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You're listening to the Back 
Home Network presented by Home 

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Field Apparel. 
Welcome back to Crimson Cast. 

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Galen Clavio, Scott Caulfield 
joining you. 

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Happy May. 
It's May 2nd of 2025. 

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We got through April, Scott, 
Long month. 

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April was a long month. 
Lot happened in April, but only 

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30 days. 
I know. 

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But you know, we went from not 
having a roster in basketball to

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having an almost complete roster
in basketball. 

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And yeah, we got Little 5. 
We got a bunch of other stuff 

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with football, spring game. 
I mean, there's just a ton of 

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things that happened. 
I went on a bourbon tasting with

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Mike Kadik and Sydney Parrish. 
A lot occurred. 

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That's the end of the honest era
in Milwaukee. 

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Yes. 
I was at Game 5, as were you. 

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Yeah, yeah. 
We'll, we'll, we'll experience. 

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We'll chat about that a little 
bit later. 

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That's that's an experience. 
I think that's worth worth 

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retelling for the peeps out 
there. 

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But before we get started, just 
a reminder we're brought to you 

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by Home Field Apparel. 
Your place to go for the finest 

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in college fashions, the softest
fabrics, the coolest designs. 

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And as I often say, Scott, not 
just college fashions, but they 

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just launched an updated IMS. 
I know they come into race. 

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It's like they do the little 5 
they do IMS. 

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They have a whole Ed Carpenter 
line. 

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It's it's like they're almost A 
at shirt brand for May and it's 

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like college is secondary. 
I mean, you know, that's a great

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point. 
Yes, but this new IMS collection

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looks awesome. 
I mean, the the last year's 

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looked awesome too. 
And so it's not like it's a 

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surprise that it looks awesome, 
but it's a maybe a mild surprise

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of how awesome it looks. 
I'm gonna pop it up on the 

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screen here so the, the folks 
that are watching on YouTube or 

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Spotify can see you've got that 
greatest spectacle bomber 

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jacket. 
You can see there. 

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That thing is a spectacle. 
It is I, I'm not sure that I can

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define what that bomber jacket 
looks like. 

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It's, it's a lot of colors, but 
it's cool looking, nice 

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checkered line snapback hat. 
You've got some tanks which I 

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will not be purchasing because 
because no one wants to see 

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that. 
You got some cool T-shirt 

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designs. 
You got some very basic like 

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those those straightforward 
heavyweight IMS TS that that 

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black one in particular looks 
awesome and just a bunch of 

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other cool apparel as well, 
including another hoodie from 

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the home field apparel who I 
think is. 

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Great wearing any of those at 
the track it's funny we're 

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taking our friends and neighbors
they've never been to the 500 

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they moved here from Iowa. 
We're, we're taking them this 

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year and just just this week 
the, the wife texts like what 

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you know, should we coordinate 
outfits? 

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It looks fun. 
And I was like, what should we 

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wear? 
And I was like, you cannot be 

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underdressed or overdressed. 
Like there is just, there's no 

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way to dress wrong. 
And you will find somebody below

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you or above you at IMS if 
you've not been to the race. 

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I mean, you'll see all those 
looks, everything you just saw 

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on the home field page, you'll 
see at the track. 

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And it's just like it is, I'm 
like, wait till you get there 

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because you can't explain what 
you're going to see. 

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It when you when you create a 
medium sized city in a day from 

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a bunch of people from all over 
the place, they're gonna look 

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different from each other as as 
people in a regular city would 

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look. 
But yes, the the only thing that

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should really be dictating what 
you wear to the 500 is a 

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combination of the weather and 
your own comfort level and I. 

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Just said wear comfortable 
shoes, right? 

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That's the only given everything
else is like, you could wear a 

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bikini and you won't be 
underdressed and you could wear 

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a suit and if somebody might 
have a better suit than you, so.

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Go to homefieldapparel.com you 
can get part of their new or the

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entire new collection. 
Use the code HOME 23 Get 15% off

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your first order again home 
field apparel.com proud 

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presenting sponsor of the back 
home network. 

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Also just a reminder, we are on 
YouTube. 

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Go subscribe to search back home
network on YouTube. 

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We're we're getting ever closer 
to that 8000 subscriber mark. 

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We're going to hit that over the
summer as we get ready for 

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football. 
You get live podcast 

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notifications, you get uploaded 
podcast notifications like this 

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one and we're going to be doing 
more in that realm. 

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I'm working on some some cool 
new stuff on the subscriber 

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front. 
So if you're a sub stack 

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subscriber, keep your eyes open 
for that. 

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We do have our own sub stack, 
crimsoncast.substack.com. 

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You can join for free, get 
emails delivered right to your 

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inbox that have our podcasts or 
and other materials in them. 

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And we'll be adding some things 
to that mixer hopefully in the 

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the next few months. 
And you also can, if you want to

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financially support the podcast,
you can do so. 

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It's only $5 a month, $50 a 
year. 

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We certainly appreciate any 
support you folks are willing to

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give. 
So Scott, we put the bat signal 

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out for questions from the 
audience on both the back home 

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Network Discord and also on 
Twitter. 

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So we've got several questions 
that we want to try to tackle. 

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We're not going to be able to 
get to all of them. 

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We got a ton of questions from 
both areas. 

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So we'll try to hit the ones 
that make the most sense for 

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this context. 
I am going to, in case anybody 

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asks or is curious, I am going 
to have a separate podcast I'm 

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going to do at some point with 
Taylor Layman from Bite Sized 

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Bison as we breakdown some of 
these recruits that IE 

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football's getting. 
I did want to lead with the news

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today, which I thought was 
really interesting and and 

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really highlights what a 
fundamentally different era we 

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are in right now. 
So news that occurred or news, I

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mean news occurred, whatever 
news broke or whatever the 

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wording would be that about noon
today, 11 O clock or noon that 

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Derek Owings, the strength and 
conditioning coach for IU 

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football, was being heavily 
courted by USC. 

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Normally when you see that kind 
of a message, it's like, well, 

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the guy's gone. 
And that's a big one 'cause, you

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know, Owings clearly took IU 
strength and conditioning to a 

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completely different level this 
past year. 

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He'd been with Signetti at JMU. 
And then we got the news a 

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couple hours later from Pete 
Thammel that IU had gotten a big

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pay raise and it signed a 
three-year extension basically. 

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And I just think we need to pump
the brakes for a second and 

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think about like, IU just fended
off USC, one of the top football

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brands in the history of college
football. 

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And paid him enough that he felt
like, you know what I need to 

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stay in Bloomington and continue
to work for IU football. 

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This is this is an, an 
incomprehensible era of IU 

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athletics and IU football. 
Scott, I don't even know how to 

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process this news that that 
should be the marketing slogan 

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for next year. 
An incomprehensible setting it 

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it used to be 1015 years ago. 
If USC just accidentally butt 

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dialed one of our coaches, that 
would be them Like, Oh yes, 

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I'll, I'll take the job. 
I mean, the idea that you know, 

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you're getting interest from USC
is, is nuts. 

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Yes, all everything you just 
said. 

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I was talking to somebody else 
about this. 

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The the thing that I love that 
Signetti is doing is, you know, 

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I was talking to somebody else 
just about how some colleges 

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seem to be caught flat footed in
this entire new realm of using 

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actually having to spend money 
at a pretty high clip for nil. 

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And some some colleges just look
like, wow, we're not ready for 

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this and we have to actually 
spend our money. 

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What what are we doing? 
What I've really enjoyed is you 

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see Signetti in all of his 
interviews in the spring talk. 

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It's not even just a hey, we're 
doing well. 

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He always says we got to have 
continued support. 

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It's like we need, We've had 
great support and we need to 

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continue having support from the
president athletic department. 

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Like, I love that Signeti's not 
taking, it's like the pressure's

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not off. 
He's still putting pressure on 

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the team talking about, you 
know, the practice wasn't good 

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enough today in April. 
But I think he's still putting 

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pressure on Dolson and, you 
know, Pam Whitten and the 

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president and just everyone at 
IU like, hey, this was great, 

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Keep it up. 
And and what you see the results

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are IU steps up and fends off 
USC and gets more money here. 

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And I think if you asked, you 
know, if you asked Signeti best 

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about this, he would say, that's
great. 

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We need to continue showing 
support like this in the future.

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I mean, that's what I love is 
it's not just, hey, we had a 

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great year. 
It's we had a good time. 

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We have good support. 
We've got to continue it. 

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But you saw it with a, a higher,
you know, a, a rehire, a a raise

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like this. 
Well, I think you're seeing it 

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also in the portal activity. 
IU's been able to pull a couple 

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of folks in in the portal and 
look, Signeti's 100% right. 

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Like this is not just about 
generating initial support. 

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It's about maintaining a base. 
And, and the, the weird thing 

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and the, the not great thing 
from a overall financial 

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perspective is that there is no 
median. 

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Like the median, the median 
keeps going up. 

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It feels like every, it's just, 
it's just endless. 

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Yeah, it's, it's, this is what 
happens with an unregulated 

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marketplace. 
And that is ultimately one of 

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those things where IU doesn't 
have a choice if they're going 

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to try to keep pace. 
And what I've been impressed 

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with is, you know, they I think 
it was earlier in the year, I 

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think it was Brian Haynes was 
getting courted. 

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They end up ponying up to keep 
him. 

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You know, Pitino Sinceri left, 
Pitino Sinceri went for a better

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job, like a, a better a better 
title. 

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And, you know, you already had 
Mike Shanahan here and Kurt 

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Signetti, you know, helping to, 
to kind of pilot things. 

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And so I, I'm just thrilled. 
And like Wes Houston said on 

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Twitter, we used to roll over 
and give up when programs like 

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USC came calling. 
Now we pony up and figure out a 

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way to make it happen. 
We're in the multiverse now. 

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And it does kind of feel that 
way. 

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It just kind of feels like IU 
has decided almost overnight, we

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are going to be a player. 
We are going, we're not just 

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going to let you take our best 
people. 

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And that this is where if you 
don't follow coaching moves or 

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player moves too closely, 
historically in college 

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football, this is what happens. 
Like it's not, it's not just 

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that Michigan has resources and 
Indiana doesn't have resources 

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historically. 
It's that when Indiana gets 

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somebody good or, you know, 
Alabama comes and takes them or 

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Michigan comes and takes them. 
And I use like whelp or. 

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Unfortunately, for a lot of 
years, none of those programs 

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are even coming to take people 
because there's nobody worth 

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taking. 
Right. 

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I'm saying the rare, the rare 
occasion when you'd have 

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somebody that would be worth 
hanging on to, it just wouldn't 

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happen. 
Well, yeah, the thing that I'll 

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say because it will start to 
happen, you know, you you've you

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mentioned this earlier, you've 
mentioned on different pods, you

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know, these are kind of, you 
know, lateral moves like going 

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from strength and conditioning 
from IU to USC. 

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You can fight those off. 
If this, you know, if he had 

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been if if it's the, you know, 
strength and conditioning coach 

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to like to offensive 
coordinator, you can't stop 

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those moves like and I think 
we're going to start seeing. 

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So, you know, and Caleb de Boer 
left, he left to be a head 

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coach. 
And that's one of those where 

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there's really no, you know, IU 
fans need to be prepared because

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I think we're going to start 
seeing in the next year or two, 

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our coaches are going to 
probably be leaving for moves 

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up. 
And those are things, you know, 

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if somebody offers you a head 
coaching job, there's only so 

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many of those. 
If you're not a coordinator, 

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somebody offers you a 
coordinator job, you got to take

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those. 
But in these like, for like 

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situations, you, you're right. 
Normally we would just say, oh, 

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well, Congrats. 
Do you, do you want some 

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00:11:15,120 --> 00:11:16,760
forwarding mailing address 
labels? 

224
00:11:16,760 --> 00:11:18,800
And it's like, no, we'll, we'll,
we'll match that often. 

225
00:11:18,800 --> 00:11:21,600
We'll probably exceed it. 
Let's dive into some of the 

226
00:11:21,600 --> 00:11:25,840
questions that other folks asked
and, and again, we had a a ton 

227
00:11:25,840 --> 00:11:30,680
of them and I think let's for 
the moment, we're going to kind 

228
00:11:30,680 --> 00:11:32,960
of get jump back and forth a 
little bit between football and 

229
00:11:32,960 --> 00:11:35,400
basketball. 
We had a lot of questions about 

230
00:11:35,400 --> 00:11:37,920
the football or the the 
basketball roster more than 

231
00:11:37,920 --> 00:11:41,640
anything else. 
And I guess maybe we'll dive in.

232
00:11:41,640 --> 00:11:45,000
I'm going to see if I've got 
some football items that we can 

233
00:11:45,000 --> 00:11:49,120
tackle first and foremost. 
And as I'm looking through the 

234
00:11:49,120 --> 00:11:53,760
questions here, so who's your 
knight or who's your Dada asks 

235
00:11:53,800 --> 00:11:57,080
or Dada, any holes or positions 
of concerns for IU football 

236
00:11:57,080 --> 00:12:01,120
following spring ball? 
I mean, here's the thing, I feel

237
00:12:01,120 --> 00:12:04,800
pretty good about who they 
brought in and the fact that 

238
00:12:04,800 --> 00:12:09,040
they still seem to be making 
some moves around the defensive 

239
00:12:09,040 --> 00:12:10,480
line. 
And this is something I'm going 

240
00:12:10,480 --> 00:12:12,120
to talk about with Taylor a bit 
more. 

241
00:12:12,480 --> 00:12:15,280
But the big thing with IU is 
this like they they clearly have

242
00:12:15,280 --> 00:12:18,720
a good starting quarterback. 
This is a guy, as we'll talk 

243
00:12:18,720 --> 00:12:21,640
about in one of the other 
questions, who has gotten mocked

244
00:12:21,640 --> 00:12:23,880
a couple of Times Now in the 
first round, right? 

245
00:12:24,000 --> 00:12:28,520
So this upcoming year, which the
IU having first round draft pick

246
00:12:28,520 --> 00:12:32,000
Costco as a quarterback is not a
thing that occurs. 

247
00:12:32,760 --> 00:12:36,520
But I think people really are 
turned on by Fernando Mendoza's 

248
00:12:36,520 --> 00:12:39,840
physicality, His his, you know, 
his ability to throw the ball 

249
00:12:39,840 --> 00:12:42,960
effectively feels like a really 
great pick up in the portal, 

250
00:12:42,960 --> 00:12:45,400
like almost one that was 
undervalued at the time that it 

251
00:12:45,400 --> 00:12:48,680
occurred. 
But that it's one that I I 

252
00:12:48,680 --> 00:12:51,160
liked. 
I liked it at the time. 

253
00:12:51,160 --> 00:12:53,520
And the more film I watched, 
I've liked it even more. 

254
00:12:54,240 --> 00:12:57,160
You, you know, you go across the
different skill positions. 

255
00:12:57,160 --> 00:12:59,040
I feel really good about what 
they did there. 

256
00:12:59,640 --> 00:13:03,120
I'm still, I'm interested to see
how the tight end position works

257
00:13:03,120 --> 00:13:05,360
out on offense because I think 
you've got some really good 

258
00:13:05,360 --> 00:13:07,840
possibilities there. 
But obviously you have to see 

259
00:13:07,840 --> 00:13:10,560
how it plays out. 
The offensive line is obviously 

260
00:13:10,560 --> 00:13:13,160
going to be one of the big ones.
And again, they went out and got

261
00:13:14,000 --> 00:13:17,440
guys, you know, they, they go 
out and, and they get a starting

262
00:13:17,440 --> 00:13:19,440
center. 
They go out and get a guy who 

263
00:13:19,440 --> 00:13:21,480
hadn't played that much at Ohio 
State, but he's got a lot of 

264
00:13:21,480 --> 00:13:23,600
physical promise. 
You know, they, they seem to 

265
00:13:23,600 --> 00:13:25,800
have dudes there that they can 
roll with. 

266
00:13:26,240 --> 00:13:29,520
And it just is going to depend 
on how quickly they coalesce. 

267
00:13:30,160 --> 00:13:32,280
You know, I think Taylor's 
talked about this a lot, you 

268
00:13:32,280 --> 00:13:34,320
know, but there's questions 
around the secondary and who 

269
00:13:34,320 --> 00:13:37,080
steps up and what they're doing.
You know, so I think that's 

270
00:13:37,080 --> 00:13:39,360
probably where the biggest 
question marks are, is, you 

271
00:13:39,360 --> 00:13:42,720
know, does the defense coalesce 
around the personnel sets that 

272
00:13:42,720 --> 00:13:45,760
they've got? 
And you know, that's that's 

273
00:13:45,760 --> 00:13:48,080
where the coaching staff, I 
think last year did just 

274
00:13:48,080 --> 00:13:49,840
tremendous work. 
I mean, you look what they did. 

275
00:13:49,840 --> 00:13:52,640
They, you know, CJ W was not on 
the team the previous year. 

276
00:13:52,800 --> 00:13:55,120
They had to integrate him into 
the guys that had come over from

277
00:13:55,120 --> 00:13:58,600
JMU and the the returning 
players they were on the roster 

278
00:13:58,800 --> 00:14:00,160
and they did a really good job 
of that. 

