1
00:00:00,700 --> 00:00:08,800
Are You Lonesome Tonight? 
Do you miss me tonight? 

2
00:00:09,100 --> 00:00:11,900
Are you sorry? 
We drifted. 

3
00:00:16,400 --> 00:00:21,200
Welcome to vegan lovers. 
Welcome we are your hosts. 

4
00:00:21,200 --> 00:00:26,800
My name is Mel and I'm kill and 
thanks for joining us because 

5
00:00:26,800 --> 00:00:34,000
ins friends friends Miles. 
Can you say used to be remains 

6
00:00:34,500 --> 00:00:37,800
co-host, creative partner. 
Yep, neighbors. 

7
00:00:38,200 --> 00:00:40,300
Kind of live in the same 
neighborhood. 

8
00:00:41,100 --> 00:00:50,000
Yeah, best of friends. 
This is from our old podcast and

9
00:00:50,000 --> 00:00:52,300
other weather Twilight. 
Where we talked about Twilight 

10
00:00:52,400 --> 00:00:56,400
and now this is our fifth 
episode. 

11
00:00:56,400 --> 00:00:59,200
Wow, of the Sith epizootic 
podcast. 

12
00:00:59,200 --> 00:01:04,099
And guys, This is a wicked long 
one so we're gonna waste no 

13
00:01:04,099 --> 00:01:05,800
time. 
We're going to just go right 

14
00:01:05,800 --> 00:01:09,800
into it. 
Okay so might as well just start

15
00:01:09,800 --> 00:01:16,100
now and then this is when James 
Taylor met Carly Simon. 

16
00:01:16,500 --> 00:01:20,400
Wow, what's your perception of 
their relationship Kelly? 

17
00:01:21,200 --> 00:01:28,800
I don't really know anything. 
I I guess that he was kind of a 

18
00:01:28,800 --> 00:01:32,100
jerk or something, but I don't 
know anything else. 

19
00:01:32,100 --> 00:01:33,300
Yeah. 
Yeah. 

20
00:01:33,300 --> 00:01:36,200
Which surprised me. 
I mean, I'm not going to spoil 

21
00:01:36,200 --> 00:01:40,500
it, but he has such a soft voice
and he's so like, his music is 

22
00:01:40,500 --> 00:01:43,100
so sweet. 
Yeah, so he seems. 

23
00:01:43,100 --> 00:01:45,400
So gentle. 
I really never knew anything 

24
00:01:45,400 --> 00:01:48,100
about them their relationship, 
and I would always get confused,

25
00:01:48,100 --> 00:01:52,100
whether he was actually married 
to Carly Simon or Carole King, 

26
00:01:52,100 --> 00:02:01,500
but it's Carol Real assignment 
other girls hymen. 

27
00:02:04,200 --> 00:02:08,199
Yeah, Carly Simon was his wife 
of several years. 

28
00:02:08,199 --> 00:02:12,400
They had a beautiful 
relationship that I would 

29
00:02:12,400 --> 00:02:19,100
describe as yeah, bitter because
that's not very beautiful. 

30
00:02:19,100 --> 00:02:23,400
It is a beautiful relationship. 
I just got its bitter, bitter 

31
00:02:23,900 --> 00:02:26,200
toxic. 
They're toxic. 

32
00:02:26,200 --> 00:02:27,200
Okay. 
Okay. 

33
00:02:27,200 --> 00:02:29,200
And then we good. 
I was heartbreaking. 

34
00:02:29,200 --> 00:02:34,500
I would say, but also very sweet
at times. 

35
00:02:34,500 --> 00:02:38,800
So yeah, I can be that way. 
Yeah, exactly. 

36
00:02:39,800 --> 00:02:41,500
That's what made it so 
heartbreaking. 

37
00:02:41,500 --> 00:02:44,300
But yeah, our boy James Vernon 
Taylor. 

38
00:02:44,300 --> 00:02:50,400
He was born on March 12th, 1948.
He was one of five children, the

39
00:02:50,408 --> 00:02:54,700
second oldest, his dad Isaac. 
He was a doctor who I think is 

40
00:02:54,700 --> 00:02:59,200
like Well known in medicine and 
later became the dean of 

41
00:02:59,200 --> 00:03:01,900
medicine at the University of 
North Carolina. 

42
00:03:02,000 --> 00:03:06,600
And his mom Gertrude Trudy who's
like a painter and a weaver and 

43
00:03:06,600 --> 00:03:09,100
a photographer. 
I think kind of I think I don't 

44
00:03:09,100 --> 00:03:10,600
know if that's like what she 
sounds cool. 

45
00:03:10,600 --> 00:03:12,500
Yeah, I don't know if it's like 
what she did or that was like 

46
00:03:12,500 --> 00:03:13,800
Hobbies. 
Yeah. 

47
00:03:14,100 --> 00:03:16,800
Part of being like a homemaker, 
I'm not sure he was born in 

48
00:03:16,800 --> 00:03:21,400
Boston, actually, he's a Boston 
boy, everybody connects, I know 

49
00:03:21,400 --> 00:03:26,100
seriously so many of our couples
are massachusetts-based You 

50
00:03:26,100 --> 00:03:28,700
know, that and we're from 
Massachusetts. 

51
00:03:30,600 --> 00:03:34,700
And, but at age, three James's 
family, relocated to Chapel 

52
00:03:34,700 --> 00:03:36,900
Hill, North Carolina. 
Hmm. 

53
00:03:36,900 --> 00:03:40,500
I know this song Carolina in my 
mind and they would still go 

54
00:03:40,500 --> 00:03:42,900
back to Massachusetts. 
Though to spend the summers in 

55
00:03:42,900 --> 00:03:45,200
Martha's Vineyard. 
Oh, really? 

56
00:03:45,500 --> 00:03:48,800
That would be significant. 
I love my husband. 

57
00:03:48,800 --> 00:03:52,600
Yeah, they're big, big Martha's 
Vineyard family. 

58
00:03:52,600 --> 00:03:56,400
The Taylor's well I age. 
Seven James's. 

59
00:03:56,400 --> 00:04:01,800
Father actually went off on a 
two-year long expedition to 

60
00:04:02,000 --> 00:04:03,800
Antarctica. 
Really. 

61
00:04:03,900 --> 00:04:09,300
Hmm to do research there when he
returned, he was an alcoholic. 

62
00:04:09,300 --> 00:04:14,500
Oh my God, how long is it for 
two years? 

63
00:04:14,900 --> 00:04:18,000
For some reason, I heard years, 
I thought months know about two 

64
00:04:18,000 --> 00:04:21,500
months, he came out about two 
years geez, that led to the 

65
00:04:21,500 --> 00:04:26,000
breakdown of his parents 
marriage, which had A big impact

66
00:04:26,000 --> 00:04:28,800
on James and later on in his 
life. 

67
00:04:28,800 --> 00:04:32,400
I actually don't know how I know
this, it's in my notes, but I've

68
00:04:32,400 --> 00:04:35,600
read it somewhere that in 
therapy sessions with his 

69
00:04:35,600 --> 00:04:40,900
father, his father theorize that
he subconsciously never loved 

70
00:04:40,900 --> 00:04:45,000
James has mom because his own 
mother died during childbirth 

71
00:04:45,000 --> 00:04:48,400
and so he never let himself get 
attached to his wife. 

72
00:04:49,000 --> 00:04:52,300
What kind of cruel? 
I mean maybe it wasn't 

73
00:04:52,300 --> 00:04:54,800
intentional but yeah. 
Subconsciously. 

74
00:04:55,600 --> 00:04:58,900
So obviously jeans is a lot of 
like, family trauma. 

75
00:04:58,900 --> 00:05:02,200
They're growing up in Martha's 
Vineyard in the Summers. 

76
00:05:02,200 --> 00:05:07,000
He met a guy named Danny 
kortchmar an aspiring guitarist 

77
00:05:07,000 --> 00:05:10,600
and they became they began 
singing folk music together and 

78
00:05:10,600 --> 00:05:14,300
coffee shops. 
As a duo called, Jamie & Koch as

79
00:05:14,300 --> 00:05:17,300
teenagers. 
And during those 10 years, James

80
00:05:17,300 --> 00:05:19,800
really struggled. 
He went to school called Milton 

81
00:05:19,800 --> 00:05:22,300
Academy in Massachusetts. 
Actually, it was a boarding 

82
00:05:22,300 --> 00:05:26,400
school and he originally had 
Really good grades, but he was 

83
00:05:26,400 --> 00:05:29,500
really depressed and struggled a
lot with the pressure of school 

84
00:05:29,500 --> 00:05:34,600
and everything, and he would 
upwards of 20 times 20 hours a 

85
00:05:34,608 --> 00:05:38,800
day like, just sleep. 
So, when he was a teenager, he 

86
00:05:38,800 --> 00:05:41,900
checked himself into McLean, 
Hospital and Belmont. 

87
00:05:41,900 --> 00:05:46,400
Massachusetts are on Christian 
worked there there for many 

88
00:05:46,400 --> 00:05:50,600
years. 
Hi Christine, and he lived there

89
00:05:50,600 --> 00:05:54,900
for nine months actually. 
Wow, and finish his school. 

90
00:05:55,600 --> 00:05:58,900
The Arlington school which is I 
think a school in the hospital, 

91
00:05:58,900 --> 00:06:03,900
which is crazy and he also wrote
a ton of music while he was at 

92
00:06:03,900 --> 00:06:06,000
McLean's. 
So that just goes to show. 

93
00:06:06,000 --> 00:06:09,800
If you're going through a tough 
time you know something good can

94
00:06:09,800 --> 00:06:11,600
come out of it and something 
beautiful. 

95
00:06:11,600 --> 00:06:14,100
Yeah and good for him for 
checking himself in. 

96
00:06:14,100 --> 00:06:17,400
I mean that's like the probably 
was like a lot more stigma about

97
00:06:17,400 --> 00:06:21,900
that back in the day. 
I know that's what this little 

98
00:06:21,900 --> 00:06:24,900
sound wrong but it's like 
weirdly nice to hear. 

99
00:06:25,000 --> 00:06:29,000
Here because I don't know. 
I know, I know, it's so not true

100
00:06:29,000 --> 00:06:31,400
at all but I always think of 
stuff like that is like being a 

101
00:06:31,407 --> 00:06:34,000
modern thing like teens are 
depressed. 

102
00:06:34,000 --> 00:06:35,600
You know. 
Yeah, exactly. 

103
00:06:35,600 --> 00:06:37,000
No. 
I mean, people have always been 

104
00:06:37,000 --> 00:06:38,500
struggling. 
Yeah. 

105
00:06:38,500 --> 00:06:45,200
I mean you can like struggle and
still, you know, be like very 

106
00:06:45,200 --> 00:06:48,800
successful and a well-known 
musician and creative like, you 

107
00:06:48,800 --> 00:06:51,500
don't have to be ashamed of it 
and like, there's no nothing 

108
00:06:51,500 --> 00:06:52,800
wrong with getting yourself 
help. 

109
00:06:52,800 --> 00:06:56,700
So, Another better man. 
Yeah, I mean I probably could 

110
00:06:56,700 --> 00:07:01,600
have by actually has been made 
Danny. 

111
00:07:01,600 --> 00:07:05,100
Encouraged him to check himself 
out of the hospital after nine 

112
00:07:05,100 --> 00:07:06,700
months. 
And so then they headed to New 

113
00:07:06,700 --> 00:07:10,200
York and formed a band with 
their friend friends, Joel, 

114
00:07:10,200 --> 00:07:13,500
O'Brien, and Zachary Weisner 
called The Flying Machine. 

115
00:07:13,900 --> 00:07:17,500
In New York, James really 
struggled and experimented with 

116
00:07:17,500 --> 00:07:21,500
drugs. 
I know he started experimenting 

117
00:07:21,500 --> 00:07:23,800
with Heroin, which is friend. 
Danny was really upset. 

118
00:07:24,000 --> 00:07:27,900
About can like John Lennon. 
Yeah, that's so true. 

119
00:07:27,900 --> 00:07:31,600
Everything connects, I feel like
messing around on her guys, 

120
00:07:31,600 --> 00:07:34,700
seriously, he would actually 
perform in Washington Square 

121
00:07:34,700 --> 00:07:38,800
Park and then fall asleep. 
Oh man, I know the band released

122
00:07:38,800 --> 00:07:41,200
a music together, but it wasn't 
really a hit. 

123
00:07:41,800 --> 00:07:44,200
And he was just in a really bad 
place and was running out of 

124
00:07:44,200 --> 00:07:48,200
money in 1967. 
He was dropped by his manager. 

125
00:07:48,400 --> 00:07:51,600
He called this father, Isaac, 
who traveled to New York to 

126
00:07:51,600 --> 00:07:54,900
Stage an intervention and bring 
James, who was 10:19 back to 

127
00:07:54,907 --> 00:07:58,100
North Carolina, I was only 19. 
Mmm. 

128
00:07:58,200 --> 00:08:01,300
So we brought it back to North 
Carolina, to get help for his 

129
00:08:01,300 --> 00:08:04,800
drug addiction later that year. 
When he was sober James, then 

130
00:08:04,800 --> 00:08:08,900
moved to London with his friend 
Danny, and they got hooked up 

131
00:08:08,900 --> 00:08:13,800
with the Beatles talent scout. 
Again, connects to our last 

132
00:08:13,800 --> 00:08:19,400
episode and they played The 
Beatles. 

133
00:08:19,400 --> 00:08:23,300
James is demo of a song called 
something in the Way She Moves, 

134
00:08:23,300 --> 00:08:28,200
or they played To Paul McCartney
and George Harrison, fillers 

135
00:08:28,200 --> 00:08:31,000
dull. 
I know I had and they stole the 

136
00:08:31,000 --> 00:08:35,299
line with the zong, something. 
And then he was, then the first 

137
00:08:35,299 --> 00:08:38,600
non-british artist to be signed 
by Apple records. 

138
00:08:39,400 --> 00:08:41,100
That's so cool. 
Mmm. 

139
00:08:41,100 --> 00:08:43,799
Yeah, so he really collaborating
with the Beatles a lot 

140
00:08:43,799 --> 00:08:48,500
throughout his career. 
So he recorded his first album 

141
00:08:48,700 --> 00:08:52,000
in 1968. 
And yeah, again, collaborated 

142
00:08:52,000 --> 00:08:56,200
with the Beatles on this album. 
During this time, a close friend

143
00:08:56,200 --> 00:08:59,800
of his named Suzanne who used to
get high with had actually 

144
00:08:59,800 --> 00:09:02,500
committed. 
Suicide, I don't think they ever

145
00:09:02,500 --> 00:09:06,100
romantically linked, but she was
inspiration for the song Fire 

146
00:09:06,100 --> 00:09:08,500
and Rain. 
The verse like, Suzanne the 

147
00:09:09,900 --> 00:09:12,000
dreams they made put an end to 
you. 

148
00:09:12,700 --> 00:09:17,700
I can't picture. 
Oh yeah. 

149
00:09:19,000 --> 00:09:23,100
But during this time, James also
began using heroin again after 

150
00:09:23,100 --> 00:09:28,200
we're not home. 1969 after 
recording his first album, he 

151
00:09:28,200 --> 00:09:31,600
returned to the US and underwent
treatment again in Chicago. 

152
00:09:31,600 --> 00:09:36,800
And there, they put him on 
methadone maintenance to get him

153
00:09:36,800 --> 00:09:39,800
clean from heroin, but then he 
just got hooked on that instead.

154
00:09:39,800 --> 00:09:43,400
So, no, not really looking good 
for James. 

155
00:09:44,100 --> 00:09:47,800
His first album James Taylor was
then released which received 

156
00:09:47,800 --> 00:09:52,300
moderate success and he used the
money from that album to then by

157
00:09:52,300 --> 00:09:56,200
175 a Acres of wood on Martha's 
Vineyard. 

158
00:09:56,200 --> 00:09:59,700
Wow because he loves markers 
Vineyard so much and then he 

159
00:09:59,700 --> 00:10:02,900
began recording his second 
studio album Sweet Baby James 

160
00:10:02,900 --> 00:10:09,100
which in 1975 sold, 1.5 million 
copies in its first year and was

161
00:10:09,100 --> 00:10:11,400
the number third on the 
Billboard Chart and was 

162
00:10:11,400 --> 00:10:14,900
nominated for several Grammys 
including album of the year. 

163
00:10:15,600 --> 00:10:17,700
And after his success, he began 
touring. 

164
00:10:17,700 --> 00:10:22,100
It was a lot of talk shows. 
He was even on the cover of Time

165
00:10:22,100 --> 00:10:26,100
Magazine with the headline. 
The new face of the face of new 

166
00:10:26,100 --> 00:10:32,100
rock and who would look at this 
cover and say, that's the man. 

167
00:10:32,100 --> 00:10:37,100
I'm going to marry Carly. 
Simon really walking down the 

168
00:10:37,100 --> 00:10:39,000
street. 
She says, I was walking down the

169
00:10:39,008 --> 00:10:42,200
street with my sister. 
We had just cramped in Indian 

170
00:10:42,200 --> 00:10:44,900
food into our mouths and were 
walking home and I looked at 

171
00:10:44,900 --> 00:10:48,200
that cover of Time Magazine. 
And it was James Taylor whom I 

172
00:10:48,200 --> 00:10:51,500
never met and I looked at him 
for Fairly far away. 

173
00:10:51,500 --> 00:10:53,700
And I said to my sister, I'm 
going to marry that, man. 

174
00:10:53,800 --> 00:10:58,600
Man, mmm that's crazy that you 
know, his music and least. 

175
00:10:58,600 --> 00:11:02,500
Yeah, so Dad and actually, they 
had met previously. 

176
00:11:02,600 --> 00:11:05,900
Oh, and Martha's still. 
Nice story. 

177
00:11:05,900 --> 00:11:09,900
Yeah, it is a nice story and I 
was just thinking I feel like 

178
00:11:09,900 --> 00:11:15,800
that comes up so often where 
someone will say and, you know, 

179
00:11:15,800 --> 00:11:19,900
with no evidence, I know I'm 
gonna marry that person and then

180
00:11:19,900 --> 00:11:22,900
they do it. 
I've heard that too, it's so 

181
00:11:22,900 --> 00:11:27,600
weird and it's like, Do they 
just say it to like make it 

182
00:11:27,600 --> 00:11:32,400
happen or I don't know or do 
they say that a couple times? 

183
00:11:32,400 --> 00:11:35,900
I know I don't know because 
there was a brief period where I

184
00:11:35,908 --> 00:11:38,500
would go on dates with people 
and then I would text my friend 

185
00:11:38,500 --> 00:11:40,400
Marissa like I'm going to marry 
that guy. 

186
00:11:40,400 --> 00:11:42,600
No way. 
See if that like would then be 

187
00:11:42,600 --> 00:11:46,000
the person would mirror but 
never would be well, did you 

188
00:11:46,000 --> 00:11:49,200
feel it? 
No, that's really what. 

189
00:11:53,800 --> 00:11:56,700
Think of someone here. 
Remember, can you think of 

190
00:11:56,700 --> 00:11:58,700
another example of someone who 
did that? 

191
00:11:58,800 --> 00:12:01,000
Well, my next episode. 
Someone do. 

192
00:12:03,300 --> 00:12:09,700
Okay, it's just such a common 
thing. 

193
00:12:09,700 --> 00:12:10,900
Yeah. 
Okay. 

194
00:12:10,900 --> 00:12:14,500
So miss Carly Simon, Carly 
Elizabeth Simon. 

195
00:12:14,900 --> 00:12:19,700
She was born June 25th in either
1943 or 1945. 

196
00:12:19,700 --> 00:12:21,700
No one knows what year she was 
born. 

197
00:12:21,700 --> 00:12:25,600
Not even Wikipedia. 
I don't know why I don't I'm 

198
00:12:25,600 --> 00:12:32,300
sure she's yeah, this happens 
with as I said in the Atlantis 

199
00:12:32,300 --> 00:12:37,300
one stages are slow. 
So yeah, it's weird. 

200
00:12:37,400 --> 00:12:40,000
Like, I always thought that 
like, celebrities like it was 

201
00:12:40,000 --> 00:12:42,300
just common knowledge, but their
birthdays are. 

202
00:12:42,300 --> 00:12:45,300
But some of these people slip 
through the cracks? 

203
00:12:45,800 --> 00:12:50,100
Yeah, she is Carly. 
Simon of Simon & Schuster. 

204
00:12:50,100 --> 00:12:53,500
Her dad is Richard. 
L, Simon the co-founder of the 

205
00:12:53,700 --> 00:12:57,800
Shane Company who also happened 
to be a talented musician. 

206
00:12:58,100 --> 00:13:01,600
I did not know. 
I had no idea either. 

207
00:13:01,600 --> 00:13:07,600
Wow, so she comes from a lot of 
money, my God actually, but in 

208
00:13:07,600 --> 00:13:10,400
her book, she says that her dad 
had basically lost all of his 

209
00:13:10,400 --> 00:13:13,700
money and that she's not as rich
as it seems. 

210
00:13:14,100 --> 00:13:16,000
Okay. 
I believe the word. 

211
00:13:16,000 --> 00:13:21,600
Yeah, everybody remind you. 
Everyone is like Cara Delevingne

212
00:13:21,600 --> 00:13:23,400
to I know seriously. 
Yeah. 

213
00:13:23,600 --> 00:13:26,000
Yeah, like kind of connections 
seriously. 

214
00:13:26,000 --> 00:13:30,200
Yeah I though. 
Publishing heiress Carly Simon. 

215
00:13:30,400 --> 00:13:34,200
Her mom. 
Andrea Heidemann Simon was a 

216
00:13:34,200 --> 00:13:37,100
receptionist for Simon and 
Schuster but then also became a 

217
00:13:37,100 --> 00:13:40,800
civil rights activist and the 
board of directors for Riverdale

218
00:13:40,800 --> 00:13:43,200
Mental Health, Association for 
30 years. 

219
00:13:43,400 --> 00:13:44,300
Mmm. 
Yeah. 

220
00:13:44,300 --> 00:13:47,800
And she is the second youngest 
Carly of her siblings. 

221
00:13:47,900 --> 00:13:51,000
She also has sisters at Joanna, 
Lucy Carly and her brother named

222
00:13:51,000 --> 00:13:54,700
Peter. 
She was raised in Riverdale, the

223
00:13:54,700 --> 00:13:57,900
Riverdale neighborhood of the 
Bronx, and despite being well 

224
00:13:57,900 --> 00:14:00,200
off, she didn't have the 
happiest childhood. 

225
00:14:00,200 --> 00:14:03,800
Her dad was really cold and 
distant and struggled with 

226
00:14:03,800 --> 00:14:07,200
depression in her Memoir. 
She writes after two daughters, 

227
00:14:07,200 --> 00:14:10,000
he'd been counting on a son, a 
male a successor to be named 

228
00:14:10,000 --> 00:14:14,200
Carl when I was born he and 
Mommy simply added a wide to the

229
00:14:14,200 --> 00:14:21,700
word like an accusing Chrome 
chromosome Carly Carly, Carly 

230
00:14:21,700 --> 00:14:24,900
Simon's. 
Yeah, yeah, sadly. 

231
00:14:24,900 --> 00:14:27,500
This is named Carl. 
Know, why did they want to avoid

232
00:14:27,500 --> 00:14:30,900
in Carl's so badly? 
Because I, his dad's name or 

233
00:14:30,900 --> 00:14:36,000
something? 
Maybe, maybe at 7, she was 

234
00:14:36,200 --> 00:14:38,400
sexually abused by a family 
friend. 

235
00:14:38,400 --> 00:14:41,600
She my God, that's horrible. 
I know, and I ate she developed 

236
00:14:41,600 --> 00:14:45,200
a stutter which caused her to 
have a lot of anxiety and the 

237
00:14:45,200 --> 00:14:48,000
only Escape her with singing. 
Hmm. 

238
00:14:48,000 --> 00:14:52,200
I know but she got over that 
stutter in the 1960s. 

239
00:14:52,300 --> 00:14:55,700
At age, 16 her father, all 
actually passed away of a heart 

240
00:14:55,700 --> 00:15:00,700
attack and in 1964 Carly and her
sister, Lucy formed, a musical 

241
00:15:00,700 --> 00:15:06,000
Duo the Simon sisters, where 
they would perform in none other

242
00:15:06,000 --> 00:15:12,900
than Martha's Vineyard what and 
they were signed by cap records 

243
00:15:12,900 --> 00:15:18,100
and had a minor Hit And just 
before dating James Carly 

244
00:15:18,100 --> 00:15:21,700
actually was briefly engaged to 
a playwright named William. 

245
00:15:23,100 --> 00:15:27,600
Mmm and in 1970, Carly signed 
with Elektra, records and 

246
00:15:27,600 --> 00:15:31,200
released her self-titled album 
in 1971, which peaked at number 

247
00:15:31,200 --> 00:15:35,300
30 on the music charts, but it 
wasn't really a huge hit then, 

248
00:15:36,400 --> 00:15:39,100
all right? 
That's Carly and James. 

249
00:15:39,200 --> 00:15:43,000
Wow, so their backstories. 
Yep. 

