1 00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:04,760 Also we didn't mention but like shout out to BN for speaking on 2 00:00:04,760 --> 00:00:08,360 our economic situation and that. Just went and blasted the 3 00:00:08,360 --> 00:00:12,280 government. The government's position is the 4 00:00:12,280 --> 00:00:14,000 people. Yeah, that's that's that was 5 00:00:14,000 --> 00:00:17,560 dope. Exactly bro what did he say? 6 00:00:17,560 --> 00:00:21,080 Freedom of expression, but not. Freedom of expression. 7 00:00:21,080 --> 00:01:25,280 Expression. What's up everyone? 8 00:01:25,280 --> 00:01:30,840 Welcome to the 3030% podcast. Podcast de la Fini. 9 00:01:33,800 --> 00:01:41,000 Yeah. Have you, have you seen that? 10 00:01:41,040 --> 00:01:43,480 Have you seen that trend? Have you seen that trend of 11 00:01:43,480 --> 00:01:46,880 people? Have you seen that trend of 12 00:01:46,880 --> 00:01:50,520 people trying to give their like daily routine in Kiswahili? 13 00:01:50,600 --> 00:01:53,160 It's so hilarious, man. No, I haven't seen that. 14 00:01:53,160 --> 00:01:57,120 It's it's actually it's actually peak entertainment and it sounds 15 00:01:57,120 --> 00:02:00,160 exactly like what you. Like, that was horrible, man. 16 00:02:00,160 --> 00:02:02,880 That's what's up, man. It's 30% podcast. 17 00:02:02,880 --> 00:02:05,160 It's us, man. We've been here for 133 18 00:02:05,280 --> 00:02:07,600 episodes. Episode 133. 19 00:02:07,880 --> 00:02:09,240 I'm Sam. That's Afam. 20 00:02:09,560 --> 00:02:12,560 Afam is a producer. I'm also a producer and we talk 21 00:02:12,560 --> 00:02:19,960 about the Kenyan music industry and we are really excited that 22 00:02:19,960 --> 00:02:24,440 you guys are joining us today. I mean, technically we are all 23 00:02:24,440 --> 00:02:26,560 producers. I mean, everyone produces carbon 24 00:02:26,560 --> 00:02:29,920 dioxide, right? So hey listen, it depends on 25 00:02:29,920 --> 00:02:33,360 what context. Of product utter work nonsense. 26 00:02:38,080 --> 00:02:41,040 Listen, we are all. Everyone produces cover, 27 00:02:41,400 --> 00:02:43,200 Everyone is a creative. Honestly, if if you're looking 28 00:02:43,200 --> 00:02:45,600 at that, like even people who are sitting, sitting in desks, 29 00:02:45,640 --> 00:02:48,800 if you're sitting in desks coming up with spreadsheets for 30 00:02:48,800 --> 00:02:51,360 your company, that's a creative because you have to really line 31 00:02:51,360 --> 00:02:53,240 them up. And then everyone is a creative. 32 00:02:53,480 --> 00:02:55,520 It's all, it's all creative work at the end of the day. 33 00:02:56,920 --> 00:02:59,360 So yeah, man, shout out to all the creatives out there, every 34 00:02:59,360 --> 00:03:01,000 single one of you. Period. 35 00:03:01,760 --> 00:03:05,080 Chat to all the workers out there and the teachers, the The 36 00:03:07,320 --> 00:03:09,120 Who else? The police. 37 00:03:09,120 --> 00:03:10,960 Can I shout out the police? That's such a touching. 38 00:03:10,960 --> 00:03:15,360 While we're here, shout out to all the industrial plants out 39 00:03:15,360 --> 00:03:18,600 there, you know, the people making our milk, our bread. 40 00:03:18,760 --> 00:03:21,560 You know, let's just shout out everyone now that we're shouting 41 00:03:21,560 --> 00:03:23,840 out everyone. We're shout out, the politicians 42 00:03:23,960 --> 00:03:25,520 shout out, just shout out everybody. 43 00:03:25,600 --> 00:03:28,800 Shout out to the farmers, Shout out to the farmers. 44 00:03:29,240 --> 00:03:30,920 Shout out to the farmers, the farmers. 45 00:03:30,960 --> 00:03:33,160 No, no, they really do hold us down for real, man. 46 00:03:33,440 --> 00:03:35,440 Underrated, underrated and appreciated. 47 00:03:36,400 --> 00:03:39,520 But yeah, what's up? What's going on? 48 00:03:40,320 --> 00:03:41,320 How's how's? Life. 49 00:03:41,880 --> 00:03:44,200 I'm good, man. I'm chilling. 50 00:03:45,120 --> 00:03:49,240 Just still living life in New York. 51 00:03:50,880 --> 00:03:55,680 Yeah, man, have I been up to anything interesting? 52 00:03:55,680 --> 00:03:59,960 I mean, I don't want to talk about streams for 1/4 podcast in 53 00:03:59,960 --> 00:04:03,800 a row, but I do I I have really been. 54 00:04:03,800 --> 00:04:05,520 You were watching Santi's stream? 55 00:04:05,520 --> 00:04:08,160 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 56 00:04:08,160 --> 00:04:12,400 I was heavy. But I will reserve my thoughts 57 00:04:12,400 --> 00:04:16,200 about I'll, I'll reserve my thoughts about that specific 58 00:04:16,200 --> 00:04:20,040 thing later in the podcast. Guys, that is called subtle 59 00:04:20,399 --> 00:04:24,840 foreshadowing anyway. Such a prove. 60 00:04:25,280 --> 00:04:28,800 Such a prove right here. Bro what a prove not not not 61 00:04:28,800 --> 00:04:32,120 just a pro. I am a consummate professional 62 00:04:32,160 --> 00:04:33,800 at my. Those words with me? 63 00:04:33,840 --> 00:04:35,760 Consummate professional. Alright, sure. 64 00:04:36,680 --> 00:04:39,840 Listen, those those words mean affirm. 65 00:04:39,840 --> 00:04:42,360 They're just a different way of describing my being. 66 00:04:42,360 --> 00:04:45,520 Yo, how are you bro? How? 67 00:04:45,520 --> 00:04:47,960 How is how's how's everything on your end? 68 00:04:50,080 --> 00:04:54,360 Uninteresting, very uninteresting. 69 00:04:55,040 --> 00:04:59,880 But it will change soon. I believe at some point in my 70 00:04:59,880 --> 00:05:04,120 life I'll become like a like a OK, I'll be an outside guy. 71 00:05:04,120 --> 00:05:07,640 I'll be like fun. I'll be a fun person at just 72 00:05:07,640 --> 00:05:09,520 going outside and just linking up with people's. 73 00:05:09,520 --> 00:05:12,960 At some point in my life something has to change and one 74 00:05:12,960 --> 00:05:15,480 day it will. But currently we are coasting 75 00:05:15,480 --> 00:05:19,240 with what we are. I like being inside though and 76 00:05:19,240 --> 00:05:22,480 not doing much. Might need some excitement in my 77 00:05:22,480 --> 00:05:24,080 life, but that's that's not up to me. 78 00:05:24,080 --> 00:05:25,200 That's up to the people around me. 79 00:05:25,200 --> 00:05:26,960 So but yeah, I'm just cool chilling. 80 00:05:26,960 --> 00:05:32,320 I've been working and yeah, what else? 81 00:05:32,320 --> 00:05:33,680 Football season has come to an end. 82 00:05:33,840 --> 00:05:37,600 So even though I started watching football seriously in 83 00:05:37,600 --> 00:05:41,840 like October, September last year, it's come to an end. 84 00:05:41,840 --> 00:05:45,600 And I just feel like there's not like a very on the very legal 85 00:05:45,600 --> 00:05:47,240 stream way where I stream things. 86 00:05:47,560 --> 00:05:50,440 I just feel like this, there's, there's nothing there except F1. 87 00:05:50,520 --> 00:05:56,200 And so just like, oh man. Yeah, F1F1 is F1 is where it's 88 00:05:56,200 --> 00:06:00,160 at now that football is is done. So me, me, I'm OK, me, I'm well 89 00:06:00,160 --> 00:06:03,840 fed. Although damn there, there's not 90 00:06:03,840 --> 00:06:07,520 going to be F1 this coming weekend, which is a bit of a 91 00:06:07,520 --> 00:06:08,880 bummer. I don't know what I'm going to 92 00:06:08,880 --> 00:06:10,760 do with my life over this weekend. 93 00:06:10,760 --> 00:06:14,240 Just no fun weekend, no F4. It might all fall apart bro. 94 00:06:15,600 --> 00:06:19,440 It it might actually, I realized why sports means so much to a 95 00:06:19,440 --> 00:06:21,760 lot of people. But let's not make this a deep 96 00:06:21,920 --> 00:06:30,680 podcast about mental health. So anyway, on that light note, 97 00:06:31,000 --> 00:06:36,800 some let's have a podcast about other people's podcasts. 98 00:06:38,720 --> 00:06:39,760 That's how you blow. Up. 99 00:06:39,840 --> 00:06:42,440 That's how you make it. Is by critique in other podcast 100 00:06:42,440 --> 00:06:44,880 critiques, critiques, critiquing critiques. 101 00:06:44,880 --> 00:06:47,000 That's that's what this is. So. 102 00:06:47,680 --> 00:06:55,800 So Prudence Tanui Kalalala. No, no. 103 00:06:56,280 --> 00:06:58,160 You can, you can. You can laugh after, you can 104 00:06:58,160 --> 00:07:00,120 laugh after you say someone's name that that goes on. 105 00:07:03,360 --> 00:07:04,760 Listen. Big P. 106 00:07:04,760 --> 00:07:06,080 Big P. Big P. 107 00:07:06,080 --> 00:07:12,880 Big P. Oh, Big P? 108 00:07:12,920 --> 00:07:14,080 Yeah. What did Big P do? 109 00:07:14,480 --> 00:07:20,080 Big P is hilarious. OK, well, Prudence to Nui AKA 110 00:07:20,080 --> 00:07:27,080 King Kalala is part of a podcast that has been generating a 111 00:07:27,080 --> 00:07:28,520 little bit of buzz. It's. 112 00:07:28,520 --> 00:07:32,240 Called fairly new podcast too. No lies. 113 00:07:32,720 --> 00:07:35,240 It's a new podcast. Just showed up actually I think. 114 00:07:36,040 --> 00:07:39,080 Yeah, it's new Ish. Yeah. 115 00:07:39,080 --> 00:07:42,880 And they're taking the streets by storm, you know, by giving us 116 00:07:43,120 --> 00:07:47,680 all the edgy opinions that we probably would never find 117 00:07:47,680 --> 00:07:50,840 anywhere else. So guys, yeah, today we want to 118 00:07:50,840 --> 00:07:55,040 talk about the thing that's just been going around, which was 119 00:07:55,160 --> 00:08:00,760 there's a clip of them discussing and by them we are 120 00:08:00,760 --> 00:08:07,400 referring to King Kalala, to Frankie, just Jim it and 121 00:08:07,400 --> 00:08:10,280 Christine Nampira. Was it Nampira? 122 00:08:11,320 --> 00:08:17,440 And yeah, essentially they were talking about how, well, I guess 123 00:08:17,440 --> 00:08:22,680 Christine was mentioning that Kenyans do not support their 124 00:08:22,680 --> 00:08:25,640 celebrities. And she gave examples of how 125 00:08:25,880 --> 00:08:30,080 when you go to social media, you see the likes of Bien and you 126 00:08:30,080 --> 00:08:34,880 see the likes of Nashinsky have relatively low followings, at 127 00:08:34,880 --> 00:08:39,559 which point King Kalala was was up in arms. 128 00:08:39,559 --> 00:08:41,960 They were both up in arms because they were like, yo, 129 00:08:41,960 --> 00:08:46,960 listen, what does me following artists like really mean in the 130 00:08:46,960 --> 00:08:49,960 grand scheme of things? When I go for their shows, I go, 131 00:08:49,960 --> 00:08:54,040 I pay VVIP for their shows. I do this, that and the 3rd to 132 00:08:54,040 --> 00:08:56,560 support their music. We listen to the music heavily 133 00:08:56,560 --> 00:08:58,520 stuff. So it doesn't matter if I don't 134 00:08:58,720 --> 00:09:02,960 follow this artist, right? Because I'm out here actively 135 00:09:03,120 --> 00:09:06,800 supporting the artist and, and that brought a lot of mixed 136 00:09:07,000 --> 00:09:11,160 reactions online. So Sam, I want to ask you the 137 00:09:11,160 --> 00:09:14,240 question, do you agree with that sentiment? 