Hi everybody. It's me.
Katie asaurus and welcome back to infinite Quest this week on
the podcast. We were honored and genuinely
surprised to have author educator and just all-around
badass. Casey Davis aka domestic
blisters from over on tick tock on the podcast.
However, Casey Davis is a fascinating human being and I
felt like she is a guest who really needs a bio before we
start the episode. And so full disclosure, I'm
reading this off of Her website because I want to get it, right?
But Casey Davis is a licensed, professional therapist, she's an
author, she's a speaker. And most importantly, she is the
person behind the mental health platform, struggle care, and
domestic blisters over on Tick. Tock.
So, Casey began her therapy Journey when she was 16 when she
entered treatment for drug addiction and mental health
issues. After she got sober, she became
a speaker and advocate, for mental health, and recovery, and
professionally. Casey has worked most of her
career in the field of addiction in rolls.
Like therapist consultant and executive director, like I said,
earlier, she's also the author of the best-selling book how to
keep house. While drowning, which if you
haven't read, you need to. I'm not saying you should.
I'm saying you absolutely need to.
If you're listening to this podcast you need to own Casey's
book. We have put a link to the new
and updated revised pre-order in the show notes.
You can check that out and we will have more information up on
our website about Casey and all of the incredible work that
she's doing. in later, but full disclosure of I have recorded
this seven separate times because that's how my day's
going and Eric's phone just rang.
So you know what? We're going to leave it in but
we're gonna have a whole page for Casey over on infinite Quest
podcast.com. But today is not that day
because GoDaddy is broken. So we will get that up as soon
as we can. But we couldn't wait to drop
this episode because honestly, it's just really fantastic and
I'm super excited about it. So, thank you for listening,
thank you for being here. We're sorry about Eric and get
ready. Because here comes the show.
Oh boy. You near near near near near new
new, new new, new judge Kebab that was Doug.
Hey everybody, it's me. Katie asaurus and welcome back
to infinite Quest. So hey, you probably found me on
Tick Tock and if you didn't, what are you doing here?
But we have a very special guest this day, you know, her as
domestic blisters over on Tick-Tock and you know, where is
Casey Davis in real life. It's Casey Davis, thanks for
being here case Davis. Hello, I am.
This is probably the most excited.
I've been to be on a podcast so far.
I'm really well. Thanks for being, I'm really
excited. So uh, oh my gosh, I have so
many, I have 10,000 questions to ask you, but the first one is
just Qui. Why, how did you get into all
this? How did you, how did you start
this whole thing? I know I'm going to start with
the hard-hitting journalistic question.
Listen, it was an accident. Yeah, it was 100% an accident.
I came to tick tock and the spring of twenty twenty right
after the shutdown. I just had a baby like,
literally weeks before I was drowning.
And postpartum depression. My house was totally not
functioning. I was overwhelmed, my husband
had just started a new job as an attorney is like and literally
his first job. Like, you just got out of law
school. So he's working seven days a
week and I live in a city where I don't have any family around.
I have a newborn in a two year old and my sister tells me to
get on Tick, Tock, and I do when I'm like, what is this dancing?
I hate it, but she got to put in the work and I was like, all
right? And I posted like some video.
Adios here and there and then one day I posted my sort of like
at this point, famous five things tidying.
Yeah Tick-Tock and I almost didn't post it.
Like I was like, is this is this stupid?
Like is this? Not valuable like are people
going to be like this is common sense.
Are people going to like judge me for how messy my houses?
But I did it. Anyways and people I was just
surprised how many people resonated with it particularly
how many people said I've never had a piece of cleaning advice
that's ever helped me until this one.
Yeah and I just sort of started answering questions and you know
because I'm a therapist, the amount of people that said like
I feel so much shame over not being able to clean or tidy.
Then I started answering that and I just started talking to
people and I take talk is like the perfect platform for me
because I'm not a great writer. It's hard for me to think of
things to say, for a long period of time, but if people are
asking me questions, I could talk for a million years.
Well, okay, so well, sorry, I didn't mean to cut you off, but
like so you said that you're not a great writer.
But like here you are on version 2 of how to keep household
drowning. So, how did, how did that come
about? So after about six months of
talking about, you know, cleaning out the intersection
between like a mental health and cleaning house in a
relationship, you're to your space.
People with jump in, start following me and ask questions
and I would want to be like just go to the beginning of The
Tick-Tock and watch them all because I sort of developed like
these foundational principles that I felt people needed to
kind of grasp before building upon that.
So I originally had the idea to write the book because I just
wanted there to be a place for people to go to sort of take in
all of the philosophy at once. Yeah.
And I had these ideas and I kept sitting down at a blank piece of
paper, like word, doc and not being able to do anything.
And over and over and over, and over and over.
I've always wanted to write a book and so what I did was I
thought, okay, screw it. I went back to the beginning of
my tech talk and I started transcribing word for word.
Every tick tock where I talked about like a concept that I
wanted to put in the book. Yeah.
