1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:02,280 Today on the Winning with Shopify podcast. 2 00:00:02,680 --> 00:00:06,280 Rebel Cheese is a non dairy plant based vegan cheese 3 00:00:06,280 --> 00:00:08,039 company. I know from experience if I 4 00:00:08,039 --> 00:00:10,320 start deleting apps, SEO starts going up. 5 00:00:10,400 --> 00:00:13,800 Where would a brand like us fit and how do we know that those 6 00:00:13,800 --> 00:00:16,640 numbers, those metrics actually are relevant to us? 7 00:00:16,920 --> 00:00:19,640 You've just made what is one of the most complicated parts of 8 00:00:19,640 --> 00:00:22,320 e-commerce and just running a retail related business. 9 00:00:22,320 --> 00:00:25,440 You've made it sound so simple. It's the process of continuously 10 00:00:25,440 --> 00:00:28,600 learning and improving and knowing that whatever is working 11 00:00:28,600 --> 00:00:31,520 today may not work tomorrow. I think so many brands like, 12 00:00:31,520 --> 00:00:33,920 well, we kind of, we kind of do this, we kind of do that. 13 00:00:34,000 --> 00:00:35,400 It doesn't really work like that. 14 00:00:35,480 --> 00:00:37,840 I've got to be ready for all the emails that come in from all of 15 00:00:37,840 --> 00:00:39,360 the dumb things you didn't think about. 16 00:00:45,560 --> 00:00:47,600 Hello and welcome to another episode of the winning We Shall 17 00:00:47,600 --> 00:00:49,280 Find podcast. It was your first time tuning 18 00:00:49,280 --> 00:00:51,440 in. Subscribe, review, get involved, 19 00:00:51,440 --> 00:00:53,640 go to our website, join the growth hub, join our newsletter 20 00:00:53,880 --> 00:00:55,600 and just engage as much as you can. 21 00:00:55,600 --> 00:00:59,280 Everything for brands that we do is completely free to do with 22 00:00:59,280 --> 00:01:01,160 the podcast. We do charge for our services, 23 00:01:01,160 --> 00:01:02,880 but the podcast element is completely free. 24 00:01:02,880 --> 00:01:05,360 So get involved, get on our newsletter, get some exclusive 25 00:01:05,360 --> 00:01:06,720 discounts. You've been tuning in for a 26 00:01:06,720 --> 00:01:09,000 while and you've not done any of those things, then please do. 27 00:01:09,000 --> 00:01:11,800 It really helps support the show, especially YouTube. 28 00:01:11,800 --> 00:01:13,560 We're really pushing our YouTube channel at the moment. 29 00:01:13,680 --> 00:01:15,800 We're getting thousands of views on there, our tick look and 30 00:01:15,800 --> 00:01:17,880 Instagram is starting to pick up as well, which is absolutely 31 00:01:17,880 --> 00:01:19,440 amazing. And it's so good having you guys 32 00:01:19,440 --> 00:01:21,520 on this journey. And as I was literally just 33 00:01:21,520 --> 00:01:23,480 saying a few minutes ago, it would be so pointless without 34 00:01:23,480 --> 00:01:24,840 all of you. So thank you so much for 35 00:01:24,840 --> 00:01:27,560 supporting the show. I'm honoured to have an amazing 36 00:01:27,560 --> 00:01:29,640 brand and an amazing guest on the show today. 37 00:01:29,640 --> 00:01:31,800 He's done a huge amount of work ahead of today, coming up with 38 00:01:31,800 --> 00:01:33,520 some amazing questions, some great answers. 39 00:01:33,680 --> 00:01:36,240 His name is Paul, he's the CTO of Rebel Cheese. 40 00:01:36,240 --> 00:01:37,920 Paul, welcome to the show. How are you? 41 00:01:38,880 --> 00:01:41,400 I'm amazing, Nick, great, wonderful to be here. 42 00:01:41,400 --> 00:01:45,960 This is such a huge honour. You're like my Trinity of E. 43 00:01:46,000 --> 00:01:47,840 Commerce, you don't have to say that. 44 00:01:48,800 --> 00:01:50,760 What else Sir? And you're like, you're my 45 00:01:50,880 --> 00:01:53,040 weekly go to guys. So thank you so much. 46 00:01:53,520 --> 00:01:54,920 Oh, amazing. I really appreciate that and 47 00:01:54,920 --> 00:01:58,040 it's so good to have you on and I'm glad we've been helpful on 48 00:01:58,040 --> 00:02:00,080 the journey. My my wife would tell me my head 49 00:02:00,080 --> 00:02:02,280 gets too big when people say this, so hopefully she doesn't 50 00:02:02,280 --> 00:02:04,400 listen to this bit. But so good to have you on. 51 00:02:04,400 --> 00:02:06,560 Paul, I'm so excited to stay. You've got an amazing 52 00:02:06,560 --> 00:02:08,080 background. The business is awesome. 53 00:02:08,639 --> 00:02:11,240 Some of the questions that I've got on my list or topics to talk 54 00:02:11,240 --> 00:02:13,720 about with you, I'm really excited about and deliberately 55 00:02:13,720 --> 00:02:16,480 don't know too much about so I can hear fresh on the show. 56 00:02:16,480 --> 00:02:19,280 But I mentioned your background. Paul, tell us what your 57 00:02:19,280 --> 00:02:21,720 background is and how you got involved in being the CTO of 58 00:02:21,720 --> 00:02:24,080 Rebel Cheese in the first place. Oh sure. 59 00:02:24,360 --> 00:02:27,480 So total, I've spent about 27 years in tech. 60 00:02:27,480 --> 00:02:31,240 I started right out of college as a software developer for 12 61 00:02:31,240 --> 00:02:36,240 years at IBM here in Austin, TX. And after that for about 5 years 62 00:02:36,240 --> 00:02:40,360 I was a product manager at the company is currently called NXP 63 00:02:40,360 --> 00:02:42,840 Semiconductor Company, but it used to be called Freescale 64 00:02:42,840 --> 00:02:45,960 Semiconductor. Then after that I spent about 6 65 00:02:45,960 --> 00:02:51,120 1/2 years as a senior product manager at Amazon and Amazon as 66 00:02:51,120 --> 00:02:54,520 everyone knows huge company. The organization that I was 67 00:02:54,520 --> 00:02:57,840 specifically in was the Amazon.com part or what we call 68 00:02:57,840 --> 00:03:03,200 retail and that gave me a lot of experience in the large 69 00:03:03,200 --> 00:03:04,880 enterprise version of e-commerce. 70 00:03:04,880 --> 00:03:09,280 And so when I met Kirsten and Fred, the Co founders of Rebel 71 00:03:09,280 --> 00:03:12,640 Cheese about six years ago, they had just started Rebel Cheese 72 00:03:13,000 --> 00:03:16,520 and kind of maintained friends with them for those few years. 73 00:03:16,520 --> 00:03:24,040 And when we had the opportunity in 2023 to be on Shark Tank, we 74 00:03:24,760 --> 00:03:28,600 I was able to join as someone just it was meant to be the 75 00:03:28,600 --> 00:03:31,600 person to fix their e-commerce site which was not on Shopify at 76 00:03:31,600 --> 00:03:34,320 the time. So my first job within a week 77 00:03:34,320 --> 00:03:38,840 was to migrate the old stack onto Shopify and get us ready 78 00:03:38,840 --> 00:03:41,440 for our Shark Tank launch. And sorry to interrupt, but what 79 00:03:41,440 --> 00:03:43,400 was it on before Shopify? What's the previous platform? 80 00:03:43,840 --> 00:03:47,920 Oh, so it was on square. I don't want to discourage the 81 00:03:47,920 --> 00:03:51,040 squares are perfectly fine. It does what it does. 82 00:03:51,040 --> 00:03:54,240 But where we needed to go for all of the traffic and 83 00:03:54,240 --> 00:03:56,920 everything that was about to happen, Shopify was just a much 84 00:03:56,960 --> 00:03:59,520 better stack. And I had looked at other 85 00:04:00,400 --> 00:04:04,680 platforms like WooCommerce and Magento, but Shopify, just as 86 00:04:04,680 --> 00:04:08,280 your listeners viewers know, just the fact that you can tune 87 00:04:08,280 --> 00:04:10,840 and tweak everything yourself and make your own mistakes is 88 00:04:10,840 --> 00:04:14,600 just the power of Shopify. Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. 89 00:04:14,600 --> 00:04:17,279 And see you've been involved in Rebel Cheese for a few years now 90 00:04:17,320 --> 00:04:20,640 and CTO like that's not the normal job title we would have 91 00:04:20,640 --> 00:04:22,760 on the show. Like Chief, I'm guessing it's 92 00:04:22,760 --> 00:04:25,360 chief technical officer. What what is, what is your role 93 00:04:25,360 --> 00:04:27,600 involved then like how, how are you involved in the in the 94 00:04:27,600 --> 00:04:28,760 business? Like, what sort of things do you 95 00:04:28,760 --> 00:04:31,960 look after? So I would say in a short 96 00:04:31,960 --> 00:04:37,520 sentence, my main role is job is being like the father guardian 97 00:04:37,520 --> 00:04:42,000 of the software stack. So initially it was our D2 CE 98 00:04:42,000 --> 00:04:47,360 commerce stack Shopify. And over the months after Shark 99 00:04:47,360 --> 00:04:51,720 Tank, as we've built out our direct wholesale program, I set 100 00:04:51,720 --> 00:04:56,720 up a separate Shopify store for wholesale and our distribution 101 00:04:56,720 --> 00:04:58,320 channel that has been building up. 102 00:04:59,120 --> 00:05:03,440 The software that distribution is using is Google Sheets, so 103 00:05:03,440 --> 00:05:06,640 not necessarily. So I have a project in place to 104 00:05:06,640 --> 00:05:08,840 also migrate that over to Shopify as well. 105 00:05:09,200 --> 00:05:12,240 And our 2 brick and mortar locations use Toast. 