Are You Lonesome Tonight? Do you miss me tonight?
Are you sorry? We drifted does your mate.
Welcome back old Sports welcome. We're talking about the 1920s
today and it's Kellen Mel. Well, I'm Mel, I'm Co and that's
our brand for cousins. We look alike.
We do last night. We were told by people that we
look like twins, we went to the podcast of bet a party.
I glass box, not sponsored but yeah, but it does do a little
podcast party and it was cool. Cool.
We actually met some podcasters that I love we met Shannon
McMahon. From moving forward, and Kelly
Williams, from Beyond the blinds.
I couldn't believe that. Oh, my god.
Really Star Struck, while we talk to them for, like, 25
minutes. Yeah, I felt a little bit like F
Scott Fitzgerald. You know?
I know instead of books podcasts.
Hmm, New York party. Hmm, open bar.
Yeah, yeah. So hungover today, that's really
fitting for this episode. Mmm.
Perfect fact because they're alcoholics.
They are they, they were. Yes, there are, no, I never know
how to talk like in present tense and past tense.
You know? Well, yeah.
I don't know, knows what I'm doing my notes.
I write something in present tense, and I'm like, wait a sec
that's 100 years ago. Well, I've been because my dog
passed away, no. But I've been seeing this grief
counselor. Mmm, she was saying to me, that
it's really Important. When you're talking about your
lost loved ones, to still use the present tense as much as
possible. And I guess like we, these
aren't like our loved ones, who does really matter.
But like you don't want to say like, oh, I loved my grandmother
something because like, you still love your grandma.
That's true. Feel like, I love my
grandmother. Like, you don't want to say
like, oh, she was an amazing person because like, even though
she's not physically alive, she's still exist in some way,
that's nice. So I feel like when you're like,
Describing people permanent characteristics of someone to
still use the present tense, but like, it's okay.
Feel like, maybe we don't kill like, memorialize like
alcoholism acting May begin advised.
Hey, there is more to them than that though.
Yeah, yeah. So today we are talking about, F
Scott Fitzgerald and Zelda Gerald and but her her maiden
name was Ser so Zelda's are. And if you don't know who they
are, I feel like most people in the English-speaking World know
they are. But just in case Scott wrote The
Great Gatsby. It's like the thing he's most
known for but he also wrote books like this side of paradise
and the Beautiful and the damned and a lot of short stories.
He also wrote The Curious Case of Benjamin Button.
Oh, I know that. That was a short story.
I know it's just a short, ya know then they made that movie
with Brad Pitt. I haven't seen it.
Go check out our Brad Pitt episode.
It's actually such a good movie. Love it.
Oh yeah. Good.
You should watch that something like a great story.
Yeah it's cool. Yeah so I have always loved the
1920s so much in fact Malin I threw a 1920s 2020 party,
January 1st 2012. Well, you know, December 31st
going into it. I was 20 themed.
We all dressed up, we mentioned out of place.
There's like a hundred people there and we had champagne.
Yep, it was the best party ever through.
Oh my gosh. And like, we were 23:20 at five
years old. Yep.
And we put so much work into it and we've been talking about it
since really 13. Yeah.
We talked about it for like 10
minutes and then we like, oh gosh, you have to do that.
Yeah. Because we said, we would always
do it when it turned, The 20th. Yeah, and it was the highlight
of the year. Yeah.
It just went downhill from there.
So everyone at the party was like, we're entering our Rhino.
My knees. Ya gonna be a sparkly year and
it was, yeah, I was doing a lot of thinking about decades
because I was researching this and I we all wanted the twenties
to be the 1920s, The Roaring 20s, and there's still time for
things to change, but I feel like it turned out more like the
30s. We didn't have a depression but
just a lot of strife and could, you know, yeah, I hate to save.
I feel like the Tans were more like the 20s and we didn't know
it. That's so true.
Yeah, exactly people who are neon dancing.
Lots of party songs. A lot of eggs.
Yeah, and people, that's when The Great Gatsby movie came out,
the 2,000 tons was actually really, it was really fun.
Really nice. It was really fun.
Yeah, the 2020s have not been fun.
No right now. It's turning around.
Its getting well, at least here. Yeah, not Ukraine, I'm sorry.
I'm sorry to get depressed. No, but that is yeah, I mean,
there's always crap going on but yeah, I was thinking a lot about
that. I So, immersed, in this guy,
I've been listening to 1920s music.
I, my personality is this episode love it, when that
happens. Yeah, I can't get out.
I'm so inspired to just like work all day party.
All night. I am like, they just lived.
It definitely did. It's hard to fit in time for
relaxing and they don't think that's got really did that.
He was very work. Hard play hard and that took a A
toll for sure. But this is this couple is, is
the 1920s, basically, I mean, don't you feel like The Great
Gatsby like is 1920s. It's like the defining thing,
the Whole Decade. But I'm sure there's a lot of,
like, Vibes that are so counter to the Greek gods.
Be, yeah, you know, like yeah, more like regular folks, or
whatever, because it didn't even have, like, they were not as
globalized and stuff. So, like, Everything was in a
way, very different, you know, what do you mean?
Like, it's like where you were and like, one part of the
country compared to like, oh, like New York City or yeah, so
different. Yeah, it was more distinct.
I think this surprising when you, when you get in the story,
they traveled so much. It's crazy.
So I really like the Great Gatsby and I've always heard of
him in Zelda and, you know, in Midnight in Paris, you see them
in that movie and I was intrigued Buy them and then when
we did the Ben Gibbard and so I Deschanel episode, he been
talked about reading this book. They have right here called dear
Scott dearest Zelda, which is all their letters between the
still survive, but back and forth between each other.
And then I read the book and I loved it and I wish I could just
read the whole entire book out loud today.
But do take way, too long. Yeah but it's very sweet and
yeah um they they were like the It couple and I do 20s.
I feel like a lot of decades have a couple over some reason
that defines the decade and this actress named Lillian Gish.
Even said about them said, they didn't make the 20s, they were
the twenties. What the words would you use to
describe this couple? I would say, well, if you like,
I could have said, but I say complicated intoxicated.
'Intoxicated intoxicated, and passionate.
Yeah, but it over all. This is worth of work fourth
word, but I thought it was like little too basic.
But crazy. Yeah, it's crazy.
It's crazy. I think this is Gary.
I feel like I've said this many times but now I think this is
the Craziest one that I've researched, I honestly don't
know much. I like, I know that they're
crazy but like, I don't know any specifics about their
relationship. I have to tell you how they met.
I'll tell you really curious. I'll tell you.
I actually use for books for this.
Yeah, I got to go into it because I got a library card and
I was like, oh my God, there's so many books about them.
They're just like went overboard.
I read one is called Flappers by Judith mackerel.
I only use the Zelda chapters or it was actually about like, six
different. A girls only did the cell of the
chapters, the Gatsby Affair by Kendall Taylor, dear Scott, dear
selda as I mentioned which is edited by Jackson are Breyer and
Kathy W barks and then I read a little bit.
I just kind of skim this one called Paradise Lost by David S
brown, which is about Scott because I felt like there
wasn't, there's kind of lacking Scott and some of the books I
read weirdly he just goes by Scott, mmm, what's his, what's
the F Francis that's it. Scott name, key Fitzgerald, so
he's related to Francis Scott Key who wrote The Star stink
Star-Spangled Banner. He's named after him.
Hmm. What's the relationship?
I wrote down. I think it's it's um it's pretty
far back. Yeah.
