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This is epicenter episode 485. 
If guests Jesse Pollock 

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Welcome to epicenter to show it 
talks about the Technologies 

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projects and people driving 
decentralization and the 

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blockchain revolution. 
I'm Brian train. 

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And I'm today here with 
Frederick are announced and 

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we're going to speak with Jesse 
Pollock. 

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He is the head of protocols and 
the base. 

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Contributor number one base, 
being the new roll up based on 

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optimism that That coin basis 
launching. 

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So really excited to have him on
and just before we get started I

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would like to tell you about our
sponsor this week. 

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So response to this week is 
Omni, which is a fantastic, 

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multi-chain, mobile wallets the 
support 25 protocols that you 

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can. 
So you can manage all your 

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assets in one place. 
And what's really cool about 

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omni's, what you can do inside 
the wallet. 

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If you want to get yield, then 
they allow you to get the best. 

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A pi AP wife, he's in a few 
Taps. 

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If you want to swap then, 
Aggregate, which has an index. 

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So you can do that for me in 
there, if you like any of these,

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they also have really Broad and 
if he support so you can collect

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manage your nft, the cross 
chains in one place. 

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So it's really the easiest way 
to use web. 

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Three is fully self custodial. 
I means you don't have to trust 

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anyone with your assets, except 
yourself, and it also has led to

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support. 
So give it a try at, Omni dot 

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app. 
So if that's Jesse, thanks so 

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much for being on the show. 
Thanks for having me all I love 

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epicenter, longtime listener, 
huge fan. 

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Yeah, I do. 
I like what you said before that

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you've liked probably listen to 
like all the episode that's 

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pretty amazing, and I think 
you've done that. 

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I've been listening for like 
four years, five years, however,

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long it's been going, we should 
give out NF. 

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T is for people who've actually 
listened to, at least, like 95% 

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of the episodes because I don't 
think that has all that many of 

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those. 
It's almost it's almost 500 

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episodes. 
So, Oh, it's a it's a lot of 

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episode. 
This thing I run three or four 

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times a week and if there's new 
episode epicenter episode, I 

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listen to it. 
Cool, cool. 

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Now we're going to have this be 
a whole quiz about my knowledge 

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about the center. 
This is exactly, who knows? 

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Maybe we'll just trust you. 
So yeah, let's get started. 

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I mean, Maybe before we get into
base, I was wondering if you can

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talk a little bit about this 
role of like head of protocols. 

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Like how did that come about? 
And like what is sort of you 

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roll been within cone base Yeah,
I better coinbase for six years 

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at this point about it. 
I guess I'm about to hit my 

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six-year anniversary. 
I joined at the beginning of 

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2017. 
After having started, a company 

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that worked with crypto 
companies back in 2013. 

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And the first four and a half 
years at coinbase. 

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I supported all the teams that 
build our consumer facing 

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products on the engineering side
so coinbase, coinbase Proclaim, 

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his wallet. 
I joined when those teams were 

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really small, you know, a 
handful of people and then 

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helped grow them too. 
A couple hundred people. 

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And then in the middle of 2021, 
I took a step back from that 

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role and stepped into a new role
at coinbase, which is the role 

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I'm in today, which didn't have 
a name at first and kind of had 

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a singular Mission. 
It was me and a really small 

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group of people, and our mission
was basically figure out. 

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How do we bring coinbase on 
chain as business? 

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Now, what does that actually 
mean? 

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If you think about coinbase, it 
was started in 2012. 

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The time you could just buy 
Bitcoin there. 

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Smart contracts, there's no kind
of unchain economy. 

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Eventually we had to support for
buying etherium like coined a 

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bunch of other assets and then 
really in the last few years 

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with things like USB C and 
coinbase wallet and CBE. 

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We started to have more what I 
would call natively on chain 

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products which are products that
are written as smart contracts 

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or interact directly with smart 
contracts and give our users, 

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whether they're individuals or 
businesses or developers access 

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to the kind of the full Power of
this platform that's emerging. 

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But those products are still a 
very small percentage of our 

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overall business. 
The vast majority of video, the 

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users, the activity, the assets 
are still in custodial, 

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centralized systems. 
And so for the last, you know, 

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almost two years I've been 
working inside, you know, this, 

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I think 3500 person Fortune, 
500, public company, trying to 

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figure out. 
How do we change that? 

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How do we go from having? 
90% off chain 10% on chain to 

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having 100% on chain, over the 
The next few years, and that's 

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been a Wandering Journey, a lot 
of learning a lot of failures 

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and out the other side of that 
came base, which we think is 

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going to be a really powerful 
platform, both for coinbase. 

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But also for the broader world 
to come onto the on chain 

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platform and start building, 
really useful things that 

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billions of users want to use. 
So, kind base is famously, a 

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publicly listed company, which 
means you have fiduciary duties 

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to your shareholders, right? 
So, what's the high level 

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business case behind introducing
base and bringing coin based on 

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Shane because basically kind of 
just justifying that with 

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ideology isn't enough, left for 
shareholders. 

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Right, you have to, you have to 
have a business case. 

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Yeah. 
Yeah. 

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And if you look at what 
coinbase, what's made coin basis

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business over the last 10 years.
I think what you'll see is that 

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we've made money by making it 
easy for users to interact with 

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an access crypto and for the 
longest time, the thing that 

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uses have wanted to do in crypto
is trade they want to speculate 

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and so we've made money by 
making it really easy for them 

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to buy crypto. 
So crypto hold crypto. 

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Do that in a secure way. 
That's trusted with easy 

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interface. 
But I think from the beginning 

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and you know, this is pretty 
well laid out. 

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In Brian Armstrong, our CEOs 
secret master plan for coinbase,

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which you run 2016, their vision
for coinbase is to bring about 

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an open crypto economy. 
Where there are millions of daps

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that billions of people are 
using that are not just trading,

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not just speculative but are 
actually things people have to 

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use on the day-to-day life to go
about the things they care 

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about. 
And I think our thesis is that 

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if we can accelerate the number 
and quality of those 

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applications, then there will be
tons of opportunity for coinbase

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to continue building easy-to-use
interfaces that are trusted for 

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our users to use those 
applications and we'll be able 

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to make money off of that 
because users will be able to 

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continue. 
You know, users will be excited 

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about paying for the privilege, 
we're paying for the access that

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claim mates will provide as kind
of a gateway to web. 

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Ri right gateway to the on chain
economy. 

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And we're, you know, we're 
already starting to see this in,

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you know, for instance and 
coinbase wallet, we have a swap 

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function there that works a lot.
Like the the swap function or 

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trade functioning coinbase.com 
but it's powered by 

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decentralized, protocols, 
powered by u0x and you know swap

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but claim based can still charge
a fee because it's really easy. 

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Users can also go into the 
browser and interact with, you 

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know, Swap and not pay the fee 
if they want. 

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But lots of people decide to 
conceive because it's easy for 

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them. 
And I think our thesis is the 

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more of those applications, the 
A growth for the business. 

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The more things for users to do,
the more users really coming on 

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James and and all of that will 
be good for a coin basis 

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business long term. 
So it's kind of like an app 

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store business model. 
Exactly. 

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Yeah, it's not store business 
model but I think the thing 

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we're excited about is it feels 
like it could be an app store, 

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but it's not going to be a 
course about store where 

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everyone's locked in and you 
have to you know build the 

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certain way or you have to pay 
certain fees because Building on

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these open platforms, you know, 
things like EDM things like the 

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Opie stack, it's going to be 
easier and easier for developers

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to opt into being on based and 
being in the clinic proxy. 

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It's me. 
Easy for users to opt into using

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base, but if people say, hey, we
don't want to be here. 

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Hey, we want to go use 
applications elsewhere. 

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I think our goal and thesis is 
awesome. 

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Like, that's what it's all 
about. 

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That's what the open crypto 
economy is about. 

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It's about having choice, and 
we're going to continue 

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supporting users to go. 
Elsewhere. 

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And then we're going to let the 
coin based products win on their

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merits by making them easy to 
youth, make him secure, making 

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the things that people want to 
use, because it makes their life

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better. 
I'm still not totally following 

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sort of the, the rationale 
behind base. 

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I mean, as I guess, one thing 
you're saying seems to be like, 

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okay, we need to have more, you 
know, daps more stuff and then 

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that's good for crypto. 
And of course like that, I 

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understand that. 
But I mean, if it's just about 

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building daps and you feel like,
oh, coinbase needs to have a 

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role in building more depth so 
that you get more usage. 

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Then I mean there's lots of like
chains Or related to the 

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Roll-Ups that are coming that 
you could put those on. 

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So what's the case, like, why 
build your own roll up? 

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Yeah, this is something we've 
thought a lot about. 

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And in the beginning of 2022, 
the way this really started was 

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we were working with our 
internal teams at coinbase. 

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Trying to understand what was 
holding them back from building 

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dabs from building on chain. 
And basically what we saw was 

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teens were struggling with how 
do we build on chain? 

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IE like re-writing solidity VM 
contracts, are we writing rough 

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since Lana, contracts or 
rewriting? 

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You know, app chains and Cosmos 
and then most people were kind 

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of by default pic. 
An evm because that was you 

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know, the most popular thing. 
But then they were getting stuck

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with where do we build on chain?
You know, do we do? 

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We put it on LY, don't know it's
too expensive. 

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We put on now to we're not quite
sure where on L2. 

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And so first half of last year 
we aligned as a business to evm 

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as a kind of primary development
platform. 

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That's what we saw the most 
growth and most kind of network 

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effects from a developer 
perspective. 

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If they're ml, one is kind of 
the place we want to put a high 

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value applications and then L 2 
is this place. 

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Are we could start to deploy 
like large-scale consumer 

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applications things I would 
reach millions of users but even

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then I think with that Clarity 
we still have two questions like

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where and L2 and so in the 
second half of last year we went

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and talked with all the all two 
teams were kind of like, Blown 

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Away by the level of creativity 
and Innovation, that was 

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happening in the space. 
And I think as we went through 

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that process, we had a really 
big change in perspective about 

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what L2 was going to look like 
from an picture perspective. 

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I think we started with the 
thesis of there's new 1 L 2. 

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It's going to be monolithic. 
And I claim these kind of has to

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pick the right one and like 
that's the most important 

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decision for us to make. 
And then I think by the time we 

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went through that process we 
ended with this vision of much 

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more. 
There's actually many of these 

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things they're going to kind of 
run in parallel. 

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They're going to gradually 
standardized and interoperate 

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and work together to scale the 
etherium. 

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And I think in that context like
the yl2, why should we build? 

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No to question became more 
obvious. 

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It was like we should build now 
too, because we want to 

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contribute to that Mash or super
chain. 

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We want to help scale etherium. 
We want to invest our resources 

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in the platform. 
We want to give our teams and 

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people who want to be building 
for our customers and easy. 

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Like, default way to do that. 
And we can do all of that 

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without being a silo without 
being an alternative kind of 

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like, you know, ecosystem being 
an island. 

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But instead being deeply 
interconnected to what right now

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is the largest crypto ecosystem 
in the world and then with a 

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clear strategy and plan. 
For how we can make sure that we

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like have even more 
interoperability between all the

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other people who are working 
there. 

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And so I think that kind of like
having The Best of Both Worlds 

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of like creating the platform 
where coinbase from a developer 

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perspective, could really start 
to like make that transition 

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have The Surety from a business 
perspective to invest in it. 

227
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While also being deeply 
interconnected was the reason 

228
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like why we chose to do this. 
I'm think the speak much more 

229
00:12:27,200 --> 00:12:28,900
about that, right? 
But you guys are building on 

230
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Lucky optimism stack and of 
course there's like other types 

231
00:12:32,500 --> 00:12:37,500
of layer choose as well. 
Like what in what ways do you 

232
00:12:37,500 --> 00:12:41,000
see base differentiating or 
like, you know what, what do you

233
00:12:41,000 --> 00:12:43,700
what are you trying to do 
different than other l2's? 

234
00:12:44,000 --> 00:12:44,800
Yeah. 
Yeah. 

235
00:12:44,800 --> 00:12:47,100
I think you know building on the
openstack and so we're obviously

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going to share a lot of the core
technology with other l2's 

237
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building. 
On the Opie stack like optimism 

238
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a net and we're joining as a 
core developer. 

239
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Early Opie stack which means 
that we're going to be kind of 

240
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dedicating our resources to 
making that as scalable as 

241
00:13:00,900 --> 00:13:03,900
possible as secure as 
decentralized, which I think is 

242
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going to pull up timelines on a 
bunch of things we really care 

243
00:13:05,900 --> 00:13:09,400
about. 
I think, in terms of the place 

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where we think we can, we can 
really differentiate it's about 

245
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kind of bringing together, the 
kind of holistic group of 

246
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coinbase products to make it 
easier for developers to build 

247
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and make it easier for users to 
use applications. 

