1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:02,600 This episode has been sponsored by a generation. 2 00:00:02,600 --> 00:00:05,640 You can more about our sponsor later on in the show. 3 00:00:06,280 --> 00:00:09,720 You're listening to episode 194 of the Marathon Running Podcast. 4 00:00:09,760 --> 00:00:11,600 In this episode we're going to talk about. 5 00:00:11,800 --> 00:00:22,480 Metabolism in running. This is the Marathon Running 6 00:00:22,480 --> 00:00:25,080 podcast by Letty and Ryan from We Got The Runs. 7 00:00:25,480 --> 00:00:28,360 Join us in our running community for weekly content that is 8 00:00:28,360 --> 00:00:32,200 motivational, educational and inspirational and that the 9 00:00:32,200 --> 00:00:35,000 Marathon Running podcast take you from the starting line to 10 00:00:35,000 --> 00:00:44,600 the finish line and beyond. Hey, runners, and welcome to 11 00:00:44,640 --> 00:00:47,040 episode 194. My Name is Letty. 12 00:00:47,240 --> 00:00:49,600 My name is Ryan. And thank you Ryan for helping 13 00:00:49,600 --> 00:00:52,680 me out in that intro. I am struggling with those 14 00:00:52,680 --> 00:00:53,680 words. I don't know why. 15 00:00:54,680 --> 00:00:55,840 Sometimes you need a little boost. 16 00:00:55,880 --> 00:00:58,160 That's OK. I do need a little boost to my 17 00:00:58,160 --> 00:00:59,600 metabolism too, right? Fitting. 18 00:00:59,920 --> 00:01:02,120 Yes. So that's what we're going to 19 00:01:02,120 --> 00:01:04,560 talk about today. I think that's a very 20 00:01:04,560 --> 00:01:07,720 interesting and cool topic. I think metabolism in general 21 00:01:07,880 --> 00:01:12,600 obviously is difficult. You have a million diet books 22 00:01:12,600 --> 00:01:16,400 and nutrition books all over the place and several different 23 00:01:16,400 --> 00:01:19,680 opinions on the topic in multiple different fields. 24 00:01:19,680 --> 00:01:25,560 But I do feel overtime nutrition and metabolism and energy in 25 00:01:25,560 --> 00:01:30,040 athletes and sports has become more known and it kind of shows 26 00:01:30,040 --> 00:01:32,600 with the athletes getting a little better and faster. 27 00:01:32,640 --> 00:01:36,600 And so hopefully the more we learn about it, the better we 28 00:01:36,600 --> 00:01:40,280 can utilize information to make us faster and better. 29 00:01:40,480 --> 00:01:44,720 I remember in college I I used to look up Gatorade and when 30 00:01:44,720 --> 00:01:47,200 they started that, for a little history I did go to University 31 00:01:47,200 --> 00:01:49,760 of Florida and University of Florida I think was the place 32 00:01:49,760 --> 00:01:52,000 where they invented Gatorade. And they noticed that like if 33 00:01:52,000 --> 00:01:54,800 they didn't give their athletes just plain water, but they gave 34 00:01:54,800 --> 00:01:57,040 them electrolytes also, that it actually improved their 35 00:01:57,040 --> 00:01:59,320 performance. And so, like, I feel like ever 36 00:01:59,320 --> 00:02:03,800 since that time, that market has just exploded, and especially 37 00:02:03,800 --> 00:02:06,720 recently, there's like a million different options and things you 38 00:02:06,720 --> 00:02:08,960 can take and drink and everything else for your 39 00:02:08,960 --> 00:02:10,560 marathons. I wonder if it was the 40 00:02:10,639 --> 00:02:13,480 electrolyte that gave them the spike or the sugar. 41 00:02:14,240 --> 00:02:15,880 There's so much sugar in Gatorade, it's. 42 00:02:16,280 --> 00:02:19,400 I think most, I think the point, the big point of it is, is the 43 00:02:20,080 --> 00:02:22,720 it's just not having pure water because like when you sweat you 44 00:02:22,720 --> 00:02:24,040 actually lose a lot of other things. 45 00:02:24,200 --> 00:02:26,400 I don't think so. The sugar is interesting, 'cause 46 00:02:26,560 --> 00:02:30,320 you do use energy and so you have to replace that with sugar 47 00:02:30,320 --> 00:02:32,360 when you're especially in high level athletics. 48 00:02:32,880 --> 00:02:35,240 But you're also what they analyzed or how I think. 49 00:02:35,360 --> 00:02:38,200 I mean, correct me if I'm wrong, anyone that's actually 50 00:02:38,200 --> 00:02:40,080 researched it because it's been a long time since I looked it 51 00:02:40,080 --> 00:02:42,600 up. But I think what they originally 52 00:02:42,600 --> 00:02:45,640 did was they kind of determined what you were losing in sweat 53 00:02:45,640 --> 00:02:49,040 while you were doing athletics and they realized, oh, you're 54 00:02:49,040 --> 00:02:53,760 losing like potassium and sodium and these other elements as well 55 00:02:53,760 --> 00:02:55,600 as the water that's coming off in the sweat. 56 00:02:55,600 --> 00:02:59,600 So in order to like make sure that you're being at your peak 57 00:02:59,600 --> 00:03:02,520 performance, we need to replace that by providing that in a 58 00:03:02,520 --> 00:03:05,920 drink that you can drink. And so I think that's how they 59 00:03:05,920 --> 00:03:09,280 originally came up with it, but it's just, it's interesting 60 00:03:09,280 --> 00:03:10,920 anyway, an interesting concept. It makes sense. 61 00:03:11,200 --> 00:03:13,320 Yeah, yeah. And I mean, even just with the 62 00:03:13,320 --> 00:03:15,440 Gatorade, see how far they have come with that. 63 00:03:15,520 --> 00:03:19,160 In the 80s they used to give their runners Coca-Cola and take 64 00:03:19,160 --> 00:03:20,880 the gas out. And Coca-Cola used to actually 65 00:03:20,880 --> 00:03:22,600 have cocaine in it. Great. 66 00:03:23,080 --> 00:03:26,520 But maybe that came to be because they noticed that it was 67 00:03:26,520 --> 00:03:29,320 more helpful than just plain water and maybe it was the sugar 68 00:03:29,320 --> 00:03:30,880 or other things in Coca-Cola that helped. 69 00:03:31,040 --> 00:03:34,480 Fortunately, I think we have evolved from that time period 70 00:03:34,480 --> 00:03:37,800 and now have better options. And maybe, you know, even though 71 00:03:37,800 --> 00:03:39,840 the increments maybe get smaller at times, there are 72 00:03:39,840 --> 00:03:42,240 breakthroughs. So maybe, you know, now or in 73 00:03:42,240 --> 00:03:44,600 the future we'll have more breakthroughs that that, you 74 00:03:44,600 --> 00:03:47,720 know, kind of do incrementally greater steps towards better 75 00:03:47,720 --> 00:03:50,880 nutrition. Yeah, I'm kind of still stuck on 76 00:03:50,880 --> 00:03:53,120 you saying that Coca-Cola used to have cocaine in this is. 77 00:03:53,720 --> 00:03:54,920 That crazy? Yeah. 78 00:03:54,960 --> 00:03:57,960 I wonder if they still sell old bottles online on eBay or 79 00:03:57,960 --> 00:03:59,960 something? I I doubt there is any and 80 00:03:59,960 --> 00:04:02,720 anything left over. The drink was. 81 00:04:02,720 --> 00:04:05,040 I'm looking this up online on the fly, so bear with me. 82 00:04:05,240 --> 00:04:09,480 But the drink was invented in nine or 1885 by a pharmacist in 83 00:04:09,480 --> 00:04:14,760 Atlanta, GA, John Pemberton, who made the original formula in his 84 00:04:14,760 --> 00:04:17,959 backyard. His recipe contained cocaine in 85 00:04:17,959 --> 00:04:21,040 the form of extract from cocoa leaf, which inspired the cocoa 86 00:04:21,040 --> 00:04:24,160 part of the beverage's name. The cola comes from the cola 87 00:04:24,160 --> 00:04:26,520 nut, which contains caffeine, another stimulant. 88 00:04:26,520 --> 00:04:28,800 So I wonder if it, you know, I originally originally, maybe it 89 00:04:28,800 --> 00:04:31,480 had cocaine and caffeine. Or maybe just cocaine. 90 00:04:31,640 --> 00:04:33,600 Oh, it's it's not real cocaine, though. 91 00:04:33,600 --> 00:04:37,120 It's like they still chew cocoa leaves in those countries, and 92 00:04:37,120 --> 00:04:39,440 that's not illegal. But creating that, you know, 93 00:04:39,440 --> 00:04:41,320 powdered white substance, that's illegal. 94 00:04:41,320 --> 00:04:44,200 So it's probably not something. Cocaine still, but you're 95 00:04:44,200 --> 00:04:45,920 referring to different things you're talking about like a 96 00:04:45,920 --> 00:04:48,560 refined, you know, when they take the coca leaf and refine 97 00:04:48,560 --> 00:04:51,800 and concentrate the cocaine versus like residual amounts of 98 00:04:51,800 --> 00:04:53,600 cocaine that's in the leaf or whatever. 99 00:04:53,600 --> 00:04:55,480 Exactly. So it probably wasn't the 100 00:04:55,520 --> 00:04:58,240 powder. I mean, it wasn't like they went 101 00:04:58,400 --> 00:05:00,880 to talk to Pablo Escobar and got like. 102 00:05:00,880 --> 00:05:03,520 That would make Coca-Cola really expensive. 103 00:05:04,600 --> 00:05:07,800 Street value nowadays I don't even know, although in Florida 104 00:05:07,800 --> 00:05:09,760 here you could probably just go down to one of the beaches and 105 00:05:09,760 --> 00:05:12,920 get lucky with a brick of cocaine that floats up to shore. 106 00:05:13,600 --> 00:05:16,000 I've read about that, but it's not the topic of today. 107 00:05:16,160 --> 00:05:18,160 And today we're going to talk about the effects of cocaine 108 00:05:18,160 --> 00:05:21,520 while learning. Today we are talking about the 109 00:05:21,560 --> 00:05:24,640 metabolic process. Like we said, our guest today is 110 00:05:24,640 --> 00:05:29,040 Patrick Davitt, PhD, Associate professor and also chair of the 111 00:05:29,040 --> 00:05:32,560 Department of Health Sciences. He's also the program director 112 00:05:32,560 --> 00:05:36,160 of the Exercise Physiology. He's a director of the Human 113 00:05:36,160 --> 00:05:39,440 Performance Lab of Saint Joseph's University. 