Wow. Very like American.
Yeah. Like tied to American history
this family on his father's side.
I mean he went back for like his great great.
Yeah, uncle or something. But yeah, Francis Scott
Fitzgerald, but he went by Scott.
I wish I could include include every single detail if you guys
are at all interested. In this, I really recommend
reading more because there's so much more.
I can include it all that always happens but this is going to be
a two-part. Oh yeah.
It's gonna be a two-parter because a lot happens and I
didn't want to skip stuff. Yeah I didn't want to rush it
too much and and I feel like the beginning of their relationship
was like so sweet and I didn't want to, I don't know, condense
it too much. Yeah that's the thing with
these. We are going to sometimes
occasionally, do ya two-part episodes now but it's like
especially with certain couples. You don't want to skip things
and then have someone be like oh you don't include oh yeah.
I know. You know what you're talking
about? Yeah.
It's hard to include everything
I know and I are going to be some things I leave out.
Um, I'm glad I actually read. I'm so glad I read this letters
book because the main book I read was that one by Kendall
Taylor. And okay, I started reading
these letters book in the introduction.
The editors of this book were like slamming, that one there.
Like that book didn't get it right Bubba, Bubba, the timeline
was messed up. And wow, it is weird.
Like I do think so. That one was the Gatsby Affair.
For some reason that book really made it seem like a terrible
relationship. I thought they both seemed kind
of terrible. I even was questioning of Zelda
even like Scott. I Googled it Zelda even like
Scott, I didn't find any results but yeah, it the book really was
like definitely on Zelda side. Yeah, which is fine but I think
it made it look like they didn't even love each other.
Yeah but then when you read this book and read all their letters
like they clearly loved each other.
So I was like what the heck why? I don't know why they wanted to
portray it that way they didn't really just maybe take a
different spin on. Yeah, yeah.
So I'm glad I didn't just stop there or else.
I would have been like pretty - I'm glad you see.
There's always so many different ways that you can tell the same
story. Yeah.
You can get a nonfiction. Yeah.
They clearly just wanted to be like Scott was horrible and
Zelda's just trapped in a marriage and like maybe if that
felt true, sometimes that's what I heard myself.
Yeah. But I Think it's way more
complicated than that. That's why I said complicate
him. But oh, so when we do get into
the letters Zelda, didn't she was kind of disorganized and she
also was in like many fires throughout her life.
So she didn't have a lot of her letters, a lot of Scots letters
are gone. Okay?
But he kept all of hers. So it seems like she wrote to
him more often but she's because not many of his letters
survived. Yeah that's how it is.
All right well I'm gonna get It F Scott Fitzgerald, and Zelda.
Fitzgerald so starts. Scott was born, September 24th,
1896. Pretty far back.
He's born in st. Paul Minnesota Minnesota.
Yep. And you know what's cool his
grandfather on his mother's side was from County from Ana and I
don't oh my gosh on his mother's side my grandmother so is our I
I know, grandmother and I don't think for man has come up yet on
this show. No shoutouts a county for man.
I know, I was so excited to see that this killing.
Yep, it's where our grandmothers from.
Yep. I don't know what town, but
whatever, his parents were Mary, AKA Molly and Edward and his dad
had a wicker furniture business, that failed, and then he became
a Salesman and then failed again.
He kept like, losing his job, but his mom had an inheritance.
Is that kind of like kept the middle class?
So they were okay. I think his dad was an alcoholic
to sadly and his parents had two daughters that died before.
Scott was born from God and epidemic.
I know that's awful. And after that Scott felt like
his mom babied him and smothered him spoiled him too much and
that, that caused him to lack his own courage and stability.
You really put some thought? Yeah, he definitely did.
It seems like later in life as an adult.
He didn't really spend too much time with his parents.
Yeah. Just kind of sad that, you know,
have any other siblings. Hmm.
Yes. He was like an only child
basically. And that's like, that's a weird
type of grief to it's like, yeah.
You have had siblings that you never met and they always kind
of like living in like the post. Yeah.
Lost period for your parents to, that's really sad.
Yeah. And then Zelda was born July
24th, 1920s it really easy to keep track of a is I love that
and so he's four years older, I think.
Hmm. Um yeah it's eldest Heir was
born in Montgomery Alabama. Her father was the associate
Justice of the Alabama Supreme Court and her mother many Macon.
She had five siblings older sister.
She did have a brother that 18 months old and another brother.
And she was the youngest kid, the baby.
Well, some have babies, yep. Yep.
But she had a lot of older siblings.
The Sayers were Southern aristocracy basically, they were
like prominent families and her dad, you know, he was a Justice
and he's pretty much a white supremacist is a judge.
He depraved black people and poor white people from voting
but I know, But luckily, you know, Zelda didn't seem to agree
with him and she she enjoyed defying him and called him old
dick because his middle name was Dickerson.
Yeah. Goes always trying to.
Yeah. Do the opposite of your destiny.
I know. It's like, okay.
Um, okay back to Scott. He grew up Catholic, and he even
considered becoming a priest at one point.
I know he attended Newman a Catholic boarding In school in
New Jersey but his grades were not that impressive and he was
already smoking and drinking at age 15, he became very easily
intoxicated even by one drink. Oh yeah, that's me
although his grades weren't that great.
He was always late to class. He really wanted to go to
Princeton and I guess he met with the board of appeals and
dressed impeccably and was very charming and somehow he got
into, Princeton is very confident that he was going to
be a good writer. And he was, yeah, he ended up
kind of losing his confidence like later in life, but I feel
like when he was young, he was like, I'm gonna be a great
novelist. No yeah yeah.
And he did it. Yeah, my God if you believe it
you can achieve it. Doo doo doo doo.
Yes, we're going to Princeton. He became a princess in 1913.
He wrote for the literary magazine, he got super into
literature and then in 1915, he fell in love for the first time
with dinner Vic, King a 16 year old Chicago debutante, she
introduced him to the world of the wealthy, which I feel like
he stayed fascinated with you. Like forever, kind of like, he's
Dan Humphrey and Serena or something.
But then his relationship with her ended a year later and and I
wasn't related. But I thought it was so sad that
he asked her for his letters back and she hadn't kept any of
them. And apparently, he had saved all
of her letters and also had typed them and bound them in a
300-page document. Like make a book of her letters.
I know it's like my letters. Yeah, I don't keep them so sad.
Yeah, so I feel like he's a big romantic.
Um, he was struggling at Princeton though and he left
americo's enter World War 1 so he enlisted in the Infantry and
became a second lieutenant. And He reported to Fort
Leavenworth, Kansas and that's when he started working on his
first novel. This side of paradise news,
often writing all he's supposed to be paying attention to
lessons about trench warfare. So then he's transferred to like
different camps, I guess to prepare to go to war, and then
he was transferred to Camp. Sheridan near Montgomery,
Alabama. And that's how he met selda
because she was in Montgomery, Alabama.
And it's so interesting because that's assuming Great Gatsby.
Like, Gatsby was stationed. I think Daisy lived in
Louisville Kentucky, but it was like, a similar thing and there
was like, all these boys in town because they were at the camp.
So they first met July 18th at Montgomery Country Club.
Dance Scott had pulled strings to get in since he wasn't a
member. I guess everyone at the club was
watching selda perform Dance of the hours, some kind of dance
and Scott wrote how that night she glistened in the evening,
comparing her to angels in Italian paintings.
Okay, so Zelda was very well known in town.
She was like the town flirt. Yeah.
