1 00:00:00,360 --> 00:00:01,560 Hey there. It's from Konstein. 2 00:00:01,560 --> 00:00:04,320 And in this episode of Bitcoin for Millennials, I'm joined by 3 00:00:04,320 --> 00:00:07,040 Matt Manning. He's a writer, coach, and the 4 00:00:07,040 --> 00:00:10,400 mind behind The Liminal Leap, where he explores how Bitcoin, 5 00:00:10,520 --> 00:00:13,920 AI and human consciousness are transforming the world and our 6 00:00:13,920 --> 00:00:16,520 place in it. I don't think most of the 7 00:00:16,520 --> 00:00:19,680 general population sees that the old system is already dying. 8 00:00:19,760 --> 00:00:22,120 It's falling away. In this conversation, we'll 9 00:00:22,120 --> 00:00:25,880 unpack how Bitcoin cracked open his worldview, how paradigm 10 00:00:25,880 --> 00:00:29,040 shifts in consciousness are unfolding, and why the 11 00:00:29,040 --> 00:00:33,360 intersection of Bitcoin, AI, and evolving human awareness matters 12 00:00:33,360 --> 00:00:36,920 now more than ever. If you enjoyed this episode, 13 00:00:36,920 --> 00:00:40,560 please like this video on YouTube and subscribe on here or 14 00:00:40,560 --> 00:00:43,720 follow me on your favorite podcasting platform to help me 15 00:00:43,720 --> 00:00:47,880 reach more people and spread the message of Bitcoin even further. 16 00:00:48,080 --> 00:00:51,240 I hope you enjoyed this episode. Now let's dive in. 17 00:00:51,960 --> 00:00:55,520 All right, Matt Manning, welcome to Bitcoin for Millennials. 18 00:00:56,480 --> 00:00:59,000 Brown, thanks for having me. I'm looking forward to the 19 00:00:59,000 --> 00:01:02,320 conversation. Likewise, man, I love that you 20 00:01:02,320 --> 00:01:05,239 are focusing on Bitcoin, AI and consciousness. 21 00:01:05,239 --> 00:01:08,840 Those are probably the three topics that I think about every 22 00:01:08,840 --> 00:01:12,640 day. So I think we'll have a really 23 00:01:12,640 --> 00:01:16,240 nice conversation around that and I hope the people listening 24 00:01:16,240 --> 00:01:20,560 will will enjoy it. But before we dive in, I I saw 25 00:01:20,560 --> 00:01:26,760 that you had a pretty successful career in tech and sales, but at 26 00:01:26,760 --> 00:01:31,400 one point you had to realization that you didn't want to do that 27 00:01:31,400 --> 00:01:34,560 anymore and you walked away. What was kind of like the moment 28 00:01:34,560 --> 00:01:38,480 or realization that made you decide to focus on, you know, 29 00:01:38,600 --> 00:01:43,240 Bitcoin AI unconsciousness? Yeah, it was. 30 00:01:43,240 --> 00:01:48,640 It was kind of a gradually and then suddenly type experience. 31 00:01:48,640 --> 00:01:52,360 So, you know, we can get more into the story, but Bitcoin 32 00:01:52,520 --> 00:01:55,400 initially is what kind of cracked me open. 33 00:01:55,400 --> 00:01:59,320 It was such a paradigm shift for me that I started to question 34 00:01:59,880 --> 00:02:04,000 everything essentially. And you know, over a number of 35 00:02:04,000 --> 00:02:07,200 years that that led to pretty big identity shift. 36 00:02:07,560 --> 00:02:11,360 And I had studied psychology and it always been interested in 37 00:02:11,360 --> 00:02:15,960 kind of consciousness and some of the more inner work. 38 00:02:17,080 --> 00:02:20,280 And I started to feel pulled back to that. 39 00:02:20,280 --> 00:02:22,720 You know, I had a successful career, like you mentioned, in 40 00:02:22,720 --> 00:02:26,760 sales. And then at some point, you 41 00:02:26,760 --> 00:02:29,240 know, I was like, I'll eventually get back into that. 42 00:02:29,240 --> 00:02:32,720 And then, you know, about four months ago, I like it hit me and 43 00:02:32,720 --> 00:02:37,800 I just went for it. Yeah, I quit my job 4 1/2 months 44 00:02:37,800 --> 00:02:40,320 ago. And just kind of following my 45 00:02:40,320 --> 00:02:43,600 heart and, and trusting that that something's emerging, but 46 00:02:43,600 --> 00:02:47,400 I'm sensing into that humanity is going through such a massive 47 00:02:47,400 --> 00:02:51,880 shift that we need more and more people to, you know, step 48 00:02:51,880 --> 00:02:54,360 outside of the normal and be willing to create something new. 49 00:02:55,080 --> 00:02:58,320 Yeah. So what was it that made you 50 00:02:59,640 --> 00:03:05,280 either go into Bitcoin or or see more than what what you perhaps 51 00:03:05,280 --> 00:03:07,680 initially thought that Bitcoin would bring you? 52 00:03:07,720 --> 00:03:10,200 I mean, this is a common theme that people have. 53 00:03:10,200 --> 00:03:14,080 You know, I think practically it's like, you know, when once 54 00:03:14,080 --> 00:03:18,680 you realize that you were lied to about money, which is 55 00:03:18,680 --> 00:03:22,680 arguably the most important technology that people use to 56 00:03:22,680 --> 00:03:27,680 communicate with each other. Right, Yeah, You know, Bitcoin, 57 00:03:27,680 --> 00:03:33,280 I got into it in 2018 after the the bull run up to like 20 K and 58 00:03:33,280 --> 00:03:36,160 I didn't know too much about it, but it crashed back down and I 59 00:03:36,160 --> 00:03:40,080 had some friends that started to kind of give me the blockchain 60 00:03:40,080 --> 00:03:43,800 crypto pitch. And I got in and, you know, put 61 00:03:43,800 --> 00:03:47,280 a little bit of money in. And my personality is one that 62 00:03:47,880 --> 00:03:50,680 once I'm into something, I like to understand it really deeply. 63 00:03:50,680 --> 00:03:53,600 So I went pretty deep down the rabbit hole in the first year 64 00:03:53,600 --> 00:03:56,960 was like kind of confusing to try to sift through all the 65 00:03:56,960 --> 00:03:59,840 noise with Bitcoin versus crypto. 66 00:03:59,840 --> 00:04:02,240 And I couldn't figure out what the crypto people were talking 67 00:04:02,240 --> 00:04:04,720 about. And eventually I kind of settled 68 00:04:04,720 --> 00:04:06,720 on the Bitcoiners. Like they were talking about the 69 00:04:06,720 --> 00:04:11,840 biggest problems in the world, you know, first principles, big 70 00:04:11,840 --> 00:04:17,680 macro problems, inflation, money printing, energy, geopolitics, 71 00:04:17,680 --> 00:04:19,680 all of that. And so, you know, I started to 72 00:04:19,680 --> 00:04:21,480 really deconstruct the whole system. 73 00:04:21,480 --> 00:04:23,560 And yeah, I came to that conclusion that you mentioned, 74 00:04:23,560 --> 00:04:26,080 that everything I thought I knew about money and that I had been 75 00:04:26,080 --> 00:04:31,520 taught about money was wrong. And it was such a paradigm shift 76 00:04:31,520 --> 00:04:34,760 that that caused me to start questioning, well, if I was 77 00:04:35,400 --> 00:04:38,560 wrong about that. And you know, the things I've 78 00:04:38,560 --> 00:04:41,600 been taught about that, like what else, what other basic 79 00:04:41,680 --> 00:04:46,840 assumptions that I have that I've just been taught, whether 80 00:04:46,840 --> 00:04:51,040 it's from my family, from a school system, from society in 81 00:04:51,040 --> 00:04:53,960 general, like what else am I missing? 82 00:04:54,360 --> 00:04:57,880 And that really started me to start questioning and, and 83 00:04:57,880 --> 00:05:01,160 looking pretty deeply at my most basic assumptions. 84 00:05:01,600 --> 00:05:04,280 And that led to a whole, you know, I say Bitcoin is an ego 85 00:05:04,280 --> 00:05:07,640 test in a lot of ways. You have to, you have to be 86 00:05:07,640 --> 00:05:11,520 willing to admit you were wrong. But in my, in my experience, 87 00:05:11,520 --> 00:05:16,320 it's kind of a warm up. Some of the deeper consciousness 88 00:05:16,320 --> 00:05:20,920 ego tests are the real tests. And, you know, I don't think 89 00:05:20,920 --> 00:05:23,200 they're, they're two separate things. 90 00:05:23,200 --> 00:05:26,520 I think Bitcoin is a catalyst for, for some shifts that are 91 00:05:26,520 --> 00:05:28,160 happening globally. Yeah. 92 00:05:29,960 --> 00:05:33,880 So many things to pull on, I think, I think on one side there 93 00:05:33,880 --> 00:05:40,520 is some, some courage needed that I, I didn't know I had that 94 00:05:40,520 --> 00:05:44,640 in a sense to really challenge what I thought was my 95 00:05:44,640 --> 00:05:46,760 understanding of a certain topic, right? 96 00:05:46,760 --> 00:05:51,360 Or anything I attached to that. And realizing that I was doing 97 00:05:51,360 --> 00:05:53,720 that in a totally unconscious way. 98 00:05:53,720 --> 00:05:57,440 Just sitting with that realization I think was already 99 00:05:57,440 --> 00:06:01,440 very interesting, right? Like just just getting there but 100 00:06:01,440 --> 00:06:04,360 then being triggered to a degree. 101 00:06:04,400 --> 00:06:07,400 Yeah, similar to you. Like I started to listen to the 102 00:06:07,400 --> 00:06:11,160 Bitcoiners pretty heavily, like 2019, you know, about a year 103 00:06:11,160 --> 00:06:14,520 after I'd gotten in and gravitated toward Bitcoin, only 104 00:06:15,040 --> 00:06:17,560 I didn't, I didn't really see the use case for crypto. 105 00:06:18,080 --> 00:06:24,160 And and then, you know, COVID happened and everything that 106 00:06:24,160 --> 00:06:27,080 these Bitcoiners have been talking about, I like light 107 00:06:27,080 --> 00:06:31,160 bulbs started to go off. And frankly, during that period, 108 00:06:31,160 --> 00:06:35,080 I was quite, I got really pessimistic about the world when 109 00:06:35,080 --> 00:06:38,080 I started to understand like where the financial system was 110 00:06:38,080 --> 00:06:43,200 going, the end game and all of the manipulation. 111 00:06:43,520 --> 00:06:46,400 And, you know, I, I felt like I was in the matrix because I was 112 00:06:46,400 --> 00:06:48,760 seeing things that, you know, and I would bring it up and 113 00:06:48,760 --> 00:06:50,800 people didn't, didn't really agree with it. 114 00:06:50,800 --> 00:06:53,720 My family, yeah, I was kind of there, thought I was a little 115 00:06:53,720 --> 00:06:58,200 bit crazy. But yeah, similar to your 116 00:06:58,200 --> 00:07:02,000 experience where, you know, it was kind of an invitation. 117 00:07:02,280 --> 00:07:06,280 And then from there, you know, I think the other thing that kind 118 00:07:06,280 --> 00:07:10,200 of opened me up and looking back on it, I was projecting a lot of 119 00:07:10,200 --> 00:07:14,200 my own anxiety internally onto like the global situation. 120 00:07:15,120 --> 00:07:20,760 And I I had had pretty significant anxiety since a 121 00:07:20,760 --> 00:07:24,040 pretty young age. And, you know, just my nervous 122 00:07:24,040 --> 00:07:29,680 system was kind of high on high alert all the time. 123 00:07:29,920 --> 00:07:32,600 And then, you know, I'm going through that kind of, well, I 124 00:07:32,600 --> 00:07:38,280 was probably in my early 30s, like 3 young kids and you know, 125 00:07:38,280 --> 00:07:41,760 one of them was special needs. And so like I was just feeling 126 00:07:41,760 --> 00:07:46,560 the pressure and, and so I started to do more meditation 127 00:07:46,560 --> 00:07:50,240 and going inward with like some of the, the questions around 128 00:07:50,240 --> 00:07:55,320 like why, why does my anxiety? Why am I like this and why, why 129 00:07:55,320 --> 00:07:58,360 do I react certain ways to different to different 130 00:07:58,360 --> 00:08:03,240 situations? And yeah, studying meditation 131 00:08:03,240 --> 00:08:08,040 and developmental psychology really kind of led to a profound 132 00:08:08,040 --> 00:08:11,320 identity shift. But I find like in that journey 133 00:08:11,320 --> 00:08:15,160 of like, you know, I think globally we're on this 134 00:08:15,160 --> 00:08:19,840 evolutionary journey society, It's at a critical juncture. 135 00:08:19,840 --> 00:08:24,600 I, I call it a liminal moment where the old is passing away 136 00:08:25,240 --> 00:08:29,200 and the new hasn't quite yet been birthed. 137 00:08:29,320 --> 00:08:31,600 Like we have to create something new. 138 00:08:32,440 --> 00:08:35,280 And I find that that happens personally as well in our own 139 00:08:35,280 --> 00:08:40,159 personal developmental journeys is like, you have to let the old 140 00:08:40,760 --> 00:08:44,320 that has served you well pass away for something new to emerge 141 00:08:44,920 --> 00:08:47,040 and you have to be OK with some volatility. 