114 00:05:39,520 --> 00:05:42,680 He's studying nutrition in depth and has become to be an expert 115 00:05:42,680 --> 00:05:45,960 in this field exactly. So we're super lucky to have him 116 00:05:45,960 --> 00:05:47,920 on today. So before we get off in another 117 00:05:47,920 --> 00:05:49,480 tangent, do you want to get into it? 118 00:05:49,680 --> 00:05:51,720 Yes, let's do that, and without any further ado. 119 00:05:51,720 --> 00:05:58,360 Here's your interview. All right. 120 00:05:58,360 --> 00:06:00,520 So I'm on with Doctor Patrick. David. 121 00:06:00,760 --> 00:06:03,080 Patrick, thank you so much for joining me today. 122 00:06:03,960 --> 00:06:06,200 Absolutely. It's an honor and a privilege. 123 00:06:06,920 --> 00:06:10,960 And then our pre recorded intro, I spoke about your titles, but 124 00:06:10,960 --> 00:06:13,080 maybe we can hear it from your own words. 125 00:06:13,600 --> 00:06:16,520 What do you do and how did you get into this field? 126 00:06:17,280 --> 00:06:20,840 Sure. So I am a college professor at 127 00:06:20,840 --> 00:06:23,160 Saint Joe's University in Philadelphia, PA. 128 00:06:23,160 --> 00:06:26,560 I am the department chair of Health Science Program Director 129 00:06:26,560 --> 00:06:28,280 for Exercise Physiology research. 130 00:06:28,440 --> 00:06:31,560 You know, scientist. My PhD is in Nutritional 131 00:06:31,560 --> 00:06:34,720 Physiology and biochemistry from Rutgers University. 132 00:06:35,160 --> 00:06:38,800 My specialty is energy metabolism within the field of 133 00:06:38,840 --> 00:06:42,320 exercise Physiology, a lot of fitness testing, and most of 134 00:06:42,320 --> 00:06:46,520 what I study is the difference of burning carbohydrates versus 135 00:06:46,520 --> 00:06:50,520 fats. And primarily in the past 6-7 136 00:06:50,520 --> 00:06:54,560 years, I've mostly been studying the endurance athlete, ultra 137 00:06:54,560 --> 00:06:58,240 endurance athlete. I've you know, on 50 Miller, 138 00:06:58,240 --> 00:07:00,200 I've done the Eastern States 100 hundred Miller. 139 00:07:00,200 --> 00:07:04,560 So it's a little about me. It's a little and it's a lot and 140 00:07:04,560 --> 00:07:06,440 we are definitely in good hands here. 141 00:07:06,440 --> 00:07:10,000 I'm super excited for this conversation today and perhaps 142 00:07:10,000 --> 00:07:13,440 let's kick it off with a definition for you to give us in 143 00:07:13,440 --> 00:07:17,560 regards to energy metabolism. Sure. 144 00:07:17,560 --> 00:07:22,760 So I mean energy is the, you know sort of the, the capacity 145 00:07:22,760 --> 00:07:24,560 to do work. We'll talk about, you know when 146 00:07:24,560 --> 00:07:29,360 we talk about energy, ATP is the molecule in the body, it's our 147 00:07:29,360 --> 00:07:33,480 energy currency. So when we say energy 148 00:07:33,480 --> 00:07:38,200 metabolism, it's the breakdown of foodstuff, food and or drink 149 00:07:38,200 --> 00:07:42,800 that contains macro nutrients, carbs, fats or you know 150 00:07:42,800 --> 00:07:45,360 proteins. And it's our body's way of 151 00:07:45,360 --> 00:07:51,400 breaking those down and deriving converting those break chemical 152 00:07:51,400 --> 00:07:55,240 breakdowns or chemical components to energy. 153 00:07:55,320 --> 00:07:57,280 That energy is in the form of ATP. 154 00:07:57,280 --> 00:08:01,440 And why that's so important is because we want to be, we have 155 00:08:01,440 --> 00:08:05,200 to do energy metabolism at all times, you know every day, 156 00:08:05,200 --> 00:08:08,840 every, every millisecond all of our cells have a a sodium 157 00:08:08,840 --> 00:08:12,560 potassium ATPS pump, this little pump that moves sodium and 158 00:08:12,560 --> 00:08:15,280 potassium in and out. So we need energy all the time. 159 00:08:15,720 --> 00:08:18,440 Most of what we talked about in the running world, in the 160 00:08:18,480 --> 00:08:22,720 exercise world, primarily relates to our skeletal muscle. 161 00:08:23,240 --> 00:08:28,040 So in order for me to talk right now, I have to contract muscles, 162 00:08:28,040 --> 00:08:31,720 you know, in my tongue, in my lips, in my lungs to push the 163 00:08:31,760 --> 00:08:34,280 air in and out. And when we are running, we're 164 00:08:34,280 --> 00:08:38,559 contracting muscles in our legs, in our hips, in our back, in our 165 00:08:38,559 --> 00:08:41,400 arms. And the contraction of those 166 00:08:41,400 --> 00:08:44,480 muscles requires energy in the form of ATP. 167 00:08:44,480 --> 00:08:47,400 And we don't really store ATP. So where do we get it? 168 00:08:47,440 --> 00:08:51,000 Well, we primarily get it from either carbohydrate or fat. 169 00:08:52,320 --> 00:08:53,280 Perfect. I love this. 170 00:08:53,280 --> 00:08:56,720 And I mean, I don't even have to talk about why runners are so 171 00:08:56,720 --> 00:08:58,800 different from people that are more sedentary. 172 00:08:59,080 --> 00:09:02,440 So let's hop right into it. Let's talk about fueling during 173 00:09:02,440 --> 00:09:04,760 training runs. Why is fueling so important 174 00:09:04,760 --> 00:09:06,840 during training runs? Yeah. 175 00:09:06,840 --> 00:09:12,440 So I mean, first and foremost, it's, it's I in general, it's 176 00:09:12,600 --> 00:09:14,840 all about performance. So why is it so important? 177 00:09:15,200 --> 00:09:18,720 Well because if you want to run you need fuel in order to 178 00:09:18,720 --> 00:09:22,880 contract the muscles to maintain whatever work output, power 179 00:09:22,880 --> 00:09:26,160 output, IE pace that you're trying to run. 180 00:09:26,840 --> 00:09:30,560 One of my favorite college professors, brilliant man named 181 00:09:30,560 --> 00:09:32,840 Doctor Malcolm Wofford, studied under Hans Krabs. 182 00:09:32,840 --> 00:09:35,240 If anyone ever took a biology class, you learn like the Krebs 183 00:09:35,240 --> 00:09:39,440 cycle and he studied on, that's Hans Krabs and my mentor and 184 00:09:39,440 --> 00:09:42,120 grad school studied under him. So anyway, he had a textbook 185 00:09:42,120 --> 00:09:44,400 that he made himself for advanced nutrition. 186 00:09:44,400 --> 00:09:47,320 It was a two semester class and it was called Keeping Your Brain 187 00:09:47,320 --> 00:09:52,800 Happy. So why we want to fuel our we we 188 00:09:52,800 --> 00:09:57,040 really say muscles, but why we want to fuel and provide energy 189 00:09:57,040 --> 00:10:01,000 during a run or a training run is really from for three 190 00:10:01,000 --> 00:10:03,600 reasons. The first one is the title of 191 00:10:03,600 --> 00:10:05,960 the book I just mentioned, Keeping your brain happy. 192 00:10:06,040 --> 00:10:09,120 And in order to do that you have to maintain a certain level of 193 00:10:09,120 --> 00:10:12,520 blood glucose at any given moment. 194 00:10:12,640 --> 00:10:15,480 You know, let's say the average individual at rest is at 70, you 195 00:10:15,480 --> 00:10:19,400 know, milligrams per deciliter, like 70 milligrams a deciliter 196 00:10:19,400 --> 00:10:22,920 of blood glucose. That's only a few teaspoons of 197 00:10:22,920 --> 00:10:25,680 glucose. It's only like 8-9 grams in your 198 00:10:25,680 --> 00:10:27,560 entire body, like your whole bloodstream. 199 00:10:28,240 --> 00:10:31,080 But we need to maintain that minimum amount. 200 00:10:31,160 --> 00:10:34,640 You know, some people that might be 70, others it might be 80. 201 00:10:34,920 --> 00:10:38,400 So we want to maintain that blood glucose and if our muscles 202 00:10:38,400 --> 00:10:41,960 are are taking glucose out and other tissues are using it, then 203 00:10:41,960 --> 00:10:43,680 we're going to deplete, start to deplete it. 204 00:10:43,880 --> 00:10:48,360 So we want to supply some energy to maintain blood glucose 2. 205 00:10:48,680 --> 00:10:53,360 We want to be able to supply energy to the working muscle. 206 00:10:53,760 --> 00:10:56,720 So the moles, especially when you get to a higher intensity, 207 00:10:56,720 --> 00:10:59,600 are going to use more carbohydrate than they will fat, 208 00:11:00,160 --> 00:11:04,360 primarily because carbs can give us ATP that energy at a faster 209 00:11:04,360 --> 00:11:07,520 rate. So they'll give us more ATP per 210 00:11:07,520 --> 00:11:11,600 second or per unit of time. Actually those are really the 211 00:11:11,600 --> 00:11:14,000 two main reasons. I feel like there was a third, 212 00:11:14,000 --> 00:11:16,800 but it it's really those two, we want to maintain blood glucose 213 00:11:17,160 --> 00:11:20,760 and that primary reason for blood glucose is to maintain our 214 00:11:20,760 --> 00:11:24,080 brain, keep our brain happy, but then also to maintain blood 215 00:11:24,080 --> 00:11:26,840 glucose. So we can provide a slight 216 00:11:26,840 --> 00:11:31,000 continual supply of that energy in the form of primarily the 217 00:11:31,000 --> 00:11:34,960 glucose to our working muscle. OK, perfect. 218 00:11:35,320 --> 00:11:39,280 And so a question, a follow up question to that is we hear 219 00:11:39,280 --> 00:11:41,920 about depleting it from you right now. 220 00:11:42,360 --> 00:11:45,760 If we were to continuously deplete it every day, we run 221 00:11:45,760 --> 00:11:49,240 without fueling and we end up depleting it, is that a way of 222 00:11:49,240 --> 00:11:53,600 training our bodies to work on less and is that something that 223 00:11:53,600 --> 00:11:56,640 will later on help us? Right. 