Welcome to Vancouver, True Crime.
I'm with a very honored guest sad, little boy, who was a
police officer, the RCMP for over 20 years, he retired in
2021 as a divisional, sergeant major, for E division, in
British Columbia. His career revolved around RCMP,
specialize in elite units. A flight safety officer.
Also known as an air marshal before moving on, as a full-time
member of the BC Lower, Mainland Emergency Response Team He was
both a breacher and a team leader.
In this conversation, we're going to talk about situational,
awareness, his career, as an RCMP officer.
Polarizing politics of the city of Vancouver is a city more
violent, is it perception? Philosophy on mindset is
background in Brazilian jiu-jitsu.
He's currently a black belt, travels around, as a
motivational speaker, and many more things.
So, let's please introduce him. Thank you for Coming to
Vancouver. True Crime.
Hey man thanks for having me. I really appreciate you coming.
On the rank that you reach before you retired and kind of.
What does that rank mean? I'm not sure it means I'm it
means a lot theoretically speaking.
My career was based upon not caring about rank so much and
wanting to do the things that I wanted to do.
So if the job that I wanted was associated with a rank, then all
the better but if it wasn't then it wouldn't stop me from doing
it. And inversely I would never have
taken a job that I didn't want to do on account of getting a
promotion. And so this was, you know, a
rule that I live by during my career.
And it certainly worked out it's magic because I ended up three
ranks higher than I ever wanted to and and doing jobs that were
very important jobs on the on account of the collective, so to
speak. So yeah, this was an opportunity
was given to me when I was still a team leader on the team on the
Emergency Response Team and I was approached by the den seal
or commanding officer of the division here in British
Columbia Brenda Butterworth car who moved on to.
From the the director of policing in British Columbia
that's at the Province level, a few months a few months after I
took office really? But yeah she approached me and
you know for for a reason that remains a bit of a mystery to me
she had made up her mind that I was the right person to come
over and bridge. The gap between the executive
officers and the the rank-and-file.
So people of Other ranks such as Constable.
Corporal Sergeant, such etc, etc.
And so I you know was on the tail end of my year, T careers.
I if I'm being honest after 12 years on the team, I was
starting to consider that perhaps it was time to move on
even though I had no particular plan of doing so.
But after the offer took me about eight weeks to make up my
mind. And finally, leave the place
that I'd worked so hard to be at in that was my soul.
Purpose for coming in the outfit and first place, which was
Emergency Response Team. But I was provided this golden
opportunity and I felt like I could make a change and I did
just that and join the commanding officers office as a
sergeant major, for the division.
And I spent two years in that role, I maybe talk about for the
Emergency Response Team and maybe break that down for,
again, for someone who's never heard of it, or maybe only seen
it on on television. In shows and Hollywood Netflix.
What's that lake? Is that it kind of an accurate
perception of what you see on Hollywood.
Yeah. No, it's nothing.
Like all it would I mean some of it obviously sometimes reality
can exceed fiction but the reality is the way tactical
teams are portrayed in the in the, you know, Hollywood sort of
context is almost always incredibly stupid and skewed,
right? And so, And this is this is my
opinion on that. But essentially our task is to
respond to calls for service that are beyond the capacity of
Patrol officers and this is not doesn't mean to be their
regulatory in nature, but we're talking by way of training and
equipment and and so it is an elite unit that uses those tools
and those tactics techniques and procedures, as well as the
equipment, as well as a training to problem-solve, is Issues
critical issues. I might I might want to say and
and prevent an escalation of violence, whatever that is.
So sometimes, yes, we maybe ask a leading violence in order to
deescalate a situation. Everything is done in a
controlled fashion. Everything is done with a
articulated, rationale and everything is done under the
tutelage. In the end, the oversight of a
critical incident command Group, which is generally comprised of
negotiators. Psychologists bomb squads and
dog squads and variety of different units that can provide
inside. The helps us problem solve
effectively that. In addition to the Emergency
Response Team ground thiel's and the element leads on the ground.
That can provide direct input from where the weight, where the
wheels meet the pavement. And then we can formulate plans
of action based on the totality of the circumstances that is in
a nutshell. What this looks like as time
went on On in that like because again I smell a hundred, the
amount of training for the different types of scenarios and
there is a lot of variety of a situations that can happen like
a even were last conversation. We talked about you know like
say a domestic violence situation that gets out of
control guys drunk and he's arguing and it gets more and
more and more violent or really bad people with explosives and
guns and they're holding someone for hostage.
So you feel like the variety of training that you had to do.
It was for constantly, did you, did you find that?
You don't just have to kind of almost reinvent the wheel
because it's because situations are all constantly evolving
weapons or changing. You know, tactics are changing
and people looking on the mental illness factor to, you know,
they had that that that's a always a big question mark when
you're walking into a very volatile situation like that.
Yeah, we as you mentioned we we treated emotionally.
Third persons, or people with documented, mental health
issues, a lot differently than we would, you know, a robber
that's taken somebody hostage inside a house and this is a
criminal barricade now, right? And so, yes, there are, there's
a lot of complexities around changing even one variables on a
call that changes the entire course of action or the
response, but having a base framework to work from so having
Focus. On the things that we can
control, like our training and tactically, having our equipment
available, having are equipment being trained on the equipment,
understanding her, legal statute, their authorities,
understanding what the offense is.
Having the right briefing format.