142 00:08:47,200 --> 00:08:52,600 And so Bitcoin in a way is like training for to be able to like 143 00:08:52,760 --> 00:08:56,400 find a place of stillness amongst all this volatility and 144 00:08:56,400 --> 00:09:01,840 hold and like trust the longer term pattern that's emerging. 145 00:09:01,840 --> 00:09:04,960 And so, yeah, I started to see these connections between like 146 00:09:05,120 --> 00:09:08,200 the inner side of, of how we develop and how society is 147 00:09:08,200 --> 00:09:11,600 developing. And yeah, it was. 148 00:09:12,120 --> 00:09:17,680 It led to some profound shifts. 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You can sign up at 167 00:10:14,400 --> 00:10:18,920 onrampbitcoin.com and use codebrum that's BR AM to receive 168 00:10:18,920 --> 00:10:22,320 $150.00 in Bitcoin after your first deposit. 169 00:10:22,840 --> 00:10:25,040 If you first want to learn more, you can also book a free 170 00:10:25,040 --> 00:10:27,960 consultation via their website to speak with one of their 171 00:10:27,960 --> 00:10:31,400 Bitcoin custody experts. Tell them you came to me and 172 00:10:31,400 --> 00:10:32,760 they'll take extra good care of you. 173 00:10:33,600 --> 00:10:36,440 There are so many people that have a similar experience, 174 00:10:36,440 --> 00:10:37,400 right? I think I'm. 175 00:10:37,400 --> 00:10:42,800 I'm also one of them in a sense that yeah, when you're triggered 176 00:10:42,800 --> 00:10:46,480 about something that you realize that you had no clue about, 177 00:10:46,480 --> 00:10:48,880 right. So money in this case, and you 178 00:10:48,920 --> 00:10:52,560 start going down the rabbit hole of studying, you know, what is 179 00:10:52,560 --> 00:10:53,920 actually money? Why? 180 00:10:53,920 --> 00:10:55,400 Why? You know what is Bitcoin? 181 00:10:55,400 --> 00:10:57,960 Why would that be a solution? Why not all the other cryptos 182 00:10:57,960 --> 00:11:02,880 and whatnot, right. And you eventually, I wonder 183 00:11:02,880 --> 00:11:06,160 what it is for you, but I got to the point where I now see, you 184 00:11:06,160 --> 00:11:09,920 know, the, the data in the Bitcoin blockchain or in the 185 00:11:09,920 --> 00:11:13,320 time chain rather, right? Like the Ledger of Bitcoin is 186 00:11:13,320 --> 00:11:17,040 basically engineer truth. It's the ultimate truth of this 187 00:11:17,040 --> 00:11:18,760 system. That's the whole point of this 188 00:11:18,760 --> 00:11:23,440 system, is that there's a base layer of truth upon which people 189 00:11:23,440 --> 00:11:27,120 do things. They they act with an incentive 190 00:11:27,120 --> 00:11:30,600 that's aligned to this truth at at this base layer. 191 00:11:30,600 --> 00:11:33,640 Yeah, and I'm starting to see it like more clearly as I've 192 00:11:33,640 --> 00:11:37,760 studied some of the more like Eastern, you know, meditative 193 00:11:38,240 --> 00:11:41,560 like these paths at that some of these mystical traditions have 194 00:11:41,560 --> 00:11:44,440 been talking about for thousands and thousands of years. 195 00:11:44,920 --> 00:11:48,720 And when you overlay it with the Bitcoin or journey, like there's 196 00:11:48,720 --> 00:11:53,080 so many similarities in that, like, Hey, reality isn't 197 00:11:53,080 --> 00:11:57,360 actually exactly how you've constructed it to be a lot of 198 00:11:57,360 --> 00:12:00,800 what your reality is. It's just a story that you've 199 00:12:00,800 --> 00:12:05,800 created to have certainty and to you know, and and that's, that's 200 00:12:05,800 --> 00:12:09,840 useful as we grow up, like we need that children need rules 201 00:12:09,840 --> 00:12:12,480 that are black and white and they need certainty to be able 202 00:12:12,480 --> 00:12:16,600 to grow. And and then at some point, you 203 00:12:16,600 --> 00:12:21,320 know, something cracks and you realize that maybe reality isn't 204 00:12:21,320 --> 00:12:26,560 exactly like I thought it was. And you know, you start to see 205 00:12:26,640 --> 00:12:28,960 something new. And then from there, like my 206 00:12:28,960 --> 00:12:33,600 experience is like you want to tell everybody about it, right? 207 00:12:33,640 --> 00:12:37,080 Like Bitcoin, you want to just, you want to talk to every person 208 00:12:37,080 --> 00:12:41,000 about it. And especially early on in my 209 00:12:41,000 --> 00:12:43,920 journey, I'm not sure how this was for you, but I was really 210 00:12:43,920 --> 00:12:47,960 into like trying to convince people about Bitcoin, but it was 211 00:12:48,440 --> 00:12:51,080 probably coming from a place of just needing to be right. 212 00:12:51,200 --> 00:12:53,720 Like, hey, I've thought about this, I'm right. 213 00:12:53,720 --> 00:12:55,560 And people would sense into that. 214 00:12:55,560 --> 00:12:57,760 And it wasn't received as as well. 215 00:12:58,200 --> 00:13:02,240 And that's similar in like the consciousness, you know, a lot 216 00:13:02,240 --> 00:13:05,280 of people want to start talking about it like, hey, you know, 217 00:13:06,000 --> 00:13:09,160 like people go do these psychedelic experiences. 218 00:13:09,160 --> 00:13:12,600 Hey, reality isn't as it seems. And they want to preach and, and 219 00:13:12,600 --> 00:13:16,560 be right about it. But then over time, you start to 220 00:13:16,560 --> 00:13:19,040 realize that people are going to be ready for it when they're 221 00:13:19,040 --> 00:13:23,360 ready for it. And there's less of this need to 222 00:13:23,360 --> 00:13:24,880 be right. And I think that's where the 223 00:13:24,880 --> 00:13:28,560 maturity starts to come in. And so I'm starting to just see 224 00:13:28,560 --> 00:13:33,120 so many parallels between the Bitcoiner journey and this 225 00:13:33,120 --> 00:13:36,280 journey of consciousness that it, you know, in my experience 226 00:13:36,280 --> 00:13:38,680 is a, they're both very deep rabbit holes. 227 00:13:39,880 --> 00:13:43,120 Yeah, I'm trying to tell more people about Bitcoin. 228 00:13:43,120 --> 00:13:46,960 I I know what this is and I also know that I cannot Orange Bill 229 00:13:46,960 --> 00:13:49,640 other people like you, Orange Bill yourself, right. 230 00:13:49,640 --> 00:13:55,160 So whether there are, I don't know, 2000 people that by 231 00:13:55,160 --> 00:13:58,320 listening to my podcast eventually get into Bitcoin or 232 00:13:58,320 --> 00:14:00,480 two people doesn't really matter. 233 00:14:00,480 --> 00:14:03,080 It would be cool if there's more, but if there's two, right, 234 00:14:03,080 --> 00:14:06,560 like, I don't know, like I get a message, I think every week from 235 00:14:06,560 --> 00:14:08,880 someone like that is already enough. 236 00:14:08,880 --> 00:14:11,680 No messages is also enough in that sense, right? 237 00:14:11,680 --> 00:14:14,720 So yeah, it's more from okay. I feel that this is something 238 00:14:14,720 --> 00:14:17,680 that is valuable and more people should know. 239 00:14:17,680 --> 00:14:22,000 That's why I'm doing this. But I'm I'm I'm okay with where 240 00:14:22,000 --> 00:14:25,320 I'm at internally. Like there is yeah, validation 241 00:14:25,320 --> 00:14:27,040 needed anymore. Yeah. 242 00:14:27,040 --> 00:14:31,120 And what I'm starting to see is that, you know, even Bitcoin, 243 00:14:31,120 --> 00:14:35,280 like I'm super bullish on Bitcoin and I think it's a total 244 00:14:35,280 --> 00:14:39,120 catalyst to a whole new world that is going to be created. 245 00:14:39,120 --> 00:14:42,280 Like the old systems. I don't think most of the 246 00:14:42,280 --> 00:14:45,480 general population sees that the old system is already dying. 247 00:14:45,520 --> 00:14:49,360 It's falling away. And you know, we have the 248 00:14:49,360 --> 00:14:51,360 opportunity to build something new. 249 00:14:51,760 --> 00:14:54,880 And you know, the base layer is, is we're so early. 250 00:14:54,880 --> 00:14:57,240 There's so many things that are going to be built on top of it 251 00:14:57,240 --> 00:14:59,560 to enable the future of humanity. 252 00:14:59,920 --> 00:15:05,680 And same with AI, but I'm also starting to tap into it's not 253 00:15:05,680 --> 00:15:09,280 just technology that is going to do that. 254 00:15:09,280 --> 00:15:12,600 Like the technology itself is only as good as the 255 00:15:12,600 --> 00:15:15,600 consciousness behind what's being created on it. 256 00:15:16,720 --> 00:15:20,520 So with AI, if we don't evolve consciousness and have more 257 00:15:20,520 --> 00:15:25,440 awakened hearts and people that are in it for the right reasons, 258 00:15:26,920 --> 00:15:30,720 then because if not, we'll just create the same problems we did 259 00:15:30,720 --> 00:15:33,080 in the old system on top of new technology. 260 00:15:33,400 --> 00:15:38,320 And same thing with Bitcoin. And so, you know, I think 261 00:15:38,320 --> 00:15:41,920 Bitcoin fixes a lot of things, but Bitcoin and AI without more 262 00:15:41,920 --> 00:15:45,560 awakened consciousness and people who are much more aware 263 00:15:45,560 --> 00:15:50,000 of of their own ego, their own projections and being able to 264 00:15:50,000 --> 00:15:52,560 step back and see all the different perspectives and 265 00:15:52,560 --> 00:15:55,280 include all sorts of different ideas. 266 00:15:55,280 --> 00:15:58,640 Like that's what we need. And I think Bitcoin helps to do 267 00:15:58,640 --> 00:16:00,800 that because like in my own journey, Bitcoin was the 268 00:16:00,800 --> 00:16:03,240 catalyst. And if you adopt the Bitcoin 269 00:16:03,240 --> 00:16:06,360 standard overtime money that gets more valuable, you have 270 00:16:06,360 --> 00:16:10,080 more time and you can, you can get out of that fight or flight 271 00:16:10,080 --> 00:16:13,400 mode where you just having to do anything to provide for your 272 00:16:13,400 --> 00:16:16,800 family to beat inflation, to do all these things that it gives 273 00:16:16,800 --> 00:16:20,520 people time to actually connect to their heart and connect to 274 00:16:20,520 --> 00:16:23,240 their soul and connect to what matters and build something 275 00:16:23,280 --> 00:16:26,720 real. So like, I think the two things 276 00:16:26,720 --> 00:16:30,600 are very interconnected, But I, I also am very passionate that 277 00:16:30,600 --> 00:16:34,600 we need more maturity emotionally, even among 278 00:16:34,600 --> 00:16:36,560 Bitcoiners. Like I think Bitcoiners are very 279 00:16:36,560 --> 00:16:40,120 altruistic and sometimes the whole like shouting and like 280 00:16:40,120 --> 00:16:44,480 crypto Bitcoin maximalism can be good. 281 00:16:44,480 --> 00:16:46,920 I also think we have an opportunity to kind of like 282 00:16:47,520 --> 00:16:50,720 upshift our messaging and and have it come out of more out of 283 00:16:50,720 --> 00:16:53,080 love instead of like we're right, you're wrong. 284 00:16:55,720 --> 00:16:58,200 I agree. You know, eventually we are all 285 00:16:58,200 --> 00:17:01,840 in this together. So, and I'm with you, like I 286 00:17:01,840 --> 00:17:04,280 think we need all sorts of different voices and there's a 287 00:17:04,280 --> 00:17:08,440 time and a place for the more, you know, aggressive messaging 288 00:17:08,440 --> 00:17:10,440 because sometimes that's what people need. 289 00:17:11,560 --> 00:17:15,240 I also think that like generally speaking, that's the type of 290 00:17:15,240 --> 00:17:19,119 messaging we have that leads to more and more polarity and 291 00:17:19,119 --> 00:17:22,839 division. And so, you know, I think it's 292 00:17:23,280 --> 00:17:26,880 as Bitcoin evolves, we're going to have to get more mature in 293 00:17:26,880 --> 00:17:30,200 how we how we message and how we connect to people and that they 294 00:17:30,200 --> 00:17:32,160 can feel the place that it's coming from. 295 00:17:33,200 --> 00:17:40,080 And yeah, and I see that more and more like I love Bitcoiners, 296 00:17:40,080 --> 00:17:44,000 like the philosophical spiritual aspects of Bitcoin are starting. 297 00:17:44,280 --> 00:17:46,800 I've been waiting for that type of conversation in the last 298 00:17:46,800 --> 00:17:48,200 year. It's like really starting to 299 00:17:48,200 --> 00:17:50,800 ramp up. So I'm really optimistic for 300 00:17:50,800 --> 00:17:53,320 where things are and and there's a time and a place to tell 301 00:17:53,320 --> 00:17:54,720 someone to have have fun staying. 