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You're listening to the Back 
Home Network presented by Home 

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Field Apparel. 
Welcome back to Crimson cast in 

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another crossover episode with 
Right Up Meridian. 

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This is where branding in the 
podcast were there you go. 

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That's that's what I like to 
see. 

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I've got minor in the other 
room, but I got got multiple of 

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those actually, but no, we're 
talking Pacers. 

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The folks asked and we responded
both Scott and I were at Game 6 

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and want to talk about that want
to talk about what's going on 

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with this series just in 
general, it has been Scott. 

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It's one of those things where 
the Pacers, the last time they 

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were in the finals, of course, 
we all know was 2000 and this is

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a special moment for Pacers 
fans. 

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What's been increasingly 
fascinating is how much of a 

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special moment these finals have
become. 

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For like most of the observers 
that watch the NBA for a living,

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the number of people who have 
talked about how special this 

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series has been, how unique it's
been, how exciting and, and back

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and forth it's been has been 
really fascinating. 

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You know, because I think you 
rarely get an opportunity as a 

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fan where it's when it's your 
team that's part of that kind of

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an environment. 
And I think that that vibe, I 

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almost feel like we've, we've 
now got the chance to really 

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talk about that as well as 
everything else and kind of just

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think about it and, and, and 
consume it internally a little 

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bit. 
Because it's just been one of 

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those series where you could 
you, you could go to either 

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emotional extreme, you could 
kind of drift between the poles.

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But at the end of it all, 
regardless, this has just been a

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remarkable experience for 
everybody involved, both fans of

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either team and also just 
neutrals that were looking for 

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good basketball. 
I'm trying in life with my kids,

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I try really hard to just stay 
in the moment and enjoy the 

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moments 'cause they go by really
quickly. 

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I'm doing the same thing here 
with this Pacers run, because 

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you're right. 
I, I, one of the calls I made to

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you a couple of weeks ago or 
right, we made the finals, was 

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that, you know, something along 
the lines of, you know, I, 

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everybody else seems to get 
titles like I, I feel like I'm 

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not deserving of one as an IU 
football, basketball Pacers fan,

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Like that's not, that's not for 
me. 

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And it's like this really could 
be my turn. 

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It's it's wild to think, but 
also you, you hit on the magical

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run that you know, you and I 
are, are obviously sports fans. 

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You see these runs that teams go
on like the the Patriots had 

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early on where, you know, the 
first time they come out of 

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nowhere at the time a backup 
quarterback, we didn't know they

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have the tuck rule game. 
And it's like, man, what a 

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magical run that would be for 
that. 

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Like that would be fun to be on 
that ride with the fan base. 

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And it's weird to look up and be
like, I'm in the middle of this 

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ride. 
And by the way, I was having 

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lunch with someone today. 
It's like it's it's been a long 

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one. 
Like like Dave's Achilles was 

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middle of April like that. 
That was still the playoffs. 

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Like we had just hired to freeze
when this all started. 

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It's insane how long this has 
been going. 

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Yeah, it, it really is a 
marathon if you were in the like

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in the midst of it all. 
And and certainly it's, you 

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know, just one of those deals 
where we'll we'll talk about it 

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more in depth as we talk about 
the game and everything like 

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that. 
But it has felt like we often 

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talk about how you get past the 
final four and the sports really

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slow down. 
And this has been the exception,

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I think for for Indiana Pacers 
fans and and people who are 

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interested in the team have 
gotten interested because it is 

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June 20th. 
This series is going to be 

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ending on June 22nd and you're 
three months from the start of 

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training camp. 
I think at that point it it's, 

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it's fascinating how it closes 
down that calendar and makes 

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everything just last longer. 
It's been, it's been quite an 

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experience anyway and. 
Along real quick, along those 

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lines of the the calendar, it 
was Zach Lowe who mentioned on 

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his podcast, I think it was 
about the Warriors this year 

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when they went out early and he 
was talking like a Warriors 

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executive and the executive's 
kind of joking is like, dude, I,

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I don't know what to do in May. 
He's like, he's like, he's got 

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joking. 
Like, is this, is this what the 

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Hornets do every year? 
Like these guys just, they just 

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have May and April and June off 
like have the Wizards. 

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Is this there's a world where 
you can just be in the NBA and 

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have May plans? 
Like what the hell is this? 

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Yeah, it is it. 
It is remarkable how you can get

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a culture to it if you're a 
successful franchise 

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consistently or not, as the case
may be. 

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So before we dive into the meat 
of things, just a reminder were 

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brought to you by Home Field 
apparel or a place to go for the

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finest in fashion and fabric 
within not just the college 

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landscape, but also the 
professional landscape. 

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They did some great work 
combining Pacers and racers and 

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putting Boomer in a car and and 
selling some stuff at the team 

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store. 
And of course they've had Pacers

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gear, they've had Colts gear. 
There's a ton of stuff up there.

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Indy 500 gear. 
Head over to home field 

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apparel.com. 
Use the code HOME 2-3 to get 15%

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off your first order. 
Go do that now and you will not 

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regret it as they've had some 
amazing merch over the course of

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time. 
I know. 

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We want them to buy now but 
maybe wait until Tuesday because

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Hopefield comes out with stuff 
they they might have 

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championship gear like. 
I would hold on to that first 

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order of purchase code. 
Just get your cart ready and 

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then fire on Tuesday. 
As always, Scott is wiser than 

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me in these things, so listen to
what Scott has to say. 

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Anyway, let's let's talk first 
about Game 6. 

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So, So you are a season ticket 
holder and you had planned on 

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getting tickets to all of the 
playoff games? 

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I am. 
I am. 

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They they just, they give them 
to me and then charge me. 

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But yes. 
Well, but I meant, but you could

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have not bought them or you 
could have sold them or 

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whatever. 
I'm not a season ticket holder, 

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so I've been having to kind of 
snipe tickets as they've come 

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about. 
I had the opportunity to buy 

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tickets for a game in the Finals
and that was Game 3. 

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And I thought, OK, I'm going to 
do that. 

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It's expensive. 
But my rationale is kind of 

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twofold. 
A, I've never been to an NBA 

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Finals as a fan. 
And the intensity, especially at

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a place like Gainbridge 
Fieldhouse, which is already 

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kind of notoriously loud and 
and, you know, vivacious and 

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boisterous, I figured, well, 
that's going to be a really 

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dynamite combination. 
But then be the last time the 

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Pacers, who are the NBA team 
that I have rooted for my whole 

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life, were in the Finals was 25 
years ago. 

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And who knows if any of us have 
25 years moving forward. 

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So, you know, the idea was I I 
want to get to a game. 

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So I chose that game knowing 
that that was likely going to 

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Take Me Out of financial 
contention to go to four or six 

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if necessary. 
Then 5 happens. 

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Therese Halliburton goes out 
injured and tickets dropped off 

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a Cliff. 
Price wise, I I still wouldn't 

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classify the price I paid as 
cheap, but comparatively 

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speaking, it felt like a a 
relative bargain to be able to 

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go and have the the pleasure of 
watching what might have been a 

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decisive game six in the NBA 
Finals for, you know, under 

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well, for for whatever price I 
paid, which I won't talk about 

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on the on the podcast here, but 
VIPVI, yeah, I mean, that's the 

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VIP content. 
That's right. 

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Yeah, Let me talk you. 
Let me walk you through my my. 

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We show our credit card 
statements every month. 

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That's a really boring. 
I want to. 

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Talk about in the Game Time app 
and how I bought. 

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By the way, I kind of recommend 
the Game Time app over some of 

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the other ones. 
I got to say that's been I've IA

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hat tip to to Stefan Krisnik for
turning me on to that one. 

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That's been a that's one I 
recommend everybody potentially 

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download. 
So anyway, so I buy the tickets 

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and I'm like, OK, you know, 
going to go to this game, going 

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to try to see what happens. 
I don't know that I was going in

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hopeless or helpless or feeling 
like it was going to be a lost 

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cause, but I know a lot of 
people were very trepidatious 

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about this game, which is why 
tickets dropped. 

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Some of it was scalpers, but I 
think some of it was perhaps 

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Pacers fans not wanting to watch
what looked like it might be an 

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inevitable end with the way that
Game four and Game 5 went. 

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So that was where I got to, you 
know, hey, let's go to the game.

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Let's, you know, let's enjoy 
this. 

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Let's have one last ride in 
Cambridge Fieldhouse. 

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Like what was your mentality 
going into this Game 6? 

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I was definitely one of the 
trepidatious ones. 

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You know, I've been positive 
throughout this whole series. 

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I I think the Pacers are a 
really good team, but I've also 

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been very honest with myself. 
I think the Thunder are a really

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good team and I've we have some 
stats where it's like these 

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teams stack up just they are 
very similar and the stats prove

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it out. 
But it, it, you know, you, you, 

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nobody knew what we were going 
to get from Halliburton coming 

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into Game 6. 
And, you know, we saw it last 

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year in the Eastern Conference 
finals. 

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They were gamey against the 
Celtics, but it's like they were

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missing that gear. 
You could tell when Halliburton 

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didn't play those last two games
at home. 

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And you know, it's, it's funny. 
It, it, it feels like at times 

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the Thunder have figured out the
Pacers and then they haven't it,

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it felt again after game five. 
It's like, oh, they they kind of

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they they that the Pacers got 
within 2 felt like the Thunder 

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exerted their will and you know 
it. 

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It did feel that the narrative 
kind of felt to me like, all 

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right, the Thunder are really 
this great team. 

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This is a moment where they're 
just going to take it and be 

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like, we are not giving you any 
room to breathe and you're not 

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going to have your starter. 
So I went in with my son, You 

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know, for the most part we were 
thinking it's a, it's a horrible

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again, I'm not playing. 
So doesn't matter what I think. 

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But it's like I, I don't need 
to, I don't need, I'm allowed to

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have doubt. 
But our, our thought was kind of

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it's a win win. 
Like if the Pacers like best 

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case scenario, it's a win win. 
But as I had told you, I told my

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son he was in the same mindset. 
It's like, you know, if the 

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Pacers lose, that's going to 
suck. 

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But not everybody gets to be in 
an arena when a championship is 

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won and a trophy is hoisted. 
And there's something unique 

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about that. 
It would have sucked. 

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I would have not enjoyed 
watching Thunder fans go nuts, 

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but it's like that that is 
something unique in a sports 

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event to be at. 
So I was kind of like, all 

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right, well, worst case 
scenario, it's not awful. 

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So I went in with that mindset 
and I, I would say that the 

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feeling in the arena definitely 
felt a little trepidatious. 

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Like there was kind of 
excitement that it wasn't as 

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electric, I would say as game 
three or game 4 where you just 

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felt like the crowd was ready to
pounce. 

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And then of course, the Pacers 
go down like 10-2 and there's 

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kind of like a oh, like, like, 
but then the Pacers came back 

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and like, and then it felt like 
right away the fans clicked in 

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and it got super intense in that
arena. 

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Yeah, I, I felt like the crowd 
ramped up like right as the 

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starting line UPS were going. 
But before that I was a bit 

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concerned about the atmosphere 
and even coming in. 

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Yeah, I I noticed. 
A lot of Thunder fans. 

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There were, well, there were a 
decent number, although 

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honestly, I was sitting up in 
the relative, relative cheap 

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seats. 
There were not nearly as many as

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I thought there were. 
There were more than there were 

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for game three. 
But even walking in, like I 

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parked and walked to the arena 
about an hour and a half hour, 

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15 before tip, I just decided to
eat at the arena. 

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There wasn't going to be enough 
time to go to a restaurant and 

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it did kind of feel like a, 
well, we'll see what happens 

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kind of attitude amongst Pacers 
fans. 

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But there didn't seem to be the 
kind of energy and excitement 

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that you saw leading in, 
especially to game four. 

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And certainly you understand why
with what we saw in Game 5. 

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But one of the things that I 
thought and one of the reasons 

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why I decided that I wanted to 
go to the game was as we've 

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talked about in various stages 
of these playoffs and as we've 

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00:11:44,720 --> 00:11:46,960
witnessed the Pacers being on 
the other side of. 

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00:11:46,960 --> 00:11:51,720
And at least in one instance 
that I can think of, it's hard 

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00:11:51,720 --> 00:11:55,920
to really get your head wrapped 
around what a team can bring to 

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00:11:55,920 --> 00:11:59,200
the table in a an elimination 
game where their backs are 

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00:11:59,200 --> 00:12:03,800
against the wall and how 
difficult that can be for an 

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opponent to deal with in the 
moment. 

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I really did feel like this was 
a Pacers team that yes, they had

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had a a bad Game 5, but they 
still were in it in the fourth 

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quarter until they kind of self 
destructed. 

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They played a great 1st 3/4 of 
game four and then essentially 

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00:12:20,520 --> 00:12:24,080
got outplayed a bit at the end. 
But you and I were exchanging 

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00:12:24,080 --> 00:12:28,200
voice memos the it'll be in the 
lead up to the game where we 

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00:12:28,200 --> 00:12:31,800
were talking about how you know,
from your perspective, it's like

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00:12:31,800 --> 00:12:33,320
the Thunder are just the better 
team. 

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00:12:33,320 --> 00:12:35,520
You know, it looks like they 
just kind of solved the Pacers. 

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00:12:35,520 --> 00:12:37,880
This was not just Scott talking,
folks. 

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00:12:37,880 --> 00:12:40,840
This was also something that we 
heard Bill Simmons and Zach Lowe

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00:12:40,840 --> 00:12:44,360
mention on the podcast that they
recorded after the game last 

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00:12:44,360 --> 00:12:45,960
night, where it just felt like 
something had. 

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00:12:46,080 --> 00:12:47,840
You for not comparing me to like
Stephen A Smith there or 

248
00:12:47,840 --> 00:12:50,320
something? 
I would never, never do that to 

249
00:12:50,320 --> 00:12:53,920
you. 
But but it did feel like perhaps

250
00:12:53,920 --> 00:12:57,920
the Thunder had flipped the 
switch and at that point it felt

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00:12:57,920 --> 00:13:00,720
like, well, they, they were just
the better team in this series 

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00:13:00,720 --> 00:13:02,760
And they that's how it works 
sometimes. 

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00:13:03,040 --> 00:13:05,560
But I, I really did feel like 
the Pacers were going to win 

254
00:13:05,720 --> 00:13:09,440
going into the game yesterday. 
I wasn't like boisterous about 

255
00:13:09,440 --> 00:13:12,880
it because you never totally 
know and a lot of it depending 

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00:13:12,880 --> 00:13:15,080
on what happened with Tyrese 
Halliburton and his injury. 

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00:13:15,080 --> 00:13:20,880
But we've seen I I I point back 
to the Knicks in game five of 

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00:13:20,880 --> 00:13:25,400
the previous series where the 
Pacers are up three one, they 

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00:13:25,400 --> 00:13:28,120
could have been up, they could 
have swept, you know, the way 

260
00:13:28,120 --> 00:13:30,200
that it went. 
They go into Madison Square 

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00:13:30,200 --> 00:13:32,960
Garden and for the first time, 
like the Knicks looked truly 

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00:13:32,960 --> 00:13:37,160
dominant in that series and they
beat the Pacers handily. 

263
00:13:37,160 --> 00:13:38,280
And it's like, where did that 
come from? 

264
00:13:38,280 --> 00:13:39,600
Now? 
Did that carry over to the next 

265
00:13:39,600 --> 00:13:41,280
game? 
No, it did not. 

266
00:13:41,680 --> 00:13:44,440
Pacers got their legs back. 
You know, the Knicks, that was 

267
00:13:44,440 --> 00:13:46,040
kind of the last gasp to some 
degree. 

268
00:13:46,040 --> 00:13:49,880
But those scenarios are always 
very special in sports and 

269
00:13:50,160 --> 00:13:51,920
especially when you have these 
series. 

270
00:13:52,080 --> 00:13:53,760
I think especially with 
basketball, it doesn't really 

271
00:13:53,760 --> 00:13:55,760
stick out as much in hockey 
because because the teams are 

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00:13:55,760 --> 00:13:58,640
generally more even, it doesn't 
stick out as much in baseball 

273
00:13:58,640 --> 00:14:01,080
because baseball just operates 
differently in terms of how the 

274
00:14:01,080 --> 00:14:04,120
games go. 
But I I really did think that if

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00:14:04,120 --> 00:14:07,400
they could get some good 
shooting, they had a real chance

276
00:14:07,400 --> 00:14:08,840
in this game. 
And if they got anything out of 

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00:14:08,840 --> 00:14:13,000
Halliburton, ironically, they 
ended up having a great game. 

278
00:14:13,040 --> 00:14:15,800
They dominate Oklahoma City and 
they didn't get a great shooting

279
00:14:15,800 --> 00:14:19,920
game, as witnessed by that O for
9 start that they had at the 

280
00:14:19,920 --> 00:14:23,400
beginning of the game. 
You know, the, as I heard one 

281
00:14:23,400 --> 00:14:26,520
person talk about, this was a 
game the Pacers absolutely 

282
00:14:26,520 --> 00:14:30,160
dominated and they shot what, 
4243% from the field for the 

283
00:14:30,160 --> 00:14:32,160
entire game, which is kind of 
nuts. 

284
00:14:32,160 --> 00:14:36,160
But but Scott, as we look at the
stats, as we look at the way 

285
00:14:36,160 --> 00:14:39,760
things went, you know, the 
overarching thing for me in this

286
00:14:39,760 --> 00:14:42,720
game was, was essentially there 
were really two things. 

287
00:14:43,120 --> 00:14:47,640
A The Pacers defense, as has 
been pointed out in numerous 

288
00:14:47,640 --> 00:14:52,520
places, just played at a level 
that I have not seen them play 

289
00:14:52,640 --> 00:14:55,120
for extended periods of time 
against Oklahoma City. 

290
00:14:55,120 --> 00:14:58,440
They've done it in spurts, but 
the way that they clamp down on 

291
00:14:58,440 --> 00:15:03,840
Oklahoma City early and, and 
regularly to me was the the the 

292
00:15:03,840 --> 00:15:06,400
thing that changed it. 
And it took the Pacers offense a

293
00:15:06,400 --> 00:15:09,000
while to catch up. 
But the fact that it, you know, 

294
00:15:09,000 --> 00:15:12,360
the Pacers offense didn't get 
going essentially until the 8 

295
00:15:12,360 --> 00:15:15,680
minute mark of the second 
quarter in any meaningful way, 

296
00:15:15,880 --> 00:15:19,120
and they were still leading by a
point at that stage illustrates 

297
00:15:19,120 --> 00:15:22,520
how good the defensive effort 
was from this Pacers team. 

298
00:15:23,120 --> 00:15:25,960
The the thing with the defense, 
you know, I'm going to, I want 

299
00:15:25,960 --> 00:15:28,760
to answer my own question, but I
want to ask it back to you is 

300
00:15:29,160 --> 00:15:31,280
it's interesting because I, I've
heard this talked about a little

301
00:15:31,280 --> 00:15:34,080
bit that, you know, there 
there's not outside of Nesmith, 

302
00:15:34,080 --> 00:15:36,960
there's not like the, oh, that's
a lockdown defender on this 

303
00:15:36,960 --> 00:15:39,120
team. 
And yet the defense has just 

304
00:15:39,120 --> 00:15:41,280
gotten better as the playoffs 
have gone along. 

305
00:15:41,280 --> 00:15:42,680
They've been a better defensive 
team. 

306
00:15:43,520 --> 00:15:45,280
You know, I look at it as a 
couple of things. 

307
00:15:45,280 --> 00:15:49,560
I think one, it's coaching. 
I mean, you just, you see, you 

308
00:15:49,560 --> 00:15:51,920
know, they, they, you saw Legler
kind of break it down a little 

309
00:15:51,920 --> 00:15:54,080
bit last night. 
You know, that the Pacers 

310
00:15:54,080 --> 00:15:55,760
changed up the way they were 
playing defense. 

311
00:15:55,760 --> 00:15:58,080
They were kind of swarming the 
middle like the Thunder had been

312
00:15:58,080 --> 00:16:00,640
doing, just not letting the 
Thunder get to the paint. 

313
00:16:01,000 --> 00:16:02,720
I also thought what was 
interesting is they really 

314
00:16:02,720 --> 00:16:05,720
weren't pressuring the ball full
court like they had in previous 

315
00:16:05,720 --> 00:16:07,360
games. 
And what I thought was 

316
00:16:07,360 --> 00:16:11,000
interesting with that was the 
Thunder did the same like the 

317
00:16:11,000 --> 00:16:12,760
Thunder kind of like, well, if 
you're not going to press, we're

318
00:16:12,760 --> 00:16:14,200
not going to press. 
It's like, OK, great. 

319
00:16:14,360 --> 00:16:17,080
Like what Halliburton bring the 
ball up like the in in a weird 

320
00:16:17,080 --> 00:16:19,320
way, it's like the Thunder were 
kind of mirroring whatever we 

321
00:16:19,320 --> 00:16:22,160
were doing. 
The other thing with our defense

322
00:16:22,520 --> 00:16:24,720
is, you know, and and it's the 
NBA. 

