1 00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:03,160 In the 14th century, if you refuse to use gunpowder because 2 00:00:03,160 --> 00:00:05,760 you liked your bows and arrows, you didn't just lose the 3 00:00:05,800 --> 00:00:09,320 argument, you lost your Kingdom and probably your life on the 4 00:00:09,320 --> 00:00:12,560 battlefield. Is Bitcoin the gunpowder of our 5 00:00:12,560 --> 00:00:15,720 time? In episode 250 of Bitcoin for 6 00:00:15,720 --> 00:00:18,960 Millennials, I'm joined by Save Dinamoose, someone who taught me 7 00:00:18,960 --> 00:00:21,560 that my lens of logically looking at the world is 8 00:00:21,560 --> 00:00:24,200 basically what the Austrian School of Economics have been 9 00:00:24,200 --> 00:00:27,440 talking about for ages. It's the only framework that 10 00:00:27,440 --> 00:00:31,320 explains the world we're seeing, yet the smartest PhDs and Nobel 11 00:00:31,320 --> 00:00:33,720 laureates remain completely blind to it. 12 00:00:33,920 --> 00:00:36,680 By the end of our conversation, you'll understand what happens 13 00:00:36,680 --> 00:00:39,600 to a society when the credit we've lived on for a century 14 00:00:39,800 --> 00:00:43,240 evaporates and we're forced into a reality where only proof of 15 00:00:43,440 --> 00:00:47,280 actual work will create value. And what happens to our world 16 00:00:47,440 --> 00:00:49,680 after that? If you are enjoying my content, 17 00:00:49,680 --> 00:00:52,440 it would mean a lot to me if you could subscribe to the channel 18 00:00:52,600 --> 00:00:54,840 and like my video to support my journey. 19 00:00:55,120 --> 00:00:57,640 Thanks for your support. Now let's dive in to this 20 00:00:57,640 --> 00:01:02,880 episode. Safe Tina Moose Welcome to 21 00:01:03,360 --> 00:01:07,040 episode 250 of Bitcoin for Millennials. 22 00:01:08,200 --> 00:01:11,640 Thank you for having me, Brian. I'm super happy you're here. 23 00:01:11,640 --> 00:01:15,720 We finally, finally made it took took some time, but yeah, I have 24 00:01:15,800 --> 00:01:17,080 I have a lot of questions for you. 25 00:01:17,080 --> 00:01:20,280 So let's see how far how far we can we can get. 26 00:01:21,160 --> 00:01:24,160 I wanted to start with the gunpowder analogy because that 27 00:01:24,160 --> 00:01:29,040 is something that on, on my journey was something you, you 28 00:01:29,280 --> 00:01:34,080 taught me and I think is a very, very relevant analogy, right. 29 00:01:34,080 --> 00:01:36,400 So you've compared Bitcoin adoption to the invention of 30 00:01:36,400 --> 00:01:39,080 gunpowder, Like if you don't use it, you become irrelevant. 31 00:01:39,440 --> 00:01:45,440 And probably that in battle too. So why is Bitcoin a, a forced 32 00:01:45,440 --> 00:01:49,880 adoption rather than a voluntary one, especially for, for nation 33 00:01:49,880 --> 00:01:52,440 states, probably for, for people that might be a bit different. 34 00:01:52,440 --> 00:01:54,960 But you know, in this context, we we talk about countries. 35 00:01:55,320 --> 00:01:56,920 No, I think. It's the same for individuals 36 00:01:56,920 --> 00:02:01,160 and countries and it's it's it's just the force of economic 37 00:02:01,160 --> 00:02:04,160 reality. The fundamental idea ultimately 38 00:02:04,160 --> 00:02:07,920 remains that all the other forms of money are going to be made at 39 00:02:07,960 --> 00:02:13,200 a higher percentage growth rate. They're going to be making more 40 00:02:13,200 --> 00:02:16,640 dollars EUR. Whatever it is, there will 41 00:02:16,640 --> 00:02:19,800 always be more and more of it being made at a higher rate than 42 00:02:19,800 --> 00:02:22,200 Bitcoin. Bitcoins supply growth rate is 43 00:02:22,200 --> 00:02:25,720 only about .8% now and it's going to continue to down. 44 00:02:26,440 --> 00:02:33,760 So we're going to be witnessing this kind of devaluation of all 45 00:02:33,760 --> 00:02:35,600 other forms of money compared to Bitcoin. 46 00:02:35,600 --> 00:02:41,040 And in the long run it, it might not sound obvious initially, but 47 00:02:41,480 --> 00:02:44,880 and people might have trouble thinking about the small 48 00:02:44,880 --> 00:02:48,080 differences in percentages. So what Bitcoin is a .8%, the 49 00:02:48,080 --> 00:02:51,560 dollar is seven, 8%. That's not a big difference, but 50 00:02:51,560 --> 00:02:53,920 it is a very, very big difference because that's seven, 51 00:02:53,920 --> 00:02:58,960 8%, you double the supply in about 10 years or so, whereas at 52 00:02:58,960 --> 00:03:04,600 .8% going down to .4% in every and having every four years, 53 00:03:05,000 --> 00:03:07,600 you're going to be adding something like 3-4 percent 54 00:03:08,000 --> 00:03:12,160 supply in 10 years. So that on its own is just a 55 00:03:13,120 --> 00:03:16,160 just over 10 years. It shows you the stark picture, 56 00:03:16,160 --> 00:03:19,600 you add you 11 form of money and then you add the other one, 57 00:03:19,600 --> 00:03:22,440 another 3-4 percent. Now do it another 10 years, you 58 00:03:22,440 --> 00:03:26,120 double the other one. So that's 4X in 20 years and 59 00:03:26,280 --> 00:03:30,840 still maybe less than 10%, probably 5% in the case of 60 00:03:30,840 --> 00:03:37,400 Bitcoin, something like that. So the the brutal reality of 61 00:03:37,400 --> 00:03:40,760 supply and demand just means that the value stored in the 62 00:03:40,760 --> 00:03:44,760 money that is increasing at a faster rate is going to be 63 00:03:44,760 --> 00:03:48,960 devalued at a faster rate and is going to lose value over the 64 00:03:48,960 --> 00:03:52,440 harder money. And then it becomes a question 65 00:03:52,440 --> 00:03:55,560 of whether you are smart enough to understand this and benefit 66 00:03:55,560 --> 00:03:59,640 from it, or if you're not, then you are just going to be the 67 00:03:59,640 --> 00:04:02,280 victim of it. You're going to work hard to 68 00:04:02,280 --> 00:04:04,520 save in the form of money that is losing value. 69 00:04:05,280 --> 00:04:08,440 And you won't understand why life keeps getting more and more 70 00:04:08,440 --> 00:04:11,480 expensive for you. You will be programmed to lash 71 00:04:11,480 --> 00:04:13,520 out and blame all kinds of different things. 72 00:04:13,520 --> 00:04:18,600 You know, COVID and the previous president, not this president 73 00:04:18,600 --> 00:04:21,720 always, you know, it's never the one who's in power, who's the 74 00:04:21,720 --> 00:04:23,080 responsible. It's always the other one. 75 00:04:23,080 --> 00:04:25,960 It's the foreigners. It's this it's that you'll be 76 00:04:25,960 --> 00:04:29,200 manipulated into thinking about other all other kind of reasons 77 00:04:29,200 --> 00:04:32,080 for your predicament. But ultimately your predicament 78 00:04:32,080 --> 00:04:35,560 is that you chose crappy money and you spend all of your life 79 00:04:35,560 --> 00:04:38,680 working for money. And if you don't give a little 80 00:04:38,680 --> 00:04:42,640 tiny bit of critical thinking about what you're using as 81 00:04:42,640 --> 00:04:46,640 money, then you are like a farmer who harvests everything 82 00:04:46,640 --> 00:04:49,840 and then leaves it at on the street at the end of the day and 83 00:04:49,840 --> 00:04:53,040 then doesn't bother or secure it and then it just goes away. 84 00:04:53,040 --> 00:04:56,200 So if you've farmed for the whole year, you worked hard, you 85 00:04:56,200 --> 00:04:58,360 harvested, and then you didn't care what happened to the 86 00:04:58,360 --> 00:05:01,480 harvest and somebody came and stole your harvest, have you 87 00:05:01,480 --> 00:05:04,400 really worked hard? No, the none of that work is 88 00:05:04,400 --> 00:05:06,840 going to count unless you can figure out how to keep it. 89 00:05:07,160 --> 00:05:08,400 And I think it's the same thing with money. 90 00:05:08,760 --> 00:05:13,400 Ultimately you just have to figure out how to save the money 91 00:05:13,400 --> 00:05:15,680 and keep the money. Otherwise, doesn't matter how 92 00:05:15,680 --> 00:05:18,240 hard you work, how much money you earned, you're always going 93 00:05:18,240 --> 00:05:22,280 to be destroyed by inflation. And you might not see it in the 94 00:05:22,280 --> 00:05:26,200 short run, but in the long run, it will catch up with you. 95 00:05:26,200 --> 00:05:28,680 And most people don't like hearing this. 96 00:05:29,080 --> 00:05:34,200 I think it's a, this is one of those things that upsets people 97 00:05:34,200 --> 00:05:38,240 who are not Bitcoiners and makes sense to Bitcoiners. 98 00:05:38,560 --> 00:05:42,720 And then there it's the small number of the no coiners that 99 00:05:42,720 --> 00:05:45,600 are ready to make the jump. When they hear this, it can 100 00:05:45,880 --> 00:05:48,760 flick a switch in their brain and then they switch from being 101 00:05:48,760 --> 00:05:50,520 no coiner to Bitcoin and they get it. 102 00:05:51,120 --> 00:05:53,880 But for the majority of people who don't, who just hear this, 103 00:05:53,880 --> 00:05:56,440 they don't get it. But I think it's a really 104 00:05:56,440 --> 00:06:00,400 powerful way of thinking about it because for most people, we 105 00:06:00,400 --> 00:06:03,960 are born in the generation that has, you know, people who are 106 00:06:03,960 --> 00:06:07,560 alive today, nobody has ever had this much choice in their life 107 00:06:07,560 --> 00:06:11,040 about things to do. You get to choose a million 108 00:06:11,040 --> 00:06:14,640 different kinds of shoes, clothes, cars and so on. 109 00:06:14,920 --> 00:06:20,000 So we used thinking of things as being consumer choices and 110 00:06:20,000 --> 00:06:23,080 ultimately, you know, you, you get to make superficial choices. 111 00:06:24,360 --> 00:06:28,360 You choose Apple or PC or whatever. 112 00:06:28,360 --> 00:06:32,640 You choose Pepsi or Coca-Cola. But people don't think. 113 00:06:32,760 --> 00:06:36,280 Too much about what they're actually choosing. 114 00:06:37,560 --> 00:06:39,480 They don't think about the things that are really driving 115 00:06:39,480 --> 00:06:41,480 them. But this is But Bitcoin is just 116 00:06:41,480 --> 00:06:44,720 a very stark slap in the face that says it doesn't matter what 117 00:06:44,720 --> 00:06:47,720 you think. Doesn't matter if you like, if 118 00:06:47,720 --> 00:06:50,760 you if you like it to be Apple or you like it to be Windows or 119 00:06:50,760 --> 00:06:52,760 you like Coca-Cola or you like Burger King. 120 00:06:53,120 --> 00:06:55,280 You have to eat this. You know, that's why I also like 121 00:06:55,280 --> 00:06:59,360 to say it's it's not the fancy cute toy that you want. 122 00:06:59,360 --> 00:07:00,840 It's the bitter medicine you need. 123 00:07:01,240 --> 00:07:04,560 And the doctor doesn't sit and ask you what flavor of medicine 124 00:07:04,600 --> 00:07:06,560 you like. You just shut up and take the 125 00:07:06,560 --> 00:07:10,400 medicine. What do you think is like one, 126 00:07:10,400 --> 00:07:13,160 let's call it glitch in the matrix that, that you've seen 127 00:07:13,160 --> 00:07:16,240 people wake up to, to the Fiat lie? 128 00:07:16,240 --> 00:07:18,360 Like what? What is the main thing that we 129 00:07:18,360 --> 00:07:21,360 should tell more people basically, because we can also 130 00:07:21,360 --> 00:07:24,200 not really blame people that they are, you know, that their 131 00:07:24,200 --> 00:07:26,680 judgement is, is, is clouded because especially in the 132 00:07:26,680 --> 00:07:29,480 Western world, you know, at least for me, it always worked, 133 00:07:29,560 --> 00:07:30,840 right? So there wasn't really a reason 134 00:07:30,840 --> 00:07:32,800 for me to actually start poking these holes. 135 00:07:33,560 --> 00:07:35,520 Yeah, well, I mean, it's increasingly working less and 136 00:07:35,520 --> 00:07:39,320 less and people are becoming more aware of its shortfalls and 137 00:07:39,320 --> 00:07:42,360 limitations. But I would say I think the 138 00:07:42,440 --> 00:07:49,360 most, the most promising path to send somebody on to in order to 139 00:07:49,400 --> 00:07:53,520 get them to the rabbit hole is to just I think to ask the 140 00:07:53,520 --> 00:07:56,280 question of why should the money supply increase? 141 00:07:56,560 --> 00:07:59,720 Why are all these banks and central banks and economists and 142 00:07:59,720 --> 00:08:03,560 presidents and of congressmen and parliamentarians and 143 00:08:03,560 --> 00:08:06,600 military generals all over the world, why do they all have very 144 00:08:06,600 --> 00:08:09,120 strong opinions about what needs to happen with the rate of 145 00:08:09,120 --> 00:08:12,040 increase in the money supply? We need to print more money for 146 00:08:12,040 --> 00:08:13,640 this. We shouldn't print for that. 147 00:08:14,600 --> 00:08:17,880 We should raise the interest rates so that we've slowed down 148 00:08:17,880 --> 00:08:20,280 the creation of money, or we should lower the interest rates 149 00:08:20,280 --> 00:08:24,240 or should we, so that we should increase the speed of the 150 00:08:24,240 --> 00:08:27,360 creation of money. And it's just taken for granted 151 00:08:27,360 --> 00:08:29,680 that the money supply has to increase. 152 00:08:30,600 --> 00:08:32,640 Nobody ever stops to ask, well, why? 153 00:08:32,919 --> 00:08:36,679 Why should it actually increase? And I think that is the most 154 00:08:36,840 --> 00:08:39,640 powerful question to ask. And I remember for me 155 00:08:39,640 --> 00:08:43,559 personally, it was maybe almost 20 years ago, 18 years ago, when 156 00:08:43,559 --> 00:08:47,360 I first came across this question and started asking it 157 00:08:47,360 --> 00:08:49,480 to myself. And then came across the answer 158 00:08:49,600 --> 00:08:52,960 of the Austrians, which is the only reason they increase the 159 00:08:52,960 --> 00:08:54,520 money supplies, because they want to rob you. 160 00:08:55,280 --> 00:08:58,720 And this is not something that you would want in a money that 161 00:08:58,720 --> 00:09:02,160 is not made to rob you. And then everything makes sense. 162 00:09:02,160 --> 00:09:06,360 And I think this is this is. The best way to go down the 163 00:09:06,360 --> 00:09:09,000 rabbit hole of Bitcoin and the best way to go down the rabbit 164 00:09:09,000 --> 00:09:12,600 hole of Austrian economics. Because for most people, 165 00:09:12,640 --> 00:09:17,640 economics is just this extremely obscure, weird, esoteric thing 166 00:09:17,640 --> 00:09:19,680 that doesn't make any sense. They go to university and 167 00:09:19,680 --> 00:09:23,000 they're taught things that make no sense and they're told to 168 00:09:23,000 --> 00:09:25,440 apply certain formulas, plug in a bunch of numbers, get the 169 00:09:25,440 --> 00:09:28,320 right answer, and you graduate. And then they leave and they 170 00:09:28,320 --> 00:09:30,560 don't quite understand what is it that I learned? 171 00:09:30,960 --> 00:09:35,480 And they don't understand what it's supposed to be the 172 00:09:35,880 --> 00:09:38,920 intellectual basis on which all of these answers are being 173 00:09:38,920 --> 00:09:41,040 arrived at. And they just ignore it. 174 00:09:41,160 --> 00:09:44,440 And then they keep having all of these questions about economics 175 00:09:45,000 --> 00:09:47,320 throughout their lives. But this is really the key 176 00:09:47,320 --> 00:09:49,760 question that you want to send them down because you could go 177 00:09:49,760 --> 00:09:53,480 down all kinds of rabbit holes that might not necessarily bring 178 00:09:53,480 --> 00:09:56,240 you to the right place. So, you know, a lot of people go 179 00:09:56,240 --> 00:09:58,080 down the rabbit hole thinking about inequality. 180 00:09:58,080 --> 00:10:00,760 But why is there inequality? And let's look at the data and 181 00:10:00,760 --> 00:10:04,080 the measurement and what happened when Reagan came in and 182 00:10:04,080 --> 00:10:06,120 then what happened when Bush came in or whatever. 183 00:10:07,360 --> 00:10:10,440 And you can get lost in all of the Fiat nonsense around that 184 00:10:10,440 --> 00:10:13,600 question or you could get into any kind of other things. 