250
00:15:43,000 --> 00:15:47,000
But like I said, they actually 
did meet before Carly saw that 

251
00:15:47,000 --> 00:15:51,600
Time magazine article. 
There's conflicting reports, but

252
00:15:52,500 --> 00:15:55,200
They both obviously spent a lot 
of time in Martha's Vineyard 

253
00:15:55,200 --> 00:15:57,700
Carly's family would also go 
every single summer. 

254
00:15:58,000 --> 00:16:01,000
They had to know each other. 
Yeah, they knew of each other. 

255
00:16:01,500 --> 00:16:04,700
I think Carly says that James 
like she thought of him as like,

256
00:16:04,700 --> 00:16:07,700
one of the cool guys on the 
island, she's a little bit older

257
00:16:07,700 --> 00:16:10,600
than him though. 
Oh, didn't realize that. 

258
00:16:10,700 --> 00:16:14,500
So James had said previously, I 
thought she was quite attractive

259
00:16:14,500 --> 00:16:17,300
but she was and still is four 
years older than I was. 

260
00:16:17,300 --> 00:16:21,000
So back then when she was 18 and
I was 14 she was a bit less 

261
00:16:21,000 --> 00:16:24,900
approachable than she was. 
When I was 24 years old, make 

262
00:16:24,900 --> 00:16:26,400
sense. 
Yeah. 

263
00:16:28,400 --> 00:16:29,600
Yeah, it is. 
There are 14. 

264
00:16:29,600 --> 00:16:32,500
You don't have a shot with an 
18-hour all no less. 

265
00:16:32,500 --> 00:16:39,100
It's like Karlie was a huge fan 
of James, though, especially 

266
00:16:39,100 --> 00:16:43,400
when he was a hit and she writes
in her book, boys and trees that

267
00:16:43,400 --> 00:16:47,500
she had seen a photograph of 
James and Joni Mitchell they had

268
00:16:47,500 --> 00:16:50,600
actually dated previously and 
that she's 12. 

269
00:16:50,700 --> 00:16:55,100
Yeah and she felt like a nun. 
Explained rage toward Tony 

270
00:16:55,100 --> 00:16:58,700
Mitchell. 
That's so funny. 

271
00:16:58,700 --> 00:17:01,000
I know. 
I love it. 

272
00:17:01,000 --> 00:17:04,300
I love these like poke people. 
Yeah. 

273
00:17:04,400 --> 00:17:06,599
There's gonna be some more 
well-known names. 

274
00:17:06,599 --> 00:17:09,300
Later on coming up. 
I love this theme. 

275
00:17:09,300 --> 00:17:13,599
Yeah, there's very much 
conflicting accounts of when 

276
00:17:13,599 --> 00:17:16,900
they actually first met as 
adults though? 

277
00:17:16,900 --> 00:17:21,200
Mmm, if you look online, most 
sources say that they met at one

278
00:17:21,200 --> 00:17:26,599
of Carly's perform, This is at 
the Troubadour and La however in

279
00:17:26,599 --> 00:17:30,900
Carly's Memoir, she recounted 
differently that it was actually

280
00:17:30,900 --> 00:17:35,600
a James is performance in New 
York City around Thanksgiving. 

281
00:17:35,800 --> 00:17:39,300
In 1971, she was invited to 
attend the concert and then 

282
00:17:39,300 --> 00:17:43,900
invited backstage to meet James.
And I'm going to read a little 

283
00:17:43,900 --> 00:17:51,100
part of her Memoir under mean. 
I'm sure she said it then, yeah,

284
00:17:51,100 --> 00:17:53,700
that must be true. 
I'm gonna take her word over 

285
00:17:53,700 --> 00:17:56,600
like the scholars writing about 
it. 

286
00:17:56,900 --> 00:18:00,900
So she says, once I laid my eyes
on James a sense of possession, 

287
00:18:00,900 --> 00:18:06,100
overtook me as if as if a dog 
fence of little white flags, had

288
00:18:06,100 --> 00:18:08,100
sprung out of the ground around 
him. 

289
00:18:08,100 --> 00:18:12,500
The women on the periphery knew 
just how far back they must stay

290
00:18:12,500 --> 00:18:14,400
from the fence. 
To avoid getting an unpleasant 

291
00:18:14,400 --> 00:18:15,800
little joke through their 
system. 

292
00:18:16,100 --> 00:18:20,300
He turned toward me and his eyes
hadn't even met mine when I said

293
00:18:20,300 --> 00:18:23,500
before I could think if you ever
A home-cooked meal while you're 

294
00:18:23,500 --> 00:18:25,400
in New York. 
I'd love to make lunch for you. 

295
00:18:25,600 --> 00:18:27,700
He looked somewhere in the 
direction of my chin with a 

296
00:18:27,700 --> 00:18:30,500
quick shutter staff of his 
eyelids and answered what about 

297
00:18:30,500 --> 00:18:32,700
tonight? 
Okay, sure sure. 

298
00:18:32,700 --> 00:18:37,100
I said yes, please. 
Sure let's lunch. 

299
00:18:38,400 --> 00:18:41,400
Yes, please. 
That's cute. 

300
00:18:41,800 --> 00:18:44,900
So after that concert, they went
to an after party and they 

301
00:18:44,900 --> 00:18:47,800
danced around the room. 
Then they go to a friend's house

302
00:18:47,800 --> 00:18:50,700
and they smoke weed, then they 
go to Carla create. 

303
00:18:50,700 --> 00:18:52,200
Yeah, then they go to Carly's 
apartment. 

304
00:18:52,300 --> 00:18:54,900
Apartment. 
And James asks, if they can get 

305
00:18:54,900 --> 00:18:58,500
in the bed and just sleep, just 
sleep. 

306
00:18:58,500 --> 00:19:01,300
Nothing more. 
And I'm going to read a little 

307
00:19:01,300 --> 00:19:04,100
page. 
Get from her Memoir, it's kind 

308
00:19:04,100 --> 00:19:07,800
of long. 
She says soft we were sheep 

309
00:19:07,800 --> 00:19:10,000
whose fleece covered every hard 
place. 

310
00:19:10,000 --> 00:19:11,800
We curled. 
We breathe it on each other's 

311
00:19:11,800 --> 00:19:13,100
necks. 
We moved. 

312
00:19:13,100 --> 00:19:16,400
We moved our limbs gently and 
discover the surface of each 

313
00:19:16,400 --> 00:19:19,000
other's skin. 
Very little hair covered either 

314
00:19:19,000 --> 00:19:21,700
of us. 
Not the full of sheep. 

315
00:19:21,700 --> 00:19:25,400
It was just Contender as rose 
petals, I was to Trembley to 

316
00:19:25,400 --> 00:19:28,700
know where the feeling was 
coming from, but James breathing

317
00:19:28,700 --> 00:19:33,200
on my hair in my ear made rise 
and meet. 

318
00:19:33,200 --> 00:19:37,100
I think there's a typo in there,
really, let me guy hair and made

319
00:19:37,100 --> 00:19:40,500
my ear made rise. 
In me a desire. 

320
00:19:40,600 --> 00:19:45,000
You made rise and me desire, 
which equate, what comes before 

321
00:19:45,000 --> 00:19:50,500
hair? 
Or did anything it on my hair 

322
00:19:50,500 --> 00:19:56,600
and my ear made me rise made. 
Wait, reading on my hair in my 

323
00:19:56,600 --> 00:20:01,800
ear, made my made rise. 
And yes, whose are good. 

324
00:20:02,900 --> 00:20:04,700
Okay, think there's a typo in 
here? 

325
00:20:05,000 --> 00:20:08,100
Okay, I'm just gonna skip ahead.
We just go to sleep with a 

326
00:20:08,108 --> 00:20:10,300
gentle unspoken suggestion from 
the man. 

327
00:20:10,300 --> 00:20:12,300
I had already lived for a year 
or more. 

328
00:20:12,300 --> 00:20:14,900
I spent every day with 
headphones on listening to his 

329
00:20:14,900 --> 00:20:17,000
second album. 
Sweet, Baby James, and 

330
00:20:17,000 --> 00:20:20,000
harmonizing with every song. 
Imagining looking into his eyes 

331
00:20:20,000 --> 00:20:23,100
and singing with him while 
singing along to James's song. 

332
00:20:23,100 --> 00:20:27,300
So I felt Of outlook on the 
world in a sense of becoming 

333
00:20:27,300 --> 00:20:30,200
part of the song, part of the 
story, The Voice, and even part 

334
00:20:30,200 --> 00:20:32,200
of a future. 
As if I could visualize future 

335
00:20:32,200 --> 00:20:36,500
Generations years, before I 
learned circle around the Sun 

336
00:20:36,500 --> 00:20:39,600
and had performed it as my solo,
when Lucy and I were the Simon 

337
00:20:39,600 --> 00:20:42,700
sisters this year listening to 
James his first album. 

338
00:20:42,900 --> 00:20:46,800
I learned the folk song as James
sing at harmonized and phrased. 

339
00:20:46,900 --> 00:20:49,700
As he did only altering the 
arrangement, a little our 

340
00:20:49,700 --> 00:20:52,300
versions could have been 
superimposed on each other's. 

341
00:20:52,300 --> 00:20:55,900
I was in the circle of his love.
Wow. 

342
00:20:56,000 --> 00:20:58,600
And then she later writes, this 
was the same pre-adolescent. 

343
00:20:58,600 --> 00:21:01,700
Nabi need boy, who had been 
subconsciously making his way 

344
00:21:01,700 --> 00:21:07,100
around my dreams for years? 
That's crazy that she listened 

345
00:21:07,100 --> 00:21:11,200
to his music every day and now 
was lying in bed with him. 

346
00:21:11,200 --> 00:21:14,900
I know seriously, it's like a 
dream come true. 

347
00:21:15,400 --> 00:21:19,000
She does say, on this page about
the first time they met and how 

348
00:21:19,000 --> 00:21:21,400
she was. 
So obsessed with him, not to 

349
00:21:21,400 --> 00:21:23,500
skip ahead. 
But many years later he would 

350
00:21:23,500 --> 00:21:27,900
accuse me of Thank him for being
James Taylor which ironically he

351
00:21:27,900 --> 00:21:31,500
meant disparagingly but it was 
right on in a very accurate 

352
00:21:31,500 --> 00:21:33,400
description of the way. 
I felt. 

353
00:21:33,600 --> 00:21:35,800
Hmm, interesting. 
Yeah. 

354
00:21:37,000 --> 00:21:42,000
But she agrees that she, like, 
loves his image more. 

355
00:21:42,000 --> 00:21:45,500
Something, I don't think so, but
I feel like she's saying it in a

356
00:21:45,508 --> 00:21:50,000
way that's meant to be endearing
of like, yeah, I loved you 

357
00:21:50,000 --> 00:21:54,800
because you were James Taylor, 
but that's who you are like, you

358
00:21:54,800 --> 00:21:56,400
are incredible. 
Yeah, exactly. 

359
00:21:56,400 --> 00:22:00,300
Like he's, he's like 
disassociated himself from the 

360
00:22:00,300 --> 00:22:02,300
image of him but yeah, that is 
who he is. 

361
00:22:02,300 --> 00:22:06,700
Yeah, Yeah, Mmm. 
So I get that, but we're getting

362
00:22:06,700 --> 00:22:12,900
ahead of So almost immediately 
actually, after this first time 

363
00:22:12,900 --> 00:22:16,400
James moved into Carly's 
apartment in Murray Hill like 

364
00:22:16,400 --> 00:22:19,400
bright away and fur. 
Carly writes in her Memoir for 

365
00:22:19,400 --> 00:22:21,900
the next fan of time. 
He and I were never apart for 

366
00:22:21,900 --> 00:22:24,300
more than a few days. 
Then they took a trip to 

367
00:22:24,300 --> 00:22:27,300
Martha's Vineyard two weeks 
after moving in together, which 

368
00:22:27,300 --> 00:22:30,100
they both bonded over a lot 
since they both had connections 

369
00:22:30,100 --> 00:22:33,900
there and he showed her around 
the house that he was planning 

370
00:22:33,900 --> 00:22:37,600
to build. 
Wow, he actually named pond on 

371
00:22:37,600 --> 00:22:43,500
the property, Carly's bottom and
Carly writes that in those early

372
00:22:43,500 --> 00:22:47,800
days and she was very hesitant 
to give away how serious she was

373
00:22:47,800 --> 00:22:50,400
about him. 
However, one day James randomly 

374
00:22:50,400 --> 00:22:53,100
shares with her that if they 
were to ever get married, they 

375
00:22:53,100 --> 00:22:56,500
would have two children. 
A girl named Sarah and a boy 

376
00:22:56,500 --> 00:22:59,300
named Ben. 
So, again, people just kind of 

377
00:22:59,300 --> 00:23:03,500
speaking the future. 
Yeah, yeah, yes, dance, that's 

378
00:23:03,500 --> 00:23:06,300
cute. 
I know, they actually spent a 

379
00:23:06,308 --> 00:23:10,700
weekend with James is Sister, 
Kate at Martha's Vineyard who 

380
00:23:10,700 --> 00:23:13,800
was dating a guy at the time, 
who was pretty terrible and 

381
00:23:13,800 --> 00:23:17,900
aggressive and just horrible and
one night James yells at the 

382
00:23:17,900 --> 00:23:20,100
sister's boyfriend and tells him
to leave. 

383
00:23:20,100 --> 00:23:23,900
And then says he's going to go 
outside and chop wood to like 

384
00:23:23,900 --> 00:23:27,800
get his anger out and Carly 
writes that in her Memoir as 

385
00:23:27,800 --> 00:23:30,900
he's chopping wood. 
He yells out Carly. 

386
00:23:30,900 --> 00:23:37,800
I love you what? 
I know yes that it dry And then 

387
00:23:37,800 --> 00:23:42,000
as he's really handsome know 
that's the first time she 

388
00:23:42,000 --> 00:23:45,600
learns. 
Was she there? 

389
00:23:45,600 --> 00:23:57,900
Or she was like listen the house
that was so aggressive. 

390
00:23:57,900 --> 00:24:01,100
I think in like up in jeans, his
sister's face. 

391
00:24:01,100 --> 00:24:03,400
So well and Carly writes about 
that. 

392
00:24:03,400 --> 00:24:06,400
The way I saw it that night 
James had seized the moment 

393
00:24:06,400 --> 00:24:09,100
protected. 
Sister had a catharsis and in a 

394
00:24:09,100 --> 00:24:12,000
fit of love-crazed wood. 
Chopping sunk my name up to the 

395
00:24:12,000 --> 00:24:16,800
Moon. 
Well, yeah, so only a few months

396
00:24:16,800 --> 00:24:19,600
into their relationship. 
Carly goes to LA to record a 

397
00:24:19,600 --> 00:24:22,000
demo in James calls her to 
reveal that. 

398
00:24:22,000 --> 00:24:25,500
Their apartment actually had 
been flooded accidentally. 

399
00:24:26,700 --> 00:24:36,200
After he, let the water run 
night, but there was a problem 

400
00:24:36,200 --> 00:24:37,700
with the FAA. 
Asset. 

401
00:24:37,700 --> 00:24:41,800
So he like turn the water on and
then it got like fixed but he 

402
00:24:41,800 --> 00:24:43,300
left the water running. 
No. 

403
00:24:43,300 --> 00:24:47,400
So he didn't like do it on 
purpose but I have a note to 

404
00:24:47,400 --> 00:24:50,000
read page 242. 
I don't know why I'm going to 

405
00:24:50,000 --> 00:24:53,200
read it. 
Okay, let's hear it less 

406
00:24:53,200 --> 00:24:55,600
important than the wallpaper was
the moment I learned what had 

407
00:24:55,600 --> 00:24:57,600
happened. 
Is this Carly said, the familiar

408
00:24:57,600 --> 00:25:01,100
gentle voice on the other end. 
This is James Taylor, not James,

409
00:25:01,100 --> 00:25:06,200
but James Taylor as if after 
four months of pro pro fiction 

410
00:25:06,200 --> 00:25:09,100
nudity, It's fine. 
As he feared, I might possibly 

411
00:25:09,100 --> 00:25:12,600
confuse him with another James 
intention James has good manners

412
00:25:12,600 --> 00:25:15,300
came out his civility. 
His old-fashioned North Carolina

413
00:25:15,300 --> 00:25:18,200
gentlemen, - I honestly couldn't
have cared less about the hot 

414
00:25:18,200 --> 00:25:21,200
water or the wallpaper or the 
condition ever record albums. 

415
00:25:21,500 --> 00:25:23,900
All of which seemed absurd and 
could be replaced. 

416
00:25:23,900 --> 00:25:26,300
The only thing I cared about was
the sweetest kindest lease, 

417
00:25:26,300 --> 00:25:29,900
replaceable man on Earth was on 
the other end of the phone. 

418
00:25:30,500 --> 00:25:34,400
Just thought that was cute. 
That sounds we that year. 

419
00:25:34,400 --> 00:25:37,900
They also both won a Grammy but 
instead of Going to the Grammys,

420
00:25:37,900 --> 00:25:44,300
they decided to just drive 
around and Carly writes in her 

421
00:25:44,300 --> 00:25:46,100
book. 
That James didn't show any 

422
00:25:46,100 --> 00:25:49,700
emotion about being nominated or
possibly winning at all like 

423
00:25:49,700 --> 00:25:53,200
your hair, mmm. 
But that she secretly like was 

424
00:25:53,200 --> 00:25:56,300
really invested in wanted to 
know if she wanted to grab me. 

425
00:25:56,500 --> 00:26:00,600
That is a big deal. 
Okay, 1972, this is a year and a

426
00:26:00,600 --> 00:26:04,700
half into dating. 
Carly is invited by Mick, Jagger

427
00:26:04,700 --> 00:26:08,700
to go to a concert in San Disco 
where she's interviewing Mick 

428
00:26:09,100 --> 00:26:11,600
for the New York Times just 
before. 

429
00:26:11,600 --> 00:26:16,100
She's about to go, James starts,
doing heroin in front of her 

430
00:26:16,200 --> 00:26:20,500
Carly and tells her that she 
needs to watch him do it. 

431
00:26:20,500 --> 00:26:24,300
So that he'll quit and Carly 
writes in her Memoir. 

432
00:26:24,600 --> 00:26:26,200
Watch. 
This is what James said. 

433
00:26:26,200 --> 00:26:29,200
Watch, I can't have you and the 
habitat, the same time. 

434
00:26:29,200 --> 00:26:31,400
I just can't. 
I've got to get rid of this. 

435
00:26:31,400 --> 00:26:33,300
Maybe. 
If you see me do it, it will 

436
00:26:33,300 --> 00:26:35,800
take away the cat and mouse game
you have to watch me. 

437
00:26:35,800 --> 00:26:37,200
I have to let it go. 
Go. 

438
00:26:39,000 --> 00:26:42,900
So then what happened? 
So then Carly was really freaked

439
00:26:42,900 --> 00:26:45,600
out by that. 
Soon after that, she goes to 

440
00:26:45,600 --> 00:26:48,900
London to record her second 
album, no secrets. 

441
00:26:49,300 --> 00:26:53,000
And she says, that James can 
only visit her for a few days of

442
00:26:53,000 --> 00:26:56,800
time because he's in New York, 
but when he does, he's sleeping 

443
00:26:56,800 --> 00:27:01,300
all the time and he's clearly 
very depressed and she just 

444
00:27:01,300 --> 00:27:05,000
assumes that he's doing drugs 
and sleeping with other people 

445
00:27:05,000 --> 00:27:07,700
when they're not together but 
she doesn't ask about it. 

446
00:27:08,100 --> 00:27:12,200
That's something. 
I know, I know while in London 

447
00:27:12,200 --> 00:27:16,000
though, Carly, this is why it's 
confusing because like, it seems

448
00:27:16,000 --> 00:27:18,900
like they're not really in a 
good place, but then Carly gets 

449
00:27:18,900 --> 00:27:23,000
a call from her sister Lucy that
dreams drove to her mom's house 

450
00:27:23,000 --> 00:27:24,600
to ask for her hand, in 
marriage. 

451
00:27:25,000 --> 00:27:28,800
Oh, hmm. 
And Carly is really excited and 

452
00:27:28,800 --> 00:27:31,800
she says, yes, please always. 
Now, she actually calls him up 

453
00:27:31,800 --> 00:27:35,300
and says that after she finds 
out that he asks, always 

454
00:27:35,300 --> 00:27:39,900
however, meanwhile back in the 
London, Carly has a very flirty 

455
00:27:39,900 --> 00:27:44,900
relationship with Mick Jagger 
and really fantasizes about 

456
00:27:44,900 --> 00:27:48,200
sleeping with him, but they 
don't do anything, what? 

457
00:27:48,200 --> 00:27:50,600
They never actually sleep 
together, but there's a very 

458
00:27:50,600 --> 00:27:55,500
clear, sexual tension and he 
even tells her that he loves her

459
00:27:55,700 --> 00:28:00,100
what I know. 
Wow. 

460
00:28:01,800 --> 00:28:03,200
Yeah. 
How can all this be happening at

461
00:28:03,200 --> 00:28:04,300
the same time? 
I know. 

462
00:28:04,300 --> 00:28:07,400
I'm like getting confused by it,
even though I did research on 

463
00:28:07,400 --> 00:28:09,900
this. 
Some people do people do just 

464
00:28:09,900 --> 00:28:13,900
kind of push. 
Things aside, exact 20 like can 

465
00:28:13,900 --> 00:28:17,000
have really bad morning and then
a good night and I don't know 

466
00:28:17,000 --> 00:28:18,000
you know what I mean? 
Yeah. 

467
00:28:18,000 --> 00:28:20,900
And I think part of it too is 
like the star appeal like it's 

468
00:28:20,900 --> 00:28:24,800
Mick. 
Jagger like I feel like at that 

469
00:28:24,800 --> 00:28:28,400
time period anybody would have 
fantasies about someone who 

470
00:28:28,400 --> 00:28:31,500
they're working closely with 
who's like super famous and a 

471
00:28:31,508 --> 00:28:35,100
huge sex symbol. 
So I'll give her a pass for 

472
00:28:35,100 --> 00:28:38,800
know. 
It's crazy but car He is picking

473
00:28:38,800 --> 00:28:44,300
up on James being pretty cold 
towards his exes actually. 

474
00:28:44,500 --> 00:28:46,800
And this, I found very 
interesting. 

475
00:28:46,900 --> 00:28:52,900
She recounts a time in her 
Memoir where she Witnesses James

476
00:28:53,700 --> 00:28:56,400
talking. 
I think it's to Joni Mitchell. 

477
00:28:56,400 --> 00:28:59,500
Let me find it, she says, but 
your earlier during the first 

478
00:28:59,500 --> 00:29:02,300
weekend, I spent at the cabin 
Maggie had called him. 

479
00:29:02,800 --> 00:29:06,200
I think that's an X actually. 
So not Joanie James picked up 

480
00:29:06,200 --> 00:29:07,800
the wall, phone mounted on the 
beams. 

481
00:29:08,000 --> 00:29:09,400
During the living room ceiling 
and place. 

482
00:29:09,400 --> 00:29:11,300
Very politely. 
Never dropping his Southern 

483
00:29:11,300 --> 00:29:13,800
gentleman. 
Persona, he warned Maggie not to

484
00:29:13,800 --> 00:29:16,600
call him ever again. 
And when he hung up the phone, 

485
00:29:16,700 --> 00:29:21,200
he started sweating at the time 
I thought his terseness was with

486
00:29:21,200 --> 00:29:24,500
her was a side long way of 
making me feel more secure in 

487
00:29:24,500 --> 00:29:27,200
his life by proving Fruit by 
providing proof that his 

488
00:29:27,200 --> 00:29:30,400
relationship with Maggie was 
over and done with still what 

489
00:29:30,400 --> 00:29:33,500
had she done and what had gone. 
So terribly wrong that she 

490
00:29:33,500 --> 00:29:35,400
deserved to be guillotined like 
that. 

491
00:29:36,100 --> 00:29:40,600
Hmm, interesting. 
It's like when James cut someone

492
00:29:40,600 --> 00:29:45,700
else, they're like done to him. 
I wonder why she was calling. 

493
00:29:45,700 --> 00:29:52,100
I know I wondered. 
Hi, yeah, that's interesting. 

494
00:29:52,200 --> 00:29:55,000
I have your baby. 
What? 

495
00:29:55,000 --> 00:29:58,000
I don't know why you're gonna 
say that. 

496
00:29:59,000 --> 00:30:01,000
That was something that was 
revealed or something. 

497
00:30:01,000 --> 00:30:04,000
No, I just said so hot in here. 
Oh my gosh. 

498
00:30:04,000 --> 00:30:05,300
I feel like I'm getting 
delirious. 

499
00:30:05,300 --> 00:30:07,600
But he's in his ice actually 
feel okay. 

500
00:30:07,700 --> 00:30:11,000
Oh, Really you? 
Because I'm in the audience. 

501
00:30:11,100 --> 00:30:12,500
Yeah. 
Probably. 

502
00:30:12,700 --> 00:30:14,600
I'm getting nervous. 
Okay. 

503
00:30:14,600 --> 00:30:16,400
I don't know, like, nervous. 
Looking good. 

