1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:03,200 Today on the Winning with Shopify podcast, was it 50,000 2 00:00:03,200 --> 00:00:04,960 reviews? He says that's what you need to 3 00:00:04,960 --> 00:00:07,160 be asking, not how did you get. Here, it's absolutely crazy. 4 00:00:07,160 --> 00:00:10,640 Yes, it's ChatGPT now instead of Google or Bing, but nothing's 5 00:00:10,640 --> 00:00:13,160 really changed. People hate Amazon and I get. 6 00:00:13,160 --> 00:00:14,880 It every time someone lands on, that's your most viewed 7 00:00:14,880 --> 00:00:17,760 products, but 90% of people that land on it jump back and go on 8 00:00:17,760 --> 00:00:19,560 another product. We would ask a similar question 9 00:00:19,640 --> 00:00:21,760 Why would you shop with us I. Would be lying if there had 10 00:00:21,760 --> 00:00:23,920 never been slapped in the wrist by Trading Standards and ASA. 11 00:00:23,920 --> 00:00:25,720 Why do people leave? It's normally because you've 12 00:00:25,720 --> 00:00:26,760 given them a reason. To leave. 13 00:00:26,760 --> 00:00:29,080 How do you do it then without? I think everyone's sitting there 14 00:00:29,080 --> 00:00:30,720 in a pencil going, Will you be done? 15 00:00:30,760 --> 00:00:31,920 Like what? What has been the strategy? 16 00:00:31,920 --> 00:00:34,600 This is not rocket science. Don't try and do everything 17 00:00:34,640 --> 00:00:36,120 because you're never going to be able to. 18 00:00:36,120 --> 00:00:42,440 Don't stress. Hello and welcome to another 19 00:00:42,440 --> 00:00:43,880 episode of a winning with Shopify podcast. 20 00:00:43,880 --> 00:00:46,880 If you've never tuned in before, I'm sitting in a real room with 21 00:00:46,880 --> 00:00:49,120 a real person today rather than talking over video, which is 22 00:00:49,120 --> 00:00:50,960 very exciting. Before we get in today's 23 00:00:50,960 --> 00:00:52,600 episode, please hit the subscribe button. 24 00:00:52,600 --> 00:00:54,800 Leave us a little review on any platform you're listening to 25 00:00:55,000 --> 00:00:58,760 Massive, massive plug as well to Spotify and it is to Shopify. 26 00:00:58,760 --> 00:01:01,640 We're a Shopify podcast to Spotify and also Apple podcast. 27 00:01:01,640 --> 00:01:03,200 Please review us on those platforms. 28 00:01:03,440 --> 00:01:05,360 We need to get more reviews to get more views. 29 00:01:05,360 --> 00:01:07,400 We're getting loads of views across other channels as well. 30 00:01:07,560 --> 00:01:10,040 If you're listening to this and going, this sounds great. 31 00:01:10,040 --> 00:01:12,040 How do I watch Nick? Want to check out our YouTube 32 00:01:12,040 --> 00:01:13,800 channel? We can also show you the video 33 00:01:13,800 --> 00:01:15,920 on Spotify as well if you want to go and sign up there. 34 00:01:16,160 --> 00:01:18,000 But today I'm delighted to be joined by Matt from Green 35 00:01:18,000 --> 00:01:19,040 People. Matt, welcome. 36 00:01:19,040 --> 00:01:20,360 How are you? I'm very good. 37 00:01:20,360 --> 00:01:21,400 And yourself. Good. 38 00:01:21,400 --> 00:01:22,200 Yeah, very good. Thanks. 39 00:01:22,200 --> 00:01:23,640 Very good. It's absolutely freezing as 40 00:01:23,640 --> 00:01:25,480 well, and we've just turned the heating off because it's noisy. 41 00:01:25,680 --> 00:01:27,680 So if we start shivering, you know why? 42 00:01:28,240 --> 00:01:30,800 But Matt, if people haven't heard of Green People that'll 43 00:01:30,800 --> 00:01:33,240 come across your brand new products before, tell us a bit 44 00:01:33,240 --> 00:01:35,320 about Green People as an organization and also a bit 45 00:01:35,320 --> 00:01:36,520 about your role in the team as well. 46 00:01:36,920 --> 00:01:39,760 Sure. So yeah, Green People are an 47 00:01:39,760 --> 00:01:44,040 organic and natural skin care brand, sun care brand and hair 48 00:01:44,040 --> 00:01:47,520 care brand based in the UK. The brand's been going a long 49 00:01:47,520 --> 00:01:49,280 time. It's been going for 28 years 50 00:01:49,280 --> 00:01:52,160 now. It was founded all of that time 51 00:01:52,160 --> 00:01:56,160 ago by a lady called Charlotte, who still is there today as CEO. 52 00:01:56,680 --> 00:01:59,480 So I found LED business, which is one thing I actually love 53 00:01:59,480 --> 00:02:03,960 about it. Green People was created to make 54 00:02:03,960 --> 00:02:07,280 products for people with skin concerns, mainly sensitive skin, 55 00:02:07,880 --> 00:02:09,639 but it's also great for lots of other things. 56 00:02:09,639 --> 00:02:12,200 Our sun care, for example, is amazing for people with prickly 57 00:02:12,200 --> 00:02:15,920 heat. So it's really, really great 58 00:02:15,920 --> 00:02:18,800 working in a sector where you genuinely can actually make a 59 00:02:18,800 --> 00:02:22,760 difference as well. I, as you can probably see, did 60 00:02:22,760 --> 00:02:24,320 not come from a beauty background. 61 00:02:25,040 --> 00:02:26,280 I've been working for Green People. 62 00:02:26,960 --> 00:02:29,200 Well, it's all right, we can be modest. 63 00:02:30,120 --> 00:02:32,880 So I've been there for about four years now and I have to say 64 00:02:32,880 --> 00:02:36,320 when I came into the beauty industry as a start, there was 65 00:02:36,320 --> 00:02:38,920 part of me that thought all beauty products are just going 66 00:02:38,920 --> 00:02:41,080 to be the same, they're just in a different bottle. 67 00:02:41,920 --> 00:02:44,080 And I'm happy to say I was actually wrong. 68 00:02:45,400 --> 00:02:48,320 And it's been really, really eye opening being there for those 69 00:02:48,320 --> 00:02:52,160 four years and actually seeing the amount of help it can give 70 00:02:52,160 --> 00:02:55,200 people. We've now got over 50,000 five 71 00:02:55,200 --> 00:02:57,600 star reviews, which is pretty cool. 72 00:02:58,360 --> 00:03:00,760 And actually when you meet the people face to face, which I 73 00:03:00,760 --> 00:03:03,640 also love doing, it's amazing to hear the stories. 74 00:03:03,640 --> 00:03:06,520 So the brand, honestly, I would say check it out. 75 00:03:06,520 --> 00:03:08,680 It's, it's a really, really great brand. 76 00:03:08,680 --> 00:03:11,320 And if anyone suffers from sensitive skin ECT, or anything 77 00:03:11,320 --> 00:03:14,640 else, we pretty much have a product F for everyone, right 78 00:03:14,640 --> 00:03:17,480 from a baby's range through to an antique ageing range. 79 00:03:18,160 --> 00:03:21,000 So my role at Green People, I'm head of digital there. 80 00:03:21,480 --> 00:03:25,440 So that means that I look after the e-commerce site, obviously 81 00:03:25,440 --> 00:03:27,800 the Shopify store, we're based out of it. 82 00:03:28,520 --> 00:03:32,000 Yeah, me too. Outside of that, I also oversee 83 00:03:32,000 --> 00:03:34,880 our marketing team. I obviously our creative team 84 00:03:35,120 --> 00:03:38,600 and I also have the joys of working with Amazon as a 85 00:03:38,680 --> 00:03:40,120 marketplace as well. God bless. 86 00:03:40,160 --> 00:03:43,680 Amazon here. Let's not go there today, but 87 00:03:43,680 --> 00:03:46,320 it's a great role because it covers a lot of different areas 88 00:03:46,320 --> 00:03:49,440 and we get to do a lot of really cool stuff in the business. 89 00:03:49,800 --> 00:03:51,360 Amazing, amazing. I'm going to pick up on 90 00:03:51,360 --> 00:03:53,600 something, I'm going to dive straight into the details here. 91 00:03:53,880 --> 00:03:56,160 Something that when we first spoke, we obviously had you talk 92 00:03:56,200 --> 00:03:58,680 at one of our meet ups in London recently as well back in 93 00:03:58,680 --> 00:04:01,480 September it would have been and something that struck me then 94 00:04:01,520 --> 00:04:03,680 you mentioned it when we spoke on the phone, on the website as 95 00:04:03,680 --> 00:04:06,320 well as people are at the heart of your business and the 96 00:04:06,320 --> 00:04:09,680 customers are those people. You could have gone into detail 97 00:04:09,680 --> 00:04:11,400 about the products and how they were developed and everything 98 00:04:11,400 --> 00:04:13,080 else, but actually you're talking about the use cases, 99 00:04:13,320 --> 00:04:15,000 which really speaks to what you know. 100 00:04:15,000 --> 00:04:18,680 Every sales mantra is always that the features tell and 101 00:04:18,680 --> 00:04:20,880 benefits sell and actually you guys are talking about that 102 00:04:20,880 --> 00:04:22,560 benefit and how it changes people's lives. 103 00:04:23,200 --> 00:04:25,240 How do you how do you tell those stories? 104 00:04:25,240 --> 00:04:27,200 Like on some of the ground level, how do you bring that 105 00:04:27,200 --> 00:04:29,200 through a web page, through an advert, through an e-mail 106 00:04:29,200 --> 00:04:30,840 campaign? How do you bring those stories 107 00:04:30,840 --> 00:04:33,320 across to encourage more people to want to get involved in in 108 00:04:33,320 --> 00:04:36,520 the business? It's a great question and also 109 00:04:36,600 --> 00:04:40,400 one that most brands in the beauty industry can't do. 110 00:04:40,760 --> 00:04:44,280 We're actually in quite a unique position where we have all of 111 00:04:44,280 --> 00:04:47,280 these testimonials and actually we've been guilty about not 112 00:04:47,280 --> 00:04:51,080 pushing them enough. Because actually, if you do take 113 00:04:51,080 --> 00:04:54,440 our products, you could start going into details of every 114 00:04:54,440 --> 00:04:57,760 single ingredient, for example, that's in there and exactly why 115 00:04:57,760 --> 00:05:01,320 we formulated it how we did. We could go into great amounts 116 00:05:01,320 --> 00:05:04,920 of detail and that's fine, but there's no empathy to that. 117 00:05:05,200 --> 00:05:07,840 That's not personal. And actually, when you're 118 00:05:07,840 --> 00:05:10,760 suffering from a skin condition, it's deeply personal. 119 00:05:11,800 --> 00:05:14,840 And actually we have been guilty before when we have ignored 120 00:05:14,840 --> 00:05:17,360 that. In recent years, we've really 121 00:05:17,360 --> 00:05:20,840 been trying to go back to that. I think we became a bit too 122 00:05:21,120 --> 00:05:24,200 formal and a bit too informative. 123 00:05:24,520 --> 00:05:27,440 And I think we've probably lost that personal side because 124 00:05:27,440 --> 00:05:29,640 actually as a brand, for example, if you meet our 125 00:05:29,640 --> 00:05:33,840 founder, huge personality, the team, great personalities and I 126 00:05:33,840 --> 00:05:36,520 think we lost that a bit. So one thing we have been trying 127 00:05:36,520 --> 00:05:39,280 to refocus in on is telling that customer story. 128 00:05:39,800 --> 00:05:43,320 In the age we're at now, we're finding videos an amazing way to 129 00:05:43,320 --> 00:05:47,360 do that, especially with Shopify now there there's some great 130 00:05:47,360 --> 00:05:50,480 apps for example out there that now mean you can do that on your 131 00:05:50,480 --> 00:05:52,640 store without having your web agent. 132 00:05:52,640 --> 00:05:55,640 She's she's shouting at you for going the page speed slowing 133 00:05:55,640 --> 00:05:58,040 down. So now we're actually able to 134 00:05:58,040 --> 00:06:00,680 deploy that. We have worked with a lot of 135 00:06:01,000 --> 00:06:04,240 ambassadors and customers over the last year to actually get in 136 00:06:04,240 --> 00:06:07,480 their stories by video because traditionally it was only in 137 00:06:07,480 --> 00:06:10,760 text reviews and we've got plenty of them and believe me, 138 00:06:10,760 --> 00:06:14,400 some of them are amazing, but it's just words. 139 00:06:14,920 --> 00:06:19,520 Video has so much power and also in today's world, people want to 140 00:06:19,520 --> 00:06:23,240 consume things differently. So I think the other trick for 141 00:06:23,400 --> 00:06:27,000 Shopify stores at the moment is how do you change your PDP 142 00:06:27,000 --> 00:06:29,920 pages, for example? So someone that wants to come in 143 00:06:30,240 --> 00:06:33,480 and read about the efficacy and the ingredients can do that. 144 00:06:33,880 --> 00:06:37,400 But you've also got one further 20 something who is used to 145 00:06:37,400 --> 00:06:40,000 getting information on the Tiktok or the Instagram. 146 00:06:40,400 --> 00:06:44,440 How do you actually do both? And also in still pictures, some 147 00:06:44,440 --> 00:06:46,120 people don't even want to play a video. 