1 00:00:14,400 --> 00:00:18,800 Welcome to epicenter episode 392, today we have on with us 2 00:00:18,800 --> 00:00:21,600 goofy, true poles, who is the co-founder of alchemax. 3 00:00:21,900 --> 00:00:24,000 But before we talk to this creepy about alchemax, we'd like 4 00:00:24,000 --> 00:00:27,600 to tell you a bit about our sponsors this week, Exodus, 5 00:00:27,900 --> 00:00:30,800 Exodus is a easy to use wallet. Which supports hundreds of 6 00:00:30,800 --> 00:00:34,100 assets and has native apps for all platforms, including IOS, 7 00:00:34,100 --> 00:00:36,500 and Android. And as a fully non-custodial 8 00:00:36,500 --> 00:00:39,800 wallet, their firm Believers in the not your keys not are coins. 9 00:00:39,800 --> 00:00:42,800 Mantra go to Exodus.com to give it a try. 10 00:00:43,700 --> 00:00:45,900 Next up, we have para swap / swap. 11 00:00:45,900 --> 00:00:47,300 Just came out with a huge upgrade. 12 00:00:47,300 --> 00:00:49,200 That's even faster and more liquid. 13 00:00:49,500 --> 00:00:52,000 It's cheaper than you know, shop and comes with a new gas token 14 00:00:52,000 --> 00:00:54,900 that can cut your gas fees by up to 50%. 15 00:00:55,000 --> 00:00:58,600 Make your trade and go to Paris swap dot IO / epicenter. 16 00:00:58,900 --> 00:01:02,500 And finally, we have Solana Solana is a next-generation. 17 00:01:02,500 --> 00:01:05,800 Blockchain with lightning-fast blocks and fees less than a cent 18 00:01:05,800 --> 00:01:08,300 per transaction. Scalability is perhaps the 19 00:01:08,300 --> 00:01:10,600 single biggest challenge preventing crypto from becoming 20 00:01:10,600 --> 00:01:12,700 the backbone to the world financial system. 21 00:01:13,100 --> 00:01:15,600 And today, Solana May well be the best solution. 22 00:01:15,600 --> 00:01:19,900 We have go to salon, a.com slash epicenter to learn more. 23 00:01:20,800 --> 00:01:25,300 All right, so Scooby it's super awesome to have you on you. 24 00:01:25,300 --> 00:01:28,200 And I have like, you know, I feel like we've like, chatted on 25 00:01:28,200 --> 00:01:31,200 like Twitter threads and stuff. For a long time. 26 00:01:31,200 --> 00:01:34,800 I think I do this like thing where annually, I figure out I 27 00:01:34,800 --> 00:01:38,100 run a script at the end of the year to see whose Twitter 28 00:01:38,100 --> 00:01:41,800 accounts I've liked the most like the who's tweets. 29 00:01:41,800 --> 00:01:44,700 I've liked the most and I think in 2020 you were like number 30 00:01:44,700 --> 00:01:47,900 like seven or eight on my list and which is really cool because 31 00:01:47,900 --> 00:01:50,100 like this is the first time wherever talking in person. 32 00:01:50,700 --> 00:01:52,000 I think probably everyone else on the list. 33 00:01:52,000 --> 00:01:54,100 It's like people actually knew in person or something but it's 34 00:01:54,107 --> 00:01:56,000 like you were. So this is really cool to 35 00:01:56,000 --> 00:01:57,500 finally get a chance to talk to you. 36 00:01:57,800 --> 00:01:59,600 So yeah. Can you tell us a little bit 37 00:01:59,600 --> 00:02:02,600 about Yourself and like, you know, I mean, okay. 38 00:02:02,600 --> 00:02:04,700 One thing that people can probably obviously tell us Koopa 39 00:02:04,700 --> 00:02:06,400 troopas is probably not your real name. 40 00:02:06,400 --> 00:02:11,100 So, tell us a little bit about how you got into crypto and why 41 00:02:11,500 --> 00:02:13,000 you use the name Scoopy, triples. 42 00:02:14,400 --> 00:02:18,300 Yeah, I mean, it's fun that we interact on Twitter, you know, I 43 00:02:18,300 --> 00:02:20,600 always loved that. You have like, these random 44 00:02:20,600 --> 00:02:24,000 geography fact threads that this continual thread. 45 00:02:24,500 --> 00:02:27,100 It's always a highlight of my day to find to learn something 46 00:02:27,100 --> 00:02:30,800 new from you, but how did Why get into crypto? 47 00:02:30,800 --> 00:02:36,800 Yeah, so it was, I mean my journey like all the way started 48 00:02:36,800 --> 00:02:39,000 back in the I think it was in 2011. 49 00:02:39,200 --> 00:02:42,500 And when I heard about the, the Silk Road for the first time, 50 00:02:42,500 --> 00:02:47,700 there was like a giant expose. It was like I'm Gawker and all 51 00:02:47,700 --> 00:02:52,400 sorts of Internet websites. And, you know, I got interested 52 00:02:52,400 --> 00:02:56,200 in it and I downloaded Tor Browser. 53 00:02:56,200 --> 00:02:59,000 And I wanted the Pirate Bay and I found a website where I could 54 00:02:59,000 --> 00:03:04,200 buy Now there's like right about that buy button and then I was 55 00:03:04,200 --> 00:03:08,400 just like hmm I don't think I'm gonna do this, this is weird 56 00:03:08,400 --> 00:03:12,100 this internet money stuff you know it sounds dumb and then I 57 00:03:12,100 --> 00:03:15,900 backed out and then so I sort of knew about Bitcoin this entire 58 00:03:15,900 --> 00:03:20,900 time didn't pay it a ton of attention to it and then like in 59 00:03:20,900 --> 00:03:24,300 2013 like a family member so I can do you got to get this 60 00:03:24,300 --> 00:03:26,300 Bitcoin thing? It just wanted to like a 61 00:03:26,300 --> 00:03:28,400 thousand dollars. I'm like, wait, what? 62 00:03:28,400 --> 00:03:29,800 Last time I checked it was like a doll. 63 00:03:29,900 --> 00:03:33,300 Dollar and so I thought, you know, I just missed it, I 64 00:03:33,300 --> 00:03:36,200 thought it was a bubble and then I felt really Vindicated when it 65 00:03:36,200 --> 00:03:39,600 crashed, you know, it was in his bare Market in like, you know, 66 00:03:39,600 --> 00:03:45,300 2015 and 2016. And my wife was like, Hey 67 00:03:45,300 --> 00:03:48,300 Scooby, we need to do some investing and, you know, start 68 00:03:48,300 --> 00:03:51,600 looking into that stuff. And this time I look, I don't 69 00:03:51,600 --> 00:03:54,300 know about this Bitcoin stuff. I know I was like following that 70 00:03:54,300 --> 00:03:55,600 a while ago. How's that doing? 71 00:03:56,200 --> 00:04:00,800 And I, you know, I went down the rabbit hole and I More about it, 72 00:04:00,800 --> 00:04:04,000 you know, on a deeper level and I was like, you know what, let's 73 00:04:04,000 --> 00:04:06,100 do this. Like you know Screw stocks, 74 00:04:06,100 --> 00:04:09,600 let's go into Bitcoin and so late 2016. 75 00:04:09,600 --> 00:04:13,500 I got into Bitcoin and 2017. I did what everyone else did and 76 00:04:13,500 --> 00:04:18,899 they you know spend a lot of money on ico's and coins that 77 00:04:19,300 --> 00:04:21,600 have fancy infographics. That make it look like they have 78 00:04:21,600 --> 00:04:24,400 an ecosystem but they really don't have an ecosystem at all. 79 00:04:24,800 --> 00:04:28,500 And then eventually I just kind of gravitated more and more 80 00:04:28,500 --> 00:04:31,400 towards a theory. Especially towards the end of 81 00:04:31,407 --> 00:04:35,500 2017 and early 2018, when the app started becoming more and 82 00:04:35,500 --> 00:04:39,500 more popular ethereum. The crypto kitties was my first 83 00:04:39,500 --> 00:04:44,200 deep and then I played around with stupid Ponzi money games 84 00:04:44,700 --> 00:04:46,900 because that was the only thing out there in 2018. 85 00:04:46,900 --> 00:04:50,100 There was no like D5. But at that time, like, you 86 00:04:50,100 --> 00:04:52,900 know, even though these were like kind of stupid money games, 87 00:04:52,900 --> 00:04:56,600 it kind of got my, you know, my brain going like, whoa, you can 88 00:04:56,600 --> 00:04:59,800 do a lot of stuff with programmable money, and at that. 89 00:05:00,000 --> 00:05:04,100 I'm I wasn't a developer, but I was like, you know what, let's 90 00:05:04,100 --> 00:05:07,000 go in, let's do this. And so I started learning how to 91 00:05:07,000 --> 00:05:11,700 code, I became a web developer at that time, sorry, getting 92 00:05:11,700 --> 00:05:18,600 some jobs for Web 2.0, stuff, using react, and then it was a 93 00:05:18,600 --> 00:05:22,700 summer of twenty. Twenty one of my friends that I 94 00:05:22,700 --> 00:05:25,400 met in crypto discords, he's like, hey, I need a front end 95 00:05:25,400 --> 00:05:29,300 developer for this app I'm making and at the time it was 96 00:05:29,300 --> 00:05:33,300 called She's fi this is back in June before, Sushi. 97 00:05:33,300 --> 00:05:35,900 Before yam before? Any of the food token? 98 00:05:35,900 --> 00:05:41,300 Craze hit, we had cheese fi and it was actually very similar to 99 00:05:41,500 --> 00:05:43,500 what ended up becoming alchemic school. 100 00:05:43,700 --> 00:05:49,600 But it had some some pretty key differences that we decided that 101 00:05:49,700 --> 00:05:53,100 we realized that would make it like non-viable as a platform. 102 00:05:53,400 --> 00:05:57,000 Essentially, what we would do for cheese fi, would you be? 103 00:05:57,000 --> 00:05:59,700 You would like lock up die for between? 104 00:05:59,900 --> 00:06:04,200 In 100 days and then you get this cheese token in exchange 105 00:06:04,600 --> 00:06:08,000 for doing that. And then the yield from your die 106 00:06:08,400 --> 00:06:12,000 would then go to buying off the cheese token from the market 107 00:06:12,500 --> 00:06:15,800 from you to swap and then we were like we thought it was 108 00:06:15,800 --> 00:06:18,900 really cool model but then we would learn more about like Mev 109 00:06:19,600 --> 00:06:22,600 minor tractable value and sandwich attacks and we realized 110 00:06:22,600 --> 00:06:25,300 that a lot of value could be extracted from that system. 111 00:06:25,300 --> 00:06:27,600 So we had to go back to the drawing board and create 112 00:06:27,600 --> 00:06:30,700 something different. And Then through that process, 113 00:06:30,700 --> 00:06:33,600 we came across. You know, what is now alchemax 114 00:06:34,700 --> 00:06:40,100 How did you kind of decide to go with the name like Scoopy? 115 00:06:40,100 --> 00:06:43,300 Triples, I think we actually were discussing this right 116 00:06:43,300 --> 00:06:45,600 before the show. I think would be really 117 00:06:45,600 --> 00:06:47,600 interesting to discuss with with viewers. 118 00:06:47,600 --> 00:06:51,400 Like, what, what got you excited about that name? 119 00:06:51,700 --> 00:06:56,600 Specifically? All right, so in Rick and Morty, 120 00:06:56,600 --> 00:07:00,700 there's an episode where they go to Pluto and because like a 121 00:07:00,700 --> 00:07:02,700 Jerry's adamant that it's a planet. 122 00:07:02,800 --> 00:07:05,400 Even though everyone says, it's not planet and like the ruler of 123 00:07:05,400 --> 00:07:08,300 that Pluto's name was asked, rupee nipples. 124 00:07:09,100 --> 00:07:11,600 And then later on, I like that name so much. 125 00:07:11,600 --> 00:07:15,400 I was playing Dungeons and Dragons and I made this like 126 00:07:15,400 --> 00:07:18,600 silly character based off of screwby nipples and that 127 00:07:18,600 --> 00:07:22,200 character's name was called Skippy triples and then when it 128 00:07:22,200 --> 00:07:25,400 came time to make my Twitter account My normal handle that I 129 00:07:25,407 --> 00:07:29,000 use other places was gone and I was like, huh, what can I use? 130 00:07:29,000 --> 00:07:30,300 And it's like, oh Scooby triples. 131 00:07:30,300 --> 00:07:32,300 That's that's a funny. Let's go with that one. 132 00:07:32,300 --> 00:07:36,200 That can be my new handle and the Scoobies triples was born 133 00:07:36,400 --> 00:07:40,100 and only blew up on Twitter recently, really like in defy 134 00:07:40,100 --> 00:07:41,700 summer. I was like, some nobody with 135 00:07:41,700 --> 00:07:45,800 like a hundred followers for, like, the longest time, So, what 136 00:07:45,800 --> 00:07:48,700 made you decide to go, like, build this whole project 137 00:07:48,700 --> 00:07:51,100 anonymously? Like, you know, for like five 138 00:07:51,100 --> 00:07:53,300 years of epicenter, surprisingly, we didn't have 139 00:07:53,300 --> 00:07:55,900 like any Anon people. And then I think suddenly in the 140 00:07:55,907 --> 00:07:58,600 last, like, six months, we just have this, like, you know, I may 141 00:07:58,600 --> 00:08:01,400 be, I think we might be like, our third and On guest at this 142 00:08:01,400 --> 00:08:03,700 point and it's like, and obviously there's others like 143 00:08:03,700 --> 00:08:08,300 larger Trend in like, you know, Anon like building anonymously. 144 00:08:08,300 --> 00:08:11,500 I mean, it's arguably, it's not a new trend, are you believed 145 00:08:11,500 --> 00:08:13,900 was the first Trend in crypto as well from Satoshi. 146 00:08:14,300 --> 00:08:16,400 But what? Did you decide to do that and 147 00:08:16,400 --> 00:08:19,100 what's been your like experience doing that? 148 00:08:21,000 --> 00:08:23,700 The only thing, like the ethos of crypto should be an honor, 149 00:08:23,700 --> 00:08:25,800 pseudo Anonymous. I mean, if you go back to the 150 00:08:25,800 --> 00:08:28,000 founder of it, all, yes, Toshi Nakamoto was. 151 00:08:28,400 --> 00:08:32,500 But I mean the reason for that is that, you know, when you are 152 00:08:32,500 --> 00:08:35,700 holding crypto assets, you know, you're holding them like in your 153 00:08:35,700 --> 00:08:39,500 house, you know, you got your seat, phrase, maybe, you know, 154 00:08:39,500 --> 00:08:43,299 backed up on a piece of paper or, you know, maybe a metal card 155 00:08:43,299 --> 00:08:47,600 if you're really precautious and you know, somebody could easily 156 00:08:47,600 --> 00:08:49,900 just like break into your house and then rip off. 157 00:08:50,400 --> 00:08:53,100 All of your, you know, all of your money, all your assets, you 158 00:08:53,100 --> 00:08:55,800 know, just by stealing some words on a piece of paper from 159 00:08:55,800 --> 00:09:01,100 you and with that in mind like I'm Anonymous for my own safety 160 00:09:01,600 --> 00:09:06,900 like I don't want to expose me or my family or anybody you 161 00:09:06,900 --> 00:09:10,700 know, who's close to me, you know to my dealings and crypto, 162 00:09:11,000 --> 00:09:14,500 you know if word got out that you know, my who I am in real 163 00:09:14,500 --> 00:09:18,200 life is Skippy triples, then you know, it might make people that 164 00:09:18,200 --> 00:09:21,300 I love and care about targets. Also, including myself. 165 00:09:21,800 --> 00:09:24,800 And there's also the thing that like, I haven't told like 166 00:09:24,800 --> 00:09:28,600 anybody in my really, like, close family and friends about 167 00:09:28,600 --> 00:09:29,900 Scooby, triples, are all chemicals. 168 00:09:29,900 --> 00:09:33,900 Because I like to kind of separate that life from, you 169 00:09:33,900 --> 00:09:36,700 know, or that that from, you know, my normal life because I 170 00:09:36,708 --> 00:09:38,700 don't want people to treat me any different than they have 171 00:09:38,700 --> 00:09:40,100 treated me. My entire life, just because 172 00:09:40,100 --> 00:09:43,600 they think I've money. And so, you know, for safety and 173 00:09:43,600 --> 00:09:46,800 my own personal reasons I choose to be anonymous. 