1 00:00:06,720 --> 00:00:09,920 You're listening to the Back Home Network presented by Home 2 00:00:09,920 --> 00:00:24,200 Field Apparel. Welcome back to Crimson Cast. 3 00:00:24,440 --> 00:00:28,960 It's still the 23rd of January at the date of this recording. 4 00:00:29,640 --> 00:00:31,880 I really appreciate you folks tuning back in. 5 00:00:32,360 --> 00:00:35,040 Dropping multiple episodes on your audience in one day is 6 00:00:35,040 --> 00:00:39,760 sometimes found upon in podcast land, but I have full faith in 7 00:00:39,760 --> 00:00:41,920 you as the audience that you can digest these. 8 00:00:42,160 --> 00:00:44,720 I know you folks meter them out as necessary, and a lot of you 9 00:00:44,720 --> 00:00:47,240 have drives that you have to make from here to there. 10 00:00:47,600 --> 00:00:50,680 And if I do nothing else in my life, if I can give you folks 11 00:00:50,680 --> 00:00:55,320 content that you don't want to turn off, I feel like I'm maybe 12 00:00:55,320 --> 00:00:57,440 contributing something positive to the zeitgeist. 13 00:00:57,440 --> 00:01:00,720 So anyway, we've got Jared Morris, a man with plenty of 14 00:01:00,720 --> 00:01:04,319 zeitgeist, joining us here In just a couple of minutes to talk 15 00:01:04,319 --> 00:01:07,600 about IU basketball. We had a a pretty good, pretty 16 00:01:07,600 --> 00:01:10,480 robust conversation. I thought about a variety of 17 00:01:10,480 --> 00:01:12,680 different things related to this team, to fandom. 18 00:01:13,320 --> 00:01:17,480 Maybe I got two negative at times, maybe I I'm not sure. 19 00:01:17,760 --> 00:01:20,960 I'll let you decide, but I thought it was a really 20 00:01:20,960 --> 00:01:22,840 fascinating convo. So I hope you enjoy it. 21 00:01:22,840 --> 00:01:24,920 Before we get to that, just a reminder folks, we are brought 22 00:01:24,920 --> 00:01:28,480 to you by Home field apparel here at the back Home Network 23 00:01:28,680 --> 00:01:32,520 here Crimson Cast where we are right now and where Jared is 24 00:01:32,520 --> 00:01:34,680 about to join. But also on assembly call which 25 00:01:34,680 --> 00:01:37,440 is where Jared's AT and I occasionally join or Scott 26 00:01:37,440 --> 00:01:42,320 occasionally joins the whole constellation of back home 27 00:01:42,320 --> 00:01:44,800 network podcast is brought to you by home field apparel are 28 00:01:44,800 --> 00:01:50,320 presenting sponsor your place to go for the very best in college 29 00:01:50,600 --> 00:01:52,720 apparel. It's hoodie season. 30 00:01:52,720 --> 00:01:56,480 It's Bomber Jacket season. It's I need to stay warm 31 00:01:56,480 --> 00:01:57,600 somehow. Season. 32 00:01:57,600 --> 00:01:59,040 That's where the crew necks come in. 33 00:02:00,120 --> 00:02:03,160 Just just the the array of things that home field has 34 00:02:03,160 --> 00:02:06,680 available for you to order is really staggering and they keep 35 00:02:06,680 --> 00:02:10,000 adding new things all the time. You can use the code Home 23, 36 00:02:10,199 --> 00:02:15,600 get 15% off your first order and subscribe to their mailing list 37 00:02:15,840 --> 00:02:20,120 you You'll get early access to understanding when things are 38 00:02:20,120 --> 00:02:21,800 popping up. You and what I mean by that is 39 00:02:21,800 --> 00:02:24,760 it'll get emailed directly to you don't have to rely on me 40 00:02:26,960 --> 00:02:29,440 telling you on the podcast. You don't have to rely on Jared. 41 00:02:29,440 --> 00:02:34,240 Whatever we will tell you specifically, you know when we 42 00:02:34,240 --> 00:02:37,800 are able to podcast to you. Home field's emails will tell 43 00:02:37,800 --> 00:02:41,200 you right when it's happening. And I've seen so many great 44 00:02:41,200 --> 00:02:44,200 things dropped on home field emails that I've gotten in on. 45 00:02:44,200 --> 00:02:46,520 And then they they'll sell out because they're very popular. 46 00:02:46,520 --> 00:02:50,160 So go check out all of the social media for home field. 47 00:02:50,160 --> 00:02:52,000 Make sure that when you order, you know you're going to get 48 00:02:52,000 --> 00:02:55,360 signed up for for their emails. They'll keep you posted on the 49 00:02:55,360 --> 00:02:58,080 stuff that they're doing. And I got to tell you, folks, 50 00:02:58,080 --> 00:03:01,400 like, we're getting closer to March, much like the start of 51 00:03:01,400 --> 00:03:04,120 the college football season. Like this is like one of the two 52 00:03:04,120 --> 00:03:05,640 times where home field really shines. 53 00:03:05,640 --> 00:03:07,800 New stuff comes out. They adapt in the moment. 54 00:03:08,040 --> 00:03:09,360 You know, I like to remind everybody. 55 00:03:09,360 --> 00:03:13,040 Like, you know, they got that Saint Peter's Strut of Destiny 56 00:03:13,040 --> 00:03:15,560 T-shirt to commemorate, you know, yet another Purdue failure 57 00:03:15,560 --> 00:03:18,880 in the NCAA tournament. They got that out real fast the 58 00:03:18,880 --> 00:03:20,720 next year. They got that Fairly Dickinson 59 00:03:20,720 --> 00:03:23,680 T-shirt out really fast. This is a company where you want 60 00:03:23,680 --> 00:03:26,920 to be poised to strike the moment they drop something 61 00:03:27,040 --> 00:03:30,280 rather than hoping that you hear about it at some point. 62 00:03:30,560 --> 00:03:33,800 Like you know some some guy like me on a podcast saying hey you 63 00:03:33,800 --> 00:03:35,000 might want to check out home field apparel. 64 00:03:35,200 --> 00:03:37,280 Don't rely on us for like breaking news. 65 00:03:37,280 --> 00:03:40,680 Use the emails for that get get on the newsletter follow them on 66 00:03:40,680 --> 00:03:42,880 social media. Anyway Home field apparel 67 00:03:43,280 --> 00:03:45,120 presenting sponsor of the back home network. 68 00:03:45,120 --> 00:03:47,360 Please go check them out. Also quick reminder, we're on 69 00:03:47,360 --> 00:03:49,280 sub stack. Please subscribe to the sub 70 00:03:49,280 --> 00:03:51,080 stack Crimson cast at substack.com. 71 00:03:51,080 --> 00:03:53,920 It's free. You'll get emails with all of 72 00:03:53,920 --> 00:03:56,960 our podcast delivered right to your door or your e-mail. 73 00:03:56,960 --> 00:03:58,680 Maybe your maybe your door is in your e-mail. 74 00:03:58,680 --> 00:04:02,360 I'm not 100% certain how your house is set up, but try to get 75 00:04:02,360 --> 00:04:05,800 that those links out to you directly so you don't have to 76 00:04:05,800 --> 00:04:09,560 worry about going on social media to find them. 77 00:04:10,240 --> 00:04:12,960 We also put additional things in the e-mail, sometimes links to 78 00:04:12,960 --> 00:04:15,560 articles, stuff like that. We also have AVIP section for 79 00:04:15,560 --> 00:04:17,600 those of you who want to financially support the podcast 80 00:04:17,800 --> 00:04:19,200 that's available for you as well. 81 00:04:19,279 --> 00:04:23,440 Anyway, we're going to go and bring Jared on now from Assembly 82 00:04:23,440 --> 00:04:25,560 call. As I said, we talked about a lot 83 00:04:25,560 --> 00:04:28,000 regarding IU basketball, pretty good conversation. 84 00:04:28,000 --> 00:04:29,600 I think you'll enjoy it. Let's get to it. 85 00:04:31,560 --> 00:04:36,080 And in back home network crossover episode land, I'm not 86 00:04:36,080 --> 00:04:40,680 sure if if your homicide life on the street and I'm law and order 87 00:04:40,680 --> 00:04:43,960 or actually I think Crimson Cast is probably homicide and 88 00:04:43,960 --> 00:04:46,600 Assembly call is probably law and order I'm guessing. 89 00:04:46,600 --> 00:04:48,000 Would that, would you agree with that? 90 00:04:49,520 --> 00:04:51,280 It is any show that harbors Ryan Phillips. 91 00:04:51,280 --> 00:04:52,800 Should it be considered law and order? 92 00:04:52,800 --> 00:04:53,760 I don't. Know that's a fair. 93 00:04:53,920 --> 00:04:56,480 Well, I figured it was like, it's one of those weird spin 94 00:04:56,480 --> 00:05:00,760 offs of law and order like, you know, like SUV, Temecula or 95 00:05:00,760 --> 00:05:04,200 something like that. So yes, let's just go with that. 96 00:05:04,200 --> 00:05:07,000 It's probably good. Anyway, Jared Morris from the 97 00:05:07,000 --> 00:05:09,760 Assembly call joining us on the show. 98 00:05:09,760 --> 00:05:12,720 Good to talk to you my friend, as we are midweek. 99 00:05:12,720 --> 00:05:15,640 There's nothing going on with IU basketball, at least on the 100 00:05:15,640 --> 00:05:17,720 men's side as they don't play till Saturday. 101 00:05:18,280 --> 00:05:20,320 So we thought we would get together and talk a little bit. 102 00:05:20,920 --> 00:05:22,400 First of all, welcome. Good to have you here. 103 00:05:23,040 --> 00:05:24,600 Thank you. It's actually, it's perfect 104 00:05:24,600 --> 00:05:26,680 timing. You know, it's not right after a 105 00:05:26,680 --> 00:05:29,560 disappointing loss where the emotions are running high. 106 00:05:29,840 --> 00:05:33,560 It's not right before a tough game where the anxiety is 107 00:05:33,560 --> 00:05:36,200 running high. It's like we've got this week to 108 00:05:36,200 --> 00:05:38,760 kind of relax, kind of take things in. 109 00:05:39,200 --> 00:05:41,640 And it's interesting like I, you know, I've been just, you know, 110 00:05:41,640 --> 00:05:44,720 kind of looking at numbers and different stuff and I really, 111 00:05:44,720 --> 00:05:47,440 you know, find myself just kind of going back and forth between, 112 00:05:48,000 --> 00:05:50,120 oh, well, that's kind of better than I thought it was. 113 00:05:50,120 --> 00:05:52,360 Oh, well, that's kind of worse so that, you know. 114 00:05:52,360 --> 00:05:56,000 And so it's just, it's just a really, it's a really weird 115 00:05:56,000 --> 00:05:59,760 season, a strange one to contextualize and just try to 116 00:05:59,760 --> 00:06:04,440 figure out how to feel about. So looking forward to exploring 117 00:06:04,440 --> 00:06:05,840 that with you here. I can't wait. 118 00:06:05,880 --> 00:06:09,480 You know, these podcasts are essentially just psychotherapy 119 00:06:09,480 --> 00:06:12,520 for ourselves and we just let you folks in on the sessions. 120 00:06:12,520 --> 00:06:14,840 It's delightful. There's actually a a mental 121 00:06:14,840 --> 00:06:18,400 health professional off camera in both of our homes. 122 00:06:18,400 --> 00:06:21,000 Just got a coaching both of us through this conversation. 123 00:06:21,000 --> 00:06:23,560 So yeah, I know it's interesting. 124 00:06:23,880 --> 00:06:26,960 If you haven't listened yet folks, check out the podcast 125 00:06:26,960 --> 00:06:29,760 that I did with Zach Osterman from the Indy Star 'cause we 126 00:06:29,760 --> 00:06:32,720 kind of delve I think into similar territory to what we're 127 00:06:32,720 --> 00:06:34,640 going to be talking about here, at least to some degree. 128 00:06:34,640 --> 00:06:39,680 But here we have Indiana Basketball, 12 and 7, four and 129 00:06:39,680 --> 00:06:42,880 four in conference. On the one hand, you've got a 130 00:06:42,880 --> 00:06:45,960 program that we all said, hey, that's probably going to be a 131 00:06:45,960 --> 00:06:48,440 bit of a rebuilding year. It's probably not going to go 132 00:06:48,440 --> 00:06:50,160 that smoothly. There's going to be some growing 133 00:06:50,160 --> 00:06:52,880 pains. And I think there might be a 134 00:06:52,880 --> 00:06:56,680 perception externally like why are you people so upset? 135 00:06:56,680 --> 00:06:58,520 Why? Why is there so you know such 136 00:06:58,680 --> 00:07:01,680 angst around the way Indiana basketball has been playing and 137 00:07:01,680 --> 00:07:05,560 and certainly angst is our stock and trade. 138 00:07:05,560 --> 00:07:08,920 It feels like from an IU fan base perspective, that's been 139 00:07:08,920 --> 00:07:10,720 the the modus operandi here for a while. 140 00:07:10,720 --> 00:07:13,880 However, the flip side of it is this is an Indiana team that has 141 00:07:13,880 --> 00:07:17,080 not looked good essentially the whole season. 142 00:07:17,480 --> 00:07:22,400 They have one win of questionable quality, and that 143 00:07:22,400 --> 00:07:25,520 is a home win against an Ohio State team that looks like it 144 00:07:25,520 --> 00:07:29,360 has stepped through a trap door on its own season. 145 00:07:30,040 --> 00:07:33,240 They've been run off the floor by superior competition now in 146 00:07:33,240 --> 00:07:36,000 multiple games throughout the course of the season, and while 147 00:07:36,000 --> 00:07:38,200 there have been individual improvements with certain 148 00:07:38,200 --> 00:07:40,240 players, Mackenzie and Bako's played better. 149 00:07:40,240 --> 00:07:43,240 Certainly, you know, Khalil Ware has certainly rounded into a 150 00:07:43,240 --> 00:07:45,720 good player. It just the whole thing feels 151 00:07:46,080 --> 00:07:50,080 both unsatisfying and foreboding, I think to a lot of 152 00:07:50,080 --> 00:07:53,040 IU fans. How off or on am I with those 153 00:07:53,040 --> 00:07:56,200 statements, Jared and and you know, how do you analyze it as 154 00:07:56,200 --> 00:07:58,600 you're looking at things here basically 2/3 of the way through 155 00:07:58,600 --> 00:08:02,360 the season? I mean, yeah, I I think that 156 00:08:02,360 --> 00:08:04,960 describes it very well. Like we all knew it was going to 157 00:08:04,960 --> 00:08:08,960 be a much rougher season obviously than the last couple. 158 00:08:08,960 --> 00:08:11,320 I mean, you're trying to replace Trace Jackson Davis and Jalen 159 00:08:11,320 --> 00:08:14,160 Hutchefino, not to mention experienced guys like Race 160 00:08:14,160 --> 00:08:16,880 Thompson and Miller Cobb. And so I think everybody 161 00:08:16,880 --> 00:08:19,880 understood that certainly in the beginning this was not going to 162 00:08:19,880 --> 00:08:22,920 look much like what it did the last couple of years in terms of 163 00:08:22,920 --> 00:08:24,920 cohesion and just play on the court. 164 00:08:25,520 --> 00:08:27,320 That is exactly what we have seen. 165 00:08:27,320 --> 00:08:31,200 And I think if you told anybody that you know through however 166 00:08:31,200 --> 00:08:33,720 many games Indiana's played, 19 games, that you would get this 167 00:08:33,720 --> 00:08:37,520 level of production from Xavier Johnson, who everybody 168 00:08:37,720 --> 00:08:39,919 pinpointed as the most important player on the roster in the 169 00:08:39,919 --> 00:08:42,440 offseason. People would have been even more 170 00:08:42,440 --> 00:08:44,720 fearful of what this season would look like. 171 00:08:45,080 --> 00:08:47,000 You know, and I think some of those fears were baked into the 172 00:08:47,000 --> 00:08:50,440 preseason, you know, predictions, you know, both the, 173 00:08:51,760 --> 00:08:54,640 you know, just the analyst ones, the subjective ones and the and 174 00:08:54,640 --> 00:08:56,840 the objective ones like Ken Palm, which had Indiana down at 175 00:08:56,840 --> 00:08:58,400 50. So all of that stuff is baked 176 00:08:58,400 --> 00:09:01,600 in, I think, you know. And so I think it's fair when 177 00:09:01,600 --> 00:09:04,920 people say, well, you know, you should have expected that this 178 00:09:04,920 --> 00:09:06,720 wasn't going to be that great of a season. 