1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:03,120 Hey, so I think it's going to go, it's going back right now. 2 00:00:03,120 --> 00:00:05,120 It's going to go towards impersonal perfect. 3 00:00:05,600 --> 00:00:10,840 Yeah, it's going to go to human driven again because it, it, it 4 00:00:10,840 --> 00:00:14,040 looks too fake. It's it's not real People like 5 00:00:14,120 --> 00:00:16,760 they like to buy from people. They don't like to buy from 6 00:00:17,120 --> 00:00:30,960 corporations. Hello and welcome to the Retail 7 00:00:30,960 --> 00:00:33,120 Podcast. I've got a big smile on my face 8 00:00:33,120 --> 00:00:36,400 because we've got an authentic, real show for you. 9 00:00:36,400 --> 00:00:38,840 Do they don't that the others aren't authentic or real? 10 00:00:39,200 --> 00:00:41,880 It's just already, from the few minutes that we've had before 11 00:00:41,880 --> 00:00:45,280 they're the start of the show, I could tell that we're in for a 12 00:00:45,280 --> 00:00:48,520 treat today. And we're lucky enough to be 13 00:00:48,520 --> 00:00:53,840 joined by Dave Munson, who's the founder and CEO and president of 14 00:00:53,840 --> 00:00:56,040 Saddleback Leather. Hopefully, Dave, that's correct. 15 00:00:56,040 --> 00:00:57,960 I've got that right. Well, you couldn't have got it 16 00:00:57,960 --> 00:01:01,160 wrong. That Lady was all Yeah. 17 00:01:01,360 --> 00:01:05,239 We'll take that as a win. And also I'm joined by Senior 18 00:01:05,239 --> 00:01:08,320 Director of Brand and Content Marketing, Melissa Dixon from 19 00:01:08,320 --> 00:01:11,040 Big Commerce. Hi Alex, Thanks for having me. 20 00:01:11,480 --> 00:01:13,920 Absolute pleasure. So what we're going to do is 21 00:01:14,000 --> 00:01:17,440 traditionally when we talk about e-commerce and digital, 22 00:01:17,440 --> 00:01:21,320 sometimes I think people get lost in this sort of where's the 23 00:01:21,320 --> 00:01:23,480 customer, right? Where is the person we're doing 24 00:01:23,480 --> 00:01:25,840 all of this for? And so for me to have the 25 00:01:25,840 --> 00:01:29,960 opportunity to have Someone Like You, Dave, who has gone through 26 00:01:29,960 --> 00:01:33,920 the journey of not only have you got beautiful products, but you 27 00:01:33,920 --> 00:01:37,040 also have bought those beautiful products online. 28 00:01:37,040 --> 00:01:40,080 And if you haven't had a chance, please go and have a look at 29 00:01:40,280 --> 00:01:43,320 Saddleback's website. Their, their products are 30 00:01:43,320 --> 00:01:47,040 beautiful. And I'm, I'm hopefully, you 31 00:01:47,040 --> 00:01:50,200 know, once I'm in the US, I'll be getting online and getting 32 00:01:50,200 --> 00:01:53,840 myself a satchel or something. But anyway, the relationship 33 00:01:53,840 --> 00:01:58,480 between e-commerce and product sometimes gets lost. 34 00:01:58,680 --> 00:02:01,920 And So what I'd like to do is spend some time with Dave 35 00:02:01,920 --> 00:02:05,200 talking about his journey on, you know, the the challenges 36 00:02:05,200 --> 00:02:09,199 that he faced as a the CEO president of this brand that's 37 00:02:09,199 --> 00:02:11,840 growing every year, going from strength to strength. 38 00:02:11,880 --> 00:02:14,680 But it's not always easy and there are challenges and you 39 00:02:14,680 --> 00:02:17,400 have to overcome that. And then we'll focus with big 40 00:02:17,400 --> 00:02:19,840 commerce in terms of how they help Saddleback. 41 00:02:19,840 --> 00:02:22,800 We will start with Saddleback first and then we'll come to 42 00:02:22,800 --> 00:02:25,920 you, if that's okay. Melissa, absolutely perfect. 43 00:02:25,920 --> 00:02:28,000 Thank you. So Dave, I was just talking 44 00:02:28,000 --> 00:02:32,040 there about the the challenges in terms of Saddleback leather 45 00:02:32,040 --> 00:02:35,960 and and what you face from an e-commerce perspective as your 46 00:02:35,960 --> 00:02:38,560 store group. Can you just sort of shine a 47 00:02:38,560 --> 00:02:40,720 light on that for us? What did that look? 48 00:02:40,720 --> 00:02:44,560 Like so when I started Saddleback, I started selling 49 00:02:44,880 --> 00:02:50,000 pretty consistently in 2003. And so website, my website was 50 00:02:50,000 --> 00:02:54,120 eBay, Yeah, and. Then at least then that's run 51 00:02:54,120 --> 00:02:55,440 off people. I should, we should have laughed 52 00:02:55,440 --> 00:02:58,480 cause some people do pay, yeah? And then, you know, I just 53 00:02:58,480 --> 00:03:00,640 thought, well, if you just have a website, people just start 54 00:03:00,640 --> 00:03:01,680 coming to it. And. 55 00:03:01,680 --> 00:03:04,840 But I didn't know about, you know, all of the technical 56 00:03:04,840 --> 00:03:06,280 things. A friend of mine made him. 57 00:03:06,280 --> 00:03:09,360 Yeah, kind of like a, it was like a third grade extra credit 58 00:03:09,360 --> 00:03:12,760 project website. And it was kind of working. 59 00:03:12,800 --> 00:03:17,120 There were a lot of websites, you know, then and as as many, 60 00:03:17,120 --> 00:03:19,840 you know, and, and it was everything is more pure. 61 00:03:19,960 --> 00:03:21,520 And so. Yeah. 62 00:03:22,080 --> 00:03:25,800 Then we got onto different platforms and we finally came to 63 00:03:25,800 --> 00:03:28,480 big commerce and had needed an, ER, full ERP. 64 00:03:28,480 --> 00:03:30,960 We've tried somewhere else. I don't want to disparage the 65 00:03:30,960 --> 00:03:34,800 awful and horrible company that I was with before that was. 66 00:03:36,800 --> 00:03:39,920 Cool. Oh my gosh. 67 00:03:40,440 --> 00:03:44,640 And so, but we found big commerce and and we tied that in 68 00:03:44,640 --> 00:03:47,160 with Acumatica. They tie in real nicely and it's 69 00:03:47,160 --> 00:03:50,320 just so everyone so easy. Everyone's just like. 70 00:03:50,320 --> 00:03:53,160 So that's been really helpful to have something you can use. 71 00:03:53,560 --> 00:03:57,240 We had a space shuttle before and there 1000 switches 72 00:03:57,240 --> 00:03:59,680 everywhere and I didn't know which ones did what. 73 00:03:59,720 --> 00:04:01,880 And this is just there are 1000 switches. 74 00:04:01,880 --> 00:04:05,160 But that just though like fly go forward to go backwards. 75 00:04:05,320 --> 00:04:07,160 It's, it's, it's really simple to you. 76 00:04:07,160 --> 00:04:09,640 So we really enjoyed. That's really helped us out a 77 00:04:09,640 --> 00:04:12,640 lot that when that when there's so much stuff, it's like having 78 00:04:12,640 --> 00:04:14,960 data, when there's so much data, you don't know what to do with 79 00:04:14,960 --> 00:04:15,800 any of it. Got you. 80 00:04:16,120 --> 00:04:18,360 It's low. Just the the most important 81 00:04:18,360 --> 00:04:21,160 thing to write in front and that's that simplifying our 82 00:04:21,160 --> 00:04:23,320 business was, is, is what's been helpful. 83 00:04:24,080 --> 00:04:28,040 Did you see obviously the products and, and when we put 84 00:04:28,040 --> 00:04:30,800 the video out, I'll have some footage of your products so 85 00:04:30,800 --> 00:04:32,680 people can actually, you know, keep talking about your 86 00:04:32,680 --> 00:04:36,360 products, But ultimately for me, it's about feel about smell 87 00:04:36,360 --> 00:04:38,640 about the look of these products, right. 88 00:04:38,640 --> 00:04:42,040 So how, what what was going through your mind when you were 89 00:04:42,040 --> 00:04:45,920 sort of crafting the E the customer experience online, you 90 00:04:45,920 --> 00:04:48,360 know, tailoring your e-commerce platform to meet? 91 00:04:48,360 --> 00:04:52,040 I think they are unique demands. I, I guess you and perfumes, you 92 00:04:52,040 --> 00:04:54,320 know, in, in the sense that you want people to smell stuff, but 93 00:04:54,320 --> 00:04:57,920 you want to buy them online. How did you, what did that look 94 00:04:57,920 --> 00:05:00,480 like for you in terms of these tools that you've mentioned? 