Are you lonesome tonight? Do you miss me tonight?
Are you sorry? Hi guys.
Hi, guys. Welcome back to another episode
of Significant Lovers. We are Your hosts.
I'm Kel and I am Mel and we are two cousins.
Two cousins from Boston, MA trivia.
Name. Well, a little outside Boston,
but yeah, not actually. Greater Boston area we we know
the city, but but now we're separated.
I'm in New York. Kelly was in New York, and she's
still kind of here in New York, but she's also back to New
England in New Hampshire. Slash New York.
I'm just kidding. I still live there, kind of.
Yeah, well, when she's here, she's living.
Yeah. What do you call that?
True living here. I know.
Yeah, today is a huge episode in my opinion.
I am so excited for this. So Mel, you have no reason to be
nervous. Mel is in charge today, but this
is the one and only Meg Ryan and Dennis Quaid and should have let
you say it. We love No, it's gay.
We love Meg Ryan because we, like a lot of hopeless
romantics, are obsessed with her romantic comedies.
Specifically, the two that we bond over so much are When Harry
Met Sally and You've Got Mail. But we also I'll fuck with
Sleepless in Seattle. I was like, kind of disappointed
in it when I first saw it. But equally.
It's a top tier film, I think. Yeah, I should see it again.
It grew on me. Have you seen any other movies
with? Her.
I don't think so. Actually I've I've seen Kate and
Leopold, but that was so long ago.
And you've seen Top Gun. She is the voice of Anastasia,
my favorite cartoon of all time. Oh yeah, I didn't know that.
And I own a movie She's in, but I haven't watched it yet.
In the land of women's OH Oh no. I have seen in the land, in the
land of women. But that was a long time ago
too. And we actually pulled our
patrons on Patreon. What is your favorite Meg Ryan
movie of when Herman, Sally, you've got male and sleepless in
Seattle? Only 2% of people said sleepless
in Seattle and Muna said pretty shocked to see sleepless in
Seattle. Got no love da da da Also not
shocked at the same time and 56% said When Harry Met Sally and
28% said You've Got Mail leaving 16% that said never seen any of
them. I'm not surprised that Harry,
when Harry met Sally's the most favorite.
I think that's what mine would be too.
Me too. It's funny because me and my
friend May, we went to Seattle recently and we were talking
about all of these movies the whole trip and she loves him in
Seattle. And my favorite would be When
Harry Met Sally. And it was interesting for us
both to look at our own love lives and be like, wow.
The plot of both of these has influenced our own romantic
desires and interests. She she's very into the love at
first sight concept, whereas I love the friends to lovers.
Trope And I do think that my love for When Harry Met Sally
has probably influenced me very heavily with some people who I
have had strong feelings for. So I could see that.
Yeah, I could see that. Especially that scene at the end
when it's New Year's Eve. I watch that every New Year's
Eve, but I've also just watched it and been like this is going
to happen for me. But it hasn't.
But maybe someday. I do love love at first sight.
I got to admit. I don't know why.
I know it's like, so simple. But something about it I do
love. So what is Meg Ryan's dating
life in real Like in real life? Is it anything like these
movies? I'll let you decide, but I don't
think so. I think Meg Ryan, Here's the
thing about these movies is she plays.
Not a honestly pretty similar character in a lot of the
romantic comedies that she's known for, where she's adorable
and quirky and, you know, sweetheart, maybe a little bit
neurotic. And I think she stubborn.
Yes, stubborn. And people always assume that
that's how she is in real life. And so the story that I'm about
to tell you. It really comes in contrast with
her characters, and that will be a problem.
Oh yeah, OK well, I'm ready. I want to hear it all.
Right. So the three words that I would
use to describe them would be idealized, complex and
disconnected. No, that last one.
Yeah. So here we are with Meg Ryan.
She was born Margaret Mary Emily Ann Hira.
Can you believe that? Like how many names was that?
123455 names I don't know why. Can you say it again?
Margaret, Mary, Emily Ann Hira, I think.
Wow, I want to say Ryan in there.
Anywhere. No, and neither is Meg, OK?
But she later when she joined SAG, she went by Ryan because
that is her grandmother's maiden name and I'm guessing that she
was still called Meg. I don't know if Meg is.
Is that a nickname for Margaret? I didn't think it was, but you
just say can be. Some people do that kind of
stuff, you know? Yeah.
So she was born November 19th, 1961 in Fairfield, CT.
I guess that would make her a. Is that a Scorpio?
Yes, I think yes. Same.
As me. So her mom was Susan Jordan, a
former actress and English teacher, and her dad was a math
teacher named Harry, and she has two sisters and a brother, and
her family was pretty devout Catholic while she was growing
up. And even though she's still
spiritual, she wasn't super Catholic herself.
And then, at age 15, her mom actually left her father and
moved to Manhattan to pursue her dreams of becoming an actress.
Which was very hard on Meg. This is going to be a big, you
know, point of tension throughout her life and her
story and even her marriage with Dennis Quaid.
And I think this had a huge impact on her, obviously.
And she was really popular in school, but I think it was
really hard for her to not have her mom there in high school,
especially like, she was the homecoming queen.
She was a cheerleader like her mom.
Like, really missed out on those experiences.
My gosh. And that's crazy that then she
went to pursue acting. I feel like I would always have
kind of a weird. Yeah, well, so I think like, she
still saw her mom, so she went to NYU for college.
So she's in New York with her mom and she's studied
journalism. But her mom at this time was
working as a casting agent. And so I think she was getting
Meg set up on commercials and doing small gigs for just extra
money on the side. And later, Meg would say that
she felt kind of cornered into acting by her mom.
I don't know how true that is. Like she was.
She was an adult at this time, but she has said that she never
intended to be an actress. Really.
That's funny that she's studying journalism, because isn't that
what Sally is in When Harry Met Sally?
Oh yeah, that's so true. She actually said that.
Like so. This is already making her seem
far less romantic than her character.
She said that she wanted to study journalism because.
She liked the idea of writing from an objective place and not
having any emotion and storytelling.
Yeah, that is different. Also, anyone that hasn't seen
when Harry mentally, obviously our whole show, like all the
episodes are modeled after like the title is modeled after it.
Just had to mention that. Yeah.
Anyway. And so she then learned a couple
small roles like she was in a soap opera.
But. Her first real role, I guess,
would be in 1986 she played Nick Bradshaw's wife Carol in Top
Gun. And then in 1987, she had a
supporting role in the drama Promised Land, which landed her
an Independent Spirit Award. So she's, you know, taking off a
little bit. And I would describe her, well,
actually people have described her in these terms as deep.
And I have a quote from. Dennis where he said Meg has a
lot of depth and range in her profession as well as a person.
She's a deep thinker in that she questions every motive in
action. She's also very into meditation
and she reads a lot. She's very spiritual.
She seems like she's very into faith.
She's charming, Billy Crystal said.
Meg is everybody you ever wanted to go out with in high school
who said no to you? She's really loyal, not to keep
name dropping, but Rosie O'Donnell said.
As a best friend you feel that you could be intimate with her
and she does wouldn't betray you and then I'll name drop one more
time and say that she's passionate, Tom Hanks said.
Who said this? Tom Hanks, he said.
She does have a. Definite way of just sitting
around and curling up in the chair when you're talking about
stuff she absorbs a lot. She asks questions, but she
doesn't do that thing that almost everybody does.
They ask you the question because they want to answer it.
Sounds like a nice friend. I know she does.
She seems like someone who's really present in the moment,
and despite being known for her romantic comedies, she's openly
admitted that she's not actually a romantic person herself and
instead. Identifies as being more
pragmatic and sensible. Wow.
I would also say that she's pretty down to earth.
It seems like she said so many times that she doesn't even
identify as being a celebrity, and then she often forgets that
people would even know who she is.
That's cool. And I have a.
Feeling well, I'll get into Dennis Clay, but I have a
feeling that he might be the opposite.
I feel like he's like he's good at being a celebrity and I feel
like to her. It's something she doesn't even
really think about, if that makes sense.
But who is Dennis? Is it weird?
Isn't it? Everyone do these episodes to
refer to them by their first name.
By the way, the weird that we call them by their first name.
