All right. Hey there.
This is Bram Constein and you're listening to Bitcoin for
Millennials. Together with my guests on this
podcast, I go on a journey to discover how our current
financial system works, why it's flawed, and why Bitcoin is the
most relevant technology that you, my fellow millennial,
should understand and adopt. Today, I'm joined by a man who,
in the past few weeks has become one of my favorite Bitcoin
content creators. This is something he's been
doing next next to his other ventures.
Being an entrepreneur and an investor, I love his faults on
Bitcoin and I'm super excited to have him as a first guest.
I don't even know his real name. He has.
He has a pseudonym. But yeah, British huddle man
welcome. Thank you very much.
Nice to where are you. Are you Dutch, by the way?
Yes. Can you hear it?
Yeah. We ruled the world, man.
You guys did. Yeah, I know.
I actually. I was on another podcast and
someone asked me about it. Like how much?
How much we learn about it And I had to answer not that much to
be honest. Like we we learn about the
golden age and stuff and that's some, you know, lots of stuff
was very bad. But the financial part basically
of it, you know, like not, not so much actually.
And that made me realize when I got that question, like I
actually don't know a lot about it.
Yeah, it's the same thing as the UK.
Like the the last thing it seems they want to teach you in
British schools is how big the British Empire was and how
powerful. Strong.
Undefeated. And unrelenting and positive it
was to the world. Yeah, you know, we just want to
know. We just want to know about all
the bad things that happen. It's like like as if bad things
don't happen. When you have the most
successful empire in the world. It's like, of course bad stuff's
gonna happen, but there was also good things.
But nobody ever wants to talk about that.
Yeah, that's what they say, right?
The stories who get told by the survivors and they can spin it
anyway. Anyway, they kind.
Of Yeah. So a quick check, Of course,
this is called Bitcoin for millennials.
Which generation do you belong to?
Like, I know you're a bit secretive.
I don't know. I'm 34 years old.
That's the same, right? So we are those millennials and
I see you do basically what you do around Bitcoin for your
parents generation. Could you tell a bit about that?
Like what's the driver there? Yeah, like, you know, one of the
I was very lucky. Like I started off in business
when I was 16 years old. I was negotiating property deals
because of my dad and I was pretty good at that at a young
age. So I was very lucky I started
off in business at a very young age.
What I what annoys me? Is that when I look at my
parents, for example, who are immigrants to the United Kingdom
who have done everything right, they've done everything right,
exactly what they tell you, go get a job, invest, etcetera,
etcetera. Save some money, invest in the
property market. And then, you know, 35 years of
building a property portfolio because it was doing the right
thing, sacrificing for their children, me and my brother and.
You when you look at the valuation of that property
portfolio, it's basically 85 to 90% lower than it should be
based on the amount of currency that's been printed.
Yeah, but it's kept up with inflation, right.
But it's number is nice, right? So the number is cool, but it
doesn't match the value. So what really has happened is,
you know, their 35 years of actually doing the right thing
has been really 35 years of their true value and sole energy
being stolen from them. And for me, that's extremely
important. You know how many people there
are who have followed exactly my parents path and have been
selfless in that and now have had their value stolen.
And they're wondering why their children are going crazy and
wondering why they can't keep up with providing the life that
they want to provide, even though they've got millions of
dollars of real estate or whatever it is.
That is, that's heartbreaking to me.
No, because great. You know, listen, we can be
frank. Can I be frank on this podcast
or I'm gonna try this. The first episode, you can set
the precedent to rest, right? I'm gonna have Greg Foss on
hopefully. So he'll continue this president
then? Yeah.
Cool. So like, you know, broke
millennials that have never done anything in the world and just
want to complain about, you know, how the world is, is
unfair, etc, etc. Is is 1.
Market for people that that need Bitcoin for sure.
I just care about people that have actually done the right
thing that I've actually done. Made an effort, actually done
something right. Not complained, shut up and
actually done the right thing and are still being fucked.
Yeah. And so when you say stolen, I I
think that's an interesting word, right?
Because like in my kind of network when I talk to, you know
people in the same generation, when I talk about, you know,
this is the money system that we participate in.
You know, per definition it gets worth, you know, anything you
own gets worth less. You know the grades in value, 2%
a year now it's way, way more. It's kind of like this value,
you know, the money energy that are the energy that you, you
know accumulated as your wealth gets stolen from you.
And I've had multiple people that told me, and I think I know
what your answer is going to be, what you think of it.
But like, yeah, when you say stolen, like, like that's a
pretty harsh word, you know, You know.
And then I kind of lose them in this conversation, which I find
very interesting. Like, why do you say stolen?
What can you define that? Or like what?
What do you mean by that? Because there has to be two.
You have to distinguish between price and value, right?
So when you said you know. Things are going down at two.
You know you're losing 2% a year.
That's really prices, right? Prices of things are going up at
2% a year, they hope over a long period of time.
But what people don't talk about is what true wealth is.
True wealth is what percentage of the overall supply of that
wealth that you control. If I control 20% of that supply,
I'm wealthier than someone who controls 10% of that supply.
So while the prices might be going up at 2% a year, the
actual percentage of wealth that you control is less over time,
even though there's quote, UN quote more money printed because
they're not giving you the appropriate amount, They're
saying, oh, your property portfolio today is worth 1% of
the money supply and we've just three X the money supply, so
300% up and we're going to increase your control of it to
1.5%. Right.