95 00:05:00,520 --> 00:05:03,480 How did you create that seamless shopping experience? 96 00:05:04,200 --> 00:05:07,480 Yeah. So what I found is that if 97 00:05:07,480 --> 00:05:10,000 people like you, then they will buy from you. 98 00:05:10,080 --> 00:05:12,920 People when they walk into a church for example, within the 99 00:05:12,920 --> 00:05:15,720 1st 5 minutes they'll they'll decide whether they're going to 100 00:05:15,720 --> 00:05:17,800 come back or not. And we have when they come on to 101 00:05:17,800 --> 00:05:22,280 the website to let people know what you're all about and with 102 00:05:22,280 --> 00:05:26,560 the textures of the website, the colours of the website, the the 103 00:05:26,800 --> 00:05:29,800 great and glorious front photo, we don't, we don't have a 104 00:05:29,800 --> 00:05:33,640 carousel going around because only we found only 1% of people 105 00:05:33,640 --> 00:05:37,240 click on that. But we want the happy smiley 106 00:05:37,240 --> 00:05:39,120 place. This is where I want to be. 107 00:05:39,120 --> 00:05:42,480 That's me right there. I want that in my life. 108 00:05:43,040 --> 00:05:45,240 Go, you get that. And then they go look around for 109 00:05:45,240 --> 00:05:48,560 something that they want to buy. We want them. 110 00:05:48,600 --> 00:05:52,240 So we're very relational. So we want warmth. 111 00:05:53,760 --> 00:05:56,480 We love people. We really, really love people. 112 00:05:56,560 --> 00:06:00,280 And so we want warmth. We want to let them get to know 113 00:06:00,280 --> 00:06:01,880 us. So I have our Saddleback story, 114 00:06:01,880 --> 00:06:04,320 which is a really interesting business story, how we start it. 115 00:06:05,560 --> 00:06:10,200 That's kind of our highlight. So we highlight my dog. 116 00:06:10,600 --> 00:06:14,040 The the story of my dog blew in every eyes when they read it. 117 00:06:14,080 --> 00:06:17,960 And so we try to make it real personal and warm and swear they 118 00:06:17,960 --> 00:06:19,880 go, I like these people. There's something about them 119 00:06:19,880 --> 00:06:23,160 that I like, tell stories. So because we're only online, 120 00:06:23,160 --> 00:06:26,000 they can't smell it, you know, they can't paste it, lick it, 121 00:06:26,080 --> 00:06:28,880 then nothing. So it is like you want to do all 122 00:06:28,880 --> 00:06:31,880 of that. So, so yeah, we have to make it 123 00:06:31,880 --> 00:06:35,120 warm and personable. And that's, that's our our key. 124 00:06:35,120 --> 00:06:36,960 That's what we strive after all the time. 125 00:06:37,200 --> 00:06:40,120 Dave, do you, I, if you don't mind, I should have done this 126 00:06:40,120 --> 00:06:41,760 right up front. Could you? 127 00:06:41,800 --> 00:06:44,600 It's just when you said the story, I, because I've spent 128 00:06:44,600 --> 00:06:48,120 some time on your website, I've just taken for granted listening 129 00:06:48,120 --> 00:06:51,320 some of the watches of this have all been to your website and 130 00:06:51,320 --> 00:06:55,080 they've seen your story and you know about how your, how you, 131 00:06:55,120 --> 00:06:58,080 how it all came to life for you. Would you mind just taking us 132 00:06:58,080 --> 00:06:59,600 through that? Just if you don't mind, just 133 00:06:59,600 --> 00:07:02,040 like, just spend a few minutes of bringing that bit to life. 134 00:07:02,200 --> 00:07:04,360 Yeah, sure. So, so I was teaching English 135 00:07:04,400 --> 00:07:08,920 down in Mexico in 1999 and I, I was 28 and I thought, and I 136 00:07:08,920 --> 00:07:11,440 thought I need a bag, you know, to carry around my school book, 137 00:07:11,640 --> 00:07:13,040 books. And I walked everywhere. 138 00:07:13,040 --> 00:07:15,520 I think I had like a jet sport backpack or something from 139 00:07:15,520 --> 00:07:17,320 college. And so I thought, what would 140 00:07:17,320 --> 00:07:21,600 Indiana Jones carry? And so that guy's a man and, you 141 00:07:21,600 --> 00:07:24,800 know, and everyone I bought a whip when after I saw the movie, 142 00:07:24,800 --> 00:07:27,800 I went to Mexico and I have Tijuana and bought a whip from 143 00:07:27,800 --> 00:07:30,720 the, the market there. And I was like, OK. 144 00:07:31,000 --> 00:07:33,480 And so I looked around for a bag, couldn't find one like the 145 00:07:33,480 --> 00:07:36,000 one I I had in my head. And I didn't know that I liked 146 00:07:36,000 --> 00:07:39,080 designing at the time. I just knew that I, I, I thought 147 00:07:39,080 --> 00:07:40,800 everyone could see things in their head like that. 148 00:07:40,800 --> 00:07:44,080 So, so I found a guy making bags and I said, hey, could you make 149 00:07:44,080 --> 00:07:46,320 up this bag? If, if I sketch it out and I 150 00:07:46,320 --> 00:07:49,040 don't want any breakable parts. And so, you know, our slogan is 151 00:07:49,040 --> 00:07:50,320 they'll fight over it when you're dead. 152 00:07:50,320 --> 00:07:52,240 But I didn't have it yet. I just said, you know, when I'm 153 00:07:52,360 --> 00:07:55,440 dead and, and the grandkids are rummaging through my office and 154 00:07:55,440 --> 00:07:57,800 they're fighting over things, I want them to fight over this 155 00:07:57,800 --> 00:07:58,720 bag. Oh, wow. 156 00:07:58,960 --> 00:08:02,560 And so, and so, yeah, he made it in 1999. 157 00:08:02,600 --> 00:08:04,840 And then when I got back to the up to Portland, OR where I'm 158 00:08:04,840 --> 00:08:08,840 from, people were four or five times a day asking me, excuse 159 00:08:08,840 --> 00:08:10,720 me, Sir, where can I find a bag like that? 160 00:08:10,720 --> 00:08:12,760 That is amazing. Where can I get one or where can 161 00:08:12,760 --> 00:08:14,800 I get 1? And I thought, hey, so I, I 162 00:08:14,800 --> 00:08:17,320 mean, I was a youth pastor. So I thought, I thought, hey, 163 00:08:17,360 --> 00:08:21,160 this would support my, my youth work and I wouldn't have to 164 00:08:21,560 --> 00:08:23,360 raise money. I wouldn't have to get a job. 165 00:08:23,360 --> 00:08:25,720 I can go anywhere. So I, I started having some more 166 00:08:25,720 --> 00:08:28,840 made, I moved to Juarez, Mexico with my black lab. 167 00:08:28,880 --> 00:08:31,360 Yeah. And we slept in a little 300, no 168 00:08:31,360 --> 00:08:35,480 $100 a month apartment on the floor, no air conditioning, no 169 00:08:35,480 --> 00:08:38,320 heat, just on the floor for three years. 170 00:08:38,400 --> 00:08:41,280 And all the money I was saving though, I was sending down 171 00:08:41,520 --> 00:08:43,440 putting it into the Bank of his father and son. 172 00:08:43,440 --> 00:08:47,120 They would send bags up on the bus to to the Juarez bus station 173 00:08:47,120 --> 00:08:49,120 and then I would get them and take them to El Paso. 174 00:08:49,120 --> 00:08:52,320 And I sold them on A at a friend's mechanic shop at night 175 00:08:52,640 --> 00:08:56,720 on eBay. And in 2006 I was in Panama 176 00:08:56,720 --> 00:09:01,800 doing some photos of the bag and a suitcase that I had and and I 177 00:09:01,800 --> 00:09:03,800 met my wife on Myspace. I checked. 178 00:09:04,960 --> 00:09:05,920 Myspace. Oh my. 179 00:09:06,320 --> 00:09:08,480 Goodness, I was like oh hubba hubba, shoot pretty. 180 00:09:09,400 --> 00:09:15,360 So started talking, flew to San Antonio, TX and started kissing. 181 00:09:15,760 --> 00:09:19,760 And next thing you know, we got married and just a few months 182 00:09:19,760 --> 00:09:23,640 later. And then nine months and 15 183 00:09:23,640 --> 00:09:25,200 minutes later, we had our little daughter. 