1 00:00:06,920 --> 00:00:10,120 You're listening to the Back Home Network presented by Home 2 00:00:10,120 --> 00:00:31,120 Field Apparel. Welcome back to Crimson Cast, 3 00:00:31,320 --> 00:00:33,800 Neil and Clavio joining you here along with Scott Caulfield. 4 00:00:34,120 --> 00:00:38,400 As we're kind of not having a great technical day to say the 5 00:00:38,400 --> 00:00:40,800 least. I am on air pods. 6 00:00:40,800 --> 00:00:45,080 Scott has barely been able to get his audio connected to me, 7 00:00:45,760 --> 00:00:49,120 and so this could be maybe the worst sounding podcast we've 8 00:00:49,120 --> 00:00:51,800 done since the Egyptian Hackers. Scott like it. 9 00:00:51,880 --> 00:00:53,880 I mean, we're we're talking about that era at this point. 10 00:00:54,200 --> 00:00:56,040 There's also the world where this just never gets released 11 00:00:56,040 --> 00:00:58,680 and you and I are talking for 30 minutes, so we can just go ahead 12 00:00:58,680 --> 00:01:00,880 and let's go all conspiracy theories out, like what are your 13 00:01:00,880 --> 00:01:03,640 thoughts on? I don't even know what to say. 14 00:01:03,640 --> 00:01:04,239 I. Don't want to piss? 15 00:01:04,360 --> 00:01:06,200 Anybody off? I'm not even going to take a fun 16 00:01:06,240 --> 00:01:09,240 example. Yeah, no, we could talk about 17 00:01:09,240 --> 00:01:12,200 the the dolphins and Showalter Fountain or something that not 18 00:01:12,200 --> 00:01:15,760 really but no we're we we're hitting Part 2 of what is 19 00:01:15,760 --> 00:01:21,960 rapidly turning into a multi part Q&A with you folks in the 20 00:01:21,960 --> 00:01:23,880 audience. So we had some other questions. 21 00:01:23,880 --> 00:01:26,240 If you listen to part one, you know what I'm talking about. 22 00:01:26,240 --> 00:01:27,960 If not you should go back and listen to part one. 23 00:01:28,240 --> 00:01:31,560 We're going to do Part 2 here. Hit some of the the more fun or 24 00:01:31,560 --> 00:01:34,560 more interesting questions that we saw in that mix. 25 00:01:35,280 --> 00:01:36,480 So we're gonna get to that right away. 26 00:01:36,480 --> 00:01:38,280 First of all, just a reminder, we're brought to you by home 27 00:01:38,280 --> 00:01:40,080 field apparel. Your place to go for the finest 28 00:01:40,080 --> 00:01:43,400 in college fashions, the softest fabrics, the coolest designs. 29 00:01:44,720 --> 00:01:47,160 They are loading up for racing season. 30 00:01:47,160 --> 00:01:50,000 Got some IndyCar stuff dropping. Soon I think there'll be some 31 00:01:50,000 --> 00:01:52,960 little 5 stuff dropping. It's already dropped and and 32 00:01:52,960 --> 00:01:55,080 some more stuff will I think maybe be coming at some point 33 00:01:55,080 --> 00:01:56,080 soon. Use the code. 34 00:01:56,080 --> 00:02:00,440 Home 23. Get 15% off your first order. 35 00:02:00,760 --> 00:02:03,840 Maybe go get one of those UConn back-to-back National title 36 00:02:03,960 --> 00:02:06,160 hoodies. If you're an IU fan, it's the 37 00:02:06,160 --> 00:02:09,560 least that you can do. Again, Home Field apparel.com 38 00:02:11,600 --> 00:02:14,840 Excuse me. Also, just a reminder, we're on 39 00:02:14,840 --> 00:02:17,280 sub stack. Go to crimsoncast.substack.com, 40 00:02:17,840 --> 00:02:21,040 sign up for free, get your podcast delivered right to your 41 00:02:21,040 --> 00:02:23,200 e-mail inbox. And if you'd like to support the 42 00:02:23,200 --> 00:02:25,200 podcast financially, we have a way to do that as well. 43 00:02:25,240 --> 00:02:29,280 So Scott, without further ado, first of all, how are you? 44 00:02:29,280 --> 00:02:31,720 Is it? Is it as rainy up there as it is 45 00:02:31,720 --> 00:02:33,120 down here in Bloomington right now? 46 00:02:33,440 --> 00:02:35,400 Not really. It's misting, although I feel 47 00:02:35,400 --> 00:02:36,760 bad. I'm watching my kids get off the 48 00:02:36,760 --> 00:02:38,240 bus. My youngest son get off the bus 49 00:02:38,240 --> 00:02:40,360 without an umbrella, so he's a little unhappy, so he might have 50 00:02:40,360 --> 00:02:42,000 a different take on it. But no, it's not. 51 00:02:42,000 --> 00:02:43,600 It's not too bad here. A little cloudy it would be. 52 00:02:43,960 --> 00:02:46,720 By the way, I I watch part of your Instagram video. 53 00:02:46,720 --> 00:02:49,800 Instagram is great. You driving around like I wanted 54 00:02:49,800 --> 00:02:51,720 to see you get to the stadium but it's like I had to do 55 00:02:51,720 --> 00:02:53,480 something else. It's like then I I couldn't go 56 00:02:53,480 --> 00:02:54,520 back. I didn't want to watch like 57 00:02:54,520 --> 00:02:55,920 another 10 minutes like to get there. 58 00:02:55,920 --> 00:02:58,080 It's like I wish there was a a scroll back and forth. 59 00:02:58,080 --> 00:03:00,320 Anyway, the eclipse, I know you lived through it. 60 00:03:00,320 --> 00:03:02,840 Like I lived through it. It was that was awesome. 61 00:03:03,000 --> 00:03:05,720 Like that was AI wasn't quite sure what to expect. 62 00:03:05,720 --> 00:03:10,680 We had done the partial in 2017. No joke for the audience. 63 00:03:10,680 --> 00:03:12,720 I hung out with my neighbors. We did an eclipse party in the 64 00:03:12,960 --> 00:03:16,960 in the middle of the cul-de-sac, but it was that was unbelievable 65 00:03:16,960 --> 00:03:20,040 and like, I get why ancient cultures thought that was a big 66 00:03:20,040 --> 00:03:22,960 deal. That was it was really cool. 67 00:03:22,960 --> 00:03:25,680 So for everybody who was able to enjoy it, I hope you did and it 68 00:03:25,800 --> 00:03:27,960 literally afterwards was like being on Space Mountain. 69 00:03:27,960 --> 00:03:30,720 Like I want to do it again like when when could we go to like 70 00:03:30,720 --> 00:03:34,600 Portugal in 20242048? Like it was it was awesome. 71 00:03:34,600 --> 00:03:36,400 Curious how your your take on it was? 72 00:03:36,960 --> 00:03:40,360 It had a similar take. And yes, you just became one of 73 00:03:40,360 --> 00:03:43,720 those Eclipse people that drives around or flies around the 74 00:03:43,720 --> 00:03:45,360 country and and just goes to eclipse. 75 00:03:45,360 --> 00:03:46,720 You can see why that's an allure. 76 00:03:46,720 --> 00:03:48,080 And I was the same way that you were. 77 00:03:49,360 --> 00:03:53,760 I I think I put this on Instagram like I I'm a I'm a bit 78 00:03:53,760 --> 00:03:55,840 of a cynic at heart. And you know, whenever you see 79 00:03:55,840 --> 00:03:59,960 this amount of of ballyhoo around an event, you're always a 80 00:03:59,960 --> 00:04:01,960 little bit skeptical if you're a cynical person. 81 00:04:01,960 --> 00:04:04,120 But I was really blown away. It was a really special 82 00:04:04,120 --> 00:04:07,480 experience. And again, I mean, I I likely 83 00:04:07,480 --> 00:04:10,200 will not be around for the next one here, but I might not be 84 00:04:10,200 --> 00:04:13,960 here when the next one happens where I'm at, and so maybe it'll 85 00:04:13,960 --> 00:04:15,600 all even out. But it was definitely a cool. 86 00:04:15,600 --> 00:04:18,680 Experience, my only take away from it is like in history 87 00:04:18,680 --> 00:04:20,680 before there were, you know, glasses and people who knew and 88 00:04:20,680 --> 00:04:21,959 you just didn't know it was happening. 89 00:04:22,880 --> 00:04:25,120 People had to just lose their vision, 'cause if you don't know 90 00:04:25,120 --> 00:04:26,720 what's going on, you're just gonna look at it like, oh, 91 00:04:26,720 --> 00:04:28,640 that's cool. And it's like it's like there 92 00:04:28,640 --> 00:04:32,400 had to be a swap of blind people or people with jacked up vision 93 00:04:32,600 --> 00:04:35,800 across solar eclipse paths in the in the in previous history. 