1 00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:03,920 You're listening to episode 296 of the Marathon Running Podcast. 2 00:00:04,040 --> 00:00:06,840 In this episode, we're going to talk about why tune up races are 3 00:00:06,840 --> 00:00:09,640 the key to your next marathon PR. 4 00:00:10,160 --> 00:00:12,920 Welcome to the Marathon Running Podcast by Marathon Journal. 5 00:00:13,160 --> 00:00:15,600 Join us every week for the insights and inspiration you 6 00:00:15,600 --> 00:00:18,440 need to get from the starting line to the finish line and 7 00:00:18,440 --> 00:00:31,200 beyond. Hey runners and welcome to 8 00:00:31,200 --> 00:00:34,520 episode 296. My name is Letty and I'm usually 9 00:00:34,520 --> 00:00:38,120 accompanied by my amazing husband Ryan, but he is Mia 10 00:00:38,120 --> 00:00:42,440 today, but that's OK. I am completely capable to solo 11 00:00:42,480 --> 00:00:46,160 intro This next guest that we have and it's a guest that we've 12 00:00:46,160 --> 00:00:49,080 had on in the past, it is Coach Chris Knighton. 13 00:00:49,280 --> 00:00:51,720 We love having coach Chris Knighton on just because he's 14 00:00:51,720 --> 00:00:54,440 such an analytical brain when it comes to marathoning. 15 00:00:54,640 --> 00:00:58,400 If you guys have not read his book yet, it is available on his 16 00:00:58,400 --> 00:01:01,840 website for free or download, which of course will link his 17 00:01:01,840 --> 00:01:03,800 contact information in the show notes. 18 00:01:04,239 --> 00:01:07,760 And he's very good at explaining the different phases that he has 19 00:01:07,760 --> 00:01:11,160 his coaching clients go through as they train for a marathon. 20 00:01:11,920 --> 00:01:15,000 That said, when I spoke to him last about what topic I could 21 00:01:15,000 --> 00:01:18,920 potentially interview him on, he actually suggested this topic of 22 00:01:19,040 --> 00:01:22,400 explaining how these tune up races that you can do before a 23 00:01:22,400 --> 00:01:26,400 marathon are eventually the key to your next marathon PR. 24 00:01:26,560 --> 00:01:29,360 And I loved that idea. So here we are. 25 00:01:29,720 --> 00:01:32,160 And I guess that concludes my solo intro. 26 00:01:32,160 --> 00:01:34,640 Without any further ado, I'm now going to play you my 27 00:01:34,640 --> 00:01:36,720 conversation with Chris Knighton. 28 00:01:39,160 --> 00:01:40,960 All right, so I'm back on with Chris Knighton from 29 00:01:40,960 --> 00:01:43,320 knightonruns.com. Chris, thank you so much for 30 00:01:43,320 --> 00:01:45,000 joining me today. You're welcome, Letty. 31 00:01:45,000 --> 00:01:46,440 Thanks for having me back on your show. 32 00:01:46,760 --> 00:01:50,200 Yes, we love having you on, but for the listeners that haven't 33 00:01:50,200 --> 00:01:52,560 listened to your previous episodes before, maybe do a 34 00:01:52,560 --> 00:01:54,560 quick introduction about yourself and your coaching 35 00:01:54,560 --> 00:01:55,400 business. Sure. 36 00:01:55,520 --> 00:01:58,520 Yeah, I'm 37. I live in Providence, RI, and 37 00:01:58,520 --> 00:02:02,880 I've been an avid runner for about a decade and coaching full 38 00:02:02,880 --> 00:02:07,920 time for about 5 years, both at the amateur marathon and half 39 00:02:07,920 --> 00:02:10,639 marathon level as well as the high school track and cross 40 00:02:10,639 --> 00:02:14,160 country level. And I coach alongside my wife. 41 00:02:14,480 --> 00:02:18,320 Our company is called Night and Runs Coaching and we work with 42 00:02:18,320 --> 00:02:21,160 folks up here in the Northeast, but also all throughout the US 43 00:02:21,160 --> 00:02:24,920 and the world, training for primarily the World Marathon 44 00:02:24,920 --> 00:02:30,040 Majors and folks who are looking to either run the first marathon 45 00:02:30,040 --> 00:02:33,840 or work towards Boston qualifier time or, you know, do all six or 46 00:02:33,840 --> 00:02:35,640 seven of the majors, that kind of thing. 47 00:02:36,080 --> 00:02:38,840 And then at the high school level, we work with, you know, a 48 00:02:38,840 --> 00:02:41,240 team training for track and cross country and we do some 49 00:02:41,240 --> 00:02:44,840 private coaching for youth, kids and occasionally adults up here 50 00:02:44,840 --> 00:02:47,120 in Providence, RI. So you basically. 51 00:02:47,120 --> 00:02:49,000 Meet runners at all paths of their lives. 52 00:02:49,000 --> 00:02:51,720 And I kind of want to throw in a thing that is really great about 53 00:02:51,720 --> 00:02:54,280 you and that's kind of how we met because you wrote a book and 54 00:02:54,280 --> 00:02:57,360 that book is very insightful. It's not one of those long 55 00:02:57,360 --> 00:02:59,760 boring reads. It's very to the point and 56 00:02:59,760 --> 00:03:02,320 almost kind of like a Bible. I feel like any runner should 57 00:03:02,320 --> 00:03:05,400 just kind of have that in the night stand as they look over 58 00:03:05,600 --> 00:03:07,880 how things are trained. But maybe you can pitch this 59 00:03:07,880 --> 00:03:09,400 book a little bit better. Yeah, sure. 60 00:03:09,400 --> 00:03:13,200 So a couple years back I basically encapsulated all of my 61 00:03:13,200 --> 00:03:16,600 marathon training philosophy and a short book called Run Faster 62 00:03:16,600 --> 00:03:19,080 Marathons. And of course, you know that's 63 00:03:19,080 --> 00:03:22,240 available on Amazon. I also have a free audio book 64 00:03:22,240 --> 00:03:24,680 version if anyone would like to listen to it, that you can 65 00:03:24,680 --> 00:03:26,720 download. If you go to my website, you 66 00:03:26,720 --> 00:03:29,160 just sign up for my e-mail list and I'll send you a copy. 67 00:03:29,480 --> 00:03:32,320 And basically in the book, I'm just very to the point. 68 00:03:32,320 --> 00:03:35,760 So it's under a three hour audio book and I think it's about 140 69 00:03:35,760 --> 00:03:38,800 pages of written word. And I really just, yeah, talk 70 00:03:38,800 --> 00:03:44,120 about how I develop training programs and what you should 71 00:03:44,120 --> 00:03:47,200 really be thinking about as an athlete when you're training for 72 00:03:47,200 --> 00:03:49,120 the marathon. I get into how you want to 73 00:03:49,120 --> 00:03:54,400 structure your training and go from just, you know, starting 74 00:03:54,400 --> 00:03:57,160 off on week 1 all the way up to like what you might want to 75 00:03:57,160 --> 00:03:59,920 prioritize and then talk about like how much running you should 76 00:03:59,920 --> 00:04:02,800 be doing, how to increase the amount of running you're doing 77 00:04:02,800 --> 00:04:07,160 over time safely and and logically so that you can over 78 00:04:07,440 --> 00:04:09,720 many months and years progress towards your goals. 79 00:04:10,240 --> 00:04:12,560 And I've gotten a lot of positive reviews on the book 80 00:04:12,560 --> 00:04:16,680 just because it is very short and to the point, but it every 81 00:04:16,680 --> 00:04:19,920 sentence in there I think is really important and provides 82 00:04:19,920 --> 00:04:21,560 like a valuable piece of information. 83 00:04:21,560 --> 00:04:24,600 So there's no fluff in there. It'll really teach you, I think, 84 00:04:24,600 --> 00:04:26,360 everything you need to know about marathon training. 