Yeah. So there's a spread that they've
stolen in that scenario that is wealth stealing.
I think that's a good explanation.
I'm gonna try. I'm gonna try that as well, but
I think it's interesting. It can't work on millennials cuz
most millennials don't have shit.
That's what I'm gonna try. Millennials don't have shit to
be stolen. Right, most.
But they still want the same as other people, right?
Like as anyone. So I think.
God loves a Tryer. And millennials these days are
the best Tryers. That's that's a good quote, man.
I well, my point was more like everyone wants the same, right?
Everyone wants hopefully a family, a place to live, you
know, take care of your parents and stuff like.
That's what everyone wants nowadays, because the marriage
rates are plummeting, the birth rates are plummeting.
I don't know if that's what everyone wants.
It sounds like what everyone wants is, you know, it is blue
hair. They want freedom.
They want all this other stuff that they don't want to pay for
or be responsible for. It sounds like one point, I
think, well, I hope you know, a reckoning day will be there when
people will realize, you know, that they have to actually do
stuff. Also, I do agree with you, but
yeah, I think it's a fair point. You know, like there's a very
big difference in these generations.
And I really love it when you say that you know you they did
what they thought was best and now you know they are actually
at the moment when they want to, you know, have the benefits of
this wealth, they have a problem.
They're now forced to scale down their living experience.
So I imagine that you do the right thing for 35 years, and
then your reward at the end of it is a lower life experience.
You scale down your house, you scale down your your living
expenses, you take less trips. Like, what are we talking about?
This isn't life. This is not what life promised.
This is not what life should be about.
And if there is a God in the world, I don't believe any God
would wish that on on it, on his or her children.
I agree. And So what would be the, like
the biggest thing that people don't understand about, you
know, the current financial system?
And why should they actually understand that?
The biggest thing is the only number that matters is what
percentage of the overall supply of currency do you control.
That's it. Nothing else matters.
If you just aim to optimize that, you'll be fine forever.
Everything else is a joke. Everything else is is like is
all of this new ones BS. If you control 1% of the money
supply today, your job is to make sure that you control 1% of
the money supply tomorrow. Simple.
That's the work you have to do. That's the work you have to do.
And unfortunately, in order to do that work, they've put you in
a position where you need to become a speculator, You need to
invest in stocks, you need to invest in property, you need to
invest in all these little things, all this stupid shit,
just to. Just to keep the value that you
already earned, because you earned that you went to work.
You worked. You earned that.
You sacrificed yourself. You sacrifice time away from
your family. You sacrifice time away from
your children. You sacrifice time away from
your wife or husband or both these days.
And now, now that you've done that, now you have to become
another job. You have to become a
professional speculator in order to just maintain that, and
there's a 95% chance you're going to lose your money whereas
you become a speculator. It doesn't make sense.
And when people hear that for the first time, like, I fully
agree. I also once had a tweet about
this. You know, like you take risk
with a venture you have or the job that you take, you know.
And then when you're home, you take on your other job.
And many people don't know that they have that actual job to
protect the the energy, the money that they that they
earned. Like if someone hears that for
the first time, like I like I see that you see that.
My goal hopefully with this podcast is to, you know help
more people see that, like how can we drill down on that a bit
like can. Is there a way you you could
explain why that is actually the case?
Yes, because everything is downstream of money.
Culture is downstream of money. Everything is downstream of
money. That everyone, everyone always
says that everything had like culture changed, right?
Culture changed, society changed.
No. What actually changed was the
money. Human beings are incentive
driven creatures and we will do an act in the way that our
incentives point us in. And when the, when the
incentives are all of this money is like printed immediately it's
out there. You're encouraged to take
further risks because you know that the value of this money is
going to go down. So I need to take risks.
And as you take those risks, your dopamine, your dopamine
structures change in your brain and now you start implementing
that level of conditioning in every area of your life and then
we end up here. Everything is downstream of the
money. And the money is corrupted
because they 12 people in the world or whatever it is, can
print a bunch of money and devalue your wealth. 12 people
in the world can sit there and go, oh, you know, Brahm has 1.5%
of the money supply and tomorrow he has 1.7% of the money supply
that I just three X. Now, if someone's watching this
and they don't think that that is unfair, you're fucked and
it's OK. Because you'll learn one way or
another. Either you learn and you take
advantage of the learning or you learn and you suffer as a result
of the learning one way or the other.
So before we move to the topic of Bitcoin, obviously you know
as something that could help or even save the people that are
stuck in this system. Who are.
What has been your most like influential on on shaping your
views on on this basically money risk, wealth, what was your
biggest influence? Really.
No, I don't really know. I think it was more so lessons
that I've learned along the way. There's never really been one
big. I've had good mentors, I've had
good guides, I've had, you know, good people around me and good
inspiring people. I just wanted to get rich.
Like when I was younger, I just wanted to get rich just like I
hope everyone else. But nowadays it seems like
people just want to don't want to get rich anymore because
being rich is bad, you know? So it's like.
I just wanted to get rich and I just wanted to create value and
and understand what that meant and how that process worked and
and just get rich and along that way I had different influences.
I had different influences when I was 16, different influences
when I was 2025. I just I I collect different
influences, so learning by doing basically.
Yeah, yeah. I've never really had just like
one person. That amazed me.
I had different people at different stages of life.
So what do you think is, is the cause of people?
Well, I think people still want to get rich in some way.
