Are you lonesome tonight? Do you miss me tonight?
Are you sorry we drifted apart? Does your?
Hi, guys. Hey everyone.
Welcome to significant lovers. Welcome, welcome.
This is a true love podcast. Yes.
About real relationships. We investigate the stories of
real life relationships, and today we're doing a big one.
This has been one that I think we've wanted to do for a long
time, but it was kind of intimidating.
And I just decided, OK, it's time to do them.
So this is Lindsey Buckingham and Stevie Nicks of Fleetwood
Mac. And in case this is your first
episode, I'm Kelly Kell. I'm Mel.
And I'm Kate or Caitlin. And we're cousins.
And sisters, we're related. Yes we are related.
My mom is sisters with their mom and we are best friends.
We also have a another cousin slash sister Shannon who is not
a host on the pod but we want to give her a shout out.
I hope you listen to this. She was on a previous episode,
the Julie Berry and Jeff Propst episode, so if you want to hear
from her, you can listen to that episode.
She was also a background audience member slash hater on
our Harry Styles and Louis Tomlinson episode, so you can
hear her a little bit on that episode as well.
Slash hater. I wanted to give a shout out to
a couple of our new patrons. Yay.
Three Lorena, Nikki and Prisa. Prisa, thank you, Thank you,
thank you. Thank you so much for joining.
Do we have any trivia this episode, Kel?
Don't hate me, but no, I don't. I'll have it next time.
I'll have it next. Time.
Actually, I have one. Oh really?
Yes. Which couple first confirmed
their relationship or it was first confirmed in the media
their relationship on April 1st, 2004?
2004 We did this, didn't we? Nope.
No, that was the couple that broke up on April 1st.
Which couple first confirmed 2004?
I'm gonna say Ben Affleck and Jennifer Gardner.
Nope. OK, 2004 and.
This is a couple we've covered. Yep.
Beyoncé and Jay-Z. Nope.
Good guess. Good guess.
Blake Shelton and Miranda Lambert.
No, it was Will and Kate. Oh my God, last.
Week. Was that in?
Was that in the episode? It was in the episode I was
listening to it this morning. But we didn't really acknowledge
it. No, you didn't really
acknowledge it. And I was remembering that there
was a trivia question about April First previously, so I was
like, oh, that'd be a good one to bring up.
Oh, that's so. Funny, it must have not meant
anything to me. Like I probably just said April
first, not even thinking about April Fool's Day.
That's. Very.
That's. Super recent.
Well, yeah, if you. That was that was the headline
where it was like Prince William finally has a girlfriend.
Oh, that's so. Funny.
Wow. April first is significant for a
lot of our couples. Like there have been, yeah,
engagement news on April 1st, breakup news, new couple alerts.
It's crazy, Yeah. What's up with that?
What's up with that?
What's up from SNL?
Yeah. Lindsey Buckingham was on a skit
of what's up with that? So.
Wuzzy OK, Connect OK, so let's get into the couple 'cause
people are people are are dying to hear about this couple.
This has been one of our most requested episodes, actually.
So guys, you're in for a treat. And Kel, what are the three
words that you would use to describe them?
The three words I would use to describe Stevie and Lindsay
would be OK. This is a phrase but twin flame.
OK. Competitive and nostalgic.
Now, I don't know if you have heard much about the twin flame
idea. It's kind of one of those new
age hippie concepts. But you know, it's thought it's
kind of like soulmate. It's thought that there's two
souls cut from the same cloth. You know that they always will
care about each other, but sometimes that flame can burn
too bright and can even be kind of toxic.
Carrie and Big. So yes, it's both negative and
positive at the same. Time.
It can be, yes. It can be negative.
And I feel like I've never really thought that about a real
life couple, which, granted, we don't actually know Lindsay
Buckingham and Stevie Nicks, but they kind of remind me of like
Chuck and Blair or Lestat and Louis from Interview at the
Vampire Show. Yeah, big and carry, not not as
much. It's not as volatile for them, I
would say. But kind of like they, even when
they're apart, they are obsessed with each other.
Even when they hate each other, they are obsessed with each
other. And there's always this love
deep down, you know what I mean? And I think that's Stevie and
Lindsay. I got really obsessed with this
couple. Caitlin was saying, I always do
this, but I feel like there's been a couple that I've
researched like of Scott and Zelda Fitzgerald, obviously
Charles and Camilla kind of little bit Taylor like where I
just get so in deep and I've been like listening to Fleetwood
Mac nonstop. So I'm really excited.
They're definitely far from perfect and have a lot of
problems, but I really ship this couple, so I'm excited to get
into it. Yeah.
So Stevie and Lindsay, in case you don't know who they are and
they were part, well, one of them is still in Fleetwood Mac.
One of them is not. They were from the rock band
Fleetwood Mac, probably one of the most iconic bands ever.
Early in Fleetwood Mac's existence, the band had a
revolving cast of band members, so they actually had 10 albums
before Stevie and Lindsay joined the band.
But in the period we're talking about, Fleetwood Mac was
comprised of Mick Fleetwood, who's on drums, John Mcvie on
bass, his wife Christine McVie on piano and vocals.
So all three of them are English.
And then there's the Americans, Lindsey Buckingham, lead guitar
and vocals, and Stevie Nicks on vocals.
Also, in case you don't know, one reason this couple is so
famous is because of the album Rumors, which I'm sure you do
know. Some of the songs on it like
Dreams, Go Your Own Way, The Chain, Don't Stop, Never Going
Back Again, Secondhand News. Oh my gosh, it's such a good
album. And, you know, the legend goes
that everybody in the band was breaking up during the making of
this album, but you're going to get to hear what was actually
happening and what that was like in this episode.
So you're going to dispel the rumors or rumors?
Yes, yes, yes. But more than Rumors too.
We're going to talk about before they were in Fleetwood Mac, even
the album before rumors and after Rumors.
And so this is going to be Part 1 because this story spans like
5 decades and I could not fit it all into this.
So next week on Patreon, we're going to continue the story.
And I got to say, Part 2 I think is just as, if not more exciting
than the rumors days. I think it's so crazy.
Yeah, it is. So definitely stay tuned for
that. And if you're not a patron, sign
up to hear it. OK.
Yeah. My sources for this just really
quick. I mostly use this book, Dreams
and Many Lives of Fleetwood Mac by Mark Blake, The Ledge
website, the Buckingham Nicks Tumblr.
That's a great source. The book Stevie Nicks, Visions,
Dreams and Visions, Dreams and Rumors by Zoe Howe.
And I got to say this book. So this is like a biography of
Stevie Nicks. She chose to focus on the the
1st 2 pages to focus on Stevie and Lindsay.
So that just shows how integral that is.
Yeah. Like she didn't write about just
like, Stevie's solo career, her childhood, whatever.
Nope. She chose to focus on her and
Lindsay, so it's a big deal. But who are they who really need
to take a sip of water? I need to calm down.
Yeah, take a breath. It's too.
Excited. I'm too excited.
I'm nervous. So Stevie Nicks, iconic singer,
right? She's this witchy woman,
brilliant lyricist. You know her songs.
Landslide Edge of 17 Dreams Rhiannon Silver Springs.
That's Stevie Nicks. She's small.
She's 5 foot one I think. I don't know why sometimes like
to describe how people look. I don't know.
In case people don't know, she has a beautiful little face, I
think brown eyes, blonde, often permed, WAVY curly hair.
And she dresses a lot in shawls and lace and long dresses, lots
of black. That's why she gets the witchy
reputation. But she also talks frequently
about things like visions and such.
So it goes beyond the outfit. In interview, Stevie's very
matter of fact, almost blunt. She seems kind of tough, but
cute and sentimental at the same time.
Romantic too. I can kind of see why our mom
Kate is like obsessed with Stevie Nicks.
I I see some similarities between them.
But she's also been called the baby of the band and that was
kind of her role. I don't know that everyone was
like protective of her. And she also kind of got away
with a lot of things, I would say.
Because of her personality or because of her age also?
I think that her age as well. I mean, she was actually older
than Lindsay, but by one year, but she was still the baby.
She was born Stephanie Lynn Nix May 26, 1948, in Phoenix, AZ.
Yeah, so Stevie is just a nickname.
You thought that that was like on her birth cert?
I did. I don't know.
I thought she was born as Stevie and you know.
Yeah, no, she's really Stephanie.
Her father was the VP of Greyhound buses and that caused
them to move around a lot. Really so?
Take a drink, Yeah. Yes, and mostly around like the
Southwest California, I would say, But they did move a lot and
that's one of the key ingredients to being a star, as
we've learned on this podcast. Even though he worked for
Greyhound, I wouldn't expect him and to be moving around a lot.
They literally had to get on Greyhound buses and move around
a lot. Yeah, I don't know, maybe he was
like opening new branches or something like that, you know?
Yeah, 'cause I don't know what a Veep he does, you know.
Yeah, I don't know. He also has a younger brother
who she seems to love very much. Growing up, Stevie loved to
perform, dance and sing from a very young age, and she would
always write and had Diaries. In high school, she acted very
herself. I think she was very cool.
She dressed Gypsy even back then, she said later in life, if
you talk to people that went to school with me, they would say
she's a little crazy. She loved music and she was
interesting. I think I was very interesting
to everybody. So she's not exactly humble,
too. In 1966, her parents moved to
San Mateo, CA, where Stevie would attend the Menlo Atherton
High School in 1966. And she was very well liked
there. She was the runner up for
homecoming queen her first year there, and one night her senior
year she went to a Young Life church meeting for students,
which was kind of just something to do.
Kids would go and sing and play music on a Wednesday night.
I feel like I would go to stuff like that at the church.
I don't know what. Like mom would just drop us off.
Like it was just some kind of really youth night thing.
Like, I don't, yeah, I don't know.
I don't remember. Maybe not senior year, but like,
really. Yeah, I definitely did.
Anyway, she was at one of these low key youth group night things
and she saw a stunning teenage boy with curly hair and intense
blue eyes. He was playing guitar and
singing California Dreaming, and that was Lindsey Buckingham.
If I didn't know anything about these two people, I would assume
that Stevie Nicks is the man and Lindsey Buckingham is.
It's so interesting how both. Their names.
I know I love it. I love it, friends, when Joey's
reading Little Woman and for the longest time he thinks Lori is a
girl. And Joe?
Is a boy for some reason, I don't know how like went over
his head but. I like the comparison, Lori and
Joe. But yeah, it's funny how that
works. That's how it was.
Yeah, I was talking about this the other day at the party, how
it's kind of, it was a Southern thing, I guess, but there used
to be a lot of guys names that now are never really used for
men, like Lindsay or Ashley O Leslie, really, Ashley, I think.
Yeah, because I think they used to be.