94 00:04:36,440 --> 00:04:38,600 I had a similar thought while it was happening. 95 00:04:38,600 --> 00:04:40,200 I was like, well, how did you know? 96 00:04:40,560 --> 00:04:44,120 At what point was it established that looking directly at the sun 97 00:04:44,120 --> 00:04:46,240 was a bad idea. I'm always I'm I'm interested 98 00:04:46,240 --> 00:04:48,160 where in in the development of human history. 99 00:04:48,160 --> 00:04:51,800 They were like, we should probably not be staring directly 100 00:04:51,800 --> 00:04:53,280 at this incredibly bright object. 101 00:04:53,760 --> 00:04:56,240 Yeah, so anyway. We had a group. 102 00:04:56,240 --> 00:04:57,880 We had like, you know, 20 kids in our neighborhood. 103 00:04:57,880 --> 00:04:58,800 And I knew it was going to happen. 104 00:04:58,800 --> 00:05:01,120 It's like we're watching like, you know, totality. 105 00:05:01,120 --> 00:05:02,400 It's like, oh, this is awesome. It's Austin. 106 00:05:02,400 --> 00:05:04,040 All of a sudden. It's like kids, glasses, like 107 00:05:04,080 --> 00:05:05,240 kids right now. Glasses, glasses. 108 00:05:05,240 --> 00:05:07,760 Like once it starts coming out, it's like, no, right now, right 109 00:05:07,760 --> 00:05:09,080 now. Glasses now like stop. 110 00:05:10,240 --> 00:05:13,240 I think the biggest thing that we noticed was the dogs. 111 00:05:13,240 --> 00:05:15,520 There were several dogs at the place that I was watching it at 112 00:05:15,520 --> 00:05:18,880 and they all got real like eerily quiet during the eclipse 113 00:05:18,880 --> 00:05:20,680 itself like during the totality part. 114 00:05:20,680 --> 00:05:23,600 So I don't know that that means anything. 115 00:05:23,600 --> 00:05:26,520 They were probably just like why is it dark all of the sudden but 116 00:05:26,520 --> 00:05:27,840 I thought that was a fascinating thing. 117 00:05:27,840 --> 00:05:30,720 Anyway, we didn't come to talk about the eclipse, but I'm glad 118 00:05:30,720 --> 00:05:33,360 that we are. We came to talk about your folks 119 00:05:33,360 --> 00:05:35,440 questions. First of all. 120 00:05:35,920 --> 00:05:39,840 Well OK, I was Scott is is somebody's trying to invade his 121 00:05:39,840 --> 00:05:42,520 office and so he's he's going and taking care of that right 122 00:05:42,520 --> 00:05:43,120 now. I hope. 123 00:05:43,120 --> 00:05:44,800 I hope he's OK. He's back. 124 00:05:44,800 --> 00:05:45,720 Everything. Everything all right? 125 00:05:45,720 --> 00:05:48,000 Was like the UPS guy got a little too friendly getting in 126 00:05:48,000 --> 00:05:51,040 the house or what happened. Sorry. 127 00:05:51,040 --> 00:05:52,920 No, no, The kids just got home, so I had to tell them to go 128 00:05:52,920 --> 00:05:53,840 downstairs. So I apologize. 129 00:05:53,840 --> 00:05:54,600 That was just bad. Timing. 130 00:05:54,600 --> 00:05:56,440 No, it's great. This is this is this is 131 00:05:56,440 --> 00:05:58,240 parenting. When you have a podcast it's 132 00:05:58,240 --> 00:06:00,520 please leave me alone. I, I I don't care if you've been 133 00:06:00,520 --> 00:06:02,960 gone all day but I love you, Grace. 134 00:06:02,960 --> 00:06:05,600 Well, Scott. Scott we have a yeah we have a 135 00:06:05,640 --> 00:06:10,440 we have a beef from one of our folks on Twitter with you, Howie 136 00:06:10,440 --> 00:06:12,400 says. Can you get Scott to stop 137 00:06:12,400 --> 00:06:15,040 referring to last year's portal class as a home run. 138 00:06:15,400 --> 00:06:18,800 I feel like we got halfway there last time when after saying we 139 00:06:18,800 --> 00:06:21,840 got where so this year we need two top five guys to be better 140 00:06:21,840 --> 00:06:24,080 off. Woodson finally seemed to 141 00:06:24,080 --> 00:06:28,200 acknowledge that fit matters. So I'll I'll support Scott in 142 00:06:28,200 --> 00:06:30,400 this. Howie, I think it's fair to say 143 00:06:30,400 --> 00:06:35,360 that the where signing was a home run, but we we didn't win 144 00:06:35,400 --> 00:06:38,960 the portal last year. So I I think there's a 145 00:06:38,960 --> 00:06:41,280 differentiation there between saying that the where signing 146 00:06:41,280 --> 00:06:45,320 was a home run and the overall portal experience for IU last 147 00:06:45,320 --> 00:06:47,240 year was a home run. Is that what you meant to say, 148 00:06:47,240 --> 00:06:48,960 or do you really mean? Do you think that the whole 149 00:06:48,960 --> 00:06:50,200 Portal experience was a home run? 150 00:06:50,200 --> 00:06:53,880 Last year I I I think so. I I think it's a home run. 151 00:06:53,880 --> 00:06:56,680 And what I mean is, like, to me, Imbaco is part of the Portal 152 00:06:56,680 --> 00:06:58,720 experience, like in the offseason. 153 00:06:59,120 --> 00:07:00,640 He's not part of the That's a recruit, though. 154 00:07:00,640 --> 00:07:02,000 That's not the portal. No, I know. 155 00:07:02,000 --> 00:07:04,200 But that's OK. All right, then. 156 00:07:04,200 --> 00:07:04,880 Then I should. All right. 157 00:07:05,120 --> 00:07:10,280 The offseason overall was a home run in that you get that I don't 158 00:07:10,280 --> 00:07:13,440 think you're ever going to see us or most schools get, you 159 00:07:13,440 --> 00:07:16,000 know, two of the top five people in a Portal class. 160 00:07:16,000 --> 00:07:18,520 It just seems very unlikely to happen to me. 161 00:07:18,520 --> 00:07:21,680 What I was saying is that you get one of the top five Portal 162 00:07:21,680 --> 00:07:23,960 guys, you get two other guys, you know, Anthony Walker, a kid 163 00:07:23,960 --> 00:07:26,960 coming off a Final four team. You have Peyton Sparks a you 164 00:07:26,960 --> 00:07:31,960 know, local you know, regional solid you know, mid level player 165 00:07:32,520 --> 00:07:35,360 pieces put together. And then I I do include Imbacco 166 00:07:35,360 --> 00:07:37,080 in that as like a five star transfer. 167 00:07:37,080 --> 00:07:40,120 So maybe I should rephrase it as like a home run offseason. 168 00:07:40,120 --> 00:07:43,560 To me that's as good as you can do in an offseason. 169 00:07:43,880 --> 00:07:48,360 I I kind of view the five star you know, re recruitment people 170 00:07:48,360 --> 00:07:51,120 at this point as Portal adjacent we'll call it. 171 00:07:51,120 --> 00:07:54,200 But that that's my overall feeling is that for an offseason 172 00:07:54,200 --> 00:07:55,960 that's about as good as you're going to get. 173 00:07:56,040 --> 00:07:58,400 Maybe it's not like an absolute Grand Slam but to me that's a 174 00:07:58,400 --> 00:08:02,640 really good offseason. My point is we haven't hit that 175 00:08:02,640 --> 00:08:06,560 yet, and it's just like we did that and it wasn't good enough. 176 00:08:06,800 --> 00:08:09,520 The idea of this goes to what you and I always talk about, the 177 00:08:09,520 --> 00:08:10,880 idea of like, we just got to do better. 178 00:08:10,880 --> 00:08:14,880 It's like that's you know when you take the totality good word 179 00:08:14,880 --> 00:08:17,320 for this week of of the offseason. 180 00:08:17,480 --> 00:08:20,040 To me it's like you can't say last season what you got was 181 00:08:20,040 --> 00:08:23,400 like AC minus, like you got really a lot of good pieces. 