185 00:10:13,600 --> 00:10:15,320 But I think this one. And then, you know, of course, 186 00:10:15,320 --> 00:10:17,720 you could find your way to important ideas. 187 00:10:17,800 --> 00:10:18,960 Goodbye going through any question. 188 00:10:18,960 --> 00:10:21,240 But I think the specifically. The one on the money supply. 189 00:10:21,840 --> 00:10:25,680 Points you to something that is fundamentally nonsensical. 190 00:10:25,680 --> 00:10:29,000 About the modern world and something that is not questioned 191 00:10:29,480 --> 00:10:31,680 and then it. Offers you the explanation for 192 00:10:31,680 --> 00:10:35,520 it, and it offers you the explanation for why it is done 193 00:10:35,520 --> 00:10:38,800 in the real world. In the real world, what is the 194 00:10:38,880 --> 00:10:42,040 what the real explanation? Is and the explanation that is 195 00:10:42,520 --> 00:10:46,160 essentially the one that is the propaganda version. 196 00:10:46,480 --> 00:10:49,160 And then it all makes sense and it all fits in your mind that it 197 00:10:49,160 --> 00:10:54,600 all becomes clear. If your Bitcoin double tomorrow, 198 00:10:54,600 --> 00:10:57,240 would you feel good about how it's secured right now? 199 00:10:57,480 --> 00:10:59,520 Most people haven't really pressure tested that. 200 00:10:59,520 --> 00:11:01,760 And I get it. Some people are comfortable 201 00:11:01,760 --> 00:11:05,160 taking full control of their own keys, but others want security 202 00:11:05,160 --> 00:11:07,280 without having to manage it all themselves. 203 00:11:07,520 --> 00:11:10,920 That's why I partnered with Onrep Multi Institution Custody, 204 00:11:10,920 --> 00:11:13,800 where your keys are held across independent institutions in 205 00:11:13,800 --> 00:11:17,080 multiple jurisdictions. No single company can access, 206 00:11:17,080 --> 00:11:19,920 move, or lose your Bitcoin. Lloyds of London insured 207 00:11:20,120 --> 00:11:22,760 inheritance planning built in and a team that walks you 208 00:11:22,760 --> 00:11:25,800 through the entire setup. They serve clients globally, 209 00:11:25,800 --> 00:11:28,440 whether you're in the US, Europe, or anywhere else. 210 00:11:28,640 --> 00:11:32,440 Book a free consultation at onlinebitcoin.com/prom to learn 211 00:11:32,440 --> 00:11:35,360 more. That's onlinebitcoin.com/prom. 212 00:11:38,240 --> 00:11:40,640 Most people stop too early with Bitcoin. 213 00:11:40,840 --> 00:11:44,000 They buy it, maybe move it to a wallet, and think they are done, 214 00:11:44,320 --> 00:11:46,520 but they're not. The real questions are how 215 00:11:46,520 --> 00:11:49,160 you're securing it, how private your setup is, and whether 216 00:11:49,160 --> 00:11:51,800 you're verifying your own transactions or trusting someone 217 00:11:51,800 --> 00:11:53,880 else. And what happens to your Bitcoin 218 00:11:53,880 --> 00:11:57,080 when something happens to you? This is the layer that most 219 00:11:57,080 --> 00:11:59,480 people ignore, and it's the most important one. 220 00:11:59,800 --> 00:12:02,800 That's why I've been working with the Bitcoin way to help you 221 00:12:02,920 --> 00:12:05,640 set up self custody properly, including privacy, 222 00:12:05,640 --> 00:12:09,120 cybersecurity, inheritance, and even running your own notes. 223 00:12:09,400 --> 00:12:12,200 And they do it without ever touching your Bitcoin. 224 00:12:12,440 --> 00:12:14,880 They're not a custodian, they're your support team. 225 00:12:15,080 --> 00:12:17,240 If you're serious about this like I am, go to 226 00:12:17,240 --> 00:12:21,600 thebitcoinway.com/bram. That's Bram to book a free call. 227 00:12:21,760 --> 00:12:24,480 They'll walk you through your setup, personalize everything to 228 00:12:24,480 --> 00:12:27,800 you, and help you get a much stronger position very quickly, 229 00:12:28,000 --> 00:12:30,000 whether you're a beginner or more advanced. 230 00:12:30,200 --> 00:12:35,440 That's the bitcoinway.com/prom. And then you start thinking This 231 00:12:35,440 --> 00:12:38,040 is why people become kind of obsessed, a little bit of 232 00:12:38,040 --> 00:12:39,920 Austrian economics because wow, wait. 233 00:12:40,400 --> 00:12:43,560 There are all these old dead people who have been thinking 234 00:12:43,560 --> 00:12:46,240 about these questions for hundreds of years in ways that 235 00:12:46,240 --> 00:12:49,080 actually make sense. So I can actually read somebody 236 00:12:49,080 --> 00:12:53,560 talk about money and economics in a way that doesn't just make 237 00:12:53,560 --> 00:12:57,840 me fall asleep or think I'm crazy or think I'm stupid and it 238 00:12:57,840 --> 00:13:00,160 can actually make sense. Because, you know, when you're 239 00:13:00,160 --> 00:13:03,680 reading Fiat economics, there's no payoff at the end. 240 00:13:03,680 --> 00:13:08,560 You know, you read Keynes or you read any of these kind of major 241 00:13:08,560 --> 00:13:10,720 economists. And you read all of their work 242 00:13:10,720 --> 00:13:12,360 and you need. Their ideology, and then you 243 00:13:12,360 --> 00:13:15,680 come to understand what they think of the world, but you 244 00:13:15,680 --> 00:13:17,880 don't understand the world. Do you understand a bunch of 245 00:13:18,480 --> 00:13:20,680 ideology that they give you, but it doesn't help you understand 246 00:13:20,680 --> 00:13:22,200 the world? The point of studying. 247 00:13:22,200 --> 00:13:24,200 Keynesian economics is just believing in the Keynesian 248 00:13:24,200 --> 00:13:26,520 story, but it doesn't help you understand how the world 249 00:13:26,520 --> 00:13:29,320 actually works. So this then helps you 250 00:13:29,320 --> 00:13:30,920 understand how the world. Actually works. 251 00:13:30,920 --> 00:13:34,240 You're not reading it to be able to show off and say that I can 252 00:13:34,240 --> 00:13:37,240 understand Keynes, I read Keynes or I read this guy or that guy. 253 00:13:37,280 --> 00:13:39,400 You're reading it because it helps you understand the world. 254 00:13:39,400 --> 00:13:42,040 And then that sends you down the Austrian rabbit hole. 255 00:13:42,040 --> 00:13:46,120 But then the other hand, perhaps even more significant rabbit 256 00:13:46,120 --> 00:13:47,920 hole that it might send you down, it's Bitcoin. 257 00:13:47,920 --> 00:13:50,800 Because when you think, OK, well, then what would happen if 258 00:13:50,800 --> 00:13:52,520 we did have a fixed supply? Money? 259 00:13:53,040 --> 00:13:56,840 Yeah, it would be like Bitcoin. It would go up forever. 260 00:13:56,840 --> 00:14:00,160 It would just have what we call number go up technology. 261 00:14:00,520 --> 00:14:03,600 And that's not a bad thing. Bitcoiners get richer by using 262 00:14:03,600 --> 00:14:07,120 Bitcoin as money, fiaters get poorer by using Fiat as money. 263 00:14:07,480 --> 00:14:09,880 And that's how it's going to play out. 264 00:14:09,880 --> 00:14:13,600 So once you understand this, there's once you see it, there's 265 00:14:13,600 --> 00:14:16,240 no unseeing it that you'll never be able to look at Fiat in the 266 00:14:16,240 --> 00:14:18,240 same way and you'll never be able to look at Bitcoin in the 267 00:14:18,240 --> 00:14:21,320 same way. And I think you switch from 268 00:14:21,320 --> 00:14:24,840 thinking of your life as being measured in terms of dollars. 269 00:14:24,840 --> 00:14:26,480 You know, I want to earn this much dollars. 270 00:14:26,480 --> 00:14:28,600 I want to have this much dollars in the bank account. 271 00:14:28,600 --> 00:14:31,280 I want to own this many dollars worth of things. 272 00:14:31,640 --> 00:14:34,240 And then you switch to started to calculate it in terms of 273 00:14:34,240 --> 00:14:38,600 Bitcoin because ultimately your dollars are just hot potatoes 274 00:14:38,600 --> 00:14:41,960 that you're trying to get rid of to make more dollars so that you 275 00:14:41,960 --> 00:14:44,080 could then exchange those dollars into Bitcoin because 276 00:14:44,080 --> 00:14:45,240 the. Bitcoins you could keep. 277 00:14:45,600 --> 00:14:48,560 And you know that they were going to hold on to their value 278 00:14:48,560 --> 00:14:50,640 because there's no central bank that's printing the bitcoins. 279 00:14:51,120 --> 00:14:53,440 There is no one who's increasing the supply. 280 00:14:53,440 --> 00:14:59,240 It comes with built in Keynesian resistance as Keynes proof so. 281 00:14:59,920 --> 00:15:03,160 I love that. Yeah, Now I, I think this is, 282 00:15:03,160 --> 00:15:06,880 this is an absolutely fantastic answer because I think, you 283 00:15:06,880 --> 00:15:10,840 know, the, the, the, the Keynesian thinking fundamentally 284 00:15:10,840 --> 00:15:19,360 I think is built on distrust of other humans and, and ingenuity. 285 00:15:19,360 --> 00:15:24,160 And you know, they kind of say like, well, because of said 286 00:15:24,160 --> 00:15:28,400 policy, right, XYZ inflation, 2%, the random number, right, we 287 00:15:28,400 --> 00:15:31,120 are incentivizing people to produce. 288 00:15:31,120 --> 00:15:34,400 But like you just illustrated, if you flip it around, if the 289 00:15:34,840 --> 00:15:38,560 reward actually becomes something that you would want to 290 00:15:39,160 --> 00:15:44,040 acquire, that's when you are motivated to actually produce in 291 00:15:44,560 --> 00:15:48,880 a a meaningful way, I would say. And so I think this is kind of 292 00:15:48,960 --> 00:15:52,720 how it also flips your, your worldview where you also, I 293 00:15:52,720 --> 00:15:56,760 think feel in this Bitcoin standard, you know, I, I think 294 00:15:56,760 --> 00:15:59,160 there's also why Bitcoin is hope, like it gives you 295 00:15:59,160 --> 00:16:03,520 motivation toward the future instead of higher anxiety toward 296 00:16:03,680 --> 00:16:06,480 the, the future, right? Which eventually, and I think 297 00:16:06,480 --> 00:16:08,880 that's more the philosophical or spiritual part would actually 298 00:16:08,880 --> 00:16:12,480 make you appreciate today even even more, right? 299 00:16:12,480 --> 00:16:15,480 Because you are focused on the future and building and having 300 00:16:15,480 --> 00:16:19,880 a, a hopeful outlook. And yeah, I, I talked to people 301 00:16:19,880 --> 00:16:23,080 that have like double masters in economics and they say, well, I 302 00:16:23,080 --> 00:16:26,800 calculated all these during my study, but we never discussed 303 00:16:27,280 --> 00:16:30,040 anything philosophically about money, right. 304 00:16:30,040 --> 00:16:33,560 And I think that is also the issue with people that don't 305 00:16:33,560 --> 00:16:35,280 have a double masters in economics. 306 00:16:35,520 --> 00:16:36,280 Like how? How? 307 00:16:36,280 --> 00:16:39,440 Could they actually figure it out? 308 00:16:39,440 --> 00:16:42,320 Right. So it's, it's just a really hard 309 00:16:43,080 --> 00:16:45,840 and and difficult narrative that has been put a bonus. 310 00:16:45,840 --> 00:16:50,320 But we also see that with very smart people, right, PhDs, Nobel 311 00:16:50,320 --> 00:16:52,400 laureates, right? They also struggle a lot with 312 00:16:52,400 --> 00:16:53,200 Bitcoin. Today. 313 00:16:53,200 --> 00:16:57,000 I saw a clip of Steve Keane, who's an economist. 314 00:16:57,000 --> 00:17:00,280 I, I didn't know him, but he apparently predicted the the 315 00:17:00,280 --> 00:17:04,160 2008 crash and, and he was now predicting Bitcoin will hit zero 316 00:17:04,160 --> 00:17:06,280 over, you know, excessive energy use. 317 00:17:06,280 --> 00:17:09,920 When we have to curb energy use, you know, Bitcoin is the first 318 00:17:09,920 --> 00:17:13,680 thing to go. Like even the fact that people 319 00:17:13,680 --> 00:17:17,800 think it's good in 2026 that you even need to talk about curbing 320 00:17:17,800 --> 00:17:20,680 the energy use, right usage, right? 321 00:17:20,680 --> 00:17:23,680 For me, that's more a signal of how bad everything is going. 322 00:17:23,680 --> 00:17:28,119 But but anyway, do you think this is an intellectual failure? 323 00:17:28,119 --> 00:17:30,720 Are they dishonest? Are they not smart enough? 324 00:17:30,840 --> 00:17:35,840 Is this kind of like some cost fallacy coming from this, you 325 00:17:35,840 --> 00:17:40,160 know, Fiat institutional system? Like like why is it so difficult 326 00:17:40,160 --> 00:17:43,040 for them? I think it's because Bitcoin is 327 00:17:43,160 --> 00:17:48,360 really smashing all the idols of Fiat and it has to smash them 328 00:17:48,360 --> 00:17:52,120 all at the same time because they are all connected to the 329 00:17:52,120 --> 00:17:54,800 Fiat grid. If you want, just like, you 330 00:17:54,800 --> 00:17:57,880 know, a power grid, everything in Fiat world is fine. 331 00:17:57,960 --> 00:18:00,520 That is financed by Fiat. That is because of government 332 00:18:00,520 --> 00:18:05,320 money printing has to essentially be based on the 333 00:18:07,000 --> 00:18:10,760 prolonging of the life of Fiat. So it's everything that runs on 334 00:18:10,760 --> 00:18:16,160 Fiat has to be pro Fiat. And Bitcoin is such a vortex of 335 00:18:16,160 --> 00:18:20,600 everything wrong with Fiat uniting together against Bitcoin 336 00:18:21,000 --> 00:18:26,720 because Bitcoin a defunds everything, so it threatens the 337 00:18:26,720 --> 00:18:28,880 entire grid. So everybody can sort of 338 00:18:29,040 --> 00:18:33,880 understand why this is going to put them out of a job. 339 00:18:33,880 --> 00:18:36,480 And a lot of these people have jobs that, you know, are 340 00:18:36,480 --> 00:18:40,320 financed by fake Fiat money. They're fake Fiat jobs, but they 341 00:18:40,320 --> 00:18:43,480 think that they are on the best that they can do in their life. 342 00:18:43,480 --> 00:18:44,720 And, you know, they may be right. 343 00:18:45,440 --> 00:18:48,680 So pushing papers and getting fake paper money for a fake job 344 00:18:48,760 --> 00:18:51,760 seems to be a. Successful business model in 345 00:18:51,760 --> 00:18:53,720 today's world. So a lot of these people aren't 346 00:18:53,720 --> 00:18:56,200 happy when you come and tell them that we're building a money 347 00:18:56,560 --> 00:19:01,040 that allows those of us who like to be productive to opt out of 348 00:19:01,040 --> 00:19:04,120 financing parasites like you. You actually have to do the 349 00:19:04,120 --> 00:19:05,480 work. Yeah, you're going to have to 350 00:19:05,480 --> 00:19:07,040 like work. Work like all the. 351 00:19:07,040 --> 00:19:09,200 Rest of us. We're going to get rid of Fiat 352 00:19:09,200 --> 00:19:11,120 privilege. So they don't like it. 353 00:19:11,120 --> 00:19:13,960 But then of course, I think it's in this particular example, the 354 00:19:13,960 --> 00:19:18,360 energy hysteria is, you know, one, one of these other. 355 00:19:19,200 --> 00:19:25,400 Factors where Bitcoin triggers fiaters because I think the 356 00:19:25,400 --> 00:19:28,960 reason there is an energy hysteria in the 1st place and I 357 00:19:28,960 --> 00:19:30,520 discussed this in the Fiat standard. 358 00:19:31,640 --> 00:19:36,480 The reason people care so much about carbon dioxide in the 359 00:19:36,480 --> 00:19:39,920 atmosphere supposedly somehow ending human civilization or the 360 00:19:39,920 --> 00:19:42,520 reason they care about how much oil and gas that we're 361 00:19:42,520 --> 00:19:46,360 consuming. The reason the hysterically have 362 00:19:46,360 --> 00:19:49,640 worried about running out of all those things for 60 years. 