You're listening to the back home network presented by home
field apparel. Welcome back to Crimson Cask ale
include a video here. Hope you folks are having a good
week. It is Thursday, the 24th of
March of the Year 2022. Lot going on and I you land.
We've had some surprising news on the coaching front as you
probably learned yesterday and if you listen to me and the
assembly call crew on assembly called radio.
Last night. You probably got a big dose of
that. We're going to talk more about
that today. We're also going to talk about
Christian Lander leaving IU. We think he's in the transfer
portal, at least and we'll also talk about just an overall recap
of expectations from this past year.
What all happened, what we should be thinking about it.
We've got Zak Osterman from the Indy star.
Are joining us once again on the podcast.
He'll be here in just a minute. But first off, just a reminder
for you all that, we are part of the back home network here, at
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All right, as promised Zach, Osterman Insider for the Indy
star covering IU, basketball and football joining us here.
Once again, like it's been a while.
How are you doing? It has been a while.
I'm recovering from what was an eventful into the season, and
they particularly eventful trip home from Portland via Denver
with some unexpected, unexpected strandings in between you.
It it felt like that was the cursed trip out for a lot of
people. I know I've seeing on social
media. I think the Leo family ended up
in like six different. He's on their way, back from
Portland. So I'm glad you finally made it
back. I was getting concerned.
I mean it was it was not necessarily basically, I my
flights out of Portland were delayed heavily on the Friday
and I came to find the realize that he was because the plane
that was supposed to come into Portland to take me and whoever
else was on that flight out to Denver had To make an emergency
landing in Amarillo. It took off from Houston and
there was smoke in the cabin. And so they had to put down and
then obviously United had to send them another plane.
Which, you know, I'd rather wait seven hours than be the guy that
gets the smoke in the cabin I suppose.
But that it's about a four and a half hour nap overnight at an
airport hotel in Denver's. Peace.
Well, it's it's always kind of definitely bagging.
Denver to of course. I've tracked or their worst
places to go. Oh, to cover tournament games
than Portland, from a travel perspective that you've
experienced. It's very hard to get there.
I know I was talking to and I swear, I'm not name-dropping.
You just told me this. Michael Lewis said that when he
worked at Butler, they were recruiting a kid out in Oregon.
At one time. I saw him out there because UCLA
was out there and he said there used to be a direct from India
to Portland as he flew it a couple times to make recruiting
trips. But if it still exists, I know
there's a direct Seattle. I know there's a direct San
Francisco. So we toyed with driving to
Seattle, the day after the game, to get the direct that of
Sea-Tac. But I, we weren't confident that
the basically, the rental car place is would open up early
enough for us to get a car, to drive to Seattle and then my
other option. Flying back.
When everything melted down was to fly, I think from Portland to
San Francisco and then take the red-eye from San Francisco,
which I've flown a couple times for different reasons.
That would have gotten me home six hours earlier, I suppose,
but I also would have had to sleep on flight, so which I
can't do. I'm not one of those people,
that's capable of sleeping sitting up.
So I'm with you. Yeah.
Yeah.
The Seattle route, Gracie Barra ended up doing that particular
one. So everybody had to find their
own way home. It was, it was an interesting
process to say the least. But anyway, glad you're back and
we got a lot to talk about here in a relatively short period of
time. I guess we need to start with
the most recent news which Of course, popped up yesterday,
which was the announcement that Dane Fife is no longer going to
be an assistant coach with Indiana University men's
basketball. We got a statement from Mike
Woodson on this. We got a smaller statement from
Dane Fife and it felt like a lot of confusion from IU fans about
the fact that this is happening. So, you know, given what
occurred yesterday. What's your observation?
What's your take on? What is taking place over the
last 24 hours? You know, I think and this is
one of those things that I think sounds pretentious who reporters
say it. And I don't have a ton of
details and a lot of this stuff tends to, I think get a lot more
dramatized overdramatized in the aftermath and it really is.
There had been just some talk that you know, number one, that
Dana Fife might want to be a head coaching candidate and a
couple different stops now. That he could not that Indiana
needed to let him go for him to be a candidate.
But number one, that Fife was kind of looking a field.
Possibly thinking about trying to be a head coach, which he
hasn't been since he went from IPFW to Michigan State.
I think what 11 years ago. That's right.
And number two, just that for whatever reason things had not
quite gelled and you know, just work kind of perfectly within
that whole staff and I think again like You say that and you
know, we see this a lot. I remember talking to you about
like when Nick Sheridan was fired as offensive coordinator,
like everybody sort of wanting there to be a bad guy.
