1 00:00:00,700 --> 00:00:03,200 I want to say this to the television audience, I made my 2 00:00:03,200 --> 00:00:08,300 mistakes but in all of my years of public life I have never 3 00:00:08,300 --> 00:00:11,300 profited. Never profited from public 4 00:00:11,300 --> 00:00:14,100 service. I've earned every cent and in 5 00:00:14,100 --> 00:00:18,500 all of my years of public life, I have never obstructed Justice. 6 00:00:19,300 --> 00:00:23,400 And I think too that I can say that in my years of public life 7 00:00:24,100 --> 00:00:27,000 that I welcome, this kind of examination because people have 8 00:00:27,000 --> 00:00:29,700 got to know whether or not their presidents a crook. 9 00:00:30,200 --> 00:00:33,900 Well, I'm not a crook. I've earned everything I've got 10 00:01:08,300 --> 00:01:13,000 so, as we Here on the day. The night before the impeachment 11 00:01:13,000 --> 00:01:17,700 vote of Donald J. Trump on this historic night. 12 00:01:18,900 --> 00:01:24,200 I thought of inviting someone on the podcast who was very much a 13 00:01:24,200 --> 00:01:30,200 part of the abuse of office, on the part of President, Richard 14 00:01:30,200 --> 00:01:33,800 Nixon, who was under investigation and going through 15 00:01:33,800 --> 00:01:42,700 impeachment hearings back in 1974 and the house voted on 16 00:01:42,700 --> 00:01:48,900 their articles of impeachment that included illegal and Us of 17 00:01:48,900 --> 00:01:52,500 actions against my guest here today on the podcast. 18 00:01:53,400 --> 00:01:58,500 And as a result of the house, committee voting in favor of 19 00:01:58,500 --> 00:02:04,100 these articles within a number of days, Richard Nixon decided 20 00:02:04,100 --> 00:02:06,500 he did not want to wait for the vote. 21 00:02:06,500 --> 00:02:10,199 That was surely going to take place on the house floor and 22 00:02:10,199 --> 00:02:12,800 remove him. Be the first president to be 23 00:02:12,800 --> 00:02:18,800 removed from office because the Democrats had the Senate and He 24 00:02:18,800 --> 00:02:23,100 was going to get convicted so he resigned, but my guest here 25 00:02:23,300 --> 00:02:26,800 today, on the podcast, he was somebody who was a patriotic 26 00:02:26,800 --> 00:02:31,100 American. He was a former Marine before 27 00:02:31,100 --> 00:02:35,700 that he was born in Chicago grew up partly in Detroit. 28 00:02:35,800 --> 00:02:38,900 Went to the Cranbrook school there and all my fellow 29 00:02:38,900 --> 00:02:42,700 michigander, as we all know, Cranbrook parents had wanted him 30 00:02:42,700 --> 00:02:46,000 to be a concert pianist and instead practically his mother 31 00:02:46,000 --> 00:02:51,800 and his sister died. And that Point his life changed 32 00:02:52,800 --> 00:02:56,500 in a profound way. So in 1954, he found himself 33 00:02:56,700 --> 00:03:00,700 after having gone to I think Harvard and Oxford joining the 34 00:03:00,700 --> 00:03:05,500 Marine Corps to, you know, do his bit to support the defense 35 00:03:05,500 --> 00:03:07,900 of the country in upon, getting out of the Marine Corps 36 00:03:07,900 --> 00:03:12,200 eventually worked for the Rand corporation, which is a was 37 00:03:12,200 --> 00:03:16,400 hired Often by the Pentagon and others in the government, to do 38 00:03:16,400 --> 00:03:22,000 analysis and other Research activities and he was hired to 39 00:03:22,000 --> 00:03:26,800 do these research activities and eventually worked in the office 40 00:03:26,800 --> 00:03:31,500 of the Secretary of Defense, under Lyndon Johnson, that man's 41 00:03:31,500 --> 00:03:38,300 name was Robert McNamara and and the Rand Corporation, it also 42 00:03:38,600 --> 00:03:42,800 undertaken a study, a research project to figure out. 43 00:03:42,800 --> 00:03:45,600 Just, what happened? How did we get into Vietnam? 44 00:03:45,700 --> 00:03:48,300 It was already a huge morass by this point by the time. 45 00:03:48,600 --> 00:03:54,900 Now, we're talking about 1967 68, it was clear to everyone 46 00:03:54,900 --> 00:04:02,100 that this was awful. Awful mistake, in a moral action 47 00:04:02,100 --> 00:04:07,100 on the part of this country and there was a rising Rising tide 48 00:04:07,100 --> 00:04:10,300 of opposition to the war in the United States. 49 00:04:10,300 --> 00:04:15,100 And of course, obviously around the world, And my guest decided 50 00:04:15,100 --> 00:04:19,300 that he could no longer have the American people. 51 00:04:19,300 --> 00:04:22,500 His fellow Americans in the dark about the lies that they were 52 00:04:22,500 --> 00:04:27,600 being told lies from there from there, very president not just 53 00:04:27,600 --> 00:04:30,200 the secretary defense not just the Pentagon whatever but from 54 00:04:30,200 --> 00:04:32,800 the president United States lying to the American people. 55 00:04:33,600 --> 00:04:36,100 There was a time when the just the very thought that a 56 00:04:36,100 --> 00:04:39,600 president would try to get away with these big lies would be so 57 00:04:39,600 --> 00:04:42,400 abhorrent to people like my guest. 58 00:04:43,100 --> 00:04:47,900 That there was a greater calling a greater duty to tell the 59 00:04:47,900 --> 00:04:51,000 truth, to the American people tell the truth in this case 60 00:04:51,300 --> 00:04:54,200 about why we were really in Vietnam and how was an 61 00:04:54,200 --> 00:04:59,600 unwinnable war, and there were lives being lost at such an off. 62 00:04:59,600 --> 00:05:03,900 I remember one week, I think Life Magazine printed the photos 63 00:05:03,900 --> 00:05:07,300 of the 500 plus dad died, and we find reports of Americans had 64 00:05:07,300 --> 00:05:09,500 died. That way thousands upon 65 00:05:09,500 --> 00:05:13,600 thousands of Vietnamese. South Vietnamese, North 66 00:05:13,600 --> 00:05:17,000 Vietnamese, eventually obviously cambodians lay oceans. 67 00:05:17,400 --> 00:05:21,900 The statistics go anywhere from 2 million, Southeast, Asians, 24 68 00:05:21,900 --> 00:05:25,500 million Southeast Asians who were killed in this war. 69 00:05:26,400 --> 00:05:31,300 This war of are doing, and my guests, couldn't couldn't 70 00:05:31,300 --> 00:05:34,300 participate in any longer. And as an act of conscience, 71 00:05:34,600 --> 00:05:39,400 gave these documents to the New York Times and they were called 72 00:05:39,400 --> 00:05:42,000 The Pentagon Papers. If you're old enough to remember 73 00:05:42,000 --> 00:05:46,200 this, You remember it? Well, if you're, if you're young 74 00:05:46,500 --> 00:05:50,900 should look this up, it was a, it was a powerful moment in an 75 00:05:51,100 --> 00:05:53,900 American history and nobody knew which way things were going to 76 00:05:53,900 --> 00:05:56,800 go. And as a result of my guests 77 00:05:56,800 --> 00:05:59,800 doing this, Richard Nixon had formed a unit. 78 00:05:59,900 --> 00:06:05,000 If you can believe this within the White House to do a number 79 00:06:05,000 --> 00:06:09,600 of illegal activities, against His opponents, his what he 80 00:06:09,600 --> 00:06:13,400 called his enemies. They were often anti-war people, 81 00:06:13,800 --> 00:06:16,300 but they were of their wide variety of people that just 82 00:06:16,300 --> 00:06:18,100 oppose Richard Nixon and his policies. 83 00:06:18,900 --> 00:06:23,300 And, and so, this unit called the plumbers unit, consisted of 84 00:06:23,300 --> 00:06:27,800 G, Gordon Liddy and Howard hunt in a number of others, and they 85 00:06:27,800 --> 00:06:32,900 were ordered to break in to the psychiatrist's office of my 86 00:06:32,900 --> 00:06:37,400 guest here today in over Labor Day in 1971. 87 00:06:38,000 --> 00:06:43,300 To steal records so that they could discredit this individual 88 00:06:43,400 --> 00:06:48,100 who had released the Pentagon papers and as a result of that 89 00:06:48,100 --> 00:06:52,300 action, an action planned in the White House, imagine that 90 00:06:52,300 --> 00:06:56,800 imagine breaking into a private citizens shrinks office to dig 91 00:06:56,800 --> 00:07:01,500 up dirt on them. So as to discredit them and to 92 00:07:01,500 --> 00:07:04,100 remember there's an election coming up the next year in 1972. 93 00:07:06,200 --> 00:07:09,400 So this so basically to prime the pump for the election, 94 00:07:10,500 --> 00:07:13,900 discredit an opponent, where have we heard this before? 95 00:07:14,300 --> 00:07:19,000 You don't have to go back any further than this past July But 96 00:07:19,000 --> 00:07:22,400 this happened, this happened back in 1971. 97 00:07:23,500 --> 00:07:27,600 And as a result, when the impeachment vote came up the 98 00:07:27,600 --> 00:07:32,000 plumbers unit this, these illegal activities, including 99 00:07:32,300 --> 00:07:36,000 against my guest here today. We're part of the impeachment of 100 00:07:36,000 --> 00:07:40,200 Richard Nixon and passed, the house Judiciary Committee at 101 00:07:40,200 --> 00:07:45,600 that time and I thought really who better to have on and thank 102 00:07:45,600 --> 00:07:49,200 God, he is still with us, he is still active, he is still 103 00:07:49,500 --> 00:07:51,100 fighting the fight for all of us. 104 00:07:51,600 --> 00:07:56,500 He is, you know, in the pantheon of great Americans that have 105 00:07:56,500 --> 00:08:00,700 affected our history in the last hundred years, you know, you can 106 00:08:00,700 --> 00:08:06,300 name the names from Rosa Parks to To so many others that 107 00:08:06,300 --> 00:08:10,800 because of a simple action they took as a citizen as a civilian, 108 00:08:12,200 --> 00:08:17,400 we actually got to be a little bit better of a country but it 109 00:08:17,400 --> 00:08:18,900 doesn't happen without the struggle. 