323
00:16:24,720 --> 00:16:27,440
Everyone's playing hard, but 
there's like a next like a a 

324
00:16:27,440 --> 00:16:30,200
McConnell level. 
We'll call it the Pacers. 

325
00:16:30,200 --> 00:16:34,240
Just everyone's busting their 
ass at all times and you see a 

326
00:16:34,240 --> 00:16:37,280
couple of plays where you know 
the Pacers get fast breaks 

327
00:16:37,280 --> 00:16:39,640
because the Thunder are running 
back, they're not sprinting 

328
00:16:39,640 --> 00:16:42,640
back. 
And the Pacers just, they were 

329
00:16:42,640 --> 00:16:45,560
going after everything and 
diving after everything. 

330
00:16:45,560 --> 00:16:48,080
And, you know, in a weird way, 
it's kind of been the way the 

331
00:16:48,080 --> 00:16:49,920
series is gone. 
It's like the starters get going

332
00:16:49,920 --> 00:16:51,560
and they kind of slow down. 
It's like McConnell comes in. 

333
00:16:51,560 --> 00:16:53,480
It's like just a juice of 
energy. 

334
00:16:53,960 --> 00:16:55,760
But no, I'm, I'm with you on the
defense. 

335
00:16:55,760 --> 00:16:58,640
I just find it interesting that 
it's not like you have, you 

336
00:16:58,640 --> 00:17:01,840
know, two or three, you know, 
Dort and Caruso like the Thunder

337
00:17:01,840 --> 00:17:04,319
do. 
It's much more of a team concept

338
00:17:04,319 --> 00:17:06,200
and it's based on effort and 
coaching. 

339
00:17:06,599 --> 00:17:09,880
Yeah, that's a great point. 
I I think that I noticed the 

340
00:17:09,880 --> 00:17:12,720
lack of full court pressure. 
I also noticed, like if you go 

341
00:17:12,720 --> 00:17:17,359
back to game four and you look 
at what the problems were for 

342
00:17:17,359 --> 00:17:19,960
the Pacers down the stretch in 
Game 4, like, you know, when 

343
00:17:19,960 --> 00:17:24,400
they they turn the corner into 
the fourth quarter, the Thunder 

344
00:17:24,400 --> 00:17:28,359
really extended the defense like
up 35 feet or so. 

345
00:17:28,359 --> 00:17:30,800
They really made it hard. 
You know, the Pacers had a 

346
00:17:30,800 --> 00:17:33,440
couple of turnovers just off of 
handoffs because they couldn't 

347
00:17:33,440 --> 00:17:35,080
get the ball anywhere. 
They couldn't pass it anywhere. 

348
00:17:35,600 --> 00:17:39,560
And the, the Thunder were, were 
weirdly passive defensively, not

349
00:17:39,560 --> 00:17:41,320
just with that, but as you 
mentioned, with the lack of full

350
00:17:41,320 --> 00:17:47,160
court pressure and the, the, the
move that Carlyle made, you 

351
00:17:47,160 --> 00:17:49,240
know, I, I couldn't, I, I, I 
don't know. 

352
00:17:49,240 --> 00:17:53,400
And I, I honestly, I didn't see 
his post game quotes to see if 

353
00:17:53,400 --> 00:17:57,320
he answered this specifically, 
but that move, was it for 

354
00:17:57,320 --> 00:17:59,880
fatigue purposes? 
Was he trying not to tire his 

355
00:17:59,880 --> 00:18:02,680
guys out? 
You know, was it a situation 

356
00:18:02,680 --> 00:18:06,120
where he felt like, well, we can
really clamp down? 

357
00:18:06,120 --> 00:18:09,200
Like, we're less interested in 
stopping the guards from 

358
00:18:09,200 --> 00:18:12,080
dribbling the ball up the floor,
and we're more interested in 

359
00:18:12,080 --> 00:18:15,480
stopping the guards when they 
penetrate into the paint, you 

360
00:18:15,480 --> 00:18:16,720
know? 
But it is interesting that 

361
00:18:16,720 --> 00:18:19,120
Oklahoma City decided they were 
going to mirror that because, 

362
00:18:19,120 --> 00:18:22,160
again, it was a counter punch as
opposed to a punch. 

363
00:18:22,760 --> 00:18:26,040
And especially, as you 
mentioned, with Halliburton 

364
00:18:26,400 --> 00:18:28,760
clearly injured. 
I mean, he only played 23 total 

365
00:18:28,760 --> 00:18:33,760
minutes in the game yesterday. 
And with, you know, TJ McConnell

366
00:18:33,760 --> 00:18:36,640
clearly being an an excellent 
player, but also a guy who you 

367
00:18:36,640 --> 00:18:41,520
can to some degree overwhelm 
and, and, and put in a difficult

368
00:18:41,520 --> 00:18:44,120
position in terms of not being 
able to pass the ball or not 

369
00:18:44,120 --> 00:18:46,320
being able to dribble. 
It just was kind of an odd 

370
00:18:46,320 --> 00:18:50,880
choice by Oklahoma City. 
And what was really fascinating 

371
00:18:50,880 --> 00:18:54,880
from the Indiana side was how 
effective it was at cutting off 

372
00:18:54,880 --> 00:18:58,560
Shay Giljus, Alexander and Jalen
Williams from the very things 

373
00:18:58,560 --> 00:19:01,720
that it made them so successful 
in the fourth quarter of game 

374
00:19:01,720 --> 00:19:03,760
four and pretty much all of Game
5. 

375
00:19:03,760 --> 00:19:07,120
Like they they essentially cut 
off the supply lines, dared the 

376
00:19:07,120 --> 00:19:10,600
Thunder to shoot from three and 
the Thunder could not hit shots 

377
00:19:10,600 --> 00:19:13,080
from three. 
I mean I think in the 1st 3/4 

378
00:19:13,560 --> 00:19:17,920
they only had. 
Yeah, the the stats are like you

379
00:19:17,920 --> 00:19:20,760
almost have to just find a game 
stat that only has 3/4 because 

380
00:19:20,760 --> 00:19:22,720
the fourth quarter was all 
garbage time, which I want to 

381
00:19:22,720 --> 00:19:24,640
get to. 
I'm yeah, fascinating thoughts 

382
00:19:24,640 --> 00:19:26,920
about that, but. 
Yeah, if you go, if, if you go 

383
00:19:26,920 --> 00:19:29,320
through and look at the, you 
know what the Thunder made, they

384
00:19:29,320 --> 00:19:33,320
made two threes in the third. 
They made 0 threes in the 

385
00:19:33,320 --> 00:19:35,400
second. 
They made 1/3 in the first. 

386
00:19:35,400 --> 00:19:37,640
So they had, they had three 
total threes. 

387
00:19:38,160 --> 00:19:40,520
And it wasn't that they weren't 
taking them, although they 

388
00:19:40,520 --> 00:19:44,400
didn't take a huge volume, I 
think for the game they ended up

389
00:19:44,480 --> 00:19:47,560
taking 30 threes, which is I 
guess a decent amount. 

390
00:19:47,560 --> 00:19:51,280
But they hit 26 percent, 26.7% 
on the game. 

391
00:19:52,120 --> 00:19:56,640
Like the Pacers can defend that 
way. 

392
00:19:56,920 --> 00:19:59,400
They can. 
It's like a quasi zone, but with

393
00:19:59,400 --> 00:20:02,360
manned principles and Sprint out
rotations. 

394
00:20:02,360 --> 00:20:06,240
And you're really covering a lot
of ground because if the Thunder

395
00:20:06,240 --> 00:20:10,480
cannot hit at a 40 to 45% rate 
from three. 

396
00:20:11,080 --> 00:20:15,280
The Pacers just have more bodies
to throw at things and they can 

397
00:20:15,280 --> 00:20:19,720
switch off so that they're not 
just locking them hard on to SGA

398
00:20:19,720 --> 00:20:21,640
all the time. 
They can use Siakam, they can 

399
00:20:21,640 --> 00:20:24,200
use Turner. 
It it was a really effective 

400
00:20:24,200 --> 00:20:26,800
defensive scheme. 
It kind of felt like a little 

401
00:20:26,800 --> 00:20:30,200
bit of a break glass in case of 
emergency approach because it's 

402
00:20:30,200 --> 00:20:33,720
not anything that we saw the 
Pacers do in this series up to 

403
00:20:33,720 --> 00:20:35,880
this point. 
And it reminds me a lot of what 

404
00:20:35,880 --> 00:20:42,000
happened in the what was it Game
6 of the Pacers Knicks series 

405
00:20:42,280 --> 00:20:45,640
where they switched from having 
Kneesmith on Brunson like they 

406
00:20:45,640 --> 00:20:47,600
had for most of the time and 
threw Nemhardt on him. 

407
00:20:47,600 --> 00:20:50,200
And suddenly Brunson was like, I
have no idea what I'm supposed 

408
00:20:50,200 --> 00:20:51,600
to be doing in this 
circumstance. 

409
00:20:51,600 --> 00:20:55,600
So like, again, as you 
mentioned, Rick Carlisle, the 

410
00:20:55,600 --> 00:20:58,960
way that he coaches and the 
strategy, I, I heard on one 

411
00:20:58,960 --> 00:21:03,800
podcast, it's like, this is a 
guy who like he realizes all the

412
00:21:03,800 --> 00:21:06,240
trade-offs and he makes 
trade-offs depending on what he 

413
00:21:06,240 --> 00:21:08,160
thinks going to be the most 
advantageous thing in the 

414
00:21:08,160 --> 00:21:09,840
moment. 
And it was clear, like 

415
00:21:09,840 --> 00:21:12,640
defensively, this made the most 
sense. 

416
00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:16,240
And he got rewarded very early, 
relatively speaking, in the game

417
00:21:16,240 --> 00:21:19,240
because the Pacers finally got 
their offense on track and they 

418
00:21:19,240 --> 00:21:23,000
were able to get a a a huge 
lead, which made playing defense

419
00:21:23,000 --> 00:21:24,880
in the third quarter much, much 
easier. 

420
00:21:25,200 --> 00:21:26,920
Well, and they got a couple 
threes to go down. 

421
00:21:26,960 --> 00:21:29,000
You know, you you had top end 
shooting well from three. 

422
00:21:29,000 --> 00:21:31,000
You had, you know, turn. 
That's not Turner Halliburton 

423
00:21:31,000 --> 00:21:32,920
shooting well from three. 
Turner is a different story will

424
00:21:32,920 --> 00:21:36,080
get to him as well. 
You know, Nemhard had a couple 

425
00:21:36,080 --> 00:21:37,480
of threes go down. 
You were just and they were 

426
00:21:37,480 --> 00:21:41,680
pushing the pace like they so 
many times in the playoffs, the 

427
00:21:41,680 --> 00:21:44,240
Pacers have used their defense 
to kind of get things amped up 

428
00:21:44,240 --> 00:21:46,200
and get the pace going in this 
way. 

429
00:21:46,200 --> 00:21:48,640
It was just they were kind of 
getting their offense to get the

430
00:21:48,640 --> 00:21:52,000
pace going and they just they 
pushed it and they were just 

431
00:21:52,000 --> 00:21:54,600
pushing it and kind of green 
light shooting all over the 

432
00:21:54,600 --> 00:21:56,920
place. 
And that is the thing with the 

433
00:21:56,920 --> 00:22:00,880
Thunder that, you know, if you 
can, the Pacers had a trouble 

434
00:22:00,880 --> 00:22:02,880
where they keep getting down. 
They have to come back from, you

435
00:22:02,880 --> 00:22:05,520
know, 12 or 13 down. 
The Thunder just aren't a good 

436
00:22:05,520 --> 00:22:07,400
three-point shooting team. 
I mean, they've they've had some

437
00:22:07,400 --> 00:22:09,560
real stinkers in the playoffs in
these finals. 

438
00:22:09,560 --> 00:22:12,440
I should say game five, they 
were what, like 2 of 16? 

439
00:22:12,720 --> 00:22:15,800
You know, in this game they were
two of 20 going into the third, 

440
00:22:15,800 --> 00:22:18,920
going into the fourth quarter. 8
for even 8 for 30 at the end of 

441
00:22:18,920 --> 00:22:21,360
the game is not awesome. 
You know, the Thunder don't 

442
00:22:21,360 --> 00:22:24,720
really have a way to get back 
from a 15 point lead if you can 

443
00:22:24,720 --> 00:22:26,800
get up by that much. 
They have to do it with defense 

444
00:22:26,800 --> 00:22:29,280
and twos and they kind of take 
their time. 

445
00:22:29,680 --> 00:22:32,920
So it it almost becomes a they 
don't have a way to do it. 

446
00:22:32,920 --> 00:22:35,440
And just the Pacers haven't been
able to kind of blitz and get 

447
00:22:35,440 --> 00:22:38,320
that going. 
And I really think it came from 

448
00:22:38,520 --> 00:22:41,360
the not pressing it. 
It was just, it was very odd. 

449
00:22:41,640 --> 00:22:44,720
And this is something I've been 
surprised at this entire series.

450
00:22:45,280 --> 00:22:48,320
Obviously it's each team is 
making adjustments, but for the 

451
00:22:48,320 --> 00:22:51,640
most part, Carlisle is coaching 
the same way he's coached all 

452
00:22:51,640 --> 00:22:53,720
season. 
You know that McConnell comes in

453
00:22:53,720 --> 00:22:56,000
with like 3 or 4 minutes to go 
in the first quarter. 

454
00:22:56,520 --> 00:22:58,280
Halliburton stays out until 
about 8 minutes. 

455
00:22:58,600 --> 00:23:00,600
Someone's come in with one 
minute to go in the quarter and 

456
00:23:00,600 --> 00:23:02,880
then come in with about 8 
minutes to go in the 2nd and the

457
00:23:02,880 --> 00:23:04,200
4th. 
Like the patterns are pretty 

458
00:23:04,200 --> 00:23:07,520
similar and like, you know, 
whether it's top end or math or 

459
00:23:07,520 --> 00:23:10,040
any, would they kind of like he 
swaps those, But it's been 

460
00:23:10,040 --> 00:23:11,560
pretty much the same. 
Where is the Thunder? 

461
00:23:11,560 --> 00:23:13,560
Or like immediately game one, 
like we're going too big. 

462
00:23:13,560 --> 00:23:15,040
Like we're not going to do that.
We're now we're going to go 

463
00:23:15,040 --> 00:23:16,840
small and then we're going to 
start pressing and then we're 

464
00:23:16,840 --> 00:23:18,680
not and then we're going to end 
in this game. 

465
00:23:18,680 --> 00:23:23,160
It felt almost like because the 
Pacers weren't just pressing, 

466
00:23:23,280 --> 00:23:26,600
but they were running, it's like
the pressure was off and felt 

467
00:23:26,600 --> 00:23:30,360
like Oklahoma City just wasn't 
their defensive pressure was not

468
00:23:30,360 --> 00:23:32,240
there. 
It just felt like they came in 

469
00:23:32,240 --> 00:23:35,280
kind of passive and there was 
almost AI wonder if there was a 

470
00:23:35,280 --> 00:23:37,800
bit of a rope, a dope like, you 
know, well, Halliburton's not 

471
00:23:37,800 --> 00:23:39,520
going to play or he's going to 
be injured and we don't need to 

472
00:23:39,520 --> 00:23:41,520
press and you know, we'll just 
we'll win the title and it's 

473
00:23:41,520 --> 00:23:45,480
like, oh shoot, we're down 15 in
the second and then oh wait, 

474
00:23:45,480 --> 00:23:47,520
Shepard just hit a three like 
we're down 30. 

475
00:23:47,520 --> 00:23:48,800
What are we doing? 
I. 

476
00:23:49,160 --> 00:23:51,520
I'm baffled by the the whole 
thing. 

477
00:23:51,560 --> 00:23:54,960
I mean, first of all, again, I 
expected Indiana to come come 

478
00:23:54,960 --> 00:23:57,840
out with a lot of energy, but I 
expected Oklahoma City to come 

479
00:23:57,840 --> 00:24:02,000
out with a lot of energy too. 
Like we talked about this and, 

480
00:24:02,000 --> 00:24:06,000
and again, as you mentioned 
earlier, it felt like Oklahoma 

481
00:24:06,000 --> 00:24:09,520
City had figured out the Pacers.
It felt like they had figured 

482
00:24:09,520 --> 00:24:12,160
out how to play them, how to 
harass them. 

483
00:24:12,800 --> 00:24:16,560
You know, we've, we've heard all
about this vaunted defense that 

484
00:24:16,560 --> 00:24:20,680
Oklahoma City has and, and their
offense is just as good. 

485
00:24:20,680 --> 00:24:27,200
They've got this tremendous net 
rating inefficiency and yet this

486
00:24:27,200 --> 00:24:31,760
is the kind of game you get 
sometimes out of younger teams, 

487
00:24:31,760 --> 00:24:33,720
I think, where it is a huge 
moment. 

488
00:24:34,520 --> 00:24:38,800
And when you get hit in the face
repeatedly over the course of 

489
00:24:38,800 --> 00:24:42,560
the first half of a game, it it,
it becomes harder and harder. 

490
00:24:42,560 --> 00:24:45,680
But, but it was just, it was odd
to me that the things that it 

491
00:24:45,680 --> 00:24:48,960
worked so well for the Thunder 
just didn't seem to be there. 

492
00:24:48,960 --> 00:24:50,680
And as as you mentioned, a lot 
of it was effort. 

493
00:24:50,680 --> 00:24:53,720
There was some early fouls, like
I did think it was interesting. 

494
00:24:53,720 --> 00:24:56,160
The Thunder I think got to four 
or five fouls in the first 

495
00:24:56,160 --> 00:24:57,680
quarter and the Pacers still had
one. 

496
00:24:57,680 --> 00:25:00,320
There were a couple of early 
fouls on Dort, which seemed to 

497
00:25:00,320 --> 00:25:03,480
change his mentality a little 
bit in terms of how he was 

498
00:25:03,480 --> 00:25:06,840
playing. 
But it really did feel like the 

499
00:25:06,840 --> 00:25:13,440
the Thunder looked almost a 
little just uncertain about what

500
00:25:13,440 --> 00:25:15,800
they should be doing and how 
they should be approaching 

501
00:25:15,800 --> 00:25:18,800
things. 
And I it's very odd because they

502
00:25:18,800 --> 00:25:23,560
didn't look that way in Game 4. 
And I do wonder to some degree 

503
00:25:24,960 --> 00:25:29,800
if what they're dealing with 
defensively at this point is a 

504
00:25:29,800 --> 00:25:33,640
real lack of core identity 
because they're not playing the 

505
00:25:33,640 --> 00:25:38,480
line UPS that they rode that 
gaudy defensive record to, not 

506
00:25:38,480 --> 00:25:40,240
just in the regular season, but 
through the first part of the 

507
00:25:40,240 --> 00:25:41,760
play offs. 
They've had to adjust. 

508
00:25:42,080 --> 00:25:45,160
They're really not playing the 
line up that got them the best 

509
00:25:45,160 --> 00:25:47,000
numbers throughout the course of
the year. 

510
00:25:47,760 --> 00:25:52,520
And that has created this kind 
of oddity where they've had to 

511
00:25:52,520 --> 00:25:58,520
lean so heavily on Lukens Dort 
and on Alex Caruso. 

512
00:25:58,840 --> 00:26:01,600
And you know that they've had to
have Hartenstein out there even 

513
00:26:01,600 --> 00:26:02,960
though he hasn't really 
performed a whole lot 

514
00:26:02,960 --> 00:26:06,320
offensively because they've 
really struggled to get great 

515
00:26:06,320 --> 00:26:09,200
defensive effort out of Chet 
Holmgren in the post. 

516
00:26:09,640 --> 00:26:13,360
And the Pacers, because of the 
way that they play and the way 

517
00:26:13,360 --> 00:26:19,120
that they move the ball around, 
have given the Thunder a type of

518
00:26:19,200 --> 00:26:23,240
offense to defend That really 
does take a lot out of you when 

519
00:26:23,240 --> 00:26:25,520
you have to do it this many 
games in a row. 

520
00:26:25,960 --> 00:26:27,760
And, you know, it's wild to 
think about. 

521
00:26:27,760 --> 00:26:31,640
This was a stat that that that 
Simmons had on his podcast. 

522
00:26:31,640 --> 00:26:34,520
I think it was Zach Lowe that 
brought it up throughout the 

523
00:26:34,520 --> 00:26:38,120
first six games combined, As 
many people that have said of 

524
00:26:38,120 --> 00:26:40,000
the Thunder are just the 
superior team. 

525
00:26:40,200 --> 00:26:44,160
They're +5 for the entire, you 
know, 6. 

526
00:26:44,160 --> 00:26:47,280
Games combined like that's it 
has been essentially an even 

527
00:26:47,280 --> 00:26:51,040
series and yet it hasn't been 
that way perceptionally in the 

528
00:26:51,040 --> 00:26:52,760
minds of people that have 
watched this series. 

529
00:26:52,760 --> 00:26:55,280
I think it's really fascinating 
points about the defense that 

530
00:26:55,280 --> 00:26:57,680
are that are tied and I think 
are positive for the Pacers. 

531
00:26:57,680 --> 00:26:59,560
Is that one. 
I think your point about the 

532
00:26:59,560 --> 00:27:02,640
lineups is is a great one. 
I think it's very, very apt. 