504
00:30:16,400 --> 00:30:18,600
Yeah, guys. 
Listeners. 

505
00:30:19,000 --> 00:30:23,900
We get nervous for her. 
I know I have stage fright. 

506
00:30:23,900 --> 00:30:29,600
I love rock music. 
I love 60s 70s. 

507
00:30:29,600 --> 00:30:32,900
I love hearing about this. 
Okay, I don't know anything 

508
00:30:32,900 --> 00:30:34,200
about this. 
Okay. 

509
00:30:34,500 --> 00:30:37,600
Love I love hearing about 
relationships. 

510
00:30:37,700 --> 00:30:40,500
Okay, do you like weddings? 
Yeah, yeah I do. 

511
00:30:40,600 --> 00:30:42,900
Okay, I guess I went to more. 
Yeah. 

512
00:30:42,900 --> 00:30:47,700
Well so James and Carly. 
They're getting married, right. 

513
00:30:47,700 --> 00:30:52,400
But get this on the evening of 
their wedding, Bianca Jagger 

514
00:30:52,500 --> 00:30:56,400
Mick Jagger's. 
Wife calls up James and tells 

515
00:30:56,400 --> 00:31:00,400
him not to marry Carly because 
she's having an affair with Mick

516
00:31:00,400 --> 00:31:02,700
Jagger. 
She had to be told that night, I

517
00:31:02,700 --> 00:31:06,700
know after I think they had a 
short engagement So I'll give 

518
00:31:06,700 --> 00:31:16,200
her that but James says to 
Bianca, I love Carly and I trust

519
00:31:16,200 --> 00:31:18,700
Carly and I'm gonna marry Carly.
Hmm. 

520
00:31:18,800 --> 00:31:21,400
So he's not really fazed by it. 
Cool. 

521
00:31:21,600 --> 00:31:23,500
Was that true? 
No. 

522
00:31:23,500 --> 00:31:25,500
They weren't having an affair. 
They had a flirtation. 

523
00:31:25,500 --> 00:31:31,100
Okay, so Carl he's pretty 
annoyed by that interest but 

524
00:31:31,100 --> 00:31:35,600
James is really not fazed. 
So on the so they get married. 

525
00:31:35,600 --> 00:31:38,900
And it's A very quick wedding. 
Like they like plan everything 

526
00:31:38,900 --> 00:31:41,000
really quickly. 
It's very small and then 

527
00:31:41,000 --> 00:31:44,300
actually James plays a concert 
that night around City Music 

528
00:31:44,300 --> 00:31:47,800
Hall where he announces that him
and Carly had just gotten 

529
00:31:47,800 --> 00:31:53,200
married during that earlier in 
the day it's crazy and Carly 

530
00:31:53,200 --> 00:31:58,000
legally takes his last name and 
rights at this gave her a sense 

531
00:31:58,000 --> 00:32:00,900
of power and that she felt 
incredibly safe and confident. 

532
00:32:00,900 --> 00:32:04,600
She says, never in my life had I
felt as sure of anything as I 

533
00:32:04,608 --> 00:32:07,000
did about my new marriage. 
To James. 

534
00:32:07,200 --> 00:32:10,200
Wow. 
And in those early days of their

535
00:32:10,200 --> 00:32:14,300
marriage, they had little alone 
time because of the NeverEnding 

536
00:32:14,300 --> 00:32:17,700
Renovations on their house, in 
Martha's Vineyard, it was just 

537
00:32:17,700 --> 00:32:22,600
like constantly contractors 
coming in like coming and going 

538
00:32:22,600 --> 00:32:25,500
working on this house. 
It's so regular. 

539
00:32:25,600 --> 00:32:27,900
I know it. 
I know it really is. 

540
00:32:28,000 --> 00:32:31,300
It's like one of their biggest 
stressors in. 

541
00:32:31,300 --> 00:32:34,500
Their relationship was the 
construction of this house, 

542
00:32:34,800 --> 00:32:37,300
which took years Is like years 
and years. 

543
00:32:37,300 --> 00:32:40,500
I've been a nice house. 
Yeah, it's very beautiful how I 

544
00:32:40,500 --> 00:32:42,900
love my husband eared. 
So this is cool. 

545
00:32:43,100 --> 00:32:45,600
Next time I go, whenever that is
I'm going to think about that. 

546
00:32:45,600 --> 00:32:47,800
Yeah. 
You probably should go check out

547
00:32:47,800 --> 00:32:51,100
the house. 
Yeah, and they because they had 

548
00:32:51,100 --> 00:32:53,500
little long time. 
They'd frequently sneak away to 

549
00:32:53,500 --> 00:32:55,900
Vang, can't summer. 
Houses in Martha's Vineyard, 

550
00:32:56,500 --> 00:32:59,300
just random people's houses, 
apparently, to have sex in them.

551
00:32:59,300 --> 00:33:03,600
Yeah. 
So very romantic. 

552
00:33:04,000 --> 00:33:08,000
Yeah. 
And then nine In 73 Carly is 

553
00:33:08,000 --> 00:33:11,200
pregnant with their first child 
which she says makes her feel 

554
00:33:11,200 --> 00:33:13,900
even more in love with James and
ever before. 

555
00:33:15,200 --> 00:33:19,000
But James is drinking a lot 
during this time period. 

556
00:33:20,000 --> 00:33:27,100
Oh man, let's see. 
I have another Passage Why? 

557
00:33:27,400 --> 00:33:29,200
Well that's gonna make a 
comment. 

558
00:33:29,200 --> 00:33:32,800
Maybe I should wait till end of 
the relationship to have 

559
00:33:32,800 --> 00:33:34,600
opinion. 
Okay, cuz I don't know the whole

560
00:33:34,600 --> 00:33:38,800
story yet. 
So Carly rights on June 18th 

561
00:33:38,800 --> 00:33:43,100
1973 and her diary we're off to 
New York in a couple of minutes.

562
00:33:43,300 --> 00:33:48,700
The day is cold and depressing, 
I'm not Lightning it any last 

563
00:33:48,700 --> 00:33:50,100
night? 
James got drunk. 

564
00:33:51,000 --> 00:33:54,500
Again, the problem is grave. 
He doesn't know why he needs to 

565
00:33:54,500 --> 00:33:57,400
go drunk, but says, he needs to 
at least four times a day. 

566
00:33:57,400 --> 00:33:59,800
I don't seem to satisfy him 
much. 

567
00:33:59,800 --> 00:34:02,500
I don't understand him when he 
says he needs me. 

568
00:34:02,500 --> 00:34:06,400
So down on himself that he 
relies not at all on himself but

569
00:34:06,400 --> 00:34:09,300
on chemicals for happiness. 
He only speaks me out for 

570
00:34:09,300 --> 00:34:11,000
affection when he fears it's 
lost. 

571
00:34:11,000 --> 00:34:13,699
I'm so sad. 
He's more physical toward me in 

572
00:34:13,699 --> 00:34:16,600
the presence of other folk. 
Then when we Are alone. 

573
00:34:16,600 --> 00:34:18,800
He thinks interesting when I 
say, I love you that. 

574
00:34:18,800 --> 00:34:21,300
I am asking a question that I 
need something in return 

575
00:34:21,300 --> 00:34:22,600
patients. 
I guess. 

576
00:34:23,900 --> 00:34:26,699
Hmm. 
Wow. 

577
00:34:26,699 --> 00:34:28,800
Yeah. 
And during the song also, I mean

578
00:34:28,800 --> 00:34:32,100
during this time period also 
they remake the song Mockingbird

579
00:34:32,100 --> 00:34:34,300
together which Peaks at number 
five. 

580
00:34:34,300 --> 00:34:38,500
On the charts. 
It's like I forgot who sings 

581
00:34:38,500 --> 00:34:42,199
this song before them. 
But I think it came to them 

582
00:34:42,199 --> 00:34:47,199
because Carly is pregnant. 
So yeah, let's hear a little bit

583
00:34:47,199 --> 00:34:49,100
of it. 
Do you wanna sure? 

584
00:34:49,699 --> 00:35:18,500
Yeah, I kind of want to do it. 
So, we just watched a cup of 

585
00:35:18,500 --> 00:35:20,100
them together. 
What did you think? 

586
00:35:20,100 --> 00:35:21,800
It's so cute. 
It is. 

587
00:35:21,800 --> 00:35:25,500
They look so goofy and happy 
silly. 

588
00:35:25,900 --> 00:35:30,000
She's beautiful. 
No, I do find him attractive. 

589
00:35:30,300 --> 00:35:32,800
Yeah, he is. 
He's also like picturing like 

590
00:35:32,800 --> 00:35:36,800
Martha's Vineyard. 
I know his house my chopping 

591
00:35:36,800 --> 00:35:40,200
wood. 
Yeah, he's so tall with his 

592
00:35:40,200 --> 00:35:45,700
little North Carolina and this 
that career really likes, oh, I 

593
00:35:45,700 --> 00:35:47,700
see what's or Tractive about 
him. 

594
00:35:47,800 --> 00:35:53,500
That is quite a red flag, though
that he seems to only like, show

595
00:35:53,500 --> 00:35:57,000
affection when he fears. 
Mmm, that she's like lost 

596
00:35:57,000 --> 00:35:58,500
interest. 
I'm just not sure how she 

597
00:35:58,500 --> 00:36:02,900
phrased it, but that he's not 
that interested until he thinks 

598
00:36:02,900 --> 00:36:05,600
me, you know, it's like a 
push-pull game type of thing, 

599
00:36:05,600 --> 00:36:06,600
you know. 
Yeah. 

600
00:36:06,600 --> 00:36:09,900
And it seems like that's how 
Carly feels a lot throughout the

601
00:36:09,900 --> 00:36:14,600
relationship but then like 
forgets that feeling when he is 

602
00:36:14,600 --> 00:36:18,500
super affectionate towards her 
and is so willing to just accept

603
00:36:18,500 --> 00:36:21,300
the good side of him and forget 
the bad, but that will keep 

604
00:36:21,300 --> 00:36:23,900
popping up more and more till 
she can't really ignore it. 

605
00:36:24,200 --> 00:36:27,800
Oh no. 
But good times, I still had so 

606
00:36:27,800 --> 00:36:31,700
many 74 and January, 7th or 
daughter, Sarah Maria, who they 

607
00:36:31,700 --> 00:36:33,300
nicknamed. 
Sally is born. 

608
00:36:34,200 --> 00:36:36,400
And during this time, it's super
cute. 

609
00:36:36,500 --> 00:36:40,600
When Carly is giving birth, 
James pretends to be a seagull 

610
00:36:40,600 --> 00:36:43,600
to distract Carly. 
And from her pain and pretends 

611
00:36:43,600 --> 00:36:46,800
that, the contractions are ocean
waves. 

612
00:36:47,500 --> 00:36:53,200
And so as she's giving birth 
he's like Carly look up is all 

613
00:36:53,400 --> 00:36:56,600
cute. 
And then while Carly is giving 

614
00:36:56,600 --> 00:36:59,000
birth. 
He also writes the song Sarah 

615
00:36:59,000 --> 00:37:03,000
Maria during it which he 
performs out of contr. 

616
00:37:03,000 --> 00:37:06,800
Again that night like dance 
teams, keep sending concerts the

617
00:37:06,800 --> 00:37:09,300
same night of like huge life 
event. 

618
00:37:09,400 --> 00:37:14,100
Oh my God, that's impressive. 
I know, Norman Lear that night, 

619
00:37:14,100 --> 00:37:17,900
I know the lyrics are cute as 
well, the Moon is the ocean and 

620
00:37:17,900 --> 00:37:22,200
the stars are in the sky and all
I can see is My Sweet Maria's 

621
00:37:22,200 --> 00:37:24,700
eyes. 
Oh, Sarah, Sarah Maria. 

622
00:37:24,800 --> 00:37:27,500
Hmm. 
So they're really big into the 

623
00:37:27,500 --> 00:37:29,900
beach and that ocean like that's
not true. 

624
00:37:30,600 --> 00:37:33,600
So James Goes On Tour, while 
Carly is home in Martha's 

625
00:37:33,600 --> 00:37:38,300
Vineyard with the baby and while
he's away, she ends up having 

626
00:37:38,300 --> 00:37:42,400
this feels super normal but she 
has a swimming pool built 

627
00:37:42,400 --> 00:37:45,700
without asking him. 
I mean it's not normal yeah 

628
00:37:45,700 --> 00:37:48,700
expensive but it's a normal 
fight I guess. 

629
00:37:48,700 --> 00:37:53,100
Yeah because I have a huge fight
about this that she had a 

630
00:37:53,100 --> 00:37:55,500
swimming pool filled but was he 
mad about you? 

631
00:37:55,700 --> 00:38:00,100
The extends, or the expand, 
like, where was he didn't like 

632
00:38:00,100 --> 00:38:02,700
that. 
She didn't ask and those pretty 

633
00:38:02,700 --> 00:38:03,900
big deal. 
Yeah. 

634
00:38:04,400 --> 00:38:07,800
It wasn't like an inground pool.
Get rid of that. 

635
00:38:07,800 --> 00:38:10,700
Yeah, and I think he had a 
problem with the fact that like 

636
00:38:10,700 --> 00:38:16,100
their living on the water like 
by the beach, and that she would

637
00:38:16,100 --> 00:38:20,000
have a swimming pool Bill. 
He was like, why just, why would

638
00:38:20,000 --> 00:38:23,500
you do that? 
Grunting her thought process 

639
00:38:23,500 --> 00:38:25,500
there? 
So yeah, yeah, but she said, 

640
00:38:25,600 --> 00:38:27,700
Says in her Memoir like I could 
have sworn. 

641
00:38:27,700 --> 00:38:32,100
I told them but I think it might
have slipped her mind. 

642
00:38:32,500 --> 00:38:35,500
That would be like my parents 
but yeah. 

643
00:38:35,500 --> 00:38:39,700
My mom and dad. 
Yeah I can just picture my debt 

644
00:38:39,700 --> 00:38:42,400
like my mom coming home having 
bought something and my dad 

645
00:38:42,400 --> 00:38:44,600
being like yeah. 
Yeah. 

646
00:38:44,600 --> 00:38:47,700
It is to the next level because 
I guess I mean, pool is 

647
00:38:47,700 --> 00:38:50,500
something that I think a married
couple would discuss. 

648
00:38:50,500 --> 00:38:52,800
Yeah, yeah, that is pretty 
extreme. 

649
00:38:53,000 --> 00:38:55,400
But when you have that kind of 
money it's like I don't know. 

650
00:38:56,400 --> 00:39:00,600
I get what he's saying, but they
were celebrities, you would 

651
00:39:00,600 --> 00:39:02,700
assume they have a pool. 
Exactly. 

652
00:39:02,700 --> 00:39:04,800
Be kind of weird to be celebrity
that out of bed. 

653
00:39:06,500 --> 00:39:09,400
I feel like rich and famous have
pool. 

654
00:39:09,400 --> 00:39:12,900
Yeah, exactly. 
Carly also writes in her Memoir 

655
00:39:12,900 --> 00:39:15,700
that during this time, even 
though they are monogamous, they

656
00:39:15,700 --> 00:39:18,700
allow each other to explore 
fantasies for the sake of their 

657
00:39:18,700 --> 00:39:22,900
music, like, in their head. 
So, those write songs like that.

658
00:39:22,900 --> 00:39:25,400
Yeah, they'll write songs with 
other Muses and they don't 

659
00:39:25,400 --> 00:39:28,800
question. 
Question-it famous, he's well so

660
00:39:28,800 --> 00:39:35,300
it's 1976 now and Carly believes
that she is pregnant so she's 

661
00:39:35,300 --> 00:39:41,400
about to tell James but as she's
about to tell him he tells her 

662
00:39:41,600 --> 00:39:44,300
that he needs to get tested for 
gonorrhea. 

663
00:39:44,400 --> 00:39:46,300
What? 
Hmm. 

664
00:39:46,600 --> 00:39:49,800
Are you kidding me? 
No, no. 

665
00:39:51,800 --> 00:39:55,400
So that's pretty bad. 
I'm really upset. 

666
00:39:55,700 --> 00:39:58,300
Yeah, I know. 
And she was so excited to I 

667
00:39:58,300 --> 00:40:00,500
thought they could only a 
fantasies I know. 

668
00:40:00,700 --> 00:40:04,800
So, obviously not so this kind 
of reveals that more is going on

669
00:40:04,900 --> 00:40:08,700
than just that my God at first, 
actually she's really concerned 

670
00:40:08,700 --> 00:40:12,100
for him, but then she gets mad. 
And she actually tries to hit 

671
00:40:12,100 --> 00:40:16,300
him with the guitar, but he 
Dodges that and then she drives 

672
00:40:16,300 --> 00:40:19,300
away and rage and then comes 
back and she's a really 

673
00:40:19,300 --> 00:40:22,000
forgiving attitude. 
You just kind of lets it go 

674
00:40:22,000 --> 00:40:24,500
crazy. 
Yeah. 

675
00:40:24,800 --> 00:40:28,800
Then in 77 she gives birth. 
She actually was pregnant to 

676
00:40:28,800 --> 00:40:30,900
their second child. 
A son named been. 

677
00:40:30,900 --> 00:40:36,300
So as you said a girl named 
Sally and a boy named Ben. 

678
00:40:37,400 --> 00:40:41,100
And yeah, and this year they 
also do a sit-down interview on 

679
00:40:41,100 --> 00:40:43,900
The Dick Cavett Show and I 
thought I'd show you a little 

680
00:40:43,900 --> 00:40:46,900
clip. 
Let's hear it. 

681
00:40:49,600 --> 00:40:51,900
Tighten your apartment saying 
who's up and who's down and 

682
00:40:51,900 --> 00:40:55,700
whose record is wearing. 
Someone's eliminate the gold 

683
00:40:55,700 --> 00:41:00,400
records and that and the charts.
And any news about how the 

684
00:41:00,400 --> 00:41:04,000
records are doing from, from the
house itself. 

685
00:41:04,000 --> 00:41:05,500
What do you think the roots are 
stage fright? 

686
00:41:05,500 --> 00:41:06,500
Are they used to say in the 
book? 

687
00:41:06,500 --> 00:41:08,000
I read as a kid about the 
acting. 

688
00:41:08,000 --> 00:41:10,400
If you are nervous, trying to 
think why you're nervous. 

689
00:41:10,400 --> 00:41:13,100
Sounds like Richard Nixon and 
then that will help you to go 

690
00:41:13,100 --> 00:41:15,900
on. 
Have you ever tried to think why

691
00:41:15,900 --> 00:41:18,200
you're nervous and then had it 
is 0. 

692
00:41:19,700 --> 00:41:23,000
I've never had it dissolved, but
I thought a good deal about why 

693
00:41:23,000 --> 00:41:25,500
it exists. 
It's gotten soft a couple of 

694
00:41:25,508 --> 00:41:32,600
times already solved. 
I think I she's great on stage. 

695
00:41:32,600 --> 00:41:36,500
I think that she's She's 
suffering under the 

696
00:41:36,500 --> 00:41:39,800
misconception that she, that, 
that nobody else feels the way 

697
00:41:39,800 --> 00:41:42,300
she does but I think everyone 
who feel stage fright feels 

698
00:41:43,900 --> 00:41:45,900
often feels as badly as you do 
it. 

699
00:41:45,900 --> 00:41:49,200
I think the Carly just won't 
allow herself to feel too bad 

700
00:41:49,200 --> 00:41:54,300
witch. 
It is a terrific thing about 

701
00:41:54,300 --> 00:41:56,700
your no I don't I don't I don't 
mean to imply that at all. 

702
00:41:56,700 --> 00:41:59,800
I mean that she's buoyant, you 
know, she won't let herself sing

703
00:42:00,600 --> 00:42:02,800
sink. 
And she yeah sink. 

704
00:42:05,300 --> 00:42:08,400
I don't know, I just really 
liked that clip like James is 

705
00:42:08,400 --> 00:42:10,500
voice. 
He's so soft-spoken and so 

706
00:42:10,500 --> 00:42:12,500
sweet. 
And so, I can just really see 

707
00:42:13,400 --> 00:42:15,300
how Carly could be in gym, 
because I'm going to say a lot 

708
00:42:15,300 --> 00:42:16,500
of things that aren't very 
sweet. 

709
00:42:16,500 --> 00:42:21,100
But no, I can see it too. 
That seems so real to, I know. 

710
00:42:21,600 --> 00:42:24,200
So back and forth. 
I love her huge smile. 

711
00:42:24,200 --> 00:42:26,700
It's so cute. 
Oh, she's beautiful. 

712
00:42:27,100 --> 00:42:29,300
He's kind of remind me of 
Joaquin. 

713
00:42:29,300 --> 00:42:32,400
Phoenix. 
Just like okay, yeah. 

714
00:42:34,700 --> 00:42:37,700
To like so, yeah, they aren't 
that interview. 

715
00:42:37,700 --> 00:42:40,300
I think they're really cute and 
they perform on stage together, 

716
00:42:40,300 --> 00:42:42,900
but Carly and her Memoir does, 
right that. 

717
00:42:43,100 --> 00:42:46,400
The marriage really is not what 
it appears to be to the public 

718
00:42:46,400 --> 00:42:50,100
at all. 
These says sorry, it's like I'm 

719
00:42:50,100 --> 00:42:53,800
reading from this too much. 
How do you have a good marriage?

720
00:42:54,900 --> 00:42:59,500
That's one of my. 
No top questions in life. 

721
00:42:59,900 --> 00:43:02,500
I know I like specially articles
about it. 

722
00:43:02,500 --> 00:43:04,900
But Liberty, Mary? 
Yeah, that's like a whole 

723
00:43:04,900 --> 00:43:07,100
different ballpark. 
Hmm. 

724
00:43:07,100 --> 00:43:11,100
She says, in her diary August 
5th 1977, our relationship is 

725
00:43:11,100 --> 00:43:13,400
far from the ideal, like one 
that the general public reads 

726
00:43:13,400 --> 00:43:16,500
about James continues to escape,
you can express, his angry 

727
00:43:16,500 --> 00:43:18,900
feelings to me, much more 
readily than his loving ones. 

728
00:43:19,100 --> 00:43:22,000
He tells me, he loves me either 
in songs, no little measurer. 

729
00:43:22,300 --> 00:43:24,900
When I am sleeping, and he's 
just turning. 

730
00:43:24,900 --> 00:43:26,500
He will say, I really love you 
Carly. 

731
00:43:26,500 --> 00:43:31,200
I'm I'm being a bummer and I'm 
too tired to respond still by 

732
00:43:31,200 --> 00:43:33,300
the end of every day. 
I always soften back to my 

733
00:43:33,300 --> 00:43:36,000
default position of delight and 
thankfulness that I'm married to

734
00:43:36,000 --> 00:43:39,900
James mmm. 
She's so in love with James like

735
00:43:39,900 --> 00:43:42,700
all these transgressions, 
everything. 

736
00:43:42,700 --> 00:43:47,800
She's so forgiving to him, and 
it seems like it, but he does. 

737
00:43:47,800 --> 00:43:52,000
Like, so it's confusing though 
in 1977 that year, he releases 

738
00:43:52,000 --> 00:43:54,700
the song. 
There we are on his album, Jade 

739
00:43:54,700 --> 00:43:58,700
T and these are the lyrics. 
Oh, I don't know if I told you 

740
00:43:58,700 --> 00:44:02,000
but you hold my heart in your 
hand and I found out something 

741
00:44:02,000 --> 00:44:04,900
about you, baby, without you. 
I'm a lonely man. 

742
00:44:05,100 --> 00:44:07,200
So though I never say that I 
love you. 

743
00:44:07,200 --> 00:44:10,200
I love you darling. 
I do Carly. 

744
00:44:10,200 --> 00:44:15,000
I do love you and though, we are
as nothing to the stars that 

745
00:44:15,000 --> 00:44:17,200
shine above, you are my 
universe. 

746
00:44:17,500 --> 00:44:20,800
You are my love here. 
We are like children forever 

747
00:44:20,800 --> 00:44:23,900
taking care of one another, 
while the world goes on without 

748
00:44:23,900 --> 00:44:28,800
us, all around us, Mmm, what 
does he say? 

749
00:44:31,300 --> 00:44:33,500
So do I never say that I love 
you. 

750
00:44:33,700 --> 00:44:35,600
What's up with that? 
I know. 

751
00:44:35,700 --> 00:44:39,700
Oh yeah, he's definitely aware. 
He's not that affectionate. 

752
00:44:40,900 --> 00:44:44,800
Yeah, it's so interests it. 
It's just boggling. 

753
00:44:44,800 --> 00:44:50,100
Like he is so thoughtful. 
Seeming soft-spoken like you 

754
00:44:50,100 --> 00:44:55,700
said, and gentle and 
Introspective and you know it's 

755
00:44:55,700 --> 00:44:58,300
just it's such a contrast. 
I know. 

756
00:44:58,300 --> 00:45:02,500
Yeah and like I mean it kind of 
reminds me of it's so different.

