1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:03,800 Coming up next on Words and Numbers, politics and Hungary, 2 00:00:04,120 --> 00:00:07,360 technology, panics, conspiracy theories. 3 00:00:08,000 --> 00:00:11,440 And are we? Partisan, Of course we're 4 00:00:11,440 --> 00:00:15,480 partisan, but what the hell? All this and more coming up next 5 00:00:15,480 --> 00:00:17,680 on Words and Numbers. Hi, I'm James. 6 00:00:17,680 --> 00:00:19,640 And I'm Anthony and. This is words and numbers. 7 00:00:24,840 --> 00:00:26,800 Ant. What's new and exciting in your 8 00:00:26,800 --> 00:00:31,440 world this week? A family of a Florida man is 9 00:00:31,440 --> 00:00:39,200 suing Google, claiming that Google's AI, Gemini drove this 10 00:00:39,200 --> 00:00:45,440 man to paranoia and suicide. We've heard stories like this 11 00:00:45,760 --> 00:00:48,160 and you know, people get concerned about AI. 12 00:00:48,160 --> 00:00:52,400 In fact, there was. It's at least one point, I don't 13 00:00:52,400 --> 00:00:55,960 know whether it was a federal or some states were talking about 14 00:00:55,960 --> 00:00:59,200 regulating AI because it's dangerous and so forth. 15 00:00:59,760 --> 00:01:05,000 And I did a little bit of background reading and there is 16 00:01:05,000 --> 00:01:09,920 a thing called worse or fever. Have you heard this term? 17 00:01:09,920 --> 00:01:13,080 It's a term in psychology. I've never heard that term 18 00:01:13,080 --> 00:01:15,520 before. Worther Fever. 19 00:01:15,840 --> 00:01:21,520 It comes from a novel by Goethe, The Sorrows of Young Worther, 20 00:01:21,520 --> 00:01:28,160 published in 1774. And in this book, which became 21 00:01:28,160 --> 00:01:32,960 quite popular, the protagonist ends up committing suicide. 22 00:01:33,400 --> 00:01:38,360 And apparently there were a number of cases back in the late 23 00:01:38,360 --> 00:01:43,840 1700s of people reading the book and then mimicking things that 24 00:01:43,840 --> 00:01:47,400 happened in the book, amongst them committing suicide. 25 00:01:47,400 --> 00:01:49,520 There were a number of people who were found, like, you know, 26 00:01:50,120 --> 00:01:52,760 their bodies were found clutching the book, this kind of 27 00:01:52,760 --> 00:01:56,920 thing. And it got me thinking about 28 00:01:58,480 --> 00:02:02,880 broadly what what the the psychologist called technology 29 00:02:02,880 --> 00:02:07,040 panics that when some technology comes along, and this was just a 30 00:02:07,040 --> 00:02:10,919 book, but what's interesting about it is when it comes about 31 00:02:10,919 --> 00:02:15,880 1774, this is around the time that you're starting to get 32 00:02:16,560 --> 00:02:19,600 greater and greater numbers of people becoming literate. 33 00:02:20,200 --> 00:02:23,920 So it's not that the book was the new technology, but rather 34 00:02:23,920 --> 00:02:27,680 that the people are reading becomes, in some sense a new 35 00:02:27,680 --> 00:02:31,520 technology. And then in the 30s and 40s, 36 00:02:31,880 --> 00:02:34,200 people were concerned about movie addiction. 37 00:02:34,960 --> 00:02:37,400 You know, we had this new thing of the moving pictures, and 38 00:02:37,400 --> 00:02:40,760 people would go, and some people go and like, watch movie after 39 00:02:40,760 --> 00:02:43,120 movie after movie. And this became a thing that 40 00:02:43,120 --> 00:02:46,320 they talk about. But then in our lifetimes, when 41 00:02:46,320 --> 00:02:52,560 I was young, Dungeons and Dragons became a new game and 42 00:02:52,680 --> 00:02:56,840 people became very concerned that it was promoting A cult 43 00:02:56,840 --> 00:03:01,000 behavior and so forth. I remember like it was yesterday 44 00:03:01,000 --> 00:03:04,880 when this group of morons called cops for Christ came to my 45 00:03:04,880 --> 00:03:09,680 school and explained to us how we were all going to burn a lake 46 00:03:09,680 --> 00:03:12,960 of non consuming fire with we play Dungeons and Dragons. 47 00:03:13,640 --> 00:03:17,120 They also said that if we listen to Led Zeppelin we were going to 48 00:03:17,120 --> 00:03:20,960 end up in the same place so it was difficult to take them 49 00:03:20,960 --> 00:03:24,560 seriously. But I myself am movie addicted 50 00:03:24,960 --> 00:03:29,960 even to this day. Well, yeah, I mean, I guess to 51 00:03:29,960 --> 00:03:33,760 an extent, everybody's addicted to something. 52 00:03:33,760 --> 00:03:37,280 I mean, you like something and you repeat the thing and at some 53 00:03:37,280 --> 00:03:39,880 point you do it enough and people label it an addiction. 54 00:03:39,880 --> 00:03:42,640 But I think it's a, it's a continuum, right? 55 00:03:43,600 --> 00:03:49,320 But even as recently as a couple of decades ago, maybe even 1 56 00:03:49,320 --> 00:03:53,920 decade ago, people were becoming very concerned about video games 57 00:03:53,920 --> 00:03:57,040 inciting violence in. Kids nonsense. 58 00:03:58,280 --> 00:04:03,920 These are technology Pinnix. My my hometown senator Joe 59 00:04:03,920 --> 00:04:06,360 Lieberman was way out in front on that. 60 00:04:06,360 --> 00:04:11,080 And he was convinced that people were young, people were coming 61 00:04:11,080 --> 00:04:13,800 violent because they played violent video games. 62 00:04:14,760 --> 00:04:19,120 Right, right. And I found, you know, as a 63 00:04:19,120 --> 00:04:22,800 young parent, and of course this is just an observation of one, 64 00:04:22,800 --> 00:04:26,680 but I'll throw it out as an observation that, you know, you 65 00:04:26,680 --> 00:04:29,880 have young kids, particularly young boys tend to be very 66 00:04:29,880 --> 00:04:32,800 rambunctious. You got to find things to for 67 00:04:32,800 --> 00:04:37,320 them to get their energy out on and I found it. 68 00:04:37,600 --> 00:04:40,760 Video games actually calmed my kids down. 69 00:04:41,400 --> 00:04:43,680 They could get it. Whatever this pent up energy was 70 00:04:43,680 --> 00:04:45,280 would come out in the video game. 71 00:04:45,280 --> 00:04:47,080 They'd be much calmer after, but nonetheless. 72 00:04:47,960 --> 00:04:54,640 And so now we have AII submit that what's going on is simply 73 00:04:54,800 --> 00:04:58,960 this again. Now you could argue AI is a 74 00:04:58,960 --> 00:05:01,440 little bit, I wouldn't even say different. 75 00:05:01,440 --> 00:05:04,840 I would say the difference would be not in quality, but in 76 00:05:04,840 --> 00:05:09,520 quantity. AI mirrors the person, and so if 77 00:05:09,520 --> 00:05:13,640 you sit down to it and you have a mental illness and you start 78 00:05:13,640 --> 00:05:17,680 interacting with it intensely, that mental illness is going to 79 00:05:17,680 --> 00:05:20,360 get reflected back at you. In fact, you probably get some 80 00:05:20,360 --> 00:05:23,840 kind of a feedback loop in which the thing expands. 81 00:05:23,840 --> 00:05:27,520 But the fundamental problem isn't the AI, in the same way 82 00:05:27,520 --> 00:05:30,800 that it isn't Dungeons and Dragons, it isn't the videos, it 83 00:05:30,800 --> 00:05:32,800 isn't the movie, it isn't the book. 84 00:05:33,320 --> 00:05:36,640 It's the user. The person is bringing something 85 00:05:36,640 --> 00:05:38,800 to the table here that's that's a problem. 86 00:05:39,760 --> 00:05:43,760 It's always the person and and you know, every couple of years 87 00:05:44,360 --> 00:05:49,360 we get a lawsuit brought by bereaved parents, typically 88 00:05:51,000 --> 00:05:57,160 because their child, usually of an early teenage vintage, has 89 00:05:57,160 --> 00:06:02,920 been talked into killing himself by a friend, a potential 90 00:06:02,920 --> 00:06:05,200 girlfriend, an ex-girlfriend right there. 91 00:06:05,200 --> 00:06:09,600 There's any number of categories you can pick from, but it's 92 00:06:09,600 --> 00:06:12,400 always somebody of roughly the same age, right? 93 00:06:12,400 --> 00:06:16,200 You never find a 52 year old talking a 14 year old into 94 00:06:16,200 --> 00:06:19,280 suicide. It's that for whatever reason 95 00:06:19,280 --> 00:06:23,880 never happens. But I always take the approach, 96 00:06:23,880 --> 00:06:28,720 and I think reasonably so, that you can't talk someone into 97 00:06:28,720 --> 00:06:33,520 suicide, right? You can, you can push and you 98 00:06:33,520 --> 00:06:35,000 can nudge. And I think that's an 99 00:06:35,320 --> 00:06:39,480 extraordinarily poor taste and you ought not do it. 100 00:06:39,480 --> 00:06:41,640 That makes you a terrible human being. 101 00:06:42,520 --> 00:06:46,600 But the people who kill themselves were very likely 102 00:06:46,600 --> 00:06:48,800 going to kill themselves no matter what. 103 00:06:50,600 --> 00:06:53,480 Now you can come up with counter examples, right? 