Because you know how publications will be like Ryan
or Quaid but I feel like this is journalism has to follow like AP
style and. This is not journalism.
We do research, but I don't think we obviously are biased
too. These are, no, these are I think
that we are more casual. These are just our friends, Mr.
Dennis. That would be funny if we did
become really formal like that, I know.
Mr. Dennis Gawade himself. So he was born April 9th,
Kristen Stewart's birthday 1954 in Houston, TX.
That would make him a guys don't hate me.
I don't know these off the top of my head An Aries right?
I'm not sure it is an Aries. I think so.
He grew up in Houston, TX and guess what?
He did not move around. He did not move around at all.
He had a very normal childhood. He grew up in the suburb of Bel
Air his entire life. I know I wouldn't have expected
it for him. His mom, Juanita, was a real
estate agent and his dad, William was an electrician.
And he also has an older brother, Randy, and I think
maybe a sister too. I'm not sure.
But so his brother Randy is also a famous actor now.
And he has said that his father was an alcoholic and his parents
divorced when he was a teenager. And at some point his father
remarried and he also got a stepbrother and a step sister
who he is very close with. But I don't really know much
about. I don't know their names, to be
honest with you. That's OK.
So yeah, he had a normal childhood that we played Little
League, he did swimming, he walked to school every day and
he seemed to be friends with all the neighborhood kids.
Just a typical childhood. As a teenager, he was very shy
and skinny and he didn't make the football team.
And so he then decided to go out for the drama department, mostly
because they had an air conditioner in the room.
And it's Texas. It was really hot.
So that was, you know, it's funny, a luxury, yeah.
But so he began acting in the school plays, and after high
school, he enrolled in the University of Houston to study
theatre. And then in 1973, during his
junior year, he dropped out and moved to Hollywood, and he
followed his older brother Randy, who at this time was now
a working actor doing small roles but could afford to house
Dennis on his couch. And at first I think you mean
Quaid. Mr. Quaid.
Oh yeah, Mr. Quaid. Yes, I was kidding at first.
Mr. Quaid really struggled to find work and he thought that he
made a big mistake. But you know, then he was only
booking small rules. And then in 1977 he met this
actress named PJ Soules who was his Co star in the film Our
Winning Season and they began to date.
And then during that time, he also unfortunately, was really
struggling with an addiction to alcohol and cocaine.
And so he booked himself into a 28 day rehab program at St.
John's Hospital And then after getting out at just age 24, him
and PJ got married. And then in 1975 he sorry, I
feel like I'm just like speeding through this.
But he landed a supporting role in the film Breaking Away, which
then got him on the radar of many more producers, especially
because the film had been nominated for Actually, I Might
Have Even. Won the Academy Award for Best
Original Screenplay. So it was small role but big
film. And then from there he had a lot
of steady roles throughout the 80s.
But his next big role would be in 1983 in the film The Right
Stuff. And after that he became much
more of a celebrity and his relationship took a back seat.
So him and PJ ended up getting divorced in 1983.
And then after that, I PJI know. Sorry.
Cute name though. That's a really cute name, but
cute. So after that, like he was a big
star. Now he's single.
He's in his late 20s, early 30s and.
He's getting kind of caught up in the Hollywood life.
He's, you know, going to an endless string of parties.
And he has a lot of celebrity friends.
He's doing a lot of drugs, Mr. Quay.
Yeah. And he's getting with a lot of
ladies. I think he's a ladies man.
And I would describe him as being really energetic.
He does have a lot of hobbies. He's funny.
He's charitable. He's always really busy.
He's a really good musician. He plays guitar.
Oh my gosh. Wait, did you say breaking away?
Yeah. Wait, was the movie?
I yeah, I saw that movie a couple months ago for my
family's movie. Did you like it?
Yeah, I did. It's a good movie.
He was like a mean one of the kids in it.
Oh, he's a kid in it? Well, no, I mean, he's like a
college kid. Oh cool.
Wait, looking it up now. Wow, he is he is pretty.
He is. He is such AI don't know.
I feel like different ages have such a look to them and who they
consider like a babe and I feel like he is such a 80s babe.
No, he really is. He's got like the.
The way his, like, jaw is, yeah, it's.
I hate to say this, this is like not politically correct of me,
but that kind of hot guy looks, I feel like usually doesn't age
that well. You know what I mean?
Yeah, well, he looks older. Well, he looks he'll be like,
but he's he's aged pretty good now.
But I feel like usually those guys really peak when they're
young. Does that make sense?
Yeah. Yeah.
I don't. I get what you're saying.
I feel like there's because I feel like he looks older than
his age. Exactly.
Look really manly and attractive.
But then. But then those guys can age just
as fast. I'm talking like the captain of
the wrestling team. Look, you know, yeah, yeah,
yeah. I know what you're saying, yeah.
Might be offensive people get over saying, but he told us to
keep in those moments rain. That's a thought that was like,
obviously not in my notes. The thoughts that are not in my
notes born in the episode can sometimes be hit or miss.
But kind of has like a Tom Cruise look to him.
Too, I can see that, Yeah. He's like, he is really sexy.
Yeah, he's got like a bravado to him, You know, it's interesting
that both, I don't know, he, he seems, it seems like he wasn't
actually like a popular guy in high school, but that kind,
that's kind of what he seems like when he's older.
Yeah, you know what I mean. So true, even though it's not a
thing when you're an adult, but I feel like that's kind of his
image once he's in Hollywood, that he's like a cool.
Guy. But you know, sometimes I almost
feel like then because he wasn't like a popular guy in high
school, he's compensating for that.
Once he becomes a Hollywood star, then it's He can't stop
himself from hanging out with all the cool people and like
partying a lot, yeah. But he also is very spiritual as
well, just like Megan that will come up later.
Oh, OK. So.
It's 1984 and Dennis has moved to New York City after living in
Hollywood, and he's there to perform in the Off Broadway show
Trues W with his brother Randy. And while there, nice, I know
cute. And while there, he spots Meg
from a distance. And he would later say we lived
about a block from each other on the Upper West Side, but we
didn't know each other. One Sunday morning, I was
walking downtown to do a matinee when I see Meg in a blue
sweater, walking up the street swinging her arms.
There was nothing about her that I couldn't forget.
Oh, swinging her arms. I know, that's so cute.
And around this time, a friend apparently had dragged.
They always say this A friend dragged me to his movie.
Like, why didn't you want to go? It's so true.
They always. Always say like I didn't even
want to go, but a friend made me OK.
I don't know if that's being honest or if it just makes the
story more. Serendipitous, but so she went
to see how. Often.
Does that happen to you? Someone drags you to something?
Yeah, so rarely. Like the movies.
Nobody makes me see a movie. I usually also don't tell people
if I don't actually want to go. She's an actress.
She. No, but I do feel like that's
something people say in interviews all the time.
Yeah. Oh, they dragged me and.
Whatever. But so they went to see Dennis's
film The Right Stuff, And she will later say, I remember
thinking that actor was a real guy guy.
Totally. They didn't meet yet what I was
trying to say. Yeah, exactly.
He's a man's man. It's 1987.
The couple finally meet for the first time while filming the
sci-fi film Inner Space, but at this time they're both in
relationships with other people. Meg wasn't that famous yet, like
she was still known for her small role in Top Gun and she
was dating the actor Anthony Edwards, who she Co starred in
that movie with Top Gun. And then Dennis was dating an
actress named Leah Thompson at the time.
And later Dennis would say we were both involved with people
at the time, so nothing was going to happen.
And Meg would say he was oh, he was miniaturized in the pod most
of the movie, so there was not much interaction.
I haven't seen the film, but sounds like his character
shrinks, shrinks down and is like isolated.
So, But then in 1995, she would tell Vanity Fair.
I remember the first time I saw his ABS.
We were making inner space and he had to do a scene in which he
didn't have on any clothes. He was in a trailer getting body
makeup on. All of us were there, staring at
his ABS and going, is there a sound those things make?
I don't know what that means. I've never thought that.
But wait, wait, can you say that again?
OK, she says. All of us were there, staring at
his ABS and going, is there a sound those things make?
Oh, like those ABS are so hot. Like, do they make a noise?