106 00:05:12,400 --> 00:05:16,440 So I have to integrate all the different software, whether it's 107 00:05:16,440 --> 00:05:20,320 Shopify or Ship Station, which we use for fulfillment and 108 00:05:20,320 --> 00:05:23,560 shipping management, our new inventory management system, 109 00:05:23,560 --> 00:05:27,640 they are, we are just like days hopefully away from turning on 110 00:05:27,640 --> 00:05:30,480 Cortana. So keeping track of all the 111 00:05:30,480 --> 00:05:33,040 integrations, making sure that everything is talking to each 112 00:05:33,040 --> 00:05:36,800 other as well as some side pieces of software like Polar 113 00:05:36,800 --> 00:05:40,520 Analytics, which we use to pull all those metrics together to 114 00:05:40,520 --> 00:05:43,760 get one big dashboard so we can kind of hopefully keep a pulse 115 00:05:43,760 --> 00:05:45,760 and everything. Yeah. 116 00:05:46,720 --> 00:05:49,360 You've just made what is one of the most complicated parts of 117 00:05:49,360 --> 00:05:52,080 e-commerce and, and just running a retail related business. 118 00:05:52,400 --> 00:05:54,760 You've made it sound so simple. So you're clearly good at what 119 00:05:54,760 --> 00:05:58,000 you're doing. I, I, I find so many hours that 120 00:05:58,000 --> 00:06:01,760 we spend even just as an agency here fixing analytics, getting 121 00:06:01,760 --> 00:06:04,800 that to talk to Shopify. We're doing a Shopify to eBay 122 00:06:04,800 --> 00:06:07,000 and a Shopify to Amazon integration for a client at the 123 00:06:07,000 --> 00:06:08,240 moment. I say integration. 124 00:06:08,240 --> 00:06:10,200 We're just setting them up and it's so good. 125 00:06:10,200 --> 00:06:13,680 Just clicking like new app, set that up, set up some information 126 00:06:13,680 --> 00:06:16,000 that eBay profiles created that product listings are going out, 127 00:06:16,000 --> 00:06:18,920 which means means we can focus our time on the imagery, the 128 00:06:18,920 --> 00:06:22,200 text, the titles, the marketing, how do we position those prices 129 00:06:22,200 --> 00:06:25,200 and that kind of thing. So Shopify is amazing that I 130 00:06:25,200 --> 00:06:26,840 always find it up there. And I was saying this before we 131 00:06:26,840 --> 00:06:29,280 hit record as well. Like I find it amazing when 132 00:06:29,280 --> 00:06:31,240 people move to Shopify, they think, great, all my technical 133 00:06:31,240 --> 00:06:34,680 woes are over. So one of my questions, which I 134 00:06:34,680 --> 00:06:36,480 think you've kind of answered already, was really going to be 135 00:06:36,680 --> 00:06:38,800 why would a Shopify brand need a CTO? 136 00:06:38,800 --> 00:06:40,600 Like, you know, you've got all these things, but I think you've 137 00:06:40,600 --> 00:06:42,640 explained really well, actually, there's two Shopify stores. 138 00:06:42,640 --> 00:06:44,440 There's another store that is currently running through a 139 00:06:44,440 --> 00:06:47,560 Google Sheet for wholesale. There's obviously Toast running 140 00:06:47,560 --> 00:06:48,960 in the stores themselves and that kind of thing. 141 00:06:48,960 --> 00:06:53,720 So there's a lot going on. And for most brands in using 142 00:06:53,720 --> 00:06:56,840 Shopify, what, what would your advice be about when they move 143 00:06:56,840 --> 00:06:59,920 to Shopify in terms of setting that expectation about it? 144 00:06:59,920 --> 00:07:02,680 Because it's not a all your technical woes are fixed. 145 00:07:03,120 --> 00:07:04,840 There are some we're going to talk about a few of these we go 146 00:07:04,840 --> 00:07:06,000 through. There are some pitfalls and 147 00:07:06,000 --> 00:07:08,240 things that can really affect actually commercial trades if 148 00:07:08,240 --> 00:07:09,760 you get them wrong. What would your advice be to 149 00:07:09,760 --> 00:07:12,640 someone who's looking to move to Shopify or you've just moved 150 00:07:12,640 --> 00:07:14,120 there and thought, great text finished. 151 00:07:14,120 --> 00:07:15,640 I can just do marketing for the rest of my life. 152 00:07:17,400 --> 00:07:20,080 So it's a big question, I would say in general. 153 00:07:20,840 --> 00:07:23,720 I mean, this seems pretty obvious for all small business 154 00:07:23,720 --> 00:07:25,640 owners, whether you're on Shopify or not. 155 00:07:25,640 --> 00:07:30,640 But just the critical piece of a small business owner is keeping 156 00:07:30,640 --> 00:07:34,480 your costs under control and that Shopify does provide a 157 00:07:34,480 --> 00:07:38,200 great way for you to see, OK, here's my AOV, my conversion 158 00:07:38,200 --> 00:07:42,840 ratio sessions turning into orders, which first time versus 159 00:07:42,840 --> 00:07:45,560 returning customers. So all those basic metrics you 160 00:07:45,560 --> 00:07:50,800 get access to and then where you have to know for your small 161 00:07:50,800 --> 00:07:54,240 business, whether you're the founder or in a supporting role 162 00:07:54,240 --> 00:07:57,720 like myself, is, are those numbers good? 163 00:07:57,840 --> 00:08:00,200 Because if you don't know, like if you don't have a, a 164 00:08:00,480 --> 00:08:05,440 comparative like counterpoint to know like, OK, we're for US food 165 00:08:05,440 --> 00:08:09,760 CPG in the US. And our, just to give a little 166 00:08:09,760 --> 00:08:14,440 bit background, our average order value for a, a typical 167 00:08:14,440 --> 00:08:19,360 customer is going to be about $110 and that's about 5 items in 168 00:08:19,360 --> 00:08:21,520 a cart. And they come back about every 169 00:08:21,520 --> 00:08:26,800 4045 days. So $110 might seem high for food 170 00:08:27,280 --> 00:08:30,440 doing e-commerce that also happens to be perishable food. 171 00:08:30,920 --> 00:08:35,720 But, and so I have to spend a lot of time listening to 172 00:08:35,720 --> 00:08:38,720 podcasts like yourself and others and reading articles 173 00:08:38,720 --> 00:08:42,880 about food CPG, but also e-commerce in general to find 174 00:08:42,880 --> 00:08:45,560 out like where would a brand like us fit? 175 00:08:45,560 --> 00:08:48,800 And how do we know that those numbers, those metrics actually 176 00:08:48,800 --> 00:08:52,120 are relevant to us just because they might be really good for 177 00:08:52,120 --> 00:08:54,280 somebody else. And then the cost to go with 178 00:08:54,280 --> 00:08:57,600 that, Because one of the good and the bad things about Shopify 179 00:08:57,600 --> 00:09:00,800 is that you have all these apps. And that's also the bad thing is 180 00:09:00,800 --> 00:09:06,200 you have all these on like, OK, if I start having 20 or 30 apps 181 00:09:06,200 --> 00:09:08,720 and do all these little different things, they might be 182 00:09:08,720 --> 00:09:12,480 saving me time, but end up costing me a lot of money that I 183 00:09:12,480 --> 00:09:14,840 may not see till 3060 days later. 184 00:09:15,240 --> 00:09:18,720 And you might realize later that, oh, there's actually a 185 00:09:18,720 --> 00:09:21,360 feature built into Shopify that I didn't know about that I could 186 00:09:21,360 --> 00:09:24,160 have actually adjusted or tuned to do one of those things. 187 00:09:24,560 --> 00:09:28,440 So for me, it's the process of continuously learning and 188 00:09:28,440 --> 00:09:32,480 improving and knowing that whatever is working today may 189 00:09:32,480 --> 00:09:35,880 not work tomorrow or vice versa. Whatever is not working today 190 00:09:36,080 --> 00:09:39,240 may work tomorrow for different reasons, new customers, 191 00:09:39,240 --> 00:09:43,040 different segments like moving into Canada or Mexico or the UK, 192 00:09:43,640 --> 00:09:46,240 that that's where you just have to keep continuously, 193 00:09:46,240 --> 00:09:49,000 continuously improving and changing and adapting and that 194 00:09:49,360 --> 00:09:50,800 takes a lot of time. Yeah, yeah. 195 00:09:51,040 --> 00:09:53,040 We're going to come back to apps in a second because you've hit 196 00:09:53,040 --> 00:09:55,760 about 5 of my, like, nerve points as an SEO guy of our 197 00:09:55,760 --> 00:09:57,120 apps. So we're going to come back to 198 00:09:57,120 --> 00:10:41,200 apps in a second. One thing we've, I completely 199 00:10:41,200 --> 00:10:43,480 forgot to ask you, Paul. And this will show how like 200 00:10:43,720 --> 00:10:46,800 click clean cut the, the, the podcast actually is. 201 00:10:47,160 --> 00:10:48,880 I didn't actually ask you what rebel cheese do. 202 00:10:48,880 --> 00:10:51,680 I mean, I know because I, I've known of you guys for a while. 203 00:10:51,960 --> 00:10:54,200 Give us a quick overview to it because you mentioned about 204 00:10:54,200 --> 00:10:57,440 perishable products, food, SMS, FMCG, which suddenly reminded me 205 00:10:57,440 --> 00:11:00,160 like we're still just, it's not just, you don't actually sell 206 00:11:00,160 --> 00:11:03,760 dairy cheese at all, do you? It's, it's vegan and, and 207 00:11:03,760 --> 00:11:04,920 different. So tell us quickly just the 208 00:11:04,920 --> 00:11:07,440 product range as well so people can picture what you guys do. 209 00:11:08,440 --> 00:11:12,760 Yes, that's correct. So Rebel Cheese is a non dairy 210 00:11:12,800 --> 00:11:14,520 plant based vegan cheese company. 211 00:11:14,520 --> 00:11:18,880 In a nutshell, our elevator pitch is we make handcrafted 212 00:11:18,880 --> 00:11:22,600 artisanal, non dairy plant based cheeses for people who want to 213 00:11:22,600 --> 00:11:28,880 see good aged fermented cheeses like Brie, smoked cheddar, 214 00:11:28,960 --> 00:11:33,400 parmesan, mozzarella that you'd be happy to present on a 215 00:11:33,400 --> 00:11:36,000 charcuterie board. So we don't do shreds, we don't 216 00:11:36,000 --> 00:11:38,760 do slices in a bag. We want you if you're gonna have 217 00:11:38,760 --> 00:11:42,200 a picnic or have a centerpiece where you're gonna have a party 218 00:11:42,480 --> 00:11:44,800 and people stop and look and like, Oh my God, what is that? 219 00:11:45,040 --> 00:11:47,400 That can't be like dairy truffle. 