1
00:00:04,800 --> 00:00:07,600
Welcome to the new manager 
podcast. 

2
00:00:07,700 --> 00:00:17,100
I'm your host, Kim nickel. 
Hello and welcome. 

3
00:00:17,300 --> 00:00:21,500
I am so glad that you're here. 
And I want to be very honest 

4
00:00:21,500 --> 00:00:28,000
with you and tell you that I 
recorded this episode and then 

5
00:00:28,000 --> 00:00:29,400
the more I was thinking about 
it. 

6
00:00:29,400 --> 00:00:32,000
The more I realized there was 
something else. 

7
00:00:32,000 --> 00:00:35,300
I wanted to include and so, I 
decided to do the whole thing 

8
00:00:35,300 --> 00:00:40,600
again, so you're getting a an 
updated. 

9
00:00:41,300 --> 00:00:46,400
And I guess the bonus lesson I 
want to offer in that is there's

10
00:00:46,400 --> 00:00:48,700
only so much pre-planning you 
can do. 

11
00:00:48,700 --> 00:00:54,100
And at some point the doing of 
the thing is the learning of the

12
00:00:54,100 --> 00:00:56,000
thing. 
There are so many ways. 

13
00:00:56,000 --> 00:00:59,000
You hear that lesson in the 
course of career and especially 

14
00:00:59,000 --> 00:01:03,200
if you're in the startup space, 
the whole obsession with 

15
00:01:03,200 --> 00:01:07,300
shipping a minimum viable 
product is because, whatever 

16
00:01:07,300 --> 00:01:11,300
idea you have, you want to make 
it and let people engage with 

17
00:01:11,300 --> 00:01:14,500
With it because that's how you 
will learn how to improve it and

18
00:01:14,500 --> 00:01:16,700
what to make. 
And when you think about your 

19
00:01:16,700 --> 00:01:19,500
career, and when you think about
leadership, and when you think 

20
00:01:19,500 --> 00:01:22,500
about the decisions you make 
around your life. 

21
00:01:23,100 --> 00:01:25,800
I want to offer the same concept
applies. 

22
00:01:25,800 --> 00:01:29,900
Like in the same way that I had 
an idea for an episode. 

23
00:01:30,100 --> 00:01:32,100
I recorded it. 
I created it. 

24
00:01:32,200 --> 00:01:36,300
And the process of doing that 
got me thinking more deeply 

25
00:01:36,300 --> 00:01:38,900
about it. 
And then I realized there was 

26
00:01:38,900 --> 00:01:42,200
more I wanted to share. 
And so you're getting This 

27
00:01:42,200 --> 00:01:47,700
revised and updated version. 
I mean, this is huge just to 

28
00:01:47,700 --> 00:01:51,400
remember because especially if 
you are a little bit of a 

29
00:01:51,400 --> 00:01:55,800
perfectionist and you hold 
yourself to a high standard that

30
00:01:55,800 --> 00:02:00,400
can work against you, when you 
hold yourself, back trying to 

31
00:02:00,400 --> 00:02:07,000
get things, perfect, in theory, 
rather than creating it engaging

32
00:02:07,000 --> 00:02:11,000
with it in the world and then 
making new decisions. 

33
00:02:11,300 --> 00:02:15,300
Based on the experience that you
have had in the course of 

34
00:02:15,300 --> 00:02:17,000
creating it. 
Releasing it. 

35
00:02:18,200 --> 00:02:24,100
So the main topic for today is 
this concept of leadership like 

36
00:02:24,200 --> 00:02:32,900
a DJ and I came to this metaphor
having gone through a few 

37
00:02:32,900 --> 00:02:37,400
experiences, where either 
leadership changed or I was 

38
00:02:37,400 --> 00:02:40,000
working with a team who is 
struggling with leadership 

39
00:02:40,000 --> 00:02:43,900
changing. 
As a coach with my clients and 

40
00:02:43,900 --> 00:02:47,900
they step into leadership roles 
and they are asking a lot of 

41
00:02:47,900 --> 00:02:51,000
questions about how to do it 
well, and how to do it, 

42
00:02:51,000 --> 00:02:54,400
effectively. 
And a lot of comparison of 

43
00:02:54,400 --> 00:02:58,700
themself to other leaders and 
wondering, how can they be 

44
00:02:58,700 --> 00:03:01,500
authentic? 
Or should they be like the 

45
00:03:01,500 --> 00:03:07,300
person who was in the role 
before, and this concept of 