138 00:09:14,400 --> 00:09:17,160 Do you agree that as long as you're supporting an artist by 139 00:09:17,160 --> 00:09:21,840 listening to their streams or contributing to their streams as 140 00:09:21,840 --> 00:09:25,680 well as buying tickets to their shows, maybe even merchandise 141 00:09:25,680 --> 00:09:28,200 and stuff like that, doesn't really matter if you're not 142 00:09:28,200 --> 00:09:34,360 showing support digitally online, on social media, ETCETC? 143 00:09:35,400 --> 00:09:40,320 I feel like it's, it's, it's a deeper, it's a question that 144 00:09:40,320 --> 00:09:45,480 requires like just more thinking than usual, because then it, it 145 00:09:45,480 --> 00:09:48,360 brings up the question of. That sounds funny. 146 00:09:49,400 --> 00:09:55,280 It brings up the question of what, what's more important for 147 00:09:55,280 --> 00:09:57,480 an artist? Is IT support now or support 148 00:09:57,480 --> 00:09:59,320 later? Support later? 149 00:09:59,320 --> 00:10:01,480 Meaning like for example, that then those are the two sides 150 00:10:01,560 --> 00:10:04,520 where if you're actively just going out and buying merchandise 151 00:10:04,520 --> 00:10:08,440 and paying for shows and you know, streaming and everything, 152 00:10:08,600 --> 00:10:11,480 that's support now where that's money going into the artist's 153 00:10:11,480 --> 00:10:16,400 pockets and they're reaping, they're reaping the benefits of 154 00:10:16,400 --> 00:10:19,200 the work they're doing. Or is IT support later? 155 00:10:19,440 --> 00:10:25,760 Because numbers having numbers, it's almost, it leads to the 156 00:10:25,760 --> 00:10:29,280 first thing, but it's like a secondary thing where it's, it 157 00:10:29,280 --> 00:10:32,200 creates the opportunity for you, for the artists to make money. 158 00:10:33,200 --> 00:10:34,200 I don't know if that makes sense. 159 00:10:34,440 --> 00:10:36,520 So that's just a big question in my mind. 160 00:10:36,520 --> 00:10:38,800 It's like, OK, like do you support the artist now or do 161 00:10:38,800 --> 00:10:40,240 you, do you, do you support later? 162 00:10:40,240 --> 00:10:43,960 Of course, I don't see why you wouldn't do both. 163 00:10:44,840 --> 00:10:47,880 Like like someone's saying I've gone to, I've gone to, I've 164 00:10:47,880 --> 00:10:49,960 gone, let's pick an artist. I've gone to calligraph show. 165 00:10:50,240 --> 00:10:53,240 And because I've gone to Calligraph show, I'm not going 166 00:10:53,240 --> 00:10:57,520 to follow him on Instagram or I'm not, I'm not going to like 167 00:10:57,520 --> 00:10:59,960 his posts or I'm not going to, I'm not going to engage with him 168 00:10:59,960 --> 00:11:01,200 on social media because I was like this showing. 169 00:11:01,200 --> 00:11:02,600 I've already given him that support. 170 00:11:02,680 --> 00:11:04,160 He doesn't need all this like that. 171 00:11:04,160 --> 00:11:07,320 That doesn't make sense. Realistically, people should 172 00:11:07,320 --> 00:11:09,960 just support artists across the board. 173 00:11:10,360 --> 00:11:12,840 Like do as much as you can. If you like this artist, if you, 174 00:11:13,080 --> 00:11:15,840 if you enjoy their music, if, if it's if they resonate with you, 175 00:11:16,040 --> 00:11:17,520 like support them across the board. 176 00:11:17,520 --> 00:11:20,720 Right. But the but the going back to 177 00:11:20,720 --> 00:11:24,000 the question, I don't know. I it in my mind, I feel like 178 00:11:24,000 --> 00:11:27,200 it's more important to have the artists reap the benefits. 179 00:11:27,240 --> 00:11:30,320 I mean to, to, yeah, put the artists in a position where they 180 00:11:30,320 --> 00:11:32,960 reap the benefits of the art. So in that case, it's like 181 00:11:33,200 --> 00:11:37,040 actually doing the things like going for shows and, and, and 182 00:11:37,040 --> 00:11:39,720 buying merchandise and, you know, actually streaming their 183 00:11:39,720 --> 00:11:43,640 music rather than liking their posts on social media and like 184 00:11:43,640 --> 00:11:48,280 and share doesn't really do much in the short term, I think. 185 00:11:49,640 --> 00:11:52,080 OK. I mean, yeah, that's a well 186 00:11:52,080 --> 00:11:57,720 balanced answer, but which is? But I know I have to act as a as 187 00:11:57,720 --> 00:12:01,200 a devil's advocate here. So what's more important to do? 188 00:12:01,400 --> 00:12:05,640 What's more important? It's the shows, it's the shows, 189 00:12:05,640 --> 00:12:07,840 it's the it's the shows, it's the merchandise. 190 00:12:07,840 --> 00:12:11,280 It's the back in the days we used to buy buy actual albums. 191 00:12:11,280 --> 00:12:13,520 It's the buying the albums. It's because that all contribute 192 00:12:13,720 --> 00:12:15,360 right now, everything, the numbers are all funny. 193 00:12:15,360 --> 00:12:19,880 So and the numbers aren't what they are. 194 00:12:21,040 --> 00:12:24,400 It's it's it's everything's a fraction of what it used to be. 195 00:12:24,400 --> 00:12:27,000 So even even the support that you might be giving an artist in 196 00:12:27,000 --> 00:12:30,920 those other ways, you have to do way more for the artist to 197 00:12:30,920 --> 00:12:35,080 benefit from them than you probably had to do like 1020, 198 00:12:35,080 --> 00:12:38,040 thirty years ago when you're buying vinyls and cassette tapes 199 00:12:39,320 --> 00:12:41,800 and floppy disk. Do people used to put music on 200 00:12:41,800 --> 00:12:43,880 floppy disks or was that is that? 201 00:12:44,040 --> 00:12:46,640 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Heavy. 202 00:12:46,640 --> 00:12:48,960 No, no, that was no. That was the thing. 203 00:12:48,960 --> 00:12:50,080 That was the thing. Yeah. 204 00:12:50,320 --> 00:12:54,080 So, so currently in today's time, it's probably advised to 205 00:12:54,080 --> 00:12:57,880 support the artists directly and where money gets to them 206 00:12:57,880 --> 00:13:01,240 directly through shows, through buying merchandise. 207 00:13:01,720 --> 00:13:04,280 If they're not in a 360 deal, if they're in a 360 deal, then 208 00:13:04,600 --> 00:13:06,960 they're just cooked like this. There's nothing you can do for 209 00:13:06,960 --> 00:13:08,520 that for that. Artist Oh, wait, that's 210 00:13:08,520 --> 00:13:10,320 interesting. Wait, that's actually an 211 00:13:10,320 --> 00:13:11,840 interesting thing You've just met. 212 00:13:11,840 --> 00:13:15,240 Wait, if an if you know an artist is not 360, wait, do you 213 00:13:15,240 --> 00:13:19,080 show solidarity for them by not buying their merchandise? 214 00:13:19,080 --> 00:13:21,080 Because you're like, you screw the label. 215 00:13:21,080 --> 00:13:23,400 I'm not supporting. This label you're putting no, 216 00:13:23,400 --> 00:13:28,520 no, you as you as a supporter have to do twice, three times as 217 00:13:28,520 --> 00:13:31,840 much for that artist to benefit. Like that puts the the supporter 218 00:13:31,840 --> 00:13:34,840 in such a the fan in in such a bad position. 219 00:13:34,840 --> 00:13:37,400 Because now I'm, I'm having to do so much for you to actually 220 00:13:37,400 --> 00:13:39,560 benefit. Or rather like when you're indie 221 00:13:39,840 --> 00:13:42,480 and you, you can make all your money for the year from just one 222 00:13:42,480 --> 00:13:45,480 show or whatever it is or from a song if it if it goes up. 223 00:13:45,480 --> 00:13:48,280 So yeah, it's 360 artists. I just cooked, man. 224 00:13:48,280 --> 00:13:50,560 I'm so sorry. Like I don't know what you want 225 00:13:50,560 --> 00:13:53,080 to say. But it depends, it depends on 226 00:13:53,080 --> 00:13:54,720 scale. It depends on scale because if 227 00:13:54,720 --> 00:13:59,560 your Beyoncé level, signing a 360 deal isn't as bad as an 228 00:13:59,560 --> 00:14:01,960 indie artist. But here's the question. 229 00:14:02,040 --> 00:14:04,480 OK. So well, in terms of what you've 230 00:14:04,480 --> 00:14:06,720 said, I do agree with you largely. 231 00:14:07,920 --> 00:14:11,360 And I think the reason why these guys have come under fire and 232 00:14:11,360 --> 00:14:15,840 they have bro, like a lot of people have been online just 233 00:14:15,840 --> 00:14:20,360 talking about how we are uplifting the wrong sort of 234 00:14:20,360 --> 00:14:24,480 podcasts in this in this space. It's true. 235 00:14:24,800 --> 00:14:27,080 It's true. People online aboard bro people 236 00:14:27,080 --> 00:14:31,000 online, they just they, they just want to have their opinion 237 00:14:31,000 --> 00:14:32,680 heard. That's it Like they're just 238 00:14:32,680 --> 00:14:34,720 sitting there and waiting for something to pop off so that 239 00:14:35,080 --> 00:14:37,600 they can type away. It's just ridiculous. 240 00:14:37,600 --> 00:14:41,800 It's it's get a job or go do your job. 241 00:14:42,520 --> 00:14:46,560 Because because even somebody, somebody was like, I really hate 242 00:14:46,680 --> 00:14:50,680 that 80% of podcasts coming out of Kenya is this type of brain 243 00:14:50,680 --> 00:14:55,320 rot content. The other 20% is unfamous people 244 00:14:55,520 --> 00:14:58,840 doing really good topics that are worth listening to, but they 245 00:14:58,840 --> 00:15:02,000 don't get as much traction. Is this our identity? 246 00:15:02,000 --> 00:15:03,320 That is so true. Yo. 247 00:15:03,320 --> 00:15:06,160 Who is that that I that he needs a Pulitzer? 248 00:15:06,160 --> 00:15:08,440 That or she, whoever it is that that's. 249 00:15:08,440 --> 00:15:10,840 A she yeah, that's fine. It was a she. 250 00:15:10,840 --> 00:15:15,760 No, that's true, though. OK, so go so so going back to I 251 00:15:15,760 --> 00:15:17,720 mean, that's our lived experience anyway. 252 00:15:18,200 --> 00:15:21,040 I'm going to. Edit. 253 00:15:22,920 --> 00:15:26,120 No, no, I'm not editing that because I commented on that. 254 00:15:26,120 --> 00:15:29,200 I quote tweeted that it actually got a lot of attraction. 255 00:15:29,600 --> 00:15:35,840 But I was going to say, I think the reason why that clip got a 256 00:15:35,840 --> 00:15:42,720 lot of like response online was one, because of the the way she 257 00:15:42,720 --> 00:15:46,400 was adamantly being loud. And I guess that's Kalala's 258 00:15:46,760 --> 00:15:53,440 personality, but also it's because it does matter how much 259 00:15:54,320 --> 00:16:00,560 how many followers somebody has and how big perception wise we 260 00:16:00,960 --> 00:16:05,040 we see these artists like on the digital spaces because whether 261 00:16:05,040 --> 00:16:08,880 we like it or not, social media is a big facet. 262 00:16:08,880 --> 00:16:12,760 Perception is everything lives today in 2025, it is. 263 00:16:13,000 --> 00:16:17,200 And the reason why perception is very important is not only 264 00:16:17,320 --> 00:16:19,960 because of cloud. A lot of people want many 265 00:16:19,960 --> 00:16:23,480 followers because of cloud, but it's not really only because of 266 00:16:23,480 --> 00:16:25,680 cloud. It's also because that 267 00:16:25,680 --> 00:16:33,000 perception acts or can contribute to leverage, right? 