182 00:08:23,720 --> 00:08:27,240 My I guess my greater point is the idea of us just we have to 183 00:08:27,240 --> 00:08:29,800 do better than that seems really unlikely to me. 184 00:08:29,800 --> 00:08:32,559 It's like we got to do better with the pieces we get. 185 00:08:32,720 --> 00:08:35,960 But I guess that that's clarification around it and I am 186 00:08:35,960 --> 00:08:39,280 including Imbaco in that. So I should say Offseason and 187 00:08:39,280 --> 00:08:41,159 not Portal. And I I hear that. 188 00:08:41,840 --> 00:08:44,600 That's AI think that's a fair clarification, and I think your 189 00:08:44,600 --> 00:08:46,880 larger point is a good one, that it's like you're going to be 190 00:08:46,880 --> 00:08:51,640 hard pressed to do as well in the overall offseason and you 191 00:08:51,640 --> 00:08:54,440 could say, well, Bryson Tucker, there's your Mackenzie Imbacco 192 00:08:54,440 --> 00:08:56,200 analog. I don't know if that's really, 193 00:08:57,520 --> 00:09:00,400 I'm not sure if Bryson Tucker will provide the same kind of 194 00:09:00,400 --> 00:09:03,760 thing that Imbaco did. But certainly getting someone of 195 00:09:03,760 --> 00:09:06,600 where's caliber, you're you're kind of having to live up to 196 00:09:06,600 --> 00:09:10,480 that expectation plus having to sign a starting point guard, 197 00:09:10,720 --> 00:09:13,960 that's a that is going to be a really fascinating task to see 198 00:09:13,960 --> 00:09:16,120 how Indiana handles that. It actually dovetails with 199 00:09:16,120 --> 00:09:19,760 another question that we got from Indibama or Indibama. 200 00:09:20,840 --> 00:09:22,680 What's the magic formula to getting. 201 00:09:23,200 --> 00:09:26,320 I'm sorry, yeah make make you up. 202 00:09:27,440 --> 00:09:31,800 Yeah the the what's the magic formula for getting completely 203 00:09:31,800 --> 00:09:34,920 unrelated portal transfers, expecting starter playing time 204 00:09:34,920 --> 00:09:37,720 and close knit, returning IU starters to gel together in a 205 00:09:37,720 --> 00:09:40,840 scheme that hasn't produced and resulting in wins and setting up 206 00:09:40,840 --> 00:09:43,400 the program for the future. And and yes, that was a run on 207 00:09:43,400 --> 00:09:46,240 sentence. So I think there's stages, you 208 00:09:46,240 --> 00:09:47,920 know, don't ask. Don't ask this for Rick Pitino. 209 00:09:47,920 --> 00:09:50,160 He doesn't know. The worst, worst experience of 210 00:09:50,160 --> 00:09:55,040 my wife Scott. No, the OK. 211 00:09:55,040 --> 00:09:57,240 So I think there's a couple of different stages there. 212 00:09:57,280 --> 00:10:02,880 You this was brought up I think by Jared from assembly call or 213 00:10:02,880 --> 00:10:07,040 it was maybe Coach Tonsoni on a show they did like last week or 214 00:10:07,040 --> 00:10:10,640 two weeks ago where it's like you know you can kind of broadly 215 00:10:10,640 --> 00:10:13,120 say well we're just going to get the best players figure out who 216 00:10:13,120 --> 00:10:16,320 the best players are then figure out what system we want to 217 00:10:16,320 --> 00:10:19,880 utilize and then try to you know and and I guess hope that the 218 00:10:19,880 --> 00:10:23,600 culture gels or you can try to go the culture route and say 219 00:10:23,600 --> 00:10:25,240 well we need to get complimentary pieces from 220 00:10:25,240 --> 00:10:29,040 personnel perspective and see if we can grow them into roles that 221 00:10:29,040 --> 00:10:32,240 operate within the structure that we want to utilize. 222 00:10:32,880 --> 00:10:35,880 I I think it's really, I think you got to kind of got you got 223 00:10:35,880 --> 00:10:38,680 to kind of do one or the other. I don't know that you can do 224 00:10:38,680 --> 00:10:42,880 both you you might be able to pull off both, but that would be 225 00:10:43,200 --> 00:10:47,760 tremendously lucky I think in the eyes of of you know college 226 00:10:47,760 --> 00:10:50,480 basketball. Because as we've seen and one of 227 00:10:50,480 --> 00:10:53,760 the things that we talked about on the Q&A yesterday and a 228 00:10:53,760 --> 00:10:57,840 little bit on when we talked on Sunday, Scott, is this idea that 229 00:10:57,840 --> 00:11:03,080 culture is so important. And even though IU players have 230 00:11:03,080 --> 00:11:07,320 clearly closed ranks and have kind of put whatever differences 231 00:11:07,320 --> 00:11:10,200 there appeared to be on the court beside or behind them, 232 00:11:12,000 --> 00:11:15,560 realistically, culture was a bit of an issue last year. 233 00:11:15,840 --> 00:11:18,160 Culture was certainly an issue, I think, in the Archie Miller 234 00:11:18,160 --> 00:11:19,600 era. Like it never felt like those 235 00:11:19,600 --> 00:11:22,880 teams properly gelled. And I think you saw that last 236 00:11:22,880 --> 00:11:24,320 year quite a bit. Now you got a little bit of 237 00:11:24,320 --> 00:11:27,280 jelling at the end, but you're also losing the point guard that 238 00:11:27,280 --> 00:11:30,120 you said was the linchpin of everything and you're losing the 239 00:11:30,120 --> 00:11:33,560 center that was, you know, your primary force on on offense and 240 00:11:33,560 --> 00:11:37,640 defense by the end of the year. I don't know that there's a, you 241 00:11:37,640 --> 00:11:40,760 know, is there a secret sauce for making that happen or a 242 00:11:40,760 --> 00:11:43,040 magic formula? I I don't think there is. 243 00:11:43,040 --> 00:11:45,960 I think you've got to get good players, 'cause if you've got 244 00:11:45,960 --> 00:11:48,880 average players who blend together well, I don't think 245 00:11:48,880 --> 00:11:52,320 that the remaining pieces that are on this team are necessarily 246 00:11:52,320 --> 00:11:55,440 good enough to get you in the top half of the Big 10 by 247 00:11:55,440 --> 00:11:58,040 themselves. But I think that the other 248 00:11:58,040 --> 00:12:00,800 aspect is you you're going to have to take some things on 249 00:12:00,800 --> 00:12:05,240 faith with some of the the higher rated players because 250 00:12:05,240 --> 00:12:08,000 you're not going to be able to necessarily filter for culture 251 00:12:08,000 --> 00:12:09,920 and that's that's the way the open market works. 252 00:12:09,920 --> 00:12:12,320 When it comes to this transfer portal, you don't have the 253 00:12:12,320 --> 00:12:14,000 luxury of just picking and choosing. 254 00:12:14,600 --> 00:12:17,760 If you're Indiana, you've really got to be purposeful in what you 255 00:12:17,760 --> 00:12:20,240 think is most important and hope that the other stuff falls into 256 00:12:20,240 --> 00:12:22,600 place. I mean, where I think Indiana 257 00:12:22,600 --> 00:12:25,560 has a problem is, and I'm just going to assume this is the 258 00:12:25,560 --> 00:12:28,520 case, you know, Mike Woodson seems to have a system that he 259 00:12:28,520 --> 00:12:30,760 wants to play basketball under. That's fine. 260 00:12:30,760 --> 00:12:31,880 You can have that and that's great. 261 00:12:32,600 --> 00:12:35,200 The the trouble is that also that that limits the number of 262 00:12:35,200 --> 00:12:36,520 people you can get in the portal. 263 00:12:36,520 --> 00:12:38,000 Because we're saying there was a culture problem. 264 00:12:38,000 --> 00:12:41,040 There was kind of like a fit of you're asking players to do 265 00:12:41,040 --> 00:12:43,880 things they really can't do because you you need them to fit 266 00:12:43,880 --> 00:12:46,360 into your system and you can have a system. 267 00:12:46,360 --> 00:12:48,720 It's fine, but it's it's if you're going to do a lot in the 268 00:12:48,720 --> 00:12:51,560 portal, which we're going to have to do, you know you're 269 00:12:51,560 --> 00:12:54,560 going to get only half The kids in the portal are probably guys 270 00:12:54,560 --> 00:12:56,600 who can play in the Mike Woodson system. 