224 00:11:56,680 --> 00:11:59,760 Yeah. No, I mean the short answer, my 225 00:11:59,760 --> 00:12:02,680 answer to almost any question I literally teach us every day in 226 00:12:02,680 --> 00:12:06,000 class is it depends because everything is context specific. 227 00:12:06,200 --> 00:12:09,000 But in general, I think the short answer would be yes. 228 00:12:09,480 --> 00:12:13,880 Is that a way of of sort of training and or a form of 229 00:12:13,880 --> 00:12:17,000 stressing our body, overloading it in a certain capacity and 230 00:12:17,000 --> 00:12:18,920 then getting our body to want to adapt? 231 00:12:19,280 --> 00:12:21,880 Yes. Now actually just to sort of 232 00:12:21,880 --> 00:12:25,680 piggyback or go back a second, when I when we say the word 233 00:12:25,680 --> 00:12:28,520 deplete, we have to think well what are we depleting. 234 00:12:28,560 --> 00:12:33,080 So I guess the third reason why we would potentially not 235 00:12:33,080 --> 00:12:35,120 necessarily during a training session, but why would we want 236 00:12:35,120 --> 00:12:38,720 to fuel would be one, maintain blood glucose so we could 237 00:12:38,720 --> 00:12:41,600 deplete that. And then if we deplete that, 238 00:12:41,600 --> 00:12:45,200 we're not providing the, the working muscle with a supply, it 239 00:12:45,200 --> 00:12:46,840 doesn't now have access to that blood glucose. 240 00:12:46,840 --> 00:12:50,840 But prior to all of that leading up to you going out on a any 241 00:12:50,840 --> 00:12:55,800 type of a training run, we store that sugar, the glucose which is 242 00:12:55,800 --> 00:12:59,320 the main carbohydrate. We store that as glycogen in our 243 00:12:59,320 --> 00:13:02,560 muscles and in our livers. So that's another thing that if 244 00:13:02,560 --> 00:13:05,520 you ate like a decent meal, as long as you ate decently well 245 00:13:05,520 --> 00:13:09,760 yesterday, if you woke up this morning, A, that's a privilege. 246 00:13:09,760 --> 00:13:14,440 So yay, but B, when you're ready to go out on your run, you had 247 00:13:14,440 --> 00:13:17,720 liver glycogen which is stored sugar and then you had muscle 248 00:13:17,720 --> 00:13:19,960 glycogen which is also stored sugar. 249 00:13:20,720 --> 00:13:23,880 The liver glycogen might be low because and I know I'm sort of 250 00:13:24,200 --> 00:13:26,920 diverting, but I'll, I'll, I'm getting to that that question 251 00:13:26,920 --> 00:13:31,480 because this is a huge thing. The liver sugar, liver glycogen 252 00:13:31,800 --> 00:13:35,720 is its primary purpose is to be stored and then when you stop 253 00:13:35,720 --> 00:13:39,960 eating to be broken down and supply sugar glucose into the 254 00:13:39,960 --> 00:13:43,680 blood so the liver can help maintain that blood glucose. 255 00:13:44,360 --> 00:13:49,600 The reason for storing it in the muscle is 100% pure energy. 256 00:13:49,720 --> 00:13:52,840 Once that sugar and glucose gets into the muscle and it's stored 257 00:13:52,840 --> 00:13:56,080 as glycogen, really just once it gets in, it's never coming back 258 00:13:56,080 --> 00:13:58,280 out. It will only be used for fuel. 259 00:13:58,640 --> 00:14:04,320 So the idea would be if we go on a run and our liver glycogen is 260 00:14:04,320 --> 00:14:08,080 depleted, we can turn some other things into glucose. 261 00:14:08,080 --> 00:14:11,320 So the liver can convert things if it's depleted to try and 262 00:14:11,320 --> 00:14:13,800 maintain our blood sugar. And that's also going to 263 00:14:13,800 --> 00:14:17,320 stimulate our body and the liver to want to adapt to be able to 264 00:14:17,320 --> 00:14:20,400 make more sugar to keep our blood and brain happy. 265 00:14:20,400 --> 00:14:26,280 But if we go out and we either didn't replenish glycogen and 266 00:14:26,280 --> 00:14:31,080 now we're going out on a sort of a fasted run, the idea would be 267 00:14:31,080 --> 00:14:35,400 yes, we're now have asking our muscles to adapt and try and use 268 00:14:35,400 --> 00:14:38,440 alternative fuel source sources. And that's where you get into 269 00:14:38,440 --> 00:14:42,840 this term, fuel partitioning substrate, you know, metabolism, 270 00:14:43,120 --> 00:14:45,680 where it's you're you're basically burning, is it carb or 271 00:14:45,680 --> 00:14:49,000 is it fat. And if you run and you're not 272 00:14:49,000 --> 00:14:53,400 supplying constant sugar in a drink or bar or whatever and 273 00:14:53,400 --> 00:14:56,280 then you're also depleting it and then you go for another run 274 00:14:56,280 --> 00:14:58,800 and you're now running in a depleted glycogen state. 275 00:14:58,960 --> 00:15:03,920 Yes, your body over time will adapt to burning more fat. 276 00:15:03,920 --> 00:15:06,320 It's going to send all these signals and now your your your 277 00:15:06,320 --> 00:15:09,480 muscles are going to adapt to increase the amount of fat that 278 00:15:09,480 --> 00:15:12,680 it can transport, the amount of fat that it can store, and the 279 00:15:12,680 --> 00:15:16,800 amount of fat that it can burn to increase the amount of energy 280 00:15:16,800 --> 00:15:20,720 you can provide per second. Because you're now putting your 281 00:15:20,720 --> 00:15:25,720 muscles through an environment you're re you're you're think of 282 00:15:25,720 --> 00:15:29,680 it as a machine shop, and you're reshaping your metabolic engine, 283 00:15:29,680 --> 00:15:34,200 which is primarily your muscle. So yes, you will, you will adapt 284 00:15:34,200 --> 00:15:35,640 to it. It just takes time. 285 00:15:35,800 --> 00:15:39,720 If you didn't need anything all yesterday after a long run, and 286 00:15:39,720 --> 00:15:42,200 then you wake up today and still didn't need anything, you might 287 00:15:42,200 --> 00:15:46,000 feel like crap during your training run, but your body will 288 00:15:46,000 --> 00:15:48,760 adapt to that. If you go out and it's cold and 289 00:15:48,760 --> 00:15:51,760 then tomorrow it's really warm, your body will adapt to that. 290 00:15:51,760 --> 00:15:55,960 The one thing we generally don't adapt to is being dehydrated 291 00:15:56,160 --> 00:16:00,240 going into a training run. OK, yeah, that makes sense. 292 00:16:00,240 --> 00:16:03,520 And so then what about not depleting yourself of food for 293 00:16:03,520 --> 00:16:05,160 an entire day, but just in the morning? 294 00:16:05,160 --> 00:16:08,000 Because I know there's this whole, you know, commotion of 295 00:16:08,000 --> 00:16:11,040 some runners run without eating in the morning, speed because of 296 00:16:11,040 --> 00:16:14,000 time or, you know, because you're just kind of not ready to 297 00:16:14,000 --> 00:16:17,520 eat and then you go for a run. How does How does that affect 298 00:16:17,520 --> 00:16:19,240 it? Yes. 299 00:16:19,680 --> 00:16:24,360 So no matter what it's, it's going to cause an adaptation. 300 00:16:24,360 --> 00:16:27,920 Your body is going to have to try and get used to that. 301 00:16:28,200 --> 00:16:31,520 So in that session and where the word depends would come from 302 00:16:31,520 --> 00:16:34,560 would be if I was working with like an athlete or if there's a 303 00:16:34,560 --> 00:16:38,840 listener, the idea would be OK, Well, is this, What type of run 304 00:16:38,840 --> 00:16:42,200 is this? How close to your marathon? 305 00:16:42,600 --> 00:16:45,280 You know most of your list, How close is your race? 306 00:16:45,640 --> 00:16:48,600 If this is just a low, you know Matt Fitzgerald, we talked, you 307 00:16:48,600 --> 00:16:51,720 know this idea of 8020. So 80% are not moderate 308 00:16:51,720 --> 00:16:53,280 intensity, they're low intensity. 309 00:16:53,600 --> 00:16:56,720 It's at the lower intensity where we tend to not burn as 310 00:16:56,720 --> 00:16:59,760 much carb. So if you didn't need anything 311 00:17:00,360 --> 00:17:04,880 and you don't have a race coming up and this isn't a very high 312 00:17:04,880 --> 00:17:10,440 intensity workout, which those only happen 20%, then your 313 00:17:10,440 --> 00:17:15,800 body's going to adapt 100% should you feel bad. 314 00:17:16,280 --> 00:17:19,160 Now here's where you have to take this into the context of 315 00:17:19,160 --> 00:17:21,119 your own life. Do you have a really important 316 00:17:21,119 --> 00:17:23,359 meeting that day? Do you have an exam that day? 317 00:17:23,359 --> 00:17:26,560 If you're a student you know, do you have like something later 318 00:17:26,560 --> 00:17:28,880 on? It's a presentation or you like 319 00:17:28,880 --> 00:17:33,120 an interview? If you know you have that, you 320 00:17:33,120 --> 00:17:37,240 might want to eat something that morning because you might not 321 00:17:37,240 --> 00:17:39,360 feel wonderful after that run in. 322 00:17:39,360 --> 00:17:42,920 In general, you probably won't feel horrible, but you might not 323 00:17:42,920 --> 00:17:46,080 be able to hit the higher intensities during that run when 324 00:17:46,080 --> 00:17:48,560 oh, I didn't need anything last night, or even if I did and I 325 00:17:48,560 --> 00:17:50,640 just, I'm going to wake up and do a fasted run. 326 00:17:51,400 --> 00:17:54,720 And that will after like a week of running, you'll start to 327 00:17:54,720 --> 00:17:57,200 really adapt to that. And after two weeks of running, 328 00:17:57,720 --> 00:18:01,560 your cells and muscles are going to be pretty decently acclimated 329 00:18:01,560 --> 00:18:03,920 by 4 weeks. You're now becoming a fat 330 00:18:03,920 --> 00:18:07,520 burning machine, so to speak. OK. 331 00:18:07,560 --> 00:18:12,200 And then I guess with all that in context, if you are only not 332 00:18:12,200 --> 00:18:16,600 fuelling your runs that are not high intensity and all that, but 333 00:18:16,600 --> 00:18:19,560 then there's marathon day. Obviously we fuel on marathon 334 00:18:19,560 --> 00:18:21,960 day, how does that affect us differently? 