1 00:00:05,000 --> 00:00:07,080 Hello and welcome to the program UFO Warning. 2 00:00:07,200 --> 00:00:09,880 In this episode, we're looking at What's Up with Skinwalker 3 00:00:09,880 --> 00:00:11,080 Ranch. That's correct. 4 00:00:11,080 --> 00:00:14,680 What's Up with Skinwalker Ranch? Must be one of the most popular 5 00:00:14,680 --> 00:00:18,720 paranormal series on television with The History Channel. 6 00:00:19,240 --> 00:00:21,080 Everybody, I think, is sort of going to walk around you if 7 00:00:21,080 --> 00:00:22,080 you're listening to this program. 8 00:00:22,480 --> 00:00:25,000 There's some questions about it. How did it get started? 9 00:00:25,040 --> 00:00:27,400 What's it all about? I mean, is it real? 10 00:00:27,800 --> 00:00:29,160 Is it just some kind of a money grab? 11 00:00:29,520 --> 00:00:30,880 I have a lot of questions myself. 12 00:00:31,240 --> 00:00:35,360 I post. I reposted a couple of posts 13 00:00:35,360 --> 00:00:38,040 that Stephen Greenstreet had put up. 14 00:00:38,040 --> 00:00:41,800 He's a bit of a skeptic, but I think he does thorough work for 15 00:00:41,800 --> 00:00:43,560 the most part. It's entertaining. 16 00:00:43,560 --> 00:00:45,520 Also, it's very high production value. 17 00:00:45,880 --> 00:00:50,000 I've been falling for a while. I found this interview that he'd 18 00:00:50,000 --> 00:00:54,920 done back a while ago with Brandon Fugel and it's about 10 19 00:00:54,920 --> 00:00:57,360 minutes long. I reposted that to the Twitter 20 00:00:57,360 --> 00:01:03,000 site talking about how Fugel got interested in Skinwalker Ranch 21 00:01:03,320 --> 00:01:04,760 and I'll play some excerpts from that. 22 00:01:04,760 --> 00:01:07,480 It's really a strange trip. I mean, he starts off looking 23 00:01:07,480 --> 00:01:11,160 for an anti gravity machine of all things, which turned out to 24 00:01:11,160 --> 00:01:15,840 be a total just a total disaster from his standpoint. 25 00:01:16,400 --> 00:01:19,560 But it was weird. The people that put him onto 26 00:01:19,560 --> 00:01:22,880 this anti gravity machine were people like General Wesley 27 00:01:22,880 --> 00:01:26,240 Clark, According to him, General Mattis. 28 00:01:26,240 --> 00:01:29,440 I've read Mattis. I mean, also, I think he 29 00:01:29,440 --> 00:01:34,360 invested in Theranos, the fraudulent blood testing 30 00:01:34,360 --> 00:01:36,800 company. And then you had how put off and 31 00:01:36,800 --> 00:01:39,040 kick green in there. It's like this. 32 00:01:39,440 --> 00:01:44,560 It's like this out of central casting from the UFO mafia. 33 00:01:45,080 --> 00:01:48,600 And it's almost to me when I when I watch this interview with 34 00:01:48,600 --> 00:01:51,280 Steven Greenstreet and I'll try to play a couple clips here for 35 00:01:51,280 --> 00:01:52,880 you. It's almost like they see this 36 00:01:52,880 --> 00:01:55,000 young guy, he has a lot of money. 37 00:01:56,520 --> 00:01:58,960 He has an interest in the paranormal, OK. 38 00:01:59,240 --> 00:02:02,600 And it's just as if they view him as some kind of a target 39 00:02:03,200 --> 00:02:06,920 kind of question about my it really, it really leads me to 40 00:02:06,920 --> 00:02:08,440 wonder about Bob Bigelow a little bit too. 41 00:02:08,440 --> 00:02:11,720 It's like he got a hold of this piece of ground and then I think 42 00:02:11,720 --> 00:02:13,760 he sold it at a pretty substantial profit. 43 00:02:14,040 --> 00:02:15,200 But we'll get into that in a minute. 44 00:02:15,400 --> 00:02:18,640 Just to give you some background on this whole thing with 45 00:02:18,640 --> 00:02:22,320 Skinwalker Ranch, I just went to Wikipedia, probably as good as 46 00:02:22,320 --> 00:02:24,800 any on this stuff. It says Skinwalker Ranch, 47 00:02:24,800 --> 00:02:27,840 previously known as Sherman Ranch, is a property 48 00:02:27,840 --> 00:02:34,280 approximately 512 acres located southeast of Ballard, Utah, that 49 00:02:34,280 --> 00:02:38,160 is reputed to be the site of paranormal and UFO related 50 00:02:38,160 --> 00:02:40,400 activities. Its name is taken from the 51 00:02:40,400 --> 00:02:44,720 Skinwalker Ranch, the Skinwalker of Navajo legend concerning 52 00:02:44,720 --> 00:02:47,600 vengeful shamans. I think that's a little bit of 53 00:02:47,600 --> 00:02:50,440 an incomplete description. I've done podcasts before on 54 00:02:50,440 --> 00:02:54,840 Skinwalkers and I think pretty well described how those things 55 00:02:54,840 --> 00:02:57,680 work as far as Native Legends concerned. 56 00:02:58,680 --> 00:03:01,040 To me, they're a whole different, a whole different 57 00:03:01,040 --> 00:03:04,080 entity compared to what they would say as a shaman, which is 58 00:03:04,080 --> 00:03:07,880 kind of a good guy, practices medicine, maybe spiritual 59 00:03:07,880 --> 00:03:10,200 healing, that sort of thing. These things seem to me just to 60 00:03:10,200 --> 00:03:15,760 be like just people that are angry and, and maybe have really 61 00:03:15,760 --> 00:03:19,720 serious mental health issues and a lot of a lot of hatred. 62 00:03:19,960 --> 00:03:22,240 And they get involved in this kind of a black magic thing 63 00:03:22,240 --> 00:03:25,560 where they have to go through a lot of really dark rituals and 64 00:03:25,560 --> 00:03:31,240 maybe even kill somebody to get accepted into this role as 65 00:03:31,240 --> 00:03:34,720 skinwalker. And it's almost like, I don't 66 00:03:34,720 --> 00:03:36,480 know, I wouldn't really compare him to Sheamus. 67 00:03:36,480 --> 00:03:40,400 I mean, maybe, maybe I'm wrong about that, but just seems to 68 00:03:40,400 --> 00:03:43,120 me, it seems like these skinwalkers are such evil 69 00:03:43,120 --> 00:03:48,280 entities and we're the Navajo from everything I can see that 70 00:03:48,280 --> 00:03:50,440 Shaman's always the good guy in their culture. 71 00:03:50,440 --> 00:03:53,840 He's supposed to be there, I guess to offer counseling and 72 00:03:54,120 --> 00:03:57,160 like I said, healing and that not seeing any skinwalkers. 73 00:03:57,160 --> 00:04:00,440 But that's another show. Anyway, it goes on and says UFO 74 00:04:00,440 --> 00:04:04,360 reports in the Unified Basin were publicized in the 1970s. 75 00:04:05,160 --> 00:04:09,240 Claims about the ranch first appeared in 1996 and Salt Lake 76 00:04:09,240 --> 00:04:12,240 City, UT Deseret News. Now, that's interesting. 77 00:04:12,520 --> 00:04:16,760 So this ranch has a long history, but we don't have any 78 00:04:16,760 --> 00:04:20,279 published claims about paranormal stuff until 1996. 79 00:04:20,519 --> 00:04:22,760 You know, after he had been bought and then resold. 80 00:04:22,760 --> 00:04:24,480 And Bob Bigelow, I suppose, or about that time. 81 00:04:24,800 --> 00:04:27,960 And later in the alternative weekly Las Vegas Mercury as a 82 00:04:27,960 --> 00:04:30,320 series of articles by investigative journalist George 83 00:04:30,320 --> 00:04:32,480 Knapp. George Knapp. 84 00:04:32,480 --> 00:04:35,920 I mean, he's an OG. These early stories detailed the 85 00:04:35,920 --> 00:04:38,720 claims of a family that allegedly experienced 86 00:04:38,760 --> 00:04:42,160 inexplicable and frightening events after they purchased and 87 00:04:42,160 --> 00:04:46,040 occupied the property. The ranch, located in West Unita 88 00:04:46,040 --> 00:04:51,200 County bordering the Unita Uri Indian Reservation, was 89 00:04:51,200 --> 00:04:55,320 popularly dubbed the UFO Ranch due to its essential 50 year 90 00:04:55,320 --> 00:04:58,240 history of odd events said to have taken place there. 