220 00:11:47,400 --> 00:11:50,440 Bree, what is this smoked cheddar, this pimento cheese. 221 00:11:51,000 --> 00:11:53,840 So that's where we we're elevating what you would 222 00:11:53,840 --> 00:11:56,880 normally see as an everyday product into something that's 223 00:11:56,880 --> 00:12:02,720 more artisanal, European. And So what we do, and a lot of 224 00:12:02,720 --> 00:12:05,640 people ask like vegan cheese, isn't that like just a lot of 225 00:12:05,640 --> 00:12:09,600 preservatives and fillers? So that's one of the things that 226 00:12:09,600 --> 00:12:13,400 makes us unique is we are taking the exact same processes and 227 00:12:13,400 --> 00:12:17,000 procedures and techniques that the dairy industry uses, just 228 00:12:17,000 --> 00:12:21,480 instead of cow, sheep, goat milk, we're using nut based 229 00:12:21,480 --> 00:12:23,280 milk. So that's the medium. 230 00:12:23,280 --> 00:12:25,600 We start with cashew milk or almond milk. 231 00:12:25,720 --> 00:12:29,280 And then from there, the rest of it is aging and fermenting the 232 00:12:29,280 --> 00:12:34,520 cheeses to get a two week old truffle Brie or a smoked cheddar 233 00:12:34,760 --> 00:12:38,760 or a pimento cheese or pepper Jack or a Gouda or mozzarella or 234 00:12:38,760 --> 00:12:41,160 any of these types of elevated cheeses. 235 00:12:41,960 --> 00:12:43,080 Yeah, yeah. And a lot of people around me 236 00:12:43,080 --> 00:12:45,280 are vegan. And I, I have, I, I call myself 237 00:12:45,280 --> 00:12:47,760 a flexitarian. I'm not vegan, but I eat a lot 238 00:12:47,760 --> 00:12:50,280 of vegan meals and stuff. So I've tried quite a lot of 239 00:12:50,280 --> 00:12:53,600 vegan cheeses and I think some of them have just not got it 240 00:12:53,600 --> 00:12:55,200 right. Like you, you eat a cheese and 241 00:12:55,200 --> 00:12:57,720 it tastes more like a soybean and you think it's not quite 242 00:12:57,720 --> 00:12:58,760 right. It's not quite where it needs to 243 00:12:58,760 --> 00:13:02,560 be, but I, I, if anyone's sitting there thinking into 244 00:13:02,560 --> 00:13:04,880 themselves as well, I'm struggling to get my brand 245 00:13:04,880 --> 00:13:08,120 positioning and stuff right. Paul, you've just described in 246 00:13:08,200 --> 00:13:10,400 like, I think that even just the first kind of two or three 247 00:13:10,400 --> 00:13:14,480 sentences, your elevator pitch absolutely nailed what you guys 248 00:13:14,480 --> 00:13:16,400 are about. There was 3 or 4 different whys 249 00:13:16,400 --> 00:13:18,920 in there about the handmade, the artisan that we want to put it 250 00:13:18,920 --> 00:13:21,720 on a cheese board. So people take inspiration from 251 00:13:21,720 --> 00:13:23,240 actually what you've just said, Paul, because it was such a 252 00:13:23,240 --> 00:13:25,600 beautiful way of explaining it and it just rolls off the tongue 253 00:13:25,840 --> 00:13:27,720 because you guys have cemented that positioning. 254 00:13:28,000 --> 00:13:30,680 I think so many brands like, well, we kind of, we kind of do 255 00:13:30,680 --> 00:13:32,800 this, we kind of do that. It doesn't, it doesn't really 256 00:13:32,800 --> 00:13:34,680 work like that to, to get it nailed. 257 00:13:34,680 --> 00:13:37,520 So then when you come to like a Google ads or your homepage to 258 00:13:37,520 --> 00:13:40,160 the website, trying to nail that can be really, really difficult. 259 00:13:40,160 --> 00:13:42,640 But I promised we're going to come back to apps. 260 00:13:42,920 --> 00:13:47,400 So apps, I know from experience, if I start deleting apps and 261 00:13:47,400 --> 00:13:49,720 depending on which ones I delete, SEO starts going up 262 00:13:49,800 --> 00:13:52,520 because and our rankings go up and traffic increases because of 263 00:13:52,520 --> 00:13:54,960 the page, page speed and page load and that sort of thing. 264 00:13:55,920 --> 00:13:57,840 Give us an overview then to how you guys, because you mentioned 265 00:13:57,840 --> 00:14:00,040 kind of that's one of the things you would advise people on the 266 00:14:00,040 --> 00:14:02,320 shop, how rebel cheese in your role. 267 00:14:02,320 --> 00:14:06,080 Have you actually attacked some of the page speed problems, some 268 00:14:06,080 --> 00:14:08,280 of the functionality problems you mentioned, obviously listen 269 00:14:08,280 --> 00:14:10,200 to podcasts, but what have been some of the outputs that you 270 00:14:10,200 --> 00:14:12,120 guys have been like? Have you developed your own code 271 00:14:12,120 --> 00:14:14,330 for things? Are you using an all more all in 272 00:14:18,040 --> 00:14:21,280 What's your approach? So great question. 273 00:14:21,280 --> 00:14:25,680 So one of the well, couple of apps that I use are Microsoft's 274 00:14:25,680 --> 00:14:30,160 clarity for heatmap and tracking and also seeing some of the page 275 00:14:30,160 --> 00:14:35,400 lags, but also Shopify's own web page performance on the 276 00:14:35,440 --> 00:14:41,720 analytics on the theme editor and Lighthouse are great tools 277 00:14:41,920 --> 00:14:45,960 that help you just know, are we accidentally inadvertently 278 00:14:45,960 --> 00:14:49,320 putting too much JavaScript heavy big images? 279 00:14:49,560 --> 00:14:53,600 Now, Shopify is good about making sure that it's helping 280 00:14:53,600 --> 00:14:58,960 you not have 50 Meg PNGS jpegs just by the nature that it 281 00:14:58,960 --> 00:15:02,120 prevents you from loading them into the store to begin with. 282 00:15:02,440 --> 00:15:06,160 But still, you still want to make sure that you don't have a 283 00:15:06,160 --> 00:15:10,240 death by 1000 paper cuts because if you get a little lazy with 284 00:15:10,240 --> 00:15:14,520 some Jpegs and PNGS after you have a few 100, then overall, 285 00:15:14,800 --> 00:15:18,320 you know, you kind of you've lost the plot as far as the page 286 00:15:18,320 --> 00:15:22,040 speed and time. And it also helps you What I 287 00:15:22,040 --> 00:15:25,560 like to do with my Shopify specialist who helps be my 288 00:15:25,560 --> 00:15:30,560 counterbalance is about every so often 30 days, we do an analysis 289 00:15:30,560 --> 00:15:35,840 to read, to reassess like OK, with AB testing of the landing 290 00:15:35,840 --> 00:15:40,240 page, product pages, even the images. 291 00:15:40,800 --> 00:15:42,600 Is this still the best thing that's working? 292 00:15:42,800 --> 00:15:45,320 So we'll do that through a careful balance of the 293 00:15:45,320 --> 00:15:48,280 quantitative data, like I just said, using some of the tools 294 00:15:48,600 --> 00:15:52,480 either built within Shopify or Lighthouse or heat clarity for 295 00:15:52,480 --> 00:15:56,760 heat map testing, AB testing, but then also the qualitative. 296 00:15:57,040 --> 00:15:59,600 So we do, I have a post purchase. 297 00:16:00,320 --> 00:16:02,920 I use user loop for my post purchase survey. 298 00:16:03,280 --> 00:16:06,520 So that's what I found is the hottest time to get someone. 299 00:16:06,520 --> 00:16:09,760 They've already spent 110 to 120 thirty dollars. 300 00:16:10,520 --> 00:16:13,160 Ask them a question, two or three questions right away. 301 00:16:13,320 --> 00:16:16,360 I give them a 10% discount if they answer all the questions 302 00:16:16,720 --> 00:16:21,240 and I have like a 37% response rate after about a year of doing 303 00:16:21,240 --> 00:16:25,080 it, I like have 100 and 1110 thousand responses. 304 00:16:25,080 --> 00:16:29,840 So a huge amount of qualitative responses to find out one of the 305 00:16:29,840 --> 00:16:34,160 reasons it's good to do that, not just for different 306 00:16:34,280 --> 00:16:37,520 demographics, but when it was a big eye opener. 307 00:16:37,880 --> 00:16:41,680 Before Shark Tank, of course our world was a lot smaller and 308 00:16:41,680 --> 00:16:45,640 therefore our customers were vegan or vegetarian. 309 00:16:45,960 --> 00:16:48,440 After Shark Tank, when I launched that post purchase 310 00:16:48,440 --> 00:16:50,720 survey and I asked what's your lifestyle? 311 00:16:50,720 --> 00:16:54,280 How would you describe yourself? Vegan, vegetarian, lactose, 312 00:16:54,280 --> 00:16:57,440 dairy intolerant or sensitive. Our world shifted. 313 00:16:57,440 --> 00:17:01,680 So we have a steady 35% of our customers are about or would 314 00:17:01,680 --> 00:17:06,480 describe themselves as vegan or vegetarian. 55% of our customers 315 00:17:06,920 --> 00:17:10,359 are dairy, lactose intolerant or sensitive. 316 00:17:10,599 --> 00:17:13,720 So that's to what you were saying earlier, A huge eye 317 00:17:13,720 --> 00:17:18,440 opener from a marketing, whether it's paid or organic, we need to 318 00:17:18,440 --> 00:17:21,200 start looking at the much bigger slice of the pie because in the 319 00:17:21,520 --> 00:17:26,240 US, about 3% of the pop of the US population identifies as 320 00:17:26,240 --> 00:17:31,840 vegan versus about 55 to 60% of the US population has some sort 321 00:17:31,840 --> 00:17:34,720 of dairy sensitivity, whether it's full blown lactose 322 00:17:34,720 --> 00:17:38,040 intolerance or makes their, you know, digestive system not 323 00:17:38,040 --> 00:17:40,440 happy. So why would we go after a small 324 00:17:40,440 --> 00:17:43,960 little slice versus a large, large swath? 