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I'm Pete Warmsley and welcome 
back to the Foilers Podcast, a 

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00:00:13,200 --> 00:00:15,880
show where we dive deep into the
world of foiling with the 

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legends, innovators and 
passionate individuals pushing 

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the boundaries of this 
incredible sport and driving it 

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forward. 
To get the latest content when 

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it goes live, don't forget to 
follow this podcast and 

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00:00:28,280 --> 00:00:30,360
subscribe to the Foilers YouTube
channel. 

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In this episode, I spoke to Fred
Hope, a World Champion kite 

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boarder who now plays a lead 
role in product development at 

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Slingshot. 
Backed by his extensive 

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experience in water sports, Fred
takes new product ideas from 

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inception through the design, 
testing, refinement and market 

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release. 
I asked Fred many of the 

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questions people have been 
asking me about their One Lock 

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Foil system, and as you'll 
discover, there's much more to 

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it than simply being able to put
your foils together without 

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screws. 
We also explored Slingshots 2026

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range of wings and boards, 
talking about their design 

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approach, how they compare to 
previous models and why people 

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should consider them when 
upgrading their gear. 

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It's a pivotal time at Slingshot
as they aim to clearly position 

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themselves as one of the most 
innovative foiling companies in 

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the industry. 
It's a great chat with Fred and 

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his perspective on this. 
Enjoy. 

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Today we're joined by Fred Hope 
from Slingshot Sports. 

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Fred, can you take us back to 
how you first got involved in 

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water sports and then how you 
how did you end up at Slingshot?

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Yeah, so I was born in Hood 
River, and my parents were 

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windsurfers. 
They met on the water, basically

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on the river at a place called 
Avery. 

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And we'd spend all day at the 
beach in the summers. 

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And then the winter, my dad 
would throw us in a van and we'd

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drive down to Baja, to La 
Ventana, and I'd hang out in the

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tide pools and then started 
windsurfing at around 5:00, I 

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think. 
They tied a little rope to the 

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back of the board, send me out, 
dragged me back in, kept doing 

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that, got pretty into that. 
And then for my 13th birthday, 

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my parents got me kite lessons. 
And so I started kiting then on 

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a twin tip the first year, 
surfboard the second. 

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And then halfway through the 2nd
year, I was in a little rowboat 

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with my dog because there wasn't
enough wind. 

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And I was so bored on the beach 
that I went in the water. 

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And this guy of kites passed me 
on a foil early days, 2015. 

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And I thought to myself, man, 
that's, that's a lot nicer than 

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rowing back and forth on this 
boat. 

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And so I put an ad in the local 
kind of Facebook page at the 

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time. 
It was like a e-mail newsletter.

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And somebody responded and said,
hey, I've got a foil you can 

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borrow. 
It was like a homemade kind of 

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hybrid foil with a carafino 
front wing and a homemade mast. 

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And it was so heavy I couldn't 
pick it up. 

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So my dad would carry it down to
the water, throw it in there, 

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and I'd get up on it and go out.
And I remember the first time 

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getting up on it, it was such a 
cool feeling, just that flying 

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ventation that I just started 
laughing. 

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And so then I basically did that
pretty much every day for two or

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three years. 
Started with straps, was doing 

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the big air, kind of got bored 
of the straps. 

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So I took them off and 
everything got way harder. 

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And I kind of enjoyed that, 
enjoyed the the struggle of 

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trying to learn how to do the 
same tricks but without straps. 

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You'd the tacks were instead of 
having the straps to hold your 

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weight down, you'd get lifted 
off. 

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And so it really fine-tuned the 
amount of power you needed for 

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the tricks. 
And so got really into that and 

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then started to go back to the 
surfboard a little bit just 

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because it was when it was so 
windy, especially in Hood River,

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it's blown like 40 miles an hour
some days going wasn't, wasn't 

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the best for that, especially in
Kite Point. 

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And so started doing that and 
then twin tipping again and that

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all kind of tied back into the 
kite foil. 

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And I was really helped with my 
progression there. 

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And then I went to College in 
Seattle, did four years studying

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marine biology, graduated and 
actually called Slingshot right 

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before I graduated and said, 
hey, I'm going to go be a marine

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biologist. 
Like thanks for everything, 

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really appreciate it. 
And that was like the height of 

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my career. 
I just won like a competition, 

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world champion competition for 
freestyle kite foiling, but just

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decided it was kind of over. 
so-called them, said thank you, 

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hung up. 
And then a week later they 

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called me back and we're like, 
hey, we've been thinking, what 

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if you were to join the company?
And then another brand also 

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reached out to me because they 
heard I was graduating. 

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And I started thinking to myself
for two weeks, hey, I could do 

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what I've been doing, be a bit a
lot more stimulated and have a 

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pretty good outlook for the 
future versus marine biology. 

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It's all grant based. 
You're working in the middle of 

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nowhere, probably on a in a 
computer in a lab, never seen in

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the sunlight. 
And so kind of decided to make 

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that switch and started out as a
product tester at Slingshot in 

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January of 2022. 
And then like a year or a year 

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and a half into it, kind of had 
to express interest in becoming 

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the sort of product line 
manager, director of product as 

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a whole, trying to like combine 
every department. 

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So in the past at a lot of 
brands and, and at Slingshot as 

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well, the product line manager 
would send the product brief to 

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the R&D department. 
They had work on the product and

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then they would pass it off to 
marketing. 

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They would write the copy, kind 
of help market it, and then they

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would pass it off to sales. 
And there wasn't anybody that 

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just held on to the product the 
entire time. 

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So my role is kind of hey, come 
up with the product line, right.

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So I'm generating the idea is 
talking with everybody, all our 

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designers, sales guys, seeing 
what we need as as products for 

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the next year or two years out. 
And then taking that to R&D and 

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working with the designers and 
testing it with them. 

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And then taking that to 
marketing and helping them write

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the copy and kind of understand 
what the product is all about. 

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And then taking it to sales, 
teach them about the product and

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then also visiting retailers and
and kind of helping educate as a

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whole. 
And so it's basically just 

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combining all of the departments
into one. 

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So that's all well understood 
throughout the process of each 

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individual product. 
And so that's been pretty fun. 

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A lot of hands on the last, this
last AWSI was the first year 

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that we had product release that
I was attached to the entire 

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time through the product line 
lens. 

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So it's pretty exciting at AWSI 
to to have all those products 

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kind of be under my belt as as a
helper. 

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It's everyone at the brand, but 
kind of as a helper and and 

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bringing it from a all the way 
to Z in terms of development. 

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So that's that's what I do now. 
That's how I got into my spot 

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and slingshot right now. 
So I still kind of am like a 

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rider. 
I have a pro model board and and

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the UFO is like a kite foil kite
still market all that, still do 

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all those videos and education, 
but behind the scenes I'm more 

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of the product line manager side
helping make the products in 

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every part of the industry. 
So pair wing, wing kite, foil, 

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wake foil, a lot of the foil 
sports, but also within kite 

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twin tips, normal kites, 
surfboards, all those kind of 

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things. 
For me, it's all about 

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stimulated as much as possible. 
I got bored just riding 

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everyday. 
So it's like, how do I, how do I

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turn that riding, that feeling 
that I've that I've come to 

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understand with products into an
actual product that benefits, 

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benefits the customer? 
Yeah, yeah. 

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And you get to stay in the 
sport. 

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You obviously still get to do a 
bit of riding and you get to to 

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see product and try product that
you're involved in. 

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Must be a bit of a dream come 
true compared to sitting in a. 

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It's pretty fun sitting in a lab
somewhere. 

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Yeah, sometimes it's hard. 
You're always going out on 

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products that aren't quite there
yet. 

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And then as soon as they're done
and you're like, OK, these are 

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great, you hand them off and 
then you're on another product. 

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That means a lot of work. 
And so you're constantly trying 

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to tell the product get better 
and helping the designers design

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A better product. 
As soon as you're done, you got 

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to get offense. 
And that way it's a little, it's

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a little tricky sometimes, but I
always have the gear that I can 

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go grab on the weekends and, and
go ride for fun. 

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And it's always fun to be on the
water trying to figure out how 

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you can describe to the designer
what needs to change to make it 

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easier for for the customer to 
ride and kind of get them what 

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they want out of it. 
And your background must be 

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fantastic for that product 
development. 

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You spent a lot of time on the 
water on all these products, so 

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the the feedback for everyone 
there must must be really good. 

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Yeah, definitely. 
And we live in Hood River, which

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is is very windy in the winter. 
I go down to Baja or the 

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Caribbean test products down 
there. 

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So we really get a lot of 
testing and we got a good, a 

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good team here with all the 
designers. 

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They all ride and we have all 
the team riders that that really

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help out a lot. 
So it's a big one, big happy 

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family that's all trying to make
the product. 

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One of the products that's got a
lot of attention to your one 

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lock system, so I want to start 
diving into that a bit. 

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Can you describe in layman's 
terms what that system is and 

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how it works and what problem it
was aiming to solve for foilers?

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Overall, it's a system that 
simplifies everything, right? 

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00:08:09,880 --> 00:08:12,960
We had Phantasm before, which 
was a foil platform with a 

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fuselage that was aluminum front
wing, back wing and a mass. 

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And they all kind of connected 
together through screws. 

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So we had three screws on the 
front wing, 3 on the mast, and 

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then two on the stabilizer and 
then four up on the pedestal. 

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And we had a lot of issues with 
corrosion with Breakers, quality

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control and weight, and then 
also this inherent kind of drag 

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that we had underwater. 
So when you ride on a wave, you 

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00:08:33,240 --> 00:08:35,919
could feel as soon as you let 
off the power, you kind of slow 

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down a little bit. 
And so we kind of figured, hey, 

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how do we make it easier for the
customer or somebody buying our 

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product to actually enjoy the 
product? 

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And that's in a couple ways, 
right? 

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00:08:46,040 --> 00:08:48,760
It's the setup, easy use there. 
It's the performance on the 

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00:08:48,760 --> 00:08:51,280
water, and also just the weight 
savings that you get with going 

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00:08:51,280 --> 00:08:53,880
with a full carbon system. 
And so we decided to throw out 

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Phantasm basically 3 1/2 years 
ago now. 

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00:08:58,480 --> 00:09:01,280
I think it was like right when I
started, the first meeting I 

191
00:09:01,280 --> 00:09:04,400
went into was, hey, we're we're 
looking at this new idea. 

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00:09:04,400 --> 00:09:07,360
How do we reinvent, not reinvent
the foil, but like reinvent the 

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00:09:07,360 --> 00:09:10,160
connection system of a foil to 
make it as streamlined and easy 

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00:09:10,160 --> 00:09:12,200
as possible to use. 
And so there were a bunch of 

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00:09:12,240 --> 00:09:15,360
strings and 3D printed parts 
that we were playing with. 

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00:09:15,440 --> 00:09:17,200
And when you go back and you 
look at them now, they're so 

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00:09:17,200 --> 00:09:18,960
different from what we ended up 
coming out with. 

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00:09:19,040 --> 00:09:22,720
But yeah, we just went down that
path and it was really, it's 

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00:09:22,720 --> 00:09:24,880
tricky because we're trying to 
make a system that's super 

200
00:09:24,880 --> 00:09:26,800
streamlined, but still strong 
enough, right? 

201
00:09:26,800 --> 00:09:29,000
We wanted that durability and 
that slingshots really well 

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00:09:29,000 --> 00:09:30,560
known for in our kites and our 
wings. 

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00:09:30,600 --> 00:09:32,040
And so that had to be in the 
foil as well. 

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00:09:32,040 --> 00:09:35,480
And so we basically decided we 
wanted a system that would work 

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with variances and tolerances in
China, right? 

206
00:09:38,200 --> 00:09:40,520
Because every piece that comes 
out of mold is slightly 

207
00:09:40,520 --> 00:09:41,840
different. 
And so you have all these brands

208
00:09:41,840 --> 00:09:44,920
having to kind of fine tune 
their their finishes or have 

209
00:09:44,920 --> 00:09:48,120
somebody in the factory down the
line sanding it and you get a 

210
00:09:48,120 --> 00:09:50,040
lot of variance there. 
And so we needed a system that 

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00:09:50,040 --> 00:09:52,360
could deal with that and to kind
of cut down on the amount of 

212
00:09:52,360 --> 00:09:54,600
Labor that went into it. 
And so we have the system where 

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00:09:54,600 --> 00:09:57,640
the pieces basically pull 
together and expand inside the 

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00:09:57,640 --> 00:09:59,000
collar. 
And you can see the videos 

215
00:09:59,000 --> 00:10:02,800
online basically that fit inside
of another triangle. 

216
00:10:02,800 --> 00:10:05,280
And the tighter it is, the more 
it expands into it. 

217
00:10:05,280 --> 00:10:07,840
And so when you get it out of 
the mold, let's say it sits 

218
00:10:07,840 --> 00:10:10,040
right here. 
Over time, when the carbon 

219
00:10:10,040 --> 00:10:12,760
wears, as it does with any 
system, you see any foil that's 

220
00:10:12,760 --> 00:10:14,760
been on the market for three 
years now, there's a little bit 

221
00:10:14,760 --> 00:10:16,320
of slop, right? 
And the screws kind of take up 

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00:10:16,320 --> 00:10:17,760
some of that. 
But there still can be a little 

223
00:10:17,760 --> 00:10:20,320
bit of play. 
Ours, as the carbon wears over 

224
00:10:20,320 --> 00:10:22,360
time, it just pulls closer and 
closer together. 

225
00:10:22,360 --> 00:10:25,320
So it's basically expanding more
and more and locking into the 

226
00:10:25,320 --> 00:10:27,040
system. 
So it's just as tight three 

227
00:10:27,040 --> 00:10:30,400
years down the line as it was 
the day you bought it because it

228
00:10:30,400 --> 00:10:34,040
just has that, that kind of 
tolerance fit going on in it. 

229
00:10:34,040 --> 00:10:37,880
But basically in the end, we 
were able to simplify 

230
00:10:37,880 --> 00:10:39,960
everything, avoid that corrosion
that we had. 