179 00:09:06,720 --> 00:09:08,440 There's still 12 and seven. Like, I get all of that. 180 00:09:09,200 --> 00:09:11,760 I think what the problem is, I mean, I think there's a couple 181 00:09:11,760 --> 00:09:14,200 problems. You know, one is obviously some 182 00:09:14,200 --> 00:09:16,720 of the stuff that people see with the flagrant fowls and the 183 00:09:16,720 --> 00:09:19,840 lack of composure and kind of the seeming lack of 184 00:09:19,840 --> 00:09:22,400 accountability and maybe discipline within the program, 185 00:09:22,720 --> 00:09:25,000 which is very hard to judge from the outside. 186 00:09:25,040 --> 00:09:27,120 I mean, all we see is the 40 minutes on the court. 187 00:09:27,120 --> 00:09:29,880 And so you see some of that stuff and it's like, Oh my God, 188 00:09:29,880 --> 00:09:32,200 like what is going on with this program right now? 189 00:09:32,720 --> 00:09:35,680 And in the absence of, you know, being at practice and seeing 190 00:09:35,680 --> 00:09:39,080 what kind of accountability is there, you combine that with the 191 00:09:39,080 --> 00:09:42,240 results and it's like what kind of foundation is being built. 192 00:09:42,720 --> 00:09:46,600 And I think again, without the concrete information, people's 193 00:09:46,600 --> 00:09:50,520 minds kind of rushed to the worst possible place to me when 194 00:09:50,520 --> 00:09:53,200 I've really tried to uncover like what is, what is my issue 195 00:09:53,200 --> 00:09:58,480 with this team when I watch it, You know, it is the results and 196 00:09:58,480 --> 00:09:59,640 all of that. There's no question. 197 00:09:59,640 --> 00:10:02,400 I mean those I think could and should be better just based on 198 00:10:02,400 --> 00:10:04,960 the talent that we have. But I think what's really 199 00:10:04,960 --> 00:10:09,360 happening is that a lot of the red flags that some people kind 200 00:10:09,360 --> 00:10:12,120 of saw the first couple years when it came to style of play. 201 00:10:12,560 --> 00:10:14,960 You know the way that Coach Woodson wants to run defense, 202 00:10:14,960 --> 00:10:18,840 the way that he wants to run offense, how that in many ways 203 00:10:19,200 --> 00:10:22,120 contrasts with what we see in modern basketball. 204 00:10:23,080 --> 00:10:25,160 There were questions about this the first two seasons. 205 00:10:25,160 --> 00:10:28,600 But because Trace was so good, because Jalen was such an 206 00:10:28,600 --> 00:10:31,160 anomaly in how he was offensively, where he was more 207 00:10:31,160 --> 00:10:34,760 comfortable in the inefficient spots than other players are, it 208 00:10:34,760 --> 00:10:38,080 covered up some of those things. And so I get frustrated, you 209 00:10:38,080 --> 00:10:40,520 know, where my frustration really kind of bubbled over some 210 00:10:40,520 --> 00:10:43,760 during the Wisconsin game is OK. You see this roster that's 211 00:10:43,760 --> 00:10:46,480 incomplete, that just doesn't have the right pieces to compete 212 00:10:46,480 --> 00:10:47,920 with good teams. That's fair. 213 00:10:47,920 --> 00:10:50,920 Like we almost surely weren't going in there and beating this 214 00:10:50,920 --> 00:10:53,080 Wisconsin team with this Indiana roster. 215 00:10:53,920 --> 00:10:57,240 But it felt watching the game to me, like you had players that 216 00:10:57,240 --> 00:11:00,400 were really trying, but it's almost like they were playing 217 00:11:00,400 --> 00:11:02,880 with their hands tied behind their back because the strategic 218 00:11:02,880 --> 00:11:06,280 choices we were making were not putting us in an advantageous 219 00:11:06,280 --> 00:11:07,800 position. Whether it came to shot 220 00:11:07,800 --> 00:11:10,360 selection, whether it came to the shots that we were willing 221 00:11:10,360 --> 00:11:13,240 to give up to Wisconsin. And you see this in some of the 222 00:11:13,240 --> 00:11:14,760 numbers. You know, like you know some of 223 00:11:14,760 --> 00:11:16,800 the shooting numbers that that we were talking about right 224 00:11:16,800 --> 00:11:19,800 before we went live. You know, Indiana's very low 225 00:11:19,800 --> 00:11:22,960 nationally in three-point and rim rate, which means we take a 226 00:11:22,960 --> 00:11:25,320 lot of shots in the mid range that don't lead to efficient 227 00:11:25,320 --> 00:11:28,600 offense. Defensively, what we prioritize 228 00:11:28,600 --> 00:11:33,760 right now allows teams to take a lot of threes and so these 229 00:11:33,760 --> 00:11:36,480 things start to add up and I don't think it's just angst 230 00:11:36,480 --> 00:11:39,240 about what is happening on the court with this team this 231 00:11:39,240 --> 00:11:41,560 season. It's what does the foundation 232 00:11:41,560 --> 00:11:43,960 look like moving forward? And even if, if Mike Woodson is 233 00:11:43,960 --> 00:11:46,240 able to recruit better in the offseason, get a more complete 234 00:11:46,240 --> 00:11:50,160 roster, are there still strategic and philosophical 235 00:11:50,160 --> 00:11:52,680 choices we're making that are going to make it hard to 236 00:11:52,680 --> 00:11:55,480 maximize that? And so I think a lot of that 237 00:11:55,480 --> 00:11:58,480 angst is not, it's not quite as much about this season. 238 00:11:58,480 --> 00:12:02,400 It's about, man, what is the ceiling of this right now? 239 00:12:02,600 --> 00:12:06,000 And so I think those two things combined, you know, are kind of 240 00:12:06,000 --> 00:12:08,280 leading to some of this, certainly, you know, at least in 241 00:12:08,280 --> 00:12:09,680 my mind. And maybe that's just, you know, 242 00:12:09,680 --> 00:12:12,520 because I've had my head buried so deep in numbers and trying to 243 00:12:12,520 --> 00:12:14,080 understand this and figure it out. 244 00:12:16,320 --> 00:12:20,320 But it is, you know, kind of hard to to to process a little 245 00:12:20,320 --> 00:12:22,480 bit in some ways. Now it's it's interesting 246 00:12:22,480 --> 00:12:25,560 because I don't know how. I don't know if the fan base in 247 00:12:25,560 --> 00:12:28,800 general is thinking about things quite as deeply as you are. 248 00:12:29,800 --> 00:12:32,680 They may be I I I don't want to sell our fans short. 249 00:12:32,680 --> 00:12:35,520 I'm sure many of them have had thoughts you know in some way 250 00:12:35,520 --> 00:12:37,960 shape or form similar to that. I I think they're. 251 00:12:38,240 --> 00:12:41,440 Some of those things are more intuitive to the like to to IU 252 00:12:41,440 --> 00:12:43,320 fans. They don't necessarily need to 253 00:12:43,320 --> 00:12:46,440 see it in the numbers, they just they don't need to go to shot 254 00:12:46,440 --> 00:12:49,160 quality and see like what where we ranked in shots. 255 00:12:49,160 --> 00:12:52,120 They could just I would advise. I would advise people not go to 256 00:12:52,120 --> 00:12:54,880 shot quality to see. No. 257 00:12:55,560 --> 00:12:59,440 I will say I mean without, without, without it being more 258 00:12:59,440 --> 00:13:02,360 programmatic and more just kind of a qualitative like, here's 259 00:13:02,360 --> 00:13:04,120 what I'm seeing when I watch this team. 260 00:13:04,760 --> 00:13:07,160 It's just an unattractive style of basketball. 261 00:13:07,160 --> 00:13:10,760 On the offensive end. It's despite being faster than 262 00:13:10,760 --> 00:13:13,080 people think that they're playing, they don't play with a 263 00:13:13,080 --> 00:13:17,080 lot of fluidity. Everything seems very overly 264 00:13:17,080 --> 00:13:22,880 rigid and certainly there are players that thrive offensively 265 00:13:23,280 --> 00:13:26,560 in terms of pure numbers, Malik renews numbers look very good. 266 00:13:26,560 --> 00:13:28,120 Khalil Ware's numbers look very good. 267 00:13:28,120 --> 00:13:29,720 Mackenzie and Baca's numbers are getting better. 268 00:13:30,000 --> 00:13:35,520 But even last year, I would argue, and the year before with 269 00:13:35,520 --> 00:13:38,280 Trace, Jackson, Davis and and with some of the other personnel 270 00:13:38,280 --> 00:13:42,040 that made-up that, those rosters, the offense under Mike 271 00:13:42,040 --> 00:13:44,760 Woodson has never looked particularly attractive. 272 00:13:44,760 --> 00:13:47,720 Now that's not a prerequisite. And you know, we often bring up 273 00:13:47,720 --> 00:13:50,120 like Virginia, which got talked about in the podcast with 274 00:13:50,120 --> 00:13:52,720 Osterman. Like, do you trade a lack of 275 00:13:52,720 --> 00:13:56,440 aesthetic quality for the ability to win a lot of games? 276 00:13:56,640 --> 00:13:59,800 The problem with IU is they don't have an aesthetically 277 00:13:59,800 --> 00:14:04,000 pleasing team offensively and they're not winning big games. 278 00:14:04,000 --> 00:14:08,080 They're not dictating things. I do think, you know, from my 279 00:14:08,080 --> 00:14:13,320 perspective, I I try to think about, OK, how mad am I about 280 00:14:13,320 --> 00:14:17,000 the way that things are going this year versus how concerned 281 00:14:17,000 --> 00:14:19,720 am I overarchingly about the program and and do I? 282 00:14:19,920 --> 00:14:20,920 Am I? Am I? 283 00:14:20,920 --> 00:14:23,440 Is it a problem if I'm conflating those two things? 284 00:14:23,440 --> 00:14:27,320 And I think for me, this year, the problem with this team is 285 00:14:27,320 --> 00:14:31,160 that there just doesn't appear to be a plan in terms of like 286 00:14:31,160 --> 00:14:33,280 what the players think they're supposed to do as far as the 287 00:14:33,280 --> 00:14:39,800 core system of IU and the way. And somebody might push back and 288 00:14:39,800 --> 00:14:41,760 say, well, no, they clearly have a plan, but they're not adapting 289 00:14:41,760 --> 00:14:45,320 out of it particularly well. Either way, that's not a plan. 290 00:14:45,320 --> 00:14:47,960 To me, if the plan is going to get abused consistently by 291 00:14:47,960 --> 00:14:52,080 better opponents that that seems more like a scheme rather than a 292 00:14:52,080 --> 00:14:56,880 plan, that's a concern. But the to me, the bigger issue 293 00:14:56,880 --> 00:14:59,840 this year, and this is where it spills over for me into future 294 00:14:59,840 --> 00:15:03,800 years, is that there's a good amount of talent on the roster. 295 00:15:03,800 --> 00:15:07,840 It may not be talent in the spots you necessarily would 296 00:15:07,840 --> 00:15:11,800 prefer it to be in, and you've had an injury issue with Xavier 297 00:15:11,800 --> 00:15:14,440 Johnson. But what's concerning is that if 298 00:15:14,440 --> 00:15:18,120 you look across the roster, you got a player like Malik, Malik, 299 00:15:18,120 --> 00:15:20,200 Renew, who's gotten better from last year. 300 00:15:21,960 --> 00:15:24,440 Who are the other players that came back from last year? 301 00:15:24,480 --> 00:15:27,440 Trey Galloway looks like he's taking a step backwards. 302 00:15:27,440 --> 00:15:31,200 In some ways he's been about as good, if not slightly better 303 00:15:31,200 --> 00:15:34,400 than others. But he he's clearly not able to 304 00:15:34,400 --> 00:15:38,480 to contribute offensively at the same degree because he's trying 305 00:15:38,480 --> 00:15:41,640 to do too many things. You recruited Caleb Banks who 306 00:15:41,640 --> 00:15:44,400 was a top 100 recruit who can barely get on the floor. 307 00:15:44,880 --> 00:15:47,920 You recruited CJ Gunner. You sustained his recruitment. 308 00:15:47,920 --> 00:15:50,520 Who was, you know, what 120th ranked player? 309 00:15:50,800 --> 00:15:55,120 Who, even when he's not getting, you know, the a flagrant called 310 00:15:55,120 --> 00:15:57,600 on him has really struggled with any kind of continuity or 311 00:15:57,600 --> 00:16:03,120 consistency in his play. And the solution I see a lot of 312 00:16:03,120 --> 00:16:05,280 people floating is, well, they clearly need to go get different 313 00:16:05,280 --> 00:16:07,400 players who can contribute in the system. 314 00:16:09,120 --> 00:16:12,840 That doesn't seem like a long term prospect for growth when 315 00:16:12,840 --> 00:16:15,800 the players that you chose to have in your system haven't 316 00:16:15,800 --> 00:16:19,080 grown into those roles. I don't know what the answer to 317 00:16:19,080 --> 00:16:23,240 that is because ultimately a lot of this era of college 318 00:16:23,240 --> 00:16:26,080 basketball is not just about what scheme are you running? 319 00:16:26,080 --> 00:16:29,440 And you know, what does Mike Woodson want to do on the floor? 320 00:16:29,600 --> 00:16:32,640 But it's about how does your roster construction contribute 321 00:16:32,640 --> 00:16:36,520 to what you're doing? And that seems to be a missing 322 00:16:36,520 --> 00:16:41,160 piece that got masked somewhat last year, but is definitely 323 00:16:41,160 --> 00:16:43,440 yielding itself in spades this year. 324 00:16:43,760 --> 00:16:46,880 How do you have confidence if you're the average IU fan, 325 00:16:46,880 --> 00:16:48,880 seeing what you're seeing? The things are going to 326 00:16:48,880 --> 00:16:52,440 magically get better when you're almost guaranteed to lose one of 327 00:16:52,440 --> 00:16:56,160 your top scorers, you know, to the NBA Draft. 328 00:16:56,160 --> 00:16:57,840 And you could lose more than that. 329 00:16:58,280 --> 00:17:00,720 It just it seems like a very daunting thing to think about as 330 00:17:00,720 --> 00:17:03,080 a fan. You know, I actually think from 331 00:17:03,080 --> 00:17:06,079 a roster perspective, it's easier for me to have optimism 332 00:17:06,079 --> 00:17:09,400 about improving the roster. And I say that because you know 333 00:17:09,400 --> 00:17:12,040 what? I think this offseason, I think 334 00:17:12,040 --> 00:17:14,720 the staff and specifically Woody, who's obviously the one 335 00:17:14,720 --> 00:17:17,599 making the final choices, I think they just made some bets 336 00:17:18,319 --> 00:17:20,760 that at the time made some sense and haven't worked out. 337 00:17:21,240 --> 00:17:24,200 You know, they, you know, originally Xavier Johnson wasn't 338 00:17:24,200 --> 00:17:27,599 supposed to be here and he got that sixth year waiver and they 339 00:17:27,599 --> 00:17:30,000 decided, OK, we're going to roll with Xavier Johnson. 340 00:17:30,160 --> 00:17:32,120 You know, as our point guard this year. 341 00:17:32,760 --> 00:17:36,320 And given what you saw from him at the end of of 2022, and even 342 00:17:36,320 --> 00:17:39,200 what you saw from him in brief spurts last season before he got 343 00:17:39,200 --> 00:17:42,360 hurt like the Xavier game, like the North Carolina game, that 344 00:17:42,360 --> 00:17:44,600 made sense. I certainly can't argue with it 345 00:17:44,600 --> 00:17:46,880 because I was arguing all offseason that Xavier is one of 346 00:17:46,880 --> 00:17:50,160 the best point guards in the Big 10 and so you have a sixth year 347 00:17:50,160 --> 00:17:52,400 guy. It makes some sense to roll with 348 00:17:52,400 --> 00:17:54,040 him. That also means that now you're 349 00:17:54,040 --> 00:17:56,320 not going to be able to go out and get, you know, another 350 00:17:56,320 --> 00:17:58,320 portal guard because those guys are going to want minutes. 