I don't know. I feel like that doesn't geeking
clench them. Yeah, I wonder.
So yeah, so they're just having a professional relationship.
And then it's 1988 and now they're both single and they're
once again Co starring in a film together.
This time they're starring in the thriller DOA.
And apparently Dennis was interested in Meg, but she was a
little bit more reserved at 1st and she later said he wasn't
what I was expecting in life. You know, the wild guy from
Texas? I kept thinking to myself, no,
not him, please not him. So I don't think he was really
her type, is what she's trying to say.
But then interesting, one hot summer night while filming,
Dennis put his arm around Meg in a crowded bar and he told
Entertainment Weekly it was like a Thunderbolt.
Both of us felt this is it, we're going to be together.
Wow, cool. I like that.
We know that. I know.
But you don't always get those little details.
I know you really don't. Those are hard to come by.
Yeah. So then right after that film
wrapped, they took a trip to Bora Bora together and they
became official. And initially, they were really
bonding a lot about both being spiritual seekers and would read
passages from their favorite books together about
enlightenment, enlightenment, and they did yoga together and
meditated. I did not picture that.
I know. Me neither.
And so that that's, I feel like a very common thing that they
both share throughout their relationship.
So then after they wrapped that film and went on their trip,
that's when Meg then was in When Harry Met Sally playing Sally
Albright. And this is a film that would,
yeah. This is, of course, a film that
would catapult her into a list status.
And she was significantly more famous than him now.
And in 2018, Dennis gave an interview with Megyn Kelly, and
he said that he struggled to cope with Meg's rising fame.
He said, when we met, you know, I was the big deal.
And then my career came to a halt.
We'd go out on the streets of New York and it would be like
Meg, Meg. And I have to admit, I actually
did feel like I disappeared. I didn't think I was that small,
but I was. It was a growth opportunity.
I learned from that. Wow, I wonder.
I just it's so interesting. Like, I wonder how it would feel
if you weren't an actor or like you weren't trying to be famous.
Would it still bother you or? I think I think it would.
If you met them and they weren't that famous and then they became
famous like that's. True.
I mean, we kind of saw that with Albert Einstein and.
Oh yeah, I think some other people too, like, suddenly
you're competing with the whole world for their attention.
Mm hmm. Yeah, you would totally change
the dynamic, but it totally changes the dynamic, I think
when it's the woman that is more successful than the guy too.
Yes, yes, I know. I mean, might be a stereotype,
generalizing, whatever. But it just seems like
throughout history, men are not comfortable with the woman
outshining them, if they're. Competitors, in a way, if
they're in, especially if they're in the same industry.
I mean, I think some men are OK with it, But yeah, I mean,
that's a thing, right? That when women win the Oscar,
they often get divorced afterward.
Whereas women, I feel like, are all often so willing and happy
to support a man. Like, I feel like we've covered
this so much on our show already.
Where the? Man is a rock star or an actor
or something, and he's like doing his thing, cheating on
her, whatever, on drugs. And the woman's just standing by
him. I know.
Well, it's, it's scene. It's unfortunate, but Cena's
like emasculating for guys, yeah, in these traditional
relationships because they're like, I should be the one that's
providing. And yeah.
It's. I know something people got to
get over, but so they had a pretty cute relationship.
They seemed really madly in love.
They dated for three years, and one time Meg hired a plane to
fly a banner that read Happy Birthday Dennis over a concert
where him and his band The Electrics, were playing.
He was in a band. Yeah, he was.
I don't think it was like a crazy famous band.
But he played guitar. And then, on her birthday in
1998, he hired A marching band to arrive onto the set of her
film and play Happy Birthday for her.
Those are both so extravagant, I know.
I love. I love above those.
Airplane banners in the sky, at the beach.
Whatever. I don't know.
I know. Me too.
Makes me so excited and happy
when I see one. I think it's just an ad for
like, Dunkin' Donuts. I know, but honestly, it works
on me. I love that they're doing this
traditional form of advertising. Yeah, and it's exciting.
It's like entertainment on the beach.
That's that's really romantic. Both of those are really cool.
Wow. But unfortunately, Dennis was
still very much struggling with his addiction and he was going
on a lot of benders. Yeah, that's not in You've Got
Mail, No. Or When Harry Meant Sally.
Oh no, that doesn't even exist in those universes.
And so he's back to doing cocaine pretty much every day,
he said. And he would arrive on set after
a Bender and everyone on the crew would know that he was
really fucked up and it started begin like began affecting his
career. So they got engaged in 1990 and
the press was super obsessed with their relationship, and no
one really knew that behind closed doors he was very much
still struggling. And according to a 2001
Entertainment Weekly article, they apparently got in a very
highly publicized argument in an LA club, which I think was about
his addiction, but I couldn't actually find, like they say,
highly publicized. I couldn't actually find any
account from that to hear any more details, but I it must have
been about his addiction, because then afterwards there
were a lot of reports that she had refused to marry him unless
he got clean. So he then went to rehab for the
second time and they had to postpone their wedding.
Oh man, I know. Like they actually had a date
set and they had to postpone, yeah.
That's tough. And following rehab, she was
really supportive and she would like go to support meetings and
like do therapy with Dennis. But apparently Megan's.
I mean, I don't think she goes by Megan.
Apparently Meg's mother, Susan Jordan, she had a fallout this
year with Meg, which I think would last to this day if she's
still alive. Like, I don't think they ever
rekindled their relationship. And apparently, really, yeah,
apparently it had to do with Dennis's drug use.
According to Meg's mom, though, Meg, when she's talked about it,
has claimed that the problems go back way further.
And of course, go back to when the mom left her father back
when she was in high school. But apparently Susan, her mom,
had publicly talked about Dennis's drug addiction to the
tabloids, and so that disobeyed Meg's trust.
And her mom also began maybe writing a tell all book about
her. But I don't think it ever was
published. My gosh, I know we saw this.
Didn't we see this with somebody?
Oh, Jennifer Aniston's mom did the same thing.
That's such a betrayal. It is.
I think her mom must have been pretty fame hungry.
And I bet that's why Meg is often like, I don't even care
about being famous, because it's something she kind of resented
her mom for. Yeah, she's seen her own mother,
stupid to such low levels for attention and money that's
upsetting, you know. I always hate to hear about that
happening. Like someone being estranged
from I know, and her mom even like her mom had breast cancer.
And so Meg would be asked about that in interviews, which I
think is a little personal, but would be asked like, would you
feel guilty if you didn't rekindle her, your relationship
with her? And she would say, like, I don't
think about that. I mean, but it must have been
really hard for her to have to make that decision, be in that
position where she had to actually cut out her mom.
You know, it's crazy that that's such an intimate, such a
personal question. I know it's crazy a stranger
would ask you. I know.
I feel like they don't really go there anymore.
I know because. Social media would shame them, I
know. Exactly.
So then it's 1991, and Dennis has been clean for several
months. And on Valentine's Day, he
suddenly tells Meg today's the day while they're staying at a
Bel Air hotel. And so the concierge tracked
down a minister and they got married in their hotel room.
She was 28 and he was 36. I wouldn't love that, but I
think because she's a strange she's estranged from her family,
there's it's probably easier to get eloped than to have a big
party. Wow, I actually didn't know
they. Got married, to be honest.
Oh, really? Yeah.
Yeah, she would later tell the New York Post.
I was laughing and crying at the same time, and I realized I
could have never gotten married in front of a whole group of
people. Yeah, some people feel.
That way, yeah. Well, whatever.
No, I like a wedding, you know. I love a wedding.
Yeah, I love it if I was her friend.
I'd be very upset, but that's OK, Meg.
And three months later, we got married.
Yeah, it only took three months. Three months and Oh yeah, three
months and eleven years or something. 12 years.
I love that. Yeah.
No, she's. I feel like that's already so
contrary to the romantic comedy character.
She doesn't even have a wedding, like a big wedding ceremony.
But there is something quite romantic, I think, about people
getting elope. I do think that that is really
sweet and kind of sexy too. Yeah, him being like today's.
The day that is on Valentine's Day, yeah.
And the whole rush of it all like that is really sweet.
