1 00:00:08,960 --> 00:00:12,320 Welcome to the APM podcast. APM is the chartered body for 2 00:00:12,320 --> 00:00:15,400 the project profession. My name is Emma Devita and I'm 3 00:00:15,400 --> 00:00:18,480 the editor of Project APM's course free journal and your 4 00:00:18,480 --> 00:00:21,520 host. In this podcast, I go behind the 5 00:00:21,520 --> 00:00:25,080 scenes at London's Natural History Museum, which is an APM 6 00:00:25,080 --> 00:00:29,280 corporate partner. The museum celebrates its 150th 7 00:00:29,280 --> 00:00:33,560 anniversary in 2031 and has kicked off a celebratory project 8 00:00:33,560 --> 00:00:36,400 programme that includes the creation of 6 new permanent 9 00:00:36,400 --> 00:00:39,200 galleries within the iconic building in South Kensington. 10 00:00:39,840 --> 00:00:42,320 The first gallery has already opened and that's where I 11 00:00:42,320 --> 00:00:44,760 headed. It's called Fixing Our Broken 12 00:00:44,760 --> 00:00:47,960 Planet and focuses on the planetary emergency and the 13 00:00:47,960 --> 00:00:50,600 solutions that scientists, including those at the Natural 14 00:00:50,600 --> 00:00:54,920 History Museum, are working on. It started life as a temporary 15 00:00:54,920 --> 00:00:59,280 exhibition that opened in 2021, but it was so successful it was 16 00:00:59,280 --> 00:01:01,680 decided a permanent home should be made for it. 17 00:01:02,400 --> 00:01:05,280 It subsequently became the kick off project for the Natural 18 00:01:05,280 --> 00:01:07,840 History Museum 150 Years Programme. 19 00:01:08,840 --> 00:01:11,760 As you might imagine, being a programme or project manager at 20 00:01:11,760 --> 00:01:14,480 the Natural History Museum, surrounded by dinosaurs, 21 00:01:14,480 --> 00:01:18,240 precious gems and taxidermied animals draws not only on strong 22 00:01:18,240 --> 00:01:21,760 project management skills but the ability to speak to all 23 00:01:21,760 --> 00:01:25,200 kinds of different stakeholders to get them on board, engaged 24 00:01:25,200 --> 00:01:27,320 and committed to a vision of what can be. 25 00:01:27,760 --> 00:01:30,360 Come with me to visit the gallery mid morning during the 26 00:01:30,360 --> 00:01:33,440 school summer holidays to get a sense of what's there. 27 00:01:38,720 --> 00:01:41,760 Samantha Bannister, who project managed the design of the 28 00:01:41,760 --> 00:01:44,480 exhibition, shows me around the rooms that shows off the 29 00:01:44,480 --> 00:01:47,600 architecture of the original building, which was completed 30 00:01:47,600 --> 00:01:50,840 back in 1881. The exhibition opened at the 31 00:01:50,840 --> 00:01:53,920 beginning of April and they're expecting to reach 1,000,000 32 00:01:53,920 --> 00:01:58,480 visitors by August. Yes, one of the whole sort of 33 00:01:58,520 --> 00:02:02,120 principles of this gallery, we've got a public span 34 00:02:02,120 --> 00:02:06,000 principle of showing off the architecture of of the building 35 00:02:06,360 --> 00:02:08,479 and bringing more daylight into our galleries. 36 00:02:08,680 --> 00:02:12,680 But the gallery itself was designed to be quite reductive 37 00:02:12,680 --> 00:02:16,360 because the whole sort of the premise of the galleries around 38 00:02:16,520 --> 00:02:20,320 highlighting the climate crisis. And so we didn't want to build 39 00:02:20,320 --> 00:02:23,080 anything unnecessarily. So. 40 00:02:23,320 --> 00:02:26,840 The design is quite reduced. We've just got showcases, we've 41 00:02:26,840 --> 00:02:29,520 just got the flints and the necessary graphics to explain 42 00:02:29,520 --> 00:02:32,080 what's going on. So yeah, there is a sort of an 43 00:02:32,080 --> 00:02:37,040 open, open plan feel to the gallery to reduce that use of 44 00:02:37,040 --> 00:02:41,320 unnecessary material. The NHM declared a planetary 45 00:02:41,320 --> 00:02:46,360 emergency and this is our sort of first physical exhibition at 46 00:02:46,360 --> 00:02:49,840 the South Kensington site, which sort of brings that to the fore. 47 00:02:50,080 --> 00:02:54,560 It displays scientists behind the scenes the work that they 48 00:02:54,560 --> 00:02:58,840 are doing to help to find solutions for the climate 49 00:02:58,880 --> 00:03:01,440 emergency. So we're looking at Specimen 50 00:03:01,440 --> 00:03:08,440 Solution Scientists Society as a sort of encompassing directive 51 00:03:08,440 --> 00:03:11,760 for the the exhibition. So it's meant to show you what 52 00:03:11,760 --> 00:03:15,920 the issues are, but bring you hope that solutions can be found 53 00:03:16,080 --> 00:03:20,480 and help you to take some actions away yourself to help to 54 00:03:20,480 --> 00:03:21,800 counter the planet. Treatment. 55 00:03:22,840 --> 00:03:25,600 The first exhibit I face is a huge Marlin. 56 00:03:26,240 --> 00:03:30,080 So this is a Marlin. So this is showing how 57 00:03:30,080 --> 00:03:34,880 overfishing of our seas can deplete our apex predators in 58 00:03:34,880 --> 00:03:38,920 our seas and that can affect the, the ecosystem of our our 59 00:03:38,920 --> 00:03:40,960 seas. So they're looking at the the 60 00:03:40,960 --> 00:03:46,080 DNA of this of this Marlin to understand how chemical makeup 61 00:03:46,080 --> 00:03:50,040 and specimen can help us to develop the solution for a 62 00:03:50,040 --> 00:03:53,480 healthier planet. I asked Samantha what her 63 00:03:53,480 --> 00:03:58,520 involvement in the project was. So I was the project manager for 64 00:03:58,520 --> 00:04:01,240 the, the sort of the exhibition development. 65 00:04:01,240 --> 00:04:05,800 So from deciding the scope of the project, developing the 66 00:04:05,800 --> 00:04:09,280 design, the 3D, the 2D design, the lighting design, the 67 00:04:09,760 --> 00:04:13,560 specimen selection, the narrative of of the exhibition, 68 00:04:13,720 --> 00:04:16,480 and then ultimately the installation of everything 69 00:04:16,480 --> 00:04:19,079 that's. In here alongside Sherry Louise 70 00:04:20,160 --> 00:04:22,960 with the the installation. So it was a two year programme 71 00:04:22,960 --> 00:04:27,280 from start to finish. And I think walking around it 72 00:04:27,280 --> 00:04:30,280 looks exactly how we envisioned it. 73 00:04:30,280 --> 00:04:33,920 Like there it it completely looks like the design that we 74 00:04:33,920 --> 00:04:37,280 were working through. We had a fly through created 75 00:04:37,280 --> 00:04:40,960 that sort of showed the space as it is and it is it's literally 76 00:04:40,960 --> 00:04:44,640 as it was on paper. So that's very nice to, to see 77 00:04:44,640 --> 00:04:48,400 that sort of the to be realised, especially with all sort of the, 78 00:04:49,000 --> 00:04:54,800 the sustainability of the sort of materials being at the fore 79 00:04:54,800 --> 00:04:58,160 and actually seeing that realised is and it's nice to see 80 00:04:58,160 --> 00:05:03,960 people walking around it. We were in here maybe 30 people 81 00:05:04,400 --> 00:05:07,720 at a time installing it and it felt very, very sparse. 82 00:05:08,040 --> 00:05:10,400 And then within the 1st 15 minutes of it opening, we had 83 00:05:10,400 --> 00:05:14,320 200 people come through the door and it's it's just not stopped. 84 00:05:14,320 --> 00:05:18,040 It's just great to see people engaging with these stories. 85 00:05:19,640 --> 00:05:21,880 What was one of the biggest challenges of putting the 86 00:05:21,880 --> 00:05:26,040 exhibition together? I guess the the really large 87 00:05:26,040 --> 00:05:28,800 specimens here. So we got the Marlin and and the 88 00:05:28,800 --> 00:05:34,400 bison over in the corner there. And in order to get the cases 89 00:05:34,400 --> 00:05:38,520 in, for example, they had to be manufactured in a way that 90 00:05:38,800 --> 00:05:42,520 they're sort of demountable. So we could bring everything in 91 00:05:42,520 --> 00:05:46,480 in pieces and assemble them here and ensuring that we could sort 92 00:05:46,480 --> 00:05:49,280 of get the specimens into those cases. 93 00:05:49,800 --> 00:05:53,880 Everything in the gallery has had conservation work done to it 94 00:05:53,880 --> 00:05:56,160 before it goes on display. So we have an in house 95 00:05:56,160 --> 00:06:01,400 conservation team who do any remedial works to the specimens 96 00:06:01,400 --> 00:06:04,840 before they go on display. So everything to make them 97 00:06:04,840 --> 00:06:06,320 display. Were they? 98 00:06:06,360 --> 00:06:07,080 Why have we? Got. 99 00:06:08,400 --> 00:06:11,840 Bison. This is about the rewilding of 100 00:06:11,840 --> 00:06:15,720 bison into. I think it's into the to the UK 101 00:06:15,720 --> 00:06:20,600 basically they help with by grazing, they help to to lock in 102 00:06:20,720 --> 00:06:24,920 carbon and so yeah, so they're sort of a natural carbon thing. 103 00:06:25,880 --> 00:06:29,560 The exhibition doesn't intend only to educate, but to provoke 104 00:06:29,560 --> 00:06:33,400 conversation. These in screens in the centre 105 00:06:33,400 --> 00:06:36,680 here by the seating are our conversation starters where 106 00:06:36,680 --> 00:06:40,800 people are asked questions and then we sort of like a poll. 107 00:06:40,800 --> 00:06:46,160 Do you think, for example, that we should continue to deep sea 108 00:06:46,160 --> 00:06:49,240 mine in order to find the necessary minerals for batteries 109 00:06:49,240 --> 00:06:52,600 or should we not be allowed to to do that? 110 00:06:52,600 --> 00:06:56,400 And then we can gather that data and use that to sort of 111 00:06:56,680 --> 00:07:01,360 understand how what society is thinking about these these 112 00:07:01,360 --> 00:07:03,520 issues. And that will be used by 113 00:07:04,120 --> 00:07:06,960 different departments across the museum. 114 00:07:06,960 --> 00:07:11,240 So we've got our learning teams, our digital teams, our policy 115 00:07:11,240 --> 00:07:14,520 makers. Yeah, so it's stated that all 116 00:07:14,600 --> 00:07:16,840 help. Drive all of that. 117 00:07:17,440 --> 00:07:24,920 These are our film booths, and this one is specifically by a 118 00:07:24,920 --> 00:07:28,240 Nook winner, a Natural Environmental Research Council 119 00:07:28,320 --> 00:07:33,680 winner, and they give awards for scientific research that looks 120 00:07:33,680 --> 00:07:38,240 into environmental issues. And so we've got three around 121 00:07:38,240 --> 00:07:42,040 the gallery. So they're sort of scientists in 122 00:07:42,040 --> 00:07:47,600 conversation with everyday people that are doing things to 123 00:07:47,640 --> 00:07:52,120 to help the environment. I asked Samantha how she got to 124 00:07:52,120 --> 00:07:56,280 where she has. So I've been here for 10 years, 125 00:07:56,840 --> 00:07:59,360 always been in the project office that started in a sort of 126 00:07:59,360 --> 00:08:01,600 support role in the first instance. 127 00:08:01,920 --> 00:08:05,760 So I've been a project manager for delivering this level of 128 00:08:05,760 --> 00:08:08,360 exhibition for about two years now. 129 00:08:09,880 --> 00:08:14,600 I think at the museum we're we're looking to have more sort 130 00:08:14,600 --> 00:08:18,360 of engagement with the science that we do behind the scenes. 