110 00:08:19,200 --> 00:08:22,100 It doesn't happen without people like my guest here today. 111 00:08:22,400 --> 00:08:26,300 Mr. Daniel Ellsberg Daniel welcome to my podcast. 112 00:08:26,400 --> 00:08:31,400 Let me zoom in here. Michael, it's honored to be 113 00:08:31,500 --> 00:08:33,900 mentioned in the same sentence with Rosa Parks. 114 00:08:33,900 --> 00:08:38,799 When this one Happened to you. I was in 12th grade in high 115 00:08:38,799 --> 00:08:41,200 school. So I'm very, I have a very clear 116 00:08:41,200 --> 00:08:44,800 memory of the whole thing, but I want to point out that this 117 00:08:44,800 --> 00:08:49,000 particular thing will first of all, you expose the truth by 118 00:08:49,100 --> 00:08:50,700 sharing these papers. And of course, the New York 119 00:08:50,700 --> 00:08:56,400 Times was ordered by the judge to cease publishing the truth 120 00:08:56,400 --> 00:09:01,800 about Vietnam and these papers. And I think that they were shut 121 00:09:01,800 --> 00:09:03,600 down. At least this part of them, 122 00:09:03,600 --> 00:09:06,400 publishing the story. Was shut down for a number, 123 00:09:06,700 --> 00:09:08,900 maybe two weeks, something like that. 124 00:09:10,000 --> 00:09:15,300 And and in that time, and they made a movie about this, I think 125 00:09:15,400 --> 00:09:19,700 you're so go called the post Katharine, Graham in the 126 00:09:19,700 --> 00:09:25,100 Washington Post decided to just start publishing it. 127 00:09:25,500 --> 00:09:28,800 Well, the times was under under, under the order of the Court, 128 00:09:28,800 --> 00:09:32,700 not to publish, they started publishing and then they were 129 00:09:32,700 --> 00:09:36,800 shut down and And then if I remember the story correctly, 130 00:09:36,800 --> 00:09:42,400 you and your wife went into hiding because you need at that 131 00:09:42,408 --> 00:09:45,700 point, the, the federal government was looking for you. 132 00:09:45,900 --> 00:09:51,000 And during those weeks, you gave it to another 15 newspapers 133 00:09:51,000 --> 00:09:53,600 across the country, so that everybody would have the so 134 00:09:53,600 --> 00:09:56,700 everybody and they all started polishing it and it's just like, 135 00:09:56,700 --> 00:09:59,900 am I do I have that correct. The, the president was saying, 136 00:09:59,900 --> 00:10:02,900 the Attorney General said that the publication of these 137 00:10:02,900 --> 00:10:07,800 thinkers who was Immediate hurt the National Security of the 138 00:10:07,800 --> 00:10:12,300 United States during wartime. And that the people anybody 139 00:10:12,300 --> 00:10:17,400 publishing, this was directly hurting the National Security 140 00:10:17,600 --> 00:10:22,500 and yet 17 newspapers who looked at those documents that I gave 141 00:10:22,500 --> 00:10:27,800 them and with the help of other people, by the way it looked and 142 00:10:27,800 --> 00:10:30,800 said, we don't agree with that. We think the public needs to 143 00:10:30,800 --> 00:10:34,400 know this and we don't see that this top secret history. 144 00:10:34,600 --> 00:10:37,700 Is going to hurt the United States at all, but on the 145 00:10:37,700 --> 00:10:41,800 country will help it by letting us understand what's going on 146 00:10:42,400 --> 00:10:45,100 and they defied the president and the Attorney General. 147 00:10:45,100 --> 00:10:50,100 There were four injunctions the Boston Globe after the 148 00:10:50,600 --> 00:10:53,900 Washington Post and the New York Times, the Boston Globe was 149 00:10:53,900 --> 00:10:56,600 enjoying the st. Louis Post-Dispatch centroid, 150 00:10:57,000 --> 00:11:01,200 eventually they gave up because with eventually Seventeen papers 151 00:11:01,200 --> 00:11:04,500 involved, one of the prosecutors said, well, it's like hurting. 152 00:11:04,600 --> 00:11:07,600 Bees. We can't, we can't stop this but 153 00:11:07,900 --> 00:11:09,800 then it went to the Supreme Court. 154 00:11:10,200 --> 00:11:13,700 But there was a, this was in effect, a wave of Civil 155 00:11:13,700 --> 00:11:17,800 Disobedience across the country by newspapers, one after 156 00:11:17,800 --> 00:11:21,000 another. Which as you know Michael are 157 00:11:21,000 --> 00:11:25,600 not sort of public interest pro bono organization. 158 00:11:26,000 --> 00:11:28,700 They're not non-profit ngos exactly. 159 00:11:29,000 --> 00:11:33,200 They were all facing risks of prosecution and risks to their 160 00:11:33,800 --> 00:11:35,200 financial. Your interests. 161 00:11:35,800 --> 00:11:38,500 And I don't think there's been anything like that in any 162 00:11:38,500 --> 00:11:40,200 country that I've ever heard of where. 163 00:11:40,400 --> 00:11:45,100 So many important institutions simply defined, the executive, 164 00:11:45,100 --> 00:11:49,700 branch and risk, communication, and risk, conjunctions to put 165 00:11:49,700 --> 00:11:52,300 out the truth. So it was, it was a very 166 00:11:53,000 --> 00:11:56,200 admirable period which to my surprise, they don't 167 00:11:56,200 --> 00:12:01,800 particularly celebrate, when the anniversaries come along the 168 00:12:01,800 --> 00:12:05,900 post in the times tend to Congratulate themselves 169 00:12:06,000 --> 00:12:09,200 reasonably for what they did. But the other 15 newspapers 170 00:12:10,200 --> 00:12:13,100 don't seem to recognize the anniversaries, and they really 171 00:12:13,100 --> 00:12:16,500 should because we need to remember that period, we need it 172 00:12:16,500 --> 00:12:19,900 right now when they and all their colleagues are being 173 00:12:19,900 --> 00:12:24,700 called enemies of the people and they rise to that challenge and 174 00:12:24,700 --> 00:12:28,800 protect our democracy as they did, then toilet themselves 175 00:12:28,800 --> 00:12:34,000 become channels for government handouts as in so many other. 176 00:12:34,100 --> 00:12:37,200 Countries. So this this thing that happened 177 00:12:37,200 --> 00:12:40,300 with, okay, so they, you know, obviously the next 178 00:12:40,300 --> 00:12:43,600 Administration they're Furious that this has happened. 179 00:12:44,000 --> 00:12:48,300 Most of the is I remember the Pentagon papers were showing all 180 00:12:48,300 --> 00:12:52,400 the mistakes and all the lies that happen from the early 181 00:12:52,400 --> 00:12:56,300 years, from actually, from Truman, through Eisenhower 182 00:12:56,300 --> 00:13:02,000 Kennedy, specially Johnson, but Nixon had only been in office. 183 00:13:02,000 --> 00:13:10,300 So, you know, a couple Of years and yet took it upon himself to 184 00:13:10,600 --> 00:13:17,000 make sure he brought you down and they had if I am. 185 00:13:17,000 --> 00:13:20,400 I correct that there was even an order to assault. 186 00:13:20,400 --> 00:13:23,900 You their interest is not in going to my psychiatrist office 187 00:13:23,900 --> 00:13:26,400 to get set. Go in on something to get 188 00:13:26,600 --> 00:13:31,300 information to discredit me. I'm already facing 12 felony 189 00:13:31,300 --> 00:13:35,700 counts, and whatever, right? For what I had actually done, 190 00:13:35,700 --> 00:13:38,600 you know, copy these papers. So there was no question of fact 191 00:13:38,600 --> 00:13:41,100 involves your, I acknowledge that from the beginning. 192 00:13:41,600 --> 00:13:45,300 So discrediting me was not going to affect the outcome of the 193 00:13:45,308 --> 00:13:46,700 trial and the outcome of the trial. 194 00:13:46,700 --> 00:13:50,000 In fact, was it what makes it was concerned about very much. 195 00:13:50,000 --> 00:13:54,700 Anyway, what they wanted was information to Blackmail me with 196 00:13:54,800 --> 00:14:01,300 to threaten me with revealing so that I would stop saying, what? 197 00:14:01,700 --> 00:14:04,600 I know to be Nixon. Currents, Energy. 198 00:14:04,600 --> 00:14:09,400 Now, the Pentagon papers ended in 68 before Nixon came in, so 199 00:14:09,400 --> 00:14:12,500 they didn't incriminate Nixon except for his participation 200 00:14:12,500 --> 00:14:15,000 under Eisenhower. They didn't say much about Nixon 201 00:14:15,000 --> 00:14:18,500 at that time. So he could easily say, well 202 00:14:18,500 --> 00:14:23,700 this was the Democrats who do this, not my policy, I was 203 00:14:23,700 --> 00:14:27,900 saying on the basis of inside knowledge, that he was 204 00:14:27,900 --> 00:14:31,500 continuing essentially the same lies and the same threats of 205 00:14:31,500 --> 00:14:34,000 escalation except he was increasing them. 206 00:14:34,500 --> 00:14:39,300 He hoped essentially to win in Vietnam, by threatening more 207 00:14:39,300 --> 00:14:43,300 than the Democrats had ever. Threaten namely nuclear weapons 208 00:14:43,300 --> 00:14:46,000 against North Vietnam, which are directly. 209 00:14:46,400 --> 00:14:50,400 Threats can directly conveyed and for which plan is for 210 00:14:50,400 --> 00:14:56,000 nuclear attacks existed known to me, by people, who would 211 00:14:56,000 --> 00:15:00,500 actually seen them also threats of invading Laos and Cambodia 212 00:15:00,500 --> 00:15:04,000 which he eventually did do not the nuclear invading her 213 00:15:04,200 --> 00:15:09,600 Vietnam, 1988 fall right involved of confronting Soviet 214 00:15:09,600 --> 00:15:14,700 shipping among other things. And basically escalating the war 215 00:15:14,700 --> 00:15:20,600 very much in order to get the North Vietnamese to make 216 00:15:20,600 --> 00:15:23,300 concessions that would amount to our winning. 