when I first
started, well after Hiles, it was a Chaos obsession and
getting the Chaos Armies book. That box set with all the cards
and everything, yeah, it was it. I think every teenager got into
chaos. I could be wrong, but I think
every, every teenager got into Chaos and fantasy or 40K.
Small model count. All the models are cool.
You've got to play with demons and they were the most, you
know, just wild, you know, army out there, so.
You know, like fascination. Yeah, it's it's metal as hell.
I mean, bolt throwing that song's about them, you know?
So that's it. Yeah, exactly, man.
Exactly. Yeah.
The allure was there, that's for sure.
The models are brilliant. I love all the 4th edition.
Yeah, just looking through that book.
I just love looking through it. All the classic models in 3rd
edition, lot of the 4th edition. All the Jess Goodwin, KAST
Champions. And then the Demons, Kev Adams,
Kev Adams. Pink Horrors, Blue Horrors, you
know, all those kind of things. And the plague bearers.
Yeah, right. You know, and I think that that
fun was still there as well at that point.
I mean, I was too young for Realms of Chaos era,
unfortunately, because I love the models and and those books
as well. Jeez, I've got to get my hands
on them one day. But there was still that, I
don't know, not necessarily silliness, but but it it was
chaotic. It was, you know, it.
It's not that random if everything.
It's just sort of, you know, angry and grim, dark, but you
know, having those wonderful bright colours and whatnot and
that silliness and you know, not to mention things like Trish
card and basement and whatnot as well.
You know, I I need an ostrich guy for a start, but bring it
on, you know, it's great. Yeah, I really love that year.
It was. It was only until I suppose
months later that I really got into fantasy for chaos, because
I really only started painting them or say a couple of years
ago. I I don't model here and there
that I liked, but I really wish when I was much younger that I'd
kind of rather than concentrating on on finishing
armies, just buying things that I love.
Because now some of those things are just so inaccessible, you
know, especially for being in Australia, just just the postage
on some things as well. So like, you can't really
justify it by killer. Kind of.
Fix knows all about that now mate.
Because you've been I've, I've haven't been living in the show
for 10 years but when? 10 years ago, it was great. eBay
was a great place, very friendly you know.
Postage was great too And now it's just I would hate to think
what it's like now. I've I've I've obviously seen
what it's like now. The postage is just gone through
the roof. It's just crazy, You know it.
It's actually more than what the thing you're buying for, you're
bidding on. It's like you're paying, paying
more, impose, you know. Yeah, yeah, it really is.
I mean you you just can't do it. And I sort of through through
COVID. I mean I I'd been painting a bit
here and there but when when COVID happened when lockdown
happened in 2020 we so so brief non hobby chat that was sort of
Maz my my partner and I we we're like 2020 is going to be our
year we're we're trying for a kid everything's going to be
good. We've got some savings.
Woo Hoo found out we were pregnant that January and it's
like, yeah 2020 woo. And then of course, you know in
March lockdown started and then Matt's lost her job at 8 months
pregnant as well. So we we became single income
through that and it's sort of, you know, it was it was very
tough times for everyone as a sort of I don't want screen
time. I wanted to do something with my
time. You know, I paint canvas and
whatnot as well, but I kind of wanted to do something for fun.
And it's like, wait, all my paints are still good?
Wait, I've still got all of those models.
I'm just going to do this. And you know, if I want to buy
more models, it has to be a bargain.
You know, I can't, you know, for the sake of the family, I can't
spend too much. So I started doing things like
Commission painting for friends, and they didn't have much cash
either. And it's like, oh, just, you
know, if you've got old models, I'll paint you new ones and then
give me some old ones. And that became a little bit of
AI mean. It's not really a business.
I've made very little cash and I only really want to do it when
I've got time. But for expanding my old Hammer
collection on a budget, it has been, you know, fantastic.