279
00:14:00,160 --> 00:14:06,080
So I feel pretty good right now 
about where IU football is at in

280
00:14:06,080 --> 00:14:10,320
terms of where the roster is. 
Now the the caveat I'll throw in

281
00:14:10,320 --> 00:14:14,200
on that is that I don't think 
that you could really say for 

282
00:14:14,200 --> 00:14:18,800
sure that this is a team that 
could repeat, you know, 11 and 

283
00:14:18,800 --> 00:14:23,920
one or or do better, but that it
may be a better roster, but it 

284
00:14:23,920 --> 00:14:26,400
might have a slightly worse 
outcome simply because the 

285
00:14:26,400 --> 00:14:30,520
schedule is it looks at least on
paper right now, Scott, that 

286
00:14:30,520 --> 00:14:32,840
it's going to be a harder 
schedule than last year. 

287
00:14:33,240 --> 00:14:36,400
So I'm not really looking at 
anything and saying, well, 

288
00:14:36,400 --> 00:14:39,080
there's a major concern there or
there's a major concern there. 

289
00:14:39,080 --> 00:14:41,240
But I like generally what 
they've done up to this point. 

290
00:14:41,240 --> 00:14:44,240
It's really just going to depend
on how it meshes over the course

291
00:14:44,240 --> 00:14:45,920
of the rest of the summer and 
into full ball. 

292
00:14:46,320 --> 00:14:48,960
Yeah, no, I, I would, I I'm 
going to kind of leave this one 

293
00:14:48,960 --> 00:14:50,960
for you and Taylor to and go 
more in depth in. 

294
00:14:50,960 --> 00:14:55,760
But I, I also like you, the more
I've dug into Mendoza have been 

295
00:14:55,760 --> 00:14:58,600
really, really intrigued because
watching the film from him on 

296
00:14:58,600 --> 00:15:00,680
Cal, it's like he does a lot of 
RPO. 

297
00:15:00,680 --> 00:15:03,640
He's just a little bit bigger 
and has seems to have a little 

298
00:15:03,640 --> 00:15:05,840
bit of a bigger arm than Rourke 
did. 

299
00:15:05,840 --> 00:15:08,960
And as we know, Rourke had a 
torn ACL the entire season. 

300
00:15:09,200 --> 00:15:13,960
And I continually go back to it 
just feels like if you are a 

301
00:15:13,960 --> 00:15:16,120
coach and you know your 
quarterback is a torn ACL, 

302
00:15:16,120 --> 00:15:18,080
you're probably throwing half 
your playbook out just like, 

303
00:15:18,080 --> 00:15:19,680
well, we can't run that. 
And. 

304
00:15:19,680 --> 00:15:21,400
So. 
He was, you know, we were 

305
00:15:21,400 --> 00:15:24,280
already kind of 1 hot hand tied 
behind our back. 

306
00:15:24,280 --> 00:15:27,520
So I'm, I'm excited that I'll 
let you pull it up. 

307
00:15:27,520 --> 00:15:30,400
There was a couple questions 
about football 1 about like what

308
00:15:30,400 --> 00:15:33,320
we thought the the the 
attendance would be the first 

309
00:15:33,320 --> 00:15:34,640
couple games. 
I was going to get to that 

310
00:15:34,640 --> 00:15:36,840
second, but the next one I was 
going to get to from Hoosiers 

311
00:15:36,840 --> 00:15:40,760
7681. 
Where exactly is a fair slash 

312
00:15:40,760 --> 00:15:44,680
justifiable place for IU 
football fans expectations to be

313
00:15:44,680 --> 00:15:47,520
for next season given last 
year's blockbuster contrasted by

314
00:15:47,520 --> 00:15:48,880
the overall history of the 
program? 

315
00:15:49,080 --> 00:15:53,800
Well worded question there. 
So I think I said this when we 

316
00:15:53,800 --> 00:15:56,920
first really started looking at 
the schedule in earnest after 

317
00:15:56,920 --> 00:16:02,840
last year ended. 
I think right now it would be a 

318
00:16:02,840 --> 00:16:06,160
big disappointment if if the 
floor for the season wasn't 

319
00:16:06,160 --> 00:16:08,560
seven wins. 
Just given the way that things 

320
00:16:08,560 --> 00:16:11,080
lay out. 
I'm anticipating Indiana's 

321
00:16:11,080 --> 00:16:14,040
probably going to win 8 or 9. 
I wouldn't be shocked if they 

322
00:16:14,040 --> 00:16:16,400
went over that. 
I think it'll just require this 

323
00:16:16,400 --> 00:16:20,600
team to continue to take leaps 
in ways that, you know, they 

324
00:16:20,680 --> 00:16:23,840
they didn't even necessarily 
fully take last year. 

325
00:16:23,880 --> 00:16:26,240
And I guess what I mean by that 
is if you look at the schedule, 

326
00:16:27,520 --> 00:16:31,400
the the tough games, the home 
game against Illinois, the game 

327
00:16:31,400 --> 00:16:36,160
at Iowa, the game at Oregon, the
game at Penn State, like those 

328
00:16:36,160 --> 00:16:41,280
are all really challenging games
even for very, very good teams. 

329
00:16:41,280 --> 00:16:45,480
And you know, it's for Indiana. 
I think the big question mark is

330
00:16:45,480 --> 00:16:54,040
going to be how how much of last
year transfers over and how much

331
00:16:54,040 --> 00:16:57,080
confidence does Indiana have 
going into these games and how 

332
00:16:57,080 --> 00:17:00,520
much, you know, consistent 
contribution can they get from 

333
00:17:00,520 --> 00:17:04,359
the new players? 
Can they do better in terms of 

334
00:17:04,359 --> 00:17:06,040
their overall offensive 
efficiency? 

335
00:17:06,040 --> 00:17:09,160
Can they do more in terms of, 
you know, continue to make stops

336
00:17:09,160 --> 00:17:11,640
on defense and force turnovers 
and all the things that made 

337
00:17:11,640 --> 00:17:14,520
last season so special for IU? 
It is. 

338
00:17:15,319 --> 00:17:17,640
There's no question that when 
you look back at what Indiana 

339
00:17:17,640 --> 00:17:19,800
did last year, it was an amazing
season. 

340
00:17:20,280 --> 00:17:24,280
But it also was one of those 
seasons where things broke like 

341
00:17:24,280 --> 00:17:26,760
exactly right. 
You, you know, UCLA was worse 

342
00:17:26,760 --> 00:17:28,119
than people thought that they 
would be. 

343
00:17:28,119 --> 00:17:30,320
Maryland was worse than people 
thought they would be. 

344
00:17:30,760 --> 00:17:33,120
Nebraska was worse than people 
thought they would be. 

345
00:17:33,520 --> 00:17:37,360
You know, Washington was about 
the same, maybe slightly worse. 

346
00:17:37,640 --> 00:17:41,400
Michigan was certainly worse. 
And Indiana deserves credit for 

347
00:17:41,400 --> 00:17:43,720
winning all of those games in 
the way that they did. 

348
00:17:44,240 --> 00:17:49,840
But, you know, I think relying 
on that to like go into Iowa, 

349
00:17:49,840 --> 00:17:52,360
where Indiana does not 
historically play well, or going

350
00:17:52,360 --> 00:17:55,080
into Penn State where Indiana 
has never won a football game 

351
00:17:55,480 --> 00:17:59,440
might be a bridge too far. 
That said, you know, if Indiana 

352
00:17:59,440 --> 00:18:02,560
wins 8 or 9 games, as I've said 
over and over again, that is 

353
00:18:02,560 --> 00:18:05,800
already like one of the top five
most successful seasons in IU 

354
00:18:05,800 --> 00:18:08,760
football history. 
And I don't. 

355
00:18:08,920 --> 00:18:10,640
Well, I've talked to a ton of IU
football fans. 

356
00:18:10,640 --> 00:18:12,440
A ton of IU football fans talk 
to me. 

357
00:18:12,720 --> 00:18:17,160
I have not detected from anybody
that they are concerned about an

358
00:18:17,160 --> 00:18:19,920
8 or 9 win season. 
I think that would be a great 

359
00:18:19,920 --> 00:18:23,320
baseline and I think it's bonus.
On top of that, but Scott, where

360
00:18:23,320 --> 00:18:25,120
are you landing on this season 
so far? 

361
00:18:25,440 --> 00:18:27,400
Very similarly. 
I mean, the the thing that I've 

362
00:18:27,400 --> 00:18:30,560
been telling people is mostly, 
you know, non IU fans who are 

363
00:18:30,560 --> 00:18:33,560
trying to gaslight. 
It's like our goal isn't, is not

364
00:18:33,560 --> 00:18:34,920
to make the College Football 
Playoff. 

365
00:18:34,920 --> 00:18:39,120
Like like if the goal of that of
us making the College Football 

366
00:18:39,120 --> 00:18:42,960
Playoff going into a season is 
probably still 5 or 6 years 

367
00:18:42,960 --> 00:18:44,640
away. 
And that would be stacking 5 or 

368
00:18:44,640 --> 00:18:46,880
6 really good seasons on top of 
each other. 

369
00:18:46,880 --> 00:18:51,360
Last year was was an aberration.
It was awesome even after last 

370
00:18:51,360 --> 00:18:53,520
year. 
And even I think we did really 

371
00:18:53,520 --> 00:18:56,480
well were we could, like you 
said, be a better team this 

372
00:18:56,480 --> 00:18:58,560
year. 
I don't go into the season 

373
00:18:58,560 --> 00:19:00,640
thinking well we should make the
College Football Playoff. 

374
00:19:00,640 --> 00:19:04,200
Like that is just a, a bar in a 
different area. 

375
00:19:04,640 --> 00:19:07,400
I'm in a very similar spot 
where, you know, I would always 

376
00:19:07,400 --> 00:19:09,480
say, dude, we, we've been bad 
for so long. 

377
00:19:09,480 --> 00:19:12,360
You just got to make a bowl and 
win a bowl game, which by the 

378
00:19:12,360 --> 00:19:15,160
way, we still haven't done. 
Like I still would like to see 

379
00:19:15,160 --> 00:19:17,440
us win a bowl. 
Not knocking last year at all, 

380
00:19:17,440 --> 00:19:19,920
but just like there, there's 
still that piece out there, like

381
00:19:19,920 --> 00:19:22,000
let's try and win a bowl game 
for the first time since what, 

382
00:19:22,000 --> 00:19:26,200
like 91. 
So, you know, I, I do think the 

383
00:19:26,200 --> 00:19:30,200
floor has raised in that six 
wins would probably, even when 

384
00:19:30,200 --> 00:19:31,840
we go to like the Motor City 
Bowl, it's like, all right, that

385
00:19:31,840 --> 00:19:35,720
would be something maybe didn't 
go right that, that the floor 

386
00:19:35,720 --> 00:19:37,600
has raised to seven. 
But we're splitting hairs. 

387
00:19:37,600 --> 00:19:42,640
You know, to me, I, I think very
similarly to what you said, 7-8 

388
00:19:42,640 --> 00:19:45,760
wins feels like a really good 
season that again, would still 

389
00:19:45,760 --> 00:19:49,840
be a historically better season.
We've had most years out of the 

390
00:19:49,840 --> 00:19:52,520
last 2025 years. 
That's nothing to scoff at. 

391
00:19:52,880 --> 00:19:55,280
That's a really good year. 
And I think the way the schedule

392
00:19:55,280 --> 00:19:58,520
lays out, I think it's 
reasonable to say a very 

393
00:19:58,520 --> 00:20:02,080
successful season would be as if
you defend Memorial Stadium, you

394
00:20:02,120 --> 00:20:03,920
know, the Illinois game is going
to be tough. 

395
00:20:04,120 --> 00:20:08,200
It's not insurmountable. 
The Wisconsin game, you know, 

396
00:20:08,200 --> 00:20:11,440
I'm not again, the history of 
playing football against 

397
00:20:11,440 --> 00:20:13,280
Wisconsin. 
I can't just I'm scared of 

398
00:20:13,280 --> 00:20:15,800
getting hit by lightning on this
beautiful sunny day saying, 

399
00:20:15,800 --> 00:20:17,760
well, you know, that's not 
insurmountable because we've 

400
00:20:17,760 --> 00:20:20,320
seen that. 
Oh never beat them outside of a 

401
00:20:20,320 --> 00:20:23,800
couple of random years. 
But it's not insurmountable to 

402
00:20:23,800 --> 00:20:25,560
say we can beat Wisconsin at 
home. 

403
00:20:25,800 --> 00:20:28,800
I think that's a really good 
spot to say, can you go 7 and O 

404
00:20:28,920 --> 00:20:32,200
or six and one at home and start
continuing? 

405
00:20:32,200 --> 00:20:33,960
You know, last year they go 
undefeated at home. 

406
00:20:33,960 --> 00:20:37,760
Can you start to show Memorial 
Stadium is a place where you 

407
00:20:37,760 --> 00:20:40,280
can't just come in and kick 
Indiana around. 

408
00:20:40,280 --> 00:20:43,200
This is a place where we're 
going to have a winning record 

409
00:20:43,200 --> 00:20:46,160
and most years will be 
undefeated or have maybe one 

410
00:20:46,160 --> 00:20:47,760
loss. 
It's not going to be a place 

411
00:20:47,760 --> 00:20:50,360
where we're having 5-6 losses. 
I think that's another good 

412
00:20:50,360 --> 00:20:52,880
place to go. 
So I think those are all really 

413
00:20:52,880 --> 00:20:56,320
good benchmarks. 
And you know, if you get seven 

414
00:20:56,320 --> 00:21:00,960
or eight wins, you're going to 
one of the 7 best bowls 

415
00:21:00,960 --> 00:21:03,800
Indiana's ever been to. 
Six, We've only been to like 12,

416
00:21:03,800 --> 00:21:06,640
but you're one of the five best 
bowls Indiana's ever been to. 

417
00:21:07,360 --> 00:21:11,960
So you know, I, I would say for 
anybody who's saying, you know, 

418
00:21:11,960 --> 00:21:14,200
we don't meet the expectation, 
we don't meet the results of 

419
00:21:14,200 --> 00:21:17,280
last year, it's like that. 
That's not what Indiana is 

420
00:21:17,280 --> 00:21:19,720
looking to do. 
But I do think for me, the floor

421
00:21:19,720 --> 00:21:23,040
is raised. 
We're normally out, you know, 12

422
00:21:23,040 --> 00:21:26,040
months ago, I would always say 
we just got to win six games. 

423
00:21:26,120 --> 00:21:27,840
Like that's our, that's, that's 
the baseline. 

424
00:21:28,320 --> 00:21:30,760
I think last year raised the 
floor to me to like, all right, 

425
00:21:30,760 --> 00:21:32,240
we can go to seven. 
Yeah. 

426
00:21:32,440 --> 00:21:35,120
Well, the one other thing I'll 
note on, I think you, you summed

427
00:21:35,120 --> 00:21:37,120
up a lot of that very well. 
I think the one other thing I 

428
00:21:37,120 --> 00:21:41,440
would note is that, you know, 
Indiana's got those four games 

429
00:21:41,440 --> 00:21:43,280
that I would consider to be 
really tough games. 

430
00:21:43,320 --> 00:21:45,480
And it's not that the other ones
are going to be pushovers by any

431
00:21:45,480 --> 00:21:46,720
means. 
They got Wisconsin at home, 

432
00:21:46,720 --> 00:21:48,800
they're going to be tough. 
They've got Michigan State will 

433
00:21:48,800 --> 00:21:51,240
be better, UCLA will probably be
better. 

434
00:21:51,240 --> 00:21:53,760
But you know, the, the games I 
read off at home versus Illinois

435
00:21:54,520 --> 00:21:57,840
at Iowa, at Oregon, at Penn 
State, that's a, that's a pretty

436
00:21:57,840 --> 00:22:01,040
tough sled. 
But the other contending teams 

437
00:22:01,040 --> 00:22:03,080
in the conference also have 
tough slates. 

438
00:22:03,080 --> 00:22:05,920
Like so you know, Ohio State, 
who lost a ton, and I mean, it's

439
00:22:05,920 --> 00:22:07,600
Ohio State. 
So they're going to reload, but 

440
00:22:08,000 --> 00:22:11,440
they've got Texas at home. 
They've got to go to Washington,

441
00:22:11,440 --> 00:22:13,440
which is tricky. 
They've got to go to Illinois, 

442
00:22:13,760 --> 00:22:16,560
they've got to go to Wisconsin. 
They've got Penn State at home 

443
00:22:16,560 --> 00:22:18,800
and Penn State's loaded for bear
and they got to go to Michigan. 

444
00:22:18,800 --> 00:22:20,560
I mean, that's a they don't. 
Have any in? 

445
00:22:22,320 --> 00:22:23,880
That's, that's right. 
Well, then they don't have 

446
00:22:23,920 --> 00:22:26,920
Indiana, you know, Penn State, 
they've got Oregon at home. 

447
00:22:27,440 --> 00:22:30,000
They've got, they're at Iowa, 
they're at Ohio State. 

448
00:22:30,840 --> 00:22:33,160
They may have the easiest 
schedule of the group. 