363 00:19:49,640 --> 00:19:52,240 And you know, we used to worry that we were going to run out. 364 00:19:52,240 --> 00:19:54,520 Then we realized, no, actually we're not going to run out. 365 00:19:54,520 --> 00:19:56,720 We just have too much of it. And that's going to mean that 366 00:19:56,720 --> 00:20:02,040 we're going to end up living in a world of pollution and dirt 367 00:20:02,040 --> 00:20:03,920 and destruction because we have too much of it. 368 00:20:04,520 --> 00:20:06,760 But the constant thing is always that we have to worry about it. 369 00:20:07,040 --> 00:20:08,800 Well, in the Fiat standard, I make the case. 370 00:20:08,960 --> 00:20:12,680 And I believe. It's, it's, it's a strong case 371 00:20:12,720 --> 00:20:15,320 when I'm biased, of course, I make the case for why this 372 00:20:15,320 --> 00:20:19,000 actually is a product of inflation, because there's, it's 373 00:20:19,040 --> 00:20:21,640 I, I don't think it's a coincidence that in the 1970s 374 00:20:21,640 --> 00:20:25,960 when inflation really took off, that that was when all of this 375 00:20:25,960 --> 00:20:27,920 environmental hysteria was really. 376 00:20:32,480 --> 00:20:35,360 It really exploded and became a serious thing. 377 00:20:35,360 --> 00:20:38,200 You know, people didn't really worry so much about it before 378 00:20:38,200 --> 00:20:40,360 the 1970s. But why did it happen in the 379 00:20:40,360 --> 00:20:42,200 1970s? Well, the major driver for it 380 00:20:42,200 --> 00:20:45,120 was that prices of things were rising. 381 00:20:45,480 --> 00:20:50,040 And so naturally people assumed the price of oil and nickel and 382 00:20:50,040 --> 00:20:52,520 copper and the uranium is going up. 383 00:20:52,520 --> 00:20:54,920 That must mean that we're running out of those things. 384 00:20:55,320 --> 00:20:59,240 So there you be. Have the roots of the hysteria 385 00:20:59,240 --> 00:21:02,400 in the 1st place. But then I think it's a much 386 00:21:02,400 --> 00:21:04,800 more adaptive story, like with everything with Fiat, you know 387 00:21:04,800 --> 00:21:07,560 Fiat because it's the lifeblood of the system. 388 00:21:07,560 --> 00:21:12,640 It then shapes the system in a way that is optimized for 389 00:21:12,640 --> 00:21:16,360 acquiring more Fiat. So the environmental hysteria 390 00:21:16,360 --> 00:21:21,240 caused by Fiat then gets captured by Fiat money and 391 00:21:21,240 --> 00:21:26,960 turned into another way of propagandizing people to ignore 392 00:21:26,960 --> 00:21:28,840 the inflation that is robbing them and destroying their 393 00:21:28,840 --> 00:21:32,680 livelihood. And so the reason that 394 00:21:32,680 --> 00:21:36,360 everything is more expensive is because we're running out. 395 00:21:36,360 --> 00:21:39,000 It's because oil is bad. It's because oil is going to 396 00:21:39,000 --> 00:21:41,160 destroy the environment. This is not sustainable. 397 00:21:41,400 --> 00:21:43,520 So we need to reduce your oil consumption. 398 00:21:43,760 --> 00:21:46,920 And we need you to switch to forms of energy that are 399 00:21:46,960 --> 00:21:50,840 essentially pre civilized, pre industrialized, that are 400 00:21:50,840 --> 00:21:53,560 dependent on the weather, you know, wind and solar and that 401 00:21:53,640 --> 00:21:58,240 are unreliable and that leave you at the mercy of nature. 402 00:21:58,240 --> 00:22:04,200 And they are. A lot less reliable, but they're 403 00:22:04,200 --> 00:22:07,880 also cheaper in a sense that they. 404 00:22:07,880 --> 00:22:11,000 Are. Not that they do not require 405 00:22:11,000 --> 00:22:15,800 constant fuel input and therefore the that they are 406 00:22:15,800 --> 00:22:18,880 less. Likely to make you notice the 407 00:22:18,880 --> 00:22:21,800 inflation you have to fill up your gas tank in the car every 408 00:22:21,800 --> 00:22:27,120 week, but you don't have to refill your windmill. 409 00:22:27,240 --> 00:22:30,400 Now the windmill is nowhere near as good as having, you know, 410 00:22:30,400 --> 00:22:34,640 twenty 20th century hydrocarbon power that's available on 24/7, 411 00:22:35,440 --> 00:22:38,800 but it makes the inflation look better, so. 412 00:22:38,800 --> 00:22:40,840 Trying to get you. To reduce your consumption of 413 00:22:40,840 --> 00:22:43,760 hydrocarbons is a way to hide the inflation. 414 00:22:44,240 --> 00:22:49,680 And I think This is why people are so heavily propagandized 415 00:22:49,920 --> 00:22:52,280 against energy consumption because, you know, all the 416 00:22:52,280 --> 00:22:53,800 energy is going to destroy the planet. 417 00:22:53,800 --> 00:22:56,760 So, you know, stay poor so that we can you can be a good person. 418 00:22:57,160 --> 00:22:59,760 This entire idea that consuming energy is bad. 419 00:22:59,760 --> 00:23:03,480 You know, people think that all these celebrities who consume a 420 00:23:03,480 --> 00:23:05,000 lot of energy, that it's a bad thing. 421 00:23:05,000 --> 00:23:08,000 They shame them for them. Of course, you know, when those 422 00:23:08,000 --> 00:23:11,920 celebrities are out there shaming others for staying warm 423 00:23:11,920 --> 00:23:15,480 in the winter, then yeah, we should shame them for getting on 424 00:23:15,480 --> 00:23:18,240 their yachts or whatever. But there's nothing wrong with 425 00:23:18,400 --> 00:23:20,360 consuming a lot of energy. It's a good thing this is how we 426 00:23:20,360 --> 00:23:22,080 stay. We survived the winter. 427 00:23:22,080 --> 00:23:25,040 And if you want the world to have more energy, you want us to 428 00:23:25,040 --> 00:23:28,480 be consuming and producing more. You want Jeff Bezos to even have 429 00:23:28,480 --> 00:23:31,800 a bigger boat Because if he's investing and buying a bigger 430 00:23:31,800 --> 00:23:35,200 boat, he's. Spending so much money on the 431 00:23:35,200 --> 00:23:38,360 boat industry, that's generating more and more boats, producing 432 00:23:38,360 --> 00:23:41,440 more and more energy, causing energy to become more plentiful, 433 00:23:41,720 --> 00:23:44,880 more. Capital intensive and therefore 434 00:23:44,880 --> 00:23:47,120 cheaper and more widely available for the world. 435 00:23:47,440 --> 00:23:51,160 We're not going to be able to have people in poverty who don't 436 00:23:51,160 --> 00:23:52,440 have electricity. They're not going to get 437 00:23:52,440 --> 00:23:56,480 electricity without the rest of the world also increasing its 438 00:23:56,560 --> 00:23:58,760 energy consumption. That's the healthy way of 439 00:23:58,760 --> 00:23:59,360 thinking. About it. 440 00:23:59,360 --> 00:24:02,160 But Fiat has turned people to thinking of energy consumption 441 00:24:02,160 --> 00:24:04,680 as a bad thing, and it's all about how we try to reduce it 442 00:24:05,040 --> 00:24:06,960 and we need to reduce and we need to make less and less and 443 00:24:06,960 --> 00:24:08,520 less of it. And it's just a completely 444 00:24:08,520 --> 00:24:11,160 incoherent. Idea because you know, nobody 445 00:24:11,160 --> 00:24:14,760 goes around saying my favorite example washing machines. 446 00:24:14,760 --> 00:24:17,360 Nobody goes around saying hey, you know what the washing 447 00:24:17,360 --> 00:24:20,000 machine is not going to take off. 448 00:24:20,000 --> 00:24:23,200 I don't think it to succeed as a technology because it consumes a 449 00:24:23,200 --> 00:24:25,200 lot more energy than just washing with your hand. 450 00:24:25,200 --> 00:24:27,880 You know, just go and wash with your hands and it's cheaper and 451 00:24:27,880 --> 00:24:31,000 easier and you don't have to buy a big giant machine that takes 452 00:24:31,000 --> 00:24:35,000 up a lot of electricity. And yet basically nobody in the 453 00:24:35,000 --> 00:24:38,040 world would say no to having a washing machine. 454 00:24:38,040 --> 00:24:41,880 Absolutely nobody who can have a washing machine, I think, 455 00:24:42,760 --> 00:24:45,360 chooses to go without one because nobody wants to wash 456 00:24:45,360 --> 00:24:48,680 their own clothes with their hands because it's too much too 457 00:24:48,680 --> 00:24:51,720 time intensive. So ultimately with technology 458 00:24:51,720 --> 00:24:53,880 gets adopted because it saves human time. 459 00:24:53,920 --> 00:24:57,720 And the reason it does that almost always is through 460 00:24:57,720 --> 00:25:00,240 increasing the utilization of energy. 461 00:25:00,240 --> 00:25:03,040 For the more ways we find of using energy, the more 462 00:25:03,760 --> 00:25:05,880 productive we become and that's a good thing and that's 463 00:25:05,880 --> 00:25:08,000 technological progress and it has always been. 464 00:25:08,360 --> 00:25:11,360 And it's an absolute shame that for the past 50-60 years been 465 00:25:11,360 --> 00:25:15,000 demonized this idea and we're reducing our energy consumption 466 00:25:15,000 --> 00:25:17,320 and the Fiat standard. I argue that this is. 467 00:25:18,400 --> 00:25:21,680 Reversed a trend of. Continuous growth in per capita 468 00:25:21,680 --> 00:25:25,520 energy consumption that has essentially stagnated for the 469 00:25:26,160 --> 00:25:29,360 past 50 years or so across the globe. 470 00:25:29,880 --> 00:25:33,480 And that for me is one of the major problems that we have in 471 00:25:33,480 --> 00:25:35,720 the world. We're getting poorer effectively 472 00:25:35,720 --> 00:25:39,000 because we can't afford energy, because we can't afford capital, 473 00:25:39,000 --> 00:25:41,720 because all of our capital being destroyed by inflation. 474 00:25:42,160 --> 00:25:46,160 Yeah. Isn't this also because the, the 475 00:25:46,440 --> 00:25:49,680 kind of like the result of, you know, in the beginning, in the 476 00:25:49,680 --> 00:25:51,640 beginning of the introduction of Fiat money? 477 00:25:51,640 --> 00:25:57,160 Let's take 7/19/71 in in, you know, in, in this context, it is 478 00:25:57,160 --> 00:25:59,160 actually a very brilliant idea, right? 479 00:25:59,160 --> 00:26:03,600 If you can just create a potential productivity out of 480 00:26:03,600 --> 00:26:06,280 nothing and you can start spending that in a country, you 481 00:26:06,280 --> 00:26:10,360 can actually, you know, grow and and build a country at at least 482 00:26:10,360 --> 00:26:12,800 in the beginning when you're introducing it, right? 483 00:26:12,800 --> 00:26:17,000 But over time, the maintaining as you're alluding to, right, 484 00:26:17,000 --> 00:26:22,720 like keeps demanding more obscurity, more layers on top 485 00:26:22,720 --> 00:26:27,640 right, more, more distractions to point people towards another 486 00:26:27,640 --> 00:26:31,320 cause of you know what whatever is going downhill in order to 487 00:26:31,320 --> 00:26:35,120 not understand the kind of like fundamental origin of it. 488 00:26:35,120 --> 00:26:39,160 And I think, you know, this goes, this goes so deep that 489 00:26:39,160 --> 00:26:42,920 even the, the, the people that are closer to the money printer, 490 00:26:42,920 --> 00:26:45,280 right? In, in finance, for example, 491 00:26:45,280 --> 00:26:48,120 with, with ESG, right? It's something that BlackRock 492 00:26:48,120 --> 00:26:51,800 came up with and they, they shared that all over the world. 493 00:26:51,800 --> 00:26:54,680 Now they're saying ESG is dead. But for example, the biggest 494 00:26:54,680 --> 00:26:58,800 pension fund in my country is still full on into all the ESG 495 00:26:58,920 --> 00:27:01,760 stuff, right? So even in those, even in those 496 00:27:01,760 --> 00:27:07,880 layers, there, there is a, I would say, well, not 497 00:27:07,880 --> 00:27:13,040 misunderstanding, but there it's like a like a ideological battle 498 00:27:13,040 --> 00:27:16,400 or, or philosophical battle going on where not everyone 499 00:27:16,640 --> 00:27:19,880 actually understands what they are participating in. 500 00:27:19,880 --> 00:27:26,600 So I'd say even at those levels, they are part of a scam that has 501 00:27:26,600 --> 00:27:31,040 a certain narrative, but they even even they don't understand 502 00:27:31,080 --> 00:27:36,240 that they are subject to yeah, this obfuscation or or 503 00:27:36,240 --> 00:27:38,640 abstraction, right. And I and I think it goes you 504 00:27:38,640 --> 00:27:41,320 you talked about diamonds being shit coins, right? 505 00:27:41,920 --> 00:27:45,400 A similar example of something that essentially organized has 506 00:27:45,400 --> 00:27:48,080 essentially controlled narrative, right, and turns out 507 00:27:48,080 --> 00:27:52,880 to to be a a scam. And maybe just a fun question 508 00:27:52,880 --> 00:27:54,440 for you. Do do you think you need to take 509 00:27:54,440 --> 00:27:56,520 a little red pill before you can take the orange pill? 510 00:27:56,520 --> 00:28:00,320 Like you need to accept that apparently this is going on, 511 00:28:00,320 --> 00:28:03,320 right? That that there is a certain way 512 00:28:03,320 --> 00:28:08,160 of how the system works that is being kept away from you on on 513 00:28:08,160 --> 00:28:10,080 purpose? Like you have to accept that 514 00:28:10,600 --> 00:28:13,800 people lie to you before you can even imagine. 515 00:28:13,800 --> 00:28:17,880 What a solution? Could be, yeah, I think there's, 516 00:28:18,080 --> 00:28:20,200 there's definitely an element of truth to that. 517 00:28:20,200 --> 00:28:25,840 And I would say there is another way of looking at it is that you 518 00:28:26,040 --> 00:28:29,040 have to take the orange pill in order to take a red pill. 519 00:28:29,200 --> 00:28:33,960 In other words, unless you understand the money issue, then 520 00:28:33,960 --> 00:28:36,080 everything else doesn't quite make sense. 521 00:28:37,000 --> 00:28:39,720 From my European friends that want to buy Bitcoin with ease, 522 00:28:39,720 --> 00:28:42,560 check out Relay. I've been a long time fan and 523 00:28:42,560 --> 00:28:45,680 happy to partner up with what I think is the best Bitcoin only 524 00:28:45,680 --> 00:28:49,040 platform for Europeans. They offer a super simple 525 00:28:49,040 --> 00:28:53,200 beginner friendly app with no distractions and no shit coins. 526 00:28:53,680 --> 00:28:56,800 You can do a quick one time smash buy or set up automatic 527 00:28:56,800 --> 00:28:59,120 purchases when you're stacking regularly. 528 00:28:59,480 --> 00:29:01,080 And here's the thing that matters most. 529 00:29:01,360 --> 00:29:05,960 Relay is 100% self custody. Every set you hold is yours, 530 00:29:06,200 --> 00:29:09,080 your keys, your coins. If you want to get started, 531 00:29:09,080 --> 00:29:11,800 download the app file in my link below or in the description and 532 00:29:11,800 --> 00:29:16,160 use code BRUM that's BR AM at checkout to get 10% off your 533 00:29:16,160 --> 00:29:18,160 fees. A huge shout out to Relay for 534 00:29:18,160 --> 00:29:20,200 sponsoring the show. Now let's continue. 535 00:29:20,240 --> 00:29:25,960 Unless you understand that there is a, there's a essentially a 536 00:29:25,960 --> 00:29:28,640 back door to the global economic system. 537 00:29:28,640 --> 00:29:31,280 There's a back door to everybody's economic system. 538 00:29:31,680 --> 00:29:34,360 Where just like if there's a back door into your computer, I 539 00:29:34,360 --> 00:29:38,560 could get into your computer and see any information I want and 540 00:29:38,560 --> 00:29:41,160 run it in a certain way and manipulate it in a way that 541 00:29:41,880 --> 00:29:44,120 surprises you because you're expecting your computer to do 542 00:29:44,120 --> 00:29:45,560 something and then something else comes out. 543 00:29:46,600 --> 00:29:48,840 It's not going to make sense unless you understand that your 544 00:29:48,840 --> 00:29:51,840 computer has a back door. Unless your computer has a back 545 00:29:51,840 --> 00:29:54,000 door. You're sitting there and you're 546 00:29:54,000 --> 00:29:57,360 not sure, and you're wondering if there's something wrong with 547 00:29:57,360 --> 00:29:59,960 the guy who sold you the computer or if the maintenance 548 00:29:59,960 --> 00:30:02,400 guy is messing with you and you're not quite sure. 549 00:30:02,400 --> 00:30:04,080 But then you realize, OK, there's a back door. 550 00:30:04,080 --> 00:30:09,320 And this thing is being essentially weaponized against 551 00:30:09,320 --> 00:30:10,200 me. It's robbing me. 552 00:30:10,200 --> 00:30:13,120 It's taking my information, it's manipulating me in certain ways. 553 00:30:13,840 --> 00:30:17,720 And essentially, I mean, you see those lies in every field of 554 00:30:17,720 --> 00:30:21,000 life. And I think the Fiat pill 555 00:30:21,040 --> 00:30:26,680 understanding the problem of Fiat is a is is. 556 00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:30,240 Essential for mental health? Because the more you see those 557 00:30:30,240 --> 00:30:32,840 things, the more it. Frustrates you because you go 558 00:30:32,840 --> 00:30:35,600 around, you think, you know, we live in a world in which you 559 00:30:35,600 --> 00:30:38,920 need to work and then you reap the reward and. 560 00:30:39,760 --> 00:30:42,120 Theft is wrong. People shouldn't take things 561 00:30:42,120 --> 00:30:43,880 from others. People shouldn't violate the 562 00:30:43,880 --> 00:30:47,880 property of others. And then you notice that all of 563 00:30:47,880 --> 00:30:50,680 the institutions that are supposed to be there to enforce 564 00:30:50,680 --> 00:30:54,680 this are in fact enforcing the exact opposite of of it in terms 565 00:30:54,680 --> 00:30:56,240 of theft. And it doesn't make sense. 