Welcome to the new manager podcast.
I'm your host, Kim nickel. Hello, and welcome.
I'm so glad you're here and I hope you're doing well today is
a very special episode. It is the 100th episode of the
new manager podcast. I will tell you that when I
started this podcast a couple of years ago, I did not realize I
had so much to say and I did not realize how many people all it
would reach. One of the things that happened
this year is that Spotify sent out a summary, like a wrapped of
information for podcasters. If you are a Spotify listener,
you also get a wrapped like a year in review of what you
listen to. Well as a podcaster they
gathered all this data and then presented it to me in a really
fun way to tell me about some of the Listening habits of my
listeners and how my podcast did over the course of the year.
And it really made me think about what I wanted to share
with you today around data story and emotion.
Because you know Spotify took all this data about how many
people listened and where in the world they are and how it
compared to this time last year. That's all data.
But the way they present it, Is in a really fun celebratory way.
It really highlights the distinction between data and
story data alone is not the story.
The story is where we get meaning.
The story is, how are you presenting?
This is that like, how am I supposed to feel about this
data? Am I supposed to feel good?
Or am? I supposed to feel bad?
And I think in our work lives, we often forget That data and
story are not the same especially if you work in a lot
of data, whether it is in coding or whether it is in finance, or
whether it is in sales conversions or whatever.
The nature of the data is that you work in when you're really
good and really understand your domain.
We forget that other people don't have that same
understanding, and we can't just send data and expect people to
know what it means. Part of the job.
God is helping people understand.
What is the story that this data is is telling and Spotify, did a
really great job of that because they delivered to me some data
about my podcast over the year and they present it with so much
celebration. And I felt so amazing and I felt
amazing for you listening because one of the things that I
learned is that my podcast was in Baton, Up 5%, most shared
globally that blew my mind. So if you are sharing this
podcast with people, you care about.
If someone that you care about shared it with you, you are all
a part of that. Ecosystem of that constellation
of helping this podcast, reach more people and help more people
truly in every industry. All over the world and that
feels so meaningful to me. So I wanted to share that with
you as a celebration, because as we come into the end of the
year, it is such a time to pause, reflect assess and
celebrate and sometimes we forget to do that because we're
either exhausted, or because we're already looking ahead at
what is coming next. So, just for a moment.
I would like to invite you to come with me into a place of
celebration for all of the things that have happened this
year and take some time in your own life.
As you think about the data, the different points of information
that you can gather from your year and then choose what is
this story? You want that data to tell?
Is it good? Or is it bad?
And you really get to decide depending on how you look at it
and present it. And so, for our topic today, I
want us to spend more time in the space of data story, and
emotion, the shows up in a lot of ways.
Some very overt and some a little more subtle.
So an overt way, this shows up is you might be in a position
where your job is to take some data and then use that.
To tell a story that compels someone else to do something
very specific. So if you work in finance, you
might take the you know, PL sheet, the profits and losses
and say Here's the data. We should feel really good about
this because this is what this means or you might say, Okay,
based on what we've seen in terms of our customer buying
Behavior, here are some data about what they're buying.
And when Here's some data about how they are buying when they
are buying. Here's a whole lot of data.
Here's the story that we can tell with that data, this is
what it means. And as a result, we should feel
really worried really, confident, really encouraged,
really concerned, right? Like, the emotion behind, that
becomes really important because emotion in is so sticky.
We can often hold on to a feeling for a lot longer than we
can hold onto specific information.
And, you know this because as a human, my guess is that you have
had experiences where you have felt really inspired, really
cared for really supported. And if someone asked you why you
might not really know, like in the workplace, you might feel
like, oh, I feel so supported by this one manager.
And if someone said why you might say, gosh, I it's hard to
pin down, it's just something. I don't know what and the
reverse to as a human. We tend to really hold onto
emotion that is uncomfortable or painful.
So you might remember that oh, this person in my life like, I
just, we don't we don't get along.
Oh well, what is it that happened?
What's the data behind the story that's creating that emotion and
you Might not even remember accurately, you might say, I
don't even remember what exactly they did or said it was so long
ago. I just remember, it wasn't good.
And so, I've always held this guarded attitude and a sense of
distrust with this person. It is so interesting.
When we start to notice how these things all fit together,
the data, the story, the emotion, and sharing a story
from some of the work that I've been doing.