533
00:27:03,200 --> 00:27:05,360
You know, what I think is 
interesting is you're starting 

534
00:27:05,360 --> 00:27:07,600
to see, but but on the flip 
side, like this is where the 

535
00:27:07,600 --> 00:27:09,920
everyone feels like, you know, 
Nash is like, damn, Thunder are 

536
00:27:09,920 --> 00:27:10,840
great. 
Their defense is awesome. 

537
00:27:10,840 --> 00:27:13,520
Like Pacers offense is good too,
Like, and you're what you're 

538
00:27:13,520 --> 00:27:17,360
starting to see is over time, 
the Pacers are starting to 

539
00:27:17,360 --> 00:27:19,720
figure out where the seams are 
in this defense. 

540
00:27:19,720 --> 00:27:22,720
And what I mean is that always, 
you know, the way the Thunder 

541
00:27:22,720 --> 00:27:25,880
play defense, the the corner 3 
is their Achilles heel. 

542
00:27:25,880 --> 00:27:29,760
Like they, they, they, they help
in and they leave the corner 3 

543
00:27:29,760 --> 00:27:31,840
open. 
And so they've been able, you 

544
00:27:31,840 --> 00:27:34,120
know, the Pacers have been able 
to, to get to that. 

545
00:27:34,480 --> 00:27:36,440
Unfortunately, a lot of the 
guys, you know, Turner hasn't 

546
00:27:36,440 --> 00:27:39,800
been shooting well, but you 
know, Nesmith has also not been 

547
00:27:39,800 --> 00:27:41,560
shooting well. 
It's getting better. 

548
00:27:41,560 --> 00:27:45,120
And I, I saw this mention. 
It makes sense now that, you 

549
00:27:45,120 --> 00:27:48,480
know, Nesmith could just be now 
getting over that ankle sprain 

550
00:27:48,480 --> 00:27:51,000
he had in the Knicks series. 
And you saw it in last night. 

551
00:27:51,240 --> 00:27:54,680
His shot, he just is firing back
up and he has that kind of, you 

552
00:27:54,680 --> 00:27:57,480
know, runs the corner, gets the 
ball kind of like, and then just

553
00:27:57,480 --> 00:28:00,240
like gets himself lined up. 
Like, so much torque on his body

554
00:28:00,240 --> 00:28:02,160
goes up. 
Those shots are starting to go 

555
00:28:02,160 --> 00:28:04,640
down. 
If those corner threes are going

556
00:28:04,640 --> 00:28:06,680
down for Nesmith, that helps 
because that's always going to 

557
00:28:06,680 --> 00:28:10,040
be there. 
But you see as the Thunder are 

558
00:28:10,040 --> 00:28:13,400
rotating off of that to cover 
that it's opening up that kind 

559
00:28:13,600 --> 00:28:16,600
of, you know, top of the key 
three or the off the the elbow 

560
00:28:16,600 --> 00:28:20,000
three that top end was hitting. 
And then I'll just, I, I texted 

561
00:28:20,000 --> 00:28:24,000
you about this like I marked 
this down in games 4:00 and 5:00

562
00:28:24,760 --> 00:28:27,720
the the the Thunder initially 
they didn't want to have this 

563
00:28:27,720 --> 00:28:29,160
switch happen. 
It happened in game five. 

564
00:28:29,160 --> 00:28:30,440
It feels like they were cool 
with it. 

565
00:28:30,720 --> 00:28:34,240
They got shit up on on 
Halliburton and Halliburton 

566
00:28:34,240 --> 00:28:37,800
really was like 1 unsure how to 
get around shit Had a couple 

567
00:28:37,800 --> 00:28:39,320
times re dribbled and had a 
dance around. 

568
00:28:39,320 --> 00:28:42,240
Took a three didn't work well 
last night. 

569
00:28:42,400 --> 00:28:45,960
One play in the third quarter. 
It's like he's he's dribbled 

570
00:28:45,960 --> 00:28:49,480
around does the corner pass to 
Naismith because it's there. 

571
00:28:49,720 --> 00:28:53,440
And then he just Halliburton 
hard cuts to the goal and it's 

572
00:28:53,440 --> 00:28:56,960
like just a touch pass back to 
Halliburton lays it up and then 

573
00:28:56,960 --> 00:28:58,560
I text you it's like you never 
saw it again. 

574
00:28:58,680 --> 00:29:01,680
It's like it very much felt like
we may not see it again, but it 

575
00:29:01,680 --> 00:29:04,600
felt like that worked. 
Do not show that again like that

576
00:29:04,600 --> 00:29:06,080
worked. 
Lay off it. 

577
00:29:06,080 --> 00:29:09,160
We're going to need that again. 
But you just like that to me is 

578
00:29:09,160 --> 00:29:12,560
a play where it's like that has 
opened up because they know the 

579
00:29:12,560 --> 00:29:15,840
corner 3 is there. 
So how do we use that to then 

580
00:29:16,440 --> 00:29:19,160
add another piece to it like the
Pacers are starting to figure 

581
00:29:19,160 --> 00:29:22,160
out wrinkles in this defense to 
run their offense? 

582
00:29:22,920 --> 00:29:24,960
And I don't just think it was, 
you know, them being at home 

583
00:29:24,960 --> 00:29:26,720
last night. 
I I think you're starting to see

584
00:29:26,720 --> 00:29:28,920
more of it. 
Even in Game 5 when they made 

585
00:29:28,920 --> 00:29:31,000
the comeback, they were getting 
the ball to Siakam. 

586
00:29:31,400 --> 00:29:33,360
Sorry. 
Then the last, last, last thing 

587
00:29:33,360 --> 00:29:37,880
I will say is, you know, the 
Pacers do love to pass in when 

588
00:29:37,880 --> 00:29:41,760
you get Siakamur Turner on a 
mismatch, but sometimes they've 

589
00:29:41,760 --> 00:29:44,240
they've taken riskier passes and
then they need to. 

590
00:29:44,520 --> 00:29:47,240
Last night it was very much like
if it's not there, we're going 

591
00:29:47,240 --> 00:29:49,480
to reset, but we're going to 
reset with a quick purpose and 

592
00:29:49,480 --> 00:29:52,080
get going again. 
Unfortunately, the Pacers at 

593
00:29:52,080 --> 00:29:54,360
times in the series are kind of 
reset and then kind of lost 

594
00:29:54,360 --> 00:29:56,480
their way and just end up Jack, 
you know, jacking up a shot. 

595
00:29:56,720 --> 00:29:59,800
So it's, it's been, they've been
very, you know, confident with 

596
00:29:59,800 --> 00:30:02,720
the ball, not making risky 
passes, but then resetting in a 

597
00:30:02,720 --> 00:30:04,880
way where we're going to get 
stuff going again. 

598
00:30:05,400 --> 00:30:08,680
But no, I I think as the series 
goes on, it's benefiting the 

599
00:30:08,680 --> 00:30:10,920
Pacers offense because they're 
starting to figure out where 

600
00:30:10,920 --> 00:30:14,520
these seams are and ways to run 
routes off of routes off of 

601
00:30:14,520 --> 00:30:16,440
routes. 
Yeah, no, I think it that's all 

602
00:30:16,440 --> 00:30:20,440
really all really well said. 
And before we dive into some of 

603
00:30:20,440 --> 00:30:24,040
the broader stats and things 
that we're seeing in the series,

604
00:30:24,080 --> 00:30:26,680
you know, we should I think 
mention some of the 

605
00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:30,200
performances. 
You know you you look at this 

606
00:30:30,200 --> 00:30:35,360
game OB top and leads the Pacers
in scoring and I mean it was 

607
00:30:35,360 --> 00:30:39,600
just from the beginning like 
came in hit a three was was all 

608
00:30:39,600 --> 00:30:44,720
over the place finished was 6 
for 12 from the field in 23 

609
00:30:44,720 --> 00:30:49,600
minutes and it's. 
You add 6 rebounds to that as 

610
00:30:49,600 --> 00:30:50,920
well. 
High level. 

611
00:30:50,920 --> 00:30:55,560
Just wait, step back Obi Topping
to me, I'm like this is where I 

612
00:30:55,560 --> 00:30:58,280
think the Pacers are in a great 
spot for the next couple years 

613
00:30:58,280 --> 00:31:01,600
is if you're any player there's 
there's tons of Obi topping type

614
00:31:01,600 --> 00:31:04,080
players in the league that's he 
was buried on the Knicks. 

615
00:31:04,520 --> 00:31:06,160
They could not figure out how to
use him. 

616
00:31:06,360 --> 00:31:09,080
If you're an athletic 6-8 guy 
who can run, jump and kind of 

617
00:31:09,080 --> 00:31:11,560
shoot, it's like you should look
at this like I want to go play 

618
00:31:11,560 --> 00:31:13,280
there. 
Like I want to go sign a two 

619
00:31:13,280 --> 00:31:16,560
year deal there because I, I 
don't know if Obi Topin is able 

620
00:31:16,560 --> 00:31:17,560
to do this anywhere else. 
Sorry. 

621
00:31:17,560 --> 00:31:20,280
I just I look at Obi Topin as 
like the everybody should be 

622
00:31:20,280 --> 00:31:22,320
looking at this and like, damn, 
I want to play with Tyrese 

623
00:31:22,320 --> 00:31:24,680
Halliburton because he's 
overrated star. 

624
00:31:24,680 --> 00:31:26,840
Whatever you Stephen A Smith can
argue that. 

625
00:31:26,840 --> 00:31:28,880
Like I'm just going to go put up
20 in a finals game. 

626
00:31:29,680 --> 00:31:33,720
It is fascinating because Topin,
if you look at his stats in kind

627
00:31:33,720 --> 00:31:38,120
of a raw setting, they, they 
don't look that much more 

628
00:31:38,120 --> 00:31:40,800
superior to what he was doing 
before. 

629
00:31:40,800 --> 00:31:43,440
I mean, he averaged 10 1/2 
points a game this year and 

630
00:31:43,440 --> 00:31:46,840
three or four rebounds a game. 
It's about what he averaged last

631
00:31:46,840 --> 00:31:48,760
year. 
And yet people forget this is 

632
00:31:48,760 --> 00:31:51,040
still a relatively young player.
He's only 26. 

633
00:31:51,040 --> 00:31:56,080
This is only Year 5. 
And what he has managed to do 

634
00:31:56,080 --> 00:31:58,600
over the course of these 
playoffs should get the Pacers 

635
00:31:58,600 --> 00:32:03,120
really excited because this is a
player that, you know, if he can

636
00:32:03,120 --> 00:32:06,560
continue to develop, you know, I
think it's going to be really, 

637
00:32:07,400 --> 00:32:09,280
you know, a really great asset 
to have. 

638
00:32:09,280 --> 00:32:12,440
And they've got him under 
contract through 2028 on a 

639
00:32:12,440 --> 00:32:14,800
really, really good deal. 
You know, I mean, he's got he's 

640
00:32:14,800 --> 00:32:18,800
making 12 and 13 million this 
year, 14 next year, 15 the year 

641
00:32:18,800 --> 00:32:22,280
after, 16 the year after that. 
That's in this in this economy. 

642
00:32:22,520 --> 00:32:26,040
That's that's nice to have. 
And as you mentioned, like the 

643
00:32:26,040 --> 00:32:30,720
athletic 6-8 guy who can hit 
threes but can defend all over 

644
00:32:30,720 --> 00:32:32,240
the place. 
And I think with topping, the 

645
00:32:32,240 --> 00:32:36,520
big thing is can he, can he dial
down the the mistakes, the 

646
00:32:36,520 --> 00:32:40,720
turnovers, the bad decisions? 
The brain mark on defense. 

647
00:32:40,760 --> 00:32:42,000
Yeah. 
I mean, because we've and it's 

648
00:32:42,360 --> 00:32:46,240
he's honestly he he's like where
you hope that Benedict Matheran 

649
00:32:46,240 --> 00:32:49,800
will get in a couple of years 
where there there's clearly 

650
00:32:49,800 --> 00:32:52,200
talent with both of those 
players top. 

651
00:32:52,200 --> 00:32:53,640
And I think it's been in the 
league longer. 

652
00:32:53,640 --> 00:32:56,080
I think that the coaching has 
gotten him a little bit better. 

653
00:32:56,480 --> 00:32:59,920
But those two in particular and 
and if you think about it like 

654
00:32:59,920 --> 00:33:04,080
top and is the primary reason 
that they get The Big Lead that 

655
00:33:04,160 --> 00:33:07,920
wins them the game in game six. 
Matheran obviously has that huge

656
00:33:08,120 --> 00:33:10,240
explosion of scoring in game 
three. 

657
00:33:10,520 --> 00:33:13,960
They've also had games in the 
playoffs and in this series, 

658
00:33:13,960 --> 00:33:15,920
Matheran most of the rest of the
games in the series where they 

659
00:33:15,920 --> 00:33:19,720
just haven't executed. 
And so they needed that game. 

660
00:33:19,720 --> 00:33:23,760
And I think it's one of the keys
with the Pacers is that they 

661
00:33:24,280 --> 00:33:27,280
they are able to win these games
when they get somebody coming 

662
00:33:27,280 --> 00:33:29,840
off the bench who can have that 
kind of a performance. 

663
00:33:29,840 --> 00:33:32,880
And really where they've been at
their best so far in these play 

664
00:33:32,880 --> 00:33:36,640
offs is when they've had two of 
those guys, because obviously TJ

665
00:33:36,640 --> 00:33:39,480
McConnell was the other one in 
this game and he was the other 

666
00:33:39,480 --> 00:33:41,640
one in game three too. 
Like this. 

667
00:33:41,640 --> 00:33:44,480
Is he did in game five? 
I mean, I heard like Bill and 

668
00:33:44,480 --> 00:33:47,160
Zach Lowe joke about it like if 
he was a free agent loss, is he 

669
00:33:47,160 --> 00:33:50,280
a Max player? 
I mean, he he comes in and it's 

670
00:33:50,280 --> 00:33:54,320
just like he's going to he he 
increases the pace, he goes 

671
00:33:54,320 --> 00:33:58,000
faster, he's able to get places,
he's able to move the ball. 

672
00:33:58,440 --> 00:34:02,520
He's he's unbelievable. 
Yeah, it's I I had a former 

673
00:34:02,520 --> 00:34:04,280
colleague who worked in Philly 
sent me an article. 

674
00:34:04,280 --> 00:34:06,080
It's like, hey, like he was the 
process. 

675
00:34:06,080 --> 00:34:08,719
It's just happening in Indy now.
I know No. 

676
00:34:08,840 --> 00:34:14,320
And his his ability to do what 
he does despite having a. 

677
00:34:15,440 --> 00:34:18,280
What seems to be an easily 
defendable game, and yet it 

678
00:34:18,280 --> 00:34:21,400
clearly is not because nobody 
can defend him, including this 

679
00:34:21,400 --> 00:34:24,199
Thunder team. 
I mean, I saw this great tweet 

680
00:34:24,199 --> 00:34:27,840
from somebody about how 
hilarious and and fitting it is 

681
00:34:27,840 --> 00:34:30,520
that this vaunted Thunder 
defense is getting terrorized on

682
00:34:30,520 --> 00:34:33,280
a nightly basis by TJ McConnell 
of all people. 

683
00:34:33,400 --> 00:34:36,000
Who's less? 
Under contract to 2029, right? 

684
00:34:36,080 --> 00:34:38,360
Yeah, again it is $1,000,000 a 
year. 

685
00:34:38,480 --> 00:34:43,120
Yeah, really, really smart moves
by the Pacers and you know, the 

686
00:34:43,280 --> 00:34:49,719
the energy level, the one the 
one tough thing about not having

687
00:34:49,719 --> 00:34:53,679
another home game is how much of
an impact TJ McConnell makes on 

688
00:34:53,679 --> 00:34:56,080
the home crowd for the Pacers 
when he comes in. 

689
00:34:56,080 --> 00:34:59,360
Obviously you don't have the 
same effect on the road, but his

690
00:34:59,360 --> 00:35:03,520
ability to galvanized the crowd,
his leaning into that role. 

691
00:35:03,800 --> 00:35:07,000
And as you mentioned, like the 
fact and Tyrese Halliburton 

692
00:35:07,000 --> 00:35:10,800
mentioned this in the post game 
yesterday, he comes in and says 

693
00:35:10,800 --> 00:35:13,120
we're going to go faster. 
Like it's not hey, the the 

694
00:35:13,120 --> 00:35:16,400
starters are on the bench. 
Let's take our foot off the gas.

695
00:35:16,480 --> 00:35:18,360
He's the one that helps keep 
that pace alive. 

696
00:35:18,360 --> 00:35:22,280
And that really bothers the 
Thunder, I think because they do

697
00:35:22,280 --> 00:35:25,320
not have a similarly equipped 
player. 

698
00:35:25,600 --> 00:35:27,880
Yes, they've been bringing 
Caruso off the bench. 

699
00:35:28,080 --> 00:35:30,080
Caruso's not that type of 
player. 

700
00:35:30,160 --> 00:35:33,080
He's an agitator, but. 
He's not an accelerator. 

701
00:35:33,120 --> 00:35:36,200
And that's funny because he's 
the, I mean, he's the oldest 

702
00:35:36,280 --> 00:35:38,480
player on the team outside of 
James Johnson. 

703
00:35:38,480 --> 00:35:41,120
He's 33 and always talk about 
like the pace, like, but he 

704
00:35:41,120 --> 00:35:44,720
comes in and it's like he looks 
so much more in shape, so much 

705
00:35:44,720 --> 00:35:47,240
faster than all of these teams. 
And this is one of those where 

706
00:35:47,240 --> 00:35:49,080
it's like, I don't this is where
I think the Pacers are set up 

707
00:35:49,080 --> 00:35:51,400
well in the East for years. 
Like, I don't the Knicks and the

708
00:35:51,400 --> 00:35:53,800
Bucks couldn't deal with that. 
But I mean, in this case, too, 

709
00:35:53,800 --> 00:35:56,320
the Thunder are in the same boat
where it's like, I don't, they 

710
00:35:56,320 --> 00:35:58,360
don't really have anybody who 
can guard McConnell. 

711
00:35:58,760 --> 00:36:02,320
Yeah, it's it's pretty 
remarkable that that, you know, 

712
00:36:02,320 --> 00:36:05,520
the Pacers find themselves in 
this particular scenario with 

713
00:36:05,520 --> 00:36:09,280
the the roster they've got and, 
and the fact that it's required 

714
00:36:09,560 --> 00:36:14,920
McConnell to come in and be a, 
you know, contributed a high 

715
00:36:14,920 --> 00:36:16,600
level pretty much every time 
he's gone in. 

716
00:36:16,600 --> 00:36:19,240
And, and you look at his stats 
over the course of the entire 

717
00:36:19,240 --> 00:36:24,680
series now, and he's shooting 
54% from the field. 

718
00:36:25,200 --> 00:36:29,000
He's shooting 60% from three, 
albeit only on five attempts, 

719
00:36:29,200 --> 00:36:32,120
78% from the free throw line, 
all in 19 minutes. 

720
00:36:32,120 --> 00:36:35,440
He's averaging, he's one of 
eight Pacers averaging double 

721
00:36:35,440 --> 00:36:40,920
figures scoring in this series, 
but he is also the Pacer with 

722
00:36:40,920 --> 00:36:45,480
the second highest assist rate 
despite playing fewer minutes 

723
00:36:45,480 --> 00:36:48,040
than all of the guys that are in
front of him are around him in 

724
00:36:48,040 --> 00:36:50,000
that mix. 
I mean, he's only played 114 

725
00:36:50,000 --> 00:36:53,040
minutes in this series. 
He's averaging 4.5 assists per 

726
00:36:53,040 --> 00:36:56,680
game as well as 2.3 steals. 
He leads the the. 

727
00:36:56,680 --> 00:36:59,840
Team in that category as well. 
It's just a really impressive 

728
00:36:59,920 --> 00:37:01,640
set of accomplishments 
throughout the course of the 

729
00:37:01,640 --> 00:37:03,440
series for him. 
Something you and I talked about

730
00:37:03,440 --> 00:37:06,280
at the beginning of the series 
is you look at the Thunder and 

731
00:37:06,280 --> 00:37:09,120
you look at how it's played out 
Now they have 3 1/2 guys. 

732
00:37:09,120 --> 00:37:11,320
I mean, Shay's averaging 30 
points a game. 

733
00:37:11,320 --> 00:37:14,160
Jalen Williams is averaging 24. 
Both those guys are awesome. 

734
00:37:14,560 --> 00:37:17,320
OK, Chet's averaging 11. 
He's hit or miss, I don't know. 

735
00:37:17,320 --> 00:37:20,200
Caruso's averaging 10 and then 
it starts falling off a Cliff. 

736
00:37:20,200 --> 00:37:23,000
Dort's averaging 8. 
Wiggins is averaging 6. 

737
00:37:23,080 --> 00:37:25,880
You know you're down to Carson. 
Wallace is averaging 5. 