268 00:16:33,160 --> 00:16:35,560 Yeah. And if you're ever able to to to 269 00:16:35,560 --> 00:16:41,680 leverage your numbers, your engaged numbers, that can open 270 00:16:41,680 --> 00:16:45,400 up so many doors for you as an artist, right. 271 00:16:45,400 --> 00:16:49,800 If if you have high engagement on your social media, you know, 272 00:16:49,800 --> 00:16:54,400 brands are going to be willing to like give you a bag to do 273 00:16:54,400 --> 00:16:57,360 things, you're going to get more deals, you're going to be able 274 00:16:57,360 --> 00:17:00,440 to even leverage more if you're assigned on a label and stuff 275 00:17:00,440 --> 00:17:06,240 like that, you know what I mean? So it's not completely useless 276 00:17:06,599 --> 00:17:09,880 to just like follow people and, and, and have like, you know, 277 00:17:09,880 --> 00:17:12,839 because we also have need to have that perception that our 278 00:17:12,839 --> 00:17:16,200 industry is doing big because you see like, you know, people 279 00:17:16,200 --> 00:17:20,640 so BN on Breakfast Club and like, or people who've never 280 00:17:20,640 --> 00:17:23,640 heard of BN because they just, you know, they follow breakfast 281 00:17:23,640 --> 00:17:25,520 club. And if they go on his account 282 00:17:25,520 --> 00:17:27,880 and they see, oh, OK, he only has a few thousand, they'll be 283 00:17:27,880 --> 00:17:31,120 like, OK, it's a relative. And, and that's just how people 284 00:17:31,120 --> 00:17:33,600 are in real life. You know, they see things as 285 00:17:33,600 --> 00:17:37,440 surface level and don't really look too deep into it because as 286 00:17:37,440 --> 00:17:42,400 we know, BN is a huge artist. We know, we know how impactful 287 00:17:42,400 --> 00:17:45,240 he has been. But other people will look at 288 00:17:45,240 --> 00:17:47,240 that and be like, no, exactly. Yeah. 289 00:17:47,360 --> 00:17:48,640 From. The outside, they're looking at 290 00:17:48,640 --> 00:17:49,360 it. You know what I mean? 291 00:17:49,360 --> 00:17:51,200 And they go up to his numbers as he's Spotify. 292 00:17:51,200 --> 00:17:56,160 And they're like, it's this is pretty low for Yeah, for someone 293 00:17:56,160 --> 00:17:58,200 who. And it's but yeah, no, no. 294 00:17:58,200 --> 00:18:00,360 And I agree with you. And it's bad because like even 295 00:18:00,360 --> 00:18:04,000 when you go to Spotify, that's another one, you know, like the 296 00:18:04,000 --> 00:18:08,200 fact that we're only just now getting artists who are breaking 297 00:18:08,200 --> 00:18:11,720 the 1,000,000 stream threshold and stuff like that. 298 00:18:12,160 --> 00:18:14,960 It's really not a good look on our industry. 299 00:18:14,960 --> 00:18:18,240 It makes us feel small. And the problem with us feeling 300 00:18:18,240 --> 00:18:22,880 like a small industry is people won't invest enough into it. 301 00:18:23,120 --> 00:18:25,280 You know what I mean? They'll, they'll low ball us 302 00:18:25,280 --> 00:18:28,040 when it comes to like investment. 303 00:18:28,040 --> 00:18:32,640 And the less money that there is circulating, the worst for it is 304 00:18:32,640 --> 00:18:37,040 for everyone, even you smaller artists, because then you'll 305 00:18:37,040 --> 00:18:40,840 just get less of the pie. That being said, I do agree with 306 00:18:40,840 --> 00:18:45,840 you because there are artists like who have large followings 307 00:18:45,920 --> 00:18:48,000 that are not engaged, you know what I mean? 308 00:18:48,000 --> 00:18:52,040 And and that's essentially very pointless because if you have 309 00:18:52,360 --> 00:18:57,000 3,000,000 followers and only 5000 of those are. 310 00:18:57,000 --> 00:18:58,960 Engaged. It looks so funny. 311 00:19:01,320 --> 00:19:03,920 Exactly. Man, it looks funny when you're 312 00:19:03,920 --> 00:19:08,760 trying to do things on that's it is an epidemic when you're 313 00:19:08,760 --> 00:19:12,520 trying to do things on that scale, but you don't have the 314 00:19:12,520 --> 00:19:17,920 real life numbers to back. So like like Sam said, it is a 315 00:19:17,920 --> 00:19:20,840 mixture of both. You can't discount one or the 316 00:19:20,840 --> 00:19:22,880 other. I think they both work hand in 317 00:19:22,880 --> 00:19:24,760 hand. Especially because especially 318 00:19:24,760 --> 00:19:27,440 because the the industry is moving towards social media now 319 00:19:28,200 --> 00:19:30,240 and essentially social media is what we're talking about in 320 00:19:30,240 --> 00:19:31,680 terms of work following and everything. 321 00:19:31,680 --> 00:19:35,920 So in addition to sex, Spotify and those and YouTube numbers 322 00:19:35,920 --> 00:19:37,760 and all of your views and listens. 323 00:19:40,480 --> 00:19:42,120 Yeah. And of course, it's a weird 324 00:19:42,120 --> 00:19:44,960 thing just because those numbers really don't mean, we don't 325 00:19:44,960 --> 00:19:47,200 really know what those numbers mean as much. 326 00:19:47,600 --> 00:19:52,200 And so you're the fan is, is relegated to a a space of just 327 00:19:52,880 --> 00:19:56,000 blind support without knowing how much an artist is going to 328 00:19:56,000 --> 00:19:57,240 get. And it even makes it worse 329 00:19:57,240 --> 00:19:59,520 because now there's different regions of the world. 330 00:19:59,520 --> 00:20:03,720 And then like if you're selling ACD in the States and you're 331 00:20:03,720 --> 00:20:07,920 selling ACD for what, $10? You translate that across the 332 00:20:07,920 --> 00:20:11,840 board with whatever currency it is, and it might still remain 333 00:20:11,840 --> 00:20:15,040 the same. But now you tell me that a 334 00:20:15,040 --> 00:20:19,760 stream in, I mean, 1,000,000 streams in the US is worth how 335 00:20:19,760 --> 00:20:22,360 many thousands of dollars? And then here it's and then in 336 00:20:22,360 --> 00:20:28,160 Kenya it's worth $300. It's like, OK, like how how, how 337 00:20:28,240 --> 00:20:31,960 as, as as a fan, am I supposed to actually support the artist? 338 00:20:32,160 --> 00:20:35,440 But then yeah, it just it just comes down to do as much as you 339 00:20:35,440 --> 00:20:40,800 can and it's up to the artist as well to do their math and figure 340 00:20:40,800 --> 00:20:46,320 out where they're getting the most value for their time and 341 00:20:46,320 --> 00:20:49,200 their skills and then communicate that to their fans. 342 00:20:49,680 --> 00:20:52,800 Not in a beggy way, because some artists are really corny with 343 00:20:52,800 --> 00:20:54,720 that. Where so cringe. 344 00:20:55,240 --> 00:20:58,680 Well, it's like, yo guys, they support one of the things I 345 00:20:58,680 --> 00:21:01,200 really don't like, even though it's become it's it's very 346 00:21:01,200 --> 00:21:06,600 normal in the streaming world and YouTube is thank you for the 347 00:21:07,560 --> 00:21:11,160 for the Super chat. It's like, oh guys, for you to 348 00:21:11,160 --> 00:21:13,160 comment, you have to super chat and for you to just you have to 349 00:21:13,160 --> 00:21:14,520 super chat and all of that business. 350 00:21:14,760 --> 00:21:17,360 It just feels it's a side point. It just feels weird to me. 351 00:21:17,600 --> 00:21:21,160 Doing that, doing that is kind of cringe, Yeah, but but for a 352 00:21:21,160 --> 00:21:24,360 lot of the big creators, like people super chat off of their 353 00:21:24,360 --> 00:21:27,480 own volition, like they just do it to do it. 354 00:21:27,680 --> 00:21:32,440 But but then I also have, I have very many thoughts about that. 355 00:21:32,440 --> 00:21:36,440 I think it's it's mostly an ego thing because a lot of people 356 00:21:36,440 --> 00:21:41,080 super chat on, on, on creators who don't need that money like 357 00:21:41,080 --> 00:21:41,920 that. You know what I mean? 358 00:21:41,920 --> 00:21:44,640 Like go like, if you're, if you're actually being generous, 359 00:21:44,640 --> 00:21:48,000 you'll go and super chat on a small creator, you know, or give 360 00:21:48,000 --> 00:21:50,360 like a really big donation to a small creator. 361 00:21:50,360 --> 00:21:54,000 But most. People $4.00 you go on, right? 362 00:21:54,880 --> 00:21:58,880 But even, but even like sending Kai like $100, you're doing that 363 00:21:58,880 --> 00:22:02,480 so that Kai can say your name and then you can like that 364 00:22:02,480 --> 00:22:04,920 dopamine rush. It's more about like the ego. 365 00:22:05,120 --> 00:22:08,800 There's a whole I can talk about this for for five hours. 366 00:22:08,800 --> 00:22:12,040 But anyway. But that's cool the. 367 00:22:12,080 --> 00:22:16,920 Thing so, so one thing that I, I do want to say that I don't like 368 00:22:16,920 --> 00:22:19,800 though, is the recent trend. It's not really recent, but the 369 00:22:19,800 --> 00:22:22,960 trend of like artists. Now when we talk about social 370 00:22:22,960 --> 00:22:27,080 media of like artists almost having to become social media 371 00:22:27,080 --> 00:22:29,600 influencers, I think you kind of touched on that. 372 00:22:29,600 --> 00:22:33,920 Like, yeah, it's it's kind of it kind of sucks, man. 373 00:22:35,040 --> 00:22:38,480 Because yeah, you see a lot of artists like complaining that, 374 00:22:38,480 --> 00:22:42,680 OK, I've released a song, but now, you know, my manager is 375 00:22:42,680 --> 00:22:45,600 telling me to make tick. Tocks and all of that. 376 00:22:45,640 --> 00:22:47,320 Yeah. And that that's that's become 377 00:22:47,640 --> 00:22:50,320 that's become the default comment for artists who don't 378 00:22:50,320 --> 00:22:52,360 want to do it. Like it's it's if you scroll 379 00:22:52,360 --> 00:22:54,520 tick tock. So my, my, the label says I need 380 00:22:54,520 --> 00:22:55,680 to make tick tock. So here you go. 381 00:22:56,000 --> 00:22:58,400 Yeah, he. Don't want to do it. 382 00:22:58,560 --> 00:23:01,160 It's not fun and it's not if it's not fun for the artist, 383 00:23:01,280 --> 00:23:03,960 it's not fun for the consumer. Because if I, if I like an 384 00:23:03,960 --> 00:23:06,480 artist and I look at him and he's just, it just looks like 385 00:23:06,480 --> 00:23:08,080 he's been forced to do something, I'm going to be like, 386 00:23:08,200 --> 00:23:10,320 like, I'm not even going to it will, it will take a lot for me 387 00:23:10,320 --> 00:23:13,920 to engage with that current with that art or whatever that piece 388 00:23:13,920 --> 00:23:16,800 of content or creativity, whatever it is. 389 00:23:16,800 --> 00:23:19,280 So it sucks, man. It's, it's the age way. 390 00:23:20,680 --> 00:23:24,920 But yeah, listen, go support your artists, artists for sure. 391 00:23:24,920 --> 00:23:30,440 Figure out where your money is coming from and and use direct 392 00:23:30,440 --> 00:23:33,480 your funds towards that. Don't make it cringy, don't make 393 00:23:33,480 --> 00:23:34,960 it weird. Just direct your fans towards 394 00:23:34,960 --> 00:23:37,200 that. But yeah. 395 00:23:37,600 --> 00:23:39,320 Speaker I think we had talked about this earlier, but then 396 00:23:39,320 --> 00:23:44,520 Speaking of BN and everything, like I had a chance to watch 397 00:23:44,520 --> 00:23:50,200 that interview, the interview he is on with he is on Breakfast 398 00:23:50,200 --> 00:23:52,680 Club with Charlemagne. Then they are knowing thing 399 00:23:52,680 --> 00:23:54,880 about sorry to interrupt, but they are knowing thing about 400 00:23:54,880 --> 00:23:57,720 podcasting is like things happen in real time. 401 00:23:57,720 --> 00:24:00,840 Like when we were recording the last podcast is when the the 402 00:24:00,840 --> 00:24:04,080 thing came out. So now this sounds like old 403 00:24:04,080 --> 00:24:06,240 news, but like bro, like we couldn't talk about it because 404 00:24:06,400 --> 00:24:08,440 we were recording then sorry. It just annoys me. 405 00:24:08,440 --> 00:24:10,880 Yeah, it just annoys you understand, That's the thing. 