All those things we can control. And then, once we've control all
those things, we're able to adapt and overcome whatever
situation might be regardless if it's different or Exactly the
same as another one. And once we conducting a risk
assessment, once we're looking at the totality of the
circumstances were able to, we're able to pick exactly where
this call differs from the previous one from the one after
and how we are going to bridge that Gap and use Innovative
tactics techniques and procedures to problem solve
those calls. So, yeah, it's consistently
keeping you on your, on your toes.
So to speak. And and it takes, it takes a lot
of flexibility. From an operational standpoint
to be able to problem-solve, a variety of different dilemmas
all with different set of circumstances the personal.
But the decompressing from after that, like you're just like, you
know, that would take a toll over time, you know, even
post-traumatic stress issues, things like that, because it's
this constant, you're thrown into almost like a meat grinder
and then expected to solve it in course of anything goes wrong.
Then yeah, you know, I think it's really interesting.
We we, as a Unit and and we've made our fair share of mistakes
when it came to Wellness and mental and emotional Wellness of
our operators. But over the years we developed,
you know, several key principles that were going by and some,
some procedures to deal with and enable our people to not only
remain healthy, but also go back to work and face another call,
and then come back and then return and face another call,
because the calls are not coming or not, they Stop coming late.
So having a way to deal with this was it was a critical piece
and I was I was semi instrumental in developing this
for this specific team. Although I certainly wasn't the
only one that was invested and in doing so.
And many of our people did that now you there's a lot of
complexities around occupational stress injuries PTSD, who gets
it, who doesn't who have, who it affects?
And to a certain extent, the job affects everybody. to a certain
extent and is just varies and scoop you know, how impacted is
someone should somebody else and it all depends on individual
factors, such as resiliency, you know, adversity written life or
not you know, selection all those things but it but in a
context of a tactical units like like the one I was on because by
way of selection and way of testing by way of everything, we
were able to mitigate perhaps some of these Some of the
effects or the after-effects of tactical operations, we weren't
able to eliminate them but certainly mitigate mitigate is,
is as good as it's going to get. And ultimately, at the end of
the day, there is a sacrifice associated with service, right?
And that's, that's a big part of it.
So, trying to mitigate it and trying to keep it as manageable
as humanly possible mostly through leadership and the rest
of it is kind of out of our out of our hands.
So, too, Speak right breacher, maybe explain to the audience.
What does that mean? Yeah, it's bent.
I want to say five years of the breacher which is the person
that gained entry to the stronghold.
So that's the person that is responsible for getting the team
from outside a building, or a house or a garage, or whatever.
The case may be into inside and do so, in a timely fashion and
in a safe manner so that they may go in and problem solve,
whatever issue is is occurring inside.
Because we, we can have the best team in the world on the
outside, but if we can get them inside with a problem is, then
we're having bigger problems, right?
So, I, my job was essentially to use either mechanical mechanical
means, or ballistic means or or explosive means to get inside a
building, so that the team could go problem solve issues side of
the door waiting for you like that.
Just yeah, that would be pretty intense, I can imagine my
question is that You ever get into a situation where it's I
say the doors completely barricaded and that and that is
the, that is the reaction they want.
And they this is their, their big moment or, you know.
Yeah. I mean, yes, I've encountered
plenty of barricades. I've been counted, I've
encountered plenty of people wanting a negative interaction
with Oodles of people that decided afterwards.
They really didn't want an interaction with police.
Once once they go once, they got the team to deal with, Certain
things. But yeah, those are those are,
you know, humans are complex creatures men.
The people do things for various reasons and it's not always
logical and it's not always common sensical as far as
everybody else is concerned. No, there there's another
podcast he I listen to he's quite a fascinating character.
He has podcast is called Ed Manifesto.
He was a cop in Mexico. And, and he talks a lot about
intention. There's there's nothing you can
do now. There's no training.
There's nothing you can. As far as someone's intention,
you know, someone's intentions are so crazy in the on yours
that there's there's no preparation to prepare for it
and and I think that's what makes situations is so volatile
because it's like, wait, what are their intentions are?
They just so crazy that they don't know what they're doing or
is this is the thing that they've been planning for a long
time, right? How How mentally do you prepare
yourself for that and how they can know, how do you balance?
I guess there must be important. Really talk about work-life
balance and yeah, I would, I wouldn't, I don't know if I
would describe my 12 years on the team as balanced quite, you
know, to make it to Anna to a unit like this.
You need a certain level of obsession, right?
That you need to be obsessed with certain degree.
And yes, work-life balance is an important is an important part
of this. Once you are active on a team.
But also, I think understanding that the team is the last last
line of defense. And so, at the end of the day,
you know, there are going to be sacrificed or that are going to
occur such as, you know, leaving birthdays and Christmas and
whatever because you get called out on these calls and sometimes
leaving for extended period of times, do all this stuff.
So, but I would say that what makes this easier is, as we as
it stands right now, there's a lot of People that don't have
much of a work-life balance, but they also working in a miserable
job that they absolutely hate, right?
Whereas, whereas it's generally speaking on the teams that the
boys just love what they're doing and our people love what
they're doing. And when you love what you're
doing easier to to maintain the perspective, it's easier to
maintain. Yes, a certain level of health
and wellness. It's easier to look at things
from a purpose standpoint. Gives you a lot of tools.