174 00:09:47,600 --> 00:09:51,000 I mean, I'm surprised that there's not more Animus Founders 175 00:09:51,000 --> 00:09:53,700 out there because I think like, you know, putting your name out 176 00:09:53,700 --> 00:09:56,200 there and your face out there is kind of dangerous. 177 00:09:58,600 --> 00:10:03,800 One thing I wanted to kind of dive into was the mechanism 178 00:10:03,800 --> 00:10:08,700 design itself of alchemax. How would you describe to 179 00:10:08,700 --> 00:10:10,700 someone hearing for the first time? 180 00:10:10,900 --> 00:10:13,500 What L can mix is at a high level? 181 00:10:14,400 --> 00:10:19,600 And what the main kind of use case, it provides for Defy, is 182 00:10:21,200 --> 00:10:23,600 Okay. So at a basic level, the way. 183 00:10:23,600 --> 00:10:28,700 All Comics works is that you deposit dye into the system, and 184 00:10:28,700 --> 00:10:32,600 then you can use that died as collateral to Mint are owned 185 00:10:32,600 --> 00:10:37,000 synthetic. Stable coin, Al USD and you can 186 00:10:37,300 --> 00:10:41,400 borrow up to 50% of the amount of collateral that you have. 187 00:10:41,400 --> 00:10:43,400 So if you put in a hundred, you can borrow 50. 188 00:10:44,100 --> 00:10:47,500 And then what happens is that the dye that you deposit gets 189 00:10:47,500 --> 00:10:50,800 deposited into urine that Finance. 190 00:10:51,200 --> 00:10:56,600 Into their diet Vault and that earns around around 15% interest 191 00:10:56,600 --> 00:10:58,600 a year. And what happens is that the 192 00:10:58,600 --> 00:11:03,500 principal from your deposit is earning yield and that gradually 193 00:11:03,500 --> 00:11:06,500 pays off your Al USD debt over time. 194 00:11:06,800 --> 00:11:10,100 And then that harvested yield also goes to a module that we 195 00:11:10,100 --> 00:11:14,100 call the the transmitter which acts as a backstop to the peg. 196 00:11:15,200 --> 00:11:20,500 So if for some reason, a Leo's D is treating at under the peg on 197 00:11:20,500 --> 00:11:21,600 our curve. Market. 198 00:11:22,000 --> 00:11:24,800 Then you can go to the transmitter module and guarantee 199 00:11:24,800 --> 00:11:30,500 a one-to-one conversion for from Ali, SD to die, other things for 200 00:11:30,500 --> 00:11:33,900 the transmitter that fill it up or when people repay their loans 201 00:11:33,900 --> 00:11:37,600 in die. So a lot of people have been 202 00:11:38,000 --> 00:11:40,700 with alchemic so you're not locked in at any time for any 203 00:11:40,700 --> 00:11:43,800 amount of time. So you can always repay your 204 00:11:43,800 --> 00:11:46,900 debt and then exit your collateral from the system. 205 00:11:46,900 --> 00:11:50,300 So whenever anybody pays and die, whether that's through 206 00:11:50,500 --> 00:11:52,200 Direct. All payments, or if they 207 00:11:52,200 --> 00:11:56,200 liquidate their die collateral to pay their debt, that dye gets 208 00:11:56,200 --> 00:11:58,400 sent to the transmitter. And the cool thing about the 209 00:11:58,400 --> 00:12:01,800 transmitter is that it takes all of its die and puts it into 210 00:12:01,800 --> 00:12:04,400 urine. And then that yield from the 211 00:12:04,400 --> 00:12:09,600 transmitter is then passed along to the depositors in our vault. 212 00:12:09,700 --> 00:12:13,400 So it boosts their apy because we have an effectively higher 213 00:12:13,400 --> 00:12:17,900 principle than then, just the deposits themselves because of 214 00:12:17,900 --> 00:12:22,700 the transmitter, so that's how we can get like 25% interest 215 00:12:22,700 --> 00:12:27,700 whereas urine is getting like 15% Let's go to our sponsor, 216 00:12:27,700 --> 00:12:31,000 Exodus Exodus is a fantastic crypto currency wallet, that 217 00:12:31,000 --> 00:12:34,500 strikes the right balance between ease-of-use security and 218 00:12:34,500 --> 00:12:37,500 great features. You can get Exodus on the iPhone 219 00:12:37,700 --> 00:12:40,900 desktop app. Web app, Android, whatever 220 00:12:40,900 --> 00:12:44,300 platform you use. It's a non-custodial wallet that 221 00:12:44,300 --> 00:12:46,500 is so critical. Because what's the point of 222 00:12:46,500 --> 00:12:50,500 crypto, if you don't control your own assets with Exodus, you 223 00:12:50,500 --> 00:12:54,700 always do the old school and they've been around since 2015, 224 00:12:54,700 --> 00:12:59,600 01, Million users rely on Exodus to, you know that they've stood 225 00:12:59,600 --> 00:13:03,900 the test of time, they have support for over 100 different 226 00:13:03,900 --> 00:13:06,700 crypto acids and remove in Exodus. 227 00:13:06,700 --> 00:13:10,200 You can easily change one different asset to the otter. 228 00:13:10,600 --> 00:13:13,900 They also allow you to buy group do with Fiat and they even have 229 00:13:13,900 --> 00:13:17,100 a great offer where you can buy up to $500 worth of crypto 230 00:13:17,200 --> 00:13:20,500 through the IOS app and Pages $1 in feet. 231 00:13:20,700 --> 00:13:24,600 So go to Exodus.com epicenter and check out their wallet. 232 00:13:24,700 --> 00:13:28,000 We want to thank Exodus. As for their amazing support of 233 00:13:28,000 --> 00:13:32,700 epicenter. So the dye that gets earned from 234 00:13:32,700 --> 00:13:35,900 urine, you know, so does a portion of it, go to start 235 00:13:35,900 --> 00:13:39,400 paying off debt and a portion goes to the transmuter or is it 236 00:13:39,400 --> 00:13:42,100 somehow the what percent is going where? 237 00:13:43,500 --> 00:13:47,400 This is a little tricky since we have our own synthetic, stable 238 00:13:47,400 --> 00:13:52,800 coin, Al USD, when we harvest the yield from yearn, we reduce 239 00:13:52,800 --> 00:13:56,100 amount of everyone's debt like globally in the system when that 240 00:13:56,100 --> 00:13:58,200 happens. But we don't actually have to 241 00:13:58,200 --> 00:14:02,200 pay the dye to like the users at this point that the guy that 242 00:14:02,200 --> 00:14:04,300 died just ends up going straight to the transmitter. 243 00:14:04,300 --> 00:14:08,400 So all of it goes the transmitter and it decrements. 244 00:14:08,400 --> 00:14:12,900 Everyone's debt at the same time, there is a 10% fee. 245 00:14:13,400 --> 00:14:18,300 Alchemic charges on yield harvests and that's kind of our 246 00:14:18,300 --> 00:14:19,200 rate. That's our take. 247 00:14:19,200 --> 00:14:23,000 That's our project fees that we take, and we have to do that. 248 00:14:24,200 --> 00:14:26,200 The bare minimum. We have to do that, just to pay 249 00:14:26,200 --> 00:14:29,700 for the fees for harvesting, because it's not cheap to run an 250 00:14:29,700 --> 00:14:34,000 app on ethereum. Gas is very expensive and some 251 00:14:34,000 --> 00:14:37,600 of the processes that we do is we don't have users call these 252 00:14:37,600 --> 00:14:39,600 functions. Instead of, we kind of batch it 253 00:14:39,600 --> 00:14:43,500 all together and the people running the protocol. you know, 254 00:14:43,500 --> 00:14:48,900 that that team we, you know, pay that cost for the our users How 255 00:14:48,900 --> 00:14:54,500 do people learn from the transmuter is everyone who's has 256 00:14:54,500 --> 00:14:57,000 a USD, like learning from it or do people have to actually 257 00:14:57,000 --> 00:15:02,400 deposit into the transmitter. So the transmitter is not really 258 00:15:02,400 --> 00:15:05,800 a vehicle for for yield or earnings. 259 00:15:05,800 --> 00:15:09,200 It's just a like a guarantee that you can redeem your, a 260 00:15:09,200 --> 00:15:13,900 Leo's D4 die and we only really see usage of that. 261 00:15:13,900 --> 00:15:17,700 When the curve pool, that we have gets a little bit. 262 00:15:17,800 --> 00:15:20,600 Bounced. And there's more, ALCS token are 263 00:15:20,600 --> 00:15:24,100 all USD tokens. Then the, the the curve tokens 264 00:15:24,100 --> 00:15:27,600 are the kind of curved metal pool tokens the three pull. 265 00:15:28,000 --> 00:15:30,000 So whenever there's like an inbounds there, we might see 266 00:15:30,000 --> 00:15:34,000 people use the transmitter which kind of access like the backstop 267 00:15:34,000 --> 00:15:38,300 of the peg, but that's like any event. 268 00:15:38,300 --> 00:15:41,600 Let like, aliens, deed falls off the peg like really badly. 269 00:15:41,600 --> 00:15:44,300 Then people could like by Augustin off the market, then 270 00:15:44,500 --> 00:15:47,200 put it in the transmuter and that could be like a source of 271 00:15:47,200 --> 00:15:51,400 yield if you Treat all used as a bond but other than that, no, 272 00:15:51,400 --> 00:15:54,800 it's just a Redemption model, you know, method of way to 273 00:15:54,800 --> 00:15:57,300 backstop the peg. So it's not really meant for 274 00:15:57,300 --> 00:16:02,200 healed, but the transmitter itself does deposit, it's over 275 00:16:02,200 --> 00:16:05,900 200 million died in to yearned and then, you know, passes on 276 00:16:06,200 --> 00:16:09,900 that yield to our users, would you say it's safe to 277 00:16:09,900 --> 00:16:15,500 characterize the main use case, people are using alchemic for is 278 00:16:15,700 --> 00:16:17,700 getting extra yield. You mentioned 25. 279 00:16:17,800 --> 00:16:20,900 Five percent relative to fifteen percent or have there been like 280 00:16:20,900 --> 00:16:22,900 other really interesting use cases. 281 00:16:22,900 --> 00:16:25,800 That have surprised you that came off the protocol. 282 00:16:28,300 --> 00:16:31,100 Yeah, so I mean, a lot of people what they're, you know, they're 283 00:16:31,100 --> 00:16:33,400 just depositing in there and just learning yield on it. 284 00:16:33,400 --> 00:16:38,200 But for the most part, people are taking on a Leo's D Loans 285 00:16:38,700 --> 00:16:42,100 and some people are using it for personal finance where they're 286 00:16:42,100 --> 00:16:45,200 selling the value of D for like, you know, TC then and then 287 00:16:45,300 --> 00:16:50,400 exiting it off of coinbase. I know, I've confirmed that 288 00:16:50,400 --> 00:16:53,500 we've had some people do this, somebody bought a boat for their 289 00:16:53,500 --> 00:16:58,200 dad, using an alchemical own, you know, guy bought a Porsche I 290 00:16:58,200 --> 00:17:00,900 know somebody who's paid for their grad, school tuition, 291 00:17:00,900 --> 00:17:05,700 using an outcome X alone. Also, some of you pay their 292 00:17:05,700 --> 00:17:10,099 hospital bill for their newborn son by financing it through an 293 00:17:10,099 --> 00:17:13,400 alchemical loan and other than personal finance. 294 00:17:13,400 --> 00:17:16,099 A lot of people what they're doing is they're either selling 295 00:17:16,099 --> 00:17:21,099 the audio CD and investing in speculating in the market, or 296 00:17:21,099 --> 00:17:23,599 they're taking their value of D, and then supplying like 297 00:17:23,599 --> 00:17:26,900 liquidity on curve, and then earning a lcx that way. 298 00:17:27,400 --> 00:17:30,500 So, Some people are, you know, using it for finance. 299 00:17:30,500 --> 00:17:33,400 Other people are speculating and other people are just trying to 300 00:17:33,400 --> 00:17:35,200 maximize their you'll farming even more. 301 00:17:36,900 --> 00:17:40,900 So on that personal finance, use case was one thing I'm a little 302 00:17:40,900 --> 00:17:46,600 bit confused about is what's the use case of borrowing a stable 303 00:17:46,600 --> 00:17:50,100 coin against over collateralized stable coin. 304 00:17:50,200 --> 00:17:54,500 So like you know, people often will use like maker compound 305 00:17:54,700 --> 00:17:59,900 because to borrow USD, but, but they put down collateral in, you 306 00:17:59,900 --> 00:18:02,500 know, either PTC or something because they're trying to 307 00:18:02,500 --> 00:18:06,500 maintain, you know, exposure to the collateral. 308 00:18:06,500 --> 00:18:10,400 A And also that you know is often I tax benefits as well to 309 00:18:10,400 --> 00:18:14,000 doing this. But why would I put down two 310 00:18:14,000 --> 00:18:17,900 hundred dollars of a stable coin just to borrow $100 of a stable 311 00:18:17,900 --> 00:18:20,300 coin? Instead of just selling or 312 00:18:20,300 --> 00:18:22,600 spending my original stable coin? 313 00:18:24,000 --> 00:18:26,700 So all times like when you have your own savings and stuff like 314 00:18:26,700 --> 00:18:29,700 that and then like an expense in life comes up, you have to make 315 00:18:29,700 --> 00:18:32,500 a choice between consumption and saving. 316 00:18:33,600 --> 00:18:36,400 Whereas without pemex, you can do both. 317 00:18:36,500 --> 00:18:40,100 You can both save and spend say then consume. 318 00:18:40,500 --> 00:18:44,300 So let's say you have a thousand dollars saved up, that's your 319 00:18:44,300 --> 00:18:48,000 rainy day fund, and then you get into a car accident and it turns 320 00:18:48,000 --> 00:18:50,100 out the bill for this car accident is going to be five 321 00:18:50,100 --> 00:18:53,100 hundred dollars to fix it. If you were to pay that out of 322 00:18:53,100 --> 00:18:54,700 pocket. He left with five hundred 323 00:18:54,700 --> 00:18:58,600 dollars of savings and let's say, you go ahead and you put 324 00:18:58,600 --> 00:19:03,000 that $500 in D5 and you're making, you know, fifteen twenty 325 00:19:03,000 --> 00:19:04,800 percent a year on that. That's great, right? 