335 00:18:21,960 --> 00:18:27,120 Is there any kind of perk, I guess, for having adapted to 336 00:18:27,120 --> 00:18:30,240 becoming more of a fat burning machine when it comes to 337 00:18:30,240 --> 00:18:32,560 marathon day? Will that I guess in the later 338 00:18:32,560 --> 00:18:36,480 miles make us better? Once your liver is depleted of 339 00:18:36,480 --> 00:18:40,920 the glycogen, can you then handle the later miles better if 340 00:18:40,920 --> 00:18:44,840 you in theory didn't fuel your easy runs throughout the week? 341 00:18:45,120 --> 00:18:47,920 Or does that not have any kind of effect on it whatsoever? 342 00:18:48,280 --> 00:18:51,280 Yeah. So you should be able to, the 343 00:18:51,280 --> 00:18:54,520 data supports that. You should be able to handle 344 00:18:54,520 --> 00:18:58,400 those later miles better, you know, and that's you're not 345 00:18:58,400 --> 00:19:01,040 really following like we didn't even get into like I'm not 346 00:19:01,040 --> 00:19:03,080 necessarily saying follow a low carb diet. 347 00:19:03,080 --> 00:19:05,480 It's just you get into this idea of nutrient timing. 348 00:19:05,480 --> 00:19:09,600 I think it was John Ivy back in like 96 or something published 349 00:19:09,600 --> 00:19:12,520 like a book, nutrient timing, published a bunch of papers. 350 00:19:12,760 --> 00:19:16,960 Because the idea would be, should you be more adapted and 351 00:19:16,960 --> 00:19:21,680 ready for those later miles. If you ran a decent number of 352 00:19:21,680 --> 00:19:26,240 your low intensity, even longer runs in either a fasted state or 353 00:19:26,240 --> 00:19:28,760 you really didn't eat much whatsoever, or you ate something 354 00:19:28,760 --> 00:19:32,440 that was like crazy slow absorption and you're not taking 355 00:19:32,440 --> 00:19:36,240 only sugars, yes you should. What it also gives you the 356 00:19:36,240 --> 00:19:39,120 advantage of is suppose they don't have something at the aid 357 00:19:39,120 --> 00:19:41,160 station. Suppose you're having like GI 358 00:19:41,160 --> 00:19:44,720 issues from whatever goo or gel or whatever you had at the last 359 00:19:44,720 --> 00:19:47,960 aid station. The idea would be if you're that 360 00:19:47,960 --> 00:19:51,160 type of individual who only fuels you're you're you're 361 00:19:51,160 --> 00:19:56,920 forming your metabolic muscle engine to burn almost 362 00:19:56,920 --> 00:20:00,720 exclusively sugary drinks and sugary foods. 363 00:20:01,400 --> 00:20:03,640 Then you need those sugary drinks and sugary foods, 364 00:20:03,680 --> 00:20:08,680 especially when you get to like 18/19/20 towards that final, let 365 00:20:08,720 --> 00:20:12,000 me say final, you know that those final five miles, 6 miles. 366 00:20:13,120 --> 00:20:15,240 If you're dependent on that, you need those. 367 00:20:15,240 --> 00:20:18,800 Otherwise that's where you will bonk because your your metabolic 368 00:20:18,800 --> 00:20:24,440 machinery doesn't have the capacity to to tap into more fat 369 00:20:24,920 --> 00:20:27,600 at whatever intensity you're running, if that makes sense. 370 00:20:28,200 --> 00:20:29,680 It does. It does completely make sense. 371 00:20:29,680 --> 00:20:32,880 And it makes me wonder why there has been lately so much stress 372 00:20:32,880 --> 00:20:37,640 on runners being told you know, just by everything out there, 373 00:20:37,640 --> 00:20:40,000 you got to fuel all of your runs, wake up and fuel your 374 00:20:40,000 --> 00:20:42,560 runs, regardless of the intensity. 375 00:20:43,920 --> 00:20:48,800 So I mean I when I give talks, I give this, this one talk, the 376 00:20:48,800 --> 00:20:50,560 title of it. Lately when I present to 377 00:20:50,760 --> 00:20:52,600 conferences and things like that, it's called the 378 00:20:52,600 --> 00:20:56,400 carbohydrate conundrum is more, better than enough, you know? 379 00:20:56,400 --> 00:20:59,640 And the idea would be well, no, because enough should be enough. 380 00:20:59,640 --> 00:21:02,120 So going over enough, it's just the key is finding out what is 381 00:21:02,120 --> 00:21:07,920 enough and a big part back in like 19, it was like 19 O eight. 382 00:21:07,920 --> 00:21:11,560 It was the Boston Marathon. They showed hey, these runners 383 00:21:11,600 --> 00:21:14,040 don't look so good and they tested their blood glucose and 384 00:21:14,040 --> 00:21:16,000 they showed that they were low and then these runners do look 385 00:21:16,000 --> 00:21:19,120 good and their glucose was good. So it's like that initiated this 386 00:21:19,600 --> 00:21:23,240 whole widespread well then let's just keep giving them glucose. 387 00:21:23,240 --> 00:21:26,000 And then in the 60s they started testing glucose in the muscle 388 00:21:26,080 --> 00:21:30,040 glycogen, the Bergstrom method. And then from there in the 80s 389 00:21:30,040 --> 00:21:35,440 and really 90s, there was just this explosion of not let's see 390 00:21:35,440 --> 00:21:39,880 how how getting more carbohydrate in will help our 391 00:21:39,880 --> 00:21:41,960 performance. They did look at some studies 392 00:21:41,960 --> 00:21:44,080 like that. Most of the studies were let's 393 00:21:44,080 --> 00:21:47,800 see how much carb we can get our muscles to burn and let's see 394 00:21:47,800 --> 00:21:51,440 how much carb, let's see how long it takes for our gut to 395 00:21:51,440 --> 00:21:56,440 have to adapt to taking as much sugar as possible. 396 00:21:56,560 --> 00:22:01,280 And I mean, in general, once you go above 60 grams per hour, 397 00:22:02,600 --> 00:22:05,920 there's not a lot of data, and there's just as much or plenty 398 00:22:05,920 --> 00:22:10,840 more data to show that going above 60 grams per hour is like, 399 00:22:11,280 --> 00:22:13,960 what's the point? Which is crazy because not for 400 00:22:13,960 --> 00:22:17,280 your listeners, but like the Cycling World right now, they're 401 00:22:18,080 --> 00:22:20,760 they're just going insane. They're like 200. 402 00:22:20,760 --> 00:22:23,600 They're going like nuts. And there's still tons of 403 00:22:23,600 --> 00:22:25,680 studies for like the last 20 years. 404 00:22:25,760 --> 00:22:28,320 Oscar, you can Droop is like one of the big He was the director 405 00:22:28,320 --> 00:22:31,040 of the Gatorade Sports Science Institute, Brilliant scientist 406 00:22:31,720 --> 00:22:33,320 and most of his literature shows. 407 00:22:33,880 --> 00:22:38,200 You know, if we give you like glucose because you can buy like 408 00:22:38,200 --> 00:22:40,800 cytosport is like pure maltodextrin, just pure glucose, 409 00:22:40,960 --> 00:22:43,600 you can burn approximately 60 grams in an hour. 410 00:22:43,600 --> 00:22:46,720 But if we give you some additional sugar, that's like 411 00:22:46,720 --> 00:22:49,960 sucrose has fructose. While we can get you to burn a 412 00:22:49,960 --> 00:22:54,200 lot more, but we don't really see this huge benefit from a 413 00:22:54,200 --> 00:22:56,640 performance standpoint. And then a big part of that as 414 00:22:56,640 --> 00:22:59,760 well is you have to give it time. 415 00:23:00,040 --> 00:23:03,040 You know, like nobody's going to sign up for a marathon if you're 416 00:23:03,040 --> 00:23:06,840 not currently in shape for the pace that you want to run six 417 00:23:06,840 --> 00:23:10,600 weeks from now, you're going to give yourself 18 plus or minus 418 00:23:10,600 --> 00:23:13,120 weeks to train for it. OK, well, why aren't you giving 419 00:23:13,120 --> 00:23:18,800 yourself that time to adapt nutritionally to random runs 420 00:23:18,800 --> 00:23:21,680 that are run either in just a glycogen depleted or, you know, 421 00:23:21,680 --> 00:23:23,520 wake up and go out on a fasted run. 422 00:23:23,880 --> 00:23:28,160 Over time you will adapt. Like there's very few people 423 00:23:28,160 --> 00:23:30,080 that wouldn't adapt. Genetics are going to play 424 00:23:30,080 --> 00:23:33,720 random roles, but like more often than not most people, if 425 00:23:33,720 --> 00:23:37,640 you give it time, they will adapt to store more fat in the 426 00:23:37,640 --> 00:23:41,000 muscle and then be able to burn more fat at that same running 427 00:23:41,000 --> 00:23:43,920 pace. That's super interesting. 