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Welcome to the new manager 
podcast. 

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I'm your host, Kim nickel. 
Hello, and welcome. 

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I'm glad you're here. 
And I hope you're doing well 

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today. 
I wanted to start with a 

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celebration, a couple of my 
clients have started new jobs 

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very recently, and there are 
kind of two things about this 

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that I specifically wanted to 
share with you, with one of my 

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clients. 
They found their job and got 

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hired a lot faster than they 
thought it would happen. 

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Their expectation was based on 
the experience. 

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They had the last time they were
looking for a job, which was 

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about two years ago. 
And at the time it was more 

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challenging and that was just 
like a less pleasant experience.

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And so as they were approaching 
this current job search, they 

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were preparing for it to be 
unpleasant and for it to take a 

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long time and what they didn't 
realize was that the job market 

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has changed what they're looking
for was actually I'm going to 

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line up. 
Really nicely with something. 

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Somebody else was looking for 
and like the whole process just 

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happened a lot faster. 
And what we also did in the 

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course of our work together was 
talk through their career 

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Journey. 
So they could really feel more 

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clear and confident in sharing 
their story about the career 

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Direction. 
They had Chosen and the changes 

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along the way and why were they 
were really interested in this 

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new job and this new company in 
this new role and things. 

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A lot faster than they planned. 
And I thought this was such a 

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great reminder to share with 
you, which is we often have our 

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past experience, and then we put
it in front of our eyes and we 

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look at the present through the 
lens of the past. 

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Now, sometimes, this is helpful,
right? 

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It's one of the ways that we 
learn from our past but it's 

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helpful to be aware when you're 
doing it. 

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Because what can happen is you 
assume the experience you had 

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before is Going to be the 
default repeat of what's going 

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to happen going forward. 
And so, the reason that becomes 

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problematic is that you don't 
prepare for what's in front of 

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you. 
You're actually preparing for 

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the past because you're assuming
the past is going to happen 

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again, and it can be hard to see
this when we're in it. 

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And so I wanted to name that so 
that you can be aware of, are 

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you? 
Trying to plan for and prepare 

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for what is happening now. 
And what is like what you want 

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to have happen in the future. 
Are you doing that by putting 

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the lens of your past in front 
of you? 

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And it's like, you're actually 
trying to solve for something 

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from two years ago rather than 
simply being present in the 

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moment with what's happening now
and kind of letting go of the 

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expectations, that things will 
be. 

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Now the The way they were 
before. 

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So that was one thing. 
And the other thing is that I 

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have another client who also is 
starting a new job and it's a 

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big job with a big title and a 
big salary. 

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And one of the things they are 
finding is all of the 

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insecurities and proving that 
they had in the past. 

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It is still with them in the 
present. 

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And this I wanted to share it 
because this is something. 

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I see a lot to where we think 
all I really have to prove 

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myself. 
I really Them to believe that I 

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can do this. 
That I'm up for the task. 

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I'm ready for this new bigger 
responsibility. 

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And then what happens is, you 
get it and then you freak out, 

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you feel all that insecurity 
flare-up, you worried, you know,

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am I up for this? 
This is different than I've done

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before there. 
Are these unexpected challenges 

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or unexpected things that I 
didn't know, you know how it 

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would be. 
And what happens is that 

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insecurity that we have. 
Have flares up no matter what is

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happening around us. 
And we sometimes think, if I 

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have a big title if I have a big
salary, if I have a lot of 

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visibility, if I'm in the in the
driver's seat and I am in the 

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one who gets to make the 
decisions. 

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Then I will really feel 
confident because I must be good

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at what I'm doing in order to 
have this new job because what 

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we think is the reason people 
have big jobs with Salaries and 

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big responsibility that must be 
because they're really good at 

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what they do. 
And those are all things that 

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don't always go together and 
sometimes that in itself, can be

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incredibly disappointing when 
you realize, oh my gosh, all 

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these people who are working at 
this level. 

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Like they are also humans and 
they're not always quite good at

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what they do. 
It can sometimes feel like a 

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disappointment and kind of a 
shock. 

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And so I wanted to share that 
with you because if you are in a

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situation where you've gotten a 
promotion or you've gotten a new

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job or you've changed Industries
and you're so excited about it, 

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but you suddenly feel a big 
flare of insecurity and your 

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confidence feels really shaky. 
That is a normal thing and 

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that's something to solve. 
Internally rather than trying to

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get an external circumstance to 
solve for that insecurity. 