325 00:17:44,440 --> 00:17:48,040 So that's been very eye opening as far testing not just 326 00:17:48,040 --> 00:17:51,960 messaging apps and performance, but knowing where we want to 327 00:17:51,960 --> 00:17:53,720 shift our messages along the way. 328 00:18:47,920 --> 00:18:49,720 We've worked with quite a few brands that are like like we've 329 00:18:49,720 --> 00:18:52,640 worked with the loose leaf tea brands that were really against 330 00:18:52,640 --> 00:18:55,240 plastic in tea bags and they were had this war on plastic and 331 00:18:55,240 --> 00:18:56,920 tea bags. And when you say to someone, you 332 00:18:56,920 --> 00:18:59,800 do realise like 10 to 20% of what you drink in a tea bag, 333 00:18:59,800 --> 00:19:03,600 Maybe we drink more tea in the UK, but in the tea bag 20, you 334 00:19:03,600 --> 00:19:06,080 know, 10 to 20% of it is plastic that you're drinking. 335 00:19:06,560 --> 00:19:08,400 People kind of go, wow, that's awful. 336 00:19:08,400 --> 00:19:10,920 And then they make another cup of tea using a tea bag rather 337 00:19:10,920 --> 00:19:12,200 than a loose leaf. They don't make a lifestyle 338 00:19:12,200 --> 00:19:14,520 change. But then when we pivoted the 339 00:19:14,520 --> 00:19:18,200 marketing to say, actually, it's delicious, like these are all 340 00:19:18,200 --> 00:19:21,120 after effects. Like it's, it's like I, I guess 341 00:19:21,120 --> 00:19:23,520 it's with some people like the brand of tobacco you might smoke 342 00:19:23,520 --> 00:19:25,600 or the alcohol you might drink or the chocolate you might 343 00:19:25,600 --> 00:19:28,400 choose, you're actually going down probably hates it, but the 344 00:19:28,400 --> 00:19:30,160 selfish route of going. I just prefer it. 345 00:19:30,160 --> 00:19:32,280 It's better. So the dairy route might be I 346 00:19:32,280 --> 00:19:34,640 feel more comfortable. So, you know, I've got some 347 00:19:34,640 --> 00:19:37,360 level of dairy intolerance. This cheese tastes amazing and 348 00:19:37,360 --> 00:19:39,720 it's dairy free. So that's a really, really good 349 00:19:39,720 --> 00:19:41,600 alternative to me. And, but actually, what then 350 00:19:41,600 --> 00:19:44,520 what you even project verbally to people is, Oh, and it's vegan 351 00:19:44,520 --> 00:19:46,680 because you like telling people you're actually eating a vegan 352 00:19:46,680 --> 00:19:49,240 cheese, even though not vegan. But it's, it's pivoting the 353 00:19:49,240 --> 00:19:51,960 marketing around that. And I think certainly for brands 354 00:19:51,960 --> 00:19:54,200 more in their infancy, it's, it's kind of going back to your 355 00:19:54,200 --> 00:19:55,960 one liner on what we do as a brand. 356 00:19:56,320 --> 00:19:59,520 It's so difficult to kind of work that out until you've got 357 00:19:59,520 --> 00:20:01,400 enough traction. It's, I call it the chicken and 358 00:20:01,400 --> 00:20:02,800 egg. You've got to get enough sales, 359 00:20:02,800 --> 00:20:05,040 get enough data to be able to analyse, to be able to get some 360 00:20:05,040 --> 00:20:07,920 qualitative reports done or quantitative data together to 361 00:20:08,120 --> 00:20:09,600 understand what really, really works. 362 00:20:10,720 --> 00:20:14,120 We've spoken about apps then. So bigger than just the apps in 363 00:20:14,120 --> 00:20:16,400 in Shopify, your bigger, wider tech stack. 364 00:20:16,920 --> 00:20:20,200 Are there any specific decisions you made early on that you've 365 00:20:20,200 --> 00:20:23,800 actually gone that was a terrible idea or actually it's 366 00:20:23,800 --> 00:20:25,880 it's been a game changer for us and we should have done it 367 00:20:25,880 --> 00:20:28,480 sooner or we didn't understand how powerful it was when we 368 00:20:28,480 --> 00:20:31,520 first integrated that tech or, or used a new piece of software. 369 00:20:33,480 --> 00:20:36,360 Well, every day I make tons of mistakes. 370 00:20:37,560 --> 00:20:40,520 Don't we all? I always hope I learn from them, 371 00:20:41,160 --> 00:20:46,320 but I think again, it was lack of time and just having wearing 372 00:20:46,320 --> 00:20:48,800 too many hats. I wish that I had more time 373 00:20:48,920 --> 00:20:54,440 earlier after we launched our Shark Tank episode to be able to 374 00:20:54,440 --> 00:20:59,360 get a really good understanding of the shipping costs for which 375 00:20:59,360 --> 00:21:03,480 would include things like Because We are plant based 376 00:21:03,480 --> 00:21:06,520 cheeses were perishable. So that means our goal is to try 377 00:21:06,520 --> 00:21:08,640 to get the product to you once we ship. 378 00:21:08,880 --> 00:21:12,440 So the fulfillment may take 3 or 4 days for the kitchen to make 379 00:21:12,440 --> 00:21:15,400 the products etcetera. But once we say your product is 380 00:21:15,400 --> 00:21:19,240 shipped 2 days or less. So that means we have to have 381 00:21:19,480 --> 00:21:22,800 insulation in the boxes that we make sure are compostable or 382 00:21:22,800 --> 00:21:26,880 recyclable ice packs that are going to be enough ice packs 383 00:21:26,880 --> 00:21:31,600 that will keep the product at 40° Fahrenheit or less for that 384 00:21:31,720 --> 00:21:36,200 one to two day travel. And also not 'cause the box to 385 00:21:36,200 --> 00:21:40,080 waste so much that we pay a crazy amount of shipping cost 386 00:21:40,080 --> 00:21:44,400 from FedEx or UPS. So we my Co founder Fred and I 387 00:21:44,400 --> 00:21:49,240 are constantly analyzing and re analyzing who is the best 388 00:21:49,240 --> 00:21:52,880 cardboard box vendor, who is the best insulation vendor, who is 389 00:21:52,880 --> 00:21:56,160 the best ice pack vendor as well as other things like the tape 390 00:21:56,160 --> 00:21:58,640 that goes on there because everybody wants to sell you 391 00:21:58,640 --> 00:22:02,400 stuff. But if one of our sub goals as 392 00:22:02,400 --> 00:22:07,040 rebel cheese is to also be sustainable and you try to have, 393 00:22:07,200 --> 00:22:10,120 you know, the the least impact on the planet as we can as far 394 00:22:10,120 --> 00:22:13,240 as these materials, that already eliminates a lot of those. 395 00:22:13,560 --> 00:22:17,640 And once we make that signed that contract for truckloads of 396 00:22:17,640 --> 00:22:21,440 boxes and ice, one of the things I didn't mention is we own our 397 00:22:21,440 --> 00:22:23,200 own vertical, our entire vertical. 398 00:22:23,400 --> 00:22:27,480 So we have our own production kitchen, our own warehouse, our 399 00:22:27,480 --> 00:22:29,880 own fulfillment center. So we own everything, which 400 00:22:29,880 --> 00:22:34,000 allows us to own everything but also make our own mistakes that 401 00:22:34,520 --> 00:22:37,720 can be very costly. So place that order for the. 402 00:22:37,720 --> 00:22:40,160 Sorry to interrupt, but just to say it's really interesting just 403 00:22:40,160 --> 00:22:42,240 on that point that you mentioned about making our own mistakes. 404 00:22:42,720 --> 00:22:45,440 Because I think a lot of brands I've talked to, whether they've 405 00:22:45,440 --> 00:22:47,040 made the jump or they're planning to make the jump to do 406 00:22:47,040 --> 00:22:49,160 all their own fulfilment of warehousing, they think it's 407 00:22:49,160 --> 00:22:52,440 going to be better. But every change, every move, it 408 00:22:52,560 --> 00:22:53,800 must come with its own challenges. 409 00:22:53,800 --> 00:22:56,000 So just, I just wanted to flag, I really appreciate you sharing 410 00:22:56,000 --> 00:22:58,920 that because it's quite a humble thing to hear actually that it 411 00:22:59,040 --> 00:23:00,560 sounds amazing. But actually it does come with 412 00:23:00,560 --> 00:23:02,880 its own challenges of now we don't have a fulfilment company 413 00:23:03,080 --> 00:23:05,120 doing what they do best. We're trying to do that bit 414 00:23:05,120 --> 00:23:06,960 ourselves, which means we're going to make we're going to 415 00:23:06,960 --> 00:23:08,800 make mistakes along the way. That can be. 416 00:23:09,000 --> 00:23:13,040 That's both pro and con because we signed the contract and then 417 00:23:13,040 --> 00:23:20,080 two weeks later 2 semi trucks, 18 Wheelers of insulation come 418 00:23:20,080 --> 00:23:22,840 or cardboard come and we're like, OK, we're committed to 419 00:23:22,840 --> 00:23:28,520 this now versus, you know, we've had some of our partners and 420 00:23:28,520 --> 00:23:32,760 other CPG brands that have commands or other VPLS that do 421 00:23:32,760 --> 00:23:34,280 that. They sign the contract. 422 00:23:34,360 --> 00:23:36,240 It's the wrong box, the wrong packaging. 423 00:23:36,240 --> 00:23:39,720 They're also committed because that's that's so it's the same 424 00:23:39,720 --> 00:23:42,960 just who is going to own the mistake and that financial 425 00:23:42,960 --> 00:23:45,840 burden. But it does allow us to do that 426 00:23:45,840 --> 00:23:49,960 with like to your question, I wish I had been able to have 427 00:23:49,960 --> 00:23:53,480 more time to learn that so that we could carefully follow the 428 00:23:53,480 --> 00:23:57,440 rules of what FedEx and UPS were wanting us and be able to set up 429 00:23:57,440 --> 00:24:00,240 the software to monitor on a very regular basis. 