You're listening to the back home network, presented by home
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Crimson cast. Scott here with you excited to
get this going. We have Tony and ranjha on to
talk about to the IU basketball season before we get to him just
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But it's done and now we bring on Tony Tony.
How you doing doing well, always happy to be here on Crimson
cast. Yes, so let's let's talk about
this season. I'll open it up, simulator, open
up with Ryan. Like, what our, how do you
compartmentalize and kind of what's your takeaway from this
year's IU basketball season. Now that we have like a week
week removed from it or two weeks.
Sure. I think you know I think that It
was pretty much in line with where my expectations were post
Xavier Johnson injury, you know. I wanted to be a second weekend
team for sure and I think they still obviously had the talent
to be that you know, the the NCAA tournament is somewhat of a
crapshoot. Once it comes down to matchups
and things and Miami was clearly a bad matchup for for not only
Indiana, but for a lot of teams in the country in a one-game
setting, but you know, when I look at the big picture, I think
back to know, Coming on Crimson cast, I think was right after
the Penn State loss and that was okay.
Dear. Yeah it was ugly and you know,
to rebound from that and really kind of reinvent themselves a
bit, you know, go to know against Purdue, you know, have
some big games and you know, have some momentum was
encouraging now. You know, you lose the only one
team walks away happy. And it certainly Wasn't a season
full of sunshine and rainbows, but like I said, once it was
once they've your Johnson went down and then once I learned, he
was out for good, which was like a week before the season ended.
I was like, yeah, this no way. This team makes a run.
Probably. And so, you know, it's always
disappointing to lose and, you know, not even make the sweet
sixteen and, you know, looking at, just what the Big Ten is as
a whole, it is a little bit discouraging, but You know, when
it when I look at it from a forty thousand foot View and I
kind of take the IU fandom out of it and I just look at it from
like a college basketball fan. I think Indiana kind of did what
a lot of people thought they would do, you know, hover around
the top, 20 for most of the year.
And, you know what, four seed in the NCAA tournament, like all
things considered, you know, a far cry from where we were
booing Archie, Miller out of Lucas Oil Stadium.
I'll take that. Yeah, I mean the thing that I've
said this other pods like that I'm wrestling with is like, how,
how to put the Xavier Johnson injury into context with this
year, because it's, you know, you hate to just be, I hate to
be the guy who's like, well, he had injured like that, that
means therefore like you have to basically an asterisk by this
year. I'm also a guy and I think a lot
of people the IU fan base. Like we kind of, you know, you
look at 1993 and it's like, all right, well, Alan Henderson got
her and that's why I did it. When a title, it's like we
almost have like a half Banner in our minds and who knows?
I mean, it wouldn't have hurt. Having Henderson would have
helped in 93, but like, who knows?
You still could have lost the cans, the Kansas game.
They also Kansas right in the elite eight.
I think that was true. They lost to I think.
So if it was Galen game like, oh, yeah, the score was 74 to 65
and, you know, anyway, but he was 3, so I don't remember that
game too. Well, wow.
Now I feel old you Great. But you look at this year, you
know, obviously Trace Jackson Davis was your best player, but
I think coming into the Year. Xavier Johnson was your second,
most important player jail of the Chaffee.
No became the second most important player throughout the
year, but starting the year, you know, Xavier was your number
two, most important player and a key part of Defense on the other
side, you know, from the guard perspective, your point guard
and I just think there's a lot of teams out there where if they
lose their second best player. Earlier in December, it really
does affect the trajectory of their season for any team and so
I hate to be like, yeah, but Xavier, but I think you just
have to bring that up whenever you talk about this season
because it fundamentally you took the number two piece off
the chessboard. But and like I've been saying to
you basically had then Jalen Hood Fino playing out of
position the entire year. I think people forget that that
for as good as he is a lot of them.
Takes that he made, I chalk up to him being out of position.
Like, he's a to guard, you were asking him to distribute to
score to guard. The number one guy, like two of
those three things were really going to be saviors job.
And now, you're asking who Cioppino to do all three of
those things. Sure.
And you know what, what I think really gets lost to is just when
you have to Dynamic Playmakers on the floor, or, you know, even
three if you count Galloway, is somebody that can stress a
defense in terms of attacking. You know, Xavier Johnson is that
and you know, when when Jalen Hutch pheno attacks a gap and
help side, you know helps but then he's reversing that to us.
Say, Miller cop who you know, has a slower release, not really
going to take somebody off the dribble, versus he comes off
that ball screen, he reverses at the Xavier Johnson, now, Xavier
Johnson's attacking closeout and then the defense is really
stressed and you've got some kind of spaced out and maybe you
got a lob to trace Jackson, Davis or something of the likes.
But, you know, When you lose that ability to really stress a
defense, it's you have to take that into play and then that's
not even factoring is defensive effort that he brings.
And like you said guarding the other team's best ball handler,
that's not factoring in just you know the intangible aspect of,
you know, just kind of being what people call, you know, a
dog, you know, just like toughness tenacity, like it.
Sometimes you got to reel them in and you know, he can, he can
stress you out a little bit and And certainly, you know, he's
not just the perfect basketball player, but I think a lot of
what he brought to the table. Indiana was obviously sorely
missing, you know that last half of the season.
And so, like you mentioned, you know, you play the hand that
you're dealt but, you know, you can still talk about, you know,
the pocket aces that came up right after or whatever the case
may be. So no.
And you can say, like, you know, he went out in December and
that's fair point. It's like you have the rest of
the year as fair point but it's like it's still I think, Not the
people forget but it's like, it just has to be stated.
Like yeah, it happened on December 17th and there was a
lot of the rest of the season to figure it out but there's some
things at all. So you just you can't figure out
like it's like yeah, yeah, yeah it's look at you.