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You know, wherever you go, you 
bring yourself with you. 

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And so I wanted to share that 
with you because I know that's 

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going to help some of you 
listening today. 

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Now, the main thing I wanted to 
talk with you today about is 

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this concept that came up as I 
was coaching a few of my clients

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and It's it comes up especially 
as you move into your 

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professional life and you gain 
more experience and you start to

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rise into higher levels of 
leadership. 

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Like, that's where it really 
starts to show up. 

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But the seeds of it are planted 
much much earlier. 

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And it's the idea of learning 
through mimicking by mimicking, 

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what we see and trying to Do the
same verses learning through 

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creating by being internally 
creative and creating something 

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because you're interested in in 
what is possible. 

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And you have an idea for how it 
can go and learning through that

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way. 
Now, when we are young and by 

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Young, I mean, like, when you're
born, we're gonna go way back. 

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One of the first ways that we 
learn like the method for 

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learning is by observing others 
and then trying to mimic what we

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see, this is how we learn to 
speak. 

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Write like you're a little baby 
and there are adults saying 

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things to you, trying to get you
to mimic them, trying to get you

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to repeat back to them. 
Like that's how we And when you 

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get a little bit older, you see 
people walking and you try to 

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mimic that, you see it, and you 
try to repeat it and do it for 

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yourself. 
And so, very, very early on. 

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We learn that being observant 
noticing how other people are 

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doing things or how other people
are being and then attempting to

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mimic that for ourselves is a 
way to learn and what becomes a 

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little bit tricky. 
Is it requires that somebody 

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outside of you is establishing a
standard and then your job is to

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meet that standard and 
traditionally School kind of 

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works like that too. 
Or even learning to play an 

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instrument. 
Right? 

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Like someone, you know, gives 
you a standard gives you a 

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scales gives you, you know, 
something to play and shows you 

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what, you know, how to hold the 
instrument or how to I took 

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piano. 
So I didn't have to hold the 

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piano but someone showed me. 
No, here's where you rest your 

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hands. 
And here's how you, you know, 

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have your elbows and here's how 
you, you know, do your scales to

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practice the fingering in the 
movement. 

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And so someone else, establishes
a standard and then your job is 

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to learn how to do that, how to 
meet that standard, and then you

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are evaluated against your 
ability to replicate, or to 

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accurately mimic. 
Fuck that behavior or that 

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standard and as we grow up, what
ends up happening is we compare 

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ourselves to others. 
We look outside. 

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We see other people and assume 
that they are demonstrating the 

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standard, like the standard and 
your job is to comply and to 

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mimic that and to replicate that
for yourself and then you You 

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decide internally, whether you 
are doing a good job or not, 

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whether you are on track or not,
based on what you see other 

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people doing. 
And we do this in careers, 

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right? 
Like comparing ourselves to our 

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friends or our peers, and making
decisions about how you feel 

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about how you're doing based on 
what where you see other people.

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We also do this in our 
relationships. 

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So if a lot of your friends are 
getting married and you are not,

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and you might think, oh my gosh,
am I behind is something wrong 

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with me? 
Am I off track? 

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Because we tend to internalize 
this kind of standard or 

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template of how things are 
supposed to be. 

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And we can be so hooked in to a 
sense of, you know, being 

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rewarded or being on track or 
feeling like we're doing a good 

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job based on that comparison. 
And one of the other ways, this 

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shows up specifically in the 
workplace. 

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Is that if you, you know, look 
around And you and especially if

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you're looking up, right? 
Like you're thinking about what 

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will my life and career look, 
like a few years, down the road.

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And you might look at, you know,
we'll who seems to be very 

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successful and success might be,
you know, the salary they make 

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success might be the kind of 
decisions. 

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They get to make success might 
be the kind of projects, they 

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get to work on. 
However, you define that you'll 

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look around. 
You'll see. 

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See, okay, if I stay here in 
this industry, or in this 

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organization, what success is 
available to me? 

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And you'll kind of look around. 
And you'll assume that what 

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you're seeing is what's 
available and that if you want 

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to be successful, it will have 
to look like what you see around

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you. 
You'll assume that you will need

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to mimic or replicate. 
What you see around you and I 

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had a client very recently, who 
was grappling with this and she 

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is at this high level in her 
organization and was having a 

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career conversation with her 
boss and her boss said, hey, 

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have you thought about going for
partner and she thought about it

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and she kind of hesitated 
actually because she thought 

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well, like I see people at the 
partner level and it doesn't 

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look like they're doing any of 
the fun. 