302 00:17:54,720 --> 00:17:59,440 For it is figuring out this duality that you have, right? 303 00:17:59,440 --> 00:18:01,920 Like on the one side that we are all the same. 304 00:18:01,920 --> 00:18:05,080 We are all you know, this is this is my current understanding 305 00:18:05,080 --> 00:18:06,520 now, right? Or what I think is most 306 00:18:06,520 --> 00:18:12,040 probable, like we, we are all like an individual piece of 307 00:18:12,040 --> 00:18:14,080 consciousness from the eternal consciousness. 308 00:18:14,080 --> 00:18:16,800 And you are in your meat suit and I'm in my meat suit, right? 309 00:18:16,800 --> 00:18:21,400 And eventually we are, we are all the same, but just our 310 00:18:21,400 --> 00:18:25,520 experience right now here is different with different, you 311 00:18:25,520 --> 00:18:30,840 know, the challenges and opportunities and and etcetera. 312 00:18:30,840 --> 00:18:35,960 And you know, if you constantly approach it like that, I think 313 00:18:35,960 --> 00:18:41,520 it's really nice to see everyone as equal. 314 00:18:41,520 --> 00:18:43,800 But in the practicality, you know, that's more in the 315 00:18:43,920 --> 00:18:47,960 metaphysical realm. But in the, in the, in the, in 316 00:18:47,960 --> 00:18:52,440 the physical reality, you, you do see all these different types 317 00:18:52,440 --> 00:18:55,520 of actions that, that people do right and opinions that they 318 00:18:55,520 --> 00:18:58,280 hold. And, you know, if they're lazy 319 00:18:58,280 --> 00:19:01,080 or actually doing the work. And I think, you know, when we 320 00:19:01,080 --> 00:19:05,040 talk about the whole corruption of money, it is because of, you 321 00:19:05,040 --> 00:19:07,400 know, other people in this physical reality that are 322 00:19:07,400 --> 00:19:11,920 actually, I'm using a system in an in an abusive way, right? 323 00:19:11,920 --> 00:19:14,800 So I think that just that tension is interesting. 324 00:19:15,880 --> 00:19:19,680 Yeah, there's certainly a lot of tension and it's it's coming to 325 00:19:19,680 --> 00:19:21,360 the forefront. And I actually think the 326 00:19:21,360 --> 00:19:26,800 tension, like tension is good. In my experience, leaning into 327 00:19:26,800 --> 00:19:29,720 tension and discomfort on the other side of that is growth. 328 00:19:30,320 --> 00:19:33,720 And we're seeing that globally and systemically. 329 00:19:33,720 --> 00:19:40,000 Like there's a lot of tension happening and you know, we have 330 00:19:40,280 --> 00:19:43,400 there's, there's on the, when you're talking about duality, 331 00:19:43,400 --> 00:19:46,360 like there's, there's a, a myriad of different 332 00:19:46,360 --> 00:19:49,040 possibilities. I I'm quite optimistic about 333 00:19:49,040 --> 00:19:54,200 what can be born for humanity this next 5 or 10 years and 334 00:19:54,200 --> 00:19:59,320 there is going to be increasing polarization because some ideas 335 00:20:00,440 --> 00:20:04,560 let's let's be honest, like people we can respect and and 336 00:20:04,560 --> 00:20:06,400 give respect to different opinions. 337 00:20:06,800 --> 00:20:09,400 That doesn't mean we have to agree and that all ideas are 338 00:20:09,400 --> 00:20:11,240 equal. There are things that are 339 00:20:11,360 --> 00:20:17,200 objectively better than others. And so, yeah, we need to be able 340 00:20:17,200 --> 00:20:21,600 to to come up with solutions that that can create the new 341 00:20:21,600 --> 00:20:24,320 systems for what's emerging. Because let's be honest, like, 342 00:20:25,040 --> 00:20:29,440 and, and I think millennials, like your audience, millennials 343 00:20:29,440 --> 00:20:33,480 have a big role to play on what's going to be created for 344 00:20:33,480 --> 00:20:35,200 the, for the world that's emerging. 345 00:20:36,440 --> 00:20:40,800 You know, I think they're the an archetypal kind of generation 346 00:20:41,120 --> 00:20:44,480 that's in between. We were born with technology, 347 00:20:46,160 --> 00:20:50,000 but just as it was emerging. So we kind of see what's, what's 348 00:20:50,000 --> 00:20:52,400 taking place. And I think we have a, a big 349 00:20:52,400 --> 00:20:55,520 role to play in, in what's going to emerge. 350 00:20:57,040 --> 00:21:00,280 But yeah, I, I totally agree with you that detention is, is 351 00:21:00,280 --> 00:21:02,720 good. And on the other, on the flip 352 00:21:02,720 --> 00:21:07,880 side of it, like if we get it wrong and we don't upshift 353 00:21:07,880 --> 00:21:12,840 consciousness and it's still like this, this dualistic 354 00:21:12,840 --> 00:21:17,200 fighting forever, we'll just have new technology to like 355 00:21:18,800 --> 00:21:22,520 accelerate the demise of what didn't work in the existing 356 00:21:22,520 --> 00:21:26,360 system. Yeah, which is obviously a nudge 357 00:21:26,360 --> 00:21:30,040 to AI that that we'll get into. But before we dive into that, 358 00:21:30,040 --> 00:21:35,080 yeah, you know, there's a more global shift in consciousness 359 00:21:35,080 --> 00:21:40,880 happening, you know, true paradigm shifts, if I may, You 360 00:21:40,880 --> 00:21:45,800 know, how based on what you've studied and, and come across, 361 00:21:45,800 --> 00:21:50,640 how do you look at what is happening there and maybe a bit 362 00:21:50,640 --> 00:21:53,840 more in general to take people along, Like how do individuals 363 00:21:53,840 --> 00:21:57,960 and and yeah, societies evolve through, you know, breakdown, 364 00:21:57,960 --> 00:22:01,040 insights, integration, growth, etcetera, like this, this kind 365 00:22:01,040 --> 00:22:04,200 of like eternal loop of, of their development. 366 00:22:05,600 --> 00:22:07,680 Yeah, I've done a lot of studying. 367 00:22:07,720 --> 00:22:10,320 One of my interests is developmental psychology. 368 00:22:10,560 --> 00:22:13,240 So, you know, for those that are interested, I don't want to get 369 00:22:13,240 --> 00:22:16,840 too into the weeds of, you know, developmental theory, people's 370 00:22:16,840 --> 00:22:20,440 eyes will glaze over. But you know, people like Ken 371 00:22:20,440 --> 00:22:23,720 Wilber, if people are interested in looking at his frameworks, 372 00:22:23,720 --> 00:22:25,240 they've, they've really influenced me. 373 00:22:25,560 --> 00:22:30,920 The, you know, the gist of, of that, that domain, it's come 374 00:22:30,920 --> 00:22:33,120 online in the last 50 or so years. 375 00:22:33,720 --> 00:22:37,600 And it's that individuals, you know, we see it in childhood, 376 00:22:37,760 --> 00:22:40,520 like children grow through different stages of 377 00:22:40,520 --> 00:22:43,840 consciousness. New capabilities come online and 378 00:22:43,840 --> 00:22:46,160 it's like a, it's a nested system. 379 00:22:46,160 --> 00:22:48,640 So very much like Bitcoin, you need the base layer to be 380 00:22:48,640 --> 00:22:53,040 healthy and then there's new capability and more complexity 381 00:22:53,040 --> 00:22:57,560 that comes online with each new phase of consciousness or 382 00:22:57,560 --> 00:23:00,560 growth. And so there's different shifts 383 00:23:00,560 --> 00:23:03,600 that happen. We don't need to go into detail 384 00:23:03,600 --> 00:23:08,040 into all of the exact shifts, but they're finding that those 385 00:23:08,040 --> 00:23:11,240 same shifts happened throughout adulthood. 386 00:23:11,400 --> 00:23:17,600 So adults continue to develop new capacities come online and 387 00:23:17,600 --> 00:23:19,400 you're able to hold more complexity. 388 00:23:19,520 --> 00:23:22,920 And it's not to say that those base layer really black and 389 00:23:22,920 --> 00:23:26,320 white things that you learned as a as a child aren't, aren't 390 00:23:26,320 --> 00:23:28,920 useful anymore. You have to build on top of them 391 00:23:28,920 --> 00:23:34,160 and know what to use when. And so individuals develop 392 00:23:34,160 --> 00:23:39,160 through these and to shift at certain stages is profoundly 393 00:23:39,160 --> 00:23:43,840 disorienting because you have to shed what you thought and who 394 00:23:43,840 --> 00:23:48,200 your identity had been built to let something new emerge. 395 00:23:48,200 --> 00:23:52,960 And so, you know, that happens in like midlife crisises that 396 00:23:52,960 --> 00:23:55,840 people are going through. There's an identity shift that's 397 00:23:55,840 --> 00:23:57,400 happening. And you know, if you, if you're 398 00:23:57,400 --> 00:24:01,240 not willing to let go of the old identity and let something new 399 00:24:01,240 --> 00:24:05,360 emerge, that can get really hairy and, and challenging. 400 00:24:05,360 --> 00:24:10,520 And so, but those same shifts that happened for individuals, 401 00:24:11,000 --> 00:24:15,120 society goes through those exact same stages as a collective. 402 00:24:15,640 --> 00:24:19,240 And so, you know, my opinion is that right now we're going 403 00:24:19,240 --> 00:24:25,080 through a, a pretty big shift in a developmental stage within 404 00:24:25,080 --> 00:24:27,440 society. And that leads to a lot of 405 00:24:27,440 --> 00:24:31,600 discomfort because the old systems that used to work and 406 00:24:31,600 --> 00:24:33,720 that were beneficial for us, that got us through the 407 00:24:33,720 --> 00:24:38,720 industrial revolution, you know, that that we could, we could 408 00:24:38,720 --> 00:24:42,200 create so many great things out of all of a sudden the, the 409 00:24:42,200 --> 00:24:46,080 Internet comes along and AI comes along and these systems 410 00:24:46,080 --> 00:24:50,640 just are not built for the speed of technology and the economic 411 00:24:50,640 --> 00:24:55,680 system that needs growth and debt and consumption forever and 412 00:24:55,680 --> 00:24:57,520 more jobs and all of those things. 413 00:24:57,960 --> 00:25:01,520 We've got these deflationary forces fighting exactly against 414 00:25:01,520 --> 00:25:04,320 it. And so there has to be a new 415 00:25:04,320 --> 00:25:07,400 operating system. So that's what I look at like 416 00:25:07,400 --> 00:25:11,960 each stage of development, it's kind of like upgrading the OS to 417 00:25:11,960 --> 00:25:15,120 this new operating system and it builds on the old, you know, 418 00:25:15,120 --> 00:25:17,800 there's things that were built on the old OS that you still 419 00:25:17,800 --> 00:25:20,840 need, but you need a whole a whole new operating system. 420 00:25:20,840 --> 00:25:23,720 And so that's where I think we're at collectively. 421 00:25:24,400 --> 00:25:29,960 And you know, it's technological and it's in, it's distinctly 422 00:25:30,000 --> 00:25:34,600 related to consciousness. So my experience in making these 423 00:25:34,600 --> 00:25:39,280 big shifts is that it can be really hard and you can go 424 00:25:39,280 --> 00:25:42,040 through some disorienting periods. 425 00:25:42,320 --> 00:25:44,720 And I think that's what's happening with us globally. 426 00:25:45,040 --> 00:25:49,320 And so, you know, there's a tendency to like resort back to 427 00:25:49,320 --> 00:25:51,840 the old ways. When something new is shifting 428 00:25:51,840 --> 00:25:56,160 that's unknown, you'll actually resort back to like the stage 429 00:25:56,160 --> 00:25:59,200 below because it's more certain. And so that's what I see 430 00:25:59,200 --> 00:26:02,240 happening in government and in these different things is like, 431 00:26:02,240 --> 00:26:06,400 we're grasping back onto the old ways of like authoritarianism 432 00:26:06,400 --> 00:26:08,920 and, you know, people just telling us what's right and 433 00:26:08,920 --> 00:26:13,080 wrong. And that just isn't going to 434 00:26:13,080 --> 00:26:15,120 work. So we have to make space for the 435 00:26:15,120 --> 00:26:17,080 new to emerge. But it's totally unknown. 436 00:26:17,520 --> 00:26:22,200 And it's disorienting because there is no map for what for 437 00:26:22,200 --> 00:26:24,000 what's being built. We have to go build it. 438 00:26:24,560 --> 00:26:29,080 I also saw in another podcast you did, like you mentioned that 439 00:26:29,080 --> 00:26:31,840 consciousness develops in predictable terms, right? 