104 00:06:53,480 --> 00:06:59,360 Philosophically at least, where you hand a man, you know, a, a 105 00:06:59,360 --> 00:07:02,240 gun with one bullet and you say either kill yourself or this 106 00:07:02,240 --> 00:07:04,560 person. I'm, I'm clearly not talking 107 00:07:04,560 --> 00:07:07,520 about that kind of thing, right? I'm, I'm talking about people 108 00:07:07,520 --> 00:07:12,160 who just go home and quietly commit suicide because somebody 109 00:07:12,160 --> 00:07:18,160 else said they should. And, and I find that they were 110 00:07:18,200 --> 00:07:23,480 on that ledge to begin with almost inevitably. 111 00:07:23,920 --> 00:07:28,960 And in the end, even if they weren't, could it really be 112 00:07:28,960 --> 00:07:32,840 anyone else's fault that someone committed suicide? 113 00:07:34,280 --> 00:07:37,760 Because that open can of worms that I don't think we want to 114 00:07:37,760 --> 00:07:41,640 open. Yeah, I'm with you that the AI 115 00:07:41,640 --> 00:07:47,720 doesn't cause the suicide. However, it seems to me that 116 00:07:47,720 --> 00:07:52,000 there are. How should I say it would be 117 00:07:52,000 --> 00:07:56,160 appropriate to give warnings that certain people who are 118 00:07:56,160 --> 00:08:00,320 susceptible probably shouldn't be messing with it, in the same 119 00:08:00,320 --> 00:08:03,080 way we give warnings for all sorts of other danger, 120 00:08:03,320 --> 00:08:06,400 potentially dangerous things that under certain 121 00:08:06,400 --> 00:08:09,560 circumstances, certain people probably shouldn't be messing 122 00:08:09,560 --> 00:08:12,080 with it? Yeah, I I get that. 123 00:08:12,200 --> 00:08:18,160 But are we going to start giving warnings for terrible people? 124 00:08:18,840 --> 00:08:21,240 If you're suicidal, you shouldn't talk to Johnny. 125 00:08:22,120 --> 00:08:25,240 He's pretty awful and he'll try and talk you into it. 126 00:08:26,840 --> 00:08:29,720 I mean, at some point I and I don't know where the point is. 127 00:08:30,120 --> 00:08:33,919 At some point it becomes just silly, right? 128 00:08:33,919 --> 00:08:37,840 Yeah, but but the that doesn't imply that we shouldn't do 129 00:08:37,840 --> 00:08:40,440 anything at all. I think there's some rush things 130 00:08:40,440 --> 00:08:44,120 that you can say. It it doesn't imply that we 131 00:08:44,120 --> 00:08:47,040 shouldn't do anything at all, although I do sense that we have 132 00:08:47,040 --> 00:08:49,960 found yet another thing that you and I are going to differ on 133 00:08:51,120 --> 00:08:54,560 because I don't know that I would take proactive steps here. 134 00:08:56,600 --> 00:08:59,960 I mean, it would be like saying we shouldn't let mentally ill 135 00:08:59,960 --> 00:09:03,040 people near search engines because they will find things 136 00:09:03,040 --> 00:09:06,880 that will make them unstable. I don't know. 137 00:09:07,040 --> 00:09:14,320 I my, my knee jerk is AI is new enough that we really it becomes 138 00:09:14,320 --> 00:09:18,520 difficult to point to common sense and say, look, any person 139 00:09:18,520 --> 00:09:22,200 with common sense would know. I don't think that's the case 140 00:09:22,200 --> 00:09:25,040 currently with AI now, five years from now, that might be 141 00:09:25,040 --> 00:09:27,640 another matter. I, I think that's right, but I, 142 00:09:27,640 --> 00:09:32,520 I point to what I perceive as a flaw in your logic, not just 143 00:09:32,520 --> 00:09:37,160 here, but overall, because you've been saying for a couple 144 00:09:37,160 --> 00:09:40,040 of years now that AI is literally no different than any 145 00:09:40,040 --> 00:09:42,040 other product that has ever hit the market. 146 00:09:42,320 --> 00:09:45,280 It will have a disruptive effect, and then that disruptive 147 00:09:45,280 --> 00:09:48,000 effect will disappear and everything will be better. 148 00:09:48,720 --> 00:09:52,840 Well, either it's so different that we have to regulate it so 149 00:09:52,840 --> 00:09:56,760 people don't kill themselves, or it's so much the same that it's 150 00:09:56,760 --> 00:09:59,760 going to follow a very clear and distinct pattern and I can't 151 00:09:59,760 --> 00:10:00,000 see. How? 152 00:10:00,000 --> 00:10:03,040 No, no, no, I, I, I think there's a, there's a third, 153 00:10:03,040 --> 00:10:06,840 which is that, look, it takes a little bit of time for people to 154 00:10:06,840 --> 00:10:09,640 figure out what this is about. Look, we did the same thing with 155 00:10:09,640 --> 00:10:13,360 cigarettes and it took a while for us to figure out that these 156 00:10:13,360 --> 00:10:16,160 things will kill you. So they put a message on it. 157 00:10:16,160 --> 00:10:21,120 Now, now, today, they this might cause cancer is kind of 158 00:10:21,120 --> 00:10:23,440 meaningless because everybody knows that, right? 159 00:10:23,440 --> 00:10:24,720 We do the same thing with alcohol. 160 00:10:24,720 --> 00:10:26,960 Look, you know, if you're pregnant, you probably shouldn't 161 00:10:26,960 --> 00:10:30,640 be doing this. But again, we've advanced enough 162 00:10:30,640 --> 00:10:32,640 that everybody knows that It's common sense. 163 00:10:32,640 --> 00:10:35,400 And I wonder if it's the same sort of thing applies with AI, 164 00:10:35,400 --> 00:10:38,600 at least for the moment. If if you have mental 165 00:10:38,600 --> 00:10:41,120 instability you shouldn't be messing with this. 166 00:10:41,640 --> 00:10:45,120 I don't know I think that just opens up the Pandora's box 167 00:10:45,680 --> 00:10:49,080 right, because everybody in the world is going to just start 168 00:10:49,080 --> 00:10:52,760 suing AI companies over every damn thing. 169 00:10:53,840 --> 00:10:57,760 I mean I I'd rather say look, you're the user you choose to 170 00:10:57,760 --> 00:11:01,320 click on the the thing now it's on you Good luck. 171 00:11:02,960 --> 00:11:04,680 I don't know we'll we'll see how it goes. 172 00:11:05,000 --> 00:11:10,360 I'm, I'm concerned that a court will find in favor of a grieving 173 00:11:10,360 --> 00:11:14,480 family and then that will cause all of the rest of us to lose 174 00:11:14,480 --> 00:11:16,920 out on something that would have been of tremendous value. 175 00:11:18,120 --> 00:11:20,800 Yeah, I, I find that hard to believe. 176 00:11:21,440 --> 00:11:25,920 If for no other reason I'm going to be cynical here in that that 177 00:11:25,920 --> 00:11:30,320 the world has spent $1.6 trillion developing this so far. 178 00:11:31,120 --> 00:11:35,040 I can't imagine some some judge somewhere is is not going to 179 00:11:35,040 --> 00:11:38,080 feel tremendous pressure. Sure. 180 00:11:38,080 --> 00:11:40,600 But if that's the case, then why proceed at all? 181 00:11:41,720 --> 00:11:46,040 And then we also have that hidden expense that we never 182 00:11:46,040 --> 00:11:49,920 talked about, the increase in insurance rates for this and 183 00:11:49,920 --> 00:11:53,600 every other damn thing because people have become so litigious. 184 00:11:54,480 --> 00:11:58,000 In the end, we all pay for this. It's not like somebody gets a 185 00:11:58,000 --> 00:12:02,080 billion dollars settlement and it doesn't come out of your 186 00:12:02,080 --> 00:12:04,600 pocket. It does in some way. 187 00:12:05,360 --> 00:12:10,960 But anyway, I want to bring us aunt to the country of Hungary, 188 00:12:11,600 --> 00:12:15,440 a place that has been very interesting lately because of a, 189 00:12:16,080 --> 00:12:19,840 what's that technical term that we use in political science all 190 00:12:19,840 --> 00:12:26,480 the time ass clown named Viktor Orban, who has run Hungary for 191 00:12:26,480 --> 00:12:31,680 the last 16 years. Donald Trump, big fan of Viktor 192 00:12:31,680 --> 00:12:34,720 Orban. As matter of fact, JD Vance went 193 00:12:34,720 --> 00:12:39,240 over to Hungary to campaign on his behalf. 194 00:12:40,000 --> 00:12:43,560 Oh oh wow, that is so embarrassing. 195 00:12:44,240 --> 00:12:48,880 He's sitting a sitting vice president campaigning on behalf 196 00:12:48,880 --> 00:12:51,280 of a foreign dignity. Woah. 197 00:12:51,280 --> 00:12:52,720 That's oh, and it gets so much better. 198 00:12:53,320 --> 00:12:57,560 During one of the rallies, they called Donald Trump on the phone 199 00:12:57,800 --> 00:13:01,160 and put a microphone up to the phone and Donald Trump said what 200 00:13:01,160 --> 00:13:05,080 a wonderful man Viktor Orban is. Oh my God. 201 00:13:05,080 --> 00:13:08,240 And how everybody should rush right out and vote for him now. 202 00:13:08,240 --> 00:13:12,000 The election was not too terribly long ago. 203 00:13:12,400 --> 00:13:17,800 And as we went to record, the news I was getting is that 204 00:13:17,800 --> 00:13:21,520 results wouldn't be available for a few more hours. 