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Ladies and gentlemen, return 
guest here, Devin Anderson. 

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This time we are not talking 
about investments, we're talking

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about performance with mostly 
sports, but maybe you can find 

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other applications. 
I very much enjoy talking to 

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Devin about this stuff. 
Devin is a very real shooter of 

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Clay's and some of what he and I
bounced off each other at a 

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breakfast last week really 
resonated for me with my golf 

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game. 
I think it can help in tennis 

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and I think there are other 
applications. 

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I hope you enjoy it. 
I like doing this kind of stuff.

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It's going to continue, so enjoy
the episode. 

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No disclaimers needed on this 
one. 

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All right. 
So ladies and gentlemen, excited

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to have Devin Anderson back. 
This is the second time that 

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we've recorded in person. 
So that's a unique guest in that

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way. 
But Devin and I were grabbing 

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breakfast the other day and we 
got into a discussion about I 

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guess, performance in mostly 
athletic pursuits, but I may get

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more into other stuff too. 
But Devin, I was, I was hoping 

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that maybe you could go into a 
little bit about your shooting 

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sort of practice and, you know, 
then we'll take it from there 

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and talk about some of the stuff
that we talked about at 

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breakfast, but just kind of give
people some background. 

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Sure. 
So my day job is that I'm a Co 

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founder of an investment 
advisory firm and I have a 

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family and all those 
responsibilities. 

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But the the last third of my 
life is I shoot shotguns 

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competitively, specifically 
sporting clays. 

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So that's a game all about being
able to. 

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In that game, you don't know 
what the targets are in advance.

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You show up, you look at them 
and you know a minute later or 

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90 seconds later you're shooting
them and they could be anything 

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and they change. 
There's professional corsetters 

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and every time you go to an 
event it's different. 

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So there's a lot of complexity 
in that. 

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You must plan and then execute 
on that plan. 

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So that's a lot different than 
many disciplines where the 

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targets are going to be the same
every time. 

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You know it's the same American 
trap or international ski 

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targets on every field, right? 
They're measured and set to very

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specific distances and speeds. 
So become but where that 

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matters, though, with respect to
performances, you'd need to the 

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game requires this very 
interesting mix of conscious 

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evaluation to make a plan, but 
then unconscious execution to be

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able to step in and actually do 
it. 

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And that's where this 
performance under pressure bit 

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becomes really hard. 
There's there are so many 

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parallels to particularly golf 
and tennis. 

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Shooting is unique, though, in 
that it has very low 

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physicality, right? 
I don't even need to be in 

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shape, right, As long as I could
stand up and move my arms 

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around, right? 
I can shoot a shotgun, but it 

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has a lot of repetition in the 
game that golf and tennis do 

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not. 
So what you end up with is this 

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very distilled mental stress of 
being able to, of having to be 

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able to make a plan and then 
step in and execute that same 

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thing, let's say three to five 
times a row, which makes, which 

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makes the game mentally very 
difficult. 

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So like when you are, when 
you're planning, are you able to

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see you get, you get 2 clays in 
every pole I believe, right? 

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So the game is most. 
It doesn't have to be, but it's 

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mostly pairs. 
So you see what the pair, what 

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the presentation is going to be 
in advance and then you have to 

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make a plan to be able to 
execute on. 

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How many minutes do you have to 
make your plan once you see 

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these things? 
Well, you, you shoot in a 

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rotation, you know, there'll be 
a group of four to six people in

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a squad trying, you know, going 
from course station to station 

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in a course. 
If you're 1st and you're the 

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first person to to shoot that 
particular stand and you are in 

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the box for the view targets, 
you're going to see the view 

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targets and you have to go right
away. 

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So it it may be less than a 
minute. 

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That kind of sucks. 
Well. 

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I mean, you get to the point, 
though, where you're planning at

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a speed that I don't think it 
matters too much It, it can be a

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disadvantage in some situations 
where you know, you've got very 

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close decisions and it does help
to see somebody else do it 

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first. 
You can't end up with that. 

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But I think among the people 
that are good for the most part,

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you get good enough for reading 
the targets, you get get enough 

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experience it it's not so much 
of an issue. 

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I think just stepping back 
though, the interesting thing 

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with all of these games is like 
kind of why do we do these 

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games? 
OK, So like if I asked you for 

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some, you're a golfer, why do 
you play golf? 

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What is the thing about golf 
that keeps you coming back time 

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after time? 
And I'm not looking for like, 

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well, I learned to play from my 
dad and, you know, I'm a 

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competitive person. 
I think all that stuff kind of 

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goes. 
That's just table sticks. 

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There are many things that could
fulfill that competitive need. 

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What is it about that game? 
What is it about the experience 

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of being out there that keeps 
you coming back? 

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Yeah, I mean, I think 1 is being
in nature. 

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I enjoy that quite a bit. 2 is 
the difficulty of hitting a 

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perfect shot is is in and of 
itself a pursuit that I enjoy. 

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Then the difficulty of doing it 
over and over and over and over 

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again is something that I enjoy.
And then the frustration of just

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like a short lapse of time, 
right? 

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My fatal flaw seems to be that I
get quick and I hit duck hooks 

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when I get quick and the ball is
traveling reasonably fast and, 

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and far, and that means it's out
of bounds. 

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So, you know, I'll have two to 
three swings around that'll cost

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me four to six shots. 
And that's the difference 

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between, I don't know, somewhere
between 75 and 78 and 84 and 86 

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or whatever. 
I love how hard it is and I 

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don't know why I love how hard 
it is, but I mean the the idea 

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of trying to, it's funny because
72 is not perfect, but that's my

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idea of perfect. 
Like the idea of trying to 

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perfect that game is what I'm 
chasing. 

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So I'm going to take what you 
said. 

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I, I spent, it was a little bit 
of a loaded question because I 

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think I know the answer and I 
think that answer is universal 

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among every golf, tennis player,
shooter. 

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And that's to do any of those 
games. 

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Well, your performance exists 
right on the edge of your 

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conscious ability. 
Well, exists not on the edge. 

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It exists beyond your conscious 
ability to execute those things.

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So those games are moving fast 
enough and with high enough 

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difficulty that you're actually 
not thinking about your 

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execution of a golf shot or a 
sporting clay shot or you know 

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your forehand and tennis, you're
not thinking about those things 

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consciously. 
You're seeing it and you're 

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letting your body do it 
unconsciously, subconsciously, 

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right? 
And the feeling of letting your 

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subconscious perform something 
that you could never do 

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consciously is really 
exhilarating. 

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And then then the second part of
your answer, which was the thing

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you said about doing it again 
and again, the ability to summon

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that capability on demand. 
So I think it's funny when you 

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ask people why, what keeps them 
coming back to competitive 

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shooting or tennis or whatever 
it is you you get a lot of 

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answers. 
But I never get this answer. 

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But then when I say it this way,
they're like, yeah, I get yes, 

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that's what it is, right? 
So then the question becomes, 

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how can I summon my unconscious 
execution at will? 

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And that's the hard part. 
There's a lot of people in these

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games that are great on the 
practice stand, OK, In my world,

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OK, they can go to a lesson and,
you know, turn targets inside 

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out for two hours during a 
lesson. 

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And then where they can go duck 
hunting where no one's keeping 

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score and shoot great. 
OK, You hear all the time I 

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hear, oh, well, this guy's a 
great hunter and he shows up and

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shoots 65% on when when there's 
referees out there, right? 

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Or the same thing. 
You see the guys on the practice

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range in golf creaming them. 
So the question is how do we 

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cope with the pressure and can 
you do it on command? 

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And that's actually because 
you're fundamentally after an 

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unconscious activity. 
That's actually the exciting 

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part, I think. 
Yeah, I would very much agree 

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with that. 
And it's amazing. 

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Like, I don't know if you watch 
that documentary or, I don't 

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know, it's a documentary full 
swing on Netflix. 

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So you know, Brooks Kepka is 
sitting there and he's talking 

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about Scotty Scheffler and he's 
like, I guarantee you he's not 

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thinking about a thing right 
now. 

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And it's so interesting that 
like when it's going well, it is

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that that bordering like like my
swing thought when I'm really 

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swinging well, I think about 
turning my hips. 

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That's it. 
I don't think about anything 

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else except for hitting the 
shot. 

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And I don't know, it's like it's
an intoxicating feeling to turn 

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your mind off and be. 
Able to execute yeah, so that's 

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exactly right. 
So, so I think ultimately it's 

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the unconscious execution part 
that makes these things so 

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interesting. 
And by the way, I mean it, it 

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comes out very so clearly in 
these types of sports 

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performances. 
There's but there's many, many 

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analogies. 
OK. 

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So a good friend of mine is an 
oral surgeon. 

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We shoot together and he 
describes, he describes surgery 

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the same way kind of in this in 
for the things that he does a 

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lot kind of the in this flow 
state, right? 

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We can talk about what that 
means and how to and how to get 

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there, which is maybe the more 
interesting thing. 

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But he describes surgery the 
same way. 

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So I've actually, I worked with 
a mental coach guy named Henry 

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Hopkin in the UK. 
And, you know, some of his other

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clients have included, you know,
F1 pit teams, OK, like those 

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guys changing tires and working 
on course. 

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That's not conscious activity 
when you're doing it in three 

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seconds or 4 seconds or whatever
it is, right? 

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There's all sorts of, you know, 
bomb squad guys, OK? 

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Like there's all sorts of of 
activities under real pressure. 

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Now those are examples of lethal
pressure, not a game, right? 

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And so a lot different. 
But you know, there's all sorts 

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of examples of having to perform
under pressure where I think the

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techniques we're going to talk 
about and like the structure of 

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how to approach performance 
under pressure matters quite a 

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bit. 
When we first had this 

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conversation, you talked about 
the F1 guys and the comment that

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I believe you made is like when 
the pit crew, when it goes wrong

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is when the guy starts to 
actually think and get in his 

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own head. 
You just watch it, you see it 

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right, Like you know when as 
like the I don't know the I'm 

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not a car racing guy. 
I don't know anything about it. 

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But like you see like the bolts 
and stuff or the car part, like 

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rolling across the ground, like 
we're now conscious, right? 

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Like in now we're not it's not 
going to happen in three seconds

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anymore, right? 
So that's the question then is, 

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is there a process that we can 
follow now that we understand? 

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Like that's what we're after, 
OK. 

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And by the way, big people think
that sports psychologist and 

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there's actually a lot of bad 
sports psychology out there, I 

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think, but this is universal, 
all sports psychology. 

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Read all of like the serious 
work on this or the people that 

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actually get paid to provide 
this advice to. 

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By the way, every high end 
athlete that exists is coached 

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on this stuff, right? 
Like no one, no one does this 

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without by just by themselves. 
Although except now that I've 

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said that we, we have this joke 
in shooting that if you want to 

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be really, really good shooting,
you have two options. 

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You either have to be so 
completely self aware, a self 

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unaware, like so unaware of 
yourself that none of this 

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matters. 
And I actually do believe there 

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are some people in my world like
that. 

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They just have very low 
self-awareness. 

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And so they don't let they don't
inject their conscious thought 

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into their performance because 
they're never aware of their 

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conscious thought, right? 
Those people are pretty rare. 

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The other option is you have to 
be so self aware that you can 

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master these things, but in the 
middle is dangerous ground 

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because now you're performed 
like your conscious self starts 

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showing up and with your swing 
thought or while you're in the 

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middle of trying to execute a 
sporting clay shot and now 

227
00:13:18,560 --> 00:13:20,120
you're in a lot of problems, 
right? 

228
00:13:20,560 --> 00:13:24,400
So you're kind of, so your two 
options are like, you know, near

229
00:13:24,400 --> 00:13:27,560
autism level, and I don't mean 
that in a derogatory way, but 

230
00:13:27,560 --> 00:13:33,120
like near autism level, low 
self-awareness or extreme self 

231
00:13:33,120 --> 00:13:36,480
actualization, right? 
Bulls are the two paths to 

232
00:13:36,480 --> 00:13:38,560
success for unconscious 
performance. 

233
00:13:38,560 --> 00:13:40,800
I I believe. 
But The thing is, you don't get 

234
00:13:40,800 --> 00:13:42,360
to choose which one of those you
are. 

235
00:13:42,880 --> 00:13:44,640
You got to, yeah. 
What the cards you're 

236
00:13:44,640 --> 00:13:47,760
neurologically dealt. 
With so I played yesterday, I 

237
00:13:47,760 --> 00:13:50,560
played with a guy who is, he's 
got his tour card. 

238
00:13:50,560 --> 00:13:53,280
He doesn't play in every event. 
He's he's not like exempt. 

239
00:13:53,280 --> 00:14:00,800
So he's got to play his way in 
and he shot 66, I shot 84 and he

240
00:14:00,800 --> 00:14:04,200
looked at me after the round and
he was like, he's like you 

241
00:14:04,200 --> 00:14:09,040
clearly have game and like 
you're just the tee shot away. 

242
00:14:09,720 --> 00:14:14,840
Like consistently hitting the 
tee shot away from being like 

243
00:14:14,840 --> 00:14:20,440
really good, but that like just 
the tee shot away. 

244
00:14:20,920 --> 00:14:21,600
Yeah, big. 
Deal. 

245
00:14:21,800 --> 00:14:24,080
Yeah. 
I mean, it's fucking night and 

246
00:14:24,080 --> 00:14:26,880
day. 
That's the difference between 

247
00:14:27,240 --> 00:14:31,040
being like kind of good at it 
and being really good at it. 

248
00:14:31,080 --> 00:14:34,600
And, and what I find 
fascinating, to your point on 

249
00:14:34,600 --> 00:14:38,880
what you're saying is like, I am
the guy in the middle, right? 

250
00:14:38,880 --> 00:14:42,160
And like, I mean, yes, 
statistically I'm like a pretty 

251
00:14:42,160 --> 00:14:47,200
decent golfer, but relative to 
what I think I should be, I'm 

252
00:14:47,200 --> 00:14:49,200
way away from where I want to 
be. 

253
00:14:49,680 --> 00:14:53,640
And I know it's all in my mind, 
but in a weird way the key is 

254
00:14:53,640 --> 00:14:57,920
like learning to turn my mind 
off while also being completely 

255
00:14:57,920 --> 00:15:01,040
tuned in. 
So the first step in all this 

256
00:15:01,040 --> 00:15:06,680
stuff is skill building. 
So people ask sometimes where 

257
00:15:06,680 --> 00:15:09,280
does confidence come from? 
Or they'll say, well, well, you 

258
00:15:09,280 --> 00:15:10,920
just need to be confident. 
OK. 

259
00:15:11,400 --> 00:15:13,360
So I think there's some like 
immutable laws. 

260
00:15:13,360 --> 00:15:18,480
I, I believe the first one is 
for most people, you can't lie 

261
00:15:18,480 --> 00:15:21,600
to yourself. 
Meaning I can't just order 

262
00:15:21,600 --> 00:15:25,160
myself to be confident. 
Doesn't work like that, right? 

263
00:15:25,720 --> 00:15:29,760
I can't look at a golf shot, 
look at a target presentation 

264
00:15:29,760 --> 00:15:34,520
and say, you know, and just 
convince myself that I can 

265
00:15:34,520 --> 00:15:37,080
execute it perfectly. 
I can't order myself to do it. 

266
00:15:37,360 --> 00:15:39,840
Not how it works. 
Now, interestingly, there are 

267
00:15:39,840 --> 00:15:43,800
people out there, including some
like Olympic athletes that would

268
00:15:43,800 --> 00:15:47,280
tell you that through routine, 
you know, you can convince 

269
00:15:47,280 --> 00:15:51,720
yourself right by by trying to 
like rebuild yourself image and,

270
00:15:52,040 --> 00:15:57,080
and, and having mantras and this
sort of thing that you can 

271
00:15:57,080 --> 00:15:59,120
essentially convince yourself. 
That's a trick. 

272
00:15:59,240 --> 00:16:01,680
I don't believe that's true. 
I think in your heart of hearts,

273
00:16:02,880 --> 00:16:06,320
when you look at something that 
you need to execute, you know, 

274
00:16:07,160 --> 00:16:11,200
whether or not that's within 
your acquired skill set or not. 