You know if you if what you're doing feels purposeful and
meaningful it does a lot to alleviate some of the issues and
some of the stressors stressors associated with this type of
work. So for me personally, I never
really had. I never really was an overly
emotional person in the context of my work.
And I also never sort of strive to strive for perfection in the
sense that that I understood the limitations from an emotional
fundamental and emotional standpoint says, annotations
that, you know, human beings are on an individual basis.
I should say, I should qualify this on an individual basis.
What my own limitations were and what some of the limitations of
the people working for me, were and understanding and knowing
your people and caring for them really helps with that.
And so we had, you know, systems and subsystems and and pillars.
In place to help them ground themselves outside of the
outside of the work capacity and that often is what's missing and
what's lacking. When the job starts defining,
you and it defines everything. You stand for anything, that
happens at interferes with a smooth operation of that creates
issues. And so we are trying to
alleviate this as much as we could, and that was one way that
we had to manage the stress associated with the job.
So furry, someone like yourself, you're on one end of the
spectrum. Um, you know, personal
responsibility or athletic, you work out a lot, your training,
you know, been on these very elite teams and then on the
other end of the spectrum where we find ourselves and we have
kind of a culture of victimization.
Everyone's a victim, professional victims and then,
almost an industry of, and enabling these people.
And then course, this is created a massive social problem.
There has been this new kind of movement, and I need all you.
Myself, I've had some bizarre run-ins with them on my
platform, you know, the a cab people and they seem to have the
year of like politicians, you know, doing Cuts in the budget
cuts and they kind of want to paint a picture that all
societies problems is because we have cost but yet they don't
have a solution of how you replace that.
So here's a person like yourself who's been on, probably some
pretty pretty scary. Violent calls that the average
person would even And it and then there's someone on the
other side screaming that you know, your job shouldn't exist.
So what's your thoughts on lick this political polarizing
environment that we find ourselves in?
Yeah, well I think it's a small minority who's really, really
loud. I don't believe at all that.
That's a majority of people. So the majority of people are
very supportive of law enforcement and supportive of
us. There are the quiet majority, so
to speak. And then you have your super
loud minority, which, you know, You call your movement, a cab or
whatever, whatever you want to call it.
You yes, far as I'm concerned, you've already discredited your
intent. You've already discredited your
thought process and you definitely negated your critical
analysis capacity. I'm not even concerned.
These types agree with those types of groups.
You know, sometimes an academic utopian way of dealing with
things. Sometimes I don't even have the
academic behind them, so they're even worse.
They're just in Utopia, but they actually don't have an education
to back it up. So from a leadership standpoint,
this it's Clear and evident there that we as a country are
failing and it's not just us as the United States as well and
others. We're failing in the leadership
Department, to establish what the reality is, and what the
root causes of some of the issues are, but look at the
states that have defunded the police right now, like New York
City, Chicago, the the murder rates are optic, 200, something
percent, it is just completely insane.
What's going on over there right now?
And in fact, a lot of the politicians that were pushing to
defund the police age agenda. And they're actually the in the
opposite direction and asking for additional support so that
they may the stats in their own state with respect to violent
crimes and and so on. So now what we're seeing is a we
want to go that way 100%. Oh wait this doesn't work.
It just backfired on us and let's go to complete opposite
way all along. I could have told you exactly
what was going to happen with this.
If anything, the police forces needed more money, more training
more, call it, whatever you want.
But if you're taking it away, And they're still out there
doing the job. How can this come across as a
good idea? How is this?
Come across commonsensical? Because it certainly isn't and
it was always doomed to fail. And we're continuing to here in
the country and Canada. If we were to compare with the
state's, our stats are not nearly as sort of catastrophic
as they are in the state. So one could look here and say,
how do you actually quantify, what isn't, and what didn't
happen? Because that's a very difficult
part of policing is to try to prove.
What you prevented because most of your job and if you're doing
it correctly things are not happening, right?
And so and so it's very difficult, you have, your Ambush
type scenarios where things are happening in would happen.
Anyways. And then you have your other,
the other side of the spectrum, where if you have prevented a
whole bunch of things then you can't, you can no longer prove
that those things would have interfered with everybody's
well-being, right? And so it's really difficult to
quantify. What isn't and it's Extremely
difficult to keep track of what is yeah and also too on top of
it. I truly believe that we live in
a more dangerous volatile Society currently, you know,
like the random we talked before random violence, you know,
people mentally ill, probably on hard drugs and in the state of
psychosis attacking people, right?
That seems to be on the rise especially interested in the
downtown. In my opinion, I really believe
that the courts and the judges have a have a Vaughan civilian
this because they just seem to let them out, let them out and
let them out. The guy that smashed up the TD
Bank. I wrote, it saw us yesterday,
always back out again, he's probably guessing not must be
frustration. You take a bad person off the
street, just to have them released again, you know, that,
that machete attack or, you know, talk to some tourists.
And back out on the street, can't find them Police Issue a
bulletin, you know, please keep your eye out for him, right.
I think they arrested him again but you know, in my opinion a
person willing to wave around a machete and actually use it at
term a menace to society. Right.
Seems like the courts are never really countable of why they
make a decision or don't make a decision.
And of course, the and lot of the cases that I researched and
talked about and did on the Podcasts.
I talk about the crown prosecutor staying charges and
to Americans, that doesn't make any sense to them.
While the dino, we mean they stayed the chart, they don't
know what that means. And I explained that a lot.