But yes, on the other side of that, there's also people that
hate all the rich people, whatever rich is nowadays, by
the way. Like, what happened there?
Why is there such a difference between these these generations
or even the people within the generation?
Well, because when you have the money, you can tell someone to
get fucked. So if if you're if I'm
controlling a population, like I completely understand why
everything's happened the way it's happened, I I get it.
Because I would do the exact same thing if I was running this
$900 trillion dollar empire, I would do exactly the same.
I would make people realize that money is not the most important
thing in the world, and I would make them realize that social
justice and other things are way more important and way more
worthwhile causes. And I would figure out a way to
steal their value from them before they've even got a chance
to realize what that value is. And I would keep them trapped.
That's exactly what I would do and that's exactly what anyone
with any common sense running a $900 trillion empire would do.
That's just opportunity cost or or just the opportunity that you
have. It's, it's my.
Job is to keep the system alive. My job is to keep my system
alive. Have you ever looked into like
the Roman Empire and the downfall of of that like
everyone? Feels pretty similar.
Everyone was obsessed with chopping their Dicks off back
then too well, and you know, cutting.
I love these pictures of cutting the cutting the coins, you know,
But do you think it's hard to understand?
That's my perception sometimes that when we read about things
in the past, you know, we kind of observe them, you know, it's
far away from us, you know, in time, but also just an
experience. And now I see people talk about,
you know, we're living through the exact same thing.
You know, like what you mentioned, there's so, so many,
so many, so many of the same things going on.
Do you think it's difficult for people to actually understand
that that what we read about is also happening now?
Well, I don't know if it's also happening now, right?
I I I think history rhymes. I don't think it was sort of
repeats itself. I think it rhymes and then it
sort of looks as similar as possible.
You know, I The problem is when somebody is so in something and
somebody's so brainwashed into something, there's nothing you
can say is going to make them go, oh, maybe I'm wrong because
there's trillions of dollars of advertising going in the other
direction to incentivize you to think that way.
So I don't believe that it's possible to turn around this
brainwashing. I don't try and fight against
it. I ridicule it.
I think it's happening and there's an agenda.
And I'm not trying to fight a $900 trillion beast, so just
take care of you in your own. Yeah, like the people you say,
anyone you love. Yeah, yeah, the people around me
are fine. The people around me are set.
You know anyone else who wants to cuz I've had conversations,
right? Why?
You know these Mpc's where you're having a conversation and
it feels like you've just got to a point where something has
started to make sense and then you know something happens to
them and and they go back, go to the bathroom or whatever, reset
and come back as as an agent again.
And it's like what what do you, how do you argue against that?
It's spiritually broke, I think also kind of like there's not a
lot of self reflection going on. There's not a lot of real, you
know there's. Absolutely 0 self reflection
going on, yeah, but no inquiry as well.
I think there's not that many just like open conversations
where you think A, I think B and let's see where we end up.
You can't because when you have to go to work for, you know, 10
hours a day, 11 hours a day, 12 hours a day, you gotta go to
work, you gotta maybe have two jobs.
You got children to look after you got, you know that the like,
you just got too much to think about and then you kill the
will. You need will.
That's why they want people to be busy, because when you're
busy, you don't have time to think, you know.
That's why. That's why the majority of
people working, they have a screen 30 centimeters in front
of. I think I read this study a
while ago, which is like. Screen or something that is 30
or 60 centimeters or something like that in front of your face
literally shuts down part of the brain.
Like the best thing you can do to wake up your brain is to look
outside and look, try and look as far as you can look.
And that starts to open up your brain again.
Wake your brain up. Yeah.
And so if we move to Bitcoin, right, I wanted to ask you, how
do you personally approach the topic of this financial risk
that we talked about? Part of that is obviously
Bitcoin. I checked out a lot of your
content and I think you also mentioned that you encountered
Bitcoin, but you did not get into it in the beginning.
I thought it was a fucking scam. So what?
What belief made you not get in two bit?
Remember, my background has been traditional asset, so it's been
real estate, it's been stocks, it's been gold, it's been all
that. And you're telling me that this
digital thing that is is, but this doesn't make any sense in
the world. That's where my mindset was, but
that was an easy dismissal. Yeah, like it was just, it was
it was the easiest and stupidest dismissal that you could have
made and and you gotta remember like.
Bitcoin right now is making a lot of sense in at least in the
last, you know, few years to peop majority of the Bitcoin
common sense comes from people that didn't have assets.
Why? Because people that do have
assets don't give a shit, right? I'm getting richer, right?
It might not be at the same rate as as I should be getting
richer, but I'm getting richer. So the urgency is less and
that's why I think the urgency is about to shift to that to
that market. Yeah, we'll get into that
because I really like your views on that.
But to just go back one thing, like what belief do you think
that caused, right? I always find it very
interesting in general when someone shares an idea or
encounters something new, like dismissing something, it's very
easy and lazy, right? And in some way also kind of,
you know, could give you some satisfaction and feeling like
you're like you're smart, right, But like actually doing the work
and kind of diving in more and and well do some self reflection
or challenge yourself, you know, that's obviously way more, way
more work. So what did you do or what did
you encounter when you actually got it?
Like what was what was the aha moment?
So I'll be, I'll be completely honest, I was just thinking
while you were while you were speaking and this is the first
time I've ever said this right, The reason why Bitcoin didn't
make any sense to me was because it didn't make any sense to the
people around me, right, Because I was around real estate guys,
stock market guys, gold guys, etcetera, etcetera.