275
00:16:11,680 --> 00:16:14,400
And there's no line to yourself.
So if we take the no line to 

276
00:16:14,400 --> 00:16:19,040
yourself thing for granted as a 
given, then as a natural 

277
00:16:19,040 --> 00:16:22,120
consequence of that, your first 
step towards towards, you know, 

278
00:16:22,120 --> 00:16:28,720
true unconscious execution is 
building skills so that you can 

279
00:16:28,720 --> 00:16:31,840
do it unconsciously, right? 
But here's the rub. 

280
00:16:32,680 --> 00:16:35,800
Skill building is necessarily a 
conscious activity. 

281
00:16:36,920 --> 00:16:39,320
Performance is an unconscious 
activity. 

282
00:16:39,600 --> 00:16:43,000
So you have to learn, you know 
that particular golf shot, 

283
00:16:43,000 --> 00:16:46,280
particular sporting clays target
particular tennis shot. 

284
00:16:46,760 --> 00:16:50,040
When you're in the process of 
learning that, you will be 

285
00:16:50,040 --> 00:16:52,880
conscious about what you're 
physically doing. 

286
00:16:53,560 --> 00:16:56,040
You may have to do drills or you
may have to do it in slow 

287
00:16:56,040 --> 00:17:00,320
motion, or you, you may even 
like look at the ball or the 

288
00:17:00,320 --> 00:17:05,000
target a little differently than
you would during if you were 

289
00:17:05,000 --> 00:17:07,240
doing it for a score or you were
actually trying to perform. 

290
00:17:07,520 --> 00:17:11,760
Because you have to teach 
yourself through repetition what

291
00:17:11,760 --> 00:17:16,359
that action feels like. 
That is a conscious activity. 

292
00:17:17,240 --> 00:17:23,160
Where I believe most people go 
wrong is that they don't 

293
00:17:23,160 --> 00:17:26,599
understand that what's going on 
in your mind while you're 

294
00:17:26,599 --> 00:17:29,560
practicing is needs to be 
different than what's going on 

295
00:17:29,560 --> 00:17:30,800
in your mind when you're 
performing. 

296
00:17:31,760 --> 00:17:34,720
And if those two things are the 
same, we're just out of the 

297
00:17:34,720 --> 00:17:36,000
gate. 
We have a problem. 

298
00:17:36,400 --> 00:17:41,560
Practice is about skill building
should be about skill building. 

299
00:17:41,880 --> 00:17:45,280
It should be about taking 
elemental parts of whatever game

300
00:17:45,280 --> 00:17:50,120
you're playing and building the 
skills that you need to execute 

301
00:17:50,120 --> 00:17:52,440
the tasks that you need under 
when you need to perform. 

302
00:17:52,800 --> 00:17:54,320
OK. 
So you know, in my world, it's 

303
00:17:54,320 --> 00:17:56,440
about there's many elements to 
it. 

304
00:17:56,440 --> 00:17:59,280
There's, you know, practicing 
specific kinds of targets so 

305
00:17:59,280 --> 00:18:00,760
that you have experience with 
them, You're comfortable. 

306
00:18:01,040 --> 00:18:05,000
How you use your eyes, like 
fascinating stuff doesn't matter

307
00:18:05,000 --> 00:18:07,640
so much in golf because you're 
striking a stationary object. 

308
00:18:07,960 --> 00:18:11,840
But in tennis and sporting 
clays, the way that you use your

309
00:18:11,840 --> 00:18:16,720
eyes in your periphery, you can 
actually massively improve the 

310
00:18:16,720 --> 00:18:20,800
way your eyes perform by 
learning how your vision works. 

311
00:18:21,240 --> 00:18:22,960
How so? 
Like what's an example? 

312
00:18:23,320 --> 00:18:26,840
OK, so if I'm shooting a target 
that was close to me and 

313
00:18:26,840 --> 00:18:33,600
traveling away, OK, at a fast 
speed, I actually, if I tried to

314
00:18:33,600 --> 00:18:37,480
look at it with focus very close
to the trap, even if I could 

315
00:18:37,480 --> 00:18:42,960
achieve focus at that speed, by 
the time I can physically move 

316
00:18:42,960 --> 00:18:46,200
and intercept this target with 
my gun in order to make a shot, 

317
00:18:46,640 --> 00:18:51,200
my eyes are well outside of the 
time frame for which I can hold 

318
00:18:51,200 --> 00:18:54,320
that focus. 
The amount of time that you can 

319
00:18:54,800 --> 00:18:58,600
achieve high detail center 
vision focus, it's very small, 

320
00:18:59,120 --> 00:19:01,880
OK, And I would be well outside 
that side. 

321
00:19:02,360 --> 00:19:06,280
It turns out your periphery 
vision is far more powerful, 

322
00:19:07,000 --> 00:19:08,880
right? 
In a way that you don't 

323
00:19:08,880 --> 00:19:11,280
understand, because as you 
experience your life and walk 

324
00:19:11,280 --> 00:19:13,800
around the planet every day, you
don't really think about what's 

325
00:19:13,800 --> 00:19:15,520
going on in your periphery. 
You think about what's going on 

326
00:19:15,520 --> 00:19:18,720
in your center focus. 
So if instead of looking for 

327
00:19:18,720 --> 00:19:22,840
detail as that target's moving 
very fast very soon after it 

328
00:19:22,840 --> 00:19:27,160
leaves the trap, if instead I 
focus my eyes out farther away 

329
00:19:27,640 --> 00:19:31,000
and beyond the plane of the 
target, and I just allow my 

330
00:19:31,000 --> 00:19:34,920
periphery to see that flash and 
I begin moving on that flash. 

331
00:19:35,400 --> 00:19:38,560
Your periphery is actually so 
strong it will put my hands and 

332
00:19:38,560 --> 00:19:40,560
my body on exactly the right 
line. 

333
00:19:40,840 --> 00:19:43,840
And as I'm approaching a point 
where I can achieve center 

334
00:19:43,840 --> 00:19:46,440
vision detail, I'll be dead in 
time with the target and ready 

335
00:19:46,440 --> 00:19:49,280
to go. 
So inexperienced shooters will 

336
00:19:49,280 --> 00:19:52,160
often say to experienced 
shooters, oh, well, you shoot 

337
00:19:52,160 --> 00:19:54,480
them so fast, I can't shoot them
that fast. 

338
00:19:54,920 --> 00:19:58,600
The reality is I'm not moving my
hands any faster or slower than 

339
00:19:58,600 --> 00:20:03,920
you are, but I'm using my eyes 
in such an efficient way that 

340
00:20:04,080 --> 00:20:07,720
time slows down for me when it 
doesn't for you. 

341
00:20:07,720 --> 00:20:12,040
And when they try to replicate 
what I do, they end up moving 

342
00:20:12,040 --> 00:20:15,040
their hands very quickly because
the information that they're 

343
00:20:15,040 --> 00:20:18,040
getting into their eyes isn't 
helping them. 

344
00:20:18,160 --> 00:20:19,800
And it's much different than 
what I do. 

345
00:20:20,080 --> 00:20:21,360
And by the way, this is not a 
phenomenon. 

346
00:20:21,360 --> 00:20:22,920
It's just shooting at tennis. 
It's everywhere. 

347
00:20:23,120 --> 00:20:26,600
There's this really awesome 
documentary called In Search of 

348
00:20:26,640 --> 00:20:29,200
Greatness. 
I can't remember the guy, the 

349
00:20:29,200 --> 00:20:31,520
director's name, but it has 
Jerry Rice in it. 

350
00:20:31,840 --> 00:20:34,760
And they, Jerry Rice was talking
about catching passes. 

351
00:20:35,080 --> 00:20:38,280
And he said, you know, when I'm 
on, I look over my shoulder and 

352
00:20:38,280 --> 00:20:41,720
I can see the threads on the 
football in slow motion. 

353
00:20:42,560 --> 00:20:46,000
OK, That's because Jerry's, he's
doing what I'm talking about. 

354
00:20:46,160 --> 00:20:49,400
He's learned how to use the 
combination of his periphery and

355
00:20:49,400 --> 00:20:53,040
center vision in such a way that
it looks like time is slowing 

356
00:20:53,040 --> 00:20:56,440
down to him. 
So look, but to watch him at a 

357
00:20:56,440 --> 00:20:58,640
distantly, he's doing this as 
he's running down a football 

358
00:20:58,640 --> 00:21:01,440
field at full speed. 
And he's a huge guy, right? 

359
00:21:01,880 --> 00:21:04,960
But to him, his perception of 
the event, it looks, it's like 

360
00:21:04,960 --> 00:21:09,280
time slows down and it's all 
about how your eyes and body 

361
00:21:09,360 --> 00:21:10,960
come together. 
And it's a it's a learnable 

362
00:21:10,960 --> 00:21:13,240
skill, But we could spend a 
whole bunch of time just on 

363
00:21:13,240 --> 00:21:15,760
that. 
But that's just one thing that 

364
00:21:15,760 --> 00:21:17,600
you could go out and practice, 
right? 

365
00:21:17,800 --> 00:21:20,280
So the point is there's in my 
world, there's, you know, 

366
00:21:20,280 --> 00:21:24,120
specific targets, there's eye 
development stuff, there's body,

367
00:21:24,120 --> 00:21:26,760
what we call frame. 
Like there's body and posture, 

368
00:21:26,760 --> 00:21:29,720
things that matter. 
And some really weird stuff, 

369
00:21:29,720 --> 00:21:35,400
like when you lean over and you 
begin to look out the top of 

370
00:21:35,400 --> 00:21:39,800
your eyes, it begins to change 
how you perceive speed and 

371
00:21:39,800 --> 00:21:42,520
distance and your ability to 
keep your eyes fixed on a 

372
00:21:42,520 --> 00:21:43,640
target. 
It's like so. 

373
00:21:43,640 --> 00:21:46,080
Well, that that would mess up 
with your your peripheral 

374
00:21:46,200 --> 00:21:48,360
vision, I would think. 
So yes, all of these things 

375
00:21:48,360 --> 00:21:51,920
interact with one another, but 
the point is, step one is you 

376
00:21:51,920 --> 00:21:55,640
got to go out and build skills. 
And as you build skills, you 

377
00:21:55,640 --> 00:21:58,760
will begin to develop confidence
in those skills. 

378
00:21:58,760 --> 00:22:02,040
And that's where confidence 
comes from first, right? 

379
00:22:02,320 --> 00:22:05,920
The bedrock of confidence has to
be your skill building. 

380
00:22:06,160 --> 00:22:07,840
But that's not what a lot of 
people do. 

381
00:22:08,240 --> 00:22:13,360
What what I mostly observe is 
that to go out and practice and 

382
00:22:13,360 --> 00:22:16,080
the practice is just about, 
well, trying to see if I can hit

383
00:22:16,080 --> 00:22:19,640
the target without really trying
to develop a specific skill, 

384
00:22:20,480 --> 00:22:22,640
right? 
The practice in golf is, well, 

385
00:22:22,800 --> 00:22:25,360
I'm just going to go to the 
range and see if I can hit, you 

386
00:22:25,360 --> 00:22:28,320
know, if I can, if I can hit 
some straight balls, not at a 

387
00:22:28,320 --> 00:22:31,040
specific target, right? 
Like the reason they're those 

388
00:22:31,040 --> 00:22:33,160
flags out on the end of the 
range are there for a purpose, 

389
00:22:33,200 --> 00:22:37,120
right? 
So then if if what your practice

390
00:22:37,120 --> 00:22:40,200
is, I just want to see if I go 
out and hit straight balls, but 

391
00:22:40,200 --> 00:22:42,480
then I show up on the golf 
course and now I've got to hit a

392
00:22:42,480 --> 00:22:45,920
target, I haven't actually been 
practicing the skill that I 

393
00:22:45,920 --> 00:22:47,920
need, right. 
So, yeah. 

394
00:22:48,040 --> 00:22:52,040
So the people, what adds up 
happening instead is people go 

395
00:22:52,040 --> 00:22:55,640
through practice and they don't 
really, they aren't really 

396
00:22:55,640 --> 00:22:58,440
developing skills. 
So then they show up to perform 

397
00:22:59,000 --> 00:23:01,560
and what's going on in their 
mind is the same thing that 

398
00:23:01,560 --> 00:23:02,800
what's going on in their 
practice. 

399
00:23:02,800 --> 00:23:04,080
I'm just trying to hit a 
straight ball. 

400
00:23:04,240 --> 00:23:08,920
It becomes super conscious, 
which on a on your best day you 

401
00:23:08,920 --> 00:23:11,800
can get away with. 
And this is another thing that 

402
00:23:11,800 --> 00:23:15,560
happens. 
The day-to-day variability in 

403
00:23:15,560 --> 00:23:18,680
your ability to execute and your
ability to use your eyes in 

404
00:23:18,680 --> 00:23:22,280
sports varies tremendously. 
Like this is something I'm 

405
00:23:22,280 --> 00:23:25,800
really in tune with because 
sporting plays and shooting is 

406
00:23:25,800 --> 00:23:29,840
such a visually oriented game. 
Tennis is is, I understand I'm 

407
00:23:29,840 --> 00:23:32,160
not a tennis player, but people 
play tennis tell me the same 

408
00:23:32,160 --> 00:23:34,280
thing. 
That's just a visually oriented 

409
00:23:34,280 --> 00:23:37,040
game. 
I can tell you, like on one day,

410
00:23:37,200 --> 00:23:39,640
I'm having a much harder time 
keeping my eye on the target 

411
00:23:39,640 --> 00:23:42,240
than I am another day. 
And I, I don't know where it 

412
00:23:42,240 --> 00:23:43,640
comes from. 
Maybe it's rest, maybe it's a 

413
00:23:43,640 --> 00:23:46,320
little bit diet, maybe it's my 
blood sugar level, you know. 

414
00:23:46,560 --> 00:23:49,400
So you try to do things to 
control those when you have a, 

415
00:23:49,680 --> 00:23:52,560
an important competition, but 
there's just going to be some 

416
00:23:52,560 --> 00:23:55,800
variance in your unconscious 
performance, right? 

417
00:23:56,720 --> 00:23:59,480
So on your best day, maybe the 
guy that doesn't really practice

418
00:23:59,480 --> 00:24:02,320
the way he should shows up and 
he has a great day, right? 

419
00:24:02,600 --> 00:24:04,280
And that happens 10% of the 
time, right? 

420
00:24:04,280 --> 00:24:06,440
You can do that 11 great round, 
right? 

421
00:24:07,360 --> 00:24:08,600
Then shows up the next kind of 
call. 

422
00:24:08,600 --> 00:24:11,080
I kind of screws it up a little 
bit and then every once in a 

423
00:24:11,080 --> 00:24:13,680
while has a melt, just a total 
meltdown, right? 

424
00:24:14,120 --> 00:24:15,240
And then the question is, well, 
what? 

425
00:24:15,240 --> 00:24:16,640
Where do these meltdowns come 
from? 

426
00:24:17,440 --> 00:24:21,880
Well, it comes from a cascading 
effect of didn't really build 

427
00:24:21,880 --> 00:24:24,520
the skills that I needed. 
Then I showed up and some things

428
00:24:24,520 --> 00:24:27,000
went wrong. 
And because my confidence isn't 

429
00:24:27,000 --> 00:24:30,880
rooted in my skills, it's 
instead rooted in my results, I 

430
00:24:30,880 --> 00:24:34,760
now become even more conscious 
of my execution. 

431
00:24:34,760 --> 00:24:38,760
I'm now, now I'm trying in my 
sling or in my shot to do it 

432
00:24:38,760 --> 00:24:41,720
better while I'm doing it, which
doesn't work right. 

433
00:24:41,920 --> 00:24:45,360
I become even more conscious and
become even then I the results 

434
00:24:45,360 --> 00:24:48,600
get worse and then you become 
even more results oriented now, 

435
00:24:48,600 --> 00:24:51,080
like I'm even more worried about
my results as they're happening 

436
00:24:51,240 --> 00:24:53,760
between holes, between stands, 
whatever, right? 

437
00:24:54,080 --> 00:24:57,160
And then because you're worried 
about that, now your decision 

438
00:24:57,160 --> 00:25:01,280
making goes in the toilet or 
you're not planning your shots 

439
00:25:01,280 --> 00:25:04,160
as well, right? 
And then you're not playing or 

440
00:25:04,160 --> 00:25:06,440
you're doing things you're like,
oh, well, I'm not hitting that 

441
00:25:06,640 --> 00:25:09,040
kind of shot well today. 
So even though that should be 

442
00:25:09,040 --> 00:25:11,320
the ideal plan, I'm not going to
do, I'm going to do something 

443
00:25:11,320 --> 00:25:13,040
else. 
You start making sub optimal 

444
00:25:13,040 --> 00:25:16,040
decisions, which even those can 
be conscious or not. 