326 00:19:04,800 --> 00:19:07,200 But without chemicals, what you could do is you could put your 327 00:19:07,200 --> 00:19:09,400 thousand dollars in it. Take out that five hundred 328 00:19:09,400 --> 00:19:14,600 dollar loan and then you could be earning interest on the 329 00:19:14,600 --> 00:19:16,700 thousand dollars that you put in. 330 00:19:17,400 --> 00:19:21,600 So you'd have a larger principle that's earning yield paying off 331 00:19:21,600 --> 00:19:23,700 your loan. So by the time that the loan has 332 00:19:23,700 --> 00:19:27,700 paid off, you will have a thousand dollars where if you 333 00:19:27,700 --> 00:19:31,300 paid out of pocket for that car accident and then you invested 334 00:19:31,300 --> 00:19:34,800 that $500 in defy and then it, you know, compounded over two 335 00:19:34,800 --> 00:19:40,100 years, you'd be looking at maybe like $700 750 but without coming 336 00:19:40,100 --> 00:19:44,800 to the ending up with a thousand dollars Example I said was like, 337 00:19:44,800 --> 00:19:47,500 you know, sometimes you want to maintain expose, the reason you 338 00:19:47,500 --> 00:19:50,000 would borrow against your ethos, you want to maintain exposure to 339 00:19:50,000 --> 00:19:52,400 eat and you thing Keith is going to go up here. 340 00:19:52,400 --> 00:19:55,000 Kind of actually is somewhat similar but you're basically 341 00:19:55,000 --> 00:19:59,200 saying Hey I want to maintain exposure to it's not really a 342 00:19:59,200 --> 00:20:06,200 stable coin it's a yield earning stable coin because in defy at 343 00:20:06,200 --> 00:20:09,900 this moment even stable coins can like give you quite a high 344 00:20:09,900 --> 00:20:12,500 return. Alka mix helps you maintain 345 00:20:12,500 --> 00:20:15,900 exposure. This like high-yield earning 346 00:20:15,900 --> 00:20:20,300 stable coin, and you're borrowing this low yield earning 347 00:20:20,300 --> 00:20:23,200 stable coin, which is the AL USD. 348 00:20:23,300 --> 00:20:25,300 Is that is that essentially What's Happening Here? 349 00:20:26,800 --> 00:20:29,400 Yeah, I like to think about Comics as like a savings 350 00:20:29,400 --> 00:20:34,200 technology and a lot of ways where you're encouraged to both 351 00:20:34,400 --> 00:20:39,800 save and spend Yours by Saving, it's giving you access to, you 352 00:20:39,800 --> 00:20:42,600 know, you're, you know, a greater and greater line of 353 00:20:42,600 --> 00:20:45,400 credit. So it's encouraging you to save 354 00:20:45,400 --> 00:20:48,100 and it's also kind of putting a limit because you can there's 355 00:20:48,100 --> 00:20:50,000 like a 200% collateralization ratio. 356 00:20:50,000 --> 00:20:52,300 Let's say you save up a million bucks and then you go into Al 357 00:20:52,300 --> 00:20:54,800 pemex you can take out five hundred thousand dollars. 358 00:20:55,100 --> 00:20:58,500 So it's not like you're gonna be able to spend And all of your 359 00:20:58,500 --> 00:21:02,800 money this is important because let's say, you know, the yields 360 00:21:02,800 --> 00:21:06,000 on upcoming to dry up or you need your collateral back for 361 00:21:06,000 --> 00:21:09,700 something in real life and you want to get out, you can pay off 362 00:21:09,700 --> 00:21:11,700 your loan. Let's say, like, if you, you 363 00:21:11,700 --> 00:21:14,500 still have your ally go State, I'll use dear, you convert it to 364 00:21:14,500 --> 00:21:17,100 die, you can pay off your loan from your wallet, or you can 365 00:21:17,100 --> 00:21:19,400 liquidate your collateral. So you can get out. 366 00:21:19,600 --> 00:21:22,700 It gives you a little bit more optionality in your spending. 367 00:21:22,700 --> 00:21:25,300 So if you wanted to, you could just have that debt repaid 368 00:21:25,300 --> 00:21:28,000 itself or you could. Repay it yourself manually. 369 00:21:28,500 --> 00:21:31,200 If you repay yourself manually, yeah, you get a little extra 370 00:21:31,200 --> 00:21:34,500 gains from, you know, the extra principle but it would be pretty 371 00:21:34,500 --> 00:21:37,700 similar to paying out of pocket. But the whole idea is that gives 372 00:21:37,700 --> 00:21:42,500 you that option ality, you can essentially get a line of credit 373 00:21:42,900 --> 00:21:45,800 that pays itself off and that, that lets you just like kind of 374 00:21:45,800 --> 00:21:49,600 take risks and do things and spend money, like, kind of in a 375 00:21:49,600 --> 00:21:53,400 guilt-free way because I know like I'm a saver naturally and I 376 00:21:53,400 --> 00:21:56,300 always like hate to take money out of my savings or out of 377 00:21:56,400 --> 00:21:59,500 Investments to, you know, to buy something, or to fund my real 378 00:21:59,500 --> 00:22:03,600 life. And without coming tonight, I 379 00:22:03,600 --> 00:22:06,200 feel like I'm not forced to make that decision anymore. 380 00:22:06,300 --> 00:22:08,700 I can just be like, hey, I'm just going to take out a loan 381 00:22:08,700 --> 00:22:10,500 that's going to pay itself off it. 382 00:22:10,800 --> 00:22:13,600 In fact, what I do for my own personal finances, I have a 383 00:22:13,600 --> 00:22:16,900 decent amount of dye and help Amex, and I just draw some 384 00:22:16,900 --> 00:22:20,700 monthly and then that pays, like all my house and family bills 385 00:22:20,800 --> 00:22:23,500 and at the end of the month, I've almost no debt. 386 00:22:23,500 --> 00:22:26,100 And then I just take another loan out and then just repeat 387 00:22:26,100 --> 00:22:26,900 the process. Process. 388 00:22:29,200 --> 00:22:32,200 So when you're looking for a flight, you go through a flight 389 00:22:32,200 --> 00:22:35,700 aggregator to see all the different places where you can 390 00:22:35,700 --> 00:22:38,600 buy the fly to get all the options and make sure you get 391 00:22:38,600 --> 00:22:41,800 the best price for your travel plans. 392 00:22:42,500 --> 00:22:46,100 And when you're making a defy swap, just do the same and use 393 00:22:46,100 --> 00:22:48,800 para swap. It beats the market prices 394 00:22:48,800 --> 00:22:51,800 across all the major indexes because it Aggregates them and 395 00:22:51,800 --> 00:22:54,700 thanks to their network of professional market makers. 396 00:22:55,200 --> 00:22:59,300 You get zero slippage on your trades so they choose Pushed a 397 00:22:59,300 --> 00:23:01,900 huge update that's even faster. More liquid. 398 00:23:01,900 --> 00:23:05,100 Thanks to a brand new. Algorithm / swap is now multi 399 00:23:05,100 --> 00:23:08,300 chain and has expanded polygon and Beynon smart chain. 400 00:23:08,800 --> 00:23:11,700 So go and check it out. Give para swap at try at 401 00:23:11,700 --> 00:23:18,300 Periscope dot IO, / epicenter, where do you see Al USD within 402 00:23:18,300 --> 00:23:19,900 defy? It seems like you see it as a 403 00:23:19,900 --> 00:23:24,300 tool for borrowing and a guilt-free way in the kind of 404 00:23:24,300 --> 00:23:28,000 way that you mentioned. But do you see it like as a 405 00:23:28,000 --> 00:23:30,500 major stable? Alcoa in for defy like how do 406 00:23:30,500 --> 00:23:34,200 you see it being composed upon and what do you see its role in 407 00:23:34,200 --> 00:23:36,600 the like whole stable coin ecosystem that already exists in 408 00:23:36,608 --> 00:23:39,100 defy? Yeah. 409 00:23:39,100 --> 00:23:41,800 Yeah, we're working actively on. Trying to get more Integrations 410 00:23:41,800 --> 00:23:44,500 for a Leo's D. First up from that one is 411 00:23:44,500 --> 00:23:48,000 getting reliable price Feats for Alia. 412 00:23:48,000 --> 00:23:51,800 See right now, we're only on the curve and factory pools and they 413 00:23:51,808 --> 00:23:55,800 don't have like any sophisticated swaps or oracle's 414 00:23:55,800 --> 00:23:58,200 associated with that. So we're trying to work with 415 00:23:58,200 --> 00:24:03,500 chain link to get a price feed for our ecosystem tokens. 416 00:24:03,500 --> 00:24:06,000 And once that happens, we're going to be able to get Al USD 417 00:24:06,000 --> 00:24:10,500 on places. Like like Ave like a rare, he's 418 00:24:10,500 --> 00:24:15,900 fuse and other lending markets, like cream as well, but I think 419 00:24:15,900 --> 00:24:19,700 more interestingly than just having it being like, a 420 00:24:19,900 --> 00:24:23,900 collateral or Capital asset, is that you could, we could work 421 00:24:23,900 --> 00:24:27,900 with like margin protocols or options, protocols, and then you 422 00:24:27,900 --> 00:24:31,000 could use a Leo SD to fund those positions. 423 00:24:31,200 --> 00:24:33,700 And then if you if you're borrowing that and alone that 424 00:24:33,700 --> 00:24:36,500 repays itself, then you can go short. 425 00:24:36,500 --> 00:24:40,000 You can go long. And be is DJing as you want to 426 00:24:40,000 --> 00:24:43,400 and know that you know, even if you lose even if you get wiped 427 00:24:43,400 --> 00:24:47,000 out you know you still have your collateral that you use to get 428 00:24:47,000 --> 00:24:50,200 your audio steel own and that debt will vanish over time so I 429 00:24:50,200 --> 00:24:53,000 think that's kind of cool. It's like a an idea of safe 430 00:24:53,000 --> 00:24:58,900 aping Could you clarify that got stuff, so you think people can 431 00:24:58,900 --> 00:25:01,500 put down die and then borrow alchemic 6-cell. 432 00:25:02,200 --> 00:25:06,600 That I'm Al can mix in exchange for what Burr Al USD. 433 00:25:06,700 --> 00:25:12,600 I'll come mixes the RSI value SD so people can put down dye into 434 00:25:12,600 --> 00:25:19,300 alchemic, Sbarro Al USD against it and they can sell that out 435 00:25:19,300 --> 00:25:23,600 USD. And by with it, Options are some 436 00:25:23,600 --> 00:25:28,100 other kind of derivative instrument, that's as you said, 437 00:25:28,100 --> 00:25:31,100 like, kind of a guilt-free experience is that kind of what 438 00:25:31,100 --> 00:25:36,200 you're envisioning. Well, what we're trying to work 439 00:25:36,200 --> 00:25:40,500 for is getting Al USD. So integrated in the defy that 440 00:25:40,500 --> 00:25:43,400 you wouldn't have to sell it for another stable coin is that you 441 00:25:43,400 --> 00:25:46,000 could go straight into that options contract or into that 442 00:25:46,000 --> 00:25:50,100 margin position using out USD. That's, that's the goal right 443 00:25:50,100 --> 00:25:53,100 there is to get to that point where it can start to be used 444 00:25:53,500 --> 00:25:56,400 across D5 in different, use cases and stuff because right 445 00:25:56,400 --> 00:25:59,500 now I can go to like margins often go to dydx, I can go to, 446 00:25:59,500 --> 00:26:04,500 you know, various platforms and and lever, you know my my Coins, 447 00:26:04,900 --> 00:26:07,400 so I can do other things and D fight with them, right? 448 00:26:07,600 --> 00:26:11,500 And I'll use the does not have that just yet, you know, because 449 00:26:11,500 --> 00:26:13,600 it's still early in the days for it. 450 00:26:13,800 --> 00:26:16,100 But once we get those Integrations and it'll, you 451 00:26:16,100 --> 00:26:20,300 know, start to drive more, the demand side for the currency 452 00:26:20,300 --> 00:26:22,900 itself, because it will have a lot more uses instead of just 453 00:26:22,900 --> 00:26:26,700 flipping for die or u.s. DC or tether some other staple 454 00:26:26,700 --> 00:26:28,800 coin. And I think that's an important 455 00:26:28,800 --> 00:26:33,200 part of having long-term Peg. Stability, is to, you know, take 456 00:26:33,200 --> 00:26:34,600 care of that. Inside. 457 00:26:36,100 --> 00:26:39,600 Essentially if that happens I'll USD is going to be competing 458 00:26:39,600 --> 00:26:43,400 than with things like die and u.s. 459 00:26:43,400 --> 00:26:46,800 DC and stuff for like usage than D Phi. 460 00:26:47,100 --> 00:26:51,600 And isn't it actually going to drive down the the yields you 461 00:26:51,600 --> 00:26:55,100 can earn on like die? Because like you know right now 462 00:26:55,500 --> 00:26:59,900 let's say, you know, right now let's say on with with on 463 00:26:59,900 --> 00:27:02,700 yearned, let's say put depositing in curve is one of 464 00:27:02,700 --> 00:27:05,800 the highest sources of you. Old, right? 465 00:27:05,800 --> 00:27:07,800 And that's his like, you know, one of the most incentivize 466 00:27:08,000 --> 00:27:13,000 pools on curve is that like three pool with die, USD T and U 467 00:27:13,000 --> 00:27:15,700 s-- DC. But now, let's imagine a world 468 00:27:15,700 --> 00:27:18,700 where I'll USD becomes. Like, you know, the fourth big 469 00:27:18,700 --> 00:27:21,600 stable coin and defy, right? What does that actually, then 470 00:27:21,600 --> 00:27:25,800 drive down yields on die. Now because it's only getting a 471 00:27:25,808 --> 00:27:30,200 quarter of the curve rewards rather than a third of them. 472 00:27:30,400 --> 00:27:34,400 And especially the question is, as Al USD becomes more popular 473 00:27:34,400 --> 00:27:36,400 does not. Drive down the yields from other 474 00:27:36,400 --> 00:27:40,600 stable coins. I think this is a really tough 475 00:27:40,600 --> 00:27:45,000 one to predict because like kind of what determines the the yield 476 00:27:45,000 --> 00:27:47,500 of a stable coin. There's there's a ton of factors 477 00:27:47,500 --> 00:27:53,500 involved you know a lot of that because you learn uses seven 478 00:27:53,500 --> 00:27:58,900 different strategies and their dive Vault for you know for 479 00:27:58,900 --> 00:28:04,800 version 2 of their vaults. And one of the strategies is to 480 00:28:04,800 --> 00:28:08,200 LP into to that curve bowl that you just mentioned. 481 00:28:09,200 --> 00:28:13,600 They also have a number of other strategies so I'm not really 482 00:28:13,600 --> 00:28:18,500 sure that we would you know if L USD became you know, a huge 483 00:28:18,500 --> 00:28:23,800 market cap that we would dilute that I mean that's sort of 484 00:28:23,800 --> 00:28:26,800 saying like you know there's a stable coin out there you sdn 485 00:28:26,800 --> 00:28:30,300 and that has like an insane amount of curve gauge weight is 486 00:28:30,300 --> 00:28:34,300 is you sdn taking yield away from die, you know. 487 00:28:34,300 --> 00:28:40,400 Like I feel like the answer is yes and no because They might be 488 00:28:40,400 --> 00:28:44,300 taking some of the curve rewards away from that three, pool curve 489 00:28:44,300 --> 00:28:47,200 and dilute and lowering the yields for die, but the same 490 00:28:47,200 --> 00:28:50,300 time, then people also balance their positions based on the 491 00:28:50,300 --> 00:28:53,100 yield. So the market react to that. 492 00:28:53,500 --> 00:28:57,100 So the appropriate amount of capital will be allocated to 493 00:28:57,100 --> 00:29:01,100 places to get that yield. So if the desired yield is 10% 494 00:29:01,100 --> 00:29:02,900 and then you see it's 5% somewhere, you're not going to 495 00:29:02,908 --> 00:29:06,100 put your stable coins in there. You're going to try to find 496 00:29:06,100 --> 00:29:08,800 somewhere else. So I think it'll balance itself 497 00:29:08,800 --> 00:29:13,300 out and I don't think Al USD would have a major impact on 498 00:29:13,300 --> 00:29:15,600 diet yields. I haven't given this a ton of 499 00:29:15,600 --> 00:29:18,400 thought, to be honest, I mean, I might want to come back and 500 00:29:18,400 --> 00:29:21,400 issue like, you know, a deeper thought on this on Twitter for 501 00:29:21,400 --> 00:29:24,500 you sometime soon, Sonny. But my gut feeling is I don't 502 00:29:24,500 --> 00:29:27,400 think we would have any significant impact on dies 503 00:29:27,600 --> 00:29:30,300 yields. That said though on version 2 of 504 00:29:30,300 --> 00:29:33,800 alchemic so which is slated to come out in two to three months, 505 00:29:34,500 --> 00:29:37,100 we will be adding multiple collateral type so you'll be 506 00:29:37,108 --> 00:29:39,400 able to put in and I use the see it was the 80s. 507 00:29:39,600 --> 00:29:43,000 Cosd you name it any viable stale stable coin, that has some 508 00:29:43,000 --> 00:29:47,000 good on chain healed. They'll all be collateral assets 509 00:29:47,000 --> 00:29:50,800 for Al USD. So will be will be siphoning 510 00:29:50,800 --> 00:29:53,800 yield from all of the stable coins in the future someday. 