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You're listening to the Back 
Home Network presented by Home 

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Field Apparel. 
Welcome back to Crimson Cast, 

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GAIL and Clavio Scott Caulfield 
joining you. 

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It is still Sunday, December 
1st. 

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If you haven't listened to our 
football recap show, go do that.

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It's that's more fun. 
It's a that's a that was a 

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joyful podcast. 
We went for over an hour, talked

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about IU bashing Purdue's train 
in there and winning 66 to 

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nothing. 
What we should do, we should 

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just we should compile all the 
stats in every podcast from here

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of the next year. 
Just tell a fun stat from that 

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game. 
Even if we're doing a podcast 

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about like NIL collectives, it's
like, hey, but did you know 

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Purdue only had two first downs,
which is just. 

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Anyway, I like where your 
thoughts are on this. 

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This is good. 
So anyway, we are now here to 

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talk basketball and you know, 
we've we've not done an official

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basketball podcast yet this 
year. 

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We're very yeah, this is and 
this we were planning on 

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podcasting prior to Atlantis on 
men's basketball. 

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We didn't the schedules didn't 
work out. 

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The holidays are always a little
bit tough with family. 

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And then Atlantis happened. 
So now I'm going to start off 

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like right at the beginning by 
acknowledging this looks like 

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we're jumping in and now talking
about a situation that's gone 

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bad. 
And that has not been the 

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intention. 
It's been more like what is the 

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inflection point to start 
talking about this team this 

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year and where things are AT. 
And so that's. 

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We both did previews with Alex 
Bozich. 

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So maybe, maybe he's like the 
connector point. 

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We both did our previews. 
It it literally was. 

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We both have busy schedules. 
Alex Bozich the the Michael 

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McDonald of the the pot, the IU 
podcast scene here. 

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Like he works with everybody. 
And so yeah, I see all of our 

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thoughts were there 
individually, but we need to 

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start doing basketball more 
regularly because that's part of

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what we do here. 
And so we're going to talk about

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where the team's at, kind of 
what the expectations were and 

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and where things are trending. 
I did AVIP subscriber only video

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on this couple of days ago. 
I'll, I'll probably be treading 

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over some similar ground. 
So I apologize to those of you 

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who have heard that already. 
We've got some different aspects

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and different angles though. 
But first, before we dive into 

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that, just a reminder, we are 
brought to you by Home Field 

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Apparel. 
Your place to go for the finest 

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in college fashions, the softest
fabric, the coolest designs. 

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You know, the we've been talking
so much about football stuff 

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with home field, but basketball 
has always been like right 

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there. 
If if football's the bread, 

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basketball's the butter for home
field apparel. 

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I don't know if that coat 
totally worked, Scott, but I'm 

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going to go with it. 
And I think basketball's the 

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Turkey, football's the gravy. 
Perhaps that's that great 

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basketball for Indiana. 
They have the shooting shirt 

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like the they wear. 
I mean, unfortunately O'Connor 

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was going to do the three win 
Atlanta shirt, but that that 

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didn't come to pass. 
But no, they have they have 

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great basketball stuff. 
And I'm with you. 

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It's it's some great vintage 
like shooting shirts and a lot 

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of the basketball shooting 
shirts are awesome. 

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Yeah, it's it's just a 
cornucopia of awesome things 

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and, and what I. 
I love the most very seasonal 

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cornucopia. 
What I also like is the amount 

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of small school shirts that they
have for college basketball. 

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You know, I mean, I, I one of my
favorite shirts still is the 

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heavyweight Fairleigh Dickinson 
tee that I got in honor of them 

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beating. 
Did you know that they beat 

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Purdue in a 116 matchup in the 
NCAA Tournament, Scott? 

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Is this the same Purdue that 
lost 66 Nothing in the bucket 

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game It's. 
The same school, yes, it's the 

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same school that that that 
school produced both a 116 loss 

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as the one seed and lost 66 
nothing in the bucket game. 

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You're absolutely right, yes, 
so, but there's there's so many 

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good options. 
To choose. 

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It's a horn of plenty of Purdue.
Lost plenty. 

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It's extra pie. 
It's just. 

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And that pie is Purdue losing. 
How did how did this get into 

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the home field read? 
I'm not entirely sure, but the 

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point is whether you're looking 
for IU apparel, whether you're 

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looking for small town college 
basketball apparel, home fields 

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got you covered. 
Head over there. 

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the ever expanding variety of 
things that they have available 

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for purchase. 
Again, home field apparel.com go

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check them out. 
Follow them on social. 

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They do a great job on 
Instagram, great job on X and 

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I'm sure they're on blue sky. 
Everybody is now over the last 

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couple of weeks. 
So also just a reminder, we're 

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on Substack. 
If you were in our Substack 

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00:04:35,920 --> 00:04:39,080
mailing list, you you're 
probably watching this video 

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right below the football video 
because I will have sent both 

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of. 
These out at essentially the 

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same time you can get podcasts 
delivered right to your inbox. 

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You get access to the video 
files as well as what we do in 

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terms of our audio stuff. 
So go to 

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crimsoncast.substack.com, 
subscribe, it's free. 

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Join the over 1100 people now 
that have subscribed. 

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There is also a pay option if 
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support the podcast, help keep 
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It's $5.00 a month, $50 a year. 
We'd love to have you in that 

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tribe as well. 
So again, 

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crimsoncast.substack.com, go 
check it out. 

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All right, Scott, well, let's 
dive into this. 

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One of the reasons we hadn't 
done basketball podcasts up to 

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this point is, frankly, we've 
had so much fun with football, 

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right? 
And there's been so much content

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to cover. 
This is one of those things 

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where in the past we always made
this transition point. 

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It was generally a a resigned, 
often times wistful transition 

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point in late October when our 
football season is essentially 

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dead and we realize, OK, now 
it's time to turn our attention 

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to basketball. 
And that hasn't happened this 

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year. 
Obviously, football continues to

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provide us with great moments 
over and over again. 

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We did, you know, 3 or 4 
podcasts about football over the

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last week. 
We did seven or eight in the 

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Ohio State week. 
There's so much to talk about 

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with football. 
So it has kind of slowed our 

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production on basketball, but 
it's also just been kind of an 

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awkward feeling start to the 
season. 

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And you could feel that in the 
the preseason, like even before 

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the first ball was tipped, just 
a lot of antipathy on the part 

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of a lot of people in and around
IU basketball. 

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Certainly the narrative coming 
into the season was one that you

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could get excited about if you 
wanted to look at it in a 

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certain way. 
You know, Indiana had a a 

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disastrous season last year, but
it ended on a a semi OK note, at

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least in terms of the the last 
few games of the regular season.

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They went out, spent a ton of 
money in the transfer portal and

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got some talented players. 
And we heard commentary from 

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Mike Woodson throughout the 
course of the offseason that 

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there were going to be changes 
and how the team played 

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stylistically that they were, 
you know, at one point in 

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October, I think he said they 
were shooting like 2728 threes a

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game in practice. 
And so, you know, when I went on

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inside the hall, I don't 
remember exactly everything you 

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said, but I think it was a 
similar vibe. 

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But it was like, you know, I was
talking to Alex. 

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I was like, if all of these 
things happen, if, if these 

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players hit the ground running 
and if they gel as a team and if

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there is actually some stylistic
change and if Indiana can do 

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some things on the recruiting 
scene, well, suddenly, you know,

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things look a lot better than 
they did. 

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And, and, you know, a lot of the
the problems in perception for 

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IU weren't just the losses on 
the court last year or the way 

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the team was playing, but it was
also losing at the time. 

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You're only committed recruit 
Liam Mcneely. 

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And then even into this fall, 
you get one recruit in Trent 

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Sizzly, but you lose three or 
four other targets. 

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You got people saying we'll just
do everything in the portal from

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now on. 
You don't really need 

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recruiting. 
But you know, the idea was if 

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all of the chips fell where they
were supposed to, this could 

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have been a special season for 
Indiana. 

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And I'm not here to say that it 
can't still by by some 

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trajectory get to that point. 
But the road is now incredibly 

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hard. 
And I think we've got enough of 

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a sample size to get a sense of 
how this team is playing and is 

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likely to play as they move 
through the rest of the 

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campaign. 
And and it's got a lot of people

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on edge. 
So, Scott, that's kind of the 

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backdrop to things. 
I don't know. 

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Did you have anything else to 
add in terms of your thoughts 

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coming into the season? 
Yeah, I mean, when I when I was 

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with Alex, you know, my my 
feeling is, and unfortunately 

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it's still kind of the same. 
And I think I speak for a lot of

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people, I was coming into this 
year and kind of like, let's 

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just wait and see. 
Like let's just wait and see how

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this team does. 
I'm cautiously optimistic. 

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You know, I've been saying for a
while, you know, this offseason 

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was great. 
You get, you know, great 

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transfers, you get some 
recommits. 

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It it was good. 
But I I was on record saying I 

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thought last offseason was 
really good. 

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You get Khalil Ware, you get 
McKenzie and Baco A live star. 

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I know he's not transfer portal,
but you, you know, in that 

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offseason, you got a lot of 
talent last offseason and it 

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didn't get you into the 
tournament. 

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And so that's where I'm like, 
well, the the answer just can't 

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be to continue to get more 
talent. 

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Like, OK, you Got Talent, but I,
I think you also had talent the 

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year before, you know, and I 
also think that the one thing 

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you didn't mention to set the 
table, which which was real and 

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happened was, you know, some of 
Woodson's comments at senior 

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night, kind of the, you know, 
the true fan comment. 

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We don't need to dig into that 
deeply, But you have this kind 

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of a bit of a divide in the fan,
you fans that are kind of 

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annoyed and just, you know, it's
not quite going where people 

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want it to go. 
And I feel like a lot of people 

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just said, OK, that that that's 
fine. 

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Like I'm not, it's not awesome. 
But like, and then, you know, 

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there's also the truth of 
football kind of just swept 

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everybody up and it's like, all 
right, we'll wait and see and I 

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will wait. 
And you see how IU basketball 

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does. 
And as you've mentioned many 

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times, it's true. 
It's kind of like, all right, 

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well, there's not a lot of great
non conference games until 

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Atlantis. 
So you know, they're going to 

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beat SIU, they're going to beat 
Eastern Illinois. 

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I mean, hopefully they they do 
and they did. 

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It's like, all right, well, I'll
kind of check in when Atlantis 

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comes out because that's kind of
the first real test. 

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And we'll see are some of the 
things that I'm cautiously 

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optimistic about going to 
happen. 

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And and we're hitting this kind 
of again, a little bit of, you 

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know, we're hitting this at an 
odd time because it's already 

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all happened. 
But that's how I was coming into

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the year feeling that, you know,
I, I, I, I want things to work 

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out, but I was very dubious on a
lot of the things I was hearing 

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because it's stuff we've heard 
years before is that, you know, 

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this was all the things we heard
last year is like, all right, 

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without trace Jackson Davis. 
Now we can see the real offense 

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that Woodson wants to install. 
You know, he wasn't able to do 

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it because you had such a 
skilled big man. 

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00:10:37,120 --> 00:10:40,880
He had to run a big offense and 
they didn't do anything and they

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they kept the same offense. 
It's like, all right, well then 

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00:10:43,520 --> 00:10:45,360
why is it going to be different?
This year was kind of my 

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00:10:45,360 --> 00:10:47,000
question. 
Like we've had three years now. 

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Like most coaches, especially in
their mid 60s, don't just start 

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00:10:50,000 --> 00:10:52,120
tinkering with the offenses that
they run. 

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And then it was like, what we 
brought in so much talent. 

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And my counter was we brought a 
lot of talent in the year 

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00:10:58,160 --> 00:11:00,200
before. 
Like this is back-to-back years.

225
00:11:00,200 --> 00:11:03,840
You brought a lot of talent in, 
you know, how, how is, and this 

226
00:11:03,840 --> 00:11:06,360
is, you know, last year, not 
only do they disappoint, they 

227
00:11:06,360 --> 00:11:08,800
seem to have a hard time 
coalescing that talent and kind 

228
00:11:08,800 --> 00:11:12,400
of creating a team atmosphere. 
How is that going to work this 

229
00:11:12,400 --> 00:11:14,880
year? 
And so I, I, I think that's the 

230
00:11:14,880 --> 00:11:17,200
feeling that I was having. 
I feel that with a lot of the IU

231
00:11:17,200 --> 00:11:19,240
fan base and people that I 
talked to is kind of just like, 

232
00:11:19,240 --> 00:11:23,720
well, I'll check back in when it
seems like they're they're kind 

233
00:11:23,720 --> 00:11:26,080
of on the right track or things 
are going the right way. 

234
00:11:26,920 --> 00:11:29,640
And thus far it it isn't quite 
there. 

235
00:11:29,640 --> 00:11:33,080
And so I worry how this season 
is going to go just from a vibes

236
00:11:33,080 --> 00:11:36,400
point of view, because it does 
feel like a lot of the fan base 

237
00:11:36,400 --> 00:11:39,160
is kind of like, all right, 
well, show me like, you know, 

238
00:11:40,000 --> 00:11:42,360
show me why I need to be excited
about this team. 

239
00:11:42,440 --> 00:11:44,680
Yeah. 
I mean everything you said, 

240
00:11:44,680 --> 00:11:48,520
absolutely. 
And I really do think so much of

241
00:11:48,680 --> 00:11:52,920
the perception of the of the 
program right now amongst 

242
00:11:53,120 --> 00:11:55,880
regular everyday fans, like 
people that I talk to, people 

243
00:11:55,880 --> 00:11:59,320
that I sit next to, people that 
that follow the podcast and, and

244
00:11:59,320 --> 00:12:01,840
people that I've seen commenting
on Assembly Call. 

245
00:12:03,080 --> 00:12:05,520
People are just sitting next to 
just like Galen is going on a 

246
00:12:05,520 --> 00:12:07,320
bench and like, you know, how 
are you basketball? 

247
00:12:07,320 --> 00:12:10,760
Talk to me. 
I don't need I went so it's 

248
00:12:10,760 --> 00:12:12,920
funny you say that. 
I was at the UNC Greensboro game

249
00:12:13,360 --> 00:12:18,440
and was sitting in not my normal
seats and just sat down and this

250
00:12:18,440 --> 00:12:22,280
older IU fan next to me. 
Just starts going off about, you

251
00:12:22,280 --> 00:12:24,880
know, well, we got some problems
on this team and it was and it 

252
00:12:24,880 --> 00:12:28,400
went it went for quite a while. 
But you know what I sense 

253
00:12:28,680 --> 00:12:30,440
really. 
But real quickly I was the South

254
00:12:30,440 --> 00:12:32,800
Carolina game and I saw somebody
at half time like, oh, Scott 

255
00:12:32,800 --> 00:12:34,520
from Crimson cast. 
OK, we're sitting by Galen. 

256
00:12:34,520 --> 00:12:36,080
Our seats are open. 
Do you want to come sit with us?

257
00:12:36,080 --> 00:12:38,520
I'm like, it's like people are 
trying to connect us on a date 

258
00:12:38,520 --> 00:12:41,960
and it's. 
Like we're on the opposite sides

259
00:12:41,960 --> 00:12:43,360
of the stadium for a reason, 
guys. 