148 00:06:46,320 --> 00:06:48,880 How do you also put it there? And then how do you get them all 149 00:06:48,880 --> 00:06:51,360 to tie together so it doesn't feel like you're reading 150 00:06:51,360 --> 00:06:53,600 something And a video is a completely different format and 151 00:06:53,600 --> 00:06:55,000 taking you in a different direction. 152 00:06:55,440 --> 00:07:00,080 But I have to say, I am loving the direction of really going 153 00:07:00,080 --> 00:07:03,440 the route of UGC customer content, whatever you want to 154 00:07:03,440 --> 00:07:03,800 call it. And. 155 00:07:04,640 --> 00:07:06,840 Was it 50,000 reviews you said? Yes, yeah. 156 00:07:06,840 --> 00:07:09,120 I mean, incredible. I know we work a lot with lots 157 00:07:09,120 --> 00:07:11,200 of the review platforms, as you know, and it's it's very 158 00:07:11,200 --> 00:07:13,760 difficult to get beyond like the first 500 get into the first 159 00:07:13,760 --> 00:07:15,160 thousand. So incredible. 160 00:07:15,160 --> 00:07:17,960 And it speaks volumes about how loyal customers are and also the 161 00:07:17,960 --> 00:07:21,320 difference you're making, as you said immediately I want to talk 162 00:07:21,320 --> 00:07:23,680 about again, this was something you mentioned before and you 163 00:07:23,760 --> 00:07:25,840 kind of touched and hear about your customer base and you 164 00:07:25,840 --> 00:07:27,640 mentioned it's someone in their 20s, someone older. 165 00:07:27,880 --> 00:07:30,080 Video is consumed in different ways by different people on 166 00:07:30,080 --> 00:07:32,480 different platforms, different devices and also in different 167 00:07:32,480 --> 00:07:33,720 places. Like sometimes it's on a 168 00:07:33,720 --> 00:07:35,440 billboard, sometimes on a YouTube screen. 169 00:07:36,160 --> 00:07:38,240 I joked recently as well. My mum keeps saying when you 170 00:07:38,240 --> 00:07:41,960 gonna be on TV and more people watch our YouTube of this. 171 00:07:41,960 --> 00:07:44,160 A lot of you guys watching now on their televisions. 172 00:07:44,160 --> 00:07:46,440 So we're probably more on TV right now than we are anywhere 173 00:07:46,440 --> 00:07:48,440 else for video, which is absolutely amazing. 174 00:07:48,960 --> 00:07:51,920 But how do you, the question really is how do you, how do you 175 00:07:52,400 --> 00:07:56,480 both target and speak to and engage such a broad customer 176 00:07:56,480 --> 00:08:00,040 base from I assume your products for for kids as well, right the 177 00:08:00,040 --> 00:08:02,440 way up to the elderly? And how do you talk to that 178 00:08:02,440 --> 00:08:04,080 whole audience? Because we talk a lot about 179 00:08:04,080 --> 00:08:07,960 niching up or niche as they say in the East Coast, but we talk a 180 00:08:07,960 --> 00:08:09,160 lot about that and how powerful that is. 181 00:08:09,160 --> 00:08:10,480 And you're doing the opposite. You're doing it really 182 00:08:10,480 --> 00:08:12,480 effectively. So how do you do that? 183 00:08:12,760 --> 00:08:15,960 Well, we are and we aren't. So first of all it's really 184 00:08:15,960 --> 00:08:19,160 difficult. It does depend on the scale of 185 00:08:19,160 --> 00:08:21,240 the brand. We and the grand scale of things 186 00:08:21,240 --> 00:08:24,720 are a small fish in a very, very large beauty industry. 187 00:08:25,480 --> 00:08:30,560 So we're not able to work with multi, multi £1,000,000 budgets 188 00:08:30,560 --> 00:08:34,360 in every category that we have. That would change the business 189 00:08:34,480 --> 00:08:37,159 completely and I would argue probably in a worse way. 190 00:08:38,559 --> 00:08:43,000 We, because we are smaller and also we are in a niche because 191 00:08:43,000 --> 00:08:45,520 our products are very highly organic, they're natural 192 00:08:45,520 --> 00:08:48,360 products and they're made for a use case. 193 00:08:48,640 --> 00:08:51,200 We're never going to be a mass market brand and actually we 194 00:08:51,200 --> 00:08:53,200 don't want to be a mass market brand. 195 00:08:53,520 --> 00:08:56,920 We're very comfortable doing what we do and doing it really, 196 00:08:56,920 --> 00:08:59,960 really well. But going back to the ages and 197 00:08:59,960 --> 00:09:02,400 the different personas, because we've sat in many marketing 198 00:09:02,400 --> 00:09:05,880 meetings and you talk through who's your customer and you say, 199 00:09:05,880 --> 00:09:09,520 well, for which range and that is what's tricky. 200 00:09:10,120 --> 00:09:13,360 And of course there's data tools galore out there now where you 201 00:09:13,360 --> 00:09:16,880 can analyse your demographics, exactly who your customer is. 202 00:09:17,200 --> 00:09:21,440 And normally we end up with five or six different personas and 203 00:09:21,440 --> 00:09:22,760 that makes it really, really hard. 204 00:09:23,360 --> 00:09:27,960 But because we need to zone in, we have lots of ranges on 205 00:09:27,960 --> 00:09:31,920 e-commerce that are brilliant products, great ranges, but not 206 00:09:31,920 --> 00:09:35,760 our main focus day-to-day. We try and focus into the core 207 00:09:35,760 --> 00:09:38,480 of what we do. For us, that's our sun care 208 00:09:38,480 --> 00:09:40,800 range. Sun care is a massive product 209 00:09:40,800 --> 00:09:43,960 for us. Our skin care ranges as well are 210 00:09:43,960 --> 00:09:47,240 really, really popular, especially our fragrance free 211 00:09:47,240 --> 00:09:49,320 skin care. So we take out everything that 212 00:09:49,320 --> 00:09:51,640 doesn't need to be in there. All of the essential oils and 213 00:09:51,640 --> 00:09:54,800 things that people react to, they get stripped out and that 214 00:09:54,960 --> 00:09:57,560 does incredibly well. And alongside that, our hair 215 00:09:57,560 --> 00:09:59,200 care range is increasingly popular. 216 00:09:59,600 --> 00:10:03,360 Really outside of that, we don't give many marketing dollars to 217 00:10:03,520 --> 00:10:07,120 anything else, but they get their word of mouth. 218 00:10:07,920 --> 00:10:11,040 Also when people come on our site having those ancillary 219 00:10:11,080 --> 00:10:14,360 products that they can buy alongside our core ranges, it 220 00:10:14,360 --> 00:10:16,880 really helps us out. But actually going back to the 221 00:10:16,880 --> 00:10:19,560 original point, we've actually done the opposite in recent 222 00:10:19,560 --> 00:10:21,080 years. We were guilty of trying to do 223 00:10:21,080 --> 00:10:23,840 everything for everyone and actually it was getting very 224 00:10:23,840 --> 00:10:26,920 fragmented. So I think if you if you're on 225 00:10:26,920 --> 00:10:30,360 limited budgets, you do have to focus in and go, what is the 226 00:10:30,360 --> 00:10:31,920 core? Hey guys, I just want to take a 227 00:10:31,920 --> 00:10:34,120 moment aside from today's episode to introduce one of our 228 00:10:34,120 --> 00:10:36,600 amazing sponsors, Covella. They are the all in one platform 229 00:10:36,600 --> 00:10:39,400 that helps you design, sample and launch your product lines. 230 00:10:39,440 --> 00:10:43,600 Covella are helping Shopify brands save up to 40% on stock 231 00:10:43,600 --> 00:10:46,320 costs thanks to their smart, streamlined supply chain. 232 00:10:46,520 --> 00:10:50,080 That means more profit for you, less costs and loads of time 233 00:10:50,080 --> 00:10:53,040 saved in trying to get stock on your shelves. 234 00:10:53,200 --> 00:10:55,440 Right now. You can fast track their waiting 235 00:10:55,440 --> 00:10:59,680 list and get 50% of your first sample order just by using the 236 00:10:59,680 --> 00:11:02,880 code winning at checkout. This exclusive offer for winning 237 00:11:02,880 --> 00:11:05,480 with Shopify podcast listeners. Just go to the link in our 238 00:11:05,480 --> 00:11:08,040 description or in our bio to unlock the savings and skip the 239 00:11:08,040 --> 00:11:09,760 cube. We build your brand, save on 240 00:11:09,760 --> 00:11:12,320 stock and step into the future of e-commerce with Covella. 241 00:11:12,520 --> 00:11:16,120 That code again, winning back to the episode and we I mean as a 242 00:11:16,120 --> 00:11:18,360 people it would be CSEO agency. We, we'd pitch you somebody at 243 00:11:18,360 --> 00:11:21,120 the moment who's office furniture and they got 48,000 244 00:11:21,120 --> 00:11:24,160 SKUs and they're like what's the lowest budget we can start with 245 00:11:24,160 --> 00:11:26,280 and we're like there's a complete oxymoron going on here 246 00:11:26,280 --> 00:11:29,880 of like you've got 10s of thousands of products with SKUs 247 00:11:29,880 --> 00:11:32,680 and then they come in different sizes you get a discount if you 248 00:11:32,680 --> 00:11:36,120 buy more than one like this this is kind of oxymoron but we want 249 00:11:36,120 --> 00:11:38,280 to start as low as possible so we've done exactly that and gone 250 00:11:38,560 --> 00:11:41,480 we we're going to hedge our bets on these three ranges. 251 00:11:41,520 --> 00:11:43,960 We only need one to work well to start moving budget into that 252 00:11:43,960 --> 00:11:46,160 and move forward and then we can start testing other things. 253 00:11:46,160 --> 00:11:48,520 But I love what you say about the core products bringing 254 00:11:48,520 --> 00:11:50,280 people in. And then actually you've got all 255 00:11:50,280 --> 00:11:52,600 these other products in there, the bigger, wider range. 256 00:11:52,600 --> 00:11:55,800 So people start adding those things in because we find it so 257 00:11:55,800 --> 00:11:58,240 often that like a brand has maybe 3 products and you're 258 00:11:58,240 --> 00:12:00,280 about to buy 1, so it tries to shove the other two down your 259 00:12:00,280 --> 00:12:01,960 throat. It's very different to have a, 260 00:12:02,240 --> 00:12:04,840 if you're buying this, then why don't you browse some other 261 00:12:04,840 --> 00:12:06,400 ranges because it's quite a big range here. 262 00:12:06,400 --> 00:12:08,880 But we're going to solve that eczema problem that you've come 263 00:12:08,880 --> 00:12:10,760 in for initially or whatever the first question is. 264 00:12:10,760 --> 00:12:15,280 So how do you guys do that with Shopify using like there's some 265 00:12:15,280 --> 00:12:18,480 sort of AI to promote products or again, you mentioned apps and 266 00:12:18,480 --> 00:12:21,840 page speed, like man of my own heart that's I'm preaching that 267 00:12:21,840 --> 00:12:24,400 every week. Oh God, it gets mentioned every 268 00:12:24,400 --> 00:12:27,640 day. The honest answer is I think 269 00:12:27,640 --> 00:12:29,560 that side of things is really evolving. 270 00:12:30,240 --> 00:12:33,920 So I, I feel that that side of Shopify tech is going to move 271 00:12:33,920 --> 00:12:37,400 forward massively in the next one to two years we're 272 00:12:37,400 --> 00:12:39,440 releasing. Updates and AII do a Tuesday tea 273 00:12:39,440 --> 00:12:42,400 break talks and every week there's new AI updates to 274 00:12:42,400 --> 00:12:44,200 sidekick and stuff that's going on so yeah it's. 275 00:12:44,200 --> 00:12:46,360 Absolutely crazy. And we're starting to see demos 276 00:12:46,360 --> 00:12:49,920 now with tech that we're like, OK, this could be game changing, 277 00:12:50,360 --> 00:12:51,760 but I don't think it's quite there yet. 278 00:12:52,120 --> 00:12:54,640 There is personalisation and AI is everywhere. 279 00:12:54,640 --> 00:12:58,160 We've been using AI in reality for like 10 plus years, just in 280 00:12:58,160 --> 00:13:01,400 different forms. Yeah, but from a personalisation 281 00:13:01,520 --> 00:13:03,120 point of view, how do we do that? 282 00:13:04,560 --> 00:13:06,680 It's it's again at the moment it's great difficulty. 283 00:13:06,680 --> 00:13:10,120 I'm sure within say 12 to 24 months, we would love for 284 00:13:10,120 --> 00:13:14,480 example, for anyone dropping onto the website to actually 285 00:13:14,480 --> 00:13:17,280 straight away be saying to them what is your skin goal? 286 00:13:17,920 --> 00:13:20,560 Because then it's not about selling more products, it's 287 00:13:20,560 --> 00:13:22,600 actually about us going. You don't need to see these 288 00:13:22,600 --> 00:13:24,720 things because actually that wouldn't be right for you. 289 00:13:24,960 --> 00:13:27,200 To simplify things, we've taken 150 the. 290 00:13:27,200 --> 00:13:28,680 Opposite of recommendations exactly. 