So then it's 1992, not long after their son and only child
together, Jack Henry, was born via an emergency C-section
because this baby weighed £10. So, wow, pretty big baby.
That's big, right? 10 pounds?
Yeah, I think so. Yeah, I hate to think that.
But yeah, I would not. How much did you weigh?
Do you? Know I was premature.
I think I weighed £5. Oh so small I know.
What about you? I think I was like 7.
Something. OK, so I.
Think that's normal. Yeah, I would not want something
£10 like coming out, coming out of me.
It just put me on dirt. Wow.
So after Jack was born and while Dennis was still recovering,
their family spent a lot of time in Montana where Dennis had
purchased a 200 acre ranch and they practice.
Dennis like did a lot of his activities.
He did a lot of fly fishing and piloting during that time.
So he's like he's such a man of his hobbies.
You know, they also, yeah, they also bought a 1917 bungalow in
Santa Monica. So they're very, they're in LA,
but they also spend a lot of time in Montana.
Isn't Jack now an actor? He is.
He's pretty successful. He was in The Hunger Games.
Yeah, I just. Had such a weird thought.
Like what if he listened to this podcast?
My God, that would be so weird. He's pretty cute and he looks
just like he looks like a perfect combination between his
parents. He does.
I know that that's such an obvious thing to say because he
literally is. But some people not as much.
You don't see it. Oh yeah.
I look nothing like my dad whatsoever.
He was in, Yeah, The Hunger Games.
Oppenheimer. That's a big one, that.
Is Big One good? Good for you.
Yeah, Jack. So.
Yes. After a lot of back-to-back,
back-to-back film projects, Meg decided to take a step back and
just focus on being a wife and a mother for a short while.
And she was profiled in Vanity Fair.
And Dennis talks a lot about those early years when he was
struggling with his addiction and he said she stayed there and
stuck it out with me. It was a big test of life on me
and on me and on her and on the relationship.
But we really loved each other enough to hang in there.
We've been together for about 8 years and people go through all
different stages. People change and we've been
able to change along with each other.
Then he laughs and says I can't speak, I can't speak for her.
I know for myself I ain't letting go.
Which is sweet. It is.
Meanwhile, Megan, the same interview says every day.
I'm surprised that Dennis and I are still together, but Dennis
and I both come into this bringing something new to the
party. Neither of us is the kind of
person that thinks the other person is going to make us feel
one way or the other. We're very intact separately so
that when we come together, it's about something else.
Hmm. Didn't Suki, Suki Waterhouse
just recently said the same thing?
Like, I'm so surprised that I'm still, like, happy with the
seafoods and I don't know if I would love that.
I guess not. I mean, I guess it's realistic,
you know, I guess so. But.
Yeah, I I think I would not. Like to hear my spouse say that?
Who would have thought I'd be happy with Mel for five years?
That's crazy. I know I didn't.
See that happening and why? But every day we bring.
Something like what if I don't bring something one day?
I know. What do you bring?
That's a lot of pressure. Yeah, reading too far into it.
Yeah, So it's so weird, though, because the Oh my gosh, the
interviewer asks Meg. This is like how crazy the times
have changed because they're talking about how Dennis used to
struggle with addiction. And the interviewer brings up
that sometimes drug addiction can lead to problems in the
bedroom and that sometimes last. Two episodes.
What has it been? A theme.
I know now I take a drink every time drug addiction leads to
erectile dysfunction. Oh my.
God, but but should I add that to the drinking?
Game maybe you Wait, no, wait, Didn't that also come up with
Elvis? Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Oh wait, from Elvis? But then also in the last
episode, it wasn't drug. It wasn't from drug addiction,
but it wasn't from drug. It was like nervousness causing
some kind. Of dysfunction.
This, you know, this actually is I think, a common problem in
relationships, though I'm very happy that we can highlight it,
but thankfully, I know we're laughing, but it's.
Very normal. It is very normal.
You don't have to be embarrassed.
But so the fact, oh, sorry, sorry, I'm like, I'm actually
flushing right now. I'm sorry but.
So we can be relieved, though, because this wasn't an issue.
Meg's laughed, and she says that's never been a problem with
Dennis. I can't believe someone asked
that. I know they they don't go there
these days. It's a little disappointing,
like nowadays it would turn on the interviewer and be like, how
dare you, I know. But in the same interview she
says that Dennis is more romantic than her, saying I
don't get my feet swept off the ground very much.
I just find that I'm very grounded.
I know this is kind of. Psychoanalyzing.
Whatever. I don't know her, but I wonder
if, because of what happened with her parents, she's just
been unable to get too excited. Or to feel.
I wouldn't want her to think this be like fooled or
something. You know what I mean?
That she thinks. She just wants to be realistic.
I don't know. Yeah, no, 100%.
She's on edge. I.
Think she is. I think she's scared and she
seems to have a wall up. But I mean, Dennis's parents.
Also got divorced. She does seem more romantic than
her, but. I know, it's it's funny how some
people react, everyone. Reacts differently to things
that happen to them. You know, everybody really is
different in their own way, yeah.
And we're. All the same, different and the.
Same, but that's the beauty of life, you know?
I know contradictions everywhere and like, I feel like, anyway,
this couple would love to have that conversation, 'cause they
really were so spiritual. Like, I do think they had a lot
of deep school conversations with each other.
And even in 1996, they took a trip to India together with
their son Jack as a part of their spiritual journey where
they meditated a lot and met with a lot of different.
Gurus. They even had their own personal
guru that they, like, consulted with.
Yeah. So they they get it, Yeah.
Yeah. And I think that goes to Meg
being so big present in the moment.
Like she's very much like, like she said grounded.
She's not like I do think a romanticism in a little bit of a
way, requires some sense of anxiety because you are thinking
a lot about the past and the future.
And if you're a grounded person, you're just in the moment, so
you're not, like, letting yourself be romantic.
That's true. That's true.
Highly romantic people are way too caught up in the past and
the future. Yeah, and that's, I would say
that's myself. So me too.
And it can be. A problem?
It doesn't. I don't think it necessarily
makes me a more peaceful person. No, no, no.
But it's fun. It is.
And also, I can't control it. So I mean, maybe I can a little
bit, but that's just my nature, Right?
Right. So then it's 1999.
Once again, Meg is profiled in Vanity Fair, and in the article
she makes it sound like they purposely don't appear together
in public that much as a conscious choice to fly under
the radar. And she reveals that they don't
have a full time nanny for their son and they share parenting
responsibilities evenly, including driving him to school
every day. And that they have a very strict
rule that one parent is always home while the other one is
working, which is very normal. Yeah, this article talks about.
How? While Dennis is a successful
actor, Meg is considered the star, and they point out that
many Hollywood marriages would. Tend to crumble with that role
reversal. And she says nothing About Us
has ever been based on ideas about each other's careers.
I've never once read a sentence about me.
I don't read reviews. I don't read articles.
I don't have any awareness of what my public persona is.
And in the interview, yeah, I know I like, almost don't buy
it. But she always says that She
goes, I don't read like she's like, I have no idea.
About anything which is good, like, she obviously must have a
lot of self-control. Yeah, seems like it.
And in the interview she. Says that they're open to
working together again, but it doesn't sound like she's that
interested in it. She says It would be
interesting, but it'd have to be based for a film that has a good
message, that's for a good cause.
And she goes on to say like they're not.
I don't know. She's like, who would want to
even watch that? She's not excited about the idea
at all. Interesting.
And I thought it this was interesting.
They asked Carrie Fisher about Dennis and Meg's relationship,
but they don't even do this anymore.
They don't ask the celebrity friends.
Like, what do you think? Yeah, the heck.
It just feels so human. Carrie says on Quaid's
confidence. He's really grounded, a real guy
and she really respects him. And then?
Carrie says that Dennis worries when Ryan's stardom might
endanger her. One weekend, Meg and I were
going to the Renaissance Fair, Fisher recalls.
Dennis said you can't go, you're too famous.
He's not daunted. He just notices and guides her
that way. OK, I feel like some.
Might find that a little controlling someone telling you
you can't go to something, but I can also see that being.
Protective. Well, I wonder if he really was
like, you can't go blocking the door, like literally saying she
can't go or just being like, you can't do that, You're too fat.