757
00:45:02,500 --> 00:45:07,500
But John Mayer, like he has such
a reputation for being a sleaze 

758
00:45:07,500 --> 00:45:10,300
ball. 
I can see that but his music is 

759
00:45:10,300 --> 00:45:13,700
so romantic. 
That's how can this person 

760
00:45:13,700 --> 00:45:17,300
exists as an artist and as a 
person at the same time, like 

761
00:45:17,300 --> 00:45:21,300
James, his music is so loving 
and that that verse makes me 

762
00:45:21,300 --> 00:45:23,800
melt so though, I On. 
I never say that. 

763
00:45:23,800 --> 00:45:25,400
I love you. 
I love you darling. 

764
00:45:25,400 --> 00:45:29,700
I do Carly. 
I do love you so sweet. 

765
00:45:29,700 --> 00:45:32,400
I love the last part about like 
the world around us. 

766
00:45:32,500 --> 00:45:34,800
Hmm. 
Yeah. 

767
00:45:34,800 --> 00:45:40,600
I don't know, I think some 
people do love and can be very 

768
00:45:40,600 --> 00:45:45,400
sweet and romantic and 
affectionate and stuff but they 

769
00:45:45,400 --> 00:45:48,900
are just troubled. 
Yeah, I mean and James has been 

770
00:45:48,900 --> 00:45:51,900
troubled his whole life like he 
had a lot of mental health 

771
00:45:51,900 --> 00:45:54,100
struggles. 
He's young and obviously as you 

772
00:45:54,100 --> 00:45:56,500
mentioned his parents divorce 
greatly affected him. 

773
00:45:56,500 --> 00:45:59,800
So we think there's definitely 
an intimacy issue there. 

774
00:46:00,000 --> 00:46:02,500
Yeah. 
But and he also is obviously 

775
00:46:02,500 --> 00:46:08,600
cheating on Carly so I don't 
know what's up with that James, 

776
00:46:08,600 --> 00:46:11,600
you got to do better, my god do 
better. 

777
00:46:11,600 --> 00:46:15,800
You're gonna lose her. 
So I'm gonna say 1978. 

778
00:46:15,800 --> 00:46:21,100
They sing lead vocals on a cover
of the song devoted to you for 

779
00:46:21,100 --> 00:46:25,100
Carly's album, which became My 
top 40 hit and Carly writes in 

780
00:46:25,100 --> 00:46:28,500
her Memoir that at this age. 
She isn't focusing on James as 

781
00:46:28,500 --> 00:46:33,700
much just because she's so busy 
with her music and the kids and 

782
00:46:33,700 --> 00:46:37,200
she writes it didn't occur to me
at this time that James might 

783
00:46:37,200 --> 00:46:43,000
have had a girlfriend or that 
that girlfriend even had a name.

784
00:46:44,200 --> 00:46:46,600
Hmm. 
And I feel like she writes in 

785
00:46:46,600 --> 00:46:50,900
her Memoir a lot that like she's
struggling with now. 

786
00:46:50,900 --> 00:46:53,700
That like she's a mom. 
James just kind of sees her 

787
00:46:53,700 --> 00:46:57,700
like, as the mom of the children
and not as like an attractive 

788
00:46:57,800 --> 00:47:00,500
young person that he fell in 
love with, which is looking hate

789
00:47:00,500 --> 00:47:05,600
that, I know, sorry for my 
language, but I feel like that's

790
00:47:05,600 --> 00:47:11,100
a common thing. 
Not even just with celebrities 

791
00:47:11,100 --> 00:47:13,100
River. 
And that's a fear of mine 

792
00:47:13,200 --> 00:47:15,400
someday, you know, I don't hate 
that. 

793
00:47:15,400 --> 00:47:20,500
It's like one thing. 
I just hate about our world, we 

794
00:47:20,500 --> 00:47:23,900
live in a society whatever, but,
you know, I feel like one. 

795
00:47:23,900 --> 00:47:26,500
Someone becomes a mom. 
I think everyone stop seeing 

796
00:47:26,500 --> 00:47:30,500
them as a real human. 
I know that's like I'm mom, you 

797
00:47:30,508 --> 00:47:32,400
know, but they don't do that 
with dads. 

798
00:47:32,400 --> 00:47:35,000
If anything, it's like space. 
Sorry. 

799
00:47:35,200 --> 00:47:39,200
There's even more attractive to 
men when they become fathers. 

800
00:47:40,300 --> 00:47:43,400
Just stop doing that. 
Mmm, Next Movement that needs to

801
00:47:43,400 --> 00:47:44,700
happen. 
I know seriously. 

802
00:47:44,700 --> 00:47:48,700
Sexualize the mom. 
Yeah that's change. 

803
00:47:48,700 --> 00:47:50,800
You're still an interesting 
person. 

804
00:47:50,800 --> 00:47:54,800
Like I know also someone has to 
raise the kid. 

805
00:47:54,800 --> 00:47:58,200
I know you do sweetie. 
I do think there is a little 

806
00:47:58,200 --> 00:47:58,700
bit. 
Sorry. 

807
00:47:58,700 --> 00:48:01,100
I'm like ranting. 
Now there can be a little bit of

808
00:48:01,100 --> 00:48:04,200
like oh Mom's only talk about 
their kids or whatever but like 

809
00:48:05,200 --> 00:48:07,800
It's important to care about 
them. 

810
00:48:07,800 --> 00:48:10,900
Yeah, they're doing their jobs, 
you know. 

811
00:48:11,300 --> 00:48:13,300
Anyway, I know I thought just 
breaks my heart. 

812
00:48:13,300 --> 00:48:17,100
I know. 
So then in 1979 a close friend 

813
00:48:17,100 --> 00:48:21,200
of Carly's, casually mentions to
Carly that James is girlfriend. 

814
00:48:21,200 --> 00:48:25,000
What her friend just casually 
mention? 

815
00:48:25,000 --> 00:48:28,800
Yeah, mentions something about 
James's girlfriend. 

816
00:48:28,800 --> 00:48:32,700
Assuming that Carly would 
already know my God and Carly 

817
00:48:32,700 --> 00:48:35,900
didn't know anything about it. 
Robot, I know. 

818
00:48:35,900 --> 00:48:40,800
And so apparently, James has 
been dating a backup dancer for 

819
00:48:40,800 --> 00:48:42,700
him. 
Named Evie was living in an 

820
00:48:42,700 --> 00:48:47,500
apartment on West 17th Street in
Manhattan that James uses her 

821
00:48:47,500 --> 00:48:50,500
recording. 
So it's a studio living there. 

822
00:48:51,200 --> 00:48:55,900
But James owns, and James is 
really cold when Carly confronts

823
00:48:55,900 --> 00:48:58,100
him about this. 
He doesn't even try to hide it. 

824
00:48:58,100 --> 00:49:02,100
He just acts very nonchalant 
about it so spooky. 

825
00:49:02,200 --> 00:49:04,600
Hmm, kinda reminds me of the 
book. 

826
00:49:04,700 --> 00:49:07,100
Look conversations with friends 
where they're like, just so 

827
00:49:07,100 --> 00:49:11,000
casual about this like, a fair 
that's going on. 

828
00:49:12,200 --> 00:49:16,500
She says, I confronted James 
about it going so far as to fall

829
00:49:16,500 --> 00:49:19,600
onto the rug in despair. 
This isn't about, you James said

830
00:49:19,600 --> 00:49:23,000
coldly, but if it wasn't about 
me who then was it about to 

831
00:49:23,000 --> 00:49:25,900
James feel as I did that, we 
were really not living but 

832
00:49:25,900 --> 00:49:29,500
merely simulating that something
once clear sharp generous 

833
00:49:29,500 --> 00:49:32,300
infinite a window view looking 
out over some forever. 

834
00:49:32,300 --> 00:49:37,900
Landscape was now too hazy to 
see through How could you say 

835
00:49:37,900 --> 00:49:41,000
this isn't about you? 
I know she's your wife. 

836
00:49:41,100 --> 00:49:45,400
I know seriously, obviously 
she's a factor here. 

837
00:49:45,400 --> 00:49:50,600
Yeah, that's so selfish. 
Despite it's breaking my heart. 

838
00:49:50,800 --> 00:49:54,100
Carly writes in her Memoir that 
she kind of accepts that this is

839
00:49:54,100 --> 00:49:57,500
just the way that rock and roll 
is and that she didn't know one 

840
00:49:57,500 --> 00:50:00,800
male musician who wasn't 
sleeping with random women on 

841
00:50:00,800 --> 00:50:06,400
the side, which makes me really 
sad like that. 

842
00:50:06,400 --> 00:50:08,800
True. 
I think it kind of is, I know, 

843
00:50:08,800 --> 00:50:12,600
like all the musicians today, 
are none of them faithful to 

844
00:50:12,600 --> 00:50:16,800
their wives at all. 
I know, I wonder that I wanted 

845
00:50:16,800 --> 00:50:22,000
to even about, like I just saw 
the national recently like that 

846
00:50:22,000 --> 00:50:23,800
bit there in like their forties 
now. 

847
00:50:23,800 --> 00:50:26,600
And I was even wondering like 
today, like still a couple 

848
00:50:26,600 --> 00:50:27,600
people. 
Yeah. 

849
00:50:28,800 --> 00:50:31,400
What's the deal? 
I don't know where or are some 

850
00:50:31,400 --> 00:50:35,000
musicians totally just boring 
and just, you know, go back to 

851
00:50:36,000 --> 00:50:39,800
the van or the Bus and yeah, I 
don't know. 

852
00:50:39,800 --> 00:50:44,500
I had a really good read out. 
Whenever I hear of any like 

853
00:50:44,500 --> 00:50:48,100
casual cheating ever done, 
something like this, like, is 

854
00:50:48,100 --> 00:50:51,400
this a thing about the whole 
world? 

855
00:50:51,400 --> 00:50:55,300
Like, no, it's cheating. 
Not commonplace at like someone 

856
00:50:55,300 --> 00:50:58,300
could be confronted about a, an 
affair and it's like no big 

857
00:50:58,300 --> 00:51:00,400
deal. 
I think it's a big deal. 

858
00:51:00,400 --> 00:51:07,000
Yeah. 
I think It is common maybe but I

859
00:51:07,000 --> 00:51:11,300
do think rock and roll. 
It's a totally different thing. 

860
00:51:11,300 --> 00:51:14,200
I'm yeah, people like throwing 
themselves at you all the time. 

861
00:51:14,200 --> 00:51:17,400
Yeah probably always going out 
for drinks and stuff and meeting

862
00:51:17,400 --> 00:51:21,400
people and traveling. 
And I don't not that I'm not 

863
00:51:21,400 --> 00:51:27,000
excusing it but I think that 
it's just crazy atmosphere. 

864
00:51:27,900 --> 00:51:30,000
But yeah, that does upset me 
everybody. 

865
00:51:30,100 --> 00:51:33,000
I know seriously. 
I mean Chris, you know the 

866
00:51:33,000 --> 00:51:37,000
Beatles what she knew the 
Beatles to oh yeah, yeah. 

867
00:51:37,000 --> 00:51:39,900
So I mean, I guess you probably 
know more than I do but like 

868
00:51:40,100 --> 00:51:43,200
does that include them cheating 
on their wives? 

869
00:51:44,300 --> 00:51:48,000
Well, we know, John did. 
I don't know the intricacies of 

870
00:51:48,000 --> 00:51:52,200
the others yet, I but I know 
that. 

871
00:51:52,200 --> 00:51:56,500
I mean, I fucking sorry. 
I'm sorry so much as I love all 

872
00:51:56,500 --> 00:51:58,900
you do. 
And I Thank him and Linda's 

873
00:51:58,900 --> 00:52:01,100
relationship. 
I haven't done like a deep dive 

874
00:52:01,100 --> 00:52:05,300
yet, but I would love to because
I love them, but I hope he 

875
00:52:05,300 --> 00:52:07,600
didn't cheat on her because I 
think of them as like the 

876
00:52:07,600 --> 00:52:11,300
perfect relationship, but I know
that before Linda, he did sleep 

877
00:52:11,300 --> 00:52:12,900
around a lot. 
Mmm. 

878
00:52:13,800 --> 00:52:16,900
So I mean you had a friend who 
was? 

879
00:52:17,000 --> 00:52:18,600
I'm not gonna say the band. 
Yeah. 

880
00:52:18,800 --> 00:52:22,000
But was a groupie for a 
well-known popular. 

881
00:52:22,900 --> 00:52:25,900
Pop ya boy band. 
Yeah, it's not the one you're 

882
00:52:25,900 --> 00:52:30,900
thinking of it's not the only, 
And they be saying this. 

883
00:52:30,900 --> 00:52:36,000
Yeah, but they seemed really 
squeaky clean from the outside. 

884
00:52:36,000 --> 00:52:38,400
Like you would think they're 
like Disney Channel type of 

885
00:52:38,400 --> 00:52:39,100
people. 
Yeah. 

886
00:52:39,100 --> 00:52:43,400
But they were having like orgies
yeah. 

887
00:52:43,500 --> 00:52:46,000
She's leaving with me. 
Yeah, well, pupil and I might, 

888
00:52:46,000 --> 00:52:52,300
yeah, which, so I'm sorry. 
Disgust me but just like that 

889
00:52:52,500 --> 00:52:55,100
scale. 
Freaks me out. 

890
00:52:55,100 --> 00:52:58,200
Mmm, you know. 
I don't know I guess it just 

891
00:52:58,200 --> 00:53:02,600
makes you wonder like for men in
general if they have access to 

892
00:53:02,600 --> 00:53:05,700
be able to sleep with whatever 
women they want. 

893
00:53:05,700 --> 00:53:09,700
Will they take advantage of it 
and at what cost I know. 

894
00:53:10,300 --> 00:53:14,200
So what percentage of men, I 
know, I want to see the data of 

895
00:53:14,200 --> 00:53:19,400
all the male musicians and rock 
stars and like how like, who was

896
00:53:19,400 --> 00:53:21,600
the most faithful? 
Yeah. 

897
00:53:21,600 --> 00:53:24,200
And which ones for the cheaters?
Because it seems like most of 

898
00:53:24,200 --> 00:53:29,800
them were cheaters and so 
casual, Maybe it's one of those 

899
00:53:29,800 --> 00:53:33,700
things where I do think who you 
hang out with, really can 

900
00:53:34,000 --> 00:53:38,000
influence your morals and just 
how you see the world. 

901
00:53:38,000 --> 00:53:42,900
And if they are like everybody 
does it then you think it's 

902
00:53:42,900 --> 00:53:44,700
normal. 
Yeah, exactly. 

903
00:53:45,000 --> 00:53:46,900
Yeah. 
And Carly was influenced by that

904
00:53:46,900 --> 00:53:49,300
as well because she felt very 
unloved and alone. 

905
00:53:49,300 --> 00:53:53,500
So she starts having an affair 
herself with a sound engineer 

906
00:53:53,500 --> 00:53:56,700
named. 
Scott lit, at her Studio Scott. 

907
00:53:56,800 --> 00:53:58,800
Got lit. 
Yeah, yeah. 

908
00:53:58,800 --> 00:54:00,700
Yeah, guys, guys. 
Very lips. 

909
00:54:00,700 --> 00:54:03,300
I'm like a movie character. 
I know. 

910
00:54:04,100 --> 00:54:08,800
But, and by her music producer 
tells her that she needs to tell

911
00:54:08,800 --> 00:54:12,500
James about this, why? 
I know James is already busy 

912
00:54:12,500 --> 00:54:15,200
with his girlfriend, her have 
anything to do with, I don't 

913
00:54:15,200 --> 00:54:17,900
know. 
So she tells James and James is 

914
00:54:17,900 --> 00:54:21,000
not fazed by it. 
And instead admits, I'm seeing a

915
00:54:21,000 --> 00:54:26,400
few women myself. 
My jaws dropped right now and so

916
00:54:26,500 --> 00:54:30,800
I'm sitting with you woman, my 
sarli later on thinks to herself

917
00:54:30,800 --> 00:54:36,100
that this is the reason why 
James was unfazed by that call 

918
00:54:36,100 --> 00:54:40,600
from Mick Jagger's wife, right 
before their wedding. 

919
00:54:40,600 --> 00:54:44,500
Well, I'm doing that too. 
Yeah, yeah. 

920
00:54:44,500 --> 00:54:48,700
It was like an unspoken 
agreement at that point that 

921
00:54:48,900 --> 00:54:51,000
they're allowed to step outside 
the marriage. 

922
00:54:51,100 --> 00:54:54,900
Even though they did have a rule
that they were Alchemist the 

923
00:54:54,900 --> 00:54:57,500
heck. 
No I feel betrayed. 

924
00:54:58,000 --> 00:55:00,900
It's really sad. 
So, Carly even writes a very 

925
00:55:00,900 --> 00:55:04,700
beautiful sad song about the 
state of their relationship. 

926
00:55:04,700 --> 00:55:08,800
It's called, we're so close. 
These are the lyrics, okay, it's

927
00:55:08,800 --> 00:55:11,800
come to be a habit with me to 
dine alone. 

928
00:55:11,800 --> 00:55:14,900
You're never home in the 
evenings and so early. 

929
00:55:14,900 --> 00:55:17,400
He says, we can be so close from
afar. 

930
00:55:17,400 --> 00:55:20,000
He says, the closest people 
always are. 

931
00:55:20,200 --> 00:55:22,300
We're so close that in our 
separation. 

932
00:55:22,300 --> 00:55:25,900
There's no distance at At all, 
there's a husky voice that 

933
00:55:25,900 --> 00:55:29,600
speaks to me in the dark and on 
the phone from Studios and west 

934
00:55:29,600 --> 00:55:32,500
side bars though. 
Tunnels of long distance. 

935
00:55:32,500 --> 00:55:35,500
He says we're Beyond flowers, he
says we're fucked. 

936
00:55:35,600 --> 00:55:38,300
We're Beyond compliments. 
We're so close that we can 

937
00:55:38,300 --> 00:55:40,900
dispense with love. 
We don't need love at all. 

938
00:55:41,700 --> 00:55:45,400
That is so sad. 
I know it's so sad but honestly,

939
00:55:45,400 --> 00:55:48,800
I feel like a lot of couples can
relate to that like the feeling 

940
00:55:48,800 --> 00:55:52,400
of being so close with someone 
that like you let go of trying 

941
00:55:52,400 --> 00:55:58,900
and their relationship That's 
definitely a common killer of 

942
00:55:59,200 --> 00:56:02,000
relationships. 
Yeah. 

943
00:56:02,600 --> 00:56:05,100
It's a good reminder. 
Yeah. 

944
00:56:05,100 --> 00:56:08,500
To all you people listening out 
all you people attending people.

945
00:56:08,500 --> 00:56:10,300
You love that. 
You love them. 

946
00:56:10,900 --> 00:56:14,500
No. 
Keep trying to woo the person. 

947
00:56:14,500 --> 00:56:20,500
Yeah that you're seeing I guess 
is if it's the beginning and 

948
00:56:21,400 --> 00:56:27,100
make offer to make them a 
home-cooked meal and top some 

949
00:56:27,100 --> 00:56:31,000
word and profess your love. 
It is a very loud. 

950
00:56:31,000 --> 00:56:33,400
Like they seemed so cute and 
lovely. 

951
00:56:33,400 --> 00:56:37,100
I know this is hard to hear. 
I know. 

952
00:56:37,100 --> 00:56:39,600
I feel like I skipped over Parts
in her book to that like we're 

953
00:56:39,600 --> 00:56:43,700
really lovey-dovey, like she 
just loves jeans so much. 

954
00:56:43,800 --> 00:56:48,500
Would you have said that he felt
the same way I think in a quiet 

955
00:56:48,500 --> 00:56:50,700
way he did. 
But I think she definitely came 

956
00:56:50,700 --> 00:56:55,600
on Stronger and was more vocal 
about her affection for him, but

957
00:56:55,600 --> 00:56:58,100
he did love her, but it just 
seems like a lot of his love was

958
00:56:58,100 --> 00:57:01,600
spontaneous though, like even 
his proposal, you know, because 

959
00:57:01,600 --> 00:57:04,200
during that time he also was 
really depressed and doing 

960
00:57:04,200 --> 00:57:05,900
heroin. 
So just kind of came out of 

961
00:57:05,900 --> 00:57:08,300
nowhere. 
But I mean like yeah like when 

962
00:57:08,300 --> 00:57:10,800
she was giving birth and he was 
true, it's cute. 

963
00:57:10,800 --> 00:57:14,100
No distracting. 
Her just it was inconsistent. 

964
00:57:14,200 --> 00:57:16,900
I kind of hate that though and 
like you can't really tell how 

965
00:57:16,900 --> 00:57:20,900
someone feels and they're being 
distant down all of a sudden. 

966
00:57:21,100 --> 00:57:23,900
Like, I love you and I didn't. 
Oh, so nice. 

967
00:57:23,900 --> 00:57:28,200
And I'm back to being down and 
we're exactly. 

968
00:57:28,300 --> 00:57:31,000
Exactly. 
It's like kind of a trauma Bond.

969
00:57:31,000 --> 00:57:35,500
Like yeah, the fact that James 
set expectations solo. 

970
00:57:35,500 --> 00:57:39,600
Most of the time made the 
moments where he is present and 

971
00:57:39,600 --> 00:57:41,900
loving seeing so much more 
special. 

972
00:57:41,900 --> 00:57:44,200
Yeah, yeah. 
So yeah. 

973
00:57:44,200 --> 00:57:46,900
Another big stress in their 
marriage to was the fact that 

974
00:57:46,900 --> 00:57:49,700
their baby Ben was sick all the 
time. 

975
00:57:51,400 --> 00:57:55,100
There was one night where he was
so sick and running a very high 

976
00:57:55,100 --> 00:58:00,100
fever and James was nowhere. 
In sight, he presumably was with

977
00:58:00,100 --> 00:58:05,800
his girlfriend Evie Carly writes
in her Memoir but then the next 

978
00:58:05,800 --> 00:58:08,400
evening Ben's fever was down and
James bounce. 

979
00:58:08,400 --> 00:58:12,500
So we start. 
So finally James comes home and 

980
00:58:12,700 --> 00:58:15,900
they get the fever down. 
They stay up all night trying to

981
00:58:15,900 --> 00:58:19,200
cool the baby down and Carly 
writes in her Memoir but then 

982
00:58:19,200 --> 00:58:20,900
the next evening Ben's fever was
down. 

983
00:58:21,100 --> 00:58:23,400
Down and James bounced up. 
And told me that he had to go 

984
00:58:23,400 --> 00:58:25,300
pick up a friend, I'll be right 
back. 

985
00:58:25,300 --> 00:58:27,400
He said he didn't return until 
8:30. 

986
00:58:27,400 --> 00:58:29,900
The following morning, I sat 
there in the living room. 

987
00:58:29,900 --> 00:58:32,700
Stone-faced either you're here 
or you're not. 

988
00:58:32,700 --> 00:58:34,200
I said wanly. 
All right. 

989
00:58:34,200 --> 00:58:36,900
Team said after a silence, I'll 
move out. 

990
00:58:39,900 --> 00:58:42,900
Right now. 
I said, all right, now I said 

991
00:58:42,900 --> 00:58:44,700
and I don't want the kids to see
you again. 

992
00:58:44,700 --> 00:58:47,600
I'm calling a lawyer. 
I want a trial separation. 

993
00:58:48,000 --> 00:58:55,900
No, but so then James does leave
the house and Carly is home and 

994
00:58:55,900 --> 00:58:59,400
she's really upset about it. 
Then the next day James just 

995
00:58:59,400 --> 00:59:06,200
comes back and they don't 
address it and carvings actually

996
00:59:06,200 --> 00:59:12,800
relieved that he came back. 
I wonder if she, when she said 

997
00:59:12,800 --> 00:59:15,500
that like almost didn't mean it 
or want it or something. 

998
00:59:15,500 --> 00:59:18,200
I think she will. 
She said either you're here or 

999
00:59:18,200 --> 00:59:20,300
you're there? 
That's very upsetting. 

1000
00:59:20,300 --> 00:59:21,900
The, he was like, okay. 
Yeah. 

1001
00:59:21,900 --> 00:59:28,100
He didn't say oh yeah. 
She didn't fight for her but he 

1002
00:59:28,200 --> 00:59:31,700
up at the same time didn't want 
to leave but Carly is still Fed 

1003
00:59:31,700 --> 00:59:37,100
Up by this affair. 
So she actually secretly gets a 

1004
00:59:37,100 --> 00:59:41,700
copy made of the key to that 
apartment wherever he is staying

1005
00:59:41,700 --> 00:59:45,800
in 1990 and she plans to 
confront a v. 

1006
00:59:46,300 --> 00:59:49,400
I was thinking we're whatever 
you said, the dress was like a 

1007
00:59:49,400 --> 00:59:52,300
hundred fourteen story or 
whatever and it's like I would 

1008
00:59:52,300 --> 00:59:55,100
go down there actually. 
I don't know if I would I would 

1009
00:59:55,100 --> 00:59:59,400
want to go down there. 
Bang the door open. 

1010
00:59:59,400 --> 01:00:02,600
Hmm with a bat. 
Yeah. 

1011
01:00:03,400 --> 01:00:06,100
And be like who the fuck is 
this? 

1012
01:00:07,300 --> 01:00:10,000
So yeah. 
Carly's really debating it like 

1013
01:00:10,000 --> 01:00:11,900
she thinks like yeah this is 
crazy. 

