All right, guys, welcome to another episode of Black Geek
Energy and on today shall look some guests come on the show and
some guests actually help start the show.
Today's guest was actually our very first guest ever and now
he's back for the third time, which at this point just makes
him a part of the foundations over here at Black Geek Energy.
If you don't know by now, you need to queue up these past
episodes 'cause he is a comic book writer whose worked on
titles like Aquaman and Star Wars Adventures.
And now he's back with his latest project, Ancestral
Recall, a story that blends black history, sci-fi and the
supernatural. Anyway, you don't really see in
comics nowadays, every single time he pulls up the comic
conversation, yeah, the conversation gets better.
So now we had to run another one for the release of his trade
paperback of this book Anyways, so give a big round of applause
for Jordy Clark. Yeah.
Appreciate y'all having me back on again.
I feel like, you know, my I need to do the SNL thing where I get
like a jacket or like a yeah like a pin or something.
I. Know, I know.
OK, Jordan, you know, I always start with the hardest question
first. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
I always start with the hardest question 1st and I just gotta
ask. I have booked you twice already.
This time was kind of different. Jordan has got some people I
received the e-mail like would you like for?
I'm like what? I was like ass because I knew
that the sun was coming down. I saw all the stuff on TikTok.
I was like, I was about to ask. I just had to get up the nerves
and write the proposal. And then here comes Jordan's
people up in them. BGEEI was like, excuse me, OK,
Jordan's people. Jordan, I guess that you you
real big time now. Well, you know, we, we, we're
trying to promote the big, the book as big as possible.
So shout out to Hannah, who's been handing a lot of the
publicity for Hawaii. Yeah, I think, you know, it's,
it's difficult. I mean, you can attest, you
know, just even doing the podcast, like booking people,
trying to, you know, coordinate all the schedules and all that
stuff. So I'm very grateful that, you
know, Hawaii is is helped out with that and, you know, been
able to kind of schedule stuff like this.
You know, when when she sent the e-mail, I was like, I know them,
you know, not even in the way. Yeah, I mean, it wasn't even in
a way that was like, you know, like, all right, black eke
energy, whatever. It was more just like, oh, it's
it's weird to get an e-mail asking if I want to go on a show
that I've already been on twice. It was real professional.
We were like, like, hey guys, can I come on the show?
That could have been the e-mail, the text.
Yeah, no, I was like, I could, I could have hit him up.
But I guess sometimes you go through the official channels,
right. So.
You had the flex on this real quick.
I know Jordan has gotten big time now, but I'm still going to
hit you up in the in the Instagram DM so.
Absolutely. Don't, don't look at me funny.
Now that you got I, I, I knew you first.
All right? No, I mean that's I was just
going to say, you know, we're we're we're family.
So you know, it's never it's never anything.
If you guys ever need me to come on the show or anything like
that, Well, it's always great to talk with y'all.
Thank you. Thank you.
OK, Jordan, we're going to start this week off by we stop every
week. We're going to get to ancestor
recall in a minute. But how has your past week been?
It's been, it's been pretty good.
You know, I wasn't going to say, you know, anything, anything
negative. I think I don't know how you all
feel just living in, in current times, but like I've been trying
to practice a bit more mindfulness for sure.
But also just like, I guess I would say, you know, like an
intentional intentionalness with the way that I, I, I choose to
spend my time and interact with things because I feel like
there's a lot of things that are trying to distract you from just
just just general life, general happiness.
And so, you know, I feel like it's kind of easy to get sucked
into not only just like negative spirals through like social
media and stuff like that, but I feel like it's also kind of just
even, you know, we're, we're in a geek space, right?
And so like a lot of you know, what, what's coming across your
feed, you know, and we, and we know this, we know that how the
algorithms work is the negativity is what gets the, the
platform and bumped up. And so, you know, you're seeing
basically just like, oh, you know, this sucked or like this
came out and I didn't like it or, you know, Can you believe
that they did XYZ in this comic or whatever?
And you're just kind of like, I'm, I'm trying to get back to
the things that I, I like and enjoy and having conversations
with people who like things and enjoy things and, and talk about
it that way. So I would say this past week
has kind of been a little bit of like a like a reset, you know,
in terms of just kind of trying to take it easy and not let
myself get caught up in too much drama going on as opposed to
like trying to find the things that I'm I'm enjoying and, and
taking it easy with that. So.
OK. Nice.
So does it mean, does that mean like, trying to like, stay out
of the news as much like you don't want, like you don't want
to see what Trump's doing every day?
You know, it's crazy because you have, Yeah, you kind of have to
be aware of things that are going on.
So, you know, I'm, I'm, I, I peep my head out, you know,
every once in a while just to get, get a wind of what's going
on. But also like, I think, I mean,
if we're talking about that specifically, you know, dude is
crazy. So every every 5 minutes
something different is happening.
So it's not even like it's not worth it to stay informed about
what's going on, but like 10 minutes from the last crazy
thing you heard could be something completely different.
And then it's just like, you know, I just spent 5 minutes
trying to process the last thing and now we're doing whatever.
So it's like, you know, I'll, I'll check in when I need to,
you know, and I kind of have my, my my trusted sources that I can
go to and be like, all right, you know, I guess that's
happening. But but also, you know, again,
not to get like, you know, super woo woo or whatever with it, but
like trying to hold on to the things that you can control and
like you can't control that man, so.
Absolutely, Absolutely. It might have been a therapy.
Control what you can control. Worry about what you can
control. Yeah, I know exactly, exactly
what you're talking about because I was playing D&D last
night. We had so much fun.
I I run AD and D campaign and my people were running from a
beholder zombie. Great, great adventures.
It did. I The thing is over and I've
checked my phone. The president's obviously a
Skywalker at this point. And I'm just like, why?
Why? So I just went in bed and I just
kept listening to my lit RPG about ants and.
And yeah, it just, it just didn't make no sense.
But yeah, I'm doing geek stuff. Was a great, great escape from
all of the Trump nonsense going on.
Absolutely, Absolutely. My previous week it's been
pretty good. I've been working from home
because we're just moving offices and I'm not a work for
home person. But this week of like just being
like not having to get up early, not having to like fight
traffic, you know, I can take a few more breaks then and the
rules is written. So yeah, it's been, it's been
hella smooth. And I went on a hike yesterday
and I'm not a hiker. I'm not a walk outside with no
destination person. So.
But it was real nice. Like, yeah, yeah.
It was like we did like 2, maybe 2 1/2 miles.
No, we did like almost 3 1/2 miles.
And like when I got home, I was like, we supposed to go out last
night. But like, we got home, we was
like, hey, a nap sounds pretty good.
But the rest of. The.
Time so you have that work from home thing like it's like, you
know, you could be home so you're playing video games.
Wow, what is going on? But but people say that they
still get their work, if not more work done.
So are you feeling that more work?
You feel like a slack off. Oh, no, I, I low key do feel
like I get more stuff done just because there's less
distractions. Like when I'm, when I'm, you
know, when I come in here, close the door, like I'm locked in
versus like in the office, like, oh, can we meet real quick?
Like somebody come over to my desk and I get a chat and that's
what, 30 minutes going right there.
You know, I don't have to like get up and leave the office and
go to the bathroom. Well, the way the bathrooms were
in my office, the bathrooms like outside, it was kind of weird.
Outside are you a gear like why are you?
Why are you using the apples? Not like they were just like
detached from the building. Like once you were in the
bathroom that was enclosed as well.
They're just detached. Marcus, why doesn't your office
has have the bathroom in the office?
Does your? No, I'm not the architect.
You're asking me the question. Hey, I can only worry about what
I can control. So.
So does the new office have bathrooms in the office so you
don't have to go down to the local Starbucks?
I don't. Know I haven't seen it.
I haven't seen it yet. Is it?
What I've heard is the kitchen is supposed to be in the middle
of the office though. And I'm like, that's weird.
Why are y'all worried about the kitchen?
Y'all need to start at the basics.
Prisons have bathrooms to Marcus.
Hey, a kitchen is like a basic need at the office.
No, it's. Not have a bathroom first.
You can't even poop poop where you where you work at on company
tile because you have to go outside the building.
And so and so and you know, that's, that's what I would do,
OK. Well, my week has been
uneventful as usual. Maybe you start living a life.
I know, right? I, I walk 2 miles just in the
woods outside my not the woods, but I live out in a rural area
so I just walk every down the street.
So it's like I'm walking in the woods.
Obviously I walk about two miles in that every day, but it's not
like up and down hills like in California with like a walking
stick. So there are stray dogs that
come out so. You need a walking stick.
I'm a dog person. Like I'll be like, hey dog, they
would like. But yeah, I've also been
listening to Chrysalis. This the new lit RPG Isakai book
audio book that I am listening to it is so good I love it.
Jordan, have you heard about the late RPGs that dungeon crawler
called the discount Dad The have you it's.
Kind of Dang. Yeah, it's supposed to be really
fun. I'm about to listen that one
next. But have you read these yet?
I've started the Dungeon Crawler Carl series which was a lot of
fun but I I haven't gotten into the other ones yet.
So now now that you're mentioning it, I need to put
them back on my list so I can. Chrysalis.
OK, Chrysalis It's about this guy, this 15 year old who gets
turned into a Ant after he dies on Earth.
And it's so good. Like the first 76 chapters of
this book, he doesn't talk to anybody.
It is so compelling that you want to know what is going on
and like throughout the book and before each, well before certain
chapters, there were, there may be a smart excerpt of how the
world works or like a narrator or a historian or something.
And it's, it's so great. It's so, so amazing how he does
this book. And I'm on book 6 now and I
can't stop listen to them. So yeah, His next book comes out
in June. And Dodge Crawler Carl.
So where are you and Dodge Crawler Carl?
I just finished the second book. Oh, way ahead of.
Yeah, way ahead. Of me.
Yeah. But now I saw, I saw too, that
they're doing them as like graphic novels now.
And I know I I feel like I've heard there's going to be like
an animated series. Yeah.
Seth Rollins Yeah. So they're really, you know,
like building that out. Yeah, yeah, on Paramountfox.
I don't know if it's animated or live action, but he's he's he's
doing it now. But yeah, Dougie Chronicle is
great. I'll wait on that.
When next month, the new Chrysalis, What comes out after
that? So I'm really into these little
RPGs. Haven't even done any of my
anime or manga stuff. Yeah, but that's all that my
week has been. I've, I've, I've been through
two of those books this week. I'm just laying down in a dark
room and it's absorbing them all.
So yeah, that's been great for me.
So, George, are you like reading the actual books?
Are you doing the audio book too?
I'm reading the actual books. I always feel like the thing
that messes me up with an audio book is like we all have our own
like internal reading speed. And so listening to like a
narrator, sometimes it's like, if they're not kind of matching
kind of how I normally read, like the pace I normally read
at, you know, it kind of throws me off because like I, you know,
I clearly love a podcast and like an audio drama and stuff
like that. But something like in a book, I
kind of either need to be physically reading it or if I'm
listening to it, like I think audiobooks really just come down
to the, to the person who's narrating it, like their energy
and they're facing and all that stuff.
So like it can kind of throw you off.
So I haven't listened to the dungeon Carlo Carlo like
audiobooks yet, But I mean, I've heard good things.
So maybe that's maybe I'll try it with the next one to see how
it feels. It's amazing.
It is amazing and the only thing is he he does all the voices
like OK, I thought he had a full studio production.
He is doing everybody in there. And the person who does Doctor
Caller Call also does the Chrysalis book.