46
00:03:07,300 --> 00:03:11,600
leadership like a DJ 
essentially, is this If I want 

47
00:03:11,600 --> 00:03:17,200
you to imagine that you are at a
party or you're at a dance club 

48
00:03:17,300 --> 00:03:19,700
and there's a DJ, and they're 
playing this music, and 

49
00:03:19,700 --> 00:03:23,600
everybody is getting with the 
groove and having a good time 

50
00:03:23,600 --> 00:03:26,900
and they are dancing. 
And it's a lovely moment and 

51
00:03:26,900 --> 00:03:31,400
then there's a new day. 
Jay so current, DJ leaves, new g

52
00:03:31,400 --> 00:03:35,100
day steps up to the deck, start 
spinning, some music, and 

53
00:03:35,100 --> 00:03:39,300
there's a little bit of this 
moment where everyone kind of 

54
00:03:39,300 --> 00:03:41,200
pauses and it's a little bit 
awkward. 

55
00:03:41,300 --> 00:03:45,000
Awkward because everyone's 
trying to decide like, how do I 

56
00:03:45,000 --> 00:03:48,300
dance to this? 
Do I want to dance to this? 

57
00:03:48,400 --> 00:03:53,400
Can I still get with this or do 
I need to take a break or maybe 

58
00:03:53,400 --> 00:04:01,800
even leave completely and every 
leader brings their own music, 

59
00:04:01,800 --> 00:04:07,600
their own tone, their own kind 
of guiding principles, whether 

60
00:04:07,600 --> 00:04:10,600
they are clearly articulated or 
not. 

61
00:04:11,300 --> 00:04:15,600
They bring this and what will 
happen is everyone will have 

62
00:04:15,600 --> 00:04:18,700
this moment of pause as they're 
trying to figure out. 

63
00:04:19,000 --> 00:04:21,000
What is it. 
That is important to this 

64
00:04:21,000 --> 00:04:23,900
person. 
What are the results that will 

65
00:04:23,900 --> 00:04:30,500
be measured what has changed 
when leadership changes and 

66
00:04:30,600 --> 00:04:37,800
depending on how close you sit 
to that leadership role. 

67
00:04:37,900 --> 00:04:41,100
It will affect you differently. 
So if you're in a really big 

68
00:04:41,300 --> 00:04:43,900
Organization. 
There might be a change in 

69
00:04:43,900 --> 00:04:46,100
leadership. 
And if you're very distant from 

70
00:04:46,100 --> 00:04:50,300
that role, then you might not 
really be affected at all. 

71
00:04:50,500 --> 00:04:52,400
And sometimes, this can be 
great. 

72
00:04:52,400 --> 00:04:56,300
It can be the sense of, I know 
exactly what my job is. 

73
00:04:56,600 --> 00:05:00,900
I know what I am supposed to 
focus on and it doesn't really 

74
00:05:00,900 --> 00:05:06,400
matter who is sitting in what 
chair because I know where my 

75
00:05:06,400 --> 00:05:09,800
expertise is, and I know what my
job is to do. 

76
00:05:10,500 --> 00:05:14,900
So Times leaders can change and 
you're not terribly affected by 

77
00:05:14,900 --> 00:05:19,200
the, you know, the the new DJ 
and then you music other times. 

78
00:05:19,200 --> 00:05:26,200
It can be a significant change. 
Maybe you are part of the hiring

79
00:05:26,200 --> 00:05:30,600
team. 
Maybe you had input about who 

80
00:05:30,600 --> 00:05:33,900
would be brought in to this new 
leadership role. 

81
00:05:34,300 --> 00:05:39,800
Maybe you had a very close 
relationship with the previous 

82
00:05:39,800 --> 00:05:44,100
leader and now is Ones coming 
in, you might feel like you have

83
00:05:44,100 --> 00:05:49,800
to rebuild trust and understand.
Are we on the same page? 

84
00:05:49,800 --> 00:05:53,800
Like what will be different? 
Now that there's a new leader, 

85
00:05:53,800 --> 00:05:59,000
in this role setting the tone 
changing the music, refocusing 

86
00:05:59,000 --> 00:06:02,700
the Strategic priorities. 
There can be a lot of questions 

87
00:06:03,200 --> 00:06:08,900
and that change in leadership 
may have a very significant 

88
00:06:09,300 --> 00:06:15,000
effect on you. 
And it may even be a situation 

89
00:06:15,000 --> 00:06:21,300
where you decide to leave the 
organization because you're not 

90
00:06:21,600 --> 00:06:24,900
really feeling connected to the 
new leadership. 