So I think our system is very different and it doesn't really,
I don't think it's helps the situation either.
There's an uptick in violence that you think that they would
be more proactive of trying to mitigate it but it just stays
been treated very differently. I guess that's a different
conversation but be Is in what your thoughts are?
Mmm. Yeah, I mean, the system itself,
needs them an overall rate, it needs an overhaul, it just, it
just does. I mean, there's so many
interrelated and interconnected pieces that need to work
together and those pieces need to be pulling in the same
direction as I as it stands right now.
We're absolutely not doing that. And the reason why we're
successful in none doing that, Is because there isn't as much
happening that makes us pay for our faulty Behavior.
So to speak, right? And so, I'll give you an example
of this and try to exemplify this a little bit more
concretely. But if you're looking at 9/11,
for example, if you looking at 9/11 and the way, the agencies
were not communicating, with each other, they were building,
you know, Empires. They had different communication
systems, they work on different radios.
They had different shift schedules.
They You know, and everybody was concerned concerned with you, no
problem solving their own set of issues and not necessarily
interacting with others or using others in the, in the pursuit of
doing that, or whatever, the case may be until the planes
hit, right? And when the, when the planes
hit, New York and in Pennsylvania, and, and all this
good stuff during 911, it forced everybody to work together.
Better more seamlessly more. Ali and it forced everybody to
look and overall their processes.
So that they may be integrating other people and agencies and
they in a realizing there was such a duplication of work that
was, that was being a causality of some of the issues that they
that they had. But we're no different here with
respect to the criminal justice system, I mean it starts at this
legislation, right? So legislative The legislation
goes through. And if it's not if it doesn't,
if it doesn't have the teeth to give the judges and lawyers and
and and people in the position to actually operationalize or
weaponize, those legislations, we're having issues.
And and then once decisions are made say at the Supreme Court
level or whatever, if those decisions are seemingly say in
favor of That guy's or offenders rather than victims, then there
has to be an extrapolation of what exactly transpired here and
what what why was the decision that was made by the Supreme
Court was made on account of and a lot of this stuff is legal
mumbo-jumbo than the leap. The laborers and win really
understand anyways so how can we articulated?
So that the lay person can understand what this entails in
a variety of different Rabbit Hole you go, you can go down up.
Right? But at the end of the day, we
definitely definitely need to look at recidivism that we have,
in this country, which respect to, and I think Vancouver.
And in the documentary, I think he will think over is dying.
Don't they speak about, you know, six thousand arrests,
like, or 6,000? People being responsible for
50,000 calls or something. I can't remember.
I can't remember where the numbers were, but I mean I've
experienced, I've experienced it myself where we had someone when
I was on patrol that we We essentially was intoxicating a
public place, pretty much every day sometimes two or three times
a day and some of these guys would have to re-400
apprehension, you know? And and and spend the night in
jail and that wasn't somebody that had a propensity for
violence. But imagine if somebody did,
somebody had a propensity for violence.
In addition to what they're already having as a set of
issues and then you allow them to be back on the street.
Again, re-victimizing other people in the same can be said
about or doing sexual. Salts.
A morsel two years. I've seen this, just from again,
running a platform falling news, you know, looking at what's
going on in the city. I have this from from my point
of view. I've seen a real uptake in
specifically in the random violence of unprovoked attacks,
right? And some of them are this
horrific, like, just like, just like there was one where a woman
made an improvised taser and she was going around tasering people
for know, like, you know, yeah. Just like, like that's just
insane cases. It seems like there are also
under the influence of usually, a hard drug, meth defend amine,
or something like that. And, and for the people that
contact me that who have been victims of and mostly women, you
know, their testimonies are terrifying, like, you know, pull
me, but her neighbor. She got hit in the head from
behind, will walk in the seawall and she woke up and st.
Paul's Hospital citizen more. So now Lot less than safe than
they used to. So baby, let's break down.
You know what you feel is one of the most important tools to
possess situational awareness, and maybe talk about what that
means and how why that's an important thing to to utilize
when you're out and about in public?
Mmm. Yeah, absolutely.
I mean situation awareness. Is just essentially having the
awareness that. Yes, there are people out there
that are wanting to do bad things to good people and that
you may be one of those good people.
So you simply it's a, it's an assumption of risk that when you
leave your house and you open that door and you walk out,
there's a variety of things that will expose you to potential
dangers. And so you have two choices, you
can put your head in the sand and pretend they don't exist and
wish that you don't get caught. You know, if you're lucky and
then we know that Wishes the last dying wish of those, who
believe that winning Can Happen by accident, or you can
literally take your fate into your own.
Ends and start looking critically at how you were
conducting business. How you were doing things, how
to you are approaching your car where do you park?
What time do you do it at which? Which route you take home, which
route you go to work on, you know, those types of things.
So having really having and also, you know, remake staying
in a semi state of alertness and I'm not talking about like being
in the red State here, where you're completing on high alert
waiting for them to come out of everywhere, but I'm talking
about simply you. You know, if you're if you're
proceeding through an airport and intersection or whatever the
case may be, are you on your phone?
You know, with all looking around, do you scan around the,
you know, generally speaking, who standing around you with
their demeanor is like what kind of threat, they might pause.