217 00:15:23,300 --> 00:15:28,100 The war namely to allow us to take our troops out. 218 00:15:28,100 --> 00:15:33,900 But to continue airpower air support to General queue. 219 00:15:34,100 --> 00:15:39,400 The alleged for the president. For public president of South 220 00:15:39,400 --> 00:15:43,000 Vietnam, our puppet right, well, had put mix it into office, 221 00:15:43,000 --> 00:15:47,500 basically, by doing what Trump is accused of doing. 222 00:15:47,500 --> 00:15:50,600 I should say, with the Russians are accused of doing colluding 223 00:15:50,600 --> 00:15:55,700 with a presidential candidate Nixon to get him elected. 224 00:15:56,000 --> 00:16:01,000 And they did that by refusing Johnson, the invitation, which 225 00:16:01,000 --> 00:16:05,200 they earlier accepted to go to Paris and Negotiations that 226 00:16:05,200 --> 00:16:08,500 might end the war and Nixon persuaded to you. 227 00:16:08,900 --> 00:16:14,400 Not to go just as just before the election and that pews 228 00:16:14,400 --> 00:16:18,100 refusal to go did. Stop the increase in the polls 229 00:16:18,100 --> 00:16:21,000 and Hubert Humphrey had been experiencing right then. 230 00:16:21,000 --> 00:16:25,000 He was even with Nixon at that point and led to exams winning 231 00:16:25,000 --> 00:16:29,900 by a very close margin after which makes it was indebted, in 232 00:16:30,100 --> 00:16:34,400 fact, really controlled by to you in a way because You could 233 00:16:34,400 --> 00:16:39,500 have revealed at any point, the impeachable acts of Nixon, which 234 00:16:39,500 --> 00:16:45,400 Lyndon Johnson described as treason in question whether it 235 00:16:45,408 --> 00:16:50,100 was treason it certainly was an impeachable act at that point. 236 00:16:50,200 --> 00:16:56,200 So for that, the war continued in the Nixon Administration and 237 00:16:56,200 --> 00:17:00,800 then following in the Ford Administration, till 1975, six 238 00:17:00,800 --> 00:17:05,000 years later. And before 73, another 20,000 239 00:17:05,000 --> 00:17:10,800 Americans had their names on the Vietnam, memorial and half a 240 00:17:10,808 --> 00:17:16,500 million or more Vietnamese had died in order to prevent Nixon 241 00:17:16,900 --> 00:17:21,000 from being impeached. Basically by Revelation by to 242 00:17:21,700 --> 00:17:25,500 that he had colluded, to win an election with a foreign power 243 00:17:25,700 --> 00:17:27,700 earlier. So they the energy mother 244 00:17:27,700 --> 00:17:30,400 Institute to right now is for the Striking. 245 00:17:30,800 --> 00:17:36,100 So essentially what you're saying is Is that they wanted 246 00:17:36,100 --> 00:17:41,800 those psychiatric files on you to use as they hoped. 247 00:17:41,800 --> 00:17:45,400 They would find things that that I wouldn't want out. 248 00:17:45,400 --> 00:17:50,200 And they could keep me from repeating or saying that Nixon 249 00:17:50,200 --> 00:17:53,300 was making nuclear threats that he intended to continue the war. 250 00:17:53,300 --> 00:17:56,000 The war was like to get larger above all. 251 00:17:56,000 --> 00:17:58,800 They feared that I had documents right? 252 00:17:59,000 --> 00:18:02,000 And I didn't know I had documents, but not what they 253 00:18:02,000 --> 00:18:06,100 feared and I could Head. Because there were people who 254 00:18:06,100 --> 00:18:08,800 left the administration when some of that is Collision, did 255 00:18:08,800 --> 00:18:13,300 occurred very creditably resigned, from the National 256 00:18:13,300 --> 00:18:16,700 Security Council over the invasion of Cambodia, but they 257 00:18:16,700 --> 00:18:20,200 didn't take documents with them or give them to me or anybody 258 00:18:20,200 --> 00:18:23,800 else is one of those people, Roger Moore's, who Deputy to 259 00:18:24,000 --> 00:18:27,600 Kissinger said later. It was the greatest shame of his 260 00:18:27,600 --> 00:18:30,700 length that they have not revealed documents. 261 00:18:30,700 --> 00:18:33,200 At that time. He said we should have thrown 262 00:18:33,200 --> 00:18:36,300 open the safe. Ifs and screamed bloody murder 263 00:18:36,800 --> 00:18:38,600 because that's exactly what it was. 264 00:18:38,600 --> 00:18:42,200 I had given me documents like that and they had to keep me 265 00:18:42,200 --> 00:18:43,700 quiet. And that's why they later 266 00:18:43,700 --> 00:18:46,800 brought people up. When they hadn't found material 267 00:18:46,800 --> 00:18:49,000 in dr. Fielding's office with which to 268 00:18:49,000 --> 00:18:54,000 Blackmail me. They then brought a dozen Cuban 269 00:18:54,000 --> 00:18:57,800 Americans veterans with the Bay of Pigs on. 270 00:18:57,800 --> 00:19:01,700 May 3rd, 1972. To the steps of the Capitol with 271 00:19:01,700 --> 00:19:06,100 orders to incapacitate me too. Really misses you in a week. 272 00:19:06,300 --> 00:19:10,500 When on the tapes Kissinger and Nixon are discussing possible 273 00:19:10,500 --> 00:19:15,300 use of nuclear weapons, Nixon is favoring them and we're afraid 274 00:19:15,300 --> 00:19:18,400 that I would have documents at that point that would forecast 275 00:19:18,400 --> 00:19:21,600 that and they had to shut me up entirely. 276 00:19:22,000 --> 00:19:25,900 Wow. So in addition to them, knowing 277 00:19:25,900 --> 00:19:29,600 that you knew you had information about what Nixon was 278 00:19:29,600 --> 00:19:34,400 really up to and fearing that you had even more information or 279 00:19:34,400 --> 00:19:37,800 documents which you didn't have. But they feared that you might 280 00:19:38,200 --> 00:19:41,000 buy a breaking into the psychiatrist's office, dr. 281 00:19:41,000 --> 00:19:45,600 Fielding they would somehow be able to have hold some sway over 282 00:19:45,600 --> 00:19:50,500 you and control you with whatever information they were 283 00:19:50,500 --> 00:19:53,500 going to find are not in his office. 284 00:19:53,900 --> 00:19:58,700 And as a result of this break-in and when it became knowledge, a 285 00:19:58,700 --> 00:20:00,700 public knowledge. I think through John Dean. 286 00:20:01,000 --> 00:20:05,000 Dean has been told by the effective head of the plumbers 287 00:20:05,000 --> 00:20:06,700 at go krogh. By the way, they were called 288 00:20:06,700 --> 00:20:09,900 plumbers because they thought of themselves as stopping leaks and 289 00:20:09,900 --> 00:20:12,700 essentially, that was leaked by me. 290 00:20:12,700 --> 00:20:14,700 That's what they were. That's what they were afraid of 291 00:20:15,000 --> 00:20:17,200 the breakout of your psychiatrists office dr. 292 00:20:17,200 --> 00:20:22,300 Feeling though, occurred almost really not, not quite a full 293 00:20:22,300 --> 00:20:25,100 year, but it about nine months before the break-in at 294 00:20:25,100 --> 00:20:26,100 Watergate. That's right. 295 00:20:26,100 --> 00:20:32,800 They later actually the effort to incapacitate Totally, which 296 00:20:32,800 --> 00:20:37,000 wasn't carried out because they became it's a longer story, but 297 00:20:37,300 --> 00:20:40,700 they became worried at the time. If they were being set up quote 298 00:20:41,000 --> 00:20:45,300 as Patsy's to be caught and they decided to throw that one, but 299 00:20:45,300 --> 00:20:48,600 that varied, they were taken around to their reconnoiter 300 00:20:48,600 --> 00:20:52,400 their next Target, which was the Watergate hotel, where the water 301 00:20:52,400 --> 00:20:55,500 getting offices, where the Democratic National Committee 302 00:20:55,500 --> 00:20:59,600 was, and weeks after that, a couple weeks after the attempt 303 00:20:59,600 --> 00:21:04,700 to incapacitate me, When carried through, they did go into the 304 00:21:04,700 --> 00:21:07,500 Watergate offices in them. They weren't caught that night. 305 00:21:07,900 --> 00:21:14,000 And then, to repair Taps bugs that hadn't functioned that 306 00:21:14,000 --> 00:21:15,800 first night. They went in again a second 307 00:21:15,800 --> 00:21:18,400 time. And this time, they were caught 308 00:21:18,700 --> 00:21:22,000 and they were being run essentially by hunted Liddy, the 309 00:21:22,000 --> 00:21:27,800 very people who had engineered the burglary of my psychiatrist 310 00:21:27,800 --> 00:21:30,500 office earlier. So in other words when they were 311 00:21:30,500 --> 00:21:36,200 caught They now had blackmail on Vixen because they knew of these 312 00:21:36,200 --> 00:21:41,100 earlier crimes, actually it's not even proved although it has 313 00:21:41,100 --> 00:21:44,900 been alleged that Nixon knew of the actual break into, you know, 314 00:21:44,900 --> 00:21:47,800 beforehand of the break into the Watergate. 315 00:21:48,100 --> 00:21:51,800 But these people knew about his earlier crimes directly against 316 00:21:51,800 --> 00:21:54,300 me, which word ordered out of the Oval Office. 317 00:21:54,800 --> 00:21:58,700 So they had to keep them quiet and by giving more than a 318 00:21:58,700 --> 00:22:02,100 hundred thousand dollars and since Liam, Bribery money to get 319 00:22:02,100 --> 00:22:05,500 them to perjure themselves in front of the grand jury and say 320 00:22:05,500 --> 00:22:08,100 that they did not know of any previous crimes. 