248
00:13:23,300 --> 00:13:26,000
So on the developer side we have
a whole kind of developer 

249
00:13:26,000 --> 00:13:30,800
organization in coinbase and 
plugging base into that as kind 

250
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of like this just works out of 
the box with all of our 

251
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developer tools is going to be 
really powerful for making it so

252
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you know, One who's just been 
writing, JavaScript can get 

253
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started and, you know, get 
started with application and 

254
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build it and you know 30 minutes
instead of 30 days and then on 

255
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the user side and I think this 
is the thing that I'm really 

256
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excited about. 
We have 110 million verify 

257
00:13:50,400 --> 00:13:54,900
users, something like, you know,
a B+ billion Assets, in our 

258
00:13:54,908 --> 00:13:57,100
ecosystem. 
And like I said at the 

259
00:13:57,100 --> 00:14:00,100
beginning, the vast majority of 
those are off chain and that's 

260
00:14:00,100 --> 00:14:02,500
because it's easier right now. 
For those people to hold their 

261
00:14:02,500 --> 00:14:05,900
sets in custodial systems. 
I think one of these that we 

262
00:14:05,900 --> 00:14:09,600
have is if we take Basically 
integrated the Colombians 

263
00:14:09,600 --> 00:14:11,300
products like coinbase and 
coinbase wallet. 

264
00:14:12,100 --> 00:14:14,300
We're actually gonna make it 
just as easy. 

265
00:14:14,300 --> 00:14:17,100
For those users to use the 
applications that people are 

266
00:14:17,100 --> 00:14:20,600
building as they can. 
You know, use the first party 

267
00:14:20,700 --> 00:14:23,300
offerings from coinbase today. 
And so what that's going to do 

268
00:14:23,300 --> 00:14:25,400
and how to differentiate the 
chains, it's going to bring all 

269
00:14:25,400 --> 00:14:31,200
this demand from kind of real 
users into Deonte an economy 

270
00:14:31,200 --> 00:14:33,700
where these new useful 
applications are starting to be 

271
00:14:33,700 --> 00:14:35,700
built. 
And I think connecting up that 

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00:14:35,700 --> 00:14:39,100
distribution both do kind of the
Enoch components of it, where 

273
00:14:39,100 --> 00:14:41,400
users are just finding the 
applications that they want 

274
00:14:41,400 --> 00:14:44,500
through listings or search, 
which our products were building

275
00:14:44,500 --> 00:14:47,200
into Clay, Mason claims. 
Well, it is gonna be huge and 

276
00:14:47,208 --> 00:14:48,900
then also, I think one of the 
things we're gonna be able to do

277
00:14:48,900 --> 00:14:51,400
is, we're going to be able to 
pull or start to build some of 

278
00:14:51,400 --> 00:14:54,600
this infrastructure around pay 
distribution where developers 

279
00:14:54,600 --> 00:14:57,100
can be like, hey, we have this 
great product. 

280
00:14:57,200 --> 00:15:00,600
We know what kind of users we 
care about and claim based can 

281
00:15:00,600 --> 00:15:04,800
help them find those users and 
help the users, find the product

282
00:15:05,100 --> 00:15:09,300
and connect that kind of Market 
of Of demand in a way that's a 

283
00:15:09,300 --> 00:15:13,400
win-win-win for the user, or the
developer, and for the ecosystem

284
00:15:13,400 --> 00:15:16,200
because now instead of the 20 
kind of holding their assets off

285
00:15:16,200 --> 00:15:19,200
chain, they're bringing them on 
chain and they're starting to be

286
00:15:19,200 --> 00:15:22,500
a part of this broader crypto 
economy that's bigger than base.

287
00:15:22,500 --> 00:15:25,500
We're getting coinbase and we 
think is the kind of like, pop 

288
00:15:25,500 --> 00:15:28,200
form for, you know, the whole 
world coming on chain over the 

289
00:15:28,200 --> 00:15:33,000
next few years. 
Jesse, you'll have to spell out 

290
00:15:33,100 --> 00:15:38,100
one thing for me a bit more. 
So basically having a venue for 

291
00:15:38,100 --> 00:15:42,100
your own people to kind of build
apps and having a venue to which

292
00:15:42,100 --> 00:15:48,700
you can kind of fun, a your 110 
million users in principle. 

293
00:15:48,700 --> 00:15:52,000
You didn't need a fresh chain 
for that or fresh roll up for 

294
00:15:52,000 --> 00:15:55,900
that right in principle you 
could have partnered with any L2

295
00:15:55,900 --> 00:15:59,000
or even are one to kind of make 
this happen. 

296
00:15:59,300 --> 00:16:02,900
And basically, you know, you 
could have contributed to the to

297
00:16:02,900 --> 00:16:05,000
the technology technology effort
and so on. 

298
00:16:05,800 --> 00:16:13,000
It has, how much is kind of this
starting from a blank slate of 

299
00:16:13,000 --> 00:16:16,900
regulatory question in an inn 
in? 

300
00:16:16,900 --> 00:16:20,600
How much is that the business 
decision? 

301
00:16:20,600 --> 00:16:25,400
Because kind of it, lets you 
gate keep in some shape or form.

302
00:16:26,800 --> 00:16:29,900
I think it's I think it's 
unfortunate I we're not starting

303
00:16:29,900 --> 00:16:32,100
from a blank blank slate, and I 
was really important to us. 

304
00:16:32,100 --> 00:16:33,700
We didn't want to go out and 
build our own technology. 

305
00:16:33,700 --> 00:16:35,500
That's why we're working on the 
Opie stack. 

306
00:16:35,500 --> 00:16:36,600
That's why we're building, isn't
it? 

307
00:16:36,600 --> 00:16:39,200
Their email to it's why we're 
contributing to and building on 

308
00:16:39,200 --> 00:16:40,900
top of these open source public 
goods? 

309
00:16:42,000 --> 00:16:46,500
But I think in terms of like why
it is a business reason, but 

310
00:16:46,500 --> 00:16:50,400
it's not about gatekeeping, it's
more that there's a ton of a ton

311
00:16:50,400 --> 00:16:52,600
of value in us having our own on
chain home. 

312
00:16:53,200 --> 00:16:56,200
And here's the example. 
That's right for the last year 

313
00:16:56,200 --> 00:17:01,600
coin This has been investing EIP
4844 which is an upgrade to a 

314
00:17:01,608 --> 00:17:04,800
cerium that's going to lower the
cost of all Roll-Ups by 10x. 

315
00:17:05,300 --> 00:17:07,700
We've put a few Engineers on 
that and we brought up the 

316
00:17:07,700 --> 00:17:10,700
timelines on that being live 
from like what was previously 

317
00:17:10,700 --> 00:17:15,800
undefined sometime 2024. 
Now to Summer 2023, that kind of

318
00:17:15,800 --> 00:17:21,599
investment is now like totally 
makes sense for our business 

319
00:17:22,700 --> 00:17:25,300
because we now have a clear. 
Rationale would like we have 

320
00:17:25,300 --> 00:17:27,400
this home. 
We know that we need to make it 

321
00:17:27,400 --> 00:17:30,000
more scalable because it's too 
expensive for our users. 

322
00:17:30,200 --> 00:17:32,300
Like let's figure out what the 
underlying infrastructure is 

323
00:17:32,300 --> 00:17:35,700
that we need to build in order 
to invest in that and I think 

324
00:17:35,700 --> 00:17:38,300
there's a bunch of things that 
are kind of like that across the

325
00:17:38,300 --> 00:17:42,600
whole company where before we 
had basically uncertainty around

326
00:17:42,600 --> 00:17:44,000
like okay we have this 
application. 

327
00:17:44,000 --> 00:17:46,900
Where do we put it is here 
better than there is this going 

328
00:17:46,900 --> 00:17:50,000
to work with all of our products
and now we've created certainty 

329
00:17:50,000 --> 00:17:53,600
insured and we say oh no we have
the home, we can invest in the 

330
00:17:53,600 --> 00:17:56,400
infrastructure you can build the
application, it will work. 

331
00:17:56,600 --> 00:18:01,000
By default, like all of these 
pieces, start to work together 

332
00:18:01,000 --> 00:18:04,200
in a way that is much more 
powerful than any of them 

333
00:18:04,200 --> 00:18:06,400
individually. 
And so I feel like one of the 

334
00:18:06,400 --> 00:18:10,700
big drivers for us on this from 
a business perspective was like 

335
00:18:10,700 --> 00:18:15,200
the shelling point of the chain 
where it's like, now we have the

336
00:18:15,200 --> 00:18:18,200
reason to do all these things on
chain and we have the place 

337
00:18:18,200 --> 00:18:19,500
where we can feel confident 
that. 

338
00:18:19,500 --> 00:18:23,100
If we do them here, it'll work 
for us and they'll fit into 

339
00:18:23,100 --> 00:18:26,800
again this broader math your 
super chain of other L2 Use of 

340
00:18:26,800 --> 00:18:30,300
other ones of aetherium. 
So we're not just off on our own

341
00:18:30,300 --> 00:18:32,600
but we're actually connecting 
people into the broader economy.

342
00:18:34,500 --> 00:18:40,600
okay, I do want to sort of 
clarify a little bit, you know, 

343
00:18:40,600 --> 00:18:43,300
expand a little bit on the 
question that for uek asked, 

344
00:18:44,300 --> 00:18:49,000
which is around You know, to 
what extent is there? 

345
00:18:49,000 --> 00:18:54,900
Some kind of permission in here?
Or is it completely, you know, 

346
00:18:54,900 --> 00:19:00,800
anyone can deploy like any kind 
of application on bass and and, 

347
00:19:00,800 --> 00:19:04,000
you know, there's no restriction
on bridging. 

348
00:19:04,000 --> 00:19:09,300
No kyc or like are you 
introducing any kind of You 

349
00:19:09,300 --> 00:19:13,500
know, sort of degrees of control
in base. 

350
00:19:15,400 --> 00:19:19,500
Yeah, so we think about base as 
a layer 2 and we think about 

351
00:19:19,500 --> 00:19:22,700
layer twos as a scaling 
solution, an extension of 

352
00:19:22,700 --> 00:19:25,700
aetherium. 
And if you look at our track 

353
00:19:25,700 --> 00:19:29,400
record over the last year and a 
half, I think what you'll see is

354
00:19:29,400 --> 00:19:33,800
that coinbase has been a very 
staunch defender of the 

355
00:19:33,800 --> 00:19:37,900
permission list - of aetherium 
of the right for users and 

356
00:19:37,900 --> 00:19:43,100
developers to write and run, 
open source code of the right 

357
00:19:43,100 --> 00:19:46,900
for people to run validators. 
And to have those validators, 

358
00:19:47,100 --> 00:19:50,500
execute that open source code, 
you know, even on things like 

359
00:19:50,500 --> 00:19:54,400
tornado, cath, you know, 
coinbase was, you know, the one 

360
00:19:54,400 --> 00:19:57,300
of the, I think, the first and 
biggest company to activate it 

361
00:19:57,300 --> 00:20:00,900
around and we're supporting, you
know, challenge that that's 

362
00:20:00,900 --> 00:20:03,500
working its way through the 
court systems around the kind of

363
00:20:03,500 --> 00:20:06,700
Open Source nature of this code 
and whether it's reasonable for 

364
00:20:06,700 --> 00:20:10,400
treasury to, you know, put open 
source code on sanctions list. 

365
00:20:10,500 --> 00:20:15,300
And so, I think our plan for 
base is to extend and build Not 

366
00:20:15,300 --> 00:20:18,000
permissionless. 
Dennis there's obviously a 

367
00:20:18,000 --> 00:20:21,100
complex path to that we're in 
the test net right now. 

368
00:20:21,100 --> 00:20:24,600
We've written a lot about our 
past to decentralization. 

369
00:20:25,500 --> 00:20:27,300
If you want to read more about, 
you can find it on our blog at 

370
00:20:27,308 --> 00:20:31,700
based on mirror dot x, y z. 
But we're working with optimism 

371
00:20:31,700 --> 00:20:34,400
to basically figure out. 
How do we decentralize the 

372
00:20:34,400 --> 00:20:37,200
underlying technology here? 
The Opie stack as quickly as 

373
00:20:37,200 --> 00:20:39,300
possible. 
So that there's no multisig 

374
00:20:39,300 --> 00:20:43,200
controlled by one individual or 
entity that can make decisions 

375
00:20:43,200 --> 00:20:44,900
about the characteristics of the
chain. 