She was the it girl in Montgomery.
Look. I don't know if you had someone
like this in your town but like a girl that dated a lot of guys
and everybody. Heard she's kind of scandalous
and run around town. And yeah, that was all the.
This is 1918. Okay.
So 2018. Yeah.
She's 1822. Yep, she's very flirty outgoing.
Rambunctious doing crazy stunts. She was like, the original
flapper, girl, and she actually, like, glitter and life, right?
Wrote some kind of article or something about how like she was
a flapper and all these. New Flappers like weren't really
Flappers like copying. Yeah, yeah I didn't realize that
flapper like I first of all I didn't know that.
It meant basically like party girl.
Yeah, I didn't really know what it meant.
I thought I was just like someone with short hair and, you
know, wore those dresses. But I didn't realize that a
flapper was almost like a hippie or a punk or a hipster.
It's like it's not just about the outfit.
It's also about the lifestyle. Yeah.
Like a flapper was like a free-spirited.
And woman. Yeah, you know, yeah.
But then I think she was similar to what happened with like,
hippies and hipsters, Punk's, whatever.
Then she saw people dressing. That way that weren't really
living the life. Yeah, she's like, copying her.
Yeah, they're not really Flappers.
I thought that was funny, but, um, Yeah, she was known for
saying shocking things. She liked to be really
provocative. Should have very very thick
southern accent. Ooh hmm she was wild.
You can got a bedroom windows and kiss.
Lots of boy she was indifferent to anyone's opinion.
Well, you can be like that if you want to.
Yeah, yeah, we're gonna do old 26.
I know. Yeah, it's all about like being
rebellious. Yeah.
Um, but her senior year of high school, she was already showing
signs of depression and that candle Taylor making the right
Taylor. Kendall Taylor, Kendall, Kendall
Taylor. I don't remember what it is.
That book speculated that she had been raped is a teenager
there isn't, you know, I don't think these like concrete
evidence, but she did write later in life.
She wrote Some books, like she wrote this novel Caesars things.
It's based on her life, and it seems very much about her life.
And there's a whole part in that seems like implies it doesn't
get too graphic details or anything.
But implies that the main character was raped.
So really sad. I don't know if it has anything
to do with that but maybe anyway.
So back to the dance where they met after the dance ended Scott
walked over to her and introduced himself and they
started dancing but everyone was trying to dance with her and
kept cutting in. So to get her alone.
Own Scott suggested a midnight date.
Oh, but Zelda, said she laughed and said, she never made late
dates with fast workers. I don't really know things, but
she apparently had often had multiple dates in one night
because she was in such high demand.
I know, I could not handle and he tried to get her phone
number, but when he tried to make plans with her, she was
booked for weeks. So he organized, an 18th
birthday party. Her to get her attention.
It's pretty extreme. So.
Okay, at this time, Scott was five foot seven.
Oh, wow. Oh yeah, yeah.
Now I'm going to this is going to talk about.
They look like he's 57. He had a very elegant, face
hair, parted down the middle. He was very get, very 1920s
here, he's very good-looking, he's very good-looking and
intelligent and dressed. Well, but he didn't have money.
Gatsby and then he tried to look the part.
Hmm, she was 55 almost eye-level with Scott, but people said she
appeared taller because you just really confident.
She was voted the prettiest and the most energetic girl with the
most kissable mouth by her classmates.
Like, oh God, most kissable kind of surprise is that she had
honey gold hair and gray, green eyes.
I think they were both really good-looking guy.
Eyes this applies to all historic couples we do.
I never really noticed this or knew this, until like this year
that if you're looking at a picture of a historic person,
and you think like, oh they look, they look so old
fashioned, or they look so weird.
Look at their face and try to picture them with modern hair.
Yeah. And you will see what they in
air quotes really look like, yeah, that because it's so weird
like hair, we really attribute with certain time period.
Kind of freaks me out because I'm like oh my God, someday
people. We're going to look at us now
and see our however, we're styling ourselves and be like,
well, they look so old, you know, the thing, like with the
Golden Girls. Oh yeah, it is see me.
Just the ladies. I think they're actually younger
than the ladies on Sex and the City.
Yeah. And just like that and so people
put like the Sex and the City hair on the golden.
Yeah it's crazy because like our Concepts that were even like I
think they're the same age as like Jennifer Aniston or yeah.
Like but that that hair at the time.
I'm was cool like just because people usually keep the same
hair forever, exact. So I people keep their 80s hair.
Yeah. So it's like to now.
That's all. Yeah.
He hair. Yes.
They kept her. Even like, yeah.
Grandparents, like the clothes that they wore.
Yeah. That we think of as old people
clothes like that. Those were young.
Yeah, that was hit. Yeah, crazy because it's like
our I don't know who's ringing the door right now.
So I do think they are very pretty people.
Yeah, but it is funny. The one is the middle part going
to come back. I know for fun.
Yeah. Okay.
So the war actually ended before Scott ever got sent to the
front. Yeah, good.
Good for him, but he actually always felt kind of ashamed
about it. I get it.
Yeah I probably felt bad. Um so Scott had this Ledger.
He wrote in that I think is kind of like one line of daily which
Mel and I have both done where he just wrote in it.
I think like everyday just short updates about his life and on
September 7th which is actually like a bit later than the dance.
But he wrote that he fell in love with Zelda.
But then February 1919 Scott left for NYC where he rented a
room on Claremont Avenue and sir working on his novel and writing
advertising copy. So, he like during the day work
in this advertising company and that night he was working on
this novel much all day and human Zelda.
Wrote many, many letters to each other and they became
unofficially engaged. Oh, they're like talking about
getting married but I don't think there was like a ring.
Wow. Yeah guys.
That like she had dated so many people that like what about him
really? I know what her off her feet.
I think it was that he did really look the part of like a
wealthy guy. And he was very confident that
he was going to be the Great American novelist and she
believed in him. But it wasn't that simple
because even though they became engaged unofficially and they
were writing really romantic letters to each other, she was
apparently seeing this guy, John Sellers, When a guy she dated in
high school and she was also seeing to football stars?
Oh, okay. Yes, it's very unofficial if he
don't think. I don't think.
Scott knew that. Yeah.
When you read the letters, they're like so lovey-dovey.
It's kind of sad. She's she is, you know, when I
was doing this research, I was like, man we're reaching hard on
Phoebe Bridgers, like I know girls are just having fun.
Honestly, that's like what guys do all the time.
They like date many different women.
And yeah, yeah. And make you think you're like
the only one. So that was totally doing that.
Yeah, she was seeing other guys, but you would even in the
letters, like she'd kind of hint that it should always say to
Scott, like, oh, I was with the boys.
Ha ha ha. It was just fraternal, but I
think it was dressing him out. Yeah, the Kendall Taylor book
did make it seem like she really didn't care for Scott at all.
But if you read the letters, like it's very, very, very cute.
I'm going to read I'm gonna read some got one here.
I love the letters. I love that in the Einstein
episode. That was like the cutest thing
ever, okay? Page 13.
It's so cute. So when you think about like,
you know, that we text now that like, we really have just been
writing to each other. I know.
We're all these, you know, like we should be really like texting
that's like texting is just like a updated version of grading
someone. Yeah, text can be very
beautiful. Yeah.
And Poetic just depends who you're talking to.
Yeah. Okay, so this is from Zelda to
Scott March 1919. She said, darling, I've nearly
set it off in the Strand today and all because we Lawrence of
the movies is your physical counterpart.