And I was. I was just too stupid to go do
the thinking for myself, I said. What made you actually do it?
So what happened was in 2020 after after the after the
worldwide flu season, I was locked down in London.
And a friend of mine who was one of those guys who I listened to
when they said that Bitcoin is a scam, actually told me you
should listen to this book called The Bitcoin Standard and
I was walking around my local park.
Because in the UK, even though we were locked down, you could
be out all day, right? And I was just listening to this
audio book and having a gold background.
The 2nd that safe and Dean in that book mentions the idea of
stock to flow. I remember stopping in the
middle of this park as I'm walking around it and realizing
that I've fucked up and. I rewind it.
OK Can we picture this like in the middle of the street?
You're standing and you're like. In the middle of a park.
It was in the middle of now. But yeah, like, it was worse
than that. I was.
I just fucked up. So I rewound it, listened to
that segment again before I even finished the rest of the book.
Because you gotta remember, also in 2017, me and my best friend,
we were smoking cigars and we were like, this Bitcoin thing
looks like it's pumping. So we both we both bought like
20 bitcoins each. While we're smoking cigars and
two weeks later once the price double we sold them and paid for
six months worth of cigars. So that was in that was in or
whatever it was. And and then this happened in
2020 and so I I literally had a Coinbase account already.
So I downloaded Coinbase again, logged into my account, wired
money from from from my bank account.
To Coinbase, and I had bought Bitcoin by the time I'd walked
home. Like that's how urgent it
became. And then in the next few months,
I moved like 35% of my net worth into Bitcoin.
And then by the end of 2020, it was significantly hard in that,
all right. So that's stock to flow model.
Not the model, just the idea, just the idea of stock model.
Wasn't around model, wasn't really even around then.
Yeah, it was just the idea, cuz coming from a gold background,
I'd never considered Bitcoin like a commodity.
Yeah, could you elaborate a bit on that?
Like what is stock to flow like? Oh, I don't know.
And how does that tie into gold? Yeah.
So when you value the idea of a hard asset, the hardness of an
asset is determined by how long does it take to get the current
on ground supply that's on this earth out of the ground again.
So if it takes 60 years, like it does for gold of new supply,
yearly supply to get as much gold as we have on the ground
right now, that has a ranking and it's 60.
Real estate has a different ranking, it's 125, right?
Silver has a different ranking. It's like 3 to 15 years,
something like that. So the higher this number is,
the harder this asset is because it's harder to get it out of the
ground. And replace the own ground
supply that's stock to flow. Simple as that.
You don't need to worry about stock to flow model.
You don't need to worry about nothing.
And what we find in a weird way as humans is that our capital,
naturally, without even knowing this, goes towards the hardest
asset. It's why real estate has the
biggest market cap in the world. It's why stocks are next, It's
why gold is next, it's why silver's, silver's next, etc
etc. We always assign our capital,
naturally. To the hardest asset and that's
why it's been real estate and is that because we want to save the
energy that we accumulate with our work, right or with our
ventures in time, right? That's right.
So what we're doing when we are looking at what do we do with
our money is very simple. We are expending our physical
energy and receiving currency for that.
And then we need to put that currency into a battery in order
to save that energy. And the battery of choice is the
battery that can be changed the least, which is the hardness of
the asset. And so far in humanity, that
asset has chosen to be real estate.
Yes. All right, so when we make the
jump to Bitcoin, right, like we talked about the system, we
talked about why people want to save money in these types of
assets. How?
How does Bitcoin offer a solution for the the problems
that people encounter with with this current system?
Many different ways. So you've got the the biggest
challenge is for is for people to understand what you're
actually buying. When you buy a property or
stocks or anything else. People think you're buying
property, you're not. You're buying scarcity, you're
buying how long it takes for somebody to build another
property. Because if I bought an apartment
building. And tomorrow, someone else could
also put an apartment building right next to it.
The value of my property would be less.
But because the very fact that it takes time to get approved,
it takes time for that to happen, is what gives my
property value. So scarcity is the actual asset.
It's not the property, it's not the stock, it's not anything
else, right? It's like how easy or hard it is
for someone else to acquire it as well.
To build it. To just build in this case.
Build, You know, get it out of the ground.
With the ground exactly. So once you understand that
scarcity is the actual true asset, at that point your only
question, next question is what's the scarcest asset And
logically you get to fact that Bitcoin is the scarcest asset
because there is only ever going to be 21 million Bitcoin.
Right. And the beautiful thing about
Bitcoin is that every Bitcoin can be split into 100 million
parts. Which means that whether you're
a street sweeper, you know, working in a corporate job, a
millionaire or a multi billionaire, you could own the
same asset with the lowest amount of cost differential
compared to anything else. Because if a billionaire wants
to buy property, he's going to get it at a lower cost than
somebody who's on the street. Gotcha.
And so I also have a question about this finite supply.
We'll get into that maybe one step back when we think about,
you know, saving that energy for the future basically also comes
from if I don't have anything that I want or need to spend it
on then I should have a vehicle through to actually you know
save that to the to the future. What do you think that the
current kind of like I like this term like time value of money,
you know, I think well the author of the Bitcoin Standard
book talks about that as well, right?
Like short time preference or long time preference where he
talks about the money or the wealth, the energy is melting,
so you have a short time preference, so you have to spend
this money. What do you think these concepts
say about like the perception of of time for people?