291 00:13:28,680 --> 00:13:31,120 Don't look at any of that. Yeah, and I wish we could do 292 00:13:31,120 --> 00:13:32,200 that. And the problem we have at the 293 00:13:32,200 --> 00:13:35,920 moment is until we have that first party data, we're not able 294 00:13:35,920 --> 00:13:38,760 to do that. And also we're in a days a world 295 00:13:38,760 --> 00:13:41,400 where a lot of people don't trust people gathering data. 296 00:13:41,400 --> 00:13:43,240 And I understand that because there's been some horrific 297 00:13:43,240 --> 00:13:47,040 stories that have come out, but from genuine companies actually 298 00:13:47,040 --> 00:13:50,480 it really can benefit the experience because I would have 299 00:13:50,480 --> 00:13:54,200 thought within 24 months when you go to a website like ours, 300 00:13:54,440 --> 00:13:56,360 it's going to ping a question straight to you. 301 00:13:56,360 --> 00:13:59,040 Even though I hate pop ups, I absolutely despise them. 302 00:13:59,320 --> 00:14:01,280 I think on this circle circumstance I would allow it 303 00:14:02,360 --> 00:14:05,000 because actually then we could tell you the whole website based 304 00:14:05,000 --> 00:14:06,560 on that. Absolutely. 305 00:14:06,560 --> 00:14:09,920 And we, we certainly we've seen like the questions or even 306 00:14:09,920 --> 00:14:13,000 turning AE commerce site into a search engine be really 307 00:14:13,000 --> 00:14:15,000 effective. We actually had three clients in 308 00:14:15,000 --> 00:14:17,440 the same year, but it's probably about two or three years ago now 309 00:14:17,720 --> 00:14:20,040 three clients in the same year try and convert like the header 310 00:14:20,040 --> 00:14:22,560 of their page and certainly the home page into a search engine. 311 00:14:23,040 --> 00:14:26,320 And of the three, the only one that worked was a pet solution 312 00:14:26,320 --> 00:14:28,760 for pharmaceuticals. So you there was only one 313 00:14:28,760 --> 00:14:31,160 product you could buy. And the question was, do you 314 00:14:31,160 --> 00:14:33,120 want one pack, 3 packs or five packs kind of thing? 315 00:14:33,120 --> 00:14:35,640 It's just the quantity. But because you only want that 316 00:14:35,640 --> 00:14:38,640 one niche prescription for that for your pet that had come from 317 00:14:38,640 --> 00:14:41,560 a vet, then the only way to get that was to go to that exact 318 00:14:41,560 --> 00:14:42,920 products. The search engine made sense of 319 00:14:42,920 --> 00:14:45,360 like just just punch in here what you want and our search 320 00:14:45,360 --> 00:14:47,000 functionality, even if you put typos in. 321 00:14:47,000 --> 00:14:49,640 So the words are really long and complicated typos. 322 00:14:50,040 --> 00:14:52,040 Put it in and we'll get you, we'll draw you down to that 323 00:14:52,040 --> 00:14:53,680 product and then you upload the prescription. 324 00:14:53,680 --> 00:14:55,720 Even if it's wrong, we'll send you the right one and give you a 325 00:14:55,720 --> 00:14:58,400 refund or charge an extra. So they, they just nailed that 326 00:14:58,400 --> 00:15:00,640 service for it. But I love that idea. 327 00:15:00,640 --> 00:15:03,040 I agree with you on pop up. So I went on a, one of our 328 00:15:03,040 --> 00:15:04,840 listeners on the, on the site, I won't mention you by name, so 329 00:15:04,840 --> 00:15:07,760 I'm going to call you out here. But one of our listeners to the 330 00:15:07,760 --> 00:15:10,160 podcast reached out and I went on their site, had to like spin 331 00:15:10,160 --> 00:15:12,440 the wheel for like a magical discount. 332 00:15:12,640 --> 00:15:14,800 So I got that just to see like, you know, what would happen. 333 00:15:14,920 --> 00:15:17,120 So click that and the wheels span and we got a little 10% off 334 00:15:17,120 --> 00:15:18,920 or something. Then the newsletter pop up came 335 00:15:18,920 --> 00:15:22,200 up, then live chat came up and then I opened up the side cart 336 00:15:22,200 --> 00:15:25,720 and I couldn't check out because the live chat was in the way. 337 00:15:25,720 --> 00:15:28,200 And it was like they're just layer up and layer up and it was 338 00:15:28,200 --> 00:15:29,760 like, I haven't even looked at a product yet. 339 00:15:30,200 --> 00:15:32,720 I landed on the site, added to cart and bang, it was like, and 340 00:15:32,720 --> 00:15:34,560 I didn't have a chance to browse or do any of the other stuff. 341 00:15:34,560 --> 00:15:37,800 So I hear you on pop ups. I think one of the things I 342 00:15:37,800 --> 00:15:40,560 think stores don't do enough and it's where having a third party 343 00:15:40,560 --> 00:15:42,960 like us or someone in the business just having like a 344 00:15:42,960 --> 00:15:45,600 spare laptop that's not logged in anywhere and it's on its own 345 00:15:45,600 --> 00:15:48,280 3G connection. Just use the site as a customer 346 00:15:48,280 --> 00:15:51,120 and go. What is my actual experience And 347 00:15:51,120 --> 00:15:52,880 I think the other thing as well, and it'd be good to find out 348 00:15:52,920 --> 00:15:56,400 your thoughts on this is we find that if we've done SEO well, 349 00:15:56,400 --> 00:15:58,840 your collections come up well. If we're doing PPC well, your 350 00:15:59,040 --> 00:16:01,120 products come up well, which means those are your landing 351 00:16:01,120 --> 00:16:03,320 pages. And brands always spend so long 352 00:16:03,320 --> 00:16:05,360 on their homepage when actually when you look at the data, it's 353 00:16:05,360 --> 00:16:07,440 like most people don't land on the homepage. 354 00:16:07,440 --> 00:16:10,840 They hit it later between products or between searches or 355 00:16:10,840 --> 00:16:12,840 between things. So the interesting to find out 356 00:16:12,840 --> 00:16:15,880 from you kind of how you guys tackle that, that user journey 357 00:16:15,880 --> 00:16:17,240 process, where do you start looking? 358 00:16:17,240 --> 00:16:20,160 What data is really key to you? Yeah, I think it's really 359 00:16:20,160 --> 00:16:22,440 changing. So sure, the traditional route a 360 00:16:22,440 --> 00:16:25,400 couple of years ago was your homepage needs to be heavily 361 00:16:25,400 --> 00:16:29,040 optimised, then they'll go into a category, then they'll go into 362 00:16:29,040 --> 00:16:31,560 a product, then they'll go into your car, Jack out and buy. 363 00:16:32,080 --> 00:16:34,400 And it's we're seeing a massive change there. 364 00:16:34,800 --> 00:16:39,080 So we're very lucky as a business where Geo or LLMS, 365 00:16:39,280 --> 00:16:41,440 they're now starting. AI, if anyone's not heard of 366 00:16:41,440 --> 00:16:42,600 that. Yeah, sorry, lots of 367 00:16:42,640 --> 00:16:45,960 abbreviation. But that for us now is playing a 368 00:16:45,960 --> 00:16:48,920 bigger and bigger part. We've got a huge amount of 369 00:16:48,920 --> 00:16:51,760 content on our website. Our blog plays a very large 370 00:16:51,760 --> 00:16:53,520 part. We've got well over 400 blog 371 00:16:53,520 --> 00:16:58,240 posts which have been written by a person over many years and is 372 00:16:58,240 --> 00:17:02,760 now serving us very, very well. And with that, what we're also 373 00:17:02,760 --> 00:17:06,839 finding from the AI tools is we're having to actually now 374 00:17:06,839 --> 00:17:10,000 adjust what our other pages look like because instead of having 375 00:17:10,000 --> 00:17:14,240 to go from home page to category to product, we're finding the 376 00:17:14,240 --> 00:17:17,760 majority now are coming in on product, not just from AI tools, 377 00:17:17,760 --> 00:17:20,280 but from Google as well. So actually one of the projects 378 00:17:20,280 --> 00:17:24,440 we've been doing is going OK in this world now what do we need 379 00:17:24,440 --> 00:17:26,839 to change on product pages? And this is horrible because we 380 00:17:26,839 --> 00:17:28,600 only launched our new site two years ago. 381 00:17:28,640 --> 00:17:32,480 So we wrote, rewrote everything. So you try breaking that to your 382 00:17:32,480 --> 00:17:35,080 team and go, actually guys, should we rewrite it all again? 383 00:17:35,080 --> 00:17:36,880 That'll be fine. We've dropped some bombs before, 384 00:17:36,880 --> 00:17:39,880 like on that so. That didn't go down very well, 385 00:17:40,200 --> 00:17:43,640 but in reality, everything now needs to be a lot more 386 00:17:43,640 --> 00:17:47,920 conversational, so the tone needs to be on there. 387 00:17:47,920 --> 00:17:52,000 FAQ is becoming so important on product pages now because that 388 00:17:52,000 --> 00:17:55,240 can feed the LLMS if you write them hand in hand. 389 00:17:55,600 --> 00:17:57,720 And actually, do you know what? Long term, I think it's a 390 00:17:57,720 --> 00:18:00,560 benefit because there's fewer steps in the customer journey. 391 00:18:01,000 --> 00:18:02,280 They're going to get less confused. 392 00:18:02,280 --> 00:18:04,280 And categories are great, but actually, if you've got 10 393 00:18:04,280 --> 00:18:07,200 products in there, they've got 10 products to choose from where 394 00:18:07,200 --> 00:18:10,160 actually if they found your product through research or 395 00:18:10,160 --> 00:18:12,960 through AI tools, they're most likely on the right product 396 00:18:12,960 --> 00:18:14,920 already. Now, sure, make it easy if 397 00:18:14,920 --> 00:18:17,480 they're find out they're not to go somewhere else, but actually, 398 00:18:17,480 --> 00:18:19,440 if they're in the right place, don't take them somewhere else. 399 00:18:20,040 --> 00:18:22,320 Keep them on that page. So if they've got questions, 400 00:18:22,320 --> 00:18:23,800 serve them up with those questions. 401 00:18:23,800 --> 00:18:27,520 But we're seeing some other brands do some amazing things on 402 00:18:27,520 --> 00:18:30,280 PDPS. So yeah, that's definitely going 403 00:18:30,280 --> 00:18:32,720 to evolve the next 12 months. I think one thing that's really 404 00:18:32,720 --> 00:18:35,200 interesting with AI though is it does a lot of that site browsing 405 00:18:35,200 --> 00:18:37,880 for you, doesn't it? You give it your criteria and it 406 00:18:37,880 --> 00:18:40,560 goes, OK, there's 8 products, but actually six of them I'm 407 00:18:40,560 --> 00:18:42,840 going to knock off already there's between these two and 408 00:18:42,840 --> 00:18:44,200 this one's probably the preference. 409 00:18:44,560 --> 00:18:46,160 So I'll say that back. And it's, it's like it's 410 00:18:46,160 --> 00:18:48,640 actually knocked out that as you say, yes, it used to be like 411 00:18:48,640 --> 00:18:50,720 home collection, product collection product collection 412 00:18:50,720 --> 00:18:51,880 product. It just kind of keep clicking 413 00:18:52,200 --> 00:18:54,200 around, whereas now it, it drives you straight into the 414 00:18:54,200 --> 00:18:56,000 product. What I love though, like, like 415 00:18:56,000 --> 00:18:58,320 you were sort of saying is nothing's at, when you look at 416 00:18:58,320 --> 00:19:01,720 like an SEO point of view, yes, it's ChatGPT now instead of 417 00:19:01,720 --> 00:19:04,160 Google or Bing, but nothing's really changed. 418 00:19:04,160 --> 00:19:07,720 It's still we want the best product or website coming up #1 419 00:19:07,720 --> 00:19:10,120 for the specific thing they're looking for, which I think is a 420 00:19:10,120 --> 00:19:13,880 really, really important point. It's something we found that AI 421 00:19:13,880 --> 00:19:17,200 is starting to help with. And I think there's going to be 422 00:19:17,200 --> 00:19:19,320 a duplicate content issue down the line and SEO for this. 423 00:19:19,560 --> 00:19:22,560 Having multiple versions of PDPS is where. 424 00:19:22,560 --> 00:19:25,040 And the PDP is a product page. They're trying to remember that. 425 00:19:25,040 --> 00:19:27,320 Lots of people are like, I might start a shop and watch this as 426 00:19:27,360 --> 00:19:28,960 much as we've been working in this for decades. 