So, I was informed by half a dozen girls before I could slam
on a hat and see for myself. He made me so homesick.
I thought of first waiting must grow easier later, but every
day, I want you more all these soft warm nights going to waste
when I ought to be lying in your arms under the moon, the dearest
arms and all the world darling arms that I love soda.
Feel around me how much longer before they'll be there to stay?
Where do I get home again? You'll certainly have a most
awful time ever, moving me one inch from you blah blah blah an
old flame from the stone. Age's is calling tonight.
He'll probably leave in disgust because I just want to talk
about you. I love you.
So and I'm So Lonesome. Well that's interesting.
She like brings up an old days, okay?
Oh I'll probably be talking about you the whole time and
then she says, oh lover lover, you are mine.
And before long, I'll be coming to you because you are doc.
My darling husband and I am your wife.
Wow. Very seriously.
I know you would think, but it's like, is this how he's talking
to everybody? I don't know if I can really
trust me. I know.
Well, yep. Mmm.
Okay, then I think, maybe like a week or two later.
There's another cute one. She said, sweetheart please,
please don't be. So depressed, will be married
soon. And then these Lonesome nights
will be forever over. And until we are, I am loving
loving, every tiny minute of the day and night, maybe you won't
understand this. But sometimes, when I miss you
most, it's hardest to write. And you can always know when I
make myself just the ache of it. All, I can't tell you if we were
together, you'd feel how strong it is.
You're so sweet when your Melancholy, I love your sad
tenderness when I've hurt you. That's one of the reasons I
could never be sorry for our quarrels and they bothered you.
So, those dear dear little fusses when I'm always.
So I'm always waiting when I always tried so hard to make you
kiss. And forget Scott, there's
nothing in all the world they want, but you and your precious
love all those material, things are nothing.
I just hate to live a sorted colorful existence because you'd
soon love me less and less and I'd want to do anything anything
to keep your heart for my own. I don't want to live.
I want to love first and And live.
Incidentally, why don't you feel that?
I'm waiting, I'll come to you lover when you're ready.
Don't don't ever think of the things?
You can't give me. You've trusted me with the
dearest heart of all, and it's so damn much more than anybody
else. In all the world has ever had.
That's funny, I, when I miss you most, I can't write you.
I know, I don't know if I believe that a good way to be
like when I'm not giving you any attention.
Yeah, because I really liked She in one letter said something
about like, it's hard to write. She's basically saying like it's
hard to do this. It's hard to do long distance
and it's hard to be always writing about what I'm up to and
I thought was funny because I feel like people still say that
today like with texting or whatever.
Yeah I can't I mean some people love.
I mean it's never really been much of a problem for me but I
know like I've some friends that don't enjoy like updating
someone about their life or whatever.
Yeah, she said something like that.
She's He's a sneaky little 10. I'm gonna be a little thing from
Scott to, oh yeah, they didn't see here that if I need, he must
have written something kind of melancholy, or whatever for her
to be like, oh, like I'm sad that you're don't like, don't be
so depressed. Yeah, yeah, he must have.
It's funny. She said she loves his
Melancholy. Like I love to make you sad
because I love when you're in a sad mood because I love to come
for you. Kind of a red flag.
Okay. So, this is March 24th, 1919 and
she put in her scrapbook actually.
Um, is very short. He wrote darling, I'm sending
this just the way it came. I hope it fits and I wish I was
there to put it on. Put it on, I love you so much.
Much, much, that it just hurts every minute.
I'm without you, do you write every day because I loved your
letter. So goodbye.
My own wife, what did he send her an engagement ring?
Ring. He said that's really valuable
things over the old. Death is so beautiful.
So, beautiful. We will die together.
I know. Oh, wow.
That is really Beautiful. Yeah, it is.
It's kind of interesting how long distance this is, and I
really aren't in person. Yeah, I know.
She's in Alabama. He's in New York.
They must have really made an impression on each other.
I know, yeah, they say a lot of things like sweetheart
sweetheart. I love you.
So, you know, a lot of stuff like that.
They do phone calls with each other to they did.
And they also did telegrams sometimes just store it things.
A lot of him being like, I'm sending this in the mail or
like, I don't know. Yeah, I think they do talk in
the phone occasionally but mostly letters, spring 1999,
Scott visited Montgomery in April, May and June.
So you went back and forth. Sometimes, you know, it's also
is still hanging out with a lot of boys and mention them a lot
in her letters to Scott and she was apparently, apparently, I
don't know when she said that she might have said this later
in life because I think at this time she was still kind of like
pretending to be a virgin. But Um, she said that she could
sleep with others and it wouldn't affect her or make her
unfaithful to him and also said that she had kissed thousands of
men and kiss and tended to kiss thousands more.
Oh I know that's funny though. He's got like 20 being
universally admired but it made him jealous to get seems like he
likes a challenge. Yeah, he loves that, for sure.
he liked her independence but he was always a lot more like
conservative in a way like he wasn't He wasn't a very sexual
guy I guess okay. Yeah I mean got lucky we're
talking about this poor man but yeah he obviously had sex but he
wasn't like flooding. Yeah he wasn't like and he
wasn't as showy about things like, I don't know.
Yeah, it wasn't promiscuous. Yeah.
And I remember he almost became a priest.
Yeah, he might be okay living without.
Yeah. Um, when he visited her, they
would go to the movies and amusement arcade and strolls in
the Moonlight and apparently, they carve their names into a
doorpost. And Scott, did his name much
larger than hers? Yes, look Frank at this point.
I'm getting the vibe that he like cares more.
Yeah, that's what he didn't really have.
Money and he couldn't compare to the wealthier men that were
pursuing her. So he was feeling really
threatened by that and he kept insisting that he's going to
become a successful novelist May 1919.
I thought was funny she wrote to him that mrs.
Francesca I don't know who that is.
But got a message from the Ouija board that her and Scott were
soul mates. Oh hmm.
I know people did the we do horn back then that's cute.
But a month later that pesky Zelda, she accidentally cents
got a letter that was meant for another guy.
Know what did she say? Apparently so I guess a guy gave
her hit a pin or something and he was an athlete.
And you know the thing people did like where my pin and I
think she was, I think she was declining it but she was being
really flirty and sweet and stuff in it, that must be tough
to see. Yeah, and Scott was very upset.
He told her not to write to him again, but Zelda did write to
him and said that she was sorry. So then Scott made a frantic
trip to Montgomery to repair the relationship and begged, her to
marry him, but she refused and ended the engagement.
Why was but I know? Yeah, but she doesn't want to be
held back. It's almost like she maybe
didn't really mean it when she's like, I'm sorry.
I know, I think he just wanted to keep him like, in her orbit.
Yeah, yeah, totally. Mmm.
Keep him hanging on. It's crazy though.
That, that book The Candle Taylor book left this whole
thing out? Yeah, that they left it out.
Makes her seem like that for hand here.
I know they just said that she ended the engagement.
They didn't explain any of this. That's crazy.
No, have you guys ever sent like a romantic?
Or flirty text to the wrong person.
Like another dude to love interest at once.
That's crazy have, you know, I haven't I know anything.
Like a guilty plea. Yeah.
I just can't imagine, I feel like I would die.
I didn't. But I received one on, for the
wrong, really. Hmm, because I know that, I
don't think this is my sophomore year guy, who I was.
Wait, last month, you received something my sophomore year.
Oh, what I think he said last month.
Oh oh, I guy who I was talking to had really strong feelings
for and like he liked me, but like we're just friends and he
just sent me a text. That was like, you're so cute.