440 00:26:31,840 --> 00:26:36,520 It's not like a like a woo woo type thing, but more like you 441 00:26:36,520 --> 00:26:39,920 mentioned the upgrading the, the operating system, but that goes 442 00:26:40,000 --> 00:26:43,160 through kind of like seasons right there, spring and summer. 443 00:26:43,160 --> 00:26:45,720 And then, you know, that's, that's the seasons of life and 444 00:26:45,720 --> 00:26:48,880 then you have seasons of death and you have to prepare for the 445 00:26:48,880 --> 00:26:51,760 new year again, right? And so I think what we're 446 00:26:51,760 --> 00:26:55,760 talking about is those seasons, but on a different level of 447 00:26:55,760 --> 00:26:59,840 where, you know, humanity is in in time and space. 448 00:27:00,240 --> 00:27:03,080 And I think this is a nice segue into AI there. 449 00:27:03,080 --> 00:27:09,040 There is a reason that AI and and Bitcoin and this larger 450 00:27:09,040 --> 00:27:12,040 global shift in consciousness are happening at the same time, 451 00:27:12,040 --> 00:27:16,920 because like you said, how are you going to value the extreme 452 00:27:16,920 --> 00:27:21,240 deflationary forces that AI brings as a technology? 453 00:27:21,240 --> 00:27:27,440 Like you cannot do that with the system that we've used to value, 454 00:27:27,440 --> 00:27:31,400 or at least price value, right, which is an inflationary force. 455 00:27:31,400 --> 00:27:34,120 And I think, you know, in, in Broken Money, Lynn Alden's book, 456 00:27:34,120 --> 00:27:37,640 she, she talks about this. And I think like that 457 00:27:37,640 --> 00:27:39,760 illustration is very, very powerful. 458 00:27:39,760 --> 00:27:43,640 Then you see that there's this this war going on between these 459 00:27:43,640 --> 00:27:50,800 forces that are basically going against some sort of natural way 460 00:27:50,800 --> 00:27:54,600 of change that just constantly happens. 461 00:27:55,920 --> 00:27:58,880 Yeah, there's, there's definitely a natural evolution. 462 00:27:59,080 --> 00:28:02,360 And the more I look at it in these different frameworks and 463 00:28:02,360 --> 00:28:04,920 all of these frameworks are just frameworks, they're just models. 464 00:28:04,920 --> 00:28:10,200 So, you know, like at some point even those models breakdown and 465 00:28:10,200 --> 00:28:14,080 we can't, those can't become a religion that we're so, you 466 00:28:14,080 --> 00:28:16,440 know, invested in that. It's the only way to view 467 00:28:16,440 --> 00:28:17,720 things. But I do think some of the 468 00:28:17,720 --> 00:28:20,160 models are helpful. And, you know, while you're 469 00:28:20,160 --> 00:28:22,960 talking, it's interesting, I think of like the 4th turning. 470 00:28:23,320 --> 00:28:25,520 I'm sure you're familiar with the 4th turning model. 471 00:28:26,840 --> 00:28:29,560 So there's that model and then there's, you know, all sorts of 472 00:28:29,560 --> 00:28:34,040 different models from different indigenous people, you know, the 473 00:28:34,040 --> 00:28:38,040 Kali Yuga. And what I'm seeing is like all 474 00:28:38,040 --> 00:28:42,800 of these models are converging on this time, like these next 10 475 00:28:42,800 --> 00:28:45,120 years or so. Like so many of the models are 476 00:28:45,120 --> 00:28:48,160 coming together pointing to massive change in humanity. 477 00:28:48,520 --> 00:28:52,640 And and then when you overlay it with the kind of developmental 478 00:28:53,200 --> 00:28:56,440 psychology models of the evolution of consciousness, I'm 479 00:28:56,440 --> 00:29:00,680 just starting to trust it that like this is how change happens. 480 00:29:00,760 --> 00:29:04,000 And you look at it across history, there's massive 481 00:29:04,000 --> 00:29:06,160 paradigm shifts that have to happen. 482 00:29:06,600 --> 00:29:10,200 And there's usually wars fought around it and massive breakdown 483 00:29:10,200 --> 00:29:14,640 and like a lot of suffering. But that's what has to happen 484 00:29:14,640 --> 00:29:21,360 for the new to emerge. And yeah, like I'm with you, AI. 485 00:29:21,680 --> 00:29:27,480 Yeah, like the, the more you study the the monetary system, I 486 00:29:27,480 --> 00:29:30,280 mean, try to make an argument for how this thing ends on the 487 00:29:30,280 --> 00:29:34,040 existing system, There's not a lot of intelligent arguments 488 00:29:34,040 --> 00:29:37,120 about how we fix the problems. It's just kicking the can down 489 00:29:37,120 --> 00:29:38,880 the road and it's getting more and more clear. 490 00:29:38,880 --> 00:29:42,120 It's the it's the root of so much of our dysfunction. 491 00:29:42,360 --> 00:29:46,280 And yeah, for it to continue to work, we need more money, more 492 00:29:46,280 --> 00:29:49,440 debt, more jobs. We need more everything. 493 00:29:49,680 --> 00:29:52,400 Like Jeff Boost said, you can't fix the climate crisis within 494 00:29:52,400 --> 00:29:55,360 that system because you have to have consumption forever. 495 00:29:55,840 --> 00:29:59,720 And so people think you can just throw more money at it. 496 00:29:59,720 --> 00:30:03,280 And then AI is coming in and taking jobs away. 497 00:30:03,680 --> 00:30:08,200 It's the productivity increases. I don't think, I don't think 498 00:30:08,200 --> 00:30:11,240 we're quite ready for what's going to happen with AI. 499 00:30:13,680 --> 00:30:16,640 If you want to self custody your Bitcoin stack, I recommend the 500 00:30:16,640 --> 00:30:19,760 Block Stream Jade Plus. I've been using this premium 501 00:30:19,760 --> 00:30:22,960 Bitcoin only hardware wallet for a few months now and I love its 502 00:30:22,960 --> 00:30:26,240 design and ease of use. 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Or, you know, one way that I 532 00:31:55,960 --> 00:32:01,000 look at it in some of these different traditions, like, you 533 00:32:01,000 --> 00:32:04,160 know, in the, in the Buddhist and, and in some of the more 534 00:32:04,160 --> 00:32:08,680 Eastern traditions, the yogic system, some of the systems in 535 00:32:08,680 --> 00:32:11,800 India and, and in the East in general, they're talking, 536 00:32:11,920 --> 00:32:14,720 they've talked for a long time how there's knowing in the mind, 537 00:32:15,280 --> 00:32:18,280 there's knowing in the heart and there's knowing in the body. 538 00:32:19,280 --> 00:32:23,240 And my opinion is that largely in the West, we've just 539 00:32:23,240 --> 00:32:25,120 worshipped the intellect in the mind. 540 00:32:26,040 --> 00:32:28,960 And if you're smart, like that's, that's one way of 541 00:32:28,960 --> 00:32:30,720 knowing in the mind is very powerful. 542 00:32:31,080 --> 00:32:37,360 But all of a sudden, like AI is severely outpacing our capacity 543 00:32:37,360 --> 00:32:41,000 for ones and zeros and binary mathematical logic and 544 00:32:41,000 --> 00:32:45,240 connecting ideas. And so, you know, what's the 545 00:32:45,240 --> 00:32:50,520 differentiator now from US versus AI? 546 00:32:50,520 --> 00:32:53,360 And it's a nervous system, it's a heart, it's a body, it's 547 00:32:53,360 --> 00:32:57,160 intuition and being able to contextualize all of this data. 548 00:32:57,800 --> 00:33:02,840 And, and so I think we have an opportunity with AI to like 549 00:33:02,840 --> 00:33:07,080 really tap into our nervous systems and have more regulated 550 00:33:07,080 --> 00:33:10,640 nervous systems because I think the existing financial system, 551 00:33:10,840 --> 00:33:13,680 the incentives make it so our our nervous systems are like 552 00:33:13,760 --> 00:33:18,760 totally over stimulated. You know, the mental health, 553 00:33:18,760 --> 00:33:21,560 anxiety, depression, all that is on the rise. 554 00:33:22,120 --> 00:33:26,840 And with this freedom that AI is going to bring, we have to learn 555 00:33:26,840 --> 00:33:28,800 to actually and bought be embodied. 556 00:33:29,160 --> 00:33:33,360 And I think that's going to be a trend for the next, you know, 557 00:33:33,680 --> 00:33:35,200 little bit. And the people who are most 558 00:33:35,200 --> 00:33:38,040 regulated and who are most embodied are going to have 559 00:33:38,120 --> 00:33:40,720 superpowers compared to the rest of society. 560 00:33:42,720 --> 00:33:44,320 So many things I'm thinking about. 561 00:33:44,520 --> 00:33:49,800 You just said Kali Yuga, which I think it's interesting because 562 00:33:49,800 --> 00:33:53,640 that touches, you know, so the so the, the Kali Yuga is like 563 00:33:53,680 --> 00:34:02,160 the, you could say like the, the cosmological phase that we're in 564 00:34:02,240 --> 00:34:05,560 or the astrological phase that we're in, however you approach 565 00:34:05,560 --> 00:34:08,000 that, right? So we're, we're, however we are 566 00:34:08,000 --> 00:34:11,560 moving to true the, the universe, you know, our, our 567 00:34:11,560 --> 00:34:16,360 solar system, etcetera, you know, moves, moves in cycles and 568 00:34:16,360 --> 00:34:20,120 it goes from basically true these seasons right from light 569 00:34:20,120 --> 00:34:24,800 to dark. And the Cali Yuga is the is, is, 570 00:34:24,840 --> 00:34:27,480 is like the winter of of that, right? 571 00:34:27,480 --> 00:34:35,800 So we're moving from that space in space basically to, to 572 00:34:35,800 --> 00:34:39,360 something new, right? And so if you believe that we 573 00:34:39,360 --> 00:34:42,480 are guided by something that is bigger than us, like literally 574 00:34:42,480 --> 00:34:46,639 our place in, in the in, in, in the universe, then that is 575 00:34:46,639 --> 00:34:51,840 something that is affecting, you know, our little meat suits here 576 00:34:51,840 --> 00:34:57,320 on, on, on Earth. And so that's why that you could 577 00:34:57,320 --> 00:35:00,360 see that it's a very natural thing and that like new, like 578 00:35:00,480 --> 00:35:04,280 the problems that are arising, but also the the solutions that 579 00:35:04,280 --> 00:35:06,280 are, that are bubbling up, right? 580 00:35:06,280 --> 00:35:08,560 That I think, you know, we're mentioning here, like Bitcoin, 581 00:35:08,600 --> 00:35:11,440 Bitcoin and AI are are are there for a reason. 582 00:35:13,120 --> 00:35:16,800 But how do we, how do we then? So I just want to touch upon 583 00:35:16,800 --> 00:35:18,960 that because you said Kelly, you guy, I think it's just, you 584 00:35:18,960 --> 00:35:20,840 know, for the for the people that are interested in that, 585 00:35:20,840 --> 00:35:26,280 Like it's when you dive into this consciousness rabbit hole 586 00:35:26,280 --> 00:35:28,400 again, right? There's there's parts of 587 00:35:28,400 --> 00:35:32,360 yourself that you find, but there's also a lot that you 588 00:35:32,360 --> 00:35:34,800 think is outside of you, but it's actually also happening 589 00:35:34,800 --> 00:35:36,840 inside of you, you know, like that. 590 00:35:36,880 --> 00:35:39,680 Yeah, as above. So below part basically. 591 00:35:41,360 --> 00:35:43,160 Yeah. And just my overarching point, 592 00:35:43,160 --> 00:35:46,240 there is just so many of these models are converging on this 593 00:35:46,240 --> 00:35:47,280 time. So. 594 00:35:47,400 --> 00:35:51,240 Whether you believe in them or not, Like, I just find it like, 595 00:35:51,240 --> 00:35:54,000 I just find it really interesting that like, you know, 596 00:35:54,120 --> 00:35:58,040 across different traditions and across the world, these these 597 00:35:58,040 --> 00:36:02,520 cycles, macro cycles that different cultures have been 598 00:36:02,520 --> 00:36:06,320 tracking, like so many of them are converging right now. 599 00:36:06,680 --> 00:36:08,800 Yeah. And I think there's something to 600 00:36:08,800 --> 00:36:12,960 that, yeah. Maybe a fun side fault is that 601 00:36:12,960 --> 00:36:20,600 that cycle is 28,000 years. So do you think that after one 602 00:36:20,600 --> 00:36:24,120 cycle people figured out this was multiple side? 603 00:36:24,120 --> 00:36:26,800 This was an actual cycle, right? It happens again? 604 00:36:27,160 --> 00:36:30,120 Or do you at least need a minimum of two of these cycles 605 00:36:30,120 --> 00:36:36,480 to have some sort of, you know, guess probability as to that? 606 00:36:36,480 --> 00:36:38,040 This is something that continues. 