91
00:06:25,700 --> 00:06:30,000
You're not really feeling the 
music that they are playing and 

92
00:06:30,000 --> 00:06:34,500
you've decided you want to do 
something else again, which is 

93
00:06:34,500 --> 00:06:37,300
fine. 
It's just interesting to notice.

94
00:06:37,600 --> 00:06:41,900
So this idea of leadership like 
a DJ and you know, You are 

95
00:06:41,900 --> 00:06:44,800
thinking about how you show up 
as a leader. 

96
00:06:45,100 --> 00:06:48,900
It also becomes helpful to think
in terms of what is the music 

97
00:06:48,900 --> 00:06:51,700
that you're bringing? 
What is the tone that you're 

98
00:06:51,700 --> 00:06:54,800
bringing? 
And it might be different. 

99
00:06:54,900 --> 00:06:58,200
And sometimes, that's fantastic.
You can be the breath of fresh 

100
00:06:58,200 --> 00:07:01,800
air, or you can be the one who 
brings Clarity or before there 

101
00:07:01,800 --> 00:07:04,600
had been confusion. 
But also, if you are 

102
00:07:04,600 --> 00:07:10,900
experiencing resistance, if you 
are experiencing a team, that is

103
00:07:10,900 --> 00:07:14,900
not not really getting with the 
groove of what you're showing up

104
00:07:14,900 --> 00:07:17,000
with. 
It can be helpful to think in 

105
00:07:17,000 --> 00:07:21,100
those terms rather than simply 
writing people off or being 

106
00:07:21,100 --> 00:07:24,400
really hard on yourself. 
It can invite you to have a 

107
00:07:24,400 --> 00:07:27,500
conversation around. 
What is it that's changing. 

108
00:07:27,500 --> 00:07:32,500
And why, as you know, if you've 
listened to my earlier episodes,

109
00:07:33,300 --> 00:07:37,400
people are selfish and I don't 
mean this in a negative way or a

110
00:07:37,400 --> 00:07:40,900
bad way, but especially when you
are leading or when you are in 

111
00:07:40,900 --> 00:07:43,900
the man. 
General people are wondering. 

112
00:07:44,100 --> 00:07:47,700
How does this affect me? 
If you're stepping in as a new 

113
00:07:47,700 --> 00:07:51,400
leader, people want to know. 
How will this new leader affect 

114
00:07:51,400 --> 00:07:53,900
me? 
Will I be evaluated along the 

115
00:07:53,900 --> 00:07:58,200
same criteria will expectations 
change. 

116
00:07:58,300 --> 00:08:00,700
Are we moving in the same 
direction? 

117
00:08:00,700 --> 00:08:03,500
Or will this leader? 
Make decisions about where we're

118
00:08:03,500 --> 00:08:05,100
going? 
And how we'll get there. 

119
00:08:05,400 --> 00:08:09,100
And we'll, I understand how I 
fit in and we'll I want to be a 

120
00:08:09,100 --> 00:08:13,600
part of this. 
All of these questions that come

121
00:08:13,600 --> 00:08:18,000
back to us, really just as 
humans wanting to do good work, 

122
00:08:18,000 --> 00:08:22,100
wanting to feel respected and 
valued and appreciated and it 

123
00:08:22,100 --> 00:08:27,900
can be really easy to overlook. 
The fact that all of this is 

124
00:08:27,900 --> 00:08:31,800
going on. 
Most of the time kind of behind 

125
00:08:31,800 --> 00:08:34,299
the scenes. 
Like it's the questions people 

126
00:08:34,299 --> 00:08:38,500
wonder but they might not even 
bring it up specifically. 

127
00:08:38,500 --> 00:08:43,500
So when you are thinking about, 
That what does it mean to be a 

128
00:08:43,500 --> 00:08:49,100
leader or if your leadership is 
changing asking that question? 

129
00:08:49,100 --> 00:08:53,000
Okay, like if we're getting a 
new DJ, how do I feel about the 

130
00:08:53,000 --> 00:08:54,300
music? 
I'm hearing? 

131
00:08:54,600 --> 00:09:00,600
Do I want to dance to this or do
I feel like I am a gentle? 