511 00:29:56,800 --> 00:30:00,500 Let's get to our sponsor Solana. Now, this is a special, and for 512 00:30:00,500 --> 00:30:03,400 me to read because I've been in deep supporter of this project. 513 00:30:03,400 --> 00:30:07,300 Since meaning the Solana, team back in 2018, I invest 514 00:30:07,300 --> 00:30:09,900 personally in the project and my company course, one is super 515 00:30:09,900 --> 00:30:13,200 deeply involved in the Solana ecosystem, including running the 516 00:30:13,200 --> 00:30:16,200 biggest validator. So, what's so cool about Solana? 517 00:30:16,600 --> 00:30:19,400 Well, we all know that scalability is the single most 518 00:30:19,400 --> 00:30:22,300 important issue facing the blockchain industry today. 519 00:30:22,700 --> 00:30:24,800 And to Solana, blockchain is an amazing solution. 520 00:30:24,900 --> 00:30:27,400 Lucien for it, the network supports thousands of 521 00:30:27,400 --> 00:30:32,100 transactions per second with 400 millisecond block times and over 522 00:30:32,100 --> 00:30:35,100 500 validators. The special thing about Solana 523 00:30:35,100 --> 00:30:38,700 is also that it's not a sharded blockchain, it's a signal 524 00:30:38,700 --> 00:30:41,500 blockchain, hyper optimized for performance. 525 00:30:41,800 --> 00:30:46,000 So that makes it really easy to maintain composability between 526 00:30:46,000 --> 00:30:48,500 all of the apps on Solana. So that they work together 527 00:30:48,500 --> 00:30:52,500 seamlessly now and forever. There's a lot of ecosystem is 528 00:30:52,500 --> 00:30:55,700 growing at a rapid pace and it's a great place to Audio project 529 00:30:55,700 --> 00:30:57,500 or just get involved with the community. 530 00:30:57,500 --> 00:31:00,600 So go to salon.com epicenter to learn more. 531 00:31:02,300 --> 00:31:07,000 What does happen in our comics when they when they the yields 532 00:31:07,000 --> 00:31:09,300 go down. So right now, let's just say as 533 00:31:09,300 --> 00:31:15,600 an example, the yield on die is 25% a year and you know, it'll 534 00:31:15,600 --> 00:31:18,900 take about two years for, you know, if let's say you bought 535 00:31:18,900 --> 00:31:22,800 you put down $100 of die, you borrow $50 a value is D. 536 00:31:22,800 --> 00:31:26,200 It'll take about approximately two years to pay off that entire 537 00:31:26,200 --> 00:31:28,800 loan. But now let's say the suddenly, 538 00:31:28,800 --> 00:31:35,100 you know, all your Like you know, the yields drop to from 25 539 00:31:35,100 --> 00:31:39,500 percent to 5 percent and now this loan suddenly takes 10 540 00:31:39,500 --> 00:31:42,900 years to pay off. How does that chain? 541 00:31:43,500 --> 00:31:46,500 Where does that affect like you do get reflected in the alchemic 542 00:31:46,500 --> 00:31:48,400 system? Like I'm out, I imagine that has 543 00:31:48,400 --> 00:31:51,800 to propagate somewhere. The alchemic system is, does it 544 00:31:51,800 --> 00:31:55,200 affect the AL USD price? Does it affect? 545 00:31:55,200 --> 00:31:56,900 Yeah, where does that affect get seen? 546 00:31:57,300 --> 00:31:59,600 Does it change the collateralization ratio needed? 547 00:32:00,800 --> 00:32:04,600 Hmm, at the most basic level, it'll mean that your debt 548 00:32:04,600 --> 00:32:07,700 repayment times will take longer, you know, the system 549 00:32:07,700 --> 00:32:11,700 should still work fine but because the debt repayments are 550 00:32:11,700 --> 00:32:14,200 taking longer, the amount of yield flowing into the 551 00:32:14,200 --> 00:32:18,200 transmitter will be lower. So in the event that we do 552 00:32:18,200 --> 00:32:21,700 destabilize, you know and we break our Peg and stuff like 553 00:32:21,700 --> 00:32:26,100 that and then let's say people use the transmuter and they use 554 00:32:26,100 --> 00:32:28,900 everything that's in the transmitter and it goes down to 555 00:32:28,900 --> 00:32:32,700 zero. At that point, then, you know, a 556 00:32:32,700 --> 00:32:37,100 Leo's D then would become like a bond of sorts and it would still 557 00:32:37,100 --> 00:32:39,700 have value and it still trade at the market in the market. 558 00:32:39,700 --> 00:32:42,800 But you might take a discount when you sell it or you could 559 00:32:42,800 --> 00:32:45,600 then purchase it from the market and then, you know, put in the 560 00:32:45,600 --> 00:32:48,400 transmitter and it would gradually turn into to die over 561 00:32:48,400 --> 00:32:52,400 time. So that that's what we worst 562 00:32:52,400 --> 00:32:54,800 case scenario. We see happening in the event, 563 00:32:54,800 --> 00:32:59,000 that yields collapse, but if yields claps for urine, they're 564 00:32:59,000 --> 00:33:00,300 probably going to collapse everywhere. 565 00:33:01,100 --> 00:33:04,200 Because they are incredibly flexible and they have a you 566 00:33:04,200 --> 00:33:08,300 know very competent team of top notch developers and strategist 567 00:33:08,300 --> 00:33:10,900 who are heavily incentivize to find the best yields because 568 00:33:10,900 --> 00:33:14,500 they earn profit off of them. I'm still confident that urine 569 00:33:14,500 --> 00:33:18,700 will have very competitive, you know, yields in relation to 570 00:33:18,700 --> 00:33:23,100 other projects in defy. But that said, yeah, definitely 571 00:33:23,100 --> 00:33:27,600 lower yields would could negatively impact the peg. 572 00:33:27,900 --> 00:33:32,100 We're not sure exactly how much. Happen to their depends. 573 00:33:32,200 --> 00:33:35,700 It really depends on if the pig itself breaks, if it doesn't and 574 00:33:35,700 --> 00:33:39,900 our liquidity incentives and the demand to supply liquidity to 575 00:33:39,900 --> 00:33:42,100 our curve pools and other markets that will have in the 576 00:33:42,100 --> 00:33:45,200 future, if that's good enough in the Pagan hold, then it'll just 577 00:33:45,200 --> 00:33:50,800 mean that debt repayment times will take longer, but, you know, 578 00:33:50,800 --> 00:33:54,200 if the peg does break, then we would be in a little bit of a 579 00:33:54,200 --> 00:33:57,900 precarious situation. So that is a risk just being 580 00:33:57,900 --> 00:34:01,800 straight up with you guys. Why is the peg holding today? 581 00:34:01,800 --> 00:34:04,400 Why is from my understanding? It feels to me that it should 582 00:34:04,400 --> 00:34:06,100 be. I'll USD should actually 583 00:34:06,100 --> 00:34:09,800 probably be treated as a bond even right now. 584 00:34:10,199 --> 00:34:15,300 So and so, probably be trading at a slight discount, like, 585 00:34:15,300 --> 00:34:16,900 there's a Time Value to the money, right? 586 00:34:16,900 --> 00:34:21,699 And so like yes, you can convert it at 121 on the transmuter. 587 00:34:21,699 --> 00:34:25,100 But, you know, at some future time and why is that not 588 00:34:25,100 --> 00:34:28,100 reflected in the price of Al USD today? 589 00:34:29,300 --> 00:34:36,100 So right now, Alias D, there's a supply of around 330, 340 590 00:34:36,100 --> 00:34:39,300 million value of D out there and currently there's around 220 591 00:34:39,300 --> 00:34:44,000 million die in the transmuter. So roughly two-thirds of the 592 00:34:44,000 --> 00:34:46,900 aliens T out. There is backed completely 121 593 00:34:46,900 --> 00:34:50,000 that you can redeem it but the other part is that these are 594 00:34:50,000 --> 00:34:53,199 over collateralized loans to like at the end of the day. 595 00:34:53,199 --> 00:34:56,400 So just like maker Dow has over collateralized loans just like 596 00:34:56,400 --> 00:34:58,400 liquidy has over collateralized loans. 597 00:34:58,500 --> 00:35:00,400 And, you know, we kind of the same thing. 598 00:35:00,400 --> 00:35:03,500 So it's not only like, you know, the the dying, the transmuter, 599 00:35:03,500 --> 00:35:06,300 this backing, it was also the, the die, that's collateral 600 00:35:06,300 --> 00:35:09,200 that's backing it as well. And the fact that people can, 601 00:35:09,500 --> 00:35:11,000 you know, repay their debt at any time. 602 00:35:11,000 --> 00:35:13,500 So, like, if you borrowed out USD and then you're, you know, 603 00:35:13,600 --> 00:35:15,800 you're trying to earn on it and then you see that, you know, 604 00:35:15,800 --> 00:35:17,700 it's price goes down. You would just feel like I am 605 00:35:17,700 --> 00:35:20,100 going to take my Holly St and pay down my loan because these 606 00:35:20,100 --> 00:35:21,800 these tokens aren't is worth this much. 607 00:35:21,800 --> 00:35:24,900 And that, right there itself is is a pagan mechanism because 608 00:35:24,900 --> 00:35:28,900 when you pay off without your stay at destroys it, And then 609 00:35:28,900 --> 00:35:31,400 that takes it off the market. And, you know, will help it 610 00:35:31,400 --> 00:35:33,800 bring it back towards more towards equilibrium. 611 00:35:34,300 --> 00:35:36,900 So I hope that answers your question. 612 00:35:38,300 --> 00:35:41,600 The other part of why it's holding the, the dollar Peg. 613 00:35:41,600 --> 00:35:44,300 So strong is. Yeah, we are incentivizing 614 00:35:44,300 --> 00:35:48,800 liquidity on curve. We, if you stake, the the value 615 00:35:48,800 --> 00:35:52,000 of T3 curve, LP tokens on our website. 616 00:35:52,000 --> 00:35:58,200 You can earn close to 40% apy on in the form of a lcx tokens. 617 00:35:59,200 --> 00:36:03,000 Our audit from certificate, just came back and that's going to 618 00:36:03,000 --> 00:36:05,800 allow us to get on curve that Phi and we'll be able to have 619 00:36:05,800 --> 00:36:09,700 access to the curve gauges as well, so that will add another 620 00:36:09,700 --> 00:36:14,400 source of yield for our stickers and depositors. 621 00:36:14,800 --> 00:36:18,500 I think it's it's like the magic of the transmuter. 622 00:36:19,200 --> 00:36:21,700 Coupled with the fact that, you know, we have these liquid 623 00:36:21,700 --> 00:36:24,500 markets that are incentivized that is keeping this Peg up. 624 00:36:26,600 --> 00:36:30,700 So that makes sense that you could earn Alchemists tokens by 625 00:36:30,700 --> 00:36:34,400 like depositing into the curve pool. 626 00:36:34,600 --> 00:36:38,400 But in your curve heavily incentivizes things to be priced 627 00:36:38,400 --> 00:36:43,300 one to one but at the end of the day even on curve, things can 628 00:36:43,300 --> 00:36:48,400 still be you know the price of a Al USD could still be less than 629 00:36:48,400 --> 00:36:52,300 one dollar relative to the other tokens in the pool and as long 630 00:36:52,300 --> 00:36:54,700 as all your checking is that. Hey, is there liquidity in the 631 00:36:54,700 --> 00:36:56,800 pool? So why why is no-one arbitraging 632 00:36:57,500 --> 00:37:02,300 and like kind of even moving the curve pool to be at whatever, 633 00:37:02,300 --> 00:37:07,200 like a properly price Bond should be I don't think there's 634 00:37:07,200 --> 00:37:11,700 really any incentive to do that. There is no ARB there, you know, 635 00:37:11,700 --> 00:37:15,700 for right now and if you try to manipulate it in, bring the 636 00:37:15,700 --> 00:37:18,600 price of value of D down that would just completely get our 637 00:37:18,600 --> 00:37:21,900 big way because people would say, Hey, you know, I can, you 638 00:37:21,908 --> 00:37:25,300 know, buy you know, a Leo's deeper 98 cents and then 639 00:37:25,300 --> 00:37:29,700 transmute it, you know, and get, you know, a dollar for it, you 640 00:37:29,700 --> 00:37:32,400 know, for 98 cents and they can get some instant yield that way. 641 00:37:32,400 --> 00:37:37,000 And we've actually seen that this week with the He's crashing 642 00:37:37,000 --> 00:37:42,500 in price since a lcx is tied to Ethan our Sushi swap market. 643 00:37:42,500 --> 00:37:46,200 We've also gone down with ether as well and because of that our 644 00:37:46,200 --> 00:37:49,800 yields have gone down. So we've seen people exit the 645 00:37:50,100 --> 00:37:53,200 liquidity pools we've seen maybe like, think we had like six 646 00:37:53,200 --> 00:37:55,300 hundred million liquidity there last week and now we have around 647 00:37:55,300 --> 00:38:02,000 550 million and at the same token since a lot of people were 648 00:38:02,000 --> 00:38:04,700 pulling out their died or their three, cool curve tokens from 649 00:38:04,700 --> 00:38:07,100 that pool. There was a bit of an imbalance 650 00:38:07,100 --> 00:38:12,900 in I'll USD went down to like 99.5 sense. 651 00:38:12,900 --> 00:38:16,200 Whereas, before it was roughly like, you know, I think it was 652 00:38:16,207 --> 00:38:19,000 trading at a slight premium to die at the time before that. 653 00:38:19,500 --> 00:38:23,600 And then, because there was that little, our people or then 654 00:38:23,600 --> 00:38:25,900 starting to use the transmuter and we lost, you know, 655 00:38:26,300 --> 00:38:31,100 transmitter had some funds taken from it during this, this period 656 00:38:31,100 --> 00:38:35,000 as well. So but the peg held, it's still 657 00:38:35,000 --> 00:38:37,900 very strong. And things seem to be in an 658 00:38:37,900 --> 00:38:40,500 equilibrium right now and we're not seeing those outflows 659 00:38:40,500 --> 00:38:43,200 anymore. So I think that's just the 660 00:38:43,200 --> 00:38:48,600 system working as intended. How long does it take for 661 00:38:48,600 --> 00:38:51,800 transmutation, at least, like, in that case that you talked 662 00:38:51,800 --> 00:38:58,200 about with die Peg breaking to like you know, 95 cents or 663 00:38:58,200 --> 00:39:01,500 sorry, the AL USD Peg, breaking it, 95 cents relative to die. 664 00:39:01,900 --> 00:39:05,600 How long does it take to transmute like Al USD in to die? 665 00:39:07,400 --> 00:39:12,800 At minimum, it's going to take 50 blocks because we put the 666 00:39:13,000 --> 00:39:18,200 distribution of the, the die, for a lie, OSD depositors in the 667 00:39:18,200 --> 00:39:20,300 transmitter to take a little bit longer. 668 00:39:20,700 --> 00:39:23,000 So that way people wouldn't be able to like grief it if they 669 00:39:23,000 --> 00:39:26,500 like called Harvest and then they could, you know, then 670 00:39:26,500 --> 00:39:30,100 immediately get that died. And, you know, so in order to 671 00:39:30,100 --> 00:39:34,800 stop that, yeah, we have that split spread over 50 blocks, but 672 00:39:34,800 --> 00:39:37,800 usually, that happens. Means whenever somebody those 673 00:39:37,800 --> 00:39:40,500 that will start flowing to your account when we their Harvest 674 00:39:40,500 --> 00:39:42,500 field or somebody repay their debt and die. 675 00:39:43,000 --> 00:39:46,900 Now, there is another function that you can use to transmit 676 00:39:46,900 --> 00:39:48,900 faster, it's called forced transmute. 