You know what I mean? Like, yeah.
Exactly. You can't in the same way that
you would say, like you can't go out in the snow wearing that.
Yeah, that's true, you know. I don't know how he said it.
Yeah, that's true. I mean.
Carrie is taking it as a positive thing, so.
And then in the article, Meg goes on to say the whole
situation with Dennis is so outrageous and fun.
It doesn't make any sense. If I had to write down about us
on paper, I would never put us together.
But I think that's part of the romance.
It's always the unexpected person that turns out to be the
ideal. He is the unexpected person in
my life. When I first saw him, I went, Oh
no, he's this huge individual with this really big persona.
And that scared me. I imagined I'd be with a Madison
Ave. type, or at least an East Coast type, but instead I'm out
riding horses and chasing bears. Interesting, yeah.
I wonder if that's an. Interesting.
There's a lot to think about. Yeah.
I wonder if that's an interesting.
Question for the audience, like about falling in love with
someone who's not your type. Yeah, yeah.
I mean, that's romantic. In itself, like the unlikely
pair I love. Like an odd couple.
I know in movies that's, again, one of the best tropes ever.
But I I also do think being in that relationship, you could in
your head be like, yeah, wait a second.
I thought I was going to be with somebody that was like this.
I always imagined myself with, I don't know writer in New York.
I don't know. I don't know what she meant by
do you think but. OK, this is my question for you
Kelly, because you had definitely have a type.
Do you think having a Mel? No, but like no but like but
like. I think for you having a type
has. I feel like some people might
think it's limiting, but I honestly maybe I do have a type
and like you can tell me, but I think not having a type.
In a way, was has been limiting for me, 'cause I'm like, I don't
know what I'm looking for. So then the pool is so much
larger and there's nothing I'm focusing on.
But I feel like having a tight can actually be really helpful
because it helps you like breakdown.
OK. This is what I'm attracted to,
you know? Does that make sense?
Yeah. Is it?
Yeah. I hope you're not intentional.
It's not intentional, No. No, But I do.
Think it could be kind of. Because I do think when I was a
teenager I was often daydreaming a lot about who I would date.
And but I will say, even though I think I have had a type, I do
think that their personalities have all been different.
So it's interesting. But yeah, I think knowing what
kind of person, I mean, he sounds like he's spiritual.
He's into the, like, deep conversations with her.
Like that's a type of person that she had before.
I mean, I think it's just having someone that shares values or is
interested in the same things as you is a good place to start.
But that doesn't mean they're going to have every single guy
or girl you date is going to have the same personality.
Yeah, because they're all, you know, I feel like because.
They're all into baseball or something.
I don't know. Someone like talks.
About a type like, it is in a way like, in a superficial sense
like. You don't really know somebody
until you get to know them, but I feel like having a tight I
wish I had more of it on the surface level.
So that way it would be easier to identify an initial
attraction which can make you more excited like in the
beginning I I think you kind of do.
I mean, I haven't met everybody that you've gone out with, but I
I think you do, but. So while they're in LA, like
most of the time, they also spend a lot of time on the ranch
and they actually have no staff. They're very down to earth.
Meg does most of the cooking and cleaning and Dennis chops wood
and tends to the horses. And the writer of this article,
Michael Shannon Schneiderson. I don't know how to say it.
But he says it isn't the stuff of tabloid scandals, this
reading on the ranch and saddling up Jack for his first
cattle drive, and she and Quaid as she and Quaid just did.
And in that sense, Ryan really is her screen persona,
apparently as clean living as she seems, unlike some other
contenders for the title of America's Sweetheart.
OK, that's kind of like shading people, but he says.
I know he says. It's not headline grabbing, but
it is in its way subtle and complex, as real life is more
compelling than film. How do you keep a good marriage
going and how, if you're an actress living that life, do you
find films about that to do? I actually don't think it's in
this article, but to that question of like how to keep a
marriage going at this in the same year.
Meg said in in an interview. There's so much mythology about
getting together and there's none about staying together.
And staying together is what's so hard.
Like basically saying that, like, real life is so different
from romantic comedies. Yeah, and then that.
Same year she was cast in the 2000 thriller Proof of Life
alongside Australian actor Russell Crowe and They.
Would go on to film the movie in Ecuador in London in spring of
2000. So now it's 2000 and there are
tabloids of eyewitness reports seeing Meg Ryan and Russell
Crowe reportedly kissing all over London and even snuggling
up together at a David Bowie concert.
What? Jack, I hope you're not
listening. I'm sure he knows.
He knows. I know what is happening.
So. Then in on June 29th, Megan
Dennis's public publicist releases a statement to People
magazine that the couple have decided to separate, which they
say is a mutual and amicable decision, though they didn't
comment on whether they would divorce, but later.
I think like the next day or something, Dennis filed for
divorce and then in July photos come out of Megan.
Russell leaving a party together, thrown by Tom Hanks,
which just validates the rumors that they're a couple and that
she left Dennis. Tom Hanks.
I'm sorry. Tom Cruise, Tom Cruise.
Oh, her call is dies in on this? No, but she is still.
Really good friends with Tom Hanks.
I do have a feeling like he's a team, Meg, but OK, I need to
know, did they break up because she's with Russell or were they
always keep listening? Keep listening.
OK, so of course Meg's mom is coming out of the woodwork,
Susan. She has to open her mouth and
talk to the press. Yeah.
So around this time, she tells the New York Post, I began
reading all these falsehoods and lies about me and the press
after she met Dennis Quaid. These are her lies constructed
by my daughter in order to enhance her image and certainly
to protect Dennis Quaid. Everyone knows Meg as this
wonderful enhancer. Image I.
Know. Like, seriously, I don't think
Meg is going out of her way to bash her mom.
She's just reacting to things that her mom is saying.
Yeah, and Susan goes. Everyone knows Mega's this
wonderful persona, the saving Angel for poor Dennis Quaid.
But I think it was a very handy thing for her to do, to present
herself as a saviour of this troubled soul who was a drug
addict. How would it have looked if it
came out that I had noticed this?
First she had to discredit me to preserve her image.
Trust me, I know what it's like to be lonely in a marriage.
I don't know Russell Crowe from a Hole in the wall, but I see
them together in pictures and I can tell there is something
there. I wish she finds the love she so
desperately wants from him and that she's finally happy.
Oh my God. What?
I'm a little confused about what her point is.
Her point is like, OK, so apparently her.
Falling out with Meg had to do with Dennis Quaid is what she's
saying, and she's saying it's because she told Meg that like.
Dennis was a drug addict, but he did struggle with addiction and
he got help. So her mom's.
Happy that she's with Russell Cronin?
Yeah, I guess so, I think. Her mom.
It seems like her mom claims that Dennis is what got in the
way of her and Meg, but I don't see what Meg did for her to.
Meg. She was just supporting her
boyfriend and then husband. What's so wrong with that?
I don't know. I think what happened is her mom
openly dished in the tabloids things that she shouldn't have.
And then together as a couple, Meg and Dennis had cut her out.
But so now Meg's mom seems happy that the marriage had failed.
She's that's not right. I know it's terrible this but
this article. Where they speak to Meg's mom
goes on to mention that Meg is around the same age that her
mother was when she walked out on their family.
And they try to draw a lot of parallels to make it seem almost
like ironic that Meg could be guilty of walking out on her own
family like she's a nine year old son and no.
And they also say, like, Dennis is desperately trying to save
the marriage. So it's making it seem like
she's guilty of the same thing that, like, she resents about
her mom, you know, Which I think is not fair, but I wonder if
that's even true. Was he desperate to save the
marriage? I don't.
Think so, But we'll see. I think I don't.
I don't think he, like, wanted to get divorced, but I don't
think he was. Innocent in this whole
situation. So then it's fall.
Well, right before fall in August, Mega officially also
filed for divorce, which I didn't know.
People both fought filed maybe if they disagree about the terms
or something. But so it's over.
Sadly, it's September and there are concerns that the affair,
the alleged affair between. Meg and Russell Crowe will hurt
her good girl persona. And there's this really telling
Entertainment Weekly article. And they say that after a test
screening, Warner Brothers actually cut out a sex scene
between Megan Russell because the audience felt that it made
her character seem less sympathetic.