427 00:19:29,200 --> 00:19:31,440 But I think one of the things that's going to change with PDPS 428 00:19:31,440 --> 00:19:34,880 a lot is really good brands have so many US. 429 00:19:34,880 --> 00:19:37,680 PS Which one do you push and where do you put them on the 430 00:19:37,680 --> 00:19:39,560 page? Which is where actually AI or 431 00:19:39,560 --> 00:19:42,960 personalized pages. So if ChatGPT can send in 432 00:19:42,960 --> 00:19:45,400 somebody to the same PDP or you've got 10 versions of it, 433 00:19:45,400 --> 00:19:47,400 Like I said, we're going to some duplicate concept problems in 434 00:19:47,440 --> 00:19:48,800 SEO. But if you've got multiple 435 00:19:48,800 --> 00:19:52,280 versions of it, ChatGPT or the AI bots, they are able to pull 436 00:19:52,280 --> 00:19:54,640 out the piece of content that's relevant to that user in that 437 00:19:54,640 --> 00:19:57,920 space for the thing they want. They some will buy on warranty, 438 00:19:57,920 --> 00:20:00,040 some will buy on price, some will buy on the output, some 439 00:20:00,040 --> 00:20:03,240 will buy on the reviews, some will buy on the size of the pot 440 00:20:03,240 --> 00:20:05,480 because they've only got a small shelf in their bathroom and 441 00:20:05,480 --> 00:20:08,160 there's only so much space. Actually, if it came in A50 mil 442 00:20:08,160 --> 00:20:11,440 instead of 200 mil, that's actually good for us because. 443 00:20:11,960 --> 00:20:13,320 I'll just keep buying the 50 mils. 444 00:20:13,480 --> 00:20:17,480 There's all these random things and you as a marketeer, you and 445 00:20:17,480 --> 00:20:19,800 I have this problem of which one do we put at the top? 446 00:20:19,800 --> 00:20:23,000 When you see the product image and the price, what comes next? 447 00:20:23,160 --> 00:20:24,240 You know, what's the first thing to push? 448 00:20:24,240 --> 00:20:26,920 So you guys must have the same thing where there's so many USPS 449 00:20:26,920 --> 00:20:28,320 and it's like we pushed that one. 450 00:20:28,320 --> 00:20:31,280 ROI is higher, but the target groups just totally changed. 451 00:20:31,560 --> 00:20:33,880 We need to be careful here. Yeah, it's a massive headache 452 00:20:33,880 --> 00:20:38,840 because we, I think we have even more USPS per product than most 453 00:20:38,840 --> 00:20:40,720 because there's so many ingredients, for example. 454 00:20:40,720 --> 00:20:43,880 So we could focus easily on ten ingredients on one product. 455 00:20:44,080 --> 00:20:47,240 OK, but which one comes first? And you could argue, well, for 456 00:20:47,240 --> 00:20:49,360 that skin condition, it would be this one for that. 457 00:20:49,360 --> 00:20:53,240 It would be that and everything from certifications, what's most 458 00:20:53,240 --> 00:20:56,080 important is it being organically certified? 459 00:20:56,080 --> 00:20:57,760 Is it that we're vegan certified? 460 00:20:57,760 --> 00:21:00,320 Is it cruelty free? Is it that we're gluten free? 461 00:21:00,320 --> 00:21:01,680 Oh, actually, by the way, we're outgoing the. 462 00:21:01,680 --> 00:21:04,280 Whole mobile screen with just those yeah. 463 00:21:04,360 --> 00:21:06,520 And the one that's important, people now don't pick out 464 00:21:06,520 --> 00:21:07,960 because there's too many. It's like, yeah, so. 465 00:21:07,960 --> 00:21:12,440 We try to be led by the data as much as possible because 466 00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:17,080 actually the more we do that, we're finding it's really 467 00:21:17,080 --> 00:21:19,960 helpful because also especially when you've got so many people 468 00:21:19,960 --> 00:21:23,600 internally who know, for example, the founder how she's 469 00:21:23,600 --> 00:21:26,120 formulated the product now that's great. 470 00:21:26,320 --> 00:21:29,920 And what she formulated it for, it works incredibly well for. 471 00:21:30,120 --> 00:21:32,760 But actually what are the customers saying about our 472 00:21:32,760 --> 00:21:35,400 products? So we do a lot of review mining 473 00:21:35,480 --> 00:21:37,080 for example. And when we have got the reviews 474 00:21:37,080 --> 00:21:40,480 we've got that becomes actually very, very useful and only 475 00:21:40,480 --> 00:21:42,080 you've probably. Got enough to see trends as 476 00:21:42,080 --> 00:21:43,880 well, which a lot of brands do. Absolutely, absolutely. 477 00:21:43,880 --> 00:21:45,880 And it's fascinating because there's things that have come 478 00:21:45,880 --> 00:21:49,880 out and those reviews that we never bring into our PDP pages 479 00:21:50,120 --> 00:21:52,800 because actually that's our customers being our biggest 480 00:21:52,800 --> 00:21:56,240 fans, saying lovely things, sometimes the odd negative 481 00:21:56,240 --> 00:21:57,760 thing, but mainly possibly you can. 482 00:21:57,760 --> 00:21:59,440 Deal with that though, better that you know. 483 00:21:59,520 --> 00:22:02,360 Exactly, 100%. But actually we've had some 484 00:22:02,400 --> 00:22:05,560 lovely surprises in there where actually when we've seen certain 485 00:22:05,560 --> 00:22:07,840 things, we've got, well, hang on, it's not formulated for that 486 00:22:08,000 --> 00:22:11,320 and you have to go, gosh, you know, they're complimenting you, 487 00:22:11,320 --> 00:22:11,760 right? Yeah, Yeah. 488 00:22:12,000 --> 00:22:13,920 So actually they've said you've done a great job. 489 00:22:14,800 --> 00:22:17,800 So we find that lubricating. The engine of my car and it's 490 00:22:17,800 --> 00:22:20,960 like, no, it's for faces. Exactly, but also post purchase 491 00:22:20,960 --> 00:22:23,040 surveys. We found great for this because 492 00:22:23,320 --> 00:22:27,200 you can now tailor your post purchase surveys based around 493 00:22:27,200 --> 00:22:28,560 say what range of product they bought. 494 00:22:28,560 --> 00:22:30,200 For example, are they a new customer? 495 00:22:30,200 --> 00:22:34,520 Are they an existing customer? And we found, again, not just 496 00:22:34,520 --> 00:22:36,640 being data LED, because that is a dangerous game. 497 00:22:36,640 --> 00:22:38,360 You do have to have a balance in the middle. 498 00:22:38,560 --> 00:22:42,320 But if you're not being at least led by data, I think you're 499 00:22:42,320 --> 00:22:44,640 going to struggle to get it right because then you'll just 500 00:22:44,640 --> 00:22:47,440 create something in your own perception that's correct and 501 00:22:47,440 --> 00:22:50,200 not necessarily what your customer actually wants to see 502 00:22:50,440 --> 00:22:52,320 and not necessarily what they're actually going to buy. 503 00:22:52,800 --> 00:22:55,760 Agreed agreed I mean we could do like 20 episodes on what you 504 00:22:55,760 --> 00:22:57,600 just said yeah this so means to fell out. 505 00:22:57,880 --> 00:22:59,640 I want to touch on one 'cause it made me laugh. 506 00:22:59,640 --> 00:23:03,840 Was the post purchase survey. Yeah, I, I'm a very devil's 507 00:23:03,840 --> 00:23:06,280 advocate in my personality. So whenever I see a post 508 00:23:06,280 --> 00:23:08,640 purchase survey on a website and it binds and I'll be buying a 509 00:23:08,640 --> 00:23:10,200 lot over the next few weeks, it's Black Friday. 510 00:23:11,000 --> 00:23:13,160 But whenever I see one and it says how did you find this? 511 00:23:13,160 --> 00:23:15,320 I'm like, someone doesn't know how to use GA4. 512 00:23:15,320 --> 00:23:17,600 And it's like whenever I see that I'm like, that's the one 513 00:23:17,600 --> 00:23:20,080 question I think you don't like. There's very little data 514 00:23:20,080 --> 00:23:22,360 available as to why someone bought stuff. 515 00:23:22,640 --> 00:23:24,720 That's what you need to be asking, not how did you get 516 00:23:24,720 --> 00:23:26,600 here? Because you know, that or we can 517 00:23:26,600 --> 00:23:30,240 get 78% attribution even with all the cookie policies ticked, 518 00:23:30,520 --> 00:23:33,240 you know, to the hills and back and the EU is happy and all this 519 00:23:33,240 --> 00:23:35,440 sort of the post purchase surveys. 520 00:23:35,640 --> 00:23:37,200 There are so many more questions, as you say, about 521 00:23:37,200 --> 00:23:40,000 personalizing them. Such a smarter way of doing it, 522 00:23:40,000 --> 00:23:42,080 saying like, did you buy this because A, you have a skin 523 00:23:42,080 --> 00:23:43,520 condition B, you've been told to buy it. 524 00:23:43,520 --> 00:23:47,120 C, your GP told you to come in. That information is absolutely 525 00:23:47,120 --> 00:23:49,840 crucial because we know they did a Google search or we know 526 00:23:49,840 --> 00:23:51,280 they've come for a TikTok ad or whatever. 527 00:23:51,560 --> 00:23:53,960 But what kind of data do you get from that that you're like 528 00:23:53,960 --> 00:23:57,840 actually this was an unforeseeable outcome that 529 00:23:57,840 --> 00:23:59,200 actually we're going to change something we're doing now? 530 00:23:59,200 --> 00:24:00,640 Are there any examples that are top to mind or? 531 00:24:00,800 --> 00:24:02,120 Sure. It's 1 great one we've got at 532 00:24:02,120 --> 00:24:05,080 the moment where we're a natural and organic brand. 533 00:24:05,760 --> 00:24:08,400 So what does natural and organic mean to you? 534 00:24:09,480 --> 00:24:12,240 Because we use that term all the time And whenever we've done 535 00:24:12,240 --> 00:24:16,200 previous surveys, we would ask a similar question, why would you 536 00:24:16,200 --> 00:24:18,280 shop with us? And naturally we are a natural 537 00:24:18,280 --> 00:24:20,320 and organic brand. So it's not going to be a shock 538 00:24:20,320 --> 00:24:21,680 that that comes right at the top. 539 00:24:22,040 --> 00:24:24,760 But what are they trying to achieve with natural and 540 00:24:24,760 --> 00:24:26,360 organic? Are they doing it for the 541 00:24:26,360 --> 00:24:28,520 environment? And sure, it ticks that box. 542 00:24:28,520 --> 00:24:31,080 Are they doing it because they've learnt that's better for 543 00:24:31,080 --> 00:24:33,560 their skin? And there's numerous other 544 00:24:33,560 --> 00:24:35,240 reasons. And that's been really 545 00:24:35,240 --> 00:24:38,920 interesting because actually you can take a very broad phrase 546 00:24:38,920 --> 00:24:41,080 that of course we have to advertise for because we do 547 00:24:41,080 --> 00:24:42,680 that. But actually getting under the 548 00:24:42,680 --> 00:24:45,280 skin of what that means to different people, that is 549 00:24:45,280 --> 00:24:48,080 really, really interesting. Yeah, fascinating. 550 00:24:48,080 --> 00:24:50,600 And I mean something we read the other day was like, I think 551 00:24:50,760 --> 00:24:53,520 we've got a 7 month old girl at home when he's going to pick up 552 00:24:53,520 --> 00:24:57,240 after we've recorded this reminds me, but she needed 553 00:24:57,240 --> 00:24:58,920 something. And we saw that the word organic 554 00:24:58,920 --> 00:25:01,640 off the back of a product. And I sort of said to my wife, I 555 00:25:01,640 --> 00:25:02,600 was like, hey, my wife's a doctor. 556 00:25:02,600 --> 00:25:03,720 So I was like, what does that mean to you? 557 00:25:03,720 --> 00:25:05,800 And she goes, it means it's made like this and gave me this 558 00:25:05,800 --> 00:25:08,480 massive medical list of like to say that in a medical. 559 00:25:08,480 --> 00:25:10,840 And I was like, what, because I had no idea. 560 00:25:10,840 --> 00:25:11,720 She's like, what does it mean to you? 561 00:25:11,720 --> 00:25:14,520 And I was like, better, you know, being really, really just 562 00:25:14,520 --> 00:25:16,680 crude about it. I was like, better organic 563 00:25:16,680 --> 00:25:19,680 sounds like it's made from natural plants rather than 564 00:25:19,920 --> 00:25:21,760 chemicals. And she goes, no, it's from 565 00:25:21,760 --> 00:25:23,840 organic chemicals. And I was like, what does that 566 00:25:23,840 --> 00:25:24,960 mean? And she was like, but This is 567 00:25:24,960 --> 00:25:26,840 why they don't go into detail as people like you wouldn't 568 00:25:26,840 --> 00:25:29,120 understand, but she obviously this doctor understands the 569 00:25:29,120 --> 00:25:31,560 medical trials and things. So I think the definition of 570 00:25:31,560 --> 00:25:33,760 stuff is, is fascinating. And that's where that 571 00:25:33,760 --> 00:25:35,320 communication with customers where you need to do the 572 00:25:35,320 --> 00:25:38,080 qualitative stuff because you've got the data on where they went, 573 00:25:38,080 --> 00:25:40,360 what they did, you know, use your hot jar clarity, how people 574 00:25:40,360 --> 00:25:43,120 used your website and see when they every time someone lands on 575 00:25:43,120 --> 00:25:45,600 that's your most viewed products, but 90% of people that 576 00:25:45,600 --> 00:25:48,040 land on it jump back and go on another product or we should 577 00:25:48,040 --> 00:25:49,240 stop selling it or get rid of it. 578 00:25:49,560 --> 00:25:51,280 That's the that's the quantitative data, but the 579 00:25:51,280 --> 00:25:54,120 qualitative stuff. Do you guys run lots of feedback 580 00:25:54,120 --> 00:25:55,800 surveys? Is it mostly the review content 581 00:25:55,800 --> 00:25:57,560 you farm? Do you have a really good 582 00:25:57,560 --> 00:25:59,680 connection as the marketing head of marketing? 