131 00:08:18,360 --> 00:08:23,160 So galleries now are sort of trying to showcase that a lot, a 132 00:08:23,160 --> 00:08:26,560 lot more, make people understand that the things that they're 133 00:08:26,560 --> 00:08:29,960 seeing on display are things that scientists that at this 134 00:08:29,960 --> 00:08:33,600 institution are working on. Be that in the dinosaurs 135 00:08:33,600 --> 00:08:39,320 gallery, be that in this sort of climate action kind of space, 136 00:08:40,000 --> 00:08:42,799 people are working everyday with these collections. 137 00:08:43,640 --> 00:08:46,200 They're doing scientific research with them. 138 00:08:47,280 --> 00:08:50,040 Yeah. So it's a lot less passive in 139 00:08:50,040 --> 00:08:55,640 terms of you just sort of see, see a dinosaur in the gallery. 140 00:08:55,640 --> 00:09:00,280 You can understand who the people behind the research 141 00:09:00,280 --> 00:09:03,040 that's been done with. That is why it's in our 142 00:09:03,040 --> 00:09:07,920 collection versus somewhere else less sort of stuffy and more 143 00:09:07,920 --> 00:09:11,680 sort of this is a living breathing organisation that does 144 00:09:11,680 --> 00:09:16,320 a lot of cutting edge research into into things you meant to 145 00:09:16,320 --> 00:09:21,120 leave with, with hope as you as you leave that there are things 146 00:09:21,120 --> 00:09:25,160 that you as an individual can do in your everyday life to help 147 00:09:25,760 --> 00:09:29,800 with the the climate emergency. You don't have to be a scientist 148 00:09:29,800 --> 00:09:34,360 that's researching you as a as a person can do small things 149 00:09:34,360 --> 00:09:38,800 within within your life, within your everyday life that will 150 00:09:38,800 --> 00:09:44,280 help with the climate emergency. I leave the gallery, walk 151 00:09:44,280 --> 00:09:46,960 through the earthquake section of the museum and then through a 152 00:09:46,960 --> 00:09:50,280 discreet door into the project office, where I sit down with 153 00:09:50,280 --> 00:09:53,800 Meg McDonald, programme manager for Fixing Our Broken Planet. 154 00:09:53,880 --> 00:09:56,880 It gives me the bigger picture, but first I ask her how 155 00:09:56,880 --> 00:09:59,480 seriously the museum takes project management. 156 00:10:00,360 --> 00:10:02,560 More and more seriously as time goes on. 157 00:10:02,560 --> 00:10:05,920 So when I first started, we were a relatively small group. 158 00:10:06,400 --> 00:10:11,720 There was a push to sort of form a project management office that 159 00:10:11,720 --> 00:10:14,680 lasted for about 5 years. And then we sort of changed TAP. 160 00:10:15,040 --> 00:10:19,200 There are now sort of 30 project managers and project support 161 00:10:19,200 --> 00:10:23,400 staff and admin, whereas we were a much smaller team back in the 162 00:10:23,400 --> 00:10:25,000 day. And when with the projects that 163 00:10:25,000 --> 00:10:33,080 we do, we're really one of three strands, 3 core teams. 164 00:10:33,440 --> 00:10:36,960 So it is at the heart of so much of what we do in terms of 165 00:10:36,960 --> 00:10:39,040 exhibitions, building works and everything else. 166 00:10:39,040 --> 00:10:43,400 So it is, it has grown, it's sort of the stature and 167 00:10:43,400 --> 00:10:47,000 importance, but it's always kind of been at the heart driving 168 00:10:47,000 --> 00:10:51,240 these exhibitions and galleries forward previously and in other 169 00:10:51,240 --> 00:10:55,360 museums still you might find that there are more curator LED 170 00:10:55,960 --> 00:10:59,880 exhibitions and galleries and it's more LED sort of by the 171 00:10:59,880 --> 00:11:03,120 content side. But there is obviously an 172 00:11:03,120 --> 00:11:07,480 increasing, it always was. But now particularly with giant 173 00:11:07,480 --> 00:11:10,800 master plans and refurbishments, there's a lot of construction 174 00:11:10,800 --> 00:11:13,080 work. And around that construction 175 00:11:13,080 --> 00:11:15,240 work comes a lot of coordination, a lot of 176 00:11:15,240 --> 00:11:22,240 stakeholder management and a lot of kind of regulatory aspects 177 00:11:22,240 --> 00:11:24,080 that need to be considered and adhered to. 178 00:11:24,720 --> 00:11:29,240 So having someone sort of be at the centre of that, you know, I 179 00:11:29,240 --> 00:11:33,680 always kind of like in PMS to a conductor, we're not playing any 180 00:11:33,680 --> 00:11:36,960 of the instruments, but we're at the core to make sure we're 181 00:11:36,960 --> 00:11:38,800 bringing in everything at the right time. 182 00:11:38,880 --> 00:11:40,480 We're giving everybody their cues. 183 00:11:41,000 --> 00:11:45,560 And I think that having that role in place and making it at 184 00:11:45,720 --> 00:11:49,040 the heart of the project really increases chances of sort of 185 00:11:49,040 --> 00:11:53,440 delivering on time and delivering to sort of the scope 186 00:11:53,440 --> 00:11:56,920 that you'd set out to. It also helps you along the way 187 00:11:56,920 --> 00:11:58,600 make sure that you're talking to the right people. 188 00:11:58,600 --> 00:12:03,080 This is a huge partially visitor facing, partially scientific 189 00:12:03,080 --> 00:12:06,680 institution. And in any number of the 190 00:12:06,680 --> 00:12:08,920 projects, whether you're looking at something that Sophie does, 191 00:12:08,920 --> 00:12:11,360 which has to do with the building itself or any of the 192 00:12:11,360 --> 00:12:13,640 building's project managers, or whether you're looking at 193 00:12:13,640 --> 00:12:17,040 galleries and exhibitions, there's a certain amount of 194 00:12:17,040 --> 00:12:19,240 stakeholders that will always be involved. 195 00:12:19,720 --> 00:12:22,040 And when we tell people about all the people who we talk to 196 00:12:22,040 --> 00:12:25,720 and sort of list them off endlessly, people are often 197 00:12:25,720 --> 00:12:27,120 shocked. You know, they, they have their 198 00:12:27,120 --> 00:12:29,160 own sort of little view of what they're doing. 199 00:12:29,160 --> 00:12:31,200 And when they see the whole picture, they realise how 200 00:12:31,200 --> 00:12:34,920 important it is to have someone, essentially how important it is 201 00:12:34,920 --> 00:12:37,800 for someone to have the big picture in their mind so that 202 00:12:37,800 --> 00:12:40,760 the people who are delivering work packages can just focus on 203 00:12:40,760 --> 00:12:44,240 their specialties. As I previously mentioned, the 204 00:12:44,240 --> 00:12:48,840 Fixing Our Broken Planet or FOBP gallery started as a temporary 205 00:12:48,840 --> 00:12:51,520 exhibition led by Meg during the COVID lockdowns. 206 00:12:52,280 --> 00:12:56,560 It was open for about 10 months I think and we phased the build 207 00:12:56,560 --> 00:12:59,720 of it, which was a a real testament to how quickly we 208 00:12:59,720 --> 00:13:01,200 moved. So we opened one section. 209 00:13:01,200 --> 00:13:05,320 The first section was food and then we moved on to materials 210 00:13:05,320 --> 00:13:07,360 and then energy. It only had three sections. 211 00:13:07,360 --> 00:13:10,520 Then we've added the the 4th for the permanent gallery. 212 00:13:11,080 --> 00:13:13,840 But it was really hugely successful in ways that I think 213 00:13:13,840 --> 00:13:16,280 that we didn't necessarily foresee. 214 00:13:16,600 --> 00:13:19,440 It had about a million people through it and it's a free 215 00:13:19,440 --> 00:13:22,080 exhibition and it was on for a certain length of time. 216 00:13:22,080 --> 00:13:24,960 So that in and of itself isn't too surprising. 217 00:13:24,960 --> 00:13:28,920 But we found that there was a lot of interest from 218 00:13:29,640 --> 00:13:33,480 policymakers and change makers and we had sort of Greta 219 00:13:33,480 --> 00:13:35,680 Thunberg was in there being interviewed. 220 00:13:35,680 --> 00:13:39,600 And you know, we found there was this whole other audience in 221 00:13:39,600 --> 00:13:42,480 terms of policy makers and change makers that we always had 222 00:13:42,480 --> 00:13:46,320 links with, but who were interested in that and who 223 00:13:46,320 --> 00:13:48,760 wanted to come to that and wanted to see it. 224 00:13:49,400 --> 00:13:51,720 There's also another part of it where it was the first time 225 00:13:51,720 --> 00:13:56,760 where we'd really spotlit our scientists work. 226 00:13:57,360 --> 00:14:00,800 You know, it's the the permanent gallery is following the same 227 00:14:00,800 --> 00:14:03,480 formula in some ways as that temporary exhibition where you 228 00:14:03,480 --> 00:14:08,280 have the specimen, the science, that the scientist that's doing 229 00:14:08,280 --> 00:14:11,920 the science, a picture of that scientist in a quote. 230 00:14:12,320 --> 00:14:14,320 And we found that people really reacted to that. 231 00:14:14,320 --> 00:14:17,200 And it's like we found our voice when it came to the planetary 232 00:14:17,200 --> 00:14:22,040 emergency and that we found that people really trusted the 233 00:14:22,040 --> 00:14:26,480 scientists more than they trust this institution as a whole. 234 00:14:26,480 --> 00:14:31,200 It was the person to person dialogue that seemed to be the 235 00:14:31,200 --> 00:14:34,880 thing that really got people interested, engage and sort of 236 00:14:34,880 --> 00:14:36,840 trusted the information that they were getting. 237 00:14:37,440 --> 00:14:40,680 We named it Our Broken Planet, how we got here and ways to fix 238 00:14:40,680 --> 00:14:44,360 it because we wanted to make sure, you know, the temporary 239 00:14:44,360 --> 00:14:46,840 exhibition, you have the name and sort of the tag, you know, a 240 00:14:46,920 --> 00:14:49,400 subtitle. We wanted to make sure that we 241 00:14:49,400 --> 00:14:53,960 were selling that idea of of that there's hope. 242 00:14:53,960 --> 00:14:55,600 Like here's the work that's happening. 243 00:14:55,600 --> 00:14:59,080 People are trying to fix this and here's ways you can fix it. 244 00:14:59,600 --> 00:15:02,920 And it's really important to us that people left with a sense of 245 00:15:02,920 --> 00:15:07,680 hope because there's some really hard hitting, really hard to 246 00:15:07,680 --> 00:15:13,800 take facts that we give and in order to not make everybody 247 00:15:13,800 --> 00:15:16,200 despondent, walk out there being like, well, that's it. 248 00:15:16,200 --> 00:15:18,240 As you say, we're screwed. We can't do anything about it. 249 00:15:19,160 --> 00:15:21,280 It would that would be a failure on our part. 250 00:15:21,280 --> 00:15:24,920 What we want to do is make people understand that they can 251 00:15:24,920 --> 00:15:28,960 do things to help. And that's how the name sort of 252 00:15:28,960 --> 00:15:31,080 changed into fixing our broken planet. 253 00:15:31,440 --> 00:15:35,440 We needed something that was shorter but still kept still 254 00:15:35,440 --> 00:15:38,440 kept conveyed. The the seriousness of the 255 00:15:38,440 --> 00:15:41,560 situation is that we do have a broken relationship with nature. 