428 00:23:43,920 --> 00:23:47,600 So you know, that also makes me wonder a little bit about the 429 00:23:47,600 --> 00:23:50,400 different types of fueling. You were talking about sucrose 430 00:23:50,400 --> 00:23:52,720 and glucose. Maybe you can get into that a 431 00:23:52,720 --> 00:23:56,040 little bit. What is the ideal fueling for an 432 00:23:56,040 --> 00:23:59,360 endurance runner and why? And then also maybe you know a 433 00:23:59,360 --> 00:24:01,560 little bit more detail where it gets stored and and what the 434 00:24:01,560 --> 00:24:03,920 purpose is for that. Yeah. 435 00:24:03,920 --> 00:24:08,280 So the, I mean the ideal fueling plan is going to be 436 00:24:08,280 --> 00:24:13,080 individualized for the runner. You know if someone's a 2 1/2 437 00:24:13,080 --> 00:24:16,600 hour marathoner versus a three hour versus a four hour versus 438 00:24:16,600 --> 00:24:20,560 A5 hour, the intensities at which you're going to run and 439 00:24:20,560 --> 00:24:23,440 then obviously the duration that one person's running for three 440 00:24:23,440 --> 00:24:26,040 hours, the other one might be running for another hour or 441 00:24:26,040 --> 00:24:31,840 maybe two more hours. So generally that person running 442 00:24:31,840 --> 00:24:36,720 at the two, two, let's say two worlds elite to like 3 hour, 443 00:24:37,160 --> 00:24:43,840 they're probably at 7580 maybe 85% of their Max VO2 Max like 444 00:24:43,840 --> 00:24:47,800 their Max capacity. Whereas many others might run if 445 00:24:47,800 --> 00:24:50,720 you're 4 hour around there four to five you might run at you 446 00:24:50,720 --> 00:24:53,240 know 70% like a little bit lower than that. 447 00:24:53,520 --> 00:24:56,840 So that change in intensity and the change in the speed and 448 00:24:56,840 --> 00:25:00,320 power output, you're going to be burning more total calories per 449 00:25:00,320 --> 00:25:04,320 minute and then you might be burning more carbohydrate if 450 00:25:04,320 --> 00:25:10,200 you're at a higher intensity. Now from a fueling a big part of 451 00:25:10,200 --> 00:25:13,640 it's going to be trial, you know a lot of it's trial and error. 452 00:25:13,640 --> 00:25:16,360 We have recommendations with tons of studies that we've been 453 00:25:16,360 --> 00:25:18,880 doing like thousands and thousands of studies over like 454 00:25:18,880 --> 00:25:23,400 the last 100 years. So the recommendation is, you 455 00:25:23,400 --> 00:25:26,040 know, we have general nutrition intake, we want to get enough 456 00:25:26,040 --> 00:25:28,080 protein. Protein is going to be really 457 00:25:28,080 --> 00:25:30,840 big, especially for runners because you're going to 458 00:25:30,840 --> 00:25:32,600 replenish repair and things like that. 459 00:25:32,600 --> 00:25:35,840 And from a carbohydrate standpoint, we have, is this a 460 00:25:35,840 --> 00:25:40,120 competition 4 hours prior, You know, you're going to want to 461 00:25:40,120 --> 00:25:44,040 eat like a a decent meal. It can have carbs, fats, 462 00:25:44,040 --> 00:25:47,240 proteins, 3 hours, a little bit less fat, a little bit less 463 00:25:47,240 --> 00:25:49,560 fiber, a little bit less protein, 2 hours, a little bit 464 00:25:49,560 --> 00:25:52,520 less of that and then one hour. You know if you're going to 465 00:25:52,560 --> 00:25:55,480 consume carb, try and make it like complex carbs. 466 00:25:56,280 --> 00:26:01,760 I'm not a huge fan of like one hour to toe the line of really 467 00:26:01,760 --> 00:26:05,920 taking any type of simple sugar. There are some individuals who 468 00:26:05,920 --> 00:26:09,800 can have what they call a hypo, hypoglycemic like rebound 469 00:26:09,800 --> 00:26:13,280 effect, where you're going to take some sugar before your run. 470 00:26:13,280 --> 00:26:15,680 Your body's going to release insulin, which is this hormone 471 00:26:15,680 --> 00:26:18,640 that tells your body to store and take up the glucose. 472 00:26:19,120 --> 00:26:21,280 And now you lower your glucose back down and then you start 473 00:26:21,280 --> 00:26:23,640 running. And the running alone now starts 474 00:26:23,640 --> 00:26:25,920 taking glucose out of the blood and your blood glucose can drop 475 00:26:25,920 --> 00:26:27,840 even lower. It doesn't happen to a lot of 476 00:26:27,840 --> 00:26:30,480 people, but if it does happen to you, you're going to bonk within 477 00:26:30,480 --> 00:26:32,840 1015 minutes if you do something like that. 478 00:26:32,840 --> 00:26:35,160 So it's like, why are you even taking that sugar in the 1st 479 00:26:35,160 --> 00:26:38,080 place? So when you say should I take 480 00:26:40,520 --> 00:26:45,240 sucrose, like mixed fructose glucose, Should I take only 481 00:26:45,240 --> 00:26:46,640 glucose? Should I take gels? 482 00:26:46,640 --> 00:26:49,320 Should I take bars? A lot of that's going to be 483 00:26:49,320 --> 00:26:52,200 individualized for most of the training. 484 00:26:53,040 --> 00:26:56,640 I just don't see the anything less than 60 minutes. 485 00:26:56,640 --> 00:26:58,920 I'll actually preface that if you're going to go out for a run 486 00:26:59,000 --> 00:27:02,280 for less than 60 minutes physiologically, like 487 00:27:03,560 --> 00:27:06,960 metabolically, the literature shows that there's essentially 488 00:27:06,960 --> 00:27:12,240 no need for you to consume any sugar during that that run. 489 00:27:12,560 --> 00:27:14,840 Why? Because if you ate properly 490 00:27:14,840 --> 00:27:18,320 leading up to that training run, then you should have plenty of 491 00:27:18,320 --> 00:27:21,400 stored sugar in your muscle to easily last you an hour. 492 00:27:21,880 --> 00:27:23,680 It could last you up to two hours. 493 00:27:24,120 --> 00:27:28,360 You know, we'll store about 1600 calories, so divide that by 4. 494 00:27:28,560 --> 00:27:31,800 You know you're going to get like 400 grams of sugar stored 495 00:27:32,240 --> 00:27:35,400 in the muscle. The liver is going to store a 496 00:27:35,400 --> 00:27:37,080 smaller amount. It's going to store like 100 497 00:27:37,080 --> 00:27:38,880 grams, so maybe like 400 calories. 498 00:27:39,320 --> 00:27:41,440 So less than 60 minutes. Like you shouldn't need 499 00:27:41,440 --> 00:27:47,360 anything. I can go into as much detail as 500 00:27:47,360 --> 00:27:51,200 you want about any stuff, but you know let me know where you 501 00:27:51,200 --> 00:27:52,080 want to go from. There. 502 00:27:52,080 --> 00:27:54,040 No, I think, you know, I've been taking notes. 503 00:27:54,040 --> 00:27:55,880 This is all really interesting data. 504 00:27:55,960 --> 00:28:01,080 So I'm loving this, I guess. I guess, yes, trial by error, 505 00:28:01,080 --> 00:28:03,240 right. Because obviously we want to 506 00:28:03,240 --> 00:28:06,360 fuel our long runs on the weekends and try these gels 507 00:28:06,360 --> 00:28:09,240 that, you know, they might taste good at 10 miles, but then at 508 00:28:09,240 --> 00:28:14,480 1314 they don't taste the same maybe, I guess, on that one. 509 00:28:14,480 --> 00:28:17,600 Why is that the case? Why is something that's so tasty 510 00:28:17,600 --> 00:28:21,320 at mile 4-5 not tasty anymore at 15? 511 00:28:21,320 --> 00:28:24,120 What happens with our body and our perception? 512 00:28:24,680 --> 00:28:26,880 Yeah, I mean that's actually a great question. 513 00:28:26,960 --> 00:28:30,360 One I one I haven't probably given as much thought and I I, I 514 00:28:30,680 --> 00:28:34,160 there are food chemists that I know that I could ask that 515 00:28:34,400 --> 00:28:36,320 question to. I mean, my guess would be 516 00:28:36,320 --> 00:28:39,240 there's something hormonally that adds the hormones over 517 00:28:39,240 --> 00:28:41,720 time. There's a like a palatability 518 00:28:41,960 --> 00:28:45,440 where just over time you're just, you're just going to get 519 00:28:45,440 --> 00:28:47,440 tired of that taste in your mouth. 520 00:28:48,320 --> 00:28:51,080 And oh, as you know, let's see, you're going out and you're 521 00:28:51,080 --> 00:28:55,960 going 10 mile, 13 mile, like, you know, like a longer run your 522 00:28:56,040 --> 00:28:57,800 your brain is going to shift things. 523 00:28:57,800 --> 00:29:02,480 So as you start to get fatigued, you're going to go out on a even 524 00:29:02,480 --> 00:29:04,800 if you're running low intensity, there's an aspect of fatigue 525 00:29:04,800 --> 00:29:07,520 that you're going to, like, get to. 526 00:29:07,920 --> 00:29:10,600 Your brain's going to start shifting things towards just 527 00:29:10,600 --> 00:29:13,040 general survival mode. Like the only thing your brain 528 00:29:13,040 --> 00:29:14,320 cares about is keeping you alive. 529 00:29:14,640 --> 00:29:17,840 In the biological world, we use like the term homeostasis, and 530 00:29:17,840 --> 00:29:21,280 that's just keeping your body in relative constancy. 531 00:29:21,480 --> 00:29:24,720 You know, like a constant or relatively constant state. 532 00:29:25,120 --> 00:29:27,400 Your glucose goes slightly up and down, your temperature goes 533 00:29:27,400 --> 00:29:30,360 slightly up and down. Your pH, your salt, stuff like 534 00:29:30,360 --> 00:29:33,680 that. So our brain wants that and it 535 00:29:33,680 --> 00:29:35,880 really wants glucose to stay normal. 536 00:29:35,880 --> 00:29:39,880 So it it's probably just some type of preference things going 537 00:29:39,880 --> 00:29:42,960 on with the brain that are just messing you up. 538 00:29:43,360 --> 00:29:46,160 The key with here's the one thing that no one ever talks 539 00:29:46,160 --> 00:29:51,480 about, almost all the literature that has ever been done on 540 00:29:51,760 --> 00:29:56,000 taking in lots and more sugar during research studies that are 541 00:29:56,000 --> 00:29:58,960 looking at performance. It's very rare for them to give 542 00:29:58,960 --> 00:30:03,560 that to you like once every hour or even once every 30 minutes. 