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Welcome to the new manager 
podcast. 

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I'm your host, Kim nickel. 
Hello and welcome, I'm glad 

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you're here. 
I hope you're doing well. 

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I am feeling really great right 
now because I spent all of last 

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week with my mentor and a 
community of other coaches, it 

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really reminded me of two 
things. 

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I want to tell you about one is 
how valuable it is to have. 

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Someone you can talk to who 100%
believes in you and 100% is 

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unattached to your life and to 
the decisions that you make, you

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know, most of us, we work with 
people, we have family, we have 

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friends, they might really 
support you, but they are not 

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unattached. 
They have opinions about you and

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what you should do and how you 
are doing it and even when it's 

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coming from a good place. 
It's still can feel heavy and it

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can get in the way. 
And I just need to tell you 

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that. 
If you have never been coached 

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before, you must experience, it 
especially around work where so 

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much of what happens there is 
either like very private. 

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So you can't talk to other 
people about what's happening on

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your team because of 
confidentiality or it just turns

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into complaining and 
commiserate. 

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Dating which feels worse because
nothing changes. 

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Like, you can feel the 
connection of comfort when we 

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say, oh, this person at work is 
driving me crazy. 

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I don't know what to do about 
them but after that initial, you

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know, feeling of, oh I see, I 
understand, I've been in that 

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situation to maybe try this. 
Like once that wears off it's 

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just you alone with your work 
and the People that you might 

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not have chosen to work with but
there you are. 

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And it is liberating beyond what
I can say to have a place to 

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talk about. 
Okay, here's what's going on. 

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Here's what I'm struggling with,
here's what I'm trying to make a

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decision about, here's where I 
feel undermined. 

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Here's where I feel frustrated 
to be able to talk about that 

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separate from your relationships
with either other. 

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Colleagues or your friends and 
family and I'll tell you, when I

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was in a work situation where I 
was feeling very frustrated 

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about the organization or about 
a relationship. 

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I was having. 
If there was some friction, I 

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wasn't sure how to handle it, it
would completely show up in my 

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relationship with my partner 
because I'd either be talking to

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him about it which then just, 
you know, brought the work issue

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home or it would In the back of 
my mind draining my energy and 

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this low level constant 
distraction. 

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So if that is something that is 
happening for you, you have to 

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come on a consult with me and 
let's talk about what is going 

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on and get it started. 
Okay, so that was one thing, but

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the second thing and this is 
what I loved when I was teaching

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my live classes in person, you 
know, starting in 2017 was when 

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you You get together with other 
people who are managers who do 

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not work in your organization. 
You have a level of anonymity 

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where nobody knows you, nobody 
knows the people you're talking 

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about, it helps to kind of undo 
the emotional charge. 

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We feel when there's that sense 
of anonymity and it is. 

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So inviting you have so much 
more freedom to be really 

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honest. 
Because you're not trying to 

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Marriage anyone's image or 
perception of you. 

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Like I have done trainings in 
companies where everybody knows 

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each other, it is a different 
vibe. 

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When I am teaching people who 
are thinking, I will never see 

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you again. 
So I can be extremely open and 

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very honest, that Community is. 
So valuable both for, you know, 

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getting actually what you want 
to learn, but also for Getting 

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some relief from the pressure, 
and the stress. 

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And the other thing that's 
really interesting, when you're 

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talking with other people, is 
that an, especially, like when 

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you're talking with other people
who don't know, you or who, 

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don't know, the work environment
that you work in is you will 

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realize that, you know, more 
than you thought you did. 

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This happens all the time both 
when I work with folks 

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one-on-one. 
And also when I was teaching 

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group classes and group 
workshops is people from 

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different Industries, different 
companies, getting together and 

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sharing. 
What have they discovered, what 

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have they tried? 
What did they learn? 

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And it starts to build your 
confidence. 

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When you realize, you know what,
I do know, some things. 

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I am not completely lost. 
I am not, I am not completely. 

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No, struggling here. 
There's actually a lot that you 

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do know, but you might have 
forgotten if you have been in a 

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state of frustration or if your 
confidence has been undermined 

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or you're just tired, it's so 
easy to forget the things you 

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all ready? 
Know and the things you do well.