And then, not to spoil, but the film.
That her and Russell starting together would go on to be a box
office failure and the film's director Taylor Hackford said
it's like the scandal had an incredibly and very destruct
destructive effect on the release of the film in the US
because the real life story overpowered the film.
Oh man, I think it's kind of not fair the.
Film maybe wasn't going to be a success anyway.
You don't know that. I do.
It's interesting. I want, I feel like people would
want to see the movie more because of the scandal, right?
That's what the entertainment. Weekly article was saying they
were saying like people probably didn't even hear about this film
and now they have it on their radar because this is really
juicy and they want to see do these actors really have
chemistry? It's like a car crash.
Reminds me of that. Don't worry, darling movie.
Oh yeah, Olivia Wilde and Harry Styles, that whole thing.
Jason Sudeikis, Did you see it? Yeah, I did.
See it? I did.
It worked on it. Wasn't enough to get me, wasn't
enough to get me in the theaters, but.
Yeah, I mean, the thing about it is, though, that Meg had this
very romantic, Good Girl America's sweetheart persona.
So like, the people who identify with her are not the people who
would be. On that's captivated by the idea
of her having an affair, and they seemed like they had a
great marriage. So it's really upsetting to
think that, like, she would throw it away.
Yeah, for people. What happened?
Yeah, so. It's October and the film Living
Proof comes out or it's it's about to come out and Megan
Russell, they don't openly talk about their relationship and
they really don't do a lot of press for the film.
But they're. Not shy about displaying their
PDA like they're very much a couple.
Photographed by paparazzi a lot. And she does an interview with W
Magazine and she says so this is what it feels like to be the
scarlet woman. Oh, I'm having that experience
now. And about the divorce, she says
My marriage and the dissolution of my marriage, Well, the real
reasons for it will always be speculation, because I'll never
talk about what went down. And neither will Dennis.
It dissolved before it became sport for the press, the public
and the press turned. It tuned in way after, so she's
basically saying like the marriage was already over, like
before her and Russell were even spotted together or had
anything. And about the rumoured affair,
she said the reasons why he and I broke up have nothing to do
with another person. My marriage was broken, nobody
else broke it, and the interviewer asks if maybe Dennis
had been unfaithful. In their marriage, and Meg says
we both behaved very honorably in our marriage and in our
breakup. He never cheated on me.
I can't believe they're saying that about him.
Oh wow. And they're like her and
Russell's relationship ended up fizzling out in December.
So it was a really short lived relationship.
So we should cover that. I know, I know.
I do think they. Went on to stay friends
afterwards. Oh, which is nice.
So then. A 2001 in July and Dennis is
interviewed in West magazine and he comments on the divorce for
the first time. And he says when you break up,
your whole identity is shattered.
That's why it is like death. It is death Next to losing a
child, the breakup of a marriage is the hardest thing to go
through. It's kind of refreshing to hear
a man say that. It is refreshing, but how does
he even know what it feels like to lose a child?
He doesn't he? Hasn't experienced that.
I think he's assuming which I do think like so drastically
different. Obviously haven't experienced
that. But I think those, I don't think
you can say that's even like next to it.
I think that's even like. Some people do do about losing
your spouse. Yeah, some people.
Do debate this like if it is more painful, and I think it's I
think it's obviously more painful if your spouse passes
away. But like I have heard people say
with a marriage like that also comes with a form of rejection.
Whereas if your spouse passed away, they they still died like
loving you. Or you can still be comforted in
that and still feel like you're allowed to love them for the
rest of your life. But with the breakup of a
marriage like, it can be so devastating because you also
have to let go of the love that you have for them in a way you
know it. No, I do think it would be
excruciating. Mm hmm.
To to lose a. Spouse from To have a spouse
pass away, though, that takes away any possibility.
Like if you got divorced, As devastating as it is, and even
if there's literally no hope, you're going to get back
together. It's never impossible.
So you can be comforted with that.
But so he shares in the interview that he and Meg are
friendly and that they share joint custody of their nine year
old son Jack. And he says, Meg and I still
talk almost every day. Our relationship is good, he
said. We were together for 13 years.
We have a child together. She knows me like nobody else.
Why not? You know, Meg and I are always
going to be together. We'll always be connected.
That's just the way it is. If anything we can be fuller
people. Maybe we've become more of
ourselves, which is very Zen of him, like he's really thinking
about this and trying to see the positive and but you know she's.
He's not wallowing in pity. He's back on the dating scene.
He was linked for a while to two different women, including Andy
McDowell and then Shannon Mogler, so it seems like he's
moving on dating again. And then, after the breakup,
Meg's acting career definitely pivots away from romantic
comedies. She starred in the dark
psychosexual thriller In The Cut, in which she plays a
frustrated poet and lecturer who becomes involved in a murder
investigation and an affair with the officer in charge.
And apparently, I think Nicole Kidman was originally supposed
to be in it. And then she dropped out.
And then Meg, she really wanted to be in it.
So she even auditioned for it, which is something.
She wasn't really doing any more in her career, and it's a very
different role than audiences we're used to seeing her in.
And there's also a lot at this time written about her being
nude in the film, especially since she's almost or over 40,
which again, really sexist. But people are almost like we're
kind of mad at her. She's so different.
Really. Yeah, people don't like her
anymore because she's just so different from.
Who they knew her as in these romantic roles, and they're
like, now she's in this sexual movie and she had an affair.
She's very much getting a lot of Flack.
But in this article, she denies that she felt any pressure to
reinvent herself. The writer says that unlike many
actresses at her age, she has no shortage of parts.
On offer instead, she puts her willingness to take such an
apparent risk down to what she calls life experiences, she
says. I understand that contradictory
things exist in one person, she says a little.
And the writer of the article, Andrew Anthony, says the
defining life experience of her past five years was the end of
her nine year marriage to Quaid in 2000 and her simultaneous
affair with Crowe, her Co star, in Proof of Life.
What kind of internal contradiction that rots is not
something upon which she chooses to elucidate, but the radical
departure from her on screen. Persona was there for everyone
to see. Her characters were not the type
to leave a husband and a son to travel around the world with an
Australian womanizer, and she says there's this play put on by
the zeitgeist and I've got a role.
There's this archetype that's been assigned to me.
Nothing I've constructed. But if you betrayed the
archetype, then you suffer the consequences.
I was really able to distinguish between that and me, and what
it's given me is the completely great freedom.
I really don't care. People can write whatever they
want and say whatever they want and I don't care.
It's a bad situation, I know, but then later.
She would go on to say that she felt like this role in in the
film in the cut. Was what got people to turn on
her. I think all of this is like
really sexist. It's kind of like what could
have happened with Kristen Stewart but didn't but people
thought it would. People were so mad.
Yeah they did. They.
No, it's. But like in the long run I don't
think it did as much do. Well, she was still young when
that happened, that's true. She had time to bounce back.
But if Meg Gran was 40 when this is happening, wait, that's so
true. Hollywood kind of says you're
already over. That's true, she.
Already had that against her and then this happens.
It's like a nail in the coffin, Yeah, but Kristen.
Stewart was in her early 20s, that's true.
So she had couple years, but I mean, I feel like there's a good
amount of time people hated Kristen Stewart and would you're
right, Home Wrecker and all these horrible names.
And she was doing a lot of small movies and it kind of seemed
like she was like, over that's. True.
Then she came back. Yeah, Yeah.
Yeah, people are a lot harder on women when they cheat.
It's yeah, unfortunate. Do you think that that's true or
an exaggeration that she left her family and went off around
the world? I with some.
Man, I think. She obviously broke a social
norm of if you're getting divorced, I do think it is
probably better to not be like flaunting a new relationship.
But I don't think that she necessarily was cheating on him.
But I'll get to that if that does come up, actually.
But yeah, I think whatever she was guilty of is what?
Men do all the time and they really don't face the
repercussions that much. If anything, sometimes with
these guys we've covered, it's just expected that they're going
to cheat on their wife. It's and women are so accepting
and forgiving of it. So she really was like held to
this different standard. And she will later say though
that she felt like that role was what got people to really hate
her, she said. I think the feeling was.