406 00:24:11,000 --> 00:24:13,800 Breaking breaking news, Breaking news one week later. 407 00:24:14,240 --> 00:24:16,120 But we had talked about it. So yeah, I watched the 408 00:24:16,120 --> 00:24:18,480 interview. I'd actually like to get your 409 00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:21,840 thoughts on this. But then I, I personally felt 410 00:24:21,840 --> 00:24:24,360 like so. So here's the thing. 411 00:24:25,120 --> 00:24:30,600 Coming from an environment that really strives to be something 412 00:24:30,600 --> 00:24:34,880 more like a lot of creatives and, and artists are, are trying 413 00:24:34,880 --> 00:24:38,520 to be part of, I mean, trying to identify with the Western, 414 00:24:39,720 --> 00:24:44,280 Western with Western creativity. Like they, they, that's, they're 415 00:24:44,280 --> 00:24:45,920 taking on that identity for themselves. 416 00:24:46,360 --> 00:24:49,280 I cringe when I see a lot of these artists on big platforms 417 00:24:49,440 --> 00:24:53,320 because a lot of them, a lot of our artists go up there. 418 00:24:53,320 --> 00:24:55,360 Let me not say a lot of I don't want to put that on people. 419 00:24:55,360 --> 00:24:57,680 But then many of our artists go up there and they try to be 420 00:24:57,680 --> 00:25:01,920 something that they're not. Like it's, it's an accent, it's 421 00:25:02,120 --> 00:25:04,280 laughing at jokes, you know, they didn't get. 422 00:25:05,240 --> 00:25:08,520 It's all this strange stuff. But then I just want to applaud 423 00:25:08,520 --> 00:25:11,400 Bien because Bien went up there and he just seemed like he was 424 00:25:11,400 --> 00:25:13,760 himself. He was cool, he was calm, he was 425 00:25:13,760 --> 00:25:16,920 collected, he was eloquent. He did everything the right way. 426 00:25:18,720 --> 00:25:19,760 I found out new things about him. 427 00:25:19,760 --> 00:25:21,960 I didn't even know he was a he was a communications major. 428 00:25:22,400 --> 00:25:25,400 Bro was just doing university to check it off, which is nearly 429 00:25:25,400 --> 00:25:29,640 all of us at this point. But yeah, that he, he was very 430 00:25:29,640 --> 00:25:32,200 composed man. And I and I like that he took 431 00:25:32,200 --> 00:25:34,480 that image up there. Like it doesn't have to be. 432 00:25:34,840 --> 00:25:36,880 People sometimes try to be too cool. 433 00:25:37,880 --> 00:25:41,360 Go up there with 500 chains, never won a chain a day in the 434 00:25:41,360 --> 00:25:43,640 life. Probably rented them and 435 00:25:43,640 --> 00:25:45,320 everything. Bien is out here saying that he 436 00:25:45,320 --> 00:25:48,920 could have carried chickens to the to the show where he could 437 00:25:48,920 --> 00:25:49,840 answer. I don't know. 438 00:25:49,840 --> 00:25:54,840 I just, I appreciate that aspect of it just him being him and 439 00:25:54,840 --> 00:25:58,640 answering questions and not trying to be too, too cool or 440 00:25:58,640 --> 00:26:07,240 trying to give Charlemagne and, and his team an image of Kenyan 441 00:26:07,280 --> 00:26:10,920 and Kenyan art that doesn't exist, which is kind of what a 442 00:26:10,920 --> 00:26:13,400 lot of people do. So shout out to him and that 443 00:26:13,680 --> 00:26:15,040 that was pretty, pretty cool, no? 444 00:26:15,760 --> 00:26:16,960 No, no, you're right. You're right. 445 00:26:16,960 --> 00:26:20,960 He he he really did. He did a good job representing 446 00:26:20,960 --> 00:26:24,080 us. And yeah, he didn't try to be 447 00:26:24,080 --> 00:26:27,680 more than he is, you know? I mean, that's genuinely how BN 448 00:26:27,680 --> 00:26:30,440 is like as a person, which which is cool. 449 00:26:31,640 --> 00:26:34,760 I remember last podcast I was like, he should have gone with 450 00:26:34,760 --> 00:26:36,720 the chicken. But I mean he explained why he 451 00:26:36,720 --> 00:26:38,440 couldn't. That would have been 452 00:26:38,520 --> 00:26:39,880 interesting. You guys in New York, you guys 453 00:26:39,880 --> 00:26:41,000 don't have chickens running around? 454 00:26:41,000 --> 00:26:43,040 That's crazy. Like I can't imagine a world 455 00:26:43,040 --> 00:26:44,480 where there are no chickens running around. 456 00:26:44,880 --> 00:26:46,080 We need chickens running around. I. 457 00:26:46,160 --> 00:26:47,720 Guess so. I've never, I haven't really 458 00:26:47,720 --> 00:26:50,920 seen chickens running around, so I guess that's a thing. 459 00:26:51,200 --> 00:26:57,480 I didn't know it was a thing, so I think so. 460 00:26:57,480 --> 00:27:01,920 My mom, I sent her the the interview to watch and the first 461 00:27:01,920 --> 00:27:04,560 thing she was like, I don't like this guy wearing the red shirt 462 00:27:04,680 --> 00:27:09,280 in reference to Shalamin because she was she everyone trying to 463 00:27:09,280 --> 00:27:13,320 tip him up. Yeah, I that's exactly what I 464 00:27:13,320 --> 00:27:16,360 was telling my mom was like, yo, everyone usually has. 465 00:27:16,360 --> 00:27:18,400 That's his strong opinion, that's his personality. 466 00:27:18,600 --> 00:27:21,720 That's why he's such a big but. You see, that's the thing. 467 00:27:21,720 --> 00:27:24,280 That's the thing that that I found interesting because, you 468 00:27:24,280 --> 00:27:27,920 know, as we know, shut up, bro. We've know Charlamagne has been 469 00:27:27,920 --> 00:27:32,040 somebody I've known in my life for like 13 years because of 470 00:27:32,040 --> 00:27:36,280 just watching his things. But like for my mom who's never 471 00:27:36,280 --> 00:27:41,800 like had any of his content, like she felt like he was like 472 00:27:41,840 --> 00:27:46,560 really trying to trip bien up. Like the mention about asking 473 00:27:46,560 --> 00:27:48,600 him about his sexuality and stuff like that. 474 00:27:48,600 --> 00:27:50,400 Like she was like, no, I don't like this guy. 475 00:27:50,640 --> 00:27:52,920 But he handled it. He handled it really well too. 476 00:27:52,920 --> 00:27:55,320 He just. Yeah, Bien handled that was 477 00:27:55,360 --> 00:27:58,760 cool. No, and and and bro, I feel like 478 00:27:58,760 --> 00:28:05,120 he he showed them that like he, he had like an intelligence with 479 00:28:05,120 --> 00:28:06,280 the way he. Oh yeah. 480 00:28:06,280 --> 00:28:08,680 Dealt. With the answer, the questions 481 00:28:08,720 --> 00:28:12,720 and the way he answered them, like we don't look like scrubs. 482 00:28:12,720 --> 00:28:16,480 We don't look like bro, you know, we're like, it's like, yo, 483 00:28:16,520 --> 00:28:18,400 can you? Imagine if it was low. 484 00:28:18,400 --> 00:28:21,560 Let me not do that. There's a couple of actors who, 485 00:28:21,560 --> 00:28:25,520 if they had gone up for us, oh boy, Kenya would be the would 486 00:28:25,520 --> 00:28:27,280 have gone viral for the wrong reasons. 487 00:28:28,080 --> 00:28:31,320 No beef, and I didn't. It's not me who said these 488 00:28:31,320 --> 00:28:34,000 words, but somebody was in the comments saying how? 489 00:28:34,000 --> 00:28:37,920 Like imagine if it was, if it was the Diamond Platinum there. 490 00:28:38,680 --> 00:28:41,520 I didn't say that. That's who was in my brain. 491 00:28:43,280 --> 00:28:46,680 Alfam did not say that this was a comment that I that was. 492 00:28:46,680 --> 00:28:49,480 In my brain, you know, saying that, no, there's some people 493 00:28:49,480 --> 00:28:51,280 who there's some people who are not trade. 494 00:28:51,400 --> 00:28:53,720 Bien is obviously trained media and I guess his degree helped 495 00:28:53,720 --> 00:28:58,040 with the whole communications thing, but then he's he he went 496 00:28:58,120 --> 00:29:00,320 up there. But there's one thing I really 497 00:29:00,320 --> 00:29:05,520 like that he said and that sort of answers the question that a 498 00:29:05,520 --> 00:29:07,680 lot of people ask where because Charlemagne, I think was 499 00:29:07,680 --> 00:29:10,480 Charlemagne who asked him, why was this Charlemagne envy? 500 00:29:10,480 --> 00:29:12,120 Who asked him like, why, why is why? 501 00:29:12,120 --> 00:29:17,600 Why are we always striving to to make it in the States? 502 00:29:17,600 --> 00:29:19,760 And there's a question that we have because a lot of a lot of 503 00:29:19,760 --> 00:29:24,400 time, we feel like our identity is almost tied to the American 504 00:29:24,400 --> 00:29:27,160 Music economy. And he said that when you win in 505 00:29:27,160 --> 00:29:32,200 the US, you win in the world, which I, you almost know, like 506 00:29:32,200 --> 00:29:34,480 it's at the back of your mind. But then just him putting words 507 00:29:34,480 --> 00:29:37,800 to that makes sense. And from an artist perspective, 508 00:29:37,800 --> 00:29:41,440 like when you, when you win in the US, it's it's a global win 509 00:29:41,440 --> 00:29:43,280 because everyone is looking at them. 510 00:29:43,800 --> 00:29:46,480 So that makes sense. But it's it's, and it's an 511 00:29:46,480 --> 00:29:51,800 unfortunate truth to have to contend with because it's even 512 00:29:51,800 --> 00:29:55,480 when you look at the value of a stream, you know, like if you're 513 00:29:55,480 --> 00:30:00,320 getting streams primarily from the US, you're making more 514 00:30:00,320 --> 00:30:04,840 money, you know what I mean? So it's unfortunate that the 515 00:30:04,840 --> 00:30:13,760 world has kind of like made it so that winning in the US, it is 516 00:30:13,760 --> 00:30:17,800 almost like more valuable even monetarily and stuff like that. 517 00:30:18,280 --> 00:30:21,400 It shouldn't be the case, but it kind of is what it is. 518 00:30:21,880 --> 00:30:27,760 I do like how they were mentioning that, you know, when 519 00:30:27,760 --> 00:30:31,840 it comes to like listening to music, they like, they want to 520 00:30:31,840 --> 00:30:34,000 hear something that they've never had before. 521 00:30:34,000 --> 00:30:38,760 Like and, and it got me thinking about how sometimes we try and 522 00:30:38,760 --> 00:30:41,960 make music that sounds like the West, but that's uninteresting 523 00:30:41,960 --> 00:30:45,400 to them because they make that music already. 524 00:30:45,640 --> 00:30:47,040 They're used to that and they want something. 