449
00:22:33,880 --> 00:22:38,200
Illinois, who everybody's been, 
you know, essentially shining 

450
00:22:38,200 --> 00:22:41,720
for this entire offseason. 
They've got to go to Indiana, 

451
00:22:41,720 --> 00:22:44,040
which is I think a tough game 
for Illinois. 

452
00:22:44,040 --> 00:22:47,560
Clearly Ohio State at home, 
they're at Wisconsin, they're at

453
00:22:47,560 --> 00:22:50,400
Washington. 
So, you know, and even Michigan,

454
00:22:50,400 --> 00:22:52,520
who I think people are expecting
to have a bounce back here, got 

455
00:22:52,520 --> 00:22:55,920
to go to Nebraska, got to go to 
USC, got to go to Michigan 

456
00:22:55,920 --> 00:22:59,960
State, got Ohio State at home. 
So that what I'm saying in this 

457
00:22:59,960 --> 00:23:05,920
is like if Indiana can find a 
pathway to get to 10 and two, 

458
00:23:06,440 --> 00:23:08,480
which I think is very 
reasonable, like I could see 

459
00:23:08,480 --> 00:23:13,280
Indiana, you know, they could 
beat Illinois and they, they 

460
00:23:13,280 --> 00:23:16,480
could, you know, maybe knock off
Iowa on the road cause Iowa's 

461
00:23:16,480 --> 00:23:18,480
kind of been hit or miss. 
I think Indiana could outscore 

462
00:23:18,480 --> 00:23:19,920
them. 
You lose at Oregon and you lose 

463
00:23:19,920 --> 00:23:21,800
at Penn State, but you win the 
rest of your games. 

464
00:23:21,800 --> 00:23:24,800
Like you're right in the mix, 
not just for a Big 10 

465
00:23:24,800 --> 00:23:27,480
championship game appearance. 
You're in the mix for College 

466
00:23:27,480 --> 00:23:29,880
Football Playoff at 10 and two, 
like 10 and 2 is, you know, 

467
00:23:29,880 --> 00:23:33,760
might be on the fringes, but you
collect a couple of top 25 wins,

468
00:23:33,760 --> 00:23:36,360
you get yourself in the top ten,
top 15 early and you're able to 

469
00:23:36,360 --> 00:23:38,640
stay there. 
That's a pretty good spot to be 

470
00:23:38,640 --> 00:23:41,840
in Indiana. 
I, I think, you know, so much of

471
00:23:41,840 --> 00:23:45,160
last year's narrative was that 
the fact that Indiana started on

472
00:23:45,160 --> 00:23:49,200
the outside of the top 25 and 
really had to fight to get that 

473
00:23:49,200 --> 00:23:51,240
consideration. 
They're going to be starting 

474
00:23:51,240 --> 00:23:53,920
with a much higher floor in the 
eyes of the committee. 

475
00:23:54,160 --> 00:23:57,320
And I do think that that matters
a lot in terms of College 

476
00:23:57,320 --> 00:23:59,920
Football Playoff aspirations. 
But even beyond that, like you 

477
00:23:59,920 --> 00:24:03,760
said, you know, even an 8 or 9 
win season would get you to a 

478
00:24:03,760 --> 00:24:06,880
really good spot. 
So after 10 and 2, you know, 

479
00:24:06,880 --> 00:24:10,520
you, you're going to have a win 
either at Oregon, at Iowa or at 

480
00:24:10,760 --> 00:24:13,200
Penn State. 
So, so the, the narrative of 

481
00:24:13,200 --> 00:24:14,120
all, they haven't beaten 
anybody. 

482
00:24:14,120 --> 00:24:15,640
It's like, well, we will have 
beaten somebody. 

483
00:24:15,640 --> 00:24:18,480
But I, I will just say this to 
Indiana fans who, who had to 

484
00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:22,560
deal with all of that last year.
If we're ten and two, and let's 

485
00:24:22,560 --> 00:24:26,480
say we lose at Oregon and lose 
at Ohio at Iowa, or maybe lose, 

486
00:24:26,480 --> 00:24:28,480
let's say we lose at Oregon, 
lose at Penn State, but we, we 

487
00:24:28,480 --> 00:24:30,640
win at Iowa. 
And maybe Iowa isn't where 

488
00:24:30,640 --> 00:24:32,000
they've always been. 
You know, they're, they're 

489
00:24:32,640 --> 00:24:36,040
outside of the top 25, you know,
unfortunately, just be prepared 

490
00:24:36,040 --> 00:24:40,360
for probably some residual 
national annoyance from last 

491
00:24:40,360 --> 00:24:42,400
year coming back to this year. 
It's like we still haven't 

492
00:24:42,400 --> 00:24:44,280
played anybody. 
It's like some of that might 

493
00:24:44,280 --> 00:24:47,120
come over. 
And if we, if we get punted from

494
00:24:47,120 --> 00:24:49,520
a College Football Playoff 
because of just crappy 

495
00:24:49,520 --> 00:24:53,120
narrative, so be it. 
Like, you know, it's, it's not 

496
00:24:53,120 --> 00:24:56,440
the end of the world, But I just
I, I, I can already kind of 

497
00:24:56,440 --> 00:24:58,760
foresee that happening. 
Is that if that's the way that 

498
00:24:58,760 --> 00:25:01,880
we get to 10 and two it, it 
could be there. 

499
00:25:01,880 --> 00:25:05,880
But I like you mentioned, that 
scenario might be good enough to

500
00:25:05,880 --> 00:25:09,960
get us into the Big 10 title 
game, which is also pretty cool.

501
00:25:10,680 --> 00:25:12,680
Let's keep knocking off things 
we've never done before. 

502
00:25:12,880 --> 00:25:15,200
You're kidding. 
We had another question. 

503
00:25:16,000 --> 00:25:19,160
I, I have a question for you. 
I'm going to, I'm, I'm pulling 

504
00:25:19,160 --> 00:25:20,960
rank and I'm putting in a 
Twitter question. 

505
00:25:22,840 --> 00:25:25,240
We're on a, you know, it's, 
it's, I have a note here like, 

506
00:25:25,240 --> 00:25:28,000
you know, days since Galen has 
not been to an, to an IU 

507
00:25:28,000 --> 00:25:30,240
football game. 
We have a calendar going there. 

508
00:25:30,240 --> 00:25:33,000
There's the days. 
It's, you know, 365 days. 

509
00:25:33,000 --> 00:25:37,120
You went to all games last year.
I look back the end of the 2023 

510
00:25:37,120 --> 00:25:40,160
season ended at Purdue. 
So I'm assuming you didn't go to

511
00:25:40,160 --> 00:25:41,200
that game. 
I don't think you went to that 

512
00:25:41,200 --> 00:25:42,080
game. 
I did. 

513
00:25:42,120 --> 00:25:45,440
I did not go to that game. 
Year of the the Allen era. 

514
00:25:45,800 --> 00:25:47,920
So. 
You will start next season. 

515
00:25:48,200 --> 00:25:49,600
You know you have season tickets
as do I. 

516
00:25:49,600 --> 00:25:52,080
You'll go to Old Dominion, go to
Kennesaw State, Indiana State, 

517
00:25:52,080 --> 00:25:54,960
you go to Illinois. 
The 1st Rd. game is Iowa. 

518
00:25:54,960 --> 00:25:58,520
Like is September 27th when your
year long streak is? 

519
00:25:58,520 --> 00:26:00,400
Are we going to hit 400 days? 
Like what? 

520
00:26:00,400 --> 00:26:03,360
What's the street going to end 
of days you get? 

521
00:26:03,360 --> 00:26:05,040
You haven't been to an IU 
football game. 

522
00:26:06,120 --> 00:26:08,560
You know, you, you're putting a 
lot of pressure on me with this.

523
00:26:08,560 --> 00:26:11,040
I hadn't thought about it in 
those terms, but you're right. 

524
00:26:11,040 --> 00:26:14,520
It, it's, I need to think 
through this a little bit more 

525
00:26:14,520 --> 00:26:17,720
because I, I don't think I'm 
making it out to Iowa because 

526
00:26:17,960 --> 00:26:21,400
Iowa, which sucks, going to Iowa
always sucks. 

527
00:26:22,000 --> 00:26:24,240
Like it's, it's not just the 
journey, it's also the 

528
00:26:24,240 --> 00:26:30,800
destination that sucks. 
But but the but and there may be

529
00:26:30,800 --> 00:26:33,920
some other things going on that 
I need to be in Bloomington for 

530
00:26:33,920 --> 00:26:36,000
which might preclude me from 
going right. 

531
00:26:36,600 --> 00:26:40,040
That's a tease out there, folks.
I can't tell you what the tease 

532
00:26:40,040 --> 00:26:42,600
is, but at that, just just know 
that there may be some things in

533
00:26:42,600 --> 00:26:47,320
Bloomington that weekend, but I 
that might put pressure on me to

534
00:26:47,320 --> 00:26:49,840
head out there for that game. 
But that that's the first one. 

535
00:26:49,840 --> 00:26:52,120
Now I am going to go to Oregon. 
That's the plan. 

536
00:26:52,800 --> 00:26:56,160
And then then from there you're 
you're looking at. 

537
00:26:56,640 --> 00:27:00,720
Michigan State, you see. 
Your home games, you know, Then 

538
00:27:00,720 --> 00:27:02,800
the the Next Rd. game is that 
game at Maryland. 

539
00:27:02,800 --> 00:27:04,800
Maryland's a tough sled. 
That's a tough place. 

540
00:27:04,800 --> 00:27:07,320
Like if you can fly there, you 
can't really drive there. 

541
00:27:07,320 --> 00:27:09,720
You almost have to go to 
Maryland and then stay and kind 

542
00:27:09,720 --> 00:27:12,200
of work your way back to hit 
State College. 

543
00:27:12,200 --> 00:27:15,520
That would be tough with my job.
But you know, the, the Penn 

544
00:27:15,520 --> 00:27:18,480
State game's an interesting one 
because what's fascinating about

545
00:27:18,480 --> 00:27:22,280
that week is that Indiana plays 
at Penn State in football. 

546
00:27:22,880 --> 00:27:25,520
That's Week 11 on a Saturday. 
We don't know what time. 

547
00:27:25,560 --> 00:27:27,720
We won't know what time until 
probably about two weeks before.

548
00:27:28,440 --> 00:27:32,520
Then the next day, Indiana's in 
Chicago basketball playing 

549
00:27:32,520 --> 00:27:37,160
Marquette at the United Center. 
So I, I am tempted to like rent 

550
00:27:37,360 --> 00:27:42,040
an RV or a sprinter van and do 
the, the double like, you know, 

551
00:27:42,040 --> 00:27:45,280
drive to State College, go to 
the football game and then drive

552
00:27:45,280 --> 00:27:48,040
to Chicago and do the basketball
game and then come back to 

553
00:27:48,040 --> 00:27:49,400
Bloomington. 
I don't think I'm actually going

554
00:27:49,400 --> 00:27:51,960
to do it, but I'm I'm really 
contemplating it right now. 

555
00:27:52,720 --> 00:27:55,040
Let me in on the the planning 
for that because you and I in 

556
00:27:55,040 --> 00:27:58,200
college, we, we had the idea of 
ballparks across America. 

557
00:27:58,200 --> 00:28:00,600
I think it was what we called. 
No, it was the Take Me Out to 

558
00:28:00,600 --> 00:28:05,120
the ballpark store. 
Scott and I were both on the 

559
00:28:05,320 --> 00:28:09,240
WIUS Sports Broadcasting staff 
and we would just kind of sit 

560
00:28:09,240 --> 00:28:13,280
around and BS during meetings, 
much to the consternation of 

561
00:28:13,280 --> 00:28:16,080
Sean Bartel and Mike Petrie 
about the ballparks. 

562
00:28:17,600 --> 00:28:21,640
Yeah, but we had this idea, and 
this was in 1998, I want to say 

563
00:28:21,640 --> 00:28:24,480
it was where we wanted to rent a
bus. 

564
00:28:25,280 --> 00:28:28,920
We wanted, or it was a bus 
originally, and we were going to

565
00:28:28,920 --> 00:28:32,600
go visit all of the ballparks in
Major League Baseball, which now

566
00:28:32,600 --> 00:28:33,920
like people do that all the 
time. 

567
00:28:34,160 --> 00:28:37,480
But at the time it felt kind of 
it was like Rd. rule, you know, 

568
00:28:37,480 --> 00:28:41,360
like Rd. rules or whatever, you 
know, for, for the sports scene.

569
00:28:42,000 --> 00:28:44,200
And we wanted to visit a bunch 
of parks we thought might close 

570
00:28:44,200 --> 00:28:46,800
down relatively soon. 
Like Tiger Stadium was one that 

571
00:28:46,800 --> 00:28:48,560
we wanted to hit. 
There were a couple of others 

572
00:28:48,560 --> 00:28:51,080
and we never knew. 
The prices right too. 

573
00:28:51,080 --> 00:28:53,640
It's like we want to throw in 
the prices right visit and and 

574
00:28:53,640 --> 00:28:55,480
honestly, it's one of the, you 
know, we have a lot of younger 

575
00:28:55,480 --> 00:28:57,760
listeners. 
If you're in college, they do it

576
00:28:58,200 --> 00:28:59,560
like I, I don't have a lot of 
regrets in my life. 

577
00:28:59,560 --> 00:29:02,640
I was like, dude, what, what did
I do that summer that would be 

578
00:29:02,640 --> 00:29:04,880
more memorable than that. 
That would have been. 

579
00:29:05,240 --> 00:29:07,520
And it's like you, we get to be 
in your, you have to be in your 

580
00:29:07,520 --> 00:29:10,160
40s. 
You have kids like me doing that

581
00:29:10,160 --> 00:29:13,920
is off the table. 
Well, I, I, I think thinking 

582
00:29:13,920 --> 00:29:16,720
back on it, our primary 
restraint is probably the reason

583
00:29:16,720 --> 00:29:18,640
why most college age students 
don't do it, which is money. 

584
00:29:18,640 --> 00:29:20,120
Like, I had to get a job that 
summer. 

585
00:29:20,160 --> 00:29:21,720
Yeah, so did I I worked at a 
summer camp. 

586
00:29:21,720 --> 00:29:23,640
Yeah. 
You can only give so much blood,

587
00:29:23,640 --> 00:29:28,080
you know and and still like 
drive with any level of effect. 

588
00:29:29,600 --> 00:29:33,040
That could be that could be take
us out to the ballpark tour to 

589
00:29:33,040 --> 00:29:38,480
do do duo right yeah, Penn State
and the market anyway, all all 

590
00:29:38,480 --> 00:29:42,160
I'm saying is, you know, if you 
if you go to Oregon and then 

591
00:29:42,160 --> 00:29:45,520
your home Michigan State, UCLA 
to go to like having the whole 

592
00:29:45,520 --> 00:29:47,080
of Iowa there, it's just a big 
hole. 

593
00:29:47,240 --> 00:29:50,840
No, Galen. 
Let's, let's not. 

594
00:29:50,880 --> 00:29:53,280
Nothing's decided yet. 
Let's just put it that way, OK? 

595
00:29:53,320 --> 00:29:57,120
Nothing's decided yet. 
Question from another question 

596
00:29:57,120 --> 00:29:59,480
on Twitter. 
What do you anticipate the 

597
00:29:59,480 --> 00:30:02,280
intendants being for the first 
three IU football games? 

598
00:30:02,280 --> 00:30:05,080
I'd imagine it's much higher 
than last year's non con, but 

599
00:30:05,080 --> 00:30:08,720
are we talking 60% full? 
90% full? 

600
00:30:10,200 --> 00:30:14,000
You know, here's the thing, I 
think the attendance is going to

601
00:30:14,000 --> 00:30:16,520
be significantly higher, you 
know, for those first three 

602
00:30:16,520 --> 00:30:21,840
games because I think Cignetti 
is going to wave his his magic 

603
00:30:21,840 --> 00:30:24,920
wand and get people out and 
people people want to view. 

604
00:30:24,920 --> 00:30:28,640
So like last year, if you want 
to see this team last year, the 

605
00:30:28,640 --> 00:30:32,080
official attendance for those 
first three games, which you can

606
00:30:32,080 --> 00:30:37,520
only trust to a small degree, I 
know, but it was 44,150 for the 

607
00:30:37,520 --> 00:30:43,480
FIU game, it was 39,000 and 82 
for the Western Illinois game. 

608
00:30:44,000 --> 00:30:47,040
And then for the Charlotte game,
which was a blazing hot day, if 

609
00:30:47,040 --> 00:30:51,920
you will recall, it was 43,000 
one O 9 and we were kind of 

610
00:30:51,920 --> 00:30:53,200
wondering if anybody was going 
to show up. 

611
00:30:53,200 --> 00:30:55,720
And then they showed up for the 
Maryland game, which had some 

612
00:30:55,720 --> 00:30:57,840
weather issues. 
Obviously you had some remnants 

613
00:30:57,840 --> 00:31:00,120
of a tropical storm that were 
blowing through at that point. 

614
00:31:00,120 --> 00:31:03,600
But that is 48,000. 
And from there, attendance, 

615
00:31:04,280 --> 00:31:06,360
Indiana sold out all the 
remaining games. 