85 00:04:26,400 --> 00:04:28,480 And I fully agree with you, and I think that makes you a good 86 00:04:28,480 --> 00:04:31,360 coach as well because you know from that book you can kind of 87 00:04:31,360 --> 00:04:35,040 gather that you're very science based and very fact, not just 88 00:04:35,040 --> 00:04:36,720 kind of feeling. And that's what we need 89 00:04:36,720 --> 00:04:39,440 nowadays, right, With so much fluff and so many pretend 90 00:04:39,440 --> 00:04:42,680 coaches out there. But with all that said, today 91 00:04:42,680 --> 00:04:44,640 we're going to talk about a topic that's a little bit 92 00:04:44,640 --> 00:04:46,360 different. Yeah, we're going to talk about 93 00:04:46,520 --> 00:04:50,400 basically the importance of doing practice races in the 94 00:04:50,400 --> 00:04:54,120 build up to a goal race at the end of your season. 95 00:04:54,440 --> 00:04:58,880 So as this is primarily a, you know, a marathon running podcast 96 00:04:58,880 --> 00:05:01,240 as the name, right. We'll, we'll put this in the 97 00:05:01,240 --> 00:05:04,120 context of training for the marathon and I want to talk 98 00:05:04,120 --> 00:05:08,480 about, you know, let's say you're doing a spring marathon 99 00:05:08,840 --> 00:05:10,680 right now as you're recording this this January. 100 00:05:10,840 --> 00:05:13,880 I have a lot of athletes doing the Boston Marathon or London, 101 00:05:13,880 --> 00:05:16,200 for example, in, in April, right. 102 00:05:16,480 --> 00:05:20,720 So what races should you be doing between now, beginning of 103 00:05:20,720 --> 00:05:24,000 the year in January to April to make sure that you're as 104 00:05:24,000 --> 00:05:27,360 prepared mentally and physically for that goal marathon as 105 00:05:27,360 --> 00:05:30,120 possible. And then also capitalize on your 106 00:05:30,120 --> 00:05:33,960 fitness, maybe set some PRS or have a lot of fun in races along 107 00:05:33,960 --> 00:05:34,360 the way. Love. 108 00:05:34,560 --> 00:05:37,080 It yeah. So basically we're talking about 109 00:05:37,480 --> 00:05:40,240 how to best structure your training for the build up 110 00:05:40,240 --> 00:05:43,280 because obviously when you're running a race later on in the 111 00:05:43,280 --> 00:05:46,520 year, you're not going to not run, but you're also not going 112 00:05:46,520 --> 00:05:49,720 to do any marathon training and marathon style workouts. 113 00:05:49,720 --> 00:05:52,600 And again, I kind of want to deflect to that book that you 114 00:05:52,600 --> 00:05:54,880 wrote because it really tells you that there are different 115 00:05:54,880 --> 00:05:57,360 phases when it comes to marathon training, etcetera. 116 00:05:57,640 --> 00:06:00,960 But let's start talking about the philosophy of practice 117 00:06:00,960 --> 00:06:02,840 racing. I know in previous podcasts 118 00:06:03,120 --> 00:06:06,800 we've talked about practice racing and how good they can be 119 00:06:06,800 --> 00:06:08,400 for you. Maybe you can elaborate on that 120 00:06:08,400 --> 00:06:09,320 a little bit. Yeah. 121 00:06:09,320 --> 00:06:14,160 So I usually refer to these races before your goal end of 122 00:06:14,160 --> 00:06:18,040 season marathon as either practice races or tune up races. 123 00:06:18,160 --> 00:06:21,040 So I might use that those two words interchangeably here just 124 00:06:21,040 --> 00:06:23,640 for the listeners. And they're very, very important 125 00:06:23,640 --> 00:06:25,880 to do with the athletes who I coach. 126 00:06:25,920 --> 00:06:29,840 If they're training for a marathon, I always, always 127 00:06:29,840 --> 00:06:33,840 recommend that they sign up for at least two practice races 128 00:06:33,840 --> 00:06:37,720 between now and then. So generally I think about 129 00:06:37,720 --> 00:06:40,560 marathon training as like 18 weeks. 130 00:06:40,560 --> 00:06:43,080 That's kind of my basic plans are 18 weeks. 131 00:06:43,080 --> 00:06:45,920 That could be much shorter. It could be as long as 20 weeks 132 00:06:45,920 --> 00:06:47,480 or so, kind of depending on the time we have. 133 00:06:47,720 --> 00:06:51,400 But basically we're saying, so in that 18 weeks between just 134 00:06:51,400 --> 00:06:55,040 starting off in the marathon, I want you to do two or three 135 00:06:55,040 --> 00:06:59,120 races in that time period so that when you get to the end and 136 00:06:59,120 --> 00:07:02,120 you get to the marathon, as I said earlier, is prepared as 137 00:07:02,120 --> 00:07:04,000 physically and mentally as possible. 138 00:07:04,080 --> 00:07:08,000 And I think that there's like specific races you want to do at 139 00:07:08,080 --> 00:07:13,320 specific times that are going to be most helpful along the way. 140 00:07:13,640 --> 00:07:15,400 Yes. So basically we're talking about 141 00:07:15,400 --> 00:07:18,160 a dress rehearsal, right? Maybe you can tell us a little 142 00:07:18,160 --> 00:07:21,240 bit about how this whole psychological edge works. 143 00:07:21,280 --> 00:07:24,720 Do you think it helps us to remember how to raise? 144 00:07:24,720 --> 00:07:27,240 Does it help us be less nervous for the marathon? 145 00:07:27,400 --> 00:07:32,280 And also, why is a chip timed trial race better than the one 146 00:07:32,280 --> 00:07:36,520 that you do out of your house? Yeah, all good questions and let 147 00:07:36,520 --> 00:07:38,640 me make sure I touch on all those points. 148 00:07:38,640 --> 00:07:42,200 If I forget any, let me know. So the first question was how 149 00:07:42,200 --> 00:07:43,880 did they prepare you mentally? Yeah. 150 00:07:44,200 --> 00:07:49,160 So I think that racing is a skill that needs to be 151 00:07:49,160 --> 00:07:52,320 developed. It's independent of fitness. 152 00:07:52,320 --> 00:07:55,800 I know people who are really, really fit who race, in my 153 00:07:55,800 --> 00:08:00,440 opinion, very poorly. And I also know people who race 154 00:08:00,440 --> 00:08:07,120 very, very well and, and always do best, both strategically and 155 00:08:07,160 --> 00:08:10,600 their confidence is such that they always get the most out of 156 00:08:10,600 --> 00:08:14,080 themselves. The mental aspect of racing is 157 00:08:14,080 --> 00:08:17,760 really, really important. Even for us adult runners doing 158 00:08:17,760 --> 00:08:21,480 marathons and half marathons where we we may say, hey, we're 159 00:08:21,480 --> 00:08:23,720 just going out there and it's just us racing against 160 00:08:23,720 --> 00:08:26,160 ourselves. It's still really, really 161 00:08:26,160 --> 00:08:31,520 important to be strategic in how you approach the pacing of your 162 00:08:31,520 --> 00:08:35,679 race, how you manage your stress levels leading up to the race 163 00:08:35,679 --> 00:08:39,280 and on race day itself. And how you kind of psych up 164 00:08:39,280 --> 00:08:44,039 yourself mentally to actually give 100% or 100 and shoot for 165 00:08:44,039 --> 00:08:47,960 110% on race day to actually eke out every bit of fitness that 166 00:08:47,960 --> 00:08:52,200 you have the best way you can. And I think that doing practice 167 00:08:52,200 --> 00:08:57,240 races, real races, real events, chip times, you know, not just a 168 00:08:57,240 --> 00:09:02,080 time trial by yourself, not just a treadmill time trial or on a 169 00:09:02,080 --> 00:09:04,360 track or something, but actually going to a race where there's 170 00:09:04,360 --> 00:09:08,360 other people, where you're, you know, you get a time at the end 171 00:09:08,360 --> 00:09:11,640 where other people see how you do, where you can compete 172 00:09:11,640 --> 00:09:14,400 against others. There's no substitute for that. 173 00:09:14,440 --> 00:09:18,600 And you know, like anything, practice makes perfect. 