738
00:37:25,880 --> 00:37:27,640
You know, you look at the 
Pacers, you have Siakam, 

739
00:37:27,640 --> 00:37:31,080
Halliburton, Top, and Turner. 
McConnell, Nemhart, Nesmith and 

740
00:37:31,080 --> 00:37:33,600
Matheran are all averaging 10 
plus in the Finals. 

741
00:37:34,280 --> 00:37:38,920
It's your, you know, this is 
where it's like it you, you know

742
00:37:38,920 --> 00:37:41,640
that a couple like even if 
Matheran's not having a game, 

743
00:37:41,640 --> 00:37:43,640
you know, McConnell will or 
Toppin will. 

744
00:37:43,640 --> 00:37:48,400
And if Toppin's night, Matheran 
might, Nesmith might it it, it's

745
00:37:48,400 --> 00:37:50,080
all there. 
I, I want to ask you a question 

746
00:37:50,080 --> 00:37:52,640
about Game 6 as we kind of look 
also to game seven. 

747
00:37:53,240 --> 00:37:57,000
I'm sitting there with my son in
the third quarter and talking to

748
00:37:57,000 --> 00:37:58,960
people around me. 
I want to pull up the, the the 

749
00:37:58,960 --> 00:38:01,080
game chart here. 
You know, as you get into the 

750
00:38:01,080 --> 00:38:04,080
third, it's, you know, the 
Pacers are definitely up. 

751
00:38:04,080 --> 00:38:06,320
They're up at one point by, you 
know, 20 points. 

752
00:38:06,600 --> 00:38:08,560
But I'm like, all right, we've 
seen enough basketball. 

753
00:38:08,560 --> 00:38:10,520
I keep telling my son like 
they're going to make a push, 

754
00:38:10,560 --> 00:38:12,280
like the Thunder are going to 
make a push. 

755
00:38:12,560 --> 00:38:15,000
Don't worry. 
The end of the quarter. 

756
00:38:15,520 --> 00:38:16,960
Worry as the case could be 
worry. 

757
00:38:17,160 --> 00:38:19,680
Like like I just don't like 
because my son's like he's 

758
00:38:19,680 --> 00:38:21,640
starting to get excited, which 
is awesome. 

759
00:38:21,880 --> 00:38:24,120
Like they're going to make a 
push and then, you know, 

760
00:38:24,200 --> 00:38:26,800
Shepherd hits the three and I'm 
like, oof, OK, this is this is a

761
00:38:26,800 --> 00:38:28,120
lot. 
But but I'm still like, they're 

762
00:38:28,120 --> 00:38:30,080
going to like they're going to 
put their starters back in and 

763
00:38:30,080 --> 00:38:31,880
make a push. 
They just took them out to rest 

764
00:38:31,880 --> 00:38:33,160
them. 
And then with like 10 minutes to

765
00:38:33,160 --> 00:38:36,360
go on the 4th, I'm like, I maybe
not. 

766
00:38:36,360 --> 00:38:38,480
And then with eight minutes to 
go, I'm just like, they're 

767
00:38:38,480 --> 00:38:40,080
they're done. 
Like they're not putting their I

768
00:38:40,080 --> 00:38:42,440
was shocked. 
I was honestly shocked that 

769
00:38:42,440 --> 00:38:43,840
they're you know, you're down 
30. 

770
00:38:43,840 --> 00:38:45,840
So I guess you're just like, all
right, we're done. 

771
00:38:45,840 --> 00:38:48,080
But like it allows the Pacers to
rest Halliburton. 

772
00:38:48,120 --> 00:38:51,760
Like I'm I'm just really 
surprised for a team that we've 

773
00:38:52,000 --> 00:38:54,800
heard about the entire season is
what a stud team is one of the 

774
00:38:54,800 --> 00:38:58,320
best teams in history. 
You know, 68 like to have the 

775
00:38:58,320 --> 00:39:00,720
balls just be like, we're going 
to sit our guys in the fourth 

776
00:39:00,720 --> 00:39:03,680
quarter. 
Like I, I, I, I was saying to 

777
00:39:03,680 --> 00:39:06,080
someone like, I just don't know 
how that affects you moving 

778
00:39:06,080 --> 00:39:08,120
forward. 
If this was the 97 bowls, I'd be

779
00:39:08,120 --> 00:39:10,040
like, all right, fine. 
Like you've earned the right to 

780
00:39:10,040 --> 00:39:11,680
just sit down. 
Like I trust you're going to 

781
00:39:11,680 --> 00:39:14,120
bring it in game seven. 
I don't know, man. 

782
00:39:14,240 --> 00:39:17,400
Like you just it it. 
It was shocking to me that they 

783
00:39:17,400 --> 00:39:19,840
didn't at least try one more 
counter punch. 

784
00:39:20,880 --> 00:39:24,800
Well, I think they would have if
it had been a 20 point margin, 

785
00:39:25,240 --> 00:39:28,760
but it was a 30 point margin 
with that Shepherd shot. 

786
00:39:28,760 --> 00:39:33,560
I mean that the, it's, it's one 
of those things where you do 

787
00:39:33,560 --> 00:39:37,760
have to some, to some degree, 
have a trigger inside where 

788
00:39:37,760 --> 00:39:39,880
you're like, OK, this is a lost 
cause. 

789
00:39:39,880 --> 00:39:45,120
And, and I, you know, keep in 
mind, like with what was it with

790
00:39:45,320 --> 00:39:50,480
436 left in the third SGA hits a
step back and it makes it a, a 

791
00:39:51,440 --> 00:39:54,040
19 point game. 
I believe it was, it was like it

792
00:39:54,040 --> 00:39:57,640
was 707657. 
It was actually 7. 

793
00:39:57,640 --> 00:40:00,600
Sorry, it was 7557 after the 
free throw. 

794
00:40:01,960 --> 00:40:05,040
So that's an 18 point margin. 
And I think if it's in that 18 

795
00:40:05,040 --> 00:40:08,040
to 20 point range, I think 
Oklahoma City's like, well, I 

796
00:40:08,040 --> 00:40:10,080
mean, we've got to, we got to 
keep going. 

797
00:40:10,080 --> 00:40:12,640
We got to keep pushing it. 
But then you look at what 

798
00:40:12,640 --> 00:40:16,400
happens after that and the 
Pacers increase the lead and 

799
00:40:16,400 --> 00:40:19,680
they get to the end of the 
quarter, it's 90 to 60 after 

800
00:40:19,680 --> 00:40:22,160
that, three from Shepherd. 
It's a 30 point margin. 

801
00:40:22,600 --> 00:40:25,320
The, the, the Thunder had shown 
nothing up to that point that 

802
00:40:25,320 --> 00:40:27,280
indicated that they were going 
to be able to make up that 

803
00:40:27,280 --> 00:40:30,000
deficit. 
Now, this is if this kind of 

804
00:40:30,000 --> 00:40:33,120
goes back, though, to something 
you said earlier about coaching 

805
00:40:33,120 --> 00:40:36,320
decisions and what you do and 
why you decide to do it. 

806
00:40:36,320 --> 00:40:40,120
And I think what's interesting 
about that decision by Mark 

807
00:40:40,120 --> 00:40:45,840
Daniel, you, you rest your 
starters because you're looking 

808
00:40:45,840 --> 00:40:47,360
at the game. 
You're like, the game's over. 

809
00:40:47,960 --> 00:40:50,040
We need to get the taste out of 
our mouth of this. 

810
00:40:50,080 --> 00:40:52,280
I don't want my guys that have 
to be out there chasing the ball

811
00:40:52,280 --> 00:40:53,600
around. 
We know that there's going to be

812
00:40:53,600 --> 00:40:55,040
a game seven. 
We're going to host it. 

813
00:40:55,040 --> 00:40:58,720
I'd rather rest the legs 'cause 
I think Scott, as I, I noted 

814
00:40:58,720 --> 00:41:00,920
this on Twitter and I think a 
lot of people noticed this as 

815
00:41:00,920 --> 00:41:02,360
well just from the shooting 
percentages. 

816
00:41:02,920 --> 00:41:05,960
Both of these teams are starting
to look what I would call 

817
00:41:05,960 --> 00:41:08,840
finals. 
Tired, you know, going back to 

818
00:41:08,840 --> 00:41:11,280
the marathon elements of this 
when you've been playing playoff

819
00:41:11,280 --> 00:41:14,960
basketball for two months, you 
know, with the Thunder having 

820
00:41:14,960 --> 00:41:20,600
gone to another Game 7 earlier 
on, they were not shooting the 

821
00:41:20,600 --> 00:41:23,440
ball particularly well. 
They outside of SGA, they did 

822
00:41:23,440 --> 00:41:26,400
not have the lift in the legs. 
You've got to try to steal some 

823
00:41:26,400 --> 00:41:29,480
rest. 
But the the payoff for that was 

824
00:41:29,480 --> 00:41:33,120
that the Pacers were then able 
to rest their starters pretty 

825
00:41:33,120 --> 00:41:35,560
quickly. 
I was actually surprised that 

826
00:41:35,560 --> 00:41:38,880
Rick left Siakam in as long as 
he did. 

827
00:41:38,880 --> 00:41:42,760
But even with that, Siakam only 
played 32 minutes, Nee Smith 

828
00:41:42,760 --> 00:41:47,760
played 25, Halliburton played 
23, you know, Nemhard played 31.

829
00:41:47,760 --> 00:41:51,160
I mean, these are pretty low 
numbers for, you know, but but 

830
00:41:51,160 --> 00:41:53,560
it's these are more along the 
lines of what the Pacers are 

831
00:41:53,560 --> 00:41:56,680
used to doing. 
And meanwhile, SGA ended up 

832
00:41:56,680 --> 00:42:00,360
playing, you know, 31 minutes 
even with being benched the 

833
00:42:00,360 --> 00:42:03,480
entire fourth quarter. 
So I was surprised. 

834
00:42:03,480 --> 00:42:05,960
But I also think it was just one
of those we have to throw in the

835
00:42:05,960 --> 00:42:08,840
towel here because we have to 
preserve something for Sunday. 

836
00:42:09,680 --> 00:42:13,560
I but this is kind of where you 
and I were talking about this a 

837
00:42:13,560 --> 00:42:17,400
little bit earlier. 
What does that do mentally for 

838
00:42:17,400 --> 00:42:20,000
your team? 
You know, the I don't know 

839
00:42:20,000 --> 00:42:25,040
exactly how the Thunder react to
getting blown out and 

840
00:42:25,040 --> 00:42:27,760
effectively losing the game by 
30, even though they actually 

841
00:42:27,760 --> 00:42:31,320
only lost the game by by what, 
17 or 18 point? 

842
00:42:32,680 --> 00:42:36,640
Well, it doesn't, you know, but 
the but the mental blow of doing

843
00:42:36,640 --> 00:42:39,680
that, knowing you didn't come 
out ready to play, knowing you 

844
00:42:39,680 --> 00:42:43,000
got out competed, yes, you know,
you're going back home. 

845
00:42:43,280 --> 00:42:45,920
But as we heard Stephen A Smith 
talk about, this is a dangerous 

846
00:42:45,920 --> 00:42:50,560
game to be playing in game six 
of the Finals against the team 

847
00:42:50,720 --> 00:42:53,800
that you really, despite what 
people thought, haven't been 

848
00:42:53,800 --> 00:42:57,240
able to actually fully figure 
out and get under your thumb. 

849
00:42:57,240 --> 00:43:00,680
Every time that you do, the 
Pacers seem to scramble out of 

850
00:43:00,680 --> 00:43:02,520
it and figure out a new way to 
bother you. 

851
00:43:02,800 --> 00:43:04,680
It's just a it's a real dice 
roll. 

852
00:43:06,120 --> 00:43:08,480
Also, the Pacers, they just 
stared into the abyss. 

853
00:43:08,480 --> 00:43:11,480
I mean, they just played a game 
at tip off where it's like if we

854
00:43:11,480 --> 00:43:13,760
lose, we're going home. 
And the Thunder haven't done 

855
00:43:13,760 --> 00:43:15,160
that yet. 
They're about to. 

856
00:43:15,160 --> 00:43:17,680
And so if you're the Pacers, 
it's like your flight today to 

857
00:43:17,680 --> 00:43:19,240
Oklahoma City is great. 
It's like, all right, we just 

858
00:43:19,240 --> 00:43:20,880
got to do what we got to do. 
Like we know what we got to do. 

859
00:43:20,880 --> 00:43:24,760
There's no second guessing it 
it, you know, if at least the 

860
00:43:24,760 --> 00:43:27,520
Thunder had come back and maybe 
cut it to within 12 and done 

861
00:43:27,520 --> 00:43:29,000
some things where it's like 
shoot, man, like they were 

862
00:43:29,000 --> 00:43:31,440
really on a run there. 
If we, you know, no, you just 

863
00:43:31,440 --> 00:43:33,000
you go in yours. 
Like we, we know what we got to 

864
00:43:33,000 --> 00:43:34,320
do. 
We have three more things up our

865
00:43:34,320 --> 00:43:35,280
sleeves. 
We have Carlisle. 

866
00:43:35,280 --> 00:43:38,760
Like, I don't know the Thunder. 
You know, I was thinking this 

867
00:43:38,760 --> 00:43:40,280
too. 
You know, at this point you're 

868
00:43:40,280 --> 00:43:42,560
kind of done with moves. 
Like there's no more massive 

869
00:43:42,560 --> 00:43:44,680
moves that you know, coaches are
going to make adjustments, but 

870
00:43:44,680 --> 00:43:47,000
it's like you've you've not say 
they've made all the 

871
00:43:47,000 --> 00:43:48,520
adjustments. 
They know each other. 

872
00:43:48,840 --> 00:43:51,840
It's they're all athletically 
they they know what they can do.

873
00:43:51,840 --> 00:43:53,280
It's like this is a mental game 
now. 

874
00:43:53,600 --> 00:43:55,560
And that's what I go to is the 
Thunder. 

875
00:43:55,560 --> 00:43:57,840
You're flying back and sure 
you're like, oh, we got we got 

876
00:43:57,840 --> 00:43:58,880
the game at home. 
It's all that. 

877
00:43:58,880 --> 00:44:01,320
But it's like until that game 
tips off. 

878
00:44:01,680 --> 00:44:04,400
Then it's you're thinking like 
this is we could lose and it's 

879
00:44:04,400 --> 00:44:07,520
all over. 
And you've not had that that 

880
00:44:07,520 --> 00:44:09,480
pressure the Pacers have already
had. 

881
00:44:10,200 --> 00:44:13,080
Is there a moment in Game 7 
where if it's not going great 

882
00:44:13,080 --> 00:44:14,880
and you're just like, Oh my God,
we did. 

883
00:44:14,920 --> 00:44:16,920
Did we blow our chance 2 days 
ago? 

884
00:44:16,920 --> 00:44:19,920
And then suddenly you give up. 
You know, there's another Siakam

885
00:44:19,920 --> 00:44:22,560
3. 
It's just like I, I, I wonder if

886
00:44:22,560 --> 00:44:25,520
the Pacers are able to just keep
game seven close, which history 

887
00:44:25,520 --> 00:44:28,480
says it will be. 
Most game sevens are ugly Betty 

888
00:44:28,480 --> 00:44:32,160
under Betty under are normally 
just ugly affairs. 

889
00:44:32,400 --> 00:44:35,760
And it's very tight. 
You know, I wonder if, if 

890
00:44:36,000 --> 00:44:38,800
mentally this hits this team 
where it's like, man, they, they

891
00:44:38,800 --> 00:44:42,480
hit that wall and they got too 
close and it's like they like, 

892
00:44:42,480 --> 00:44:44,320
shoot, we should have grabbed it
2 days ago. 

893
00:44:44,880 --> 00:44:47,560
I, I don't know, because this 
is, this is definitely a young 

894
00:44:47,560 --> 00:44:50,520
team that, you know, they don't 
have the experience of a coach 

895
00:44:50,520 --> 00:44:52,520
and a player winning a title 
like the Pacers do. 

896
00:44:53,000 --> 00:44:55,200
True. 
I mean, the thing I will say, 

897
00:44:55,200 --> 00:44:58,560
and This is why this game is 
people have asked like, who's 

898
00:44:58,560 --> 00:45:00,880
going to win Game 7? 
Like it's impossible to call 

899
00:45:00,880 --> 00:45:04,040
because there's just so many 
variables that you will not be 

900
00:45:04,040 --> 00:45:06,880
able to figure out in this 
process because what you just 

901
00:45:06,880 --> 00:45:09,720
described. 
You know, when you take that gut

902
00:45:09,720 --> 00:45:13,160
punch after, you know, you get 
you get boat raced in this game,

903
00:45:13,240 --> 00:45:17,280
you're in a position where you 
now you got to go back and 

904
00:45:17,280 --> 00:45:20,440
reconjure the energy. 
Well, the Pacers had that same 

905
00:45:20,440 --> 00:45:24,440
experience in game 4, which led 
into game five and everybody was

906
00:45:24,440 --> 00:45:25,560
like, well, they're dead in the 
water. 

907
00:45:25,560 --> 00:45:26,840
And then they were able to come 
back. 

908
00:45:26,840 --> 00:45:29,800
So you know, these things, these
switches get flipped. 

909
00:45:30,320 --> 00:45:34,560
The the Thunder youth thing is 
interesting because what has 

910
00:45:34,560 --> 00:45:38,720
also been an abiding thing for 
them as a team has been how 

911
00:45:38,720 --> 00:45:41,960
steady they've been and how very
Workman like they've been. 

912
00:45:42,200 --> 00:45:43,600
Neutral is their is their 
slogan. 

913
00:45:43,760 --> 00:45:46,400
Right. 
And so will they be able to 

914
00:45:46,400 --> 00:45:49,280
return to neutral? 
And this is always the big 

915
00:45:49,280 --> 00:45:52,520
question mark. 
I mean, to me it, it is a mental

916
00:45:52,520 --> 00:45:54,520
game. 
But I also think to some degree 

917
00:45:54,520 --> 00:45:57,240
what you have to think about 
with with Oklahoma City in 

918
00:45:57,240 --> 00:46:01,040
particular is it's it's mental, 
but a lot of it is also just 

919
00:46:01,040 --> 00:46:04,520
performance. 
And as you mentioned, they've 

920
00:46:04,520 --> 00:46:06,920
essentially turned into a two 
man team. 

921
00:46:07,640 --> 00:46:11,160
They are Shay Gilgeous Alexander
and Jalen Williams. 

922
00:46:11,400 --> 00:46:15,080
And that is not what they were 
in the regular season. 

923
00:46:15,080 --> 00:46:19,360
In the regular season, Chet 
Holmgren was a the the third 

924
00:46:19,360 --> 00:46:22,760
star, like the guy who could 
contribute consistently and Lou 

925
00:46:22,760 --> 00:46:27,240
Dort would play at a high 
defensive level and you couldn't

926
00:46:27,240 --> 00:46:29,240
exploit him. 
And he was just this cheat code 

927
00:46:29,240 --> 00:46:33,240
defensively. 
And Isaiah Hartenstein was, you 

928
00:46:33,240 --> 00:46:36,200
know, able to contribute both 
offensively and defensively. 

929
00:46:36,200 --> 00:46:39,960
And I mean, Hartenstein had 
another game where he was just 

930
00:46:40,680 --> 00:46:43,160
non factor. 
Chet Holmgren had another game 

931
00:46:43,440 --> 00:46:46,680
where not only was he a non 
factor, you know, like 

932
00:46:46,800 --> 00:46:51,080
defensively, he was a non factor
offensively. 2 for 9 from the 

933
00:46:51,080 --> 00:46:54,560
field O for three from three had
four points, had two turnovers, 

934
00:46:55,600 --> 00:46:59,400
got blocked at the three-point 
line by Miles Turner cleanly 

935
00:46:59,560 --> 00:47:03,160
again again. 
I I mean, so if I'm the Thunder,

936
00:47:03,480 --> 00:47:09,560
what bothers me about this game 
is of Game 7 is which of your 

937
00:47:09,560 --> 00:47:12,000
guys are going to conjure up the
big game? 

938
00:47:12,000 --> 00:47:15,920
I mean, Alex Caruso in game four
goes off, scores a ton of 

939
00:47:15,920 --> 00:47:19,120
points, was scoreless in this 
game in 22 minutes. 

940
00:47:19,840 --> 00:47:23,400
Jalen Williams scored 40 points 
in game five. 

941
00:47:23,800 --> 00:47:27,120
And as I'm sure everybody's 
heard by this point was -40 and 

942
00:47:27,120 --> 00:47:31,400
plus minus in this game, Like 
that's inconceivable almost, 

943
00:47:31,560 --> 00:47:33,800
Scott, to to go through that 
much of A swing. 

944
00:47:34,360 --> 00:47:37,600
So when you look at that and 
then you look at the Pacers and 

945
00:47:37,600 --> 00:47:40,320
you say to yourself, well, you 
know, the thing about the Pacers

946
00:47:40,320 --> 00:47:43,000
is you rattle off those eight 
guys in double figures. 

947
00:47:43,000 --> 00:47:46,120
They also have nobody averaging 
20 plus points a game. 