Ming. I was in a conversation quite
recently with a client who is reflecting on how and actually I
should back up a little bit. So we first started working
together when she was very new world, new MID in her career and
now she's very senior and she said, you know, I've always felt
like I didn't really fit in and I was kind of in my little
corner of the organization, just working quietly on my thing and
people would treat me in a way that wasn't very Very
respectful. So this is the, the data and the
story, they would behave a certain way.
They would talk to me in a certain way and I thought, oh
maybe they're doing this because I haven't earned their respect.
Maybe there's something accurate in the way.
They're treating me. Maybe that's just, maybe I'm not
as good at what I do as I think because she was using their
behavior, as, as information about herself and then kind of
believing, maybe that's true. And then the emotion she felt
around. It was well, you know, it's
fine, I work in an industry that wasn't really designed for
people like me. So I'll just work quietly in my
own little corner. And what's really interesting is
that having known her for a couple of years now and seen her
growth as she does things her own way?
She's now having this experience, or people are kind
of Blown Away by who she is, and what she does and how she does
it. And they're treating her
differently and she noticed this and she said it's very strange
that people are being really nice to me like all of a sudden,
it seems like people are seeing me differently and are treating
me like really nicely. And they just never realized
really how good I am. And she said I didn't even
realize how good I was. I just assumed all, you know, I
just kind of fly under the radar.
And so, as she is now, Lysing that the information, the data
she was getting based on how other people treated her, right.
It really was just not a not an accurate signal about the
quality of work she was doing or her capacity to do really
influential, and really significant work.
There was something else in play.
And the story that she's telling herself now is, oh, I do
incredible work. I'm very good at my field.
I'm very diagnosed build into our market and our industry in a
way that nobody else in my organization is and I do things
my own way. It might seem weird or quirky,
but it's really effective and it works for me.
And so she's been able to kind of unhook from taking the
responsiveness and reactions of other people and making that
mean something about her and making that mean, like she's not
enough. So we can look at At the
interplay of these three elements data story and emotion,
in a few different ways. And this will become really
helpful for you both in terms of communicating with stakeholders,
whether it's your manager, a cross-functional partner, or
team, whether it's communicating with your people on your team or
whether it's communicating with clients and managing
relationships externally, when you start to To think, in terms
of what is the data I have to work with?
What is the story I want to tell?
Like, is this data good or bad? What does it mean?
And as humans were always looking for meaning, tell me
what it means, don't just give me the information, tell me what
it means, as you start thinking in those terms and this
additional part, how do you want to feel about it?
What is the emotion that you want to feel?
What is the emotion that you want?
The? Other person to feel are be
aware of. It really creates a lot of ease
and a lot more understanding because then it gets us out of
kind of either fighting with other people like which we often
do in our mind, rather than actually externally with with
people, but it also keeps you from being in conflict with your
self. The story that you tell about
yourself the story that you tell about other people and how they
They should be or why they're being a certain way, all of that
starts to get untangled and you start to find more ways to be
effective and to do it in a way that really honors who you are
as a person. So, one way I also have been
thinking about this is when we think about what it means to be
underrepresented in your workplace and that can be across
a lot of different dimensions. Jin's.
As I mentioned once before, to underrepresented means the way I
think about it is when you look at who you work with, there's a
voice in your head that says, oh, I'm not like them.
I don't quite fit in here. I might need to present myself
in a certain way in order to belong or create connection.
Here I am the only one like me here.
That is a signal in your mind that you're that you're
registering. Something that is
underrepresented because you don't see it in front of you.
And what super interesting is that sometimes these are
invisible things like it might be a disability.
It might be around a health issue.
Something that is not obvious on the surface, but underneath it
affects your experience and the way that you exist in the world,
but they can also be things like age.
Either being eldest or being youngest, they can be around
gender. It can be around marital.
It's like if you're the only person who is married and you
work with all these single people or the reverse, maybe
you're the only single person or the only divorced person, or the
only widowed person and you work with people, who are all
long-term marrieds, or maybe it's around parental status.
Maybe you're the only one who has young kids, or maybe you're
the only one who has grown kids or maybe the people that you
work with are not parents at all.
All like that can also create that feeling of whoo, not quite,
not quite fitting in here, your ethnic background, which we've
talked about a little bit. You might scan the room and
think, ooh, there's no one here that quite looks like me.
I have a different ethnic background.
It might be around your sexual orientation, your education,
which is interesting too because with education that can often be
kind of invisible, except now, with different platforms.