271 00:12:56,600 --> 00:12:59,200 It's not a knock on the system. It's just in any system like if 272 00:12:59,400 --> 00:13:02,200 if Purdue needed six guys in the system, it's like Matt Painter 273 00:13:02,200 --> 00:13:05,560 has a very specific system that he needs players now. 274 00:13:05,560 --> 00:13:09,000 He recruits for it, he builds for it in in programs that kind 275 00:13:09,000 --> 00:13:12,680 of have a self defined system. The portal is great when you're 276 00:13:12,680 --> 00:13:14,960 getting a piece here, a piece there, and you can kind of plug 277 00:13:14,960 --> 00:13:17,040 them in. The idea that we need to get 278 00:13:17,040 --> 00:13:21,000 this many pieces into the portal is tough because the other 279 00:13:21,000 --> 00:13:24,360 option is, you know, well then then you might need a, you know, 280 00:13:24,360 --> 00:13:26,560 a a a system that's much more flexible. 281 00:13:26,560 --> 00:13:28,320 Like a coach is just going to, we're going to, we're going to 282 00:13:28,320 --> 00:13:30,440 see the pieces we have and I'm going to build my system around 283 00:13:30,440 --> 00:13:32,920 the pieces I have. We don't seem to have that. 284 00:13:32,960 --> 00:13:36,840 And so that that's where I get concerned is you need to get six 285 00:13:36,840 --> 00:13:39,200 people like we've talked about. Two of them need to be high 286 00:13:39,200 --> 00:13:43,080 level, but they also need to be guys who will be able to do 287 00:13:43,120 --> 00:13:45,080 exactly what you need them to do. 288 00:13:45,400 --> 00:13:47,800 And there's some players who just are not going to be fits 289 00:13:47,840 --> 00:13:49,920 based on the system that you're running. 290 00:13:50,320 --> 00:13:52,920 And it's like I just wonder if you're kind of self, you're 291 00:13:52,920 --> 00:13:56,000 making the selection process so small, they only have a couple 292 00:13:56,000 --> 00:13:58,640 guys you can go after. And that's where I get concerned 293 00:13:59,160 --> 00:14:01,160 with what we're doing. But I I think that's part of the 294 00:14:01,160 --> 00:14:04,680 problem is we have a pretty inflexible system that we're 295 00:14:04,680 --> 00:14:07,760 playing basketball under, which in and of itself, again isn't 296 00:14:07,760 --> 00:14:12,720 bad, but it is very tough when you need to get half your team 297 00:14:12,720 --> 00:14:16,320 in a three-week period of guys who also fit the system you want 298 00:14:16,320 --> 00:14:20,240 to play. Let's move on to the next 299 00:14:20,240 --> 00:14:22,960 question. We had a question. 300 00:14:23,080 --> 00:14:24,760 I know there's one you in particular want to get to. 301 00:14:24,760 --> 00:14:26,400 We will get to that in a in a second. 302 00:14:28,400 --> 00:14:33,400 So this is one I was going to say for like a solo pod, but I 303 00:14:33,400 --> 00:14:35,080 I'll go ahead and ask it while you're here. 304 00:14:35,080 --> 00:14:38,800 Robbie Malcolm? Yeah, Robbie Malcolmson asks. 305 00:14:39,160 --> 00:14:41,800 There are many justifiable criticisms to the transfer 306 00:14:41,800 --> 00:14:43,840 portal. However, as a challenge, can you 307 00:14:43,840 --> 00:14:47,200 defend the current portal and what it has to offer the average 308 00:14:47,200 --> 00:14:51,920 coach, athlete and university? So I'll say this, and people 309 00:14:51,920 --> 00:14:54,200 have listened to the show for a while, have heard me say this 310 00:14:54,200 --> 00:14:57,880 before you can. You can be critical of the way 311 00:14:57,880 --> 00:15:01,400 the transfer portal operates and how it fits within the confines 312 00:15:01,400 --> 00:15:04,720 of college basketball. I think that that's fair in as 313 00:15:04,720 --> 00:15:07,760 much as it is a sea change of epic proportions from how we 314 00:15:07,760 --> 00:15:10,040 used to do business. You know, transfers were very 315 00:15:10,040 --> 00:15:13,080 rare. Certainly multiple time 316 00:15:13,080 --> 00:15:15,840 transfers were non existent, essentially, except in 317 00:15:15,840 --> 00:15:18,960 incredibly special cases. It's led to a lot of uncertainty 318 00:15:18,960 --> 00:15:23,040 year to year about rosters. The the key thing that is the 319 00:15:23,040 --> 00:15:26,800 defense of the transfer portal is that colleges and 320 00:15:26,800 --> 00:15:30,520 universities engaged in high level collegiate athletics have 321 00:15:30,520 --> 00:15:34,960 forever argued that athletes are just students, that they're not 322 00:15:34,960 --> 00:15:37,160 like a special class, that they're not employees. 323 00:15:37,160 --> 00:15:40,080 None of that. Well, there's not really any 324 00:15:40,080 --> 00:15:46,400 justifiable argument for having students, which is what the 325 00:15:46,400 --> 00:15:48,600 colleges and universities have argued, that the athletes are 326 00:15:48,640 --> 00:15:52,480 not being able to move from school to school like any other 327 00:15:52,480 --> 00:15:55,080 student can. As, as I'll say like if I'm if I 328 00:15:55,080 --> 00:15:59,040 have a student in my class right now, who's going here? 329 00:15:59,200 --> 00:16:01,840 But they really, after thinking about it, really think that 330 00:16:01,840 --> 00:16:05,040 they'd be happier at, you know, back home at Illinois, you know, 331 00:16:05,040 --> 00:16:08,080 University of Illinois. They can just leave IU and go to 332 00:16:08,080 --> 00:16:09,880 Illinois. And as long as they get accepted 333 00:16:09,880 --> 00:16:12,320 by Illinois and can transfer classes and they can go play 334 00:16:12,320 --> 00:16:15,880 there or go start, go go start classes there, Why should that 335 00:16:15,880 --> 00:16:18,000 be any different? If you're going to classify 336 00:16:18,200 --> 00:16:20,640 athletes as students at the collegiate level, why should the 337 00:16:20,640 --> 00:16:24,680 rules be any different for them? The other thing I'll say is that 338 00:16:24,880 --> 00:16:29,160 the reason the transfer portal exists is because colleges and 339 00:16:29,160 --> 00:16:32,080 universities know that if they try to restrict movement of of 340 00:16:32,080 --> 00:16:35,920 athletes now, they'll get sued and they'll lose because there's 341 00:16:35,920 --> 00:16:38,960 no real justification for it. Do coaches like that? 342 00:16:38,960 --> 00:16:40,440 No. Do athletic directors like that? 343 00:16:40,440 --> 00:16:42,120 No. But guess who has the ability, 344 00:16:42,120 --> 00:16:43,640 the ability to change it right now? 345 00:16:44,080 --> 00:16:46,120 Colleges and universities, The NCAA. 346 00:16:46,120 --> 00:16:47,720 That is the membership of the NCAA. 347 00:16:47,720 --> 00:16:51,040 This isn't just some random judgement or some random 348 00:16:51,360 --> 00:16:54,600 decision that was handed down. This is specifically what the 349 00:16:54,600 --> 00:16:56,760 membership is allowing to happen. 350 00:16:56,760 --> 00:16:59,200 They could change the rules. They could make the movement of 351 00:16:59,200 --> 00:17:00,920 players a lot more professional in nature. 352 00:17:00,920 --> 00:17:02,440 There's a ton of things they could be doing. 353 00:17:03,160 --> 00:17:04,560 Do they do those things? No. 354 00:17:05,079 --> 00:17:08,400 And so I have a hard time, like really? 