445
00:25:16,040 --> 00:25:20,120
And then the whole thing just 
spins around until you're 

446
00:25:20,120 --> 00:25:23,640
totally out of control and you 
shoot 20 strokes off or, you 

447
00:25:23,640 --> 00:25:26,560
know, 15 targets off of your 
average because you're just, 

448
00:25:26,640 --> 00:25:28,480
you're, you're in a meltdown, 
right? 

449
00:25:28,960 --> 00:25:30,680
But that's where it comes from, 
right? 

450
00:25:31,760 --> 00:25:37,680
Is this progression of if your 
confidence isn't coming from 

451
00:25:37,680 --> 00:25:42,000
skill building and instead 
coming from your recent results,

452
00:25:43,080 --> 00:25:45,320
things begin to unravel under 
stress? 

453
00:25:45,720 --> 00:25:47,600
Yeah, yeah. 
Preach. 

454
00:25:48,120 --> 00:25:51,240
Something that's interesting 
that you said about the target 

455
00:25:51,240 --> 00:25:55,280
being on the range. 
I had had a previous guest, he 

456
00:25:55,280 --> 00:26:00,320
actually said that he in 
Minnesota, one of the benefits 

457
00:26:00,400 --> 00:26:04,680
to teaching kids in the winter 
is that he puts these little 

458
00:26:04,680 --> 00:26:10,840
foam balls out there. 
And because they're just foam 

459
00:26:10,840 --> 00:26:15,320
balls, it enables the people 
that he's working with, 

460
00:26:15,320 --> 00:26:19,440
predominantly high school kids, 
to focus on the actual swing 

461
00:26:19,440 --> 00:26:23,360
change as opposed to the result 
that occurs from the skill 

462
00:26:23,360 --> 00:26:29,080
building. 
So the ability to build the 

463
00:26:29,080 --> 00:26:32,720
skill and detach yourself from 
the poor result then inevitably 

464
00:26:32,720 --> 00:26:36,400
occurs when you're consciously 
trying to build the skill is 

465
00:26:36,400 --> 00:26:38,840
actually a benefit. 
And to your point, when you get 

466
00:26:38,840 --> 00:26:42,640
conscious out on the course or 
I'm sure when you're shooting, 

467
00:26:42,640 --> 00:26:46,440
that's when like the reaction 
time slips. 

468
00:26:46,760 --> 00:26:48,600
Well, it's not just reaction 
time, it's your whole. 

469
00:26:48,920 --> 00:26:53,440
It's the trust that you need to 
have in order to get out of the 

470
00:26:53,440 --> 00:26:56,320
way to let your body finish the 
motion that you need to make, 

471
00:26:57,320 --> 00:26:59,520
right? 
So that's about trust and 

472
00:27:00,040 --> 00:27:04,160
conscious thought is the enemy 
of that trust, no doubt, right. 

473
00:27:04,360 --> 00:27:09,480
If you're, if you are thinking 
like if you're trying to control

474
00:27:09,760 --> 00:27:13,200
what your body is doing, that 
means your subconscious is not 

475
00:27:13,200 --> 00:27:16,440
controlling it. 
So the, you know, we're, we're, 

476
00:27:16,640 --> 00:27:18,680
we're eventually going to get to
like routine and elements of 

477
00:27:18,680 --> 00:27:21,080
routine. 
But really the whole purpose of 

478
00:27:21,080 --> 00:27:26,840
routine is to keep your 
conscious mind occupied with 

479
00:27:26,840 --> 00:27:30,400
something constructive so that 
your unconscious mind can 

480
00:27:30,400 --> 00:27:32,880
execute the physical activity 
that is required. 

481
00:27:33,720 --> 00:27:36,080
You described to me when we were
having breakfast, you were 

482
00:27:36,080 --> 00:27:40,720
having a great round and you 
were really unconscious and you 

483
00:27:40,720 --> 00:27:43,240
were letting yourself be 
unconscious and you were able to

484
00:27:43,240 --> 00:27:45,120
visualize a shot and it would 
just happen. 

485
00:27:45,560 --> 00:27:48,720
Yeah, yeah. 
So there will be as I'm sure you

486
00:27:48,720 --> 00:27:51,280
can identify with. 
There's days where that that 

487
00:27:51,280 --> 00:27:55,120
state comes easier. 
There's days where you're able 

488
00:27:55,120 --> 00:27:57,760
to trust yourself with that more
than others. 

489
00:27:57,920 --> 00:28:00,360
Now there's and and I don't 
think, you know, I've talked to 

490
00:28:00,360 --> 00:28:03,440
a lot of people into the 
shooting world about this, less 

491
00:28:03,440 --> 00:28:07,000
so and golf and tennis, but I 
don't know that anyone really 

492
00:28:07,000 --> 00:28:11,400
knows where that comes from. 
OK, So when I hear people talk 

493
00:28:11,400 --> 00:28:17,200
about getting in the zone, well,
I start cringing because I think

494
00:28:17,200 --> 00:28:20,480
it's really unconstructive to 
think about the zone as an 

495
00:28:20,480 --> 00:28:24,280
ephemeral state versus a process
because I'm going to feel 

496
00:28:24,280 --> 00:28:28,120
different every day, OK? 
What I can't control that. 

497
00:28:28,440 --> 00:28:32,720
What I can do is control the 
process that I follow every day 

498
00:28:33,080 --> 00:28:37,440
to get myself prepared and and 
then during the execution of my 

499
00:28:37,440 --> 00:28:39,440
performance, right. 
And while I'm out of 

500
00:28:39,440 --> 00:28:43,560
competition, the flow state 
isn't a thing that's with you or

501
00:28:43,560 --> 00:28:47,040
not with you. 
Sometimes I think the flow state

502
00:28:47,040 --> 00:28:51,040
is the process that you follow 
to attempt to get there, right. 

503
00:28:51,240 --> 00:28:54,760
And sometimes, sometimes it's 
going to be easier to get there 

504
00:28:54,760 --> 00:28:56,600
than others. 
Sometimes you're never going to 

505
00:28:56,600 --> 00:29:00,400
like fully click. 
But if you have good routine and

506
00:29:00,400 --> 00:29:04,520
good process and your and your 
confidence is coming from your 

507
00:29:04,520 --> 00:29:09,360
skills and you're, you know, as 
I don't know in years, I'm going

508
00:29:09,360 --> 00:29:13,200
to say this as minimally results
oriented as achievable, right? 

509
00:29:13,440 --> 00:29:16,720
I think for a lot of people that
are successful in business and 

510
00:29:16,720 --> 00:29:20,720
life, and then, you know, then 
take that and they want to take 

511
00:29:20,720 --> 00:29:24,600
that skill set and go to and 
apply. 

512
00:29:24,600 --> 00:29:27,720
That's the same things that they
did to be successful in business

513
00:29:28,080 --> 00:29:32,080
that to be successful in in 
performance sports, right? 

514
00:29:33,240 --> 00:29:35,600
I think that's a very natural 
approach that people want to 

515
00:29:35,600 --> 00:29:38,760
take. 
The the problem is that it 

516
00:29:38,760 --> 00:29:41,040
doesn't their different skills, 
right? 

517
00:29:41,360 --> 00:29:45,480
The ability to plan and set your
conscious thinking aside when 

518
00:29:45,480 --> 00:29:48,240
you need to perform is just 
completely different than the 

519
00:29:48,520 --> 00:29:52,320
kind of taskmaster approach 
that's required for practicing. 

520
00:29:52,560 --> 00:29:56,360
So I mentioned that I've worked 
with a, a performance coach and 

521
00:29:56,760 --> 00:29:59,200
he at when we first started 
working together, he did this 

522
00:29:59,200 --> 00:30:02,360
really long multi hour interview
kind of covering all the aspects

523
00:30:02,360 --> 00:30:05,120
of my life, including, you know,
kind of my work life, home, 

524
00:30:05,120 --> 00:30:08,240
family balance versus shooting. 
And he asked me at one point he 

525
00:30:08,240 --> 00:30:12,160
said, why do you think you've 
been successful in the other 

526
00:30:12,160 --> 00:30:14,480
areas of your life? 
I kind of, I think I gave the 

527
00:30:14,480 --> 00:30:18,320
answer that like every business 
person would, which is, you 

528
00:30:18,320 --> 00:30:21,560
know, like I, I'm tenacious and 
you know, I have this kind of 

529
00:30:21,560 --> 00:30:24,440
very diligent taskmaster 
approach where I just keep 

530
00:30:24,440 --> 00:30:26,960
grinding away at it until I've 
got it right. 

531
00:30:27,360 --> 00:30:31,280
And he's like, great, OK, He's 
like, but I'm here to tell you 

532
00:30:32,240 --> 00:30:37,240
that by definition, the things 
that you did to be successful to

533
00:30:37,240 --> 00:30:40,640
this point will not be the 
things that help you get to the 

534
00:30:40,640 --> 00:30:44,040
next level by definition, 
because if they were, you would 

535
00:30:44,040 --> 00:30:46,160
already be doing it. 
He's like, so we can just 

536
00:30:46,160 --> 00:30:51,000
accept, you know, as a precept. 
Clearly you've got to add 

537
00:30:51,000 --> 00:30:52,760
something to get to the next 
level. 

538
00:30:53,040 --> 00:30:58,040
And that something is, you know,
recognizing that there's this 

539
00:30:59,000 --> 00:31:01,240
necessary difference between 
conscious practice and 

540
00:31:01,240 --> 00:31:04,800
unconscious performance and then
building a, a system, OK, which 

541
00:31:04,800 --> 00:31:09,440
is routine in order to unlock 
your unconscious performance as 

542
00:31:09,440 --> 00:31:12,840
consistently as possible. 
And by the way, and the 

543
00:31:12,880 --> 00:31:15,320
interesting thing is we, we can 
sit here and talk about 

544
00:31:15,560 --> 00:31:18,600
intellectually or conceptually 
why all of this matters. 

545
00:31:19,040 --> 00:31:21,200
But interestingly, you don't 
actually have to know any of 

546
00:31:21,200 --> 00:31:24,160
that for it to work. 
I could just teach you a 

547
00:31:24,160 --> 00:31:27,760
framework of routine, teach, 
tell you none of the reasons 

548
00:31:28,400 --> 00:31:30,840
physiologically or 
psychologically why it works, 

549
00:31:30,840 --> 00:31:34,000
and it would not matter. 
What matters is that you just do

550
00:31:34,000 --> 00:31:37,600
it. 
And that's a lot different than 

551
00:31:37,600 --> 00:31:41,200
skill building when you're 
trying to build the skills of 

552
00:31:41,200 --> 00:31:42,680
making the gulf shot or 
shooting. 

553
00:31:42,760 --> 00:31:47,320
When it comes to routine, I 
think it's intellectually sat 

554
00:31:47,320 --> 00:31:49,560
like to the intellectually 
curious, it's interesting to 

555
00:31:49,560 --> 00:31:52,120
know why it works, but you 
actually don't need to know any 

556
00:31:52,120 --> 00:31:54,320
of it, right? 
I don't need to tell you about 

557
00:31:54,320 --> 00:31:58,040
like synapses and all this stuff
in, in dopamine and like all 

558
00:31:58,040 --> 00:31:59,720
this stuff that goes on in your 
brain. 

559
00:32:00,080 --> 00:32:03,160
It actually like it's 
interesting, but it doesn't 

560
00:32:03,160 --> 00:32:07,960
matter. 
What matters is that you follow 

561
00:32:07,960 --> 00:32:11,960
the sequence of events that will
trigger the things in your mind 

562
00:32:12,000 --> 00:32:14,880
and help your body create these 
cues that will help you perform 

563
00:32:14,880 --> 00:32:16,600
under pressure. 
Yeah. 

564
00:32:17,040 --> 00:32:20,560
People can reference our first 
episode and I'll link to it. 

565
00:32:20,560 --> 00:32:24,440
But unless I'm mistaken, part of
your business is hedging tail 

566
00:32:24,440 --> 00:32:25,520
risks. 
Yeah. 

567
00:32:25,560 --> 00:32:28,200
We, we have some long, long 
volatility focus for some 

568
00:32:28,200 --> 00:32:32,720
mitigation strategies, yes. 
Now, when those tail risk events

569
00:32:32,720 --> 00:32:38,080
occur, maybe I mean it's not a 
split second at all, but it's a 

570
00:32:38,080 --> 00:32:42,360
sort of a condensed period of 
time that the market reacts, I 

571
00:32:42,360 --> 00:32:45,000
would think. 
Do you have any of this stuff 

572
00:32:45,000 --> 00:32:49,240
that that pops into your head in
those like does does some of 

573
00:32:49,240 --> 00:32:53,120
this crossover to your work or 
is that a completely separate 

574
00:32:53,400 --> 00:32:55,280
skill set? 
I mean in the sense. 

575
00:32:55,280 --> 00:32:59,080
That there's process, yes, but 
you know, all this like routine 

576
00:32:59,120 --> 00:33:01,960
and pressure under performance 
stuff that I'm talking about 

577
00:33:02,440 --> 00:33:05,760
really applies to executing 
unconscious activities under 

578
00:33:05,760 --> 00:33:09,520
pressure, right? 
Because, you know, again, just 

579
00:33:09,520 --> 00:33:13,600
fundamentally, the game is 
moving so fast, you don't have 

580
00:33:13,600 --> 00:33:17,040
time to react to a conscious. 
And by the way, there's 

581
00:33:17,040 --> 00:33:18,800
actually, you know, we could 
keep going with the sports 

582
00:33:18,800 --> 00:33:20,520
analogy. 
So there's this, there's this 

583
00:33:20,520 --> 00:33:23,920
just amazing clip of Kobe Bryant
that I love where someone's 

584
00:33:23,920 --> 00:33:27,240
asking him about. 
He's talking about doubt and why

585
00:33:27,240 --> 00:33:30,880
it's so unproductive to like 
worry about your future 

586
00:33:30,880 --> 00:33:33,000
performance. 
There's a lot of little gems in 

587
00:33:33,000 --> 00:33:37,320
that clip, but one of them is 
he's like, look, all you can do 

588
00:33:37,560 --> 00:33:41,120
is train as hard as you can, 
step out there and let it flow. 

589
00:33:41,120 --> 00:33:44,760
And then you see what happens. 
Well, then you take that 

590
00:33:44,760 --> 00:33:47,760
information and then the next 
day, whether you win or lose, 

591
00:33:47,760 --> 00:33:50,040
you're going to show up the next
day and start all over again. 

592
00:33:50,280 --> 00:33:53,480
So you take that information, it
that goes into your training 

593
00:33:53,480 --> 00:33:56,240
regimen, you trade as hard as 
you can, but then when it's time

594
00:33:56,240 --> 00:33:58,200
to compete, you just step out 
and let it flow. 

595
00:33:58,280 --> 00:34:01,160
I even think the choice of words
he uses there is informative. 

596
00:34:01,320 --> 00:34:04,640
He uses the word flow, right? 
I mean, if you've ever, I feel 

597
00:34:04,640 --> 00:34:08,280
like it's harder to see when 
you're farther back at a 

598
00:34:08,280 --> 00:34:11,639
basketball game, but when you if
you get seats really close or 

599
00:34:11,639 --> 00:34:14,639
hockey's like this too, I feel 
like when you get really close 

600
00:34:14,639 --> 00:34:19,520
to the side of the court or the 
rink and you see how fast these 

601
00:34:19,520 --> 00:34:22,120
guys are moving, it's not 
conscious activity. 

602
00:34:22,159 --> 00:34:24,159
They're not thinking about what 
they're doing. 

603
00:34:24,679 --> 00:34:28,760
It's unconscious activity. 
So, so like this stuff matters. 

604
00:34:28,800 --> 00:34:32,840
It's a little less applicable 
to, you know, I think business 

605
00:34:32,840 --> 00:34:36,520
because most of our business 
stuff is not real time 

606
00:34:36,520 --> 00:34:38,960
unconscious decision making and 
performance. 

607
00:34:38,960 --> 00:34:41,800
It's very conscious execution of
strategy, right. 

