1 00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:02,320 You know how every home has that one spot, the place you think 2 00:00:02,320 --> 00:00:05,040 about throughout the day where you can finally exhale? 3 00:00:06,160 --> 00:00:08,400 For me, it's my bed. But here's The funny thing, It's 4 00:00:08,400 --> 00:00:10,720 not just my bedding anymore. Be honest. 5 00:00:10,720 --> 00:00:12,880 Who in your house tries to sneak into your bed the most? 6 00:00:12,880 --> 00:00:16,520 At mine, it's a toss up between my husband and my daughters. 7 00:00:16,760 --> 00:00:18,680 And I get it. Like, it's technically my 8 00:00:18,680 --> 00:00:20,600 husband's bed too, but it's my bed, you know? 9 00:00:20,920 --> 00:00:22,800 But I get it. Because of the. 10 00:00:22,800 --> 00:00:26,400 Cozy earth sheets and I have the silk comforter and the linen 11 00:00:26,400 --> 00:00:28,200 duvet cover on the silk comforter. 12 00:00:28,600 --> 00:00:30,720 It's like. Being the VIP. 13 00:00:30,840 --> 00:00:33,440 Lounge of the house. It's like sleeping on a cloud 14 00:00:33,440 --> 00:00:37,000 and being wrapped in a cloud hug and I just love it so much. 15 00:00:37,000 --> 00:00:39,720 In fact, as I'm sharing this with you, I want to go and lie 16 00:00:39,720 --> 00:00:42,720 in bed right now. Their sheets, as I've shared 17 00:00:42,720 --> 00:00:45,600 with you, are made from viscos from bamboo, and they naturally 18 00:00:45,600 --> 00:00:48,160 Wick away heat and moisture. So you sleep several. 19 00:00:48,160 --> 00:00:50,560 Degrees cooler. That means even on those nights 20 00:00:50,560 --> 00:00:53,880 when it feels impossible to get comfortable, I actually wake up 21 00:00:53,880 --> 00:00:56,000 refreshed. Thank goodness, because I need 22 00:00:56,000 --> 00:00:59,160 to wake up feeling that way. And it's not just. 23 00:00:59,240 --> 00:01:02,160 The blanket of course you can get any of their blankets like 24 00:01:02,160 --> 00:01:05,120 the bubble cuddle blanket or as I've shared, I have the silk 25 00:01:05,120 --> 00:01:06,400 comforter. It's a. 26 00:01:06,400 --> 00:01:07,760 Really true. Full. 27 00:01:07,760 --> 00:01:11,560 On experience, the bubble cuddle blanket in fact has such a plush 28 00:01:11,560 --> 00:01:14,840 texture and mid weight feel that it's perfect for curling up in 29 00:01:14,840 --> 00:01:18,480 the bedroom or draped across the couch as a cozy centerpiece for 30 00:01:18,480 --> 00:01:20,800 all of your guests. And we're approaching fall, 31 00:01:20,800 --> 00:01:22,920 which is my favorite. Season and then winter. 32 00:01:22,920 --> 00:01:25,280 Is my second favorite season, so that means that it is the 33 00:01:25,280 --> 00:01:27,520 perfect time. To cozy. 34 00:01:27,600 --> 00:01:32,120 PFI as I like to say your homes. And honestly it makes those 35 00:01:32,120 --> 00:01:34,480 mornings when you just can't get out of bed even harder. 36 00:01:34,480 --> 00:01:37,120 And that's kind of the point when life feels stressful. 37 00:01:37,120 --> 00:01:39,200 That's the spot I can't wait to retreat to. 38 00:01:39,600 --> 00:01:41,160 My cozy earth bed feels different. 39 00:01:41,160 --> 00:01:44,240 It's where my comfort and comfort for my family lives. 40 00:01:44,480 --> 00:01:47,520 And once you try it, I guarantee you you'll never want to go 41 00:01:47,520 --> 00:01:49,560 back. The best part of course is that 42 00:01:49,560 --> 00:01:52,320 there is 0 risk. You get a 100 night sleep trial. 43 00:01:52,320 --> 00:01:55,120 So if you don't love it, you can send it back, though I promise 44 00:01:55,120 --> 00:01:57,840 you won't want to. There is also a. 10 and your 45 00:01:57,840 --> 00:01:59,200 warranty because? Once you feel. 46 00:01:59,200 --> 00:02:01,360 This level of comfort, you want it to last. 47 00:02:01,560 --> 00:02:04,760 So do yourself a favor, head to cozyearth.com and use my code 48 00:02:04,760 --> 00:02:08,240 human HR for 40% off. And if you get a post purchase 49 00:02:08,240 --> 00:02:10,759 survey, let them know that you heard about cozy Earth right 50 00:02:10,759 --> 00:02:13,880 here, because your bed should be more than just a place to sleep. 51 00:02:13,880 --> 00:02:17,360 It should be your happy place to Cozy Earth makes that possible. 52 00:02:17,400 --> 00:02:19,880 Welcome to the bringing the human back to human resources 53 00:02:19,880 --> 00:02:22,240 podcast. I'm Tracy Chernoff, and I've 54 00:02:22,240 --> 00:02:24,640 spent my entire professional career in HR. 55 00:02:25,160 --> 00:02:28,280 Each week, we'll explore the delicate balance between people 56 00:02:28,280 --> 00:02:31,240 and business with the aim to reconnect the two and create 57 00:02:31,240 --> 00:02:34,160 meaningful outcomes. Listen in as I share my own 58 00:02:34,160 --> 00:02:37,960 experiences, challenge the status quo, and chat with guests 59 00:02:37,960 --> 00:02:41,000 from various industries about our mission to bring the human 60 00:02:41,000 --> 00:02:42,440 back to human. Resources. 61 00:02:42,480 --> 00:02:44,280 Hi, everyone. Welcome back to the podcast. 62 00:02:44,280 --> 00:02:46,480 Thank you so much for being here for another week. 63 00:02:46,480 --> 00:02:50,320 I have with me my esteemed colleague, although only 64 00:02:50,320 --> 00:02:52,480 colleagues in the podcasting space really because I'm not an 65 00:02:52,480 --> 00:02:56,680 attorney, but this is Brian. You probably, we remember him, 66 00:02:56,680 --> 00:02:59,640 hopefully know him by now because he joins me every month 67 00:03:00,000 --> 00:03:02,120 for a Policy Pulse segment on this podcast. 68 00:03:02,880 --> 00:03:05,720 And this week or this month, I should say, we're actually going 69 00:03:05,720 --> 00:03:08,240 to take a little bit of a different approach. 70 00:03:09,120 --> 00:03:12,480 We have some questions that have either been submitted or that 71 00:03:12,480 --> 00:03:16,440 we've kind of asked ourselves that we want to pose and kind of 72 00:03:16,440 --> 00:03:20,520 have a bit of a broader discussion about and on. 73 00:03:20,560 --> 00:03:23,440 And so, you know, naturally, if you've listened to these Policy 74 00:03:23,440 --> 00:03:27,640 Pulse segment episodes, you know that we generally kind of come 75 00:03:27,640 --> 00:03:31,640 packed with all of these recent legislative changes or updates 76 00:03:31,640 --> 00:03:35,960 or things that could be kind of coming down the kind of the 77 00:03:35,960 --> 00:03:39,360 funnel, so to speak, in terms of HR and policy and law. 78 00:03:40,200 --> 00:03:44,280 And so rather than doing just that, we're going to speak a 79 00:03:44,280 --> 00:03:46,680 little bit more broadly, of course, as I mentioned. 