132
00:09:00,600 --> 00:09:04,600
No to that and I'll find 
something else to do. 

133
00:09:05,200 --> 00:09:08,700
So here are a couple of things. 
I want to I want to share with 

134
00:09:08,700 --> 00:09:13,700
you and with respect to this. 
Is that when a new leader comes 

135
00:09:13,700 --> 00:09:15,400
in? 
There are a few specific 

136
00:09:15,400 --> 00:09:18,900
questions that will come to 
mind. 

137
00:09:20,400 --> 00:09:22,400
That people will want to know of
a leader. 

138
00:09:22,800 --> 00:09:26,300
For example, how do you see 
things? 

139
00:09:27,700 --> 00:09:30,500
When a new leader comes in, 
people want to know, how do you 

140
00:09:30,500 --> 00:09:33,100
see things? 
This is a question about 

141
00:09:33,100 --> 00:09:39,500
perspective and a perspective, a
question of worldview related to

142
00:09:39,500 --> 00:09:42,800
this. 
They want to know what are your 

143
00:09:42,800 --> 00:09:46,200
guiding principles? 
And especially when we're 

144
00:09:46,200 --> 00:09:50,700
speaking in a language like oh 
this leader is very data-driven.

145
00:09:50,800 --> 00:09:53,700
They say, oh, I'm happy to be 
your new manager. 

146
00:09:53,700 --> 00:09:57,700
I'm a very data driven person. 
People still want to know, Like,

147
00:09:57,700 --> 00:10:00,500
what does that mean specifically
and what are your guiding 

148
00:10:00,500 --> 00:10:05,200
principles around that data 
around how we get it around? 

149
00:10:05,200 --> 00:10:10,900
How we use it around? 
Which data do we value or 

150
00:10:10,900 --> 00:10:15,100
prioritize? 
Like, people want to know what, 

151
00:10:15,100 --> 00:10:20,300
what the guiding principles are 
similar related to this. 

152
00:10:20,300 --> 00:10:26,800
What do you pay attention to? 
What do you pay attention to? 

153
00:10:27,600 --> 00:10:30,600
Because what you pay attention 
to will often shape what the 

154
00:10:30,600 --> 00:10:33,600
expectations are. 
And also the sense of what is 

155
00:10:33,600 --> 00:10:39,600
it, that matters here, and this 
becomes also very significant 

156
00:10:39,800 --> 00:10:42,200
around. 
You know, how with the culture 

157
00:10:42,200 --> 00:10:46,800
and how do we treat one another?
So if there is, you know, one 

158
00:10:46,800 --> 00:10:54,300
person whose ideas are always 
discounted or a voice that is 

159
00:10:54,800 --> 00:10:57,200
always or consistently 
overlooked. 

160
00:10:57,400 --> 00:11:01,700
Or a voice that is always 
deferred to. 

161
00:11:02,700 --> 00:11:05,500
We're always looking, you know, 
as humans. 

162
00:11:05,500 --> 00:11:08,800
Like where does the leader pay 
attention? 

163
00:11:08,800 --> 00:11:11,700
What is it that they value? 
Where is their attention going? 

164
00:11:12,300 --> 00:11:15,600
If you want to look at it in 
more of a negative mindset. 

165
00:11:15,600 --> 00:11:19,200
That's also the part of you that
might feel like a little kid. 

166
00:11:19,200 --> 00:11:21,700
That wonders. 
What can I get away with? 

167
00:11:24,200 --> 00:11:26,200
Right. 
For reading really honest. 

168
00:11:26,200 --> 00:11:28,100
It plays out in that direction, 
too. 

169
00:11:29,500 --> 00:11:32,700
Also, we want to know what is 
important to you. 

170
00:11:33,400 --> 00:11:37,600
Whenever a new leader comes in. 
What is important to you? 

171
00:11:38,700 --> 00:11:40,800
This relates again to, like, 
what are your guiding 

172
00:11:40,800 --> 00:11:42,700
principles? 
How do you see things? 

173
00:11:42,700 --> 00:11:47,800
What do you pay attention to? 
What, what can we get away with?

174
00:11:48,400 --> 00:11:51,600
So, all of these questions are 
in play and whenever there's 

175
00:11:51,600 --> 00:11:54,100
that new person, that moment 
where you're kind of feeling 

176
00:11:54,100 --> 00:11:56,400
into like, is this music I can 
get with? 