566 00:30:56,600 --> 00:30:59,400 And you know, you could discover this in terms of money. 567 00:31:00,120 --> 00:31:03,440 You could discover it in in the sense of the theft of inflation. 568 00:31:03,440 --> 00:31:06,040 You could discover it in terms of all the lies that you see in 569 00:31:06,040 --> 00:31:10,800 all these bullshit fields of. Science and academia and media 570 00:31:10,800 --> 00:31:13,680 and propaganda. So a lot of. 571 00:31:14,760 --> 00:31:17,440 You know, climate science is essentially a stupid 572 00:31:17,440 --> 00:31:18,960 pseudoscience in modern universities. 573 00:31:18,960 --> 00:31:20,880 Macroeconomics is a stupid pseudoscience. 574 00:31:21,280 --> 00:31:24,880 Modern nutrition science is just a recipe to get you sick and 575 00:31:24,880 --> 00:31:28,600 profitable for pharmaceutical companies and junk food 576 00:31:28,600 --> 00:31:31,440 companies. And, you know, discovering one 577 00:31:31,440 --> 00:31:33,640 of those things and you see these people on the Internet who 578 00:31:34,360 --> 00:31:36,440 fall down one of these particular rabbit holes. 579 00:31:36,800 --> 00:31:40,240 And it can be pretty. Disconcerting. 580 00:31:40,240 --> 00:31:44,080 And it can be confusing and it can be destructive to a person. 581 00:31:44,080 --> 00:31:47,240 Imagine, you know, you're a nutrition PhD, and then in your 582 00:31:47,240 --> 00:31:51,120 last few years in your nutrition PhD, you realize you're just out 583 00:31:51,120 --> 00:31:54,040 there telling people how to eat, to be sick, and that if you 584 00:31:54,040 --> 00:31:56,640 wanted them to be healthy, you would tell them the exact 585 00:31:56,640 --> 00:31:59,320 opposite of what's your job. It requires you to tell them. 586 00:31:59,880 --> 00:32:03,320 That can break a person to find that out. 587 00:32:03,720 --> 00:32:05,840 And it breaks them with the more they think. 588 00:32:05,840 --> 00:32:07,800 About it how is this this thing still alive? 589 00:32:07,800 --> 00:32:12,440 How is the system still functioning and understanding 590 00:32:12,440 --> 00:32:14,400 how money works? You start seeing it everywhere 591 00:32:14,400 --> 00:32:19,640 and still start. Being capable of accepting that, 592 00:32:19,640 --> 00:32:22,960 yeah, this thing is a big giant lie, OK, nutrition is a lie. 593 00:32:22,960 --> 00:32:24,360 So what else? The climate is a lie. 594 00:32:24,480 --> 00:32:26,480 Makes sense. I mean, it's the same university 595 00:32:26,480 --> 00:32:28,480 that publishes all the nutrition garbage. 596 00:32:28,960 --> 00:32:33,840 Clearly their climate garbage is not going to be much different. 597 00:32:34,400 --> 00:32:37,400 And so you're much more capable of accepting these days because 598 00:32:37,400 --> 00:32:38,560 you can. See the mechanism and you 599 00:32:38,560 --> 00:32:43,120 realize that ultimately. In a free market where you don't 600 00:32:43,120 --> 00:32:48,480 have that Fiat back door success for any idea or any business or 601 00:32:48,480 --> 00:32:53,320 any avenue of human endeavor, success in that Ave. in anything 602 00:32:53,320 --> 00:32:56,880 is going to be dependent on meeting the needs of others, 603 00:32:56,880 --> 00:32:59,440 being able to help others in value. 604 00:32:59,440 --> 00:33:01,560 So if you're going to set up a restaurant, it's only going to 605 00:33:01,560 --> 00:33:03,080 succeed if you're able to feed others. 606 00:33:03,520 --> 00:33:05,960 And if you're going to set up a bank, it's only going to succeed 607 00:33:05,960 --> 00:33:07,800 if it feeds others. And if you're going to set up a. 608 00:33:08,520 --> 00:33:11,560 University, it's only going to succeed if it can help people 609 00:33:12,520 --> 00:33:15,680 increase their knowledge in ways that are beneficial to them, 610 00:33:15,680 --> 00:33:18,040 that they value, that they're willing to pay for, that they're 611 00:33:18,040 --> 00:33:21,880 willing to tell their friends and family to go and pay for as 612 00:33:21,880 --> 00:33:24,880 well. So in that world, you have to 613 00:33:24,880 --> 00:33:27,800 be. Tethered to reality, the 614 00:33:27,800 --> 00:33:30,680 nutrition department has to tell people how to actually stop 615 00:33:30,680 --> 00:33:33,480 being fat and sick. And if you don't do that, you go 616 00:33:33,480 --> 00:33:36,400 out of business. But in the Fiat world, you 617 00:33:36,400 --> 00:33:38,400 don't. And that's really the powerful 618 00:33:38,400 --> 00:33:41,200 idea of Fiat, because the success of a particular 619 00:33:41,200 --> 00:33:43,280 nutrition. Department for instance, in any 620 00:33:43,280 --> 00:33:46,120 particular. University is almost entirely 621 00:33:46,120 --> 00:33:51,400 removed from the success of their teachings at helping the 622 00:33:51,640 --> 00:33:53,880 patients and clients achieve the results that they want. 623 00:33:54,520 --> 00:33:57,320 So if you want to work. On. 624 00:34:00,000 --> 00:34:04,520 On nutrition, your job is not to go out there and help people. 625 00:34:04,520 --> 00:34:09,840 Your job is to secure funding. And because Fiat is what funds 626 00:34:09,840 --> 00:34:11,880 the university of Fiat is what funds academia. 627 00:34:11,880 --> 00:34:15,679 So Fiat is not doing that for free. 628 00:34:15,679 --> 00:34:17,480 There are certain. Things that you need to do, you 629 00:34:17,480 --> 00:34:19,600 need to be loyal to the Fiat regime. 630 00:34:19,600 --> 00:34:22,080 Essentially you need to repeat the Fiat regime propaganda in 631 00:34:22,080 --> 00:34:25,040 order to get the Fiat funding. And so that's. 632 00:34:25,040 --> 00:34:27,360 Why nutrition departments can continue. 633 00:34:28,239 --> 00:34:30,400 For 70 years to tell people to eat. 634 00:34:30,440 --> 00:34:34,159 Garbage and it just continues. And when somebody points out, 635 00:34:34,159 --> 00:34:36,600 hey, look, you're feeding them garbage, they're getting fat, 636 00:34:36,600 --> 00:34:40,000 they're getting sick. Then you either have to double 637 00:34:40,000 --> 00:34:42,880 down on the recommendations of let's feed them more garbage, 638 00:34:42,880 --> 00:34:45,600 let's feed them garbage harder, or, you know, make some 639 00:34:45,639 --> 00:34:50,280 inconsequential to the tiny detail of maybe put some garnish 640 00:34:50,280 --> 00:34:54,440 on the garbage. You, you, you get to keep your 641 00:34:54,440 --> 00:34:55,440 job. But if you're trying to do 642 00:34:55,440 --> 00:34:57,920 something drastic, say no, actually what we're doing is 643 00:34:57,920 --> 00:34:59,600 wrong and we should stop feeding them garbage. 644 00:34:59,840 --> 00:35:01,880 Or you're going to lose the Fiat funding and then you're going to 645 00:35:01,880 --> 00:35:03,960 be ostracized and you're going to be called a crank and you're 646 00:35:03,960 --> 00:35:07,040 going to be called a crazy conspiracy theorist and you're 647 00:35:07,040 --> 00:35:08,040 going. To lose your job and you're 648 00:35:08,040 --> 00:35:09,800 going to lose your. Wife and family and you're going 649 00:35:09,800 --> 00:35:11,760 to end up on the street and you're going to end up homeless 650 00:35:12,160 --> 00:35:15,160 and it's going to drive you mad because how is it that all these 651 00:35:15,160 --> 00:35:19,600 people don't understand that? It's very obvious that what I'm 652 00:35:20,360 --> 00:35:22,920 telling them is true and they don't get it. 653 00:35:22,960 --> 00:35:26,440 But they can't get and you need to stop trying. 654 00:35:26,440 --> 00:35:34,200 To argue with this wall of. People who aren't paid to think, 655 00:35:34,200 --> 00:35:37,160 people are paid to just repeat their propaganda. 656 00:35:37,560 --> 00:35:43,560 So I think these things are just, this is really, I think 657 00:35:43,560 --> 00:35:46,160 the most powerful thing about Bitcoin because it it helps you 658 00:35:46,160 --> 00:35:49,200 understand all of those things in concert, you see. 659 00:35:49,200 --> 00:35:50,760 Why? OK, they're lying about the 660 00:35:50,760 --> 00:35:52,480 wars. They're lying about history. 661 00:35:52,480 --> 00:35:54,800 They're lying about what's happening today. 662 00:35:54,800 --> 00:35:56,160 They're lying about what happened yesterday. 663 00:35:56,160 --> 00:35:57,480 They're going to lie about what's going to happen. 664 00:35:57,480 --> 00:35:59,920 Tomorrow they're lying about the food, they're lying about the 665 00:35:59,960 --> 00:36:02,720 electricity, they're lying about everything there is. 666 00:36:02,720 --> 00:36:05,160 There are certain interests that benefit from each one of these 667 00:36:05,160 --> 00:36:07,120 lies. And then once they get their 668 00:36:08,000 --> 00:36:13,120 claws on to the Fiat printer and they can direct it in the ways 669 00:36:13,600 --> 00:36:17,000 that they want to finance the institutions that they want, 670 00:36:17,000 --> 00:36:20,440 that they can just build this narrative that they want to last 671 00:36:20,480 --> 00:36:24,520 for as long as the currency lasts and as long as we have a 672 00:36:24,520 --> 00:36:26,920 dollar, we're going to have. All of the Fiat world. 673 00:36:26,920 --> 00:36:31,200 The bullshit. Bitcoin was or, or well, the 674 00:36:31,200 --> 00:36:34,080 what is money question was really for me the opening for 675 00:36:34,080 --> 00:36:36,880 the rest of the rabbit hole. Because if this isn't true and 676 00:36:36,880 --> 00:36:38,800 everything is downstream from the money, right? 677 00:36:38,800 --> 00:36:43,920 If all the incentives change or or possibly can change because 678 00:36:43,920 --> 00:36:48,000 of the quality of the money, then basically everything coming 679 00:36:48,000 --> 00:36:52,000 from the money can also be corrupted, right? 680 00:36:52,000 --> 00:36:57,000 And it's, it's just very hard to distinguish what is real, 681 00:36:57,000 --> 00:37:00,120 whatever real is, right, and and what is fake and what is good 682 00:37:00,120 --> 00:37:03,520 and, and what is bad. And I think that is what makes 683 00:37:03,520 --> 00:37:09,280 this time also so strange is that at the towards the end of 684 00:37:09,280 --> 00:37:12,440 this Fiat Mani regime, it's just getting crazier and more 685 00:37:12,440 --> 00:37:15,440 chaotic, right? And there's just more fog and 686 00:37:15,440 --> 00:37:18,280 it's just more and more difficult for more and more 687 00:37:18,280 --> 00:37:20,840 people to actually find this. Yeah. 688 00:37:20,840 --> 00:37:23,600 What I think is, is, is the light in the darkness, which is 689 00:37:24,000 --> 00:37:27,160 Bitcoin, right? But then along the way, we have 690 00:37:27,160 --> 00:37:31,720 people even like Christine Lagarde of the ECB talking about 691 00:37:31,720 --> 00:37:35,080 Bitcoin, which I think is a huge signal. 692 00:37:35,080 --> 00:37:38,840 And I wanted to ask you how you judge that when you see people 693 00:37:38,840 --> 00:37:40,680 in those places talk about Bitcoin. 694 00:37:40,680 --> 00:37:44,360 Because if it's irrelevant and stupid and a random Tulip Ponzi, 695 00:37:44,360 --> 00:37:48,720 whatever bubble, why would you even waste the breath on 696 00:37:48,720 --> 00:37:50,920 Bitcoin? So what do you think when these 697 00:37:51,280 --> 00:37:54,080 types of people in these positions talk about Bitcoin? 698 00:37:54,080 --> 00:37:57,600 What kind of signal is that? I think it signals that they're 699 00:37:57,680 --> 00:38:00,520 essentially irrelevant. I think that's the most 700 00:38:00,920 --> 00:38:03,520 important thing to take from anything that they say, because 701 00:38:03,800 --> 00:38:06,480 nothing they say can affect Bitcoin in a real sense. 702 00:38:07,200 --> 00:38:11,280 The Bitcoin protocol isn't going to find the next proof of work 703 00:38:11,280 --> 00:38:15,280 solution faster because Lagarde said something and it's not 704 00:38:15,280 --> 00:38:18,560 going to be able to, you know, clear my transaction without a 705 00:38:18,560 --> 00:38:21,560 transaction fee because she said something and it's not going to 706 00:38:21,560 --> 00:38:24,720 allow me to double spend anything because she or somebody 707 00:38:24,720 --> 00:38:28,720 like her said anything. So for me, the most powerful 708 00:38:28,720 --> 00:38:31,480 thing about it, and this is one of the things that really made 709 00:38:31,480 --> 00:38:37,320 me switch my thinking on Bitcoin when I went from being a skeptic 710 00:38:37,320 --> 00:38:41,960 it to being a Bitcoiner is just. That it continues to operate. 711 00:38:41,960 --> 00:38:44,360 There's something so powerful about the fact that it's a piece 712 00:38:44,360 --> 00:38:45,840 of software that's generating a new. 713 00:38:45,840 --> 00:38:48,320 Block every 10 minutes and anybody in the world can see 714 00:38:48,320 --> 00:38:50,000 that. You can just go and see that 715 00:38:50,000 --> 00:38:52,480 every 10 minutes. Approximately there's a new 716 00:38:52,480 --> 00:38:55,240 block coming out. And then on the other hand, you 717 00:38:55,240 --> 00:38:59,240 have Fiat world where it's, you know, stupid people get on 718 00:38:59,240 --> 00:39:01,280 podiums and say things and then things happen. 719 00:39:01,280 --> 00:39:03,400 You know, Trump gets on and says we're going to destroy their 720 00:39:03,400 --> 00:39:06,120 electricity and then people lose electricity. 721 00:39:06,760 --> 00:39:12,120 And that is a different world. It's, you know, government with 722 00:39:12,120 --> 00:39:15,920 Fiat has destroyed people's understanding of how the world 723 00:39:15,920 --> 00:39:19,160 actually functions and turned it into just thinking that there 724 00:39:19,160 --> 00:39:22,120 has to be some big daddy who gets on a podium at some point 725 00:39:22,120 --> 00:39:24,640 and says something and then we listen and then the world 726 00:39:25,080 --> 00:39:26,640 changes. And so, you know, people listen 727 00:39:26,640 --> 00:39:29,600 to politician speeches, which I think is just an insane thing to 728 00:39:29,600 --> 00:39:32,440 do. It's, it's, it's almost as crazy 729 00:39:32,440 --> 00:39:35,640 as having a heroin addict. You're just ruining your brain 730 00:39:35,680 --> 00:39:39,320 for a quick fix of. Dopamine. 731 00:39:39,320 --> 00:39:41,240 I've accept that dopamine from heroin. 