231
00:10:39,960 --> 00:10:42,760
We have full carbon. 
The manufacturing costs went 

232
00:10:42,760 --> 00:10:46,080
down a little bit too. 
We didn't have to use such high 

233
00:10:46,560 --> 00:10:50,240
level carbon with the geometry 
that we had because when we had 

234
00:10:50,240 --> 00:10:53,600
that mass foot that went into 
the fuselage, you had a limit on

235
00:10:53,600 --> 00:10:56,160
how wide the the profile could 
be, right. 

236
00:10:56,160 --> 00:10:58,800
And with developments of 
profiles overall through 

237
00:10:58,800 --> 00:11:01,800
software's, you've been able, 
we've been able to find profiles

238
00:11:01,800 --> 00:11:05,400
that are wider but still have 
less drag than our narrow race 

239
00:11:05,400 --> 00:11:07,520
profiles that we used to have in
the Phantasm series. 

240
00:11:07,520 --> 00:11:10,440
And so we can get a lot more 
strength without adding like 

241
00:11:10,520 --> 00:11:12,800
1000 bucks to the first cost or 
something like that. 

242
00:11:13,400 --> 00:11:15,280
And so that's helped us kind of 
differentiate. 

243
00:11:15,280 --> 00:11:17,680
Now we have 2 mass lines instead
of one with Phantasm. 

244
00:11:17,680 --> 00:11:19,960
Keep a lot, a lot of strength 
that's way stronger than 

245
00:11:19,960 --> 00:11:22,040
Phantasm overall. 
We don't have the breakage in 

246
00:11:22,040 --> 00:11:24,520
the mass that we used to have or
the fuselage corroding and 

247
00:11:24,520 --> 00:11:26,360
snapping over time or the screws
stripping out. 

248
00:11:26,360 --> 00:11:29,480
And so really solved all of 
those quality issues that we had

249
00:11:29,480 --> 00:11:31,440
overall. 
And then on the water, this was 

250
00:11:31,440 --> 00:11:35,280
kind of like the aha moment was 
when we would ride and then go 

251
00:11:35,280 --> 00:11:38,040
back to Phantasm. 
You would realize how much drag 

252
00:11:38,040 --> 00:11:40,160
those screws were actually 
creating and it was hard to 

253
00:11:40,160 --> 00:11:42,520
realize till you'd actually 
ridden something that was 

254
00:11:42,520 --> 00:11:44,480
streamlined, right? 
Like you have you ever been on E

255
00:11:44,480 --> 00:11:46,400
foil and you let out on the 
throttle and you feel that 

256
00:11:46,400 --> 00:11:50,560
instinct down a little bit? 
So as in system, we were feeling

257
00:11:50,560 --> 00:11:54,800
when we went back to it, not 
that much, but like 2 to 5% of 

258
00:11:54,800 --> 00:11:56,920
that same feeling was going on 
where when you let out on the 

259
00:11:56,920 --> 00:11:59,640
power, you would feel that foil 
start to get a little unstable 

260
00:11:59,640 --> 00:12:00,960
and start to pull down a little 
bit. 

261
00:12:00,960 --> 00:12:03,560
But because of all those screws 
along the bottom and all the 

262
00:12:03,560 --> 00:12:06,400
weird scenes and stuff with the 
mass foot and fuselage and just 

263
00:12:06,400 --> 00:12:09,760
all the connection systems. 
So by going back to Phantasm, we

264
00:12:09,760 --> 00:12:12,640
actually realized the biggest 
benefit to the system was not 

265
00:12:12,640 --> 00:12:15,880
actually the ease of use or lack
of corrosion, all that stuff. 

266
00:12:15,880 --> 00:12:18,400
It was the feel on the water, 
which is pretty exciting to see.

267
00:12:18,400 --> 00:12:21,640
So there was that performance 
benefit that we saw from from 

268
00:12:21,640 --> 00:12:23,920
one lock over the phantasm 
system that we had before. 

269
00:12:23,920 --> 00:12:27,040
So, yeah, it's interesting 
because I suppose one of the the

270
00:12:27,040 --> 00:12:30,920
challenges maybe for you guys is
everyone thinks it's all about 

271
00:12:30,920 --> 00:12:33,880
just the, the ease of not having
screws. 

272
00:12:33,880 --> 00:12:37,000
And you know, the the process 
was getting rid of screws 

273
00:12:37,000 --> 00:12:39,520
because they're a pain in 
putting together a foil. 

274
00:12:39,600 --> 00:12:41,120
But there's a lot more to it 
than that. 

275
00:12:41,240 --> 00:12:43,400
And I suppose there's, yeah, 
there's a bit of a job in 

276
00:12:43,400 --> 00:12:45,400
getting that message out there 
because a lot of people are 

277
00:12:45,400 --> 00:12:48,480
thinking no screws, it's 
quicker, but there's much more 

278
00:12:48,480 --> 00:12:50,680
to it than that. 
It's it's pretty hard to 

279
00:12:50,680 --> 00:12:54,000
describe a feeling without 
sounding like a generic water 

280
00:12:54,000 --> 00:12:57,120
sports company that says like 
feel the flight or something, 

281
00:12:57,160 --> 00:12:59,080
you know, like that doesn't 
actually anybody. 

282
00:12:59,080 --> 00:13:02,280
And so in the beginning we kind 
of more focused on what we could

283
00:13:02,280 --> 00:13:04,520
actually show, which was the 
ease of putting it together. 

284
00:13:05,320 --> 00:13:08,800
And then now we have, we have 
people that have that have 

285
00:13:08,800 --> 00:13:11,040
gotten the foil that are talking
to their friends and, and they 

286
00:13:11,040 --> 00:13:13,880
don't actually talk about the 
easy use as much as they do the 

287
00:13:13,880 --> 00:13:15,560
feel on the water and how smooth
it is. 

288
00:13:16,360 --> 00:13:18,920
But it's really hard to describe
that in an Instagram post or an 

289
00:13:18,920 --> 00:13:22,360
e-mail or on an ad on I win surf
or I kite surf. 

290
00:13:22,520 --> 00:13:26,520
And so it's, it's a bit trickier
to describe that to the 

291
00:13:26,600 --> 00:13:28,920
customer. 
We're trying overall through 

292
00:13:28,960 --> 00:13:31,800
through the writing that we're 
showing on the water and really 

293
00:13:31,800 --> 00:13:34,560
through demos and stuff like 
that is everyone that comes in 

294
00:13:34,560 --> 00:13:37,920
and demos the foil really enjoys
it and notices, notices the lack

295
00:13:37,920 --> 00:13:40,120
of screws when they go back to 
their other foil. 

296
00:13:40,120 --> 00:13:44,000
So it's kind of like you can't 
tell somebody, they just have to

297
00:13:44,000 --> 00:13:47,160
feel it themselves, which is why
our new motto is feel the 

298
00:13:47,160 --> 00:13:51,280
difference for for the new year 
is actually like asking people 

299
00:13:51,280 --> 00:13:53,520
to go try our products, not just
the foil, but the kites and the 

300
00:13:53,520 --> 00:13:56,120
wings and the boards. 
You do notice that that feeling 

301
00:13:56,200 --> 00:13:57,680
when you get on any one of our 
products. 

302
00:13:57,680 --> 00:13:59,920
And that's really what we've 
tried to do is, is make it so 

303
00:13:59,920 --> 00:14:03,160
the customer feels, feels what 
we want them to or like the 

304
00:14:03,160 --> 00:14:07,040
benefits in, in our product 
overall and the ease of use and 

305
00:14:07,040 --> 00:14:09,320
the and the smoothness and the 
efficiency overall. 

306
00:14:09,320 --> 00:14:12,440
Certainly people that are racing
foils are covering up their 

307
00:14:12,440 --> 00:14:15,200
screws to make them more 
streamlined. 

308
00:14:15,200 --> 00:14:17,840
So I suppose you just don't have
that issue with this, with this 

309
00:14:17,840 --> 00:14:18,480
foil, yeah. 
Yeah. 

310
00:14:18,480 --> 00:14:20,240
I mean, it's not a race foil. 
I will say that. 

311
00:14:20,520 --> 00:14:23,120
Yeah, sure. 
It's going as fast as possible. 

312
00:14:23,120 --> 00:14:25,640
There's a lot of a lot of 
compromises you have to make on 

313
00:14:25,640 --> 00:14:28,840
both sides, whether you want to 
go race or kind of generic for 

314
00:14:28,840 --> 00:14:31,440
the average customer that 
doesn't need to go 50 kilometers

315
00:14:31,440 --> 00:14:33,360
an hour. 
There are things that if you 

316
00:14:33,360 --> 00:14:34,920
wanted to make it full race, you
would change. 

317
00:14:34,920 --> 00:14:38,360
But for for the speeds that 
people are riding at, it's 

318
00:14:38,480 --> 00:14:43,200
plenty fast overall. 
Hey foilers, I just want to take

319
00:14:43,200 --> 00:14:45,480
a moment to let you know about 
lip sunglasses. 

320
00:14:46,120 --> 00:14:48,920
They're made for water sports 
and they're absolutely game 

321
00:14:48,920 --> 00:14:51,280
changing. 
I first bought a pair of lips 

322
00:14:51,280 --> 00:14:54,760
and glasses because I had UV 
damage in one of my eyes from 

323
00:14:54,760 --> 00:14:57,840
long term exposure through many 
years of water sports. 

324
00:14:58,400 --> 00:15:01,680
I was also getting very tired of
squinting through glare every 

325
00:15:01,680 --> 00:15:04,880
time I went falling and honestly
they blew me away. 

326
00:15:05,360 --> 00:15:07,600
They're made for water sports. 
They've got lightweight and 

327
00:15:07,600 --> 00:15:10,000
flexible frames for comfort and 
durability. 

328
00:15:10,400 --> 00:15:13,400
They've got injected 
polarisation in the lenses for 

329
00:15:13,400 --> 00:15:16,680
glare free vision and a double 
stage retention system that 

330
00:15:16,680 --> 00:15:19,360
means they can't come off even 
in the biggest wipeout. 

331
00:15:19,680 --> 00:15:22,880
They also have a watershedding 
lens coating that keeps your 

332
00:15:22,880 --> 00:15:26,080
view crystal clear. 
I love them so much that I 

333
00:15:26,080 --> 00:15:28,520
actually became the Australian 
distributor. 

334
00:15:29,040 --> 00:15:31,800
If you want the best on water 
eyewear, check out Lip 

335
00:15:31,800 --> 00:15:35,840
Sunglasses and as Foilers 
listeners, you get 15% off their

336
00:15:35,840 --> 00:15:41,040
premium Typhoon model with Zeiss
lenses using the code Foilers 

337
00:15:41,360 --> 00:15:44,080
15. 
Give them a try and do your eyes

338
00:15:44,080 --> 00:15:47,000
a favour. 
What were the the biggest 

339
00:15:47,000 --> 00:15:50,760
engineering design challenges 
for you guys in in putting that?

340
00:15:50,760 --> 00:15:53,840
Strength overall, right? 
Like you have the carbon weave 

341
00:15:54,080 --> 00:15:58,120
down the mass and then it has to
open up around the the open 

342
00:15:58,120 --> 00:16:00,720
collar at the bottom so that 
carbon weaves around. 

343
00:16:00,720 --> 00:16:05,600
And so in the beginning we had a
certain thickness in in the side

344
00:16:05,600 --> 00:16:09,160
walls of that collar. 
And my job was basically to 

345
00:16:09,160 --> 00:16:10,720
break. 
I break a lot of stuff that's 

346
00:16:10,720 --> 00:16:13,920
kind of like go out and ride it 
and, and see if you break or if 

347
00:16:13,920 --> 00:16:16,760
the product breaks first, right?
And so I've been that a lot and 

348
00:16:16,880 --> 00:16:19,480
I was breaking a lot of mass 
trying different layups. 

349
00:16:19,480 --> 00:16:21,200
They got stronger and stronger, 
but we never really hit the 

350
00:16:21,200 --> 00:16:22,480
point where we were happy with 
it. 

351
00:16:22,560 --> 00:16:27,560
And so we actually retooled all 
of our products like 3/4 of the 

352
00:16:27,560 --> 00:16:29,920
way through development. 
We said, hey, we need a lot more

353
00:16:29,920 --> 00:16:32,120
strength in here. 
So we beefed up the amount of 

354
00:16:32,120 --> 00:16:35,680
material on the collar by going 
closer in, not not expanding on 

355
00:16:35,680 --> 00:16:37,400
the outside because we know we 
wanted low drag. 

356
00:16:37,400 --> 00:16:40,080
We don't want to have it be a 
bulbous piece, but the inner 

357
00:16:40,080 --> 00:16:42,080
part of the collar got material 
here. 

358
00:16:42,080 --> 00:16:45,320
And so we retooled our front 
wings and our stabilizers to be 

359
00:16:45,320 --> 00:16:47,480
a little bit smaller to have 
that strength where it needed to

360
00:16:47,480 --> 00:16:49,120
be in the collar. 
That was a big piece. 

361
00:16:49,120 --> 00:16:52,360
We had obviously QC issues, 
factories changing things on us 

362
00:16:52,360 --> 00:16:55,280
last minute a little bit just 
trying to to make the process of

363
00:16:55,280 --> 00:16:57,000
building easier. 
And so we had to remind them of 

364
00:16:57,000 --> 00:16:59,880
like the durability standards 
that we needed sanding overall, 

365
00:16:59,880 --> 00:17:03,080
teaching them how to how to sand
the foils to to be smooth 

366
00:17:03,080 --> 00:17:06,160
through the water, that more 
gloss isn't necessarily better, 

367
00:17:06,880 --> 00:17:09,440
things like that. 
And then obviously we have these

368
00:17:09,440 --> 00:17:11,800
flag screws on the top, we call 
them T locks that you can, 

369
00:17:11,800 --> 00:17:14,280
they're kind of like the Conrad 
things, but they lift up and you

370
00:17:14,280 --> 00:17:17,200
can set them into position like 
you want, trying to find the 

371
00:17:17,200 --> 00:17:19,200
right aluminum for that so they 
don't corrode. 