I mean any anybody that's an important basketball player that
goes down, it changes the trajectory of the season, I
mean, look at help Paul George. Broke his leg in the Pacers
still haven't recovered. That's fair.
I think. Get in there.
They're working on it man. So if I just talked about that
was the Pacers game us. Talk about that last night give
them some credit. I was like this is such a side
but like they don't get the Pacers don't get credit enough
for you know all of these guys want trades and everybody's
trading like you know a dollar for a bunch of draft picks and
beans. It's like the Pacers traded Paul
George heard, amata sabonis, and Victor Oladipo, they traded an
All-Star for two. Becoming All-Stars and then they
traded sabonis. They traded Oladipo for a couple
pieces, but he was that was a very odd situation.
They still got some stuff back and they trade us a bonus for
Halliburton. They traded to current All-Stars
for each other. Like, I don't know of any other
team in the NBA, that's done for trades where they're trading
All-Stars and getting all stars back.
That's very impressive. Absolutely, a young All-Star in
this. I'm with you, I'm with, ya know,
so it's all day, that's our next podcast.
There's not a lot of great that we can.
Maybe start a faceless podcast. Alright so coming soon on the
home network maybe of home field can get a MBA license you know
just Connor if you're listening some good Pacers this some great
at retro a be a pastry stuff. Anyway total diversion this is
where we did Galen to steer the ship and get it filled with real
real Scott in Back to the season, you do the film room you
look at things you know this is the question I have for this
season going. The next season.
It's I know you can't answer it but I'm just curious.
Like you look at the plays that are being called and great stuff
on the film room as best. You can tell from what you saw
from Woodson in the NBA which is albeit you know ten plus years
ago. Do you think Woodson's offense
these last two years was designed because he had traced
Jackson Davis and had to maximize his ability and then
next year Year, we're going to see a different offense, or do
you think this is what Woodson really wants to run in in
college again? I know you can't be like, I know
what, what's and wants. But I don't know if you see
anything when you're watching the film room.
Like if you see anything that helps, you answer that question.
Yeah, you know, I do think that this is something that that
Woodson, you know, catered because of Trace, Jackson, Davis
being his best play. I mean, he even said as much in
his postgame press conference, after think it was Miami, you
know. I said look, I've never had to
run an offense that was posed to oriented and you know, my best
players a point or a post player.
So I figured it out which I actually think as long as things
change moving forward that that's encouraging for Indiana
because with Archie Miller was like, look, we're going to run
the pack line defense. We're going to run blocker mover
offense and I don't care who my Personnel is and and you know
what seems like look? I'm going to adjust my offense,
based around my personnel and whom I play makers are And I
think that's encouraging. You know what I can say, from
what I can tell it, what, sins in be a background is, which I
also I also think is encouraging is he's going to run something
until you stop it. And then once you stop it, he's
just going to run the same thing, but it's just gonna be a
simple counter and then he's going to run that till you stop
it. Like, you know, with with Trace
Jackson Davis, like, you think about the Illinois game?
They weren't doubling trace, and they ran the exact same action.
Time After Time, After Time and Trace kept scoring.
And then they started A little bit and he ran a simple handoff
and then got a wide open 3 pointer.
Like so that's, that's something that I think comes from the NBA
background because those NBA guys, they'll run the same thing
until you prove that you can stop it.
And what's in certainly does that I also think what's his
background from the NBA, where you can tell that he's very
strong. His out of timeout Place.
Indiana is very good out of timeouts and they usually will
run like a wrinkled off of something that usually Ali, do
and usually get a bucket, you know, one of the better, they
call them, you know, atos one of the better ATO teams in the
country and so, you know, and then can you Hunter it was on a
Twitter space two days ago, I think.
And he said as much as well, he said look, our offense is going
to look completely different next year because, you know,
it's not going to be post oriented and that's exciting.
You know, I think if you're an Indiana fan, that's exciting.
It's been, it's been the better part of six, seven years.
Even go back to Joann Morgan kind of being a focal point of
the offense. It's been a while since we've
kind of seen what you would quote unquote, modern offense.
You know, I will say Indiana, their offense.
This year was a lot better in terms of spacing and in, you
know, not just planting to guys under the basket and there's no
opportunity for dribble drives. You know, I think Indiana was
better in that sense this year but, you know, overall, I'm
excited for what next season looks like, don't get me wrong,
love Tracy action. Davis.
Great player. You know, one of the all-time
greats, probably at Indiana but I'm excited to see what the team
looks like, without him, you know, not to not to play him
down by any means. Like I said, like great player,
but it's just exciting to see what a non-postal rain and
offense. Might look like I completely
agree and you hit on that where it's like, this is where it is
and I'll give you the opportunity to talk about, you
know, trace. And if you have a spot to place
him, like I'm I'm not sure I keep on saying, I'm not sure I'm
ready where to place him in, and it might be a couple of years
ago, where is he? And my hierarchy, but And again,
I'm not like, I've never been like a Mount Rushmore guy.
Here's my top four legs. He get a four spot.
Like it's to me, it's more of a Continuum.
And there's just like there's top-level guys, and there's not
like he's up there and I think it's a little bit unfair, when
you're not you, but when somebody's like, well he hasn't
you didn't win a Big Ten title and go to a final four.
It's like alright, well neither is Indiana, like I mean, we want
a couple, big tent sites, like we're not where we were in the
80s and 70s and and 90s like I did that we're sending.
Sunday's Knighthood kind of went around there like, you know,
we're not having that success. So just to be like, hey, after
four years of a, you know, bad regime under Archie, we want you
to take two years and get to a final part that's asking a lot,
but he had a lot of individual success and like it and he, he
stayed and he worked his butt off.