616
00:31:07,320 --> 00:31:11,760
I will be surprised if the first
game of the season, which is the

617
00:31:11,760 --> 00:31:15,280
Old Dominion game, if that 
doesn't have close to 50,000 

618
00:31:15,280 --> 00:31:17,160
people, I don't know if it'll be
a complete sell out. 

619
00:31:17,680 --> 00:31:20,640
I think there's going to be a 
ton of things there's there's 

620
00:31:20,640 --> 00:31:23,640
already a ton of things I know 
about that people are going to 

621
00:31:23,640 --> 00:31:25,800
want to be in the stands for for
that game. 

622
00:31:26,240 --> 00:31:28,520
And so I think that that's going
to draw a lot of people. 

623
00:31:28,640 --> 00:31:31,600
Hopefully it's an evening game. 
It'd be nice to not have 

624
00:31:31,600 --> 00:31:34,280
something in the blazing sun on 
August 30th. 

625
00:31:35,520 --> 00:31:38,360
I think Kennesaw State will 
probably also be pretty well 

626
00:31:38,360 --> 00:31:40,920
attended. 
That's Labor Day weekend, so 

627
00:31:40,920 --> 00:31:42,280
that's always an interesting 
one. 

628
00:31:42,360 --> 00:31:45,840
Just in terms of people going on
vacation, I could see it dipping

629
00:31:45,840 --> 00:31:49,880
a bit for Indiana State, 'cause 
it's Week 3 and then back in 

630
00:31:49,880 --> 00:31:52,080
earnest for that Illinois game. 
That Illinois game's going to be

631
00:31:52,080 --> 00:31:53,640
a sellout. 
But I wouldn't be shocked if all

632
00:31:53,640 --> 00:31:59,400
those games were in the 46 to 
50,000 range, which we haven't 

633
00:31:59,400 --> 00:32:03,240
had a lot of games in early 
September against, you know, 

634
00:32:03,240 --> 00:32:05,480
that level of competition. 
Get up to that mark. 

635
00:32:05,480 --> 00:32:09,120
I mean, you, you go back last, 
not last year, two years ago, 

636
00:32:09,760 --> 00:32:13,000
that opener against Ohio State 
drew 50,000 and 50, but it was 

637
00:32:13,000 --> 00:32:16,680
Ohio State and then it was back 
to 42,000 when Indiana played 

638
00:32:16,680 --> 00:32:20,200
Indiana State the following day.
So I, I do think there'll be a 

639
00:32:20,200 --> 00:32:22,520
lot of people though, a lot more
than we're used to seeing just 

640
00:32:22,520 --> 00:32:24,320
because there's going to be so 
much excitement about the team. 

641
00:32:24,320 --> 00:32:26,040
And I think tickets will be a 
little more affordable for 

642
00:32:26,040 --> 00:32:28,200
people. 
I I agree with all that. 

643
00:32:28,200 --> 00:32:30,560
I think the other thing that you
have in play is, you know, you 

644
00:32:30,560 --> 00:32:34,560
go back and look at last season,
the games against FIU, Western 

645
00:32:34,560 --> 00:32:38,200
Illinois and Charlotte, kind of 
the three Gimme or you know, non

646
00:32:38,200 --> 00:32:40,720
big Ted games. 
We won them, but the scores were

647
00:32:40,720 --> 00:32:46,640
31 to 777 to 3, 52 to 14. 
I mean, just just ass kickings 

648
00:32:46,640 --> 00:32:48,880
across the board. 
I remember us having the pod 

649
00:32:48,880 --> 00:32:51,640
after Western Illinois where 
it's like, that's just fun. 

650
00:32:51,640 --> 00:32:52,680
And we don't get to do that a 
lot. 

651
00:32:52,680 --> 00:32:55,080
It's like it's fun watching our 
team go and just kick somebody 

652
00:32:55,080 --> 00:32:58,360
out. 
Versus 2023, we played Akron and

653
00:32:58,360 --> 00:33:03,200
we won in quadruple overtime, 29
to 27, where it's like, you 

654
00:33:03,200 --> 00:33:07,040
know, games like that is when 
people are like, I, I, you know,

655
00:33:07,080 --> 00:33:11,240
do I want to go watch Indiana 
almost lose to Kennesaw State? 

656
00:33:11,240 --> 00:33:13,280
You know, if they, if they have 
a tough time against Old 

657
00:33:13,280 --> 00:33:15,240
Dominion, that's what that's not
going to happen. 

658
00:33:15,440 --> 00:33:19,240
Like Signeti has shown that he's
going to take these games 

659
00:33:19,240 --> 00:33:22,200
seriously and that he's going to
come out and we're probably 

660
00:33:22,200 --> 00:33:25,000
going to lay the smack down to 
Old Dominion, Kennesaw State and

661
00:33:25,000 --> 00:33:28,080
Indiana State. 
And that's going to get its own 

662
00:33:28,080 --> 00:33:30,120
level of excitement. 
You know, it's like, oh wow, 

663
00:33:30,200 --> 00:33:33,800
this is kind of fun to watch IU 
score 5 touchdowns at like so I 

664
00:33:33,800 --> 00:33:36,760
I agree with you on those 
numbers, but it's all leading up

665
00:33:36,760 --> 00:33:38,880
to that Illinois game is going 
to be awesome. 

666
00:33:38,920 --> 00:33:41,880
So it's going it should be. 
I'm pretty sure Illinois don't 

667
00:33:42,640 --> 00:33:44,640
have their schedule in front. 
I think they have a pretty easy 

668
00:33:44,640 --> 00:33:49,200
Rd. into that game as well. 
That should be two top 20 or 25 

669
00:33:49,200 --> 00:33:51,480
teams. 
It is leading up to kind of a 

670
00:33:51,480 --> 00:33:55,440
very early big 10 matchup. 
That could honestly be another 

671
00:33:55,440 --> 00:33:59,120
big noon Saturday, Saturday, 
just like keep keep stacking 

672
00:33:59,120 --> 00:34:01,680
those up. 
But I, I think that alone 

673
00:34:02,040 --> 00:34:04,920
knowing that's kind of on the 
way, like I remember this a long

674
00:34:04,920 --> 00:34:07,680
time ago, the, you know, the 
year we played Michigan and we 

675
00:34:07,680 --> 00:34:09,560
were four and oh, and they were 
four and oh, it was like the Ben

676
00:34:09,560 --> 00:34:12,520
Chapel year that there was 
excitement building up in the 

677
00:34:12,520 --> 00:34:14,520
games leading up to it. 
Like, oh, we just got to keep 

678
00:34:14,520 --> 00:34:15,920
winning. 
And like we, that Michigan game 

679
00:34:15,920 --> 00:34:17,320
is going to be big. 
I think you'll see something 

680
00:34:17,320 --> 00:34:20,239
similar with Kennesaw State and 
Indiana State where you see the 

681
00:34:20,239 --> 00:34:22,639
crowd start to grow because it's
like, all right, I want to start

682
00:34:22,639 --> 00:34:26,080
getting my feel for this team 
because we got a real 1 coming 

683
00:34:26,080 --> 00:34:29,719
up on September 20th. 
Yeah, I mean, I, I just think 

684
00:34:29,719 --> 00:34:32,000
the vibe will be really good and
I think it'll stay that way 

685
00:34:32,000 --> 00:34:34,480
until people feel like they, 
they don't have a reason for the

686
00:34:34,480 --> 00:34:39,040
vibe to be good anymore. 
But you know, that's, I don't 

687
00:34:39,040 --> 00:34:41,719
anticipate that being that big 
of an issue, at least not in the

688
00:34:41,719 --> 00:34:44,679
short term. 
So let's let's jump to some 

689
00:34:44,679 --> 00:34:47,800
other questions. 
As again, we had we had a ton of

690
00:34:47,800 --> 00:34:52,840
them across the board. 
So let's jump over to basketball

691
00:34:53,199 --> 00:34:55,080
as, as we had a ton of questions
there. 

692
00:34:55,080 --> 00:34:58,200
So we had a question from Robbie
Malkinson. 

693
00:34:58,200 --> 00:35:00,600
Could the summer trip for the 
men's basketball team to play 

694
00:35:00,600 --> 00:35:02,880
overseas help with building 
early team chemistry? 

695
00:35:02,880 --> 00:35:05,600
And the rumor is, I think 
somewhere in the Caribbean. 

696
00:35:06,040 --> 00:35:07,200
Yes. 
I mean, the question is 

697
00:35:07,200 --> 00:35:09,520
absolutely yes. 
And I think, you know, we, we've

698
00:35:09,520 --> 00:35:11,800
seen Indiana do trips every now 
and again. 

699
00:35:11,800 --> 00:35:15,000
You, you're, you can only, and 
under the current NCAA rules, 

700
00:35:15,000 --> 00:35:18,160
you can only do a certain number
or like you do 1 and then you 

701
00:35:18,160 --> 00:35:20,480
have to wait a couple years 
before you can do another one. 

702
00:35:20,480 --> 00:35:23,920
But I think for IU, it's going 
to be really, really important 

703
00:35:24,000 --> 00:35:28,000
that they get one of these under
their belt and the guys can 

704
00:35:28,000 --> 00:35:31,160
learn how to play with each 
other in an actual game setting.

705
00:35:31,560 --> 00:35:35,480
You know, you, you can do 
informal, you know, games, you 

706
00:35:35,480 --> 00:35:39,080
can do, you know, certain 
limited amounts of practices, 

707
00:35:39,080 --> 00:35:41,640
but you just, you can't 
substitute what you get when you

708
00:35:41,640 --> 00:35:43,080
actually put everybody on the 
floor. 

709
00:35:43,520 --> 00:35:46,440
They get used to what their 
roles are and how it works. 

710
00:35:46,440 --> 00:35:49,240
And so I think it absolutely 
helps with chemistry. 

711
00:35:49,240 --> 00:35:52,160
And I think it may actually just
be a necessity to get this team 

712
00:35:52,160 --> 00:35:55,600
up and running, given that it is
a bunch of guys who largely have

713
00:35:55,600 --> 00:35:57,160
not played with each other up to
this point. 

714
00:35:58,520 --> 00:36:04,360
I, I agree or I tend to agree, 
but you know, I, I go back to 

715
00:36:04,360 --> 00:36:07,480
like, was it 2000? 
I'm looking up right now 2021 

716
00:36:07,920 --> 00:36:11,520
the team went to the Bahamas 
before the season and a lot of 

717
00:36:11,520 --> 00:36:14,000
it came out like, oh, are they, 
they kind of gelled and 

718
00:36:14,000 --> 00:36:16,280
coalesced and that was a team 
that think that's a team that 

719
00:36:16,280 --> 00:36:20,360
went 7:00 and 12:00. 
If I have my years right, team 

720
00:36:20,360 --> 00:36:22,680
ended in 2021. 
I mean that was either the last 

721
00:36:22,680 --> 00:36:24,920
year of Archie or the first year
of Woodson. 

722
00:36:25,520 --> 00:36:26,520
It's like it's first year of 
Woodson. 

723
00:36:26,520 --> 00:36:31,960
The midterm. 
It's I, it's like, I think these

724
00:36:31,960 --> 00:36:35,040
pre season trips, you can kind 
of bend them to whatever the 

725
00:36:35,040 --> 00:36:37,720
result of the season is that if 
the team ends up looking pretty 

726
00:36:37,720 --> 00:36:39,480
good, it's like, oh, that trip 
made the difference. 

727
00:36:39,480 --> 00:36:41,560
If it doesn't, the team is not 
great. 

728
00:36:41,560 --> 00:36:43,000
It's like, well, that didn't do 
much. 

729
00:36:43,000 --> 00:36:44,680
I I agree, I think it's going to
hurt. 

730
00:36:44,840 --> 00:36:47,480
And I agree that with 12 guys 
who don't really know each 

731
00:36:47,480 --> 00:36:51,200
other, putting together more 
time in the Crucible together is

732
00:36:51,200 --> 00:36:53,280
going to be good. 
But I think it ends up coming 

733
00:36:53,280 --> 00:36:56,840
down to, you know, if, if you 
have the right coaching staff in

734
00:36:56,840 --> 00:36:58,960
place, these trips are going to 
matter. 

735
00:36:58,960 --> 00:37:01,600
And I, I think we both, I have 
the hope that Derezza is the 

736
00:37:01,600 --> 00:37:04,200
right answer to that. 
I just, we, we've done these 

737
00:37:04,200 --> 00:37:06,800
before and had seasons that are 
kind of lackluster of seasons 

738
00:37:06,800 --> 00:37:08,360
where it's like, man, this team 
doesn't look connected. 

739
00:37:08,360 --> 00:37:12,440
I guess that Bahamas trip didn't
matter, but I don't think it can

740
00:37:12,440 --> 00:37:15,320
hurt. 
That's my whole thing. 

741
00:37:15,320 --> 00:37:19,160
I don't see it hurting at all. 
And I and I think ultimately you

742
00:37:19,160 --> 00:37:21,840
just got to have some kind of an
environment, especially with how

743
00:37:21,840 --> 00:37:23,920
quickly the season starts. 
I mean, you're playing Marquette

744
00:37:23,920 --> 00:37:27,800
on what I think November 9th. 
You, you know, you're, you're 

745
00:37:27,800 --> 00:37:30,560
going to have to figure out a 
way to mesh a little bit ahead 

746
00:37:30,560 --> 00:37:31,720
of time. 
And look, even with that, it's 

747
00:37:31,720 --> 00:37:34,160
going to be a work in progress 
through the first month or so. 

748
00:37:34,480 --> 00:37:36,280
Not too different from football 
last year. 

749
00:37:36,600 --> 00:37:39,440
You know, people forget there 
was some questions after that 

750
00:37:39,440 --> 00:37:42,320
FIU game and it was like, we'll 
pump the brakes because they're 

751
00:37:42,320 --> 00:37:44,200
rounding into shape. 
And that's exactly what 

752
00:37:44,200 --> 00:37:45,520
happened. 
And I think with this point, you

753
00:37:45,520 --> 00:37:50,040
got to give Darren Devries and 
his staff some, some credit and 

754
00:37:50,040 --> 00:37:54,600
some grace, I guess, in trying 
to put piece all this together. 

755
00:37:54,600 --> 00:37:56,280
But I, I do think the trip will 
be helpful. 

756
00:37:57,720 --> 00:38:04,800
Let's see, we had a question 
regarding some other items with 

757
00:38:04,800 --> 00:38:06,520
IU basketball. 
I'll just kind of digging into 

758
00:38:06,520 --> 00:38:10,240
some of these here. 
Someone asked, does IU is lore 

759
00:38:10,240 --> 00:38:12,360
StarCraft? 
Does IU need a rim protector to 

760
00:38:12,360 --> 00:38:16,200
compete in the Big 10? 
So, so here's the thing, like I 

761
00:38:16,200 --> 00:38:20,280
feel like rim protection is both
important and overemphasized 

762
00:38:21,200 --> 00:38:26,800
because when you look at the 
last couple of years, you know, 

763
00:38:26,800 --> 00:38:30,600
if you're looking at it from the
perspective of block percentage,

764
00:38:30,600 --> 00:38:33,480
like, you know, are you, are you
collecting blocks at the rim? 

765
00:38:33,720 --> 00:38:37,280
Are you altering shots? 
You know, last year the, the top

766
00:38:37,280 --> 00:38:41,360
two teams in the league, 
Michigan State and, and Maryland

767
00:38:41,360 --> 00:38:45,000
was tied for second. 
They were, they were #1 and #2IN

768
00:38:45,000 --> 00:38:48,720
block percentage. 
But I think it's important to 

769
00:38:48,720 --> 00:38:53,040
keep in mind that the third best
team in block percentage in the 

770
00:38:53,040 --> 00:38:56,200
conference last year was 
Minnesota, who was not a good 

771
00:38:56,200 --> 00:38:57,640
team. 
You know, that that was a team 

772
00:38:57,640 --> 00:38:59,080
that was not particularly 
talented. 

773
00:38:59,080 --> 00:39:01,640
They, they struggled quite a bit
throughout the course of the 

774
00:39:01,640 --> 00:39:03,720
year. 
And, and even when you look at, 

775
00:39:03,760 --> 00:39:06,160
you know, something like 
offensive rebounding percentage,

776
00:39:06,760 --> 00:39:09,760
it wasn't an exact correlation 
to teams necessarily being 

777
00:39:09,760 --> 00:39:12,600
great. 
You know, defensive rebounding 

778
00:39:13,080 --> 00:39:16,800
percentage and things like that.
I I don't think you necessarily 

779
00:39:16,800 --> 00:39:22,200
need A7 footer or like a, a 
hyper large big in there doing 

780
00:39:22,200 --> 00:39:24,200
that. 
I think if you can, if you have 

781
00:39:24,200 --> 00:39:28,560
two athletic post players who 
can rebound and defend 

782
00:39:28,560 --> 00:39:32,520
effectively, I think that's more
important than having a quote UN

783
00:39:32,520 --> 00:39:35,400
quote rim protector. 
You know, certainly rim 

784
00:39:35,400 --> 00:39:38,960
protection's nice, but again, 
it's like, I'll point back to 

785
00:39:38,960 --> 00:39:43,080
the 2022 season when Indiana's 
rim protection that whole season

786
00:39:43,080 --> 00:39:46,960
was a six, nine guy in Trace 
Jackson Davis and a six, eight 

787
00:39:46,960 --> 00:39:50,040
guy in Race Thompson. 
And that's essentially the sizes

788
00:39:50,040 --> 00:39:53,160
of what Indiana's got out there 
going into this upcoming year. 