372
00:17:19,200 --> 00:17:22,400
New T knots that for M6, we 
switched to that from M8 to try 

373
00:17:22,400 --> 00:17:25,640
to save on weight overall. 
And just easy use and tune 

374
00:17:25,640 --> 00:17:29,040
ability for this RTS system that
we have that allows you to notch

375
00:17:29,040 --> 00:17:32,360
the foil plate into the board 
and then smack the back down and

376
00:17:32,360 --> 00:17:35,240
then put T locks or flag screws 
in the back. 

377
00:17:35,920 --> 00:17:38,240
We needed to change to M6 for 
that too, so we could have these

378
00:17:38,240 --> 00:17:39,920
little slats going on the bottom
of the plate. 

379
00:17:39,920 --> 00:17:42,280
So yeah, I would say strength 
was like the main challenge. 

380
00:17:42,320 --> 00:17:45,880
And then also the latch actually
has a lot of a lot of thought 

381
00:17:45,880 --> 00:17:47,800
behind it. 
We wanted to make sure that when

382
00:17:47,800 --> 00:17:51,720
somebody gets a completely new 
weight of assembler foil, 

383
00:17:51,720 --> 00:17:54,320
generally they're going to over 
tighten it, right? 

384
00:17:54,320 --> 00:17:56,880
So the latch, they're going to 
be like, oh, I don't I don't 

385
00:17:56,880 --> 00:18:01,240
trust it to slam it down, right.
We wanted to make sure that we 

386
00:18:01,240 --> 00:18:05,000
like try to aluminum latches and
and hard density plastics and 

387
00:18:05,000 --> 00:18:07,640
soft density plastics. 
We want to make sure that if 

388
00:18:07,640 --> 00:18:10,280
people were to over tighten that
latch, they wouldn't end up 

389
00:18:10,280 --> 00:18:13,360
breaking the fuselage because 
you've got a little notch in 

390
00:18:13,360 --> 00:18:15,440
here that the latch goes into 
and then tightens down. 

391
00:18:15,440 --> 00:18:18,920
As it tightens down, it pulls 
against the little surface Here 

392
00:18:19,640 --> 00:18:22,000
there was metal and somebody 
tried to do that that wanted to 

393
00:18:22,000 --> 00:18:24,320
tighten it down where the 
tension starts here and they 

394
00:18:24,320 --> 00:18:26,600
locked down. 
It would crush the carbon right 

395
00:18:26,600 --> 00:18:28,720
here. 
And so we kind of spent a long 

396
00:18:28,720 --> 00:18:31,320
time figuring out what's the 
right density of plastic in our 

397
00:18:31,320 --> 00:18:35,800
latch so that it stays very 
strong and keeps its shape 

398
00:18:35,800 --> 00:18:37,520
unless you were to over tighten 
it. 

399
00:18:37,560 --> 00:18:40,480
And we wanted to make sure the 
latch crushes before the carbon 

400
00:18:40,480 --> 00:18:43,360
because the latch is like it's 
like $4.00 to replace and the 

401
00:18:43,360 --> 00:18:46,800
stabilizer is $300, though. 
It's like which if you're, if 

402
00:18:46,800 --> 00:18:49,600
you're not assembling it 
correctly in the latch, you can 

403
00:18:49,680 --> 00:18:52,280
adjust it. 
So there's a little pin with the

404
00:18:52,280 --> 00:18:55,040
spec with the Dyneema line. 
And over time, as that foil 

405
00:18:55,040 --> 00:18:57,440
pulls closer together, right, 
you need to have adjustability 

406
00:18:57,440 --> 00:18:59,000
so it still stays tight with the
latch. 

407
00:18:59,080 --> 00:19:00,920
And so there's this little pin 
that you unscrew and it was 

408
00:19:00,920 --> 00:19:02,680
like, what's the size of that 
pin need to be? 

409
00:19:02,920 --> 00:19:05,160
How much stiffness is there need
to be in that pin? 

410
00:19:05,720 --> 00:19:08,080
How does it back out without 
hitting the sides of the 

411
00:19:08,080 --> 00:19:09,920
fuselage? 
So the latch was really took, 

412
00:19:09,960 --> 00:19:11,840
took a lot of time, the latch 
and then the strength of the 

413
00:19:11,840 --> 00:19:14,240
collar. 
We spent the pure time on 

414
00:19:14,480 --> 00:19:16,240
overall. 
One of the things that people 

415
00:19:16,240 --> 00:19:19,640
kind of, I suppose, wonder about
is, you know, you're at the 

416
00:19:19,640 --> 00:19:22,080
beach, sand might get into the 
mechanism. 

417
00:19:22,080 --> 00:19:24,720
What happens there? 
Is there a wear issue or is is 

418
00:19:24,720 --> 00:19:26,000
is? 
That, I mean, they're not like 

419
00:19:26,080 --> 00:19:28,760
it's sandpaper, right? 
Sand is sandpaper if you put in,

420
00:19:29,440 --> 00:19:30,520
Yeah. 
But like I said, it doesn't 

421
00:19:30,520 --> 00:19:32,560
really matter that much. 
Not that I'm suggesting putting 

422
00:19:32,560 --> 00:19:35,880
sand in it because it's 
obviously, but if, if that 

423
00:19:35,920 --> 00:19:38,000
should happen, it just pulls 
closer together, right? 

424
00:19:38,000 --> 00:19:39,520
So it's not really that big of 
an issue. 

425
00:19:40,280 --> 00:19:42,920
There are videos that I've put 
out proving that you can still 

426
00:19:42,920 --> 00:19:44,440
put it together. 
If there's sand in it, you can 

427
00:19:44,440 --> 00:19:46,600
still get it out because it's 
not like AI don't know if you 

428
00:19:46,600 --> 00:19:48,320
win surf before, but you know 
how you put your mask. 

429
00:19:49,000 --> 00:19:50,960
People on the beach would be 
like spending all day trying to 

430
00:19:50,960 --> 00:19:53,280
get the mask apart because 
there's sand in it, because it's

431
00:19:53,280 --> 00:19:55,760
not really a tapered fit. 
It's it's a very minor taper 

432
00:19:56,560 --> 00:20:00,160
ours, if you look at it closely,
it's a triangle on a triangle 

433
00:20:00,280 --> 00:20:02,400
inside of a triangle, right? 
And so as you twiggle that 

434
00:20:02,400 --> 00:20:05,440
fuselage out the stabilizer, it 
pops out and it actually pulls 

435
00:20:05,440 --> 00:20:07,480
away and down. 
And so there's plenty of space 

436
00:20:07,480 --> 00:20:09,560
for it to slide out. 
Then the front wing pops back 

437
00:20:09,560 --> 00:20:11,880
down and then slides out. 
So you don't have this this 

438
00:20:11,880 --> 00:20:15,040
really aggressive fit on it that
doesn't let it slide out or 

439
00:20:15,040 --> 00:20:17,600
slide in when there's sand. 
So you can look up that video, 

440
00:20:17,600 --> 00:20:19,920
you can hear the sand crushing 
inside of it when I close the 

441
00:20:19,920 --> 00:20:21,440
latch down. 
We haven't really had any 

442
00:20:21,440 --> 00:20:22,600
issues. 
And the other thing too to 

443
00:20:22,600 --> 00:20:25,720
remember is. 
Most people, I would like to 

444
00:20:25,720 --> 00:20:28,360
think don't dip their front wing
in sand before they put their 

445
00:20:28,360 --> 00:20:30,600
foil together. 
They like happen in the water, 

446
00:20:30,600 --> 00:20:33,280
which obviously, yeah, there's 
some space in there. 

447
00:20:33,840 --> 00:20:35,840
The sand might get in. 
It's not an issue at all. 

448
00:20:35,840 --> 00:20:38,280
You pull it, you pull it apart, 
there's I've never had it get 

449
00:20:38,280 --> 00:20:39,360
stuck. 
Nobody else had. 

450
00:20:39,720 --> 00:20:42,280
So yeah, it's definitely not not
a concern there. 

451
00:20:43,400 --> 00:20:46,480
And when you're testing it and 
you've had other riders using 

452
00:20:46,480 --> 00:20:49,480
it, what sort of what sort of 
feedback did you get? 

453
00:20:49,480 --> 00:20:53,200
What sort of stood out for you? 
Any surprises that people found 

454
00:20:53,200 --> 00:20:56,720
when they use the system? 
Yeah, I mean, I'd say the 

455
00:20:56,720 --> 00:20:59,880
majority of people that try it 
don't actually give the most 

456
00:20:59,880 --> 00:21:02,120
valuable feedback until they go 
back to their foil. 

457
00:21:02,120 --> 00:21:05,200
And that's that kind of inherent
drag that screws had. 

458
00:21:05,200 --> 00:21:08,720
A lot of people from other 
brands have told me, hey, I 

459
00:21:08,720 --> 00:21:11,080
didn't actually know screws were
this big of a problem, right? 

460
00:21:11,080 --> 00:21:13,040
And we're kind of under the 
radar right now, which is kind 

461
00:21:13,040 --> 00:21:16,080
of nice because I don't know I 
don't think that that many 

462
00:21:16,080 --> 00:21:17,680
brands are working on a 
screwless system. 

463
00:21:17,840 --> 00:21:20,400
So that's actually kind of nice,
but they were saying, hey, I 

464
00:21:20,400 --> 00:21:22,760
like I realized that that's a 
that's an added benefit, a 

465
00:21:22,760 --> 00:21:24,760
really huge benefit of the one 
lock system. 

466
00:21:24,760 --> 00:21:27,600
And then for the downwinds, most
people here don't want to wait, 

467
00:21:27,800 --> 00:21:30,000
pair wing up and then foil back 
down. 

468
00:21:30,000 --> 00:21:33,200
We're very fortunate to have a 
60 mile an hour road right next 

469
00:21:33,200 --> 00:21:34,960
to where we go. 
And so people get back in band 

470
00:21:34,960 --> 00:21:37,240
and then they drive up. 
There's always an issue of like 

471
00:21:37,240 --> 00:21:39,360
trying to get all your shit 
inside of a van, right? 

472
00:21:39,360 --> 00:21:43,160
And there's this either photos 
of foils everywhere stabbing 

473
00:21:43,160 --> 00:21:45,120
through each other into boards 
and stuff like that. 

474
00:21:45,120 --> 00:21:48,600
And it's, it's actually fun and 
so easy to take your foil apart 

475
00:21:48,600 --> 00:21:51,240
that you just do it naturally. 
It's easier, protects all your 

476
00:21:51,240 --> 00:21:53,000
gear. 
You're not having the the wing 

477
00:21:53,000 --> 00:21:54,640
tips chip when they bounce back 
and forth. 

478
00:21:54,640 --> 00:21:57,120
You have a hole, the front wing 
in the stabilizer in your hand. 

479
00:21:57,840 --> 00:22:00,040
You know that it's safe. 
So that's a huge added benefit 

480
00:22:00,040 --> 00:22:01,880
that I've heard the feel of the 
drag. 

481
00:22:01,920 --> 00:22:04,960
I think also the weight savings.
It's, it's all carbon, right? 

482
00:22:04,960 --> 00:22:06,960
And the stiffness is, is really 
big too. 

483
00:22:07,200 --> 00:22:10,160
Our foil designer Bobby spent a 
lot of time and the software is 

484
00:22:10,160 --> 00:22:12,360
trying to find the right profile
that keeps that stiffness but 

485
00:22:12,360 --> 00:22:16,360
keeps the drag down overall for 
the riding speed, like obviously

486
00:22:16,360 --> 00:22:18,960
profiles are tuned for certain 
riding speeds and we chose the 

487
00:22:18,960 --> 00:22:22,000
riding speed of the average 
customer, maybe slightly above 

488
00:22:22,000 --> 00:22:24,640
average customer. 
So you get, you get the most 

489
00:22:24,640 --> 00:22:27,320
efficiency between like 12 and 
22 miles an hour. 

490
00:22:27,320 --> 00:22:30,240
Now we're working on masks that 
have more efficiency higher up, 

491
00:22:30,240 --> 00:22:32,760
but when you when you do that, 
you opt to get dragged further 

492
00:22:32,760 --> 00:22:35,080
down. 
So it's about making that range 

493
00:22:35,080 --> 00:22:38,120
of speed as large as possible 
and also keeping that stiffness 

494
00:22:38,120 --> 00:22:39,880
there. 
So we don't have have any 

495
00:22:39,880 --> 00:22:42,800
breakages and have as much 
stiffness as possible row 

496
00:22:42,800 --> 00:22:44,600
riding. 
Yeah, yeah. 

497
00:22:44,600 --> 00:22:47,520
And in terms of 
interchangeability and 

498
00:22:47,960 --> 00:22:51,240
modularity, what's available in 
that range that people can sort 

499
00:22:51,240 --> 00:22:52,880
of swap in and out using the 
ones? 

500
00:22:52,880 --> 00:22:54,840
Yeah. 
So before I talk about that, 

501
00:22:54,840 --> 00:22:56,560
that's another benefit that you 
just reminded me of. 

502
00:22:56,560 --> 00:22:59,960
People here have actually 
stopped changing their hand 

503
00:22:59,960 --> 00:23:01,880
wings out and they just changed 
their front wing. 

504
00:23:01,920 --> 00:23:04,840
So they're on a 925. 
They go out, it's kind of light 

505
00:23:04,840 --> 00:23:07,200
wind, The wind picks up. 
Instead of coming in and getting

506
00:23:07,200 --> 00:23:09,840
their pump pumping another wing,
wrapping the other one up, 

507
00:23:09,840 --> 00:23:12,440
putting it back in their car, 
they put their front wing, 

508
00:23:12,440 --> 00:23:16,360
that's a 725 or an 825 down by 
the water, come in, switch it 

509
00:23:16,360 --> 00:23:17,640
out. 
The wing is still attached to 

510
00:23:17,640 --> 00:23:18,880
their leash. 
The board's upside down. 