351 00:17:58,760 --> 00:18:01,960 They bet on Trey Galloway to be able to be, you know, the 352 00:18:01,960 --> 00:18:05,360 starting two guard to be able to continue flourishing in a higher 353 00:18:05,360 --> 00:18:07,120 usage role than he had last year. 354 00:18:07,680 --> 00:18:09,520 You are right. You know, at times he hasn't 355 00:18:09,520 --> 00:18:14,240 produced like we need him to. I put that blame more on the 356 00:18:14,240 --> 00:18:16,760 roster construction in the role he's being asked to play than 357 00:18:16,760 --> 00:18:19,440 him. I think Trey, I mean of anybody 358 00:18:20,040 --> 00:18:22,440 tries his damnedest every game and a lot of the times when he's 359 00:18:22,440 --> 00:18:26,480 doing stuff that you're like Trey, no, it's because a guy is 360 00:18:26,480 --> 00:18:29,280 being asked to be a go to scorer who isn't comfortable in that 361 00:18:29,280 --> 00:18:31,280 and I don't think he always picks his spots well. 362 00:18:31,560 --> 00:18:33,520 Sometimes he does. You know Kansas, he was great. 363 00:18:33,520 --> 00:18:35,400 He's at other games where he where he has been. 364 00:18:36,280 --> 00:18:38,920 I I think he's a little overexposed for what he's able 365 00:18:38,920 --> 00:18:40,920 to do. Now you've got. 366 00:18:40,920 --> 00:18:41,960 You know you may disagree with that. 367 00:18:41,960 --> 00:18:44,280 Well, here's the one thing. I hear this over and over and I 368 00:18:44,280 --> 00:18:46,720 understand it and and there's a real hesitancy on the part of 369 00:18:46,720 --> 00:18:48,760 anybody to criticize Trey Galloway. 370 00:18:48,760 --> 00:18:52,040 And I get it, but we've been saying that since the first 371 00:18:52,040 --> 00:18:56,200 month of the season, like after a while, it is incumbent upon 372 00:18:56,200 --> 00:18:59,360 you as a leader if you are, if you are overextending yourself 373 00:18:59,400 --> 00:19:03,040 every single game, to dial it back a little bit because it's 374 00:19:03,040 --> 00:19:05,640 causing more problems than it's solving, That would be the only 375 00:19:05,640 --> 00:19:07,000 thing that I would push back on there. 376 00:19:07,880 --> 00:19:11,120 And I do agree and and look and Mike Woodson has been very 377 00:19:11,120 --> 00:19:13,520 clear, he's got to get more from his senior guards, There's no 378 00:19:13,520 --> 00:19:17,200 question. But you know he pushed it and 379 00:19:17,200 --> 00:19:19,640 pushed it against Kansas and we got a vintage performance that 380 00:19:19,640 --> 00:19:22,800 almost gave us the victory, you know, and so you didn't want him 381 00:19:22,800 --> 00:19:25,800 to slow it down that day. But so I just, I have some 382 00:19:25,800 --> 00:19:28,240 sympathy for him because I think he's he's he's in a 383 00:19:28,240 --> 00:19:31,960 disadvantageous spot compared to his skill level and I think he's 384 00:19:31,960 --> 00:19:34,200 trying his best to make it work. It's just not always working. 385 00:19:34,640 --> 00:19:37,880 And so I think the staff made a bet that those guys could be a 386 00:19:37,880 --> 00:19:40,000 backcourt that would be competitive in the Big 10. 387 00:19:40,520 --> 00:19:42,200 It made sense to me in the offseason. 388 00:19:42,200 --> 00:19:43,640 So I'm not going to kill him for it now. 389 00:19:43,960 --> 00:19:46,240 But it hasn't worked out. And ultimately the buck stops 390 00:19:46,240 --> 00:19:47,920 with them. You're going to make a bet like 391 00:19:47,920 --> 00:19:48,960 that. It needs to work out. 392 00:19:48,960 --> 00:19:52,520 You know, they bet that CJ Gunn, I think would be a little bit 393 00:19:52,520 --> 00:19:55,400 more ready to play. And I think at times when CJ has 394 00:19:55,400 --> 00:19:57,600 been allowed to play with three or four other starters on the 395 00:19:57,600 --> 00:20:00,920 court, he's been better. At times when it's been CJ and 396 00:20:00,920 --> 00:20:03,840 four bench guys or three bench guys, he struggled and those 397 00:20:03,840 --> 00:20:06,480 line UPS have struggled. You know, that is again a 398 00:20:06,480 --> 00:20:08,840 strategic philosophical choice that I disagree with. 399 00:20:10,040 --> 00:20:13,760 So I think you know those three guys were so important heading 400 00:20:13,760 --> 00:20:17,880 into the season and you have gotten in, in acts, you've 401 00:20:17,880 --> 00:20:22,920 gotten the worst case scenario in CJ, you've gotten a, you know 402 00:20:22,920 --> 00:20:26,000 based on his kind of where he was recruited in his development 403 00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:27,080 curve. I wouldn't say this is 404 00:20:27,080 --> 00:20:30,000 necessarily an unlikely scenario, but it's certainly not 405 00:20:30,400 --> 00:20:35,000 on the optimistic side. And Trey, I mean, you know, 406 00:20:35,000 --> 00:20:36,720 maybe we overrated what he could do. 407 00:20:36,720 --> 00:20:38,360 He's been less than what you wanted. 408 00:20:38,400 --> 00:20:41,400 And so you know, for for folks who listen to the Ex's and Jo's 409 00:20:41,400 --> 00:20:43,560 podcast, which I will plug every day, very. 410 00:20:43,920 --> 00:20:47,320 Very good show. You know, they talk about, you 411 00:20:47,320 --> 00:20:49,760 know that they have talked about, you know you've got and 412 00:20:49,800 --> 00:20:52,320 everybody knows this, you've got to get more production from your 413 00:20:52,320 --> 00:20:54,640 guards. But the actual empirical 414 00:20:54,640 --> 00:20:57,200 difference in production, like if you just look at, you know, 415 00:20:57,200 --> 00:21:00,680 they like to look at the box plus, minus numbers, it is such 416 00:21:00,680 --> 00:21:03,600 a massive gulf between what what good teams get. 417 00:21:03,960 --> 00:21:06,160 And that is why even though Indiana has an excellent 418 00:21:06,160 --> 00:21:09,040 frontcourt that's been very productive, we've struggled so 419 00:21:09,040 --> 00:21:11,120 much to compete in some of these other games. 420 00:21:11,120 --> 00:21:13,760 And so I think if you go into this offseason and X isn't 421 00:21:13,760 --> 00:21:17,480 there, you've got, you know, you've got the story to tell 422 00:21:17,480 --> 00:21:20,440 about Jalen Hood Shaffino, tons of nil money and minutes. 423 00:21:21,200 --> 00:21:24,520 You should be able to get a good portal guard hopefully who can 424 00:21:24,520 --> 00:21:28,040 come in and make an instant impact, which could have, you 425 00:21:28,040 --> 00:21:31,120 know, which could really change how this thing looks now. 426 00:21:31,120 --> 00:21:34,560 I still think there's all kinds of strategic and philosophical 427 00:21:34,560 --> 00:21:37,960 things that, you know, may put a ceiling on how good that can be. 428 00:21:38,560 --> 00:21:40,640 But I think if you're kind of looking at, you know, kind of 429 00:21:40,640 --> 00:21:43,200 what Ave. is going to lead to the most improvement for this 430 00:21:43,200 --> 00:21:46,880 program moving forward, I think fixing the roster issues is 431 00:21:46,880 --> 00:21:48,440 probably the quickest path there. 432 00:21:48,920 --> 00:21:52,200 And if Mike Woodson can be convinced to maybe pull his 433 00:21:52,200 --> 00:21:56,480 basketball philosophies a little bit more into what is proven to 434 00:21:56,480 --> 00:21:59,680 work more often in college basketball, and now I think 435 00:21:59,680 --> 00:22:01,800 you've got a path to where things can really improve. 436 00:22:02,040 --> 00:22:04,800 The issue right now is we're stuck watching A-Team where both 437 00:22:04,800 --> 00:22:10,760 issues are bad or down and exacerbating each other, and 438 00:22:10,760 --> 00:22:13,280 that makes it very difficult in the moment to see light through 439 00:22:13,280 --> 00:22:16,200 the darkness, not to be overly dramatic. 440 00:22:16,240 --> 00:22:18,000 No, not no. Of course it's like we're in a 441 00:22:18,000 --> 00:22:19,680 Verizon commercial all of a sudden. 442 00:22:20,280 --> 00:22:23,240 But no, it's it. Look, I I hear all of that. 443 00:22:23,240 --> 00:22:28,800 I guess where I get concerned is you had there. 444 00:22:29,000 --> 00:22:30,520 Yes, you made bets. So we've talked. 445 00:22:30,520 --> 00:22:32,440 I've talked about this on on Crimson Cast before. 446 00:22:32,440 --> 00:22:34,600 I think we've talked about it too, like you made bets on 447 00:22:34,600 --> 00:22:38,600 certain players, but you didn't leave yourself any room for 448 00:22:39,000 --> 00:22:43,440 something going wrong. And this has been pointed out by 449 00:22:43,440 --> 00:22:46,040 many people who were more concerned about the guard 450 00:22:46,040 --> 00:22:48,440 situation in the offseason. You just didn't get anybody. 451 00:22:48,440 --> 00:22:54,640 Now, was that a choice or was that people talking to people 452 00:22:54,640 --> 00:22:59,240 who were in the portal or in the recruiting spectrum and saying, 453 00:22:59,240 --> 00:23:02,840 do you really want to go play for Indiana where the guards 454 00:23:02,840 --> 00:23:06,000 underperform and and are put in on efficient situations and are 455 00:23:06,000 --> 00:23:08,040 basically subordinate to the post players. 456 00:23:08,640 --> 00:23:11,240 And we've seen nothing this year that's going to call Matt down. 457 00:23:11,240 --> 00:23:13,040 In fact, if anything it's going to get worse. 458 00:23:13,040 --> 00:23:17,440 So to fix what you're talking about, you don't have any guards 459 00:23:17,440 --> 00:23:19,560 coming in. In the next recruiting class. 460 00:23:19,840 --> 00:23:21,760 You're going to have to go do that in the portal. 461 00:23:22,400 --> 00:23:27,560 What Portal guards of the caliber that would be needed to 462 00:23:27,560 --> 00:23:30,240 have Indiana playing at the level that we think that they 463 00:23:30,240 --> 00:23:33,480 should be playing at are going to say, I really want to go to 464 00:23:33,480 --> 00:23:36,440 IU and play there. I think that's an open question. 465 00:23:36,440 --> 00:23:39,080 Not saying it won't happen, but I think that ultimately you are 466 00:23:39,080 --> 00:23:42,560 looking at a situation now where much much has happened with 467 00:23:42,560 --> 00:23:44,960 Archie Miller. There's this perception that 468 00:23:45,280 --> 00:23:49,000 there's much better places, more modern places, where you can 469 00:23:49,000 --> 00:23:53,000 showcase your game as a guard other than Indiana, that you 470 00:23:53,000 --> 00:23:55,560 could go to. So why go there when you can't 471 00:23:55,560 --> 00:23:56,840 guarantee? And really, you don't have a 472 00:23:56,840 --> 00:23:59,360 whole lot other than Jalen Huchafino, who as well as he 473 00:23:59,360 --> 00:24:02,480 played, he didn't come out of there with great efficiency 474 00:24:02,480 --> 00:24:04,880 statistics. He came out of there essentially 475 00:24:04,880 --> 00:24:07,440 playing second fiddle to a post player. 476 00:24:07,880 --> 00:24:10,440 And yes, he still got drafted. I mean that, but that's a lot of 477 00:24:10,440 --> 00:24:14,480 evidence for the prosecution. If you're going to argue to 478 00:24:14,480 --> 00:24:16,440 somebody that's on the recruiting trail and deciding 479 00:24:16,440 --> 00:24:19,480 whether it's your school or Indiana in your regard, what is 480 00:24:19,480 --> 00:24:21,840 it exactly about going there that you would be interested in 481 00:24:22,040 --> 00:24:24,480 at this point? So I I would make one 482 00:24:24,480 --> 00:24:26,320 distinction. I think it, I think it would be 483 00:24:26,320 --> 00:24:32,120 very, very hard to sell a wing right now on coming to Indiana, 484 00:24:32,520 --> 00:24:34,760 you know, you've got Mike Woodson's infamous comment from 485 00:24:34,760 --> 00:24:36,480 last season. It's not my job to get Miller 486 00:24:36,480 --> 00:24:39,040 cop shots. You know, we've seen guys like 487 00:24:39,040 --> 00:24:42,640 that be an afterthought. I think this staff should have 488 00:24:42,640 --> 00:24:46,760 all the ammunition they need to sell a legit lead guard on why 489 00:24:46,760 --> 00:24:50,480 you would want to come here. You know, I, I, I, I, I think 490 00:24:50,480 --> 00:24:52,720 maybe I look at the Jalen Hoocherfino example a little bit 491 00:24:52,720 --> 00:24:54,560 differently than how you just described it. 492 00:24:55,000 --> 00:24:57,080 I don't think those guys necessarily going to be like, oh 493 00:24:57,080 --> 00:24:59,040 wow, his offensive rating was only 95. 494 00:24:59,040 --> 00:25:02,680 They're going to see this guy was drafted, he was used, the 495 00:25:02,680 --> 00:25:05,400 ball was in his hands and the offense was tailored to his 496 00:25:05,400 --> 00:25:07,720 strengths. That's the story that you tell. 497 00:25:08,080 --> 00:25:11,120 That combined with playing time in nil should put Indiana in a 498 00:25:11,120 --> 00:25:13,240 good position to get a difference maker at that 499 00:25:13,240 --> 00:25:15,800 position. Now you start talking about why 500 00:25:15,800 --> 00:25:17,480 can't we get a guy like Dalton Connect? 501 00:25:17,600 --> 00:25:20,280 Well, now I can list 1000 reasons why that guy may 502 00:25:20,280 --> 00:25:23,280 question why should I come here. On the bright side, you've 503 00:25:23,280 --> 00:25:26,960 already got Liam Mcneely committed who fills some of the 504 00:25:26,960 --> 00:25:28,920 things. You know, theoretically, if he's 505 00:25:28,920 --> 00:25:31,840 as good when he comes in as advertised and he's a freshman, 506 00:25:31,840 --> 00:25:34,560 so you don't want to put too much on him, but you have a guy 507 00:25:34,560 --> 00:25:36,960 there who should be able to do some of those things. 508 00:25:37,440 --> 00:25:40,120 So now the question is, does Trey Galloway come back? 509 00:25:40,640 --> 00:25:42,680 Are you going to pencil him in as you're starting two? 510 00:25:42,680 --> 00:25:45,080 Would he be OK with the 6th man role and you can get another 511 00:25:45,080 --> 00:25:47,960 guy, you know, there's some more question marks there. 512 00:25:48,280 --> 00:25:50,840 I don't think it should be such a big question mark to get the 513 00:25:50,840 --> 00:25:52,800 lead guard who's going to run your offense. 514 00:25:53,240 --> 00:25:55,840 You know, if this staff can recruit like we've seen them 515 00:25:55,840 --> 00:25:58,080 recruit, 'cause I think the story is still very compelling 516 00:25:58,080 --> 00:26:01,520 for that guy, you know, for the next kind of shooter. 517 00:26:01,600 --> 00:26:05,120 And yet, but yet there's no but yet there's nobody lined up 518 00:26:05,120 --> 00:26:07,920 right now to come take that role, Jared. 519 00:26:07,920 --> 00:26:10,840 I mean, that's what concerns me. Well, no. 520 00:26:10,840 --> 00:26:13,280 I think they're banking on getting someone in the portal 521 00:26:13,280 --> 00:26:14,880 who obviously isn't available yet. 522 00:26:15,040 --> 00:26:17,120 You know, we won't know who that guy is going to be. 523 00:26:17,120 --> 00:26:20,480 Like say that Wade Taylor from Texas A&M, right, who I think 524 00:26:20,480 --> 00:26:22,880 has had some issues like say he decides to transfer. 