184 00:09:25,360 --> 00:09:30,200 And we, yeah, just been a in 2008, we started the factory in 185 00:09:30,200 --> 00:09:32,240 Mexico where all day memories are. 186 00:09:32,240 --> 00:09:34,760 And it's, oh, it's this beautiful part of the country 187 00:09:34,760 --> 00:09:39,160 and but tanneries everywhere and everyone knows leather shoe 188 00:09:39,160 --> 00:09:41,960 manufacturing capital. And so we started the factory 189 00:09:41,960 --> 00:09:44,520 there because no one cares about your, your stuff as much as you 190 00:09:44,520 --> 00:09:46,240 do. So we, we started making our own 191 00:09:46,240 --> 00:09:48,440 things and it's just been growing ever since. 192 00:09:48,560 --> 00:09:51,920 And we just celebrated 16 years with our own factory. 193 00:09:52,720 --> 00:09:55,560 Oh, wow, last month. No, no, this earlier this month. 194 00:09:55,800 --> 00:09:59,200 And so we have a lot of the original employees now we have a 195 00:09:59,200 --> 00:10:03,360 school with a, a school there. It's an all English homeschool 196 00:10:03,360 --> 00:10:05,920 curriculum. So for all of the kids of the 197 00:10:05,920 --> 00:10:09,200 employees to give them a English is a big, huge deal. 198 00:10:09,280 --> 00:10:12,600 And we have marriage classes and parenting classes and we have 199 00:10:12,600 --> 00:10:14,560 counselling because we love our people. 200 00:10:14,600 --> 00:10:17,800 And so ministry never stopped. I just used to be with youth, 201 00:10:17,800 --> 00:10:21,080 but it just continued on in a different way with our people at 202 00:10:21,080 --> 00:10:22,240 the factory. So. 203 00:10:22,920 --> 00:10:26,160 That's fantastic and it actually lends itself to the sort of the 204 00:10:26,160 --> 00:10:28,400 question. So as you've gone on this 205 00:10:28,400 --> 00:10:31,880 journey, if I, if I understand this quickly, you've always sold 206 00:10:31,880 --> 00:10:36,240 online, is that is that correct? Exclusively online, yes. 207 00:10:36,360 --> 00:10:40,600 And so obviously we were in focus on your previous provider 208 00:10:40,640 --> 00:10:44,440 who was who was a very tough experience for you and they'll 209 00:10:44,440 --> 00:10:48,520 and you were with eBay. Can you just tell me in what do 210 00:10:48,520 --> 00:10:51,320 you look for then? Because you must have some, I 211 00:10:51,320 --> 00:10:55,360 don't know, secret Spidey sense that tells you that these are 212 00:10:55,360 --> 00:10:58,200 the sorts of in order to improve the website. 213 00:10:58,200 --> 00:11:01,160 I mean, I know you said you use data for the carousel, for 214 00:11:01,160 --> 00:11:02,520 example. You know, you weren't getting a 215 00:11:02,520 --> 00:11:05,080 lot of clicks and carousels. So that's not where we're going 216 00:11:05,080 --> 00:11:07,720 to focus. How do you decide on where you 217 00:11:07,720 --> 00:11:12,480 are focusing? So on conversion rate, because 218 00:11:12,640 --> 00:11:14,880 the goal of a business is to make money. 219 00:11:15,320 --> 00:11:19,080 Like if you don't make money, then if you can't leave the 220 00:11:19,080 --> 00:11:23,040 company to making money, then at the end of the year, then who 221 00:11:23,040 --> 00:11:25,640 cares? All of the activities you do if 222 00:11:25,640 --> 00:11:28,640 you don't make money. So it's a lot easier to get to 223 00:11:28,640 --> 00:11:30,960 convert more of the customers that you already get to the 224 00:11:30,960 --> 00:11:34,080 website than to get more, more people to the website. 225 00:11:34,160 --> 00:11:37,200 So working on viral videos and all of that sort of thing. 226 00:11:37,680 --> 00:11:39,320 That's that's nice and everything. 227 00:11:39,600 --> 00:11:42,600 And do an NCO that that helps get more customers in. 228 00:11:42,760 --> 00:11:47,200 Yeah, once they get there, if you can, you go from 2% to 4% 229 00:11:47,400 --> 00:11:49,320 and you just doubled your sales for the whole year. 230 00:11:49,400 --> 00:11:53,640 Yeah, holy cow. And so split testing and doing 231 00:11:53,640 --> 00:11:57,040 all kinds of just what, what? So we're looking at marketing. 232 00:11:57,040 --> 00:12:01,120 We go, yeah, we go what, what videos will help people to make 233 00:12:01,120 --> 00:12:05,320 a decision today and we work on what will have the most impact 234 00:12:05,320 --> 00:12:08,080 for which product. So we look and which colour. 235 00:12:08,360 --> 00:12:12,200 And so for a flight back, for example, one of our briefcases, 236 00:12:12,920 --> 00:12:16,400 which is the best colour and then we'll go on that colour and 237 00:12:16,400 --> 00:12:19,840 then we'll do a video explaining and taking all the questions 238 00:12:19,840 --> 00:12:23,200 that customer service asks gets asked about it so that people 239 00:12:23,200 --> 00:12:27,000 don't ask customer service and they, and it's really easy, 240 00:12:27,000 --> 00:12:30,160 easy, easy. So that's where we focus is more 241 00:12:30,160 --> 00:12:31,920 on conversion rate than anything else. 242 00:12:32,640 --> 00:12:35,200 This is one of the questions that I'm I'm sort of just made 243 00:12:35,200 --> 00:12:39,560 me think of in terms of your digital touch points through or 244 00:12:39,560 --> 00:12:42,680 your path to purchase like the, the mission that people go 245 00:12:42,680 --> 00:12:46,040 through your store. You mentioned data earlier. 246 00:12:46,040 --> 00:12:50,320 Do you feel that you have enough data now on the bringing the 247 00:12:50,320 --> 00:12:53,640 invisible and making that visible as people go through 248 00:12:53,640 --> 00:12:56,000 your store? Are you happy with that level of 249 00:12:56,400 --> 00:13:02,560 visibility that you have now? You know, it's always changes. 250 00:13:02,720 --> 00:13:05,120 It's always changing. I, you know, when the iPads 251 00:13:05,120 --> 00:13:08,640 first came out, someone, one of my friends said, dude, you'd 252 00:13:08,720 --> 00:13:10,520 crush it if you had an iPad case. 253 00:13:10,520 --> 00:13:12,320 I mean, there's nothing out there. 254 00:13:12,320 --> 00:13:14,160 There's like you would do so well. 255 00:13:14,160 --> 00:13:18,600 And I go, it was like the iPad 2 and I go, but I do have an iPad 256 00:13:18,600 --> 00:13:21,080 case. He goes, no, you don't. 257 00:13:21,080 --> 00:13:23,240 I looked at all of your website and I couldn't find it. 258 00:13:23,480 --> 00:13:26,880 And so I made it visible. I made it like on the top 259 00:13:26,880 --> 00:13:31,120 navigation iPad cases got you sold thousands of them. 260 00:13:31,400 --> 00:13:33,160 Yeah, totally right. Sold thousands. 261 00:13:33,520 --> 00:13:39,760 So it's my fault if, if I can't, if I, it's not their fault that 262 00:13:39,760 --> 00:13:42,360 they just they're too dumb or something to find it. 263 00:13:42,760 --> 00:13:45,080 It's that I had 7 drop downs to get to it. 264 00:13:45,400 --> 00:13:48,920 Yeah. And so, so yeah, no, that's, 265 00:13:49,040 --> 00:13:51,880 that's a big deal. People finding and a lot of 266 00:13:51,880 --> 00:13:53,440 things they don't know that they need it. 267 00:13:54,080 --> 00:13:56,000 Yeah. Like we have this little, this 268 00:13:56,000 --> 00:13:59,880 little serving little tray here, little ballet tray. 269 00:14:00,360 --> 00:14:02,040 OK all. Yeah, yeah. 270 00:14:02,040 --> 00:14:07,480 And and pipes and cigar cutters and stuff and no one. 271 00:14:07,720 --> 00:14:10,200 I didn't know I needed it until I got till I designed it. 272 00:14:10,200 --> 00:14:13,720 It was like, holy cow, it is awesome. 273 00:14:14,240 --> 00:14:17,840 And now, yeah, we sell oodles of them, but people don't know they 274 00:14:17,840 --> 00:14:21,240 they need it until they find it. So part of the really thinking 275 00:14:21,240 --> 00:14:24,440 through and of course thinking through what, what is the most 276 00:14:24,440 --> 00:14:27,000 profitable. Also, our trunk is not very 277 00:14:27,000 --> 00:14:29,880 profitable, but it's, you know, $5900. 