There doesn't have to be a bad guy like for it just to be
something where you know, it's just not it's not quite the
right fit for whatever different reason and you know, I do think
this is probably a little bit something that maybe reflects
Mike Woodson's time in the NBA that you When you see a problem
on your staff, you just not problem, but that's the wrong
way to say it. But something that's not
functioning right on your staff. You just address it as quickly
as you can quite frankly. I think there were people that
rightly or wrongly felt like Archie Miller may be needed to
shake up his staff more often than he did in his four years in
Bloomington. So I think that it's just I
think it You know, not wanting to not wanting to assign sort of
basically blame in the sense that like I said, one person's
the good guy, one person's the bad guy.
This was just about I think and I think Mike was his statement,
you know, I mean if it was fairly pointed, I thought like
it was not a it was not just the sort of perfunctory and I'm
looking for it while we talked. It was not just the sort of
perfunctory, you know, we thank Dane for his work and look
forward to whatever. I mean it.
You know, he says, I'm committed to doing what I believe is best
for the continued growth of our men's basketball program.
Sometimes that commitment can result in some very difficult
decisions. And that is the case today.
Ultimately. I believe that the fit must be
right with the coaching staff and I've decided that A change
is necessary. I mean, like it, you know, any
also goes on to say, you know, day in five will always be part
of the Hoosier family and I wish him well in his future Pursuits,
but like, you know, that doesn't leave a lot of ambiguity for the
idea that for whatever reason that relationship just wasn't
strong enough to be productive. And and again, if you know, Time
will tell whether decisions. Any decision that Mike Woodson
takes, is the right one or not. But at, very least.
I think you want someone in that position to be decisive.
And I think this is an example of him being decisive and
saying, you know, for reasons that Mike Woodson has said many
times what happens in the locker room stays in the locker room
for reasons that he's not going to discuss publicly.
Now, it's, you know, he's decided it's time to move on.
What's the problem in these sorts of situations too?
Because I think fans have gotten so used to feeling like they
know everything that's going on and feeling like there's,
there's got to be explanations for all of these things and it's
just probably not isn't nothing officials going to come out in
any sort of a circumstance like this Bo.
But certainly, I think people are looking at this and perhaps.
I mean, there was a lot of talk and, you know, I think those of
us who are close to the program or at least follow it closely.
That this wasn't the case, but a lot of people had this
perception that fight was coming in as The Heir Apparent is,
okay, you know, here's a guy with X number of years of
coaching experience on the on the assistant side, who's just
going to take over at some point whenever Woodson and decides to
hang it up, but that really wasn't the case.
And it does feel like to some degree people's responses to
this in the IU fan base, you know, perhaps were a little more
polarized than they would have been.
Otherwise if it had been a different assistant.
Or somebody that didn't have the IU ties as well, as you know,
just kind of the overall marketing package coming in that
fight did. And I think like, like if it
first of all, it wasn't a former player, you know, I think
getting people would, you know, be a lot less put off in in
nearly all cases. I think the other thing is like
a lot of people did and this includes in the media.
So I'm not just saying oh this is just, you know, Dopey fans on
social media like this includes, you know, people in sort of You
know, my corner of the store if you want to say I think filled
in those gaps, in a way that no one really like Scott.
Dolson. Never even really suggested
thing, Fife was like coaching waiting or heir-apparent.
Certainly Mike Woodson, I think. Probably would have taken
offense to the idea that he was just coming in for only a few
know. I think, Mike Woodson on the
things going to be the coach, to these 80.
But, you know, I think he, I think he feels like he's still
got a lot of years left, you know, kind of a lot of miles
left in himself, as a coach. And I think he would have taken
offense to the idea that basically, he was just coming in
to keep the seat warm for someone else, you know, Dana
Fife never really liked. Doing five did not March him and
say, I'm here to be the head coach at Indiana and a few years
time like that was That was something where I think other
people fill in those gaps. And, and, you know, you know, as
well as I do that. The problem is that sometimes,
you know, it can turn into a game of telephone where one
person assumes a thing. They tell someone else about
their assumption that person tells someone else about it.
Like it's opinion that person tell someone else about it.
Like, it's fact and all of a sudden this this sort of
narrative is built that, you know, the next 20 years of IU
basketball are Mike, Woodson, you know, until he's ready to
retire. And then handing it off today
and five when not. Not that, I'm not saying that
couldn't have happened. I'm not saying that that wasn't
even something that occurred to Mike Woodson.
Her Scott, Dolson, or whoever when they were putting that
staff together last year, but it was nothing, that was ever, the
formal plan or really anything close to it.
And so you probably do get some of that.
And I mean like it, you know, I wouldn't have blamed then fight
for coming in and being like hey if I come in and do a good job
at, I could wind up in that situation.