1014
01:00:11,900 --> 01:00:15,200
I don't know if I can do it. 
She's really nervous but she 

1015
01:00:15,200 --> 01:00:20,600
does it she leaving things home 
with the babies and she goes out

1016
01:00:20,600 --> 01:00:24,600
to the apartment when okay? 
I have a question when You say, 

1017
01:00:24,600 --> 01:00:27,400
lose him at home is a said, 
Martha's Vineyard. 

1018
01:00:27,500 --> 01:00:29,900
No, this is actually a New York 
guy they spend. 

1019
01:00:29,900 --> 01:00:34,100
I was getting confused, like, 
how are they going from MV to 

1020
01:00:34,300 --> 01:00:36,700
the, you know? 
Now, they have an apartment in 

1021
01:00:36,700 --> 01:00:39,700
New York, too. 
I think Martha's Vineyard is 

1022
01:00:39,700 --> 01:00:44,100
mostly a summer very, yeah, 
they're getting my car or maybe 

1023
01:00:44,100 --> 01:00:47,300
she flies, you know. 
Yeah, this is when they're in 

1024
01:00:47,300 --> 01:00:49,600
New York. 
So I don't know what he's doing.

1025
01:00:49,700 --> 01:00:52,600
Infidelity wise in Martha's 
Vineyard if he has another 

1026
01:00:52,600 --> 01:00:58,000
girlfriend on the island. 
Lifeguard anyway. 

1027
01:00:59,300 --> 01:01:03,100
But so Carly really wants the 
girlfriend to like see her as a 

1028
01:01:03,107 --> 01:01:06,200
real person and to like know 
that like it's a real marriage 

1029
01:01:06,200 --> 01:01:10,300
that she's interfering with. 
So she goes there and she 

1030
01:01:10,300 --> 01:01:14,300
confronts IV and she says I'm 
Carly. 

1031
01:01:14,300 --> 01:01:19,900
I said and every says, well, 
you're not a friend of mine, I 

1032
01:01:19,900 --> 01:01:22,200
know. 
But still, I'm Carly. 

1033
01:01:24,000 --> 01:01:27,000
I know. 
No, but still I'm Carly and Abby

1034
01:01:27,000 --> 01:01:29,700
says to her. 
James doesn't love you don't you

1035
01:01:29,700 --> 01:01:33,800
know that he calls you a JAP and
he told me you by I don't know. 

1036
01:01:34,000 --> 01:01:35,900
He told me. 
You buy a big Mercedes 

1037
01:01:35,900 --> 01:01:39,000
convertibles and drive around 
California trying to be a movie 

1038
01:01:39,000 --> 01:01:41,000
star but you're not pretty 
enough. 

1039
01:01:41,200 --> 01:01:44,900
She continued in this vein Jamie
had told her that I'd built a 

1040
01:01:44,900 --> 01:01:48,400
swimming pool because I couldn't
bear to step on any seaweed or 

1041
01:01:48,400 --> 01:01:50,900
any rocks. 
Beneath my feet where real 

1042
01:01:50,900 --> 01:01:55,800
people go swimming this comes up
again, I know, Okay. 

1043
01:01:55,800 --> 01:01:58,500
I love the beach. 
Not to go under two hands in 

1044
01:01:58,500 --> 01:01:59,200
here. 
I do. 

1045
01:01:59,200 --> 01:02:01,700
It'll be yeah. 
But like sometimes it's too 

1046
01:02:01,700 --> 01:02:03,400
cold. 
I'm guessing they would have 

1047
01:02:03,400 --> 01:02:05,600
heated floors on. 
Yeah, exactly. 

1048
01:02:06,200 --> 01:02:09,800
Sometimes it's sharks. 
Sometimes the waves are too 

1049
01:02:09,800 --> 01:02:10,800
treacherous. 
Yeah. 

1050
01:02:11,000 --> 01:02:12,800
And you want to still go 
swimming? 

1051
01:02:12,800 --> 01:02:14,000
Yeah. 
It's time to just want to like 

1052
01:02:14,000 --> 01:02:17,900
float. 
Mmm or just, you know, read a 

1053
01:02:17,900 --> 01:02:20,400
book on the wall. 
I mean, yeah, there's nothing 

1054
01:02:20,400 --> 01:02:22,100
wrong with The Best of Both 
Worlds. 

1055
01:02:22,100 --> 01:02:23,300
Having? 
Yeah. 

1056
01:02:23,300 --> 01:02:26,700
Beach and What is it? 
I mean, you ever go to a nice 

1057
01:02:26,700 --> 01:02:29,700
resort, you got both right there
and you can choose. 

1058
01:02:29,700 --> 01:02:33,000
I love. 
I love having not a care in the 

1059
01:02:33,000 --> 01:02:36,700
world, but to decide am I going 
to spend the day at the beach or

1060
01:02:36,700 --> 01:02:38,400
the pool? 
And it's like pool in the 

1061
01:02:38,400 --> 01:02:41,100
morning Beach later or reverse? 
Yeah. 

1062
01:02:41,200 --> 01:02:43,400
Yeah. 
You go to the beach and then you

1063
01:02:43,408 --> 01:02:47,000
get the sand off in the pool. 
So I don't know why this is a 

1064
01:02:47,008 --> 01:02:53,500
big party. 
Yeah, with older rock friends. 

1065
01:02:53,500 --> 01:02:56,500
I know No, I don't get it. 
I don't know why. 

1066
01:02:56,500 --> 01:02:59,300
This was a huge marital issue 
for giv. 

1067
01:02:59,300 --> 01:03:03,800
Is she should not? 
She does not know who I'm 

1068
01:03:04,100 --> 01:03:05,500
speaking to. 
I know. 

1069
01:03:05,500 --> 01:03:08,900
She's really smart so small. 
She says he says you spend all 

1070
01:03:08,900 --> 01:03:11,600
day shopping and buying fur 
coats and that you are dressing 

1071
01:03:11,600 --> 01:03:14,300
up, your children. 
Just like you, he tells me that 

1072
01:03:14,300 --> 01:03:17,700
you nurse your little boy still,
and that he will grow up to be a

1073
01:03:17,700 --> 01:03:21,900
very mmm. 
We're just little boy, is still 

1074
01:03:21,900 --> 01:03:24,800
quite young. 
He said, you don't really Sing 

1075
01:03:24,800 --> 01:03:27,500
well, and that you spent all 
day, getting bikini waxes. 

1076
01:03:27,500 --> 01:03:29,400
So you look good for your rich 
boyfriend. 

1077
01:03:29,500 --> 01:03:32,200
Who sends a planes for you all 
over the world. 

1078
01:03:32,200 --> 01:03:35,800
They getting the key. 
I know nice takes five minutes. 

1079
01:03:36,900 --> 01:03:39,300
He says you won't even notice 
when he's out of your house 

1080
01:03:39,300 --> 01:03:41,800
because you're so in love with 
your diamonds, in your fancy 

1081
01:03:41,800 --> 01:03:45,600
shoes and you tried them on in 
front of your mirror, you are a 

1082
01:03:45,600 --> 01:03:50,500
party girl, you are a bitch, a 
city girl, a lazy Playgirl. 

1083
01:03:50,500 --> 01:03:54,200
What did he call you? 
Yes, a swashbuckler it. 

1084
01:03:54,400 --> 01:03:56,900
That's so mean. 
Yeah. 

1085
01:03:56,900 --> 01:04:00,200
Every does not like that. 
I think I would like breakdown. 

1086
01:04:00,800 --> 01:04:03,900
And Carly says to her. 
I know you want to believe 

1087
01:04:03,900 --> 01:04:06,500
everything. 
James has told you, but you have

1088
01:04:06,500 --> 01:04:09,900
to see it all can't be true. 
He would never have loved me in 

1089
01:04:09,900 --> 01:04:13,300
the first place place. 
If I was all those things, he 

1090
01:04:13,300 --> 01:04:16,000
just said them to justify his 
actions to you. 

1091
01:04:16,300 --> 01:04:20,100
And then Evie says, he said, 
once you were sexy and fun, and 

1092
01:04:20,100 --> 01:04:23,500
now you ruined it all with your 
greediness and your furniture 

1093
01:04:23,500 --> 01:04:30,300
and your What what did she say 
about that? 

1094
01:04:30,700 --> 01:04:37,100
Anything like, she uses the 
bathroom and she freshens up and

1095
01:04:37,900 --> 01:04:43,700
I think she contemplates cutting
herself, but she doesn't. 

1096
01:04:44,300 --> 01:04:50,700
That would be horrible to hear 
that to hear your husband said. 

1097
01:04:50,700 --> 01:04:54,300
Those horrible things about you.
I know I think about I think she

1098
01:04:54,400 --> 01:04:57,600
I was in shock, too. 
And like she said, she didn't 

1099
01:04:57,600 --> 01:04:59,900
really believe it or believe 
that he meant it. 

1100
01:05:00,200 --> 01:05:03,300
What would you have done know? 
What would I have done? 

1101
01:05:04,500 --> 01:05:08,200
I would have punched that girl. 
I think it would have been. 

1102
01:05:08,400 --> 01:05:12,400
I mean I'm not I've never been 
in like a physical fight but I 

1103
01:05:12,400 --> 01:05:15,700
think it would be really hard 
besides my sisters and I was 

1104
01:05:15,700 --> 01:05:20,800
younger but I think we really 
hard not to do something. 

1105
01:05:20,800 --> 01:05:24,900
Yeah I don't know how she does /
Derek interface or I'm being 

1106
01:05:24,900 --> 01:05:28,500
like, yeah, because that girl 
did not hold back and I really 

1107
01:05:28,500 --> 01:05:32,900
wonder if that's her real name. 
If she stood out there, but 

1108
01:05:34,600 --> 01:05:38,900
yeah, I'm not a violent person 
by any means, but I don't think 

1109
01:05:38,900 --> 01:05:40,700
I would have been able to 
control myself. 

1110
01:05:40,700 --> 01:05:42,600
Yeah. 
I, I would have lost it. 

1111
01:05:42,607 --> 01:05:44,500
Yeah. 
Even just listening to, this 

1112
01:05:44,500 --> 01:05:47,700
isn't not even me. 
I know, like, getting all heated

1113
01:05:47,700 --> 01:05:51,800
up right now, even if someone 
said that to her friend, I think

1114
01:05:51,800 --> 01:05:56,400
I would have Just completely 
would March down there or knock 

1115
01:05:56,400 --> 01:05:59,800
down the door. 
So, she says, I came out of the 

1116
01:05:59,800 --> 01:06:03,000
bathroom and without a single 
word, put on my coat, I held up 

1117
01:06:03,000 --> 01:06:06,600
my hand to Evie shake and said 
she looked down at the floor. 

1118
01:06:07,000 --> 01:06:08,800
Evie. 
I said, I'm really glad I came 

1119
01:06:08,800 --> 01:06:10,300
here tonight. 
I'm sure I didn't make you 

1120
01:06:10,300 --> 01:06:13,000
happy, but I want you to know 
that I will tell James that I 

1121
01:06:13,008 --> 01:06:15,300
saw you. 
I tried not to sound pompous, or

1122
01:06:15,300 --> 01:06:18,700
insincere and considering the 
context felt as though I'd 

1123
01:06:18,700 --> 01:06:21,600
succeeded in being decent. 
When our eyes connected for a 

1124
01:06:21,607 --> 01:06:25,300
split second, I smiled broadly. 
Every didn't smile back nor had,

1125
01:06:25,300 --> 01:06:32,300
I expected her to. 
I didn't need her to mmm. 

1126
01:06:34,000 --> 01:06:38,200
I'm so upset right now, I know 
and I think James, once again. 

1127
01:06:38,200 --> 01:06:42,100
See is seemingly unfazed by 
Carly meeting at view. 

1128
01:06:42,200 --> 01:06:43,800
Oh, great. 
I know. 

1129
01:06:44,000 --> 01:06:47,300
It seems like everything. 
He's just like nonchalant about,

1130
01:06:47,400 --> 01:06:50,700
besides the swimming pool. 
Yeah, so true. 

1131
01:06:51,900 --> 01:06:56,600
Hey, so it's 1980 and somehow 
they're actually still together 

1132
01:06:56,700 --> 01:07:01,400
and on her ninth studio album. 
Come upstairs, Carly releases a 

1133
01:07:01,400 --> 01:07:06,000
song titled James, and Olivia, 
Star James. 

1134
01:07:06,000 --> 01:07:09,800
Your voice is like water. 
When I lift the shell to my ear,

1135
01:07:09,800 --> 01:07:12,000
I can hear you. 
Pouring out your heart. 

1136
01:07:12,000 --> 01:07:16,200
To me James, the beauty of your 
voice lists us from sadness. 

1137
01:07:16,500 --> 01:07:20,600
James let us become like water 
together, sing to me, sit on the

1138
01:07:20,607 --> 01:07:24,700
edge of my bed as when we were, 
as when we first spent nights 

1139
01:07:24,700 --> 01:07:27,500
together, your body wrapped 
around your guitar. 

1140
01:07:27,500 --> 01:07:29,500
Let the music speak for your 
heart. 

1141
01:07:29,500 --> 01:07:31,900
Let them combined like water and
sand. 

1142
01:07:31,900 --> 01:07:35,400
Let them meet the are like oops 
of rain and bring us together 

1143
01:07:35,400 --> 01:07:41,000
once again. 
She also writes a song called in

1144
01:07:41,000 --> 01:07:44,700
pain, which is very depressing. 
It's just like the, about the 

1145
01:07:44,700 --> 01:07:49,600
end of the relationship. 1981, 
Carly goes on tour for this 

1146
01:07:49,600 --> 01:07:53,000
album come upstairs, but is 
struggling badly from anxiety 

1147
01:07:53,000 --> 01:07:56,600
and depression, due to the 
crumbling marriage, there's some

1148
01:07:56,600 --> 01:07:57,600
it been? 
Yeah. 

1149
01:07:57,600 --> 01:08:00,300
There's some been is also 
struggling from kidney 

1150
01:08:00,300 --> 01:08:02,900
dysplasia, which is quite 
serious. 

1151
01:08:02,900 --> 01:08:06,400
It's actually what student? 
Sarah Hyland had the actors from

1152
01:08:06,400 --> 01:08:08,600
Modern Family. 
Emily that she needed to kidney 

1153
01:08:08,600 --> 01:08:11,700
transplants for. 
So that's causing a lot of 

1154
01:08:11,700 --> 01:08:14,900
stress and Carly isn't really 
eating, and she's losing a lot 

1155
01:08:14,900 --> 01:08:17,700
of weight. 
And she actually collapse on 

1156
01:08:17,700 --> 01:08:21,100
stage at a show in Pittsburgh. 
And then several other tour 

1157
01:08:21,100 --> 01:08:23,899
dates are cancelled because 
she's too weak to perform. 

1158
01:08:24,000 --> 01:08:28,500
No, no, no, don't hurt her 
James. 

1159
01:08:30,200 --> 01:08:32,500
She seems like such a ray of 
sunshine. 

1160
01:08:33,000 --> 01:08:35,600
My gosh, and this hurts me. 
Well, she's a beaut. 

1161
01:08:35,600 --> 01:08:39,000
First of all, her book is 
Beautifully written like even 

1162
01:08:39,100 --> 01:08:42,899
her diary entries from way back 
when she has such a beautiful 

1163
01:08:42,899 --> 01:08:47,399
way with words and she's so in 
love with James like, you know, 

1164
01:08:47,500 --> 01:08:52,000
yes she does cheat on him but 
it's out of, he started exactly.

1165
01:08:52,100 --> 01:08:54,000
I think she kind of does it to 
get a reaction? 

1166
01:08:54,000 --> 01:08:58,800
Yeah, that's only fair. 
I can't blame her at all. 

1167
01:08:58,800 --> 01:09:02,800
Virginia on him and she could 
not really monogamous and ya 

1168
01:09:02,800 --> 01:09:07,100
know. 
So, you know, I don't think 

1169
01:09:07,100 --> 01:09:08,500
that's wrong. 
Me neither. 

1170
01:09:08,500 --> 01:09:10,399
I think all's Fair. 
Once the other person is 

1171
01:09:10,399 --> 01:09:12,500
cheating and will not stop being
an idiot. 

1172
01:09:12,600 --> 01:09:15,399
Yeah, I mean, he's just 
basically established. 

1173
01:09:15,500 --> 01:09:18,100
Mmm. 
This is the way it is, you know.

1174
01:09:18,100 --> 01:09:20,899
Exactly. 
So Carly ends up spending a 

1175
01:09:20,899 --> 01:09:24,300
month in the hospital to gain 
weight and when she gets out, 

1176
01:09:24,300 --> 01:09:28,700
James has a new girlfriend an 
actress named Catherine Walker, 

1177
01:09:28,700 --> 01:09:30,500
who later becomes his second 
one. 

1178
01:09:32,300 --> 01:09:42,500
My mouth Sokka doesn't come beIN
audio, but he's he's checking 

1179
01:09:42,500 --> 01:09:45,200
out James releases. 
His tenth studio album. 

1180
01:09:45,700 --> 01:09:48,500
The lead single is called Hard 
Times, which gives a clue to 

1181
01:09:48,500 --> 01:09:51,000
fans that their marriage is on 
the Rocks. 

1182
01:09:51,000 --> 01:09:55,200
So lyrics, are we've seen some 
Hard Times Hard Times holding it

1183
01:09:55,200 --> 01:09:58,700
together ain't always easy, an 
angry, man, hungry woman. 

1184
01:09:59,000 --> 01:10:00,900
They're driving each other 
crazy. 

1185
01:10:01,100 --> 01:10:05,900
It's so So low down Showdown. 
There's nothing else. 

1186
01:10:06,300 --> 01:10:09,800
Safe to say babies on the town 
babies looking around. 

1187
01:10:09,900 --> 01:10:13,400
Talking about walking away, 
don't let go, Gotta Give It One 

1188
01:10:13,400 --> 01:10:16,200
More Chance. 
We've got a hold on, loving me 

1189
01:10:16,200 --> 01:10:20,700
may not take make much sense but
I'm gone on you baby, baby. 

1190
01:10:21,000 --> 01:10:22,700
I'm gone and I want you back 
again. 

1191
01:10:22,700 --> 01:10:25,700
I may be wrong for you baby. 
Maybe I'm wrong but I love you. 

1192
01:10:25,700 --> 01:10:28,700
Just the same. 
Interesting. 

1193
01:10:29,600 --> 01:10:33,300
Interesting. 
Wasn't That. 

1194
01:10:35,000 --> 01:10:37,300
Carly and her Memoir keeps 
repeating that line. 

1195
01:10:37,300 --> 01:10:41,000
Angry man, hungry woman about 
their relationship. 

1196
01:10:41,700 --> 01:10:42,900
I hate that. 
I know. 

1197
01:10:43,300 --> 01:10:48,200
And then 1981, they're 
officially separated and Carly 

1198
01:10:48,200 --> 01:10:52,500
is interviewed about it. 
Here it is to the state of your 

1199
01:10:52,500 --> 01:10:55,300
marriage which has been highly 
publicized. 

1200
01:10:56,200 --> 01:10:59,700
What is this state or and 
prognosis for the future? 

1201
01:11:00,700 --> 01:11:04,300
God will being the asked a 
personal question like this over

1202
01:11:04,400 --> 01:11:06,300
over television, where a lot of 
people are looking at. 

1203
01:11:06,300 --> 01:11:09,500
It makes me want to take a jump.
Yeah, it makes me want to just 

1204
01:11:09,500 --> 01:11:15,100
go over there and jump, jump 
down but it's it's it's a it's a

1205
01:11:15,108 --> 01:11:18,100
fairly, you know, accepted fact 
that we are separated. 

1206
01:11:18,100 --> 01:11:19,800
Yes. 
We're not living together. 

1207
01:11:19,800 --> 01:11:24,800
We are we're both doing fine. 
Both mother and child are doing 

1208
01:11:24,800 --> 01:11:30,000
fine. 
We are We're in a better State 

1209
01:11:30,000 --> 01:11:33,000
now than we have been in, in 
quite a while. 

1210
01:11:33,400 --> 01:11:38,000
And, and I don't have any 
feelings of regret about having 

1211
01:11:38,000 --> 01:11:41,800
been married to James. 
We had nine wonderful years 

1212
01:11:41,800 --> 01:11:45,200
together, and two wonderful 
children and two, wonderful 

1213
01:11:45,200 --> 01:11:47,300
children. 
And and I think it's to our 

1214
01:11:47,300 --> 01:11:53,000
credit that we realized when 
Things were no longer really 

1215
01:11:53,000 --> 01:11:56,300
mental and that things right 
now. 

1216
01:11:56,900 --> 01:11:59,500
Yes. 
And for the foreseeable future 

1217
01:11:59,500 --> 01:12:05,800
and Know You Can Tell She's just
so broken up over it. 

1218
01:12:06,000 --> 01:12:09,700
But she still she doesn't want 
to say anything bad about James 

1219
01:12:09,900 --> 01:12:12,900
at all. 
Well she sure is sweet. 

1220
01:12:13,000 --> 01:12:14,400
Hmm. 
What she said. 

1221
01:12:14,400 --> 01:12:20,000
But so then it's 1982 James and 
Carly have been broken up for a 

1222
01:12:20,800 --> 01:12:26,000
And James dropped off the kids 
at Carly's place and Carly 

1223
01:12:26,000 --> 01:12:29,200
writes that their relationship 
at this time would usually be 

1224
01:12:29,200 --> 01:12:33,200
described as sharp and he did, 
but occasionally civil. 

1225
01:12:33,800 --> 01:12:36,600
But on this one particular 
night, when James is dropping 

1226
01:12:36,600 --> 01:12:39,800
off the kids, he unexpectedly 
comes inside the apartment and 

1227
01:12:39,800 --> 01:12:44,100
just sits down and they just 
stare at each other in silence 

1228
01:12:44,600 --> 01:12:48,400
until they make their way into 
the bedroom and sleep together. 

1229
01:12:48,400 --> 01:12:52,500
Oh my God. 
God Charlie Wright's. 

1230
01:12:53,000 --> 01:12:58,200
Wow, I noticed that James is 
long, aristocratic fingers were 

1231
01:12:58,200 --> 01:13:01,100
stained with nicotine. 
Mostly, I noticed that he wasn't

1232
01:13:01,100 --> 01:13:04,400
wearing a wedding ring. 
There was a hesitation, but that

1233
01:13:04,400 --> 01:13:08,800
familiar weight like that of 
some Sleek animal grafted onto 

1234
01:13:08,800 --> 01:13:11,500
me later. 
I knew he'd say he was sorry and

1235
01:13:11,500 --> 01:13:14,900
that he hadn't meant to meant 
it, that it didn't mean 

1236
01:13:14,900 --> 01:13:16,800
anything. 
But in those moments, I was in 

1237
01:13:16,800 --> 01:13:18,900
heaven that lost had toppled 
him. 

1238
01:13:20,200 --> 01:13:24,300
Unlike then she says, I felt 
like I was Orpheus leading your 

1239
01:13:24,400 --> 01:13:27,600
eurydice out of the underworld 
not daring to look back until we

1240
01:13:27,600 --> 01:13:30,900
had at least reached the upper 
air, but unlike the myth is B. 

1241
01:13:30,900 --> 01:13:33,600
The gender roles been reversed 
and never looked back and James 

1242
01:13:33,600 --> 01:13:36,600
still disappeared. 
Wow. 

1243
01:13:36,700 --> 01:13:40,400
Wow. 
Oh my gosh, that felt like a 

1244
01:13:40,400 --> 01:13:43,000
novel or something. 
I know, I felt like you were 

1245
01:13:43,000 --> 01:13:46,100
reading Tom. 
I know this your sleeves looking

1246
01:13:46,100 --> 01:13:50,500
heat of passion. 
Sometimes I feel like From this 

1247
01:13:50,500 --> 01:13:53,700
show, I'm realizing that, like, 
sometimes real life is just 

1248
01:13:53,700 --> 01:13:58,200
crazier than Fiction. 
I know seriously. 

1249
01:13:58,600 --> 01:14:01,500
I know without saying anything, 
he sat on the bed. 

1250
01:14:04,300 --> 01:14:09,000
Okay, but this is crazy 1985. 
Now, Carly gets engaged to a 

1251
01:14:09,000 --> 01:14:13,100
drummer named Russ. 
Kunkel, who is any detail? 

1252
01:14:13,100 --> 01:14:15,900
This is well, conkel. 
Hmm. 

1253
01:14:18,800 --> 01:14:23,400
He's drumming on tour with James
who's James live on particular 

1254
01:14:25,200 --> 01:14:30,100
and Carly is asked about this in
an interview with Charlie Rose. 

1255
01:14:30,500 --> 01:14:33,000
Let's hear it. 
Interesting. 

1256
01:14:33,000 --> 01:14:35,300
Russell conquer raises the 
question, that's often 

1257
01:14:35,300 --> 01:14:37,400
speculating the process, whether
the two of you are going to get 

1258
01:14:37,400 --> 01:14:40,000
married. 
Well, this is a, this is a 

1259
01:14:40,000 --> 01:14:45,400
Divine possibility, a Divine 
possibility, he plays. 