I wouldn't have been able to do this without sort of taking that
angle now And then also, you know, having some some very
generous friends as well. I think in 2021 I'd painted Wolf
about 40 or 50, guard some Armageddon steel agents and
tanks and stuff for a friend. And he's like, he sort of does
the same thing. Wheels and deals, buys stuff to
sell it on and keeps what he wants.
He's like, oh, I've got these these old things that are
sitting around. I'm never going to paint them.
Do you want them? It's like, oh, like what what do
you what have you got? And he he shows me a Rogue
Trader Land Raider and a Rogue Trader Chaos Dreadnought
complete with with Pointy Dong. He's like, yeah, you know, like
they they're yours if you want them.
And I'm like OK. Because.
I'm not, yeah. Road Trader Land Raider My God,
I hate to think how much they cost.
About 200 U.S. dollars or something.
Now if you want to buy. 1. Yeah, it's just insane, that
mate. So that's great.
It's a good deal, man. That's a good, that's a good
incentive, you know, paint to get acquire more models that you
want. That's a great idea.
I do it from time to time too. It's really nice and and people
appreciate your work because I know you're a prolific painter
and you have a ton of armies. You painted through the Cow
Bunga Painting challenges. We'll talk about that more in
just a moment. I think we might just go for a
quick break at break, guys. And when we come back, we'll
delve more into Martin's history and the armies that he's
collected and painted. And we can.
Yeah, we can talk about that in just a moment.
So we'll be back in just a SEC. Have you always dreamed of
having your old gangsters of armies professionally painted in
the style of the white dwarf battle reports of the 1990s?
Well, let me introduce you to Eddie LED Painting Studios Japan
as a professional painter with over 30 years experience in
having a short stint working at the Gameswish of Nottingham
Studio as a miniature painter in the mid 1990s.
I now work as a full time professional miniature painter
having the joy to turn your old love metal and plastic
miniatures into life with saturated colour and of course
with Goblin green bases. For inquiries, please contact me
via e-mail at evielead@gmail.com That's EAVYLE ad@gmail.com.
And please check out the links in the show description for my
Facebook gallery page. And I hope to hear from you soon
to start your dream project. So mate, now just before we get
into it, I want to say just a message to Doctor the Viking.
If he is listening to this, I hope he's doing well because
sadly he had to end the Cow Bunga challenge.
He's a really he's he was just amazing what what he did.
I mean yeah the amount of people who pulled together to do these
challenges and the output of just Gen. like communication he
had with on social media. The the the degree of like the
graphic design and everything he did.
I think he just did it through like Microsoft Word or something
like that. This is nuts.
I don't. Know how he did it, you know,
like his his output across multiple systems.
You know as well. But then also to be running the
challenge and and you know running his own content was
insane. You know, I guess you know
something he had to give and you know he's sort of had to bow out
hopefully just for the moment. I do hope he returns, you know,
and I have, I have actually been chatting to him recently.
I'd sort of, you know, reached out a couple of times and just
said, you know, whenever you're ready.
But you know, because we we all, especially through the, the
Cowabunga Painting challenge, I mean we've all become great
friends, you know, outside of stuff.
We'll send each other care packages across continents,
which is just so nice. And oh God, one of my favorite
ones was Michael Merck Jensen from from Denmark.
He had just said, hey, you know, like I think it was when I was
doing the Imperial Guard Army. So sort of the one that Khan
Effect saw then my 08/08. There's sort of the whole thing
I guess is a like 5 planet kind of regiments using stuff like
the Black Codex. What are they called?
The the conscripts as well, but using second edition and the
canyons. What was that?
Sorry. There's a penal legion as well.
Yeah, the Penal Legion. That's right.
Yeah. So, you know, you can give them
friends and whatnot. Good times.
The the the idea of black codex games is something that's come
up a few times and I certainly want to kind of have a go at
that. I've been considering the Wild
boys for the for the Hawks as well post this challenge
somewhere in the second which walks right now and I do have a
decent snake bite contingent in the wings but I haven't.
I haven't done as much and so as I would like to otherwise.