511
00:23:18,880 --> 00:23:20,800
They're still dripping wet. 
They just pop it out and then go

512
00:23:20,800 --> 00:23:23,280
back out to ride the bigger 
swell that have come up or the 

513
00:23:23,280 --> 00:23:25,200
the higher winds and they want 
to ride faster. 

514
00:23:25,200 --> 00:23:27,760
That's that's another benefit. 
But in terms of our line 

515
00:23:27,760 --> 00:23:30,920
overall, we have 4 series. 1 is 
just for kite. 

516
00:23:30,920 --> 00:23:34,760
So there's three wings, 700 up 
to 1200 for more of the 

517
00:23:34,760 --> 00:23:38,040
efficiency style riding where 
it's like down winding winging 

518
00:23:38,040 --> 00:23:40,080
and beginner of all those 
sports. 

519
00:23:40,080 --> 00:23:42,520
We have the ES, which is our 
beginner front wing. 

520
00:23:42,520 --> 00:23:47,200
It's about 5:00 to 6:00 aspect 
ratio, nice big thing, very safe

521
00:23:47,480 --> 00:23:53,240
round of wing tips, all that. 
That's 1250155018502250. 

522
00:23:53,240 --> 00:23:57,200
So all the sizes. 
And then our kind of like mid 

523
00:23:57,200 --> 00:24:02,760
aspect is our glide series that 
goes 625 all the way up to 1525 

524
00:24:03,000 --> 00:24:09,080
and it goes 678911, 131525 S 
quite a quite a big range. 

525
00:24:09,080 --> 00:24:11,440
You can dock start on the big 
size, you can just RIP on the 

526
00:24:11,440 --> 00:24:15,480
6:25. 
And then we have our more 

527
00:24:15,480 --> 00:24:19,200
efficiency like high aspect. 
It's, it's only 11 aspect ratio.

528
00:24:19,640 --> 00:24:23,360
It's a a flow series and that 
comes in 600-800-1000. 

529
00:24:24,000 --> 00:24:26,680
And then we're working on higher
aspects in the in the 13 range 

530
00:24:26,680 --> 00:24:28,760
that that are pretty testing 
pretty well that we're pretty 

531
00:24:28,760 --> 00:24:32,120
excited about. 
They're going to come probably 

532
00:24:32,120 --> 00:24:33,640
in the spring. 
We're still working on the lay 

533
00:24:33,640 --> 00:24:35,280
UPS, trying to make them as 
stiff as possible. 

534
00:24:35,480 --> 00:24:37,760
We basically get like beginner 
intermediate advance. 

535
00:24:37,760 --> 00:24:40,800
And then we're going to have the
extra advance that that most 

536
00:24:40,800 --> 00:24:42,840
people will find pretty spicy. 
But they're going to they're 

537
00:24:42,840 --> 00:24:44,240
going to want to ride that at 
some point. 

538
00:24:44,280 --> 00:24:47,320
And it's a wing that's that's so
fun that it keeps me going back.

539
00:24:47,320 --> 00:24:49,440
I don't think I'll ever be able 
to master it just because it's 

540
00:24:49,440 --> 00:24:51,080
always kind of one step ahead of
me. 

541
00:24:51,080 --> 00:24:53,280
Always wants to go faster, 
always wants to turn tighter. 

542
00:24:54,000 --> 00:24:56,920
So that's really fun. 
But for now, yeah, we have those

543
00:24:56,920 --> 00:25:00,880
three series for efficiency 
foiling and then the one series 

544
00:25:00,880 --> 00:25:03,360
for kiting. 
And then for stabilizers, we 

545
00:25:03,360 --> 00:25:08,520
have our big, big 270 stabilizer
that's super easy to ride, very 

546
00:25:08,520 --> 00:25:11,360
stable in the roll. 
And then we have a 180 turbo 

547
00:25:11,360 --> 00:25:12,600
that's kind of like the all 
around. 

548
00:25:12,880 --> 00:25:15,920
Somebody wants the Cadillac, 
they go out and ride that my 

549
00:25:15,920 --> 00:25:17,760
Rolls Royce in, in Australia, I 
would imagine. 

550
00:25:18,440 --> 00:25:22,800
And then our kite stabilizer, 
the car 200 that's got winglets.

551
00:25:22,800 --> 00:25:25,400
So it's it's really good at 
holding its its edge when going 

552
00:25:25,400 --> 00:25:27,440
upwind. 
And then for our super efficient

553
00:25:27,880 --> 00:25:31,240
kind of high aspect stabilizer 
line, we have three that fit 

554
00:25:31,240 --> 00:25:35,680
into the flare stabilizer line. 
So there are 11 aspect ratio 175

555
00:25:35,920 --> 00:25:39,760
and a 145 and the 175 comes in 
two lengths, so 24, which is 

556
00:25:39,760 --> 00:25:42,080
pretty short. 
It would be like riding a 50cm 

557
00:25:42,080 --> 00:25:45,840
fuselage. 
And then the the long is a 30 

558
00:25:45,840 --> 00:25:47,880
centimeter fuselage on the tail,
right. 

559
00:25:47,880 --> 00:25:50,520
We can measure from the trailing
edge of the mass to the to the 

560
00:25:50,520 --> 00:25:52,720
center of the stabilizer. 
That would be like riding 

561
00:25:52,720 --> 00:25:58,280
probably like a 650 fuselage. 
So Stilo spicy versus the turbo 

562
00:25:58,280 --> 00:26:03,800
sit on a 36 and then the 270 
sits on a 38 centimeter. 

563
00:26:03,800 --> 00:26:06,920
So we kind of like as they get 
more efficient and more 

564
00:26:06,920 --> 00:26:08,920
advanced, we also shrink the 
tail so that it gets a lot more 

565
00:26:08,920 --> 00:26:11,400
playful. 
And then for mass line, 

566
00:26:11,720 --> 00:26:15,040
aluminum, carbon and then high 
modulus carbon, both the carbon 

567
00:26:15,040 --> 00:26:20,520
lines are in 3 sizes, 728292. 
And then we have a Pro HM1O2 for

568
00:26:20,520 --> 00:26:22,160
chyphoid. 
And that's that faster profile 

569
00:26:22,160 --> 00:26:24,160
that I was talking about. 
We're going to expand that down 

570
00:26:24,160 --> 00:26:27,840
at some point into faster mass 
overall for that more advanced 

571
00:26:27,840 --> 00:26:30,720
rider that's willing to suffer a
little bit on drag on the low 

572
00:26:30,720 --> 00:26:34,720
speeds, but get all that top end
once they start ripping and then

573
00:26:34,720 --> 00:26:36,840
aluminum, it's 52 all the way to
92. 

574
00:26:38,080 --> 00:26:41,120
And the one lock system is an 
alloy mast. 

575
00:26:41,120 --> 00:26:42,480
We've got a carbon version of 
it. 

576
00:26:43,240 --> 00:26:44,640
Yeah, we have both, Yeah, yeah, 
yeah. 

577
00:26:44,880 --> 00:26:47,840
So we have aluminum and then 
carbon and then high modulus 

578
00:26:47,840 --> 00:26:49,560
carbon. 
OK, so as if you. 

579
00:26:49,600 --> 00:26:50,720
Are flowings. 
Yeah. 

580
00:26:50,720 --> 00:26:54,360
Our flowings are high modulus 
carbon are glides, our normal 

581
00:26:54,360 --> 00:26:57,720
carbon and then our eases are 
like a carbon fiberglass mix 

582
00:26:58,360 --> 00:27:00,440
that has plenty of stiffness for
the amount of size. 

583
00:27:00,440 --> 00:27:03,200
But with the but the shape of 
it, you can have a lot of 

584
00:27:03,200 --> 00:27:06,200
strength by going a little bit 
more affordable in the in the 

585
00:27:06,200 --> 00:27:08,320
layup overall, so more people 
can get into the sport. 

586
00:27:08,920 --> 00:27:11,000
Yeah. 
And the sort of variety you've 

587
00:27:11,000 --> 00:27:15,000
been designing that for is 
you're saying kind of average 

588
00:27:15,000 --> 00:27:19,120
rider, above average rider in? 
Terms of eases, beginner rider 

589
00:27:19,120 --> 00:27:21,840
glide is kind of intermediate, 
but I still ride the 6:25. 

590
00:27:21,840 --> 00:27:25,040
That's my favorite wing just 
because when I go out, it's for 

591
00:27:25,040 --> 00:27:26,360
fun. 
It's usually on the really big 

592
00:27:26,360 --> 00:27:27,680
days. 
And I'd like that kind of 

593
00:27:27,680 --> 00:27:31,840
slightly lower aspect 9 AR to 
get into the bumps and not feel 

594
00:27:31,840 --> 00:27:34,520
like it's too high aspect and 
I've got too much going on out 

595
00:27:34,520 --> 00:27:38,120
at the tips. 
So that's while it's it desks or

596
00:27:38,120 --> 00:27:39,840
it's intended for the 
intermediate rider. 

597
00:27:39,840 --> 00:27:42,920
The size that you choose really 
depends like how advanced it is,

598
00:27:42,920 --> 00:27:44,800
right? 
Like the average intermediate 

599
00:27:44,800 --> 00:27:48,520
rider probably shouldn't ride a 
625, but 1525 might be too big. 

600
00:27:48,520 --> 00:27:50,800
And so it spans quite a large 
range of riders. 

601
00:27:50,800 --> 00:27:52,880
And then the Flow series is our 
11 AR. 

602
00:27:53,720 --> 00:27:57,800
That one's definitely more 
advanced, more rolly, faster, a 

603
00:27:57,880 --> 00:27:59,680
little bit less low and sharper 
tips. 

604
00:27:59,680 --> 00:28:01,680
You're going to not be happy if 
you hit him. 

605
00:28:01,760 --> 00:28:05,080
You know, kind of that same game
as with everybody with an 11 AR 

606
00:28:05,840 --> 00:28:08,040
win. 
And in terms of you, you said 

607
00:28:08,040 --> 00:28:09,960
there was one for for dock 
falling at that. 

608
00:28:09,960 --> 00:28:11,440
That's getting pretty popular 
here. 

609
00:28:11,440 --> 00:28:14,640
It's a great offseason thing to 
do when you haven't got the 

610
00:28:14,640 --> 00:28:16,560
summer breezes. 
What? 

611
00:28:16,560 --> 00:28:18,080
Which one did you recommend for 
that again? 

612
00:28:19,000 --> 00:28:22,840
Yeah, we got that 1525 for like 
the large guys and then a 1325 

613
00:28:22,840 --> 00:28:27,440
for medium or smaller people. 
And then actually I'm talking to

614
00:28:27,440 --> 00:28:29,600
team riders from other brands. 
They've they've tried our our 

615
00:28:29,600 --> 00:28:32,600
flow series and they feel like 
the 800 is the best advanced 

616
00:28:32,720 --> 00:28:35,480
dark start set up a little small
for most people. 

617
00:28:35,480 --> 00:28:37,680
I'm not sure I could ride it, 
but a lot of time Doc, sorry, 

618
00:28:37,680 --> 00:28:40,280
but these kids that are really 
good, they they like that wing a

619
00:28:40,280 --> 00:28:41,760
lot. 
And we have 1000 that helps. 

620
00:28:41,760 --> 00:28:44,160
And then at some point we're 
going to release the Flow 1200, 

621
00:28:44,160 --> 00:28:47,720
which will be kind of our pair 
wing, front wing and dark star 

622
00:28:47,720 --> 00:28:49,120
wing for for the advanced 
riders. 

623
00:28:49,120 --> 00:28:50,920
And that's I've written that 
decent amount. 

624
00:28:50,920 --> 00:28:52,920
We just checked it off. 
It's it's a great wing, super 

625
00:28:52,920 --> 00:28:56,120
fun, really efficient and and 
nice to ride. 

626
00:28:56,480 --> 00:28:59,800
And you've released quite a few 
other products, folding products

627
00:28:59,880 --> 00:29:02,800
this year as well with 2026 kind
of lineup. 

628
00:29:02,800 --> 00:29:05,240
Can you give us a bit of an 
overview of of some of the 

629
00:29:05,240 --> 00:29:07,640
things that you know you're 
excited about that have come out

630
00:29:08,000 --> 00:29:08,720
recently? 
Yeah. 

631
00:29:08,720 --> 00:29:11,960
So for the boards, we have a 
whole new line of wing boards. 

632
00:29:11,960 --> 00:29:17,320
We basically, I think a year and
a half ago sat down with Gabriel

633
00:29:17,480 --> 00:29:20,440
our our board designer were 
like, hey, throw out everything 

634
00:29:20,440 --> 00:29:22,080
we've been doing. 
Like we want to really 

635
00:29:22,080 --> 00:29:25,080
understand what makes a board 
release off the water as easy as

636
00:29:25,080 --> 00:29:27,520
possible. 
And he came up with this concept

637
00:29:27,520 --> 00:29:30,040
that the Tri surface planning 
hole, which is like a marketing 

638
00:29:30,440 --> 00:29:34,840
word for the idea that the 
chimes go about 1/3 of the way 

639
00:29:34,840 --> 00:29:37,920
in on each side of the board, 
Super slight angle and then the 

640
00:29:37,920 --> 00:29:40,160
bottoms flat. 
And so as you get going, those 

641
00:29:40,160 --> 00:29:42,040
chimes easily come up out of the
water. 

642
00:29:42,120 --> 00:29:44,280
And then you've just got a 
smaller surface on the bottom. 

643
00:29:45,200 --> 00:29:47,640
And then on the tail, we 
basically chopped most of the 

644
00:29:47,640 --> 00:29:50,400
tails off so that all the water 
releases at the same time. 

645
00:29:51,040 --> 00:29:52,480
And that really helps. 
Like you look at some of these 

646
00:29:52,480 --> 00:29:55,040
boards that have kind of a 
stepped angle at the tail. 