I wind up with that opportunity. There's, you know, there's
absolutely nothing wrong with that either but it was never
like Like he was never any ones. Laid out strategy.
And and so I think that a lot of that just kind of happened,
organically and when it, when it was something that got sort of,
you know, suddenly got some traction kind of in the, in the
Zeitgeist, you know, the IU basketball Zeitgeist, like it,
it sort of became like a it became something, everyone
assumed. Yeah.
It was like, well, that's that's not really something any anyone
can assume rightly. Let's switch gears a little bit
to the other news. Came out yesterday, which was
the news that Christian Lander has entered the transfer portal.
Again. This is not a surprise.
I think anybody that's been observing things.
Christian Lander came in, very highly regarded, five-star
recruit. Reclassified had to really not
productive years at IU under two different coaches, a lot of
calls for him to play in the early and middle portions of the
Season that just kind of went on unheated and now we get this
announcement. What's your overall evaluation?
Not just of the announcement that he's entering the portal
but I guess of the the whole Christian Lander experiment here
over the last couple of years for, Indiana.
Yeah, I mean it just never has taken off.
Last season, was tough for him. It was tough for a lot of
freshman. You know, he played in 26 of
Indiana's 27 games but you know without non-conference games
with such a chopped-up preseason, you know, I mean, I
think we've all had this point kind of heard horror stories
about athletes who were quarantined for weeks on end
because like, you know, they live with two other athletes and
one of them got covid and everyone had to be quarantined
and then you know, they got Covid.
Never one had to be quarantined and then the third roommate.
And so that you had to go through the whole process of,
basically the entire apartment getting covid, or the entire
dorm room or whatever. And guys, just not being able to
leave for like three, four, five weeks.
Well, that's also time, you can't practice.
That's time. You can't condition that's time.
You can't work on things in the gym by yourself.
And I think last season was a really tough season for a player
like Christian Lander and through, no, fault of his own at
all, to try and reclassify as a smaller.
I think under sized, but a smaller point guard.
And come into the Big Ten, just a lot of the time he would have
needed to make that adjust those physical adjustments and mental
adjustments was was kind of is robbed of it by just everything
that around covid-19 and the weirdness of the season and
everything like that. I think that you know,
ultimately we all kind of looked at Lander and said well, can he
be something else? Something more this season, you
know, but from the very beginning, I mean he didn't Much
at all in the Bahamas and and so it, you know, basically if that
if that's the starting point of the season and publicly
certainly, it should be Israel, never really changed.
He only played in 13 of Indiana's. 35, regular season
games this year of those thirteen six were in Indiana's
first seven. He only played more than 10
minutes in a game twice. And, you know, listen, I heard
all the calls for Christian Lander to get more play.
In time it was something that came up regularly and our
postgame question and answer sessions.
It was something people would tweeted us and all that
different kind of stuff. And what I said all the time was
You know, if you look at his final numbers, his turnover rate
was close to 38 percent. It was above 38 percent and the
for conference games. He played it was 33.7% in the 70
R A+ V can Palm games. He appeared in that's what top
50 top 100. Yeah meteor a is top 50 to be is
50 to 100. He averaged six point five.
Fouls committed per 40 minutes in four conference games.
That number was 9.6. Like that is And just in an
eye-watering number, his turnover rate was actually
resume. He's assist rate.
Was actually slightly lower this season than it was last season.
He was a little bit better finishing in his fourth. 12,
from three. He was 10 of 19 on twos.
You felt like that weird just sort of funk that he got into
were like, he didn't make a two pointer until like the second or
third to last game in the Big Ten season last year, you know,
that, that was an outlier. And I think he, you know, as he
gets wherever he went lands. Gets more minutes and gets to
use. More possessions will be a
factor around the rim and I also still think there's a really
good offensive player. There is assist numbers aren't
awful. They're just not good enough to
outweigh his issues with turnovers and fouls turnovers
and Pals were always what it felt like kept him on the bench
that in. You know, Mike Woodson just
didn't feel like compared to Rob fantasy compared to Xavier
Johnson. Even compared to like a sort of
secondary point guard. Liked real away.
He could trust Lander to to handle the ball without turning
it over and to defend Fend. Effectively, without fouling, I
just I don't think anybody's really terribly surprised by
this. And again, I think I think a lot
of this is just kind of bad luck for Lander in some ways.
Like if he had if he had stayed in his normal high school class
and coming to Indiana last summer.
I do wonder if things would be different for him.
But, you know, he does feel like more than most sort of an
uncommon casualty of All the things that made the day-to-day
practice of being a college basketball player, more
difficult in 2020, 2021, and it just never quite came together
for him. And with certainly the
possibility that, you know, if you're Indiana, you're going to
get Xavier Johnson and Rob fennessy back after the season
and at Jalen who Cioppino with Gabe cups and jukai Newton
coming in behind them. You know, it just again, I don't
think anybody's terribly surprised.