And then I sort of edited it for readability and then I was like,
okay the next step is to like string all these Concepts
together until like a chapter book and Katie I couldn't do it.
Like I couldn't organize in my head like how did how they all
connected? Yeah.
And so for weeks I just stared at it and started it and I
finally came to the conclusion that I could either publish a
book that was just a bunch of disjointed paragraphs.
Or I could not publish a well-done real book.
Yeah. So I was like, fuck it.
I'm gonna just, I'm just gonna publish it as disjointed
paragraphs and in a being, like, 60 pages and like it as most of
the people that I've ever read the first edition.
Now, like the chapters are like a few paragraphs of peace.
I love it, though. Because of that, you know, like
it's I mean I know that this is an interview about you, but
we're Also working on our book and it's we're having the same
thing. Like we're completely
overwhelmed all the time trying to figure it out.
And like obviously I saw your like when I got your book, I was
like, oh, this is just how I should write the book.
Like, this is just this. It's a perfect model, it's
perfect. 100% is how you should read?
Write it? Because here's the thing.
Katie, is that everyone that read it was like man.
I wish I could show you some of the emails like one that I'll
never forget, was this woman who said my husband died five years
ago and I To love to read. But since he died, I have not
been able to read one book until yours.
People who have ADHD people who are autistic people that have
learning disabilities. Saying, this is the first book.
I've been able to read. This is the first time I haven't
been overwhelmed, like there was information in this book.
I knew could help me, and I could actually access it.
Yeah. And the most incredible thing
is, like, people now, it's like, the big interview question is
like, what gave you the idea to like, write a book?
That's so accessible for a readers?
Mmm. And the answer is, like, I
didn't I didn't write a book to be accessible to readers.
I wrote a book that was accessible to me to write it.
Yeah. I mean, the only way I could
write it and it ended up being like exactly what everyone
needed. And so, I love it.
It's like minor 0. Divergence.
My like my limitations, mmm, ended up creating a book that
was perfect for the limitations of the people that want to
access the material. I mean it's phenomenal is what
it is. I love it so much.
It's like it was like it's like sitting literally like on my
bedside table right now. I was going to bring it up
because I was like I should like have it for the interview that I
was like, no. It's in my spot where I'm
reading it. But okay.
So you also said something really interesting about like
just be the the ability to access information and so like
I'm really interested in your background as a therapist
because I feel like you know, you came to take back and we
like it's weird too because like we've had He's very similar
Tick-Tock Journeys. I think in a lot of ways but
you're like, a professional. And I'm just some dipshit on the
internet. But like, how like, how do you
find? Like, I guess, how do you think
about making your message accessible?
Like, what goes into that process?
Well, it was interesting by way of the book.
When, you know, the book got picked up by Simon & Schuster
and we talked about, we want to expand the book.
We We wanted to make it longer my number-one, like goal was to
continue to have the book be accessible and talking about
like creative ways that we can do that.
And that's how we came up with the idea.
You know, we kept the chapter short, but that's also how we
came up with the idea of, like the shortcut through the book
and Bolding all of the main points, putting in the literal
metaphors, like all these things, so that people could
continue to do that and doing the audio book.
And I think that Tick-Tock itself is just like kind of
geared towards Minds like ours. Yeah, like I told someone the
other day, like, okay, if I had like six subjects, I wanted to
learn about. Like let's say I want to learn
about ADHD anti-racism meteorology and like, you know,
like just six subjects. Yeah.
If you gave me like, six audiobooks I wouldn't get
through them. Yeah.
Or if you gave me like six lectures or sick, like I
wouldn't get through them, but if you gave me one feed and you
took all six of those subjects and broke those like hours, long
lectures and to 30, second increments and allowed me to
listen to all six lectures simultaneously, 30 seconds at a
time. Like, I would learn so much and
I have learned so much like it's the perfect platform for like, I
these are all subjects I'm interested in, but at the same
time, I need them in small clips and so it hits all of those
like, every swipe is novel. Yeah, every swipe feels urgent,
every swipe is interesting. And it's fascinating to me how
like I couldn't, I mean, I have a seat you about eight eighty HD
that I want to get through desperately and it's so Hard.
But yet like I learned so much through the psychologists on
Tick-Tock because they're giving it to me in these 30 second
increments. And so I think that like some of
it is I'm getting better about talking and making things.
It just it makes me be as short as possible.
I guess is what it is. No.
That's that makes total sense. Well, okay.
And one of the things that I was and this I'm going to confess
Jess this to you. So I don't know if you know this
or not, but when I first started watching your content, I was
like, oh, she has eight HD. Like, I was like, clearly, she's
a mom with ADHD and she has like our ADHD house.
Like the all this great. I love this lady's content and
then at some point in like, one of your videos, you said I don't
have ADHD. I was like bitch.
What? And then like later on, like
just like in the past year right?
You got your official diagnosis? Yeah.
What was what was that?
Like, this is like the funniest story to this day.