789
00:39:53,520 --> 00:39:56,280
So, you know, I keep hearing 
this refrain like they got to 

790
00:39:56,280 --> 00:39:58,720
get a rim protector and they may
still like they're not done 

791
00:39:58,720 --> 00:40:02,720
building the roster, but I could
absolutely see a scenario where 

792
00:40:02,720 --> 00:40:08,120
Indiana's like we would rather 
have a a more agile, slightly 

793
00:40:08,120 --> 00:40:11,200
smaller frontline. 
Because it might be easier for 

794
00:40:11,200 --> 00:40:14,320
them to rebound, you know, and, 
and look, there's so many 

795
00:40:14,320 --> 00:40:16,240
different ways to win basketball
games. 

796
00:40:16,240 --> 00:40:18,000
And I've talked about this on 
the show before. 

797
00:40:18,480 --> 00:40:23,280
You're, you know, Indiana has 
kind of largely predicated a lot

798
00:40:23,280 --> 00:40:26,600
of what it's done the last few 
years on this idea that they 

799
00:40:26,600 --> 00:40:30,560
were going to focus on certain 
aspects of defense and, and of 

800
00:40:30,560 --> 00:40:32,520
offense. 
And, you know, if you look at 

801
00:40:32,520 --> 00:40:34,800
Mike Woodson's statistical 
profile, it was like, we're 

802
00:40:34,800 --> 00:40:39,120
going to have a high assist rate
offensively and we're going to 

803
00:40:39,680 --> 00:40:42,640
try to shoot the ball relative 
relatively well and we're going 

804
00:40:42,640 --> 00:40:46,040
to try to hold the opposition 
down to a lower shooting 

805
00:40:46,040 --> 00:40:47,800
percentage. 
And that kind of worked. 

806
00:40:47,800 --> 00:40:49,240
It didn't work the last two 
years. 

807
00:40:49,240 --> 00:40:52,600
It worked the first two. 
But the flip side of that is, 

808
00:40:53,000 --> 00:40:57,240
you know, Indiana, you know, 
kind of voluntarily chose not to

809
00:40:57,240 --> 00:40:59,200
be particularly great at 
offensive rebounding. 

810
00:40:59,200 --> 00:41:02,720
They they didn't really focus on
limiting their own turnovers or 

811
00:41:02,720 --> 00:41:06,000
turning the opposition over. 
Those are just as important ways

812
00:41:06,000 --> 00:41:09,240
to win if you look at the four 
factors of basketball and what 

813
00:41:09,240 --> 00:41:10,800
contributes statistically to 
victory. 

814
00:41:10,800 --> 00:41:14,480
So, you know, look, there's 
still time to add to the roster.

815
00:41:14,480 --> 00:41:16,600
I'm still interested to see if 
they had somebody else. 

816
00:41:16,600 --> 00:41:19,040
But if the roster that they have
now is what they go in with 

817
00:41:19,040 --> 00:41:22,040
primarily, I think you can be a 
very successful team in the 

818
00:41:22,040 --> 00:41:24,560
conference with that type of a 
roster if you've got the right 

819
00:41:24,560 --> 00:41:26,120
system and you're coaching it 
properly. 

820
00:41:26,440 --> 00:41:29,080
Yeah, you you took one of the, 
one of the thoughts right out of

821
00:41:29,080 --> 00:41:31,680
my mind is that, you know, the, 
the most successful season we 

822
00:41:31,680 --> 00:41:33,760
had in the last four years was 
2022. 

823
00:41:33,760 --> 00:41:36,480
And that was Trey Jackson Davis,
who had a block percentage of, 

824
00:41:36,560 --> 00:41:40,080
you know, he was 24th in the 
country in block percentage, but

825
00:41:40,080 --> 00:41:42,400
he's 69. 
You know, then the years after 

826
00:41:42,400 --> 00:41:45,800
that, you had Khalil Ware at 7 
foot and Omar Balo at 7 foot or 

827
00:41:45,800 --> 00:41:48,120
seven One, you'd be like, oh, 
just that's a better rim 

828
00:41:48,120 --> 00:41:49,640
defensive. 
And it's like, Nope, the the 

829
00:41:49,640 --> 00:41:52,400
results weren't there. 
I would also say that, you know,

830
00:41:52,400 --> 00:41:55,240
you look at just a quick NBA 
corollary. 

831
00:41:55,560 --> 00:41:59,040
You know, the Pacers just played
the Bucks Giannis Anton and Kupo

832
00:41:59,040 --> 00:42:02,120
is definitely a rim protector. 
But I, I think this is something

833
00:42:02,120 --> 00:42:05,960
that you see with the way that 
Indiana basketball is putting IU

834
00:42:06,040 --> 00:42:09,320
college basketball is putting 
their roster together is similar

835
00:42:09,320 --> 00:42:11,760
in a way to what the Pacers are 
doing is that the last couple 

836
00:42:11,760 --> 00:42:15,600
years the Pacers have been fun 
because they're using offense as

837
00:42:15,600 --> 00:42:17,240
defense. 
And what I mean by that is their

838
00:42:17,240 --> 00:42:21,080
offense scores very, very high 
points per possession. 

839
00:42:21,080 --> 00:42:24,000
And they're also very efficient.
Don't turn the ball over. 

840
00:42:24,160 --> 00:42:26,440
So, you know, it's like they're 
playing the Bucks like, great, 

841
00:42:26,440 --> 00:42:27,640
we're going to hit a three, hit 
a 2. 

842
00:42:27,640 --> 00:42:29,360
Great, we're going to hit a two,
you're going to turn it over. 

843
00:42:29,360 --> 00:42:31,120
Great. 
We're going to hit a 2, you're 

844
00:42:31,120 --> 00:42:32,560
going to turn it over. 
We're going to hit a three, 

845
00:42:32,560 --> 00:42:34,640
you're going to hit 2. 
Suddenly you're down 6 points. 

846
00:42:34,640 --> 00:42:37,600
The Bucks are down 6 points. 
And it's like we now have to do 

847
00:42:37,600 --> 00:42:40,640
way more on offense. 
Not because the Pacers defense 

848
00:42:40,640 --> 00:42:43,880
is awesome, it's just the Pacers
offense is so efficient and 

849
00:42:43,880 --> 00:42:46,800
scores at a high clip that it 
puts a lot of pressure on the 

850
00:42:46,800 --> 00:42:49,680
other team's offense. 
And I think the way that Devries

851
00:42:49,680 --> 00:42:53,560
is in building this roster, 
scoring is at a premium and 

852
00:42:53,560 --> 00:42:56,680
shooting is at a premium. 
And I think that, you know, 

853
00:42:56,760 --> 00:42:58,840
you're not going to fill all of 
the holes. 

854
00:42:59,080 --> 00:43:01,960
But if Indiana can score a 
little bit more, a little more 

855
00:43:01,960 --> 00:43:05,520
effectively and a with a little 
more points per possession, 

856
00:43:05,760 --> 00:43:08,880
that's going to put pressure on 
other teams when they hit Lols 

857
00:43:09,120 --> 00:43:10,920
even more than a rim protector 
would. 

858
00:43:11,640 --> 00:43:15,680
That's the thing, if if you if 
you're shooting well, it takes a

859
00:43:15,680 --> 00:43:18,720
lot of pressure off of your 
offense and your defense. 

860
00:43:18,720 --> 00:43:22,880
And it's clear from my 
evaluation of what they're doing

861
00:43:22,880 --> 00:43:24,520
in the portal that that's what 
they're aiming at. 

862
00:43:24,520 --> 00:43:27,800
They're aiming at shooting. 
They're aiming at being able to 

863
00:43:27,800 --> 00:43:31,360
switch effectively on defense 
and and they're aiming at having

864
00:43:31,360 --> 00:43:33,960
guys that can drive to the 
basket and create both 

865
00:43:33,960 --> 00:43:36,760
opportunities for themselves and
space for their teammates. 

866
00:43:37,560 --> 00:43:43,120
So again, it's a different style
and it does kind of beg the 

867
00:43:43,120 --> 00:43:45,520
question and and this was 
actually, I think asked by 

868
00:43:45,520 --> 00:43:49,640
Patrick, can you build a roster 
for modern basketball 

869
00:43:49,640 --> 00:43:52,480
parentheses the tournament and 
the Big 10 or does there have to

870
00:43:52,480 --> 00:43:54,240
be a shift in the conference 
style first? 

871
00:43:54,880 --> 00:43:56,400
You know, I I would look at it 
like this. 

872
00:43:57,480 --> 00:44:02,280
I don't think Indiana is built 
right now to compete for the Big

873
00:44:02,280 --> 00:44:04,360
10 title unless a bunch of stuff
goes right. 

874
00:44:04,360 --> 00:44:07,560
And that's fine. 
Now they might and, and I'm not 

875
00:44:07,560 --> 00:44:10,920
trying to put an artificial cap 
on them, but you know, I think 

876
00:44:10,920 --> 00:44:14,920
Indiana, just like the, the, the
talent floor is probably a 

877
00:44:14,920 --> 00:44:17,760
little too low for that. 
Just in terms of, you know, if 

878
00:44:17,760 --> 00:44:20,040
you've got questions about the 
players Indiana's brought into 

879
00:44:20,040 --> 00:44:24,720
the portal, they're all pretty 
high performance guys at lower 

880
00:44:24,720 --> 00:44:26,240
levels. 
And then the question becomes, 

881
00:44:26,240 --> 00:44:27,920
well, how do they transition to 
the higher level? 

882
00:44:27,920 --> 00:44:29,640
I think they're going to 
transition pretty well. 

883
00:44:30,480 --> 00:44:33,680
But even with that, there's just
going to be certain teams that 

884
00:44:33,680 --> 00:44:35,800
are going to have a higher 
caliber of athlete and higher 

885
00:44:35,800 --> 00:44:40,600
caliber of, of, you know, 
basketball ability. 

886
00:44:41,440 --> 00:44:45,040
But I do think that this Indiana
team is built really well to be 

887
00:44:45,040 --> 00:44:47,080
a good shooting team. 
That would be a really difficult

888
00:44:47,080 --> 00:44:50,240
out in the NCAA tournament. 
And then it's really just about 

889
00:44:50,240 --> 00:44:52,560
matchups. 
So I, I think that, you know, 

890
00:44:52,560 --> 00:44:55,280
there are circumstances where 
you can compete and do both. 

891
00:44:55,280 --> 00:44:59,000
I think it's frankly what John 
Beeline did the best at Michigan

892
00:44:59,000 --> 00:45:03,760
was he figured out a way to kind
of have it where he could be a 

893
00:45:03,760 --> 00:45:06,920
competitive team in the Big 10 
but could still compete in the 

894
00:45:06,920 --> 00:45:09,360
NCAA Tournament. 
I think Beau Ryan figured that 

895
00:45:09,360 --> 00:45:11,840
out very late in his tenure and 
and that was really what 

896
00:45:11,840 --> 00:45:15,440
elevated Wisconsin. 
You know, Purdue has done it. 

897
00:45:15,440 --> 00:45:17,400
I mean, I think you got to give 
them credit, but they've done it

898
00:45:17,400 --> 00:45:22,000
by kind of like taking the Big 
10 style and making it work in 

899
00:45:22,000 --> 00:45:24,240
the NCAA. 
Tournament and Michigan State 

900
00:45:24,240 --> 00:45:27,520
both kind of just pushed the Big
10 style as far as it can go in 

901
00:45:27,520 --> 00:45:30,920
the tournament, so. 
Look, I, I, there's, there's a 

902
00:45:30,920 --> 00:45:32,920
lot of question marks. 
We had another question that I, 

903
00:45:32,920 --> 00:45:35,120
I'm not going to try to tackle 
right now about like what are 

904
00:45:35,120 --> 00:45:38,400
the early power rankings when it
comes to the teams in the Big 10

905
00:45:38,400 --> 00:45:40,280
for the upcoming year? 
I mean, it's hard to say like 

906
00:45:40,280 --> 00:45:41,800
the rosters aren't even complete
yet. 

907
00:45:42,320 --> 00:45:46,160
And until the dust settles, it's
almost a fool's errand to try to

908
00:45:46,160 --> 00:45:48,040
evaluate that. 
But I do think Indiana's in a 

909
00:45:48,040 --> 00:45:50,320
good spot right now because 
they've got interchangeable 

910
00:45:50,320 --> 00:45:52,280
parts. 
They've got parts that look like

911
00:45:52,280 --> 00:45:55,400
they can step up and, and, and 
be the leading scorer one night 

912
00:45:55,400 --> 00:45:57,200
and then step into the 
background for the next couple 

913
00:45:57,200 --> 00:45:58,880
of nights and not have to be 
that big of a deal. 

914
00:45:59,000 --> 00:46:02,120
But that's the kind of thing I 
think to keep an eye on. 

915
00:46:02,480 --> 00:46:06,320
And as you try to cobble a 
roster together this year, it's 

916
00:46:06,320 --> 00:46:09,200
going to be different than what 
you're going to have moving 

917
00:46:09,200 --> 00:46:11,560
forward. 
There was another question that 

918
00:46:11,560 --> 00:46:12,960
really ties into this is what 
our. 

919
00:46:13,200 --> 00:46:14,600
Rankings just got me thinking of
I. 

920
00:46:14,600 --> 00:46:16,880
I do love it. 
Just tangential but I love the 

921
00:46:16,880 --> 00:46:20,160
meme of the Brad Underwood in 
like the 80s. 

922
00:46:22,360 --> 00:46:25,680
That is 80s, but he looks like 
he's like coaching in Belgrade. 

923
00:46:25,680 --> 00:46:28,760
Yeah, I know it's pretty. 
You haven't seen his photo yet. 

924
00:46:28,760 --> 00:46:30,600
I must see if I can call it up. 
They. 

925
00:46:30,800 --> 00:46:33,600
Sign they sign like a bunch of 
just euro players with names 

926
00:46:33,600 --> 00:46:37,000
that are, you know, like Akovic 
and but the picture is just 

927
00:46:37,000 --> 00:46:39,840
great that's been going around. 
It's like the the Russian 

928
00:46:39,840 --> 00:46:41,640
assistant coach from 88 or. 
Something. 

929
00:46:42,160 --> 00:46:47,440
Yeah, it's it's pretty 
remarkable how I, I always 

930
00:46:47,440 --> 00:46:51,120
appreciate when we get coaches. 
I I think I've found it here. 

931
00:46:51,120 --> 00:46:52,760
Here we go. 
Let me let me call this up real 

932
00:46:52,760 --> 00:46:54,800
quick. 
Know their know their like they 

933
00:46:54,800 --> 00:46:57,840
know what they like. 
Well, not just that, but I like,

934
00:46:57,840 --> 00:47:00,360
I like coaches that will go 
along. 

935
00:47:00,400 --> 00:47:02,000
There we go. 
Yeah. 

936
00:47:02,040 --> 00:47:04,280
That that's just a great photo 
right there for those of you who

937
00:47:04,280 --> 00:47:05,680
are watching on YouTube or 
Spotify. 

938
00:47:05,680 --> 00:47:08,440
I mean a little John C Reilly. 
It's like, I think that looks 

939
00:47:08,440 --> 00:47:10,240
like John C Reilly's next role. 
Yeah. 

940
00:47:10,280 --> 00:47:13,120
See, people thought this was AI.
That's actually what Illinois 

941
00:47:13,160 --> 00:47:16,840
campus looks like. 
I mean, if you've been and if 

942
00:47:16,840 --> 00:47:19,920
you've been, you know exactly 
what I'm talking about that that

943
00:47:19,920 --> 00:47:23,240
that, you know, champagne or 
Urbana, right? 

944
00:47:23,240 --> 00:47:25,520
Well, they're both depressing 
would be what I would say. 

945
00:47:25,520 --> 00:47:29,400
But no, look, there's going to 
be a lot of teams in the mix. 

946
00:47:29,880 --> 00:47:31,480
But like this year is a great 
example. 

947
00:47:31,480 --> 00:47:35,520
Like, I don't know that anybody 
would have guessed that the 

948
00:47:35,520 --> 00:47:39,200
particular mix of teams that 
were good played the way that 

949
00:47:39,200 --> 00:47:40,960
they played this year. 
And you also have teams like 

950
00:47:40,960 --> 00:47:43,480
Oregon that were just hot and 
cold all year, and they'd win a 

951
00:47:43,480 --> 00:47:44,280
game. 
You'd be like, wow, that's 

952
00:47:44,280 --> 00:47:45,920
incredible. 
And then they'd lose by 20 at 

953
00:47:45,920 --> 00:47:47,360
home to Illinois. 
And it's like, what? 