And he got as I talked about, with Ryan, the last pot, like,
he got so much better, which is amazing because he was so good,
like he was so efficient. So good, his junior year, and
This year, he came back with a whole set of skills and the stat
that I keep on going back to the Oscars, a kosterman pointed out
earlier, like that. He had a higher assist rate than
Yogi, Ferrell didn't 2016, which is just bananas.
But anyway, all of that said, you are right.
Like I'm also it was great seeing him.
It was awesome. Having him.
I enjoyed the experience with Trace.
I think that they can be mutually exclusive.
I'm also very excited to see us run a A more modern offense, but
I will leave it here. Just do you have any like, you
know, we're where are you and your head Spate?
What's with trace and where he fits into IU Legacy?
Similar to you where I think you know it might be a couple years
for you kind of look back and maybe appreciate what he
brought. But when I look at great
players, I look at you know the impact you have on winning and
that's not saying winning championships.
It's like how much better do you make your team and you take
Trisha X and Davis away from this team?
They'll pass for years and could be pretty ugly, I think.
And so, yes, did he That he take his team to the final four.
No. Did he win a Big Ten title?
No, but did he impact winning in a large way?
Yes, you know, that that Indiana Team without Trace.
Jackson Davis is not a ninja tournament team.
The last two seasons obviously. Yes, you know, is a bottom
dweller in the Big Ten. So, you know, you look at the
all-time greats of Indiana and there was a lot of pieces around
them to that helps them to those final fours.
And, you know, I think that has to be taken into consideration.
Of, who else did you play with you?
Did you play with other greats and things like that?
And and you know the big Ten's is different now too.
You know there's just it's a different animal in terms of
style and, you know, the trace Jackson Davis got beat up every
single night. Every single night, he was, you
know, he was in the post, playing Seven Footers and was an
extremely efficient player. As you mentioned, highest rate,
high block rate You know, ended up like I didn't used to think
back when Trace was a sophomore junior in high school and I was
coaching against him that he was at athletic, you know, he was
kind of a giraffe on roller skates, like I've a guy vividly,
remember we had a big at Southport that ended up playing
Juco and we played against race and, you know, we were isolating
Trace because he just struggled to stay in front and, you know,
obviously it's now seven, eight years later from that.
But He turned into an athlete. I mean, I'm Mega athlete and
that's, you know, he's he's going to get drafted based on.
Obviously, he has basketball skill but that athleticism he's
gonna be able to run the floor. He's going to be able to be in
ball screens. You can be able to catch lobs.
Like those are the things NBA teams are going to be looking at
for him to contribute to their squad.
And, you know, that's a testament to trace.
Like he had talent but he put the work in.
And as you mentioned, got better and better.
And better each and every year and, you know, as a basketball
purist like you just got Appreciate a kid that's going to
put that work in. When he don't want to say, you
didn't have to. But you know, he obviously
wanted to get better it when it's the key.
There is a you saying, you know, imagine this team without him
and this is kind of like a, you know, not getting political.
But in politics, it's always the talk about how, like, you, you
never get credit for the, the crisis that you averted, like,
you know, the the, the, the, the financial crisis that doesn't
happen nobody's like, oh my gosh, you saved us because
nobody knew what was going to happen.
Open and so you don't get credit for that and in a weird way,
you're kind of here with Trace where it's like, you know, him
taking this team to a double by in the Big Ten tournament and
getting us this you know to the second game in the tournament.
It's like that. That's a lot for where he
drugged, you beat Purdue twice. And like like we just talked
about, you know, how important Xavier Johnson was to this team,
go back and think that like, you know, we lost Iowa by 2.
We lost in Northwestern by three points, in two games.
You know, you have a hard time saying if Xavier is healthy the
entire season, if you know, I know if ifs and buts like you
can't just take all the wins. But like, does he swing those
three games maybe? And if he does, we're 15 and 5.
And we co share the Big Ten title with Purdue.
It's like, there you go. Trace has like Xavier breaking,
his foot had nothing to do with Trace Jackson Davis, and it's
like, you all you do is change that.
And again, I'm giving us three wins.
And who knows? But like that, that That change
had nothing to do with with Trey.
So I'm I'm with you. It's but it is an odd Legacy and
it's just unfortunately you know an Indiana there's so much
history of winning that you know gets it's just there but he he
definitely had a fantastic career and it he's up there.
It's like that's all I keep on saying it's like he is up on
that list of IU, great players. And what do you start talking?
Like the best players in the 21st century.
Or the last 2000 in this Century in the last 20 years.
We're in the 22nd century. Now I was screwed that up.
Thanks 21st, right? I 21st, yeah, I think since 22
2008 he's he's up there. What do you have like, you know,
Yogi and him or you know some of the dudes from the Zeller
Oladipo team? It's like and, you know, he's up
there and like that's, that's truly something.
So yeah, we have that, you know, as we look at the offseason now,
we talked about the offense. Since you know what?
I think. We both want to see a different
offense. We hope that comes out.
What are you hoping to see out of the portal?
I'm again I don't want to get granular and like, I don't, we
don't need to talk about like this guy that guy like there's a
lot of targets and it's all going to be a very fluid moving
base. And I think it's, it's fun.
It's exciting. I also don't we don't need to
start getting into like, you know, every single guy in the
poor because not we're not going to give it.
What are you looking to see us do at kind of a high level of
the port? If you have certain guys, you do
want to talk about, go for it, too.
Sure, yeah. Think you know you look at what
wins in March, you certainly want to build your team around
that, but you also have to look at.
How do you get to March? Which means grinding through the
Big Ten and you have to build your team around that as well.
And those things are like opposed, unfortunately, in the
Big Ten it and I think we saw that in the commit Indiana
picked up yesterday from Peyton Sparks, like probably not a guy
that through March You're Gonna Want to run your offense or
anything of that sort, you know, he's a back to the basket post
player but he 69 250 pounds and he's a guy that's going to be
frontcourt depth that you can throw out there in the Big Ten
and he can hold his own. And that's I just, I want to
interrupt real quick. Just this is not towards you.