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Work that I like to do. 
It seems like all they do is 

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business development. 
They're not actually doing the 

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design and running the projects.
They're doing a lot more of this

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other kind of work that I'm not 
interested in. 

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And they also seem really busy 
and not that happy. 

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And she thought, like, if that's
what it needs to be, you know, 

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work at the partner level or 
Torque at the principal level, 

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where I'd have to give up the 
work. 

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I actually like doing and I 
would be even busier and it 

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would not be that much. 
Hon. 

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I don't know that. 
I want that. 

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And so what we've been working 
on is noticing. 

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Oh, right. 
Like, this is you doing that 

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mimicking, like seeing what's 
outside? 

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Comparing yourself to that? 
And assuming that what you see 

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is the only option rather than 
asking yourself. 

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Well, if you are going to be 
partner, or if you are going to 

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be principal, what would you 
want that to look like? 

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What kind of partner would you 
want to be? 

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What kind of principal would you
want to be? 

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How would you want that to work?
And considering the possibility 

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that you could actually create 
that? 

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Just because you don't see, it 
doesn't mean it's not possible. 

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But as humans we tend to 
overlook this, right? 

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Like, what we see tends to 
solidify as that's what's 

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available and I have to choose 
from that. 

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It can be trickier to feel like 
there is room to design and 

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create. 
Your own version of that. 

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So if mimicking and learning by 
mimicking and learning by 

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replication and learning, by 
comparing to an external 

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standard, that someone else has 
established. 

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Like if that's kind of where we 
start and it's helpful sometimes

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what other Alternatives do we 
have? 

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And this is where I want to 
share the possibility of 

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creating and learning through. 
Shannon rather than from 

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replication or mimicking. 
So, when we're learning by 

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creating, what we do is we look 
to others as one example of how 

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it can go not as the example or 
the standard and it's no longer 

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your job to meet that. 
Now, looking at others, just 

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becomes information that can be 
really interesting. 

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Just noticing. 
Okay. 

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So this is how I'm seeing it 
done or this is you know, how 

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I'm noticing. 
Some people do it and then you 

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ask yourself. 
What is it that I want? 

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How is it that I would want to 
do this? 

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Like what are the pieces that I 
would want to have be a part of 

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this? 
If I were going to do it in my 

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style or in my voice? 
What would that be like? 

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And the hardest part about that 
is our instinct when? 

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You've gotten really good at 
mimicking, others. 

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It's so hard to trust that your 
own ideas are as worthy and 

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valuable and that they will 
work. 

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So that's that's the work that 
we do is to kind of unwind that 

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story because when you start to 
get curious, like if trusting 

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that your own ideas are also as 
valuable and as possible as what

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you see, modeled some Times that
can be a hard. 

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Leap can feel like a leap of 
faith. 

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It can feel very risky and very 
scary. 

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So where you start is you just 
start to get curious. 

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You ask yourself. 
How would I want this to go? 

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What might be possible? 
What is, you know, the ultimate 

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results that I want to create 
and what are all the different 

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ways that I could create that? 
Even if it's something that I'm 

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not seeing other people do and 
we just start with that 

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Curiosity and then you begin To 
create it. 

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So one of my clients wanted to 
create in her life, no meeting 

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Fridays and it felt kind of 
risky because she didn't see 

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anybody else in her organization
doing that. 

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But we said okay, if you got to 
choose how your schedule worked 

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like, what is the schedule that 
would be most supportive for the

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work that you do and for the way
that you want to live, and she 

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said, I want no meeting Fridays.
I want time for Focus work. 

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I want time for deep thinking. 
Gagging, I just want to have 

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that time at the end of the week
where I'm not in meetings all 

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day. 
So what happens? 

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Somebody asks her if she can 
meet on a Friday, what she did 

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was she responded to this person
and she said, hey, I'm trying 

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out. 
No meeting Fridays. 

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Can we schedule for you know? 
Next Monday afternoon instead? 

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And the person said, oh, yeah. 
Good for you. 

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Of course we can it was no big 
deal. 

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So she got curious, right? 
Like, how do I want my schedule 

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to work? 
And she started to create it. 

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Let's see if we can actually 
make this happen. 

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And so as you start to take 
these small steps and you start 

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to build your trust in what is 
possible and you start to learn 

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as you go, what really works for
you. 