Okay. So you have to understand like
background wise like I come to tick tock like I start talking
about like these weird ways in which I think about my home and
how I was like, optimizing my home.
And I'm also like going through this journey at the same time as
the audience like I began optimizing my home as I'm
talking to people about optimizing my home.
Yeah, and the first thing I notice is that, like, so many
people who are saying, like, wow, this is really helping me
say, like, I'm ADHD. This really helps me.
I'm like, huh, that's cool. That's cool.
And and people start to say like, are you ADHD?
And so what happens for me is that like I have this weird like
imposter syndrome almost where? Like I yes I'm sure.
Yes. I have some mental health
struggles but I also Also, like, I'm fine.
Like I'm, I'm relatively happy, like I.
So I have what I have in my mind is like I want to be transparent
and authentic, I never want to pretend to be quote unquote,
like more mentally ill than I am to gain followers if that makes
sense. Yeah, absolutely.
And I don't want to like, pretend to be ADHD to gain
followers and things like that. So and I have this fear that,
like, if If I talk about some of these struggles that I have
people who know me in real life are going to be like oh she's
put into pretending to like be broken now.
Yeah, because I have like a pretty successful career like
with the exception of addiction and my teenage years like I was
pretty good at school like I'm pretty intelligent all the all
these things where The stereotypical picture of what it
looks like to be a THD. Was not something that I related
to MMM. Yeah, I don't know anything
about that. Right?
And so with people, literally, my followers kept saying Casey,
like we're not trying to diagnose you but God damn girl
like this looks exactly like ADHD.
Yeah, yeah. Like the impetus to, like, go
seek diagnosis, then Lippy literally, okay, that's really
fascinating. To me, I was told by my
followers, go get a freaking assessment and, and I had this,
it was weird. I really did feel like, well I
don't deserve to call myself neurodivergent.
I've been relatively successful like there's nothing to which I
can point. That is really like hung me up.
Yeah, and I was seeing a psychiatrist at the Time for
postpartum depression. Hmm.
And I just switched to a new one because the one I was seeing
like only sees you for your first year postpartum.
So I get to this new psychologist and I say I also
want to talk about like ADHD and I was told by her staff that
she's like well she will not diagnose her assess you like you
have to go get the psychological testing for it and then she can
treat you for it which I think is probably just a common thing,
right? But she kind of just brings it
up. Like, oh, you say you had
concerns here about ADHD and I was like yeah, she's like well
Makes you think that you have a PhD.
And I remember thinking like, I'm about to say something
really embarrassing. I was like, so you know,
Tick-Tock she was like, yeah, I was like, I have a rather large
Tick-Tock following and they have all told me that they think
I have ADHD. She was like, I'm sorry what?
And I was like yeah. And I just like I really relate
to a lot of the people who are talking about have ADHD and yada
yada yada. She was like, okay, so like what
things in your life Make you think that?
And because it was a like, Telehealth one I was like.
So for example I like bring her into my kitchen right?
Which looks like it hasn't been cleaned in several days.
Yeah. And like, so, for example, I've
been trying to create the system where I can make my house
functional. And so, I have this little list
and I'm like, scuse me, scuse me.
I'm like moving things all around my desk and I'm like,
here it is. Here it is.
Here's the list. And, and there's only five
things on this list, but you see dr.
S. If I don't look at the list, I
can't remember the five things, it's the five things, same order
every night and I can't remember it.
In fact, I can't remember anything and I'm starting to
think that the only reason that I ever know what in my house
needs to be done is because I see it but then I start doing
something else and I forget about it but then I see it again
and I realize it. But like that's no way to live.
I can't keep track of all these tasks just as I visually seeing
them and everything has to be visually organized.
I can't do apps. I can't do writing notes in my
Mind, like, everything has to be.
I said, I look like somebody who is putting together a conspiracy
board, like, with the strings, and the pillars and it said that
is how I have to organize my whole life.
So I do this for like 10 minutes straight and then she goes.
Mmm, well, I will send you some self assessments but you this is
a very Your presentation of adult, female ADHD, proud of
you, and this moment, I'll send you the assessments, but you
can, you can take it to the bank, this woman, like, she
doesn't even make me go, get the testing.
She's like, oh no, this is very clear.
And like, it's since then, it's so obvious.
Now that I know what's happening, and so many things in
my life makes sense because she starts asking, this is the Other
part that's wild. She starts asking me about my
childhood. And I said, well, I always did
well in school unless there was a diction present and she said,
well, what do you mean? And I said, well, I always sat
in the front of the class, I always listened.
I said, but I never did my homework, but I always listen to
the lectures. The lectures were always
interesting. And so what I would do in
schools, I'd sit in the front, I would listen to the lectures.
I participate in class and then I would Ace every single test
and quiz, but I never did my homework.
But because of the way, the grades were weighted I could get
zeros on every homework assignment.
Still get an A in the class. Yeah I said and when I moved up
to high school they did not. Wait grades that way.