Oh my God. And then like I was like, oh my
God and then five minutes later he was like, oh I'm so sorry.
That was for someone. That's insane.
I think I cried. Oh, yeah, that is bad.
Kind of like, you got to keep that straight.
If you're going to be doing that.
Yeah, Scott told his friend Edmund went by the nickname
bunny, which is in the book, secret history.
I feel like she must have gotten it from that.
I don't know. Maybe that is a common nickname
for Edmund, but anyway, his friend, Bonnie willesden.
Why said He told him that he wouldn't care if Zelda died but
couldn't bear to have her marry. Another Scott said, yeah, that's
pretty nice. I know, I know.
But you know what though? Like I've heard that's a thing
like, because with death, there's not a rejection.
Mmm. And he felt very rejected by
her. I bet he didn't mean it.
I mean, yeah, it is. It is really that's horrible.
But he wrote to another friend, no personality.
Strong, as Zelda's could go without getting criticism.
I've always known that. Any girl who gets stood in
public, meaning like drunk who, frankly, enjoys until shocking
stories, who smokes constantly and makes the remarks that she
has kissed, thousands of men and intense, kiss thousands.
More cannot be considered Beyond reproach, but I fell in love
with her courage. Her sincerity and her flaming
self-respect, I love her and that's the beginning and end of
everything. I've heard that quote before,
um, you're still a Catholic but Zelda's the only God I have left
now. Very intense.
Like Twilight, I wanted. You are my life.
Yeah, yeah, Scott was working on his novel all the time and then
he quit his job. So this is August 1919 to move
back to his parents house in st. Paul to complete his novel,
which is this side of paradise. And in the novel, he weaves a
lot of Zelda's letters and her Diary pages.
I guess that she let him read. He puts like a lot of Zelda into
the book September 1990 1919. This side of paradise was
accepted by scribner's and then him and Zelda became engaged
again. You know, book deal.
Yeah, I mean I guess at this time period women really did
kind of rely on their husbands money, but it does kind of Upset
me that she seemingly only got back together with him.
Once he got money management Gatsby he's fine without it.
He's fine. Yeah, he's fine with it.
He wanted that I feel like part of the reason he even worked
this hard was to like get they'll do.
Yeah. Yeah.
He knew the reality of the situation.
It's so interesting though, because in The Great Gatsby it's
like you must have the sense of an awareness that like Zelda is
only with him for superficial reasons in a way.
Not only with him. Yeah, she's much more infatuated
with that, then. Yeah, it's so interesting
because I remember way later in their life.
In some letter, he expressed like some frustration about the
fact that like, the men have to do the work, and she just gets
his money, even though she felt trapped by situation to like she
wanted, she wanted to be free, like I think she would have
liked to do her own thing. But it's interesting that, you
know, way the kind of I know it sounds like a cliche but like
patriarchal system, like he felt kind of Trapped in it too.
He had to like at this point. It's like fun and good.
But like later in life they have lot of money troubles and he's
like trying to work his butt off to make money and he's like you
just use my money. I could see no I could see a
picture like yeah, I want to do half.
Yeah, he was really good at was always thinking like oh, You
could get a job at like, a store or something.
Yes, got but, but whatever. Yeah.
So this side of paradise is published and it's a overnight
bestseller. And it was apparently, like, of
its time, the first to portray, like a complex modern heroin and
it, because it's so accurate. Accurately depicted, the way
young people, behave people thought of Scott is kind of an
expert on dating and Flappers and he was asked to lecture Sure
about Flappers and get a lot of young women fans.
It's a know he was a really good writer but seems like very lucky
that it became a success. Like you know just being a good
writer doesn't mean that something will be.
Yeah. Really known about so that's
cool. I know I think that it is pretty
admirable that he was able to write about the time like while
it was happening. I think, I think that's hard I
because I like to write to and I never really feel inclined to
talk about like right now. Ya know what I mean.
Like a sense of like removal from it.
Yeah. Like what's so special about it?
Yeah, totally. He also had a story in the
Saturday evening, post, published called head and
shoulders and then he sold movie rights to it to MGM.
So, he all of a sudden got like a bunch of money to celebrate.
He went to Cartier and bought a platinum and diamond watch.
Had it engraved from Scott to Zelda and mailed it to her.
Oh my gosh. Hmm.
And it was like $600 or something, which is insane for.
Back then. Yeah.
I mean that's a lot of money now.
Yeah. Yeah.
For a while. Yeah.
That's probably worth thousands
of dollars today. I don't trust the mail.
Not living with him, though. He's.
Yeah. She's still in Montgomery.
Yeah. What's keeping her there, if
they're engaged, well, kind of just taking that next step.
I guess. I don't think they could like,
live together until they were actually married, and I don't
think he had like, actually I asked her dad for permission yet
or anything. He took two trips to Montgomery
to see her and apparently they resumed their sexual relations.
Oh maybe from his Ledger. I don't know, I guess her
period. I'm sorry.
Sheldon's got in the grave apparently.
Her period was late, and he sent her some abortion pill, but she
refused to take them. Them.
Oh my God, but she must not have been pregnant, because nothing
happened. It's all this family didn't
approve of Scott for her, and her mom would actually always
give her newspaper clippings about failed writers and stuff.
They didn't want her to be with him but after his book showed up
in a bookstore in Montgomery, two days later.
Their engagement was announced in the paper and selda traveled
up to New York to be with him and I guess the news shocked.
A lot of people in town and two guys thought they were going to
marry her That's what I thought I was gonna die.
I know. I know yes.
He like we thinks Gods like the main character in the story.
Really. Oh, good for him.
Like that's like kind of trauma at this point in her life.
Zelda was pretty proud to say, she didn't really have any
Ambitions, just wanted to have fun and she was kind of happy to
just like assumes God's identity in a way like she was just happy
to be his wife. Wife.
She was a smart girl. But like she?
What she didn't really have any goals or anything.
Yeah, sometimes gold hurt. I know January 17 1920 this when
prohibition started. Oh yeah, mmm-hmm.
So now alcohol was illegal and everyone was underage and I
didn't really put it together like this until doing the
research, but if formed, I mean, yeah, we all know this.
But like, if formed such a culture around alcohol, it's
kind of like in School. I don't know if you guys are
like this, but like there was a culture around drinking, like
meeting up with people in the hallway.
Like who you want to drink, like when we get alcohol, yeah, we
can go with this person's basement and have a sleepover
this weekend, you know? Like oh, lifestyle built around
out finding alcohol and it like, it was you drank?
What? You could get?
Yeah, like, you any, and when you got it, you drink a lot.
Yeah, exactly. Know you because you couldn't
have it and it was like, you didn't, you didn't drink, like
good drink. Things like yeah, like pretty
much like straight up. Like yep, I don't know.
And it was the same for prohibition-era because people
were drinking bootlegged, liquor the people made in their
bathtubs or whatever. And a lot of it tasted really
badly and that's actually why people started getting really
creative with cocktails to, like, cover up the taste.
Oh wow, just cool. But yeah, they were going to
speakeasies. Like, literally, what you think
in the movies? It was real.
Like when the cops come in they would like pull Very in the
shelves, would flip over? Yeah.
Bottles would like go down a chute.
Like it's so cool. I went to the city Kesey about a
month ago. That was really cool.
Yeah. Like walk into a phone booth.