80 00:03:46,680 --> 00:03:50,520 And so one of the things that I that actually Brian and I were 81 00:03:50,520 --> 00:03:55,000 talking about offline just before is how some of these 82 00:03:55,000 --> 00:03:58,040 things that we've even reported on in the last several months, 83 00:03:58,480 --> 00:04:02,720 how some of these laws and policy changes or upcoming laws 84 00:04:02,720 --> 00:04:06,880 and policy changes are kind of pointing to a more localized 85 00:04:06,880 --> 00:04:11,920 effort or localization within the nature of HR and how we 86 00:04:11,920 --> 00:04:14,800 navigate some of these things. So Brian, I think I'm going to 87 00:04:14,800 --> 00:04:17,839 leave it to that. Maybe we start with how these 88 00:04:19,200 --> 00:04:23,920 some of these ideas and changes proposed by some of these states 89 00:04:23,920 --> 00:04:28,400 have localized our roles a bit more, whether it's HR or just 90 00:04:28,600 --> 00:04:32,520 kind of staying on top of the legal updates. 91 00:04:33,040 --> 00:04:37,480 Yeah, I think, I think the, the one of the easiest ways to sort 92 00:04:37,480 --> 00:04:42,600 of sum it up is that the federal government is in the process of 93 00:04:42,640 --> 00:04:49,440 deregulating laws related to HR policies related to HR employer 94 00:04:49,440 --> 00:04:53,320 employee relationships. Some States and cities are not. 95 00:04:53,640 --> 00:04:57,880 And so now as we were discussing just a minute ago offline, it's, 96 00:04:57,880 --> 00:05:01,920 it's like HR is hyperlocal. And it doesn't matter if you're 97 00:05:01,920 --> 00:05:05,240 only located in Texas, you're only located in Illinois. 98 00:05:06,120 --> 00:05:10,080 If you have employees in a dozen different states, you have to be 99 00:05:10,080 --> 00:05:14,200 hyperlocal in your knowledge of the laws in those States and in 100 00:05:14,200 --> 00:05:17,080 some cases in individual cities where you have employees. 101 00:05:17,560 --> 00:05:19,880 And that's kind of the, the thing that we've talked about 102 00:05:20,280 --> 00:05:22,560 for a few months now we've alluded to, and I think we 103 00:05:22,560 --> 00:05:25,120 probably said multiple times too, is that HR is becoming sort 104 00:05:25,120 --> 00:05:29,160 of a patchwork of, of laws and regulations. 105 00:05:29,160 --> 00:05:33,600 And employers need to be aware of, of that patchwork and 106 00:05:33,600 --> 00:05:37,360 understand what do I need to adhere to when I hire an 107 00:05:37,360 --> 00:05:42,320 employee in this new state? What do I need to adhere to when 108 00:05:42,320 --> 00:05:46,440 I advertise to hire a new employee in this state or hired 109 00:05:46,440 --> 00:05:49,520 nationwide? Like it's just, there's so much 110 00:05:51,120 --> 00:05:53,840 there's, so it, it's a tough time to be in HR honestly, 111 00:05:53,840 --> 00:05:56,440 because there's it, it, there's so much that you have to know. 112 00:05:56,440 --> 00:06:00,320 You have to basically get an on the job JD in some cases to to 113 00:06:00,320 --> 00:06:05,680 really really understand and and effectively implement some of 114 00:06:05,680 --> 00:06:08,120 these changes that are happening in both directions. 115 00:06:08,600 --> 00:06:10,480 Totally. And one of the things that I had 116 00:06:10,480 --> 00:06:13,120 said to you before we started recording was that in my 117 00:06:13,120 --> 00:06:18,600 practice, I look at what the most strict state or, you know, 118 00:06:18,880 --> 00:06:21,760 this is, of course, assuming just the US regulations, the 119 00:06:21,760 --> 00:06:24,040 most strict state, because you can't, by the way, you can't 120 00:06:24,040 --> 00:06:28,640 apply like US regulations to like Canada or other places 121 00:06:28,640 --> 00:06:29,640 around the world. Don't do that. 122 00:06:30,160 --> 00:06:32,600 But anyway, I take the most strict state and I'm like, OK, 123 00:06:32,600 --> 00:06:33,840 everyone's going to fall in line to that. 124 00:06:33,840 --> 00:06:38,520 Most strict philosophy, but what we've seen, which is interesting 125 00:06:38,520 --> 00:06:41,600 is that there are some states outside of California and New 126 00:06:41,600 --> 00:06:45,320 York which are the most notable for being the most strict or you 127 00:06:45,320 --> 00:06:49,280 know, most employee friendly, quote UN quote is that there are 128 00:06:49,280 --> 00:06:52,920 states that are starting to take strictness to a new level even 129 00:06:52,920 --> 00:06:57,040 beyond what New York and California typically adhere to 130 00:06:57,040 --> 00:07:00,280 or require from employees. So when I think about you use 131 00:07:00,280 --> 00:07:05,120 the word patchwork, I think about how in our roles, like 132 00:07:05,120 --> 00:07:08,120 it's true, if we have you could have employees in 50 states, 133 00:07:08,120 --> 00:07:11,720 especially if you're a remote employer and you have to be able 134 00:07:11,720 --> 00:07:16,240 to figure out, OK, well, is California or New York, are they 135 00:07:16,240 --> 00:07:19,280 the most strict in this thing that we assume they're the most 136 00:07:19,280 --> 00:07:21,920 strict with? Or is it Colorado or is it 137 00:07:21,920 --> 00:07:26,720 Hawaii or is it San Francisco, not even just California, right. 138 00:07:26,720 --> 00:07:30,560 And so I think there is an element there that puts a lot of 139 00:07:30,560 --> 00:07:35,280 ownership on us within HR. But then I also think about, and 140 00:07:35,280 --> 00:07:37,680 this is kind of what I had written down for us today is 141 00:07:37,680 --> 00:07:42,520 like beyond federal minimums, beyond the state and local laws, 142 00:07:43,000 --> 00:07:47,920 how do employers with this multi state approach, you know, kind 143 00:07:47,920 --> 00:07:52,920 of navigate the what could be conflicting or overlapping? 