376
00:20:44,900 --> 00:20:48,700
The Censorship of this chain, 
there's you know, forced 

377
00:20:48,700 --> 00:20:52,900
inclusion rights that are upheld
at the L1 that even if you have 

378
00:20:52,900 --> 00:20:55,700
a sequencer, that's misbehaving 
transactions can still be 

379
00:20:55,700 --> 00:20:59,900
processed and then we're, you 
know, desensitizing the 

380
00:20:59,900 --> 00:21:02,700
sequencing layer. 
So that more people can be kind 

381
00:21:02,700 --> 00:21:06,200
of building blocks and summing. 
Those transactions to the to 

382
00:21:06,400 --> 00:21:11,100
broader out one in batches and 
so it's going to be a journey as

383
00:21:11,100 --> 00:21:13,600
we work our way towards Main and
will be continue to communicate 

384
00:21:13,600 --> 00:21:17,400
about it, but We believe in the,
you know, permissionless of 

385
00:21:17,400 --> 00:21:20,800
etherium, we see base as an 
extension of aetherium and as a 

386
00:21:20,800 --> 00:21:22,500
scaling Solution on top of the 
theorem. 

387
00:21:22,900 --> 00:21:25,600
And, you know, we see that kind 
of holding across all the layer 

388
00:21:25,600 --> 00:21:28,300
twos and that's what we're going
to be working to uphold from a 

389
00:21:28,308 --> 00:21:31,900
decentralization and open 
perspective of the next few 

390
00:21:31,900 --> 00:21:37,100
months and years. 
So we're I think we're all 

391
00:21:37,100 --> 00:21:42,900
familiar with kind of the 
decentralization shortcomings of

392
00:21:43,000 --> 00:21:45,400
l2's. 
I think this is this goes 

393
00:21:45,400 --> 00:21:46,700
without saying, we all know 
this. 

394
00:21:46,700 --> 00:21:50,600
And I think this is, it's kind 
of a dead horse to beat because,

395
00:21:50,600 --> 00:21:55,000
I mean, it's, I mean, everyone 
always says, look, we are 

396
00:21:55,000 --> 00:21:58,100
decentralized this and I think 
technical technologically, this 

397
00:21:58,100 --> 00:22:03,700
is possible, and it will happen.
But just to clarify, as is, does

398
00:22:03,800 --> 00:22:08,600
base have any Other 
permissioning systems or 

399
00:22:08,600 --> 00:22:14,200
settings that set it apart from 
the standard Opie deployment, 

400
00:22:16,000 --> 00:22:18,000
we're running the standard Opie 
deployment. 

401
00:22:18,300 --> 00:22:21,900
Our goal is to continue up 
streaming all of our changes, to

402
00:22:21,900 --> 00:22:26,700
the standard Opie deployment and
work with optimism, to release, 

403
00:22:26,700 --> 00:22:30,400
consistently across opium a net 
and base and to have those 

404
00:22:30,400 --> 00:22:34,300
operate on the same code base. 
Could I think this is what what?

405
00:22:34,300 --> 00:22:36,500
Brian was kind of trying trying 
to get it. 

406
00:22:36,500 --> 00:22:42,800
So basically, anyone can kind of
keep lie adapt on base if they 

407
00:22:43,100 --> 00:22:45,200
choose to do. 
So in principle, you can censor 

408
00:22:45,200 --> 00:22:49,000
them from your interfaces just 
like an app store doesn't have 

409
00:22:49,000 --> 00:22:55,800
to show an app, but you can't 
kind of exclude them from from 

410
00:22:55,800 --> 00:22:58,800
the, from the L2, that's super 
reassuring to hear. 

411
00:22:59,000 --> 00:23:01,700
There's no mechanisms and oop 
stack code base to do that. 

412
00:23:01,700 --> 00:23:05,300
And You know where continue to 
contribute to the openstack 

413
00:23:05,300 --> 00:23:08,400
codebase continuing to 
decentralized oop stack code 

414
00:23:08,400 --> 00:23:10,700
base. 
I think your observation around 

415
00:23:10,700 --> 00:23:13,700
kind of interfaces is exactly 
right and this is what you see. 

416
00:23:13,700 --> 00:23:17,900
Pretty consistently across the 
board with these layer twos and 

417
00:23:17,900 --> 00:23:21,300
now ones as well which is that 
if folks are hosting things like

418
00:23:21,300 --> 00:23:24,200
Bridges or they're hosting 
things? 

419
00:23:24,800 --> 00:23:27,000
Yeah, I mean like which I think 
is a canonical example. 

420
00:23:27,500 --> 00:23:31,000
There are often times are almost
always applying some level 

421
00:23:31,200 --> 00:23:34,700
judgment around. 
What kind of users whether it's 

422
00:23:34,700 --> 00:23:37,500
based on IP or addresses, they 
want to let use those 

423
00:23:37,500 --> 00:23:41,700
interfaces, but then they're 
fighting to protect the 

424
00:23:41,700 --> 00:23:44,600
permission of the sness, the 
underlying Network, smart 

425
00:23:44,600 --> 00:23:47,600
contracts, the nodes, that's 
what optimism has done 

426
00:23:47,600 --> 00:23:50,600
consistently. 
And that's what our plan is to 

427
00:23:50,600 --> 00:23:52,600
do as well. 
We want to be building with 

428
00:23:52,600 --> 00:23:55,800
optimism, going towards the 
centralization and treating 

429
00:23:55,800 --> 00:23:59,400
layer to, as an extension of 
etherium, that protects the 

430
00:23:59,400 --> 00:24:02,500
right for developers and users 
to run open source code. 

431
00:24:02,800 --> 00:24:05,800
Just like, people have been 
running code on other systems 

432
00:24:05,800 --> 00:24:08,300
for a long time and just like 
the internet remains an open 

433
00:24:08,300 --> 00:24:09,700
protocol that anyone can build 
on. 

434
00:24:10,000 --> 00:24:12,400
We see etherium kind of 
upholding the same standards. 

435
00:24:13,900 --> 00:24:19,200
SS centralized exchange, you 
have certain requirements, you 

436
00:24:19,200 --> 00:24:23,600
know, from The Regulators, as to
kind of funds and users, you can

437
00:24:23,600 --> 00:24:26,400
on board. 
So where exactly do you draw the

438
00:24:26,400 --> 00:24:30,100
line between the user and the 
non user of coinbase? 

439
00:24:30,200 --> 00:24:33,200
If people kind of move around on
base? 

440
00:24:33,300 --> 00:24:37,400
Add those people automatically 
kind of users of coinbase or can

441
00:24:37,400 --> 00:24:41,500
coinbase users automatic? 
I mean, can they just move 

442
00:24:41,500 --> 00:24:44,400
around base? 
Really, and how do you deal with

443
00:24:44,400 --> 00:24:49,200
kind of funds that you may not 
be able to kind of onboard on to

444
00:24:49,200 --> 00:24:52,400
coinbase proper? 
But that have kind of come in 

445
00:24:52,400 --> 00:24:58,500
contact or have come to belong 
to coinbase users on base. 

446
00:24:58,800 --> 00:25:03,900
It to me, it seems like really 
difficult terrain to Steppin. 

447
00:25:05,400 --> 00:25:07,300
Definitely very difficult 
terrain to step in. 

448
00:25:07,400 --> 00:25:11,200
You know, I think coinbase is at
the Vanguard of trying to figure

449
00:25:11,200 --> 00:25:14,900
out what is the, where are the 
lines? 

450
00:25:14,900 --> 00:25:17,100
And, you know, there's not going
to be clear lines on any of this

451
00:25:17,100 --> 00:25:21,200
stuff like the ways were the 
laws that were working with are 

452
00:25:21,800 --> 00:25:24,000
old and you know I think our 
position has been pretty 

453
00:25:24,000 --> 00:25:28,300
consistently like it's time to 
create new laws that create 

454
00:25:28,300 --> 00:25:31,500
regulatory certainty for 
developers create protections 

455
00:25:31,500 --> 00:25:34,200
for users but also support 
Innovation. 

456
00:25:34,400 --> 00:25:37,600
I think to your Question in 
particular around, like kind of 

457
00:25:37,600 --> 00:25:39,500
what's the difference between 
the centralized part of the 

458
00:25:39,500 --> 00:25:42,200
business and the exchange and 
kind of more decentralized 

459
00:25:42,200 --> 00:25:45,000
software parts to business. 
You know, this is something that

460
00:25:45,000 --> 00:25:47,700
we've actually been dealing with
for a long time. 

461
00:25:47,800 --> 00:25:50,900
You know, if you look at 
coinbase.com and the coinbase 

462
00:25:50,900 --> 00:25:54,200
mobile app, those things are 
different than coinbase wallet, 

463
00:25:55,000 --> 00:25:56,500
right? 
Coinbase.com and the Clemens 

464
00:25:56,500 --> 00:26:00,800
mobile app, you know, when you 
sign up You create an account. 

465
00:26:00,800 --> 00:26:03,800
Using the password you give us 
your verified information. 

466
00:26:04,100 --> 00:26:08,700
We confirm that information, we 
do the kyc checks, we report on 

467
00:26:08,700 --> 00:26:12,800
all of that, you know, within 
kind of the the guidelines that 

468
00:26:12,800 --> 00:26:15,100
we work with regulatory 
perspective in different 

469
00:26:15,100 --> 00:26:18,000
jurisdictions. 
That's obviously been hugely 

470
00:26:18,000 --> 00:26:22,100
successful for many users and 
it's different than Clarice 

471
00:26:22,100 --> 00:26:23,600
wallet. 
If you download coinbase wallet 

472
00:26:23,600 --> 00:26:24,700
today, you can download climb 
this wall. 

473
00:26:24,700 --> 00:26:27,900
Anywhere in the world, you can 
use the software requirements 

474
00:26:27,900 --> 00:26:30,600
wallet to generate a Private 
key. 

475
00:26:30,600 --> 00:26:34,200
That is yours that you then use 
to interact with any application

476
00:26:34,200 --> 00:26:38,300
that's deployed on the cerium. 
Another Network to, and coinbase

477
00:26:38,300 --> 00:26:42,900
in that context is really 
providing software to let users 

478
00:26:42,900 --> 00:26:46,500
manage their own information. 
Their own data, their own 

479
00:26:46,700 --> 00:26:51,300
private, cubes and transact with
again this open source software 

480
00:26:51,300 --> 00:26:56,100
that's running on a theorem, as 
kind of a base layer and our 

481
00:26:56,400 --> 00:27:00,100
stance on that has been again. 
People can enjoy I said, run 

482
00:27:00,100 --> 00:27:03,800
software and that they should 
have rights protected around 

483
00:27:03,800 --> 00:27:06,300
that, and we're going to support
them in doing that. 

484
00:27:06,300 --> 00:27:10,200
And so I think that's going to 
be the same, you know, 

485
00:27:11,000 --> 00:27:16,300
regulatory gray area or, you 
know, lack of clarity that were 

486
00:27:16,600 --> 00:27:20,700
navigating with base. 
And again, our goal is to build 

487
00:27:20,700 --> 00:27:23,400
on and extend the kind of 
foundation that aetherium has 

488
00:27:23,400 --> 00:27:28,500
built and see and treat layer to
as an extension of that, and 

489
00:27:28,500 --> 00:27:31,300
make sure that we're kind of 
Upholding those values because 

490
00:27:31,300 --> 00:27:34,500
we think that That's essential 
ization that openness, that's 

491
00:27:34,500 --> 00:27:37,500
what enables us to build a 
global crypto economy. 

492
00:27:37,700 --> 00:27:40,200
That's what's going to enable us
to bring a billion people, to 

493
00:27:40,200 --> 00:27:43,300
people billion people on chain, 
and increase economic freedom 

494
00:27:43,300 --> 00:27:46,200
everywhere. 
Cool know. 

495
00:27:46,200 --> 00:27:50,500
I really appreciate you know the
clear answer and and that also 

496
00:27:50,500 --> 00:27:52,400
the stands, right? 
I think that's really amazing 

497
00:27:52,400 --> 00:27:55,800
that like, you know, coinbase is
really building something, you 

498
00:27:55,800 --> 00:27:59,400
know, fully open, permission 
lists and yeah. 

499
00:27:59,400 --> 00:28:00,800
So I think that's that's very 
cool. 

500
00:28:01,500 --> 00:28:06,300
One thing I'm curious about, of 
course any change or, you know, 

501
00:28:06,300 --> 00:28:11,100
primarily any change building. 
Like some kind of chain is not a

502
00:28:11,100 --> 00:28:14,400
new thing, right? 
I guess most known is like, by 

503
00:28:14,400 --> 00:28:18,700
Nance, right? 
Like the by nouns chain that? 

504
00:28:18,700 --> 00:28:21,300
I think kind of failed, right? 
But then, by non-smart Chain, 

505
00:28:21,300 --> 00:28:22,700
which has been pretty 
successful. 

506
00:28:23,400 --> 00:28:27,300
What are they are? 
Some things that you learned or 

507
00:28:27,300 --> 00:28:29,700
something very like, okay? 
This, these are things we really

508
00:28:29,700 --> 00:28:32,900
want to do differently compared 
to how bonanzas approached it. 