583 00:25:59,680 --> 00:26:02,240 Do you connect really well with the customer service team to see 584 00:26:02,240 --> 00:26:05,200 what's being said on the phones over emails, that kind of thing? 585 00:26:05,200 --> 00:26:06,560 Like how do you tie all of that together? 586 00:26:07,200 --> 00:26:09,680 Again, the team of our size, it's a real challenge. 587 00:26:10,400 --> 00:26:14,240 And are we perfect? No, but are we trying to do it 588 00:26:14,240 --> 00:26:16,280 in a much more jointed way? Absolutely. 589 00:26:17,440 --> 00:26:21,720 I, I think there was a thinking about probably five years ago. 590 00:26:22,000 --> 00:26:23,720 I've been in E Comm for too long now. 591 00:26:24,600 --> 00:26:28,040 The, you had separate teams, the marketing was one team and you 592 00:26:28,040 --> 00:26:31,600 had e-commerce team and you had your customer care team and 593 00:26:31,600 --> 00:26:33,120 they, they all do their own thing. 594 00:26:33,680 --> 00:26:36,760 And it created so many companies and I speak to lots of brands 595 00:26:36,760 --> 00:26:39,880 who have exactly this, where each department is doing really, 596 00:26:39,880 --> 00:26:41,600 really well. But actually are they all 597 00:26:41,600 --> 00:26:43,480 talking to each other? Not really. 598 00:26:44,920 --> 00:26:49,600 And now also with the technology we use, for example, chat on our 599 00:26:49,600 --> 00:26:53,560 site, we're also hopefully going to be bringing in NPS scores and 600 00:26:53,560 --> 00:26:54,960 things like that soon on the site. 601 00:26:55,360 --> 00:26:58,480 And all of those are being brought in to make a better 602 00:26:58,480 --> 00:27:01,880 customer experience because why they all need to be tied 603 00:27:01,880 --> 00:27:05,120 together is so key. Because in e-commerce, we all 604 00:27:05,120 --> 00:27:09,200 spend far too much with Google, Meta and all the people we don't 605 00:27:09,200 --> 00:27:10,640 want to give money to. But we have to. 606 00:27:10,960 --> 00:27:12,680 And that's fine. That's life. 607 00:27:12,960 --> 00:27:16,880 But at the same time, would a lot of brands, including 608 00:27:16,880 --> 00:27:19,720 ourselves at the time, have been not good enough at retaining 609 00:27:19,760 --> 00:27:22,800 those customers? And the ultimate focus needs to 610 00:27:22,800 --> 00:27:26,600 be on that because then you can spend less dollars or you can 611 00:27:26,600 --> 00:27:29,280 just have more customers, but only if you look up we can. 612 00:27:29,320 --> 00:27:30,800 Spend more because you know you're gonna get the lifetime 613 00:27:30,800 --> 00:27:32,760 value on them, which is, yeah, a powerful place to be. 614 00:27:32,840 --> 00:27:36,960 So we're some of the one of the focuses for 2026 for us will be 615 00:27:37,360 --> 00:27:39,200 increasing that customer experience even more. 616 00:27:39,200 --> 00:27:40,720 We know we've got amazing products. 617 00:27:40,760 --> 00:27:43,080 Our reviews, I know I keep banging on about them, but for 618 00:27:43,080 --> 00:27:44,800 us it's really key. They're there. 619 00:27:44,880 --> 00:27:48,520 Our product genuinely works and in general, our customers are 620 00:27:48,520 --> 00:27:51,160 really happy. But can we do more things to go 621 00:27:51,160 --> 00:27:52,480 the extra mile? Of course we can. 622 00:27:52,480 --> 00:27:56,920 Every brand can, but you also need the tools to deliver that. 623 00:27:57,200 --> 00:27:59,520 And that's where I think technology can be used across 624 00:27:59,520 --> 00:28:01,760 the teams to kind of join a lot of the dots. 625 00:28:02,280 --> 00:28:04,760 And I think just internal communication also is massively 626 00:28:04,760 --> 00:28:06,200 key. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. 627 00:28:06,200 --> 00:28:09,240 And we, we actually learned from, we, we work half in B to B 628 00:28:09,280 --> 00:28:11,560 and half in e-commerce and all the sort of stuff we talk about 629 00:28:11,560 --> 00:28:13,480 on the show. But from the B to B world, the 630 00:28:13,480 --> 00:28:15,320 biggest thing we've learned is actually saying to the sales 631 00:28:15,320 --> 00:28:18,280 team every, especially if they only sign like two or three new 632 00:28:18,280 --> 00:28:21,960 deals a month, like super high value, super low volume, they're 633 00:28:21,960 --> 00:28:23,760 fantastic. Say to the top sales guys in the 634 00:28:23,760 --> 00:28:26,400 team, like every time you sign a client, can you send us the 635 00:28:26,400 --> 00:28:29,760 pitch deck with a 5 minute just voice over saying, yeah, we 636 00:28:29,760 --> 00:28:31,560 spoke about this in the meeting. They really honed in on this 637 00:28:31,560 --> 00:28:33,840 slide and we find all those things are going well. 638 00:28:33,840 --> 00:28:36,240 If we put that on the website, it doesn't actually say that the 639 00:28:36,240 --> 00:28:38,840 product or service or tech work can even do that. 640 00:28:39,120 --> 00:28:42,560 But that's the thing that 3 pitches in the last three months 641 00:28:42,880 --> 00:28:45,400 and you've only signed 9 customers, they've all mentioned 642 00:28:45,400 --> 00:28:46,480 that. So that customer service, look, 643 00:28:46,480 --> 00:28:49,040 it was actually from B to B that we as an agency sort of learnt 644 00:28:49,040 --> 00:28:50,400 that and took that to E com going. 645 00:28:50,720 --> 00:28:52,880 This was five years ago. It's like we need to read the 646 00:28:52,880 --> 00:28:54,280 reviews more. We need to talk to customer 647 00:28:54,280 --> 00:28:55,920 service. We need to and actually going 648 00:28:55,920 --> 00:28:57,920 outside of and I think brands as well. 649 00:28:58,000 --> 00:28:59,920 I don't know if I don't know if you're guilty of this or not, 650 00:28:59,920 --> 00:29:02,440 but you get locked into the review platform, you're paying. 651 00:29:03,000 --> 00:29:05,120 And actually what you need to do is go on Google and put in your 652 00:29:05,120 --> 00:29:08,120 brand in speech Marks and then also put minus your domain. 653 00:29:08,400 --> 00:29:11,120 So it shows you everything to do with your brand, excluding your 654 00:29:11,120 --> 00:29:13,600 website, which then means you can see what people are actually 655 00:29:13,600 --> 00:29:15,400 saying about you. So someone will say, oh, 656 00:29:15,520 --> 00:29:17,880 Trustpilot scores fantastic or yacht PO reviews are looking 657 00:29:17,880 --> 00:29:20,080 brilliant right now. And then actually when you go 658 00:29:20,080 --> 00:29:21,960 onto Google, it's like, well, everyone's moaning about you on 659 00:29:21,960 --> 00:29:24,200 this other platform over here, like FIFO, they hate you. 660 00:29:24,240 --> 00:29:26,920 You really hate it. You're not, but it's that kind 661 00:29:26,920 --> 00:29:28,400 of thing. No, but not looking outside of 662 00:29:28,400 --> 00:29:30,360 your own sphere is really key, isn't it? 663 00:29:30,840 --> 00:29:33,400 It it really is. And also being big enough to 664 00:29:33,400 --> 00:29:36,160 take the criticism, there's many, many brands that if 665 00:29:36,160 --> 00:29:38,760 something's negative, they'll just completely ignore it, where 666 00:29:39,040 --> 00:29:42,800 actually it's a huge opportunity because no brand is perfect. 667 00:29:42,800 --> 00:29:44,120 Some brands think they are, but they're not. 668 00:29:44,960 --> 00:29:47,240 And you can always learn. You can always do things better. 669 00:29:47,240 --> 00:29:50,240 And also, especially as technology evolves and comes in, 670 00:29:50,760 --> 00:29:53,400 we're opening ourselves up for things going wrong. 671 00:29:53,800 --> 00:29:56,360 But actually, unless we're listening when that happens and 672 00:29:56,360 --> 00:29:58,200 learning from it, it will just go wrong again. 673 00:29:58,440 --> 00:30:00,200 Doing something wrong once is absolutely fine. 674 00:30:00,200 --> 00:30:02,280 Doing the same thing twice? That's not good. 675 00:30:02,800 --> 00:30:05,360 Black Friday and cyber money are coming in fast as your store 676 00:30:05,360 --> 00:30:07,120 ready. You need your marketing dialed 677 00:30:07,120 --> 00:30:09,480 in before the big rush and our sponsor Saguna has everything 678 00:30:09,480 --> 00:30:11,840 you need in one place. From emails and pop ups to 679 00:30:11,840 --> 00:30:14,600 reviews and more, Saguna's suite of tools is built exclusively 680 00:30:14,920 --> 00:30:17,760 for Shopify, so everything works seamlessly in your store. 681 00:30:17,840 --> 00:30:21,840 And right now with code WWS 20, you get 20% off your first three 682 00:30:21,920 --> 00:30:23,560 months. So don't wait until the chaos 683 00:30:23,560 --> 00:30:25,160 starts. Get your Black Friday and Cyber 684 00:30:25,160 --> 00:30:29,040 Monday marketing ready today at seguno.com/winning with 685 00:30:29,080 --> 00:30:32,200 shopifythatsseguno.com/winning with Shopify. 686 00:30:32,680 --> 00:30:35,760 So with all of that in mind, then we're talking a lot about 687 00:30:35,760 --> 00:30:38,280 the digital world, and I think it's amazing what you guys do in 688 00:30:38,280 --> 00:30:40,000 the digital space. But you've not been a digital 689 00:30:40,000 --> 00:30:42,200 first business historically, have you? 690 00:30:42,200 --> 00:30:45,400 When we spoke before, you said that actually moving more D to C 691 00:30:45,400 --> 00:30:47,280 and moving more online and getting more stuff through the 692 00:30:47,280 --> 00:30:49,160 website. And we joked just before we hit 693 00:30:49,160 --> 00:30:51,320 record about like the way the margin is, which is selling more 694 00:30:51,320 --> 00:30:53,360 direct. Tell us about some of the early 695 00:30:53,360 --> 00:30:56,160 days of your journey and what that transformations involved. 696 00:30:56,160 --> 00:30:58,320 The pain, the success. Yeah. 697 00:30:58,360 --> 00:31:00,160 How's it all gone? Well, I've only been there for 698 00:31:00,160 --> 00:31:02,600 four years, so I can only talk about the last four years. 699 00:31:02,600 --> 00:31:05,720 But before I got there, obviously, as I mentioned at the 700 00:31:05,720 --> 00:31:07,680 beginning, the company's been going for 28 years. 701 00:31:08,040 --> 00:31:10,680 So it's obviously have many evolutions now through that. 702 00:31:10,800 --> 00:31:14,800 But especially going back then, it was hugely reliant on health 703 00:31:14,800 --> 00:31:18,640 stores, bricks and mortar stores, wholesale outlets to get 704 00:31:18,640 --> 00:31:21,320 it into their international distributors. 705 00:31:21,480 --> 00:31:26,480 There was many, many, many avenues of sale and before Ecom 706 00:31:26,480 --> 00:31:29,760 became what it is now, brilliant because they don't really 707 00:31:29,840 --> 00:31:33,320 interfere with each other. If you've got a store in one 708 00:31:33,320 --> 00:31:36,600 place and another store in a different town, why does that 709 00:31:36,600 --> 00:31:38,960 matter? So it was blissful if you look 710 00:31:38,960 --> 00:31:43,640 back where now it just doesn't work like that anymore. 711 00:31:43,680 --> 00:31:48,480 So for brands like us, which has that legacy, you actually 712 00:31:48,480 --> 00:31:51,120 swiftly realize, especially since lockdown, all the 713 00:31:51,120 --> 00:31:54,920 e-commerce stores that have come in, you can actually open 714 00:31:54,920 --> 00:31:57,760 yourself up too white. Because actually what nobody 715 00:31:57,760 --> 00:32:01,840 wants is the silly price wars that go on an Amazon or eBay 716 00:32:01,840 --> 00:32:04,840 where they're all undercutting each other by 1 penny and 717 00:32:04,840 --> 00:32:05,880 there's someone selling you first. 718 00:32:06,040 --> 00:32:08,400 In the search and suddenly you got 50,000 orders and then 719 00:32:08,720 --> 00:32:10,720 you're a penny too expensive, so you've lost all your orders. 