If somebody approaches you, do you have the knowledge skills
and ability to look at their hands, to make sure they cannot
deliver a threat because they don't necessarily have something
in their hands or if they do creating some distance like you
know, there's there's there's two things, there's a situation
situation, awareness piece, And then there's the associated
actions that you're going to take.
Once you realize what's going on, so understanding what's
happening, and what you need to be doing to sort of lessen or
mitigate the risk associated with a certain event is critical
in ensuring that you are safe and, and that needs to be done
on an individual basis, is no questionnaire.
Right, of course. So what if you not necessary
you're in the situation? Like, I mean, you're more of a
witness but let's say you're like out with your spouse or
friends or loved ones, or whoever you're only saying the
restaurant Pub or somewhere a bit crowded.
There's lots of people in like a big fight breaks out or there
was a video. I think I sent you a copy was a
stabbing just before Halloween, pretty horrific videos, a big
dude, he fought awful four or five guys, he end up getting
Stabbed but you know chairs are being kicked over tables or
being kicked. Over is pretty, you know, pretty
dramatic stuff. Right?
What would you say the best thing to do in a situation like
that if you're with a loved one though if you know what I mean.
Mmm Yeah. Well there's there's a variety
of different scenarios right. They need all depends who you
are and what your skills knowledge and abilities are.
But I would I will say this generally speaking things just
don't come out of nowhere. Generally speaking there's a
there's a build up to those things.
So I'm going to surmise That during or before the fight, in
the case of the video you sent me there there there has to have
been a, an escalation sorta between, you know, the parties
and and and something that could have been easily picked off
proper, probably if somebody was paying attention.
And so for me, it starts there. Like, is there a my sitting next
to a group that I anticipate, my have some issues, and my, are
they starting to interact adversely with another group?
And if that's the case, how how do I go about getting my wife
myself and the kids moved, you know, by speaking to one of the
waiter or whatever the case may be?
So there are actions that you can take before it blows up.
Then this might include you picking up your stuff and
heading out, like, we're gonna we're gonna take it to go, like
I don't like the current situation that the climate in
here. I don't like the crowd in here.
I don't like what's unfolding in here and I suspect it will
Escalade Let's grab our, let's grab our food and head out, you
know, those are, those are all viable options.
As far as I'm concerned. I have, you know, certain things
that I'm not prepared to do one of those things.
Is, I'm not prepared to let the collective, the, the innocent
Collective sustained injuries, or, or being hurt by somebody
that's actively looking to hurt people but not in the context of
a specific conflict. So you have two people that
disappear consensually decide to fight.
That's their prerogative man. I'm not getting involved in this
and less and less, you know, evidently one person is now, you
know, on the ground unconscious and the other one is going to
kick him in the head so to speak.
But I'm not. This is those are not the types
of scenarios that I generally would get involved in the
involved in. Unless there is an actual victim
like somebody is actually being victimized by a criminal
offense. Like for me, the priority is
always to get the family out of there and they can do they can
We can generally will have those conversations before like this
where the exit, the emergency exit is, this is, this is where
we can link up. If something goes up and if I'm
in a restaurant and something starts escalating and we're
making some moves, I might be telling the people I'm with like
look if something happens. This is this.
What I'd like you to do, you know?
And and we generally we generally get you know kind of
kind of do this and the bit of a plan B.
He's failing to have a plan is no plan.
Yeah, for sure. I do know I have a large female
audience, so I looked like safety tips for them as well,
women for a good general, safety tips for women are out by
themselves, you know, like just doing their thing shopping.
Because what this, again these random attacks lot of times,
it's like a woman downtown shopping guy hits her in the
head with a hammer, you know, just as well.
The worst thing I could possibly imagine, you know, thinking
things out That's for like what? Over some advice?
Would you give them perilous? Yeah, I mean exactly the same as
we just discussed, right? Having your wits about you,
keeping your eyes open, understanding that again.
As I said earlier, that, that bad things happen to good people
and that you are not exempt from that.
You you are going to have your time, something is going to
happen. It's almost guaranteed if you
live in an urban center specifically and and and and
your tools to prevent those things from happening are
hinging primarily in your ability to recognize the threat
before it starts. And if you don't have that,
you're going to be reactive when you are reactive, you're always
behind. You can never, you can never
sort of beat somebody to the punch so to speak.
If they are, if they're the initiator and you weren't
prepared for whatever it is, that's coming.
And so again, in the spirit of every We just discussed, it's a
critically important for women and men to actually be paying
attention, to their surroundings, to pay attention
to the environment, to pay attention to the people walking
towards them, to make sure that they use physical obstacles in
between them and somebody else. If they, if they can switch, you
know, Streetside if they have to whatever the case may be, so
that they may create some distance and have more time to
react to anything in one of the, one of the critical piece that I
think we Would we need to mention?
Is that the people that are victimizing people in random
Fashions? Like this is, generally not so
Random. It's random in that there's no
known affiliation between the victim and the person, that's
obviously assaulting them more or doing something to them, but
it's not random in the sense that the person that's selected
that victim, picked them for a reason.
And generally, that reason is the perceived factors of them
not having the ability to Physically overpower the person
that's delivering the threat or the or the, you know, the
assault or that the risk of getting caught is very low.
So ability to fight back is a big thing.