321 00:22:08,700 --> 00:22:13,000 This was further obstruction of justice Dean told the president, 322 00:22:13,000 --> 00:22:16,500 it was a cancer on the presidency was getting further 323 00:22:16,500 --> 00:22:20,400 and further they had to lie to conceal, other lies and 324 00:22:20,400 --> 00:22:24,800 eventually, because Dean brought that out, it did eventually get 325 00:22:25,300 --> 00:22:28,400 to my court because the trial was still going on and they were 326 00:22:28,400 --> 00:22:35,900 obliged to inform the court. And that came out and then hunt 327 00:22:35,900 --> 00:22:38,900 in others. Reverse their perjury and 328 00:22:38,900 --> 00:22:44,600 revealed things about the wiretapping of meeting the five 329 00:22:44,600 --> 00:22:48,100 psychological profiles and the joined the CIA had done against 330 00:22:48,100 --> 00:22:51,200 me, which was against their Charter to do on an American 331 00:22:51,200 --> 00:22:55,400 citizen and other. Other crimes came up there, this 332 00:22:55,400 --> 00:22:58,900 is all being coordinated out of the White House hunt and Liddy, 333 00:22:58,900 --> 00:23:00,800 they're in there. I think their offices there were 334 00:23:01,000 --> 00:23:03,100 Wherever they were meeting in the old executive office, 335 00:23:03,100 --> 00:23:08,200 building all part of the White House complex there and and this 336 00:23:08,200 --> 00:23:11,200 would eventually all come together with all the other 337 00:23:11,200 --> 00:23:15,100 things they were doing so called plumbers unit as part of one of 338 00:23:15,100 --> 00:23:18,800 the Articles of impeachment, the abuse of power, Nixon's, abuse 339 00:23:18,800 --> 00:23:20,500 of power. So, here we are. 340 00:23:20,500 --> 00:23:21,900 Now, how are you feeling tonight? 341 00:23:21,900 --> 00:23:24,200 I mean, here we are. We're on the eve of this 342 00:23:24,200 --> 00:23:29,000 impeachment vote. You are a historic figure that 343 00:23:29,000 --> 00:23:33,000 that the actions that you had. Really taken to tell the truth 344 00:23:33,000 --> 00:23:39,200 about Vietnam and it resulting in this abuse of you first of 345 00:23:39,208 --> 00:23:42,200 all the break-in your psychiatrist office but also the 346 00:23:42,800 --> 00:23:46,300 plan to incapacitate you and then the cover up the 347 00:23:46,300 --> 00:23:50,500 obstruction of justice. Just as, by the way, one of the 348 00:23:50,500 --> 00:23:54,100 comes to the impeachment here against President Trump, which 349 00:23:54,100 --> 00:23:58,500 will almost certainly go through tomorrow in the house is 350 00:23:58,500 --> 00:24:02,700 essentially cover-up. In of Justice, which he went 351 00:24:02,700 --> 00:24:07,900 through, which Trump organized in response to a truth teller to 352 00:24:07,900 --> 00:24:11,200 a whistleblower people, whistleblower, like you and in 353 00:24:11,200 --> 00:24:16,400 return to keep that from being investigated Trump made, 354 00:24:16,600 --> 00:24:20,800 absolutely unprecedented orders of cover-up, that no government 355 00:24:20,800 --> 00:24:24,800 official could respond to subpoenas by the, by the 356 00:24:24,800 --> 00:24:29,100 Congress in clear Defiance of the Constitution and separation 357 00:24:29,100 --> 00:24:30,800 of powers, the powers of congress here. 358 00:24:31,000 --> 00:24:34,100 To investigate and impeach, he's in effect. 359 00:24:35,100 --> 00:24:38,600 It's like rolling up the 82nd Airborne around the White House 360 00:24:38,600 --> 00:24:42,500 and saying, come and get me, right? 361 00:24:42,500 --> 00:24:45,700 A little monster film or something you write hurting 362 00:24:45,700 --> 00:24:49,700 people with great consequences if they told the truth as 363 00:24:49,700 --> 00:24:52,100 ordered by Congress. So what's that like for you 364 00:24:52,100 --> 00:24:54,500 today today? Tonight, here we are. 365 00:24:55,100 --> 00:25:00,000 And it's it's it's not exactly Deja Vu, but it's kind of a 366 00:25:00,200 --> 00:25:03,800 must-have whatwhat is going through you right now. 367 00:25:04,300 --> 00:25:08,500 Well, there is a difference in the situation which is that the 368 00:25:08,500 --> 00:25:13,000 Senate is certain almost, you know, the Republicans in the 369 00:25:13,000 --> 00:25:19,800 Senate to defy the law, to defy the Constitution, to defy the 370 00:25:19,800 --> 00:25:24,800 evidence of their own senses as to what's happened here and vote 371 00:25:24,800 --> 00:25:28,600 for equipment. So he will almost certainly be 372 00:25:28,600 --> 00:25:33,400 acquitted of this indictment. Which is what the impeachment a 373 00:25:33,408 --> 00:25:37,700 month to an indictment, and he will go into the election 374 00:25:39,600 --> 00:25:44,500 claiming that he's been totally exonerated indicating by the 375 00:25:44,500 --> 00:25:49,100 way, a very dangerous precedent. It pretty much comes close to 376 00:25:49,100 --> 00:25:54,100 saying that a president whose party controls the Senate, which 377 00:25:54,100 --> 00:25:57,900 determines conviction is above the law, right? 378 00:25:58,000 --> 00:26:00,900 Right thing, he wants Foreign Affairs and domestic. 379 00:26:01,100 --> 00:26:04,000 Affairs. If the president can get away 380 00:26:04,000 --> 00:26:07,700 with this, he can definitely get away with anything of his own 381 00:26:07,700 --> 00:26:11,100 party controls the Senate. And that means that we don't 382 00:26:11,100 --> 00:26:14,200 have a government of law. He is in effect a king. 383 00:26:14,600 --> 00:26:18,600 So yeah, so the big difference obviously between tonight, 384 00:26:19,000 --> 00:26:25,700 tomorrow and back in, 1974 is remember what a real difference 385 00:26:25,800 --> 00:26:33,100 in both parties from then. Is this that going to Another 386 00:26:33,100 --> 00:26:36,200 indictment impeachment. A number of Clinton. 387 00:26:36,200 --> 00:26:40,400 I think 17 Democrats voted for the inquiry impeachment inquiry 388 00:26:40,400 --> 00:26:45,500 into Clinton and number were would have voted for impeachment 389 00:26:45,500 --> 00:26:48,600 at that point. What makes in faith in led to 390 00:26:48,600 --> 00:26:52,800 his resignation, was the Republicans in the Senate are 391 00:26:52,800 --> 00:26:55,700 ten count it. We're going to vote against you 392 00:26:55,700 --> 00:26:57,400 because the evidence is so clear. 393 00:26:57,700 --> 00:27:01,600 Now, that obviously simply can't happen now, For the simple 394 00:27:01,600 --> 00:27:06,700 reason that the Republicans are proving absolutely impervious to 395 00:27:06,700 --> 00:27:09,900 evidence and to their obligations, to uphold the 396 00:27:09,908 --> 00:27:11,700 Constitution. How did this happen? 397 00:27:11,700 --> 00:27:14,800 How did you, how did we go from a time when there were 398 00:27:14,800 --> 00:27:17,300 Republicans, who told Nixon to stand down? 399 00:27:17,700 --> 00:27:21,100 Yes, we are going to vote to convict you, if you don't resign 400 00:27:21,700 --> 00:27:25,500 that, that we're that after this vote tomorrow, and it goes to 401 00:27:25,500 --> 00:27:30,000 the Senate after the holidays, that the that the Senate is 402 00:27:30,000 --> 00:27:35,000 already made clear. That it may be a near unanimous 403 00:27:36,000 --> 00:27:40,200 vote, amongst the Republicans in the Senate to ignore the 404 00:27:40,200 --> 00:27:42,400 evidence to ignore the Constitution. 405 00:27:43,000 --> 00:27:46,800 And just just line up like, Lemmings behind Donald Trump. 406 00:27:47,000 --> 00:27:51,300 And it's not enough to move Trump out of office, which we 407 00:27:51,300 --> 00:27:55,600 won't do by impeachment and conviction, but it's not enough 408 00:27:55,600 --> 00:27:58,800 to move them out of office by election, which is absolutely 409 00:27:58,800 --> 00:28:01,900 essential for reasons. I hope we go into But that's not 410 00:28:01,900 --> 00:28:04,300 enough. The Senate has to be changed. 411 00:28:04,300 --> 00:28:08,700 The house has to be change and really all these are necessary 412 00:28:08,700 --> 00:28:15,100 conditions for survival in terms of our climate climate change, 413 00:28:15,100 --> 00:28:19,800 in terms of our democracy, I would say it's essential, it's 414 00:28:19,800 --> 00:28:24,000 not enough because the Democrats have not done nearly enough in 415 00:28:24,000 --> 00:28:27,600 the past and I they won't do enough on these issues in the 416 00:28:27,600 --> 00:28:31,100 future, but at least they won't be leaving in exactly the wrong 417 00:28:31,100 --> 00:28:33,100 direction. Richmond as the Republicans are 418 00:28:33,100 --> 00:28:36,200 right now. So okay, so let's Jump Ahead a 419 00:28:36,200 --> 00:28:40,000 month or so, the Senate has not convicted Trump. 420 00:28:41,000 --> 00:28:45,800 He claims a great Victory. They, they try to slam the 421 00:28:45,800 --> 00:28:50,000 Democrats for trying to, you know, overthrow the king. 422 00:28:50,500 --> 00:28:52,800 What do we do, then? Where are we at them? 423 00:28:52,900 --> 00:28:56,200 We do have an election. Obviously, there is still an 424 00:28:56,200 --> 00:28:58,500 election, yet scheduled, this is correct. 425 00:28:58,500 --> 00:29:04,000 Okay, I'll give you. Here's the thought that will not 426 00:29:04,600 --> 00:29:08,300 be received. Well I suspect by many in your 427 00:29:08,300 --> 00:29:11,000 audience but I'm going to tell you the truth of what I think 428 00:29:11,000 --> 00:29:17,900 are what I worry about there is more than a chance that Trump 429 00:29:18,100 --> 00:29:21,200 will get reelected. I see Biden as a ticket to 430 00:29:21,208 --> 00:29:22,700 Trump. That is that? 431 00:29:22,700 --> 00:29:27,200 Yes, and I and not just by those who will vote third party, I 432 00:29:27,200 --> 00:29:30,800 think a Centrist somebody like Biden. 