But anyway to to get back to the whole point of this I was doing
the guard at that point and Michael had said, oh you know,
like I can send you some stuff if you want.
I'm like, oh that'd be fantastic.
He's like, oh, you're doing chaos as well, right?
I'll, I'll check in some dragon bits and random parts and
whatnot. I opened up the yarnser package.
I've had a Krish Kardon zombie dragon minus the head for over
20 years that a friend gave me and it had the missing part that
had come from Denmark to finally complete that model.
Could not believe it, but you know, doing that kind of thing
for each other, because I know there's a lot of guys around
Virginia and the States as well. So watch my sis Dennis and John
and and Trevor. Those guys certainly will help
each other out as well, which is fantastic.
So having that, that very wide hockey family across across the
world is, you know, really does wonders.
It's and has certainly helped a lot of us finish projects that
otherwise would have just remained dreams for a very long
time. Yeah, that's great.
Yeah, so, yeah, so. Cheers to Doctor the Viking.
I hope everything's going well for you, mate.
Have you come back to that point?
And because a lot of people miss you, not just for the challenge,
but I think just to have you there, you know what I mean?
Like like I said. Like that was.
Amazing the quality of the the stuff he was making the
photography the design layout and everything looks so
professional so well polished and so and and like I said it
brought a lot of people together and you're still together like
you're gaming with you know Ben and I don't think Ben I think
sorry kind of fix and I think kind of fix is in the challenge
but you know Adrian was there and I think Mark was in the
challenge as well And yourself it brought you guys together
because you knew everybody through Oh well he lives in
Sydney. Oh, he lives in, you know what
have you. And then you all you guys got
together because of that challenge, which I think is
excellent, so. Yeah, it it is really wonderful
And you know, I want to thank all of those guys for for the
friendship over the years and regardless of the hobby stuff as
well, you know, we've all got to see each other a lot more And
it's, you know, it's been really wonderful because I think the
the hobby is the one thing that's sort of the the constant
between all of us because quite a few of us are from I suppose
quite different walks of life otherwise.
But it doesn't matter at all which is just fantastic and yeah
so thank thanks to the doctor as well he I did do a little
tribute for him as well with this this current challenge
which I don't know might have posted on on my Instagram.
But I did actually get one of the old walk pain boys and
painting up with the with the little pizza slice as well on
his on his little banapol bit there as well.
So Mad dot Cowabunga does feature in this walk army as
well in In the good Doctor's absence for the actual
challenge. But yeah, it's nice to be able
to do those kinds of things, definitely.
Well, the good thing I think at the end of that was it was
resurrected by other people in the community.
They they took the Banner poll and raised it high and you know
recruited more people for the challenge and now it's still
going and and out on our discord at the Crown of Command you can
see the results of people, you know, painting and showing the
work in progress and then seeing the updates on their blog.
So if anything it's great to see that people have, you know,
picked it up and started going with it because I know they, you
know, people felt passionate about it.
I think a lot of guys and a lot of Aussies too.
There's a lot of Aussies entering that.
It's really good to see. It always warms my heart when I
see lots of Australians involved in the tabletop community.
Because yeah, when we think about Australia and how sparsely
spread out big the major cities are, and then you look at other
countries like Europe and America and that kind of thing,
you would think they'll have much more high concentration of
gamers. But it always surprised me how
many Australians are involved with tabletop gaming, especially
Games Workshop, 90s games, you know?
Yeah, it's a really, really strong thing because even
outside of of the Discord community and and the Facebook
communities I've you know, whether it's through through
friends of my partner or just just randomly at parties or what
have you, the amount of people wear the touchstone or the the
the common interest has been hobby.
And then we start talking. It's like oh what do you play?
And so many even people who might have initially started
just getting into it for the first time but now are looking
back and going like oh, I love the saturated colours.
Oh, I love the you know the rules.
I love, you know the artwork of the time.
You know, it is aesthetically very different to now and part
of me does think that, you know, it's interesting to see people
who weren't into it, who weren't into it then.