948
00:47:46,880 --> 00:47:52,720
And the stat I saw earlier, the 
last NBA champion to win without

949
00:47:52,720 --> 00:47:55,320
anybody averaging 20 points per 
game, You want to guess who it 

950
00:47:55,320 --> 00:47:57,680
was? 
OK. 

951
00:47:57,960 --> 00:48:02,080
That's a great question. 
It is I'm not going to say a 

952
00:48:02,080 --> 00:48:04,480
Kobe team. 
I would, I would I would not 

953
00:48:04,480 --> 00:48:06,240
have. 
I as soon as I saw what the 

954
00:48:06,240 --> 00:48:08,560
answer was, I was like, Oh, of 
course I would have not have 

955
00:48:08,560 --> 00:48:10,120
gotten it. 
Off the top of my head. 

956
00:48:10,320 --> 00:48:12,880
I my guess would be the O 4 
Pistons. 

957
00:48:13,160 --> 00:48:17,760
Like that was a right, right 
franchise, wrong year. 

958
00:48:17,760 --> 00:48:20,160
It was actually the 1990 
Pistons. 

959
00:48:21,320 --> 00:48:25,160
If you remember the the old 
heads in the audience, if you 

960
00:48:25,160 --> 00:48:27,880
remember those Pistons, the Bad 
Boys Pistons, they all the the 

961
00:48:27,880 --> 00:48:32,080
focus is on the Bad Boys part. 
But the thing about that team 

962
00:48:32,080 --> 00:48:36,280
that was so unique was that it 
really they had a generational 

963
00:48:36,280 --> 00:48:38,560
point guard, obviously, and 
Isaiah Thomas, but that was not 

964
00:48:38,560 --> 00:48:41,080
a team that had a dedicated 
score. 

965
00:48:41,360 --> 00:48:46,680
If you if you squint, you can 
kind of see a similar make up in

966
00:48:46,680 --> 00:48:49,880
terms of what you've got going 
on with this Pacers team this 

967
00:48:49,880 --> 00:48:50,920
year. 
Because, you know, back to the 

968
00:48:50,920 --> 00:48:54,200
Joe Dumars as your shooting 
guard, you had Bill Lane beer 

969
00:48:54,480 --> 00:48:57,440
and James Edwards in the post 
You had was like. 

970
00:48:57,840 --> 00:49:00,240
Vinny Johnson of that team. 
Basically, yes, you know, he's 

971
00:49:00,280 --> 00:49:03,840
kind of in the microwave mode. 
They bring Mark Aguire in who's 

972
00:49:03,840 --> 00:49:07,600
kind of in that Nemhard mode. 
I mean, there's and then now 

973
00:49:07,600 --> 00:49:10,640
that team played, it was a much 
different era of the NBA, but. 

974
00:49:10,920 --> 00:49:13,760
There's no there's no lamb beer.
You just can't comp lamb beer. 

975
00:49:13,960 --> 00:49:15,920
You know, and everybody looks at
Isaiah and they're like, well, 

976
00:49:15,920 --> 00:49:18,800
you know, all time 50 greatest 
players and stuff like that. 

977
00:49:18,800 --> 00:49:21,600
Twelve time All Star, whatever 
it was, he was clearly a player 

978
00:49:21,600 --> 00:49:23,880
at a higher level than anybody 
the Pacers have, but they didn't

979
00:49:23,880 --> 00:49:27,960
rely on Isaiah for everything 
like a lot of these other teams 

980
00:49:27,960 --> 00:49:29,480
have. 
And so I do think that that's an

981
00:49:29,480 --> 00:49:31,760
interesting aspect as you go 
into Game 7. 

982
00:49:32,640 --> 00:49:37,600
The the the Thunder have to get 
a great a great game out of SGA.

983
00:49:37,800 --> 00:49:40,480
They have to get a great game 
out of Jalen Williams. 

984
00:49:40,480 --> 00:49:43,800
They have to get a great game, 
or at least a good game out of 

985
00:49:43,800 --> 00:49:47,560
at least two other players 
because it's too much of A 

986
00:49:47,560 --> 00:49:51,640
possession load to go through a 
48 minute or more basketball 

987
00:49:51,640 --> 00:49:56,080
game, relying entirely on SGA 
and Jalen Williams to do all of 

988
00:49:56,080 --> 00:49:57,960
the scoring. 
And that's essentially what they

989
00:49:57,960 --> 00:50:00,600
put themselves in the position 
of doing over the court. 

990
00:50:00,600 --> 00:50:02,240
That what they did, at least in 
Game 6. 

991
00:50:02,400 --> 00:50:06,400
So the, the thing that concerns 
me, but I'll also flip it as a 

992
00:50:06,400 --> 00:50:09,000
positive is I, I, I, I agree 
with you. 

993
00:50:09,400 --> 00:50:11,920
I would also say when you look 
at like the history of game 

994
00:50:11,920 --> 00:50:14,440
sevens in the NBA, which they're
they're what's awesome is there 

995
00:50:14,440 --> 00:50:17,160
haven't been a lot like this is 
really I want to finish with 

996
00:50:17,160 --> 00:50:20,480
like a big picture Pacers talk, 
but this is this is cool stuff. 

997
00:50:20,480 --> 00:50:24,320
I mean, just making a Game 7. 
There's been five, I think since

998
00:50:24,320 --> 00:50:26,640
the ABA merger. 
There's there's not a lot of 

999
00:50:26,640 --> 00:50:28,880
Game 7. 
This is a big deal. 

1000
00:50:28,880 --> 00:50:33,480
Obviously you assume that, you 
know, Shay and Jalen are in, you

1001
00:50:33,480 --> 00:50:37,240
know, 1 camp for the for the the
Thunder and Siakam and 

1002
00:50:37,240 --> 00:50:39,640
Halliburton are in the other for
the Pacers, where you they're 

1003
00:50:39,640 --> 00:50:41,080
your stars. 
You're probably going to get 

1004
00:50:41,080 --> 00:50:42,840
that out of them. 
Although Halliburton sometimes 

1005
00:50:42,840 --> 00:50:45,560
has the he's got to have at 
least a relatively aggressive 

1006
00:50:45,560 --> 00:50:48,200
Halliburton game. 
The thing is, normally these 

1007
00:50:48,200 --> 00:50:51,680
Finals games also get swung by 
just a role player like somebody

1008
00:50:52,000 --> 00:50:53,960
is going to do something 
abnormal. 

1009
00:50:53,960 --> 00:50:55,920
And is that Wiggins hitting a 
bunch of threes? 

1010
00:50:55,920 --> 00:50:57,960
Is that Dort hitting a bunch of 
threes? 

1011
00:50:57,960 --> 00:51:00,640
You know, unfortunately, 
normally the role players are 

1012
00:51:00,640 --> 00:51:03,200
going to play better at home, 
which is what concerns me. 

1013
00:51:03,800 --> 00:51:08,880
The flip side is for the Pacers,
you have a history of Naismith 

1014
00:51:08,880 --> 00:51:12,120
got red hot against the Knicks 
on the road. 

1015
00:51:12,120 --> 00:51:15,800
You had a role player just go 
nuclear to get you a game there.

1016
00:51:15,800 --> 00:51:19,240
It wasn't a Game 7, but you did 
have last year, oddly, again in 

1017
00:51:19,240 --> 00:51:21,280
the Garden, that the place no 
one can win where the refs are 

1018
00:51:21,280 --> 00:51:23,520
going to screw you. 
You know, the Pacers shot the 

1019
00:51:23,520 --> 00:51:26,200
lights out. 
Turner had a phenomenal game 

1020
00:51:26,560 --> 00:51:28,440
against the Knicks last year in 
Game 7. 

1021
00:51:28,920 --> 00:51:31,840
He's probably a little more than
role player, but you know, I, I 

1022
00:51:31,840 --> 00:51:34,680
will say that I'm on the record 
that you're going to have one of

1023
00:51:34,680 --> 00:51:39,160
those kind of off the star 
marquee guys go nuts. 

1024
00:51:39,480 --> 00:51:41,280
That'll probably swing this 
game. 

1025
00:51:42,200 --> 00:51:45,480
You know, the the Pacers have a 
history of doing it on the road.

1026
00:51:45,760 --> 00:51:48,920
Unfortunately the history is 
normally those guys are are 

1027
00:51:48,920 --> 00:51:51,560
normally from the home team 
where it happens, which is what 

1028
00:51:51,560 --> 00:51:54,560
concerns me. 
I want to show a couple of shot 

1029
00:51:54,560 --> 00:51:57,640
charts if that's OK with you 
from the series. 

1030
00:51:59,840 --> 00:52:03,040
Scott has vetoed my shots. 
That'll be good. 

1031
00:52:03,200 --> 00:52:04,960
Let me see if I can actually get
this. 

1032
00:52:05,400 --> 00:52:08,240
This is one that I loaded just 
just real quick like go ahead 

1033
00:52:08,480 --> 00:52:11,560
shows just how you know for all 
the talk. 

1034
00:52:11,720 --> 00:52:14,440
It's so funny because it's like 
the Thunder when they when they 

1035
00:52:14,440 --> 00:52:16,360
lose like man, they're playing 
bad and it's like man, the 

1036
00:52:16,360 --> 00:52:18,680
thunders defense like having 
submissions or maybe the Pacers 

1037
00:52:18,680 --> 00:52:20,680
offense is good, but maybe the 
Pacers are good. 

1038
00:52:20,880 --> 00:52:22,840
You look at this stat and this 
is off NBA. 

1039
00:52:22,840 --> 00:52:25,400
You can just see basically it 
goes through points, rebounds, 

1040
00:52:25,400 --> 00:52:27,960
assists, steals, blocks, 
turnovers, field goal 

1041
00:52:27,960 --> 00:52:29,960
percentage, 3 point possessions,
free throw percentage. 

1042
00:52:30,440 --> 00:52:31,600
It's basically a dead heat. 
It's. 

1043
00:52:31,680 --> 00:52:34,680
Pretty dark even, yeah. 
There's a little variance here 

1044
00:52:34,680 --> 00:52:36,800
and there, but there's nothing 
that's like, wow, they're really

1045
00:52:37,080 --> 00:52:39,480
like, we have 6 blocks, they 
have 5.5. 

1046
00:52:39,480 --> 00:52:43,720
Let's let's discuss your 
thoughts to all the talk of what

1047
00:52:43,720 --> 00:52:45,960
a generationally good team the 
Thunder are. 

1048
00:52:45,960 --> 00:52:48,200
And like, is this one of the top
three teams of all time? 

1049
00:52:48,200 --> 00:52:51,640
It's like the the the Pacers 
can't just be like, well, you 

1050
00:52:51,640 --> 00:52:54,840
got lucky with the game like we 
have played with them. 

1051
00:52:54,840 --> 00:52:58,360
And to your earlier point, after
six games, it's a + 5. 

1052
00:52:58,360 --> 00:53:02,040
Like this is basically as dead 
heat a finals as you're ever 

1053
00:53:02,040 --> 00:53:03,400
going to get. 
Go ahead. 

1054
00:53:03,400 --> 00:53:04,280
Sorry. 
Yeah, I know. 

1055
00:53:04,280 --> 00:53:06,920
I mean all all of that and and 
more. 

1056
00:53:07,000 --> 00:53:10,760
It's it's a great point. 
Let me let me get these shot 

1057
00:53:10,760 --> 00:53:12,040
charts. 
I'm going to zoom in a little 

1058
00:53:12,040 --> 00:53:14,280
bit because there's some 
fascinating things I've noticed 

1059
00:53:14,680 --> 00:53:17,240
in the way these teams are 
playing with, you know, against 

1060
00:53:17,240 --> 00:53:18,600
each other. 
Oh, hold on, Let me Scroll down 

1061
00:53:18,600 --> 00:53:23,720
a little bit more here. 
OK, so this is the Oklahoma City

1062
00:53:24,160 --> 00:53:26,320
shot chart for the entire 
series. 

1063
00:53:26,320 --> 00:53:29,440
And, and what I want to note is 
if you go down and look at like 

1064
00:53:29,440 --> 00:53:32,120
field goal percentage versus 
league average, like the bluer 

1065
00:53:32,120 --> 00:53:35,240
it gets, the less good it is, 
relatively speaking. 

1066
00:53:35,240 --> 00:53:39,200
So the Thunder are they're 
they're fairly hot in the corner

1067
00:53:39,200 --> 00:53:42,280
3 on the right side, although 
they haven't taken terribly many

1068
00:53:42,280 --> 00:53:44,440
of those. 
They're not shooting corner 

1069
00:53:44,440 --> 00:53:46,240
threes particularly well from 
the left side. 

1070
00:53:46,640 --> 00:53:51,080
They are struggling down low in 
terms of their shooting 

1071
00:53:51,080 --> 00:53:54,240
percentages. 
And what's interesting is only 

1072
00:53:54,240 --> 00:53:58,440
61% immediately around the 
basket, only 38% in the paint 

1073
00:53:58,800 --> 00:54:01,000
and then only 38% in the mid 
range. 

1074
00:54:01,000 --> 00:54:03,320
And that's really where this 
team is is supposed to thrive. 

1075
00:54:03,560 --> 00:54:06,440
If you look at some of their 
individual players, like let's 

1076
00:54:06,440 --> 00:54:09,720
look at Chet, Chet has been 
horrific all over the place. 

1077
00:54:09,720 --> 00:54:16,160
Like Chet, I know Chet is 2 for 
17 from three. 

1078
00:54:16,480 --> 00:54:21,160
He is 17 for 32 immediately 
around the basket. 

1079
00:54:21,160 --> 00:54:26,040
This is a 7 foot one guy who 
like thrives in that area and 

1080
00:54:26,040 --> 00:54:28,640
he's not been any better in the 
paint or in the mid range. 

1081
00:54:28,640 --> 00:54:32,160
I mean, that is a really 
impressive defensive performance

1082
00:54:32,160 --> 00:54:34,120
by Indiana against him for the 
whole series. 

1083
00:54:34,520 --> 00:54:38,440
Jalen Williams is interesting. 
Williams has been great around 

1084
00:54:38,520 --> 00:54:40,800
like in the paint, he's he's 
71%. 

1085
00:54:40,880 --> 00:54:44,080
But if you'll notice, what did 
the Pacers do not in the paint 

1086
00:54:44,080 --> 00:54:46,960
immediately around the basket? 
What did they do in last night's

1087
00:54:46,960 --> 00:54:48,640
game? 
They just closed all that off 

1088
00:54:48,680 --> 00:54:49,960
They. 
Closed it all off and they 

1089
00:54:49,960 --> 00:54:52,120
pushed him out a little bit. 
If you get him away from 

1090
00:54:52,120 --> 00:54:54,520
immediately around the basket, 
if you don't let him close, if 

1091
00:54:54,520 --> 00:54:58,240
you make him shoot or you know, 
Drifters, leaners, whatever, 

1092
00:54:58,640 --> 00:55:03,600
he's shooting 34.8% from the 
paint, he's shooting 30.4% from 

1093
00:55:04,040 --> 00:55:06,200
the mid range. 
That's that. 

1094
00:55:06,400 --> 00:55:08,880
I mean that that is going to be 
hard for them to overcome if 

1095
00:55:08,880 --> 00:55:12,160
they can't figure it out. 
If you look at SGA, he's been 

1096
00:55:12,800 --> 00:55:17,920
red hot around the basket. 
He's been red hot from the mid 

1097
00:55:17,920 --> 00:55:22,600
range, but he's only 5 for 20 
from three, and he's only 43.2 

1098
00:55:22,600 --> 00:55:25,000
where he's in the paint but not 
at the basket. 

1099
00:55:25,800 --> 00:55:29,560
And again, if you look at what 
they did yesterday, they kind of

1100
00:55:29,560 --> 00:55:32,120
baited him into going One 
Direction. 

1101
00:55:32,520 --> 00:55:35,880
And yeah, he picked up some 
bogus foul calls, but he also 

1102
00:55:35,880 --> 00:55:38,440
put a bunch of shots up that 
didn't go in, which was a bit of

1103
00:55:38,440 --> 00:55:41,880
a surprise given how good of a 
shooter he's been so far in this

1104
00:55:41,880 --> 00:55:44,760
series. 
Anything from that stick out to 

1105
00:55:44,760 --> 00:55:45,560
you? 
I just thought some of that 

1106
00:55:45,560 --> 00:55:47,240
stuff was really fascinating to 
look at. 

1107
00:55:47,400 --> 00:55:50,160
No, it is. 
It's it's amazing how bad Chet 

1108
00:55:50,160 --> 00:55:51,440
has been. 
Like when you look at that, like

1109
00:55:51,440 --> 00:55:53,200
I was going through all the 
other plays, I was joking. 

1110
00:55:53,200 --> 00:55:55,640
Like I'll do Hartenstein and 
even Hartenstein, it's a very 

1111
00:55:55,640 --> 00:55:59,240
small sample size, but it's red 
and green and like it's pretty 

1112
00:55:59,240 --> 00:56:01,960
good. 
And, and Chet is just, yeah, 

1113
00:56:01,960 --> 00:56:04,720
it's, it's not good. 
The other one that I'll mention 

1114
00:56:04,720 --> 00:56:08,320
here is this is Logan's Dort, 
who does not shoot very much and

1115
00:56:08,320 --> 00:56:12,600
he is essentially become like a 
safety valve 3 point shooter on 

1116
00:56:12,600 --> 00:56:15,320
kick outs. 
And the reason I bring this up 

1117
00:56:15,320 --> 00:56:18,440
is he's been well above average 
from all of the three-point 

1118
00:56:18,440 --> 00:56:21,680
zones. 
However, I'll note that that is 

1119
00:56:21,680 --> 00:56:24,760
important when you think about 
how badly he shot from three in 

1120
00:56:24,760 --> 00:56:27,600
game six. 
Could we be seeing him regress 

1121
00:56:27,600 --> 00:56:31,000
back to the mean as this series 
goes further on? 

1122
00:56:31,280 --> 00:56:34,440
If that's no longer a reliable 
weapon for Oklahoma City, that 

1123
00:56:34,440 --> 00:56:36,560
takes a big part of their 
arsenal out. 

1124
00:56:36,560 --> 00:56:39,640
That helped to take some 
defensive pressure off of SGA 

1125
00:56:39,640 --> 00:56:41,720
and Jalen Williams. 
Could you? 

1126
00:56:41,720 --> 00:56:43,800
Are you going to do the Pacers? 
Yes, I'm going to go to the 

1127
00:56:43,800 --> 00:56:45,320
Pacers next. 
All right, good. 

1128
00:56:45,600 --> 00:56:47,680
So this is the entire Pacers 
roster I hope. 

1129
00:56:48,480 --> 00:56:51,880
You hit, it's just insane. 
So they are shooting from the 

1130
00:56:51,880 --> 00:56:55,880
right corner, three, they are 
shooting 52.6%. 

1131
00:56:55,880 --> 00:57:00,440
Twenty of 38, which I mean 
they're shooting well from the 

1132
00:57:00,440 --> 00:57:03,400
left corner. 
They're 10 for 27 there, you 

1133
00:57:03,400 --> 00:57:05,320
know, But what's fascinating 
about this team is they're not 

1134
00:57:05,320 --> 00:57:08,240
finishing well around the rim. 
They're only at 61%. 

1135
00:57:08,240 --> 00:57:09,760
It's actually under league 
average. 

1136
00:57:10,000 --> 00:57:14,080
But they're mid range, which 
long time Crimson cast fans will

1137
00:57:14,080 --> 00:57:16,760
laugh at this, but this has been
where the Pacers have feasted 

1138
00:57:16,760 --> 00:57:18,480
throughout the course of this 
series. 

1139
00:57:18,760 --> 00:57:24,720
They're shooting 47% from the 
mid range and it has that really

1140
00:57:24,720 --> 00:57:27,560
saved them in several of these 
games when the threes haven't 

1141
00:57:27,560 --> 00:57:29,760
been going in and they can't 
really finish around the rim 

1142
00:57:29,760 --> 00:57:32,800
because of the Thunder's size. 
It's been fascinating watching 

1143
00:57:32,800 --> 00:57:36,240
them kind of mold their offense 
around knowing that they can get

1144
00:57:36,240 --> 00:57:38,960
those shots and into their 
credit, making them happen. 

1145
00:57:39,560 --> 00:57:41,040
Have you? 
Are you rethinking? 

1146
00:57:41,040 --> 00:57:43,400
The the Mike Woodson offense now
not you. 

1147
00:57:44,400 --> 00:57:46,920
You know, if Mike Woodson had 
this array of players playing 

1148
00:57:46,920 --> 00:57:49,240
for him in Indiana, yeah, you 
know, knock yourself out. 

1149
00:57:50,320 --> 00:57:52,040
The mid range never went out of 
vogue. 

1150
00:57:52,040 --> 00:57:54,320
It was just that the most people
don't have the players to play 

1151
00:57:54,320 --> 00:57:55,760
it. 
Go to TJ McConnell. 

1152
00:57:55,760 --> 00:57:58,240
It's just insane. 
Yeah, McConnell's nuts. 

1153
00:57:58,240 --> 00:58:03,080
McConnell is. 
It's just it's insane. 5 for 

1154
00:58:03,080 --> 00:58:06,920
eight from the mid range, 12 for
25 from the paint, you know, and

1155
00:58:06,920 --> 00:58:12,640
then he's 3 for four from three 
and has just been a guy that you

1156
00:58:12,720 --> 00:58:14,920
you rely on in a bunch of 
different spots there. 

