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Welcome to the new manager 
podcast. 

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I'm your host, Kim nickel. 
Hello and welcome. 

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I'm glad you're here and I hope 
you're doing well. 

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I wanted to let you know that I 
am taking new clients. 

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So if you want to work with me, 
go into the show notes, you'll 

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find a link to schedule a 
consult directly on my calendar.

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We work together for six months 
and the reason why Is because 

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the coaching that we do together
is about Shifting. 

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The way, you're thinking, 
beginning to see things in a new

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light and then implementing the 
Insight on a regular basis. 

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You've had years of building up 
habits and patterns for how you 

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are at work and how you think of
yourself and those habits and 

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patterns are really familiar. 
Or so you're going to use them 

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all the time in the work that we
do as you're growing in becoming

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a more effective leader and 
feeling more authentic. 

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And confident in the way that 
you work with people, it helps 

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to have a regular touch point 
every week in order to help 

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establish some new patterns deal
with some of the fears that come

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up and just partner with you 
through the course of, you know,

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six months. 
Life the highs and the lows of 

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work and life as a human. 
So that's why I work with my 

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clients that way, I love it, 
it's really fun to see how you 

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can grow and change and really 
start to thrive in a new way 

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through the coaching we do. 
So if that sounds like something

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that you want, then book a 
consult. 

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Let's talk about it. 
All right. 

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Now let's get on to our episode 
today. 

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I want to talk With you about 
three things that I've seen my 

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clients deal with and I'm 
guessing that you're going to 

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deal with this to in the course 
of your life. 

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In the course of your career. 
They are anxiety, perfectionism 

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and problem-solving. 
And these are each things that 

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we tend to use. 
I think, especially early in our

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life and early in our career and
they can help us become 

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successful and reach a level of 
achievement. 

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Which means we're very reluctant
to let them go. 

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I had a client years ago and we 
were working on mindfulness for 

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her life and for her work and 
she had this moment where she 

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asked me, but we if I let go of 
my anxiety, will I stop 

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achieving things? 
Well, I stopped being productive

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and it was this really 
interesting light bulb moment 

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where she Aged even though she 
had a lot of anxiety, she was 

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relying on it, she was using it 
to drive her achievement and to 

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drive her success. 
And she had this belief to, 

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like, if I'm anxious, that means
I'm doing it, right? 

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Because everyone around me is 
also anxious. 

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Everyone around me, who seems 
successful, who is working at a 

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higher level. 
They all seem to be anxious all 

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the time. 
So, Felt weird to question. 

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Do I even need that anxiety in 
order to achieve and to 

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accomplish thing as she hadn't 
really seen someone who could 

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work at this high level and take
on this. 

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This more successful level in 
her organization and did it 

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without anxiety. 
And so that was one of the 

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things, the things we had to 
unwind and perfectionism to. 

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So I see this a lot where people
will come and they'll say I have

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this Perfectionism and it 
stresses me out and I'm always 

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worried and I'm always feeling 
not good enough because nothing 

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is ever quite perfect enough. 
But I feel like I need that in 

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order to be successful, if I'm 
not perfect, if I'm not striving

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for Perfection then, doesn't 
that mean? 

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I'll start slacking off if I'm 
aiming for Perfection. 

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Won't that make me 
detail-oriented? 

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Won't that make me? 
And so I can make sure that 

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everything is to the correct and
and perfect standard. 

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And what's so interesting? 
These things often go together 

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and they can be useful, they can
fuel success and our Drive in 

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our motivation. 
But what tends to happen is 

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that, when you rely on those 
exclusively that turns into 

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burnout, that turns into 
rumination where your mind won't

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stop thinking about how Not good
enough and all the things that 

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could go wrong and it actually 
then starts to undermine our 

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ability to think deeply to take 
a higher level perspective. 

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It makes us extremely risk of 
verse. 

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So then we're afraid of, you 
know, what will people think if 

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I do something and it's not 
perfect, we really start to hold

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ourselves back and when you then
become a manager, you end up 

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then holding others. 
To this exacting standard and 

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that can have a really kind of 
crushing effect on how people 

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feel about, you know, not 
feeling supported feeling 

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criticized all the time. 
If you've ever had a manager who

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was highly anxious and highly 
perfectionistic, it might have 

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been really challenging my 
clients that have had this 

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experience. 
Say, I feel like I can't ever do

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anything right. 
And so why even try nothing I 

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ever do is good enough. 
So you know my manager, no, only

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sees the things I don't do. 
Well, they never tell me what I 

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do. 
That they appreciate, they never

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tell me what I do do. 
Well, they just take that for 

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granted. 
And so we want to be really 

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mindful. 
We want to be aware of, you know

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what your own relationship is to
anxiety. 