720 00:32:10,720 --> 00:32:14,160 It's yeah. And it's, it is also a lot about 721 00:32:14,280 --> 00:32:16,960 you've got to look after your brand and the brand perception 722 00:32:16,960 --> 00:32:20,160 in the marketplace. And actually you've got to also 723 00:32:20,160 --> 00:32:23,120 remember that if you're selling to a third party, they're not 724 00:32:23,120 --> 00:32:25,880 going to love or care for your brands like the brand does 725 00:32:25,880 --> 00:32:28,760 itself. So unless you're working with 726 00:32:29,080 --> 00:32:33,560 big partners or just really good partners who are on the journey 727 00:32:33,560 --> 00:32:36,000 with you, if you change your packaging, they're updating 728 00:32:36,000 --> 00:32:39,000 that, they're keeping your RRPS up to date. 729 00:32:39,000 --> 00:32:41,120 If there's new ingredients, they're updating it. 730 00:32:41,120 --> 00:32:43,800 The descriptions are up to date. But very, very quickly, 731 00:32:43,800 --> 00:32:46,040 especially when you open yourself up to wholesalers and 732 00:32:46,040 --> 00:32:49,600 things like that where anybody can buy your product, suddenly 733 00:32:49,600 --> 00:32:51,360 you're looking at it going, well, that's information's 734 00:32:51,360 --> 00:32:52,440 wrong. Who's selling it? 735 00:32:52,600 --> 00:32:54,720 We have no idea. We don't know who these people 736 00:32:54,720 --> 00:32:56,920 are. And it's not that they're 737 00:32:56,920 --> 00:33:00,000 necessarily doing a bad job, they're just not in the brand 738 00:33:00,000 --> 00:33:02,200 like we are. So we they've got a different. 739 00:33:02,200 --> 00:33:04,200 Set of KPI's, don't they for them it's we just need to sell 740 00:33:04,200 --> 00:33:06,680 the products and get the margin Yep, it's totally different and. 741 00:33:06,680 --> 00:33:09,040 We also have to be very careful in our market because obviously 742 00:33:09,040 --> 00:33:12,400 it is a health product. So we have to be very careful 743 00:33:12,400 --> 00:33:14,560 what we claim about the product and rightly so. 744 00:33:14,760 --> 00:33:17,800 We need to make sure that ingredient lists are true, 745 00:33:17,800 --> 00:33:21,840 accurate, correct and we just need to be doing it well. 746 00:33:22,600 --> 00:33:28,000 And we recently over the last few years, we've tried to slim 747 00:33:28,000 --> 00:33:30,000 that back. So anybody that sells our 748 00:33:30,000 --> 00:33:32,800 product, we want to look at them and go, they are adding 749 00:33:32,800 --> 00:33:36,960 something to our brand, whether they just have new reach or 750 00:33:37,000 --> 00:33:40,560 they've got a fantastic online store or they're reaching a new 751 00:33:40,560 --> 00:33:43,200 market or a new demographic, whatever that is. 752 00:33:43,600 --> 00:33:46,080 Don't get me wrong, I love working with third parties as 753 00:33:46,080 --> 00:33:49,520 well and our B2B team do a really valuable role and we need 754 00:33:49,520 --> 00:33:52,640 to work together again. But at the same time, we've now 755 00:33:52,920 --> 00:33:57,440 managed to get back control of our brand where the information 756 00:33:57,440 --> 00:33:59,840 on the Internet is of a good quality. 757 00:33:59,840 --> 00:34:02,960 Again, we're working with partners we really enjoy working 758 00:34:02,960 --> 00:34:05,360 with. And it does also mean then that 759 00:34:05,680 --> 00:34:08,880 there is also a reason to shop with green people directly 760 00:34:09,199 --> 00:34:12,639 because yes, we've tried to become a digital first company 761 00:34:12,639 --> 00:34:15,480 and we have succeeded. We are now a digital first. 762 00:34:15,760 --> 00:34:19,239 But it's come a huge sacrifice over the last years from a 763 00:34:19,239 --> 00:34:22,719 business to actually go, OK, we need to change the way we 764 00:34:22,719 --> 00:34:27,040 supply, who we supply and just get the brand integrity across 765 00:34:27,040 --> 00:34:31,040 the market that we want to have. And I know the word journey is 766 00:34:31,040 --> 00:34:33,400 used a lot, but it really has been a massive journey to 767 00:34:33,400 --> 00:34:34,920 achieve that. And a long one. 768 00:34:34,920 --> 00:34:38,480 It's taken 24 months to get to where we are today, which is now 769 00:34:38,480 --> 00:34:41,280 in a really good and healthy place, working with great 770 00:34:41,280 --> 00:34:44,239 partners. So it's, yeah, it's, to be 771 00:34:44,239 --> 00:34:46,960 honest with you, it's been fun but hard. 772 00:34:47,719 --> 00:34:50,159 In which all the best journeys have a challenge like no story 773 00:34:50,159 --> 00:34:51,920 starts with and everything was great at the end. 774 00:34:52,520 --> 00:34:53,520 It's always something in the middle. 775 00:34:53,520 --> 00:34:56,280 But I love what you mentioned. There's 2 routes I want to go 776 00:34:56,280 --> 00:34:58,120 down from this One is to talk a little bit about the wholesale 777 00:34:58,120 --> 00:35:00,760 side and actually where you guys in marketing might then clash 778 00:35:00,760 --> 00:35:02,440 with how someone else is positioning the same product, 779 00:35:02,880 --> 00:35:04,360 which I'm sure you've had some instances that. 780 00:35:04,760 --> 00:35:06,520 And then it'd be good to have to talk about what you can and 781 00:35:06,520 --> 00:35:08,600 can't say about the product because some people you're 782 00:35:08,600 --> 00:35:10,960 thinking are starting a for a competing brand. 783 00:35:10,960 --> 00:35:12,480 But that that is one of the issues you mentioned is like 784 00:35:12,480 --> 00:35:14,520 someone fills out a small form on Shopify and you've just got a 785 00:35:14,520 --> 00:35:16,520 new competitor. And that applies to all of us. 786 00:35:16,720 --> 00:35:18,320 Absolutely. But on the B2B side, yeah. 787 00:35:18,320 --> 00:35:20,600 I mean, how much have you come up against like same product, 788 00:35:20,600 --> 00:35:22,960 same situation or actually these guys are just, they've just got 789 00:35:22,960 --> 00:35:25,240 the branding wrong. There's a distributed pixelated 790 00:35:25,240 --> 00:35:27,520 logo of us or something that we, we've certainly put Google 791 00:35:27,520 --> 00:35:28,840 shopping in front of clients before and gone. 792 00:35:29,040 --> 00:35:30,840 There's your product in two places. 793 00:35:30,840 --> 00:35:32,440 One is you and one's another out there. 794 00:35:32,600 --> 00:35:34,840 Same price. Sorry, same picture, different 795 00:35:34,840 --> 00:35:37,640 price, different reviews you charge for delivery they don't 796 00:35:37,640 --> 00:35:39,560 like. It's a real value loss coming to 797 00:35:39,560 --> 00:35:41,480 you. Like how do you guys add that 798 00:35:41,480 --> 00:35:44,600 value on your own site And how much do you find products are 799 00:35:44,720 --> 00:35:47,280 still positioned as they should be on other retail sites? 800 00:35:48,200 --> 00:35:51,720 So we luckily have a really, really great business to 801 00:35:51,720 --> 00:35:54,360 business team who are really on the ball with it to be fair. 802 00:35:54,400 --> 00:35:57,120 So and they work now close really closely with the people 803 00:35:57,120 --> 00:35:59,840 we work with. So it's becoming fairly rare now 804 00:35:59,840 --> 00:36:03,200 for us to go on Google Shopping like we used to do and go, Oh 805 00:36:03,240 --> 00:36:05,640 dear, this looks horrendous. Yeah, and there were. 806 00:36:05,640 --> 00:36:09,000 Times, believe me, we did that, yeah, but luckily that that's 807 00:36:09,000 --> 00:36:10,880 changing so it's becoming less of an issue. 808 00:36:10,880 --> 00:36:14,040 But of course we want those green people, customers to come 809 00:36:14,040 --> 00:36:16,920 to us and stay with us. And both of those two things 810 00:36:16,920 --> 00:36:19,680 have different challenges. First of all, in the acquisition 811 00:36:19,680 --> 00:36:24,920 of customer, what you've got to do is also tell people why they 812 00:36:24,920 --> 00:36:28,800 should buy your brand at all. What we obviously come up 813 00:36:28,800 --> 00:36:32,200 against some if they go to one of our partners is none of those 814 00:36:32,200 --> 00:36:34,800 partners obviously only sell green people that'll be selling 815 00:36:34,800 --> 00:36:37,800 our competing brands. And every brand does have its 816 00:36:37,800 --> 00:36:40,720 place in the market. But actually what is really, 817 00:36:40,720 --> 00:36:44,000 really key is why should they buy green people. 818 00:36:44,400 --> 00:36:48,880 And sometimes, like we've been saying in this episode, we are 819 00:36:48,880 --> 00:36:52,480 selling to people really either wanting just natural and organic 820 00:36:52,480 --> 00:36:55,240 ingredients because they believe it's better for the environment 821 00:36:55,240 --> 00:36:58,680 and the planet, or which is the majority of our customers, they 822 00:36:58,680 --> 00:37:02,560 have a skin concern and we can help them fix that problem. 823 00:37:02,680 --> 00:37:05,440 We certainly can't guarantee it, and we'll come on to claims in a 824 00:37:05,440 --> 00:37:06,120 minute. Yeah. 825 00:37:06,400 --> 00:37:08,280 But from the way we've formulated the products, it 826 00:37:08,280 --> 00:37:11,680 should most definitely help. You've got to. 827 00:37:11,720 --> 00:37:15,080 And when they come to our own store, we have a much better 828 00:37:15,080 --> 00:37:18,640 chance of being able to do that because we are in control of 829 00:37:18,640 --> 00:37:21,280 actually being able to surface them with the story of why the 830 00:37:21,280 --> 00:37:23,880 brand exists, which is incredibly powerful. 831 00:37:24,120 --> 00:37:27,040 And anyone listening to this, I urge them to go and look at that 832 00:37:27,040 --> 00:37:30,800 story because it's incredible. But outside of that, cuz it's 833 00:37:30,800 --> 00:37:34,520 not just about the story, it's also about going and why are our 834 00:37:34,520 --> 00:37:39,120 products right and who for? And I'd like to think we pretend 835 00:37:39,120 --> 00:37:43,120 that that's not for everybody. And we now set out who the 836 00:37:43,120 --> 00:37:46,760 product is right for. And actually, if you have that 837 00:37:46,760 --> 00:37:51,600 honesty and integrity as a brand, people are likely to buy 838 00:37:52,120 --> 00:37:54,600 because actually we've got a product that works. 839 00:37:54,600 --> 00:37:56,520 We've been honest with them and said who it's for. 840 00:37:57,280 --> 00:37:59,360 We think we priced them reasonably for what they are. 841 00:37:59,640 --> 00:38:01,960 So we try and tick all the boxes of why they would buy. 842 00:38:02,280 --> 00:38:05,520 There's also things of course that we do, like loyalty 843 00:38:05,520 --> 00:38:08,600 schemes, for example, on our website, like most brands, we do 844 00:38:08,600 --> 00:38:11,800 have a subscription offering people that want subscription. 845 00:38:12,160 --> 00:38:14,800 And we try and do everything we possibly can to treat those 846 00:38:14,800 --> 00:38:16,480 customers well. Going back to the earlier 847 00:38:16,480 --> 00:38:19,320 conversational customer experience, we're always trying 848 00:38:19,320 --> 00:38:22,000 to heighten and make it better and better and better. 849 00:38:22,320 --> 00:38:25,640 Look after those people. And a bit like going to agencies 850 00:38:25,640 --> 00:38:29,880 as an example, people always change agencies all the time in 851 00:38:29,880 --> 00:38:33,280 our market, whether it's marketing, web agency, no one. 852 00:38:33,280 --> 00:38:35,000 Ever leaves us, of course, but never. 853 00:38:35,280 --> 00:38:39,000 It never happened, but agencies have often said to us as a 854 00:38:39,000 --> 00:38:43,520 brand, why do people leave? My answer normally is quite 855 00:38:43,520 --> 00:38:45,200 simple. It's normally because you've 856 00:38:45,200 --> 00:38:48,080 given them a reason to leave, even if that's because you 857 00:38:48,080 --> 00:38:50,080 haven't been proactive. So not necessarily doing 858 00:38:50,080 --> 00:38:53,160 something wrong, but there's been some sort of doubt you've 859 00:38:53,160 --> 00:38:55,680 managed to put in their mind which has ended with them 860 00:38:55,680 --> 00:38:57,640 leaving. And it's exactly the same for 861 00:38:57,640 --> 00:38:59,760 the customer. Actually, if you treat your 862 00:38:59,760 --> 00:39:04,160 customers really well, give them product that work, give them the 863 00:39:04,160 --> 00:39:06,600 right incentives to come back in a positive way. 864 00:39:06,600 --> 00:39:09,880 So you're treating them really nicely and making sure that also 865 00:39:09,880 --> 00:39:13,280 they can't just go on Google Shopping and find you 50% 866 00:39:13,280 --> 00:39:15,640 cheaper over here and then they think you're ripping them out, 867 00:39:15,640 --> 00:39:16,800 which. We all do when we're buying a 868 00:39:16,800 --> 00:39:19,760 product, of course. And look, with AI tools and 869 00:39:19,760 --> 00:39:22,280 things like that, we all know how easy it is now to compare 870 00:39:22,280 --> 00:39:25,560 around the web. But it's just about treating 871 00:39:25,560 --> 00:39:28,320 them well, treating them fairly, giving them a good experience, 872 00:39:28,320 --> 00:39:29,880 and then they're most likely to come back. 873 00:39:30,480 --> 00:39:33,120 And we do have very good retention rates for that exact 874 00:39:33,120 --> 00:39:34,960 reason. Which you make it sound so 875 00:39:34,960 --> 00:39:37,920 simple, but I think like I said earlier, if people go and use 876 00:39:37,920 --> 00:39:41,680 their own sites as a customer words, I even said to a brand 877 00:39:41,680 --> 00:39:45,080 recently, order some of your own products to your house and use a 878 00:39:45,080 --> 00:39:47,640 fake name and do that. And so I was like, Oh my gosh, 879 00:39:47,640 --> 00:39:49,560 the packaging is so nice in the warehouse. 