177
00:11:57,000 --> 00:12:00,200
It's because we're trying to And
and fill in those questions for 

178
00:12:00,200 --> 00:12:02,800
ourselves. 
So I want to give you a specific

179
00:12:02,800 --> 00:12:05,800
example of how I've encountered 
this in my own career. 

180
00:12:06,600 --> 00:12:08,800
Many years ago. 
I worked for a start-up. 

181
00:12:09,000 --> 00:12:14,300
We were maybe 12 people, maybe 
18, kind of depended on, you 

182
00:12:14,300 --> 00:12:17,900
know, when, in the year it was. 
So, but relatively small group 

183
00:12:18,200 --> 00:12:21,200
and we had this leader, the 
founder of the company. 

184
00:12:21,200 --> 00:12:28,100
His name is Tom, and one of the 
things he declared, like one of 

185
00:12:28,100 --> 00:12:33,100
the things, Things. 
He said to us was that when we 

186
00:12:33,200 --> 00:12:44,400
sell, when we mark it, we do not
sell through fear, shame or 

187
00:12:44,400 --> 00:12:50,100
guilt, that was part of how he 
saw things. 

188
00:12:50,100 --> 00:12:53,400
That was part of his guiding 
principle, which is as a company

189
00:12:53,800 --> 00:12:57,300
that is wanting to amplify and 
contribute in a positive way. 

190
00:12:57,700 --> 00:13:04,500
We will not Do that by tapping 
in to our customers fear. 

191
00:13:04,900 --> 00:13:09,400
We won't leverage their shame. 
We won't amplify a feeling of 

192
00:13:09,400 --> 00:13:12,900
guilt in order to drive them to 
a buying behavior. 

193
00:13:13,700 --> 00:13:17,500
And this was a choice that he 
made and then we could all 

194
00:13:17,500 --> 00:13:20,500
aligned to that. 
And I thought this was 

195
00:13:20,500 --> 00:13:25,100
incredible because, you know, as
you know, probably because 

196
00:13:25,100 --> 00:13:27,800
you're a human who buys things 
in the world, whether it's 

197
00:13:27,800 --> 00:13:29,900
toothpaste. 
A store, a college degree or 

198
00:13:29,900 --> 00:13:31,700
whatever. 
There are a lot of different 

199
00:13:31,700 --> 00:13:36,400
emotions that drive buying 
behavior and fear. 

200
00:13:36,400 --> 00:13:38,600
Shame and guilt are very 
effective. 

201
00:13:38,900 --> 00:13:42,000
Like, if you amplify that 
enough, you can then sell 

202
00:13:42,000 --> 00:13:45,300
someone a solution. 
And I mean, it works, right? 

203
00:13:45,300 --> 00:13:49,100
That's why we see a lot of 
advertising and a lot of sales 

204
00:13:49,100 --> 00:13:53,500
practices whether, you know, 
their intentional or not like 

205
00:13:53,500 --> 00:13:55,800
it's effective and it works. 
So it's something that we see a 

206
00:13:55,800 --> 00:14:01,100
lot. 
So, with Tom And his role as the

207
00:14:01,100 --> 00:14:06,000
leader who is setting the tone, 
right, like setting that the 

208
00:14:06,000 --> 00:14:11,000
music, he said we don't do this,
he just decided. 

209
00:14:11,900 --> 00:14:15,600
And so when we then thought 
about, you know, what do we pay 

210
00:14:15,600 --> 00:14:19,900
attention to so much of what we 
were doing in the way that we 

211
00:14:19,900 --> 00:14:22,100
work together? 
And also the actions we were 

212
00:14:22,100 --> 00:14:27,400
taking as we were Building 
Product out and testing it with 

213
00:14:27,400 --> 00:14:30,200
customers. 
Is we were paying attention to 

214
00:14:30,700 --> 00:14:35,500
what are the choices were making
that ignite different emotions 

215
00:14:35,500 --> 00:14:42,300
with our community and we wanted
to really lean on inspiration 

216
00:14:42,600 --> 00:14:46,000
possibility. 
I would even say a sense of 

217
00:14:46,000 --> 00:14:48,100
agency. 
Although that wasn't language 

218
00:14:48,100 --> 00:14:51,200
that we used at the time. 
But as I look back on it, it was

219
00:14:51,200 --> 00:14:56,700
all about redirecting folks 
attention towards what is 

220
00:14:56,700 --> 00:14:59,100
possible for them. 
And what are the That they can 

221
00:14:59,100 --> 00:15:01,200
make. 
So what is it that you pay 

222
00:15:01,200 --> 00:15:04,100
attention to and what is 
important to them? 