509
00:28:33,900 --> 00:28:38,300
Yeah, great question. 
And just as like context, 

510
00:28:38,300 --> 00:28:40,400
historical data point. 
We've actually looked at 

511
00:28:40,400 --> 00:28:44,400
building a chain twice before 
and we decided not to in 2018 

512
00:28:44,400 --> 00:28:47,200
and 2020. 
And the reason why we decided 

513
00:28:47,200 --> 00:28:50,900
not to build a chain in those 
times, is we didn't think that 

514
00:28:50,900 --> 00:28:55,800
we could launch a chain that 
would live up to our values and 

515
00:28:55,800 --> 00:28:59,000
beliefs about the crypto economy
and in particular, we didn't 

516
00:28:59,000 --> 00:29:02,200
want to launch something that 
would put our users on an island

517
00:29:02,600 --> 00:29:05,600
or Silo them or make them be 
disconnected from all of the 

518
00:29:05,600 --> 00:29:07,900
other Innovation that's 
happening and that they're using

519
00:29:07,900 --> 00:29:12,100
coinbase products to access and 
I think the thing that shifted 

520
00:29:12,100 --> 00:29:15,500
now is we feel like we can we 
feel like we can have both We 

521
00:29:15,500 --> 00:29:18,700
can both create the home for us 
on chain and be deeply 

522
00:29:18,700 --> 00:29:20,600
interconnected to the broader 
crypto economy. 

523
00:29:21,900 --> 00:29:25,600
And I think as we look at, you 
know, other chains, like Finance

524
00:29:25,600 --> 00:29:28,600
more chain. 
That's probably the key 

525
00:29:28,600 --> 00:29:31,800
difference in our philosophy and
approach that we're taking here.

526
00:29:31,900 --> 00:29:34,300
When I look at my Ants Marching,
the thing that gets me really 

527
00:29:34,300 --> 00:29:35,400
excited. 
And something that I think we've

528
00:29:35,400 --> 00:29:40,600
learned a lot from, is the 
combination of having interfaces

529
00:29:40,600 --> 00:29:44,300
that people use consumers, real 
consumers, use combined with a 

530
00:29:44,300 --> 00:29:46,200
chain. 
Structure that people can build 

531
00:29:46,200 --> 00:29:49,500
applications on super powerful. 
If you look at the activity 

532
00:29:49,500 --> 00:29:53,200
that's happening on buying smart
chain, it is mostly small scale,

533
00:29:53,400 --> 00:29:56,400
retail users doing small 
transactions, whether it sends 

534
00:29:56,400 --> 00:30:01,400
or receives of tether or swaps 
of, you know, like $10. 

535
00:30:02,400 --> 00:30:05,700
It's every it's everyday people 
actually using the chain and 

536
00:30:05,700 --> 00:30:07,800
that's because they have 
interfaces that enable them to 

537
00:30:07,800 --> 00:30:09,900
use the chain. 
And that's why by an smart chain

538
00:30:09,900 --> 00:30:13,700
has, I think 10 million monthly 
transacting addresses, which is 

539
00:30:13,700 --> 00:30:15,200
five times bigger than 
aetherium? 

540
00:30:15,600 --> 00:30:17,600
Ten times bigger than the next 
L2. 

541
00:30:17,900 --> 00:30:21,000
And that's I think that's 
incredible. 

542
00:30:21,000 --> 00:30:24,600
It's incredible. 
Illustration of how if you stop 

543
00:30:24,600 --> 00:30:28,800
just forcing users to do things,
like pick the infrastructure 

544
00:30:28,800 --> 00:30:30,100
that they want to run their apps
on. 

545
00:30:30,300 --> 00:30:33,600
And instead, just give them 
products and applications that 

546
00:30:33,600 --> 00:30:36,600
they actually care about, 
they're going to use it and that

547
00:30:36,600 --> 00:30:38,100
can drive real adopter of 
crypto. 

548
00:30:38,500 --> 00:30:41,900
Now, I think our approach is 
like let's take that learning 

549
00:30:42,000 --> 00:30:45,000
and then let's figure out how to
do it in a way where we're not 

550
00:30:45,000 --> 00:30:46,200
off. 
Off to the side. 

551
00:30:46,400 --> 00:30:50,300
We're not creating our own 
siloed ecosystem, but instead we

552
00:30:50,300 --> 00:30:54,800
are using base, almost as a 
bridge and the value that we 

553
00:30:54,800 --> 00:30:58,000
repeat over and over again, is a
bridge, not an island, which 

554
00:30:58,000 --> 00:31:00,700
basically means that we think 
about base as the way that users

555
00:31:00,700 --> 00:31:03,400
are going to come from off chain
to on chain. 

556
00:31:03,700 --> 00:31:07,600
And then the way that we're 
going to enable users to go 

557
00:31:07,600 --> 00:31:10,500
everywhere else and we can do 
that by continuing to support 

558
00:31:10,500 --> 00:31:13,900
all these chains across our 
product other l2s if there is 

559
00:31:14,300 --> 00:31:16,500
other L1 equal. 
Sometimes we're going to do that

560
00:31:16,500 --> 00:31:19,900
by building really deep 
interoperability between base 

561
00:31:19,900 --> 00:31:22,800
and the theorem between base and
other altitudes between base and

562
00:31:22,800 --> 00:31:27,000
other L1 ecosystems like Cosmos.
Like gnosis like Solana. 

563
00:31:27,800 --> 00:31:32,200
And I think are these like we're
at day 0 in this story. 

564
00:31:32,300 --> 00:31:36,800
There's still a small millions 
of real human beings who are 

565
00:31:36,800 --> 00:31:41,000
transacting on chain every day. 
And we need to get that too few 

566
00:31:41,000 --> 00:31:44,900
billion transacting every day. 
And in that, it's going to take 

567
00:31:44,900 --> 00:31:46,600
all kinds. 
Kinds of innovation, it's going 

568
00:31:46,600 --> 00:31:49,600
take a diversity of different 
solutions and we want to be 

569
00:31:49,700 --> 00:31:53,000
bringing people in accelerating 
the growth of the broader kept 

570
00:31:53,000 --> 00:31:54,600
economy. 
Having base, obviously, play an 

571
00:31:54,600 --> 00:31:58,500
important role in it, but 
letting users and developers to 

572
00:31:58,500 --> 00:32:01,200
choose where they want to be 
building in a way that kind of 

573
00:32:01,200 --> 00:32:05,000
lives up to the best values of 
crypto and the openness, and the

574
00:32:05,000 --> 00:32:07,700
interoperability that we see 
making Crypt of such a special 

575
00:32:07,700 --> 00:32:12,400
place. 
I totally subscribe to that 

576
00:32:12,400 --> 00:32:16,200
ethos but don't you know, don't 
dismiss Finance matching too 

577
00:32:16,200 --> 00:32:19,700
quickly because what they what 
they're actually able to do is 

578
00:32:19,900 --> 00:32:23,200
they do a lot of? 
Yeah, you you never thought 

579
00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:34,200
you'd hear that for me, right? 
But I know I love it and I mean 

580
00:32:34,200 --> 00:32:39,500
the way that they're doing is 
they're just able to do massive 

581
00:32:39,500 --> 00:32:41,400
amounts. 
And of transactions per second 

582
00:32:41,500 --> 00:32:45,300
by, you know, by virtue of being
pretty, you know, centralized. 

583
00:32:45,300 --> 00:32:49,100
But I mean, same can be said 
for, you know, the Opie stack. 

584
00:32:49,100 --> 00:32:51,500
But I know the roadmap and so 
on. 

585
00:32:51,700 --> 00:32:57,400
But the numbers of transactions 
that you can do on an optimism 

586
00:32:57,400 --> 00:33:00,500
roll up, it's nowhere near the 
number of transactions. 

587
00:33:00,500 --> 00:33:02,800
You can do unbalanced marching 
right? 

588
00:33:02,900 --> 00:33:06,400
So basically if you have like a 
hundred and ten million users on

589
00:33:06,400 --> 00:33:10,900
coinbase, how are they all going
to fit onto your Or roll up. 

590
00:33:11,800 --> 00:33:14,500
Yeah, I really across the board.
We have a lot of scaling 

591
00:33:14,500 --> 00:33:19,300
challenges II challenge that 
binds Merchant has some, you 

592
00:33:19,300 --> 00:33:25,100
know, like meaningful lead on 
other L 20s or even other ones 

593
00:33:25,100 --> 00:33:29,000
like, like like gnosis, I mean, 
by Ants Marching is running on 

594
00:33:29,000 --> 00:33:34,300
death and Aragon, you know, 
those are the same clients that 

595
00:33:34,300 --> 00:33:35,900
were using to run a theory on 
the same clients. 

596
00:33:35,900 --> 00:33:39,200
We're using to run these layer 
twos and they've tweaked the 

597
00:33:39,200 --> 00:33:40,400
gas. 
It's a little bit. 

598
00:33:40,400 --> 00:33:42,800
So they have higher gas 
tournaments, which you know, has

599
00:33:42,800 --> 00:33:47,000
the downside of bloating data 
much faster but the upside of it

600
00:33:47,000 --> 00:33:49,600
creating a little bit more 
significantly, more throughput, 

601
00:33:49,700 --> 00:33:54,100
but I don't think that there's, 
like, meaningful technological 

602
00:33:54,100 --> 00:33:57,200
advantage that by an smart 
chain, has over other l2s. 

603
00:33:57,200 --> 00:34:01,000
And in fact, I think, I think, 
what is more likely to happen 

604
00:34:01,000 --> 00:34:04,600
is, you know, almost like the 
tortoise versus the hare, right?

605
00:34:04,600 --> 00:34:08,300
If you look at layer 2 on a 
cerium, there's actually a 

606
00:34:08,308 --> 00:34:11,400
pretty clear path. 
To driving down costs 

607
00:34:11,400 --> 00:34:16,300
consistently because the biggest
source of costs is L1 aetherium 

608
00:34:16,300 --> 00:34:18,699
data availability. 
And we're running this road map 

609
00:34:18,699 --> 00:34:21,400
around 44 for predicting. 
That's going to create a new 

610
00:34:21,400 --> 00:34:23,000
kind of data availability on 
this area. 

611
00:34:23,000 --> 00:34:25,699
That's going to be much cheaper 
to use and then we can grow that

612
00:34:25,699 --> 00:34:28,900
capacity over time to continue 
driving down costs. 

613
00:34:29,699 --> 00:34:33,900
That's not the same situation 
for by an smart chain. 

614
00:34:33,900 --> 00:34:37,000
Like if they want to solve the 
like how do we continue putting 

615
00:34:37,000 --> 00:34:40,199
so many transactions through by 
Our chain. 

616
00:34:40,199 --> 00:34:43,000
But then manage with State 
growth, they're gonna have to 

617
00:34:43,000 --> 00:34:47,400
figure out how to do that at the
L1 context, which is a hard 

618
00:34:47,400 --> 00:34:50,300
engineering problem. 
And that's kind of why yeoreum 

619
00:34:50,300 --> 00:34:53,500
has decided to pursue this 
roll-up Centric, scaling roadmap

620
00:34:53,500 --> 00:34:57,200
where you separate the concerns 
you do data, availability L1 and

621
00:34:57,200 --> 00:34:58,800
then you push the execution down
down to. 

622
00:34:58,800 --> 00:35:04,300
And so I mean, I think I think 
time will tell but today, by 

623
00:35:04,300 --> 00:35:06,700
Nance margin is more expensive 
than other. 

624
00:35:06,700 --> 00:35:10,700
All twos maybe has more 
throughput but But the costs are

625
00:35:10,700 --> 00:35:14,600
higher and I think from a 
long-term perspective I at least

626
00:35:14,600 --> 00:35:18,900
feel a lot more confident in the
scaling roadmap that folks like 

627
00:35:19,000 --> 00:35:23,400
if your IAM and gnosis are 
running with 4844 around 

628
00:35:23,400 --> 00:35:25,300
providing data availability tell
to us. 

629
00:35:26,700 --> 00:35:29,700
I hear that to me. 
The question is so basically 

630
00:35:29,700 --> 00:35:34,600
invariably with an heir to your 
transaction costs are going to 

631
00:35:34,600 --> 00:35:40,500
be correlated with I mean 
proportional to the anyone fees,

632
00:35:40,500 --> 00:35:43,900
right? 
So basically there's there's 

633
00:35:43,900 --> 00:35:50,100
only so much you can ultimately 
settle to aetherium, right? 

634
00:35:50,100 --> 00:35:52,800
So basically, I mean, even if 
you I mean, and we are now even 

635
00:35:52,800 --> 00:35:55,200
talking about layer 3 is because
basically layer tools are 

636
00:35:55,200 --> 00:35:56,900
getting too expensive for me. 
Things. 