525 00:26:23,280 --> 00:26:26,080 That's the kind of guy Indiana should have a compelling 526 00:26:26,640 --> 00:26:28,880 argument, and I'm not saying him specifically, but a guy like 527 00:26:28,880 --> 00:26:31,600 that, who's proven it, who's older, who you can step in and 528 00:26:31,600 --> 00:26:34,040 give him the ball and say you're going to run the offense, but I 529 00:26:34,040 --> 00:26:36,160 guess he should be able to go after a guy like. 530 00:26:36,160 --> 00:26:38,920 That I'm with you there. I just A, they've had those 531 00:26:38,920 --> 00:26:41,720 types of people on campus and haven't been able to close the 532 00:26:41,720 --> 00:26:44,600 deal. And B, the the fact that there's 533 00:26:44,600 --> 00:26:49,640 no other recruits like you know the top 100 level recruits as 534 00:26:49,640 --> 00:26:53,920 guards that would be in that role that are in the pipeline 535 00:26:53,920 --> 00:26:57,560 right now for Indiana is a real concern from an atmospherics 536 00:26:57,560 --> 00:26:59,760 perspective. Like I, I, yes, they were in 537 00:26:59,760 --> 00:27:02,520 hard on boogie flan that didn't work. 538 00:27:03,640 --> 00:27:07,240 If it was at it like that's a real problem from my perspective 539 00:27:07,240 --> 00:27:11,120 because I just don't the portal can provide you things. 540 00:27:11,120 --> 00:27:13,680 It obviously it got this team, Khalil Ware which is great. 541 00:27:14,120 --> 00:27:17,880 And yes, you've had the trap door open up and Tamar Bates and 542 00:27:17,880 --> 00:27:20,440 Mackenzie and Baco have both fallen through it after 543 00:27:20,440 --> 00:27:22,560 decommitting from other schools before. 544 00:27:22,960 --> 00:27:28,640 But the the lack of you know, even like a general sense of 545 00:27:28,640 --> 00:27:31,120 direction and the oh, we're going to wait for someone who 546 00:27:31,120 --> 00:27:34,000 doesn't actually exist yet because we think we might be 547 00:27:34,000 --> 00:27:36,880 able to talk them into coming here when you're likely going to 548 00:27:36,880 --> 00:27:38,960 be coming out of the season where you didn't make the NCAA 549 00:27:38,960 --> 00:27:41,200 tournament, might not make the NIT tournament. 550 00:27:41,440 --> 00:27:44,480 Are probably going to lose your best offensive player from a 551 00:27:44,480 --> 00:27:46,680 numbers perspective to the NBA draft. 552 00:27:47,520 --> 00:27:50,400 That's a daunting combination of things, Jared. 553 00:27:50,400 --> 00:27:52,080 I mean, from my perspective at least. 554 00:27:52,520 --> 00:27:53,800 It is. It is. 555 00:27:54,040 --> 00:27:58,240 But my counter to that would be we had this staff hasn't had a 556 00:27:58,240 --> 00:28:02,360 chance to go out and recruit an experienced lead guard without 557 00:28:02,360 --> 00:28:05,320 Xavier Johnson. They're kind of taking up all 558 00:28:05,320 --> 00:28:06,960 the minutes. Although they did, they did, 559 00:28:07,280 --> 00:28:10,160 They did recruit Xavier Johnson for that role. 560 00:28:10,440 --> 00:28:12,600 Well, they did. And that, that, that went wrong, 561 00:28:12,720 --> 00:28:15,040 you know. And so I look, I think it's fair 562 00:28:15,040 --> 00:28:19,480 to say, you know, look, you had this guy in your locker room. 563 00:28:19,480 --> 00:28:22,360 You should be able to evaluate him as much as anybody. 564 00:28:22,360 --> 00:28:24,480 And look, maybe he just hasn't come back from the injury like 565 00:28:24,480 --> 00:28:26,040 they thought re injuring himself. 566 00:28:26,040 --> 00:28:27,600 Like there's a lot of things that have happened with X. 567 00:28:27,600 --> 00:28:30,120 And so, you know, I'm not pinning all that on the stack. 568 00:28:30,160 --> 00:28:34,040 Sometimes stuff just goes wrong. Here's my maybe controversial 569 00:28:34,040 --> 00:28:37,200 opinion. I think there's a chance that it 570 00:28:37,200 --> 00:28:41,200 is actually better for this program given what they need 571 00:28:41,200 --> 00:28:43,800 right now that Boogie Flan chose to go to Kentucky. 572 00:28:43,800 --> 00:28:47,640 And I'll tell you why, given how bad this season has been and is 573 00:28:47,640 --> 00:28:50,760 shaping up to be and how much they need to bounce back next 574 00:28:50,760 --> 00:28:52,760 season. I think going into next season 575 00:28:52,760 --> 00:28:55,880 giving the ball to a freshman guard adds a whole lot of risk 576 00:28:55,880 --> 00:28:58,120 and volatility to a program that doesn't need it. 577 00:28:58,480 --> 00:29:00,920 But if they did land boogie fland now you're not going to be 578 00:29:00,920 --> 00:29:04,600 able to go out and be able to sell the minutes and the roll to 579 00:29:04,600 --> 00:29:07,760 a more experienced guy. And what this team clearly needs 580 00:29:07,760 --> 00:29:11,520 under Mike Woodson is a guy who can come in and man that role, 581 00:29:11,520 --> 00:29:13,640 be experienced, hit the ground running from day one. 582 00:29:13,960 --> 00:29:15,880 Now, everything that you said is fair. 583 00:29:15,880 --> 00:29:18,600 They haven't been able to recruit a guy like this yet, but 584 00:29:18,600 --> 00:29:21,320 they haven't really had the opportunity in the offseason 585 00:29:21,320 --> 00:29:25,680 with experienced Portal guards with this role just there for 586 00:29:25,680 --> 00:29:28,000 somebody. And so I I'm not saying it's a 587 00:29:28,000 --> 00:29:32,280 guarantee that it'll happen, but it is to me, if you're looking 588 00:29:32,280 --> 00:29:35,520 for, OK, what's the how do you craft an argument for how this 589 00:29:35,520 --> 00:29:37,760 gets better and not just a little bit better, but a lot 590 00:29:37,760 --> 00:29:40,720 better next season. That's where it has to start. 591 00:29:40,720 --> 00:29:42,840 And I think they've got everything there to make it 592 00:29:42,840 --> 00:29:44,640 happen. They're just going to have to go 593 00:29:44,640 --> 00:29:45,960 close the deal. I don't know. 594 00:29:46,120 --> 00:29:48,720 You may be right. But I guess my my counter to 595 00:29:48,720 --> 00:29:52,520 that would be you could still go get an experienced Portal guard 596 00:29:53,160 --> 00:29:56,280 and have Boogie flanned. That's what they did with Xavier 597 00:29:56,280 --> 00:29:59,280 Johnson and Jalen Hoochieffino. They they they already had the 598 00:29:59,280 --> 00:30:02,440 experienced guy they brought in, the freshman who wasn't supposed 599 00:30:02,440 --> 00:30:04,960 to serve in the role that he eventually had to serve into 600 00:30:05,040 --> 00:30:08,520 thanks to Xavier's injury. But they were. 601 00:30:08,600 --> 00:30:10,040 They were able to pull both those in. 602 00:30:10,040 --> 00:30:14,320 So now it almost feels like they have to get 2 experienced Portal 603 00:30:14,320 --> 00:30:17,720 guards. Because I'm not, you know, at 604 00:30:17,720 --> 00:30:22,200 this point, as much as I admire Gabe, Cups hustle, I, I'm, I'm 605 00:30:22,240 --> 00:30:25,760 very, I'm becoming increasingly concerned about his inability to 606 00:30:25,760 --> 00:30:29,560 contribute offensively. How, how much better does that 607 00:30:29,560 --> 00:30:33,240 get through an entire offseason? Is he really able to grow into a 608 00:30:33,240 --> 00:30:36,040 role where you can just count on him for 20 some minutes a game 609 00:30:36,040 --> 00:30:36,800 next year? I don't. 610 00:30:36,800 --> 00:30:39,440 I don't know if you can. That's. 611 00:30:39,440 --> 00:30:41,680 Well, that's, yeah. You know, but, but this is 612 00:30:41,680 --> 00:30:43,880 Galen. I think this is where, you know, 613 00:30:43,880 --> 00:30:46,000 I know a lot of people, Oh well you know we're probably not 614 00:30:46,000 --> 00:30:47,160 going to make the in state tournament. 615 00:30:47,160 --> 00:30:48,880 So this season is over. I mean I think that's a 616 00:30:48,880 --> 00:30:52,160 ludicrous statement. The season is getting very 617 00:30:52,160 --> 00:30:54,360 nearly close to over for achieving any of the goals that 618 00:30:54,360 --> 00:30:58,120 we had starting the season. No argument there, but I think 619 00:30:58,120 --> 00:31:00,840 watching the development of players like him between now and 620 00:31:00,840 --> 00:31:02,600 the end of the season is so important. 621 00:31:02,880 --> 00:31:05,080 You know, I thought, I thought what we saw in the first half 622 00:31:05,080 --> 00:31:08,000 from Gabe against Wisconsin, scoring 7 points in three 623 00:31:08,000 --> 00:31:11,080 different ways, you know, on a nice little mid range on a catch 624 00:31:11,080 --> 00:31:13,080 and shoot 3 on a drive to the basket. 625 00:31:13,480 --> 00:31:15,920 That was good to see. You know, you don't need him 626 00:31:15,920 --> 00:31:19,480 being a big time scorer, you just need him able to threaten 627 00:31:19,480 --> 00:31:20,840 when the opportunities are there. 628 00:31:21,200 --> 00:31:23,920 So can he develop into that guy now? 629 00:31:24,160 --> 00:31:26,840 I don't think you want to go into next season with him as 630 00:31:26,840 --> 00:31:29,520 your starter. But if he is penciled into the 631 00:31:29,520 --> 00:31:32,000 role that Rob Fennessy had in Michael Woodson's first year, 632 00:31:32,000 --> 00:31:35,080 where he's a defensive oriented guard who can come in and add a 633 00:31:35,080 --> 00:31:39,080 little bit more efficiency, you know, scoring wise and just as a 634 00:31:39,080 --> 00:31:42,160 distributor in your bench unit, that's a really nice piece to 635 00:31:42,160 --> 00:31:44,800 have. But yes, you know what's going 636 00:31:44,800 --> 00:31:47,120 to make the difference on next year's team is who do they go 637 00:31:47,120 --> 00:31:48,760 out and land from a guard perspective? 638 00:31:49,000 --> 00:31:51,360 And maybe the statement I made about Boogie Fland and is being 639 00:31:51,360 --> 00:31:53,280 better off not getting him isn't correct. 640 00:31:53,280 --> 00:31:55,680 Because you're right, they were able to recruit Jalen Hutchafina 641 00:31:55,680 --> 00:31:57,760 when they had X. Maybe they would have been able 642 00:31:57,760 --> 00:32:01,840 to go land another guy in the portal, but the number one thing 643 00:32:01,840 --> 00:32:04,440 they've got to get is a guy who can hit the ground running next 644 00:32:04,440 --> 00:32:06,920 year with the ball in his hands and make this offense make 645 00:32:06,920 --> 00:32:09,240 sense. And Galen, we've seen it now for 646 00:32:09,240 --> 00:32:11,720 three years. I hope there are some changes to 647 00:32:11,720 --> 00:32:15,040 the way that we do things, but the system that we run right now 648 00:32:15,040 --> 00:32:19,520 requires players who can go make individual plays. 649 00:32:19,960 --> 00:32:22,320 Jalen Hood Shaffino could go make individual plays. 650 00:32:22,760 --> 00:32:25,680 You've got to have a guy in that spot who is a difference maker. 651 00:32:25,920 --> 00:32:29,200 That's true on any roster, but it's especially true on our 652 00:32:29,200 --> 00:32:31,320 roster with our chosen style of play. 653 00:32:31,320 --> 00:32:35,720 Well that's that's a a larger concern as well and I do worry 654 00:32:35,920 --> 00:32:37,440 because I. That's my bigger concern. 655 00:32:37,640 --> 00:32:39,880 Well, but I think it fits into the roster construction thing 656 00:32:39,880 --> 00:32:43,400 too, though, because like what you're talking about requires a 657 00:32:43,400 --> 00:32:48,560 very specific and particular type of person who doesn't need 658 00:32:48,880 --> 00:32:54,240 coaching, is frankly around being a professional at the 659 00:32:54,240 --> 00:32:58,040 collegiate level, so to speak. You know, and it feels like to 660 00:32:58,040 --> 00:33:01,280 some degree, this is where someone like CJ Gunn or someone 661 00:33:01,280 --> 00:33:05,320 like Caleb Banks has really struggled a bit because it 662 00:33:05,320 --> 00:33:08,680 almost feels as if those guys are trying to grow into a role 663 00:33:09,040 --> 00:33:10,520 that they don't know how to grow into. 664 00:33:10,800 --> 00:33:14,120 They can't play the right way yet and they haven't really 665 00:33:14,120 --> 00:33:16,800 improved a great deal in terms of their on court. 666 00:33:16,960 --> 00:33:18,880 I mean they have the the occasional moment kind of like 667 00:33:18,880 --> 00:33:22,560 Jordan Geronimo where like Geronimo he could on an on any 668 00:33:22,560 --> 00:33:26,600 random night give you like a really great 14 minutes and that 669 00:33:26,600 --> 00:33:28,320 was it. And he never really learned a 670 00:33:28,320 --> 00:33:30,280 whole lot beyond that and that's still what he's doing at 671 00:33:30,280 --> 00:33:35,680 Maryland to some degree. But you know the fact that we, 672 00:33:35,720 --> 00:33:39,640 we appear to have this focus as a program around, OK, we need 673 00:33:39,640 --> 00:33:44,200 guys who can go do things by themselves in this framework of 674 00:33:44,200 --> 00:33:46,880 an offense and and honestly also defensively. 675 00:33:47,000 --> 00:33:50,120 But you don't have those people. You haven't been able to develop 676 00:33:50,120 --> 00:33:54,480 those people and you're not at the top of the charts in terms 677 00:33:54,480 --> 00:33:57,120 of attractive destinations for people that are going to be in 678 00:33:57,120 --> 00:33:58,640 the portal who can do those things. 679 00:33:58,640 --> 00:34:00,960 There's going to be plenty of people in the Portal, but a lot 680 00:34:00,960 --> 00:34:03,440 of them are going to be people who didn't play a whole lot at 681 00:34:03,440 --> 00:34:06,680 their previous institutions like Anthony Walker or played at a 682 00:34:06,680 --> 00:34:11,159 lower level like Peyton Sparks. That's not a plug and play kind 683 00:34:11,159 --> 00:34:14,960 of situation and and I think as as this season has gone along, I 684 00:34:14,960 --> 00:34:17,159 guess that's where a lot of my concerns have started to 685 00:34:17,159 --> 00:34:19,440 manifest as we get into the longer term things. 686 00:34:19,440 --> 00:34:24,120 It's this idea that OK, last year's team in spite of some 687 00:34:24,120 --> 00:34:28,639 roadblocks and some some speed bumps worked eventually. 688 00:34:28,800 --> 00:34:31,040 It wasn't always the most aesthetically pleasing to watch. 689 00:34:31,360 --> 00:34:33,800 They had a lot of games they had to grind out, but they were able 690 00:34:33,800 --> 00:34:36,960 to grind them out. But that was largely because of 691 00:34:36,960 --> 00:34:40,040 the NBA caliber talent, the experience that they had. 692 00:34:40,280 --> 00:34:43,520 This vintage doesn't really have the experience. 693 00:34:43,520 --> 00:34:46,760 And you know, while it has the NBA talent, it's kind of arrayed 694 00:34:46,760 --> 00:34:50,880 differently. Next year's rosters probably. 695 00:34:51,360 --> 00:34:53,400 I mean, maybe it will be at the same level. 696 00:34:53,600 --> 00:34:56,560 It's hard to see it being like significantly better. 697 00:34:56,560 --> 00:34:59,160 You might, you could, you're going to have Liam Mcneely come 698 00:34:59,160 --> 00:35:00,720 in, but you're going to lose Khalil Ware. 699 00:35:00,720 --> 00:35:03,480 So that kind of that that balances itself out. 700 00:35:03,720 --> 00:35:08,680 I'm just really fascinated to see, like, who are the people 701 00:35:08,680 --> 00:35:11,000 that you're going to get, who you'll be able to actually plug 702 00:35:11,000 --> 00:35:13,600 in and make this run significantly better, which goes 703 00:35:13,600 --> 00:35:16,080 back to something that you've been talking about, which is 704 00:35:16,440 --> 00:35:18,960 there have to be some changes to the approach. 705 00:35:19,720 --> 00:35:22,920 Is that really on, like, is that on the cards? 