256 00:15:41,560 --> 00:15:43,800 We didn't want to shy away from that. 257 00:15:44,520 --> 00:15:47,320 But putting the fixing in, it's like there is ways to do this. 258 00:15:47,320 --> 00:15:50,640 We can do this. All hope is not thought so our 259 00:15:50,640 --> 00:15:53,440 out of the kind of temporary exhibition and out of the 260 00:15:53,720 --> 00:15:58,120 everything that we've learned. It was decided that this because 261 00:15:58,120 --> 00:16:02,240 the museum has a strategy to 2031 to make advocates from for 262 00:16:02,240 --> 00:16:06,160 the planet, you know, to make a place where both people and 263 00:16:06,160 --> 00:16:09,680 nature thrive. It was decided that we would 264 00:16:09,800 --> 00:16:12,800 create this into a longer term offer. 265 00:16:14,120 --> 00:16:17,840 Doing the work to the gallery had been on the table for a lot 266 00:16:17,840 --> 00:16:19,960 longer before that decision had been made. 267 00:16:20,160 --> 00:16:22,720 They talked about different things that could go in that 268 00:16:22,720 --> 00:16:25,960 gallery, different types of of exhibitions. 269 00:16:27,000 --> 00:16:29,640 And then when they landed on sort of that as a, as a lovely 270 00:16:29,640 --> 00:16:31,720 space for fixing our broken planet. 271 00:16:32,360 --> 00:16:38,120 But also there was sort of side stuff that was happening, side 272 00:16:38,120 --> 00:16:40,200 programming that was happening while we were in lockdown, 273 00:16:40,200 --> 00:16:42,600 mainly online because that's the only way that you could do it. 274 00:16:43,000 --> 00:16:47,520 We had some audience engagement events that were online. 275 00:16:47,880 --> 00:16:50,320 And then this meant that we weren't just keeping it to South 276 00:16:50,320 --> 00:16:52,840 Kensington either. It wasn't South Kensington 277 00:16:52,840 --> 00:16:54,320 centric, it wasn't London centric. 278 00:16:54,880 --> 00:16:57,560 We could invite the nation and indeed people from around the 279 00:16:57,560 --> 00:17:02,720 globe to take part in these discussions or watch people who 280 00:17:02,720 --> 00:17:09,200 were activists or climate influencers speak on various 281 00:17:09,800 --> 00:17:13,400 related topics. You know, they had, we had one 282 00:17:13,400 --> 00:17:17,119 that had Jane Fonda speaking to a young activist and those 283 00:17:17,200 --> 00:17:22,240 proved to be incredibly effective at sort of maximising 284 00:17:22,240 --> 00:17:25,520 the reach of everything, getting that messaging out really far. 285 00:17:26,400 --> 00:17:31,760 I think the NHM 150 programme was sort of developed while we 286 00:17:31,760 --> 00:17:36,400 were already putting Fixing Our Broken Planet in, but Fixing Our 287 00:17:36,400 --> 00:17:40,560 Broken Planet being the 1st permanent gallery that we'd put 288 00:17:40,560 --> 00:17:45,840 in since 2016 when we opened the main hall, it seems like the 289 00:17:45,840 --> 00:17:48,120 perfect place to launch that front. 290 00:17:48,160 --> 00:17:52,160 Make that the first of those. Originally we started with an 291 00:17:52,160 --> 00:17:56,160 idea that the Fixing Our Broken Planet gallery in that space 292 00:17:56,160 --> 00:17:58,120 would only be sort of three to five years. 293 00:17:58,640 --> 00:18:04,240 But given the importance of the topic, we and our ongoing sort 294 00:18:04,240 --> 00:18:07,920 of strategy, that was when it was the decision was taken to 295 00:18:07,920 --> 00:18:10,560 make it the 10 year and then position it as the first of the 296 00:18:10,560 --> 00:18:13,960 NHM 150. And the NHM 150 has grown out of 297 00:18:13,960 --> 00:18:17,880 the fact that a, we have, we're going to be 150 years old in 298 00:18:17,880 --> 00:18:21,760 2031, which is we obviously want to celebrate that, but also 299 00:18:21,760 --> 00:18:24,520 because we have an ever increasing number of visitors 300 00:18:24,520 --> 00:18:28,480 that come here. And we have lovely gallery 301 00:18:28,480 --> 00:18:34,880 spaces that have for decades now bin back of house bin collection 302 00:18:34,880 --> 00:18:37,920 stores. And we have an opportunity to 303 00:18:37,920 --> 00:18:41,520 refurbish them and open to the public and and bring the museum 304 00:18:41,520 --> 00:18:44,120 back to the original Waterhouse galleries, the original 305 00:18:44,120 --> 00:18:45,800 galleries that it was always meant to be. 306 00:18:46,760 --> 00:18:49,640 I ask Meg about what she has learnt from this project that 307 00:18:49,640 --> 00:18:52,680 will feed into the creation of the further 5 galleries as part 308 00:18:52,680 --> 00:18:57,080 of the 2031 programme. Lots. 309 00:18:58,680 --> 00:19:04,000 I think the broader programme is going to benefit hugely from us 310 00:19:04,000 --> 00:19:07,400 having on through this one at a time where they were all these 311 00:19:07,400 --> 00:19:11,120 emerging things, where the Tennis Valley Science Park was 312 00:19:11,120 --> 00:19:15,160 was beginning to take shape, where the idea of NHM 150 came 313 00:19:15,160 --> 00:19:18,040 in, where the idea of making fixing our broken planet a 314 00:19:18,040 --> 00:19:22,200 permanent gallery and with the surrounding programme all sort 315 00:19:22,200 --> 00:19:26,040 of came together, but not necessarily in the right order. 316 00:19:26,920 --> 00:19:30,200 So there was a lot of sort of going down a certain way and 317 00:19:30,200 --> 00:19:33,680 then having to catch up. I think having gone through that 318 00:19:33,680 --> 00:19:39,680 process, will it help us better plan forward plan for the rest 319 00:19:39,680 --> 00:19:41,440 of the galleries, which is something that we're absolutely 320 00:19:41,440 --> 00:19:43,800 doing. The fact that it's a programme 321 00:19:43,800 --> 00:19:47,960 of a number of galleries means that it's, you know, it's baked 322 00:19:47,960 --> 00:19:51,080 in that we will be looking across the entirety of it to be 323 00:19:51,080 --> 00:19:56,720 able to work more efficiently, to be able to plan things now so 324 00:19:56,720 --> 00:20:01,000 that it works across all of the galleries to minimise clashes. 325 00:20:01,400 --> 00:20:05,720 We don't have a great deal of room here for parking stuff 326 00:20:05,720 --> 00:20:10,400 temporarily and we're going to have elephants and dinosaurs to 327 00:20:10,400 --> 00:20:13,800 move as well as innumerable smaller specimens. 328 00:20:13,800 --> 00:20:17,440 So it's, it's really good to have I think, I think having 329 00:20:17,440 --> 00:20:21,840 gone through this in more of a bits and pieces way is going to 330 00:20:21,840 --> 00:20:26,920 really have us well equipped. To look at it all holistically, 331 00:20:27,000 --> 00:20:32,720 take those lessons about spaces to, to, to work spaces to store 332 00:20:32,720 --> 00:20:36,960 temporarily, you know, the things that might happen with 333 00:20:36,960 --> 00:20:40,400 the fabric of the building. Things that we should expect to 334 00:20:40,400 --> 00:20:43,960 be surprises, you know, because it is an old building. 335 00:20:44,200 --> 00:20:46,840 All of those things are going to massively feed into it and make 336 00:20:46,840 --> 00:20:49,640 our lives a lot easier in the long run, I think. 337 00:20:50,520 --> 00:20:53,280 I asked about the budget for the gallery and, as part of that, 338 00:20:53,280 --> 00:20:55,800 the use of innovative, sustainable materials. 339 00:20:56,680 --> 00:21:03,120 It wasn't a ginormous budget, it was healthy and part of the the 340 00:21:03,120 --> 00:21:06,440 design was obviously to be as sustainable as possible. 341 00:21:06,480 --> 00:21:10,560 So not you'll have noticed that it's not very heavy onset works, 342 00:21:10,800 --> 00:21:14,200 it's not a lot of built walls and you know, structures. 343 00:21:14,520 --> 00:21:17,840 So that's sort of reflected in the budget. 344 00:21:18,240 --> 00:21:20,760 But also we brought on a sustainability consultant, which 345 00:21:20,760 --> 00:21:22,800 was something that we've never done before for this. 346 00:21:22,800 --> 00:21:25,600 So there are some new things for which we invested some of that 347 00:21:25,600 --> 00:21:30,160 money in, but it was a challenge too because it was using 348 00:21:30,360 --> 00:21:34,280 sustainable materials, which a means you can't, if there's a 349 00:21:34,280 --> 00:21:37,200 problem with the delivery, you can't go down to sort of B&Q to 350 00:21:37,200 --> 00:21:42,040 go get more timber or something. But also because they aren't 351 00:21:42,360 --> 00:21:46,560 widely available on the market, they have that sort of specialty 352 00:21:46,640 --> 00:21:49,000 materials costs associated with them as well. 353 00:21:49,280 --> 00:21:52,960 So I think the team did a really great job in coming in at, I 354 00:21:53,200 --> 00:21:54,840 think they came in slightly under budgeting. 355 00:21:56,120 --> 00:21:58,720 What's her advice to other project professionals who want 356 00:21:58,720 --> 00:22:01,320 to experiment with more sustainable materials and 357 00:22:01,320 --> 00:22:05,240 practises? Well, I, I think there's, you 358 00:22:05,240 --> 00:22:08,400 shouldn't underestimate the amount of time it takes that 359 00:22:08,400 --> 00:22:12,240 you'll have that you necessarily need to commit to, to sort of 360 00:22:12,240 --> 00:22:17,560 research of these new materials. They're not known to people in 361 00:22:17,680 --> 00:22:20,760 the construction industry. They're often made by smaller 362 00:22:20,760 --> 00:22:24,280 companies outside of the country. 363 00:22:24,480 --> 00:22:28,320 You know, there's it, it took our design team a fair amount of 364 00:22:28,320 --> 00:22:32,360 time, probably more than we had expected to do the research. 365 00:22:32,360 --> 00:22:35,560 And also it's because there is so many claims that on that 366 00:22:35,560 --> 00:22:38,440 could look good on the surface. But when you start to dig down, 367 00:22:38,880 --> 00:22:42,160 you can find many reasons why they become unsustainable or not 368 00:22:42,160 --> 00:22:45,520 as green as they they claim. There's then materials that 369 00:22:45,520 --> 00:22:49,360 aren't robust enough. You know, we have 6.2 million 370 00:22:49,360 --> 00:22:52,120 people come through the gap the the museum last year. 371 00:22:52,120 --> 00:22:55,480 We need stuff that's going to stand up to the sort of wear and 372 00:22:55,480 --> 00:22:57,400 tear of that. So I would, I wouldn't 373 00:22:57,400 --> 00:23:00,440 underestimate the amount of time for research and development of 374 00:23:00,440 --> 00:23:05,320 these materials and also don't as don't underestimate the the 375 00:23:05,320 --> 00:23:07,760 level of risk. And as long as you are capturing 376 00:23:07,760 --> 00:23:11,320 that, spending time figuring out how to mitigate that, then 377 00:23:11,320 --> 00:23:13,000 you're managing that as best you can. 378 00:23:14,000 --> 00:23:17,520 I asked Meg about how successful the project has been and how 379 00:23:17,520 --> 00:23:21,800 they measure that. Well, we generally have a number 380 00:23:21,800 --> 00:23:25,520 of KPIs and benefits, obviously, that tie back to the strategic 381 00:23:25,520 --> 00:23:29,320 aims of the museum. That's the very simple answer 382 00:23:29,320 --> 00:23:31,560 when it comes to fixing our broken planet. 383 00:23:31,560 --> 00:23:35,200 It's it, it has a layer of complexity because it, it comes 384 00:23:35,200 --> 00:23:39,480 down to how do you measure creating advocates for the 385 00:23:39,480 --> 00:23:42,760 planet? How do you know when you've done 386 00:23:42,760 --> 00:23:46,960 that and the museum has actually developed sort of an advocate 387 00:23:47,600 --> 00:23:51,880 advocacy engagement model that they are using, which is 388 00:23:51,880 --> 00:23:56,640 basically to it to inform, to inspire and to empower. 