677 00:39:48,900 --> 00:39:53,100 It's kind of a bit of an advanced function and it's 678 00:39:53,100 --> 00:39:55,600 really only for ethers can Pro users. 679 00:39:56,300 --> 00:39:59,900 Basically, you'd have to query in a 30mm address that state 680 00:39:59,900 --> 00:40:03,200 into the transmitter. It's possible that you can have 681 00:40:03,200 --> 00:40:05,400 too much dye allocated to a position. 682 00:40:06,000 --> 00:40:11,300 I put in 100, 000 USD. There's a little box in there 683 00:40:11,300 --> 00:40:14,000 that says amount of transmittable die. 684 00:40:14,000 --> 00:40:18,100 I have if I put in 100 Augustine and I've hundred transmittable 685 00:40:18,100 --> 00:40:20,600 die. It'll just, you know, burned 100 686 00:40:20,600 --> 00:40:23,700 Al USD and give me 100 die when I hit the transmit button. 687 00:40:24,000 --> 00:40:27,400 But it's possible with our current design for the 688 00:40:27,400 --> 00:40:30,200 transmitter. For you to have 100 ounc, 689 00:40:30,600 --> 00:40:33,200 deposited. And then have more than 100 000 690 00:40:33,200 --> 00:40:37,200 USD that 100 more than 100 Immutable die. 691 00:40:38,100 --> 00:40:40,500 I could have a million transmittable die. 692 00:40:40,500 --> 00:40:45,000 In fact, like, en 100 position and what you can do is, you can 693 00:40:45,000 --> 00:40:48,100 force transmitted somebody who's over-allocated. 694 00:40:48,200 --> 00:40:52,400 And when that happens, all of their excess, allocated dye goes 695 00:40:52,400 --> 00:40:56,600 straight to your allocated die. So, it's sort of like an 696 00:40:56,600 --> 00:40:59,900 incentivised Cron job. There's a handful of people we 697 00:40:59,900 --> 00:41:03,100 know in the ecosystem that kind of take care of this and they've 698 00:41:03,100 --> 00:41:06,300 been, you know, we don't know who they are, but they Figured 699 00:41:06,300 --> 00:41:11,000 out this this Force transmitted system and they have been 700 00:41:11,000 --> 00:41:14,700 carving the peg here and there which is actually a kind of a 701 00:41:14,700 --> 00:41:17,600 service for everybody in the ecosystem because you know 702 00:41:17,600 --> 00:41:20,100 they're helping you know bring stability to the price of value 703 00:41:20,100 --> 00:41:22,600 of D. We did try to implement that 704 00:41:22,600 --> 00:41:28,000 into the UI but we're having some issues with our graph and 705 00:41:28,000 --> 00:41:29,900 it wasn't reliable. So we just like cut it from the 706 00:41:29,908 --> 00:41:32,200 UI but occasionally what we'll do. 707 00:41:32,200 --> 00:41:36,000 If we notice like people like my ties and transmitting well, All 708 00:41:36,000 --> 00:41:38,100 four strands meet a couple positions, and then transmit 709 00:41:38,100 --> 00:41:40,600 ourselves. And then that will disperse the, 710 00:41:40,600 --> 00:41:43,500 the yield even lie to everyone else in the system kind of 711 00:41:43,500 --> 00:41:48,200 immediately at that time. Sure what one question I didn't 712 00:41:48,200 --> 00:41:50,100 fully understand what is the situation? 713 00:41:50,100 --> 00:41:52,500 How do you get yourself into a situation? 714 00:41:52,900 --> 00:41:59,600 Where the your died allocate it is greater than your value of D. 715 00:41:59,600 --> 00:42:02,000 How do you get into a situation? Where you can be Force 716 00:42:02,700 --> 00:42:06,400 transmitted. So this was like, Kind of like a 717 00:42:06,400 --> 00:42:10,900 computer science problem is that imagine like you know the dye 718 00:42:10,900 --> 00:42:13,100 that's flowing into the transmitter is like rain falling 719 00:42:13,100 --> 00:42:16,900 from the sky and you're staking position your deposit for a 720 00:42:16,900 --> 00:42:20,000 Leo's D is like a bucket and of course, when the buckets full 721 00:42:20,000 --> 00:42:22,900 you would expect it to you know, not overflow or anything like 722 00:42:22,900 --> 00:42:24,500 that. It would just be full, right? 723 00:42:24,700 --> 00:42:31,200 But because ethereum is the way that it is and you can't like 724 00:42:31,200 --> 00:42:33,700 have like, you know, kind of code like self-executing, you 725 00:42:33,700 --> 00:42:35,800 always have to like you know pay the gas and push that button. 726 00:42:35,900 --> 00:42:40,100 In to do it, we couldn't find a problem or a solution at the 727 00:42:40,100 --> 00:42:46,900 time for that term, a term mentality for ending the, you 728 00:42:46,900 --> 00:42:50,800 know, the distribution for people who are like overfilled 729 00:42:51,200 --> 00:42:53,000 and so we were kind of scratching our heads. 730 00:42:53,000 --> 00:42:55,400 We were playing around with an Epoch model and other things 731 00:42:55,400 --> 00:42:58,800 like that. And then one of our deaths have 732 00:42:58,800 --> 00:43:01,500 made like a an app from like back in 2018. 733 00:43:02,300 --> 00:43:04,700 And it's like, hey, what if we repurpose this code? 734 00:43:05,500 --> 00:43:08,200 For the transmuter it's like if we do that then it's going to 735 00:43:08,200 --> 00:43:10,600 overfill. And like what if I we turn you 736 00:43:10,600 --> 00:43:13,700 know, an overfull position? Let somebody else be able to 737 00:43:13,700 --> 00:43:16,800 transmute that and we could just send the divs over or the 738 00:43:16,800 --> 00:43:19,200 allocation over to them and that would be like an incentivize 739 00:43:19,200 --> 00:43:21,800 Cron job. And so we're trying to use 740 00:43:21,800 --> 00:43:26,000 crypto token on or economics to solve a computer science 741 00:43:26,000 --> 00:43:28,300 problem. Essentially, the good news is 742 00:43:28,300 --> 00:43:31,500 that in our version 2. We have figured out this problem 743 00:43:32,300 --> 00:43:35,000 and we're not going to have to do this this awkward for 744 00:43:35,200 --> 00:43:38,900 Transmute kind of like Pnina work around to get the system 745 00:43:38,900 --> 00:43:41,900 working in a little just it'll just work and it'll be simple 746 00:43:41,900 --> 00:43:45,500 and will be nice. That's pretty clever solution. 747 00:43:45,500 --> 00:43:47,900 I like that. Now we can now I understand with 748 00:43:47,900 --> 00:43:50,200 the whole that's that's pretty cool. 749 00:43:50,900 --> 00:43:54,100 And you before the system we had it was it was untenable where 750 00:43:54,100 --> 00:43:57,300 you'd have to stake your ally USD weekly and then claim 751 00:43:57,300 --> 00:44:02,500 whatever got transmuted weekly then Reese take it and you know 752 00:44:02,500 --> 00:44:06,800 when we are kind of testing that before we launched like I just 753 00:44:06,800 --> 00:44:09,500 hated it I'm like no nobody's going to do this nobody's going 754 00:44:09,500 --> 00:44:13,000 to spend you know you know five hundred dollars in gas form. 755 00:44:13,100 --> 00:44:16,000 Or, you know, an undetermined pay out every week. 756 00:44:16,100 --> 00:44:19,400 That's why we switched it. It's not perfect, but it works 757 00:44:19,400 --> 00:44:22,000 at the time and we have a much better solution going forward. 758 00:44:23,700 --> 00:44:26,700 So, I don't know if you might not this, not not be what you 759 00:44:26,700 --> 00:44:31,300 want to hear, what, what this somewhat almost reminded me of 760 00:44:31,600 --> 00:44:34,800 was. So I'm very familiar with Fay in 761 00:44:34,800 --> 00:44:39,600 this like slightly reminded me of Fae in some ways, we're 762 00:44:39,700 --> 00:44:43,300 especially in the case, where Faye is over collateralized, 763 00:44:43,300 --> 00:44:46,200 where, you know, which it is currently, right? 764 00:44:46,200 --> 00:44:49,400 I currently in Faye, the price that the clock with collateral 765 00:44:49,400 --> 00:44:53,600 that it has is much higher than the Outstanding, like, stable 766 00:44:53,600 --> 00:44:57,700 coin liabilities that has. And their premise is that, you 767 00:44:57,700 --> 00:45:01,900 know, we can keep this Peg going as long as possible. 768 00:45:01,900 --> 00:45:09,200 Because anyone who wants out can get out any time and we're able 769 00:45:09,200 --> 00:45:12,000 to do this and we can keep this going for as long as possible 770 00:45:12,000 --> 00:45:15,100 because the eith price is going to, as long as the eith price is 771 00:45:15,100 --> 00:45:17,700 going to keep going up. We're going to continuously keep 772 00:45:17,700 --> 00:45:21,000 having a way for the people who want out get out when they want 773 00:45:21,000 --> 00:45:23,800 to get out it. This is actually very similar in 774 00:45:23,800 --> 00:45:26,500 a lot of ways, but instead of depending on the eith price 775 00:45:26,500 --> 00:45:32,000 going up here, it's depending on the yearn yields, right? 776 00:45:32,000 --> 00:45:36,700 As long as the urine yields are like earning money, we'll have 777 00:45:36,700 --> 00:45:39,800 enough money to protocol. Will have enough reserves to let 778 00:45:39,800 --> 00:45:43,600 the people who want to go out. Be able to go out and what's 779 00:45:43,600 --> 00:45:47,200 nice as opposed to in Faye. It's like this claw do is lower 780 00:45:47,200 --> 00:45:52,000 bounded at the hopefully the interest rates on the on urine 781 00:45:52,000 --> 00:45:54,300 do Don't go - right. Like I mean, you know, in 782 00:45:54,308 --> 00:45:56,500 traditional Trad fire, we do actually have negative interest 783 00:45:56,500 --> 00:45:58,800 rates but you know, at least on hopefully when you're in the 784 00:45:58,808 --> 00:46:02,000 prices should never go - and it certainly increases lower 785 00:46:02,000 --> 00:46:04,900 bounded zero while in the PHA case, you know the price. 786 00:46:05,500 --> 00:46:07,700 There's a situation where the protocol can become under 787 00:46:07,700 --> 00:46:11,700 collateralized as well. I didn't really think about that 788 00:46:11,700 --> 00:46:14,900 comparison. But yeah, yeah, I guess where 789 00:46:14,900 --> 00:46:17,800 they're backed by eith, you know, collateral and buying 790 00:46:17,800 --> 00:46:22,100 power to buy back, everything were powered by, you know, die 791 00:46:22,100 --> 00:46:24,000 yield being able to buy back everything. 792 00:46:25,000 --> 00:46:28,600 The cool thing about alchemic Siz that, like, you know, you 793 00:46:28,600 --> 00:46:31,000 know, you could use it by yourself, you could be the only 794 00:46:31,000 --> 00:46:33,200 participant in. It wouldn't make much sense, if 795 00:46:33,200 --> 00:46:36,400 that were the case, but you could because, you know, your 796 00:46:36,400 --> 00:46:39,500 die collateral is locked until either. 797 00:46:39,500 --> 00:46:44,700 You read Your debt or the or, you know, the yield is a paid 798 00:46:44,700 --> 00:46:47,900 off itself or in the yield pays off the debt itself. 799 00:46:47,900 --> 00:46:51,300 So, like, you know, even if like, you know, takes 10 years 800 00:46:51,300 --> 00:46:54,200 for, you know, your loan to mature and nobody's using the 801 00:46:54,207 --> 00:46:56,700 system, and you're just holding this Al USD out there. 802 00:46:56,700 --> 00:46:57,700 You don't know what to do with it. 803 00:46:57,700 --> 00:46:59,700 Eventually, you will be able to redeem that for die. 804 00:46:59,800 --> 00:47:02,000 So there is always that guarantee that we're going to 805 00:47:02,000 --> 00:47:05,300 build a make you whole. And now pemex it just might take 806 00:47:05,300 --> 00:47:08,600 a long time in the worst case scenario and that's actually 807 00:47:08,600 --> 00:47:09,800 something we really really care about. 808 00:47:09,900 --> 00:47:14,700 About you know a lot of us came from detent money games and we 809 00:47:14,700 --> 00:47:16,900 didn't like the fact that so many people were getting wrecked 810 00:47:17,100 --> 00:47:19,500 or the fact that if somebody had to if somebody one that meant 811 00:47:19,500 --> 00:47:22,300 somebody else had to lose in those games. 812 00:47:22,300 --> 00:47:25,200 And so without chemicals we thought how can we make it so 813 00:47:25,200 --> 00:47:28,400 that we can make everybody whole again no matter what no matter 814 00:47:28,400 --> 00:47:33,600 what happens and other than a urine hack, you know, of the, 815 00:47:33,700 --> 00:47:36,700 The Vault that we're using, I don't see a scenario where 816 00:47:36,700 --> 00:47:39,300 anybody could actually lose money using our system. 817 00:47:40,900 --> 00:47:45,400 What's the long-term Vision that you have for alchemic 6, where 818 00:47:45,400 --> 00:47:48,000 do you see yourself in 5 years? 10 years. 819 00:47:48,600 --> 00:47:52,400 As part of this, like, defy story are there like new 820 00:47:52,400 --> 00:47:55,300 products in that I can imagine like ethos collateral. 821 00:47:55,900 --> 00:47:57,800 Yeah. What's the the long-term vision 822 00:47:57,800 --> 00:48:00,900 for you? We're targeting this month, we 823 00:48:00,900 --> 00:48:04,400 might slip in the next month, we're going to be launching a 824 00:48:04,400 --> 00:48:06,700 leathe. It'll work very similar to Al 825 00:48:06,700 --> 00:48:10,900 USD where you deposit teeth and you can take out an ally Sloan. 826 00:48:11,500 --> 00:48:12,800 It might have some different parameters. 827 00:48:12,800 --> 00:48:15,300 Like you might have a different conversation ratio because ET 828 00:48:15,300 --> 00:48:18,200 old is lower than die yield. So we don't want, you know, 829 00:48:18,200 --> 00:48:20,900 somebody to be in there and then have a loan, you know, be 15 830 00:48:20,900 --> 00:48:23,900 years to take off pay off. So we might increase the 831 00:48:23,900 --> 00:48:26,900 collateralization ratio for that one and we're playing around 832 00:48:26,900 --> 00:48:28,100 with some other parameters as well. 833 00:48:28,100 --> 00:48:32,100 But that should be Out. Relatively soon as Shand, the, a 834 00:48:32,100 --> 00:48:35,500 leaf is, I think, is a really cool one, because you can, you 835 00:48:35,500 --> 00:48:39,100 know, lever up on your wreath or you can even, you know, use it 836 00:48:39,100 --> 00:48:43,300 as a cashing out method or a way to shore teeth or to hedge it. 837 00:48:43,800 --> 00:48:46,600 So, I think it's gonna open up a lot of really interesting use 838 00:48:46,600 --> 00:48:50,400 cases. Then after we get a lethal or 839 00:48:51,200 --> 00:48:54,000 heads down focused on getting our version to out, which will 840 00:48:54,000 --> 00:48:57,500 open up a multi collateral, Al-Qaeda mix essentially. 841 00:48:58,000 --> 00:49:01,500 So they'll be You know, for a Leo's D, multiple stable coins 842 00:49:01,500 --> 00:49:03,400 that can be used as to Collateral. 843 00:49:03,900 --> 00:49:07,200 And the cool thing is like you can like make a composite 844 00:49:07,200 --> 00:49:09,300 position of a lot of different stable coins. 