608
00:34:42,199 --> 00:34:45,239
But that said, we certainly have
process in our business, right? 

609
00:34:45,480 --> 00:34:49,320
We have, you know, a set even in
an even for our, you know, our, 

610
00:34:49,440 --> 00:34:52,520
we run discretionary strategies.
We have an expectation of how 

611
00:34:52,520 --> 00:34:56,719
things evolve in a process that 
we follow, and then we exercise 

612
00:34:56,719 --> 00:35:00,680
kind of discretion inside of 
these small bands, like we're 

613
00:35:00,680 --> 00:35:02,440
not just totally making it up as
we go along. 

614
00:35:03,280 --> 00:35:06,360
Yeah, I was more thinking like 
COVID, some of those days it 

615
00:35:06,360 --> 00:35:09,800
didn't even feel like you had 
time to process the information 

616
00:35:10,720 --> 00:35:13,920
and you almost had to, like, 
know what was going on. 

617
00:35:14,560 --> 00:35:15,400
I don't know. 
Yeah. 

618
00:35:15,400 --> 00:35:19,320
I mean, I don't want to turn too
far left into like theories on 

619
00:35:19,320 --> 00:35:22,240
investment management, but we're
of the belief that you need to 

620
00:35:22,240 --> 00:35:26,600
manage to the risk, OK, rather 
than think about the risk in 

621
00:35:26,600 --> 00:35:29,560
terms of your dollar 
allocations, OK, you need to 

622
00:35:29,560 --> 00:35:33,560
think about when an event 
happens, what's the what is the 

623
00:35:33,600 --> 00:35:36,680
actual price change to that 
thing, right? 

624
00:35:36,680 --> 00:35:40,400
And you need to manage to that. 
So when the when the COVID, you 

625
00:35:40,400 --> 00:35:44,440
know, likes, we weren't live and
for that, but you know, when you

626
00:35:44,440 --> 00:35:51,120
have moves like that, for us, 
the risk is dictating how we 

627
00:35:51,120 --> 00:35:54,680
react when we get to a certain 
risk level, We rebalance. 

628
00:35:54,680 --> 00:35:58,880
Now the exact point, right? 
You know, do we rebalance when 

629
00:35:58,880 --> 00:36:01,480
we get to short 70 deltas or 
short 90? 

630
00:36:02,080 --> 00:36:03,880
And dude, that's where the 
discretion happens. 

631
00:36:03,880 --> 00:36:07,800
But we know inside this range, 
it's it is going to happen, 

632
00:36:08,000 --> 00:36:11,920
right? 
So there's process still and 

633
00:36:11,920 --> 00:36:15,720
we're coming into it with a 
plan, but that plan is focused 

634
00:36:15,720 --> 00:36:18,520
about the amount of risk we're 
taking and the rate at which 

635
00:36:18,520 --> 00:36:21,560
prices are changing. 
Rather than thinking about the 

636
00:36:21,560 --> 00:36:25,120
world kind of statically, which 
is I, I'm going to allocate this

637
00:36:25,120 --> 00:36:27,520
many dollars to this and this 
many dollars to that. 

638
00:36:27,680 --> 00:36:30,080
And then I'm going to wait three
months and see what happens. 

639
00:36:30,600 --> 00:36:32,160
Right, Much different 
orientation. 

640
00:36:32,600 --> 00:36:35,000
Yeah, that makes sense. 
The other thing I was thinking 

641
00:36:35,000 --> 00:36:38,040
about when you were talking is 
baseball's got to be incredibly 

642
00:36:38,320 --> 00:36:40,560
this way, right? 
Like if you're trying to think 

643
00:36:40,560 --> 00:36:45,280
about as a pitcher, like am I 
flipping my wrist the right way?

644
00:36:45,280 --> 00:36:47,520
Like you're going to miss it? 
I would I assume you miss your 

645
00:36:47,520 --> 00:36:50,280
release point and then for as 
from a batter's perspective you 

646
00:36:50,280 --> 00:36:52,880
have like no time to process I 
mean. 

647
00:36:53,000 --> 00:36:57,760
Go to a batting cage, try to hit
a 60 mile an hour fastball, and 

648
00:36:57,760 --> 00:37:03,720
then realize that these guys are
hitting balls that are 90% 

649
00:37:03,720 --> 00:37:07,840
faster than that, right? 
So that's all, you know, 

650
00:37:08,080 --> 00:37:10,680
hitting, you know, that's all 
unconscious activity. 

651
00:37:10,680 --> 00:37:13,440
But again, the great baseball 
players, they say the same thing

652
00:37:13,440 --> 00:37:17,400
that Jerry Rice does. 
They're they're so in tune with 

653
00:37:17,400 --> 00:37:22,840
using their eyes that they can 
see the thread on the ball 

654
00:37:23,200 --> 00:37:26,240
spinning. 
So again, like you see the the 

655
00:37:26,240 --> 00:37:30,760
same, the same themes emerge 
over and over and over, right. 

656
00:37:30,960 --> 00:37:34,040
So you're hitting a baseball as 
best as I understand it, you 

657
00:37:34,040 --> 00:37:37,200
know, it's about using your eyes
and reacting to what you see. 

658
00:37:37,760 --> 00:37:41,240
Now I can barely because I, I 
don't have the skill of being 

659
00:37:41,240 --> 00:37:44,040
able to see a baseball. 
I just see that 60 mile. 

660
00:37:44,040 --> 00:37:47,720
I just see a blur, right? 
I'm sure if I got a batting 

661
00:37:47,720 --> 00:37:50,440
coach, if you could tell me this
is where you need to focus and 

662
00:37:50,440 --> 00:37:51,600
this is how you have to use your
eyes. 

663
00:37:51,760 --> 00:37:54,240
Just the same way that if I was 
coaching a shooter, I can tell 

664
00:37:54,240 --> 00:37:57,440
you, here's the target. 
Put your eyes out here, focus 

665
00:37:57,440 --> 00:37:59,800
them here. 
Use your periphery like this. 

666
00:37:59,800 --> 00:38:03,880
Like I'm sure it's possible, but
in with time and practice, you 

667
00:38:03,880 --> 00:38:06,480
would get there. 
But it's the it's all 

668
00:38:06,480 --> 00:38:10,960
fundamentally the same, right? 
This sort of skill building, 

669
00:38:11,320 --> 00:38:14,520
conscious skill building, using 
your Physiology to the best that

670
00:38:14,520 --> 00:38:18,320
you can for that game, and then 
being confident you can do that 

671
00:38:18,560 --> 00:38:22,320
and wrapping a routine around it
so that you can essentially turn

672
00:38:22,320 --> 00:38:27,200
the thinking off and let it go. 
So, so the question then is, OK,

673
00:38:27,200 --> 00:38:29,000
well, that sounds interesting. 
How do you do that, right? 

674
00:38:29,000 --> 00:38:34,080
Like what is a routine, right? 
Is it some guy out there like, 

675
00:38:34,120 --> 00:38:37,040
you know, flicking his waistband
and his hat around? 

676
00:38:37,200 --> 00:38:41,160
Is that a routine right? 
Because you you see that in all 

677
00:38:41,160 --> 00:38:42,720
these sports, right? 
People with like very 

678
00:38:42,720 --> 00:38:46,400
complicated pre shot routines 
Like do I need to have that? 

679
00:38:46,920 --> 00:38:49,360
Yeah, Yeah, yeah, right. 
I'm kind of making a joke. 

680
00:38:49,360 --> 00:38:50,720
To me the answer is obviously 
no. 

681
00:38:50,880 --> 00:38:53,360
Well, like Nomar Garcia, Para, 
you remember that guy? 

682
00:38:53,360 --> 00:38:55,280
Like I don't want to have to 
touch my wrist that much. 

683
00:38:55,280 --> 00:38:58,080
Yeah, exactly. 
But he's doing it for a reason. 

684
00:38:58,600 --> 00:39:01,000
OK? 
And The funny thing about 

685
00:39:01,000 --> 00:39:04,160
routine is like they'll mimic 
someone else's routine, but 

686
00:39:04,160 --> 00:39:06,800
they're but the person mimicking
doing isn't doing it for a 

687
00:39:06,800 --> 00:39:08,800
reason. 
I've so many interesting 

688
00:39:08,800 --> 00:39:12,120
examples of this, but what 
matters, so kind of what matters

689
00:39:12,120 --> 00:39:16,440
here though, is that the routine
has to meet certain objectives. 

690
00:39:16,440 --> 00:39:18,680
So let's talk about the first 
thing to realize is that 

691
00:39:19,080 --> 00:39:21,640
planning a shot is not routine. 
That's planning. 

692
00:39:21,920 --> 00:39:23,240
Planning is a conscious 
activity. 

693
00:39:23,720 --> 00:39:26,440
OK, so your routine doesn't even
really begin until once you've 

694
00:39:26,440 --> 00:39:28,880
stopped planning, right? 
You look at your golf shot, I 

695
00:39:28,880 --> 00:39:31,520
look at my targets, OK? 
Tennis doesn't really have any 

696
00:39:31,520 --> 00:39:33,280
planning, guys hitting the ball 
at you, right? 

697
00:39:33,640 --> 00:39:36,520
I make my plan and then the 
conscious part is now over. 

698
00:39:37,840 --> 00:39:41,000
Hopefully no more consciousness.
Then I would tell you. 

699
00:39:41,000 --> 00:39:42,920
There's kind of, now we're 
talking about routine. 

700
00:39:43,080 --> 00:39:45,360
There's kind of four big phases 
of routine. 

701
00:39:46,040 --> 00:39:49,920
The 1st is you have to 
physically get yourself set, OK?

702
00:39:50,680 --> 00:39:56,800
Clothes, glove, hat, glasses, 
your posture, OK, all of those 

703
00:39:56,800 --> 00:40:00,080
things you, your feet planted 
where you want them or you've 

704
00:40:00,080 --> 00:40:02,880
got to be physically set. 
Step one. 

705
00:40:04,320 --> 00:40:11,120
Step 2 begins and ends with some
sort of visualization of what 

706
00:40:11,120 --> 00:40:13,040
the shots going to be. 
Visualization is an interesting 

707
00:40:13,040 --> 00:40:15,280
thing in that. 
I think that is planning, no? 

708
00:40:15,920 --> 00:40:18,480
No, because a planning is is 
evaluative. 

709
00:40:18,640 --> 00:40:20,680
It has an evaluation aspect to 
it. 

710
00:40:20,920 --> 00:40:26,640
OK, so planning is I could start
my barrel at any of these spots.

711
00:40:26,640 --> 00:40:29,720
Which one is it going to be? 
I can plan to break the target 

712
00:40:29,720 --> 00:40:31,400
at any of these spots. 
Which one is it going to be? 

713
00:40:31,600 --> 00:40:34,360
There's an evaluation element to
planning. 

714
00:40:35,080 --> 00:40:40,640
Visualization is what am I going
to see and possibly even feel 

715
00:40:40,640 --> 00:40:45,120
with my body as I'm doing it. 
It's rehearsing the thing that 

716
00:40:45,120 --> 00:40:48,880
you've already evaluated. 
You do need, as you go from the 

717
00:40:48,880 --> 00:40:54,000
step one physical plant stuff 
into the visualization, you need

718
00:40:54,000 --> 00:40:57,320
to have a physical cue. 
OK, so this is actually how your

719
00:40:57,320 --> 00:41:00,920
body works. 
You can link physical activities

720
00:41:01,000 --> 00:41:02,480
to things that go on in your 
mind. 

721
00:41:02,840 --> 00:41:06,120
Doing the same thing over and 
over elicits the same thoughts, 

722
00:41:06,720 --> 00:41:09,760
right? 
Hopefully familiar, comfortable 

723
00:41:09,760 --> 00:41:11,800
thoughts. 
That's part of the routine. 

724
00:41:12,440 --> 00:41:16,120
So whatever that cue is, I can 
tell you it. 

725
00:41:16,120 --> 00:41:20,680
For me, once I've physically got
myself set up, as I'm putting 

726
00:41:20,680 --> 00:41:22,640
the shells in the gun, that's 
what I'm doing. 

727
00:41:22,640 --> 00:41:25,880
My visualization, Literally, as 
they're going in there, I'm 

728
00:41:25,880 --> 00:41:28,360
looking down at it, but I'm not 
thinking about putting the 

729
00:41:28,360 --> 00:41:31,080
shells in the gun. 
I'm thinking I'm visualizing the

730
00:41:31,080 --> 00:41:33,520
shot that I'm about to make. 
Visualization is a weird thing 

731
00:41:33,520 --> 00:41:37,600
in that for some people, it's a 
picture of what it's going to 

732
00:41:37,600 --> 00:41:40,760
look like at the moment of 
performance, right at the moment

733
00:41:40,760 --> 00:41:43,800
I pull the trigger. 
Sometimes for other people, it's

734
00:41:43,800 --> 00:41:46,640
a movie, like they see the shot 
coming together. 

735
00:41:47,720 --> 00:41:49,040
Different things work for 
different people. 

736
00:41:49,040 --> 00:41:50,480
You just got to figure out what 
that is for you. 

737
00:41:50,520 --> 00:41:52,320
Right? 
But I can tell you for sure that

738
00:41:52,320 --> 00:41:55,120
you must take the visualization 
box somehow. 

739
00:41:55,440 --> 00:41:57,000
OK. 
And then at the end of the 

740
00:41:57,000 --> 00:42:00,280
visualization comes another 
trigger that tells you it's time

741
00:42:00,280 --> 00:42:04,560
to go to the next phase, which 
is the actual unconscious 

742
00:42:04,560 --> 00:42:07,520
performance. 
Now, you asked me when we had 

743
00:42:07,520 --> 00:42:09,880
lunch, you know, do you need, do
any of these need to be a fixed 

744
00:42:09,880 --> 00:42:12,040
amount of time? 
The answer to that question is 

745
00:42:12,040 --> 00:42:17,640
no, except this part from the 
time, whatever your cue is to go

746
00:42:17,640 --> 00:42:21,000
from phase two, your 
visualization to phase three 

747
00:42:21,000 --> 00:42:24,400
execution, that needs to be the 
same amount of time every time. 

748
00:42:25,040 --> 00:42:28,240
And what that cue is for you 
again, you have to decide. 

749
00:42:28,920 --> 00:42:30,440
But I can tell you it has to be 
something. 

750
00:42:30,760 --> 00:42:34,000
So for me, I finish visualize 
and then I I shoot an over under

751
00:42:34,000 --> 00:42:35,560
shotgun. 
I close it. 

752
00:42:36,120 --> 00:42:38,320
That's the cue that it's now 
time to perform. 

753
00:42:39,240 --> 00:42:43,120
And there is a fixed amount of 
time between when I close that 

754
00:42:43,440 --> 00:42:45,600
gun and when I call pole for the
target. 

755
00:42:45,880 --> 00:42:49,200
Every single time. 
It's extremely consistent. 

756
00:42:50,320 --> 00:42:55,160
The purpose of that is that you,
you want it to be consistent. 

757
00:42:55,160 --> 00:42:57,280
The reason that has to be a 
fixed amount of time, it's 

758
00:42:57,280 --> 00:42:59,400
because you've made your plan. 
You've got yourself set. 

759
00:42:59,400 --> 00:43:00,840
You visualize what you're going 
to do. 

760
00:43:02,240 --> 00:43:06,280
This is now the point where 
unconscious thought popping in 

761
00:43:06,280 --> 00:43:09,320
is the most destructive. 
You've decided what you want to 

762
00:43:09,320 --> 00:43:10,840
do. 
You've loaded yourself up for 

763
00:43:10,840 --> 00:43:12,640
it. 
Now you just need to do it. 

764
00:43:12,640 --> 00:43:16,120
No more evaluation, right? 
Evaluation right here is where 

765
00:43:16,120 --> 00:43:18,280
people really get in trouble, 
right? 

766
00:43:18,360 --> 00:43:20,520
You might as well not even have 
the routine if you're going to 

767
00:43:20,520 --> 00:43:23,520
go start evaluating again after 
you've done all this work like 

768
00:43:23,520 --> 00:43:26,800
for, you know, in my world. 
So people they get ready and 

769
00:43:26,920 --> 00:43:29,680
they've kind of done all these 
things and now they're staring 

770
00:43:29,680 --> 00:43:33,040
out into the field And I just 
thought I like, no good can come

771
00:43:33,040 --> 00:43:35,320
of that, right? 
Or imagine you, you set up your 

772
00:43:35,320 --> 00:43:38,400
goal shot, you're standing over 
the ball and you're just staring

773
00:43:38,400 --> 00:43:40,400
at it. 
Why? 