It's not quite so much that nostalgia thing for them.
It is just an aesthetic preference, which is kind of
cool, you know. Obviously, you know, looking at
the artwork and looking at the work that went into things like
the photography and the sculpting and whatnot.
It is a lot, you know, and this is to to get away from my my
hobby chat and be more more sort of arty kind of chat.
But it's it's a lot more organic shape wise.
There's a feeling of the sculpt. You can look at something like a
Jazz Goodwin or a Trish Carden or Ellie Morrison and know who's
done it. Whereas I think you would be
quite challenged to do that now. But also I mean you would
probably know this as well. There was certainly a time in in
the sort of golden age where you could tell who painted them all
as well. And I love that, you know, it's
fantastic. It is a valid art form,
definitely. We we look now what how big
things are like the, you know, golden Demon now and things like
Las Vegas open, you know, out outside of our corner of the
hobby, just how much effort and just how much has changed the
quality of paint, the the brushes, the use of color
theory, all of this stuff. It's wonderful and so much of it
was still there back then. The sort of explore that through
that lens is something that certainly as a you know, as a
hobbyist personally has been a big motivation for me as well.
Yeah, good, man. That's great.
Now you are a very motivated individual because you've
painted quite a lot. Man.
I've seen you put a lot of stuff, not just 40K, with
fantasy as well. So let's go through your
collections. What exactly have you been
painting since COVID? It's like there must be OK, I
think the where do I even start? OK, since COVID is probably
that's a good time because I think that's where I've been
doing it consistently for a long time and making almost like a
daily thing because I do find it quite relaxing to paint.
Like I think I said said before, it's not screen time, you know,
you're you're giving yourself that time to enjoy and that's
something that I love. I suddenly became more painter
than a gamer. And yes, looking at the amount,
I think just before my son was born in the last week, I wasn't
sure how much time I would have to paint.
So I freaked out and I had bought a bunch of new Necrons
and I speed painted over 24 hours 64 models I think.
And I'm like that wasn't that wasn't as hard as I thought.
Obviously that was airbrushed and new models and whatnot kind
of thing, but it kind of inspired me.
So when I was like OK, well you know the very first challenge
was Blood Angels, second edition Blood Angels that were that were
my first first Imperial love anyway.
And when we. So the initial format of the
challenge I think for the very first year for the Cowabunga
Challenge was over six months. You've got 200 point blocks, the
five months, and then you've got a bonus month, which can also be
a sort of Mulligan month. So if you run out of time or you
know you just aren't inspired for that particular bit that
you've got left, or maybe you want to use that time to paint
extra models, then you can do that.
And because I've been so motivated by that initial
success, I just kept it up and then I started keeping a tally
just on my phone of how many models I'd paint and it became,
I can get a little bit competitive and it became a sort
of, OK, I'll see what I can paint this year and then I'll
beat that record. So I think the first year, so
the 2020, OK, this is going from memory, but I think I painted
about 187 models. Then the next year I painted 220
something. Then the next year was I think
well that was last year, that was a personal event and I
finally hit the more than a model a day.
I think I hit about 375. But I think since COVID and with
what I've painted now, I did some rough figures in my head.
I think I've painted about 1200 models.
That's a lot, yeah. And when I, you know, when I put
that together, I think Adrian and I from the challenge were
chatting about how much we've painted because he did a massive
walk army, which kind of effects sort of played against part of
two weeks ago. And I always thought, you know,
jeez, I'm never going to hit the amount of Adrian's condition.
It's like, no, no, you you smashed that.
And I was like, oh, did I? But that's the thing.
It's just for the love of, you know, I think the important
thing is I don't burn myself out.
If I'm not hungry for it, I'll leave it a bit and then I know
that I'll want to anyway. And also before COVID, I think
when I'd sort of been, I think, playing 7th edition 40 KA,
friend of my partner. Her husband is a commissioned
painter and he maintains that the best way to paint the most
amount of models is do it the laziest and then tidy everything
up as much as you want. So he taught me a lot about
airbrushing, which I don't always do for a free army, but
he taught me quite a lot. Max.