845 00:49:09,300 --> 00:49:14,400 And now Comics, imagine each stable coin as an ingredient and 846 00:49:14,400 --> 00:49:17,900 you can customize or you can make your own recipe using the 847 00:49:17,900 --> 00:49:20,000 different ingredients and different balances that you want 848 00:49:20,000 --> 00:49:22,000 to. So if you want like a position 849 00:49:22,000 --> 00:49:26,800 that's 30% die, 50% USD, see 20% tether, you could do that if you 850 00:49:26,808 --> 00:49:30,000 want to. And then as That you can see 851 00:49:30,000 --> 00:49:33,000 like, which stable coins are offering the best yields and 852 00:49:33,000 --> 00:49:35,500 stuff like that. You can Constructor your 853 00:49:35,500 --> 00:49:38,300 position that way. So that that's one cool thing 854 00:49:38,300 --> 00:49:42,500 about version 2 and the same property will also be there for 855 00:49:42,900 --> 00:49:44,400 a late. And we're also going to be 856 00:49:44,400 --> 00:49:47,500 launching out Bitcoin as well and that'll take like various 857 00:49:47,800 --> 00:49:52,600 flavors of Bitcoin on ethereum. And then from there is right 858 00:49:52,600 --> 00:49:57,600 now, an alchemist V1 we launched on audited and we were unsure of 859 00:49:58,000 --> 00:50:01,100 any security Issues with economic exploits. 860 00:50:01,100 --> 00:50:05,400 So we lock down smart contracts from interacting with Malcolm X. 861 00:50:06,200 --> 00:50:09,400 So, we would prevent like flash loans and things like that. 862 00:50:09,800 --> 00:50:12,800 Some unknown stuff. Good news is that we got our 863 00:50:12,800 --> 00:50:15,500 audit back and everything came back really good. 864 00:50:15,500 --> 00:50:20,100 No critical issues were found. So, you know, funds are safe, 865 00:50:21,900 --> 00:50:25,800 but going forward and not to mix V2, is we're going to remove 866 00:50:25,800 --> 00:50:28,500 that restriction, and it's going to be a lot more composable. 867 00:50:28,700 --> 00:50:30,700 And then, To be building modules. 868 00:50:30,700 --> 00:50:33,800 On top of it, I can't get into detail about too much about 869 00:50:33,800 --> 00:50:37,800 those. I did say that I did leak on the 870 00:50:37,800 --> 00:50:40,600 bank list podcast earlier that one of the modules is going to 871 00:50:40,607 --> 00:50:44,100 be for delegated credit. So like when you deposit die 872 00:50:44,100 --> 00:50:47,400 then you have like a creditor value is D that you can take 873 00:50:47,400 --> 00:50:50,100 out. You know this new module are 874 00:50:50,100 --> 00:50:52,300 going to be working on is going to allow you to then. 875 00:50:52,400 --> 00:50:55,300 Let somebody else borrow that Al USD from you. 876 00:50:56,100 --> 00:50:59,100 I don't want to go into too many details about the system, but 877 00:50:59,200 --> 00:51:00,900 but I think that's going to be something that's really 878 00:51:00,900 --> 00:51:04,900 powerful. We're also working on a handful 879 00:51:04,900 --> 00:51:08,900 of are a few other modules in the one that I am leading in 880 00:51:08,900 --> 00:51:14,200 designing is a alchemic style and that's going to bring a cash 881 00:51:14,200 --> 00:51:19,000 flow model to the ALCS tokens a for participants of the dowel. 882 00:51:19,000 --> 00:51:21,600 It's we're going to be experimenting with conviction 883 00:51:21,600 --> 00:51:28,600 voting borrowing some of the security module from Ave so like 884 00:51:29,400 --> 00:51:33,700 Something happens to the protocol and we suffer a loss A 885 00:51:33,700 --> 00:51:37,200 lcx takers in the Dow could get slashed and their token sold at 886 00:51:37,200 --> 00:51:39,400 auction to make the protocol whole again. 887 00:51:39,400 --> 00:51:42,000 So they'll be, you know, security and insurance model 888 00:51:42,200 --> 00:51:47,500 baked into it down and it's going to be executing code, you 889 00:51:47,500 --> 00:51:49,600 know? So the doubt self right now we 890 00:51:49,600 --> 00:51:54,200 have a multisig community and developer multisig with the time 891 00:51:54,200 --> 00:51:58,300 lock and governance be a snapshot but the the doubt self 892 00:51:58,300 --> 00:52:00,400 will you know? Execute the code. 893 00:52:00,700 --> 00:52:03,500 Unlike the semi trusted setup we have right now. 894 00:52:04,400 --> 00:52:07,300 And so, we're going to be borrowing heavily from the 895 00:52:07,300 --> 00:52:09,500 governor Alpha contract from compound. 896 00:52:09,500 --> 00:52:11,700 So we're going to be mixing all those things together to make 897 00:52:11,700 --> 00:52:15,300 something new. And also the goal is to to 898 00:52:15,300 --> 00:52:19,300 gamify it and turn it into something kind of cool and 899 00:52:19,300 --> 00:52:21,100 unique that hasn't been done before. 900 00:52:21,100 --> 00:52:24,500 So please look forward to that when it comes out after V2, 901 00:52:24,500 --> 00:52:29,000 later this year, in to 2022, we're going to be expanding the 902 00:52:29,300 --> 00:52:32,400 Cases of alchemic, by adding more modules, trying to secure 903 00:52:32,400 --> 00:52:36,700 more Integrations and defy. The Holy Grail is to get an 904 00:52:36,700 --> 00:52:38,900 outcome. It's credit card where you 905 00:52:38,900 --> 00:52:41,200 could, you know, it'll take your stable coin deposits. 906 00:52:41,200 --> 00:52:44,000 And then all, you'll just have access to this, you know, line 907 00:52:44,000 --> 00:52:48,700 of credit that you can use for spending that actually might be 908 00:52:48,700 --> 00:52:51,200 in the cards. I don't want to say too much 909 00:52:51,200 --> 00:52:54,300 now, but yeah. We know some people that went 910 00:52:54,300 --> 00:52:58,600 might be able to get this to get it going and a lot of the 911 00:52:58,600 --> 00:53:03,000 members of the The team are also really into in a peas and gaming 912 00:53:03,000 --> 00:53:04,400 and stuff like that. And that's something that I 913 00:53:04,408 --> 00:53:07,300 think our team as they all come expressed. 914 00:53:07,700 --> 00:53:10,400 You know, platform matures is an area that we might start 915 00:53:10,400 --> 00:53:14,800 branching off into one area that we're really excited about is 916 00:53:15,100 --> 00:53:17,800 flipping the model paying for games on its head a little bit 917 00:53:17,800 --> 00:53:22,700 and doing a form of steak to pay to play where you can leverage 918 00:53:22,700 --> 00:53:25,500 the actual outcome exist. Mm to finance, paint for games 919 00:53:25,500 --> 00:53:29,000 without actually having to, you know, purchase a game or, you 920 00:53:29,000 --> 00:53:32,200 know, Having to unleash a pay for all these like you know, 921 00:53:32,600 --> 00:53:34,300 microtransactions and stuff like that. 922 00:53:34,300 --> 00:53:37,500 Instead, you would just say hey I deposit a couple hundred die 923 00:53:37,500 --> 00:53:40,400 and then I get to play this game as long as I have my deposit in 924 00:53:40,400 --> 00:53:43,900 there instead. So that's a something that we're 925 00:53:43,900 --> 00:53:47,800 pretty excited about. But that's down the line as far 926 00:53:47,800 --> 00:53:51,200 as stuff like that goes. And then you know, long, long 927 00:53:51,200 --> 00:53:54,300 term goals is, you know, for values D. 928 00:53:54,800 --> 00:54:01,000 We hope that we can become one of The top decentralized stable 929 00:54:01,000 --> 00:54:05,000 coin out there, it's sort of like a metastable point to in 930 00:54:05,000 --> 00:54:06,400 the future. It will be when we have multi 931 00:54:06,400 --> 00:54:09,900 collateral Alias D so it'll be like a composite of all the the 932 00:54:09,900 --> 00:54:12,600 stable coins. Right now we have around three 933 00:54:12,600 --> 00:54:16,200 hundred and three hundred thirty million, I'll use the out there. 934 00:54:16,200 --> 00:54:18,200 I think it'd be really cool if we can get over a billion. 935 00:54:18,900 --> 00:54:22,400 So that's, you know, one of our goals is to get over a billion 936 00:54:22,400 --> 00:54:26,200 dollars of value of D out there, if not more, that could be cool 937 00:54:26,300 --> 00:54:29,500 if we could take maker Dallas. The top decentralized able Now 938 00:54:29,500 --> 00:54:31,000 they're really cool. I don't know if I can get that 939 00:54:31,000 --> 00:54:33,100 far, but you know, that would be cool. 940 00:54:34,400 --> 00:54:37,100 And what do you see? As some of the biggest risks 941 00:54:37,100 --> 00:54:41,400 facing you guys, especially from, you know what can 942 00:54:41,400 --> 00:54:46,700 competition do right, as well. Like what happens if maker says, 943 00:54:46,700 --> 00:54:50,200 hey, we're going to start taking why assets so like, you know, 944 00:54:51,000 --> 00:54:54,600 like a derivative of, what about your deposit and like accept 945 00:54:54,600 --> 00:54:58,000 that as collateral. How does that change the 946 00:54:58,000 --> 00:55:03,300 Dynamics of the alchemic system? Yeah, we're already starting to 947 00:55:03,300 --> 00:55:06,100 see that a little bit. I know cream was playing around 948 00:55:06,100 --> 00:55:09,100 with the idea of allowing, why assets as collateral I think 949 00:55:09,200 --> 00:55:12,800 unit protocol is also playing around with that as well, but 950 00:55:12,800 --> 00:55:16,900 they still would be different from alchemic because when you 951 00:55:16,900 --> 00:55:19,300 borrow their, their stable coins, that you're still getting 952 00:55:19,300 --> 00:55:21,900 charged interest. If I borrow usdp, I'm going to 953 00:55:21,908 --> 00:55:24,800 be getting charged 12%. If I borrowed, I think it's 954 00:55:24,800 --> 00:55:26,500 something like five or six percent right now. 955 00:55:26,500 --> 00:55:29,600 I'm not entirely sure. Whereas, with us you you're not 956 00:55:29,600 --> 00:55:31,500 gonna have to pay interest on the LAUSD. 957 00:55:32,900 --> 00:55:36,700 Instead your collateral is going to be paying off that debt over 958 00:55:36,700 --> 00:55:37,900 time. So I think that's something 959 00:55:37,900 --> 00:55:41,900 unique for our pemex and the way that we constructed our system 960 00:55:42,800 --> 00:55:45,800 that other people, you know, they would either have to clone 961 00:55:45,800 --> 00:55:49,300 us to replicate it for their own apps. 962 00:55:50,600 --> 00:55:53,500 Isn't this interest important in these systems? 963 00:55:53,500 --> 00:55:58,100 Because it's what helps bring the price back to a Peg. 964 00:55:58,200 --> 00:56:02,100 And it's like or because if people like, you know, you want 965 00:56:02,100 --> 00:56:04,900 to let kind of incentivize people to pay off their debt and 966 00:56:04,900 --> 00:56:09,300 like, having this interest is kind of what does that without 967 00:56:09,300 --> 00:56:11,900 requiring people to pay off their debt and like, have an 968 00:56:11,900 --> 00:56:14,400 interest. How do you kind of get people to 969 00:56:14,400 --> 00:56:19,000 want to pay off their debt? Yeah, so if Al USD is off the 970 00:56:19,000 --> 00:56:22,800 Peg and it's a cheaper, you know, in let's say like you 971 00:56:22,800 --> 00:56:26,200 borrowed it at one point and you sold it for a dollar and then 972 00:56:26,200 --> 00:56:29,100 later on, it's like 97 cents. You could be like, hey, I'm 973 00:56:29,100 --> 00:56:32,500 going to, you know, by this out USD off the market because it's 974 00:56:32,500 --> 00:56:35,300 at a discount right now and I can pay off my debt for cheap 975 00:56:35,800 --> 00:56:38,300 like for cheaper than I would have been able to otherwise. 976 00:56:39,300 --> 00:56:42,500 So that is a paying module or mechanism right there. 977 00:56:43,000 --> 00:56:44,800 And then it's just like, you know, Arbitrage to the 978 00:56:44,800 --> 00:56:49,800 transmitter is the Aspect right there, that helps balance the 979 00:56:49,800 --> 00:56:52,200 peg out. And the fact that like we, you 980 00:56:52,200 --> 00:56:56,500 know, instead of like, people paying 12%, you know, for 981 00:56:56,500 --> 00:57:01,000 interest, you know, we're having that 12% paid by your 982 00:57:01,000 --> 00:57:03,500 essentially and that's going into the transmitter. 983 00:57:03,500 --> 00:57:06,500 So that that's the transmitter of the money in their sort of 984 00:57:06,500 --> 00:57:10,600 like this buffer that says like hey if you know the pig is you 985 00:57:10,600 --> 00:57:13,100 know you know at risk then people are going to go in the 986 00:57:13,100 --> 00:57:16,500 transmitter and then you know, use that as the method to You 987 00:57:16,500 --> 00:57:19,000 know, convert their earliest either they're going to orbit 988 00:57:19,400 --> 00:57:22,000 from the curve pool and stuff like that and make money off of 989 00:57:22,000 --> 00:57:25,400 it. And those those together they 990 00:57:25,400 --> 00:57:28,200 all, you know, so far, everything seems to be 991 00:57:28,200 --> 00:57:32,000 indicating that those those mechanisms are working to 992 00:57:32,000 --> 00:57:34,800 maintain the peg for it. I think one of the other things 993 00:57:34,800 --> 00:57:38,700 that makes die Peg. So strong and S USD always have 994 00:57:38,700 --> 00:57:41,900 a premium, is the fact that, you know, they are in demand assets 995 00:57:41,900 --> 00:57:45,700 and defy whether that's through yield farming or, you know, 996 00:57:46,700 --> 00:57:51,500 Using them as assets and other things are in other protocols. 997 00:57:51,900 --> 00:57:56,000 I think that's what you know is driving the, the high price for, 998 00:57:56,000 --> 00:57:59,000 you know, the premium for died in the premium 4S USD is the 999 00:57:59,000 --> 00:58:01,300 fact that they're useful and they are used everywhere. 