954
00:47:47,360 --> 00:47:50,640
And this. 
Goes into, you know, for IE like

955
00:47:50,640 --> 00:47:53,440
you're, you're building a team. 
You know, the, it's, it's tough 

956
00:47:53,440 --> 00:47:55,280
to project. 
It's also tough to get too 

957
00:47:55,280 --> 00:47:57,000
concerned about what you see on 
paper. 

958
00:47:57,000 --> 00:47:59,120
Cause to your point this year, 
Rutgers should have been 

959
00:47:59,120 --> 00:48:00,680
awesome. 
It's like 2 top five picks in 

960
00:48:00,680 --> 00:48:02,560
the draft like that. 
That's awesome. 

961
00:48:02,560 --> 00:48:04,680
Every team would take that. 
It's like, well, but maybe 

962
00:48:04,720 --> 00:48:08,000
they're going to suck. 
We had another question from the

963
00:48:08,000 --> 00:48:09,960
Discord. 
This is from camera 26. 

964
00:48:09,960 --> 00:48:12,480
Would love your perspective on 
the perfect mix between Portal 

965
00:48:12,480 --> 00:48:14,440
and high school recruits going 
forward. 

966
00:48:14,960 --> 00:48:17,280
How should someone like Devries 
handle that, especially in a 

967
00:48:17,280 --> 00:48:21,440
basketball rich state like 
Indiana versus Pitino's comments

968
00:48:21,440 --> 00:48:23,200
on not worrying about high 
school recruiting? 

969
00:48:23,200 --> 00:48:27,920
So I don't think anybody really 
knows what the best. 

970
00:48:27,920 --> 00:48:31,360
Approach is here, yeah. 
And let me try to explain it 

971
00:48:31,360 --> 00:48:34,000
this way. 
Like there are going to be some 

972
00:48:34,000 --> 00:48:36,880
surefire freshman that you're 
going to want to bring in. 

973
00:48:37,600 --> 00:48:42,160
But the problem that I think 
you're going to run into with 

974
00:48:42,160 --> 00:48:46,520
high school recruiting is in 
order to like look at what 

975
00:48:46,520 --> 00:48:48,680
Indiana's done. 
Like most of the players that 

976
00:48:48,680 --> 00:48:51,800
they brought in in the portal 
are they have, they have one 

977
00:48:51,800 --> 00:48:54,160
year left, they might have two 
years left. 

978
00:48:54,640 --> 00:48:57,160
There's there's not very many 
players with multiple years of 

979
00:48:57,160 --> 00:48:59,400
eligibility that are going to be
on the roster. 

980
00:48:59,400 --> 00:49:02,120
Trent Cisley being one of them, 
obviously is the is the lone 

981
00:49:02,120 --> 00:49:04,480
incoming recruit as of right 
now. 

982
00:49:05,800 --> 00:49:10,200
So the question is less about, 
well, what's the balance of high

983
00:49:10,200 --> 00:49:14,240
school recruiting and portal 
acquisition and more. 

984
00:49:14,680 --> 00:49:16,880
Let's say you go get two or 
three really good high school 

985
00:49:16,880 --> 00:49:18,720
players. 
What are you going to tell them?

986
00:49:19,000 --> 00:49:23,680
Hey, come here, but you're not 
as good as the upper class 

987
00:49:23,680 --> 00:49:27,720
players that we have brought in.
So you're going to sit, are they

988
00:49:27,720 --> 00:49:29,760
going to be like, wow, coach, 
that sounds great. 

989
00:49:30,200 --> 00:49:33,720
Now, maybe maybe with NIL in a 
different way and maybe with 

990
00:49:33,720 --> 00:49:36,360
some more ironclad contracts, 
they'd be willing to do that. 

991
00:49:36,360 --> 00:49:38,200
But a lot of those players would
be like, well, why don't I just 

992
00:49:38,200 --> 00:49:42,400
go play at another major school 
that's lower down in the in the 

993
00:49:42,400 --> 00:49:45,680
pecking order, get a year of 
training and then figure out who

994
00:49:45,680 --> 00:49:49,040
wants me the following year? 
Because the flip side is you 

995
00:49:49,040 --> 00:49:50,880
could go be a freshman 
somewhere. 

996
00:49:50,880 --> 00:49:53,960
Think of all the freshmen that 
Indiana have had over the course

997
00:49:53,960 --> 00:49:57,240
of the last five or six seasons 
that didn't pan out and 

998
00:49:57,240 --> 00:49:59,960
transferred either eventually or
immediately. 

999
00:50:00,600 --> 00:50:02,360
You know you can and you can 
just, you know, you go through 

1000
00:50:02,360 --> 00:50:05,080
the rosters. 
I'll, I'll skip this past year's

1001
00:50:05,080 --> 00:50:07,520
roster because it's not really a
fair one to think about. 

1002
00:50:07,520 --> 00:50:12,280
But like look at look at the 
roster last year and the guys 

1003
00:50:12,280 --> 00:50:14,560
who were high school recruits 
that Indiana brought in. 

1004
00:50:14,560 --> 00:50:19,440
See it Gabe Cups who's gone, 
Caleb Banks gone, CJ Gunn gone, 

1005
00:50:20,280 --> 00:50:23,400
McKenzie and Bacco now gone. 
Although you got 2 good years 

1006
00:50:23,400 --> 00:50:26,920
out of him, you know, you go 
back to a, a couple of years 

1007
00:50:26,920 --> 00:50:31,800
prior you had Lake Renew also a 
recruit gone well, right. 

1008
00:50:31,800 --> 00:50:33,720
But, but that's a different 
category. 

1009
00:50:33,720 --> 00:50:35,840
I think the, the Renew, what I'm
talking about is not the guys 

1010
00:50:35,840 --> 00:50:38,440
that can come in and start right
away with the guys who are 

1011
00:50:38,440 --> 00:50:41,280
growers. 
You know, the, the Jordan 

1012
00:50:41,280 --> 00:50:43,480
Geronimo is an example of that 
type of player. 

1013
00:50:43,480 --> 00:50:46,080
Like are you going to roll the 
dice on a guy like Jordan 

1014
00:50:46,080 --> 00:50:48,240
Geronimo that is a developmental
player? 

1015
00:50:48,520 --> 00:50:51,240
Or are you going to be like 
maybe go play at Iona for a year

1016
00:50:51,480 --> 00:50:53,000
and then we'll see where things 
land? 

1017
00:50:54,000 --> 00:50:57,160
So that's where I don't really 
know what the balance is going 

1018
00:50:57,160 --> 00:51:00,080
to be for a school like Indiana,
which the expectation is going 

1019
00:51:00,080 --> 00:51:04,280
to be that Indiana is going to 
be back up to a level where 

1020
00:51:04,280 --> 00:51:07,400
they're competing for, you know,
at the very least, single digit 

1021
00:51:07,400 --> 00:51:10,680
seeds in the NCAA tournament 
under the debris there and 

1022
00:51:10,680 --> 00:51:15,480
hopefully a lot more than that. 
So I wish I had a good answer. 

1023
00:51:15,680 --> 00:51:19,920
I would like to see Indiana have
enough recruiting juice to bring

1024
00:51:19,920 --> 00:51:25,040
in a couple of stud high school 
recruits every year, like 2, 

1025
00:51:25,320 --> 00:51:28,520
maybe three, if you can 
guarantee that they're going to 

1026
00:51:28,520 --> 00:51:32,080
be better than the people that 
you could get in the portal and 

1027
00:51:32,080 --> 00:51:33,840
go ahead and roll the dice with 
them. 

1028
00:51:34,360 --> 00:51:36,360
And and then the rest of the 
guys are guys that you're 

1029
00:51:36,360 --> 00:51:39,800
filling in portal positions with
over, you know, over the the 

1030
00:51:39,800 --> 00:51:43,840
spring session. 
But there's going to be coaches 

1031
00:51:43,840 --> 00:51:46,000
like Patina who are going to be 
like, why would I even bother 

1032
00:51:46,000 --> 00:51:48,800
with high school recruiting when
I can go get players that have 

1033
00:51:48,800 --> 00:51:51,440
already gotten a chance to scout
for two years at the college 

1034
00:51:51,440 --> 00:51:53,080
level? 
And I just have to make sure 

1035
00:51:53,080 --> 00:51:54,600
that they're the right fits for 
my system. 

1036
00:51:55,520 --> 00:51:58,480
You know, I think you can't take
a lot of what Debris is doing 

1037
00:51:58,480 --> 00:52:01,360
right now as necessarily what 
Debris is going to do in the 

1038
00:52:01,360 --> 00:52:04,960
future because Debris is trying 
to build something from scratch 

1039
00:52:05,000 --> 00:52:08,640
right now. 
Not just a new roster, but a new

1040
00:52:08,640 --> 00:52:13,040
roster that fits a new system. 
It won't be a new system next 

1041
00:52:13,040 --> 00:52:14,520
year. 
And it'll be more about, OK, 

1042
00:52:14,520 --> 00:52:16,840
what can we plug in? 
What pieces do you lose? 

1043
00:52:16,960 --> 00:52:19,280
How does all that reconcile? 
I think it's a really 

1044
00:52:19,280 --> 00:52:21,360
fascinating question and I wish 
I was smart enough to have the 

1045
00:52:21,360 --> 00:52:23,360
answer to it right now. 
But I think it's really going to

1046
00:52:23,360 --> 00:52:27,720
depend on circumstance and the 
way that you like. 

1047
00:52:27,920 --> 00:52:31,000
You're always going to learn 
lessons based upon what happened

1048
00:52:31,000 --> 00:52:33,680
the first time. 
And that might end up like 

1049
00:52:33,680 --> 00:52:36,040
impacting the way you decide to 
approach it the next time. 

1050
00:52:36,880 --> 00:52:41,560
I mean, the answer is you want 
to have 72% transfers, not 

1051
00:52:42,920 --> 00:52:44,200
random numbers. 
This is great. 

1052
00:52:44,280 --> 00:52:47,040
Yeah, 70, maybe 71%. 
But if they're if they're over 

1053
00:52:47,040 --> 00:52:48,280
that, you know, you're you're 
screwed. 

1054
00:52:49,040 --> 00:52:52,680
No, it, it's not only going to 
be basis year to year, it's also

1055
00:52:52,680 --> 00:52:54,960
circumstantial. 
So, I mean, you know, I, I think

1056
00:52:54,960 --> 00:52:57,320
there's some, it, it's very 
similar like to Indiana, you 

1057
00:52:57,400 --> 00:53:00,360
know, recruiting Indiana, like 
the the years that, you know, 

1058
00:53:00,360 --> 00:53:03,800
Greg Owen and Mike Conley are 
seniors in, in Indiana high 

1059
00:53:03,800 --> 00:53:05,200
school basketball. 
It's like, yeah, you should 

1060
00:53:05,200 --> 00:53:07,440
probably get those guys on your 
team. 

1061
00:53:07,680 --> 00:53:10,560
The years where, you know, it's 
there's not a great player, 

1062
00:53:10,560 --> 00:53:12,440
maybe you don't recruit Indiana 
that year. 

1063
00:53:13,160 --> 00:53:17,960
I I think again, this this is a 
a very circumstantial year for 

1064
00:53:17,960 --> 00:53:20,120
debris. 
He's doing what he has to do to 

1065
00:53:20,120 --> 00:53:21,600
me. 
I think the answer is you. 

1066
00:53:22,240 --> 00:53:24,920
I don't think the answer is 
going to be all one way or all 

1067
00:53:24,920 --> 00:53:27,120
the other way. 
Like I think the coaches who are

1068
00:53:27,120 --> 00:53:30,600
kind of, you know, askewing the 
transfer portal, we're doing 

1069
00:53:30,600 --> 00:53:32,840
this straight the old way with 
nothing but recruits. 

1070
00:53:33,160 --> 00:53:35,560
I think they're going to 
struggle for for a lot of the 

1071
00:53:35,560 --> 00:53:37,720
reasons we talked about. 
It's like it's just tough to to 

1072
00:53:37,720 --> 00:53:39,640
know, you know, what you're 
getting with high school 

1073
00:53:39,640 --> 00:53:41,800
recruits. 
But I also look at, you know, 

1074
00:53:41,800 --> 00:53:44,080
guys like Pitino who are just 
saying apps screw it, we'll just

1075
00:53:44,080 --> 00:53:46,040
do nothing but transfers. 
I think they're going to 

1076
00:53:46,040 --> 00:53:49,800
struggle for for other reasons. 
I, I think it's always going to 

1077
00:53:49,800 --> 00:53:53,680
be best to have a mix, but I 
think that mix alchemy is going 

1078
00:53:53,680 --> 00:53:56,560
to change every year based on 
who are the recruits you're 

1079
00:53:56,560 --> 00:53:58,320
getting? 
Is your recruiting base? 

1080
00:53:58,320 --> 00:54:00,680
Are there a lot of five stars 
that year that you're in the mix

1081
00:54:00,680 --> 00:54:02,000
for? 
Then maybe that's a year you go 

1082
00:54:02,000 --> 00:54:04,360
heavy recruiting. 
If it's not, then maybe it's a 

1083
00:54:04,360 --> 00:54:06,200
year you go heavy transfers. 
Do you feel like there's some 

1084
00:54:06,200 --> 00:54:09,040
transfers coming in that you're 
going to get it the handle on? 

1085
00:54:09,040 --> 00:54:12,160
So I, I think the answer, you 
know, the answer is both 

1086
00:54:12,160 --> 00:54:14,880
interesting but kind of boring 
and that it's, it's probably, 

1087
00:54:15,360 --> 00:54:18,000
it's going to be a mix and it 
probably should be a mix that 

1088
00:54:18,000 --> 00:54:20,360
changes year over year. 
And I just think to me, the 

1089
00:54:20,360 --> 00:54:24,280
answer is, I don't want a coach 
who's stuck hard one way or the 

1090
00:54:24,280 --> 00:54:26,000
other because I don't think 
that's the right answer. 

1091
00:54:26,000 --> 00:54:27,960
I think the right answer is 
going to change in some years. 

1092
00:54:27,960 --> 00:54:30,880
It might be we should have 7 
high school recruits because we 

1093
00:54:30,880 --> 00:54:33,200
got a ton of great five stars 
who all can come in and start. 

1094
00:54:33,560 --> 00:54:35,920
And then some years maybe we go 
nothing but portal because we 

1095
00:54:35,920 --> 00:54:38,800
have no good recruits coming in.
And I think you have, if 

1096
00:54:38,800 --> 00:54:42,720
anything you're seeing now, you 
need coaches who are flexible 

1097
00:54:43,080 --> 00:54:48,280
and, and not so tied to a system
or a viewpoint, but I want my 

1098
00:54:48,280 --> 00:54:52,240
coach to be flexible and 
basically to build the team the 

1099
00:54:52,240 --> 00:54:56,000
way that they're going to get 
the best players on that team or

1100
00:54:56,000 --> 00:54:58,440
the best players. 
That fit what they're trying to 

1101
00:54:58,440 --> 00:55:00,280
do with that team. 
I should say no, I think that's 

1102
00:55:00,280 --> 00:55:02,080
reasonable. 
And and again, it's it's going 

1103
00:55:02,080 --> 00:55:04,440
to be very situational and I 
think I always know what it 

1104
00:55:04,440 --> 00:55:07,960
comes down to. 
Like, you know, even Duke relied

1105
00:55:07,960 --> 00:55:11,760
on a a couple of of transfers 
from elsewhere this year. 

1106
00:55:11,800 --> 00:55:15,560
We did a scion James had been at
Tulane, Mason Gillis, who came 

1107
00:55:15,560 --> 00:55:18,080
off the bench a decent amount 
was obviously at Purdue. 

1108
00:55:18,080 --> 00:55:20,880
Malik Brown came in from 
Syracuse and they were, you 

1109
00:55:20,880 --> 00:55:23,240
know, Gillis and Brown were more
like bit players. 

1110
00:55:23,240 --> 00:55:26,480
But even Duke, who, you know, 
probably can get whatever five 

1111
00:55:26,480 --> 00:55:29,520
stars they want in any given 
year, wasn't afraid to dip into 

1112
00:55:29,520 --> 00:55:31,960
the portal a bit. 
But I think their ratio is 

1113
00:55:31,960 --> 00:55:34,520
likely going to be OK. 
We'll suck up the five stars. 

1114
00:55:34,520 --> 00:55:36,480
And I think for a lot of other 
teams, it's like, well, we got 

1115
00:55:36,480 --> 00:55:38,160
to figure out some other 
approaches to doing things. 

1116
00:55:38,160 --> 00:55:39,840
Yeah. 
And I, I, you are right. 

1117
00:55:39,840 --> 00:55:41,920
But it's also like they're like 
they're getting guys like Cooper

1118
00:55:41,920 --> 00:55:43,560
flag. 
It's like that's that's a five 

1119
00:55:43,560 --> 00:55:46,160
star that you know, is going to 
be a five star. 

1120
00:55:46,160 --> 00:55:47,000
Who can start. 
Yeah. 

1121
00:55:47,000 --> 00:55:50,240
Crimson Fire asked on Twitter. 
Beyond year one, do you see IE 

1122
00:55:50,240 --> 00:55:52,320
men's basketball bringing in 
more high end true freshmen? 