880 00:39:49,720 --> 00:39:52,320 It does not survive the truck. And you're like, well, now you 881 00:39:52,320 --> 00:39:54,760 know, get some better packaging. And then one of our clients did 882 00:39:54,760 --> 00:39:56,360 that. They end up saving money on the 883 00:39:56,480 --> 00:39:59,280 new packaging solution that was more robust and customers then 884 00:39:59,280 --> 00:40:02,000 started saying like. It's such a great box that comes 885 00:40:02,000 --> 00:40:04,360 in. I now use it for a sorting unit 886 00:40:04,360 --> 00:40:06,080 in one of my cupboards and you're like, well, that's got 887 00:40:06,080 --> 00:40:07,520 it's got their brand and that's kind of cool. 888 00:40:07,800 --> 00:40:09,160 And we will put a link in the description. 889 00:40:09,160 --> 00:40:10,720 By the way, you mentioned about people coming to see see the 890 00:40:10,720 --> 00:40:13,080 brand and we'll put a link to green people in the description. 891 00:40:13,080 --> 00:40:14,920 So check that out guys, and we'll get you to read it out in 892 00:40:14,920 --> 00:40:15,640 a minute as well. That will. 893 00:40:15,680 --> 00:40:17,080 Help my targets as well. So please. 894 00:40:17,080 --> 00:40:18,520 But yeah, yeah. That'll be cool. 895 00:40:18,520 --> 00:40:19,960 And that'll be a nice little back link on SEO. 896 00:40:19,960 --> 00:40:22,040 We were joking about that earlier, but you actually said, 897 00:40:22,040 --> 00:40:24,520 I think a really good point is anyone you work with, you say 898 00:40:24,520 --> 00:40:27,120 link back to us because then we get the equity from that. 899 00:40:27,120 --> 00:40:29,280 And chances are an agency you work with 10 years ago, we'll 900 00:40:29,280 --> 00:40:31,160 still have the link on there because it's like, look what we 901 00:40:31,160 --> 00:40:32,080 did. And it's yeah. 902 00:40:32,080 --> 00:40:33,520 And it's. So you've still got that, that 903 00:40:33,520 --> 00:40:37,000 power there. Let's talk though about the 904 00:40:37,000 --> 00:40:40,160 issues when it comes to ad copy and what you can and can't say 905 00:40:40,200 --> 00:40:42,600 on your site. We, I would be lying if I've 906 00:40:42,680 --> 00:40:44,920 never been slapped on the wrist by Trading Standards and ASA. 907 00:40:45,160 --> 00:40:47,480 And in most of the situations like let's wait for them to 908 00:40:47,520 --> 00:40:48,720 e-mail. And there's obviously different. 909 00:40:48,720 --> 00:40:49,880 Those are the UK governing bodies. 910 00:40:49,880 --> 00:40:51,880 So Advertising Standards Authority and Trading Standards. 911 00:40:52,160 --> 00:40:54,040 And there are several others in the UK. 912 00:40:54,040 --> 00:40:56,280 There'll be others in other countries, but what kind of 913 00:40:56,280 --> 00:40:59,000 things do you guys come up against where it's like, this is 914 00:40:59,000 --> 00:41:02,280 true and we want to say it but we can't and versus like what is 915 00:41:02,280 --> 00:41:05,000 the lean process that I imagine you guys are created to go? 916 00:41:05,200 --> 00:41:06,760 This is just how we get stuff approved quickly. 917 00:41:06,760 --> 00:41:09,440 And if it's a bit by the by or a bit close to the line, here's 918 00:41:09,440 --> 00:41:12,320 how we decide. Well, actually, sometimes 919 00:41:12,320 --> 00:41:15,160 frustratingly. But we really don't take that 920 00:41:15,160 --> 00:41:18,720 line. We say internally we're too 921 00:41:18,720 --> 00:41:21,160 safe. Whether that's true or not is 922 00:41:21,160 --> 00:41:24,480 for people to debate. But we very much err on the side 923 00:41:24,480 --> 00:41:25,960 of caution. That's how the company has 924 00:41:25,960 --> 00:41:29,600 always been. And yes, I think especially in 925 00:41:29,600 --> 00:41:32,920 the UK, you have to be incredibly careful of what you 926 00:41:33,000 --> 00:41:35,640 say. Take eczema as a prime example. 927 00:41:36,760 --> 00:41:39,560 Go back to reviews again, look at our reviews and people will 928 00:41:39,560 --> 00:41:42,120 say it's helped cure their eczema. 929 00:41:42,360 --> 00:41:45,480 We didn't say that, they said that, but if we said that, 930 00:41:46,240 --> 00:41:49,240 that's not just a slap on the wrist, that's just not allowed. 931 00:41:49,600 --> 00:41:52,800 So it is treading that line because at the end of the day, 932 00:41:52,840 --> 00:41:55,960 you've got a product to sell. So if you say nothing about that 933 00:41:55,960 --> 00:41:57,680 product, no one's going to buy it. 934 00:41:58,000 --> 00:42:00,920 But there is a ton of rules and regulations. 935 00:42:01,160 --> 00:42:04,200 So it is really important. Again, going back to balance and 936 00:42:04,200 --> 00:42:06,960 people communicating. If we were just the marketing 937 00:42:06,960 --> 00:42:09,480 team sat together and the conversation was what would we 938 00:42:09,480 --> 00:42:12,840 like to say? We could go, well, look at this 939 00:42:12,840 --> 00:42:17,040 review, let's say that and it would be like, no, we can't say 940 00:42:17,040 --> 00:42:18,240 that, but that's what we'd like to. 941 00:42:18,640 --> 00:42:21,600 So it's a balance. And you would not believe we, we 942 00:42:21,600 --> 00:42:24,840 work really closely, Trustpilot and Saguno, one of our sponsors, 943 00:42:24,840 --> 00:42:27,480 the podcast do reviews. We work really closely with the 944 00:42:27,480 --> 00:42:31,080 review platforms to get the most out of them. 945 00:42:31,080 --> 00:42:32,840 And one of the things people don't do enough, which is what 946 00:42:32,840 --> 00:42:34,680 you've just said when you say people brands don't do enough of 947 00:42:34,680 --> 00:42:37,840 this, is actually just just run a review as your ad. 948 00:42:38,280 --> 00:42:41,160 Not enough people do it and it's totally verified, totally 949 00:42:41,160 --> 00:42:43,960 authenticated. And it's so easy. 950 00:42:43,960 --> 00:42:46,880 Like how many, I mean, how many hours have you and I spent in 951 00:42:46,880 --> 00:42:48,720 rooms with your you and your team? 952 00:42:48,960 --> 00:42:51,400 I've spent with clients of ours. We're sitting there scratching 953 00:42:51,400 --> 00:42:54,560 their heads going what else can we say about this blooming cup? 954 00:42:54,560 --> 00:42:56,880 Like it's a cup and we not selling enough and we were 955 00:42:56,880 --> 00:42:58,240 selling loads and now we're selling less. 956 00:42:58,240 --> 00:42:59,640 Like what else can we write about it? 957 00:42:59,800 --> 00:43:03,600 If someone says like this cup is the nicest cup to drink out of 958 00:43:03,880 --> 00:43:06,400 and it's just they're using the word nice, which is a terrible 959 00:43:06,400 --> 00:43:08,680 marketing word, but it's powerful because it's five star. 960 00:43:08,680 --> 00:43:10,960 It's from Dave in Watford. Thank you, Dave. 961 00:43:10,960 --> 00:43:13,600 You know, like this is this review and that those, those 962 00:43:13,600 --> 00:43:16,960 reviews are so important. We, we found some incredibly big 963 00:43:16,960 --> 00:43:19,560 global organizations we're working with where they've got 964 00:43:19,560 --> 00:43:21,720 all these reviews, similar numbers to you with 50,000 965 00:43:21,720 --> 00:43:23,400 reviews and 10s of 1000 reviews clocking up. 966 00:43:23,400 --> 00:43:25,640 And they've not even integrated them properly into the schema on 967 00:43:25,640 --> 00:43:27,000 the website. So they're not in their SEO 968 00:43:27,000 --> 00:43:30,360 listings and also the review platforms automatically. 969 00:43:30,360 --> 00:43:31,680 And there's something you guys can go and check. 970 00:43:31,680 --> 00:43:34,600 They upload the reviews automatically into Google Ads 971 00:43:34,840 --> 00:43:36,840 and Google Ads receive that data. 972 00:43:37,320 --> 00:43:39,880 And we did a bit of a survey amongst pitches we were doing 973 00:43:39,880 --> 00:43:43,320 over the last six months and over half of them were paying 974 00:43:43,320 --> 00:43:47,520 for, paid for review platforms. And they were not getting those 975 00:43:47,520 --> 00:43:49,400 reviews into their ads. The ads weren't coming. 976 00:43:49,400 --> 00:43:50,560 The reviews weren't coming across the ads. 977 00:43:50,760 --> 00:43:52,080 So they're paying for it. They're not getting it. 978 00:43:52,080 --> 00:43:55,040 When we fixed it, ROI just straight up because it wasn't 979 00:43:55,040 --> 00:43:57,720 just here's an ad about some stuff or a product right now, it 980 00:43:57,720 --> 00:43:59,400 was here's a product people love. 981 00:43:59,800 --> 00:44:01,160 And see, I just, I love what you say about that. 982 00:44:01,160 --> 00:44:03,680 And actually using that kind of does bypass a lot of these rules 983 00:44:03,680 --> 00:44:05,560 and laws. It's a really smart way to go 984 00:44:05,560 --> 00:44:07,280 and actually you're saving yourself time and money creating 985 00:44:07,280 --> 00:44:07,760 things. But I. 986 00:44:07,760 --> 00:44:11,320 Think also it's a great point on the fact that we definitely are 987 00:44:11,320 --> 00:44:15,840 guilty as a brand of oh, because we've got so much to say and we 988 00:44:15,840 --> 00:44:18,400 want it to look amazing. We've just done a new shoot to 989 00:44:18,400 --> 00:44:21,280 be like, we must put this out. We need to do video. 990 00:44:21,600 --> 00:44:24,400 You always get distracted away from those testimonials and 991 00:44:24,400 --> 00:44:27,040 reviews and you end up making something that looks great. 992 00:44:27,320 --> 00:44:30,000 And then you sit in a meeting and there's someone that goes, 993 00:44:30,400 --> 00:44:31,600 why haven't we just got review ads? 994 00:44:31,600 --> 00:44:34,960 And part of you wants to go, oh, come on, everyone's got review. 995 00:44:34,960 --> 00:44:36,280 We've got to have some creativity. 996 00:44:36,920 --> 00:44:40,800 So, but I use the word balance all the time and it is striking 997 00:44:40,800 --> 00:44:42,600 that again. But yes, testimonials are so 998 00:44:42,600 --> 00:44:45,440 important and it, yes, you are allowed to put them out there. 999 00:44:45,440 --> 00:44:48,520 But also we've still got to be careful within them that they're 1000 00:44:48,520 --> 00:44:51,520 not saying something how incredibly amazing it might 1001 00:44:51,520 --> 00:44:53,400 sound that the product might not actually do. 1002 00:44:53,600 --> 00:44:54,520 Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. 1003 00:44:54,760 --> 00:44:57,480 And coming into land, I want to talk about one last thing, which 1004 00:44:57,480 --> 00:44:59,040 a lot of brands aspire to do this. 1005 00:44:59,040 --> 00:45:02,000 You're doing some of this. It's just internationalisation. 1006 00:45:02,000 --> 00:45:05,320 Obviously Shopify markets has been a complete game changer for 1007 00:45:05,320 --> 00:45:06,880 businesses. It's created a headache for us 1008 00:45:06,880 --> 00:45:09,200 in the SEO world because it's like we're going to use to find 1009 00:45:09,200 --> 00:45:12,240 markets like right, HRF Lang tags, languages, we've got to 1010 00:45:12,240 --> 00:45:14,480 work, some translators, we've got to go back and forth with 1011 00:45:14,480 --> 00:45:16,440 them going. I get that that's what you call 1012 00:45:16,440 --> 00:45:18,800 it in Germany, but no one seems to be searching that in Germany. 