278 00:14:29,960 --> 00:14:32,400 But I would rather sell this little serving little ballet 279 00:14:32,400 --> 00:14:36,520 tray all day long over a trunk because I more profitable. 280 00:14:37,440 --> 00:14:40,960 The data I use is, is which pieces are more profitable. 281 00:14:41,480 --> 00:14:44,760 So at the end of the year, if I focus on which briefcase, which 282 00:14:44,760 --> 00:14:48,480 duffel bag, I focus on, not necessarily trying to show 283 00:14:48,480 --> 00:14:50,560 everything to everyone because they can't see it all. 284 00:14:51,440 --> 00:14:53,480 I got you. Well, I mean, again, we're 285 00:14:53,480 --> 00:14:56,600 coming up to hopefully this episode will be out in the next 286 00:14:56,600 --> 00:14:58,200 couple of weeks. I think it'll probably be out 287 00:14:58,200 --> 00:15:00,520 next week. So it'll be well in the, you 288 00:15:00,520 --> 00:15:03,760 know, Christmas period. Christmas people are Christmas 289 00:15:03,760 --> 00:15:05,680 shopping. I'm just curious the data that 290 00:15:05,680 --> 00:15:09,840 you use for colours and again, because you've been doing this 291 00:15:09,840 --> 00:15:12,720 for so long, where are you, what, what, what's sort of 292 00:15:12,720 --> 00:15:15,640 driving that for you? And do you see any trends for 293 00:15:15,640 --> 00:15:18,320 this Christmas that you think, you know, I don't know, there's 294 00:15:18,320 --> 00:15:21,200 a colour that's really from your website, you're pulling that 295 00:15:21,200 --> 00:15:24,560 insight and then that's going to go into your holiday season, 296 00:15:24,560 --> 00:15:30,120 marketing or e-commerce? Yeah, so we used to do 297 00:15:30,120 --> 00:15:33,040 snowflakes going, coming down on our website, you know, Yeah, 298 00:15:33,680 --> 00:15:37,480 you'd absolutely, I'm hearing yeah, little, but all of those 299 00:15:37,480 --> 00:15:42,120 little details make it like holly around around the the our 300 00:15:42,120 --> 00:15:45,440 logo. It slows down our our load time 301 00:15:45,440 --> 00:15:48,840 a little bit, but it just makes people smile. 302 00:15:48,920 --> 00:15:52,520 If you can make people smile and Yep, and have warmth and have 303 00:15:52,520 --> 00:15:55,960 smiley pictures of people smiling, they're happy they're 304 00:15:55,960 --> 00:15:57,880 with other people. That's what everyone wants. 305 00:15:57,880 --> 00:16:01,200 So like this leather right here, it's a has a warmth to it as 306 00:16:01,200 --> 00:16:03,520 opposed to like a a greyish brown. 307 00:16:04,480 --> 00:16:09,880 It just feels warmth. Fireplaces Reds will have a lot 308 00:16:09,880 --> 00:16:14,920 of Reds in Christmassy red. Everyone just likes red. 309 00:16:15,000 --> 00:16:18,800 So warmer, warmer colours. Red's not serious. 310 00:16:20,200 --> 00:16:21,880 Yeah, I think people like warmth. 311 00:16:22,600 --> 00:16:24,640 Got you. When you when you look to the 312 00:16:24,640 --> 00:16:28,640 future of e-commerce, do you see any major? 313 00:16:28,920 --> 00:16:31,720 Do you, I mean, I'm, I'm asking you to look into your looking 314 00:16:31,720 --> 00:16:34,480 glass. Well, what do you see the major 315 00:16:34,480 --> 00:16:40,200 trends? I see it's gonna swing from just 316 00:16:40,280 --> 00:16:46,520 I I think it's gonna swing away from no personality to heavy. 317 00:16:46,560 --> 00:16:49,040 It's gonna go back. Right now it's it's swinging 318 00:16:49,040 --> 00:16:52,240 towards AI driven content. Yeah. 319 00:16:52,240 --> 00:16:57,120 And every word is perfect and it flows like perfectly. 320 00:16:57,120 --> 00:16:59,800 Everything's perfect. But that's not real life. 321 00:17:00,320 --> 00:17:03,040 Yeah, well, don't make mistakes. People make mistakes. 322 00:17:03,240 --> 00:17:08,520 People use commas and and they they're live and they maybe 323 00:17:08,520 --> 00:17:11,119 ramble a little. So I think it's going to go, 324 00:17:11,240 --> 00:17:13,599 it's going back right now. It's going to go towards 325 00:17:13,599 --> 00:17:17,599 impersonal perfect. It's going to go to human driven 326 00:17:17,599 --> 00:17:21,200 again because it, it, it looks too fake. 327 00:17:21,520 --> 00:17:25,000 It's it's not real people like they like to buy from people. 328 00:17:25,200 --> 00:17:29,320 They don't like to buy from corporations and so I think it's 329 00:17:29,320 --> 00:17:34,000 going to go back to very being very personal and and less 330 00:17:34,000 --> 00:17:35,880 corporate. OK. 331 00:17:35,920 --> 00:17:37,720 So it's, it's really, really interesting. 332 00:17:37,720 --> 00:17:40,320 We're obviously we're talking about Christmas and, and the, 333 00:17:40,400 --> 00:17:43,920 and the holiday season in general because it's let's look 334 00:17:43,920 --> 00:17:47,280 at it as a festive season with the economy and the backdrop of 335 00:17:47,280 --> 00:17:48,840 the economy. I know we've got the election in 336 00:17:48,840 --> 00:17:52,520 a couple of weeks, but life is still tough for for a lot of 337 00:17:52,520 --> 00:17:55,560 people out there. I'm just curious how you go 338 00:17:55,560 --> 00:17:59,200 about your pricing strategy. Your you mentioned about your 339 00:17:59,200 --> 00:18:02,200 profit strategy, if you like, you know, selling the trays over 340 00:18:02,480 --> 00:18:06,920 the the big suitcase or or trunk, that's what you call it 341 00:18:06,920 --> 00:18:09,480 trunk. I'm just curious what how do you 342 00:18:09,480 --> 00:18:12,800 decide especially in like a tough economy where, where 343 00:18:12,800 --> 00:18:16,240 people are very price or yeah price conscious? 344 00:18:16,960 --> 00:18:20,560 Yeah. So we found 299 is it? 345 00:18:21,160 --> 00:18:23,920 You'll sell way more at 299 than you will at 300. 346 00:18:24,320 --> 00:18:29,320 So as in like two 299 not 299? $299 you. 347 00:18:30,040 --> 00:18:31,600 Sell 9290. Nine. 348 00:18:32,160 --> 00:18:34,360 Yeah, right. Candy bar now, yeah. 349 00:18:35,520 --> 00:18:37,560 But two. Yeah, 299. 350 00:18:37,560 --> 00:18:39,760 Yeah. Someone will, someone will buy 351 00:18:39,760 --> 00:18:42,320 something. It's kind of a a spontaneous so. 352 00:18:42,320 --> 00:18:44,560 Well, they have been good to be this year. 353 00:18:44,560 --> 00:18:49,120 I'll get something like that. But 319, 329, anything over 354 00:18:49,120 --> 00:18:53,360 that, it starts getting like, think about it, it's height 355 00:18:53,360 --> 00:18:54,640 right now. Do I really need this? 356 00:18:54,920 --> 00:18:58,200 But with retail therapy, I'm sad, I'm depressed, I don't feel 357 00:18:58,200 --> 00:18:59,200 good. Everything's tough. 358 00:18:59,200 --> 00:19:00,880 I haven't had any luxury in my life. 359 00:19:00,960 --> 00:19:03,560 What the heck, I'm going to buy something and they want to feel 360 00:19:03,560 --> 00:19:06,280 nice. And so when people and when so 361 00:19:06,280 --> 00:19:09,480 we we are promoting selling. Our average order value went 362 00:19:09,480 --> 00:19:13,720 down this year over prior years, this year and last year over the 363 00:19:13,720 --> 00:19:18,480 years before because we started focusing on selling lower, I 364 00:19:18,480 --> 00:19:21,760 started designing lower dollar pieces, still high quality. 365 00:19:21,760 --> 00:19:24,600 We didn't lower quality at all, but things that bring people 366 00:19:24,600 --> 00:19:27,640 joy. So I would rather sell 1010 367 00:19:27,640 --> 00:19:30,600 little ballet trays than sell 11 briefcase. 368 00:19:30,840 --> 00:19:33,360 And it's easier to sell 10 little ballet trays than one 369 00:19:33,360 --> 00:19:34,640 briefcase. I got all. 370 00:19:35,120 --> 00:19:39,440 And so, so we've been promoting lower dollar, still high 371 00:19:39,440 --> 00:19:42,480 quality, lower dollar stuff to our people and it's been 372 00:19:42,480 --> 00:19:44,440 successful. That's phenomenal. 