But just I saw some people on Twitter.
I listened to the assembly call, emergency pod and they had
people like chiming it and I get it.
I'm a fan but it's like it is this funny thing where it's like
we get Peyton Sparks and people are meet like do we need
shooting? We need a guy who can do this
because that's like you understand.
Like we're not going to get our first Sky in the portal.
Who does everything you want like that doesn't exist like
we're not getting Kevin Durant in the portal like like not
everyone's going to people with real find a flaw.
Yeah like we need more shooting it's like all right well I think
we're going to get more people like I don't think Woodson's
like right. Peyton Sparks.
I'll see you guys in October. Like I'm done.
Yeah. It's like it is and I get it.
Like, I get where fans are coming.
It's just funny. Everyone's like immediately
saying everything we need, and it's like, all right, like this
is one dude. Likes were there anyway.
Go ahead. Sorry Justin yeah.
Baby laughs yesterday. Yeah, you know, I think I think
there's certainly just like the 30 years of mediocrity of
Indiana is wearing on this fan base.
If you haven't seen that on kidding through Twitter and
message boards and all that good stuff.
But yeah. So you like I said, do you, you
have to build a team to get to March because I think Michigan
truly has a team that can win in March, but they don't have a
team that can win the Big Ten and so they didn't even get to
March and May Coach that can win either or to be determined.
And so, I think, you know, you see that frontcourt depth with
the guy like Peyton Sparks, but obviously you need Dynamic
guards that can then play on both ends, you know, you see
that in the Miami is the same Diego, State's the fa use and,
you know, then even going back to like last season, where is
more of a Blueblood final four than this year, where it's kind
of All over the place, Dynamic guard play wins Wings a wing
that can score. But, you know, I think that's
something that Indiana really lacked this year.
I, you know, I got a lot of nice things to say about Miller cop,
you know, in the role that he played and stepped in and you
know, was far better on the defensive end than I think
anybody probably even gives him credit for just by positioning
himself properly. Obviously a student of the game,
you know, he noted on his Twitter thread, he wrote the
other day like he got his report was so heavy but I digress, you
know, Indiana needs a real quick on that.
What did you glean from his T of like, and I haven't read the
whole thing, he had like it, you know, 100 comment, Twitter,
thread, like a bunch of points. What did you glean from that is
if you teach, is there anything that you took away from my God
it's really interesting or like you read anything to anything
that he tweeted out with that thread, My overall thought was
really just kind of like this kid gets it, you know?
Like he's smart. He gets it.
He understands the game very well.
Obviously, he took it seriously. SLI like very, very seriously.
You know, talked about prepping his body for games stretching,
mentally, you know, talked about scouting reports and things like
that. So you know, I walked away from
it like this, the kid really gets it and I say, kid, he's
like five years younger than me, this this.
Yeah, but he, you know, he understood and Max, I think
maximized his ability, like, just, like I said, in terms of
body prep, Scouting Report, you know?
Up shots, whatever the case may be, you know, he he maximized
his ability which, you know, is everything you can ask for in a
player. And yeah, well, you know, with
that said, I would prefer a more Dynamic Wing that can score the
basketball and put some stress on defense.
You know, and I use recruiting that I think, you know, in like
a LED l'm, who's got a visit scheduled for next week, I
think, I think, I think Dead period starts today so all the
The coaches go to the Houston and so they they don't allow in
person recruiting. So I think it's like the six.
There's something I'm not bad but you know, he's a guy that
averaged 18 points per game in ivy league and you know, the ivy
league is people are seeing these Mass Exodus like what's
going on the ivy league? They don't allow grad student or
like, grad, fifth year, basically writers.
And so that's why you're seeing this, you know, plethora of
these really solid players coming out of the ivy league in
the portal, but You know, Indiana and then you want a
modern five. I think meaning guy that can go
sit, ball screens, catch Labs, protect the rim, things like
that, and they think they're recruiting that also in the kid
out of Virginia, you know, they had a, they had a, what's
called, Zoom meeting with him yesterday.
And so, you know, there that's kind of what I want to see.
So, you know, Indiana's recruiting the guys to play a
modern style of basketball, and then obviously, you know, the
news came out Last night about a possibly kicking the tires on
Caleb love. That would be a dynamic
backcourt. But man, there I can see the
Twitter tweet tweets now on Xavier Johnson.
Caleb love back court. There would be you know it would
be interesting to say the least but you know, Caleb loves the
guy that took his team to the final four last season and then
he, you know, kind of was the reason.
This team was the NIT this year. So, you know, a polarizing
subject and I know you mentioned like not Really getting specific
on guys. Just kind of spit balling on
like who Indiana's going after I like the type of player that
they're going after because those are the guys that went in
March. And then, you know, you got the
Peyton Sparks that can kind of help you compete in the Big 10.
You've got Malik renew, obviously who's a bigger build
can compete in the Big Ten, but does play a little bit more
modern style than then tracing and can stretch the floor, you
know, showcase that he'll shoot, two, three a little bit this
season and some pick and pop action.
So you know, all that said I like what Indiana's attempting
to do in the portal But as you mentioned, there are other teams
going for these players. And, you know, till when these
recruitments of players that are ranked in the top 10 of portal
players across, you know, every Outlet you look at, you know it
those are not easy recruitments to win.
But then Deanna's in the game right now with a lot of what
these top guys and you know, with the we should be thankful
for this portal because without it, you know, Indiana's roster
could look a little Bleak next to you.
But, you know, I like where they're at currently and I'm
optimistic but I'm with you on all of that.