205 00:13:22,040 --> 00:13:26,680 But Axios has come up with the headline earthquake in Hungary, 206 00:13:26,680 --> 00:13:29,160 Orban defeated after 16 years in power. 207 00:13:30,920 --> 00:13:34,480 So all the JD Vance and Donald Trump in the world might not 208 00:13:34,480 --> 00:13:39,000 have been able to help him. And I hope that's true. 209 00:13:39,720 --> 00:13:41,400 Well, I wonder if it went the other way. 210 00:13:43,240 --> 00:13:45,120 Yeah, it could it it might well have. 211 00:13:45,520 --> 00:13:53,000 Orban was he's one of these kind of, how do you even put it, Neo 212 00:13:53,000 --> 00:13:57,240 authoritarians, right? That, that you see around the 213 00:13:57,240 --> 00:14:04,440 world right now flowing from the, the Trumpism that we 214 00:14:04,440 --> 00:14:08,160 experienced here, right? So you, you get it in Japan, you 215 00:14:08,160 --> 00:14:12,960 get it in Italy, you get it in Hungary, although Orban predates 216 00:14:12,960 --> 00:14:17,080 Trump by a bit. It it's interesting, right? 217 00:14:17,080 --> 00:14:20,880 And I think from what I was able to scan right before this 218 00:14:20,880 --> 00:14:25,560 episode, very, very quickly, it does seem as though he has 219 00:14:25,560 --> 00:14:35,320 conceded and it's over, which changes the face of Europe and 220 00:14:35,600 --> 00:14:42,280 will now Central and Eastern Europe will not be the same 221 00:14:42,280 --> 00:14:46,160 because of this. There, there is a, a, a new 222 00:14:46,160 --> 00:14:49,160 breath of a new kind of air in that area. 223 00:14:49,680 --> 00:14:53,280 And we're going to have to wait and see what it all means in the 224 00:14:53,280 --> 00:14:57,600 end. But it's heartening that an 225 00:14:57,600 --> 00:15:00,120 authoritarian has been sent packing. 226 00:15:01,000 --> 00:15:04,520 And you know, people like Erdogan over in Turkey should be 227 00:15:04,520 --> 00:15:09,320 shaking in their boots right now because what happened in Hungary 228 00:15:09,320 --> 00:15:11,840 could easily happen in other places. 229 00:15:12,640 --> 00:15:16,680 So the world and look, it's N = 1. 230 00:15:16,720 --> 00:15:21,680 You can't make solid predictions here, but the world might be 231 00:15:21,680 --> 00:15:23,520 getting a little tired of this nonsense. 232 00:15:24,440 --> 00:15:26,520 Yeah. And we'll see where it goes. 233 00:15:26,880 --> 00:15:30,360 I'm, I'm fascinated to see where it goes next. 234 00:15:30,840 --> 00:15:34,640 And this of course, brings us to the foolishness of the week. 235 00:15:34,640 --> 00:15:36,960 And it's kind of a happy foolishness of the week. 236 00:15:38,720 --> 00:15:42,000 You and I have talked about many, many, many conspiracy 237 00:15:42,000 --> 00:15:46,880 theories over the years. Some of my all time favourites, 238 00:15:46,880 --> 00:15:47,920 right? Pizzagate. 239 00:15:47,920 --> 00:15:50,840 Remember that one? Pizzagate was great. 240 00:15:51,160 --> 00:15:54,680 Q Anon. That was as much fun as a 241 00:15:54,680 --> 00:15:57,640 political scientist could ever have, right? 242 00:15:57,640 --> 00:16:01,320 Reading that nonsense and watching people fall for it 243 00:16:01,320 --> 00:16:05,640 left, right and center. 9/11 truthers are probably some of 244 00:16:05,640 --> 00:16:11,640 the worst people I've ever seen. And yet I can't log on to X 245 00:16:11,800 --> 00:16:14,840 without at least seeing them once a week. 246 00:16:15,440 --> 00:16:19,480 And and I don't know if you know this, but X has a feature where 247 00:16:19,480 --> 00:16:21,800 you can block certain. Words. 248 00:16:23,080 --> 00:16:24,200 Oh really? I didn't. 249 00:16:24,200 --> 00:16:25,360 Know that, yeah. And. 250 00:16:25,400 --> 00:16:28,120 And I found a couple of words that block I. 251 00:16:28,280 --> 00:16:30,840 Well, the word I blocked was chemtrails. 252 00:16:31,680 --> 00:16:34,520 And all the chemtrails people just magically disappeared. 253 00:16:34,840 --> 00:16:37,200 It's as if they don't even live anymore. 254 00:16:37,720 --> 00:16:41,200 Well, I know they're all, I know they're all still out there, but 255 00:16:41,320 --> 00:16:43,480 they're all so stupid that I don't want to hear it. 256 00:16:43,800 --> 00:16:48,960 So bye bye. And then there's the Holocaust 257 00:16:48,960 --> 00:16:53,720 deniers, which are probably the worst of the bunch, right? 258 00:16:54,480 --> 00:17:01,000 And I read something today that indicates that the the total 259 00:17:01,000 --> 00:17:06,960 number of Jews in the world is still lower than pre Holocaust 260 00:17:06,960 --> 00:17:07,480 levels. So. 261 00:17:08,359 --> 00:17:09,800 Really. That's surprising. 262 00:17:11,040 --> 00:17:16,400 It's 2026. Yeah, that was 80 years ago. 263 00:17:16,400 --> 00:17:19,760 Oh my God. Do you know the numbers? 264 00:17:19,760 --> 00:17:23,200 Like proportionally how? How much are they down compared 265 00:17:23,200 --> 00:17:29,280 to before? Right now, of the total number 266 00:17:29,440 --> 00:17:36,920 of Jews in the world, 7.2% or 7.2 million of them live in 267 00:17:36,920 --> 00:17:42,520 Israel and approximately 6.3 of them, which about 40%, live in 268 00:17:42,520 --> 00:17:48,120 the United States. That's about 85% of Jews 269 00:17:48,120 --> 00:17:51,520 worldwide. Isn't that interesting? 270 00:17:52,480 --> 00:17:58,960 So in 1939, the Jewish population was 16.6 million. 271 00:17:58,960 --> 00:18:06,680 Today, well, it dropped to 11,000,000 in 45, which is a 272 00:18:06,680 --> 00:18:11,760 pretty significant drop in Right now it's about 14.8 million. 273 00:18:13,040 --> 00:18:16,080 Oh wow. Right, right. 274 00:18:16,080 --> 00:18:17,960 But that's not what I wanted to talk about. 275 00:18:17,960 --> 00:18:20,440 Believe it or not, what I wanted to talk about. 276 00:18:20,480 --> 00:18:22,320 Right, you said this was a happy foolishness. 277 00:18:23,160 --> 00:18:27,360 Yes, the flat earthers. The flat earthers who are fit to 278 00:18:27,360 --> 00:18:30,680 be tied over everything they've seen with Artemis 2. 279 00:18:31,320 --> 00:18:36,520 They, they just can't cram all the Artemis 2 data into their 280 00:18:36,560 --> 00:18:41,720 idiotic worldview. And, and honestly, and I wonder, 281 00:18:42,280 --> 00:18:48,560 I really do wonder, because if you were in NASA, right, if you 282 00:18:48,560 --> 00:18:55,040 were up and running in NASA and you had any say at all, wouldn't 283 00:18:55,040 --> 00:18:59,000 you have made Artemis 2 do a Figure 8 around the Earth and 284 00:18:59,000 --> 00:19:01,960 around the moon? Well, in fact, that's what it 285 00:19:01,960 --> 00:19:05,040 did, right? I thought it just went and went 286 00:19:05,040 --> 00:19:07,560 to the moon. No, it had to orbit the earth 287 00:19:07,560 --> 00:19:10,040 1st and then the moon. It orbited and then came back. 288 00:19:10,080 --> 00:19:13,720 Then then, shouldn't we be forcing by law everybody to 289 00:19:13,720 --> 00:19:17,000 watch the orbit of the Earth to see? 290 00:19:17,000 --> 00:19:21,400 It no, but you perfect roundness you you aren't being created 291 00:19:21,600 --> 00:19:23,240 creative enough. James. 292 00:19:23,240 --> 00:19:28,680 There are all sorts of of explanations that one can give 293 00:19:28,800 --> 00:19:34,720 as to how that might be simulated, despite the fact that 294 00:19:34,720 --> 00:19:37,440 indeed the world is flat. Right. 295 00:19:37,440 --> 00:19:40,840 Well, I'll, I'll just want a completely different topic. 296 00:19:41,600 --> 00:19:47,800 Some doctor was complaining on, on X this week that in order to 297 00:19:47,800 --> 00:19:51,720 be admitted to the hospital in which she she had whatever 298 00:19:51,720 --> 00:19:54,640 rights doctors have at hospitals, you had to fill out a 299 00:19:54,640 --> 00:19:58,680 form. And one was your, your gender. 300 00:19:59,360 --> 00:20:03,000 And one of the things you could choose was gender queer. 301 00:20:04,040 --> 00:20:08,200 Which I, I don't know what that tells anybody, but I got to tell 302 00:20:08,200 --> 00:20:13,840 you, man, there's not a force on earth or in heaven strong enough 303 00:20:14,120 --> 00:20:17,760 that would get me not to check that box as I checked. 304 00:20:19,680 --> 00:20:23,000 I just want to throw it out there because it's kind of funny 305 00:20:23,120 --> 00:20:26,480 and I, I just, I wouldn't be able to help myself. 306 00:20:27,880 --> 00:20:31,640 Anyway, we were going to talk about something relatively 307 00:20:31,640 --> 00:20:35,320 serious today, weren't we? Well, yeah, what we wanted to 308 00:20:35,320 --> 00:20:41,520 talk about is, is the fact that this goes in cycles. 