91 00:04:58,640 --> 00:05:02,000 According to Kellner and Knapp, they saw or investigated 92 00:05:02,000 --> 00:05:06,200 evidence of close to 100 incidents that include vanishing 93 00:05:06,200 --> 00:05:10,000 and mutilated cattle, sightings of unidentified flying objects 94 00:05:10,000 --> 00:05:13,800 or orbs, large animals with piercing red eyes that they were 95 00:05:14,320 --> 00:05:17,400 that they say were unscathed when struck with bullets, and 96 00:05:17,400 --> 00:05:20,480 invisible objects emitting destructive magnetic waves. 97 00:05:20,960 --> 00:05:24,000 Among those involved were retired U.S. 98 00:05:24,040 --> 00:05:29,800 Army Colonel John B Alexander, who characterized the mid side 99 00:05:29,800 --> 00:05:34,640 effort as an attempt to get hard data using a standard scientific 100 00:05:34,640 --> 00:05:36,960 approach. However, the investigators 101 00:05:36,960 --> 00:05:40,200 admitted to difficulty obtaining evidence consistent with 102 00:05:40,400 --> 00:05:43,480 scientific publication. You have to wonder how much 103 00:05:43,480 --> 00:05:45,520 money these guys got from the federal government. 104 00:05:45,520 --> 00:05:46,560 You know, there was some at least. 105 00:05:47,000 --> 00:05:49,880 Cattle mutilations have been part of the folklore of the 106 00:05:49,880 --> 00:05:54,080 surrounding area for decades. When Robert Bigelow, remember, 107 00:05:54,080 --> 00:05:57,120 we talked about him the other day, made his money starting out 108 00:05:57,120 --> 00:06:00,680 in real estate and hotels and that he's like in his 80s now. 109 00:06:00,680 --> 00:06:03,720 His wife passed away recently. Looks like he's had some tragedy 110 00:06:03,720 --> 00:06:06,040 in his family. I believe we reported that he 111 00:06:06,040 --> 00:06:09,200 had a son that committed suicide and a grandson who either 112 00:06:09,200 --> 00:06:10,960 committed suicide or died of a drug overdose. 113 00:06:11,480 --> 00:06:14,320 So he's, he's had, he's had a lot of trauma, but he's got this 114 00:06:14,320 --> 00:06:17,520 interest in the paranormal and he has a lot of money and he 115 00:06:17,520 --> 00:06:21,720 also has an interest in outer space, talking about setting up 116 00:06:21,720 --> 00:06:24,760 the kind of a space station up there. 117 00:06:25,960 --> 00:06:29,680 He had he, he had big, had that big low what aerospace, whatever 118 00:06:29,680 --> 00:06:32,600 for a long time. So he's been a mover and shaker 119 00:06:32,840 --> 00:06:38,640 kind of between the government as a as a government contractor, 120 00:06:39,280 --> 00:06:42,560 as friends of Harry Reid and also somebody who can fund this 121 00:06:42,560 --> 00:06:44,240 stuff and his research paranormal. 122 00:06:44,240 --> 00:06:46,520 So he's kind of in this whole area. 123 00:06:47,280 --> 00:06:50,840 It says when Robert When Robert Bigelow, founder of the National 124 00:06:50,840 --> 00:06:54,840 Institute for Discovery Science, purchased and ranch for $200,000 125 00:06:54,840 --> 00:06:59,760 in 1996, this was reportedly the result of his having been 126 00:06:59,760 --> 00:07:03,400 convinced by the stories of mutilations that included tales 127 00:07:03,400 --> 00:07:06,400 of strange lights and unusual impressions made in grass and 128 00:07:06,400 --> 00:07:11,480 soil told by the family of former ranch owner Terry Sherman 129 00:07:13,120 --> 00:07:17,320 in 2005. Colin Kellner and co-author 130 00:07:17,320 --> 00:07:20,400 George Knapp published a book, Hunt for the Skinwalker, in 131 00:07:20,400 --> 00:07:23,520 which they described the ranch being acquired by Bigelow to 132 00:07:23,520 --> 00:07:27,000 study anecdotal sightings of UFOs, Bigfoot like creatures, 133 00:07:27,160 --> 00:07:30,680 crop circles, glowing worms, and poltergeist actively reported by 134 00:07:30,680 --> 00:07:33,760 its former owners. Kellner and Knapp's book was 135 00:07:33,760 --> 00:07:38,160 read by Defense Intelligence Agency official James Lakatsky, 136 00:07:38,520 --> 00:07:41,480 who contacted Bigelow and obtained permission to visit the 137 00:07:41,480 --> 00:07:43,800 ranch. Lakatsi had a supernatural 138 00:07:43,800 --> 00:07:47,760 experience there, which Bigelow relate to his friend Harry Reid. 139 00:07:48,120 --> 00:07:52,200 Reid and Ted Stevens, a UFO experiencer, quickly agreed that 140 00:07:52,200 --> 00:07:56,240 the ranch deserved attention and inserted a line into the 141 00:07:56,240 --> 00:08:00,880 Department of Defense budget, appropriating $22 million to 142 00:08:00,880 --> 00:08:03,160 study unidentified real phenomena. 143 00:08:04,440 --> 00:08:07,360 And of course, you end up with Louis Elizondo in charge of a 144 00:08:07,360 --> 00:08:10,200 tip. Wow, is that the way we really 145 00:08:10,200 --> 00:08:13,280 want to fund this stuff? A couple of big shots go out to 146 00:08:13,280 --> 00:08:16,600 a ranch, think that they have an experience, and then somebody 147 00:08:16,600 --> 00:08:18,960 just says, OK, well, here's $22 million. 148 00:08:19,320 --> 00:08:21,720 I mean, honestly, does that sound like good government to 149 00:08:21,720 --> 00:08:23,920 you? It doesn't to me, it says under 150 00:08:23,920 --> 00:08:26,640 criticism. Skeptical author Robert Schaefer 151 00:08:26,640 --> 00:08:29,560 believes the phenomena at Skinwalker Ranch to be almost 152 00:08:29,560 --> 00:08:34,240 certainly illusory, given that NIDCEI found no proof after 153 00:08:34,280 --> 00:08:37,440 several years of monitoring, and that the previous owners of the 154 00:08:37,440 --> 00:08:40,280 property, who had lived there for 60 years, said that no 155 00:08:40,280 --> 00:08:42,840 supernatural events of any kind happened to them. 156 00:08:43,159 --> 00:08:46,080 Schaefer considers the parsimonious explanation to be 157 00:08:46,080 --> 00:08:50,520 that Sherman family invented the story to story prior to selling 158 00:08:50,520 --> 00:08:54,720 it to the gullible Bigelow, with many of the more extraordinary 159 00:08:54,720 --> 00:08:58,920 claims originating solely from Terry Sherman, who worked as a 160 00:08:58,920 --> 00:09:02,360 caretaker after the ranch was sold to Bigelow. 161 00:09:02,880 --> 00:09:04,880 Interesting. I do know that that clip, that 162 00:09:04,880 --> 00:09:09,320 interview that Green Street did with Brandon Fugel, he said that 163 00:09:09,680 --> 00:09:12,760 Bigelow wouldn't give him any of the data they had collected. 164 00:09:14,440 --> 00:09:15,600 I don't know. Maybe he thinks it's 165 00:09:15,600 --> 00:09:17,520 proprietary. But then again, if the 166 00:09:17,520 --> 00:09:20,160 government spent $22 million, of which quite a bit of that or 167 00:09:20,160 --> 00:09:22,920 some of that had been spent investigating my ranch and the 168 00:09:22,920 --> 00:09:26,400 data wasn't up to snuff, I might not want to expose it either. 