637
00:35:57,300 --> 00:36:02,100
I recently spoke with Jordi from
from polygon. 

638
00:36:03,300 --> 00:36:05,700
This is actually this interviews
coming out after yours. 

639
00:36:05,700 --> 00:36:08,100
So I can't. 
I basically no one will know 

640
00:36:08,100 --> 00:36:12,300
this. 
But basically, their plan is to 

641
00:36:12,300 --> 00:36:17,200
kind of have like this system of
chains and depending on what 

642
00:36:17,200 --> 00:36:22,700
you're actually requirements in 
terms of transaction costs and 

643
00:36:24,000 --> 00:36:28,100
and security guarantees are they
were I commend you a different 

644
00:36:28,100 --> 00:36:29,500
chain. 
So basically, basically they 

645
00:36:29,500 --> 00:36:34,700
will send you two polygons, UK, 
evm or polygon p. 

646
00:36:34,700 --> 00:36:39,400
O Ms. Or, you know, any of the 
other ZK chains. 

647
00:36:39,400 --> 00:36:43,500
They're currently incubating, 
the do you think Bay's can kind 

648
00:36:43,500 --> 00:36:50,300
of somehow toe the line between,
you know, between kind of 

649
00:36:50,300 --> 00:36:54,800
excluding people on economic 
grounds in terms of transaction 

650
00:36:54,800 --> 00:36:58,500
costs were excluding dad or how 
are you thinking about that? 

651
00:37:00,000 --> 00:37:02,700
Yeah, good question. 
And in first, the first thing 

652
00:37:02,700 --> 00:37:07,300
I'll clarify is I think actually
that with 4844 which is Proto 

653
00:37:07,300 --> 00:37:09,800
dang, starting one of the really
powerful things that's going to 

654
00:37:09,808 --> 00:37:12,200
happen is we're going to now 
start to have two separate fee 

655
00:37:12,200 --> 00:37:16,200
markets for L1. 
So we'll have the few market for

656
00:37:16,300 --> 00:37:19,700
like transactions on L1 that are
doing execution, like a swap or 

657
00:37:19,700 --> 00:37:22,200
NF 2 Min, or whatever. 
And that will continue to have 

658
00:37:22,200 --> 00:37:25,400
the kind of like market-driven 
demand based on events. 

659
00:37:25,400 --> 00:37:27,600
Like there's a big Min. 
You're going to see more Spike. 

660
00:37:27,600 --> 00:37:29,800
You can see higher gas. 
It's then we're going to have 

661
00:37:29,800 --> 00:37:32,800
this other market for blob space
which is just the data 

662
00:37:32,800 --> 00:37:36,400
availability market and that 
market isn't going to have the 

663
00:37:36,400 --> 00:37:43,100
same kind of demand-based Kerr, 
as intense demand curves because

664
00:37:43,100 --> 00:37:45,900
the primary use case is going to
be l2's that are consistently 

665
00:37:45,900 --> 00:37:48,600
publishing data. 
And so I think one of the things

666
00:37:48,600 --> 00:37:50,400
that are actually going to see 
is we're going to see a 

667
00:37:50,700 --> 00:37:54,800
Divergence of the L2 cost from 
having that direct correlation 

668
00:37:54,800 --> 00:37:57,700
to the L1 execution cost. 
And instead what we'll see is 

669
00:37:57,700 --> 00:38:00,600
over time, whereas To be able to
drive down the aisle to cost 

670
00:38:00,600 --> 00:38:05,600
because we're gonna be able to 
create more data, availability 

671
00:38:05,800 --> 00:38:09,700
through Protank charting and 
then folding starting that, I 

672
00:38:09,700 --> 00:38:12,700
think eventually should be 
basically infinite if we can 

673
00:38:12,700 --> 00:38:16,400
solve the technology problems. 
And that's going to mean, we'll 

674
00:38:16,400 --> 00:38:20,600
be able to continue driving down
cause they say that's that's the

675
00:38:20,600 --> 00:38:23,600
first thing is like, I do think 
that there's a pass to like 

676
00:38:23,600 --> 00:38:27,300
lowering costs on l2's. 
Consistently for the next decade

677
00:38:27,700 --> 00:38:30,700
in a way that will get Really 
cheap fees. 

678
00:38:31,500 --> 00:38:33,900
The other thing I'll say is, I 
actually totally agree with 

679
00:38:33,900 --> 00:38:37,800
jordi's perspective and you 
know, we've talked about this a 

680
00:38:37,808 --> 00:38:41,400
lot with optimism. 
We don't think anyone chain is 

681
00:38:41,400 --> 00:38:44,000
going to be the answer cryptos 
too big. 

682
00:38:44,100 --> 00:38:48,900
It's a bring a billion people on
chain and not only is that a 

683
00:38:48,900 --> 00:38:52,000
huge amount of demand, but you 
also have applications that are 

684
00:38:52,800 --> 00:38:54,600
you know, just have really 
different requirements in terms 

685
00:38:54,600 --> 00:38:57,000
of how they run and the mental 
model that I have for. 

686
00:38:57,000 --> 00:39:01,200
This is Model of web to. 
If you look at the average kind 

687
00:39:01,200 --> 00:39:05,700
of developer lifecycle of a web 
to business, maybe they start on

688
00:39:05,700 --> 00:39:08,400
like a shared hosting solution 
Heroku. 

689
00:39:08,700 --> 00:39:11,900
And then, that gets too 
expensive for them or it's too 

690
00:39:11,900 --> 00:39:13,700
slow and they're like, okay now 
we can go to AWS. 

691
00:39:13,700 --> 00:39:15,700
We're going to run our own 
computers on AWS that are 

692
00:39:15,700 --> 00:39:18,800
virtualized and that works 
really well for them. 

693
00:39:18,800 --> 00:39:22,400
And then they get big enough at 
some point and they're like wow 

694
00:39:22,500 --> 00:39:25,000
like it's too expensive for us 
to be on AWS. 

695
00:39:25,000 --> 00:39:28,100
Now we're going to get our own 
Data Center and we're going to 

696
00:39:28,100 --> 00:39:29,100
have our own data. 
A thinner. 

697
00:39:29,100 --> 00:39:30,200
We're going to that's in the 
hardware. 

698
00:39:30,200 --> 00:39:31,800
We're going to find you never 
going to make it work 

699
00:39:31,800 --> 00:39:34,900
specifically for our use case. 
I actually think applications 

700
00:39:34,900 --> 00:39:38,000
and crypto will go through a 
similar trajectory where they'll

701
00:39:38,000 --> 00:39:41,600
start on a shared chain and it 
will be like, oh now we can like

702
00:39:41,600 --> 00:39:44,100
get easy access to all liquidity
and it all just work, it's 

703
00:39:44,100 --> 00:39:47,600
really easy to deploy. 
And then after a certain point, 

704
00:39:47,600 --> 00:39:50,200
they'll be like, wow, now we're 
in this chain and we're like 

705
00:39:50,200 --> 00:39:52,600
paying all these Gatsby's. 
And it's not really working 

706
00:39:52,600 --> 00:39:55,300
perfectly for us and we've 
scaled me of millions of users. 

707
00:39:55,800 --> 00:39:59,400
What if we would be better 
served by running our own So the

708
00:39:59,400 --> 00:40:02,600
stack and having it interoperate
with that other chain and still 

709
00:40:02,600 --> 00:40:05,900
have the same API or interface 
available to users through other

710
00:40:05,900 --> 00:40:08,700
chain, but have our own kind of 
custom stack. 

711
00:40:08,700 --> 00:40:13,200
That's powering the underlying 
business logic and I expect that

712
00:40:13,200 --> 00:40:15,500
to happen. 
That's why we're building on the

713
00:40:15,500 --> 00:40:17,000
Opie stack. 
That's why we have this vision 

714
00:40:17,000 --> 00:40:20,600
of a super chain where what will
happen over the next five years 

715
00:40:20,600 --> 00:40:23,100
is we're basically you have 
thousands millions of chains 

716
00:40:23,200 --> 00:40:26,900
that have different use cases 
that serve different kind of 

717
00:40:26,900 --> 00:40:30,300
application developer needs and 
that It all kind of fit together

718
00:40:30,300 --> 00:40:34,500
through interoperability so that
the user, they aren't having to 

719
00:40:34,500 --> 00:40:37,900
make choices of like, am I 
running on this one or that one?

720
00:40:38,000 --> 00:40:41,100
Just like you don't make choices
around like what's my Tier 1 

721
00:40:41,100 --> 00:40:45,100
versus tier 2 is p as I'm 
connecting to internet instead. 

722
00:40:45,100 --> 00:40:48,000
They just run the applications 
that they care about and the 

723
00:40:48,000 --> 00:40:50,100
kind of abstraction of the super
chain. 

724
00:40:50,100 --> 00:40:52,900
However, that shapes up to be, 
make sure that that's executed 

725
00:40:52,900 --> 00:40:56,100
in the right place. 
And so, I think polygon, you 

726
00:40:56,107 --> 00:40:58,700
know, spend a lot of time 
apologized. 

727
00:40:59,100 --> 00:41:01,700
Their Vision, our vision and the
cosmos Vision. 

728
00:41:01,800 --> 00:41:05,500
Everything's kind of converging 
to this idea that there's going 

729
00:41:05,500 --> 00:41:08,200
to be many of these things. 
They're going to interoperate 

730
00:41:08,300 --> 00:41:10,400
they're going to have different 
configurations of data 

731
00:41:10,400 --> 00:41:13,800
availability and that mesh is 
going to be the thing that 

732
00:41:13,800 --> 00:41:16,200
enables crypto to grow to 
billions of users. 

733
00:41:16,300 --> 00:41:18,500
I think the places where there's
difference in differences in 

734
00:41:18,500 --> 00:41:20,800
perspective. 
Are you know what exactly is a 

735
00:41:20,808 --> 00:41:23,000
technology that we're going to 
use the coordinate? 

736
00:41:23,000 --> 00:41:26,400
Those things where exactly is 
the data availability going to 

737
00:41:26,400 --> 00:41:28,500
live? 
What are the kind of 

738
00:41:28,800 --> 00:41:33,700
Foundational validator sets or 
you know trusts networks that 

739
00:41:33,700 --> 00:41:35,500
secure different parts of the 
system. 

740
00:41:35,900 --> 00:41:37,300
People have different 
perspectives there but I 

741
00:41:37,308 --> 00:41:39,700
actually think from a like 
architecture perspective we're 

742
00:41:39,700 --> 00:41:43,500
generally converging Yeah, 
absolutely. 

743
00:41:43,900 --> 00:41:47,700
Well, we have talked, we've 
mentioned quite a bit, you know,

744
00:41:47,700 --> 00:41:51,400
pisac, you guys building on that
and on Optimum On optimism. 

745
00:41:51,800 --> 00:41:56,000
Now, of course, that's not the 
only layer to technology is. 

746
00:41:56,000 --> 00:42:01,500
I mean, arbitrary term is of 
course the other roll up that 

747
00:42:01,700 --> 00:42:06,000
today you know it's life and has
significant traction and then 

748
00:42:06,000 --> 00:42:08,500
there's a lot of other things 
coming right with more like 

749
00:42:09,100 --> 00:42:13,600
based on ZK technology. 
So, Why did you guys decide to 

750
00:42:13,600 --> 00:42:19,400
go with the Opie stack? 
So one note on Dopey stack and 

751
00:42:19,400 --> 00:42:22,000
just kind of optimism. 
Very optimistic versus ZK. 

752
00:42:22,000 --> 00:42:25,900
Roll-Ups generally and I think 
we don't think about this as 

753
00:42:25,900 --> 00:42:29,800
like an optimistic or ZK, 
roll-up question. 

754
00:42:30,600 --> 00:42:34,700
I think our thesis is that as 
these technology is mature, 

755
00:42:35,100 --> 00:42:37,000
basically, what's gonna happen 
is because they're all open 

756
00:42:37,000 --> 00:42:39,100
source because this is all being
done in the open. 

757
00:42:39,100 --> 00:42:41,800
We're gonna be able to bring 
together the best of all of 

758
00:42:41,800 --> 00:42:44,600
these things to upgrade the 
chains. 

759
00:42:44,800 --> 00:42:47,800
And so as we've been building, 
Based and as we've been kind of 

760
00:42:47,800 --> 00:42:50,500
doubling down on the Opie stack.
I think the key thing that we've

761
00:42:50,500 --> 00:42:54,600
really optimized for is how do 
we create a modular foundation 

762
00:42:54,600 --> 00:42:58,200
for this chain? 
So that as the technology 

763
00:42:58,200 --> 00:43:00,600
matures we can plug in the 
things that make it better. 