732 00:39:41,240 --> 00:39:44,560 It presumes likely a lot better. Than what you get from listening 733 00:39:44,560 --> 00:39:50,200 to a politician. But ultimately the key thing is 734 00:39:50,200 --> 00:39:53,360 that nothing that they say can actually change anything in the 735 00:39:54,120 --> 00:39:56,760 Bitcoin world. And so Bitcoin continues to 736 00:39:56,760 --> 00:40:00,560 operate even as all of these people go through all kinds of 737 00:40:00,800 --> 00:40:03,320 silly misunderstandings and silly statements about what 738 00:40:03,320 --> 00:40:05,120 Bitcoin is. They say that Bitcoin is for 739 00:40:05,120 --> 00:40:08,040 criminals. Doesn't matter TikTok next 740 00:40:08,040 --> 00:40:09,960 block. Then they change their mind and 741 00:40:09,960 --> 00:40:13,000 say, well, actually, maybe it can be useful for people who are 742 00:40:13,040 --> 00:40:16,000 in dysfunctional currencies. What is this going to do? 743 00:40:16,000 --> 00:40:20,480 Doesn't matter TikTok next block and number go up number keeps 744 00:40:20,480 --> 00:40:24,000 going up block number keeps going up and these people can 745 00:40:24,000 --> 00:40:27,120 make whatever noises that they want and it's I think it's 746 00:40:27,160 --> 00:40:31,520 beautiful because it it's it's beautiful because first of all. 747 00:40:31,640 --> 00:40:34,480 It allows you as a. Bitcoiner not to care because if 748 00:40:34,480 --> 00:40:36,320 you weren't the Bitcoin, if you didn't have Bitcoin, you have to 749 00:40:36,320 --> 00:40:38,200 care about what Christine Lagarde says and you have to 750 00:40:38,200 --> 00:40:41,000 care about what Jay Powell says and what Trump says and what all 751 00:40:41,000 --> 00:40:43,760 these people say because your entire portfolio depends on 752 00:40:43,760 --> 00:40:45,120 them. If the Trump decides to put 753 00:40:45,120 --> 00:40:48,800 tariffs, then your savings are wiped out. 754 00:40:48,800 --> 00:40:51,440 You might have to dry, delay retirement. 755 00:40:51,680 --> 00:40:52,840 So you need to follow that stuff. 756 00:40:53,040 --> 00:40:55,360 But with Bitcoin, you don't really have to care about what 757 00:40:55,360 --> 00:40:57,200 they say. You just buy your Bitcoin and 758 00:40:57,200 --> 00:41:00,400 then these people become like a circus that is irrelevant to 759 00:41:00,400 --> 00:41:02,160 your life. You know, if you go and watch 760 00:41:02,160 --> 00:41:04,920 it, it's not going to affect you in any way as you're just 761 00:41:04,920 --> 00:41:07,200 wasting time and money on watching it. 762 00:41:07,480 --> 00:41:11,360 So that's the best thing about it that that you're protected. 763 00:41:11,680 --> 00:41:15,600 But I think also the secondary order of it is that you start 764 00:41:16,560 --> 00:41:19,160 understanding that there are things that. 765 00:41:19,880 --> 00:41:24,000 Should not be up for people on Podia to decide. 766 00:41:24,480 --> 00:41:28,480 And there needs to be a, a, a deeper understanding that more 767 00:41:28,480 --> 00:41:30,760 and more of the world needs to be outside the control of these 768 00:41:30,760 --> 00:41:33,600 lunatics so that it doesn't matter which kind of lunatic we 769 00:41:33,600 --> 00:41:35,840 we get. It doesn't matter which 770 00:41:36,160 --> 00:41:39,760 blackmailed demented paedophile is in charge. 771 00:41:40,000 --> 00:41:43,640 They can't destroy the money. That's the thing I I wouldn't 772 00:41:43,640 --> 00:41:47,240 care about whether it's the red or the blue demented paedophile 773 00:41:47,240 --> 00:41:49,800 who's in charge, as long as they don't have a money printer. 774 00:41:49,800 --> 00:41:52,800 The amount of damage that they can do is massively, massively 775 00:41:52,800 --> 00:41:56,400 restricted. And so Bitcoin is restoring 776 00:41:56,400 --> 00:41:58,040 this. And it's, you know, of course it 777 00:41:58,040 --> 00:42:01,560 helps that in the late stages of Fiat, you know, they are not 778 00:42:01,560 --> 00:42:05,640 sending their best, you know, But at least in the 1960s, 779 00:42:05,640 --> 00:42:09,360 nineteen 50s, at the early stages of the degeneration of 780 00:42:09,800 --> 00:42:13,600 civilization, at least the presidents looked presidential 781 00:42:13,600 --> 00:42:17,960 and they could string together a few sentences without sounding 782 00:42:17,960 --> 00:42:20,800 like complete morons. Now they don't. 783 00:42:22,800 --> 00:42:26,760 The guy before this one was sniffing children on stage and 784 00:42:26,760 --> 00:42:29,720 nobody said anything about it. And he didn't even know his own 785 00:42:29,720 --> 00:42:33,920 name at the end of his term. And this new guy is complete 786 00:42:34,000 --> 00:42:37,680 freaking lunatic who thinks Israeli ways of doing more are 787 00:42:37,680 --> 00:42:39,480 just normal. He just thinks it's normal to 788 00:42:39,480 --> 00:42:42,240 just go around and mass murder people and destroy their 789 00:42:42,240 --> 00:42:47,920 electricity and you're stuck with just continuously degrading 790 00:42:47,920 --> 00:42:51,000 quality of people. In fact, I mean, this is not 791 00:42:51,000 --> 00:42:54,440 even just not even subjective judgment. 792 00:42:54,680 --> 00:42:58,760 You look at the level of writing involved in presidential 793 00:42:58,760 --> 00:43:02,840 speeches and you see that basically we're down to 1/4 794 00:43:02,840 --> 00:43:07,040 grader whereas. 100 or 150 years ago, the US president would have 795 00:43:07,040 --> 00:43:10,600 been writing something at at the level of what would be 796 00:43:10,600 --> 00:43:12,280 considered a graduate student today. 797 00:43:12,680 --> 00:43:16,880 Now we're at a retarded 4th grader, a retarded, violent 4th 798 00:43:16,880 --> 00:43:21,800 grader who thinks it's normal to be telling people that he's 799 00:43:21,800 --> 00:43:26,280 going to be destroying all of their infrastructure. 800 00:43:26,960 --> 00:43:29,600 So, yeah. So I think it's, it's great that 801 00:43:29,600 --> 00:43:32,800 Bitcoin offers people the chance to just out of listening to 802 00:43:32,800 --> 00:43:36,440 these lunatics. And it's a small step. 803 00:43:37,280 --> 00:43:39,960 That continues to increase with every other person, and these 804 00:43:39,960 --> 00:43:41,960 people are just going to lose their. 805 00:43:42,080 --> 00:43:44,120 Power and their grip over people's minds. 806 00:43:44,120 --> 00:43:46,200 I think it's an end. That's an encouraging thing. 807 00:43:47,520 --> 00:43:51,000 Yeah, you just made me realize that, you know, belief in Fiat 808 00:43:51,000 --> 00:43:54,000 money is based on words and belief in Bitcoin is based on 809 00:43:54,000 --> 00:43:57,120 work, right? So if you want to align with 810 00:43:57,320 --> 00:44:04,560 with words that more than not eventually are shown to be 811 00:44:04,560 --> 00:44:07,760 empty, right? Or do you want to align with 812 00:44:07,880 --> 00:44:09,680 with with work? And that's why I think it's 813 00:44:09,680 --> 00:44:13,800 also, yeah, a spiritual thing is like, do I want to be the actor 814 00:44:13,800 --> 00:44:15,400 or do I want to be the subject, right? 815 00:44:15,400 --> 00:44:19,000 Like, do I want to watch this speech of, you know, random, 816 00:44:19,000 --> 00:44:23,520 another president XYZ telling me, you know, everything is fine 817 00:44:23,520 --> 00:44:27,040 and I shouldn't worry? Or am I going to take upon this 818 00:44:27,040 --> 00:44:32,480 work of life basically upon myself and try to to make 819 00:44:32,480 --> 00:44:37,040 something of it, right. And I, I think that that comes 820 00:44:37,040 --> 00:44:41,160 back so many times that that Bitcoin is really this mirror to 821 00:44:41,160 --> 00:44:43,680 all this nonsense, right? Like there's this absolute 822 00:44:43,680 --> 00:44:47,640 transparency, there's the proof of work and, and Bitcoin is 823 00:44:47,640 --> 00:44:51,880 basically everything that Fiat money is, is, is not. 824 00:44:51,880 --> 00:44:56,840 And the cool thing is that, yeah, it, it's being shown more 825 00:44:56,840 --> 00:45:00,200 and more and more. But I do want to say like, it is 826 00:45:00,200 --> 00:45:04,160 quite slow or at least maybe maybe for us, right? 827 00:45:04,160 --> 00:45:08,000 Like in some way we figured this out or we think we we figured 828 00:45:08,000 --> 00:45:11,960 this out. But in, in my opinion, it's 829 00:45:11,960 --> 00:45:15,920 going slower than I thought before, or maybe that I would 830 00:45:15,920 --> 00:45:18,680 have wanted to before. Because, you know, it's becoming 831 00:45:18,680 --> 00:45:22,240 more and more obvious that there's only one ending for, for 832 00:45:22,240 --> 00:45:24,800 Fiat. And I, I just wanted to know, 833 00:45:24,800 --> 00:45:28,120 like, how is that for you? Like did did your vision change 834 00:45:28,800 --> 00:45:32,480 since, you know, riding the Bitcoin standard or, you know, 835 00:45:32,480 --> 00:45:35,160 starting to publicly share, you know, all your thoughts? 836 00:45:35,760 --> 00:45:39,120 Let's say, I think it's like 778 years ago, right? 837 00:45:39,120 --> 00:45:42,480 Like retail interest is less, there's more adoption as a 838 00:45:42,480 --> 00:45:45,880 financial asset rather than money, you know, like, do we 839 00:45:45,880 --> 00:45:47,880 need more time? What what are your thoughts 840 00:45:47,880 --> 00:45:49,800 around this? And and maybe also, yeah, how, 841 00:45:49,840 --> 00:45:52,560 how did they change for you over over this time period? 842 00:45:53,040 --> 00:45:59,400 Well, I think in my case, I was already pretty much a Bitcoin 843 00:45:59,400 --> 00:46:04,000 maximalist before, before Bitcoin was a thing. 844 00:46:05,080 --> 00:46:06,960 In other words, I, you know, I was already into Austrian 845 00:46:06,960 --> 00:46:08,680 economics, I was already a gold bug. 846 00:46:09,000 --> 00:46:12,760 I already believed in hard money and I already understood some of 847 00:46:12,760 --> 00:46:15,920 the problems of Fiat and the ways in which it ruins the 848 00:46:15,960 --> 00:46:16,720 world. So. 849 00:46:17,400 --> 00:46:23,160 In 2010, 2009, 2010, 2011 when I had. 850 00:46:23,600 --> 00:46:26,520 Not heard of Bitcoin or I may have heard in Bitcoin, Bitcoin 851 00:46:26,520 --> 00:46:30,560 in passing, but I didn't think much of Bitcoin during those 852 00:46:30,560 --> 00:46:33,080 days. If you had been one of my 853 00:46:33,080 --> 00:46:36,840 friends, you know, we would have been spending a lot of time 854 00:46:37,040 --> 00:46:39,120 talking. I would have been wasting a lot 855 00:46:39,120 --> 00:46:41,640 of your time talking to you about the problems of Fiat, that 856 00:46:41,640 --> 00:46:46,160 now Fiat destroys everything and inflation and the gold standard. 857 00:46:47,280 --> 00:46:52,320 This is what I practiced on all of my friends during that 858 00:46:52,320 --> 00:46:54,160 period. And then, you know, they all 859 00:46:54,360 --> 00:46:57,680 started thinking I'm weird and stopped talking to me and then I 860 00:46:57,680 --> 00:47:01,640 had nothing but Bitcoin. So I ended up going into Bitcoin 861 00:47:01,880 --> 00:47:04,160 having. Already had a pretty good idea 862 00:47:04,160 --> 00:47:05,600 about this. So when I first heard about 863 00:47:05,600 --> 00:47:08,840 Bitcoin, I think for most people they think OK, this is a new 864 00:47:08,840 --> 00:47:11,800 money, new payment network, new way of doing things. 865 00:47:12,240 --> 00:47:15,200 And then when they start looking into it they come across the 866 00:47:15,520 --> 00:47:18,360 economic significance of it. Well, it's fixed in supply, 867 00:47:18,360 --> 00:47:21,400 which means you go down this entire rabbit hole and you 868 00:47:21,400 --> 00:47:24,960 understand inflation. And then you start realizing 869 00:47:24,960 --> 00:47:27,520 your food is poisoned and everything you're taught is a 870 00:47:27,520 --> 00:47:30,240 lie and your world is different and you join a cult and you 871 00:47:30,240 --> 00:47:34,880 shave your head and you get ripped and you start lifting and 872 00:47:34,880 --> 00:47:38,200 you get a lot of sun and you fix your life financially and you 873 00:47:38,200 --> 00:47:41,040 save in Bitcoin and you are born again. 874 00:47:41,040 --> 00:47:43,680 It's a hero's journey. In my case, it was a little bit 875 00:47:43,680 --> 00:47:47,600 different because I was already brainwashed as part of the cult 876 00:47:48,000 --> 00:47:53,200 from my Austrian and gold times. And when I'd heard about 877 00:47:53,200 --> 00:47:57,240 Bitcoin, I immediately made the association of all of these 878 00:47:57,240 --> 00:47:59,920 ideas that yeah, well, if we had the digital hard money, that 879 00:47:59,920 --> 00:48:02,080 would be awesome. But obviously it's not going to 880 00:48:02,080 --> 00:48:06,400 work because, you know, I'm an econ PhD, so I know. 881 00:48:06,760 --> 00:48:08,360 I could pass. Judgment on things without 882 00:48:08,360 --> 00:48:10,640 having to read them. You know, you have that kind of 883 00:48:10,640 --> 00:48:13,280 confidence that only a PhD can give you that I don't actually 884 00:48:13,280 --> 00:48:17,280 need to read about Bitcoin to understand and explain to people 885 00:48:17,280 --> 00:48:19,920 why it won't work, right? Because I have PhD. 886 00:48:20,400 --> 00:48:23,280 So for years you just go around thinking, well, you know, it 887 00:48:23,280 --> 00:48:25,320 would be neat. If this thing was the digital 888 00:48:25,320 --> 00:48:28,040 way of having gold, the governments couldn't stop, but 889 00:48:28,040 --> 00:48:31,000 obviously they're going to stop it and it's going to die, and so 890 00:48:31,040 --> 00:48:32,760 I'm not going to waste my time reading about it. 891 00:48:33,160 --> 00:48:36,480 And then eventually you know it. Keeps not dying and it keeps 892 00:48:37,400 --> 00:48:40,400 rising and it keeps getting bigger and keeps all these 893 00:48:40,400 --> 00:48:43,400 bitcoins continue to just succeed with their Bitcoin that 894 00:48:43,400 --> 00:48:45,000 they're happy about it. And at some. 895 00:48:45,000 --> 00:48:48,720 Point You need to shut up and eat some humble pie and. 896 00:48:49,760 --> 00:48:51,640 Actually start looking into the thing and then when I started 897 00:48:51,640 --> 00:48:56,240 looking into to it, I realized OK, this thing might actually. 898 00:48:56,240 --> 00:48:59,520 Survive. And then that was the moment 899 00:48:59,520 --> 00:49:02,080 because, OK, well, now we can actually do those things. 900 00:49:02,080 --> 00:49:06,280 We don't have to keep waiting on that little turtle of gold. 901 00:49:07,360 --> 00:49:13,480 To keep hopefully maybe one day performing a miracle and 902 00:49:13,480 --> 00:49:16,000 becoming money again. Now we have a digital. 903 00:49:16,000 --> 00:49:20,080 Thing that can that can fix this problem because it rises in 904 00:49:20,080 --> 00:49:22,920 value so it gives people a very big incentive to buy more and 905 00:49:22,920 --> 00:49:25,480 more of it, which isn't really the case with gold because it's 906 00:49:25,720 --> 00:49:28,560 already very big already very distributed there's not much 907 00:49:28,560 --> 00:49:34,520 room for its growth in terms of market value so practically it. 908 00:49:35,320 --> 00:49:40,240 If we actually allow this, all these technological advancements 909 00:49:40,240 --> 00:49:46,000 to really have the productivity gains that you know, every 910 00:49:46,000 --> 00:49:48,920 technological advancement has has given us right towards the 911 00:49:48,920 --> 00:49:55,280 future, especially with with AI. What, what does well in a 912 00:49:55,280 --> 00:49:59,080 deflationary world where money gains value and purchasing power 913 00:49:59,080 --> 00:50:04,240 over time, are there even people that want to be a debtor 914 00:50:04,240 --> 00:50:07,520 basically? Like do do loans disappear as, 915 00:50:07,560 --> 00:50:11,680 as we know them? Like how, how is growth fueled 916 00:50:11,760 --> 00:50:16,560 in a world that looks like that is, you know, now, especially 917 00:50:16,560 --> 00:50:19,360 with this, with these technological advancements that 918 00:50:19,360 --> 00:50:23,600 are very deflationary, How, how do you think through that or how 919 00:50:23,600 --> 00:50:25,200 do you explain that to to someone? 920 00:50:26,440 --> 00:50:30,760 Well. I think I have maybe one of my 921 00:50:30,760 --> 00:50:35,240 most controversial ideas is this idea that as money gets. 922 00:50:35,240 --> 00:50:38,800 Harder. Interest rates decline and so a 923 00:50:38,880 --> 00:50:42,560 terminally hard money or if strictly scarce money strictly 924 00:50:42,560 --> 00:50:45,760 fixed in supply is eventually going to result in the 925 00:50:46,080 --> 00:50:50,520 elimination of interest rates. And so we'd have lending done at 926 00:50:50,520 --> 00:50:55,880 0% interest between people who trust each other, but businesses 927 00:50:55,880 --> 00:50:59,120 would be financed by equity. This is the claim that I would 928 00:51:00,360 --> 00:51:03,000 claim. And I, you know, I've written 929 00:51:03,000 --> 00:51:04,920 about this and I've spoken about it and published in separate 930 00:51:04,920 --> 00:51:08,920 places. And I think my idea is I'm first 931 00:51:08,920 --> 00:51:11,080 of all, this isn't saying, you know, this is something that 932 00:51:11,080 --> 00:51:11,960 should. Happen. 