260
00:12:43,360 --> 00:12:46,440
No, I'm kidding. 
That's not true, Scott. 

261
00:12:46,440 --> 00:12:48,960
Scott always invites me over to 
his seats one time a year, which

262
00:12:48,960 --> 00:12:51,960
is great, so I find. 
You to halftime. 

263
00:12:51,960 --> 00:12:54,920
You didn't show up that time. 
I, I, well, I was, I was with, I

264
00:12:54,920 --> 00:12:57,160
was with my kid and, and she 
wanted to do a lap. 

265
00:12:57,800 --> 00:12:59,440
No, I'm totally derailed. 
No, it's fine. 

266
00:12:59,640 --> 00:13:05,520
But the the the commentary I 
hear from most people is. 

267
00:13:05,680 --> 00:13:07,640
Is kind of. 
Split in a couple different 

268
00:13:07,640 --> 00:13:09,440
ways. 
There's the people who were 

269
00:13:09,440 --> 00:13:13,280
really put out by Woodson's 
comments and the timing of those

270
00:13:13,280 --> 00:13:17,560
comments. 
It's, it's really one of those 

271
00:13:17,560 --> 00:13:24,240
things, I think where you, you 
had a bad year and OK, you felt 

272
00:13:24,240 --> 00:13:26,640
as the coach, like you got 
unfairly blamed. 

273
00:13:26,640 --> 00:13:29,120
You didn't like the fact that 
people were talking negatively 

274
00:13:29,120 --> 00:13:32,000
about your, your job. 
I get all that. 

275
00:13:32,000 --> 00:13:35,880
But you got to have, in my 
opinion, a little more of a 

276
00:13:35,880 --> 00:13:40,360
sense of the audience. 
Most people that are at games 

277
00:13:40,360 --> 00:13:42,280
and most people that are 
following along with IU, yes, 

278
00:13:42,280 --> 00:13:45,960
they're frustrated because you 
follow up a couple of tournament

279
00:13:45,960 --> 00:13:47,840
appearances with a year where 
you're not making the 

280
00:13:47,840 --> 00:13:50,720
tournament, where your team 
looks like all of the bad 

281
00:13:50,720 --> 00:13:54,360
memories that everybody had of 
the Archie Miller era. 

282
00:13:55,240 --> 00:13:58,440
And you know, you've got your 
athletic director actually still

283
00:13:58,440 --> 00:14:01,200
having to apologize for your 
comments as late as may, like, 

284
00:14:01,200 --> 00:14:04,320
whatever the, whatever the, the 
purpose of the comments was. 

285
00:14:04,320 --> 00:14:07,360
And I've heard people argue, oh,
it was just intended at the 

286
00:14:07,640 --> 00:14:10,560
online audience that was 
aggressively calling for 

287
00:14:10,560 --> 00:14:13,240
Woodson's job. 
Even if that was the intent, the

288
00:14:13,240 --> 00:14:16,840
way it was taken was, wow, this 
is kind of arrogant. 

289
00:14:16,840 --> 00:14:19,400
Like this is not a season where 
you need to be proclaiming 

290
00:14:19,400 --> 00:14:21,640
yourself is like, I'm going to 
be the coach here for a long 

291
00:14:21,640 --> 00:14:23,880
time. 
And you know, the true fans 

292
00:14:23,880 --> 00:14:25,520
understand and are rooting for 
us like you. 

293
00:14:25,520 --> 00:14:30,640
Just that that creates the 
potential for division and 

294
00:14:31,320 --> 00:14:34,160
that's it was it was the wrong 
time to do it. 

295
00:14:34,160 --> 00:14:36,560
Or, you know, it was, it was not
not the right venue, especially 

296
00:14:36,560 --> 00:14:38,840
senior night when you're 
supposed to be focusing on on 

297
00:14:38,840 --> 00:14:43,040
the players. 
And so it did set the table for 

298
00:14:43,720 --> 00:14:46,880
a bunch of IU fans who I think 
otherwise would have groused 

299
00:14:46,880 --> 00:14:50,360
about the year, but probably 
wouldn't have thought any more 

300
00:14:50,360 --> 00:14:52,440
of it other than what they got 
to figure all this stuff out. 

301
00:14:52,600 --> 00:14:55,720
It kind of created a little bit 
of an internal referendum on, 

302
00:14:55,920 --> 00:14:57,920
well, does Woodson really know 
what he's doing here? 

303
00:14:57,920 --> 00:14:59,680
Like is, is this plan going to 
work? 

304
00:15:00,200 --> 00:15:03,800
And the, the refrain I hear over
and over again and, and I think 

305
00:15:03,800 --> 00:15:09,000
it's a, it's a fair argument. 
It's like, can you really trust 

306
00:15:09,000 --> 00:15:11,840
Woodson to make all these 
changes and do the things that 

307
00:15:11,840 --> 00:15:13,840
he's that we know that Indiana 
needs to do? 

308
00:15:13,840 --> 00:15:17,040
And, and for many people, they 
didn't trust the idea that 

309
00:15:17,040 --> 00:15:19,640
Woodson was going to be 
interested in making those 

310
00:15:19,640 --> 00:15:22,280
changes. 
The talent that they brought in,

311
00:15:22,280 --> 00:15:24,120
in the portal was certainly 
impressive. 

312
00:15:24,480 --> 00:15:27,400
And I think people rightfully 
got excited about the idea of 

313
00:15:27,400 --> 00:15:31,080
Miles Rice and Omar Balo and 
Kane and Carlisle. 

314
00:15:31,080 --> 00:15:32,800
And, you know, how are these 
guys going to plug in? 

315
00:15:32,800 --> 00:15:36,360
Bryson Tucker was an intriguing 
pick up at the last second from 

316
00:15:36,360 --> 00:15:40,200
a recruiting perspective. 
And you had, of course, Malik 

317
00:15:40,200 --> 00:15:42,120
Renew coming back. 
You had Trey Galloway coming 

318
00:15:42,120 --> 00:15:43,800
back. 
You had what looked like all the

319
00:15:43,800 --> 00:15:45,560
right pieces. 
Mackenzie Mbako was likely to 

320
00:15:45,560 --> 00:15:47,400
take a leap, and he looks like 
he kind of has, at least 

321
00:15:47,400 --> 00:15:51,720
offensively. 
The problem, though, is that so 

322
00:15:51,720 --> 00:15:54,240
much of the excitement that 
people should have been feeling 

323
00:15:54,240 --> 00:15:57,200
about this year was largely 
tempered through this idea that 

324
00:15:57,360 --> 00:15:59,240
we don't think Indiana's 
actually going to be able to 

325
00:15:59,240 --> 00:16:03,040
compete at the level that we'd 
like to see Indiana compete 

326
00:16:03,360 --> 00:16:05,960
because of the system that's 
being utilized and because of 

327
00:16:05,960 --> 00:16:09,680
the lack of likelihood that that
system would materially change. 

328
00:16:09,680 --> 00:16:13,840
And that that's what made 
Atlantis worse to me, I think, 

329
00:16:14,040 --> 00:16:18,680
is that you had not only did you
have, you know, the a bad game 

330
00:16:18,680 --> 00:16:21,680
against USC Greensboro. 
And then you come in and you get

331
00:16:21,680 --> 00:16:24,400
blown out by Louisville and it 
was not as close as the final 

332
00:16:24,400 --> 00:16:26,160
score indicated and you lost by 
28. 

333
00:16:26,840 --> 00:16:29,720
You get severely outclassed by 
Gonzaga. 

334
00:16:29,720 --> 00:16:31,760
I wouldn't say that you got 
blown out by them, but it was 

335
00:16:31,760 --> 00:16:34,480
essentially a 20 point game from
about the 10 minute mark of the 

336
00:16:34,480 --> 00:16:38,000
first half all the way through. 
And then you win a meaningless 

337
00:16:38,000 --> 00:16:40,200
game against the Providence team
that does not look very good 

338
00:16:40,200 --> 00:16:43,120
this year at all, the way that 
you lost the Louisville. 

339
00:16:43,120 --> 00:16:46,840
Game and the Gonzaga game. 
Put on display most of the 

340
00:16:46,840 --> 00:16:50,160
offensive problems that haven't 
been fixed that are going to 

341
00:16:50,160 --> 00:16:53,320
haunt the perception of Mike 
Woodson and his Indiana teams 

342
00:16:53,400 --> 00:16:56,840
probably for as long as he's 
here, unless there is a 

343
00:16:56,880 --> 00:16:59,600
demonstrable change in the way 
that they approach the game. 

344
00:17:00,800 --> 00:17:02,800
And then there's the added 
problem. 

345
00:17:02,800 --> 00:17:05,960
And again, this was a problem 
that was under the surface all 

346
00:17:05,960 --> 00:17:09,280
last year and it rarely got 
specifically talked about, but 

347
00:17:09,280 --> 00:17:12,200
it's starting to rear its head 
again is that the defensive 

348
00:17:12,200 --> 00:17:14,200
effort does not appear to be 
there. 

349
00:17:14,480 --> 00:17:18,040
Whether it's the effort or 
whether it's the the plan or 

350
00:17:18,040 --> 00:17:19,880
some combination of both. 
And it's probably some 

351
00:17:19,880 --> 00:17:24,119
combination of both. 
IU let's guys drive the lane on 

352
00:17:24,119 --> 00:17:26,599
them all the time. 
They let wide open threes, they 

353
00:17:26,599 --> 00:17:29,360
move the wrong direction. 
There was a breakdown that I saw

354
00:17:29,360 --> 00:17:33,120
of that Louisville game that was
done by a a YouTube commentator 

355
00:17:33,720 --> 00:17:35,840
who focuses on teams not playing
well. 

356
00:17:35,840 --> 00:17:37,960
He just ripped Indiana apart. 
And every piece of video 

357
00:17:37,960 --> 00:17:40,320
evidence is like I he's yeah, 
he's not wrong here. 

358
00:17:41,080 --> 00:17:45,960
So you've added these additional
issues of perception to to 

359
00:17:45,960 --> 00:17:49,320
what's going on. 
And you've also, as you alluded 

360
00:17:49,320 --> 00:17:51,880
to, left yourself in a position 
where you now don't have any 

361
00:17:51,880 --> 00:17:54,760
good non conference wins and you
have no route to pick up good 

362
00:17:54,760 --> 00:17:57,320
non conference wins. 
And as we know, that matters a 

363
00:17:57,320 --> 00:17:58,640
lot when it comes to the 
tournament. 

364
00:17:59,200 --> 00:18:01,360
And the tournament was always 
what people said was like, it's 

365
00:18:01,400 --> 00:18:03,640
it's this or bust. 
It's like Sweet 16. 

366
00:18:03,880 --> 00:18:06,080
Like we have to see some 
tangible progress as far as 

367
00:18:06,080 --> 00:18:08,000
that's concerned. 
So it's just a bunch of things 

368
00:18:08,400 --> 00:18:11,440
all at once right now, Scott, 
and none of it's good at this 

369
00:18:11,440 --> 00:18:14,440
stage. 
Well, what what Atlantis also 

370
00:18:14,440 --> 00:18:18,120
leaves you with is another 
season where you're not going to

371
00:18:18,120 --> 00:18:22,360
have a a kind of a signature non
conference win, which is 

372
00:18:22,360 --> 00:18:25,240
something that Indiana was, you 
know, in the heyday when you and

373
00:18:25,240 --> 00:18:27,600
I were growing up was known for.
You know, you had non conference

374
00:18:27,600 --> 00:18:28,680
games. 
You always have the game against

375
00:18:28,680 --> 00:18:31,240
Kentucky. 
You know, you you obviously 

376
00:18:32,160 --> 00:18:35,160
would get big Big Ten wins, you 
know, in which was beaten Purdue

377
00:18:35,160 --> 00:18:36,800
with was that gedy when they 
were ranked number one. 

378
00:18:37,160 --> 00:18:40,280
But but part of, you know, 
what's important and also, you 

379
00:18:40,280 --> 00:18:41,880
know, what's been talked about 
is, you know, getting the non 

380
00:18:41,880 --> 00:18:44,240
conference schedule up. 
And that was one of those 

381
00:18:44,240 --> 00:18:46,720
refrains like, all right, the 
first thing Woodson did is he 

382
00:18:46,720 --> 00:18:49,320
upgraded our non conference 
schedule, which he did and he 

383
00:18:49,320 --> 00:18:51,520
gets credit for. 
But it was, you know, middle of 

384
00:18:51,520 --> 00:18:53,160
last, you know, beginning of 
last year was kind of the 

385
00:18:53,160 --> 00:18:54,680
discussion. 
All right, he's done a good job 

386
00:18:54,680 --> 00:18:56,560
of getting the games back on the
schedule. 

387
00:18:56,720 --> 00:19:00,200
Now we got to start competing in
those games and maybe, you know,

388
00:19:00,200 --> 00:19:03,600
moving toward possibly, you 
know, hushed tones, winning one 

389
00:19:03,600 --> 00:19:06,600
of those games. 
You know, we're not even at the 

390
00:19:06,600 --> 00:19:09,600
competing level. 
And and that's that's the scary 

391
00:19:09,600 --> 00:19:13,840
part. 
And you know, it, it it's it's 

392
00:19:13,840 --> 00:19:15,920
very frustrating. 
And sometimes, you know, coaches

393
00:19:15,920 --> 00:19:19,120
are coaches are always in spots 
where the post game stuff, 

394
00:19:19,120 --> 00:19:21,080
there's nothing good they can 
say, you know, they can't come 

395
00:19:21,080 --> 00:19:22,840
out and just say, you know, hey,
we suck. 

396
00:19:22,840 --> 00:19:24,360
Like no one's ever going to say 
that. 

397
00:19:24,360 --> 00:19:29,000
But it is frustrating and just 
again, kind of goes to this lack

398
00:19:29,000 --> 00:19:31,680
of understanding how your 
comments are going to be taken 

399
00:19:32,160 --> 00:19:35,840
when you just get boat raced by 
Louisville and you come out, you

400
00:19:35,840 --> 00:19:38,920
know, a Louisville team that I I
think brought zero points back 

401
00:19:38,920 --> 00:19:41,920
from last year, a complete team 
of all new players. 

402
00:19:42,280 --> 00:19:44,480
And your post game comments are,
you know, we really got to 

403
00:19:44,480 --> 00:19:46,040
figure out how to gel together 
as a team. 

404
00:19:46,040 --> 00:19:48,840
We have a lot of new pieces. 
It's like, well, Louisville 

405
00:19:48,840 --> 00:19:50,120
doesn't seem to have that 
problem. 

406
00:19:50,120 --> 00:19:52,320
And they have a first year coach
and you're in year 4. 

407
00:19:52,320 --> 00:19:54,400
And then this is from a large 
picture. 

408
00:19:54,400 --> 00:19:56,440
This is something I've talked 
about ad nauseam. 

409
00:19:56,520 --> 00:20:00,360
You know, when you look at 
coaches, wherever they are kind 

410
00:20:00,360 --> 00:20:03,720
of is where they are by year 3 
or 4, you know? 