706 00:35:22,920 --> 00:35:26,360 Is that something where is there enough of a realization that 707 00:35:26,360 --> 00:35:31,280 what's happening is not working, that there would be an 708 00:35:31,280 --> 00:35:33,960 alteration? That is very rare in coaching in 709 00:35:33,960 --> 00:35:37,520 general, not just with Mike Woodson, but with any coach that 710 00:35:37,520 --> 00:35:41,200 they would after a few years and after a lifetime spent doing 711 00:35:41,200 --> 00:35:42,960 this, they'd just suddenly be like, you know what? 712 00:35:43,720 --> 00:35:46,000 The stuff I'm doing just really isn't happening. 713 00:35:46,000 --> 00:35:49,000 I'm going to change it up because I have to that really 714 00:35:49,040 --> 00:35:51,720 like, I'd be very surprised if that's the direction that things 715 00:35:51,720 --> 00:35:53,520 went. I would too. 716 00:35:53,520 --> 00:35:58,160 I think that's unfair to expect. You know, Woody has the 717 00:35:58,160 --> 00:36:01,080 philosophies that he has. A lot of them were built and 718 00:36:01,080 --> 00:36:05,640 developed in the NBA and he still, in a lot of ways coaches 719 00:36:05,640 --> 00:36:08,720 college basketball games like they are NBA games now. 720 00:36:08,720 --> 00:36:10,320 He adjusts as the season goes on. 721 00:36:10,600 --> 00:36:12,280 You know, he shortens his rotation. 722 00:36:12,280 --> 00:36:16,120 He stops doing the line changes, which to me actually makes doing 723 00:36:16,120 --> 00:36:18,400 the line changes earlier in the season make less sense. 724 00:36:18,400 --> 00:36:23,600 But whatever, you know, but he's, you know, this philosophy 725 00:36:23,600 --> 00:36:26,720 is what it is. And so I don't think you're 726 00:36:26,720 --> 00:36:28,200 going to make massive changes there. 727 00:36:28,480 --> 00:36:30,840 But what you can make, I think are tweaks. 728 00:36:31,320 --> 00:36:34,400 I mean, Galen, we are leaving so much offensive efficiency on the 729 00:36:34,400 --> 00:36:37,400 court with our shot selection. It's outrageous. 730 00:36:37,440 --> 00:36:39,960 It really is like it and I think it's probably frustrating. 731 00:36:41,040 --> 00:36:43,840 Give them the numbers, Jared. Give them the numbers, please. 732 00:36:45,200 --> 00:36:47,880 I mean, OK, so this was before the Wisconsin game. 733 00:36:48,320 --> 00:36:51,520 We were in the 98th percentile in the amount of long twos that 734 00:36:51,520 --> 00:36:54,160 we took. OK, these are not like your 735 00:36:54,160 --> 00:36:56,520 little short mid range ones. These are 17 feet to the 736 00:36:56,520 --> 00:36:59,240 three-point line. The long ones, we were in the 737 00:36:59,240 --> 00:37:02,680 98th percentile and we were one of the worst teams in the 738 00:37:02,680 --> 00:37:04,960 country in efficiency. So we were taking them more than 739 00:37:04,960 --> 00:37:07,920 anybody and less efficient than almost anybody. 740 00:37:07,920 --> 00:37:10,520 I think we were averaging like .55 points per possession on the 741 00:37:10,520 --> 00:37:13,760 shots, on those shots. Then we went into the Wisconsin 742 00:37:13,760 --> 00:37:16,040 game and in the first half took six of them and made one. 743 00:37:16,040 --> 00:37:18,240 And I was just ready to throw things in my house. 744 00:37:18,800 --> 00:37:22,520 You know that to me. And you know, again, you know, 745 00:37:22,520 --> 00:37:24,600 Mike Woodson played in a different era. 746 00:37:24,640 --> 00:37:28,360 He was a guy who lived in the mid range, you know, even when 747 00:37:28,360 --> 00:37:30,720 he was coaching, you know, coaching guys like Joe Johnson 748 00:37:30,720 --> 00:37:33,120 and Carmelo Anthony, These are players who were very effective 749 00:37:33,120 --> 00:37:35,080 in that range. And when you have a player who 750 00:37:35,080 --> 00:37:38,640 can make them, that's one thing. You know, you may recall, you 751 00:37:38,640 --> 00:37:42,600 know last year, early in the season we are very frustrated 752 00:37:42,600 --> 00:37:44,600 about this, but as the season went on, it's like, well, you 753 00:37:44,600 --> 00:37:48,560 know you've got a freshman in Jalen that had to take the ball 754 00:37:48,560 --> 00:37:51,120 from Xavier Johnson. It makes sense to tailor your 755 00:37:51,120 --> 00:37:52,800 offense around where he's comfortable. 756 00:37:53,120 --> 00:37:54,440 Those are the shots he's comfortable with. 757 00:37:54,560 --> 00:37:58,400 Fine, if a guy can actually make them, then you give him a little 758 00:37:58,400 --> 00:38:01,520 bit of a longer leash, right? Mackenzie Mbako I think is 759 00:38:01,520 --> 00:38:04,160 averaging .8 points per possession on those long twos. 760 00:38:04,680 --> 00:38:08,200 It's still not that efficient, you know, there's he'd be more 761 00:38:08,200 --> 00:38:11,120 efficient if he would drive or take a step back, theoretically, 762 00:38:11,480 --> 00:38:13,480 but he can at least make them at a decent clip. 763 00:38:13,840 --> 00:38:17,040 But when CJ Gunn is scoring like .4 points per possession on them 764 00:38:17,040 --> 00:38:19,960 and Gabe Cups, is that like .3 points per possession on them? 765 00:38:20,640 --> 00:38:22,600 Maybe those shots don't need to be there. 766 00:38:22,600 --> 00:38:26,760 They're essentially turnovers. You know, basically every two 767 00:38:26,760 --> 00:38:29,440 long twos Indiana takes is a turnover because they're not 768 00:38:29,440 --> 00:38:31,840 getting offensive rebounds and they're missing so many of them. 769 00:38:32,440 --> 00:38:36,320 So that is not something that I think has to be part of this 770 00:38:36,320 --> 00:38:38,040 philosophy of Mike Woodson's offense. 771 00:38:38,040 --> 00:38:41,760 Like, I think, look, he likes to have shooters who space the 772 00:38:41,760 --> 00:38:43,760 floor and are relatively stationary. 773 00:38:43,760 --> 00:38:45,920 I'd love to see more movement from those guys. 774 00:38:46,760 --> 00:38:48,880 You know, like in the Wisconsin game, you know, you saw Max 775 00:38:48,880 --> 00:38:52,120 Klezmet do a great job of relocating and finding openings. 776 00:38:52,120 --> 00:38:54,360 Our guys don't do that as much. Could we start to do that? 777 00:38:54,360 --> 00:38:57,200 Maybe. You know, I don't think, I don't 778 00:38:57,200 --> 00:38:59,600 even think it's fair to ask a guy to come coach your program 779 00:38:59,600 --> 00:39:01,360 and say you need to change everything you do. 780 00:39:01,840 --> 00:39:04,120 If that's what you're going to do, then just fire the guy, 781 00:39:04,120 --> 00:39:05,400 right? And I certainly don't think 782 00:39:05,400 --> 00:39:08,520 we're at that point. But I do think it's fair to ask 783 00:39:08,520 --> 00:39:11,480 a coach to say, OK, you've got this overall philosophical 784 00:39:11,480 --> 00:39:13,520 construct of how you want to play offense and how you want to 785 00:39:13,520 --> 00:39:16,160 play defense. But can you tweak that in 786 00:39:16,160 --> 00:39:19,320 meaningful ways each season to maximize the players that you 787 00:39:19,320 --> 00:39:21,520 have? That is my biggest frustration 788 00:39:21,520 --> 00:39:23,720 this year. I think we have seen, you know, 789 00:39:23,720 --> 00:39:27,240 Indiana teams in past seasons where it look like the players 790 00:39:27,240 --> 00:39:29,280 were a little checked out. It didn't really look like you 791 00:39:29,280 --> 00:39:31,920 had the effort in the fight most nights out. 792 00:39:31,920 --> 00:39:34,560 I don't get that feeling. I get the feeling that the guys 793 00:39:34,560 --> 00:39:37,320 are really trying to do what they're being asked to do. 794 00:39:37,760 --> 00:39:41,200 And in a lot of games what they're being asked to do is 795 00:39:41,200 --> 00:39:43,640 just not really giving them a fighting chance and against some 796 00:39:43,640 --> 00:39:47,280 opponents almost runs counter to what may be kind of like an 797 00:39:47,280 --> 00:39:50,200 objective strategy would be for how you want to play this team. 798 00:39:50,680 --> 00:39:51,880 So that's where I get frustrated. 799 00:39:51,880 --> 00:39:54,720 But I think that, you know, within that is again a ray of 800 00:39:54,720 --> 00:39:58,000 hope where it's like, you know, hey, if you get talented players 801 00:39:58,000 --> 00:40:00,840 in the system, they're going to have freedom to express their 802 00:40:00,840 --> 00:40:03,480 talent and make big plays. And you saw that with Trace, you 803 00:40:03,480 --> 00:40:07,000 saw it with Jalen at times. It could be very good if we 804 00:40:07,000 --> 00:40:10,480 could just make some tweaks. That make it make more sense for 805 00:40:10,480 --> 00:40:12,360 the particular set of guys on the roster. 806 00:40:12,360 --> 00:40:15,400 You know, if we can recognize, hey, these bench line UPS aren't 807 00:40:15,400 --> 00:40:18,960 working, but when you have two bench players paired with three 808 00:40:18,960 --> 00:40:20,520 starters, it actually works pretty well. 809 00:40:20,520 --> 00:40:23,960 Let's stop doing this sooner. All of these things could add up 810 00:40:23,960 --> 00:40:26,680 to meaningful improvements. The problem is we haven't seen 811 00:40:26,680 --> 00:40:30,240 any of them and that's part of or many of them and that's part 812 00:40:30,240 --> 00:40:32,720 of what's led to this season bottoming out. 813 00:40:32,760 --> 00:40:35,000 This is this. Is part of what I meant when I 814 00:40:35,000 --> 00:40:38,680 said earlier it doesn't feel like there's a plan because it 815 00:40:38,680 --> 00:40:41,680 feels like a lot of the poor decisions that get made 816 00:40:41,880 --> 00:40:46,560 offensively and defensively don't happen because of, well, 817 00:40:46,560 --> 00:40:49,760 this is how Indiana was destined to play this possession or this 818 00:40:49,760 --> 00:40:54,040 stretch of possessions. It's just like guys do good 819 00:40:54,040 --> 00:40:56,480 things on some possessions and then they do bad things on other 820 00:40:56,480 --> 00:40:58,520 possessions. There's very little continuity 821 00:40:58,520 --> 00:41:01,760 in in how Indiana is executing what they're doing. 822 00:41:02,240 --> 00:41:08,440 And I guess, you know, my my worry with a lot of this is, you 823 00:41:08,440 --> 00:41:11,720 know, perhaps this is how it's been all along and it just 824 00:41:11,720 --> 00:41:14,640 didn't look as bad last year because you had one of the most 825 00:41:14,640 --> 00:41:17,440 efficient scorers in college basketball covering up a bunch 826 00:41:17,440 --> 00:41:19,320 of sins. I I think this is actually where 827 00:41:19,320 --> 00:41:21,200 it kind of shines to you more on the defensive end. 828 00:41:21,280 --> 00:41:24,360 And you know, it's interesting because we spend so much time 829 00:41:24,360 --> 00:41:28,960 talking about offense, and rightfully so, but the defensive 830 00:41:29,160 --> 00:41:33,600 effort, the defensive intensity, the defensive approach is not 831 00:41:33,600 --> 00:41:36,000 really good for a full 40 minutes. 832 00:41:36,120 --> 00:41:39,160 And I don't know that it has been good for a full 40 minutes 833 00:41:39,160 --> 00:41:43,960 this season. And if that isn't there, then I 834 00:41:44,080 --> 00:41:46,360 that's where I start to worry about what are the broader 835 00:41:46,360 --> 00:41:48,400 cultural issues within the program? 836 00:41:48,400 --> 00:41:52,360 Because I look, I can deal with you being bad offensively. 837 00:41:52,360 --> 00:41:55,560 And we've seen teams that aren't great offensively make the NCAA 838 00:41:55,560 --> 00:41:58,080 tournament because they just are able to grind teams down. 839 00:41:58,080 --> 00:42:01,800 This team really doesn't provide a huge amount of resistance 840 00:42:02,040 --> 00:42:03,880 defensively. It feels like, particularly 841 00:42:03,880 --> 00:42:06,880 against teams that have either a really good system like Purdue 842 00:42:06,880 --> 00:42:11,160 does, or really talented individual players who like 843 00:42:11,160 --> 00:42:14,240 Auburn who are able to take advantage of individual 844 00:42:14,240 --> 00:42:17,280 mismatches. And that's the thing I didn't 845 00:42:17,280 --> 00:42:19,400 think we would have a problem with under Mike Woodson. 846 00:42:19,400 --> 00:42:22,320 Like I thought that would get nailed down very quickly and 847 00:42:22,320 --> 00:42:24,320 it's almost gone the opposite and people will blame the 848 00:42:24,320 --> 00:42:27,400 scheme, but even with the scheme, it just feels like 849 00:42:27,400 --> 00:42:29,880 there's not the urgency on defense. 850 00:42:29,880 --> 00:42:32,840 I mean when you've got Greg Guard of all people saying, God, 851 00:42:32,840 --> 00:42:35,040 Bob Knight would have been disappointed in both teams. 852 00:42:35,280 --> 00:42:37,960 Like first of all, I don't, Greg, I don't need to hear from 853 00:42:37,960 --> 00:42:42,880 you under any circumstances. But if I am of all the things to 854 00:42:42,880 --> 00:42:47,480 say, that is essentially say yeah, you know either team 855 00:42:47,480 --> 00:42:51,400 played hard defensively and and if you've got the opposing coach 856 00:42:51,400 --> 00:42:54,000 saying that about your team, like that's a real problem. 857 00:42:55,360 --> 00:42:58,400 Yeah, you know you are right. I think the defense is the 858 00:42:58,400 --> 00:43:01,120 bigger issue. I think it is easier to 859 00:43:01,160 --> 00:43:03,120 identify. I think it's easier for most 860 00:43:03,120 --> 00:43:04,400 fans. And I I put myself here. 861 00:43:04,400 --> 00:43:06,960 I'm not like Coach Tonsoni. I'm not like Tony Adranya. 862 00:43:07,160 --> 00:43:09,360 I can't watch or play once and tell you what was run. 863 00:43:09,360 --> 00:43:11,560 I got to watch it, you know many times. 864 00:43:11,560 --> 00:43:15,120 And so, you know, for me, I, I get caught up in a lot of things 865 00:43:15,120 --> 00:43:17,680 that regular fans get caught up in, which is like, that was a 866 00:43:17,680 --> 00:43:19,760 bad shot, 'cause I can recognize that, right? 867 00:43:19,760 --> 00:43:23,040 And so I think it's easier to identify when an offensive 868 00:43:23,040 --> 00:43:25,040 possession doesn't quite look right. 869 00:43:25,040 --> 00:43:27,520 And maybe what, you know, some of the issues are defensively, 870 00:43:27,520 --> 00:43:30,840 it's different, you know, because it's so interconnected. 871 00:43:30,840 --> 00:43:33,720 And you really have to understand what's the scattering 872 00:43:33,720 --> 00:43:36,280 report on a particular guy to know if this guy was doing the 873 00:43:36,280 --> 00:43:38,800 right thing, leaving to help all of those things, you know? 874 00:43:38,800 --> 00:43:41,200 So when Mike Woodson came, he talked a lot about defense, and 875 00:43:41,200 --> 00:43:43,240 we saw a very good defense that first season. 876 00:43:43,600 --> 00:43:46,440 You know, Xavier Johnson was still at his peak athletically 877 00:43:46,880 --> 00:43:48,560 and was, I mean, just hounding people. 878 00:43:48,560 --> 00:43:50,880 I mean, do you remember when Xavier Johnson first got here? 879 00:43:51,160 --> 00:43:54,760 He was a breath of fresh air, how he defended, how hard he 880 00:43:54,760 --> 00:43:57,920 played, you know, all those things and he really helped make 881 00:43:57,920 --> 00:44:01,640 that defense work. But then behind him you had guys 882 00:44:01,640 --> 00:44:03,880 who are athletically challenged like Parker Stewart and Miller 883 00:44:03,880 --> 00:44:06,080 Kopp, but who had been around the game for a while. 