1157
00:58:14,920 --> 00:58:17,680
And it's been really, really 
effective to see Pascal Siakam 

1158
00:58:17,680 --> 00:58:20,840
has been the one guy that's 
really finished effectively down

1159
00:58:20,840 --> 00:58:24,920
low if you look at Obi Toppin. 
You know his. 

1160
00:58:24,920 --> 00:58:28,400
Performance from three, he's 9 
for 23 from kind of straight 

1161
00:58:28,400 --> 00:58:31,920
away he's 3 for five in the left
corner, you know, and that's 

1162
00:58:31,920 --> 00:58:35,760
where he's really made some hay.
You compare it with Miles 

1163
00:58:35,760 --> 00:58:37,240
Turner. 
Miles Turner is. 

1164
00:58:37,240 --> 00:58:40,640
One for 18, which is so weird 
'cause that's his shot. 

1165
00:58:40,640 --> 00:58:44,280
The top of the key 3 has been 
his shot his whole career and 

1166
00:58:44,280 --> 00:58:48,800
it, it, it, he's the one that I 
just, you know, if he hits a 

1167
00:58:48,800 --> 00:58:52,400
couple of threes in game 4, is 
this series over? 

1168
00:58:52,760 --> 00:58:55,160
You know, if he, if he's 
shooting this way against the 

1169
00:58:55,160 --> 00:58:58,920
Bucks, are we even here? 
I mean it's, it's wild where 

1170
00:58:58,920 --> 00:59:01,880
he's gone off and, and his 
shots, it's not because of 

1171
00:59:01,880 --> 00:59:03,400
defense. 
Those are open shots. 

1172
00:59:03,400 --> 00:59:07,000
I just, I think he is in a in 
his head slump. 

1173
00:59:07,200 --> 00:59:09,640
You would think it he's going to
get out of it, but I've been 

1174
00:59:09,640 --> 00:59:11,200
thinking that for like 3 games 
now. 

1175
00:59:11,560 --> 00:59:12,360
Right. 
That's the thing. 

1176
00:59:12,360 --> 00:59:15,440
It almost feels like he's in an 
offensive tailspin. 

1177
00:59:15,440 --> 00:59:18,720
I mean, one for 18 on shots he's
taking his whole career. 

1178
00:59:18,720 --> 00:59:21,440
It's it's just. 
I was joking in the fourth 

1179
00:59:21,440 --> 00:59:23,840
quarter, like just put him in 
and run some actions for him 

1180
00:59:24,080 --> 00:59:27,320
just to get him some looks like 
against crappy backup guys. 

1181
00:59:27,320 --> 00:59:29,200
Just can you get him feeling 
better? 

1182
00:59:29,400 --> 00:59:30,720
Yeah. 
I mean, it's it's going to be 

1183
00:59:30,720 --> 00:59:33,960
interesting to see what happens 
with him because again, it's one

1184
00:59:33,960 --> 00:59:38,360
of those things where it doesn't
make sense that the Pacers would

1185
00:59:38,360 --> 00:59:42,040
be even in this series given how
little they've. 

1186
00:59:42,040 --> 00:59:44,840
Gotten out of Miles Turner 
offensively, Like you go through

1187
00:59:44,840 --> 00:59:47,760
and look at what he has 
contributed, you know, over the 

1188
00:59:47,760 --> 00:59:51,800
course of the series, he is he's
he's averaging 11 points per 

1189
00:59:51,800 --> 00:59:55,360
game. 
But that is very misleading in 

1190
00:59:55,360 --> 00:59:56,560
terms of like he's shooting 
back. 

1191
00:59:56,840 --> 01:00:00,080
Of 11, yeah. 
Yeah, he's shooting 36.8% from 

1192
01:00:00,080 --> 01:00:05,000
the field, 20% from three, you 
know, and, and where he's, where

1193
01:00:05,000 --> 01:00:09,640
he's really made his most 
contributions is he's, he's 

1194
01:00:09,640 --> 01:00:12,880
rebounded the ball fairly well, 
but he's gotten out rebounded 

1195
01:00:12,880 --> 01:00:18,480
by, by multiple guards. 
Is does he have one game in him 

1196
01:00:18,480 --> 01:00:21,720
that's at least like what his 
normal because he's shooting 

1197
01:00:21,720 --> 01:00:23,720
he's the worst. 
The worst field goal percentage 

1198
01:00:23,720 --> 01:00:25,800
for the Finals of the Pacers, 
the worst three-point shooting 

1199
01:00:25,800 --> 01:00:27,680
percentage of the Pacers in the 
Finals. 

1200
01:00:28,240 --> 01:00:31,920
It, it, it, I, I keep feeling 
he's got to have a better game 

1201
01:00:31,920 --> 01:00:34,240
in him. 
I know he's been sick, you know,

1202
01:00:34,240 --> 01:00:37,640
just like health wise, I know he
was sick in like games 3 and 4, 

1203
01:00:38,120 --> 01:00:40,000
but it, it's his shot just looks
off. 

1204
01:00:40,000 --> 01:00:43,080
And, and now the what concerns 
me is like in game six, there 

1205
01:00:43,080 --> 01:00:46,280
was a lot of times he had shots 
and just pump faked or passed 

1206
01:00:46,280 --> 01:00:48,560
off. 
Like he he's obviously in in his

1207
01:00:48,560 --> 01:00:50,400
head in a funk. 
He just needs to see the ball. 

1208
01:00:50,400 --> 01:00:51,520
Go in the hoop. 
Yeah. 

1209
01:00:51,520 --> 01:00:55,800
No, it's, it's just it's a 
bizarre regression overall for 

1210
01:00:55,800 --> 01:00:58,240
him. 
And, you know, now I'll say, 

1211
01:00:58,360 --> 01:01:01,000
well, I do give him credit. 
He is still playing good 

1212
01:01:01,000 --> 01:01:03,920
defensive ball. 
And and that has been why you've

1213
01:01:03,920 --> 01:01:05,560
seen him stay on the floor so 
much. 

1214
01:01:06,120 --> 01:01:09,120
It's just like, that's the one. 
And this is where injuries hurt 

1215
01:01:09,120 --> 01:01:11,520
the Pacers in ways that the 
national media never talked 

1216
01:01:11,520 --> 01:01:15,120
about. 
To only have Tony Bradley or 

1217
01:01:15,200 --> 01:01:18,360
Thomas Bryant or Obi Toppin. 
Like those are your three 

1218
01:01:18,360 --> 01:01:21,680
choices, not none. 
I mean, Obi Toppin obviously 

1219
01:01:21,680 --> 01:01:24,440
brings a ton to the table, but 
he's not like an ideal like for 

1220
01:01:24,440 --> 01:01:27,280
like replacement at the four or 
anything like that. 

1221
01:01:27,280 --> 01:01:29,040
I'm talking to my. 
Brother-in-law about this. 

1222
01:01:29,040 --> 01:01:31,400
You know, Isaiah Jackson was 
huge in the Knicks series last 

1223
01:01:31,400 --> 01:01:33,200
year. 
Like he, he played a big role as

1224
01:01:33,200 --> 01:01:35,280
a nice backup center. 
And you're right, no one talks 

1225
01:01:35,280 --> 01:01:36,520
about it. 
It's like, oh, you, you lose 

1226
01:01:36,520 --> 01:01:38,240
your backup center. 
He's like, no, Isaiah Jackson 

1227
01:01:38,240 --> 01:01:40,920
was a big piece of it. 
And who knows what Wiseman could

1228
01:01:40,920 --> 01:01:43,240
have done. 
I can at least imagine Wiseman 

1229
01:01:43,240 --> 01:01:46,160
would provide what Bradley's 
providing, if not a little bit 

1230
01:01:46,160 --> 01:01:48,560
more. 
So I'm, I'm with you, if you're 

1231
01:01:48,560 --> 01:01:51,320
bringing one of those two guys 
off the bench, is that, does 

1232
01:01:51,320 --> 01:01:53,880
that swing this series? 
You're still here, man. 

1233
01:01:54,120 --> 01:01:57,520
You're in a game seven, you 
know, let's talk. 

1234
01:01:57,720 --> 01:02:00,120
I mean, it's funny. 
We're we're beyond Scott's fever

1235
01:02:00,120 --> 01:02:01,400
dreaming. 
You are here. 

1236
01:02:01,760 --> 01:02:04,320
It truly you and I had some fun 
text back and forth. 

1237
01:02:04,320 --> 01:02:06,680
Just I want to have some fun 
talk at you know, I talked to 

1238
01:02:06,680 --> 01:02:08,800
friends on Friday. 
It's like, man, I you know, the 

1239
01:02:08,800 --> 01:02:10,240
Pacers can't score in this Game 
7. 

1240
01:02:10,240 --> 01:02:11,440
They're probably going to lose 
the series. 

1241
01:02:12,320 --> 01:02:14,880
There's some there's some fun 
media talk you can have at this 

1242
01:02:14,880 --> 01:02:17,760
point, but it it you know, it 
really is for the championship 

1243
01:02:17,760 --> 01:02:19,800
now, like there's there's no 
other option. 

1244
01:02:20,600 --> 01:02:22,880
And you know, it's it's one 
game, as they all say, but it 

1245
01:02:23,480 --> 01:02:26,520
there's a lot on the line here 
and there is some legacy stuff. 

1246
01:02:26,720 --> 01:02:32,200
You know, some it's a lot, but 
it sorry, go there. 

1247
01:02:32,600 --> 01:02:37,840
You're you're right. 
So it's kind of a big deal. 

1248
01:02:37,840 --> 01:02:39,600
Yeah, no, I know it's please go 
ahead. 

1249
01:02:40,080 --> 01:02:43,240
Try to not get into the the 
media speak, but it's so hard 

1250
01:02:44,680 --> 01:02:47,520
from the Pacers perspective. 
You know, I was talking about, 

1251
01:02:47,520 --> 01:02:49,000
you know, where does this put 
Halliburton overall? 

1252
01:02:49,000 --> 01:02:53,800
It just it it's a if, if they 
win this, he immediately becomes

1253
01:02:53,800 --> 01:02:54,960
a guy. 
You know, I don't I don't I'm 

1254
01:02:54,960 --> 01:02:56,840
not into the is he a star? 
Is he a superstar? 

1255
01:02:56,840 --> 01:02:57,880
Is he top ten? 
I don't care. 

1256
01:02:58,160 --> 01:03:01,920
He just he he becomes part of an
echelon that is just like he's a

1257
01:03:01,920 --> 01:03:05,440
dude and he's LED A-Team. 
He's had, I mean, just maybe the

1258
01:03:05,440 --> 01:03:09,040
most unbelievable game-winning 
shot mode. 

1259
01:03:09,040 --> 01:03:12,360
I mean, from a narrative point 
of view, this ends with him 

1260
01:03:12,360 --> 01:03:16,480
taking one more final shot to 
win the finals. 

1261
01:03:16,840 --> 01:03:21,440
That would be on unbelievable, 
But it it it puts Halliburton at

1262
01:03:21,440 --> 01:03:25,200
a level where it's done it it 
puts the Pacers at a point where

1263
01:03:25,200 --> 01:03:29,040
they can really run this core 
from a period of strength, like 

1264
01:03:29,040 --> 01:03:30,720
not trying to chase. 
It's like, oh man, we got a 

1265
01:03:30,720 --> 01:03:33,080
chip. 
Let's you know, you can afford 

1266
01:03:33,080 --> 01:03:34,640
to run it back. 
Maybe you try something, you 

1267
01:03:34,640 --> 01:03:38,760
just you're not chasing it. 
You know, it it probably keeps 

1268
01:03:38,760 --> 01:03:41,960
Turner here. 
It puts Carlisle in a it just it

1269
01:03:41,960 --> 01:03:44,640
it changes everything. 
But I think it mostly changes 

1270
01:03:44,640 --> 01:03:48,280
for Halliburton and Siaka. 
Yeah, no, I agree with all of 

1271
01:03:48,280 --> 01:03:50,080
that. 
I mean, it's I I think for the 

1272
01:03:50,080 --> 01:03:56,920
individual players, it's so much
of your reputation in the NBA is

1273
01:03:56,920 --> 01:04:01,800
centered around these sorts of 
moments and being able to 

1274
01:04:01,800 --> 01:04:04,400
execute them. 
I mean, you, you think about the

1275
01:04:04,400 --> 01:04:07,400
way we think about Kawhi Leonard
versus the way we think about 

1276
01:04:07,400 --> 01:04:09,680
James Harden. 
And, you know, they've had 

1277
01:04:09,680 --> 01:04:11,760
similar injury issues, like 
they're different types of 

1278
01:04:11,760 --> 01:04:13,520
players. 
But you know, Leonard's won two 

1279
01:04:13,520 --> 01:04:17,560
titles, including a title with 
his own team that, you know, 

1280
01:04:17,720 --> 01:04:20,960
with the Raptors that that his 
own team in quotes isn't he's 

1281
01:04:20,960 --> 01:04:22,240
not there anymore. 
But you know what I mean? 

1282
01:04:23,400 --> 01:04:27,000
For the Pacers, there's another 
level from the players 

1283
01:04:27,000 --> 01:04:29,440
perspective. 
And it's a tough one for people,

1284
01:04:29,440 --> 01:04:32,120
I think, to get their heads 
wrapped around because, you 

1285
01:04:32,120 --> 01:04:36,240
know, we've had out of the blue 
champions, but they're they 

1286
01:04:36,240 --> 01:04:40,720
tended to be led by big name 
players. 

1287
01:04:40,800 --> 01:04:44,000
Giannis with the Bucks, 
obviously LeBron winning with 

1288
01:04:44,000 --> 01:04:46,520
the Cavs. 
You mentioned that O 4 Pistons 

1289
01:04:46,520 --> 01:04:48,240
team. 
That's probably the last one 

1290
01:04:48,240 --> 01:04:50,760
where it felt like there really 
wasn't a guy like that. 

1291
01:04:50,760 --> 01:04:53,200
And obviously Leonard with the 
Raptors. 

1292
01:04:53,920 --> 01:04:57,880
You know, so it's it it's almost
one of those things where it 

1293
01:04:57,880 --> 01:05:01,120
enhances everybody's reputation,
but it doesn't enhance any one 

1294
01:05:01,120 --> 01:05:04,400
player's reputation to like an 
insane level except for probably

1295
01:05:04,400 --> 01:05:07,160
Halliburton. 
It should enhance Siakam if they

1296
01:05:07,160 --> 01:05:12,200
were to win it because Siakam. 
Is probably like if they win and

1297
01:05:12,200 --> 01:05:17,720
he scores 20 he's he's probably 
the finals MVPI mean that that's

1298
01:05:17,720 --> 01:05:19,480
the other quiet thing like that 
is up for grabs. 

1299
01:05:19,520 --> 01:05:21,560
The finals MVP for me is like 
completely up for grabs. 

1300
01:05:21,560 --> 01:05:24,120
It could be Jalen Williams. 
I've wondered this in the 

1301
01:05:24,120 --> 01:05:26,280
background just this. 
There's no way to answer this, 

1302
01:05:26,280 --> 01:05:30,840
but cause Shay is Canadian and 
Halliburton was on the Olympic 

1303
01:05:30,840 --> 01:05:34,400
team, I do wonder if he's 
getting calls or able to make 

1304
01:05:34,400 --> 01:05:37,400
calls with basically every NBA 
star that was on. 

1305
01:05:37,440 --> 01:05:41,120
You know, you have Curry, 
LeBron, Durant, guys who have 

1306
01:05:41,120 --> 01:05:44,120
been in the NBA, you know, 
they're all friends and they, 

1307
01:05:44,120 --> 01:05:46,560
but it's like those Olympic guys
have a connection. 

1308
01:05:46,880 --> 01:05:50,400
And then most of the Thunder are
Canadian or younger. 

1309
01:05:50,400 --> 01:05:52,480
It's like Halliburton's there. 
I wonder if Halliburton is 

1310
01:05:52,480 --> 01:05:55,320
getting a call from LeBron. 
Be like, hey man, here's some 

1311
01:05:55,320 --> 01:05:57,760
things to keep in the back of 
your mind as a guy who's been 

1312
01:05:57,760 --> 01:05:59,400
here before. 
I mean, Curry's been and they're

1313
01:05:59,400 --> 01:06:02,400
like, I just, I, I wonder that 
along this ride if, if those 

1314
01:06:02,400 --> 01:06:05,160
guys are mentoring him a bit. 
Yeah, I know. 

1315
01:06:05,160 --> 01:06:09,080
It's, it's, it's an interesting 
question and I it's impossible 

1316
01:06:09,080 --> 01:06:11,200
to know unless, unless somebody 
was to tell us. 

1317
01:06:11,200 --> 01:06:14,760
But it is an interesting thought
to me though, the big what? 

1318
01:06:14,760 --> 01:06:17,440
Does it do for the city? 
I mean, sorry, go ahead. 

1319
01:06:17,520 --> 01:06:18,880
That's. 
Where I'm actually exactly where

1320
01:06:18,880 --> 01:06:21,880
I was headed. 
I mean, to me, for the Pacers, 

1321
01:06:22,640 --> 01:06:29,000
it is, it is the legitimacy the 
franchise has been trying to get

1322
01:06:29,280 --> 01:06:33,000
really since they joined the NBA
in the merger. 

1323
01:06:33,720 --> 01:06:36,040
You know, they've, they the 
Pacers have kind of been in this

1324
01:06:36,040 --> 01:06:40,000
unique spot within the NBA 
spectrum where they've had 

1325
01:06:40,480 --> 01:06:43,720
really, if you think about it, 
you know, since the merger, 

1326
01:06:43,720 --> 01:06:50,120
they've had four distinct team 
eras where they were a contender

1327
01:06:50,600 --> 01:06:54,160
and couldn't quite breakthrough.
Obviously the 90s era that 

1328
01:06:54,160 --> 01:06:58,080
started in in 94 and really ran 
all the way through to the 

1329
01:06:58,080 --> 01:07:01,320
finals appearance in 2000. 
They had that second very 

1330
01:07:01,320 --> 01:07:05,760
abbreviated run a couple of 
years later with Ron Artest and,

1331
01:07:05,760 --> 01:07:08,920
and that group that ended up 
getting derailed by the Malice 

1332
01:07:08,920 --> 01:07:13,320
and the Palace. 
They have the the early 20 tens 

1333
01:07:13,320 --> 01:07:17,680
team with Paul George and, you 
know, and and Hibbert and that 

1334
01:07:17,680 --> 01:07:19,920
whole group. 
And then they've got this group.

1335
01:07:20,240 --> 01:07:23,240
And this group is probably the 
group that the fewest people saw

1336
01:07:23,240 --> 01:07:25,600
coming. 
But it's also the group that 

1337
01:07:25,600 --> 01:07:28,960
punched through and has led the 
Pacers as far as they've ever 

1338
01:07:28,960 --> 01:07:33,360
been right in the NBA play offs.
And, you know, I can tell you 

1339
01:07:33,400 --> 01:07:38,480
it's been fun connecting with 
people who were fans in the 90s 

1340
01:07:38,960 --> 01:07:42,800
of those teams and how 
emotionally invested people have

1341
01:07:42,800 --> 01:07:45,280
gotten really overnight. 
I mean, I think people were 

1342
01:07:45,280 --> 01:07:48,400
excited about the Pacers last 
year with that kind of magical 

1343
01:07:48,400 --> 01:07:49,960
run to the Eastern Conference 
finals. 

1344
01:07:50,400 --> 01:07:55,640
But the way the season started 
this year and the uncertainty 

1345
01:07:55,640 --> 01:07:58,000
about what the team was going to
look like as they went into the 

1346
01:07:58,000 --> 01:08:01,200
playoffs and who they were going
to be facing, you know, people 

1347
01:08:01,200 --> 01:08:03,200
were like, this is great, this 
team is good. 

1348
01:08:03,200 --> 01:08:05,120
I don't think people were 
thinking this team could win a 

1349
01:08:05,120 --> 01:08:09,400
title. 
You know, the there there is it.

1350
01:08:09,400 --> 01:08:11,560
It's not it's not an end all be 
all. 

1351
01:08:11,560 --> 01:08:15,600
It doesn't fix everything or put
you in an echelon forever in 

1352
01:08:15,600 --> 01:08:18,200
terms of like, you know, people 
thinking about you differently. 

1353
01:08:18,200 --> 01:08:20,760
The Raptors being a great 
example of that, the Bucks being

1354
01:08:20,760 --> 01:08:23,399
another great example of that. 
But those teams have titles, 

1355
01:08:23,560 --> 01:08:28,000
like those franchises have 
titles in the NBA And I think 

1356
01:08:28,000 --> 01:08:33,200
for the Pacers and this very 
proud basketball fan base and 

1357
01:08:33,200 --> 01:08:38,920
and the city of Indianapolis, 
which has won title as a 

1358
01:08:38,920 --> 01:08:42,399
professional sports city in its 
history. 