I'm very fortunate there because he does it just for money and
makes good coin each year doing it for people.
But I took a lot of that and then sort of adapted it to to my
wants and my, you know, I suppose, how I wanted to achieve
my hobby goals as well. So I think in that time I've got
a handful of handful of models from the Kelas Keep expansion of
Hero Quest to finish. But I've got that, the original
box and then Return of the Witch King finished, which I was very,
very happy with. And I actually really need to do
a photo shoot with those. Yeah, yeah.
But also, I mean, let's see, I'm, I'm looking at my my
cabinet right now, but I've got in 4th edition points.
I've got about 3 1/2 thousand point Chaos, army of warriors
and beasts and demons all mixed up, as it should be.
None of this, absolutely. I mean, how?
How is it chaotic if they're all the same troop type?
It's not chaos, but I think about four and a half thousand
points of 2nd edition 40K chaos. Can you tell them I metalhead?
I mean like there's quite a lot of chaos.
About 3000 points of undead for fantasy 4th edition again as
well. I just counted up.
I'm just shy of 3000 points of orcs and goblins of the same era
with some 5th edition stuff and a handful of I think the 6th or
7th edition knight goblins only because they were part of a big
lot. I I couldn't say no to about 150
goblins for the 300 Aussie bucks.
So as you do then 2 1/2 thousand 4th edition, What else?
2800 of Imperial Guards second edition, 3500 Blood Angels about
4000 of Eldar for 2nd edition and the vast majority so.
So anything fantasy I haven't really done.
Fantasy painting challenges the the the Crown of Command one is
one that I always intend to do but I get caught up with the
with the 2nd edition one, that's six months and then I sort of
go, oh, I'm just going to paint the stuff I want to paint Now
I'm like, oh, I've had this in the pile.
I think I've got about 60 half painted models and some shelves
next to me right now. But but after I've sort of
painted that many of one particular army, I'm I'm not
usually done. I'm still hungry but for
something else. So that's that's how I do it.
I try and keep like I'm not getting bored.
Like it's if I don't want to paint the models for the months
in a pledge, I will paint the next month's models instead and
trick myself into thinking that like, ha ha, I got to
procrastinate just like I always enjoy doing.
But really I've already just painted more models and then
I've got that spare time. It's like, oh, what else can I
paint, you know. So it's it's a good thing like
learning your if you do want to paint more and still be happy
with your, you know, your output, not just the amount but
quality, do something interesting.
So like, I think we're talking about color theory and the color
wheel and whatnot. So you know, when I want to do
more bright colors because I'm doing a lot of snake bites and
bad moons, it's like, OK, I'm going to learn how to paint
yellow better. Sounds silly, but, you know,
experimenting with things like pink or magenta undercoat or
maybe doing some undershading with an airbrush and then
looking at how pink and yellow work together.
Or maybe then doing like a purple base for for Orcskin just
on a couple of models here and there and it's like, Oh well,
I've got to finish it to make sure it works.
It's like, Oh well, I've finished that model now.
Oh, I'll try a different one, you know, And that's like, OK,
well, I've got, you know, 10 painted snake bites now.
And that was just a that wasn't a real thing.
That was just a test, you know, it's I don't know.
I I would love to hear from people if they have these things
where they they trick themselves into doing better.
As I should, as I should absolutely.
Motivation is a big, big part of it.
And I suppose the challenges create that motivation because
you have that sort of not not real pressure but then you have
that just that push to you know paint that 200 point block like
you say the slice of pizza for cowabunga or you know the call
of the call of the crown challenge might have you know
500 points or whatever it might be.
So but then I think once you're in it and you can see, you can
visualize. OK, well I've actually painted
this much already. I've painted one unit of of how
it is or I've painted one squad of Howling Banshees.