411
00:20:03,720 --> 00:20:06,160
And so if you're looking at any 
of the coaches at the top 

412
00:20:06,200 --> 00:20:10,800
echelon of college basketball by
year three or year 4, you have a

413
00:20:10,800 --> 00:20:13,240
pretty good idea of where 
they're going to be. 

414
00:20:13,280 --> 00:20:17,520
A, A coach who takes a team to a
national title in the last 1520 

415
00:20:17,520 --> 00:20:21,320
years, it's very rare that 
they're still having a hard time

416
00:20:21,320 --> 00:20:24,040
competing in big games in year 4
of their program. 

417
00:20:24,040 --> 00:20:26,320
Normally by year 4, you're 
seeing those things happen. 

418
00:20:26,440 --> 00:20:28,720
That's what's concerning. 
But. 

419
00:20:28,880 --> 00:20:33,840
This season specifically, you 
know, you mentioned this in the 

420
00:20:33,840 --> 00:20:36,880
VIP video, but it just we will 
rephrase it again because it's 

421
00:20:36,880 --> 00:20:38,840
going to come up over and over 
again. 

422
00:20:39,160 --> 00:20:42,360
The problem we had last year is 
that we had no good non 

423
00:20:42,360 --> 00:20:45,080
conference wins. 
And you know, people can look at

424
00:20:45,080 --> 00:20:47,040
it and I've had friends like, 
Hey, it's it's November. 

425
00:20:47,120 --> 00:20:50,280
You still have all the big 10. 
It's like, well, but the big 10 

426
00:20:50,280 --> 00:20:53,920
comes around, unless you're 
going to go like, you know, 15 

427
00:20:53,920 --> 00:20:58,000
and two in the big 10 or 
whatever number of games is, you

428
00:20:58,000 --> 00:20:59,640
know, you're you're going to win
some, you're going to lose some,

429
00:20:59,640 --> 00:21:02,280
but so is everybody else. 
And you're not going to be able 

430
00:21:02,280 --> 00:21:04,720
to really gain anything on your 
metrics. 

431
00:21:04,720 --> 00:21:07,800
Your metrics are kind of going 
to be mostly locked in once you 

432
00:21:07,800 --> 00:21:10,960
get to the big 10. 
And what's going to help you is 

433
00:21:10,960 --> 00:21:15,840
those non conference games, much
like in 2023, we had that road 

434
00:21:15,840 --> 00:21:18,680
win Xavier, which just kept 
giving dividends throughout the 

435
00:21:18,680 --> 00:21:21,520
entire year as they stayed 
highly ranked. 

436
00:21:21,520 --> 00:21:23,800
And then that helped us with our
metrics. 

437
00:21:24,560 --> 00:21:26,360
I, I don't know, man, it's, it's
tough. 

438
00:21:26,360 --> 00:21:32,120
And you know, for a program that
builds itself on trying to be at

439
00:21:32,120 --> 00:21:34,840
the top level, to have another 
non conference where you're not 

440
00:21:34,840 --> 00:21:39,160
going to have any real, not even
competing with the big boys is, 

441
00:21:39,160 --> 00:21:41,720
is tough. 
And, you know, I, I think it's 

442
00:21:41,720 --> 00:21:43,640
going to continue to be 
something that hampers us 

443
00:21:43,640 --> 00:21:45,400
throughout the year as we get 
into the meat of the Big 10 

444
00:21:45,400 --> 00:21:48,120
schedule because you're just 
going to have a real hard time 

445
00:21:48,120 --> 00:21:51,160
showing where are those tier one
Rd. wins. 

446
00:21:51,640 --> 00:21:54,040
I mean. 
But let's let's. 

447
00:21:54,040 --> 00:21:57,880
Look first at style of play a 
little more in depth and what's 

448
00:21:57,880 --> 00:22:00,080
what we're seeing in terms of 
the numbers. 

449
00:22:01,280 --> 00:22:04,000
And then let's talk about the 
schedule 'cause I think these 

450
00:22:04,000 --> 00:22:06,320
are two separate issues. 
And it's like, again, I wanted 

451
00:22:06,320 --> 00:22:09,080
to, I think leading by talking 
about kind of the atmosphere 

452
00:22:09,080 --> 00:22:12,080
around this is important and, 
and I think 1. 

453
00:22:12,280 --> 00:22:15,040
Atmosphere thing just in a word 
that you talked about was just 

454
00:22:15,520 --> 00:22:18,320
it it is interesting to me you 
said you know division, those 

455
00:22:18,320 --> 00:22:21,480
kind of division, the fan base 
it is really interesting for 

456
00:22:21,480 --> 00:22:25,000
years was always the talk of we 
got to bring an IU guy back it 

457
00:22:25,000 --> 00:22:28,280
it's interesting that you know 
people weren't happy under 

458
00:22:28,280 --> 00:22:29,960
Archie. 
It didn't feel like there was 

459
00:22:29,960 --> 00:22:31,840
division. 
It was just like hey this guy's 

460
00:22:31,840 --> 00:22:33,960
not doing a great job we 
probably need to move on. 

461
00:22:34,240 --> 00:22:38,040
It's really interesting that you
get an IU guy in who you feel 

462
00:22:38,040 --> 00:22:41,320
like would would understand what
the culture is and all that and 

463
00:22:41,320 --> 00:22:43,640
then. 
Now you're, you're, he's the one

464
00:22:43,640 --> 00:22:46,280
kind of causing division. 
I I think that's interesting. 

465
00:22:46,520 --> 00:22:52,920
It's, you know, I, I've thought 
about that a lot because you're 

466
00:22:52,920 --> 00:22:54,480
right. 
And it's actually kind of an 

467
00:22:54,480 --> 00:22:58,000
underrated aspect of this. 
I mean, Mike Woodson has done a 

468
00:22:58,000 --> 00:23:02,960
lot of things that have helped 
to restore some aspects of 

469
00:23:03,520 --> 00:23:07,000
traditional IU basketball 
culture and I think he deserves 

470
00:23:07,000 --> 00:23:08,600
credit for that. 
I think it was something that 

471
00:23:08,600 --> 00:23:13,760
was needed in terms of smoothing
out the remaining ruffled edges 

472
00:23:13,760 --> 00:23:16,840
that still exist from the night 
situation and everything that 

473
00:23:16,840 --> 00:23:18,800
fell out over the the 20 years 
after that. 

474
00:23:20,040 --> 00:23:27,000
But I think what's increasingly 
true is that is no longer 

475
00:23:27,000 --> 00:23:29,720
important to the level that it 
used to be. 

476
00:23:30,880 --> 00:23:35,320
And instead what is important is
the style of play and the roster

477
00:23:35,320 --> 00:23:37,720
management like that has become 
so paramount. 

478
00:23:37,720 --> 00:23:41,120
And if if you think about the. 
The teams and the coaches that 

479
00:23:41,120 --> 00:23:46,560
are really faring well right now
in college basketball, it's, you

480
00:23:46,560 --> 00:23:50,080
know, coaches that have created 
a style of play that really 

481
00:23:50,080 --> 00:23:53,960
works for what they're doing and
they've been able to recruit to 

482
00:23:53,960 --> 00:23:56,040
that effectively. 
The way that they're approaching

483
00:23:56,040 --> 00:23:59,080
the game is a lot more modern in
terms of either their defensive 

484
00:23:59,080 --> 00:24:01,000
performance or their offensive 
performance. 

485
00:24:01,640 --> 00:24:02,720
And I think the big problem that
I've. 

486
00:24:02,720 --> 00:24:08,520
Seen out of Woodson is, you 
know, so much of what gave the 

487
00:24:08,600 --> 00:24:11,800
what gave the Knight era 
basketball teams the moral 

488
00:24:11,800 --> 00:24:15,520
authority to be viewed even in 
seasons where they weren't 

489
00:24:15,520 --> 00:24:18,520
playing as well as they could 
have was this idea that, hey, we

490
00:24:18,520 --> 00:24:21,880
know this system wins. 
We know that what Indiana does 

491
00:24:21,880 --> 00:24:24,680
on offense works when it's 
worked to perfection. 

492
00:24:25,240 --> 00:24:27,720
Indiana's really hard to beat. 
They win championships. 

493
00:24:27,720 --> 00:24:30,360
We know defensively the same 
thing. 

494
00:24:31,120 --> 00:24:34,400
And I would say that Woodson is 
simply not demonstrated in any 

495
00:24:34,400 --> 00:24:39,400
of the years so far that this 
system that he's tried to play 

496
00:24:39,560 --> 00:24:43,440
on both sides is actually 
sufficient to winning anything 

497
00:24:43,440 --> 00:24:45,960
other than a middling level of 
basketball games in the 

498
00:24:45,960 --> 00:24:48,840
conference. 
And so I think a lot of the way 

499
00:24:48,840 --> 00:24:51,400
that Woodson tried to address 
the crowd and tried to address 

500
00:24:51,400 --> 00:24:54,400
himself within the context of of
that and a lot of Woodson's 

501
00:24:54,400 --> 00:24:57,080
defenders, that's the piece 
that's missing. 

502
00:24:57,240 --> 00:25:02,400
It's like you, you can't act 
with that approach unless you've

503
00:25:02,400 --> 00:25:04,840
got the results to back it up 
and those results just haven't 

504
00:25:04,840 --> 00:25:06,320
materialized. 
And yes, there have been good 

505
00:25:06,320 --> 00:25:08,480
individual moments. 
There's, you know, there's been 

506
00:25:08,480 --> 00:25:11,480
the wins over Purdue, there was 
the win over Kent State and the 

507
00:25:11,480 --> 00:25:12,600
tournament. 
You know, there were there's 

508
00:25:12,600 --> 00:25:16,440
been other little things like 
that, the win at Xavier, But if 

509
00:25:16,440 --> 00:25:20,240
that's been undermined, not just
by the overall lack of high end 

510
00:25:20,240 --> 00:25:23,600
wins and and competing for 
championships, but it's also 

511
00:25:23,600 --> 00:25:26,640
been undermined by these 
particular types of performances

512
00:25:26,640 --> 00:25:29,440
where you get a bunch of really 
highly committed, highly 

513
00:25:29,440 --> 00:25:34,560
invested IU fans flying places 
to watch your team play games 

514
00:25:34,920 --> 00:25:37,720
and you get embarrassed in those
games. 

515
00:25:37,920 --> 00:25:42,640
And much like, I mean, the 
previous games, it's been kind 

516
00:25:42,640 --> 00:25:45,800
of one offs, you know, you, you,
you go to Vegas, you get blown 

517
00:25:45,800 --> 00:25:48,960
out by Arizona, you go to 
Kansas, you get blown out by 

518
00:25:48,960 --> 00:25:52,120
Kansas, you go to New York, you 
get blown out by UConn. 

519
00:25:52,120 --> 00:25:55,800
Fortunately of the second game 
here, it's like 2 games in a 

520
00:25:55,800 --> 00:25:58,800
row. 
The style of play that you have 

521
00:25:58,800 --> 00:26:01,800
chosen to play with your chosen 
roster, the roster you went out 

522
00:26:01,800 --> 00:26:06,320
and spent multiple millions of 
dollars on in in NIL was looked 

523
00:26:06,440 --> 00:26:08,840
inadequate. 
Like looked looked like a a 

524
00:26:08,840 --> 00:26:12,640
second tier team compared to not
just Gonzaga, who everybody 

525
00:26:12,640 --> 00:26:16,040
expected, but Louisville, who 
brought in what 13 new players 

526
00:26:16,360 --> 00:26:21,000
and a new coach that that is 
really hard to come back from. 

527
00:26:21,000 --> 00:26:24,960
And and so I think about that 
and it's like Woodson is still, 

528
00:26:25,160 --> 00:26:27,720
if I'm playing, you know, our 
amateur psychologist here a 

529
00:26:27,720 --> 00:26:29,440
little bit. 
I think he's still proceeding 

530
00:26:29,440 --> 00:26:31,120
from the idea that, hey, this 
system works. 

531
00:26:31,120 --> 00:26:33,520
I know it works. 
And what's working against him 

532
00:26:33,520 --> 00:26:36,320
now is a lot of IU fans are 
looking at it and saying we're 

533
00:26:36,320 --> 00:26:39,920
not seeing the results. 
So how can you be this dedicated

534
00:26:39,920 --> 00:26:43,320
to this system that isn't 
working and speak, you know, 

535
00:26:43,520 --> 00:26:45,440
like when you're talking about 
the kinds of things that were 

536
00:26:45,440 --> 00:26:48,400
mentioned on senior night, those
resonated with fans because I 

537
00:26:48,400 --> 00:26:51,440
think the fans were like, well, 
we might listen to that if we 

538
00:26:51,440 --> 00:26:54,160
were seeing more results. 
And now this season starts the 

539
00:26:54,160 --> 00:26:56,600
way that it has. 
And I think it didn't take very 

540
00:26:56,600 --> 00:26:58,200
much. 
For a lot of fans to get upset 

541
00:26:58,200 --> 00:27:00,440
really quickly because that was 
the base level that they were 

542
00:27:00,440 --> 00:27:02,840
coming in with. 
When the last thing before we 

543
00:27:02,840 --> 00:27:04,920
move on Atlanta. 
So I, I look at like my 

544
00:27:04,960 --> 00:27:08,400
father-in-law, who is, is a 
sports fan, but not deep in the 

545
00:27:08,400 --> 00:27:11,160
weeds of IU. 
And you know, we're up in, you 

546
00:27:11,160 --> 00:27:14,360
know, we're up in Fort Wayne for
Thanksgiving and I turned the 

547
00:27:14,360 --> 00:27:16,000
game on just to watch a little 
bit of it. 

548
00:27:16,000 --> 00:27:18,320
And he's like, oh, man, IU still
having trouble. 

549
00:27:18,320 --> 00:27:21,640
And it's like he's done like he,
he's like, he doesn't have to 

550
00:27:21,640 --> 00:27:23,920
win my father-in-law. 
But like that, you know, you and

551
00:27:23,920 --> 00:27:25,960
I are a different breed. 
People listening to the show are

552
00:27:25,960 --> 00:27:28,240
very invested in IU basketball 
and we're going to live and 

553
00:27:28,240 --> 00:27:31,760
breathe in and out. 
Part of what made IU special was

554
00:27:32,320 --> 00:27:35,040
people would check in and be 
like, oh, wow, they're good. 

555
00:27:35,040 --> 00:27:37,680
Like you, you'd get this kind of
ancillary fan base that kind of 

556
00:27:37,680 --> 00:27:39,440
builds up. 
And that's what gives you the 

557
00:27:39,440 --> 00:27:42,520
power to to be a major blue 
blood. 

558
00:27:42,960 --> 00:27:46,080
Those people check in like these
Atlantis games are really 

559
00:27:46,080 --> 00:27:48,560
important, even the Vegas ones, 
the New York ones, like they're 

560
00:27:48,560 --> 00:27:50,800
important because over the 
holidays, people start to kind 

561
00:27:50,800 --> 00:27:54,600
of check in and those, you know,
passive fans kind of look up. 