They were surnames originally, I think, and then they kind of
became first names for men and then they became first names for
women. I know actually doing all this
research now, I like love the name Lindsay.
For a guy. I think I think it's cool, yeah.
I don't know. Maybe also because my boyfriend
seems Charlie, I feel. I mean, that's a nickname, but
I'm kind of used to like the E sound for a guy, so I don't
know. I like it.
I think Lindsay works better than Ashley because I think
Ashley's just been so Co opted by I guess the females or
whatever. Ashley, Ash is dark Ash.
Ash is, you know, a dark thing. Yeah.
Is that where the name? Ash comes from Ashley I.
Think maybe I don't know like from.
Pokémon Ashley like ASHL EE or something I don't know what.
What are you trying to say? Maybe if it was just spelt
differently, I don't know. What for What?
I think that's more feminine. Masculine, you think?
Yeah, definitely. I don't know.
I think Renee too. I mean, that's a French name,
but I think that used to be more for men and that was more of a
woman's name. I mean, really, names can be,
you know, they don't have to have any gender.
I I like names to be If you really like a name, name your
kid that. The only thing is kids.
Some kids, unfortunately, might get made fun of if their name is
a girl's name. So Lindsay, Lindsay actually had
two older brothers, Jeff and George.
And he said, I don't know why I got called Lindsay.
Maybe my mother had some intuition that I was going to be
weird. Maybe they thought they were
going to have a girl or something and then that didn't
feel like. No, changing the name was it was
a guy's name. There's also Lindsey Graham.
Oh yeah. What's that?
I. Forgot that that was his name.
Lindsey Graham, Politician. Republican.
Yeah. When, who?
Where? He's, you know him, isn't he
from? Like is he from he's?
From. He's like friends with Trump,
you know? Senator from South Carolina.
That's that's Yeah, I don't know.
Well, that's another Lindsay. That's true.
The thing is, when I hear the name Lindsay, I pretty much only
think of Lindsay Lohan. So.
I know I actually almost said Lindsay Lohan the other day when
I was talking about it. So this is then count as second
Lindsay we've covered. Yeah, this is.
Well, he does spell it differently.
It's SEY, not AY. But does that count then if it's
different spellings? Yeah, I would say it counts.
OK. Yeah.
So Lindsay Adams, Buckingham, he's, you know, he's one of the
singers. There's three singers in
Fleetwood Mac, him, Stevie and Christine McPhee.
He's one of the singers and the lead guitarist.
He also had a solo career. I would describe him as
immensely creative. He's also been described as
jittery, always needs to be occupied, sort of a control
freak, stubborn, but seems overall optimistic.
And he has been called intimidating.
And according to Christine McVie, Lindsay's not really
close friends with anybody. Ken Callay, I know Ken Callay
was their sound engineer. He's also the father of Colby
Callay, remember? Yeah, their sound engineer.
Is. Yeah, I know.
I didn't know she was a nympho baby.
Well, anyway, he described Lindsay Buckingham as
extraordinarily talented, Extraordinarily annoying.
Oh, you. Know he was born October 3rd,
1949 in Palo Alto, CA. As I said, he had two brothers,
Jeff and George. His father ran a coffee roaster
called Alta Coffee. I don't think it was like hugely
successful, just kind of, you know, most cities have their
small coffee roasters. So that's what he did.
And Lindsay taught himself guitar at age 6.
Lindsay has super curly hair. In the 70s he wears wore it very
long, like a fro. And he had a beard too.
So he has like all this hair was just his face poking out.
But later in the 80s, his curls are shorter and he's clean
shaven. And I gotta admit, very
attractive. I was getting really attracted
to Lindsay Buckingham while recording, which, you know, I,
I'm a millennial, you know, I didn't know.
I'm sure anyone older listening will be laughing at me, but I
just. I didn't really know what he
looked like so. Yeah, you really only know
people as whenever. OK, you know what?
I don't even know where I'm going.
Well, yeah, he like he wasn't in our teen magazines growing up,
you know. So anyway, as I said, he was at
that event playing that church event, playing the Mamas and the
Papas song California Dreaming, when the New Girl joined in
Stevie Nicks. She started singing with him and
harmonizing with him, and he was like, whoa, who's this?
He was actually a junior and she was a senior, and I'm guessing
they talked and hung out, but they didn't really reconnect for
a while. She graduated and started going
to college nearby. Lindsay was still in high school
and he was in a band called Fritz and they needed a singer
at some point. And he remembered Stevie and was
like, hey, what about that Stevie girl?
And she was still in the area. So they asked her to join and
Stevie joined the band Fritz. And they were in Fritz together
for four years. And the band actually did pretty
well on the local scene. They opened for Jimi Hendrix and
Janis Joplin. Wow.
Yeah, they recorded a demo, but it went nowhere, I guess.
But Lindsay and Stevie weren't dating yet.
Apparently. None of the guys in the band
were allowed to ask Stevie out. And it was like a rule they had
and they both were in relationships, too.
But she has said, I think there was always something between me
and Lindsay. So, you know, they had that demo
album they recorded and there it didn't go anywhere.
And the producer told them, you know, I think that you 2 are
really talented and you guys would have more success if you
were a duo instead of in this band.
I think you should go to LA and be a duo and see how that goes.
And so they had to leave their band and they felt really bad
about that. But I guess they I think they
were just more talented than them or something.
So Stevie and Lindsay moved to LA and then this is like when
they started dating. I don't know if it's because now
they weren't in the band and they're like, OK, the guys won't
get mad at me or something. Or probably they were kind of
pushed together by this producer.
I don't know. But this is when they got
together. So now they're living together
and they're. In LA and they were roommates
and they were roommates and they were writing songs together, I
think. So they went to LA.
I think it was like one of those confusing things where it didn't
really work out and they came back to the Bay Area and they
because I read that they also worked in Lindsays daddy's
coffee plant after hours. So you know it, I think that it
was one of those confusing timelines where they went for a
couple months and came back. But I just thought it was cool
that Lindsay said in the coffee plant.
He said we'd drive up there at 7:00 at night and leave at 3:00
in the morning. And that's how we ended up with
10 songs and that's how we fell in love.
Sweet. And Lindsay's dad actually died
when he was 21, which it's really sad.
I know. So then they finally, like they
moved to LA for real together. Stevie's parents were not happy
about this at all, that she was giving up college to go live
with a guy, but she was doing it.
She wanted to be a star. Lindsay ended up getting mono.
Mels had mono so bad that he couldn't sit up.
He didn't even have the strength to strum his guitar.
So that's actually how he got so good at finger picking.
Like he is a legend for his finger picking style.
Like if you know and never going back again, like songs like
that, it's because he would just lie there on his bed with his
guitar, like on top of him and all he could do is move his
fingers. And that's how he got so good at
it. Wow.
Forgive me for being like ignorant because I've never
gotten mono and I know nothing about it, but since they were
together, how did he get mono? Can't you get it from, like,
sharing drinks from people? But yeah, how did she not get
it? I don't know.
What do you know about that, Mel?
Yeah, everyone, by the time you're like, in your 30s,
everyone has been exposed to it. But it's just like COVID, like,
some people are symptomatic and some people are not.
So she might have already been exposed to mono and just had
like, an asymptomatic reaction to it, or she might have had
like, just like a cold in the past, and that was her version
of mono. But yeah, it's really not like,
you know, they say the kissing disease, it's kind of random how
you get it. You don't necessarily like his?
Yeah, I don't think. He was cheating if that's what
you're. OK, no, that's what I was
thinking. But like, oh, all I know about
mono is from that one episode of Glee when Finn and Quinn get
mono. So that's like all I know about
it. And so I truly, really.
Bad Danielle can tell you. Oh my God, yeah.
When you get it bad, it's the worst guy.
I was just. Curious like, not that he
cheated, but like how he got it. And then like, I don't know how
she didn't, you know? She was probably lucky, she
probably had antibodies from somewhere.
I mean, maybe she had a mild form.
That's the thing, I had mono super super bad when I was 19
and it ruined my whole life. Yeah, I think it really does
that we need to spread awareness.
No, seriously, like people trivialize it so much as like a
young teenager kissing disease. Like it's the cold or something.
No, yeah, it is horrible. You will be.
If you have a bad, you will be out of Commission for like over
a year. It sucks.
But then some people I knew got it and they were like fine after
like a week. And that annoyed me so much
because it'd be like, what's wrong with you?
Why are you still sick? Yeah, but I, I think Lindsay had
it really bad. And there was this.
I mean, OK, I don't know that much about Lindsay before this,
but I feel like it did really affect him, like mentally as
well. And during this time, he wrote a
song that ends up being a Fleetwood Mac song later called
I'm So Afraid. I actually love this song.
It's so good. But he's like, I'll never
change. I never will.
He says I'm so afraid of the way I feel.
And it's like a super dark song. And I don't know.
He wrote it during this time, but he also wrote a pretty
instrumental song called Stephanie.
So that's nice while they were living in LA.
So I guess he gets better and he sits up and he's able to play
guitar. Stevie would work as a Hostess
or a cleaning lady to pay the bills while Lindsay stayed at
home and practiced guitar and wrote songs.
And this is after he has mono. So he he is better, I think.
But it does seem really unfair that one of them, you know, he
was just staying at home and like smoking pot and working on
guitar and she was making all the money for them.
But I guess they felt like they needed one of them to be good at
an instrument in writing the songs.
I don't know. But it is unfair because later
in life Stevie's criticized a lot for her lack of
musicianship, but she really never got the chance to get
super good at guitar because she was making the money while
Lindsay was at home. He was like the good guitars or
something. I know, I don't know.
He could have worked, he could have worked on the weekends or
like. He didn't work, she just paid
for everything. I mean I think he did have an
inheritance but still like it. It does seem uneven and she has
said about this. I ironed his jeans and sewed
moons and stars on them and made the House Beautiful.
I was the cleaning lady. OK, there's no reason to iron
his jeans. No, that's going a little extra
for. That.
Well, some of them. Are you just saying you
shouldn't iron jeans at all or she doesn't have to iron his
jeans? Yeah, he's home.
What the heck? He's home all day.
Also, yeah, like, why does he even need to wear jeans if he's
home all day? Who wears jeans at home?
Actually, Kelly. Does I do, I do and I do irons
on my jeans. I don't even own that.
Either, you know, the more loose leg ones, like they get wrinkly.
I guess, but again, like who's he trying to impress?
If he's just at home or he's just around, I don't know.
I think Lindsay does care about his appearance.
He's not really the type to just be in sweatpants.
I think, well, you know what he can learn if if he's home, I
know, I know he can learn how to.
He can he. Can learn to iron his own jeans.
I think that Stevie's point wasn't necessarily that like he
was a brat. I think she just like, was
devoted to him, like she loved him.