525 00:30:47,040 --> 00:30:49,560 Different at a high level, yeah, yeah. 526 00:30:49,560 --> 00:30:52,400 And they do. And so that kind of brings me to 527 00:30:53,520 --> 00:30:57,880 to what we prioritize as Kenyan artists. 528 00:30:57,880 --> 00:31:02,120 I think we have a lot of Kenyan artists who are authentic and I 529 00:31:02,120 --> 00:31:07,200 think Kenyan artists we we mix and match like our genres, which 530 00:31:07,200 --> 00:31:12,240 is nice. I think we do need more boldness 531 00:31:12,360 --> 00:31:21,320 in terms of being comfortable being Kenyan on music, in 532 00:31:21,320 --> 00:31:26,200 projects, ETCETC. Just the way they do it in the 533 00:31:26,200 --> 00:31:33,880 Nigerian scene where it's like, it's not not I'm not frowned 534 00:31:33,880 --> 00:31:38,680 upon, but like it's the norm. It's the norm to be hyper proud 535 00:31:38,680 --> 00:31:42,520 of, like, you know what I mean? Like the Nigerian culture and 536 00:31:42,520 --> 00:31:44,920 stuff like that. So I think I think that's 537 00:31:44,920 --> 00:31:47,800 something that I took away from from that. 538 00:31:47,800 --> 00:31:51,000 And it's like, yeah, I think the artist who's really going to 539 00:31:51,000 --> 00:31:57,200 like breakthrough in East from East Africa, from Kenya in the 540 00:31:57,200 --> 00:32:03,680 Western markets, it might not be like a Western leaning artist, 541 00:32:03,680 --> 00:32:08,360 or maybe it'll be one who uses Western like, I don't know, 542 00:32:08,360 --> 00:32:11,400 soundscapes, but like it's completely authentically Kenyan. 543 00:32:11,560 --> 00:32:15,000 I don't know. But like we, we need to like 544 00:32:15,200 --> 00:32:22,080 have more supremely Kenyan sounding artists. 545 00:32:23,440 --> 00:32:24,320 I don't know. Yeah, yeah. 546 00:32:24,920 --> 00:32:26,640 I don't know if you get what I'm trying to say. 547 00:32:26,640 --> 00:32:30,640 I do. I like your point of the being 548 00:32:30,640 --> 00:32:32,960 comfortable. I think it's, it's being 549 00:32:32,960 --> 00:32:36,720 comfortable on both sides because you can be comfortable 550 00:32:36,720 --> 00:32:38,760 in your skin where you're not afraid to show your culture in 551 00:32:38,760 --> 00:32:41,200 your songs and your music. And then there's the other side, 552 00:32:41,200 --> 00:32:44,000 which is not really talked about where some people are not, they 553 00:32:44,000 --> 00:32:51,760 are not proud of their culture so much that they lean too much 554 00:32:51,760 --> 00:32:53,320 into it when it doesn't make sense. 555 00:32:54,120 --> 00:32:57,800 And then that's where you have music musicians, when you know 556 00:32:57,920 --> 00:32:59,080 that they could be doing so much more. 557 00:32:59,080 --> 00:33:01,320 Their music comes out sounding like it should be on ABBC 558 00:33:01,440 --> 00:33:05,840 documentary and it's just Masai beads and Everything Everywhere. 559 00:33:07,640 --> 00:33:10,840 You need to like being comfortable in your being 560 00:33:10,840 --> 00:33:15,840 comfortable with your art. It's it's resisting the need to 561 00:33:15,840 --> 00:33:19,480 conform, but also resisting the need to do too much. 562 00:33:19,920 --> 00:33:22,760 Then the question can arise, I can you do too much in your 563 00:33:22,760 --> 00:33:23,600 music? I think you can. 564 00:33:23,600 --> 00:33:25,680 I think some people just try too much. 565 00:33:26,000 --> 00:33:28,080 Oh yeah, yeah. Yeah, to identify with their 566 00:33:28,080 --> 00:33:30,120 culture. So much so that it's it's not 567 00:33:30,360 --> 00:33:33,040 relatable anymore and it just seems like you're trying hard. 568 00:33:33,480 --> 00:33:37,120 So yeah. That's that's that's true, 569 00:33:37,240 --> 00:33:42,240 that's true, but I actually do want to talk about this topic, 570 00:33:42,240 --> 00:33:46,960 but in a different context. So I said I was going to talk 571 00:33:46,960 --> 00:33:52,680 about streaming and like I said, I watched yet again. 572 00:33:52,680 --> 00:33:55,320 I spent the week watching Santi I. 573 00:33:55,600 --> 00:33:57,600 Just wake up in the morning and throw on Santi. 574 00:33:59,680 --> 00:34:04,520 That's the exaggeration. Like I did that one day I woke 575 00:34:04,520 --> 00:34:06,720 up and I was like, I've got to see this stream. 576 00:34:07,000 --> 00:34:10,639 And it was a stream of Santi putting on like some underground 577 00:34:10,639 --> 00:34:14,560 artists in his, in one of his streams. 578 00:34:15,280 --> 00:34:20,239 Essentially, the idea was he had like he had like 10 of them come 579 00:34:20,239 --> 00:34:25,040 through to his house and then he introduced them to his audience. 580 00:34:25,040 --> 00:34:28,080 They're like, oh, and for those of you who don't know, Santi 581 00:34:28,320 --> 00:34:30,600 goes by cruel Santino. He's a. 582 00:34:30,800 --> 00:34:34,719 Legend in the part of. The Alti, yeah, he's a big part 583 00:34:34,719 --> 00:34:39,040 of the Alti wave. Yeah, the Alti wave in Nigeria, 584 00:34:39,520 --> 00:34:43,480 the biggest song that people kind of recognize him by, is 585 00:34:43,480 --> 00:34:46,800 called Rapid Fire, if you're interested in looking for that. 586 00:34:46,800 --> 00:34:53,040 But anyway, so he was just out there like introducing them to 587 00:34:53,040 --> 00:34:56,000 his audience. And then at the end, all of them 588 00:34:57,080 --> 00:35:02,200 made music in the house and they were separated into two teams. 589 00:35:02,720 --> 00:35:05,600 The producers were there. And then they made like music. 590 00:35:05,840 --> 00:35:07,600 And that's cool. And I was just looking at all 591 00:35:07,600 --> 00:35:12,320 these kids and I'm like, wow. They're super like young, 592 00:35:12,640 --> 00:35:17,960 talented, but not so dissimilar from the people who have 593 00:35:18,120 --> 00:35:23,160 interacted with back home because even then they are very 594 00:35:23,280 --> 00:35:26,520 also inspired by Western culture and stuff like that. 595 00:35:26,520 --> 00:35:30,280 But they they, they found a way to like really properly fuse it 596 00:35:30,880 --> 00:35:34,280 with the Nigerian culture. Anyway, I say all this to say, I 597 00:35:34,280 --> 00:35:39,520 don't know why there's not like an equivalent support for like 598 00:35:39,520 --> 00:35:45,680 our underground slash alti artists who are doing similar 599 00:35:45,680 --> 00:35:48,480 things because, you know, I would so he would introduce like 600 00:35:48,640 --> 00:35:54,240 an artist lua dot MP4 or Z level 10, for example. 601 00:35:54,240 --> 00:35:55,760 And I'm like, oh, I don't know who these kids are. 602 00:35:55,880 --> 00:35:58,640 But then I go to the the Instagram, I go to the, the, 603 00:35:58,640 --> 00:36:01,400 the, the spotifies and they have numbers. 604 00:36:01,720 --> 00:36:05,560 Like they have, they have like, yeah, yeah, they have like, you 605 00:36:05,560 --> 00:36:09,280 know, 40,000 monthly listeners, for example, or something like 606 00:36:09,280 --> 00:36:13,080 that, which isn't big, but like in the underground scene that's 607 00:36:13,080 --> 00:36:18,040 viable, you know, I mean, so, so I was just looking at all that 608 00:36:18,040 --> 00:36:21,200 stuff and I was like, damn, why is it so dissimilar here? 609 00:36:21,440 --> 00:36:27,360 And then I see Jovi releasing music and Jovi released the song 610 00:36:27,360 --> 00:36:33,360 247 recently and it's not too dissimilar to what these kids 611 00:36:33,360 --> 00:36:36,480 are doing. Yet I feel like Jovi doesn't get 612 00:36:36,520 --> 00:36:38,880 as much support. He gets a lot of support. 613 00:36:38,880 --> 00:36:42,160 Don't get me wrong, Jovi gets a lot of support, but he doesn't 614 00:36:42,160 --> 00:36:46,280 get as much support. Like for breaking the mold, 615 00:36:46,280 --> 00:36:49,080 hopping on like opium type beats and stuff like that. 616 00:36:49,280 --> 00:36:51,280 But he's still rapping in in sheng. 617 00:36:51,280 --> 00:36:53,720 I mean, it's sharp at the end of the day, right? 618 00:36:54,720 --> 00:36:58,680 He but he doesn't get as much support, you know, like Kina, 619 00:36:58,680 --> 00:37:01,440 Swahili, Papi and akumbo like shout out to them. 620 00:37:01,640 --> 00:37:05,680 They've been out here for a minute, but like you know, their 621 00:37:05,680 --> 00:37:11,160 movement hasn't like it hasn't blown up the way like it could 622 00:37:11,160 --> 00:37:12,360 have. For example, you know what? 623 00:37:12,360 --> 00:37:15,000 I mean, it had a period where it was catching, catching a little 624 00:37:15,000 --> 00:37:20,520 bit of fire and then very. Promising, yeah, can Albizi, for 625 00:37:20,520 --> 00:37:24,040 example, and stuff like that. But like, I feel like we can 626 00:37:24,040 --> 00:37:28,400 rally around some of these people a little bit more. 627 00:37:28,720 --> 00:37:33,760 And I want to ask you why you think, like, where's like the 628 00:37:33,760 --> 00:37:39,440 disconnect between like, like Jovi being elevated to being 629 00:37:39,440 --> 00:37:42,320 more mainstream because Jovi has been around for a while. 630 00:37:43,480 --> 00:37:47,280 And then there's another mini conversation to be had about the 631 00:37:47,280 --> 00:37:51,560 state of Sharp and, you know, why it hasn't, like, panned out 632 00:37:51,560 --> 00:37:53,960 the way it should have. But yeah, yeah. 633 00:37:53,960 --> 00:37:56,000 So maybe answer the first one first. 634 00:37:58,120 --> 00:38:02,120 It's also frustrating because someone like Jovi, who is, I 635 00:38:02,120 --> 00:38:04,280 mean, he's been the past couple of songs that we've had him on, 636 00:38:04,280 --> 00:38:06,240 he's like been rapping, rapping, rapping. 637 00:38:07,240 --> 00:38:10,800 And, and there's good raps coming out of that side of 638 00:38:10,880 --> 00:38:16,840 things, especially now that the other rappers like the block, 639 00:38:16,920 --> 00:38:18,960 the blockbuster rappers that we're supposed to be having, 640 00:38:19,320 --> 00:38:22,880 they aren't really doing much. Honestly, it's not much coming 641 00:38:22,880 --> 00:38:28,520 out of that camp. I don't know it, let me say I'm, 642 00:38:28,520 --> 00:38:34,880 I'm not exactly sure where I, I can pinpoint the, the, where the 643 00:38:34,880 --> 00:38:38,560 disconnect is. I do feel like it's a cultural 644 00:38:38,560 --> 00:38:42,720 thing because I don't know if the mainstream accepts, accepts 645 00:38:43,200 --> 00:38:46,560 the music, accepts rap in the way they are presenting it. 646 00:38:47,240 --> 00:38:49,440 It's completely different. It's very new school. 647 00:38:50,560 --> 00:38:52,800 It's that's a bar. That's a bar. 648 00:38:52,800 --> 00:38:55,920 It's very say that again. Say that you don't know if you 649 00:38:55,960 --> 00:38:56,680 don't know. I don't know. 650 00:38:56,720 --> 00:38:58,480 I don't know. I don't know if the masses 651 00:38:59,000 --> 00:39:03,280 accept rap in the way that the newer kids are presenting it. 652 00:39:04,080 --> 00:39:06,240 Yeah, because it's it's a completely different culture. 