223
00:15:04,500 --> 00:15:08,300
And for my manager and leader at
the time, Tom? 

224
00:15:08,500 --> 00:15:12,900
What was important to him was to
build something, meaningful, and

225
00:15:12,900 --> 00:15:15,500
Powerful. 
That would be a net benefit in 

226
00:15:15,500 --> 00:15:21,300
the world and it was important 
to be mindful of how we were 

227
00:15:21,300 --> 00:15:27,300
playing with emotion. 
Now, all of that really came 

228
00:15:27,300 --> 00:15:28,800
from one. 
Choice. 

229
00:15:28,800 --> 00:15:33,900
The choice that he made in his 
role of leader and manager. 

230
00:15:33,900 --> 00:15:36,200
And then he communicated that to
us. 

231
00:15:36,200 --> 00:15:42,500
And then so many of our 
decisions and choices about how 

232
00:15:42,500 --> 00:15:45,900
we ran the business and how we 
engaged with customers and 

233
00:15:45,900 --> 00:15:48,700
clients would then align to 
that. 

234
00:15:48,708 --> 00:15:53,500
Like that was kind of how we all
danced along and I mentioned 

235
00:15:53,500 --> 00:15:54,600
this. 
And, you know, one of the 

236
00:15:54,600 --> 00:15:57,900
reasons why I look back on this 
time with such appreciation. 

237
00:15:59,300 --> 00:16:05,700
Is realizing, you know, that was
a choice and so much of what 

238
00:16:06,500 --> 00:16:10,500
being a leader means. 
Whether you are a formerly, a 

239
00:16:10,500 --> 00:16:14,600
manager and have direct reports 
and fill out performance reviews

240
00:16:14,600 --> 00:16:18,100
for the people on your team or 
whether you are an informal 

241
00:16:18,100 --> 00:16:24,600
manager, like a product manager 
or you're managing up, or you're

242
00:16:24,600 --> 00:16:27,600
managing accounts, and you're 
managing those relationships 

243
00:16:27,900 --> 00:16:33,300
even though It's not a direct 
report situation that the way 

244
00:16:33,300 --> 00:16:40,900
that you make decisions sets the
tone, the way that you see 

245
00:16:40,900 --> 00:16:46,600
things sets the tone, your 
guiding principles, the 

246
00:16:46,600 --> 00:16:53,900
underlying, why of why you make 
the decisions that you do sets 

247
00:16:53,900 --> 00:16:58,400
the tone and this plays into so 
many different moments. 

248
00:16:59,200 --> 00:17:04,099
In the workplace, it affects 
performance reviews and how 

249
00:17:04,099 --> 00:17:11,300
people are evaluated it affects 
promotions and what behaviors 

250
00:17:11,300 --> 00:17:18,000
and qualities are seen as 
promotable or that register, as 

251
00:17:18,300 --> 00:17:23,400
kind of like, valid things. 
And I'm thinking specifically 

252
00:17:23,400 --> 00:17:27,500
of, you know, a client, a couple
of client conversations I've had

253
00:17:27,500 --> 00:17:32,100
with folks Who have come to me 
because they say, you know, I'm,

254
00:17:32,400 --> 00:17:37,000
I'm only evaluated against these
particular qualities, but I put 

255
00:17:37,000 --> 00:17:41,000
all this other effort into these
other things at work, and 

256
00:17:41,000 --> 00:17:44,100
they're not being recognized. 
And so, a lot of the work that I

257
00:17:44,100 --> 00:17:49,700
do with them is coaching them to
include that as part of their 

258
00:17:49,700 --> 00:17:55,600
value story and to educate, 
Their colleagues and their 

259
00:17:55,700 --> 00:18:01,300
managers so that all of the 
value that they're creating is 

260
00:18:01,300 --> 00:18:05,900
acknowledged and can start to 
become included in that 

261
00:18:05,900 --> 00:18:10,400
evaluation in that assessment. 
So, you know, it can be, it can 

262
00:18:10,400 --> 00:18:12,200
be unsettling. 
Anytime. 

263
00:18:12,400 --> 00:18:16,200
There is a change in leadership.
It can feel destabilizing. 