144 00:07:52,920 --> 00:07:55,280 Now, of course, something that's more strict, like I said, in my 145 00:07:55,280 --> 00:07:57,800 own practice, that's generally what everyone falls in line to, 146 00:07:58,640 --> 00:08:01,640 but it's a little tough if you're you have all of these 147 00:08:01,640 --> 00:08:05,760 multiple types of rules and laws and policies that you have to 148 00:08:05,760 --> 00:08:07,720 navigate. Like I think about pay 149 00:08:07,720 --> 00:08:11,920 transparency versus scheduling versus AI and hiring, like all 150 00:08:11,920 --> 00:08:17,000 of these things can impact a company in one sitting, but have 151 00:08:17,000 --> 00:08:20,240 different levels of strictness regardless of the state. 152 00:08:20,240 --> 00:08:24,360 And so how do you, how would you suggest that companies and HR 153 00:08:24,360 --> 00:08:26,080 leaders kind of go about navigating that? 154 00:08:27,160 --> 00:08:29,560 Well, I have an unsatisfactory answer to that. 155 00:08:29,600 --> 00:08:33,159 And it it is that it's, there is no easy way there. 156 00:08:33,159 --> 00:08:34,480 There is no great way to go about it. 157 00:08:35,520 --> 00:08:38,080 Your approach is one that I recommend to clients as well. 158 00:08:38,080 --> 00:08:43,000 Frequently everybody's a case by case basis, but broad brush 159 00:08:43,000 --> 00:08:44,680 strokes. Yes, I, I take a similar 160 00:08:44,680 --> 00:08:48,440 approach to you that if you have employees in say Texas, Florida, 161 00:08:48,440 --> 00:08:53,200 NY, Washington, IL, pick Washington, pick Illinois and 162 00:08:53,200 --> 00:08:57,640 just make it easy on yourself and abide by those, those, those 163 00:08:57,640 --> 00:09:01,000 laws. If you have more employees, if 164 00:09:01,000 --> 00:09:04,200 you have a more robust HR department, then maybe you split 165 00:09:04,200 --> 00:09:06,200 it up. Maybe you, you have different 166 00:09:06,200 --> 00:09:10,880 handbooks for different states or you have different addendums 167 00:09:10,880 --> 00:09:14,360 on, on your handbooks for, for different states to sort of make 168 00:09:14,360 --> 00:09:17,680 sure you're, you're compliant in each of the states where, where 169 00:09:17,680 --> 00:09:19,640 you have employees. And to your point, cities as 170 00:09:19,640 --> 00:09:22,160 well, because some cities have higher minimum wages, have 171 00:09:22,160 --> 00:09:23,400 different reporting requirements. 172 00:09:23,400 --> 00:09:25,320 So it's important to, to keep all that in mind. 173 00:09:25,320 --> 00:09:28,760 Again, going back to the hyperlocalness of the, of HR 174 00:09:28,760 --> 00:09:31,160 today, that that's kind of the record. 175 00:09:31,160 --> 00:09:33,440 I, I'm, I'm with you. That's, that's sort of my 176 00:09:33,440 --> 00:09:35,880 recommendation as well. It's not, that's what I mean 177 00:09:35,880 --> 00:09:37,600 when I say it's unsatisfactory. It's not. 178 00:09:37,760 --> 00:09:40,480 It's not easy, it's not simple, it's not efficient. 179 00:09:41,840 --> 00:09:44,240 You have to, you have to figure out what's best, what's best for 180 00:09:44,240 --> 00:09:48,040 your business, what's best for your employees, and what, what 181 00:09:48,040 --> 00:09:49,840 sort of the differences are between the states. 182 00:09:49,880 --> 00:09:51,800 Like if you have a state like Florida and a state like 183 00:09:51,800 --> 00:09:54,320 Washington, your differences are vast. 184 00:09:54,400 --> 00:09:57,560 So maybe it does make sense to have two different handbooks 185 00:09:57,560 --> 00:09:59,600 for, for your two different sets of employees. 186 00:10:00,880 --> 00:10:04,040 If the states are relatively similar and you're just in a 187 00:10:04,040 --> 00:10:07,600 couple of states, then maybe that's OK to to, you know, pick 188 00:10:07,600 --> 00:10:09,120 the strictest and and go from there. 189 00:10:09,360 --> 00:10:11,640 Again, it's it's sort of a case by case basis and it's 190 00:10:12,040 --> 00:10:14,640 unfortunately it's not easy. Yeah, totally. 191 00:10:14,880 --> 00:10:18,480 I am a big fan of addendums. I think that they solve a lot of 192 00:10:18,480 --> 00:10:22,160 headaches, you know, because it's like then each person in 193 00:10:22,160 --> 00:10:24,800 their own state can figure out OK, what's applicable to them. 194 00:10:25,600 --> 00:10:28,360 No, And I, I think that is that's pretty satisfactory. 195 00:10:28,360 --> 00:10:32,000 I think that that helps. And I've seen, I mean, in my own 196 00:10:32,000 --> 00:10:37,440 like kind of life helping people with their handbooks and 197 00:10:37,440 --> 00:10:40,720 whatever. I see some really terribly 198 00:10:40,720 --> 00:10:43,960 executed handbooks and handbooks are really important. 199 00:10:44,280 --> 00:10:47,360 And sometimes people are like, Hey, updated my handbook like 20 200 00:10:47,360 --> 00:10:48,160 years ago. It's fine. 201 00:10:48,160 --> 00:10:49,920 You're like, what, what do you mean? 202 00:10:49,920 --> 00:10:53,160 Like things are so different even from a year. 203 00:10:53,160 --> 00:10:56,080 I mean, really the best practice and at least in my, my book is 204 00:10:56,080 --> 00:10:59,680 to update a handbook every year, at least look for any particular 205 00:10:59,680 --> 00:11:03,160 updates that might be relevant. But there is, I mean, there's a 206 00:11:03,160 --> 00:11:06,760 lot of, there's a, there's a lot of pressure on HR teams, I think 207 00:11:06,760 --> 00:11:10,200 to, to be not only knowledgeable, but also 208 00:11:10,200 --> 00:11:13,800 compliant. And when I think about the the 209 00:11:13,800 --> 00:11:17,400 stigmas associated with HR especially, you know, where 210 00:11:17,520 --> 00:11:20,400 generally handbooks kind of fall into like HR operations and 211 00:11:20,400 --> 00:11:24,800 things like that, that it can just feel again, kind of tied to 212 00:11:24,800 --> 00:11:27,520 these stigmas that we're just focused on, like what the 213 00:11:27,520 --> 00:11:30,200 business and what protects the business and what, you know, 214 00:11:30,200 --> 00:11:32,920 makes what what businesses have to do to make sure that they 215 00:11:32,920 --> 00:11:36,840 don't get in trouble. And realistically, these are 216 00:11:36,920 --> 00:11:40,120 these regulations are also in support of employees, even in 217 00:11:40,120 --> 00:11:42,760 states where it doesn't necessarily feel that way. 218 00:11:43,120 --> 00:11:47,760 The intention is to at least have some sort of understanding 219 00:11:47,760 --> 00:11:52,120 of what is obligatory for a company and what an employee 220 00:11:52,120 --> 00:11:54,480 falls, you know, kind of falls into. 221 00:11:55,280 --> 00:11:57,720 You know, I think about some states like Texas and Florida 222 00:11:57,720 --> 00:12:01,760 that generally don't really have many employee friendly laws, but 223 00:12:01,760 --> 00:12:06,480 there are still laws there, like a minimum wage that are set to 224 00:12:06,480 --> 00:12:09,160 protect an employee in some capacity. 