653 00:39:06,320 --> 00:39:13,040 The rap that we that we all that we all supported and and like 654 00:39:13,040 --> 00:39:16,040 played and everything that was the kleptomaniac because it was 655 00:39:16,560 --> 00:39:18,880 Kalama Shaka than them. It was giddy, giddy Maji Maji. 656 00:39:18,880 --> 00:39:27,040 It was the the theirs felt a lot closer to I'm talking about now 657 00:39:27,040 --> 00:39:30,400 my generation, because I realized that sometimes we have 658 00:39:30,400 --> 00:39:33,240 conversations and then we leave out the fact that like we're 659 00:39:33,240 --> 00:39:34,760 talking from a specific age range. 660 00:39:34,760 --> 00:39:39,720 Like for me, that kind of rap, it just felt like it had more to 661 00:39:39,720 --> 00:39:42,400 it. Something Bien was saying on and 662 00:39:42,400 --> 00:39:45,120 actually mentioned it on on on the interview where he said that 663 00:39:46,320 --> 00:39:49,480 back then when $0.50 was popping, like $0.50 was popping 664 00:39:49,520 --> 00:39:51,920 in the US and people in his village were singing were were 665 00:39:51,920 --> 00:39:53,800 were rapping along. Too many men. 666 00:39:54,240 --> 00:39:57,320 This days. The people at the top of 667 00:39:57,320 --> 00:40:00,040 Kendrick is not going to no one is playing. 668 00:40:00,840 --> 00:40:03,320 No one is playing Kendrick in the in the villages right now. 669 00:40:03,880 --> 00:40:06,720 And. It might be a thing of the time 670 00:40:06,720 --> 00:40:10,240 and how people communicate their struggles through time. 671 00:40:10,440 --> 00:40:13,040 Sometimes it could be just the culture in the way that maybe 672 00:40:13,040 --> 00:40:15,600 the struggles people are communicating resonate a lot 673 00:40:15,600 --> 00:40:19,040 more with the people, resonate a lot more with the listeners than 674 00:40:19,280 --> 00:40:21,240 maybe in a separate time. These days. 675 00:40:21,240 --> 00:40:24,640 It's more internetty. I don't have that. 676 00:40:25,480 --> 00:40:26,680 That's the one where I can put it. 677 00:40:26,680 --> 00:40:29,200 It's just more. There's more of a modern twist 678 00:40:29,200 --> 00:40:35,480 to wrap and it's quick and it's sometimes the concepts are half 679 00:40:35,480 --> 00:40:37,920 baked, but that's how that's what makes it cool. 680 00:40:37,920 --> 00:40:41,400 It's like it's it's just it's more based on aura and swag than 681 00:40:42,440 --> 00:40:45,760 wraps. And so maybe maybe just the way 682 00:40:45,760 --> 00:40:49,920 they're they're presenting it, it it's not connecting. 683 00:40:52,200 --> 00:40:53,560 Yeah, but I see. But I see. 684 00:40:53,760 --> 00:40:56,960 No, no, yeah. It just is just so you can go. 685 00:40:56,960 --> 00:41:02,280 It's it at some point we have to move away from what was old and 686 00:41:02,280 --> 00:41:03,680 then and then figure out what's new. 687 00:41:03,680 --> 00:41:07,280 So it's now up to up to the field to figure out how to make 688 00:41:07,440 --> 00:41:12,760 the new rappers, the drillers, the boom bop guys, the 689 00:41:12,760 --> 00:41:15,760 underground guys, the shrappers, all of how to make the new 690 00:41:15,760 --> 00:41:19,600 rappers resonate with more of the masses than just their 691 00:41:19,600 --> 00:41:23,480 little cliques, which is I think a big problem that we're having. 692 00:41:23,520 --> 00:41:24,600 That's why it's not crossing over. 693 00:41:25,720 --> 00:41:27,240 Well said. Well said. 694 00:41:27,280 --> 00:41:30,880 I I agree with you. I agree with you for the most 695 00:41:30,880 --> 00:41:36,280 part because, yeah, I mean, because Ken A Jovi and we've 696 00:41:36,280 --> 00:41:38,840 just had a conversation about being authentically Kenyan. 697 00:41:40,120 --> 00:41:45,400 But I think the reason why I'm really excited by things like, 698 00:41:45,680 --> 00:41:50,080 you know, Sharp is because it's mixing cultures and then 699 00:41:50,080 --> 00:41:54,840 offering something new because of that, like combination of 700 00:41:54,840 --> 00:41:58,200 cultures, you know what I mean? As opposed to just like trying 701 00:41:58,200 --> 00:42:02,800 to rap in English over a bomba beat as a Kenyan, you know what 702 00:42:02,800 --> 00:42:05,600 I mean? Then it just becomes like you're 703 00:42:05,600 --> 00:42:08,000 really just mimicking. But like if you're doing Shrap 704 00:42:08,320 --> 00:42:12,880 over a heat type beat, like you're offering something kind 705 00:42:12,880 --> 00:42:17,560 of like unique or even farther, if you put Afro drums on that 706 00:42:17,560 --> 00:42:22,480 heat type beat and then wrap in in, in sheng and stuff, that 707 00:42:22,480 --> 00:42:25,080 just like makes something completely unique, which is what 708 00:42:25,080 --> 00:42:27,720 the kids are doing like in Nigeria anyway. 709 00:42:27,720 --> 00:42:32,680 I don't know, Maybe it's just like maybe our, our, our 710 00:42:32,680 --> 00:42:37,120 industry is a little bit slow to react to newer like things. 711 00:42:37,120 --> 00:42:40,360 Maybe, I don't know. Maybe it's the beats as well, 712 00:42:40,360 --> 00:42:43,000 like if you throw on, if you throw on vocal beat and listen 713 00:42:43,000 --> 00:42:44,720 to it without vocals, like that's a joint. 714 00:42:44,960 --> 00:42:46,800 I think it's difficult for people to throw on like a heat 715 00:42:46,800 --> 00:42:48,960 type beat these days and like be vibing to it. 716 00:42:49,240 --> 00:42:52,240 It's just OK. But for me that's that's a like 717 00:42:52,240 --> 00:42:55,560 even the, the the Jovi stuff, that shit is hard, man. 718 00:42:55,560 --> 00:42:58,880 But I don't know, Maybe it's because I don't know. 719 00:42:59,520 --> 00:43:03,560 It's an interesting conversation to have, but I think Jovi will 720 00:43:03,560 --> 00:43:08,760 have will definitely receive his flowers very soon if he keeps 721 00:43:08,800 --> 00:43:11,960 like he's on a run, if he keeps going. 722 00:43:11,960 --> 00:43:15,240 And I think he's carrying the shrub scene right now, man, not 723 00:43:15,240 --> 00:43:15,960 gonna lie. And. 724 00:43:16,040 --> 00:43:19,760 Just on a side point, on a side point question, do you think he 725 00:43:19,760 --> 00:43:21,680 should just keep doing it or do you think he should? 726 00:43:22,280 --> 00:43:25,520 You know, like when an artist it starts popping off and they're 727 00:43:25,560 --> 00:43:30,880 they're making good art, good songs, and they now have to kick 728 00:43:30,880 --> 00:43:33,600 into a gear of OK, I am an artist and I need to move like 729 00:43:33,600 --> 00:43:35,920 an artist. Almost like what like like what 730 00:43:35,920 --> 00:43:37,880 BN is doing. Do you think Jovi needs to do 731 00:43:37,880 --> 00:43:41,720 that or do you think he stays in his his lane and it just comes 732 00:43:41,720 --> 00:43:45,800 to him naturally? No, he needs to keep on doing 733 00:43:45,800 --> 00:43:47,160 this. He needs to keep on doing this 734 00:43:47,160 --> 00:43:49,880 strategy because his strategy now, like ever since he dropped 735 00:43:49,880 --> 00:43:54,840 Boy was drop an extremely hard snippet and then drop the song 736 00:43:55,080 --> 00:43:58,200 like after like a few weeks, he needs to keep on. 737 00:43:58,600 --> 00:44:00,760 He needs to rinse that like pathway. 738 00:44:00,760 --> 00:44:04,440 He needs to do it like another two times and then put together 739 00:44:04,440 --> 00:44:07,200 like a project. I think he needs to really put 740 00:44:07,200 --> 00:44:10,800 his foot on the gas and then also make sure that the visuals 741 00:44:10,800 --> 00:44:14,880 are still very, very compelling. What about the business? 742 00:44:14,960 --> 00:44:17,920 Yeah, he's going to have. Side of it like what does he do? 743 00:44:20,040 --> 00:44:22,160 What do you mean what? Do you mean what does he do to 744 00:44:22,200 --> 00:44:26,640 escape? Escape just remaining creating 745 00:44:26,640 --> 00:44:31,400 really dope tracks that just stay at a certain level and 746 00:44:31,400 --> 00:44:34,240 don't break bound. That's a difficult question. 747 00:44:35,240 --> 00:44:39,080 Like I said, I think he needs to, he needs to keep at it and 748 00:44:39,080 --> 00:44:41,320 hope one of these things really like pops off. 749 00:44:41,560 --> 00:44:48,960 Ultimately, that's all he can do because then with that like buzz 750 00:44:48,960 --> 00:44:53,000 around his name, then maybe he can start leveraging that for 751 00:44:53,000 --> 00:44:58,040 more things and then having more money to invest into doing like 752 00:44:58,040 --> 00:45:00,360 shows. Maybe he could he could with 753 00:45:00,360 --> 00:45:04,280 this buzz and with this like momentum through his own show, 754 00:45:04,520 --> 00:45:07,560 you know, maybe put on some other small artists, like as an 755 00:45:07,560 --> 00:45:10,360 under as the under acts or whatever, you know what I mean? 756 00:45:10,360 --> 00:45:14,560 Like he but but I think ultimately he just needs to keep 757 00:45:14,560 --> 00:45:17,800 on like turning the screw and releasing this music in the same 758 00:45:17,800 --> 00:45:21,080 way with amazing visuals. So just investing more like in 759 00:45:21,120 --> 00:45:25,200 the he just needs to invest. Keep investing the way he has 760 00:45:25,200 --> 00:45:30,000 been on the videos to make them as compelling as possible. 761 00:45:30,320 --> 00:45:34,960 And then see if you can like now get maximize on the YouTube 762 00:45:34,960 --> 00:45:39,120 front. Yeah, just make sure like the 763 00:45:39,120 --> 00:45:42,320 the numbers are looking good on YouTube and shit like that. 764 00:45:43,520 --> 00:45:46,760 See if he can get partnerships on streaming so that they can 765 00:45:46,760 --> 00:45:49,600 help push his numbers and push his work a little bit more. 766 00:45:50,080 --> 00:45:53,000 And then from there, I think we'll start to see something. 767 00:45:53,800 --> 00:45:56,480 But right now I'd say he's carrying the sharp scene. 768 00:45:57,360 --> 00:46:00,280 Boutros I wouldn't say has fallen off, but like Buttress 769 00:46:00,280 --> 00:46:01,840 became a little bit more mainstream. 770 00:46:02,400 --> 00:46:05,040 And I think for Buttress, what happened was he just he landed 771 00:46:05,040 --> 00:46:07,960 on a hit and from there it just. Yeah, man, you. 772 00:46:07,960 --> 00:46:09,560 Know what I mean? It sucks. 773 00:46:09,560 --> 00:46:11,960 It sounds ruined careers bro like it's crazy. 774 00:46:13,040 --> 00:46:14,280 Let me say no. Ruin. 775 00:46:14,280 --> 00:46:17,240 I wouldn't say ruin. Let me say Ruin because that 776 00:46:17,240 --> 00:46:18,200 sounds bad. Hit song. 777 00:46:18,480 --> 00:46:23,360 Hit songs. They have a way of of taking you 778 00:46:23,360 --> 00:46:26,840 away from what everyone knows you to be and just focusing you 779 00:46:26,840 --> 00:46:28,880 on one thing. I guess that's what I mean. 780 00:46:28,880 --> 00:46:31,480 I don't necessarily mean, but then it's like people who are 781 00:46:31,480 --> 00:46:35,320 really rocking with him as a sharper it's. 782 00:46:35,800 --> 00:46:39,160 Because Angela was not sharp, you know what I mean? 783 00:46:39,200 --> 00:46:42,600 And, and so, and I'm sure in his head, in his head he had to 784 00:46:42,600 --> 00:46:47,880 like, despite the, the, he's like, OK, me, I'm, I'm buttress 785 00:46:47,880 --> 00:46:50,280 because of shrap and all that stuff. 