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And perfectionism, and 
understand why we might actually

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choose to continue them even 
when we don't enjoy them. 

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But if If we perceive them as 
necessary to success 

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achievement, if we identify with
being a hard worker means that 

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I'm anxious and have this 
exacting perfectionism, that 

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makes it really difficult to let
go of them because then it kind 

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of threatens, our identity of 
being a hard worker. 

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And we think, well, I don't want
to be lazy, and I don't want to 

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be, you know, uncaring, you 
know, we can Of wrap up all 

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these stories into this big 
jumble and so part of what we 

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want to do is start to see. 
Well what is the actual effect? 

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And is it still something that 
you want? 

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Just because it was useful at 
one stage of your career and of 

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your life doesn't necessarily 
mean that it's serving you now 

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and I sometimes think of this 
like you could fuel your engine 

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with coal and it will work. 
It actually works very 

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effectively. 
Li like anxiety and 

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perfectionism, it's kind of like
coal in the engine definitely 

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can work. 
But over time there is a cost 

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that becomes more difficult to 
extract more costly to run it 

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ends up, you know, polluting 
your environment. 

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And what we can do is we can 
shift that energy source to 

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something that is going to be 
more sustainable and less 

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costly. 
So we can switch you to solar. 

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You can switch you to win, we 
can switch you to some kind of 

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combination of things. 
So you're still able to 

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accomplish and Achieve but now 
it's being driven from a 

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different place. 
This also connects to 

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problem-solving, so often early 
in career we think oh I have to 

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be a great Problem Solver and 
you know, even separate from 

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career in your own life and 
especially if you grew up where 

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maybe your household wasn't 
super stable. 

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Able or the adults in your life,
or not that reliable or not that

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trustworthy or, you know, they 
were just humans and not fully 

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present and, you know, they 
didn't receive the handbook of 

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had a perfectly, be an adult for
the particular human that you 

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are, you might have decided 
early in your life that it's up 

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to you to solve the problems of 
other people. 

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Or it's up to you to solve the 
problems that you encounter and 

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you went into this kind of 
hyper. 

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Problem-solving mode and you 
might have been rewarded for 

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being a problem. 
Solver, whether that meant you 

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were being the Diplomat in your 
family that D escalated the 

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stress and the tension or in 
your career being rewarded for 

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solving problems and doing that 
quickly now this can sound 

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really weird but what I want to 
tell you is that there can be a 

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time when focusing on problem 
solving Is not actually what is 

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needed. 
Now, let me give you a couple of

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examples. 
When you become a manager, 

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sometimes part of your job is to
help other people solve. 

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The problem, you might be able 
to solve it exactly quickly 

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easily on your own. 
But as the manager, your job is 

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actually to coach and manage and
train other people so that they 

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can learn how to do that 
themselves. 

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When you don't, then you become 
the bottleneck and you actually 

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start spending more time in the 
role of individual contributor 

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rather than in the role of 
strategic thinker and decision 

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maker and coach and the one who 
helps expand the capacity of 

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other people. 
Also, when we jump into 

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problem-solving, were often 
doing that based on our past 

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experience. 
And sometimes what is more 

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valuable is to slow down. 
On get really curious, do higher

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level thinking, so strategic 
thinking rather than reactive in

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the moment. 
Let me jump in to solve the 

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problem and part of the 
challenge as you go in your 

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career is learning how to 
discern between when is a 

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problem-solving mindset needed 
and actually, when is your 

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Isince and your curiosity and 
slowing down. 

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When is that needed? 
When is a different skill 

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needed. 
So, anxiety, perfectionism, 

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problem solving. 
All of these can be very useful 

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but we want to be mindful of 
when are they not? 

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When are they getting in the 
way? 

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And when you start to notice 
that you're going to want to 

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know how to think differently 
and you're going to After shift 

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your pattern into something new 
and this can be uncomfortable. 

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And this is often where a lot of
the coaching happens, which is 

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let's start to think about what 
else is possible. 