225 00:12:09,400 --> 00:12:11,800 Obviously it's hard to argue that when you compare to another 226 00:12:11,800 --> 00:12:15,440 state, you know, that might be more, again, you know, employee 227 00:12:15,440 --> 00:12:18,240 friendly, so to speak, But there's, there's a lot of 228 00:12:18,240 --> 00:12:23,640 ownership and, and I think that in like during COVID, we saw a 229 00:12:23,640 --> 00:12:27,560 lot of cuts in HR, especially, of course, recruiting, but like 230 00:12:27,560 --> 00:12:29,640 just in general, a lot of layoffs. 231 00:12:29,640 --> 00:12:33,800 Amongst HR teams. And now I, I wonder if there's 232 00:12:33,880 --> 00:12:39,080 any inclination in the business landscape that's going to really 233 00:12:39,480 --> 00:12:43,040 kind of require businesses to further invest in HR teams and 234 00:12:43,040 --> 00:12:46,200 not run so lean because most there isn't. 235 00:12:46,400 --> 00:12:49,920 I'm sure that everyone has brought this up even within 236 00:12:49,920 --> 00:12:54,320 their own like experiences, anyone listening who's in HR, 237 00:12:54,320 --> 00:12:56,760 but you know, there's always this like what's what is the 238 00:12:56,760 --> 00:12:58,800 ideal number? What's the magic number for like 239 00:12:58,800 --> 00:13:02,040 number of employees to number of HR partners, right? 240 00:13:02,440 --> 00:13:04,680 And a lot of companies, they can they. 241 00:13:04,680 --> 00:13:07,880 Run up to like. 300 employees with just a handful of HR 242 00:13:07,880 --> 00:13:10,000 people. And it's like, can you, can you 243 00:13:10,000 --> 00:13:12,840 really do that? It kind of depends on your, your 244 00:13:13,280 --> 00:13:15,320 distribution, I suppose of employees. 245 00:13:15,320 --> 00:13:18,000 But it's like, is that really the right way to go? 246 00:13:18,000 --> 00:13:21,720 You know, I don't know. Yeah, I, I agree. 247 00:13:21,720 --> 00:13:24,520 And, and I've seen it myself over the last, over the last 248 00:13:24,520 --> 00:13:28,600 decade or so too, that like there are so many, so many 249 00:13:28,600 --> 00:13:31,560 companies like you've said who are, who are in that multiple 250 00:13:31,560 --> 00:13:35,920 100 employee headcount range that maybe don't even have a 251 00:13:35,920 --> 00:13:39,720 dedicated HR team. And it's one of those things 252 00:13:39,720 --> 00:13:42,400 that it makes you, from my perspective, it makes you come 253 00:13:42,400 --> 00:13:45,880 in and think like, wow, it's amazing that you've gotten this 254 00:13:45,880 --> 00:13:50,720 far, not because HR is like this, you know, this, this 255 00:13:50,720 --> 00:13:54,360 revenue generating type type department for, for most 256 00:13:54,360 --> 00:13:58,760 companies, but it does help keep you compliant and which, which 257 00:13:58,760 --> 00:14:02,160 is a way of asset protection for businesses. 258 00:14:02,160 --> 00:14:06,400 So, yeah, and I think that that it's important to, to, to sort 259 00:14:06,400 --> 00:14:13,200 of, I'll mention 11 instance of sort of some recent news out of 260 00:14:13,200 --> 00:14:15,840 Washington. This was just in the last few 261 00:14:15,840 --> 00:14:23,040 weeks, a judge ruled that employees, sorry, candidates and 262 00:14:23,040 --> 00:14:28,600 job applicants can sue employers, private employers in 263 00:14:28,600 --> 00:14:33,960 the state of Washington if they don't adhere to the state's job 264 00:14:33,960 --> 00:14:37,840 posting requirements, namely the pay ranges that are required. 265 00:14:38,400 --> 00:14:41,640 And the unique thing about this, and the reason I'm calling it 266 00:14:41,640 --> 00:14:46,600 out is because applicants can be from anywhere and they don't 267 00:14:46,600 --> 00:14:51,400 have to be qualified. So you could just sort of troll 268 00:14:51,400 --> 00:14:56,040 Indeed and find applicant job postings in the state of 269 00:14:56,040 --> 00:15:00,600 Washington, see that there's no job range, salary range posted, 270 00:15:01,320 --> 00:15:04,440 and then sue that employer. Now, do I think this is going to 271 00:15:04,440 --> 00:15:07,200 be an epidemic of just people doing that and making a living 272 00:15:07,200 --> 00:15:08,200 off of it? Absolutely not. 273 00:15:08,200 --> 00:15:13,360 It's not going to be worth your time, but it is sort of a it's 274 00:15:13,360 --> 00:15:17,080 sort of a yellow flag that like this is Washington putting 275 00:15:17,080 --> 00:15:21,160 employers on notice that there are multiple ways that you can 276 00:15:21,160 --> 00:15:24,800 get into trouble for not following the rules of of 277 00:15:24,800 --> 00:15:27,560 Washington state. And so I think that's important 278 00:15:27,560 --> 00:15:32,840 to call that out just to remind people that if you're hiring 279 00:15:33,160 --> 00:15:36,320 nationwide or if you're hiring within the state of Washington, 280 00:15:36,920 --> 00:15:39,960 those rules apply. Much like Colorado. 281 00:15:39,960 --> 00:15:44,600 We've seen that in Colorado too, where employers based in Texas 282 00:15:44,600 --> 00:15:47,880 have posted a job on Indeed. It's a nationwide job posting, 283 00:15:48,160 --> 00:15:51,200 no salary range listed. That employer gets into trouble 284 00:15:51,280 --> 00:15:53,640 because they're they're accepting applicants from within 285 00:15:53,640 --> 00:15:56,680 the borders of Colorado. So again, back to the hyperlocal 286 00:15:56,680 --> 00:15:59,680 patchwork nature of it all. You've just got to, got to be 287 00:15:59,680 --> 00:16:03,480 focused and have, have an understanding of, of where 288 00:16:03,480 --> 00:16:07,200 you're hiring people, where you're looking for employees. 289 00:16:07,840 --> 00:16:11,000 And, and to your point about handbooks, making sure that 290 00:16:11,000 --> 00:16:14,400 those are up to date. Because letting it go 20 years 291 00:16:14,400 --> 00:16:18,160 is just not, it's kind of like, you know, yeah, it's not, I 292 00:16:18,160 --> 00:16:20,000 mean, it's, it's kind of like an estate plan, right? 