786 00:46:50,480 --> 00:46:53,440 But what really put me on was this. 787 00:46:53,560 --> 00:46:56,080 So what do I do? You're in a crossroads. 788 00:46:56,080 --> 00:46:59,120 Like do I keep on doing shrap? Do I keep on doing the stuff 789 00:46:59,120 --> 00:47:02,320 that really put me on? Then it becomes like confusing. 790 00:47:02,600 --> 00:47:04,480 Also his mainstream. So what happens? 791 00:47:04,560 --> 00:47:08,360 Everybody wants collaborations in in some sense, you also kind 792 00:47:08,360 --> 00:47:12,400 of dilute yourself because now you're stretching yourself where 793 00:47:12,400 --> 00:47:14,880 you're doing collabs for so many different people. 794 00:47:14,880 --> 00:47:19,280 And like your presence is like, like Jovi only pops out when 795 00:47:19,280 --> 00:47:22,840 he's releasing music. He has like a few songs here and 796 00:47:22,840 --> 00:47:26,760 there with other people, but for the most part, like he's not so 797 00:47:26,760 --> 00:47:29,520 over saturated. So we're always excited to 798 00:47:29,520 --> 00:47:33,600 listen to Jovi as opposed to Boutros because Boutros is such 799 00:47:33,600 --> 00:47:37,600 a huge name now. So it's not dichotomy. 800 00:47:37,600 --> 00:47:43,440 I don't know, it's kind of weird, but yeah, we'll see. 801 00:47:43,440 --> 00:47:46,440 We'll see how the sharp scene goes because like, as a 802 00:47:46,440 --> 00:47:48,320 movement, it's really slowed down. 803 00:47:48,320 --> 00:47:51,200 But Jovi's carrying, so yeah, I don't know. 804 00:47:52,000 --> 00:47:55,840 Anyway, Oh my God, we have yapped. 805 00:47:56,440 --> 00:47:58,440 Do you want? What else was there to talk 806 00:47:58,440 --> 00:48:00,800 about? Well, I just want to, I just 807 00:48:00,800 --> 00:48:06,000 want to give a shout out to Nairobi R&B. 808 00:48:06,200 --> 00:48:09,160 Yeah, they're bringing such a keyboard to the country, man. 809 00:48:09,160 --> 00:48:12,680 And this is off the back of bringing Jules last month. 810 00:48:13,000 --> 00:48:15,000 So bro. Those those of you. 811 00:48:15,400 --> 00:48:19,120 As well, man yeah, yeah, that was Nairobi R&B as well, man. 812 00:48:19,120 --> 00:48:22,480 So I just want to give a big shout out to fame and and the 813 00:48:22,480 --> 00:48:26,920 team, the whole team over there for like giving people dope 814 00:48:26,920 --> 00:48:29,080 experiences. So a lot of people might not 815 00:48:29,080 --> 00:48:32,600 know Sasha Kibo because she's really bubbling up right now, 816 00:48:32,600 --> 00:48:38,160 but big in the UK, like R&B scenes has a lot of music with 817 00:48:38,160 --> 00:48:41,720 K1 has a song that's doing really well with black, has 818 00:48:41,720 --> 00:48:44,560 another song doing really well with Destin Kondrad, which is 819 00:48:44,560 --> 00:48:48,320 super fire. One of those names was going to 820 00:48:48,320 --> 00:48:52,760 be like really noticeable or notable sorry in the future. 821 00:48:52,760 --> 00:48:57,360 So to get her like, in this period of her career when she's 822 00:48:57,360 --> 00:49:00,560 like skyrocketing, that's insane. 823 00:49:01,600 --> 00:49:04,920 And Sam and I were debating over, OK, now she's going to be 824 00:49:04,920 --> 00:49:07,520 in the country. I know you have to do a club 825 00:49:07,520 --> 00:49:09,200 yourself, hop into the. Studio. 826 00:49:09,560 --> 00:49:11,960 Right I. Mean, we saw Jules, we saw, 827 00:49:12,520 --> 00:49:15,880 yeah, but we saw Jules in the Stew with Benzema and Watenda 828 00:49:15,880 --> 00:49:18,440 wheelie, right? So I'm trying to see such a. 829 00:49:19,000 --> 00:49:20,320 Keyboard. I tried to see such a keyboard. 830 00:49:20,360 --> 00:49:22,600 Zinnia with some shit. Yeah, yeah, yeah. 831 00:49:24,440 --> 00:49:27,920 The question was, OK, does does she tap into that lane where 832 00:49:27,920 --> 00:49:30,600 it's like comfortable for her? You know, it's the R&B. 833 00:49:30,600 --> 00:49:33,400 It's it's that sound that's that's pretty similar, you know, 834 00:49:34,200 --> 00:49:42,240 or does she go completely left and gets a song with, I don't 835 00:49:42,240 --> 00:49:46,640 know, get a song with and and you wire Tajiri or something. 836 00:49:46,640 --> 00:49:51,000 That's not something that's not down that R&B lane. 837 00:49:51,000 --> 00:49:53,000 Something that's a bit unpredictable. 838 00:49:53,960 --> 00:49:57,160 And yeah, the question is how much freedom does she even have 839 00:49:57,160 --> 00:50:01,360 to do that? Like you know the label have 840 00:50:01,360 --> 00:50:05,240 expectations, you know? And the most is true, she just 841 00:50:05,280 --> 00:50:07,960 have expectations for herself and just the lane she wants to 842 00:50:07,960 --> 00:50:08,640 go in. That's true. 843 00:50:08,760 --> 00:50:11,480 I don't know. I feel like the most the, the 844 00:50:11,480 --> 00:50:13,800 name that makes the most sense is Zinnia. 845 00:50:14,760 --> 00:50:17,080 Or if she was working with producers, if like she was 846 00:50:17,080 --> 00:50:21,880 tapping in with like ukulele or something like that, or I don't 847 00:50:21,880 --> 00:50:24,480 know. So, so yeah, either way, man, 848 00:50:24,800 --> 00:50:28,560 bro, we can't let her come to the country and all she does is 849 00:50:28,560 --> 00:50:30,440 perform and nothing else happens, bro. 850 00:50:30,440 --> 00:50:33,400 That's a wasted opportunity in my opinion, man. 851 00:50:33,560 --> 00:50:37,400 Sasha Kibo has to come in the country and then we get 852 00:50:37,400 --> 00:50:40,440 something more than just the performance, like, you know what 853 00:50:40,440 --> 00:50:42,800 I mean? Because that's how that's how 854 00:50:42,880 --> 00:50:48,800 like through collaboration is how just like things grow, you 855 00:50:48,800 --> 00:50:50,840 know what I mean? Yeah, this is this is a side 856 00:50:50,840 --> 00:50:52,960 point, but I'm just thinking about it and I feel like we do 857 00:50:52,960 --> 00:50:56,920 need more studios because every time this artists come, the only 858 00:50:56,920 --> 00:50:58,480 studio we see there is a snowball. 859 00:50:59,080 --> 00:51:04,440 Like we need more studios and more spaces for these artists to 860 00:51:04,880 --> 00:51:06,720 be able to create. And it's just, it's been snow. 861 00:51:06,760 --> 00:51:09,240 And that's not bad because they're obviously, you know, 862 00:51:09,240 --> 00:51:12,200 they've done well enough for them to, to, to deserve to bring 863 00:51:12,200 --> 00:51:14,160 this artist in. But then, yeah, I think I think 864 00:51:14,240 --> 00:51:21,080 it will benefit us to have more big, big, well equipped. 865 00:51:21,600 --> 00:51:24,320 I'm just studios where the vibe is there. 866 00:51:24,320 --> 00:51:27,160 So that so that a lot of these artists can there's just more 867 00:51:27,160 --> 00:51:29,680 options because then more options mean like, I'm thinking 868 00:51:29,680 --> 00:51:33,080 about the situation where 34 big artists come into the country 869 00:51:33,240 --> 00:51:35,800 and they're here for a limited time and the only place they can 870 00:51:35,800 --> 00:51:38,000 go is is like a snowball, you know? 871 00:51:38,000 --> 00:51:41,920 And that might limit the amount of art that we get from them. 872 00:51:43,120 --> 00:51:44,760 But yeah, man, I don't know if she collapsed with. 873 00:51:44,800 --> 00:51:49,040 We'll wait and see. I stand that show honestly 874 00:51:49,040 --> 00:51:53,000 because like you, I thought I did not not like you, but like 875 00:51:53,000 --> 00:51:55,600 many people, I thought I did not know who she was until I went to 876 00:51:55,600 --> 00:51:59,840 Spotify and I saw that I'm already liking a bunch of her 877 00:51:59,840 --> 00:52:03,000 songs so. Of her music, yeah. 878 00:52:03,000 --> 00:52:06,400 Yeah, so. Right, that should be this 879 00:52:06,400 --> 00:52:11,800 month, but yes, speaking and bro, if me I was home, I I would 880 00:52:11,800 --> 00:52:13,520 definitely. I know you're going to be there. 881 00:52:13,520 --> 00:52:15,200 Frontline. Yeah, you're going to be there. 882 00:52:15,200 --> 00:52:17,640 The first one they're saying crooning, Crooning. 883 00:52:17,720 --> 00:52:20,080 I'll. Be singing the same wire like 884 00:52:21,720 --> 00:52:24,080 might I might depending on the context. 885 00:52:24,080 --> 00:52:26,520 We have any music to cry to, whatever will be up there 886 00:52:26,520 --> 00:52:27,680 crying. Oh, no, no, no, no. 887 00:52:27,680 --> 00:52:29,360 She does. She does. 888 00:52:29,360 --> 00:52:30,720 What are you talking about? Some. 889 00:52:30,720 --> 00:52:32,520 What are you talking? You definitely be up there 890 00:52:32,520 --> 00:52:34,560 crying. Listen to her, listen to her. 891 00:52:34,560 --> 00:52:37,920 All the stuff when she did, she did more acoustic things, like 892 00:52:37,920 --> 00:52:41,640 over just piano. Oh my God, bro, yeah, she bro. 893 00:52:41,640 --> 00:52:46,600 She has, she has a bag. But yeah, man, new music, man. 894 00:52:46,600 --> 00:52:50,040 What did you listen to this? New music this week, new music 895 00:52:51,600 --> 00:52:53,840 Nameless Nameless is he collaborate with Eli AJ, which 896 00:52:53,840 --> 00:52:54,960 is cool. Out again? 897 00:52:56,240 --> 00:53:00,240 Yeah, man is working, bro. Like he's he's really pushing 898 00:53:00,480 --> 00:53:03,760 and I like that he's doing a bunch of different things like 899 00:53:03,760 --> 00:53:05,720 collaborating with different sides of the industry. 900 00:53:06,160 --> 00:53:10,480 So that's cool. Speaking of the oldies, King 901 00:53:10,480 --> 00:53:13,280 Kaka, he's still dropping music, I think. 902 00:53:13,280 --> 00:53:16,280 I think he's gearing up for a project with Scar. 903 00:53:17,160 --> 00:53:18,520 It looks like that. I don't know if it's been 904 00:53:18,520 --> 00:53:19,680 announced. I'm not really been following 905 00:53:19,680 --> 00:53:21,960 that, but they've dropped two singles this week. 906 00:53:21,960 --> 00:53:28,280 They they dropped find me with so it's Kinkaka scan Cardinali 907 00:53:28,280 --> 00:53:30,960 and Jirai, which is an interesting pairing. 908 00:53:31,520 --> 00:53:32,960 That wasn't bad. Actually enjoyed that a little 909 00:53:32,960 --> 00:53:35,800 bit. What else? 910 00:53:35,800 --> 00:53:43,280 Octopus dropped June 25th and again, this is it's it's it's, I 911 00:53:43,280 --> 00:53:44,960 mean, it's, it's a man, a man, a song, right? 