If the person doesn't think that you have the ability to fight
back and just could be completely erroneous, you may
you may you know mistakenly fall on the person that actually
doesn't look like they can fight back for very capable and now
you're in a bad place but generally bullies will select
our I get very carefully, they will select their target so that
their own safety is not jeopardized by whatever actions
that they're taking. They're also used surprise and
violence of action to prevent somebody from that even
potentially could have the place the the, the ability to defend
themselves. But because they were surprised
they were ambushed. They, they haven't had an
opportunity to do it. So so there are trying to
control the parameters, around, whatever criminal Behavior,
they're exhibiting. And so the best way to alleviate
any of that is to actually Harden the target, which is a
concept in which if a person is looking at you, are they going
to think this is something? This is somebody I could con
right now, they're not paying attention, they're not doing
this. They're not doing that.
They're completely exposed or Baxter and everybody there
buried in their phone and also they're out of shape, they don't
have the ability, it looks like they don't have the ability to
fight whatever and is there. No.
Is there anybody around that? Can that can Have me caught if
the answer is no to all of those questions then that person is a
perfect candidate. Conversely.
If the person looks like they're paying attention that they're
scanning that their safety conscious that potentially are
in good, physical condition with an ability to run fight, or
scream or whatever the or combination of all of those
things and and is generally aware of your presence in the
area and looking at you in a sort of suspicious, you know.
Way, like they're looking at you like, knowing that you're up to
no good. And then that person now has to
make a choice. Am I going to take that person
or the next person that actually doesn't give me any of those
signs? And the answer is always the
same. They will pick the person that
has the less likelihood of getting him hurt or cut every
single time. Well, that makes sense totally.
So you're a martial arts instructor, you're also a
co-owner of a martial arts studio.
What's the name of your studio? Essential martial arts, and
you're currently a black belt in Brazilian jiu-jitsu for women.
Men who are interested in learning martial arts.
Maybe. Tell them more why you believe.
Brazilian jiu-jitsu is better martial arts and say karate or
the other ones. Well it's not so much as better
in terms of its application. It's not necessarily better on
all aspects and we've discussed this last time but it's not
necessarily better for disciplines and their silly
better for, you know, mental and emotional Wellness.
All those things, you can get a lot out of any martial arts and
doing that, but I think when it comes to the wheels, hitting the
pavement, what we have seen and this became quite obvious in 3,
when the UFC first started, and everybody was expecting these
striking Arts to be dominating and really, it was never the
case hardly ever. And it was mostly some skinny
ground fighter that used, you know, you know, leverage and
angles, and techniques and, and fulcrums and levers and to be
able to overcome natural strength, power and athleticism
of an opponent, right? And so, one of the biggest One
of the biggest concern is that you're always at the mercy of
somebody that has a better physical gift for violence.
So sighs, you know, speed power, all those things are very
concerning and so, having an art that whole premise, they called
it, the gentle art. And the whole premise is to have
the ability to defend yourself by using techniques tactics
procedures, things that are science-based, that are helping
you alleviate. And negate some of the tools
that the other person might have such as speed, power and status
is MM. And so that is essentially the
basic premise of Brazilian jiu-jitsu.
So it makes it a very effective art.
However, it also has to be combined with an ability to
protect against strike, because if you have no ability to
protect against strike or you don't have any tag down cap
abilities. Now, you are looking at not
being able to impose your will with your Jiu-Jitsu because you
simply cannot That close enough for you can get the person to
the ground or whatever the case may be.
And so if you were to look at it from a self-defense perspective,
the actual best way to do it is to kind of go with a mixed.
Martial art Roots, which gives you a comprehension and an
understanding of the basic mechanics of stand-up fighting
striking and then also of the mechanisms that you can use and
will use to bring the person where you want to bring them
which is in the case of Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu on the And
so that you may enact tactics and techniques that you have in
the ground fighting realm. And so, having the ability to
marry up those three things ability to sustain and survive,
an assault and initial, and initial Onslaught having the
ability to control the fight and bring the fight where you want
it. And then impose your will with
your Technique and your, and your angles, and your and your
leverage. When on the ground with the
person is, is critical. And so there is no magic pill in
all of those things. You just need to put the time in
and you need to, you need to be acquainted to a reasonable level
so that you may perform under stress, but it's important thing
that you bring up too. Because a lot of these
situations are very volatile and the average person who may not
even been in a fight before, men never been in a violent
encounter. It's a real different thing when
you're in that moment and it's, you know, adrenaline is going
and it's a, you know, for a lot of people, very frightening.
So even the ability to try to stay calm in these situations
are very helpful and stuff so that the training for that is
important, right? And then even, I even look at as
a confidence booster, if you take someone, even regardless of
the martial arts, they choose fight them dedicating
themselves, and they're getting more physical fed confidence
goes up. They may not just this for that
alone. They, as we were talking about
won't appear to be an ideal Cleo victim, as much as say, someone
who doesn't That training and that ability to kind of stay
calm under a very scary situation.
Let's talk about the teen violence because that's
something that does concern me. And I do see that this is seen
something that's on the rise. It seems like teens are more
violent and what's carry with them is that they do swarming
attacks that used knives, they use up bear spray and they do
these horrible coordinated attacks on their victims,
regardless if they're male or female, it, which is really You
really disturbing it's almost something like that of Lord of
the Flies or something. What's your thoughts on this
phenomenon? Yeah, I mean there is some there
is some empirical data that's being collected as we speak and
I can't, I can't Source it right now, but I'm sure if your
listeners are listening to this, they'll be able to kind of look
it up. But there is, there is some
empirical evidence suggesting that the, the brain size of the
current teenagers of actually shrunk and it's taken and one of
the one of the part of the brain.