764
00:43:00,600 --> 00:43:04,100
And so an example of this is 
we're starting with optimistic 

765
00:43:04,100 --> 00:43:05,900
fault Gruber. 
That's going to be the thing 

766
00:43:05,900 --> 00:43:07,400
that kind of secures the 
network. 

767
00:43:07,800 --> 00:43:13,100
But that proved ER component of 
the Opie stack is module and the

768
00:43:13,107 --> 00:43:16,500
second we have AZ, K EB M, 
that's mature enough. 

769
00:43:17,700 --> 00:43:21,700
We can add that in either in a 
multi prove or setup or as a 

770
00:43:21,707 --> 00:43:23,400
replacement for the optimistic 
Poober. 

771
00:43:23,600 --> 00:43:26,200
And I think we believe that over
the next few years were 

772
00:43:26,200 --> 00:43:29,500
basically going to increment to 
the upgrade this thing. 

773
00:43:29,500 --> 00:43:33,400
So that sometime in 2024 2025, 
we're gonna have many provers 

774
00:43:33,400 --> 00:43:35,300
running in parallel. 
They're going to provide more 

775
00:43:35,300 --> 00:43:37,500
resiliency, more redundancy on 
the system. 

776
00:43:37,900 --> 00:43:42,400
Lower finality time between L1 
and L2 and make it so no failure

777
00:43:42,400 --> 00:43:45,100
in one place, you know, risks 
user funds. 

778
00:43:45,500 --> 00:43:49,300
So that Kind of mental model of 
like this isn't optimistic or 

779
00:43:49,300 --> 00:43:52,600
ZK, roll up but instead it's 
like optimistic and ZK roll up 

780
00:43:52,600 --> 00:43:57,200
and it's like how do we build 
the system to be upgradeable so 

781
00:43:57,200 --> 00:43:59,900
it can be flexible to those 
technology improvements. 

782
00:43:59,900 --> 00:44:02,400
I think has been The Guiding 
kind of North our processes. 

783
00:44:02,400 --> 00:44:05,800
We've been building base in 
terms of Y optimism and oop 

784
00:44:05,800 --> 00:44:07,700
stack. 
Specifically, I'd say there's 

785
00:44:07,700 --> 00:44:10,400
really four reasons. 
The first reason is this kind of

786
00:44:10,400 --> 00:44:12,500
Technology question? 
It's like you know, how did we 

787
00:44:12,500 --> 00:44:14,900
get to how do we make sure we're
building on a sufficiently 

788
00:44:14,900 --> 00:44:18,900
modular sufficiently strong? 
Nation for what we think will be

789
00:44:18,900 --> 00:44:21,300
many many years. 
If iteration in terms of making 

790
00:44:21,300 --> 00:44:25,700
this chain high quality and we 
feel great about collaboration 

791
00:44:25,700 --> 00:44:28,800
with optimism there. 
Other thing also says, we also 

792
00:44:28,800 --> 00:44:30,900
feel great about all the other 
incredible work that's happening

793
00:44:30,900 --> 00:44:32,700
in the industry. 
You know, the work that our 

794
00:44:32,700 --> 00:44:34,600
drums doing is totally Cutting 
Edge. 

795
00:44:34,700 --> 00:44:38,700
They've been leading the way on 
the Paul Kruger scroll in terms 

796
00:44:38,700 --> 00:44:41,800
of having the ZK U VM that's UVM
equivalent. 

797
00:44:41,800 --> 00:44:44,500
I think they're really pushing 
boundaries polygons in terms of 

798
00:44:44,500 --> 00:44:47,900
just moving quickly. 
Getting things out the door. 

799
00:44:48,400 --> 00:44:50,200
You know, huge inspiration 
there. 

800
00:44:50,200 --> 00:44:53,800
And I think our goal is to not 
just work with optimism but to 

801
00:44:53,800 --> 00:44:56,100
work with all of these teams to 
figure out. 

802
00:44:56,100 --> 00:45:00,300
How do we bring the best of 
these Technologies together to 

803
00:45:00,300 --> 00:45:04,300
scale, the crypto economy, and 
make it possible for a million 

804
00:45:04,300 --> 00:45:06,200
Builders to create the 
applications that bring a 

805
00:45:06,207 --> 00:45:09,400
billion users on Jane. 
But anyways, the first ones 

806
00:45:09,400 --> 00:45:12,400
technology, I did a second. 
Big reason why we're working 

807
00:45:12,400 --> 00:45:15,300
with optimism is the kind of 
Licensing and open source 

808
00:45:15,300 --> 00:45:19,300
approach of the OPC. 
If you re m is open-source 

809
00:45:19,300 --> 00:45:23,000
freely available, that's been 
the thing that has both driven 

810
00:45:23,000 --> 00:45:25,100
so much of the Innovation that's
happened around the theorem 

811
00:45:25,100 --> 00:45:28,100
because people could for can 
experiment with it and I think 

812
00:45:28,200 --> 00:45:31,100
been so essential to protecting 
that permissionless nests and 

813
00:45:31,100 --> 00:45:32,600
openness that we talked about 
earlier. 

814
00:45:33,400 --> 00:45:37,200
And I think optimism's approach 
with the Opie stack is the same 

815
00:45:37,200 --> 00:45:38,700
and that felt really important 
to us. 

816
00:45:38,900 --> 00:45:41,500
We want to be taking our 
resources, not putting them into

817
00:45:41,500 --> 00:45:44,400
a silo, or I think that was 
just-- benefiting coinbase, but 

818
00:45:44,400 --> 00:45:46,400
instead putting them into 
something that was open source. 

819
00:45:46,500 --> 00:45:49,000
Something I was freely available
to anyone could benefit from 

820
00:45:49,100 --> 00:45:51,700
whether they wanted to join in 
with us and build or Fork. 

821
00:45:52,200 --> 00:45:55,900
So that kind of open-source 
ethos was the second reason, the

822
00:45:55,900 --> 00:46:00,200
third reason was often isms work
and thinking around funding 

823
00:46:00,200 --> 00:46:02,700
public goods. 
I don't know how much you guys 

824
00:46:02,700 --> 00:46:04,800
know, but they've been running 
these retroactive public its 

825
00:46:04,800 --> 00:46:07,400
funding rounds. 
And in general kind of pushing 

826
00:46:07,500 --> 00:46:09,900
the boundaries of like how can 
we make sure that we're getting 

827
00:46:10,200 --> 00:46:12,400
the money that's created in 
these systems back to the 

828
00:46:12,400 --> 00:46:14,700
underlying infrastructure, 
whether its core, internet 

829
00:46:14,700 --> 00:46:17,800
infrastructure or a theorem in 
Structure like Gap and not their

830
00:46:17,800 --> 00:46:20,900
mind in Oregon or the Opie stack
infrastructure. 

831
00:46:20,900 --> 00:46:24,800
And so, contributing to that, 
and being a part of it, and 

832
00:46:24,800 --> 00:46:26,700
supporting those public goods, 
felt really important to us. 

833
00:46:27,300 --> 00:46:29,100
That's also why we're 
contributing a portion of the 

834
00:46:29,100 --> 00:46:33,000
revenue That Base generates from
transaction fees back to that 

835
00:46:33,000 --> 00:46:35,600
retroactive public goods funding
mechanism, through the optimism 

836
00:46:35,600 --> 00:46:37,700
Collective. 
So I was the third reason and 

837
00:46:37,700 --> 00:46:42,200
then the fourth reason was We 
started working with optimism 

838
00:46:42,600 --> 00:46:47,900
little bit more than a year ago,
on VIP 4844 which again is this 

839
00:46:47,900 --> 00:46:50,800
upgrade to a theorem that was 
before we started working on 

840
00:46:50,800 --> 00:46:52,800
base, we didn't know we were 
going to build now to it that 

841
00:46:52,800 --> 00:46:56,600
time, we were just wanting to 
scale here again because we felt

842
00:46:56,600 --> 00:46:58,400
like scaling a theorem was going
to help the industry which is 

843
00:46:58,400 --> 00:47:02,000
going to help coinbase. 
I think through that context of 

844
00:47:02,000 --> 00:47:06,100
like working on a theory, mm 
together and writing code and 

845
00:47:06,100 --> 00:47:09,500
writing docs and like 
collaborating, we build trust. 

846
00:47:09,500 --> 00:47:11,400
We got to know each other. 
We got to fill out each other 

847
00:47:11,400 --> 00:47:12,800
and be like, do we work well 
together? 

848
00:47:12,800 --> 00:47:15,200
What I think we saw was like, 
yeah, we work well together. 

849
00:47:15,400 --> 00:47:17,300
And this is actually been a 
consistent pattern that we've 

850
00:47:17,300 --> 00:47:19,900
seen. 
Which is that the shelling point

851
00:47:19,900 --> 00:47:23,800
of a cerium from a collaboration
perspective of finding people 

852
00:47:23,800 --> 00:47:26,000
and starting there and being 
like, let's work on the theorem 

853
00:47:26,000 --> 00:47:27,900
because we know it's going to be
good for all of us. 

854
00:47:28,200 --> 00:47:32,400
And then as we do that, Now, as 
we build that context, how do we

855
00:47:32,400 --> 00:47:34,800
kind of add on additional 
collaborations? 

856
00:47:35,200 --> 00:47:37,600
I think that's been a really 
powerful approach that has 

857
00:47:37,600 --> 00:47:40,900
consistently, brought us great 
people who we love working with 

858
00:47:42,900 --> 00:47:45,600
Yeah, that's that's super 
interesting. 

859
00:47:45,900 --> 00:47:48,400
It's funny I've actually never 
had this. 

860
00:47:49,600 --> 00:47:53,600
I mean basically building 
upgradable infrastructure 

861
00:47:54,300 --> 00:47:58,700
protocol is this is is super 
difficult because you kind of 

862
00:47:58,700 --> 00:48:02,900
have to know where you want to 
be able to upgrade right. 

863
00:48:02,900 --> 00:48:05,200
You don't want to be able to 
upgrade everything. 

864
00:48:05,400 --> 00:48:10,700
So how how far have you planned 
this out to kind of upgrade Bays

865
00:48:10,700 --> 00:48:12,800
into a z. 
Okay. 

866
00:48:12,800 --> 00:48:15,900
Roll up because basically from 
an engineering perspective 

867
00:48:16,700 --> 00:48:21,200
that's that seems incredibly 
complex and really difficult to 

868
00:48:21,207 --> 00:48:24,200
kind of lay out. 
So basically, to me it would 

869
00:48:24,200 --> 00:48:28,100
seem it might, I mean from it 
and you know, from practical 

870
00:48:28,100 --> 00:48:33,500
perspective and might even be 
easier to just redeploy a new 

871
00:48:33,500 --> 00:48:39,000
roll up, that's kind of innately
ZK, you know, rather than kind 

872
00:48:39,000 --> 00:48:42,000
of ensuring that you can upgrade
in all the right places. 

873
00:48:44,300 --> 00:48:46,900
I think there's a lot of hard 
technology problems to solve 

874
00:48:46,900 --> 00:48:50,300
here. 
But I think one of our goals and

875
00:48:50,300 --> 00:48:53,700
Theses here is this is a 
long-term investment, a 

876
00:48:53,707 --> 00:48:55,500
long-term project. 
We're going to measure our 

877
00:48:55,500 --> 00:48:59,300
success on the order of beers 
just like if you're in has 

878
00:48:59,300 --> 00:49:01,600
measured its success on the 
order of years and I think, you 

879
00:49:01,600 --> 00:49:06,300
know, we've been inspired by a 
theorems ability to consistently

880
00:49:06,300 --> 00:49:08,000
make progress and upgrade 
itself. 

881
00:49:08,100 --> 00:49:10,800
Even as that has been a real 
challenge. 

882
00:49:10,800 --> 00:49:13,300
You know, something taking 
longer than we might want, but 

883
00:49:13,300 --> 00:49:19,600
that At malleability and the 
ability to evolve, I think it 

884
00:49:19,600 --> 00:49:24,000
has been very inspiring for us, 
in terms of like the specific 

885
00:49:24,000 --> 00:49:27,200
technology side. 
You know, I think with the way 

886
00:49:27,200 --> 00:49:30,800
we've been building, the 
openstack is to have as much 

887
00:49:30,800 --> 00:49:34,900
modular as possible around the 
proving layer and around the 

888
00:49:34,900 --> 00:49:37,800
data availability layer, because
those are the things that feel 

889
00:49:37,800 --> 00:49:40,400
like from our perspective, 
they're the most. 

890
00:49:40,400 --> 00:49:43,700
Well, defined in terms of places
that we will want to upgrade. 