433 00:29:33,000 --> 00:29:35,800 People will stay home. Yeah, yes. 434 00:29:36,000 --> 00:29:38,400 Yes. Young people will stay home. 435 00:29:38,400 --> 00:29:41,100 They will not vote for a third party. 436 00:29:41,100 --> 00:29:43,200 That's really I should have put it that way. 437 00:29:43,200 --> 00:29:45,600 You might go to one of the two. Yeah, yeah, we think probably 438 00:29:45,600 --> 00:29:48,300 will be just to stay home but that will be enough. 439 00:29:48,400 --> 00:29:50,000 I asked you what are we going to do? 440 00:29:50,400 --> 00:29:53,000 When the Senate doesn't convicted Trump? 441 00:29:53,200 --> 00:29:56,600 And you said, well, there's an election coming up and that is 442 00:29:56,600 --> 00:29:59,000 very true. We can vote in the primaries and 443 00:29:59,000 --> 00:30:02,400 you should vote for the person who most Most aligns with you 444 00:30:02,600 --> 00:30:06,000 don't, don't be playing. Some kind of weird game has of 445 00:30:06,000 --> 00:30:11,500 Chess, just vote for who you like the best and then, and then 446 00:30:12,500 --> 00:30:15,300 let that person hopefully win if not get behind. 447 00:30:15,300 --> 00:30:17,600 Whoever the person is that wins the nomination. 448 00:30:17,600 --> 00:30:20,000 Yes. Bernie Sanders was criticized by 449 00:30:20,000 --> 00:30:24,200 many people for doing that in 2016 and that just revealed to 450 00:30:24,200 --> 00:30:29,600 me, that people are my son and left us can be as much in denial 451 00:30:30,200 --> 00:30:34,400 as people on the right. Or anybody else because to say 452 00:30:35,100 --> 00:30:41,600 he was wrong to support Hillary at that point, is to fail to see 453 00:30:42,400 --> 00:30:47,600 to refuse to see the Trump was even worse on balance than 454 00:30:47,800 --> 00:30:49,900 Hillary. No, Bernie did the right thing 455 00:30:49,900 --> 00:30:52,000 burning. I'm aware of all. 456 00:30:52,000 --> 00:30:57,100 I accept all of the left criticisms of the democratic 457 00:30:57,100 --> 00:31:00,500 party and of Hillary, specifically, and of Obama. 458 00:31:01,200 --> 00:31:04,300 And most of these candidates right now certainly is Biden, 459 00:31:04,400 --> 00:31:08,800 tremendous, shortcomings and far from adequate from what we need 460 00:31:09,000 --> 00:31:11,300 at all and nobody's perfect, you know? 461 00:31:11,300 --> 00:31:16,500 Even from any particular point of view, even even Bernie 462 00:31:16,500 --> 00:31:19,400 Sanders and Elizabeth Warren, have haven't taken on the 463 00:31:19,400 --> 00:31:20,900 military-industrial complex. Hello. 464 00:31:20,900 --> 00:31:24,200 Bernie has talked about it more than almost anybody else or 465 00:31:24,200 --> 00:31:29,300 nuclear weapons various things. But, you know, they really are a 466 00:31:29,400 --> 00:31:32,600 new voice. I will be Certainly I would say 467 00:31:32,600 --> 00:31:36,100 I will be back in Bernie Sanders and remember is Michael, as you 468 00:31:36,100 --> 00:31:39,800 know, it's not just who you vote for who won votes for in the 469 00:31:39,800 --> 00:31:43,000 voting booth that really doesn't matter that much. 470 00:31:43,000 --> 00:31:46,100 When you come down to one, vote does not determine elections. 471 00:31:46,500 --> 00:31:50,200 It's how you use your activity, your influence your audience. 472 00:31:50,200 --> 00:31:54,000 If you have one your voice and especially in the swing States 473 00:31:54,200 --> 00:31:58,200 under our current system, remember I really and I think 474 00:31:58,200 --> 00:32:01,100 you agree would like very much to change that currency. 475 00:32:01,200 --> 00:32:03,200 Distance. So the electoral system college 476 00:32:03,200 --> 00:32:07,400 does not rule and everybody's will count in the different 477 00:32:07,400 --> 00:32:10,600 states and you won't have swing states that exists. 478 00:32:10,600 --> 00:32:14,000 That will not be a phenomena at that point, but it is very much 479 00:32:14,000 --> 00:32:17,800 now. So there will be 4 to 10 states 480 00:32:18,200 --> 00:32:22,200 that will be critical here. And it will be essential to 481 00:32:22,200 --> 00:32:29,800 elect a non, not Trump, whoever it is even by grief, we could do 482 00:32:29,800 --> 00:32:35,300 it. Because bad shorter short, as he 483 00:32:35,300 --> 00:32:40,100 is in terms of what we need. It's not Trump. 484 00:32:40,200 --> 00:32:45,000 He will not be trying to destroy civilization in terms of 485 00:32:45,000 --> 00:32:49,400 climate, which Trump is trying to do in effect, right? 486 00:32:49,600 --> 00:32:52,000 How do we? But how it's amazing to me that 487 00:32:52,000 --> 00:32:56,100 you maintain this level of optimism, you know what other 488 00:32:56,100 --> 00:33:00,500 hand, where did you? I hear you? 489 00:33:00,500 --> 00:33:03,000 Sing. That we still have. 490 00:33:03,000 --> 00:33:06,400 We still have elections? Yeah, we still have a chance. 491 00:33:06,800 --> 00:33:10,300 We have at least a chance by next November to stop the 492 00:33:10,300 --> 00:33:11,900 madness. The current Madness. 493 00:33:11,900 --> 00:33:15,400 Yes, of Donald J Trump. Yes, that is a, is a 494 00:33:15,400 --> 00:33:17,700 possibility, not necessarily a reality. 495 00:33:17,900 --> 00:33:19,600 I agree with you. I think of the election were 496 00:33:19,600 --> 00:33:22,300 held today. Whoever the Democrat would be 497 00:33:23,400 --> 00:33:27,700 would win the popular vote by more votes than Hillary wanted 498 00:33:28,300 --> 00:33:32,800 in 16, but could still lose the For college to Trump. 499 00:33:32,800 --> 00:33:34,800 Yeah. Because his loyal supporters 500 00:33:34,800 --> 00:33:41,600 have not deserted him, they will be out in force for him and he 501 00:33:41,600 --> 00:33:44,100 went to see that's not to their credit, really? 502 00:33:44,400 --> 00:33:47,600 I have to say yes. A lot of those people are 503 00:33:47,600 --> 00:33:50,000 abused. They have been oppressed. 504 00:33:50,000 --> 00:33:53,300 They have been ignored by the Democrats as much as find 505 00:33:53,300 --> 00:33:56,300 anybody they've been lied to they've been left in the Lurch 506 00:33:56,300 --> 00:33:57,200 etc. Etc. 507 00:33:57,400 --> 00:34:00,300 That's all true. They are a victim when they feel 508 00:34:00,300 --> 00:34:05,800 that way and With basis to respond to that, by electing. 509 00:34:05,800 --> 00:34:08,800 Donald Trump is not to their creditors. 510 00:34:08,800 --> 00:34:12,500 I don't see no around that now. And we are talking about white 511 00:34:12,500 --> 00:34:16,300 people, I am the Trump demographic, I am an angry white 512 00:34:16,300 --> 00:34:19,199 guy over the age of 50 with a high school education. 513 00:34:19,699 --> 00:34:23,699 So that so I know these guys because I grew up with them, I 514 00:34:23,707 --> 00:34:29,699 still know them back home here and I understand why they're 515 00:34:29,699 --> 00:34:32,100 upset. I understand why even though 516 00:34:32,100 --> 00:34:36,100 they some of them don't agree with Trump saw him as the human 517 00:34:36,100 --> 00:34:39,199 Molotov cocktail that they could throw into the system to just 518 00:34:39,199 --> 00:34:42,900 blow things up because their lives have been so miserable for 519 00:34:42,900 --> 00:34:45,900 the last 10, 20 years, I get it, I get that. 520 00:34:46,000 --> 00:34:49,699 But what I say to them is this, you know, who else has it and 521 00:34:50,100 --> 00:34:55,400 miserable black people, black African Americans. 522 00:34:55,500 --> 00:35:00,900 So as as much as Black America has been punked on You know, as 523 00:35:00,900 --> 00:35:04,400 much as they've had to go through or Native Americans who 524 00:35:04,400 --> 00:35:09,000 has it worse than them. And yet, what do they do when 525 00:35:09,000 --> 00:35:12,500 they come out to vote? They vote for the Democrat and 526 00:35:12,500 --> 00:35:14,700 woohoo. Democrat, every time they don't 527 00:35:14,700 --> 00:35:18,500 say oh, you know, I'm nobody's done anything for me. 528 00:35:18,500 --> 00:35:22,000 So I'm either going to stay home or I'm going to vote the third. 529 00:35:22,000 --> 00:35:24,000 I'm going to, I'm going to. Yeah, I don't care if Trump gets 530 00:35:24,000 --> 00:35:28,300 in there ninety-eight percent of black women. 531 00:35:29,300 --> 00:35:32,400 Voted against Trump voted for him. 532 00:35:32,900 --> 00:35:36,100 Most of, obviously, for Hillary, they voted for Hillary and yet, 533 00:35:36,500 --> 00:35:39,300 are they not as abused as lunch bucket? 534 00:35:39,300 --> 00:35:43,300 Joe from Macomb County in Michigan? 535 00:35:43,800 --> 00:35:46,300 I would say, yes, I would say they've had to go through the 536 00:35:46,300 --> 00:35:50,100 struggle that that poor white people have to go through. 537 00:35:50,500 --> 00:35:54,000 But what you know, what is why do black people just say to hell 538 00:35:54,000 --> 00:35:56,200 with this. You know I'm going to vote for 539 00:35:56,200 --> 00:35:58,900 Trump on his that. How does that argument? 540 00:35:59,300 --> 00:36:01,500 Go over. In other words, heavy and not 541 00:36:01,500 --> 00:36:05,900 very well, very well, but I don't care because I'm going to 542 00:36:05,900 --> 00:36:10,200 tell them to quit whining. Quit whining and do the right 543 00:36:10,200 --> 00:36:13,400 thing, and I agree with you them. 544 00:36:13,400 --> 00:36:16,500 And I say this, look, I realize the Democrats. 