That's Really shrunk is the part that's responsible for empathy.
So I don't know if the prefrontal cortex or I believe
it might be and then so they would be resorting more to the
monkey brain or that a mandala amigdala to basically respond to
certain stimuli eyes. It sounds like, it sounds like
an innocuous thing, but think about taking empathy of humans.
Like I can't think of anything more catastrophic than that.
I mean, if you don't have that in your dehumanizing humans, I
mean, the sky's the limit on what it is that I'm willing and
able and capable of doing to other people.
And so I wouldn't be surprised if that's the case on account of
electronics and having your entire world and thrall, didn't
it having such a part, polarizing social media
landscape, and having having some some such political
division and whatever. So, all those things are feeding
into some of the, some of the things that might be compounded
by the fact that there are some physiological.
Associated with all the things that we're living with nowadays.
So, it seems as though they have the ability experts, have the
ability to kind of put their fingers on some of the main
contributors, and that's both concerning and elating at the
same time because if we can point a finger on it, then can
we do something to, you know, turn this around?
And the answer generally is yes, but it has to be it.
Has to be identified first. So I would say that with all
that, and the dissent, a desensitization to violence
perpetrated by, you know, video games and and, and, and trust
me, I where I played video games and video games, I'll make
Killers. But if Killers have, if people
have propensity for certain violent crimes and they're
spending their entire time being rewarded on a whether it's on a
consumer Tori, you know, reward system or some other types of
Reward as a result of their actions such as kicking an old
lady in the head and in some video games they're playing,
then it reinforces some some key and very terrifying behaviors.
And so, again it's this is for a long-winded people that much
smarter than me also but at the end of the day, we know that
there is contributing factors several of them and All of them
are in peace and parcel. Responsible, for what we are
seeing today is quite frightening and stuff.
You know, I've have, you know, I have a stepson who's 22 and, you
know, the really had a huge, you know, I say you he's on a
violent kid or anything like that, but in the saying he had
this massive big screen TV. You know, we're playing Call of
Duty full blast and just bored what we do for him.
He's fine. He's playing a game before.
Some kid, maybe little know why. Wired the right way and he's
just in his submersible into this violent World being around
teenage. So they're doing a lot more
drugs, taking like dick. Like it's going out of style and
popping this and popping that drinking energy drinks and
monsters and things like that. So very different, they're
jacked up stuff. And then you know, again we're
not talking about, you know, where, when I was 14, I probably
didn't have the most common sense either, but the level of
violence is on a different level, it's just, it's quite,
it's quite Frightening. And I, hopefully that's a,
that's a trend that will go down because it's pretty ugly.
And in, even for them to look, we're saying before, they don't
understand that you're going on committing violence to people,
you're going to run into a dog way more vicious than you, and
it's just a matter of time. And these 14 year old kids
without their bear, spray won't have a chance.
And honestly, it's almost like it's like, you know, Lord help
them. If they ever run into a real
real wolf, you know, it's it's a troubling time for parents.
Right. So yeah.
So hopefully, you know, things will change.
So for teenagers as I think, you know, in my opinion, to be great
for teenagers, that go into martial arts and stuff like
that. Do you have a lot of teen
programs things like that? Your studio?
Oh yeah, absolutely and teenagers I would say is
probably our biggest demographics but it seems to be
it seems to be consistent across the Lower Mainland.
The majority of Studios as you know, Oodles of Is that are out
there doing the things, which is good news, you know, but but the
entire conversation here, it kind of brings up another point,
which is the age of criminal responsibility raised like.
And, and it's so interesting how the United Nations despite
having conversation with States and key players and people
within the un's, you know, talk about or is that trying to
establish a Anibal Miss in terms of age of criminal
responsibility yet. Here we are.
You have places like Switzerland that I think it's six years old
or something like that and then you have other places, which is
where it where it's 18 writes, the Spectrum goes anywhere from
five to literally 20, you know, in the world age of criminal
responsibility yet. We know for a fact medically
speaking and physiologically speaking that the brain does not
is Fully developed until the mid 20s.
And so having the about the ability and the capacity to sort
of have consequential thinking with respect to the actions that
you are taking is coming later in age.
And so those are all things that we need to be.
That we need to kind of be looking at also from a societal
standpoint. Yeah it is.
It's very troubling because again it's like what does the
future hold for them right? For our society.
Are they going to get More violent as they get older, or is
this like unfortunate is like a really terrible Trend.
I hope it's a terrible Trend, I hope it doesn't, it's not
something that's going to continue getting worse, you
know, I wishful thinking but you know, one can hope, right?
Let's talk about then we're going back to Vancouver.
So the bank were dying documentary, a multiple things
going on with them, you know, from mental illness drug
addiction and homelessness. How do we get these people so
where they're off the street, getting the proper help, in my
opinion, them being treated in a kind of look at an open-air
psychiatric, kind of facility with the public, to, in my
opinion, it doesn't work. You know, II, don't know what
the answer to this is. I mean, as it's and I'm sure
it's a multi-prong answer and I'm sure it's way above my pay
grade or, or even, you know, to a certain extent intellectual
capacity but I think and evidently what needs to happen.
So if you look at the base model for managing the drug sort of
pandemics in Vancouver had been established initially on four
different pillars right out of those four pillars.