891
00:49:43,900 --> 00:49:46,900
Evolve data availability right 
now is obviously going to be a 

892
00:49:46,900 --> 00:49:49,100
cerium. 
We want to make it so people can

893
00:49:49,100 --> 00:49:52,700
also use the Opie stack to not 
run on ethereum whether that's 

894
00:49:52,700 --> 00:49:55,700
putting their data on other L1 
or putting their data in the 

895
00:49:55,707 --> 00:49:57,800
data availability committee, 
that's gonna allow them to run 

896
00:49:57,800 --> 00:49:59,400
it. 
Much faster and have much lower 

897
00:49:59,400 --> 00:50:02,800
fees, so I'd say and then 
improving side, really talked 

898
00:50:02,800 --> 00:50:04,700
about this, you know, thinking 
about optimistic, rolls-royce's,

899
00:50:04,700 --> 00:50:07,000
you get robbed. 
So I think those are the two 

900
00:50:07,000 --> 00:50:10,900
areas that we focus most on From
upgradability perspective, in 

901
00:50:10,908 --> 00:50:15,100
terms of the exact ZK you No 
path there. 

902
00:50:15,400 --> 00:50:17,100
I think it's, I think it's very 
possible. 

903
00:50:17,700 --> 00:50:21,600
I think one of the things that 
we definitely feel is like it's 

904
00:50:21,600 --> 00:50:24,500
the, it's not the expertise that
we have a coin basis and I also 

905
00:50:24,500 --> 00:50:28,400
don't think it's the expertise 
that optimism has a topi, Labs, 

906
00:50:28,400 --> 00:50:32,500
optimism foundation, and this 
one like that at some in some 

907
00:50:32,500 --> 00:50:34,500
ways that feels like a risk in 
some ways, it also feels like 

908
00:50:34,500 --> 00:50:38,600
exciting to us like what that 
means is there's face for more 

909
00:50:38,600 --> 00:50:41,500
people to be building with us, 
you know, there's space for 

910
00:50:41,500 --> 00:50:43,600
other teams to say hey wow, this
is a value. 

911
00:50:43,800 --> 00:50:46,600
Both yelling Point like let's 
figure out how to make this work

912
00:50:47,200 --> 00:50:49,100
and we're you know, we're having
some of those conversations 

913
00:50:49,100 --> 00:50:53,400
today and I think that there's a
very real path to both bringing 

914
00:50:53,400 --> 00:50:57,100
the technology but also bring 
the talent together to 

915
00:50:57,100 --> 00:51:01,100
contribute to you know there's 
open source interoperable freely

916
00:51:01,100 --> 00:51:04,500
available tool kit that's 
starting to kind of shape up to 

917
00:51:04,500 --> 00:51:08,300
scale it cerium and the broader 
crypto economy. 

918
00:51:10,600 --> 00:51:13,100
When are the other drawbacks of 
optimism is kind of the 

919
00:51:13,100 --> 00:51:16,800
withdrawal period, right? 
So basically, I think it's 

920
00:51:16,800 --> 00:51:19,700
pretty well known that when you 
kind of want to withdraw 

921
00:51:19,700 --> 00:51:23,100
something from an optimistic 
roll-up, you have like this 

922
00:51:23,100 --> 00:51:26,400
weight period of one week and 
for many assets this isn't 

923
00:51:26,400 --> 00:51:29,900
really that much of that big of 
a deal because you can have like

924
00:51:29,900 --> 00:51:32,700
a liquidity protocol that kind 
of upgrades on top of it. 

925
00:51:33,600 --> 00:51:39,400
But it's a major usability 
problem for everything that's 

926
00:51:39,800 --> 00:51:42,300
nonsense. 
A fungible oral liquid, right? 

927
00:51:42,300 --> 00:51:48,300
So basically, so if you have an 
N ft or any sort of at a station

928
00:51:48,300 --> 00:51:52,700
or social graph or whatever and 
you want to bring it down from 

929
00:51:52,700 --> 00:51:55,900
this, optimistic roll up onto 
another optimistic rolled up or 

930
00:51:56,200 --> 00:52:01,200
layer, one, or another layer 
one, that's you're locked in for

931
00:52:01,200 --> 00:52:04,100
a week. 
And anyway, how are you guys 

932
00:52:04,100 --> 00:52:08,500
thinking about that? 
Yeah, I'm definitely a challenge

933
00:52:08,800 --> 00:52:11,100
and, you know, to your point 
like for fungible assets, this 

934
00:52:11,100 --> 00:52:15,700
is much less in the challenge 
because, you know, we you can do

935
00:52:15,700 --> 00:52:18,500
kind of liquidity bridging 
across them and coinbase has a 

936
00:52:18,500 --> 00:52:21,400
product that makes it. 
So anyone can bring assets from 

937
00:52:21,500 --> 00:52:24,700
autism to aetherium or polygon 
to aetherium or Arbitron to 

938
00:52:24,700 --> 00:52:27,900
etherium instantly. 
And I think we've seen that 

939
00:52:27,900 --> 00:52:30,800
that's pretty consistently been 
like the solution for users and 

940
00:52:30,800 --> 00:52:33,500
do appreciate that on the non 
fungible side. 

941
00:52:33,500 --> 00:52:35,000
I think, I think you're exactly 
right. 

942
00:52:35,000 --> 00:52:38,100
We have work to do here. 
It's, you know, one thing that 

943
00:52:38,100 --> 00:52:41,500
gives me a little bit of Solace 
has people are used to waiting 

944
00:52:41,500 --> 00:52:44,600
absurd amounts of times for some
of these things and existing 

945
00:52:44,600 --> 00:52:47,500
Financial system. 
If you think about like getting 

946
00:52:47,500 --> 00:52:52,200
a loan or you know, getting your
identity verified by the DMV 

947
00:52:52,200 --> 00:52:57,200
like people's expectation bar 
for getting that like final 

948
00:52:57,200 --> 00:53:00,300
check if they want to move 
somewhere else, it's pretty low 

949
00:53:00,400 --> 00:53:03,000
today. 
So I think that that gives us 

950
00:53:03,000 --> 00:53:05,400
time to solve this as we get 
there. 

951
00:53:05,700 --> 00:53:09,300
I think there's some paths that 
we could follow like obviously 

952
00:53:09,600 --> 00:53:12,700
you know, upgrading or 
incorporating a ZK, roll-up can 

953
00:53:12,700 --> 00:53:15,800
lower the finality there. 
I think that there are things 

954
00:53:15,800 --> 00:53:22,800
around L2 L2 interoperability 
that can get us faster than kind

955
00:53:22,800 --> 00:53:26,100
of the L1 finality, through 
shared sequencing. 

956
00:53:26,300 --> 00:53:30,100
I'm really excited about that. 
I think the thesis, I generally 

957
00:53:30,100 --> 00:53:34,400
have it. 
Most users sometime in the next 

958
00:53:34,400 --> 00:53:38,700
little while, will start to on 
board directly owned L1, L2 and 

959
00:53:38,700 --> 00:53:42,000
live directly on L2. 
And they'll, we will actually 

960
00:53:42,000 --> 00:53:45,900
have that many reasons to go to 
L1 unless they're, you know, 

961
00:53:46,000 --> 00:53:49,400
large-scale business users who 
will probably be already on L1 

962
00:53:50,100 --> 00:53:54,100
and now world, you know, if 
you're on 1 L 2, great like you 

963
00:53:54,100 --> 00:53:57,400
know, you don't run size shoe, 
if you're on other l2's, I think

964
00:53:57,400 --> 00:54:00,700
that there's a path for us to 
get more interoperability there 

965
00:54:01,000 --> 00:54:05,600
that Laura finality, so 
definitely a hard problem 

966
00:54:05,600 --> 00:54:08,300
definitely one that we think 
needs to get solved in order to 

967
00:54:08,300 --> 00:54:10,700
you know, provide the ideal user
to experience here. 

968
00:54:10,700 --> 00:54:14,900
But also one that we think we 
will be able to solve with time.

969
00:54:16,200 --> 00:54:21,300
Who is so M, let's talk about 
the depth developers who will 

970
00:54:21,300 --> 00:54:24,500
deploy to base. 
So I assume in the beginning, 

971
00:54:24,500 --> 00:54:27,600
this will mostly be Cross 
deployments of things that 

972
00:54:27,600 --> 00:54:34,600
already run on other chains. 
So how do you go about? 

973
00:54:34,800 --> 00:54:37,600
Not starting on an empty chain, 
right? 

974
00:54:37,600 --> 00:54:41,600
Because if the on the if on day 
one you kind of all open them. 

975
00:54:41,600 --> 00:54:45,300
All and say this is our 
decentralized model everyone. 

976
00:54:45,300 --> 00:54:48,900
Go look at It it and everything.
I'm loving their attacks, right?

977
00:54:48,900 --> 00:54:53,900
Yeah, yeah, exactly. 
So how do you go about kind of 

978
00:54:54,200 --> 00:54:58,200
creating this day? 
One experience for your 

979
00:54:58,200 --> 00:55:07,100
currently centralized users. 
Yeah, so one thing I'll note is,

980
00:55:07,100 --> 00:55:10,400
you know, like the natural 
course of changes, you do have 

981
00:55:10,400 --> 00:55:14,000
some inevitable, phasing that 
has to happen. 

982
00:55:14,000 --> 00:55:16,400
Like you have to do genesis, 
then you have to get some 

983
00:55:16,400 --> 00:55:18,700
infrastructure on there and that
supports other infrastructure 

984
00:55:18,700 --> 00:55:20,700
that supports and other 
infrastructure and that supports

985
00:55:20,700 --> 00:55:23,100
the product. 
So I expect like we're not going

986
00:55:23,100 --> 00:55:26,900
to on day, one have literally 
everything ready to go because 

987
00:55:27,000 --> 00:55:30,300
they depends on, you know, Swap 
and you know coin made small 

988
00:55:30,300 --> 00:55:32,800
interface for borrowing. 
Ends on Ave and we need to get 

989
00:55:32,800 --> 00:55:35,400
all those things sequence. 
So I expect like it will be a 

990
00:55:35,400 --> 00:55:38,500
one two three month period where
we're going to be doing that 

991
00:55:38,500 --> 00:55:42,500
bootstrapping in terms of like, 
you know, if we think about that

992
00:55:42,500 --> 00:55:45,400
is just kind of a given for any 
chain, how do we make sure that 

993
00:55:45,400 --> 00:55:47,800
at the end of that 
bootstrapping, the mute that 

994
00:55:47,800 --> 00:55:52,000
basis the Lively exciting place 
that people want to be, you 

995
00:55:52,000 --> 00:55:55,000
know, one of our values is that 
basis for everyone. 

996
00:55:55,000 --> 00:55:57,500
And we tried to embody that 
best, we could pre-announcement.

997
00:55:58,600 --> 00:56:01,200
We're going to contract try and 
embody that as best we can post 

998
00:56:01,200 --> 00:56:02,000
announcements. 
As well. 

999
00:56:02,000 --> 00:56:06,400
And so I think we went out on 
last Thursday with something 

1000
00:56:06,400 --> 00:56:11,400
like 70, Builders who committed 
to be Building on Base includes 

1001
00:56:11,400 --> 00:56:15,400
basically every kind of Blue 
Chip protocol in the space, a 

1002
00:56:15,408 --> 00:56:18,100
ton of different infrastructure.
Providers do multiple block 

1003
00:56:18,100 --> 00:56:22,400
explorers multiple node 
providers, multiple data 

1004
00:56:22,400 --> 00:56:26,500
providers multiple nft data 
providers and that multiple 

1005
00:56:26,500 --> 00:56:27,800
thing has been really important 
to us. 

1006
00:56:27,800 --> 00:56:31,500
One thing that we really wanted 
to make sure was that we weren't

1007
00:56:31,600 --> 00:56:33,100
Making everything, just climb 
base. 

1008
00:56:33,100 --> 00:56:35,800
So, it wasn't just like first 
party, first party, first party,

1009
00:56:35,800 --> 00:56:37,400
because that's all like, it 
would set everything off on a 

1010
00:56:37,408 --> 00:56:41,300
wrong tone and basis for 
everyone and that we weren't 

1011
00:56:41,300 --> 00:56:44,400
making it a winner-take-all. 
There like a king making 

1012
00:56:44,400 --> 00:56:46,500
situation, where we were like 
hand picking someone. 

1013
00:56:46,500 --> 00:56:49,100
And, you know, that person was 
going to go and kind of take all

1014
00:56:49,100 --> 00:56:52,100
the value. 
And so, for every category, our 

1015
00:56:52,100 --> 00:56:56,400
goal was to get at least three 
people that we felt like, could 

1016
00:56:56,400 --> 00:56:59,900
be kind of a viable option for 
Builders, and users who are 

1017
00:56:59,900 --> 00:57:04,400
coming on chain and Achieve that
in the opening kind of 

1018
00:57:04,400 --> 00:57:06,400
announcement in the folks who 
have already committed to 

1019
00:57:06,400 --> 00:57:10,100
building. 
I think post-launch, we've been 

1020
00:57:11,700 --> 00:57:15,300
exceeded my wildest expectations
in terms of the amount of demand

1021
00:57:15,400 --> 00:57:19,400
and inbound that we've had over 
the last five days is been a 

1022
00:57:19,408 --> 00:57:22,100
fire hose where you've done for 
this week. 