430 00:24:00,760 --> 00:24:04,680 We've been able to correct that now by having AI and some tools 431 00:24:04,680 --> 00:24:07,400 that one of our other Co founders, Kirsten made that are 432 00:24:07,400 --> 00:24:11,920 trying to make sure to carefully monitor the shipping costs so 433 00:24:11,920 --> 00:24:15,800 that if we're using FedEx or UPS, they have different rules 434 00:24:15,840 --> 00:24:20,240 versus weight versus dimensions so that we're within that so 435 00:24:20,240 --> 00:24:23,120 that we don't end up with a surprise bill, you know, at the 436 00:24:23,120 --> 00:24:24,640 end of the week or 30 days later. 437 00:24:24,920 --> 00:24:26,160 Yeah. And I guess at your level as 438 00:24:26,160 --> 00:24:29,760 well, if you make, I mean, you call it a mistake, but even if 439 00:24:29,760 --> 00:24:33,160 it's just over, if it's underestimated by 5%, you times 440 00:24:33,160 --> 00:24:37,400 that 5% cost underestimation by a few thousand orders. 441 00:24:37,400 --> 00:24:39,480 And suddenly the finance director is knocking on your 442 00:24:39,480 --> 00:24:40,720 door going, Paul, we need to talk. 443 00:24:41,320 --> 00:24:44,120 It's like, what have I done now? It's always that, that kind of 444 00:24:44,120 --> 00:24:45,800 conversation which we need to avoid. 445 00:24:46,280 --> 00:24:47,880 And I think it's so easy though, isn't it? 446 00:24:47,880 --> 00:24:50,840 With Shopify, which is also definitely a blessing, but can 447 00:24:50,840 --> 00:24:53,720 also be a bit of a curse to say that it's so easy just to like 448 00:24:53,720 --> 00:24:56,840 put the FedEx app into Shopify. And if an order comes in and 449 00:24:56,840 --> 00:24:59,800 FedEx goes, great, drop it off to us, which, you know, we'll 450 00:24:59,800 --> 00:25:01,440 get that thing out to the customer. 451 00:25:01,440 --> 00:25:03,880 And what you don't see is there's no one approving all 452 00:25:03,880 --> 00:25:07,320 those individual costs. Say, I've noticed with so many 453 00:25:07,320 --> 00:25:09,800 clients over the years. And we, although we're in front 454 00:25:09,800 --> 00:25:12,280 end customer acquisition, we hear about these things from 455 00:25:12,280 --> 00:25:15,280 clients where they've missed kind of like 1 use case where 456 00:25:15,280 --> 00:25:18,200 it's like this one product's not expensive enough, but it's 457 00:25:18,200 --> 00:25:20,040 heavy, so it doesn't justify the shipping cost. 458 00:25:20,640 --> 00:25:23,480 And it's, it's normally when we turn around and say, Hey, we've 459 00:25:23,480 --> 00:25:26,280 got a new bestseller product ROI on Google's going through the 460 00:25:26,280 --> 00:25:28,000 roof and they're like, stop selling. 461 00:25:28,160 --> 00:25:30,640 They're made of concrete. Like it's so heavy and we don't 462 00:25:30,640 --> 00:25:31,960 make it. It's fine if they order the 463 00:25:31,960 --> 00:25:34,200 products that goes on the fit the concrete, but don't just 464 00:25:34,200 --> 00:25:36,200 sell the concrete. And we're like, oh, we've become 465 00:25:36,200 --> 00:25:38,360 a bit of a niche. And we actually had that with 466 00:25:38,360 --> 00:25:41,200 them concrete bases to Paracel umbrellas for people's gardens 467 00:25:41,200 --> 00:25:42,560 at one point. It's like if they buy an 468 00:25:42,560 --> 00:25:44,320 umbrella, fine. If they don't buy an umbrella, 469 00:25:44,320 --> 00:25:46,680 it costs us more to ship than the product costs. 470 00:25:47,000 --> 00:25:49,680 And it was like, OK, we just put the price up and they did and we 471 00:25:49,680 --> 00:25:51,680 eventually found the right kind of financials in a different 472 00:25:51,680 --> 00:25:53,760 delivery company. But as I say, it's those little 473 00:25:53,760 --> 00:25:55,840 use cases and I'm sure you guys have had this in the over the 474 00:25:55,840 --> 00:25:57,280 years. Those little use cases can 475 00:25:57,280 --> 00:25:59,320 really come back to sting you if you get them wrong, especially 476 00:25:59,320 --> 00:26:02,640 on your level because 1 little mistake becomes 1000 when 1000 477 00:26:02,640 --> 00:26:04,920 orders have gone through. Right. 478 00:26:04,920 --> 00:26:08,280 And related to that is also having worked at a company like 479 00:26:08,280 --> 00:26:13,000 Amazon, everyone expects free shipping, one day, one hour 480 00:26:13,000 --> 00:26:15,280 delivery. You know, it's like, OK, we 481 00:26:15,560 --> 00:26:17,200 can't do that. If you think about it, it's at. 482 00:26:17,240 --> 00:26:19,480 Your front door? Yeah, it's not How? 483 00:26:19,520 --> 00:26:21,520 Like small business offer, you can't just get free. 484 00:26:21,520 --> 00:26:26,080 So we're having to carefully always discuss and re discuss, 485 00:26:26,080 --> 00:26:28,600 analyze what is the correct threshold? 486 00:26:28,600 --> 00:26:31,880 Is it a $20 flat fee? But knowing that we still are 487 00:26:31,880 --> 00:26:35,840 going to eat a certain amount because if the cost is $24.00 to 488 00:26:35,840 --> 00:26:38,040 ship a product, we're eating that $4.00. 489 00:26:38,320 --> 00:26:41,200 Did we then send that message on the website to customers like, 490 00:26:41,200 --> 00:26:45,360 hey, you might think $20 is expensive, but it's actually 491 00:26:45,360 --> 00:26:48,720 costing us $24.00 or we have to think about that. 492 00:26:48,720 --> 00:26:50,240 The customer doesn't care about that. 493 00:26:50,240 --> 00:26:52,480 They're probably thinking that's your problem, not mine. 494 00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:55,920 So I want this when I want it. So those are all things that are 495 00:26:56,600 --> 00:26:59,960 interesting and always a constant battle to discuss. 496 00:27:01,000 --> 00:27:03,280 And it's hard, isn't it? Because I think certainly from 497 00:27:03,280 --> 00:27:05,080 the kind of financials point of view, you're looking at a 498 00:27:05,080 --> 00:27:07,600 spreadsheet and saying, oh, it's too expensive or here's how 499 00:27:07,600 --> 00:27:09,760 we're going to make it work on the financials with product 500 00:27:09,760 --> 00:27:11,560 prices, delivery costs, etcetera, etcetera. 501 00:27:11,960 --> 00:27:14,720 But then there's always some creative genius that comes in 502 00:27:14,720 --> 00:27:16,680 the room at some point and goes, hey, have you tried this 503 00:27:16,680 --> 00:27:18,120 delivery company? And it's like, well, that just 504 00:27:18,120 --> 00:27:20,680 changes everything. So I, I always say you need to 505 00:27:20,680 --> 00:27:22,360 kind of balance, make sure there's the space for the 506 00:27:22,360 --> 00:27:25,120 creativity to find solutions to these creative solutions to 507 00:27:25,120 --> 00:27:28,040 these problems. And the creative solution we've 508 00:27:28,040 --> 00:27:29,920 seen with one client in particular was actually to say, 509 00:27:30,080 --> 00:27:32,480 we're going to put the whole delivery cost on the customer. 510 00:27:32,480 --> 00:27:34,000 We know our competitors don't do that. 511 00:27:34,000 --> 00:27:36,320 It gives us a competitive like disadvantage. 512 00:27:36,680 --> 00:27:39,240 But the, the reason that they did that, although the way they 513 00:27:39,240 --> 00:27:42,040 counted that was creative creatively to say, do you know 514 00:27:42,040 --> 00:27:43,760 what? You don't want the delivery cost 515 00:27:43,760 --> 00:27:45,840 to be cheap. As you say, you need this 516 00:27:45,840 --> 00:27:48,720 product to be refrigerated on its transit and it needs to 517 00:27:48,720 --> 00:27:52,160 arrive refrigerated, which means we're not going to leave it on 518 00:27:52,160 --> 00:27:54,760 your doorstep in the middle of summer while you're not there. 519 00:27:54,800 --> 00:27:56,840 And it will just, everything will just apart and it'll be a 520 00:27:56,840 --> 00:27:59,680 disaster. And, and, and also sort of the 521 00:27:59,680 --> 00:28:01,640 laws are in the US, but you're liable, you know, like we're 522 00:28:01,640 --> 00:28:03,640 still liable. It's all these kind of things, I 523 00:28:03,640 --> 00:28:05,720 think actually explaining stuff like that or having like a 524 00:28:05,720 --> 00:28:08,280 booked delivery slot. If it's a large furniture item, 525 00:28:08,560 --> 00:28:11,400 like we've got one client that they offer free delivery on 526 00:28:11,400 --> 00:28:13,960 their sofas, They offer premium delivery where you know, it's 527 00:28:13,960 --> 00:28:15,880 going to be a morning or an afternoon and then they offer 528 00:28:15,880 --> 00:28:18,400 like a one hour slot delivery. And we've actually found by 529 00:28:18,400 --> 00:28:20,800 changing the design of it, the one hour slot delivery has 530 00:28:20,800 --> 00:28:23,720 become the most popular, even though it costs another £100. 531 00:28:24,320 --> 00:28:26,320 But the sofa itself would cost over 1000. 