Three were not used at all. So all's that was the entire
work was done on one of the four pillars, which was to rid, the
harm reduction pillar, right? And and harm reduction only
offers so much if you refuse to touch the rest of it.
And so it's not so much that the academic precedent that was sort
of the solutions that were worked out by academics before
in relation to the drug crisis in Vancouver wasn't adequate.
Is that the application of? It wasn't right.
And so, it's not to say that the plan wasn't good, but the the
interpretation and enacting on that plan was erroneous.
So, the question now is, We have new leadership leadership coming
into the city. They will have to look at the
evidence to critically and not worry so much about sort of the
narrative polarizing narratives that are going around from one
side or the other and and have that measured approach problem
solving this. But also be very honest with
what's actually occurring, you can sugarcoat things and then
try to address them. You need to expose things so
that you may address them. So expose them, and don't don't
worry so much about shaming this and that.
And this other person, focus more on.
How do we address this stop being a victim of your
circumstances? We have a drug problem.
Drugs isn't good. It's not about shaming, a not
shaming. It's about the people that are
actually doing it and that are addicted or lives are completely
at the mercy of those substances.
It's almost like in the past, they've been they've been
forgotten. Nothing about.
So this is what your predicament is and you will never get out of
it. So let's just make sure that we
don't change them you know instead of like hey man you can
you can do a lot better for yourself and you can have a lot
better in way you have currently and those are some of the ways
that we can do this and but as long as we are catering to a
sentence of controlling the Optics, if I if I can sort of
phrase it phrase it this way it's not going to work in order
for us to change things. We need to address things and We
need to address all their seriousness far as like the
criminal aspects of drugs, you know, the trafficking, the
exporters the, you know, the Smugglers and that kind of stuff
but I'm talking no 4 on the end user.
How many of them would you say in your career as a police
officer when you get into these volatile situations where the
person was either under the influence of alcohol or drugs?
Like what would you say? It was a pretty high percentage.
Oh yeah, it was at least 95%. Wow, unbelievable.
Yeah, I thought Bhai, I was getting my head, I was actually
guessing about fifty percent. So that's that's incredible.
The job is seems to have like, so many nuances that are not
really in the best of the definition of the, the handbook
of what a police officer is, where do you go from there?
Right? If you can't even get to the
point where it's saying, like, hey, this person was drunk and
did all this violence, and therefore, they shouldn't be
removed off the street. And then you have these people
that kind of intervene on their behalf.
Well, it's not their fault, they have this, they have that.
You know, it's a strange situation.
We find ourselves in it really, is it is and it and they can
blurs the lines. And then again it just keeps the
problem to where it has and if anything, it's growing worse,
right? It's I've been aware of the
downtown Eastside for about 30 years, has been working in close
proximity, even had friends and ended up there, it is beyond
worse than I've ever seen now it is it's at the end of the day,
if people are, doesn't matter if they're in poverty or whatever
they are and they deserve a Life with dignity and life that they,
they should be able to get out of it if they want to.
And it seems like, for whatever it is.
It seems like they're trapped in this horrible cycle is the
cycle. That just keeps continuing
continuing, so there we are. Right.
Mmm. So why do you tell people what
you're currently doing? Your, you have a new business
now you're retired. You're not RCMP anymore.
So what do you do now? Yeah, I do a variety of
different. When things but Consulting
security or otherwise, I do performance coaching.
So this is primarily I would say, life coaching, you know,
like goal said and increasing performance in whatever field of
endeavor you're in. So I do a lot of one-on-one Zoom
type meetings and coaching on that.
Do women person also, I do overseas work again in the
security field primarily and I would say Dangerous areas.
I currently I'm doing my masters in global counterterrorism, so I
won't also in school at, you know, at the moment at the
moment, which is taking a lot of time, taking a lot of my time
and what else I got going on? I'm doing that content creation
and and and documentaries style projects that I have going on.
And do I have I have a Book. I'm writing on what I'm working
on that may end up being motivational videos, we don't
know yet. It might actually, you know, go
from being a book to to being another medium by which we're
going to deliver our material. I do resilience training, I do
leadership training with law enforcement and non-law,
enforcement agencies, and bring my experience to bear in some of
those and some of those circles. So, yeah, so that's essentially
what I'm doing, what I have been doing for two years, but the
name of your business Raven TJ. And how does one thing they're
listening? How do they get in touch with
you if they wanted to learn, Brazilian Jiu, Jitsu mindset or
any of the other many things that you offer?
Yeah, like Brazilian jiu-jitsu, they can go straight to the
Ascension, Martial Arts, website, and send us an email,
and we'll set up a special, you know, consultation where they
can come and we're doing an introduction to Brazilian
jiu-jitsu. If they've never seen it, if
they've done it before, and they want to just start, they can
just send us a message and we can make that happen when it
comes to the performance coaching side.
I'd and anything related to me. My Instagram is probably the
best way to do it my Instagram, I'm sure you'll have linked to
your to the podcast here but well I really appreciate you
taking the time honestly as with its honor to interview you and I
want to thank you for your 20 or service and I really appreciate
everything that you've done and really done a lot of stuff and
just really incredible story. So thank you so much for coming
on, Vancouver. True Crime.
Absolutely. Thanks for having me, man.
All right. You take care of.
You have a wonderful day. Sounds good YouTuber.