Like I think it's also in a Bitcoin standard where he talks
about, well if you have a long time preference, you can
actually be happier, have less stress, you know you can
actually plan your life basically.
Like what are your thoughts around that?
Yeah, I think definitely, like, the longer you think how the
happier you are because at least you have purpose.
That's the problem right now with a lot of young people is,
they think, living for now. Is is the right thing to do, but
the problem is, is that when you live for now, you have no long
term purpose and human beings, especially young men, need
purpose. Yeah.
Right. And so, yeah, having something
that you can put your wealth into, that you can have a vision
of. You know, quote UN quote,
spending later and what it's going to give you.
And etc, etc. Allows you to have an anchor in
the universe that you can build something around.
Most people don't have that. They're absolutely purposeless,
and that doesn't give them any anchor to build something
around. Most people's purpose is their
job. Think about that.
So do they feel unsafe then? Like not safe enough to you just
feel actually have that. Just feel lost you Just when
you're when you're in that state, you feel lost.
And the beautiful thing about feeling lost is if I can make
you feel lost, I can make you follow me quickly.
And that's where the system comes back into play.
So if we translate this into how can we help people?
What is your preferred way or mental model to explain Bitcoin
then? Well, you are working.
You are exchanging your physical energy for currency.
And that currency needs to be stored somewhere in order for
you to spend it tomorrow. If you don't think it needs to
be stored somewhere for you to spend it tomorrow, have the best
life possible, Go do whatever you want to do.
But if you believe that your work today should be valued
tomorrow, and the energy that you've converted from your work
today should be valued tomorrow, well, now you need a battery.
And now the question is which battery are you going to use?
And now we can argue about that. The problem with real estate as
a battery is that they tell you this is the capacity of the
battery and then they keep increasing the capacity of the
battery, right? And your wealth, your currency
is not going up fast enough to maintain that percentage that
you own. So it's devaluing your energy.
So if you need a battery like that, well, Bitcoin might be the
best battery that you're looking for.
Yeah, So when people want to eventually adopt Bitcoin, they
have to learn, I think two things that they are not
thinking about now, right They have to learn to trust a
computer code basically. But also they have to trust
themselves. Like I have a few millionaire
friends that I'm trying to Orange Bill.
I haven't had any luck, honestly.
But one of them said, well, what if I have a million in Bitcoin
and then I have like full agency over keeping that safe, full
responsibility? Basically, yeah.
This is why the ETF is so big for me.
I've been saying this since 2021.
In fact, 2020 the ETF is extremely big news because most
people are not comfortable having a bearer instrument.
Bitcoin is a bearer instrument, so that means you own it, right?
You have it on you, right? You bear it, you control it, you
you're responsible for it. And and by the way, name another
big market cap asset that's a bearer instrument, Yeah.
There is none, right? It's all abstractions you mean?
Yeah, real estate's not a bearer instrument.
Yeah, stocks are not a bearer instrument, right?
To a certain extent, the way gold is mostly owned is not a
bearer instrument like Jewels watches maybe.
They're not big enough. They're not big enough for
market cap. I agree watches are a bearer
instrument, but there's not a big enough market cap.
So most assets that turn into a big market cap are not bearer
instruments, which is why the ETF is so important.
Because just like your friend, I have those same friends that are
so worried about, you know, losing their Bitcoin, they'll
only buy it once the ETF comes out.
Which is why the capital flow that's going to come as soon as
this ETF is approved is immense. And nobody's, nobody's really
thinking about that, which is why I try and talk about it as
much as I can. Yeah, let's dive into that in a
second, because I had, I had a question about that too.
What I actually wanted to ask about, you know that that
trusting new things, like, it's kind of like a paradigm shift in
thinking, right? Like if you understand why you
need Bitcoin as a vehicle to save your energy to the future,
and you have to you have to trust a computer and also
yourself, you know, what does that say about the concept of
trust in, you know, our current society?
People don't have trust in themselves, so.
How can you? How can you even expect them to
have trust in themselves when all they've done their entire
life is trusted their teachers right, then, trusted their
professors and then trusted their bosses, and then trusted
everyone around them to direct their life besides them?
They're not trained. You have to train yourself to
trust yourself. But nobody has been, has had
that training. Nobody has ever gone out there
and said I'm just going to put my own bulls on the line and do
what I want to do. They go to university because
people tell them to go to university.
They go get a job because people tell them they this is the job.
There's already a very few people in the world that
actually say I want X and I'm going to go do it.
So what are some first principles that people could
follow to maybe get to that point where they can unlearn
these things or see themselves or the world in a different way?
It's tough. It's tough because the world
makes it so safe to be in that in that realm.
I don't even, you know, it's it's quite interesting.
I don't even talk about like what are the first principles
because I think that if you have it, you're gonna do it.
Because I can't tell you what to do.
You couldn't tell me what to do because I I just, I had
something right. I had something that was like.
My dad, I my dad was negotiating a property deal when I was 15
years old and I was watching him and he got off.
He got off the phone and I was smirking and he said what are
you smirking about? And I said, that looks easy.
At 15 right now. The best gift my dad ever gave
me was he didn't tell me to get fucked.
He said, well show me if it's that easy, show me.
So I had something at 15 years old where even though my mouth
had just written a check that my my buddy had no idea how to
cash, I had to go figure it out. Right now you're telling me that
someone who's a millennial at 30 years old, 34 years old, 35
years old, who's got a family, a child, a job so ingrained into
the system, you're so hopelessly dependent on the system and now
you want to figure out first principles like your best chance
is Bitcoin. Yeah.