1260
01:14:45,500 --> 01:14:47,200
He's going to be touring with 
James, right? 

1261
01:14:47,700 --> 01:14:50,000
Yes. 
Is that going to be easy? 

1262
01:14:51,100 --> 01:14:53,100
You'll have to ask me that in 
about 3 months. 

1263
01:14:53,100 --> 01:14:55,100
What do you expect trouble? 
And what does change say about 

1264
01:14:55,100 --> 01:14:57,500
all this? 
Again, you'll have to ask you. 

1265
01:14:58,900 --> 01:15:03,100
I don't talk to him about that. 
You don't. 

1266
01:15:04,400 --> 01:15:05,800
Okay. 
This is something I guess 

1267
01:15:05,800 --> 01:15:08,900
between James and Russ. 
Yeah, they have been working 

1268
01:15:08,900 --> 01:15:11,900
together for years and I don't I
don't really see that there's 

1269
01:15:11,900 --> 01:15:13,600
any reason to stop. 
Yeah. 

1270
01:15:18,300 --> 01:15:20,600
And Charlie Rose. 
Yeah. 

1271
01:15:20,600 --> 01:15:26,700
So flustered I know. 
Oh my gosh car. 

1272
01:15:28,200 --> 01:15:31,000
But, you know, I feel like a 
part of Carly like, like, based 

1273
01:15:31,000 --> 01:15:32,900
off her book. 
I feel like she's still I was in

1274
01:15:32,900 --> 01:15:37,500
love with James as the stairs 
went by. 

1275
01:15:37,900 --> 01:15:41,700
So I do wonder if like, there's 
a little bit of like, vindictive

1276
01:15:42,100 --> 01:15:46,600
and they're on her part. 
Maybe she was acting kind of 

1277
01:15:46,600 --> 01:15:49,400
like, I don't know. 
You gotta ask James. 

1278
01:15:49,400 --> 01:15:53,700
Yeah, we don't talk about that. 
Yeah, I mean, James is always 

1279
01:15:53,700 --> 01:15:58,100
unfazed by these things that he 
should have a motion for so. 

1280
01:15:58,900 --> 01:16:00,200
Wow. 
They never end up getting 

1281
01:16:00,200 --> 01:16:02,100
married though. 
Um, and they decide they're 

1282
01:16:02,100 --> 01:16:04,600
better. 
A off as friends, interesting. 

1283
01:16:04,800 --> 01:16:09,000
And meanwhile, during this time,
James gets married to that 

1284
01:16:09,000 --> 01:16:12,900
girlfriend from before Catherine
Walker and they're married until

1285
01:16:12,900 --> 01:16:15,000
1996. 
Wow. 

1286
01:16:15,100 --> 01:16:18,700
Damn, Carly is interviewed at 
her home in New York City. 

1287
01:16:18,700 --> 01:16:22,800
And she says that her 
relationship with James is 1986.

1288
01:16:22,800 --> 01:16:27,700
Now is strained, but that she 
still has feelings for him and 

1289
01:16:27,900 --> 01:16:32,400
she describes that she's the 
main caretaker for their kids. 

1290
01:16:32,900 --> 01:16:36,600
And that James is only involved 
when it's convenient for him. 

1291
01:16:36,600 --> 01:16:40,300
And he just kind of comes and 
goes and she says, like I would 

1292
01:16:40,300 --> 01:16:44,700
be probably on tour more often 
but I have the responsibility of

1293
01:16:44,700 --> 01:16:46,800
the kids. 
My main job is a mom. 

1294
01:16:47,000 --> 01:16:51,100
Yeah, where is James main job is
still to be a musician first and

1295
01:16:51,100 --> 01:16:55,900
he's a father. 
S II did wonder frequently. 

1296
01:16:55,900 --> 01:16:59,800
Like if James was a present 
father at all, I think he still 

1297
01:16:59,800 --> 01:17:03,200
remained in Sally and Ends 
lives. 

1298
01:17:03,200 --> 01:17:06,800
They're both musicians now, and 
like there have been videos of 

1299
01:17:06,800 --> 01:17:11,300
them performing with James on 
stage, but definitely their 

1300
01:17:11,300 --> 01:17:15,100
primary caretaker was Carly and 
they're much closer with Carly. 

1301
01:17:16,200 --> 01:17:20,900
Yeah, 1987 Carly marries another
James. 

1302
01:17:20,900 --> 01:17:23,600
A man named James Hart. 
A writer, and poet, and 

1303
01:17:23,600 --> 01:17:26,000
businessman writer poet 
business. 

1304
01:17:26,000 --> 01:17:29,300
Yeah, that's how he's described 
on Wikipedia, they divorced in 

1305
01:17:29,308 --> 01:17:32,400
2007 because he ends up being 
gay. 

1306
01:17:32,500 --> 01:17:37,900
Say, oh no. 
So I don't know anything about 

1307
01:17:37,900 --> 01:17:40,800
gay the whole time. 
I'm not sure. 

1308
01:17:40,800 --> 01:17:47,000
I don't know much about their 
marriage but 1988 James is 

1309
01:17:47,000 --> 01:17:51,000
interviewed a part of the Joe 
Jackson interviews. 

1310
01:17:51,100 --> 01:17:56,000
And he's asked about Carly and 
says he was too young to be 

1311
01:17:56,000 --> 01:18:00,200
married. 
What I'm going to say that here 

1312
01:18:00,200 --> 01:18:04,000
it is. 
I still It's my friends with 

1313
01:18:04,000 --> 01:18:05,900
Carly. 
Yeah, no. 

1314
01:18:05,900 --> 01:18:09,400
I would say that we were friends
and I I tend to want to have as 

1315
01:18:09,400 --> 01:18:12,000
little contact with her as 
possible and I assume that she's

1316
01:18:12,000 --> 01:18:14,500
the feeling's mutual it 
communicates. 

1317
01:18:14,500 --> 01:18:16,700
Um, what about the kids and 
that's it. 

1318
01:18:17,300 --> 01:18:20,300
It ended up that literally I 
wouldn't say it's terribly 

1319
01:18:20,300 --> 01:18:24,800
bitter. 
I just I just think that that it

1320
01:18:24,800 --> 01:18:29,700
ended format that it's that's I 
prefer to have very limited 

1321
01:18:29,700 --> 01:18:32,400
contact Thang. 
Yeah. 

1322
01:18:32,500 --> 01:18:35,000
Yeah, one thing about the Joe 
Jackson interview is, that's the

1323
01:18:35,000 --> 01:18:39,100
first time we hear like, James 
doesn't really communicate with 

1324
01:18:39,100 --> 01:18:41,800
Carly at all. 
Like, and that kind of speaks 

1325
01:18:41,800 --> 01:18:45,300
back to in Carly's memory. 
When she's writing about James 

1326
01:18:45,300 --> 01:18:49,400
is coldness towards his Exes, in
the past, how we just completely

1327
01:18:49,400 --> 01:18:52,500
cuts and cuts them out, and 
that's it door, slams. 

1328
01:18:52,500 --> 01:18:55,900
Mmm. 
And I'm all for no contact after

1329
01:18:55,900 --> 01:18:57,800
break-up. 
But he definitely takes it to 

1330
01:18:57,800 --> 01:18:59,500
the extreme. 
Yeah. 

1331
01:18:59,600 --> 01:19:04,300
Like he's done and I don't know.
Maybe that's because he can't 

1332
01:19:04,300 --> 01:19:10,900
control himself like maybe he 
sees it very black and white and

1333
01:19:10,900 --> 01:19:15,500
otherwise he would walk into her
apartment and sit on the bed and

1334
01:19:15,500 --> 01:19:18,500
sleep with her. 
Once again, I am Oliver no 

1335
01:19:18,500 --> 01:19:22,000
contact when you need to get 
over a relationship, but you 

1336
01:19:22,000 --> 01:19:26,200
should not be talking to your 
ex-boyfriend or ex-girlfriend or

1337
01:19:26,208 --> 01:19:29,000
whatever if you still have 
feelings for them. 

1338
01:19:29,000 --> 01:19:31,300
You need to move on whatever. 
But I do think like if Years Ago

1339
01:19:31,300 --> 01:19:35,600
by There's no reason to still be
so hostile, I mean unless they 

1340
01:19:35,600 --> 01:19:38,100
did something exactly. 
Let me she's the mother of his 

1341
01:19:38,100 --> 01:19:40,000
children. 
Like how can you not talk to 

1342
01:19:40,000 --> 01:19:41,100
her, you know. 
Yeah. 

1343
01:19:41,100 --> 01:19:45,700
Like I it makes me really sad 
that they're not on a talking 

1344
01:19:45,700 --> 01:19:49,400
basis when they have children 
together like I feel like it 

1345
01:19:49,400 --> 01:19:51,500
probably would have been a lot 
easier for the kids if their 

1346
01:19:51,500 --> 01:19:55,100
parents still got along and you 
know could be in the same room 

1347
01:19:55,100 --> 01:19:57,900
with each other and it's all 
James choosing not to be. 

1348
01:19:57,900 --> 01:20:01,800
Yeah. 
So I got asked, where does 

1349
01:20:01,800 --> 01:20:03,800
You're So Vain? 
Into all this. 

1350
01:20:03,800 --> 01:20:06,700
Oh, that's a great question. 
She wrote that before. 

1351
01:20:06,800 --> 01:20:10,200
Oh, really? 
Yeah, before they dated, I think

1352
01:20:10,200 --> 01:20:12,500
at the beginning of their 
relationship, it's not about 

1353
01:20:12,500 --> 01:20:14,800
James whatsoever. 
Mmm. 

1354
01:20:14,800 --> 01:20:18,500
I think it's about actually a 
couple people. 

1355
01:20:18,500 --> 01:20:21,200
She obviously has never really 
said who it's about. 

1356
01:20:21,500 --> 01:20:26,100
It's 100% not about James Taylor
at all and think he is vain. 

1357
01:20:27,400 --> 01:20:28,900
Hmm. 
Not know. 

1358
01:20:28,900 --> 01:20:30,500
I don't think that's his 
problem. 

1359
01:20:30,500 --> 01:20:33,400
I think he's a lot of problems 
but entity is Isn't one? 

1360
01:20:33,400 --> 01:20:35,800
Yeah, it didn't realize I was 
before it could. 

1361
01:20:35,800 --> 01:20:37,500
Yeah, that's a good question, 
though. 

1362
01:20:37,800 --> 01:20:40,100
It could potentially be about 
Warren BB. 

1363
01:20:40,200 --> 01:20:44,200
I think that's one of the 
biggest suspects by. 

1364
01:20:44,200 --> 01:20:45,900
Yep. 
Not James. 

1365
01:20:46,800 --> 01:20:49,700
That's pretty successful song. 
Oh, yeah. 

1366
01:20:49,700 --> 01:20:54,700
And so, when that song came out 
to like beforehand, James was a 

1367
01:20:54,700 --> 01:20:58,400
lot more successful than Carly, 
but that kind of Switched things

1368
01:20:58,400 --> 01:21:00,600
for a while because it came out 
right in the beginning of their 

1369
01:21:00,600 --> 01:21:05,800
relationship, okay? 
Not Nope, he's not even on the 

1370
01:21:05,800 --> 01:21:07,600
table. 
I think she explicitly says that

1371
01:21:07,600 --> 01:21:11,700
to make sense. 
That's an amazing Breakup Song. 

1372
01:21:11,700 --> 01:21:14,700
Actually just in our last 
episode, when we were talking 

1373
01:21:14,700 --> 01:21:19,700
about Alanis Morissette and You 
Oughta known to see how direct 

1374
01:21:19,700 --> 01:21:22,800
that song is kind of reminds me 
of your soaping. 

1375
01:21:22,800 --> 01:21:27,500
Yeah, like just being, like, not
holding back at all. 

1376
01:21:27,500 --> 01:21:30,800
They're both iconic breakup 
songs. 

1377
01:21:31,400 --> 01:21:33,300
Put them in your breakup 
playlist. 

1378
01:21:35,800 --> 01:21:38,700
But yeah. 
So then in 1994 she's on the 

1379
01:21:38,700 --> 01:21:40,800
Howard Stern Show. 
Oh my God. 

1380
01:21:41,000 --> 01:21:45,200
And Howard does not hold back, 
he never does. 

1381
01:21:45,300 --> 01:21:48,100
Oh, I know you're getting 
something good. 

1382
01:21:48,500 --> 01:21:51,600
All right, here's a clip. 
Pretty sleazy looks like James 

1383
01:21:51,600 --> 01:21:54,600
Taylor and he sings like James, 
Taylor your son, which is gonna 

1384
01:21:54,600 --> 01:21:57,400
be a nightmare for you because 
you reminded a James every 

1385
01:21:57,400 --> 01:21:58,600
minute, when you look at them 
right? 

1386
01:21:58,900 --> 01:22:01,000
Or is it good? 
It's wonderful as it. 

1387
01:22:01,200 --> 01:22:05,000
With you is wonderful. 
You know, I really liked it. 

1388
01:22:05,000 --> 01:22:06,800
I think the world of James. 
He do. 

1389
01:22:07,100 --> 01:22:09,600
Absolutely. 
And and it's must've got a good 

1390
01:22:09,600 --> 01:22:10,400
settlement. 
You guys. 

1391
01:22:10,400 --> 01:22:10,900
Split. 
Everything. 

1392
01:22:10,900 --> 01:22:12,400
Equally when you were broke up 
to cut. 

1393
01:22:12,400 --> 01:22:14,300
That must've been a bonanza 
between you and money and his 

1394
01:22:14,300 --> 01:22:16,200
money. 
Yeah, they just took their own 

1395
01:22:16,200 --> 01:22:18,200
separate piles. 
I think I'm gonna take a guess, 

1396
01:22:18,200 --> 01:22:20,200
I'm going to say that was a 
hundred million dollar divorce 

1397
01:22:20,200 --> 01:22:25,100
settlement 50/50 You gotta 
remember that I because I don't 

1398
01:22:25,100 --> 01:22:27,800
do concerts I don't make a lot 
of money and and or James 

1399
01:22:27,800 --> 01:22:31,100
performs two three times a day 
he makes up for what you do. 

1400
01:22:31,100 --> 01:22:33,000
That's right. 
He's great. 

1401
01:22:33,100 --> 01:22:35,800
A lot of money, he's great but 
he is great and but obviously he

1402
01:22:35,800 --> 01:22:37,200
wasn't the man that could 
satisfy. 

1403
01:22:37,200 --> 01:22:43,100
You know it's true. 
You needed a real man, you don't

1404
01:22:43,100 --> 01:22:47,700
need no sensitive man who sings 
folk tunes that guy you need an 

1405
01:22:47,700 --> 01:22:52,600
angry shock jock, you need 
baseball player, you do not need

1406
01:22:52,600 --> 01:22:54,100
to Little can't believe he 
broke. 

1407
01:22:54,100 --> 01:22:56,600
Did he break up with you or you 
broke it off with him? 

1408
01:22:56,600 --> 01:23:00,300
Or just, you know, it's never 
just one that it takes two to 

1409
01:23:00,300 --> 01:23:02,300
tango. 
And it takes two to pretty much 

1410
01:23:02,300 --> 01:23:05,200
dissolve something that's that 
important because I would have 

1411
01:23:05,200 --> 01:23:06,700
stayed with you. 
I find it very sexy unless 

1412
01:23:06,700 --> 01:23:07,800
you're a pain in the ass to live
with. 

1413
01:23:07,800 --> 01:23:09,900
I can't figure out the downside.
Well what did he say when you 

1414
01:23:09,900 --> 01:23:11,200
asked him? 
That said you were a pain in the

1415
01:23:11,200 --> 01:23:18,200
ass to live with, oh he did he 
did you want to say about him 

1416
01:23:19,300 --> 01:23:20,700
know that he had his 
opportunity? 

1417
01:23:20,700 --> 01:23:25,600
You should certainly do that. 
Oh, yeah, gentlemen, know he is 

1418
01:23:25,608 --> 01:23:26,500
he didn't. 
He said, you were hard to live 

1419
01:23:26,500 --> 01:23:30,300
without you were very different 
and you only he said, toward the

1420
01:23:30,300 --> 01:23:32,500
annually kids are listening. 
So toward the end, you didn't 

1421
01:23:32,500 --> 01:23:34,100
give him that, much sex. 
No, no. 

1422
01:23:34,100 --> 01:23:35,900
He, he did. 
He said, you got it, like, two 

1423
01:23:35,900 --> 01:23:39,000
or three times a month, and he 
just couldn't take it anymore. 

1424
01:23:40,200 --> 01:23:42,600
My guess on James, is that he 
probably started messing around 

1425
01:23:42,600 --> 01:23:44,100
with some groupies and stuff and
you caught him. 

1426
01:23:44,800 --> 01:23:47,500
Well, how close am I? 
I could figure this whole thing 

1427
01:23:47,500 --> 01:23:50,400
out. 
Okay, well I'll close the, my my

1428
01:23:50,400 --> 01:23:52,600
clothes just tell me if I'm 
getting it. 

1429
01:23:53,000 --> 01:23:54,400
Am I getting warm? 
No you not. 

1430
01:23:54,700 --> 01:23:56,600
Tell the truth. 
You know what it was? 

1431
01:23:56,600 --> 01:23:58,700
You catch em all. 
Let's just say it was my fault. 

1432
01:23:58,700 --> 01:24:00,000
You were busy. 
Go on tour. 

1433
01:24:00,000 --> 01:24:01,800
We didn't pay attention to his 
needs. 

1434
01:24:01,900 --> 01:24:03,600
You were caught up in your own 
Fame. 

1435
01:24:03,600 --> 01:24:05,700
Understand a lot of what I 
needed to understand. 

1436
01:24:05,700 --> 01:24:09,700
I was young, and I did you need 
to understand what song is this.

1437
01:24:12,500 --> 01:24:14,000
He was going through in his 
life. 

1438
01:24:15,200 --> 01:24:19,400
He just goes for it. 
Oh, he doesn't hold back at all 

1439
01:24:19,700 --> 01:24:21,900
and it's sweet. 
How Carly is like, you don't 

1440
01:24:21,900 --> 01:24:24,500
need to belittle him. 
Like she really, even though she

1441
01:24:24,500 --> 01:24:28,200
really has every right to 
belittle him, she is so 

1442
01:24:28,200 --> 01:24:33,300
respectful of jeans and as 
defensive him years later, wow, 

1443
01:24:34,400 --> 01:24:38,900
why is she being so kind and 
selfless. 

1444
01:24:38,900 --> 01:24:43,300
Like it's nice and it's 
admirable but no so hard on 

1445
01:24:43,300 --> 01:24:48,100
herself. 
It was At all remotely close. 

1446
01:24:48,100 --> 01:24:50,400
I think she did everything she 
could to keep that marriage 

1447
01:24:50,400 --> 01:24:53,300
alive past the point of no 
return. 

1448
01:24:53,700 --> 01:24:59,400
And forgave a lot that in my 
opinion is unforgivable and I I 

1449
01:24:59,400 --> 01:25:02,900
think Howard Stern is so funny 
but I was feeling really bad for

1450
01:25:02,900 --> 01:25:07,800
her right now. 
I feel really bad but I mean she

1451
01:25:07,800 --> 01:25:11,600
should have just said that I 
mean I get it doesn't want to 

1452
01:25:12,800 --> 01:25:17,500
talk badly about James. 
Yes, but that's frustrating me. 

1453
01:25:17,800 --> 01:25:20,200
Hmm. 
I mean, even in her Memoir word,

1454
01:25:20,200 --> 01:25:22,400
she's writing about James 
cheating on her. 

1455
01:25:22,400 --> 01:25:25,800
Like, obviously his actions are 
pretty bad, but she still speaks

1456
01:25:25,800 --> 01:25:30,700
of him with the utmost kindness 
and love, and she's not willing 

1457
01:25:30,700 --> 01:25:33,200
to bad-mouth him at all. 
I mean, he is the father of her 

1458
01:25:33,200 --> 01:25:35,900
children. 
So I wonder if he really did say

1459
01:25:35,900 --> 01:25:39,600
that to Howard Stern about. 
That's so mean her. 

1460
01:25:39,600 --> 01:25:41,500
Not those sleeping with him 
enough. 

1461
01:25:41,500 --> 01:25:44,400
Why can't he reciprocate? 
I know. 

1462
01:25:45,200 --> 01:25:48,600
And honestly two to three times 
a month isn't bad. 

1463
01:25:48,600 --> 01:25:53,300
I know they're near married at 
23 times a month. 

1464
01:25:54,500 --> 01:25:56,800
That's good. 
He's traveling all the time. 

1465
01:25:56,800 --> 01:25:59,500
Anyway, I know exactly. 
I mean, Larry with this point I 

1466
01:25:59,508 --> 01:26:05,400
know two or three times a year. 
Some people do sometimes never. 

1467
01:26:06,000 --> 01:26:10,100
So he's got a problem. 
Mmm. 

1468
01:26:11,100 --> 01:26:13,500
Yeah. 
So yeah, 2001. 

1469
01:26:13,500 --> 01:26:18,600
James, Mary's, Boston Symphony, 
Orchestra director, Kim Smith 

1470
01:26:18,600 --> 01:26:23,300
TIG and they go on and have two 
sons Rufus and Henry they're 

1471
01:26:23,300 --> 01:26:24,800
still together to this. 
Days. 

1472
01:26:24,800 --> 01:26:27,700
I made this woman in an 
interview leader. 

1473
01:26:27,700 --> 01:26:30,400
James said something like. 
Well, when you love someone, 

1474
01:26:30,400 --> 01:26:32,600
that's just what you do. 
You just do the right thing and 

1475
01:26:32,600 --> 01:26:36,300
get married. 
So just kind of weird because 

1476
01:26:36,300 --> 01:26:38,100
it's like he'd already been 
married twice before. 

1477
01:26:38,100 --> 01:26:40,400
Yeah, I don't know if he's just 
doing that because he feels like

1478
01:26:40,400 --> 01:26:44,200
it's the right thing to do but 
I'm sorry, I still can't over, 

1479
01:26:44,500 --> 01:26:46,800
still can't get over Howard 
Stern. 

1480
01:26:46,900 --> 01:26:51,200
Saying only give us X to three 
times a month, I know. 

1481
01:26:51,200 --> 01:26:54,100
Yeah I mean he does give the 
best interviews but that is so 

1482
01:26:54,300 --> 01:26:58,700
So crossing a line and that way,
do you think, do you think that 

1483
01:26:58,700 --> 01:27:01,000
James really said it? 
I don't know. 

1484
01:27:01,500 --> 01:27:04,000
I do believe that James probably
said that she was difficult to 

1485
01:27:04,000 --> 01:27:06,200
live with. 
I don't think he said this in an

1486
01:27:06,500 --> 01:27:11,100
on-air interview, though, must 
have been off the record. 

1487
01:27:11,100 --> 01:27:15,200
I don't like, does he know? 
Howard Stern, a little bit more 

1488
01:27:15,200 --> 01:27:17,900
like this is the first time they
met and he just said that, I 

1489
01:27:17,900 --> 01:27:20,000
know. 
Yeah, I know just how to live 

1490
01:27:20,000 --> 01:27:22,100
with him and she doesn't put out
that easy. 

1491
01:27:25,300 --> 01:27:27,700
Is that how is oranges is in 
ferryman? 

1492
01:27:27,700 --> 01:27:30,700
Yeah, exactly. 
I mean he probably put the words

1493
01:27:30,700 --> 01:27:33,100
in James's mouth. 
How many times did you sleep 

1494
01:27:33,100 --> 01:27:38,000
together or does the 16 of them 
up to three times a month? 

1495
01:27:38,000 --> 01:27:48,000
Yeah, okay, Howard Stern, kept 
glavine to himself do after he 

1496
01:27:48,000 --> 01:27:50,700
said something like, you need a 
real man. 

1497
01:27:51,000 --> 01:27:54,100
Yeah. 
What's he trying to say? 

1498
01:27:54,200 --> 01:27:57,600
He himself. 
Yeah, you're a real shock jock 

1499
01:27:59,100 --> 01:28:01,500
your review. 
Yeah, you're a beautiful woman. 

1500
01:28:02,600 --> 01:28:05,700
Oh my God. 
Yeah, it's so funny. 

1501
01:28:05,800 --> 01:28:07,900
He feels that way for Kristen 
Stewart. 

1502
01:28:07,900 --> 01:28:12,000
Yeah. 
Because I'm in a way kind of 

1503
01:28:12,000 --> 01:28:14,800
reminds me of Miley Cyrus for 
some really? 

1504
01:28:15,400 --> 01:28:17,300
Yeah. 
Ricky Smiley reminds me of Carly

1505
01:28:17,300 --> 01:28:18,800
Simon. 
I feel like, you know, with 

1506
01:28:18,800 --> 01:28:23,100
their haircut now to and yeah, 
yeah, I don't see it yet but 

1507
01:28:23,100 --> 01:28:25,900
I'll keep my eyes again. 
Skinner in the voice. 