You know, I think that's just her point with that quote.
I don't want to generalize but I did read once somewhere.
Again, I don't want to stereotype and apply gender
norms, but actually like a lot of women think that if they do a
lot for a man, that that will make the man loyal to them or
make them love them more, you know, like, but almost like
treating them the way their mother would.
But it's actually the opposite. A man will love you more when
he's given the opportunity to do stuff for you because then he
thinks, I've invested all this work and it just like
psychologically makes them think, oh, I must like, I love
this person because I've done all these things for them.
But if you do a lot of stuff like that, like bend over
backwards to basically be their mom, they'll just like take it
for granted and like won't even really recognize it.
Not all men. Again, I'm not one generalize,
but just something to keep in mind that, you know, you're no
one's unless it is your child, You're not their mother.
And they, yeah, I don't know, they won't even notice that,
Like their clothes are put away for them.
I think that that somewhat did play into their relationship,
actually. It's funny you say that because,
you know, they would go on to record together a lot.
And whenever Lindsay had a bad day in the studio, he would kind
of like, go to Stevie for comfort, kind of as if she was
her mom or something. And she would be like, I'm, you
know, I can't. Sometimes she would agree with
whatever criticism the band had. And it was like a tough place to
be. Like he wanted her to like, take
care of him basically. But she was in the band too.
So it's it was just a weird dynamic.
But anyway, back to their LA apartment life.
Finally, their duo. They were calling themselves
Buckingham Knicks. They got a contract with Anthem
Records, which was a small independent label that was like
an offshoot of a bigger label. And they recorded an album
together. And I think it all went fine.
But there was one issue, which was the cover.
The photographer said it wasn't sexy enough and wanted them both
to be topless. And Stevie said, I'm actually
quite prudish. So when they suggested they
shoot Lindsay and me nude on the cover, I could not have been
more terrified. Lindsay was like, oh, come on,
this is art, don't be a child. I thought, who are you?
Don't you know me? I did it because I felt like a
rat and a trap. But she regretted it.
And then from then on, she told herself she would never let
herself feel pressured into doing something like that again.
Yeah. Yeah, so their debut album,
Buckingham Knicks, was released September 1973.
And yeah, so he's topless. They're both topless.
You can't really see anything. Like her shoulder is kind of
covering her chest. But it, I mean, it is kind of
shocking that they're just out there topless.
People say this album is really good and I really want to hear
it, but you can't stream it. It was never made into a CD.
You can't buy an iTunes or anything.
It's out there on like some vinyls if you can find it or get
it on eBay or something, but it's not like available really
today. And that's partly because of
Stevie's current feelings for Lindsay and being unwilling to
go through the process of publishing it again.
So that's why you can't hear it. Is there something also that
spoiler connected to the spoiler?
Like the topless nature of it also.
Maybe. But OK, here's the weird thing.
I'm jumping way ahead. Kind of recently on her
Instagram, Stevie posted a picture of it and was like, I
mean, how many years ago was that 40 year anniversary of it's
our anniversary of Buckingham Knicks?
Like she posted it. So I don't know if I don't think
she is that bothered by the cover anymore I feel like.
A lot of older celebrities do that, though.
Their Instagram is just like a lot of like throwbacks.
Yeah, maybe. Maybe somebody else did it.
Maybe it wasn't even. Her.
Yeah, yeah, she might be paying someone to.
Yeah, especially if she is, I mean, you're going to get into
this. So I don't know the full story.
If she is hesitant to re release it, it would be weird to be like
40 years celebrating this album that no one can listen to, you
know? So it seems like it would
probably be like some paid employee who's running her
Instagram. Yeah.
Oh, an anniversary is coming up of one of her albums.
We're going to post it or whatever, you know.
I want to hear it though, because people say it's
basically like a Fleetwood Mac album in a way.
Maybe I'll buy like a $60.00 fine a little bit.
Oh, $60.00 that's not as much as.
Yeah, it's not that fit. No, there's.
Gonna be like 600. OK, the $60.00 ones are bootleg.
So somebody else like recorded it and then pressed it.
If you want to get like a real original.
I mean, some people say I was like looking on Reddit.
Some people say they just found it at record stores.
I don't know. I'm going to keep my eyes open.
Same for Lana, you know, her early albums are like that too.
They're just, some of them are out there.
You can get them on eBay for like $70.00 or something.
But anyway, randomly, I just have a bullet point here where I
said Lindsay has sort of a high pitched kind of Western, I guess
Californian voice, Stevie's voice a little Husky singing.
Lindsay is able to sing very high, almost feminine sometimes,
but also low. I don't know, I think their
voices sound very interesting together.
So even before they joined Fleetwood Mac, Lindsay and
Stevie started having issues. Yeah, As I said, there's a lot
of pressure being creative and romantic partner simultaneously.
And even though they were very devoted to each other, they were
also very competitive over whose songs were best and things like
that because they both would write lyrics.
Stevie only knew, like, a couple chords on the guitar, but she
would write the melodies. And then she would kind of like,
bring them to Lindsay, and he would flush it out and turn it
into more of a song. I guess in 1974, just to make
some money, Lindsay took a job playing guitar in Don Everly's
backing group. So he went on tour and while he
was the keyboard player in that band, offered Stevie his lodge
in Aspen, Co. So she made the 13 hour drive
from LA to Aspen just to get some time away from LA and chill
out. And I think it just sounded like
a cool opportunity. So she's staying at this guy's
house in Aspen, and this is when she started writing the song
Landslide. Like by herself.
Yep, I think she like visited a friend that lived there.
But yeah, she was just there by herself.
And so you know when she writes, I saw my reflection in the snow
covered hills. That's Aspen.
And she was, she was grappling with what to do in life.
You know, her and Lindsay had this album, but it was kind of a
flop. It didn't go anywhere.
And things were shaky with him. And you know, when she writes,
I've been afraid of changing because I've built my life
around you. That's about him.
I know. Did you guys?
See recently when Tom Brady posted the song to his story.
It was landslide. Well, it was landslide.
It was a cover. By the chicks.
But he boasted it to the story, like the day that the news of
Giselle being pregnant with another man came out.
So, so funny. I know, so sad.
He would just let the world. He would just let the world know
that he's like in his feelings. And I was like that.
It was like and it was specifically.
Like he made it on Instagram. You know how you like, you can
put the lyrics to the song, too. Yeah, it was specifically.
The lyrics that. Were can I handle the seasons of
my life like I think I think it might have been the I've been
afraid of changing cause I've built my life around you line.
Oh my gosh. The caption also was.
Just, Oh my God, he really wanted.
Oh yeah, it was three hearts. What was the caption?
Oh, I mean, doesn't that song touch everybody I know?
It's so good. And I feel like time and time
again, like all these horrible things they go through just
creates beautiful music. What were you going to say
though? I was going to say.
I don't know why. Like before I knew much about
Fleetwood Mac, I thought that she wrote that song later.
I don't know. Me too because I feel like.
I didn't know, I would think. That someone would.
Have more life experience to write that song almost I know I.
Didn't I? Didn't.
Realize that Fleetwood Mac really went back into her, I
guess, catalogue of songs. Yeah, yeah.
She had been worried because Lindsay was away on tour.
She was worried about groupies and such that he might cheat on
her. But for all of Lindsay's faults
that will come up, I don't think he was ever unfaithful.
OK, that's good. That's.
Good. I was kind of worried about
that. Yeah, but when?
He returned to Aspen after this tour.
For some reason he was in a very bad mood and I don't think we as
a public know why. We don't know.
But he was so mad and he left with the car that she had driven
there. So he drove back to LA and she
was just left stuck there. But her dad was the VP of
Greyhound, so he was very easily able to get her a bus pass.
And her parents ended up just getting her a flight back to LA.
But it was very dramatic, like something happened where he was
like, I'm leaving and he drove back without her.
And I'm not even in Fleetwood Mac yet.
It's already very turbulent. How did he?
Get to Aspen. I don't know, I guess the
Torbrus. Brought him or something I don't
or I I have no idea how he got there but some somehow he got
there. Well wait a SEC cause the guy in
the band lived there. That was the house she was at.
So I guess he maybe. Brought Lindsay back with him
and then. And that was their car I.
Think yeah, And then he. Ditched her there.
Yeah, he he left. Her That's awful so.
I know. So how did they join Fleetwood
Mac? The story.
Goes. Because Fleetwood Mac was
already a band that existed. They were an English Blues band,
so kind of different how we think of them today.
They were at the studio, I guess, working on trying to make
our next record, Sound City Studio.
And Mick Fleetwood was theirs. And he heard them playing and he
was really impressed. And Mick asked Lindsay.
Just Lindsay if he would join Fleetwood Mac because they had
recently lost their guitarist Bob Welch, and Lindsay was
hesitant to join. Actually, he really liked what
they had going on in Buckingham Knicks.
They had, you know, their album wasn't that successful, but they
had a little bit of popularity in Alabama randomly, But Stevie
said, are you crazy? We need the money.
Fleetwood Mac was already pretty successful band.
So Lindsay said, sure, I'll join, but you have to take my
girlfriend Stevie too. And Mick said yes, wow.
So Lindsay Stevie joined the band.
I think you could imagine, because Christine Mcvee was in
the band too, and she was one of the singers.
And I think you could imagine her feeling maybe a little weird
that now there's another female singer.
You know, she was kind of like the token girl in the group.
But I don't know. Apparently she was very gracious
and welcoming to Stevie and they became friends.
So they began working on an album together February 1975.
And Lindsay and Stevie I guess brought a lot of new excitement
and chemistry to the band. They had been struggling for a
while after losing a bunch of members, and they were really
happy that it sounded great, like these new members made the
band a lot better, they felt. And Stevie and Lindsay came with
a bunch of songs already written like Ran in and Landslide and
Monday Morning, and they just turned those into Fleetwood Mac
songs basically. So Mick Fleetwood, he was the
drummer. He was essentially the
bandleader. Like it was his band
essentially. Even though he had just joined,
he kind of had to tell Lindsay that.
Like, you know, it's, it's kind of my band because Lindsay had
so many ideas and opinions about what things should go.
So they're already having a little bit of tension.
I was going to. Say, because I feel like it'd be
so awkward to join a band and there's already members there
and then just be like, and here's all the ideas that we
have for it and like here's these songs you have and oh,
include my girlfriend and she can be singers and it's like he
just like took over if. You joined a band.
I feel like if that was me, I would really just like stick to
the sidelines cuz that's just kind of the person that I am.
Even if they asked my opinion, I'd be like, Oh no, it's like
you're banned. I don't know.
Like I just joined. Like no, I wouldn't even.
I mean how long I would need to be in a band before I would even
start to voice my opinion. To be fair to Lindsay, that.