355 00:17:08,400 --> 00:17:11,839 I understand why fans don't like it, but this is the system that 356 00:17:11,839 --> 00:17:14,440 colleges and universities have claimed that they've been using 357 00:17:14,440 --> 00:17:17,160 for a long time. So if you're mad about it, you 358 00:17:17,160 --> 00:17:20,440 need to get on your local, like, board of trustees or athletic 359 00:17:20,440 --> 00:17:22,920 director or what have you and say why don't we change the 360 00:17:22,920 --> 00:17:24,960 rules and why don't we make it a little bit more equitable for 361 00:17:24,960 --> 00:17:28,200 the players And you sign them to contracts, employment contracts. 362 00:17:28,200 --> 00:17:30,680 Well, now they can't move that. I mean, did you ever wonder why 363 00:17:30,680 --> 00:17:33,160 there's not like a transfer portal in the NFL? 364 00:17:33,160 --> 00:17:35,160 It's because they have a collective bargaining agreement. 365 00:17:35,320 --> 00:17:37,640 It's because there are rules about here's how much we're 366 00:17:37,640 --> 00:17:40,080 going to pay you and here's how long the contract is and if we 367 00:17:40,080 --> 00:17:42,240 cut, here's how much money you get, if any. 368 00:17:42,440 --> 00:17:44,840 Like that's how sports is supposed to work. 369 00:17:45,200 --> 00:17:47,800 And so that would be what I would say to people who don't 370 00:17:47,800 --> 00:17:49,920 like the portal. I don't like some of the things 371 00:17:49,920 --> 00:17:52,120 it's done, especially to football and basketball. 372 00:17:52,520 --> 00:17:55,800 But this is what you said you were doing for years as a as an 373 00:17:55,800 --> 00:17:58,800 entity, the NCAA. And so, welcome to reality. 374 00:17:59,120 --> 00:18:01,720 I look at it kind of like a stock bubble where you have all 375 00:18:01,720 --> 00:18:04,480 this pent up energy of P and we for so long people haven't been 376 00:18:04,480 --> 00:18:06,160 able to move or transfer like you mentioned. 377 00:18:06,680 --> 00:18:09,560 And now it's like it it kind of is being blown out and I think 378 00:18:09,560 --> 00:18:11,160 it's good. You know the the thing that I 379 00:18:11,160 --> 00:18:14,760 think is funny and these are single cases, but you know I 380 00:18:14,760 --> 00:18:19,040 look at the transfer portal as a real benefit for coaches and 381 00:18:19,040 --> 00:18:20,880 programs that have their S together. 382 00:18:20,880 --> 00:18:22,760 And so you look at a, you know the two teams who just played 383 00:18:22,760 --> 00:18:24,640 for the national championship, Purdue and Connecticut. 384 00:18:24,920 --> 00:18:27,120 Connecticut had some turnover. A lot of those guys went to the 385 00:18:27,120 --> 00:18:29,480 NBA, but you had a lot of, you know, some of the pieces from 386 00:18:29,480 --> 00:18:31,440 last year's team and this year's team, Purdue. 387 00:18:32,120 --> 00:18:34,680 It's almost the entire team back and it's a very unique 388 00:18:34,680 --> 00:18:36,920 circumstance. But it's like this talk of like, 389 00:18:36,920 --> 00:18:38,120 Oh my gosh, all you're going to get. 390 00:18:38,120 --> 00:18:39,840 You know, it's funny when people are like, I hate the men's game. 391 00:18:39,840 --> 00:18:41,000 None of the same players are there. 392 00:18:41,000 --> 00:18:43,240 And it's like all the all this change and difference, like, 393 00:18:43,240 --> 00:18:44,720 well, Purdue's been here for two years. 394 00:18:44,720 --> 00:18:46,360 They look pretty the same. Next year, I think they're going 395 00:18:46,360 --> 00:18:48,400 to look pretty like There's a lot of teams that do have a lot 396 00:18:48,400 --> 00:18:51,280 of consistency and it does feel like if you're a coach who 397 00:18:51,280 --> 00:18:54,360 builds a good program and has things kind of loaded in 398 00:18:54,360 --> 00:18:57,600 correctly, the portal is a great spot to get a couple pieces here 399 00:18:57,600 --> 00:19:00,280 and there and keep growing. I do think where it's tough is 400 00:19:00,280 --> 00:19:03,400 where you, if you have programs that are not well maintained or 401 00:19:03,400 --> 00:19:07,400 not well, you know, put together in the past, it's like what you 402 00:19:07,400 --> 00:19:09,960 could just kind of keep the pieces you had and kind of have 403 00:19:09,960 --> 00:19:12,400 this fifed them. Now everybody can leave and you 404 00:19:12,400 --> 00:19:14,800 can you get a little more free market in here. 405 00:19:15,080 --> 00:19:18,120 And it makes the job a lot tougher for coaches who are not 406 00:19:18,120 --> 00:19:20,360 doing a good job. And personally, I don't feel bad 407 00:19:20,360 --> 00:19:22,960 for any of them. Like you just don't get to get 408 00:19:22,960 --> 00:19:25,360 somebody for four years because you signed them early. 409 00:19:26,720 --> 00:19:30,000 So I I like it and I think you're seeing, you know, we just 410 00:19:30,000 --> 00:19:31,440 had back-to-back national champions. 411 00:19:31,440 --> 00:19:33,720 It's not like this is going to be a crap shoot every year and 412 00:19:33,720 --> 00:19:37,160 you re roll the dice. It's like you're starting like 413 00:19:37,160 --> 00:19:38,920 people are like, man, Connecticut's going to go 414 00:19:38,920 --> 00:19:41,000 forever. It's like, well, I thought the 415 00:19:41,040 --> 00:19:43,280 the big thing of the Portal was like you're never, teams are 416 00:19:43,280 --> 00:19:44,840 never going to stay together, you're never going to get 417 00:19:44,840 --> 00:19:46,760 consistency. It's like we almost seem to have 418 00:19:46,760 --> 00:19:48,120 more of it now in the Portal era. 419 00:19:48,120 --> 00:19:51,640 So I think it's it's it makes it harder for the mediocre coaches 420 00:19:51,800 --> 00:19:53,000 and that's why they don't like it. 421 00:19:53,080 --> 00:19:55,640 But I think for the coaches who were good, it actually makes it 422 00:19:55,640 --> 00:19:57,160 better. And you might see even more 423 00:19:57,160 --> 00:20:01,520 dynasty building in the Portal era than we saw in the last 1520 424 00:20:01,520 --> 00:20:04,560 years. Yeah, I mean and and look, 425 00:20:04,560 --> 00:20:07,840 sometimes it's not that, you know, I mean some of it is 426 00:20:07,840 --> 00:20:10,120 players don't want to sit around, They want to get playing 427 00:20:10,120 --> 00:20:13,120 time. This is, this is how it works. 428 00:20:14,880 --> 00:20:16,920 I think a lot of people that don't like the portal in 429 00:20:16,920 --> 00:20:22,120 football or basketball, you know, look, so many players got 430 00:20:22,120 --> 00:20:25,040 stashed for two or three years until the coach was ready to 431 00:20:25,040 --> 00:20:27,680 play them. And now there's movement, 432 00:20:27,680 --> 00:20:29,400 there's freedom of movement. Of course people are going to 433 00:20:29,400 --> 00:20:31,280 utilize that. If you don't like it, I 434 00:20:31,280 --> 00:20:33,000 understand. But that's why you have to make 435 00:20:33,440 --> 00:20:37,080 them employees like you that you have to pay them like the idea 436 00:20:37,080 --> 00:20:39,960 that well we're going to give you this scholarship but and 437 00:20:39,960 --> 00:20:42,600 you're but you're really here to play sports and you know it and 438 00:20:42,600 --> 00:20:45,160 we know it, but we're not going to play you until we're ready to 439 00:20:45,160 --> 00:20:48,480 play you. I mean it's just not I know that 440 00:20:49,120 --> 00:20:51,800 that's what most of college sports was based on. 441 00:20:52,080 --> 00:20:54,560 But it's also very different from how the rest of the 442 00:20:54,560 --> 00:20:58,200 sporting world operates. You know when, and again, I'll 443 00:20:58,200 --> 00:21:00,920 use like European soccer as an example, like you can sign 444 00:21:00,920 --> 00:21:03,080 players but you're going to loan them out and have them play at 445 00:21:03,080 --> 00:21:06,160 other places so they continue to get better, not just so they you 446 00:21:06,200 --> 00:21:09,920 you don't get significantly better unless you're playing 447 00:21:09,920 --> 00:21:11,760 regularly against other competition. 