1123
00:55:52,320 --> 00:55:55,600
They're just going to roll with 
one or two yearly with Clark, 

1124
00:55:55,600 --> 00:55:57,720
Adams and Johnson, the assistant
coaching group, which is a 

1125
00:55:57,720 --> 00:56:00,800
really good recruiting group. 
Rod Clark, I hope so. 

1126
00:56:01,040 --> 00:56:06,560
Rod Clark the the the Tennessee 
recruiting coach now an IU coach

1127
00:56:06,560 --> 00:56:08,320
and obviously Drew Adams and 
Kenny Johnson. 

1128
00:56:08,320 --> 00:56:11,600
We know, but you have three guys
that can get dudes, especially 

1129
00:56:11,600 --> 00:56:13,760
high end freshmen. 
Look, here's the thing. 

1130
00:56:14,040 --> 00:56:16,680
Indiana's kind of starting from 
scratch with a lot of these 

1131
00:56:16,680 --> 00:56:19,720
recruits, right? 
New coaching staff, but also a 

1132
00:56:19,720 --> 00:56:22,040
coaching staff that was 
struggling to land these 

1133
00:56:22,040 --> 00:56:23,680
players. 
They know they end up going to 

1134
00:56:23,680 --> 00:56:28,360
Connecticut or they end up going
to other places, Maryland and so

1135
00:56:28,480 --> 00:56:34,080
Kentucky, you know, and you've 
got to build relationships early

1136
00:56:34,120 --> 00:56:36,440
with those players. 
And I think I saw news the other

1137
00:56:36,440 --> 00:56:40,000
day, like Drew Adams was up at 
Lawrence North or something 

1138
00:56:40,200 --> 00:56:42,360
seeing a top. 
Level prospect like a four-star 

1139
00:56:42,360 --> 00:56:45,760
center that's, that's going to 
take a little bit of time. 

1140
00:56:45,800 --> 00:56:47,080
Yeah. 
You're, you're looking right now

1141
00:56:47,080 --> 00:56:49,520
at freshman and sophomore, which
means you're not getting them 

1142
00:56:49,520 --> 00:56:52,200
till what, the 20/28/2020 nine 
class. 

1143
00:56:53,200 --> 00:56:55,960
The one thing though is, I mean,
Indiana is, is in really good 

1144
00:56:55,960 --> 00:56:58,280
NIL shape. 
I don't think people realize how

1145
00:56:58,280 --> 00:57:02,920
good of NIL shape Indiana is in 
Indiana has spent a ton of money

1146
00:57:03,320 --> 00:57:05,360
on on both football and 
basketball. 

1147
00:57:05,360 --> 00:57:08,680
But but a basketball, I mean it,
it significantly exceeds what 

1148
00:57:08,680 --> 00:57:12,480
they spent last year. 
And that's going to help in this

1149
00:57:12,480 --> 00:57:15,160
process as well because that 
does ultimately resonate with 

1150
00:57:15,360 --> 00:57:17,280
with people and you would expect
that. 

1151
00:57:17,280 --> 00:57:21,840
So let's see a couple of other 
questions. 

1152
00:57:21,840 --> 00:57:24,040
I, I wanted to get us out 
roughly after an hour. 

1153
00:57:24,040 --> 00:57:26,120
I didn't want to go too far on 
this, but but some good 

1154
00:57:26,120 --> 00:57:31,240
questions from people overall. 
Hoosier Lee on the Discord ask. 

1155
00:57:31,240 --> 00:57:33,480
Curious about your take on the 
IU basketball staff. 

1156
00:57:33,920 --> 00:57:36,440
To me, it seems reflective of 
Debris's general approach. 

1157
00:57:36,800 --> 00:57:39,000
Solid, not flashy, ready to do 
the heavy lifting. 

1158
00:57:39,000 --> 00:57:41,360
I mean, it's a fairly flashy 
group in terms of like you've 

1159
00:57:41,360 --> 00:57:45,400
got you've got a guy in Drew 
Adams who has a pretty sizeable 

1160
00:57:45,400 --> 00:57:49,040
recruiting footprint. 
You've got Kenny Johnson, who 

1161
00:57:49,200 --> 00:57:51,800
obviously we're very familiar 
with, has a has a lot of 

1162
00:57:51,800 --> 00:57:54,760
connections to the DMV where 
you've got a ton of recruits to 

1163
00:57:54,760 --> 00:57:56,520
come out every year. 
And Indiana's gotten some some 

1164
00:57:56,520 --> 00:57:58,640
pretty good players out of 
there, including Victor Oladipo.

1165
00:57:59,320 --> 00:58:03,760
And you know, Rod Clark coming 
in from Tennessee was heavily 

1166
00:58:03,760 --> 00:58:06,320
involved with the Dalton Connect
recruitment, which Indiana lost 

1167
00:58:06,320 --> 00:58:08,200
just heavily involved with, you 
know, a couple of other 

1168
00:58:08,200 --> 00:58:12,440
recruitments of note. 
I'm, I would call them more than

1169
00:58:12,440 --> 00:58:14,800
just solid. 
I think that's a really, really 

1170
00:58:14,800 --> 00:58:18,160
formidable recruiting group that
all has different strengths. 

1171
00:58:18,760 --> 00:58:22,920
And you know, you got Nick 
Norton and you've the, the other

1172
00:58:22,920 --> 00:58:24,400
coach whose name had just 
escaped me. 

1173
00:58:24,400 --> 00:58:26,440
I apologize. 
Who I'm assuming you're going to

1174
00:58:26,440 --> 00:58:30,440
be focusing more on on court 
coaching and training. 

1175
00:58:30,440 --> 00:58:33,000
I think that's the kind of mix 
that you need moving forward. 

1176
00:58:33,240 --> 00:58:35,840
So I, I really like the staff. 
It's a, it's a fascinating 

1177
00:58:35,840 --> 00:58:38,040
staff. 
It's a staff that's got a lot of

1178
00:58:38,880 --> 00:58:43,160
different facets to it. 
And again, you a, you never 

1179
00:58:43,160 --> 00:58:45,880
really know how all of that's 
going to fit together, as we 

1180
00:58:45,880 --> 00:58:47,080
talked about with some other 
things. 

1181
00:58:47,080 --> 00:58:50,560
But on paper, you know, you 
think about some of the names 

1182
00:58:50,560 --> 00:58:52,760
that were tossed around earlier 
for some of the assistance. 

1183
00:58:52,920 --> 00:58:55,400
This is a pretty good spot to 
land with this group, it feels 

1184
00:58:55,400 --> 00:58:57,040
like, all things considered. 
Agreed. 

1185
00:58:57,200 --> 00:58:59,400
I agree with you. 
Yeah. 

1186
00:58:59,440 --> 00:59:02,600
Couple of other quick questions.
So we had a question from 

1187
00:59:02,600 --> 00:59:06,800
Hoosier in Japan and this I I 
promised everybody that I was 

1188
00:59:06,800 --> 00:59:11,720
going to be doing a series on 
nil and the house settlement. 

1189
00:59:11,720 --> 00:59:14,600
I've been waiting on the House 
settlement to actually settle so

1190
00:59:14,600 --> 00:59:17,640
I can do that podcast series. 
But in the meantime, Hoosier in 

1191
00:59:17,640 --> 00:59:20,840
Japan asked, is it possible to 
have a regulated, fair and 

1192
00:59:20,840 --> 00:59:24,000
equitable system for player 
payment and portal transfers 

1193
00:59:24,400 --> 00:59:30,080
that promotes parentheses, not 
buys allegiance to a school or 

1194
00:59:30,080 --> 00:59:35,880
team? 
So here's how I will say my 

1195
00:59:35,880 --> 00:59:39,880
answer to this I I think it's 
absolutely possible to have an 

1196
00:59:39,880 --> 00:59:42,880
equitable system for player 
payment and portal transfer, but

1197
00:59:42,880 --> 00:59:47,040
it requires the schools and the 
conferences involved to create 

1198
00:59:47,040 --> 00:59:50,200
rules. 
And these cannot be one way 

1199
00:59:50,200 --> 00:59:53,720
unilaterally imposed rules like 
the NCAA and its member schools 

1200
00:59:53,720 --> 00:59:56,040
have gotten used to doing. 
It has to be a system where 

1201
00:59:56,040 --> 00:59:58,600
there's some collective 
bargaining involved with the 

1202
00:59:58,600 --> 01:00:01,160
athletes. 
This cannot be a situation where

1203
01:00:01,160 --> 01:00:02,960
all these things are being 
dictated to people. 

1204
01:00:03,680 --> 01:00:06,440
Because I just, I think we've 
seen consistently now that the 

1205
01:00:06,440 --> 01:00:09,040
courts are like, your business 
is not that special. 

1206
01:00:09,160 --> 01:00:13,440
College athletics, like your 
business is not so unique and so

1207
01:00:13,440 --> 01:00:14,880
dependent on. 
I mean, remember the big 

1208
01:00:14,880 --> 01:00:18,440
argument was if players get 
paid, people will stop watching 

1209
01:00:18,440 --> 01:00:20,480
college sports. 
Meanwhile, we just had like the 

1210
01:00:20,480 --> 01:00:23,240
highest rated Final Four in a 
while. 

1211
01:00:23,240 --> 01:00:27,240
I think it was, I mean, like 
it's ludicrous that, and it 

1212
01:00:27,240 --> 01:00:30,240
always was ludicrous, this idea 
that somehow people were going 

1213
01:00:30,240 --> 01:00:32,840
to stop watching college sports 
because there was money 

1214
01:00:32,840 --> 01:00:35,880
involved. 
So the, the NCAA has gotten so 

1215
01:00:35,880 --> 01:00:39,640
used to dictating these terms 
that there is a pathway to a, a 

1216
01:00:39,640 --> 01:00:42,720
more equitable system, but it 
requires what the professional 

1217
01:00:42,720 --> 01:00:46,920
leagues have, which is a player 
union or something similar and 

1218
01:00:46,920 --> 01:00:49,800
collective bargaining between 
that and the teams in the 

1219
01:00:49,800 --> 01:00:52,560
conferences involved. 
I don't know that we'll get 

1220
01:00:52,560 --> 01:00:55,720
there with the way that the 
current leadership of the NCAA 

1221
01:00:55,720 --> 01:00:58,680
is approaching things because 
their answer to everything 

1222
01:00:59,120 --> 01:01:01,880
really for the last 15 years has
been, well, we'll just throw 

1223
01:01:01,880 --> 01:01:05,680
more lawyers at it, which is 
not, that's not a system that's 

1224
01:01:05,680 --> 01:01:07,320
going to produce anything fair 
and equitable. 

1225
01:01:07,720 --> 01:01:10,280
Now, the one other thing I'll 
say, though, about what Hoosier 

1226
01:01:10,280 --> 01:01:14,240
in Japan asked about, you know, 
a, a, a system that promotes 

1227
01:01:14,800 --> 01:01:16,040
you've. 
Been real quick on that. 

1228
01:01:17,040 --> 01:01:19,800
This is more your expertise than
mine, but I'm just as a, as a 

1229
01:01:19,800 --> 01:01:23,160
sideline fan. 
But knowing how it all works, I,

1230
01:01:23,640 --> 01:01:26,080
I love hearing this. 
I also get in these debates of 

1231
01:01:26,080 --> 01:01:27,280
how we can set it up and all 
this. 

1232
01:01:27,280 --> 01:01:30,400
But I think in the end it is all
just wasted breath. 

1233
01:01:30,400 --> 01:01:34,160
Because even if what you need is
exactly what you mentioned, 

1234
01:01:34,160 --> 01:01:37,000
which is collective bargaining, 
but you need a league and you 

1235
01:01:37,000 --> 01:01:40,680
know, the NBA has a commissioner
and a commissioner can dictate 

1236
01:01:40,680 --> 01:01:42,880
terms. 
And in the end, the Pacers and 

1237
01:01:42,880 --> 01:01:45,840
Bucks are, are competing, but 
they are also part of a 

1238
01:01:45,840 --> 01:01:48,080
collective. 
And they, they do things that 

1239
01:01:48,080 --> 01:01:51,480
are for the best of the NBA and 
the owners, you know that 

1240
01:01:51,480 --> 01:01:53,600
they're, they're competing 
against other, but they are also

1241
01:01:53,600 --> 01:01:56,520
collectively working together to
make the NBA better because they

1242
01:01:56,520 --> 01:02:00,360
all make money that way. 
Unfortunately, the NCAA is like 

1243
01:02:00,360 --> 01:02:02,160
Bloodsport. 
It's just everyone is out for 

1244
01:02:02,160 --> 01:02:04,600
their own. 
Like Indiana University is 

1245
01:02:04,600 --> 01:02:07,440
theoretically kind of partnered 
with other Big 10 schools, but 

1246
01:02:07,440 --> 01:02:09,600
they're not. 
And if they can do things that 

1247
01:02:09,600 --> 01:02:11,840
kills Michigan State or 
Michigan, it's like they will do

1248
01:02:11,840 --> 01:02:13,680
that. 
The the conferences are 

1249
01:02:13,680 --> 01:02:16,040
theoretically working together 
for the collective good of the 

1250
01:02:16,040 --> 01:02:19,480
NCAA, but they're not. 
And if the Big 10 can RIP out 

1251
01:02:19,480 --> 01:02:21,840
schools from the PAC 12, they 
will do it in an instant. 

1252
01:02:22,080 --> 01:02:24,280
And then suddenly those schools 
are now in the Big 10 and 

1253
01:02:24,280 --> 01:02:26,440
they're blood sporty against 
these other schools. 

1254
01:02:27,160 --> 01:02:29,960
And they're just. 
And then, you know, you also 

1255
01:02:29,960 --> 01:02:32,480
have, you know, as you've 
mentioned many times, you have 

1256
01:02:32,480 --> 01:02:35,680
the TV partners, which are in 
their own battles between each 

1257
01:02:35,680 --> 01:02:38,640
other, using schools as proxies 
to fight their own battles. 

1258
01:02:38,640 --> 01:02:41,320
And a lot of times they're the 
ones pulling the strings. 

1259
01:02:42,080 --> 01:02:45,480
There's I don't just, I just 
don't see a way of having all of

1260
01:02:45,480 --> 01:02:48,640
this being put together in a 
spot where everyone who's been 

1261
01:02:48,640 --> 01:02:53,400
kind of acting as their own 
sheriff for 140 years, you're 

1262
01:02:53,400 --> 01:02:56,160
going to get someone to be the 
commissioner of all of this. 

1263
01:02:56,480 --> 01:03:01,040
And everyone's going to kind of 
work in the best interest of the

1264
01:03:01,040 --> 01:03:04,400
overarching good. 
And so I unfortunately think 

1265
01:03:04,400 --> 01:03:06,520
it's just going to be little 
band aids here and there. 

1266
01:03:06,520 --> 01:03:09,040
And you're going to have, these 
are all interesting ideas. 

1267
01:03:09,040 --> 01:03:10,960
We can talk about it. 
Not to pour cold water on it, 

1268
01:03:10,960 --> 01:03:14,920
but I just, I don't see how it 
ever gets kind of resolved in a 

1269
01:03:14,920 --> 01:03:17,880
way that makes sense. 
Well, it'll just be kind of 

1270
01:03:17,880 --> 01:03:20,400
these theories of every year. 
It's like, man, this is really 

1271
01:03:20,400 --> 01:03:22,360
stupid. 
And that kid got 5 million. 

1272
01:03:22,360 --> 01:03:24,040
What the hell? 
Like, they're getting underpaid 

1273
01:03:24,040 --> 01:03:25,840
and they have so much money and 
like, man, they're blowing a lot

1274
01:03:25,840 --> 01:03:27,120
of money. 
And like, that's the way it's 

1275
01:03:27,120 --> 01:03:28,960
going to be because everyone is 
there. 

1276
01:03:28,960 --> 01:03:31,680
There is no person who's leading
the collective. 

1277
01:03:31,680 --> 01:03:36,560
Charge it requires there to be 
adults in the room who who I'm 

1278
01:03:36,600 --> 01:03:39,480
seriously, it requires because 
you're, you're right. 

1279
01:03:39,480 --> 01:03:42,120
And I'm going to talk about this
a lot more in depth on the NIL 

1280
01:03:42,120 --> 01:03:44,760
series. 
But it requires people 

1281
01:03:44,760 --> 01:03:48,880
acknowledging that, hey, what we
have done doesn't work anymore 

1282
01:03:48,880 --> 01:03:51,080
and the courts have said that it
doesn't work anymore. 

1283
01:03:51,080 --> 01:03:53,320
And we're not going to get 
somebody in Congress to wave a 

1284
01:03:53,320 --> 01:03:55,840
magic wand and fix it for us, 
which has been the entire 

1285
01:03:55,840 --> 01:03:58,440
strategy of the NCAA, it seems 
like, for the last four years. 

1286
01:03:59,920 --> 01:04:03,040
Well, even in the sorry, even in
the NBA, they put rules in to 

1287
01:04:03,040 --> 01:04:05,040
like protect the owners from 
themselves. 