Interesting. I'm I'm.
While you're talking, I'm thinking like what what was my
own points or what are my own things and I have to be honest
to say that I also don't, right. I can't really identify it.
I don't know. It's kind of like a gradual,
yeah. Every time, every time somebody
asks somebody who's done something good in life, like
what did you, what did they all come out with?
It's all BS. Pursue your passion.
That's the worst advice you can give someone like read books.
What are we talking about? It's all bullshit, but nobody
has the answer because if you're listening to others instead of
yourself that like like what you?
Mentioned Most people are too stupid to listen to.
They They shouldn't listen to themselves because they're
probably too stupid to do it right.
Because what? You can only listen to your own
wisdom once you have some wisdom, right?
I had to go fail. I had to actually pick up the
damn phone, call someone who wanted to sell property and
fail. At 16 years old, over and over
and over and over again, in order to train myself to read
the patterns of what might be successful, how do you expect
someone to do that when they're 35 years old, with two kids, a
wife and all those responsibilities?
I agree. Very, very hard.
So Bitcoin. That's why Bitcoin is the only
self teaching tool that will allow you to do that, yeah.
Basically, here's what it is You need to get comfortable with
proving yourself right. And guess what that takes?
It takes risk. It takes heartbreak.
It takes telling everyone to get fucked.
It takes all of that. And most people don't have the
bandwidth to do that because the system is, it has has got them.
Yeah. I find it so interesting when
you say risk, like I I think I also once I once tweeted this
like I have Bitcoin because I'm pretty risk averse actually.
Yeah. And it kind of ties in back back
into what you said about, you know, like when you take risk
with a venture or a job and you earn money and then you have to
take more risk to actually protect what you just got
rewarded for taking risk. And I just really think like I
don't want to do that. You know, like I don't, I don't
want to do that. But still I do think I'm taking
a risk by adopting this new thing, right.
And honestly, not totally understanding what's kind of
more like the meta play, the bigger play is of these
financial institutions and what's going to happen.
And I want to recommend one of your last videos where you share
about what the BlackRock plan is and this is one of my next
questions. But I think it's a nice
reflection to to think about what am I actually doing.
But I think in general that is what Bitcoin does, you know?
The biggest gift that Bitcoin will give most millennials that
actually get it and do it is the gift of being right, yes.
Right when I negotiated my first property deal and I basically
pivoted from trying to deal with distressed sellers to just going
straight to developers because I was like, well.
There are distressed homeowners and there are distressed
property developers. And the distressed property
developers are easy to deal with as a 16 year old because I don't
give a shit. And I can't be as emotionally
empathetic as my dad could be when he's talking to a
distressed seller because I cannot relate.
But I can relate to a property developer who's distressed
because I can say, oh, you got 25 units to suck and sell those
in 30 days, right? I can relate to that so.
And that was found. That was that was actually
ridiculed at the beginning when I decided to try and make that
pivot at 16. There is nothing sweeter than
actually just doing that and telling everyone that was
laughing at me to get fucked because I was right.
The biggest gift Bitcoin will give to millennials is that
first boost of I'm right. That's 100%.
This is something I also want to share to the people listening.
Like why I got I got into Bitcoin gradually Bitcoin
gradually more and more and more over time, like over the past 10
years. But once I saw a tweet, I don't,
I don't remember who it was by. But they said if you even
remotely think Bitcoin is going to be a thing, you know, like an
actual, like like the, you know, the big teases of sucking up all
the, you know, wealth in the world and and etc.
Do you want to be in the stadium and have a seat when that
happens or not? And I read that and I thought
that is what I want because I want to be at the point that you
just illustrated. When that happens, I am sitting
there with my popcorn and I think maybe there will be a tear
because I'm just, I will be proud of myself that I'm right.
You know, That is exactly, exactly what you're saying.
Yeah, that's why it's very important for young people to
stack up as much of these I'm right moments at a young age.
You know, I plan on having children one day.
And from my experience, that's exactly what I'll try and create
for them, that experience of I'm right.
Yeah. Fuck you.
I'm right. That's very, very important for
young people. And I thought I wasn't before,
but then I thought I was. And then I got shown and I was
right. Yeah.
So young young people don't have many of these.
Right. And they've and they've not been
young people. We have not been given the
ability to have these moments. We've either had to go take them
and create them or we just don't.
Yeah, I agree. That's why do you think when you
know when, back in the day when when young kid, young boys were
becoming men, what do they have to do?
Yeah, hard stuff, that initiation anything.
Quite a lion, right? Because then why?
Because what that emboldens inside of you is that I'm right.
I won. I write.
I'm right that they got out of it, that they went through it,
you mean? I'm right.
And so that's what that's what young, young young men need.
And I don't think we have many of those things.
I found the source of those things through business and real
estate. It just depends.
Some people find the source of those things through something
else. You're certainly not going to
find the source of those things through fucking chakra
cleansing, right? All right.
I love that. When we move to back to Bitcoin
kindish again. You know, you talk and you press
very hard on this finite supply of Bitcoin and we briefly
touched on it right when you talked about heart as it's how
hard is it to make another one. You know, how predictable is a
certain type of supply? You really press on like finite
supply, something that is very rare.