309 00:20:41,520 --> 00:20:45,120 We've been doing this podcast for what, 8 years now? 310 00:20:45,600 --> 00:20:49,200 And we've been through. We started under the Obama 311 00:20:49,200 --> 00:20:56,240 administration, I believe, and then had Trump won, then had 312 00:20:56,240 --> 00:20:58,920 Biden, and now we have Trump, too. 313 00:20:59,880 --> 00:21:04,080 And there's this pattern that emerges that when there's a 314 00:21:04,080 --> 00:21:11,240 Democrat in office, we get a spike in, you know, membership 315 00:21:11,240 --> 00:21:15,880 requests and speaking requests from people who are Republican. 316 00:21:16,720 --> 00:21:20,920 When there's a Republican in office, it goes the other way. 317 00:21:21,520 --> 00:21:27,240 And so it seems that that were perceived to be anti Democrat 318 00:21:27,240 --> 00:21:29,840 during the Democratic administrations and anti 319 00:21:29,840 --> 00:21:31,920 Republican during the Republican administrations. 320 00:21:32,240 --> 00:21:36,320 And the fact of the matter is we're not either of those things 321 00:21:36,320 --> 00:21:39,520 as. As usual, you're being way too 322 00:21:39,520 --> 00:21:41,720 nice. You're, you're framing things in 323 00:21:41,720 --> 00:21:46,240 way too sensible a way. When there is a Republican 324 00:21:46,240 --> 00:21:50,960 administration, as there is right now, we are either 325 00:21:50,960 --> 00:21:56,680 suffering from Trump Derangement Syndrome or we're a couple of 326 00:21:56,680 --> 00:21:59,640 cocks. When there are when there are 327 00:21:59,640 --> 00:22:04,800 Democrats in office, we are a couple of reactionary 328 00:22:04,800 --> 00:22:10,000 conservatives who would enslave half the world given the chance 329 00:22:12,000 --> 00:22:17,280 that this is how it is no matter who's in charge, the people who 330 00:22:17,280 --> 00:22:20,800 are in our orbit. And and by in our orbit. 331 00:22:21,120 --> 00:22:24,000 We were talking very specifically about our little 332 00:22:24,000 --> 00:22:26,560 community, which is no longer little. 333 00:22:26,840 --> 00:22:30,880 I think we should call it our medium sized community over 334 00:22:30,880 --> 00:22:33,720 words and numbers backstage where the conversation 335 00:22:33,720 --> 00:22:40,360 continues, as I like to say back in the before times and the, the 336 00:22:40,360 --> 00:22:45,480 people there are very, very hostile towards one another 337 00:22:45,480 --> 00:22:46,800 right now. And I think it's a good 338 00:22:46,800 --> 00:22:50,200 microcosm of the broader electorate, right. 339 00:22:51,360 --> 00:22:57,960 But because it's a, a Republican administration and because many 340 00:22:57,960 --> 00:23:01,520 of the people weren't with us when there was a Democratic 341 00:23:01,520 --> 00:23:06,120 administration, they just naturally assume that everything 342 00:23:06,120 --> 00:23:12,520 we say, which is very typically anti administration, they just 343 00:23:12,520 --> 00:23:15,200 naturally assumed that we are anti Trump. 344 00:23:15,640 --> 00:23:18,520 And definitionally we are anti Trump. 345 00:23:19,240 --> 00:23:22,760 But we were also anti Biden right before that and we were 346 00:23:23,080 --> 00:23:26,680 anti Trump right before that and we were anti Obama right before 347 00:23:26,680 --> 00:23:31,800 that, right? We we are anti authoritarian 348 00:23:33,080 --> 00:23:34,560 authoritarian. Yeah. 349 00:23:35,280 --> 00:23:38,800 And whoever's in charge, we're going to have some things to say 350 00:23:38,800 --> 00:23:44,640 about that because people who exercise power over other people 351 00:23:45,080 --> 00:23:49,520 tend to do it in ways that we find offensive. 352 00:23:50,240 --> 00:23:52,120 Yeah. And I, I would say more than 353 00:23:52,240 --> 00:23:56,520 ways that we find offensive, ways that we find antithetical 354 00:23:56,680 --> 00:24:03,080 to the principles that most of us, both left and right proposed 355 00:24:03,080 --> 00:24:07,640 to, to uphold principles in our founding documents about the 356 00:24:07,760 --> 00:24:10,640 individual rights in the proper role of government. 357 00:24:11,000 --> 00:24:13,760 And, and what what I find is people on both the left and the 358 00:24:13,760 --> 00:24:18,160 right will say they believe in limited government, they believe 359 00:24:18,160 --> 00:24:24,160 in, in individual rights, except for this one thing that they're 360 00:24:24,160 --> 00:24:27,400 particularly fond of. And if this thing that they're 361 00:24:27,400 --> 00:24:31,360 fond of requires authoritarianism to bring it to 362 00:24:31,360 --> 00:24:34,200 fruition, all of a sudden they're authoritarian. 363 00:24:34,760 --> 00:24:38,360 Well, that's fine if there's only one thing, but there's 364 00:24:38,600 --> 00:24:41,200 hundreds of millions of things and before you know it, never. 365 00:24:41,200 --> 00:24:44,160 One thing. Yeah, you've got the government 366 00:24:44,160 --> 00:24:48,000 that we have now. I think that's right. 367 00:24:48,000 --> 00:24:53,400 And you know the the old, I don't know how apocryphal it 368 00:24:53,400 --> 00:24:55,680 even is, right, if this ever happened. 369 00:24:56,160 --> 00:24:58,600 But you know, Mr. Franklin, what have you given us? 370 00:24:58,800 --> 00:25:04,320 A Republic if you can keep it. And part part of the keeping of 371 00:25:04,320 --> 00:25:06,920 the Republic is that you have to follow the rules. 372 00:25:07,240 --> 00:25:10,840 The rules have to be more important than your preferred 373 00:25:10,840 --> 00:25:15,560 outcome right now, today, over this particular issue, right? 374 00:25:15,560 --> 00:25:20,080 Which is why you and I tend to be, dare I say it, First 375 00:25:20,080 --> 00:25:23,240 Amendment absolutists. Say whatever you want. 376 00:25:24,320 --> 00:25:26,720 There shouldn't be anything off the table, right? 377 00:25:26,720 --> 00:25:28,360 You should be able to say whatever the hell you want. 378 00:25:29,040 --> 00:25:32,960 That doesn't mean there should be no repercussions, right? 379 00:25:32,960 --> 00:25:35,200 It just means you should be able to say whatever you want. 380 00:25:35,760 --> 00:25:38,880 And if you come to have to pay a price for what you have said, 381 00:25:38,880 --> 00:25:41,640 well, I guess you should have thought of that. 382 00:25:42,360 --> 00:25:44,800 But that doesn't mean you can't say what you want to say. 383 00:25:45,160 --> 00:25:48,640 And it doesn't mean that the person next to you can't reply. 384 00:25:49,720 --> 00:25:52,880 It means the person next to you can't beat you with a stick. 385 00:25:53,640 --> 00:25:57,480 It means the cop near you can't put you in jail. 386 00:25:58,240 --> 00:26:01,720 And we are ever absolutists on this matter. 387 00:26:02,480 --> 00:26:07,000 And occasionally we're, we are called fools because of this, 388 00:26:07,000 --> 00:26:09,680 right? Because isn't it so obvious that 389 00:26:09,680 --> 00:26:13,160 this person should never be allowed to say what he's saying? 390 00:26:14,480 --> 00:26:18,280 Well, no, it it's actually not obvious to me. 391 00:26:18,720 --> 00:26:22,080 Not at all. We're we are Second Amendment 392 00:26:22,080 --> 00:26:26,040 absolutists. The right to keep and bear Arms 393 00:26:26,040 --> 00:26:30,400 shall not be infringed. All I see everywhere I look is 394 00:26:30,400 --> 00:26:33,200 an infringement. Every time I have to have a 395 00:26:33,200 --> 00:26:35,880 license, my right has just been infringed. 396 00:26:36,920 --> 00:26:43,160 When I can't have a magazine of a certain number of with a 397 00:26:43,160 --> 00:26:46,520 certain number of bullets in it, that's an infringement. 398 00:26:47,360 --> 00:26:50,960 Hell, I'll go so far as to say an automatic weapons ban is an 399 00:26:50,960 --> 00:26:55,280 infringement. See, don't but, but notice this 400 00:26:55,280 --> 00:26:58,880 is a good example because somebody, somebody could come 401 00:26:58,880 --> 00:27:04,040 back at you and say, well, you're just for violence. 402 00:27:05,040 --> 00:27:08,200 That's not, no, it doesn't say you're for violence. 403 00:27:08,200 --> 00:27:11,120 You're for the right to defend yourself. 404 00:27:11,120 --> 00:27:14,560 That's very different saying that you're right, you you're 405 00:27:14,560 --> 00:27:17,200 for the right to impose violence on others. 406 00:27:17,200 --> 00:27:19,640 That's not what we're saying. That's correct. 407 00:27:19,640 --> 00:27:25,880 I think I should be subject to all of the laws against doing 408 00:27:25,880 --> 00:27:29,440 harm to other human beings, right? 