293 00:16:20,000 --> 00:16:22,880 Like you wouldn't, you wouldn't let your will go for 20 years, 294 00:16:22,880 --> 00:16:23,960 right? Things change. 295 00:16:23,960 --> 00:16:27,720 You buy a new house, you have, you have a, a kid, you have, you 296 00:16:27,720 --> 00:16:29,960 know, you get divorced, you get remarried, you have all these 297 00:16:29,960 --> 00:16:33,440 life changes over the course of 20 years, you're going to update 298 00:16:33,440 --> 00:16:34,760 that. Same thing is true with 299 00:16:34,760 --> 00:16:36,600 handbooks. Totally. 300 00:16:36,600 --> 00:16:41,120 I mean, I just as an anecdote, I remember when the pay 301 00:16:41,120 --> 00:16:43,760 transparency laws started to become a little bit more 302 00:16:43,760 --> 00:16:45,480 widespread. I mean, of course there were 303 00:16:45,480 --> 00:16:49,120 already states that had these, but I think maybe it was New 304 00:16:49,120 --> 00:16:51,640 York and California kind of coming around around the same 305 00:16:51,640 --> 00:16:56,280 time a few years ago. And I remember saying to my team 306 00:16:56,280 --> 00:17:00,000 at the time, not in HR but in recruiting, that, hey, we, we're 307 00:17:00,000 --> 00:17:02,760 just, you know, we had, we post nationwide, we're posting salary 308 00:17:02,760 --> 00:17:05,680 ranges in every single job. And that's just the way it's 309 00:17:05,680 --> 00:17:06,920 going to go. And I remember there were a lot 310 00:17:06,920 --> 00:17:10,040 of questions not only from the recruiting team, but also from, 311 00:17:10,040 --> 00:17:13,560 you know, the, the leadership, like, is this really what we 312 00:17:13,560 --> 00:17:15,640 have to do? Can we just make it specific? 313 00:17:16,040 --> 00:17:19,040 Like there's no controlling who is applying to these job. 314 00:17:19,040 --> 00:17:22,920 Like as a remote employer, you are taking applications unless 315 00:17:22,920 --> 00:17:25,040 you restrict it. Even though you can still get an 316 00:17:25,040 --> 00:17:29,480 application from anyone, you you have to be compliant in the 317 00:17:29,480 --> 00:17:32,760 states where you could potentially be sourcing a 318 00:17:32,760 --> 00:17:34,320 candidate and finding a candidate. 319 00:17:35,280 --> 00:17:39,400 And even still, when I scroll on LinkedIn and of course I look at 320 00:17:39,400 --> 00:17:43,680 jobs, whether they're HR jobs or otherwise, and I see so many 321 00:17:43,680 --> 00:17:48,120 companies that don't post the salary range in that are like 322 00:17:48,120 --> 00:17:51,920 based in New York, based in New Jersey, and it just doesn't 323 00:17:51,920 --> 00:17:54,120 really make any sense. I don't know. 324 00:17:54,120 --> 00:17:57,800 And then then I question like, well, you know, if I were 325 00:17:57,800 --> 00:18:00,680 interested in applying to a job there, like, is this the company 326 00:18:00,680 --> 00:18:03,520 where they're not even compliant with, you know, something that's 327 00:18:03,520 --> 00:18:06,720 pretty easy to execute on? It's very, very, very strange. 328 00:18:07,200 --> 00:18:10,000 And I don't know if that, you know, sometimes I think it's a 329 00:18:10,000 --> 00:18:13,760 reflection of whether or not they have an HR team, frankly, 330 00:18:14,040 --> 00:18:18,400 or, and, and, or I wonder, like, do they just not care? 331 00:18:18,400 --> 00:18:21,320 Do they think they're above this law and that it could just get 332 00:18:21,320 --> 00:18:24,160 away with it? But all of what you said is 333 00:18:24,160 --> 00:18:27,280 really interesting that, you know, you could there is no 334 00:18:27,280 --> 00:18:28,520 controlling where people are applying. 335 00:18:28,520 --> 00:18:31,200 It's not like you're immediately turned off from the application 336 00:18:31,200 --> 00:18:33,760 when you enter your street address or your home address, I 337 00:18:33,760 --> 00:18:37,520 should say. And I think I, I do think that a 338 00:18:37,520 --> 00:18:41,400 lot of this, I'm going to use your term again, patchwork, that 339 00:18:41,400 --> 00:18:44,640 is kind of behind some of the ways in which we have to work 340 00:18:44,640 --> 00:18:46,680 now. I think a lot of this comes from 341 00:18:46,680 --> 00:18:49,760 the advent of improved technology. 342 00:18:50,120 --> 00:18:53,840 Because obviously, like when we think about LinkedIn or Indeed, 343 00:18:54,160 --> 00:18:57,680 it's like, wow, you can apply for a job anywhere if it's 344 00:18:57,680 --> 00:18:59,400 remote and you can work from anywhere. 345 00:18:59,680 --> 00:19:03,080 And yet that means that anywhere applies. 346 00:19:03,400 --> 00:19:07,720 So all of those laws apply. And so it's really quite 347 00:19:07,720 --> 00:19:10,760 interesting, I think. Yeah, it is. 348 00:19:10,760 --> 00:19:14,320 And so which one do you follow? I mean, you know, we, we were 349 00:19:14,320 --> 00:19:17,360 talking about this offline and I'll, I'll, I'll be brief, but 350 00:19:17,360 --> 00:19:19,320 like it because it's kind of 1/2 baked thought. 351 00:19:19,320 --> 00:19:25,720 But we could absolutely see it in my estimation. 352 00:19:25,840 --> 00:19:31,760 We could absolutely see some states suing other states for 353 00:19:31,800 --> 00:19:37,720 for their policies for job hiring, for example, much like 354 00:19:37,720 --> 00:19:43,200 we have seen over the last over the last year or so, some some 355 00:19:43,240 --> 00:19:48,160 very conservative states suing like Texas suing New York when 356 00:19:48,160 --> 00:19:51,400 doctors in New York are sending abortion pills to patients in 357 00:19:51,400 --> 00:19:53,920 Texas. We could see something similar 358 00:19:54,000 --> 00:19:59,680 where Texas says Washington, you, you cannot have salary 359 00:19:59,680 --> 00:20:03,240 ranges in job postings that are visible to applicants in Texas 360 00:20:03,240 --> 00:20:07,120 because we forbid having that and we could see. 361 00:20:07,800 --> 00:20:10,560 We could potentially see litigation between states on 362 00:20:10,560 --> 00:20:14,800 stuff like that, which is like I said it, maybe it's a little, 363 00:20:14,800 --> 00:20:17,920 yeah, it's a little wild, but I, I don't think it's out of the 364 00:20:17,920 --> 00:20:20,600 realm of possibility. No, certainly not, especially if 365 00:20:20,600 --> 00:20:25,040 you have a state that's trying to assert their opinion on 366 00:20:25,040 --> 00:20:27,680 something, you know, like how far are they going to take it? 367 00:20:28,400 --> 00:20:31,640 And like you said, we've already seen that between some states. 