And when I moved to high school, the things on the test were over
things that we didn't go over and class.
It was things you read in the homework and in grade school
wasn't like that there were it wasn't like extra stuff.
You were reading that you didn't also here in lecture and she was
like I mean yeah. Yeah.
Like, so what you're saying is, like, when you were in a
structure, you did well. And when you left that
classroom, you either forgot to write down the assignment.
You close the notebook and forgot that the assignment was
written down. You had no external structure
for getting this homework done. And I was like, yeah.
But I also like I was not distracted, right?
Because that picture of like the young white boy who can't and
that's when she explains to me. Like, you know, ADHD isn't about
not being able to pay attention. It's about not being able to
regulate your attention. Yeah.
And the reason nobody caught it in you Casey is because you were
interested in school. I just how the fuck, are we the
same person? That's what I am.
Dear Lord. Um well.
Okay, speaking of being the same person, um one of the things
that I like and I being real, truly appreciate about your
content is that That you show your house, you show the mess,
you show the Clutter you show the.
The I won't say disorganization but you know the organization
that works for you and it was one of the first times like and
it's so funny because people say this to me.
But now I'm saying it to you but it's like it was one of the
first times that I saw somebody's house that looked
like mine. It was the first time that I was
like oh my God like you can be a brilliant intelligent woman and
like also have a kitchen that looks like a kitchen, you know?
And so like, I guess like I feel like I'm like wasting you on the
podcast. If I don't ask you for like, you
know, you're like top five pieces of advice.
But first, I want to hear about the magnets, how did okay, how
did the magnets start? How did the magnet academy has
happened? Are they working still?
Is this? Is this a new says, like, how is
it? How is it going with the
magnets? Okay, so my so as you guys know,
heard, My husband's a lawyer, I was actually a stay-at-home mom
when I started my tic toc Channel.
And, you know, since my Tick-Tock Channel took off, I
wrote the book and I have a web site, I've all these other
projects and so I actually a few months ago, transitioned our I
guess admitted to myself like I'm not a stay-at-home mom, I'm
actually a work at home mom. Like I'm actually working, I
actually have a lot of things to do and my husband and I hired
someone to Nanny are two small kids during the day so that I
had this protected time to work. So, we have this big transition,
where I went from basically a full-time stay-at-home mom to a
working parent. So with that, like my husband
and I realized like we really need to read divide our like
division of family labor in the home because you know we've had
some shifts and I had learned about this book called Fairplay
which is written by Eve Rod ski and she's a lawyer and she
basically wrote this book about dividing labor and about about
how so many marriages end in divorce over the issue of
division of labor. Yeah.
And it's not as simple as who's cleaning the toilets.
It's about like this growing resentment from the person
socialized, as a woman that they're carrying all of this
mental load, all of these tasks, and they begin to feel resentful
and unappreciated and it eventually erodes, their trust
and respect of each other. Yeah, and she came up with the
system for Fairly dividing labor between Sort of heteronormative
couples and I really want it. I mean, I get questions about
division of labor a lot on my channel.
And so, I was like, this is the perfect example, this is a
perfect opportunity. Let's use this system because a,
I think it would help us be. Then I can talk about it on my
tech Channel. That's my husband's like great,
whatever. Some yeah.
So, we read this book, and in the book, she basically says
like she lists out all of these different like tasks and
spheres. Ears and she does a good job of
both, like the physical tasks, like who's going to pick up the
kid, but also like the mental labor, like, who's thinking
about charity? Or who's thinking about the
mental health of? Yeah, you know, whatever
whatever. Yeah, and she has this card deck
which has like, I think 86 cards and she basically devises it
like a game, like you deal the deck and you have these times
when you come back together and talk about whether it's working
and you can read deal the deck and, you know, some car To your
maybe re dealing from day to day, right?
Like we, if you really both of you hate dishes, maybe your re
dealing dishes every day. Like today, I'm dishes, tomorrow
your dishes, and then maybe you have like the romance card where
it's like this month. I'm thinking about setting up
our dates and the next month you are so we deal this deck, you
know, there's like 76 tasks that we come up with but now I have
like a deck of 76 cards and me being ADHD like I'm like I'm
like this isn't visual enough for me.
Me like I'm not going to remember all of these tasks and
and Michael mentioned something similar.
Like how am I going to remember all of this?
Yeah. Particularly because there are
tasks that switch back and forth at different frequencies.
Yeah. So that's when I had this idea.
Like what I want to do is like put each task on a little
magnet, like the magazine anklets are like a little bit
bigger than a quarter and get like a Magnet board and like
split it in half like okay, here's your tasks, here's my
tasks that way like we can when we're switching tasks like just
move the little icon across and we can see big picture, what
we're doing and the other thing that's incredible about it is
that it really gives like a sense of appreciation because
visually like you're looking and seeing how much labor like both
of you are doing for that family?
Yeah. Yeah.