933 00:51:11,960 --> 00:51:14,560 And I'm not saying that the government's in a Bitcoin 934 00:51:14,560 --> 00:51:16,920 standard need to ban credit in any way. 935 00:51:17,520 --> 00:51:20,880 I'm saying that the force of economic incentives that exists 936 00:51:22,160 --> 00:51:25,680 to shape interest rates is likely going to cause interest 937 00:51:25,680 --> 00:51:27,400 rates to disappear. And I say this as an. 938 00:51:27,400 --> 00:51:30,280 Austrian, which is, you know, it's heretic to say this as a 939 00:51:30,720 --> 00:51:33,120 mainstream economist, but it's also heretic to say this as an 940 00:51:33,120 --> 00:51:36,320 Austrian because what distinguishes or money, one of 941 00:51:36,320 --> 00:51:39,920 the many distinguishes, many, many distinctions of the 942 00:51:39,920 --> 00:51:44,960 Austrian school is that it offers the best explanation of 943 00:51:44,960 --> 00:51:47,840 interest, the economic and the explanation for why we have 944 00:51:47,840 --> 00:51:50,680 interest rates. And so to use that explanation, 945 00:51:50,680 --> 00:51:52,760 what what I do is that I use the Austrian explanation for 946 00:51:52,760 --> 00:51:55,720 interest to explain why interest would actually go away. 947 00:51:56,120 --> 00:51:59,640 So it is quite heretic from the Austrian perspective. 948 00:51:59,640 --> 00:52:03,720 But in brief, the Austrian idea is that interest rates are a 949 00:52:03,760 --> 00:52:06,880 reflection of time preference. So time preference. 950 00:52:06,880 --> 00:52:09,720 Is the degree to which people discount the future so if. 951 00:52:09,720 --> 00:52:13,480 You have a high time preference, then you discount the future a 952 00:52:13,480 --> 00:52:15,880 lot, so therefore you don't think about the future. 953 00:52:15,880 --> 00:52:20,000 So you spend all of your money. So that means you have little 954 00:52:20,000 --> 00:52:23,640 capital available for lending, and that means you're likely to 955 00:52:23,640 --> 00:52:26,320 want to borrow. Both of these things cause 956 00:52:26,320 --> 00:52:29,880 interest rates to rise. So if people's interest rates, 957 00:52:30,200 --> 00:52:33,400 if people's time preferences rise, then you would expect 958 00:52:33,400 --> 00:52:37,760 interest rates would also rise. People will discount the future 959 00:52:37,760 --> 00:52:39,360 heavily. And so if you want to 960 00:52:39,360 --> 00:52:43,480 incentivize me to save for the future, you need to pay me a 961 00:52:43,480 --> 00:52:49,520 higher interest rate and that then causes interest rates to 962 00:52:49,520 --> 00:52:52,280 rise. So if we have the opposite 963 00:52:52,280 --> 00:52:55,760 process, which is time preference declines, then you 964 00:52:55,760 --> 00:52:58,400 get people saving more. That means capital becomes more 965 00:52:58,400 --> 00:53:00,640 abundant. That means the cost of capital 966 00:53:00,640 --> 00:53:03,520 declines. And so when we have economic 967 00:53:04,000 --> 00:53:06,480 prosperity, when we have peace, when we have economic growth, 968 00:53:06,480 --> 00:53:09,840 when we have stability for decades and centuries, what 969 00:53:09,840 --> 00:53:11,720 happens is that interest rates decline. 970 00:53:12,440 --> 00:53:15,040 That's good. That's means that we are saving 971 00:53:15,040 --> 00:53:16,760 so much. Capital is abundant. 972 00:53:16,760 --> 00:53:20,840 Entrepreneurs are able to find financing at relatively low 973 00:53:20,840 --> 00:53:23,360 costs. And the low cost of financing 974 00:53:23,360 --> 00:53:27,000 means that businesses have a better chance of succeeding and 975 00:53:27,000 --> 00:53:30,200 remaining sustainable. So you want this to happen. 976 00:53:30,640 --> 00:53:33,320 And the Austrian explanation, I believe, is very correct. 977 00:53:33,320 --> 00:53:40,400 And it's a strong argument in favor of interest lending and a 978 00:53:40,400 --> 00:53:42,520 strong argument against prohibition of interest state 979 00:53:42,520 --> 00:53:44,160 lending. Because in a sense, what it's 980 00:53:44,160 --> 00:53:47,760 saying is that if the government says you cannot lend that 981 00:53:47,800 --> 00:53:52,160 interest, it's essentially like trying to mandate time 982 00:53:52,160 --> 00:53:54,480 preference, but you cannot mandate people's time 983 00:53:54,480 --> 00:53:56,640 preference. And when you ban them from 984 00:53:56,640 --> 00:53:59,120 borrowing and lending, you're only going to exacerbate the 985 00:53:59,120 --> 00:54:01,960 problems. Because if I have a time 986 00:54:01,960 --> 00:54:04,680 preference that is very high and requires me to get money right 987 00:54:04,680 --> 00:54:09,800 now, I am better off to get the money now because I might need 988 00:54:09,800 --> 00:54:12,000 it. You know, I, I need to borrow to 989 00:54:12,000 --> 00:54:14,160 make rent. If I don't make the payment by 990 00:54:14,160 --> 00:54:16,200 the end of this month, I get kicked out. 991 00:54:16,200 --> 00:54:20,240 So it's worth it for me to pay 5% extra next month, let's say, 992 00:54:20,840 --> 00:54:25,000 in order to not get kicked out. So in a sense, it's a little bit 993 00:54:25,000 --> 00:54:27,520 like a price gouging. I think of interest rates as 994 00:54:27,520 --> 00:54:29,640 like price gouging. If there's a natural disaster, 995 00:54:30,040 --> 00:54:33,880 things become more expensive. People who have scarce resources 996 00:54:34,120 --> 00:54:37,080 will charge more for them. Now you might say. 997 00:54:37,080 --> 00:54:41,360 Well, you would say and. You know, the Super, the the, 998 00:54:41,440 --> 00:54:46,240 the trains and the OR the boats or the the roads are locked into 999 00:54:46,240 --> 00:54:47,960 the town. So we have a limited amount of 1000 00:54:48,600 --> 00:54:52,160 water and bread and things for the next week or so until we get 1001 00:54:52,160 --> 00:54:54,480 supplies. So people who have those things 1002 00:54:54,920 --> 00:54:57,920 are going to want to hoard them and people who don't have those 1003 00:54:57,920 --> 00:54:59,400 things are going to want to pay a lot for them. 1004 00:54:59,400 --> 00:55:02,880 So the price is going to go up. Now, is that a good thing or a 1005 00:55:02,880 --> 00:55:04,720 bad thing? Well, I mean, it's a bad thing 1006 00:55:04,720 --> 00:55:10,560 compared to not to being able to buy it cheaply, but it's a good 1007 00:55:10,560 --> 00:55:12,280 thing compared to not being able to buy it. 1008 00:55:12,760 --> 00:55:15,240 Because if you try to keep the price fixed, then the first 1009 00:55:15,240 --> 00:55:17,560 people to get into the supermarket are going to hoard 1010 00:55:17,560 --> 00:55:20,880 all the quantities and then they're going to leave everybody 1011 00:55:20,880 --> 00:55:22,800 else without it. So but then when the price 1012 00:55:22,800 --> 00:55:25,680 rises, more people have the chance to access it. 1013 00:55:25,680 --> 00:55:28,720 And I think the more important idea is also when the price is 1014 00:55:28,720 --> 00:55:32,800 rising, there is a strong incentive for people to bring in 1015 00:55:32,800 --> 00:55:34,880 more resources. So anybody who's got a car that 1016 00:55:34,880 --> 00:55:38,920 can find its way to the town that doesn't have the disaster 1017 00:55:38,920 --> 00:55:42,280 can go and get things and sell them at the higher price. 1018 00:55:42,280 --> 00:55:44,080 If you're not paying him a higher price, it's not going to 1019 00:55:44,080 --> 00:55:45,960 make sense for him to go and get it. 1020 00:55:46,400 --> 00:55:50,160 So the higher prices are the solution to the high prices 1021 00:55:50,160 --> 00:55:52,720 because they offer a bounty to all producers to make more and 1022 00:55:52,720 --> 00:55:55,000 more. And in a sense, you could say 1023 00:55:55,000 --> 00:55:56,360 the same thing about interest rates. 1024 00:55:56,640 --> 00:56:00,280 Interest rates are the solution to interest rates in that high 1025 00:56:00,280 --> 00:56:04,000 interest rates encourage people to save more, which then brings 1026 00:56:04,000 --> 00:56:06,120 in more capital on the market, which brings the price of 1027 00:56:06,120 --> 00:56:09,640 savings down. But then what happens if we take 1028 00:56:09,640 --> 00:56:12,680 this and extend it further to its logical conclusion. 1029 00:56:13,120 --> 00:56:16,800 Now I well, one of the main ideas that posit in the Bitcoin 1030 00:56:16,800 --> 00:56:19,360 standard and I think one of the things that made it popular with 1031 00:56:19,400 --> 00:56:22,000 a lot of people is to try and draw the link between the 1032 00:56:22,000 --> 00:56:24,760 hardness of money and the time preference. 1033 00:56:24,760 --> 00:56:27,440 And the key idea is and I think this is something. 1034 00:56:27,440 --> 00:56:30,440 Most bitcoiners will attest to as soon as you're able. 1035 00:56:30,440 --> 00:56:33,280 To start saving in Bitcoin, your time preference drops. 1036 00:56:33,280 --> 00:56:36,000 You start thinking more and more about the future, so you're 1037 00:56:36,000 --> 00:56:37,600 more. Likely to save because now your 1038 00:56:37,600 --> 00:56:41,880 savings can actually turn into increased economic valuation in 1039 00:56:41,880 --> 00:56:44,400 the future. You're more likely to think of 1040 00:56:44,400 --> 00:56:46,560 the long term in all kinds of different manners, not just in 1041 00:56:46,560 --> 00:56:50,880 financial ways. So what happens now if we have? 1042 00:56:51,040 --> 00:56:54,520 The process of capital accumulation, hard money and 1043 00:56:54,520 --> 00:56:58,120 lowering time preference continuing to go on for decades 1044 00:56:58,120 --> 00:56:59,920 and centuries. Which was what was happening 1045 00:56:59,920 --> 00:57:01,320 historically. If you look historically at 1046 00:57:01,320 --> 00:57:05,040 interest rates, you see that they've largely been on a 1047 00:57:05,400 --> 00:57:10,520 journey of decline, interrupted. With a lot of disasters and when 1048 00:57:10,520 --> 00:57:12,240 there's a big war, when there's an earthquake, when there's a 1049 00:57:12,240 --> 00:57:15,200 plague, interest rates spike up because it's a disaster. 1050 00:57:15,200 --> 00:57:16,600 People need money very desperately. 1051 00:57:16,600 --> 00:57:22,120 The price of money goes. Up a lot, but overall the As 1052 00:57:22,120 --> 00:57:25,440 humanity progresses, as we accumulate more capital, as we 1053 00:57:25,440 --> 00:57:29,400 become more civilized, as we become more educated and more 1054 00:57:29,400 --> 00:57:32,440 capable of thinking of the future, we start accumulating 1055 00:57:32,440 --> 00:57:35,360 more capital. We lower the price of capital, 1056 00:57:35,360 --> 00:57:38,160 interest rates decline. So by the beginning of the 20th 1057 00:57:38,160 --> 00:57:40,440 century, interest rates were at their. 1058 00:57:40,440 --> 00:57:44,360 Lowest level in history at around 2 1/2% at the Bank of 1059 00:57:44,360 --> 00:57:46,640 England, which was the lowest interest rate in the world. 1060 00:57:48,000 --> 00:57:51,920 And then we took a civilizational detour away from 1061 00:57:51,920 --> 00:57:55,800 civilization to the value of Fiat barbarism over the last 100 1062 00:57:55,800 --> 00:58:00,040 and 1012 years. And that caused interest rates 1063 00:58:00,040 --> 00:58:02,200 to rise. But imagine if we'd continued, 1064 00:58:02,200 --> 00:58:04,160 and this is the topic of my last book, the Gold standard. 1065 00:58:04,480 --> 00:58:08,400 Imagine if we continued on the journey of hard money on the 1066 00:58:08,400 --> 00:58:10,840 gold standard for another 112 years. 1067 00:58:10,840 --> 00:58:13,600 Where would we be today? Interest rates were already at 2 1068 00:58:13,600 --> 00:58:15,560 1/2 percent. Imagine more capital 1069 00:58:15,560 --> 00:58:19,320 accumulation, more and more wealth, more productivity, 1070 00:58:19,520 --> 00:58:22,480 people becoming more affluent, people able to think about the 1071 00:58:22,480 --> 00:58:25,440 future more and more and more. That only means. 1072 00:58:25,880 --> 00:58:28,920 More capital accumulation and lower interest rates. 1073 00:58:29,360 --> 00:58:33,240 Eventually you get to the. Point where the interest rate 1074 00:58:33,240 --> 00:58:37,600 that you could get on borrowing is equal to the. 1075 00:58:39,680 --> 00:58:46,080 Is below the cost of storage. So if you have your money and 1076 00:58:46,080 --> 00:58:48,200 you just keep it and you store it, you might have to pay 1077 00:58:48,200 --> 00:58:52,440 something like 1% on that money. So at a certain point. 1078 00:58:53,400 --> 00:58:57,520 The interest rate that you would pay that you would receive on 1079 00:58:57,520 --> 00:59:03,320 lending can. At 0% it becomes attractive. 1080 00:59:03,560 --> 00:59:07,000 You are willing to accept a 0% nominal interest rate because 1081 00:59:07,480 --> 00:59:11,080 getting 0% nominal interest rate is better than paying 1% on 1082 00:59:11,080 --> 00:59:13,480 storing the money. Particularly when you keep in 1083 00:59:13,480 --> 00:59:17,440 mind that 0% nominal interest rate is actually positive in 1084 00:59:17,440 --> 00:59:20,160 real terms because this is hard money that is appreciating. 1085 00:59:20,160 --> 00:59:23,480 And that was an initial starting assumption of this mental model. 1086 00:59:23,880 --> 00:59:26,760 So if the money's appreciating interest rates are declining, 1087 00:59:27,200 --> 00:59:32,160 eventually interest rates at 0% becomes the inevitable the the, 1088 00:59:32,200 --> 00:59:35,520 the market clearing price. We have so much abundance of 1089 00:59:35,520 --> 00:59:40,880 capital and people are happy to just give you their capital if 1090 00:59:40,880 --> 00:59:42,920 you're trustworthy and willing to bring it. 1091 00:59:42,920 --> 00:59:45,160 Back in a year because you save them on the cost of storing 1092 00:59:45,160 --> 00:59:47,080 capital. And then when you want to 1093 00:59:47,080 --> 00:59:50,840 actually invest, if you have a business where you're not just 1094 00:59:50,840 --> 00:59:52,800 taking the capital because you're my friend and you have an 1095 00:59:52,800 --> 00:59:57,080 emergency and I'm going to help you out, you're actually going 1096 00:59:57,080 --> 01:00:00,160 to put it into an investment. Well, in this case, I want a 1097 01:00:00,160 --> 01:00:03,280 share, I want to be part of the business. 1098 01:00:03,280 --> 01:00:04,760 So I will just. Get the equity. 1099 01:00:05,360 --> 01:00:07,320 And here, you know that a lot of people. 1100 01:00:08,240 --> 01:00:09,360 Sorry. Can you hear this? 1101 01:00:09,360 --> 01:00:10,400 There's a sign in the back. Yeah. 1102 01:00:10,520 --> 01:00:14,200 But it's OK, It's OK. Yeah, this is the Iranian 1103 01:00:14,200 --> 01:00:16,640 missiles flying overhead. Oh wow. 1104 01:00:17,200 --> 01:00:19,560 Yeah, but it's OK. It happens every day. 1105 01:00:20,720 --> 01:00:23,480 At this point, I think the interceptors are all gone. 1106 01:00:23,480 --> 01:00:27,320 So low risk that they would intercept them and fall on us. 1107 01:00:27,320 --> 01:00:30,280 They're just going to keep flying to their intended target. 1108 01:00:30,280 --> 01:00:35,520 But anyways. So I would say so. 1109 01:00:35,520 --> 01:00:37,680 So then the financing happens through equity. 1110 01:00:37,680 --> 01:00:38,880 That was the last thing I said about. 