368 00:20:33,000 --> 00:20:37,360 And so it's like, well, depending on the topic, they 369 00:20:37,360 --> 00:20:42,000 might feel really impassioned by that particular topic and take 370 00:20:42,000 --> 00:20:44,600 it to that, that level and to that extent. 371 00:20:44,600 --> 00:20:46,720 And then it's just at that point, it's like, what are these 372 00:20:46,720 --> 00:20:49,560 states doing with taxpayer dollars? 373 00:20:49,560 --> 00:20:51,600 Like, is this really where you want to spend it? 374 00:20:51,880 --> 00:20:54,080 But I mean, at the end of the day, like, it is true, it can 375 00:20:54,080 --> 00:20:56,600 happen and politics can be very petty. 376 00:20:56,600 --> 00:21:00,240 So I wouldn't count against it personally. 377 00:21:00,400 --> 00:21:02,120 Well, we heard the prediction here first. 378 00:21:02,400 --> 00:21:05,920 So, Brian, if it happens, you can totally claim claim rights. 379 00:21:05,920 --> 00:21:09,560 Claim rights. I know that you also wanted to 380 00:21:09,560 --> 00:21:13,480 talk a little bit about this whole idea of free speech. 381 00:21:14,360 --> 00:21:17,680 And it's just so interesting because like I had said to you 382 00:21:17,680 --> 00:21:22,600 offline, someone had brought up something similar to me recently 383 00:21:22,600 --> 00:21:25,120 where I was like, well, it's kind of like a fine line between 384 00:21:25,520 --> 00:21:30,760 what someone can and, and is responsible for in terms of what 385 00:21:30,760 --> 00:21:34,360 they say, what they can say and what they do say online. 386 00:21:34,360 --> 00:21:38,840 And then what a company's ability to kind of enforce their 387 00:21:38,840 --> 00:21:43,120 own policies, expectations or brand against what might have 388 00:21:43,120 --> 00:21:44,440 been said. You know, because sometimes 389 00:21:44,440 --> 00:21:50,320 there's conflicting messaging there and that in most cases, 390 00:21:51,400 --> 00:21:53,720 people can't necessarily just say whatever they want. 391 00:21:53,720 --> 00:21:56,160 So I'll I'll pass to you because I know you have some thoughts 392 00:21:56,160 --> 00:21:58,120 there. Yeah, I mean it. 393 00:21:58,120 --> 00:22:02,080 It's an important time, I think, to remind employees, but also 394 00:22:02,080 --> 00:22:06,040 employers that free speech is a constitutional right. 395 00:22:07,320 --> 00:22:11,480 And that means it is not a that means it protects you from the 396 00:22:11,480 --> 00:22:15,120 government as an individual, not from your boss, not from your 397 00:22:15,120 --> 00:22:22,400 employer, regardless of what you want to say or on what medium 398 00:22:22,400 --> 00:22:26,240 you want to say it. Free speech is a 399 00:22:26,240 --> 00:22:27,760 constitutionally protected right. 400 00:22:28,400 --> 00:22:33,520 Everyone inside the borders of the United States, regardless of 401 00:22:33,520 --> 00:22:38,560 citizenship, regardless of of of your heritage, you have those 402 00:22:38,560 --> 00:22:39,960 constitutional rights to free speech. 403 00:22:41,320 --> 00:22:45,160 Your employer, because America is in the mostly an at will, 404 00:22:45,480 --> 00:22:47,120 with few exceptions, at will country. 405 00:22:47,960 --> 00:22:50,480 Your employer can terminate you as long as it's a non 406 00:22:50,480 --> 00:22:54,280 discriminatory reason. So they can terminate you for 407 00:22:54,280 --> 00:22:56,600 saying something on social media, they can terminate you 408 00:22:56,600 --> 00:22:59,480 for saying something on a podcast, they can terminate you 409 00:23:00,000 --> 00:23:04,680 for basically any reason as long as it is not discriminatory and 410 00:23:04,680 --> 00:23:08,520 as long as it's not in say, retaliation for a whistle blower 411 00:23:08,520 --> 00:23:13,440 claim or something like that. So your free speech rights as it 412 00:23:13,440 --> 00:23:17,840 as it relates to your employer are quite limited. 413 00:23:19,040 --> 00:23:21,880 That's not to say that you shouldn't speak your mind, you 414 00:23:21,880 --> 00:23:27,320 just need to be aware of the limitations of those rights that 415 00:23:27,320 --> 00:23:30,200 you have. Right, No, it, I think it's, we 416 00:23:30,200 --> 00:23:32,880 should probably have like an annual reminder on this because 417 00:23:34,040 --> 00:23:36,600 I, you know, look, I scroll very deeply and read it. 418 00:23:36,600 --> 00:23:39,760 I don't really contribute a lot. I like to just read the other 419 00:23:39,760 --> 00:23:41,880 crazy thoughts that are not other crazy thoughts because I 420 00:23:41,880 --> 00:23:44,720 don't have crazy thoughts, but the, the, the people out there 421 00:23:44,720 --> 00:23:49,080 that have just like crazy opinions, in my opinion, crazy 422 00:23:49,080 --> 00:23:51,600 opinions on things. And of course, there's like an 423 00:23:51,640 --> 00:23:55,760 HR subreddit. And really I just kind of, I 424 00:23:55,760 --> 00:23:58,120 browse right. Like I want to see in people who 425 00:23:58,120 --> 00:24:01,920 are not in HR will ask HR people questions in that subreddit. 426 00:24:02,360 --> 00:24:05,400 And sometimes I see things that are really bewildering, like, 427 00:24:05,600 --> 00:24:10,200 you know, my, I, my employer terminated me or rescinded my 428 00:24:10,200 --> 00:24:13,680 job offer because of my social media page or because I have 429 00:24:13,680 --> 00:24:15,640 only fans, which I don't, by the way. 430 00:24:15,640 --> 00:24:18,680 I'm I'm reiterating what people say on Reddit. 431 00:24:18,680 --> 00:24:21,360 This is not coming out right. I do not have that. 432 00:24:21,360 --> 00:24:24,400 I'm barely on Instagram. You would not catch me on there 433 00:24:25,320 --> 00:24:27,680 anyway. This is not OK. 434 00:24:27,680 --> 00:24:30,960 Let me, should I start over Anyway, you get where I'm saying 435 00:24:30,960 --> 00:24:33,560 what I'm saying, But this is like these are questions that or 436 00:24:33,680 --> 00:24:35,920 things that people are bringing up on on the subreddit. 437 00:24:36,240 --> 00:24:40,200 And it's like they're really confused why their employer 438 00:24:40,600 --> 00:24:44,240 takes kind of like a formal stance against them and says you 439 00:24:44,280 --> 00:24:46,840 either can't work here, you can't work here any longer. 