1359
01:08:42,399 --> 01:08:45,439
And that was of course the Colts
19 years ago or 18 years ago, 

1360
01:08:45,439 --> 01:08:46,800
whatever you want to count it 
as. 

1361
01:08:48,120 --> 01:08:52,120
It would be one of those things 
that moves this that like 

1362
01:08:52,240 --> 01:08:55,720
Indiana and Indianapolis in 
particular into a different 

1363
01:08:55,720 --> 01:08:57,520
mentality and a different 
mindset. 

1364
01:08:58,279 --> 01:09:00,399
You know, and look, you could 
say the same thing about 

1365
01:09:00,399 --> 01:09:04,760
Oklahoma City, but to a more 
like a greater extreme, because 

1366
01:09:04,760 --> 01:09:09,240
that would be kind of the 1st 
truly Oklahoma City thing that 

1367
01:09:09,240 --> 01:09:11,600
they could point to. 
That's like, this is 100% ours. 

1368
01:09:11,600 --> 01:09:13,960
We're not leaning on the Sonic's
history. 

1369
01:09:14,200 --> 01:09:17,160
Yes, they've had good teams too.
They've had great players in the

1370
01:09:17,160 --> 01:09:19,800
last 15 years. 
But that essentially imprints 

1371
01:09:19,800 --> 01:09:23,399
their franchise and their city 
as having won a title at the 

1372
01:09:23,399 --> 01:09:26,680
major level. 
But for the Pacers, the, the, 

1373
01:09:27,120 --> 01:09:29,200
the, the pathway's been much 
longer. 

1374
01:09:29,640 --> 01:09:32,000
The fans have waited longer. 
There's a much deeper 

1375
01:09:32,000 --> 01:09:34,200
connection. 
I just think it would mean so 

1376
01:09:34,200 --> 01:09:37,800
much for the city to have that 
happen and for the franchise. 

1377
01:09:38,040 --> 01:09:40,399
It essentially validates an 
entirely different way of 

1378
01:09:40,399 --> 01:09:43,120
building a team and an entirely 
different way of approaching 

1379
01:09:43,120 --> 01:09:47,399
basketball in the NBA that a lot
of people are big fans of and 

1380
01:09:47,399 --> 01:09:49,359
have rooted for and wanted to 
see succeed. 

1381
01:09:49,359 --> 01:09:50,560
I'm not just talking about 
Indiana people. 

1382
01:09:50,560 --> 01:09:51,840
I'm talking about people across 
the league. 

1383
01:09:52,560 --> 01:09:53,439
Yeah, agreed. 
Yeah. 

1384
01:09:53,439 --> 01:09:55,080
And and also just the way to 
play basketball. 

1385
01:09:55,080 --> 01:09:57,320
It's funny. 
Like this is not only TJ 

1386
01:09:57,320 --> 01:09:59,720
McConnell, like Ryan Racilo had 
a great thing where he went on 

1387
01:09:59,720 --> 01:10:01,600
this rant about how like that's 
every high school coach. 

1388
01:10:01,600 --> 01:10:03,160
It's just like drooling over 
McConnell. 

1389
01:10:03,440 --> 01:10:05,520
But the way that Halliburton 
plays of just, you know, pass 

1390
01:10:05,520 --> 01:10:07,120
the ball, like you get rid of 
it, you'll get it back. 

1391
01:10:07,120 --> 01:10:10,080
And this ethos of like pass and 
move and run and play with 

1392
01:10:10,080 --> 01:10:15,160
effort, It's funny how 
nationally they, they, the media

1393
01:10:15,160 --> 01:10:16,960
seems confused to how to deal 
with the Pacers. 

1394
01:10:16,960 --> 01:10:19,640
Like this is what everybody, but
then like they complain about we

1395
01:10:19,640 --> 01:10:21,280
hate ISO ball. 
And it's like this is the 

1396
01:10:21,280 --> 01:10:24,480
antithesis of that. 
Like this is not one guy just 

1397
01:10:24,480 --> 01:10:27,040
dribbling and just doing the 
same motion and the same pick 

1398
01:10:27,040 --> 01:10:29,280
and roll every time. 
Like it's right here. 

1399
01:10:29,320 --> 01:10:31,000
Everything everyone's 
complaining about in basketball,

1400
01:10:31,000 --> 01:10:32,520
like the Pacers do not play that
way. 

1401
01:10:33,040 --> 01:10:34,760
I think they would, Obviously 
we're biased. 

1402
01:10:34,760 --> 01:10:35,960
I think they'd be a great 
champion. 

1403
01:10:36,840 --> 01:10:40,720
Maybe we'd get a Christmas game.
Maybe we'd get on national TV 

1404
01:10:40,720 --> 01:10:44,400
like two more times next year. 
Damn, man, I want it. 

1405
01:10:45,720 --> 01:10:49,000
I just God damn. 
It would be nice to win a title.

1406
01:10:49,000 --> 01:10:53,760
It, it, it there's we don't know
how this ends, but it does. 

1407
01:10:53,880 --> 01:10:56,560
I mean, this has been a 
storybook and you look at the 

1408
01:10:57,320 --> 01:10:59,960
the things that had to happen 
for us to get here. 

1409
01:11:00,720 --> 01:11:02,680
It it's really hard to get here 
again. 

1410
01:11:03,000 --> 01:11:06,680
And it's it would God, it would 
be nice to to, to get it done. 

1411
01:11:07,560 --> 01:11:10,160
It would be. 
I mean, it's, it's we've talked 

1412
01:11:10,160 --> 01:11:11,400
about. 
The way I mean, this has still 

1413
01:11:11,400 --> 01:11:14,120
been an amazing run. 
I still had a hell of a time and

1414
01:11:14,120 --> 01:11:17,480
in two or three years which 
banner is up is is I'll still 

1415
01:11:17,480 --> 01:11:19,520
remember all of the times I had 
with my son. 

1416
01:11:19,520 --> 01:11:21,920
I'm sure everyone out there same
thing like me with my son, my 

1417
01:11:21,920 --> 01:11:23,760
wife. 
Going to games like all of this 

1418
01:11:24,120 --> 01:11:27,400
one game isn't going to really 
change how much fun this ride 

1419
01:11:27,400 --> 01:11:30,440
is. 
It just probably means back to 

1420
01:11:30,440 --> 01:11:32,920
your credit card. 
Like am I going to spend 400 

1421
01:11:32,920 --> 01:11:35,400
bucks on Monday morning on 
championship gear or not? 

1422
01:11:37,120 --> 01:11:39,800
I, I've thought about this a lot
and this is something you and I 

1423
01:11:39,800 --> 01:11:43,560
talked about on the podcast. 
I think the, when we did the 

1424
01:11:43,560 --> 01:11:46,920
game three podcast, it's 
something I've talked about with

1425
01:11:46,920 --> 01:11:49,560
other folks about like, how much
do you guard your heart with 

1426
01:11:49,560 --> 01:11:54,920
these things? 
And how much do you, you know, 

1427
01:11:54,920 --> 01:11:57,160
to, to watch your team win a, a,
a title? 

1428
01:11:57,240 --> 01:11:59,320
I remember I remember the 
feeling when the Colts won the 

1429
01:11:59,320 --> 01:12:04,480
Super Bowl and how I remember 
driving I was I would watch the 

1430
01:12:04,520 --> 01:12:07,240
that whole night was weird but I
remember I watched it somewhere 

1431
01:12:07,240 --> 01:12:11,560
in Indianapolis and I was 
driving downtown to go meet my 

1432
01:12:11,640 --> 01:12:13,680
then girlfriend where she was 
working. 

1433
01:12:13,680 --> 01:12:16,640
And I remember driving through 
downtown Indy in the dead of 

1434
01:12:16,640 --> 01:12:18,560
night. 
It was freezing cold that night 

1435
01:12:18,920 --> 01:12:22,080
and at the window down, just 
listening to people going nuts 

1436
01:12:22,080 --> 01:12:26,040
on the street and thinking this 
is so cool that the team I've 

1437
01:12:26,040 --> 01:12:29,720
rooted for and the the city that
I mean, I'm not from 

1438
01:12:29,720 --> 01:12:31,280
Indianapolis, but I'm from 
Indiana. 

1439
01:12:31,280 --> 01:12:33,520
You know, Indianapolis is 
essentially the representative 

1440
01:12:33,520 --> 01:12:37,920
of Indiana on the on the 
national stage, won a major 

1441
01:12:37,920 --> 01:12:39,920
title. 
Now there are people who live in

1442
01:12:39,920 --> 01:12:41,640
cities where this is 
commonplace. 

1443
01:12:41,640 --> 01:12:45,120
If you're from Boston or Los 
Angeles or whatever it it 

1444
01:12:45,120 --> 01:12:46,520
doesn't, I don't think it hits 
the same. 

1445
01:12:47,360 --> 01:12:52,920
But for for Pacers fans, there's
a bunch of complicating factors 

1446
01:12:52,920 --> 01:12:54,840
here. 
I think, at least in my mind, 

1447
01:12:54,840 --> 01:12:58,520
like AI, don't think if you'd 
polled Pacers fans at the 

1448
01:12:58,520 --> 01:13:02,440
beginning of the Bucks series 
and ask them like realistically,

1449
01:13:02,440 --> 01:13:04,240
where do you think that these 
teams going to go? 

1450
01:13:04,640 --> 01:13:06,440
I don't think that they're 
saying they're going to win the 

1451
01:13:06,440 --> 01:13:08,160
Finals or even get to the 
Finals. 

1452
01:13:08,960 --> 01:13:11,600
But then you've also had this 
whole thing where the Pacers got

1453
01:13:11,600 --> 01:13:15,040
to the Finals and everybody 
said, well, that's a nice story.

1454
01:13:15,040 --> 01:13:17,800
They've been fun to follow, but 
this Thunder team is way too 

1455
01:13:17,800 --> 01:13:19,160
good and they're going to 
overwhelm them. 

1456
01:13:19,480 --> 01:13:22,760
And then that didn't happen. 
But then you lose game four and 

1457
01:13:22,760 --> 01:13:25,520
it's like, well, we lost our 
chances, as you said multiple 

1458
01:13:25,520 --> 01:13:29,680
times in voice memos to me, and 
you know, they just were a 

1459
01:13:29,680 --> 01:13:33,080
better team. 
Well, now you're in a game to go

1460
01:13:33,080 --> 01:13:35,080
on the road, and yes, that's 
going to be incredibly 

1461
01:13:35,080 --> 01:13:36,560
difficult. 
And you have to essentially 

1462
01:13:36,560 --> 01:13:39,920
erase everything that you think 
that you knew not just from Game

1463
01:13:39,920 --> 01:13:41,440
6, but from the rest of the 
series. 

1464
01:13:42,760 --> 01:13:45,600
But you've essentially 
demonstrated that you are the 

1465
01:13:45,600 --> 01:13:50,960
equal of this historically good 
team in in in the NBA, in the 

1466
01:13:50,960 --> 01:13:52,680
Oklahoma City Thunder from this 
year. 

1467
01:13:53,320 --> 01:13:57,680
And to sit there on the 
precipice and not win is a 

1468
01:13:57,680 --> 01:14:02,040
really, really hard thing. 
And you can't really think about

1469
01:14:02,040 --> 01:14:05,280
how you'll feel one way or the 
other until after whatever 

1470
01:14:05,280 --> 01:14:10,520
happens in Game 7 happens. 
And I don't know how to like, 

1471
01:14:10,840 --> 01:14:13,800
what I mean by that is 
ultimately, as you said, a win 

1472
01:14:13,800 --> 01:14:18,360
or a loss is not going to erase 
how amazing this last couple of 

1473
01:14:18,360 --> 01:14:22,240
months have been. 
But a win, it's like, you know, 

1474
01:14:22,240 --> 01:14:26,000
famously, you know, Bob Knight 
right before the IU Syracuse 

1475
01:14:26,000 --> 01:14:28,600
game in 87, you know, they're 
talking about it. 

1476
01:14:28,600 --> 01:14:30,560
And he's explained, you know, to
all the guys like, hey, this has

1477
01:14:30,560 --> 01:14:32,800
been a a really great run. 
You guys have really acquitted 

1478
01:14:32,800 --> 01:14:34,640
yourself as well. 
The last thing he says before he

1479
01:14:34,640 --> 01:14:37,360
leaves the locker room is no 
one's going to remember you if 

1480
01:14:37,360 --> 01:14:42,400
you finish second, which which 
by the way, sounds great when 

1481
01:14:42,400 --> 01:14:44,560
you win, if you lose, it's like,
damn it, Bob, like that's bad. 

1482
01:14:45,680 --> 01:14:48,840
But it but it does it it it puts
a different it it puts a 

1483
01:14:48,840 --> 01:14:51,400
completely different wrapping on
all the things that we just 

1484
01:14:51,400 --> 01:14:52,840
discussed. 
If you win the title. 

1485
01:14:53,240 --> 01:14:57,000
And to be sitting here in a 
season and in a playoffs that 

1486
01:14:57,000 --> 01:14:59,760
most people didn't think the 
Pacers would get even into the 

1487
01:14:59,760 --> 01:15:02,440
finals, let alone to a game 7A 
decisive game. 

1488
01:15:03,000 --> 01:15:05,280
And to have demonstrated that 
they can play with the Thunder, 

1489
01:15:05,280 --> 01:15:08,160
that they can beat the Thunder, 
not just in close games, but 

1490
01:15:08,160 --> 01:15:12,160
they can blow them out, man, it 
would be tough to make it that 

1491
01:15:12,160 --> 01:15:15,480
far and not come away with it. 
And I was thinking about this in

1492
01:15:15,480 --> 01:15:18,760
relation to IU football because 
we just had a magical run. 

1493
01:15:19,200 --> 01:15:20,960
And I look back very fondly on 
that. 

1494
01:15:20,960 --> 01:15:23,360
I went to the game at Notre 
Dame, as did you. 

1495
01:15:23,800 --> 01:15:26,680
And again, I think the 
difference is, you know, we had 

1496
01:15:26,680 --> 01:15:29,040
never been anywhere near those 
heights. 

1497
01:15:29,040 --> 01:15:30,680
The Pacers have been to the 
finals that, you know, the 

1498
01:15:30,680 --> 01:15:32,000
Eastern Conference finals last 
year. 

1499
01:15:32,800 --> 01:15:35,680
But also, you know, being 
honest, it's like, all right, I 

1500
01:15:36,400 --> 01:15:39,040
if we had beaten in Notre Dame, 
where we going to go beat 

1501
01:15:39,040 --> 01:15:40,520
Georgia? 
Like then could we have beaten 

1502
01:15:40,520 --> 01:15:42,280
Penn and there's like four more 
steps? 

1503
01:15:42,920 --> 01:15:45,920
It's like I I can look back on 
last year, like damn, that was 

1504
01:15:45,920 --> 01:15:46,880
awesome. 
Like that was great. 

1505
01:15:46,880 --> 01:15:49,680
It ended in a loss as most 
everyone's teams do. 

1506
01:15:49,960 --> 01:15:52,480
I don't I wasn't heartbroken 
with that one. 

1507
01:15:52,960 --> 01:15:54,880
This one is different because 
it's so close. 

1508
01:15:55,040 --> 01:15:57,920
If there there is no more big 
bosses like this is the end of 

1509
01:15:57,920 --> 01:16:01,040
Mario Brothers. 
It's you looking at God, what's 

1510
01:16:01,760 --> 01:16:04,000
the dragon or whatever the guy's
name is? 

1511
01:16:04,920 --> 01:16:06,440
Bowser. 
Bowser at the you're you're 

1512
01:16:06,440 --> 01:16:09,120
staring at Bowser. 
There is no, you know, man well,

1513
01:16:09,120 --> 01:16:10,640
but we probably wouldn't have 
beaten the Thunder. 

1514
01:16:10,640 --> 01:16:13,920
It's like, no, this is it, Like 
this is all there is to it. 

1515
01:16:13,920 --> 01:16:16,760
And I'm I'm with you. 
It's probably going to hurt. 

1516
01:16:17,200 --> 01:16:19,520
I I love how you said that. 
Like how guarded am I with my 

1517
01:16:19,520 --> 01:16:20,640
heart? 
Because I'm honestly not sure 

1518
01:16:20,640 --> 01:16:24,200
I'm trying to. 
You, you, you have been all over

1519
01:16:24,200 --> 01:16:25,480
the map. 
You're not the only one. 

1520
01:16:25,520 --> 01:16:27,800
I mean it really. 
I, I really, I don't know how 

1521
01:16:27,800 --> 01:16:30,080
to. 
I'm trying to guard it but I 

1522
01:16:30,080 --> 01:16:31,720
want to enjoy it. 
I really don't know how to 

1523
01:16:31,720 --> 01:16:33,520
handle this. 
Now, I, well, I don't think 

1524
01:16:33,520 --> 01:16:36,480
there's, there's not a manual 
for how to handle these kinds of

1525
01:16:36,480 --> 01:16:38,160
things. 
I think most people who have, 

1526
01:16:38,560 --> 01:16:41,520
who have either been fans of 
this team or people that have 

1527
01:16:41,520 --> 01:16:43,840
hopped on the bandwagon 
relatively recently and, and 

1528
01:16:43,840 --> 01:16:45,800
just, you know, just started to 
get into it. 

1529
01:16:46,480 --> 01:16:51,000
It's this is uncharted territory
for everybody in this fan base. 

1530
01:16:51,000 --> 01:16:54,280
Like, the the furthest the 
Pacers ever went was game six of

1531
01:16:54,280 --> 01:16:56,880
the Finals. 
And that series felt like it was

1532
01:16:56,880 --> 01:17:01,920
over, you know, after games. 
Yeah, you know, And so this this

1533
01:17:01,920 --> 01:17:04,400
series felt like it was over. 
And I think everybody went in 

1534
01:17:04,400 --> 01:17:06,480
and was like, we're going to 
give it one last go in game 

1535
01:17:06,480 --> 01:17:08,160
bridge. 
And then the Pacers doing this, 

1536
01:17:08,160 --> 01:17:11,360
it's like flung the shutters 
wide open again. 

1537
01:17:11,560 --> 01:17:14,720
And everybody's like, Oh my God,
where, where, where are we in 

1538
01:17:14,720 --> 01:17:17,560
the mix of all of this? 
And so I am really excited to 

1539
01:17:17,560 --> 01:17:19,360
see what happens. 
It's going to be an amazing 

1540
01:17:19,360 --> 01:17:22,360
experience watching this game. 
What's your plan? 

1541
01:17:22,360 --> 01:17:25,000
So I I immediately looked on 
StubHub. 

1542
01:17:25,000 --> 01:17:27,080
I probably should have looked at
what's the new website you told 

1543
01:17:27,080 --> 01:17:28,360
me. 
Game. 

1544
01:17:28,360 --> 01:17:29,800
Time, game time, I need to look 
at that. 

1545
01:17:29,800 --> 01:17:33,040
I was so I I, I will give you my
thought process because I've 

1546
01:17:33,040 --> 01:17:35,880
been kind of a guy who's been 
saying forever, Hey, man, if the

1547
01:17:36,240 --> 01:17:38,720
I use ever in a final four, I'm 
going, you know, price be 

1548
01:17:38,720 --> 01:17:40,720
damned. 
If I use in the BCS, I'm going 

1549
01:17:40,720 --> 01:17:42,640
price be damned. 
And Pacers would have been 

1550
01:17:42,640 --> 01:17:44,760
there. 
Prices would have been damned. 

1551
01:17:45,160 --> 01:17:47,000
It would have been high. 
But I was like, all right, you 

1552
01:17:47,040 --> 01:17:49,080
know, and I, I've been, dude, 
I've been going to games with 

1553
01:17:49,080 --> 01:17:51,040
my, my son over the last two or 
three years. 

1554
01:17:51,040 --> 01:17:53,440
He loves basketball. 
This is the perfect age for him.

1555
01:17:53,920 --> 01:17:55,440
I told him, like, dude, you're 
my ride or die. 

1556
01:17:55,440 --> 01:17:58,080
Like I'm going, we're either, 
we're doing Game 7 together 

1557
01:17:58,080 --> 01:18:00,240
either at home or like, I'm not 
going to ditch you. 

1558
01:18:01,000 --> 01:18:03,720
No, But I thought about it for 
12 1/2 seconds when I looked at 

1559
01:18:03,760 --> 01:18:08,160
the prices, like, am I going to 
pay like 12 1/2, you know, $1200

1560
01:18:08,160 --> 01:18:08,920
for my son to go? 
But. 

1561
01:18:08,920 --> 01:18:12,760
I mean game time has has tickets
at 881 in the upper bowl. 

1562
01:18:13,040 --> 01:18:17,760
I know I've so but here's my 
thought is tough analysis. 

1563
01:18:17,760 --> 01:18:19,480
We're either going to win or 
lose, but like if we. 

1564
01:18:20,120 --> 01:18:22,440
If we. 
Lose If we lose, like it, it 

1565
01:18:22,440 --> 01:18:24,680
would be cool to see the trophy 
thing, but that would be 

1566
01:18:24,680 --> 01:18:26,200
heartbreaking. 
And then it's like, then I got 

1567
01:18:26,200 --> 01:18:28,240
to fly home. 
It's like it's done all that. 