Was his hesitation like he already had a vision like he
that's why he didn't want to join Fleetwood back in a way.
Like he wanted to have control over their songs and such.
And yeah, I think they just expected him to be a guitarist,
but he really came. Charging in I would compare.
Him to like Paul McCartney and The Beatles, if you remember
that like him saying like we should do this, we should do
this like, well you do this like telling people what to do, but I
feel. Like they.
Needed them more than the other way around.
It's so funny. Because.
As time went on, I think of the band as Stevie's band.
That would be a point of. Contention.
I know this sucks but. Like, it wasn't until recently.
And sorry to all the older generation people who may be
listening, but I didn't know that Fleetwood Mac was named for
people in the band. Yeah, yeah, it's Nick.
Fleetwood and then John Mcvie. That's where the name came from.
But I had no I know. It's confusing because.
I think Stevie and Lindsay are the stars of the band.
Are they the two people who are on?
The cover of the Rumors album. No, Caitlin.
Asked me that the other day. Actually, no, that is Mick
Fleetwood and Stevie. Oh, OK, So these songs that they
brought to the table ran in landslide.
These ended up on the Fleetwood Mac album, often called the
White Album. So we're not at rumors yet, but
this is such a Yeah, well, it's called Fleetwood Mac.
It's like self-titled. I know.
It's weird. It's just like The Beatles.
They have. I know.
I was going to say the. Self-titled I'll you take.
That from the you know and this one, it it looks stylistically
kind of similar to rumors the cover, but this one has just
John and Mick on the cover. It's it's such a good album.
But even then there were jealousies and dramas starting.
Stevie was jealous that Lindsay and Christine had written the
song World's Turning Together and she is quoted saying I had
been with Lindsay all these years and we had never written a
song together. I think she means like the
lyrics. Was that by Choi?
I guess, yeah, I mean I. Think Lindsay and Stevie had
always like separately written lyrics and melodies and then
they would like come together and flesh it out.
But in this case, Lindsay and Christine like sat down and
wrote World's turning together. And she was jealous of that.
So this self-titled album was a huge success.
It had hits like Monday Morning, Landslide, Say You Love Me,
Rhiannon and the band went on tour.
And so, you know, we've heard about drama happening with
Lindsay and Stevie, but John and Christine McPhee were having
issues too. And their marriage actually did
not make it through this tour. They were going to get divorced.
Oh my God. Just.
Crazy, I know. Lindsay and Stevie were fighting
as well, and Stevie would find refuge with Christine.
You know, the two of them would be together kind of like the
girls versus the guys, but Lindsay was sort of out on his
own socially. He wasn't really buds with the
other guys, so he would just be in his hotel room, like
feverishly writing songs and struggling with demons and
roses, according to the Stevie Nicks book.
And Lindsay start to notice that Mick Fleetwood seemed attracted
to Stevie. They were always goofing off
together, and one day they were all smoking weed together and
Lindsay abruptly turned to Mick and said it's you and Stevie,
isn't it? And Mick just hammered I don't
know what you mean. And it was just never mentioned
again. What but that?
Would come back. It just feels like.
It's never a good idea to mix relationships with work,
especially. Being a musician.
I mean, not like work work. Like I think if you're working
an office job, yeah. I mean, sure, there's drawbacks
from that, but if you're into somebody and they're into you,
go for it. I wouldn't hold back.
But like Blake Shetland and Mariah Lambert, that didn't work
out. And then this is just it, just
chaos. Like you don't want your whole
career to fall apart just because you know of your
relationship, at least for normal people, for the most
part. Like let's say if you are
working in office, you could just find a job somewhere else.
But if your whole job is being a singer and being a part of a
band, what are you going to do? I know I feel like the only.
Thing with that is like it's almost unavoidable if you're
spending all this time together and you're attracted to each
other. Like I feel like the alternative
is you date someone else who's not in the band and then
problems arise because they're jealous that you're spending all
this time with someone that you have intense chemistry with.
And then you know one thing leads to another and you have.
One too many. Glasses of wine and next thing
you know it's. True.
So if you're. In bands just don't have a
romantic partner I guess is what the it's.
I think. I think it's hard, like Mel was
saying. I mean, I actually put this
later in my notes, but I was watching a lot of live
performances of them and I sent you guys some clips we're going
to watch later. But and Oh my God, we're almost
at an hour. What the heck?
We're only on Page 5. Playing on stage together.
It's almost like being at a party or like a club.
Like the music is so emotional. The bass, I mean, John McPhee is
amazing at bass. The bass is pulsing.
The lights are on you. You're next to each other.
You're singing how you feel, like I can just imagine.
How could you deny that? You know what I mean?
Like, it seems so passionate. Every night you're basically at
a party under these lights looking at each other.
Like I think it would be very hard to deny in a way.
So yeah, this self-titled album was hit and they went on tour
for it. And I almost feel like to
compare it to modern times, like just imagine, let's just pretend
like Chapel Ron was a band and you know, this album was super
successful. Imagine if like then she had
another album that was like even more of a big deal.
I feel like that's what happened with Rumors.
Like the self-titled was already really big, but then Rumours
happened and it was just crazy. But like, they were building.
They were building. And then this other one comes
out. I just have this quote.
So we're going to get segue into Rumors now.
But when Muncie Buckingham hears a song from Rumors on the radio,
he sometimes listens, but his knee jerk reaction is to change
the station because it dredges up subtext around the songs and
that's not always pleasant. And that's from that Fleetwood
MacBook mentioned earlier. This album is crazy, has
secondhand news, dreams, never going back again, don't stop, Go
your own way. Those are just the opening 5
songs. Then there's also the chain You
make loving fun. I don't want to know just so
good you can go your. Own way.
Go. Away.
Yeah, and you know. Everyone knows it already, but
everybody was breaking up. So John and Christine were
getting divorced. Nick Fleetwood and his wife,
Jenny Boyd, were splitting up. She's actually the sister of
Patti Boyd, who was married to George Harrison and then caught
with Eric Clapton. That one, Yeah.
So feels like her sister. Like deal with the devil.
Or something for fame that was like, you're gonna be famous and
successful, but you're all, yeah, divorced.
And break. Up and have a terrible romantic
relationship time of it you know I know it's one.
Of the other I guess. It was a balance, so they had a
lot of problems. During the making of this album,
obviously everyone was distressed and depressed and
breaking down and on drugs, copious amounts of cocaine.
But people will also say that it was kind problems stemmed also
from Mick being a poor leader, not necessarily just because of
the breakups, but I mean them had to contribute to it.
But Mick, I mean, he this was kind of a bad idea.
I think he rented a house for all of them outside of Miami to
record the album. Like, I don't know, like should
you all just be like in the same space constantly all the time?
I know, especially if they're. Like some of them are going
through divorce. Some of them.
Yeah, two of them. Yeah, two of them are married.
A married couple that's getting divorced.
I'm sure some of them can. You know, record separately,
yeah, but later on. They did move to San Francisco
area, so you know, Lindsay and Stevia are still together, but
they're starting to fight a lot. And there's one story about how
they were recording backing vocals for You Make Loving Fun
and they just both exploded for some reason.
Nobody remembers why, but Stevie yelled fuck you asshole, and
Lindsay said he's moving out of their apartment once Rumors was
finished. And then they just went right
back to singing. I wonder.
What was happening? I think that.
Lindsay could be kind of critical about the music and I,
I think they both were very sensitive.
I think that he was also jealous sometimes.
And Stevie, I think also was kind of flirting with Nick
Fleetwood and like, there was just a lot going on.
But Stevie was actually the one who officially ended it with
Lindsay. She couldn't really take his
moods anymore, and she is the one that broke up with him.
And in his own words, he said that he was devastated.
I think that even though they fought a ton, he didn't think
that they would actually break up, you know, and they had only
apparently only been together for four years, which I don't
know how that all fit into four years, but it did.
And Stevie, you know, she was becoming star of the show, as
you said, Mel, which really bothered Lindsay, especially
since Stevie only wrote really simple songs like the melodies
and kind of relied on him to turn them into full songs, even
the songs about him. So he was getting really annoyed
that, like, she just would be like, hey, I have this song I
wrote. And then he, he felt like he was
like, turning it into the hit songs.
And then she was getting all the credit for it.
And they were very competitive with each other.
So they're broken up. Christine and Stevie officially
move out of the house and rented their own apartments to get away
from the guys. Yeah.
And Lindsay was convinced that Christine was influencing Stevie
to break up with him. Like, as if it was this packed,
like, let's all, I'll break up with the men or something.
Even though they had broken up, though, Lindsay was still going
over to sleep over sometimes. So they were still together.
Yeah. Girl, you need to like put your.
Foot down or something. He was still sleeping.
Over people were just going crazy though, Like they weren't
sleeping. They were taking tons of
cocaine. Yeah, literally like working all
night. I I just imagine it being like a
total mess too. I think.
I think it was. How old are they right now?
I was going to ask that. OK, 1976.
Stevie was born in 1948. OK?
So she was 28. OK.
OK. 27. I guess I thought they were
going to. Be still in their early 20s by
this point, but. I was going to give them a.
Pass I was. Going to be like, they're still
in their early 20s. They're still figuring it out.
28 is. Early 20s Kate.
Yeah, Mel's 20. Eight.
What are you trying to say? They're ancient.
I didn't say she wasn't young, I just didn't say she wasn't early
20s. Yeah, yeah.
I know it's kind of cool in a way.
I like that they're not super young, but it's also a little
strange because it is so over the top and sometimes childish.
So we've talked about this a little bit in like the Phoebe
Bridgers episode. We were so mystified about like,
how the heck, Like how does Phoebe still?
How is she still in a band with her drummer who she used to
date? And she writes songs about him.
Like, how does that happen? And I feel like we, because
she's a more recent celebrity, we don't have insight into that.
You know, there aren't like biographies written about her,
but I feel like you can kind of get a little inside.
Look at what that's like here. Because, you know, Stevie and
Lindsay were writing about each other for this album while they
were breaking up, and you wonder, like, how the heck did
that happen? It wasn't easy, though.
It wasn't chill. It wasn't like they just showed
up and was like, hey, I have this song.
They wanted to be a very honest, I think in their songs for some
reason, but they were very afraid to share them.
And Lindsay would hide the lyrics from Stevie in case you
would object to them. Like the song Secondhand News,
which Lindsay wrote for months, it was just an instrumental
because he didn't want anybody to hear what the lyrics were.
And in the early versions of the lyrics, like in the demos, you
can hear he's sort of mumbling them.
Like he just doesn't want Stevie to hear what he's actually
saying, which is crazy because like, they're in this van
together and they have these secrets, you know?
You know she's. Weird.
Eventually, I know, I know. That would be like intoxicating
for me if I'm. Going through a breakup I got
like, you know like normal, normal people are like over
analyzing their social media or like their Venmo transaction.