So I went to Etsy and I found this this like Etsy shop called
the Buttercup house. She makes chore magnets.
That's so funny, email her. And I'm like, I have a custom
list and she's like, great and she made me these custom magnet
76 magnets. And she actually messaged me the
other day, I was like, are you famous on the internet?
And I was like, she's like, because I'm getting a lot of
orders and I was like and then her life.
Changed forever, she's like, a nice share the list with people.
I'm like yes, sure, the list. So it's mostly e, vronsky's Fair
playlist, but then we added some extra things that like pertain
to us. Yeah.
And so now, I have these 76 magnets, and I'm like, I'm going
to go probably today and like, get a board.
And the thing that I love about this system, Katie is that,
like, her whole thing revolves around this concept called
unicorn space and the Unicorn space is The the place in which
you reclaim the right to be interesting.
Okay. And I like this outfit, this is
particularly something that comes up when couples have been
together a long time, especially after they have children.
Yeah because when you get bogged down as the main family labor
person because care tasks are cyclical and never-ending like
you very quickly can run out of having any time space or energy
to do anything other. And fulfill your role in that
family. Yeah absolutely.
And so the Unicorn space is your right to be interesting where
you have to pick something that makes you feel one of the
following like Words alive. Passionate interesting
captivated, or something like that.
I don't remember the exact words.
And so like this whole conversation about division of
labor, it's she the way she sets it up.
It's not about you. Do this.
Usually the it's both of us are All people who deserve to be
passionate and have lives and identities outside of whatever
role were playing in this family.
Yeah. And so you start by picking your
unicorn space and so like I picked, I'm actually doing a
podcast with a friend of mine that has nothing to do with
anything. I do on Tick Tock and it's just
fun, right? And so I'm like this is my
unicorn space. This is the thing I'm going to
do and and you make this commitment of like the whole
point of dividing our labor is so that like we can protect each
other's time. In space and capacity to like do
these things. So, in my board, it's going to
be like name at the top and then there's going to be a line that
says unicorn space so that like whatever season and you can
change your thing right. But like it's written there and
it's amazing because now like let's say that lets say that my
husband chooses like golf like he loves Golf and he has not had
the time to play golf in a long time.
But now, instead of going to play golf being a thing where
it's like, man, I really shouldn't leave Casey home with
the kids. Or me being like, oh, he's going
to play golf. It's like I'm excited for him.
Yeah, right. Yeah.
And then moving underneath, that is going to be our magnets and
our magnets are broken up into several categories.
So the first category of magnets is called The Daily Grind.
These are the tasks that have to be done every single day day in
day out. Pretty much like on its own
schedule. So, these are things like
dishes, laundry, feeding things like that and so we make sure
that those are well balanced. And then there are things that
Like, purely mental labor. So, like spirituality, the
mental health of our children romance special needs things
that like they might have some tasks related to them but the
majority of the labor is just like making the time to think
about it. Yeah.
And then we have our tasks that are related to our home but they
don't have to be done every day. So we divide those up and then
we have our children tasks, things related to our children,
and we divide those up. And the whole idea of the magnet
is like when you own it and this is what Eve says you own the CPE
which is conception planning execution.
I like that because that's not like will write me a list and
I'll do it. It's no I'm not make the list
myself, we love that. We love that and I think it's
perfect for people who are neurodivergent because it gives
you it empowers you to create the system that works for you.
So like if I have dishes And I decide well, if I'm the one
loading up, the dishwasher at night, I know what my like
unique barriers around dishes are.
Like I know that I'm not somebody who can get dishes,
into the dishwasher as I go along.
Like, I work better with having like, not thinking about dishes
forever and then having 20 minutes to think about dishes,
right? Yeah.
But I'm also overwhelmed by a
big stack of dishes. I'm also like overwhelmed with
dishes in the sink. So like when I decide I'm going
to get a dish rack And we're going to put our dirty dishes on
the dish rack, all throughout the day, because then at the end
of the day, I can set aside time to load the dishwasher but then
because they're organized. It's not visually overwhelming
to me. Yeah, and our sink is functional
all day long. Like basically the idea is like
my partner doesn't get to say shit because it's mine.
I own the whole thing I can come up with whatever system.
Now obviously he gets a say and to whether that impedes on like,
Is functioning in the house. Yeah.
But like, I own laundry and we don't feel.
We don't fold our clothes. Yeah.
Well, okay. I want to talk to you about that
specifically because this is a true story.
I did a lecture last night for group of professional organizers
and I think I talked about you more than I talked about myself
like death, but I like one of the things that came up was
like, how do you develop systems?
I was like, oh my God. Okay, so there's this lady, her
name is domestic lister's but I'm I'm fast like it again, like
I'm fangirling out a little bit. It's fine were all fine, but
like you were one of the first like people and I didn't, I
wasn't interacting like, you know, it's like we like I just
Tick Tock but you were one of the first people who like we're
just like, hey, the system doesn't have to be like a, you
know, quote unquote normal system if it works for you and I
was like my brain is exploding like how like I'm so fascinated.