I also look at this portal year as like to me, this is really
important for Woodson to show. He can nail it because for two
reasons, one like this is the way basketball is going to be.
I personally think it's good. I think it's good that you know
the students have the freedom to move and to get more money other
place. I think that's great.
But the idea of like, you know, well Just yeah, we got to deal
with portal this year. It's been a bunch of kids leaves
like no, I think this is going like this is every year.
Like I think some older I you fans than me or probably a deal
with a guy, is the one year off. Then we go back to, you know,
getting kids from Indiana for years like no, I need like to me
it's important, Woodson shows he can nail this year because he's
going to have to do this every year.
Like, this is going, this is the way college basketball is going.
But I also think this year is important because I just, as
I've mentioned before, I think that Woodson has the most kind
of Advantages going into this offseason that he may ever have
in that. He's just coming off a
successful. I mean, you're a protected seed,
you want to turn him again? Yeah, we didn't go to a sweet 16
or a final four but we didn't flame out.
We won two big games against Purdue.
Like we had some nice signature wins.
You just took two dudes who were, you know, Trace Jackson
Davis was not on the draft radar in jail, huh?
Chaffee. No was around there.
You now have them put your fee nose like near the lottery and
Trace checks Davis is a projected you know, late first
round pick. That's a huge move for two
dudes. In one year.
You also have you no good at I owe money behind you but you
also have three starting spots you know if we if we assume you
know, Xavier Johnson and leak renew or back and those are our
starters. You know there may be four
starting spots, who knows? But you at least have three
spots available and they betray Galley takes one, you have to.
But like you have open minutes available like I look at.
This is like this is probably the best you're going to have
all Those things that are Advantage Plus, that's not to
mention, you know, what's at some point?
We're going to get to a point where Woodson's age will become
a factor in the number of years left on his contract, like those
things matter, because everyone's looking three to four
years out, you know, what's it going to be like in 3 to 4
years? If I do come here for and maybe
now it's moving more to 23. But you know, that's that's
going to be a factor every year more than it is this year.
So I look at this year as like Woodson's got all the cards in
his hand, to your Your point, he's got, he's got pocket aces.
Like this will be the best hand. He has to play, probably over
the next couple of years, the transfer portal.
So he's gotta show, he could do it because if he can't hit the
portal correctly. Now I am very concerned because
getting the portal, right? Is as important as recruiting,
maybe even more as we go forward in college basketball.
Yep. I totally agree.
And I think to what I like about what Indiana is doing in the
portal right now is You know, it doesn't necessarily have to be
the top dog in the portal that you go, get.
You get guys that fit what you want to do.
And, you know, it because I think you look at Illinois, last
year, you know, they get Terrance Shannon, they get
Matthew mayor, they and then they've got sky Clark coming in.
It was pretty real five-star and weren't very good at this.
You know, scar Kings of leaving, Shannon, and mayor don't really
seem like they fit and, you know, they 100% hit the portal
out of the park. On paper but you got to get guys
that fit what you want to do and I think that's what we're seeing
with Indiana, you know. They want to play a more modern
style of basketball. They want to have Dynamic
Playmakers, I can play on both sides and they want somebody
that can protect the rim, ideally, you know, and that's in
that Shedrick kid from Virginia. So I'm excited about what
they're doing and like you said, you know, there's there's a lot
of time left to get these things done and, you know, Indiana
could strike out and then you've got Concerns about you know,
what they can do in the portal moving forward.
And you've also just got some concerns about what next season
may look like. What?
And the other thing that I like is and let's just be frank and
we'll talk facts here where I you fans.
But, you know, there are some stuff early on in Woodson's tend
to he's treating this offseason differently.
I'll just say that. Like, you know, as I always
mention, I have friends on the street who were other fans of
Big Ten teams but like my buddy, Robert who's a Michigan State
grad, like He was giving me grief last year because, you
know, Michigan State's getting Xavier Booker.
And he's like last year. He's like, why is it Mike
Woodson? The Indiana State title game,
and it's like, what's an wasn't there?
And it's like, there was a feel of like, you know, is he on Vic?
I don't know where it key wasn't there and Hampton celebrate his
birthday? I believe.
Right? And you know again we're all
fans here but it's like this is there did seem to feel, I'll
just speak my mind here that it felt like, you know, Woodson
came down and he's He wants to win, he's trying, but it did
feel like maybe he came down and kind of that Steve Spurrier mode
of like, all right, you know, college is little bit easier in
the pros and I can take some breaks, and it feels like now he
understands like, oh no, this is a grind.
This is probably more work in the NBA and like, I, this is
this period is almost as important as ever get like,
there really is? No massive offseason, maybe it's
like June July, or you can take your break in the Hamptons but
like there were some stuff early on where it's like, why is he
not at the Indiana State title game even if he's just there to
kiss ass and talk to coaches? Keep you can't be the coach
Indiana basketball and not be at the Indiana, High School title
game. Just like that's, that's a kind
of a pretty big deal to be there either.
You're not going to get Xavier Booker, just be there talk to
his coach because his coach might have another kid.
Like we had a kid Kokomo in 2024 is really good.
Like anyway it felt like there was a bit of you know,
laissez-faire attitude towards some of this which does feel
like this off season has changed.
When you see Woodson, his entire staff, they're all over the
place. Now, they are all over the
portal. They're doing all of these
visits and to me that's encouraging that it feels like
he's there. The staff is really active and
engaged and going at this with everything they have it may not
work but at least it feels like they are giving Full Throttle
for a bunch of different people. Yeah I think I think the Of
anything I do think this offseason is a bit different in
the sense of you know Mike Watson didn't want.
They were Booker you know just flat-out didn't want them from
everything I've heard. Yeah.
And didn't you know didn't didn't see kind of the bigger
picture of like what attending that State title game probably
looks like in the Optics of it you know he's just like I don't
want anybody there. I'm not going.