So I really think that that's why I like the Chrysalis book so
much. Chris is audio book.
But yeah, the person who is reading this is a amazing, is
amazing. All right.
Okay, I'm like that too, Jordan, Like I have.
You're not supposed to do this, but I read with the voices in my
head and sometimes the audiobook person is just like boring.
It's like I can make this more. Yeah, yeah.
And I think that's the thing too, because I was just to
another one and I can't even finish it because it was so
boring. And the other thing is I have to
be without any distractions. Like I was listening to
audiobook and walking. If a squirrel run across the
street, that's 45 seconds that I've lost in the audience.
Like then I got to go back 60 seconds to catch up with where I
was. So no distractions as I have to
be a mind of Zen. And I think that's might be why
I like it, because I'm not thinking, you know, I'm not
overthinking anything. So I don't know, maybe a foreign
meditation for me? Yeah, yeah, OK.
OK, DeMarcus at this point let's go ahead and move on to our put
you on 2nd. Jordan, you know how this works.
We are going to put our lists on to something that we have liked
recently, whether it is a podcast or a movie or TV show or
book or anything. And this is sponsored by a good
friends at Movie Pass. So, DeMarcus, can you please
tell them a little bit about Movie Pass?
Absolutely. We Pass is a subscription based
service. You download the app, go ahead
and do your sign up and everything and they will send
you a movie pass card that acts just like a debit card.
And you can use that to buy movie tickets in theaters from
any theater, Regal, AMC, Cinemark, Cinepolis, any place
where you go see movies, you can use that to buy your tickets.
The whole thing, the whole premise, the whole, the whole
reason movie passes here is to make it easier, cheaper and more
affordable for you and your friends to go to the movies.
You know, I was using it before they sponsored the podcast and
it definitely does that in spades.
I had like the lowest tier account and I was spending like
$10 a month to get these movie credits and I was seeing two or
two to three movies a month. And after I used it once I made
my money back even at the cheapest theater that was like
around me. This was probably like 4 years
ago at this point and it's cheapest movie theater.
I was spending $16.00 a ticket, $10 a month, $16.00 a ticket and
I'm seeing 2 to 3 movies a month.
Y'all do the math. Movie pass for your ass.
Yeah, and MoviePass, it'll it allows you to buy your ticket on
that that movie theaters website.
So you're still accruing your points for like free popcorn or
free additional movie tickets. And what I started doing this, I
started to actually buy tickets to black movies.
I'm not going to see like this new you, me and Tuscany.
I'm not going to watch that love story child.
I don't really care. Oh, OK.
What? You better take it for it.
What like I, I, I love the Baileys.
Well, the one Bailey, the other Bailey went to the Kanye
concert. So I'm kind of iffy with her
right now. But I love the Baileys and I'm
going to support them. I'm going to support black
movies. So I have been using the points
I've I've been been given to purchase this black movie and to
make sure that this black movie succeeds.
And according to the the charge, it's it's it's been succeeding
and more black movies like it are going to be made.
So, yeah. Nice.
So this week I want to put you on to a movie that I saw called
Hollow Rd. Now this one is about two
parents and they get a call from their child who is coming home
from college and she gets into an accident and her parents once
a police wants a retired detective, once a a ambulance
emergency. EMT.
EMT and they are telling her don't call the cops yet and they
are racing to her because guess what, the girl was too scared to
give this this girl who she ran over CPR.
So they're like don't call the cops, we're coming.
You can blame it on us. But some something happens.
This other woman shows up and she knows a lot about this girl
and her family. Very suspenseful because all you
see are these two distraught parents and they are racing to
this daughter that we never seen.
And I very suspenseful, very thrilling, very good, extremely
good. I answered my seat the whole
time. Hollow Rd.
Go see it. OK, OK, very nice.
I have a movie to put y'all on to as well.
This one is called the Double Star.
The double. Yep, this one is it stars Jesse
Eisenberg there in like this, not apocalyptic, but like like a
different, a different alternative reality or whatever.
And they are like data entry clerks.
He's a daily entry clerk or something like this where he's
just like pushing buttons and doing math at his job, but he's
like super passive, super meek and like everybody just pretty
much just like runs over him in every part of his life.
And at a certain point his like doppelganger shows up.
Like his character's name is Simon James the doppelganger
shows up in heat in the doppelganger's name is James
Simon. And so James Simon is everything
Simon James wants to be. Like he tells what he wants.
He gets all the girls, he gets the promotions.
Like he starts at this, he starts at the same job and
within a few weeks he's like at a senior executive or something
like that. And like he starts kind of like
pushing Simon James around to like the original character.
And I'm not going to ruin it for you, but it's just he's trying
to, I don't know, he's trying to like figure out how to be a
person. I think I've seen this.
It was. It's pretty good.
It's like super suspenseful. It's like it's funny.
It's, it's a bit cringy in some parts.
It's, you know, there's some, there's some blood here and
there. OK, now I'm interested.
OK, Jordan, So what do you have to put our listeners on to for
this week? So I was thinking about it and
like, I don't, I don't think I have to put anybody on to
Resident Evil 9. I just started playing it like
I'm a little bit late. I feel like people probably know
about that. So instead I'm going to go with
a book that I read not that long ago.
I don't know if you guys have heard of this one.
It's called Burned Down Masters House by Clay Kane.
It just came out, I want to say like a month or two ago.
And it it it does what it proposes to do if you're curious
about that. But it, it is a historical
fiction novel that like takes real life stories of slaves and
their accounts and reimagines them in a way that like gives
them more agency. But also is like, you know, I
think when you, when you think about narratives of that time,
right? Like for a lot of people, I
understand a little bit of like the desire to get away from that
just because it can be, you know, very traumatic and like,
you know, reading about and thinking about what it was in
those times. But I think, you know, for, for
me, for somebody who's very interested in, in history and
just imagining, you know, black futures, like thinking about a
time where, you know, you, you, you didn't have that freedom and
autonomy. But like, you know, we still
made culture, we still made community, we still made family.
We still had all of this stuff. Like you couldn't, you couldn't
take that away from us. And I think a big part of this
book is there's, you know, a continual refrain about like,
you know, as they, they passed down, you know, knowledge to
each other or, you know, skills or even just again, like
community to each other. That's kind of the thing that
they always keep saying. It's like, you know, they, they
can't take that away from you. Like once you have, you know,
the knowledge, once you have, you know, once you, once you
learn how to read, once you learn how to, you know, think
and plan like all of the stuff that it can't be taken away from
you. And so, you know, it's a little
like, it's a little Django, you know, OK, Like it's not, it's
not necessarily like in that same vein of I mean, it does
get, it does get pretty violent, you know, throughout.
But yeah, I think it is, it's a, it's an interesting way that it
kind of, you know, brings in a lot of different stories and
narratives that, you know, maybe people didn't know before.
Like there's some, there's a queer romance that kind of goes
in and out of the story. There's, you know, a lot of
different, like female perspectives.
There's a lot of different, you know, perspectives from people
who I think maybe don't always necessarily get included in
these stories. And so, you know, by the end of
it, like it's, it can be a tough read in places, but I think by
the end of it, you are like, that's the book that I was
hoping it was. So, you know, I would, I would
recommend it to people. You know, you can get it,
however you get it. I'm sure there's audiobook
ebook. You know, I got my copy from my
local library. So like, you know, hit up your
libraries and, and all that. But yeah, burn down Masters
House by Clay Kane I would say would be my my thing to put
people onto. OK.
That sounds like a very
interesting book. And you read a lot of books,
Jordan, when you even find the time to even read all these
books. I think that's part of, you
know, going back to, to my attempts to kind of quiet out
the noise of everything going on around us.
Like, you know, when I sometimes when I feel myself like reaching
from my phone or like, you know, wanted to like jump on YouTube
or whatever, like I'll stop for a second and then think if
there's a book that I want to read and maybe like start like
getting into that And like, you know, if the book is holding my
attention, then, you know, that's a good sign.
But if it's like, all right, let me, let me do a little
something. And then even if I can't, you
know, if I don't finish it over, I don't get too far.
Like at least I, I started it. So for people who maybe are kind
of like lapsed readers or never really into reading, I would
definitely suggest a like, there's, there's all kinds of
books out there, you know what I mean?
I think maybe sometimes people think about, oh, you know, like
I'm really into, you know, this specific genre or like, you
know, I really don't like, you know, like fantasy books or this
kind of book, you know what I mean?
But like, I, I try to read around as much as possible.
So I mean, there's all the genres, you know, from horror to
fantasy to, you know, accident adventure, but then, you know,
there's, you know, people's books of essays, there's
people's books of poems, there's historical, not fiction, all
kinds of stuff. So even if you're just like, I'd
like to learn more about something, you know, there's,
there's books that can help with that.
If you're like, I would like to, for me, a lot of it is, is
getting to experience the world through different people's eyes,
you know, and like having the opportunity to to see the world
in a way that I you know, even even when you watch a movie,
right, Like there's certain things that you can pick up and
glean if you're watching like, you know, Korean film or you
know, South American film. But I think even just through
the reading sometimes, like it's really putting you in that
perspective of, you know, another person.
And so for me, it's, it's almost like getting to, to travel
around to all of these different places.
So like Jared was saying, like once you're, once you're into a
book, like once something that's like captured you, it is hard to
put it down. You know what I mean?
Because there's, there's a lot of books that I'll read it, you
know, I'll start, maybe I'll start the day and I'll, I'll
read like a chapter or something.
And then for the rest of the day until I get another chance to
pick it up again, I'm just like, man, I wonder what's going to
happen. Then I'm just like, you know,
I'm thinking about it, you know, And so I think even that, you
know, just just starting off small, if you're like, alright,
you know, I haven't read a, a full book in a long time.
There's plenty of books that are 100 pages or less that are like
well worth your time to read. So even if you just start small
with something and kind of pick up the habit again, it's, it's
something where, you know, I, my goal this year is to read 52
books. But even if you just read 5
books, like I, I think you've done yourself a service, you
know, so like, it doesn't even have to be like a marathon where
like I'm reading, I'm trying, I'm trying to read the whole
library or something crazy like that.
You could just, you know, start with like it's just a couple,
you know, And even if it's not like the thing that you do all
the time, I think it is helpful to, to do it, you know, make it
like a small part of your, your hobbies and habits to just, you
know, maybe you read, you know, a book every two to three
months, you know. That's that's what must be right
there, a book every two to three months.
Now, Jordan, there you do have your own podcast.
White people Won't save you. Let me ask you a question.
You haven't published a new episode since March 19th and and
today is April the 26th. Jordan, can I please get a new
episode of Why People Won't Save You?
I need a new episode. Absolutely.
Can. I think, you know, me and me and
Cameron have taken just a, just a short break to kind of retool
some things because I think we're, we've been doing it for
almost 6 years now. And so, you know, like we've
talked about doing a lot of things and then like we always,
you know, kind of put it off because I feel like we're both,
you know, busy and just, and just living.
And so we really wanted to be a little bit more intentional this
year with things. So we, we took a little break so
we could bank a couple episodes. So this week we're going to
start putting stuff out just so we can have, you know, stuff in
the vault and start pointing it out more regularly.
I think we're getting ready to make a bit more of an investment
in terms of like, you know, the production for things and like
trying to level things up that way.