Oh yeah. And then like say like oh like
we're coming. Yeah, the 1920s were just so
cool and like women started carrying flask like under their
skirts and people just, you know, wanting to party more than
ever. Yeah.
Totally Backfired, totally backfired on the American
people. So, yeah, Zelda is got were
already into drinking, but now they started drinking a lot, you
know, and I guess so, maybe she hadn't left for New York yet in
February 1920. She wrote a letter to him and
said, I just thought it was poetic and cute.
She wrote, you're a necessity and a luxury, and a darling,
precious lover, and you're going to be a husband to your wife.
Oh, how cute. So in April 3rd 1928, finally
got married in st. Patrick's Cathedral.
Wow. We want their mouths in New
York. That's like did it to pay for
that. That's crazy.
I don't know. But it was actually very small
only, like her sisters and his friends were there and his her
sisters actually. Felt like, Scott didn't do a
good job planning. It they didn't have like a
luncheon after anything and I guess they always resented him
for that. That after, after their wedding
and the book success, the fitzgeralds became celebrities
in Manhattan's most sought-after couple ever.
They were invited to every Chic party.
They were getting up to crazy things.
They were dancing on tables. One time, Scott Road on a Taxis
roof. All Zelda was perched on the
hood. They're jumping into City
fountains. Oh yeah, so the strip down naked
and ran down the street and jumped into a fountain.
Oh my God. Scott with Scott and his friend
following. And after they jumped in the are
confronted by the police. And apparently, she also does
robed in Grand Central Station on her way to meet her friend,
George who's George? And okay, apparently, four
months into marriage Zelda had an affair with this literary
critic, George, Mike G, Nathan? What the fuck?
Why don't you serve down in the station?
The cop and of cameras. Yeah.
They were so famous like such an IT couple that there is a
tabloid writer at Hearst, that was assigned to cover Justice
cotton Zelda. Wow.
So, you know, it's prohibition. People are partying more than
ever. They were drinking pretty much
every day. I mean he was still writing
every day too, but I guess like then at night, he would be
drinking and her favorite cocktail.
I kind of want to make this next time was called the Orange
Blossom. It's Usually, orange, sweetened
orange juice and gin she drank orange blossoms like every day.
So then they know they're having fun in Manhattan, but then they
went to Westport Long Island that summer.
So Scott could, like, focus more on his writing and get away from
all the partying, but the partying kind of followed them.
People just came to their house. Zelda was, apparently openly
flirting with that guy George and to get back at her scotford
with several several other women.
Yeah. Wow.
Then I went back to the city and Scott was working on his novel
every day and he's busy. So Zelda just kind of went out
and flirted with all his friends and in his diary, Scott's friend
Alex said she tried to kiss him oh no I don't know what like I
don't think they had an understanding, not only yeah.
Like I don't think he was okay with it but in a way he kind of
he knew, I think he used it like his inspiration for his books.
But I feel like he likes the challenge of it.
Yeah but I would imagine it's hard for her if she liked always
had just so much attention from guys like left and right whole
life to then be married. It's like how do you turn that
off? Yeah, yeah I know.
So that book his book that came out the side of paradise, they
were actually offered to play the main characters in the movie
version. Wow.
But Scott decided no because he thought it might damage his
writing career and confused me. Leaders, which I guess.
Yeah, why we we, I don't think he was an active, and Zelda was
very disappointed. And thought it was an
opportunity, being snatched away from her because he that lead
into trouble. Yeah, then August 1920, just
just for context women, finally, get the right to vote, oh night.
So yeah, that wasn't a thing yet March. 1921 Zelda actually
became pregnant 10. Listen to their marriage.
Wow, definitely with his child. Yeah, I think so.
Okay, yeah, I don't know if she was like actually sleeping with
anyone or if she was just kissing guys.
I don't know. But yeah, it's it's definitely
their child. They then at this point traveled
to England, France and Italy. Wow.
And I learned at this time that Pete, I didn't know that the
people would leave their address with American American Express,
so people could locate each other abroad.
You know, that I don't have. Like an international phone book
type of pillow. Interesting.
Yeah, never heard of that song. That's cool but then yeah, they
want to hear it. But then came back and then they
went to st. Paul, where he's from and on
October 26th, their daughter Francis Scott, Key Fitzgerald is
born Francis like the girl version Francis with an E, you
know, basically is the same exact name.
Oh yeah, Francis Scott. Key Fitzgerald and her nickname
is Scotty. Oh cute.
Yeah, and crazy enough. This is the first time Zelda met
Scott's parents. Oh, when they went there she's
pregnant getting go to the I know.
Yeah, they didn't go to the wedding and Zelda was in labor
for a long time. I guess in Scott said that he
would kill himself if she died very Twilight.
Yeah, varied wildly. When Scotty was born I guess
they'll do was still really loopy because she had like
anesthesia she said I hope it's a Hope, it's beautiful and a
fool. A beautiful little fool.
Oh, so that's use that in Great Gatsby on interesting.
Yep. So then November to June 19-22.
That seven months, they rented a house in lived in St.
Paul. And not that long after Scotty
was born, like, a couple months later, she became pregnant
again. But she didn't feel ready to
have another baby. So she took abortion pills and
Scott wrote in his Ledger, his son.
Down the toilet of the XXX hotel after dr.
X pills. Oh wow.
I didn't know that those pills were like accessible back then,
I know apparently. Yes, it seems like he was kind
of ashamed about it, like he did.
He censored it in his own, kind of it, diary kind of sad, but I
don't know how I felt about it March. 1922 Scott, second novel,
the beautiful and the damned was published in in the first
edition to he wrote in it. He dedicated to Zelda, he said,
for my darling wife, my dearest, sweetest Babu, without whose
love and Aid. Neither this book, or any other
would ever been possible from me?
Who loves her more than, who loves her, more every day with a
heart full of worship for her. Lovely self, Scott.
And I guess that like firts copy, he put a lock of her hair
and a blue ribbon and was pressed inside the cover.
And I guess it's still there to this day.
Wow, mmm. Once again, they were asked to
play the main characters in a movie version but Scott
declined. And once again that very much
upset, so the and when they went to see the movie, she was pissed
and said, loudly in the theater that was like, criticizing the
performance. And Scott also said, he thought
was the worst movie ever, saw. I know.
Yeah, not not happy with me version.
That first Elda had encouraged. Scott to use her journal.
Things you said for inspiration in his writing but now she was
getting kind of sick of it. Don't like the he was using so
much of her for inspiration. It's sweet that he is though.
Yeah, I know but I think this is when this is when she starts to
be like I want to make things I want to do things.
She wasn't she didn't want to be doing nothing and yeah let's add
that you wanted to act in the films and I don't know if she
too like was she a good act? I don't think that they
necessarily would have been able to do that.
Yeah, October 1922, they returned East to New York and
they rented a house on Long Island so Scott could focus on
writing. So while they're living on Long
Island, Scott later said that this time was full of failure
and miseries drinking and debt, people came to their house all
the time to party and I guess next door, was a bootlegger who
lived like a millionaire just so Gatsby.
I know, They were drinking a lot I guess one night Scott spent 43
dollars alone on alcohol which is like five hundred dollars
today. My God and Zelda became so
intoxicated one night that she drove their Rolls-Royce off the
pier into the Great Neck Bay but luckily the tide was out.
Okay, geez. Yeah, I know they were not good
at. I think that because of the
success like he had his first book and then the short story
the movie rights, like they had a lot of money at first.
They got used to spending it and now they didn't have as much
money, but we're still kind of living lavishly.