607 00:36:38,040 --> 00:36:40,960 So if you if you calculate that and then think about how far 608 00:36:40,960 --> 00:36:45,600 advanced you should be as a civilization, you will also end 609 00:36:45,600 --> 00:36:49,640 up in some corner realizing that what you think you know about 610 00:36:49,640 --> 00:36:53,000 civilization and how far they were in terms of technology and 611 00:36:53,000 --> 00:36:57,400 understanding the universe is also not aligned with the 612 00:36:57,400 --> 00:37:01,400 reality of this knowledge being present as well. 613 00:37:01,480 --> 00:37:02,160 Right. So yeah. 614 00:37:03,360 --> 00:37:06,320 And my thoughts are that, you know, this evolutionary process 615 00:37:06,400 --> 00:37:10,200 is really big and really long and can take a lot of time for 616 00:37:10,200 --> 00:37:15,200 humanity to evolve. And everything I'm seeing is 617 00:37:15,200 --> 00:37:19,120 pointing to like what we're about to go through in the next 618 00:37:19,120 --> 00:37:25,000 10 years being such a seismic shift that like, you know, what 619 00:37:25,000 --> 00:37:28,320 happens in centuries is going to happen in a few years. 620 00:37:28,320 --> 00:37:32,520 Like the, the amount of progress is, is really is going to be 621 00:37:32,520 --> 00:37:34,040 really fast. And I don't, I don't. 622 00:37:34,120 --> 00:37:36,840 So that's where I think it, it requires a whole new operating 623 00:37:36,840 --> 00:37:40,520 system in our nervous systems and the way we think, the way we 624 00:37:40,520 --> 00:37:43,000 engage with each other. I'm really excited about it. 625 00:37:43,320 --> 00:37:48,560 And I'm I'm inspired by the millennial kind of group. 626 00:37:48,640 --> 00:37:51,520 And I think that's why I'm excited to be on this podcast 627 00:37:51,520 --> 00:37:55,680 because I think millennials have a deep role to play in what's 628 00:37:55,880 --> 00:37:58,280 what's happening. So, yeah, well. 629 00:37:58,520 --> 00:38:04,680 I think we are in the place where we are moving into further 630 00:38:04,680 --> 00:38:07,920 adulthood 1. I think in further power 2 631 00:38:08,080 --> 00:38:10,760 right, Like so, so people are growing up, they're moving into 632 00:38:10,760 --> 00:38:15,520 certain positions, they're moving into wards more, more 633 00:38:15,520 --> 00:38:17,640 wealth, so. Yeah, more influence. 634 00:38:17,800 --> 00:38:19,920 Yeah, exactly. So they have they have more, 635 00:38:19,960 --> 00:38:24,040 more influence. So understanding the shifts that 636 00:38:24,040 --> 00:38:28,880 are happening and I think either what you can do with it or how 637 00:38:28,880 --> 00:38:33,080 you can contribute to it are are two very big topics and I think 638 00:38:33,400 --> 00:38:37,000 are under discussed. So I'm happy we are having this 639 00:38:37,320 --> 00:38:41,280 this conversation like, but how, how can we make this more 640 00:38:41,280 --> 00:38:45,680 practical? Like how can people view, I 641 00:38:45,680 --> 00:38:48,720 think we touched upon Bitcoin a bit, but like Bitcoin and AI as 642 00:38:48,720 --> 00:38:55,000 these external catalysts for these, these internal inquiries 643 00:38:55,000 --> 00:38:59,200 or shifts in, in consciousness. Like how have you experienced 644 00:38:59,200 --> 00:39:00,800 that? Or maybe how, how have you, what 645 00:39:00,800 --> 00:39:05,560 have you learned from, from other people that yeah, kind of 646 00:39:05,920 --> 00:39:07,440 this journey? Yeah. 647 00:39:07,440 --> 00:39:11,960 I mean, my view is that decentralization is this just 648 00:39:11,960 --> 00:39:14,360 overarching theme that's happening. 649 00:39:14,720 --> 00:39:17,200 And it's not just in the financial system. 650 00:39:17,560 --> 00:39:23,720 Like I see it happening in spirituality where people don't 651 00:39:23,720 --> 00:39:28,000 want to outsource like to some organization to just tell them 652 00:39:28,000 --> 00:39:30,720 what to believe. They want to experience it 653 00:39:30,720 --> 00:39:33,520 themselves. And so I think decentralized 654 00:39:33,520 --> 00:39:36,840 spirituality, the realization that like you were talking about 655 00:39:36,840 --> 00:39:40,480 how we're all one. And it's my belief that we're 656 00:39:40,720 --> 00:39:45,560 like the human, we are the supercomputer and we are all 657 00:39:45,680 --> 00:39:50,000 each a node on the network that's connected through ways 658 00:39:50,000 --> 00:39:53,640 that aren't typical, like we can't access through the typical 659 00:39:53,640 --> 00:39:58,080 human senses. But there's, there's a deeper 660 00:39:58,080 --> 00:40:02,320 connection that's happening. And so when you kind of exit the 661 00:40:02,320 --> 00:40:07,080 matrix and start to see life in a different way, when you go 662 00:40:07,080 --> 00:40:11,600 inward and you start to connect to like your own heart, your 663 00:40:11,600 --> 00:40:15,200 own. Your soul, what you're good at, 664 00:40:15,200 --> 00:40:19,800 your own passions, like the things that you know, like the 665 00:40:19,800 --> 00:40:23,200 question I like to ask is if money weren't a thing, if if I 666 00:40:23,200 --> 00:40:26,880 knew I, if money was taken care of and success was guaranteed, 667 00:40:27,160 --> 00:40:30,240 what would I go do? Like, what am I that passionate 668 00:40:30,240 --> 00:40:33,240 about that I can go build that helps humanity. 669 00:40:33,560 --> 00:40:36,720 And so I think Bitcoin allows us to be able to do that. 670 00:40:37,120 --> 00:40:40,280 And with more and more people tapping into that, like my 671 00:40:40,280 --> 00:40:45,560 belief is that we each have creative capacities and a 672 00:40:45,560 --> 00:40:49,720 purpose within us that can benefit humanity and that we can 673 00:40:49,960 --> 00:40:54,080 have joy and like, have a ton of energy to work toward. 674 00:40:54,360 --> 00:40:57,760 But the existing financial system doesn't allow that. 675 00:40:58,200 --> 00:41:00,960 It stifles creativity from a really young age. 676 00:41:00,960 --> 00:41:02,600 It tells you exactly what to believe. 677 00:41:02,960 --> 00:41:06,000 It just turns into you into a productivity worker that has to 678 00:41:06,000 --> 00:41:10,280 go, you know, just beat inflation and and you're you're 679 00:41:10,280 --> 00:41:14,160 stuck and you can't tap into like those deeper capacities 680 00:41:14,440 --> 00:41:17,600 that are inside of you. And so the more you can do some 681 00:41:17,600 --> 00:41:20,880 of that inner work and deconstruct your own and do some 682 00:41:20,880 --> 00:41:24,800 of that challenging work, I find the more it opens up for you to 683 00:41:24,800 --> 00:41:30,400 be more spontaneous and to like really see what it is that you 684 00:41:30,400 --> 00:41:33,000 can bring to the world. And so if we can get more 685 00:41:33,000 --> 00:41:38,800 Bitcoiners to awaken to that and like really follow their own, 686 00:41:40,000 --> 00:41:45,280 their own souls purpose with the knowledge of Bitcoin and some of 687 00:41:45,280 --> 00:41:49,720 these systems, like we can build so many amazing things on top of 688 00:41:49,720 --> 00:41:52,280 it that can, that can benefit everybody. 689 00:41:52,800 --> 00:41:56,320 And in a deflationary world where where money gets more 690 00:41:56,320 --> 00:41:59,440 valuable over time, we have the time to do that. 691 00:41:59,440 --> 00:42:02,520 And just imagine a world where people are so connected and have 692 00:42:02,520 --> 00:42:05,560 energy because they're doing what they like and they're doing 693 00:42:05,560 --> 00:42:08,520 what they enjoy. I think this next 10 to 15 years 694 00:42:08,520 --> 00:42:10,600 is going to allow us to do that if we get it right. 695 00:42:13,320 --> 00:42:17,840 Yeah, I, I, I fully agree. I don't, I don't think that's a 696 00:42:17,840 --> 00:42:23,120 surprise, but I, I also, I'm just realizing that not many 697 00:42:23,120 --> 00:42:26,960 people are talking about this And, and also how again, you 698 00:42:26,960 --> 00:42:29,520 know, this ties it back to the money. 699 00:42:29,520 --> 00:42:34,920 And I think what you just said is exactly why I said, you know, 700 00:42:35,320 --> 00:42:39,880 the, the broken money also keeps you stuck in this physical 701 00:42:39,880 --> 00:42:42,520 reality or in your body too much, right? 702 00:42:42,520 --> 00:42:46,760 Like feeling that anxiety or the the growing uncertainty towards 703 00:42:46,760 --> 00:42:49,120 the future and the worrying about the future. 704 00:42:49,120 --> 00:42:51,520 Or disconnected from your body because you don't want to feel 705 00:42:51,520 --> 00:42:53,440 that. Like I actually think it's. 706 00:42:53,920 --> 00:42:56,040 Yeah. It's like causing us to not be 707 00:42:56,040 --> 00:42:58,240 connected to our body because it's like, I don't want to feel 708 00:42:58,240 --> 00:43:02,120 that I'm going to numb out with food and Netflix and weed and 709 00:43:02,120 --> 00:43:04,920 beer and, you know, whatever. To just, like, not feel how 710 00:43:04,920 --> 00:43:06,880 challenging reality is. Yeah, yeah. 711 00:43:07,560 --> 00:43:09,800 Yeah, exactly. So yeah, that's what I mean with 712 00:43:09,800 --> 00:43:12,040 the physical reality, like you're, you're stuck in that and 713 00:43:12,040 --> 00:43:15,760 you're staying in that, then there's no real yeah, you. 714 00:43:16,000 --> 00:43:20,920 But people don't have options or are not seeing the the 715 00:43:20,920 --> 00:43:24,680 possibility they have in themselves to, you know, step 716 00:43:24,680 --> 00:43:27,760 out of that. But I think Fiat money is a big 717 00:43:29,000 --> 00:43:33,440 catalyst in. Yeah, fear. 718 00:43:33,560 --> 00:43:36,280 Exploring the. Spiritual money is designed to 719 00:43:36,280 --> 00:43:40,080 keep you. Like, that was part of the 720 00:43:40,080 --> 00:43:43,960 paradigm shift is I just thought, wow, like, in a lot of 721 00:43:43,960 --> 00:43:49,000 ways, we're just modern slaves. And people hear that and they 722 00:43:49,000 --> 00:43:51,720 have a lot of resistance to it. Like, oh, no, look how far we've 723 00:43:51,720 --> 00:43:53,640 come as humanity. And I agree with that. 724 00:43:53,640 --> 00:43:56,040 Like, you know, we don't own slaves. 725 00:43:56,040 --> 00:43:59,000 But in a lot of ways, like, the system just keeps us so 726 00:43:59,000 --> 00:44:02,520 entrenched and it stifles our creativity, our passion. 727 00:44:02,920 --> 00:44:05,920 Like, no wonder the mental health crisis is what it is 728 00:44:05,920 --> 00:44:10,440 because, like, people don't have a lot of freedom to follow what 729 00:44:10,440 --> 00:44:14,120 they're, what they're, you know, system is telling them to do. 730 00:44:14,240 --> 00:44:18,680 Yeah. What we're talking about with 731 00:44:18,680 --> 00:44:24,000 Fiat money is that it's so invisible, like you don't know 732 00:44:24,000 --> 00:44:28,240 that you're a slave to debt because you spend your finite 733 00:44:28,240 --> 00:44:33,560 time and energy to get a reward. That another person that as we 734 00:44:33,560 --> 00:44:37,880 talked about, is the same as you and me in its essence, right, 735 00:44:38,160 --> 00:44:41,960 coming from the eternal consciousness, is using a system 736 00:44:42,120 --> 00:44:48,280 made by other people to gain an advantage over you. 737 00:44:48,600 --> 00:44:53,280 So they can print units of a money at will by the Press of a 738 00:44:53,280 --> 00:44:57,840 button and therefore devalue the reward that you got for 739 00:44:57,840 --> 00:44:59,960 expending your finite energy and time. 740 00:45:00,280 --> 00:45:04,520 And if you just, you know, take yourself out of the equation and 741 00:45:04,520 --> 00:45:08,200 just look at it objectively, you know, trading, you know, as a 742 00:45:08,200 --> 00:45:11,440 human trading finite time and energy for a reward that other 743 00:45:11,440 --> 00:45:17,200 people know better than you can create infinitely at will is the 744 00:45:17,200 --> 00:45:19,720 dumbest thing that you can do. And as long as you're not aware 745 00:45:19,720 --> 00:45:25,160 of that, you're a slave to those people literally, right? 