So we want, we want to take a little step back so we could
kind of like reorganize stuff and then, you know, come back
with hopefully, I mean, you know, people, people keep like,
you know, like you just did keep hitting this up and like, oh,
you know, we're ready for more episodes and, and all that
stuff, which we we greatly appreciate, but we also want to
make sure that we're we're keeping up, you know, the level
of quality and like maybe even increasing it a bit if possible.
So, you know, we got you and we got I'll, I'll give you the
episode that's coming out this week is the last Boy Scout with
Bruce Willis and David Wayne's. I don't know if you remember
this movie where Bruce Willis is like a down on his luck
detective and Wayne's crazy to watch it now is a is a football
player who got kicked out of the NFL for gambling and his
girlfriend Halle Berry. I think this might be like Halle
Berry's like second or third, like it's really early in her
career is like, you know, involved in some some not great
things. And so like they team up to to
get into it. But the beginning, you may have
seen this even if you haven't seen the movie.
The beginning is Billy Blanks, the Taibo.
Billy Blanks is a football player who is like in deep with
some, like gambling bookie and like, does PCP in the locker
room, has to go out. It's like a rainstorm.
So it looks like it's filmed like it's a war movie, you know,
And like, it's like it's raining.
It's like a torrential downpour on the field.
And he's like, he gets a call in the locker room that's like, you
need to score a touchdown, you know, or bad things are going to
happen to you. And so he goes out of the field
and they give him the ball and like, he's he's the running
back. So he's coming out the backfield
and like, he jukes a couple of guys.
He runs over a few guys. And then there's one more guy
between him and the end zone, and so he pulls out a gun and
shoots. Him on the.
Field and then shoots himself. And that's how the movie starts.
OK, OK. On the I know this movie and I
do not remember this scene during.
The game. Yes, I don't think that's the
play that coach called. I think he, I think that was an
audible. Yeah, white people will say to
you, it's possibly the hardest podcast that you have to do.
Because I remember for this podcast, DeMarcus maybe watched
The Hobbit, and I absolutely hated it because of how those
Caucasian people would just break into people's houses for
the the whole entire movie. And that was the byline of the
movie. We break into people's houses
for these three. Movies.
And. I wanna, I wanna, I wanna add a
correction here. It wasn't DeMarcus that said
watch these movies. That was our other Co host.
We used to have Laurente. That was his episode.
He asked you to watch those movies.
He didn't make you. You're growing.
I am blaming you and and you do this.
You watch movies that are questionable for that your whole
podcast, like when I was so blessed to be on and I watched
what was my movie about the about Stonewall?
Was it called? It was called Stonewall.
It was just called Stonewall, yeah.
Yeah, that two musical directors wrote, wrote like a musical, but
without the music, and it was so crazy and.
It was by Roland Emberg who did Independence Day.
Yeah, it. Was crazy.
It, it was insane. The movie was insane and I we
had a lot to say. I think this podcast was like
over 2 hours long about how dumb it was.
I could not imagine doing that again about a different movie
because talking to y'all about it was fun and it was hilarious.
But watching the movie, taking notes on it, remembering stuff
about it, that was so tedious. That was so Oh my, I, I, I, I
was killing myself. I wanted to take breaks, but I
do if I took a break, I would not feel happy.
So I was so happy when Tubi would play their commercials
because I wouldn't have to see the movie for 190 seconds.
So I, I, I have to give it up to you for your podcast.
Like we talk about we cover here, we talk about anything,
but y'all do the research and y'all go through the smog.
All y'all's podcast that is just so admirable, so admirable.
DeMarcus, you have to. DeMarcus has to do it.
Because I mean, you're more than welcome to come on.
We we got so many movies. OK, yeah, 'cause he he, it's
hard for him to watch a movie that he does not like now.
Well, yeah. No, I can watch a movie once I
start a movie, like more than likely I'm a finish it 'cause I
got to see, I got to see what happens.
OK, I would love to see you watch a movie.
Well, I didn't, I I didn't know. I wouldn't like it as much, but
I didn't like it. So maybe I don't know.
Yeah. DeMarcus, is there an activity
for the week? There's absolutely an activity
this week and if it is your first time tuning into Black
Geek Energy, the way these activities and games work is
DeMarcus comes up with games and activities.
He is the judge, agree and execution of all things
activities and games on Black Geek Energy comes up with the
questions, the answers. He decides who's right, who's
wrong, what's right, what's wrong and who wins and who
loses. So today's game, I wish I had a
better name for, we can call it factor fiction.
And what I'm going to do is I'm going to read you a little
snippet of a black historical figure from the diaspora.
So this could be someone in Africa, someone in America,
somewhere else in the in the world.
And you have to tell me whether this was a real person who did a
real thing or a fake person and they did not do this thing.
OK. Does it does it make sense?
Makes sense, Jerry. Yeah.
All right. Cool, Cool, cool, cool.
All right. So I'm thinking of a number
between 5 and 15. Five.
And what happens to what I'm? Trying to mix it up a little
bit. Lord OK 7.
OK. 12. The number was 14.
Jordan, you're going. OK All right.
And some of these names, I might screw them up, so please forgive
me. Please be grateful.
Euphemia Lofton Hayes became the first Black woman to earn a PhD
in mathematics from an American University in 1949 and spent her
career training generations of mathematicians at Howard
University. Is this a real person or just a
fake person? Like part of me wants to say not
even that somebody got a degree before that, but also Black
history is full of those surprises where you're like, oh,
it wasn't until. OK, yeah.
So I mean, some of the sounds familiar.
I'm going to say it's fact, OK? Correct.
This is a real person. Euphemia Lofton Hayes was a
trailblazer in STEM who broke barriers for decades before the
phrase representation matters was coined.
All right, Jared, next one is for you, Sir.
I'm. I got it.
This is the name. Hold on.
I'm on Arenas was a warrior queen from the ancient Kingdom
of Cush who led her armies into battle against Roman forces
around 25 BCE, negotiating a peace treaty so favorable that
historians still study it today. I am going to say fiction.
Fiction. OK, Oh, it is real.
Oh. Amana Rinas was was the Queen of
Christian, one of the most remarkable military leaders of
the ancient world. And she is real, very real.
And she negotiate a peace treaty with the romance.
That's what she did. Somebody needs to get her on the
phone. OK.
Evans ain't doing it. All right, Jordan, we're back to
you question #3 Kofi Asante, known as the architect of
tomorrow was a Bronze Age comics engineer who invented solar
pilot, who invented a solar powered city grid for a
fictional African nation and is cited by real engineers as an
inspiration. So this is.
Yeah. This one's a bit better.
Is this a character from a real comic book or is this all made?
What? What was the date again?
There's no date, no date. There's no date, you said.
You said Bronze Age. Bronze Age of Comics, yes.
'Cause I'm just trying to, I'm trying to think of like, you
know, like, like Sun man and like, you know, someone like
this super early original black. Yeah, I mean, he couldn't.
He could have not been a superhero.
He could have been like, yeah, right.
Let's let's say because because it sounds like it's a cool idea.
I'm going to say fact just because I want it to be a true
thing all. Right, you want it to be a true
thing. So we're going to go real.
And the answer is no, he was. That's just fictional.
It sounds real. I hope you Sante, but also I
don't haven't read a lot of Bronze Age comics.
All good. But, you know, I feel like the
inspiring real engineers made it feel like it was a real thing.
All right, Jared, back to you. Matthew Henson was born to a
freeborn, was born to freeborn sharecropper parents.
One year after emancipation, he became the first Black person to
reach the North Pole as a part of the 19 O 9 expedition with
Robert Peary, though Peary received most of the credit for
decades. Is Matthew Henson real or fake?
I feel like it's like a Lois and Clark thing.
First was to reach the North Pole.
First black person to reach the North Pole as part of the 19 O 9
expedition, but he was not credited is what they're saying.
Well, Perry received most of the credit for decades.
Fiction. Fiction.
And the answer is real. I've heard of Matthew Henson
because the, like, I think the story goes like period and his
crew, like these, these these white folks were like dying,
like they were getting frostbite and Period and Matthew Henson
basically had to like, drag them the rest of the way of the up
the mountain. Yeah.
But didn't get no credit. I'll be.
I'll let them on the side. All right, Jordan, back to you
question #5 Zara Osay is a 22nd century activist who preserves
the oral histories of the African diaspora using quantum
memory technology, a central figure in a celebrated
Afrofuturist novel. Yeah, I don't know why you're
getting these ones. Yeah, no.
Well, thinking about it, there's certain parts of this that sound
familiar and I don't know if I'm just confusing them with other
people or but again, I'm going to go fact because it sounds
dope and I want it to be real. Right.
And it is fictional. No, this is all all made of.
I don't know that there's any Afro features novel with Azara
Osei, but you know, now they could be.
Yeah. So all right, back to you.
Thelonious Monk was a jazz pianist and composer who helped
create bebop alongside Charlie Parker in the 1940s, and is
widely considered one of the most harmonically advanced
musicians of the 20th century, real or fake.
Real. And that is correct.
Thelonious Monk's a real person. He's a very famous jazz
musician. Jerry, if you didn't get this
one, very disappointed. Yeah, I've I've heard that name
before, like. Yeah, Melvin A.
Name I. Familiar.
I was going to say Melvin's. Melvin's mostly based on
Thelonious Monk. So I'm glad that that was
included in there. Thanks all right, number 7.
And we got to another fictional character Jordan to OK OK with a
game. General Adeze Nosu is a
fictional black woman general in a near future sci-fi setting who
unified 3 warring factions using ancestral diplomacy loosely
based on real African conflict resolution traditions.
See, now I'm messed up because the last two people were
fictional and it was fiction. And now I feel like I'm in a
trap where if I say fiction, it's going to be the one that's
not fiction, she's saying. So I'm going to, I'm going to
stick with what I've been doing. I'm going to, I'm going to
triple down. OK, OK, How will you feel if
this one is also fictional after you say it real?
I mean, it's all good, but I, you know, I just, I'm trying to
bet, I'm trying to play the odds and see like one of these, one
of these got to be real. Yeah, this one is also
fictional. Damn, three in a row.
Good. Next, DeMarcus.
Ancestral diplomacy is real, and it's rooted in traditions like
Ubuntu philosophy, but the character is.
OK, I'm have to make some of these people real.
Just. The.
The retroactive Vindicator. We got a Rick on this episode.
Yeah. All right.
Jared Thurgood Marshall argued 32 cases before the Supreme
Court, and 129 of them more than any private attorney in U.S.
history at the time, before becoming the first Black justice
on that same court. I don't know if any of those
facts are real, but I know Thurgood Marshall is real.
Isn't he the one that went to? Howard, I think.
So. Yeah, so, so he's he's the bad
one if he's the one. That went to.
Howard the bad one of of which group?
What do you? Who is?
Who is the good one if he's the? He's saying that he didn't go to
the real Hu. Yeah, he he did not go to the
real Hu, but he is still on the Black History Month posters.
He's not like the black guy on the Supreme Court now.
But I I want to say that facts. All right.
And that is correct. They're good.
Muscle was a real person. And he did argue 32 cases in
front of Supreme Court. I feel like I knew that.
Like the 32 cases part, I didn't know who won.
I don't know. That's pretty impressive.
I I did not know that who's you do your Black History Month
report on? I used to always do.
Like, I just stick to the bacon, the basics.
MLK Malcolm X Yeah. I did George Washington Carver
in elementary. Washington Carver, you know,
and. In middle school, I did.
RuPaul, Charles. OK, OK, That is a, that's a
good, that's a deep cut. That's a good one.
Like looking back, I wish I had chosen more people, more black
people that people, folks didn't know.