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So having conversations, super 
Valuable. 

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So I'm telling you that up 
front. 

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Okay, what I really wanted to 
talk with you today is that 

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managing is a separate job. 
It is a separate skill set. 

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And it's interesting to me that 
we overlook this, we Overlook 

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that managing people is a, it's 
an entirely separate job, it's a

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different set of skills than 
whatever you have been doing 

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before. 
And the way I like to think 

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about it is imagine that you're 
in a car, you have never driven 

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a car before, but you think to 
yourself, well, I've written in 

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a lot of cars. 
I'll for many, many years. 

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I have been in the backseat of a
lot of cars, a lot of different 

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cars. 
I've watched drivers drive and 

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in fact, I've given feedback 
about how poorly they drive. 

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And in fact I can look out of 
the car I'm in and into other 

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cars and I can see other drivers
and I always spot who's driving 

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very poorly. 
So I know all of the things that

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bad drivers do and let me tell 
you I have had so many bad 

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drivers of the cars that I've 
been in. 

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And then from the back seat, I 
got promoted. 

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I got to sit up front in the 
passenger seat. 

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Gave me a whole new perspective.
I could see a lot more of the 

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road. 
I understood a lot more about 

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what the driver was doing. 
I even had access to the radio 

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and to the air conditioning. 
So I began to influence the 

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environment I was in and I was 
making decisions that affected 

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everybody else in the car. 
And then someone says alright 

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great you've got all these years
of experience of being in cars. 

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And you understand what bad 
driving is? 

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Congratulations. 
Here are the keys you now? 

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Get to drive and you think yes, 
I have been wanting to do this. 

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I am ready to do this and you 
open the door. 

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You get in the seat, you close 
the door. 

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And you think what is all this? 
How wait what? 

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Like I've seen this. 
Done. 

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Countless times. 
I've seen people drive, I've had

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very strong opinions about the 
ability of other drivers and now

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I'm in the driver's seat and I 
know we got some Petals on the 

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floor. 
I know we've got this, you know,

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gear shift here. 
I know I've got like, you know, 

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a wiper, you know device and 
I've got lights that go on and 

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there's some other kind of 
buttons and a display and a A 

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steering wheel, okay? 
Like no problem, like I've got 

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this, but the truth is that the 
experience of driving, the car 

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requires skills that you have 
not fully developed. 

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And it doesn't matter how many 
hours or for how many years 

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you've seen other people do it. 
Yes. 

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You have ideas about how to do 
it. 

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Well but there is The very 
specific skill of actually 

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driving that you only really 
learn when you are in the 

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driver's seat. 
So I wanted to share that story 

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with you because only think 
about driving, it seems obvious,

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right? 
But it's a different skill and 

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yeah, like you might not be good
at it at first, or you might 

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feel really confident until you 
get in the driver's seat and 

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then you think, oh, I'm not 
exactly. 

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Really sure how this all works. 
And that's not a reason to give 

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up or to say well I guess I just
can't do it. 

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It's only for certain people, 
not for me. 

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It just means that when you 
drive the car, you will have a 

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period of learning how to do 
that. 

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Same with managing and in fact, 
with managing can be even a 

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little weird because you might 
end up managing people because 

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your organization is growing 
really fast, and you've been 

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there the longest or, you know, 
That function the best. 

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And so they're like, great. 
We're going to have you manage 

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these people. 
Ready go? 

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And you have like, no driver's, 
ed, no training. 

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And you know, no one to kind of 
show you what all the things 

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are. 
You just suddenly find yourself 

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in this position where you have 
a responsibility and it can be 

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really hard when you are not 
used to doing things poorly. 

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So I'm looking at you, my very 
strong. 

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It's like if you were a good 
student in school and you feel 

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very competitive and you do not 
like the feeling of knowing that

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you're not doing a good job, 
this is going to be extra hard 

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for you because one of the 
skills that you need to develop 

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is the skill of feeling 
uncomfortable. 

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The skill of acknowledging, 
okay? 

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I don't know how to do this. 
I don't like this feeling, but 

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it's fine. 
I am going to learn how to do 

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this. 
This is a normal part of the 

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process. 
SS. 