532 00:28:26,360 --> 00:28:29,800 So you're adding 1015 percent, 1010% or less. 533 00:28:29,800 --> 00:28:32,480 Sorry to the cost, but you know, you've got that. 534 00:28:32,960 --> 00:28:35,800 Zach, how much do you then have to work or get involved yourself 535 00:28:35,800 --> 00:28:37,880 in marketing? Because you're the one that's 536 00:28:37,880 --> 00:28:40,560 come up with the the integration or the spreadsheet that says we 537 00:28:40,560 --> 00:28:42,600 can, we can do this effectively and we can do this efficiently 538 00:28:42,600 --> 00:28:44,120 from a cost analysis point of view. 539 00:28:45,160 --> 00:28:49,840 Oh, so that's a great question because we're a small company. 540 00:28:50,280 --> 00:28:54,040 It's really only about 15 or less of us that I would consider 541 00:28:54,040 --> 00:28:56,320 like the corporate team, which is kind of weird saying that 542 00:28:56,320 --> 00:28:59,960 coming from Amazon, the core of us that do all the work like 543 00:29:00,400 --> 00:29:03,680 that are not that probably came out the wrong way. 544 00:29:03,680 --> 00:29:06,320 But the folks that are in the production kitchen or working at 545 00:29:06,320 --> 00:29:10,240 the restaurants or in the fulfillment center are doing 546 00:29:10,240 --> 00:29:13,080 their respective roles. But the rest of us that are the 547 00:29:13,080 --> 00:29:18,800 two Co founders are marketing lead customer service, those we 548 00:29:18,800 --> 00:29:20,440 all get together to make those decisions. 549 00:29:20,440 --> 00:29:25,840 Because to your question, I'm seeing it from the tech stack. 550 00:29:26,080 --> 00:29:28,720 Our marketing person is seeing it from the messaging to the 551 00:29:28,720 --> 00:29:32,000 customer because nervously it has to think about like, I got 552 00:29:32,000 --> 00:29:34,320 to be ready for all the response, the emails that come 553 00:29:34,320 --> 00:29:36,760 in from all of the dumb things you didn't think about. 554 00:29:36,760 --> 00:29:42,080 I don't know founder who handles the APR he's looking at like OK, 555 00:29:42,160 --> 00:29:46,000 well that's going to cost us this amount and by our other Co. 556 00:29:46,040 --> 00:29:48,400 So we all have our different lens and how we that's really 557 00:29:48,400 --> 00:29:52,120 cool, really helps so that we're trying to look around the 558 00:29:52,120 --> 00:29:54,760 corners as much as possible and I. 559 00:29:54,800 --> 00:29:57,040 I find this so much and we talk about, there's a couple of other 560 00:29:57,040 --> 00:29:58,360 questions I want to. So it's very inside. 561 00:29:58,360 --> 00:30:01,000 But just just to add this, I, I find that from a marketing 562 00:30:01,000 --> 00:30:04,440 content point of view, people like the CTO, the customer 563 00:30:04,440 --> 00:30:08,000 service team are vital. And I'd say even more in the B 564 00:30:08,000 --> 00:30:10,480 to B kind of lead generation world than e-commerce like we're 565 00:30:10,480 --> 00:30:13,800 talking about today. But in B to B, we find that we 566 00:30:13,800 --> 00:30:17,600 often say like, get us your best salesperson and show us just in 567 00:30:17,600 --> 00:30:19,760 a minute per pitch. Just whip us through the slide 568 00:30:19,760 --> 00:30:22,200 deck and the, and just a quick analysis of the conversation you 569 00:30:22,200 --> 00:30:25,920 had for your best 3 corporate companies or deals you signed 570 00:30:25,920 --> 00:30:28,000 recently. And half the stuff they talk 571 00:30:28,000 --> 00:30:30,720 about, not on the website, not in the ads nobody knew about. 572 00:30:31,000 --> 00:30:33,080 And it's like, well, that's the reason people bought from you. 573 00:30:33,080 --> 00:30:35,160 Let's get them to the forefront because that, that's the real 574 00:30:35,160 --> 00:30:36,720 thing that made people tick. Because you're the guy who's 575 00:30:36,720 --> 00:30:39,040 been, you know, the woman who's been standing in front of people 576 00:30:39,040 --> 00:30:41,560 and, and shaking the hand at the end of that conversation. 577 00:30:41,720 --> 00:30:43,880 It's exactly the same in e-commerce for customer service. 578 00:30:44,240 --> 00:30:46,640 You made me laugh. Just say you say the things we 579 00:30:46,640 --> 00:30:48,920 did that are causing problems. I've had a few emails from 580 00:30:48,920 --> 00:30:51,080 customer service teams saying like, you're our marketing 581 00:30:51,080 --> 00:30:52,360 agency. Why have you got this on the 582 00:30:52,360 --> 00:30:53,280 ads? And we're like, well, it's on 583 00:30:53,280 --> 00:30:54,760 the website. Why is it on the website? 584 00:30:55,080 --> 00:30:57,480 It's only this investigation begins of like and it. 585 00:30:57,720 --> 00:30:59,080 Yeah. And there's a whole world of 586 00:30:59,080 --> 00:31:01,240 outcomes that come from that. But I love, I love the way you 587 00:31:01,520 --> 00:31:02,160 describe. Actually. 588 00:31:02,160 --> 00:31:04,200 We sit down and talk about things, guys, we're going to 589 00:31:04,200 --> 00:31:05,400 change this. What does that mean for you? 590 00:31:05,400 --> 00:31:07,600 For you, for you? And almost a space where each 591 00:31:07,600 --> 00:31:10,040 person, each team, each department can bring ideas and 592 00:31:10,040 --> 00:31:12,520 say at customer service, we get a lot of questions about this. 593 00:31:12,520 --> 00:31:14,120 Could we put something on the website to stop that? 594 00:31:14,320 --> 00:31:15,520 That becomes a marketing campaign. 595 00:31:15,520 --> 00:31:17,440 You think of a bit the tech actually that could solve that 596 00:31:17,440 --> 00:31:19,600 problem for customers. It might be that they're asking 597 00:31:19,600 --> 00:31:21,440 about delivery times and we should put something on the 598 00:31:21,440 --> 00:31:24,040 website about it. You can change the SMS messages 599 00:31:24,040 --> 00:31:26,600 that go out and this whole conveyor belt of things can come 600 00:31:26,600 --> 00:31:29,360 along to fix that use case. And ultimately it means you get 601 00:31:29,360 --> 00:31:31,320 more attention from your customers, you get more sales. 602 00:31:32,160 --> 00:31:34,520 But some good things must come out of that when you're then 603 00:31:34,520 --> 00:31:36,240 looking forward with these ideas. 604 00:31:36,640 --> 00:31:39,000 So the question I really want to ask you is looking forward what, 605 00:31:39,000 --> 00:31:41,000 what are some of the things in the e-commerce world and also 606 00:31:41,000 --> 00:31:44,120 within Rebel GS that you, you specifically, as well as the 607 00:31:44,120 --> 00:31:47,640 company are really excited about looking forward in? 608 00:31:47,640 --> 00:31:50,760 What if you read the news in the UK or the USA right now, it's 609 00:31:50,760 --> 00:31:53,000 all looking a bit bleak. Like, tell us some of the stuff 610 00:31:53,000 --> 00:31:54,120 you're excited about at the moment. 611 00:31:54,440 --> 00:31:59,320 Looking forwards. So it's a looking forward, I 612 00:31:59,360 --> 00:32:01,840 mean kind of the looking forward, but right in front of 613 00:32:01,840 --> 00:32:05,120 us right now is tariffs, tariffs to us or what's this world going 614 00:32:05,120 --> 00:32:06,840 to be? But I think it's going to give 615 00:32:06,840 --> 00:32:11,000 us a good exercise, small businesses, large businesses to 616 00:32:11,000 --> 00:32:15,560 have a Plan B and a plan C. So if your supply chain has 617 00:32:15,560 --> 00:32:19,480 traditionally been like we get this set of ingredients from 618 00:32:19,840 --> 00:32:23,120 this country in Southeast Asia and then these from Latin 619 00:32:23,120 --> 00:32:25,040 America, Do you have a backup plan? 620 00:32:25,560 --> 00:32:27,880 And that's easier said than done because for small businesses, 621 00:32:27,920 --> 00:32:31,240 no, we don't because it's money like we. 622 00:32:31,440 --> 00:32:36,040 So that's going to give us all a chance to sit down and think we 623 00:32:36,040 --> 00:32:39,880 need to have a plan B&C. So when any kind of shifts 624 00:32:39,880 --> 00:32:43,320 happen in the world, we're ready for that as well. 625 00:32:43,520 --> 00:32:46,120 And not just from the supply chain, but what's the messaging? 626 00:32:46,360 --> 00:32:49,840 Because if you rely on your products being organic or like 627 00:32:49,840 --> 00:32:52,320 you were saying earlier about the tea company with the 628 00:32:52,320 --> 00:32:56,320 plastic, you might need to also pivot when your product 629 00:32:56,960 --> 00:33:00,240 ingredients or whatever changes that might change some of the 630 00:33:00,240 --> 00:33:02,920 messaging to customers. And as you have to get ahead of 631 00:33:02,920 --> 00:33:05,240 that. Another one that's, I mean it's 632 00:33:05,240 --> 00:33:07,960 kind of tiresome right now for folks is AI. 633 00:33:08,720 --> 00:33:11,280 We are looking at AI all over the place. 634 00:33:11,280 --> 00:33:14,600 I mean me specifically because I'm the tech person in the team. 635 00:33:15,400 --> 00:33:17,160 You must know. About AI, surely that's there. 636 00:33:17,160 --> 00:33:20,280 That's probably what people say to you quite a lot, what I've 637 00:33:20,280 --> 00:33:22,320 been doing. With Polar Analytics, which is a 638 00:33:22,320 --> 00:33:27,920 fantastic tool to gather all the metrics is I've also been I hope 639 00:33:27,920 --> 00:33:31,720 no one, none of the polar people are on her condition, but you're 640 00:33:31,720 --> 00:33:33,720 safe, don't worry. I think we're both considering. 