448 00:21:12,200 --> 00:21:15,720 And that is I think an important aspect to all of this. 449 00:21:15,720 --> 00:21:17,960 There are many other models that could be utilized that would 450 00:21:17,960 --> 00:21:20,480 make a lot more sense than the Transfer Portal model, but it 451 00:21:20,480 --> 00:21:22,480 would require a different financial model to go. 452 00:21:22,480 --> 00:21:25,680 Along with the NBA, as example, like the Pacers have Jairus 453 00:21:25,680 --> 00:21:27,480 Walker, who they signed. Like they're not playing him a 454 00:21:27,480 --> 00:21:29,560 ton, which I have concerns about, but it's like they're 455 00:21:29,560 --> 00:21:31,480 playing him in the G League and they're playing him in other 456 00:21:31,480 --> 00:21:32,880 areas. They're not stashing him as 457 00:21:32,880 --> 00:21:34,200 much, but they're also paying him. 458 00:21:34,240 --> 00:21:37,560 You know, the league and the NBA Players Association agreed on a 459 00:21:37,560 --> 00:21:39,800 salary structure for, you know, for first year players. 460 00:21:39,800 --> 00:21:42,160 He's making like 6.7 million this year and it's like that's 461 00:21:42,400 --> 00:21:44,960 that is his job and they either likes it or he doesn't. 462 00:21:45,200 --> 00:21:47,480 But it's like he's going to make you know, 7 million next year 463 00:21:47,480 --> 00:21:50,040 whether they stash him or they don't and it's OK. 464 00:21:50,040 --> 00:21:52,560 And to your point, you make them employees and it's like then you 465 00:21:52,560 --> 00:21:55,640 decide whether you want to be stashed on an Alabama or not, 466 00:21:55,880 --> 00:21:57,480 but you're going to get compensated for it. 467 00:21:57,480 --> 00:21:59,600 Right now it's just this is complete free market. 468 00:22:00,920 --> 00:22:03,240 You had a question you wanted us to hit, so why don't we go to 469 00:22:03,240 --> 00:22:04,760 that one? Do you have the text of it up 470 00:22:04,760 --> 00:22:08,920 there or do I need to find? It if I can have it here in a 471 00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:12,160 SEC. I think let's do, we'll do some 472 00:22:12,160 --> 00:22:15,040 Scott searching for the the question music. 473 00:22:15,040 --> 00:22:16,440 How about that, let's see if we can get some. 474 00:22:17,800 --> 00:22:19,680 There we go, here we go. This was from loop. 475 00:22:20,040 --> 00:22:22,440 There we go, I. Let's just keep this on, 476 00:22:22,440 --> 00:22:23,200 actually. Yeah, go ahead. 477 00:22:23,200 --> 00:22:25,520 This is great. Can you explain to the younger 478 00:22:25,520 --> 00:22:28,840 audience that Bob Hite was Dan Hurley before Dan Hurley was Dan 479 00:22:28,840 --> 00:22:30,320 Hurley? I thought different eras, 480 00:22:30,320 --> 00:22:31,720 different rules, but same results. 481 00:22:32,600 --> 00:22:35,600 So you know what? I think where this comes from is 482 00:22:35,600 --> 00:22:38,480 what you saw. My version of where I think 483 00:22:38,480 --> 00:22:40,720 where this comes from is what you saw with UConn the other 484 00:22:40,720 --> 00:22:43,880 night playing Purdue was their offense was just terrific. 485 00:22:43,880 --> 00:22:46,440 I mean, to the point that almost looks like, you know, you're 486 00:22:46,440 --> 00:22:49,960 running a new style of offense. And I I I do think there are 487 00:22:49,960 --> 00:22:55,480 some pieces there where Uconn's offense is so crisp, so clean 488 00:22:55,640 --> 00:22:58,160 compared to every other buddy. Everybody else seeing college 489 00:22:58,160 --> 00:23:02,200 basketball, there are some Knight corollaries there. 490 00:23:02,920 --> 00:23:04,760 The thing that I'll say with Knight, as I thought about this 491 00:23:04,760 --> 00:23:06,480 a little bit more, I'm going to take it a bit of a different 492 00:23:06,480 --> 00:23:09,360 angle. But the thing with Knight is 493 00:23:09,360 --> 00:23:13,720 that, you know, basketball was so different before Bob Knight 494 00:23:13,720 --> 00:23:15,640 came in. It's almost Stone Age to not. 495 00:23:15,640 --> 00:23:18,320 It's like, you know, they were playing North Carolina was 496 00:23:18,320 --> 00:23:20,680 playing four corners. They'd get up, you know, 24 to 497 00:23:20,680 --> 00:23:24,000 20 and then just have four dudes go to every corner of the of the 498 00:23:24,080 --> 00:23:27,120 the court and just hold the ball and pass it around. 499 00:23:27,800 --> 00:23:30,360 You know, Knight came in and revolutionized defense, 500 00:23:30,360 --> 00:23:33,400 revolutionized offense, where I took this though and started 501 00:23:33,400 --> 00:23:37,240 thinking and I remember us talking about this a bit during 502 00:23:37,240 --> 00:23:40,360 the, you know, when when Knight passed away last October. 503 00:23:40,440 --> 00:23:44,160 But I really pulled it out here. You know, people looked at Dan 504 00:23:44,160 --> 00:23:45,560 Hurley. It's like, my God, he just won 505 00:23:45,560 --> 00:23:48,760 back-to-back titles and they're, they're on pace to kill it at 506 00:23:48,760 --> 00:23:51,880 UConn. The thing with Hurley is he's 51 507 00:23:51,880 --> 00:23:54,400 years old and he's won two titles. 508 00:23:55,040 --> 00:23:57,360 This is the thing with Knight that, like you talk about a 509 00:23:57,360 --> 00:24:02,000 savant like Knight in 1976, when he won a title with an 510 00:24:02,000 --> 00:24:07,600 undefeated team, was 36 years old. 3535. 511 00:24:07,600 --> 00:24:10,760 But I was doing 1976 -, 40 so. 35 He was. 512 00:24:10,920 --> 00:24:13,520 He was born like November 1st, I think. 513 00:24:13,520 --> 00:24:17,880 Or they're very. 35 When he was 30, he left Army. 514 00:24:17,880 --> 00:24:22,360 I got a couple things here with a record of 102 and 50 when he's 515 00:24:22,360 --> 00:24:25,040 35. Before the season he won a 516 00:24:25,040 --> 00:24:26,840 title. He's 3435. 517 00:24:27,400 --> 00:24:32,160 Here's his record 195 and 70. That's good for 70 through 3% 518 00:24:32,160 --> 00:24:34,920 winning percentage. Kids with the Final Four ACCAT 519 00:24:34,920 --> 00:24:38,800 championship and an elite 8. So if you look at coaches who 520 00:24:38,800 --> 00:24:43,120 have won, you know, a title that young, it doesn't exist. 521 00:24:43,120 --> 00:24:45,480 You know, Wooden was 54 years old. 522 00:24:45,600 --> 00:24:49,280 Coach K was 44 years old. Coach K was 45. 523 00:24:49,280 --> 00:24:51,880 When he won, his second Knight was 40. 524 00:24:52,160 --> 00:24:55,600 When he won 81. When he won two, he was 45 when 525 00:24:55,600 --> 00:25:00,120 he won his third. The only person in his universe 526 00:25:00,520 --> 00:25:03,720 is honestly Billy Donovan. Billy Donovan won his first at 527 00:25:03,720 --> 00:25:07,400 41 and then back-to-back won his second at 42. 528 00:25:07,720 --> 00:25:11,000 But at 42, Knight was basically on the path to getting two like. 529 00:25:11,000 --> 00:25:13,560 So to me, no knock on Dan Hurley. 