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Here's what I do know. 
Here's what I can you know, the 

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resources that are available to 
me. 

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Here's what I need to find out, 
you can get started. 

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But what happens a lot of times 
is when you start putting all 

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this pressure on yourself to do 
a good job when you haven't had 

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any guidance or training or 
mentoring or anyone to help you 

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think through what do you need 
to be thinking about? 

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Now, in this new role of being 
in the driver's seat, what tends

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to happen? 
Ian is we keep all of that 

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uncertainty, super, super 
private? 

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We don't tell anyone because you
know, you're afraid of what will

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they think? 
If they find out, I feel 

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insecure. 
And I don't know what I'm doing.

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You'll think, oh my gosh, 
they're paying me way too much. 

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I don't know what I'm doing. 
You'll keep it private. 

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You'll start to doubt yourself 
and then what I've seen happen 

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from that is either that's when 
micromanaging can come out. 

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Because then the thought is I 
have to prove I'm doing a good 

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job so I'm going to control as 
much as I can in order to ensure

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the result, the outcome that I'm
responsible for and that can 

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turn into micromanaging so fast 
or you do a little bit. 

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Like I don't want to hurt 
anyone's feelings and I'm not 

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exactly sure of what I'm doing. 
So I want everyone to feel happy

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with me because that's how I 
will measure. 

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ER, success. 
If my people are happy, that's 

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what I will use to feel 
successful. 

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And then you avoid the hard 
conversations. 

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You are have a really hard time,
giving a corrective feedback or 

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telling people, hey, look like 
this here. 

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We need to change. 
This isn't working. 

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You'll have a hard time standing
up for yourself for your team, 

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for being an advocate. 
It ends up backfiring and that 

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way too. 
So and we'll gosh and especially

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and now with so much still of 
work from home and so much 

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remote work, it's really easy to
hide to only present the face on

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Zoom of hey everything's great. 
I've got it under control and 

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then get off that call and feel 
terrible. 

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And feel the pressure and feel 
like I can't let people know. 

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So you know, I want to frame 
this in this way because I want 

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to normalize it. 
I want to normalize that this is

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a really common experience and 
that there's nothing wrong with 

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you. 
If you are experiencing this, it

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just means, oh, you're now in 
the driver's seat but you know, 

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you're expecting yourself too. 
Know how to do something right 

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away that you've never done 
before and it is so interesting.

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Isn't it that in the workplace? 
You know, we often think oh, the

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reason why this person is in a 
leadership role. 

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The reason why this person isn't
a manager role is because they 

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must be good at what they do. 
It is not always true that can 

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be shocking. 
It was surprising to me when 

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when I had that realization and 
when I I was first managing 

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people at a team of 18 and it 
was like, oh, all of a sudden 

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it's like, oh, I have to make 
decisions about team meeting and

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about one-on-ones and about pay 
increases and about performance 

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reviews and here's another 
thing. 

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So when you become a manager, 
you also get access to new 

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information and two more 
information, and some of this 

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will be very, very specific and 
clear like, now that you're 

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managing You may have access to 
see the salary history of the 

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people on your team. 
We're normally that information 

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would have been considered 
really private. 

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You wouldn't have been able to 
know that but now you might have

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access to that and it might feel
weird. 

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Might feel very personal. 
You will also get more access 

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more perspective to what else is
happening in the organization. 

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You'll be in meetings with 
higher level people having 

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different kinds of conversations
and you'll be expected to 

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understand what's going on. 
Even if people are not telling 

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you what's going on, you'll be 
expected to understand what you 

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need to tell your people in 
order to get them to do. 

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You know, whatever it is that 
they need to do and to figure 

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that out on your own and again, 
the two extremes I see is either

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being Over heavy-handed, right? 
Being too controlling or being a

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bit to it deferential. 
A bit too, you know prioritizing

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do people like me are people 
having a good time? 

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A good experience and that and 
but and what's interesting is 

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that both of those over 
corrections, I see it coming 

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from a good place, like nobody 
wakes up in the morning. 