169 00:09:26,720 --> 00:09:31,200 Then it goes on here, it says in 2023, Ufologist Barry Greenwood, 170 00:09:31,760 --> 00:09:34,400 writing in the Journal of Scientific Exploration, 171 00:09:34,680 --> 00:09:38,120 criticized the $22 million research program led by Jame 172 00:09:38,120 --> 00:09:40,480 Lakatsky. He emphasized the lack of any 173 00:09:40,480 --> 00:09:43,600 documentary evidence of the ranch after many decades of 174 00:09:43,600 --> 00:09:47,200 exploration and characterized Skinwalker as always in the 175 00:09:47,200 --> 00:09:49,800 business of selling belief and hope. 176 00:09:50,160 --> 00:09:52,920 Yeah, that's a little weird. It says here under ownership 177 00:09:53,120 --> 00:09:58,600 1934 to 1994 was owned by Kenneth and Edith Myers, 1994 to 178 00:09:58,600 --> 00:10:03,240 1996 Terry and Gwen Sherman. So they only owned it for a 179 00:10:03,240 --> 00:10:08,360 couple years and then from 96 to 2016 Robert Bigelow owned it and 180 00:10:08,360 --> 00:10:14,480 then in 2016 he sold it to Brandon Fugel via Adamatanium 181 00:10:14,480 --> 00:10:18,680 Real Estate. It says 2016 Bigelow sold 182 00:10:18,680 --> 00:10:22,600 Skinwalker Ranch to Adamatanium Real Estate for around 500,000. 183 00:10:22,760 --> 00:10:25,680 I think I've read as much as a million or million to but we'll 184 00:10:25,680 --> 00:10:30,520 stick with 500,000 he since he paid 200,000 for it I guess not 185 00:10:30,520 --> 00:10:34,720 bad for a 10 year return on investment after his purchases. 186 00:10:35,080 --> 00:10:38,480 Roads leading to the ranch were blocked, the perimeter was 187 00:10:38,520 --> 00:10:42,520 guarded by cameras and barbed wire, and signs were posted that 188 00:10:42,520 --> 00:10:44,960 aim to prevent people from approaching the ranch. 189 00:10:45,320 --> 00:10:48,520 Animatian Real Estate, a Delaware limited liability 190 00:10:48,520 --> 00:10:52,360 company based in Salt Lake City, UT filed AUS trademark 191 00:10:52,360 --> 00:10:57,760 application to the service mark Skinwalker Ranch on February 192 00:10:57,760 --> 00:11:00,880 15th, 2017. Well, I guess that's smart. 193 00:11:00,880 --> 00:11:03,440 At least you got things trademarked or whatever or? 194 00:11:03,800 --> 00:11:05,800 Yeah. And was approved and registered 195 00:11:05,800 --> 00:11:10,560 on April 14th, 2020 with the mark applicable to providing 196 00:11:10,600 --> 00:11:13,920 recreation facilities, entertainment services, namely 197 00:11:14,160 --> 00:11:16,320 creation, development, production, distribution and 198 00:11:16,320 --> 00:11:20,800 multimedia content, Internet content, motion pictures in 199 00:11:20,800 --> 00:11:23,240 television shows. An additional trademark filing 200 00:11:23,240 --> 00:11:26,080 to expand use on cups and mugs, T-shirts and short sleeve 201 00:11:26,080 --> 00:11:29,560 shirts, sports caps and hats was followed by Adam attaining real 202 00:11:29,560 --> 00:11:33,840 estate on January 21st, 2021 and was approved and registered on 203 00:11:33,840 --> 00:11:36,720 July 12, 2022. So I mean, I mean, it's an 204 00:11:36,720 --> 00:11:38,520 entertainment thing. I don't blame the guy for doing 205 00:11:38,520 --> 00:11:41,760 that. In March 2020, Brandon Fugel, a 206 00:11:41,760 --> 00:11:45,440 real estate developer and tech investor, announced ownership of 207 00:11:45,440 --> 00:11:48,400 the ranch. In 2022, Fugel announced a 208 00:11:48,400 --> 00:11:51,960 partnership with Hutchings Museum Institute in Lehi, UT, 209 00:11:52,360 --> 00:11:55,560 designed to better understand the environment and historical 210 00:11:55,560 --> 00:11:58,560 significance of the ranch. Well, I mean, he's paid a lot of 211 00:11:58,560 --> 00:12:01,360 money for this thing. It's he's, he is a real estate 212 00:12:01,360 --> 00:12:03,600 guy. You can't blame him for wanting 213 00:12:03,600 --> 00:12:05,800 to maximize the value of this thing. 214 00:12:05,800 --> 00:12:07,440 I'd say he's done a really good job of that. 215 00:12:08,360 --> 00:12:10,120 Wow. So anyway, I've been doing 216 00:12:10,120 --> 00:12:11,840 looking around here for some of the owners. 217 00:12:12,200 --> 00:12:16,760 This here comes to us from the UFO from the UFO database.com. 218 00:12:17,320 --> 00:12:24,320 It says rancher Terry Sherman owned Skinwalker Ranch from 1994 219 00:12:24,320 --> 00:12:27,200 to 1996. Terry Sherman purchased 220 00:12:27,200 --> 00:12:30,800 Skinwalker Ranch with his wife Gwen in 1994. 221 00:12:31,200 --> 00:12:34,400 They purchased a property from Kenneth and Edith Myers who 222 00:12:34,400 --> 00:12:36,360 owned their property for over 60 years. 223 00:12:36,720 --> 00:12:40,640 Terry and Gwen had long dreamed of owning a ranch in a remote 224 00:12:40,640 --> 00:12:43,120 area where they could be left alone to raise their price 225 00:12:43,120 --> 00:12:46,520 cattle and focus on their private life private family 226 00:12:46,520 --> 00:12:49,040 life. The Shermans claimed they 227 00:12:49,040 --> 00:12:52,000 experienced a rash of unexplainable incidents on the 228 00:12:52,000 --> 00:12:56,920 ranch from 1994 to 1996, including cattle mutilations, 229 00:12:57,200 --> 00:13:00,600 the odd disappearance of at least three dogs, orange and 230 00:13:00,600 --> 00:13:04,200 blue orbs, UFO sightings, encounters with odd creatures, 231 00:13:04,480 --> 00:13:06,480 interdimensional portals, and more. 232 00:13:06,800 --> 00:13:09,680 Due to these frightening anomalous experiences and the 233 00:13:09,680 --> 00:13:13,680 financial hardships from the loss of cattle, the Sherman's 234 00:13:13,680 --> 00:13:16,560 sold the ranch to Robert Bigelow Real Estate Group. 235 00:13:16,720 --> 00:13:20,080 In 1996. Terry and Gwen purchased another 236 00:13:20,080 --> 00:13:22,720 ranch within 50 miles of Skinwalker Ranch, but Terry 237 00:13:22,720 --> 00:13:26,280 agreed to assist Bigelow's National Institute for Discovery 238 00:13:26,880 --> 00:13:29,960 NIDS Scientific Study Group to investigate the odd phenomenon 239 00:13:29,960 --> 00:13:32,080 on the property. Terry helped manage the property 240 00:13:32,080 --> 00:13:35,960 and called the NIDS team when odd activity was witnessed. 241 00:13:36,880 --> 00:13:38,400 That's a little interesting, I guess. 242 00:13:38,400 --> 00:13:41,800 And then it has a thing here on Bob Bigelow also just kind of 243 00:13:41,800 --> 00:13:45,120 give you the history of this ranch. 244 00:13:46,360 --> 00:13:50,400 It seems like we keep seeing the same players over and over and 245 00:13:50,400 --> 00:13:53,440 over again. And it's just like with 246 00:13:53,440 --> 00:13:56,320 anything, the chain of custody kind of becomes blurred a little 247 00:13:56,320 --> 00:13:58,680 bit to wondering what's real and what's not real. 248 00:13:58,800 --> 00:14:01,360 So let's take a look at another article on the Skinwalker Ranch 249 00:14:01,600 --> 00:14:04,800 and then get into this interview that Steven Greenstreet did with 250 00:14:04,800 --> 00:14:08,200 Brandon Fugel. So just to kind of fill in the 251 00:14:08,200 --> 00:14:11,160 empty spaces here, I want to look at this article from 252 00:14:11,200 --> 00:14:13,920 npr.org. NPR is not my favorite source, 253 00:14:13,920 --> 00:14:17,320 but sometimes they do some good reporting and stuff like this. 254 00:14:17,320 --> 00:14:20,160 A lot of times they're good about getting some dates and 255 00:14:20,160 --> 00:14:24,840 places and names in so we can kind of have a scaffolding to 256 00:14:24,840 --> 00:14:27,920 build our ideas on. Skid and Walker Ranch is more 257 00:14:27,920 --> 00:14:30,160 than just what you happen to see on The History Channel, OK? 258 00:14:30,440 --> 00:14:33,160 There's a lot more going on behind the scenes here and I 259 00:14:33,160 --> 00:14:35,760 think we have to consider the profit motive. 