But yeah, it'll it'll be interesting.
See where Lander ends up landing on this transfer process.
Assuming he does indeed transfer which as you just mentioned I
think is certainly more likely than not at this stage and
hopefully it's at a place where he can get the runway needed to
kind of get the development level up where it needs to be
and actually be able to contribute on a consistent
basis. So we'll, we'll see how that
plays out for. And there's certainly no
shortage of Landing spots out there and I am quite curious as
far as where he ends up. Let's switch gears a little bit
more and kind of pull the lens out a little bit.
So obviously this was a different kind of season for
Indiana and that they ended up in the NCAA tournament at the
end of it, but it was a season that had a similar kind of
template to what we've seen out of some of them were previous
vintages of IU basketball, where they start off fairly strongly
and then go into a pretty negative Swoon.
In February the difference, being this Year that this team
did kind of pull out of it, particularly in the Big Ten
tournament and then, you know, getting through the play-in
game. When you look back at this
season. What's your overall evaluation
of how it went? Was it from a program
perspective successful and what sort of things stuck out to you,
either good or bad about the way that the season progressed for,
Indiana? I think there were a couple of
things that functionally deviated from the last, you
know, through four seasons, and I think they were, I think they
were important. I think they showed up in the
end. The primary one being that
Indiana, really I think did find a new level of competitiveness.
Like they basically had two games this season where they
just never competed and that was something that happened.
If you go back and look at certain the last full season
they played, which was the season when they still probably
would have made the NCAA tournament in 2020.
There were still probably a half dozen or more games.
You could go back to certainly on the road in Big Ten play in
particular that you can go back to and just say like they never
had a chance in that game, you know, from from the opening tip.
It was, you know, 7:36 at the second media timeout.
And you know, I mean even games where like they close the score,
the close, the game late, and I'm kind of skipping over last
season, just because it was, it was very weird last year.
But like, you know, they were down 17.
With 11:22 left in the second, half at Rutgers in the 2020
season, you know, they lost by 15 on the road at Penn State.
They were down by 20 with three minutes left in the second half
at that game. So, your excuse me in the second
half of that game. They were, I mean, frankly,
nowhere near Michigan at any point in Archie, Miller's tenure
and I'm not picking on our champion.
I mean, that's that's the, that's the comparison, but we're
using because that's that's the team that most closely.
Resembled this one in terms of playing front of fans, played a
full schedule. But also, you know, some of the
same guys on the team Race Thompson, Rob fennessy Trace
Jackson Davis Etc. The only two games Indiana had
this season, where they just kind of just just could not hold
their own at all. We're Michigan at home, which
was their third game in seven days on the back of an
inevitable unavoidable. Emotional, letdown after Purdue,
and then st. Mary's, when it was very clear.
Like, I don't know if I don't know, if this showed up your TV,
I can never tell. What shows up on TV in real
time? You could, I mean, you could
visibly see Indiana, like you see any other players,
recognizing what they were supposed to do and just not
being able to do it and it was just amazed five games in eight
days. And obviously that's not an
excuse for them. Like, the Counterpoint is put
yourself in a position where you don't need to play five
high-stress games. In eight days, just to get
there, right? Deep Purdue on the road, beat
Ohio State on the road and you don't have to.
You can, you can lose to Illinois on the Friday, the big
day. Tournament, you're fine.
You don't even have to go play Wyoming.
You know, you're not even in the first four, you get the whole
rest, you know, some people wanted to compare Indiana to
Notre Dame and it's like well, that's that's not really fair.
Irrespective of the fact. I think st.
Mary's is a better basketball team than Alabama Notre.
Dame only played one game in their conference tournament and
then they played well and then play the game on the Tuesday.
So they played two games in seven days before they played
Alabama, where as Indiana had played four games in seven days
before they played st. Mary's.
I do think that Indiana found a greater competitive level this
season, both at home and certainly on the road, you know,
Wisconsin on the road. Yes.
It's a collapsed but they were also up 20, Ohio State on the
road. They absolutely had no business
should not have lost that game, but they were leading by four
with a minute 20 left. When could we have said that the
season before two seasons before, you know, I think
everyone including me was surprised to see how competitive
they were in West Lafayette. Against a Purdue team that's
flawed, but still as talented as any in the conference.
The flip side of that is it goes back to that whole thing about
the way you lost the st. Mary's, you find a way to take
that competitiveness and go up a step or two.