I. Know, but we get to like.
Basically hear their diary and like what they're saying about
us. I would be waiting.
No, but like edge of my. Seat to hear.
That the better side. Of it would be able to express
your thoughts and be able to have them hear it.
Yeah, but under the guise of. Like artistic?
Creativity. Too like, under the guise of
like making art rather than like, just like bombarding them
with like your thoughts and. True, true, true.
Like. Annoying text message, yeah, but
I just thought. That was really.
Human and cool to hear that. I don't know.
I think sometimes I think like, how do these stars do this?
They just, you know, put their feelings aside.
But it sounds like it was very hard, obviously, that he was
hiding it. And the lyrics to that song
aren't super bad, but I guess, I guess they're kind of
vulnerable. He says, I know there's nothing
to say. Someone has taken my place.
And that would refer to Don Henley of the Eagles because
Stevie quickly started dating him.
And it's kind of funny because he actually has super curly
hair, too. I guess she's just like, just
like Lindsey Buckingham. And then he also in the song
says, I've been tossed around enough.
I'm just secondhand news. I don't really know what he
means by that, to be honest. He did.
Feel like he was kind of like not that important in the band
comparatively to Stevie. Oh, like she's front page news
and I'm just like secondhand news.
Like I don't really matter. Yeah, it's all about her.
Thanks, Kate. That makes sense.
That's what I'm just gathering from.
What you told no and it could be no, but I.
I was thinking only like in a relationship way and I couldn't
really figure it out. But I mean maybe in their
relationship he also. Also felt like it was all about
her. But that's just my
interpretation. I think that's good insight.
You know Stevie also wrote Dreams in the fallout of their
breakup, which is amazing. Song Thunder.
Only happens. When it's raining, players only
love you when they're playing. Although I do wonder if if she
meant player in a different way than we think player because I
don't really think of Lindsay as a player so I don't know what
would be. The other interpretation maybe
just like he plays. Games like mind games type of
thing, Isn't that what a player is?
Well, I think of a. Player as more like a guy that I
guess that is part of it but that he is like non committal
and and like. Like gets with a lot of people.
Yeah, but I don't really, I, I don't think that's Lindsay.
So maybe it was more literally like, yeah, someone that plays
with your head or something, like she got played.
And then Lindsay also. Wrote Go your own Way and Stevie
hated the line shaking up packing up is all you want to
do, but she had to sing it and do backup vocals for it.
But she hated it because it was like he was accusing her of just
wanting to go out and sleep around.
There were some songs that Stevie would approach him to
work on and he would say, no, I don't want this on the record.
And she would cry and yell I hate you so.
Oh my God. Wait, who are the members?
Of the band. OK.
So it's them two. There's Mick Fleetwood, who is
basically the it's his band, he's the drummer.
There's John Mcvee. He's the bassist and Christine
Mcvee, who's piano and also sings, and she's the right song.
And then that's it. Yeah.
Why does it matter? If Lindsay wants it on the
album, why does he get a say over everybody else?
He was like. Essentially the producer.
I don't know why, and I don't know how that happened.
Yeah, I don't know. I don't.
I don't know if the rest of the band got involved.
I know that sometimes Christine McPhee, I mean, she's a really
cool lady, but sometimes she didn't love Stevie songs.
So maybe she just would agree with Lindsay and say like, no,
like, I don't know, Also like. I know he was going through his
own divorce. I think that's what you said
earlier. But poor Fleetwood because he
just has these two couples that are probably just going through
things on the daily just constantly.
I don't know how he dealt with it breaking.
Down and screaming and he's. Yelling.
Too, And I don't know how, you know, screaming and crying the
other couple was, but I know I don't think they were.
Really, I think, OK, that's good, at least I think.
John and Christine. At least like in the studio were
a little more composed and just didn't really talk to each
other. Another song we have to talk
about is Silver Springs. Stevie wrote this song about
Lindsay and it was intended to be on the album but ultimately
it was cut because Mick. So Mick is still kind of in
charge because Mick felt like there wasn't room for another
ballad and that it was too long. It ended up being a single on AB
side of Go Your Own Way, which was like both Lindsay and
Stevie's breakup songs and Stevie was pissed when she found
out that this wasn't going to be on the album.
She like threw a fit in the parking lot.
Silver Springs is an amazing song and it was sort of a deep
cut for a long time because it was only a single, you know, But
it did get its shining moment in 1997, which we'll get to in Part
2 and we will look at the lyrics then.
So Lindsay said about recording rumors.
He said I still had to see Stevie every day and never got a
chance to get any closure. I still had to try and do the
right thing for her and in some ironic sense help her move away.
We were also aware that there was this calling, this destiny
that we needed to fulfil. Whatever was going on with one's
personal life was secondary to this calling.
They've talked a lot about feeling like it was destiny or
something that they had to be in Fleetwood Mac.
And yeah, as I said, like, he was upset that Stevie would
write these songs about him that were really bare bones, kind of
like, I feel like if I wrote a song, you know, like, I know a
couple chords, like. And then you know I need.
Help and he was annoyed that he would like help her with them
and then they would turn into these hits and they were more
popular than quote his songs. So he was starting to get
jealous and like resentful about that.
The band spent over a year recording his album.
It was total chaos working nocturnal hours and people only
working when they felt like it. Well, I was just going to say
like. Sorry, I keep having like all
these allusions to things and like references and stuff, but
no, it's cool, Elton. John and.
His partner? Writing partner Bernie Toppin.
Well. Bernie Toppin, he can write
lyrics, but he can't really write the like the instrumental
part of it, the melodies. He can't do that.
So he gives it to Elton and then that's kind of what it's like.
It's. Kind of the same thing, but it's
like obviously. Everybody is going to know the
person who, Yeah, I mean, people are probably are giving her
credit for writing the songs, but she's also singing them.
And everybody usually knows the singer rather than the person
who's, like, helping out with the musical arrangements or
helping out even with the writing, you know?
So there's no wonder why he's not gonna get full credit for
that. And I know that sucks.
That shouldn't be how it would be.
I know. But also they.
Are Fleetwood Mac like it's not like they're her single songs or
something. No, but she is one of the.
Singers, you know. Yeah, but also like, what about
John? Mcvie, like he's just playing
bass on everybody's song, like, and he's, he's not like crying
about not getting attention. He is writing the lyrics like
it's like he's using that. The lyrics are what connect
people, connect people. I'm not saying they're produced
in another way that people would necessarily love them as much as
they do, but those are the lines that people quote over and over
again. You will never get away with the
sound of a woman who loves you like she's still writing this.
I know. And she does write on her
guitar. She's not like, as skilled as
Lindsay on the guitar, but she does, you know, put the songs
together. So yeah.
And the reason she's not as good as Lindsay is because she was a
Hostess and he stayed home all day.
So it's not fair. Yeah.
OK. So February 1977 Rumors was
finally released. As I said, had Stevie and Mick
Fleetwood on the cover, which apparently upset the others,
which is understandable. I don't know why only two of
them are on the cover. Did they do like the photo
shoot? Without the others?
Or did they do a photo shoot with everybody and then the
photo that got chosen was only them two?
Or I'm not positive? But I think the reason it's just
the two of them is for some reason Mick wanted it to match
the other album, which just had two with one only two.
People. Oh, OK, OK, I guess I see, I see
the IT is a really. Cool cover, like I do feel bad
that others aren't on it but it is a iconic cover where you know
she's reaching with that like crystal ball and he has those
beard like wooden balls hanging between his legs I feel.
Like I've never known. You've never noticed?
That I never noticed. That was like a deep look and
that was. Apparently like a real thing
that he would wear balls. Yeah, fuck, I have never.
Noticed that before in my me neither.
It's a little cheeky. Saucy, he would actually wear.
That I don't mean, I don't think like.
To the store, but you know, just when they were.
That's still weird like. Just being.
Weird. That is very weird.
No offense, if anybody. Out there listening does that,
but really that's they were. Just being crazy and silly I
guess. So this was the. 70s after all.
Yeah, anyway. So Rumor is obviously a huge
success. It topped the charts in the US,
Canada, Australia. UKA won Best album 1977 at the
Grammys even. Even though I don't care.
About the Grammys, That's so cool.
And just as it was released, they posed for their
unforgettable Rolling Stone cover, which pictures them all
in bed together. I don't know if you've seen this
cover before, but looking it up, I think it's been replicated
many times. Like the Gossip Girl promos.
I remember. I think, I think they were
inspired by it, like just having a bunch of people in bed
together. Oh yeah, X-Files.
Has recreated that before. Really.
Yeah. It's.
Like it's become a. Trope.
Almost it definitely. Does because of the ex couples.
Didn't want to cuddle together and this was shot by Annie
Leibovitz, same photographer that did like the John and Yoko
cover where he's naked so she wanted people to be like
cuddling. But the ex couples didn't want
to be together so they switched pairings.
So Lindsay and Christine McVie were holding each other, Stevie
and Mick Fleetwood were holding each other, and then poor John
McPhee is just by himself. And.
Apparently, posing for this cover sort of ignited the flame
that led to Mick Fleetwood and Stevie Nicks having an affair.
Wait, how's that? But they weren't the ones that
were posed together. Yes, they were.
It was Lindsey. Buckingham and Christine Mcvee
were holding each other, Stevie Nicks and Mick Fleetwood were
cuddling together, and then poor John Mcvee was by himself.
And then her and Mick Fleetwood actually started a fling after
this. Oh my God, like they touched.
Each other and they're like, wait, I like this.
Yeah, because I guess the. Photo shoot took like hours.
He's also like. Naked it looks like.
I know. I mean, I don't.
Know if they're I think I mean he might have.
Like I don't think they're naked, I think, but he his he,
his legs are exposed and his top is exposed.
It's very racy. But oddly, even though this
happened apparently after the photo shoot, but they were still
there, according to Stevie, her and Lindsay got to talking about
how amazing it was that not long ago, so she had been a waitress,
actually a Hostess, but she said waitress and he didn't have a
job. But now they were on the cover
of Rolling Stone and she said. And we lay there for two hours
and making out. Finally Annie Leibovitz had to
tell us to leave. But in one afternoon she had put
me and Lindsay back together and planted the seed for Mick and
me. Yeah.
So OK, I guess I did. The photo shoot, they were like
cuddling with the different people in the band.
And then I guess afterwards something happened.
They were still there afterward. Lindsay and Stevie were like,
this was amazing or something. And then they like started
making out. I don't know.
But Lindsay has a different story about it.
He said that they embraced for about 15 minutes.
I don't know what that means. And then Mick came over and said
people were starting to get uncomfortable.
Maybe they were on. Drugs.
Yeah, I don't know. It's it's very weird.