389 00:23:57,600 --> 00:24:00,120 And this is all gone through our wonderful sort of audience 390 00:24:00,160 --> 00:24:03,400 research and evaluation team, because that's the tricky part 391 00:24:03,520 --> 00:24:06,560 to capture. You can say, you know, we've had 392 00:24:06,560 --> 00:24:08,960 a million people through in the first six months. 393 00:24:08,960 --> 00:24:13,760 You can say, you know, we've had a number of pieces in the media, 394 00:24:13,760 --> 00:24:16,560 we've had this coverage, we've had these policy makers come to 395 00:24:16,560 --> 00:24:20,080 visit, but how do you actually measure what happens when 396 00:24:20,080 --> 00:24:23,360 someone leaves and whether they take those actions? 397 00:24:23,360 --> 00:24:26,080 And that's a much more that's, that's almost an impossible 398 00:24:26,080 --> 00:24:29,160 thing to do. So what we can do is, is try to 399 00:24:29,160 --> 00:24:32,600 quantify the sort of positive interactions and the onward 400 00:24:32,600 --> 00:24:35,760 journey that someone might take through our channels and then 401 00:24:35,760 --> 00:24:39,680 make sure that we're providing links and tools to other 402 00:24:39,680 --> 00:24:41,760 organisations and wherever we can send them. 403 00:24:42,680 --> 00:24:44,680 What's about the delivery of the project? 404 00:24:45,200 --> 00:24:49,480 It was a very hard deadline. This is one of the things about 405 00:24:49,480 --> 00:24:53,800 the projects, particularly the, the, the public facing ones have 406 00:24:54,000 --> 00:24:56,840 less leeway. I mean, some of the stuff that 407 00:24:56,840 --> 00:25:00,120 the buildings team do absolutely have a hard deadline and they're 408 00:25:00,120 --> 00:25:02,640 they, they face it innumerable challenges on that. 409 00:25:03,040 --> 00:25:05,560 But when you're opening a gallery or temporary exhibition, 410 00:25:05,560 --> 00:25:08,240 there's definitely, definitely a movable deadlines for 411 00:25:08,240 --> 00:25:09,640 completion. And it can be really 412 00:25:09,640 --> 00:25:13,560 challenging. And this team managed to pull it 413 00:25:13,560 --> 00:25:15,800 off. So they they opened it on time, 414 00:25:15,800 --> 00:25:21,840 despite some some small delays that are are small in and of 415 00:25:21,840 --> 00:25:24,040 themselves. But when they start getting more 416 00:25:24,040 --> 00:25:27,400 new, even more in number, it does have sort of have a, a 417 00:25:27,880 --> 00:25:31,840 compacting consequence or outcome. 418 00:25:32,120 --> 00:25:35,480 But they, they did, they did deliver it on time and they did 419 00:25:35,480 --> 00:25:38,080 deliver it to budget. So for, and, and they delivered 420 00:25:38,080 --> 00:25:39,640 it to the quality that they asked for. 421 00:25:39,640 --> 00:25:43,960 And that's often where the stressor is when you have a, a 422 00:25:43,960 --> 00:25:47,320 very, very, very firm timeline that in which you can't go past 423 00:25:47,320 --> 00:25:50,800 you often something has to give. But they really worked very hard 424 00:25:50,800 --> 00:25:53,920 at a number of teams across the museum to get that open in time. 425 00:25:54,640 --> 00:25:57,480 Does the museum take a particular approach to managing 426 00:25:57,480 --> 00:26:02,200 projects? We used to be, we used to try to 427 00:26:02,200 --> 00:26:05,720 follow Prince 2 for a really long time because obviously that 428 00:26:05,720 --> 00:26:09,920 was sort of the government way approach to project management. 429 00:26:10,560 --> 00:26:14,640 But recently we have been looking more at APM and their 430 00:26:14,640 --> 00:26:17,840 approach to it through the project management qualification 431 00:26:17,840 --> 00:26:22,360 PMQ on which we've just loads of our PMS have just been sort of 432 00:26:22,360 --> 00:26:24,920 trained on it. They've just written the exam 433 00:26:25,520 --> 00:26:31,160 and we have our membership and that seems to be a better fit 434 00:26:31,240 --> 00:26:35,040 for us as an organisation because it's very grounded in 435 00:26:35,840 --> 00:26:42,280 practical approaches. Of course, every project is, you 436 00:26:42,280 --> 00:26:45,000 know, we get a project that very massively. 437 00:26:45,000 --> 00:26:49,200 So you know, I talk about ME programme managing FOBP 438 00:26:49,200 --> 00:26:52,680 programme which involves learning international 439 00:26:52,680 --> 00:26:55,840 partnerships and all of these teams. 440 00:26:56,200 --> 00:27:00,160 But then I also just recently put a singular dinosaur in a 441 00:27:00,160 --> 00:27:02,920 display case. So you have these varying 442 00:27:02,920 --> 00:27:05,920 projects with varying amounts of money, varying amounts of teams, 443 00:27:06,880 --> 00:27:12,200 but really when we're, we're quite strict on making sure that 444 00:27:12,200 --> 00:27:15,120 we have that project management framework and it is the sort of 445 00:27:15,120 --> 00:27:20,760 the APMPMQ that so that we have our documentation is, is the 446 00:27:20,760 --> 00:27:24,240 same across all of the projects. And the way that we approach 447 00:27:24,240 --> 00:27:29,360 stakeholder management, you know, lessons, all of that sort 448 00:27:29,360 --> 00:27:33,840 of stuff is, is generally tends to be more APM these days. 449 00:27:35,080 --> 00:27:38,240 Now let's turn to the detail of delivering the construction of 450 00:27:38,240 --> 00:27:41,280 refurbishment side of the project, which was the 451 00:27:41,280 --> 00:27:44,920 responsibility of senior project manager Sophie Dolan, who has 452 00:27:44,920 --> 00:27:47,920 worked at the Natural History Museum for three years and in 453 00:27:47,920 --> 00:27:50,800 construction project management for eight years, most recently 454 00:27:50,800 --> 00:27:54,080 at the National Gallery Victoria in Melbourne, where she was 455 00:27:54,080 --> 00:27:56,160 involved in the building of a new gallery. 456 00:27:56,880 --> 00:28:00,160 So I'm actually sort of one of the few people in our team who's 457 00:28:00,480 --> 00:28:02,480 from what I call more of a traditional background. 458 00:28:02,480 --> 00:28:05,400 Our team are really diverse and have really interesting sort of 459 00:28:05,840 --> 00:28:07,680 past careers and all sorts of different things. 460 00:28:08,080 --> 00:28:09,960 I'm one of the few who sort of come from a traditional point of 461 00:28:09,960 --> 00:28:11,440 view. So I did a construction 462 00:28:11,440 --> 00:28:15,320 management degree at university in Australia and then I've 463 00:28:15,320 --> 00:28:18,040 worked in project management since. 464 00:28:18,200 --> 00:28:21,200 And then I did my 8:00 PM qualification earlier this year. 465 00:28:21,320 --> 00:28:25,440 So I feel like I kind of was a qualified PM anyway, but it's 466 00:28:25,440 --> 00:28:28,680 nice to have the extra stuff and I did actually get a lot out of 467 00:28:28,680 --> 00:28:30,040 it and learned a lot out of that as well. 468 00:28:31,120 --> 00:28:33,600 What's about dealing with people who might not be familiar with 469 00:28:33,600 --> 00:28:37,160 the world of project management? Stakeholder management is such a 470 00:28:37,160 --> 00:28:42,040 big part of what we do because whilst people might have a 471 00:28:42,200 --> 00:28:45,200 general idea that the building needs upkeep or we need new 472 00:28:45,200 --> 00:28:48,280 exhibitions and new galleries, it's if it's not kind of in 473 00:28:48,280 --> 00:28:51,440 their, their team's line of sight and priorities and, and 474 00:28:51,600 --> 00:28:55,400 staff resource and whatnot, it can be quite hard to sort of 475 00:28:56,520 --> 00:28:58,360 balance that. So it's all about like early 476 00:28:58,360 --> 00:29:00,720 communication, running some workshops with them, explaining 477 00:29:00,720 --> 00:29:02,120 what we're doing and why is a big one. 478 00:29:02,120 --> 00:29:04,680 And like, you know, if we're talking APM benefits really 479 00:29:04,680 --> 00:29:08,320 comes into this because we have to explain to people like, you 480 00:29:08,320 --> 00:29:11,200 know, there may be some disruptions, some noise and so 481 00:29:11,200 --> 00:29:13,880 on for this amount of time. But why we're doing that is to 482 00:29:13,880 --> 00:29:16,840 give you this new gallery and then you can display some of 483 00:29:16,840 --> 00:29:19,920 your amazing specimens or give you a nicer workspace or, you 484 00:29:19,920 --> 00:29:24,000 know, like everything we do is to benefit the museum and it's 485 00:29:24,000 --> 00:29:26,040 staff and it's visitors and it's collections. 486 00:29:26,280 --> 00:29:32,840 So which is no sort of small task, but I'd say it kind of 487 00:29:32,840 --> 00:29:35,520 depends on your audience. Like we have some teams who 488 00:29:35,520 --> 00:29:39,160 actually we have a lot of in house technical trades. 489 00:29:39,160 --> 00:29:43,880 So like carpenters and joiners and AV specialists and people 490 00:29:43,880 --> 00:29:46,040 who build robots and like do all that kind of stuff. 491 00:29:46,440 --> 00:29:48,600 Most people have now outsourced that or get freelancers in. 492 00:29:48,600 --> 00:29:51,040 Whereas we have an in house team again, some of whom have been 493 00:29:51,040 --> 00:29:54,160 here for nearly 40 years, which is some of them built their 494 00:29:54,160 --> 00:29:57,080 creepy crawlies exhibition, which is our next project to to 495 00:29:57,120 --> 00:29:59,280 change that one up. So really useful talking to them 496 00:29:59,280 --> 00:30:01,080 because they remember what's around. 497 00:30:01,360 --> 00:30:06,680 Whereas some so they they tend to need that less kind of not 498 00:30:06,680 --> 00:30:08,920 dumbing down, but sort of simple terms and whatnot. 499 00:30:08,920 --> 00:30:12,600 They kind of get it. Whereas some of the teams who a 500 00:30:12,960 --> 00:30:18,840 really specific science focus or or a curatorial focus, but you 501 00:30:18,840 --> 00:30:20,040 know, we just work around our audience. 502 00:30:20,040 --> 00:30:22,760 So we we love visuals. You know, we do big maps showing 503 00:30:22,920 --> 00:30:24,720 this area is going to be impacted for this long. 504 00:30:25,640 --> 00:30:28,400 Here's the route you can go And you know, we just we kind of 505 00:30:28,480 --> 00:30:32,840 tailor as we go yeah early comms, really early comms and 506 00:30:32,840 --> 00:30:36,560 keep and not just once like it's the repeated because people 507 00:30:36,560 --> 00:30:38,800 forget people are busy. They have, you know, really busy 508 00:30:38,800 --> 00:30:40,320 other jobs. We're saving the planet right. 509 00:30:40,440 --> 00:30:45,800 You know, we've got a respect people's time and their main 510 00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:47,520 work focus. We can't expect everyone to just 511 00:30:47,720 --> 00:30:50,280 work around us all the time and our works. 512 00:30:50,640 --> 00:30:54,680 So yeah, I'd say early and regular communication for sure. 513 00:30:55,440 --> 00:30:56,920 You know, we do all the stakeholder mapping. 