1023
00:57:22,500 --> 00:57:26,000
I'm doing this for my hotel room
and similarly feels like a 

1024
00:57:26,008 --> 00:57:30,000
little bit of a fire hose. 
I think people see the potential

1025
00:57:30,500 --> 00:57:32,900
for what we can do. 
If If we, you know, connect up 

1026
00:57:32,900 --> 00:57:34,600
the coinbase distribution 
connected to coinbase 

1027
00:57:34,600 --> 00:57:37,100
experiences, to the on chain 
economy and they want to be a 

1028
00:57:37,107 --> 00:57:39,700
part of that. 
And so obviously there's a lot 

1029
00:57:39,700 --> 00:57:43,300
of work for us to do in terms of
making sure that those folks you

1030
00:57:43,308 --> 00:57:45,400
know get situated that they have
the right to learn that they 

1031
00:57:45,408 --> 00:57:46,600
have the right infrastructure. 
They have the right 

1032
00:57:46,600 --> 00:57:48,700
documentation. 
I think we're off to a really 

1033
00:57:48,700 --> 00:57:51,300
good start. 
I'm about to go do a workshop 

1034
00:57:51,300 --> 00:57:53,400
with the, you know, a bunch of 
builders that you've Denver to 

1035
00:57:53,408 --> 00:57:55,400
help them build on bathe this 
week. 

1036
00:57:55,400 --> 00:57:59,300
I'm just going to be Literally 
on the ground meaning people 

1037
00:57:59,300 --> 00:58:02,900
connecting with people being as 
helpful as I possibly can be and

1038
00:58:02,900 --> 00:58:06,400
hammering home this value that 
we have, which is that basis for

1039
00:58:06,400 --> 00:58:09,400
everyone, it's an open 
ecosystem, it's not just 

1040
00:58:09,400 --> 00:58:14,100
coinbase, it's not quite amazed 
chain, it is base, and base for 

1041
00:58:14,100 --> 00:58:18,400
everyone. 
How many of these all your base 

1042
00:58:18,400 --> 00:58:22,200
are belong to us? 
Jokes, are you getting lots? 

1043
00:58:22,700 --> 00:58:24,900
Yeah. 
You are very first week. 

1044
00:58:27,100 --> 00:58:32,000
All your base are belong to you,
which felt much more like, you 

1045
00:58:32,000 --> 00:58:35,500
know, we don't your base, you on
your base, it's for everyone. 

1046
00:58:36,200 --> 00:58:40,600
We actually, we tried to put 
that in the Genesis block for 

1047
00:58:40,600 --> 00:58:44,800
the test net, but we messed up 
and so it's not just as black 

1048
00:58:44,800 --> 00:58:46,600
for the test net. 
That was the plan. 

1049
00:58:47,100 --> 00:58:49,100
We'll see if we put it in the 
chest and spot for the main. 

1050
00:58:49,100 --> 00:58:51,200
Now, we might put something else
or still deciding. 

1051
00:58:51,900 --> 00:58:53,100
Yeah. 
Maybe one of the things we love 

1052
00:58:53,100 --> 00:58:55,100
about the name base. 
I mean there's two things we 

1053
00:58:55,100 --> 00:58:58,100
love about the name base, lat, 
In so many things about the 

1054
00:58:58,100 --> 00:58:59,400
name. 
Based, what is that? 

1055
00:58:59,400 --> 00:59:02,200
It's just like spiritually 
connected to coinbase, you know,

1056
00:59:02,200 --> 00:59:06,800
it's like of coinbase but not 
coinbase, which feels really 

1057
00:59:06,800 --> 00:59:09,600
meaningful to us to, is that 
obviously, it's connected to 

1058
00:59:09,600 --> 00:59:13,600
this meaning of, like 
Foundation, of kind of being 

1059
00:59:13,600 --> 00:59:15,800
this essential part of the 
broader kept economy and 

1060
00:59:15,800 --> 00:59:21,700
platform and then three, it is 
like the most memorable meme 

1061
00:59:21,700 --> 00:59:26,100
word ever, like the number of 
based memes and all your, all 

1062
00:59:26,100 --> 00:59:29,000
your, all your Our Belong To You
memes. 

1063
00:59:29,000 --> 00:59:31,500
We have a whole meme Channel 
acquiring base that I haven't 

1064
00:59:31,500 --> 00:59:33,400
yet, gotten permission to just 
share publicly. 

1065
00:59:33,800 --> 00:59:37,100
When people are just been baking
base memes, we've tried to build

1066
00:59:37,100 --> 00:59:39,900
on that mutability with the blue
dot, which we think has worked 

1067
00:59:39,900 --> 00:59:43,400
pretty well. 
But in general, like, there's so

1068
00:59:43,400 --> 00:59:47,400
much great content to be created
here and we think that that kind

1069
00:59:47,400 --> 00:59:50,500
of content is the stuff that's 
going to bring in everyday 

1070
00:59:50,500 --> 00:59:54,600
people to come use base and 
that's who we need. 

1071
00:59:54,600 --> 00:59:56,500
If we want to get to a billion 
people on chain. 

1072
00:59:57,000 --> 00:59:58,400
It's going to take a lot of 
memes. 

1073
01:00:00,100 --> 01:00:02,200
Absolutely, you mentioned 
maenette launched. 

1074
01:00:02,300 --> 01:00:06,000
Maybe final question here. 
I mean, what is the timeline for

1075
01:00:06,000 --> 01:00:09,600
minute launch and maybe if there
are any other major Milestones 

1076
01:00:09,600 --> 01:00:13,200
that are coming up for bass? 
Yeah. 

1077
01:00:13,200 --> 01:00:15,900
So we're working to get to Maine
as quickly and safely as 

1078
01:00:15,900 --> 01:00:19,800
possible. 
Hopefully next few months, one 

1079
01:00:19,800 --> 01:00:23,200
of the things that we, you know,
I think benefit from here is 

1080
01:00:23,200 --> 01:00:25,600
like, we're not running this 
chain. 

1081
01:00:25,600 --> 01:00:27,700
Like this is not the first test 
net for this chain. 

1082
01:00:27,900 --> 01:00:30,000
This is not for the 
technologist, powering the 

1083
01:00:30,000 --> 01:00:31,800
chain. 
We're not like, off on our own 

1084
01:00:31,800 --> 01:00:34,100
doing this, and so that's going 
to have us. 

1085
01:00:34,600 --> 01:00:37,500
Let us have a shorter test net 
period, Then potentially other 

1086
01:00:37,500 --> 01:00:40,300
things that are coming to Market
because we have that resiliency 

1087
01:00:40,300 --> 01:00:43,000
and redundancy and the battle 
testing that's already In other 

1088
01:00:43,000 --> 01:00:46,800
ecosystems, I think optimism is 
currently planning to bring 

1089
01:00:46,800 --> 01:00:49,500
Bedrock, which is kind of the 
release that we're running on 

1090
01:00:49,500 --> 01:00:55,300
two main that in mid late, April
and will pass follow them. 

1091
01:00:57,200 --> 01:01:00,600
So no specific timeline. 
But next few months is what 

1092
01:01:00,600 --> 01:01:02,700
we're aiming for. 
There's a lot of excitement, a 

1093
01:01:02,707 --> 01:01:06,000
lot of anticipation. 
We're going to do it as quickly 

1094
01:01:06,000 --> 01:01:09,200
and safely as we can and get 
based in the hands of builders 

1095
01:01:09,400 --> 01:01:12,400
that they can start building and
are my goal. 

1096
01:01:12,500 --> 01:01:16,200
It's not that I haven't set the 
goal yet but it's the framing 

1097
01:01:16,200 --> 01:01:19,900
that I've been working with is a
built a million builders on base

1098
01:01:19,900 --> 01:01:23,600
in 2023. 
A billion people on base in 2024

1099
01:01:24,800 --> 01:01:26,100
Wow. 
Okay. 

1100
01:01:26,100 --> 01:01:27,300
I like that. 
That's a good. 

1101
01:01:27,300 --> 01:01:32,600
That's an audacious goal and 
I've got one of these days. 

1102
01:01:32,600 --> 01:01:35,600
It's gonna happen. 
Yeah, it really does feel like 

1103
01:01:35,600 --> 01:01:40,100
we've been You know like climate
crypto has been kind of like 

1104
01:01:40,600 --> 01:01:42,800
working its way past a certain 
point. 

1105
01:01:42,800 --> 01:01:45,600
The platform is going to work, 
we're gonna have the right w. 

1106
01:01:45,600 --> 01:01:48,400
We have the right identity tools
were gonna have the right wallet

1107
01:01:48,400 --> 01:01:50,100
infrastructure. 
We have the right chamber, sir, 

1108
01:01:50,100 --> 01:01:52,900
it's me low-cost enough and to 
me, it really feels like this is

1109
01:01:52,900 --> 01:01:56,900
the year where those pieces are 
finally, like, almost ready like

1110
01:01:56,900 --> 01:01:59,700
they're in sight. 
And we just need to push a 

1111
01:01:59,707 --> 01:02:02,500
little bit harder to get them. 
All to work really well together

1112
01:02:02,700 --> 01:02:04,600
and that's going to be this 
Catalyst that will drive the 

1113
01:02:04,600 --> 01:02:07,400
next, you know, billion people 
and change cool. 

1114
01:02:07,800 --> 01:02:10,600
Well, Jesse, thanks so much for 
coming on is been really a 

1115
01:02:10,600 --> 01:02:13,500
pleasure to speak with you. 
I think you did an excellent job

1116
01:02:13,500 --> 01:02:17,900
at sort of explaining to us what
base is and and I think one 

1117
01:02:17,900 --> 01:02:20,500
thing also really appreciated, 
you know, like emphasizing and 

1118
01:02:20,500 --> 01:02:23,900
sort of, you know, the values 
behind that and calling basis 

1119
01:02:23,900 --> 01:02:25,700
values. 
And I think for sure I agree 

1120
01:02:25,700 --> 01:02:29,600
that, you know, coinbase has 
been doing, you know, a very 

1121
01:02:29,600 --> 01:02:32,200
important job, right? 
In, like trying to like push 

1122
01:02:32,200 --> 01:02:36,700
back a bit against like, all the
horrible regulatory ideas and 

1123
01:02:36,700 --> 01:02:39,100
Gary Gensler. 
And whatnot is coming. 

1124
01:02:40,100 --> 01:02:42,100
So I think that's you know 
really important, right? 

1125
01:02:42,100 --> 01:02:45,700
And hopefully you guys will 
continue to do that work and 

1126
01:02:45,700 --> 01:02:49,100
advocate for, you know, free and
open decentralized systems and 

1127
01:02:49,100 --> 01:02:52,000
open Financial system. 
So thanks so much and really 

1128
01:02:52,000 --> 01:02:55,200
excited to see how basically 
develop and how are we going to 

1129
01:02:55,500 --> 01:02:59,400
how you going to fare on these 
these targets that you guys are 

1130
01:03:00,000 --> 01:03:04,600
have set. 
Well, I appreciate y'all having 

1131
01:03:04,600 --> 01:03:06,800
me on said, help people build on
base. 

1132
01:03:07,800 --> 01:03:10,100
Cool. 
Thanks so much Jesse, and thanks

1133
01:03:10,100 --> 01:03:11,600
so much for listeners for tuning
in. 

1134
01:03:12,000 --> 01:03:16,000
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1135
01:03:16,100 --> 01:03:19,300
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1136
01:03:19,300 --> 01:03:20,800
very excited to be back next 
week. 

1137
01:03:22,900 --> 01:03:24,800
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1138
01:03:25,100 --> 01:03:26,700
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1139
01:03:27,300 --> 01:03:30,100
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01:03:30,100 --> 01:03:33,200
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01:03:33,500 --> 01:03:36,300
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1142
01:03:36,300 --> 01:03:39,300
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1143
01:03:39,300 --> 01:03:42,400
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1144
01:03:42,400 --> 01:03:45,000
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01:03:51,200 --> 01:03:53,800
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01:03:53,800 --> 01:03:55,200
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01:03:55,400 --> 01:03:57,700
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01:03:57,700 --> 01:04:01,000
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01:04:01,000 --> 01:03:53,800
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01:03:53,800 --> 01:03:55,200
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01:03:55,400 --> 01:03:57,700
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01:03:57,700 --> 01:04:01,000
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1155
01:04:01,000 --> 01:04:01,300
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