530 00:25:13,560 --> 00:25:15,520 What Dan Hurley is doing with that team. 531 00:25:15,880 --> 00:25:18,880 There are pieces of that offense that are great to see. 532 00:25:18,880 --> 00:25:21,080 But to me, that's the thing with Knight, that I think it's 533 00:25:21,080 --> 00:25:25,320 forgotten because Knight turned old very quickly. 534 00:25:25,320 --> 00:25:28,320 Like by 8485 he suddenly had a sweater and the Gray hair. 535 00:25:28,320 --> 00:25:30,600 Like he just he looked old. And you and I grew up when it's 536 00:25:30,600 --> 00:25:34,040 just like night was that older figure, like he's so damn young. 537 00:25:34,040 --> 00:25:35,240 When he won his first title, it's. 538 00:25:35,320 --> 00:25:38,880 Unbelievable. It's funny because, and I I may 539 00:25:38,880 --> 00:25:41,880 be wrong, there might be an individual who is younger, but 540 00:25:42,920 --> 00:25:45,880 the other coach who had that ridiculous amount of success 541 00:25:45,880 --> 00:25:51,720 that young is Branch McCracken, who won a title at age 32, went 542 00:25:51,720 --> 00:25:55,920 to war, served in the military for three years, came back 543 00:25:56,000 --> 00:25:58,400 Heather. No, he was. 544 00:25:58,400 --> 00:26:00,600 He was born in 19 O 8. OK, sorry, sorry. 545 00:26:01,320 --> 00:26:03,480 So he was born June 9th, 19 O 8. So. 546 00:26:03,760 --> 00:26:06,240 So he was actually 31. I'm sorry he wasn't 32 when he 547 00:26:06,240 --> 00:26:10,400 won the title so but then what left for the Army had to rebuild 548 00:26:10,400 --> 00:26:12,160 the program essentially from scratch. 549 00:26:12,160 --> 00:26:16,240 Won another title in 1953 when he's only 444 years old. 550 00:26:17,360 --> 00:26:19,480 It is. It is interesting to think about 551 00:26:19,480 --> 00:26:23,560 how unique IU has been placed and having young coaches like 552 00:26:23,560 --> 00:26:27,080 that but and Hurley's a great example, like he's he's younger 553 00:26:27,080 --> 00:26:31,040 than Painter but just barely. You know, I think Brad Stevens 554 00:26:31,040 --> 00:26:35,200 is younger than him, but what's fascinating to me and and where 555 00:26:35,200 --> 00:26:40,360 I think the comps with Hurley tonight are more direct. 556 00:26:41,800 --> 00:26:45,120 A. Hurley is, like, clearly a 557 00:26:45,120 --> 00:26:50,000 maniac and he he talks shit in press conferences. 558 00:26:50,120 --> 00:26:52,840 He yells at officials. He kind of acts in a way that 559 00:26:52,840 --> 00:26:56,600 most coaches don't and like. He gets away with it. 560 00:26:56,840 --> 00:26:59,760 Play during the game, yeah. I mean that was, I just, I mean 561 00:26:59,760 --> 00:27:02,680 you know, an average even Ignite had done that I think especially 562 00:27:02,680 --> 00:27:04,760 in his later year 90. 8 Weedy front page. 563 00:27:05,280 --> 00:27:08,560 Of SI but, but, but the fact that Hurley does it. 564 00:27:08,560 --> 00:27:10,880 I even, I was like, that's actually really endearing that's 565 00:27:10,880 --> 00:27:14,040 that was that was great to see Hurley's ability. 566 00:27:14,480 --> 00:27:18,040 I think, you know the the the the talking and the way he uses 567 00:27:18,040 --> 00:27:20,400 the press and the way that he battles officials, the way he 568 00:27:20,400 --> 00:27:24,120 backed those officials down from from calling a Zach Edie game 569 00:27:24,120 --> 00:27:26,240 named the way they normally call a Zach Edie game. 570 00:27:26,920 --> 00:27:29,600 I mean all of that is very reminiscent of night. 571 00:27:29,600 --> 00:27:30,880 And I'm not the only one who feels that way. 572 00:27:30,880 --> 00:27:33,480 There's a there's some really prominent people who I text back 573 00:27:33,480 --> 00:27:35,720 and forth with who say the same thing. 574 00:27:36,200 --> 00:27:40,480 But the thing that gets me about Hurley is, I mean, it's hard to 575 00:27:40,480 --> 00:27:44,320 lead a basketball revolution at the college level right now. 576 00:27:44,760 --> 00:27:48,600 But his preparation for other teams and his the way that he 577 00:27:48,600 --> 00:27:51,520 gets his staff to work on things, his ability to pick 578 00:27:51,520 --> 00:27:55,240 exactly the right players to fill the spots in his system and 579 00:27:55,240 --> 00:27:58,720 this run that they've been on now for the last two years, it 580 00:27:58,720 --> 00:28:02,000 is all of those things in combination are incredibly 581 00:28:02,000 --> 00:28:05,840 reminiscent to me of what Bob Knight did here from like 1973 582 00:28:05,840 --> 00:28:08,920 to 1976, which should have culminated in two back-to-back 583 00:28:08,920 --> 00:28:11,200 national titles, but obviously didn't because of what happened 584 00:28:11,200 --> 00:28:14,880 in 75 S Yes. I think if you're out there and 585 00:28:14,880 --> 00:28:17,720 you have any sense of IU history or Bob Knight history and you're 586 00:28:17,720 --> 00:28:21,400 like, you know what, that that Dan Hurley really is reminiscent 587 00:28:21,400 --> 00:28:23,760 of Bob Knight. You're you're not off base by 588 00:28:23,760 --> 00:28:25,800 any means. You're you are exactly right. 589 00:28:26,080 --> 00:28:28,120 And I think it's a really fascinating thing to watch. 590 00:28:28,400 --> 00:28:30,320 And it's just a shame that he's at UConn. 591 00:28:30,680 --> 00:28:33,120 I mean, I'm really happy for UConn that they've got him. 592 00:28:33,120 --> 00:28:38,040 But man, it's what What's annoying is that Dan Hurley was 593 00:28:38,040 --> 00:28:41,800 there for the taking for a bunch of programs sitting there at 594 00:28:41,800 --> 00:28:44,320 Rhode Island, and it's like everybody dawdled. 595 00:28:44,600 --> 00:28:46,120 I don't know if he would have gone a whole lot of other 596 00:28:46,120 --> 00:28:47,640 places. He seems to really like the 597 00:28:47,640 --> 00:28:49,080 Northeast. His wife seems to really like 598 00:28:49,080 --> 00:28:51,520 the Northeast. But it it makes you wonder. 599 00:28:51,520 --> 00:28:53,320 You really do scratch your head. And I'm not just talking about 600 00:28:53,320 --> 00:28:54,480 Indiana. I'm talking about a bunch of 601 00:28:54,480 --> 00:28:57,560 other programs. It's like, man, that you're 602 00:28:57,560 --> 00:29:00,920 talking about, you know, much like Indiana hiring night after 603 00:29:00,920 --> 00:29:03,920 Wisconsin missed on him, Notre Dame could have had him. 604 00:29:03,920 --> 00:29:06,440 He wanted night wanted to go to Notre Dame and they they didn't 605 00:29:06,440 --> 00:29:08,840 have a coaching vacancy and Indiana jumped on it. 606 00:29:09,400 --> 00:29:11,600 I mean it. It's one of those sliding doors 607 00:29:11,600 --> 00:29:14,080 moments that doesn't just affect that program, but affects the 608 00:29:14,080 --> 00:29:16,760 entirety of college basketball. And not to get to night, but 609 00:29:16,760 --> 00:29:20,920 where Where we could see the difference is the age thing. 610 00:29:20,920 --> 00:29:24,920 I think affected night in that he had so much success so early 611 00:29:25,200 --> 00:29:28,160 and I still say he had he had Larry Bird on campus after the 612 00:29:28,160 --> 00:29:30,640 76 title team. So there's a world where like if 613 00:29:30,640 --> 00:29:32,800 he gets. That right before it was before 614 00:29:33,600 --> 00:29:35,640 bird. Bird left in 74. 615 00:29:35,640 --> 00:29:37,600 Yeah, so. Yeah, but I mean he he able to 616 00:29:38,440 --> 00:29:40,440 identify that and keep that as a war where he keeps it. 617 00:29:40,440 --> 00:29:43,120 But Knight had so much success. I don't want to go down this 618 00:29:43,120 --> 00:29:47,480 road, but like so much success so early that that, you know, he 619 00:29:47,480 --> 00:29:49,920 gets to a point where he's kind of like, all right, I did it. 620 00:29:49,920 --> 00:29:52,440 What else is there to do? And he kind of gets in this mode 621 00:29:52,440 --> 00:29:54,400 of like I want a title. Like I'm going to go hunt for a 622 00:29:54,400 --> 00:29:56,240 year and I'm being very, very broad. 