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So, here's what I want to offer,
three specific qualities or 

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three specific things you can 
reach for. 

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Instead, if you notice that your
tendency towards anxiety, 

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perfectionism, and 
problem-solving tend to be the 

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first or most present things for
you. 

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So number one, curiosity 
curiosity will help you with all

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three of these. 
Actually anxiety comes up when 

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we're thinking about the future 
and we have a fear about what 

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will happen and we have 
uncertainty and there's you know

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all the energy and things ayat e
starts to go really fast and 

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curiosity will help to slow the 
Mind down which is helpful 

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because it Brings you back into 
the present moment. 

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Like what is it? 
That we know what is it that we 

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have tended to? 
What is the thing? 

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We actually need to be worried 
about right now. 

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Sometimes, our anxiety gets us 
to solving problems way too 

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soon. 
Like you don't need to be 

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worried about that until you 
reach, you know, so much revenue

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or until you hire. 
So many people like, don't don't

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be worried about that. 
Yet. 

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It's kind of like if you have a 
kid and you're worried about 

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their college essay or their SAT
scores and it's like you don't 

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need to worry about that. 
On the day, you bring them home 

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from the hospital like it's too 
soon to worry about that. 

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There's a lot of other stuff 
that we need to focus on First 

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and actually if we tend to the 
things in the present, then they

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can roll into at to reducing 
Social Challenges about had, but

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the way we do that is by staying
Us by being present because that

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lets us actually draw in 
information rather than the 

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speculation that your creative 
mind will do when we're curious.

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It opens us up to receive more 
information more perspective, it

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lets us kind of slow down so we 
can get better thinking, more 

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perspective, more information 
and I found two that when we've 

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been driving our success with 
anxiety, and we think my gosh, 

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but if I don't have the anxiety,
Then, won't I start slacking 

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off. 
The answer is no, because you 

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are a curious, humid, and you 
are just interested. 

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You are really interested. 
And I wonder what would happen 

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if I got to make those kinds of 
decisions? 

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I wonder what would happen if we
did it this way? 

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I wonder if there's an easier 
and more effective and efficient

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way to accomplish this, the 
Curiosity. 

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Is a powerful engine. 
It's a powerful driver but it 

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requires us to step out of the 
anxiety so that we can kind of 

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sink into and Savor that 
Curiosity that doesn't feel 

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tightly wound but instead just 
feels interested and open and 

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creative. 
So with perfectionism, what will

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help there Is also the Curiosity
of this time, asking, I wonder 

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what's really required here? 
If you've ever heard some, you 

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know that phrase done is better 
than perfect. 

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When perfectionism gets to kind 
of controlling and the way that 

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we're thinking about it, we it 
can end up causing delay, delay,

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delay delay because nothing is 
ever perfect. 

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And what also happens is, you 
prevent yourself from learning 

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So if we say OK, Perfection 
might not be the goal. 

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What if learning was the goal? 
What if the way we improve? 

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Is actually, by discovering 
where the gaps are? 

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And the only way we're going to 
do that is by letting things 

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move forward imperfectly. 
So, bringing the Curiosity into 

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the room, asking yourself, what 
is truly required here? 

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What is really the level we need
to solve for here? 

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What are the specific 
requirements? 

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It's that are needed here and 
tending to those letting go of 

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the perfectionism because you 
can let detail-oriented be 

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driven by that Clarity. 
The Curiosity of what actually 

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needs to be addressed here. 
And when you realize, Well when 

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things don't go quite right, 
that's actually the most 

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valuable information, you can 
get because it it gives you real

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feedback, gives you real A not 
simply speculative data, right? 

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So getting out of the 
hyper-vigilance because 

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hyper-vigilance is often from 
this place of, I need to make 

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sure that nothing goes wrong 
when we have Clarity with some 

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curiosity, we think well there's
probably going to be something 

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that goes wrong that I'm not 
actually thinking about or 

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something that goes wrong in a 
way that I, you know, I was 

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expecting but not in this exact 
way or Just understanding. 

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Okay, this part might not go 
exactly to plan or kind of 

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expecting that there's a 
likelihood, that could happen. 

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So, here's how we'll address 
that if that comes up that 

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Clarity and that Curiosity can 
be a lot more effective than 

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kind of the straitjacket 
perfectionism. 