514 00:30:56,920 --> 00:31:02,160 We work out, you know, the, the folks who need a lot more kind 515 00:31:02,160 --> 00:31:05,760 of regular cons or like Taylor cons, whereas the ones who just 516 00:31:05,760 --> 00:31:07,520 sort of need to know every month or So what you're doing. 517 00:31:07,720 --> 00:31:09,440 We we map all that type of stuff out. 518 00:31:09,920 --> 00:31:12,440 What's been really good that our team do is not just on a 519 00:31:12,440 --> 00:31:15,680 specific project level. Do we do those columns and 520 00:31:15,680 --> 00:31:19,040 information, but we do like, you know, coffee mornings and whole 521 00:31:19,040 --> 00:31:22,040 company presentations where we explain what our team do and who 522 00:31:22,040 --> 00:31:23,480 we are and why we're doing what we're doing. 523 00:31:23,480 --> 00:31:25,480 Because I think sometimes and every team do it. 524 00:31:25,760 --> 00:31:29,880 You know, sometimes, like I'm really not from a science 525 00:31:29,880 --> 00:31:31,160 background. I can't stress that enough. 526 00:31:31,160 --> 00:31:33,840 So sometimes I feel quite lost here with not lost here, but 527 00:31:33,840 --> 00:31:36,920 sort of a bit out of my depth when they, when we get a 528 00:31:36,920 --> 00:31:39,040 presentation about someone who's just discovered a new type of, 529 00:31:40,280 --> 00:31:43,160 or, you know, something, I found it really interesting and I 530 00:31:43,160 --> 00:31:45,280 think it's fantastic. But I'm kind of they sometimes 531 00:31:45,280 --> 00:31:47,680 they're using words and I'm like, what does that mean? 532 00:31:47,680 --> 00:31:50,240 So I think, you know, they do it for us, we do it for them. 533 00:31:50,240 --> 00:31:53,080 And I think it's a really nice culture we have here in the 534 00:31:53,080 --> 00:31:55,640 museum where we, we are encouraged to learn about what 535 00:31:55,640 --> 00:31:58,320 all the other departments do. And I think that goes a long way 536 00:31:58,320 --> 00:32:02,280 to then understanding when the difficult things come in doesn't 537 00:32:02,280 --> 00:32:03,760 make it perfect. And then, you know, we 538 00:32:03,760 --> 00:32:05,400 definitely have difficult conversations. 539 00:32:05,400 --> 00:32:09,480 And I think the, the where it gets tricky sometimes too is the 540 00:32:09,480 --> 00:32:13,400 priorities. So, you know, a lot of 541 00:32:13,400 --> 00:32:15,680 organisations have this where, where it has to go to the 542 00:32:15,680 --> 00:32:19,200 director level to say, do we lose commercial revenue by 543 00:32:19,200 --> 00:32:22,000 stopping events to allow works to happen or do we keep the 544 00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:23,800 events going and then the works are pushed back. 545 00:32:23,800 --> 00:32:27,560 But that means we have a lot of money in, in, you know, delayed 546 00:32:27,880 --> 00:32:31,560 construction time and we have to those decisions sit well, well 547 00:32:31,760 --> 00:32:34,320 beyond us. But we again, we have a team of 548 00:32:34,400 --> 00:32:38,400 excellent directors who have the best interests of the museum and 549 00:32:38,400 --> 00:32:40,440 its staffing, collections and visitors at heart. 550 00:32:40,440 --> 00:32:42,760 And they kind of they make those decisions. 551 00:32:42,760 --> 00:32:47,240 But we we prepare little effectively, little business 552 00:32:47,240 --> 00:32:49,880 cases to sort of explain. We're working with other teams 553 00:32:49,880 --> 00:32:51,160 to say, look, here are your options. 554 00:32:51,400 --> 00:32:53,920 How do you want to tackle this? Because when we're such a busy 555 00:32:53,920 --> 00:32:55,800 live environment, we can't just stop all events. 556 00:32:55,800 --> 00:32:59,080 We can't just stop having visitors from for a day, you 557 00:32:59,080 --> 00:33:01,640 know, we, you know, but then we can't stop our works either. 558 00:33:02,080 --> 00:33:05,160 So it's a really tricky juggle at times, but very luckily we 559 00:33:05,160 --> 00:33:07,800 are supported by our our managers in that, which is 560 00:33:07,800 --> 00:33:11,320 great. Let's rewind and allow Sophie to 561 00:33:11,320 --> 00:33:15,760 tell us what her role covers. So yeah, so I'm a senior PM, 562 00:33:15,960 --> 00:33:20,000 senior project manager here. Currently I'm working on the 563 00:33:21,200 --> 00:33:23,320 similar type of thing of what I did for the last gallery. 564 00:33:23,320 --> 00:33:28,040 So the, the gallery shell refurbishment of the what we 565 00:33:28,040 --> 00:33:29,680 call Gallery 33. So that's the one that's 566 00:33:29,680 --> 00:33:32,040 currently the creepy crawlies, which is a lot of people's 567 00:33:32,040 --> 00:33:35,200 favourite from when they were a kid built back in the 80s. 568 00:33:35,840 --> 00:33:38,600 So that one is due to now be removed. 569 00:33:38,600 --> 00:33:42,400 So we're gonna strip that out. We, we, we sometimes call it the 570 00:33:42,400 --> 00:33:44,200 children's gallery. Every gallery is the children's 571 00:33:44,200 --> 00:33:46,320 gallery at this place. But that one in particular is 572 00:33:46,320 --> 00:33:50,400 like really interactive and fun and yeah, it's bugs. 573 00:33:50,560 --> 00:33:52,000 So kids like bugs and things like that. 574 00:33:52,880 --> 00:33:54,400 So yeah. So that one is due to be 575 00:33:54,400 --> 00:33:56,800 stripped out after for just about 40 years. 576 00:33:57,680 --> 00:34:01,120 And we will, you know, recycle, donate, you know, as much of it 577 00:34:01,120 --> 00:34:04,800 as we feasibly can. And then my role is very much 578 00:34:05,640 --> 00:34:07,960 the restoration of the gallery. So it's a little bit different 579 00:34:07,960 --> 00:34:10,480 to the FABP ones. That one, that gallery was in 580 00:34:10,480 --> 00:34:13,159 much worse condition just for various reasons over the years 581 00:34:13,159 --> 00:34:16,320 of, you know, water damage. And so we had to do a full roof 582 00:34:16,560 --> 00:34:19,040 replacement. We replaced all the glazing we 583 00:34:19,040 --> 00:34:21,719 did, replaced about 1/3 of flooring where it had rotted 584 00:34:21,719 --> 00:34:23,960 away. It was all covered under vinyl. 585 00:34:24,560 --> 00:34:26,520 Yeah. Basically it was a 1970s 586 00:34:27,239 --> 00:34:28,960 exhibition called the Whole of Human Biology. 587 00:34:28,960 --> 00:34:32,400 So it was all about the human body and how does it work. 588 00:34:32,840 --> 00:34:38,600 And it was, for its time, it was extremely sort of trailblazing. 589 00:34:38,600 --> 00:34:42,080 And it was a really new type of exhibition that was had come to 590 00:34:42,080 --> 00:34:46,440 the UK. However, as Meg was talking 591 00:34:46,440 --> 00:34:49,480 about before, they had no respect for the Victorian 592 00:34:49,480 --> 00:34:51,280 architecture. So they built what we call a 593 00:34:51,280 --> 00:34:53,800 space frame. So it's basically a white box on 594 00:34:53,800 --> 00:34:58,240 the inside of the gallery. And then this big metal almost 595 00:34:58,240 --> 00:35:00,880 looks like a climbing frame that ran across the ceiling. 596 00:35:01,040 --> 00:35:03,080 So you could, if you look it up through it, you could sort of 597 00:35:03,080 --> 00:35:04,240 see bits of the ceiling and so on. 598 00:35:04,880 --> 00:35:06,560 But there was no celebration of the architecture. 599 00:35:06,560 --> 00:35:08,680 They covered all the original oak floors with vinyl. 600 00:35:09,040 --> 00:35:10,640 A real shame to be honest with you. 601 00:35:10,640 --> 00:35:13,120 But it look, it was there for nearly 50 years. 602 00:35:13,120 --> 00:35:14,600 So it, you know, it had a good life. 603 00:35:15,000 --> 00:35:17,200 A lot of people fondly remember it from their own childhoods and 604 00:35:17,200 --> 00:35:18,800 things. So, yeah. 605 00:35:18,800 --> 00:35:22,040 So that one was again, big sort of decommissioning and strip out 606 00:35:22,040 --> 00:35:23,960 process. So we had to take out all the 607 00:35:24,240 --> 00:35:27,880 that one didn't have any actual specimens in it, but yeah, took 608 00:35:27,880 --> 00:35:29,600 out all the models and the graphics and things like that. 609 00:35:29,600 --> 00:35:32,640 Again, we donate, we recycle, we do as much as we can on that 610 00:35:32,640 --> 00:35:35,960 front, and then you're left with this empty shell. 611 00:35:35,960 --> 00:35:39,000 So then it's a huge process of because we were doing the roof 612 00:35:39,000 --> 00:35:42,640 as well, we had to set up a big internal sort of structure, 613 00:35:42,680 --> 00:35:46,760 scaffold structure, and then remove all the old slate tiles 614 00:35:46,760 --> 00:35:50,520 and pull out all the old legs. And we had so many discoveries 615 00:35:50,520 --> 00:35:52,640 on because what's tricky is because it's Grade 1 heritage 616 00:35:52,640 --> 00:35:55,080 listed, you can't just go roofing it open to do surveys 617 00:35:55,080 --> 00:35:57,560 when you feel like it. You have to a lot of it. 618 00:35:57,960 --> 00:36:00,280 You're not given permission to actually have a look until 619 00:36:00,280 --> 00:36:03,080 you're actually doing the works, which makes it really tricky 620 00:36:03,080 --> 00:36:05,200 because you just find so many things. 621 00:36:05,200 --> 00:36:07,240 And the roof filled up was not what we expected. 622 00:36:08,200 --> 00:36:09,760 It wasn't even the depth we expected. 623 00:36:09,760 --> 00:36:12,640 There was all sorts of things that meant we have to do a lot 624 00:36:12,640 --> 00:36:14,440 of redesign. So this, it was a really 625 00:36:14,440 --> 00:36:16,520 challenging project for that team. 626 00:36:17,040 --> 00:36:19,080 I mean, I came in halfway and I found it challenging, let alone 627 00:36:19,080 --> 00:36:21,920 the folks at the start. So it was just lots of surprises 628 00:36:21,920 --> 00:36:25,600 because we did have some of the original drawings from the 629 00:36:25,600 --> 00:36:28,160 original architect after Waterhouse, but not all of them. 630 00:36:28,280 --> 00:36:31,880 So and like I mentioned being heritageist and we can't just go 631 00:36:31,880 --> 00:36:34,040 like pulling things apart and having a look to see how they 632 00:36:34,040 --> 00:36:35,520 work. So that to then inform the 633 00:36:35,520 --> 00:36:39,800 design and the cost plans on. So we yeah, a lot of things were 634 00:36:39,800 --> 00:36:44,040 not quite how we thought the yeah, building fabric surprises. 635 00:36:44,360 --> 00:36:47,440 I will say on the flip side of that though is challenging as it 636 00:36:47,440 --> 00:36:51,000 was and it did resulted a lot of difficulties for that project. 637 00:36:51,400 --> 00:36:54,960 We now have a much better idea of what our buildings are 638 00:36:54,960 --> 00:36:56,840 made-up of. And we've tested, you know, 639 00:36:57,120 --> 00:36:58,960 concrete samples, we've tested paint samples. 