1508
01:28:25,900 --> 01:28:30,600
Yeah, keep your eyes. 
So Carly actually remained a 

1509
01:28:30,608 --> 01:28:35,500
lifelong friend with James's 
brother, Livingston, Taylor and 

1510
01:28:35,500 --> 01:28:37,700
Livingston. 
Yeah, and they collaborate on 

1511
01:28:37,700 --> 01:28:41,900
music together all the time and 
attend events together for each 

1512
01:28:41,900 --> 01:28:44,500
other. 
And in 2002, they even released 

1513
01:28:44,500 --> 01:28:47,300
a duet title that best of 
friends. 

1514
01:28:47,500 --> 01:28:49,700
This is branches brother. 
That's crazy. 

1515
01:28:49,700 --> 01:28:51,100
Yeah. 
And like, if you go on my 

1516
01:28:51,100 --> 01:28:54,800
Livingston's Instagram page, 
like all the time, I'm he calls 

1517
01:28:54,800 --> 01:28:58,400
Carly like my dear beautiful 
friend, interesting. 

1518
01:28:58,400 --> 01:29:00,100
And it's just interesting 
because James doesn't 

1519
01:29:00,100 --> 01:29:03,800
communicate with Carly at all. 
He's got her completely 

1520
01:29:03,800 --> 01:29:07,700
possible. 
I know that's very nice. 

1521
01:29:07,700 --> 01:29:10,200
They have this beautiful 
friendship, I can imagine that 

1522
01:29:10,200 --> 01:29:14,600
being annoying maybe for James. 
Like he sees his brother at a 

1523
01:29:14,600 --> 01:29:18,700
family party or whatever 
Christmas and it's like hanging 

1524
01:29:18,700 --> 01:29:20,200
out with my ex-wife all the 
time. 

1525
01:29:20,200 --> 01:29:24,300
I know exactly. 
I mean, It is sad though when 

1526
01:29:24,300 --> 01:29:29,300
people break up and they are 
supposed to like not see the 

1527
01:29:29,300 --> 01:29:32,800
other people in their exes live 
anymore. 

1528
01:29:32,800 --> 01:29:37,100
So hmm. 
And now even in 2020 during like

1529
01:29:37,100 --> 01:29:41,500
the lockdown stuff Livingston 
did a little online concert of 

1530
01:29:41,500 --> 01:29:45,900
Carly's music and when he's 
starting a, he's describing her 

1531
01:29:46,300 --> 01:29:51,300
my old and beautiful friend, 
Harley son, love. 

1532
01:29:51,600 --> 01:29:56,200
I know maybe My old and 
beautiful. 

1533
01:29:56,300 --> 01:30:01,500
It's just so interesting because
I don't, but I know me too. 

1534
01:30:01,600 --> 01:30:03,200
Actually, he looks a lot like 
gee, I don't know. 

1535
01:30:03,200 --> 01:30:08,300
Some well, I think he might be, 
but Carly has so much love and 

1536
01:30:08,300 --> 01:30:10,100
respect to for the Taylor 
family. 

1537
01:30:10,100 --> 01:30:13,700
So it's really only James that 
is cut her out. 

1538
01:30:13,700 --> 01:30:15,800
I feel like his whole family 
loved her too. 

1539
01:30:17,100 --> 01:30:19,100
In 2002. 
Also, Carly is interviewed on 

1540
01:30:19,100 --> 01:30:22,200
CBS Sunday Morning and reveals 
that James gets mad. 

1541
01:30:22,200 --> 01:30:24,500
Whenever she Talks about him in 
the Press. 

1542
01:30:24,500 --> 01:30:27,800
Oh really. 
You have to know that. 

1543
01:30:27,800 --> 01:30:31,700
Even after all this time, people
are still interested in you and 

1544
01:30:31,700 --> 01:30:35,100
James Taylor. 
I am not allowed to talk about 

1545
01:30:35,100 --> 01:30:37,900
it. 
Bye James. 

1546
01:30:39,000 --> 01:30:43,800
Every time I talk about this 
subject, I get a lot of grief 

1547
01:30:44,100 --> 01:30:49,400
from James who doesn't really 
like to acknowledge that he has 

1548
01:30:49,400 --> 01:30:52,500
a past. 
Wow. 

1549
01:30:54,300 --> 01:30:57,300
Okay. 
I know it's kind of interesting 

1550
01:30:57,300 --> 01:31:00,500
that like she didn't say age 
like her publicist or something 

1551
01:31:00,500 --> 01:31:03,500
beforehand. 
Like, oh, James is off the table

1552
01:31:03,500 --> 01:31:05,500
right now. 
She kind of didn't want us to 

1553
01:31:05,500 --> 01:31:08,000
know that, like, James is for 
fitting her. 

1554
01:31:08,100 --> 01:31:12,700
My God talking about their 
relationship is he pissed about 

1555
01:31:12,700 --> 01:31:19,900
this Memoir? 
Actually we know later on James.

1556
01:31:19,900 --> 01:31:22,700
Let's see. 
He releases an I'll just skip 

1557
01:31:22,900 --> 01:31:27,800
Ahead to your point in 2020 and 
James actually releases an audio

1558
01:31:27,800 --> 01:31:30,500
book about the first 21 years of
his life. 

1559
01:31:30,500 --> 01:31:33,200
So convenient link currently an 
audiobook. 

1560
01:31:33,300 --> 01:31:34,800
Hmm. 
Yep. 

1561
01:31:35,500 --> 01:31:38,900
I don't know. 
Look no. 

1562
01:31:38,900 --> 01:31:41,800
It's just an audio. 
Okay, so he must have written it

1563
01:31:41,800 --> 01:31:44,600
down somewhere and then just 
read it but you can't read it 

1564
01:31:44,600 --> 01:31:45,800
yourself. 
Okay. 

1565
01:31:45,800 --> 01:31:47,800
I don't know why. 
Maybe it's just like cheaper 

1566
01:31:47,800 --> 01:31:52,800
that they don't have to print it
and Carly's excluded. 

1567
01:31:52,900 --> 01:31:55,500
It's a brief mention of when he 
met her at 14, years old, in 

1568
01:31:55,500 --> 01:31:59,800
Martha's Vineyard and he says 
about her Memoir. 

1569
01:32:00,300 --> 01:32:02,100
I think she's been pretty kind 
to me. 

1570
01:32:02,100 --> 01:32:04,300
And that's certainly her story 
to tell. 

1571
01:32:04,500 --> 01:32:08,000
Maybe she got better offers or 
maybe they were more compelling.

1572
01:32:08,000 --> 01:32:12,500
Somehow one should be free to be
oneself and not the prosecuting 

1573
01:32:12,500 --> 01:32:15,400
attorney in the defense. 
It would be hard for me. 

1574
01:32:16,600 --> 01:32:21,100
I really know. 
I don't know, like hard for him 

1575
01:32:21,100 --> 01:32:26,200
to tell his side of the story 
but doesn't have a book that you

1576
01:32:26,200 --> 01:32:29,000
read. 
Well, it's about that's a 

1577
01:32:29,000 --> 01:32:35,700
biography about him which was 
written with interviews from his

1578
01:32:35,700 --> 01:32:38,800
family but he didn't write it 
himself. 

1579
01:32:38,800 --> 01:32:41,500
Okay. 
And that one is a little less 

1580
01:32:41,500 --> 01:32:44,900
like revealing it kind of mostly
walks through his career. 

1581
01:32:45,000 --> 01:32:47,100
Okay. 
Warren With Carly. 

1582
01:32:47,100 --> 01:32:50,600
Even mentioned. 
Yeah she was mentioned and she 

1583
01:32:50,600 --> 01:32:52,500
was interviewed for that book as
well actually. 

1584
01:32:52,500 --> 01:32:57,200
Oh, if she participated in the 
writing of it I know was it 

1585
01:32:57,200 --> 01:33:00,100
after they broke up. 
Oh that's nice. 

1586
01:33:00,100 --> 01:33:03,500
Yeah, she doesn't seven Carly 
along with her. 

1587
01:33:03,500 --> 01:33:06,900
Kids, been and Sally sing a 
cover of James of song. 

1588
01:33:07,000 --> 01:33:12,000
You can close your eyes on her 
album into white and then they 

1589
01:33:12,000 --> 01:33:14,600
appear on Oprah. 
And she says that she decided to

1590
01:33:14,600 --> 01:33:18,500
cover that song because He's one
of the great songwriters of all 

1591
01:33:18,500 --> 01:33:25,900
time, I know she still loves him
in 2010. 

1592
01:33:25,900 --> 01:33:31,800
James is interviewed and makes a
rare comment about Carly. 

1593
01:33:32,200 --> 01:33:38,200
This is a part of 7:30 report 
reluctant to talk about your 

1594
01:33:38,200 --> 01:33:41,700
first wife, Carly Simon which I 
respect but but can we talk for 

1595
01:33:41,700 --> 01:33:42,900
a moment about your music 
together? 

1596
01:33:42,900 --> 01:33:46,200
Because for a time there you 
were America's indeed much of 

1597
01:33:46,200 --> 01:33:49,100
the World's favorite singer 
songwriter company while I'm 

1598
01:33:49,100 --> 01:33:51,000
happy to talk about Carly. 
Hmm. 

1599
01:33:51,800 --> 01:33:53,200
Stop. 
How important was that part of 

1600
01:33:53,200 --> 01:33:55,600
your life? 
It must have been very well you 

1601
01:33:55,600 --> 01:33:59,800
know consuming at the time it 
was and but it was a very public

1602
01:33:59,800 --> 01:34:04,900
marriage and a very you know, 
for me it was just premature, 

1603
01:34:05,500 --> 01:34:11,300
you know, I had no business 
making that You know, it amazes 

1604
01:34:11,300 --> 01:34:14,200
me that people get married at 
the age of in their 20s at all. 

1605
01:34:14,200 --> 01:34:15,900
You know I mean what do you 
know? 

1606
01:34:16,600 --> 01:34:20,900
Very little? 
No, it was just it was sort of, 

1607
01:34:21,500 --> 01:34:26,300
it was kind of doomed. 
I mean, really it was just, I 

1608
01:34:26,300 --> 01:34:34,300
was unfit to be a husband and 
father and We took the ferry 

1609
01:34:34,300 --> 01:34:36,600
must be very tough thing to 
scientific knowledge. 

1610
01:34:38,000 --> 01:34:40,300
Yeah, I know it's not hard to 
say if it's just Peyton, we 

1611
01:34:40,300 --> 01:34:41,300
true. 
Yeah. 

1612
01:34:43,700 --> 01:34:45,800
And, yeah, I mean that makes 
sense. 

1613
01:34:45,800 --> 01:34:50,100
I mean, he had his struggles 
with mental health, and drugs, 

1614
01:34:50,100 --> 01:34:55,400
and alcohol for his early 20s. 
And yeah, I don't think he was 

1615
01:34:55,400 --> 01:34:59,800
even really clean by the time he
got married and had kids so it 

1616
01:34:59,800 --> 01:35:04,000
obviously was not the best time 
for that type of commitment. 

1617
01:35:04,100 --> 01:35:08,400
It's pretty chill, Zen of him to
say it like that. 

1618
01:35:08,400 --> 01:35:12,500
Just It's not hard to say just 
it's true. 

1619
01:35:12,600 --> 01:35:16,000
I wasn't fit for it. 
No, I wasn't. 

1620
01:35:16,000 --> 01:35:18,000
Yeah. 
Good. 

1621
01:35:18,200 --> 01:35:20,200
I know his face when he's is 
like not. 

1622
01:35:20,200 --> 01:35:23,700
I'm happy to talk about Carly. 
Like I feel like a tells many 

1623
01:35:23,700 --> 01:35:25,800
stories. 
Yeah, I know. 

1624
01:35:27,500 --> 01:35:29,600
I do think he was quite sad 
about the end of the 

1625
01:35:29,600 --> 01:35:31,700
relationship, though. 
Like, I do think he really did 

1626
01:35:31,700 --> 01:35:37,300
love Carly and maybe the reason 
he doesn't talk to her anymore 

1627
01:35:37,900 --> 01:35:42,700
is because he can't really face 
like his own guilt about that 

1628
01:35:42,700 --> 01:35:46,100
relationship ending. 
Yeah, I think that happens a 

1629
01:35:46,100 --> 01:35:47,200
lot. 
Hmm. 

1630
01:35:48,600 --> 01:35:53,100
I know if are broken. 
So also the end. 

1631
01:35:54,800 --> 01:35:59,600
So 2015 is when this book 
actually came out and so in this

1632
01:35:59,600 --> 01:36:03,200
book Carly actually reveals that
she still lives at their home in

1633
01:36:03,200 --> 01:36:06,600
Martha's Vineyard. 
Really and she even still sleeps

1634
01:36:06,600 --> 01:36:11,300
in the same bed that they went 
and she still has a lot of 

1635
01:36:11,300 --> 01:36:14,300
James's belongings just up in 
the house and hasn't even 

1636
01:36:14,300 --> 01:36:17,800
changed the living room much 
since they live together. 

1637
01:36:18,900 --> 01:36:21,400
And these are a few comments 
that Carly made in. 

1638
01:36:21,500 --> 01:36:26,900
In the Memoir about her 
feelings, about James in 2015. 

1639
01:36:27,000 --> 01:36:31,500
She says, because no matter how 
many years have gone by James 

1640
01:36:31,500 --> 01:36:34,500
for me, will always be a big 
part of what I call home. 

1641
01:36:34,600 --> 01:36:37,700
Hmm. 
Chelsea says today James would 

1642
01:36:37,700 --> 01:36:39,300
likely forget a good many 
things. 

1643
01:36:39,300 --> 01:36:42,400
I remember being flooded with 
color just as you might also 

1644
01:36:42,400 --> 01:36:45,800
recall sunlight on days that for
me were gray and dimly lit. 

1645
01:36:46,000 --> 01:36:48,800
Whatever he thinks of me today, 
I dare say it's slightly less 

1646
01:36:48,800 --> 01:36:52,400
damaging than the way. 
I see myself through his Eyes. 

1647
01:36:52,400 --> 01:36:56,500
Oh my God. 
I know that is sad. 

1648
01:37:00,500 --> 01:37:04,900
She also true. 
I know, I know, she's a 

1649
01:37:04,900 --> 01:37:08,500
beautiful writer. 
She says, is when James walked 

1650
01:37:08,500 --> 01:37:11,900
into her room, any room, he 
transformed it, charging it up 

1651
01:37:11,900 --> 01:37:15,000
with his Radiance. 
His message of, I'm just passing

1652
01:37:15,000 --> 01:37:17,000
through. 
But while I'm here, it's the 

1653
01:37:17,000 --> 01:37:19,500
Night Before Christmas thinking 
about it. 

1654
01:37:19,500 --> 01:37:22,200
Now, many years later I can 
still still feel that. 

1655
01:37:22,200 --> 01:37:25,400
Oh dear, sweet. 
Jesus is here, James is here 

1656
01:37:25,400 --> 01:37:28,000
feeling. 
And that's all there is to it. 

1657
01:37:28,000 --> 01:37:32,700
Oh my God. 
I know that is love seriously. 

1658
01:37:32,700 --> 01:37:34,900
It's so beautiful. 
Yeah. 

1659
01:37:34,900 --> 01:37:39,800
Like even if even though James 
isn't in her life anymore, when 

1660
01:37:39,800 --> 01:37:44,600
she still feels irradiance in 
the room as magical as 

1661
01:37:44,600 --> 01:37:47,500
Christmas, it reminds her of 
James. 

1662
01:37:49,100 --> 01:37:52,700
All these years later. 
After everything. 

1663
01:37:54,700 --> 01:38:01,500
I'm gonna cry. 
Mmm, she also says, I've stopped

1664
01:38:01,500 --> 01:38:04,900
trying to stop loving the heart 
may be broken, but Brokenness 

1665
01:38:04,900 --> 01:38:08,000
doesn't stop it from loving. 
How can you not love a person 

1666
01:38:08,000 --> 01:38:09,600
whose genes are in the two 
people? 

1667
01:38:09,600 --> 01:38:12,300
Your children? 
You love most in the world. 

1668
01:38:14,900 --> 01:38:19,200
And I think that's totally human
and very normal and still love 

1669
01:38:19,700 --> 01:38:23,600
who used to be with you know, 
even if they really hurt you and

1670
01:38:23,600 --> 01:38:26,200
you're not together anymore. 
Yeah. 

1671
01:38:26,800 --> 01:38:29,800
Like how can I just always 
struggled like how can it go 

1672
01:38:29,800 --> 01:38:34,500
from being so in love to like 
nothing or to hate, you know, I 

1673
01:38:34,500 --> 01:38:36,400
agree. 
And I also think that forcing 

1674
01:38:36,400 --> 01:38:39,800
yourself to not love somebody 
who you loved a lot, just for 

1675
01:38:39,800 --> 01:38:42,400
the sake of moving on with your 
life, doesn't really make you 

1676
01:38:42,400 --> 01:38:45,400
stop loving them. 
Yeah, it's Going to make it any 

1677
01:38:45,400 --> 01:38:48,000
easier. 
Just is repressing that feeling.

1678
01:38:48,000 --> 01:38:51,300
And so like, it's okay to still 
love somebody but to like not be

1679
01:38:51,300 --> 01:38:53,600
together. 
Yeah, it's okay. 

1680
01:38:55,100 --> 01:38:57,900
Maybe this is speaking to 
somebody that's hearing isn't 

1681
01:38:57,900 --> 01:39:02,800
going through but you can sit 
with that and still feel those 

1682
01:39:02,800 --> 01:39:06,400
feelings of love and that 
doesn't mean that you have to do

1683
01:39:06,400 --> 01:39:11,500
anything about it or to get back
with that person, but it's just 

1684
01:39:11,500 --> 01:39:13,500
okay. 
And I like have Harley has 

1685
01:39:13,500 --> 01:39:17,100
accepted that that That visit 
need to make herself. 

1686
01:39:17,100 --> 01:39:19,000
Not love James. 
Mmm. 

1687
01:39:22,600 --> 01:39:26,300
She also makes several comments 
about him in the press and she 

1688
01:39:26,300 --> 01:39:29,900
actually tells the times that 
James forbids, their kids from 

1689
01:39:29,900 --> 01:39:31,900
sharing his phone number with 
her. 

1690
01:39:32,200 --> 01:39:34,600
Wow, Mmm. 
Yeah, I was one of her. 

1691
01:39:34,800 --> 01:39:37,900
Hmm, I thought she wasn't 
supposed to talk about them. 

1692
01:39:38,200 --> 01:39:42,600
I now she's talking about but 
also like he doesn't control 

1693
01:39:42,600 --> 01:39:44,500
her. 
No, no, no, no. 

1694
01:39:44,700 --> 01:39:46,500
You know, Carly you talking 
about him as me? 

1695
01:39:46,500 --> 01:39:49,200
Yeah. 
Why, you know, even if he 

1696
01:39:49,200 --> 01:39:53,800
requested that she doesn't have 
to say, yes, I know exactly. 

1697
01:39:54,000 --> 01:39:56,300
She does can't forbid her from 
doing anything. 

1698
01:39:56,300 --> 01:39:59,800
I mean, if he wouldn't stop 
himself from cheating on her 

1699
01:40:00,000 --> 01:40:01,700
with Evie. 
Yeah. 

1700
01:40:01,700 --> 01:40:05,000
And others getting gonorrhea, 
she was pregnant. 

1701
01:40:05,000 --> 01:40:09,400
Then she can do whatever the 
fuck she wants means I know. 

1702
01:40:10,000 --> 01:40:12,300
But wow, that's crazy. 
She can't have his phone number.

1703
01:40:12,400 --> 01:40:17,200
Hmm, damn, yeah. 
Yeah, 20:21 actually. 

1704
01:40:17,200 --> 01:40:20,500
So basically the present Carly 
is asked about her relationship 

1705
01:40:20,500 --> 01:40:23,400
again with James Taylor. 
She's constantly asking this and

1706
01:40:23,400 --> 01:40:26,800
this is her response. 
What's relationship with James 

1707
01:40:26,800 --> 01:40:30,500
Taylor? 
Now, I don't speak to him, he 

1708
01:40:30,500 --> 01:40:33,400
never comes here. 
He doesn't even come to Ben's 

1709
01:40:33,400 --> 01:40:37,200
house which is right down down 
them drive, your son's house. 

1710
01:40:37,400 --> 01:40:41,800
Yeah he doesn't he doesn't feel 
at home on the island. 

1711
01:40:41,800 --> 01:40:44,400
He recently said to somebody, 
it's her. 

1712
01:40:44,700 --> 01:40:49,000
It's not my Island anymore, the 
relationship is a pest, it's a 

1713
01:40:49,000 --> 01:40:52,800
pest for him on one level and 
it's a pest for me on an on 

1714
01:40:52,800 --> 01:40:57,100
another level. 
But I am, I'm saying, let's 

1715
01:40:57,500 --> 01:41:00,800
let's put on some lotion that's 
going to, it's going to help us.

1716
01:41:01,100 --> 01:41:04,600
We've got to because we're both 
public figures, the world knows 

1717
01:41:04,600 --> 01:41:07,100
both of us or some of the world 
knows, both of us. 

1718
01:41:07,100 --> 01:41:10,000
And knows, what would you do? 
What would you do if you were 

1719
01:41:10,000 --> 01:41:14,100
presented with this problem? 
I'm not sure. 

1720
01:41:14,300 --> 01:41:16,600
I am sure that I'm glad I don't 
have this problem. 

1721
01:41:16,900 --> 01:41:22,800
I am too, I love that. 
She asked the interview I know. 

1722
01:41:22,800 --> 01:41:24,300
Would you do? 
What would you do? 

1723
01:41:24,300 --> 01:41:30,300
That's a conversation with Dan 
Rather on AC AXS TV. 

1724
01:41:30,600 --> 01:41:33,400
Okay, he's really wasn't 
expecting. 

1725
01:41:33,400 --> 01:41:35,900
I know. 
I'm not sure, I'm really 

1726
01:41:35,900 --> 01:41:37,500
thankful. 
I don't have that problem. 

1727
01:41:37,500 --> 01:41:38,800
What if he did have that 
problem? 

1728
01:41:39,100 --> 01:41:42,700
Well, my life. 
Oh my God. 

1729
01:41:42,900 --> 01:41:47,600
He won't even visit been, I know
I know this is Mars has been her

1730
01:41:47,600 --> 01:41:49,600
the talking. 
Yeah, yeah, sad. 

1731
01:41:49,600 --> 01:41:52,400
He's the love my husband. 
You know, he doesn't even feel 

1732
01:41:52,400 --> 01:41:56,200
like it's home anymore. 
I know, it makes me really sad. 

1733
01:41:56,200 --> 01:41:58,700
I mean, they're getting older 
too, they're in their 70s and I 

1734
01:41:58,700 --> 01:42:01,200
really wonder like, you know, 
life is short. 

1735
01:42:01,200 --> 01:42:03,600
Like, will there ever be 
reconciliation for the two of 

1736
01:42:03,600 --> 01:42:05,200
them? 
Can they ever be on speaking 

1737
01:42:05,200 --> 01:42:07,800
terms? 
Like it's a pest? 

1738
01:42:09,000 --> 01:42:10,300
So many years have passed 
through. 

1739
01:42:10,300 --> 01:42:12,700
He's been married twice after 
her. 

1740
01:42:12,800 --> 01:42:16,500
Sure, she's been married before.
Like they have two kids. 

1741
01:42:16,500 --> 01:42:21,400
Two kids are grown adults. 
Yeah, I just don't understand. 

1742
01:42:22,500 --> 01:42:26,300
I think why he still doesn't 
talk to her after all this time,

1743
01:42:26,500 --> 01:42:28,800
is it? 
Because he feels like his 

1744
01:42:29,000 --> 01:42:31,500
current wife would have a 
problem with it. 

1745
01:42:32,500 --> 01:42:34,500
This is one of these life 
questions I have. 

1746
01:42:34,500 --> 01:42:39,700
It's like what what is it why is
it that in romantic 

1747
01:42:39,700 --> 01:42:41,700
relationships? 
It's so unlike any other 

1748
01:42:41,700 --> 01:42:46,000
relationship like, For some 
reason, you just can't want some

1749
01:42:46,000 --> 01:42:49,800
people apparently can't but 
like, it's just, it's, it's not 

1750
01:42:49,800 --> 01:42:52,300
can't change it. 
I know. 

1751
01:42:52,300 --> 01:42:55,400
I'm like, moving my hands 
around, like, going to from 

1752
01:42:55,400 --> 01:42:59,500
lovers to friends or just 
amicable family members or 

1753
01:42:59,500 --> 01:43:01,400
whatever. 
Like, it's so hard for some 

1754
01:43:01,400 --> 01:43:03,400
reason. 
So unique, I was thinking that 

1755
01:43:03,400 --> 01:43:08,300
the other day, it's like, why is
there this one really is just on

1756
01:43:08,300 --> 01:43:11,700
such a different level of 
everything else. 

1757
01:43:11,700 --> 01:43:15,300
And I know this, This thing that
we're all like hungry for the 

1758
01:43:15,300 --> 01:43:18,900
same time and add so much 
pressure to life at the same 

1759
01:43:18,900 --> 01:43:24,300
time and it's just so intense. 
Yeah and yeah, I don't know what

1760
01:43:24,300 --> 01:43:27,000
his deal is, though, he's 
getting getting older. 