774
00:43:40,800 --> 00:43:44,640
Like the only thing that can 
happen is unproductive thoughts 

775
00:43:44,640 --> 00:43:46,440
popping up into your mind, 
right? 

776
00:43:46,920 --> 00:43:49,560
So if you have this fixed amount
of time between your queue, I 

777
00:43:49,560 --> 00:43:52,520
close the gun and the time I and
my execution, I call for the 

778
00:43:52,520 --> 00:43:55,920
target. 
That helps you that it helps 

779
00:43:55,920 --> 00:43:58,520
mitigate these unconscious 
thoughts from popping in. 

780
00:43:58,800 --> 00:44:01,360
Then phase three is hopefully an
unconscious execution. 

781
00:44:01,520 --> 00:44:03,400
I've called for the target. 
I'm going to make my move. 

782
00:44:03,400 --> 00:44:05,080
I'm going to pull the trigger, 
I'm going to break it or not. 

783
00:44:05,600 --> 00:44:09,160
And then there's this optional 
4th stage, which is if it 

784
00:44:09,160 --> 00:44:13,160
doesn't go as you planned, OK, 
if I didn't hit the target or 

785
00:44:13,680 --> 00:44:16,320
you know, I felt something went 
wrong that I didn't like, I 

786
00:44:16,320 --> 00:44:18,720
potentially have to do some more
planning. 

787
00:44:18,720 --> 00:44:22,160
Now I potentially have to go 
back into, make some 

788
00:44:22,160 --> 00:44:25,480
evaluations, reset my plan, and 
then I go back to my 

789
00:44:25,480 --> 00:44:28,080
visualization. 
So that's the framework and 

790
00:44:28,080 --> 00:44:30,000
those are the steps that you're 
going to have to go through 

791
00:44:30,840 --> 00:44:34,200
planning conscious part, you 
know, that's the first thing. 

792
00:44:34,200 --> 00:44:36,800
And then once you have a plan, 
get yourself set, there's going 

793
00:44:36,800 --> 00:44:39,760
to have to be some visualization
and then an execution and then 

794
00:44:39,760 --> 00:44:41,600
an optional re evaluation if you
need it. 

795
00:44:41,840 --> 00:44:45,560
And before looping back to that 
visualization and you've got it.

796
00:44:45,600 --> 00:44:47,080
And then you and you've got to 
have some cues. 

797
00:44:47,080 --> 00:44:51,000
You got to tell your body it's 
it's time to move from one phase

798
00:44:51,000 --> 00:44:53,280
to the next with a physical 
movement. 

799
00:44:53,480 --> 00:44:56,240
OK, because, and, and that's 
important because that physical 

800
00:44:56,240 --> 00:45:00,160
movement will help, that will 
help train your mind to follow 

801
00:45:00,160 --> 00:45:03,920
this process all the time. 
And if you take all these boxes 

802
00:45:03,920 --> 00:45:06,800
and you go out and you practice 
your routine. 

803
00:45:06,800 --> 00:45:08,840
So this is kind of another wild 
thing about practice. 

804
00:45:09,400 --> 00:45:11,600
There's skill building practice,
which is always that we've 

805
00:45:11,600 --> 00:45:13,680
talked about conscious, right? 
Like I'm, I'm kind of 

806
00:45:13,680 --> 00:45:15,640
consciously evaluating what I 
want to do. 

807
00:45:16,680 --> 00:45:19,120
But then there's execution 
practice, which is I'm just 

808
00:45:19,120 --> 00:45:22,320
going to go out and actually run
my routine as if I were 

809
00:45:22,320 --> 00:45:25,040
performing. 
Now it's not as good as, as if 

810
00:45:25,040 --> 00:45:28,240
you were performing because 
there's no pressure, but you're 

811
00:45:28,240 --> 00:45:32,040
actually practicing your 
routine, right, which is a 

812
00:45:32,040 --> 00:45:35,080
second kind of practice and, and
a very important kind of 

813
00:45:35,080 --> 00:45:36,680
practice. 
And you can go do that. 

814
00:45:36,680 --> 00:45:40,480
You can go to the, you can go to
the range and, and have a plan 

815
00:45:40,560 --> 00:45:43,040
for that practice session of 
having no skill building. 

816
00:45:43,280 --> 00:45:47,680
I'm only going to work on my 
routine and smooth my routine 

817
00:45:47,680 --> 00:45:49,120
out and be comfortable in my 
routine. 

818
00:45:49,400 --> 00:45:52,280
And that is a worthwhile and 
important goal. 

819
00:45:52,280 --> 00:45:55,000
And I, I think very, very few 
people do it. 

820
00:45:55,480 --> 00:46:00,120
And as you do that, you can kind
of make that better by trying to

821
00:46:00,120 --> 00:46:03,200
introduce some stress, right? 
So if I've turned up at my, for 

822
00:46:03,200 --> 00:46:06,040
my practice session and my goal 
that day is to practice working 

823
00:46:06,040 --> 00:46:10,320
through my routine, you can do 
things to try and put some 

824
00:46:10,320 --> 00:46:12,840
pressure on it to simulate 
competition. 

825
00:46:13,360 --> 00:46:15,640
So for example, one of the 
things that in the shooting 

826
00:46:15,640 --> 00:46:21,080
world that we'll do is I'll take
some not super hard, but middle 

827
00:46:21,080 --> 00:46:23,160
difficulty to upper middle 
difficulty target. 

828
00:46:23,560 --> 00:46:27,000
And I'll just stand there until 
I can hit ten of them in a row. 

829
00:46:27,760 --> 00:46:29,960
Not just hit ten of them in a 
row, but hit ten of them in a 

830
00:46:29,960 --> 00:46:32,680
row in my process. 
OK. 

831
00:46:34,000 --> 00:46:36,320
And you want to talk about the 
confidence you can get from that

832
00:46:37,360 --> 00:46:40,320
now? 
Like you're building confidence 

833
00:46:40,320 --> 00:46:42,920
in a belief that you can do it 
under pressure. 

834
00:46:42,920 --> 00:46:44,920
It's still not as good as 
actually having to do it for a 

835
00:46:44,920 --> 00:46:51,480
score under real pressure, but 
as you get to 7 or 8 becomes 

836
00:46:51,480 --> 00:46:53,920
harder to hit the 9th, it 
becomes harder to hit the 10th 

837
00:46:54,400 --> 00:46:56,320
right. 
Yeah, because you're like, if I 

838
00:46:56,320 --> 00:46:59,200
don't hit this I got to go back 
to 1 and I don't want Steve gear

839
00:46:59,200 --> 00:47:00,920
all day. 
Like do you know how many, how 

840
00:47:00,920 --> 00:47:04,960
many times I've been out at the 
range and I just want to go 

841
00:47:04,960 --> 00:47:06,960
home? 
I've been out there for 2-3 

842
00:47:06,960 --> 00:47:10,000
hours, you know, I've shot 67800
targets. 

843
00:47:10,000 --> 00:47:14,680
I want to go home and I can't 
get the 10th 1:00 and I've and 

844
00:47:14,680 --> 00:47:18,680
I've, and I've done it now 567 
times I've gone, I've gone 

845
00:47:18,680 --> 00:47:22,000
through four boxes to try and 
get that 10th target right. 

846
00:47:22,480 --> 00:47:24,840
Like the pressure that that 
creates. 

847
00:47:25,200 --> 00:47:27,520
And you could, you can imagine 
doing the same thing with golf 

848
00:47:27,520 --> 00:47:29,840
right on the range, trying, 
trying to put it on the, on the 

849
00:47:29,840 --> 00:47:31,640
practice target. 
You know, the, on the pin that's

850
00:47:31,640 --> 00:47:34,120
out there, right? 
The pressure that that builds 

851
00:47:35,120 --> 00:47:39,600
not only helps you do it under 
pressure, but it makes you more 

852
00:47:39,600 --> 00:47:41,840
comfortable with the pressure 
when it shows up in a 

853
00:47:41,840 --> 00:47:44,840
competition. 
I was in a lesson one time and 

854
00:47:44,840 --> 00:47:47,360
the guy that I take lessons 
from, Anthony Matarese, you 

855
00:47:47,360 --> 00:47:52,520
know, widely, I think viewed as 
the, you know, the kind of the 

856
00:47:52,520 --> 00:47:55,280
preeminent shotgun instructor in
the United States, if not the 

857
00:47:55,280 --> 00:47:58,240
world. 
We were shooting as kind of very

858
00:47:58,480 --> 00:48:02,680
delicate, slow off speed target.
And he said to me, he goes, you 

859
00:48:02,680 --> 00:48:05,400
know, because that's a good 
target. 

860
00:48:05,400 --> 00:48:07,280
You should just be able to come 
out here and hit twenty holes in

861
00:48:07,280 --> 00:48:09,200
a row. 
Well, after my lesson, I went 

862
00:48:09,200 --> 00:48:12,280
back there and try to do it. 
I could get 14, but I couldn't 

863
00:48:12,280 --> 00:48:14,520
get 20. 
I just got I, I tapped out like 

864
00:48:14,520 --> 00:48:17,400
I, I mean, literally shot all 
the ammo in my car trying to do 

865
00:48:17,400 --> 00:48:19,800
it. 
So I'm back in the clubhouse 

866
00:48:20,880 --> 00:48:23,440
afterwards and he's like, yeah, 
I saw you out there. 

867
00:48:24,000 --> 00:48:25,880
Still at, still at that same 
one. 

868
00:48:26,200 --> 00:48:27,840
I said, yeah. 
I said, listen, I was trying to 

869
00:48:27,840 --> 00:48:29,520
get 20 in a row. 
I said I got 14. 

870
00:48:29,520 --> 00:48:31,120
I didn't get 20. 
And he didn't laugh at me. 

871
00:48:31,120 --> 00:48:33,280
He goes, he's like, oh, you 
actually tried to do that? 

872
00:48:33,280 --> 00:48:35,440
He's like, that's kind of crazy.
He's like, I can do twenty of 

873
00:48:35,440 --> 00:48:37,440
those, but I do it in my mind. 
Little different. 

874
00:48:37,440 --> 00:48:39,400
Little different but. 
He's also at a much higher level

875
00:48:39,400 --> 00:48:43,920
than I am, so there's real value
in that sort of practice, but it

876
00:48:43,920 --> 00:48:48,600
takes some real grit to be able 
to turn up and do it right. 

877
00:48:49,080 --> 00:48:55,040
And that's a long way away from 
practicing skill building, which

878
00:48:55,040 --> 00:48:57,560
is a long way away from just 
trying to show up and hit some 

879
00:48:57,560 --> 00:49:00,760
ball straight right. 
Yeah, I don't know if you deal 

880
00:49:00,760 --> 00:49:03,240
with this in shooting. 
The other thing that I that I 

881
00:49:03,240 --> 00:49:07,160
find is I missed 2-3 footers 
yesterday. 

882
00:49:07,840 --> 00:49:11,400
That the first one I kind of 
pushed and that one doesn't 

883
00:49:11,400 --> 00:49:13,800
drive me nuts. 
But the second one it was on the

884
00:49:13,800 --> 00:49:17,680
very next hole and it was a hard
breaker right to left and it was

885
00:49:17,680 --> 00:49:24,440
downhill and I just like hit it 
like such a Pansy that it broke 

886
00:49:24,440 --> 00:49:26,680
across the face of the hole and 
I missed it. 

887
00:49:27,440 --> 00:49:29,600
And I said to the guys I was 
playing with, I was like, I 

888
00:49:29,600 --> 00:49:36,040
don't know why my mind is 
comfortable missing a shot by 

889
00:49:36,040 --> 00:49:40,120
under hitting it, but I'm not 
comfortable being firm. 

890
00:49:40,120 --> 00:49:43,360
Now the answer is one way I have
a tap in for five and the other 

891
00:49:43,360 --> 00:49:45,360
way I have like a four footer 
coming back. 

892
00:49:45,360 --> 00:49:47,760
And that's I don't want a four 
footer coming back. 

893
00:49:48,360 --> 00:49:51,520
But I think it's, I think it's 
interesting. 

894
00:49:52,080 --> 00:49:57,720
I don't know why at certain 
points like just a moment of 

895
00:49:57,720 --> 00:50:02,800
doubt will creep in and create 
such a bad result, like right 

896
00:50:02,800 --> 00:50:05,840
before pulling the trigger. 
There's there's a couple things 

897
00:50:05,840 --> 00:50:09,600
I I would say there. 
The 1st is that you were afraid.

898
00:50:10,880 --> 00:50:13,320
You had some fear at some level,
conscious or not. 

899
00:50:13,400 --> 00:50:15,560
Yeah, which makes no sense. 
Like it doesn't fucking matter. 

900
00:50:15,880 --> 00:50:19,560
But there was some fear. 
Anytime you're competing and you

901
00:50:19,560 --> 00:50:24,600
have any sort of fear about a 
shot whatever at the end of the 

902
00:50:24,600 --> 00:50:26,120
round, you need to go write that
down. 

903
00:50:27,840 --> 00:50:32,840
And I keep idle journal, OK? 
And I write about all my 

904
00:50:32,840 --> 00:50:35,480
competitions in there. 
And the most important thing 

905
00:50:35,480 --> 00:50:38,880
that I write in that journal is 
when I was afraid of something. 

906
00:50:39,160 --> 00:50:41,880
Because when you're afraid of 
something in competition, that's

907
00:50:41,880 --> 00:50:44,720
the first thing that you should 
go practice, OK? 

908
00:50:45,560 --> 00:50:48,960
Interesting. 
So you were afraid of it for a 

909
00:50:48,960 --> 00:50:51,800
reason. 
Now you would just missed a pot 

910
00:50:51,800 --> 00:50:54,920
on the previous hole. 
So maybe you were a little 

911
00:50:54,920 --> 00:50:56,920
careful. 
So we talked about one thing. 

912
00:50:56,920 --> 00:50:59,800
We talked about shooting is the 
difference between careful and 

913
00:50:59,800 --> 00:51:04,240
careless missing. 
When you're a developing shooter

914
00:51:04,640 --> 00:51:09,600
golfer, it's probably a little 
better that you have careful 

915
00:51:09,600 --> 00:51:13,160
misses because you're still kind
of in the skill accumulation 

916
00:51:13,160 --> 00:51:15,000
phase, right? 
What you need is lots of 

917
00:51:15,000 --> 00:51:16,800
repetition. 
You're trying to build skill and

918
00:51:17,280 --> 00:51:23,160
you know, I don't mind a careful
miss at that stage. 

919
00:51:24,480 --> 00:51:28,160
You don't want to be careless 
when you're developing because 

920
00:51:28,160 --> 00:51:30,320
you don't know what you're 
doing, right? 

921
00:51:30,320 --> 00:51:31,880
You don't, You're not just you 
don't want to be throwing the 

922
00:51:31,880 --> 00:51:34,680
gun around and throwing the club
around like, you know, careless 

923
00:51:34,680 --> 00:51:36,120
is a real problem when you're 
developing. 

924
00:51:36,600 --> 00:51:38,760
Interestingly, that inverts when
you get good. 

925
00:51:39,440 --> 00:51:44,960
OK, now being care careless. 
I would rather see an 

926
00:51:44,960 --> 00:51:48,960
experienced person have careless
misses because it means that 

927
00:51:48,960 --> 00:51:52,640
they aired a little bit more 
towards trusting their process 

928
00:51:53,720 --> 00:51:58,640
versus a careful mess. 
Probably meant that you weren't 

929
00:51:58,640 --> 00:52:00,960
trusting your process. 
Yeah, that makes sense. 

930
00:52:00,960 --> 00:52:05,360
So a care, a careless miss is 
almost, if anything, it's it's 

931
00:52:05,360 --> 00:52:08,680
a, it's a byproduct of maybe 
overconfidence bias, but at 

932
00:52:08,680 --> 00:52:11,080
least it's an earned right when 
you're good. 