623 00:29:56,240 --> 00:29:59,440 But it's like Hurley feels like he might be maniac enough to go 624 00:29:59,440 --> 00:30:00,960 like I'm a try and win 5-6 seventies. 625 00:30:01,080 --> 00:30:04,320 Not that Knight wasn't trying, but Knight kind of would do it 626 00:30:04,320 --> 00:30:06,800 and then like put his feet up and it's like can I autopilot to 627 00:30:06,800 --> 00:30:09,120 one more than he couldn't And it't like I'm going to go get 628 00:30:09,120 --> 00:30:11,520 Isaiah Thomas Hall win. He's like, all right let's I'm, 629 00:30:11,800 --> 00:30:13,520 I'm screw this. I'm getting back into it like. 630 00:30:14,080 --> 00:30:16,800 And I think that's part of the savant piece of night where it's 631 00:30:16,800 --> 00:30:20,760 like he knew he was so good he could just activate Voltron and 632 00:30:20,760 --> 00:30:23,000 just do it. But he he there was a part of 633 00:30:23,000 --> 00:30:25,720 night where he would just kind of go fishing for a year. 634 00:30:25,720 --> 00:30:27,600 It felt like. And I'm not sure Hurley's going 635 00:30:27,600 --> 00:30:29,280 to do that. Night. 636 00:30:29,280 --> 00:30:31,480 Two things about that. And then we'll wrap up this 637 00:30:31,480 --> 00:30:34,400 episode a night. But for those who know the 638 00:30:34,400 --> 00:30:37,160 story, Knight famously almost walked away from coaching 639 00:30:37,160 --> 00:30:41,920 entirely in 1981 after that 81 title and went and he almost 640 00:30:41,920 --> 00:30:46,920 became the lead studio analyst for CBS for basketball and CBS. 641 00:30:46,920 --> 00:30:48,520 To the point, the CBS. Checks to the family. 642 00:30:48,560 --> 00:30:50,880 It's like Bill Raffey stole the job thanks to that. 643 00:30:51,680 --> 00:30:54,200 You know, I mean, but. But CBS thought they had him and 644 00:30:54,200 --> 00:30:56,520 the only reason that Knight really came back was because 645 00:30:56,520 --> 00:31:00,000 Landon Turner gets in the accident that summer after the 646 00:31:00,200 --> 00:31:03,360 the the title. And you know. 647 00:31:03,360 --> 00:31:06,120 So that's important to keep in mind is that that mentality. 648 00:31:06,120 --> 00:31:09,280 I mean at that point Knight was was 40, you know about to turn 649 00:31:09,280 --> 00:31:12,040 41. And I think he's looking for AI 650 00:31:12,080 --> 00:31:14,160 know it's just wild. But he's looking at looking for 651 00:31:14,160 --> 00:31:17,400 a second act at that point. His second act ends up being 652 00:31:17,400 --> 00:31:19,960 back here in Indiana. But I've always felt you know 653 00:31:19,960 --> 00:31:23,480 with with the not just the way that Knight like really held 654 00:31:23,480 --> 00:31:24,520 forward. We're going to we're going to 655 00:31:24,520 --> 00:31:26,520 follow the NCAA rules here in Indiana. 656 00:31:26,840 --> 00:31:30,040 Like, yes, some of that was principal, but a lot of that was 657 00:31:30,040 --> 00:31:33,760 Knight to some degree. I think tying one hand behind 658 00:31:33,760 --> 00:31:37,680 his back to see if he could succeed under those guidelines, 659 00:31:37,960 --> 00:31:40,280 you know, and and so many things he refused to do and then 660 00:31:40,280 --> 00:31:42,280 eventually had to kind of go back on like we're not going to 661 00:31:42,280 --> 00:31:44,480 recruit junior college players. Well, hey, he goes and recruits 662 00:31:44,480 --> 00:31:46,960 2 junior college players and they end up winning the title in 663 00:31:46,960 --> 00:31:48,000 87. Yeah. 664 00:31:48,080 --> 00:31:50,720 But a lot of it was also like what you said and you saw this 665 00:31:50,720 --> 00:31:55,080 phase with him in the early 80s after the the 81 title, you saw 666 00:31:55,080 --> 00:31:57,600 this phase in the 90s, which is really what led to his downfall 667 00:31:57,600 --> 00:32:00,480 in terms of on court success. He leave the recruiting to the 668 00:32:00,480 --> 00:32:05,320 assistants and the assistants weren't picking players that fit 669 00:32:05,320 --> 00:32:08,880 his system and his mentality, and he's to blame for that. 670 00:32:08,880 --> 00:32:11,240 I'm not making excuses. I'm just saying like a lot of 671 00:32:11,240 --> 00:32:12,880 that ends up coming back to this idea. 672 00:32:12,880 --> 00:32:17,640 That night was much like Hurley, one of those guys who clearly 673 00:32:17,640 --> 00:32:21,160 like, has made the game easy for himself and can make it easy for 674 00:32:21,160 --> 00:32:23,000 others. You do run the risk with those 675 00:32:23,000 --> 00:32:25,480 types of coaches. After a while it's like, what is 676 00:32:25,480 --> 00:32:28,320 the challenge here? Like what am I really measuring 677 00:32:28,320 --> 00:32:31,000 myself up against, and what else could I be doing the? 678 00:32:32,200 --> 00:32:33,960 Connection to UConn. You saw it the other night where 679 00:32:33,960 --> 00:32:35,800 it's just like, I watch that game. 680 00:32:35,800 --> 00:32:36,760 It's like, how? And I don't. 681 00:32:36,760 --> 00:32:38,800 I don't watch a ton of Big East. I'm like, how the hell did Nukon 682 00:32:38,800 --> 00:32:40,480 lose this year? You're just watching him play. 683 00:32:40,480 --> 00:32:43,040 It's like just watching him through the tournament and again 684 00:32:43,040 --> 00:32:45,040 that keys. Hurley's doing a great job of 685 00:32:45,040 --> 00:32:46,800 getting this team focused at the right time. 686 00:32:46,800 --> 00:32:49,440 But you look at this team and it's like, Jesus, I don't, I 687 00:32:49,440 --> 00:32:50,560 don't know how you beat this team. 688 00:32:50,560 --> 00:32:54,200 Like if you have Edie, who who has his own unique talent, it's 689 00:32:54,200 --> 00:32:55,560 like they just they had a game plan. 690 00:32:55,560 --> 00:32:57,640 They they figure it out and we're watching the game. 691 00:32:57,640 --> 00:32:59,240 And I love my wife. She's like, God, they have a 692 00:32:59,240 --> 00:33:01,720 great game plan for Edie. It's like you're watching this 693 00:33:01,720 --> 00:33:05,440 and it just jumps off the page. How good they are. 694 00:33:05,440 --> 00:33:06,800 Just how crisp and efficient they are. 695 00:33:06,800 --> 00:33:08,360 And you know, I can't believe they ever lose. 696 00:33:09,800 --> 00:33:12,280 Anyway, that'll wrap it up for Part 2 of the Q&A. 697 00:33:12,280 --> 00:33:14,280 We really appreciate you folks joining us. 698 00:33:14,280 --> 00:33:17,400 We'll be back I think with the Part 3 might just be me, but 699 00:33:17,400 --> 00:33:20,040 we'll see how that goes. Anyway, thanks, Scott. 700 00:33:20,080 --> 00:33:21,920 It's always a pleasure to talk to you during the middle of the 701 00:33:21,920 --> 00:33:23,680 day. Thanks to all you folks out 702 00:33:23,680 --> 00:33:25,080 there. Thanks to our friends at the 703 00:33:25,080 --> 00:33:28,040 Back Home Network and Home Field Apparel, our presenting sponsor 704 00:33:28,360 --> 00:33:31,200 back with more podcasting coming up soon for Scott. 705 00:33:31,200 --> 00:33:33,440 I'm Galen. This is Crimson Cast. 706 00:33:33,840 --> 00:33:35,720 We'll catch you folks. On the flip side, bring back the 707 00:33:35,720 --> 00:33:37,320 Bison. That's all everybody.