562
00:27:54,600 --> 00:27:57,720
It's like, oh, Nah, we still are
getting blown out by Louisville,

563
00:27:57,720 --> 00:27:59,640
man, that sucks. 
All right, well, I'll check in 

564
00:27:59,640 --> 00:28:01,280
later. 
It's like then they won't check 

565
00:28:01,280 --> 00:28:04,600
back in and you, you, you, you 
start to lose the momentum And, 

566
00:28:04,600 --> 00:28:08,200
and it's just, it's a bummer 
that again, you had another high

567
00:28:08,200 --> 00:28:09,760
profile and you weren't even 
able. 

568
00:28:09,840 --> 00:28:12,880
To compete anyway. 
No again, yeah. 

569
00:28:12,880 --> 00:28:16,320
So when we look at the numbers, 
here's what's disturbing to me. 

570
00:28:16,320 --> 00:28:18,360
And you know, when you hear all 
this talk about, you know, we're

571
00:28:18,360 --> 00:28:20,160
going to change the offense, 
shoot more threes. 

572
00:28:21,200 --> 00:28:25,280
I mean, let's start there 
because that's that's become is 

573
00:28:25,280 --> 00:28:28,120
something that really you 
clearly separates Indiana 

574
00:28:28,120 --> 00:28:31,240
offensively from what other 
teams are doing, teams that 

575
00:28:31,240 --> 00:28:34,240
Indiana would like to aspire to 
be as a program in terms of 

576
00:28:34,240 --> 00:28:36,240
success. 
Maybe not necessarily like be 

577
00:28:36,240 --> 00:28:39,440
exactly them. 
Indiana is shooting better from 

578
00:28:39,440 --> 00:28:41,080
three. 
I talked about this in the in 

579
00:28:41,080 --> 00:28:42,960
the podcast that I did the other
day. 

580
00:28:43,320 --> 00:28:45,680
They're shooting 35.8% from 
three. 

581
00:28:45,680 --> 00:28:48,200
That's 89th in the country. 
That is significantly better 

582
00:28:48,200 --> 00:28:52,080
than what they shot last year. 
Last year they were shooting 

583
00:28:52,360 --> 00:28:58,440
32.4% and you know, 35.8% is 
about a percentage point less 

584
00:28:58,440 --> 00:29:02,600
than what they shot in the the 
year that they went and and beat

585
00:29:02,600 --> 00:29:04,920
Kent State in the tournament. 
Trace Jackson Davis is senior. 

586
00:29:04,920 --> 00:29:08,080
So you you do like to see that. 
And the free throw shootings 

587
00:29:08,080 --> 00:29:10,400
gotten better after three 
straight years of the free throw

588
00:29:10,400 --> 00:29:13,240
shooting being bad, they've 
actually jumped their free throw

589
00:29:13,240 --> 00:29:18,400
shooting by 12%. 
Last year it was 65.4 or 66.4, 

590
00:29:18,560 --> 00:29:22,600
this year at 78.1. 
So you you are seeing some 

591
00:29:22,600 --> 00:29:24,480
positive changes in terms of 
shooting. 

592
00:29:24,640 --> 00:29:29,680
The problem is that is the rate 
the, the three-point average 

593
00:29:30,200 --> 00:29:33,800
that Indiana is shooting in 
terms of the amount of threes 

594
00:29:33,800 --> 00:29:35,960
that they're shooting in 
relation to the overall points 

595
00:29:35,960 --> 00:29:40,880
that they're scoring is 29.9. 
The three-point attempts to 

596
00:29:40,880 --> 00:29:44,960
field goal attempts, that is 300
and 48th in the country. 

597
00:29:44,960 --> 00:29:46,800
And Scott, I, I got news for 
you. 

598
00:29:47,120 --> 00:29:50,840
There's only 364 teams in 
Division One. 

599
00:29:51,240 --> 00:29:53,920
Their assist rate is still high,
but that's always very high as a

600
00:29:53,920 --> 00:29:57,280
very assist focused team. 
But just that right there to to 

601
00:29:57,280 --> 00:30:02,440
be after seven games, 300 and 
48th in the country in field 

602
00:30:02,440 --> 00:30:05,400
goal or three-point attempts as 
a ratio of overall field goal 

603
00:30:05,400 --> 00:30:11,440
attempts that I mean, it's a, 
it's bad strategy in an era when

604
00:30:11,440 --> 00:30:14,320
so many teams get so many points
from the three-point line. 

605
00:30:14,640 --> 00:30:18,400
But B, it just looks so out of 
step with the teams that 

606
00:30:18,400 --> 00:30:19,720
Indiana's trying to compete 
against. 

607
00:30:19,720 --> 00:30:21,800
And that has a direct impact on 
recruiting. 

608
00:30:21,960 --> 00:30:24,520
It has a direct impact on just 
the overall perception of the 

609
00:30:24,520 --> 00:30:28,440
program. 
Yeah, I mean, I I see it with my

610
00:30:28,440 --> 00:30:30,560
son who who I coach in 
basketball. 

611
00:30:30,560 --> 00:30:33,640
He just loves to shoot threes. 
And it is something that kids 

612
00:30:33,680 --> 00:30:36,000
like to do. 
Is it something that's been 

613
00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:38,040
brought up a couple of times 
that, you know, when you watch 

614
00:30:38,040 --> 00:30:39,920
this team, it's like, man, does 
that look like fun to play? 

615
00:30:40,360 --> 00:30:43,000
It's like probably not. 
And and that's what a lot of 

616
00:30:43,000 --> 00:30:44,360
recruits see. 
But here's the thing, you know, 

617
00:30:44,360 --> 00:30:47,840
the a couple a couple points 
that you brought up, you know, 

618
00:30:48,120 --> 00:30:52,160
the what's odd is the years that
we've shot better from three. 

619
00:30:52,400 --> 00:30:56,480
You know, like Woodson's first 
year, we shot 33% from 3 wasn't 

620
00:30:56,480 --> 00:30:58,560
awful. 
We were taking more. 

621
00:30:58,600 --> 00:31:01,840
Sorry I'm messing this up. 
His first year we shot 33% from 

622
00:31:01,840 --> 00:31:04,040
three. 
We took 31% of our shots were 

623
00:31:04,040 --> 00:31:06,920
from three. 
The next year, Trace Jackson 

624
00:31:06,920 --> 00:31:09,760
Davis is senior year, we 
actually shot better from 336%. 

625
00:31:09,760 --> 00:31:12,200
We were 39th in the country, but
we shot less. 

626
00:31:12,320 --> 00:31:14,200
We shot 26% of our shots from 
three. 

627
00:31:14,200 --> 00:31:17,560
So as we get better shooting 
threes, we take less of them. 

628
00:31:18,240 --> 00:31:20,720
And and the other argument that 
that always kind of I roll my 

629
00:31:20,720 --> 00:31:22,920
eyes is the idea of like, well, 
there's a lot of ways to win 

630
00:31:22,920 --> 00:31:25,600
basketball games. 
Like, OK, there is you, you can.

631
00:31:26,280 --> 00:31:31,760
But if if you're going to be 
350th in the country in any 

632
00:31:31,760 --> 00:31:35,040
aspect of any of the metrics, 
whether it's rebounding or two 

633
00:31:35,040 --> 00:31:38,160
point percentage or free throw 
or steal, like if you're going 

634
00:31:38,160 --> 00:31:41,640
to be this off the mark of 
everything else, you have to be 

635
00:31:41,640 --> 00:31:44,640
elite somewhere else. 
And if so, if you're not going 

636
00:31:44,640 --> 00:31:48,520
to shoot a bunch of threes, fine
in that scenario, as you and I 

637
00:31:48,520 --> 00:31:51,240
have talked about, knowing 
basketball, you probably need to

638
00:31:51,240 --> 00:31:54,680
rebound at an elite percentage. 
You need to be unbelievably 

639
00:31:54,680 --> 00:31:56,080
efficient with your two point 
shots. 

640
00:31:56,080 --> 00:31:57,400
You're probably going to go to 
the line a lot. 

641
00:31:57,400 --> 00:31:59,480
You got to be really good at 
free throws and you need to be 

642
00:31:59,480 --> 00:32:02,160
really good defensively. 
And you got to pick one of those

643
00:32:02,160 --> 00:32:04,760
things and maybe be in the top 
20 in the country. 

644
00:32:04,840 --> 00:32:08,280
And I think that's the problem 
is this is being wrapped up in 

645
00:32:08,280 --> 00:32:10,240
like, hey, man, the group think 
everyone's got to do the same 

646
00:32:10,240 --> 00:32:12,560
thing. 
It's like, no, but then then 

647
00:32:12,560 --> 00:32:14,800
where are we elite? 
Because if you're going to be 

648
00:32:14,800 --> 00:32:18,240
this hyper deficient in one 
area, you know, that's the 

649
00:32:18,240 --> 00:32:20,600
problem. 
And the last thing I'll say is 

650
00:32:20,840 --> 00:32:26,400
where it is really frustrating 
is it's just so unmodern with 

651
00:32:26,400 --> 00:32:30,400
the way basketball is played, 
but it also just is the way it's

652
00:32:30,400 --> 00:32:33,360
played. 
You know, you get down by 7 to 

653
00:32:33,360 --> 00:32:38,000
10 to Gonzaga and it's like you,
you can't come back when you're 

654
00:32:38,000 --> 00:32:39,720
just hitting. 
You know, it's two and they hit 

655
00:32:39,720 --> 00:32:42,400
a three and then two and then 
they miss and then it's like 2 

656
00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:44,760
and then a three. 
Like when other teams are 

657
00:32:44,760 --> 00:32:47,760
shooting threes at such a higher
clip than you are. 

658
00:32:48,360 --> 00:32:52,000
You really have to find a way to
get ahead in every game and kind

659
00:32:52,000 --> 00:32:55,440
of grind teams out 'cause once 
you're down by 10 or 12 it 

660
00:32:55,440 --> 00:32:58,640
becomes unbelievably hard to get
back into the game when you're 

661
00:32:58,640 --> 00:33:02,200
just taking twos every time. 
There's another aspect to this 

662
00:33:02,360 --> 00:33:06,600
and it's something that's become
a big problem now it's it's a 

663
00:33:06,600 --> 00:33:09,360
recoverable problem. 
But you know, when in Mike 

664
00:33:09,360 --> 00:33:15,360
Woodson's first year Indiana 
turned the ball over on 17.2% of

665
00:33:15,360 --> 00:33:18,240
their possessions, which was 
actually top third in the 

666
00:33:18,240 --> 00:33:21,840
country, that in good like you 
know, it was 101st in the 

667
00:33:21,840 --> 00:33:24,120
country was the ranking. 
The year that they were the four

668
00:33:24,120 --> 00:33:27,880
seed, they only turned the ball 
over on 78% of possessions, 

669
00:33:27,880 --> 00:33:32,040
which was better, excuse me, a 
16.8% of possession, 78th in the

670
00:33:32,040 --> 00:33:35,400
country. 
Now, what's interesting to me is

671
00:33:35,400 --> 00:33:40,680
that last year Indiana turned 
the ball over on 17.5% of 

672
00:33:40,680 --> 00:33:44,240
possessions, almost the same 
number as Woodson's first year, 

673
00:33:44,440 --> 00:33:48,240
but instead of ranking 101st, 
that percentage now ranked 

674
00:33:48,240 --> 00:33:51,440
208th. 
And what you can take from that 

675
00:33:51,440 --> 00:33:54,320
is that a lot of teams across 
the country got better at taking

676
00:33:54,320 --> 00:33:56,720
care of the ball. 
Indiana got worse. 

677
00:33:56,800 --> 00:34:00,960
Now, of course, well, it, well, 
Indiana got worse relative to 

678
00:34:00,960 --> 00:34:05,320
everybody else. 
Now you can attribute that to 

679
00:34:05,320 --> 00:34:09,560
OK, well, OK, you lose Xavier 
Johnson, you've got Gabe Cups 

680
00:34:09,560 --> 00:34:12,040
and Trey Galloway doing most of 
the ball handling. 

681
00:34:12,600 --> 00:34:15,239
That's a rough spot. 
You would, you know, you'd be 

682
00:34:15,239 --> 00:34:18,400
like, OK, fine. 
This year, Indiana's turning the

683
00:34:18,400 --> 00:34:21,679
ball over on almost 20% of 
possessions, 19.7%. 

684
00:34:21,920 --> 00:34:23,880
Both real and relative, right? 
Right. 

685
00:34:23,880 --> 00:34:28,920
There's 275th in the country and
that is a disaster. 

686
00:34:29,360 --> 00:34:32,880
It's a disaster for a team that 
doesn't take a lot of threes 

687
00:34:33,239 --> 00:34:36,440
because if you're turning the 
ball over on two or three 

688
00:34:36,440 --> 00:34:38,719
additional percent of 
possessions throughout the 

689
00:34:38,719 --> 00:34:43,600
course of a game, that is two or
three possessions that if your 

690
00:34:43,600 --> 00:34:46,480
opponent hits a three, you've 
double whammied yourself on. 

691
00:34:47,199 --> 00:34:49,719
And and so you put yourself in a
position where your possessions 

692
00:34:49,719 --> 00:34:53,159
have to count even more. 
And unfortunately for Indiana, 

693
00:34:53,159 --> 00:34:56,520
it it, it doesn't make a lot of 
sense that they would be having 

694
00:34:56,520 --> 00:34:59,200
this many turnover problems 
because they got a point guard 

695
00:34:59,200 --> 00:35:02,680
like they brought a guy in at 
point guard who was supposed to 

696
00:35:02,680 --> 00:35:06,040
be, you know, the, the answer 
there that was that was what was

697
00:35:06,040 --> 00:35:09,160
going to fix the issue that 
Indiana was having. 

698
00:35:09,160 --> 00:35:12,000
And, and if you look at Miles 
Rice, like his, his assist 

699
00:35:12,000 --> 00:35:15,000
rate's been really good. 
He's he's got an assist rate of 

700
00:35:15,000 --> 00:35:17,200
22.6. 
He's 300 and 17th in the 

701
00:35:17,200 --> 00:35:21,440
country. 
His turnover rate is 25.3%, 

702
00:35:21,840 --> 00:35:25,880
which I mean, that's, that's 
wildly not good for a starting 

703
00:35:25,880 --> 00:35:30,360
point guard. 
Last year, by comparison, Gabe 

704
00:35:30,360 --> 00:35:33,280
Cubs had a turnover percentage 
of 24.8%. 

705
00:35:33,560 --> 00:35:37,000
And in the games that he played,
Xavier Johnson had a turnover 

706
00:35:37,000 --> 00:35:39,960
rate of 25.6%. 
So the reason I bring this up 

707
00:35:40,440 --> 00:35:43,760
is. 
It almost feels like the 

708
00:35:43,760 --> 00:35:46,360
offensive discipline that 
Indiana was playing with those 

709
00:35:46,360 --> 00:35:48,000
first couple of seasons under 
Woodson. 

710
00:35:48,000 --> 00:35:50,040
And maybe a lot of this had to 
do with the fact you had Trace 

711
00:35:50,040 --> 00:35:53,240
Jackson Davis drawing players in
defensively. 

712
00:35:53,280 --> 00:35:55,200
He could. 
He was a very good passer out of

713
00:35:55,200 --> 00:35:56,760
the post. 
That's gone now. 