373 00:19:44,880 --> 00:19:47,920 So. So something for everyone, as 374 00:19:47,920 --> 00:19:49,400 they would say. Yes. 375 00:19:49,880 --> 00:19:51,680 Right. OK, fantastic. 376 00:19:52,000 --> 00:19:55,760 Melissa, I know that big commerce does a lot of research 377 00:19:55,840 --> 00:19:59,520 for the holiday season and you, you must have so much back end 378 00:19:59,520 --> 00:20:03,640 data that you you have. I'm just curious what what types 379 00:20:03,640 --> 00:20:07,320 of trends are you seeing for this 2024 holiday season? 380 00:20:07,960 --> 00:20:11,320 Yeah, well, I, I wish I had all the data. 381 00:20:11,840 --> 00:20:16,040 We have a lot, a couple things are really standing out. 382 00:20:16,320 --> 00:20:19,640 So first and foremost, you know, we always talk about, oh, it 383 00:20:19,640 --> 00:20:22,040 seems like the holidays start earlier every year. 384 00:20:22,360 --> 00:20:25,560 They do, you know, I think we've seen this for a couple years 385 00:20:25,560 --> 00:20:32,240 now, but retailers like Amazon, Walmart, Target, they're rolling 386 00:20:32,240 --> 00:20:35,120 out, you know, huge shopping events in October. 387 00:20:35,120 --> 00:20:37,160 So that's really a standout thing. 388 00:20:38,240 --> 00:20:43,120 We also know that I believe it was, I think it's NRS reported 389 00:20:43,120 --> 00:20:47,360 that nearly half, like 45% of holiday shoppers plan to buy 390 00:20:47,360 --> 00:20:51,080 items before November. I mean, we're almost in November 391 00:20:51,080 --> 00:20:54,280 now. So I, I, it's likely, you know, 392 00:20:54,280 --> 00:20:57,520 held true. But I think, I think what that 393 00:20:57,520 --> 00:21:02,120 means for these brands and retailers is that kind of just 394 00:21:02,120 --> 00:21:06,560 like Dave said, holiday sales, pricing, promotions, discounts, 395 00:21:06,560 --> 00:21:10,360 they remain essential to incentivize shoppers in this 396 00:21:10,360 --> 00:21:14,040 season. So Cyber Week also, those five 397 00:21:14,040 --> 00:21:18,960 days between Thanksgiving to Cyber Monday, those are still 398 00:21:18,960 --> 00:21:20,760 huge. It's still the biggest shopping 399 00:21:20,760 --> 00:21:22,880 week of the year. We see that with our big 400 00:21:22,880 --> 00:21:26,920 commerce customers, the broader industry trends reflect that. 401 00:21:27,200 --> 00:21:31,400 So it's really important for these brands and retailers to 402 00:21:31,400 --> 00:21:35,920 sort of strike a balance between the early promotions and also 403 00:21:35,920 --> 00:21:38,400 the big like traditional holiday deals. 404 00:21:38,680 --> 00:21:42,800 So basically just the span of the holiday season is longer 405 00:21:42,800 --> 00:21:46,320 than it used to be. So that's a big one that that 406 00:21:46,320 --> 00:21:51,040 has a really notable impact on on shopping trends. 407 00:21:51,040 --> 00:21:54,480 And then also another one worth calling out, I think is the 408 00:21:54,960 --> 00:21:59,000 increased demand for flexible payment options. 409 00:21:59,000 --> 00:22:02,200 Like that's huge. Dave spoke a lot about check out 410 00:22:02,200 --> 00:22:05,360 and that is that's critical. So we're talking about things 411 00:22:05,360 --> 00:22:09,160 like digital wallets, the NPL, and that's buy now, pay later, 412 00:22:09,360 --> 00:22:14,040 even crypto, You know, I would say all of those are key. 413 00:22:15,600 --> 00:22:19,720 Buy now, pay later has really interesting data around it. 414 00:22:20,440 --> 00:22:24,080 The most recent forecast that I read, which I think was in 415 00:22:24,160 --> 00:22:30,680 August, the US buy now pay later market is projected to reach 94 416 00:22:30,680 --> 00:22:35,560 billion this year and then exceed 100 billion in 2025. 417 00:22:35,960 --> 00:22:39,240 This is massive and it's, you know, it's not for every 418 00:22:39,240 --> 00:22:43,680 shopper, it's not for every business, but it's important to 419 00:22:43,680 --> 00:22:48,160 see how these trends are growing because really the overarching, 420 00:22:48,400 --> 00:22:50,920 the overarching trend is the need for flexibility. 421 00:22:51,360 --> 00:22:55,400 So either it's BNPL or whether it's digital wallets, it's all 422 00:22:55,400 --> 00:22:59,920 about making sure that your customers have the options that 423 00:22:59,920 --> 00:23:02,640 they want. And then the last standout trend 424 00:23:02,640 --> 00:23:05,640 that I'll really mention this should come as no surprise to 425 00:23:05,640 --> 00:23:10,480 anybody, but mobile commerce is just keeps going up. 426 00:23:10,480 --> 00:23:15,160 Like I, I was looking at, I think I use E marketer a lot to 427 00:23:15,200 --> 00:23:19,920 pull data and six in 10 US consumers are using mobile 428 00:23:19,920 --> 00:23:21,480 wallets to make payments this year. 429 00:23:21,720 --> 00:23:25,960 So mobile is, is just on the rise. 430 00:23:25,960 --> 00:23:29,760 And that's of course going to be crucial for, for the holiday 431 00:23:29,760 --> 00:23:32,520 season. In fact, I don't know if you, if 432 00:23:32,520 --> 00:23:36,840 you recall this Alex or Dave, but last year, last holiday 433 00:23:36,840 --> 00:23:42,720 season was the first year that mobile sales overall surpassed 434 00:23:42,800 --> 00:23:44,720 desktop. That's a big deal. 435 00:23:44,880 --> 00:23:46,520 You know, it, that was just last year. 436 00:23:46,520 --> 00:23:48,480 It was, it was the first year that we did that. 437 00:23:48,680 --> 00:23:52,840 So that it was 51% last year. It's projected to be 53% this 438 00:23:52,840 --> 00:23:55,400 year. So what that means is that 439 00:23:55,400 --> 00:23:58,840 having that mobile friendly experiences is absolutely a 440 00:23:58,840 --> 00:24:00,920 must. So that's, you know, mobile 441 00:24:00,920 --> 00:24:04,320 friendly design, smooth navigation, a layout that 442 00:24:04,320 --> 00:24:07,080 basically works seamlessly on any screen. 443 00:24:07,880 --> 00:24:09,320 Melissa, I've got a question about that. 444 00:24:09,400 --> 00:24:10,760 I'm sorry, interrupting. Sure. 445 00:24:10,800 --> 00:24:14,000 Do you have that by category or like are people buying yachts on 446 00:24:14,000 --> 00:24:18,040 their on their phone or are they buying like is it, is it skirts? 447 00:24:18,200 --> 00:24:19,600 I mean, yeah. So. 448 00:24:19,760 --> 00:24:21,040 Really, what is it? Yeah. 449 00:24:21,040 --> 00:24:24,920 So definitely look at, if you're interested, look at like NRF 450 00:24:24,920 --> 00:24:28,040 data, they always have, they always have the best. 451 00:24:28,040 --> 00:24:32,720 And then there's also Salesforce and Adobe for our big commerce 452 00:24:32,720 --> 00:24:34,200 data. And in the broader industry 453 00:24:34,200 --> 00:24:37,680 trends, what we're seeing is that people are becoming more 454 00:24:37,680 --> 00:24:41,000 and more comfortable buying those big purchases. 455 00:24:41,200 --> 00:24:46,440 So whereas in the beginning, maybe pre pandemic, it was, you 456 00:24:46,440 --> 00:24:51,120 know, mostly just fashion or small goods, we're starting to 457 00:24:51,120 --> 00:24:54,680 see the industry starting to see larger purchases becoming more 458 00:24:54,680 --> 00:24:58,040 common on mobile. People got more comfortable with 459 00:24:58,040 --> 00:25:03,680 it during COVID, and now across generations, they're starting to 460 00:25:03,680 --> 00:25:06,440 embrace it. So yeah, it's really interesting 461 00:25:06,440 --> 00:25:08,400 to watch. So those are a few of the key 462 00:25:08,400 --> 00:25:11,240 trends that we really see. And of course, you know, I mean, 463 00:25:11,480 --> 00:25:15,440 retailers are still gonna have their fair share of challenges 464 00:25:15,440 --> 00:25:18,880 like every year talked about economic uncertainty, 465 00:25:18,880 --> 00:25:21,800 macroeconomics, you know, and they're still always planning 466 00:25:21,800 --> 00:25:27,480 for traffic surges and demand. But I think that what it all 467 00:25:27,480 --> 00:25:31,440 comes down to whether you're whether you're leveraging, you 468 00:25:31,440 --> 00:25:33,440 know, some of the latest technologies, whether you're 469 00:25:33,600 --> 00:25:36,880 adhering to these trends, trying to apply them to your business. 