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And this is so cool. 
Because what it means is, as you

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go instead of comparing yourself
to what you see, other people 

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doing and assuming that, what 
they're doing, is what you 

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should be doing. 
Doing or that what they have is,

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what you should have. 
What happens when you are doing 

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this from creation, is that you 
check in with yourself you check

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in with your results. 
And you ask is this creating 

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what I want rather than 
comparing yourself to others and

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feeling like you're, you know, 
behind or off track according to

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somebody else because the other 
thing that happens, especially 

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as we get older, Older in life 
is that if you are continuing to

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work primarily from mimicking 
and from replicating, what 

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happens is you get really good 
at creating a life and a career 

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that you might not even want. 
Like you can feel the sense of 

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reward of I did it. 
I'm on track but you never 

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paused to ask is this even 
something that I truly want for 

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myself? 
And as a human, you learn more 

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and more about yourself every 
year of your life. 

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And in your career, you 
absolutely learn more and more 

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about yourself. 
I have a new neighbor and we met

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yesterday because he 
accidentally locked himself out 

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of his apartment. 
So, he rang my doorbell and like

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I had helped him kind of get 
sorted out, but he told me that 

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he used to work in mining and he
was, Are going to grad school to

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learn how to build tunnels and 
he said, yeah, I just got tired 

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of living so far away from 
everybody and he wanted to do 

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work. 
That was closer to people in 

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closer to town and I thought. 
Yep. 

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This is exactly what we do. 
We get interested in something. 

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We go down One path and you 
learn more about yourself as you

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go and you learn more about what
you want. 

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And it's not that you were 
wrong. 

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Long before like, with my 
neighbor. 

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It's not that it was wrong that 
he, you know, he didn't make a 

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mistake in going into mining. 
Right? 

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Like he said, a goal, he 
achieved it and along the way. 

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He learned some new things about
himself. 

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I think this is true for all of 
us in our careers. 

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Yes. 
There are a few folks who know, 

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at a very early age like this is
what I'm going to do. 

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And they have that Clarity. 
That was not me and that's not 

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most of the people I know and 
work with. 

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So I'm That might also be true 
for you. 

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So when you are creating you 
release, the comparing yourself 

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to others and you also release 
the story that you're behind and

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you decide what you want based 
on your vision by checking, in 

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with yourself, as you go and by 
experimenting and trying things 

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along the way. 
And what's amazing is that it is

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so surprising what is actually 
possible, and what you can 

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create. 
Because you're always learning 

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more about yourself and the 
world and your industry. 

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Or if you change careers, like 
there's so much that's available

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when we start to kind of soften 
our grip on the template that we

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think we have to follow. 
When we realize that other 

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people are showing us examples 
of what's possible, but it's not

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a complete set and so you don't 
have to comply or Or adhere to 

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what you think you're supposed 
to do, or what you think, your 

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career is supposed to look like,
you can actually create 

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something that is so tailor-made
for you. 

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That supports your goals 
professionally and financially 

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00:21:19,400 --> 00:21:23,100
and in your personal life and it
might look different than how 

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00:21:23,100 --> 00:21:27,300
you thought it would. 
And that's okay doesn't mean 

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that you're behind doesn't mean 
that anything is gone wrong. 

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It just means that you are 
leading the way. 

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You are in Creative territory. 
You are charting A, New Path and

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00:21:41,800 --> 00:21:47,400
you are inspiring and lighting a
path for others. 

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00:21:48,000 --> 00:21:50,300
So that is what I wanted to 
share with you today. 

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00:21:50,700 --> 00:21:53,300
Thank you so much for being 
here. 

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00:21:53,300 --> 00:21:56,300
Thank you for listening. 
I hope you have a great week and

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00:21:56,300 --> 00:22:04,000
I'll talk to you next time. 
If you know, it's time to level 

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00:22:04,000 --> 00:22:07,900
f. 
You feel your perfectionism Self

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00:22:07,900 --> 00:22:10,200
Doubt and uncertainty getting in
the way. 

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00:22:10,600 --> 00:22:14,100
Then come work with me. 
We'll have six months of 

341
00:22:14,100 --> 00:22:18,100
one-on-one coaching and it all 
starts by going to my website, 

342
00:22:18,200 --> 00:22:24,400
chemicalguys.com coaching and 
joining my waitlist. 

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00:22:24,800 --> 00:22:26,000
Talk to you soon.