714
00:35:57,440 --> 00:36:00,400
Indiana doesn't have that aspect
of their game. 

715
00:36:00,720 --> 00:36:03,840
And so it takes what's already 
kind of a tenuous offense to win

716
00:36:03,840 --> 00:36:08,120
games with and makes it even 
worse to win games with because 

717
00:36:08,120 --> 00:36:10,520
you're you're just missing those
extra possessions and that's 

718
00:36:10,520 --> 00:36:12,360
points that you can't afford to 
not score. 

719
00:36:12,920 --> 00:36:16,440
Yeah, no, I I completely agree. 
And it won't again, it just goes

720
00:36:16,440 --> 00:36:20,640
to a team that looks kind of 
undisciplined. 

721
00:36:20,760 --> 00:36:23,000
I mean, it's something we talk 
about in football, a lot of team

722
00:36:23,000 --> 00:36:27,040
that turns the ball over a lot. 
It it it oddly, it's oddly they 

723
00:36:27,040 --> 00:36:28,560
they look disciplined and 
undisciplined. 

724
00:36:28,560 --> 00:36:30,240
And what I mean is like they 
turn the ball over a lot. 

725
00:36:30,240 --> 00:36:33,160
They miss defensive assignments,
but yet they look disciplined in

726
00:36:33,160 --> 00:36:35,480
a way that Archie's team look 
the same way where it's like 

727
00:36:35,480 --> 00:36:39,760
they're they're so in their head
of trying to run whatever system

728
00:36:39,760 --> 00:36:41,800
they have to run it. 
It's almost like at times 

729
00:36:41,800 --> 00:36:43,680
they're not playing basketball. 
Like I remember there's 

730
00:36:43,680 --> 00:36:46,600
something Tony Adrani and I 
talked about, you know, with 

731
00:36:46,600 --> 00:36:48,640
like Rob Phenisee, like just 
kind of looks like dude, just go

732
00:36:48,640 --> 00:36:50,560
play hyper. 
Like he looks so in his own 

733
00:36:50,560 --> 00:36:52,360
head. 
And you see it with the way they

734
00:36:52,360 --> 00:36:54,360
play these Woodson teams the 
same way. 

735
00:36:54,360 --> 00:36:58,280
It's like they're so focused on 
trying to play whatever this 

736
00:36:58,280 --> 00:37:01,240
style is and get to the right 
place that they're not playing 

737
00:37:01,240 --> 00:37:04,040
basketball and they look both 
disciplined and undisciplined at

738
00:37:04,040 --> 00:37:07,160
the same time. 
Defensively, this was one of the

739
00:37:07,160 --> 00:37:09,360
things we talked about a lot at 
the end of last year. 

740
00:37:09,400 --> 00:37:12,960
And you know, as much rightful 
attention was paid to how bad 

741
00:37:12,960 --> 00:37:16,200
Indiana's offense was at times 
down the stretch last year, 

742
00:37:16,960 --> 00:37:19,360
defensively they were pretty 
deficient as well. 

743
00:37:19,360 --> 00:37:23,080
You know, they finished last 
year going off of Ken Palm, 84th

744
00:37:23,080 --> 00:37:25,840
in the country in adjusted 
defensive efficiency. 

745
00:37:26,840 --> 00:37:30,080
You know, so the idea was, 
always, and this was where I was

746
00:37:30,080 --> 00:37:32,480
a little skeptical about how 
good Indiana was going to be 

747
00:37:32,480 --> 00:37:34,040
this year, but I was going to 
give them the benefit of the 

748
00:37:34,040 --> 00:37:36,040
doubt. 
It's like you were 105th in 

749
00:37:36,040 --> 00:37:38,720
offensive efficiency and 84th in
defensive efficiency. 

750
00:37:38,720 --> 00:37:40,640
And if you're going to be a team
that's going to compete for a 

751
00:37:40,640 --> 00:37:44,280
Sweet 16, both of those numbers 
probably need to be in the top 

752
00:37:44,280 --> 00:37:47,360
20, at the very least the top 
30. 

753
00:37:48,160 --> 00:37:50,760
So, so far this year through 
seven games and you still got a 

754
00:37:50,760 --> 00:37:53,720
little bit of leakage from last 
year in the stats. 

755
00:37:54,280 --> 00:37:56,800
But according to Kenpom, 
Indiana's 48th in adjusted 

756
00:37:56,800 --> 00:38:01,400
offensive efficiency and 71st in
adjusted defensive efficiency. 

757
00:38:01,400 --> 00:38:05,080
Even if you take Torvic, which 
is generally a little bit kinder

758
00:38:05,080 --> 00:38:09,240
to Indiana for whatever reason, 
through these metrics, Torvic's 

759
00:38:09,240 --> 00:38:12,600
got Indiana 37th offensively and
65th defensively. 

760
00:38:12,600 --> 00:38:14,680
Still not good enough in either 
category. 

761
00:38:15,280 --> 00:38:18,920
The the defense is a real issue 
because you've obviously got 

762
00:38:18,920 --> 00:38:22,720
much better rim protection now 
with Ballo than you had last 

763
00:38:22,720 --> 00:38:25,880
year where wasn't quite the same
type of rim protector. 

764
00:38:25,880 --> 00:38:30,120
I mean, last year Indiana was 
54th in the country and block 

765
00:38:30,120 --> 00:38:34,360
percentage, they blocked 7.6% of
of shot attempts. 

766
00:38:34,360 --> 00:38:37,640
This year, the block percentage 
is lower, but Indiana's 18th in 

767
00:38:37,640 --> 00:38:39,160
the country. 
So they do have a legitimate rim

768
00:38:39,160 --> 00:38:43,760
protection right now, but it's 
not translating into defense. 

769
00:38:43,760 --> 00:38:47,240
And the reason why, Scott, if 
you look at the numbers, it's 

770
00:38:47,240 --> 00:38:50,160
not shooting percentage. 
Indiana is actually doing a 

771
00:38:50,160 --> 00:38:51,920
pretty good job of holding their
opponents. 

772
00:38:52,200 --> 00:38:55,160
Their opponents are only 
shooting 29.9% from three. 

773
00:38:55,400 --> 00:38:57,440
They're only shooting 48% from 
2. 

774
00:38:57,760 --> 00:39:00,360
Indiana is doing fine in those 
areas, but where they're getting

775
00:39:00,360 --> 00:39:03,880
killed right now is on the 
offensive glass for the other 

776
00:39:03,880 --> 00:39:07,080
team. 
Indiana is allowing a opponents 

777
00:39:07,080 --> 00:39:10,600
to get offensive rebounds at a 
33.5% clip. 

778
00:39:10,680 --> 00:39:13,280
That's 200 and 91st. 
And for those of you who've been

779
00:39:13,280 --> 00:39:16,120
following along, you know that 
an offensive rebound surrendered

780
00:39:16,280 --> 00:39:19,200
means an extended possession and
a greater chance for the other 

781
00:39:19,200 --> 00:39:23,120
team to score. 
So that's what worries me. 

782
00:39:23,120 --> 00:39:26,880
It's like you've got 2 bigs, and
unlike last year, you've got two

783
00:39:26,880 --> 00:39:29,560
bigs who are pretty much in 
vicinity of the post. 

784
00:39:30,200 --> 00:39:32,600
They're not rebounding, they're 
not getting good rebound 

785
00:39:32,600 --> 00:39:35,960
performances out of their guards
or their swing men, and so 

786
00:39:36,160 --> 00:39:37,640
they're undoing themselves 
there. 

787
00:39:37,640 --> 00:39:41,200
Now, is that a system issue or 
is that an effort issue? 

788
00:39:41,200 --> 00:39:43,360
It's probably a little bit of 
both, but it's worth noting. 

789
00:39:43,360 --> 00:39:47,400
Indiana was bad last year. 
At that, you know that where 

790
00:39:47,400 --> 00:39:49,720
Indiana really fell down last 
year defensively was they didn't

791
00:39:49,720 --> 00:39:51,560
force turnovers. 
Well, they're forcing more 

792
00:39:51,560 --> 00:39:53,600
turnovers this year. 
They're forcing 4% more 

793
00:39:53,600 --> 00:39:57,120
turnovers, but their offensive 
rebounding allowed has gone up 

794
00:39:57,120 --> 00:40:00,120
by 4 percentage points. 
So whatever gains they've gotten

795
00:40:00,120 --> 00:40:02,520
in the turnover forcing, they've
lost in the offensive 

796
00:40:02,520 --> 00:40:07,040
rebounding. 
It's it's all true. 

797
00:40:07,320 --> 00:40:12,200
Here's what's wild in Woodson's 
four years, you had Trace 

798
00:40:12,200 --> 00:40:15,000
Jackson Davis, who we can all 
agree was, I mean, a little bit 

799
00:40:15,000 --> 00:40:19,160
undersized, but just a 
unbelievable post player at IU. 

800
00:40:19,440 --> 00:40:23,800
The next year you have Khalil 
Ware who had a phenomenal year 

801
00:40:24,000 --> 00:40:27,160
was lottery pick or a high first
round pick, if not a lottery 

802
00:40:27,160 --> 00:40:29,360
pick. 
And then this year, by the way, 

803
00:40:29,360 --> 00:40:32,960
you also had Malik renew there 
in over, you know, overlapping, 

804
00:40:32,960 --> 00:40:35,360
though growing as a player. 
This year you have Malik Renew, 

805
00:40:35,360 --> 00:40:40,280
who's a a very solid home grown 
post player and you get Balo, 

806
00:40:40,280 --> 00:40:43,800
one of the best portal post 
players, you know, a 7 foot 

807
00:40:43,800 --> 00:40:47,440
beast of a guy. 
I'm looking at the offensive 

808
00:40:47,440 --> 00:40:50,200
rebounding, both defense, you 
know, against the defense and 

809
00:40:50,200 --> 00:40:53,880
our own offensive rebounding. 
The only year we've ever been in

810
00:40:53,880 --> 00:40:57,680
the top 100 in the country, it 
was Woodson's first year. 

811
00:40:57,960 --> 00:41:01,480
Our defensive allowed offensive 
rebound, we were 64th in the 

812
00:41:01,480 --> 00:41:05,160
country every other year. 
I mean, right now we're 200 and 

813
00:41:05,160 --> 00:41:08,000
91st in the country on giving up
offensive rebounds and us 

814
00:41:08,000 --> 00:41:10,720
getting offensive rebounds. 
We cracked it at 99 in the 

815
00:41:10,720 --> 00:41:14,520
country. 
To have that string of big men 

816
00:41:14,840 --> 00:41:17,360
coming through this and kind of 
becoming big men, you and 

817
00:41:17,360 --> 00:41:21,680
running your entire everything 
as a big man centered offense 

818
00:41:21,680 --> 00:41:27,320
and defense, to have these 
really sub optimal rebounding 

819
00:41:27,320 --> 00:41:31,960
numbers is kind of wild. 
And and that's, you know, just 

820
00:41:31,960 --> 00:41:34,040
taking a step back. 
That's what's so frustrating 

821
00:41:34,040 --> 00:41:36,240
with all of this. 
Galen is this is on the heels. 

822
00:41:36,240 --> 00:41:39,440
It's not like we lost recruits 
or we've had it. 

823
00:41:39,480 --> 00:41:42,520
Yeah, yes, Xavier Johnson was 
injured last year, but this is 

824
00:41:42,520 --> 00:41:47,040
coming off of back-to-back years
where I continue to say you give

825
00:41:47,040 --> 00:41:51,520
Woodson an A or an A+ in what he
brought in talent wise in the 

826
00:41:51,520 --> 00:41:53,680
offseason in both, recruit in 
both. 

827
00:41:53,880 --> 00:41:56,600
Sorry, not recruiting, but well,
some recruiting, but mostly in 

828
00:41:56,880 --> 00:41:59,560
flipping, flipping recruits and 
in the transfer portal. 

829
00:41:59,800 --> 00:42:04,120
So you I have a really hard time
saying, well, it's talent OR 

830
00:42:04,120 --> 00:42:06,120
we're not rebounding because we 
don't have the big men like you.

831
00:42:06,160 --> 00:42:09,800
You had a generational big man, 
you had a lottery pick, big man.

832
00:42:09,800 --> 00:42:13,560
You know how maybe the best 
portal big man, it can't be 

833
00:42:13,560 --> 00:42:15,440
talent. 
So that's why the the spotlight 

834
00:42:15,440 --> 00:42:19,360
continues to turn toward the 
coaching staff because in the 

835
00:42:19,360 --> 00:42:23,520
system, because you've had 
probably the best two years of 

836
00:42:23,520 --> 00:42:27,560
talent acquisition on this team 
and you're still seeing these 

837
00:42:27,560 --> 00:42:31,400
numbers that don't make a lot of
sense given what you have on the

838
00:42:31,400 --> 00:42:34,760
team position wise. 
Yeah, I mean, that's where I 

839
00:42:34,760 --> 00:42:36,920
keep going back and forth 
because there's clearly moments 

840
00:42:36,920 --> 00:42:42,480
when IU individual players just 
aren't doing the right things. 

841
00:42:43,080 --> 00:42:46,000
But it does kind of feel more 
systematic. 

842
00:42:46,000 --> 00:42:50,480
And and and it's it's a problem 
that it can get fixed, but it 

843
00:42:50,480 --> 00:42:53,840
needs to get fixed fast. 
And this is where, you know, to 

844
00:42:53,840 --> 00:42:56,840
some degree the lack of good non
conference opponents may be a 

845
00:42:56,840 --> 00:43:00,160
silver lining to some degree, 
but it may also be fool's gold. 

846
00:43:00,400 --> 00:43:03,640
Because I could see Indiana 
going out, winning the next few 

847
00:43:03,640 --> 00:43:07,080
games, coasting into the, you 
know, the start of the, the, 

848
00:43:07,160 --> 00:43:10,560
the, the real Big 10 schedule in
January, thinking they've got 

849
00:43:10,560 --> 00:43:13,360
this stuff solved and then 
having it fall apart. 

850
00:43:13,360 --> 00:43:15,840
And that's kind of what's 
happened to Indiana over the 

851
00:43:15,840 --> 00:43:18,080
course of the last few years. 
If you think about it, like go 

852
00:43:18,080 --> 00:43:23,080
back to Woodson's first season 
and you had a situation where 

853
00:43:23,080 --> 00:43:27,680
Indiana, they were 16 and 5:00 
and 7:00 and 4:00 at the end of 

854
00:43:27,680 --> 00:43:30,880
January. 
And then they lost five in a row

855
00:43:31,400 --> 00:43:34,920
and seven of nine. 
And they managed to pull 

856
00:43:34,920 --> 00:43:37,920
themselves together in the Big 
10 tournament, but they were 

857
00:43:37,920 --> 00:43:40,440
very close to not making the 
tournament at all the following 

858
00:43:40,440 --> 00:43:42,400
year. 
It kind of worked out, but 

859
00:43:42,400 --> 00:43:47,120
still, you know, Indiana lost 
four games down the stretch from

860
00:43:47,120 --> 00:43:51,560
January 31st to February 28th 
and and only won five in that 

861
00:43:51,560 --> 00:43:53,960
stretch. 
You know, last year was 

862
00:43:53,960 --> 00:43:57,920
obviously a real problem and 
that happened earlier from the 

863
00:43:57,920 --> 00:44:01,480
beginning of January to the end 
of February. 