264
00:18:16,500 --> 00:18:20,000
Even if it's a leader that you 
are really excited for, you 

265
00:18:20,000 --> 00:18:21,900
know, this has nothing really to
do with. 

266
00:18:21,900 --> 00:18:26,100
Is it a good leader, or a L, it 
really is more about how we as 

267
00:18:26,100 --> 00:18:32,000
humans navigate change, and a 
lot of times leadership changes 

268
00:18:32,300 --> 00:18:36,600
and you're not involved in that 
decision, you know, it changes 

269
00:18:36,600 --> 00:18:39,800
in, maybe you haven't been a 
part of that decision, but your 

270
00:18:39,800 --> 00:18:46,600
life will be affected depending 
on who this person is, how they 

271
00:18:46,600 --> 00:18:50,500
see things, what their guiding 
principles are what they pay 

272
00:18:50,500 --> 00:18:53,800
attention to what is important 
to to them. 

273
00:18:56,200 --> 00:19:01,300
And then looking at it from the 
perspective of when you are 

274
00:19:02,200 --> 00:19:08,600
stepping into a leadership role,
when you are stepping into a 

275
00:19:08,600 --> 00:19:12,800
manager role. 
You may not realize it. 

276
00:19:13,400 --> 00:19:19,000
But all the folks connected to 
you, your team, your peers, the 

277
00:19:19,000 --> 00:19:23,900
others that you work with. 
They may also be taking a moment

278
00:19:23,900 --> 00:19:27,800
of pause to get us. 
Sense of this about you. 

279
00:19:28,700 --> 00:19:32,800
They're also going to be feeling
into like what is the music that

280
00:19:32,800 --> 00:19:35,900
you're bringing in? 
What is the the beat? 

281
00:19:35,900 --> 00:19:38,800
What is the tone? 
Can they dance? 

282
00:19:38,800 --> 00:19:43,000
Can they have a good time? 
Can they work effectively? 

283
00:19:44,600 --> 00:19:50,800
With the new music that you are 
bringing. 

284
00:19:52,700 --> 00:19:56,300
So, this is something that I've 
been thinking about. 

285
00:19:56,300 --> 00:19:59,700
And, you know, the first time I 
recorded this, I realized there 

286
00:19:59,700 --> 00:20:05,000
was so much to this that I had 
not thought about until I 

287
00:20:05,000 --> 00:20:09,100
recorded it once, and I decided 
that it was worth it, that you 

288
00:20:09,100 --> 00:20:14,200
are worth it to take the time to
re-record this. 

289
00:20:14,400 --> 00:20:20,100
And share more with you. 
So as we get ready to wrap up 

290
00:20:20,100 --> 00:20:23,500
this episode, a couple ideas I 
want to share is when you think 

291
00:20:23,500 --> 00:20:29,300
about who are the best leaders 
or the best managers that you've

292
00:20:29,300 --> 00:20:35,000
worked with, look at it through 
the lens of like what was it 

293
00:20:35,000 --> 00:20:38,300
about them? 
That made it a great experience.

294
00:20:38,400 --> 00:20:42,300
How did they set the tone? 
What was the kind of music that 

295
00:20:42,300 --> 00:20:46,100
they brought? 
What was the Decisions that they

296
00:20:46,100 --> 00:20:51,100
made, like in the same way that 
my former colleague, Tom had a 

297
00:20:51,108 --> 00:20:56,200
very clear decision about how we
would market and sell, and how 

298
00:20:56,200 --> 00:20:58,600
that affected everything that we
did. 

299
00:20:59,100 --> 00:21:01,100
When you think about the 
managers you've worked with 

300
00:21:01,100 --> 00:21:04,800
that, you've really liked. 
What were those underlying 

301
00:21:04,800 --> 00:21:08,100
principles or guidelines, even 
if they weren't specifically 

302
00:21:08,100 --> 00:21:13,400
articulated like, what was your 
sense of how they worked, and 

303
00:21:13,400 --> 00:21:16,600
how they Did their leadership 
and managing? 

304
00:21:16,900 --> 00:21:20,500
What is it? 
That was kind of underneath 

305
00:21:20,500 --> 00:21:23,300
that. 
And then if you've ever had a 

306
00:21:23,308 --> 00:21:27,500
situation, where you felt really
frustrated, it's probably there 

307
00:21:27,500 --> 00:21:31,500
because there was a disconnect 
or a sense of dissonance. 