545 00:36:16,900 --> 00:36:20,800 If you're living in Detroit, if you're living in, Flint, you 546 00:36:20,808 --> 00:36:24,200 know where the Democrats, why are we in year, five? 547 00:36:24,200 --> 00:36:26,000 Or whatever? It is of, the Flint poisoning, 548 00:36:26,700 --> 00:36:28,900 we have a Democratic governor now in. 549 00:36:29,100 --> 00:36:33,800 Sing Michigan where you know so I get it, I totally get it. 550 00:36:34,000 --> 00:36:38,000 I'm every bit as pissed off. But we have to think clearly 551 00:36:38,000 --> 00:36:44,200 here and not just be run by are legitimate emotional state. 552 00:36:45,200 --> 00:36:50,300 Because we have to remove somebody said this to me here 553 00:36:51,200 --> 00:36:53,500 the other day. It's like the body politic of 554 00:36:53,500 --> 00:36:58,200 America right now is a very, very sick, very ill patient and 555 00:36:58,200 --> 00:37:02,600 Trump is the boy Boil on that, on that diseased body but that's 556 00:37:02,600 --> 00:37:07,400 what he's just the yes Lance the boil get rid of the boil but you 557 00:37:07,400 --> 00:37:10,400 still got the the disease body. You've got to take care of. 558 00:37:10,600 --> 00:37:14,100 And the reason why Bernie is number one in all the polls with 559 00:37:14,100 --> 00:37:18,500 latino voters number two, with average Americans after buying 560 00:37:18,500 --> 00:37:21,700 right now, and that's changing more and more, you know, Bernie 561 00:37:21,700 --> 00:37:24,700 is has really risen with African-American voters in 562 00:37:24,700 --> 00:37:28,400 recent polls and that's because they know he's the real deal. 563 00:37:29,300 --> 00:37:35,300 He will not turn on them, he will not be bought off and they 564 00:37:35,300 --> 00:37:38,400 know that. And that's why they will be 565 00:37:38,400 --> 00:37:42,800 excited about voting for him. I feel very strongly about the, 566 00:37:42,800 --> 00:37:47,500 okay, and with you, you mentioned to michiganders and 567 00:37:47,500 --> 00:37:51,100 said that I went to Cranbrook, which is, of course, very rich. 568 00:37:51,100 --> 00:37:55,800 Boys school, which we were the sons of the Roger. 569 00:37:56,300 --> 00:37:59,300 The Rogers that you turned against the sons of the auto 570 00:37:59,300 --> 00:38:03,300 manufacturers, Jim Rogers math. I was a scholarship student full 571 00:38:03,300 --> 00:38:09,400 scholarships through and in fact, Act, when I graduated, I 572 00:38:09,400 --> 00:38:13,300 spent the summer working at the Dodge plant number three in 573 00:38:13,300 --> 00:38:16,700 Hamtramck because I was expecting a life as a labor, 574 00:38:16,700 --> 00:38:20,200 organizer or labor or labor Economist, which is what I 575 00:38:20,200 --> 00:38:24,300 studied in college. And I was very familiar with the 576 00:38:25,500 --> 00:38:29,900 Memorial Day Massacre Republic Theater in Chicago and the 577 00:38:30,300 --> 00:38:33,600 battle of the overpass in with Walter Reuther and so forth. 578 00:38:33,900 --> 00:38:36,700 And that's where I was headed. I joined the UAW. 579 00:38:36,900 --> 00:38:38,800 I was 17 had to get my father out. 580 00:38:38,800 --> 00:38:41,200 Wow. But yeah. 581 00:38:41,200 --> 00:38:45,600 So just for people listening that the Dodge Factory in 582 00:38:45,600 --> 00:38:48,700 Hamtramck. Michigan, Hamtramck is a city 583 00:38:48,700 --> 00:38:50,900 within the city limits of Detroit. 584 00:38:51,400 --> 00:38:55,800 So it's like right? It's a hardcore town that exists 585 00:38:55,800 --> 00:38:59,100 within the city limits of Detroit and that factory 586 00:38:59,100 --> 00:39:02,100 experiencing right now. Very bad hearing problems. 587 00:39:02,100 --> 00:39:04,800 Really got worse. It started in the in the Press 588 00:39:04,800 --> 00:39:09,000 shop in Hamtramck, which If you've been in a Press Room, you 589 00:39:09,008 --> 00:39:13,000 know, where they punch out that the big things, the tops and 590 00:39:13,300 --> 00:39:15,900 yeah, brutal, the sides. And so, for the scream of those 591 00:39:15,900 --> 00:39:19,700 machines, I've never really recovered from I, in fact, I was 592 00:39:19,700 --> 00:39:23,600 very interested to see that the first place that the UAW, 593 00:39:24,100 --> 00:39:27,900 bargained on conditions, not just salary, you know, 594 00:39:27,900 --> 00:39:31,500 retirement, whatever. But conditions was Dodge plant 595 00:39:31,500 --> 00:39:35,500 number three, where they used to wear hearing, you know, phones 596 00:39:35,500 --> 00:39:37,800 over your ears of Muffler. Over the years at all. 597 00:39:38,000 --> 00:39:41,700 Now they do. So I might hearing is really 598 00:39:41,700 --> 00:39:44,500 damaged. Now, I'm sorry about that and 599 00:39:44,500 --> 00:39:50,200 I'm sorry that Detroit and Hamtramck is his responsible for 600 00:39:50,200 --> 00:39:51,700 this. None of them. 601 00:39:52,200 --> 00:39:55,400 I became a cold warrior as did a lot of the unions. 602 00:39:56,100 --> 00:40:00,700 In fact at that time and when do you mean a different direction? 603 00:40:01,000 --> 00:40:06,700 But certainly I didn't imagine in. 604 00:40:06,800 --> 00:40:10,000 Ever the best thing I can say for the Democratic party now is 605 00:40:10,000 --> 00:40:14,800 that it has Alexander your costume AOC you in it and has 606 00:40:14,800 --> 00:40:16,900 Bernie Sanders who has Elizabeth Warren. 607 00:40:18,300 --> 00:40:22,100 And I must say it didn't dream in 2016. 608 00:40:22,100 --> 00:40:26,400 At the beginning of the campaign that an old Jewish socialist, 609 00:40:26,400 --> 00:40:29,900 could come close to getting that nomination or had a real track 610 00:40:29,900 --> 00:40:32,200 and getting it. I don't think burning himself 611 00:40:32,700 --> 00:40:35,900 imagine that at the beginning and no, he didn't. 612 00:40:36,900 --> 00:40:41,100 Me of taking over the Democratic party which is not an overnight 613 00:40:41,100 --> 00:40:45,900 thing, it takes long. Organizing and long work in 614 00:40:45,900 --> 00:40:49,600 emulation of what the right wing did the right wing youth in 615 00:40:49,600 --> 00:40:52,100 particular, I think Young Americans for Freedom. 616 00:40:52,100 --> 00:40:55,600 So they took over the Republican party after the defeat of their 617 00:40:55,600 --> 00:41:01,900 Kennedy Goldwater in 1964. He was totally destroyed lost, 618 00:41:01,900 --> 00:41:05,500 you know, everything. But a few things in the South 16 619 00:41:05,500 --> 00:41:08,100 years later. They had taken over the 620 00:41:08,100 --> 00:41:11,300 Republican party to the point where they got one, a Reagan in 621 00:41:11,300 --> 00:41:15,400 1980. Well, we don't have in a way 16 622 00:41:15,400 --> 00:41:19,700 years to do something about climate, but the idea of working 623 00:41:19,700 --> 00:41:25,900 politically to change the possibilities in this country 624 00:41:26,500 --> 00:41:31,500 isn't, is the challenge to us. We can't, we can't go on as of 625 00:41:31,500 --> 00:41:36,200 now, and getting either Sanders or Warren in, which will be very 626 00:41:36,200 --> 00:41:38,300 hard. Once again, Stitch, I would say 627 00:41:39,400 --> 00:41:45,100 we need that and going to try to do our best even if it even if 628 00:41:45,100 --> 00:41:49,500 it's a long shot to do that because as Noam Chomsky puts it 629 00:41:49,700 --> 00:41:54,000 Republican party, today is the most dangerous, political 630 00:41:54,000 --> 00:41:59,100 organization in human history and sounds almost necessarily 631 00:41:59,500 --> 00:42:02,400 crazy hyperbolic. How can one say anything like 632 00:42:02,400 --> 00:42:04,700 that? And when he referring to is the 633 00:42:04,700 --> 00:42:08,600 fact that he says, They are doing their absolute best 634 00:42:08,600 --> 00:42:14,600 monolithically to favor, the short-run interests of 635 00:42:14,600 --> 00:42:21,000 ExxonMobil and others and put fossils foot CO2 into the 636 00:42:21,000 --> 00:42:25,600 atmosphere as fast as they can. And right huh there's never been 637 00:42:25,600 --> 00:42:28,100 anything like that. We've never faced a conscious 638 00:42:28,100 --> 00:42:31,500 challenge like that ever. That's so true. 639 00:42:31,600 --> 00:42:34,400 I want to ask you just before we close here. 640 00:42:34,900 --> 00:42:38,800 Something about A documentary. It's actually my favorite 641 00:42:38,800 --> 00:42:42,500 documentary of all time. It's called hearts and Minds by 642 00:42:42,500 --> 00:42:46,800 the director, Peter Davis. You appear prominently in this 643 00:42:46,800 --> 00:42:49,300 documentary. This is now this was me back in 644 00:42:49,300 --> 00:42:57,100 1975 76 and and he interviews you just before the end of the 645 00:42:57,107 --> 00:42:58,600 war. Okay. 646 00:42:58,600 --> 00:43:03,100 So yeah, I think he probably started this back in 72 73 the 647 00:43:03,100 --> 00:43:06,600 project itself. Oh no it was done in in 72 73. 648 00:43:07,300 --> 00:43:12,200 Yeah, and they came out and 75 I believe and won the Oscar for 649 00:43:12,200 --> 00:43:14,900 best documentary. It's no surprise that in a very 650 00:43:14,900 --> 00:43:17,500 poor country. You can find people who will 651 00:43:17,500 --> 00:43:22,000 wear for in uniforms what is always surprised us? 652 00:43:22,000 --> 00:43:25,200 What we've never been willing to predict or understand? 