She says that it that day it started for her and Mick, but
also that she made out with Lindsay for two hours.
So there's yeah, don't. Know not.
Reliable and he says. It was only. 15 minutes, so
don't lie. What happened?
Steve. Is kind of.
Yeah, Stevie is an unreliable narrator.
Like even there, how she said like waitress, like she had said
she was a Hostess because she wasn't good enough to be a
waitress. Like she often changes the
story. I think something happened
though, because he did say they embrace for 15 minutes.
But was that a hug? Was that making out?
I don't, I don't know. But Lindsay actually had
recently started dating somebody new.
And keep in mind Stevie was dating Don Henley from the
Eagles too. Oh, at this time I forgot about
that. Yes, and.
And now she has like a crush. On Mcfleetwood and making out
with. Lindsay wasn't Stevie was this
in another episode? Stevie talked to somebody and
was like, oh, in my day when I was young, I was it Kristen
Stewart? Who was this somebody?
Oh, maybe. Because she loved Twilight.
Yeah, I was. I've been thinking about that.
Have you? That'll be in part.
Two do. You know what I'm talking about.
I think so. Yeah, like I was defending
somebody saying yes, yes, I was defending.
Kristen Stewart her Was it Kristen my.
Day. Yeah, like in my day.
Like I've cheated, but everybody I've been with like, has
forgiven me or something. So they're like, there's been
overlap, you know? So.
So maybe she was with that guy, but was like, it's fun, Yeah.
She's like I. Made.
Out with. Lindsay at the photo shoot today
and then the Eagles guy was like, it's OK, Stevie, you know,
I don't. Yeah, I guess.
So I love that she loves Twilight I.
Know. It's so cute.
That'll be in Part 2. Yeah.
So Lindsay had recently started
dating a woman named Carol Ann Harris.
She was actually a studio manager who was around when they
were recording rumors, and she was studying to become a sound
engineer. But sadly, she dropped that to
focus entirely on dating Lindsay.
You scared, you said. Sadly, she dropped no no.
Not as bad as. That, but she gave them her
career goals. I know, and they dated for
several years. But Lindsay, Lindsay said in an
interview, he said being in this band fucks up relationship with
chicks. Since Stevie.
I found that to be true. I could meet someone that I
really like, maybe have a few days to get it together and
that's it. The rest of the time I'm too
into Fleetwood Mac. Yeah, and even though he was.
With Carol Ann, for a long time, she did say that he was like so
obsessively with Mac and it was stressful having Stevie around
all the time. I can imagine.
But, and even though they just had that really passionate make
out when they went on tour for Rumors, any warmth between them
pooled a lot. Stevie said that they hardly
spoke and said we would get on and off the same plane without
interacting at all. And even though she was seeing
Don Henley, and even though he was married to Jenny Boyd,
Stevie and Mick Fleetwood stuck up a relationship in the final
leg of the Rumors tour in New Zealand, Australia and Japan in
December 1977. And this has been described as
the craziest time of their lives.
Mick and Stevie sneaking away together, You know, there was a
lot of drugs and booths and hotels, and it was just really
wrong and exciting. I think Lindsay claimed that he
didn't feel betrayed by Mick Fleetwood.
He tried to play it cool when he was asked about it by The
Independent because the public found out about it somehow.
And he said that he'd been surprised that it hadn't
happened yet because Stevie had had several boyfriends in
between. And he said that a couple times.
Like, I think he was really bitter that Stevie moved on
before him and had multiple relationships.
OK. And then in 1978, John McPhee
got remarried to a woman named Julie Rubens and Fleetwood Mac
attended the wedding. And this is where the affair
between Stevie and Mick really blew up.
First of all, Stevie showed up wearing a white dress to the
wedding, which is a tonal fuck off when Stevie is usually.
Like wearing all black. I know, right?
The one. Time she wears white and so
Mick's. Wife was there and seeing Stevie
just made her breakdown and she pleaded with Stevie to think of
the children cause yeah her and Mick had kids and Stevie was
trying to defend herself and then people came to see what was
going on and then Stevie left. I'm confused.
Think of the. Children.
Because she's wearing white. No, just she was.
There, I guess and like that they, I, I guess they were just
acting brazenly open together. I don't, I don't know, I guess
her presence just really obsessed, upset, I don't know,
maybe just walking into. The Walking.
Into the reception. She's like the bride just
breaks, no? I think, I think what happened
was it wasn't that bright. It was Mick's wife.
Sorry, there's too many people. I think Stevie showed up.
Mick is there with his wife and his wife knows that something's
going on between them and she like walks away or something and
is crying. And then he was.
But I guess it it was taking a long time where I don't know,
they were trying to work it out. Like, I don't know, sorry, I
should have clarified that. But they were like still
technically together. OK, now I get it.
Now I get. It now I get it.
Sorry, I should have said that. And so there's probably not.
That many like, yes, the band is together all the time, but she's
probably not around Mick's wife that often.
So this is probably when like they're all together and things
are coming to a head. And then the fact that she wore
white doesn't really have anything to do with Mick's wife,
but she's probably like, and on top of this, don't respect other
women. The fact that you are wearing
white to a wedding. Yeah, I think.
And she just looked beautiful. Apparently, Stevie and people
were complimenting her. And I think it just really
pissed Mick's wife off a lot. Understandable.
Yeah. But now it's time.
For another album. Tusk.
So Lindsay wanted to do something different this time.
Punk rock was really coming up in the late 70s.
Folk, the kind of music that Lindsay I really loved before,
like Simon Garfunkel and such, wasn't really as in anymore.
It was more punk and more gothic.
Things like The Cure was coming out.
And so he wanted to really push the boundaries and do something
different, entirely different from Rumors.
And I got to say, before researching, I didn't really
listen to Tusk that much. I knew the song Tusk, but it's
so good. I I think it's like such an
influential album. I mean, when I listen to it, I
feel like it sounds like 2010's indie rock, like it sounds like
group love and like MGMT and Edward Sharpe and Magnetic
Zeros, you know, those type of bands.
Like, yeah, it's so cool. Are there any notable?
Songs on the album I would say. Tusk.
Do you know Tusk? No.
It's like, don't say that you love me.
It's like a crazy song. It kind of sounds like the
circus. Yeah.
I'd say the other hit is Sarah. If that's a Stevie song, it's
like Sarah. I don't know.
But it didn't have a ton of hits.
And that's that was a problem, which we'll get to later.
And this was a tough time too. Lindsay was actually diagnosed
with epilepsy. He was having seizures.
And I, I kind of coined this, but I think he was having rage
attacks. Like he was just having like a
lot of angry episodes. And I read that because, I don't
know, I feel like earlier in the story, it didn't seem like that
happened. And then this started happening
and I was like, that's weird. Like, what are the odds he
started having epileptic episodes and then also being
really angry. And I read that the medicine he
took, one side effect would be being like, quote, an angry
zombie. And I don't know if people still
take this medicine. It was the 70s.
But he would kind of like, have these weird rages of being
angry. And he also completely changed
his look during Tusk. He shaved his beard.
He cut his hair short, he started wearing eyeliner, so he
looked a lot more like gothic and also wearing more like
Blazers. You know, a lot less hippie,
more, more gearing up for the 80's.
The band spent 13 months making Tusk and they spent over
$1,000,000 on that time. And it is a great album.
But as I said, they didn't have as many hits and it's a lot less
cohesive. Like the songs definitely sound
like, oh, this is a Stevie song, this is a Christine song, this
is a Lindsay song. And so you can kind of tell even
in the music that they were less cohesive than before.
I looked up the album. I don't like that they abandoned
the two people on the album cover.
Look, I know. It was just odd that it was.
So important for rumors like, oh, we need two people I know
for it and. Then for the next.
Time, I'm like, actually, we're completely, yeah, the cover, the
cover. Has like a dog biting someone's
foot. It's totally different I.
Don't know, you know. I think sometimes artists like
have to move on a little bit to you have to.
Change. I mean I get.
It but if if it's been like your thing for multiple albums up to
that point, like just keep with it, you know, I guess, I think.
Lindsay was afraid of them becoming, like, a caricature of
themselves or something, like they needed to change.
Yeah. So Tusk was released October
1979, and they went on tour right after that.
And of course, tensions were high.
They're always increasing, and they're getting in order with
each other. This was really bad.
They did a show in Auckland, New Zealand, and Lindsay was drunk
on whiskey plus his epilepsy medicine.
And he, I guess, was super annoyed with Stevie.
And he pulled his jacket over his head and started mimicking
Stevie's shawl and, like, dancing around pretending to be
her. And then he lay on the ground
under her, playing guitar and grinning.
And he just stayed there for three songs.
And then at one point he reached out and kicked her.
That's really like. Laying down I.
Know kicked up? No, I think he got up.
And then kicked her and after the show Stevie was running
after him, but Christine beat her and Christine McPhee slapped
Lindsay on the face and yelled don't ever do something like
that to this band ever again. Apparently everybody was freaked
out in quotes. And Stevie.
Cried. It's a good thing he.
Really good at playing the guitar on his back.
That's true. That's true.
But I. Wonder if it was like his
medicine that was making him act out or yeah, flared with like
drugs as well or what? But one of the the.
Stevie Nicks book I read kind of drew that conclusion that he
shouldn't have been mixing alcohol with his medicine and
that it was like making him just lose all control basically.
And he claims that he doesn't remember doing that.
And I don't think it's on video, but he said that he wouldn't
doubt that he did that, but he didn't remember.
And he said you have to understand that this was someone
I met when I was 16. I was completely devastated when
she took off. And yet trying to rise above it
professionally, I produced hits for her.
I had to do a lot of things for her I really didn't want to do.
If I kicked her on stage, sorry, it just sounds ridiculous to
say, but if I kicked her on stage, that was something coming
through the veneer. There had been a lot of
darkness. Yeah, I bet he.
Did do it, but I don't think it was.
Yeah, I think. So intentional like I don't
think. If he was completely stone cold
so we're in the right frame of mind, he would do it.
It's still crazy though. I don't know how we know this
but I guess she shared it with the world.
In one of Stevie's Diaries from the Tusk tour.
She wrote one more time on the plane.
Lindsay is a usual asshole self. I'm coming to the conclusion
that Lindsay and I are at an end.
So sad to see good love go bad. It's crazy because I think she
is with Mick and still kind of Don Henley at this time or maybe
that's over. It just kind of failed out with
Don Henley. I don't think they had like an
official breakup. But it's crazy that she's like
just now saying like it's over, you know, But a good love go
bad. That's something that I was
thinking about and that I asked on the pole.
When love turns to hate, I asked our patrons.
It's so sad when this happens, you know, when people love each
other so much that they will iron little moons and stars on
their genes and then they hate each other.