Right. Yeah.
What about you, Jordan? Who did you do your Black
History Month before now? I think just like DeMarcus I, I
remember doing like a Rosa Parks and I think I also did Thurgood
Marshall for one of them. OK, I.
Think and yeah, we cuz cuz in Maryland, you know, Benjamin
Banneker is also like cuz he's from Baltimore.
So I'm pretty sure I did the Benjamin Banneker thing as well.
Yeah, yeah. See, and now I just, I, I hope
kids now are doing folks that we've never heard of.
Yeah, they're doing like streamers speed, really.
Yeah, I. Guess yeah, that counts.
That that's what they're doing now, TI.
Yeah, that's, that's a good one, No.
You if you go to school in
Atlanta, that's a great one to do.
No, not with his convictions. I mean, yo, everyone has a
story. All right, let's get to these
last two questions. He don't want to talk about the
conventions. The conventions.
Jordan Adwar, known as the Memory Keeper, is a fictional
elder in an effort Future Story maintained a living archive with
every black person erased from here in history.
Her mind holds 2000 years of forgotten names.
Wow. I'm going to quadruple down
'cause I gotta, I can't, it can't be four in a row.
Can you pay for this? Even if it is, I'm getting a lot
of inspiration, so. Yeah, yeah.
But this like this is a common archetype though, like the
memory keeper and it's usually is a black person or blackish.
Oh man. Is this like, I mean, are we
speaking in terms of like magical Negro sense of like, you
know, the the one who keeps the knowledge and.
If you're referencing the movie The The Society of Magical
Negroes. Please don't let's forget that
just so. Much and I was so excited for
it. Yeah, the funniest episode that
you've done by. God, that.
Yeah, I, I like to not look back on that.
Yeah, I hope everybody has moved past that.
Because it was such a good teaser and did the trailer and
did the very two weeks later, they dropped their whole
trailer. We were like, what is this?
What is? This like you got to be kidding
me, I don't think. Yeah, I don't want to go on a
whole rant about it, but this? Last question and then we can.
Yeah. Jared John Owusu Ado was a
Ghanaian architect who Co founded the Ghana Institute of
Architects in 1959, designed landmark buildings such as NEST,
including the Community Care Center and Unity Hall, and
became the university's first Ghanaian Head of Architecture
department. What?
What school was it again? He went to the Ghana Institute
of Architects in 1959. Facts.
And that is correct. John Alusuado is a real person,
the pioneer of tropical modernism, a place based climate
conscious style of he developed to give Ghanaian architecture
its own identity after independence.
Cool. Yeah, see, I hope, I hope folks
are doing their Black History Month projects on people like
this, because I had no idea who this guy is.
They do a mega the stallion child but.
But yeah, the winner of this game, Jared, and you know, I
feel like this was unfair. We won't.
We need to do better.
I did not expect I use Claude instead of ChatGPT to help build
this game and he and there are a lot of like links to like where
the information comes from. And it did.
I think it did a good job of these.
They were the ones that were meant to trick you.
You are more, you are more loyal and faithful than I was.
Because after that second one wasn't real, I've been like, all
of these are fake. I mean, you know, as a former
president once said, fool me twice, can't fool me again.
OK all. Right, Jordan, we were talking
about the movie This Society of Magical.
No how? Horrible it was.
Yeah. And now I would like to open up
the floor for you to go on your little rant.
I think the thing that still kills me about that movie is the
like full like just whole misunderstanding of what a
magical Negro is. Like it was so bizarre to title
the movie that and then to not have any like any real combative
back and forth. I mean, like the idea that black
people need to make white people feel good for the for things not
to be bad or like to like even it was like, like the like,
because David Alan Grier, I think is pissed off most about
this movie. It's like, you know, he's he's
like he's telling Justice Smith over and over again.
Hey, this is for like the betterment of the world.
Like you need to do this. And it's just like, show me the
evidence. Like, OK, you're saying this
like you're saying that you've been magical coons for however
long you've been doing this for. And like, show me because we're
still doing this. So like, have you made the world
a better place? Because like I'm looking around
and I would have some questions about like how how effective
this strategy has been. But then it's also, I mean, it's
weird because like if you look at it on its surface, the
Society of magical Negroes are the villains of the movie.
Like, they're not. They're they, they are harboring
and harnessing these quote, UN quote magical abilities and
using them for themselves and not sharing them with other
Black people or using them to make other Black people's lives
better. And yet we're looking at it as
like a desirable way to be. And then at the very end, when
Justice Smith shows David Alan Grier that like, this whole
thing is bullshit, David Alan Grier is like, yeah, so I'm
going to go back inside and keep doing that now.
And it's like, what are? You What are we doing?
That's crazy and then like the end and end reveal it's just
like why did they give you money to do this dog like what the
hell is going on man like this is crazy so but.
It it definitely feels like one of those movies that's like, oh,
it will definitely get made because it I feel like it this
one almost like pandas to white people.
Yeah. And then you, you mentioned like
the magic, like why isn't he doing this, sharing it with
other black people? And like, why are they using it
for themselves? They couldn't like part of the
part of that power. Right.
Yeah, right. In the beginning, like he like
tried to do something for himself with the power.
And it's like, you can't do that.
It's like, this is to make white people comfortable, not you.
I'm like, I'm so frustrated because I expected like, because
I think I had heard it was like, what if there's like a black
Harry Potter and it's like that kind of movie?
And I was like, oh, that's sort of fighting.
You know, he's going to learn to learn magic and be slinging
spells. I was like, oh this is bullshit.
And it's going to be black. Yeah.
That's that's what I wanted.
And it wasn't this. But the worst part of this was
David Alan Grier was in this movie being the worst Coon ever.
And it wasn't even funny. Like how Samuel L Jackson was a
Coon. It wasn't Samuel Jackson in.
Oh yeah, Django. Yeah, it wasn't funny.
And it was like you're David Alan Grier from Living Single
and Tales from the Hood and so many other David Alan Grier
stuff. The legend himself.
Why are you in this movie, child?
Yeah, thankful that y'all did it.
I could not do it again. Y'all's patience on that podcast
is. God's here.
I could make it 30 minutes into the movie before I had to turn
it off. Because I mean, you, you did the
right thing. You know, it's just again,
fascinating how like look at because I think that the same
year I want to say the blackening came out and it's a
make that movie. That's that's what we like.
That's what we want to see. That's a movie that is, you
know, whether you had, you know, some issues with it or whether
you loved it, whatever it is, like it's a movie that is
engaging with the premise full stop.
You know, like they the the trailer is the movie.
You know, like you, you didn't walk into it and you were like,
oh, this is something completely different.
Like this isn't what I thought I was going to go see, but also
they did it in a way where it like it was funny, which which
helps I think at the screen of the Society of of Magical
Negroes, maybe like 3 people laughed the whole film, you
know, which is like, you know what Jared is saying.
This is David Alan Grier. David Unger is somebody that
like, even if he's not trying to be funny, it is funny.
You know, like he should make you laugh, even just the way
that he says a line or like a face that he makes or nothing.
The whole movie, everybody was just like not having it.
And then when I saw the blackening, it was like black
people are having a great time all enjoying the film.
And so like, it's a very different mode.
But like you said, DeMarcus, like they I'm sure somebody saw
that script wherever that got produced and they were like, we
got we got our one, here's our one for the year.
We can cross that off the list and.
Yes, and then a black guy wrote and directed this tragedy.
Yeah, that was a that was not a good press tour for him, not at
all. Right.
OK ancestral recall. Wow Jordan bravo.
This book was amazing. This book was I I I, I think
that this book says a lot about you and your love of history.
Your love of black people. One thing I want to know is how
did you pick who to put in the book?
Because the premise of this book is this guy gets powers from
historical figures. So did you pick the historical
figures first or did you pick the situation 1st and find
historian figures? How did that happen?
So a lot of the, the choice of who was going to be on the book,
I think the factors that I went with were one, you know,
obviously I wanted to choose people who are not, you know,
top of mind, not like the first Google search.
You know, I wanted to go deeper and to have people that you, you
haven't heard of before or maybe like you've you've heard of
them, but you don't really know much about them.
And so picking people like Jean Louis Michel, who was the
greatest sword fighter of the 19th century, picking people
like Bill Pickett, who was like the first black rodeo star.
You know, names that you, you're not going to find in, you know,
your your history books, you know, your textbooks at school,
but that are still important. And I think people should know
and, you know, should be celebrated in that way.
The second thing was because of how Melvin's powers work, you
know, it's kind of like they're like situationally based, right?
Like something's happening, he needs to do something in the
moment. So he's kind of reaching back to
the perfect person who can help him out in that situation.
And so it was slightly situationally based in terms of
like, all right, so, you know, this is this is the plot of this
particular, you know, chapter. What is he going to do?
OK, so who's somebody that could help him, you know, break into,
you know, this building? Marie Van Burton Brown, the
inventor of like the the first home security system or, you
know, he doesn't really know how to ride a bike.
Who can help him do that? Oh, Kitty Knox, like one of the
first black women cyclists. Like finding these people who
can he can he can use the abilities from, but, you know,
still treating them with respect and and giving them, you know,
space to shine and not just having them be like, you know,
oh, OK, thanks for that. Bye.
Now. I'm going to go.
Yeah, but like, all right, you know, having having that moment
with them. But then also, I think the the
most difficult part is I wanted to put so many people in the
book, but like trying to keep that pacing of, you know, we
kept it. We kept it to two people a
chapter because it was like if we did 5 or 6 seven, you know
what I mean? Like we didn't want to, we
didn't want to step on anybody where it's just like, oh, you
know, and and, and right on the heels of that, here's somebody
else, you know, instead of like that moment gets to breathe.
You know, he's he's met that person.
We kind of have that information now.
And, you know, we'll we'll meet somebody new, you know, maybe
near the end of the book or, you know, the different part.
But yeah, I just didn't want to overload it because, again, I
feel like there's so there's so many incredible stories
throughout black history. So I really wanted to spotlight
as many people as possible. But then even, you know, cut
slight spoilers, I guess, you know, at the end, we do get like
one of my favorite pages, like the big splash page with all of
the the the different historical figures on it.
And that was our way of kind of like, all right, who else can we
kind of sneak in the last minute just to have that?
So. Yeah.
Yeah, that's that's actually one of my favorite parts about this
book. Like each time he activates his
power, it's like, who's going to be next?
It's going to be something I someone who I haven't heard of
or I'm like less familiar with. Did you know all these folks
already? Like, were you already familiar
with all the people in the in the comic?
There's like 1. Like I knew Bill Pickett
beforehand. I had like a passing knowledge
of of Sam Marlowe, like I'd heard the name and I want to say
similar to Ronald Duncan, who was the first, the first
American ninja, not even the first black ninja, but just the
first ninja in general. Like again, somebody that I kind
of like had come across, but I didn't really know much about
them. But everybody else was, it was
new to me, which was great, you know, just in doing the research
because I think I hopefully came across on the page, but I had as
much fun just kind of like discovering these people and
discovering their stories. And at the end, if you, if you
pick up the trade paperback, you know, I was very grateful that
we're able to include little mini biographies for everybody.
So if you, if you read it and then you're like, oh man, I'd
like to know more about, you know, this particular person,
you could just flip to the back. And then, you know, we have, you
know, quick biographies about them.
Definitely like continue to look them up and, and find out more
about them. But we, we definitely want to
include more information about everybody just because I think,
you know, a, a, a page or two, you know, is not enough to tell
the full story. But at the same time, I think
that having even just that introduction to them could go a
long way to to get people's curiosity up.