Which I get, but it's like your point, like, it's the Optics of
like, just, yeah, there because all the coach me, your
basketball coaching Indiana. Like, most of the coaches go to
that game or they know who's there and it's just like,
sometimes you just need to be seen.
Like just like, you know, he might go ahead.
Yeah, no, I think I think it's fair point.
I think you know, I think we're in agreement that it was a miss
and and not attending you know. And then with the portal stuff
last year, Indiana didn't really want anybody the portal.
They thought they had everybody coming back.
They had their Coming freshman class, that was really strong.
You know, I think they had they hosted two guys on visits in
Dexter. Dennis and the McNeil McNeil or
something kid that went to Ohio State.
And so I think last year, to this year, there are some
variances and just in terms of needs, and I do think that's
somewhat of why you see this different point of attack as
well. From what sitting company is
just based on the team makeup, but I'm encouraged by
everything. We're seeing with what in
they're doing. You know, they've been on the
plane now and gone to I think three and home visits with
portal prospects, you know, they've got a they've gotten
Sparks to commit, you know, they're in the game with these
big-time recruits in there. They're doing what they need to
do to be able to you know at least be in the conversation and
that's what's important for me or your head man.
You know, and I do think it's a learning curve, like you
mentioned like yeah, it's college basketball.
Coaching is hard and it's a Right.
And, you know, I think it's it's why.
If a head coach can jump up to that NBA level, they do because
it's it's easy. It's well, it's more money one,
it is easier from a standpoint of, like, you got an offseason,
you know, it's obviously harder because you're managing a lot of
Egos and, you know, it's a business for sure.
So I don't want to say, it's easier, but when terms of time
commitment, I do think that college is 365 days a year
pretty much, you know, you got to be on the phones.
Even if you're on vacation, you got to be texting kids and like
I'm like, what's in 64, 65 years old.
Does he really want to go chase around some 16 year old?
And you know see how their day is going?
Just to say, did it. Yeah.
When he he's probably like I really don't care what's going
on with this kid right now but yeah, I think it's a steep
learning curve. I think he's learned learning it
quickly and I think you know, I have no qualms about what he
doing in the recruiting cycle right now at all and I think,
you know, he's got us in the game for a while.
Top 2024's as well. Now, we strike out on all of
them, you know, we may be having a different conversation, but as
of right now, I'm satisfied with where Indiana, you know, is in
standing with transfer portal and, you know, 2024 targets.
Yeah. And, you know what's also I
think I'm assuming this is the idea.
This is important. But like, you know, Galen got me
into the, the Reddit college basketball thread is really
good. It's kind of, it's a little
less, obviously, it's not IU Centric, but it's nice to kind
of get, it's a relatively sane discourse.
I would say, but you're getting people who are obviously not
just Indiana basketball. Fans are out there, it does feel
like and again, you know, I hate to say this but it's just we've
we've not been so relevant that At little winds have to be
thought of as important because we can't just go from zero to
final four. But, you know, I think it's
interesting that you know, Caleb love goes on the market.
He's obviously a very high-profile portal guy.
You know, 45 years ago, assuming pretend the portal was there,
like it, Kayla blood type portal guy.
I don't think Indiana would have been in the conversation but you
go on the Reddit thread. Again it's just that that thread
but it's like there's are non Indiana people on that thread
who are like the top two scorers like Memphis Indiana, like you
see Indiana's like listed all the So it's like there's even if
we don't get them it's like there's a lot of smoke there.
And again, not getting guys isn't great, but the fact that
we're kind of, it feels like we're in the conversation for
every high level portal guy. That's not nothing, right?
Absolutely. And you know, I think I think a
big part of a pitch for my you to is you're putting on National
Television every night, you know, I know it's Big Ten in
general but like if you're playing the Big 12 you're
playing like Half your games on ESPN plus right now or, you
know, a cc Plus or whatever. The case may be so Indiana,
obviously has a lot to sell, you know, and then a great and I
owe. You know, you've got NBA level
coach like you mentioned, that is just kind of improved.
Two players stocks to go make a lot of money.
Like there's like, if I'm Caleb love and I see what Mike Woodson
did was save your Johnson last season and then what he's done
with Jalen hitch Vino and and then, you know, traces in the
same position but I'm Going, how does this guy helped me get to
that next level? And you know he's got a proven
track record of a being able to to coach at the highest level
and knows exactly what it takes to get there and then he's got a
track record now of getting the guys there.
And so that's that's a lot to sell in my opinion.
I think it's why you see Indiana is in the mix for pretty much
everybody that they want you know, which is good to see.
Yeah, no, and I think it's it. Also, I think there is it does
help in the portal also because you know, there is a scarcity
issue to like this was always, you know, with Tom crean.
It felt like he was just offering everybody and just like
was kind of like if you were a top 20 recruit you got an offer
for my you but it didn't feel like anybody it at that time, it
always felt like I they were using.
I you as a leverage chip to go somewhere else, there is a field
now, we'll see how it plays out, but it does feel like you know,
some of these you know, like you look at like you We've been
talking Jameson battle a lot, and, you know, it's me, it's
like I think part of the pitch to is like, hey man, like Caleb
love because a lot of other dudes, like if you want it, go
for it. If not like this spot, you have
may not be available in two weeks and that scarcity.
It's kind of. It feels like it's shifting
where people aren't using us to leverage a better spot to go to
UNC or Kansas. It does feel like we got a lot
of top-level guys that we're talking to and it's like to the
to the players like hey, Man, like you got to kind of make up
your mind because, you know, if you sit on your feet, you kick,
you kick it around too long. You may not have that spot at
for us anymore, and I think that's a nicer place to be than
where we've been in the past, a hundred percent and Yeah, I've
uh I've kind of been talking with some friends about like how
does that process work? Like you know your curtain LED
them in battle and they're the same same position you.