1013 00:45:18,800 --> 00:45:21,440 So it's not what they call it. And find the balance, you know, 1014 00:45:21,440 --> 00:45:22,880 use the word balance again, find that. 1015 00:45:23,080 --> 00:45:24,760 Talk us through your internationalisation journey, 1016 00:45:24,760 --> 00:45:26,120 like what countries have you launched in? 1017 00:45:26,120 --> 00:45:28,600 How slow or quick was it? What uptake have you had? 1018 00:45:28,720 --> 00:45:30,320 What's it like entering basically a whole new world, 1019 00:45:30,400 --> 00:45:32,400 world of like these people don't know us? 1020 00:45:32,400 --> 00:45:33,960 Like we need to talk about this. Yeah. 1021 00:45:33,960 --> 00:45:36,240 Well, a subject we spoke about earlier was having to be the 1022 00:45:36,240 --> 00:45:39,480 underdog sometimes because Green People is a completely 1023 00:45:39,480 --> 00:45:44,760 independent company. We've not got investors, we 1024 00:45:44,760 --> 00:45:47,880 don't borrow huge sums of money, so we have to do things 1025 00:45:47,880 --> 00:45:49,960 organically. So when the subject of 1026 00:45:49,960 --> 00:45:51,920 international internationalization comes up, 1027 00:45:52,480 --> 00:45:55,920 rightly so, at a board level, it's kind of like, and how do we 1028 00:45:55,920 --> 00:46:00,440 pay for that? So from the underdog mentality, 1029 00:46:00,600 --> 00:46:03,600 you have to go, OK, well, we can't just go in and throw money 1030 00:46:03,600 --> 00:46:06,160 at it. There's partly an exciting 1031 00:46:06,160 --> 00:46:07,520 thought of being able to do that. 1032 00:46:07,520 --> 00:46:09,920 But actually on the flip side, you've got to do it the hard way 1033 00:46:10,280 --> 00:46:12,520 and you've got to think of clever ways to do it. 1034 00:46:14,120 --> 00:46:17,880 What we've tried to do mainly focusing on the European market 1035 00:46:17,880 --> 00:46:20,640 at the moment is actually go without those millions of 1036 00:46:20,640 --> 00:46:24,200 dollars to put into it, how can we get our brand seen And let 1037 00:46:24,200 --> 00:46:25,320 me. Ask you your own question. 1038 00:46:25,320 --> 00:46:27,720 How do you do it then without I think everyone's seen in a 1039 00:46:27,760 --> 00:46:29,360 pencil going, well, what have you done? 1040 00:46:29,360 --> 00:46:30,680 Like what? What has been the strategy? 1041 00:46:30,680 --> 00:46:34,520 So look, I, I think the and this is not rocket science, but use 1042 00:46:34,520 --> 00:46:37,960 marketplaces because it's fine making your Shopify market 1043 00:46:37,960 --> 00:46:41,160 store, making it look amazing, paying lots of money to get it 1044 00:46:41,160 --> 00:46:43,960 professionally translated, doing SEO. 1045 00:46:44,280 --> 00:46:47,040 But if nobody's ever heard of your brand or seen you, you're 1046 00:46:47,080 --> 00:46:48,880 fighting a losing battle. Unless you get. 1047 00:46:48,880 --> 00:46:50,720 Number one, you get the traffic in people like, well, who are 1048 00:46:50,720 --> 00:46:51,560 these guys? Yeah. 1049 00:46:51,560 --> 00:46:54,840 And if you've got the money to pay a very big influencer to 1050 00:46:54,840 --> 00:46:56,280 endorse your product, it might be different. 1051 00:46:56,280 --> 00:46:58,760 We don't have that. So what we're trying to do is an 1052 00:46:58,760 --> 00:47:01,680 Omni channel approach using marketplaces. 1053 00:47:01,680 --> 00:47:04,920 So take Amazon for example, that our team also looks after. 1054 00:47:05,240 --> 00:47:09,040 That is the biggest shop window you are ever going to have as a 1055 00:47:09,040 --> 00:47:11,680 brand. And people hate Amazon, and I 1056 00:47:11,880 --> 00:47:14,840 get it, but with them for a long time and they can be very 1057 00:47:14,840 --> 00:47:18,200 frustrating. But at the same time, millions 1058 00:47:18,200 --> 00:47:21,640 and millions and millions of people can get eyeballs on your 1059 00:47:21,640 --> 00:47:24,280 brand, even if you don't pay for advertising. 1060 00:47:24,320 --> 00:47:25,840 Of course, more eyeballs if you do. 1061 00:47:26,240 --> 00:47:28,800 But actually, if you optimize those listings, just like you 1062 00:47:28,800 --> 00:47:31,680 would do with your website, you can get so many people looking 1063 00:47:31,680 --> 00:47:33,880 at your products. And then funnily enough, your 1064 00:47:33,880 --> 00:47:35,880 website traffic will start to go up. 1065 00:47:36,200 --> 00:47:39,800 But what I would say to anyone looking at doing it is take your 1066 00:47:39,800 --> 00:47:43,160 time with internationalization because actually it's really be 1067 00:47:43,160 --> 00:47:47,160 hard. Pick a country, not ten because 1068 00:47:47,160 --> 00:47:49,480 again, it's very tempting, especially with Shopify markets. 1069 00:47:49,480 --> 00:47:51,840 You could be like, I'll turn on that country, I'll turn on that 1070 00:47:51,840 --> 00:47:53,360 one. All that looks great, never 1071 00:47:53,360 --> 00:47:54,480 thought about. Clients guilty. 1072 00:47:54,520 --> 00:47:56,560 That one we were talking about before we hit record, yeah. 1073 00:47:56,840 --> 00:47:59,640 Well, we won't go there, but I would just say, look, 1074 00:47:59,640 --> 00:48:03,680 concentrate on one unless you've got the team and the investment 1075 00:48:03,680 --> 00:48:07,000 to go bigger than that, do one really well before you start 1076 00:48:07,000 --> 00:48:09,200 chasing all of the other countries because you'll make 1077 00:48:09,200 --> 00:48:11,960 more money in that one than the 10 you're going to turn off and 1078 00:48:11,960 --> 00:48:13,000 not doing them, do them especially. 1079 00:48:13,080 --> 00:48:15,160 And if you choose an EU country as well, I'm not going to get 1080 00:48:15,160 --> 00:48:17,960 political today, but if you choose one and they are in the 1081 00:48:17,960 --> 00:48:21,160 European Union, then actually you take France, actually 1082 00:48:21,240 --> 00:48:24,280 Germany, Spain, Italy, there are neighboring countries that then 1083 00:48:24,280 --> 00:48:26,600 it's easier to go from France to Germany than it was from the UK 1084 00:48:26,600 --> 00:48:29,120 to France in the 1st place, given the currency difference to 1085 00:48:29,120 --> 00:48:31,160 everything else. And the reason he's laughing is, 1086 00:48:31,880 --> 00:48:34,000 yeah, we've got more than one client at the moment going like 1087 00:48:34,400 --> 00:48:36,000 guys, exciting news. We're going to launch in 1088 00:48:36,000 --> 00:48:38,400 Australia and we're like, I was, I mean, it's literally the 1089 00:48:38,400 --> 00:48:40,800 opposite side of the world. Like, you know, one of the guys 1090 00:48:40,800 --> 00:48:43,200 on my board is out there right now and I message him in the 1091 00:48:43,200 --> 00:48:46,480 morning when he's about to go to bed and I messaged him in the 1092 00:48:46,480 --> 00:48:49,000 evening when he's just woken up. When we're communicating right 1093 00:48:49,000 --> 00:48:50,760 now, I'm like, why are you shipping products there? 1094 00:48:50,960 --> 00:48:54,760 And the big other side, I would say of why is, if you've not 1095 00:48:54,760 --> 00:48:58,160 fully exhausted, what you could do in one country, it doesn't 1096 00:48:58,160 --> 00:49:00,280 mean you don't go to the next country, but there has to be a 1097 00:49:00,280 --> 00:49:03,800 reason why that country is going to be more successful than where 1098 00:49:03,800 --> 00:49:06,320 you are now. I think it it does as you say, 1099 00:49:06,520 --> 00:49:08,040 the, the markets make it really easy. 1100 00:49:08,040 --> 00:49:11,400 And I'm sure it becomes a vanity project going to, we're in 19 1101 00:49:11,400 --> 00:49:14,160 countries now. No one buys from 17 of them, 1102 00:49:14,320 --> 00:49:15,920 but. There's also some horror stories 1103 00:49:15,920 --> 00:49:19,080 and I know you've got a lot of US viewers, but on the flip 1104 00:49:19,080 --> 00:49:23,000 side, I've met lots of UK brands going to the US and, for 1105 00:49:23,000 --> 00:49:25,480 example, not understanding the tax systems and things like 1106 00:49:25,480 --> 00:49:25,840 that. Yeah, the. 1107 00:49:25,840 --> 00:49:27,720 Sales tax at least stay. Oh, there's some horror. 1108 00:49:27,800 --> 00:49:30,680 Stories. So yeah, just do it carefully. 1109 00:49:30,680 --> 00:49:34,080 Don't just get click happy with the countries, choose it really 1110 00:49:34,080 --> 00:49:35,880 carefully. And actually just just on that 1111 00:49:35,880 --> 00:49:38,440 as well, if anyone missed my episode on Tuesday, it's a 1112 00:49:38,440 --> 00:49:40,920 really valid point because on Tuesday I was sharing that 1113 00:49:40,920 --> 00:49:43,280 actually that Meta and Instagram, now, they used to 1114 00:49:43,480 --> 00:49:45,680 work as an intermediary, intermediary for you in the 1115 00:49:45,680 --> 00:49:47,960 states across the US. They don't anymore. 1116 00:49:48,160 --> 00:49:50,200 You have to pay each state individually as of I think it 1117 00:49:50,200 --> 00:49:52,640 was a few weeks ago. So that's changed in America as 1118 00:49:52,640 --> 00:49:54,680 well. So yeah, it's, and I'm not, 1119 00:49:55,040 --> 00:49:56,680 we're not calling out America saying that I was getting so 1120 00:49:56,680 --> 00:49:58,440 much more difficult there. Like if anyone's seen what our 1121 00:49:58,440 --> 00:50:00,680 government's up to, it's carnage over here. 1122 00:50:00,680 --> 00:50:02,080 Like that could. Be another episode. 1123 00:50:02,080 --> 00:50:04,000 Yes, yeah. And this is going out just 1124 00:50:04,000 --> 00:50:06,400 before the budget. So we're still happy. 1125 00:50:06,400 --> 00:50:09,000 We've been sleeping. We'll see what We'll see what 1126 00:50:09,000 --> 00:50:11,160 happens. But I mean, look, Matthew, we're 1127 00:50:11,160 --> 00:50:12,680 sorry. Matt, thank you so much for your 1128 00:50:12,680 --> 00:50:13,560 time. Appreciate you coming on the 1129 00:50:13,560 --> 00:50:15,000 show. What is the URL? 1130 00:50:15,000 --> 00:50:16,160 How can people get in touch with you? 1131 00:50:16,160 --> 00:50:18,840 What are your social channels? How can people engage and follow 1132 00:50:18,840 --> 00:50:20,800 the journey and get involved? So it's simply 1133 00:50:20,800 --> 00:50:24,600 greenpeople.co.uk, not.com, but dot co.uk. 1134 00:50:25,960 --> 00:50:29,440 We're on Instagram, we're on Tiktok, we're on Facebook, all 1135 00:50:29,440 --> 00:50:32,960 the usual channels. The last thing I would say is 1136 00:50:32,960 --> 00:50:37,440 for people especially trying to launch a Shopify store, don't 1137 00:50:37,440 --> 00:50:39,280 stress. There is so much going out there 1138 00:50:39,280 --> 00:50:42,400 at the moment with AI and apps galore. 1139 00:50:42,760 --> 00:50:45,160 Don't try and do everything because you're never going to be 1140 00:50:45,160 --> 00:50:46,320 able to and your every other page. 1141 00:50:46,320 --> 00:50:47,240 Speeds. Exactly. 1142 00:50:47,280 --> 00:50:49,440 But every other brand is in the same place. 1143 00:50:49,680 --> 00:50:52,600 So all I would say is try and understand your customer really 1144 00:50:52,600 --> 00:50:55,520 well, what they're looking for and develop your site for that. 1145 00:50:55,520 --> 00:50:57,160 Amazing. Well, thanks so much, Matt, and 1146 00:50:57,160 --> 00:50:58,560 for everybody watching at home as well. 1147 00:50:58,560 --> 00:51:00,400 Thanks for tuning in again, if you haven't already hit 1148 00:51:00,400 --> 00:51:02,360 subscribe, leave us a review. We've been talking about how 1149 00:51:02,360 --> 00:51:04,840 powerful it is for the brands. We as winning shop fight our 1150 00:51:04,840 --> 00:51:07,600 brand as well. So please do share the love go 1151 00:51:07,600 --> 00:51:09,080 and subscribe to us on lots of different channels. 1152 00:51:09,080 --> 00:51:09,960 Leave us for a few if you haven't. 1153 00:51:10,000 --> 00:51:12,640 And if you want any help, hello at winning we shopfite.com send 1154 00:51:12,640 --> 00:51:13,800 us an e-mail. Thanks for tuning in. 1155 00:51:13,800 --> 00:51:15,880 We'll be back again on Tuesday with another tea break talks. 1156 00:51:16,040 --> 00:51:18,880 Yost have just launched something that is absolutely 1157 00:51:18,920 --> 00:51:22,520 game changing. Their new AI brand insights tool 1158 00:51:22,520 --> 00:51:25,640 is now in beta and it's built to help you track your brand's 1159 00:51:25,640 --> 00:51:29,360 visibility, sentiment and credibility across AI platforms 1160 00:51:29,360 --> 00:51:32,520 like ChatGPT. As search expands from Google to 1161 00:51:32,560 --> 00:51:34,880 AI answers. 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