640 00:36:58,960 --> 00:37:01,280 We've through this project, we've discovered a lot of stuff 641 00:37:01,280 --> 00:37:05,800 about not just the current sort of build, but how it has looked 642 00:37:05,800 --> 00:37:08,800 over the last 150 years. So we've done the paint 643 00:37:08,800 --> 00:37:11,520 analysis, we've done the analysis of the slate we had on 644 00:37:11,520 --> 00:37:13,720 the roof and worked out the exact quarry it came from, like 645 00:37:13,720 --> 00:37:17,520 all this kind of stuff. So we now know that the, you 646 00:37:17,520 --> 00:37:21,160 know, next couple of gallery projects to come in 647 00:37:21,160 --> 00:37:23,440 restorations, we're much better prepared and we have a lot of 648 00:37:23,440 --> 00:37:26,440 lessons learned and a lot of information we can bring 649 00:37:26,440 --> 00:37:30,200 forward, which I think is, you know, really useful. 650 00:37:30,280 --> 00:37:33,040 And you could look at it in the negative way of, you know, it 651 00:37:33,040 --> 00:37:35,880 was a really hard project and all these things kind of came up 652 00:37:35,880 --> 00:37:37,000 and there were a lot of surprises. 653 00:37:37,000 --> 00:37:39,920 But we're trying to think of it in the positive of thinking of 654 00:37:39,920 --> 00:37:41,880 all that information we can apply to the next ones. 655 00:37:43,480 --> 00:37:46,400 What did she learn from this project that she will use on the 656 00:37:46,400 --> 00:37:50,600 next? Within reason, because it's not 657 00:37:50,600 --> 00:37:55,280 always possible, is allowing for more contingency for things not 658 00:37:55,280 --> 00:37:57,840 being where you think they will be in the build up of the the 659 00:37:57,840 --> 00:37:59,600 building fabric or or the structure. 660 00:37:59,600 --> 00:38:02,840 So time and. Resource time, resource budget 661 00:38:04,040 --> 00:38:06,800 people, resource to I know, and this is something that the 662 00:38:07,520 --> 00:38:10,160 exhibition team can speak about as well, is that. 663 00:38:11,120 --> 00:38:13,280 I. Think initially because the 664 00:38:13,680 --> 00:38:16,920 exhibition, it started a bit smaller than it ended up being. 665 00:38:16,920 --> 00:38:18,360 It was just meant to be a temporary one. 666 00:38:18,920 --> 00:38:24,640 It was resourced accordingly and then it grew with the, you know, 667 00:38:24,760 --> 00:38:27,440 it was, you know, decision. It should, you know, be bigger 668 00:38:27,440 --> 00:38:29,680 than it is. It wasn't just like scope creep. 669 00:38:29,680 --> 00:38:31,880 It did, you know, we did say, look, let's actually make this a 670 00:38:31,880 --> 00:38:35,120 bigger thing. It probably should have had some 671 00:38:35,120 --> 00:38:38,400 more resources allocated. We did do a fair few things 672 00:38:38,400 --> 00:38:40,360 quite well of, you know, bringing people back to the 673 00:38:40,360 --> 00:38:41,800 benefits on why, why are we here? 674 00:38:41,800 --> 00:38:42,640 Why are we doing what we're doing? 675 00:38:42,680 --> 00:38:47,000 Stakeholder management was done quite well and change control 676 00:38:47,000 --> 00:38:50,880 and so on, things like that. I think programme was one of our 677 00:38:50,880 --> 00:38:56,400 trickiest ones and we were really unfortunately bound by 678 00:38:56,400 --> 00:38:59,680 what our contractors were saying in their programme because that 679 00:38:59,680 --> 00:39:01,800 was sort of the dates we would have to take to stakeholders and 680 00:39:01,800 --> 00:39:04,800 take to put in our reporting and our governance and things like 681 00:39:04,800 --> 00:39:07,120 that. And I think as the project got a 682 00:39:07,120 --> 00:39:10,040 little unwieldy because it was just growing and having all 683 00:39:10,040 --> 00:39:14,000 these issues, the programme became a really difficult one to 684 00:39:14,000 --> 00:39:16,760 match because we didn't necessarily feel we had control 685 00:39:16,760 --> 00:39:18,560 over it. And I was sort of sitting more 686 00:39:18,560 --> 00:39:24,360 with the, the contractor. So possibly changing the way we 687 00:39:24,400 --> 00:39:27,680 ran that and like seeing if there was a way we could not 688 00:39:27,680 --> 00:39:29,720 necessarily have more influence over it because it, the builder 689 00:39:29,720 --> 00:39:32,120 was telling us the truth. You know, this is this is what 690 00:39:32,120 --> 00:39:33,360 it is and this is how long it will take. 691 00:39:33,760 --> 00:39:38,200 But I think finding that balance between saying, yes, you, you 692 00:39:38,520 --> 00:39:40,640 know, show us your programme, here's what you think we can do, 693 00:39:40,640 --> 00:39:44,480 and then us having more influence over that and so on. 694 00:39:45,600 --> 00:39:49,640 Because yeah, the the programme did grow a fair bit throughout 695 00:39:49,640 --> 00:39:54,160 the throughout the job. Sherry Louise Rowe is a senior 696 00:39:54,160 --> 00:39:57,040 projects and programme manager who helped bring the projects 697 00:39:57,040 --> 00:39:59,640 over the line. She has worked at the Natural 698 00:39:59,640 --> 00:40:03,040 History Museum for 21 years, working her way up from duty 699 00:40:03,040 --> 00:40:07,040 manager to her current position. She explains that she now works 700 00:40:07,040 --> 00:40:09,920 on the more strategically important projects and temporary 701 00:40:09,920 --> 00:40:12,960 exhibitions, of which there are typically 3 running every year, 702 00:40:13,320 --> 00:40:15,200 which take around 2 years to develop. 703 00:40:15,880 --> 00:40:18,920 She normally runs a project team of around 4 professionals and 704 00:40:18,920 --> 00:40:22,120 then a broader team of 12. Some of the projects have 705 00:40:22,120 --> 00:40:25,960 included a tour of Dippy the dinosaur around the UK, an 706 00:40:25,960 --> 00:40:29,680 exhibition on animal sex and moving the museum's statues of 707 00:40:29,680 --> 00:40:33,240 Charles Darwin, scientist Thomas Huxley and the museum's founder 708 00:40:33,240 --> 00:40:35,000 Sir Richard Owen around the building. 709 00:40:35,880 --> 00:40:39,080 So I'm overseeing some of the temporary exhibitions, so the 710 00:40:39,080 --> 00:40:42,160 one that Sam's doing on Jurassic Oceans and another one called 711 00:40:42,160 --> 00:40:44,560 Great Ocean Forests, these are open in the next couple of 712 00:40:44,560 --> 00:40:47,560 years. I oversee the art programme, the 713 00:40:47,560 --> 00:40:49,240 project manager works on the art programme. 714 00:40:49,720 --> 00:40:53,200 So we've got a gallery called the German Gallery, which is 715 00:40:53,680 --> 00:40:56,640 sponsored partly by the German Foundation and it has to be an 716 00:40:56,640 --> 00:41:00,440 art science type exhibition that goes in there. 717 00:41:00,520 --> 00:41:02,600 Yeah. So in the past we've done things 718 00:41:02,600 --> 00:41:07,400 like Gregor Sailor exhibition. We've had various artists that 719 00:41:07,400 --> 00:41:09,720 we've commissioned done stuff. We had the Moon Museum of the 720 00:41:09,720 --> 00:41:11,440 Moon here. That was really good. 721 00:41:11,480 --> 00:41:13,000 I did that one actually. That's that was a really good 722 00:41:13,000 --> 00:41:14,040 project. Yeah. 723 00:41:14,960 --> 00:41:17,640 I asked her what's unique about working at the museum. 724 00:41:18,600 --> 00:41:21,400 I think it is just the one for a better word. 725 00:41:21,400 --> 00:41:26,880 The randomness of it really. Every day is, is different. 726 00:41:26,880 --> 00:41:28,320 You know, it's not, you're not at the job where you're doing 727 00:41:28,320 --> 00:41:31,640 the same, I know data input or seeing the same people. 728 00:41:31,640 --> 00:41:34,840 It's very, you know. Different. 729 00:41:35,560 --> 00:41:38,240 What skills do you need to thrive somewhere like this? 730 00:41:39,120 --> 00:41:42,520 I think you have to be a good communicator and knowing how to 731 00:41:42,520 --> 00:41:45,600 deal with the various, and it's only probably something you can 732 00:41:45,600 --> 00:41:49,120 learn while you're here, because I knew nothing about science or 733 00:41:49,120 --> 00:41:52,600 curators and conservation and how they feel about their 734 00:41:52,600 --> 00:41:55,400 specimens and their objects. And if there is an issue 735 00:41:55,640 --> 00:41:58,400 regarding them, you know you're going to treat it quite 736 00:41:58,600 --> 00:42:02,720 sensitively and carefully, just can't bulldoze in and whatever. 737 00:42:04,200 --> 00:42:08,600 So I think you've got to learn how to communicate effectively 738 00:42:08,600 --> 00:42:10,360 to the right people in the right way. 739 00:42:11,000 --> 00:42:13,920 How do you learn to deal effectively with specialists as 740 00:42:13,920 --> 00:42:17,160 a project manager? I sort of put it on them, like 741 00:42:17,320 --> 00:42:21,560 give them ownership of it, make them understand that I think I 742 00:42:21,560 --> 00:42:23,840 understand that they're the, they're the expert. 743 00:42:24,040 --> 00:42:28,400 So I'm relying on them to give me the right information to take 744 00:42:28,400 --> 00:42:30,760 some ownership and responsibility for it. 745 00:42:30,760 --> 00:42:33,800 And don't, I don't go in saying, right, I'm the project manager. 746 00:42:33,800 --> 00:42:35,880 I'm going to be in charge of you or I need you. 747 00:42:35,920 --> 00:42:39,240 We work as a team. I need you and your expertise 748 00:42:39,240 --> 00:42:42,240 because I don't know, I think what best conditions are for a 749 00:42:42,240 --> 00:42:46,120 specimen or I don't know, the best way for AV hardware to be 750 00:42:46,120 --> 00:42:49,440 installed into the floor. You know, I'm relying on you as 751 00:42:49,440 --> 00:42:52,840 my fellow project team members, but you know, we make this 752 00:42:52,840 --> 00:42:54,840 project, we deliver this project together. 753 00:42:54,840 --> 00:42:58,880 I just the conductor, the, you know, the band leader that 754 00:42:58,880 --> 00:43:02,200 brings it all together and, you know, might be the head of the 755 00:43:02,200 --> 00:43:05,680 face and the name of the document, but it's all the 756 00:43:05,680 --> 00:43:07,000 others that really do all the work. 757 00:43:07,840 --> 00:43:11,320 I ask her, how do you make a project a success at the museum? 758 00:43:11,920 --> 00:43:16,480 Once you know, you know how the museum works and the the various 759 00:43:16,760 --> 00:43:20,280 bureaucracies and the hierarchies and that that go on. 760 00:43:20,760 --> 00:43:23,920 But you're still an important cog in the massive wheel. 761 00:43:25,480 --> 00:43:28,600 But I think you can only do what you've got given in front of 762 00:43:28,600 --> 00:43:29,560 you. If you haven't got a set amount 763 00:43:29,560 --> 00:43:31,120 of time, ain't got a set amount of money. 764 00:43:31,360 --> 00:43:35,360 We, I think that I think we very rarely fail. 765 00:43:35,720 --> 00:43:38,240 You know, we always deliver on time within budget. 766 00:43:38,840 --> 00:43:42,320 And as I think you just got to be, you could be quite calm as 767 00:43:42,320 --> 00:43:44,760 well. You can't be too hot headed. 768 00:43:44,760 --> 00:43:48,680 And yeah, you're going to have a level head about you and take 769 00:43:48,680 --> 00:43:52,560 all the different personalities on and everyone's arguments, 770 00:43:52,560 --> 00:43:55,600 whatever and just sometimes be a peacemaker, be a mediator. 771 00:43:55,600 --> 00:43:58,040 You know you have different lots of hats to wear. 772 00:43:59,040 --> 00:44:01,520 What are the hardest parts of delivering a project? 