933
00:52:11,160 --> 00:52:16,040
Well, I wouldn't, I understand 
why you say that, but I think 

934
00:52:16,040 --> 00:52:20,320
that what it really comes down 
to is the difference between 

935
00:52:20,320 --> 00:52:23,720
being, I can tell you what the 
numbers are in shooting because 

936
00:52:23,720 --> 00:52:25,840
I know I've experienced them. 
I don't know what they are in 

937
00:52:25,840 --> 00:52:28,920
goal in shooting. 
The difference between being an 

938
00:52:28,920 --> 00:52:37,040
80% shooter and an 88% shooter, 
well, that's too wide between an

939
00:52:37,040 --> 00:52:42,160
84% shooter and an 88% shooter. 
OK, those four targets, that's 

940
00:52:42,160 --> 00:52:45,000
trust. 
You're not breaking 84% without 

941
00:52:45,440 --> 00:52:48,000
most of the required techniques 
to be able to do it. 

942
00:52:48,760 --> 00:52:51,200
You're going to get the next 4 
by being able to trust that you 

943
00:52:51,200 --> 00:52:54,720
can do them under pressure. 
Where are you 87? 

944
00:52:54,720 --> 00:52:56,560
I changed my I started wearing 
glasses last year. 

945
00:52:56,560 --> 00:52:58,560
I had a weird year but I tried 
87% last year. 

946
00:52:59,040 --> 00:53:02,040
What's like elite, elite, elite?
91. 

947
00:53:03,120 --> 00:53:05,720
So. 
So what's that delta between 87 

948
00:53:05,720 --> 00:53:07,720
and 91? 
How wide is that gap? 

949
00:53:08,120 --> 00:53:11,200
It's a lot. 
It's a lot of experience, but 

950
00:53:11,200 --> 00:53:14,000
specifically not necessarily 
experienced with targets, 

951
00:53:14,000 --> 00:53:18,080
experience with pressure. 
It's how you cope with pressure 

952
00:53:18,680 --> 00:53:24,480
and how good you can be with 
trusting the skills that you 

953
00:53:24,480 --> 00:53:25,840
have. 
And this is kind of where I'm 

954
00:53:25,840 --> 00:53:28,040
going, right? 
The reason that I want you to 

955
00:53:28,040 --> 00:53:30,480
write the fear down in the 
journal is that so you go 

956
00:53:30,480 --> 00:53:33,360
practice the things that you're 
scared of so that you have more 

957
00:53:33,360 --> 00:53:36,960
confidence about them so that 
you have a chance of trusting it

958
00:53:36,960 --> 00:53:40,640
more, right? 
So the best shooter in the 

959
00:53:40,640 --> 00:53:42,440
United States right now is guy 
named Brandon Powell. 

960
00:53:42,440 --> 00:53:49,480
Brandon says all the time in 
interviews that he lets his 

961
00:53:49,480 --> 00:53:55,880
trust run so far that he 
believes that he probably misses

962
00:53:55,880 --> 00:53:58,480
a few because he trusted it too 
much. 

963
00:53:58,920 --> 00:54:04,600
But that's still better than 
than if he didn't do that, If he

964
00:54:04,600 --> 00:54:08,120
started to get a little careful 
and it went wrong, probably miss

965
00:54:08,120 --> 00:54:10,720
more. 
So the problem with really 

966
00:54:11,000 --> 00:54:13,840
getting the trust up is that you
feel like it might betray you, 

967
00:54:14,720 --> 00:54:17,400
right? 
But I think the truth of the 

968
00:54:17,400 --> 00:54:21,920
matter is not trusting your 
unconscious execution, not 

969
00:54:21,920 --> 00:54:24,480
trusting your conscious 
execution conditioned on the 

970
00:54:24,480 --> 00:54:26,000
fact you've actually done the 
skill building. 

971
00:54:26,000 --> 00:54:27,680
And I'm, I want to, that's 
really important. 

972
00:54:27,680 --> 00:54:29,800
I want to come back to that. 
Assuming you've done the skill 

973
00:54:29,800 --> 00:54:31,920
building, not trusting your 
conscious execution is a far 

974
00:54:31,920 --> 00:54:35,080
bigger mistake, right, than 
being careful. 

975
00:54:35,200 --> 00:54:36,880
And that that's Brandon's point,
right? 

976
00:54:37,160 --> 00:54:40,960
Like, look, I might miss one 
that people think is silly, but 

977
00:54:40,960 --> 00:54:42,600
I ain't going to be. 
But still, I'm still going to 

978
00:54:42,600 --> 00:54:44,760
have more than everybody else, 
right? 

979
00:54:45,280 --> 00:54:48,160
And he did and he asked for the 
last for the last few years, 

980
00:54:48,480 --> 00:54:50,400
which brings me out. 
Just as a little side note, 

981
00:54:51,000 --> 00:54:53,840
there's a lot of like bad advice
out there. 

982
00:54:54,000 --> 00:54:57,720
And I'm, I don't know what the 
golf analogies are, but I can 

983
00:54:57,720 --> 00:55:00,560
give you, I'm sure you, if I 
tell you the shooting 1 you 

984
00:55:00,560 --> 00:55:02,200
could probably find in the 
ollies 1. 

985
00:55:02,920 --> 00:55:09,240
I hear people say all the time, 
well, just look at the target. 

986
00:55:09,240 --> 00:55:12,000
If you just look hard at the 
target, it's going to your 

987
00:55:12,000 --> 00:55:15,000
body's going to sort itself out,
right? 

988
00:55:15,000 --> 00:55:17,920
And you hear all this quite 
crazy stuff, like you got to see

989
00:55:17,920 --> 00:55:20,760
like, you know, little dark 
spots and detail on the target 

990
00:55:20,760 --> 00:55:22,520
and, you know, stare a hole 
through the target. 

991
00:55:22,520 --> 00:55:24,200
I hear all. 
Yeah, aim small, miss small 

992
00:55:24,200 --> 00:55:25,880
types. 
I hear all this stuff, OK? 

993
00:55:26,440 --> 00:55:29,600
And the thing about it is that 
it's not totally wrong. 

994
00:55:29,640 --> 00:55:34,000
You do need to look acutely at 
the target, but there's a 

995
00:55:34,000 --> 00:55:37,480
difference between visual 
acuity, the detail that you see,

996
00:55:37,920 --> 00:55:41,840
and visual discipline, which is 
the process of keeping your eye 

997
00:55:41,880 --> 00:55:45,240
on the target. 
OK, but see, none of that 

998
00:55:45,240 --> 00:55:49,040
matters if you haven't built the
skill to be able to execute the 

999
00:55:49,040 --> 00:55:52,840
movement. 
So you can go up to a guy that 

1000
00:55:52,840 --> 00:55:56,920
has five 6000 tournament targets
or experience and you can tell 

1001
00:55:56,920 --> 00:55:59,280
him to look at the target until 
you're blue in the face, he's 

1002
00:55:59,280 --> 00:56:02,600
still going to miss. 
So all of this. 

1003
00:56:02,600 --> 00:56:03,400
Stuff. 
Why is that? 

1004
00:56:03,400 --> 00:56:05,600
He just doesn't have enough 
experience, Yeah. 

1005
00:56:05,680 --> 00:56:07,360
Right. 
His body doesn't know what it 

1006
00:56:07,360 --> 00:56:10,200
feels like to make the moves. 
He's not. 

1007
00:56:10,440 --> 00:56:11,880
He's going to. 
He gets up. 

1008
00:56:11,920 --> 00:56:15,120
There's this in shooting sports,
in archery and kind of 

1009
00:56:15,120 --> 00:56:17,160
everything involving shooting, 
not just shotguns. 

1010
00:56:17,480 --> 00:56:19,160
There's this concept called 
target panic. 

1011
00:56:19,720 --> 00:56:22,840
Target panic is basically when 
you you kind of come close to 

1012
00:56:22,840 --> 00:56:24,480
the moment of pulling the 
trigger and freak out a little 

1013
00:56:24,480 --> 00:56:27,680
bit, right? 
Yeah, dude, it's like when I'm 

1014
00:56:27,680 --> 00:56:30,240
on the tee and I'm trying to hit
a cut, right before I pull it 

1015
00:56:30,240 --> 00:56:32,840
back, I say don't double cross 
this and hook it, and then I do 

1016
00:56:32,840 --> 00:56:35,120
that well. 
OK. 

1017
00:56:35,120 --> 00:56:38,000
Interestingly, yeah, that's 
related. 

1018
00:56:38,240 --> 00:56:42,720
But the way that we get rid of 
that, though, is by filling our 

1019
00:56:42,720 --> 00:56:45,680
conscious mind with our routine,
right? 

1020
00:56:45,680 --> 00:56:48,640
Keeping your conscious mind 
occupied on that visualization, 

1021
00:56:48,880 --> 00:56:50,360
you have your cue, and then 
you're off. 

1022
00:56:50,520 --> 00:56:52,600
That's the whole point of that 
fixed amount of time is to get 

1023
00:56:52,600 --> 00:56:55,480
rid of exactly what you just 
described now. 

1024
00:56:55,480 --> 00:56:58,160
Those if it creeps in though, 
like in shooting, can you 

1025
00:56:58,160 --> 00:56:59,760
restart your routine, start 
over? 

1026
00:56:59,760 --> 00:57:01,680
Yeah, yeah. 
That's what you need to do is 

1027
00:57:01,680 --> 00:57:05,760
just stop and do it again. 
So on Sunday I was on a very 

1028
00:57:05,760 --> 00:57:08,960
high score. 
I'm on the last stand of 14. 

1029
00:57:09,400 --> 00:57:12,840
The last pair I've dropped five 
targets. 

1030
00:57:12,840 --> 00:57:15,600
OK, so if I hit these next two 
targets, I will have shot 95 out

1031
00:57:15,600 --> 00:57:18,400
of 100. 
I'm I've already hit there's it 

1032
00:57:18,400 --> 00:57:21,040
was a four pair stand. 
I've already hit three pairs. 

1033
00:57:21,040 --> 00:57:22,160
I've just got to hit the last 
pair. 

1034
00:57:22,320 --> 00:57:24,360
So there's no doubt I can 
physically do it. 

1035
00:57:24,360 --> 00:57:27,520
It's just a question of can I 
keep my shit together long 

1036
00:57:27,520 --> 00:57:30,200
enough to hit the last two? 
I'm in my routine. 

1037
00:57:31,440 --> 00:57:35,840
I'm as I'm closing the gun for 
whatever reason, a cart goes 

1038
00:57:35,840 --> 00:57:38,840
behind the stand and it caught 
my attention. 

1039
00:57:39,560 --> 00:57:44,040
OK, now the weird thing about 
distractions. 

1040
00:57:44,560 --> 00:57:48,240
You can actually perform 
distracted, but what you can't 

1041
00:57:48,240 --> 00:57:52,200
do is perform while thinking 
about if you're distracted. 

1042
00:57:53,000 --> 00:57:56,000
See the difference? 
Yes, the second one is 

1043
00:57:56,000 --> 00:57:58,640
conscious, right? 
The first one is not. 

1044
00:57:59,040 --> 00:58:00,600
There I know. 
It's kind of why if you have 

1045
00:58:00,600 --> 00:58:04,560
like a consistent noise in the 
background, not such a problem. 

1046
00:58:05,000 --> 00:58:09,440
But to your point, like a cart 
disrupting silence, it is 

1047
00:58:09,440 --> 00:58:10,280
different. 
Hearts. 

1048
00:58:10,280 --> 00:58:12,600
I mean, look, gun ranges are 
busy places. 

1049
00:58:12,960 --> 00:58:14,720
There's crap going on behind the
stand all the time. 

1050
00:58:15,600 --> 00:58:18,760
Most of the time I like, I don't
even hear it. 

1051
00:58:19,800 --> 00:58:22,640
But The funny thing about your 
perception is that sometimes 

1052
00:58:22,640 --> 00:58:24,520
these things grab. 
There's a difference between 

1053
00:58:24,520 --> 00:58:27,320
perception and attention. 
I can perceive something but not

1054
00:58:27,320 --> 00:58:30,200
pay attention to it, right? 
Like I'm aware that there's a 

1055
00:58:30,200 --> 00:58:31,880
window over here and there's 
trees and there's wind, but I'm 

1056
00:58:31,880 --> 00:58:33,400
not paying attention to them, 
right? 

1057
00:58:34,000 --> 00:58:37,440
So whatever reason that cart, 
not only I perceived it and it 

1058
00:58:37,440 --> 00:58:40,520
got my attention and literally I
opened the gun. 

1059
00:58:40,800 --> 00:58:44,400
I even took the shells out. 
OK, I took the shells out. 

1060
00:58:44,400 --> 00:58:48,120
I put them back in my pocket. 
I moved my feet, I looked at the

1061
00:58:48,120 --> 00:58:51,800
trap and I said, sorry, cart got
just got in my head. 

1062
00:58:51,840 --> 00:58:55,560
I'm I'm just going to restart. 
And I went through my whole 

1063
00:58:55,560 --> 00:58:57,400
routine again. 
I replanned my feet. 

1064
00:58:57,400 --> 00:59:00,000
I got my body and shoulders and 
everywhere where I was 

1065
00:59:00,000 --> 00:59:02,480
comfortable, I put shells back 
in. 

1066
00:59:02,480 --> 00:59:04,960
I visualized close the gun, call
for it. 

1067
00:59:04,960 --> 00:59:08,680
Senator, I'm shot in 95. 
I will tell you I've been in 

1068
00:59:08,680 --> 00:59:14,960
that situation a lot of times 
where I didn't reset and I want 

1069
00:59:14,960 --> 00:59:18,640
I don't have the data, but 
easily more than 50% of the time

1070
00:59:18,640 --> 00:59:22,600
I'm not. 
I don't get it done if I just 

1071
00:59:22,600 --> 00:59:24,160
try to force through the 
distraction. 

1072
00:59:24,480 --> 00:59:28,800
And the big difference is I can 
tell you that for me, when a 

1073
00:59:28,800 --> 00:59:34,840
distraction occurs, if I catch 
myself thinking about if I'm 

1074
00:59:34,840 --> 00:59:37,760
distracted and even the 
slightest degree, automatic 

1075
00:59:37,760 --> 00:59:40,160
restart. 
Yeah, well, that thought to the 

1076
00:59:40,160 --> 00:59:43,760
earliest comment that you made 
about we're all sort of chasing 

1077
00:59:44,040 --> 00:59:47,880
the edge of subconsciousness. 
The second something enters your

1078
00:59:47,880 --> 00:59:50,760
conscious mind, you are out of 
the other state, and the other 

1079
00:59:50,760 --> 00:59:52,600
state is actually the 
performance state. 

1080
00:59:53,560 --> 00:59:56,440
No doubt. 
And The thing is that once you 

1081
00:59:56,440 --> 00:59:59,720
can actually kind of fall into 
this unconscious performance 

1082
00:59:59,720 --> 01:00:01,280
state by accident every once in 
a while. 

1083
01:00:01,480 --> 01:00:04,640
So that's why when the guy, you 
know, when the guy that's 

1084
01:00:04,640 --> 01:00:08,040
usually shooting 95 every once 
in a while shoots 82, but he 

1085
01:00:08,040 --> 01:00:09,280
kind of fell into it by 
accident. 

1086
01:00:09,520 --> 01:00:11,920
Who knows why or how he got 
there, right? 

1087
01:00:12,520 --> 01:00:16,040
We we don't know, but he got in 
there and he was performing. 

1088
01:00:16,040 --> 01:00:18,680
So he stayed confident 
throughout the whole period and 

1089
01:00:18,680 --> 01:00:21,040
he and he got it done, but he 
doesn't know how to replicate 

1090
01:00:21,040 --> 01:00:22,760
it, right. 
So one of the things my coach 

1091
01:00:22,760 --> 01:00:25,800
Anthony often says is, you know,
it's one thing. 

1092
01:00:26,280 --> 01:00:28,800
To be performing well when 
you're on the good side of the 

1093
01:00:28,800 --> 01:00:31,880
confidence curve. 
The question is, and the thing 

1094
01:00:31,880 --> 01:00:34,760
that separates the long term 
winners from everybody else, 

1095
01:00:35,360 --> 01:00:38,360
what are you going to do when 
you're on the wrong side of the 

1096
01:00:38,360 --> 01:00:41,400
conference curve? 
How do you take a, how do you 

1097
01:00:41,520 --> 01:00:44,480
stop that? 
That meltdown that we talked 

1098
01:00:44,480 --> 01:00:47,280
about, that meltdown process 
that we talked about earlier, 

1099
01:00:47,400 --> 01:00:50,280
How do you stop that? 
And you know, you're not going 

1100
01:00:50,280 --> 01:00:53,280
to perform your best on your 
day, but you can save it. 