1111 01:00:39,200 --> 01:00:43,080 I'll just continue and say and. I think the key thing that 1112 01:00:43,080 --> 01:00:46,800 people miss is that they assume that they look at a business and 1113 01:00:46,800 --> 01:00:49,800 they see that the business was financed by credit and they 1114 01:00:49,800 --> 01:00:52,240 think that if credit did not exist, then that business 1115 01:00:52,240 --> 01:00:54,160 couldn't have been financed, therefore credit. 1116 01:00:54,160 --> 01:00:57,040 That's good. This is, this is an example of 1117 01:00:57,040 --> 01:00:59,640 not thinking in an economic way because you're not thinking of 1118 01:00:59,640 --> 01:01:02,280 the opportunity cost. You're thinking that this credit 1119 01:01:02,280 --> 01:01:07,080 is just materialized and that it has created more capital goods. 1120 01:01:07,080 --> 01:01:10,720 But in reality, a bank issuing credit is not creating more 1121 01:01:10,720 --> 01:01:14,720 capital goods. And so the capital, the actual 1122 01:01:14,720 --> 01:01:18,720 physical goods that we need in order to produce consumer goods, 1123 01:01:19,240 --> 01:01:22,440 the labor that we need to put into it, these are resources 1124 01:01:22,440 --> 01:01:25,440 that can't be increased by just generating credit by saying, 1125 01:01:25,440 --> 01:01:27,320 hey, let me borrow money from you. 1126 01:01:27,880 --> 01:01:31,600 That doesn't mean that now we've got more workers in our country. 1127 01:01:31,920 --> 01:01:34,480 So therefore I can build my business and you can build your 1128 01:01:34,480 --> 01:01:36,960 business if you can build the business with your money. 1129 01:01:37,440 --> 01:01:40,200 And I can't build it because I don't have the money and I don't 1130 01:01:40,200 --> 01:01:42,160 have the workers and the machines that you need for your 1131 01:01:42,160 --> 01:01:44,960 business. Now, if I borrow money from a 1132 01:01:44,960 --> 01:01:48,480 bank, that doesn't magically mean that you and I can both now 1133 01:01:48,480 --> 01:01:50,400 have all the machines and the workers that we need. 1134 01:01:50,880 --> 01:01:52,760 The number of machines and the workers are still the same. 1135 01:01:53,040 --> 01:01:59,720 So ultimately I think this is like the biggest trick in in 1136 01:01:59,720 --> 01:02:04,160 economics and in Fiat world. This all of Keynesian thinking 1137 01:02:04,160 --> 01:02:07,480 and all of Fiat thinking comes from this illusion that if you 1138 01:02:07,480 --> 01:02:10,960 just issue more credit, if you issue more claims on money, if 1139 01:02:10,960 --> 01:02:14,240 you increase the supply of money, you can increase the 1140 01:02:14,240 --> 01:02:17,400 number of things for rich money stands for. 1141 01:02:17,920 --> 01:02:21,240 It's exactly as stupid as saying if we just print more tickets, 1142 01:02:21,240 --> 01:02:23,320 we can increase the capacity of the stadium. 1143 01:02:23,640 --> 01:02:26,720 No, the stadium fits 50,000 people and it has 50,000 1144 01:02:26,720 --> 01:02:28,600 tickets. Printing more tickets is not 1145 01:02:28,600 --> 01:02:32,360 going to increase the capacity. And so this is the thing that I 1146 01:02:32,360 --> 01:02:35,000 would say this is an argument against Fiat and it's also the 1147 01:02:35,000 --> 01:02:38,560 argument against credit in general. 1148 01:02:38,560 --> 01:02:41,880 Well, it's not necessarily the argument against credit. 1149 01:02:41,880 --> 01:02:44,600 It's the argument against the argument against equity as a 1150 01:02:44,600 --> 01:02:47,800 mode of financing in that it doesn't matter if it's equity or 1151 01:02:47,800 --> 01:02:49,000 credit. At the end of the day, the 1152 01:02:49,000 --> 01:02:53,840 number of resources that we have is fixed and they can either go 1153 01:02:53,840 --> 01:02:55,520 to my restaurant or your restaurant. 1154 01:02:55,520 --> 01:02:57,920 And if we have more resources, we can finance both. 1155 01:02:57,920 --> 01:03:01,880 But if we don't, then we just need to a way of allocating 1156 01:03:01,880 --> 01:03:08,120 these resources and equity can do that job and it's a safer way 1157 01:03:08,120 --> 01:03:10,000 of doing it. It's a more reliable way, It's 1158 01:03:10,000 --> 01:03:14,960 more financially robust and it's less likely to result in 1159 01:03:14,960 --> 01:03:19,160 negative outcomes. And it doesn't, I mean, I guess 1160 01:03:19,160 --> 01:03:22,960 the key thing is that it does not pretend to be creating more 1161 01:03:23,040 --> 01:03:26,560 capital and therefore it's not going to lead to the 1162 01:03:27,440 --> 01:03:32,360 consequences of delusion. In a Fiat money world, we think 1163 01:03:32,360 --> 01:03:35,960 we can solve everything by just creating more units of the 1164 01:03:35,960 --> 01:03:37,720 money. Whereas, you know, in the in the 1165 01:03:37,720 --> 01:03:40,800 example you gave, stuff is just going to happen. 1166 01:03:40,800 --> 01:03:42,400 People are just going to do things. 1167 01:03:42,400 --> 01:03:45,120 Some people were prepared, some, some weren't right. 1168 01:03:45,120 --> 01:03:48,760 Some people by luck still have their car, others, others don't. 1169 01:03:48,760 --> 01:03:53,320 And that is just the hardness of the reality at a certain point. 1170 01:03:53,320 --> 01:03:58,320 And I feel that with Fiat money there is a way to fake that or 1171 01:03:58,320 --> 01:04:03,800 fake solve certain problems that in the long run are are never 1172 01:04:03,800 --> 01:04:05,480 solved. So I hope that makes it that. 1173 01:04:05,480 --> 01:04:07,160 That would be my layman reflection. 1174 01:04:07,160 --> 01:04:09,080 Absolutely. And I think you know that you 1175 01:04:09,080 --> 01:04:12,520 can take it to the extreme. The the Fiat mentality, I 1176 01:04:12,520 --> 01:04:17,040 believe, is what leads us to a place where the concept of what 1177 01:04:17,040 --> 01:04:19,760 is a woman has become such a controversial thing because 1178 01:04:20,280 --> 01:04:23,040 everything is paid. You can pay to become a man, 1179 01:04:23,520 --> 01:04:25,440 basically. You can pay exactly. 1180 01:04:25,680 --> 01:04:27,240 You. Can just pass it by Fiat. 1181 01:04:27,240 --> 01:04:31,360 So if if government can decide what is science and if 1182 01:04:31,360 --> 01:04:33,680 government says this is right science, this is bad science, 1183 01:04:33,680 --> 01:04:35,440 this is good medicine, this is bad medicine. 1184 01:04:35,840 --> 01:04:38,120 If government can just, you know, pass a law that says, hey, 1185 01:04:38,120 --> 01:04:40,760 we can all stay home and therefore the disease will go 1186 01:04:40,760 --> 01:04:43,480 away. If government can essentially 1187 01:04:44,160 --> 01:04:48,560 enforce everything by Fiat, people get in this into their 1188 01:04:48,560 --> 01:04:51,160 idea that all you need to do in order to make something happen 1189 01:04:51,160 --> 01:04:53,440 is just convince the right people in the right position to 1190 01:04:53,440 --> 01:04:57,200 issue the right call. And then it happens. 1191 01:04:57,400 --> 01:05:02,400 So you get your doctor and to perform a certain surgery, and 1192 01:05:02,400 --> 01:05:06,240 then you go to a a government office, and then the government 1193 01:05:06,240 --> 01:05:08,560 office changes your thing on your passport. 1194 01:05:08,560 --> 01:05:11,920 You go from F to M or M to F or whatever, and that's it. 1195 01:05:11,960 --> 01:05:13,520 You know, you've become the new thing. 1196 01:05:13,760 --> 01:05:16,720 And it's just, it's, it's a mentality where everything is 1197 01:05:16,720 --> 01:05:20,560 subject to our desires. That the world is not something 1198 01:05:20,560 --> 01:05:25,160 that we get to. We, we, it's insanity because we 1199 01:05:25,160 --> 01:05:27,640 don't accept that there are things in the world that are 1200 01:05:27,680 --> 01:05:31,720 outside of our control, that we need to be accepted and lived 1201 01:05:31,720 --> 01:05:36,800 with rather than changed. So you can't pass a law that 1202 01:05:36,800 --> 01:05:39,320 says the sun needs to rise from the West. 1203 01:05:39,960 --> 01:05:42,520 There are no democratic processes that will ever pass 1204 01:05:42,520 --> 01:05:44,520 this. And I think people would be a 1205 01:05:44,520 --> 01:05:47,440 lot happier if they realize that so much more of the world is 1206 01:05:47,440 --> 01:05:49,680 like that. They need to just accept it. 1207 01:05:50,040 --> 01:05:53,600 And I think the thing that Bitcoin is doing is that it's 1208 01:05:53,720 --> 01:05:58,080 taking away the power of people in authority to be able to 1209 01:05:58,960 --> 01:06:05,080 decree those things by Fiat and put people out of their, you 1210 01:06:05,080 --> 01:06:12,080 know, just create a new reality that people can just pass by 1211 01:06:12,080 --> 01:06:14,680 law. And this is this is what Fiat 1212 01:06:14,680 --> 01:06:18,680 ends because we're making those people go bankrupt so they can't 1213 01:06:18,680 --> 01:06:21,560 continue to just shape reality as they want. 1214 01:06:22,280 --> 01:06:26,720 And it's giving the people who hold on to reality financial 1215 01:06:26,720 --> 01:06:29,680 rewards for doing so. This was really the bad thing, 1216 01:06:29,680 --> 01:06:33,040 because in the Fiat world, if you go along with the insanity, 1217 01:06:33,080 --> 01:06:35,720 you get rich. And then this has been setting 1218 01:06:35,720 --> 01:06:40,000 up generations of humans to be raised contrary to human nature 1219 01:06:40,000 --> 01:06:43,360 for centuries in millennia, which is you need to believe in 1220 01:06:43,360 --> 01:06:45,920 lies in order to succeed. You need to cheat, you need to 1221 01:06:45,920 --> 01:06:49,040 lie, you need to bear false witness. 1222 01:06:49,040 --> 01:06:52,360 When they tell you this is 1 + 1 equals to three, you have to go 1223 01:06:52,360 --> 01:06:54,120 and say yes, 1 + 1 equals to three. 1224 01:06:54,360 --> 01:06:56,600 That's how you get the degree. That's how you get the job. 1225 01:06:56,600 --> 01:06:57,560 That's how you get the promotion. 1226 01:06:57,560 --> 01:07:00,960 That's how you get the money. So we've had this drilled into 1227 01:07:00,960 --> 01:07:03,640 us, this kind of delusion of Fiat, the idea that you can just 1228 01:07:03,640 --> 01:07:07,040 make everything into whatever you want by just passing a law. 1229 01:07:07,040 --> 01:07:09,160 You know, you can bring democracy to Iran. 1230 01:07:09,160 --> 01:07:11,440 Just press a few buttons and then things blow up. 1231 01:07:11,440 --> 01:07:13,440 And then we bring democracy to Iran. 1232 01:07:13,440 --> 01:07:17,800 We can bring female liberation to Afghanistan. 1233 01:07:17,800 --> 01:07:21,200 We can do all kinds of things. We can shape the entire world as 1234 01:07:21,200 --> 01:07:24,080 we want it. And we we do it because we have 1235 01:07:24,080 --> 01:07:28,640 this insane thing called a money printer that is just a back door 1236 01:07:28,640 --> 01:07:32,880 into all of reality, a back door to all of the all of the 1237 01:07:32,880 --> 01:07:34,200 economics of how the world works. 1238 01:07:34,640 --> 01:07:36,640 Yeah. Well, as long as people believe 1239 01:07:36,640 --> 01:07:40,240 that it has value, right. I mean, I think there's 99 or 1240 01:07:40,240 --> 01:07:44,320 11, I think it's nine countries in Africa that's still used as a 1241 01:07:44,320 --> 01:07:47,400 Central African franc that that, that France produces, right? 1242 01:07:47,400 --> 01:07:51,440 And they they still believe that that is the money in in some 1243 01:07:51,440 --> 01:07:53,520 way. And they're also partially 1244 01:07:53,520 --> 01:07:57,240 probably probably forced, right? But I think that is kind of like 1245 01:07:57,240 --> 01:08:00,080 an outlandish example. Whereas just in the Western 1246 01:08:00,080 --> 01:08:03,200 world, I think what people just need to realize that it's, it's 1247 01:08:03,200 --> 01:08:06,840 basically exactly the same. But you're steered towards that 1248 01:08:06,840 --> 01:08:10,320 point of believing that, you know, this is the organically 1249 01:08:10,320 --> 01:08:12,880 the best form of money that we ended up with. 1250 01:08:12,880 --> 01:08:15,760 And therefore, you know, don't, don't ask questions, please. 1251 01:08:15,760 --> 01:08:19,760 You know, like I, I, I think that is what also opened my 1252 01:08:19,760 --> 01:08:22,800 eyes, just hearing people from Lebanon OR whatever, just 1253 01:08:22,800 --> 01:08:25,040 realizing that that's the exact same money system. 1254 01:08:25,040 --> 01:08:30,080 But I'm lucky for now to have grown up in a Western country, 1255 01:08:30,080 --> 01:08:33,640 you know, and I never really had to experience what these people 1256 01:08:33,640 --> 01:08:35,680 have experienced. But fundamentally it's it's 1257 01:08:35,680 --> 01:08:37,920 basically the same. Yeah, you just. 1258 01:08:37,920 --> 01:08:40,960 Got a different chamber in the Russian roulette gun but if. 1259 01:08:42,359 --> 01:08:45,520 You're taking more spins every day, don't worry. 1260 01:08:46,200 --> 01:08:51,880 Let's talk about the Netherlands introducing my country attacks 1261 01:08:51,880 --> 01:08:54,760 on unrealized gains, right, a 36% tax. 1262 01:08:54,760 --> 01:08:58,240 And actually today I saw a inflation calculator from a big 1263 01:08:58,240 --> 01:09:02,640 Dutch bank that's calculated with I think 4.5% inflation that 1264 01:09:02,920 --> 01:09:12,319 in 20 forty €200,000 would have lost 46% of of of its value. 1265 01:09:12,319 --> 01:09:14,680 It's interesting that this is just, you know, on the on the 1266 01:09:14,680 --> 01:09:21,000 public website of a big bank. So people need to mitigate this 1267 01:09:21,000 --> 01:09:25,359 loss of purchasing power so they are forced to invest, IE take 1268 01:09:25,359 --> 01:09:28,640 more risk, right? Create more anxiety towards this 1269 01:09:28,640 --> 01:09:32,840 future, have an even even higher time preference. 1270 01:09:32,840 --> 01:09:37,640 And if they succeed, they're now proposing to tax that with with 1271 01:09:37,640 --> 01:09:41,240 46%. How do you look or how do you 1272 01:09:41,240 --> 01:09:45,920 view these types of topics that are now actually discussed that 1273 01:09:45,920 --> 01:09:49,840 have horrible president by the way where they have been 1274 01:09:49,840 --> 01:09:52,120 attempted before? Is is this kind of like the 1275 01:09:52,120 --> 01:09:55,520 final boss of Fiat desperation or or how do you think about it? 1276 01:09:56,280 --> 01:09:58,840 Yeah, it's difficult to tell. I mean, it's the numbers that 1277 01:09:58,840 --> 01:10:01,480 just keep going up and you know, the, the, the they talk about 1278 01:10:01,480 --> 01:10:03,400 unrealized capital gains as well. 1279 01:10:03,400 --> 01:10:06,040 And it's just it, it, it's fantastic. 1280 01:10:06,040 --> 01:10:10,080 And I mean, this is this is a historical trend that has been 1281 01:10:10,080 --> 01:10:16,040 noted by many historians. The old Arab historian Ibn 1282 01:10:16,040 --> 01:10:19,680 Saldun, I think, wrote about this hundreds of years ago, 800 1283 01:10:19,680 --> 01:10:20,800 years ago. I think he lived, I can't 1284 01:10:20,800 --> 01:10:22,960 remember the exact date. But anyways, he wrote many years 1285 01:10:22,960 --> 01:10:27,200 ago about how when a state is young and healthy and vigorous 1286 01:10:27,200 --> 01:10:31,480 in the early stages of its rise, the government is only taking a 1287 01:10:31,480 --> 01:10:37,760 small fraction of taxes and it allows people to be free, and 1288 01:10:37,760 --> 01:10:40,200 therefore people have a lot of money and that causes growth. 1289 01:10:40,960 --> 01:10:43,600 And you know, he, he, he. Referred to it in terms of 1290 01:10:43,600 --> 01:10:46,120 cycles. Eventually the generations that 1291 01:10:46,120 --> 01:10:50,720 get born into wealth lose the hardness. 1292 01:10:50,720 --> 01:10:52,960 The asabi as he called it, and the I mean. 1293 01:10:55,000 --> 01:10:58,760 The work ethic, you could argue is, is, is a part of it so that 1294 01:10:58,760 --> 01:11:01,040 these generations then are born with a lower work ethic. 