It's a propels you on to keep going and it's and I think out
of those challenges now I've. I know we're not the only
challenge out there and the Cow Bung isn't the only challenge
but I think they're really great inspiration or a source of
motivation for people who have struggled in the past to finish
things and complete things. And then when they have, like
you guys have, you've actually taken them to the club and
actually started playing with those models, which is even the
best thing, you know, that's the cherry and the cake, so to
speak. Exactly.
You know, like it's not just like you do it and that's like
you don't see the benefit. Like, I mean even if you fail
the challenge, the worst thing that happens is you've got 1/2
of a painted army that you planned and that is much more
than you would have had otherwise quite.
But it's also that thing of support as well.
You know, yes, people have gotten, you know, more models
through a challenge to add to it.
And I mean, that's great as well, But I'll definitely admit
to the fact that sometimes I have struggled with the choices
that I've made for going on. Maybe I've bitten more if I can
chew or love these models, but I'm just really not motivated to
paint these particular ones right now.
And we do, you know, cheer each other on or egg each other on
sometimes as well to do more as someone like Roger in the group
is very keen to do as well, where you know, you could paint
40 grit and he's like, where's the rest of the 2nd edition box?
You know that's but, you know, like it's it's it's funny.
It's good. And and even if you're just, you
know, part of the way through and you've got something like
Facebook chat or a Discord and being able to share work in
progress and go, oh, what do you guys think or what would you do
here? You can ask people who are, you
know, not necessarily even better painters but maybe people
who might have more experience or even just a different
experience Like if you're trying a new army maybe they've already
painted one. And I have some some tips that
might help you sort that out. Certainly things like with batch
painting as well, or maybe even what model, you know, what
colors to start off with for a basis as well to save yourself
time. There's lots of things like
that. I think that it doesn't matter
if I mean saying someone, saying they're a better painter than
someone. I don't think you should ever
compare yourself to anyone in your painting except for
yourself. Compare yourself to your old
work. And that's another way of really
staying motivated I find as well, because you can see that
journey. Like as I look across and and
see my display show, you know this is stuck in the last 12
months. Everything else is packed away,
so these rotate. But if I then get stuff out for
a game and go into my drawers and pick them out and put
together a list and I'll have the models there so I can kind
of visualize everything and go, wow, that was only a year ago
and now I can do this or or that was such a struggle.
But sometimes also you forget, like, you know, I I'm very in a
fortunate position where I have painted multiple armies.
I can go and look at something and go, that's how I did that.
I think I can actually probably apply that to this project as
well. And that's much better than what
I've been doing or it's much easier or faster.
Whatever I need, you know, I think not just for a sort of
like don't give yourself the sad from from looking at the best
painters and going, oh, I can't do that.
Look at what you've done in the past compared to now and say I
can do all of this. You know, it's a wonderful thing
to be able to do. I highly encourage everyone to
be able to do that, you know, especially when you're taking on
a new project as well. Do that just beforehand.
Look at what you've got and they go.
What do I really want to achieve here, you know?
Is there anything to learn from what I've already done?
Yep, That's very good advice. Thank you, man.
That's great, mate. Yeah, challenges can be very
daunting. Just painting an army can be
very daunting. You know, when you first look at
all those models, especially one of fantasy people coming back
into the old world now and they're thinking, oh, let's
start N Goblin army. Oh, that's great.
How many models do I need? Oh, just about 200, that's all.
That's a Beasley number, you know.
So yeah, having all those tricks and having the support there
from people to say, hey, you know, I did this, you know, so
many years ago, I think maybe as advice you should approach it
this way and I know can't can't affect is a prolific painter.
He does a lot of stuff with his 40K armies, painting those up as
you would have seen it the day that you were there in the Blue
Mountains. Now just just touching on that
particular games day that you were there for.
Now that was four of you, wasn't it?
Just four of you guys there playing on that day, Four was.
Playing second edition, Yeah, so this is.
A good time for kind of fix to jump in here, because kind of
fix what what, what actual armies were represented on the
day. It was Aux versus James like
Cult and Dark Angels versus Imperial Card.