1000 00:58:01,900 --> 00:58:05,100 And I think if we can get that going for Alias D, then, you 1001 00:58:05,100 --> 00:58:09,000 know, we'll have we'll take care of the demand side of it, even 1002 00:58:09,000 --> 00:58:12,100 stronger. So is this going to be enough to 1003 00:58:12,100 --> 00:58:15,500 incentivize and keep the peg strong long-term? 1004 00:58:15,800 --> 00:58:20,700 I I'm leaning towards yes but I guess we won't really know until 1005 00:58:20,700 --> 00:58:23,600 the bear Market hits and we'll see what happens to the yields 1006 00:58:23,600 --> 00:58:26,700 on chains. Like My worry is, if yields go 1007 00:58:26,700 --> 00:58:31,200 up like under 5% I think we would still be fine at around 5% 1008 00:58:31,200 --> 00:58:34,300 but under 5% is where I might start getting my start to worry 1009 00:58:34,300 --> 00:58:37,700 about the effectiveness of the system and the safety of it. 1010 00:58:37,700 --> 00:58:40,300 So I'm not the safety but more the stability of it. 1011 00:58:40,300 --> 00:58:44,100 But I think if we take care of the demand side, then all the 1012 00:58:44,100 --> 00:58:47,400 other fears about the pegging are going To you know, be 1013 00:58:47,400 --> 00:58:52,300 diminished significantly. Doesn't this also creates like a 1014 00:58:52,600 --> 00:58:56,000 free. You can leverage on like your 1015 00:58:56,000 --> 00:58:59,500 urine yields. So like because if you let's say 1016 00:58:59,500 --> 00:59:05,200 I take it, I take my die, put it in Alka, mix 40, 50 % of all 1017 00:59:05,200 --> 00:59:07,500 USD. But now if the value is D is 1018 00:59:08,000 --> 00:59:12,400 trading at 121 with die, I could go trade that for more die. 1019 00:59:12,500 --> 00:59:15,100 Put that in, alchemy mix again and take out. 1020 00:59:15,100 --> 00:59:18,900 I'll USD and I can keep doing this process again and again and 1021 00:59:18,900 --> 00:59:24,400 I'm essentially going to be In. I basically got a free 2x 1022 00:59:24,400 --> 00:59:30,800 leverage on my die and this means I just doubled my yearn 1023 00:59:30,900 --> 00:59:36,100 earnings, right? Yes, that would mean the same 1024 00:59:36,100 --> 00:59:39,400 thing. Yes, you can lever up to 2x the 1025 00:59:39,400 --> 00:59:41,400 efficiency gets down every single step. 1026 00:59:41,400 --> 00:59:44,600 Imagine that you start at 100, you're trying to get the 200. 1027 00:59:44,600 --> 00:59:49,100 So your next step is 150. Then from 115, go to 175 and you 1028 00:59:49,107 --> 00:59:52,200 can go to 187. Evan and then, you know, they're 1029 00:59:52,200 --> 00:59:56,500 so like, you know, depends on your size and how efficient 1030 00:59:56,500 --> 00:59:59,100 that's going to be, but yes, that is something you can do. 1031 00:59:59,100 --> 01:00:03,000 That's also why we have a 200% collateralization ratio if it 1032 01:00:03,000 --> 01:00:07,200 were any less than this recursive, you know, borrowing 1033 01:00:07,200 --> 01:00:11,600 strategy could easily go up to like five, six, seven, eight, X. 1034 01:00:11,600 --> 01:00:16,400 And that would be, you know, I think unfair for other users in 1035 01:00:16,400 --> 01:00:21,100 the system because essentially they would be You can yield from 1036 01:00:21,100 --> 01:00:23,000 other people if that makes sense. 1037 01:00:24,800 --> 01:00:26,700 How does the equilibrium of this workout? 1038 01:00:26,700 --> 01:00:29,600 Like, it is the rational thing for everyone to do is that 1039 01:00:29,600 --> 01:00:31,400 everyone should be doing this, right? 1040 01:00:31,800 --> 01:00:36,800 And then what happens, if everyone does this do there's 1041 01:00:36,800 --> 01:00:40,700 the there's the urine earnings per die, just half. 1042 01:00:41,000 --> 01:00:43,100 What's the equilibrium of this scenario? 1043 01:00:43,200 --> 01:00:45,100 Seems like it's something that everyone should be doing by 1044 01:00:45,100 --> 01:00:48,900 default, in fact, you're in itself, should be doing, I 1045 01:00:48,900 --> 01:00:50,400 disagree with that. I don't think everyone should be 1046 01:00:50,408 --> 01:00:53,400 doing that by default. But anyway, let me like, let me 1047 01:00:53,400 --> 01:00:55,200 get to that. So if Like the you're involved 1048 01:00:55,200 --> 01:00:57,600 with, I think what makes them special and different from 1049 01:00:57,600 --> 01:00:58,800 other. Your aggregators is that they're 1050 01:00:58,800 --> 01:01:02,400 scalable because they can add any arbitrary amount of 1051 01:01:02,400 --> 01:01:06,700 strategies to their vault and that allows it to like you know 1052 01:01:06,900 --> 01:01:10,500 no one you'll provider gets overwhelmed by the yourens TV, 1053 01:01:10,500 --> 01:01:14,100 all coming into it and you know, we've seen like when we first 1054 01:01:14,100 --> 01:01:18,800 started, the yv Dy V had like, I think, like 20 or 30 million in 1055 01:01:18,800 --> 01:01:21,200 it and now it has over 600 million in it. 1056 01:01:21,200 --> 01:01:24,400 And yet the yields have still held up very very, very well and 1057 01:01:24,500 --> 01:01:28,600 And I attribute, yearns, Brilliance and engineering, and 1058 01:01:28,600 --> 01:01:31,100 their strategist for making that happen. 1059 01:01:31,800 --> 01:01:35,300 So I don't think the yield of the year, the yields from urine 1060 01:01:35,300 --> 01:01:39,700 would collapse in that scenario. But what would happen is the 1061 01:01:39,700 --> 01:01:41,700 yields in our pemex would go down. 1062 01:01:41,700 --> 01:01:47,200 Because right now, there is we have the transmitter in the, the 1063 01:01:47,200 --> 01:01:49,800 die that that's holding in the yield, that that's passing on to 1064 01:01:49,800 --> 01:01:51,800 it. And right now there's about, you 1065 01:01:51,800 --> 01:01:57,100 know, similar amount of dye In the transmitter that's in the 1066 01:01:57,200 --> 01:02:00,100 Alchemists vaults and because of that it's basically doubling 1067 01:02:00,100 --> 01:02:04,100 yearns apy because we have like twice the amount of principal 1068 01:02:04,700 --> 01:02:07,800 and if a lot of people were doing this, leveraged recursive, 1069 01:02:07,800 --> 01:02:12,000 leverage to strategy than it, would throw that balance out and 1070 01:02:12,000 --> 01:02:14,400 beat make it a little bit more heavier towards the Vault side 1071 01:02:14,400 --> 01:02:18,400 instead of the transmitter side. And because of that, that would 1072 01:02:18,900 --> 01:02:23,500 lower the relative amount of principle that the transmitter 1073 01:02:23,500 --> 01:02:26,400 has a relation to the Vault, which would lower yields for 1074 01:02:26,400 --> 01:02:30,000 everybody in the system, but it wouldn't lower the income of the 1075 01:02:30,000 --> 01:02:31,300 system. In fact, that would probably go 1076 01:02:31,300 --> 01:02:35,700 up if there was more in the, you know, more aggregate die in the 1077 01:02:35,700 --> 01:02:39,300 system, and you know, that that died that they're borrowing and 1078 01:02:39,300 --> 01:02:41,200 that they're leveraging and everything like that, that's 1079 01:02:41,200 --> 01:02:44,200 still locked as collateral. So that's going to be sending 1080 01:02:44,200 --> 01:02:47,000 email to the transmuter this whole while and everything like 1081 01:02:47,000 --> 01:02:50,600 that. So that should work out. 1082 01:02:50,900 --> 01:02:53,600 As long as like, the collateralization ratio isn't 1083 01:02:53,600 --> 01:02:58,100 too low, then I don't think this recursive strategy is, is is 1084 01:02:58,100 --> 01:03:03,500 damaging to the system, but if everyone were to do it, it could 1085 01:03:03,500 --> 01:03:06,300 have some unintended consequences and maybe 1086 01:03:06,300 --> 01:03:09,500 destabilize the peg temporarily at times. 1087 01:03:09,500 --> 01:03:12,600 In my opinion, I think long term you might actually be healthier 1088 01:03:12,600 --> 01:03:14,900 for the paint because that means there's more die locked in the 1089 01:03:14,900 --> 01:03:18,300 system and more guaranteed you know yield coming into it. 1090 01:03:18,300 --> 01:03:22,500 So it's not quite a new Neutral thing, it's slightly negative, 1091 01:03:22,500 --> 01:03:25,300 but not that negative for the for people to be using the 1092 01:03:25,300 --> 01:03:26,300 strategy. My opinion. 1093 01:03:27,600 --> 01:03:31,500 And I also think that like you know, speculating on altcoins, 1094 01:03:31,600 --> 01:03:36,600 you know, or trying to farm and other stable coins using the the 1095 01:03:36,600 --> 01:03:39,900 stuff that you borrow is is also, you know, really popular, 1096 01:03:39,900 --> 01:03:41,800 and viable strategy. So I don't see a lot of people 1097 01:03:41,800 --> 01:03:49,100 doing the recursive strategy. One question I had was about 1098 01:03:49,100 --> 01:03:53,900 Community obviously having a token, a lcx token. 1099 01:03:54,500 --> 01:03:58,900 So quickly kind of community is one of the most important things 1100 01:03:59,500 --> 01:04:02,700 for alchemic, slang term success. 1101 01:04:02,700 --> 01:04:04,700 How do you think about like attracting a community? 1102 01:04:04,700 --> 01:04:09,700 Keeping people very engaged and you've mentioned the team, a few 1103 01:04:09,700 --> 01:04:11,900 times. How do you see like the team as 1104 01:04:11,900 --> 01:04:15,000 distinct from the community and what's yours? 1105 01:04:15,200 --> 01:04:19,900 Long-term plans for for decentralization and governance 1106 01:04:19,900 --> 01:04:24,900 for alcoholics. So we love our community, we 1107 01:04:24,900 --> 01:04:28,800 have a Discord and we try to make our Discord a lightly 1108 01:04:28,800 --> 01:04:32,000 moderated place, so people can have fun, and they can, you 1109 01:04:32,000 --> 01:04:34,000 know, shitpost and enjoy in there. 1110 01:04:34,500 --> 01:04:36,700 And we have lots of funny and silly emojis and there that 1111 01:04:36,700 --> 01:04:40,700 people use and stuff like that. So we are communities, really 1112 01:04:40,700 --> 01:04:42,900 good? Are we have a community manager 1113 01:04:43,300 --> 01:04:49,300 gorby who set up our Discord and we engage with them like daily I 1114 01:04:49,300 --> 01:04:52,100 get in there answer questions and post along with everyone 1115 01:04:52,100 --> 01:04:54,300 else. We actually even have a sub 1116 01:04:54,300 --> 01:04:56,700 community that was created inside and out Comics. 1117 01:04:56,700 --> 01:05:01,500 They're called the Young shoots and they just theorize like all 1118 01:05:01,500 --> 01:05:03,700 these DJ and stuff that you can do without chemicals and other 1119 01:05:03,700 --> 01:05:06,900 apps in court in connection without chemicals and stuff like 1120 01:05:06,900 --> 01:05:08,400 that. And they just do the they post 1121 01:05:08,400 --> 01:05:12,300 about it in a degenerate channel in our Discord. 1122 01:05:12,800 --> 01:05:16,400 One way that we engage them is that you know like us in the 1123 01:05:16,400 --> 01:05:19,400 core team like we might come up with like a plan or an outline 1124 01:05:19,400 --> 01:05:21,800 of some things I'm going to do or some changes that we make. 1125 01:05:22,000 --> 01:05:25,100 But then will will go to the community and our Discord in our 1126 01:05:25,100 --> 01:05:29,400 forum and well, what will ask for comments and then, you know, 1127 01:05:29,400 --> 01:05:31,800 we'll launch into a big debate and then we'll try to find 1128 01:05:31,800 --> 01:05:37,300 consensus among everybody. And then, you know, once we have 1129 01:05:37,300 --> 01:05:40,200 some good options or we have consensus, will take it to the 1130 01:05:40,200 --> 01:05:45,100 snapshot, to make it official and then we'll execute, you 1131 01:05:45,100 --> 01:05:47,400 know, in accordance with the communities, which is at that 1132 01:05:47,400 --> 01:05:49,700 time. It's a little bit centralized, 1133 01:05:49,700 --> 01:05:53,000 but I think we're doing a pretty good job of involving Our 1134 01:05:53,000 --> 01:05:55,500 community and keeping them in the loop and keeping them 1135 01:05:55,500 --> 01:05:58,900 involved with, you know, making decisions. 1136 01:05:58,900 --> 01:06:03,500 And I think that's good for, you know, getting them involved in 1137 01:06:03,500 --> 01:06:06,800 keeping them sticky and our community occasionally, I'll go 1138 01:06:06,800 --> 01:06:10,200 in there and I'll we have a tip Bott and I'll Make It Rain is if 1139 01:06:10,200 --> 01:06:14,500 I'm feeling generous, especially like, if somebody's contributing 1140 01:06:14,500 --> 01:06:17,200 a by notice somebody has been like in our support Channel and 1141 01:06:17,200 --> 01:06:19,800 like you know been helping out a bunch of newcomers like you know 1142 01:06:19,800 --> 01:06:21,200 I'll throw him a tip or something. 1143 01:06:21,200 --> 01:06:23,600 Makes it really dank meme. I'll throw The tip things like 1144 01:06:23,600 --> 01:06:25,100 that, and I think stuff like that. 1145 01:06:25,100 --> 01:06:27,100 And people seeing like, just like kind of random acts of 1146 01:06:27,100 --> 01:06:29,600 generosity Inspire other people to do that. 1147 01:06:29,600 --> 01:06:33,600 So like what I've seen now is like, people I've tipped for 1148 01:06:33,600 --> 01:06:35,700 their work in the protocol or not tipping other people. 1149 01:06:35,700 --> 01:06:39,100 So it's like this sort of like generous or this virtuous cycle 1150 01:06:39,100 --> 01:06:43,000 going on and I think that's helping our community a lot 1151 01:06:43,900 --> 01:06:47,400 going forward for academics and how we're going to decentralize 1152 01:06:47,400 --> 01:06:50,000 is later this year, we're going to be launching out coming style 1153 01:06:50,000 --> 01:06:55,300 and that's going to basically Remove the dev Stranglehold on 1154 01:06:55,300 --> 01:07:00,100 power as we're going to ditch the, the multisig, you know, and 1155 01:07:00,100 --> 01:07:02,100 snapshot format. And it's going to go straight to 1156 01:07:02,107 --> 01:07:04,100 like on chain governance and everything like that. 1157 01:07:04,400 --> 01:07:07,000 And at that point, anything we want to do, like, we're not 1158 01:07:07,000 --> 01:07:09,100 gonna be able to force anything. Everything's going to have to go 1159 01:07:09,100 --> 01:07:12,200 through the Dow for better or worse, and we're going to go 1160 01:07:12,200 --> 01:07:14,200 into that right now. We're still like an early phase 1161 01:07:14,200 --> 01:07:17,100 in our growth phase and I think having the the multi sake of 1162 01:07:17,100 --> 01:07:19,400 time lock and the flexibility of that is better. 1163 01:07:19,400 --> 01:07:22,300 It allows us to move a little bit faster and you know, conduct 1164 01:07:22,300 --> 01:07:26,900 deals Things like that and help us get started, but we're 1165 01:07:26,900 --> 01:07:30,800 planning to grow up and get our community, becoming the owners 1166 01:07:30,800 --> 01:07:34,100 of the protocol itself and the Dow. 1167 01:07:34,100 --> 01:07:38,000 Hopefully, the down designing is going to be highly engaging and 1168 01:07:38,100 --> 01:07:41,900 get everybody in there and inactive and give them reason to 1169 01:07:41,900 --> 01:07:47,100 to be active as well. So tell us a bit about your 1170 01:07:47,300 --> 01:07:55,200 exiting news, and I'm a type of machine stuff that my exiting 1171 01:07:55,200 --> 01:07:58,500 these, my what I'm excited about or what I'm exiting about. 1172 01:07:59,500 --> 01:08:01,400 Yeah, distressed to learn about like, you know what show, you 1173 01:08:01,400 --> 01:08:06,500 know, you guys did a raise after sort of the launch of the token 1174 01:08:06,500 --> 01:08:09,400 and protocol and stuff. So you know really interested to 1175 01:08:09,408 --> 01:08:12,600 learn about like how that process goes and like you know, 1176 01:08:13,200 --> 01:08:16,899 it is you know most teams And do you usually do like, raise money 1177 01:08:16,899 --> 01:08:18,500 from investors pre-launch of a token. 