308
00:21:31,600 --> 00:21:35,700
Like it just didn't feel right. 
Or it felt like there was not 

309
00:21:35,700 --> 00:21:42,300
alignment or there was an Abrupt
change in strategic direction or

310
00:21:42,300 --> 00:21:46,200
in priorities or in In the 
vision or the way that was 

311
00:21:46,200 --> 00:21:53,700
articulated, abrupt change, can 
create a lot of resistance and a

312
00:21:53,700 --> 00:21:57,800
lot of friction. 
And when we have resistance and 

313
00:21:57,800 --> 00:22:01,100
friction, it draws so much of 
our energy and it's really 

314
00:22:01,100 --> 00:22:05,300
difficult to do our best work 
when that is part of the 

315
00:22:05,300 --> 00:22:08,200
experience. 
So those are my thoughts for you

316
00:22:08,200 --> 00:22:11,000
today. 
I hope you take time to reflect 

317
00:22:11,000 --> 00:22:14,200
for yourself on what this has 
meant for you. 

318
00:22:14,600 --> 00:22:17,900
With the leaders and managers 
that you've experienced. 

319
00:22:18,400 --> 00:22:24,100
And when you think about how you
want to show up as a leader and 

320
00:22:24,100 --> 00:22:29,000
a manager, the toned that you 
will set and how you will 

321
00:22:29,000 --> 00:22:34,400
communicate, what your vision 
is, how you see things, what 

322
00:22:34,400 --> 00:22:37,300
your guiding principle is. 
What is it that you pay 

323
00:22:37,300 --> 00:22:42,400
attention to, you know, with so 
much work from home happening as

324
00:22:42,400 --> 00:22:45,900
we're in the pandemic. 
I think one of the things that's

325
00:22:45,900 --> 00:22:50,500
been fantastic is the 
conversation of, you know, I 

326
00:22:50,500 --> 00:22:54,300
don't really care. 
I'm not going to track when 

327
00:22:54,300 --> 00:22:58,900
you're when you're online. 
Or you know, how many of your 

328
00:22:58,900 --> 00:23:03,100
hours are on work hours. 
What I care about is, are you 

329
00:23:03,100 --> 00:23:07,200
getting your work done? 
Are you available in a reliable 

330
00:23:07,200 --> 00:23:09,400
way? 
Like if you take time off in the

331
00:23:09,408 --> 00:23:14,300
middle of the day in order to 
drop your kid at school or an 

332
00:23:14,500 --> 00:23:19,300
Your to manage your own mental 
emotional, health, great do it. 

333
00:23:19,300 --> 00:23:24,000
Whatever allows you to show up, 
and do great work. 

334
00:23:24,000 --> 00:23:28,500
And as long as our communication
is open and we are working 

335
00:23:28,500 --> 00:23:31,800
effectively together. 
I don't need to micromanage when

336
00:23:31,800 --> 00:23:34,300
your butt is in front of your 
laptop. 

337
00:23:35,100 --> 00:23:38,500
I really loved that the way that
we're working. 

338
00:23:38,500 --> 00:23:44,300
Now, his kind of required that 
we all become more flexible and 

339
00:23:44,400 --> 00:23:48,900
Maybe even more honest, about 
what we need and about how we're

340
00:23:48,900 --> 00:23:55,300
going to do great work. 
So take some time, notice for 

341
00:23:55,300 --> 00:23:59,600
yourself how this concept might 
show up and think intentionally 

342
00:23:59,800 --> 00:24:04,500
about what is the tone that you 
want to bring into the workplace

343
00:24:04,500 --> 00:24:06,500
and to the people that you work 
with. 

344
00:24:07,300 --> 00:24:09,700
Thanks so much. 
I will see you next time. 

345
00:24:14,500 --> 00:24:17,300
Do you want personal 
confidential help with your 

346
00:24:17,300 --> 00:24:20,600
situation at work? 
I offer one-on-one coaching and 

347
00:24:20,600 --> 00:24:24,800
can help you overcome challenges
reach your goals and become a 

348
00:24:24,800 --> 00:24:28,600
more effective leader to 
schedule a consult. 

349
00:24:28,600 --> 00:24:34,900
Go to my website, Kim nickel.com
coaching and we'll schedule time

350
00:24:34,900 --> 00:24:38,300
to talk about what's going on 
with you and how I can help. 

351
00:24:38,400 --> 00:24:39,400
Talk to you soon.