That what like First like, how you came to sort of that
discovery of, like, it's okay to not fold your laundry because I
put my laundry in bins and I have felt guilty about that for
years, you know. So like how did you come to like
creating those systems that just work for you and honestly like
fuck everybody else? And then like how did you go
about if you did like just kind of like releasing that guilt and
shame surrounding like the expectation that like it's Has
to be something different cause I'm fascinated by your work in
this. So this is something random, but
I love Grey's Anatomy, and there's like this pivotal scene
that's burned into my mind when so Cristina Yang is like one of
the most talented like surgeons on the team, right?
And she's like, top of her class top of the, whatever there's
this pivotal like, burned into my brain scene.
Where She takes her boyfriend like her boyfriends.
Like why don't we ever spend the night at your apartment?
And she finally takes them to his apartment and she like gives
him this debrief before she opens the door and it's like I
remember this episode. I know what you're talking
about, okay. Yes, I remember this episode.
But proceed for those who have it.
She's like, no matter what you see, like, please still love me,
basically, like I can't prepare you for this.
And he's like, what are you talking about?
Like there's gonna be dead bodies in there something.
So she opens the door and it is The messiest apartment you've
ever seen and she like, reveals that instead of doing laundry,
she just buys new underwear every week and he like looks
around and you can see it on her face.
She's like bracing for the rejection and the Judgment.
Hmm, and he just looks at her and says, he's like a really,
really tiny guy. So he just looks at her and goes
Okay. And that's it.
And like she has this moment where she's loved, despite the
fact that she has shown this like deep dark secret of being a
messy person. Yeah.
And I don't even know how I'm going to connect that to
anything else I'm going to say, but like that actually had a
really big impact on me as a person.
Yeah. Because I am that way.
Like, I am the person who early in my marriage made salmon and
then didn't wash dishes for two weeks and got maggots.
Yeah, like I am that person who, you know, has had coffee cups
mold on my bedside table while I look at it every day and go.
Oh God, I should do something about that.
That I want, you know, like right now there is a multi
coffee cup on this desk like automobiles like yep that's yep.
I just noticed it. I was like, oh yeah, it's been
there for like three days, a great.
Cool, cool, cool. And I think that getting sober
at a really young age and having to do a lot of work around
worthiness and a lot of work around like being 100% honest
about myself and the things that I thought were shameful And
getting into that practice of both doing a lot of therapy and
doing a lot of recovery work where you're encouraged to like
just put your whole self out there and I just, I really did
have enough times and enough experiences where I said the
thing that I thought was going to do me to rejection and
worthlessness and somebody did not run screaming from the room.
Yeah. Like that experience over and
over and over solidified for me. This idea that I am a person
that is Worthy. And I really got into a lot of
Brunei, Browns, work and dr. Kristin Neff, who talked about
Shane vulnerability and self-compassion.
And, you know, I was a therapist for a long time in the realm of
addiction. But the other thing that I did
was I was a compliance manager. Mmm, I'm uh, I'm sort, I'm a
weirdo. And that I love the therapy
aspect, but I also am somebody who worked in healthcare.
Compliance. So I was the person who was
designing systems, I would read the giant Manual of like the
joint commission for Hospital policies and I would figure out
like there's all these things you have to do.
And I and my brain just naturally worked in this way
where it's like, okay if we have to meet all of these goals and
do all these things, and follow these policies, we're going to
have to create systems. Yeah.
That get all of these things done because no person.
It's just going to remember this list, right?
And so creating a system for quality control and all these
things that feel very vague but actually had very specific
systems and I loved it. Katie like I loved coming up
with systems for how to get things done and I never worked
at a place for more than a couple of years, because what I
love to do is go into a place, figure out what's wrong, fix it.
And then I get bored and I want to leave.
Yeah, that and I always thought that I was just irresponsible.
Isabel. And that was like a bad thing
about me because I don't have like so but it's not, it's just
my brain. And so I think that like this
background of creating systems to solve problems and being a
therapist and having like a pretty good sense of worthiness
and things like that, but I'd never actually applied any of
that to my home until I started my Tick Tock Channel.
Hmm, there were a few things that I'd sort of like my little
five things Tiding, right? But I Really, what happened was
like, the universe just took an ADHD brain.
That is good at systems. That tends to hyper focus on
things. Anyways, and locked me in my
house for two weeks and so I genuinely just started like, I'm
incapable of thinking, like, a deeply about things and I didn't
have anything else to think about.
Hmm. And so, I just like, started
looking around and it having philosophical fucking thoughts
about my Laundry and creating systems and then people were
into it. And then I like that.
I mean, it literally was like, I'm convinced you just, they
just took my undiagnosed unmedicated ADHD brain locked.
It in a house where I didn't have anything to think about
except for my chronic laundry pile and I just started fixing
shit. Yeah.
And creating systems and it wasn't, it was hard for me to
give myself permission to go outside of the box.