1178 01:08:18,500 --> 01:08:21,500 So, how did that process? Differ a specially. 1179 01:08:21,500 --> 01:08:22,399 When, you know, you guys are all. 1180 01:08:22,399 --> 01:08:25,200 So like, you know, mostly Anon and stuff. 1181 01:08:25,200 --> 01:08:27,600 And so what was the fund? What it was just like very 1182 01:08:27,700 --> 01:08:31,600 unique fundraising process like, Yeah. 1183 01:08:31,600 --> 01:08:37,200 So this all started because before we launched all Comics, I 1184 01:08:37,200 --> 01:08:41,300 needed it to have like a job done to help us get the 1185 01:08:41,500 --> 01:08:45,000 everything ready before launch. And so I contracted another 1186 01:08:45,000 --> 01:08:47,700 developer and said, hey can you get this done for me? 1187 01:08:48,200 --> 01:08:50,500 It's urgent and it's a little bit beyond my skill level. 1188 01:08:50,800 --> 01:08:53,300 And it said, sure, it's like, yeah, I told him at the time 1189 01:08:53,500 --> 01:08:55,000 back. When before we launch, when I 1190 01:08:55,000 --> 01:08:58,600 thought the price of a nail CX token was like 15 bucks. 1191 01:08:59,399 --> 01:09:01,899 Yeah, I'll pay 100. Am You actually get this job 1192 01:09:01,899 --> 01:09:06,399 done and then we after we launched, we Moon. 1193 01:09:06,399 --> 01:09:11,800 And at the time I sent this guy, his hundred lcx lcx was worth, I 1194 01:09:11,800 --> 01:09:13,200 think like eight hundred dollars. 1195 01:09:13,700 --> 01:09:16,000 So what I thought was gonna be like a fifteen hundred dollar 1196 01:09:16,000 --> 01:09:18,200 payment turned into like an eighty thousand dollar payment, 1197 01:09:18,200 --> 01:09:23,899 and then the guy sent it to, he cashed it out like immediately 1198 01:09:24,600 --> 01:09:30,399 and sold it for for, I think, Keith and then people were 1199 01:09:30,399 --> 01:09:32,200 walking. Monitoring the dev wallets, and 1200 01:09:32,200 --> 01:09:34,500 like the devs are really getting, the devs are rocking 1201 01:09:34,700 --> 01:09:37,300 and I'm like, no nose. I just promised somebody a 1202 01:09:37,300 --> 01:09:41,300 payment before we launch them just making good on my word and 1203 01:09:41,700 --> 01:09:44,100 because of that, we realize that we were like, under a 1204 01:09:44,100 --> 01:09:46,000 microscope. Every single thing that we were 1205 01:09:46,000 --> 01:09:49,200 doing any movement of our funds, everything was going to be 1206 01:09:49,200 --> 01:09:51,000 heavily scrutinized. And we thought like if we're 1207 01:09:51,000 --> 01:09:55,100 going to, you know, like in our a lot of our team was still 1208 01:09:55,100 --> 01:09:57,500 working a day job. At the time, we we've been 1209 01:09:57,500 --> 01:10:00,500 developing this in our spare time since, you know, midsummer 1210 01:10:01,400 --> 01:10:06,400 So, for the team to quit their day, jobs, I'd have to cash out 1211 01:10:06,400 --> 01:10:08,900 some males Yaks in order to have enough funds to, you know, 1212 01:10:08,900 --> 01:10:12,400 support them and their families and stuff and seeing the 1213 01:10:12,400 --> 01:10:15,300 reaction to the market and the community. 1214 01:10:15,300 --> 01:10:18,800 When, you know, I sent this tokens to the other deaf who 1215 01:10:18,800 --> 01:10:20,400 cash them out. And they thought that we were 1216 01:10:20,400 --> 01:10:23,800 rocking like we have to have it, we have to find a different way. 1217 01:10:24,300 --> 01:10:28,600 Luckily, I mean a girl capital and they were one of our like 1218 01:10:28,600 --> 01:10:30,900 they contributed to her. Initial liquidity pool. 1219 01:10:31,100 --> 01:10:35,200 On Sushi Swap and there's they have a lot of people in there 1220 01:10:35,200 --> 01:10:37,500 that are traitors and developers are really, really well 1221 01:10:37,500 --> 01:10:41,100 connected into the ecosystem. And I ask them is like, hey, do 1222 01:10:41,100 --> 01:10:43,500 you think he could help us try to find some OTC partners? 1223 01:10:43,500 --> 01:10:47,200 Because we thought if we want OT see, you know, we wouldn't have 1224 01:10:47,200 --> 01:10:49,800 these problems with people freaking out thinking that we 1225 01:10:49,800 --> 01:10:52,100 were rocking and stuff like that and dumping on sushi. 1226 01:10:52,600 --> 01:10:56,800 So they hooked us up with a number of players in the space 1227 01:10:56,800 --> 01:10:59,300 that we're all interested in getting a lcx anyway. 1228 01:10:59,800 --> 01:11:04,200 And we struck out A deal at the time the the price of Ale CX is 1229 01:11:04,200 --> 01:11:09,900 like 750 or $800 and we you know we settled on a price of $700 1230 01:11:09,900 --> 01:11:13,200 for the OTC so overall pretty good investors. 1231 01:11:13,400 --> 01:11:17,100 They got in a slight discount and we didn't you know jump the 1232 01:11:17,100 --> 01:11:19,000 market. So I think it was a pretty good 1233 01:11:19,000 --> 01:11:23,700 win-win situation and those funds allowed the team to quit 1234 01:11:23,700 --> 01:11:27,300 their day jobs completely so you go full time so that was really 1235 01:11:27,300 --> 01:11:31,800 important for us and then during those negotiations In some other 1236 01:11:31,800 --> 01:11:34,400 investors jumped in and said, hey, we'd also like to lead a 1237 01:11:34,407 --> 01:11:37,700 strategic round without chemists. 1238 01:11:37,700 --> 01:11:41,800 And so we work out a deal with them and that was using the, the 1239 01:11:41,800 --> 01:11:45,500 douse funds itself. So that seeded our dowel with 1240 01:11:45,500 --> 01:11:47,200 over three million dollars of capital. 1241 01:11:48,600 --> 01:11:50,900 So it's giving us a lot of flexibility for, you know, 1242 01:11:50,900 --> 01:11:54,200 paying for Audits and other expenses that are coming up as 1243 01:11:54,200 --> 01:11:58,300 well, between those two deals, the team is taken care of. 1244 01:11:58,300 --> 01:12:02,300 And the the protocol is in good shape, going forward. 1245 01:12:02,800 --> 01:12:06,500 I think if our app wasn't compelling and novel and 1246 01:12:06,500 --> 01:12:09,500 something new, we probably would not have ever been offered this 1247 01:12:09,900 --> 01:12:12,400 these deals. So I think that that's, you 1248 01:12:12,400 --> 01:12:16,600 know, you know is very flattering and very nice, you 1249 01:12:16,600 --> 01:12:20,000 know, for our protocol that they would consider to invest in 1250 01:12:20,000 --> 01:12:22,400 Anonymous Deb's. I also think that maybe because 1251 01:12:22,400 --> 01:12:25,200 I have a little bit of clout reputation in the space and I'm 1252 01:12:25,200 --> 01:12:28,300 connected to people like equal Capital that that also probably 1253 01:12:28,300 --> 01:12:32,800 made investors a little bit more comfortable investing So, you 1254 01:12:32,800 --> 01:12:36,300 know, I don't know if other anons could pull this off. 1255 01:12:36,300 --> 01:12:40,300 They might not be as, you know, as connected as Scoopy triple 1256 01:12:40,300 --> 01:12:43,900 say Can you tell us a little bit about what you girl? 1257 01:12:43,900 --> 01:12:49,200 Capital is? Yeah, we're just a it's just a 1258 01:12:49,200 --> 01:12:54,600 group of anions and and people who we have a couple docs 1259 01:12:54,600 --> 01:13:00,200 members as well. And so we are like we together. 1260 01:13:00,200 --> 01:13:04,000 We form like, we're all our own individual, LPS and together. 1261 01:13:04,000 --> 01:13:06,100 We form our own little kind of like ad. 1262 01:13:06,100 --> 01:13:09,100 Hoc decentralized VC, not really decentralized. 1263 01:13:09,500 --> 01:13:13,000 We're not a dowel or anything like that per se, but we try to 1264 01:13:13,000 --> 01:13:18,000 find ecosystem projects that are Seemed to us that are cool. 1265 01:13:18,000 --> 01:13:20,900 We're not just like there to you know invest in things and flip 1266 01:13:20,900 --> 01:13:22,400 it and take profits and stuff like that. 1267 01:13:22,400 --> 01:13:25,100 But we want to find projects that we think are cooler moves 1268 01:13:25,100 --> 01:13:29,100 of the space forward and then we pull our funds together and we 1269 01:13:29,100 --> 01:13:32,700 invest and so far, we've done radical. 1270 01:13:32,800 --> 01:13:34,600 I'll can mix. You know, socks. 1271 01:13:35,600 --> 01:13:39,300 That was more of a liquid token investment and Arbitron. 1272 01:13:40,100 --> 01:13:46,200 And yet, Yes, so those are the the Investments that we have a z 1273 01:13:46,200 --> 01:13:47,800 girl. Right now we've actually turned 1274 01:13:47,800 --> 01:13:51,100 down a lot of things just because you know, we wanted to 1275 01:13:51,100 --> 01:13:54,400 kind of distinguish ourselves as people, you know, who are more 1276 01:13:54,600 --> 01:13:56,800 allies of the ecosystem. Instead of people were just out 1277 01:13:56,800 --> 01:14:00,200 there to, you know, make a quick buck in flip tokens and stuff 1278 01:14:00,200 --> 01:14:05,200 like that. That's a very eclectic set of 1279 01:14:05,300 --> 01:14:09,400 investment, I guess it fits for a very eclectic set of LPS. 1280 01:14:10,400 --> 01:14:14,700 It's very, very collected, like the E girl chat is just a really 1281 01:14:14,700 --> 01:14:18,600 wild and random place where we go from talking to defy to 1282 01:14:18,600 --> 01:14:25,000 talking to two women and girls. And then we talk about when we 1283 01:14:25,008 --> 01:14:28,000 talk about like the Chen's trading and then, you know, 1284 01:14:28,000 --> 01:14:30,400 Insider news, like all sorts of stuff just gets talked about 1285 01:14:30,400 --> 01:14:33,100 there and it's like you know, because there's a few devs in 1286 01:14:33,100 --> 01:14:37,100 there, there's myself included we have professional Traders 1287 01:14:37,900 --> 01:14:42,300 people, you know, like CL. You know, and Jeff Wang. 1288 01:14:43,600 --> 01:14:47,900 And we also have just like D5 power users, like dhn Spartan is 1289 01:14:47,900 --> 01:14:50,200 in there as well. So like it's just a very good 1290 01:14:50,200 --> 01:14:52,700 eclectic mix. We actually have some girls, any 1291 01:14:52,700 --> 01:14:58,200 girl, shout out to Ava Baylin. She's really helped us organize 1292 01:14:58,200 --> 01:15:00,700 and turn it into a reality before her. 1293 01:15:00,700 --> 01:15:02,800 We were just e-girls and now we re Queens. 1294 01:15:03,700 --> 01:15:06,300 So it's a really fun place. It's really cool. 1295 01:15:06,300 --> 01:15:08,900 It's exciting. And it's definitely been 1296 01:15:08,900 --> 01:15:13,400 something that's no helped out pemex because, you know, they've 1297 01:15:13,400 --> 01:15:15,700 been able to connect us with a lot of good people that have 1298 01:15:15,700 --> 01:15:19,600 helped us as well. Yeah, and I think we're coming 1299 01:15:19,600 --> 01:15:23,500 up to near the end of our time so is anything, you know, I 1300 01:15:23,500 --> 01:15:26,300 guess you already talked a little bit about the future of 1301 01:15:27,200 --> 01:15:29,400 Malcolm X, but is there anything else you want? 1302 01:15:29,400 --> 01:15:33,400 You know, the listeners to know about and what's coming up next 1303 01:15:33,400 --> 01:15:38,200 for a alchemax? Yeah, so there's actually a lot 1304 01:15:38,200 --> 01:15:40,900 of stuff coming up right now, our audit just got back. 1305 01:15:41,000 --> 01:15:43,500 We're just sending it back to our auditor real quick to get it 1306 01:15:43,500 --> 01:15:46,500 finalized and everything. Like that, everything came back 1307 01:15:46,600 --> 01:15:49,800 looking good and that's going to give us the green light to get 1308 01:15:49,800 --> 01:15:54,100 onto curved out Phi. Also, getting Insurance options 1309 01:15:54,100 --> 01:15:56,300 for alchemic. So so those are some 1310 01:15:56,400 --> 01:15:59,700 developments are going to coming in sometime over the next week 1311 01:15:59,700 --> 01:16:01,600 or so. And then shortly thereafter, 1312 01:16:01,600 --> 01:16:03,600 we're going to be launching a leathe. 1313 01:16:03,600 --> 01:16:07,100 So, you know, towards the end of May There's going to be a decent 1314 01:16:07,100 --> 01:16:09,500 amount of stuff coming going on without pemex. 1315 01:16:10,100 --> 01:16:12,400 Then we'll probably have a little bit of a quiet period. 1316 01:16:12,400 --> 01:16:16,700 As we are going heads down on getting V2, ready for launch, 1317 01:16:17,500 --> 01:16:20,500 you know, sometime towards the end of July or early, August, is 1318 01:16:20,600 --> 01:16:25,300 what we're aiming for. So, yeah, that's, that's a, the 1319 01:16:25,300 --> 01:16:27,400 next few months of alkynes right there. 1320 01:16:29,400 --> 01:16:32,600 There's any more developments will be sure to tweet them very 1321 01:16:32,600 --> 01:16:36,500 loudly from our Twitter. Yeah, thanks so much Scoopy. 1322 01:16:36,800 --> 01:16:40,200 How can users get started? If they want to interact with 1323 01:16:40,200 --> 01:16:43,400 all chemists? Yeah, so you can go to alchemic 1324 01:16:43,400 --> 01:16:46,500 that fight, that's our homepage, they can there's links to the 1325 01:16:46,500 --> 01:16:50,000 app there and you know, the app is a I think pretty 1326 01:16:50,000 --> 01:16:51,900 straightforward to use. There's tutorial videos linked 1327 01:16:51,900 --> 01:16:55,500 on the website itself and if that's too hard and find us on 1328 01:16:55,500 --> 01:16:59,200 Discord and get involved or ask questions on there and you know, 1329 01:16:59,200 --> 01:17:01,200 be plenty of people there willing to help you out. 1330 01:17:02,100 --> 01:17:03,700 All right, cool. Thanks so much. 1331 01:17:05,400 --> 01:17:07,300 Thank you for joining us on this week's episode. 1332 01:17:07,600 --> 01:17:09,200 We release new episodes every week. 1333 01:17:09,800 --> 01:17:12,500 You can find And subscribe to the show on iTunes Spotify, 1334 01:17:12,600 --> 01:17:15,700 YouTube SoundCloud or wherever you listen to podcast. 1335 01:17:16,000 --> 01:17:18,800 And if you have a Google home or Alexa device, you can tell it to 1336 01:17:18,800 --> 01:17:21,800 listen to the latest episode of the epicenter podcast, go to 1337 01:17:21,800 --> 01:17:24,900 epicenter, .t V /, subscribe for a full list of places where you 1338 01:17:24,900 --> 01:17:27,500 can watch and listen, while you're there, be sure to sign up 1339 01:17:27,500 --> 01:17:29,600 for the newsletter. You get new episodes in your 1340 01:17:29,600 --> 01:17:32,800 inbox as they're released. If you want to interact with us 1341 01:17:33,100 --> 01:17:35,800 guests or other podcast listeners, you can Us on Twitter 1342 01:17:36,200 --> 01:17:38,600 and please leave us a review on iTunes helps people find the 1343 01:17:38,608 --> 01:17:42,300 show and we're always happy to read this but thanks so much and 1344 01:17:42,300 --> 01:17:43,800 we look forward to being back next week.