Obviously only want to take one, do you tell them like first one
to commit gets it? Or are you slow playing it like
that that part of it is is a nice problem to have but I do.
I'm intrigued on how that works. We do you've got so many you
know, kind of Hats in the ring. Yeah.
No. It's it would be really
interesting to talk to some like, to talk.
I'm with you, like talk to a coach who's legitimately gone
through that and like how you play it because I I would assume
if you're I you you probably have like you have one that you
like a little bit better. Like the I think this would be
the guy who's our real fit and then you probably play it as
such but yeah that I'm with you then be really interesting to
like deep dive. You know how that works and you
how You schedule the visits at all that, but it does feel like
we're more in the driver seat, this offseason.
It's been in quite a while. Yeah, for sure.
Okay. Because with high school
recruiting, you know, it's a longer process and so you know,
you've got more time to figure all that out, but this is such a
condensed process that like you know, if you're trying to get
four five new players on your team but you've got 15, you
know, kind of offers out there two guys.
It's just yeah I'm very intrigued on how that all plays
itself out and you know what the communication looks like with
the guy. Might be you know one be instead
of one a on your Laura you're more plugged into this than I
am. I'm curious if you have any
insight on this like it seems to be in college football.
It feels like most of the top guys.
They already know where they're going before they even announced
in the portal think you'll see this like, hey, I'm on the
portal. Hey, I'm at you see USC like
within 10 minutes. Like wow, that was as a quick
decision like it does feel like most of the top guys in
football. It's like the portal Ting
happens before the portal opens and like by the time, you know,
they're available the only tea it's like Indiana in football
were kind of like always like oh, hey like we did realize
everyone's already got a pick like let's figure out who we
got. It feels like it's not that way
in basketball. Is that true or do you it feels
like most of these top guys have not already made their decision
when they open up their portal recruitment.
It is a is that true and B. Do you have any idea why it's
different than football and basketball.
I think it's true to an extent. So I think I think you know,
there's certainly some back-channeling going on, you
know. Yeah, starting in like January
of staff's trying to get feels from AAU coaches or whatever the
case may be of like with this guy into the portal and then you
know, the staff talking. Is this?
A guy we'd want to go after if he enters, you know, I've got a
connection here to his, a, you coach, whatever the case may be.
So there's certainly some back-channeling going on, but I
don't think there's too many that have their mind made up
when they portal. I think that, you know, they've
got a fairly select list and then, you know, Maybe somebody
comes out of the blue of like a blue blood or something.
Like we want that guy and then all of a sudden it just changes
the game but I think it's some of it is that, you know, it's
just the basketball team. The rosters are so small.
And so, you know, teams don't know what's going to happen or
who's entering the portals. You know, you might need half
your new team, you might need 20 new players, like I you did last
year. So I think that's why it's not
as cut and dry as you may see him football.
But you know, I Like I think David Johnson was an example.
He knew he was coming Indiana as soon as using the portal.
I think he was at IU commit very soon after because he had a
relationship with Kenya. So certainly some
back-channeling going on but I do agree with you.
That it's not at like football where it's like like David
Jackson, he entered the portal and he was an eye.
You commit like the next day. Yeah.
And so yeah, certainly some some conversations going on before
the portal actually exist. But yeah, as always college
football is dirtier than any of the other.
Sport like no matter how like CD you think college basketball,
might be it feels like college football is always like hold my
beer mode for college football. Oh yeah, 100% and Indiana.
Football is always not good at it.
So let's kind of wrap up on this.
Like, what are your, what are your thoughts?
I hate expectations but it's just the only word I can.
I can use it. What are your expectations for
next year in both? You know, how the team looks the
offense. We run?
Kind of, you know, how you how you would see the season going.
I'm encouraged, you know, obviously, we don't know what
the roster looks like quite yet, but I've got an idea of what are
you at least once the roster to look like?
And, you know, it with that said it has me encouraged about what
they'll look like. You know they'll be they'll be
more athletic and they'll be deeper which is encouraging to
me like you know, on paper but you know in in terms of what
they're look going after in the portal these are always deep in
October and then we get to March.
It's like nobody could play but you're right.
These are guys do that like everybody that recruiting the
portal which as you mentioned know, they're going to be
possibly three starters and then you know, sixth or seventh man
that they're going to get out of the portal.
Everybody they're recruiting now again they've got to land some
of these guys but everybody that recruiting has been productive
at the college level already and to me that's important because
you know, Tamar Bates, lot of potential.
No production. Join Geronimo, a lot of
potential minimal production. Logan dunk them never saw him
play you know so and then Malik renew freshman you know.
So these guys that you kind of expect to be really really
solid. It was kind of based on
potential last year in terms of depth.
Well now this year you're looking a guys hopefully that
have been productive at the college level already and to me
that that means something, you know, granted it's not at the
Big Ten level For some of these guys.
But so yeah, so I think Indiana on paper should have a deeper
team than what we've seen. They'll be more athletic and
then all offensively, you know, just a better flow, you know, in
terms of more ball screens, the floor opened up.
Hopefully you're still going to see the ball thrown in the post.
Malik renews a very good post player.
You know, he can score with both hands, he's got good feet and I
think you're going to see him make a big jump next season, as
long as he can stay on the floor and Terms of foul trouble.
I think you're going to see him make a big jump.
You know, Xavier Johnson is a Difference Maker, he can run the
floor, he can run a ball you know as what he says run a
ballclub and you know would expect him at 22, 23, 24 years
old, next season can help kind of be the driving force of
Indiana, kind of turning that corner on top in terms of
toughness and I know that's an intangible and I know it's a
buzz word that gets thrown around a lot.