Nice. Yeah, absolutely.
A different question I had. So I'm reading through and I and
Melvin is like it's like two sides to him from from that I'm
seeing what I'm reading. Like when he's when he's
estimating his powers, he's like confident.
He's like forceful, all this kind of stuff.
But you know, non powered. He's he's got like this like
general anxiety. He's like he's a bit of a grumpy
old man. So he has these parts where it's
just like scribbles. Yeah.
Whenever he's getting frustrated and then there's like a
translation of the scribble somewhere else on the page, like
a footnote. Is that like, where?
Where is that part coming from? Just because I enjoy a good
grumpy old man trope? Yeah, that who you are.
Well, so I think like I mentioned earlier, he's he's
heavily based on Thelonious Monk and his his wife June is heavily
based on Nelly Monk, Thelonious's wife.
And so Thelonious Monk, if you if you don't know him and you
haven't seen any like video of him famously like hated being
interviewed, hated having, you know, conversations with people
like would go more or less non verbal at times when people were
talking to him just because he like that's not what he was
about, You know, like he was he was often in his own inner
creative world, thinking about music or you know, other things.
And like, you know, people who like knew him, knew him, you
know, could get some stuff out of him.
But even his wife, you know, at times would be like she could
sense all right, you know, he's going into that space.
So like the, you know, time, time for conversation is over,
right. And so petty, petty.
But I think that was a big part of his of what I wanted to do
with Melvin was kind of bring that in because, you know, what
I find really fascinating about him is he's he's not your
typical hero. You know, he's not like he
doesn't want to go on an adventure.
He doesn't want to have all of this stuff happen to him.
But you know, his love for his wife is like the central part of
his being. You know, I mean, like he he
loves her more than anything. And it's not even necessarily a
situation where it's like he's dependent on her.
Like in some ways he is, but but he also hasn't been able to
really make that kind of connection with any other
person, you know what I mean? So it's like she's the, the one
that, that kind of keeps him, you know, levelled out, right?
And so when she's not there, he's kind of like, you know,
he's, he's trying to have conversations with people when
he's going to the pharmacy in the, in the 1st chapter, it's
just kind of like every, everything is, is coming at him
too quick. He's got to, you know, enter the
information. He's got to remember the, you
know, prescription name and like all of this other stuff.
And it's like overwhelming, right?
And so I thought it would be very interesting just to have
somebody who is has has to act, has to do all these things, has
to and even part of it too with Mirror and his neighbor, right?
Like she kind of assumes the junior role in in certain
respects just because like Melvin on his own, not going to
not going to do it. He might not get him to leave
the house. So like, he still needs that
push, but you kind of see as the story continues on, like you
said, like his confidence building, but also that
connection that he's having with, you know, these ancestral
figures and even the community that he's building, you know,
with Mirren and other people, like starts to give him, you
know, that that confidence to go out and do what he needs to do.
So yeah, like I thought it was, you know, having that journey
from like when you first meet him, he's like, please don't.
They'll talk to me, they'll look at me.
I want none of that to the end where he's kind of is this this,
you know, Multiversal Hero is kind of like a really cool
journey that, you know, I'm glad people are connecting to.
Absolutely. Yeah, and I really like that in
this book. You know, I don't really like a
love story, Give me Blood or Any day, but the way that you
depicted love in this book, like the way.
One of the best moments for me was when they were in the
doctor's office and finding out about Melvin's diagnosis.
And I thought that that was such a great loving moment between
two companions. Of course, a splash page when
they are going through the different times.
I read the pages when they're going through the different
times, you know, from meaning not to engagement to wedding to
first date. I thought that those were really
special and I just want to know where did all that come from?
Where What is the inspiration for all the love in this book?
Well, I think again, like having, having them be based on
Thelonious Monk and his wife Nelly, Like, I really wanted to
find a way to to tell a story that had these two people at the
heart of it where, you know, for a lot of a lot of people on the
outside looking in at Thelonious and Nelly were just like, what a
what a weird relationship that is, right.
Like he just kind of grumbles and plays the piano and like,
and then she has to like, you know, do all his, you know,
other stuff and like be his manager, even though she's not
his manager. And just like, you know, it can
feel like, I think as a creative person when you're in a
relationship with somebody, you know, there is kind of that give
and take, right? Of like, you know, you need to
have your time and your space to be creative to, to work on your
projects. And, you know, it can be
difficult at times to kind of, you know, express that because
you don't want to be like, you know, leave me alone or, you
know, I need to go in this room for like 4 hours and like, don't
talk to me. But at the same time, like there
is, you know, just such a, such a beautiful connection between
Melvin and June. And I think when you're, when
you're thinking about, you know, black love stories and
particularly, you know, older black people who we rarely get
to see in those situations, like we really rarely get to see, you
know, black people in their, you know, 60s and up, like together
with each other, like, you know, living and having already like
lived, you know, a full life together, you know what I mean?
And so I really honed in on that central bit because it, it felt
like just the natural through line for the story.
Like, you know, the the black history stuff is, is central and
you know, like all of the the action and other stuff is, is
cool too. But just from a story
perspective, you know, I'm a very character driven writer.
And so I really need to know like, what is it that these
characters want? And like, what's the worst thing
that could happen to them? What's the best thing that could
happen to them? And you know, how do you kind of
put them, you know, through all those motions and from Elvin,
the worst thing that could happen is like Jim's done
around, you know what I mean? And like, that's his central
motivation through so much of it is like just getting back to
her, just making sure that she's safe.
And then on the other side too, like June's not just sitting
there waiting for him to show up.
Like she's very active herself. She's also trying to get back to
him, you know, from her end. And you can just kind of tell
like that. You know, I, I think when you
think about people at that age, you kind of think, Oh, well,
like, not like it's over for them, but like they've, they've
lived a life. And now it's just like, you
know, you're just, you're just counting the days together as
opposed to like they've, they've got so much life still to live.
They've got so much of their story still left to go.
And so I really wanted to have this older couple who, you know,
like is, is almost getting like the second lease on, you know,
all of their relationship in terms of like the possibilities
of what's still to come. And so, yeah, I, I feel like
when you have I, I haven't really done, you know, too much
romance in, in the Aquaman issue.
You know, like that was another key element with, with Jackson
Hawaii, that romance and romance comics used to be like the
highest selling comics period. You know what I mean?
Like romance comics, yeah, back in like the 40s and 50s, because
the biggest, like, audience was like teenage girls who would be
buying all the Archie comics and all the other different comics.
And so like, yeah, I feel like romance.
Well, I'm not particularly like a romance person and that like
I'll read romance novels or like, I like a ROM com and like,
you know, even like the older movies from like the 40s and the
50s that were like, you know, romance base, like those are
fun, like those kinds of romantic comedies.
But I think that was another thing too.
I just wanted to kind of challenge myself to see if I
could tell a story that had a romance at the center of it and
make it feel believable and not cheesy or corny or, you know,
kind of like tired, but like feel genuine and earnest.
And so, you know, enough people have commented that I feel like
I did do that, which which I'm I'm happy to to hear.
But yeah, like I really felt like, you know, if I can nail
the romance at the center of the story, then, you know, I can, I
can easily build everything else on top of that.
Yeah, well, you should do more romance and just next time,
maybe just a little bit of blood up in there.
OK, I'll see what I can do. No, the the the romance really
comes through and it and like you said, it felt real and
genuine cuz these aren't like 2 perfect people who you know have
the perfect love. You know, it's and I can
definitely see like in the story, maybe it's like chapter 3
or something, but there you you do like you're doing the
flashback on Melvin, like he wasn't always this like anxious
person who, you know, goes non verbal and has panic attacks and
that sort of happened over time. And like Jerry mentioned the
diagnosis and that I think that that was like one of the realest
moments the show, the love. But I guess is it, did his, did
Melvin's power sort of awaken with this anxiety disorder like
or are those two things connected or does he have
general anxiety and he has this ancestral recall power?
Yeah, he's, he's got the anxiety and he's got the ancestral
recall power. But I do think that they, they
do speak to each other, you know, in the sense of like, it's
that anxiety that like triggers those moments where he kind of
taps into it. Because that was another thing
that I was thinking about is like, well, if he could just do
this all the time, you know what I mean?
Like, it's not even that it diminishes it, but it's it's
kind of like any, any great power has, you know, a
limitation to it, right? Like a power.
You're freezing a little bit, I think.
About the sun, you know, then like he's just strong all the
time and he's beating the shit out of everybody.
And like if the flash didn't have to worry about, you know,
the the what's going on with the speed force, you know, even if
spider man didn't run out of web sometimes, you know, like that
kind of takes the drama out of it because there needs to be I
could. So from Elvin, it's kind of like
he can't just do it, you know, like when he wants to like he
kind of needs to be pushed into this overly stressful situation
where it, you know, it starts to activate and then, you know,
he's he's able to, you know, find the right person to help
him, guide him through the situation.
So yeah, it wasn't necessarily like, oh, OK, like this, this
equals this. But I did find it was a good,
you know, almost kind of trigger thing where it's like, all
right, you know, he's already this kind of overly anxious
person. So what can we do to kind of
make sure that like we keep that balance of things or he's not
just like, I want to do karate now or like I I want to be Jesse
Owens now. And it's like, well, you know,
that's, I mean, that's cool, but that's not necessarily going to
make it a dramatic story as opposed to like, all right, we
already know, you know, he's, he's not dealing well with
things already. So like now when a robot's
coming out of them, that's probably going to make it like
even even more over the top. So yeah, it was, it was kind of
something that I stumbled into or I was like, oh, like this is
a good way to kind of activate these powers and, and, you know,
have a conversation about both of those things.
Nice. Yeah, like that.
I never got that. I just thought it was just a a
sci-fi thing that the the the the the robots did the powers.
I I so good catch the markets. Yeah, 'cause I don't know,
'cause I, I think I noticed that like whenever he was getting
stressed, like that's when his eyes would go.
I'm like, OK, yeah, like maybe there's like a connection here.
And so. But this is, I guess what I
heard you say is that the powers do not come from the anxiety.
So hypothetically, he could have been doing the essential recall
things before the general anxiety.
So do you think we'll ever get to see that version of Melvin
where he's like, all right, I got my anxiety under control and
now I have full control over my abilities as well?
Yeah, almost like a like a like a Grey Hulk situation.
Yeah, yeah. The best of both, you know.
He goes to karaoke and he's challenging, you know?
Yeah, I think, you know, also part of the story is like,
acceptance, you know, like coming, coming to terms with,
you know, kind of who you are. There's that moment where Melvin
and Mirren are taking their drive, you know, to the MLC
headquarters. And, like, Melvin, like, freaks
out on her. And then she, like, apologizes
to him because he's like, you know, I, this is just who I am.
And I guess I'm like a screw up, but I can't help it.
And he's like, Oh no, like. Yeah, I'm.
Doing it, I'm doing it to her like this is how people treat me
like I'm, I need to, I need to chill and I need to like, you
know, help her as, as June, you know, has helped me before I
realized that like, even though, you know, I might have things
about me that are, that are different or things about me
that like, you know, I, I recognize maybe aren't like fun
for other people, you know, I can't control it.