174 00:09:18,600 --> 00:09:21,040 The more you do it, the better off you'll be. 175 00:09:21,200 --> 00:09:24,520 And I honestly think the best way to become a better eraser is 176 00:09:24,520 --> 00:09:29,440 to 1st learn what good racing strategy is and then practice it 177 00:09:29,520 --> 00:09:32,120 until it becomes second nature. Until you can do it every single 178 00:09:32,120 --> 00:09:34,600 time, you know to the best of your ability. 179 00:09:34,880 --> 00:09:39,120 And once you've done that, then you won't have nearly as many 180 00:09:39,120 --> 00:09:40,920 bad races. Racing will be much more 181 00:09:40,920 --> 00:09:43,680 predictable when you're doing half marathons and marathons, 182 00:09:43,680 --> 00:09:45,040 you'll live up to your fitness more. 183 00:09:45,120 --> 00:09:48,040 You know, obviously they'll be outside factors like weather and 184 00:09:48,040 --> 00:09:49,800 things like be out of your control sickness. 185 00:09:49,880 --> 00:09:53,040 But everything that you can control, you'll be able to 186 00:09:53,120 --> 00:09:58,080 perform execute on much, much more reliably and you'll get 187 00:09:58,080 --> 00:10:00,320 better times out of yourself and you'll feel much more confident 188 00:10:00,320 --> 00:10:03,520 and less stressed heading into your Gold Race if you've 189 00:10:03,520 --> 00:10:06,240 practiced all these things multiple times in the lead up to 190 00:10:06,240 --> 00:10:07,680 it. I mean, I can totally see that 191 00:10:07,680 --> 00:10:11,040 just because, you know, I'm one of those people that don't do 192 00:10:11,040 --> 00:10:14,480 the five KS and I think I should because at this point I get 193 00:10:14,480 --> 00:10:16,960 really psyched out when I'm at the starting line for any big 194 00:10:16,960 --> 00:10:18,400 race. And I think that definitely 195 00:10:18,400 --> 00:10:20,040 helps. Practice makes perfect, like you 196 00:10:20,040 --> 00:10:24,200 said, but also maybe it'll kind of tune it down because as you 197 00:10:24,200 --> 00:10:27,120 know, in a marathon, as soon as the gun goes off, you're fine. 198 00:10:27,320 --> 00:10:31,520 But it's the hours days leading up to the race that are so 199 00:10:31,520 --> 00:10:41,400 difficult for some of us, yeah. And another important part of 200 00:10:41,400 --> 00:10:45,480 the practice races is it gives you like a very realistic figure 201 00:10:45,480 --> 00:10:47,840 on what you can run in the marathon. 202 00:10:47,840 --> 00:10:51,560 One of the things that I kind of I really dislike sometimes when 203 00:10:51,560 --> 00:10:55,040 I'm coaching certain athletes is if they don't do any practice 204 00:10:55,040 --> 00:10:58,560 races before their marathon and then they have like some 205 00:10:58,560 --> 00:11:00,760 ambitious time goal in their marathon. 206 00:11:00,760 --> 00:11:04,240 And sometimes, you know, there are some people who don't need 207 00:11:04,240 --> 00:11:07,200 the practice races and they can do really well and and they can 208 00:11:07,200 --> 00:11:09,160 run a good time. They have a great gauge of their 209 00:11:09,160 --> 00:11:12,960 fitness, but you just have less information to go on. 210 00:11:12,960 --> 00:11:18,120 You know, workouts are not that great of a representation of how 211 00:11:18,120 --> 00:11:21,520 fast you can actually race. The best representation of how 212 00:11:21,520 --> 00:11:24,280 fast you can race is another race. 213 00:11:24,280 --> 00:11:26,600 People can lie to themselves in workouts, think that they're 214 00:11:26,600 --> 00:11:29,600 fitter than they are. And on the flip side, people can 215 00:11:29,600 --> 00:11:34,040 just like not be as good at workouts and much better at 216 00:11:34,040 --> 00:11:35,960 races. That's something actually, I, I 217 00:11:35,960 --> 00:11:39,640 think for me, I often do way better in races than I do in 218 00:11:39,640 --> 00:11:42,320 workouts and I coach athletes. So it's the complete opposite. 219 00:11:42,760 --> 00:11:47,040 So racing frequently is the best way to get better at racing. 220 00:11:47,080 --> 00:11:48,360 Yes. And I think that's especially 221 00:11:48,360 --> 00:11:51,680 true because a lot of coaches, I mean everyone coaches 222 00:11:51,680 --> 00:11:55,160 differently, but a lot of coaches don't do the full out 223 00:11:55,160 --> 00:11:57,680 Saturday workout. They don't say run out for 224 00:11:57,680 --> 00:12:01,160 marathon pace for the 16 miles. So you don't really get a gauge 225 00:12:01,160 --> 00:12:04,120 because you can hit the paces, but then you have to translate 226 00:12:04,120 --> 00:12:07,320 that speed into a long race. Yeah, for sure. 227 00:12:07,640 --> 00:12:11,280 And there are indicator workouts like, you know, I'll say, hey, 228 00:12:11,280 --> 00:12:14,440 if you do a 20 mile long run and sixteen of those are at marathon 229 00:12:14,440 --> 00:12:17,720 pace, like sure, you can definitely do that in your 230 00:12:17,720 --> 00:12:21,080 marathon, but you don't really know until you do the marathon. 231 00:12:21,360 --> 00:12:24,000 I mean, every, everyone's one thing to keep in mind with the 232 00:12:24,000 --> 00:12:28,360 workouts is like everyone is best at one specific distance 233 00:12:28,680 --> 00:12:31,360 based on their phys Physiology. You know, everyone listening to 234 00:12:31,360 --> 00:12:35,200 this wants to run a marathon, but not everyone listening to 235 00:12:35,200 --> 00:12:37,520 this is physiologically best at the marathon. 236 00:12:37,520 --> 00:12:40,720 Some of you listening, maybe you're best at running like 800 237 00:12:40,720 --> 00:12:44,360 meters or 5K or half marathon. When some of you are best at 238 00:12:44,360 --> 00:12:47,680 marathon and you know, people who are better at shorter 239 00:12:47,680 --> 00:12:50,440 distances just physiologically, you know, oftentimes they can 240 00:12:50,440 --> 00:12:53,880 run faster in workouts and but they don't have that endurance. 241 00:12:54,320 --> 00:12:57,000 And then other, other times, you know, I have people who really 242 00:12:57,000 --> 00:12:59,040 struggle in the shorter, faster workouts, but they have 243 00:12:59,040 --> 00:13:03,120 incredible endurance. And really it's only through, 244 00:13:03,200 --> 00:13:06,240 well, me as a coach, it's learning somebody's patterns and 245 00:13:06,480 --> 00:13:09,520 and history of, you know, how they perform in races and 246 00:13:09,520 --> 00:13:12,640 workouts where I can really get a good sense of how someone's 247 00:13:12,640 --> 00:13:15,160 going to perform in a race after working with them for a long 248 00:13:15,160 --> 00:13:17,440 period of time and understand yourself. 249 00:13:17,440 --> 00:13:21,080 But again, like, yeah, workouts are, they only indicate what you 250 00:13:21,080 --> 00:13:25,120 might be capable of, but races are much, much more indicative 251 00:13:25,400 --> 00:13:27,040 of what you can truly do. I love it. 252 00:13:27,040 --> 00:13:31,280 That's so true and so much just in this part of the podcast, 253 00:13:31,280 --> 00:13:32,480 right? You know, we have to just kind 254 00:13:32,480 --> 00:13:37,680 of, I guess, be humbled by what we are physiological capable of. 255 00:13:37,680 --> 00:13:41,120 And yes, you can train, but then you do have your free 256 00:13:41,120 --> 00:13:43,720 dispositions of what you're going to be best at. 257 00:13:43,720 --> 00:13:47,840 So I guess with that, let's move on to how to construct a season. 