1101
01:00:53,680 --> 01:00:55,640
OK. 
On Saturday, I actually, I 

1102
01:00:55,640 --> 01:00:58,360
wasn't feeling that well. 
I was having trouble keeping my 

1103
01:00:58,360 --> 01:01:02,520
eye on the target. 
I still scrapped out 86, right? 

1104
01:01:02,520 --> 01:01:04,360
Not not a good score for that 
course. 

1105
01:01:04,800 --> 01:01:08,040
Kept me off the podium despite 
shooting very well the next day.

1106
01:01:08,600 --> 01:01:12,600
But I still finished tied for 
fourteen in the overall event of

1107
01:01:12,600 --> 01:01:16,280
400 plus. 
OK, if I would have let the 

1108
01:01:16,280 --> 01:01:21,040
Saturday go into a meltdown, you
know, now, who knows, right? 

1109
01:01:21,360 --> 01:01:23,080
And I could have been in the 
middle of the whole field, 

1110
01:01:23,640 --> 01:01:26,160
right? 
So the question is, what are you

1111
01:01:26,160 --> 01:01:30,840
going to do when it's not going 
well, right? 

1112
01:01:31,320 --> 01:01:33,520
And the answer is, you know, you
got to have a plan. 

1113
01:01:33,640 --> 01:01:36,800
We've just spent an hour talking
about the plan is I have a 

1114
01:01:36,800 --> 01:01:39,200
routine, right? 
I have this thing that insulates

1115
01:01:39,200 --> 01:01:41,480
my unconscious behavior to the 
best of my ability. 

1116
01:01:42,200 --> 01:01:45,720
Have you found any correlation 
between? 

1117
01:01:45,720 --> 01:01:49,000
I know that you've said that a 
routine can be any amount of 

1118
01:01:49,000 --> 01:01:53,680
time, but have you found a 
correlation between like like 

1119
01:01:53,680 --> 01:01:56,360
something? 
My bias would be to say that a 

1120
01:01:56,360 --> 01:02:00,040
shorter routine is better 
because there's just fewer 

1121
01:02:00,040 --> 01:02:02,840
seconds for your conscious mind 
to take over. 

1122
01:02:02,840 --> 01:02:05,160
I would agree with you. 
For me, that's the case. 

1123
01:02:06,200 --> 01:02:08,480
And if you watch shooting is 
interesting because we have lots

1124
01:02:08,480 --> 01:02:12,480
of repetition. 
If you watch some people, even 

1125
01:02:12,480 --> 01:02:16,040
when they're shooting well, the 
the total time that they take to

1126
01:02:16,400 --> 01:02:18,520
go through the routine and 
execute a shot is exactly the 

1127
01:02:18,520 --> 01:02:21,760
same. 
Other people will get faster the

1128
01:02:21,760 --> 01:02:24,560
better they do, and they're 
doing it intentionally. 

1129
01:02:24,960 --> 01:02:27,720
OK, so that guy I mentioned 
before, Brandon, who's right now

1130
01:02:27,720 --> 01:02:32,320
is the best in the US, he will 
actually get faster as he gets 

1131
01:02:32,320 --> 01:02:35,000
deeper into the stand. 
So the time between pair 2:00 

1132
01:02:35,000 --> 01:02:38,080
and 3:00 will be more than the 
time between pair 3:00 and 4:00.

1133
01:02:38,320 --> 01:02:41,520
And if you watch him, something 
literally looks like he's 

1134
01:02:41,520 --> 01:02:44,600
ejecting the shells and, like, 
throwing the next one in as fast

1135
01:02:44,600 --> 01:02:46,720
as he can. 
And he'll even say like, you 

1136
01:02:46,720 --> 01:02:48,480
know, I just wanted to get him 
dead and get out of there 

1137
01:02:48,760 --> 01:02:53,920
because he's so like locked in 
to what he knows he needs to do 

1138
01:02:53,920 --> 01:02:58,320
that he it's just a matter of 
executing that works for him. 

1139
01:02:58,320 --> 01:03:00,240
I know other people that that 
doesn't work for. 

1140
01:03:00,240 --> 01:03:04,520
So I think it's, that's a very 
personal, personal thing. 

1141
01:03:04,720 --> 01:03:08,400
Then the only absolutes are 
you've got to tick the boxes 

1142
01:03:08,800 --> 01:03:11,560
right, Got to have planning, 
you've got to have set up, 

1143
01:03:11,560 --> 01:03:13,440
you've got to have 
visualization, you've got to 

1144
01:03:13,440 --> 01:03:17,480
have execution. 
And there's got to be a physical

1145
01:03:17,480 --> 01:03:20,240
cue that gets you from one of 
those things to the next. 

1146
01:03:20,760 --> 01:03:23,200
You've got to be able, you know,
those I think are absolute. 

1147
01:03:23,440 --> 01:03:28,240
The time between your cue from 
finishing your visualization to 

1148
01:03:28,560 --> 01:03:31,440
execution, I think that's got to
be as close to constant as 

1149
01:03:31,440 --> 01:03:33,160
possible. 
I'll keep that unconscious 

1150
01:03:33,160 --> 01:03:36,160
thought down. 
But you know, I know that I 

1151
01:03:36,160 --> 01:03:39,680
can't go to, I do speed up a 
tiny amount, but not a lot. 

1152
01:03:39,720 --> 01:03:41,520
I, I don't like to go too fast, 
just me. 

1153
01:03:41,960 --> 01:03:45,480
But I think that, you know, the 
goal is to keep your conscious 

1154
01:03:45,480 --> 01:03:47,840
mind occupied. 
It's easier to do that on 

1155
01:03:47,840 --> 01:03:50,400
average for the average person 
for less time than more time. 

1156
01:03:51,360 --> 01:03:54,440
Yeah, I have to, I have to think
so because the more time you're 

1157
01:03:54,440 --> 01:03:57,360
sitting over it, the more, I 
mean, it's it's your point, Like

1158
01:03:57,520 --> 01:03:59,760
the person that finishes the 
routine and then they're staring

1159
01:03:59,760 --> 01:04:01,760
down the range, right. 
Even if you're staring down the 

1160
01:04:01,760 --> 01:04:04,320
range for five seconds every 
time. 5 seconds is a. 

1161
01:04:04,320 --> 01:04:06,280
Long time you. 
Could think a lot of things in 

1162
01:04:06,280 --> 01:04:07,280
five seconds. 
That's right. 

1163
01:04:07,280 --> 01:04:10,040
Like I got to think that you 
finish it and go. 

1164
01:04:10,200 --> 01:04:13,720
And it's especially dangerous 
what once you've completed a 

1165
01:04:13,720 --> 01:04:16,120
visualization, You should be 
moving on to execution. 

1166
01:04:16,400 --> 01:04:19,200
If you're standing there staring
at the ball, staring out into 

1167
01:04:19,200 --> 01:04:22,160
the field, it's there's just no 
upside. 

1168
01:04:22,160 --> 01:04:23,400
There's no upside. 
There's you. 

1169
01:04:23,440 --> 01:04:26,160
There's nothing that you can be 
doing in that time that you 

1170
01:04:26,160 --> 01:04:27,720
shouldn't have already done, 
right? 

1171
01:04:28,160 --> 01:04:31,840
You can only invite conscious 
interruption and that and while 

1172
01:04:31,840 --> 01:04:33,760
you're doing that. 
Yeah, that makes sense. 

1173
01:04:34,720 --> 01:04:37,520
So you're working on a project. 
Do you want to leak it or do you

1174
01:04:37,520 --> 01:04:39,360
want to wait? 
We'll wait. 

1175
01:04:39,560 --> 01:04:41,360
Yeah, it's not. 
It's still coming together. 

1176
01:04:41,360 --> 01:04:44,360
I am working on a project. 
It's about this plus many other 

1177
01:04:44,360 --> 01:04:47,360
things. 
It's about development of 

1178
01:04:48,200 --> 01:04:51,280
shooting development, but it's 
all man, I'm I'm a year away at 

1179
01:04:51,280 --> 01:04:54,640
least again, I just started 
interviews like it's going to 

1180
01:04:54,840 --> 01:04:57,200
it's coming, but. 
Well, I, I like, I like the 

1181
01:04:57,200 --> 01:05:00,120
insight that you had out of it 
that, that we're really just 

1182
01:05:00,120 --> 01:05:02,640
chasing the edge of subconscious
and conscious. 

1183
01:05:02,720 --> 01:05:04,120
I, I think that's correct. 
That's. 

1184
01:05:04,120 --> 01:05:06,560
What it's it, it, that's what's 
exciting about these things, 

1185
01:05:06,560 --> 01:05:08,360
right? 
Like this notion that you can 

1186
01:05:08,360 --> 01:05:13,280
just turn up for some sport and 
you can do this thing that's on 

1187
01:05:13,280 --> 01:05:17,560
the absolute edge of human 
perception and physical 

1188
01:05:17,560 --> 01:05:20,200
possibility and you can do it at
will. 

1189
01:05:21,040 --> 01:05:24,640
Like that's, it's like, it's, 
it's like superhero stuff 

1190
01:05:24,640 --> 01:05:26,840
almost, right? 
Like you're, you're really 

1191
01:05:26,840 --> 01:05:30,400
pushing the edge of your 
physical and perceptual 

1192
01:05:30,400 --> 01:05:33,800
abilities and to be able to do 
it on command, like what? 

1193
01:05:33,800 --> 01:05:37,120
That's exciting, right? 
And I, I think that's the real 

1194
01:05:37,480 --> 01:05:42,240
appeal to, to, to these sports, 
whether people kind of realize 

1195
01:05:42,240 --> 01:05:44,680
it or not. 
And when they get that special 

1196
01:05:44,680 --> 01:05:48,400
day where they kind of fall 
backwards into the performance 

1197
01:05:48,880 --> 01:05:52,280
and they're reminded like, oh, 
wow, This is why I'm out here. 

1198
01:05:52,280 --> 01:05:58,160
Well, I'm here to tell you that 
with, you know, kind of, I don't

1199
01:05:58,160 --> 01:06:01,640
want to say careful work, but by
following, by setting up a 

1200
01:06:01,640 --> 01:06:05,320
routine, by structuring your 
practice the right way, by 

1201
01:06:05,320 --> 01:06:08,480
recursively taking the things 
that make you afraid and cycling

1202
01:06:08,480 --> 01:06:11,760
them into your practice. 
Like you actually can put a 

1203
01:06:11,760 --> 01:06:15,880
process in place that will put 
you in that state more often 

1204
01:06:15,880 --> 01:06:20,400
than you would ever imagine. 
I remember asking Henry, I was 

1205
01:06:20,400 --> 01:06:23,240
like, Henry, well, I'm shooting.
Well, it seems like every time 

1206
01:06:23,240 --> 01:06:26,400
slows down and like it almost 
seems like the targets stop and 

1207
01:06:26,400 --> 01:06:29,480
it's so easy. 
And you know, if I could get to 

1208
01:06:29,760 --> 01:06:32,080
and I just I'd seen him, I'd 
been at a competition here in 

1209
01:06:32,080 --> 01:06:35,280
Florida in February. 
My on my first ever session with

1210
01:06:35,280 --> 01:06:37,080
him was in Dallas in the 
following month. 

1211
01:06:37,080 --> 01:06:40,160
And I, I described to him one 
specific stand was really hard 

1212
01:06:40,160 --> 01:06:43,360
stand and there was three, you 
had to do it three times. 

1213
01:06:43,360 --> 01:06:46,520
And the first one was just dead 
perfection. 

1214
01:06:46,520 --> 01:06:48,240
And I said I felt like time 
slowed down. 

1215
01:06:48,240 --> 01:06:50,680
I said, I remember Henry. 
I felt like I had the target on 

1216
01:06:50,680 --> 01:06:53,640
the end of a stick and all I 
just had to pull trigger. 

1217
01:06:53,640 --> 01:06:55,800
And then the next two times 
didn't come together. 

1218
01:06:55,800 --> 01:06:57,360
I was like, I was like, if I 
could do that. 

1219
01:06:57,360 --> 01:06:59,680
And he goes, yeah, that's what 
we're doing here. 

1220
01:07:00,680 --> 01:07:03,160
He goes, that's the whole point 
of what I'm about to teach you. 

1221
01:07:03,160 --> 01:07:04,920
And I'm like. 
Wait a minute, that's a Japan 

1222
01:07:04,920 --> 01:07:07,840
before, do you? 
Mean to tell me that like I can 

1223
01:07:07,840 --> 01:07:12,360
make it like that all the time 
and he's like, it may not be all

1224
01:07:12,360 --> 01:07:17,280
the time, but I'm going to teach
you the best possible way to get

1225
01:07:17,280 --> 01:07:18,600
close. 
And he was right. 

1226
01:07:18,920 --> 01:07:23,000
What a high man like, like the 
day that you can, you know, 

1227
01:07:23,080 --> 01:07:26,560
actually summon that on command.
Yeah. 

1228
01:07:26,600 --> 01:07:30,520
And and so you know that the 
process for guys like you and me

1229
01:07:30,520 --> 01:07:36,360
is, but it's it's really 
something to watch the greats of

1230
01:07:36,360 --> 01:07:41,720
whatever sport you're into that 
really can do it on command 

1231
01:07:42,000 --> 01:07:44,640
unconsciously. 
Yeah, there's not, you know, 

1232
01:07:45,720 --> 01:07:47,720
Tiger Woods isn't out there 
thinking about it. 

1233
01:07:48,440 --> 01:07:50,240
He did all the thinking on the 
practice field. 

1234
01:07:50,360 --> 01:07:52,560
Yeah. 
He's just out there doing it. 

1235
01:07:52,880 --> 01:07:55,800
Yeah, right. 
But a bunch of steps you got to 

1236
01:07:55,800 --> 01:07:58,000
get to before you get there. 
Yeah, no doubt. 

1237
01:07:58,640 --> 01:08:01,200
Well, thank you for stopping by 
and talking about this. 

1238
01:08:01,200 --> 01:08:04,360
I I love the first conversation.
I I hope that people that are 

1239
01:08:04,360 --> 01:08:06,320
listening like this one, I think
they will. 

1240
01:08:06,440 --> 01:08:10,440
Yeah, I think if you're into if 
you're into sports and you 

1241
01:08:10,440 --> 01:08:17,680
struggle with why am I awesome 
20% of the time, OK, another 60%

1242
01:08:17,680 --> 01:08:21,600
of the time and then 20 and then
another 20% of the time I'm in a

1243
01:08:21,600 --> 01:08:23,399
meltdown. 
Hopefully the hopefully this 

1244
01:08:23,800 --> 01:08:25,120
this helps. 
Right. 

1245
01:08:25,520 --> 01:08:28,200
And I would, you know, if you're
interested about reading about 

1246
01:08:28,200 --> 01:08:32,840
the stuff, the old Barbara Tella
books, golf was not a game of 

1247
01:08:32,840 --> 01:08:35,120
perfect. 
In the inner game of tennis, he 

1248
01:08:35,120 --> 01:08:38,240
talks about these constructs in 
terms of like the self one, self

1249
01:08:38,240 --> 01:08:40,560
two thing. 
It's all the same. 

1250
01:08:40,840 --> 01:08:44,760
There's plenty of good sports 
psychology out there that some 

1251
01:08:44,760 --> 01:08:48,800
of them are academic others. 
But you know, ultimately this is

1252
01:08:48,800 --> 01:08:50,960
what I just described is what's 
in those books, right? 

1253
01:08:51,160 --> 01:08:53,800
There's no magic beans. 
There's no secret knowledge. 

1254
01:08:53,840 --> 01:08:56,520
This is it. 
It's just hard work to practice 

1255
01:08:56,520 --> 01:08:57,920
it. 
Yeah. 

1256
01:08:57,920 --> 01:09:00,479
And I, and I think that I mean 
you said, you know, if you're 

1257
01:09:00,479 --> 01:09:04,600
good 20%. 
And I think the more interesting

1258
01:09:04,600 --> 01:09:08,840
question is like, let's say I'm 
good 75% of the time. 

1259
01:09:09,399 --> 01:09:13,600
Why is that last 25% so hard to 
close the gap on? 