864
00:44:01,720 --> 00:44:06,400
They lost what, 12345678 of 11 
games? 

865
00:44:07,720 --> 00:44:11,040
And so I do worry this year with
the amount that needs to be 

866
00:44:11,040 --> 00:44:14,560
fixed, either in the game 
planning or in the effort or 

867
00:44:14,560 --> 00:44:19,160
some combination of both. 
You don't have a lot of live 

868
00:44:19,200 --> 00:44:22,760
ammo experiences really with IU 
going up against good 

869
00:44:22,760 --> 00:44:25,440
competition. 
And while there's nobody stellar

870
00:44:25,440 --> 00:44:29,560
in the Big 10, you've also got a
lot of teams that are solidly in

871
00:44:29,560 --> 00:44:32,800
that kind of 15 to 50 range. 
And those are the teams that 

872
00:44:32,800 --> 00:44:34,920
Indiana has tended to struggle 
with in the Big 10. 

873
00:44:35,040 --> 00:44:36,800
Those are the teams you've got 
to figure out how to beat 

874
00:44:36,800 --> 00:44:39,760
consistently. 
And I don't know, and I don't 

875
00:44:39,760 --> 00:44:41,440
think any of us are going to 
know until they actually start 

876
00:44:41,440 --> 00:44:43,720
playing those games, whether 
Indiana will have fixed all of 

877
00:44:43,720 --> 00:44:46,080
the problems that we've seen pop
up here over the first seven 

878
00:44:46,080 --> 00:44:48,920
games. 
I mean, I'll, I'll ask you this 

879
00:44:48,920 --> 00:44:51,520
in kind of a roundabout way, 
like based on where we're at 

880
00:44:51,520 --> 00:44:56,440
now, what do you think Indiana 
would have to do win wise to get

881
00:44:56,480 --> 00:44:59,320
into the NCAA Tournament? 
And, and I, I ask it with this 

882
00:44:59,320 --> 00:45:03,360
caveat, is it right now on Ken 
Pom we are projected to go 17 

883
00:45:03,360 --> 00:45:05,280
and 14 and 9:00 and 11:00 in the
Big 10. 

884
00:45:05,520 --> 00:45:07,400
That's a projection, right? 
Things can change. 

885
00:45:07,440 --> 00:45:08,920
That's not going to be where it 
goes. 

886
00:45:09,440 --> 00:45:12,760
But I've you and I have been 
looking at Ken Pom for 20 years 

887
00:45:12,760 --> 00:45:15,760
now. 
I will say this, it's normally 

888
00:45:15,760 --> 00:45:18,240
not far off. 
Like normally you don't see a 

889
00:45:18,240 --> 00:45:22,280
team projected to go 9:00 and 
11:00 that goes 15 and five. 

890
00:45:22,960 --> 00:45:26,720
It could happen, it probably has
happened in some spots along the

891
00:45:26,720 --> 00:45:30,320
way, but most of the time you're
looking at maybe a two to 

892
00:45:30,320 --> 00:45:33,080
three-game variance and that's 
pretty extreme. 

893
00:45:33,440 --> 00:45:37,040
So looking at that as like, you 
know, if you say that twelve 

894
00:45:37,040 --> 00:45:41,560
wins is probably everything 
going right for Indiana, maybe 

895
00:45:41,560 --> 00:45:47,280
13, is that enough to get us, 
you know, solidly in the 

896
00:45:47,280 --> 00:45:50,600
tournament? 
What do you think? 

897
00:45:51,080 --> 00:45:54,800
So a lot of it depends on who 
the wins are against, not how 

898
00:45:54,800 --> 00:45:57,120
many wins there are. 
And this is where Atlantis, I 

899
00:45:57,120 --> 00:46:00,400
think we're going to look back 
on it and say this was a real 

900
00:46:00,400 --> 00:46:03,160
problem. 
And, and look, a lot of it is 

901
00:46:03,160 --> 00:46:07,200
bad strategy, frankly, in terms 
of scheduling because I, I 

902
00:46:07,200 --> 00:46:09,280
mentioned this on Twitter. 
I also mentioned it on the. 

903
00:46:09,680 --> 00:46:12,920
The the the. 
Podcast I did earlier, let's say

904
00:46:12,920 --> 00:46:15,360
Indiana beat Louisville. 
Let's just say they won that 

905
00:46:15,360 --> 00:46:17,000
game. 
You're you're so right on. 

906
00:46:17,040 --> 00:46:21,840
This they would have played West
Virginia and Oklahoma. 

907
00:46:22,040 --> 00:46:23,600
They wouldn't have played 
Gonzaga. 

908
00:46:23,760 --> 00:46:26,040
They wouldn't have played. 
They actually kind of got lucky,

909
00:46:26,320 --> 00:46:28,520
you know, in terms of a shot at 
playing a good team. 

910
00:46:28,640 --> 00:46:30,960
Gonzaga lost that first game, 
yeah. 

911
00:46:31,360 --> 00:46:33,200
And then we, you know, they of 
course, Indiana loses that game 

912
00:46:33,200 --> 00:46:37,520
anyway. 
But you know, you can't take 

913
00:46:37,520 --> 00:46:40,960
bracket style exempt tournaments
and just count on the idea that 

914
00:46:40,960 --> 00:46:42,280
the best teams are going to 
advance. 

915
00:46:42,280 --> 00:46:43,480
And that's been extreme this 
year. 

916
00:46:43,480 --> 00:46:46,480
I mean, look what happened in 
Maui with UConn, Iowa State 

917
00:46:46,480 --> 00:46:50,800
losing in the first round. 
So you look at the schedule now,

918
00:46:50,800 --> 00:46:55,080
Indiana's best win is a home win
against South Carolina, who's 

919
00:46:55,080 --> 00:46:56,120
not going to make the 
tournament. 

920
00:46:56,120 --> 00:46:58,800
They just beat Providence, who's
also not going to make the 

921
00:46:58,800 --> 00:47:01,080
tournament. 
Their remaining non conference 

922
00:47:01,080 --> 00:47:03,200
schedule, they have four games 
left. 

923
00:47:04,160 --> 00:47:06,720
They have Sammy Houston State 
who's 126 in Kenpom. 

924
00:47:06,720 --> 00:47:08,640
They're not going to. 
That's not going to matter. 

925
00:47:08,640 --> 00:47:11,440
That's not going to help. 
Miami of Ohio is 185th in 

926
00:47:11,440 --> 00:47:12,720
Kenpom, that's not going to 
help. 

927
00:47:12,840 --> 00:47:16,440
Chattanooga is 171st in Kenpom, 
that's not going to help. 

928
00:47:16,800 --> 00:47:19,360
Winthrop is 165, that's not 
going to help. 

929
00:47:19,360 --> 00:47:22,720
And the problem with these 
games, and this is where we've 

930
00:47:22,720 --> 00:47:27,840
talked a lot about the ideal 
approach to scheduling, you've 

931
00:47:27,840 --> 00:47:31,120
got to beat those teams by at 
least the margins that you're 

932
00:47:31,120 --> 00:47:33,280
being projected. 
And that's hard against those 

933
00:47:33,280 --> 00:47:36,840
kind of 100 to 200 style teams, 
especially if you are not 

934
00:47:36,840 --> 00:47:40,240
totally clicking as a a roster 
yourself. 

935
00:47:40,680 --> 00:47:44,080
Because right now Indiana, 
according to Kenpom, in order to

936
00:47:44,080 --> 00:47:46,840
get positive benefits metrics 
wise going to have to beat Sam 

937
00:47:46,840 --> 00:47:51,000
Houston State by at least 12, 
Miami of Ohio by at least 15, 

938
00:47:51,080 --> 00:47:54,680
Chattanooga by at least 15 and 
Winter by at least 15. 

939
00:47:56,200 --> 00:47:58,120
And this is. 
Or this is a team this year and 

940
00:47:58,120 --> 00:48:00,680
last year that it looks like 
they have a hard time locking in

941
00:48:00,680 --> 00:48:04,080
for 40 minutes, which is what 
you have to do to put some of 

942
00:48:04,080 --> 00:48:05,720
these teams away. 
And I mean, all you have to do 

943
00:48:05,720 --> 00:48:08,880
is look at that UNC Greensboro 
game, right, which was another 

944
00:48:08,880 --> 00:48:11,520
one where they needed to win by 
more points than what they won 

945
00:48:11,520 --> 00:48:13,200
in that game. 
Now, they did give them credit. 

946
00:48:13,200 --> 00:48:15,240
They beat Providence by 
significantly more. 

947
00:48:15,240 --> 00:48:18,840
So they do have that gear. 
My point, though, is that you 

948
00:48:18,840 --> 00:48:21,120
take those games out, none of 
those four games are going to 

949
00:48:21,120 --> 00:48:22,720
help Indiana make the 
tournament. 

950
00:48:22,720 --> 00:48:25,520
And in fact, they could all hurt
Indiana's chances of making the 

951
00:48:25,520 --> 00:48:27,560
tournament. 
If they don't win convincingly 

952
00:48:27,560 --> 00:48:29,960
in each of them, then you get 
into the Big 10. 

953
00:48:30,840 --> 00:48:34,160
So right now, Torvic is 
projecting Indiana with an 

954
00:48:34,160 --> 00:48:36,720
overall record of 18 and 13 and 
10 and 10. 

955
00:48:37,040 --> 00:48:39,880
Ken Poms got them at 17 and 14 
and 9:00 and 11:00. 

956
00:48:39,880 --> 00:48:45,040
Prior to the Providence game, 
the projection was like 16 and 

957
00:48:45,040 --> 00:48:49,200
15 and 8:00 and 12:00. 
So if you look at the schedule 

958
00:48:49,200 --> 00:48:52,480
that Indiana's got right now, 
first of all, I'll note that if 

959
00:48:52,480 --> 00:48:55,840
you take the Ken Pom 
probabilities right now, it has 

960
00:48:55,840 --> 00:49:01,800
Indiana losing 6 games and eight
of their last ten in a row, six 

961
00:49:01,800 --> 00:49:05,280
in a row and eight of their last
ten from the end of January to 

962
00:49:05,280 --> 00:49:07,080
the end of or to the middle of 
March. 

963
00:49:07,160 --> 00:49:09,240
Looking at the Kenpom 
projections, January and 

964
00:49:09,240 --> 00:49:11,920
February would be a We might 
need to get the Counting Crows 

965
00:49:11,920 --> 00:49:14,560
to redo their song along 
December and make it long. 

966
00:49:14,560 --> 00:49:18,160
January and along January you 
have loss, loss, loss, loss, 

967
00:49:18,160 --> 00:49:21,480
home win against Maryland and 
then loss, loss, loss, loss, 

968
00:49:21,480 --> 00:49:23,840
loss, loss. 
And then win, win. 

969
00:49:23,840 --> 00:49:26,200
And then two more losses to 
close out the season. 

970
00:49:26,200 --> 00:49:29,000
So what are the marquee games 
left on Indiana's schedule? 

971
00:49:29,880 --> 00:49:32,600
So you've got there, this is 
where you first look at Rd. 

972
00:49:32,600 --> 00:49:34,080
games. 
So here's the road games that 

973
00:49:34,080 --> 00:49:35,720
Indiana's got the rest of the 
season. 

974
00:49:35,720 --> 00:49:39,080
They've got to go to Nebraska, a
place that's been a joy to play 

975
00:49:39,080 --> 00:49:42,200
in for Indiana recently. 
What you said before and it's 

976
00:49:42,200 --> 00:49:46,240
like it's 100% true. 
It's just like take a period it,

977
00:49:46,240 --> 00:49:48,160
it shouldn't be that way. 
Like that's insane that we just 

978
00:49:48,160 --> 00:49:50,200
like Nebraska, like we keep 
adding these. 

979
00:49:50,440 --> 00:49:52,760
We should be getting rid of like
Wisconsin being a house, but we 

980
00:49:52,760 --> 00:49:55,520
just keep adding houses of 
horrors to our Big 10 schedule. 

981
00:49:55,520 --> 00:49:58,360
It's like East Lansing now. 
Nebraska, Really. 

982
00:49:58,760 --> 00:50:02,120
Sorry, no, you're right. 
Then then that's your that's 

983
00:50:02,120 --> 00:50:04,480
your December Rd. game. 
That's on a Friday. 

984
00:50:04,560 --> 00:50:07,080
That's that's a great Friday 
right before finals. 

985
00:50:07,280 --> 00:50:08,840
Real motivation on the road 
there. 

986
00:50:08,840 --> 00:50:10,280
If you're any TI don't care who 
you are. 

987
00:50:10,280 --> 00:50:13,920
Indiana, whoever, then their 
next Rd. game in the Big 10 is 

988
00:50:13,920 --> 00:50:17,280
at Penn State, another place 
that's been just a tremendous 

989
00:50:17,280 --> 00:50:20,760
trip here lately for Indiana. 
Then you go down the list, you 

990
00:50:20,760 --> 00:50:22,920
got to go to Iowa. 
Again, not a place Indiana has 

991
00:50:22,920 --> 00:50:25,400
historically played that well 
at. 

992
00:50:25,400 --> 00:50:28,320
Ohio State that that's a marquee
game. 

993
00:50:28,320 --> 00:50:30,560
That's the type. 
And Indiana did go in there and 

994
00:50:30,560 --> 00:50:33,520
win surprisingly last year. 
But you've got a new coach. 

995
00:50:33,680 --> 00:50:35,840
That was kind of the game that 
got Chris Holtman fired, if I 

996
00:50:35,840 --> 00:50:39,560
remember correctly. 
They have to go to Northwestern,

997
00:50:39,640 --> 00:50:42,000
not a place Indiana has played 
particularly well, and also not 

998
00:50:42,000 --> 00:50:44,160
a game you're going to get much 
juice from because 

999
00:50:44,160 --> 00:50:46,600
Northwestern's 65th right now in
Kenpalm. 

1000
00:50:46,600 --> 00:50:50,880
You're that's not going to count
as a good win at Purdue, at 

1001
00:50:50,880 --> 00:50:57,960
Wisconsin, at Michigan State, 
and then you get at Washington, 

1002
00:50:58,600 --> 00:51:00,520
which Indiana is projected to 
win by a point. 

1003
00:51:00,640 --> 00:51:03,920
And then you got to also do at 
Oregon on the same trip and 

1004
00:51:03,920 --> 00:51:06,440
Oregon's legitimately good. 
So out of all of that, your 

1005
00:51:06,440 --> 00:51:11,280
marquee opportunities are at 
Ohio State, at Purdue, at 

1006
00:51:11,280 --> 00:51:14,840
Wisconsin, maybe at Michigan 
State and at Oregon. 