Maybe this is even the 1st and the only time that we actually
have something that has a finite supply.
So ending supply. Can you explain why it's so
important and why? Why?
It's hard for people to wrap
their head around that. Yeah, because, you know,
everyone thinks property is a finite supply.
But it's a lie because my dad, who came to the United Kingdom,
you know, almost 4 decades ago. Yeah.
So it's like.
He could buy 10 properties. Me, 40 years later, if I want
to, I can buy 10 properties. There might not be the same
property, they might not be in the same place.
But I can still buy 10 properties with Bitcoin.
That's completely impossible. It's completely impossible
because you can't just make more Bitcoin and put it in the side
of the universe where it just has a lower price.
Can't do it. I can buy.
Maybe 10,000 Satoshi's I can buy, maybe a million Satoshi's.
But I'm never going to be able to buy a whole Bitcoin and out
of the miraculous, right? Like, let's say I become, you
know, a tech multibillionaire. Now I can go and buy the same 10
properties that my dad bought because I have the extra amount
of of paper to do it outside of the miraculous.
I can't. I can't do it.
So that's that's what Bitcoin is.
Unlike property, unlike stocks. I can't just go buy as something
that looks like this. It's not possible.
And does that also tie into what people call the, you know, the
game theory of Bitcoin, where once it's bought, I think over
70% of Bitcoin haven't moved in 18 months or 24 months even,
like once it's bought by someone who understands it will never be
on the market again? You know, This is why I get
worried now because the the type of buyer that's coming into
Bitcoin next is a scary buyer. You know one of the things, so I
collect watches, right? And you know the one of the when
I'm smoking cigars with a with with a bunch of my friends,
one's name is Adam. And and the one thing I love
about Adam is that we can just be honest about the fact that
it's just the childlike behavior that we want.
Fuck the watches. Yeah, having a having that watch
is nice, but the fact that he got it before me or that I have
it is what's fun or for list or not or yeah.
Whatever, right? Like, that's what's fun.
It's a. Game It's like me and Adam have
a war about which which chair we're gonna sit in in the cigar
lounge. Like I like there's only one
chair that has the view of the whole cigar lounge.
And every single time he'll send me a picture of that chair and
he say this chair has my name on it.
And then I'll go there, sit on the same chair and take a
picture and said fuck you, this is all childish bullshit, but
that's what that's what's fun. Once you have a certain amount
of money and we're about to enter the buyers for Bitcoin,
that will be able to look you in the face and say I have one
Bitcoin, you don't fuck you. And so that's when we move on to
the ETF's. Can you shortly explain what an
ETF is and and what is happening here and what your thoughts are
on it? Yeah.
So an ETF is, imagine a company that owns a particular asset.
The only thing that company owns is that particular asset and you
get to buy shares in that company.
That's an ETF. So the value of your shares is
going to be completely related to the value of the assets in
the company. So the difference here is
instead of you having to control that Bitcoin and actually take
custody of it, the ETF will do that and be responsible.
And there are great regulations in the US to allow people to do
this and they make money on fees or.
Yes. So they'll charge you a small
fee for doing all the work, all right.
And so you pay that continuously when you hold the shares or when
you buy it? Yeah.
So you'll pay that on an annual basis or whatever it is based on
this and it will just come out of your holdings, All right.
So that ETF is basically a claim on that asset in that sense.
Yeah. All right.
And So what we have in the US is.
Actually not. Technically, it's not a claim on
that. It's a representation or.
That right. Yeah.
It's an abstract. Yeah.
OK. And so those are tradable,
right, the. Yes, I can now trade my shares
to you and yes, exactly. Yeah, OK.
It can happen all over, all over the world, you know, while the
markets are open. And that is that is the scariest
thing to happen to Bitcoin since Bitcoin was incepted.
Yeah, because we have 8-9. I'm not sure I.
Don't even know too many applications for these types of
ETF's in America. I think the second deadline is
coming up tomorrow actually, which I don't know what the
Bloomberg guys said, they said 858075 or 85% chance of this
year approval. And I also saw somewhere on
Twitter where someone said like it's like a 50% chance of
tomorrow. I'm not sure, but like why is
there a wall of money coming as you mentioned?
Well, just like your friend mentioned, right?
Like your friend who's a millionaire said to you that he
is worried about how to look after his Bitcoin.
Well, if there was a service where he could just go into his
broker account that he's used to buying stocks with and tap and
say buy the Bitcoin ETF and he gets price exposure on that,
which is pretty much what most people only want anyway.
It now unlocks a bunch of capital.
Second layer to that is, you know, there's there's the top
500 asset managers in the world control about $130 trillion of
wealth and each and every single one of them is going to be
incentivized to sell Bitcoin because there's now a fee
attached to it because of the front.
So there is a tremendous amount of capital coming to an asset
where 80% of the assets don't move every single time it drops
down to 85%. And the supply is about to be
cut in half again in April. Yeah.
So that's the flow, right? Less flow, less stock to be
traded basically, which means well in, in your course you, you
teach and substantiate why you have a $5,000,000 Bitcoin price.
Maybe it changed actually now that you read some new stuff,
let's say it gets to that price, right?
Like I think you said, 20302032 is kind of your target ish.
Like if someone actually holds Bitcoin as the asset, not the
ETF, maybe also the ETF. I saw you explain it as well,
like how can you live of how can you live of that, Like how can
you make sure that you don't have to sell your Bitcoin?