Yeah, I didn't have that much money.
So they were really just blowing all their money and I guess got
would get really obnoxious. When he was drunk one time, he
chewed a wad of twenty dollar bills started.
Proclaiming, I'm an alcoholic. Oh my God.
No, those bells are like and I guess they'll does.
Zelda's sister and husband came to visit once for lunch, but
when they arrived Scott and Zelda, we're still in bed with
hangovers. That was so rude.
They're so secure the baby. They have like a nanny.
Okay. Yeah, I know.
Yeah, I think that they did really love Scotty and they did
spend time with her but they were still up to their party and
stuff. I know, but people even though,
like, they're getting pretty messy now people still thought
that they appeared to be the perfect.
Couple? Yeah, the editor Of the dial
Gilbert. Celled said that.
When he saw zeldin Scott, it was like, seeing two of the most
beautiful people in the world floating toward me smiling.
People said they saw them often locked in their own world
talking, drinking kissing, sometimes falling asleep in each
others arms. Thank you, Zelda.
Started writing short stories and having them published to
what is encouraged to put Scott's name on the byline for
more money. And sometimes there's just
Scott's name. Oh.
It was pretty upsetting. Yes.
It would be like Zelda and if Scott Fitzgerald.
Yeah. And then the next it seemed like
he like helped her. Yeah, kind of sucked, but they
were like, well, you'll make more money if it says, F Scott.
Yeah, exactly. That's sad.
Um, I can 24 they set sail for France where it was much cheaper
to live because the exchange rate was way better for the
dollars favor and there they would feel more rich and free I
guess. Midnight a minute.
I'm Parris. Yep.
But then, yeah, they went to Paris, then they moved down to
the French Riviera and this is June 1924 Zelda began an affair
with a French pilot named Edward Chozen.
And this has been Scott was writing The Great Gatsby, so I
could see for him. Like it's a Great Gatsby.
Like, That really is like drawing on inspiration from his
own relationship with her like feeling.
Like he's just kind of not good enough.
Yeah yeah true. I'm gonna pull out a little More
like in theme with the episode Drinkin Drinkin.
I cannot drink that much though. I'll get some over tonight.
We're in general. In general.
Look at body. Just like, doesn't respond.
Well, I feel like Scott It was often said that he would have
like, one drink and then being come so drunk.
But then it seems like later in life.
I don't know if it's taller. One tolerance one up or
something, but he was drinking more.
But yeah, it seems like he actually was one of those people
that for some reason his body just like didn't process on call
that much. I could drink like every single
day and my tolerance would not go up really?
Yeah, I do think when you get older, it starts to not work.
Go down my bilirubin, my livers, always elevated your, what my
Billy. Reuben?
I don't even know what that is. I'm in your liver.
It's always whenever I get like a blood workup at the doctor's,
it's always elevated. Do they tell you that or do you
just like, look at the they tell me they're like, oh, some people
are just like that, but I'm like, is that why?
I don't really process alcohol that well, because my name is
not that. Like, I don't even know what
that does. I don't know sometimes if you're
a doctor, we're so lucky to have you on this Earth.
Thank you. I know a doctor.
Wow. I think that they're just so
busy. I get it.
Yeah, but sometimes, I'm like, I think doctors are not concerned
about things. I've told you this story, my
legs are going numb all the time and no one was taking it
seriously. Yeah, I kind of had to look into
it myself and the lady at the health food store, help me.
Oh my God, but he was like, okay, hello.
My legs are going completely, not in that case.
I really bad and they're just like, it's because half so many
patients. Yeah, You're just like, they
just want to like get you in and get you out of there and then
you like read your chart after and you're like what, why does
it say like yeah. I don't know.
I know something concerning. Oh, what happens?
Yeah, sometimes actually Zelda was having, I didn't include it
because I didn't think I had time, but she was having a lot
of issues. I think she was having, like
abdominal pain. She was Ill a lot when they're
in Europe. I think she ended up being like
her appendix out or something, but I don't get how it seems
like it's going on. Going on for months though.
Oh really? It was like an emergency?
Yeah, yeah. I don't know.
Yeah. So they're in the French.
Riviera Scott is too busy to hang out with her.
He's working on The Great Gatsby and they start making all these
friends. They were really good at making
friends or maybe his friends and friends and, you know, people
but she started having an affair with this French pilot named Ed
Wood, it Ward and you Indeed, you o AR DS like the French.
Hmm. Fine.
And the book that book, I read called the Gatsby Affair.
By Kendall Taylor was so focused on this affair.
It was like, I do think it was a huge part of their lives but she
kind of made him be like a third character in the whole story and
I skipped something out of it because they're be like a whole
chapter just about Edward and like his childhood and okay this
is not relevant but she I thought it was like a huge, huge
deal and Zelda's life. How long did it last for only
about month? Oh snot yeah.
Yeah I know and like even you know later in their life when
they're older the book would tell you like what Edward was up
to. Oh it seems like she kind of I
mean I do think it was a big deal in Zelda's life but I I'm
sorry Kendall Taylor for listening but I feel like she
just kind of came up with like this thesis like yeah I was in
love with handsome as me. Yeah, but I don't know.
Did they write letters to each other after it ended, or never
spoke again. And did she like, write in a
journal about it? Like, there's no way to know
that it was. Yeah, well.
So she wrote Delta wrote two novels one called save me, the
waltz in one called Caesars things and they both I think
both of them had correct me if I'm wrong people but both of
them had part about having an affair with a pilot.
Okay? So it was obviously like a Big
deal in her life story but yeah, during the summer that summer
Scott was convinced that having sex with Des decreased his
creativity. So he was practicing abstinence
interesting. Hmm.
Which probably in five overwhelmed, sell know who was
clearly into some. Yeah I think she's got needs.
I've heard of people doing stuff like that.
Have you? Yeah yeah.
Yeah. To concentrate.
I feel like I'm thinking more distracted.
I know some people think that they need to channel that energy
like yeah, whatever. I had a friend who believe that
that would affect his athletic abilities.
They know who I'm talking about. No.
He's not my friend. I don't guess it was
interesting. Yeah he told everybody maybe it
just Fred but yeah just like keep this in.
Yeah, keep it in. They don't know where doc.
Yeah. Wow that's a lot of
self-control. I know I wonder if that's just
an excuse. Maybe there's also like a little
bit of fear just in general but I don't know.
I wonder if Scott was kind of making an excuse or for this
100%. I want to say I wonder if he was
like a little not less attracted to him to Zelda but like didn't
we didn't want to sleep with her after her Affair maybe and so.
Well at this point he doesn't know about the pilot but he did
know about I think like the other flirtations and stuff
George. Yeah.
So Zelda well he's being abstinent Zelda.
Be can't begin. A whirlwind affair with Edward.
And as I said that book, I read dedicated huge amount of it to
him and Edward, actually spoke very little English and Zelda
was only like proficient in French but they were very
attracted to each other. You spent a lot of time at the
beach where Scott didn't really go because he was ashamed of his
feet, okay? And I'm happy apparently until
he was 12 years old, he never showed anybody his feet.
What's wrong with that? Well, I guess I don't know if it
was both of them are just one but his toes kind of like Criss
crossed over each other and he's very ashamed of that and he
always wore socks. Never took his psyche so it's
one said something to him one time.
Yeah. Maybe I'm not somebody who gets
like really grossed out about feet.
Be honest with you. Some people like really are like
be it. I don't ya me.
I'm saying I don't love you but like I don't hate them either.