But when Buddy would ask when someone would say, you know, I
just can't seem to get my laundry folded.
I'd be like, well, soft holding it and I feel like I should stop
holding it to I I have I have 10,000 more questions but we
had, it's getting to be the wrap-up time and now I'm sad
because I just want to have the conversation for forever.
Okay, so this is this going to be the lightning round.
What is like, your number one piece of advice for like the
person who might be listening to this going like I have just
found you. I've just found your content
like I'm just starting this journey on my own.
Like, what is your advice for that?
Like first. First day of like, it's time to
accept yourself for who you are. Yeah, my first advice is to hear
this sentence. And the sentence is, this care
tasks are morally neutral. They have nothing to do with
being a good or bad person that we're going to stop thinking
about whether something is good enough, and we're going to start
thinking about whether something functions in your home.
And that you are a person who deserves to function, even if
you don't like yourself, and there's nothing actionable about
that advice, Or step. And I think that that's
important like we all we often want to jump into these Biggs
intricate sentence in systems because we have all this is it
this is going to revolutionize if this is going to whatever
like this is why every book about how to optimize your life
is like behind me on my shelf and very few of those habits.
Am I still doing? Yeah.
And so I think that allowing yourself the time to just sort
of marinate on the idea that The way that you do or don't do care
tasks or approach care tasks is has nothing to do with your
character. I was I just like again, I know
that that I'm interviewing you, but I just want to say for the
record that you were the first person who told me that and that
changed my life and I am so grateful to you for that, like I
was like, oh I don't have to feel like a shitty person for
not. Okay, okay, cool.
The what what that's a shift? Okay, second question.
What is the most useful thing that you own that?
You feel like every neurodivergent person should
have, man, there are so many, but Like, um, like lightning
round it. So, if you want to do like, more
than one, it's okay, this is. No, I'm gonna give you guys far
as like products go. There are two things.
I have two timers in my life that are incredible.
Right. I have a big, what's called a
visual timer? It's a big round timer and when
you turn the dial, it like, makes whatever time a different
color. And this is really helpful for
time, blindness. When you don't you have a hard
time, conceptualizing And time. Because what it does is that it
allows you to visual visualize time as a percentage.
Yeah. As a instead of a number.
Yeah, that's really helpful. My kids also use it, they
respond well to it it's really helpful for.
Okay, I'm going to do something for 15 minutes.
That is something I use for care tasks.
So that is super helpful for timing, myself and Care tasks.
If I have to do suck are tasks that I And boring or sort of a
low dopamine. Giving myself that visual timer
when it comes to work like things like that.
I do at a desk the cube timer is life-changing for me, so a cube
timer is literally what it sounds like it's a big Cube on
each face. There is a different time.
So like 5 minutes, 10 minutes, 20 minutes, 30 minutes, and you
can get them that have different time increments to.
And the way that works, X is that when you flip the cube,
whatever time increment is facing up, automatically starts
a timer, very cool. And the reason that this is so
helpful is because I learned early on just like when we were
talking about like The Tick Tock thing, like, if I can do
multiple things at once. Like, let's say, I want to read
a book. I would sit down and I would
start my phone alarm for like 15 minutes.
I'd read for 15 minutes and go off.
I'd set it for 5 minutes. I'd look at ticked off for 5
minutes, then I go back to 15 minutes and I would sort of Back
and forth between two tasks, so that I never got bored and I
kept making progress on them and this Cube.
Timer allows me to do that without looking at my phone.
Oh, that's nice. And so it's Flip Flip.
Flip Flip. It's really tactilely.
Satisfying to do differently. Yes, I don't get distracted by
other things. But the other thing that I use
it for is my time Oneness when it comes to so much of what I
do. I do is kind of creative stuff
at my desk but then I'll have like something that I have to be
at. So like this podcast, for
example. So let's say that I sit down at
my desk at 9 a.m. and I know I need to be at a podcast at 10
like I will look and go. Okay, it's nine.
Look down, do something for five minutes and then look up and I'm
15 minutes late to this podcast. Listen, I was in it on the floor
with the dog at 10:56 and I went, oh, shit, it'll I can just
keep running to my computer that's real time.
So it's so it's so Frustrating the way that I the way that I
will try to avoid that is even worse because then I'm looking
up every two minutes, right? You're like, I don't want to be
late, I know, whatever. So what I do is I take my my
timer. Yeah, and I'll go, okay, have to
be somewhere in an hour and I'll put it on 30 minutes, nice.
And it'll click and I'll look up at 30 minutes and then I'll put
it on 20 minutes and then the 10 and then five.
So I'm using it to visual to, I'm using it to orient myself.
To the time. Yeah without having to
frantically look up or worry about getting lost like I can
safely get lost in something knowing that I have this system
for orienting myself to how close I'm getting to needing to
stop. Yeah, I love that.
I love not checking your phone either.
I would like to apologize for the next question, but if I
don't ask it, Eric will be grumpy if you're a regular
listener of infinite Quest. You know what's coming, okay?