543 00:30:03,560 --> 00:30:07,200 Most of the studies actually look at 15 minute boluses. 544 00:30:07,600 --> 00:30:10,280 It's like every 15 minutes we're going to give these subjects 545 00:30:10,480 --> 00:30:13,040 this amount of sugar. And it's like how many of your 546 00:30:13,040 --> 00:30:18,400 listeners, how many of you would love to pound a gel or pound 547 00:30:18,400 --> 00:30:22,160 some Gatorade or whatever other it is every 15 minutes. 548 00:30:22,360 --> 00:30:26,960 And it's like, I know I don't. So most of the literature is 549 00:30:26,960 --> 00:30:30,600 based on that type of controlled, you know, randomized 550 00:30:30,600 --> 00:30:34,360 controlled trials in the laboratory on a treadmill or on 551 00:30:34,360 --> 00:30:37,640 a bike. And the idea is it's every 15 552 00:30:37,640 --> 00:30:39,120 minutes they're giving you this amount. 553 00:30:39,520 --> 00:30:44,200 And in the real world, you're half a marathon in or you're 554 00:30:44,200 --> 00:30:45,760 going out on that long training run. 555 00:30:45,760 --> 00:30:48,360 And it's like, who wants to a bring that much? 556 00:30:48,360 --> 00:30:49,960 How far apart are the aid stations? 557 00:30:49,960 --> 00:30:52,280 If you're running the race and then you got to carry all that 558 00:30:52,280 --> 00:30:55,000 stuff. So then you get into this whole 559 00:30:55,000 --> 00:30:59,120 concept of like why are they recommending so much during and 560 00:30:59,120 --> 00:31:03,440 everyone uses this concept of glycogen sparing and and that's 561 00:31:03,440 --> 00:31:07,520 just simply not true. So the glycogen sparing myth is 562 00:31:07,760 --> 00:31:11,640 that we store glucose as glycogen in our muscles. 563 00:31:12,000 --> 00:31:16,000 And the myth is that on a a longer run, let's say an hour or 564 00:31:16,000 --> 00:31:21,400 two hours or or even longer, by taking in dietary sugar, you're 565 00:31:21,400 --> 00:31:25,160 going to spare your muscle from having to tap into that stored 566 00:31:25,160 --> 00:31:27,200 glycogen. So you're going to keep it as 567 00:31:27,200 --> 00:31:30,080 glycogen and not break it down and you're going to tell your 568 00:31:30,080 --> 00:31:33,480 muscle, just use this blood sugar, use the sugar that I just 569 00:31:33,480 --> 00:31:37,240 drank and that doesn't happen. And the reason is because we 570 00:31:37,240 --> 00:31:41,360 store the sugar as glycogen because it's the fastest burning 571 00:31:41,360 --> 00:31:46,600 fuel that will, that will give us energy over a 30 minute, 60 572 00:31:46,600 --> 00:31:49,800 minute time period. So your muscle, when it's doing 573 00:31:49,800 --> 00:31:55,280 it in intensity, that warrants immediate energy, it's going to 574 00:31:55,280 --> 00:31:58,480 use the glycogen no matter how much sugar you throw at it from 575 00:31:58,480 --> 00:32:00,880 the blood. All right, so then instead, your 576 00:32:00,880 --> 00:32:04,560 muscle, your your body uses your muscles glycogen and then we're 577 00:32:04,640 --> 00:32:08,200 going to the liver next. Yeah, you're going to, yeah, The 578 00:32:08,200 --> 00:32:13,160 liver is putting glucose out. It's either making it from some 579 00:32:13,160 --> 00:32:16,040 byproducts of fat, not the fat, but things that we store fat 580 00:32:16,040 --> 00:32:18,240 with, there's this glycerol. So your liver can make that 581 00:32:18,240 --> 00:32:21,640 glucose from other things. That's called gluconeogenesis, 582 00:32:21,640 --> 00:32:25,560 like we make new sugar from other things, but then it stores 583 00:32:25,560 --> 00:32:27,400 the the glycogen in the liver and we break it down. 584 00:32:27,680 --> 00:32:30,800 So that liver's purpose is to supply glucose to the blood. 585 00:32:31,000 --> 00:32:34,080 I have one study I was looking at this morning, it's 175g per 586 00:32:34,080 --> 00:32:38,960 hour for a 2 hour session and they showed that versus you know 587 00:32:38,960 --> 00:32:41,520 like 30 grams or something. There's no difference in 588 00:32:41,520 --> 00:32:44,240 glycogen breakdown. Your muscles are going to use 589 00:32:44,240 --> 00:32:47,320 the stored sugar, glucose at which is glycogen. 590 00:32:47,560 --> 00:32:50,360 They're going to use it based on intensity, based on the 591 00:32:50,360 --> 00:32:53,120 contraction itself. If you contract your muscles 592 00:32:53,120 --> 00:32:56,120 more and you crack contract them more forcefully, you know, if 593 00:32:56,120 --> 00:32:58,520 you're having a bigger stride because you're doing a faster 594 00:32:58,520 --> 00:33:01,080 pace, your muscles are going to break down and go into the 595 00:33:01,080 --> 00:33:04,960 glycogen whenever they feel the need that they need that super 596 00:33:04,960 --> 00:33:07,600 fuel. We store a finite amount of it 597 00:33:07,600 --> 00:33:09,000 over time. Yeah, deplete it. 598 00:33:09,000 --> 00:33:11,160 You can replenish it and store it a little bit more, but you 599 00:33:11,160 --> 00:33:14,320 can only pack so much sugar into your muscle because your muscle 600 00:33:14,320 --> 00:33:17,160 has to store water with it. But we don't spare it. 601 00:33:17,440 --> 00:33:20,760 So every podcast I ever go on, I love dispelling that myth 602 00:33:20,760 --> 00:33:26,600 because all of the sugar gurus, their studies are the ones that 603 00:33:26,600 --> 00:33:28,760 are showing we're not sparing muscle glycogen. 604 00:33:29,160 --> 00:33:31,680 Is it possible? It's possible, but it's almost 605 00:33:32,680 --> 00:33:36,040 non existent. You can take in 200 grams an 606 00:33:36,040 --> 00:33:38,240 hour and you're still not going to spare it. 607 00:33:38,240 --> 00:33:40,600 Your your muscles are still going to breakdown glycogen at 608 00:33:40,600 --> 00:33:42,920 whatever rate. If you want to take dietary 609 00:33:42,920 --> 00:33:46,080 sugar during a run, what it's going to do is it's going to 610 00:33:46,200 --> 00:33:48,680 it's going to keep the blood glucose normal and it's going to 611 00:33:48,680 --> 00:33:51,640 spare the liver glycogen. But anyway. 612 00:33:52,320 --> 00:33:57,560 So then once the muscles have been depleted of glycogen, how, 613 00:33:57,920 --> 00:34:00,720 I mean, I'm sure you've seen a ton of charts from endurance 614 00:34:00,720 --> 00:34:03,040 athletes running at a certain pace and heart rate and all 615 00:34:03,040 --> 00:34:04,360 that. What happens? 616 00:34:04,360 --> 00:34:08,159 I heard that this is probably 2 hours or so into your intense 617 00:34:08,159 --> 00:34:10,800 high intensity run and then what happens? 618 00:34:10,800 --> 00:34:14,920 We see a heightened heart rate and that's where we hit the wall 619 00:34:14,920 --> 00:34:17,280 and fall off. All wheels fall off. 620 00:34:17,679 --> 00:34:20,320 Yeah, well, yeah, the ultimate. I mean, there's multiple reasons 621 00:34:20,320 --> 00:34:23,960 why someone would like like Crazy Bonk and all of a sudden 622 00:34:23,960 --> 00:34:27,199 you just like can't run anymore. Because what would start to 623 00:34:27,199 --> 00:34:30,520 happen is once that glycogen gets low, now you're not able to 624 00:34:30,520 --> 00:34:33,719 maintain that pace because you can't generate the energy that 625 00:34:33,719 --> 00:34:36,440 fast to keep your muscles contracting. 626 00:34:36,440 --> 00:34:39,920 So you would just slow down. But because the brain cares 627 00:34:39,920 --> 00:34:44,480 about survival, that's slowing down, many times can come with 628 00:34:44,840 --> 00:34:48,440 like extreme fatigue. And that would be sort of that 629 00:34:48,520 --> 00:34:51,199 bonk. What if you're 2 hours in and 630 00:34:51,199 --> 00:34:53,760 you're depleting that glycogen part of that? 631 00:34:53,760 --> 00:34:57,360 Then it is, well, what's your hydration status? 632 00:34:57,360 --> 00:35:00,000 So there's other factors that are going to go into like that 633 00:35:00,000 --> 00:35:03,600 complete bonk, but what would happen 2 hours in if you were 634 00:35:03,600 --> 00:35:09,320 running at like like hardcore marathon pace or like 8085% or 635 00:35:09,320 --> 00:35:10,920 90%? You would simply just have to 636 00:35:10,920 --> 00:35:13,600 slow down your your muscles are going to be able to shift a 637 00:35:13,600 --> 00:35:16,320 little bit and up regulate the amount of fat that they're 638 00:35:16,320 --> 00:35:18,960 burning and the amount of like sugar they're taking out of 639 00:35:18,960 --> 00:35:20,560 blood. But once that glycogen is 640 00:35:20,560 --> 00:35:24,840 depleted, which can be around 2 hours at like a high enough 641 00:35:24,840 --> 00:35:27,280 intensity, you're going to have to slow down. 642 00:35:28,120 --> 00:35:32,000 OK, perfect. And I guess, well, maybe my 643 00:35:32,000 --> 00:35:36,080 last, maybe not, but my question is there's different gels and I 644 00:35:36,080 --> 00:35:38,360 know you've studied different gels in depth. 645 00:35:38,880 --> 00:35:42,440 I've tested you can since about November. 646 00:35:42,840 --> 00:35:46,760 I feel great using it. It might also be that you know 647 00:35:46,760 --> 00:35:50,040 for the first time I'm really regularly using a gel, whereas 648 00:35:50,040 --> 00:35:52,520 before I would just kind of take whatever was in the pantry. 