So like, what can I do, you know, to kind of still remain
true to myself while also, you know, like learning, learning
how to, to balance, you know, some of my more like eccentric
personality traits. And so, you know, I, I don't
know, I don't know if he'll ever like, cuz some, some things like
that, like don't get fixed. Like it's just, that's just how
you are. And so, you know, him learning
to live with that and accept that, but also learning to, to
lean on, you know, people in his community and his inner circle
who can kind of help him, you know, mitigate and deal with
that. Because if we're, if we're real,
you know, about a lot of mental health issues specifically in
the black community, it does come from a, a specifically for
black men. It does come from a perspective
of like, well, you have to be strong and being strong is that
you have to do it alone and you can't tell other people about it
or like make it other people's problem as opposed to like, you
know, if if you're viewing it as a problem, I think that's,
that's already like the first misstep of like, all right, this
is something that needs to be fixed as opposed to like, all
right, this is something that I know about myself now.
And now, you know, I need to obviously do what I can to, you
know, help myself, but also know that sometimes I'm going to need
other people to help me and not feel like I can't speak to
somebody, talk to somebody or even allow somebody to help me.
You know, as opposed to like keeping up this facade of like
strength and like I got everything under control all the
time when that's nobody does, you know, that's that's not true
about anybody. So, you know, I think that's
also the thing too for Melvin is like, you know, him accepting
and learning that like, you know, just because, you know,
this is going on with me doesn't mean that I I'm a burden to
other people. Like other people still want to
be around me and they still want to help me.
And so like, leaning into that instead of being, you know,
trying to just just tough it out on his own.
Yeah. And that was like, that was one
of the hardest scenes is like, it was, it was a really good
scene, Melvin and mirroring, driving down to the MLC
headquarters. It was a really good scene, but
one of the hardest scenes for me just because I'm like, I'm like,
yeah, for exactly all the reasons you said it just like,
like she's just talking. She's excited to be here with
you and you just really shut her down.
And I didn't really, I didn't pick up on like the like he's
doing to her, what people have done to him.
But it was, it was just like, you know, if I was a crier, that
would have been the scene they got.
I cried a little bit when I wrote it.
So I feel like that, you know, that kind of helped, you know,
if I'm feeling that emotion and then hopefully it's going on to
the page. Yeah, absolutely.
I remember one of my favorite pages was the page where he's on
the horse and his hair is on fire.
And I don't know, he just looked so majestic.
And I remember you talking in the last episode about how the
artist would put in things. I think you said that the panda
was made by the artist as well. So can you just talk a little
bit about your relationship between you and I?
Can't remember his name, but the artist of this column.
Adigan. Yeah, yeah.
Adigan. So Adigan and I were part of the
Milestone initiative together. And so we got to know each other
a little bit, you know, during that week that we were all
together at the DC headquarters. And I think, you know, one of
the things I really appreciate about working with him, one is
that he's extremely talented. So he makes me look good, you
know, when you read the book. But also is that, you know, like
we, we had a number of discussions before we even
started working on the project. And as we continue to go along,
I could kind of feel him getting more and more confident with not
only just the characters and the subject matter, but like with
the idea that he has ownership over the book as well.
So it's not just, you know, Jordan says, and I have to do
that, but like, OK, like Jordan's giving me this platform
and he's giving me, you know, this kind of blueprint in terms
of what's happening in the issue.
But I, I also have, you know, license to do things like, you
know, draw the fire on the hair or, you know, insert the panda
or, and knowing that, you know, he's not going to come back and
be and like, tell me, oh, like, take that out.
Like, I don't like that, but more so be like, you know, it's
kind of like a, you know, like improv comedy.
You know, the the biggest rule is like, yes, and right.
Like you ever say no, like don't do I, I hate that, you know, you
got OK, like I'm, I'm presented with this idea.
How can I build on that? So you know, every time I would
get stuff back, I would like, OK, it seems like if you're
putting that on the page, that's telling me that that's a
direction that you want to go in.
And so instead of shutting that down, cuz it's not what I wrote,
it's more like, OK, that's fun. How could we add to that?
How could we build on top of that?
And so that was really fun for me as well, just to be able to
see getting the pages back, being like, you know, like you
were saying to Marcus, you were like, oh, his eyes are lighting
up. What's going to happen next?
You know, I got the pages back and I was like, oh man, what,
what, how did you do this time? You know what I mean?
This is great. So, you know, there are certain
instances where I I I tried to be open, you know, but but not
kind of leave him out on an island of just like, and they
fight and you like, you figure that out, but more just like,
all right, you know, here's here's, you know, that for
example, like the, the martial arts fight sequence where it was
like, here's here's like I sent him like video, you know, of
Ronald Duncan and kind of said, OK, so here's like here, here it
is. Actually take a look at it, you
know, like, what do you want to include from this?
What, what can you see from this that would be cool to add into
it? And kind of let him, you know,
pick and choose from that, you know, what it was that he wanted
to do because I felt like whatever he was going to choose
was going to look great, you know, So I didn't want to like
overwrite and like dictate to him what he should be doing.
But also, you know, just gave, gave him like parameters of like
art. We've got like 5 panels.
So like, you know, like we can do this, this, this and this,
but feel free to add or, you know, include anything else that
you see that looks cool, that might make for a cool scene.
So, you know, I'm, I'm very grateful to not only have gotten
a chance to work with him on this, but just in terms of like
a collaborative effort. I feel like it was a lot of fun
not to just have somebody who's as engaged with the work as you
are, but is like is challenging themselves as well.
You know, like you could kind of see him like, all right, here's
the scene. Like how, how far can I push it?
How crazy can I get with it? Because there was some, some
instances like when you first see, see Mitchell, the big like
AI corporate, you know, Overlord, like if he's got the,
the helmet on and all that crazy stuff.
Like, you know, I, I sent him some reference that was kind of
like that. But when I saw the actual image,
I was like, that's it, you got it, You know, So there are a lot
of moments like that where it's like, you know, I'm guiding and
I'm giving you a reference, an idea to, but it's always
rewarding and fulfilling when you have a partner who's who's,
who's meeting you there and pushing you as well.
Absolutely nice yeah. I love that.
I love that y'all work in relationships like that.
If it sounds like there's like a lot of stress where you can just
throw him the ball and be like, hey, look, this is what I want
to get done and. You know, right?
He's taking it to the hoop. And I'm glad you brought up
Mitchell because I did have a question about him and we've
talked a lot about the heroes. So Mitchell is like the main
antagonist. Does Mitchell know about
Melvin's powers? Because there was a scene where
he's like, he's like, oh, this is what it feels like to be
connected to like a higher mind or like an enhanced, you know,
human or something like that. So does he know about the powers
that he find out? Or he's just like, oh, there's
something special about this guy and I need it so.
As you know at the beginning of the story, Mitchell and the MLC
like they're pulling people from time to be, you know, like kind
of a test group for all of their various messed up products.
Don't think so, but it is the. Pauper one I was like.
But it is like, you know, that's, that's we live in a, we
live in a crazy enough world where like, who can say what the
future will hold? But if you, if you gave an AI
like full control over a company, like their directive is
going to be to make as much money as possible and not worry
about anything else. And so, you know, like,
initially they're just pulling people from time, but once they
get a sense of like, oh, like this guy, maybe they don't know
how he's able to do what he's doing, But like they're getting
the sense that, oh, like he's got something, he's got this
connection. And then when they start like,
you know, doing the experiments on them, they're like, Oh, now
if I could tap into that, then like I, I have like a, like a
endless, you know, supply endless, you know, ability to,
to do all these other things. And so, like, once he gets the
idea, it's like, all right, you know, I can really, I could
really push this company to the next level.
And all I need is you. All I need is to continue to
just like, you know, pull your brain apart.
And so initially, it's not something that he knows, but
once he starts to pick up on it, you know, like Melvin kind of
becomes his obsession and even like, using June as something to
kind of lure him closer. And so he can, he could finally,
like, capture him as part of his plan, too.
OK, dope, dope. Yeah.
Because I, I definitely felt that.
I was like, oh, like, oh, he's like, he's zeroing in.
Yeah. Is it like he's trying to like,
take the power or does he just want the brain?
Yeah, cool, man. All right.
And I know we're like a little bit over time.
So I want to ask you one more question.
And it might, might be a spoiler, like kind of question
because in the end, you know, everyone's back home, happy
ending. And then they get this knock on
the door and they're like, hey, we keep seeing these ghosts.
What are these ghosts? Because that's why where the
story ends and there's nothing else.
I'm like, what's happening next? So I think, you know, we're
we're me and Adegan are very much invested in like wanting to
do more of the story. And so like we definitely wanted
to leave it in the place where if if we got the call and
they're like, all right, it's just a recall.
Take two. Like where you going to go with
it? You know, it's like, I, I think
for Melvin, the first part of the story is like, sorry, I, I
got the powers. I don't know how the powers
work. You know, I'm not necessarily
comfortable with this, you know, and he and June go through this
whole adventure and then at the end it's like, all right, here's
the new status quo, right? Like now, now Melvin is kind of
like, you know, a champion of, you know, people who maybe don't
have anywhere else to go or anywhere else to turn and like
they, they can go to him and see if he's able to solve the
problems for them. But you know, the first, the
first round, you know, we, we weren't real science fictiony
with it. And so the second round it was
kind of like, well, what, what's another direction that we could
take it where, you know, maybe he's dealing with something a
little bit more supernatural. Maybe he's dealing with
something that's a little bit more, you know, out of his
wheelhouse, you know, out of his comfort level.
Because that's again, always the fun part with with heroes and
characters is like, all right, we know, you know, Superman can
beat up like Brainiac or whatever, but like now it's
like, well, Mr. Mitsublik right in the magic, it's like, well,
he doesn't do that. That messes him up.
You know, that's like the opposite of what he's good at.
And so, you know, finding something where it's like, all
right, you know, Melvin has seemingly, you know, dealt with
this sentient AI, but like, what about a ghost?
What about, you know, something that's like completely on the
opposite end of the spectrum? So we've got ideas for for
stories to tell with that, which could be a lot of fun And even
like adding an additional layer when you think about the
ancestral recall power, right? Like he's more or less communing
with the dead, right? Like he's, he's almost got a
supernatural power himself. And so, you know, him now
stepping into a space where it's like, maybe other people don't
have the exact same power as he does, but maybe they have the
ability to do something similar to him.
And like, how could he, how would he interact with that?
Or, you know, like bump up against that?
So, you know, we, we like I said, we got ideas and hopefully
we'll be able to tell that story as well.
Yeah, that sounds like a lot of good stuff.
I can't wait for that after 2. As you know, I love me a ghost.
So yes, okay, Jordan, you completed the interview portion
of this podcast. Now I'm going to now I'm going
to enter the 17 quick fire question portion.
And if you recall in this portion, I'm going to ask you 17
quick fire questions. You can answer with a yes or no,
but this is a podcast and we want to hear your full answer.
You can do whatever you want, whatever you want.
Are you ready? I'm ready now.
These are 17 more quick fire questions.
So I kind of had to reach into reach into the the bank for
these. So let's see now, if Ancestral
Recall had a theme song, what would the song be?
There's a this is kind of an obscure song because we did a
playlist for Ancestral Recall. Like I made-up a playlist of
songs and I sent it to add again to listen to while working on
it. So there's a song called Great
Blacks by Georgia and Moldrow, which is kind of, I mean, it's,
it feels like, you know, the the musical equivalent of it, you
know, because she's talking about how she she gets her
power, you know, just in life from, you know, like the
ancestors and how they kind of inspire her.