647
00:29:55,040 --> 00:29:57,880
We've had a couple that released
and when you're riding, you're 

648
00:29:57,880 --> 00:30:00,080
just about to get on foil and 
you feel that tail kind of suck 

649
00:30:00,080 --> 00:30:02,080
you down a little bit. 
We wanted to avoid that. 

650
00:30:02,080 --> 00:30:05,560
And so how do you make a long 
board release off the water with

651
00:30:05,560 --> 00:30:07,400
our flow crafts? 
That's our mid length line. 

652
00:30:08,080 --> 00:30:09,760
That was by just chopping off 
the back. 

653
00:30:09,760 --> 00:30:12,800
And so those two boards, glide 
craft and flow craft are really,

654
00:30:12,800 --> 00:30:15,160
really nice boards. 
There's they're super easy to 

655
00:30:15,160 --> 00:30:16,480
ride. 
The mid length, obviously a 

656
00:30:16,480 --> 00:30:20,200
little bit easy or harder, but 
we didn't go full super narrow 

657
00:30:20,200 --> 00:30:22,360
mid length, right, like the 
seventeens that people are 

658
00:30:22,360 --> 00:30:25,600
riding, you know, they're really
that's a that's a very advanced 

659
00:30:25,600 --> 00:30:27,880
board. 
Like for me, it's fun for the 

660
00:30:28,080 --> 00:30:29,680
normal person out there. 
They're they're pretty 

661
00:30:29,680 --> 00:30:32,040
aggressive. 
So we kept it around 20 to 20, 

662
00:30:32,560 --> 00:30:36,360
two, I think in terms of width 
from 45 up to 95. 

663
00:30:36,360 --> 00:30:39,520
So you get most of the 
stability, but with as much 

664
00:30:39,520 --> 00:30:41,880
efficiency as you can as you can
throw in that shape. 

665
00:30:42,480 --> 00:30:45,200
And most people too, they ride a
little a little more offset. 

666
00:30:45,200 --> 00:30:46,920
Like you look at some people 
here, they're riding toes 

667
00:30:46,920 --> 00:30:49,720
forward. 
So that added weight or added 

668
00:30:49,720 --> 00:30:52,400
width gives you a little bit 
more of that leverage side to 

669
00:30:52,400 --> 00:30:54,800
side. 
And then our glide craft starts 

670
00:30:54,800 --> 00:30:59,240
at like 23 1/2 wide in the 70 
and goes up to 26, I think in 

671
00:30:59,240 --> 00:31:00,400
the 1:20. 
So that's kind of our 

672
00:31:00,400 --> 00:31:03,400
intermediate beginner board 
depending on the size that you 

673
00:31:03,400 --> 00:31:04,720
choose. 
And then we also spend a lot of 

674
00:31:04,720 --> 00:31:06,720
time on the layups overall to 
make the boards lighter. 

675
00:31:07,640 --> 00:31:11,520
So I think our 55 is like 9 1/2 
lbs now, which is is pretty good

676
00:31:11,520 --> 00:31:14,520
for us. 
We've we've come along in, in 

677
00:31:14,520 --> 00:31:16,240
that, in that space in the 
layups. 

678
00:31:16,240 --> 00:31:19,000
Gabriel spent a bunch of time in
China working with those guys in

679
00:31:19,000 --> 00:31:21,760
the factory trying to make make 
them more more efficient at 

680
00:31:21,760 --> 00:31:24,400
building and keeping more of 
that epoxy out so you don't just

681
00:31:24,400 --> 00:31:26,200
layer it on and throw a bunch of
putty on top. 

682
00:31:27,000 --> 00:31:29,640
You mean it must must be a 
challenge to get you got to get 

683
00:31:29,720 --> 00:31:32,440
maintained strength that 
everyone wants, everything 

684
00:31:32,440 --> 00:31:34,400
lighter. 
Yeah, everyone wants. 

685
00:31:34,560 --> 00:31:36,240
Lighter, but they also want to 
be able to drop it on the 

686
00:31:36,240 --> 00:31:38,360
ground. 
And in this industry too, 

687
00:31:38,360 --> 00:31:39,960
everyone loves to warranty 
stuff, I find. 

688
00:31:39,960 --> 00:31:42,760
So you got to make sure that 
they're not just like cracking 

689
00:31:42,760 --> 00:31:45,120
it when they accidentally bump 
their car and stuff like that. 

690
00:31:45,760 --> 00:31:49,000
Whereas like in surf, you break 
your board, there's no warranty,

691
00:31:49,000 --> 00:31:51,320
right? 
Like you, you rode it too hard. 

692
00:31:51,320 --> 00:31:52,920
You know, wind sports is very 
different. 

693
00:31:52,920 --> 00:31:56,360
So we're trying to keep that in 
mind and not go too, too low on 

694
00:31:56,360 --> 00:31:58,720
the durability scale because we 
were still like to kind of have 

695
00:31:58,720 --> 00:32:00,800
that in all our products. 
It's kind of one of our main 

696
00:32:00,800 --> 00:32:03,200
focuses here at Slingshot. 
Yeah. 

697
00:32:04,480 --> 00:32:07,040
A lot smaller. 
We have two boards, Dwarf Craft 

698
00:32:07,040 --> 00:32:10,280
and Hope Craft that just 
released got some improvements 

699
00:32:10,280 --> 00:32:13,320
in the chimes and then we have 
the puddle pumper that's 

700
00:32:13,320 --> 00:32:16,720
actually our dock start board. 
Super super user friendly and 

701
00:32:16,720 --> 00:32:20,320
really affordable in the US it's
like 399, maybe 450 now at the 

702
00:32:20,320 --> 00:32:24,360
tariffs, but that's a pretty 
good price board, super stiff 

703
00:32:24,360 --> 00:32:26,480
you can hit it with a hammer. 
It's not going to break, which 

704
00:32:26,480 --> 00:32:30,440
is really nice and then for the 
more premium dark star board, 

705
00:32:30,440 --> 00:32:33,480
you go up to the hope craft. 
We have an 80cm or 90cm so you 

706
00:32:33,480 --> 00:32:35,240
can really get rid of a lot of 
that swing weight and. 

707
00:32:35,840 --> 00:32:37,920
What about your? 
What about your wings? 

708
00:32:38,400 --> 00:32:39,840
What are you? 
What have you got in there? 

709
00:32:40,040 --> 00:32:43,600
Yeah, so we released the Sling 
Wing V6 and then the NXT V2. 

710
00:32:43,600 --> 00:32:47,240
So NXT is made out of a Lula 
Full Lula Super Performance 

711
00:32:47,240 --> 00:32:50,520
Premium, really, really stiff. 
And then we have our V6 that's 

712
00:32:50,640 --> 00:32:52,840
built in Dacron, a little bit 
more affordable, still gets a 

713
00:32:52,840 --> 00:32:54,440
lot of that stiffness. 
The leading edge is a little bit

714
00:32:54,440 --> 00:32:56,680
bigger. 
So you get the same similar 

715
00:32:56,680 --> 00:33:00,640
stiffness with with a less stiff
material overall. 

716
00:33:01,200 --> 00:33:05,040
And then the V6 has code 95 P, 
which is like the stiffer 

717
00:33:05,040 --> 00:33:07,440
trailing edge doesn't get 
destroyed in the waves or 

718
00:33:07,440 --> 00:33:08,920
stretch out. 
And then the Alula version is 

719
00:33:08,920 --> 00:33:11,960
all about weight savings. 
And so super light canopy 

720
00:33:11,960 --> 00:33:15,960
overall and and we're working on
this new carbon handle as well 

721
00:33:15,960 --> 00:33:18,640
for those wings. 
It's not quite done yet, but at 

722
00:33:18,640 --> 00:33:21,880
some point we'll release that 
and that saves, it's like 40% 

723
00:33:21,880 --> 00:33:24,800
lighter overall in the handle 
versus our current handle. 

724
00:33:24,800 --> 00:33:27,560
So that'll be an added benefit 
at some point when it comes out.

725
00:33:28,160 --> 00:33:30,640
Yeah. 
But have you, have you done a 

726
00:33:30,640 --> 00:33:33,160
Lula Wings before in the series 
or is this? 

727
00:33:33,440 --> 00:33:34,520
Yeah, is it new? 
Yeah. 

728
00:33:34,840 --> 00:33:37,760
So we have the NXTV. 
Was that released like 2 years 

729
00:33:37,760 --> 00:33:38,880
ago? 
A year and a half ago. 

730
00:33:39,360 --> 00:33:41,480
OK. 
This one's significantly better.

731
00:33:41,480 --> 00:33:44,920
Obviously it's it's a lot better
in the tack, doesn't roll under 

732
00:33:44,920 --> 00:33:47,520
the board as much. 
We really fine-tuned it a lot 

733
00:33:47,520 --> 00:33:50,760
after our first Alula wing. 
So it's really, really a nice 

734
00:33:50,760 --> 00:33:52,800
wing to use. 
A lot of people that have rented

735
00:33:52,800 --> 00:33:54,520
it have actually come back and 
said the same things. 

736
00:33:54,520 --> 00:33:57,160
That kind of feels like a 
Mercedes on the road, like it's 

737
00:33:58,040 --> 00:34:00,200
very direct. 
Yeah, all that kind. 

738
00:34:01,080 --> 00:34:03,560
There's V brands that were they 
were kind of holding back on 

739
00:34:03,560 --> 00:34:06,960
Alula because it's not as you 
know, it's it's just not as as 

740
00:34:06,960 --> 00:34:09,199
strong as some of the other 
materials, but it has a lot 

741
00:34:09,320 --> 00:34:12,440
benefits. 
So that some some have been a 

742
00:34:12,440 --> 00:34:15,639
bit slower and some have rice 
riding and jumped on it. 

743
00:34:15,639 --> 00:34:18,159
So it's, you know, it's 
interesting to see which brands 

744
00:34:18,159 --> 00:34:19,480
are. 
Yeah, yeah. 

745
00:34:19,560 --> 00:34:22,840
What I found in terms of the 
durability side of the material 

746
00:34:23,239 --> 00:34:27,920
is it's not so much the material
Lula, it's the stitching that 

747
00:34:27,920 --> 00:34:30,560
brands choose to use or the 
bladders that they choose to 

748
00:34:30,560 --> 00:34:34,400
use. 
And so I, I had this 35 that was

749
00:34:34,400 --> 00:34:37,679
our check off version of the NX 
TV2, basically our last sample 

750
00:34:37,679 --> 00:34:39,040
when we said, OK, this is good 
to go. 

751
00:34:39,719 --> 00:34:41,600
I think I've got like 300 hours 
on it. 

752
00:34:41,679 --> 00:34:44,679
It's the one that I do all the I
did like a shove it on it. 

753
00:34:44,679 --> 00:34:47,080
That's, that's the same exact 
wing that I've been riding for 

754
00:34:47,239 --> 00:34:51,280
like a year now. 
And I don't fold it properly. 

755
00:34:51,280 --> 00:34:54,280
Everyone complaints that I'm not
holding it when I wrap it up 

756
00:34:54,280 --> 00:34:57,400
properly, but I haven't had any 
issues with it. 

757
00:34:57,400 --> 00:35:00,080
It's because the seams have 
really been beefed up because 

758
00:35:00,080 --> 00:35:02,600
the material like in the 
factory, they lay out the whole 

759
00:35:02,600 --> 00:35:05,800
sheet, shine a flashlight behind
it and check for the quality of 

760
00:35:05,800 --> 00:35:08,400
the material before they use it 
in in wings or kites. 

761
00:35:08,400 --> 00:35:10,600
And so they're really diligent 
about that. 

762
00:35:10,600 --> 00:35:14,040
And we're really diligent about 
the seam and the backing tape on

763
00:35:14,040 --> 00:35:16,160
it and try and keep that 
strength there as much as 

764
00:35:16,160 --> 00:35:18,920
possible. 
So we really have, I don't think

765
00:35:18,920 --> 00:35:22,480
we've had any warranties on 
blowouts or the material 

766
00:35:22,480 --> 00:35:24,960
breaking at all just because 
that part is so durable. 

767
00:35:26,080 --> 00:35:28,040
There's always people that like 
pop their wing with airfoil and 

768
00:35:28,040 --> 00:35:30,120
stuff like that. 
Our investor did it the other 

769
00:35:30,120 --> 00:35:32,640
day and to tell him he was kind 
of out of luck because it is 

770
00:35:32,640 --> 00:35:35,000
foil headed. 
But in terms of the durability 

771
00:35:35,000 --> 00:35:37,640
of the material, I haven't seen 
anything that that makes me 

772
00:35:37,640 --> 00:35:39,880
think it's not as strong or 
stronger than Dacron. 

773
00:35:40,440 --> 00:35:41,880
Yeah, yeah. 
And you're right about the 

774
00:35:41,880 --> 00:35:43,960
bladders. 
I think there's been a couple of

775
00:35:44,720 --> 00:35:46,960
couple of instances or brands 
that have used quite, really 

776
00:35:46,960 --> 00:35:50,160
thin bladders and they're just 
constantly causing issues. 

777
00:35:50,160 --> 00:35:53,040
I mean, I've heard of people 
just whinging along and they 

778
00:35:53,120 --> 00:35:56,080
literally have exploded. 
Yeah, yeah. 

779
00:35:56,080 --> 00:35:58,640
So that can be a bit of an issue
as well I think. 

780
00:35:59,080 --> 00:36:01,760
Yeah, I think that there's 
there's that chase of poor 

781
00:36:01,760 --> 00:36:05,600
performance and lightweight and 
there's a lot of downsides, 

782
00:36:05,600 --> 00:36:07,400
right? 
Like you start driving a 

783
00:36:07,400 --> 00:36:09,880
Porsche, you're going to have a 
lot of a lot of reasons to take 

784
00:36:09,880 --> 00:36:11,880
it back to the mechanic to get 
it fixed, right? 

785
00:36:11,880 --> 00:36:13,320
And we don't really want to have
that. 

786
00:36:13,600 --> 00:36:16,040
We try to get as close to a 
Porsche as possible without 

787
00:36:16,040 --> 00:36:19,320
having those issues because we 
don't really want to have to 

788
00:36:19,320 --> 00:36:21,360
have the customer go on a trip 
and have an issue, right? 