And how does that happen? And I asked our listeners, I
know I asked, is there anyone you once dated or had feelings
for dot dot dot that you now hate slash dislike, can't stand?
And 69% of you guys said yes, The vast majority.
That's crazy. I know 21% said.
Sorta. I'm actually.
Actually not. Surprised.
Yeah. Really.
Yeah, I honestly was. Like, duh.
I don't know. I know.
Yeah, I thought that was. Like.
But then I can see why some people would have past
relationships that maybe were amicable or it was more
bittersweet. Well, hey, there's some people
that are. Like I'm friends with all my
exits, you know? I don't know people.
What do they say the opposite of love is?
Indifference. I mean, yes, if you love
someone, pretty easy to hate them.
Yep, I. Think we only have two comments
so far, but I might revisit this next week to, Melanie said.
At 35, I can see that any of my exes were just I'll suited for
each other. We're right for the right for
that time it grew apart. Even if there are qualities I
dislike, I feel like that's their deal to work out.
If you asked me when I was younger, the whole the vitriol
might have been there though. And Lauren said I would say at
this point where I'm in a happy relationship, I harbor almost no
feelings of hate towards exes. Do we want to see them again?
Absolutely not. Do I hate them?
Also no, some exes absolutely deserve to be hated, but I'm not
there. Yeah.
Yeah, I feel like hate. Is a lot of energy that once you
let go of it, like that's when you truly move on.
But yeah, I feel like why? Why do you think that happens?
What that those stages of. Grief where you're really angry
at the person, most likely if you were broken up with and you
had dreams of being with that person and you wanted the
relationship to workout. And they're the one that credits
short. You're angry with them, and that
will manifest as hate, you know? So yeah, you're gonna hate that
person. Yeah, I also.
Think it's kind of, as Caitlin is saying, an important step to
hate the person. I feel like there have been
people who I've really been down bad for.
And then you got to make that list of every single thing you
hate about that person. You got to really like retrain
your brain to dislike them so much that you lose that
attraction and fondness for them all together.
And I feel like that's when you start to heal because you're
like, wait a minute, I hate them.
Like, I don't even like them anymore, which is so sad.
You know, it really makes me think of, I've been afraid of
changing because I built my life around you.
Like, how sad to like abandoned that old part of yourself, that
love that person. But once you let go of that,
like, that's when you truly can move on, or once.
You get that, like even just starting that ingling of hate,
that's when you have to be like, OK, delete their contact number,
block them on all these things. So then you don't go down that
route of actually like once that hate kind of dissipates, you're
like, actually it wasn't that bad.
Maybe I do want to get back with them or something like that, you
know? Yeah, but in their case.
They never got that space. Yeah, they're on tour buses and
planes together, Just constantly together.
I mean, think about how tough it is to travel with people.
Imagine having to do that with my God who you hate.
And I do think in a. Way it's easier or like, safer,
more comfortable to dislike each other.
Because imagine if they were like, seriously like bleeding
hearts still loving each other and having to deal with this.
Like, that would be just so painful.
Like, I don't even know how they would survive that.
I feel like it's almost like protection to dislike each
other. Oh, definitely, yeah.
By the end of the Tusk. Tour they had squandered most of
their money and not made much of A profit.
Mick Fleetwood was fired as band manager, which I bet was a
difficult conversation, but Mick also told Mick also, so Lindsay,
we're not doing this weird shit again next time.
And Lindsay and Stevie fled to make their own solo albums.
Oh. Solo.
I thought you meant. Together it's going to be like,
no separate. Separate solo albums separately.
They fled metaphoric, metaphorically, they're still in
the band, but they're like, OK, we're going to do solo albums.
But is. Fleetwood and Stevie still
together? Or is this kind of like they
are? They are, but Stevie then also
starts seeing another guy called Paul Fishkin.
It's just young. Yeah, Stevie.
Definitely. Like monogamy probably isn't for
her. I don't know.
Yeah, I. Do think Lindsay seems much more
monogamous than her? Like he dates this Carol and
girl for like, so many like eight years or something.
And yeah, they're they just seem a little different in that way.
OK, I have a little bit more, but I do have to go to the
bathroom. Is that OK?
Go piss, girl. I'm gonna go get water.
Hi I'm looking at pictures of. Fleetwood Mac right now.
I like actually. Lindsay's look for the Tusk
time, I feel like. Mick.
Fleetwood is kind of scary looking, like there's a lot of
pictures where his eyes are all bulged.
He reminds me of. Like Rasputin?
Yes. Yeah.
Rasputin scares. Me.
He looks somewhat. Like him?
Hi. What are you laughing?
About Caitlin just said that. Mick Fleetwood reminds her of
Rasputin. I can kind of see that.
But OK, my next thing I was going to say is.
That. That you know, Lindsay has a
solo album called Law and Order and he has this song on it
called Trouble. And I randomly became obsessed
with this song and this is the song that made me think that
Lindsay is so hot and. Mick Fleetwood.
Actually looks pretty good in him too, but I don't think we
have time to watch it. This video.
Oh, sorry, he's in the video. I'm like, I'm not explaining
things. Well.
Mick Fleetwood is in the video as well.
And yeah, I can see the Rasputin comparison, but well, Mel.
Said that Matt Fleetwood scared her and then I said he looks
like Rasputin and she said Rasputin scares her.
So then we started laughing about it.
I think he's no, he scared. Me because?
Incarnated if you. Look at photos.
From when they're young, his eyes are like all bulged like he
looks. Like he's like.
Purposely trying to look creepy. How tall?
Is he too? He looks.
Like he's wicked tall, 7 feet tall, yeah.
Oh, he's 65. I guess it's almost as high as I
thought, but still. 65 is pretty tall.
Most most people are not taller than that.
So 6 foot 6 on Wikipedia. Oh wow.
OK, so yeah, as I said, Lindsay had this solo album.
I think it did pretty well, but it wasn't like a social reset or
anything. It didn't change the world.
But not long after his album, Stevie released solo album
Belladonna. This is the one with the song
Edge of 17, which is huge. Yeah, God.
Sorry, what? I just saw a Really.
Creepy. Photo of Mick Fleetwood.
Yeah, that was the one. I saw.
What is it called? I'll copy it.
And Oh my God. No, but I've watched interviews
with him. I think he's not bad looking.
I think he has a pretty good face.
He's really cool image. Just Google.
Images Name You'll see a couple really creepy photos of him.
He's just. A.
Goofball. He's just trying to be weird,
like the the wooden balls I told you about.
Yeah. So on her Belladonna solo album,
she worked with Tom Petty a little bit.
And she, in the interview, gushed about how great it was
working with him. And she compared it to working
with Lindsay and how she couldn't write lyrics with
Lindsay. And she said, Lindsay and I have
so much behind us that it would be difficult to sit down and get
into lyrics. As it is, he asks me, who's this
one about? What are you talking about on
this line? What does this mean?
And who could blame him? Although almost anybody would be
able to answer Lindsay's first two questions with you.
And you, apparently, she gave Lindsay a copy of Belladonna,
signed with, like, a message to him, but he left it propped
against the studio wall for, like, a month.
And then she ended up just taking it back and crossed out
the dedication and gave it to somebody else.
Oh my gosh, I know. Also, I feel bad for.
Whoever got it second. Couldn't she have gotten
another? Copy Why did she have to like
reuse the mincey 1 I feel like. Thanks.
I guess in 1981. The band got back together to
record their next album, Mirage in France, and of course,
everybody was raging arguments nearly every night.
And it might make you wonder, why did they do it?
I was just about, you know why? Why do they just?
Keep doing it. I think it is because they did
realize, like, this was huge. Like, this band was truly
awesome. Like, the music was amazing.
And also the money. I mean, I think it was just too
much to walk away from, like such success.
I think they all thought about quitting, but they also felt
like, you know, how can I quit Fleetwood Mac?
This is like the biggest band in the world right now.
So I think that's why they kept doing it.
But now that they're in the post MTV world, they have to start
making music videos. And in The Mirage album, there's
the song Gypsy. And Stevie was annoyed that for
the Gypsy video, she had to dance and be kissed and caressed
by Lindsay, even though she said seeing him with another woman
made her feel absolutely I'll she didn't want to be near him
either. And did they not just come up
with? Like a different idea for the
video I know right have. To that's what I don't, I don't
know. I don't know who's in charge of
these things, music videos, but that was the idea and I feel
like they really wanted to play it up like, oh, Lindsay and
Stevie, you know, I don't know why she had to when the album
came out. Interestingly, if the covers for
The Mirage Deluxe CDs, there are pictures of Lindsay kissing
Stevies bare shoulder. Even though I think he's he's
still with Carol Ann, I think that her and Mick Fleetwood kind
of fizzle out by now. It's kind of weird.
They didn't have like an official like breaking up date,
but it was just kind of a transient relationship.
Then they had The Mirage tour. Stevie and Lindsay once again
we're having tension on stage. At one point, Lindsay appeared
to intentionally bump into Stevie with his guitar.
And here you'll get to see a little bit of the tension.
So I sent you guys some clips to play.
This is them performing Go Your Own Way.
And I just, I know we can't convey this over audio, but I'll
just play the song so you guys can hear it from 2:23 to 2:45.
Them just staring at each other and the intensity of it.
Eye contact. In this clip, I know they're.
Like stinging to each other. I could not.
Date Lindsay Buckingham if this was his ad, I know.
It's Stevie Nicks. OK?
I don't see what you. See in Mick Fleetwood too.
I'm sorry. I'm not, no.
I'm attracted. To Lindsey Buckingham, I'm just
saying that, OK, maybe we need to watch the Trouble video, we
can watch it on our own. Time OK, yeah, he just.
OK in the video. It I think it's supposed to.
Be like cheesy. There's a line of guys playing
guitar and there's a line of guys playing drums and Mick is
in the front and the way he's playing, he just looks so
confident and like casual and cool and I just thought he
looked good. I don't think he looks bad or.
Anything. I just think Lindsey looked like
that. It's yeah.
No, he doesn't. He does have crazy eyes when
he's playing the drums. He looks like he's having the
best time ever and he's like his eyes are going crazy.
It's kind of nice. OK, so then I I have another
clip right now is them performing the chain.
So this is around 2:30 and this is them looking very intensely
at each other while they're angrily singing If you don't
love me now, you'll never love me again.
Oh my God. Oh my God.
This keeps showing. Christine, it's like she's like
in the middle of it all. I see what you mean though.
What you said earlier about like you're at a club every single
night, like the wind is blowing, this is there's a lot of
emotions. It's powerful.
The adrenaline, the music's pumping.
I know what. It could be so.
Charged. I also feel like, OK, I've never
seen Fleetwood Mac, sadly, our mom has seen them many times and
she was showing me her photo album and mom also, I got to say
our mom loves Stevie Nicks so much and she back in the day,
she went to San Francisco for work.