746 00:45:25,160 --> 00:45:29,120 And because also in this, in a debt based money system, when 747 00:45:29,120 --> 00:45:36,120 you take on debt and the units you use to to pay it off get 748 00:45:36,120 --> 00:45:40,680 worth less and less, You know, you were just being put on this 749 00:45:40,680 --> 00:45:44,360 hamster wheel that if you don't understand what you're doing, 750 00:45:44,360 --> 00:45:48,080 which ties into the beginning of our conversation, you are 751 00:45:48,080 --> 00:45:53,440 totally unaware of, of what is happening to you. 752 00:45:53,480 --> 00:45:56,240 And you just think you're, you're doing it because everyone 753 00:45:56,240 --> 00:45:58,840 is doing it right. Yeah, that is what we do. 754 00:45:59,040 --> 00:46:03,320 Life, yeah. Yeah, and it the system needs 755 00:46:03,320 --> 00:46:09,040 more and every generation it takes more money to live the 756 00:46:09,040 --> 00:46:12,560 same kind of a lifestyle. Like if you look at in the 80s 757 00:46:12,560 --> 00:46:17,000 in the US at least, like I look at, you could live on one income 758 00:46:17,000 --> 00:46:21,680 in the 80s and you could have like a house and maybe a 759 00:46:21,680 --> 00:46:24,560 vacation home and like all the things. 760 00:46:24,560 --> 00:46:29,000 And now to like do that, you need two people working and the 761 00:46:29,000 --> 00:46:31,440 amount of debt and leverage that you need to live that kind of 762 00:46:31,440 --> 00:46:35,200 lifestyle. And yeah, the, the whole system 763 00:46:35,200 --> 00:46:42,200 is, is, is extractive, meaning that, you know, they, they steal 764 00:46:42,360 --> 00:46:46,240 your wealth via inflation, but they just want it to be at 2 or 765 00:46:46,240 --> 00:46:52,160 3% so that it's not enough to where you really feel it. 766 00:46:52,600 --> 00:46:54,200 They just wanted to be invisible. 767 00:46:54,400 --> 00:46:57,320 And yeah, this, this question, like if, if someone's new 768 00:46:57,320 --> 00:47:00,800 getting into this, it's like, I just always thought that 769 00:47:00,800 --> 00:47:04,560 inflation was like this natural thing that just happened. 770 00:47:04,840 --> 00:47:08,400 Like things get more expensive. That's, that's just how markets 771 00:47:08,400 --> 00:47:11,400 work. And it's like, no, that's 772 00:47:11,400 --> 00:47:15,040 actually not the nature of a, of a true free market. 773 00:47:15,040 --> 00:47:20,200 That's just because, you know, somebody can create money out of 774 00:47:20,200 --> 00:47:23,960 nothing and it steals from everybody else. 775 00:47:24,080 --> 00:47:28,840 Like the very nature of the Fiat system is based on theft. 776 00:47:31,840 --> 00:47:33,760 Yeah, that's wild. Don't you think that's 777 00:47:33,760 --> 00:47:38,680 realization is, yeah, I think the fork in the road, if you 778 00:47:38,680 --> 00:47:43,680 think when you're listening, well, you know, some some people 779 00:47:43,680 --> 00:47:48,080 that listen regularly know this stuff somewhere or to a deeper 780 00:47:48,080 --> 00:47:49,560 level. But if you're hearing this for 781 00:47:49,560 --> 00:47:53,400 the first time, I think this is exactly what I meant with the 782 00:47:53,400 --> 00:47:58,600 fork in the roads. So don't, don't, don't assume 783 00:47:58,600 --> 00:48:02,040 that what we are saying is correct without doing any of 784 00:48:02,040 --> 00:48:05,360 your research. Do your own research and try to 785 00:48:05,360 --> 00:48:09,200 figure out if what we're talking about is correct or not right? 786 00:48:09,200 --> 00:48:12,000 That's the only way for you to actually get to the fork in a 787 00:48:12,000 --> 00:48:14,520 road. And then think about, OK, what 788 00:48:14,520 --> 00:48:18,400 do I do with this information? Well, one, how do I go through 789 00:48:18,920 --> 00:48:23,000 the confrontation with the fact that I was probably super 790 00:48:23,000 --> 00:48:26,520 unconscious about this part of my reality? 791 00:48:28,160 --> 00:48:31,400 And then after that, it's kind of like, what do I do with this? 792 00:48:31,800 --> 00:48:35,840 Do I ignore this because it's super super uncomfortable? 793 00:48:36,880 --> 00:48:38,840 I'm pretty fucked up. Especially the older you are, 794 00:48:38,840 --> 00:48:42,600 the more fucked up it is I think to realize and the harder also 795 00:48:42,600 --> 00:48:44,880 to. And the more you realize, like, 796 00:48:45,320 --> 00:48:48,240 if you have kids, like, I know you have kids, I have kids, the 797 00:48:48,240 --> 00:48:51,440 more you realize that like, oh, it's just disproportionately 798 00:48:51,440 --> 00:48:54,800 affecting each generation. And millennials have felt it 799 00:48:54,800 --> 00:48:56,600 compared to like the boomer generation. 800 00:48:56,800 --> 00:49:00,400 Just imagine if we continue in this system, like what that's 801 00:49:00,400 --> 00:49:04,200 going to look like for our kids, They will own nothing like that. 802 00:49:04,200 --> 00:49:07,120 You know, that's just how it's going to end up being. 803 00:49:07,520 --> 00:49:12,080 And so, yeah, for that, for that fact alone, for the future 804 00:49:12,080 --> 00:49:18,200 generation, it's a worthy cause. And so when we think about, you 805 00:49:18,200 --> 00:49:24,640 know, the proliferation of AI, the increasingly accelerating 806 00:49:24,720 --> 00:49:26,920 deflationary forces behind that, right? 807 00:49:26,920 --> 00:49:30,320 Like if centuries are going to happen in the, in the next 10 808 00:49:30,320 --> 00:49:34,360 years. And this is how I talk about AI, 809 00:49:34,360 --> 00:49:39,640 like AI is democratizing productivity amongst people, but 810 00:49:39,640 --> 00:49:42,080 also eventually amongst the machines, right? 811 00:49:42,080 --> 00:49:48,120 Yep. So your cognition is enhanced to 812 00:49:48,120 --> 00:49:52,240 a degree, like it's enhanced with this thing in your hands, 813 00:49:52,240 --> 00:49:54,520 right? You're basically a Cyborg with 814 00:49:54,520 --> 00:49:56,640 the phone in your hand. Like the, the, the, the 815 00:49:56,680 --> 00:50:00,280 technology is an extension of your, your body and your brain 816 00:50:00,280 --> 00:50:07,120 to that, to that sense, right? But AI is, is, is a few steps 817 00:50:07,120 --> 00:50:10,040 even further. So on one side, you're enhanced 818 00:50:10,040 --> 00:50:13,800 with this technology. On the other side, your 819 00:50:15,200 --> 00:50:18,760 intellect is also being harvested in a sense by AI, 820 00:50:18,760 --> 00:50:20,680 right? And there will be this global 821 00:50:21,520 --> 00:50:26,480 BLOB of human intellect that's also being democratized. 822 00:50:26,480 --> 00:50:29,360 So yeah, how do you look at that? 823 00:50:29,360 --> 00:50:36,240 Like, how do people. Yeah, I'm thinking about what to 824 00:50:36,240 --> 00:50:41,320 say, like, how what are the risks to the evolving of human 825 00:50:41,320 --> 00:50:43,800 consciousness if we don't understand this? 826 00:50:43,800 --> 00:50:47,320 Because I do feel that if you don't understand what is 827 00:50:47,320 --> 00:50:52,000 happening with AI, it's going to be a big shock when you realize 828 00:50:52,000 --> 00:50:58,120 what is happening, which is this basically dissolvement of your 829 00:50:58,120 --> 00:51:00,400 human intellect. I don't know how else to define 830 00:51:00,400 --> 00:51:01,640 it. Maybe you have a better one. 831 00:51:02,920 --> 00:51:06,400 If you're not prepared for that, it's going to be very hard 832 00:51:06,400 --> 00:51:08,440 mentally. So how do you look at that kind 833 00:51:08,440 --> 00:51:11,240 of like clash that's going on? And maybe also, where does 834 00:51:11,400 --> 00:51:17,320 Bitcoin tie into that for you? Yeah, like with I think 835 00:51:17,320 --> 00:51:21,440 decentralization like I said, is this big theme and that's part 836 00:51:21,440 --> 00:51:26,360 of the risk with AI, as if if AI is just used to centralized more 837 00:51:26,360 --> 00:51:30,480 and more power and control in the hands of a few, which I 838 00:51:30,480 --> 00:51:33,040 think is happening. You see the the amount of 839 00:51:33,040 --> 00:51:35,760 investments going into these big AI companies. 840 00:51:36,840 --> 00:51:40,720 And if there's only a few people that are programming how AI is 841 00:51:40,720 --> 00:51:44,240 responding to everybody, like you can influence the minds of 842 00:51:45,040 --> 00:51:48,480 everyone that's interacting with it through these subtle tweaks. 843 00:51:49,080 --> 00:51:53,400 And so that's a huge risk, in my opinion, is the centralization 844 00:51:53,400 --> 00:51:56,840 of AI. And if it's just used based on 845 00:51:56,840 --> 00:52:01,920 the old consciousness of control and manipulation, then all it's 846 00:52:01,920 --> 00:52:06,400 going to do is just exacerbate the problems that we've had in 847 00:52:06,400 --> 00:52:11,000 the existing system. And so I don't really have any 848 00:52:11,000 --> 00:52:18,680 good answers, but you know, I think one thing is once AI gets 849 00:52:18,680 --> 00:52:21,520 more smart and you need to interact with it with money, why 850 00:52:21,520 --> 00:52:24,840 would an AI accept any money that can just be created out of 851 00:52:24,840 --> 00:52:28,040 nothing? I think Bitcoin will become the 852 00:52:28,040 --> 00:52:31,000 native currency that an AI is going to want to use. 853 00:52:31,200 --> 00:52:34,480 So there's that side of it. And then the other side is this, 854 00:52:34,920 --> 00:52:39,560 how can we create decentralized AI systems where people can have 855 00:52:39,560 --> 00:52:43,760 choice to plug into the, to the models and have it be open 856 00:52:43,760 --> 00:52:48,440 source? And so you can see what the bias 857 00:52:48,440 --> 00:52:50,760 is on what's, what's programmed into it. 858 00:52:51,080 --> 00:52:54,720 Because if we're just trusting these, these big institutions 859 00:52:55,160 --> 00:52:59,800 and if there's been, there's malintent behind it, that's 860 00:52:59,800 --> 00:53:03,000 going to create all sorts of downstream consequences. 861 00:53:03,520 --> 00:53:06,720 And so that's where I think the consciousness piece, like the 862 00:53:07,360 --> 00:53:10,880 the more mature stages of consciousness, you can start to 863 00:53:10,880 --> 00:53:14,720 see all of these complex adaptive systems and the 864 00:53:14,720 --> 00:53:19,560 question becomes like, cool, there's all this technology that 865 00:53:19,560 --> 00:53:23,680 I'm using and it's doing all of these amazing things. 866 00:53:24,520 --> 00:53:29,040 Is it doing good or is it harming people downstream? 867 00:53:29,440 --> 00:53:34,880 And so, yeah, like AI, in my opinion, is only as only as 868 00:53:34,880 --> 00:53:38,280 useful as the consciousness behind it, the human 869 00:53:38,280 --> 00:53:39,960 consciousness that's programming it. 870 00:53:40,240 --> 00:53:43,680 So if we don't have, again, people that are awakened and can 871 00:53:43,680 --> 00:53:46,280 see all these different perspectives and that have 872 00:53:46,280 --> 00:53:50,960 humanity's best interest at heart, then whatever's 873 00:53:50,960 --> 00:53:54,840 programming, it is just going to be programmed for war and hatred 874 00:53:54,840 --> 00:53:57,200 and division and all of the exist, all of the things that 875 00:53:57,200 --> 00:53:59,280 the existing system already does. 876 00:54:00,680 --> 00:54:02,760 It's just putting gasoline on the fire. 877 00:54:04,560 --> 00:54:07,840 So there's a risk, there's a massive risk to it. 878 00:54:07,880 --> 00:54:13,120 And if we can get it right, like there's so much potential, but 879 00:54:13,120 --> 00:54:20,720 it's, yeah, the next 10 years are going to be quite crazy. 880 00:54:23,080 --> 00:54:27,480 Think one of the things that I learned along the way is there's 881 00:54:27,480 --> 00:54:30,320 always a good and bad, right? There's no good without bad, and 882 00:54:30,320 --> 00:54:33,800 there's no bad without without good, and so there's always. 883 00:54:33,800 --> 00:54:38,000 Yeah, yeah, these. Two ways that it could go. 884 00:54:39,040 --> 00:54:41,680 There's always opposition and opposing forces and everything, 885 00:54:41,680 --> 00:54:42,480 yeah. Yeah. 886 00:54:42,480 --> 00:54:48,400 But well, if we go towards the positive direction, you know, 887 00:54:48,400 --> 00:54:51,600 that, that you mentioned, that doesn't mean there will also be 888 00:54:51,600 --> 00:54:56,280 people that, that, that, that aren't doing bad right there. 