470 00:25:37,080 --> 00:25:40,200 It's really about during the holiday season, I think just 471 00:25:40,520 --> 00:25:45,600 having that clear communication with your shoppers to manage 472 00:25:45,600 --> 00:25:49,680 their expectations and just, you know, telling them, telling them 473 00:25:49,680 --> 00:25:54,400 when things are going to arrive. Having really clear best sellers 474 00:25:54,400 --> 00:25:57,160 like you talked about Dave with the iPad case, like that's a 475 00:25:57,160 --> 00:25:59,440 perfect example. And make sure your site's 476 00:25:59,440 --> 00:26:03,560 optimised for search and, you know, merchandising and having 477 00:26:03,560 --> 00:26:06,720 your best sellers out there communicating those discounts 478 00:26:06,800 --> 00:26:08,760 and just strong communication throughout. 479 00:26:09,200 --> 00:26:12,160 If you were going to make a list, I say the top five things 480 00:26:12,360 --> 00:26:14,960 for the trends that you're saying that I need to be getting 481 00:26:14,960 --> 00:26:18,520 my business aware of or ready for trading or the holiday 482 00:26:18,520 --> 00:26:21,640 season. Well, I say five. 483 00:26:21,640 --> 00:26:24,360 Maybe it could be less, it could be more, but I'm just curious 484 00:26:24,360 --> 00:26:28,000 what, what are those features that I need on my e-commerce 485 00:26:28,000 --> 00:26:30,880 site to hit those? Yeah, great question. 486 00:26:30,920 --> 00:26:36,360 I would argue that in a lot of the data back to the sub, Dave, 487 00:26:36,360 --> 00:26:38,040 you, you kind of spoke to this too. 488 00:26:38,440 --> 00:26:42,600 Check out is the most critical point, right? 489 00:26:42,600 --> 00:26:45,160 And you want to remove all friction. 490 00:26:45,360 --> 00:26:49,040 So I would say overall it's the checkout experience. 491 00:26:49,040 --> 00:26:53,520 Now a huge piece of that is having the flexible payment 492 00:26:53,520 --> 00:26:57,880 options. So for example, we at Big 493 00:26:57,880 --> 00:27:02,120 Commerce, we just launched Fast Lane by PayPal. 494 00:27:02,200 --> 00:27:06,240 That's a good example of one. We're actually, I, I love how 495 00:27:06,240 --> 00:27:08,880 Big Commerce is always innovating with payments too. 496 00:27:08,880 --> 00:27:11,960 And with our partners, we were actually the first e-commerce 497 00:27:11,960 --> 00:27:14,120 platform to launch Fast Lane by PayPal. 498 00:27:14,560 --> 00:27:17,480 So that's really exciting 'cause we're trying to stay on the 499 00:27:17,480 --> 00:27:21,200 forefront for our customers so that they can deliver the best 500 00:27:21,200 --> 00:27:27,440 experience to their customers. So check out and payments is in 501 00:27:27,440 --> 00:27:30,520 in my mind and based on everyone I've spoken to and all the 502 00:27:31,200 --> 00:27:33,800 number one absolutely hands down. 503 00:27:34,880 --> 00:27:37,560 These like Fast Lane are really interesting because it's just 504 00:27:37,560 --> 00:27:41,640 this immediate purchase where you know, you don't have to put 505 00:27:41,640 --> 00:27:44,200 in any information. These are just things that 506 00:27:44,400 --> 00:27:47,280 during the holiday season especially, people have a lot of 507 00:27:47,280 --> 00:27:50,720 shopping to do and don't want the friction. 508 00:27:51,000 --> 00:27:57,080 So I would say payments and checkout are #1 I would also say 509 00:27:57,480 --> 00:28:00,880 that I do think optimising for mobile is huge. 510 00:28:00,880 --> 00:28:06,400 It a must and if you know there may be delays like people may 511 00:28:06,400 --> 00:28:10,800 have put things off like we're seeing now that like I was just 512 00:28:10,800 --> 00:28:14,920 saying if mobile purchases or eclipsing desktop this is no 513 00:28:14,920 --> 00:28:18,200 longer a nice to have. I was just talking to one of our 514 00:28:18,200 --> 00:28:23,680 customers actually leading a panel on mobile commerce last 515 00:28:23,680 --> 00:28:25,640 week. One of our customers homedics, 516 00:28:26,480 --> 00:28:31,120 great brand and the the woman that I was speaking with was 517 00:28:31,120 --> 00:28:34,160 talking about the fold does not exist. 518 00:28:34,160 --> 00:28:38,080 You know, for so many years we lived by this idea of the fold 519 00:28:38,080 --> 00:28:42,040 and merchandising and now it's, you know, it's obsolete. 520 00:28:42,400 --> 00:28:47,840 So designing for any device, especially mobile forward is be 521 00:28:47,840 --> 00:28:54,080 great. I think too there's also, I 522 00:28:54,080 --> 00:28:57,880 would say what's also paramount and this, this is not a trend, 523 00:28:57,880 --> 00:29:02,320 but just the direction of e-commerce and commerce in 524 00:29:02,320 --> 00:29:07,680 general is just optimising for Omni channel commerce and the 525 00:29:07,680 --> 00:29:10,680 connectivity between channels. I mean, that's, that's huge. 526 00:29:10,720 --> 00:29:14,040 You know, we have a big commerce, one of the ways that 527 00:29:14,040 --> 00:29:17,880 we're helping people. We have our subsidiary brand 528 00:29:17,880 --> 00:29:22,880 Feedinomics, which for many is like a feed management solution, 529 00:29:23,680 --> 00:29:28,000 which is so fantastic. And I, I just want to, this is 530 00:29:28,000 --> 00:29:30,160 one that I just want to like scream it from the rooftops 531 00:29:30,160 --> 00:29:33,880 because I'm like, wait a second, why isn't everybody using this? 532 00:29:34,240 --> 00:29:38,480 It's basically what it does is like harmonises your product 533 00:29:38,480 --> 00:29:42,440 data across all your channels. It automates and optimises your 534 00:29:42,440 --> 00:29:45,840 product catalogue to ensure that your product listings are 535 00:29:45,840 --> 00:29:49,280 showing up accurately and optimise across all these 536 00:29:49,280 --> 00:29:51,000 channels. Everything like marketplaces, 537 00:29:51,240 --> 00:29:55,000 social, you know, your website ads like anywhere. 538 00:29:55,280 --> 00:29:58,800 So that means your products are that much more discoverable. 539 00:29:59,160 --> 00:30:03,200 And implication is then you know, you're reaching more 540 00:30:03,200 --> 00:30:04,600 people, you're making more sales. 541 00:30:04,600 --> 00:30:08,080 So I think Omni channel connectivity is is another one 542 00:30:08,080 --> 00:30:12,160 that's paramount. And yeah, Wilson to us for five. 543 00:30:12,160 --> 00:30:16,520 I'll keep going. I mean, I do think that AI 544 00:30:16,520 --> 00:30:20,640 powered functionality like there's there are so many use 545 00:30:20,640 --> 00:30:25,000 cases that are so much broader than people even realise that 546 00:30:25,520 --> 00:30:28,520 you just give brands the the competitive edge. 547 00:30:28,520 --> 00:30:31,600 But, you know, I think there's tools like Cleveland Bloomreach 548 00:30:31,600 --> 00:30:34,840 and search string that like analyse browser behaviour and 549 00:30:34,840 --> 00:30:38,720 provide tailored product searches and personalised 550 00:30:38,720 --> 00:30:40,520 merchandising and recommendations. 