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And says, I want to be a 
terrible manager today, and I'm 

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going to be the manager that my 
team goes home to their family 

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and complains about Nobody says 
that. 

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Nobody but what happens because 
you care and you're simply 

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uncertain you haven't developed 
the skills or the mindset yet. 

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So we get over controlling to 
try to get the good outcome or 

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overly deferential and avoidant.
In order to try and get the 

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outcome. 
It's really interesting. 

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When you start to notice and 
then question what, like, notice

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what you do, and then question, 
why you do it, or notice, what 

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you don't do, what you're 
avoiding and question, why 

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you're avoiding it. 
There's so much Insight that 

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comes from all of that. 
So that is what I wanted to 

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share with. 
You is just this awareness that 

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managing people is a Great job. 
It's a separate skill set and 

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it's fascinating how we can, you
know, you can get into a 

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position of managing people even
though you haven't done that job

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before you also might find and 
what I might offer to you is 

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there's a lot of Hope and 
optimism in that if you are not 

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yet managing like if you don't 
yet have direct reports or if 

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you're managing a really small 
team and the next level up for 

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you'll be a much larger team. 
It's also a reminder Kinder. 

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Don't wait to be ready before. 
You're ready. 

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Don't think, well before, I can 
manage a team of that size I 

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have to, you know, manage a team
of a similar size because that 

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will keep you out of the game. 
Like, that'll keep you from 

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promoting, like, promoting 
yourself. 

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It'll keep you from inviting 
yourself into that higher level.

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It'll keep you from applying for
jobs because you will disqualify

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yourself because you'll say, oh,
I don't have, I don't have 

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everything. 
But what I want to remind Mind, 

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you, is that any time you see a 
job posting or any time that 

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there's an opening internally 
for and, you know, a higher 

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level roll? 
It's because somebody really 

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wants someone to raise their 
hand and say, I'm ready for 

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that. 
Give it to me. 

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I'm going to do it. 
And here's why I can do it. 

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Like you don't have to have 
everything. 

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Perfect. 
Somebody really wants you to 

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raise your hand and say, yep, 
let me go. 

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I want to take it. 
And then your work is to 

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understand for yourself. 
Why will I be successful at that

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thing? 
Even if I haven't done that 

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00:19:30,200 --> 00:19:34,100
exact thing before, And that's 
part of them. 

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What you talk about, whether 
it's in your cover letter 

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00:19:37,600 --> 00:19:42,200
interview, or just having 
conversations, you know, one of 

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the greatest ways to move your 
career forward is to let other 

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people know what you have an 
appetite for. 

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Oh, I think I'd be really great 
at that. 

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Here's why I feel so eager feels
so ready to do this when you 

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start with that sense of self 
assurance, redness that sense of

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confidence people want to say 
yes to that because they want 

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00:20:10,000 --> 00:20:15,000
that Ashura Dennis and that 
confidence in that role they 

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00:20:15,000 --> 00:20:21,900
want to say yes, make it easy 
for them to say yes to you the 

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other way, I think about this, 
sometimes the idea that managing

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is a separate skill, even if 
you've been around it, if you've

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been managed, you've had 
Opinions about how people 

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00:20:33,400 --> 00:20:35,400
manage. 
Then you get in the driver's 

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00:20:35,400 --> 00:20:38,100
seat feels kind of different. 
I think about this too, around 

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sales. 
Like you can be really good at 

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00:20:44,100 --> 00:20:47,300
buying things. 
I'm so good at buying things. 

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00:20:47,300 --> 00:20:51,400
I buy things all the time. 
If I groceries I buy coffee, you

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00:20:51,400 --> 00:20:56,800
know, I pay my cell, phone bill.
I'm, you know, I buy things like

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00:20:57,300 --> 00:20:59,700
it's my job. 
I'm so good at buying things 

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00:20:59,700 --> 00:21:02,600
really good at consuming super 
good. 

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00:21:03,400 --> 00:21:10,100
But then if you're asked to sell
something, people either love 

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00:21:10,100 --> 00:21:13,100
sales or They tend to freak out 
about it. 

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00:21:13,100 --> 00:21:15,700
Like oh my gosh, I don't know. 
I'm terrible at sales. 