260 00:14:36,000 --> 00:14:39,000 And, and so if Brandon Fiegel wants to make money off 261 00:14:39,000 --> 00:14:42,600 Skinwalker Ranch, that's fine. He's he's not making a secret 262 00:14:42,600 --> 00:14:44,400 about that. I think he's a legitimate 263 00:14:44,400 --> 00:14:47,760 businessman and he has an interest in the paranormal and 264 00:14:47,760 --> 00:14:51,200 UFOs, clearly. And if he wants to, if he wants 265 00:14:51,200 --> 00:14:55,400 to go ahead and market that and make money off it, more power to 266 00:14:55,400 --> 00:14:58,120 him. But the people that I'm critical 267 00:14:58,120 --> 00:15:01,480 of are people like that claim to be whistleblowers like Louis ET 268 00:15:01,480 --> 00:15:05,640 all, who claim that they're just in this because they care about 269 00:15:05,640 --> 00:15:09,280 the American people. Well, they could care about the 270 00:15:09,280 --> 00:15:11,720 American people, but they should also be honest about the fact 271 00:15:12,160 --> 00:15:15,640 that there's that there is money involved and that they're making 272 00:15:15,640 --> 00:15:17,920 money. And I don't regret them that. 273 00:15:18,120 --> 00:15:20,920 But they should just be honest about it and say, look, I am 274 00:15:20,920 --> 00:15:23,360 doing this work with these guys. I've worked with me before. 275 00:15:23,360 --> 00:15:24,840 This is what our relationship is. 276 00:15:25,280 --> 00:15:29,160 And if they were clear and above board about things like that, I 277 00:15:29,160 --> 00:15:30,360 would be a lot less critical of them. 278 00:15:30,600 --> 00:15:33,200 But when you have things like the Tic Tac video show up 279 00:15:33,400 --> 00:15:37,360 unannounced and we have, you know, the usual suspects lurking 280 00:15:37,360 --> 00:15:40,240 around in the Pentagon parking lot, but nobody knows for sure 281 00:15:40,240 --> 00:15:42,840 where this thing came from and a lot of money's made off of it, 282 00:15:43,200 --> 00:15:45,480 Then it leads me to say, hey, I wonder what's going on here. 283 00:15:45,960 --> 00:15:49,560 Just like Bob Bigelow, he's he's a successful businessman. 284 00:15:49,720 --> 00:15:51,800 Like I said, he's had a lot of tragedy in his life. 285 00:15:51,800 --> 00:15:54,560 I could see that. I can empathize with that. 286 00:15:55,960 --> 00:15:57,720 He's probably a really great guy. 287 00:15:57,960 --> 00:16:01,840 But I think we also have to consider the whole picture, and 288 00:16:01,840 --> 00:16:03,200 we're talking about Skin Walker Ranch. 289 00:16:03,200 --> 00:16:05,760 We have to consider the fact that Bob Bigelow did own this at 290 00:16:05,760 --> 00:16:08,000 one time, that he was an associate or a friend or 291 00:16:08,000 --> 00:16:11,280 whatever with Harry Reid, that he does have a financial 292 00:16:11,280 --> 00:16:15,280 interest in this thing, and that there was government, government 293 00:16:15,280 --> 00:16:19,040 money spent investigating this property that he did make at 294 00:16:19,040 --> 00:16:23,120 least $300,000 when he sold it. I just think it's unfair to 295 00:16:23,120 --> 00:16:26,320 assume that all of these celebrities are just out there 296 00:16:26,960 --> 00:16:29,080 trying to bring us disclosure out of the kindness of their 297 00:16:29,080 --> 00:16:31,360 heart. I really think that we need to 298 00:16:31,360 --> 00:16:35,000 look at all the connections and do the critical thinking and not 299 00:16:35,000 --> 00:16:36,840 just act like a bunch of little kids about this stuff. 300 00:16:37,200 --> 00:16:39,240 Now, this article, like I said, is from npr.org. 301 00:16:39,240 --> 00:16:42,960 It says secret Pentagon program spent millions to research UFOs. 302 00:16:43,280 --> 00:16:47,480 This is dated September or December 17th, 2017 by James 303 00:16:47,480 --> 00:16:49,320 Dubeck. Got a nice big picture of the 304 00:16:49,320 --> 00:16:51,480 Pentagon there. A secret Pentagon program 305 00:16:51,480 --> 00:16:56,560 existed for at least three years and spent more than $20 million 306 00:16:56,760 --> 00:17:00,960 in research on UFOs, according to multiple media reports 307 00:17:00,960 --> 00:17:04,319 published Saturday. The program reportedly examined 308 00:17:04,319 --> 00:17:08,520 cases including incidents of pilots claiming to have seen 309 00:17:08,800 --> 00:17:12,400 flying objects that appeared to defy the laws of physics. 310 00:17:13,200 --> 00:17:15,520 And then it says video posted on YouTube as well as on the 311 00:17:15,520 --> 00:17:18,640 website of the New York Times purports to be footage taken by 312 00:17:18,839 --> 00:17:23,079 the Navy FA 18 fighter jets showing a disk like object in 313 00:17:23,079 --> 00:17:24,560 the sky. Look at that thing. 314 00:17:24,560 --> 00:17:26,079 It's rotating voices saying the video. 315 00:17:26,359 --> 00:17:29,040 This is a video we're talking about the Tic Tac called the 316 00:17:29,040 --> 00:17:31,720 Advanced Aviation Threat Identification program. 317 00:17:31,720 --> 00:17:33,320 That's ATIP. That's Louisville. 318 00:17:33,680 --> 00:17:36,520 It was run out of the Pentagon by former Department of Defense 319 00:17:36,520 --> 00:17:38,800 intelligence officer Louis Elizondo. 320 00:17:39,040 --> 00:17:41,080 Now that's what NPR is telling you. 321 00:17:41,080 --> 00:17:43,840 We've had all different kinds of stories coming up in the DoD. 322 00:17:44,240 --> 00:17:49,200 It began in some form in 2007, according to The Washington Post 323 00:17:49,240 --> 00:17:53,280 and The New York Times, and officially ended in 2012, though 324 00:17:53,280 --> 00:17:55,960 it may still be in existence in some capacity. 325 00:17:56,040 --> 00:17:58,440 The time says, yeah, these things just keep morphing. 326 00:17:58,640 --> 00:18:02,800 But it does seem from everything I've read that this saying had a 327 00:18:02,920 --> 00:18:06,920 expiration date on it. They assigned $22 million to it, 328 00:18:06,920 --> 00:18:09,240 and it was for five years. That's as I understand it. 329 00:18:09,440 --> 00:18:13,920 Former Democratic Senator Harry Reid obtained funding for the 330 00:18:13,920 --> 00:18:18,520 program beginning in 2009. Was support from late Democratic 331 00:18:18,520 --> 00:18:22,680 Senator Daniel anyway and late Republican Senator Ted Stevens? 332 00:18:22,880 --> 00:18:27,520 Political reports. Not sure how it started in 2007, 333 00:18:27,520 --> 00:18:30,640 didn't get funded to 2009, but yeah, whatever. 334 00:18:30,960 --> 00:18:33,600 According to the Washington Post, the program spent at least 335 00:18:33,600 --> 00:18:37,520 $22 million for the purpose of collecting and analyzing a wide 336 00:18:37,520 --> 00:18:41,880 range of anonymous aerospace threats, ranging from advanced 337 00:18:41,880 --> 00:18:45,960 aircraft fielded by traditional US adversaries to commercial 338 00:18:45,960 --> 00:18:48,640 drones to possible alien encounters. 339 00:18:48,960 --> 00:18:51,560 They put a big, big, wide definition on that thing. 