Casey Davis, magical fairy, Appears in front of you and you
have your choice. You can either speak every
language in the world fluently and beautifully instantly or
option, b. You can play every musical
instrument in the world, like virtuoso level ARB.
What are you choose? You can only choose one.
Do people struggle with this because I would never choose
anything. But speaking, all those
languages, it's Fascinating People.
Okay. Hey would you like to expound
on? Why you don't have a man I think
because do you ever do like Enneagram stuff?
Yeah okay so I thought that I was an ideogram 8 because I'm
very you know extroverted and principled and all this stuff
whatever and when it told me that I was a nine I was like
what a Helper but when it when the Enneagram broke down like
it's about why you do things and I realized that that was so true
for me because like, I experienced a meaningful life,
directly related to feeling as though I'm being helpful.
Yeah. And so what comes up for me in
that question is like I would be so needed.
So useful. If I spoke every language that
makes sense. That's a great answer.
But there's it is a fearsome, contested debate here on the
podcast. Still a lot of lot of bass.
Lot of. Yeah.
Lot of bees. Lot more be.
I see, I would say that I would choose a to but a lot of people
to speak it's fascinating. And there the the answers are
always very different. It's real, it's really fun.
It's a great question. I love it.
I just think about how many social situations where there's
like a conundrum where I would be like It's me.
I have the perfect thing that can fix and solve this problem.
It was like jump out like Hello, haha, I spoke.
I spoke your language all alone and be great.
And let me tell you like so many things that I now know, have to
do with me being ADHD. Yeah, were I spent my whole life
being told that those traits were me being selfish,
self-centered, self-absorbed, egotistical and and don't get me
wrong Katie like I was actually All of those things like period
of my life. Yeah but the mistake that got
made was like I internalized that it was my personality.
Yeah that was chitty. Not that like I needed to learn
to orient. My personality to think of
others. Yeah.
Like I like to be helpful experience meaning in being
helpful and being thought of as being helpful and like there are
ways in my My life in which like I have been Unbound read and
self-serving and like my need to want to feel helpful has been
more important than whether I'm actually helping like
absolutely. But today I have a pretty good
and healthy outlook on. Okay.
When am I centering myself? When am I, you know, I need to
have some boundaries over it but at the end of the day also being
like it's okay. It's okay that I like to solve
problems. It's okay that I like to learn
things and teach people things and I can learn to not have my
identity bound up in that without hating the personality
that I have. Ya know, that's, I feel like
that's a really hard lesson to learn.
And again, we might be the same person.
Like there's like I can think of so many times where I have
really centered myself in places where I didn't need to but it's
because I was desperate to be helpful.
I was Britt to like be like, oh maybe if I like insert myself
into this problem, they'll like me and it's like so much of that
is foundationally based in like neuro divergency and like that
kind of like need to fit in. When like it's like the world
doesn't exactly fit the way that you feel like you're supposed
to. Like, I don't really relate to
that so hard and it doesn't like it doesn't like justify what I
make mistakes. But what it does do is that the
mistakes that I make are always out loud.
Yes, like my Friend is introverted on the Spectrum and
she struggles with perfectionism and so like the way that she
enters a scenario is like sit back.
Listen, don't do something that you might make a mistake.
But like internally, she could be like centering herself just
as much as me. Yeah, but she's not going to say
something. Impulsively, do something
impulsive lead, whatever. So like she and I could be the
exact Out of like self-absorbed or insecure in a moment.
Yeah but because of my personality like I'm going to do
like socially unacceptable or like mistake out loud.
Yeah. And so like she and I had such
different experiences going through the same experiences
where like I internalized like oh, it's obvious when I'm like
being sort of off-center yeah, that makes total sense.
Oh, I don't ever want this conversation to end, but we have
to stop recording. Okay.
Casey Davis. Domestic blisters, tell them
tell the people where they can find you and where they can buy
your book, okay? So my book is how to keep house.
While drowning, you can get it pretty much anywhere in D bound,
Books-A-Million Barnes and Noble, Amazon.
My website is struggle care.com. And there's actually a book tab
where you can see exactly where all the places that you can buy
it, it's also on audio. It is released And April 26th of
2022. So depending on when you're
hearing this, you can either preorder it now or you can order
it. If it's out, I also am on
Tick-Tock as domestic blisters and I do have in stes and
Facebook's I'm not as active on those but you can get those at
struggle care. Great.
And just, for dear listener, I will link all of the things ever
in the, the show notes. And then I will also make a
special Casey gets her own page here.
On on, on infinite Quest. So we'll hook you up with a on
the extras section of the website so you can find all the
links and I'll link like the Cuban stuff to it'll be, it'll
be great. Well, Casey, thank you so much
for being here. This I have admired your work
for so long. I look up to you so much.
I'm so grateful that you took time out of your very busy
schedule, but thanks. Thanks for being here.
Thank you. This is wonderful.