884 00:44:06,080 --> 00:44:08,600 Parker Stewart's dad as a coach, Miller Kopp, is a very smart 885 00:44:08,600 --> 00:44:11,240 basketball player. They picked it up and and they 886 00:44:11,240 --> 00:44:13,440 really improved offensively as the season went on. 887 00:44:13,840 --> 00:44:16,080 And you had guys like Race Thompson and Trace Jackson 888 00:44:16,080 --> 00:44:18,840 Davis, who had been coached under Archie Miller, who is a 889 00:44:18,840 --> 00:44:21,040 good teacher of defensive principles. 890 00:44:21,480 --> 00:44:24,240 And so you had those guys who I think understood defense. 891 00:44:24,520 --> 00:44:26,680 There are some similarities between the Pack line and what 892 00:44:26,680 --> 00:44:30,200 Indiana is running now. And so I think that worked that 893 00:44:30,200 --> 00:44:31,800 season. Last year you saw a little bit 894 00:44:31,800 --> 00:44:33,480 of slippage. The team was younger. 895 00:44:33,560 --> 00:44:36,320 Xavier Johnson wasn't there. Defensively, I think it made 896 00:44:36,320 --> 00:44:39,560 sense why the defense wasn't quite as good this year. 897 00:44:39,560 --> 00:44:44,200 Now you have a whole lot of new guys running a complex system 898 00:44:44,440 --> 00:44:48,320 where you really have to make a series of split second decisions 899 00:44:48,320 --> 00:44:50,600 on OK, do I help? When do I get back? 900 00:44:50,800 --> 00:44:53,120 You know, all these things that more experienced players can 901 00:44:53,120 --> 00:44:55,840 make quicker and there really needs to be some cohesion. 902 00:44:55,840 --> 00:44:59,000 And so you've got a lack of cohesion, a lack of experience. 903 00:44:59,440 --> 00:45:03,320 And to me, what I think sometimes looks like kind of a 904 00:45:03,320 --> 00:45:07,400 lack of effort or or even a lack of toughness, a lot of times 905 00:45:07,400 --> 00:45:10,560 it's just indecision and a slight lack of conviction and 906 00:45:10,560 --> 00:45:13,240 what you're doing because when you're constantly getting 3 907 00:45:13,240 --> 00:45:15,960 pointers drained in your face, that's very demoralizing. 908 00:45:16,640 --> 00:45:20,240 And so I think that's all of that has kind of mixed together 909 00:45:20,240 --> 00:45:24,000 in this defensive Stew that is just really not good. 910 00:45:24,040 --> 00:45:26,920 And to me, you know, outside of going zone at the end of the 911 00:45:26,920 --> 00:45:29,160 Louisville game, which really kind of ended up winning that 912 00:45:29,160 --> 00:45:30,640 game. And if you really spirited 913 00:45:30,640 --> 00:45:34,640 defensive efforts at home where I think the home crowd helps 914 00:45:34,640 --> 00:45:38,000 push you through when you might get frustrated or indecisive or 915 00:45:38,000 --> 00:45:40,200 all the things that can bother you defensively. 916 00:45:40,720 --> 00:45:43,040 You don't see that stuff on the road and the whole thing just 917 00:45:43,040 --> 00:45:46,120 collapses. In addition to strategic choices 918 00:45:46,120 --> 00:45:49,040 like hey let's double Stephen Crowell but leave Max Klezman 919 00:45:49,040 --> 00:45:52,920 open three straight possessions. Well now you know it's all just 920 00:45:52,920 --> 00:45:56,240 kind of going wrong And that to me defensively everything that 921 00:45:56,240 --> 00:45:59,160 could go wrong is. So if you get you know if you. 922 00:45:59,480 --> 00:46:02,360 But but here also is a problem Galen is if you're if this is 923 00:46:02,360 --> 00:46:07,400 going to be a let's you know, just kind of recruit talent and 924 00:46:07,400 --> 00:46:09,680 replacing the portal and we're kind of constantly churning 925 00:46:09,680 --> 00:46:12,960 through new guys, you're never really going to get the cohesion 926 00:46:12,960 --> 00:46:17,000 with this defense that you need. Length can help, athleticism can 927 00:46:17,000 --> 00:46:19,880 help. But the path to building an 928 00:46:19,880 --> 00:46:22,960 elite defense is not the one that Indiana is following, and 929 00:46:22,960 --> 00:46:24,480 that's kind of my long term concern. 930 00:46:24,480 --> 00:46:28,880 Well, what I think is interesting is when you look at, 931 00:46:28,880 --> 00:46:31,720 we try to break down why the defense isn't playing that well 932 00:46:31,720 --> 00:46:34,320 this year. It's not what you would think. 933 00:46:34,880 --> 00:46:38,080 They're not giving up a higher three-point percentage the the 934 00:46:38,080 --> 00:46:40,320 three-point percentage. Indiana's surrendering is 935 00:46:40,320 --> 00:46:43,040 basically the exact same as it's been for the last six seasons. 936 00:46:43,360 --> 00:46:45,200 Yeah, it's not the percentage, it's the problem. 937 00:46:45,600 --> 00:46:48,560 Well, right. It's the rate, but but then 938 00:46:48,560 --> 00:46:51,920 there has to be an adaptation, which we haven't seen on that. 939 00:46:52,400 --> 00:46:55,000 You know the what what I find most fascinating is actually 940 00:46:55,000 --> 00:46:59,000 what is worse this year is that Indiana's giving up more twos 941 00:46:59,600 --> 00:47:02,120 and they're a higher percentage of twos, even though they're not 942 00:47:02,120 --> 00:47:04,720 getting shot as much. And they're also they're 943 00:47:04,720 --> 00:47:07,440 significantly down from what they have been in terms of 944 00:47:07,440 --> 00:47:10,880 getting blocks. There's there's a clear lack of 945 00:47:10,880 --> 00:47:16,000 physicality and a clear lack of utilization of size in the post 946 00:47:16,200 --> 00:47:20,040 for Indiana playing defense, despite this being one of the 947 00:47:20,040 --> 00:47:23,800 tallest teams in all of college basketball at every single 948 00:47:23,800 --> 00:47:26,800 position, that that's what worries me. 949 00:47:26,800 --> 00:47:29,600 So you I think you may be right in as much as perhaps there is a 950 00:47:29,600 --> 00:47:32,760 lack of conviction because you know you get burned so many 951 00:47:32,760 --> 00:47:34,880 times doing XY and Z. But like the things that are 952 00:47:34,880 --> 00:47:39,560 burning Indiana visually the three pointers isn't really 953 00:47:39,560 --> 00:47:42,160 what's contributing to the the vast majority of issues. 954 00:47:42,160 --> 00:47:45,200 It's the day-to-day stuff. It's also the lack of 955 00:47:45,200 --> 00:47:48,920 rebounding, You know and and and you know they keep teams off the 956 00:47:48,920 --> 00:47:52,040 offensive glass and it's just like that shouldn't be that way 957 00:47:52,040 --> 00:47:54,400 with this personnel set if you're going to play this way, 958 00:47:54,600 --> 00:47:58,480 if this can't be the outcome. Well, and you know, and here's 959 00:47:58,480 --> 00:48:00,400 where a lot of things are interconnected, right? 960 00:48:00,400 --> 00:48:04,520 So, you know, #1, not having Trace Jackson Davis, who is a 961 00:48:04,520 --> 00:48:06,840 very versatile interior defender really hurts. 962 00:48:07,080 --> 00:48:10,160 You know, Khalil Ware I think is a good weak side shot blocker, 963 00:48:10,520 --> 00:48:12,400 right? But if you're expecting him to 964 00:48:12,400 --> 00:48:16,120 try and guard a Zac Edie or or guard a physical center, he's 965 00:48:16,120 --> 00:48:17,840 really going to struggle doing that. 966 00:48:18,080 --> 00:48:20,120 And so that's part of the reason why the two point percentage 967 00:48:20,120 --> 00:48:22,200 Indiana's giving up is a little bit better. 968 00:48:22,480 --> 00:48:25,560 Trace, you know who really struggled as a defender early in 969 00:48:25,560 --> 00:48:29,280 his career, became so much better by his last season, 970 00:48:29,440 --> 00:48:30,760 right? And so you don't quite have that 971 00:48:30,760 --> 00:48:32,440 with Khalil. And it's probably not fair to 972 00:48:32,440 --> 00:48:34,600 expect it from him. He's a sophomore, right, who has 973 00:48:34,600 --> 00:48:36,960 made a lot of improvement. So I don't mean it as a knock on 974 00:48:36,960 --> 00:48:39,680 him, you know. But you also have Malik Renew, 975 00:48:40,120 --> 00:48:44,240 who is so important, essential to what Indiana's doing 976 00:48:44,240 --> 00:48:47,840 offensively and carry such a load on the offensive end that 977 00:48:47,840 --> 00:48:49,400 creates 2 things on the other end. 978 00:48:49,560 --> 00:48:52,680 One, he defends afraid to foul. He has to. 979 00:48:53,040 --> 00:48:55,440 He cannot get in foul trouble because the team doesn't have 980 00:48:55,440 --> 00:48:58,080 answers without him. And I think he's carrying such a 981 00:48:58,080 --> 00:49:01,240 heavy load offensively, You know, especially if he's playing 982 00:49:01,240 --> 00:49:04,880 40 minutes against Wisconsin, you can't go, especially a big 983 00:49:04,880 --> 00:49:07,480 guy like him, he can't go all out at all times. 984 00:49:07,480 --> 00:49:09,920 And I think you're seeing slippage from him a little bit 985 00:49:09,920 --> 00:49:12,480 defensively and on the defensive glass because of that. 986 00:49:12,920 --> 00:49:15,680 Where that's interconnected is if you had guards who could take 987 00:49:15,680 --> 00:49:18,400 more pressure off of him offensively now, maybe you could 988 00:49:18,400 --> 00:49:21,080 get a little bit more balanced effort and focus from him on 989 00:49:21,080 --> 00:49:23,320 both ends. And again, I don't say this as a 990 00:49:23,320 --> 00:49:26,000 knock on Malik. I think as a sophomore he's 991 00:49:26,000 --> 00:49:27,720 doing everything you could ask of him. 992 00:49:27,720 --> 00:49:30,480 But he's not Superman, He's not senior year, Trace. 993 00:49:30,480 --> 00:49:33,640 Trace could do it on both ends. That's why what he did as a 994 00:49:33,640 --> 00:49:38,400 senior was so spectacular. But if you have to have that to 995 00:49:38,400 --> 00:49:42,360 make the system work well, those players staying for four years 996 00:49:42,360 --> 00:49:45,120 with that level of talent do not come around that often. 997 00:49:45,600 --> 00:49:49,120 So the you know that's. I'm struck suddenly by, OK, this 998 00:49:49,120 --> 00:49:52,480 is the second player who plays major minutes that we're saying 999 00:49:52,480 --> 00:49:57,160 is obligated to do way too much. This is Trey Galloway and Malik 1000 00:49:57,160 --> 00:49:59,360 Renew. This is where a lot of my 1001 00:49:59,360 --> 00:50:00,800 concerns are starting to come in. 1002 00:50:00,840 --> 00:50:03,800 Like if you're This is a five man game. 1003 00:50:04,720 --> 00:50:08,200 So much rests on the shoulders of a small number of people. 1004 00:50:08,600 --> 00:50:10,280 Otherwise everything goes off the rails. 1005 00:50:10,280 --> 00:50:12,400 But. It did last year too, but Jalen 1006 00:50:12,400 --> 00:50:13,880 had a bad game. He had no chance. 1007 00:50:13,880 --> 00:50:17,640 And and look, you know, and look, last year's team and 1008 00:50:17,640 --> 00:50:20,240 coaching staff deserves credit for figuring out a way to pull 1009 00:50:20,240 --> 00:50:22,960 it together. Yeah, but there's a there's an 1010 00:50:22,960 --> 00:50:25,440 alternate reality where that doesn't happen. 1011 00:50:25,840 --> 00:50:29,400 And you know that we're seeing the alternate reality here. 1012 00:50:29,400 --> 00:50:32,680 We saw it in Woodson's first year, which now it's like, well, 1013 00:50:32,680 --> 00:50:37,360 what's the what's the reality and what's the fake reality? 1014 00:50:37,360 --> 00:50:40,000 I don't entirely know which kind of gets. 1015 00:50:40,000 --> 00:50:42,600 When Xavier Johnson became an all Big 10 level point guard at 1016 00:50:42,600 --> 00:50:43,880 the end of the year, they went on a run. 1017 00:50:44,040 --> 00:50:46,760 Well bright but they but you look at what they sustained 1018 00:50:46,760 --> 00:50:49,240 leading up to that is the is the larger issue. 1019 00:50:49,240 --> 00:50:53,000 I mean when they lose, they lost five out of seven heading into 1020 00:50:53,000 --> 00:50:56,240 that Big 10 tournament. And you know it wasn't like 1021 00:50:56,240 --> 00:51:00,080 those were all to great teams. And so that's this is where I 1022 00:51:00,080 --> 00:51:04,240 get my, my concern level rises and I guess this ties into how 1023 00:51:04,520 --> 00:51:07,320 perhaps we could finish up, which is what happens the rest 1024 00:51:07,320 --> 00:51:09,600 of the way with this Indiana team. 1025 00:51:09,600 --> 00:51:13,960 I mean, you know right now they sit at 12:00 and 7:00 and they 1026 00:51:13,960 --> 00:51:17,680 have 12 games remaining in the conference. 1027 00:51:17,960 --> 00:51:23,920 They have games at Illinois, at Ohio State, at Purdue, at Penn 1028 00:51:23,920 --> 00:51:26,120 State, at Maryland, at Minnesota, and then they get 1029 00:51:26,120 --> 00:51:28,840 home games against Iowa, Penn State, Northwestern, Nebraska, 1030 00:51:28,840 --> 00:51:34,800 Wisconsin and Michigan State. Their four and four record thus 1031 00:51:34,800 --> 00:51:38,240 far has been against one of the easier schedules in the 1032 00:51:38,240 --> 00:51:40,920 conference and I think they have like the 4th hardest schedule 1033 00:51:40,920 --> 00:51:43,000 remaining. And this is not a team that's 1034 00:51:43,000 --> 00:51:46,480 exactly exactly what has been forged in the fires of the the 1035 00:51:46,480 --> 00:51:48,960 the schedule so far. They look very tentative. 1036 00:51:50,080 --> 00:51:52,880 How do you see this playing out? I mean you know Indiana's got 1037 00:51:52,880 --> 00:51:55,120 four. They need to get four wins to 1038 00:51:55,120 --> 00:52:00,400 get to a a guaranteed 500 record minimum in the regular season 1039 00:52:00,400 --> 00:52:03,720 plus conference tournament. Can they get the four wins? 1040 00:52:03,760 --> 00:52:06,040 Will they will not? Not Can I know they can. 1041 00:52:06,120 --> 00:52:09,840 Will they get the four wins? Wait, they would need 6 right to 1042 00:52:09,840 --> 00:52:12,760 finish 500? No, they're 12 and seven right 1043 00:52:12,760 --> 00:52:15,520 now. Oh, oh, to finish, overall OK. 1044 00:52:15,800 --> 00:52:18,040 If they lose in the first round of the Big 10 tournament, they'd 1045 00:52:18,040 --> 00:52:20,400 be 16 and 16. Yes. 1046 00:52:22,320 --> 00:52:28,480 I don't know, Galen. My inclination after the last 1047 00:52:28,480 --> 00:52:31,560 four games of basketball that we've seen at, you know, against 1048 00:52:31,560 --> 00:52:35,840 Rutgers, Purdue, Wisconsin specifically, is to think the 1049 00:52:35,840 --> 00:52:40,120 pessimistic end. But, you know, I think, and this 1050 00:52:40,120 --> 00:52:42,440 is where I try to go back to what we talked about at the 1051 00:52:42,440 --> 00:52:44,720 beginning of the season, which was this team is going to be 1052 00:52:44,720 --> 00:52:47,080 better in February and March than they are now, than they are 1053 00:52:47,080 --> 00:52:50,440 at the beginning. OK, well, what has changed to 1054 00:52:50,440 --> 00:52:52,080 make you feel like that's not the case? 1055 00:52:52,080 --> 00:52:53,680 And the big thing is Xavier Johnson, right? 