340 00:18:52,200 --> 00:18:54,600 I'm not sure how the Skidden Walker Ranch would really come 341 00:18:54,600 --> 00:18:55,760 into that. But yeah, whatever. 342 00:18:56,120 --> 00:18:59,240 I'm not embarrassed or ashamed or sorry I got this thing going, 343 00:18:59,240 --> 00:19:01,720 Reed told the Times. I think it's one of the good 344 00:19:01,720 --> 00:19:03,360 things I did in my congressional service. 345 00:19:03,680 --> 00:19:06,960 I've done something that no one else has ever done before. 346 00:19:07,280 --> 00:19:10,040 Yeah, that's a fact. He remained proud of his efforts 347 00:19:10,040 --> 00:19:12,720 in a statement posted on Twitter on Saturday. 348 00:19:12,720 --> 00:19:14,080 This is back to the 17th, of course. 349 00:19:14,080 --> 00:19:18,400 He's passed away now. It says if anyone says they have 350 00:19:18,400 --> 00:19:20,320 answers, they're fooling themselves. 351 00:19:20,520 --> 00:19:23,600 We don't know the answers, but we have plenty of evidence to 352 00:19:23,600 --> 00:19:26,000 support asking questions. This is about science and 353 00:19:26,000 --> 00:19:28,520 national security. If America doesn't take the lead 354 00:19:28,520 --> 00:19:30,120 in answering these questions, others will. 355 00:19:30,120 --> 00:19:33,840 Senator Harry Reid, December 16th, 2017. 356 00:19:34,200 --> 00:19:39,120 Reid was persuaded in part by aerospace Titan and hotel chain 357 00:19:39,120 --> 00:19:44,040 founder Bob Bigelow, a friend and fellow Nevadan who owns 358 00:19:44,040 --> 00:19:46,280 Bigelow Aerospace. Of course, we know that's no 359 00:19:46,280 --> 00:19:49,480 longer in existence. A space technology company and 360 00:19:49,480 --> 00:19:51,640 government contractor, Political said. 361 00:19:52,040 --> 00:19:54,040 Do you see the problem with these government contractors? 362 00:19:54,360 --> 00:20:00,920 I mean, if the deep state wanted to hide A spaceship or just a 363 00:20:00,920 --> 00:20:05,040 piece of meta material, they could certainly do that at one 364 00:20:05,040 --> 00:20:08,480 of these government contractor sites and you wouldn't have any 365 00:20:08,480 --> 00:20:12,040 FOIA access to it. The site's report continued. 366 00:20:12,320 --> 00:20:16,160 Bigelow, whose company received some of the research contracts, 367 00:20:16,160 --> 00:20:19,800 was also a regular contributor to Reed's reelection campaign. 368 00:20:20,320 --> 00:20:25,480 Campaign finance records show at least $10,000 between 1998 and 369 00:20:25,480 --> 00:20:28,280 2008. Yeah, 10,000 and 22 million out, 370 00:20:28,280 --> 00:20:31,280 maybe, I don't know. Bigelow has spoken openly in 371 00:20:31,280 --> 00:20:34,680 recent years about his views that extraterrestrial visitors 372 00:20:34,680 --> 00:20:38,400 frequently travel to Earth. He also purchased the Skinwalker 373 00:20:38,400 --> 00:20:42,400 Ranch in Utah, the subject of intense interest among believers 374 00:20:42,400 --> 00:20:45,480 in UFOs. Reed and Bigelow did not respond 375 00:20:45,480 --> 00:20:47,360 to multiple requests for comment. 376 00:20:48,080 --> 00:20:50,320 It just all goes back to this notion of accountability. 377 00:20:50,840 --> 00:20:53,080 It wasn't only concern for threats posed by 378 00:20:53,080 --> 00:20:55,160 extraterrestrials. Former officials told the media 379 00:20:55,160 --> 00:20:59,560 outlets they worried about advanced aircraft programs that 380 00:20:59,560 --> 00:21:01,200 could have been developed by China or Russia. 381 00:21:01,440 --> 00:21:03,600 You've always got to throw the Chinese and Russians in there. 382 00:21:03,920 --> 00:21:07,160 Elizondo, who ran the program, resigned in October and said the 383 00:21:07,160 --> 00:21:09,320 military did not take it seriously enough. 384 00:21:10,600 --> 00:21:15,320 Louis Elizondo, the guy that wanted to have a big naval 385 00:21:15,320 --> 00:21:19,720 exercise involving, I don't know, dozens of nuclear powered 386 00:21:19,720 --> 00:21:23,200 ships and attempt to capture a UFO. 387 00:21:23,800 --> 00:21:26,840 What could go wrong there? Despite overwhelming evidence at 388 00:21:26,840 --> 00:21:30,160 both the classified and unclassified levels, certain 389 00:21:30,160 --> 00:21:33,360 individuals in the DVD remain staunchly opposed to further 390 00:21:33,360 --> 00:21:37,560 research on and what could be a tactical threat to our pilots, 391 00:21:37,760 --> 00:21:40,640 sailors and soldiers, and perhaps even an existential 392 00:21:40,640 --> 00:21:44,040 threat to our national security, Elizondo wrote in resignation 393 00:21:44,040 --> 00:21:47,480 letter to Defense Secretary Jim Mattis, the Post reported. 394 00:21:47,480 --> 00:21:49,760 Of course, I'm sure he's talking about the colons elite, the 395 00:21:49,760 --> 00:21:53,520 fanatical Christians. And he wrote it to Jim Mattis, 396 00:21:53,760 --> 00:21:58,000 the guy that in the guy that reportedly encouraged Brandon 397 00:21:58,000 --> 00:22:01,560 Fugel to invest in this anti gravity machine, which turned 398 00:22:01,560 --> 00:22:05,200 out to be a complete fraud, allegedly. 399 00:22:05,760 --> 00:22:07,800 Interesting. An anonymous former 400 00:22:07,800 --> 00:22:11,200 congressional staffer told political that Senator Reid 401 00:22:11,200 --> 00:22:14,000 eventually agreed the ATEP program was not worth 402 00:22:14,000 --> 00:22:17,360 continuing. Yeah, maybe he didn't want too 403 00:22:17,360 --> 00:22:20,120 many eyes shining on it. You know, after a while, the 404 00:22:20,120 --> 00:22:23,680 consensus was we really couldn't afford anything of substance, he 405 00:22:23,680 --> 00:22:26,520 recalled. They produced reams of paperwork 406 00:22:26,600 --> 00:22:30,440 after all of that. There was really nothing there 407 00:22:30,440 --> 00:22:33,640 that we could find. It all pretty much dissolved 408 00:22:33,640 --> 00:22:38,600 from that reason alone and the interest level was losing steam. 409 00:22:38,920 --> 00:22:42,840 Elizondo is now listed as the director of Global Security and 410 00:22:42,840 --> 00:22:47,240 spatial Programs for Two of the Stars Academy of Arts and 411 00:22:47,240 --> 00:22:51,680 Science, a company Co founded by former Blink 182 guitarist Tom 412 00:22:51,680 --> 00:22:53,520 Delong. And I believe that Hal Puthoff 413 00:22:53,520 --> 00:22:56,440 is involved in that too. Another one of these guys that 414 00:22:56,440 --> 00:22:59,440 was telling Brandon Fugel about the anti gravity machine. 415 00:23:00,240 --> 00:23:02,400 Wow. A company Co founded by former 416 00:23:02,400 --> 00:23:06,280 Blink 182 guitarist Tom Delong. Over the years my mind 417 00:23:06,280 --> 00:23:09,120 constantly swirled with thoughts of unexplained, of the 418 00:23:09,160 --> 00:23:12,560 unexplainable and the hope that unblocking these mysteries would 419 00:23:12,560 --> 00:23:15,240 possibly be the key to a better future for my kids to long road. 420 00:23:15,480 --> 00:23:18,200 In a statement on the company's website blah blah blah to the 421 00:23:18,200 --> 00:23:21,360 stars Academy posted the Navy video on YouTube Saturday. 422 00:23:21,360 --> 00:23:23,720 Yeah, where did they get that video from? 423 00:23:24,120 --> 00:23:27,520 Could it have been from Elizondo, a former employee? 