773 00:44:02,160 --> 00:44:05,280 There are certain things that we're just giving a hard no on 774 00:44:05,640 --> 00:44:08,040 and just like, you know, it's not even worth arguing it. 775 00:44:08,040 --> 00:44:09,560 It's a no, it's not going to happen. 776 00:44:09,560 --> 00:44:11,880 We need to find an alternative way. 777 00:44:12,200 --> 00:44:13,960 You know, it might not be that we've got enough budget for 778 00:44:13,960 --> 00:44:15,760 something or we just don't have enough time. 779 00:44:15,760 --> 00:44:17,520 We haven't got enough time, right? 780 00:44:17,520 --> 00:44:19,640 What do we prioritise and what can we say? 781 00:44:19,640 --> 00:44:21,920 It's an exhibition. So we opened this gallery on the 782 00:44:22,240 --> 00:44:24,760 3rd of April. It did get to a point where 783 00:44:24,760 --> 00:44:26,720 we're like, right, what are going to be priorities that can 784 00:44:26,720 --> 00:44:31,080 happen after we open? What can we not open without and 785 00:44:31,080 --> 00:44:33,720 say, you know, there was a hard, that date of opening could not 786 00:44:33,720 --> 00:44:35,080 change. There was press, there was 787 00:44:35,080 --> 00:44:38,280 everything else set around it. It was out there in the public. 788 00:44:38,280 --> 00:44:40,800 So we're like, OK, that wasn't have to wait till after. 789 00:44:40,800 --> 00:44:45,160 No, wouldn't people wouldn't know, but for us we'd know that 790 00:44:45,160 --> 00:44:46,880 was about priority and that sort of thing. 791 00:44:46,880 --> 00:44:50,960 If it comes to money and it's which often unfortunately is an 792 00:44:50,960 --> 00:44:55,440 issue, just say, OK, we might not be able to do the higher 793 00:44:55,440 --> 00:44:57,880 spec or something. What's an alternative? 794 00:44:57,880 --> 00:45:00,680 What else could we produce? Or, you know, does someone else 795 00:45:00,680 --> 00:45:03,400 have to give? Or something else? 796 00:45:04,600 --> 00:45:07,800 What was her involvement in the Fixing Our Broken Planet 797 00:45:07,800 --> 00:45:10,560 project? So actually I didn't come on 798 00:45:10,560 --> 00:45:15,000 till last May I think. So more Reba stage 5. 799 00:45:16,280 --> 00:45:20,800 It just came obvious that it was almost too big for one person 800 00:45:21,920 --> 00:45:24,120 and Sam had done a great job up until then, but it was going to, 801 00:45:24,120 --> 00:45:26,200 you know, principals contractor was about to come on. 802 00:45:26,200 --> 00:45:27,720 It was only going to get bigger and bigger. 803 00:45:28,040 --> 00:45:31,080 So I came on to sort of just help Sam out really. 804 00:45:31,320 --> 00:45:34,120 I took on a relationship with the principal contractor. 805 00:45:34,960 --> 00:45:39,240 She took on some of the other smaller work packages and we 806 00:45:39,240 --> 00:45:40,720 sort of then managed it together. 807 00:45:41,640 --> 00:45:45,080 And I, and I say I oversaw all the install stuff while she did 808 00:45:45,080 --> 00:45:47,960 all the other, but you know, the work practise that she'd been 809 00:45:47,960 --> 00:45:50,360 managing up until that time. It's easier if she to carry on 810 00:45:50,360 --> 00:45:52,080 doing that and I did the new things. 811 00:45:52,080 --> 00:45:56,000 So the principal contractor, the installation schedule, all the 812 00:45:56,000 --> 00:45:58,520 logistics about coming on site, all that sort of thing. 813 00:45:59,320 --> 00:46:02,400 At the time didn't think that it was something that hadn't been 814 00:46:02,400 --> 00:46:04,000 done before. I just thought it was like we've 815 00:46:04,000 --> 00:46:06,720 been given a lovely brand new open space. 816 00:46:07,200 --> 00:46:09,960 We need to fill it with someone that's going to look amazing, 817 00:46:09,960 --> 00:46:13,640 which obviously colleagues were in charge of designing and 818 00:46:13,800 --> 00:46:18,160 producing and whatever it was just it was more, I guess for me 819 00:46:18,160 --> 00:46:19,880 and Sam, we knew we had a deadline. 820 00:46:19,880 --> 00:46:24,520 It had to happen and it was getting everything ready for 821 00:46:24,520 --> 00:46:27,600 that day again. It wasn't until afterwards, I 822 00:46:27,600 --> 00:46:29,680 think you look back and think, Oh my God, this is the first one 823 00:46:29,680 --> 00:46:32,720 we've done since whatever the date is more Hincy Hall, I 824 00:46:32,720 --> 00:46:35,120 guess. So, yeah, I didn't typically 825 00:46:35,120 --> 00:46:37,600 feel pressure at the time that it was something new. 826 00:46:37,960 --> 00:46:40,480 It was more just like, Oh my God, we're running out of time. 827 00:46:40,480 --> 00:46:42,480 We've got a lot to do in a short amount of time. 828 00:46:42,600 --> 00:46:45,040 And it was a lot of very much all hands on deck. 829 00:46:45,160 --> 00:46:47,040 And we built in like the contingency time. 830 00:46:47,040 --> 00:46:49,360 We could do evening work, do weekend work. 831 00:46:49,360 --> 00:46:52,800 I mean, luckily we didn't have to rely on weekend work. 832 00:46:52,800 --> 00:46:55,680 I think we did a couple of evenings just to get, you know, 833 00:46:55,680 --> 00:46:58,200 be also conscious. Don't want people to burn out 834 00:46:58,200 --> 00:47:01,880 and, you know, because then that has a negative effect as well or 835 00:47:01,880 --> 00:47:03,360 people going off sick or whatever. 836 00:47:05,920 --> 00:47:09,840 So yeah, you just have to find the time and or bring an extra 837 00:47:09,840 --> 00:47:13,240 resource if you're able to and just make it work. 838 00:47:14,320 --> 00:47:16,640 I asked if she was there for the opening of the gallery. 839 00:47:17,520 --> 00:47:20,440 We sort of stood outside because we hadn't, because the doors 840 00:47:20,440 --> 00:47:23,440 that you went in this morning, everyone thought they were just, 841 00:47:23,440 --> 00:47:24,800 that was hoarding because they haven't. 842 00:47:24,920 --> 00:47:27,400 That's just how it was designed. It's going to look like that. 843 00:47:27,400 --> 00:47:29,000 So those doors were shut the whole time. 844 00:47:29,200 --> 00:47:32,280 So the first time we'd seen it open was the morning of the 845 00:47:32,280 --> 00:47:34,640 third. And then we sort of stood on the 846 00:47:34,640 --> 00:47:37,720 other side of the corridor, we got back to dinosaurs and just 847 00:47:37,720 --> 00:47:39,360 watched everyone go with an hour really. 848 00:47:39,360 --> 00:47:42,600 It was quite weird. And just watching how people 849 00:47:42,600 --> 00:47:48,320 were reacting and acting in the gallery and around the showcases 850 00:47:48,320 --> 00:47:51,480 and stuff. And it's always so busy. 851 00:47:51,800 --> 00:47:54,320 You are relieved. And it hasn't really ended. 852 00:47:54,320 --> 00:47:59,880 There's still lots of snagging and bits to continue with and 853 00:47:59,880 --> 00:48:03,200 reporting and stuff. But yeah, it was a bit like, oh 854 00:48:03,400 --> 00:48:05,320 God, I've done that. And it fell just in time for 855 00:48:05,320 --> 00:48:07,280 Easter whole day. So I think nearly all of us took 856 00:48:07,320 --> 00:48:10,280 breaks at different point and just like just forget about it 857 00:48:10,280 --> 00:48:13,400 for a few days. What approach does she take to 858 00:48:13,400 --> 00:48:15,600 projects? If you ask everyone in the 859 00:48:15,600 --> 00:48:17,800 office, they'll all just say how laid back I am. 860 00:48:18,720 --> 00:48:23,400 I don't get particularly panicked or stressed, and I 861 00:48:23,400 --> 00:48:26,600 guess I'm quite methodical in that way. 862 00:48:27,000 --> 00:48:31,640 And let's say it's all about priorities and listing what 863 00:48:31,640 --> 00:48:33,680 needs to be done when, what can wait? 864 00:48:33,680 --> 00:48:36,440 We can do that later. So rush for that and set in the 865 00:48:36,440 --> 00:48:38,120 right deadlines at the right time. 866 00:48:38,800 --> 00:48:43,400 And I just think, you know, I think we do is, is obviously for 867 00:48:43,400 --> 00:48:47,040 people to come and enjoy. And they don't see what I think 868 00:48:47,040 --> 00:48:50,240 that goes on behind the scenes, like whether, you know, blood, 869 00:48:50,240 --> 00:48:53,000 sweat and tears or whatever. And there's just no point 870 00:48:53,000 --> 00:48:56,560 getting what I'm trying to. They won't know if we've done 871 00:48:56,560 --> 00:48:58,240 something wrong. The visitors won't know if 872 00:48:58,240 --> 00:49:01,720 something you know that showcases that look quite right 873 00:49:01,720 --> 00:49:04,320 or whatever. So I don't feel all those. 874 00:49:04,320 --> 00:49:06,240 We always try. We always strive to get things 875 00:49:06,240 --> 00:49:09,160 absolutely right. It's not the end of the world if 876 00:49:09,160 --> 00:49:12,520 we don't. I guess you, you can't come in 877 00:49:12,720 --> 00:49:16,760 with two fixed like say I have this style of project management 878 00:49:17,120 --> 00:49:19,840 and that's that's it. Because it's not, it won't work 879 00:49:19,840 --> 00:49:23,960 here and you have to have a flexible approach, be good at 880 00:49:24,800 --> 00:49:28,360 communicating and be aware of all the different needs and 881 00:49:28,360 --> 00:49:31,840 expectations from all the different stakeholders and 882 00:49:31,840 --> 00:49:34,920 departments across the museum because No2 are the same. 883 00:49:36,760 --> 00:49:39,080 What is the new galleries in the programme now? 884 00:49:39,840 --> 00:49:42,880 Some are existing ones like we've done and need to be 885 00:49:42,880 --> 00:49:46,680 stripped out and started again. Or I think at least one of them 886 00:49:46,680 --> 00:49:49,640 is. Used to be a gallery, public 887 00:49:49,640 --> 00:49:54,560 gallery years and years ago, but has since been taken by 888 00:49:54,560 --> 00:49:57,240 collections and office space and whatever. 889 00:49:57,720 --> 00:50:00,320 So yeah, it's like we said earlier, it's about bringing 890 00:50:00,320 --> 00:50:04,240 back the fabric of the building to the visitors. 891 00:50:05,360 --> 00:50:08,200 Samantha Bannister, who project managed the design of the 892 00:50:08,200 --> 00:50:11,400 exhibition and who took me on the tour earlier, sat down with 893 00:50:11,400 --> 00:50:13,800 me and gave me a bit more background on her role and the 894 00:50:13,800 --> 00:50:18,600 work she's engaged in. I'm a project manager in the 895 00:50:19,240 --> 00:50:24,080 Estates projects master planning department, and really I manage 896 00:50:24,560 --> 00:50:28,960 public engagement projects. So these are things like ranging 897 00:50:28,960 --> 00:50:32,560 from permanent gallery spaces to temporary exhibitions and 898 00:50:32,560 --> 00:50:37,000 sometimes even commercial activities like the ice rink 899 00:50:37,000 --> 00:50:40,640 that we used to do before the Urban Nature project. 900 00:50:40,880 --> 00:50:44,000 And so, yeah, I'm really sort of on the the public engagement 901 00:50:44,000 --> 00:50:47,680 side of things versus we've got our buildings PM that they look 902 00:50:47,680 --> 00:50:50,600 into the infrastructure of of the building. 903 00:50:51,000 --> 00:50:55,920 What's her role on the project? So I came in as sort of the the 904 00:50:55,920 --> 00:51:00,360 start up stage just before we sort of kicked off concept 905 00:51:00,680 --> 00:51:03,720 design. So yeah, responsible for sort of 906 00:51:03,720 --> 00:51:07,520 setting the scope and the the parameters of the project, 907 00:51:07,800 --> 00:51:12,080 getting in any of the design team members that we needed. 