258 00:13:47,840 --> 00:13:50,400 And I'm going to ask you, why is the half marathon considered the 259 00:13:50,400 --> 00:13:52,200 gold standard for a marathon tune up? 260 00:13:52,200 --> 00:13:54,680 And when is the ideal time to schedule that? 261 00:13:54,680 --> 00:13:58,680 So with my coaching philosophy fee for the marathon I've moved 262 00:13:58,680 --> 00:14:01,920 through, I've moved my athletes through several different stages 263 00:14:01,920 --> 00:14:05,040 as they work through like that eighteen weeks from beginning to 264 00:14:05,080 --> 00:14:06,920 goal race. I think before we talk about the 265 00:14:06,920 --> 00:14:10,520 importance of like what races to do when, just to give a high 266 00:14:10,800 --> 00:14:15,160 level overview of the phases. I start off athletes with, you 267 00:14:15,160 --> 00:14:18,200 know, roughly, let's say a month or so of base building where 268 00:14:18,200 --> 00:14:20,440 they're just increasing their mileage and doing mostly easy 269 00:14:20,440 --> 00:14:22,640 running, not a lot of workouts at that point. 270 00:14:22,640 --> 00:14:25,720 Then I move my athletes into more of a speed development 271 00:14:25,720 --> 00:14:29,640 phase where they're working on shorter paces like 5K and 10K 272 00:14:29,640 --> 00:14:32,440 and maybe a little bit of mile pace for about a month or so. 273 00:14:32,440 --> 00:14:37,480 And then for the final two months, three months of 274 00:14:37,480 --> 00:14:42,680 training, I focus on endurance building, so marathon specific 275 00:14:42,680 --> 00:14:45,280 training. So tempo runs, longest long 276 00:14:45,280 --> 00:14:48,680 runs, highest mileage, less of the shorter distance speed. 277 00:14:48,680 --> 00:14:51,280 And as you approach your marathon, you reach your highest 278 00:14:51,280 --> 00:14:54,240 mileage, you taper that down and and then you do your gold race. 279 00:14:54,240 --> 00:14:57,360 So that's kind of how I structure the way that makes the 280 00:14:57,360 --> 00:15:01,760 most sense to fit practice races into that is to do practice 281 00:15:01,760 --> 00:15:04,560 races in increasing order of distance. 282 00:15:04,560 --> 00:15:07,760 So for the marathon, two or three races I think is the 283 00:15:07,760 --> 00:15:10,760 perfect number to do before the marathon. 284 00:15:10,760 --> 00:15:15,200 And I would say not not less than two and not more than 285 00:15:15,200 --> 00:15:17,360 three. I think it's really important to 286 00:15:17,360 --> 00:15:21,120 race enough, but not too much. So two to three. 287 00:15:21,160 --> 00:15:22,640 And I like to increase the distance. 288 00:15:22,640 --> 00:15:25,800 So let's just walk through a example. 18 weeks, right? 289 00:15:25,800 --> 00:15:29,640 So you have like your first four weeks of base building, if you 290 00:15:29,640 --> 00:15:33,160 do a race in there, don't count it towards one of these races 291 00:15:33,160 --> 00:15:34,720 because you're not really in good shape yet. 292 00:15:34,760 --> 00:15:37,480 A race in those first four weeks in the base building phase is 293 00:15:37,480 --> 00:15:39,520 maybe just a good sense of like where you're at when you're 294 00:15:39,520 --> 00:15:41,320 getting started. It's not going to be a very 295 00:15:41,320 --> 00:15:43,320 meaningful race for you. It's just a sense of where 296 00:15:43,320 --> 00:15:44,920 you're starting. After those four weeks in the 297 00:15:44,920 --> 00:15:47,160 base building, you get into the more of the speed development 298 00:15:47,160 --> 00:15:48,680 phase for about another month or so. 299 00:15:48,680 --> 00:15:50,480 You're going to be doing mile pace, you're going to be doing 300 00:15:50,480 --> 00:15:54,560 5K pace, 10K pace. Towards the end of that is like 301 00:15:54,560 --> 00:15:59,280 a great, great time to schedule a 5K or A10K. 302 00:15:59,280 --> 00:16:02,280 So by this point in your training, you've basically done 303 00:16:02,280 --> 00:16:04,960 a month or so of base building and you've done a month or so of 304 00:16:04,960 --> 00:16:08,120 like 5K10K pace, two months of good training, maybe a month or 305 00:16:08,120 --> 00:16:11,880 so of workouts. So at the end of that, put a 5K 306 00:16:11,880 --> 00:16:16,480 or A10K to see where you're at, to see how much speed you've 307 00:16:16,480 --> 00:16:21,480 built in that first 18 weeks before you then transition to 308 00:16:21,480 --> 00:16:23,000 focusing more on longer distances. 309 00:16:23,000 --> 00:16:26,720 So that 5K or 10K, that would be the first race that I recommend 310 00:16:27,160 --> 00:16:29,160 doing. So that feedback is probably 311 00:16:29,160 --> 00:16:32,400 also really good for you as a coach, right, because you've 312 00:16:32,480 --> 00:16:36,120 brought your students through these periods of where you do 313 00:16:36,120 --> 00:16:39,680 certain things and then you see how they have improved. 314 00:16:39,880 --> 00:16:43,360 Do you start with a time trial at first, just to kind of see 315 00:16:43,520 --> 00:16:46,480 how you're going to approach it and what they respond to best? 316 00:16:46,840 --> 00:16:49,560 Yeah, so if it's a new athlete, like someone I'm just teaming up 317 00:16:49,560 --> 00:16:52,800 with for the first time, I do usually give them a time trial. 318 00:16:53,000 --> 00:16:55,720 Usually I do like a two mile time trial just because it's 319 00:16:55,720 --> 00:16:58,080 like a weird distance from most people, but it's pretty 320 00:16:58,080 --> 00:17:00,360 informative and it's low stress I think for most folks. 321 00:17:00,360 --> 00:17:02,960 So I would do that in that base building phase after a couple 322 00:17:02,960 --> 00:17:05,240 weeks of training just to get a sense of where they're starting 323 00:17:05,240 --> 00:17:06,839 at. But again, I wouldn't count that 324 00:17:06,839 --> 00:17:08,520 as like one of these practice races. 325 00:17:08,520 --> 00:17:10,560 It's just kind of to get a baseline for where they're at. 326 00:17:10,640 --> 00:17:14,839 But after somebody runs a 5K or A10K towards the end of the 327 00:17:14,839 --> 00:17:17,800 speed development phase, it's I, I think there's a lot of 328 00:17:17,800 --> 00:17:20,680 benefits to it. The first is for most marathon, 329 00:17:20,680 --> 00:17:23,280 5K and 10K is not like a huge priority for them. 330 00:17:23,280 --> 00:17:28,440 So it's a very relatively low stress, low stakes race for them 331 00:17:28,440 --> 00:17:31,000 to do. It's a good entry into racing 332 00:17:31,000 --> 00:17:34,760 before they get to what maybe they think is a more mentally 333 00:17:34,760 --> 00:17:36,800 challenging race, which is the half or the full. 334 00:17:36,840 --> 00:17:40,720 So it's a good entry point to racing in the training cycle. 335 00:17:40,760 --> 00:17:44,160 Also for most marathoners and half marathoners, many of them 336 00:17:44,160 --> 00:17:47,400 don't have that much experience raising 5K or 10K. 337 00:17:47,400 --> 00:17:49,760 So many people just go right up to long distance. 338 00:17:49,760 --> 00:17:52,800 They never really even focus much on the shorter stuff, 339 00:17:52,800 --> 00:17:54,800 especially if they picked up running later in life. 340 00:17:54,800 --> 00:17:58,720 So a lot of people have like fairly weak 5K and 10K PRS and 341 00:17:58,720 --> 00:18:01,000 if they've been training for a while it can be a great 342 00:18:01,000 --> 00:18:03,720 opportunity to get a 5K or A10K PR. 343 00:18:03,760 --> 00:18:06,880 I'm coaching a guy right now who's running a half marathon in 344 00:18:06,880 --> 00:18:11,080 March and he's doing 25 KS. This is tune ups for that half 345 00:18:11,520 --> 00:18:15,800 and like he hasn't really run a 5K in like 2 years, so it's 346 00:18:15,800 --> 00:18:18,600 great to get back and work on that speed and he has a good 347 00:18:18,600 --> 00:18:22,640 shot of of getting APR along the way, even though his goal race 348 00:18:22,640 --> 00:18:24,560 is ultimately going to be a longer distance event. 