649 00:35:52,520 --> 00:35:54,840 But I'm kind of more on a regimen right now. 650 00:35:55,120 --> 00:35:59,000 But I know that you can talks about having their slow release 651 00:35:59,000 --> 00:36:01,920 carbs versus there being quick release carbs. 652 00:36:02,280 --> 00:36:04,920 And since you have studied, you can maybe you can talk to us a 653 00:36:04,920 --> 00:36:09,400 little bit about if that works and how all that is? 654 00:36:10,120 --> 00:36:12,360 Yeah. So a couple years ago I did a 655 00:36:12,360 --> 00:36:17,680 research study looking at testing generation you can back 656 00:36:17,680 --> 00:36:20,200 then it was called super starch. Today it's called live steady 657 00:36:20,320 --> 00:36:24,520 and it's a cornstarch derived you know, carb product. 658 00:36:25,200 --> 00:36:29,480 And the idea is the the big claim was always, which is what 659 00:36:29,480 --> 00:36:32,840 my literature showed, that it's absorbed very slowly, but it's 660 00:36:32,840 --> 00:36:36,800 these huge molecules, but it has a low osmolality, meaning 661 00:36:36,800 --> 00:36:42,640 there's not a lot of molecules in like a particular solution. 662 00:36:42,640 --> 00:36:47,000 So it passes from the stomach very quickly and then it's more 663 00:36:47,000 --> 00:36:49,240 in your small intestine. That's where we actually like 664 00:36:49,280 --> 00:36:53,080 truly cleave it and break it apart into glucose molecules and 665 00:36:53,080 --> 00:36:55,600 bring it into the body. And that happens very, very 666 00:36:55,600 --> 00:36:57,600 slowly. So it doesn't slosh around in 667 00:36:57,600 --> 00:37:00,080 your stomach and then it just sits in the small intestine, 668 00:37:00,080 --> 00:37:02,960 which doesn't slosh around and it gets broken down very, very, 669 00:37:02,960 --> 00:37:06,480 very slowly. So I put elite runners, I tied 670 00:37:06,480 --> 00:37:08,600 triathletes, ultra endurance marathon runners. 671 00:37:08,600 --> 00:37:11,520 They ran 3 hours on the treadmill and they did it three 672 00:37:11,520 --> 00:37:13,560 times. They either took water, they 673 00:37:13,560 --> 00:37:17,040 used generation Yukin, or they used a maltodextrin, which is 674 00:37:17,040 --> 00:37:20,840 pure glucose and absorbed faster than almost any other sugar on 675 00:37:20,840 --> 00:37:23,160 the market. They came, they were each came 676 00:37:23,160 --> 00:37:25,480 in three times. And what we showed was the water 677 00:37:25,480 --> 00:37:28,960 group, their glucose didn't spike, but their glucose 678 00:37:28,960 --> 00:37:31,360 dropped. You know, eventually over time 679 00:37:31,800 --> 00:37:36,240 the maltodextrin group, their sugars shot up 'cause we gave 680 00:37:36,240 --> 00:37:39,360 them 50 grams once and then nothing for the remainder of the 681 00:37:39,360 --> 00:37:42,160 three run, Three hour run, glucose shut up in the 682 00:37:42,160 --> 00:37:45,000 maltodextrin group. And then by 60 minutes it was 683 00:37:45,000 --> 00:37:47,520 actually right AT. And then right after 60 minutes 684 00:37:47,520 --> 00:37:49,880 it dropped below resting glucose. 685 00:37:50,360 --> 00:37:53,440 And then in the Super starch group or the Live Steady group, 686 00:37:54,200 --> 00:37:57,880 it slowly rise Rose didn't really rise up that much and 687 00:37:57,880 --> 00:38:01,200 then it kind of tapered off and lasted all three hours. 688 00:38:01,680 --> 00:38:04,800 I used Stabilized to tracer this fancy technique where I can 689 00:38:04,800 --> 00:38:07,080 collect breath and I can actually analyze how many grams 690 00:38:07,080 --> 00:38:09,080 of the drink you're burning per hour. 691 00:38:09,680 --> 00:38:14,080 And the the Live Steady was still showing up in like most of 692 00:38:14,080 --> 00:38:18,800 the subjects at 3 hours, whereas we recouped pretty much all of 693 00:38:18,800 --> 00:38:22,400 the maltodextrin like there was nothing left whatsoever. 694 00:38:22,800 --> 00:38:27,400 The idea there would be for me that's like you and I have 695 00:38:27,400 --> 00:38:30,240 talked in the past of this idea of consistency. 696 00:38:30,840 --> 00:38:33,720 You've got to be consistent with your training runs, you know. 697 00:38:33,720 --> 00:38:37,080 And it's that consistency that's going to lead to you probably 698 00:38:37,080 --> 00:38:39,880 toeing the line on marathon day and running the pace that you 699 00:38:39,880 --> 00:38:43,320 want because you've you have a proven track record of miles and 700 00:38:43,320 --> 00:38:47,600 bounce under your belt. So the idea of of products, you 701 00:38:47,600 --> 00:38:50,680 know, I mean I'll I'll eat oatmeal on a lot of mornings but 702 00:38:50,680 --> 00:38:54,000 if I'm going out on a run I'll take with me something like the 703 00:38:54,000 --> 00:38:55,680 generation. You can either they're, they 704 00:38:55,680 --> 00:38:57,880 have these gel packets which are which are awesome. 705 00:38:57,880 --> 00:38:59,960 They're not as concentrated, which is great. 706 00:39:00,040 --> 00:39:04,560 It's not like this massive shot of sweet sugar you know they 707 00:39:04,560 --> 00:39:07,040 have the bars stuff like that if powder. 708 00:39:07,280 --> 00:39:11,160 So what I use that for is I call it like AIV trickle. 709 00:39:11,160 --> 00:39:13,920 It's an insurance policy. It's going to give you an IV 710 00:39:14,000 --> 00:39:18,640 trickle of glucose into the bloodstream and it's going to 711 00:39:18,640 --> 00:39:24,160 ultimately create an almost bonk proof glucose scenario because 712 00:39:24,160 --> 00:39:26,240 that bonk is really blood glucose. 713 00:39:26,240 --> 00:39:28,760 Like your your muscle glycogen is never going to be depleted to 714 00:39:28,760 --> 00:39:32,600 0, but the brain is picking up on it and then the brain's 715 00:39:32,600 --> 00:39:35,720 really going to bonk if the blood glucose gets too low. 716 00:39:36,120 --> 00:39:38,480 Most people, that's around. If you're running, that's around 717 00:39:38,480 --> 00:39:41,200 like 70. If you wear like a continuous 718 00:39:41,200 --> 00:39:42,920 glucose monitor. If I was working with an 719 00:39:42,920 --> 00:39:47,640 athlete, the invention of CGMS, that's like a game changer 720 00:39:47,800 --> 00:39:51,520 because I can personally dial you in and have you run out on a 721 00:39:51,520 --> 00:39:55,240 fasted run or give you something like the live steady you can and 722 00:39:55,240 --> 00:39:58,240 then watch your glucose and ask you, hey, how do you feel. 723 00:39:58,240 --> 00:40:00,880 Let me know when you start to feel tired and then I can 724 00:40:00,880 --> 00:40:03,880 identify here's where your blood glucose tells me you're getting 725 00:40:03,880 --> 00:40:05,760 tired. So as long as I can keep your 726 00:40:05,760 --> 00:40:10,080 blood glucose above that level. Throughout your run then you 727 00:40:10,080 --> 00:40:13,200 shouldn't feel tired from a glucose perspective. 728 00:40:14,080 --> 00:40:18,280 So the idea would be then I can custom tailor well when how many 729 00:40:18,360 --> 00:40:22,120 you know grams, how many packets of of you can do I need to give 730 00:40:22,120 --> 00:40:25,840 you over X amount of period. And the idea of that type of 731 00:40:25,840 --> 00:40:29,760 product is it's just lasts up 15 grams of it, which is I think 732 00:40:29,760 --> 00:40:33,000 one one of the packets. It lasts so much longer than a 733 00:40:33,000 --> 00:40:37,720 15 shot 15g shot of a gel 'cause that gel's going to go in and 734 00:40:37,720 --> 00:40:39,440 it's going to already start to come back down. 735 00:40:40,040 --> 00:40:43,800 Your body burns carbohydrate based on how much you send it. 736 00:40:44,720 --> 00:40:47,480 Yeah, that's interesting. I love that you, you know with 737 00:40:47,480 --> 00:40:50,760 all your educational background are taking the same product too. 738 00:40:50,760 --> 00:40:53,080 So that kind of instills a little bit of confidence. 739 00:40:54,040 --> 00:40:58,160 So I mean I guess since you are talking about you can in very 740 00:40:58,680 --> 00:41:02,440 happy terms, I just want you to tell our audience whether you're 741 00:41:02,440 --> 00:41:06,240 sponsored by them or affiliated in any way to promote their 742 00:41:06,240 --> 00:41:08,680 product because you know that's always my number one question. 743 00:41:08,680 --> 00:41:11,880 And now that we finally entered the world of having a sponsor, I 744 00:41:11,880 --> 00:41:14,560 just want to, you know, be transparent about it. 745 00:41:15,360 --> 00:41:17,560 Yeah. So no, I am not paid by 746 00:41:17,560 --> 00:41:19,560 generation. You can, I've never been paid by 747 00:41:19,600 --> 00:41:21,880 generation. You can the study that it did 748 00:41:21,880 --> 00:41:27,560 back in 2021 or what I published in 2021, I did get that study 749 00:41:27,560 --> 00:41:29,480 sponsored. I didn't receive anything. 750 00:41:29,480 --> 00:41:33,920 The subjects got you know like some payment and then you know 751 00:41:33,920 --> 00:41:36,200 they sent me you can and they helped pay for the blood 752 00:41:36,200 --> 00:41:38,880 analysis and stuff like that. But no, I've never been paid. 753 00:41:39,360 --> 00:41:42,280 I'll get some products and things like that occasionally. 