1761
01:43:27,000 --> 01:43:29,900
I mean, you know, you could just
try me like she's saying like 

1762
01:43:29,900 --> 01:43:31,800
the look like lotion. 
Yeah. 

1763
01:43:31,800 --> 01:43:35,500
We're like, you know, it sucks 
and it's hard but just try. 

1764
01:43:35,700 --> 01:43:37,600
Yeah, I mean, I had a friend 
growing up. 

1765
01:43:37,600 --> 01:43:40,700
Her parents were divorced but 
her dad would still go to every 

1766
01:43:40,700 --> 01:43:45,100
Christmas party at her house and
her You know, had a new 

1767
01:43:45,100 --> 01:43:48,600
boyfriend that they lived with 
and they were just so amicable 

1768
01:43:48,600 --> 01:43:51,900
like, they really celebrated 
together. 

1769
01:43:51,900 --> 01:43:53,300
They would have dinners 
together. 

1770
01:43:53,300 --> 01:43:55,900
They were good friends after and
I'm sure that took some time, 

1771
01:43:55,900 --> 01:43:58,800
but I feel like that's the ideal
for divorced parents and it 

1772
01:43:58,808 --> 01:44:02,300
makes me sad that some parents 
can't do that, I know. 

1773
01:44:02,500 --> 01:44:05,900
But that's, yeah, that's their 
relationship that's Carly, 

1774
01:44:05,900 --> 01:44:13,700
Simon, no way. 
I was researching them for weeks

1775
01:44:13,700 --> 01:44:16,000
and weeks and I have a great 
job. 

1776
01:44:16,400 --> 01:44:18,700
I hope it can. 
I was so invested. 

1777
01:44:18,800 --> 01:44:24,000
Yeah I am like truly. 
I was just living it. 

1778
01:44:24,700 --> 01:44:30,000
I feel like I just went through 
a breakup and now I'm 70 and 

1779
01:44:30,300 --> 01:44:34,900
still in love with my ex-husband
and I think I lie, still Dad, 

1780
01:44:34,900 --> 01:44:37,800
she still does love him which is
the part that makes me really 

1781
01:44:37,800 --> 01:44:42,700
sad and he's just he is such a 
This about him too. 

1782
01:44:43,800 --> 01:44:46,700
Yeah, he doesn't want to 
acknowledge that he has a past. 

1783
01:44:47,100 --> 01:44:50,200
Wow likelihood that they'll get 
back together. 

1784
01:44:52,600 --> 01:44:55,200
She's still married. 
I'm going to say it's probably 

1785
01:44:55,200 --> 01:44:58,500
zero but I don't know. 
I mean maybe he'll like at the 

1786
01:44:58,500 --> 01:45:02,600
end of his life you know, 
realize it really was the one 

1787
01:45:02,600 --> 01:45:04,700
all along. 
I just think he must have 

1788
01:45:04,700 --> 01:45:06,400
different. 
Probably still does love her if 

1789
01:45:06,400 --> 01:45:08,200
he refuses to speak to her. 
Yeah. 

1790
01:45:08,400 --> 01:45:12,800
Like if you care that much. 
There's something there that you

1791
01:45:12,800 --> 01:45:16,100
don't want to acknowledge. 
Yeah, it's been two years. 

1792
01:45:16,100 --> 01:45:21,200
Yeah, broke up in 1981. 
Okay, 40 years. 

1793
01:45:22,800 --> 01:45:28,700
Yeah, 40 years ago, 40 years and
he still won't talk to her. 

1794
01:45:29,400 --> 01:45:34,100
They have two kids together. 
You think he would be over it by

1795
01:45:34,100 --> 01:45:38,300
now is truly incredible. 
I kind of love it in a way that 

1796
01:45:38,300 --> 01:45:42,600
humans can still care about 
something for like, 40 years. 

1797
01:45:42,600 --> 01:45:44,700
I know seriously. 
I mean, I love that. 

1798
01:45:44,700 --> 01:45:47,500
She hasn't even really changed. 
The interior of their house, all

1799
01:45:47,500 --> 01:45:50,200
that much, that she still sleeps
in the same bed. 

1800
01:45:50,300 --> 01:45:52,500
I find it hard to believe that 
she is. 

1801
01:45:52,600 --> 01:45:55,200
Is like this materialistic 
person. 

1802
01:45:55,300 --> 01:45:58,500
My God me too. 
She seems like such a happy got 

1803
01:45:58,500 --> 01:46:00,000
that. 
I don't see that. 

1804
01:46:00,000 --> 01:46:04,400
So it's James like a super 
hippie or something like to the 

1805
01:46:04,400 --> 01:46:06,800
next level, like he doesn't like
possessions or something. 

1806
01:46:06,800 --> 01:46:09,400
Like okay. 
I mean, they're both pretty red.

1807
01:46:09,400 --> 01:46:13,400
Yeah, I'm just trying to figure 
this out and he grew up pretty 

1808
01:46:13,400 --> 01:46:16,200
wealthy as well. 
If she hasn't even changed a 

1809
01:46:16,200 --> 01:46:19,800
living room, she can't be that, 
you know, much of a shopper. 

1810
01:46:19,800 --> 01:46:22,400
Yeah, I agree and I meant she 
had them. 

1811
01:46:22,500 --> 01:46:24,900
Money to go shopping. 
And why is that an issue in 

1812
01:46:24,900 --> 01:46:27,800
their relationship? 
Her manicures and she writes so 

1813
01:46:27,800 --> 01:46:30,500
beautifully in his so 
intersective. 

1814
01:46:30,500 --> 01:46:33,300
I just don't see her. 
As is like Material Girl. 

1815
01:46:33,300 --> 01:46:37,800
No, I don't think so either. 
And when you try on shoes, you 

1816
01:46:37,800 --> 01:46:40,100
do look in the mirror. 
Yeah. 

1817
01:46:40,200 --> 01:46:44,600
To evy's point, I know like 
every must have been like in her

1818
01:46:44,600 --> 01:46:46,400
early twenties. 
Yeah, thing. 

1819
01:46:46,400 --> 01:46:47,900
How can you not look in the 
mirror. 

1820
01:46:47,900 --> 01:46:51,500
I know seriously, seriously. 
And there's nothing wrong with 

1821
01:46:51,500 --> 01:46:56,300
loving yourself. 
Look and she should love herself

1822
01:46:56,300 --> 01:46:58,700
reading herself. 
I mean, if she was taking care 

1823
01:46:58,700 --> 01:47:01,700
of the kids, he was a mom. 
You should go get yourself a 

1824
01:47:01,708 --> 01:47:06,600
manicure if she feels like and 
also the the part of I think the

1825
01:47:06,600 --> 01:47:11,400
part that would probably be 
like, that's it for me as a part

1826
01:47:11,400 --> 01:47:13,300
about her still nursing their 
son. 

1827
01:47:13,500 --> 01:47:16,000
Yeah, James had an issue with 
that and said he's going to grow

1828
01:47:16,000 --> 01:47:18,800
up to be a fairy. 
Yeah, that first of all, that's 

1829
01:47:18,800 --> 01:47:20,100
pretty homophobic. 
I know. 

1830
01:47:20,100 --> 01:47:22,400
But also the sun was he still 
you? 

1831
01:47:22,500 --> 01:47:24,000
Young. 
He was young but I mean he had a

1832
01:47:24,000 --> 01:47:26,700
lot of health problems so she 
probably was nursing him because

1833
01:47:26,700 --> 01:47:31,200
of yeah, bad to give her to give
him, you know, some of her 

1834
01:47:31,200 --> 01:47:34,000
antibodies or whatever. 
But I mean, here she is home 

1835
01:47:34,000 --> 01:47:36,700
with the kids doing all the 
parenting work. 

1836
01:47:36,900 --> 01:47:42,700
He's criticizing her about it. 
So upsetting, what would you say

1837
01:47:42,700 --> 01:47:45,400
though? 
Your percentage of chance that 

1838
01:47:45,400 --> 01:47:48,200
they'll get 5%? 
Yeah 25. 

1839
01:47:48,200 --> 01:47:50,600
Yeah I would say like 52, I'm 
present. 

1840
01:47:50,600 --> 01:47:54,500
I'm not gonna say it's zero 
because I never know, never 

1841
01:47:54,500 --> 01:47:55,800
know. 
And I do think there are 

1842
01:47:55,800 --> 01:47:57,600
feelings there. 
Yeah. 

1843
01:47:57,800 --> 01:48:00,900
Oh my God, I like the Carly to 
acknowledge, like, because we 

1844
01:48:00,900 --> 01:48:05,400
are public figures know. 
We have to be on good terms, 

1845
01:48:05,400 --> 01:48:07,900
like they're always going to 
continue to be asked about this 

1846
01:48:07,900 --> 01:48:10,700
relationship. 
So, Probably the best answer 

1847
01:48:10,700 --> 01:48:14,500
that. 
Oh yeah, we get along and We 

1848
01:48:15,200 --> 01:48:17,000
know bad feelings here. 
Yeah. 

1849
01:48:17,500 --> 01:48:19,500
They are going to be asked about
it forever. 

1850
01:48:19,900 --> 01:48:22,000
Okay I need someone maybe Howard
Stern. 

1851
01:48:22,000 --> 01:48:25,800
I'm sorry guys, I'm sorry. 
I need someone to ask Cristen 

1852
01:48:25,800 --> 01:48:31,000
zuly these questions about well 
my God, I'm sorry, God. 

1853
01:48:31,400 --> 01:48:32,700
I've no, it's not really didn't 
know. 

1854
01:48:32,700 --> 01:48:35,300
But I was thinking that too. 
When I was reading this Memoir, 

1855
01:48:35,600 --> 01:48:38,100
I need Kristen Stewart to write 
a book like this. 

1856
01:48:38,100 --> 01:48:39,300
Yes. 
Oh my gosh. 

1857
01:48:39,300 --> 01:48:43,600
I need I need to learn about the
first time that Rob and Kristen 

1858
01:48:43,700 --> 01:48:47,400
Work together. 
I need to learn about the first 

1859
01:48:47,400 --> 01:48:53,200
time they laid eyes on each 
other said, I love you. 

1860
01:48:53,500 --> 01:48:55,500
I need to know about the 
nitty-gritty break up. 

1861
01:48:55,500 --> 01:48:58,600
Yeah, I want about the day after
the breakup. 

1862
01:48:58,600 --> 01:49:03,500
I want to know if there was any 
rebound sex in there, this is 

1863
01:49:03,500 --> 01:49:07,000
our favorite couple guys. 
Yeah, this is a couple that are 

1864
01:49:07,000 --> 01:49:12,100
broadcast is inspired. 
Yeah, I just need someone to ask

1865
01:49:12,200 --> 01:49:16,300
why isn't her assets and Need 
someone to ask Jim Dodd Rhythm. 

1866
01:49:16,600 --> 01:49:17,900
When's the last time you spoke 
to him? 

1867
01:49:18,000 --> 01:49:19,700
I no wait. 
That's a perfect guy. 

1868
01:49:19,700 --> 01:49:20,700
Hasn't. 
Anyone said that? 

1869
01:49:20,700 --> 01:49:24,100
Yeah, I mean, I know. 
Well, that interviews recently, 

1870
01:49:24,100 --> 01:49:25,800
right? 
I mean, I guess you're married. 

1871
01:49:25,800 --> 01:49:28,500
What I know that people are last
year, I feel like people are a 

1872
01:49:28,500 --> 01:49:30,900
little more respectful and 
interviews today. 

1873
01:49:32,000 --> 01:49:34,300
Maybe they feel uncomfortable, 
or maybe they're not supposed to

1874
01:49:34,300 --> 01:49:36,900
ask about it. 
But why isn't anyone asked? 

1875
01:49:36,900 --> 01:49:40,300
I know, I mean, maybe because 
James Taylor and Carly Simon 

1876
01:49:40,300 --> 01:49:43,600
have kids together. 
It's yeah, like a C4. 

1877
01:49:43,800 --> 01:49:47,200
Into a square is when a couple 
without kids breaks up, it's 

1878
01:49:47,200 --> 01:49:52,700
assumed that they probably don't
communicate darn but someone 

1879
01:49:52,700 --> 01:49:56,700
know someone should have the 
balls as, you know, if you do 

1880
01:49:56,700 --> 01:49:58,400
it, I'll pay you 50 bucks. 
Yeah. 

1881
01:49:58,700 --> 01:50:00,400
Or Rob, I think Rob wouldn't 
answer. 

1882
01:50:00,400 --> 01:50:03,900
Now, Kristen is more likely to 
answer. 

1883
01:50:07,100 --> 01:50:11,300
This is fascinating and I should
mention too that I feel like one

1884
01:50:11,300 --> 01:50:15,100
of the even when their marriage 
was See they always had like a 

1885
01:50:15,100 --> 01:50:18,200
fire performing together and 
that's like, when Carly really 

1886
01:50:18,200 --> 01:50:20,700
felt James is love. 
Like, almost the most strongly 

1887
01:50:20,700 --> 01:50:22,600
is really on stage together. 
Yeah. 

1888
01:50:22,600 --> 01:50:24,200
And Carly's, not really a 
performer. 

1889
01:50:24,200 --> 01:50:25,700
I think she said I wanted these 
interviews. 

1890
01:50:25,800 --> 01:50:31,300
She has bad stage fright so 
she's so rarely performs, so 

1891
01:50:31,300 --> 01:50:36,500
sweet, but she would with James,
wow. 

1892
01:50:38,400 --> 01:50:42,400
I wonder if anything else will 
come out in the future 

1893
01:50:43,000 --> 01:50:48,300
interviews. 
I don't know, James, if you're 

1894
01:50:48,300 --> 01:50:50,700
listening, just Carly a call. 
Yes. 

1895
01:50:50,700 --> 01:50:54,800
And your it swim in the pool. 
Yeah, and then tell us what 

1896
01:50:54,800 --> 01:50:58,700
happened? 
Yeah, Carly with anybody. 

1897
01:50:58,800 --> 01:51:00,800
I don't think so. 
Yeah. 

1898
01:51:01,400 --> 01:51:04,900
She I just love her look like, I
think you're still looks great. 

1899
01:51:07,000 --> 01:51:11,800
I love her smile. 
Yeah, I wanted to say random 

1900
01:51:11,800 --> 01:51:14,000
news. 
Wait wait, do everything more? 

1901
01:51:14,000 --> 01:51:15,400
Oh I guess I had one more 
random. 

1902
01:51:15,400 --> 01:51:18,000
Okay. 
About Carly shippers of Taylor 

1903
01:51:18,000 --> 01:51:22,800
Swift and Karlie Kloss really 
cling to this couple interesting

1904
01:51:22,800 --> 01:51:28,600
Lee enough because Taylor Swift 
was apparently named after James

1905
01:51:28,600 --> 01:51:29,900
Taylor. 
Wow. 

1906
01:51:30,000 --> 01:51:34,800
In Karlie Kloss was apparently 
named after Carly Simon. 

1907
01:51:35,100 --> 01:51:37,000
Why did they spell it 
differently? 

1908
01:51:37,100 --> 01:51:38,000
Current. 
I don't know. 

1909
01:51:38,400 --> 01:51:41,000
I'm not sure, but that's 
interesting. 

1910
01:51:41,500 --> 01:51:44,900
So they really identify with 
this couple. 

1911
01:51:44,900 --> 01:51:48,500
Mmm. 
It's kind of faded and Taylor 

1912
01:51:48,500 --> 01:51:53,000
Swift is a huge fan of both 
Carly Simon and James Taylor. 

1913
01:51:53,000 --> 01:51:56,800
She's still a numerous records 
numerous times said on record 

1914
01:51:56,800 --> 01:52:00,300
that she was inspired by their 
music and as even performed with

1915
01:52:00,300 --> 01:52:03,000
the both of them. 
So I do wonder if yeah, I wonder

1916
01:52:03,000 --> 01:52:05,300
if she's like said something to 
either. 

1917
01:52:05,400 --> 01:52:08,300
No. 
About being obsessed with their 

1918
01:52:08,300 --> 01:52:12,800
ex. 
Mmm, it's a theory. 

1919
01:52:13,400 --> 01:52:16,200
But yeah, maybe Taylor Swift 
will bring them together know 

1920
01:52:16,200 --> 01:52:18,000
maybe. 
But what were you gonna say? 

1921
01:52:18,100 --> 01:52:21,600
Oh, just. 
Um, I told you about this but 

1922
01:52:21,600 --> 01:52:26,100
just, you know, a little weird 
connection that happened 

1923
01:52:26,100 --> 01:52:31,100
recently, which I feel like 
keeps happening stuff that there

1924
01:52:31,100 --> 01:52:34,100
was a video, this is going to 
count way later, but there was 

1925
01:52:34,100 --> 01:52:36,800
an interview that came out 
recently with Cara Delevingne. 

1926
01:52:37,200 --> 01:52:40,600
Apparently, she's getting, I 
guess you didn't get it yet, but

1927
01:52:40,600 --> 01:52:43,700
she's getting an awareness and 
Linda s'mores that tattoo. 

1928
01:52:44,100 --> 01:52:48,100
And it's going to be lionesses, 
she wrote ironic in her 

1929
01:52:48,100 --> 01:52:50,400
handwriting or something and 
Cara's going to get that 

1930
01:52:50,400 --> 01:52:52,400
tattooed just crazy. 
It's just weird. 

1931
01:52:52,400 --> 01:52:55,200
We just cover them with like 
interesting to connect, it's so 

1932
01:52:55,200 --> 01:52:56,000
weird. 
I feel ya. 

1933
01:52:56,000 --> 01:52:59,500
So many of our couples keep 
overlapping and I literally I 

1934
01:52:59,508 --> 01:53:02,300
just Googled Cara Delevingne 
just to make sure I smelled her 

1935
01:53:02,300 --> 01:53:06,000
last name correctly and then 
that I just saw that I was like 

1936
01:53:06,000 --> 01:53:09,000
what? 
So weird feeling our podcast was

1937
01:53:09,000 --> 01:53:14,400
like, I don't know, manifesting 
nothing because member also. 

1938
01:53:14,400 --> 01:53:19,100
I know this is our last podcast 
but we said Harry and like 

1939
01:53:19,100 --> 01:53:22,000
Michael should just quit being 
broiled. 

1940
01:53:22,700 --> 01:53:26,600
It dead like a week later, I 
know. 

1941
01:53:27,300 --> 01:53:31,500
So yeah, Kristen Stewart, you 
should write a memoir, tell all 

1942
01:53:31,500 --> 01:53:35,500
yeah, you should share the juicy
details like Carly Simon. 

1943
01:53:35,500 --> 01:53:39,200
Did I feel like she B things 
sometimes, right. 

1944
01:53:39,200 --> 01:53:43,600
Like yeah, he's written scripts 
and oh yeah, I'm sure she has 

1945
01:53:43,700 --> 01:53:46,100
journals, and she actually does 
have a short film apparently 

1946
01:53:46,100 --> 01:53:48,500
that was inspired by her breakup
with Rob. 

1947
01:53:48,500 --> 01:53:56,000
Would we have not watched? 
We're going to, yeah, but I 

1948
01:53:56,008 --> 01:53:58,300
don't know what it is. 
Sometimes you just never get 

1949
01:53:58,300 --> 01:54:01,200
around to things that you want 
to do. 

1950
01:54:01,200 --> 01:54:04,100
Yeah, those things, you know, 
even if it doesn't even take 

1951
01:54:04,100 --> 01:54:08,400
them much time, it just Not the 
beautiful thing of life that 

1952
01:54:08,400 --> 01:54:11,500
there's so many things that you 
want to do and not enough time 

1953
01:54:11,500 --> 01:54:12,600
to do them. 
I know. 

1954
01:54:13,500 --> 01:54:17,300
Well, I guess I don't know. 
It's a beautiful, it's it is, it

1955
01:54:17,300 --> 01:54:20,600
is because we're not like bored 
out of our minds. 

1956
01:54:20,800 --> 01:54:23,100
There is always something to do.
Yeah. 

1957
01:54:23,100 --> 01:54:26,000
If you think about it, yeah, you
set your mind to it. 

1958
01:54:26,700 --> 01:54:30,800
Yeah. 
Oh wow, not three hours. 

1959
01:54:30,800 --> 01:54:35,300
Same this guys We thought I 
thought John Yoko is gonna be 

1960
01:54:35,300 --> 01:54:37,400
three hours. 
It was like two hours mmm-hmm, 

1961
01:54:37,700 --> 01:54:40,200
and then we thought that Alanis 
Morissette and Dave Coulier 

1962
01:54:40,200 --> 01:54:43,800
would be like a half hour and it
was yeah, like an hour fifteen 

1963
01:54:43,800 --> 01:54:45,200
years. 
Yeah, I was afraid. 

1964
01:54:45,200 --> 01:54:49,600
It was gonna be like 20 and I 
was like not a bad thing, but I 

1965
01:54:49,600 --> 01:54:52,000
just would have felt a little 
bit like a delinquent or 

1966
01:54:52,008 --> 01:54:55,100
something like that. 
I showed up with nothing for 

1967
01:54:55,100 --> 01:54:57,000
fair. 
Little this a but yeah. 

1968
01:54:57,000 --> 01:54:58,800
Actually turned out to be more 
than I thought. 

1969
01:54:59,000 --> 01:55:01,100
Yeah, that's funny. 
Well, I'll tease our next 

1970
01:55:01,100 --> 01:55:04,400
episode. 
Is a little bit more present 

1971
01:55:04,400 --> 01:55:11,400
day. 
It involves a breakup between I 

1972
01:55:11,407 --> 01:55:14,400
was going to totally get away 
between it's a little bit more 

1973
01:55:14,400 --> 01:55:17,300
present day. 
It's about the breakup of a 

1974
01:55:17,300 --> 01:55:21,500
well-known comedian and his 
wife, you probably already know 

1975
01:55:21,500 --> 01:55:26,000
what this is, but our next 
episode, it left me feeling. 

1976
01:55:26,000 --> 01:55:30,400
So heartbroken that I literally 
felt sick to my stomach. 

1977
01:55:30,400 --> 01:55:31,700
Really. 
Hmm. 

1978
01:55:31,700 --> 01:55:35,100
So it's going to be Be a 
tearjerker, but one that you 

1979
01:55:35,100 --> 01:55:38,100
might be interested in, we can 
all cry together. 

1980
01:55:42,000 --> 01:55:43,900
Oh, yeah. 
And also, in this relationship, 

1981
01:55:43,900 --> 01:55:46,000
it's probably obvious. 
But who do you blame? 

1982
01:55:46,200 --> 01:55:48,800
Oh yeah. 
Oh completely blame James 

1983
01:55:48,800 --> 01:55:53,400
Taylor. 
I'm so stupid that I thought 

1984
01:55:53,400 --> 01:55:55,500
You're So Vain was like about 
him. 

1985
01:55:55,900 --> 01:55:59,300
So then from the beginning I was
like, oh yeah blame him from the

1986
01:55:59,300 --> 01:56:01,300
get-go. 
Actually nothing to do with it. 

1987
01:56:04,000 --> 01:56:07,300
I'm glad you taught me that but 
yeah, you guys should listen to.

1988
01:56:07,400 --> 01:56:10,300
We're so close by Carly Simon. 
It's so beautiful. 

1989
01:56:10,300 --> 01:56:15,800
Listen to their, we are by James
Taylor and I highly encourage 

1990
01:56:15,800 --> 01:56:20,200
you to also read Carly's Memoir,
boys, and trees, it's 

1991
01:56:20,400 --> 01:56:22,100
beautifully written. 
I feel like there's so many 

1992
01:56:22,100 --> 01:56:24,900
things that I didn't even get to
convey especially about them 

1993
01:56:24,900 --> 01:56:27,000
falling in love and how much she
loved him. 

1994
01:56:27,800 --> 01:56:30,600
So I want to read it. 
Yeah I have it right here. 

1995
01:56:30,800 --> 01:56:32,400
Take it home with you and that's
it. 

1996
01:56:32,400 --> 01:56:34,400
Thank you guys for listening. 
Learning so much. 

1997
01:56:34,400 --> 01:56:36,700
I don't want. 
Ending know. 

1998
01:56:37,500 --> 01:56:38,500
Thank you. 
Mel. 

1999
01:56:38,700 --> 01:56:40,600
Thank you. 
Yeah. 

2000
01:56:40,600 --> 01:56:43,200
One of our listeners who gesture
that we end with guys. 

2001
01:56:43,200 --> 01:56:46,100
It's not you, it's me, that was 
us. 

2002
01:56:47,400 --> 01:56:50,700
I love the, I love the 
suggestion, but I don't know. 

2003
01:56:50,700 --> 01:56:53,200
I don't, I've makes me feel like
we're breaking up. 

2004
01:56:53,200 --> 01:56:55,900
I know. 
No, it's not. 

2005
01:56:55,900 --> 01:56:57,600
I guess it is the end of the 
episode. 

2006
01:56:57,700 --> 01:57:00,900
Yeah. 
But we'll get back together next

2007
01:57:01,100 --> 01:57:02,000
week. 
Oh, yeah. 

2008
01:57:05,000 --> 01:57:08,900
Oh, give me that. 
Yeah, we love you guys.