889 00:54:56,280 --> 00:54:59,880 There will always be people that totally, you know, bad, bad 890 00:54:59,880 --> 00:55:02,360 stuff. And by the way, you know, doing 891 00:55:02,360 --> 00:55:06,080 bad things for one person is actually doing a good thing, 892 00:55:06,080 --> 00:55:07,520 right? So that's also even that the 893 00:55:07,520 --> 00:55:10,360 whole perception of yeah, totally reality. 894 00:55:10,360 --> 00:55:16,080 However, you, you judge that. And so I'm thinking about how, 895 00:55:16,080 --> 00:55:18,360 how do you, how do we make this practical? 896 00:55:18,360 --> 00:55:20,600 I'm thinking you know this is happening anyway. 897 00:55:21,520 --> 00:55:24,240 Yeah, this is happening. Prepare for it, right? 898 00:55:24,240 --> 00:55:27,960 And think about the beginning of the conversation where we talked 899 00:55:27,960 --> 00:55:31,600 about, you know, the data and the Bitcoin time chain is a 900 00:55:31,600 --> 00:55:33,800 truth that you can anchor yourself to. 901 00:55:33,800 --> 00:55:38,640 And once you get there, it's an invitation to also walk or 902 00:55:38,640 --> 00:55:42,240 investigate, you know, the more inward path, path of 903 00:55:42,480 --> 00:55:45,720 consciousness or self realization. 904 00:55:45,720 --> 00:55:51,120 And perhaps getting there could kind of be like the antidote, 905 00:55:51,120 --> 00:55:54,400 like adopting Bitcoin plus trying to develop yourself in a 906 00:55:54,400 --> 00:55:58,960 more conscious way is a way to build a little bubble around you 907 00:55:58,960 --> 00:56:02,960 for the craziness that's going to happen because that craziness 908 00:56:03,280 --> 00:56:05,680 is going to be very hard to predict. 909 00:56:05,760 --> 00:56:10,440 You know, if AI is just a compounding technology in a 910 00:56:10,440 --> 00:56:15,120 sense, I mean, what what's I mean, like I said, it's Bitcoin 911 00:56:15,240 --> 00:56:18,600 AI consciousness for me. So every day I'm working with AI 912 00:56:18,600 --> 00:56:21,040 and trying to build stuff and seeing new tools and whatever it 913 00:56:21,520 --> 00:56:27,200 it's it's, it's crazy how much you can do in so little time and 914 00:56:27,200 --> 00:56:30,440 then to realize that this is the worst that AI will ever be 915 00:56:30,440 --> 00:56:32,920 today, right? It's already better. 916 00:56:32,920 --> 00:56:35,160 And like that, what you can already do is just. 917 00:56:35,840 --> 00:56:36,760 And it's mind. Boggling. 918 00:56:36,760 --> 00:56:39,960 And so I don't even think it's like 100 years in 10 years. 919 00:56:39,960 --> 00:56:42,960 I think it's probably going to be like 1000 years in 10 years, 920 00:56:43,040 --> 00:56:45,000 just from my personal experience with. 921 00:56:45,920 --> 00:56:48,440 I'm with you. Just the pace and seeing what 922 00:56:48,440 --> 00:56:52,280 you can do and so I'm. Hesitant because I don't want to 923 00:56:52,280 --> 00:56:55,520 scare people but I agree with. You, I think, I think it's, it's 924 00:56:55,520 --> 00:56:58,200 way more than you think, to be honest. 925 00:56:58,200 --> 00:56:59,560 Yeah. I don't think we're quite ready 926 00:56:59,560 --> 00:57:01,680 for it. And yeah, to your point, like 927 00:57:02,840 --> 00:57:06,320 that's where I think the more we can get, and this is starting to 928 00:57:06,320 --> 00:57:08,800 make its way into Bitcoin or conversation is like 929 00:57:09,520 --> 00:57:15,680 consciousness, inner work becoming like trusting yourself 930 00:57:15,680 --> 00:57:19,720 as a node and your own inner truth and knowing that there's 931 00:57:19,720 --> 00:57:23,440 something deep within you that you can trust and creating that 932 00:57:23,440 --> 00:57:28,480 capacity. And so, yeah, I'm actually, I 933 00:57:28,480 --> 00:57:32,160 think the more we can get Bitcoin or specifically to like 934 00:57:32,240 --> 00:57:36,880 awakened consciousness, there can be so much good that can be 935 00:57:36,880 --> 00:57:40,280 built. And so yeah, I'm actually, I'm 936 00:57:40,280 --> 00:57:44,200 launching this beta group. I have some ideas around kind of 937 00:57:44,200 --> 00:57:48,760 this Bitcoiner journey and overlaying it with the 938 00:57:48,760 --> 00:57:51,600 consciousness journey, doing some of the meditative breath 939 00:57:51,600 --> 00:57:53,880 work, like the inner work that we're talking about. 940 00:57:54,360 --> 00:57:57,560 And so if anyone's interested that that hears this, they can 941 00:57:57,560 --> 00:57:59,480 reach out. I've got a small group of 942 00:57:59,480 --> 00:58:02,200 Bitcoiners that I'm going to be doing this with to get some 943 00:58:02,200 --> 00:58:03,680 feedback on it. And then I'm going to be 944 00:58:03,680 --> 00:58:06,960 launching some offerings around it where we have, you know, 945 00:58:06,960 --> 00:58:11,360 groups of like 10 or 12 people. And we're comparing this 946 00:58:11,360 --> 00:58:14,560 Bitcoiner journey to this inner work, consciousness journey. 947 00:58:14,560 --> 00:58:17,520 For those that want to go inward and do some of this, this inner 948 00:58:17,520 --> 00:58:20,480 work and, you know, upgrade yourself, upgrade your own ego 949 00:58:21,840 --> 00:58:26,280 and, and learn how to be more embodied and, and come from a 950 00:58:26,280 --> 00:58:29,160 place of wholeness. So that's coming down the road 951 00:58:29,160 --> 00:58:30,360 for me. I'm excited about it. 952 00:58:30,560 --> 00:58:31,720 I love that. That's dope. 953 00:58:31,720 --> 00:58:34,560 See, that's what I love about Bitcoin is that didn't it 954 00:58:34,560 --> 00:58:41,240 invites anyone to eventually create something and participate 955 00:58:41,240 --> 00:58:44,160 and contribute in in their own way. 956 00:58:44,160 --> 00:58:46,240 So I absolutely love that you're doing that. 957 00:58:46,240 --> 00:58:52,120 Are there any like practical steps or, or mindsets you think 958 00:58:52,560 --> 00:58:55,600 people could adopt to kind of like navigate this period of 959 00:58:55,600 --> 00:59:01,240 transition or like how how would you help someone or invite 960 00:59:01,240 --> 00:59:04,560 someone who who is interested in in what we're talking about 961 00:59:04,560 --> 00:59:06,760 into? Yeah, like their next step. 962 00:59:09,040 --> 00:59:11,720 Yeah, I think stillness is really important. 963 00:59:14,080 --> 00:59:17,160 Finding space to like, I think we're over stimulated. 964 00:59:17,440 --> 00:59:21,200 I, I also think that with all of this information and the 965 00:59:21,200 --> 00:59:25,160 constant barrage of like dopamine that our systems are 966 00:59:25,160 --> 00:59:31,600 getting is creating nervous systems that I don't think 967 00:59:31,600 --> 00:59:34,840 humans nervous systems have ever been this overwhelmed in the 968 00:59:34,840 --> 00:59:40,240 history of our evolution. And so, yeah, I mean, I, I don't 969 00:59:40,240 --> 00:59:43,400 think our brains are wired for the amount of information that 970 00:59:43,400 --> 00:59:45,680 we consume. Like it's just never happened 971 00:59:45,680 --> 00:59:48,200 before. And so there's this barrage of 972 00:59:48,200 --> 00:59:53,480 information. And so learning to come and find 973 00:59:53,480 --> 01:00:02,000 stillness, disconnect from, you know, all of the the input and 974 01:00:02,000 --> 01:00:05,680 be able to go inward and like be with yourself, be with. 975 01:00:06,440 --> 01:00:10,480 The uncomfortable feelings and see what's there and really be 976 01:00:10,480 --> 01:00:14,920 like kind to yourself and give your your system space to be 977 01:00:14,920 --> 01:00:18,400 able to relax. That way, when you do engage 978 01:00:18,400 --> 01:00:21,560 with the technology and AI, you can come from a place of 979 01:00:22,480 --> 01:00:25,400 stillness and wholeness and where you're doing it 980 01:00:25,400 --> 01:00:29,960 consciously and you're choosing to build with it as opposed to 981 01:00:29,960 --> 01:00:35,040 like this constant need for more and more dopamine to distract 982 01:00:35,040 --> 01:00:37,120 from what we're actually feeling in the body. 983 01:00:37,440 --> 01:00:40,960 So yeah, a lot of my work is around embodiment, meditative 984 01:00:40,960 --> 01:00:48,040 work, breath work, somatic work, and, and figuring out like, you 985 01:00:48,040 --> 01:00:52,520 know, how is it that my own fears are showing up and what 986 01:00:52,520 --> 01:00:55,080 I'm building? How is it that my own fears are 987 01:00:55,080 --> 01:00:58,600 showing up in my relationships with those that I care about? 988 01:00:59,600 --> 01:01:01,760 Those types of things I think are really important. 989 01:01:01,760 --> 01:01:04,280 And then my experience is when you do some of that inner work 990 01:01:04,280 --> 01:01:07,640 and heal some of the parts of yourself, you know, this human 991 01:01:07,640 --> 01:01:12,440 experience is just overwhelming. We're all dealing with, you 992 01:01:12,440 --> 01:01:16,880 know, different traumas and things that our bodies have have 993 01:01:16,880 --> 01:01:19,400 dealt with and different reactions to it. 994 01:01:19,840 --> 01:01:24,560 And so giving ourselves space to heal and I think to also be 995 01:01:24,560 --> 01:01:29,280 connected to the Earth, time outside in nature is and there's 996 01:01:29,440 --> 01:01:32,280 lots of new research that's that's showing up for that. 997 01:01:32,280 --> 01:01:35,520 And so, yeah, I think it's a return back to like slowing down 998 01:01:35,520 --> 01:01:37,800 a little bit, slow down so you can go fast. 999 01:01:38,320 --> 01:01:42,440 And yeah, I have a lot of other thoughts on it, but I think 1000 01:01:42,600 --> 01:01:46,760 inner work to to really heal your own nervous system and come 1001 01:01:46,760 --> 01:01:49,960 from a place of wholeness and abundance and stillness is 1002 01:01:49,960 --> 01:01:52,840 what's needed in this fast-paced, crazy world that 1003 01:01:52,840 --> 01:01:57,160 we're living in. Yeah, I absolutely love that. 1004 01:01:57,160 --> 01:02:02,000 I think this is also what we're seeing like more and more people 1005 01:02:02,000 --> 01:02:05,720 are moving towards that, although I think we also see the 1006 01:02:05,720 --> 01:02:11,280 polarity grow. But I'm, I'm thinking about how 1007 01:02:11,280 --> 01:02:16,120 I view Bitcoin is this parallel mirror right to, to Fiat the 1008 01:02:16,120 --> 01:02:18,760 money. And so as long as Bitcoin 1009 01:02:18,760 --> 01:02:24,520 exists, you have something to to push against this predatory Fiat 1010 01:02:24,520 --> 01:02:28,040 money system. And I think when the people that 1011 01:02:28,040 --> 01:02:34,560 adopt Bitcoin show that they are less anxious, more happy, more 1012 01:02:34,560 --> 01:02:40,960 optimistic about the future, better prepared for this time 1013 01:02:40,960 --> 01:02:47,480 where, you know, all these big cycles, but also, you know, 1014 01:02:48,480 --> 01:02:51,120 technological advancements in our reality are actually 1015 01:02:51,120 --> 01:02:53,080 happening. That if we are better prepared 1016 01:02:53,080 --> 01:02:56,640 for that, that will also be an invitation for for the people 1017 01:02:56,640 --> 01:02:58,960 that are on this this other path, right? 1018 01:02:58,960 --> 01:03:04,520 And they will be looking at us thinking like, why why aren't 1019 01:03:04,520 --> 01:03:07,200 they so affected by this craziness here? 1020 01:03:07,200 --> 01:03:08,720 Like, why aren't they captured by that? 1021 01:03:08,720 --> 01:03:11,480 What am I actually doing right? And then getting to that point 1022 01:03:11,480 --> 01:03:13,280 that we started the conversation with. 1023 01:03:13,280 --> 01:03:18,240 It's just the realization of am I doing what I'm doing in a 1024 01:03:18,240 --> 01:03:24,200 conscious way or not? And if I'm OK enough or brave 1025 01:03:24,200 --> 01:03:27,360 enough or however you want to call it to accept that I'm doing 1026 01:03:27,360 --> 01:03:29,640 all these things in the totally unconscious way. 1027 01:03:30,280 --> 01:03:32,560 OK, what? What do I do now? 1028 01:03:32,720 --> 01:03:34,440 Right. And then that is the invitation 1029 01:03:34,440 --> 01:03:41,880 to perhaps cross the bridge to yeah, that that other side and 1030 01:03:41,880 --> 01:03:45,000 and improving. Totally, and going back to like 1031 01:03:45,000 --> 01:03:48,000 what we talked about earlier, there is this we need to like 1032 01:03:48,000 --> 01:03:51,400 talk about Bitcoin and spread the the good news to people. 