551 00:30:40,520 --> 00:30:43,800 Like, you know, that's, that's different, that's a different 552 00:30:43,800 --> 00:30:49,200 thing than using AI to create content or which, you know, 553 00:30:49,200 --> 00:30:50,360 there's nothing wrong with that either. 554 00:30:50,360 --> 00:30:53,800 It's for some people, for some people, it's not the businesses 555 00:30:53,800 --> 00:30:58,840 that maybe aren't so keen on using AI to create content, for 556 00:30:58,840 --> 00:31:04,160 example, it might behove them to look into using AI to make, you 557 00:31:04,160 --> 00:31:06,840 know, to have AI generated product recommendations and 558 00:31:06,840 --> 00:31:11,560 merchandising and all of that. So I do think that is that's 559 00:31:11,560 --> 00:31:14,960 been another huge trend that's, that's really just, you know, 560 00:31:15,280 --> 00:31:17,880 shifting the way we go about utilising our data. 561 00:31:18,280 --> 00:31:20,560 OK. I I'm just curious in terms of 562 00:31:20,560 --> 00:31:24,520 wrapping things up when you look to and and Dave, I do have one 563 00:31:24,520 --> 00:31:28,040 question for you. Don't jump off and when you, 564 00:31:28,040 --> 00:31:34,080 when you, when you look at sort of 24/20/24, 2020, 25 is big 565 00:31:34,080 --> 00:31:37,640 commerce like you mentioned payments, are they are there any 566 00:31:37,640 --> 00:31:42,080 other areas that you're focusing on in terms of providing that 567 00:31:42,080 --> 00:31:45,640 seamless shopping experience across all channels? 568 00:31:45,640 --> 00:31:48,520 What what are your, if you like big bets or innovations and 569 00:31:48,520 --> 00:31:52,000 enhancements that that you're going to be focusing on as you 570 00:31:52,000 --> 00:31:54,280 go forward? So where are we innovating? 571 00:31:54,680 --> 00:31:55,880 Yeah. I think like what you're going 572 00:31:55,880 --> 00:31:59,480 to focus on in 2025. OK, so there's so a lot of 573 00:31:59,480 --> 00:32:02,080 exciting stuff happening. One of the biggest ones that 574 00:32:02,080 --> 00:32:05,760 we're so excited about is called Catalyst, which is our new 575 00:32:05,760 --> 00:32:09,600 headless storefront solution. Then basically it's like pre 576 00:32:09,600 --> 00:32:13,840 optimised for performance for SEO and it's designed to 577 00:32:13,840 --> 00:32:17,720 simplify headless builds so people can get to market faster. 578 00:32:17,720 --> 00:32:20,720 And a lot of people, you know, we can get into headless, but 579 00:32:20,720 --> 00:32:22,720 that's a whole subject of its own. 580 00:32:22,960 --> 00:32:29,480 But the, the, the point is that this is something that creates a 581 00:32:29,800 --> 00:32:33,200 stronger, more effective user experience that asks people to 582 00:32:33,200 --> 00:32:37,000 go to market faster. And so that solution layered 583 00:32:37,000 --> 00:32:41,000 with Makeswift, which is subsidiary and that's our, 584 00:32:41,200 --> 00:32:43,280 that's our no code visual editor. 585 00:32:43,400 --> 00:32:46,720 You have these two entities, they're Catalyst and Makeswift. 586 00:32:47,000 --> 00:32:50,880 And it basically it's a game changer, like allowing brands 587 00:32:50,880 --> 00:32:54,560 and retailers to quickly create these beautiful, engaging 588 00:32:54,800 --> 00:32:57,360 experiences with like 0 coding knowledge. 589 00:32:57,360 --> 00:33:00,920 So Burrow is a customer that I love. 590 00:33:00,920 --> 00:33:03,600 That's a good example. Their furniture, their furniture 591 00:33:03,600 --> 00:33:06,840 brand too, that's utilising that. 592 00:33:07,040 --> 00:33:09,080 So there's that. And then I already talked about 593 00:33:09,080 --> 00:33:11,560 Feedenomics. One of the things Feedenomics is 594 00:33:11,560 --> 00:33:15,560 doing though, on top of just the the standard, you know, feed 595 00:33:15,560 --> 00:33:20,440 management, Feedenomics is also has a new instant commerce 596 00:33:20,440 --> 00:33:24,040 offering, which is basically partnering with like brands and 597 00:33:24,040 --> 00:33:27,760 retailers and marketplaces to enable same day delivery. 598 00:33:27,760 --> 00:33:31,400 It's essentially to keep up with the competition and the Amazon 599 00:33:31,400 --> 00:33:36,160 effect as we say. So that's something that is 600 00:33:36,160 --> 00:33:41,280 going to be really useful for brands year round, but also for 601 00:33:41,280 --> 00:33:43,560 the holidays, like something like that can help capture a 602 00:33:43,560 --> 00:33:46,840 last minute shoppers who maybe miss the standard shipping cut 603 00:33:46,840 --> 00:33:50,280 off. Also with AI driven 604 00:33:50,280 --> 00:33:53,120 personalization, a couple of things we're focusing on now, 605 00:33:53,120 --> 00:33:57,400 you know, we're we're dipping our toes into the AI game and 606 00:33:57,400 --> 00:34:01,240 getting there with tools like we have big AI, we call it big AI 607 00:34:01,240 --> 00:34:04,920 product recommendations that you know, personalise that shopper 608 00:34:04,920 --> 00:34:08,239 journey. And then also there is a big AI 609 00:34:08,239 --> 00:34:11,600 copywriter tool that we have, which does streamline the 610 00:34:11,600 --> 00:34:14,880 creation of SEO friendly product descriptions, which is really 611 00:34:14,880 --> 00:34:17,960 useful to a lot of brands when it comes to writing descriptions 612 00:34:18,880 --> 00:34:20,639 and then advanced checkout tools. 613 00:34:20,840 --> 00:34:24,280 That's going to continue to be an area of innovation native one 614 00:34:24,280 --> 00:34:27,239 page check out and I mentioned fast Lane, which is like the 615 00:34:27,239 --> 00:34:30,280 latest in our payment innovation partnerships. 616 00:34:30,639 --> 00:34:33,880 So yeah, so lots of exciting things happen. 617 00:34:33,880 --> 00:34:35,679 It's. Just and then it's interesting 618 00:34:35,679 --> 00:34:39,159 in terms of the focus areas that you've got in terms of as in 619 00:34:39,159 --> 00:34:42,760 like check out payments are some of the the trends. 620 00:34:43,080 --> 00:34:45,360 Dave, again, I always make this assumption. 621 00:34:45,480 --> 00:34:47,960 Are you actually in physical stores anywhere? 622 00:34:48,000 --> 00:34:50,080 It's like, you know, we talk about Omni channels and 623 00:34:50,080 --> 00:34:52,960 channels. Or are you pureplay online only? 624 00:34:53,920 --> 00:34:56,320 No, Just yeah. Is that called pureplay? 625 00:34:57,040 --> 00:35:01,160 Oh as well, we come to that. Or yeah, So yeah, we're pure 626 00:35:01,160 --> 00:35:06,240 players, OK. Plan I'm just curious as an 627 00:35:06,240 --> 00:35:09,240 e-commerce leader, are you looking or an e-commerce 628 00:35:09,240 --> 00:35:11,560 business? Are you looking is physical 629 00:35:11,560 --> 00:35:14,560 because I'm just if you're going to go through the sort of 630 00:35:15,400 --> 00:35:19,640 iterations that some other pureplay E com companies have 631 00:35:19,640 --> 00:35:24,120 done. No, just in our own little 632 00:35:24,440 --> 00:35:27,240 little shop here, yeah. Here in and where is that? 633 00:35:27,240 --> 00:35:28,440 When you say here, where is that? 634 00:35:28,600 --> 00:35:31,800 We're in Azle, TX. It's near Fort Worth, Dallas 635 00:35:31,800 --> 00:35:33,040 Fort Worth. OK. 636 00:35:33,040 --> 00:35:35,960 So in fact, one of our customers flew in from California. 637 00:35:35,960 --> 00:35:38,320 A lot of people fly in the DFW for a conference. 