Right, OK, so kind of X tell us about your game, how how did
your game go with was with Moody, wasn't it?
Yeah, so the Gene Sealer cult versus Orks pretty much like
fairly large armies either side. I took a very small amount of
Gene Sealers because I thought they'd be a bit wasted against
Orks. The Orks had massive firepower.
We played very conservatively. Neither army wanted to jump over
the sort of ruins and face each other off.
They sort of like sculpt around a bit.
It's very interesting, very close game, very fun.
But Martin's game went, and I'll let him talk about it, but his
his game went in a way that I didn't think it would.
It was very surprising. It's very fun.
Right. So Martin, you played, you
played in peer regard against Dark Angels, is that right?
I did, yes, yes. I was playing Marcellus macro
Dutch in all of the chats. He he runs A blog as well and
does some painting challenges himself.
Lovely, lovely fella. And he was using, yes, Dark
angels, which he's done. He's actually worked on them for
a couple of the painting challenges and seeing them in
person was unreal, you know, So good.
And yeah, I took out my it's from the third Cowabunga
challenge, my Awido 808. So running, you know, all
regimental setups, you know, as the good book says, so you know,
for for every basic or every weapons squad, you know, then
you've got your auxiliary choices, you've got your command
structure and whatnot. It's my very first time playing
guard as opposed to sort of testing on a table.
And I played Guard in other editions, but this was my first
chance to actually use this particular challenge army in
second edition, against another person from the challenge.
So it was very exciting. Awesome.
Yeah, it was probably. So we shared pictures I think in
the various chats of of what we were all using, because we're
all chums and there's no need for hidden lists or anything
like that. I think I'd kind of tried to go
well. We all kind of went very
WYSIWYG. So what you see is what you get
just to make it nice and simple. And that's kind of how we paint
in the challenges anyway. You know, like we don't give
each other War Gear cards, give the characters War Gear cards
unless it's represented on the model.
It's just the thing that's always been there, and I quite,
quite like it anyway. But in this case, Mark had gone
very elite in his choices, so he had the Death Wing.
Terminator is a land radar which was just absolutely pristine and
stunning tactical squad and Asma die as the commander I believe
so the interrogated chaplain and oh and of course the tech marine
right next to the whirlwind as well.
So whirlwind against God, you know you're you're asking for
trouble and I tried to go very fluffy.
So I think in that space I had two or three infantry units, the
the three heavy weapons teams sort of as one choice I think 2
command units and then the command HQ and then I think an
Imperial Guard, Demolisher, A Basilisk and a Hell Hound.
So it was quite evenly balanced. I thought until I started
reading about the Barrage rules, where for those of you who might
not have played with or against Guard for a long time, it was
only the one. Yeah, because Demolishers don't
do it. It's only the Basilisk.
But for every Basilisk, Lehman, Ross, Battle, Tank, and Griffin,
you've got a chance of being able to have shots at the start
of the game. And then depending if you've got
Comm links, which I did, you've got a chance of doing one at the
start of your time as well And boy did I make some rolls
because so the game started off with with the the Land Raider
rolling out and looking you know toughest guts and and shooting
everything up and unfortunately not penetrating the Demolisher.
By one or two points. Each time it kept hitting the
turret, which is like I think one of the highest armor values
in second edition for any vehicle.
I think it's like 25 or something like that.
On the front. It's actually, it's more than a
Land Raider, which stunned me. I actually didn't realize that
at the time. Yeah, yeah, it's a few, a few
interesting little things like that.
Because like I said, you know, I've read the books obviously in
in preparation, but I've never played the army in the edition.
I've had the books for years. And anyway, yeah, the, the, the
dice, as I think I'd mentioned before were Mark must have like
kicked the witch or something on the way there.
I don't know yeah yeah yeah yeah.
Walked under a black cat and had a had a ladder walk in front of
him something like that. I don't know because yeah there
were there were some like you know of course the the the
age-old thing of oh it'll be fine just don't roll A1.