Yeah, there's a lot. There's a lot of ways, There's a
lot of ways to do that. You can borrow against your
Bitcoin. I wouldn't do it right now.
You can borrow against your
Bitcoin. You can have the ETF right now,
you know, most people don't realize this, but there is
something called a stock loan, right.
So if I have a bunch of shares, I can loan money against those
shares pretty easily at market at you know, almost just tiny
bit above Fed rates and that's absolutely that will be possible
with the ETF. So there's many, many different
ways to do that. It's just now is not the right
time to do that, yeah, but in 20-30 those are kind of like the
options then. Yeah.
Cuz right now you know, when you're comparing, like I've been
saying this since 2021, by the way, right?
When Block Five was doing its thing and I said it's like,
imagine you own a property and you want to rent out that
property and you have two estate agents show up to try and get
that contract to rent that property.
One of them is in a sharp suit. He's absolutely respectful.
Shakes your hand like a like a man breaks everything down for
you logically, you know makes sense.
Says you know, I, I, I think that we can probably get the
market currently rents for a let's just say $1000 a month.
We could probably end up getting you 1000 eleven $100 a month
something like that. If you if you want to sign with
me then the next guy rocks up. He's got a shitty car, right?
He gets out of it. He's missing a sock, his
trousers ripped. Right.
You can tell that he's been doing cocaine because you can
see a little bit of white stuff on his nose.
He walks up to you. He shakes your hand like a
woman, right? His hair's all over the place.
He's fidgety all the time. He doesn't know how to have a
conversation with you, but promises you they can get you
$1500 a month, yeah. Who are you giving the property
to? Well, now I would say the money.
You would say the money. That's the that's a very
interesting point. No, that's a good point.
That's a very interesting point. Maybe I answer to, well, me.
For me, I would not. I would not do that.
I was thinking more the regular person perhaps would choose the
money. Well, it's actually not true
because when I asked my parents, my parents immediately said the
person with the person who said 1100 and looks like he knows
what he's doing right. That's a very interesting point.
We just that that that's a good moment and that's what's
happening right now. Block 5 showing up as that
second guy on cocaine and telling you they can give you,
you know, bitcoins generating you.
I don't know, let's say bitcoins compounding at 80% a year and
they're saying we can give you 82.5% a year.
Yeah, but I'm. I look like I've been taking
cocaine, my trousers ripped. There's no evidence of me being
able to do this before. I'm just just started becoming a
realtor, etc. Etc.
Yeah, and people are going, oh, that makes sense.
Right. That's why millennials will lose
their fucking Bitcoin. Because the people like my
parents, the boomers, have been through this before.
They've seen all that BS before and they're not giving their
Bitcoin up to those people, but they've been burned, of course.
They've been burned before, so they're coming along and they're
buying Bitcoin. They're never, ever going to
sell it. Ever, ever.
And they're not going to give it to anyone unless it's BlackRock,
Goldman Sachs, someone like that.
JP Morgan Chase, etc. Etc.
They're not going to give it to any random idiot like Block Fi
or Celsius. That's why millennials get
fucked. And when do you think this is
going to happen? This transition is happening
right now. The buyer of Bitcoin right now
is not the millennial because the millennial, as always, is
too busy chasing dodge coin. I agree.
So I wanted to ask as two last questions to to wrap up this
convo. I actually wanted to ask like do
you think wealth equates happiness?
Or maybe even better, what is wealth?
Yes, wealth. Wealth definitely equates
happiness. Now you might say that, oh, I
don't need wealth to be happy. Fine, but wealth definitely
increases your happiness. That is a lie They told you.
Oh, don't don't worry about chasing money.
Chase happiness. That's a that's a lie.
It's a lie. You telling me that?
Yeah. OK.
Me and you both have problems. I'm broke your Ridge.
You don't think you're going to be happier being able to deal
with those problems better with that money?
Sure. There there are certain problems
in the world, like losing family members.
That no matter how much money you have, we're both going to go
through the same thing. But there's probably less than
ten of those problems that we can both experience at the same
level. Every other problem, you being
richer versus me being broke, is going to allow you to deal with
that problem better, quicker. Yeah.
All right, last one. What's a core belief you will
never let go? Oh shit, that's a really good
one. That above everybody else, I'm
right and I can figure it out. I love that.
Thank you. Thanks.
I really enjoyed this. Thanks for being my first guest.
I wish. You the best of luck with it.
Thank you. Could you please share, like
where people can find you? I definitely recommend, like,
your short e-mail video course on getting to know you better,
hearing your kind of like thesis around Bitcoin, yeah?
You know, to find me the first and only thing you need to do is
go to youtube.com which I'm sure everyone knows and just type in
British huddle start right. I will link this in the show
notes. Definitely yeah, thanks again so
much and I wish you all the best.
I hope to stay in touch. Thank you very much my friend.
Let's see you where we end up. Sorry.
I'll see you in the Netherlands soon.
Yeah, Dope man. Thanks.
I hope you enjoyed this episode. If you did, it would be amazing
if you could rate, review and subscribe on the podcast
platform of your choice. It will help us educate more
millennials on the importance of Bitcoin.
You can follow and connect with me on Twitter.
I'm Bramk. That's at Bramk.
And if you are or know someone who has an interesting
perspective on Bitcoin that's worth sharing, hit me up.
I read and reply to every single message.
I appreciate your support and hope you'll be here for the next
episode. Thanks for listening.
Bye, I'm a.