That can quick, quick thing would be, you know, a love
supreme by John Coltrane. I feel like it's kind of the the
vibe. Send us this playlist man, we
like you guys for sure. You can DM it to me on Instagram
because we family like that. Sending your people to me What?
OK, use the. People.
Yeah, use the people. Who is your favorite black comic
book writer of all time? All time I would say Dwayne
Mcduffie. I just feel like, you know, from
from a reader perspective and also just from a, from a writing
perspective. Like I really appreciate how he
was able to in his own way, you know, sprinkle black history
into his work, whether it was the milestone stuff or the DC
stuff. But then also, you know, it felt
like he had such a clear and distinct voice as a writer and
was very much pushing up against the edge, like the infamous, you
know, static cover with, with the condoms on it, you know what
I mean? And like the way that he was
very much adamant about like, this is what's happening, you
know what I mean? Like people are, are, are dying
from like AIDS and like, you know, this is like a real thing
that's happening in our community.
And like, that's what milestone is about is having these
conversations. So like, you know what, what,
what is the problem with static practicing safe sex?
Like what is the issue with him, you know, like, you know,
wanting to, you know, and it's a love story.
It's all those other, you know what I mean?
So like, I I feel like for him doing that and just like the
principles of him, you know, as somebody who I think as black
people in life, no matter what, you know, field you're in,
somebody's played in your face before.
And you just had to be like, OK, you know, And the way that he
was able to kind of, you know, he, he had to withstand a lot of
that, but still continue to be, you know, creative and, you
know, just a just a powerful voice in the industry.
So definitely Dwayne. OK, OK, if you could go to a
fictional world and steal an item, what item would you steal
and bring back? Home.
Oh boy, I would say I would. I would go to the Star Trek
universe and I would steal the food replicator.
Wow. And just hope it would still
work. I don't even know where I put
it. What kind of batteries do?
That thing I don't know, but you know, like just the idea of I I
do enjoy cooking, but you know, on those days where you're just
like, damn, I just need to eat whatever or you're just so you
got to crave in you're just like, man, you know what I
really want right now? And then you just press a button
and there it. Is we lost the cheddar biscuits?
Yeah, exactly. But then my thing is, doesn't
that run on like human waste? I don't know.
I don't know how it works, you know.
Like I feel like. Let's not ask no more questions.
Nobody wants to know how the sausage is made, but yeah that's
a good one. I was thinking like Green
Lantern's ring or something from Dungeon Dragon but no.
That's a great answer. What's harder to write, dialogue
or world building? That's tough.
I feel like dialogue can get so specific, you know, and you
really got to think about who a character is and just like
honing that voice for them so that they sound distinct.
You know what I mean? Like you can, you know how
Batman sounds, right? Like, you know how, you know,
Gandalf sounds like they've got like particular ways of speaking
and stuff and the world building.
I kind of look at them, you know, hand in hand, like the the
dialogue is character building and then the world building is
on top of that. And so they're they're
constantly interacting with each other.
But I would, I would say dialogue only because I think
for world building, you can sometimes just like map
something onto it and call it the world, you know, like you
can just you're we're in New York City and that's it.
As opposed to like, all right, I got to really figure out how
this person is going to talk and interact with these people.
So. OK, if your main character had
to team up with one hero, who are you thinking?
So we're talking about Melvin, who do I think would be a good
or like a fun interaction? You know, this is just the first
thing that came to my head and it just, it's, it's I guess how
I think it would be fun for him to team up with somebody like
Squirrel Girl just because like she's so positive and so like
energetic and so like, you know, she, she, she feels similar to
Mirren in some ways, but again, she's also like super powerful.
She needs to be. And I could see them having like
a fun back and forth interaction where, you know, she's just
fascinated by him and like wanted to ask him all kinds of
questions. And he's just like, I just let
me #2 Runner up would be now that I'm thinking about it would
be Moon Girl. Because I feel like Moon Girl
would also be similar to like, really want to figure out how
Melvin worked. But then I also think Melvin,
like, seeing this, like, super intelligent young black girl
would be like, protect her at all costs.
Yeah, Yeah. I'm gonna do what I gotta do.
So. Yeah, I, I, I, I said the
Punisher because I'm sick and demented, but I think the
conversations between him and Icon would be pretty
interesting, yeah. Mm hmm.
OK. You know, with Luke Cage, like
they old like old like school buddies or something like that.
What's your favorite? And you know the croc?
The croc is black. Yeah, the croc.
I think that the croc. Kill the croc.
Yeah, kill a Croc, because the Croc he he protects the kids in
Gotham in the sewers. But I, I think that, you know, I
because he, you know how Melvin protects June, not June, but
the. Mirror, mirror, mirror.
Yeah. That you said how he would
protect Moon grow, I think that he would have some common things
with Killer. Crack.
I can see it. OK, Speaking of killer Crack,
what's your favorite villain oranges story?
I mean the ones the ones that are popping to the mind
initially. I like the Hood for Marvel just
because like it feels like a real person, you know, in that
way that not everybody is the Kingpin, right?
Not not everybody's going to be, you know, the one running the
show, but also like you've got ambition, you know, and like how
how far would you go to get the thing that you want, even if it
meant giving up parts of yourself, literally parts of
your soul? And then not even is it worth
it? But like, you know, I think
that's, that's one of the trappings of success is that
every time you think you got the thing that you want, there's
actually another thing that you want.
And so there's there's not, there's no end.
There's no like, oh, I made it. Now it's like, OK, but now I got
to either like protect where I'm at or get to another spot.
So I feel like, you know, the hood is very relatable.
And then I'm just a big Doctor Doom fan.
So I'm I'm, I'm always writing for him.
And I think he's, again, such a fascinating character in that
balance of like, he's a villain, you know, there's no question
about that. But then he also has his own set
of morals and principles that make him who he is.
Like he's not going to do he hates Red Skull because he's a
Nazi. Yeah, I.
Mean, he doesn't rock with that, you know, and like, he, he he
looks at other villains with disdain as well for some of the
things that they do or they believe.
Now, is he out here doing all kinds of crazy stuff himself?
Absolutely. But like, he's able to.
Yeah. Yeah.
How did you think the hook was portrayed on Ironhart the TV
show? I mean, it was interesting
because I feel like, you know, part of part of the challenge of
something like that is it's not really about him, you know, but
also I feel like every good hero is is balanced and measured
against their villain. And so I do, I do wish there was
a little bit more space for him to have gotten not only fleshed
out, but like really like seeing the consequences of like his
actions because a lot of his reveals got like were like real
late in the show. And so like knowing some of that
stuff in the beginning would have been more helpful as
opposed to like getting near the end.
And it's like, oh, you're like this person's son, OK.
Like that. I would have liked to have known
couple episodes ago because I maybe would have informed more
of your choices, but. Yeah, Ironheart was a great
show. What is your What is your
favorite book of the year so far?
My favorite book of the year so far is a book called The Score,
which is not really, it's not quite a self help book.
I guess it was more of a psychology book, but it's a book
that's talking about how a a lot of the world that we live in has
become gamified where, you know, like where we're looking at so
many things in terms of like successes and failures.
And, you know, we've really allowed a lot of things to take
over just the way that we think and like interact with the
world. But then also it's about games
and like the philosophy of games and how games help us, you know,
be more flexible, more creative, more empathetic and how, you
know, like how your perspective of going into a game can really
affect your life, right? Like if you're somebody who is,
I forget the exact term that they use in the book, but it's
like if you're somebody who, who goes into a game and it's not
even about not caring if you win or lose, but like you, you like
the process of the game. You like playing the game, you
like learning the game. You like having, you know, the
challenges of the game and kind of figuring things out in that
way. And so for you, the enjoyment of
the game is the game itself, not necessarily the end of the
result. As opposed to somebody who only
cares about winning, who only cares about, you know, like, and
is doing everything in their power to win.
You know, like, again, Jared, I'm sure you've played Dungeons
and Dragons with people who are just like, I'm trying to win D&D
and it's like, that's not really fun because you can't win the
game. You know, really like you can't
be in. Condition and then push you
toward. It yeah, you can.
You can accomplish the goal of the game.
But like the fun of Dungeons and Dragons is this communal playing
activity, creating this character, thinking about this
world and, and you're doing it in community with the other
people at the table, right. The game doesn't work if you
know, you've got 6 people and five of them are bought it and
one of them is like, and I killed this person.
You're like, you didn't even talk to us about that.
Like you're just doing, you know, whatever you want to do.
You know, you're just looting everybody.
It's not, it's not as fun as opposed to like, oh, OK, this is
something that we're sharing and doing together.
And so I, I really enjoyed this book because of it.
It put into perspective a lot of things.
There's a lot of I could, I know this is the rapid fire session,
though. I wouldn't go too far to it, but
I would recommend reading it, especially if you're somebody
who's kind of struggled with seeing the, the, the pace and
the speed of the modern world and, and feeling like, you know,
there's some weird things going on in the way that, you know, a
lot of stuff now is being engineered to like attract and
maintain all of our attention as opposed to, you know, finding
the enjoyment of that. Because the last, last quick
thing is that it really talks about how like failure and being
bad at things is good for you. Like picking up a new hobby and
a new skill and not being good at it, but like the, the
learning process of it, right? Of like, all right, you know, I
don't know how this works. Let me figure it out Instead of
that instant gratification of like, all right, I tried it.
I'm good at it. I'm going to keep doing it as
opposed to like I tried it, I'm not good at it.
So I'm never going to do that again.
Because like, that's just not how life works.
Like nobody's good at everything.
But also like part of the what gives life its its fullness is
struggling at different parts to get to where you want to get to.
If everything is easy or if everything is simple or if
everything is just catered to you, then you never learn, you
never grow, you never, you know, take on different perspectives.
So like, we can struggle in games and it's safe, you know,
it's a safe place for us to kind of overcome these obstacles and
then we can take that into our real life.
But if you're, if you're only quote UN quote playing to win,
then you're kind of missing out on a lot of other things.
So yeah. And it's, it's because in my
book now, Chrysalis, you know, the main character, he struggled
with the game. He didn't know how to play.
He was run over with a chick with his head cut off, even
though he's A and there's this new character who came in just
recently on book 6 and he died in the world by getting run over
by a ice cream ice cream truck. And he loves it.
He's learning the rules. He is getting it.
He is leveling up quickly. So it's it's fun to see their
dynamic. And plus the new guy is a evil
demon. OK, What is your favorite horror
movie ever? Favorite horror movie ever I
would say is Get Out. I can't think of.
I can't think of a movie that I saw in a theater that like hit
me in such a similar way. You know, like I've seen scarier
movies than Get Out and I've seen, you know, definitely
movies that that gave me a more visceral reaction when watching
it. But I feel like Get Out just for
everything that it hit and like seeing it for the first time,
you know, like that, that kind of has stayed with me of just
like how everything played out. And like when you get to the
end, you're just like, Oh my God, you know, you kind of put
everything together, you know, and I, and I am, I'm more of a,
a psychological horror than like a straight like blood and guts
whore kind of person. Like I can appreciate, you know
that, but I, I really like the psychological elements.
So I would say get out. OK, real or fictional, who is
your favorite black couple? This is tough because now I'm,
yeah, now I'm trying to think of like, I will say as a side note,
and this is very, very recent, I cannot express how disappointed
I am in Klay Thompson for the epic fumble of like, it's one
thing to end your relationship with Megan Thee Stallion, right?
It's one thing to say, hey, we did it.
It was fun. But we've decided that, you
know, like, it's probably best if we both find, or maybe we're
looking for different things or whatever.