653 00:43:26,600 --> 00:43:30,700 Is that the Vietnamese communist leadership can find enough 654 00:43:30,700 --> 00:43:34,900 people to live in the tunnels fight for nothing, wearing Rag 655 00:43:34,900 --> 00:43:39,000 and shorts year after year, under the American bombs a war 656 00:43:39,000 --> 00:43:43,500 in which one side is entirely financed and equipped and 657 00:43:43,500 --> 00:43:47,500 supported by foreigners. Is not a Civil War. 658 00:43:47,900 --> 00:43:50,400 The only foreigners in that country where the foreigners we 659 00:43:50,400 --> 00:43:53,900 financed in the first part of the war and the foreigners, we 660 00:43:53,900 --> 00:43:56,200 were in the second half of the water. 661 00:43:57,800 --> 00:44:01,200 Basically we didn't want to acknowledge the scale of our 662 00:44:01,200 --> 00:44:03,100 involvement there. We didn't want to realize that 663 00:44:03,100 --> 00:44:06,100 it was our war because that would have been to say that 664 00:44:06,100 --> 00:44:10,600 every casualty on both sides was a casualty caused by our policy. 665 00:44:10,800 --> 00:44:14,200 Question used to be, might it be possible that we were on the 666 00:44:14,200 --> 00:44:18,600 wrong side and in Vietnamese War, but we weren't on the wrong 667 00:44:18,600 --> 00:44:22,800 side, we are the wrong side. Wow. 668 00:44:23,200 --> 00:44:29,000 So that is maybe one of the most profound statements I've ever 669 00:44:29,000 --> 00:44:32,500 seen in a documentary that we are the wrong side. 670 00:44:33,400 --> 00:44:36,800 It's so hard for us as Americans to wrap our heads around the 671 00:44:36,800 --> 00:44:39,700 idea. How could we possibly be the 672 00:44:39,700 --> 00:44:42,900 wrong side? Why we're for truth and Justice 673 00:44:42,900 --> 00:44:45,800 and the American way and we delivered democracy to your 674 00:44:45,800 --> 00:44:50,300 doorstep But the truth was something very different, a 675 00:44:50,308 --> 00:44:56,300 truth that you exposed with the Pentagon papers and and it's 676 00:44:56,300 --> 00:44:58,700 such a moment in this film. When I saw in the theater with 677 00:44:58,700 --> 00:45:04,800 an audience back in back in the mid-70s it was like a mallet 678 00:45:05,200 --> 00:45:08,400 coming out of the screen and whacking me and everybody else 679 00:45:08,400 --> 00:45:10,900 in the audience. It was so powerful. 680 00:45:11,700 --> 00:45:16,400 And what have we learned now? All these years later, All these 681 00:45:16,400 --> 00:45:21,000 almost 50 years later when we're talking right now, just a week 682 00:45:21,000 --> 00:45:25,200 or two, after the revelation of the so-called Afghanistan papers 683 00:45:25,700 --> 00:45:28,800 and which it turns out that the highest officials in the 684 00:45:28,800 --> 00:45:32,200 government military and civilians were asking, well, the 685 00:45:32,200 --> 00:45:35,500 Secretary of Defense Rumsfeld missing, I can't see who the 686 00:45:35,500 --> 00:45:40,600 good guys are here or loot the general in charge of the area. 687 00:45:40,800 --> 00:45:44,300 Basically saying, you know, we didn't have the foggiest idea 688 00:45:44,300 --> 00:45:47,500 what we were doing it again. Then only the good guys and who 689 00:45:47,500 --> 00:45:50,900 are the bad guys, but they weren't facing up ever. 690 00:45:51,500 --> 00:45:55,100 They were recognizing that we were in those endless. 691 00:45:55,100 --> 00:45:58,600 Stalemates that we were making no progress that the statements 692 00:45:58,600 --> 00:46:02,600 about progress that we were all these same people were making to 693 00:46:02,600 --> 00:46:05,900 the American public and the president is making we're false 694 00:46:05,900 --> 00:46:09,500 that wasn't happening. And then go on again, not one of 695 00:46:09,500 --> 00:46:11,500 them. I think reveal that at the time 696 00:46:11,800 --> 00:46:16,700 but what they haven't fixed up to is our role there, Which is 697 00:46:17,300 --> 00:46:22,200 foreign Invaders, foreign occupiers and none of these 698 00:46:22,400 --> 00:46:28,400 sides on the thing we're terribly real, whoa, you know, 699 00:46:28,400 --> 00:46:32,700 admirable in all respects who is in effect, but there were some 700 00:46:32,700 --> 00:46:35,100 people there, who really had, no right to be there. 701 00:46:35,100 --> 00:46:40,000 Killing people, and that was us what they hadn't faced up to was 702 00:46:40,200 --> 00:46:43,900 an imperial rule here and Empire, where we thought we had 703 00:46:43,900 --> 00:46:45,500 the right to we make other other. 704 00:46:45,600 --> 00:46:49,200 Nations in to decide regime change, in regime changes, 705 00:46:49,300 --> 00:46:53,600 virtual definition of empire. Now the notion that we have a 706 00:46:53,600 --> 00:47:00,300 right to go on killing Afghans for whatever reason protecting 707 00:47:00,300 --> 00:47:04,200 women in there and who need protecting but do whatever that 708 00:47:04,200 --> 00:47:08,200 we have a right to be killing Afghans right now and losing 709 00:47:08,200 --> 00:47:14,000 some Americans but in a 10 or more 21 rate killing Afghans is 710 00:47:14,000 --> 00:47:18,100 something American people. Haven't faced up to and that's 711 00:47:18,100 --> 00:47:21,800 true elsewhere and in Yemen right now where's that? 712 00:47:21,800 --> 00:47:26,100 We're supporting the Saudis, giving them weapons selling 713 00:47:26,100 --> 00:47:29,700 them, weapons servicing their planes refueling their planes, 714 00:47:29,700 --> 00:47:35,000 giving them Target information, which they largely use to kill 715 00:47:35,000 --> 00:47:38,500 civilians in Yemen and to blockade them and produce famine 716 00:47:38,500 --> 00:47:42,000 syrup. Ricky's were both houses of 717 00:47:42,000 --> 00:47:45,800 Congress actually voted to cut off the Aid by the Way. 718 00:47:45,800 --> 00:47:50,300 An effort happened to be led by Senator Bernie Sanders, but he 719 00:47:50,300 --> 00:47:55,400 got actual votes that had never happened since from Republican 720 00:47:55,400 --> 00:47:59,000 field in a since 1973. When Congress could off the 721 00:47:59,000 --> 00:48:02,500 votes for Vietnam, that was the first time in history where I 722 00:48:02,500 --> 00:48:06,700 think any legislature had cut off funding for ongoing war on 723 00:48:06,700 --> 00:48:11,500 that time and the second time except that trump vetoed it. 724 00:48:11,900 --> 00:48:16,400 So enormous crime against the piece is Going on right now 725 00:48:16,400 --> 00:48:19,700 crime against humanity in Yemen, right us. 726 00:48:20,100 --> 00:48:23,500 And that doesn't Define us as the good guys. 727 00:48:24,100 --> 00:48:31,900 It just now we, the idea that we support democracy in the third 728 00:48:31,900 --> 00:48:36,100 world, we former Colonial world, the underdeveloped world is 729 00:48:36,100 --> 00:48:39,000 false. It's a myth that I believed in, 730 00:48:39,000 --> 00:48:42,300 for much of my life. And finally came to Solomon 731 00:48:42,300 --> 00:48:45,000 sudden certainly wasn't sure in Vietnam, but it was really 732 00:48:45,000 --> 00:48:47,000 later. After that, I came to see that 733 00:48:47,000 --> 00:48:52,900 that was not an aberration that. Basically we more often than not 734 00:48:53,000 --> 00:48:58,700 support dictatorship schools to authoritarian regimes because 735 00:48:58,700 --> 00:49:03,100 they suit, our corporate interests are economic interests 736 00:49:03,100 --> 00:49:07,400 better than a democracy better than country with unions and 737 00:49:07,400 --> 00:49:11,500 peasant organizations do and with welfare states of any kind. 738 00:49:12,200 --> 00:49:18,700 So that it's simply false We are the good guys when it comes to 739 00:49:18,900 --> 00:49:21,700 that part of the world that half of the world and that's still 740 00:49:21,700 --> 00:49:26,500 true, it's what we're seeing. Now, the Afghan papers, show 741 00:49:26,500 --> 00:49:29,500 that these people I think never did come to understand that even 742 00:49:29,500 --> 00:49:31,600 though they knew we weren't winning. 743 00:49:32,200 --> 00:49:35,700 But you know, we're American people have been willing to 744 00:49:35,700 --> 00:49:40,500 tolerate killing foreigners from the air without too many 745 00:49:40,500 --> 00:49:43,100 American casualties in definitely. 746 00:49:43,500 --> 00:49:48,200 And that's what you just seem a 18 years in Afghanistan without 747 00:49:48,300 --> 00:49:51,700 changing both parties. It can go on for another 18 748 00:49:51,700 --> 00:49:58,100 years and then let's hope not. I think I just also just want to 749 00:49:58,800 --> 00:50:03,900 I don't know if I've ever done this in person or have told you 750 00:50:03,900 --> 00:50:08,900 this over the phone or whatever. So, just a I just I'm just 751 00:50:08,900 --> 00:50:11,000 saying I was I don't know if I've ever mentioned this to you, 752 00:50:11,300 --> 00:50:15,700 or thank you just outright. Thank you, personally, thank you 753 00:50:16,400 --> 00:50:21,200 for what you've done for, what you did for the when you look at 754 00:50:21,200 --> 00:50:23,900 what's happened. Now to Chelsea, Manning to Ed 755 00:50:23,900 --> 00:50:27,200 Snowden. Yeah, I mean, it's what they did 756 00:50:27,200 --> 00:50:31,800 was really, no different than what you did. 757 00:50:32,600 --> 00:50:37,300 And you are considered an American hero and I don't 758 00:50:37,300 --> 00:50:43,000 understand why these two individuals don't get the scent. 759 00:50:43,000 --> 00:50:45,800 But boy, I'll tell you, you know, they want to lock them up 760 00:50:45,800 --> 00:50:49,500 and throw the key away and the message to other possible 761 00:50:49,500 --> 00:50:54,200 whistleblowers is, don't you even think about taking 762 00:50:54,200 --> 00:50:55,900 documents that will tell the American people? 