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Where nothing feels good enough 
and everything feels like, you 

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know, just feels heavy rather 
than understanding. 

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Okay. 
We're going Do it in this way. 

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I'm not going to be perfect 
about it and that's actually 

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great because that's the only 
way I'll get the learning and 

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the information. 
And this also, when you're in a 

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leadership role, the way that 
you model this for others 

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becomes really valuable. 
Because what can happen is that 

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when your team thinks, oh my 
gosh, my boss needs everything 

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to be perfect, one of the 
downsides to that is that people

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start to hide. 
They stop asking for support. 

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Port, they start to hide 
problems, which means they don't

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surface, until they've really 
escalated and become bigger. 

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So when you have the mentality, 
not so much. 

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We're going for a perfect but 
let's get clear about what the 

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standard is, what we need to do 
to reach it. 

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And then what happens, if 
something goes a bit sideways or

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something, isn't quite there, 
what do we do about that? 

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Then it can actually create more
open lines of communication and 

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it can Create a mindset of 
learning and a culture of 

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learning. 
And when you have people that 

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are really self-driven, and that
know that it's safe to learn. 

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That's amazing, like, that's 
great. 

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That also gets you better 
information because you have all

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of these mines that are working 
towards learning and Improvement

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and that aren't feeling like 
it's a penalty. 

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Like absence of perfection 
becomes a penalty. 

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So Clarity, curiosity can help 
as kind of an antidote or kind 

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of help you to to, you know, 
adjust the perfectionism dial 

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and then with problem solving 
remembering that sometimes 

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presence and that Curiosity, and
that Clarity that actually 

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becomes more valuable, that 
helps you to slow down. 

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It helps you to think better. 
It helps you to get out of the 

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rushing reactive. 
Like need to be right? 

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It's all on me mentality, and it
gets you more into. 

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Let me bring a higher quality of
attention into the situation. 

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Let me understand on a deeper 
level, what's going on? 

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Let me bring my presence here 
rather than my problem solving 

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and I'll just add that in your 
personal life as well presents 

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over problem-solving can be an 
Terribly effective way to 

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deepen, trust help people, and 
create a better relationship 

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with others. 
So, that's a, should be like, a 

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whole different conversation. 
But all I just want to leave you

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with is just the note that in 
your relationships with others, 

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even outside of work. 
Remember sometimes presence over

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problem. 
Solving is what helps it's like 

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when you go into Problem solving
mode with someone part of your 

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attention, leaves, the room. 
And sometimes the most helpful 

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thing you can do with someone is
simply remain with them, stay 

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present with them. 
You might be surprised that they

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can solve their own problem or 
it might simply be something 

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that is like an unsolvable 
conundrum, the situation that 

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they simply need to be with and 
deal with that doesn't have like

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a solution. 
It's just and here it is, but 

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I'm going to be with you through
this challenge so that is what I

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wanted to share with you today. 
Watch out for anxiety. 

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Perfectionism and problem 
solving, they are things that we

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sometimes learn and that we over
rely on. 

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We think our success is 
dependent upon them, which then 

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makes us reluctant to give them 
up. 

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So I want to offer to you that 
you can experience success. 

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And achievement without being 
driven by those qualities. 

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Instead, you want to cultivate 
your presence. 

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You want to cultivate your 
curiosity, you want to ask for 

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clarity. 
And when you do all of these, 

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what happens is, you start to 
feel more calm in your life 

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because you feel more equipped. 
And when you feel more calm, and

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when you feel more equipped, 
then you have this kind of 

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authentic. 
Since that simply emerges, it's 

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not performative, it's just like
who you are, it's who you're 

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being. 
When you're present, curious, 

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clear, and calm. 
So fascinating. 

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So that's what I wanted to share
with you today. 

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Thank you so much for listening.
I hope you have an amazing week 

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and I'll talk to you next time 
if you know, it's time to level 

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up, but you feel Really your 
perfectionism Self Doubt and 

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00:22:44,100 --> 00:22:47,700
uncertainty getting in the way 
then come work with me. 

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00:22:48,200 --> 00:22:51,600
We'll have six months of 
one-on-one coaching and it all 

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00:22:51,600 --> 00:22:57,900
starts by going to my website, 
chemicalguys.com coaching and 

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00:22:57,900 --> 00:23:01,700
joining my waitlist talk to you 
soon.