1007
00:51:15,240 --> 00:51:19,840
So I think you got to win two of
those games if if you have no 

1008
00:51:19,840 --> 00:51:23,440
non conference victories, I 
think you need two wins in those

1009
00:51:23,440 --> 00:51:27,320
types of games. 
To try to develop a resume that 

1010
00:51:27,320 --> 00:51:30,000
isn't just a. 
Hold homecourt right and and 

1011
00:51:30,000 --> 00:51:32,840
hold pretty good serve. 
At home you can, you can afford 

1012
00:51:32,840 --> 00:51:34,800
a couple of losses at home. 
I don't think, I don't think 

1013
00:51:34,800 --> 00:51:36,880
you're at a point now, 
especially with the unbalanced 

1014
00:51:36,880 --> 00:51:38,440
schedules. 
But it's like look at the teams 

1015
00:51:38,440 --> 00:51:42,200
that Indiana's got coming in. 
They've they've got Illinois and

1016
00:51:42,200 --> 00:51:44,120
I'm this is not all of them. 
This is just the marquee ones. 

1017
00:51:44,120 --> 00:51:46,400
They get Illinois at home on the
14th of January. 

1018
00:51:46,960 --> 00:51:50,760
They got Maryland, who's semi 
decent on the 26th of January. 

1019
00:51:50,760 --> 00:51:53,560
They're 34th in Kent Palm. 
They got Michigan, who looks 

1020
00:51:53,560 --> 00:51:58,120
legitimately pretty decent. 
They're 22nd in Kent Palm. 

1021
00:51:58,440 --> 00:52:03,520
You got UCLA on Valentine's Day,
who's 17th in Kent Palm. 

1022
00:52:03,600 --> 00:52:07,280
You've got Purdue on the 23rd at
the Sunday game and then you got

1023
00:52:07,280 --> 00:52:10,920
Ohio State at home, so that's 
six games there and you probably

1024
00:52:10,920 --> 00:52:13,600
need to win five of those four, 
four. 

1025
00:52:13,680 --> 00:52:16,320
I think if you win 2 Rd. games, 
you could afford to go four and 

1026
00:52:16,320 --> 00:52:18,440
two in those, but you got to win
all the rest of your games as 

1027
00:52:18,440 --> 00:52:20,480
well. 
Now, again, I'm not saying 

1028
00:52:20,480 --> 00:52:23,320
Indiana can't do that. 
I think Indiana's got the talent

1029
00:52:23,320 --> 00:52:26,800
to do it. 
I don't think Indiana is playing

1030
00:52:27,120 --> 00:52:30,960
a style of basketball or playing
consistently enough over 40 

1031
00:52:30,960 --> 00:52:33,280
minutes that they will be able 
to win all of those games. 

1032
00:52:33,280 --> 00:52:35,280
But that's essentially the road 
that's in front of them. 

1033
00:52:35,640 --> 00:52:39,520
And oh, by the way, you also 
can't afford the random stumbles

1034
00:52:39,720 --> 00:52:42,760
that we've seen Indiana have 
consistently over the course. 

1035
00:52:43,320 --> 00:52:46,520
Of, you know, really the last 
decade, you know, you, you can't

1036
00:52:46,520 --> 00:52:50,480
afford to lose at home to Penn 
State like Indiana did last year

1037
00:52:50,480 --> 00:52:53,480
when they lost by 14. 
You can't afford to lose at home

1038
00:52:53,480 --> 00:52:56,760
to Northwestern like Indiana did
last year or Nebraska like 

1039
00:52:56,760 --> 00:52:58,800
Indiana did last year. 
You're just not going to have 

1040
00:52:58,800 --> 00:53:01,440
that flexibility. 
And and that is something that's

1041
00:53:01,440 --> 00:53:03,960
really concerning. 
It's going to take a level of 

1042
00:53:03,960 --> 00:53:07,600
consistency and focus that we 
just haven't seen on the non 

1043
00:53:07,600 --> 00:53:10,320
trace Jackson Davis rosters thus
far. 

1044
00:53:11,040 --> 00:53:14,840
Where does that where does that 
stability come from this year? 

1045
00:53:15,320 --> 00:53:17,600
You know, is this where Trey 
Galloway's able to take the team

1046
00:53:17,600 --> 00:53:20,640
and put them on his shoulders? 
I don't know if Trey Galloway's 

1047
00:53:20,640 --> 00:53:24,160
really capable of doing quite. 
That from where he sits within 

1048
00:53:24,160 --> 00:53:26,360
the the pecking order on the 
roster and what he brings to the

1049
00:53:26,360 --> 00:53:28,400
table. 
But I'm not sure who else it 

1050
00:53:28,400 --> 00:53:31,480
comes from. 
And that is a real concern as 

1051
00:53:31,480 --> 00:53:35,280
you think about like gaming out.
What would Indiana need to do to

1052
00:53:35,280 --> 00:53:38,920
even make the field, let alone 
be in an advantageous seating 

1053
00:53:38,920 --> 00:53:41,000
situation? 
That seems even more difficult 

1054
00:53:41,000 --> 00:53:43,960
at this point, unless. 
You see a big turn around when 

1055
00:53:44,200 --> 00:53:47,080
just making the field does feel 
and we're just we're talking 

1056
00:53:47,080 --> 00:53:50,120
here, not saying it, but if that
becomes it does feel like that's

1057
00:53:50,120 --> 00:53:53,000
moving the goal posts because it
always felt like this year it 

1058
00:53:53,160 --> 00:53:55,160
was like, all right, well, this 
is this is a roster where you 

1059
00:53:55,160 --> 00:53:58,280
could compete for a big 10 
title, No worst be third or 

1060
00:53:58,280 --> 00:54:01,440
fourth in the big 10 and really 
go for a protected seed in the 

1061
00:54:01,440 --> 00:54:05,000
tournament. 
You know, this is I'm I'm sorry,

1062
00:54:05,000 --> 00:54:07,880
I'm going to take a step back 
just and and go back to the 

1063
00:54:07,880 --> 00:54:09,800
schedule. 
But you know, I was also 

1064
00:54:09,800 --> 00:54:13,400
thinking of this, that it it it 
it it feels like we're losing 

1065
00:54:13,400 --> 00:54:18,200
the thread of of what Indiana 
basketball was just little bit, 

1066
00:54:18,200 --> 00:54:20,120
little bit. 
And what what I mean by that is 

1067
00:54:20,680 --> 00:54:23,560
as you're rattling off that non 
conference, I think back to you 

1068
00:54:23,560 --> 00:54:27,760
did a great podcast couple years
ago, one of the the history of, 

1069
00:54:27,760 --> 00:54:30,920
you know, sports. 
You did like 93 Indiana 

1070
00:54:30,920 --> 00:54:34,040
basketball and you look at their
non conference and it is just 

1071
00:54:34,080 --> 00:54:36,400
banger after banger. 
It's like just a great, you 

1072
00:54:36,400 --> 00:54:39,200
know, greatest hits album, just,
you know, play the top 15 team, 

1073
00:54:39,200 --> 00:54:41,320
top twelve team. 
But that was something, you 

1074
00:54:41,320 --> 00:54:43,800
know, I remember going with my 
dad to games, you know, every 

1075
00:54:44,000 --> 00:54:46,560
November in Assembly Hall, like,
Oh yeah, Kansas. 

1076
00:54:46,560 --> 00:54:48,680
No, we got Kentucky coming or 
not Kentucky, but you know, we 

1077
00:54:48,720 --> 00:54:51,320
have we have Kansas or we have, 
you know, a spunky UTEP team or 

1078
00:54:51,320 --> 00:54:53,960
just you you'd have a lot of 
these big games. 

1079
00:54:54,520 --> 00:54:56,480
Now as a ticket holder, it's 
like, all right, I get South 

1080
00:54:56,480 --> 00:54:59,320
Carolina that that's awesome. 
Like and that like that is 

1081
00:54:59,320 --> 00:55:01,040
something real. 
As somebody who pays for 

1082
00:55:01,040 --> 00:55:04,120
tickets, it's like it does suck 
that all of the non conference 

1083
00:55:04,120 --> 00:55:07,400
games are just kind of garbage 
wins that we kind of struggle to

1084
00:55:07,400 --> 00:55:11,680
get through. 
And then the other piece is, you

1085
00:55:11,680 --> 00:55:15,040
know, you mentioned like Trey 
Galloway, so much of Indiana 

1086
00:55:15,040 --> 00:55:18,720
basketball has. 
And I, I, I take a minute while,

1087
00:55:18,720 --> 00:55:20,480
as I say this, I don't want to 
get too far down this road, but 

1088
00:55:20,480 --> 00:55:23,000
it's been about having a team 
of, you know, people from 

1089
00:55:23,000 --> 00:55:25,120
Indiana having, you know, and I 
don't believe you have to 

1090
00:55:25,120 --> 00:55:27,200
recruit just the state to, to be
good. 

1091
00:55:28,080 --> 00:55:31,040
But the, you look at the title, 
the, the really good teams have 

1092
00:55:31,040 --> 00:55:32,480
always had some Indiana kids on 
it. 

1093
00:55:32,480 --> 00:55:34,000
Like that's always been 
something and that's been 

1094
00:55:34,000 --> 00:55:36,200
something unique about Indiana 
basketball. 

1095
00:55:36,200 --> 00:55:38,640
It's not just UNLV. 
We're just going to get dudes in

1096
00:55:38,640 --> 00:55:41,760
and just pay to play and do it. 
Like Indiana basketball does 

1097
00:55:41,760 --> 00:55:43,000
have an ethos. 
So I don't want to get into 

1098
00:55:43,000 --> 00:55:46,160
going the right way. 
But you've always had Indiana 

1099
00:55:46,160 --> 00:55:48,520
kids kind of lead Indiana, even 
in the last couple years. 

1100
00:55:48,520 --> 00:55:50,680
You have the Yogi Ferrell team. 
It's kid from Indiana, Cody 

1101
00:55:50,680 --> 00:55:52,040
Zeller. 
You know, that team had also 

1102
00:55:52,040 --> 00:55:55,080
had, you know, Jordan Halls and 
it can work. 

1103
00:55:55,360 --> 00:55:57,560
Look up at West Lafayette like 
they're doing with Indiana 

1104
00:55:57,560 --> 00:55:59,920
players up there. 
You kind of lost that thread 

1105
00:55:59,920 --> 00:56:02,720
with this team as well. 
And now it just becomes all 

1106
00:56:02,720 --> 00:56:05,120
right, man, just win. 
Like it's like, all right, I'm 

1107
00:56:05,120 --> 00:56:07,640
not paying to see great games in
the non conference. 

1108
00:56:07,880 --> 00:56:11,080
I don't really have players that
I've connected with or that have

1109
00:56:11,080 --> 00:56:13,760
come through the Indiana 
basketball system, which leads 

1110
00:56:13,760 --> 00:56:15,960
to your point of like, who 
really is leading this team? 

1111
00:56:16,720 --> 00:56:19,680
And I think this is all part of 
that Stew where it's like, all 

1112
00:56:19,680 --> 00:56:23,360
right, it just now it's it's a 
business decision, like just win

1113
00:56:23,360 --> 00:56:25,840
games because that's all you. 
You've kind of ripped away all 

1114
00:56:25,840 --> 00:56:29,960
the other pieces of playing some
unique teams and not having, you

1115
00:56:29,960 --> 00:56:32,440
know, that that threat of 
Indiana players on the team. 

1116
00:56:34,000 --> 00:56:35,760
Yeah. 
You know, look, it's, it's one 

1117
00:56:35,760 --> 00:56:37,360
of those things. 
There's a, there's a cultural 

1118
00:56:37,360 --> 00:56:39,880
aspect to it. 
There's A and what I mean by 

1119
00:56:39,880 --> 00:56:44,400
that is when you're the, the 
basketball's changing, college 

1120
00:56:44,400 --> 00:56:46,400
basketball's changing, college 
sports are changing. 

1121
00:56:46,400 --> 00:56:50,000
And, and so I think it's really 
easy to get caught up too much. 

1122
00:56:50,000 --> 00:56:52,080
And well, we used to do things 
this way and we had success. 

1123
00:56:52,440 --> 00:56:59,440
But I think your point is valid 
because there's, there's clearly

1124
00:56:59,520 --> 00:57:01,600
we've had good individual 
players come in. 

1125
00:57:01,600 --> 00:57:04,080
Khalil Ware was a good 
individual player that came in 

1126
00:57:04,560 --> 00:57:08,680
and he performed well. 
He got himself drafted, but 

1127
00:57:08,680 --> 00:57:11,480
there was just like that team 
was not very good. 

1128
00:57:11,760 --> 00:57:15,000
And so, you know, you've had 
that in IU history before where 

1129
00:57:15,000 --> 00:57:17,480
you've had good individual 
performers, but then you've had 

1130
00:57:17,760 --> 00:57:21,080
things not work, you know, well,
for the team overall. 

1131
00:57:21,080 --> 00:57:24,000
Walt Bellamy, I mean, he was on 
teams that were on probation. 

1132
00:57:24,000 --> 00:57:27,480
So it's kind of like, you know, 
great player, top draft pick and

1133
00:57:27,760 --> 00:57:30,640
couldn't quite get it done. 
But it's Noah. 

1134
00:57:30,680 --> 00:57:32,520
Noah Vonleh is another one. 
Yeah, absolutely. 

1135
00:57:32,520 --> 00:57:36,320
So these things do occur, but I 
guess what what's problematic 

1136
00:57:36,320 --> 00:57:40,360
here is you're, it almost feels 
like you're not giving yourself 

1137
00:57:40,360 --> 00:57:42,880
the best chance to win with 
those types of players. 

1138
00:57:42,880 --> 00:57:49,440
And as you mentioned, there's a,
a gradually less tied in core 

1139
00:57:49,440 --> 00:57:53,480
of, of, of fans because you 
don't have the this constant 

1140
00:57:53,480 --> 00:57:55,320
success that's tying you to the 
program. 

1141
00:57:55,720 --> 00:57:57,320
You don't have the development 
of players. 

1142
00:57:57,320 --> 00:57:59,680
And again, that's probably going
away just in general in college 

1143
00:57:59,680 --> 00:58:01,800
basketball. 
But it does leave Indiana in 

1144
00:58:01,800 --> 00:58:04,680
this weird spot where so many of
the things that the program was 

1145
00:58:04,680 --> 00:58:07,600
built on just don't seem to be 
working particularly well. 

1146
00:58:07,880 --> 00:58:10,960
And what's the solution? 
Like, how does that get 

1147
00:58:10,960 --> 00:58:13,080
answered? 
And this is where I my hope, and

1148
00:58:13,080 --> 00:58:16,440
just to kind of finish things 
off here, my hope was that we 

1149
00:58:16,520 --> 00:58:19,440
were actually getting changes 
that that the systems were going

1150
00:58:19,440 --> 00:58:22,440
to change, that the teams were 
going to go out and play with a 

1151
00:58:22,440 --> 00:58:25,200
renewed sense of togetherness 
and focus. 

1152
00:58:25,720 --> 00:58:28,760
And look, that could still 
happen this year, that the 

1153
00:58:28,760 --> 00:58:33,560
system's changing becomes 
progressively less likely every 

1154
00:58:33,560 --> 00:58:36,440
time we see, you know, a game go
by. 

1155
00:58:37,040 --> 00:58:40,760
But the the effort levels and 
the intensity and the focus 

1156
00:58:40,760 --> 00:58:42,480
could still be there and 
coalesce. 