789
00:36:21,360 --> 00:36:25,240
That would be a big bummer. 
And I don't remember I changed 

790
00:36:25,240 --> 00:36:28,960
out of bladder with Slingshot. 
Whereas you go on trips and you 

791
00:36:28,960 --> 00:36:30,320
hear about all these people that
have issues. 

792
00:36:30,320 --> 00:36:33,000
It's it's really an added 
benefit that that I think we've 

793
00:36:33,000 --> 00:36:35,400
spent a lot of time making sure 
that durability that I keep 

794
00:36:35,400 --> 00:36:38,120
saying is is present at 
Slingshot for all of our 

795
00:36:38,120 --> 00:36:40,560
products. 
My backgrounds, marketing and 

796
00:36:40,560 --> 00:36:42,400
branding. 
So I want to ask you a few 

797
00:36:42,400 --> 00:36:45,160
questions about kind of 
Slingshot as a as a brand in the

798
00:36:45,160 --> 00:36:48,840
competitive market. 
When when people think of 

799
00:36:48,840 --> 00:36:51,720
Slingshot as a brand, what do 
you want to come to mind? 

800
00:36:51,720 --> 00:36:55,400
What are the associations that 
you're aiming to build around 

801
00:36:55,400 --> 00:36:58,280
Slingshot? 
Yes, that's that's an issue 

802
00:36:58,280 --> 00:37:01,440
we're grappling with right now 
is it's a lot of people think 

803
00:37:01,800 --> 00:37:03,320
Slingshot used to be innovative,
right. 

804
00:37:03,320 --> 00:37:07,560
Like you look back at 2000 to 
2014, a lot of great products 

805
00:37:07,560 --> 00:37:11,080
like we had the one pump, the 
bars that never wore out, the 

806
00:37:11,080 --> 00:37:13,000
RPM came out really changed the 
game. 

807
00:37:13,000 --> 00:37:15,320
And then the the Hoverglide 
foil, those colorful ones with 

808
00:37:15,320 --> 00:37:18,840
the neon green and yellow front 
wings, really innovative 

809
00:37:18,840 --> 00:37:20,440
products. 
Then we had a slump, basically 

810
00:37:20,440 --> 00:37:25,000
20, I think kind of 2017 until 
2024. 

811
00:37:25,840 --> 00:37:30,840
And in 2021 we got a new guy 
that came in and kind of helped 

812
00:37:30,840 --> 00:37:35,240
us reorg a little bit and said, 
hey, we need to invest in new 

813
00:37:35,240 --> 00:37:37,880
designers, right? 
We need a younger group inside 

814
00:37:37,880 --> 00:37:40,080
this office working on new ideas
and stuff like that. 

815
00:37:40,080 --> 00:37:44,240
So we hired Addie, a guy named 
Bobby again, and Gabriel and I 

816
00:37:44,240 --> 00:37:46,560
was one of those hires too. 
So basically brought the average

817
00:37:46,560 --> 00:37:49,480
age of Slingshot down by 
probably 20-30 years, which was 

818
00:37:49,480 --> 00:37:51,920
huge. 
A lot of new ideas though that 

819
00:37:51,920 --> 00:37:54,960
started in 2021 and, and 
everybody's like they started 

820
00:37:54,960 --> 00:37:57,400
going down the hill of, of 
designing right and, and 

821
00:37:57,400 --> 00:38:01,840
bringing out new products. 
And I do feel like 2024, we were

822
00:38:01,840 --> 00:38:04,200
halfway there in terms of having
all of our products be really 

823
00:38:04,200 --> 00:38:07,600
high level, 2020 five, 100%. 
I think all of the products that

824
00:38:07,600 --> 00:38:09,520
we have in our line are really 
there. 

825
00:38:09,520 --> 00:38:11,800
So now we're trying to figure 
out how do we how do we tell 

826
00:38:11,800 --> 00:38:14,680
that to the customer that that 
we're back, Slingshot is back, 

827
00:38:14,680 --> 00:38:17,800
the innovation is back and one 
of the ways was, was through 

828
00:38:18,080 --> 00:38:20,280
that campaign feel. 
The difference is that don't 

829
00:38:20,280 --> 00:38:22,960
necessarily take our word for, 
for the product being better 

830
00:38:22,960 --> 00:38:26,600
because everyone says that we've
been saying it for years doesn't

831
00:38:26,600 --> 00:38:27,800
actually mean anything these 
days. 

832
00:38:28,240 --> 00:38:30,920
It's more go to your local 
retailer, go to these demo 

833
00:38:30,920 --> 00:38:33,480
centers that we have and go try 
the product for yourself. 

834
00:38:33,680 --> 00:38:36,680
You know, and this summer we 
basically you haven't been a 

835
00:38:36,680 --> 00:38:38,640
Hood River, but our office is 
right on the water. 

836
00:38:38,640 --> 00:38:41,400
And downstairs we have this 
garage that used to be our huge 

837
00:38:41,400 --> 00:38:42,720
R&D space, which is great for 
me. 

838
00:38:42,720 --> 00:38:46,120
But our CEO came in one day and 
he was like, hey, we need 

839
00:38:46,120 --> 00:38:47,760
product people trying our 
product for free. 

840
00:38:48,200 --> 00:38:52,840
So we, we shrank the RNG size by
50% of the garage or 50%. 

841
00:38:53,520 --> 00:38:56,440
Still plenty of space. 
Obviously we have tons of boxes 

842
00:38:56,440 --> 00:39:00,000
and tons of places to play gear.
But we have 50% of that garage 

843
00:39:00,000 --> 00:39:02,360
went into a demo center where 
people could walk in for free 

844
00:39:02,360 --> 00:39:05,040
and then check out a product for
two to three days. 

845
00:39:05,760 --> 00:39:09,000
So they got to take it home, 
deal with it, kind of use it, 

846
00:39:09,000 --> 00:39:11,400
take it out on a couple sessions
and then bring it back. 

847
00:39:11,760 --> 00:39:14,480
Then they could come back and 
try another product the next the

848
00:39:14,480 --> 00:39:17,840
next time they came in. 
And that worked really well for 

849
00:39:17,840 --> 00:39:22,400
us, really got out these new 
2026, yeah, 2026 product line 

850
00:39:22,400 --> 00:39:24,800
products onto the water and in 
people's hands. 

851
00:39:25,920 --> 00:39:28,000
That's kind of one of the ways. 
But obviously we could do like a

852
00:39:28,000 --> 00:39:30,880
docu series on, on each one of 
our designers that we've 

853
00:39:30,880 --> 00:39:33,680
invested in things like that and
and that'll come down the pipe. 

854
00:39:33,680 --> 00:39:34,960
But there's only so much 
bandwidth. 

855
00:39:34,960 --> 00:39:37,880
And for us, innovation is, is 
really important. 

856
00:39:38,280 --> 00:39:39,760
Obviously the marketing side is 
important too. 

857
00:39:39,760 --> 00:39:44,120
And we, we have guys doing that.
But in terms of like, do we put 

858
00:39:44,120 --> 00:39:47,120
Bobby, our foil designer on 
camera talking about a foil that

859
00:39:47,120 --> 00:39:49,360
he's designing? 
Or do we rather have him design 

860
00:39:49,360 --> 00:39:52,160
the foil and actually make a 
product that comes to, you know,

861
00:39:52,160 --> 00:39:53,480
like it's kind of that trade off
right now. 

862
00:39:53,480 --> 00:39:56,200
I think in the winter as things 
slow down a little bit here and 

863
00:39:56,200 --> 00:39:58,280
there's not as many people 
walking in and asking questions 

864
00:39:58,280 --> 00:40:01,760
about our new products, we'll be
able to do that a bit better and

865
00:40:01,760 --> 00:40:04,560
and film that. 
So that's definitely one of the,

866
00:40:04,680 --> 00:40:06,920
one of the steps we're going to 
take overall. 

867
00:40:07,000 --> 00:40:09,000
And then obviously like 
education about our product. 

868
00:40:09,000 --> 00:40:12,760
We, we've been running some ads 
on not necessarily just like, 

869
00:40:12,760 --> 00:40:15,440
Hey, buy this for this discount.
You know, it's, it's more like 

870
00:40:15,720 --> 00:40:18,280
learn about the one lock system.
We have a foil Finder on our 

871
00:40:18,280 --> 00:40:21,200
website that you can click 
through and it, it gives you the

872
00:40:21,200 --> 00:40:24,640
foil that I would recommend. 
I, I built it with AJ, our, our 

873
00:40:24,640 --> 00:40:26,840
website guy, and we were like, 
Hey, let's help the customer 

874
00:40:26,840 --> 00:40:29,680
understand what foil and our 
line we think they should be 

875
00:40:29,680 --> 00:40:31,160
riding without having to call 
us, right? 

876
00:40:31,160 --> 00:40:34,320
So you can click through that, 
choose your weight, wind speed, 

877
00:40:34,320 --> 00:40:38,440
sport, skill level, all that, 
and it'll spit out the foil that

878
00:40:38,440 --> 00:40:41,240
that I would recommend for you. 
And there's obviously like a 

879
00:40:41,240 --> 00:40:44,040
little bit of play there. 
You can mix and match stabilize 

880
00:40:44,040 --> 00:40:45,760
in the front wings depending on 
the wind speed and stuff. 

881
00:40:45,760 --> 00:40:48,880
But it's about trying to make it
easier to understand, like what 

882
00:40:48,960 --> 00:40:51,560
what product would fit for you 
so that if you buy something you

883
00:40:51,560 --> 00:40:54,000
are happy with it overall. 
Yeah. 

884
00:40:54,160 --> 00:40:56,360
So there's a couple ways. 
Obviously you can always do 

885
00:40:56,360 --> 00:40:58,800
more, but it's a little hard 
these days. 

886
00:40:59,000 --> 00:41:01,880
You got to pay, pay a lot of a 
lot of money for athletes and 

887
00:41:01,880 --> 00:41:03,920
stuff like that. 
So we're kind of going back out 

888
00:41:03,920 --> 00:41:07,840
and and talking to athletes and 
stuff like that, seeing it's a 

889
00:41:07,840 --> 00:41:09,240
lot. 
It's a lot better now you just 

890
00:41:09,240 --> 00:41:11,960
to be when your product isn't 
good, you got to pay money for 

891
00:41:11,960 --> 00:41:14,600
people to ride your stuff And 
it's not, it's not a great 

892
00:41:14,600 --> 00:41:16,400
relationship, right? 
But now we have actually people 

893
00:41:16,400 --> 00:41:18,520
come in to us being like, Hey, 
I've seen the one lock. 

894
00:41:18,520 --> 00:41:19,800
I've written it. 
I really enjoy it. 

895
00:41:20,400 --> 00:41:22,760
I love your new wings. 
They, the kids, they like to 

896
00:41:22,760 --> 00:41:26,040
spin and flip on them. 
The, the older guys that they, 

897
00:41:26,080 --> 00:41:28,160
they really like them too. 
And then our kites, I don't know

898
00:41:28,160 --> 00:41:30,560
if you know anything about 
kiting on a twin tip, but our 

899
00:41:30,560 --> 00:41:33,320
big air, a series of kites is 
doing really, really well. 

900
00:41:33,320 --> 00:41:35,720
Our, our athlete just won the 
latest competition. 

901
00:41:35,760 --> 00:41:38,200
I think we're going to have 
probably 2:00 to 3:00, maybe 4 

902
00:41:38,200 --> 00:41:41,360
athletes in King of the Air. 
So we've really innovative a lot

903
00:41:41,360 --> 00:41:43,240
in kite. 
That is a four letter podcast. 

904
00:41:43,240 --> 00:41:46,520
It doesn't really matter, but 
we've we've been putting for 

905
00:41:46,520 --> 00:41:49,760
everywhere and and I think 
that's important to to know and 

906
00:41:49,760 --> 00:41:51,560
to see in in our product line 
overall. 

907
00:41:52,120 --> 00:41:54,480
Yeah. 
So, so from, you know, one of 

908
00:41:54,480 --> 00:41:57,160
the challenges for any brands to
stand out in the market. 

909
00:41:57,160 --> 00:42:01,480
So is innovation one of the key 
platforms for the Slingshot 

910
00:42:01,480 --> 00:42:04,600
brand going forward or are there
some other elements that you 

911
00:42:04,600 --> 00:42:05,200
want in there? 
Yeah. 

912
00:42:05,240 --> 00:42:07,680
I mean, we've always we've 
always done well when we've 

913
00:42:07,680 --> 00:42:10,280
innovative, like those products 
that I've said change the 

914
00:42:10,280 --> 00:42:11,960
market. 
One, however, glad got people 

915
00:42:11,960 --> 00:42:13,920
unemployment when they thought 
it was really gnarly because of 

916
00:42:14,400 --> 00:42:17,160
the safe colors and like the 
ease of use and kind of making 

917
00:42:17,160 --> 00:42:19,360
that flight system where you 
could have different length 

918
00:42:19,360 --> 00:42:20,560
mass. 
You didn't have to just get 

919
00:42:20,560 --> 00:42:23,280
right into it. 
The one pump easier to pump up 

920
00:42:23,280 --> 00:42:25,560
your kite, the bars that don't 
wear out. 

921
00:42:25,560 --> 00:42:28,360
All those kind of things were 
innovations where we won and it 

922
00:42:28,360 --> 00:42:30,320
and it paid off right. 
And so now we're trying to make 

923
00:42:30,320 --> 00:42:32,600
sure that that is in a lot of 
places in our product. 

924
00:42:32,600 --> 00:42:36,280
And if the product isn't 
actually doing a service to the 

925
00:42:36,280 --> 00:42:39,880
customer and in the new model, 
we don't actually bring it out. 

926
00:42:40,000 --> 00:42:42,440
And so there's always like 
before we product, we say, Hey, 

927
00:42:42,880 --> 00:42:43,800
have we made it? 
Is it? 