641 00:33:33,720 --> 00:33:36,560 What they do so I can see because again they need to make 642 00:33:36,560 --> 00:33:41,840 money, but it's a very expensive analytics, it's a software So 643 00:33:41,840 --> 00:33:48,280 now with apps, no code apps like Replit and I was able to build 644 00:33:48,280 --> 00:33:51,120 essentially my version of a Control Center. 645 00:33:51,160 --> 00:33:54,160 I need a better name for it. Trying to think of like what is 646 00:33:54,200 --> 00:33:58,800 a TARDIS or, you know, Jarvis or something, but I built a Control 647 00:33:58,800 --> 00:34:01,960 Center that will essentially pull in all of the metrics 648 00:34:01,960 --> 00:34:05,480 reports that I need from Shopify, Shipstation, gorgeous 649 00:34:06,320 --> 00:34:10,199 rebuy, judge me for reviews so that we can see all in one 650 00:34:10,199 --> 00:34:14,520 place, a Clavio, all of those metrics, those reports and how 651 00:34:14,520 --> 00:34:18,520 they interact with each other. And I would say a year ago 652 00:34:18,719 --> 00:34:22,679 having a no code app like something like Replit would have 653 00:34:22,679 --> 00:34:25,400 just been clunky and impossible to use. 654 00:34:25,719 --> 00:34:29,520 But now within about 5 weeks, I was able to build something 655 00:34:29,520 --> 00:34:33,040 that's actually very usable and is I can see, you know, month to 656 00:34:33,040 --> 00:34:35,480 month is going to get even easier and better to use. 657 00:34:35,840 --> 00:34:39,679 So that's something I think it doesn't matter how big or small 658 00:34:39,679 --> 00:34:44,280 your company is and how if you're in food, clothing, tea, 659 00:34:44,600 --> 00:34:48,040 whatever it is, AI is going to be a part of our lives. 660 00:34:48,040 --> 00:34:51,560 Just like smartphones, the Internet, cloud services, you 661 00:34:51,560 --> 00:34:53,880 know, electricity. It's going to be something that 662 00:34:54,000 --> 00:34:56,400 no, like, why wouldn't this have AI? 663 00:34:56,400 --> 00:34:59,200 We're not even going to be talking about it as a thing in 664 00:34:59,200 --> 00:35:01,400 the next few months to a year. It's just going to be part of 665 00:35:01,400 --> 00:35:03,800 every piece of software that is just going to help you. 666 00:35:04,240 --> 00:35:06,680 And that's just something we have to really get used to using 667 00:35:06,680 --> 00:35:10,200 and feel comfortable with it or hire somebody that is capable 668 00:35:10,200 --> 00:35:12,520 with it from day one. Yeah, absolutely. 669 00:35:12,520 --> 00:35:15,800 And just to say on AI, if this is going to be a selfless, a 670 00:35:16,080 --> 00:35:19,640 selfish plug and I'm doing a selflessly growth hub guys is 671 00:35:19,640 --> 00:35:20,720 our community. It's completely free. 672 00:35:20,720 --> 00:35:23,360 If you want to join anybody, go and check out the growth hub. 673 00:35:23,400 --> 00:35:25,520 And it might have just happened, but we're probably going to do a 674 00:35:25,520 --> 00:35:27,880 few on them. And we did an e-mail one about 675 00:35:27,880 --> 00:35:30,200 e-mail content just before I recorded this episode with Paul 676 00:35:30,200 --> 00:35:33,080 where I'm sitting right now. We would have done one on AI, I 677 00:35:33,080 --> 00:35:35,280 think, before this episode's gone out, but we're going to do 678 00:35:35,280 --> 00:35:37,080 a few more. They're completely free round 679 00:35:37,080 --> 00:35:38,520 tables. They're on Google meets you just 680 00:35:38,640 --> 00:35:40,680 come along. I'm the only non brand there. 681 00:35:40,920 --> 00:35:43,600 And as soon as the brands are talking, I just kind of go quiet 682 00:35:43,600 --> 00:35:45,560 or I instigate conversation if, if needs be. 683 00:35:45,560 --> 00:35:48,400 But it's the opportunity to talk about AI and something we did on 684 00:35:48,400 --> 00:35:50,360 the e-mail one as we started discussing some of the AI tools 685 00:35:50,360 --> 00:35:51,880 people are using and how they're using them. 686 00:35:52,360 --> 00:35:54,040 And Tara, you deserve a shout out. 687 00:35:54,040 --> 00:35:56,360 Tara, you've been such a core part of the community since 688 00:35:56,360 --> 00:35:59,840 before we launched it. Tara mentioned, and I'll leave 689 00:35:59,840 --> 00:36:02,920 it with Tara to, to kind of talk about it in the in the chats on 690 00:36:02,920 --> 00:36:04,640 there. But Tara mentioned she's now got 691 00:36:04,640 --> 00:36:06,440 an e-mail she can send or an e-mail address. 692 00:36:06,440 --> 00:36:08,720 She can send an e-mail to you saying discount this brand and 693 00:36:08,720 --> 00:36:12,560 on my site by 10% and it goes to ChatGPT and it goes through to a 694 00:36:12,560 --> 00:36:14,600 Shopify store and everything starts discounting, which is 695 00:36:14,600 --> 00:36:17,320 absolutely incredible. And it's just amazing seeing 696 00:36:17,320 --> 00:36:20,480 these use cases of how people are using AI and, and starting 697 00:36:20,480 --> 00:36:22,240 to bring it together. I think it's still, it's 698 00:36:22,480 --> 00:36:24,520 certainly not going to replace William Shakespeare in the near 699 00:36:24,520 --> 00:36:27,520 future, but it is starting to do certainly those like Domino 700 00:36:27,560 --> 00:36:29,680 effect where you're like, I just want to tell it one thing and 701 00:36:29,680 --> 00:36:32,200 have it do all of this or here's tons of data. 702 00:36:32,680 --> 00:36:35,440 Tell me based on all this data, tell me what product I should 703 00:36:35,440 --> 00:36:36,880 put in my homepage banner right now. 704 00:36:36,880 --> 00:36:39,640 What's the best selling product based on my inventory levels, 705 00:36:39,640 --> 00:36:42,400 current sales trajectory, stock that's coming in. 706 00:36:42,400 --> 00:36:44,840 And it can do that in real time. It can do it very quickly. 707 00:36:44,840 --> 00:36:46,360 And then you can go and check it yourself. 708 00:36:46,360 --> 00:36:48,760 And it's easier to go and check what it's come up with and find 709 00:36:48,760 --> 00:36:50,760 the find the answer yourselves, which I think is amazing. 710 00:36:52,200 --> 00:36:54,040 Last question then Paul. So we're going to finish on 711 00:36:54,040 --> 00:36:55,920 this. Just having a quick glance at 712 00:36:55,920 --> 00:36:59,400 the time, what are some exciting new features and launches that 713 00:36:59,400 --> 00:37:01,680 we should keep an eye out specifically from Rebel Cheese 714 00:37:01,680 --> 00:37:03,400 coming up in the in the near future? 715 00:37:04,560 --> 00:37:09,960 Oh. So I would say one thing is 716 00:37:10,920 --> 00:37:15,440 hopefully if things go well, we would like to open a. 717 00:37:16,080 --> 00:37:19,800 So we consider Austin, TX our home, our main distribution 718 00:37:19,800 --> 00:37:21,520 center. We make all the products here. 719 00:37:21,760 --> 00:37:23,440 We're fulfilling and shipping from here. 720 00:37:23,440 --> 00:37:27,840 Again, like I said, we own the entire vertical stack, but we do 721 00:37:27,840 --> 00:37:31,480 realize that to get broad reach across the US for customer 722 00:37:31,480 --> 00:37:36,120 experience and controlling costs, we have plans to open a 723 00:37:36,120 --> 00:37:38,880 second distribution center on the East Coast of the US, 724 00:37:38,880 --> 00:37:40,880 hopefully second-half of this year. 725 00:37:41,280 --> 00:37:46,160 And then if that goes well, maybe in 26, open another 726 00:37:46,440 --> 00:37:48,200 distribution center along the West Coast. 727 00:37:48,520 --> 00:37:51,240 And the plan for that would be by having the three distribution 728 00:37:51,240 --> 00:37:55,000 centers, Austin, what East Coast and West Coast, it'll allow us 729 00:37:55,000 --> 00:37:59,720 to do ground delivery within one day, which will really 730 00:37:59,720 --> 00:38:03,800 dramatically just decrease the cost of shipping And all those 731 00:38:03,800 --> 00:38:05,280 materials that I talked about earlier. 732 00:38:05,880 --> 00:38:11,040 And we were shipping to Canada as a test because we got a lot 733 00:38:11,040 --> 00:38:15,080 of emails from customers in Canada about the lack of good 734 00:38:15,080 --> 00:38:18,840 quality plant based cheese products worked really well and 735 00:38:18,920 --> 00:38:22,560 we had temporarily paused them because of the tariffs. 736 00:38:22,560 --> 00:38:26,120 We would like to turn it back on and they they've been a very, 737 00:38:26,120 --> 00:38:30,040 very loyal set of customers. And with that in just a little 738 00:38:30,040 --> 00:38:33,520 bit, I'm going to be talking for to a representative from Mexico. 739 00:38:33,520 --> 00:38:38,800 And he has about 25 grocery stores that he said Mexico is 740 00:38:38,800 --> 00:38:42,440 also very plant based, very vegetarian culture and would 741 00:38:42,440 --> 00:38:45,440 really, really love to have our products in. 742 00:38:45,560 --> 00:38:48,000 And he's help, he's going, he's willing to help us get into 743 00:38:48,000 --> 00:38:51,520 Mexico. And lastly, if all goes well 744 00:38:51,520 --> 00:38:53,960 with our distribution plan, we would love to be in the UK. 745 00:38:53,960 --> 00:38:56,600 Our one of our Co founders Kirsten is we would love that 746 00:38:56,600 --> 00:38:58,080 too. Oh, is she brilliant. 