The feeling with Hollywood was mutual.
I felt done when they felt done probably.
But yeah, and it almost it's interesting because I feel like
she purposely, almost as a form of rebellion took that role to
play into what like people thought of her.
But it just made people more mad.
So then we're in the mid 2000s, everyone's moving on.
It's 2004 and Dennis married. His real estate agent, Kimberly
Buffington, and they welcomed fraternal twins born via
surrogate in 2007, and they would be married for the next
several years. They divorced in 2016, and now
he's remarried to his fourth wife.
Wow and. Meg's career during this time
also, it really starts to lull, but she starts focusing on other
things. She's doing a lot of travelling.
And then in 2006, she adopted a baby girl from China.
Oh, I didn't know that, Yeah. And as a single mom, and then I
have clips from 2006 when she goes on Oprah.
So let's. Talk.
When you were dating Russell Crowe, there was lot you.
You took a lot of heat for that. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
What was true and what wasn't true?
Well, my marriage was. A.
I. Think I have to talk about.
It in a way that's most respectful to my son.
It was a very unhealthy marriage and it was pretty much not a
happening marriage for for a very long time.
I probably should have left much earlier and I'm very.
I'm very sad, actually, that it all had to come apart in the way
that it seemed to have, you know, that it was never about
another. Man, it was only about what our,
my and Dennis's relationship just couldn't sustain, you know?
And it's I think once the tablets get a hold of three
celebrity names, just. Really in trouble?
No. Your name?
Goes on that. Board every week.
And there it is, baby. Yeah, that's right.
Do you think you took a public? Bullet for something that wasn't
really your fault, You do in what way?
Well, I think I did, and I think.
I think, honestly, Russell did too, because he he.
He wasn't a home wrecker. He took a lot.
Of heat for that. And he had a lot of grace,
frankly, about not saying, not talking about things that he
knew were going on in my marriage.
And and I always, I'll be very grateful to him for a long time
for that, really. Yeah, yeah.
And he was. Around at a you know a divorce
is a possibly hard transition in your life and he was there for a
few months and and. And you know, I didn't.
Leave my marriage for Russell Crowe.
I left my marriage because your marriage.
Wasn't working. My marriage was not working.
Yeah. Interesting.
Oh gosh. I love Oprah.
Me too. It really she oh, Meg Ryan is
she still looks like her cute so I know.
And. That is interesting.
Like did you do you feel like you took a bullet for something
that wasn't your fault? That would be.
That does require a lot of self-control as a person.
If you're getting so much hate to not come out and be like,
well, you guys don't understand because right, we have barely.
Been together or something? Yeah.
If that is true. I do think if you still love
your ex-husband like Dennis, she wouldn't want to go out there
and be like, well, actually, like, he has problems.
Yeah, exactly. You know, we are, you know, she
doesn't want. It's like a tough situation to
be in because you don't want to slander someone that you do care
about. Yeah, that's.
True, but then your reputation is being tanked.
But I mean what you said before, like even when she was way
younger, that she never really cared about being famous.
Whatever. It's if this.
Is all true. It's pretty nice of her to just
take it and let her reputation get ruined.
Yeah, it's so interesting. Because in the same interview,
Oprah kind of says this to a lot of the people she interviewed.
Interviews that get divorced, but she's like, but you guys
looked like such a beautiful couple, like you're on the red
carpet, You had this amazing marriage.
Was that all real? And then Meg goes, well, we
weren't even really showing up to red carpets towards the end.
Together. We weren't even going to things
like as a couple. And it just takes me back to
that article in 1999, which is like the last full year of their
marriage. Where the article makes it sound
like they don't go to events together on purpose because they
want to fly under the radar, like they don't want a lot of
publicity, but actually it's because they couldn't stand each
other. Like, it's so funny.
Yeah. And it's like it maybe even both
things were true. Maybe they would always get in
bad moods when they did stuff like that.
So then they thought, oh, it's better if we just don't.
Yeah, let's just stay home. You can do your own.
Thing You can always put a positive spin on things, but
yeah. Relationships are so
complicated, I know, so speaking.
Of more on that Oprah interview, OK.
Here we go. Funk Thinkers is really
interesting. 'Cause I obviously I do this
show so I talk to women all the time who are in bad
relationships, or how I bet there's an estimate.
I don't know if anybody's ever done this of when it starts to
go wrong. You know it really can't be
repaired. How long do you stay after you
know it's really over? I think you want it, not.
To be over. Very much.
I mean you, but I hear people. Like some, for some people it's
like 7 years. It's like I knew seven years
ago. It wasn't five years.
You. Knew five years, yeah.
Easily, really. And you have.
Children, you know, people have children.
There's a lot of, there's this whole thing that you need to
sustain. There's a lot of even if your
marriage isn't good, and even if you need.
To get out you. Still feel guilty somehow?
Which, yeah, yeah, you know. Maybe that's a female thing.
I'm not. I don't know.
But but but it's crazy how you have to talk yourself into
protecting yourself. And so there are times, and I
think every woman's life where she really does need to get out
and expand and do all those things, get all those things
that make her her the best version of herself, OK?
Oh my gosh. She knew for five years.
Oh, that's tough. Wow.
I feel like that would be really hard to hear.
If you were the other person or if you were their child, that
would be tough. But that is, I do think, like to
me, their marriage just seems like so many other married
couples where they are kind of unhappy and the romance has died
and it's unfortunate and it's sad.
If they were so spiritual, it's like you would think.
That would be something that they'd be able to be more
connected about in a way, but I just think it didn't work.
It's scary to talk about like, I don't want that to happen to me.
I know it's. Like, at one point they were
hiring marching bands and pilots to do these big gestures.
He was putting his arm around her in a on a hot summer night
at the bar, and one thing led to another.
Like what happens? I know I.
I mean, I feel like there's probably so much we don't know.
And also, I'm not married, so I'm not a marriage expert.
But just what she said about like, expanding, still growing.
I do think when you're in a relationship, it is still
important to make sure you're still doing that good.
To do things on your own and you don't have to feel like
tethered. It shouldn't feel that way, I
don't think. I don't know.
I feel like that happens a lot in relationships, but this is
so. Bad I feel like for me to
speculate, but I almost wonder if.
You know how they talked a lot about how they didn't have a
staff at their ranch and they did all the chores?
And obviously that's good because they were very
traditional in that way and down to earth.
But I almost wonder if they, like, outsource some of the more
mundane things. Do you guys think then a couple
would have more time to, like, spend with each other to work on
the romance? You know what I mean?
Like, OK, OK, it seems like the richest people have the most
relationship. Issues sometimes, actually.
I don't think it would make a difference, I agree.
You sometimes, you know, I agree.
You sometimes think those household chores are the things
that are causing all this stress.
But you're right. It's like you could have all the
free time in the world and still not really be getting along.
Yeah, something to think about. Anyways, it's 2008 and Meg does
an interview with in style and she opens up more about the
divorce. She says it was a great story,
but what wasn't in the story was the reality of my marriage for
nine years. Dennis was not faithful to me
for a long time and that was very painful.
I found out more about that once I got divorced.
Yeah, isn't that interesting because she said.
She said before he never cheated on me.
I can't believe people would even say that.
And now she's saying years later that he did cheat on her.
What? I mean, I.
Believe it. Probably.
I mean, he was a famous actor. It happens all.
It literally happens all the time.
It's. Crazy like so shocked the wife
cheated. The The husbands do usually
cheat in a lot of these stories that we cover.
He's a big celebrity. So, but it's I think the
shocking part is that she had previously.
Was he was she protecting him or like did she just find out
later? I wonder how she found out.
I don't know. Oh, so then Dennis is not happy
that she said this though. And he goes to the Daily News
and he says it was eight years ago and I find it unbelievable
that Meg continues publicly. To rehash and rewrite the story
of our relationship. Also, I find it regrettable that
our son Jack has to be reminded in a public way of the turmoil
and pain that every child feels in a divorce.
I myself moved on years ago and am fortunate to have a happy,
beautiful family. It was eight years ago.
Move on. I hate.
That's like, really? Belittling something, I know,
Yeah, it's tough because he is using some good weapons here.