928
00:42:43,800 --> 00:42:45,600
Is the customer really going to 
enjoy this product? 

929
00:42:45,600 --> 00:42:47,080
Are they going to like it better
than the last one? 

930
00:42:47,080 --> 00:42:48,480
Or is it just like a graphic 
update? 

931
00:42:48,480 --> 00:42:53,120
That's kind of kind of weird and
are not necessarily necessary, 

932
00:42:53,120 --> 00:42:55,920
right where we just like flog 
hold stock and then bring up 

933
00:42:55,920 --> 00:42:59,800
bring a new one. 
And so we've been really, really

934
00:42:59,800 --> 00:43:02,000
mindful of that. 
And we've also obviously with 

935
00:43:02,000 --> 00:43:04,680
more designers, you design a lot
more, you can have more time on 

936
00:43:04,680 --> 00:43:06,880
each product. 
So whereas before we had one guy

937
00:43:06,880 --> 00:43:09,760
doing kite wing and foil, now we
have a kite guy, we have a foil 

938
00:43:09,760 --> 00:43:12,320
guy, we got a wing guy and we 
have a board guy. 

939
00:43:12,520 --> 00:43:15,680
And so that like it's very, very
clear in our product that 

940
00:43:15,680 --> 00:43:17,920
everything is much more well 
thought out and we have a lot 

941
00:43:17,920 --> 00:43:20,480
more time to be like, hey, are 
we ready for that product to 

942
00:43:20,480 --> 00:43:22,360
come out? 
You know, and so sometimes we 

943
00:43:22,360 --> 00:43:24,800
delay, sometimes we bring things
up and release them earlier, 

944
00:43:24,800 --> 00:43:27,760
like we did with our mid length 
boards this year, releasing them

945
00:43:27,760 --> 00:43:30,520
Midsummer versus at the end of 
the summer when when we had 

946
00:43:30,520 --> 00:43:33,840
originally planned to. 
So yeah, innovations are going 

947
00:43:33,840 --> 00:43:36,440
to be pretty important. 
We were in that slump, right? 

948
00:43:36,440 --> 00:43:39,240
We're coming out of that slump. 
I think that's important to to 

949
00:43:39,240 --> 00:43:41,040
be mindful of why we got into 
that slump. 

950
00:43:41,040 --> 00:43:43,080
It's because of lack of 
innovation, just like putting a 

951
00:43:43,080 --> 00:43:46,280
new graphic on the same product 
and saying, hey, it's a new RPM 

952
00:43:46,280 --> 00:43:48,760
or something like that. 
So we're being very mindful of 

953
00:43:48,760 --> 00:43:51,400
that overall. 
It's not always smooth sailing 

954
00:43:51,400 --> 00:43:53,440
for all brands. 
There are moments where you look

955
00:43:53,440 --> 00:43:55,680
back and say how did we, how did
we get here? 

956
00:43:55,720 --> 00:43:57,560
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 
But it's a matter of learning 

957
00:43:57,560 --> 00:43:59,960
from that, I suppose. 
And sounds like you've you've 

958
00:43:59,960 --> 00:44:02,800
kind of reflected on that. 
And certainly you've certainly 

959
00:44:02,800 --> 00:44:06,040
got products like the One Lock 
which clearly didn't demonstrate

960
00:44:06,040 --> 00:44:07,760
innovation. 
No one else is doing anything, 

961
00:44:08,160 --> 00:44:11,080
anything like that. 
So it's a good platform to 

962
00:44:11,080 --> 00:44:13,040
communicate that I would think. 
Yeah, we're very. 

963
00:44:13,360 --> 00:44:16,280
That's obviously like the thing 
that everyone looks at, but it's

964
00:44:16,480 --> 00:44:18,520
anywhere you look on the on the 
product line. 

965
00:44:18,840 --> 00:44:21,000
Yeah, you can really see what 
we've done, right when you 

966
00:44:21,000 --> 00:44:23,680
compare it to the old, old 
stuff, even last year, like huge

967
00:44:23,680 --> 00:44:26,640
jump in our board design, you 
jump into foil. 

968
00:44:26,640 --> 00:44:29,920
Obviously the wings feel much 
better on the water. 

969
00:44:30,000 --> 00:44:33,480
The kites are just blowing 
people's minds, so it's really 

970
00:44:33,480 --> 00:44:35,880
exciting. 
And where's, where's the split 

971
00:44:35,880 --> 00:44:38,760
first Slingshot in terms of, you
know, is there a focus you 

972
00:44:38,760 --> 00:44:41,320
obviously got, you're very 
strong in karting, there's 

973
00:44:41,320 --> 00:44:44,480
winging. 
Where does the Slingshot brand 

974
00:44:44,480 --> 00:44:48,080
set sort of sit in that? 
Is it is it moving in any 

975
00:44:48,080 --> 00:44:49,880
direction? 
Are you focusing more or less in

976
00:44:49,880 --> 00:44:53,640
one area or is it a crossbow? 
Pretty easily, it's a small 

977
00:44:53,640 --> 00:44:56,160
industry, right? 
Like we are, we are one of the, 

978
00:44:56,240 --> 00:44:59,120
the brands that spans quite a 
large group of products, right? 

979
00:44:59,960 --> 00:45:04,040
The Armstrong code foils axis, 
they're focused on foil, right? 

980
00:45:04,040 --> 00:45:08,880
But we have kite wing foil. 
We do wake boards too. 

981
00:45:08,880 --> 00:45:10,320
There's a guy wakeboarding right
here in a photo. 

982
00:45:10,880 --> 00:45:13,240
We, we span a large, a large 
group of sports. 

983
00:45:13,240 --> 00:45:15,480
And, and before we weren't able 
to keep up, right? 

984
00:45:15,520 --> 00:45:18,760
Like I was just saying, but now 
we have a designer for, for a 

985
00:45:18,760 --> 00:45:20,960
lot of these products that 
they're not just juggling 

986
00:45:20,960 --> 00:45:22,800
everything. 
And so that's, that's really 

987
00:45:22,800 --> 00:45:25,000
going to help. 
I would say in terms of the 

988
00:45:25,000 --> 00:45:27,720
products that we're working on, 
it's a, it's a huge focus on 

989
00:45:27,720 --> 00:45:31,120
efficiency and kind of that 
downwind faster riding speed 

990
00:45:31,160 --> 00:45:32,240
that we're focusing on right 
now. 

991
00:45:32,240 --> 00:45:35,920
We feel like we've got 980% of 
the customers in terms of our 

992
00:45:35,920 --> 00:45:37,400
range of foils that we have 
right now. 

993
00:45:37,400 --> 00:45:40,000
And then that new 13 aspect 
ratio is really going to help 

994
00:45:40,520 --> 00:45:42,480
get into that higher speed 
riding downwind. 

995
00:45:42,480 --> 00:45:44,680
The more advanced rider that 
that really is looking for 

996
00:45:44,680 --> 00:45:46,960
something to keep him excited or
her excited. 

997
00:45:47,760 --> 00:45:51,680
And so efficiency, newer 
profiles in the mast, lighter 

998
00:45:51,680 --> 00:45:54,960
boards, the kind of more 
efficient bottoms, things like 

999
00:45:54,960 --> 00:45:57,560
that. 
And then the kites, obviously we

1000
00:45:57,560 --> 00:46:01,040
have working on new kite, foil 
kite and new big air kites all 

1001
00:46:01,040 --> 00:46:03,480
the time. 
So yeah, we're investing 

1002
00:46:03,480 --> 00:46:06,800
everywhere and, and we've 
actually started to invest more 

1003
00:46:06,800 --> 00:46:09,680
in Dark Start as well. 
Just wrote the product for those

1004
00:46:09,680 --> 00:46:12,720
for, for new product lines, 
trying to make a more 

1005
00:46:12,720 --> 00:46:15,360
well-rounded dark start focus 
front wings, things like that. 

1006
00:46:15,360 --> 00:46:19,040
So we are investing everywhere. 
I'd say there isn't really a 

1007
00:46:19,040 --> 00:46:21,120
spot right now where we're like,
hey, that's, that's not 

1008
00:46:21,120 --> 00:46:23,520
important to us. 
You know, like we're working as 

1009
00:46:23,520 --> 00:46:27,120
we have wings kites, we have 
this bandwidth now that we that 

1010
00:46:27,120 --> 00:46:28,760
we didn't have before. 
And there's a lot of excitement 

1011
00:46:28,760 --> 00:46:31,880
in the office of like, hey, we 
have time like we have a lot of 

1012
00:46:31,880 --> 00:46:34,000
people working on this. 
We got smart minds, young 

1013
00:46:34,000 --> 00:46:36,120
thinkers that that think out 
it's out-of-the-box. 

1014
00:46:36,120 --> 00:46:39,160
And so it's, it's really 
exciting for the brand overall. 

1015
00:46:39,680 --> 00:46:44,360
And I think the momentum is 
starting to grow for sure over 

1016
00:46:44,360 --> 00:46:45,600
this summer. 
There was there's a lot of 

1017
00:46:45,600 --> 00:46:47,400
momentum locally. 
And then I think as people 

1018
00:46:47,400 --> 00:46:50,320
travel for the winter, that's 
going to help spread that 

1019
00:46:50,320 --> 00:46:53,320
momentum elsewhere for the one 
lock especially, but also the 

1020
00:46:53,320 --> 00:46:56,080
boards and the wings and 
everything foil related. 

1021
00:46:56,880 --> 00:46:58,080
Yeah. 
I mean, as you said, the, you 

1022
00:46:58,080 --> 00:47:02,080
know, having that demo offer 
available, it is important for 

1023
00:47:02,080 --> 00:47:04,480
brands to be seen out there. 
It makes a big difference, 

1024
00:47:04,480 --> 00:47:07,360
people talking about them on the
beach because we're all, we're 

1025
00:47:07,360 --> 00:47:09,560
all pretty chatty community. 
I think sometimes if you're not 

1026
00:47:09,560 --> 00:47:12,280
careful, you can spend half an 
hour in the car park talking 

1027
00:47:12,280 --> 00:47:15,200
about here and stuff. 
So the more if you're out there,

1028
00:47:15,400 --> 00:47:17,800
the more it grows, yeah. 
Yeah, I don't feel like 

1029
00:47:17,800 --> 00:47:20,280
Instagram posts necessarily sell
product anymore. 

1030
00:47:20,280 --> 00:47:22,040
It's it's talking to your buddy 
at the beach, right? 

1031
00:47:22,360 --> 00:47:23,840
Yeah. 
Yeah, I was like, hey, how do 

1032
00:47:23,840 --> 00:47:25,520
we, how do we get people on the 
beach actually riding our 

1033
00:47:25,520 --> 00:47:28,840
product and chattering about it,
You know, and that was through 

1034
00:47:28,840 --> 00:47:30,520
that demo program that worked 
really well for us. 

1035
00:47:30,520 --> 00:47:32,720
And now we're going to have one 
in Florida and one down in Baja 

1036
00:47:32,720 --> 00:47:34,560
for the winter months. 
And the next summer, we'll have 

1037
00:47:34,560 --> 00:47:36,640
it in Hood River as well. 
Cool. 

1038
00:47:36,720 --> 00:47:40,560
I want to ask you some quick 
fire questions to kind of kind 

1039
00:47:40,560 --> 00:47:41,960
of wrap up a little bit. 
Yeah. 

1040
00:47:42,000 --> 00:47:44,920
So yeah, it can be long answers 
if you like. 

1041
00:47:45,560 --> 00:47:48,720
So let's let's kick off. 
If you could foil anywhere in 

1042
00:47:48,720 --> 00:47:50,640
the world tomorrow, where would 
it be? 

1043
00:47:50,640 --> 00:47:54,680
Where would you go? 
Caribbean near Antigua probably 

1044
00:47:54,680 --> 00:47:56,600
that's that's one of my favorite
spots of Cape Foil. 

1045
00:47:56,840 --> 00:47:59,560
Nice flat water you can cross 
from island to island. 

1046
00:47:59,560 --> 00:48:01,640
It's not the safest. 
I wouldn't recommend it, but I 

1047
00:48:01,640 --> 00:48:05,600
have to have it tell my parents.
But yeah, that'd definitely be 

1048
00:48:05,960 --> 00:48:07,640
Antigua, Puerto Rico, that kind 
of area. 

1049
00:48:07,640 --> 00:48:11,280
It's nice and warm, windy. 
So is it not safe because what 

1050
00:48:11,280 --> 00:48:14,520
it's the waves of a long way out
like Mauritius, like 2 KS out 

1051
00:48:14,520 --> 00:48:16,560
like Mauritius? 
Or is it just heavy? 

1052
00:48:16,720 --> 00:48:20,080
Yeah, there's no, there's reefs 
that block the waves pretty nice

1053
00:48:20,080 --> 00:48:24,280
and kite pointing I really enjoy
in flat water over waves. 

1054
00:48:24,280 --> 00:48:27,760
If there's waves, I'd rather go 
kite surfing or wing just 

1055
00:48:27,800 --> 00:48:30,080
because you can really ride the 
wave a lot better. 

1056
00:48:30,760 --> 00:48:33,480
So I look for that flat water, 
kind of consistent 6 or 8 

1057
00:48:33,480 --> 00:48:37,920
meters, my preferred size that 
that's almost every day down 

1058
00:48:37,920 --> 00:48:40,960
there. 
And what's your favorite front 

1059
00:48:40,960 --> 00:48:44,520
wing at the moment and why? 
It's hard. 

1060
00:48:44,520 --> 00:48:46,840
I'm going to I'm going to cheat 
on Kai phone a little bit and 

1061
00:48:46,840 --> 00:48:49,560
say that it's the glide 625 for 
pair winging. 

1062
00:48:50,320 --> 00:48:55,120
Yes, this little 9S or yeah, 
like like 8.6 aspect ratio 

1063
00:48:55,120 --> 00:48:58,120
nugget of a wing that that has a
slightly different profile than 

1064
00:48:58,120 --> 00:49:00,240
the larger sizes that keeps a 
lot of its low end. 