409 00:27:29,440 --> 00:27:31,480 Those laws don't just magically go away. 410 00:27:32,480 --> 00:27:35,920 But, you know, look, here are a couple of things that we are 411 00:27:35,920 --> 00:27:40,480 absolutists about. Well, that doesn't make us 412 00:27:40,480 --> 00:27:44,400 crazy. That puts us fully in line with 413 00:27:44,400 --> 00:27:46,720 the framers of the American Constitution. 414 00:27:47,880 --> 00:27:52,720 But notice something to to deal with this. 415 00:27:52,720 --> 00:27:57,840 Someone has got to listen to what you just said and process 416 00:27:57,840 --> 00:28:02,080 it and understand the nuance that when you say something like 417 00:28:02,080 --> 00:28:06,200 you're for free speech, that doesn't mean you are against 418 00:28:06,200 --> 00:28:08,480 ramifications of free speech, right? 419 00:28:08,480 --> 00:28:10,160 You have to think, you have to listen, You have to think about 420 00:28:10,160 --> 00:28:15,760 this. That's unfortunately difficult. 421 00:28:16,040 --> 00:28:19,120 And let me say it differently. I think we have become largely 422 00:28:19,120 --> 00:28:22,520 lazy in that we don't do either of those things. 423 00:28:22,520 --> 00:28:25,800 We don't listen to each other and we don't think about what 424 00:28:25,800 --> 00:28:29,400 each other have said. Rather, we take the easy way out 425 00:28:29,480 --> 00:28:35,040 of I heard you say something that is antithetical to what I 426 00:28:35,040 --> 00:28:37,440 perceive the Republican stand for. 427 00:28:37,640 --> 00:28:40,680 Therefore, you're a Democrat and I put you in the Democrat box 428 00:28:40,800 --> 00:28:44,320 and I subscribe to you all the things I think I understand 429 00:28:44,320 --> 00:28:47,120 about Democrats. And so I, I haven't had to 430 00:28:47,120 --> 00:28:49,040 listen or think about what you said. 431 00:28:49,160 --> 00:28:52,120 I just decided. And and if you're a Democrat, 432 00:28:52,560 --> 00:28:55,240 you're evil. Right, right. 433 00:28:55,280 --> 00:28:58,440 Yeah. Now, now, the the sociologists 434 00:28:58,440 --> 00:29:04,080 and political scientists will tell you that political party is 435 00:29:04,120 --> 00:29:08,120 a very good and effective shorthand for understanding 436 00:29:08,520 --> 00:29:10,720 where people sit, by and large, right? 437 00:29:10,720 --> 00:29:18,880 So if I say I'm a Republican, well, if I said in 1982 I'm a 438 00:29:18,880 --> 00:29:23,920 Republican, you would have been able to to assume a bunch of 439 00:29:23,920 --> 00:29:26,080 things. Now you wouldn't be correct 440 00:29:26,080 --> 00:29:29,640 about all of them, but you could assume a bunch of things and be 441 00:29:29,640 --> 00:29:33,480 about 8595% correct. You could assume that I'd be in 442 00:29:33,480 --> 00:29:39,240 favor of limited government, lower taxes, probably a limited 443 00:29:39,240 --> 00:29:45,600 foreign policy that kept troops back home rather than out out 444 00:29:45,600 --> 00:29:49,040 abroad in messy conflicts. You see where I'm going with 445 00:29:49,040 --> 00:29:52,120 this, right? That I would probably be a 446 00:29:52,120 --> 00:29:56,720 Second Amendment purist, and on and on and on and on. 447 00:29:56,720 --> 00:30:00,640 And I could do with the same kind of list for the Democrats 448 00:30:00,680 --> 00:30:05,120 of the same period. Political, political party is a 449 00:30:05,120 --> 00:30:10,560 good shorthand for understanding roughly where people stand, or 450 00:30:10,560 --> 00:30:15,600 at least it was. Now it the parties have changed 451 00:30:15,600 --> 00:30:19,480 over time and they're getting more difficult to keep up with. 452 00:30:20,320 --> 00:30:24,040 So I'm not so sure what I'm looking at now. 453 00:30:24,040 --> 00:30:27,240 When somebody says I'm a good Republican, right? 454 00:30:27,240 --> 00:30:29,440 Does that mean you're a Reagan Republican? 455 00:30:29,840 --> 00:30:32,480 Does that mean you're a Trump Republican? 456 00:30:32,800 --> 00:30:35,680 Somewhere in the middle? Are you just an anti Clinton 457 00:30:35,680 --> 00:30:38,240 Republican, an anti Obama Republican? 458 00:30:38,720 --> 00:30:42,280 What's the list of things that makes a Republican or Republican 459 00:30:42,280 --> 00:30:45,000 right now? And it's it's not exactly clear. 460 00:30:45,760 --> 00:30:48,200 But it I think it's worse than that, James. 461 00:30:48,840 --> 00:30:53,240 I can't even, I have trouble imagining what it is about a 462 00:30:53,240 --> 00:30:55,600 Republican that's different from a Democrat. 463 00:30:55,960 --> 00:30:57,480 And I don't mean about the voters. 464 00:30:57,480 --> 00:31:00,480 I mean about the the policies, the politicians, right? 465 00:31:00,680 --> 00:31:04,240 Because yeah, I I think that's exactly right. 466 00:31:04,240 --> 00:31:08,440 And if you, if you ask me what it was to be a, a Democrat in 467 00:31:08,440 --> 00:31:13,160 198283, I could answer you just exactly as easily as I did with 468 00:31:13,160 --> 00:31:15,760 the Republicans. Right now. 469 00:31:16,720 --> 00:31:23,360 I'm not sure now the Republicans have the benefit of being able 470 00:31:23,360 --> 00:31:27,800 to think in their minds or even say out loud if they feel like 471 00:31:27,800 --> 00:31:30,160 it. Republicanism is whatever Donald 472 00:31:30,160 --> 00:31:34,200 Trump says it is, right? And that that's actually more 473 00:31:34,200 --> 00:31:37,080 reasonable than it might at first sound to be. 474 00:31:38,760 --> 00:31:43,200 Democrats don't have any option that's like that at all. 475 00:31:44,360 --> 00:31:47,520 There's nobody in their party they can point to, so all they 476 00:31:47,520 --> 00:31:52,000 can do is say the Democrats believe in exactly the opposite 477 00:31:52,000 --> 00:31:55,800 of whatever Donald Trump believes, which by definition is 478 00:31:55,800 --> 00:32:01,040 stupid. Well, yeah, and I mean, So what? 479 00:32:01,040 --> 00:32:03,040 Let let's take a few examples. What does he believe in? 480 00:32:03,040 --> 00:32:06,920 Well, he's invaded the the Middle East and he's bombing 481 00:32:06,920 --> 00:32:10,600 people. OK, well, Obama bombed people as 482 00:32:10,600 --> 00:32:14,360 well. He's spending more money than we 483 00:32:14,360 --> 00:32:15,920 have. He promised to shrink the 484 00:32:15,920 --> 00:32:20,520 deficit and is actually grown. OK, well, so too did Biden and 485 00:32:20,880 --> 00:32:25,720 Democrats before him. I don't even if you say as a 486 00:32:25,720 --> 00:32:28,920 Democrat I'm against everything that Donald Trump is for. 487 00:32:29,240 --> 00:32:33,600 If you look historically and only go back 1020 years and 488 00:32:33,600 --> 00:32:37,160 you'll find the Democratic Party is actually for all those things 489 00:32:37,160 --> 00:32:41,120 that Donald Trump is for. And here's the brilliant sleight 490 00:32:41,120 --> 00:32:43,920 of hand. And it is brilliant. 491 00:32:44,600 --> 00:32:52,840 The entire ruling class has made people believe that there are, 492 00:32:52,840 --> 00:32:57,800 in fact, two options and one is completely different from the 493 00:32:57,800 --> 00:33:02,600 other. But where we sit as regular 494 00:33:02,600 --> 00:33:08,120 citizen human beings, it's not left versus right, Democrats 495 00:33:08,120 --> 00:33:12,320 versus Republicans. It's them versus US. 496 00:33:12,960 --> 00:33:16,720 Yeah. And we made fun of Viktor Orban, 497 00:33:16,720 --> 00:33:20,160 the the kind of the teapot dictator that he he wanted to 498 00:33:20,160 --> 00:33:23,280 be. Well, we have an entire 499 00:33:23,280 --> 00:33:28,520 republican system of government that in the end has found a way 500 00:33:28,800 --> 00:33:33,840 to in in some become a teapot dictator. 501 00:33:35,040 --> 00:33:39,840 Yeah, and it's very much like I, I think about these brands and I 502 00:33:39,840 --> 00:33:42,680 can't think of a contemporary one, but one of the first cars I 503 00:33:42,680 --> 00:33:45,120 ever brought bought was a Geo Tracker. 504 00:33:45,120 --> 00:33:47,200 Chevrolet made what? A what? 505 00:33:47,200 --> 00:33:50,600 A piece of garbage car that. Was oh, I love that car, but the 506 00:33:50,600 --> 00:33:56,160 Geo tracker was the same exact car as the Suzuki sidekick. 507 00:33:56,680 --> 00:34:01,760 They just changed the the name tag that they put on it, and you 508 00:34:01,760 --> 00:34:04,800 end up in a situation where that's what we have now with the 509 00:34:04,800 --> 00:34:08,480 Democrats and Republicans. It's the same exact product. 510 00:34:08,480 --> 00:34:10,199 They just put different names on it. 511 00:34:10,480 --> 00:34:13,600 And what is that product? It's authoritarianism. 