747 00:38:58,120 --> 00:38:59,000 Love that. Absolutely. 748 00:38:59,000 --> 00:39:00,680 We're a tiny island. But yeah, we'd love to have 749 00:39:00,680 --> 00:39:01,760 Rebel Cheese here. Definitely. 750 00:39:01,960 --> 00:39:04,240 We've been sending some. Test packages and they make it 751 00:39:04,240 --> 00:39:06,600 safely across the pond. So we would love to be able to 752 00:39:07,360 --> 00:39:09,960 open up and distribute to the UK first. 753 00:39:09,960 --> 00:39:12,880 And then we have some very loyal German and Swiss. 754 00:39:13,200 --> 00:39:15,640 Swiss is very surprising, but very, very loyal. 755 00:39:15,640 --> 00:39:18,440 Swiss Swiss cheese. Is a really big thing, really 756 00:39:18,440 --> 00:39:19,600 big thing here in Europe yeah, yeah. 757 00:39:20,040 --> 00:39:23,240 And I guess the. Last thing is we have been 758 00:39:23,240 --> 00:39:26,600 working really hard to get everything kosher and hopefully 759 00:39:26,600 --> 00:39:29,320 in the next week or two we'll have our kosher certification, 760 00:39:29,320 --> 00:39:35,240 which for those of you that are not in food CPG brands, the 761 00:39:35,240 --> 00:39:40,360 kosher community is, is very, very, very loyal to their 762 00:39:40,360 --> 00:39:43,440 products because they look for those symbols that define that. 763 00:39:43,440 --> 00:39:47,640 The brand has gone through very strict, very regimented analysis 764 00:39:47,640 --> 00:39:50,880 to determine that all the ingredients that go into your 765 00:39:50,880 --> 00:39:55,000 brand are also kosher. So that's one thing, the loyalty 766 00:39:55,000 --> 00:39:57,360 of the kosher community, those who practice the kosher 767 00:39:57,360 --> 00:39:59,400 lifestyle. The other thing that I learned 768 00:39:59,720 --> 00:40:06,600 in having to do this myself was that people who live in kosher 769 00:40:06,600 --> 00:40:08,720 neighborhoods. That they themselves are not 770 00:40:08,720 --> 00:40:13,240 kosher, have grown up thinking and believing that the kosher 771 00:40:13,240 --> 00:40:16,360 symbol is a sign of good health because of those strict 772 00:40:16,360 --> 00:40:20,080 regimented process to get your product kosher. 773 00:40:20,080 --> 00:40:23,440 So it actually is served as a health indicator for a lot of 774 00:40:23,440 --> 00:40:26,040 brands because of that rigorous testing. 775 00:40:26,040 --> 00:40:29,680 And so that's going to really help unlock a lot of the 776 00:40:29,680 --> 00:40:32,800 communities along the East Coast of the US and Houston. 777 00:40:33,880 --> 00:40:35,440 So that we're very excited about that. 778 00:40:36,320 --> 00:40:38,160 I think there was a. Similar thing actually with and 779 00:40:38,160 --> 00:40:40,920 it's quite amusing looking back now, but it was fair trade and I 780 00:40:40,920 --> 00:40:42,840 remember someone when it kind of clocks. 781 00:40:42,840 --> 00:40:44,560 I used to think that, oh, fair trade must be really healthy 782 00:40:44,560 --> 00:40:47,480 because it's fairly traded less pesticides and other stuff. 783 00:40:47,840 --> 00:40:49,960 And then it really came to a head when someone said, you 784 00:40:49,960 --> 00:40:52,360 know, Cadbury's chocolate, that's that's fair trade. 785 00:40:52,360 --> 00:40:54,360 It must be healthy. I was like, it can't be it's 786 00:40:54,360 --> 00:40:57,680 chocolate cannot be healthy. Like, I mean it, maybe it could 787 00:40:57,680 --> 00:40:59,320 have this day and age, but certainly five years ago, it's 788 00:40:59,320 --> 00:41:02,240 like it can't be another sense of it's fairly traded, not 789 00:41:02,240 --> 00:41:05,320 healthy food, but I think kosher absolutely is because it's 790 00:41:05,560 --> 00:41:08,760 probably very similar to what I've forgotten the name of the 791 00:41:08,760 --> 00:41:11,360 diet now, the sugar free diet that a lot of people do. 792 00:41:12,920 --> 00:41:14,600 I can't remember now. I mean, it's like carb free, 793 00:41:14,600 --> 00:41:17,760 sugar free keto, keto diet, that's it. 794 00:41:17,760 --> 00:41:20,120 So there's things like the keto diet where naturally it's you're 795 00:41:20,120 --> 00:41:24,000 cutting out things that we know are bad for our bodies, which is 796 00:41:24,000 --> 00:41:26,760 really exciting. But I mean, it's such an amazing 797 00:41:26,760 --> 00:41:29,000 journey you guys are on. I say this is some I guess we're 798 00:41:29,000 --> 00:41:31,080 going to try and get you back in a year if you're around, Paul, I 799 00:41:31,080 --> 00:41:33,440 appreciate your Diaries getting more and more busy as time goes 800 00:41:33,440 --> 00:41:35,640 on, but we'll try and get you back in a year and see if you've 801 00:41:35,640 --> 00:41:36,880 opened this distribution centres. 802 00:41:37,120 --> 00:41:39,040 Plenty of brands we've worked over the years have done that. 803 00:41:39,480 --> 00:41:42,240 One in particular up in Washington state, they opened up 804 00:41:42,240 --> 00:41:43,760 on the, they were going to go East Coast. 805 00:41:43,760 --> 00:41:46,600 They did it in Texas instead. And now the delivery costs have 806 00:41:46,600 --> 00:41:49,200 been just dramatically dropped. I always imagine the US is in a 807 00:41:49,200 --> 00:41:50,960 massive V, isn't it? It's kind of like you've got the 808 00:41:50,960 --> 00:41:52,480 coast down as Texas back up the other coast. 809 00:41:52,480 --> 00:41:54,320 So no one wants to live in the desert. 810 00:41:55,080 --> 00:41:57,080 Well, some people do in the middle in the Midwest. 811 00:41:57,560 --> 00:41:59,280 But Paul, I mean, thank you so much for your time. 812 00:41:59,280 --> 00:42:01,200 I really appreciate you. Obviously, very, very busy 813 00:42:01,200 --> 00:42:03,160 individual, amazing career so far. 814 00:42:03,160 --> 00:42:05,000 And it feels like it's only just getting started in the shop fire 815 00:42:05,000 --> 00:42:06,080 world. So thank you so much for your 816 00:42:06,080 --> 00:42:07,720 time and thanks for all the insights you shared with us 817 00:42:07,720 --> 00:42:09,760 today. Well, thank you so much. 818 00:42:09,760 --> 00:42:12,720 Nick, this has been amazing and yeah, definitely love to come 819 00:42:12,720 --> 00:42:15,600 back in a year and that's going to put a light of fire under our 820 00:42:16,240 --> 00:42:17,920 butts to make sure. Yeah, we're going to have to 821 00:42:17,920 --> 00:42:19,200 open the. Distribution center I'm going to 822 00:42:19,200 --> 00:42:22,040 be really disappointed now otherwise now I hope it all goes 823 00:42:22,040 --> 00:42:23,880 really, really well. And so yeah, if everyone tuning 824 00:42:23,880 --> 00:42:26,560 in at home, if you want to reach out to Paul and Paul, what is 825 00:42:26,800 --> 00:42:28,640 what's the website? How can people find out about 826 00:42:28,640 --> 00:42:30,400 Rebel Cheese? So so. 827 00:42:30,920 --> 00:42:36,680 We are rebelcheese.com, so Rebel Cheese oneword.com, easy URL and 828 00:42:36,680 --> 00:42:39,640 my e-mail is paul@rebelcheese.com. 829 00:42:39,640 --> 00:42:42,720 You can reach me via e-mail. You can search for me on 830 00:42:42,720 --> 00:42:45,560 LinkedIn. I'm happy to answer any 831 00:42:45,560 --> 00:42:47,080 questions. I can tell you things, my 832 00:42:47,080 --> 00:42:49,080 mistakes. I don't know if I've had this 833 00:42:49,160 --> 00:42:52,600 done, but I can definitely tell you the mistakes I've made, so I 834 00:42:52,600 --> 00:42:53,080 love that. Well, you've. 835 00:42:53,080 --> 00:42:55,000 Definitely done something really well to help bring the company 836 00:42:55,000 --> 00:42:56,880 to where it's today. So, yeah, appreciate your time 837 00:42:56,880 --> 00:42:58,720 And so, and definitely reach out to Paul if you do have any 838 00:42:58,720 --> 00:43:00,400 questions, especially about any of the apps we've mentioned 839 00:43:00,400 --> 00:43:01,680 today. And I think one thing that's 840 00:43:01,680 --> 00:43:04,360 really powerful as well that, that that's probably worth 841 00:43:04,360 --> 00:43:06,920 asking, asking you, Paul from, from anyone is if you're 842 00:43:06,920 --> 00:43:09,360 thinking of using any of the apps or the tools that we've 843 00:43:09,360 --> 00:43:12,120 spoken about today. Paul isn't doesn't strike me as 844 00:43:12,120 --> 00:43:14,320 someone who's just kind of added it and left it alone. 845 00:43:14,320 --> 00:43:17,000 You know, Paul's the CTO, so he's had to test the tech, make 846 00:43:17,000 --> 00:43:18,760 it integrate, probably found some holes and bugs. 847 00:43:18,760 --> 00:43:21,440 And as you say, nobody made some mistakes which have led to using 848 00:43:21,440 --> 00:43:23,520 it better in the in the in the and end result anyway. 849 00:43:23,520 --> 00:43:26,000 So I'm definitely utilize that. Guys, if you haven't already, I 850 00:43:26,000 --> 00:43:28,320 mentioned the start, please hit the subscribe button, leave us a 851 00:43:28,320 --> 00:43:30,400 review on whatever platform you're listening to this on. 852 00:43:30,600 --> 00:43:31,760 Check out the growth hub as well. 853 00:43:31,760 --> 00:43:33,480 And you come and chat some amazing brands that we've got in 854 00:43:33,480 --> 00:43:35,360 there as well. And we hope you can join us 855 00:43:35,360 --> 00:43:37,000 again next week. Thank you for tuning in.