Like, yeah, you're right. You know, that's upsetting for
Jack, but yeah, that is a good weapon.
On like, yeah, her reputation was tanked because people said
she was cheating. And then, if it is true that you
were too, I think she has the right to set the record straight
100. Percent like, how dare you let
her take the fall for this? Yeah, if you were cheating on
her. I know.
I. Like I do.
That is a good point about Jack. I can see as a parent being
like, why are you bringing this up?
But he can't be that obtuse to be like, it's like, it's like,
you know, this has followed her around for eight years now.
Even him saying it was eight years ago.
Yeah, that's eight years that her life has been changed since
this happened. It makes sense that after all
this time, she's going to set the record straight, right?
Oh no, It's crazy when, like, later on, it gets messy.
I know. Oh man, I'm sure like that
might. Come hand in hand with maybe
like other disagreements that they might have when it comes to
parenting, they also live far. It's kind of somewhere to
marriage story. Like I think she went to New
York. He's spending a lot of time in
LA and Montana. I bet there was like strife
arguments that arise in that situation.
She she goes on to say in this article that Russell Crowe as
she said in the Oprah interview, wasn't the reason for the
divorce and she said I think he took a big hit but Russell
didn't break up the marriage. He was definitely there at the
end, but it wasn't his fault. I was a mess.
I hurt him too at the end. I couldn't be in another long
relationship. It wasn't the time for that, so
I got out, so maybe we can. Cover them someday.
But, she goes on to say in the interview, I am not a victim.
My time as a scarlet woman was really interesting.
As painful as it was, it was also incredibly liberating.
I didn't have to care about what people thought, and it was
always really so curious to me. It's an old fashioned idea, so
anachronistic I understood it was a conflict.
Meant about being lovable. And it felt nice, you know?
But it also felt after time, like ideas were being projected
onto me that had nothing to do with me.
The girl next door to what? Interesting, I know.
It almost seems like she did feel like trapped in a way by
her persona and like being lovable.
And I think there's a part of her that did kind of enjoy
breaking out of that. Yeah.
Wow. Then in 2011, she.
Started dating musician John Mellencamp and they were off and
on for a while and she later got engaged to him.
But they broke up in 2019. Why do I feel like I've heard of
him? Yeah, I do too.
Mellencamp. He does the song.
Jack and Diane. Yeah, that's him.
It's from the 80s. Oh, you're right.
The. 80s guy. Yeah, you're right.
OK. Yeah.
Yeah, yeah, we know him. Yeah.
Jack and Diane, so yeah. Then in 2015, Meg made her
directorial debut with the drama film Ithaca, in which she also
stars opposite, once again, Tom Hanks.
I think they must be super close and her son Jack and Jack.
So it's a coming of age drama about a teenage boy played by
Jack and his newlywed, widowed mother, played by.
Meg and it's based on the book of the same name.
And in an interview, Meg said that she first read the book
during her divorce from Dennis and that she really connected
with the story because she was very concerned about her own
divorce and how that would affect Jack.
And she said that she related to the book because the grown-ups
in the community didn't necessarily have all the
answers, but they were always there for the there for the
transitions this young man had to make.
And I think she was very concerned as a mother, like she
knew from her own parents experience that divorce really
affects the child and was really worried about that with Jack.
That's interesting. And then Jack.
Yeah, he's now a famous actor. In 2016, he went on a podcast at
23 years old, and he says it's one of those weird ages for your
parents to get divorced. So this was looking back on when
he was nine or eight years old, he said you're old enough to
know what's going on, but young enough to be kind of naive about
it. It's a whole deal.
It's hard to ignore when you're at a grocery store and you're
checking out and you look at magazines and there's a photo of
them with a little paper rip graphic between them.
It's a hard deal. Wow, I know.
That's sad. That's crazy to like, actually
have to see that. Your two parents like your mom
and your dad? I feel like I I can't even
imagine I. Cannot imagine I know.
Put myself. In his shoes, that's crazy,
because I feel like it's already such a big deal if you're a kid
and then to like, see reminders of it.
I wonder if it almost like makes you like, desensitized to it or
something. I feel like it.
Would make me so nervous though. I know like whatever my parents
are telling me. And then if you see something
different written in the magazine.
I might be scared. Like, what's the truth?
Yeah, you're like, can I even trust my parents?
So after the breakup, like I said, Meg's career seemingly
never really was the same again. She was in significantly less
movies. And then after 2015, she didn't
work at all until this past year, Like, she didn't do any
acting at all. And in October of this year,
2023, she said, I took a giant break because I felt like there
were just so many other parts of my experience as a human being I
wanted to develop. It's nice to think of it as a
job and not a lifestyle and that is a great way of navigating it
for me. But she also just like, admit so
she also turned 40 and there were just like less roles that
she was interested in that were available to her and probably
the role she. Did get offered.
She wasn't interested in. Yeah.
And just at this point, she's already achieved a lot of
success. I feel like she doesn't really
care about, like chasing anything else.
She's like very much about looking inward than chasing
anything outward, I mean. If I had the money, I would love
to pursue random things, yeah. I never think it's that.
Weird when actors stop acting. I know.
Yeah, it's a lot of work. If you could just chill, why
wouldn't you? Yeah, exactly.
She has hobbies. Yeah, you can travel.
She still gets money. She's fine.
Yeah. Yeah.
I don't blame her. It's kind of it's almost nice.
It's like, OK, now I have an excuse.
Yeah. But the last thing I have is in
2018 Dennis was on Andy Cohen's show and Andy asked what his
relationship with Meg was like and he said we're friendly.
Yeah we are. Obviously we did a really good
job Co parenting because look at the result and that's nice.
I think they are. Friendly, but yeah, that is when
Meg Ryan met Dennis Quaid. Wow.
I I feel like this could be a movie.
I mean, it's like, yeah, a lot more.
I I don't know. I mean.
It's not going to have that happy they end up together
ending, but it's nice that it seems like now they're OK with
each other. Happy, but it doesn't seem like
they're like friends or anything.
But I think they're fine with each other, yeah, yeah.
Isn't she in a romantic comedy that's coming out this year?
Yeah, So that's like the first role she's done.
I was at reading about it actually seemed pretty good, but
I totally forget the plot now. I know.
I kind of want to see it. We should see it.
We should, yeah. But yeah, definitely not, you
know, when Harry Met Sally in real life.
And I guess that's. Expected you.
Can't. I expect her to literally be
those characters. I know.
I think she is really cute and like lovable and stuff.
But yeah, she's definitely a little bit more guarded and I
don't know, that's crazy, I feel like.
I kind of, when I was younger, missed the whole thing.
Those years of her being like a scarlet letter woman, I that's
the thing. I'm I'm guessing people who were
older than us at that time, like they remember it better, but it
seems like society has moved on from it now.
Yeah, I think so. I don't.
I never hit people talking about that when she comes up, so.
Wow. Well, that is really
interesting. I didn't know any of that.
So thank you, Mel. Yeah, thanks for listening.
I can't wait to see pictures of her and Dennis.
Yeah, they had. For the week that we promote
this, They had such a cute look like, I feel like people.
There's this one time they were on the red carpet and they both
wore matching pantsuits. Iconic.
I can't wait to look at pictures of them.
Oh my gosh. Well Mel, do you want to tease
our bonus episode that will be on Patreon next week?
Yes, next week. It will be a little bit more
recent and we're going to explore a very short lived
engagement that should be a drink as well, a short
engagement, a broken engagement, broken engagement.
Yes, I'll add that to the, I'm going to add that.
Yep. And.
It was. I guess people thought this was
an unlikely pairing at the time they did.
An odd couple can't. Wait.
And as always, we have bonus episodes every other week.
I'm sure you can see them in the feed.
You can subscribe just for a little bit.
Listen to them all. You don't have to stay forever.
Of course, we would love it if you stay forever.
And we have polls now on our Patreon too.
And yeah, if you if you enjoy this podcast, if you've been
listening for a while, we would super appreciate it if you give
us a review. Feel weird asking for that but.
They say you. Should.
But All in all thank you Mel. This was an awesome episode.
Thank you guys, and we'll get back together next week.
Get back together. Next week, woo Hoo.