912 00:53:44,960 --> 00:53:48,360 Just really chronicling it and very, very emotional chords, 913 00:53:49,120 --> 00:53:50,920 throwing news clips in there as it was. 914 00:53:50,920 --> 00:53:53,000 It was decent. I mean, it's if if you're 915 00:53:53,000 --> 00:53:55,840 looking to relieve that and you really like Octopus like that, 916 00:53:55,840 --> 00:53:58,080 that would be a that would be a decent song. 917 00:54:01,560 --> 00:54:02,840 Do you have do you have thoughts? 918 00:54:04,280 --> 00:54:05,200 I'm going to put you on the spot. 919 00:54:05,200 --> 00:54:07,360 No, no, no, yeah. Now that you're giving me faces, 920 00:54:08,480 --> 00:54:09,520 you've put me on this photo, but. 921 00:54:09,520 --> 00:54:13,280 No, Oh my Oh my God that is giving you faces bro. 922 00:54:13,280 --> 00:54:17,840 No no no, I actually do respect artists who put like the 923 00:54:17,880 --> 00:54:20,200 message. Also we didn't mention but like 924 00:54:20,200 --> 00:54:25,120 shout out to Bien for speaking on our economic situation and 925 00:54:25,120 --> 00:54:26,920 that. Just went and blasted the 926 00:54:26,920 --> 00:54:31,440 government. The government is the people. 927 00:54:31,440 --> 00:54:32,800 Yeah, that's that's that was dope. 928 00:54:33,400 --> 00:54:37,640 Exactly bro, what did he say? Freedom of expression. 929 00:54:38,000 --> 00:54:39,680 But not freedom after. Expression. 930 00:54:39,680 --> 00:54:44,600 Expression came up with that. Shout out to. 931 00:54:44,600 --> 00:54:46,440 Him. I know I came up with that, but. 932 00:54:46,440 --> 00:54:49,840 Yeah, I don't know, but shout out to Mr. Alusa Continua. 933 00:54:50,400 --> 00:54:53,680 Goodness, yeah. And it was confirmed to Oh my 934 00:54:53,680 --> 00:54:58,720 goodness, I'm so. So anyway, we'll wait for the 935 00:54:58,720 --> 00:55:01,360 songs, luckily. What else did I listen to? 936 00:55:01,360 --> 00:55:05,160 What else did I listen to? There's one other song I want to 937 00:55:05,160 --> 00:55:09,480 shout out, Boy Black. Boy Black and Zawadi released a 938 00:55:09,480 --> 00:55:11,520 song. It was very interesting. 939 00:55:11,720 --> 00:55:14,600 I'm of course a big fan of Boy Black and his raps. 940 00:55:15,040 --> 00:55:17,680 Zawadi also wrapped her up was really interesting though. 941 00:55:17,720 --> 00:55:21,600 It was was not it was unexpected. 942 00:55:22,120 --> 00:55:23,800 Let me say that. It was very unexpected. 943 00:55:23,800 --> 00:55:25,360 So. And that was pretty cool Shout 944 00:55:26,000 --> 00:55:27,040 yeah. Listen jumped a project 945 00:55:27,040 --> 00:55:30,560 recently, Sun Wave Records. I don't know if that's the name. 946 00:55:30,560 --> 00:55:32,600 I think that might be the name. I'm going off off the top of my 947 00:55:32,600 --> 00:55:36,960 head. So shout out to him and lastly, 948 00:55:36,960 --> 00:55:39,840 shout out to Mawira, who is back with Vumbi. 949 00:55:41,560 --> 00:55:44,840 Yeah, hopefully he keeps releasing music and we see more 950 00:55:44,840 --> 00:55:46,640 from him. Yeah, I think. 951 00:55:46,640 --> 00:55:48,080 Oh, wait. And lastly, lastly, sorry, 952 00:55:48,080 --> 00:55:53,000 lastly, let me be Roland, Krista and Savara, which is 953 00:55:53,000 --> 00:55:57,680 interesting, but I did not think about that pairing but appearing 954 00:55:57,680 --> 00:55:59,640 with three of them on the track. But that was interesting. 955 00:55:59,640 --> 00:56:02,720 I think somewhere I did well. It's a very relaxed, chill song. 956 00:56:03,080 --> 00:56:05,320 And yeah, I enjoyed that one as well. 957 00:56:06,080 --> 00:56:10,040 That's about all I'm. Surprised you didn't mention The 958 00:56:10,040 --> 00:56:13,920 World by Ochiko. I thought that would be along 959 00:56:13,920 --> 00:56:16,360 your why? Why did you think that? 960 00:56:16,760 --> 00:56:17,040 Yeah. See. 961 00:56:17,040 --> 00:56:18,240 And that's that's where you made it because. 962 00:56:18,240 --> 00:56:21,440 You like that folk? No, it's because you like that. 963 00:56:21,520 --> 00:56:22,320 You. Always, No. 964 00:56:22,520 --> 00:56:25,080 You're saying that because there's two of us on this on on 965 00:56:25,080 --> 00:56:28,760 this platform and one of us does not listen to that kind of music 966 00:56:28,760 --> 00:56:30,360 at all. So now you're automatically 967 00:56:30,360 --> 00:56:35,480 going to make the other person. OK, OK, you know what? 968 00:56:35,920 --> 00:56:36,800 You know what? Take it back. 969 00:56:36,800 --> 00:56:41,240 I'm backing off, but shout out to Orchico for releasing the 970 00:56:41,240 --> 00:56:45,760 song The World. Another favorite artist of yours 971 00:56:45,760 --> 00:56:48,400 Caliber, Witty, released the song Poor It. 972 00:56:49,240 --> 00:56:51,520 On to yo, Mombasa is very old and let's go bro. 973 00:56:52,760 --> 00:56:54,840 Yeah, shout out to Caliber Witty. 974 00:56:56,440 --> 00:57:02,480 I want to say shout out to Iana. She released a song with Kobe 975 00:57:02,480 --> 00:57:04,840 Banks called Finally Done with School. 976 00:57:05,760 --> 00:57:09,040 Love that like hip hop like chill vibe. 977 00:57:11,360 --> 00:57:17,120 There was a song by Mauricio Brilliante and Nesburu, they 978 00:57:17,120 --> 00:57:19,400 released a song called Protelele. 979 00:57:20,800 --> 00:57:24,640 So bro, this guy's released the UNS jams like every week like 980 00:57:24,640 --> 00:57:28,040 it's nothing. There's this artist I didn't 981 00:57:28,040 --> 00:57:29,720 know too much about called Binoy. 982 00:57:30,280 --> 00:57:34,760 He released a song called Beat. He's a Kenyan, Kenyan born 983 00:57:34,880 --> 00:57:40,240 artist but lives in Lai Believe so you know. 984 00:57:40,240 --> 00:57:44,160 Yeah, he's somebody new. I've never heard of him before. 985 00:57:44,160 --> 00:57:47,760 But like, shout out to him for releasing some music. 986 00:57:48,720 --> 00:57:52,920 My Molo dropped the song Guidance produced by Cap. 987 00:57:54,600 --> 00:58:00,720 Yeah, man, Cap never disappoints with his production and I don't 988 00:58:00,720 --> 00:58:06,400 think I listen to anything else except for the song that we want 989 00:58:06,400 --> 00:58:12,400 to put on today for the end of the podcast, which is 247 by 990 00:58:12,400 --> 00:58:16,520 Jovi Jove and Sahili Papi. Listen when we look, when we 991 00:58:16,520 --> 00:58:20,560 talk about a song that makes you want to just like wear black Air 992 00:58:20,560 --> 00:58:28,960 Force ones, go outside and just. Engage why their shoes wear 993 00:58:28,960 --> 00:58:30,720 black? Because of the people who it's 994 00:58:31,320 --> 00:58:32,840 because of the people who wear them. 995 00:58:32,840 --> 00:58:35,600 Like bro, the people who wear them are usually about that 996 00:58:35,600 --> 00:58:36,360 life. Let. 997 00:58:36,920 --> 00:58:41,720 Me tell you, when I listen to Jovi man, yeah, when I listen to 998 00:58:41,720 --> 00:58:45,000 Jovi man, I just feel like bro, I need to be. 999 00:58:45,000 --> 00:58:48,400 And if you know me, you know I'm the least person to be this way. 1000 00:58:48,480 --> 00:58:50,120 But like bro, you just feel like you know? 1001 00:58:50,240 --> 00:58:52,360 You're not doing any of that activity. 1002 00:58:52,360 --> 00:58:55,800 No, no, no, no. You're listening to it in your 1003 00:58:55,800 --> 00:58:58,040 headphones. Yeah, good. 1004 00:58:58,040 --> 00:58:58,840 Stay out of. Stay out of. 1005 00:58:58,840 --> 00:59:02,680 I'm feeling like I'm in, I'm feeling like I'm in the street. 1006 00:59:03,080 --> 00:59:05,560 But anyway, shout out to Jovi. You should have said the way you 1007 00:59:05,640 --> 00:59:07,240 said that. That didn't come up hard. 1008 00:59:08,240 --> 00:59:10,160 It's OK. It's not the life you built, you 1009 00:59:10,200 --> 00:59:11,640 built for. And thank we. 1010 00:59:11,720 --> 00:59:14,080 Thank we thank God for that. Yeah. 1011 00:59:14,240 --> 00:59:16,280 Let me be honest. I am not built for that life. 1012 00:59:16,280 --> 00:59:18,760 But anyway, yeah. So the song I want to play for 1013 00:59:18,760 --> 00:59:24,560 the end of the podcast is 247 by Jovi Jov and Swahili. 1014 00:59:24,880 --> 00:59:57,400 Happy 247. Yeah. 1015 01:00:15,680 --> 01:00:23,680 Bandi hawa Julikani party Jovi kamlesh patni magoroza kombak 1016 01:00:23,680 --> 01:00:29,040 Niko trap harakati maze Jovi Nikki Guangi hini Capitalism, 1017 01:00:29,400 --> 01:01:33,210 Organism, Symbolism heretic. That was 247 by Jovi Jove and 1018 01:01:33,210 --> 01:01:36,330 Swahili Papi. Shout out to them. 1019 01:01:36,850 --> 01:01:41,010 That was like an insanely tough listen. 1020 01:01:41,930 --> 01:01:47,490 So hard so fire. I can't wait for more music from 1021 01:01:47,490 --> 01:01:50,960 Jovi Jove, man. This is your year, man. 1022 01:01:51,040 --> 01:01:53,320 Make sure you keep on. You stay releasing. 1023 01:01:54,240 --> 01:01:59,280 Yo Sam, that's another podcast down the can. 1024 01:01:59,480 --> 01:02:02,760 If you're new listening to this podcast, I'd like to end it with 1025 01:02:02,760 --> 01:02:06,000 the three C's. And what are those you may ask? 1026 01:02:06,000 --> 01:02:10,640 Well, this is a mantra that I've kind of devised for myself that 1027 01:02:10,640 --> 01:02:12,480 I thought I would share on the podcast. 1028 01:02:12,640 --> 01:02:15,440 And what are these 3C's confidence. 1029 01:02:15,600 --> 01:02:18,240 You need to be confident in your art, in your work. 1030 01:02:18,480 --> 01:02:24,440 Make sure that that confidence is exuding in your work. 1031 01:02:24,520 --> 01:02:27,800 Believe in yourself a little bit because when you do, other 1032 01:02:27,800 --> 01:02:29,360 people will believe in you as well. 1033 01:02:29,640 --> 01:02:33,200 Consistency Make sure that you are creating your art 1034 01:02:33,200 --> 01:02:37,480 consistently as well as releasing consistently. 1035 01:02:37,640 --> 01:02:41,040 I mean, we can see Jovi Jov is doing that right now. 1036 01:02:41,040 --> 01:02:45,560 Releasing consistently is actually giving him a buzz and, 1037 01:02:45,560 --> 01:02:50,920 and, and it's so dope to see. So make sure you're consistent 1038 01:02:51,000 --> 01:02:55,480 with how you're creating. And lastly, craft, always work 1039 01:02:55,600 --> 01:02:58,840 on your craft. Read something that helps you 1040 01:02:58,840 --> 01:03:03,200 progress your art. Only 5 minutes, 10 minutes a day 1041 01:03:03,200 --> 01:03:07,400 is enough for you to start really, really improving. 1042 01:03:08,200 --> 01:03:13,560 So I know we all have 5 to 10 minutes in our day to dedicated 1043 01:03:13,560 --> 01:03:15,600 to our craft, so make sure you're doing that. 1044 01:03:15,960 --> 01:03:22,560 And yeah man, Episode 133, Sam. Yep. 1045 01:03:23,560 --> 01:03:24,480 Yeah. Thank you guys. 1046 01:03:25,080 --> 01:03:28,040 We stay safe. Stay, stay clean out there. 1047 01:03:28,040 --> 01:03:31,200 The air is getting dirtier. The politicians are not here to 1048 01:03:31,200 --> 01:03:33,560 help you. No one will save you. 1049 01:03:34,120 --> 01:03:40,680 Just leave your life. And on those. 1050 01:03:41,920 --> 01:03:44,560 Words, yeah. Yeah, yeah. 1051 01:03:44,560 --> 01:03:48,480 We will catch you on episode 134.