1260
01:09:13,600 --> 01:09:16,520
Because like a majority of the 
time I'm good. 

1261
01:09:16,640 --> 01:09:18,120
Oh yeah? 
Well, but it gets even more 

1262
01:09:18,120 --> 01:09:20,920
complicated. 
It's harder to win your second 

1263
01:09:20,920 --> 01:09:22,439
big tournament that it is your 
first. 

1264
01:09:23,160 --> 01:09:26,840
What that? 
Expectations now, now you have 

1265
01:09:26,840 --> 01:09:31,800
all this performance stuff and 
you start to feel like you 

1266
01:09:32,000 --> 01:09:34,160
you've already proven that you 
can do it. 

1267
01:09:34,399 --> 01:09:36,279
Yeah, you've proven you can do 
it. 

1268
01:09:36,279 --> 01:09:39,120
And so now, like all the all the
pressure goes up. 

1269
01:09:39,640 --> 01:09:42,640
Yeah. 
Or let's say you've won some big

1270
01:09:42,640 --> 01:09:46,240
stuff, whatever big is for you. 
And then you turn up at your 

1271
01:09:46,240 --> 01:09:49,439
little local tournament with 
hardly any competition where 

1272
01:09:49,680 --> 01:09:51,880
you're the favorite to win by a 
lot. 

1273
01:09:53,040 --> 01:09:54,600
That's a whole different kind of
pressure. 

1274
01:09:54,640 --> 01:10:00,360
Yeah, right. 
So this it manif that pressure 

1275
01:10:00,360 --> 01:10:05,200
manifests itself in different 
forms and evolves differently as

1276
01:10:05,200 --> 01:10:08,800
your career progresses. 
And it's all a little different,

1277
01:10:09,440 --> 01:10:13,960
but you know, the bedrock coping
mechanism is this. 

1278
01:10:13,960 --> 01:10:18,520
It's to just keep on your 
process and do your best not to 

1279
01:10:18,520 --> 01:10:20,280
become results oriented in the 
middle. 

1280
01:10:20,720 --> 01:10:22,640
Yeah, try to have fun in the 
meantime, right? 

1281
01:10:23,520 --> 01:10:26,000
OK, so that's now you're I, I 
know we're at the end here, but 

1282
01:10:26,000 --> 01:10:28,560
that you're asking the fun thing
is interesting. 

1283
01:10:29,520 --> 01:10:32,680
Fun is when you perform well. 
I always have fun when I perform

1284
01:10:32,680 --> 01:10:34,000
well. 
I don't have a whole lot of fun 

1285
01:10:34,000 --> 01:10:36,080
when I don't. 
So people say to me. 

1286
01:10:36,160 --> 01:10:38,480
It's actually kind of a 
byproduct of the process. 

1287
01:10:38,480 --> 01:10:41,000
I hear people say all the time 
like, oh, I'm I'm just going to 

1288
01:10:41,000 --> 01:10:45,080
go and have fun, OK. 
Or the the a thing that 

1289
01:10:45,080 --> 01:10:47,920
popularly is said in the 
northeast part of the shooting 

1290
01:10:47,920 --> 01:10:54,520
world is something like if I 
shoot to win, I often lose, but 

1291
01:10:54,520 --> 01:10:57,400
if I shoot for fun, I always win
or no, Yeah. 

1292
01:10:58,640 --> 01:11:01,560
Or if I shoot for, I don't know,
it's some saying like this, but 

1293
01:11:01,560 --> 01:11:04,920
the the point of the saying is 
if you shoot to win, you'll pull

1294
01:11:04,920 --> 01:11:06,880
a lot of pressure on yourself 
and you most often won't. 

1295
01:11:07,480 --> 01:11:12,040
OK. 
To which I say, yeah, but if you

1296
01:11:12,040 --> 01:11:14,200
don't shoot to win, you're 
almost never going to. 

1297
01:11:14,880 --> 01:11:18,320
OK. 
So rather than avoid the 

1298
01:11:18,320 --> 01:11:21,480
pressure, change your 
relationship with the pressure, 

1299
01:11:22,000 --> 01:11:24,640
right? 
Have coping mechanisms, have 

1300
01:11:24,640 --> 01:11:28,120
confidence that aren't is not 
rooted in your results, and then

1301
01:11:28,120 --> 01:11:30,040
just deal with the pressure, 
right? 

1302
01:11:30,040 --> 01:11:34,240
Learn to learn to take it and 
then have the goal to win. 

1303
01:11:34,240 --> 01:11:36,840
But to run away or people say, 
well, you need to, you need to 

1304
01:11:36,840 --> 01:11:38,880
act like it doesn't matter. 
Impossible. 

1305
01:11:38,880 --> 01:11:41,000
You can't lie to yourself. 
It does matter. 

1306
01:11:41,120 --> 01:11:43,360
If it didn't matter, first of 
all, one, we wouldn't be out 

1307
01:11:43,360 --> 01:11:47,320
there keeping score all right, 
and two, you wouldn't be out 

1308
01:11:47,320 --> 01:11:50,080
there to begin with because 
there would be no, it's the 

1309
01:11:50,080 --> 01:11:52,680
objective measure of your 
ability to summon it that's 

1310
01:11:52,680 --> 01:11:55,400
exciting, right? 
So like the whole, you know, 

1311
01:11:55,400 --> 01:11:58,880
just have fun slash act like it 
doesn't matter thing. 

1312
01:11:58,920 --> 01:12:01,920
I I mean, I just call total 
bullshit on that because you're 

1313
01:12:01,920 --> 01:12:05,440
right. 
Like I'm having the most fun 

1314
01:12:06,280 --> 01:12:10,440
when I'm performing well and my 
all of my work is coming 

1315
01:12:10,440 --> 01:12:11,560
together. 
That's fun. 

1316
01:12:11,840 --> 01:12:16,400
OK, Do you know how many 
straight up depressing and sad 

1317
01:12:16,400 --> 01:12:18,840
plane rides home I've had home 
from coming coming from 

1318
01:12:18,840 --> 01:12:21,120
competitions? 
I had years of them. 

1319
01:12:21,160 --> 01:12:23,880
I mean, maybe the first eight 
years of my shooting career. 

1320
01:12:23,880 --> 01:12:26,000
That's mostly what they were, 
right? 

1321
01:12:26,000 --> 01:12:28,400
Because I you takes a long time 
to win. 

1322
01:12:28,400 --> 01:12:30,560
OK. 
It takes a long time to even do 

1323
01:12:30,560 --> 01:12:36,520
well. 
So like, either you learn that 

1324
01:12:36,520 --> 01:12:40,560
that's part of your process and 
accept it or you quit, you know,

1325
01:12:40,560 --> 01:12:44,720
or you start kind of believing 
this nonsense about, well, what 

1326
01:12:44,720 --> 01:12:45,840
you should be doing is having 
fun. 

1327
01:12:45,840 --> 01:12:48,560
No. 
That is kind of a loser 

1328
01:12:48,560 --> 01:12:51,480
mentality, isn't it? 
I mean in a way. 

1329
01:12:51,480 --> 01:12:52,840
You said it, yeah. 
Yeah. 

1330
01:12:53,880 --> 01:12:56,840
I don't know anyone who is 
consistent. 

1331
01:12:57,680 --> 01:12:58,880
Consistence may be a strong 
word. 

1332
01:12:59,360 --> 01:13:01,680
It's hard to dominate these 
games because they're so 

1333
01:13:01,680 --> 01:13:04,040
complicated, right? 
But the people at the top of 

1334
01:13:04,040 --> 01:13:09,040
them didn't get there by 
believing, only half believing 

1335
01:13:09,040 --> 01:13:10,800
that they could. 
Yeah, right. 

1336
01:13:11,000 --> 01:13:14,920
They believed that they could 
based on their work and skill 

1337
01:13:14,920 --> 01:13:19,560
building and experience, right? 
And you got to really care in 

1338
01:13:19,560 --> 01:13:22,640
order to put those hours in. 
So to act like you don't care is

1339
01:13:22,640 --> 01:13:24,440
fucking bullshit. 
Going back to your previous 

1340
01:13:24,440 --> 01:13:27,000
comment about like, you got to 
believe what you're telling 

1341
01:13:27,000 --> 01:13:29,040
yourself. 
Because I know I'm the one that 

1342
01:13:29,040 --> 01:13:31,520
said to have fun, but I don't 
actually believe that I'm going 

1343
01:13:31,520 --> 01:13:33,360
out to have fun. 
I believe I'm going out to 

1344
01:13:33,360 --> 01:13:35,400
perform. 
And when I perform, I have fun. 

1345
01:13:35,400 --> 01:13:36,640
And that's. 
OK. 

1346
01:13:36,960 --> 01:13:41,720
Now, OK, I do have to say that I
think that they're we're talking

1347
01:13:41,720 --> 01:13:45,920
about this is all in the context
of maximizing performance. 

1348
01:13:46,320 --> 01:13:51,640
If your goal is not to maximize 
performance, then a lot of this 

1349
01:13:51,640 --> 01:13:53,400
changes. 
There are plenty of people in 

1350
01:13:53,400 --> 01:13:55,440
shooting, plenty of people in 
golf, plenty of people in tennis

1351
01:13:55,800 --> 01:13:58,880
that are there truly for 
recreation and they do like to 

1352
01:13:58,880 --> 01:14:03,200
turn up an event, maybe to shoot
harder targets or for the social

1353
01:14:03,200 --> 01:14:06,120
aspect of being at a big 
tournament where their goal is 

1354
01:14:06,120 --> 01:14:11,200
not to maximize performance. 
OK, to those people, I mean, no 

1355
01:14:11,200 --> 01:14:15,120
offense when I say the fun stuff
and that your goal should I I 

1356
01:14:15,120 --> 01:14:18,200
mean no offense to those people,
I get it. 

1357
01:14:18,560 --> 01:14:19,760
You're there for a different 
reason. 

1358
01:14:19,760 --> 01:14:22,480
They're totally great. 
And actually we're happy to have

1359
01:14:22,480 --> 01:14:25,000
you there. 
Like not everyone has to be 

1360
01:14:25,000 --> 01:14:29,080
there for cutthroat competition.
You're trying to push themselves

1361
01:14:29,080 --> 01:14:31,880
as hard as they possibly can. 
That's what I like. 

1362
01:14:31,960 --> 01:14:34,160
Doesn't mean that's where other 
people are like totally OK. 

1363
01:14:34,400 --> 01:14:38,200
So I think it is important to 
recognize like the different 

1364
01:14:38,200 --> 01:14:41,720
goals that people have with the 
stuff and not everyone is there 

1365
01:14:41,720 --> 01:14:45,400
for the same reasons that I am. 
But if you are there to maximize

1366
01:14:45,400 --> 01:14:48,920
performance, I'm 1000% buying 
everything I've said here. 

1367
01:14:49,560 --> 01:14:51,120
Yeah, well, I'm with you on 
that. 

1368
01:14:52,040 --> 01:14:55,880
Relatedly, I have, you know, I 
mean, it's interesting. 

1369
01:14:55,920 --> 01:14:59,640
Sometimes I've performed well 
while having some like, you 

1370
01:14:59,640 --> 01:15:01,520
know, booze on the course or 
whatever. 

1371
01:15:01,920 --> 01:15:04,160
And I always get disappointed 
when that happens because I'm 

1372
01:15:04,160 --> 01:15:07,600
like, man, why did why did it 
take the booze to let go, right.

1373
01:15:07,600 --> 01:15:11,680
How do I let my mind let go 
without that rather than because

1374
01:15:11,680 --> 01:15:14,720
it's obvious it's in me, right? 
It just fucking showed it right?

1375
01:15:14,720 --> 01:15:17,480
So like, why can't I turn? 
Because you just haven't 

1376
01:15:17,480 --> 01:15:21,960
established yet the right tool 
set, the right process, the 

1377
01:15:21,960 --> 01:15:24,920
right routine that helps you 
access it, right? 

1378
01:15:25,080 --> 01:15:27,200
Which I say, you know, there's a
framework that requires 

1379
01:15:27,200 --> 01:15:30,320
customization. 
I would say that it took me well

1380
01:15:30,320 --> 01:15:33,320
over a year and I shoot a lot of
competitions. 

1381
01:15:33,320 --> 01:15:36,360
I shoot 10,000 plus registered 
targets a year. 

1382
01:15:36,920 --> 01:15:40,920
It took me well over a year from
the start of my routine 

1383
01:15:40,920 --> 01:15:43,320
development, when I first 
started really committing to it,

1384
01:15:43,960 --> 01:15:47,800
to getting it to the point where
I really felt like it was 

1385
01:15:47,960 --> 01:15:51,440
helping OK. 
Took Wow just to the point where

1386
01:15:51,440 --> 01:15:54,000
it was helping, not to the point
where you like had it. 

1387
01:15:54,000 --> 01:15:57,640
Then took a lot more time where 
it was like solid, right? 

1388
01:15:57,840 --> 01:15:59,760
And it went through a lot of 
iterations like that. 

1389
01:15:59,760 --> 01:16:01,960
I remember I went through a 
period where I was taking a 

1390
01:16:01,960 --> 01:16:05,160
really a long period of time and
my friends were like, dude, why 

1391
01:16:05,160 --> 01:16:06,600
are you so slow? 
This is brutal. 

1392
01:16:06,600 --> 01:16:09,080
Would you stop it? 
And then it's because I was 

1393
01:16:09,080 --> 01:16:13,800
still working through what all 
of my pieces were right of, of 

1394
01:16:13,800 --> 01:16:16,320
what I was putting in those 
boxes in the framework, right? 

1395
01:16:16,680 --> 01:16:19,440
And then I'd speed some part up 
and then I'd screw up another 

1396
01:16:19,640 --> 01:16:24,080
like, and it was a full like 
year of iteration before. 

1397
01:16:24,080 --> 01:16:27,600
Like I got the routine into 
something that I like and it is 

1398
01:16:27,600 --> 01:16:30,280
repeatable and I'm comfortable 
with like. 

1399
01:16:31,080 --> 01:16:32,200
So that's a big. 
Commitment. 

1400
01:16:32,560 --> 01:16:35,040
Right. 
To take something that you care 

1401
01:16:35,040 --> 01:16:38,080
about and put this thing into 
it. 

1402
01:16:38,280 --> 01:16:40,200
That's going to take a long time
to work out, but. 

1403
01:16:40,200 --> 01:16:42,400
It's worth it. 
Yeah, that's what the people the

1404
01:16:42,400 --> 01:16:46,560
top have done. 
Duh, that's right and that's 

1405
01:16:46,560 --> 01:16:48,720
what it takes. 
Not fake it right and believe it

1406
01:16:48,720 --> 01:16:50,640
when it counts. 
And that's the other, Yeah, the 

1407
01:16:50,640 --> 01:16:53,760
whole don't lie to yourself if 
you know you've done that work, 

1408
01:16:54,200 --> 01:16:56,320
OK. 
And when you have a mess or a 

1409
01:16:56,320 --> 01:17:02,600
bad shot, if you can say to 
yourself, I made the wrong plan,

1410
01:17:03,480 --> 01:17:05,560
right? 
I did not make the right plan. 

1411
01:17:05,880 --> 01:17:08,840
Or you know what? 
I executed that poorly because I

1412
01:17:08,840 --> 01:17:12,240
got a little conscious, but I 
know how to not do that now. 

1413
01:17:12,240 --> 01:17:15,640
Like you don't even go close to 
the meltdown rabbit hole. 

1414
01:17:15,960 --> 01:17:18,080
You don't even go near it, 
right? 

1415
01:17:18,360 --> 01:17:22,160
Just go back to your process 
because you believe that you 

1416
01:17:22,160 --> 01:17:25,880
have one. 
But the only way that I think 

1417
01:17:25,880 --> 01:17:27,920
that belief is sustainable is if
you do. 

1418
01:17:28,200 --> 01:17:30,240
Noted. 
Well, thank you very much for 

1419
01:17:30,240 --> 01:17:31,600
sharing your knowledge. 
I appreciate. 

1420
01:17:31,600 --> 01:17:34,160
It man, thanks for having me. 
I love this stuff and that was 

1421
01:17:34,160 --> 01:17:35,440
great. 
It's a lot of fun to come and 

1422
01:17:35,440 --> 01:17:36,760
see you again. 
All right, good deal. 

1423
01:17:36,760 --> 01:17:37,280
Have a good one.