440 00:24:47,160 --> 00:24:50,640 And most people in that subreddit will reply saying, 441 00:24:50,640 --> 00:24:54,520 look, you know, an employer is like free to do that unless 442 00:24:54,520 --> 00:24:57,280 you're in one of these few states that are not at will. 443 00:24:58,400 --> 00:25:03,120 And that ultimately, like, yeah, your presence online could 444 00:25:03,120 --> 00:25:08,680 affect your ability to be hired or maintain your employment. 445 00:25:08,960 --> 00:25:12,400 And I think about, you know, this just from the perspective 446 00:25:12,400 --> 00:25:18,480 of like brand connection, like if someone has and only fans or 447 00:25:18,480 --> 00:25:22,880 something that's maybe a little bit more controversial or like 448 00:25:22,880 --> 00:25:26,400 puts them paints themselves in like a way that maybe the the 449 00:25:26,440 --> 00:25:28,760 company does not want to align themselves with. 450 00:25:29,320 --> 00:25:31,960 That's kind of that. And it doesn't matter whether 451 00:25:31,960 --> 00:25:35,680 you have the right to do whatever you want with whomever 452 00:25:35,680 --> 00:25:39,560 you want and however you want online, there is potential for 453 00:25:39,560 --> 00:25:41,360 repercussion. And at the end of the day, I 454 00:25:41,360 --> 00:25:45,080 mean, just like being a smart consumer, you can be a smart 455 00:25:45,080 --> 00:25:48,160 provider and like you can decide, OK, this is what I want 456 00:25:48,160 --> 00:25:50,400 to do for myself and I don't care if I'm fired. 457 00:25:50,400 --> 00:25:53,560 Or you can say, oh, actually I don't want these repercussions. 458 00:25:54,280 --> 00:25:56,120 I'm going to just like not do this. 459 00:25:56,440 --> 00:26:00,360 And then sometimes, just my last point on this, I've actually not 460 00:26:00,360 --> 00:26:03,040 sometimes it's maybe less sometimes and more so like in 461 00:26:03,040 --> 00:26:07,840 the past, I've had questions from friends actually who have 462 00:26:07,840 --> 00:26:11,680 said that they make their profiles private. 463 00:26:11,680 --> 00:26:14,120 Doesn't that protect them in any way? 464 00:26:14,200 --> 00:26:16,800 And no it doesn't because you can get docs to anytime. 465 00:26:16,800 --> 00:26:20,960 Like someone whoever follows you could easily just share whatever 466 00:26:21,160 --> 00:26:24,560 thing you might post that you think is, you know, appropriate 467 00:26:24,560 --> 00:26:27,200 for your page, but isn't necessarily something that 468 00:26:27,200 --> 00:26:30,440 again, like a brand or your company would want to align 469 00:26:30,440 --> 00:26:32,920 with. So I think maybe it's part of 470 00:26:32,920 --> 00:26:36,360 maturing and it is like understanding that, you know, 471 00:26:36,360 --> 00:26:39,520 understanding that you are not. You sure you have? 472 00:26:39,520 --> 00:26:42,200 Freedom of speech, but that doesn't mean that your employer 473 00:26:42,200 --> 00:26:45,200 wants you to say anything and everything at any time. 474 00:26:45,280 --> 00:26:47,240 We saw this like with the insurrection to people were 475 00:26:47,240 --> 00:26:50,360 arrested, you know, and then their employers decided that 476 00:26:50,360 --> 00:26:53,920 that was not, you know, that did not align with their company 477 00:26:53,920 --> 00:26:56,360 messaging. Yeah, exactly. 478 00:26:56,920 --> 00:26:59,720 And I think it's, I think it's asking sort of the question of 479 00:26:59,720 --> 00:27:01,520 should you be able to say things? 480 00:27:01,560 --> 00:27:04,880 Yes, I, I think you should. I, I'm not necessarily a free 481 00:27:04,880 --> 00:27:09,320 speech absolutist like somebody like Elon claims to be, but I, 482 00:27:09,320 --> 00:27:12,600 I, I think with a few limitations, yes, you should be 483 00:27:12,600 --> 00:27:15,160 able to say what you want. If, you know, you can't incite 484 00:27:15,160 --> 00:27:19,840 violence, you can't threaten people with with physical or 485 00:27:19,840 --> 00:27:25,000 imminent harm, shouldn't say like just abhorrent things about 486 00:27:25,000 --> 00:27:28,160 other people or about people in general or just abhorrent 487 00:27:28,160 --> 00:27:33,280 things, period. But that doesn't mean that the 488 00:27:33,280 --> 00:27:37,200 existing laws that we have in this country give you the right 489 00:27:37,480 --> 00:27:41,480 to say those things. And yeah, I think it's just kind 490 00:27:41,480 --> 00:27:46,760 of understanding where we are that there are some statutes in 491 00:27:46,760 --> 00:27:50,160 some States and cities that provide some protections for 492 00:27:50,160 --> 00:27:52,840 employees to say what they want on social media without 493 00:27:52,840 --> 00:27:54,600 repercussion. Again, as long as it's not 494 00:27:54,600 --> 00:27:57,040 inciting violence, as long as it's just not generally 495 00:27:57,040 --> 00:28:01,960 abhorrent speech. But to claim that you had, as an 496 00:28:01,960 --> 00:28:04,320 employee, have a constitutional free speech right to say 497 00:28:04,320 --> 00:28:07,840 whatever you want with your as it relates to your employer, 498 00:28:08,160 --> 00:28:10,400 that's unfortunately not not the case. 499 00:28:11,360 --> 00:28:15,200 You know, my last point on this is that there is someone on 500 00:28:15,200 --> 00:28:18,000 LinkedIn. I won't even say that I follow 501 00:28:18,000 --> 00:28:20,080 them so much. I think that they just come up 502 00:28:20,080 --> 00:28:22,040 on my LinkedIn. I don't know, it's an algorithm 503 00:28:22,040 --> 00:28:27,160 thing and they are like actively outing their past employer and 504 00:28:27,240 --> 00:28:31,320 like, like, I think that's probably why I still like get it 505 00:28:31,320 --> 00:28:33,880 because I keep reading like what they're saying, but it's like, 506 00:28:34,120 --> 00:28:39,160 see another person from insert company name is like terminated 507 00:28:39,160 --> 00:28:40,840 for this thing. And like people are starting to 508 00:28:40,840 --> 00:28:43,200 talk and like they're talking about the culture and like the 509 00:28:43,640 --> 00:28:46,920 toxicity and all this stuff. And I'm like, I just don't think 510 00:28:46,920 --> 00:28:51,800 you'd ever catch me doing that. Like I it's just, I get it. 511 00:28:51,880 --> 00:28:53,520 They're they're not there anymore. 