349 00:18:24,560 --> 00:18:28,720 I think the last thing that helps me as a coach with is when 350 00:18:28,720 --> 00:18:34,320 I see a marathoner run a 5K, the outcome of that race tells me if 351 00:18:34,320 --> 00:18:39,320 they are more of a speed or a endurance kind of if they're if 352 00:18:39,320 --> 00:18:42,600 they're physiologically kind of more predisposed to speed or 353 00:18:42,600 --> 00:18:44,760 endurance. So like I was saying earlier, 354 00:18:44,840 --> 00:18:48,000 you know, just everyone's body's different and the one of the 355 00:18:48,000 --> 00:18:50,640 cool things about running and, and track and field and 356 00:18:50,640 --> 00:18:53,800 athletics in general is like everyone has unique gifts and is 357 00:18:53,800 --> 00:18:57,160 best at a certain event. So, you know, I can tell a lot 358 00:18:57,160 --> 00:19:01,080 based on how someone does in a 5K relative to other races that 359 00:19:01,080 --> 00:19:04,080 they run. Like if speed is their strength 360 00:19:04,080 --> 00:19:06,720 or if endurance is their strength and which one they 361 00:19:06,720 --> 00:19:10,000 might need to work on more or, or you know what? 362 00:19:10,000 --> 00:19:12,680 Yeah, what weakness they could improve more and maybe if we can 363 00:19:12,680 --> 00:19:16,760 relax a bit on strength. Excuse me if we can like ease up 364 00:19:16,760 --> 00:19:19,920 on the speed development because they're plenty fast enough to 365 00:19:20,040 --> 00:19:22,840 run their gold marathon time or if they actually need to get 366 00:19:22,840 --> 00:19:26,560 faster and, and speed is one of their, their limiting factors 367 00:19:26,560 --> 00:19:29,240 and they do need to continue to work on speed in order to reach 368 00:19:29,520 --> 00:19:31,240 gold marathon times that they may have. 369 00:19:31,240 --> 00:19:34,240 So it's, it's a very, it's helpful for me as a coach to get 370 00:19:34,240 --> 00:19:35,600 a sense of what type of athlete they are. 371 00:19:35,600 --> 00:19:38,200 One other thing you you asked is like, why is the half marathon 372 00:19:38,560 --> 00:19:41,680 so good for, you know, practicing to get ready for the 373 00:19:41,680 --> 00:19:43,400 marathon? I do want to circle back to that 374 00:19:43,400 --> 00:19:45,840 if that's OK. So we had talked about the first 375 00:19:45,840 --> 00:19:47,800 two months of training. You do your base building, you 376 00:19:47,800 --> 00:19:51,840 do your speed development, then you do a 5K or A10 Ki. 377 00:19:51,880 --> 00:19:55,640 Think the 10K is probably a little more helpful when 378 00:19:55,640 --> 00:19:58,320 training for a marathon, but I often leave it up to the 379 00:19:58,320 --> 00:20:01,240 athletes individual preference. Then after you've done that 380 00:20:01,240 --> 00:20:04,320 speed development phase of training, after that five care 381 00:20:04,320 --> 00:20:08,920 10 Ki transition my athletes to more of an endurance focused 382 00:20:09,000 --> 00:20:12,880 training for the rest of their time between then in their 383 00:20:12,880 --> 00:20:14,960 upcoming marathon. So what that means is. 384 00:20:15,040 --> 00:20:19,440 So we basically stop doing the 5K and the 10K pace workouts and 385 00:20:19,440 --> 00:20:24,080 we switched to just doing tempo and marathon paced workouts with 386 00:20:24,080 --> 00:20:26,760 the addition of strides throughout the week just to 387 00:20:26,880 --> 00:20:30,120 maintain some like turnover. So you know, for most athletes 388 00:20:30,120 --> 00:20:33,480 that's going to mean you're now doing one or two tempo workouts, 389 00:20:33,480 --> 00:20:36,920 half marathon pace, maybe 10K pace is the fastest, but you 390 00:20:36,920 --> 00:20:39,560 know, a lot of stuff at marathon pace are a little bit faster, 391 00:20:39,560 --> 00:20:42,280 nothing too crazy. So really for the remainder of 392 00:20:42,280 --> 00:20:44,480 training, and that could be 2-3 months depending on how much 393 00:20:44,480 --> 00:20:47,720 time you have of you do, you're focusing on the specific demands 394 00:20:47,720 --> 00:20:51,880 of the marathon, long endurance runs at marathon pace a little 395 00:20:51,880 --> 00:20:54,760 bit quicker. And yeah, doing a half marathon 396 00:20:54,760 --> 00:21:00,000 I think is the perfect way to see what you're going to be 397 00:21:00,000 --> 00:21:04,120 capable of for the marathon. I like to have my athletes do a 398 00:21:04,120 --> 00:21:09,440 half marathon about four to six weeks, maybe 4 to 8 weeks at the 399 00:21:09,440 --> 00:21:12,760 most before to their goal marathon. 400 00:21:12,760 --> 00:21:16,560 And that time frame is really specific because any closer than 401 00:21:16,560 --> 00:21:21,680 four weeks to your marathon, you may not recover enough from the 402 00:21:21,680 --> 00:21:24,920 half marathon to bounce back and then run a really good marathon. 403 00:21:24,920 --> 00:21:29,320 Please don't underestimate how hard 1/2 marathon can be on your 404 00:21:29,320 --> 00:21:31,000 body. Some people recover very quick, 405 00:21:31,000 --> 00:21:33,800 some people don't. And all these races I'm talking 406 00:21:33,800 --> 00:21:37,960 about doing, I do want you to run them at 100% effort, not 407 00:21:37,960 --> 00:21:39,880 hold back. So, you know, any damage that 408 00:21:39,880 --> 00:21:42,520 comes to your body, you accept. And that's just structured in 409 00:21:42,520 --> 00:21:44,320 the training. You're not doing these at like 410 00:21:44,400 --> 00:21:46,880 80% or 90%. You're doing about, you know, as 411 00:21:46,880 --> 00:21:49,640 if they were your gold race. So if you do your half marathon 412 00:21:49,640 --> 00:21:52,320 four to six weeks before, you know, then maybe the next week 413 00:21:52,320 --> 00:21:54,080 after that you can recover a bit. 414 00:21:54,080 --> 00:21:59,160 And then you have three weeks or you know, 5 weeks or whatever to 415 00:21:59,160 --> 00:22:03,480 do a few more big long runs and then taper down before your 416 00:22:03,480 --> 00:22:05,520 race. But along the way throughout 417 00:22:05,520 --> 00:22:08,920 training, you know, as your coach or if you're self coached, 418 00:22:09,440 --> 00:22:13,600 you can put your race times into a race prediction calculator and 419 00:22:13,600 --> 00:22:17,520 say, OK, I ran this 5K, you know, two months in the 420 00:22:17,520 --> 00:22:19,840 training, it thinks I can do this for the half. 421 00:22:19,840 --> 00:22:23,400 OK, so then you know what to structure your, your paces at to 422 00:22:23,400 --> 00:22:27,360 get ready for that half. Then you do the half and, and 423 00:22:27,360 --> 00:22:31,200 hopefully that went well. And then you can say, OK, this 424 00:22:31,200 --> 00:22:34,600 is predicting that I can do this for the marathon. 425 00:22:35,080 --> 00:22:37,840 And then you know what to structure your paces at in 426 00:22:37,840 --> 00:22:39,520 training to get ready for the marathon. 427 00:22:39,520 --> 00:22:44,160 And hopefully you're getting more confident with racing as 428 00:22:44,160 --> 00:22:47,760 you go along and more sure of what you're capable of. 429 00:22:47,760 --> 00:22:50,040 And you know, you're getting a lot of valuable information. 