1056 00:52:53,680 --> 00:52:56,200 No one expected this. You know, a guy who had an 1057 00:52:56,200 --> 00:53:00,040 assist rate of above 35 for five years, suddenly plummeting to 1058 00:53:00,040 --> 00:53:02,880 like 15. That's difficult to expect, 1059 00:53:02,920 --> 00:53:06,200 right? So if as he gets a little bit 1060 00:53:06,200 --> 00:53:09,440 more healthier and rebuilds confidence, if he can be more 1061 00:53:09,440 --> 00:53:12,920 productive and maybe not even be the guy that he was, but be able 1062 00:53:12,920 --> 00:53:16,280 to give you 20 to 22 minutes a game with an assist rate in the 1063 00:53:16,280 --> 00:53:19,640 20 fives and just be a little bit more solid. 1064 00:53:20,320 --> 00:53:22,840 I think there's a path to win some of those games, especially 1065 00:53:22,840 --> 00:53:25,280 the home games, maybe even some tough ones like beating a 1066 00:53:25,280 --> 00:53:28,440 Michigan State at home or you know, who else do they play at 1067 00:53:28,440 --> 00:53:30,600 home that you know, or beating a Wisconsin at home? 1068 00:53:30,880 --> 00:53:32,640 That doesn't seem out of the question. 1069 00:53:33,280 --> 00:53:36,760 The problem with this team is it's just really hard to expect 1070 00:53:36,760 --> 00:53:39,160 consistency, let alone from game to game. 1071 00:53:39,480 --> 00:53:43,000 But from, you know, minute to minute, I mean, the way this 1072 00:53:43,000 --> 00:53:45,680 team has started 1st and 2nd halves has been outstanding. 1073 00:53:46,240 --> 00:53:49,640 I mean the thing about this roster that would probably shock 1074 00:53:49,640 --> 00:53:53,480 people is if you look at evanmia.com and you look at the 1075 00:53:53,480 --> 00:53:56,880 top ten five man lineups, the top 10 most efficient 5 man 1076 00:53:56,880 --> 00:53:59,760 lineups in the country, Do you realize the Gabe Cup starting 1077 00:53:59,760 --> 00:54:03,240 lineup is fifth in the country in efficiency margin, adjusted 1078 00:54:03,240 --> 00:54:06,000 efficiency, margin cups, Galloway and Baco, Renew and 1079 00:54:06,000 --> 00:54:08,680 wear. I mean, those five are playing 1080 00:54:08,680 --> 00:54:13,040 at an elite level to start halves, but it just dwindles 1081 00:54:13,040 --> 00:54:15,280 from there. It's almost like, you know, as 1082 00:54:15,280 --> 00:54:18,080 the residue from whatever coaching they're getting before 1083 00:54:18,080 --> 00:54:21,400 the game and at halftime whittles away, they just lose 1084 00:54:21,400 --> 00:54:23,880 their ability to play coherent basketball and obviously the 1085 00:54:23,880 --> 00:54:26,280 bench struggles factor in there and there's lots of, you know, 1086 00:54:26,440 --> 00:54:29,520 reasons there. So I'm filibustering and not 1087 00:54:29,520 --> 00:54:34,160 answering the question, but the real answer is I I just, I don't 1088 00:54:34,160 --> 00:54:35,640 know. Honestly, I don't have a great 1089 00:54:35,640 --> 00:54:39,840 feel for this team right now and maybe that's because if I 1090 00:54:39,840 --> 00:54:42,600 actually were to admit how I feel would be a little bit more 1091 00:54:42,600 --> 00:54:45,920 negative than I want to say. But I do think there is a there 1092 00:54:45,920 --> 00:54:48,200 is a world because of the talent. 1093 00:54:48,200 --> 00:54:51,240 I mean, Malik Renew is just a supremely gifted offensive 1094 00:54:51,240 --> 00:54:54,000 player. Mackenzie and Bako may end up 1095 00:54:54,000 --> 00:54:55,520 being Big 10 Freshman of the Year. 1096 00:54:55,520 --> 00:54:58,200 And he's a guy who, if Indiana starts giving him a higher 1097 00:54:58,200 --> 00:55:01,080 volume of shots, could start scoring 20 points a game. 1098 00:55:01,560 --> 00:55:04,400 Like there's a path there to win because they're going to be some 1099 00:55:04,400 --> 00:55:07,200 nights when those are two of the three best players on the court, 1100 00:55:07,840 --> 00:55:09,880 you know? But there's just so many other 1101 00:55:09,880 --> 00:55:12,760 issues with this, with this team that those two guys could have a 1102 00:55:12,760 --> 00:55:14,920 great game and it can still not be enough. 1103 00:55:15,280 --> 00:55:17,680 Last year that wasn't the case. If Trace and Jalen played great, 1104 00:55:17,680 --> 00:55:20,320 Indiana would win because Cop was solid. 1105 00:55:20,320 --> 00:55:23,320 You know, other guys were solid. And the fact that you can't even 1106 00:55:23,320 --> 00:55:27,640 really count on that now, you know, is it just it makes me 1107 00:55:27,640 --> 00:55:29,600 wonder. And so, you know, I would, if I 1108 00:55:29,600 --> 00:55:32,680 had to offer a prediction, you know, I'd say Indiana probably 1109 00:55:32,680 --> 00:55:35,920 lose, loses one or two more games and they win from here on 1110 00:55:35,920 --> 00:55:38,560 out. But I don't, I think it would be 1111 00:55:38,560 --> 00:55:41,800 fair if you wanted to take an optimistic look and say, hey, we 1112 00:55:41,800 --> 00:55:43,200 expected this team to get better. 1113 00:55:43,600 --> 00:55:45,920 I think they can when they start playing teams that aren't quite 1114 00:55:45,920 --> 00:55:48,080 as good as Purdue and at Wisconsin, I mean, those are 1115 00:55:48,080 --> 00:55:52,240 particularly tough matchups. You know, there's a path. 1116 00:55:52,480 --> 00:55:56,520 I just I struggle to trust that this group can get on that path 1117 00:55:56,520 --> 00:56:00,720 based on what we've seen so far. Yeah, it's, it's interesting. 1118 00:56:00,720 --> 00:56:03,960 It's just this feels like Groundhog Day for IU basketball. 1119 00:56:03,960 --> 00:56:07,680 I mean if you go back to the last year of cream, we're 1120 00:56:07,680 --> 00:56:09,840 recording this on the 23rd of January. 1121 00:56:09,880 --> 00:56:12,560 If you take the record for Indiana and the regular season 1122 00:56:12,560 --> 00:56:15,800 from the 22nd of January on through all those years, it goes 1123 00:56:15,800 --> 00:56:19,360 as follows, 3 and 8, four and six, five and eight, five and 1124 00:56:19,360 --> 00:56:21,280 eight, three and eight, four and eight. 1125 00:56:21,920 --> 00:56:25,200 Last year was nine and four, you know, and and that's where it 1126 00:56:25,200 --> 00:56:28,480 kind of felt like things had turned around a little bit and 1127 00:56:28,480 --> 00:56:32,760 then they didn't. And I I think it's it's 1128 00:56:32,760 --> 00:56:40,160 supremely frustrating across the board that there's been such a 1129 00:56:41,280 --> 00:56:45,480 regression in the basic concepts of how Indiana's playing this 1130 00:56:45,480 --> 00:56:47,400 year. Yes, there was some of that that 1131 00:56:47,400 --> 00:56:50,720 was expected. It's not unrecoverable, but it 1132 00:56:50,720 --> 00:56:54,520 is frustrating because it just kind of feels like after a 1133 00:56:54,520 --> 00:56:58,000 moment and it's actually goes ties back into something that I 1134 00:56:58,000 --> 00:56:59,440 was talking with Zach Osterman about. 1135 00:57:01,720 --> 00:57:05,280 After a moment where it felt like Indiana fans and the 1136 00:57:05,280 --> 00:57:11,080 program had gotten out of the dark and the trajectory was 1137 00:57:11,080 --> 00:57:14,280 moving in a better direction, it's suddenly gone the other 1138 00:57:14,440 --> 00:57:17,120 direction. And that's really hard to get 1139 00:57:17,120 --> 00:57:19,960 your head wrapped around. And I, you know, I think if 1140 00:57:19,960 --> 00:57:23,320 people are reacting negatively to some of the the angst that's 1141 00:57:23,320 --> 00:57:27,480 being expressed by IU fans, I think there's this kind of 1142 00:57:27,480 --> 00:57:32,560 dreaded pit of the stomach feeling regarding the direction 1143 00:57:32,560 --> 00:57:35,200 of the program where it's like I don't think anybody's got it in 1144 00:57:35,200 --> 00:57:38,840 their heads that hey, sitting here and contemplating another 1145 00:57:38,840 --> 00:57:42,560 January, February combination that goes like this is, is is 1146 00:57:42,560 --> 00:57:47,400 going to be enjoyable. No, you know, and look, I I get 1147 00:57:49,240 --> 00:57:53,640 the the bewilderment some have expressed with the fanbase's 1148 00:57:53,640 --> 00:57:57,960 reaction and how it can seem. Certainly look, the more extreme 1149 00:57:57,960 --> 00:58:01,360 reactions that you see out there and anybody calling for Woodson 1150 00:58:01,360 --> 00:58:03,280 to be fired like that stuff is all ridiculous. 1151 00:58:03,280 --> 00:58:06,800 And I think for the most part, social media noise, you know, 1152 00:58:07,120 --> 00:58:10,440 Facebook and Twitter and all these sites kind of incentivize 1153 00:58:10,440 --> 00:58:12,880 for the most extreme reactions and you get that there. 1154 00:58:13,080 --> 00:58:15,800 I think once you get out of those bubbles, it's not quite as 1155 00:58:15,800 --> 00:58:21,360 extreme, but it's still palpable because of just and you know, 1156 00:58:21,360 --> 00:58:24,000 and you've talked about this a lot, which is just this 1157 00:58:24,000 --> 00:58:29,640 misalignment of what is promised to IU fans and what they kind of 1158 00:58:29,640 --> 00:58:33,400 see as being reasonable based on resources and everything 1159 00:58:33,400 --> 00:58:35,280 available. And then what actually happens. 1160 00:58:35,280 --> 00:58:38,360 And it's always like, God, it feels like this is less than it 1161 00:58:38,360 --> 00:58:41,480 could be, you know. And so and I think you're just, 1162 00:58:41,480 --> 00:58:44,280 you're seeing some of that stuff bubble up this season where it's 1163 00:58:44,280 --> 00:58:47,960 like, man, because I think you know my philosophy on this Galen 1164 00:58:47,960 --> 00:58:50,640 is I'm always going to be super patient with a coach's first two 1165 00:58:50,640 --> 00:58:53,120 years. Did it with Archie, you did it 1166 00:58:53,120 --> 00:58:54,960 with Crane. Did it with Woodson. 1167 00:58:55,080 --> 00:58:57,720 I'm going to give the benefit of the doubt on red flags, all that 1168 00:58:57,720 --> 00:59:01,680 stuff, you know, year three, it seems to me that if the same 1169 00:59:01,680 --> 00:59:04,800 issues are happening, it's time to start being kind of concerned 1170 00:59:04,800 --> 00:59:07,720 that this is a feature, not a bug, of what the coach is doing. 1171 00:59:08,320 --> 00:59:11,080 And I think there may be other people like that to where now 1172 00:59:11,080 --> 00:59:15,120 you see some of these issues and it's like, man, you know, is 1173 00:59:15,120 --> 00:59:16,960 this, is this going to be another one of those false 1174 00:59:16,960 --> 00:59:19,800 starts where it feels like we have hope and then it doesn't 1175 00:59:19,800 --> 00:59:22,240 happen? And is that fair to Mike 1176 00:59:22,240 --> 00:59:23,840 Woodson? No, maybe not. 1177 00:59:23,840 --> 00:59:27,160 It's but it's the job he took. And yeah. 1178 00:59:27,560 --> 00:59:30,520 Well, and that's the thing. It feels it it feels when you 1179 00:59:30,520 --> 00:59:33,600 complain about these things and look there, there's the, there's 1180 00:59:33,600 --> 00:59:36,960 the micro level of look, the team is young, they're still 1181 00:59:36,960 --> 00:59:38,480 learning. I get all of that. 1182 00:59:38,840 --> 00:59:41,960 The complaints about why is this trending in this direction are 1183 00:59:41,960 --> 00:59:48,840 not truly fair. But this is where the the way 1184 00:59:48,840 --> 00:59:54,880 that we view these things tends to get off track compared to the 1185 00:59:54,880 --> 00:59:57,560 reality. These things are often times 1186 00:59:57,560 --> 01:00:00,040 categorized within the confines of who's the players at that 1187 01:00:00,040 --> 01:00:02,000 moment, who, who's the coach at that moment. 1188 01:00:02,440 --> 01:00:08,640 And it sounds entitled for IU fans to say we can't be having 1189 01:00:08,640 --> 01:00:11,920 this happening. But on the flip side, it's it's 1190 01:00:11,920 --> 01:00:14,520 kind of like that debate on Twitter yesterday about Iowa 1191 01:00:14,520 --> 01:00:15,800 fans. Like there were, there were some 1192 01:00:15,800 --> 01:00:18,480 media members who were like how could you possibly think that 1193 01:00:18,480 --> 01:00:21,880 getting rid of? Of, you know, Fran McCaffrey 1194 01:00:21,880 --> 01:00:24,320 would be a good idea. He's the all time winningest 1195 01:00:24,320 --> 01:00:26,320 coach in Iowa history. Then you look at Iowa's history 1196 01:00:26,320 --> 01:00:28,080 and it's like, well, they've they haven't been past the Sweet 1197 01:00:28,080 --> 01:00:31,960 16 since Fran got there and it's been 15 years. 1198 01:00:31,960 --> 01:00:37,120 And there is this mentality I think sometimes from the outside 1199 01:00:37,400 --> 01:00:39,360 where it's like I don't understand why these people are 1200 01:00:39,360 --> 01:00:40,920 so upset. I don't understand why they were 1201 01:00:40,920 --> 01:00:44,600 overreacting. But it is an accrual of things 1202 01:00:44,600 --> 01:00:48,640 over the course of time and it is unfortunate that Mike Woodson 1203 01:00:48,640 --> 01:00:50,800 and his staff and the players I think find themselves in the 1204 01:00:50,800 --> 01:00:53,600 crosshairs of this. But I also like I look around 1205 01:00:53,600 --> 01:00:58,960 the the country and I say it, it's not this hard to put 1206 01:00:58,960 --> 01:01:04,560 together a core program that's going to win games and be 1207 01:01:05,200 --> 01:01:06,840 competitive and look competitive. 1208 01:01:06,840 --> 01:01:08,560 And and you know, the point I made at the end of the 1209 01:01:08,840 --> 01:01:11,520 conversation with Zach was it's not like this team is like kind 1210 01:01:11,520 --> 01:01:13,520 of on the boundaries of the tournament. 1211 01:01:14,040 --> 01:01:15,760 It's that they're significantly outside it. 1212 01:01:15,760 --> 01:01:18,320 Like they've played about as 100th best team in the country 1213 01:01:18,320 --> 01:01:21,080 and that's that I don't think is unfair to point out. 1214 01:01:21,480 --> 01:01:22,960 Right. And so I have two quick things 1215 01:01:22,960 --> 01:01:25,640 on that. One, you know last year and you 1216 01:01:25,640 --> 01:01:28,120 know Ryan and I had this debate on the assembly call, you know, 1217 01:01:28,120 --> 01:01:31,400 we're by season's end, he said Indiana underachieved. 1218 01:01:32,000 --> 01:01:34,200 And my argument was, come on, you know, we hadn't made the 1219 01:01:34,200 --> 01:01:36,560 tournament in six years. This is the second year in a row 1220 01:01:36,560 --> 01:01:39,640 we got a four seed. You know, you dealt with the 1221 01:01:39,640 --> 01:01:42,840 injury of Xavier Johnson. Like, is it conceivable they 1222 01:01:42,840 --> 01:01:44,280 could have done better? Yes. 1223 01:01:44,320 --> 01:01:47,480 But to me, was it fair to expect them to do better? 1224 01:01:47,480 --> 01:01:49,560 Like that was a good season, right? 1225 01:01:49,560 --> 01:01:53,960 And so I think people who didn't find success in last year, that 1226 01:01:53,960 --> 01:01:56,080 to me is a little bit unreasonable, right? 1227 01:01:56,720 --> 01:02:01,240 But when you look at this year, like all of the potential issues 1228 01:02:01,240 --> 01:02:04,040 were kind of baked into being ranked 50th in Kenpalm at the 1229 01:02:04,040 --> 01:02:07,440 beginning of the season. Now Indiana's down at 100. 1230 01:02:07,880 --> 01:02:10,120 Here's a question for you. Remember the Kentucky season? 