424 00:23:27,520 --> 00:23:30,280 I don't know. The Post wrote that Elizondo 425 00:23:30,640 --> 00:23:33,280 sought the release of videos from the military when he 426 00:23:33,280 --> 00:23:35,400 decided to resign from the Defense Department. 427 00:23:35,680 --> 00:23:37,480 So he asked for the release of videos. 428 00:23:37,480 --> 00:23:40,320 And what did that involve? That involved Christopher Mellon 429 00:23:40,320 --> 00:23:44,120 handing him a brown paper bag with the videos inside. 430 00:23:44,400 --> 00:23:45,960 That's what's been alleged. I don't know. 431 00:23:45,960 --> 00:23:49,080 I'm curious. In an earlier effort, the Air 432 00:23:49,080 --> 00:23:53,520 Force earlier studied UFO studies between 1947 and 1969, 433 00:23:53,520 --> 00:23:56,360 mainly as part of Project Blue Book program. 434 00:23:56,760 --> 00:24:00,520 Yeah, once again, NPR, just like all the rest, doesn't do a thing 435 00:24:00,520 --> 00:24:05,560 as far as investigating the chain of custody with these Tic 436 00:24:05,560 --> 00:24:08,360 Tac UFO videos. All right, so you kind of have 437 00:24:08,360 --> 00:24:10,240 the players there. I just want to play a couple 438 00:24:10,240 --> 00:24:13,520 quick clips from this Green Street interview and then we'll 439 00:24:13,520 --> 00:24:16,400 wrap this up. In the most fundamental ways 440 00:24:16,400 --> 00:24:20,200 that we propel and even power our world, we're still dealing 441 00:24:20,200 --> 00:24:23,760 with technology that is very old and antiquated. 442 00:24:24,360 --> 00:24:26,640 It bothered me and I became obsessed. 443 00:24:27,120 --> 00:24:29,880 And then he remembered Joe Furmage. 444 00:24:30,240 --> 00:24:32,800 I remember Joe Furmage and the fact that he'd done this 445 00:24:32,800 --> 00:24:37,920 interview and it claimed that he was going to be investing in 446 00:24:38,160 --> 00:24:41,080 physics programs. And I thought, well, you know, 447 00:24:41,480 --> 00:24:45,720 maybe he has some insights. Fugel says he contacted Furmage 448 00:24:45,920 --> 00:24:49,920 and had a meeting with him. And I'm whisked into a garage 449 00:24:50,440 --> 00:24:53,560 where there are the equivalent of giant tinker toys. 450 00:24:53,560 --> 00:24:58,000 It looks like spinning objects, mechanical, very rudimentary, 451 00:24:58,320 --> 00:25:01,880 crude mechanical devices that are, that are being operated. 452 00:25:01,880 --> 00:25:06,080 And I see an older bearded Joe Furmage. 453 00:25:06,480 --> 00:25:09,880 Fugel says Furmage claimed to be on the cusp of inventing 454 00:25:09,880 --> 00:25:14,240 humanity, changing anti gravity technology that would allow 455 00:25:14,240 --> 00:25:16,880 humans to travel to the stars. He said. 456 00:25:16,880 --> 00:25:19,880 I believe that you've been LED here for a reason, right here in 457 00:25:19,880 --> 00:25:23,160 my garage before you. You are looking at the early 458 00:25:23,160 --> 00:25:27,720 proof of concept embodiments of the the experiments showing the 459 00:25:27,720 --> 00:25:30,520 physics underpinning these new advancements. 460 00:25:30,640 --> 00:25:34,880 Feugel says he was skeptical, but Firmage introduced Feugel to 461 00:25:34,880 --> 00:25:38,000 various people who would back up his claims. 462 00:25:38,520 --> 00:25:44,920 He puts me on the phone with General Wesley Clark, former 463 00:25:44,920 --> 00:25:48,800 chairman of the Joint Chiefs. He introduces me to General 464 00:25:48,800 --> 00:25:51,400 Clark's as General Clark, I'd like you to meet Brandon Fugel. 465 00:25:51,960 --> 00:25:54,880 You know, he needs to know that there's that there's reality to 466 00:25:54,880 --> 00:25:58,240 this, you know, would you mind telling him your views? 467 00:25:58,240 --> 00:26:01,560 And General Clark said yes, I I don't have any problem. 468 00:26:01,560 --> 00:26:05,800 I great to meet you. You know, Mr. Fugel, I, I 469 00:26:05,880 --> 00:26:08,040 support Mr. Furmage. I've been following his work 470 00:26:08,040 --> 00:26:11,160 closely and there's truth to it. A representative for General 471 00:26:11,160 --> 00:26:14,480 Clark told me that while the general does not specifically 472 00:26:14,480 --> 00:26:18,640 remember this phone conversation with Fugel, he did indeed know 473 00:26:18,640 --> 00:26:23,240 Joe Furmage and was in fact interested in Furmage's claims 474 00:26:23,240 --> 00:26:26,720 of exotic technology. So I'm, I'm blown away here. 475 00:26:26,720 --> 00:26:29,920 I have former chairman of the Joint Chiefs, head of NATO 476 00:26:29,920 --> 00:26:34,960 command, who's confirming that Joe has been involved with 477 00:26:35,240 --> 00:26:39,200 credible activities, confirming that there's some reality. 478 00:26:39,840 --> 00:26:43,920 Next, Furmage put Fugel on the phone with Hal Puthoff and Kit 479 00:26:43,920 --> 00:26:47,720 Green. Both were former CIA scientists 480 00:26:47,960 --> 00:26:51,600 with a long history of researching otherworldly topics 481 00:26:51,680 --> 00:26:57,240 like UFOs and psychic powers. They also vouched for Joe 482 00:26:57,240 --> 00:26:59,920 Furmage. This all happens back-to-back on 483 00:26:59,920 --> 00:27:02,120 the same day. So yeah, Wesley Clark helped put 484 00:27:02,120 --> 00:27:04,000 off Get Green. So you had a series of yeah 485 00:27:04,080 --> 00:27:05,440 phone calls series? Of phone calls. 486 00:27:05,800 --> 00:27:09,160 Put Off in Green had long been involved with millionaire Robert 487 00:27:09,160 --> 00:27:12,320 Bigelow's hunt for the paranormal, and at the time of 488 00:27:12,320 --> 00:27:16,560 this phone call with Fugal in 2009, they were both involved in 489 00:27:16,560 --> 00:27:20,920 a now infamous $22 million Pentagon program headed by 490 00:27:20,920 --> 00:27:24,240 Bigelow. The program, among other things, 491 00:27:24,480 --> 00:27:28,400 allegedly investigated strange phenomena at Skinwalker Ranch, 492 00:27:28,800 --> 00:27:32,040 which at the time was owned by Robert Bigelow. 493 00:27:32,600 --> 00:27:35,000 Now if I'm going to put my skeptic's hat on, what I'm 494 00:27:35,000 --> 00:27:39,360 seeing here is Brandon Fugel getting involved with this guy 495 00:27:39,440 --> 00:27:42,960 in probably some successful real estate deals where he's running 496 00:27:43,640 --> 00:27:47,680 office space to him. And then down the road, what 15 497 00:27:47,680 --> 00:27:50,640 years later or something, he starts thinking about 498 00:27:51,600 --> 00:27:55,360 alternatives to the jet engine and he decides to give this 499 00:27:55,520 --> 00:27:59,320 fellow a call who claims to have this anti gravity machine that 500 00:27:59,320 --> 00:28:01,960 he's working on. The important part though, it's 501 00:28:01,960 --> 00:28:03,640 not this machine because it never panned out. 502 00:28:03,640 --> 00:28:06,280 But the important part to me is the names involved. 503 00:28:06,880 --> 00:28:13,680 General Wesley Clark, how put off Kick Green, Bob Bigelow. 504 00:28:13,880 --> 00:28:18,400 It's the same names that you see over and over and over again and 505 00:28:18,400 --> 00:28:22,480 what I call the UFO Mafia. But can you see the intersection 506 00:28:22,480 --> 00:28:25,520 here between people in the Defense Department, in the 507 00:28:25,520 --> 00:28:30,280 military and the folks in the intelligence community coming 508 00:28:30,280 --> 00:28:33,440 together with? And honestly, it almost looks 509 00:28:33,440 --> 00:28:37,600 like praying on successful businessmen, really. 