430 00:22:50,040 --> 00:22:52,960 If it seems like there's some mismatch in your times of like, 431 00:22:53,280 --> 00:22:54,880 you know, maybe you say, hey, I did really good. 432 00:22:54,880 --> 00:22:57,720 I thought I did really good, but like my times only projecting to 433 00:22:57,720 --> 00:23:01,720 this or whatever for the other distance, maybe, maybe that's a 434 00:23:01,720 --> 00:23:04,160 good indicator that I like you know, how how you should what 435 00:23:04,160 --> 00:23:06,320 you should focus on in the rest of training or you make it a 436 00:23:06,320 --> 00:23:10,000 good sense of like, wow, like the shorter races tell me I can 437 00:23:10,000 --> 00:23:12,600 run this fast in the marathon, but I've never even run close to 438 00:23:12,600 --> 00:23:15,520 that fast in the marathon. Like that's a good indication of 439 00:23:15,520 --> 00:23:18,200 what you're capable of and and maybe what you need to focus on 440 00:23:18,200 --> 00:23:19,480 if you want to run that in the marathon. 441 00:23:19,480 --> 00:23:21,840 So you get a lot of valuable information and then you know, 442 00:23:21,840 --> 00:23:24,760 you have realistic expectations of what you can actually do in 443 00:23:24,760 --> 00:23:26,400 your next race. By the time you get to your 444 00:23:26,400 --> 00:23:29,600 race, you're hopefully very confident in it and you know, 445 00:23:29,600 --> 00:23:30,960 you know what you're capable people of. 446 00:23:31,200 --> 00:23:33,320 So you just need to live up to that. 447 00:23:33,720 --> 00:23:36,840 And you know, I think when people race with this frequency 448 00:23:36,840 --> 00:23:39,800 of like roughly once every one or two months, and you do that 449 00:23:39,880 --> 00:23:42,400 for a long period of time, you know, for multiple seasons, 450 00:23:42,880 --> 00:23:45,800 that's how you get to be a very good confident racer. 451 00:23:45,800 --> 00:23:48,400 And then you can get the most out of the fitness that you're 452 00:23:48,400 --> 00:23:50,760 working so hard to achieve. Perfect. 453 00:23:50,760 --> 00:23:52,120 Well said. I do want to talk to you a 454 00:23:52,120 --> 00:23:55,400 little bit about what tools there are for prediction and all 455 00:23:55,400 --> 00:23:57,960 that stuff, because obviously we all know Garmin and Starba are 456 00:23:57,960 --> 00:24:00,200 completely off. But before we do that, I want to 457 00:24:00,200 --> 00:24:03,840 take a step even further back and talk about, you mentioned a 458 00:24:03,840 --> 00:24:07,160 little bit about recovery and integrating recovery after the 459 00:24:07,320 --> 00:24:11,920 those races, but what about pre race, right? 460 00:24:11,920 --> 00:24:15,160 Because you have these runners that are now just using online 461 00:24:15,160 --> 00:24:18,320 training plans and they put their races and then there is a 462 00:24:18,320 --> 00:24:20,920 training plan. You can't really tell it that 463 00:24:20,920 --> 00:24:24,560 hey, I'm racing and as you mentioned, you want them to run 464 00:24:24,560 --> 00:24:27,640 at 100% of the race. So normally you would taper down 465 00:24:27,640 --> 00:24:29,920 to a race. Is there tapering down to those 466 00:24:29,920 --> 00:24:32,040 smaller ones and the half marathons? 467 00:24:32,040 --> 00:24:34,560 And then also once they are done, how do you integrate the 468 00:24:34,800 --> 00:24:37,000 recovery? Maybe you can dive into that a 469 00:24:37,000 --> 00:24:39,240 little bit deeper. Yeah, that's the great question. 470 00:24:39,280 --> 00:24:41,680 You know, obviously not, it's not always going to work out 471 00:24:41,680 --> 00:24:45,040 perfectly because it depends on like what when your races are 472 00:24:45,040 --> 00:24:47,280 and maybe it doesn't always fit perfectly into your training 473 00:24:47,280 --> 00:24:49,040 plan. But I think in an ideal 474 00:24:49,040 --> 00:24:54,320 situation, you would, you would not taper your mileage for these 475 00:24:54,320 --> 00:24:56,280 tune up braces. So the only thing you would tape 476 00:24:56,280 --> 00:25:00,080 your mileage for is your your gold marathon at the end you 477 00:25:00,080 --> 00:25:01,440 want to keep all throughout training. 478 00:25:01,440 --> 00:25:03,680 So being as consistent as possible. 479 00:25:03,720 --> 00:25:07,400 You really don't need to taper for a for A5 Ki would say for 480 00:25:07,400 --> 00:25:09,360 like 90% of the people listening to this. 481 00:25:09,640 --> 00:25:14,040 And then for 1/2 again with at that point in your training when 482 00:25:14,040 --> 00:25:17,680 you do that, you're so close to your marathon already only like 483 00:25:17,680 --> 00:25:19,840 4 to six weeks out that I wouldn't want to drop your 484 00:25:19,840 --> 00:25:22,720 mileage before it. Just want to do it and, and see 485 00:25:22,720 --> 00:25:24,880 where you're at. One of the valuable things with 486 00:25:24,880 --> 00:25:30,080 doing that is keeping in mind that a big reason why marathon 487 00:25:30,080 --> 00:25:33,960 training works is this concept of your training under like 488 00:25:33,960 --> 00:25:36,840 continuous load or cumulative fatigue. 489 00:25:36,840 --> 00:25:39,720 Every time you do a workout or race, you're tired going into 490 00:25:39,720 --> 00:25:41,240 it. You're not fully tapered into 491 00:25:41,240 --> 00:25:42,800 it. So when you do these tune up 492 00:25:42,800 --> 00:25:45,840 races, even though I'm saying to him at 100%, you're not fully 493 00:25:45,840 --> 00:25:49,160 rested going into it, that's OK. So you know, then when you 494 00:25:49,160 --> 00:25:52,160 project out what you could do in the marathon, then you might, 495 00:25:52,240 --> 00:25:54,360 you think like, OK, this is what it thinks I can do. 496 00:25:54,760 --> 00:25:57,560 But now imagine if I was fully rested, I could probably even do 497 00:25:57,560 --> 00:26:01,360 even better or I have a better chance of reaching that time, 498 00:26:01,360 --> 00:26:04,560 which seems so hard to hit. But if you're fully tapered, 499 00:26:04,560 --> 00:26:08,480 it's one of the magic things about going into a goal race and 500 00:26:08,480 --> 00:26:12,040 being fully prepared for it. So what I would do though, is I 501 00:26:12,040 --> 00:26:15,280 would probably skip the workout right before the race. 502 00:26:15,280 --> 00:26:18,440 So I would replace one of your weekly workouts with with the 503 00:26:18,440 --> 00:26:20,600 race. So kind of depends on the 504 00:26:21,040 --> 00:26:24,520 athlete, but I generally take two approaches with with 505 00:26:24,600 --> 00:26:26,480 training programs for my athletes. 506 00:26:26,480 --> 00:26:30,040 I either have them do like 2 midweek workouts in the long run 507 00:26:30,080 --> 00:26:34,520 or I have them do one week workout that's longer in the 508 00:26:34,520 --> 00:26:37,160 long run. But I never really have more 509 00:26:37,160 --> 00:26:40,520 than like 2 intense days per week, like 2 hard days per week 510 00:26:40,520 --> 00:26:44,040 regardless of the structure. So if you were doing a weekend 511 00:26:44,040 --> 00:26:46,680 race, I would just make sure that like the three or four days 512 00:26:46,680 --> 00:26:49,000 beforehand, you're not doing anything intense. 513 00:26:49,320 --> 00:26:53,360 So if we think about like a classic Tuesday workout, 514 00:26:53,360 --> 00:26:56,760 Thursday workout, Saturday long run, if you're doing a Saturday 515 00:26:56,760 --> 00:27:00,320 or Sunday race, I would get rid of like your Thursday workout 516 00:27:00,320 --> 00:27:03,000 and just do an easy run that day with some strides at the end. 517 00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:05,480 So I would just do like a Tuesday workout and then you'd 518 00:27:05,480 --> 00:27:09,080 have until the weekend just easy, but keep the mileage up, 519 00:27:09,120 --> 00:27:11,720 but no intensity. And that kind of helps freshen 520 00:27:11,720 --> 00:27:13,040 me up a little bit before the race. 521 00:27:13,640 --> 00:27:16,920 And then you just last thing on this, you know, in an ideal 522 00:27:16,920 --> 00:27:20,840 world, then after the race you could following week take 523 00:27:20,840 --> 00:27:23,640 recovery week. And when I do recovery weeks 524 00:27:23,640 --> 00:27:25,960 with my athletes, it's basically, you know, I give them 525 00:27:25,960 --> 00:27:29,840 three or four weeks of like a set mileage with intensity. 