And like this is a amicable and, but to like do everything that
you did and then get called out in the way that you did.
And then I don't know, dude. Like that's just like, I can't,
I can't put those pieces together, but it's a real, as
far as a real couple. I mean, I feel like I really do.
And I'm not just saying this because of my book, but I do
really like Thelonious Monk and and Nelly Monk because I feel
like that was just such a, a real genuine relationship
between two people who needed each other, you know, and really
loved each other and in such a way that's like inspirational
so. It's a fumble.
Mega the stallion. After you buy her a house, you
name your boat after her. After she cooks your parents the
best Thanksgiving meal they ever had in their life.
Crazy. OK, if you can live in any
fictional universe, where you going?
This is tough. I I think about this sometimes
and like everything has pros and cons, right?
Like there's certain places that look like fun, but then like
zombies, maybe it would, yeah, maybe it wouldn't be fun after a
while. I mean, even something like, you
know, if you lived in the Mario universe, it's like, that's
probably fun for a little bit, but then like go, then you got
to talk to you got to talk to Toad all the time.
Like that's I would say, if I could live in a fictional
universe, I would, you know, I would like to live in like AD
and D type universe just because of the ability to then like have
the adventure, you know, like in that way where I think if
depending on what you wanted to do, you know, like there are so
many options and so many ways to go about it, like, you know,
fact that might show up and that's a problem.
But but there's still there's no other play.
I mean, there's no other place where it's just like, and you
just, I mean, if you go to like the Hello Kitty universe, I
guess you can like, you know, just just chill all day.
But that again, like that would kind of get boring after a
while. If you want a little bit of
adventure, if I'm going to go to a fictional place, I'm trying to
like, you know, get get the full effect of it.
So I would do, I would do AD and D universe.
I would be a paladin. Beholden to a God, huh.
Other. Creature, yeah, I don't I can't,
I don't I don't know what vow I would take, but you know then
you because you get a little bit of the magic and you get a
little bit of the the sword play.
So best of both worlds, you know.
OK, All right, that's very interesting.
That's a whole other conversation that we can have
this time. You're coming on.
Who's your favorite black sci-fi character?
This is also tricky. You know who I'm going to say,
and it's it's probably not a good thing, but I don't know if
either of you saw Alien Earth, not yet, but Morrow from Alien
Earth, I don't know. Something about him felt like,
you know, it didn't end the way that I wanted it to for him.
But like, when he was in it, like that scene, not a spoiler,
but the scene where he's like plugging into the ship and he's
like sweating profusely while he's, like, interrogating.
Yeah. The other.
I was just like, what is happening?
But I really. Yeah.
I mean, he was such an interesting and, like, flawed
and complicated character where you were just like, I do want
him to do the thing that he wants to do, but what he wants
to do is not good. Yeah.
And so. But he's also black, so I'm
rooting for him. So I don't know.
I'm just like, but I I really enjoyed his character and the
actor who played him was terrific as well, so.
Yeah, I liked him too, and it's a good show.
You need to watch it. OK, OK, I'll write it down right
now. Especially because you can like
like binge it because going week week to week on that was.
It was tough. Yeah, all right, What's 1 trope
you're tired of in comics? I mean, I guess, you know,
obviously the comic book deaths can get tiresome after a while,
but I would say I really I am kind of over and and it's it's
kind of two different things. But like, either the the person
like loses their powers and they have to like figure out how to
be a hero without their superpowers anymore, or the Iron
Man Batman like, oh, they don't have any money anymore.
So how are they still going to be, you know, the superheroes
like, but like Batman will lose his money and still have all the
Batman things. So it's like, well, this isn't
really different. And like Iron Man lose all his
money and still have the Iron Man suit.
So it's like, well, he's still Iron Man.
Like he can't make, I guess. But like, and it's also in those
two particular cases, you're telling me these white men can't
get more money? That's crazy.
Because on both, on both tops, because these are both recent
comic book trolls that happened. They were no longer
billionaires, but they still had some millions they could, you
know, spend. So I was like.
They don't have $1,000,000, they have $999 million.
Yeah, You know, or like if Bruce Wayne wanted to be part of like
a venture startup operation, like he could.
I mean, you look at all these people hitting the lick on like
Kaushi or whatever, like Batman can't come up off a prediction
market real quick if you need some money.
Like, That's right, Yeah. I mean all.
Right. If aliens come to Earth with the
intent to kill, what comic book are you handing them to save
humans? To save humans.
Oh boy. I mean, they already they're
already coming with the intent to kill.
We're in a we're in a tough position.
Am I trying to show them the beauty of humanity?
Am I trying to to scare them off?
I would hand them. One of my favorite all time
comic books is a comic called Day Tripper, which is about a
obituary writer who at the end of each chapter he dies.
Yeah. And then the next chapter starts
up again and the next period of his life.
So like if he had kept living, what would happen next?
And I think it is a very beautiful story about, you know,
humanity and like, the value of life and like the the
preciousness of each moment and each period of time in your
life. And so maybe that would be
enough to persuade them to not kill us.
Or, or it would persuade them like, oh, humans are completely
cool with Diane. Let's destroy.
Yeah, they just keep coming back.
Then maybe they'll just completely misinterpreted, but I
mean, they're never going to do that anyway, so.
Yeah, I love Day Tripper, by the way.
All right. Who is your favorite writer,
artist duo in comics? My favorite all time writer
artist duo I would say is Ed Brubaker and Sean Phillips, just
because I really love all of their collaborations, you know,
whether it's criminal, whether it's fatale, whether it's a lot
of the newer stuff that they've been doing.
And I think just in terms of like the, the crime fiction, you
know, like there's, there's other people who do it, but it,
it does feel like everybody's kind of chasing them.
And it does feel like, you know, one of my favorite things with
a, with a writer artist duo is when it feels like they're just
one person, you know, like it feels like they've, they've kind
of melded into one specific identity.
So I would say Ed Brubaker and Sean Phillips.
OK cool, cool. What is 1 show or movie that
you're looking forward to in 2026?
I'm going to say I love boosters like I think that movie looks
like a lot of fun. I really like boots Riley and
like just it feel it feels like what he's really good at is a
like giving you just an insane idea.
You know, like something that you you read the plot and you're
like that doesn't work. How does that work?
Like what's going on? Like if?
If somebody gave you the plot of Sorry to bother, you would be
like, this is what? But then you watch the movie and
you're like, oh, OK. Like he's he's he's locked it
in. And so I feel like that's this,
this looks like another home run with that.
You know, the cast looks great. And I feel like he's always he's
always got something up his sleeve in the terms of like just
the overall message of his film. So I'm excited to see where he's
going with this one. Yeah, that and is God is, is I
am. Really.
All right, what's one word you you'd use to describe your
writing style? I like to think that my writing
is, I'm going to go, I'm going to go with humanist, you know,
like, I feel like my, my, one of my favorite writers is Kurt
Vonnegut, who was the, I think he was like the head of the
humanist organization for a while there, or like the
Humanist Church. But I think for me, like
humanism really is just about like how we are all the same in
a lot of levels, but we're also, you know, very much our own
people. And, you know, it's just about
like looking at each other, treating each other with
respects and treating each other with, you know, just like a
level of grace that I feel like, you know, we're all nobody's
perfect and nobody's going to get it right all the time.
But you know, the constantly like just trying to to be holier
than thou when like we're all in the bud together.
Like, you know, there's no reason to act like, you know,
anybody's got it more figured out than anybody else.
And so I think with a lot of my work, I like to, to try to give
really grounded, you know, even within something like ancestral
recall where like he's, he's doing all this crazy stuff, he's
going all these adventures. But like Melvin feels like a
person that you would know, you know, if you if you took the
superpowers away, It's like, oh, that's less he's got he's got
unk energy like you can, you know, so I, I guess that's the
word I would describe. My writing is, is kind of feels
like, you know, where I'm, I'm giving everybody, I'm painting
everybody with, you know, and an individual brush.
You know, like I want to respect everybody's individual
perspectives, but also, you know, that there's a lot of
things that connect us and, you know, trying to highlight those
things as well. OK, final question, since since
you have been on your tour, your podcasting tour, how is our
podcast in comparison to? Comparison.
OK, OK, I will say, I mean this is this is not a shot or a shade
at any other podcast that I've done or that I've been on.
But it is interesting, I think in discussing this book in a lot
of different places, like whenever I'm in, whenever I'm in
an all black space, you know, there's a there's a level of
comfort and understanding and like being able to just have
conversations naturally without explaining things or, you know,
like going into greater detail about things that are just
understood, you know, culturally.
And so I really appreciate not even just you guys having me on
for 1/3 time, but every time, you know, it's, it's a lot of
fun just to be able to, to chop it up because I think we're all
on the same vibe and same level in terms of like, you know,
cultural stuff, but also like, you know, geeky and nerdy stuff.
And like, it makes the conversation really easy and,
and fun. Like I, I don't know how long
we've been talking, but it feels like, you know, 5 minutes, you
know, so. Thank you.
Thank you so much. Well, Jordan, that was 17
questions there. Jordan, I got to tell you, and
I've been meaning to tell you that since you came on here the
first time. You gave us one piece of advice
that has given our podcast much success and much credence that
we use to this day, and that is just reach out to who you want
to be on. Yeah, we've got TJ Stews, Ben,
Corey Jones, Raywa, our daily. Who did we have on last week?
The choreographer and director. Jamal Sims.
Jamal Sims, who is writing a movie now with Oprah Winfrey.
So that is all thanks to you. We owe so much success to Jordan
Clark. So I have got to say thank you
because I would have never thought I thought you had to go
through people to find to, to, to find these and people that it
would be like an absorbent amount of money.
But you really opened the door for me and this podcast.
So I have got to eternally and forever say thank you to you.
You are the godfire this podcast, which you have given us
this inspiration and you have made this podcast as successful
as it is today. So thank you, thank you and
thank you for your kind words. I know that we tried to make
this thing a good a good place, a comfortable place for people
to be on. And we are also happy to have
you on for a 4th, 5th, 9th, 20th, 35th time because it is
always a great thing. And, and yeah, thank you so much
for all your advice and all your confidence and everything.
Hey appreciate you guys too and give yourself some credit cuz
y'all made it happen you know what I mean?
Like you put the work in and you do you know all the things that
you needed to do to make it successful.
So you know claps claps for y'all keep it going.
Always happy to see your success.
OK. And if you want to read such a
recall, it is available at your local comic book store.
I think you can order it online. Absolutely.
Get it? The price is too low if I do too
loud. Y'all should get it immediately
because this is probably one of the best books.
It's a it's a great centerpiece at your home and a good day to
talk about with your friends. Especially that last little fast
page. It's one of my favorite pages
after the horse. Jordan, where can they find you?
You can find me on all the social medias at Jr.
Sosa 18, JRSO, SA-18. You can also check out the White
People Won't Save You podcast wherever you get your podcasts.
Nice. And yeah, you can find us on
Black Geek Energy for your socials.
And this is an amazing episode. Jordan, thank you.
You got to come on again. We may just have you on as a
comic book, a special guest comic book maybe.
Maybe because I had Dwayne Mcduffie, I was thinking we
could do an episode on him because she talked to him.
Maybe you could come back on and talk about Dwayne Mcduffie.
I. Would love to Yes I.
Know OK, I will. And yeah, I think that's the end
of Black Geek Energy, guys. Yeah, BGE out appreciate you for
coming on again. Yeah, appreciate y'all anytime.