And when some of those games, then you don't have to put
yourself in such an extreme, you know, physical and emotional
situation in March. And then maybe you aren't just
exhausted. By the time you get to Thursday
the first week in the NCAA tournament.
And I think what followed that statistically was some of the
things that underpin this team success.
Really stayed very consistent across the course of the season.
They had the best defense in the Big Ten.
It was a top 25 defense nationally that it was best in
the Big Ten. They were second best in the
conference in Big 10 games alone ineffective.
Go defense, they were fourth in opponent turnover percentage
there. Oh, they're overall turnover
percentage to opponent turnover percentage was very good.
It was 17.5, opponent, turnover percentage, to 15.2 Indiana's,
turnover rate. They were top five in the
conference. And to point and three point
defense. They were first in Block rate,
and these were things that, like, we could see some of this
stuff shape up under Archie Miller, but then, it would em
away. As you know, as Seasons war on
this was this team held tightly to its ability to defend
through, you know, basically difficult situations.
No matter what was no matter what was happening, you know, no
matter who they were facing where they were etcetera.
And I think that that's That's certainly evidence of the idea
that sort of, you know, the underpinnings of my questions
program are are sticking and guys are bought into them and
they're staying bought into them.
And even, you know, even when Indiana had lost five in a row
in February and it looked like the season was completely
slipping away. They didn't let it, they came
home. They took care of business
against Maryland. They took care of business on
the road against Minnesota. Maybe the worst game, they
played in the last month of their season was at home to
Rutgers and that's a three-point loss to an NCAA tournament team
like they You to win that game, but you know, what was the worst
game of the last month of their season, each of the previous
three years. It was probably a blowout loss
to someone. So I just think, I think, I
think this season did represent progress.
I think there are positives as, with anything, it only matters.
If it's built on like that, that will always be true.
But I do think that from Indiana's perspective, you did
see progress this Easton in ways that we're sort of Tangible and
intangible and a lot of that stuff, was interrelated, and I
think, I think you should. I think if I would have laid,
you know, laid all of this out for you, at the beginning of the
season. I would have said they have the
best defense in the Big Ten in when 21 games and win an NCAA
Tournament game, you know, they played in the semi-finals of the
conference tournament. They break the losing streak to
Purdue. Is that a successful season for
you? Then?
I think the majority of Indiana fans would say yes in year one
under Mike Woodson, and obviously the journey there can
be stressful and frustrating and different times for different
reasons, but I don't see how you can't see, you know that season
as a success. Then from here, it's just a
question of how they build. Well that's going to be the
interesting thing because this team was certainly built around
certain structures. You know, the primary one being
traced. Jackson Davis is the primary
Conduit on offense. Now, you did see Xavier Johnson
at a step up and take a more prominent role in the offense as
time went along. But this was not a very good
offense for Indiana and it kind of did feel like a bit of a step
back in some ways. Even from what they did last
year. And that was not a Really good
offense either. You've got a very good chance
and nobody knows for sure yet. But has a very good chance to
race Jackson Davis is going to move on.
And I guess my question for you is, are you do you see these
causes for concern in the way that I, you approached offense
this year that were more schematic or strategic based
versus Personnel, based. In other words is, are I use
offensive woes that have now really been there under two
different coaches who have two very different styles.
Are they, because of the Personnel set, that's there
right now? Or is it the way that Indiana is
approaching the ball? On the offensive side of things?
I mean, that is sort of a jury's out situation like there are
ways in which Indiana, it was actually worse this season than
it was last season. It is worth saying that in Big
10 games alone. They wind up, averaging, the
exact same number of points per possession, 100 1.008 points per
possession. Each of the last two seasons is
what Indiana's finished with on an adjusted basis in Big Ten
play. I think you had, I think, I
mean, I personally would be encouraged where an Indiana fan
to see. Mike Woodson's.
You know, I think long-term what Mike Woodson wants to be really
underpin. His offense is ball screen
actions, you know, pick-and-roll offense and everything that that
sort of spreads out from there. I mean, quite literally the way
you spread the floor off that stuff and what you do with it.
I think it, you know, if I were an IU fan, I would be encouraged
by how that evolved. And certainly the way like how
Clearly different. That was by March 1 then where
it was January 1. Now, part of this is always
going to be about how Mike Woodson adjusts to the fact that
he can't keep his roster permanent.
He can't say, I like you you're going to stay.
You know, we're going to give you a two-year deal or whatever.
We're going to, you know, you you found a roll here.
We're going to keep you around. There.
Probably is sort of a wider. Question of like, how does ni L
affect someone like Choice Jackson Davis?
His decision, you know, if I've gotta say you could literally
give somebody a two-year contract at me.