763 00:50:55,900 --> 00:50:59,800 The truth. Well, the Moreland who those two 764 00:50:59,800 --> 00:51:05,400 people are heroes of mine. And and at the same time, I 765 00:51:05,400 --> 00:51:07,400 identify them with them. What does that mean? 766 00:51:07,400 --> 00:51:14,100 Well, they represent what they did represents my, What I've 767 00:51:14,100 --> 00:51:17,200 Done best, the best part of my life, which is not the whole of 768 00:51:17,200 --> 00:51:22,700 My Life by any means. But I know when in, like, Ed 769 00:51:22,700 --> 00:51:25,700 Snowden very much, but I admired, I don't know, Chelsea 770 00:51:25,700 --> 00:51:32,300 speak of, but I know them as people, whose example, I would 771 00:51:32,300 --> 00:51:36,900 like, To see others phone and my newest hero and as much as them 772 00:51:36,900 --> 00:51:43,800 actually is 16 years old. Greta totenberg my God, I think 773 00:51:43,900 --> 00:51:45,900 this point will interest you, isn't it? 774 00:51:45,900 --> 00:51:52,400 Made very often she's known for leading inspiring demonstrations 775 00:51:52,600 --> 00:51:56,400 all over the world, 1.6, 1.2 million. 776 00:51:56,400 --> 00:52:01,000 I think it was in the beginning of the year and in October 4 to 777 00:52:01,000 --> 00:52:04,200 6 million people. Young people demonstrated 778 00:52:04,200 --> 00:52:09,500 against the apathy, the inactivity on climate change, 779 00:52:10,400 --> 00:52:14,500 but they demonstrated on a weekday on Friday. 780 00:52:14,700 --> 00:52:20,200 They took off from school and we called the situation as she did 781 00:52:20,200 --> 00:52:25,700 when she was doing it alone as a strike, that's what it is. 782 00:52:26,300 --> 00:52:29,400 I don't think we're going to change the world here and change 783 00:52:29,400 --> 00:52:32,200 their policies, without being willing to use. 784 00:52:32,400 --> 00:52:37,700 The sentence against but very specifically strikes, general 785 00:52:37,700 --> 00:52:40,800 strike. And that's what she is leading 786 00:52:41,000 --> 00:52:44,300 right now. And as I say my own interest in 787 00:52:44,300 --> 00:52:48,600 the in the labor movement that's how as you know the labor the 788 00:52:48,600 --> 00:52:53,600 your car industry was centrally organized by sit-down strikes 789 00:52:53,700 --> 00:52:56,700 occupying buildings which were held by the Supreme Court to be 790 00:52:56,700 --> 00:53:00,400 illegal eventually. But by that time and I'm violent 791 00:53:00,500 --> 00:53:05,600 inside they just occupied the place and they had organized 792 00:53:05,700 --> 00:53:08,600 pretty much the Auto industry at that point. 793 00:53:08,700 --> 00:53:13,200 And we're going to have to show that kind of willingness to 794 00:53:13,200 --> 00:53:17,300 paint personal costs and to take a risk and to change our lives 795 00:53:17,300 --> 00:53:21,900 directly you asked whether I was an optimist, here's the kind of 796 00:53:21,900 --> 00:53:27,900 optimist I am great at Winburn said to a parliament recently, I 797 00:53:27,900 --> 00:53:33,400 saw the quote in there and transcript Tri-Cities Which one 798 00:53:33,400 --> 00:53:36,300 it was? She listed all the things that 799 00:53:36,300 --> 00:53:43,200 had to be done to avert catastrophic climate change and 800 00:53:43,200 --> 00:53:47,100 she said, I don't believe for a second that you're going to do 801 00:53:47,100 --> 00:53:52,400 any of these things but I hope I'm wrong and I realized when I 802 00:53:52,400 --> 00:53:57,900 read that that's my hope. I don't see a likely way out of 803 00:53:57,900 --> 00:54:01,500 the situation we've created here giving me strength of the 804 00:54:01,500 --> 00:54:03,000 institutions. We're facing the 805 00:54:03,000 --> 00:54:07,900 military-industrial complex, the fossil fuel industry, Exxon 806 00:54:08,000 --> 00:54:12,700 places like that, the bank's, I don't see how we get behind 807 00:54:12,700 --> 00:54:16,600 them, but I hope I'm wrong. And that's not an idle hope 808 00:54:16,800 --> 00:54:20,100 because I've often been wrong in the past, I've been wrong. 809 00:54:20,400 --> 00:54:23,600 So that's my hope. We've got a chance, it's not 810 00:54:23,600 --> 00:54:29,800 impossible, just the other day at caught 25, which Lele climate 811 00:54:29,800 --> 00:54:32,300 conference when she gave a terrific. 812 00:54:32,400 --> 00:54:36,700 Speech and follow my. I don't think she is vote 813 00:54:36,700 --> 00:54:39,400 directly inspired this. But a lot of people rushed the 814 00:54:39,400 --> 00:54:44,300 stage young people, and occupied it for a while and they were 815 00:54:44,300 --> 00:54:50,200 chanting. We are unstoppable and change is 816 00:54:50,200 --> 00:54:52,400 possible. Another world. 817 00:54:52,400 --> 00:54:54,600 And so they said another world is possible. 818 00:54:55,600 --> 00:54:58,300 It's true, it's possible. It's not possible. 819 00:54:58,300 --> 00:55:03,300 Yes, that's what we've got to work with and It's worth it, 820 00:55:03,700 --> 00:55:07,500 because the stakes are everything, the stakes in the 821 00:55:07,500 --> 00:55:11,200 climate area and nuclear are everything. 822 00:55:11,700 --> 00:55:15,300 So, it is worth our utmost efforts without violence. 823 00:55:15,300 --> 00:55:20,200 I would say, truthfully, but with shelf risk and 824 00:55:20,200 --> 00:55:24,600 self-sacrifice, it's, we have a chance of enlarging that 825 00:55:24,600 --> 00:55:27,000 possibility, and keeping it all going. 826 00:55:27,300 --> 00:55:29,500 I'm with you. I'm with you all the way with 827 00:55:29,500 --> 00:55:32,200 that. I feel every bit of the dish. 828 00:55:32,400 --> 00:55:37,300 Fair in the first part of what you said that, that we are 829 00:55:37,300 --> 00:55:44,700 probably doomed at this point, but but the one hope, is that if 830 00:55:44,700 --> 00:55:47,900 people get active. Now strike. 831 00:55:47,900 --> 00:55:51,600 Now fight. Now, we have that chance. 832 00:55:52,200 --> 00:55:53,800 Why would we not take that chance? 833 00:55:54,400 --> 00:55:56,900 Who would sit idly by at this point? 834 00:55:57,300 --> 00:56:00,600 You've been that inspiration, Greta is now that inspiration 835 00:56:00,700 --> 00:56:03,600 and we need to take take that and run with it. 836 00:56:03,700 --> 00:56:07,900 Absolutely, absolutely. Daniel Ellsberg I can't thank 837 00:56:07,900 --> 00:56:11,700 you enough here on the eve of this impeachment. 838 00:56:11,700 --> 00:56:18,300 Vote to have you with us. You were part of the reason that 839 00:56:18,300 --> 00:56:23,000 Nixon was in the process of being impeached, 45 years ago. 840 00:56:23,700 --> 00:56:27,600 This year, you're still with us. You're still fighting strong. 841 00:56:28,100 --> 00:56:31,800 We love you. Thank you for being on my second 842 00:56:31,800 --> 00:56:35,700 podcast. It's a it's a real pleasure. 843 00:56:35,700 --> 00:56:40,500 Thank you shanz likely because you are using your life, you 844 00:56:40,500 --> 00:56:45,600 exemplify right livelihood very much does films her powerful and 845 00:56:45,600 --> 00:56:50,300 have the real chance of bringing about change no guarantee, but 846 00:56:50,600 --> 00:56:53,400 no better chance, and thank you for those. 847 00:56:53,500 --> 00:56:55,600 Well, thank you. And thank to everyone listening. 848 00:56:56,000 --> 00:57:00,200 We thank you. And and we, we invite you to be 849 00:57:00,200 --> 00:57:01,700 part of this, if you're not already. 850 00:57:03,400 --> 00:57:06,900 Always remember as I say to everybody, there's more of us 851 00:57:07,200 --> 00:57:11,000 than there are of them. Don't ever forget that we have 852 00:57:11,000 --> 00:57:13,800 power. We have it in our hands and a 853 00:57:13,808 --> 00:57:16,300 lot of us, I think just don't know it, but it's there and it 854 00:57:16,300 --> 00:57:19,600 needs to be used and use now ASAP. 855 00:57:20,200 --> 00:57:21,800 So thank you. Thank you. 856 00:57:21,800 --> 00:57:26,300 Daniel Ellsberg and that's our second podcast here, with Rumble 857 00:57:26,600 --> 00:57:29,000 with Michael Moore and the past few days. 858 00:57:29,000 --> 00:57:35,000 However, it has become evident to me That I no longer have a 859 00:57:35,000 --> 00:57:38,900 strong enough political base in the Congress, the justify 860 00:57:38,900 --> 00:57:44,700 continuing that effort. I would have preferred to carry 861 00:57:44,700 --> 00:57:48,300 through to the Finish. Whatever the personal Agony, it 862 00:57:48,300 --> 00:57:54,100 would have involved. And my family unanimously urged 863 00:57:54,100 --> 00:57:58,400 me to do. So But the interest of the 864 00:57:58,400 --> 00:58:03,600 nation, must always come before any personal considerations from 865 00:58:03,600 --> 00:58:05,700 the discussions. I've had with Congressional and 866 00:58:05,700 --> 00:58:07,700 other leaders. I have concluded. 867 00:58:08,600 --> 00:58:12,600 That because of the Watergate matter, I might not have the 868 00:58:12,600 --> 00:58:17,800 support of the Congress that I would consider necessary to back 869 00:58:17,800 --> 00:58:21,100 the very difficult decisions and carry out the duties of this 870 00:58:21,100 --> 00:58:23,600 office. And the way the interests of the 871 00:58:23,600 --> 00:58:30,200 nation a require, I have never been a quitter. 872 00:58:27,900 --> 00:58:30,200 I have never been a quitter.