512 00:34:14,159 --> 00:34:16,760 In both cases, they're looking to expand. 513 00:34:16,760 --> 00:34:19,199 They're successfully expanding the power of the federal 514 00:34:19,199 --> 00:34:23,239 government to the exclusion of of individual rights. 515 00:34:24,040 --> 00:34:27,400 And you might think that they're that, well, OK, but they're 516 00:34:27,400 --> 00:34:31,400 expanding in a way that I want whether I'm a Democrat or 517 00:34:31,400 --> 00:34:35,239 Republican, depending on which versions in the White House. 518 00:34:35,239 --> 00:34:37,400 But no, they're, they're expanding it in in all sorts of 519 00:34:37,400 --> 00:34:38,920 ways. They're just calling it 520 00:34:38,920 --> 00:34:42,000 different things. But they're expanding it in ways 521 00:34:42,000 --> 00:34:46,639 you want right this second. But the next group of people 522 00:34:46,639 --> 00:34:52,080 will take what was created before, build on it, and run 523 00:34:52,080 --> 00:34:55,159 with it. Well, in a good example of this, 524 00:34:55,719 --> 00:35:00,080 I believe it was Bill Clinton who had that famous quote with 525 00:35:00,080 --> 00:35:03,120 regard to executive order, stroke of the pen law of the 526 00:35:03,120 --> 00:35:06,280 land. When asked about these executive 527 00:35:06,280 --> 00:35:08,120 orders he was signing, thought this is pretty cool. 528 00:35:08,120 --> 00:35:10,120 We just make an executive order, it becomes the law. 529 00:35:10,440 --> 00:35:13,640 And you and I said at the time, this is before we had the the 530 00:35:13,640 --> 00:35:18,280 podcast that you extend that. And before you know it, you, 531 00:35:18,360 --> 00:35:22,360 you're no longer making laws via Congress and votes. 532 00:35:22,600 --> 00:35:25,800 It's simply a president who says, let it be thus. 533 00:35:26,040 --> 00:35:28,280 And that's exactly what we have currently. 534 00:35:29,600 --> 00:35:33,520 It is. And you know, Barack Obama said 535 00:35:33,520 --> 00:35:36,720 I can't get gun control through Congress, but I have a phone and 536 00:35:36,720 --> 00:35:39,240 a pen. Right, Yeah. 537 00:35:39,280 --> 00:35:43,440 It's not a Republican thing, it's a politician thing. 538 00:35:44,160 --> 00:35:46,560 Well, it is right now. Give it a couple of years, it'll 539 00:35:46,560 --> 00:35:49,600 be a Democrat thing. That that's right, whoever we 540 00:35:49,600 --> 00:35:54,080 have the misfortune of living with in the next administration. 541 00:35:54,080 --> 00:35:58,600 And right now, it's almost impossible for me to believe the 542 00:35:58,600 --> 00:36:01,800 Democrats won't be able to get their act together to put a 543 00:36:01,800 --> 00:36:06,280 winning candidate up there. But they have repeatedly shot 544 00:36:06,280 --> 00:36:10,800 themselves in the feet before. So let's not go crazy, right? 545 00:36:10,800 --> 00:36:16,200 Could be another Republican. I could virtually guarantee you 546 00:36:16,200 --> 00:36:19,800 it won't be JD Vance. But I can't guarantee you we'll 547 00:36:19,800 --> 00:36:22,680 be Marco Rubio. Yeah. 548 00:36:23,000 --> 00:36:25,000 Ready. Well, he's done what he needed 549 00:36:25,000 --> 00:36:28,680 to do. Yeah, we talked in the opening 550 00:36:29,400 --> 00:36:33,320 matter about the feedback that can happen with an AI if you're 551 00:36:33,320 --> 00:36:37,680 mentally ill and it feet and it reflects that to you and you get 552 00:36:37,680 --> 00:36:39,520 worse and that gets reflected back to you. 553 00:36:39,520 --> 00:36:42,120 It's a feedback mechanism. I think we have a similar 554 00:36:42,440 --> 00:36:46,520 feedback mechanism here that as the two parties become 555 00:36:46,640 --> 00:36:53,000 effectively the same reasonable people say what's the point in 556 00:36:53,000 --> 00:36:57,520 voting and they stop voting. So who does vote are the 557 00:36:57,560 --> 00:37:01,960 unreasonable people who by definition occupy the extremes 558 00:37:01,960 --> 00:37:06,040 of the left and the right. And So what do you get is a 559 00:37:06,040 --> 00:37:11,080 sequence every 4 to 8 years of someone whose claims to be more 560 00:37:11,080 --> 00:37:14,600 extreme to the One Direction versus more extreme to the 561 00:37:14,600 --> 00:37:17,320 other. And it comes back dressed up 562 00:37:17,360 --> 00:37:20,720 really as authoritarianism. It will stand in the scope of 563 00:37:20,720 --> 00:37:24,040 the federal government. 'Cause you've just described the 564 00:37:24,040 --> 00:37:28,600 primary system to AT right, you have to run further right and 565 00:37:28,600 --> 00:37:33,160 further left on either side of the divide to get the 566 00:37:33,160 --> 00:37:35,480 nomination. But the minute you get the 567 00:37:35,480 --> 00:37:42,400 nomination, you have to rush to the middle because now it's it's 568 00:37:42,440 --> 00:37:48,680 Burger King versus McDonald's. It's the same terrible product, 569 00:37:49,080 --> 00:37:52,280 just packaged a little differently, right? 570 00:37:52,680 --> 00:37:58,000 And This is why people win the White House with by like 2 571 00:37:58,000 --> 00:38:02,760 percentage points, right? If, if there were a real, and if 572 00:38:02,760 --> 00:38:10,600 there were a real option, you would see often enough landslide 573 00:38:10,600 --> 00:38:15,240 victories because people would say, oh, this is a real option, 574 00:38:15,240 --> 00:38:19,000 I'm going with this. And Reagan then destroys 575 00:38:19,000 --> 00:38:22,360 Mondale, right? Mondale wins Minnesota, DC and 576 00:38:22,360 --> 00:38:27,960 nothing else right now. People had a choice in that 577 00:38:27,960 --> 00:38:30,800 election. It was an obvious choice and 578 00:38:30,800 --> 00:38:33,560 they made it. And you could argue whether they 579 00:38:33,560 --> 00:38:36,800 made it correctly or not. I personally think they did, but 580 00:38:36,800 --> 00:38:41,440 there are counter arguments. But when somebody wins almost 581 00:38:41,440 --> 00:38:46,600 every Electoral College vote, that wasn't a focus group 582 00:38:46,600 --> 00:38:52,120 election, right? When I mean, there are people 583 00:38:52,120 --> 00:38:54,760 alive right now who can't remember one that was like that. 584 00:38:55,400 --> 00:38:59,960 And that was back when we had Republicans who stood for 585 00:38:59,960 --> 00:39:02,200 certain things. We had Democrats who stood for 586 00:39:02,200 --> 00:39:06,680 certain things and, and frankly, I think some of the things 587 00:39:06,680 --> 00:39:09,800 Republicans, a lot of things Republicans stand for, I agree 588 00:39:09,800 --> 00:39:13,600 with wholeheartedly. And there are a decent number 589 00:39:13,600 --> 00:39:17,480 and I I might even say many things that Democrats stand for 590 00:39:17,680 --> 00:39:19,760 that I agree with wholeheartedly. 591 00:39:19,960 --> 00:39:22,040 Well, maybe. We don't get those that's. 592 00:39:22,640 --> 00:39:25,200 If I could stop you right there, You mean stood for? 593 00:39:28,240 --> 00:39:30,120 Yeah. But well, when I say stand for, 594 00:39:30,120 --> 00:39:32,880 I guess what what I'm saying when I say stand for, I'm not 595 00:39:32,880 --> 00:39:35,880 picturing the parties. I'm picturing voters who 596 00:39:35,880 --> 00:39:38,520 identify. So the average voter who 597 00:39:38,520 --> 00:39:40,800 identifies as Republican, you ask him, look, what do you 598 00:39:40,800 --> 00:39:43,000 believe in? And do the same thing with the 599 00:39:43,000 --> 00:39:45,120 average voter who identifies as Democrat. 600 00:39:45,400 --> 00:39:48,920 And I think you will find most reasonable people will find a 601 00:39:48,920 --> 00:39:51,600 lot of things in both lists that they like. 602 00:39:51,640 --> 00:39:58,920 And I, I submit that this is a good thing because the the 603 00:39:58,920 --> 00:40:03,240 Democrats see the world. I'm going to paint very broadly 604 00:40:03,240 --> 00:40:05,280 here. They see the world from one 605 00:40:05,280 --> 00:40:07,120 perspective. The Republicans see it from a 606 00:40:07,120 --> 00:40:11,040 different perspective. And neither perspective is 100% 607 00:40:11,040 --> 00:40:13,360 of the truth. You need to bring these two 608 00:40:13,360 --> 00:40:16,400 together. But your question begging here, 609 00:40:16,400 --> 00:40:18,440 right? You're saying ultimately, that 610 00:40:18,440 --> 00:40:23,720 decent people are decent? Oh, I think, well, no more than 611 00:40:23,720 --> 00:40:26,120 no, no, I, I, no, I I'll help you out there. 612 00:40:26,120 --> 00:40:28,400 I would say people on average are decent. 