1295 01:11:01,040 --> 01:11:06,400 So then they start spending things down and the government 1296 01:11:06,400 --> 01:11:09,880 becomes more and more used to the idea that it is responsible 1297 01:11:09,880 --> 01:11:11,920 for others. So it starts charging more and 1298 01:11:11,920 --> 01:11:16,400 more. So it's the, the, it's, it's the 1299 01:11:16,400 --> 01:11:21,400 inevitable cycle of States and civilizations rising and 1300 01:11:21,400 --> 01:11:25,400 falling. And then it's repeated in many 1301 01:11:25,400 --> 01:11:27,680 civilizations and the studies and the historians that are 1302 01:11:27,680 --> 01:11:31,800 written about. It have also done the same also 1303 01:11:32,000 --> 01:11:34,520 done so from many many civilizations that Anthony 1304 01:11:34,520 --> 01:11:44,800 Gibbons wrote about this and the the British general who was in 1305 01:11:44,800 --> 01:11:47,760 charge of the Jordanian army. He also wrote a great book on 1306 01:11:47,760 --> 01:11:50,480 this. So I think this is sadly. 1307 01:11:50,480 --> 01:11:54,480 What we're seeing in Europe and it's, it's striking how bad it 1308 01:11:54,480 --> 01:11:56,120 is. And I, you know, I, I'm a person 1309 01:11:56,120 --> 01:11:58,520 who really loves European like, you know, most people get 1310 01:11:58,520 --> 01:12:03,360 obsessed with East Asia or they go to Japan. 1311 01:12:03,360 --> 01:12:06,960 And I, I like Europe. I've always been a big fan of 1312 01:12:06,960 --> 01:12:08,680 Europe. I love traveling to Europe and 1313 01:12:09,080 --> 01:12:11,440 I'm very grateful for all the amazing things that Europe has 1314 01:12:11,440 --> 01:12:13,360 given us. And it really saddens me to see 1315 01:12:13,360 --> 01:12:18,680 Europe like this because it's you can see the you, you, you 1316 01:12:18,680 --> 01:12:22,520 can see the economic suffocation because salaries are low, 1317 01:12:22,520 --> 01:12:26,200 productivity is low, taxes are very high, regulations are very 1318 01:12:26,200 --> 01:12:27,680 high. And it is. 1319 01:12:27,720 --> 01:12:31,480 It's it's it seems almost deliberate at certain. 1320 01:12:31,480 --> 01:12:35,000 Points And I think, you know, you look at how US foreign 1321 01:12:35,000 --> 01:12:37,240 policy has been acting up in the last couple of years. 1322 01:12:37,240 --> 01:12:40,400 I think you start seeing yeah, this is quite deliberate. 1323 01:12:40,880 --> 01:12:46,560 I think there is a deep animosity in the US against 1324 01:12:46,560 --> 01:12:51,480 Europe and. It's, I think it's helping shape 1325 01:12:51,480 --> 01:12:53,040 these policies. It's helping shape all of the 1326 01:12:53,040 --> 01:12:54,360 kind of. Policies that are, I would say, 1327 01:12:54,360 --> 01:12:57,120 destructive to Europe, you know, the energy policies, the 1328 01:12:57,120 --> 01:13:01,400 destruction of Nord Stream, the crazy immigration policies that 1329 01:13:01,400 --> 01:13:06,800 they have, the softness on crime, you know, importing 1330 01:13:06,800 --> 01:13:10,680 people from all over the world and the releasing and not having 1331 01:13:10,680 --> 01:13:15,480 proper criminal accountability. All of that suggests something 1332 01:13:15,480 --> 01:13:19,320 really perverse taking place. And it is really sad. 1333 01:13:19,760 --> 01:13:23,240 And there's, you know, I don't have any political solutions to 1334 01:13:23,280 --> 01:13:25,800 offer on this. I think the only thing that can 1335 01:13:25,800 --> 01:13:27,680 be said is just an individual solution. 1336 01:13:28,400 --> 01:13:31,240 The only thing that you can do is sort yourself out to figure 1337 01:13:31,240 --> 01:13:34,320 out how to try and reduce your tax burden as much as you can, 1338 01:13:34,640 --> 01:13:41,440 set up businesses abroad or set a presidency abroad and try and 1339 01:13:41,520 --> 01:13:43,040 slug it out. It's a tough time. 1340 01:13:43,360 --> 01:13:46,360 It's terrible. But you know, I guess 1341 01:13:47,040 --> 01:13:50,240 consolation is could be a lot worse than a lot of other worst 1342 01:13:50,240 --> 01:13:54,760 places in the world. So maybe and and you know, it's 1343 01:13:55,040 --> 01:13:57,920 it was a lot worse for your ancestors as well. 1344 01:13:58,360 --> 01:14:02,160 A lot of the Europeans in the past had a lot of worst 1345 01:14:02,160 --> 01:14:04,360 situations deal with then high tax rates. 1346 01:14:04,360 --> 01:14:10,640 So count your blessings that raise up your sleeves and get 1347 01:14:10,640 --> 01:14:14,240 to. Work for sure, yeah, I I also 1348 01:14:14,280 --> 01:14:17,200 think that, you know, obviously this is called Bitcoin from LED 1349 01:14:17,200 --> 01:14:23,240 else I think I think Bitcoin is the prime tool for millennials 1350 01:14:23,520 --> 01:14:28,520 at least to attempt to to escape what is the end, the inevitable 1351 01:14:28,520 --> 01:14:30,600 end of the of the Fiat path, right. 1352 01:14:31,480 --> 01:14:35,600 And I, I think that without Bitcoin, I would be less hopeful 1353 01:14:35,600 --> 01:14:37,920 about the future. But I do want to ask you like 1354 01:14:37,920 --> 01:14:41,480 what, what do you think is the biggest threat or risk to 1355 01:14:41,480 --> 01:14:49,920 Bitcoin that you see today? Well, I wrote this in the 1356 01:14:49,920 --> 01:14:52,720 Bitcoin standard and I elaborated on it in the Fiat 1357 01:14:52,720 --> 01:14:57,440 standard and I would say it probably still is the biggest 1358 01:14:57,440 --> 01:15:01,760 risk. I I still don't think it's a 1359 01:15:01,760 --> 01:15:05,520 real big risk, but it is the biggest. 1360 01:15:05,600 --> 01:15:07,120 Just because the biggest doesn't mean it's big. 1361 01:15:09,000 --> 01:15:13,640 So the And this is the idea that governments go back on a gold 1362 01:15:13,640 --> 01:15:16,520 standard. I think the most serious threat 1363 01:15:16,520 --> 01:15:19,800 to Bitcoin would be monetary responsibility. 1364 01:15:19,800 --> 01:15:21,480 And gold already has what is it now? 1365 01:15:21,480 --> 01:15:25,160 Something like a $30 trillion market cap, $25 trillion market 1366 01:15:25,160 --> 01:15:28,080 cap, something in that range. So it's already more than 10 1367 01:15:28,080 --> 01:15:32,160 times larger than Bitcoin in terms of liquidity and money. 1368 01:15:32,160 --> 01:15:36,400 Is a network good? It's a good whose value is 1369 01:15:39,040 --> 01:15:42,240 proportional to the number of people who use it and to the 1370 01:15:42,240 --> 01:15:44,600 number of people who are able to transact with you in it. 1371 01:15:44,600 --> 01:15:48,960 So if the more liquid a money is, the more useful it is. 1372 01:15:48,960 --> 01:15:51,440 That's why everybody wants to go to the winner. 1373 01:15:51,440 --> 01:15:54,000 That's why money is a winner take home market and that's why 1374 01:15:54,000 --> 01:15:57,320 it's very difficult for 2nd place to replace the 1st place. 1375 01:15:57,320 --> 01:16:01,920 So if the world goes on a gold standard in the next month or 1376 01:16:01,920 --> 01:16:04,400 so, and all of the world's governments now peg their 1377 01:16:04,400 --> 01:16:08,640 currencies to gold, or, you know, either you peg it to gold 1378 01:16:08,640 --> 01:16:11,600 or you go to a hyperinflation. In that world, everybody has 1379 01:16:11,600 --> 01:16:13,280 access. To money that doesn't have an 1380 01:16:13,720 --> 01:16:18,520 inflation or a very low inflation and in that world a 1381 01:16:18,520 --> 01:16:21,040 lot of the problems that governments are creating for 1382 01:16:21,040 --> 01:16:24,760 people would go away because it becomes much harder for them to 1383 01:16:26,680 --> 01:16:30,720 centrally plan their economies and micromanage your life if 1384 01:16:30,720 --> 01:16:38,960 they don't have their money printer available so with with 1385 01:16:39,240 --> 01:16:42,920 that you know a lot of the incentives for using Bitcoin 1386 01:16:42,920 --> 01:16:47,320 goes away you don't need to escape inflation and then 1387 01:16:47,640 --> 01:16:51,040 because you can just hold gold and your government isn't such a 1388 01:16:51,040 --> 01:16:54,000 horrible police state because it doesn't have a money printer 1389 01:16:54,000 --> 01:16:57,360 anymore and so they let you get on with your life most of the 1390 01:16:57,360 --> 01:17:00,880 time we go back to a modern model of government similar to 1391 01:17:00,880 --> 01:17:06,440 Western Europe in the 1890s I think that would be the most 1392 01:17:06,960 --> 01:17:11,520 significant risk to Bitcoin because it would reduce interest 1393 01:17:11,520 --> 01:17:14,920 in Bitcoin and it would reduce the desire for people to get 1394 01:17:14,920 --> 01:17:18,480 into it and it would likely 'cause people to just lose 1395 01:17:18,480 --> 01:17:22,840 interest in it over time having said that I still think that 1396 01:17:23,000 --> 01:17:29,040 would not kill Bitcoin because even if it does cause say A1234 1397 01:17:29,040 --> 01:17:32,640 year bear market in Bitcoin where the price crashes can 1398 01:17:32,640 --> 01:17:36,720 happen has happened before but. I think ultimately the limited 1399 01:17:36,720 --> 01:17:39,280 supply of Bitcoin means that it's just going to go back to 1400 01:17:39,280 --> 01:17:42,240 going up and then people are going to want to hold more of 1401 01:17:42,240 --> 01:17:43,520 it. And then the more they hold it, 1402 01:17:43,520 --> 01:17:46,160 the more it goes up. It's just better money and it's 1403 01:17:46,160 --> 01:17:47,640 going to win. So it's going to keep 1404 01:17:47,640 --> 01:17:52,280 appreciating eventually to overtake gold is what I believe. 1405 01:17:52,840 --> 01:17:58,840 But you know, they the more that governments mess up with their 1406 01:17:58,840 --> 01:18:03,720 monetary policies and with their control over their citizens, the 1407 01:18:05,200 --> 01:18:08,000 faster this would happen. Likely because more and more 1408 01:18:08,000 --> 01:18:12,920 people will go to Bitcoin and fewer people will go to gold 1409 01:18:12,920 --> 01:18:15,200 because gold will still not be usable as money. 1410 01:18:15,200 --> 01:18:17,680 And that's it's main impediment because government ban you from 1411 01:18:17,680 --> 01:18:20,680 using it as money. So if they let you use gold. 1412 01:18:21,080 --> 01:18:24,360 If they make gold, become the money and gold already. 1413 01:18:24,360 --> 01:18:26,200 Has a massive. First mover advantage in 1414 01:18:26,200 --> 01:18:31,360 liquidity that I think could set Bitcoin back significantly, but 1415 01:18:31,760 --> 01:18:35,800 the highly unlikely to happen. I agree. 1416 01:18:35,840 --> 01:18:38,160 All right, three very short questions to wrap up. 1417 01:18:38,160 --> 01:18:41,120 This can be all right answers. What is the one thing about the 1418 01:18:41,120 --> 01:18:44,320 next 10 years that is very obvious to you, but you think 1419 01:18:44,320 --> 01:18:53,200 sounds insane to other people? Bitcoin can't think of anything 1420 01:18:53,200 --> 01:18:55,520 else. I mean, a lot of, I believe in a 1421 01:18:55,520 --> 01:18:57,600 lot of insane things in this world. 1422 01:18:58,720 --> 01:19:00,880 A lot of people think I'm crazy over all kinds of things. 1423 01:19:00,880 --> 01:19:03,920 But I think the one that is the most important and most 1424 01:19:03,920 --> 01:19:07,200 consequential of them all is going to be Bitcoin. 1425 01:19:07,640 --> 01:19:10,280 All right. And when do we see you on Joe 1426 01:19:10,280 --> 01:19:13,000 Rogan? I did not tell him did. 1427 01:19:14,600 --> 01:19:17,640 He ever call like you're ready? I I assume you're ready? 1428 01:19:18,040 --> 01:19:22,120 No, but I train every day all. Right, last one, and I ask 1429 01:19:22,120 --> 01:19:24,560 everyone the last one. What is a core belief that you 1430 01:19:24,560 --> 01:19:31,360 will never let go of? Never is a big word. 1431 01:19:31,600 --> 01:19:35,280 I've, you know, changed my mind a lot of things over the years. 1432 01:19:36,440 --> 01:19:39,000 A core belief. I mean, I wouldn't say a belief 1433 01:19:39,000 --> 01:19:44,680 that I would never let go of because I belief is I, I would 1434 01:19:44,680 --> 01:19:48,880 say a value is something that I would not want to ever let go of 1435 01:19:49,040 --> 01:19:54,920 and beliefs because, you know, if tomorrow the sun starts to 1436 01:19:54,920 --> 01:19:57,800 rise from the West, I'm going to have to change my belief about 1437 01:19:57,800 --> 01:19:59,760 it. I don't think it'll happen. 1438 01:19:59,800 --> 01:20:03,480 But you know, I, I believe things because they're true. 1439 01:20:03,480 --> 01:20:08,640 So I find it hard to make a case for something that I know for 1440 01:20:08,640 --> 01:20:11,280 sure will always be true, because who knows? 1441 01:20:12,320 --> 01:20:14,760 But with values, I think you know my value. 1442 01:20:14,760 --> 01:20:19,760 My my fundamental moral value in life is the idea of non 1443 01:20:19,760 --> 01:20:22,840 aggression, Non aggression principle from Marty Rothbard 1444 01:20:22,840 --> 01:20:26,160 and the anarchists and libertarians and Austrians. 1445 01:20:27,000 --> 01:20:30,200 And it just. Means that you do not initiate 1446 01:20:30,480 --> 01:20:35,280 violence against individuals who are not initiating violence 1447 01:20:35,280 --> 01:20:38,680 against you you do not take the property of individuals without 1448 01:20:38,680 --> 01:20:41,800 their consent you do not touch the body or property of a person 1449 01:20:41,800 --> 01:20:45,040 without their consent. I think this is something that 1450 01:20:45,040 --> 01:20:49,000 I've believed and held and valued for a very long time. 1451 01:20:49,720 --> 01:20:53,360 And I genuinely and honestly believe that it has made my life 1452 01:20:53,360 --> 01:20:57,320 a lot better. It's, it's, it's difficult to 1453 01:20:57,320 --> 01:21:02,000 explain this to people who don't agree with it because they don't 1454 01:21:02,000 --> 01:21:05,640 see how this kind of mentality can be very destructive for you. 1455 01:21:05,640 --> 01:21:09,480 If you think that you are, that you have the legitimacy to abuse 1456 01:21:09,480 --> 01:21:11,600 other people, to take things from other people because of 1457 01:21:11,600 --> 01:21:15,800 whatever stories you tell yourself, I think it makes you a 1458 01:21:15,880 --> 01:21:18,800 far worse person for yourself, for your own goals. 1459 01:21:19,200 --> 01:21:24,480 And having the maturity and the intelligence and the morality to 1460 01:21:24,480 --> 01:21:30,440 be able to just completely disavow the concept of violating 1461 01:21:30,440 --> 01:21:33,840 the property in the body of others makes you so much more 1462 01:21:34,880 --> 01:21:38,800 sane, so much more capable of understanding the world, so much 1463 01:21:38,800 --> 01:21:42,160 better at acting to impose the world in the way that you want, 1464 01:21:42,360 --> 01:21:46,640 rather than essentially fantasizing about violence as a 1465 01:21:46,640 --> 01:21:50,400 way of solving things. Thank you for sharing that and 1466 01:21:50,400 --> 01:21:53,800 thank you so much for your generosity and your time and 1467 01:21:53,800 --> 01:21:56,280 celebrating this episode with me. 1468 01:21:56,760 --> 01:21:58,120 I thought it was very interesting. 1469 01:21:58,200 --> 01:22:01,520 So thanks a lot and we'll stay in touch and and all the best. 1470 01:22:01,640 --> 01:22:02,520 Thank you. Thank you, Sir. 1471 01:22:02,680 --> 01:22:03,760 Take care. Bye, bye. 1472 01:22:03,920 --> 01:22:06,160 You too. I hope you enjoyed this episode. 1473 01:22:06,240 --> 01:22:09,520 If you did, you can click here to find more just like it and 1474 01:22:09,520 --> 01:22:12,400 click here to find all Bitcoin for Millennials podcast 1475 01:22:12,440 --> 01:22:14,720 episodes. Also, if you want to help me 1476 01:22:14,720 --> 01:22:18,560 shine a light on the message of Bitcoin, please like this video 1477 01:22:18,560 --> 01:22:22,120 and subscribe to stay connected. I hope to see you for a next 1478 01:22:22,120 --> 01:22:23,040 episode. Bye.