1568
01:18:28,600 --> 01:18:30,840
Even if we win, it would be 
awesome. 

1569
01:18:31,120 --> 01:18:32,960
But I'd be like itching to get 
home. 

1570
01:18:32,960 --> 01:18:35,160
Like I'd want to see my wife, 
like I want to see my friends. 

1571
01:18:35,160 --> 01:18:37,000
Like I'd be like, when's the 
parade like and somebody has to 

1572
01:18:37,000 --> 01:18:40,800
fly home and I, I realize like I
have great friends and family 

1573
01:18:40,800 --> 01:18:43,800
here, obviously like I'm going 
to just do a watch party at my 

1574
01:18:43,800 --> 01:18:45,000
house. 
My neighbor actually has a great

1575
01:18:45,000 --> 01:18:46,600
set up with a pool and an 
outdoor TV. 

1576
01:18:46,600 --> 01:18:48,640
We might do a watch party there.
And I was like, you know what? 

1577
01:18:49,040 --> 01:18:51,960
I, I as cool as it would be to 
be in the arena, it's a lot of 

1578
01:18:51,960 --> 01:18:55,560
work and it probably would be a 
little bit like sad that night 

1579
01:18:55,560 --> 01:18:57,400
either way. 
Just going to a random Holiday 

1580
01:18:57,400 --> 01:19:00,400
Inn in Oklahoma City, even 
knowing I've won, just being 

1581
01:19:00,400 --> 01:19:02,400
like, I, I have no one to talk 
to about it. 

1582
01:19:03,320 --> 01:19:05,120
I. 
I've decided like, I think 

1583
01:19:05,120 --> 01:19:07,720
that's the right move for me. 
So I'm doing an outdoor watch 

1584
01:19:07,720 --> 01:19:10,600
party and that's, that's, that's
my mindset. 

1585
01:19:10,600 --> 01:19:13,520
Where are you at? 
I, I am actually working an 

1586
01:19:13,520 --> 01:19:16,760
event that night, but I will be,
I will be in a spot where I can 

1587
01:19:16,760 --> 01:19:20,040
watch the game with people. 
I'm not going to get to choose 

1588
01:19:20,040 --> 01:19:23,520
the venue. 
Well, no, I mean, these these 

1589
01:19:23,520 --> 01:19:27,040
are people I don't mind watching
the game with, but yeah, it's I 

1590
01:19:27,040 --> 01:19:29,080
mean, it's going to be a 
different kind of environment 

1591
01:19:29,080 --> 01:19:32,120
certainly. 
But look, I again, I don't think

1592
01:19:32,120 --> 01:19:35,960
you could make long term plans 
around game seven of the NBA 

1593
01:19:35,960 --> 01:19:39,000
Finals in terms of what you were
going to do to watch. 

1594
01:19:39,000 --> 01:19:42,880
It would have been cool to go 
and and witness it one way or 

1595
01:19:42,880 --> 01:19:46,880
the other, But it's it's a lot 
of money and it's also just one 

1596
01:19:46,880 --> 01:19:52,880
of those things where you're so 
much of what we've watched in 

1597
01:19:52,880 --> 01:19:56,120
this series has been from a 
distance, but it's been amazing 

1598
01:19:56,120 --> 01:19:58,160
to watch from a distance. 
I mean, you know, some of the 

1599
01:19:58,160 --> 01:20:02,240
most memorable elements of this 
this whole streak have been on 

1600
01:20:02,240 --> 01:20:06,680
the road, whether it was game 
five of the Cavs series or 

1601
01:20:06,680 --> 01:20:10,320
whether it was game one of the 
Knicks series or whether it was 

1602
01:20:10,320 --> 01:20:14,080
game one of the finals. 
I mean it, it's so I'm used to 

1603
01:20:14,080 --> 01:20:17,600
watching it on TV. 
And actually I'm, I'm, I am kind

1604
01:20:17,600 --> 01:20:19,960
of glad I'm going to have to 
watch it in a different location

1605
01:20:19,960 --> 01:20:25,320
because in the finals I am, 
let's see, I'm 2 and O in person

1606
01:20:25,680 --> 01:20:30,240
at at Gainbridge. 
I'm one and one watching it 

1607
01:20:30,240 --> 01:20:32,880
upstairs pub. 
I'm Owen one watching from my 

1608
01:20:32,880 --> 01:20:36,960
house and I'm Owen one watching 
from Kilroy's in downtown Indy. 

1609
01:20:37,240 --> 01:20:40,840
So I I needed another venue and 
I was rapidly running out of 

1610
01:20:40,840 --> 01:20:43,400
places to go. 
And so we're going to change up 

1611
01:20:43,400 --> 01:20:47,000
the mojo, go to a new location. 
Hopefully that ends up working 

1612
01:20:47,000 --> 01:20:48,720
out for us. 
Office lounge is pissed. 

1613
01:20:48,720 --> 01:20:50,360
They're like, man, we're going 
this 18. 

1614
01:20:50,360 --> 01:20:52,080
We could have gotten Galen for 
one game. 

1615
01:20:53,200 --> 01:20:55,920
I used to just like go to 
Chili's, you know, hit the bar 

1616
01:20:55,920 --> 01:20:58,920
up. 
It was popular the last time the

1617
01:20:58,920 --> 01:21:00,480
Pacers were in The Who knows 
Eric? 

1618
01:21:01,080 --> 01:21:03,120
Blooming on you. 
That's back up somebody else. 

1619
01:21:03,120 --> 01:21:05,720
All right, we're done. 
Yeah, it's so. 

1620
01:21:06,200 --> 01:21:08,240
We'll see what. 
Happens and obviously 

1621
01:21:08,240 --> 01:21:11,560
predictions it's just it's I 
just I I think it'll be a close 

1622
01:21:11,560 --> 01:21:13,960
game. 
I just you haven't seen Game 7 

1623
01:21:13,960 --> 01:21:16,400
blowouts. 
It's just, it is. 

1624
01:21:16,400 --> 01:21:18,360
I was shocked at how few there 
have been. 

1625
01:21:18,720 --> 01:21:21,720
When you go back, it's like I 
remember the Knicks, Rockets one

1626
01:21:21,720 --> 01:21:23,800
where Starks went like one for 
18 and it's like that. 

1627
01:21:23,800 --> 01:21:25,400
There's only been three since 
then. 

1628
01:21:25,400 --> 01:21:26,080
It's. 
Just wild. 

1629
01:21:26,800 --> 01:21:32,520
I mean, the, the one thing that 
will play a big role in all of 

1630
01:21:32,520 --> 01:21:35,600
this is do you get a neutral 
whistle in this game? 

1631
01:21:36,600 --> 01:21:38,400
You know is the is the game 
called? 

1632
01:21:38,840 --> 01:21:41,000
At this point, like we're done 
trying to extend the series. 

1633
01:21:41,040 --> 01:21:42,040
Right. 
Well, that's that's the 

1634
01:21:42,040 --> 01:21:44,640
question, you know, and it's 
like, and no one knows who the 

1635
01:21:44,640 --> 01:21:46,240
refs are going to be. 
And I have a lot of people have 

1636
01:21:46,240 --> 01:21:48,360
been like, no, Scott Foster's. 
I don't know if Scott Foster's 

1637
01:21:48,360 --> 01:21:52,240
really that big of a deal in a 
in a take away game, unless he 

1638
01:21:52,240 --> 01:21:55,920
just calls a janky, you know, 
Start Stop type of game like you

1639
01:21:55,920 --> 01:21:59,000
did in game 4I mean you had you 
had Tony Brothers back who did 

1640
01:21:59,000 --> 01:22:02,000
not cover himself in glory with 
his officiating in Game 6. 

1641
01:22:02,000 --> 01:22:04,400
And it didn't matter. 
But the you know, it was 

1642
01:22:04,400 --> 01:22:06,400
interesting because the 
physicality that the Thunder 

1643
01:22:06,400 --> 01:22:09,760
like to engage in was getting 
penalized early in the game 

1644
01:22:09,760 --> 01:22:12,160
yesterday in a way that it 
hadn't in some of the other 

1645
01:22:12,160 --> 01:22:14,360
games. 
And so at home for the Thunder. 

1646
01:22:14,400 --> 01:22:15,120
Yeah. 
Oh, right. 

1647
01:22:15,120 --> 01:22:18,240
And that's the big question. 
Like how much do the does the do

1648
01:22:18,240 --> 01:22:20,760
the officiate officials lean 
into that? 

1649
01:22:22,080 --> 01:22:24,240
How well do the Pacers shoot on 
the road? 

1650
01:22:24,520 --> 01:22:26,920
How well do the role players for
Oklahoma City play? 

1651
01:22:27,120 --> 01:22:31,560
How but ultimately it's like how
well does the Pacers defense and

1652
01:22:31,560 --> 01:22:36,440
energy travel in this game is 
going to be the question mark. 

1653
01:22:36,440 --> 01:22:39,560
I mean, I think the I mean, the 
Thunder I think are a 6 1/2 

1654
01:22:39,560 --> 01:22:41,360
point favorite was what I was 
seeing. 

1655
01:22:41,560 --> 01:22:45,440
I think Pacers money line is 
like was like plus 260 this 

1656
01:22:45,440 --> 01:22:47,360
morning. 
We'll see where that goes. 

1657
01:22:47,880 --> 01:22:50,760
I mean, the the Thunder have to 
be considered the favorite 

1658
01:22:50,760 --> 01:22:52,640
because they've got the 
homecourt advantage. 

1659
01:22:52,880 --> 01:22:57,280
They have the MVP and they have 
a guy who's played about as well

1660
01:22:57,280 --> 01:23:01,240
as the MVP in this series. 
And that's a lot for the Pacers 

1661
01:23:01,240 --> 01:23:03,800
to overcome. 
The question is, can the Pacers 

1662
01:23:03,800 --> 01:23:06,200
get a good shooting game? 
You know, can they get Miles 

1663
01:23:06,200 --> 01:23:08,120
Turner on track? 
Can they get another good game 

1664
01:23:08,120 --> 01:23:10,840
out of Amahart offensively? 
And and, you know, do they do 

1665
01:23:10,840 --> 01:23:14,280
the Pacers pulling his defensive
assignments back a little bit 

1666
01:23:14,280 --> 01:23:16,440
and not running him around as 
much, does that translate into 

1667
01:23:16,440 --> 01:23:18,120
offense the way it did in Game 
6? 

1668
01:23:18,400 --> 01:23:21,960
Is Halliburton more right and 
able to do more in this game? 

1669
01:23:22,320 --> 01:23:27,120
Is Siakam able to continue this 
steady, like 19 and 12 that he's

1670
01:23:27,120 --> 01:23:29,240
been or 19 and eight that he's 
been averaging? 

1671
01:23:29,520 --> 01:23:31,440
Can try to break the slump. 
Well, right, yeah. 

1672
01:23:31,440 --> 01:23:33,760
I mean, there's there's so many 
and who's the guy that comes off

1673
01:23:33,760 --> 01:23:35,440
the bench or is there a guy that
comes off the bench? 

1674
01:23:35,440 --> 01:23:37,160
Like there's just so many 
different variables. 

1675
01:23:38,000 --> 01:23:40,280
You know, I think you go in 
thinking that the Thunder or the

1676
01:23:40,280 --> 01:23:43,040
favorite, but I also think you 
go in thinking the Thunder have 

1677
01:23:43,040 --> 01:23:46,480
all of the pressure because they
are going to be in front of 

1678
01:23:46,480 --> 01:23:51,000
their fans and we've already 
seen their fans get nervous a 

1679
01:23:51,000 --> 01:23:53,800
couple of times in games and 
kind of go away from an energy 

1680
01:23:53,800 --> 01:23:56,080
perspective. 
I'm going to be really curious 

1681
01:23:56,080 --> 01:23:58,720
to see what ends up happening 
across the board in this one. 

1682
01:23:58,720 --> 01:24:01,160
I have no idea. 
I've I've looked at all the 

1683
01:24:01,160 --> 01:24:02,800
stats. 
I've thought about it a ton. 

1684
01:24:02,960 --> 01:24:04,680
I have no idea where this game 
is going. 

1685
01:24:04,680 --> 01:24:06,520
It's going to be fascinating to 
watch though, every. 

1686
01:24:06,520 --> 01:24:10,240
Game in Oklahoma, the Pacers 
have gotten down by 10 or 15, 

1687
01:24:10,480 --> 01:24:13,640
and so I just history says 
that'll happen again. 

1688
01:24:13,640 --> 01:24:16,640
I just hope it doesn't because I
was telling some about this 

1689
01:24:16,640 --> 01:24:17,840
earlier. 
Like I think going in we're 

1690
01:24:17,840 --> 01:24:19,640
probably a 30% favorite to win 
the game. 

1691
01:24:19,640 --> 01:24:21,080
It's like, I'll take it. 
That's fine. 

1692
01:24:21,880 --> 01:24:25,000
But I, I was saying like the, 
the, the longer the game goes 

1693
01:24:25,000 --> 01:24:28,880
and the closer, if the Pacers 
are within 5 and half, I'd say 

1694
01:24:28,880 --> 01:24:30,680
we're 40%. 
And I'm like, if we can get to 

1695
01:24:30,680 --> 01:24:33,680
the fourth quarter and it's 
still a three, three to five 

1696
01:24:33,680 --> 01:24:36,280
point game, like we haven't 
gotten down by 10 or 15, we're 

1697
01:24:36,280 --> 01:24:39,880
having to just hustle back in. 
It's like I, I think it's a coin

1698
01:24:39,880 --> 01:24:41,600
toss at that point. 
It might even be the Pacers 

1699
01:24:41,600 --> 01:24:44,600
advantage for exactly what you 
said is like all the pressure is

1700
01:24:44,600 --> 01:24:46,400
on the Thunder. 
This is all there's to lose. 

1701
01:24:46,400 --> 01:24:50,560
And, and just like, I mean, this
is the last thing I will say, 

1702
01:24:50,920 --> 01:24:55,920
just like crowds can help you. 
I felt it before when when 

1703
01:24:55,920 --> 01:24:59,160
you're the favorite and you're 
not doing well, the crowd can 

1704
01:24:59,160 --> 01:25:01,920
get tight and that can push on 
to the players and suddenly it's

1705
01:25:01,920 --> 01:25:05,240
like they can be a weird energy.
I felt that at Assembly Hall a 

1706
01:25:05,240 --> 01:25:08,560
couple games like in in some of 
those really nadir times where 

1707
01:25:08,560 --> 01:25:11,280
you're just not doing well and 
the crowd starts getting real 

1708
01:25:11,280 --> 01:25:14,040
antsy. 
It's a real thing and and it it 

1709
01:25:14,040 --> 01:25:17,000
negatively effects you as much 
as the positive energy can help 

1710
01:25:17,000 --> 01:25:18,640
you. 
And that's something where if 

1711
01:25:18,640 --> 01:25:22,760
the Pacers are up in the fourth 
quarter, I can see it getting 

1712
01:25:22,760 --> 01:25:25,880
real tight. 
The the the two things about the

1713
01:25:25,880 --> 01:25:29,200
game that concern me the most 
are the very beginning and the 

1714
01:25:29,200 --> 01:25:30,520
very end. 
Yeah. 

1715
01:25:30,520 --> 01:25:34,240
Because the Pacers have now 
multiple games in a row gotten 

1716
01:25:34,240 --> 01:25:36,440
off to really bad offensive 
starts. 

1717
01:25:36,880 --> 01:25:38,840
They dug themselves out of it in
six. 

1718
01:25:38,920 --> 01:25:41,160
They didn't really ever dig 
themselves fully out of it in 

1719
01:25:41,160 --> 01:25:42,520
five. 
I mean, they did get back to 

1720
01:25:42,520 --> 01:25:45,880
within two, but it was. 
Game 2, they didn't ever got out

1721
01:25:45,880 --> 01:25:48,760
of it. 
So I do worry about that, and I 

1722
01:25:48,760 --> 01:25:51,760
worry about the Pacers getting 
into a rhythm early, figuring 

1723
01:25:51,760 --> 01:25:54,920
out their offense while also 
playing tough defense. 

1724
01:25:55,280 --> 01:25:58,320
But the other thing I do worry 
about at the end is something 

1725
01:25:58,320 --> 01:26:01,400
we've talked about a bunch, 
which is that whatever you think

1726
01:26:01,400 --> 01:26:09,280
of SGA, he hits shots on his 
command and the Pacers don't 

1727
01:26:09,280 --> 01:26:12,960
really have a go to guy that 
they can go to on five or six 

1728
01:26:12,960 --> 01:26:15,920
consecutive possessions when you
have to score. 

1729
01:26:17,280 --> 01:26:21,600
And they've shown they can 
defend SGA pretty well. 

1730
01:26:22,400 --> 01:26:26,880
But this does this is the kind 
of game where if he is playing 

1731
01:26:26,880 --> 01:26:31,520
at an MVP level, you would 
expect him to, you know, be able

1732
01:26:31,520 --> 01:26:34,960
to go out and and put a ton of 
points on the board and do so 

1733
01:26:34,960 --> 01:26:37,560
consecutive or consistently. 
I think it's going to be 

1734
01:26:37,560 --> 01:26:40,480
fascinating because you look at 
his last five games, he scored 

1735
01:26:40,880 --> 01:26:45,840
21 points, 31 points, 35 points,
24 points and 34 points over the

1736
01:26:45,840 --> 01:26:49,400
course of those games. 
That's, you know, from this last

1737
01:26:49,400 --> 01:26:55,280
one back down, you know, he's, 
he's clearly comfortable with 

1738
01:26:55,280 --> 01:26:58,720
taking 20 plus shots a game. 
They're probably gonna need that

1739
01:26:58,720 --> 01:27:00,280
down the stretch. 
And I think the question for the

1740
01:27:00,280 --> 01:27:02,120
Pacers is, can they keep 
scoring? 

1741
01:27:02,640 --> 01:27:06,080
Game 6 was the first game in 
this entire playoff run that the

1742
01:27:06,080 --> 01:27:10,760
Pacers won without scoring 110 
or more points or 100. 

1743
01:27:10,760 --> 01:27:12,680
And what was it not 100 and 
10100. 

1744
01:27:12,720 --> 01:27:16,600
And yeah, 110 was the number. 
And they were able to do that 

1745
01:27:16,600 --> 01:27:19,720
because of their defense. 
And so they, they, they have to 

1746
01:27:19,720 --> 01:27:21,920
score in this game and they need
to start that early. 

1747
01:27:22,320 --> 01:27:25,560
I don't know what kind of legs 
either of these teams has, you 

1748
01:27:25,560 --> 01:27:31,240
know, 41% for both, 41% for the 
Pacers, 42% for the Thunder in 

1749
01:27:31,240 --> 01:27:34,160
Game 6. 
And you know, you go back and 

1750
01:27:34,160 --> 01:27:37,000
you look at what's happened in 
the other games in this series 

1751
01:27:37,000 --> 01:27:41,320
and Game 5. 
The what would the, what did the

1752
01:27:41,320 --> 01:27:44,360
Pacers shoot in that? 
They shot 45% in that game. 

1753
01:27:44,800 --> 01:27:47,840
And Oklahoma City shot 43%. 
Like this. 

1754
01:27:47,840 --> 01:27:51,360
The shooting percentage numbers 
have dropped for both of these 

1755
01:27:51,360 --> 01:27:54,640
teams as the series has gone on.
Who has the legs left to 

1756
01:27:54,640 --> 01:27:57,000
actually get jump shots off and 
consistently hit them 

1757
01:27:57,000 --> 01:27:58,840
throughout? 
Or who can get to the rim most 

1758
01:27:58,840 --> 01:28:01,680
effectively? 
So anyway, we'll see what 

1759
01:28:01,680 --> 01:28:03,080
happens. 
Scott should be fascinating. 

1760
01:28:03,360 --> 01:28:04,160
Yep. 
Yes, Sir. 

1761
01:28:04,400 --> 01:28:05,440
There you go. 
All right. 

1762
01:28:05,760 --> 01:28:09,960
Well, we appreciate you folks 
sticking with us as we recap 

1763
01:28:09,960 --> 01:28:13,160
what happened in Game 6IN 
preview, a game seven in the NBA

1764
01:28:13,160 --> 01:28:15,640
Finals of the Pacers taking on 
the Oklahoma City Thunder with a

1765
01:28:15,640 --> 01:28:20,720
chance to win the Pacers first 
ever franchise NBA title. 

1766
01:28:20,720 --> 01:28:22,800
Also a chance for the Thunder to
do the same. 

1767
01:28:22,800 --> 01:28:27,240
So for Scott, I'm Galen, this is
Crimson Cast. 

1768
01:28:27,320 --> 01:28:29,880
We appreciate you joining us 
folks and we will catch you on 

1769
01:28:29,880 --> 01:28:33,960
the flip side. 
Yes, sirs, Pacers in seven catch

1770
01:28:33,960 --> 01:28:35,880
you folks on the flip side, solo
everybody. 

1771
01:28:38,160 --> 01:28:40,960
Sorry, I said flip side twice. 
I just got too excited there, 

1772
01:28:40,960 --> 01:28:41,320
folks.