510 00:28:37,600 --> 00:28:41,600 Some, I would say, kind of shady stuff perhaps going on here 511 00:28:41,600 --> 00:28:44,240 where this guy's LED into thinking you can invest money in 512 00:28:44,240 --> 00:28:46,880 this thing, which of course, it turns out to be a total failure. 513 00:28:48,400 --> 00:28:54,280 And then as we listen to this next clip, it's almost like like 514 00:28:54,280 --> 00:28:57,640 a like a typical scam artist deal. 515 00:28:57,800 --> 00:28:59,760 You get the guy who wants Brandon Fugel. 516 00:28:59,760 --> 00:29:01,720 He's kind of the sucker. He's got the money. 517 00:29:01,960 --> 00:29:05,080 So they clip him once on the anti gravity and then they come 518 00:29:05,080 --> 00:29:08,640 back for a second bite out of the apple with the Skinwalker 519 00:29:08,640 --> 00:29:10,400 Ranch deal. The whole thing looks so 520 00:29:10,400 --> 00:29:12,920 suspicious to me, but that's just how I view it. 521 00:29:12,920 --> 00:29:15,640 I mean, I could be wrong. Let's let's listen to this next 522 00:29:15,640 --> 00:29:17,080 excerpt and then we'll finish up. 523 00:29:18,520 --> 00:29:20,400 They have the disappointment of family. 524 00:29:21,280 --> 00:29:26,000 I at that point in time, I had lost a lot of faith and trust in 525 00:29:26,000 --> 00:29:29,160 people. Fugle says this was a dark time 526 00:29:29,160 --> 00:29:34,960 for him, that he struggled to trust anyone, and even his faith 527 00:29:35,240 --> 00:29:39,760 in the Mormon church was shaken. But this all changed with a 528 00:29:39,760 --> 00:29:46,240 phone call in 2015. Late 2015, I received a call 529 00:29:46,240 --> 00:29:50,240 from Doctor Hal Putoff and Doctor Christopher C Green. 530 00:29:50,360 --> 00:29:53,760 Kit Green. The same two guys just a few 531 00:29:53,760 --> 00:29:58,120 years after the Joe Furmage motion scientist debacle, Fugel 532 00:29:58,120 --> 00:30:02,280 says Hal Putoff and Kit Green had a brand new proposition for 533 00:30:02,280 --> 00:30:04,480 him. And in the middle of that call, 534 00:30:04,600 --> 00:30:06,320 both Doctor put off and Doctor, Green said. 535 00:30:06,320 --> 00:30:09,880 Are you familiar with a certain piece of property in Utah known 536 00:30:09,880 --> 00:30:12,080 as Skinwalker Ranch? What do you know about 537 00:30:12,080 --> 00:30:14,800 Skinwalker Ranch? Fugal says put off and Green 538 00:30:14,800 --> 00:30:17,600 told him that the ranch was for sale. 539 00:30:18,120 --> 00:30:21,080 We'd like to suggest that you take a meeting with Mr. Bigelow 540 00:30:21,120 --> 00:30:23,480 if you're interested. Would you be open to it? 541 00:30:23,480 --> 00:30:28,120 And I said absolutely. Fugal flew to Las Vegas to meet 542 00:30:28,120 --> 00:30:32,120 with Robert Bigelow and discuss purchasing Skinwalker Ranch. 543 00:30:32,800 --> 00:30:37,200 Fugal says Bigelow would only sell the ranch as is and that 544 00:30:37,200 --> 00:30:40,920 Bigelow would not be sharing with Fugal any of the research 545 00:30:40,920 --> 00:30:43,960 he had done at the ranch over the last 20 years. 546 00:30:44,640 --> 00:30:50,000 I agreed. I said OK fine, I'll buy it as 547 00:30:50,000 --> 00:30:53,200 is. On April Fool's Day 2016, 548 00:30:53,560 --> 00:30:57,160 Brandon Fugal became the official owner of Skinwalker 549 00:30:57,160 --> 00:31:00,720 Ranch. I think that clip really sums it 550 00:31:00,720 --> 00:31:02,280 up. So you have Brian Fiegel, this 551 00:31:02,280 --> 00:31:04,960 young guy, very wealthy and sounds like maybe his family has 552 00:31:04,960 --> 00:31:07,280 a lot of money too. He has an interest in the 553 00:31:07,280 --> 00:31:11,480 paranormal and he has an interest in breaking science 554 00:31:11,480 --> 00:31:13,560 technology. He gets involved in this fellow 555 00:31:14,000 --> 00:31:16,000 in this whole anti gravity thing, which ends up being a 556 00:31:16,000 --> 00:31:18,560 total scam. But but who gave him the 557 00:31:18,560 --> 00:31:20,720 confidence to go into that business relationship? 558 00:31:20,720 --> 00:31:25,880 Well, Wesley Clark, General Wesley Clark how put off and Kit 559 00:31:25,880 --> 00:31:28,640 Green, a couple of old school Intel guys. 560 00:31:29,440 --> 00:31:31,960 Of course the whole thing ends up to be a complete failure. 561 00:31:31,960 --> 00:31:34,320 He loses all this money, he loses his face, he feels 562 00:31:34,320 --> 00:31:36,360 terrible about it. He says he feels so bad he 563 00:31:36,360 --> 00:31:39,720 almost loses his faith in his Mormonism, and then he gets a 564 00:31:39,720 --> 00:31:43,960 phone call. Now this is such a classic move 565 00:31:44,200 --> 00:31:46,600 as far as that confidence game goes in my opinion. 566 00:31:46,920 --> 00:31:50,360 The two guys that he relied on for advice that caused him to 567 00:31:50,360 --> 00:31:54,000 lose all the money in the 1st place, calling back with another 568 00:31:54,480 --> 00:31:57,240 proposition. Some people might view that as 569 00:31:57,240 --> 00:31:59,320 well. If he's a big enough sucker to 570 00:31:59,320 --> 00:32:01,480 pay out the first time, he might be a big enough sucker to pay 571 00:32:01,480 --> 00:32:04,120 out the second time. You know, a good con man is not 572 00:32:04,120 --> 00:32:06,720 going to let a victim off the hook with just one scam. 573 00:32:06,720 --> 00:32:09,520 We're going to come back and try to get him multiple times as a 574 00:32:09,520 --> 00:32:12,920 rule. That's just what I can see, but 575 00:32:13,040 --> 00:32:14,600 I'm not calling these guys scammers. 576 00:32:14,600 --> 00:32:16,960 I'm just saying that it could look that way to some people. 577 00:32:17,320 --> 00:32:21,120 Anyway, they give him this whole spiel about Skinwalker Ranch. 578 00:32:21,120 --> 00:32:26,960 So my question is, why is Hal Puthoff and Kit Green acting as 579 00:32:27,240 --> 00:32:30,760 de facto real estate agents for Bob Bigelow? 580 00:32:31,040 --> 00:32:33,520 I mean, if Bob Bigelow wants to sell a ranch, one, it just go 581 00:32:33,520 --> 00:32:36,480 down to one of the local real estate agents and put this thing 582 00:32:36,480 --> 00:32:38,680 up for sale. But that's not it. 583 00:32:38,680 --> 00:32:40,880 It's almost like they're priming this guy and they're giving the 584 00:32:40,880 --> 00:32:42,960 business about all the cool stuff that's happening out there 585 00:32:42,960 --> 00:32:45,120 and the research that Bob Bigelow's done. 586 00:32:45,120 --> 00:32:47,560 And man, you know, this ranch would be a really cool thing for 587 00:32:47,560 --> 00:32:50,480 you to have what she ends up buying for. 588 00:32:50,760 --> 00:32:54,120 Well, according to Wikipedia, Bigelow paid 200,000 for it and 589 00:32:54,120 --> 00:32:56,440 sold it for 500,000. I've heard higher numbers. 590 00:32:57,440 --> 00:32:59,560 I think it's safe to say he made a pretty healthy profit. 591 00:32:59,720 --> 00:33:03,720 But what you can see in play here is Bob Bigelow. 592 00:33:03,720 --> 00:33:06,640 He's one of these guys that is a successful businessman and he's 593 00:33:06,640 --> 00:33:10,160 kind of moving in between as a government contractor, as a 594 00:33:10,160 --> 00:33:13,960 friend of politician Harry Reid and doing his own investigation 595 00:33:13,960 --> 00:33:16,040 and as a beneficiary of government funding. 