But you know, I feel I feel like Indiana against Miami just kind
of got out. Just you know those guys were
going after every loose ball. They just you know Indiana
didn't look to be in the same ballpark just in terms of that
intangible and again I know it's a buzzword and it's it's what
you see is not necessarily the big picture but I'm excited.
You know, it's March 30th, it has been out of the tournament.
Now a couple weeks and I'm still excited about Indiana
basketball. I think that means something.
There's been many years were by March 30th at Mike.
I don't want to talk about Indiana, basketball.
Like I'm apathetic about it, like that's not where I'm at
currently. So to me that's a sign of
encouragement. Yeah, I mean, and I think we've
talked about on this pot and I've heard it a couple other
places, but it is really worth noting.
When you talk about the portal is just how, how transferable
those numbers are for portal guys, compared to, you know,
freshman? So you look at, you know, Malik
renew his fresh, his senior year at Mount Verde the average of no
11.9, 12 points a game basically and He averaged with the rebound
stats like he was like 12 and 6, basically his senior year, you
know, his freshman year, he did not average that here, he had a
good year, but he definitely had a freshman year.
You look at someone like Xavier Johnson, he pulled his stats
like is last year Pittsburgh. He had an offensive rating of
105, average, you know, effective field, goal, shooting
percentage of 49 point to his first year at Indiana has a, you
know, offensive rating of 102 and effective field goal
shooting Eating a 40 46.1, you know, picking random stats here.
But it's like what he did at Pittsburgh.
Was very transferable what he did in Indiana in high school to
college. You can't really transfer that.
And so you look at a guy like, you know, I'm pulling up a
Jameson battle here, get not saying he's what we have to get
or not, but just a guy I know we're going after pretty hard,
you know, this is a guy who you know is averaging, you know,
he's putting up, you know, 12 14 points a game and you know is
offensive ratings, not off. It's 88.9 eat.
But like, you know, you're going to get that.
He had a really bad year last year, but he's every other year
at Minnesota, and George Washington.
He had an offensive rating over 100, you know, effective field
goal, percentages of over 55%, you assume you're going to get
something very similar to that. Because, you know, I think what
is often forgotten is that? Yes.
Battles in a unique spot because he's going for big tend to Big
Ten, but, you know, Caleb Sparks he's going from, you know, Max
cool. To a Big Ten school.
He's got a deal with a higher level of competition in the Big
Ten, but he still played against D1 opponents for a year or two.
He's already made the transition from high school to college,
which is we've all done. It is a huge transition.
You're living on your own. You have a lot more freedom, you
know, suddenly all the competition is really good, and
that's a huge most. Guys are not Jalen Hood Fein or
they just come in and they're plug and play and even jail,
Hood Shafi, know, you saw some some, you know, he had some ups
and downs as freshman year so that's I'm encouraged having so
many portal guys. Coming in is like, I think you
can plug and play a lot of those numbers in.
Whereas like you said it was kind of like, all right,
tomorrow, Bates, can't he make the jumper like, you know, how
does his 15 points a game in high school really translate to
the to Big Ten? It's like, I don't know, whereas
I think a lot of the other guys, we really can put that in a lot
of, you know, they're not dealing with all your stuff.
They're just dealing with a couple of things like a new
system and in the Big Ten. So I am also encouraged and it
seems like we're getting We're going after a lot of the guys,
we want to get in the portal and hopefully we get some of them
and we'll see. But I'm with you excited last
thing. Like what is your expectation
for next year as a season? Like what's a, what's a good
season for you? I want to make second weekend,
you know, it's been a while, you know, second weekend, you know,
I think similar to what we saw this season.
Like if you can be a top 25 team for the most of the most of the
year and get be protected to seed and then hopefully get a
better matchup and The NCAA tournament.
But you know what? I want to see really is turn the
corner. In terms of not having a team
that is solely built for Big, Ten basketball and having a team
that's built for where College basketball's going on the
greater landscape. You know, I think that the Big
10 is, is falling into a rut, a bit based on building teams for
Big, Ten play and then you get to March and there's not even a
you know Michigan State's you're so sweet 16 Squad you know I
also think the Big Ten beats up on each other so much that it's
not like these Big Ten teams outside of Purdue being the
biggest upset ever. We're being upset, you know,
they're all six seven, eight nine seeds losing in the second
round, you know, or you know, Indiana losing to a five seed,
like it the Big Ten, it wasn't like there was a bunch of ones
into seeds that were getting upset.
They beat a point there and they're all kind of Middle Road
tournament chips when that happens.
So, you know, that's, that's getting off my soapbox a little
bit. Now, da Butt.
Ted, make sweet 16 and I'm happy.
That's a, those are high. I love it, man.
It's good. Those are high aspirations.
I think, I think you to me it's like I'm a little bit lower.
I just think you got to make a tournament, you know, and just
get in hopefully, you know, out of the play and range be in the,
you know, 89 range for me is like that would be as I sit
here. Now, on March 30th that to me
would be like you just, you have to make the tournament.
You can't start having these ups and downs, like you've got to
figure out a way to flatten the Curve.
So speak to go back to what we talked about earlier covid day.
So anyway two weeks - curve Baby by the curve baby.
Yeah let's go back to that just do masks but flatten the curve
Tony good stuff. You can catch him on the the
film room. Appreciate you.
Have it on having you on and we'll definitely have you on as
we roll into the beginning of the Season.
We see what's going on the transfer portal portal, but
thank you guys all look forward to what's going on the portal
and hopefully in a couple of weeks.
We'll know a little bit more about what this team looks like
and maybe we can do a deeper dive into that that roster
because again I think some of those stats will be
transferable. We can get a pretty good feel
for what we might be looking at next year with the Hoosiers.
Anyway for Tony, this is Scott signing off.