Like LinkedIn people can kind of go and see, oh, where did this
person go to school? And you might work in an
organization or an industry that really prizes and exalts,
certain educational backgrounds. So you might be the only person
with or without a certain educational background, it might
be around language. Maybe, you're the only person
who speaks multiple languages, maybe you're the The only person
who learned your business language later in life and I am
an English speaker. And so and a lot of my listeners
are English speakers obviously because that's that's the only
language I have available to me to convey this to you.
But a lot of my listeners are like they speak multiple
languages. It's like a very multinational
Multicultural community and workplace.
So depending on your like language, what languages you
have, that might be an element of being underrepresented and
then of course, all of the invisible things, the things
that people can't see, but are present whenever you are in the
room. So when we think about all of
these different dimensions that we can experience being
Underrepresented one more. I just want it.
I thought of that I wanted to add tenure in the industry or
organization. If you are the newest person and
you're coming into an organization where everyone else
has 20 years of experience or people have been in that
organization longer than you have, that can also create a
little bit of that awareness. And it can often first register
as a kind of tension, like we get a little tense, a More
alert, you know, we are social animals.
We want to feel connection. We want to feel acceptance.
And so what I want to offer is that all of that we can think of
in terms of data, like what is the data about the feeling of
not fitting in or the feeling of being different?
And then we get to the story, what does it mean?
And often a lot of the work I do with my clients is around.
Identifying, what is the default story that you have about it and
what is the effect of that default story and then what
other stories are available or possible?
Because that will show up in your ability and willingness to
manage and to sometimes be uncomfortable?
Speaking up advocating for yourself, making decisions that
might seem different, but actually, Really are effective
and work for you. You're simply kind of pioneering
or creating a new way of doing things.
So understanding, what is this story that you want to create
from that data and then how do you want to feel about it?
And what I love is, when you are able to really kind of take some
ownership in the most loving and empowered way around.
Here's the story that I I am going to tell with the data that
I have available and then how am I going to feel about it?
I'm going to feel capable confident courageous proud,
right? Like, how am I going to feel?
And when we're intentional about that, that can really go a long
way to getting us out of a place where we feel small uncertain
insecure. Like we're being harshly, judged
by A others or feeling like, oh, I have to do something in order
to prove myself or gained someone else's respect, right.
That's a hard game to be in because it's like, you're always
chasing something from somebody who might not have it available
to give you. And we really don't want to get
kind of locked in the stalemate, around someone's behavior when
that's actually not the most important thing, Right?
Like the most important thing is who you are, why you're there
and how you choose to manage and lead and show up in the
workplace and the decisions that you're going to make, when
you're making decisions from feeling grounded, confident,
proud, courageous, and having a sense of clarity of like, I know
how I feel. And I know why and I am choosing
A story I'm choosing to create meaning from this data, that
really will serve me and the bigger purpose of what I'm here
to do, and who I'm here to be, it really changes the
experience. So that is what I wanted to
share with you in today's episode.
The 100th episode. That's something that we get to
celebrate together. Because I always feel like, you
know, I At to share my knowledge and perspective with you because
I know that you take it and run with it and you do something
great with it and it eases your burden a little and it lets you
do incredible work in a world that is not always an easy world
to be in and in an organization. And with other humans, not
always easy. But here we are.
We keep showing up and now we do it with a little more.
Or awareness, a little more grace, a little more kindness,
and a little more courage. So thank you so much for
listening and if you want to work with me one-on-one, good
news, you can, if you've been struggling with issues around
especially around confidence or around, how to deal with
difficult work situations as a new manager come work with me.
It does not have to be this hard.
I was chatting with a friend of And he was saying, you know,
Kim, when I started managing people, it's like I inherited a
bag of snakes, he said it was so difficult and I when I look
back, I really wish I'd had a coach because it didn't need to
be that hard so I can help you come work with me.
If you have to deal with a bag of snakes, or if you just feel
like, you know, you're kind of wandering through the desert or
you're trying to keep your head above water.
I can help doesn't have to be that hard.
We can start making it better right away.
Way. Go into the show notes.
You'll find a link to my calendar.
I'll talk to you soon. Thanks so much for listening and
I'll talk to you next time. Bye.
Hey before you go if you like this podcast leave a review.
Tell me why you listen and what has helped you?
Thanks so much. I'll see you next time.
Way. Go into the show notes.
You'll find a link to my calendar.
I'll talk to you soon. Thanks so much for listening and
I'll talk to you next time. Bye.
Hey before you go if you like this podcast leave a review.
Tell me why you listen and what has helped you?
Thanks so much. I'll see you next time.