You know, you mean that is something that is going to be a
factor for guys like that, that may be on the fringes of getting
drafted and it's sort of a question of do you want to chase
the to a deal? Do you want to go to Europe or
is the money? Good enough to stay in
Bloomington to stay or not? Just in Blooming and just in
general I'm talking about players like Trace Jackson
Davis, not just him. You know, a lot of this.
Just comes down to shooting the ball better and you know it we
can break down. Why?
This team didn't shoot the ball. Well, but like we're kind of
past the point of It feels like we're sort of past the point of
like saying, you know, oh, well, you know, this team can't shoot
because of this or this team, can't shoot.
But it's five straight years where Indiana has finished.
Well, outside the top 150 nationally, so, you know, you
know substantially below the national average in three-point
shooting. I don't have their numbers
immediately available, but I would be very surprised if
Indiana improved much at all. If at all on basically their
attempts per game, which was something we heard from Mike
Woodson, early in the year, you know, I want you guys to keep
shooting even if you're not making three days almost the
kind of the idea and it made sense in Indiana, then kind of
got away from it of even if we're not going to hit a bunch
of Threes every night, if we take a bunch of them,
eventually, enough of them will go in that defense will have to
That word the currently do that never really happened.
You know, I guess what I'm trying to get at is ultimately
everything makes a lot more sense.
If Indiana can just find a way to start hitting some threes can
get up to 35% in conference play as a, you know, in three-point
shooting and like I mean, 35% Indiana finished.
I'm looking at the numbers right now in conference play alone,
Indiana finished 13th. Only, surprisingly Wisconsin was
lower in team, three-point shooting percentage in
conference play alone. If Indiana shot 35 percent from
three, they would have finished eighth.
Like they would have been dead middle of the conference.
They would have been one person, one tenth of a percentage Point
behind, Illinois, which was a really good 3-point shooting
team. By the way, had a lot of really
good 3-point shooters. And still as a team in
conference, my only shot 35.1% but like if Indiana hits four
percent, more of its 3s, or even three and a half percent more of
its threes, probably wins three or four more games and just
like, if you look at shock quality metrics, or if you just
watch it with your own eyes and you just charged things as you
watch him just like Archie, Miller's offense, which people
complain about endlessly. The offense made open shots that
either players were hesitant to take or they couldn't make
consistently enough. You find a way to get guys who
make those shots more often to the tune of like three more
threes, a game, which is, is certainly the bare minimum of
where Indiana needs to be, if it wants to compete for Big Ten,
titles consistently and we're a program that can recruit the way
Indiana can recruit probably should be, you know, three more
threes per game. And this team is wins 24 games,
20, maybe even 25 games. And then we're saying, wow, that
was a resoundingly successful season and my point is all this
stuff is interrelated. You can't just say well trained.
Davis is important. You can throw him away as long
as you can make shots, but like, you can probably survive, Trace
Jackson. Davis has departure with a
lesser big, man in the post. If you have two or three more
guys that are three-point threats.
It's just about how you evolve. And again, it was not
necessarily A statistically successful on offenses was on
defense. I think you saw Indiana really
sort of embrace with Mike Woodson was trying to do
offensively by the end of the season.
Now, what you need is to just up the talent level of the skill
level to the point. That that often swin.
It produces those shots. Those shots fall more, often
every time, but more often in past years.
This is where I would ask you. Well, you know, how does I you
improve the roster over the course of the summer?
And how do they develop certain guys with all the player
movement that we have? Now in college basketball.
It's a very different type of equation.
So I guess the question I would ask you is.
In whatever way you might be able to speculate.
Given what you saw this year. What is Woodson?
Need to concentrate on in order to do what you just described,
which is up the talent level on the roster while maintaining
some degree of continuity and building off of what they did so
far in this first season. I think I mean first of all it
is worth saying Indiana's. Got three freshmen to fit onto
its roster before it. Does anything else.
One of them obviously already has a place.
Now of Christian land or having left.
You've still got two more you not thinking about it and like
for like, but like, let's just say, you know, Christian land or
left and down. Okay.
So now Jalen Hood should be no has his spot.
It doesn't work that way, but I'm just, you know, thinking
about it in a way that makes more sense, you know, is easier
to organize in your mind. You got another Garden.
CJ gun. You got a verse.
Go forward and Caleb banks, that I think is better than people
realize. I think he also might need a
little time, but I think he has the potential to be a really
really good player. Like I compared him a little bit
to do on Morgan when I saw him and I don't love player
comparisons. But like I see a really
versatile forward there. That might just need 12 to 18
months to really kind of figure out.
This is how I need to be this tough strong.
I need to be at the college level.
This is how I got this. This diverse array of gifts.
This is how I get the most out of all of them.
But I think he can be a really good player long-term.