She went to Stevie and Lindsay's high school, went into the
library, found their yearbook and took pictures of it.
And she gave me, she was looking everywhere for these pictures,
but she gave me the negatives. So I'm going to get them scanned
again with my film guy in town. But she that was how obsessed
she was. So she, you know, her Twilight
is like Fleetwood Mac. She's obsessed.
So I know. Yeah.
She's seen them several times. I'm so jealous.
I never have. But I did see this band called
In the Valley Below. Do you know the song Peaches?
Like one of the words swimming on the beaches, reaching for the
sweetest, sweetest Peaches. OK.
They're like a super indie band, but it is a couple.
And I saw them in concert once and they had that vibe.
It seemed like they hated each other.
It was so weird because it was known that they were a couple,
but like, one of them would like, try to embrace the other
and then the other would like, shun them.
Like it was just so strange and it it was actually
uncomfortable. So I don't know, I feel like
that does happen. And I kind of can imagine how
that felt like. So, you know, even though all
this is going on out of nowhere, Stevie shocked the world by
marrying her best friends recent widow.
So tragically, her best friend Robin died after having a baby
boy. I know.
It's so sad. I know.
I think she had leukemia. Oh my God.
And Stevie was just completely distraught and so was her
friend's husband. And Stevie wanted to take care
of her friend's son, Matthew. And so her and her friend's
husband just decided to get married.
And they they got married just like out of nowhere.
But were they romantic? I think they.
Were but Stevie said that it got really strange like so the guy's
name, strangely, his name is Kim Anderson, which like what?
It's just funny because again, it's kind of like a feminine
name or like traditionally feminine, but it just it got
very strange. Like he would think that she was
ROM Robin. Like they had a lot of
similarities, I guess. And like it turned into like she
was replacing her and it just, it really was dark and they were
they were not ready to make this kind of decision, I don't think.
I wonder what. Even spurned on the decision to
even get married. I think she just, she was.
So grief stricken she would just like to lose her friend that
young. I mean Stevie was 34.
I'm guessing her friend was around the same age.
Then it quickly turned into a disaster actually, and it only
lasted 3 months and then they divorced.
Yeah, very. Painful, and Lindsay was
described as horrified when he found out, but all of her
friends and family were concerned and didn't think it
was a good idea. Meanwhile, in 1983, Lindsay had
the 50s esque song Holiday Rd. for a National Lampoon's
Vacation. And I feel like that's probably
his biggest hit. And I texted you guys like I
didn't realize that was him. And then we.
Got in like a. Not not argument, but Caitlin
such didn't know that song and I was like, yes, you do.
Yes, you do. Yes, you do.
I do. Now.
But like, I don't know, for some reason, just based on the title,
I didn't. And I also said like I.
Well, I also. Said it wasn't like the.
Quintessential 80s song for me, like you said, it's one of the
first songs you think of when you think of the 80s, but I
don't think it's one of them for mine, for me at least.
OK, maybe that's. Maybe that's dramatic, but I.
I It is a classic 80s. Song 1984 Lindsay split from his
long time girlfriend Carol Ann Harris and he released a song
called Go Insane which was thought to be about her, but
later in life Lindsay said it was about Stevie Nicks still on
his mind. Apparently the band finally
reassembled for the first time in four years.
So this is 1986 to create the album Tango in the Night.
This time they mostly recorded at Lindsay Buckingham's house
and he ran a tight ship. This time it ended at 11:00 PM.
No more crazy all nighters and things like that.
Stevie was actually having frequent nose bleeds and falls
and blackouts from her incessant cocaine usage and she went to a
doctor and was told that she could have a brain hemorrhage or
even die, could die soon if she doesn't cut down on cocaine.
So later that year, she attended the Betty Ford Center for
Cocaine Addiction and then she was prescribed Klonopin, which
launched an even more difficult drug addiction for her, which is
really hard. 1987 Tango in the Night was released.
It has this hit song, Little Lies.
I don't know if you know it. It's it's on the radio.
Definitely tell me lies. Tell me, sweet.
Little lies, yeah, tell. Me.
Tell me. Lies the song everywhere in Big
Love. Stevie was upset that she wasn't
represented as much on this album, but Lindsay said in in an
interview, if you say it took ten months to a year to make,
I'm not exaggerating. We only saw her all of two
weeks, so I guess she wasn't as much involved in Fleetwood Mac
at the time. In the song Big Love music
video, Lindsay is mostly the star and it shows him being
romantic with this woman throughout it, while the rest of
the band is just kind of dancing and making small appearances and
I just wondered how Stevie felt about that.
And shockingly, Lindsay ended up quitting Fleetwood Mac after
Tango in the Night because he felt used.
Mick and Stevie were on drugs. He said that they were both so
out of it and he was fed up with giving his solo work to it and
he didn't feel appreciated. So he left Fleetwood Mac.
But the rest of the band did not want him to go.
I mean, he was a super talented songwriter and amazing guitarist
and, you know, he's part of the band.
So they had a meeting at Christine Mcphee's house to try
to convince him to stay. And Mick Fleetwood, he has an
autobiography. And in it he described this
meeting as a showdown. Lindsay said he'd given 12 years
of his life to the band and he couldn't do it all anymore,
which upset the rest of the band.
They're like all do it all. You don't do everything and.
Then Stevie told. Lindsay, you've broken my
fucking heart on this. And I guess this really pissed
him off and he tried to leave, but then she stopped him from
leaving the room in the doorway and he pushed her aside and said
get out of my way bitch. And fucked a lot of you, I know.
And then Stevie, this is I think all according to Mick Fleetwood,
so take that what you will. I mean, I don't know if we can
believe everything he wrote. Stevie ran after him outside and
grabbed him and he slapped her and they basically had like a
real fight. I know I did not know about
this, but it is crazy because, you know, it seemed like Stevie
didn't want to see him anymore. She was so done with this.
She wanted space from him. And then he tries to quit the
band and she kind of loses it and is like, no, you can't quit
the band. Like, you know what's up with
that? It's interesting.
But he did end up leaving the band.
He did reunite with them during the promo for Tango in the Night
and then they had the Behind the Mask tour, which Kate mom
actually went to. I saw and.
Her photo album? Pictures from that mom.
Apparently mom brought a sign to the concert that said we miss
Lindsay. What?
Did it say I'm not? Crazy like we.
Miss Lindsay or something, because he wasn't in the band
anymore and they did replace him with two guys.
So that does show, I guess, how impactful he was.
But I mean, that's so dramatic and I do hate to see people
physically fighting. I didn't know that was going to
happen when I was researching this, but Lindsay did reunite
with them because Stevie actually, I think at the end of
the Behind the Mask tour, she decided to leave Fleetwood Mac
too. She quit the band in 1990 and he
came back to do her last shows of Fleetwood Mac.
And so this is Stevie's last shows, December 6th and December
7th, 1990, they performed Landslide together and I sent
this clip to you guys. You can see in the video that
before they perform the song, they kiss on the lip, which it's
really short, But and then Stevie says it's kind of hard to
hear because it's a super grainy video and audio.
But she says I dedicate this song to Buckingham Knicks
because I hope he will find it in his heart to spend some time
with me again and maybe make some more music.
And they perform and near the end, she sort of opens her arms
as if to hug him, but he just kind of like opens his arms
further. It's it's kind of awkward.
It's like, I don't know why it seemed like he was kind of
avoiding hugging her. But then after the song ends,
they walk out arm in arm and I would like to dedicate it to
Buckingham Dicks because I hope that maybe someday he will find
it in his car to. Spend some time with me again
and maybe do some more reason. The actual performance like
isn't. That maybe because it's hard to
see. It's not like as emotional.
I mean, the song itself is emotional, but they're not like
there's less eye contact then. Yeah, there is.
But the. Yeah, that kiss in the beginning
is kind of cheeky, but also I commented.
I could watch hundreds and hundreds of versions of the song
live or recorded, cocaine loaded or not, and every single version
is so unique and charged with hundreds of different emotions I
can't help but cries. Theirs is the king of love
stories, and no song portrays the sadness and death of it more
than Landslide. Well put.
Oh, I see it. Ephah O'Neill wedding music from
15 years. Ago from 15 years ago.
All the comments are from like. 1516 years ago, yes, someone
commented. 16 years ago. No, she was definitely wanting a
hug. He was having none of it.
I feel bad for both of them. I don't know, I just.
Think the world might end when these two just stop singing My
God. So.
Neither of them are in Fleetwood Mac anymore.
They went from literally physically fighting each other
to kissing on stage. So that's the end of Part 1 and
Part 2 will pick up in the 90s. Wow.
Thank you guys for listening. Thank you Cal for.
All that research, I'm hooked. I can't believe how much.
There is. I can't believe that they're
broken. Up and there's more for Part 2 I
feel like if. Somehow we got into it all.
We'd be here all night or something.
If this is only I know. I know I could have like, no,
never mind. I couldn't have we.
I feel like that's. What I like about our podcast is
we really do do deep dives into these couples and sometimes that
means you like have to split up the episode or else, you know,
you're worried people are going to be like, well, you left out
this. You left out that and like
sometimes. You do have to skip details.
But. Yeah, that's what that's what
the show's all about. Learning more, you know.
Getting deep into it, I think a lot of people know that you
know, dreams or go your own ways about them.
But yeah, there's a lot of stuff that I feel like isn't talked
about as much. So it was fun learning about it
and yeah, I guess, I guess no teaser.
I can't really be too mysterious about it.
Who? Are we talking about next?
Next week will be about. Two people in Fleetwood bag.
That will be. Our.
Last, Not our last Patreon of the year, because we will have
another one after that, a special episode, but that will
be our last coupled episode of the year, Yeah, because we're
going to have. We're in December.
We always take a little break because it gets crazy with
Christmas and, you know, everything.
But we will still have our regular, regularly programmed
Patreon episodes. And the other December Patreon
episode will be kind of a fun bonus mystery episode.
Yeah. So basically this.
Is our last free episode of the year, so anyone who's listening,
who is? Not a.
Patron, we hope you have a wonderful holiday season.
You can totally become a patron if you want a little bit more
before. Next.
Year, but otherwise, I guess we will see you next year.
Yeah, yeah. Our Patreon could be a little
holiday gift you get yourself, or something you gift for
someone else, or something you put on your wish list for.
Others to buy you. Just think about it.
There is also a new. Feature If for some reason you
don't want to subscribe, I don't know why, but like, let's say
you only want Part 2. That's it.
You can buy it and you can have it for yourself.
So that's a new feature on there, but we love you guys.
So much and we'll get back together next week.
We'll get back together. Next week is your.
Heart filled with pain, Shall I come back again?
Tell me, dear, how are you lonesome to?