908 00:51:12,240 --> 00:51:16,760 It was delivered in house by our NHM design studios. 909 00:51:16,760 --> 00:51:22,040 So 3D design was was covered, but we needed to get in our 2D 910 00:51:22,040 --> 00:51:29,240 designer QS PD. Three of the zones, the material 911 00:51:29,240 --> 00:51:35,040 zone, the energy zone and the food zone were zones that were 912 00:51:35,040 --> 00:51:38,080 represented in the original temporary exhibition. 913 00:51:38,080 --> 00:51:43,640 Some of the specimens that were in the temporary exhibition have 914 00:51:43,840 --> 00:51:47,480 been removed because they we have to consider how long 915 00:51:47,480 --> 00:51:51,360 they've been on gallery from the conservation conditioning 916 00:51:51,360 --> 00:51:55,960 perspective that we had to replace some of those stories in 917 00:51:55,960 --> 00:51:59,040 order that we weren't damaging our specimens. 918 00:51:59,520 --> 00:52:05,360 The longer a specimen will be on display, the more sort of 919 00:52:05,920 --> 00:52:08,200 detrimental that can be to a specimen. 920 00:52:08,400 --> 00:52:14,280 So your conditions have to be very set with temporary 921 00:52:14,280 --> 00:52:17,160 exhibition. A lot of those spaces are kind 922 00:52:17,160 --> 00:52:20,200 of like black box spaces, so there's there's no daylight in 923 00:52:20,200 --> 00:52:23,240 those galleries. So in order for us to be able to 924 00:52:23,240 --> 00:52:28,120 maximise what we can put on on display, but they're often on a 925 00:52:28,120 --> 00:52:32,120 run for seven months. So you can put things on that 926 00:52:32,120 --> 00:52:35,360 are considered more fragile because of the shorter time 927 00:52:35,360 --> 00:52:38,200 frame. Whereas for this gallery, it's 928 00:52:38,200 --> 00:52:40,600 meant to be in the space for a minimum of 10 years. 929 00:52:40,800 --> 00:52:44,760 You have to understand what specimens. 930 00:52:45,240 --> 00:52:47,240 Will be able to. Withstand that some of those 931 00:52:47,240 --> 00:52:52,160 specimens will need to be rotated out, some of the stories 932 00:52:52,160 --> 00:52:55,960 will need to be swapped later down the line in order that 933 00:52:55,960 --> 00:52:59,520 we're yeah, we're we're managing the risk to those specimens. 934 00:53:00,160 --> 00:53:04,760 The whole concept of the gallery is to enable us to update it as 935 00:53:04,760 --> 00:53:09,520 science changes. It's meant to be a much more 936 00:53:09,520 --> 00:53:14,800 sort of dynamic space, so we can swap stories in and out as the 937 00:53:14,800 --> 00:53:18,040 science around something changes, as something is more 938 00:53:19,280 --> 00:53:22,600 perhaps to the fore in the news, for example, like wildfires have 939 00:53:22,600 --> 00:53:26,000 been quite in the news at at the moment, but there may be 940 00:53:26,000 --> 00:53:31,000 something else that is more relevant to at the time that we 941 00:53:31,000 --> 00:53:32,480 want to represent on the gallery. 942 00:53:32,880 --> 00:53:35,680 It's ongoing. So, so the project team that we 943 00:53:35,680 --> 00:53:39,760 had to deliver this this exhibition has it's sort of 944 00:53:40,000 --> 00:53:45,920 disbanded and really the the the update side of things will be 945 00:53:46,000 --> 00:53:49,840 led by our interpretation team, who are the people that do the 946 00:53:49,840 --> 00:53:54,360 research into what stories we can tell and what specimens we 947 00:53:54,360 --> 00:53:58,720 can put on gallery when we come to do those swaps. 948 00:53:58,720 --> 00:54:01,720 Project management team will get involved again in order to 949 00:54:01,720 --> 00:54:04,640 coordinate that. But yeah, that's sort of 950 00:54:04,760 --> 00:54:09,000 specific looking at what stories we want to put on since outside 951 00:54:09,120 --> 00:54:11,840 project. Yeah, we designed it. 952 00:54:11,840 --> 00:54:16,880 And then in that time we're establishing the the content, 953 00:54:16,880 --> 00:54:19,480 the narrative, what specimens we can use. 954 00:54:20,720 --> 00:54:23,960 And then once all the design is finished and you've established 955 00:54:23,960 --> 00:54:28,240 what stories you're using, you go into the construction phase. 956 00:54:29,080 --> 00:54:32,640 So procuring principal contractors, procuring showcase 957 00:54:32,640 --> 00:54:40,520 manufacturers and then we had to procure with the 3D ceramic 958 00:54:40,520 --> 00:54:44,440 plinths as part of that subcontracted to our PC. 959 00:54:45,680 --> 00:54:47,640 Yeah. So there's a sort of an off site 960 00:54:47,760 --> 00:54:52,640 construction period where all of those things are being made, 961 00:54:52,640 --> 00:54:57,200 manufactured and then we bring them to start and install them 962 00:54:57,600 --> 00:55:01,760 in gallery. It started in the beginning of 963 00:55:01,760 --> 00:55:05,160 November and we opened the 3rd of April. 964 00:55:06,480 --> 00:55:08,960 I ask her what was the biggest challenge she faced. 965 00:55:10,160 --> 00:55:14,800 Our biggest change I think was around the the prints that are 966 00:55:14,800 --> 00:55:18,960 in the gallery. Those were developed, they're a 967 00:55:19,280 --> 00:55:23,440 3D printed ceramic. It's quite an innovative 968 00:55:24,200 --> 00:55:26,960 material to use. The reason reviews that is for 969 00:55:26,960 --> 00:55:31,400 sustainability reasons. It's made out of natural 970 00:55:31,400 --> 00:55:34,480 materials. It's all held together without 971 00:55:34,480 --> 00:55:39,200 the need for screws and the car footprint of things like screws 972 00:55:39,200 --> 00:55:41,160 we've sort of taken into account and stuff. 973 00:55:41,560 --> 00:55:45,160 But because it's an innovative product, we had to go through 974 00:55:45,160 --> 00:55:47,040 quite a bit of prototyping with that. 975 00:55:47,040 --> 00:55:52,200 And we had some issues with things not drying correctly and 976 00:55:52,200 --> 00:55:56,480 therefore not firing correctly. So it was quite a process to 977 00:55:56,480 --> 00:55:59,800 sort of get that right. And that was quite sort of a 978 00:55:59,800 --> 00:56:05,080 linchpin moment in our programme in terms of we can, we got the 979 00:56:05,080 --> 00:56:08,920 showcases in and then we wrapped the showcases with those clips. 980 00:56:09,240 --> 00:56:12,360 And that was sort of the major bit of work that was really 981 00:56:12,360 --> 00:56:15,240 happening in that gallery. So we had a long lead time of 982 00:56:15,240 --> 00:56:19,880 like enabling works waiting for these ceramic clips to come in. 983 00:56:20,760 --> 00:56:22,320 What lessons will she take from it? 984 00:56:23,120 --> 00:56:28,240 So the whole sort of the point of of this as well was it wasn't 985 00:56:28,240 --> 00:56:33,760 necessarily for us to create the most sustainable gallery 986 00:56:33,880 --> 00:56:37,200 possible though, because as I said, there were constraints 987 00:56:37,200 --> 00:56:41,400 around that. But for really for us to attempt 988 00:56:41,440 --> 00:56:45,440 to reduce our sort of cup footprint around our gallery 989 00:56:45,440 --> 00:56:48,080 production. But really so that we can sort 990 00:56:48,080 --> 00:56:53,600 of create an initial assessment of how this gallery has 991 00:56:53,600 --> 00:56:57,960 performed so that future galleries can look back at what 992 00:56:57,960 --> 00:57:01,120 we've done and understand where they could improve on the 993 00:57:01,120 --> 00:57:03,320 process. So it's really to yeah, to 994 00:57:03,320 --> 00:57:07,680 create this is an assessment from a sort of carbon 995 00:57:07,680 --> 00:57:11,760 perspective of delivering this gallery so that yeah, future 996 00:57:11,760 --> 00:57:18,360 galleries can try to improve in terms of the next galleries. 997 00:57:18,640 --> 00:57:24,400 We've taken a lesson around the working in parallel on the base 998 00:57:24,400 --> 00:57:27,240 field side of things as well as the exhibition development side 999 00:57:27,240 --> 00:57:30,760 of things. Whereas for this, for this 1000 00:57:30,760 --> 00:57:38,000 exhibition of this gallery, the base build was very much in 1001 00:57:38,000 --> 00:57:40,360 front of the exhibition development. 1002 00:57:40,480 --> 00:57:44,480 And that was some around the decision about what was going to 1003 00:57:44,480 --> 00:57:48,160 be put in there. And we didn't know that FOBP was 1004 00:57:48,160 --> 00:57:52,080 going to be the gallery that we were going with at that stage, 1005 00:57:52,960 --> 00:57:55,960 but it just meant that the interface between the two 1006 00:57:55,960 --> 00:58:00,800 projects were there was some some things that had been sort 1007 00:58:00,800 --> 00:58:03,480 of developed as part of the exhibition. 1008 00:58:03,480 --> 00:58:08,120 The base build that had we known the exhibition was going into 1009 00:58:08,120 --> 00:58:11,240 it, we probably would have looked to do slightly 1010 00:58:11,240 --> 00:58:15,280 differently. So going forward across all of 1011 00:58:15,280 --> 00:58:19,520 our new galleries, we are working more in parallel with 1012 00:58:19,520 --> 00:58:22,000 that base build and that exhibition development of the 1013 00:58:22,000 --> 00:58:26,760 base build can more easily achieve what the exhibition 1014 00:58:26,760 --> 00:58:31,400 design requires. I leave the project office and 1015 00:58:31,400 --> 00:58:34,080 I'm emerging to a throng of museum visitors. 1016 00:58:34,640 --> 00:58:37,160 It's been a privilege to go behind the scenes at the museum 1017 00:58:37,160 --> 00:58:39,880 and understand what it takes to put together a new gallery like 1018 00:58:39,880 --> 00:58:43,160 this and how's this fits into the institution's globally 1019 00:58:43,160 --> 00:58:45,720 important role in combating climate change. 1020 00:58:46,240 --> 00:58:48,960 No matter which sector you work in, I hope you found something 1021 00:58:48,960 --> 00:58:51,960 in our conversations that might inspire you or help you in your 1022 00:58:51,960 --> 00:58:55,280 project work. Anyway, thanks again to Meg, 1023 00:58:55,320 --> 00:58:58,680 Sophie, Sherry, Louise and Samantha for joining me and to 1024 00:58:58,680 --> 00:59:00,720 you for listening to the APM Podcast. 1025 00:59:01,560 --> 00:59:03,960 Just to mention, you can find out more about my Natural 1026 00:59:03,960 --> 00:59:07,800 History Museum visit in the Autumn 2025 issue of Project 1027 00:59:07,800 --> 00:59:08,960 Journal. Don't miss it. 1028 00:59:09,600 --> 00:59:12,480 And don't forget to look out for more episodes or to rate and 1029 00:59:12,480 --> 00:59:14,440 review us. Wherever you get your podcasts. 1030 00:59:15,160 --> 00:59:17,920 We'd welcome you to get in touch with your comments, feedback and 1031 00:59:17,920 --> 00:59:22,040 suggestions by emailing us at APM Podcast at 1032 00:59:22,040 --> 00:59:25,920 thinkpublishing.co.uk. This podcast has been brought to 1033 00:59:25,920 --> 00:59:29,240 you by APM, the chartered body for the project profession. 1034 00:59:29,960 --> 00:59:33,680 For more information on APM, visit apm.org.uk.