I think from there. And obviously, as you said there
will always be an inherent sort of lack of clarity because of
the portal in the one-time, transfer exception, how easy it
is for people to move from there.
I think the next question you have to sort out is the post.
Like, I literally talk to Peyton Sparks, who averaged 13 and a
half points in eight and a half rebounds per game for ball.
State is a freshman, the season, he was Mac freshman of the Year
Ball State fired, their head coach.
Now, paid Sparks is in the transfer portal.
He's here, in from West. Virginia is here, in from
Loyola. He's hearing from Cincinnati and
he's hearing from Indiana. And he's from Indiana, and I
think at least to some extent, I want to put words in his mouth.
I think at least, to some extent, he grew up in.
Are you fan Indiana's? Message is basically, you know,
we want to be involved. We, you know, keep us in touch,
keep us in your plans. We are still figuring out what
our guys are doing in the post. If you get one appraised Jackson
Davis, erase Thompson Mac. You know, as long as you don't
have an exodus of your reserve, bigs guys, like Logan dunk on
Michael dirr. Well, then maybe you just say,
okay. Well, slot Jordan Geronimo in at
the, for, we'll play it. Maybe it's let's let's say.
Trace Jackson Davis leaves, but race Thompson.
Elects to takes the extra year. I'm just making this up.
This is not me speaking with inside knowledge.
You know, if you're Indiana, you might look at that and say hey,
we'll play a little smaller and will give up a little bit of Rim
protection, but we're going to be more athletic.
And by the way, I actually don't think they give up that much
room protection because I think Jordan Geronimo could do a lot
of the Sort of backside hunting, that train tracks and Davis.
Did he get a lot of his blocks, but you know, will be more
athletic in these areas or will be smaller in these areas or
again. Like we, you know, we'll have
more guys in the for that we think can hit shots, whatever it
is, but I think that the Beyond fitting the three sign.
He's on to the roster. One of them has a spot now.
You need to figure out where you're at in the post and what
you need in the post because I am very much among those that
thinks that you know, one of the one of the important Evolutions
from year one to year two, maybe even years two and three of Mike
Woodson's offense as it relates to the personally as right now
is it's important to have good post play but I don't think this
offense is going to be as healthy as it can be until you
are good enough in other areas. Making on the ball shot making
Etc, where you don't have to be so reliant on the ball, touching
the post, and not just touching the post.
But like the idea that, every, every half-court possession
needs to start with a really deliberate post up and then
Branch out from there that that doesn't stress a defense.
I mean, it does in the sense that racetrack and Davis is a
good player, but it doesn't the sense that it doesn't get bodies
moving. It doesn't get the ball moving
quickly enough at times. Sometimes it does and Trace
Jackson Davis. Race Thompson.
Both got a lot better as pastors this year and that's important.
And you could see the way that the offense, you know, added
layers. When Trace Jackson Davis was
suddenly confident making those skip passes to the corner to the
wing, but it's still could stand to be an offense.
That's a little bit more guard driven in the way that it makes
plays in the way that it sort of, you know, creates within
possess half-court. Possessions.
That's a bit of a tangent, forgive me.
No, but the thing is, you still need.
Now really solid. Reliable number one in the post.
So you need to figure out if you have one or if you need to go
get one. That's probably a portal
situation. That is, that is probably more
likely to be someone, like, Peyton Sparks out of the portal
than it is, you know, there just by this point in the the
recruiting calendar there just aren't a lot of impact bigs
around. They're incredibly valuable and
most of them have committed and or signed.
So it's probably a portal addition, whoever it is.
But you've got to be sure that you're going to have space for
that person. First.
You got to be sure that like okay race Thompson, this told us
he's done. He's leaving.
He's you know, he's his IU, career is over, Trace Jackson,
Davis, same thing. And I think that's probably the
next question to to answer from there.
Because I do think you have maybe a somewhat uncommon amount
of like, it very much. Feels Like You Can Count On
like, Jordan Geronimo tomorrow bait stray Galloway, Anthony Lee
all quite possibly Rob fantasy. You know, to some extent, even
like Xavier Johnson, I mean did Johnson was players like maybe
he, maybe he declares at least just to go through the process
and get some feedback Etc. You have a solid nucleus.
There are guys that you can rely on between the guys that I just
mentioned in your freshman, you need again a little bit more
organic attrition to fit the freshman in, if there's more
room after that, I'm guessing it's probably going to be big
man related and you're going to have to figure out what you need
to do. There.
Does that create a problem though?
Because we Talk about the need for shooting and outside of
Xavier Johnson. That group that you just
announced. That's there's not a whole lot
of demonstrated outside shooting ability in that group.
That's fair. And you know, I mean then maybe
it's about a coaching staff earning its money.