1065
00:49:00,640 --> 00:49:02,880
And the way you can just roll it
from side to side and push 

1066
00:49:02,880 --> 00:49:06,400
against it and breach and 
without dropping out of foil is 

1067
00:49:06,400 --> 00:49:08,320
really, really nice. 
And then in Kai foil, obviously 

1068
00:49:08,320 --> 00:49:12,960
that's 755 is my favorite wing. 
I've been riding for like 6 

1069
00:49:12,960 --> 00:49:15,920
years now and it just we haven't
been able to make it make it 

1070
00:49:15,920 --> 00:49:18,120
better because it just feels so 
good on the water. 

1071
00:49:18,600 --> 00:49:20,920
So between those two wings, it's
a it's a hard choice. 

1072
00:49:21,800 --> 00:49:25,680
What about one thing about the 
one lock system that most riders

1073
00:49:25,680 --> 00:49:27,480
don't know about, but should 
know about? 

1074
00:49:28,880 --> 00:49:31,960
I think it's that excitement to 
take your foil apart, right? 

1075
00:49:31,960 --> 00:49:34,800
Like it's so easy that you just 
choose to do it and throw it in 

1076
00:49:34,800 --> 00:49:36,800
the back of your car. 
Obviously I could talk about 

1077
00:49:36,800 --> 00:49:38,960
like how smooth it is on the 
water and stuff like that, but 

1078
00:49:39,280 --> 00:49:41,400
that's more of the feel thing 
that people need to just 

1079
00:49:41,400 --> 00:49:45,440
experience themselves. 
But it's, it's so easy to just 

1080
00:49:45,440 --> 00:49:47,640
throw it in someone's car that 
you just always have a foil in 

1081
00:49:47,640 --> 00:49:50,480
your in your car, right? 
Like I go to Seattle to visit my

1082
00:49:50,480 --> 00:49:52,560
friends every once in a while. 
I'll just throw a dock start set

1083
00:49:52,560 --> 00:49:55,240
up in there and when we're 
driving around, we go get lunch 

1084
00:49:55,240 --> 00:49:57,480
or something like that. 
I'll just click it together 

1085
00:49:57,480 --> 00:49:59,800
super quickly and the goat to 
pump around a little bit, try 

1086
00:49:59,800 --> 00:50:01,200
not to get wet and then come 
back. 

1087
00:50:01,240 --> 00:50:03,840
And so that's really an added 
benefit of just getting on the 

1088
00:50:03,840 --> 00:50:06,400
water as fast as possible that I
really enjoy. 

1089
00:50:07,080 --> 00:50:09,280
But yeah, obviously all the 
other things that I've spent an 

1090
00:50:09,280 --> 00:50:13,480
hour talking about, Yeah, yeah. 
What's the most underrated skill

1091
00:50:13,480 --> 00:50:15,560
of foil? 
A foiler should practice. 

1092
00:50:16,800 --> 00:50:20,360
Switching feet for sure yeah 
when I was when I was learning 

1093
00:50:20,360 --> 00:50:22,880
how to kite foil, there's 
there's a spot here people kite 

1094
00:50:22,880 --> 00:50:25,000
at the immense site and then you
can go up to Wells Island, which

1095
00:50:25,000 --> 00:50:28,480
is upwind a little bit and I 
would go out I'd ride like 

1096
00:50:29,080 --> 00:50:31,800
probably 50 meters and do a foot
swap and turn around and come 

1097
00:50:31,800 --> 00:50:34,440
back ride 50 meters do another 
foot swap and I'd slowly be 

1098
00:50:34,440 --> 00:50:36,560
going up wind and I'd try to 
make it to Wells Island. 

1099
00:50:36,560 --> 00:50:39,520
And if I didn't make it, I'd 
restart and keep trying that 

1100
00:50:39,520 --> 00:50:42,240
foot swap back and forth. 
And, and I didn't think of it 

1101
00:50:42,240 --> 00:50:43,520
then. 
I just like the challenge of 

1102
00:50:43,640 --> 00:50:45,320
trying to get to Wells through 
foot swapping. 

1103
00:50:45,320 --> 00:50:49,640
But when I'm riding at the Hatch
now I can, I can ride either 

1104
00:50:49,640 --> 00:50:50,920
way. 
I can switch my feet on the way 

1105
00:50:50,920 --> 00:50:52,920
with the wing down. 
And I think it's really helpful 

1106
00:50:52,920 --> 00:50:54,880
for both riding swell and get 
into the right position as 

1107
00:50:54,880 --> 00:50:57,080
quickly as possible, but also 
avoiding other people and 

1108
00:50:57,080 --> 00:50:58,520
avoiding boats and stuff like 
that. 

1109
00:50:58,640 --> 00:51:01,080
And also getting up and in in 
weird conditions. 

1110
00:51:01,080 --> 00:51:03,960
Or like you, you go out right 
foot forward when you're left 

1111
00:51:04,240 --> 00:51:06,680
foot foiler in waves, you need 
to be able to get up on foil as 

1112
00:51:06,680 --> 00:51:10,760
quick as quickly as possible. 
So yeah, riding both ways your 

1113
00:51:10,760 --> 00:51:12,280
feet. 
It's an interesting one. 

1114
00:51:12,280 --> 00:51:15,560
I think if you come from wing 
windsurfing, windsurfing, you, 

1115
00:51:15,640 --> 00:51:18,160
you kind of naturally go both 
ways, right? 

1116
00:51:18,560 --> 00:51:21,560
But if you come from surfing or 
something, you, you obviously 

1117
00:51:21,640 --> 00:51:23,200
you, you've got a way you 
prefer. 

1118
00:51:23,200 --> 00:51:26,720
And I see plenty of people with 
boards with only two foot straps

1119
00:51:26,720 --> 00:51:30,680
on, for example, Whereas I find 
I find that as a as a ex 

1120
00:51:30,680 --> 00:51:33,760
windsurfer pretty pretty bizarre
because it's. 

1121
00:51:33,960 --> 00:51:37,040
Also, a voice accurate, like if 
you're always riding the same 

1122
00:51:37,040 --> 00:51:38,600
way, your body's going to get 
all twisted. 

1123
00:51:39,200 --> 00:51:41,280
So it's really important to kind
of balance that out. 

1124
00:51:41,680 --> 00:51:44,200
The other thing I've been trying
to do is ride 1 footed for as 

1125
00:51:44,200 --> 00:51:46,440
long as possible. 
Winging it's it's type 1 is 

1126
00:51:46,440 --> 00:51:47,920
really easy, right? 
Because you have so much left 

1127
00:51:47,920 --> 00:51:50,480
winging, it's pretty easy and 
actually foil driving. 

1128
00:51:50,480 --> 00:51:53,040
I'm starting to try to ride just
one footed on the board with 

1129
00:51:53,040 --> 00:51:56,360
nothing to lean against in it. 
Just like anything you do to 

1130
00:51:56,800 --> 00:51:59,080
kind of practice your balance 
just helps you overall when you 

1131
00:51:59,080 --> 00:52:01,360
when you actually need it in for
cares. 

1132
00:52:02,280 --> 00:52:05,680
Yeah. 
How would you describe foiling 

1133
00:52:05,800 --> 00:52:07,880
in one word? 
What comes to mind for you? 

1134
00:52:08,720 --> 00:52:11,240
I think efficiency is definitely
the word that I use all the 

1135
00:52:11,240 --> 00:52:12,400
time. 
I mean, you could say like it's 

1136
00:52:12,400 --> 00:52:13,880
freedom or fine or things like 
that. 

1137
00:52:13,880 --> 00:52:16,120
But at the end of the day, the 
reason we do it is because it's 

1138
00:52:16,120 --> 00:52:18,040
efficient. 
You can get out in lighter 

1139
00:52:18,040 --> 00:52:20,760
winds, you can ride smaller 
waves, you can go faster. 

1140
00:52:21,320 --> 00:52:24,440
It's a smoother feel overall. 
And what's the next big falling 

1141
00:52:24,440 --> 00:52:26,760
adventure or challenge on on 
your Horizon? 

1142
00:52:27,080 --> 00:52:28,680
I don't know. 
I got kind of addicted to 

1143
00:52:28,720 --> 00:52:31,760
crossing from from land to an 
island or island to island. 

1144
00:52:31,920 --> 00:52:34,320
Obviously, I'd like to do it 
with with the GPS and things 

1145
00:52:34,320 --> 00:52:36,360
like that versus just a compass 
like I did last time. 

1146
00:52:36,360 --> 00:52:39,760
But I think that that challenge 
of high point long distances is 

1147
00:52:39,760 --> 00:52:42,120
kind of fun. 
I think going to Peru would be a

1148
00:52:42,160 --> 00:52:43,840
great trip. 
That's on my bucket list and 

1149
00:52:43,840 --> 00:52:47,720
Mauritius as well, obviously. 
So one of those 3 for sure, if 

1150
00:52:47,720 --> 00:52:49,440
not all three, just need to find
the time. 

1151
00:52:49,760 --> 00:52:51,680
One of the challenges, I 
suppose, in working in the 

1152
00:52:52,040 --> 00:52:55,880
industry is, is making time to 
make sure you still get out 

1153
00:52:55,880 --> 00:52:58,960
falling rather than, you know, 
sit in an office for too long. 

1154
00:52:59,400 --> 00:53:02,400
Yeah, getting that balance wrong
must be. 

1155
00:53:02,400 --> 00:53:04,440
That's Bobby, our foil designer.
Run inside. 

1156
00:53:04,440 --> 00:53:06,120
Just came fast. 
Yeah. 

1157
00:53:06,520 --> 00:53:08,640
He featured on the podcast. 
You can let him know. 

1158
00:53:08,640 --> 00:53:09,760
Oh, he's. 
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 

1159
00:53:09,880 --> 00:53:12,840
Well, for sure. 
Anything we haven't covered? 

1160
00:53:12,920 --> 00:53:15,240
Any other things you wanted to 
mention today? 

1161
00:53:15,240 --> 00:53:16,600
I. 
Don't think so. 

1162
00:53:17,200 --> 00:53:19,440
I feel like we've covered cover 
a lot of the product side and 

1163
00:53:19,440 --> 00:53:21,400
marketing side. 
Yeah, sales side. 

1164
00:53:21,400 --> 00:53:23,240
I mean, it's a retailer and 
stuff like that. 

1165
00:53:23,240 --> 00:53:26,680
It's not that exciting. 
I think it's I think the world's

1166
00:53:26,680 --> 00:53:28,600
gonna be pretty excited to see 
what we're coming out with in 

1167
00:53:28,600 --> 00:53:31,600
the future. 
A lot of that and in that 

1168
00:53:31,600 --> 00:53:33,720
downwind efficiency, ocean 
performance is what we're 

1169
00:53:33,720 --> 00:53:36,120
calling it. 
So higher aspect wings that 

1170
00:53:36,120 --> 00:53:38,320
don't necessarily mean that 
you're riding in a straight 

1171
00:53:38,320 --> 00:53:39,920
line. 
I feel like a lot of foils that 

1172
00:53:39,920 --> 00:53:42,800
I've tried when they go high 
aspect, they get really locked 

1173
00:53:42,800 --> 00:53:44,120
in. 
They're not that fun to ride 

1174
00:53:44,120 --> 00:53:47,160
like they're fast down the line,
but I don't really like going in

1175
00:53:47,160 --> 00:53:48,520
a straight line. 
That's why I never Kai foil 

1176
00:53:48,520 --> 00:53:50,680
raced. 
I like the car possible. 

1177
00:53:50,680 --> 00:53:53,040
So we've really been trying to 
make high aspect wings that have

1178
00:53:53,040 --> 00:53:55,520
all those characteristics of 
speed, but still roll really 

1179
00:53:55,520 --> 00:53:56,880
well. 
And so through the wing tip 

1180
00:53:56,880 --> 00:53:59,720
shape and keeping those smaller 
wing tips and adding kind of 

1181
00:53:59,720 --> 00:54:02,520
twist up on the wing tips, we've
been able to make this this wing

1182
00:54:02,520 --> 00:54:04,400
that'll come in at some point 
that's really exciting. 

1183
00:54:04,720 --> 00:54:07,320
That rolls really well, pumps 
really well, is super fast. 

1184
00:54:07,320 --> 00:54:09,400
So oil is going to be really 
nice. 

1185
00:54:09,400 --> 00:54:11,920
The mass that we're working on 
too, obviously our products out 

1186
00:54:11,920 --> 00:54:14,880
right now is is very amazing, 
very competitive. 

1187
00:54:14,960 --> 00:54:16,560
All the people that try it 
really like it. 

1188
00:54:16,560 --> 00:54:19,920
So I don't really think that 
there's, like I said, a spot 

1189
00:54:19,920 --> 00:54:21,400
that we aren't currently 
present. 

1190
00:54:21,400 --> 00:54:24,960
Maybe docks are like docks are 
specific wings, but those we're 

1191
00:54:24,960 --> 00:54:28,120
working on too. 
So yeah, I feel like we've got a

1192
00:54:28,120 --> 00:54:30,400
lot of the product side, which 
is which is my favorite part 

1193
00:54:30,400 --> 00:54:31,680
too. 
Like marketing is kind of fun 

1194
00:54:31,680 --> 00:54:34,680
too, but I really like investing
the time with the designers and 

1195
00:54:34,680 --> 00:54:37,360
working with them to to kind of 
solve these problems that we 

1196
00:54:37,360 --> 00:54:39,840
have every day. 
Fantastic. 

1197
00:54:40,320 --> 00:54:43,480
Thank you so much for your time 
that I've read and more people 

1198
00:54:43,480 --> 00:54:46,520
should definitely take a look at
the gear and obviously some 

1199
00:54:46,520 --> 00:54:49,720
exciting times coming ahead for 
a Slingshot as a brand across 

1200
00:54:49,720 --> 00:54:50,920
Sporting. 
Yeah. 

1201
00:54:50,920 --> 00:54:55,280
Yeah, let's see how it goes. 
Thank you for your time.