613 00:40:29,320 --> 00:40:32,600 I believe that. I, I just think that's question 614 00:40:32,600 --> 00:40:34,640 Becky, right? It's not saying anything. 615 00:40:37,240 --> 00:40:40,240 I look, I don't know what to make of all of this. 616 00:40:40,240 --> 00:40:45,320 I've seen it unfold over the past number of years and then, 617 00:40:45,400 --> 00:40:49,200 sadly, I've seen it unfold in our little corner of the 618 00:40:49,200 --> 00:40:53,000 universe. A corner that we like to say is 619 00:40:53,360 --> 00:40:57,360 reasonable and the people there are relatively friendly, but the 620 00:40:57,360 --> 00:41:01,440 people there are starting to hate each other the same way 621 00:41:01,440 --> 00:41:03,400 people everywhere starting to hate each other. 622 00:41:03,400 --> 00:41:05,440 Oh, I don't think so. I don't think I don't. 623 00:41:05,600 --> 00:41:08,360 Think that's the case at all? I don't. 624 00:41:08,520 --> 00:41:11,120 Think that's the case at all? Go look a lot closer. 625 00:41:11,560 --> 00:41:14,240 I get, I get no. I get the mail, I get e-mail 626 00:41:14,240 --> 00:41:18,480 saying it. Hate is an awfully strong word. 627 00:41:18,960 --> 00:41:22,680 Yeah, that's the word they use. OK, well, I can't speak to what 628 00:41:22,680 --> 00:41:28,880 they're they're thinking is what I have observed is people 629 00:41:29,280 --> 00:41:34,600 becoming a little fractious about certain topics in I'm 630 00:41:34,600 --> 00:41:38,000 having to step in maybe more, not all the time, but more so 631 00:41:38,000 --> 00:41:41,320 than I've done in the past to say, hey, look, remember this is 632 00:41:41,320 --> 00:41:46,640 a forum for discussing things. Well, and one of the sad things. 633 00:41:46,640 --> 00:41:48,280 Keep the conversation on the topic. 634 00:41:48,280 --> 00:41:51,320 If you're right, if you're right about whatever your position is, 635 00:41:51,600 --> 00:41:53,840 then it will come out as we discussed this. 636 00:41:54,360 --> 00:41:57,160 One of the sad things is, is that you know, no matter what 637 00:41:57,160 --> 00:42:01,720 you say, no matter how kind hearted it was, no matter what 638 00:42:01,720 --> 00:42:05,880 motivated you, like I will say things like, man, Donald Trump's 639 00:42:05,880 --> 00:42:08,000 ankles are not looking great these days. 640 00:42:08,000 --> 00:42:11,360 I think there's a problem here. And then, you know, people will 641 00:42:11,360 --> 00:42:14,560 jump all over me saying why, why do you have to stir hatred for 642 00:42:14,560 --> 00:42:17,080 Donald Trump like this? Why do you want Donald Trump to 643 00:42:17,080 --> 00:42:19,680 die? And I'm like, buddy, I said he 644 00:42:19,680 --> 00:42:21,520 has ankles. I didn't say I wanted him to 645 00:42:21,520 --> 00:42:26,040 die, right? And did should I have said look 646 00:42:27,160 --> 00:42:31,040 bloated ankles are a sign of and then list all of the medical 647 00:42:31,840 --> 00:42:36,600 conditions that that have been that, you know, any little 648 00:42:36,600 --> 00:42:41,840 criticism of anybody, everybody on the other side just loses 649 00:42:41,840 --> 00:42:44,800 their mind. And I want to go back. 650 00:42:44,800 --> 00:42:49,160 If you want to pick on Rand Paul to take one from my list of 651 00:42:49,160 --> 00:42:52,800 people who I really like, I think that's fine. 652 00:42:53,240 --> 00:42:56,360 If you want to say I'm glad his neighbor beat him as badly as he 653 00:42:56,360 --> 00:43:00,000 did, he broke all his ribs, I think you might be a problem 654 00:43:00,600 --> 00:43:02,080 right there. I just think, you know, if you 655 00:43:02,080 --> 00:43:04,280 want to say, all right, you know, Rand Paul's acting like a 656 00:43:04,280 --> 00:43:07,040 bit of an idiot today. Yeah. 657 00:43:07,440 --> 00:43:09,960 OK. I don't know about that slide, 658 00:43:09,960 --> 00:43:13,480 that that seems fine. But if you want to say something 659 00:43:13,480 --> 00:43:17,360 like Rand Paul is a moron who never should have gotten 660 00:43:17,360 --> 00:43:21,640 anywhere near the Senate, you've gone too far, right. 661 00:43:21,640 --> 00:43:24,200 There are just these gigantic differences between these types 662 00:43:24,200 --> 00:43:27,600 of statements. I think the question ultimately 663 00:43:27,600 --> 00:43:33,320 is when you, when 1 engages with others on topics like this, what 664 00:43:33,320 --> 00:43:36,280 is your goal? Is it to feel good about 665 00:43:36,280 --> 00:43:40,360 yourself and what you purport to believe? 666 00:43:40,760 --> 00:43:45,840 Or is it to discover the truth? Because if it's the first thing, 667 00:43:45,840 --> 00:43:49,720 why are you bothering having discussions at all, right? 668 00:43:50,320 --> 00:43:53,600 Find people who agree 100% with you and just hang out with them. 669 00:43:53,600 --> 00:43:55,000 You'll feel really good about yourself. 670 00:43:55,320 --> 00:43:58,200 Yeah, if your. Goal and and you will be filled 671 00:43:58,200 --> 00:44:01,000 with hatred for everybody else, sure. 672 00:44:01,160 --> 00:44:06,000 But if your goal is to discover the truth, then you want to 673 00:44:06,000 --> 00:44:08,720 surround yourself with people who disagree with you. 674 00:44:08,840 --> 00:44:13,960 That's how you distinguish between the things that you 675 00:44:13,960 --> 00:44:17,200 think are true and are and the things that you think are true 676 00:44:17,280 --> 00:44:19,640 and aren't. You've got to have around you 677 00:44:19,640 --> 00:44:23,600 people who are willing to push back and say, no, I think you're 678 00:44:23,600 --> 00:44:25,080 wrong because of the following things. 679 00:44:25,240 --> 00:44:28,240 But the important thing, and this is what we tried to do in 680 00:44:28,240 --> 00:44:33,680 backstage is, is to keep the conversation on the topic. 681 00:44:34,200 --> 00:44:39,760 If I disagree with you about whatever gun control, it doesn't 682 00:44:39,760 --> 00:44:42,040 mean I hate you and you're disagreeing with me. 683 00:44:42,120 --> 00:44:44,920 I if I perceive that your disagreement means that you hate 684 00:44:44,920 --> 00:44:47,040 me, I've completely lost the thread. 685 00:44:47,480 --> 00:44:52,760 The point is this topic. Is this position correct or is 686 00:44:52,760 --> 00:44:56,280 it not correct? Sometimes I hate you. 687 00:44:59,080 --> 00:45:00,920 You don't like anybody, that's the problem. 688 00:45:01,920 --> 00:45:05,720 But I never say it out loud and I never and I certainly never 689 00:45:06,560 --> 00:45:09,760 type it out in a in an Internet forum. 690 00:45:09,760 --> 00:45:13,720 Right there there are just simple rules and and the the 691 00:45:13,720 --> 00:45:19,120 first thing that everybody should remember is that the two 692 00:45:19,120 --> 00:45:23,880 parties their goal is to separate you along partisan 693 00:45:23,880 --> 00:45:28,080 lines yes, that is they. Love it when we do this, yeah. 694 00:45:28,320 --> 00:45:33,000 And their goal is to get 51% of you because that's a lot easier 695 00:45:33,000 --> 00:45:37,120 than getting 85% of you. So that is their goal. 696 00:45:37,560 --> 00:45:41,640 And if that's their goal, you should start asking some hard 697 00:45:41,640 --> 00:45:44,640 questions of them. Like just how different are 698 00:45:44,640 --> 00:45:48,200 they? Are they really that different? 699 00:45:48,800 --> 00:45:52,920 Or do they just set it all? Up to make it look like they're 700 00:45:52,920 --> 00:45:57,640 that different. Do the people at the top of each 701 00:45:57,640 --> 00:46:03,760 party, are they real or are they playing a role now? 702 00:46:03,760 --> 00:46:08,400 If they were real, their opinions would remain the same 703 00:46:08,400 --> 00:46:11,760 over time. More or less right for the most 704 00:46:11,760 --> 00:46:14,640 part. But I can go find you Democrat 705 00:46:14,640 --> 00:46:19,360 after Democrat after Democrat who was against illegal 706 00:46:19,360 --> 00:46:22,920 immigration not not long ago either. 707 00:46:22,960 --> 00:46:27,880 Active Democrats right now who would say things like we have to 708 00:46:27,880 --> 00:46:31,560 get rid of every illegal immigrant in this country. 709 00:46:32,480 --> 00:46:35,040 How different do you think these these two groups of people are? 710 00:46:35,880 --> 00:46:39,840 They're playing roles, and they're playing roles to get 711 00:46:39,840 --> 00:46:42,560 your support. And I'm going to say this till 712 00:46:42,560 --> 00:46:46,960 the day I die, it's not left versus right. 