526 00:27:30,080 --> 00:27:33,440 And then I have a cutback week that's a little bit less depends 527 00:27:33,440 --> 00:27:37,280 on the athlete, but maybe 75 to like 90% of their normal 528 00:27:37,280 --> 00:27:39,720 mileage. And then just no intensity that 529 00:27:39,720 --> 00:27:42,120 week, maybe just some strides or some short hills. 530 00:27:42,120 --> 00:27:44,520 And that gives them a bit of a mental break and a bit of a 531 00:27:44,520 --> 00:27:47,480 physical break before we then resume harder training the 532 00:27:47,480 --> 00:27:50,400 following week and maybe step up their mileage the following 533 00:27:50,400 --> 00:27:53,280 week. So if ideally, if you can go 534 00:27:53,280 --> 00:27:56,560 into your race untapered and then take a recovery week the 535 00:27:56,560 --> 00:27:58,560 following week, I think that that's a good approach. 536 00:27:58,560 --> 00:28:00,400 Perfect, Craig. Thank you for explaining that. 537 00:28:06,480 --> 00:28:10,000 And now let's move on to the question about your way of 538 00:28:10,000 --> 00:28:12,800 predicting. Obviously with a race, you 539 00:28:12,800 --> 00:28:15,120 interpret the data and you kind of have an idea. 540 00:28:15,280 --> 00:28:17,040 But then we also have other tools, right? 541 00:28:17,200 --> 00:28:19,720 You mentioned some race prediction places where you can 542 00:28:19,720 --> 00:28:22,560 insert numbers. And then we have the Garmin and 543 00:28:22,560 --> 00:28:26,320 Strava, which are always wrong. So tell us what you think about 544 00:28:26,320 --> 00:28:29,120 all that. Yes, I really don't like the 545 00:28:29,120 --> 00:28:33,360 watch based predictors like the Garmin predictions, Java 546 00:28:33,360 --> 00:28:36,200 predictions, all that stuff. Anything that's predicting what 547 00:28:36,200 --> 00:28:40,640 you can do in a race based off of like analyzing your runs or 548 00:28:40,640 --> 00:28:43,520 heart rate data or whatever. I suggest turning all those all 549 00:28:43,520 --> 00:28:46,000 that off. I I've personally never used it, 550 00:28:46,320 --> 00:28:50,360 but I've had a lot of athletes tell me about it and I almost 551 00:28:50,360 --> 00:28:52,000 always disagree with what it says. 552 00:28:52,360 --> 00:28:55,080 And they're often telling me like, you know, it thought I 553 00:28:55,080 --> 00:28:56,800 could do this, but then I did this. 554 00:28:56,800 --> 00:28:59,640 I think it's just not accurate. I think it's, you know, maybe 555 00:28:59,640 --> 00:29:02,560 sometimes it is, but I think by and large it's inaccurate. 556 00:29:02,560 --> 00:29:07,000 It sets you up for, you know, it gives you false expectations of 557 00:29:07,000 --> 00:29:08,800 what you're capable of. I don't even know. 558 00:29:08,800 --> 00:29:10,240 Maybe it thinks you're worse than you are. 559 00:29:10,240 --> 00:29:11,480 Maybe it thinks you're better than you are. 560 00:29:11,480 --> 00:29:13,040 I don't know. I just don't think it's right. 561 00:29:13,080 --> 00:29:16,200 It also like I know Garmin, maybe it's Garmin, I don't know, 562 00:29:16,200 --> 00:29:19,040 but sometimes watches will tell you like if your training has 563 00:29:19,040 --> 00:29:22,080 been productive or unproductive or if you're peaking or 564 00:29:22,080 --> 00:29:24,200 whatever. I suggest turning all that stuff 565 00:29:24,200 --> 00:29:26,080 off. I it really frustrates me when 566 00:29:26,080 --> 00:29:29,520 athletes tell me that their watch is telling them that or 567 00:29:29,520 --> 00:29:31,160 whatever. I'm just like, just turn it off. 568 00:29:31,160 --> 00:29:32,680 It doesn't know the full picture. 569 00:29:33,080 --> 00:29:36,920 I just don't think it's right. So it's, turn it off if you can. 570 00:29:37,360 --> 00:29:40,640 The, I mentioned earlier in this podcast, the best way to know 571 00:29:40,640 --> 00:29:44,480 what you're capable of doing in a race is by comparing it to 572 00:29:44,480 --> 00:29:48,520 past races that you've done. I don't think that training can 573 00:29:48,520 --> 00:29:50,680 kind of indicate what you're capable of. 574 00:29:50,680 --> 00:29:54,520 But the like, if you want to know what you can do in a 10K, 575 00:29:54,760 --> 00:29:57,480 you need to run a 5K or a half. If you want to know what you can 576 00:29:57,480 --> 00:30:00,160 do in a marathon, you need to run a 10K or a half. 577 00:30:00,360 --> 00:30:02,720 And then that just kind of put you in the ballpark and then you 578 00:30:02,720 --> 00:30:05,560 go and see, right. And, you know, if you're trying 579 00:30:05,560 --> 00:30:08,240 to PR, then you need to be like, OK, what have I done in this 580 00:30:08,240 --> 00:30:10,280 race in the past? And then, you know, what have I 581 00:30:10,280 --> 00:30:13,960 done for other races recently? And is that projecting out in 582 00:30:13,960 --> 00:30:15,680 race calculators saying I can run faster? 583 00:30:15,680 --> 00:30:16,840 Do I feel like my training is better? 584 00:30:16,840 --> 00:30:18,400 Do I feel fitter? I don't know. 585 00:30:18,400 --> 00:30:21,120 The only way to really know is to actually do the race. 586 00:30:21,120 --> 00:30:24,440 That said, you know, the one tool that I use everyday and I 587 00:30:24,440 --> 00:30:28,560 think is super, super accurate is the it's the V dot 588 00:30:28,560 --> 00:30:30,200 calculator. Think that's what it's 589 00:30:30,200 --> 00:30:32,640 officially called and that's been around for a really long 590 00:30:32,640 --> 00:30:35,760 time. Basically, you can plug in a 591 00:30:35,760 --> 00:30:39,600 race time from a recent race that you did and it will give 592 00:30:39,600 --> 00:30:43,560 you a whole bunch of training paces and it will give you 593 00:30:43,560 --> 00:30:47,400 predictions and what it thinks you can do for different races 594 00:30:47,400 --> 00:30:49,360 based on that. Before there was the calculator, 595 00:30:49,360 --> 00:30:52,320 there was a bunch of tables so you could use in a book, but I 596 00:30:52,320 --> 00:30:56,120 think that's super accurate generally, especially when 597 00:30:56,120 --> 00:30:59,520 you're comparing like a race distance to like the next race 598 00:30:59,520 --> 00:31:01,920 distance over. So like comparing like if 599 00:31:01,920 --> 00:31:05,280 someone runs a 5K to what they can do in like a 10K or 10K to 600 00:31:05,280 --> 00:31:08,720 1/2 or half to a marathon. It's not always as accurate when 601 00:31:08,720 --> 00:31:12,960 you're like comparing a 5K to a marathon, but it tells you the 602 00:31:12,960 --> 00:31:15,800 potential that you may have as an athlete. 603 00:31:15,800 --> 00:31:19,800 Like if you ran this time in the 5K, you have the potential to do 604 00:31:19,800 --> 00:31:21,680 this in the marathon. Doesn't necessarily mean you can 605 00:31:21,680 --> 00:31:24,880 do it right away, but I find that that tool is very, very 606 00:31:24,880 --> 00:31:27,360 accurate. And I often have athletes run 607 00:31:27,680 --> 00:31:29,560 within a second to what it predicts. 