Getting guys better at shooting. You know, I mean like an end it
I mean, look at it this way. If you could get robbed fantasy
to, let's say, Rob fantasy and Trey Galloway both come back.
I'm just making this up right now, last season, Rob fantasy
shot, 19 of 72, which is 26.4%, Roy Galloway shot, six of 28,
which is 21.4 percent from three.
You know, what, if neither of those guys increase their volume
dramatically, but they both hit six percent more of their
threes. Now, you wouldn't look at Trey,
Galloway and say, my God. Great three-point shooter, but
if Trey Galloway shot 43's and hit, I don't know, 11 of them or
know, what would that be? Like, 12 of them?
That's not a great percentage. I think what is that?
That somewhere around 30%? I can't do math.
Zack. What are you doing?
I think it's somewhere around 30%, but like that, six more
threes for a team that 33 plus just like that.
Six more threes for a team that lost A bunch of close games.
If Rob fennessy takes 83s next season.
He took 72 this season and he hits 25 of them that six more
threes. I just gave you 12 more
three-pointers and like, That is effectively the difference.
When it seemed that you 32 percent from three and a team
that shoots 35 percent from three is like 12, 15, 18 3.
Jiggly, if you're not going to take a ton of them, right?
So my point here is you need some volume Shooters.
You need like a Jordan Geronimo to take a step forward or you
need Miller cop to be more reliable.
Maybe CJ gun, or Jalen Hurd, Shafi, no, turns out to be a
good volume shooter. And if there is an opening to go
look for that player, either in high school recruiting or in the
portal, by all means take it, you know. if you have but like
my point, what I'm trying to say is Indiana. 121 games went to
the semi-final of the Big Ten. Tournament won a game in the
NCAA tournament. While shooting 33.3% from behind
the three-point line 31.9% in conference play.
Part of the solution to the problem can be taking a 22%
three-point shooter and making him a 30%.
Three-point shooter, it the solution to the problem isn't
always just taken a 35% guy and making him a 45 percent guy.
It's great to have that player. But it's also great to take
Miller cop from 36.1% 35.1%. In conference play up to, let's
say, 40 percent and 39% in conference play with the same
number of attempts, or maybe even a couple more attempts.
My point is, you can get better for shooting the three, even if
some guys averages are not as good as what you consider kind
of the national mean, if they're better than they were a season
ago. Because this team, obviously in
the right situations in the right moments.
This team is probably only about, I would say, 10 to 15,
made threes away from like beating Syracuse, beating Penn
State beating, Wisconsin once. We beating Ohio State or Purdue
and I just turned to 20 and 21 and 14 team into a 25 and 10
team. And with it without giving you
Robert Horry, you know, that, you know, I mean without giving
you Nick sighs lock to use a recent, Indiana and Sample, but
by getting the guys, you have to shoot a little bit better.
That may have to be the solution and other people don't want to
hear that. And now I mean errors because
you know, I think the kind of man you're well within your
rights to look around fantasy and say, but it's been four
years. Maybe this is just who he is.
But like if you're you know, this is this is the position in
the end. It's coaching staff has created
for itself. And again, maybe it got like CJ
gun was a really good shooter in high school comes in and is
immediately a 38 39 percent three-point shooter and you can
live with some of his physical deficiencies because he's only a
freshman or some of his deficiencies on the defensive
end, whatever it is because he's in Experienced but you know,
this is the position Indiana's put itself in.
Yes, they'd love to have more three-point shooting, but like
the example I gave earlier, if you lose race and Trace, I think
you've got to start by going getting another volume post guy
first. Now, I think that's ultimately
what it comes down to what you said, a minute ago.
If there's some trepidation on a part of IU fans, it's that they
just haven't seen that internal development of Shooters.
Increasing their percentages effectively over the course of
their careers. So new coaching staff.
Laughs and you did see a few improvements this year,
including Jordan Geronimo and race Thompson shooting from
outside, and they showed some level of proficiency.
They hadn't before. So, it's not out of the
question. I don't blame my you fans if
they're going to hold their expectations on this, a bit
until they see it, but that ultimately ends up being the
issue. So anyway, we're out of time.
Zach, Osterman from the Indy star.
Great to talk to you again as always.
And we'll look forward to touching base.
Maybe next month. Maybe, maybe.
Basketball. Maybe football.
Seems like there's going to be a decent amount of stuff to talk
about with both of those programs.
Yeah, absolutely. Always fun to come and chat.
Thanks for having me. Absolutely.
Thanks to all you folks for tuning in.
This is Crimson cast. I'm Galen klaviyo.
We will catch you. Folks on the flip side.
Bring back the Bison, so everybody.