596 00:33:16,480 --> 00:33:19,520 And he's just kind of, you know, he's kind of he's kind of 597 00:33:19,520 --> 00:33:23,080 captured that whole area. He's successful at it at at 598 00:33:23,320 --> 00:33:24,600 moving through those different doors. 599 00:33:25,000 --> 00:33:28,000 And then you have almost like an accomplish, you could say, my 600 00:33:28,000 --> 00:33:31,240 opinion, associate, associate, maybe we should say of how put 601 00:33:31,240 --> 00:33:36,520 off and kick Green and General Clark and General Mattis, As 602 00:33:36,520 --> 00:33:40,280 Green Street has posted in Twitter, they're kind of driving 603 00:33:40,280 --> 00:33:46,400 people toward him to maybe be exploited or at least to buy his 604 00:33:46,400 --> 00:33:48,560 real estate at 2 1/2 times what he paid for. 605 00:33:48,720 --> 00:33:50,840 And so eventually he buys Skinwalker Ranch. 606 00:33:51,120 --> 00:33:54,120 And I suppose lucky for him, he's able to land this contract 607 00:33:54,120 --> 00:33:57,480 with The History Channel and with a bunch of these UFO 608 00:33:57,480 --> 00:33:59,480 celebrities. And now they have a successful 609 00:33:59,480 --> 00:34:02,080 show and hopefully he's made his money back. 610 00:34:02,560 --> 00:34:04,960 But what I want you to take from this whole thing with Skinwalker 611 00:34:04,960 --> 00:34:08,719 Ranch is that it almost seems to me that Skinwalker Ranch is a 612 00:34:08,719 --> 00:34:12,239 vehicle. It's a vehicle for creating 613 00:34:12,239 --> 00:34:16,600 wealth. And the way it creates wealth is 614 00:34:16,600 --> 00:34:20,960 that it uses different players from different sectors of this 615 00:34:21,120 --> 00:34:24,360 UFO economy. We have people like Bob Bigelow 616 00:34:24,719 --> 00:34:27,960 who are old school business guys. 617 00:34:27,960 --> 00:34:29,120 They've been around for a long time. 618 00:34:29,120 --> 00:34:31,360 They've been successful. And they've been successful not 619 00:34:31,360 --> 00:34:34,840 only in the private industry of, you know, building this hotel 620 00:34:34,840 --> 00:34:37,760 chain from scratch, but they've also been successful at landing 621 00:34:37,760 --> 00:34:40,239 government contracts, whether it's through his aerospace 622 00:34:40,239 --> 00:34:45,480 company or whether it's through a tip doing research on his 623 00:34:45,480 --> 00:34:47,639 ranch. Research which basically just 624 00:34:47,639 --> 00:34:51,960 consists of, it looks to me like volumes of stories, anecdotal 625 00:34:51,960 --> 00:34:55,080 evidence, not so much scientifically research stuff. 626 00:34:55,639 --> 00:34:58,960 But it's a fun hobby that the taxpayers paid for. 627 00:34:59,600 --> 00:35:02,040 The other players, of course, are politicians like Harry Reid 628 00:35:02,240 --> 00:35:05,800 that direct the funding. And then you have these guys 629 00:35:05,800 --> 00:35:10,040 that stand around this, these UFO mafia members, the big time 630 00:35:10,040 --> 00:35:14,720 guys like Hal put off, Kick Green, whatever generals you're 631 00:35:14,720 --> 00:35:18,560 talking about, whether it's Mattis or Clark or whoever, and 632 00:35:18,560 --> 00:35:21,640 the host of others that always seem to be in the right place at 633 00:35:21,640 --> 00:35:25,120 the right time to get paid. They rotate from jobs. 634 00:35:25,240 --> 00:35:29,000 Usually they have a long career in intelligence or defense or 635 00:35:29,000 --> 00:35:30,640 both. And then they go through these 636 00:35:30,640 --> 00:35:33,560 revolving doors, whether it's into an aerospace company or 637 00:35:33,680 --> 00:35:35,720 whether it's into one of these UFO programs that have been 638 00:35:35,720 --> 00:35:38,200 handpicked by a senator like Reed. 639 00:35:38,640 --> 00:35:41,280 Somehow they position themselves in a place where they're either 640 00:35:41,280 --> 00:35:45,760 going to profit immediately or down the road because it adds to 641 00:35:45,760 --> 00:35:48,920 their reputational clout. Then of course someone's got to 642 00:35:48,920 --> 00:35:52,840 pay for this, so it's either going to be the taxpayer, such 643 00:35:52,840 --> 00:35:57,400 as when Harry Reid writes out a check for $22 million, or 644 00:35:57,400 --> 00:36:02,520 possibly a independently wealthy businessman like Ryan Fugel who 645 00:36:02,520 --> 00:36:06,360 gets convinced that this guy is building an anti gravity machine 646 00:36:06,840 --> 00:36:08,840 and he invested millions of dollars himself. 647 00:36:09,000 --> 00:36:11,560 There's always a target. There are always the people in 648 00:36:11,560 --> 00:36:15,280 the background that seem to be directing the money toward the 649 00:36:15,280 --> 00:36:16,960 scam. Whether it was a thorough no 650 00:36:16,960 --> 00:36:21,000 scam where she's claiming that she can test blood or she's now 651 00:36:21,000 --> 00:36:24,680 in prison because people got hurt from this, or whether it's 652 00:36:24,680 --> 00:36:27,920 this guy who claims that he has his anti gravity machine. 653 00:36:28,160 --> 00:36:30,800 It's always some. It's always some above and 654 00:36:30,800 --> 00:36:33,240 beyond claim. OK, that can't be scientifically 655 00:36:33,240 --> 00:36:35,440 proven. There's always the gullibles, 656 00:36:35,440 --> 00:36:38,120 investors that want to put their money into it because somehow 657 00:36:38,120 --> 00:36:41,080 they think that they're going to discover fame or fortune. 658 00:36:41,440 --> 00:36:45,560 And then you have this whole pack of almost like wolves just 659 00:36:45,560 --> 00:36:50,200 driving these gullible investors toward whatever thing this is 660 00:36:50,200 --> 00:36:53,080 they're investing in. In the con game they're called 661 00:36:53,080 --> 00:36:57,960 the Mark, and in this case it seems to me that the Mark was 662 00:36:58,080 --> 00:37:02,080 branded Fugel and the prize was anti gravity which could lead to 663 00:37:02,080 --> 00:37:06,400 free energy. That was the first scam, my 664 00:37:06,400 --> 00:37:08,880 opinion. And then the second scam is 665 00:37:08,880 --> 00:37:10,480 Skinwalker Ranch. We're going to find something so 666 00:37:10,480 --> 00:37:12,600 big here it just turns the whole world upside down. 667 00:37:12,880 --> 00:37:16,240 Now Fugel is not a dumb guy I don't think, and I think he has 668 00:37:16,240 --> 00:37:20,280 been smart enough to exploit this whole Skinwalker Ranch 669 00:37:20,280 --> 00:37:24,320 thing into a very profitable television series on History 670 00:37:24,320 --> 00:37:26,120 Channel. They are doing some interesting 671 00:37:26,120 --> 00:37:28,320 stuff out there. Don't get me wrong, I do watch 672 00:37:28,320 --> 00:37:32,160 it occasionally but I have doubts and I have doubts because 673 00:37:32,160 --> 00:37:33,400 of the people that were pushing it. 674 00:37:33,520 --> 00:37:36,920 It's the same faces every time and I have doubts because of the 675 00:37:36,920 --> 00:37:40,240 amount of money involved and I have doubts because of the hard 676 00:37:40,240 --> 00:37:42,000 science that hasn't been produced. 677 00:37:43,000 --> 00:37:45,480 I guess we'll have to wait and see until next time. 678 00:37:45,760 --> 00:37:47,680 This is UFO warning over and out.