638 00:35:38,760 --> 00:35:40,440 Yeah. And they drive all the way over 639 00:35:40,640 --> 00:35:44,320 to come to the mothership to. The and how, how, how long of a 640 00:35:44,320 --> 00:35:45,880 drive is that? Because I'm just planning my 641 00:35:45,880 --> 00:35:49,960 next trip. It's about 45 minutes from the 642 00:35:49,960 --> 00:35:53,560 airport, OK, And we're building our headquarters about 5 minutes 643 00:35:53,560 --> 00:35:54,920 from here. We're going after the coolest 644 00:35:54,920 --> 00:35:59,520 headquarters in the whole world. That's our goal, not the big. 645 00:35:59,800 --> 00:36:03,320 Curious why? Have you got plans of what's 646 00:36:03,320 --> 00:36:07,400 going to make that cool? Tunnels and swinging bridges 647 00:36:07,400 --> 00:36:11,400 between the buildings and and secret rooms and we're going to 648 00:36:11,400 --> 00:36:14,480 have a lot of fire and one of the buildings we're making with 649 00:36:14,480 --> 00:36:18,760 solid leather leather bricks, bricks of of like straw bales 650 00:36:18,760 --> 00:36:22,120 and hay bales or baling are leather scraps so the whole 651 00:36:22,160 --> 00:36:25,520 building will be solid leather so yeah, stuff like that but no 652 00:36:25,520 --> 00:36:26,160 the. When's that? 653 00:36:26,160 --> 00:36:27,640 When's that opening? So OK. 654 00:36:28,400 --> 00:36:30,880 We're hoping to have that open May 1st. 655 00:36:31,600 --> 00:36:33,360 But in 25? In 20. 656 00:36:33,360 --> 00:36:35,560 Yes, yes. And we have a little, you know, 657 00:36:35,560 --> 00:36:38,400 you got to fix it up a little bit, but for the zip lines and 658 00:36:38,400 --> 00:36:40,240 stuff. But we're, yeah, that's the, 659 00:36:40,880 --> 00:36:42,640 that's the goal. But you know, just there. 660 00:36:42,680 --> 00:36:45,040 And So what we do is we're strictly online. 661 00:36:45,920 --> 00:36:49,040 But what I've seen is people going away from getting into 662 00:36:49,040 --> 00:36:51,640 other people's stores, wholesaling B to B Yeah. 663 00:36:51,840 --> 00:36:55,640 What I've seen is they pull out of that and I've seen them 664 00:36:55,640 --> 00:37:00,000 opening their own stores cuz in high traffic areas, if you're 665 00:37:00,000 --> 00:37:03,720 Lucchesi or some really recognised boot brand or 666 00:37:03,720 --> 00:37:06,000 something, you go to a store that sells those. 667 00:37:06,120 --> 00:37:08,520 But if no one knows about you, they're not going to go to a 668 00:37:08,520 --> 00:37:11,040 strip mall or somewhere that doesn't have you want them to 669 00:37:11,040 --> 00:37:14,120 discover you for smaller brands. So we're going to be opening, 670 00:37:14,640 --> 00:37:18,600 we're hoping to open some stores in high traffic areas close by. 671 00:37:18,600 --> 00:37:22,360 But the mothership will be here at the here at the headquarters. 672 00:37:22,600 --> 00:37:24,520 Fantastic. So so watch this space. 673 00:37:25,000 --> 00:37:26,560 Watch this space. Yeah, yeah, yeah. 674 00:37:27,000 --> 00:37:31,680 No, But the as soon as we start saying it costs us $100 to make 675 00:37:31,680 --> 00:37:37,400 it and then so we wholesale it for 200 to a, to a big box store 676 00:37:38,000 --> 00:37:42,280 and then they sell it for 400. We just like, we, we, we, we 677 00:37:42,280 --> 00:37:45,000 don't like that. We like the flexibility of if it 678 00:37:45,000 --> 00:37:47,080 costs 100, we could sell it for 2:50. 679 00:37:47,320 --> 00:37:49,520 Yeah, I got it. As you said, it has an impact on 680 00:37:49,520 --> 00:37:52,720 your pricing strategy, so. Yeah, there was, you know, you 681 00:37:52,720 --> 00:37:54,960 have nice stuff. But I mean, I, I like Aston 682 00:37:54,960 --> 00:37:58,520 Martins, the Rolls Royces, but at the same time, you know, 683 00:37:58,600 --> 00:38:02,040 they're not affordable. I wouldn't be married if I 684 00:38:02,040 --> 00:38:06,400 bought 1. Of course, my, my marriage would 685 00:38:06,400 --> 00:38:11,480 struggle a lot if I, if I bought 1 and so, but I wouldn't 686 00:38:11,480 --> 00:38:16,120 struggle as much as someone bought a, you know, a 5A5 687 00:38:16,120 --> 00:38:21,520 hundred $700.00 briefcase. If it were at $1000 or 1200, you 688 00:38:21,520 --> 00:38:25,480 start getting out of the realm of like, maybe one day, yeah. 689 00:38:26,280 --> 00:38:29,040 I got you perfect. So Melissa same question to you 690 00:38:29,040 --> 00:38:31,840 before we wrap things up. So you mentioned as we were 691 00:38:31,840 --> 00:38:35,400 talking about communication being key, I was wondering can 692 00:38:35,400 --> 00:38:38,920 you obviously it is key and and all the different forms of 693 00:38:38,920 --> 00:38:42,040 communication that exists out there, you know, whether it's 694 00:38:42,040 --> 00:38:45,240 WhatsApp, whether it's messaging I miss, can you, can you just 695 00:38:45,240 --> 00:38:47,240 expand on that whole thing for us a bit? 696 00:38:47,480 --> 00:38:51,480 Yeah, I think what sometimes get gets lost in the fray of the 697 00:38:51,480 --> 00:38:57,000 holidays is how crucial communication is to the customer 698 00:38:57,000 --> 00:39:00,240 experience. You know, I mean, as a seller, 699 00:39:00,240 --> 00:39:03,360 as a retailer, as a brand, one of your objectives, you're 700 00:39:03,360 --> 00:39:07,920 trying to build trust and confidence to make sure those 701 00:39:07,920 --> 00:39:11,240 shoppers feel confident enough to make the purchase right. 702 00:39:11,520 --> 00:39:17,560 So that it's so crucial to be able to communicate proactively 703 00:39:17,760 --> 00:39:21,160 with your customers. And what we find, what the data 704 00:39:21,160 --> 00:39:25,160 shows is that if you are, if you're telling your customers 705 00:39:25,160 --> 00:39:29,560 upfront, hey, maybe this product isn't going to arrive overnight, 706 00:39:29,720 --> 00:39:33,040 but it's going to be here, then you know, here's here are the 707 00:39:33,080 --> 00:39:37,800 updates with your order. Here is the cut off date for you 708 00:39:37,800 --> 00:39:40,320 know, to get your product by the holidays. 709 00:39:40,560 --> 00:39:45,560 Here is when this particularly great holiday offer ends. 710 00:39:45,880 --> 00:39:49,920 People, shoppers are so much more likely to embrace that than 711 00:39:49,920 --> 00:39:53,320 if you don't provide them with the chin upfront. 712 00:39:53,520 --> 00:39:57,600 So I, I can't, you know, overstate that enough. 713 00:39:57,600 --> 00:40:01,840 I think that just making sure that you're communicating 714 00:40:01,840 --> 00:40:05,520 clearly with your shoppers like Dave talked about being liked. 715 00:40:05,840 --> 00:40:08,800 And, you know, saying if people like you, they will buy from 716 00:40:08,800 --> 00:40:11,080 you. And that's a huge piece of that 717 00:40:11,080 --> 00:40:14,400 is if you're transparent and communicate with your shoppers. 718 00:40:14,400 --> 00:40:17,800 So definitely take that to heart for the holidays, I think. 719 00:40:18,400 --> 00:40:21,160 Yeah, I, I, I agree. I mean, we're not going to talk 720 00:40:21,160 --> 00:40:24,400 about it, but for me, retail is a conversation and it's one that 721 00:40:24,400 --> 00:40:27,640 you want to be involved in and you want people to sort of slip 722 00:40:27,680 --> 00:40:29,480 into that. Like we all love those beautiful 723 00:40:29,480 --> 00:40:32,920 conversations and I, I can so see why communication is so 724 00:40:32,920 --> 00:40:35,960 important because you need that ongoing communication. 725 00:40:36,240 --> 00:40:39,600 Dave, Melissa, thank you so much for carving out some time in 726 00:40:39,600 --> 00:40:42,360 your days to have this conversation. 727 00:40:42,520 --> 00:40:45,040 For me, it's been super enlightening and I look forward 728 00:40:45,040 --> 00:40:48,640 to seeing you both in person. Maybe Melissa at NRF, but Dave, 729 00:40:48,880 --> 00:40:50,960 hopefully in Dallas sometime I'll be there. 730 00:40:50,960 --> 00:40:54,200 So let's just watch this space. Yeah, thank. 731 00:40:54,320 --> 00:40:56,200 Thank you for having us. I really appreciate you 732 00:40:56,200 --> 00:40:58,280 including us in what you're doing. 733 00:40:58,720 --> 00:41:00,400 It was. Fantastic. 734 00:41:00,480 --> 00:41:00,960 Thank you.