608 00:31:29,560 --> 00:31:33,480 So yeah, I think Jack Daniels might have applied his name to 609 00:31:33,480 --> 00:31:35,560 it at one point. I don't know if he's still 610 00:31:35,560 --> 00:31:38,960 affiliated with it, but the V dot calculator I think is highly 611 00:31:39,400 --> 00:31:40,760 highly accurate. I thought he. 612 00:31:40,760 --> 00:31:43,200 Was the one that actually invented it if I'm not wrong. 613 00:31:43,200 --> 00:31:44,040 I'll have to look that. Up. 614 00:31:44,040 --> 00:31:46,800 Yeah, it's in his book. It's in his his book. 615 00:31:46,920 --> 00:31:49,760 And yeah, he actually passed away this past year, which I I 616 00:31:49,760 --> 00:31:51,480 read about, which was sad to hear, but yeah. 617 00:31:51,480 --> 00:31:52,680 Just recently, right? Yeah. 618 00:31:52,680 --> 00:31:54,880 Yeah. But his the, the V dot 619 00:31:54,880 --> 00:31:58,680 calculator, it's it's tables based on like VO2 Max 620 00:31:58,680 --> 00:32:01,440 measurements of athletes I think and then extrapolate it out over 621 00:32:01,440 --> 00:32:03,920 different, different race distances, something like that. 622 00:32:04,240 --> 00:32:06,040 But I find it very very very accurate. 623 00:32:06,080 --> 00:32:08,200 Yeah, and I've heard that feedback from other coaches as 624 00:32:08,200 --> 00:32:09,480 well. And you know, it just goes to to 625 00:32:09,480 --> 00:32:12,280 show there is no AI that can substitute for a really good 626 00:32:12,280 --> 00:32:13,200 formula. Yeah. 627 00:32:13,400 --> 00:32:15,000 And of course, knowing how to use it right. 628 00:32:15,000 --> 00:32:16,280 Yeah, so. Perfect. 629 00:32:16,720 --> 00:32:17,720 Well, thank you. Chris. 630 00:32:17,720 --> 00:32:21,160 Do you have any other tips when it comes to these uncoached 631 00:32:21,160 --> 00:32:23,120 runners? Obviously we will tell them all 632 00:32:23,120 --> 00:32:26,960 to go to you to have a great coach, but is there anything 633 00:32:26,960 --> 00:32:30,080 else that you would like to tell the runners that are now 634 00:32:30,080 --> 00:32:33,760 thinking about incorporating races into their training plans 635 00:32:33,760 --> 00:32:36,280 in order to have the best marathon this year? 636 00:32:36,280 --> 00:32:38,200 Yeah. I mean, I think that there's 637 00:32:38,200 --> 00:32:40,320 probably two types of people who are listening to this. 638 00:32:40,320 --> 00:32:44,000 There's either the folks who like never race before their 639 00:32:44,000 --> 00:32:47,200 goal races and, and I would highly encourage you to give it 640 00:32:47,200 --> 00:32:48,760 a shot before your next marathon. 641 00:32:48,760 --> 00:32:52,040 You know, race once every month or two in the build up to your 642 00:32:52,040 --> 00:32:54,880 marathon and it's a great way to get more comfortable racing. 643 00:32:54,920 --> 00:32:58,280 If you're someone who races all the time, like every week or 644 00:32:58,280 --> 00:33:01,440 every two weeks, I would encourage you to step back a 645 00:33:01,440 --> 00:33:04,600 little bit from that and it's and pick and choose your races a 646 00:33:04,600 --> 00:33:07,520 bit more carefully. And again, just go down to this 647 00:33:07,520 --> 00:33:11,440 frequency of like no more than once a month and build up in 648 00:33:11,440 --> 00:33:14,240 distance towards your goal race. I think that that's the perfect 649 00:33:14,240 --> 00:33:16,560 frequency for getting ready for a marathon. 650 00:33:16,640 --> 00:33:19,840 And you know, if you're already doing what I'm saying, then good 651 00:33:19,840 --> 00:33:20,880 job. I think you're on the right 652 00:33:20,880 --> 00:33:21,920 track. Awesome. 653 00:33:21,920 --> 00:33:24,920 And then, coach, can you please let our listeners know how they 654 00:33:24,920 --> 00:33:28,080 can best find you? Yeah, I'm on Instagram at night 655 00:33:28,080 --> 00:33:32,320 and runs mostly just sharing like success stories from my 656 00:33:32,320 --> 00:33:34,840 athletes these days. You can reach out to me there 657 00:33:35,200 --> 00:33:37,720 also on my website, nightinruns.com. 658 00:33:37,720 --> 00:33:39,840 I have a ton of podcast episodes. 659 00:33:39,840 --> 00:33:42,800 If you enjoyed this that you can listen to on other subjects, 660 00:33:42,800 --> 00:33:46,400 definitely get my my free audio book download by signing up for 661 00:33:46,400 --> 00:33:48,320 my e-mail list on my website as well. 662 00:33:48,720 --> 00:33:51,320 And yeah, it's probably the best ways to reach out to me. 663 00:33:51,320 --> 00:33:54,560 I, you know, now the beginning of the year is, is a great time 664 00:33:54,560 --> 00:33:56,800 to get started. A lot of people are excited to 665 00:33:56,800 --> 00:33:58,560 to train. I've had a number of folks reach 666 00:33:58,560 --> 00:34:00,320 out to me to get started this year, which is great. 667 00:34:00,480 --> 00:34:02,920 You know, if it's a good fit, I'm I'm always happy to bring on 668 00:34:02,920 --> 00:34:05,320 a new athlete. So if your performance driven 669 00:34:05,320 --> 00:34:08,320 and and you know, love this sport and want to make sure that 670 00:34:08,320 --> 00:34:11,560 you do it the right way and and want to make it a long term 671 00:34:11,560 --> 00:34:14,560 habit and lifestyle as I don't have to chat with you and we can 672 00:34:14,560 --> 00:34:15,840 you can see what you can do with your running. 673 00:34:15,840 --> 00:34:16,719 Perfect. Well said. 674 00:34:16,760 --> 00:34:18,480 Thank you, Chris, so much. I appreciate it. 675 00:34:18,560 --> 00:34:23,679 Thanks, lady. Thank you, Chris for coming on 676 00:34:23,679 --> 00:34:26,480 and speaking with us. That was very insightful and 677 00:34:26,480 --> 00:34:28,840 super exciting. And hopefully some of us with 678 00:34:28,840 --> 00:34:32,280 New Year's just having passed, will take your advice into 679 00:34:32,280 --> 00:34:36,199 consideration as we train for our next marathon and implement 680 00:34:36,199 --> 00:34:39,080 those speed workouts for all of you listeners. 681 00:34:39,080 --> 00:34:42,199 As I mentioned, everything will be LinkedIn, the show notes 682 00:34:42,199 --> 00:34:46,000 below as well as our website where we have written an article 683 00:34:46,000 --> 00:34:48,360 and pulled out the most important parts of our 684 00:34:48,360 --> 00:34:50,600 conversation with Chris. You can find that at 685 00:34:50,600 --> 00:34:53,480 marathonjournal.com, but probably we also LinkedIn the 686 00:34:53,480 --> 00:34:56,600 show notes. So I guess that wraps it up for 687 00:34:56,600 --> 00:34:59,000 today. Stay tuned for next week's 688 00:34:59,000 --> 00:35:02,400 episode because we are going to have an amazing guest coming on, 689 00:35:02,600 --> 00:35:06,760 not to talk about her book, but to talk about how she operates. 690 00:35:06,760 --> 00:35:10,040 And that guest is going to be, you guessed it, Keira Knightley. 691 00:35:10,160 --> 00:35:13,800 It's going to be very awesome. So it's going to be very 692 00:35:13,800 --> 00:35:16,040 awesome. So make sure that you subscribe 693 00:35:16,040 --> 00:35:18,720 to this podcast and give us a rating while you're at it. 694 00:35:19,120 --> 00:35:21,480 And with that, have a great week of running. 695 00:35:24,040 --> 00:35:26,080 You've been listening to the Marathon Running Podcast by 696 00:35:26,080 --> 00:35:28,880 Marathon Journal. If you've enjoyed the show, 697 00:35:28,880 --> 00:35:31,880 check us out at marathonjournal.com or follow us 698 00:35:31,880 --> 00:35:33,840 on social media. Happy training.