713 00:46:47,280 --> 00:46:52,720 It's them versus US. It's their job to keep us at 714 00:46:52,720 --> 00:46:54,920 each other's throats. Yeah. 715 00:46:55,080 --> 00:46:59,360 And if you, if you would just stop taking the bait even for a 716 00:46:59,360 --> 00:47:02,960 week, you'd be surprised what you'd be able to figure out. 717 00:47:03,480 --> 00:47:06,280 You'd be shocked. Just don't believe a word out of 718 00:47:06,280 --> 00:47:09,600 any of their mouths. And this is, you know, something 719 00:47:09,600 --> 00:47:12,400 that economics taught me that political science has a lot of 720 00:47:12,400 --> 00:47:14,320 trouble with right revealed preferences. 721 00:47:15,120 --> 00:47:18,600 Watch what people do, not what they say. 722 00:47:19,680 --> 00:47:24,160 Just discount every single thing they say and watch what they do 723 00:47:25,200 --> 00:47:28,160 and you'll see it clear as day, clear as day. 724 00:47:29,040 --> 00:47:32,920 And if that ever comes to pass, and I don't think it will, but 725 00:47:32,920 --> 00:47:38,440 if it does, we will live in a better, happier, kinder, more 726 00:47:38,440 --> 00:47:42,480 wonderful world. Until then, you should join us 727 00:47:42,480 --> 00:47:45,480 on Words and Numbers backstage and become part of the problem. 728 00:47:45,760 --> 00:47:52,000 You should also check us out at Patreon, because that's actually 729 00:47:52,000 --> 00:47:54,880 how we can afford to get these episodes up these days, 730 00:47:55,040 --> 00:47:59,680 sponsorless though we may be. If you're a big giant rich 731 00:47:59,680 --> 00:48:02,960 person and you would launch like to sponsor a podcast, you you 732 00:48:02,960 --> 00:48:04,560 get in touch with me right quick. 733 00:48:04,880 --> 00:48:07,640 That words and numbers e-mail address that ain't gives out 734 00:48:07,640 --> 00:48:11,720 episode after episode after episode goes directly to both of 735 00:48:11,720 --> 00:48:14,600 our e-mail boxes. So I have no choice but to look. 736 00:48:14,920 --> 00:48:19,400 So if you would like to sponsor the podcast you and and Patreon 737 00:48:19,400 --> 00:48:22,400 is a a little too low stakes for your liking. 738 00:48:23,640 --> 00:48:27,200 Drop me a line and we'll make it work until. 739 00:48:28,200 --> 00:48:31,200 Well, hang on before, before you end, since since you raised 740 00:48:31,200 --> 00:48:34,840 Patreon, we should take a moment to thank our Patreon sponsors. 741 00:48:34,840 --> 00:48:38,840 People came when we went on hiatus and we said, well, we're 742 00:48:38,840 --> 00:48:40,200 thinking maybe we won't come back. 743 00:48:40,200 --> 00:48:43,240 This kind of thing. People came out of the woodwork 744 00:48:43,960 --> 00:48:47,600 they did and we're and we had There are people who are giving 745 00:48:47,600 --> 00:48:49,320 a tremendous amount of money on Patreon. 746 00:48:49,320 --> 00:48:52,720 There are people who are giving a buck a month and we are just 747 00:48:52,720 --> 00:48:56,400 thankful for all of you across the entire spectrum, every. 748 00:48:56,400 --> 00:48:58,880 Bin I don't want to make it seem, I don't want to make it 749 00:48:58,880 --> 00:49:00,880 seem like there wasn't anybody there before. 750 00:49:00,880 --> 00:49:05,600 There was and well, there was. We're very, very grateful to to 751 00:49:05,600 --> 00:49:12,920 you, you guys, people how to put this when we say we had 752 00:49:12,920 --> 00:49:18,320 sponsors, they didn't really pass much it it was barely 753 00:49:18,320 --> 00:49:22,920 enough to cover our our our expense, the Internet bill, let 754 00:49:22,920 --> 00:49:24,560 alone our time that that's right. 755 00:49:25,480 --> 00:49:29,040 We have never made a living doing this right. 756 00:49:29,080 --> 00:49:32,360 And and I think maybe people don't understand that, but but 757 00:49:32,360 --> 00:49:36,480 we haven't we this is very, very small potatoes. 758 00:49:36,480 --> 00:49:41,560 If, if this money, if, if all the money we ever made for the 759 00:49:41,560 --> 00:49:46,320 entire run of the entire podcast was put in one pot, we could not 760 00:49:46,320 --> 00:49:48,720 fly away to Jamaica and stay there. 761 00:49:48,840 --> 00:49:52,240 We might not even be able to fly to Jamaica, right? 762 00:49:52,240 --> 00:49:57,160 Let's just be honest about it. So when we say things like the, 763 00:49:57,480 --> 00:50:02,640 the you guys on Patreon are literally the reason why we're 764 00:50:02,640 --> 00:50:09,640 still up and running, that is literally true, absolutely, 765 00:50:09,640 --> 00:50:12,600 literally true. And we couldn't be more 766 00:50:12,600 --> 00:50:15,640 grateful. I, I'm trying to, you know, 767 00:50:15,640 --> 00:50:18,160 thank everybody personally. It, it's hard to keep up with, 768 00:50:18,680 --> 00:50:22,760 but I mean, you have made all the difference and we really 769 00:50:22,760 --> 00:50:24,440 appreciate it. So thank you. 770 00:50:24,920 --> 00:50:29,160 And really all we need aunt are 10,000 people who will give us 771 00:50:29,160 --> 00:50:31,520 $1.00 a month. That's all we need. 772 00:50:32,720 --> 00:50:34,360 And I don't want to think as well. 773 00:50:34,720 --> 00:50:39,520 We've had a lot of people also join words and numbers backstage 774 00:50:39,560 --> 00:50:42,040 on Facebook. And I know a lot of you don't. 775 00:50:42,720 --> 00:50:45,440 I've heard from a lot of people that they don't want to be on 776 00:50:45,440 --> 00:50:48,840 Facebook. And you can, we can do the same 777 00:50:48,840 --> 00:50:52,000 thing on Patreon. There's Patreon has the, the, 778 00:50:52,120 --> 00:50:54,520 the interface that you, we can carry on conversations. 779 00:50:54,520 --> 00:50:56,400 They're just like we do on backstage. 780 00:50:56,880 --> 00:51:01,400 But the backstage is what, like 1700 people now 1800 people, 781 00:51:01,400 --> 00:51:05,240 something like that. One of the things that that we 782 00:51:05,240 --> 00:51:09,320 keep driving home, which relates to this topic for this episode 783 00:51:10,280 --> 00:51:16,160 is to to talk civilly with people who disagree with you 784 00:51:16,280 --> 00:51:19,440 with I highly encourage you to talk with people who disagree 785 00:51:19,440 --> 00:51:21,400 with you. The trick, I think, is pretty 786 00:51:21,400 --> 00:51:25,840 simple. It's never addressed the other 787 00:51:25,840 --> 00:51:30,080 person. Anytime I start to say but you 788 00:51:32,080 --> 00:51:35,960 I've gone off the rails. Keep the conversation on the 789 00:51:35,960 --> 00:51:42,160 topic, not on the other person. Avoid ad hominems at every turn. 790 00:51:43,200 --> 00:51:45,920 Easy advice. But it's even worse than ad 791 00:51:45,920 --> 00:51:47,480 hominems. I mean, people know this. 792 00:51:47,480 --> 00:51:50,120 They say, well, if I say, well, you're just an idiot, that's not 793 00:51:50,240 --> 00:51:52,440 ad hominem. It's more subtle than that. 794 00:51:52,440 --> 00:51:57,520 If I bring you into the conversation as a topic, I've 795 00:51:57,520 --> 00:52:04,440 gone off the rails. I'll agree with that in spirit, 796 00:52:04,560 --> 00:52:08,840 I think. But you know, we often say, oh, 797 00:52:08,840 --> 00:52:13,320 here we go, Donald Trump again, you know, we do it. 798 00:52:14,040 --> 00:52:16,240 Yeah, here we go. Chuck Schumer, I don't do it. 799 00:52:16,280 --> 00:52:18,920 Here we go, Chuck Schumer, blah blah blah blah blah. 800 00:52:19,520 --> 00:52:24,720 But you know, it's the thing, not the guy, right? 801 00:52:25,400 --> 00:52:30,080 And look, I know it's hard and you know where I'm going with 802 00:52:30,080 --> 00:52:31,680 this aunt. Everything's hard. 803 00:52:32,200 --> 00:52:34,600 It's really, really hard to be nice to each other. 804 00:52:35,440 --> 00:52:39,440 Damn near impossible most days. But you should figure out a way 805 00:52:39,600 --> 00:52:43,440 because your time on this world is short, and people will 806 00:52:43,440 --> 00:52:47,560 remember you by the attitude you took toward them. 807 00:52:48,480 --> 00:52:50,200 So you should just be nice to each other. 808 00:52:50,920 --> 00:52:54,400 Because if if you are, that's how you'll go out. 809 00:52:55,160 --> 00:52:58,800 People will say that Henry, he was a pretty nice guy, all 810 00:52:58,800 --> 00:53:02,880 things considered. And how would you prefer to be 811 00:53:02,880 --> 00:53:05,760 remembered? Is there something better than 812 00:53:05,760 --> 00:53:07,520 that? I don't think there is. 813 00:53:08,440 --> 00:53:09,880 I think that's as good as it gets. 814 00:53:10,440 --> 00:53:14,360 So be nice to each other. I know it's hard, but I know you 815 00:53:14,360 --> 00:53:17,240 can do it. And Aunt, I will catch you next 816 00:53:17,240 --> 00:53:19,720 week. I love you saying that I will 817 00:53:19,720 --> 00:53:23,280 catch you next week. See you next time, James.