1033 01:03:51,720 --> 01:03:55,360 You know, we talked about that and you know, if it's obviously 1034 01:03:55,360 --> 01:03:58,280 if it's coming from this need to be right like that can be met 1035 01:03:58,280 --> 01:04:01,200 with resistance. But my experience too, like all 1036 01:04:01,200 --> 01:04:07,200 the people that I've told about Bitcoin for years, there's an 1037 01:04:07,200 --> 01:04:10,680 interesting thing that happens when they just watch you and 1038 01:04:10,680 --> 01:04:13,840 your conviction and what it enables for you in your life and 1039 01:04:13,840 --> 01:04:18,520 how you're able to embody the values that Bitcoin that you're 1040 01:04:18,520 --> 01:04:20,880 preaching. How can you really live that? 1041 01:04:21,000 --> 01:04:24,360 Like, that speaks more than any words that you could say. 1042 01:04:24,360 --> 01:04:27,800 And that's what I hear you saying is like, oh, people start 1043 01:04:27,800 --> 01:04:29,840 to see, hey, what's going on with these Bitcoiners? 1044 01:04:29,840 --> 01:04:33,240 I started to see it in 2018-2019 when I was listening to them. 1045 01:04:33,440 --> 01:04:35,400 I didn't quite know what they were talking about. 1046 01:04:35,640 --> 01:04:37,760 A lot of their ideas made me uncomfortable. 1047 01:04:38,000 --> 01:04:42,600 It challenged my worldview, but it felt like they were on to 1048 01:04:42,600 --> 01:04:45,600 something and they had a different view on reality. 1049 01:04:46,080 --> 01:04:49,080 And then when you watch and see what Bitcoin enables in your 1050 01:04:49,080 --> 01:04:52,960 life and you know, don't get me wrong, there's still Bitcoiners 1051 01:04:52,960 --> 01:04:56,520 that, that, you know, are doing things for the wrong reasons. 1052 01:04:56,520 --> 01:04:59,320 And there's bad actors in Bitcoin, there's bad actors 1053 01:04:59,320 --> 01:05:02,040 everywhere. But I think the incentives that 1054 01:05:02,040 --> 01:05:08,440 Bitcoin aligns on, on a layer, on a layer of trust where we can 1055 01:05:08,440 --> 01:05:13,240 trust and verify in a world that like digitally speaking, it's 1056 01:05:13,240 --> 01:05:17,120 getting harder and harder to know what's real and what's not. 1057 01:05:17,440 --> 01:05:22,760 And so if you can build on that layer of trust and then allow 1058 01:05:22,760 --> 01:05:25,320 yourself to go inward and free up more of your time and 1059 01:05:25,320 --> 01:05:31,360 resources on a Bitcoin standard. My own experiences that like, I 1060 01:05:31,360 --> 01:05:34,000 can't even believe what Bitcoin has enabled for me. 1061 01:05:35,120 --> 01:05:39,440 If you would have told me back in 2018, you know, that I would 1062 01:05:39,600 --> 01:05:44,040 like in 2025, I would quit my job and just like try to build 1063 01:05:44,040 --> 01:05:45,320 something. I'd have been like, you're 1064 01:05:45,320 --> 01:05:48,600 crazy. You know, Bitcoin in a lot of 1065 01:05:48,600 --> 01:05:52,880 respects enabled that for me and enabled me to have the, the 1066 01:05:52,880 --> 01:05:55,840 shifts internally and to be in a place where I could take that 1067 01:05:55,840 --> 01:06:00,160 type of a risk. Yeah, we need more Bitcoiners to 1068 01:06:00,160 --> 01:06:04,280 be, to be awakened and to be bold and to live from a, a deep 1069 01:06:04,280 --> 01:06:08,240 place within their own soul. And I, I just, I'm totally 1070 01:06:08,240 --> 01:06:11,920 inspired by, you know, podcasts like yours in the audience and, 1071 01:06:12,160 --> 01:06:14,640 and Bitcoiners in general. I'm so excited to see what we 1072 01:06:14,640 --> 01:06:17,920 can build over the next 5 or 10 years. 1073 01:06:17,920 --> 01:06:21,120 And it's going to be turbulent. It's going to be difficult. 1074 01:06:21,160 --> 01:06:25,400 We're going to be tested. Yeah, I, I agree it's going to 1075 01:06:25,400 --> 01:06:29,880 be super, super interesting. I think that's why I am so happy 1076 01:06:29,880 --> 01:06:33,120 to have a seat in the stadium to, to and, and, and try to 1077 01:06:33,120 --> 01:06:35,600 contribute to see how this all will unfold. 1078 01:06:37,000 --> 01:06:42,320 Maybe 2 questions to to wrap up. So looking ahead, what is your 1079 01:06:42,320 --> 01:06:47,520 vision for how Bitcoin AI and this evolving consciousness 1080 01:06:47,520 --> 01:06:53,000 might shape the future? So either leadership or society 1081 01:06:53,000 --> 01:06:56,840 or you know, whatever you want to talk about, but like what? 1082 01:06:56,840 --> 01:07:03,000 What is your view of the future? Yeah, I think if we get it 1083 01:07:03,000 --> 01:07:06,520 right, Bitcoin, Bitcoin can enable an era of peace and 1084 01:07:06,520 --> 01:07:10,040 abundance that we can barely even comprehend. 1085 01:07:11,480 --> 01:07:14,720 You know, we're entering a period of, you're already 1086 01:07:14,720 --> 01:07:20,600 starting to see it, significant kinetic conflict and wars. 1087 01:07:21,520 --> 01:07:26,560 And when you really break it down, the system needs war to 1088 01:07:26,560 --> 01:07:29,440 function. There's economic incentives, you 1089 01:07:29,440 --> 01:07:35,040 need to create these conflicts and so on, a Bitcoin standard, 1090 01:07:35,120 --> 01:07:38,360 everything gets flipped. The incentives of politicians, 1091 01:07:38,360 --> 01:07:43,600 of leaders, there is no longer an incentive. 1092 01:07:44,640 --> 01:07:47,400 You know, I don't think Bitcoin totally gets rid of like human 1093 01:07:47,400 --> 01:07:52,720 nature and you know, the aggression and boundaries and 1094 01:07:53,200 --> 01:07:55,320 you know, the things that that create wars. 1095 01:07:55,720 --> 01:07:59,640 But on a Bitcoin standard, you better have a damn good reason 1096 01:07:59,640 --> 01:08:02,800 to go drop some bombs on people because you're only funding it 1097 01:08:02,800 --> 01:08:06,000 through taxation. You can't, you can't create 1098 01:08:06,000 --> 01:08:07,920 money out of thin air to fund a war. 1099 01:08:08,720 --> 01:08:13,120 And so that's one of the big things that I love about Bitcoin 1100 01:08:13,120 --> 01:08:16,720 is that it flips the incentives of those that are in power where 1101 01:08:16,720 --> 01:08:20,800 they actually have to do the things that the people want them 1102 01:08:20,800 --> 01:08:24,720 to do. And it enables peace. 1103 01:08:25,399 --> 01:08:28,439 And I think on a Bitcoin standard and it enables more 1104 01:08:28,439 --> 01:08:31,640 people to be connected to their own. 1105 01:08:31,720 --> 01:08:36,000 I truly believe that each of us has a reason. 1106 01:08:36,000 --> 01:08:38,800 We're here. We're we're each one of one. 1107 01:08:38,920 --> 01:08:43,520 There's nobody like Brahm that can do what you do and each 1108 01:08:43,520 --> 01:08:46,960 person like, but the system tells us how to act. 1109 01:08:47,120 --> 01:08:51,560 And so the more we can step out of the existing system and step 1110 01:08:51,560 --> 01:08:56,479 into our our own inner knowing and live from that place and 1111 01:08:56,479 --> 01:09:00,439 enter a flow state. If we have so many humans doing 1112 01:09:00,439 --> 01:09:04,760 that like I don't, I think the world could get like better than 1113 01:09:04,760 --> 01:09:10,960 we can even begin to imagine. I think that's a lovely view of 1114 01:09:10,960 --> 01:09:14,359 the future, something I would also love to be a part of. 1115 01:09:15,880 --> 01:09:18,960 I I wonder how long it takes before we get there. 1116 01:09:18,960 --> 01:09:24,200 But I'm happy we are at least attempting to contribute to to 1117 01:09:24,200 --> 01:09:27,439 something like that. And I think that's what like the 1118 01:09:27,439 --> 01:09:30,880 more I'm seeing that I don't want to be all sunshine and 1119 01:09:30,880 --> 01:09:34,240 rainbows like this, you know, Unicorn guy that has this vision 1120 01:09:34,240 --> 01:09:37,800 of this utopia, Because I do think that the next 10 years are 1121 01:09:37,800 --> 01:09:42,800 going to be so challenging. And for the old to break down to 1122 01:09:42,800 --> 01:09:46,359 enable something like that to emerge, Like the old has to 1123 01:09:46,359 --> 01:09:48,640 break down and it's already breaking down. 1124 01:09:48,640 --> 01:09:54,000 The old system is dying. And so, but if we can have that 1125 01:09:54,000 --> 01:09:57,440 end goal in mind of what could potentially be birthed out of a 1126 01:09:57,440 --> 01:10:01,960 breakdown, that gives me the hope to be able to continue 1127 01:10:01,960 --> 01:10:05,520 building through what is going to be difficult. 1128 01:10:05,760 --> 01:10:08,800 It's just is like, I don't see any other way around it. 1129 01:10:08,800 --> 01:10:13,320 And so, yeah, I don't know how long that takes for that type of 1130 01:10:13,320 --> 01:10:17,440 a vision, but having more people seeing that that could take 1131 01:10:17,440 --> 01:10:20,800 place out of this is what's going to allow us to have hope. 1132 01:10:20,800 --> 01:10:23,200 Like that's why, you know, Sailor talks about it. 1133 01:10:23,200 --> 01:10:27,520 Bitcoin is hope and I know that you have to do a lot of work to 1134 01:10:27,520 --> 01:10:30,080 get to that conclusion, but I think that Bitcoin, what it 1135 01:10:30,080 --> 01:10:32,680 enables, is a very hopeful future. 1136 01:10:34,000 --> 01:10:36,600 Yeah, yeah, I agree. I am. 1137 01:10:36,680 --> 01:10:41,120 I would love to ask you my last question which I asked everyone 1138 01:10:41,120 --> 01:10:44,560 the same question, which is what is a core belief that you will 1139 01:10:44,560 --> 01:10:49,120 never let go of? That's a very interesting 1140 01:10:49,120 --> 01:10:52,800 question, and I think over the years I would have had different 1141 01:10:52,880 --> 01:11:05,200 answers to that. My answer is that I I aspire to 1142 01:11:05,200 --> 01:11:12,360 live my life in a way that I have strong beliefs, but that 1143 01:11:12,360 --> 01:11:15,480 I'm willing to change my beliefs when there's new information 1144 01:11:15,480 --> 01:11:19,720 presented. And so I would like to believe 1145 01:11:20,560 --> 01:11:26,360 that I'm not attached to my own beliefs so much that I would 1146 01:11:26,360 --> 01:11:32,560 never let them go. Even Bitcoin, like I think at 1147 01:11:32,560 --> 01:11:38,080 some point even Bitcoin has to be transcended and can't become 1148 01:11:38,080 --> 01:11:41,080 the new religion that we're so attached to that it's the only 1149 01:11:41,080 --> 01:11:44,040 way of life. So I'm sure there's something 1150 01:11:44,040 --> 01:11:48,400 that I would cling to so much that I would resist letting go 1151 01:11:48,400 --> 01:11:51,200 of it. But intellectually and from a 1152 01:11:51,200 --> 01:11:55,680 philosophical viewpoint, I would hope to live my life in a way 1153 01:11:55,680 --> 01:12:00,880 that there is no belief that I would not be willing to let go 1154 01:12:00,880 --> 01:12:02,840 of. Awesome, man. 1155 01:12:03,200 --> 01:12:04,640 Well, thanks so much for sharing. 1156 01:12:04,640 --> 01:12:07,600 Thanks so much for your time and this insightful conversation. 1157 01:12:07,920 --> 01:12:11,280 And yeah, let's see what the future holds, man. 1158 01:12:11,400 --> 01:12:13,480 Thank you so much. Thanks bro, I enjoyed it. 1159 01:12:13,960 --> 01:12:16,800 I hope you enjoyed this episode. If you did, you can click here 1160 01:12:16,800 --> 01:12:20,160 to find more just like it and click here to find all Bitcoin 1161 01:12:20,160 --> 01:12:22,160 for millennials podcast episodes. 1162 01:12:22,520 --> 01:12:25,720 Also, please like this video if you want to help shine a light 1163 01:12:25,720 --> 01:12:28,680 on the message of Bitcoin and subscribe to my channel to stay 1164 01:12:28,680 --> 01:12:30,920 connected. I hope to see you for the next 1165 01:12:30,920 --> 01:12:31,880 episode. Bye.