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00:21:15,700 --> 00:21:20,200
I don't know how to sell really,
because you've been a part of a 

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00:21:20,200 --> 00:21:25,300
sales relationship for years. 
You've been on the buyer side, 

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00:21:26,100 --> 00:21:31,100
you've encountered salespeople 
people have sold things to you, 

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00:21:31,600 --> 00:21:38,100
you have you know, enjoyed 
buying things but of course 

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selling is a separate skill set.
Ling is a thing. 

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00:21:42,100 --> 00:21:48,300
You can learn to do just like 
managing people and then, you 

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00:21:48,300 --> 00:21:50,400
know, if you're great at sales 
and then you need to learn to 

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00:21:50,400 --> 00:21:52,300
manage people. 
That's also a different skill 

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00:21:52,300 --> 00:21:54,800
set but I want to give a little 
warm. 

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00:21:54,800 --> 00:22:01,600
Shout out to my sales team 
managers because I feel like you

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00:22:01,600 --> 00:22:05,300
know there's there's something 
kind of magical that happens 

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00:22:05,300 --> 00:22:08,300
around sales and especially 
people who feel called into 

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00:22:08,300 --> 00:22:11,400
leadership in sales because it's
so much about About 

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00:22:11,400 --> 00:22:15,400
relationships so much about 
energy so much about the 

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00:22:15,400 --> 00:22:19,100
invisible qualities, that make 
sales happen. 

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00:22:19,100 --> 00:22:24,900
So I'm just through this sound. 
I am seeing you and giving you a

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00:22:24,900 --> 00:22:29,200
little bit of high five. 
So managing people is a separate

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00:22:29,200 --> 00:22:32,900
skill, don't freak out. 
If you don't know that you'd 

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00:22:32,900 --> 00:22:35,600
like, if you realize, I don't 
know what I'm doing or freak 

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00:22:35,600 --> 00:22:37,800
out. 
It's fine, but don't live in the

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00:22:37,800 --> 00:22:41,100
freak out that's exhausting and 
it doesn't help you or anybody. 

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00:22:41,300 --> 00:22:43,300
You'll just get really, really 
tired. 

335
00:22:44,200 --> 00:22:47,700
You have options like you're 
listening to this podcast for 14

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00:22:48,300 --> 00:22:51,500
to reach out to me. 
Schedule a consult. 

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00:22:51,600 --> 00:22:54,300
Let's talk and get this sorted 
out for you. 

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00:22:54,600 --> 00:22:58,600
Oh, and extra bonus tip because 
it is the beginning of the year.

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00:22:59,200 --> 00:23:04,500
There are so many organizations 
that are sponsoring their 

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00:23:04,500 --> 00:23:09,100
employees to get coaching to get
training with me. 

341
00:23:09,600 --> 00:23:13,100
So that is something we in talk 
about to on your consult is the 

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00:23:13,100 --> 00:23:15,400
Strategic approach for how to do
that. 

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00:23:15,400 --> 00:23:19,600
How to advocate for yourself to 
get that and realizing that 

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00:23:19,600 --> 00:23:22,500
might be available to you. 
Mmm. 

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00:23:23,000 --> 00:23:28,200
And someone might be really, 
really glad that you are taking 

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00:23:28,200 --> 00:23:31,200
a leadership role in your own 
Career Development and saying, 

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00:23:31,200 --> 00:23:33,200
hey, I want to get better at 
this thing. 

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00:23:33,200 --> 00:23:35,900
I found someone to work with. 
Let's make that happen. 

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00:23:37,200 --> 00:23:40,000
So many options. 
All right, that is what I have 

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00:23:40,000 --> 00:23:43,200
for you today. 
I am glad that you are here, 

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00:23:43,300 --> 00:23:47,900
listening and learning and I 
will talk to you next time. 

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00:23:52,500 --> 00:23:56,500
Hey before you go if you like 
this podcast, please leave a 

353
00:23:56,500 --> 00:24:00,200
review. 
Tell me why you listen and what 

354
00:24:00,200 --> 00:24:02,400
has helped you? 
Thanks so much. 

355
00:24:02,500 --> 00:24:03,700
I'll see you next time.