There were a lot of ones when when they mattered and then
there were a lot of sticks when it mattered for me.
So I think after the land raid rolled out, had Asmadai in it
with the, you know with I suppose plasma gun section with
the veteran Sergeant for the tactical squad.
It then got penetrated by a heavy plasma cannon at maximum
power. Then everything got hit by a
heavy flame. I let all the crew essentially
because it burst into flames. They got out and then the next
barrage I think took out all but one of them.
I think at the start of my next turn it just got a bit
ridiculous, I think by the end of it.
So I had taken hold and I used that the Mad dot Cowabunga as
the encounter, bearing in mind we were.
We'd all met through the Cowabunga Challenge and I think
it was engage and destroy for Mark, but in the end I think the
only model was a lightning or death wing Terminator that was
left. I think I've never, I don't
think I've ever even in like battle reports.
You know even your one's post post the white dwarf years for
for 2nd edition era. I don't think I've seen God go
that well. Yeah, I completely, completely
admit that it was not me being tactical, it was, you know, it
was the luck of the dice 100%. But the fact that you could see
that, you know, it's interesting like nowadays with with you know
current editions there's always talk of matter and whatnot and
and I'm sure it existed, you know back then for tournaments
but I was too young for them at that point and certainly I I
think some of the it'd be interesting to see some of those
relics, you know where people take as many tech marines with
jump packs and vortex grenades as possible kind of thing.
I've heard that is a thing you know for for a probably beardy
list. But yeah, no one really does
that. It really was just luck at the
dice. But now it's wonderful because
we've we've been friends for so many years.
We finally had that game and I've watched that that Dark
Angels army grow in the same way that that Marx watched that
Imperial Guard army grow. But now it's got beef, it's got
history and we're keen for another game, you know, that's
that's, you know, influenced how it's going to go next time.
You know, I love that. You really love that feeling,
you know, and I'm sure that certainly with the the battle
reports that you've done as well, Josh, you know it was some
of your regular opponents. I'm sure you guys have that as
well now and it's it's time to come across, especially with the
new formats for the battle reports, which I love by the
way. You know, being able to see that
kind of stuff and and know that that's the kind of games that
that I have and that I enjoy as well, really wins my heart.
I absolutely love it. That's wonderful mate.
That's great. Now I'm glad that you and Ben,
sorry you and Khan FX and the other guys connected.
So Mark and Moody, I'm really happy to see that and I hope
that continues and I hope that eventually grows into more
people connecting with you guys through Facebook or through
Discord or whatever and getting together and and you know coming
along and playing games with you guys because that's really the
aim of what we're doing. The Crown of Command is
connecting people together and, you know, sharing the same hobby
we all love and being part of these painting challenges and
getting their models on the table painted, of course.
So Martin from From Myself and Carne Effects, thank you very
much for being a guest on the Crown of Command.
It's been a pleasure to talk to you, Sir, and continue painting
those wonderful armies of yours. Thank you so much, Josh and
carne effects as well, really, really appreciate it.
Had a had a great time chatting. We'll definitely have to do it
again sometime. Absolutely.
And I I definitely want to see photos of you guys playing games
very soon. Yes.
Sure. We will definitely line some up
con effects and I will definitely have to have a chat
about that after this and and sort it out for sure.
Maybe we can take two Tyranid armies versus yourself and
Adrian, I think, because yeah, he's got, he's got needs.
Yeah, yeah, Mark has knits. They are beautiful, like
wonderful bright colours, but also some of the armour cast
part and variants as well, which are awesome.
I can't wait to see them in person, I don't think I've ever
had the displeasure of playing against them but but I'm keen to
see. You know, now that I've had a
taste of what hot plasma can do against some of the biggest
models in the game. You know, bring it on.
All right, guys. Well, thank you so much again.
Take care everybody, and we'll catch you again next time.
Thank you. Thanks so much everyone.
Thanks for having me catch you next time.
See you, buddy.