754 00:41:43,720 --> 00:41:48,240 It's one of those things where at some point there's a medical 755 00:41:48,240 --> 00:41:52,280 doctor, Peter Atia, who he's been really good, where he says 756 00:41:52,280 --> 00:41:54,280 here are the products that I will support. 757 00:41:54,840 --> 00:41:58,080 And these are products that I am endorsing not because they're 758 00:41:58,080 --> 00:42:00,440 paying me to endorse, but because I believe. 759 00:42:00,440 --> 00:42:01,960 Yeah, I mean, I'm a research scientist. 760 00:42:01,960 --> 00:42:05,200 Like I spent seven years getting my PhD and I've been, you know, 761 00:42:05,200 --> 00:42:07,120 studying this stuff for many, many more. 762 00:42:08,720 --> 00:42:12,440 It's it's a wonderful merge. When you find products in life 763 00:42:12,680 --> 00:42:16,760 that are just unbelievable, it's like if you wear a pair of 764 00:42:16,760 --> 00:42:21,520 Lululemon anything, you're like, Oh my gosh, this product is 765 00:42:21,520 --> 00:42:23,400 amazing. You know, stuff like that, like 766 00:42:23,400 --> 00:42:26,560 path projects in the running world, they've they don't, you 767 00:42:26,560 --> 00:42:29,000 know, I don't get paid. Their products are amazing. 768 00:42:29,000 --> 00:42:33,880 But no, it's a product that it'd be different too if I didn't 769 00:42:33,880 --> 00:42:39,080 test it on myself. So I can give you my expertise 770 00:42:39,080 --> 00:42:41,800 based on the literature that I've done in the research lab, 771 00:42:41,800 --> 00:42:46,440 but I've pricked my fingers like 50 times after consuming a 772 00:42:46,440 --> 00:42:49,040 variety of different products, including the generation you 773 00:42:49,040 --> 00:42:50,960 can. And I can tell you it does not 774 00:42:50,960 --> 00:42:53,880 spike my blood sugar. And by default it will. 775 00:42:53,960 --> 00:42:57,440 I do not crash my blood sugar. So that's what I'm going to go 776 00:42:57,440 --> 00:43:00,480 for on those runs. You know, you got to try the 777 00:43:00,480 --> 00:43:02,320 different flavors of different products. 778 00:43:02,320 --> 00:43:04,160 Try what? What you like, like what's the 779 00:43:04,160 --> 00:43:07,560 best diet, whatever diet you're going to follow, I can give you 780 00:43:07,560 --> 00:43:10,320 guidelines. And my guidelines are I'm not a 781 00:43:10,320 --> 00:43:13,840 huge fan of, like, injecting sugar into my bloodstream 782 00:43:14,000 --> 00:43:17,920 because I don't see the supporting research and data in 783 00:43:17,920 --> 00:43:20,720 the literature. To say anything over 60 grams 784 00:43:20,720 --> 00:43:23,000 per hour is going to be beneficial. 785 00:43:23,000 --> 00:43:25,560 And I don't even think that's beneficial for anything less 786 00:43:25,560 --> 00:43:28,560 than an hour long run. And I also don't think it's 787 00:43:28,560 --> 00:43:31,720 beneficial on even runs that are longer than an hour that are at 788 00:43:31,720 --> 00:43:34,120 a lower intensity. That's what the science is 789 00:43:34,120 --> 00:43:36,080 telling me. That's what I'm going to tell 790 00:43:36,080 --> 00:43:38,760 other people. OK, perfect. 791 00:43:38,760 --> 00:43:41,200 Now I appreciate your transparency. 792 00:43:41,520 --> 00:43:46,120 So I appreciate your time. Yeah, no, I I I it's an honor 793 00:43:46,120 --> 00:43:48,640 and a privilege. I hope to bring nothing but 794 00:43:48,640 --> 00:43:51,480 value to your show. I I support your success and 795 00:43:51,760 --> 00:43:53,600 hope to bring nothing but value to your listeners. 796 00:43:53,760 --> 00:43:56,080 Perhaps you can let our listeners know how they can find 797 00:43:56,080 --> 00:43:57,720 you if they want more information. 798 00:43:58,240 --> 00:44:00,920 Yeah, absolutely. I mean, you can go, I have a 799 00:44:00,920 --> 00:44:05,040 website, patdavitt.com on there. I do a daily newsletter. 800 00:44:05,600 --> 00:44:09,320 The newsletter is not nutrition, it's a little bit more mindset 801 00:44:09,320 --> 00:44:11,000 based. It's basically a daily 802 00:44:11,000 --> 00:44:14,960 newsletter of encouragement, inspiration, and I just, it's a 803 00:44:14,960 --> 00:44:17,680 it's a small consensus of a lot of quotes, my own writings and 804 00:44:17,680 --> 00:44:18,920 there's different themes each day. 805 00:44:18,920 --> 00:44:22,240 And then in the newsletter I talk about a summary, I give you 806 00:44:22,240 --> 00:44:25,440 backgrounds, homework items, Here's what to do in your own 807 00:44:25,440 --> 00:44:27,400 life. So there's like sort of a mini 808 00:44:27,640 --> 00:44:30,080 thing for your readers to do, because every day I give them 809 00:44:30,080 --> 00:44:33,360 two homework items, I give them reading materials, suggestions 810 00:44:33,360 --> 00:44:36,240 and things like that. So you can reach out to me if 811 00:44:36,240 --> 00:44:38,280 you ever have any questions. Just through there, there's an 812 00:44:38,280 --> 00:44:39,720 inquiry page and things like that. 813 00:44:43,120 --> 00:44:45,760 Thank you so much Patrick for speaking with me and I look 814 00:44:45,760 --> 00:44:48,640 forward to having you on for another episode, perhaps on 815 00:44:48,640 --> 00:44:51,800 protein or something else that we can talk about when it comes 816 00:44:51,800 --> 00:44:54,760 to running. If you listeners have any ideas 817 00:44:54,760 --> 00:44:58,440 of what you want to hear and we can interview Patrick, let us 818 00:44:58,440 --> 00:45:00,320 know. You can always drop us a note on 819 00:45:00,320 --> 00:45:03,120 Instagram or wherever. And I guess at this point we 820 00:45:03,120 --> 00:45:04,840 want to thank our sponsor generation. 821 00:45:04,840 --> 00:45:08,200 You can if you are tired of the spike and crash or if you have 822 00:45:08,200 --> 00:45:11,200 some GI distress, why not give him a try. 823 00:45:11,360 --> 00:45:14,640 Because you know Emily Sisson, Sarah Hall, Emma Bates, Carrot 824 00:45:14,640 --> 00:45:16,920 Amato, all those top runners use. 825 00:45:16,920 --> 00:45:19,440 You can so we have some codes for you. 826 00:45:19,720 --> 00:45:23,640 If you want to use MRP as a code for 20% off you can go to the 827 00:45:23,640 --> 00:45:27,760 website youcan.co or if you just want to try them, you get a 828 00:45:27,880 --> 00:45:30,040 sample pack of four gels for free. 829 00:45:30,040 --> 00:45:33,080 You just pay the shipping and you can do that by going to 830 00:45:33,080 --> 00:45:38,480 youcan.co/MRP. The conversation was great. 831 00:45:38,480 --> 00:45:41,440 It's always appreciated. I love hearing you know thing 832 00:45:41,440 --> 00:45:44,280 from things, from educated people so that hopefully I can 833 00:45:44,280 --> 00:45:48,120 learn more. And so, Letty, this is being 834 00:45:48,120 --> 00:45:51,800 recorded prior to but it's going to come out after the Orlando 835 00:45:51,800 --> 00:45:54,120 Olympic Trials, right? Yes, that's right Ryan. 836 00:45:54,160 --> 00:45:58,560 This is going to come out on Monday the 5th and the Olympic 837 00:45:58,560 --> 00:46:00,240 trials happened just two days ago. 838 00:46:00,360 --> 00:46:04,120 So who won? We don't know yet, but you will 839 00:46:04,120 --> 00:46:07,840 find out in a couple hours because we are recording a bonus 840 00:46:07,840 --> 00:46:11,040 episode on this to cover the Olympic Trials as media. 841 00:46:11,040 --> 00:46:14,640 So we'll give you all the insights from the weekend up at 842 00:46:14,640 --> 00:46:17,120 the Olympic Trials. Which brings us to our next 843 00:46:17,120 --> 00:46:19,680 sponsor, ESPN, which is Leddy's new employer. 844 00:46:20,280 --> 00:46:23,120 I wish. I actually, you know what? 845 00:46:23,120 --> 00:46:26,560 I wanted to be a reporter and journalist and author and all 846 00:46:26,560 --> 00:46:31,200 that stuff up until I was 15. Until you moved out of the 847 00:46:31,200 --> 00:46:33,760 country, huh? Where all of a sudden, you know, 848 00:46:33,760 --> 00:46:36,560 I wasn't as quick anymore. I couldn't just crack those 849 00:46:36,560 --> 00:46:39,920 jokes because the English vocabulary wasn't quite there 850 00:46:39,920 --> 00:46:41,400 yet. So it definitely is impressive 851 00:46:41,400 --> 00:46:44,480 that you can even do a podcast now after learning the language, 852 00:46:44,680 --> 00:46:46,760 your third language. It's good that you get to live 853 00:46:46,840 --> 00:46:49,760 your pseudo dream as an early teenager now. 854 00:46:50,520 --> 00:46:55,920 Kind of right, yeah. Anyway, so stay tuned for next 855 00:46:55,920 --> 00:46:59,400 weeks episode, which we haven't determined yet what we're going 856 00:46:59,400 --> 00:47:00,240 to. Talk about. 857 00:47:00,360 --> 00:47:01,600 But it's going to be fun. It's. 858 00:47:01,600 --> 00:47:03,360 Going to be great. It's always great. 859 00:47:03,360 --> 00:47:07,080 It's the best episode ever. All right. 860 00:47:07,080 --> 00:47:09,520 So with that, we are going to go drink some Coca-Cola because you 861 00:47:09,520 --> 00:47:12,120 make me thirsty. Without cocaine and have a good 862 00:47:12,120 --> 00:47:18,680 week of running. Thanks for tuning in. 863 00:47:19,000 --> 00:47:21,800 For more information Ant Marathon running news, please 864 00:47:21,800 --> 00:47:25,680 head to www.marathonrunningpodcast.com 865 00:47:25,720 --> 00:47:27,480 and we'll be back next week.