1231 01:02:10,120 --> 01:02:12,960 Was it two or three years ago when they just bottomed out and 1232 01:02:12,960 --> 01:02:14,840 they went 9 and 16? Do you know what? 1233 01:02:14,840 --> 01:02:17,600 They were ranked in Kim Palm 47th. 1234 01:02:18,560 --> 01:02:20,400 Because all of their losses were close. 1235 01:02:20,400 --> 01:02:22,560 They just kept losing these close games, right? 1236 01:02:23,000 --> 01:02:26,880 And part of the problem for Indiana this season is the wins 1237 01:02:27,280 --> 01:02:29,240 haven't looked good and have been closer than they should, 1238 01:02:29,240 --> 01:02:31,160 and the losses have been total blowouts. 1239 01:02:31,440 --> 01:02:35,320 And so it just makes you feel like you're not even almost on 1240 01:02:35,320 --> 01:02:37,320 the same plane as some of these other teams. 1241 01:02:37,320 --> 01:02:40,840 And I think what Indiana fans want is to get up on that plane, 1242 01:02:41,120 --> 01:02:44,240 stay on that plane, and maybe you move back and forth and it's 1243 01:02:44,240 --> 01:02:47,080 like, OK, we're 50th this year, we're on the bubble or maybe we 1244 01:02:47,080 --> 01:02:49,880 make the NIT, whatever, You're going to have a season like 1245 01:02:49,880 --> 01:02:54,160 that, but not be like in the basement of the conference, you. 1246 01:02:54,920 --> 01:02:56,600 Know. And be just trying to keep your 1247 01:02:56,600 --> 01:02:59,160 head above triple digits in in metrics. 1248 01:02:59,160 --> 01:03:00,840 I I agree. I like it's like like North 1249 01:03:00,840 --> 01:03:04,160 Carolina last year who you know, kind of had the season from hell 1250 01:03:04,160 --> 01:03:07,360 and people are questioning, you know, Hubert Davis's job, they 1251 01:03:07,360 --> 01:03:10,440 were like 49th or 43rd in in Ken Pop. 1252 01:03:10,680 --> 01:03:13,160 Look, the analytics aren't everything, but what they are, 1253 01:03:13,160 --> 01:03:15,560 as we talk about all the time on this network, they are an 1254 01:03:15,560 --> 01:03:18,120 indicator of the relative strength of how you're playing 1255 01:03:19,280 --> 01:03:20,800 against other teams in the country. 1256 01:03:20,800 --> 01:03:24,000 And it's it's by far the best, way more than record, more than 1257 01:03:24,000 --> 01:03:27,800 ranking in polls to be able to meter that out. 1258 01:03:27,800 --> 01:03:29,400 And then that's the thing. It's like you're going to get a 1259 01:03:29,400 --> 01:03:33,680 bottoming out occasionally. But for for for people who watch 1260 01:03:33,680 --> 01:03:37,000 this program for a while, to look at this team and say, you 1261 01:03:37,000 --> 01:03:41,400 know what? As it currently sits, according 1262 01:03:41,400 --> 01:03:47,920 to the metrics, this team will be worse than the 2011 team that 1263 01:03:47,920 --> 01:03:52,840 went 12 and 20 and 3 and 15 in the conference and will be worse 1264 01:03:52,840 --> 01:03:55,320 than any of the teams that came since then. 1265 01:03:55,800 --> 01:03:57,920 That's a really hard pill to swallow. 1266 01:03:57,920 --> 01:04:00,560 And that's where you could say this was going to be a 1267 01:04:00,560 --> 01:04:02,400 rebuilding year. This was going to be a year 1268 01:04:02,400 --> 01:04:04,360 where things didn't go great. It was going to be a rougher 1269 01:04:04,360 --> 01:04:07,400 year. That's not what we were talking 1270 01:04:07,400 --> 01:04:09,680 about. Like that's that's a different 1271 01:04:09,680 --> 01:04:11,720 level. And and so that's where I'm 1272 01:04:11,720 --> 01:04:14,960 really fascinated I guess to kind of to to to put a dot on 1273 01:04:14,960 --> 01:04:16,800 this at the end. That's where I'm really 1274 01:04:16,800 --> 01:04:22,440 fascinated to see what happens over this next 12 games, because 1275 01:04:22,440 --> 01:04:26,400 ultimately if there has been cultural progress made with IU 1276 01:04:26,400 --> 01:04:29,440 basketball, this is where it has to shine. 1277 01:04:29,800 --> 01:04:31,920 This is where, OK, maybe you're not going to make the NCAA 1278 01:04:31,920 --> 01:04:36,360 tournament, but but going four and eight over these last 12, I 1279 01:04:36,360 --> 01:04:40,000 think that's a real red flag going into the off season, If 1280 01:04:40,000 --> 01:04:43,480 you go six and six, you're not expected to go six and six, 1281 01:04:43,480 --> 01:04:45,600 you're going to go, you know you're going to 500 in 1282 01:04:45,600 --> 01:04:47,200 conference, you're going to go to the NIT. 1283 01:04:47,320 --> 01:04:49,440 Is that a good season? Is that an acceptable season? 1284 01:04:49,440 --> 01:04:52,440 No. But given the hand that's 1285 01:04:52,440 --> 01:04:55,160 currently been dealt and given the way that the season's going 1286 01:04:56,160 --> 01:04:58,600 to me, I think if you're an IU fan, you can at least go into 1287 01:04:58,600 --> 01:05:00,960 the offseason and say, well, they figured some things out 1288 01:05:00,960 --> 01:05:04,120 down the stretch. And I have a bit more faith that 1289 01:05:04,240 --> 01:05:07,760 the trajectory of this program is going to be one that will 1290 01:05:07,760 --> 01:05:10,480 take us where we need to go in the future. 1291 01:05:11,200 --> 01:05:13,040 You go four and eight down the stretch. 1292 01:05:13,160 --> 01:05:15,960 I'm not sure that you can reliably say that internally, 1293 01:05:15,960 --> 01:05:17,720 and I think that's where the questions get louder. 1294 01:05:18,760 --> 01:05:21,320 Yeah, and even, you know, even going deeper than the record, 1295 01:05:21,320 --> 01:05:24,120 even if Indiana goes 4:00 and 8:00, but those eight losses are 1296 01:05:24,120 --> 01:05:25,880 competitive. You know, you're competitive at 1297 01:05:25,880 --> 01:05:28,400 Illinois, you're competitive at Purdue, and you're playing 1298 01:05:28,400 --> 01:05:31,080 better. That's what I think is important 1299 01:05:31,080 --> 01:05:32,840 to watch for. You know, what is the 1300 01:05:32,840 --> 01:05:34,360 foundation? I think you learn a lot about 1301 01:05:34,360 --> 01:05:36,920 the foundation of your program in the worst seasons. 1302 01:05:37,200 --> 01:05:38,760 You know, what is the actual floor here? 1303 01:05:38,760 --> 01:05:41,840 How far can we go? Well, we've dropped further than 1304 01:05:41,840 --> 01:05:43,760 anyone would have expected and people can say whatever they 1305 01:05:43,760 --> 01:05:45,360 want. There were a lot of people who 1306 01:05:45,360 --> 01:05:46,760 were pessimistic early in the season. 1307 01:05:46,960 --> 01:05:49,760 No one thought Indiana was going to be playing this poorly, 1308 01:05:50,120 --> 01:05:52,800 right? And so can this group rebound 1309 01:05:52,800 --> 01:05:54,280 together? Can the staff make some 1310 01:05:54,280 --> 01:05:57,320 adjustments, which, to be fair, they have done in the last 1311 01:05:57,320 --> 01:05:59,960 couple of January's and February's little tweaks to help 1312 01:05:59,960 --> 01:06:02,800 get more out of the personnel. And so I'm curious to see what 1313 01:06:02,800 --> 01:06:05,720 Mike Woodson does because I think at times he has shown a 1314 01:06:05,720 --> 01:06:09,400 real handle on his personnel in terms of, you know, just being 1315 01:06:09,400 --> 01:06:12,640 able to get them motivated for for particular games, being able 1316 01:06:12,640 --> 01:06:14,640 to make little shifts and unlock something. 1317 01:06:15,680 --> 01:06:18,320 You know, do we see some of that stuff here down the stretch that 1318 01:06:18,320 --> 01:06:20,880 helps lead to improved play? I'm with you, Galen. 1319 01:06:20,880 --> 01:06:24,560 I think these these next you know the next couple months are 1320 01:06:24,960 --> 01:06:28,160 really really important for setting the stage for what comes 1321 01:06:28,160 --> 01:06:32,280 because part of that pitch in the offseason to you know Portal 1322 01:06:32,280 --> 01:06:35,560 guard Capital P, Capital G that everybody has penciled into the 1323 01:06:35,920 --> 01:06:37,120 you know to the roster next year. 1324 01:06:37,200 --> 01:06:40,160 We just don't know who it is is hey look you're going to come 1325 01:06:40,160 --> 01:06:42,720 play with Malik Renew who became an all big 10 player. 1326 01:06:42,920 --> 01:06:44,960 You know we went 500 down the stretch. 1327 01:06:44,960 --> 01:06:46,960 We've got you know these other guys coming back. 1328 01:06:46,960 --> 01:06:50,080 You know Caleb Banks really you know came on here at the end of 1329 01:06:50,080 --> 01:06:53,040 the season and we think he's a building block now like these 1330 01:06:53,040 --> 01:06:57,160 kinds of things can be really important and so no Indiana May 1331 01:06:57,160 --> 01:06:58,760 is not going to make the NCA tournament. 1332 01:06:58,760 --> 01:07:02,520 I mean, you know, a barring I I was using the Bart Torvik team 1333 01:07:02,520 --> 01:07:04,360 cast. If we win out, we would be a six 1334 01:07:04,360 --> 01:07:07,280 seed, according to. The yeah no it's I I think we 1335 01:07:07,280 --> 01:07:10,520 can just I I've I was doing that for a while I've I've just just 1336 01:07:10,520 --> 01:07:13,240 like you know what let's let's just let's just have a glass of 1337 01:07:13,240 --> 01:07:15,200 warm milk instead of doing that. It'll be healthier. 1338 01:07:16,640 --> 01:07:18,320 I'm with but. Anyway, but I I agree with you, 1339 01:07:18,360 --> 01:07:20,360 it is huge last stretch of the season. 1340 01:07:20,360 --> 01:07:24,000 That's the question. And and look, ultimately you 1341 01:07:24,880 --> 01:07:26,360 season can go the way people hoped. 1342 01:07:26,560 --> 01:07:28,960 Now it's a table setter for what the next year is. 1343 01:07:29,920 --> 01:07:32,120 We've had plenty of table center years that we're supposed to add 1344 01:07:32,120 --> 01:07:34,320 up to something in the future. And I think that the people that 1345 01:07:34,320 --> 01:07:36,800 are skeptical about this adding up to something better in the 1346 01:07:36,800 --> 01:07:40,600 future have a lot of reasons why they should feel that way. 1347 01:07:41,080 --> 01:07:44,360 And I hope that there can be some hard truths and 1348 01:07:44,360 --> 01:07:48,160 realizations as we move forward because right now this is just 1349 01:07:48,160 --> 01:07:50,600 not it. And you know, even by the 1350 01:07:50,600 --> 01:07:56,360 standards of and again, the last thing I'll say, you get this 1351 01:07:56,360 --> 01:08:00,000 kind of flexibility or this kind of leeway if you are at a 1352 01:08:00,000 --> 01:08:04,600 program that is at this level culturally but has had some 1353 01:08:04,600 --> 01:08:07,320 sustained success and falls on hard times for a couple of 1354 01:08:07,320 --> 01:08:09,160 years. That's not what Indiana's been. 1355 01:08:10,080 --> 01:08:15,280 And to to Zach's point, from our podcast, it gets harder for 1356 01:08:15,280 --> 01:08:18,240 every successive coach and every successive group of players 1357 01:08:18,240 --> 01:08:21,000 because you're now living with not just the present and the 1358 01:08:21,000 --> 01:08:23,359 disappointment of the present, but the expectations of the 1359 01:08:23,359 --> 01:08:26,960 past. And but I also think that 1360 01:08:27,200 --> 01:08:30,439 realistically, we've seen enough examples of programs figuring it 1361 01:08:30,439 --> 01:08:33,319 out that there's no reason why Indiana can't figure it out. 1362 01:08:33,680 --> 01:08:35,960 It's just that they haven't figured it out, at least not 1363 01:08:35,960 --> 01:08:38,720 consistently. And whether last year is the 1364 01:08:38,720 --> 01:08:44,640 harbinger of better times to come or an isolated incident out 1365 01:08:44,640 --> 01:08:47,800 of a much longer stretch of mediocrity and disappointment 1366 01:08:47,800 --> 01:08:50,680 from a program perspective, that's ultimately the big 1367 01:08:50,680 --> 01:08:52,040 question mark. So we'll see. 1368 01:08:52,200 --> 01:08:56,520 See what happens anyway. Well, on that happy note, we'll 1369 01:08:56,640 --> 01:08:59,279 we'll wrap up the crossover episode. 1370 01:08:59,279 --> 01:09:03,200 Jared is always a pleasure. You guys have Assembly call 1371 01:09:03,200 --> 01:09:04,760 radio coming up Thursday, correct? 1372 01:09:05,120 --> 01:09:06,479 Thursday night. Yep. 1373 01:09:06,479 --> 01:09:08,760 I'm not sure exactly what we'll talk about yet. 1374 01:09:08,760 --> 01:09:12,560 May have a guest for that one but it'll you know Simly car 1375 01:09:12,560 --> 01:09:14,560 radio was ours. Our chance to take a step back 1376 01:09:14,680 --> 01:09:17,359 post game shows tend to be very emotional and in the moment 1377 01:09:17,600 --> 01:09:20,120 Simly car radio, you can step back and kind of look at things, 1378 01:09:20,200 --> 01:09:23,240 you know, with a you know just kind of a broader view. 1379 01:09:23,240 --> 01:09:25,680 So we'll do that and then be ready on Saturday for whatever 1380 01:09:25,680 --> 01:09:29,240 happens at Illinois which is a huge opportunity for Indiana to 1381 01:09:29,240 --> 01:09:33,040 start to change the narrative or another chance to just continue 1382 01:09:33,040 --> 01:09:34,960 it on. And you know, for all the 1383 01:09:34,960 --> 01:09:38,880 frustration, I mean I will be there cheering and hoping and 1384 01:09:38,880 --> 01:09:42,479 supporting the program as much as we can because all we want 1385 01:09:42,479 --> 01:09:44,720 is, you know for this team to figure it out and get it. 1386 01:09:45,439 --> 01:09:47,600 And I think these players are playing hard enough that they 1387 01:09:47,600 --> 01:09:49,800 they warrant continued you know, support. 1388 01:09:49,800 --> 01:09:52,640 And I would just like to see them put in a little bit better 1389 01:09:52,640 --> 01:09:54,200 position to maximize their talents. 1390 01:09:54,200 --> 01:09:56,280 And if that happens, who knows, maybe you can go up there and 1391 01:09:56,280 --> 01:09:59,200 compete in champagne and make it a pleasant Saturday afternoon. 1392 01:10:00,720 --> 01:10:03,720 To paraphrase Mick Mick Jagger, love is just a kiss away. 1393 01:10:04,160 --> 01:10:07,040 And in this case a kiss is a road victory in Illinois, which 1394 01:10:07,040 --> 01:10:09,160 I'll note Maryland did couple weeks ago. 1395 01:10:09,200 --> 01:10:12,400 So it's it's not out of the realm of possibility, but we'll 1396 01:10:12,400 --> 01:10:15,000 see what happens Anyway. Be sure to check out Assembly 1397 01:10:15,000 --> 01:10:16,440 Call Radio. Be sure to check out Assembly 1398 01:10:16,440 --> 01:10:19,560 Call Post Game after that Illinois game and the entire 1399 01:10:19,560 --> 01:10:23,520 constellation of the podcast that we have here on the back 1400 01:10:23,520 --> 01:10:26,560 home network. As always, we are pleased to 1401 01:10:26,840 --> 01:10:28,880 have everybody along for the ride. 1402 01:10:28,880 --> 01:10:32,720 So for Jared and the Assembly Call crowd, I'm Galen Clavio 1403 01:10:32,720 --> 01:10:36,120 from Crimson Cast. I'll be back with Scott later on 1404 01:10:36,120 --> 01:10:38,320 this week. We'll talk about something I'm 1405 01:10:38,320 --> 01:10:41,000 sure should be fascinating of itself. 1406 01:10:41,000 --> 01:10:42,800 So anyway, thanks for listening, folks. 1407 01:10:42,800 --> 01:10:44,800 We'll catch you folks. On the flip side, bring back the 1408 01:10:44,800 --> 01:10:45,760 Bison. So everybody.