512 00:28:53,520 --> 00:28:57,480 And so yes, they can, you know, what's the harm in terms of 513 00:28:57,480 --> 00:28:59,920 their relationship with that that company. 514 00:28:59,920 --> 00:29:03,440 But I don't know, I just, I feel like I'm kind of a product of 515 00:29:03,600 --> 00:29:06,680 like my parents generation. They're boomers where it's like, 516 00:29:06,680 --> 00:29:10,600 Oh my gosh, you could burn every single bridge because it's a 517 00:29:10,600 --> 00:29:15,760 small industry potentially that this person's in and this is how 518 00:29:15,760 --> 00:29:19,200 you want to spend your time online, like just completely 519 00:29:19,600 --> 00:29:22,720 destroying them with your name. It's like they're not even 520 00:29:22,720 --> 00:29:26,040 attempting to disguise themselves and Glassdoor reviews 521 00:29:26,040 --> 00:29:29,720 like they're just, they are just putting it all out there. 522 00:29:29,720 --> 00:29:32,560 And I mean, like, again, it's kind of a paradox. 523 00:29:32,560 --> 00:29:37,000 Like you can say kind of anything, of course with the 524 00:29:37,000 --> 00:29:41,680 asterisk of, you know, what is reasonable to say and not 525 00:29:41,680 --> 00:29:45,480 illegal, but it's like, are, is there any thought on 526 00:29:45,480 --> 00:29:47,880 consequences? Like if I were that person's 527 00:29:48,040 --> 00:29:50,880 potential future employer, I don't think I'd be interviewing 528 00:29:50,880 --> 00:29:53,320 them. I'd be like, you make one 529 00:29:53,320 --> 00:29:55,600 mistake and then you're going to be outed like that. 530 00:29:56,280 --> 00:29:57,880 You're right. It, it's a fine line because 531 00:29:57,880 --> 00:30:02,400 there's the, there's that, that that mindset of, you know, I can 532 00:30:02,400 --> 00:30:04,520 say what I want and yeah, I agree with that. 533 00:30:04,600 --> 00:30:08,080 You can and should say what you want, but you have to be 534 00:30:08,080 --> 00:30:13,120 prepared for the repercussions. And in our society, there can be 535 00:30:13,560 --> 00:30:17,760 nearly unlimited repercussions from your current or potential 536 00:30:17,760 --> 00:30:21,560 employers for, for things that you may say that they just, they 537 00:30:21,560 --> 00:30:23,720 just don't want to touch. Some employers are fine with it. 538 00:30:23,720 --> 00:30:27,120 Some employers are like, yeah, we, we are going to speak freely 539 00:30:27,120 --> 00:30:28,720 about politics. We're going to speak freely 540 00:30:28,720 --> 00:30:34,040 about, about civil rights. Like maybe, maybe those are the 541 00:30:34,040 --> 00:30:37,320 employers that, that people like that need to, need to find. 542 00:30:37,600 --> 00:30:40,920 But for the most part, I, I tend to agree with you. 543 00:30:41,560 --> 00:30:44,800 I don't necessarily subscribe to the same idea anymore, but I 544 00:30:44,800 --> 00:30:47,680 tend to agree with you that the majority of, of American 545 00:30:47,680 --> 00:30:49,960 companies are like that, that like, we're just gonna stay away 546 00:30:49,960 --> 00:30:51,400 from this. We don't want the hassle. 547 00:30:51,400 --> 00:30:54,360 We don't want the stress with with someone who is who is that 548 00:30:54,360 --> 00:30:55,760 open? Yeah, exactly. 549 00:30:55,800 --> 00:30:59,760 And and I realize I've already said this is my final thing like 550 00:30:59,800 --> 00:31:02,880 3 separate times, but this is really my final thing because I 551 00:31:02,880 --> 00:31:04,560 have to insert this quote. It's so good. 552 00:31:04,720 --> 00:31:07,720 It is from a former Real Housewives of Housewife of New 553 00:31:07,720 --> 00:31:11,640 York, Dorinda Medley, who said say it, forget it, write it, 554 00:31:11,640 --> 00:31:13,960 regret it. And that is like, you know, 555 00:31:13,960 --> 00:31:18,120 those are words to live by, I think because you say something 556 00:31:18,120 --> 00:31:20,960 and maybe people like completely forget what you actually said 557 00:31:20,960 --> 00:31:24,240 because the game of telephone. But when you write it, that's 558 00:31:24,320 --> 00:31:27,640 that's it. It's an ink or online forever. 559 00:31:27,640 --> 00:31:29,760 You know you have no idea who screenshots things. 560 00:31:30,640 --> 00:31:34,080 Exactly, exactly. I will say, just to twist this 561 00:31:34,080 --> 00:31:38,760 back to HR, that you absolutely want to write it down when it 562 00:31:38,760 --> 00:31:42,800 comes to HR because if you don't write it down, it didn't happen. 563 00:31:42,920 --> 00:31:45,040 If you don't document it, it didn't happen. 564 00:31:45,040 --> 00:31:46,000 Yeah, yeah, yeah. Right. 565 00:31:46,000 --> 00:31:50,000 Document everything unless you don't want to regret it later 566 00:31:50,000 --> 00:31:52,200 because it has nothing to do with HR, right? 567 00:31:52,320 --> 00:31:55,280 That's fair, that's fair. That would be taking it back to 568 00:31:55,280 --> 00:31:57,520 Real Housewives of New York, the OG cast. 569 00:31:58,480 --> 00:32:00,760 Amazing. Well, Brian, thank you so much. 570 00:32:01,120 --> 00:32:03,800 Really appreciate it. I think the next time we speak, 571 00:32:03,800 --> 00:32:06,000 maybe we'll infuse some of these additional questions that we 572 00:32:06,000 --> 00:32:09,520 have for you. And for any listeners who want 573 00:32:09,600 --> 00:32:14,040 to ask any questions directly to Brian, please feel free to send 574 00:32:14,040 --> 00:32:15,240 those in. You can e-mail me at 575 00:32:15,240 --> 00:32:18,240 contact@hrtracy.com. And Brian, thank you so much 576 00:32:18,240 --> 00:32:20,320 again, and we'll see you next month. 577 00:32:20,440 --> 00:32:21,560 Thank you, Tracy. Appreciate it. 578 00:32:21,680 --> 00:32:24,960 Hey, just before you go, don't forget to subscribe to the show 579 00:32:24,960 --> 00:32:27,840 so that you are the first to hear when an episode drops each 580 00:32:27,840 --> 00:32:31,280 week and maybe leave a five star review and a comment about how 581 00:32:31,280 --> 00:32:34,080 much you love this episode. Plus, if you have someone in 582 00:32:34,080 --> 00:32:36,560 mind who would really enjoy this episode, make sure you share it 583 00:32:36,560 --> 00:32:38,520 with them. Thank you so much for tuning in 584 00:32:38,520 --> 00:32:39,880 and I'll see you next week.