1157
00:58:43,040 --> 00:58:44,720
I think that's what Indiana 
needs at this point. 

1158
00:58:44,720 --> 00:58:47,840
And I think as as much as the 
fan base reacted negatively, 

1159
00:58:47,840 --> 00:58:51,320
understandably so to those 
Atlantis games, you know, they 

1160
00:58:51,320 --> 00:58:54,520
did react well to like Langdon 
Hatton playing really hard and 

1161
00:58:54,520 --> 00:58:57,000
Luke Goody showing fire in the 
in the huddle. 

1162
00:58:57,320 --> 00:58:59,080
That's good. 
We want to see those things. 

1163
00:58:59,080 --> 00:59:01,040
People like the effort that Trey
Galloway gives. 

1164
00:59:02,520 --> 00:59:04,840
You know, I think that I've 
liked individual moments with 

1165
00:59:04,840 --> 00:59:06,720
Miles Rice and I'm hoping that 
he's going to settle in. 

1166
00:59:06,720 --> 00:59:09,000
I've liked some of the 
individual moments on offense. 

1167
00:59:09,320 --> 00:59:11,680
With Renew and with Balo. 
But then there's been some 

1168
00:59:11,680 --> 00:59:15,120
things with fouls, with Renew, 
with defensive effort, with from

1169
00:59:15,120 --> 00:59:18,000
Balo, where you're just like, 
OK, I can't feel completely 

1170
00:59:18,000 --> 00:59:20,360
great about that. 
And you can kind of go down the 

1171
00:59:20,360 --> 00:59:21,840
list with every player on the 
roster. 

1172
00:59:21,840 --> 00:59:24,240
There's something to like about 
all of them, but they don't 

1173
00:59:24,240 --> 00:59:27,760
really seem to be coalescing 
into something that you can feel

1174
00:59:27,920 --> 00:59:30,240
confident going into a game and 
saying, hey, we're going to win 

1175
00:59:30,240 --> 00:59:32,360
this game. 
That's my big hope for Indiana 

1176
00:59:32,360 --> 00:59:35,720
is that that changes over the 
course of the next couple of 

1177
00:59:35,720 --> 00:59:39,280
weeks that you really start to 
get, you know, you you get 

1178
00:59:39,280 --> 00:59:42,280
Mackenzie and Baca rolling on 
both ends of the floor as 

1179
00:59:42,280 --> 00:59:43,920
opposed to just the offensive 
side. 

1180
00:59:43,920 --> 00:59:45,840
You get Cannon Carlisle back 
from injury. 

1181
00:59:46,040 --> 00:59:48,400
You get Bryson Tucker more 
minutes and hopefully get his 

1182
00:59:48,640 --> 00:59:50,160
overall offensive performance 
up. 

1183
00:59:50,160 --> 00:59:52,320
There's there's so many little 
things that add up to big 

1184
00:59:52,320 --> 00:59:54,720
things. 
I just don't know what the route

1185
00:59:54,720 --> 00:59:57,280
is for Indiana other than that 
that because right now they kind

1186
00:59:57,280 --> 00:59:59,800
of are who they are. 
They're going to have to play 

1187
00:59:59,800 --> 01:00:02,920
significantly over their heads 
moving forward to be 

1188
01:00:02,920 --> 01:00:05,160
significantly better than they 
currently are right now. 

1189
01:00:05,160 --> 01:00:07,960
And I'm not sure that that's the
trajectory that they're on at 

1190
01:00:07,960 --> 01:00:09,760
this point. 
Yeah, I mean, I would just I 

1191
01:00:09,760 --> 01:00:12,840
would caution everybody and I 
have to caution myself too. 

1192
01:00:12,840 --> 01:00:15,280
Like just don't don't get 
yourself in the in the the 

1193
01:00:15,280 --> 01:00:16,800
thought process. 
Like, well, they can just start 

1194
01:00:16,800 --> 01:00:18,440
shooting more 3. 
It's going to be like if this 

1195
01:00:18,440 --> 01:00:21,200
team is not going to do that, 
like we there's enough evidence 

1196
01:00:21,200 --> 01:00:23,080
now that would be out of the 
realm. 

1197
01:00:23,080 --> 01:00:27,520
So I look at it as I'm curious 
to see where they're going to 

1198
01:00:27,520 --> 01:00:30,960
try and become the most 
efficient in the country at. 

1199
01:00:30,960 --> 01:00:33,040
Are they going to try and bring 
their turnovers down? 

1200
01:00:33,040 --> 01:00:35,520
Because I, I think rebounding 
would be the place to go. 

1201
01:00:35,720 --> 01:00:38,160
And that's what I would be 
looking at is can they become 

1202
01:00:38,400 --> 01:00:42,480
just an elite rebounding team on
either side of the ball? 

1203
01:00:42,600 --> 01:00:45,920
Can they just get more and more 
efficient on offense or maybe 

1204
01:00:45,920 --> 01:00:47,400
bring their defensive stats 
down? 

1205
01:00:47,760 --> 01:00:50,120
I would just urge everybody 
don't get in the fallacy of 

1206
01:00:50,120 --> 01:00:51,920
like, oh, well, they can just 
start shooting more threes. 

1207
01:00:51,920 --> 01:00:55,400
Or you have the one game where 
Mbako, you know, shoots, you 

1208
01:00:55,400 --> 01:00:58,080
know, 6 from 10 from three. 
It's like, all right, now we're 

1209
01:00:58,080 --> 01:01:00,200
going to start shooting threes. 
Like, I don't think that's going

1210
01:01:00,200 --> 01:01:02,480
to be the route because it just 
hasn't been. 

1211
01:01:02,480 --> 01:01:04,440
You've had these old blips of 
games where you shoot a bunch of

1212
01:01:04,440 --> 01:01:07,320
threes and then we go back to 
either not shooting threes or 

1213
01:01:07,320 --> 01:01:10,560
shooting them poorly. 
I, I think that's, I think 

1214
01:01:10,560 --> 01:01:12,880
everyone's in a better mindset. 
If you just start looking at 

1215
01:01:12,880 --> 01:01:15,600
other places like, hey, maybe 
and I think hopefully the 

1216
01:01:15,600 --> 01:01:17,160
coaching staff is doing the same
thing. 

1217
01:01:17,160 --> 01:01:20,160
You know, they they have this. 
We've we've railed on the 

1218
01:01:20,160 --> 01:01:22,000
schedule. 
But the good thing is you do 

1219
01:01:22,000 --> 01:01:25,320
have this moment where you have 
a nice little basically month 

1220
01:01:25,320 --> 01:01:29,000
runway between now and January 
5th where you can be in the lab 

1221
01:01:29,000 --> 01:01:31,920
and can you work some stuff out?
And can you work with your post 

1222
01:01:31,920 --> 01:01:35,800
players to get them to put the 
effort and the discipline to go 

1223
01:01:35,800 --> 01:01:37,560
out and and rebound at a high 
level? 

1224
01:01:37,560 --> 01:01:40,320
Because there's really nothing. 
This team is big. 

1225
01:01:40,480 --> 01:01:42,080
Like you watch them, it's like, 
dude, this team is big. 

1226
01:01:42,080 --> 01:01:44,120
They're large, They're they're 
imposing. 

1227
01:01:44,240 --> 01:01:46,880
There's no reason why they 
couldn't be a top 2030 team in 

1228
01:01:46,880 --> 01:01:49,680
the country on offensive and 
defensive rebounding. 

1229
01:01:49,680 --> 01:01:52,800
And if you do that, it covers up
a lot of the three-point 

1230
01:01:52,800 --> 01:01:54,640
shooting, It covers up a lot of 
the turnovers. 

1231
01:01:55,080 --> 01:01:58,400
So that that's what I'm going to
hopefully look for over the next

1232
01:01:58,400 --> 01:02:01,760
couple of weeks because they 
they do have a runway to get 

1233
01:02:01,760 --> 01:02:05,920
5678 wins here kind of right. 
The ship put the Atlantis thing 

1234
01:02:05,920 --> 01:02:09,480
behind them and then get into 
the meat of that January 

1235
01:02:09,480 --> 01:02:12,840
schedule with hopefully kind of 
a new identity in those 

1236
01:02:12,840 --> 01:02:16,280
respects. 
Yeah, I mean, from my point, you

1237
01:02:16,280 --> 01:02:18,560
know, from my vantage point, 
when I look at the stats as we 

1238
01:02:18,560 --> 01:02:22,040
close things up here, like 
you've got two top 300 scorers 

1239
01:02:22,040 --> 01:02:25,040
from an efficiency perspective 
in the country right now in 

1240
01:02:25,040 --> 01:02:27,440
Mackenzie and Bacco and Malik 
Renew. 

1241
01:02:27,600 --> 01:02:31,520
You have a top 50 guy in assists
in Trey Galloway in relatively 

1242
01:02:31,520 --> 01:02:35,520
limited minutes. 
You've got Omar Barlow, who's 

1243
01:02:35,520 --> 01:02:37,960
got one of the best effective 
field goal percentages in the 

1244
01:02:37,960 --> 01:02:41,840
entire country. 
These are not numbers that 

1245
01:02:41,840 --> 01:02:44,840
should be equating to A5 and two
team whose best win is at home 

1246
01:02:44,840 --> 01:02:48,920
against South Carolina and who 
lost by a combined, what you 

1247
01:02:48,920 --> 01:02:53,320
know, 44 points against the two 
teams with a pulse that they 

1248
01:02:53,320 --> 01:02:56,200
played on their schedule so far.
So look, the pieces are there. 

1249
01:02:56,760 --> 01:02:58,200
There's got to be more 
coalescing. 

1250
01:02:58,200 --> 01:02:59,800
There's got to be a different 
approach. 

1251
01:03:00,200 --> 01:03:01,920
I think the rest of the way. 
I think you hit the nail on the 

1252
01:03:01,920 --> 01:03:05,960
head and I hope they get there 
because man, the last thing I 

1253
01:03:05,960 --> 01:03:10,240
want is another like war in in 
IU basketball. 

1254
01:03:10,240 --> 01:03:13,120
The last thing I want to see is 
is more angst and more 

1255
01:03:13,360 --> 01:03:15,320
infighting and people going at 
each other. 

1256
01:03:15,320 --> 01:03:20,600
It's just, it's been so long and
look, I think IU fans are are 

1257
01:03:20,600 --> 01:03:23,320
right to be frustrated, but got 
to just make things so much 

1258
01:03:23,320 --> 01:03:25,880
easier If IU as a basketball 
team could pull themselves 

1259
01:03:25,880 --> 01:03:30,040
together, figure out how to play
as best they can with this 

1260
01:03:30,040 --> 01:03:33,040
system that they're playing. 
Because when they're all playing

1261
01:03:33,040 --> 01:03:35,440
at that level, as you said, they
are kind of they're a top 20 

1262
01:03:35,440 --> 01:03:38,760
roster in terms of talent. 
It's just a long route to get 

1263
01:03:38,760 --> 01:03:40,800
from where they're at right now 
to that. 

1264
01:03:41,080 --> 01:03:43,280
And fortunately, they still got 
2/3 of the season to do it. 

1265
01:03:43,280 --> 01:03:45,840
So, you know, maybe that's the 
silver lining or 3/4 of the 

1266
01:03:45,840 --> 01:03:47,720
season to do it. 
Yeah, no, and I, I agree with 

1267
01:03:47,720 --> 01:03:48,880
you. 
I don't, I don't want to have 

1268
01:03:48,880 --> 01:03:51,960
another slog through January, 
February, get to the infighting,

1269
01:03:51,960 --> 01:03:56,400
have all new factions created 
like we, we just it it'd be nice

1270
01:03:56,400 --> 01:03:59,840
to have a season that just kind 
of didn't have a a massive 

1271
01:03:59,840 --> 01:04:01,320
anxiety point, which I think 
we've talked about. 

1272
01:04:01,320 --> 01:04:04,560
It's been like 9 or 10 years and
it's been quite a while. 

1273
01:04:04,840 --> 01:04:06,440
It it's really, it's, it's been 
a while. 

1274
01:04:06,440 --> 01:04:08,000
I'll just leave it at that. 
Like it's, it's been a while. 

1275
01:04:08,000 --> 01:04:11,520
I would like to have a season 
where we can just focus on some 

1276
01:04:11,520 --> 01:04:14,640
good basketball, look at the 
wins and it would be nice to get

1277
01:04:14,640 --> 01:04:17,400
into March and be solidly in the
tournament. 

1278
01:04:17,400 --> 01:04:19,040
Like we were tour, you know, 
whatever. 

1279
01:04:19,520 --> 01:04:21,600
Two years ago we we had the four
seed like that. 

1280
01:04:21,600 --> 01:04:23,720
That would be nice. 
It'd be nice to be off the 

1281
01:04:23,720 --> 01:04:26,000
bubble. 
Yeah, well, we'll see what 

1282
01:04:26,000 --> 01:04:28,720
happens and certainly we'll be 
back to talk more basketball. 

1283
01:04:28,720 --> 01:04:30,480
Indiana with a big game coming 
up this week. 

1284
01:04:30,480 --> 01:04:33,360
Two big games in terms of just 
maintaining the course and 

1285
01:04:33,360 --> 01:04:35,760
starting to get things back on 
track as they play Sam Houston 

1286
01:04:35,760 --> 01:04:40,440
State Tuesday at 7:30 and then a
Friday home game against Miami 

1287
01:04:40,680 --> 01:04:43,600
of Ohio. 
So all of that coming up, we'll 

1288
01:04:43,600 --> 01:04:45,640
see what happens with it all, 
but we appreciate you folks. 

1289
01:04:45,720 --> 01:04:48,600
Just in Georgia football team 
made the NCAA basketball 

1290
01:04:48,600 --> 01:04:51,080
tournament like they they with 
three losses. 

1291
01:04:51,080 --> 01:04:52,760
They're good enough to make 
their they're they got a better 

1292
01:04:52,760 --> 01:04:53,720
protected seat. 
So there you go. 

1293
01:04:53,720 --> 01:04:56,400
They got a four seat already. 
So those set those boys. 

1294
01:04:56,400 --> 01:05:00,040
Deserved it, they really did. 
So anyway, for Scott, I'm Galen.

1295
01:05:00,040 --> 01:05:02,040
This is Crimson cast. 
Thanks again for joining us here

1296
01:05:02,040 --> 01:05:05,320
as we cover IU basketball and 
we'll continue to cover IU 

1297
01:05:05,320 --> 01:05:06,840
football. 
More programming coming up later

1298
01:05:06,840 --> 01:05:08,920
on this week. 
Might have a live watch party 

1299
01:05:08,920 --> 01:05:11,320
going for that Sam Houston State
game because we've also got the 

1300
01:05:11,320 --> 01:05:13,800
College Football Playoff reveal 
happening at the same time. 

1301
01:05:13,800 --> 01:05:16,320
Lots of stuff going on. 
Anyway, we'll catch you folks. 

1302
01:05:16,320 --> 01:05:19,760
On the flip side, bring back the
Bison, stay, never daunted. 

1303
01:05:19,800 --> 01:05:20,440
So on everybody.