Like same time, you never likely won't be like, yeah, people
really do. Got like yeah I stood by weird
feet not I don't care. Yeah, I don't love them but same
they don't think pulse me either because it's like I see fee
every single day so it's like not crazy to see another pair of
feet. What about sorry listeners.
What about someone's feet there? I really not cared for though,
like really, really wonky, gross toenails.
You know, if they smelled I think that like, other than
that, I don't know. I just okay.
Yeah. The human body in general,
doesn't really gross me out too much good?
Yeah, that's healthy. Yeah.
It's Ed's got obviously, a lot of Shame on his feet.
So he didn't really go to the beach because he didn't like to
take his shoes off. Scott on July 13th. 1924 Scott
learned about the affair. Wow, I'm not really sure.
I don't know if anybody really knows, but somehow he learned
about it. And in The Ledger he will
actually maybe this is how he learned about heard about it.
My next bullet point, no one knows.
We're talking in The Ledger. He said this was the big crisis
and Zelda confessed. Her love to Edward and said that
he wants, she wanted a divorce. I know she said I love with him
and I want a divorce. And what happened next is kind
of up in the air. There's like a couple different
stories. Scott told his relatives that he
tried to fight Edouard, but Edward refused to fight him.
Some people think it went down, like, in The Great Gatsby where
because he also, said, he made Edward, he told Zelda, to tell,
Edward to comment like, claim her basically, like, come over
here and say. Yeah, tell it to my face.
Yeah, the kind of like The Great Gatsby.
Beware. What?
How's it go? It's like tell tell Tom you
never loved him and like she won't do it.
I don't know. People think it might have kind
of gone down like this. But apparently the confrontation
never occurred and Scott also claimed that he locked cells in
her room until Edward came to claim her but he never did.
Oh, that's sad. I know.
And apparently Edward didn't, actually, I don't think he
actually wanted Zelda to leave her husband for him.
I think he's Is more of like a casual thing.
I don't think he was actually planning on.
Yeah, Mary we should ever is fucked up and she really got
swept up in it and I think she was really heartbroken from the
whole thing. Yeah.
So I can see why. Yeah, I thought it was like,
very significant. Yeah but it is it is crazy.
Like I don't know, I guess Selden Scott seemed happy and
then all of a sudden maybe not all of a sudden but she just was
ready to leave him for this guy. And Scott actually he wrote that
he always I felt like Zelda was looking for a more powerful male
like Edward. He wrote he wrote, I am half
feminine. That is my mind is in the last
analysis, she is a stronger person than I am.
I have creative fire but I am a weak individual.
She knows this and really looks upon me as a woman.
Oh, that's what he thought least.
Yeah, well I mean there's something very like emasculating
to about a man getting cheated on me so I could see kind of
what he would think that. And at this point I think he's
been too young quite. Yeah.
Yeah, and he's doesn't leave her.
I know it's really sad, but it kind of reminds me of like, Joe,
DiMaggio and Marilyn Monroe in a way where it's like, well you
knew she was like this. Yeah, exactly.
And I think that's a part of it though.
Like, he was attracted to like that that other people found her
attractive because it's the like prize of Lego but she chose me.
Yeah. Yeah.
I mean, I feel like women feel like that all the time.
Like a guy is like a bachelor. Something a bad boy.
Yeah. Like idea of like oh but like,
they'll settle down for me. Yeah.
But I think he wanted that and Caroline make anybody change
their ways? I know.
Joe DiMaggio was totally like that to like he knew Marilyn was
like this sexy lady like you know, her job was basically
being sexy but he wanted her to change for him.
Yeah. Yeah, you can't really expect
that right now. If you're listening guys, look
at be easier to find someone who's not very flirty and sexy
and then they change to be. Yeah, yeah, for you.
You have for yeah. Yeah, just for you.
Yeah, easier. Um, and she likes all that.
Definitely had like a very sexual fiery energy in Scott.
I guess did not really. And I kind of said this earlier,
but his friend, Oscar Kalman, I don't how many freakin friends I
had, but Um, wrote about him and said about Scott and said he was
not very interested in sex. Dot, dot dot, not very Lively
male animal. Scott like the idea of sex for
its romance and daring but was not strongly sexed and inclined
to feel the ACT is not strongly sexed and he was inclined to
feel that actual Act of sex was messy.
It's very that's so interesting though, because I feel like a
lot of women would actually love that.
The right of him cheating on. You is so small be crew.
He's sex is a very romantic thing.
He's not looking for it from other people but it's so
interesting that he's then gravitating towards a woman
who's like, yeah, outwardly. Sexy.
Yeah. So, you know, he's a kind of
setting himself up I know in August he wrote in his Ledger
Zelda and I close together so I guess they were the affair thing
blew up in jail. Why?
But I guess in August, he felt like they were better.
But then he wrote also about the affair.
I knew something had happened that could never be repaired.
Hmm. And that's where I was going to
end part 1 actually. Can it be repaired?
I don't know. Well, I dunno, but it's only
1924, but I felt like so much happened in the beginning of the
relationship. Yeah.
Oh, that is a cliffhanger really.
Yeah, I don't know how it's gonna, I honestly don't know.
They're look the rest of their relationship.
Like, do they live old together and like die as a married?
Couple II to be honest, truth. Be told, I do not know, I guess
you'll find again. Is it tragically?
Because it Yeah, it is pretty tragic but but it's not
completely dark and black and terrible, but mmm.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. It doesn't seem like it's going
in a good direction to be honest with you.
I know. Yeah.
Well yeah. I guess we can't really tease
next week. I think you guys know next week.
Yeah. Well on patreon will be
continuing The story was there. Anything else you wanted to chat
about before we sign off? I think.
So, was there anything like extra That last episode I was
saying, I want to Lana and John Mayer to be together, but she's
engaged now in her songs in The Great Gatsby movie.
So yeah, lighted did. Yeah, I think so.
Yeah. So I was maybe you never know.
I mean, I want her to, I want her to have a successful
engagement and marriage and stuff.
So I hope I was wrong. Poor John.
Yeah, he'll find some. I will trigger somebody.
He'll find someone. Yeah, he'll think I'll date him
Johnny. Honestly, I honestly like II am
stupid. He's cheating.
Yeah, I like, I think so. He's a little, he's kind of has
elbow tight. He is.
He is, he is a hopeless romantic though, John Mayer.
Yeah, I think so too. And make she clearly He is
romantic to I mean, she wrote really speed things, I didn't
read them all obviously what she wrote very very, very lovely
things to Scott. She would kind of sprinkle in
some questionable things do. But yes.
Would you say that like attention was her currency in a
sense? Like maybe her if her whole like
adolescence like getting attention from boys with
something that like meet her, the most popular powerful girl
in town. Yeah, it's gonna be really hard
as you get older and your a married Men and like and you
don't have a job. You're not allowed to act in
these movies, you want? Yeah.
Don't get the credit for your writing.
Yeah. Like what else does she have?
Exactly. She's still she's getting like
power from her interactions with men.
Yeah I think she was starting to feel really restless.
Yeah. Looking for some kind of Outlet.
Yeah. Just like guys can just be so
entertaining. I'm really bored and like I just
want Like, yeah, I'm from the guy.
Yeah, their relationship definitely changes a lot in part
two, I would say. Well, I don't know.
I feel like that 153 fast. Actually, it did.
Yeah, I'm excited for the next episode.
Thank you guys so much for listening and we'll get back
together next week. We'll see you then.