1288
01:04:05,040 --> 01:04:07,520
Like they'll do this. 
Like you can't trade 5 future 

1289
01:04:07,520 --> 01:04:09,680
draft draft. 
You only trade like every other 

1290
01:04:09,680 --> 01:04:12,680
year 'cause it's a fun story. 
They get the owner of the Cavs 

1291
01:04:12,680 --> 01:04:15,800
traded literally every draft 
pick in the 80s just one off 

1292
01:04:15,960 --> 01:04:18,080
these and just try and like this
sucks. 

1293
01:04:18,080 --> 01:04:21,160
And so they put factors in to 
stop themselves from kind of 

1294
01:04:21,160 --> 01:04:23,640
being themselves. 
You just don't have any of that 

1295
01:04:23,640 --> 01:04:26,560
in the instant way. 
So the, the one other thing I'll

1296
01:04:26,560 --> 01:04:30,720
note just in terms of the, the, 
the question that Hoosier in 

1297
01:04:30,720 --> 01:04:37,680
Japan asked about, you know, 
the, the loyalty being, you 

1298
01:04:37,680 --> 01:04:40,320
know, promoting loyalty as 
opposed to buying allegiance. 

1299
01:04:40,320 --> 01:04:43,480
And I just, here's the thing 
that I think we have to keep in 

1300
01:04:43,480 --> 01:04:49,000
mind on all of this. 
People have jobs. 

1301
01:04:49,680 --> 01:04:53,360
Why do we work where we work? 
You know, why do we do? 

1302
01:04:53,360 --> 01:04:55,920
You're different, you're 
self-employed, but you know, you

1303
01:04:55,920 --> 01:04:59,320
know, for those of us who have 
to work for other people, why do

1304
01:04:59,320 --> 01:05:01,480
you do what you do? 
Do you do it because of an 

1305
01:05:01,480 --> 01:05:05,360
abiding loyalty to the company? 
If that's your primary 

1306
01:05:05,360 --> 01:05:08,480
motivating factor, you're 
probably not getting paid your 

1307
01:05:08,480 --> 01:05:11,400
actual market value. 
And that isn't to say that that 

1308
01:05:11,400 --> 01:05:16,080
that's wrong or that that's bad,
but I think you you can't. 

1309
01:05:16,080 --> 01:05:18,560
I've never felt like in these 
sorts of circumstances where 

1310
01:05:18,560 --> 01:05:22,200
there is significant value of 
what you do. 

1311
01:05:22,680 --> 01:05:25,080
And let's be honest, like 
college basketball players, 

1312
01:05:25,080 --> 01:05:28,120
college football players, the 
reason why there's so much money

1313
01:05:28,360 --> 01:05:29,720
is because there's so much 
interest. 

1314
01:05:29,720 --> 01:05:31,760
And the reason there's so much 
interest is that these are very,

1315
01:05:31,760 --> 01:05:34,400
very elite people at something 
that's very, very public. 

1316
01:05:34,400 --> 01:05:37,240
It's not a whole lot different 
than why do movie stars get paid

1317
01:05:37,240 --> 01:05:40,280
a lot of money, you know, or, or
why do people in other pursuits 

1318
01:05:40,280 --> 01:05:42,800
where there's a very finite 
small number of people that have

1319
01:05:42,800 --> 01:05:46,440
the opportunities? 
So, you know, the idea that a 

1320
01:05:46,440 --> 01:05:50,200
lot of people have that, you 
know, loyalty needs to be the 

1321
01:05:50,200 --> 01:05:56,560
primary factor here is I think 
part of the issue with the way 

1322
01:05:56,560 --> 01:05:59,680
that people are viewing the 
whole NIL situation in the 

1323
01:05:59,680 --> 01:06:02,360
transfer portal, 'cause you'll 
see people entering the transfer

1324
01:06:02,360 --> 01:06:04,480
portal still and it'll be like, 
oh, that, you know, that guy 

1325
01:06:04,480 --> 01:06:08,640
quit or that guy left his team 
and is chasing something. 

1326
01:06:08,640 --> 01:06:11,200
And you see this even in the 
NBA, You know, when LeBron James

1327
01:06:11,200 --> 01:06:15,040
leaves the Cavs and goes to the 
Heat or leaves the Cavs and goes

1328
01:06:15,040 --> 01:06:17,200
to the Lakers, it's like, well, 
you're just ring chasing. 

1329
01:06:17,200 --> 01:06:22,720
And it's like, well, the the 
flip side of that is what you 

1330
01:06:22,720 --> 01:06:25,360
see with Giannis right now 
where, you know, here's, you 

1331
01:06:25,360 --> 01:06:28,680
know, Giannis, they win a title 
and they've watched their entire

1332
01:06:28,840 --> 01:06:31,720
roster collapse around them due 
to bad management. 

1333
01:06:31,720 --> 01:06:35,880
And there's been some bad luck. 
Obviously, if Giannis leaves 

1334
01:06:35,880 --> 01:06:39,240
this offseason to go to another 
team, there's going to be people

1335
01:06:39,240 --> 01:06:41,640
who will be like, oh, he just, 
you know, left to go chase a 

1336
01:06:41,640 --> 01:06:42,800
ring. 
And it's like, he already won a 

1337
01:06:42,800 --> 01:06:45,120
ring. 
Like, like, loyalty only goes so

1338
01:06:45,120 --> 01:06:47,000
far. 
You have to watch out for 

1339
01:06:47,000 --> 01:06:50,880
yourself to some degree. 
And I don't think it's fair in 

1340
01:06:50,880 --> 01:06:56,360
college athletics to hold 
players accountable on a loyalty

1341
01:06:56,360 --> 01:07:01,280
perspective to teams that the 
coaches themselves do not have 

1342
01:07:01,280 --> 01:07:04,080
much loyalty to beyond whatever 
the paycheck is. 

1343
01:07:04,520 --> 01:07:07,120
And there are certainly 
exceptions to that, but most of 

1344
01:07:07,120 --> 01:07:09,840
the exceptions are people that 
are paid incredibly well and 

1345
01:07:09,840 --> 01:07:13,160
have set up a system that is 
very successful for themselves 

1346
01:07:13,160 --> 01:07:17,520
to stay at that point. 
You know, So this is where I, I 

1347
01:07:17,520 --> 01:07:22,120
do think as you, as we go into 
this era, we don't like if a, if

1348
01:07:22,120 --> 01:07:26,080
a, if a, a regular college 
student decides after a year of 

1349
01:07:26,080 --> 01:07:28,360
going to Indiana that they don't
want to go there anymore and 

1350
01:07:28,360 --> 01:07:31,800
they want to transfer to Butler 
or Ball State or or Iowa or 

1351
01:07:31,800 --> 01:07:34,080
something like that. 
We're not like, well, gosh, 

1352
01:07:35,640 --> 01:07:37,560
where's your allegiance? 
And we're just like, well, OK, 

1353
01:07:37,560 --> 01:07:38,880
they just, they, they went 
somewhere else. 

1354
01:07:38,880 --> 01:07:41,000
It wasn't for them. 
But, you know, but we have this 

1355
01:07:41,000 --> 01:07:45,880
psychological issue with sports 
where we feel like the athletes 

1356
01:07:46,120 --> 01:07:51,200
owe the fans something above and
beyond what we would expect out 

1357
01:07:51,200 --> 01:07:54,640
of any other employee. 
And I just don't think that 

1358
01:07:54,640 --> 01:07:56,800
that's healthy because I don't 
think it's realistic. 

1359
01:07:56,800 --> 01:07:59,440
And I think ultimately it's a 
two way St. 

1360
01:07:59,640 --> 01:08:03,560
We want players to be loyal and 
have like, you know, unbought 

1361
01:08:03,560 --> 01:08:06,840
allegiance to schools. 
And yet the schools will get rid

1362
01:08:06,840 --> 01:08:09,680
of a player at the drop of a hat
if they're not good enough. 

1363
01:08:10,200 --> 01:08:11,920
It's. 
Not a four year scholarship. 

1364
01:08:12,040 --> 01:08:15,960
Right, you know, so, so that's 
where the you know, the the 

1365
01:08:15,960 --> 01:08:18,120
questions are really good one, 
but it's like a two-part 

1366
01:08:18,120 --> 01:08:21,279
question and both parts are 
really complicated because I 

1367
01:08:21,279 --> 01:08:24,000
don't if I'm a player and I'm 
looking at this current system, 

1368
01:08:24,000 --> 01:08:27,640
it's like, what exactly am I 
supposed to be loyal to? 

1369
01:08:27,960 --> 01:08:29,880
Look at all the coaching 
movement that happened in the 

1370
01:08:29,880 --> 01:08:32,560
offseason this year. 
You know it, it's there. 

1371
01:08:32,560 --> 01:08:37,120
There's so much going on that I 
don't even know with a 

1372
01:08:37,120 --> 01:08:40,399
collective bargaining system 
like you would you would you 

1373
01:08:40,399 --> 01:08:43,200
would still be buying allegiance
at that point because what you 

1374
01:08:43,200 --> 01:08:45,560
would be doing is you would be 
signing a contract and you would

1375
01:08:45,560 --> 01:08:47,640
be saying I'm staying here for 
two years or three years or 

1376
01:08:47,640 --> 01:08:50,200
however long, which would 
actually be better for the 

1377
01:08:50,200 --> 01:08:52,560
player than the system that 
existed before, like you just 

1378
01:08:52,560 --> 01:08:56,680
said, which is 1 where it's one 
year renewable, but it could be 

1379
01:08:56,680 --> 01:08:59,960
not renewed for whatever reason.
That's the thing I think people 

1380
01:08:59,960 --> 01:09:02,720
have to understand is like this 
is not players suddenly getting 

1381
01:09:02,720 --> 01:09:05,760
disloyal because they're greedy.
It's players seeking out their 

1382
01:09:05,760 --> 01:09:08,240
market value because now they 
have the chance to do so for the

1383
01:09:08,240 --> 01:09:11,520
first time. 
And unless the schools are 

1384
01:09:11,520 --> 01:09:14,080
willing to say you're an 
employee, we're willing to pay 

1385
01:09:14,080 --> 01:09:16,960
you as such. 
I don't know where the loyalty 

1386
01:09:16,960 --> 01:09:18,680
exactly is coming from on that 
side. 

1387
01:09:18,880 --> 01:09:20,920
Well, yeah, I'm, I'm just going 
to re quote you in like 12 

1388
01:09:20,920 --> 01:09:23,520
different times. 
It's like the, the, the analogy 

1389
01:09:23,520 --> 01:09:26,720
to people in their jobs is, is 
perfect 'cause people have their

1390
01:09:26,720 --> 01:09:29,399
jobs and they get paid. 
It, it reminds me of one of my 

1391
01:09:29,399 --> 01:09:31,640
get to a point here, but it 
reminds me of one of my quotes 

1392
01:09:31,640 --> 01:09:34,479
from the, the show Mad Men, 
where, you know, the, the, the 

1393
01:09:34,520 --> 01:09:36,760
character of Peggy is like, 
well, you got an award and like,

1394
01:09:36,760 --> 01:09:38,720
I gave you all the ideas and you
never said thank you. 

1395
01:09:38,720 --> 01:09:40,800
And he's like, that's what the 
money's for. 

1396
01:09:40,880 --> 01:09:43,359
Like that's why you get paid. 
Like that's your thank you is 

1397
01:09:43,359 --> 01:09:46,240
the money. 
But you know, the the reason I 

1398
01:09:46,240 --> 01:09:50,040
think people get and for the 
most part, people understand pro

1399
01:09:50,040 --> 01:09:51,319
sports. 
It's like, oh, well, you're 

1400
01:09:51,319 --> 01:09:55,080
going to go, you know, if if 
Miles Turner this you get a lot 

1401
01:09:55,080 --> 01:09:57,040
of Pacers talk. 
But if Miles Turner gets a, you 

1402
01:09:57,040 --> 01:10:00,840
know, 5, you know, three-year, 
$45 million deal and the Pacers 

1403
01:10:00,840 --> 01:10:02,520
can't match it, it's like, well,
yeah, he's got to take that. 

1404
01:10:02,520 --> 01:10:04,080
It's more money. 
People understand that because 

1405
01:10:04,080 --> 01:10:06,320
these are employees and everyone
has a job and they know that 

1406
01:10:07,000 --> 01:10:09,320
this goes back something you 
said ad nauseam, but it's so 

1407
01:10:09,320 --> 01:10:11,640
true. 
Part of the problem is the NCAA 

1408
01:10:11,640 --> 01:10:13,160
doesn't like they don't know 
what business they're in. 

1409
01:10:13,160 --> 01:10:16,240
And because they no one can just
say these are employees. 

1410
01:10:16,800 --> 01:10:18,920
It's like it's well, they're 
student athletes and they're 

1411
01:10:18,920 --> 01:10:20,560
doing it for the like. 
When you start talking about all

1412
01:10:20,560 --> 01:10:23,360
the things that I think fans 
forget the connection to 

1413
01:10:23,360 --> 01:10:26,320
employees like, well, they 
should have allegiance just but 

1414
01:10:26,400 --> 01:10:27,640
but they shouldn't. 
If you're just like, oh, these 

1415
01:10:27,640 --> 01:10:29,920
are employees. 
These are guys who work for IU, 

1416
01:10:30,120 --> 01:10:32,800
just like, you know, Tyrese 
Halliburton, I'm sure he likes 

1417
01:10:32,800 --> 01:10:35,800
the Pacers, but he also gets 
paid by the Pacers and he's an 

1418
01:10:35,800 --> 01:10:40,360
employee of the Pacers. 
You know, I just, I think that 

1419
01:10:40,360 --> 01:10:43,320
because nobody can just come out
and say their employees, you 

1420
01:10:43,320 --> 01:10:45,920
start to when you start talking 
in all these other terms, I 

1421
01:10:45,920 --> 01:10:47,120
think that's where it gets mixed
up. 

1422
01:10:47,120 --> 01:10:49,640
But if you look at them just as 
employees, everyone understands 

1423
01:10:49,640 --> 01:10:51,480
like, yeah, that's you're, 
you're doing it for the money 

1424
01:10:51,480 --> 01:10:54,040
and you have allegiance. 
Some people probably like here. 

1425
01:10:54,160 --> 01:10:55,960
It's like some students love 
going there and love the 

1426
01:10:55,960 --> 01:10:59,160
university, and most people who 
play for it, they probably care 

1427
01:10:59,160 --> 01:11:01,520
about it, but in the end, it's 
still transactional. 

1428
01:11:03,520 --> 01:11:05,720
Good place to stop. 
We'll we'll obviously have a lot

1429
01:11:05,720 --> 01:11:08,120
more on this. 
We're we're waiting for more is 

1430
01:11:08,120 --> 01:11:11,200
the thing today where I guess 
Donald Trump met with Nick Saban

1431
01:11:11,200 --> 01:11:14,720
and and now he's talking about 
an executive order about who, 

1432
01:11:14,800 --> 01:11:19,560
who knows about college pay. 
For athletes, Bill Simmons could

1433
01:11:19,560 --> 01:11:22,000
finally get his sports bar. 
Sports is our job. 

1434
01:11:22,240 --> 01:11:23,200
Amazing. 
Wow. 

1435
01:11:23,560 --> 01:11:25,960
So a lot to talk about with this
as we move forward and a lot of 

1436
01:11:25,960 --> 01:11:28,360
other questions that we couldn't
get to, which we will get to 

1437
01:11:28,360 --> 01:11:30,680
again at some point in the near 
future. 

1438
01:11:30,680 --> 01:11:32,400
We will have more podcasts 
coming. 

1439
01:11:32,600 --> 01:11:34,360
Schedules are starting to settle
down a little bit. 

1440
01:11:34,360 --> 01:11:37,600
We're into May little lighter 
time, but we got plenty to talk 

1441
01:11:37,600 --> 01:11:40,920
about here. 
So be sure to keep staying like 

1442
01:11:40,920 --> 01:11:42,720
tuning in to the back home 
network. 

1443
01:11:43,040 --> 01:11:46,880
Be sure to subscribe to us here 
on on Crimson cast and we'll go 

1444
01:11:46,880 --> 01:11:48,600
ahead and wrap things up. 
Scott, it's always a pleasure. 

1445
01:11:48,600 --> 01:11:50,960
Great to talk to you on a Friday
afternoon and I hope you have a 

1446
01:11:50,960 --> 01:11:52,280
good rest of the weekend. 
You too, man. 

1447
01:11:52,880 --> 01:11:55,400
All right. 
Thanks for watching or listening

1448
01:11:55,400 --> 01:11:57,880
to Crimson Cast or both. 
We will catch you folks. 

1449
01:11:57,880 --> 01:12:01,000
On the flip side, stay never 
daunted, Bring back the Bison 

1450
01:12:01,960 --> 01:12:04,360
and just remember, folks, we got
the Indy 500 at the end of the 

1451
01:12:04,360 --> 01:12:05,800
month. 
Always the best month of the 

1452
01:12:05,800 --> 01:12:08,040
year. 
Pacers in the playoffs, plenty 

1453
01:12:08,040 --> 01:12:09,600
of good things catch you on the 
flip side. 

1454
01:12:10,040 --> 01:12:10,600
So everybody.